Knowledge Fight - #298: January 20-23, 2013
Aired: 2019-05-20
Duration: 02:21:55


=== Why I Faked an Injury (03:40) ===

[00:00:00]  Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.
[00:00:01]  Thanks for holding.
[00:00:04]  Hello, Alex.
[00:00:04]  I'm a first-time caller.
[00:00:05]  I'm a huge fan.
[00:00:06]  I love your work.
[00:00:07]  I love you.
[00:00:07]  Hey, everybody.
[00:00:08]  Welcome back to Knowledge Fight.
[00:00:09]  I'm Dan.
[00:00:10]  I'm Jordan.
[00:00:10]  We're a couple dudes.
[00:00:11]  Like to sit around, drink novelty beverages, and talk about Alex Jones.
[00:00:14]  I'm trying to be creative.
[00:00:15]  I like it.
[00:00:18]  I think that was a Marty DeRosa.
[00:00:20]  I don't know what that was.
[00:00:22]  I don't know.
[00:00:23]  Novelty beverages.
[00:00:27]  Got a question?
[00:00:30]  Dan!
[00:00:31]  Good.
[00:00:33]  When was the last time you played an organized sport?
[00:00:36]  Organized sport, that's interesting.
[00:00:38]  It's been a long time.
[00:00:39]  I played basketball in junior high, in middle school.
[00:00:44]  And then I played football when I went to junior high.
[00:00:47]  And I was not good, and I faked an injury.
[00:00:50]  That's a good idea.
[00:00:51]  In order to not have to play.
[00:00:53]  I went to the doctor because I had some knee pain.
[00:00:56]  And I went to the doctor and he looked at my tendons or something.
[00:01:00]  He was checking me out, and he said I had something called Osgoode Schlotter Syndrome.
[00:01:04]  Which is where the tendons in your knee grow separately.
[00:01:08]  But if you don't, most of the time it resolves itself as you get older.
[00:01:12]  But I use that as an excuse not to play because two days were really hard.
[00:01:18]  They sucked, didn't they?
[00:01:18]  They were brutal.
[00:01:19]  I just got regular injuries and have a high chance of CTE.
[00:01:25]  I was told that I would be on the line too, like on the offensive line.
[00:01:29]  And I just was like, I'm not going to run into somebody over and over again.
[00:01:33]  This doesn't seem like the part of the game I was interested in.
[00:01:37]  Right, right, right, right.
[00:01:38]  Not a team player, and so I stopped that.
[00:01:42]  Did you ever participate in any?
[00:01:44]  You know, comedians have had the rare meetup where they play softball or something like that.
[00:01:48]  They play softball with Joe Fernandez and Nate Burroughs and all that.
[00:01:52]  Yeah, yeah, I'd play that.
[00:01:53]  That was bad.
[00:01:53]  That was real bad.
[00:01:54]  Yeah, well.
[00:01:55]  Also, my buddies back in Columbia were in a bowling league.
[00:01:59]  And I never bowled in their league, but I would come to the bowling alley with them because we would just get pitchers and get really fucked up.
[00:02:05]  Right, right, right, right.
[00:02:06]  Now, that's perfect.
[00:02:06]  Yeah, we would just get really drunk, and we had a rule.
[00:02:09]  There's a rule that if you didn't close your frame, you didn't get to sit down.
[00:02:14]  That's about all I remember.
[00:02:16]  We just get really drunk and scream.
[00:02:18]  Yeah.
[00:02:18]  Oh, man.
[00:02:19]  It sounds like my ideal night.
[00:02:20]  Yeah, it was a good time.
[00:02:21]  No, I'm not much into team sports.
[00:02:24]  Well, as an adult, especially.
[00:02:26]  But, I mean, I would still go play softball if those comedians invited me again.
[00:02:29]  Yeah, that'd be fun.
[00:02:30]  Maybe.
[00:02:30]  I'd do it.
[00:02:31]  I've never gotten an invite.
[00:02:32]  Well, I don't think we were as good of friends back when I was playing softball with the boys.
[00:02:37]  That's a song, isn't it?
[00:02:38]  Yeah, that's playing with the boys.
[00:02:40]  Playing softball with the boys.
[00:02:41]  Nope, that's volleyball from Top Gun.
[00:02:45]  After Chasing Sunsets.
[00:02:47]  What's that?
[00:02:48]  One of life's greatest joys.
[00:02:49]  Of course.
[00:02:50]  Playing with the boys.
[00:02:52]  Lyric from that Keddy Logan.
[00:02:56]  Let's get into the actual show.
[00:02:58]  We are taking too long.
[00:02:59]  All right.
[00:03:00]  All right.
[00:03:00]  So, Jordan, today we got an interesting episode to go over.
[00:03:02]  We're going over January 20th through 23rd, 2013, because I was looking at stuff this weekend and I was just thinking, I cannot talk about the present day.
[00:03:13]  I just don't want to do it.
[00:03:15]  I'm not leaving the present day behind.
[00:03:17]  We'll get back to it probably for Wednesday.
[00:03:20]  But I was just in a state of mind that I was like, I can't do it.
[00:03:24]  And I'm too curious about what's going on with the 2013 investigation looking into Alex's coverage of Sandy Hook, especially after Paul Joseph Watson interviewed Professor James Tracy on the last episode.

=== Why We Talk About Abortion (03:48) ===

[00:03:37]  I was very interested to see what would happen from that.
[00:03:39]  And my curiosity could not be contained.
[00:03:41]  Yeah, I mean, if you want to know our opinion on current day events, I believe we just did an episode fairly recently where we talked about how all abortion should be legal.
[00:03:52]  Yeah.
[00:03:52]  Period.
[00:03:53]  Period.
[00:03:54]  Well, I'm sure Alex is talking about that, and I think there is some value to us covering that, which is why I'm not leaving the present day.
[00:04:01]  And that's not really why I decided not to get into it.
[00:04:05]  It's that I watched a couple episodes, and some of the stuff I was just like, I don't fucking, I don't think it's, I don't think it's good to cover this.
[00:04:12]  Yeah.
[00:04:12]  And I'm not talking about the abortion bills because that is something that I think that we have not, I think we're pretty clear where we stand.
[00:04:19]  Yeah, but I think you've, yeah.
[00:04:20]  But I also don't think that maybe we've done enough in terms of vocalizing some things.
[00:04:26]  And especially, you know, we don't tweet much or get involved in social media.
[00:04:31]  So I feel like we may be a little derelict in pushing publicly our support of opposition to these bills.
[00:04:39]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:04:40]  So that's something that's worthwhile to talk about, especially when we get back to the present day.
[00:04:45]  That's not what is bothering.
[00:04:47]  Let's not worry about it.
[00:04:49]  So we'll get into some stuff.
[00:04:53]  But first, we've got to get into saying thank you to the people who have signed up and are supporting the show.
[00:04:58]  So first of all, I'd like to say thank you to Emily.
[00:05:00]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:00]  You are now a policy wonk.
[00:05:02]  I'm a policy wonk.
[00:05:03]  Thank you, Emily.
[00:05:03]  Thank you, Emily.
[00:05:04]  Next, James.
[00:05:05]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:06]  You are now a policy wonk.
[00:05:07]  I'm a policy wonk.
[00:05:08]  Thank you, Jake.
[00:05:09]  Thank you, James.
[00:05:10]  Next, Jake.
[00:05:11]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:11]  You are now a policy wonk.
[00:05:13]  I'm a policy wonk.
[00:05:14]  Thank you, James.
[00:05:15]  Thank you, Jake.
[00:05:16]  Next, Amberly.
[00:05:16]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:17]  You are now a policy wonk.
[00:05:19]  I'm a policy wonk.
[00:05:20]  Thank you, Emberly.
[00:05:21]  Now, finally, I'd like to say thank you to somebody who took their donation, bumped it up a little bit.
[00:05:25]  Bumped it up.
[00:05:26]  We appreciate that very much.
[00:05:27]  So much so, in fact, that I have a new drop.
[00:05:31]  Uh-oh, this is the whole reason that we're here.
[00:05:33]  The technocrat level.
[00:05:34]  Yeah.
[00:05:35]  So, Courtney, thank you so much.
[00:05:36]  You are now a technocrat and the first to hear this new drop.
[00:05:41]  I'm a policy wonk.
[00:05:42]  Crikey, Mike, that's fantastic.
[00:05:44]  Have yourself a brood.
[00:05:45]  How's your 401k doing, bro?
[00:05:47]  We got to go full-telt buggy on this, Watson.
[00:05:49]  There we go.
[00:05:50]  Get out of business.
[00:05:51]  We ain't making that money off that heroin.
[00:05:53]  Why are you pimps so good?
[00:05:55]  My neck is freakishly large.
[00:05:57]  I declare info war on you.
[00:05:59]  Thank you so much, Courtney.
[00:06:01]  Thank you very much, Courtney.
[00:06:03]  Congratulations, Courtney.
[00:06:04]  I'm not sure if that is as good as our old Technocrat drop.
[00:06:08]  We'll see how the reviews come in.
[00:06:10]  It's going to be hard to beat baby shark parts, though.
[00:06:12]  That's true.
[00:06:14]  You might, by popular demand, be asked to splice that back in there somewhere.
[00:06:17]  Anyway, I do not respond to terrorists, but I do take feedback.
[00:06:22]  Gentle criticism.
[00:06:24]  If you'd like to support our show and what we do, you can do that by going to our website, knowledgefight.com, clicking that button that says support the show.
[00:06:29]  We would appreciate it.
[00:06:30]  Please do.
[00:06:31]  So now, Jordan, I told you that I don't want to talk about the present day, but I was listening to May 15th, 2019, and Alex said something on the episode that made me think that we're having an effect on his world.
[00:06:44]  Okay.
[00:06:44]  I'm not entirely sure, but I think that we're responsible for this clip.
[00:06:50]  This is one of the first times that I've heard Alex say something on the show that I don't think can have anything to do with anybody but us.

=== Alex Jones Defense (06:27) ===

[00:06:59]  This blew my mind.
[00:07:00]  The media and the left brings up things I never said in my voice and then tells people, did you hear what Alex is doing?
[00:07:07]  Why he paid for his college tuition for his kids on you?
[00:07:10]  Why he made $80 billion off you?
[00:07:12]  Why he talks about you every day?
[00:07:14]  None of that's even true.
[00:07:17]  And now the new thing is, Alex Jones killed people.
[00:07:23]  Alex Jones is a murderer.
[00:07:25]  Alex Jones is in prison.
[00:07:27]  He's seen Billy Weaver and other videos on the street with Hitler Benn and others.
[00:07:32]  And people walk up and they go, Alex Jones is in prison for murder.
[00:07:37]  And we all kind of laugh and go, ha.
[00:07:38]  But see, I guess in their weird group collective or however this thing works, I'm not sure.
[00:07:45]  They think I'm in prison now.
[00:07:48]  They said I was being sued by Sandy Hook before I was.
[00:07:54]  And now they say I'm in prison for murdering people.
[00:07:58]  So I think that this might be a sort of straw man-y version of people accusing him of killing people.
[00:08:04]  Which I've never heard anybody but us talk about.
[00:08:08]  Never.
[00:08:10]  That's not like a criticism that comes up in, I don't know, right-wing watch pieces about him.
[00:08:17]  But we're the only people who consider this episode pointing out that Alex killed a guy.
[00:08:25]  Now they're saying I'm in prison.
[00:08:27]  No, we're just saying you definitely, probably technically killed a guy, Alex.
[00:08:31]  I don't know if this has anything to do with us, but it was one of the things that I was like, wow.
[00:08:35]  That's wild.
[00:08:36]  Yeah, it seems very strange.
[00:08:38]  So we're going to get to this the 20th to the 23rd of January, 2013.
[00:08:43]  There's a lot of big stuff that happens in this.
[00:08:45]  There's an interesting trend that we can track, and then a couple of big narratives and big things that we've got to get into.
[00:08:53]  So I'm excited to do that.
[00:08:54]  But before we do, here is an out-of-context drop from today's show.
[00:08:58]  Yeah, I pee in my backyard.
[00:08:59]  I mean, who does?
[00:09:00]  Fair enough.
[00:09:02]  Cool, cool, cool.
[00:09:03]  All right.
[00:09:03]  Nothing against it.
[00:09:04]  I'm not going to go.
[00:09:05]  Yeah, we grew up in rural America.
[00:09:07]  You peed in the backyard.
[00:09:08]  Yep.
[00:09:09]  So here's what I'm going to say right off the top: January 20th is a clip show.
[00:09:13]  That is a Sunday.
[00:09:14]  And so he just is still on vacation to play his clips.
[00:09:17]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:09:18]  January 21st, Alex is out of studio, but we don't need to talk about that episode.
[00:09:22]  Mike Adams fills in as the host, and he just talks to that sheriff, Denny Payman, the guy who arrested a judge.
[00:09:27]  Again?
[00:09:28]  Well, Alex talked to him the first time, and now he's having him back.
[00:09:30]  That's what I'm saying.
[00:09:31]  Because he's talking shit about how he's not going to enforce gun laws.
[00:09:34]  So he's an all-star for InfoWars.
[00:09:36]  So Mike Adams has him in, interviews him.
[00:09:38]  He talks to an author whose name is Max Velocity.
[00:09:41]  And if gun.
[00:09:44]  Tell me what he wrote.
[00:09:45]  Gun to my head, I don't remember.
[00:09:48]  I couldn't tell you anything that he did or what that interview was about, but his name is Max Velocity.
[00:09:54]  Max Velocity, writer of most speed.
[00:09:56]  Yeah.
[00:09:57]  And then at the end, he brings in our boy, John Rappaport, to have a little chat.
[00:10:01]  It's a useless episode.
[00:10:02]  Although, it is worth noting that January 21st, 2013 was the day of Obama's second inauguration.
[00:10:08]  On the day of his first inauguration, Alex left the show to go get interviewed on RT for a little while.
[00:10:14]  And on his second inauguration, Alex wasn't even in the studio.
[00:10:17]  For someone who's so committed to the fight against the globalists and Obama, he seems to not ever be around on big news days or be totally fine to just leave the ship.
[00:10:26]  Yeah.
[00:10:27]  It's very weird.
[00:10:28]  That's probably calculated on his side so he doesn't work himself up into too much of a frenzy.
[00:10:34]  It's possible.
[00:10:35]  Or I don't know, man, because some of the times it's just a complete coincidence.
[00:10:39]  Like, he couldn't have known in advance that the Pope would step down.
[00:10:42]  Right.
[00:10:42]  But he was out of studio on the day that he did.
[00:10:45]  Did he know in advance that the Pope stepped out?
[00:10:47]  Now we're talking into some serious territory.
[00:10:50]  Yes.
[00:10:52]  So here we go.
[00:10:53]  We're going to jump in on the 22nd.
[00:10:55]  Here is the first clip.
[00:10:57]  Alex is getting a little bit defensive about people saying that he doesn't know what he's talking about and that he's kind of making stuff up.
[00:11:05]  Fans think I'm super smart and that, man, how does he keep knowing what's going to happen?
[00:11:11]  And then my detractors think I'm up here writing science fiction on the air, telling you what I imagine is going to happen because it's so fantastical.
[00:11:22]  And it's neither one.
[00:11:25]  I've read hundreds of books and probably over a thousand different white papers put out by the CFR, put out by the Club of Rome.
[00:11:33]  You say, where are they?
[00:11:34]  What is the endgame.com?
[00:11:35]  Has a bibliography on that film.
[00:11:37]  Great place to start.
[00:11:38]  Uh-oh.
[00:11:40]  Are we going back to Microsoft and Carta?
[00:11:43]  Yeah, for those of you who have not listened to our coverage of Alex's documentary Endgame, I should explain why that clip is really fucked up.
[00:11:49]  Alex's bibliography for Endgame is mostly just citations to Ancarta pages for things that don't actually support his claims at all, links to Infowars articles he wrote himself, and tons of entries that just say insert citation here, evidencing a completely incomplete work that he never felt the need to finish.
[00:12:06]  It was hard.
[00:12:07]  Yeah.
[00:12:08]  And for a lot of those entries where he needed to insert a citation later, he could never have completed his task because there were bibliography entries presuming to provide a citation to something that doesn't exist, often completely manufactured quotes.
[00:12:20]  His bibliography for Endgame is complete shit.
[00:12:23]  And a high school teacher wouldn't even let it fly as acceptable for a term paper, much less for a documentary presuming to prove a grand conspiracy bent on global enslavement and depopulation.
[00:12:33]  Even people who believe Alex should really see this bibliography as damning proof that he has no idea what he's talking about.
[00:12:39]  WhatistheEndgame.com was a website that Alex used to redirect to EndgameTheMovie.com.
[00:12:44]  But this episode that we're listening to here is in 2013.
[00:12:48]  And according to snapshots on the Wayback Machine, the URL, at is the endgame.com, has not worked as a redirect since at least 2008.
[00:12:56]  It's been five years since this has been an appropriate place to direct his listeners.
[00:13:02]  So if you were to actually.
[00:13:04]  So even him giving you the link to the bibliography that doesn't actually exist, the link itself doesn't even exist anymore.

