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Aug. 7, 2015 - Louder with Crowder
33:54
Carly Fiorina Uncensored on #SJW Feminism and Weak Leaders | Louder With Crowder
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This is why people are fed up with the political class.
So number one, secure the border.
This isn't rocket science.
It takes money, it takes manpower, it takes technology, but mostly what it takes is to grow a pair and lead.
Second, to use your phrase, second, we have to fix the legal...
So glad to have this next guest.
This is the first.
This is the first here on Louder with Crowder.
We have never had a politician on the program, generally because, let me preface this, they usually send us a request with talking points, and I say, I don't really want to do that.
And this was the opposite.
So Carly Fiorina, thank you so much for being on.
Well, thank you so much for having me.
And I'm really honored.
I almost want to say to be your first politician, only I'm not a politician, but I am running for president.
That's true.
Okay, I'm sorry.
There's a negative connotation there.
I just meant you're running for office.
Yes, exactly.
And I'm honored to be your first office runner.
I think we had a local guy a while back.
But you know what?
That's something I'd like to lead with.
I spoke with your assistants there.
Of course, you're much more professional than myself.
It's just me and Jared producing.
And I said, listen, are there any things that I have to avoid?
Or, you know, I've worked with people in political office for a while.
She said, nope.
Carly's prepared for everything.
Is that just something that...
I mean, are you crazy or are you just that well prepared?
Well, it's a couple things.
First of all, I've...
I've been in and around the world a long time, and I know what I know, and I know what I believe.
It doesn't mean I can't learn something new.
It means that the issues that I talk about are not talking points to me.
Secondly, I'm not afraid of who I am or what I believe.
And so people have a right to ask me whatever they'd like.
You know, Winston Churchill once said something interesting.
He said, there is no such thing as an indiscreet question, only an indiscreet answer.
So I'm I'm really happy to be candid with people when they ask me questions that are interesting to them.
Although, to be fair, Churchill said that before GoPros were invented.
I think that could have changed his opinion a little bit.
Right off the bat, you seem to have a good sense of humor about it.
I'm not a journalist.
I'm an entertainer.
One thing I've noticed, contrary to everyone else out there right now, Is instead of sort of beating up on each other like Republicans are doing, you know, you've been going straight after the opposition, Hillary Clinton.
And we've coined you the conservative honey badger.
Is that a conscious decision?
Or did you say, I'm just going to avoid the sort of muckraking as long as I can in the primaries and focus on the real opponent?
Or is it just something that happened organically?
Well, I think first it's important to remember What this fight is about.
And I think 2016 is going to be a real fight, and we're in it already.
And it's a fight between conservatism, the values and the principles and the policies that I know work best to lift people up, and a Democrat Party that honestly has become so extreme in its positions on a whole host of issues that they are undermining the character and a Democrat Party that honestly has become so extreme in its positions on a whole host of issues that they are undermining the character of our nation, I believe, and also undermining the leadership and the position of our
Hillary Clinton happens to be the frontrunner of her party.
And so if you're going to attack that platform and that set of beliefs, you've got to attack the person out in front telling Americans that this is going to be good for them when we know it's going to be terrible.
But, I mean, the noticeable difference between you and, say, a lot of people who, you know, will share the stage with you is, well, everyone gets into like him or hate him attacking Trump or attacking somebody else.
You seem to focus in on Hillary, and you seem to focus in on policy and on the history of this administration.
Why do you think you're the only one, and I'm not the only one who's noticed this, who seems to be doing that?
Well, I don't know.
I can't speak for the others.
I will say...
You know, sometimes boys like to have a fight, you know?
But the real fight, the real issue, the real issue is the future of the nation.
I really believe that.
I think we're at a pivotal point.
I'm not trying to avoid your question.
I'm trying to answer your question.
I think we are at a pivotal point.
I am running for office because I believe we're at a pivotal point.
I think this is a fight we have to win.
I think we need a different kind of leadership, not just to win this election, But actually to put a leader in the White House who will do the right things for the nation and indeed for the world.
On that point, you say, boys, like a fight.
We will get letters.
People are like, I can't believe how sexist that is, and I understand what you're coming from.
