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Aug. 30, 2023 - The Joe Rogan Experience
02:27:34
Joe Rogan Experience #2027 - Oliver Anthony
Participants
Main voices
j
joe rogan
01:07:37
o
oliver anthony
01:12:23
Appearances
Clips
b
b-real
00:01
j
jamie vernon
00:45
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Speaker Time Text
unidentified
Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out!
The Joe Rogan Experience.
Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.
joe rogan
Do you ever find yourself with the desire to welcome the Crocs into your life?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I've got some genuine Realtree Crocs from when I'm out in the stand, you know?
joe rogan
I know guys who use those as camp shoes.
They like to walk around camping them because you're wearing heavy boots in the mountains.
oliver anthony
Yeah, they're nice to kind of keep with you as a spare.
You know, if you soak your boots or you're just trying to go in and out of the house real quick.
joe rogan
Brian Simpson now has Crocs and stage Crocs.
So before Brian Simpson goes on stage, he takes off his walk-around Crocs and he puts on his pristine stage Crocs.
It's hilarious.
It's so funny.
He used to do it with sneakers.
He used to walk around with Crocs and then he would wear sneakers on stage.
And then he went from Crocs to stage Crocs.
oliver anthony
Yeah, maybe I'll look into it.
I need to get some new boots.
My boots are like, these are the ones I always wear.
We were walking through the airport yesterday and they're like literally, one of the soles is falling off.
I'm like, I gotta figure out something.
joe rogan
You gotta get them resold, man.
They're authentic.
oliver anthony
Yeah, these are my genuine.
joe rogan
You earned them.
People pay for those.
oliver anthony
I thought about it.
I was joking with my buddy the other day.
I went and changed my oil at his house before we drove to North Carolina.
And I left the empty jug of the dirty oil sitting in his garage.
And I was like, I'll get it.
unidentified
Whatever.
oliver anthony
He said, no, man.
He said, I'm selling that on eBay.
That's Oliver Anthony's authentic used motor oil out of his truck.
joe rogan
You'd probably get 20 bucks for that.
Yeah, there's a lot of people that definitely would buy that.
But what I mean, people buy used clothes because they want to wear clothes that look like, you know, they have character.
You know, like it drives me crazy.
When I see people with pants that are just...
Or shredded all over the place.
Like your knees are exposed.
oliver anthony
Yeah, well see the pro tip I have for that is just go to Goodwill.
You can get real used clothes.
joe rogan
For real used clothes.
But that's extra like hipster authentic if you go to a real used clothes store.
What do they call those?
Vintage?
oliver anthony
Yeah, like that vintage look.
joe rogan
Oh yeah, if you could buy some holey t-shirt that some dirty hippie wore to a Rolling Stones concert in the 1970s, you can get that now?
That's worth a lot of money.
You know, if he died of a heroin overdose and he kept the fucking t-shirt at his mom's house and she said to sell it, that's worth a lot of money.
oliver anthony
I've tried to hold on to things that I think I could sell down the road.
Look, I've still got the strings that I recorded Richmond North of Richmond on my guitar.
I almost threw them away.
I was like, oh, hold on a second.
joe rogan
You could definitely sell those.
oliver anthony
In hard times, yeah, I may have to.
joe rogan
Yeah, you could definitely sell those.
But that would be like an honest sale.
People can't say, oh, he's a sellout.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I'm just selling junk I have.
Actually, I'm considering selling my truck.
I don't know, I think we talked about this once before, but it's worthless to me.
It's got 325,000 miles on it and a salvage title, and I still daily drive it, but I thought, man, if I could sell this and somebody pay 50 grand for it or whatever and send it towards a charity, it would be pretty slick to do.
joe rogan
It has a salvage title?
oliver anthony
It does, yeah.
joe rogan
What happened?
Did you buy it when it was already wrecked?
oliver anthony
It's a 2007 Suburban.
I paid a couple grand for it years ago.
Just here recently, I had to have it towed.
It broke down.
The rollback driver, I don't know if he was under the influence or something, but he unhooked all the chains off and then tilted the bed back.
unidentified
Oh no.
oliver anthony
So the whole truck rolled right off the back of the rollback.
joe rogan
Oh no.
oliver anthony
And it totaled the truck out.
It bent a bunch of stuff under the drive shaft and the front of the frame and all.
And of course, I'm sitting there trying to figure out what to do with my truck and here comes all the police and they're like, oh, is that really you?
Let's get it.
So here I am.
I'm on the phone with my insurance company and then all these guys are coming up trying to take selfies with me and stuff.
joe rogan
That's hilarious.
oliver anthony
I guess this is the world I live in now.
joe rogan
So, can the truck be fixed?
oliver anthony
It's drivable.
Yeah, I'm driving it.
It rides kind of like a covered wagon now.
unidentified
So, at some point, I'm going to have to upgrade.
joe rogan
Is the frame bent?
Is the suspension bent?
oliver anthony
Yeah, the drive shaft in the back's bent, I think, is what's causing it to shake.
joe rogan
Oh, so you've got a wobble in your drive shaft?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I mean, it went Dukes of Hazzard style off the back of the truck.
joe rogan
As an adult, that show drives me nuts, watching those cars land.
Like, what are you doing to those cars?
oliver anthony
Well, hey, this one can do it.
joe rogan
Yeah, sort of.
oliver anthony
Maybe I'll donate it to Whistlin' Diesel and just let him kill it.
I don't know.
It'd be pretty slick.
joe rogan
Well, you could do that.
Or if someone is listening to this and they want to do something cool and they've got the cheddar, buy it from you and then send it to Roadster Shop and have them put, like, a badass suspension...
And, you know, make it a real sleeper.
They can do shit like that.
Because you have to get all that replaced anyway.
Why not replace it with, like, better shit?
oliver anthony
It'd be cool for somebody to have it.
It would have a cool story behind it, you know?
joe rogan
This company called Roadster Shop, they've been on my podcast before.
One of the things they do is they do, like, a sleeper series.
I think they call it the Legend Series.
I'm actually not sure what they call it.
But what they do is they'll take an old car.
So the outside looks like shit.
The outside is patina and rust and all that stuff.
And then they'll just completely redo everything underneath it with like a crazy engine, insane brakes, insane handling and suspension.
But it still looks like a 72 GMC pickup truck.
But underneath it, it's just a monster.
oliver anthony
It's got all the monitored amenities, because new cars are so much more efficient.
You don't realize when you...
joe rogan
So they do stuff like this, but they have different kinds of builds.
No, so these are all just like the different ones that they did.
Survivor Series, that's what it is.
I think the Survivor Series, that's what it is.
Like, they leave the outside.
oliver anthony
It's interesting to me that older vehicles had so much more character.
Like, I don't know if it's just that it's...
joe rogan
It's people who are doing drugs, bro.
That's what it is.
We nailed it with them.
We sat down with them and they introduced me to all these people that were the designers back in GM in the day.
This guy was a freak.
He was wearing like crazy red suits.
The guy was probably definitely on acid.
And these are the people that created these insane shapes.
And then when the sweeping psychedelics drug act of 1970 came along, they made everything a schedule one drug.
unidentified
Yeah.
oliver anthony
And that is when cars went downhill.
joe rogan
It is when cars went downhill.
oliver anthony
It was early 70s.
Yes.
joe rogan
You can get a 71 Barracuda and it's still sick.
But you get into like 72, 73. Those cars look like shit.
75, they're garbage.
b-real
79, they're done.
joe rogan
Everyone's on coke.
Everyone thinks everything they do is amazing.
You get the movie Showgirls.
oliver anthony
Everything lost its art and it became focused more on algorithms of what's going to sell and what's more efficient and what's better to produce.
joe rogan
Sort of, but back then I don't even think they had data they were going on.