=== Alex Jones' Gun Control Rage (15:19) ===

[00:13:14]  That is next level.
[00:13:15]  And hadn't for five years.
[00:13:17]  That's next level shit right there.
[00:13:19]  That's sloppy.
[00:13:20]  He doesn't care.
[00:13:20]  He doesn't care about proving his business.
[00:13:23]  So Alex is pretty mad about gun control stuff, as he always is.
[00:13:27]  And there was a Time magazine issue that came out that had some people on the cover who were working towards gun regulation and sensible gun laws.
[00:13:37]  And Alex is pretty mad about it.
[00:13:39]  And then I've got to sit there and see Time magazine, the gunfighters.
[00:13:44]  And on the cover of it, it shows Biden, Bloomberg, and shooting victim Giffords.
[00:13:52]  What?
[00:13:53]  What?
[00:13:54]  You can't do that.
[00:13:55]  And you know what's interesting is she was pro-gun before she got, and she pretty much still is.
[00:13:59]  I don't know how they got her to be part of this.
[00:14:01]  I guess she's been obviously injured, shot in the head.
[00:14:05]  So we don't have time to right now cover all of the details of the Gabrielle Giffords shooting and also not just her being shot, a lot of other people, including a nine-year-old girl who was killed in that shooting.
[00:14:18]  We will get into that at some point.
[00:14:20]  I promise everybody that I know that we've gotten some requests to cover that because I'm sure Alex's behavior is terrible.
[00:14:27]  Yeah, well, just the way he flippantly said, she got blue or whatever.
[00:14:31]  He did that sort of mocking voice about shooting victims.
[00:14:34]  Oh, yeah, sure.
[00:14:34]  She got hit in the head with a bullet, whatever people call that these days.
[00:14:38]  Right.
[00:14:39]  And the only thing that I would point out about this, and the only thing that I really want to draw attention to, is the difference between how Alex is treating this and Steve Scalise.
[00:14:50]  The idea that he turned Steve Scalise's shooting into proof of Antifa Democrat hunting Republicans and all of that.
[00:14:59]  And then he's mocking Gabrielle Giffords.
[00:15:02]  It just is pretty bad.
[00:15:06]  Well, people on the right really don't like it whenever they are the results of their own actions, you know?
[00:15:15]  And so they have to undercut any other possible results of their actions.
[00:15:21]  In order to preserve the ability to scream bloody murder about when Republicans are attacked by gun violence, they have to minimize whenever anybody else is attacked by it.
[00:15:32]  I guess.
[00:15:32]  Yeah, I suppose so.
[00:15:34]  You gotta save your energy.
[00:15:36]  Yeah.
[00:15:37]  I don't think that there's anything wrong with criticizing Giffords for her political positions, if that's what you want to do.
[00:15:44]  Like, I still think it's fine to call Steve Scalise a piece of shit.
[00:15:47]  Yeah, he still is.
[00:15:48]  But at the same time, it's not okay to mock him being shot.
[00:15:52]  Yeah.
[00:15:52]  It's not okay to mock Gabrielle Giffords being the victim of an attempted assassination.
[00:15:58]  That's not okay.
[00:15:59]  You could critique her positions, but that's not what he's doing.
[00:16:02]  Yeah, imagine he was talking about Reagan getting shot, and he was like, oh, alleged shooting victim, President Reagan.
[00:16:09]  He might have done that if he was on the air.
[00:16:11]  All right, well then, yeah.
[00:16:13]  Okay, well, then I applaud him for consistency, I suppose.
[00:16:16]  So at this point in history, in January 2013, Alex was pretty focused on Piers Morgan.
[00:16:25]  Of course.
[00:16:25]  He had recently gone on Piers Morgan's show.
[00:16:28]  Kicked his ass all over the place.
[00:16:29]  Oh, my God.
[00:16:30]  All over the floor.
[00:16:30]  All over the entire set.
[00:16:32]  Where, wah, wah, get him out of here.
[00:16:34]  All of the staff offered to work for Alex.
[00:16:36]  Took over his show.
[00:16:37]  CNN pays Alex now just to not go on there now.
[00:16:40]  Alex took all the craft service and complained about it.
[00:16:43]  And everyone was like, you are right, Alex.
[00:16:45]  This is shitty.
[00:16:47]  Even the two Secret Service agents shot him in the hallway.
[00:16:50]  He bested Piers in about every way.
[00:16:53]  And that's great.
[00:16:56]  So he's let this drop a little bit here by the 22nd.
[00:17:00]  He's kind of...
[00:17:01]  It's old news.
[00:17:02]  Yeah, he's moved on a little bit towards trying to get Obama impeached.
[00:17:07]  Yeah.
[00:17:08]  That's great.
[00:17:08]  Maybe he'll get invited onto Obama's cabinet.
[00:17:12]  But there's a new clip of Piers Morgan that Alex has found, and this just adds fuel to Alex's fire that Piers Morgan wants to kill all the gun owners.
[00:17:22]  Of course.
[00:17:23]  And here's how Alex brings it up.
[00:17:25]  See, they want to kill you.
[00:17:26]  You have to understand.
[00:17:27]  They want to kill you and then rape your wife.
[00:17:30]  Not these people specifically individually, but that's where this leads.
[00:17:33]  That's what tyrants end up doing.
[00:17:35]  Here it is.
[00:17:36]  But what do you need a semi-automatic weapon for?
[00:17:39]  The only reason I think you need it is, Piers, challenge Alex Jones to a boxing match, show up with a semi-automatic that you got legally, and pop him.
[00:17:48]  I'd love to see that in uniform.
[00:17:52]  And then Piers goes and goes, yeah, I'll wear my brother's uniform.
[00:17:54]  So again, these guys are low-level minions.
[00:17:56]  They just fantasize about shooting me.
[00:17:58]  That was the clip that Alex has already played.
[00:18:00]  That's busted messenger, and we've uniformly condemned that and said that was the fucking stupidest thing anybody could have done.
[00:18:06]  Listening to it again, I do think she thought that he meant like hitting him in the face with the butt of the gun.
[00:18:13]  Or possibly, he says it as a boxing match.
[00:18:15]  Yeah, exactly.
[00:18:17]  I don't know.
[00:18:18]  I can't pretend to understand or know what someone is experiencing in the moment or what they are interpreting.
[00:18:24]  Right.
[00:18:24]  But it doesn't feel like she's responding to someone saying you should kill this guy.
[00:18:27]  Exactly.
[00:18:28]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:18:29]  But whatever.
[00:18:30]  Alex still, no matter how much I disagree with him about everything, he's right to not accept someone talking about him like that, especially on national television.
[00:18:39]  I agree.
[00:18:39]  Unfortunately, he makes way too big a deal out of it.
[00:18:43]  But the higher level ones, not these little guys, but history shows, they want to burn cities, loot, take over.
[00:18:49]  Let's go out to break with this next Piers Morgan clip.
[00:18:51]  Here he is talking about killing all of us.
[00:18:53]  Here it is.
[00:18:54]  Then Trini and in his All On Britain's Got Talent, they all do their respective kind of things that they're supposed to be famous for.
[00:19:00]  You know, lots of pops ranting about green credentials.
[00:19:03]  He's lots of sulky jokes.
[00:19:04]  Trini talking about what you guys are wearing.
[00:19:06]  How do you mark them?
[00:19:07]  How would you scale them?
[00:19:09]  What I'd do is I'd replace the buzzers with a machine gun and just take them all out and do the public a massive favor.
[00:19:14]  What I'd do is I'd replace the buzzers with a machine gun and just take them all out and do the public a massive favor.
[00:19:20]  There you go.
[00:19:22]  Now, again, Piers Morgan himself, I was saying not his guest, but Piers Morgan, mass death.
[00:19:26]  And he's dead serious, and he's biting his lip, and he's getting excited.
[00:19:30]  And that's why physically, when I was around him, I got very angry at a primitive level.
[00:19:35]  That's why I challenged him.
[00:19:36]  I mean, I was like, you think you're tough, buddy?
[00:19:39]  I want to be the champion of liberty.
[00:19:41]  I'll stand against you.
[00:19:42]  I know who you are.
[00:19:44]  I know who you are.
[00:19:46]  You rapracious would-be mass murderer.
[00:19:50]  Bam.
[00:19:51]  Nice.
[00:19:52]  So Alex has found a new clip of Piers Morgan talking about shooting people, and he plays it over and over and over again, and he says that it's about shooting gun owners.
[00:20:04]  And so in this next clip, he plays the clip again and discusses it a little bit more.
[00:20:09]  And because he played it so many times.
[00:20:10]  I was just going to ignore it.
[00:20:12]  Honestly, I didn't care.
[00:20:13]  But because he played it so many times, I started to notice what was actually being talked about.
[00:20:18]  See if you can pick out the names that are being discussed and what the situation the interviewer is asking Piers about.
[00:20:24]  Because I can explain it all to you on the other side of this clip, and it has nothing to do with what Alex is talking about.
[00:20:30]  A new clip surfaced of him in England of all places while he was back visiting for two weeks before all this happened.
[00:20:37]  Why?
[00:20:39]  And there he is sniveling about how line up the gun owners and just machine gun us with a government gun, you notice.
[00:20:47]  Government gun good, citizen gun bad.
[00:20:50]  Here it is.
[00:20:51]  Theoretical situation: you've got Clarkson, Trini, and in his All on Britain's Got Talent.
[00:20:56]  They all do their respective kind of things that they're supposed to be famous for.
[00:20:59]  You know, lots of pups ranting about green credentials and his love to skew jokes, Trini talking about what you guys are wearing.
[00:21:05]  How do you mark them?
[00:21:06]  How would you scale them?
[00:21:08]  What I'd do is I'd replace the buzzers with a machine gun and just take them all out and do the public a massive favor.
[00:21:13]  What I'd do is I'd replace the buzzers with a machine gun and just take them all out and do the public a massive favor.
[00:21:19]  What I'd do is just replace the buzzers with a machine gun.
[00:21:22]  Always fantasizing about shooting people.
[00:21:25]  All right, so are you.
[00:21:26]  So yeah, no shit.
[00:21:28]  Do you get what's going on here?
[00:21:30]  He's talking about Clarkson on Britain's Got Talent.
[00:21:35]  You picked up some of the important details that Alex is praying his audience can't make out.
[00:21:40]  He's not talking about Jeremy Clarkson, is he?
[00:21:42]  He is.
[00:21:42]  Oh, well, then everybody in Britain at the time was like, why not shoot Jeremy Clarkson?
[00:21:46]  That was like a thing that everybody was saying.
[00:21:49]  And we'll get into why.
[00:21:50]  Yeah.
[00:21:50]  Because he's a fucking.
[00:21:51]  I remember because I watched Top Gear around that time and he was a piece of shit.
[00:21:54]  Yeah.
[00:21:55]  So Alex is completely misrepresenting this clip.
[00:21:57]  He's saying Piers wants to line up and shoot gun owners, but as you could tell from just barely listening to the clip, it's obvious that's not what he's talking about.
[00:22:07]  The first indication of that is that the interview is asking Piers about certain people, imagining what he would rate them if they were contestants on Britain's Got Talent, a show that Piers Morgan was one of the judges on for the first four seasons.
[00:22:17]  Right.
[00:22:17]  Which is why it's relevant to ask that question.
[00:22:20]  One of the names listed is Clarkson, which, as you were able to suss out, is a reference to the Sun journalist Jeremy Clarkson, who's possibly best known as one of the hosts of Top Gear from 1988 to 1998, and then again from 2012 to 2015.
[00:22:34]  I say this is obviously a reference to Jeremy Clarkson because he and Piers Morgan have a well-documented long-standing feud.
[00:22:41]  Some of this dates back to when Piers was the editor of the Daily Mirror.
[00:22:44]  Clarkson wasn't happy about some of the photos that were published of him in the tabloid and how Piers was kind of sort of having Clarkson stocked to dig up dirt on him, being that Clarkson was at the sun, which was a direct competitor, and the mirror was in bad shape financially at the time.
[00:22:57]  Unhappy about that treatment, Clarkson poured a glass of water on Piers when he ran into him on a plane.
[00:23:04]  Because they're both grown-ups.
[00:23:06]  Let's just remind everybody there's no hero in this story.
[00:23:10]  This later escalated at a 2004 British press award ceremony where a fairly drunk Clarkson approached Piers and told him, quote, now that you're in my world of the telly, I can tell you you're crap.
[00:23:20]  The Guardian reports.
[00:23:23]  What a killer line.
[00:23:25]  Yeah.
[00:23:26]  You, sir, are not good.
[00:23:28]  The Guardian reports about what happened next.
[00:23:30]  Apparently, Clarkson, quote, claims Morgan slighted his wife in fairly base terms, which is a very British way to phrase that.
[00:23:37]  At this point, Clarkson started swinging, apparently connecting at least two good shots.
[00:23:42]  He put his keys in a bowl.
[00:23:44]  Just gave him one right in the kisser.
[00:23:46]  Piers, unfazed, yelled, quote, is that all you got?
[00:23:50]  It turned out it wasn't.
[00:23:53]  That's a very British way of putting that.
[00:23:56]  Piers would tell The Guardian, quote, he then tried to head-butt me, missing my nose by about an inch.
[00:24:01]  Later, Piers would say, quote, I've frankly taken worse beatings from my three-year-old son.
[00:24:06]  All right.
[00:24:06]  Now that's a better line than your crap.
[00:24:08]  He apparently still has a scar from the fight, though.
[00:24:10]  So apparently, his three-year-old is quite a striker.
[00:24:15]  When Clarkson sobered up the next day, he was quoted as saying, It's all true what you heard.
[00:24:20]  This is just one in a long line of clashes.
[00:24:22]  We'll have to kiss and make up.
[00:24:24]  However, later he was spotted at Windows on the World, which is a bar, telling people that he, quote, did it all for Britain.
[00:24:32]  Well, now he's just being unfairly drunk.
[00:24:35]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:24:36]  The two would publicly end their feud in 2015 with Piers announcing that they declared a truce after a, quote, five-hour drinking session.
[00:24:43]  Clarkson said the inspiration for the truce was, quote, I'm going through a difficult.
[00:24:50]  I'm going through a difficult divorce.
[00:24:52]  My first ex-wife has also come out of the woodwork to give me hell.
[00:24:55]  I'm smoking too much, drinking too much, my back hurts.
[00:24:57]  I'm all over the papers with this N-word scandal.
[00:25:00]  I'm at war with the BBC bosses, and my mother has just died.
[00:25:03]  I simply don't have the energy for you anymore.
[00:25:06]  That N-word scandal is a reference to how, on an episode of Top Gear, when trying to pick between two cars, Clarkson did the old eeny-meenie-miny mo thing, but also mumbled the N-word in the spot you might expect a habitual racist to.
[00:25:17]  Yeah.
[00:25:17]  I got in a little bit of hot water about that.
[00:25:19]  Yeah, well.
[00:25:20]  The desire to shoot Jeremy Clarkson has nothing to do with guns in this clip, or his support for guns.
[00:25:26]  Anything like that in this clip.
[00:25:27]  The second person that was listed by the interviewer as a contestant on this hypothetical episode of Britain's Got Talent is Trinny, which is a reference to Trini Woodall.
[00:25:36]  Trini appeared as a contestant on the 2007 season of Comic Relief Does the Apprentice, the UK version of.
[00:25:43]  Well, the Comic Relief Charity.
[00:25:45]  Oh, okay.
[00:25:45]  Now I got it.
[00:25:46]  Now I got it.
[00:25:46]  It's the UK version of basically the celebrity apprentice.
[00:25:49]  Yeah, now I got it.
[00:25:49]  But it's set up to raise money for comic relief.
[00:25:52]  She and Piers got into a bit of a famous fight on the show.
[00:25:55]  On the episode, each team was supposed to get a chef assigned to them that would help them complete their mission for the episode.
[00:26:00]  The chef for the girls' team accidentally showed up at the boys' team, who decided that instead of sending him where he was supposed to go, they would lock him up in their bathroom.
[00:26:07]  Trini went to try and sort this out, but an argument broke out and things turned a little bit violent.
[00:26:12]  If you watch the actual video of the show, the whole thing began as an obviously contrived and manufactured drama, but it appears to have led to some bad feelings between Piers and Trini, who was mocked quite a bit in the media about how she ended up crying after the fight.
[00:26:25]  This sort of fight went a long way towards solidifying Piers' reputation as being a complete asshole.
[00:26:31]  Which only benefited him later.
[00:26:33]  Which, I should point out, was not something that wasn't part of his brand already.
[00:26:38]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:26:38]  But this was.
[00:26:39]  He was the editor of The Mirror.
[00:26:40]  Right.
[00:26:40]  His job is to be an asshole.
[00:26:42]  This escalated things a little bit.
[00:26:43]  He made Trini cry.
[00:26:45]  Yeah.
[00:26:46]  It fed into that in an ugly way.
[00:26:48]  So I'm sure he doesn't look back at that interaction with Trini fondly.
[00:26:52]  Him joking about shooting her has nothing to do with her supporting guns either.
[00:26:56]  The interviewer is asking a hypothetical question about these two people doing an act on Britain's Got Talent.
[00:27:01]  He suggests Clarkson would be going on about his green credentials because Clarkson was a big enemy of the green movement, calling it a, quote, byproduct of old trade unions and CNB lesbians.
[00:27:11]  Trini would talk about what everyone is wearing because she was the host of What Not to Wear for its first five seasons.
[00:27:16]  This clip has nothing to do with guns.
[00:27:18]  It has to do with Piers Morgan's high-profile feuds in the UK.
[00:27:21]  I grant that the joke that he's making is an incredibly poor taste, and I would probably critique him for that, but to pretend this clip has anything to do with his positions on gun control is a brazen act of intellectual dishonesty.
[00:27:31]  Alex is confident he can pass it off because his audience, he knows, won't carefully listen to that, and they'll just assume Clarkson and Trini are gun lovers in the UK or something like that.
[00:27:40]  If Alex were operating from a sincere position, he would never try to pass off this kind of manipulation on his audience.
[00:27:46]  This is deeply intentional.
[00:27:50]  You know, it's weird because it is played in enough of a context for you to get that he's not necessarily taking it out of context, but because you don't know, because the average American has no idea what the context actually is, it is exactly like playing it out of context.
[00:28:08]  You know what I mean?
[00:28:09]  Yeah.
[00:28:09]  Like it's yeah.
[00:28:10]  And most of his listeners won't know British celebrities.
[00:28:13]  Right.
[00:28:14]  They won't be able.
[00:28:15]  I don't even know why I do.

=== NPR's Ad Pitch Character (03:43) ===

[00:28:16]  And you couldn't pick out the name Trini from listening to Clarkson.
[00:28:20]  Yeah.
[00:28:21]  But you know, it doesn't.
[00:28:26]  The accent will be a problem for some people.
[00:28:28]  They'll just hear it and be like, oh, this is what Alex has framed it.
[00:28:31]  He does say that he wants to shoot people on Britain's Got Talent.
[00:28:34]  That must be what he's talking about.
[00:28:36]  Alex wouldn't lie to me about the context.
[00:28:38]  Of course not.
[00:28:39]  No, Also, he got the quote that Alex wants so bad, which is that because he replays the part of the quote that he loves so much.
[00:28:47]  And it's like whenever he plays it again, I see it almost on one of his documentaries where it's got the full body shot of him saying that.
[00:28:55]  Then it zooms in and crops out and it's close to the head.
[00:28:58]  No, no, and then it zooms in and crops out and it's just the lips going, kill them with their arms.
[00:29:04]  Yeah.
[00:29:04]  Yeah, totally.
[00:29:05]  It's classic Alex Jonesian manipulation of the highest order.
[00:29:09]  And none of that is to defend Piers Morgan.
[00:29:10]  He can still go fly a kite.
[00:29:12]  I don't care.
[00:29:13]  I think in all of that, Trini's probably the only one who's probably fine.
[00:29:17]  I don't know enough about her.
[00:29:18]  I have no idea what she is like as a person or even as a celebrity.
[00:29:22]  I just know that Piers Morgan made her cry.
[00:29:24]  Yeah, next to two world-class assholes in Jeremy Clarkson and Piers Morgan, I bet she comes out like roses.
[00:29:30]  I am more sympathetic, but also with the caveat that she might have some terrible skeletons that I'm unaware of.
[00:29:36]  I would like to know what her style choices are on what not to wear before I make any.
[00:29:40]  There's five fucking seasons for you to go watch with your girlfriend.
[00:29:44]  So in this next clip, Alex discusses how the Soviet-Russian-Nazi Germany mix is coming.
[00:29:50]  Okay.
[00:29:50]  The oppression that that represents is coming.
[00:29:53]  And then we get to see what ad pivots looked like in 2013.
[00:29:56]  Ooh, I'm excited.
[00:29:57]  This is what's being proposed, all right out of a mix of Soviet Russia, Nazi Germany.
[00:30:02]  I mean, if you know history, it's incredible.
[00:30:04]  I do.
[00:30:05]  A couple issues.
[00:30:06]  Don't forget this broadcast is listener supported.
[00:30:08]  Be sure and support the radio sponsors you both hear locally and the national ads.
[00:30:13]  So that's kind of fine.
[00:30:15]  Yeah, that's a normal.
[00:30:17]  That's what you would expect on NPR.
[00:30:19]  Sort of.
[00:30:20]  It has the character, though, of the Nazi Soviet oppression is coming.
[00:30:24]  Please support the sponsors.
[00:30:26]  So it still has that character of extreme evocative thing and then ad pitch.
[00:30:33]  Yeah.
[00:30:33]  You know, it still has that character, but he's not getting people whipped into a frenzy the same way he does in the present day before he goes to an ad.
[00:30:41]  So there's differences, but similarities.
[00:30:43]  Well, yeah, there is, and there is.
[00:30:45]  It's like an unevolved bulbasaur.
[00:30:47]  No, that's just a regular bulbasaur.
[00:30:49]  Whatever the Pokemon evolution thing is.
[00:30:51]  I don't know how to do it.
[00:30:52]  Would you be talking about an ivysaur or a venusaur?
[00:30:55]  We need to know these answers.
[00:30:56]  Charizard.
[00:30:59]  Sharzard, actually.
[00:31:00]  Whatever.
[00:31:01]  She sang that song.
[00:31:02]  Do you believe in life after love?
[00:31:03]  Okay.
[00:31:04]  Yeah.
[00:31:05]  Did you have a point?
[00:31:09]  What was I saying?
[00:31:10]  Oh, no, it is similar to NPR in that it was.
[00:31:14]  Obviously, he is still doing his Whip People Up Into a Frenzy, but it was ostensibly in regard to an actual news story.
[00:31:21]  So for NPR, it would be something along the lines of like, Alabama's abortion law is the most draconian thing in the history.
[00:31:28]  This channel is supported by listeners like you.
[00:31:32]  NPR would separate them with a bed of music.
[00:31:36]  Yeah, that's true.
[00:31:37]  That's true.
[00:31:37]  Probably throw in some weird folk song in between.
[00:31:41]  Too fan throat singing.
[00:31:42]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:31:43]  Some sort of world.

=== Max's Gold Market Prediction (05:06) ===

[00:31:45]  Isn't that Pat Nazal's fit?
[00:31:47]  Yeah.
[00:31:48]  So at this point, Alex gets a guest who comes in.
[00:31:50]  It's our boy, Max Kaiser.
[00:31:52]  He doesn't have that interesting.
[00:31:56]  Has he tried changing his name to Max Koinzer yet?
[00:31:58]  Oh, man, that would be great.
[00:31:59]  That'd be perfect.
[00:32:01]  He doesn't have that interesting of an appearance of his own volition, let's say.
[00:32:07]  Something happens while he's on air that ends up becoming very interesting, and he's just sort of silently on the phone and getting interrupted because of that.
[00:32:17]  But this is probably the only clip I'm really interested in playing of his, and that is him making financial predictions.
[00:32:23]  Now, whether the bonds collapse between now and April, as I predicted on your show last year, it could happen.
[00:32:30]  I think it could happen.
[00:32:32]  I might be wrong, but I won't be wrong by much.
[00:32:34]  I could be wrong by a few weeks, a few months.
[00:32:36]  But that's huge.
[00:32:38]  We're going to see.
[00:32:38]  We're going to see bonds collapse.
[00:32:40]  We're going to see gold now panic like buying in the gold market, taking gold a lot higher.
[00:32:48]  So the one thing that's interesting about that prediction, I find it very interesting, in many ways, he's not entirely wrong.
[00:32:55]  Okay.
[00:32:55]  While it would be absurd to say that the bond market collapsed in April 2013, there was a very large sell-off that occurred in May 2013, which is close enough that I find giving him kind of partial credit for that prediction.
[00:33:08]  Yeah, I think I would take that a month, monthly.
[00:33:10]  Yeah, it's pretty great.
[00:33:12]  The sell-off was the result of the Federal Reserve chairman, Ben Bernanke, signaling that he was going to taper off quantitative easing and slow down bond purchases.
[00:33:20]  It's worth noting that Alex and his guests constantly call on the Fed to end quantitative easing, so they were getting exactly what they wanted, and unsurprisingly, it led to a downturn in the market.
[00:33:29]  What?
[00:33:30]  The bond market began to stabilize by the fall, and within a year, things were back up to where they started with an almost full recovery.
[00:33:36]  Ultimately, I fail to believe that Alex or Max really care too much about the health of the bond market, considering that immediately after Trump won the 2016 election, the bond market crashed to the tune of a loss of $1 trillion.
[00:33:49]  And I don't recall either of them issuing dire warnings about that situation.
[00:33:52]  Summer of rage!
[00:33:54]  This prediction by Max Kaiser is not really a psychic prediction or anything, though.
[00:33:57]  There was talk that the Fed was going to make this move around that time of 2013.
[00:34:01]  So I reiterate that I'm only giving him partial credit, but he's not far off.
[00:34:06]  Everybody who is paying enough attention probably could have guessed that there were strong indications.
[00:34:10]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:34:11]  He's being a little bit more sensational than he needs to be, possibly, but he's not being as irresponsible as a lot of Alex's other guests in the financial sphere.
[00:34:22]  But it's important to note that they're only talking about the coming market trouble in service of that second part, that gold is going to go up.
[00:34:28]  And let me tell you, Jordan, it did not.
[00:34:30]  What?
[00:34:31]  Despite Max his explicit prediction that it was going to go up because of the downturn in the bond market, the bond market did go down more or less as he predicted.
[00:34:42]  But gold started 2013 at $1,663.75 per ounce.
[00:34:48]  On the day of this episode, it was up to about $1,692.32 per ounce.
[00:34:53]  By the time of the bond market sell-off, the price was down to $1,470.44 an ounce.
[00:34:59]  Ooh, that's not good.
[00:35:00]  And it would continue dropping for the rest of the year, ending on New Year's Eve at $1,205.40 an ounce.
[00:35:07]  Oh, boy, that's not great.
[00:35:08]  Representing an approximately 27% drop in value.
[00:35:12]  Gold made a slight uptick in 2014, but it never reached $1,400 an ounce again, and it ended the year down at $1,181.33.
[00:35:21]  Gold spent 2015, barely staying above $1,000 an ounce, and ended the year at $1,060.80.
[00:35:29]  So for the next two years after this, gold did not go up very high, and it still hasn't.
[00:35:35]  Yeah, you would have lost almost 40%.
[00:35:37]  What?
[00:35:38]  Maybe a little bit more?
[00:35:39]  You give or take.
[00:35:40]  Yeah, that's not good.
[00:35:41]  Alex and Max's prediction about the bond market exists in service of strengthening their appeals for their audience to buy gold, which would maybe be decent speculative advice if this weren't a show being syndicated by a gold sales company.
[00:35:53]  These sorts of conversations seem like they would be a bit more suspicious, less suspicious, excuse me, if they weren't immediately followed by a commercial for Midas Resources, which it is.
[00:36:03]  As soon as they go to break, Ted Anderson has a commercial for Midas Resources.
[00:36:07]  Of course.
[00:36:08]  So all of this has to be seen within that larger context within that intentional model.
[00:36:15]  Yeah, and that's the oldest simple call to action in the book.
[00:36:20]  Like, you're all going to die.
[00:36:22]  Buy gold.
[00:36:23]  Next thing you know, hey, guess who's selling gold?
[00:36:25]  It's me.
[00:36:26]  But the thing that I find more interesting about it is that Max, in terms of the financial people that I've seen on Alex's show, he's the closest to having not crazy setups.