I think you gave a great answer on The View, one that was overlooked because the abortion thing is kind of what was picked up.
But they asked you about feminism, and you crystallized it, I think, in a way that resonates with a lot.
Certainly people like my wife, who would consider herself a feminist, but she can't stand what's newly been coined third-wave feminism, this sort of aggressive feminism.
You said a feminist is anyone who makes a choice.
A choice like I did to be CEO or a choice to be a stay-at-home mom?
There's a really strong...
I've talked about this with some people who work with you.
Gamergate was a launching pad for a lot of young Americans.
The politicization of free speech right now.
A lot of people seem to be rejecting the dogmatic feminism.
But this includes a lot of strong women.
Do you think that was a message that maybe was lost on people of the view?
And is it one that you plan to focus on?
I mean, obviously going up against likely another woman.
Well, I do think, as I said on The View, that a feminist is any woman who chooses her own life.
And we know there are many, many women in the world who don't have that opportunity.
I do think the term feminism has been politicized by the left.
And indeed, there are a lot of left-leaning and left-wing women who don't care Anything about empowering other women.
I mean, for heaven's sakes, EMILY's List, the pro-abortion group, has literally called my candidacy offensive to women.
Now, you know, that's about ideology.
It's not about making sure that women have opportunities to do whatever they choose to do and certainly whatever men do.
It's about ideology.
And I think we do have to continue to point out that the Democrats have come this way.
It's a party of such extreme positions.
It is a party that plays identity politics.
You know, you're a woman, therefore you have to care about this and think this way.
You're a Hispanic, you have to care about this issue and think this way about it.
You're an African American, you can only care about this issue and think a particular way about it.
If you don't fit into their identity groups and think the way they want you to on the specific issue they think you should care about, then you're sort of ostracized.
That's a terrible thing, and you bet we have to call that out.
That's part of what I mean when I say we have a fight on our hands, really.
Right.
So I guess a big part of what you're sort of putting under that same umbrella of feminism is calling out the hypocrisy of leftist women telling other women what makes them a feminist.
Exactly.
It is hypocrisy.
It's hypocrisy to say you're only a feminist.
You only measure up in my eyes if you agree with everything that I say.
Hillary Clinton actually said this.
She actually said when she was campaigning against Joni Ernst, first woman senator from the state of Iowa, and for Bruce Braley, she actually said, well, you know, it's not enough to be a woman.
You have to be a woman who believes.
And then she went through the litany of left-wing progressive views that she holds.
Right.
Yeah, and that's something I do remind you.
As a comic, I would not be as reserved as you are on the personal front with feminism.
There's just a litany of hypocrisy with Hillary Clinton.
We won't necessarily get into that, but I appreciate where you're coming from on that.
So let me ask you this.
In discussing the feminism thing, I thought it was a very funny sketch you did with BuzzFeed.
I also thought it was smart because it's an audience that no Republican candidates that I know of are reaching out to.
I thought you did a very funny job.
But I know you're probably aware that BuzzFeed has pushed microaggression theory.
They've pushed a lot of really sort of, honestly, anti-woman, pro-third-wave feminist causes.
I got the sense that you were doing a funny sketch...
But they thought that maybe they were going to use it to make a political statement, if you look at some of the writing and the comments, that you weren't necessarily intending.
Am I completely off base?
Keep in mind, my white male privilege is showing.
Well, I wouldn't say that.
But look, here's the thing.
People can say whatever they want to say.
You know, that is part of what we have in this country, free speech.
So people can interpret something I do or something I say.
They're free to do it.
I do think this.
Humor is, and I applaud you for being a comedian, humor is a powerful weapon to make a point.
You know, I was asked on a Saturday morning national television show, just as an example of this, I was asked whether a woman's hormones prevent her from serving in the Oval Office.
And my answer was, can we think of a single instance in which a man's judgment was clouded by his hormones?
Including in the Oval Office.
Now, by the way, everyone laughs when I say that, and it makes the point immediately.
It makes the point that, yes, it's funny, but the truth is it's ridiculous to say that a woman's hormones prevent her from serving in the Oval Office, just as it's ridiculous not to acknowledge that there are certain things that women hear that men don't hear.
It's still different for women.
That's a fact.
