Andrew Klavan and guests dissect Al Sharpton’s history—from the 1980s Tawana Brawley hoax to inciting Crown Heights riots and boycotting Freddy’s Fashion Mart—while exposing how Democrats like Warren and Harris shield him. Raynard Jackson counters with Black conservatives’ success under Trump, citing Republican-led cities outperforming Democratic ones, but urges engagement over divisive rhetoric. Kathy Zhu’s Miss Michigan title revocation for tweets on black-on-black crime and hijabs reveals systemic bias against conservatives, while Klavan ties it to leftist materialism, contrasting it with purpose-driven values like motherhood. The episode frames identity politics as a corrupting force, weaponizing grievance to fracture unity and silence dissent. [Automatically generated summary]
Donald Trump attacked corruption-infested race-baiter Al Sharpton Jr. yesterday, and Sharpton responded with a lie-infested tirade in which he claimed Trump was racist for using the word infested.
This is the same evil-infested Sharpton who shot to fame by trumpeting the false race claims of Tawana Brawley in the 1980s, even laying blame on an innocent police officer who had earlier committed suicide.
But when Trump called the disgrace-infested Sharpton a, quote, con man, unquote, it must have been because Trump is racist for using the word infested.
Senator Elizabeth Warren defended the sin-infested Sharpton, saying, quote, and this is a real quote, Al Sharpton has dedicated his life to the fight for justice for all.
She didn't mention whether this included the 1991 part of his life, when Sharpton stirred up trouble over a tragic traffic accident in which the victim was a black child and the driver was a Hasidic Jew.
The bigotry-infested Sharpton spewed so much anti-Semitic hatred, he helped incite some of the worst anti-Jewish riots this country has ever seen.
Four years later, Sharpton also helped incite a vicious anti-Semitic boycott against a Jewish shop owner, an incident that ended in mass murder.
But when Donald Trump called the hate-infested Sharpton a, quote, troublemaker, unquote, it must have been because Trump is racist for using the word infested.
Kamala Harris also rushed to defend the ugliness-infested Sharpton, saying, quote, and again, a real quote, Sharpton has spent his life fighting for what's right and working to improve our nation, unquote.
This might not include the time the slander-infested Sharpton falsely accused three white Duke University lacrosse players of rape, or falsely accused George Zimmerman of murdering Trayvon Martin, or falsely claimed Michael Brown was a gentle innocent shot dead by a racist cop.
Still, when Donald Trump said the turpitude-infested Sharpton, quote, hates whites and cops, unquote, that must have been because Trump is racist for using the word infested.
Either that or Sharpton and his Democrat defenders are all crap-infested.
Trigger warning, I'm Andrew Clavin, and this is the Andrew Clavin Show.
I'm the hunky-dunky, life is tickety-boo.
Birds are winging, also singing, hunky-dunky-dunky.
Ship-shaped tipsy-topsy, the world is a bitty zing.
It's a wonderful day.
Hoorah, hooray!
It makes me want to sing.
Oh, hurrah, hooray.
Oh, hooray, hurrah.
Drew's Hopeful Timeshare00:15:27
You know, I keep hearing this story about people who have fallen for this timeshare spiel.
This hasn't happened to me, but I keep hearing about it.
People, they hear it's a great investment.
It's a legacy for the kids.
You can stay wherever you want, whenever you want.
And none of that turns out to be true.
The ugly truth is, with a timeshare, you can never tell how much it's really going to cost or when it's going to end.
Many owners trying to sell their timeshares online find out the hard way.
It's not an investment because you can't get rid of it and you can't get a dollar for it.
And with those rising annual maintenance and assessment fees, buying a timeshare is like giving the timeshare company a blank check for life.
Even when you die, your family gets stuck with this burden.
Stop the insanity today.
There is a way out.
If you're stuck in a timeshare nightmare, go to icanceltimeshare.com and tell them I sent you.
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That's icanceltimeshare.com.
And again, tell them I sent you because it helps keep the lights on here.
Politics corrupts, but identity politics corrupts absolutely.
Politics corrupts because it reduces complex issues to binary choices.
It forces us into bed with people we might not like in order to achieve ends that we do like.
And it goads us to see our opponents as enemies.
All that is normal.
It's a tale as old as time.
But identity politics corrupts at a level that is corrosive to us as individuals and destructive to the country.
Identity politics reduces you not to a set of philosophical points of view, which is a fair, if simplistic, way to work out your political differences, but to an existential identity.
It puts forward the idea that that identity is oppressed and helpless, and then it rewards your victimhood and helplessness with government and social largesse, dollars earned by the work of others.
places in college you may not deserve, jobs that another person is more qualified to perform, reparations for wrongs you never suffered, and so on.
But there's a catch.
In order to belong to your oppressed, victimized, and helpless identity group and thus receive these so-called entitlements, you have to agree with a set of opinions and political points of view.
And by a startling coincidence, these are the exact set of opinions that maintain the power of the people doling out the entitlements.