=== Live Breaking News Interrupts (15:26) ===

[00:36:40]  The other people have pretty insane first stages that get to the gold thing.
[00:36:46]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:36:47]  Because Max is kind of like close to harbor.
[00:36:50]  Close.
[00:36:52]  Anyway, it's all irrelevant because something happens.
[00:36:55]  There's breaking news while Alex is in the middle of interviewing Max, and he will not stop interrupting Max to cover it, which I don't know.
[00:37:06]  Max is boring and kind of irrelevant.
[00:37:08]  He's not.
[00:37:08]  He's got chops compared to a lot of these dinghy.
[00:37:10]  Oh, well, yeah, compared to a lot of these.
[00:37:12]  That's a low bar.
[00:37:14]  Totally.
[00:37:14]  Low bar.
[00:37:15]  Totally.
[00:37:15]  But if I was talking to anybody who's an Alex Jones guest, he's one of the few people I would not interrupt.
[00:37:20]  Oh, okay.
[00:37:20]  Because he can handle himself with the word pretty well.
[00:37:23]  And he's kind of funny.
[00:37:26]  Okay.
[00:37:26]  He's decently clever.
[00:37:28]  All right.
[00:37:28]  Well, you've never played enough clips of him to me for me to get that kind of impression.
[00:37:32]  Well, but that's because they're also kind of boring.
[00:37:34]  See, well, that's what I'm saying.
[00:37:36]  The cleverness is contextually fairly boring.
[00:37:39]  But whenever I hear him coming up on an episode, whenever Alex is like, Max Kaiser's coming up, I'm like, this won't be too painful.
[00:37:45]  Oh, okay.
[00:37:45]  Oh, that's nice.
[00:37:46]  So anyway, there's breaking news.
[00:37:47]  This is Stockholm Syndrome.
[00:37:48]  You realize that.
[00:37:49]  Yeah, that's my life.
[00:37:53]  So, yeah, I only get excited when a monster is announced.
[00:37:57]  Because then I'm like, oh, great.
[00:37:58]  I get to learn about.
[00:38:00]  We've got one guy to cover later who is whoo-boy.
[00:38:02]  Of course.
[00:38:03]  So there's breaking news, and here's what it is.
[00:38:06]  All right, stay there.
[00:38:07]  Stay there.
[00:38:08]  By the way, KVUE is reporting.
[00:38:09]  CNN refuses to show live coverage.
[00:38:11]  Very suspicious.
[00:38:12]  Mass shooting at Lone Star College in Houston.
[00:38:15]  We'll be back.
[00:38:16]  So Alex has exactly what he needed.
[00:38:19]  No.
[00:38:20]  I have predicted that after Alex recognized the popularity of these Sandy Hook YouTube videos, as represented by him and Paul both talking about 10.6 million views in 10 days on this YouTube video.
[00:38:34]  We got to get into this business.
[00:38:36]  Paul Joseph Watson interviews James Tracy.
[00:38:39]  I had a strong suspicion that there was going to be something.
[00:38:43]  And I believe that the way Alex is covering this shooting at the Lone Star College in Texas is a pretty strong example of his pivot.
[00:38:53]  So is he going to go straight into Crisis Actor now?
[00:38:57]  No.
[00:38:58]  On this shooting.
[00:38:58]  No, no, no, no.
[00:39:00]  But what he's going to do is insist that there's something suspicious about CNN not covering this shooting, not broadcasting everything live for the world to see because there's a cover-up going on.
[00:39:12]  CNN learned their lesson because of Sandy Hook because they talked to people on the scene and they showed a guy in the woods and now there's all these questions.
[00:39:20]  So Alex insists that he's going to play the streams from the local news channels on his show because he's going to show you the truth that CNN won't show you.
[00:39:31]  Sure.
[00:39:32]  So here is him covering this, and we'll get into what's going on.
[00:39:38]  This is embarrassing.
[00:39:39]  Obviously, we have it recorded and we'll have it on the nightly news tonight.
[00:39:44]  I'll file a special report for him for sure.
[00:39:46]  We'll have already listeners.
[00:39:49]  As this develops, at least three people shot at Lone Star College in Houston, and I walked out there during the break, and CNN's going, We're not going to show live feeds.
[00:39:59]  We'll show selective clips.
[00:40:02]  So now, oh, we're not going to show live feeds.
[00:40:06]  But who is is K-H-O-U.
[00:40:08]  So we need to go to their website, K-H-O-U, and K-V-U-E has it.
[00:40:13]  So we've now reached a point where CNN will not show you what's happening.
[00:40:17]  Oh, because we might see other shooters in camo getting arrested.
[00:40:21]  So Alex is basically pitching the narrative that this is a false flag.
[00:40:25]  Yes.
[00:40:25]  CNN is covering it up by not broadcasting it.
[00:40:28]  But he is going to do the work that they refuse to do by airing the Houston K-H-O-U feeds.
[00:40:35]  Oh, boy, that's so infuriating because it's such a they've got you coming or going.
[00:40:40]  It doesn't matter.
[00:40:41]  It's also super transparent.
[00:40:42]  He recognizes that this Sandy Hook truth video, quote-unquote, truth, video is so popular that there's a huge market for it.
[00:40:50]  So we're going to claim that space early with this next shooting because this is the next one after he realizes that market share.
[00:40:59]  Yeah.
[00:41:00]  God, that's the most crass capitalistic thing that like the idea that he's already plotting in advance how he's going to make money off of the next school shooting that his rhetoric makes renders inevitable.
[00:41:14]  He would probably call it coverage.
[00:41:16]  Sure.
[00:41:17]  You would call it making money.
[00:41:19]  Yeah.
[00:41:19]  Potato, potato.
[00:41:21]  Fair.
[00:41:21]  So here's the next clip of that.
[00:41:23]  He is going to live coverage.
[00:41:26]  CNN won't air it.
[00:41:27]  This is suspicious.
[00:41:29]  We're watching it live.
[00:41:30]  They don't want you hearing the original eyewitness accounts.
[00:41:32]  This is very suspicious.
[00:41:35]  Turn it up and students or not, right?
[00:41:37]  Yeah, correct.
[00:41:38]  So basically, I'm going to be able to get a lot of include that 128.
[00:41:43]  And as soon as I heard the bullets flying or the gun being fired off, CNN will not let you see this.
[00:41:51]  Very suspicious.
[00:41:52]  So you ran.
[00:41:53]  So his position is pretty clear.
[00:41:55]  Yeah, and where he's coming from.
[00:41:57]  What she's saying and what anybody is saying is very irrelevant, apparently, because we are not listening to any of it and we're just hearing, see, this is suspicious.
[00:42:05]  Right.
[00:42:06]  And the not listening is pretty strengthened in this next clip.
[00:42:12]  All the way down back here on the other side.
[00:42:14]  Come on, tell us how many days.
[00:42:17]  That's pretty gross.
[00:42:18]  Wow.
[00:42:19]  Wow, that's fucked up.
[00:42:21]  Yeah.
[00:42:22]  So on January 22nd, 2013, there was a shooting on the campus of Lone Star College, a community college in Harris County, unincorporated area outside of Houston.
[00:42:31]  The shooting was the result of an argument between the gunman, Trey Foster, and another student, Jody Neal.
[00:42:37]  Thankfully, no one was killed, but three people were hospitalized in the aftermath, including someone who was accidentally arrested.
[00:42:44]  There was a second person, this guy, who was arrested named Carlton Barry.
[00:42:48]  But charges against him were dropped six days later because he wasn't guilty of anything.
[00:42:52]  However, after the police pressed charges, he admitted that he was there and that he knew Foster had been the shooter.
[00:42:58]  The police defended arresting Barry and charging him because, quote, if they had not charged Barry, Foster might not have been arrested, and the gun believed to have been used in the shooting might not have been recovered.
[00:43:07]  The police were real insistent they'd done nothing wrong.
[00:43:10]  With the sheriff even going so far, save your lives.
[00:43:16]  Sorry.
[00:43:17]  I'm sorry.
[00:43:18]  If the police insist they did nothing wrong, they probably killed 30 people.
[00:43:22]  The sheriff went so far as to demand an apology from the local news channel for covering his own press conference where he showed off Barry's mugshot and said, quote, if we can make an example out of anyone, we will.
[00:43:33]  I hope he gets what he deserves for putting others in harm's way.
[00:43:36]  How dare you show people what I said?
[00:43:39]  Basically, I want an apology from you.
[00:43:41]  It's important to make the distinction that this happened at a college and also that it was a shooting that happened at a school, not a school shooting.
[00:43:49]  You know what I mean?
[00:43:50]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:43:51]  It's a fine distinction.
[00:43:52]  It's still a terrible thing, and it's a disaster, but I do think that technical difference between an argument escalating into a shooting at a college and someone setting out to shoot people at a college or any other school are different things.
[00:44:05]  Okay, so this was because, God, I wish I didn't have to say that I don't remember a mass shooting.
[00:44:14]  But we live in a world where they all kind of tend to be awesome.
[00:44:18]  So this one was a person-to-person fracas that got out of control.
[00:44:25]  Yes.
[00:44:25]  This wasn't premeditated.
[00:44:27]  I've got guns and I'm taking them into the school tomorrow.
[00:44:30]  It wasn't.
[00:44:30]  But Alex doesn't know that at this point.
[00:44:32]  He has no information, and he's barely listening to these witnesses that are being covered by KHOU.
[00:44:37]  His intentions in terms of covering the story are crystal clear from the first seconds he's talking about this story.
[00:44:42]  He's convinced that with Sandy Hook, the globalists slipped up and accidentally aired evidence that their gunmen were in the woods and all that shit.
[00:44:48]  Alex is saying that they're not going to be so sloppy this time, which is why he's making a big deal out of the fact that CNN isn't live streaming coverage of the school.
[00:44:56]  The fact that without knowing any of the details, he covers this breaking story this way is all the proof you need to know that his primary motivation is finding alleged proof in this shooting that Sandy Hook was fake.
[00:45:08]  This story is a prop to him from the jump to help justify his own coverage or eventual coverage of Sandy Hook.
[00:45:17]  Well, isn't that so fucked up?
[00:45:19]  That's what I'm saying.
[00:45:20]  They've got you coming and going.
[00:45:21]  CNN fucked up a few times with their coverage of Sandy Hook.
[00:45:25]  And so in response to that, they learned a lesson and they were like, we're going to do responsible reporting.
[00:45:31]  Fucking up is evidence of a conspiracy and doing responsible reporting is evidence of a conspiracy.
[00:45:37]  Totally.
[00:45:37]  There's nothing you can do.
[00:45:39]  Yeah.
[00:45:39]  Also, I need to mention this.
[00:45:41]  In researching the story, I couldn't help but notice an interesting trend.
[00:45:45]  I may not have mentioned this, but the shooter and the victim in this case were both black men.
[00:45:49]  Generally, when I read about one of these shootings, the criminal past of the shooter is discussed, as it was in this instance.
[00:45:56]  But something that I found really weird is how the media seem to also be interested in covering the criminal past of the victim, Jody Neal.
[00:46:02]  In an article in Click to Houston, quote, Neal also has a criminal history.
[00:46:07]  He was convicted of unauthorized use of a motor vehicle in 2004 in possession of a switchblade and knuckles and misdemeanor assault in 2010.
[00:46:15]  Thanks, News.
[00:46:16]  I don't have to care as much about him anymore because you have shown that he is less than human by having a criminal record.
[00:46:22]  Good work, guys.
[00:46:23]  You fucking did it.
[00:46:24]  It's really wild.
[00:46:25]  This guy is only part of this story because he was shot, but the media felt it somehow helped flesh out the story to discuss his arrests.
[00:46:32]  I cannot think of another time when I've been reading media coverage of other shootings where this sort of coverage is applied.
[00:46:38]  And I've read a lot of stories about shootings for preparations for these podcasts, the research.
[00:46:43]  The only other times I can think of are, of course, other high-profile cases where non-white people are killed, often by the police.
[00:46:50]  Yeah, it's not an illusion.
[00:46:55]  How many times do we have to see a white shooter fuck up 30 goddamn people, and then the news shows a picture of him playing fucking football in his backyard and a black victim gets his fucking mugshot put up to him?
[00:47:10]  Totally.
[00:47:11]  Fuck off.
[00:47:11]  A 2018 study out of Ohio State University found that white mass shooters are 95% more likely to be described as mentally ill as opposed to black shooters.
[00:47:20]  There you go.
[00:47:21]  They analyzed media coverage of 219 attacks to reach this conclusion and said, quote, much of the media coverage of white shooters framed them as sympathetic characters who were suffering from extreme life circumstances.
[00:47:31]  He was just so quiet and he was a nice kid.
[00:47:34]  But black shooters were usually made to seem dangerous and a menace to society.
[00:47:38]  It's pretty awful that this bias is so stark when discussing perpetrators of crimes, but it's completely insane to see this directed towards a victim.
[00:47:46]  And I find it very hard to ignore that racial element, considering the countless stories about white victims of mass shootings I've read over the course of doing this podcast.
[00:47:55]  That's so fucked up.
[00:47:56]  And this is not an isolated case.
[00:47:58]  In a 2017 article on the Huffington Post, which is an updating of the original pieces published in 2014, headlines regarding stories of white shooters and black victims are juxtaposed.
[00:48:08]  And the trend you see is very telling.
[00:48:10]  Media often responds to white shooters with a round of pearl clutching and disbelief that this good person could do something so bad.
[00:48:17]  Meanwhile, headlines covering black victims of murder often highlight how the guy wasn't really that good of a guy and probably a criminal.
[00:48:24]  So you shouldn't worry too much about the fact that they got shot to begin with.
[00:48:27]  Oh, he killed nine people and injured six more, but he was an honor student in high school.
[00:48:33]  This guy got shot, but let me tell you something.
[00:48:35]  He got a below two GPA.
[00:48:37]  So who's the real victim here?
[00:48:40]  It's super fucked up, and I don't know what else to say about it other than I would bet anything that Alex will not do a better job of covering this than Click to Houston.
[00:48:48]  God.
[00:48:48]  Or maybe he won't even go over it anymore after this at all, quite frankly, once he realizes that it's not going to help him.
[00:48:56]  Christ.
[00:48:57]  Yeah.
[00:48:58]  So Alex has a story about a young girl in Pennsylvania who got suspended for having a bubble gun, you know, like a little Hello Kitty bubble gun.
[00:49:09]  And he's going to make a big deal out of it.
[00:49:10]  Oh, we're going to get some purple penguin action going on here.
[00:49:13]  Sort of.
[00:49:14]  We'll see how it goes.
[00:49:16]  Max, what do you make of this new phenomenon?
[00:49:18]  Because I've never seen them do this, where they say, oh, it's too hurtful.
[00:49:22]  Like a little girl has a Hello Kitty bubble machine.
[00:49:26]  I actually bought these for my kids.
[00:49:28]  You pull the trigger and you stick it.
[00:49:31]  It's not even meant to be a, quote, gun.
[00:49:32]  It's a thing to hold and put bubbles.
[00:49:34]  A little pink Hello Kitty deal.
[00:49:35]  And the police came and grabbed the little girl because a bubble thing she had.
[00:49:39]  Kids are being arrested for Nerf guns that are orange or being detained.
[00:49:43]  I mean, this is like mind control where you can have all the drones killing people all day.
[00:49:49]  That's beautiful.
[00:49:51]  But you're going to get grabbed for Hello Kitty bubble toys.
[00:49:54]  Okay.
[00:49:55]  Not a apples to apples comparison.
[00:49:58]  Not necessarily.
[00:49:59]  I get where he's coming from, I suppose.
[00:50:02]  Sort of.
[00:50:03]  I can see a very, very tenuous connection, but yeah.
[00:50:07]  Slightly.
[00:50:08]  This is kind of one of these big stories that Alex has been going on about at this time frame.
[00:50:13]  I haven't really touched it yet because I kind of thought it was going to be a flash in the pan, just like a one-day story, and then it was going to go away.
[00:50:19]  Because I just thought it was like, oh, this is stupid.
[00:50:21]  We don't have time to cover it.
[00:50:23]  But now I see it's not going to go away, so I decided I'd look into the story.
[00:50:26]  You've got to do it.
[00:50:26]  So there's a five-year-old child in Mount Carmel, Pennsylvania, who was suspended from kindergarten.
[00:50:31]  But the issue wasn't that she hadn't a Hello Kitty bubble gun.
[00:50:34]  It's that she beat a kid to death with it.
[00:50:37]  Not really.
[00:50:38]  But she was threatening to shoot other students, which the school felt was in violation of their zero tolerance policies, regardless of the real or fakeness of the gun.
[00:50:46]  I would probably say that this is a little severe.
[00:50:48]  I understand their reasoning, but I think this sort of situation is one that probably calls for some creative thinking.
[00:50:54]  Probably the best response would be to not make the child feel othered or excluded, like a suspension might make them feel, but to provide them with some kind of a setting where their parents can, you know, we could discuss that this is really inappropriate and can't be allowed.
[00:51:07]  Whatever my feelings on the matter are, I'm not a school administrator, and I've never really talked to a five-year-old, so my opinion is useless.
[00:51:14]  Take it with a grain of salt.
[00:51:16]  Anyway, it doesn't matter.
[00:51:17]  On January 30th, the school district overturned the suspension and wiped the child's record clean, making this entire thing as if it never happened.
[00:51:25]  Right.
[00:51:25]  It may have been easier for the mother to get the suspension overturned since she was a former cop and had multiple lawyers with her at a closed-door meeting where they discussed the suspension.
[00:51:35]  That's a lot easier to get over than an under-staffed and underpaid somebody trying to get this overturned.
[00:51:43]  The meeting was closed to the press, so we may never know exactly what happened within it, but it kind of feels like it was about suing the school district, since her lawyer announced after the suspension was erased that there would be no lawsuit.