They were going on past success.
So if you go to the 1980s, some of the worst movies that were ever made, like the cocaine years, I really strongly feel like those people were going on reputations of sales, and the studio would put a lot of money behind someone who had a great reputation, and this guy's fucking partying and doing lines and writing crazy shit in these scripts, and some of them are good and some of them aren't so good, but they're all kind of clunky.
They're all kind of disconnected.
That like a true masterpiece of a movie isn't.
You know, like Taxi Driver.
Like you go back and watch Taxi Driver.
That's a masterpiece of a movie.
It's so connected.
You're connected to all the action.
It's like you're on the edge of your seat.
It's wild.
The acting's insane.
Even Jodie Foster as a kid is insane in it.
It's so good.
But cocaine movies in the 80s?
They were nuts, man.
They didn't go on algorithms.
I think they just went on what they thought people wanted.
They probably took polls, but who the fuck's answering polls?
Polls are the worst way to get information because you're only getting information from people dumb enough to answer polls.
That's such a small group of people.
How many people answer polls when they call you up?
How many fucking people would the life have time for a poll?
You know, do you think Jordan Peterson has ever answered a poll?
oliver anthony
Yeah, like, um, I always get those calls and immediately hang up.
joe rogan
Yeah, just shut the fuck up.
I'm sorry I have to do this to you, but bye.
No, don't hang up!
Some of them will beg.
unidentified
Please!
joe rogan
They can't get anybody to do it.
oliver anthony
Yeah, it's fascinating to see throughout history times when people were able to really connect with other humans, whether it's through movie or film or cars or whatever.
Maybe it was the psychedelics or whatever, I don't know, but there was a huge disconnect, it seemed like.
After the 70s with all that, things kind of went off.
And it's interesting even now, like I see a lot of the new movies coming out, they're all just sort of remakes of...
They're like a reconceptualization of something that's happened 15 years ago.
There's not a lot of new stuff out there for people to connect with.
It's...
joe rogan
Yeah, Matt Damon did this conversation about why it's so much more difficult to make movies now, there's no DVD sales anymore, and it was very interesting, and it kind of makes sense.
I think it's just, it's really hard to finance those fucking things, and you want a guaranteed success.
What's a guaranteed success?
You need a superhero.
People like superheroes, you know?
And if your superhero's trans, even better.
You can figure out a way to make it.
Every ethnicity inside the group of superheroes that are there, perfect.
Now we're good.
Now we need CGI, we need aliens, explosions.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I think CGI is a blessing and a curse because, like...
I don't know, some of the best film, it doesn't necessarily have the best stunts.
You can tell where some of it's fabricated, but that's okay because you know the whole thing's a fabrication going into it.
It's just about being able to believe the story within it.
That's what's important.
I'm not a huge movie guy, and I guess it's difficult for me to sit three hours and watch something straight.
My mind's already long gone within the first 30 minutes doing something else, but Star Wars was really partial to me growing up.
And I don't think they'll ever touch the original series, even though, yeah, you can tell some of it, even with some of the renovations they've done on the newer versions of it, adding CGI into the old films, it's like just the story of the originals to me meant a lot more than the newer stuff just because of the...
You don't believe it looking at it with your eyes as much, but you believe it more with your mind, like listening to what it has to tell you, you know?
joe rogan
I think that Star Wars is like generational wealth.
Like, the original guy who started the company was a bad motherfucker.
That guy was out there grinding, and he was selling soap out of the back of a wagon in 1890. But the folks who inherited the company three, four, and five generations in...
They're kind of flat.
It's different.
When I watch Star Wars now, it's like a bunch of stuff happening.
It's still fun.
They're still good.
I enjoy them.
But Star Wars won in the context of whatever year it was.
What was it?
77 or something like that?
oliver anthony
Hey, there you go.
joe rogan
Let's take a pop.
What do you think it is?
What was first Star Wars, if you had a guess?
oliver anthony
Yeah, probably late 70s, I'd say.
joe rogan
Yeah, I want to say like 77. In my unprofessional opinion.
Am I right?
77?
Yay!
Look at that.
That movie, at that time, was fucking groundbreaking.
It was amazing.
Rick Baker did the special effects.
That was when I was a serious special effects nerd.
When I was a little kid, I wanted to do special effects for the movies.
That's how I became a giant fan of Rick Baker.
That's why we have that American Werewolf in London in the lobby.
oliver anthony
Oh, okay.
joe rogan
Gotcha.
oliver anthony
Yeah, yeah.
joe rogan
This guy named Pat McGee.
It's funny because that's our second one.
We have another one that's in the pool hall.
And the reason why is that Pat McGee, who is this amazing special effects guy, he was also on the podcast back in the day.
He made an American Werewolf in London that you could buy online.
And I'm like, that would be the sickest thing for the studio ever.
And then Rick Baker came and was a guest and Rick Baker said, the proportions are off.
Like the wolf, the arms weren't as long.
It was like shorter, it was like this and that.
So Pat McGee listened and he was like, shit, I gotta make a better one.
And so he made an even better one.
And the new one is all hair.
There's no synthetic hair.
So it's all like, I think it's yak hair that they use.
So it's like individual hairs are put in all over this wolf.
And it looks fucking amazing.
oliver anthony
It does look...
Yeah, that's the first thing that catches your eye walking in here, I'd say, out of everything.
joe rogan
Yeah, that thing's sick.
oliver anthony
You're not going to find one of those many other places.
joe rogan
That was 100% my favorite horror movie.
I love that movie because it's funny.
It's terrifying.
It has to do with the werewolf theme to me is so amazing that you take some person who's like a good person.
They're a friendly, nice guy.
And you're like, hey, man, you have to lock yourself in a cage.
You're going to become a monster.
It's like, what the fuck?
What the fuck are you saying?
It doesn't make any sense!
And they never want to believe, and you know it's going to happen.
And in that one, that was the first time in one of those movies where you got to see the advancements of special effects.
Like, what year was American Werewolf in London?
Let's guess that.
I want to say 82?
I'm going to say 82, 84?
81. 81. I should have stuck with 82. Back then, when you had special effects, it was kind of like they didn't move that good.
They couldn't get their faces to move that good.
But he had figured out a way to get your hands to grow.
Like...
And he had to figure out a way to get things in his cheeks where his cheeks were bubbling.
Yeah, it's awesome.
And it's all real.
None of it is CGI. And there's something about that uncanny valley when you're watching a CGI transformation.
Your brain knows it's bullshit.
For whatever reason, you're better off having it look fake but be a real thing like John Carpenter's The Thing.
You're better off with that than you are with CGI. For whatever reason, CGI just...
oliver anthony
Yeah, I mean, I think we just have seen...
joe rogan
There it is.
jamie vernon
There it is.
This is behind-the-scenes footage I always wanted to show you.
joe rogan
Oh, wow.
jamie vernon
I thought it was pretty cool because it still moves in a very interesting way.
joe rogan
Yeah, but that's a physical thing moving.
It's not a CGI. That does look exactly like the wolf in the lobby, doesn't it?
But back then, they couldn't even get the thing to close its mouth.
Look how sick that is.
oliver anthony
That's awesome.
joe rogan
Imagine if you're in a subway and you see that fucking thing turning a corner.
My god that scene was amazing where the poor guy was stuck in the subway And he was running from it and then you see it at the bottom of the escalator stairs.
That's that's like Just those quick glimpses of a thing like that is so much more terrifying than some long CGI'd up monster killing someone scene like the American werewolf in London was just a masterpiece Landis just Nailed it.
It was the perfect horror movie.
And it was funny.