Strange.
In the immortal words of squad congresswoman Ayanna Presley, we don't need any more brown faces that don't want to be a brown voice.
We don't need black faces that don't want to be a black voice.
We don't need Muslims that don't want to be a Muslim voice.
We don't need queers that don't want to be a queer voice.
Have you got that?
You hand over your mind, your freedom of thought, your powers of perception, your self-reliance, and of course your vote, and you get to trade your helpless poor baby victimhood for dollars and privileges.
It's disgusting.
It's a betrayal of the American dream.
It rots communities and individual souls, and it makes it almost impossible for people of goodwill to reach out across the make-believe barriers of so-called identity to secure the unity of our foundational values, life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness.
Donald Trump has broken through this system and cleared a path for us to reach out to one another, but he's done it in a brutish way, kind of like the incredible Hulk busting through a wall.
That makes a lot of decent people afraid to take advantage of the moment, and it gives fodder to the woke slash racist left and their woke slash racist media servants.
Which brings us back to the fact that politics corrupts because politics is politics.
We only have two realistic choices.
There's no sense pretending there's more.
Personally, I would rather follow the Hulk and walk over the rubble of the identity politics wall to join my fellow Americans of all kinds than I would live inside the prison of identity politics that we were in before Trump arrived.
Let me remind you before I get started today that tomorrow is Mailbag Day, the all-important mailbag day when finally your problems will be solved.
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Many years ago, I was working on a film project with a pal of mine, and he was a black guy, and we both had kids in the same school.
And we were, you know, having one of those late-night conversations driving around LA.
And I said to him, you know, I can't help noticing.
Now our kids were both millennials.
You know, they were millennial kids.
So they're a little older now.
And I said to him, I can't help noticing that these kids don't care about race.
They don't really care about sexuality.
They are able to make friends across all of these barriers.
He said, isn't it maybe time that old men like you and me let them go?
Isn't it time we let the race thing go?
And he turned to me and he said, No, race is everything.
And I feel like we old folks, like dead bodies reaching up out of the grave, have dragged down a generation that was ready to let this go and have brought us them back to this identity politics, which I feel is anti-American.
I feel it's so corrosive.
I feel it's worth talking about, and I feel it's worth it's interesting to watch how Trump is handling it and how his opponents are handling it.
Let me introduce Raynard Jackson.
He's a Pulitzer Prize nominator, nominated columnist, founder, and chairman of Black Americans for a Better Future, BAFBF, a federally registered 527 super PAC established to get more blacks involved in the Republican Party.
He focuses on black entrepreneurs.
Reynolds, are you there?
Hey, how are you doing?
Good, good, Drew.
You seem to have the problem with these words today.
You okay?
I'm tired.
What can I tell you?
It's still early in the morning.
Well, thank you so much for coming on.
I really do appreciate it.
I want to ask you, I mean, you want to bring people in, blacks into the Republican Party, which I think the Republican Party could sorely use.
Is Trump helping or is he hurting?
Both.
He's doing both.
Okay.
His record of accomplishment, especially relative to the black community, is phenomenal.
He's done more for the black community, for example, in the historically black colleges and universities.
He's done more in two years than Obama did in eight years.
Obama devastated the black community as far as the colleges.
Obviously, he talks a lot about the unemployment rate, the First Step Act, et cetera.
But he needs to spend more time talking about his accomplishments and less with the tweeting back and forth of, to me, irrelevant people, to be honest with you.
And then the second thing, Drew, they have got to find some credible, real blacks to be surrogates for the administration, the RNC, the campaign, and have them go across the country.
People like Herman Cain, Jennifer Carroll, they're in Florida.
So there are tons of blacks out there, but they're not being utilized.
And would it work?
Will blacks respond?
I mean, it seems to me that basically the Democrats have just kept this vote in their pocket again and again, despite the fact that they don't seem to do anything.
And they do run all these cities where there's such terrible trouble in these communities.
But Drew, see, you've drank the Kool-Aid as well.
I used to have this conversation with Rush Limbaugh back in the 90s when I did his TV show.
And Rush would always say to me, Jackson, there's a growing trend of conservatism in the black community.
I said, Russ, you're full of crap.
I said, blacks have always been conservative.
We don't need to be persuaded because we already are conservative.
We don't need to be convinced because we know liberalism has failed black.
The only thing we need, Drew, is to be invited to be a part of the team.
That's the difference.
First of all, it's a beautiful thing to hear.
I mean, I find it so frustrating.
I sit here and, you know, I come from a generation where we were taught it's not supposed to matter.
We're all Americans.
We're all in this together.
And it seems that this has devolved into a point where it's almost impossible to hold the conversation.
And what you're saying essentially is that that is a facade put up by the media and the Democrats.
That's not what's really going on.
Right.
And I'm going to tell your audience something, Drew, that probably they're going to find surprising.
I've been black most of my life.