=== Media Double Standards (04:21) ===

[00:51:54]  Surprise.
[00:51:54]  Yeah.
[00:51:55]  It also is worth noting that the child's mother, when interviewed after the suspension was overturned, thanked the, quote, thousands of people worldwide who emailed the school administration.
[00:52:03]  This is almost certainly a result of media like Alex covering the case, because otherwise, why would someone outside of Pennsylvania care about a five-year-old getting a possibly slightly too strict punishment in her kindergarten class?
[00:52:14]  Who cares?
[00:52:15]  Right.
[00:52:16]  Alex posted multiple stories about this on Infowars.com, and it's come up a bunch of times on the radio show that I've been listening to.
[00:52:23]  But suspicious in its absence is any story pointing out that the suspension was overturned.
[00:52:27]  It has, however, been used since then as a waypoint in other stories with no clarification that it didn't lead to a suspension or any charges of terrorist threatening.
[00:52:36]  If you're a journalism outlet, that's pretty important as a clarification to make.
[00:52:40]  Yeah, it would seem that way.
[00:52:41]  But this is such catnip to this type of totally.
[00:52:44]  And not just that, but also the like, you know, when I was a kid, we grew up playing cowboys and Indians.
[00:52:50]  We used to threaten to shoot each other all the time, this young generation and all that shit.
[00:52:54]  That's that is right up there, dumb fuck alley.
[00:52:58]  Yeah, but you know, I'm saying that a journalism outlet would post a clarification or something, like an update on the stories, but come on.
[00:53:07]  We've learned over and over again that Infowars is not a journalism outlet.
[00:53:10]  It is a white identity propaganda outlet.
[00:53:13]  And how do I know that, Jordan?
[00:53:15]  How's that?
[00:53:15]  One of the easiest ways is to compare coverage of similar circumstances where the person they're talking about isn't white.
[00:53:22]  Let's take a look.
[00:53:23]  One of the clearest examples of Infowars double standard as it relates to this is how they covered the case of Ahmed Mohammed, the 14-year-old child.
[00:53:30]  Terrorist.
[00:53:30]  Already done.
[00:53:31]  Move on.
[00:53:32]  He built a clock in a pencil case that his teachers thought resembled a bomb, which led to the police taking him into custody.
[00:53:37]  Infowars consistently refers to Ahmed as, quote, clockboy or clock kid.
[00:53:43]  You know, so at least there's a variation.
[00:53:45]  Yeah.
[00:53:46]  I would say clockboy is better.
[00:53:47]  It's always in quotes, too.
[00:53:49]  He always does the air quotes.
[00:53:50]  He's in writing.
[00:53:52]  Clockboy.
[00:53:53]  Why?
[00:53:54]  I don't know.
[00:53:54]  It's derisive.
[00:53:56]  It's a quote.
[00:53:57]  Jesus.
[00:53:58]  And all their coverage seemed to take as proven that Ahmed was engaged in a hoax.
[00:54:03]  Right.
[00:54:03]  On September 22nd, 2015, Steve Watson wrote an article with the headline, quote, Judge, Clock Kid Family Could Be Charged with Fraud if Incident is Proved Purposeful Hoax.
[00:54:14]  That headline is meant to imply that a judge hearing the case about the child is saying that.
[00:54:18]  But the judge in question is Fox News host Andrew Napolitano.
[00:54:21]  There it was.
[00:54:22]  The sub-headline of the story is a quote from Napolitano, quote, money has been collected on false premises.
[00:54:29]  The problem here is that the full quote from Napolitano is, quote, if the parents were involved in a hoax, now you have a fraud going because money has been collected on false pretenses.
[00:54:38]  That sub-headline is in and of itself a fraud.
[00:54:41]  It removes the conditional aspect of the beginning of the sentence, which the end of the sentence relies on.
[00:54:47]  They might as well have gotten a quote from Judge Reinhold, for Christ's sake.
[00:54:51]  Could have.
[00:54:51]  Yeah, it would have been the same.
[00:54:52]  InfoWars went out of its way to post tons of stories attacking Ahmed, framing the situation as an elaborate hoax to make it look like Islamophobia is an actual problem, when, as Alex is more than happy to tell you, it's not.
[00:55:03]  Of course, he'll tell you that right after he explains that once a population is more than 10% Muslim, the Muslims are commanded by Muhammad to attack everyone.
[00:55:10]  That's not Islamophobia.
[00:55:12]  That's Islama-reasonabia.
[00:55:15]  So, if you're keeping score, a white child is suspended for threatening to shoot classmates with a fake gun.
[00:55:19]  It's a huge deal, and we need to take this very seriously.
[00:55:22]  A child named Mohammed gets taken into custody for bringing a clock people thought was a bomb to school without ever threatening anyone.
[00:55:28]  It's an elaborate ruse to defraud people and cause racism against white people.
[00:55:32]  Yeah, that sounds right.
[00:55:33]  So, you see how this works?
[00:55:34]  That makes perfect sense.
[00:55:35]  You see how this works?
[00:55:36]  Yeah, a lot of 14-year-olds are thinking on that third-dimension of hoax situation.
[00:55:44]  Yeah.
[00:55:44]  So, that's what the important thing to keep in mind is the coverage of this girl with the Hello Kitty gun.
[00:55:52]  It's demonstrative.

=== Alex's Gun Obsession (07:59) ===

[00:55:54]  What's the difference?
[00:55:55]  Well, who's Alex is more into guns than bombs?
[00:55:59]  Yeah.
[00:56:02]  That actually might work.
[00:56:04]  So, Alex gets back to covering this Texas shooting, and he's still pretty eager.
[00:56:10]  He's almost salivating to get this raw coverage that he thinks will show that this is a false flag.
[00:56:16]  Or at least show.
[00:56:17]  Hold on, we're going to go to a witness.
[00:56:18]  Turn her up.
[00:56:19]  Go ahead.
[00:56:19]  CNN doesn't want you to see this.
[00:56:21]  Here it is for radio.
[00:56:21]  Why don't you tell me what you saw?
[00:56:22]  No, actually, I wasn't in the library.
[00:56:24]  It was a friend in the library.
[00:56:25]  That's right.
[00:56:26]  And she came to our class 308 to get somebody out of class and to tell them that it was a lot of shooting going on.
[00:56:35]  Well, of course, that scared us.
[00:56:37]  So what happened was that we all just cut off the lights.
[00:56:41]  CNN won't show you that.
[00:56:42]  We're going to get on all the computers.
[00:56:44]  And the teacher told us it was a closet just in case.
[00:56:47]  But to be quiet.
[00:56:48]  And we were there for a while, a long time.
[00:56:50]  And of course, we started hearing the helicopters.
[00:56:53]  But we finally got the internet on Channel 11.
[00:56:57]  And that's when we found out what had actually happened.
[00:57:00]  I didn't hear this shooting, but somebody else did.
[00:57:04]  So because someone came into your classroom, you hunkered down right there in the classroom.
[00:57:07]  Unbelievable.
[00:57:08]  Right.
[00:57:08]  That was the only.
[00:57:09]  No, that was all very believable.
[00:57:12]  Yeah.
[00:57:12]  That was one of the most believable things I think I've ever heard.
[00:57:16]  But I think Alex, you could tell, is a little disappointed.
[00:57:19]  Oh, yeah.
[00:57:19]  I'm not sure if it fully came out in that clip, but if you listen to the entire thing, there's a sense of deflation that comes over him as he keeps going back to the live coverage.
[00:57:30]  Yeah.
[00:57:30]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:57:31]  And in this next clip, I think is where he finally reaches the end of his rope.
[00:57:36]  So then you're going to realize that the gold has been sold.
[00:57:38]  It's not there.
[00:57:39]  And you've got to get away from the camera.
[00:57:40]  Let's come to this female reporter real fast.
[00:57:42]  Talk to the police.
[00:57:42]  Shut up, Max.
[00:57:44]  Kind of find out what the latest and greatest information may be as far as the city.
[00:57:51]  We're not over here and can give us any of that information.
[00:57:54]  We are going to bring that update to you.
[00:57:56]  But just to sort of recap what we believe we do know at this point is before she was pulled away to get the latest information, I did learn that the person that they do have in custody, they are unsure if that person is actually a shooter or is actually a person who may have been involved in the altercation that led to all of this at this point.
[00:58:16]  If this isn't stage you watch, it's going to be gang-related.
[00:58:20]  Oh, boo.
[00:58:21]  So Alex Alex has realized that all of the people that are being interviewed are black.
[00:58:28]  And I think that there is a strong sense that he pivots the narrative.
[00:58:34]  That's why it's gang-related, because the people that are being interviewed are black.
[00:58:37]  Well, and that's how he dismounts from his, this could be a false flag.
[00:58:41]  He's like, oh, but this is the other way we can not care about it and push this to the side.
[00:58:46]  Because he doesn't talk about it anymore for the rest of the show.
[00:58:49]  Of course not.
[00:58:50]  He goes into Overdrive and does an extra half hour.
[00:58:52]  He doesn't go back to the feed.
[00:58:53]  On the 23rd of January, which we'll get into, he doesn't talk about the shooting anymore, except to say it is possibly gang-related.
[00:58:59]  Sure, sure.
[00:59:00]  She started with this overeagerness to be like, this is going to be the next Sandy hook, and I'm going to be on the ground getting the information that others will then use to make these super popular, profitable videos.
[00:59:14]  And it's not that.
[00:59:16]  And as it goes along, he realizes, shit, fuck it.
[00:59:19]  And he dismounts.
[00:59:20]  It's disgraceful.
[00:59:22]  I think you can see very clearly what's going on.
[00:59:25]  His intentions are just overt.
[00:59:28]  It is a little bit like ambulance chasing, you know?
[00:59:32]  It's that nothing excites him more than hearing that.
[00:59:38]  And this is one of the times where you hear the screeching brakes and no crash.
[00:59:43]  And he's like, oh, this sucks.
[00:59:46]  Yeah, this is gang-related.
[00:59:47]  I can't work with this.
[00:59:48]  Yeah, no kidding.
[00:59:50]  So Alex goes into overdrive here on the 22nd.
[00:59:52]  And I don't have any clips of this, but he and Max Kaiser discuss how Glenn Beck is trying to buy a bunch of property and create a libertarian fantasy land in the middle of Texas.
[01:00:00]  That sounds fun, actually.
[01:00:02]  In the middle of the conversation, Alex conveniently remembers a recent conversation he had with a real estate guy who was working with Beck and reports that Beck is planning on buying a closed shopping mall to serve as the center of his new town.
[01:00:15]  It's ludicrous.
[01:00:16]  Alex is just making shit up.
[01:00:18]  All right, let's catch up with Beckville.
[01:00:20]  How's that going?
[01:00:21]  I don't know.
[01:00:22]  I wanted to include clips of this, but it's so long, so rambling, and so inconsequential, and we have a lot to get through.
[01:00:27]  So I just decided to tell you about it.
[01:00:30]  It's absurd.
[01:00:31]  And, man, Max Kaiser is swinging for the fences talking shit about Glenn Beck.
[01:00:36]  All right.
[01:00:36]  It's pretty crazy.
[01:00:37]  I like it.
[01:00:37]  Yeah, he goes pretty hard on it.
[01:00:39]  He goes ham.
[01:00:40]  He goes ham.
[01:00:41]  Okay, okay.
[01:00:43]  As the kids said six years ago.
[01:00:44]  But we don't have time for that.
[01:00:45]  We only have time for me to tell you about it for about 45 seconds or so.
[01:00:49]  Here we go.
[01:00:50]  Because on the 23rd, we get into something that I've been waiting for for quite a while.
[01:00:56]  And that is for Alex to get specific about why he thinks Aurora was fake.
[01:01:01]  Could these events be staged?
[01:01:03]  And then when they have the telltale signs, then it moves into it's a probability they are.
[01:01:08]  Especially Colorado.
[01:01:10]  I mean, that is cartoon level, where he's getting DARPA funding and mind control.
[01:01:15]  He's got a top Air Force psychiatrist who'd been the head of whole operations at entire bases in San Antonio over him, meeting with him multiple times a week.
[01:01:24]  They're talking about national security and the police don't want it released his workbook with her where he reportedly was planning to do all this.
[01:01:34]  You want me to keep going?
[01:01:35]  Witnesses of multiple shooters, all the rest of it.
[01:01:38]  Him in the jail saying, I don't remember who I am, obviously drugged out of his mind.
[01:01:43]  So I've been waiting for a while, like I said, for Alex to bring up specific complaints about the Aurora shooting.
[01:01:49]  But over the course of the last bunch of episodes, all he's done is say it's fake.
[01:01:52]  And that's unsatisfying for me to respond to because then I have to assume what his conspiracy theories are.
[01:01:57]  I was waiting for him to get into the details because I've read James Holmes' entire 128-page psychiatric evaluation and so much more about this case.
[01:02:06]  And I was just itching for Alex to pop his dumb head above the ground so I could bonk him on the head like a whack-a-mole.
[01:02:12]  As sane people remember, on the night of July 20th, 2012, James Holmes went to a midnight Dark Knight Rises at the Century 16 Theater in Aurora, Colorado.
[01:02:21]  He proceeded to set off tear gas or something similar to tear gas in the theater before opening fire, ultimately killing 12 people and injuring 70 others.
[01:02:29]  After that, he exited the theater and waited for the police to come and arrest him.
[01:02:33]  As he told the authorities, he'd done some calculations and realized he wouldn't survive the escape.
[01:02:38]  He absolutely committed this horrific act of terrorism.
[01:02:40]  And in the next, however long this takes, I will deconstruct and disprove each one of Alex's reasons for believing this was a false flag or, as he calls it, cartoonishly fake.
[01:02:49]  Yeah.
[01:02:50]  So I want to apologize to you in advance.
[01:02:52]  I'm just going to take a nap real quick.
[01:02:53]  He has the same last name as you.
[01:02:55]  Oh, yeah.
[01:02:55]  No, that's, of course.
[01:02:56]  I apologize for this.
[01:02:57]  So you're just going to say Holmes the whole time.
[01:02:58]  There will be a number of times I say Holmes, and as I was writing this out, I was like, Jordan's not going to like this.
[01:03:03]  No, I think generally I'm referred to as Jordan on the show.
[01:03:06]  No, that's true.
[01:03:06]  But I mean, if there was a mass shooter named Friesen, I probably wouldn't be thrilled to hear that.
[01:03:11]  A lot of Holmes's shooters.
[01:03:14]  H?
[01:03:14]  H H?
[01:03:15]  That one I'm fine with, inexplicably.
[01:03:17]  Well, because he's Chicago.
[01:03:19]  Yeah.
[01:03:20]  Chicago.
[01:03:21]  Well, you got to rep Chicago.
[01:03:22]  Doesn't matter.
[01:03:23]  Doesn't matter if it's a murder castle or not.
[01:03:25]  You got to rep Chicago.
[01:03:27]  Yeah.
[01:03:28]  I was going to say something about his creativity, but then I realized I was drifting way too close to Alex saying you've got to give it to the smaller pirates.
[01:03:34]  That's not.
[01:03:35]  Got to handle it.
[01:03:37]  So first I want to talk about the DARPA funding of the mind control stuff that Alex is bringing up.