There's funny moments in it.
oliver anthony
Yeah, that's cool when you can get humor in there, too.
Yeah, that kind of reminds me of my dog when I don't give him table scraps.
unidentified
He's got that terrible face like that.
joe rogan
That thing was amazing.
Yeah.
But it's just the difference between digital and real.
And you're going to have to deal with that soon.
Because I guarantee you there's going to be some people that are making some CGI, AI. Oh, there already are.
Are they out there?
oliver anthony
Oh, yeah, I'm sure.
joe rogan
I'm sure there are.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I haven't kept up with a lot just because, you know, I'm doing...
So anything social media related right now or anything any internet presence I have right now is coming from me off the phone just like before everything blew up so I haven't invested the time to like look at everything circulating but I've people like friends and family have sent me stuff and some of it's pretty funny but you know they've got all these different AI remixes of the song with different voices and overlay different faces and all and it's it's funny to see where it's gonna go you know that is funny Yeah, you're going to have to deal with that.
joe rogan
My daughter sent me some advertisement.
She goes, did you do this advertisement?
I'm like, nope.
Nope, that's not really my voice.
I mean, it is my voice.
oliver anthony
The day after things blew up, one of the towing companies had an ad on Facebook that had...
It wasn't really me, but it was a red beard and the side profile of sunglasses looking out the window.
I'm like, okay.
joe rogan
How dare you?
oliver anthony
I guess I've made it anyway.
That's when I realized people are already ripping things off.
And what's crazy is every shirt that I've worn anywhere in public, there's an organization that I'm not officially related to or in any way have done anything with, but it's a friend of a friend in the neighborhood.
It's called Nets with Vets, and they take out...
Veterans with PTSD and let them go deep-sea fishing.
So he asked me last minute just to wear his shirt at one of the concerts.
And do you know now there's like 1,500 listings online for counterfeit Nets with Vets shirts?
And so the organization reached out like, hey, are you like making shirts, ripping us off?
It's like, it's not me.
So it's a weird thing.
I've already experienced a lot of that stuff.
Not so much on the AI side, but just, I don't know, the internet's just such a rowdy place, you know?
joe rogan
Oh, it's so rowdy.
The world's a rowdy place.
oliver anthony
It is, and maybe people bring their best and their worst on the internet.
I've always tried to stay off social media as much as possible, but I've learned very quickly that Twitter and Facebook and stuff like you...
You see comments and feedback from people both overwhelmingly positive that maybe you wouldn't get in a personal conversation, but also overwhelmingly negative, too.
People just use that as a vent.
They just take whatever seething hatred they have inside of them.
They're like, oh, I'm getting that guy with it.
joe rogan
If you had a song just about love that resonated like that, it would be almost impossible to hate you.
But you have a song where you're talking about how people are fed up with shit.
And it obviously resonated.
I mean, I've seen songs go viral.
But that's pretty bananas, son.
Your shit went to the moon right away.
God, I'm not sure who sent it to me.
I'll have to find out who sent it to me.
Because it's one of those things where once one person sent it to me, then it was like dozens of people were sending it to me.
oliver anthony
It's funny because originally that song wasn't really even in my top five.
It's not normally the type of song.
I've written songs with similar messages, but as far as that sort of, I guess, anthem format is what people are calling it.
It's like an anthem.
That's not something I would normally write.
Yeah.
joe rogan
But it's an unlikely anthem.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Insane times.
It would be an unlikely anthem.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I had no idea that that song would react the way it did.
joe rogan
Well, you're a smart guy and it's representative of how a lot of people feel.
And it's also, there's something about the way certain people sing.
And I don't know what it is because I can't sing.
But there's a tone, there's an authentic sound.
And I know when they're faking it.
And it's not that they're not faking it in a beautiful way.
Like there's a lot of people, the faking is probably a bad term.
But they're sounding perfect and they're singing a song.
There's something missing.
I don't know what it is, but some people, like Janis Joplin's one of my greatest examples.
Take a little piece of my heart, there's an authenticity in that voice God damn, man, if that doesn't bring you to your knees, play that.
Play that.
We need to hear that.
We got time.
This fucking song.
This is one of those songs that every time I hear it, it just takes me, in my mind, to what it must have been like to be alive in 1968, or whenever it was that this came out.
And this hippie chick who's 27 years old has a voice from the heaven.
unidentified
God damn, son.
joe rogan
Listen to that.
Give me some volume.
unidentified
Yeah, it's timeless, too.
Like... - Hmm.
She was a magical person.
joe rogan
Magical person.
It's a magical person.
oliver anthony
Yeah, she's really singing with everything in her.
Everything.
Yeah, I think...
At least in my case, I think the one thing that's helped me, too, is that my singing isn't the best, but I've never had any vocal lessons or anything, so the way I sing is just the way I sing.
And so I think even the same way with her and other people, it's maybe rough around the edges, it could be a little pitchy, or you're not using the right part of your face when you project and whatever.
And so on paper, things aren't quite right, but I guess to another human, it sounds right, because it is what it is, you know?
joe rogan
It's authentic.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, I don't think there's any right way to do anything.
I mean, there's...
Like, you see it in everything.
There's a person who violates the rules, and they're the best at it.
oliver anthony
And then the rules almost morph into whatever that is.
It's funny, like, with music.
Yeah, music has...
Country in particular, but music in general has gotten way too wrapped up in like this algorithm of how many beats per minute it needs to have and How many verses and how they need to be layered and it's like they've almost created this sort of like industry standard Like OSHA rule book of how music needs to be performed And so like you can only do that so many thousands of times before people are like, okay, what else is there?
joe rogan
You know, well people like that too.
That's the thing.
There's a lot of damn people There's a lot of people.
The problem I think with a lot of people is they want you to like what they like.
And if you don't like what they like, what you like sucks.
It's funny like that, man.
We're so tribal.
We are tribal with our cell phones.
You know, we're an Android or PC. Android people have to stick together.
It's like, we're so weird.
We're so weird.
But we're like that with our musical tastes.
We're like that with our...
Cultural sensitivities or cultural sensibilities rather, like the way we feel about life and how life should be.
We want everybody to kind of think along the ways that we think.
It's very strange.
And when a person like yourself gets labeled a right-wing, left-wing fanatic, like right out of the gate.
oliver anthony
Both in like a week and a half, and yeah, at least I know I'm doing something right.
Like, to me...
joe rogan
Yeah, they're looking for your Biden campaign contributions now.
They're going through your fucking taxes.
The whole thing is so bonkers, man.
Like, can't they just accept that you made a great song and people enjoy it?
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Why do people have to attack it?
oliver anthony
Well, I think it's just for whatever reason, I've been...
I'm the subject matter the last couple weeks, and in everyone's defense, I probably haven't...
I've waited for this opportunity, I guess, to really have a real conversation with somebody about whatever it is I am.
So people are just trying to find, who's this Oliver Anthony guy?
And what is he?
And where does he work?
And who did he vote for?
And what's his family like?
Because they want to sort of build this image of whatever it is that the person behind the song represents, for better or for worse.
The people who agree with it want to...
I don't know.
It's really funny to watch on my end, because obviously I know what's true and what's not, and so just even what I've skimmed through of people sending me, like singing at the Super Bowl, how many people have formed an opinion about whether or not I should be paid to sing at the Super Bowl.
I'm not singing at the Super Bowl.
That's just something somebody made up.
But there's been hundreds of hours of people's time wasted probably talking about I think it's great.
It's wild.
At least everybody can have a good laugh, you know, so.
joe rogan
Well, I mean, it's a subject of discussion.
So, like, everybody is getting involved.
And somehow or another it became cultural.