No, and I appreciate that because I think it's the same issue with race, right?
We're told by one side that we just have to be completely, totally colorblind, and then we're told by the other side that if you recognize any differences at all, it's inherently racist.
We're humans, and I don't think there's anything sexist about recognizing the inherent differences between men and women.
Let's be honest.
Some things, women are going to be better.
They're going to naturally excel compared to men, and vice versa.
I don't know when that became hateful.
Yes, exactly.
That's exactly right.
And my way of saying it is this.
Every single human being has potential.
Every human is gifted by God.
I'm a conservative because I believe that every person should have the opportunity to fulfill their potential, to find and use their God-given gifts.
That doesn't mean we're all the same.
We're not all the same.
But each of us has value, each of us has potential, and we are all the same in the eyes of God.
So in other words, it hurts us all if a group's potential is not fulfilled.
If women are underutilized, that hurts everybody.
The data is very clear.
If we have too many African Americans struggling in poverty, not getting a good education and not having an opportunity to move ahead in their lives, that hurts us all as well.
Yeah, I think it's that bigotry of low expectations, the soft bigotry, but you have it a lot.
That's right.
Well, and I think, by the way, to your point, that is exactly the point of this fight in 2016.
Because I believe the core difference, and I started to say this on The View, the core difference...
Before they interrupted you?
No, no, no, no, no.
They always do.
Actually, before they ran out of time, Whoopi Goldberg ran out of time and got very upset.
But, see, I think the core of conservatism is...
No one of us is any better than any other one of us.
Each of us has the capacity to live lives of dignity and purpose and meaning.
I think the core of progressivism, of the extreme left wing of the Democrat Party now, is actually, some of us are smarter than others.
Some of us are better than others.
Some of you aren't capable of living good lives.
So some of us are going to take care of others.
And I think it is the height of disrespect and disregard, and we need to call that out.
Well, it's the divide and conquer strategy of the left.
And isn't it convenient that they ran out of time?
If only she could have run out of time as they were shooting Karina Karina, because that is what is truly offensive to men and women alike.
A travesty of film.
You're going to get a letter from Whoopi, Carly.
I'm sorry.
You don't have to agree.
You know, I told Whoopi.
I have to say, Whoopi was arguing with her producer for more time.
She wanted to hammer me on abortion for another day.
Yeah, well, Rosie Perez, I mean, when she tried to rebut what you said, and listen, you don't have to agree with me here, but it came across as though she was barely walking upright in her thought process.
It was no to you citing the polls on, I think it was abortion, was it past 20 weeks or 22 weeks?
I don't want to misquote you.
It was 20 weeks.
Five months.
I think it comes down to whether it's a life or not.
There are close-handed issues and there are open-handed issues.
And then I think with both of those kinds of issues, there are closed-handed ways to deal with it and sometimes there are open-handed ways to deal with a closed-handed issue.
If that's confusing, you can rewind it.
We have this online.
With abortion, I know they try to go rape and incest so that they can get you off topic and removes it from the table.
I thought you were very smart in saying, okay, let's say we make exceptions for that small fraction of abortions.
Then can we all find common ground on these late-term abortions on which the vast majority of Americans agree?
And all they could say is, no, I don't believe your poll numbers.
Well, and of course now we have these Planned Parenthood videos.
Which actually have nothing to do with whether you're pro-life or pro-choice.
I know a lot of pro-choice women and a lot of pro-choice men who are horrified by these videos as they should be.
Okay, Carly, hold that thought.
We will be right back.
Louder with Crowder.
She's classing up the joint.
We will be back.
We are back with Carly Fiorina, of course, running for president.
If you haven't heard of her, you probably will after.
I don't know if it's appropriate to use any kind of a murder comparison when it comes to debates, but every time I see Carly Fiorina respond to a question in media, I think of that song, Let the Bodies Hit the Floor.
That's what pops into my head.
I can't control it.
I'm a male.
I'm naturally aggressive.
This is why I shouldn't be in office.
Carly, you were talking about the Planned Parenthood videos.
I want you to continue with that, and I don't want to interrupt.
Well, I said that this is not about being pro-choice or pro-life.
This is about the character of our nation.