=== James Holmes' Academic Scores (15:34) ===

[01:03:42]  I'm just going to go in order of the complaints that he brought up in that clip.
[01:03:45]  Yeah, sure.
[01:03:46]  Let's do it.
[01:03:46]  James Holmes was a good student in high school.
[01:03:48]  He ended with a GPA of 3.77 and graduated 82nd in a class of 531.
[01:03:54]  He went on to do his undergrad at UC Riverside, initially setting out to get a Bachelor of Arts in neuroscience, but changing his path to seek a Bachelor of Science, still in neuroscience, a few years into his college career.
[01:04:04]  He graduated college with a GPA of 3.949, so on paper, he was a pretty damn good student.
[01:04:10]  The psychological evaluation that was done to try and determine whether he was competent to stand trial includes his GRE scores, but they're literally impossible to be accurate, as their number is way higher than the GRE test scoring range.
[01:04:24]  It must have been a mistyping.
[01:04:25]  So he got a 45 on the ACT.
[01:04:27]  Yeah, other reports I've found said that he was in the 98th percentile for the verbal session of the GRE and 94th percentile for the quantitative score.
[01:04:36]  Sure.
[01:04:36]  These are the kind of scores that would put you well on your way towards scholarships and ease of entry into most grad programs.
[01:04:42]  But some of the most top-tier schools, particularly ones with very specific programs, have other requirements they look for in candidates than just test scores.
[01:04:51]  My dad is involved in the process of grad school applications for the religious studies department at UT Austin, and I've spoken to him in the past about the process.
[01:04:58]  It's very complicated to put into concrete terms, but a school doesn't want to offer one of their limited slots in their grad program to somebody that they don't feel will succeed there.
[01:05:07]  It could be that they feel like the student would do better in a different program, and they're aware of the different programs in different schools.
[01:05:13]  You know, there's networks.
[01:05:14]  People know each other.
[01:05:16]  Try this one.
[01:05:17]  Maybe you'd do better at X, Y, or Z school.
[01:05:20]  So that's one possibility.
[01:05:22]  Or it could be as simple as the student isn't as good a candidate as a number of the others they're evaluating that year.
[01:05:28]  Absolutely.
[01:05:29]  You could be perfect on paper, but if, say, six other people that are a better fit apply than you that year, you may still not get into the program that you apply for.
[01:05:38]  And this is what appears to have happened with Holmes.
[01:05:40]  He applied to a bunch of the best neuroscience schools in the country, but was rejected by all of them.
[01:05:46]  These were elite programs.
[01:05:48]  So he was probably up against candidates that had just as good a test scores, probably better extracurricular records, and almost certainly better interviews because he was socially weird.
[01:05:58]  Of course.
[01:05:59]  It's how most people would describe him.
[01:06:01]  Yeah.
[01:06:02]  So.
[01:06:03]  He was not neurotypical.
[01:06:06]  Sure.
[01:06:06]  Yeah.
[01:06:06]  After getting rejected from these schools, his parents reported that Holmes fell into a depression where he would sleep most of the day and watch television.
[01:06:13]  They encouraged him to apply to schools that he had a better shot of getting into, and he did.
[01:06:17]  One of the schools he applied to was the University of Iowa, and their admissions process officers gives a glimpse into how the applications went.
[01:06:26]  The person interviewing him noted that Holmes' record was a, quote, slam dunk.
[01:06:30]  But the interview that he gave, he was found to be, quote, bizarre, disconnected, and aloof with a global lack of affect.
[01:06:38]  This administrator went on to tell the admissions team not to admit him under any circumstances.
[01:06:43]  He applied to at least five schools and was accepted to two, ultimately choosing the University of Colorado at Denver over the University of Illinois, Urbana.
[01:06:51]  His first year there, his performance was not up to what the high school and undergrad careers he had would have led students to expect.
[01:07:00]  And his GPA slipped to around 3.3.
[01:07:03]  In his lab rotations, there were a lot of people that he was making uncomfortable with his social awkwardness and his habit of, quote, uncomfortable joke making.
[01:07:11]  Oh, boy.
[01:07:12]  About as far as I could get in terms of details of that, but you got to assume.
[01:07:15]  You know that guy.
[01:07:17]  I've met that guy.
[01:07:18]  We've all met that guy.
[01:07:19]  He entered the program in June 2011, and a year later, he had to undergo his preliminary oral exams.
[01:07:25]  And on June 7th, 2012, that was when they were to take place.
[01:07:29]  The results were not good.
[01:07:30]  Quote, James did not pass the preliminary oral exams.
[01:07:33]  Professors report that James was unable to get from A to G in a timely, organized manner in his answers.
[01:07:40]  They stated that they were concerned that he might not have more than a superficial knowledge of the material, or that he simply knew the words to use without understanding the concepts.
[01:07:49]  They stated that he performed poorly uniformly, not just in one particular portion or topic.
[01:07:55]  He failed these exams, but grad schools don't kick out students lightly.
[01:07:59]  They told him that he could take a different exam and stay in the program, but Holmes said he would rather resign.
[01:08:04]  Alex believes that he received DARPA funding.
[01:08:06]  And the reason for this theory is that Holmes was the recipient of a grant awarded by the National Institutes of Health in the amount of $26,000.
[01:08:14]  Here's how that grant works.
[01:08:15]  Every year there are about six new neuroscience grad students who enter the program at the University of Colorado, Denver.
[01:08:22]  The grant from the NIH is given to the school, and then the director of the Neuroscience Center at that school, Diego Restrepo, along with a group of faculty members, decide what students to give the grant to.
[01:08:33]  The NIH didn't choose James Holmes, and they probably actually had no idea who he even was.
[01:08:38]  Each year, three of the six new grad students get this grant, and three second-year students get it as well.
[01:08:44]  Holmes basically had a 50% chance of getting this grant through the school.
[01:08:48]  There's nothing weird about this, especially considering that on paper he looked like a super promising candidate for their program.
[01:08:54]  You have to understand that element here.
[01:08:56]  He was overqualified on paper for a school like the University of Colorado, Denver, but unable to pass the more nebulous aspects of the application process for a top-tier school.
[01:09:05]  This is in no way meant to insult people who went to the University of Colorado Denver or anybody involved with the school, but they were probably super excited to have a student like him in their program, so him getting that grant makes total sense.
[01:09:18]  Also, that grant is a large part of the conspiracy that DARPA funding was involved in Holmes, and he had mind control work that he was doing, but that's complete bullshit and doesn't take into account how grad schools work or any of the facts in the case, really.
[01:09:32]  From there, the assertions get even wilder.
[01:09:34]  Kurt Nimmo wrote in an article on InfoWars about Holmes' DARPA connections, and these connections are super weak.
[01:09:41]  The first is that Holmes was a research assistant at the Salk Institute at UC San Diego, and that the Salk Institute had worked with DARPA on the, quote, peak soldier performance program.
[01:09:51]  Oh, boy.
[01:09:52]  Are you following this?
[01:09:53]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:09:55]  This is going to be circuitous if I understand correctly.
[01:09:59]  I'm going to try and not take the long road around a little bit.
[01:10:03]  Well, I think Nimoy is going to.
[01:10:05]  Yeah, Nimmo, sorry.
[01:10:07]  First problem with his theory about this peak soldier performance program is that though the name sounds scary, that program wasn't about mind control or anything like that.
[01:10:15]  It was largely about preventing muscle fatigue and creating cool new things like gloves that can cool as well as warm for soldiers' hands and also prosthetics.
[01:10:24]  They have a lot of innovative ways for wounded soldiers who've lost limbs.
[01:10:28]  It's a lot of research into being able to have them have mobility and arm use again.
[01:10:33]  Right.
[01:10:33]  And deadening their souls like Kurt Russell.
[01:10:37]  Less of that.
[01:10:37]  Oh, okay.
[01:10:38]  Also, DARPA funds research all over the goddamn place.
[01:10:41]  That doesn't mean anything definitive in terms of this, like proving a link between them and Holmes.
[01:10:46]  All you have here is a super flimsy connection that you can use to then suggest secretly that there's way more going on here than you know.
[01:10:52]  Meanwhile, you've proved nothing.
[01:10:54]  For instance, in 2015, Janelle Ayers got a $500,000 grant from DARPA while at the Salk Institute, the same place that they're talking about, to pursue her research into, quote, bolstering a person's microbiome to help their body overcome an infection.
[01:11:08]  Anything suspicious there?
[01:11:09]  I don't know.
[01:11:10]  That's what the global culture is.
[01:11:11]  You want to make a conspiracy out of this?
[01:11:12]  That's what they would want you to do.
[01:11:13]  They would want to keep your biome from getting all messed up.
[01:11:17]  Everybody knows that.
[01:11:18]  DARPA is super public and open that every year it gives out a ton of grants in the form of their young faculty award to quote rising stars and junior research positions.
[01:11:26]  It would be kind of more interesting if maybe James Holmes had gotten one of those or if they were disproportionately awarded to the schools that he was at, but none of that's the case.
[01:11:34]  So conspiracy theorists conveniently just ignore that part where DARPA splashes research money all over the place, making it super easy to connect them to things through webs of coincidence that you could just exaggerate, which is all that's going on here.
[01:11:47]  Yeah, I was like, what?
[01:11:50]  80% of grants can be six degrees of separation back to DARPA or whatever it is you want.
[01:11:55]  Also, he was just an intern at this Salk Institute.
[01:11:58]  So I don't know what, anyway.
[01:12:00]  Well, that's who the globalists would choose to mind control, though.
[01:12:03]  You wouldn't choose one of the main guys.
[01:12:04]  You would choose the other.
[01:12:06]  It's both, quite frankly.
[01:12:07]  Yeah, that he's being mind-controlled and that he was working on mind-controlled.
[01:12:11]  Oh, okay.
[01:12:12]  The theory eclipses both.
[01:12:14]  Really?
[01:12:15]  We're going to do both things.
[01:12:16]  So it's sort of mystery science theater with Joel having an experiment done on him.
[01:12:21]  And then Joel is Dr. Forrester as well.
[01:12:23]  Right, right, right.
[01:12:24]  So it just is a.
[01:12:25]  That is a very absolute.
[01:12:28]  That's all it is.
[01:12:29]  Absolutely.
[01:12:29]  The conspiracy, at least this piece of it, was largely the result of quote-unquote reporting, or as I'm going to call it, speculating, done by former InfoWars employee Wayne Madsen, who, if you recall, is the guy who we're making fun of with our Call Larry Nichols shirts.
[01:12:43]  As you can see, again, this is super interesting that essentially what's happening is that someone Alex has deep connections with and who has at least freelanced for Infowars at this point is coming up with the bullshit conspiracy theory, which Alex is then propagating.
[01:12:57]  This pattern is becoming incredibly consistent.
[01:13:01]  They do the work, Alex spreads the shit.
[01:13:04]  Nice embedded plug for the shirts.
[01:13:06]  No problem.
[01:13:08]  Anytime Wayne Madsen comes up, we have a responsibility to remind people that it was him who said that Hillary Clinton's chef got murdered and a piece, a paper on his shirt, said Call Larry Nichols.
[01:13:21]  Makes no sense.
[01:13:22]  Wonderful.
[01:13:22]  So now we get to the claim of the top Air Force psychiatrist who'd been working over whole operations in San Antonio was working with Holmes.
[01:13:31]  Yeah, that one was interesting to me.
[01:13:32]  I'm glad.
[01:13:33]  I'm glad, because that means you're going to be interested.
[01:13:35]  I am interested.
[01:13:36]  I was interested in the previous part, too.
[01:13:38]  I know.
[01:13:38]  Less interested than the Air Force psychiatrist, to be honest.
[01:13:41]  So one of the things that's important to point out here, just off the bat, is that in order to complete their psychological evaluation of Holmes and determine if he was sane enough to stay on trial, the Colorado Mental Health Institute conducted interviews with 12 mental health clinicians that he'd had relevant contact with before and after his crime.
[01:13:57]  During the relevant period between March 21st and June 11th, 2012, Holmes was seeing a therapist through the University of Colorado Student Health Services.
[01:14:07]  This therapist was Dr. Lynn Fenton, and they met seven times in total.
[01:14:12]  Her name was made public very early in the investigation because before carrying out the shooting, Holmes sent Fenton a package containing the notebook that Alex is lying about, saying it's a workbook that they worked on together.
[01:14:23]  Oh, okay.
[01:14:23]  He sent her a package that contained that notebook, and because of that, her name got released, possibly unintentionally, when reports came out about the package.
[01:14:32]  Yeah.
[01:14:33]  Okay.
[01:14:34]  In his evaluation, Holmes explains that he lost the fear of consequences for his actions while working with Dr. Fenton.
[01:14:39]  When asked about it, he says that he didn't tell Fenton about it because he knew that she would lock him up.
[01:14:44]  And, quote, I would not be able to kill people, not be able to get out of this depression and increase my worth.
[01:14:50]  More on those worth ideas here in a little bit.
[01:14:52]  Right, right.
[01:14:53]  It is probably not a good idea to tell your therapist that you became a psychopath.
[01:14:58]  No, and it is very clear consistently about not telling her things.
[01:15:01]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:15:02]  It doesn't matter if he told her or not, though, because she got the point.
[01:15:06]  In his trial, Fenton testified that after their last session, which he left early, quote, she was so concerned that Holmes might be a danger to the public in the month before the Aurora theater shooting that she contacted police and Holmes' mother, a violation of healthcare privacy law.
[01:15:22]  She breached confidentiality, but she decided that she couldn't do anything further since he hadn't been specific enough in their sessions for him to reach the legal criteria for her to hospitalize him.
[01:15:34]  From his psychological evaluation, it's pretty clear that he knew where the line was, and he kept things from Fenton specifically, so she couldn't hospitalize him.
[01:15:42]  He said he couldn't tell her that he was buying weapons, any details of the specific plan, or that he wanted to be locked up, because if he did, she would hospitalize him, and then he couldn't carry out his plan, which he thought would cure his depression.
[01:15:55]  There are plenty of people who have questions about whether or not she did enough, but from where I'm sitting, I see a therapist who broke protocol to try and stop this guy from hurting people.
[01:16:04]  Definitely not someone who is his mind control handler, as the conspiracy theories go.
[01:16:09]  Yeah, it sure sounds like she was trying to save lives.
[01:16:11]  And did it probably about as much as he could.
[01:16:14]  Yeah, well, probably more than you're supposed.
[01:16:16]  Well, obviously more than you're supposed to.
[01:16:19]  Like, she went beyond what people would consider, I guess, okay.
[01:16:24]  Yeah.
[01:16:25]  The conspiracy theory hinges about her being a mind control doctor from the Air Force.
[01:16:32]  It all hinges on one sentence from one CNN article about Dr. Fenton.
[01:16:35]  Well, that's worthwhile.
[01:16:36]  Quote, she worked as a physician in private practice in Denver from 1994 to 2005 and was chief of physical medicine for the U.S. Air Force in San Antonio, Texas in the early 90s, according to her resume.
[01:16:48]  That was it.
[01:16:48]  Yep.
[01:16:49]  That's the whole thing.
[01:16:50]  From there, speculation ran rampant.
[01:16:52]  According to the conspiracy chef blog, her resume said that she was the chief of physical medicine and staff psychiatrist for the U.S. Air Force in San Antonio from 1990 to 1993, which is absolutely not proof of anything other than that she is a doctor and she had a job.
[01:17:06]  Nowhere does anyone prove that chiefs of physical medicine are mind control doctors.
[01:17:10]  Nowhere does anyone establish that staff psychiatrists are, quote, over whole operations.
[01:17:16]  This is just complete assumption and embellishment that these people are carrying off.
[01:17:19]  Right.
[01:17:20]  Well, if we cross-reference this, though, with all the other Air Force heads of physical medicine, then we can conclude, of course, that every mass shooting has been traced back to an Air Force head of physicians.
[01:17:36]  That makes perfect sense.
[01:17:37]  Maybe, but I think that the conspiracy theorists knew that was kind of weak.
[01:17:40]  So in order to make things more convincing, they point to the fact that Fenton was reprimanded for prescribing herself and a few other people that she knew drugs in her past.
[01:17:49]  All right, well, that sounds fun.
[01:17:50]  Sure.
[01:17:50]  She's not supposed to do that.
[01:17:52]  But a closer examination of what she actually did makes the infraction look super minor.
[01:17:57]  Though she was reprimanded in 2005, the incidents happened between 1997 and 1999, and they were Claridin and Ambien for her husband, which I say, who cares?
[01:18:06]  Yeah, you need a prescription for those?
[01:18:09]  It's crazy.
[01:18:11]  She got three tabs of Xanax for herself to take while her mother was in the process of dying, and four Xanaxes for a friend who was afraid to fly.
[01:18:19]  I don't care about any of this stuff.
[01:18:20]  Nope, not at all.
[01:18:21]  Zero.
[01:18:22]  It's against.
[01:18:23]  Zero.
[01:18:23]  It's against the law, but it's not the kind of misprescribing that I would call immoral.
[01:18:28]  Yeah, there's a difference between misprescribing and then abusing something.
[01:18:34]  Like, this is not abuse.
[01:18:36]  If she had abused it, then fuck yeah, let's think on a technicality you could say she's abusing it.
[01:18:43]  I suppose.
[01:18:44]  But I'm not part of the medical ethics board, so I don't.
[01:18:48]  I see why she prescribed these things, and it's not like she's getting tons of Vicodin to sell on the street or something like that.
[01:18:55]  Stealing is bad, but if you're starving and you stole a loaf of bread over a six-month span, look, you're fine.

=== Unruh's Confession Skepticism (15:39) ===

[01:19:01]  Either way, she was reprimanded for it and had to take a class on proper procedure.
[01:19:05]  That's the fitting punishment for what she did.
[01:19:07]  I don't see any problems with this.
[01:19:09]  Claritin.
[01:19:10]  But it was enough to make a conspiracy out of.
[01:19:13]  All of a sudden, she turned into an unethical psychiatrist, and people started to write blog posts that started with the words, a lot of people are asking.
[01:19:21]  God damn it.
[01:19:22]  One has to wonder.
[01:19:23]  No, you don't.
[01:19:24]  Is it possible that?
[01:19:25]  Stop that.
[01:19:26]  From there, Spaghetti just got thrown against the wall.
[01:19:29]  She got her undergrad from UC Davis, and apparently some people believe that they have a monkey colony there to study mind control.
[01:19:35]  What?
[01:19:35]  Sure.
[01:19:36]  Jolly and West worked at the same Air Force base as she did 40 years prior, so she must have been doing the same MK Ultra work as him.
[01:19:42]  Huh?
[01:19:43]  These are some of the more non-insane theories that get thrown over.
[01:19:46]  Wait, what?
[01:19:46]  That was the non-insane version.
[01:19:48]  Some of the more easy ones to explain or tell you about.
[01:19:51]  Okay.
[01:19:51]  So there's literally zero evidence that Dr. Fenton is anything other than a school psychiatrist who also worked in an Air Force base 13 years prior.
[01:19:58]  There's no evidence that she was a, quote, top Air Force psychiatrist or psychologist, especially considering that she only worked for them for three years, and Lackland Air Force Base isn't even close to being the biggest or, you know, I don't know.
[01:20:11]  Well, she did leave screaming, I'll never work for this mind control program again.
[01:20:16]  That was damning.
[01:20:17]  That was, that was, that quote is a little bit harder to brush aside.
[01:20:22]  None of this stuff that Alex is talking about in terms of her being a top Air Force psychologist over whole operations in San Antonio is true.
[01:20:30]  He's just taking tiny details of her life and exaggerating them into what he needs to help him cast suspicions.
[01:20:36]  God, I know we're seven million episodes into this, but somehow there's still a part of me that is like, Alex, you're cheating.
[01:20:45]  This is not fair.
[01:20:47]  You're not playing by the rules, goddammit.
[01:20:50]  And to make it worse, to make exactly what you're saying worse, much of the primary sourcing for the conspiracies about Lynn Fenton trace directly back to John Rappaport, who, again, is a very frequent contributor to InfoWars.
[01:21:02]  Oh!
[01:21:03]  And has at least some sort of formal relationship with the business as the fourth hour host of Alex's show.
[01:21:07]  You're not allowed to do this.
[01:21:09]  Many of the blogs that paint her as an unethical therapist and speculate about her being up to no good with Holmes link back to articles on Rappaport's own blog, No More Fake News, as well as articles that he wrote with his byline on Infowars.
[01:21:23]  Again, we can see this pattern.
[01:21:24]  Alex's associates create flimsy bullshit.
[01:21:27]  He spreads it, presenting it as well-researched facts.
[01:21:29]  Oh, God, I hate this.
[01:21:31]  So let's talk about this notebook.
[01:21:33]  This workbook.
[01:21:35]  All right.
[01:21:35]  So he and Fenton were working together.
[01:21:38]  And what's their face?
[01:21:39]  Who was in that?
[01:21:40]  They were old.
[01:21:41]  They were, she read them the- McAdams.
[01:21:44]  McAdams, that's who it was.
[01:21:46]  This is a different notebook.
[01:21:46]  Oh, okay.
[01:21:47]  Much more upsetting.
[01:21:48]  Much more.
[01:21:49]  I don't know.
[01:21:50]  I hated that movie.
[01:21:51]  I would say, I guarantee I've looked through this notebook.
[01:21:54]  More upsetting.
[01:21:55]  Okay.
[01:21:55]  So Alex is saying that police are citing national security and they don't want to release the.
[01:22:01]  It did get released.
[01:22:02]  Yeah.
[01:22:02]  So in May 2012, Holmes began planning his shooting, writing about his mental state and what he hoped to do in a notebook.
[01:22:09]  It's important to note very specifically that he wasn't working on this with any mental health practitioner.
[01:22:14]  This was strictly an extracurricular activity.
[01:22:16]  On InfoWars, an anonymously written article claims without proof that the notebook, quote, is an obvious attempt to hastily arrange a backstory on Holmes and portray him as a murderous psychopath.
[01:22:27]  He'd been expressing his desire to kill since March 2012 when he told a friend identified as Miss D as much in a group G, or I'm sorry, in a G chat.
[01:22:36]  He says he wanted to kill people, to which she replies that it's too much effort and he'd just end up in jail.
[01:22:41]  Holmes replies, quote, that's why you kill many people.
[01:22:44]  In these G-Chat logs, as well as his notebook, Holmes expressed ideas about what he calls human capital.
[01:22:50]  It's basically a twisted version of believing that an hour of skilled labor is intrinsically more valuable than an hour of unskilled labor.
[01:22:57]  In his conception, the human capital of a life is priceless.
[01:23:00]  So, quote, you take away life and your human capital is limitless.
[01:23:05]  He seemed to believe that his life was low on human capital, and that by killing a large number of people, he would get the capital that he was missing.
[01:23:13]  Right.
[01:23:13]  He was soul-eating.
[01:23:14]  Yes.
[01:23:15]  He felt that raising his worth in this way, raising his human capital level, was the only way that he could rid himself of this terrible depression that he lived in.
[01:23:22]  Okay.
[01:23:23]  In the G-Chat sessions.
[01:23:24]  Somehow that's more reasonable than Scientology.
[01:23:27]  In his G-Chat sessions, he expresses that he's not all evil and that killing people is plan B.
[01:23:32]  He claims that he found a good path that he would rather try.
[01:23:35]  And that plan, which is described in the interviews subsequently with him, the plan that he had was, quote, living a good life.
[01:23:42]  That was it.
[01:23:43]  It's very unspecific.
[01:23:43]  That was the whole thing.
[01:23:44]  Yeah.
[01:23:45]  And it did not work out.
[01:23:46]  Okay.
[01:23:46]  Because he did go for that plan B.
[01:23:48]  Yeah.
[01:23:48]  Holmes wrote all about his plans in this notebook, which he mailed to Dr. Fenton on July 19th, 2012, choosing that date specifically because he knew it wouldn't arrive until after the shooting.
[01:23:58]  He sent it hours before he would go off to do this shooting.
[01:24:01]  So he wanted to torture her as well.
[01:24:03]  He doesn't know why.
[01:24:05]  In that mental evaluation, he's asked about why he sent it to her and what he thought her response would be.
[01:24:11]  And he seemed unable to say why he did it.
[01:24:16]  It didn't seem like he wanted to torture her.
[01:24:19]  Right.
[01:24:19]  It seemed like it was just, I'd been working with her.
[01:24:22]  It almost felt from reading it, like his response was, she might want to know.
[01:24:27]  Yeah.
[01:24:27]  And I don't know.
[01:24:28]  I mean, as a, she might have, she might be invested in my.
[01:24:31]  She might be curious.
[01:24:32]  Yeah.
[01:24:33]  I don't know if that was his motivation.
[01:24:35]  But from the questioning about it, it didn't seem like it was a middle fingers.
[01:24:40]  Right, right, right.
[01:24:40]  If you were writing it up as a movie, though, it would be some kind of unrequited love.
[01:24:45]  Maybe.
[01:24:46]  If you were making another version of the notebook, a much darker version of the notebook.
[01:24:49]  Oh, no.
[01:24:50]  So the notebook is full of disturbed thoughts and descriptions of what he was going through in the months leading up to the shooting.
[01:24:56]  He discusses deceiving Dr. Fenton and how his plan was to, quote, prevent building a false sense of rapport, speak truthfully, and deflect incriminating questions.
[01:25:05]  So he was intentionally withholding information from her in order to be able to follow through with the plan.
[01:25:11]  Throughout the notebook, Holmes presents himself as having a lifelong struggle about the question of the meaning of life as well as the meaning of death.
[01:25:18]  It's a question he can't solve, and it seems to give him great anguish.
[01:25:22]  The solution he arrives at, it seems, is that, quote, if you destroy all life, then there is no question.
[01:25:28]  So he believed that, which is really grandiose.
[01:25:32]  Yeah.
[01:25:33]  But he also discusses having these grandiose thoughts since the age of 10, imagining that he would be able to do something that would kill everyone in the world.
[01:25:40]  Yeah.
[01:25:40]  That's tough because that is something that, like, bipolar, I've had delusions of grandeur so many times.
[01:25:48]  Like, and like a disconcerting number of times where I'm surprised that I'm still allowed here anywhere.
[01:25:59]  So it is unfortunate that it's like, I totally understand how that can twist and warp you in ways that you, like, it's impossible to really kind of explain to somebody who's never experienced that.
[01:26:13]  And none of this is to say that what he did.
[01:26:17]  No, no, no, fuck him.
[01:26:19]  To provide an explanation is not to minimize his actions or excuse them.
[01:26:23]  No.
[01:26:24]  It's to explain that this conspiracy that Alex is pitching is complete nonsense.
[01:26:28]  Right.
[01:26:29]  This is something, this notebook is something that he created on his own as who knows, maybe it helped him feel like he was doing something or externalize himself from the fact that he was going to kill a bunch of people, intellectualize it, work through these issues.
[01:26:45]  And it had nothing to do with Dr. Fenton.
[01:26:47]  He sent it to her before he went and did the crime, knowing that it would arrive later.
[01:26:52]  It's very clear from the available information.
[01:26:55]  Yeah, I only point that out not as like I empathize or this is an explanation, more a that's a terrifying reality is like not to not to minimize it.
[01:27:08]  There's so many other factors, but like there, but for the grace of God, go I, that kind of situation.
[01:27:14]  You know, it's a nightmarish thing to be held in a prison by your own brain.
[01:27:20]  So fuck.
[01:27:22]  So now to the question of multiple shooters.
[01:27:25]  There's always reports of multiple shooters in the immediate time frame after a mass tragedy.
[01:27:30]  That's not enough evidence for a conspiracy.
[01:27:32]  If it were, then literally everything that's ever happened probably didn't happen.
[01:27:35]  Yeah.
[01:27:36]  I've looked through the conspiracies about the idea of multiple shooters being involved in the shooting, and nothing even rises to the level of interesting me.
[01:27:43]  It's all very standard stuff about police dispatchers saying there may be multiple shooters and witnesses reporting things like someone said someone was shooting in the lobby.
[01:27:52]  So all that sort of stuff is exactly what you see in every situation.
[01:27:57]  If a police dispatch said, we can 100% guarantee that there is only one shooter with so little information available, that'd be fucked up.
[01:28:05]  Yeah.
[01:28:06]  So now on to the question of this jailhouse confession of not knowing who he is and he's drugged up.
[01:28:11]  Right, right, right, right.
[01:28:12]  So throughout his psychological evaluation, Holmes repeatedly discusses how he made various efforts to alter his appearance for the shooting.
[01:28:19]  So he could emotionally separate the part of himself that he decided that decided to kill a bunch of people from the part of himself that he thought was normal.
[01:28:26]  He bought black contact lenses to wear during the shooting, quote, as a way to differentiate myself from my normal self.
[01:28:33]  Jesus, he's red dragon.
[01:28:35]  He said that he liked the look because it looked like he was possessed.
[01:28:39]  In the initial police report, the first officers to make contact with him pointed out that his eyes were very dilated, but this was before they knew that he had black contacts in.
[01:28:47]  This is where the misconceptions come from, where he was whacked out on drugs.
[01:28:51]  No, god damn it.
[01:28:53]  That's the complete explanation.
[01:28:54]  That's the whole fucking explanation.
[01:28:56]  Jesus, it's so goddamn simple.
[01:28:58]  Absolutely.
[01:28:59]  Fucking Christ.
[01:29:00]  So he had taken one Vicodin an hour prior to going to the theater just in case he got injured while doing the shooting, but other than that, he was completely clean of alcohol or street drugs.
[01:29:10]  So he was on a few medications, but by the time the possibility of antipsychotic meds came up, he rejected the idea while he was working with Dr. Fenton because by that point he'd already failed out of grad school and his insurance in the program wouldn't cover it.
[01:29:24]  Around June 11th, 2012, he dyed his hair red, but contrary to the media's portrayal of it, he didn't intend for it to have any connection to the Joker.
[01:29:32]  Again, it was an attempt to differentiate who he was going to be from the part of himself that he felt was good.
[01:29:38]  And he said he changed his appearance, quote, because I was not my normal self.
[01:29:42]  Yeah.
[01:29:43]  God, that's another fucked up part of it is that, like, oh, well, I can't get anti-psychotics because my insurance won't cover it or because I ran out of insurance.
[01:29:52]  But that might be what Heath used as an excuse.
[01:29:56]  Oh, no, no, no, entirely.
[01:29:57]  I'm just saying the fact that that is a reality, regardless of this particular instance, is insane to me.
[01:30:03]  It is.
[01:30:04]  Simply because, look, it's a good teachable moment.
[01:30:06]  Maybe you could save lives.
[01:30:08]  Yeah.
[01:30:09]  So that was about protecting the part of himself that he thought was good.
[01:30:12]  All these changes of his appearance.
[01:30:14]  If he completely altered his physical appearance, he felt he wasn't himself anymore and that, quote, the other me did everything.
[01:30:20]  The report is pretty clear that though this is psychologically relevant, it doesn't present with the same symptoms that disassociation often does.
[01:30:28]  And that his choosing to compartmentalize his actions seems largely willful.
[01:30:32]  There was something up, but through all of it, he knew who he was.
[01:30:35]  Yeah.
[01:30:36]  After he was put in custody, Holmes took a predictable turn for the worse.
[01:30:39]  The ideas that he had about being able to raise his human capital and free himself from his depression by killing hadn't worked, and he was still depressed.
[01:30:47]  He descended into a full-on psychotic break, requiring staff to restrain him for his own safety as he was banging his head on walls and apparently trying to fall from his bed in a manner so as to fall on his head.
[01:30:57]  Dr. Frazier reported that he did not know where he was and that his thinking was completely disorganized and talked a lot about being in a quote shadow box and the need to hide from shadows.
[01:31:08]  But this is after all of the custody.
[01:31:11]  This is when he's taking.
[01:31:12]  Yeah.
[01:31:12]  He was put on Resperidone and responded very well.
[01:31:15]  He became able to organize his thoughts enough to understand what year it was and who was the president and where he was.
[01:31:21]  His auditory and visual hallucinations subsided as well.
[01:31:24]  They also found that he was in a starvation delirium due to not eating because he was paranoid about the food that was being provided at the hospital.
[01:31:31]  They put him on a saline drip and he improved again dramatically.
[01:31:34]  During that time, he was also put on the right medication.
[01:31:38]  Before that, he was saying all sorts of wild shit, but he was also being kept in isolation, so no one but his doctors would have heard him saying any of that stuff.
[01:31:45]  The stories about the things that James Holmes said in prison all come from a man who was also in the jail at the time, a man named Steve Unruh.
[01:31:53]  Unruh claimed that while they were both in booking cells, he had a four-hour talk with Holmes and talked him out of committing suicide in this chat wherein Holmes said he was programmed to kill by an evil therapist.
[01:32:04]  What we do know for sure is that Unruh was at the Arapahoe Sheriff's Detention Facility in the hours before the shooting, having been arrested on drug and theft charges.
[01:32:14]  He alleges, although prisoners are kept separate, they can communicate through gaps in cell doors.
[01:32:20]  Multiple officers at the Sheriff's Department, including the captain and lieutenant, have gone on record and said the communication, like Unruh is describing, is impossible due to the layout of the holding cells.
[01:32:31]  So that's one problem with his story, perhaps.
[01:32:35]  So he's almost playing on the idea that we have from movies of the jails being bars, and you can still, like, even if it's a solid wall between you, you can still talk through the bars and get that.
[01:32:48]  Gotcha.
[01:32:48]  Unruh's big proof that he did talk to Holmes is a phone number that Holmes gave him and told him to call.
[01:32:53]  555.
[01:32:55]  That number goes to a bereavement counselor who said that she has never met or spoken with James Holmes or Steve Unruh.
[01:33:01]  He claims that Holmes tried to send him a letter in prison, but that it was intercepted, but no official record of an interception or a letter exists.
[01:33:08]  Yeah, it was intercepted by Raptor Princesses.
[01:33:10]  Let's move on.
[01:33:12]  Given the unlikely nature of their communication being possible and the inconclusiveness of any proof that Unruh has been able to provide, I see this with a little bit of skepticism.
[01:33:21]  Probably one important thing to consider is that Unruh had just been released from six years in prison and then had been rearrested and was looking at a steep sentence for reoffending.
[01:33:30]  From an article in Westworld, quote, he's going public with this account of the encounter with Holmes, he says, only after trying to interest the Arapahoe County District Attorney's Office in his story.
[01:33:40]  He's currently facing habitual criminal charges and had hoped to deal his way into a mental health treatment rather than a 12-year prison sentence.
[01:33:47]  Although an investigator visited him, quote, the DA hasn't been working with me, he sighs.
[01:33:53]  Occam's Razor tells me that this story is a load of bullshit, and that Unro was spending it to cut a deal and somehow turn a coincidence that he was in the holding at the same time as Holmes into a positive for him.
[01:34:02]  The DA didn't believe his story, since it's clearly nonsense, so he decided to take it to the public and see if he could find any interest there.
[01:34:09]  Yeah.
[01:34:09]  It's also probably worth noting that in 2014, Steve Unruh self-published a book called The Truth: Massacre at Cinema 16.
[01:34:16]  And here is the description of that book.
[01:34:18]  Quote, a family man with an addiction relapse gets an intervention in his life, and also in a mass murderer's life.