And then there was Dwight from The Office.
oliver anthony
Oh, yeah.
joe rogan
He chimed in that if he was going to write a cultural anthem, what did he say?
Something like he wouldn't write about overweight people on welfare.
He would write about billionaires and their taxes.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
There is nothing funnier.
Then millionaires?
Talking shit about billionaires.
There is nothing funnier about millionaires pretending these billionaires are out of touch.
oliver anthony
Oh, yeah.
joe rogan
And then, you know, take Dwight from the office down to West Virginia.
You know, take him through those coal mining countries.
Take him through those places in Appalachia where people have extreme poverty and pills have ravished those areas.
Take him through there.
oliver anthony
And it's everywhere.
Yeah, the sad thing is it's everywhere now.
You know, it's funny.
People, right off the get-go, I guess because it was Radio WV that posted the original video, but I've never once advertised myself as being necessarily from the mountains.
My grandfather grew up in the western part of Virginia in the mountains, but I'm from Farmville, which is technically Piedmont.
But even in...
Throughout rural Virginia, that poverty is a big issue and drugs are a big issue.
I mean, it's not just even in the rural areas.
You go into downtown Richmond or any downtown, anywhere for that matter, it's almost like, yeah, these problems exist everywhere now.
And I think, I mean, obviously they are because that's why the song resonated the way it did.
joe rogan
They exist in other countries.
oliver anthony
In other countries, yeah.
joe rogan
Well, people are tired of being fucked with.
And it seems like people in power are always fucking with people.
And I think it's a natural inclination that human beings have and I think the Founding Fathers of this country recognized that when they set up our government.
They set up our government to protect it against tyranny.
And they did it by having all these different branches of government and they're all coordinated and there's a lot of fucking, a lot of stuff that keeps people from just running it the way they want to run it like a king.
oliver anthony
I mean, I'm certainly no professional historian, but my understanding is that the federal government was never intended to be the size that it is today.
We're very top-heavy in the way we're structured.
Our federal government is enormous and out of control and almost impossible to manage.
But then on our community level and in our state government, especially local government, things are just...
Very neglected and weak and disconnected.
And so, like, that's why you see a lot of the problems.
Like, we shouldn't have to rely on the federal government to fix things out in the street in small-town America.
Like, the communities and the local government should be the ones fixing that.
And that's the way I see things.
Like, even before the...
I think that's really...
joe rogan
That's a good argument if the country didn't get to the size that it got.
The problem is you can't have, like, 30 people running 300 billion people.
oliver anthony
But I think you could have more issues.
So, like, I just...
I think it's almost impossible...
It's almost impossible for states to be able to have the control to make the right decisions for the people in their areas when the federal government limits them in so many different ways.
joe rogan
I don't know anything about this, so I'm going to be talking out of my ass.
But I would imagine they're probably low on funding, too.
There's probably a lot of issues, especially in places that are poor, because they rely on taxes from those people.
It's all very complicated, but the idea of taxing the rich being the way to fix all this.
No, you're just going to give more money than the government.
And they're not really good at doing stuff.
You know, I mean, would it be nice if rich people donated to fixing streets and schools and stuff like that?
Yeah, for sure.
Yeah, it would be.
Good call.
Also, fat people shouldn't be buying fucking fudge rounds with food stamps.
Also, that's not good.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and that's a funny...
joe rogan
But also...
oliver anthony
That's a conversation that sort of got blown multiple ways.
And really, I like to let a song be left up to the interpretation of the listener.
But even with that, it's like, yeah, I would love to write a song about...
I always thought it was funny when GM got bailed out of the recession after they made all these terrible decisions.
I never understood why we...
I've never understood corporate welfare either to much of an extent, so I do understand the people making that argument.
joe rogan
Well, the corporate welfare argument is you're going to lose a shitload of jobs.
You can preserve those jobs, give those people a loan, they build back up, then they repay the loan.
That's what they did, though.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
So there's actually some benefit to that.
It keeps American jobs, and it also keeps one of the most iconic American car manufacturers in business.
It's good for everybody.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
I think.
oliver anthony
It's a good conversation to have.
It is.
joe rogan
Like what gets bailed out and what doesn't and why.
oliver anthony
Yeah, but ultimately, yeah, I do see a lot of people that aren't taken care of.
joe rogan
Yeah.
You know the most used business that didn't get taken care of during the crash?
unidentified
Who?
joe rogan
The porn business.
The porn business got wrecked.
They got wrecked, because they used to rely on DVD sales, and then internet pirating came along, and they lost everything.
And meanwhile, these politicians are probably whacking off every day to them.
oliver anthony
That's a big industry even today.
joe rogan
For sure!
oliver anthony
Well, hey, for whatever they lost during the recession, they made it back during COVID, because that's my understanding everyone was doing that then.
joe rogan
I don't know how that works.
Like, who's getting paid?
I don't know how that works.
I'm sure there's a lot of money in that business.
There's obviously a lot of eyeballs in that business.
I believe it's one-third of internet traffic worldwide or something bonkers like that.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Isn't it something like that?
jamie vernon
It should be more.
joe rogan
Let's find out what it is.
What's the percentage of points?
And everybody's like, I don't know where it's coming from.
unidentified
It's not me.
joe rogan
I've never even seen one of these films.
oliver anthony
That stuff's terrible for people.
joe rogan
It's terrible for some people.
oliver anthony
I gave that up.
joe rogan
I think it's like Adderall.
Some people can handle it.
oliver anthony
That is one thing I had to give up.
Yeah, because it's, I don't know, it does disconnect you from reality in many ways.
And I think a lot of the weird perversion we see coming out, sort of like now at this point you read about, I mean I even reference some of it in the song of course, but you read about a lot of the weird things that people are doing that maybe wouldn't have been accepted a hundred years ago.
I think...
People go down these rabbit holes with porn, and they start off with the video with the milkman, and by the end of it, it's like, where did I end?
unidentified
I don't know.
oliver anthony
It's almost like a drug.
People have to keep chasing that thrill, and it takes them down very destructive rabbit holes, if you will.
joe rogan
It definitely can for some people.
oliver anthony
I have no issue with anybody watching it, but I hate to read about some of the things that it does to people.
It ruins marriages and that kind of thing.
I don't know.
joe rogan
I think a lot of things ruin people.
I think they also should be legal.
Sure, yeah.
Alcohol ruins people.
I like the fact that bars are legal.
Shit, I own a bar.
Alcohol is legal.
I like it.
It's not good for everybody, though.
Some people drink alcohol and they lose their fucking mind, and it's not good for them, whether it's genetically or whatever it is.
They can't have a drink.
I like a drink.
You know, and I support your right to do whatever you want.
Like, you know, I think if cocaine was legal, the same amount of people would probably do it, and it would be real.
You'd get pure cocaine.
It'd probably be better.
We'd probably have better music.
If you're getting this fentanyl mixed shit, and you're out of your fucking head, you're dying of overdoses.
unidentified
Yeah, well, that's the problem.
oliver anthony
Like, yeah, I mean, gosh, yeah, look at when the government bans something.
It only makes it worse.
So that's certainly not the answer.
joe rogan
I'm not interested in Adderall.
I'm interested in trying it once.
But I'm not interested in doing Adderall.
I am interested.
I'm lying.
I'm interested because everybody loves it.
But I'm scared of it.
jamie vernon
The porn stats, you're right about 30%, but this is the only one I find to be odd.
joe rogan
In 2020, 16.5 years was the average age of first exposure to porn in the United States.
jamie vernon
16 and a half?
That's like you're a sophomore, junior in high school.
joe rogan
That's because 90-year-old people are still alive, and they do it based on them.
unidentified
I first saw my girly movie when I was 20. Frank had a reel-to-reel camera in the basement.