I'm shocked.
You could knock me over with a feather, yeah.
And so I kind of know what the thinking is within my community.
And let me tell you something.
Blacks are asking no.
They're begging, Drew.
They're begging Republican and conservatives.
Give us a reason to vote Republican.
The philosophical issues aren't the problem.
The value system isn't the problem.
This party and the conservative movement, Drew, does not make blacks, including myself, feel like we're welcomed into that.
I've been in the party 30 years.
And I've been delegates to presidential conventions.
I've been the first and only black in Virginia where I live to be elected, national committeeman for the young Republic.
I got all kinds of credentials behind my name.
Graduated from Oral Roberts University, so you can't out-evangelical me.
But yet, Drew, here's 2019, and I'm so tired of being the only black or one of the few blacks at all the events, whether it's the finance events I go to, whether it's just regular party events I go to.
And you know what bothers me, Drew, is one thing if you say to me, Jackson, we don't give a darn about diversity.
At least I know you're aware of the issue, but you just don't care.
But when you are totally oblivious to the lack of diversity, you're the more dangerous person.
You know, I think on the other side of this, I think Republicans feel so beaten down, especially by the press, that they've given up.
I mean, when Mitt Romney went to the NAACP, the NAACP.
Yeah, he got he got.
Say again, I'm sorry.
He didn't listen.
He went anyway.
I advised him not to go.
Because they're a leftist organization.
But not only that, Drew, I am so sick and tired of conservatives when it comes to the black community.
They will go to Al Sharpton's event.
They will go to Jesse Jackson's event.
They will go to the NAACP.
How about this novel thought, Drew?
And I hope you're sitting tight because I'm falling together.
How about letting people like me, Herman Kane and others, put together our own room full of black folks who are friendly to us and have all of our dignitaries come and speak to them?
CPAC in February, you know who they had front and center?
They invited Van Jones.
Yeah, okay.
Okay.
I hear you.
No, it's a perfectly good response.
Hermie Kane, Jennifer Carroll, first black lieutenant governor of the state of Florida, a 20-year Navy vet.
Don't invite her, but you're going to go across the enemy and wonder why as soon as Van Jones gets his 15 minutes of fame with CPAC, he walks out and they call him a bunch of races.
Because the Republican Party has been convinced by the media, basically, that those are the only blacks available.
That's basically the idea, I guess.
The Republican Party, because you know what, Drew?
How about a friend of mine who recently died, but she was the Senate minority leader in the state of Oregon.
Black female civil rights icon.
You have a friend of mine, Lynn Hutchins, in Wyoming, got elected last November to the state senate as a Republican in Wyoming.
You got two 19-year-olds in Connecticut, blacks, at 19 voted to the Board of Education as Republican.
You got a black 20-something-year-old in West Virginia who got voted as a Republican to the state house in West Virginia.
So let's start with the elected officials.
If you claim ignorance and you don't know who we are, don't you know who your own folks are who are elected under the Republican banner?
Really?
Come on, Drew, work with me.
Yeah, no, no, I'm hearing it.
I think it's great.
You're actually giving me hope.
This is a good thing.
So let me ask you specific issues.
You know, we're talking about Baltimore.
We all know these cities are in terrible, terrible trouble.
We all know there hasn't been a Republican passing through Baltimore for 20 years in terms of the government.
They have not had a Republican governor.
I mean, mayor in Baltimore over 50 years.
So what do these communities need?
What should the Republican response be?
Listen, Drew, come on.
It didn't amaze.
You look at Baltimore.
They have not had a Republican mayor in over 50 years.
What does that say?
You have Los Angeles.
They had Mill, I mean, Bradley was mayor of LA for 20 years plus.
You had David Dinkins for eight years in New York.
What do they have?
And Coleman Young in Detroit was mayor like over 20 years, I think.
Now, what do they all have in common, Drew?
They're all Democrats.
They have black.
They aren't black, Democrat, black mayors, a majority black population.
It wasn't until Republicans took over each of those cities with Republican principles that the city's pathologies turned around.
So it's not the color of the elected person's skin that matters.
It's the ideology and the ideas they're pushing.
So that tells me every time when you look at the members of the Congressional Black Caucus, about 45 of them, look at their district.
All of their districts are pissed poor districts, or Trump has been alleged to say, ass-hole countries.
And it has nothing to do with this color of their skin.
It's the policies they're pushing, Drew.
That is the issue.
So my last question.
Can Trump be reached?
Can he make adjustments to get his message out without breaking things all the time, do you think?
Trump is who he is.
At his age, no one changes at that age.
And so the best we can hope to do is to gather enough pressure from his friends and get him to alter some of the things he's doing.
Change, no.
Let's say we get him to decrease his tweeting by 10%.
That's a step in the right direction.
Okay, I'll take it.
Okay.
Rainer Jackson, Pulitzer Prize, nominated columnist, founder and chairman of Black Americans for a Better Future.
I hope you'll come back.