=== Alien Workshop Controversies (05:20) ===

[01:34:25]  Just hours after the man kills 12 people and injures 70, the killer wants to commit suicide, and the author is used as a vessel from a higher power to pray with the killer, convince him to repent, and talk him out of his suicidal thoughts.
[01:34:37]  I think all this has a pretty simple explanation, and that is that Steve Von Rue is not a good source of information, and we should not believe him.
[01:34:44]  But this jailhouse confession, it seems kind of like he is an opportunist.
[01:34:49]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:34:50]  I wonder how good that book is, though.
[01:34:52]  Oh, man.
[01:34:53]  Is it any good?
[01:34:54]  Did you read it?
[01:34:54]  I didn't, because I couldn't find a PDF of it or anything.
[01:34:57]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:34:58]  That's not a surprise.
[01:34:59]  I did find a lot of indications that the people who published it, the house that published it, is on a lot of people's.
[01:35:06]  Publishers Clearinghouse.
[01:35:07]  It's on one of a lot of warning lists.
[01:35:10]  Gotcha.
[01:35:11]  For people who are writing things about don't work with them.
[01:35:14]  Gotcha.
[01:35:14]  It may not be one of the more credible publishers of books, which shouldn't surprise too much.
[01:35:20]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:35:21]  It's one of those schemes where he wound up paying a lot and he did not recoup his expenses.
[01:35:29]  Let's put it that way.
[01:35:30]  So we're done now with the.
[01:35:32]  Oh, well, it was wonderful doing this show with you.
[01:35:37]  I wish you the best in future projects.
[01:35:40]  This isn't a complete rundown of all of the conspiracies that people spin about the Aurora shooting, but there's no way that you possibly could in Alex made five specific claims that he was using to reinforce his position that the Aurora shooting was cartoonishly fake and obviously a false flag.
[01:35:58]  None of them stand up to scrutiny, even in the least, and all are easily cast aside as completely manufactured or misrepresented bits of information, seeking a predetermined conclusion, namely that the shooting was fake.
[01:36:10]  His evidence that the shooting is cartoonishly fake is cartoonishly awful.
[01:36:14]  At least two of the theories I can trace back specifically to InfoWars contributors as either being the root of the theory or being the largest propagators once they got rolling, which I think feels a little bit significant.
[01:36:26]  Seems important.
[01:36:27]  Yeah.
[01:36:28]  Ultimately, what's going on here is that Alex is aggressively arguing that the Aurora shooting was fake to justify his position that Sandy Hook was fake.
[01:36:35]  When you analyze his claims about Aurora, you can clearly see that there's no support here for his Sandy Hook position.
[01:36:41]  And in fact, it only makes his behavior look worse.
[01:36:44]  It's very stupid.
[01:36:44]  Yeah, this is bullshit.
[01:36:45]  He's very stupid.
[01:36:46]  I'm mad.
[01:36:47]  He's cheating.
[01:36:47]  He is.
[01:36:48]  cheating i think that you're not allowed i think Why are we doing something about cheating?
[01:36:54]  Don't we have refs?
[01:36:55]  Don't we have a referee somewhere who can be like, no, no, no, no, you're cheating.
[01:36:58]  Get out of here.
[01:36:59]  See, Jordan, I think, unfortunately, you've just described what we are doing.
[01:37:03]  No, that's right.
[01:37:04]  We're not doing it.
[01:37:05]  Info refs.
[01:37:05]  We're better than.
[01:37:06]  We should have called the show InfoWars.
[01:37:07]  We're better than the NBA referees, but yeah.
[01:37:10]  Yeah.
[01:37:11]  So let's move on to this next clip where Alex has a new business venture that he is going to announce.
[01:37:16]  Oh, no.
[01:37:17]  We have some new skateboards.
[01:37:19]  We got contacted.
[01:37:21]  We shouldn't even talk about this yet.
[01:37:22]  No, you don't.
[01:37:22]  The point is they're up there on the site, so I need to discuss that probably at another point.
[01:37:29]  Great way to wake people up is to have skateboards with Infowars.com.
[01:37:32]  It is a great way to wake people up.
[01:37:34]  Alien Workshop artwork on it.
[01:37:36]  Oh, no.
[01:37:38]  Alien Workshop.
[01:37:39]  Tyranny Grinder 1.
[01:37:40]  But Alien Workshop is a pretty big skateboard company.
[01:37:42]  At least it's big enough that I, a non-skateboarder, am aware of it.
[01:37:46]  It's pretty fucked up.
[01:37:47]  Oh, that's a real skateboard.
[01:37:48]  Skating Workshop is a pretty big shit.
[01:37:51]  It's fucked up.
[01:37:51]  They released decks in collaboration with Infowars in January 2013.
[01:37:56]  But it also does speak to something that I've learned from knowing a lot of skaters over the course of my life, and that is that many of them are really cool, and some of them are pretty clever, but they're not the best decision makers, generally speaking.
[01:38:06]  No.
[01:38:07]  One of the things that's the biggest bummer about hearing that clip is that at the time, Alien Workshop was owned by Rob Deerdick, star of the delightful MTV shows Robin Big and Rob Deardick's Fantasy Factory.
[01:38:18]  It's really sad for me to realize that he put out an InfoWars deck between the fifth and sixth seasons of Fantasy Factory.
[01:38:24]  It kind of doesn't surprise me now that I know it's that Rob.
[01:38:28]  Now that I know it's that Rob, I totally buy that he would be like, InfoWars sounds like a great thing to partner with.
[01:38:34]  It makes me so sad.
[01:38:35]  Oh, I'm sorry.
[01:38:36]  Makes me look at Rob a little differently.
[01:38:38]  I enjoyed those shorts.
[01:38:38]  You look at him the same way.
[01:38:40]  I enjoyed Robin Big quite a bit.
[01:38:42]  Okay.
[01:38:42]  Anyway, I don't think the decks were a huge hit.
[01:38:45]  And most of the responses I can find that remain online are not positive, ranging from a Reddit comment that just says, fuck Alex Jones to a message board thread accusing Alien Workshop of being a satanic company that, quote, gay-ass occult doodles on their brand, their boards and clothes.
[01:39:01]  All right.
[01:39:02]  They also accuse Alex of selling out for working with them, which is pretty funny to imagine that co-branding a skateboard in 2013 is the point at which someone would accuse Alex of selling out.
[01:39:10]  Yeah, I was going to say, dude, this is a blip.
[01:39:12]  You're way, way far off on this one.
[01:39:14]  This is a fucking blip in the radar.
[01:39:16]  Yeah, this is nothing.
[01:39:17]  So neither of them got what they wanted out of it.
[01:39:20]  Sort of people attacking Alien Workshop and Alex.
[01:39:22]  It's like the perfect synthesis of the bad parts of your fandom or not going to like both of them hate each other.