Honestly, to watch these women picking over babies, that's what these women are calling them.
It's not someone else calling them babies.
I mean, there are people saying, oh, look, it's a baby.
Oh, look, it's twins.
Oh, look, it's an arm and a leg.
This is about the character of our nation.
And to talk about extreme, the Democrat Party has closed ranks, rallied around and said, absolutely, there's nothing wrong here.
There's nothing to see here.
Just go on, go on, go on.
And by the way, their extreme position is...
It's not a life until it leaves the hospital.
That is their position, that it's not a life until it leaves the hospital.
Honestly, I can support that, but so many people don't know it because they wrap it up in this baloney about women's health and all the rest of it.
Oh, we're doing breast exams.
Actually, they're doing no such thing.
It's a series.
It's a web of falsehoods designed to protect the harvesting of baby's body parts.
That right there, you can either take this as an insult or a compliment.
As someone who's worked with consulting, when you were talking about, they say this, that was very off the cuff and seemed like an actual conversation.
That's what I think attracts people like me to someone like you.
Now, every consultant there in D.C. would tell you not to do that.
Please don't change that, because I've never gotten that with any other politician.
Well, you know what?
Actually, I really appreciate you saying that, because...
One of the things that I was determined when I started this campaign was never to sound like a politician.
Most people are sick of politicians.
I am too.
We're sick of sanitized sound bites and bumper sticker rhetoric.
And the truth is, people just want to have a conversation.
Because they know there are really important issues that we ought to be having real conversations about.
That's absolutely true.
And I was thinking about this today and talking with my father about it.
I think when running for office, I think hyperintelligence is overrated.
I think you need to be smart enough.
I think Ronald Reagan was a smart guy.
I think if you were to put him in an IQ lineup, he probably wouldn't be the number one draft pick.
But I think he was a smart guy.
But he was an incredibly effective communicator.
Sometimes you need a Captain Kirk instead of a Spock.
I think you probably have quite a bit of both.
I think there are other people.
I don't want to throw anyone under the bus who's going to be on stage with you, who are hyperly intelligent, who don't realize that they're not super effective communicators.
I mean, the guy who engineered this computer on which I'm speaking with you is not someone who I probably want in office.
And that's just one layman's point of view.
Since we're doing this, and since I just heaped praise on you, I'm going to have to hit you with a couple of hardballs.
Is that okay?
Of course.
Okay, my apologies.
No apology necessary.
Well, you know, that's the sexism in me.
I want to be a gentleman, but I also have to do my job.
The knock against you that you hear on Twitter, if you have to get out ahead of this, I'm sure it'll come up, is some people say, well, tenure at HP wasn't as great as it could have been.
What do you say to those people?
What's your response?
Because you know that's what some people might bring up.
You know, I led Hewlett Packard through a very difficult time.
The dot-com bust, post 9-11, the worst technology recession in 25 years.
You may remember that it's taken the NASDAQ, the Technology Heavy Stock Index, 15 years to recover to its dot-com boom highs.
So in that very difficult period of time, yes, I had to make some difficult choices.
Nevertheless, Many of our competitors disappeared off the map.
We didn't.
We went from 44 billion to almost 90 billion in revenue.
We quadrupled our growth rate.
We quadrupled our cash flow.
We tripled innovation to 11 patents a day.
Most importantly, we went from lagging behind in every product category and every market segment to leading.
And the only way for a company to succeed, particularly in technology, or for a country to succeed, frankly, is to lead and to grow.
Now, at the end of that tenure, I got fired.
I got fired in a boardroom brawl that lasted two weeks.
And you know why I got fired?
Because when you challenge the status quo, which is what leadership takes every time.
Leaders challenge the status quo.
You make enemies.
And sometimes those enemies stab you in the back.
That's life.
It's why so many people don't lead, I'll guarantee you.
When I am in the Oval Office, I will lead as well.
And I'll make plenty of enemies.
But in the end, the problem with Washington is no one will ever challenge the status quo.
And so we have all these festering problems that have been around forever, and we have issues that have been talking about forever, and we talk about them every election cycle, and somehow nothing really changes because no one's prepared to challenge the status quo.
I am.
I've done it, and I know the consequences.