Rainer Jackson's Call for Change00:10:49
I really enjoyed this conversation.
I'd like to talk to you more.
Please do.
Anytime, I'll be there.
All right.
Thanks very much.
I appreciate it.
Okay, bye-bye.
Yeah.
You know, it does make me hopeful because I really do feel that we are wrapped around the media.
You know, the media has power.
It doesn't have as much power as it thinks it does.
It sometimes backfires on the Democrats because the Democrats hear themselves echoed back to themselves and they make the mistake of thinking that the rest of us believe it.
We must believe it because it's the only thing going on.
But it has tremendous power over the people in Washington, D.C. that they do not hear.
I mean, that's an amazing fact when you think about it.
Van Jones invited to speak to conservatives.
Not that we shouldn't hear liberal voices, but where is Herman Kane?
Where are all the young black politicians who want to come into the Republican Party?
It is a problem.
I know this.
I know it is for a fact.
And, you know, it's just, it's just painful to me as like a guy from that generation where we were taught, hey, we can get by past this.
All we got to do is stop.
We got to stop looking at each other in terms of our race.
Once we stop doing that, you know, there's always going to be cultures.
There's always going to be differences.
There's always going to be little tribal glitches in your head.
That is not a problem.
The problem is this philosophical difference where we say that we are permanently divided, that we are different in some kind of essential way.
I mean, the thing about this is when you look at poor communities, they all have the same problems.
Going back in time to poor Irish communities in England, going back to poor communities in France in the 19th century, they all have the same problems because poverty creates, poverty creates the pathologies that continue poverty.
And that is just true no matter what color people are because people are all the same.
You know, I was just looking at what was going on and I was making fun of it in the opening, but it's not really all that funny.
You know, this thing with Donald Trump going after Al Sharpton, Al Sharpton joined the, oh, Baltimore, what a wonderful, wonderful town parade.
And Trump said, I've known Al for 25 years.
I went to fights with him and Don King, always got along well.
He loved Trump.
Trump tweeted.
This is Trump's tweet.
He said, Sharpton would ask me for favors often.
Al as a con man, a troublemaker always looking for a score, just doing his thing, must have intimidated Comcast NBC, hates whites and cops.
And Sharpton went out and he made this speech, I believe it was in Baltimore, hitting back at Trump.
This is cut number two.
As for his attacks on me personally, Donald Trump and I've known each other 25 years.
I've marched on him with Central Park five.
I've dealt with him on the birth issue.
He can say what he wants.
Called me a troublemaker?
Yes, I make trouble for bigots.
I made trouble for him with Central Park.
I made trouble with him for birth.
There isn't.
I'm going to keep making trouble for bigots.
As far as me being a con man, if he really thought I was a con man, he'd be nominating me for his cabinet.
So he doesn't believe that because if you remember right after he was elected, he called me personally and asked me to come meet with him.
And he said, I'm a roaster to come and meet with me.
So he doesn't believe that, but he's playing a race divisive card.
We are here to talk about how we build together and get something done.
In that spirit, let me bring the former chair of the Republican National Committee.
So, you know, Sharpton's funny.
He said, if I were really a con man, he'd appoint me to the cabinet.
That's a funny line.
But the Democrats, who just react to everything Trump does, because Democrats, Democrat being a Democrat, is emotionalism.
They just react to everything he does.
They come out and they rush out to back him.
Let me just read you some of these tweets.
I alluded to them in the opening, but it's worth going back.
Kamala Harris, the Reval, that's his Twitter handle.
The Reval has spent his life fighting for what's right and working to improve our nation, even in the face of hate.
It's shameful yet unsurprising that Trump would continue to attack those who have done so much for our country.
That's Kamala Harris, Elizabeth Warren.
The Reval has dedicated his life to the fight for justice for all.
No amount of racist tweets from the man in the White House will erase that, and we must not let them divide us.
I stand with my friend Al Sharpton in calling out these ongoing attacks on people of color.
Bill de Blasio, I've known the Reval for decades, and Trump's characterization is not only disrespectful, it's untrue.
While the Reval was pushing for justice in the teachings of Dr. King, Trump was calling for the execution of five innocent black boys, innocent, as we say, my buttocks.
Now, this is this guy.
I mean, the history of Al Sharpton is insane.
It's amazing.
I mean, 1987, Tawana Brawley, a young girl, 15-year-old black girl, claimed she had been raped by white people, came out of, was found in a garbage bag with feces and racial epithets written on her body.
One of Sharpton's top aides said Sharpton was pretty well convinced from the very get-go that this was untrue.
But he attached himself to her like a leech, began to drum up her claims, made a big fuss out of it, accused a dead cop, a troubled cop who had committed suicide of being one of the racists, and then accused another man of having killed the cop who committed suicide.
And he still insists that this was a good thing.
After seven months of investigations, a grand jury concluded that it had found, quote, overwhelming evidence that Brawley had entirely fabricated her story and had faked the incident in order to avoid her parents discovering that she had been visiting her boyfriend.