=== Aurora Shooting Revelations (15:32) ===

[01:39:29]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:39:30]  So anyway, sorry, Rob.
[01:39:33]  I'm out.
[01:39:35]  If you're listening about my best friends, all right.
[01:39:39]  All right.
[01:39:40]  I told you earlier.
[01:39:40]  Let's get back down to business.
[01:39:42]  All right.
[01:39:42]  I told you earlier that we were going to meet a real crazy, a real bad person, a real monster, which is the sort of thing that always excites me about doing these episodes.
[01:39:52]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:39:53]  On the one hand, I was also really excited about the opportunity to talk about the Aurora shooting because Alex brings it up all the time as proof that Sandy Hook could be fake.
[01:40:01]  And I knew that down the road we would need to do that.
[01:40:05]  But that was probably like 20 minutes, half an hour of this episode.
[01:40:08]  And I'm sorry if that bored anybody, but it's essential that we cover that as we go through Sandy Hook.
[01:40:14]  It's a big piece of his shit.
[01:40:15]  But I thought that was going to be it for this episode.
[01:40:19]  Okay.
[01:40:19]  And then a crazy showed up.
[01:40:21]  All right.
[01:40:21]  And I was like, oh, this might be even more interesting.
[01:40:25]  Not Hamamoto, though, right?
[01:40:26]  It's not Hamamoto.
[01:40:27]  Okay.
[01:40:27]  Although, it does involve Asia.
[01:40:30]  Okay.
[01:40:32]  Okay.
[01:40:34]  I know.
[01:40:34]  I understand.
[01:40:35]  Professor of Asian.
[01:40:36]  I know.
[01:40:36]  I know.
[01:40:36]  I understand.
[01:40:37]  Yeah.
[01:40:37]  I got you.
[01:40:38]  So I'm going to just go ahead and play this clip, and then I'll explain why this is super exciting for me.
[01:40:46]  Dr. James Garrow joins us because if you're up at Infowars.com, you can see this article.
[01:40:52]  I'll also punch it up for people watching on television.
[01:40:55]  Nobel Peace Prize nominee, Obama asked military leaders if they will fire on U.S. citizens.
[01:41:01]  Shock claim purported to come from one of America's foremost military leaders.
[01:41:05]  Well, we've already got General Boykin, former head of special forces saying our government, he believes, was giving weapons to Al-Qaeda, and that's what Benghazi is as a cover-up.
[01:41:14]  He believes it's admitted.
[01:41:16]  And that's what's so incredible here.
[01:41:18]  Is it?
[01:41:19]  We don't know if it's Boykin.
[01:41:20]  I'm going to try to find out here.
[01:41:21]  But the point is, if you go to our article, and there were other articles that actually broke it in The Examiner and a couple others the day before, and I'm giving him credit.
[01:41:28]  Our articles, though, back it up with the Army training manuals from 2010, FM 3-39.40, interment resettlement.
[01:41:37]  Boo, for sure.
[01:41:37]  It also has gun confiscation, how to take over cities.
[01:41:40]  You can click on that and read that.
[01:41:42]  The pleasure response team is the backup that, hey, this guy's credible.
[01:41:46]  That's why we got him on.
[01:41:47]  And I believe he's telling the truth.
[01:41:49]  So for a long time, I've heard Alex make the following argument, which is what he's talking about here, and what Jim Garrow is on the show to talk about.
[01:41:56]  Obama only wants bloodthirsty patriot haters in the highest offices of the military and the police.
[01:42:03]  In order to achieve this goal, he's put a litmus test in for advancement, if you want a promotion.
[01:42:07]  This test is asking potential candidates if they would fire on American citizens.
[01:42:12]  Sometimes this is couched as shooting people who won't turn in their guns or wouldn't go along with martial law.
[01:42:17]  There's different flavors of it.
[01:42:19]  The particular details change depending on what narrative Alex wants to push, but the basic point is the same.
[01:42:24]  Obama is selectively promoting evil patriot haters so they can have a top-down control over law enforcement, which will then oppress Alex and his friends.
[01:42:33]  I've literally never once thought to look into this because it sounds like complete bullshit and just a dumb paranoid fantasy.
[01:42:39]  But one of the other reasons I never looked into it and I never wanted to dig into it was that Alex never gives a citation for it.
[01:42:46]  So now we have FM-39994.
[01:42:51]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:42:52]  He never talks about where he got this information from.
[01:42:55]  Who said this?
[01:42:56]  So I'm happy to look into all sorts of obviously not true things, but when it just looks like a wild goose chase, I have better uses of my time.
[01:43:03]  Not much better, but slightly better uses of it.
[01:43:05]  Fair, fair, fair.
[01:43:06]  And now, on a silver platter, Alex tells me that he got this information from Dr. Jim Garrow.
[01:43:11]  He even makes it seem a little bit too clear in that clip that Garrow's claims are all he has to back this up, and he's taking his word for it because he thinks Garrow is credible.
[01:43:20]  Well, who is Garrow?
[01:43:21]  If the debate is based on Garrow's credibility, that's something I can look into.
[01:43:27]  If it says doctor before a name, and then it says welcome to InfoWars, you're not a trustworthy source.
[01:43:35]  I don't care.
[01:43:36]  I don't care what you're a doctor of.
[01:43:37]  Hold that thought.
[01:43:38]  You're not a trustworthy source.
[01:43:39]  Hold that thought.
[01:43:40]  Okay.
[01:43:40]  So let me make this clear.
[01:43:41]  Jim Garrow is a lunatic.
[01:43:43]  Here are some of the completely unfounded claims that he has made over the years.
[01:43:47]  He was a guest on the End Times radio show where he claimed that he knew that Andrew Breitbart, Tom Clancy, and Michael Hastings were all killed under direct orders by Barack Obama because they knew that he wasn't actually an American president, but was in reality a Saudi Arabian agent.
[01:44:03]  Why did Tom Clancy specifically know this information?
[01:44:07]  Because he's got fucking sources, man.
[01:44:10]  You think he just writes those books?
[01:44:11]  I'm going to be honest with you.
[01:44:13]  I don't.
[01:44:14]  Because he doesn't.
[01:44:15]  Doesn't he hang out with Steve Chenick?
[01:44:17]  I believe he's written like four books and every other has been ghostwritten.
[01:44:22]  On the Tea Party, on a Tea Party podcast, he claimed that Obama was in touch with aliens or some group that would pretend to be aliens.
[01:44:29]  It's kind of unclear.
[01:44:31]  Either way, Obama was planning to unveil the contact with these aliens as a grand deception, which is dangerously close to the plot of Childhood's End.
[01:44:38]  And so I don't care.
[01:44:40]  In November 2013, he went on another right-wing show and alleged that Obama and George Soros were conspiring to kill 300 million Americans by dropping nukes on cities.
[01:44:50]  So that would leave about 30 million or so, give or take?
[01:44:54]  Yeah, it would mostly just leave Obama, Soros, and Valerie Jarrett, who he seems to really hate.
[01:44:58]  I really feel like the Fed would definitely reinstate quantitative easing if 90% of the population were wiped out.
[01:45:06]  So he goes on to argue that Obama almost carried out this plan, but he was stopped at the last minute by three brave military men.
[01:45:16]  All right.
[01:45:17]  A ragtag team of misfits coming together.
[01:45:21]  Okay.
[01:45:22]  He said that Obama and Soros, who he was calling a Nazi collaborator at that time, hatched this plan so Soros can make more money betting against the dollar.
[01:45:30]  There's literally no evidence that any of this ever happened, and nukes did not kill 300 million people.
[01:45:36]  That's true.
[01:45:37]  Garrow still argued that Obama should, quote, either be put up against the wall and shot or hung for his part in this imaginary plot.
[01:45:44]  Okay.
[01:45:45]  All right.
[01:45:46]  I don't think that's how we do justice.
[01:45:48]  That seems dangerous as a precedent.
[01:45:50]  But hey, what are you going to do?
[01:45:51]  He claimed that Obama tried to kill him by sabotaging his car, but God protected him.
[01:45:56]  More likely scenario, his car didn't start one day, and Garrow decided to turn it into a spy novel.
[01:46:02]  Oh boy.
[01:46:03]  He's claimed that Obama blew up the Malaysian plane and has also accused Obama of being a secret Chinese and Muslim operative along with Saudi Arabia and one.
[01:46:12]  Anybody else?
[01:46:14]  Probably.
[01:46:14]  Is there anybody he's not working with against the United States?
[01:46:18]  Patriots.
[01:46:18]  Well, yeah, but even they are working against the United States, so Obama would, by definition, work with them.
[01:46:24]  I suppose.
[01:46:25]  Though it was not necessarily part of his original appearances in right-wing media, eventually he began claiming that he was a former CIA officer.
[01:46:34]  Isn't it funny how that information comes out over time?
[01:46:37]  Yeah, he claimed that he's been in the agency since the age of 18 until 2013.
[01:46:42]  His father's name is the Dutchman.
[01:46:44]  He was kicked out in 2013 by Obama and Valerie James.
[01:46:49]  Oh, great.
[01:46:49]  Was this before or after they tried to bomb his car?
[01:46:52]  Unclear.
[01:46:53]  A few problems with this story.
[01:46:54]  Though you can be in the CIA at 18, you also have to have a bachelor's degree in order to apply.
[01:46:59]  It's not unheard of to have a bachelor's at the age of 18, but it's super unlikely.
[01:47:03]  And Garrow did not.
[01:47:05]  Especially if you're Garrow.
[01:47:07]  Does he even have a doctorate?
[01:47:08]  We'll get to that.
[01:47:09]  Okay, that's what I was waiting to hear.
[01:47:11]  Another requirement is that you have to have three years' experience in a relevant field, like being in the military or law enforcement, which I don't see in Garrow's story.
[01:47:18]  So it seems like he doesn't reach that requirement.
[01:47:21]  Also, you have to be a citizen of the U.S. to join the CIA.
[01:47:24]  And according to his bio on IMDb, written by user Dr. Jim Garrow.
[01:47:34]  That could be an alias.
[01:47:35]  And I should point out, his bio, which I said is written by user Dr. Jim Garrow, is written alternatingly in the first and third person.
[01:47:47]  He slipped.
[01:47:48]  All right.
[01:47:48]  All right.
[01:47:49]  I am talking to the third person.
[01:47:51]  Oh, boy.
[01:47:52]  So, according to that bio, he was born in Scotland and has lived most of his life in Canada.
[01:47:56]  I see no evidence that he's a U.S. citizen, although he might be.
[01:48:00]  He also has that Canadian aboot, that sort of vowel pronunciation in his interview.
[01:48:07]  So I know that he has at least lived in Canada for long periods of time.
[01:48:11]  Oh, boy.
[01:48:12]  He has a profile on IMDb, as I mentioned, because in 2015, he started pivoting towards being an actor, appearing in Nothing You've Ever Heard Of, but also having more acting credits than Alex.
[01:48:22]  Garrow did two episodes of a show called Shadowland where he turned in a game-changing performance as fly fisherman.
[01:48:31]  Wait, he was in two episodes as fly fisherman?
[01:48:33]  Maybe it's a two-parter.
[01:48:35]  I don't know.
[01:48:36]  He calls himself Dr. Jim Garrow because he claims to have a doctorate degree from North Carolina College of Theology, which is not an accredited school.
[01:48:44]  And in case anyone wants to go back and look through their records and pull up his coursework or anything like that, don't worry about it if you don't find anything, because the degree is honorary.
[01:48:53]  So he didn't actually even do he got an honorary degree from a place where you could probably buy an honorary non-accredited College of Theology in North Carolina.
[01:49:03]  Yeah.
[01:49:03]  Like many weirdos Alex knows, Garrow claims to have been nominated for a Nobel Prize and claims that he lost specifically to Obama, thus only further igniting their rivalry.
[01:49:13]  Now, I will say this: I too agree that Obama did not deserve that peace prize.
[01:49:19]  I'm also going to say that Garrow does not deserve it either.
[01:49:22]  It is not an either-or situation.
[01:49:24]  He presents it as it being between the two of them.
[01:49:27]  Yeah, yeah, like there were two finalists.
[01:49:29]  There is the first black president of the United States and then that guy.
[01:49:35]  He will say things like, Obama, you beat us.
[01:49:40]  He's got a lot of very personal gripes with Obama.
[01:49:43]  A user by the name of Jim Garrow also has edited Wikipedia pages to include the claim of his lost Mobile nomination.
[01:49:52]  Okay, okay.
[01:49:53]  In 2001, Garrow tried to run a flight school at the region of Waterloo International Airport in Canada.
[01:49:58]  Why?
[01:49:59]  He doesn't know how to.
[01:50:00]  Is he a pilot?
[01:50:01]  No.
[01:50:01]  He got in a little bit of trouble when Transit Canada found out that the plane he was using was not insured or registered, leading to a $2,850 fine after, quote, a civil aviation tribunal found he had intentionally deceived his instructors.
[01:50:14]  Wait, so there's only $2,850 is the only fine.
[01:50:20]  I think he also had to shut down the school.
[01:50:22]  Whoa, okay.
[01:50:23]  All right.
[01:50:24]  All this is to say that I don't know if I think Jim Garrow is a very credible source.
[01:50:28]  I might go ahead and not believe him when he says that Obama is trying to get troops to agree to fire on citizens based on all this other bullshit he said.
[01:50:35]  You are not going to believe a former 18-year-old CIA wonder kind.
[01:50:41]  You're going to take the word of, let's say, all other available sources over this man.
[01:50:47]  Well, maybe I'm being a little bit too quick to judge.
[01:50:50]  I think you are.
[01:50:50]  Because there's other things.
[01:50:51]  Give me eight more examples of him being not on the level.
[01:50:55]  See, there's other things that Jim Garrow does that make him almost a saint.
[01:51:02]  No.
[01:51:03]  You might say.
[01:51:03]  No, I will not say that.
[01:51:05]  And Alex brings up one of these things in this next clip.
[01:51:09]  And I should have added, you've gotten 45,000 plus.
[01:51:12]  And we actually, David Knight has adopted children from China who would have been disposed of girls.
[01:51:20]  So he vouches for you as well.
[01:51:22]  I mean, I know who you are, but he says you're certainly the bona fide.
[01:51:26]  So thank you for that information.
[01:51:28]  Saving 45,000 girls at the UN and the eugenicist sayer works nothing because they're such big feminists.
[01:51:34]  So he saved 40,000 Chinese children.
[01:51:38]  45,000 Chinese children who were going to be eliminated.
[01:51:42]  He's a hero.
[01:51:43]  Also, that's how David Knight is.
[01:51:46]  That's how Alex is portraying David Knight's adoption of two Asian girls.
[01:51:52]  What?
[01:51:52]  He saved them from being eliminated?
[01:51:55]  Yeah, that's a little fucked up.
[01:51:57]  That's right, what you'd expect for Alex.
[01:51:59]  Yeah, that's true.
[01:52:00]  I wonder what David Knight tells the stories.
[01:52:02]  Jesus.
[01:52:03]  So a lot of this next part is sourced from a great piece by Kim Mackerel in the Guelph Mercury publication.
[01:52:10]  Okay.
[01:52:10]  She did an amazing investigative piece on Jim Garrow.
[01:52:14]  And what you're about to learn might blow your mind.
[01:52:17]  I really don't think so.
[01:52:18]  So one of Garrow's main selling points, as we heard Alex describe, is 45,000 children saved.
[01:52:25]  It's one of the reasons Alex is hailing him as a hero.
[01:52:28]  It's that he runs this organization called Pink Pagoda, where he claims to alternatingly the number varies all the fucking time.
[01:52:35]  Sometimes it's 34,000.
[01:52:36]  In this case, it's 45,000.
[01:52:38]  Anyway, he saved a bunch of children, females in China, whose parents would have abandoned or killed them due to the one-child policy.
[01:52:45]  Hold on, one quick question.
[01:52:46]  Right.
[01:52:47]  It's called Pink Pagoda.
[01:52:48]  Yeah.
[01:52:49]  Right?
[01:52:49]  Yeah.
[01:52:50]  Hold on to your question.
[01:52:52]  Chinese.
[01:52:52]  Don't worry about it.
[01:52:54]  Okay.
[01:52:55]  Really feel like that's a.
[01:52:56]  Okay.
[01:52:56]  If he's really doing this, good on him, I guess.
[01:53:00]  However, some people have raised some questions about whether or not Garrow is just making all this stuff up.
[01:53:05]  Brian Stey, who adopted three children from China himself, has become a bit of an advocate and facilitator for people who want to adopt children from China.
[01:53:13]  And when he heard about Garrow, he got in contact with him to learn more.
[01:53:17]  Quote, I've talked to Jim Garrow a lot about the program.
[01:53:19]  He indicated areas in China where he works, and I've made contact with orphanages in those areas and have been unable to substantiate anything he said.
[01:53:27]  Surprise.
[01:53:27]  When confronted with this information, Garrow replied that, of course, no one knows what he's doing.
[01:53:32]  I'm in the CIA!
[01:53:33]  Because what he's doing is illegal.
[01:53:38]  Not only in China, but internationally.
[01:53:45]  That's not a defense.
[01:53:46]  Nope.
[01:53:49]  Because he's doing this shit without the proper authority on a very real and technical level.
[01:53:53]  He's involved in a child trafficking ring.
[01:53:56]  The flippantness with which Garrow admits that he's illegally taking children out of China has, quote, led some to worry that Garrow is involved in the buying and selling of babies.
[01:54:08]  I look these up and nobody knows who you are.
[01:54:10]  Of course not.
[01:54:12]  I'm stealing them.
[01:54:13]  Right.
[01:54:14]  What?
[01:54:15]  Pink Pagoda is not properly registered as a charitable organization.
[01:54:18]  Surprise.
[01:54:18]  And as such, it's not supposed to take in philanthropic donations.
[01:54:21]  But this hasn't stopped him from soliciting donations on his website, then denying he ever did so when asked about it.
[01:54:26]  Surprise.
[01:54:27]  He's claimed that Pink Pagoda has incurred $26 million in expenditures over the span of 10 years, and that the money came from running an importing business, particularly of Tim Horton's coffee.
[01:54:39]  Tim Horton spokesman Alexandra Seigel, quote, says Garrow has no affiliation with the company.

=== Scams and Smuggling (06:37) ===

[01:54:45]  That's what they would say though.
[01:54:46]  Quote, he's definitely not authorized and not licensed to sell our products.
[01:54:50]  So I guess we can add smuggling to his resume.
[01:54:54]  She says that at a press conference with like 30 adopted Chinese children behind her.
[01:54:59]  In 2009, he claimed that a lawyer named Kenneth Hua had come on board with Pink Pagoda as their legal advisor.
[01:55:06]  When a reporter reached out to Kenneth, he said, quote, I've never been involved with Pink Pagoda, and I have no idea about this organization.
[01:55:12]  I'm really mad at this guy referring to Garrow.
[01:55:17]  That's a little bit of an understatement, dude.
[01:55:19]  Jim Garrow would go on to write a book about his work with Pink Pagoda.
[01:55:22]  One of the people who wrote endorsements for him, included in the book, it's part of the book, is endorsements of him.
[01:55:29]  One of the people who wrote one is none other than our old friend and noted liar, Jerome Corsi.
[01:55:33]  Oh, I was actually going to bet on Mike Adams.
[01:55:36]  I was going with Mike Adams on this one.
[01:55:39]  I put the health ranger's fingers in every pocket.
[01:55:41]  You missed this one.
[01:55:42]  Interestingly, at the time, Corsi was employed by WorldNet Daily.
[01:55:45]  And wouldn't you know it, WorldNet Daily's book division published Garrow's book.
[01:55:50]  So I didn't want to read this book.
[01:55:52]  That's cheating!
[01:55:53]  It is.
[01:55:54]  I hate it.
[01:55:56]  Play by the rules, guys.
[01:55:58]  I read a review of this book that I can only describe as scathing that was posted on the Research China blog, run by a group dedicated to helping families understand the stories of the children they adopt, so as to help them create a fuller sense of themselves as they grow up.
[01:56:11]  The book is described as a litany of stereotypes about Chinese culture, which gave the reviewer, quote, the feeling that he was watching a predictable movie.
[01:56:20]  Garrow's view of China is described as, quote, Western, simplified, and largely unfamiliar.
[01:56:26]  The book is devoid of any discussion of the specifics of how adoptions work, and it seems like...
[01:56:31]  You take them!
[01:56:31]  It seems like that's not a stylistic choice.
[01:56:34]  It appears that Garrow does not even know the forms that are required to complete the process of bringing a child into the country.
[01:56:39]  You don't need to know the forms when you just grab them.
[01:56:42]  Here's my form.
[01:56:43]  You want some candy?
[01:56:44]  It's only made worse by protracted action scenes in the book where Garrow's Chinese intelligence operative friend, who he calls Yoda, commits a bunch of murders to protect Garrow and his mission to save children.
[01:56:57]  The whole thing is ridiculous.
[01:56:59]  So now I want to read this book because Tom Clancy probably died because he couldn't write this book.
[01:57:07]  So there's a really good chance that Garrow's never been arrested for child trafficking in a ring that he claims to operate because he's just making it up.
[01:57:14]  Yeah.
[01:57:14]  There's a really good chance that, like, as we're, I would have felt bad about us laughing about this story if I felt it was real.
[01:57:22]  Yeah.
[01:57:23]  I think he's just lying about all this.
[01:57:24]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:57:25]  If you openly admit to running a child trafficking ring.
[01:57:30]  But for good.
[01:57:30]  But for good.
[01:57:31]  Again, see, that doesn't.
[01:57:34]  There's not a good child trafficking.
[01:57:36]  I mean, I don't know.
[01:57:36]  Yeah.
[01:57:37]  So I think that that's why he's never been arrested because he was foolish.
[01:57:39]  Because it's not real.
[01:57:40]  Journalists who have tried to contact any of the schools or orphanages he claims association with in China are constantly unable to find any proof that they're real and end up just dialing phone numbers that lead to disconnected lines.
[01:57:51]  Garrow did get arrested, though.
[01:57:53]  In late 2014, he was.
[01:57:56]  We all assumed we were getting to an arrest record sooner or later.
[01:57:59]  In late 2014, he was arrested and, quote, faced charges of unauthorized possession of a firearm, possession of a firearm, possession of a prohibited firearm, and careless use and storage of a firearm.
[01:58:10]  As is the case with everyone who Alex hangs out with, Garrow immediately claimed he was set up, and it was probably Obama behind it.
[01:58:17]  I can't find out any information about the outcome of this case, but I assume that it wasn't too severe, since afterwards, he's still all over right-wing media making up all sorts of complete bullshit.
[01:58:27]  So this is this guy.
[01:58:30]  Great.
[01:58:30]  Anybody who, I don't know, maybe has been to China or knows about other cultures would probably look at him and be like, what the fuck?
[01:58:39]  Yeah.
[01:58:39]  But it's convenient, though, because if he doesn't do any of this work, then he can just claim to.
[01:58:47]  Right.
[01:58:47]  Right.
[01:58:48]  Because it's illegal, but you can't be arrested for illegal things that you're not actually doing.
[01:58:52]  And if someone approaches you about trying to get a child or something like that, you can say, we're too busy right now.
[01:58:58]  I'm sorry, we're not taking on new clients.
[01:59:02]  Right, whatever.
[01:59:02]  You can deflect and pretend that you're super busy.
[01:59:05]  If someone comes to you and says, you took my child, you know that you didn't.
[01:59:09]  Yeah.
[01:59:10]  It's kind of a really great story.
[01:59:14]  Somebody's trying to double scam you.
[01:59:16]  They're trying to scam the scammer like, ah, you've took my child.
[01:59:20]  You owe me $40,000.
[01:59:21]  Ha ha, no, I didn't.
[01:59:23]  You don't have a child.
[01:59:24]  I don't know, but it seems like a pretty good scam.
[01:59:27]  I mean, it's a terrible scam.
[01:59:28]  Yeah, it's a terrible scam.
[01:59:29]  But in terms of consequences, if you're someone like him, it seems pretty limited.
[01:59:34]  Yeah.
[01:59:34]  If you present the air of great humanitarianism, you can get a lot of people tricked.
[01:59:40]  And I think a lot of people are.
[01:59:41]  Yeah.
[01:59:42]  Because he seems like his story is full of holes.
[01:59:45]  His career is full of bullshit and frauds.
[01:59:48]  Also, I didn't even get into this stuff.
[01:59:50]  He is like an educator.
[01:59:51]  And I kept finding instances in his backstory.
[01:59:56]  Like this Guelph Mercury article includes a number of instances where he was like running a school or he was a teacher in a school.
[02:00:03]  And then people in the area were like, they remember him leaving town quickly.
[02:00:08]  Yeah.
[02:00:08]  Yeah.
[02:00:09]  So it seems like there's scams.
[02:00:11]  He's got another monorail to build somewhere else.
[02:00:13]  Kind of, yeah.
[02:00:14]  He just have that itinerant grifter kind of vibe going with him.
[02:00:19]  It's like Kung Fu, but instead of David Cassidy Carradine going around solving people's problems, he starts people's problems.
[02:00:28]  And claims to steal children.
[02:00:30]  It's like a prequel show for every episode of Kung Fu.
[02:00:34]  There's a prequel episode of Dr. Garrot fucking shit up.
[02:00:40]  It is wild, though, to think that in 2019, Alex is so obsessed with imagined child trafficking rings.
[02:00:46]  And here in 2013, he's talking to somebody who is alleging that he runs a child trafficking ring.
[02:00:53]  An imaginary child trafficking.
[02:00:55]  It's so weird.
[02:00:56]  It's so weird.
[02:00:57]  Like with the Somali pirates thing, you've got to give it up to the Somali Pirates.
[02:01:00]  It blew my mind.
[02:01:01]  Well, yeah, but you got to give it up to the Somali pirates.
[02:01:04]  This is a very similar thing for me.
[02:01:06]  It's like, this is crazy.