We all got there.
We had raincoats on.
joe rogan
That's what it is.
It's like when you factor in infant mortality to the average age that people died during the Roman era.
That's what it is.
oliver anthony
So you expect it to be lower than 16 and a half?
joe rogan
Yeah, it should be.
You give a kid a phone.
oliver anthony
Now, um...
joe rogan
Instantly they...
oliver anthony
I know that was one thing that was interesting to me in Virginia.
They just recently changed a law where I think you have to enter your driver's license to watch porn now.
joe rogan
Hilarious.
Now they know exactly who's watching porn.
Well, that's good if you're watching some freak shit, you know?
If you're into, you know...
It's like, I don't know.
You don't want to give the government the ability to spy on you.
You just don't.
And you don't want to give...
Because the government is just humans.
We like to think of the government as being some all-powerful, all-moral, all-ethical entity that controls us in a perfect and very robust and well-considered way.
But that's not real.
The reality is it's Human beings like you and like me and like Jamie.
People.
People that get to dictate what other people can and can't do.
And that's where shit gets weird.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and a lot of people, I think, go into government with good intentions, but it's like anything else.
I think you get in the mix.
It's like things change and you have to go with the flow and sort of agree on things that maybe your heart doesn't necessarily agree with.
And so that's why you see politicians Yes, there's a lot of that.
There's too much money tied up in politics.
Too much bribe and extortion and slap on the back deals and stuff that should never be allowed to happen.
Yeah, that's what's really created a lot of dishonesty within it.
joe rogan
There's a bunch of decisions that got made a long time ago that really fucked us.
And one of them was when they let drug companies advertise on television.
There's only two countries in the world that allow that.
oliver anthony
Really?
joe rogan
The United States and New Zealand.
Yeah, and I think it was 97. Was it 97 when they allowed that?
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, it's funny, because, yeah, you watch the commercial, and then at the end, it's like...
joe rogan
Side effects, man.
oliver anthony
It's the best thing in the world.
unidentified
You get to that last 20 seconds, you're like, oh, I don't know about that.
joe rogan
I know, you're at a cookout, everything looks great, next thing in your asshole is fucking spraying blood, and you're suicidal.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, what?
unidentified
What?
oliver anthony
Yeah, like, I mean...
joe rogan
And they say it all so fast.
This is how...
You know?
oliver anthony
Yeah, big pharma, I guess, right.
joe rogan
Suicidal thoughts.
Suicidal ideation.
Rectal bleeding.
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, I mean, that's...
Like, fortunately, at this point in my life, I haven't been on many medications, but I went on a run with SSRIs, and I can tell you from me, it's like it's...
The last 20 seconds applied more than the first two minutes of the commercial.
Like, I didn't find any benefit in that.
And it's...
Yeah, it's...
I don't know.
I... I think there's alternatives to pharmacy medicine in a lot of cases.
Maybe even if it's just habits.
It's okay to prescribe a medication to keep somebody on course.
For example, I've got a relative of mine.
I won't call him out, but he won't change the way he eats at all.
But he'll take whatever medications every day to keep his his, you know, keep the diabetes away and keep his blood sugar, blood pressure low and all that.
But it's like there should be more integration of like, hey, maybe this is like a plan of what you should do to go along with this medicine.
Ideally, eventually get it's like they don't want you to really get off the medicine, though.
If anything, they want you to keep taking it.
Right.
So like, yeah, it's weird.
It is weird that it's almost advertised like it's a soda or a car or something, you know.
joe rogan
Well, it's weird that, you know, people are so we're so kind of like dependent on other people to take care of us that we would rather go somewhere and get some medication than fix our life, than fix your lifestyle choices.
And that's, and we've been programmed to sort of think that there's solutions for you out there.
Go get those solutions.
That's not a solution, like, internally you need to reconsider, like, what you're doing to your actual physical body.
Like, what are you doing to your physical body?
Like, are you giving your physical body the exercise that it deserves to be robust and healthy?
If you're not, you should.
Are you eating food that's nutritious?
If you're not, you should.
oliver anthony
Well, and how do you do that in today's time anyway if you don't have a lot of money?
joe rogan
Well, you can exercise for sure.
oliver anthony
Nutritious food.
Exercise, certainly.
joe rogan
There's a way to eat nutritious food on a budget, but you have to be diligent.
And the problem is fast food.
And food deserts.
But if you have a supermarket, if there's a supermarket where you live, then you can get food.
And if the supermarket has food, you can get healthy food.
And it's not that much more expensive.
Even people that go on a carnivore diet.
I know people that go on a carnivore diet on a budget, and they go to Costco and get a big tube of ground beef.
And they freeze a lot of it, and they cook a bunch of it in portions.
oliver anthony
I know, and that's a lot better than the crap from the store, but even it's not...
I mean, you read about...
I mean, just in the part of the country I'm at, we've got a really close family of ours that farms.
The father and the son have both died from cancer from the commercial agriculture they've been in spraying.
And all that stuff ends up in the food.
I've read about microplastics in the food.
You go and buy a tub of ground beef, how much plastic was in the food of all the bags of crap that they threw in there to feed the animals.
It is...
Really, I think the only way in this time in the area we're in, unless you're going to go buy really expensive food out of some fancy-smanshy grocery store that I can't spell the name of, it's like you're really better off going to somebody local and buying it direct, like buying it almost straight from the farmer.
joe rogan
Well, certainly if you have an organic farm near you.
Yeah, definitely.
But yeah, pesticides and herbicides are a real deal.
Atrazine, you know, Alex Jones famously said, they're turning the frogs gay.
But they are.
They're making them hermaphrodites.
They're making them switch sexes.
Atrazine is a very potent endocrine disruptor, and it's a fertilizer.
Is it a pesticide?
Pesticide.
One of those.
I think it's a pesticide.
oliver anthony
Something needs to be done about it.
joe rogan
But there There's a lot of that shit that they spray on food.
Something like 90 plus percent of people tested have glyphosate in their blood.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's wild.
I mean, that is an herbicide that they spray on stuff.
oliver anthony
Yeah, so to me, it's like, yeah, you can definitely eat healthy, but even then, a lot of the food today isn't very healthy, inherently just because of the way it's grown.
Yeah.
joe rogan
Well, there's a lot that is.
There's still a lot that is.
You can certainly eat healthy.
It's not easy, but neither is being sick.
Being sick is not easy either, man.
Just the amount of money you're going to lose by having a body that's defeating you every turn.
You're always tired.
You have no inspiration.
You have no motivation.
You can't get shit done.
It's one of the reasons why I can get a lot of shit done.
Being healthy makes a giant difference.
You have so much more energy than regular people.
Who are just like sitting around all day because you don't demand anything of your body.
If you don't demand anything of your body, it's like good.
We'll just fucking atrophy into a sack of bones and meat.
oliver anthony
Yeah, being complacent is like the worst thing for you.
Physically testing yourself is good and then mentally testing yourself and spending your time working towards some sort of purpose.
Like I think that's really what was...
That's really what was killing me the last few years was just, and I see this in friends and family and people I know, but even just from a mental standpoint, not spending your day working towards whatever purpose it is that you feel like you really need to accomplish deep down inside, I think that will really kill you over a period of time.
Like, you know, you go work your 9 to 5 or whatever, you come home, and then you just Start swiping, start wasting the rest of your evening.
That's your time to be productive, working towards whatever passion project or hobby.
joe rogan
Sure, as long as you don't enjoy your 9 to 5. Some people actually enjoy their 9 to 5, and they want to go play video games.
I'm not trying to shame them folks.