And again, a top aide of Sharpton said he knew this from the very start.
the Crown Heights riot, an absolute, absolute pitiful shame.
This is 1991.
You know, there was a car accident.
A guy was, a Hasidic Jew was actually struck by another car, and then his car veered onto a sidewalk and hit and killed a seven-year-old boy, a Guyanese boy.
So he was black.
Here is some of the stuff Al Sharpton said.
He said, if the Jews want to get it on, tell them to pin their yarmulke's back and come over to my house.
Historically, there's been a lot of tension between blacks and Jews.
A Jewish guy was killed by a black mob in response.
An innocent Jewish guy had nothing to do with anything.
He was killed by a black mob.
And Sharpton did nothing but drum up the anti-Jewish hatred.
And ultimately, there were terrible, terrible riots, among the worst anti-Jewish activity in American history.
And Al Sharpton was right in there stirring it up.
You know, this is something my father was from Baltimore.
My family comes from Baltimore.
My father's father was a pawnbroker, a classic Jewish way to get up out of poverty, worked in black communities.
And my father used to say they hated us because we were the only white people who would deal with them.
We were the only white people who were in their community.
So they knew us face to face and they hated us and they took out their animosity on white people and us because we were there.
And so Al has just spent a lot of time stirring up that hatred between blacks and Jews.
And of course, the people in power love it when minorities fight with each other because that means they're not fighting with the people in power.
1995, Freddy's Fashion Mart, there was a Jewish-owned clothing store.
The people who owned the clothing store, an African-American church, raised the rent on the clothing store.
So in order to pay the raised rent, Freddie's Fashion Mart had to raise the rent on one of the business's sub-tenants, which happened to be a black-owned record store.
So there were protests.
Al Sharpton turned up, again, was, we will not stand by and allow them to move this brother so that some white interloper can expand his business on 125th Street.
This thing was rife, rife with anti-Semitic language.
And finally, a guy went into Freddie's with a gun and flammable liquid, shot several customers, and set the store on fire.
Seven store employees died of smoke inhalation.
And what were they?
They weren't Jews.
They were Hispanic people.
So this is stuff Al Sharpton did.
He slandered the Duke University lacrosse players, accused them of rape.
He helped stir up the Ferguson riots after Michael Brown was shot.
Remember, that was the hands-up, I believe that was the hands-up, don't shoot thing, but we found out later that Brown had charged.
A large guy had charged the cop and the cop was defending himself.
And this is the guy who became an advisor to Obama.
He was in and out of the White House.
Obama, when he realized, you know, I believe, this is my narrative, but I believe when Obama saw that his policies, the policies he was certain would work, actually made things worse.
That's when he reverted to the race card.
That's when he reverted to dividing us and saying, oh, cops were racist.
A lot of them, remember the Dallas cops were murdered.
And I feel that that blood was on Obama's hands.
You know, I'm watching this in agony.
I'm watching it in agony because I really do believe in assimilation.
And assimilation is difficult.
Assimilation is unnatural.
It is natural for us to stick with our own.
You know, Ben and I have this argument about the film Get Out, which I thought was a terrific little horror picture.
And Ben, just the other day, I saw him on the Sunday special saying he thought it had racial problems because it portrayed even nice white people, even friendly white people, as ultimately racist, ultimately people who are going to destroy black people.
I think that's a misreading of the film.
I think the film is showing you in a horror movie the fear black people have that if they assimilate, they will lose their identity.
We all have that fear.
I mean, I wrestled with converting to Christianity for months and months and months because I was afraid that I was betraying my Jewish identity and just somehow trying to assimilate.
We all have that fear.
It is difficult for everybody to assimilate.
The tribal pull is always very powerful.
Remember, that's what The Godfather is about.
So much American art is about assimilation.
That's what The Godfather is about when the Godfather III, Michael Corleone, says you try to get out, but they suck you back in.
That's the opposite side of get out.
It's the idea that you can never, never become fully American, never leave your tribal loyalties behind, which is the other side of it.
It is this terrible tension that assimilation creates.
This identity politics is like a truck driven into this very delicate web that America has tried to create, where we are all in this together.
It is a Christian idea.
In Christ, there is no Jew or Greek.
In freedom, there is no black or white.
That is supposed to be the idea.
I know that there's a history.
I understand that each one of us has gone through things that can never be undone.
Stripped of Title00:11:05
I understand all that.
But this identity politics, it is poison.
It is poisoning the American well.
It is poisoning the American idea.
It's disgusting.
And the fact that our media supports it and our media promulgates it and our media props it up in order to keep Democrats in power, because that's its ultimate goal.
It's certainly not to improve the lives of anybody since it doesn't improve the lives of anybody.
It's just a terrible, terrible thing.