=== Mattis And The Litmus Test (10:02) ===

[02:01:08]  Anyway.
[02:01:08]  Look, a sword can have two edges.
[02:01:11]  On one edge is child trafficking for evil, and on the other edge is child trafficking for good.
[02:01:16]  It doesn't matter if you can't falsify a birth certificate for one of these stolen Chinese children.
[02:01:23]  So Alex doesn't care about all that stuff.
[02:01:26]  He just assumes he's a hero.
[02:01:27]  He's getting kids out of China.
[02:01:28]  It's awesome.
[02:01:29]  And it's mostly because what he isn't interested in, what he is interested in, is this claim that Garrow has made on his Facebook page that Obama has put in this litmus test.
[02:01:40]  And so here he describes that litmus test information.
[02:01:44]  And keep in mind, as you're listening to this, that what he's describing is third-hand information.
[02:01:50]  Thirdhand.
[02:01:51]  A call the day before yesterday in the morning from this officer, a former officer.
[02:01:56]  He's retired.
[02:01:58]  But he was quite upset that one of the people he'd encouraged to join the military was being squeezed out, that he was forced to resign his commission.
[02:02:07]  And it was because a question was asked of him.
[02:02:11]  Now, I've called it a litmus test, but basically what it is, he was asked, if in a scenario, if in a situation where the military was called upon to go and confront people who were armed, American citizens, who would not relinquish their arm in spite of the Second Amendment right to hold arms, would you fire on American citizens?
[02:02:33]  This gentleman related to me that the officer was totally flummoxed that he would be asked this question, and he said his answer was no, I would not fire on American citizens.
[02:02:46]  And he was forced to resign his commission immediately.
[02:02:50]  Amazing.
[02:02:52]  Tell us more about to quote you here from the article.
[02:02:57]  You basically described him as one of America's most foremost military heroes.
[02:03:05]  Can you give us an idea about this person?
[02:03:07]  Is this person going to go public?
[02:03:08]  And then this person real?
[02:03:10]  So he's one of the most foremost hero in the military.
[02:03:15]  I swear to God, if Stebblebein is the situation here.
[02:03:17]  No, I think Stebblebein's dead.
[02:03:20]  Stevelbine did.
[02:03:23]  I actually know who I think he's trying to imply.
[02:03:26]  And we'll talk about that here in a second.
[02:03:28]  But it's most important that this story is relayed through a game of telephone.
[02:03:33]  So I'm me telling you this story that I heard from a former officer who talked about the market.
[02:03:38]  Who heard it from a guy he encouraged to join the military.
[02:03:41]  Yes.
[02:03:42]  So it's real thin so far.
[02:03:46]  And so I want to play this next clip before we get into it because Garrow embellishes even more and talks about how this guy is a fucking legend.
[02:03:53]  He's a household name.
[02:03:54]  Oh, boy.
[02:03:55]  And he will not become going public.
[02:03:58]  This man is a legend.
[02:04:00]  Yes, you would know his name.
[02:04:01]  Every American would know his name.
[02:04:03]  And no, he will not be coming public.
[02:04:05]  He'll not be bringing it out in public.
[02:04:07]  He thought that the best thing he could do is put it out in a different way.
[02:04:11]  I was honored that he called me.
[02:04:13]  But he didn't call you.
[02:04:14]  Someone else did.
[02:04:15]  So the timing of this conspiracy popping up is suspicious.
[02:04:18]  In March 2013, General Jim Mad Dog Mattis retired from his post as the head of Central Command.
[02:04:24]  What if Obama had tried to get Mattis to agree to shoot on civilians?
[02:04:27]  And he, being the mad dog that he is, said no, sir, and was drummed out of the service.
[02:04:32]  The timing matches up, Jordan.
[02:04:33]  Case closed.
[02:04:34]  That does sound right.
[02:04:35]  The problem is that Jim Mattis announced his resignation in April 2012.
[02:04:38]  So now we're looking at a few possibilities.
[02:04:40]  Either Obama told Mattis he needed to shoot on civilians, he said no, and Obama said, okay, I'll just keep you around for 11 months while we try and find a replacement.
[02:04:48]  Meanwhile, Mattis kept serving the president he knew was trying to get him to kill patriots.
[02:04:51]  Right.
[02:04:52]  Sounds like him.
[02:04:53]  Or Mattis resigned for other reasons, and then Obama asked him to shoot on civilians after he'd already quit just to fuck with them.
[02:04:59]  I'm not sure exactly what's going on.
[02:05:00]  That would be a solid baller move from Obama.
[02:05:04]  Mike dropped.
[02:05:05]  So Mattis is the only high-profile military resignation around this time.
[02:05:08]  And clearly, it's who Garrow is trying to imply is the person he's talking about.
[02:05:12]  Yeah, yeah.
[02:05:12]  He knows better than to be specific, though, since he's making it all up.
[02:05:16]  Mattis's resignation was because he and Obama didn't see eye to eye on Mattis's desire to attack Iran.
[02:05:21]  Also, Mattis joined the Marines in 1969, so whoever this guy Garrow was talking to who encouraged Mattis to join up must be old as shit.
[02:05:28]  Mattis was 63 when he retired.
[02:05:30]  So what is this dude, 80?
[02:05:31]  Anyway, I'm being petty.
[02:05:33]  This is just another fraud being carried out by this fraud guy.
[02:05:35]  That's all he's going to do.
[02:05:37]  Why are we doing this?
[02:05:38]  Right.
[02:05:38]  So Alex thinks he knows who it is, though.
[02:05:40]  And Garrow is pretty insistent that he's not going to tell him or even deny that someone, like Alex tries to make, is it this guy?
[02:05:47]  He's like, I'm not going to talk about it.
[02:05:49]  So Alex knows, though.
[02:05:51]  Alex has figured it out.
[02:05:52]  You know, my guess, if I have to say who it is, is that it'd be somebody like Lieutenant General William Boykin, who's also exposing right now that the government's giving weapons to Al-Qaeda.
[02:06:02]  So Alex insists that it's Boykin, and he later is like, I'm certain of it.
[02:06:08]  I'm 100% sure.
[02:06:09]  Here's the problem.
[02:06:12]  You know, Alex believes that Boykin's the person that Garrow has recently talked to about recently being drummed out of the service, which is stupid because Boykin retired in 2007, well, before Obama even took office.
[02:06:23]  So he wouldn't have any reason to get mad in 2013.
[02:06:28]  Also, in 2013, William Boykin was employed as the executive vice president of the Family Research Council.
[02:06:34]  Oh, my fucking God.
[02:06:36]  He's in the Family Research Council, which is why Alexander is evil.
[02:06:40]  Yeah.
[02:06:41]  As you might guess, from that piece of information, William Boykin is a real piece of shit, and Alex loves him.
[02:06:46]  Unfortunately, we don't have time to get into him today, but I'm sure he'll show up as a guest on the show soon since Alex thinks that he's Garrow's source for the show.
[02:06:53]  Yeah, that does make sense.
[02:06:55]  And they might try and turn that into some sort of a spectacle.
[02:06:58]  I'm not entirely sure.
[02:07:00]  This interview goes great.
[02:07:02]  Alex loves Jim Garrow.
[02:07:05]  I don't think the two of them have ever spoken before, and they are fast friends, mostly because Garrow is reinforcing all the things that Alex talks about.
[02:07:16]  And he does the Steve Pieczenik move of really over-flattering Alex.
[02:07:21]  He's like, I didn't know who I was coming in to talk to today, but you know everything.
[02:07:25]  You are right on about all this stuff.
[02:07:27]  And so here they talk about how Obama has Hitler youth ready to replace these old generals that fail the litmus test of shooting on civilians.
[02:07:37]  Alex gets so fucking excited that this guy is on the same tip as him.
[02:07:42]  If they'll not give the right answer to this litmus test, they've got a whole army of young kids who don't know any better ready to move in.
[02:07:49]  And keep in mind, who are the people who get away with in the despotic times?
[02:07:54]  Who are the ones that they rely on in the end?
[02:07:57]  It's the young kids who don't know any better, but who can point a gun and kill people.
[02:08:00]  Wait a minute.
[02:08:01]  So your military source knows about the FEMA Corps.
[02:08:05]  Now, now this isn't secret, but it's not well known to the public.
[02:08:08]  Describe what he told you about that, about the Ugand squads for about 17 squads.
[02:08:14]  Well, his words exactly were: here's the Hitler youth being resurrected now under this name of Obama Corps.
[02:08:22]  That's exactly what he said.
[02:08:23]  Oh, my, this is devastating.
[02:08:25]  This is devastating.
[02:08:27]  Because I've gone and looked this up before I got you on, and I know the big Christian circles you're in.
[02:08:32]  99% I know.
[02:08:33]  And I've talked to you off air, and you're just like, nope, I'm not talking, but I know who this is.
[02:08:37]  You think it's William Boykin?
[02:08:39]  Yeah.
[02:08:39]  Ah, man, that is devastating.
[02:08:42]  He's so excited.
[02:08:43]  Devastating.
[02:08:43]  It was not devastating.
[02:08:44]  And this is I think it took him down.
[02:08:47]  It was a load of shit.
[02:08:48]  No, it took him down, right?
[02:08:49]  No.
[02:08:50]  So the two of them decide to speak more frequently and maybe go get coffee.
[02:08:54]  I don't know.
[02:08:54]  Oh, that's nice.
[02:08:56]  I mean, I like it.
[02:08:57]  I like a new friendship developing.
[02:08:59]  That part is me talking.
[02:09:01]  They didn't actually say that in the interview.
[02:09:03]  But they end up appearing like their friendship is solidified.
[02:09:07]  Yes.
[02:09:07]  And he leaves.
[02:09:08]  And then Alex goes into Overdrive, and he has Melissa Melton in.
[02:09:13]  Oh, I'm sorry.
[02:09:14]  I don't have any clips of this, but it does bear mentioning.
[02:09:17]  Jenk Uger comes in as a guest.
[02:09:19]  Do what now?
[02:09:20]  And we can't cover it.
[02:09:22]  It's absurd.
[02:09:24]  Not because there's anything wrong with it, but it's exactly what you'd expect, and it's kind of unsatisfying.
[02:09:29]  Yeah.
[02:09:30]  Like, it's Jenk just saying, like, Alex, you do have a good point that the bankers do have too much control, but what you're talking about is absurd.
[02:09:39]  It's just that over and over again.
[02:09:41]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[02:09:42]  Alex, there's more complexity to this.
[02:09:43]  But it's very respectful.
[02:09:44]  Jenk is very nice to him.
[02:09:46]  Oh, that's nice.
[02:09:47]  And Alex keeps bringing up, do you understand why we need guns?
[02:09:50]  And he's like, Alex, even if I had a thousand guns and I was in the woods and I had a fortified position, if those drones come, the military is going to be able to, you know, I don't think you having guns is really going to make that much of a difference.
[02:10:03]  I don't.
[02:10:03]  And Alex is like, ah, he's mad.
[02:10:06]  But I thought, like, when Alex said, we're going to have the Young Turks Jenk Uger on, it's going to be, you know, I was like, this is going to be crazy.
[02:10:15]  And it's ultimately not that crazy.
[02:10:16]  It's just kind of a boring interview where Jenk tries.
[02:10:20]  Like I said, it's just him saying, this is more complicated than that, Alex.
[02:10:22]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[02:10:23]  And then finding points of agreement and then trying to explain to Alex that what he believes is stupid.
[02:10:30]  Kind of.
[02:10:30]  Yeah.
[02:10:31]  And I don't know.
[02:10:33]  You can go find it on YouTube if you want to listen to that interview.
[02:10:36]  I just didn't think there was much worthwhile there.
[02:10:38]  Other than someone fairly rational appearing on the show and trying to appeal to Alex on a not yelling at each other level.
[02:10:47]  Yeah.
[02:10:47]  But that doesn't make for good clips.
[02:10:49]  Yeah.
[02:10:49]  So check that out if you want.
[02:10:51]  Then Alex goes to Overdrive.
[02:10:53]  And he has Melissa Melton, who is one of his employees who has now left and makes videos talking about how full of shit Alex is.

=== Britain's Violent Crime Capital (03:05) ===

[02:11:00]  Yeah, well, that's not hard.
[02:11:02]  She comes in because apparently she studied statistics in college.
[02:11:06]  Oh, boy.
[02:11:06]  And so they have the gun statistics and violent crime statistics.
[02:11:10]  And they're trying to argue that gun ownership is on the rise and violent crime is lowering, and that there's a causal connection between the two.
[02:11:19]  Which is something Alex tried to bring up with Jenk.
[02:11:22]  And he's like, well, there are other factors to consider that might be attributable.
[02:11:27]  It's not necessarily that gun ownership caused that.
[02:11:30]  Right.
[02:11:30]  Well, and in probably refutation to your argument, crime in the areas where guns are concentrated has not fallen violent crime compared to that Stanford study about concealed carry and crime rates hadn't come out at this point.
[02:11:50]  That data wasn't available.
[02:11:52]  Alex is just taking some raw data from the FBI and creating his own conclusion from it.
[02:11:58]  Yeah, yeah.
[02:11:58]  And so Melissa.
[02:11:59]  Which people on the right never twist and denigrate statistics in order to make a bullshit point.
[02:12:06]  Yeah.
[02:12:06]  And so they start also talking about UK crime statistics and how since they took guns.
[02:12:12]  The reporting, all that stuff.
[02:12:16]  But Melissa Melton says something that I think is pretty funny.
[02:12:18]  Well, they're calling Britain the violent crime capital of the UK because it's higher.
[02:12:23]  Their rates are higher for violent crime than, I believe, Australia, South Africa, here.
[02:12:29]  They're calling Britain the violent crime capital of the UK, Danny.
[02:12:34]  So compared to Northern Ireland, what are you saying?
[02:12:39]  Scotland?
[02:12:41]  No, Britain is the whole thing.
[02:12:43]  It's Great Britain.
[02:12:44]  The United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland.
[02:12:47]  So maybe she is talking about Northern Ireland.
[02:12:49]  Then she goes on to compare Canada, South Africa, and the United States as being all of those are part of the UK.
[02:12:58]  The United Kingdom of Great Britain, Northern Ireland, the United States, Canada, South Africa, and, I don't know, New Zealand.
[02:13:07]  Let's throw that one up.
[02:13:08]  I'm guessing it could be a slip of some sort.
[02:13:11]  Yeah, it's almost certain that she meant London.
[02:13:13]  I don't think she did.
[02:13:14]  You don't think so?
[02:13:15]  I don't think she did.
[02:13:16]  You really think she has to?
[02:13:18]  I don't think she did.
[02:13:18]  And also, of course it is.
[02:13:21]  It's London.
[02:13:22]  I don't think that's what you meant.
[02:13:23]  Okay.
[02:13:24]  So after.
[02:13:25]  Maybe she meant Britain is the violent crime capital of the EU.
[02:13:28]  Could be.
[02:13:29]  That could be.
[02:13:29]  Could be.
[02:13:30]  Yeah.
[02:13:30]  I would be willing to accept that as a possibility.
[02:13:32]  Yeah.
[02:13:33]  But whatever point she's trying to make is specious and poorly said.
[02:13:37]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[02:13:37]  So we have one last clip here.
[02:13:39]  And Melissa Melton and Alex get into talking shit on Joe Biden, which is fine, I guess.

=== Faking the Ninth Circle (08:09) ===

[02:13:45]  Whatever.
[02:13:46]  I don't care.
[02:13:46]  I'm not going to bad.
[02:13:47]  Yeah, I'm cool with it.
[02:13:48]  Not going to bad for Joe Biden.
[02:13:49]  Fuck him.
[02:13:50]  But I will say that the way they're doing it is pretty disgraceful and gross.
[02:13:54]  And that is to say that he was smiling a lot during the press conference where Obama talked about gun control.
[02:14:01]  And then in a speech that he was giving, he talked about how these aren't kids that were just killed.
[02:14:06]  They were riddled with bullets.
[02:14:08]  And so Alex keeps playing a supercut of him saying riddled with bullets.
[02:14:12]  And just like, oh, look at him.
[02:14:14]  He's so excited about the riddling of bullets.
[02:14:17]  God.
[02:14:17]  It's pretty gross.
[02:14:19]  But he does a weird Biden impression.
[02:14:21]  And then he says, he says this where he's like, I'm just trying to feed the trolls.
[02:14:25]  You know, like, I'm doing these wacky things, these impressions, because then the trolls cover it.
[02:14:29]  Right.
[02:14:30]  But then he keeps talking, and you really get the sense that he's madder about these supposed trolls than he wants you to think he is.
[02:14:39]  This clip is a ride.
[02:14:41]  You know, I got to feed the trolls here on air when I do these little pieces.
[02:14:44]  They take it out of context.
[02:14:46]  They've got it clipped together and dub my voice saying racist stuff, too.
[02:14:49]  Oh, wonderful.
[02:14:50]  But it doesn't.
[02:14:50]  All it does is discredit them.
[02:14:52]  Basically, it's a good way to spend your time.
[02:14:54]  Hey, good for them.
[02:14:55]  Yay.
[02:14:55]  They're going to die of cancer early, too.
[02:14:57]  They probably.
[02:14:58]  When they're dang wretching their guts, I'm about to take the whole express elevator straight to hell, where the devil and all his angels are waiting to roll with your soul like a millstone and take you right to the center of the frozen lake in the ninth circle.
[02:15:11]  Gun statistics.
[02:15:12]  If you've ever won.
[02:15:15]  Holy shit.
[02:15:16]  The ninth circle gun statistics.
[02:15:18]  If you've ever won.
[02:15:20]  Is that feeding the trolls?
[02:15:23]  They're going to take this out of context.
[02:15:25]  Me saying.
[02:15:26]  They're going to be damned to hell.
[02:15:29]  That's weird.
[02:15:30]  That is a very strange.
[02:15:31]  I just feel more anger.
[02:15:33]  And I think part of it is probably just muscle memory.
[02:15:35]  Like he started down that road and he's like, I know how to do this.
[02:15:38]  Yeah.
[02:15:38]  But man, it feels madder than he probably intended it to.
[02:15:43]  You'll be damn.
[02:15:44]  Because it got personal real quicker.
[02:15:46]  It got personal a lot quicker than he thought it was going to be.
[02:15:48]  It definitely did.
[02:15:49]  Oh, I'm going to feed the trolls here.
[02:15:50]  And she was kind of non-committal to him.
[02:15:52]  And so he's like, well, she better be on my team here.
[02:15:55]  Aggressively.
[02:15:56]  So there you go.
[02:15:57]  Lest she go to hell.
[02:15:58]  And she's not on his team anymore.
[02:15:59]  She's not on his team anymore.
[02:16:00]  She's left in for a war.
[02:16:01]  That's because she is in the frozen lake and the ninth circle of hell.
[02:16:05]  Absolutely.
[02:16:05]  That makes sense, right?
[02:16:06]  Yeah.
[02:16:07]  So we come to the end of this stretch.
[02:16:09]  And I think it's interesting because some of the things that I expected are coming to pass.
[02:16:14]  You know, like the prediction that after Alex had, or Paul Joseph Watson, more correctly, had that interview with James Tracy and they recognized the value of Sandy Hook conspiracy theories, that he would try and get more aggressively into that market.
[02:16:30]  His behavior in the aftermath, in the literal immediate aftermath of the Lone Star College shooting, indicates to me, I mean, it's just a few days after all the talk about how popular the Sandy Hook videos are.
[02:16:43]  So I see that as kind of a pretty strong indication that he's wanting to get into that market.
[02:16:50]  And that we might see whenever there's any kind of a shooting or breaking news, Alex try to behave this way.
[02:16:56]  I think he's going to lose his mind through that.
[02:16:59]  That constant chase for the proof of the fakeness of these things.
[02:17:03]  And you know what?
[02:17:04]  God, that's a sentence that is so unimaginable that for people outside of our world, the sentence, he's looking for constant proof of this being fake.
[02:17:15]  Like ridiculous.
[02:17:17]  What are you doing?
[02:17:18]  What is anybody talking about when that happens?
[02:17:20]  There's a wrestling term called working yourself into a shoot, where what that describes is like a work is something that you're faking.
[02:17:28]  Yeah.
[02:17:28]  You know, like I'm faking being mad at you.
[02:17:31]  Right.
[02:17:31]  But sometimes people get, they do that so aggressively that it becomes real, which is the shoot.
[02:17:37]  Yeah.
[02:17:37]  You work yourself into a shoot.
[02:17:39]  Yeah.
[02:17:39]  And I think Alex is kind of doing that now.
[02:17:42]  I think we're seeing the process of him trying to capitalize on this thing, the profitability of Sandy Hook videos, and he's going to end up in a shoot where he's actually perpetuating these things that he was just trying to capitalize on.
[02:18:00]  And I think that's my working theory right now.
[02:18:04]  That's a very plausible theory.
[02:18:06]  I like that theory.
[02:18:07]  I think he accidentally went, he got too far in.
[02:18:10]  He got in too deep.
[02:18:11]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[02:18:12]  And he got into that territory where there's consequences.
[02:18:16]  It was like the sunk cost fallacy for him.
[02:18:18]  He just kept going like, well, I've already invested so much of my time in finding one of these fake shootings.
[02:18:23]  I get so much more excited and so much more disappointed with each successive failure.
[02:18:28]  much reinforcement from the audience yeah much people many people saying you gotta tell the truth about sandy hook uh i think he's i don't know i i started to I started to reflect on this.
[02:18:40]  I'm like, I really, I see such trouble ahead in 2013.
[02:18:47]  I see such trouble.
[02:18:51]  I can't get over how fascinated I am about how badly this is going to go.
[02:18:56]  I mean, the prediction that I had on the last episode that he would start getting into this business a bit more was made before I listened to that episode with the Lone Star college shooting.
[02:19:06]  I didn't know that in advance.
[02:19:08]  And so the idea that the next day that he's back in studio after his vacation, that's the angle he takes.
[02:19:16]  It suggests they did one of their very, very, very rare production meetings in InfoWars.
[02:19:21]  They were like, this is the tip we got to get on.
[02:19:24]  It worries me that I might be accurate and that it might spiral real hard out of control.
[02:19:29]  You know, it's interesting because of his relative, you know, because he was so far under the radar back in 2013.
[02:19:38]  It's entirely possible that we'll find stuff that's even more damning and disgusting than what he has in the present day.
[02:19:47]  I think that what, yeah, I mean, I agree.
[02:19:49]  And I think that within context, even things that are known, like that he did say that they were actors, I think you provide the things that preceded that and led him down that road.
[02:20:01]  Yeah.
[02:20:01]  It makes it even worse.
[02:20:03]  I mean, if we see the track being that he recognized 10.6 million views on this video and everyone is demanding, like all my audience says cover it.
[02:20:13]  And then he does, I think that makes it worse.
[02:20:16]  It kind of does suggest a very, well, I mean, if you were doing a psychological evaluation, you would say he is mentally fit to stand trial for this situation.
[02:20:26]  This is premeditated.
[02:20:27]  Anyway, we'll be back on Wednesday, probably for a modern day episode.
[02:20:31]  But until then, we have a website.
[02:20:32]  We do.
[02:20:33]  It's KnowledgeFight.com.
[02:20:34]  That's right.
[02:20:34]  We have Twitter.
[02:20:35]  It's OlivergeUnderscore Fight.
[02:20:36]  And I'm at GoToBed Jordan.
[02:20:38]  And we're on Facebook.
[02:20:39]  We are on Facebook.
[02:20:40]  We are also on the interwebs where you can find the audio recordings of things like this.
[02:20:46]  It's true.
[02:20:46]  What is it called?
[02:20:47]  Podcasts.
[02:20:48]  Podcasts.
[02:20:49]  We're on the podcast applications.
[02:20:51]  iTunes.
[02:20:51]  You can go to any one of those.
[02:20:53]  Various places.
[02:20:54]  And you'll find us probably.
[02:20:55]  Probably.
[02:20:56]  Anyway, as I look over this.
[02:20:59]  Ooh, shit.
[02:21:00]  Right?
[02:21:01]  This is a literal murderer's row.
[02:21:04]  I mean, Jim Garrow seems to be lying about everything.
[02:21:09]  I still don't.
[02:21:09]  I don't know.
[02:21:11]  He's got a sketchy fucking past, though.
[02:21:13]  In his imagination, he's killed so many people.
[02:21:17]  But also, you'd think the guilt that he would feel.
[02:21:19]  There's so many holes in his story, too, though.
[02:21:22]  Like, why do you keep skipping town?
[02:21:23]  I'm not willing to say that.
[02:21:24]  He's in the CIA.
[02:21:25]  I'm not willing to say he's never murdered anybody.
[02:21:27]  Well, he was in the CIA at 18.
[02:21:29]  You probably have to kill somebody just to get in the CIA that early.
[02:21:32]  I'm positive that I've used this before, but I'm just going to say Max Kaiser.
[02:21:36]  Max Koinzer is actually a good person.
[02:21:38]  Max Koinzer has not killed anybody.
[02:21:39]  But technically, someone who probably technically has and is being called out about it now is Alex Jones.
[02:21:48]  Andy in Kansas, you're on the air.
[02:21:49]  Thanks for holding.
[02:21:51]  Hello, Alex.
[02:21:52]  I'm a first-time caller.
[02:21:53]  I'm a huge fan.
[02:21:54]  I love your work.