Maybe you should talk to your wife every now and again, but if you want to play Diablo 4 at 3 o'clock in the morning, I support your right to do it.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and I don't even mean so much video games, but just that mindless scrolling that I've found myself being into, too.
joe rogan
Bro, I've seen more people get hit by cars over the last five months on Instagram.
More people get shot, more people get mauled by animals.
Instagram's wild.
It is wild, the shit they're allowed to show you.
And one of them was like, it's okay, he's fine.
Like, there was a big letter, you know, a big print over the video of this guy getting hit by a truck.
Like, that guy is not fine.
I'm not a medical expert, but when you get hit by a truck and launched into the windshield of an oncoming car, I guarantee you, you're not fine.
oliver anthony
No, I get it.
Look, I've been that guy that sat...
I've wasted at least an hour sometimes in a row watching Russian dashcam videos of these logging trucks flying off the road and stuff.
I don't know.
There's something that just gets your brain excited.
I don't know.
It's very addictive.
joe rogan
It's not good for you to see that many people die and that many people get bit by crocodiles.
I've seen more people get bit by crocodiles.
I don't know what the fuck is wrong with my algorithm.
But I've seen more people get bit by crocodiles over the last six months than having a long-ass time.
But yeah, it's mostly a waste of time.
But it's also fun.
There's a lot of funny videos on there.
It's just a matter of being disciplined.
You just got to know when you're scrolling too much.
And the way I avoid that is by doing stuff.
So there's a lot of stuff I do, you know, whether it's archery or playing pool.
There's a lot of stuff that I do where I don't, there's no time, you're not spending any time on that.
And so there's a complete different focus.
Like when I'm shooting a bow, when I'm shooting at a target and I'm just practicing, my mind is empty.
All I'm thinking about is the shot process.
All I'm thinking about is whether or not the arrow broke clean.
Did I move my shoulder a little?
Why did that one go three inches left?
Like, what happened there?
Was it my elbow?
Was my elbow up high?
How was my follow-through?
Okay, let's think about it and let's do it again.
So that's like a mind-cleansing thing.
Yoga classes like that.
If you can find a good, hot yoga class...
Man, when you're fucking...
Standing there holding on to one foot and one foot is extended and you're hobbling around on one like, bitch, you ain't thinking about jack shit, but what you're doing.
oliver anthony
Well, that does a good job of connecting you to your body too, which is something maybe we're not very good at either.
joe rogan
It's very good for people.
Yoga is like one of, if I had one thing to recommend someone who's never done any exercise before, please try yoga.
Don't hurt yourself.
Go slow because a lot of people do hurt themselves.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I can't imagine me trying to do that.
joe rogan
One of my friends who's a doctor said that yoga is like one of the main people that...
It's yoga and jiu-jitsu, he said.
People that come in to see him for treatment.
But jiu-jitsu makes sense.
It's literally a sport of trying to break bodies.
oliver anthony
But yeah, yoga you would think it would be the opposite, if anything.
joe rogan
Yeah, I've pulled muscles in yoga.
Yeah, you're doing hard stuff.
But hot yoga, I think, is a little better for that because it really does warm your body up almost instantly.
If you do the Bikram series, I know that guy was a creep, but if you do the series, I don't believe he even invented that series of poses.
I think he just popularized it.
And they're all like standard yoga poses, but that series is designed very well to get you really warmed up.
So by the time you get into more complicated and challenging movements, your body's pretty warmed up.
It's a good system.
It's fucking hard, man.
A 90-minute hot yoga class at 105 degrees is a motherfucker.
oliver anthony
That sounds great.
Sounds like a great walk away from that, the feeling you get.
joe rogan
Oh, you feel so relaxed now.
oliver anthony
That is one thing I'm looking forward to now is continuing to focus on mental health and that area, but also I'm excited to get into better shape physically.
The only thing I've done in the last six months at all is running.
We were planning on...
We were planning on trying to schedule a run in September that I think was like 10 miles or something.
So it was a friend of mine that I've been running with two or three days a week.
Whatever's on your mind when you start, it's gone by the time you leave.
It's something good about getting everything connected again.
But music is big for me on that too.
Just getting your...
Playing an instrument and singing like you're just...
Everything's all one again.
It's very easy, especially...
And maybe because of social media and because of the way technology...
I don't know what it is that...
I'm certainly no Dr. Phil, but it's like the world we live in today, your mind is very easily disconnected from your body physically.
You can get lost just worrying and thinking and doing.
It's good to have something like that, I guess, to...
Grounding is the word or whatever.
I don't know.
But it's good to have something like that to get you back into reality again.
joe rogan
Yeah.
My belief is that all human beings need something creative.
Whether that's something creative as a game that you play that you get to invent moves or think about things and strategies or whether that game or whether that creativity expresses itself in music or in drawing, painting, something.
I think people really get a great satisfaction out of making things and of creating things.
oliver anthony
Sure, and everyone's good at something.
That's what's crazy.
I'd say almost everyone's good at something.
joe rogan
I know some people.
oliver anthony
Well, maybe they haven't figured out what it is, but you know.
That's one thing I've enjoyed over the years with what I've done in the past is meeting all these different people.
You'd be surprised at how unique people are and what they're able to do.
I don't know.
Everyone seems like they have that one thing.
Maybe even if it's something that they had as a kid that they lost along the way.
But people are really good at shit.
Sometimes you underestimate people.
And people don't spend the time they need to develop the craft it is they have.
joe rogan
It's also sometimes people don't find a thing early on in their life.
Where they get into it.
So if they don't have a thing ever, it's very difficult for them to gravitate towards a something.
But that's why martial arts classes are great for that.
Because all of a sudden you're learning this new thing and it's exciting.
Like, oh my god, it's Monday night.
We're going to go to jiu-jitsu class.
You got your little white belt on, you're tying it, and you're freaking out.
But afterwards, you feel like, wow, I really did something.
I really challenged my fears.
I really took a class, and I'm learning some stuff, and I'm doing it with other people that are learning, and I'm making new friends.
There's something really cool about that.
And that's also a thing that people need that they don't have, is a real community.
You know, like, feeling of community.
You know, like, one of the nice things about comedians is that we all work together.
So this is like this real feeling of community.
We go on the road together.
We travel to different countries together.
Like, all the guys that I go on the road with, we're friends.
Like, we hang.
We laugh.
We're just having drinks and having dinners places.
And just everywhere you go, you're with family.
It's beautiful.
It's beautiful in that way.
If you don't have that, man, if you don't have a thing where you're really connected to like-minded people, it sucks.
It's not fun.
Maybe the friends that you have are all fucked up and they're going in the wrong direction and try to pull you with them.
oliver anthony
Maybe your job sucks.
That happens.
You have to be careful who you keep in your social circle because you'll end up just like them.
joe rogan
Well, you have to be careful of energy vampires.
There's people that are energy vampires, and they'll steal from you.
They really will.
They'll steal from you.
They don't want to do the work, but they want you to do the work for them.
Like, they want you to be involved in everything that they're doing, even though they're not making any changes.
And they want to drag you in, and they want it to be the focus of all the attention.
And you really find out after a while that if you were around positive people, then all of a sudden you're uplifted and you have all this energy.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and it's funny how that works.
Yeah, it's interesting.
All that stuff kind of goes on behind the scenes and you don't really think about it.
One thing that really benefited me...
Even in my early 20s on, a lot of my friends seem to be older.
One of my best friends, I'm 31, he's probably in his mid-40s.
And then everyone above them is like, my best drinking buddy for years, he's like 65, 66. I love hanging out with older people though because they're a lot wiser.
joe rogan
Some of them.
oliver anthony
Well, I'm a dummy too, so it's okay if I'm hanging out with dummies.
But yeah, I like hanging out with older people.