I was very hopeful to hear what Rayner Jackson was saying, that if we can get past this basically this defensive line that the media has put between mainstream Republicans and black people, if we can run through that line, if we can bust through that line,
maybe we can start to look at each other, look each other in the eye and start talking about the things that we really need, that we really need to do to get past some of the problems and bring us together and get back to the idea that we are all one under the American flag.
All right.
I'm going to take a break, but then we're going to have Kathy Zhu, the former Miss Michigan who was stripped of her title by Miss World America because of her tweets.
Come over to dailywire.com while you're there, subscribe.
Then you can be in the mailbag tomorrow.
I will answer all your questions, solve all your problems.
I mean, for 10 lousy bucks, you get all your problems solved.
Not some of your problems solved.
We don't, you know, that's the $5 one.
But for $10 a month, $100 for the year, I will solve all your problems.
Where can you get a better deal than that?
All right.
Kathy Zhu is the former Miss Michigan stripped of her title by Miss World America because of some tweets she sent out.
She is vice president of the College Republicans at the University of Michigan.
Kathy, you're there.
Hi, how you doing?
Hi, how are you?
It is good to see you.
Thank you so much for coming on.
I appreciate it.
Thank you for having me.
I want to hear a little bit of your story because the pageant world is a world I know very little about.
And so I'd like to know some of your background.
You came over here from China when you were five.
Is that right?
Correct.
And do you have any memories of that?
Does your memory go back that far?
Yeah, I do.
And I also have been there back, I think, twice in my life.
Okay.
And how does that affect your outlook?
You know, I hear stories about China every day from my grandparents who are back still in China and my parents.
And I know what the scary censorship and stuff it's like over there to advocate for communism and socialism here is just really, really gross.
All right.
So it helped to give you a more conservative point of view.
Is that fair to say?
Yes.
And you seemed, were you a Trump supporter from the very beginning?
No, I actually wasn't.
In high school, my friends liked Obama.
So I said, you know what?
I like Obama too because he's cool.
He's a cool president.
But after all, I searched up some facts, did some research myself online, and I've noticed that my leanings lean towards the right.
And then that's when I switched over and became a conservative.
So at what point did you become interested in pageants?
Is that something you did your whole life or was it later on?
No, this is my first pageant ever that I participated in.
So this is actually a bucky list checkoff.
So this turned into a really interesting experience.
So this is just something you thought this is one of these days I'd like to do a pageant.
So again, this is something I know almost nothing about.
So walk me through it a little bit.
What do you do when you want to enter a pageant?
So usually pageants are the traditional type, which is you put an application and then you go compete amongst every other contestant.
For mine, it was a bit different because mine was still new in America.
Miss World is actually a very popular organization in other parts of the country, but it just started up in America, especially in Michigan.
This is the first time ever that they had a Michigan person to represent.
So mine was just an application, a video entry, a resume, volunteer hours, like online meetup.
And then we basically got appointed after they selected a candidate from this group of applicants.
Okay.
So, and then when you get selected as a candidate, what do you have to do to win the pageant?
I mean, you won the pageant, right?
You were the crown.
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah.
So as I said, we have to submit all these hours of volunteer hours, an interview, a video submission.
And after that, we come together with Miss Indiana and the teens, and we just bond and talk about our experience and stuff.
And then we do a photo shoot, which then goes to the national if we want to compete in that.
How long after you won were you stripped of the title?
So I was actually, I was crowned on Sunday and then I was announced on Wednesday.
Then I got stripped of the title on Thursday.
So a day.
All right.
So that was, that was pretty quick.
And it happened because of some tweets.
Correct.
Two particular tweets.
All right.
So before you tell me what was in the tweets, how did those tweets come to light?
I actually have no idea.
I think that someone probably emailed them or someone reached out to them.
I'm not too sure.
But I think that they weren't the ones who initially found it because if they did, they would have, you know, I think they would have told me to be out immediately, but it didn't.
I think that first they should have vetted me better, honestly, if they wanted someone to not be conservative.
Second, they should have listened to my standpoint and my views and listened to what I had to say about those tweets before they removed.
And they didn't.
They just said, you're out.
You're gone.
Not at all.
I mean, obviously, this is something people do.
I mean, every time somebody wins a Heisman trophy or any kind of award, people seem to go back into their tweet history.
What did the tweets say?
So one of the tweets was talking about black and black violence.
It was in response to another tweet, and this person was saying how, I mean, he was tweeting all day about how cops are racist, cops are pigs, cops are killing innocent black people.
And I got frustrated and I replied to one of the tweets and I said, you know, the majority of black deaths are caused by other black people.
So fix problems within your own communities before pushing out this narrative on other people.
And apparently that was racist, even though that was facts, statistics.
It's found on the FBS website.
That was one of them.
The second one was about a hijab.
And it was basically my past university in Florida before I transferred to Michigan.
I walked past this booth and I said, try on a hijab.
It was apparently trying a hijab day, which I had no idea that was a thing.
I went over and I was like, okay, that's really interesting.