Holy crap.
I expected you to dance around that one a little bit more, so I need to have a follow-up.
I would say good answer, and hopefully people who lob those criticisms out there can take it.
Also, I mean, with HP, too, when I was a kid, it was basically kind of a printer company, and now they're selling smartphones.
So it's changed drastically as far as what they offer in my lifetime.
Well, exactly, and my mandate was to transform a company that was lagging further and further behind.
Into a leader.
We did that.
We did that.
I say we because it was tens of thousands of dedicated employees.
But transformation, change takes leadership.
It was my job to lead.
Great answer.
And I know that all too well with boardroom brawls and politics.
I don't do that well with a backstabbing crowd.
And I get the sense that you're not a backstabber.
You look someone in the eye and stab them in the face if they've really done you wrong.
Not literally.
Not literally.
Do not take this literally.
People are going to take that clip and say, Carl, it's going to be able to stab someone in the face.
No, but you know, to your point, let me just say, I believe very strongly in character and integrity.
I learned that from my mother and father.
To me, what that means is, if you're going to say something behind somebody's back, you better be prepared to say it to their face.
I am prepared to have honest disagreements, honest brawls with people, but I will always say it to their face.
That's a double-edged sword, though, too.
I was talking with my dad about this.
My wife is a very strong woman.
My mom is a very strong woman.
And so I think that people like my father and I find ourselves attracted to you as a candidate because that's what we seek in a woman.
A lot of men can't handle that.
Not to sound like a social justice warrior feminist here, third wave feminist, but there are a lot of men who can be intimidated by that and seek out the opposite.
So do you think...
That's just one of those things that's out of your control, and people will react how they react?
Because there are two different kinds of men, and some guys are going to adore you, and some guys are going to head for the hills.
Well, I do think there is a difference.
I'm not everybody's cup of tea, but what I've found over the course of my lifetime is I can gather enough support to get...
I also think you have to pick times.
Not every fight is worth fighting.
It doesn't mean you run around with your dukes up all the time.
Quite the opposite, in fact.
There are times when you've got to let stuff go.
There are times when you have to say, you know what, I'm going to set this aside for now and find common ground with you and collaborate.
There are times, however...
I hate to cut you off.
Can you hold that thought?
I'm sorry?
I said I hate to cut you off.
Can you hold that thought?
We have a hard break here, and then I want to bring you back because I know where you're going with it, and I like it.
I dig it.
Carly Fiorina, Ladder with Crowder.
Stay tuned.
Carly Fiorina was going to make a point.
We made her wait because we are horrendous human beings.
Please take the floor and continue because I liked where you were going.
Well, the point I was making is there is a time to set something aside and focus on finding common ground with someone.
There is also a time when you've got to really sit down with somebody and say, we have a major disagreement here.
These are the things that I cannot agree with you on.
In my experience, even in that moment, there is an opportunity to find common ground.
There is an opportunity for collaboration.
But sometimes you get to a point where literally there is no common ground and there isn't an opportunity.
And at that point, you have to be honest and walk away.
Let me just bring that to the world stage.
One of the problems with this Iran deal is we never walked away.
We never said We can't come to agreement here.
This is a principle that we can't bend on.
You know, anytime, anywhere inspections, for example.
We didn't say, sorry, we have to walk away now.
This is a principle upon which we cannot bend.
And if you're not prepared to do that in a deal, in life, in leadership, then you're going to get rolled.
You're going to get rolled.
No, that's absolutely true.
And it's funny.
We were talking about this, I think, last week.
We do find it funny that you have leftists who want to take away someone's revolver because he's taken a Xanax at some point in his lifetime.
But, oh, Iran with nuclear capabilities?
We're fresh on board.
What could possibly go wrong there?
I can't think of anyone less mentally stable as a whole than the nation of Iran.
You know, it's funny.
I literally have this written down and I don't write questions down.
I'm going to read this for you word for word.
I think a lot of candidates compromise when compromise isn't necessary.
But you need to find the places where you can because compromise and responsibility is hard.
Bluster is easy.
How do you draw that line?
You basically just answered that word for word.
I guess to expand on how you need to be prepared to walk away.
Is there anything else that you think is important in drawing that line?