It reconnects you back to like, I don't know, they've just experienced so much more than you ever could in that extra 20 years or whatever, 10 years.
It's like, those are the kind of people you want to surround yourself with are people that are going to...
That are more experienced than you, more wise.
People that you can aim toward being.
Certainly not people that are immature or on a bad streak.
Even now, I'm cutting out the drinking.
Like I said, I haven't gotten high in almost two months now.
A month and a half or two months.
joe rogan
That was your problem, huh?
Was the weed?
oliver anthony
Yeah.
The problem for me was I knew that I needed to do this.
I knew I needed to I procrastinated with music a long time.
I mean, I'm 31. I've been playing guitar and singing on and off since I was a kid.
My grandma was in a band years ago.
I remember as a little kid, what got me interested in all of it was Dukes of Hazzard when I was a kid.
I was like five.
I used to sit with my grandma and we'd sit and watch Dukes of Hazzard and watch Waylon Jennings pick that guitar.
Of course, I had no idea who Waylon Jennings was.
I just fell in love with that.
I grew up listening to that 70s country.
She loved all the old stuff like the 50s and 60s.
Even in the 70s.
Even Janice and all that.
She really introduced me a lot into music when I was a little kid.
I just kind of held on to it.
I never pursued it the way I should.
And then I'd play at a bonfire party or I'd play at whatever.
It's a friend's house.
And everybody's like, man, you got to do something with this.
You don't want to waste this talent you've got and whatever.
And that would almost make me feel even shittier because I'm like, oh, man, I suck.
I'm such a piece of crap for not doing something with this.
So yeah, when I was outside of work, I'd drink, I'd get just absolutely stoned, and I would just sit around and try to think about anything but what it was that I really needed to be doing, which was like...
And so it's kind of like funny, but that's ended up what kind of sparked me into like writing all these songs and doing all this stuff because it's like, I don't know, just like with you probably with what you do, jujitsu or whatever, it's like for me, songwriting is, it gets my head, like you said, getting your head clear, you know, because that's all you can, and songwriting is interesting for different people, but now that I've been in the, I guess now that I've been in the industry for two weeks and I've talked to like, Now that you've been in the industry, you've conquered it.
Now that I'm an industry expert, it's like some of the other musicians I've talked to, like the people I've looked up to over the years, they experience this too.
But certain people, when you songwrite, it's dramatic.
joe rogan
Do you write all your own songs?
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Have you been accused of not writing your own songs?
oliver anthony
Very early on, yeah, because since my state, I guess it's not even my stage name, it's Oliver Anthony Music, and so it's supposed to represent music from, you know, Oliver Anthony Music is my grandfather, and so he grew up in the 30s in the mountains and used to tell all these wild stories about how life was back then, but the music's just sort of a characterization of, like, that period in time and those people, you know, and that's...
So yeah, when...
joe rogan
So your real name is not Oliver?
oliver anthony
Yeah, Christopher Anthony Lunsford is my real legal name.
And so that's what's on, like, if you look up the songwriting...
joe rogan
Why did you decide to sing as Oliver Anthony?
Just in...
oliver anthony
Well, like I said, I just had the YouTube channel listed as Oliver Anthony Music.
Um...
Just because, like, that's sort of the demeanor or the, like I said, the character I was, like, that older Virginia-style music.
Like, if you go on YouTube and you look up that type of music from back then, like, those old recordings of people, like, that's what I, I just love that type of stuff.
joe rogan
Do you think you're gonna keep that name?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I mean, a lot of people still call me Chris.
And I've posted on social media, call me whatever.
I mean, I've been called a lot worse than either of those things.
But, yeah, it'll stay Oliver Anthony music indefinitely.
Yeah.
It's a special name, and it's a special name to me, not only because it was my grandfather's name, but it's sort of like, to me, it reminds me of how different things were back then.
But he was born Oliver Anthony, but everybody called him Antony growing up.
And so, like, he always thought his name was Anthony Oliver.
And, uh, last name Engel.
And so, like, it wasn't until he was in his 60s and going to retire, he realized that his name didn't match his birth certificate.
So he had to actually change his legal name when he was in his 60s.
But it's because back then...
joe rogan
He thought his name was Anthony Oliver?
oliver anthony
Yeah.
His whole life?
But his legal name was...
And so it's...
Yeah, and his parents named him.
So it's just like...
But all the paperwork back then was so scattered up because a lot of people were illiterate.
And of course documents weren't tracked as well as they are now, you know, and so it's like There's people in the family that have a different spelling and it's the same last name But the few letters are different stuff.
It's just kind of cool like but he just he just thought that was crazy He had to change his name and he was 65 so he could draw his retirement because his Social Security and everything was under a totally different name, but I That's crazy.
It's just special to me.
He's like the only other one in the family like me.
Most of our family's average height, six feet and under, but he and I were both 6'6", redheaded, left-handed.
I don't know.
In a lot of ways, I just thought it was special to kind of respect him.
He passed away in 2019, and that's kind of when I... I guess that's when I first kind of adapted the name for the music.
I didn't really get serious with anything until probably...
joe rogan
Two weeks ago?
oliver anthony
Yeah, until a couple weeks ago.
I think I uploaded the first original.
When I decided I was in it to win it and I really wanted to make this thing happen...
It was probably May of last year when I uploaded Ain't Got A Dollar.
Or it might have been Rich Man's Goal was the first one I uploaded on YouTube.
But that's when I decided, like, alright, I'm doing this thing.
joe rogan
So you were just smoking too much weed, drinking too much, and just procrastinating.
oliver anthony
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, and so that, and, you know, like, anxiety is definitely something that's underestimated.
You know, I used to laugh about, or not laugh about, but I used to just not really understand when people talked about mental health and anxiety, because everyone gets stressed out over stuff, and so you think of anxiety as being just like this normal phenomenon everyone deals with, but...
Your mind can really put you in a dark place to where that thing just holds on to you.
It just makes it very difficult for you to do anything.
So yeah, I spent at least two years of my life almost constantly just having what felt like just a knot right here, just wrenching at me.
joe rogan
Well, that's especially true for people that are pursuing a non-traditional life that doesn't have any guarantees.
It's a wild life to try to be an entertainer.
Just to...
Choose to try to make it in this wild world of people that are singing and Making songs and you want people to pay attention to you Like you know how many fucking people are singing how many people can sing how many people are Recording things and now with YouTube and the like how many people are putting stuff up on the internet for other people to enjoy It's a lot well idea that you're gonna stand out So that you're filled with anxiety just because of that because you're this future is uncertain Yeah,
oliver anthony
I think for me, a lot of the anxiety came from me just feeling like I was running out of time.
Like I knew that I had an ability to pursue this and kind of take this adventure on.
And I just had kept, like I said, for 10 years or more, I'd pick the thing up for a few months and then I'd put it down.
And just always doubting myself, you know?
Yeah.
joe rogan
Well, I think it's...
I mean, the universe, in some weird way...
Always sort of finds Like for people that becomes very successful Especially like yourself.
It's almost like that's the best way to do it Like I've never met anybody where I was like your way to do it isn't the wrong way to do it like I everybody that I meet that becomes successful especially like overnight people it's like oh I see all these fat.
Well, that's why you're good That's very good.
You're good because you had a real life, like a real tortured regular life, like regular people.
If you're in the fucking Mickey Mouse Club when you're 14, and then all of a sudden you're famous.
I mean, I love Miley Cyrus to death, and she's fucking insanely talented.
And I heard her new album is her best ever.
Everybody's raving about it.
But I feel...
Bad for people that become famous when they're young.
I just feel like that's a heavy burden for you to have to carry, and you didn't ask for it.
You can't ask for it.