So I took a picture of the booth.
And one of the girls came up to me and said, hey, do you want to try on a hijab?
And she was going to put it over me.
And I said, no, it's okay.
I'm already late for class.
I got to go.
So after that, I posted it online.
I said, is this a religious garment or is this a fashion statement?
Like, what are you trying to prove here?
There's women right now, you know, struggling right now in Muslim-majority countries and they're being oppressed.
And yet you're not talking about that.
Instead, you want to focus on how fun it is to wear a hijab.
It was just ridiculous.
You know, what's interesting to me about this is, you know, they write out introductions for me so I can introduce my guests.
And in the introduction, it said that you were stripped of your title because of insensitive tweets, which, and I left that word out because I'm not sure.
Those are insensitive and you don't seem to feel apologetic for them at all.
Am I right?
Yeah, not at all.
No, I stand by everything that's on my Twitter account.
When I post something, it's either my firm opinion or it's either I researched something and that's statistics and facts presented to you right there.
So for me to apologize, it's just like apologizing for my morals and values.
So I don't apologize.
So when they stripped you, they didn't talk to you.
They didn't give you a chance to defend yourself.
What would you say to them if they were capable of listening?
You know, if they were actually willing to ask me, hey, what were you thinking about these tweets?
What were your intentions?
I would say, you know, my intentions weren't to be insensitive.
My intentions was to first back up the law enforcement from people who think that they're all pigs putting a blanket statement over cops.
And then another one is that I don't want to be forced to put on something I don't want to put on, especially, you know, pageants are all about women, empowerment, women's body, my choice, stuff like that.
If I don't want to put something on, I'm not going to put something on.
So for them to force me basically to put a hijab on to be not Islamophobic, that's just wrong.
You know, I've paid a price for my opinions in Hollywood, not getting work in Hollywood that I think I would have otherwise gotten.
And one of the questions I get asked all the time is, what do I do?
How do I speak out?
Is it worth speaking out?
How do you feel about that?
You were stripped of your title.
Now, in your case, this was a bucket list thing, but there are some, pardon me, there are some women who want these pageants very desperately.
It is one of their ambitions, one of their career goals.
What do you say to people who ask you whether they should speak out?
You know, I think it depends on what you actually want in life.
For me, I like being a fighter.
I like being able to express my opinions.
I like that we have to, you know, we have to protect conservative people right now, especially in today's political climate.
Everyone, the media, you know, school teachers, colleges, they're all left-leaning.
And for us to be diminished because we don't speak out is just wrong.
And I think that conservatives especially need to speak out and form an alliance basically saying that, hey, we are still present.
We are still here.
We have an opinion and you can't turn us into liberals.
So it's just like that.
What do you plan to do now to keep your voice alive and to keep saying the things that you're saying?
So I did political commentary ever since probably senior or junior year of high school, ever since I became a conservative.
And I'm still going to continue doing that.
I'm going to be, you know, I've been campaigning for a lot of candidates and in other states.
And I just plan to keep doing that and stand up for what I believe in and keep talking about it.
Well, good for you, Kathy, on this show.
You remain Michigan.
And we thank you for coming on.
I appreciate your talking to me.
Thank you.
Thanks a lot.
Just really, truly an incredible thing that we're going through.
Teachers being fired for having beliefs in, you know, like I said in the introduction, it said that was written for me.
It said she was thrown out for insensitive tweets, but I don't think those tweets are insensitive.
I don't think it's insensitive to say that a hijab comes along with a certain point of view, a certain religious point of view, and to try it on as if it were just a fashion statement is absurd.
I don't think it's at all prejudiced to point out that black-on-black violence is what costs black lives.
If black lives matter, then we have to sort of tell the truth about how they're being lost and what's going on about them.
So it's not as if she said something racist or something cruel or something that shouldn't be said.
She just spoke the truth as she saw it and spoke her point of view.
And if that's going to cost you your crown, I think the pageant, Miss World America, is not very American and actually is not going to help the world.
All right, let me end with a final reflection, which had to be what I thought was one of the saddest stories I read, certainly yesterday, but for a while.
This is a story about Candace Buznell.
Why Money Isn't Everything00:05:55
She's now 60, but back in the 80s, I guess it was, 80s and 90s, she wrote the Sex in the City column that later became the famous TV series starring Sarah Jessica Parker.
And the TV series, which I only saw once or twice, I kind of sampled it because it was such a big deal, but it wasn't something that I was interested in.
But a lot of people said, and I actually think this is true, that it was written by gay guys and it was actually not about four women.
It was about four women fronting for the opinions of these gay guys.
And some of the conversations about sex really did sound like gay guys and not like women talking about sex.
But the point of this was, was the idea of really enjoying yourself, of having sex, of being free to have the kind of sex you want.
There was a romantic strain in it.
People were looking for love, but it was this continual idea of sex not having a moral component.
In other words, if you had sex promiscuously, you were not violating any kind of a moral code.