Because it is important to compromise and then also not compromise when it's pivotal.
That's right.
That's right.
I think there are three cardinal rules to deal-making.
And let's face it, compromise is making a deal, okay?
You're compromising with your teenager or the nation of Iran or the opposite party.
Compromise is about making a deal.
To make a good deal, I think there are three cardinal rules.
Number one, you have to state what your principles, your walkaway positions are.
Not at the end, at the beginning.
You've got to go to people and say, look, this is what I have to have.
I have to have it.
I cannot compromise on it.
And then, number two, you have to be prepared to put everything else into the center of the table in a spirit of truly willing and open-minded collaboration.
But you have to be clear about what your absolute must-have principles and goals are.
Three, you have to be willing to walk away.
Because if you don't walk away, people don't believe you will.
And they further don't believe that you actually care about it.
And so if you don't walk away, my cardinal rule, honestly, I've done a lot of deals in my life, and my cardinal rule always to myself and to any negotiating team that I was coaching was, if you haven't walked away from the table three times, you haven't gotten the best deal you could.
It's just how people operate.
They test.
They test the limits.
We test the limits in our families.
We test the limits with our spouses.
We test the limits with our negotiating opponents.
So you have to walk away.
And then finally, the last cardinal rule that President Obama broke totally, is you don't celebrate the deal until you have the deal you want.
So if you celebrate a deal before you have one, guess what happens?
The other side keeps negotiating.
And that's what happened with Iran.
I agree with you on everything you just said, except the concept of compromising with a teenager.
I don't think you ever compromise with a teenager.
Oh, okay, maybe.
I'll give you that.
Yeah, then you end up with the Clinton family.
So, listen, again, that was me.
That was not her.
Here's one thing that is concerning to me a little bit.
I will say on a personal level, I don't think...
how it came out.
But as someone who was raised in Quebec, okay, parliamentary system, you're basically talking about mob rule.
You talked on a recent program, I can't remember exactly where it was, we'll have it up at the website, about technology engaging citizens with government.
I want to be clear, are you, you're not talking about governance by referendum, are you, as opposed to, you know, representative republic, because that's what I grew up with in Quebec, and that's immediately, if ever we go to that, it sends up red flags, because nothing gets done in Quebec.
No.
What I am talking about, though, let me give you a very real example.
Okay.
One of the things that I think has to happen is we have to go to zero-based budgeting.
We actually have to know where every dollar is being spent so we can prioritize our dollars.
You know, we're not today, which is why government just gets bigger and bigger and more and more inept.
So I would go into the Oval Office in a weekly radio address, just as an example, and I would ask people to take out their smartphones.
And I would say, I'd like to ask you a question.
Do you think we should know where your money is being spent?
Press one for yes, two for no.
People will vote.
What does that do?
It signals to their representatives, this is an issue we care about.
This is what we think ought to happen.
We know that politicians in the political process respond to pressure.
It's how we got Congress in three short weeks to pass a bill that said people could get fired at the VA if they didn't do their job.
Of course, they haven't fired anyone.
But it was this massive amount of pressure from people saying, guess what?
We care about this.
You've got to be able to fire someone.
The point is ours was intended to be a citizen government.
Citizens need to be engaged in the process of their government.
And technology gives us a tool to engage citizens directly in the questions that matter to them so that their representatives can respond to what people really think.
We don't need pollsters telling us what people think.
We all know there are issues with polls, huge issues with polls.
People can actually tell us what they think now.
That would be good to know.
Okay, a couple of things that you just brought up.
You were talking about voting yes, hit one for yes, two for no in Florida.
They would mash it with their palm and then demand a recount.
Which brings me to Jeb Bush.
You talked about polls.
Here's something, Carly, and you may like the guy.
You may not...
I'm not a huge fan of him as potential president.
That's my opinion.
I don't know him personally.
But...
I don't know anybody, Carl.
And I know a lot of people.
And my producers don't know anybody.
And no one in my family knows anybody.
We don't know a single person, not one, who Jeb Bush is their guy.
How in the world does he lead in any poll?
Because when I talk about that, you hear an outcry on Twitter of people saying they don't believe in the primary system.
They think it's rigged.