And this is an idea that was being sold to people for a long time.
So anyway, the story here is that Candace Buzznell now says she regrets choosing a career over having children, as she is now, at 60, truly alone.
She divorced her husband, a ballet dancer, in 2012, and said it made her realize the importance of starting a family.
She's worth around 18 million pounds.
This is a British paper reporting this.
And she says, when I was in my 30s and 40s, I didn't think about it.
Then when I got divorced and I was in my 50s, I started to see the impact of not having children and of truly being alone.
I do see that people with children have an anchor in a way that people don't who have no kids.
And she goes on to talk about the fact that there is no one to care for you in your old age.
She has to rely on girlfriends instead of the children who would take care of her.
I couldn't help but notice, and I don't mean this as an attack on her because we're all guilty of this to some degree, I couldn't help but notice that even now, the same reasons that she followed the promiscuity path, which were selfish reasons, are the reasons she wants to have had a child, the selfish reasons.
She's alone.
She wants someone to take care of her.
And it points out to me the essential materialism of leftism, which I've talked about before.
Leftism is a materialist creed.
It is a creed that says I can fix this if two people have unequal amounts of money.
I can take money away from one and give it to the other, and then they will be equal.
And of course, the flaw in that is it doesn't look into the idea of why one person has more money than the other, why taking the money away and giving it to this other person might hurt that person, as if that person were not just a material entity who, when you gave them more money, had more Money, but was it also a spiritual entity who was going to behave in certain ways that might hurt him whether he had the money or not?
So, this essential materialism of leftism and the essential selfishness of materialism.
Under materialism, there's really no reason to do anything for anybody else.
Truly, there's not, except to your own advantage.
You have kids because they'll take care of you in your old age and you won't be truly alone.
But the thing is, if you have a spiritual idea of life, if you have an idea that we're not just physical entities, we're not just meat puppets who can be controlled with drugs, who can be satiated with food and sex, who can be made equal with money, if you don't look at it that way, if you look at us as entities, entire entities who are selves, you start to think about other things.
The religious point of view, the spiritual point of view, is that things have a purpose.
Things are whole and have a purpose.
Sex has a purpose.
It has a lot of purposes.
It has varying purposes, but it does have a purpose.
Your profession has a purpose.
Life has a purpose.
And one of the purposes of physical life, when looked at as being part of spiritual life, one of the purposes of life is to create life, is to give the gift that you've been given to someone else.
That is one of the reasons that you have children.
It's not.
You know, people always say, well, parents of young children are not among the happiest people.
That's true, but that doesn't mean they're not among the most fulfilled people.
Having children opens up a wall that you didn't even know was there, turns your two-dimensional life that you thought was a three-dimensional life into a truly three-dimensional life.
It deepens your sadness and it deepens your joy.
It deepens everything about your life because it is the purpose of your body.
The purpose of your body and its life is to create more life.
And when you do things for their purpose, you suddenly find they're harder.
The world may not be as kind to you as it would be if you do it for the world.
And you'll find you are much more richly fulfilled and happier.
I don't sit down and write to make money.
I don't sit down and write so that people will applaud me.
I sit down and write because I think there's something inside me that is trying to communicate itself that I was given.
It was given to me to do this.
And I try to do it with that spirit.
I really do every day.
I like making money off it.
I like the fact that I can make a profession out of it.
I like the fact that sometimes it wins me praise.
Writers want to be read and writers want to be praised.
I'm not denying any of that, but I know that the purpose of it is something other than that.
And the purpose of life is to make life.
And I think it's something that we have been talked out of, especially women by feminists who are idiots.
They have been talked out of their own purpose, their central purpose.
It is the central purpose of your physical being.
And I thought when I read that about Candace Buzznell, the first thing that took me that occurred to me is, you know what?
There's no going back.
There's no going back.
That's a mistake you cannot correct.
And it is an essential mistake.
And I think that everybody should be thinking about it and breaking out of the chains that the left has surrounded us, the materialist chains, which are also chains of selfishness.
I'm going to stop there.
Tomorrow is the mailbag.
Get your questions in now.
Writers And Their Purpose00:01:27
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Hit that mailbag image and pour your questions in there because all your problems will be solved.
I'm Andrew Clavin.
This is The Andrew Klavan Show.
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And our supervising producers are Mathis Glover and Robert Sterling.
Edited by Adam Sayovitz.
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The Andrew Clavin Show is a Daily Wire production.
Copyright Daily Wire 2019.
Hey guys, over on the Matt Wall Show today.
Democrats are rushing to the defense of Al Sharpton just a day after insisting that Baltimore is a wonderful and safe city.
We'll talk about how the Democrats are managing to lose every argument with Trump because they insist on taking the extreme opposite position from whatever position he just took, no matter what it was.
Also, should cops be pulling people over to give out prizes as rewards for following the law?
And a student is accused of sexual assault because he quote unquote cajoled a woman into sex with flattery.