They think conservative media is trying to manipulate it just as bad as leftist media tries to manipulate nationals.
And I don't tend to chalk up to, I guess, collusion, what could be chalked up to incompetence.
But in this case, when I don't know a single person with JEP, how is there such a discrepancy?
Well, because I think it depends a lot on what polls you're looking at.
So let's just take this debate tonight.
Fox News decided to use national polls.
What national polls at this point in a race are measuring, really, is name ID. Right.
Because there's so many people who aren't paying attention yet.
If you go into state polls, a Florida poll, an Iowa poll, a New Hampshire poll, you'll see very different results than the national polls.
Because they're talking to people in those states who are actually engaged and who are going to vote.
A national poll measures basically name ID. So guess who has the highest name ID in the field?
Donald Trump.
Guess who's next?
Jeb Bush.
Can we talk about Trump or do we not want to talk about Trump?
Sorry, I just made it horrendously uncomfortable.
Okay, Trump has been a catalyst here for the illegal immigration issue.
Now, not taxable.
I'm not convinced he's a conservative.
We have a lot of, I mean, when you have Clinton's front and center at your wedding, when you give six figures to the Clintons, when you're literally a card-garing Democrat for most of your life, I'm not convinced.
I do think he served a little bit as a catalyst for some issues where maybe he'll allow some of the candidates who are a little bit namby-pamby to grow a pair.
That's my opinion.
Maybe he'll serve that role.
Some people might say you're not as hard on immigration as someone like a Trump, who I haven't really heard off for an actual solution.
Clarify your stance so that no one else is misquoting on immigration.
What would a Carly Fiorina administration do?
What I have said consistently all along is, number one, we have to secure the border.
By the way, how long have we been talking about securing the border?
30 years.
I mean, to be accurate, the border has not been secure for 30 years.
We've been talking about it for at least 25.
It's still not secure.
So what does that tell you?
It tells you politicians talk, talk, talk, talk, talk, and yet it never gets done.
Sanctuary cities.
You know how long San Francisco has been a sanctuary city?
Since 1989.
Everyone's going to get all fired up about this.
They're going to give speeches.
They're going to pass laws, and yet nothing really changes.
This is why people are fed up with the political class.
So number one, secure the border.
This isn't rocket science.
It takes money, it takes manpower, it takes technology, but mostly what it takes is to grow a pair and lead.
Second, to use your phrase, second, we have to fix the legal immigration system.
How long has the legal immigration system been broken?
How long have we been talking about it?
25 years.
25 years.
We've had over 16 different visa programs.
We have an e-verify system that doesn't work.
Really?
In 2015, we can't create an e-verify system that is working, that is mandatory.
We're handing out border crossing cards every single day over the Mexico border.
You're supposed to come in for a day and return home.
Nobody checks.
This is an example of ineptitude or the disregard of the political class of issues that really matter.
And finally, I have said equally explicitly, That I don't think if you've come here illegally and stayed here illegally that you get to earn a path to citizenship, ever.
You may earn legal status at some point, but there has to be a reward for people who study our history, take the oath, raise their hand, understand that citizenship is a privilege to be earned.
There has to be a consequence for those people who played by the rules.
I have said this from day one, over and over and over.
Yes, Donald Trump.
Make this issue popular.
But make no mistake, loads of Republican politicians, many of whom are running, have not fixed this problem in 25 years.
And we can't blame it all on the Democrats, because we've had Republicans in the White House.
We've had the majority in the House and Senate.
People go on to get along.
The status quo hasn't changed.
Whatever your issue or cause, whatever festering problem you hope would get solved, political class has failed us, actually.
Bodies, hit floor.
Carly Fiorina, thank you so much.
We know you're busy.
We'll let you go.
Godspeed.
And hopefully we'll check back with you.
And that name ID situation will change.
I'm betting that it will.
Thank you.
Thank you.
I really enjoyed it.
Have me back.
We will have you back.
There we go.
You saw it.
So this is like a verbally binding contract.
We didn't scare Carly Fiorina off.
Thank you so much, Carly.
We will have you back.
And really, we are going to be watching this like a hawk.
Thank you.
Alright, take care.
Lauder with Crowder.
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