You don't know what it is.
It's like getting a face tattoo when you're five.
It's like, I want to get a heart tattooed on my forehead.
Let everybody know I'm full of love.
Like, okay, Billy, let's take you to the tattoo park.
Like, I want to be famous so everybody knows me.
oliver anthony
Okay, Billy, let's get you in front of TV. Yeah, and it's tough, because then...
Everyone's perception of everything is different anyway based off the way they were brought up.
Like, you know, the way you and I look at something, we both look at something a certain way, and it's our way of looking at it, and to us that's reality, but everyone's perception is just different, just inherently, just based off the way we were raised and maybe even our genetics and the way our...
Things we've experienced are the way our parents taught us things.
And so, like, yeah, it's...
It is tough if you get thrown into that at such an early age.
Because this is just such a...
I feel bad for anybody that gets thrown into all this anyway.
Like, the things I've seen and heard and witnessed and...
joe rogan
Just in a couple of weeks.
oliver anthony
You need to do this and you've got to do that.
joe rogan
Yeah, but that's just people pulling out your strings.
oliver anthony
This almost crazy sense of urgency everyone's sort of thrown on me to do something with this.
And it's like, I don't...
Yeah, at the end of the day, I've got to remember who I was a month ago, and I've got to make sure that I... And it's okay to evolve from that and change.
I don't want to always be stuck being that guy, but I don't want to leave him behind either.
joe rogan
Listen, man, just be yourself.
You're going to be fine.
This is like this conversation that we had over the phone.
I said, fuck all those urgent people.
You have talent.
You have talent.
You don't need anything else but talent.
Talent and authenticity.
You got both of those things.
This urgency thing?
What the fuck are they talking about?
You've literally had the number one song like instantly.
You can't do that again?
How the fuck do you know?
You don't know jack shit.
These people are crazy.
They don't understand what's going on and they don't understand what it's like to be famous.
You are in a weird spot right now.
What you need to do right now is just keep being you.
And don't let anybody control you and don't let anybody wrap.
And certainly don't let anybody put you on some crazy publicity campaign to try to capitalize on this great moment and immediately get some large record machine behind you and mass produce.
oliver anthony
Yeah, because that really goes against the whole message that I wanted to get out in the first place.
And so, yeah, what would it benefit me to sign a big deal or have some...
Like, I don't know.
As busy as things get, I don't know that I'd ever let anybody even manage my social media and stuff.
Like, that's just something that I'd like to have the hand on.
joe rogan
I do mine.
I do all mine.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
I don't want anybody doing my shit.
oliver anthony
That's ridiculous.
Well, I think, like we talked about earlier, your show in general, the reason people watch it isn't, you know, you could add more people in and have more special effects and lights and, you know, figuratively speaking, you could make this into something bigger than what it already is, but it would just take away.
Like, sometimes the more you add, the more you take away.
It's the fact that you have conversations with people that you're genuinely interested in.
Like, we don't have enough real conversation in any way in the world.
joe rogan
Like, We have very little.
oliver anthony
I had never had a Twitter account.
I made one a couple weeks ago to start uploading.
Oh, you've got to get on X and upload all the stuff.
And within like a week, I'm like, okay, I get it.
joe rogan
I'm tapping out.
Yeah, I don't read any of my stuff on Twitter.
I do post occasionally.
What I do like to do is repost things that I think are interesting.
I do like that.
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, thanks.
I appreciate it.
joe rogan
Well, that's what Instagram I put that up on.
oliver anthony
Okay, yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, but yeah, a lot of people liked it.
I think on my account alone, it had more than...
I'll tell you how many views it had.
I want to say it's somewhere around 11 million views.
I was explaining it to someone the other day.
I was like, do you know how insane that is?
Yeah.
You could put something up that this guy just made 12.8 million views.
oliver anthony
Wow.
joe rogan
That's bonkers, dude.
That's bonkers.
That's a lot of fucking human beings.
That's a lot of human beings.
oliver anthony
Yeah, so I've had to ask myself why that happened the way it did, and...
And look, I've said this a hundred times already, but I'm certainly no preacher.
People have made comments about, oh, well, why does he read scripture or whatever and talks about God, but then he does other things.
I do have some foul language, and I do sing some songs that I've written about whatever, getting high and hanging out in the woods.
It's just what I am.
Like, I'm not here to say that I'm anybody better than anybody else by any means.
joe rogan
Well, didn't God invent the woods and weed?
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, there you go.
joe rogan
I don't believe anybody that tells you that God doesn't want you to have weed.
oliver anthony
I do want to use...
If there's anything I'd like to capitalize on with my opportunity, it's just like...
Because for me, just being in the position that I've been in the last two years and just the trash I've had in my head is...
I tell you, I don't care who...
Look, I haven't been in a church in 10 years, and I'm not saying I'd ever go back into one again.
I don't know about all that, but there's a lot of things in Proverbs and Ecclesiastes that make sense and are timeless to today.
If people could just have enough open-mindedness to just read a little bit of Proverbs and just see what it has to say, I think it would make the world a better place.
There's a lot of truth in those words.
They don't just talk about...
joe rogan
It's it's real life advice that that that I that I work toward every day applying in my own life So was there like a moment with you because I've read the legend story but I wanted to ask you this in live in person Was there a moment when you had like a literal come to Jesus moment where you were at rock bottom?
unidentified
Yeah, I mean what was going on?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I was at a point where I was having I Man, I don't even think I'd call it panic attacks.
It was just like...
I was so...
Everything was just so screwed up.
I was getting like...
I was getting chest pains and shooting pains all down into my...
Like I was having like almost cardiovascular symptoms that are just...
I guess now I realize there's stress and anxiety related, but I really thought I was going to die.
Holy shit.
joe rogan
This is why you're drinking a lot or smoking weed a lot?
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, I think maybe the weed was even causing some of that.
I was slamming down, you know, we can grow it in Virginia now, so I grew a lot of pounds of weed last year.
And I don't even know what I'm going to do with it all now.
joe rogan
You can sell that on eBay.
Sell it in your truck.
You can buy a Suburban.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I'll save it for hard times.
joe rogan
If you come to Virginia, the back of the Suburban, where it's legal, the back of the Suburban will be packed with as much weed that is legal to sell you.
oliver anthony
But yeah, I had grown some crazy stuff and was smoking it.
joe rogan
Oliver Anthony weed brand.
We're in.
oliver anthony
Let's go.
joe rogan
Hulk Hogan's got his own weed brand.
Why don't you?
oliver anthony
We'll talk about all that, the growing, because I am intrigued with the growing.
But yeah, to your point, it was like I just almost disconnected from reality.
I don't want to say I was having like...
I was never psychotic or having like...
joe rogan
You're freaking out.
oliver anthony
I was very disassociated from my reality.
I can remember just being around really close friends having dinner one night.
You know you get warm and fuzzy feelings being around people you care about.
And everything was just ice cold.
It was almost like I just tried to feel something other than what I was feeling.
joe rogan
What were you thinking during these times?
oliver anthony
I was thinking that...
joe rogan
Like, what was the state of your life?
oliver anthony
I was thinking, like, that I was gonna...
I was thinking, like...
See, I don't know.
Suicide's a weird thing because...
And I can't speak for everybody, but for me, like...
It wasn't that I ever wanted to kill myself.
Like, I knew I wanted to keep trying to fight and get out of whatever it is I was in, but it was almost like...
At some point, I thought I was gonna do it almost as a fight-or-flight response.
Like...
That I couldn't escape whatever it is that I was in and like that was my own that was gonna eventually be my only way out and so It's sad and it's whatever it like I hate even talking about this, but I feel like I should talk about it I mean where else to talk about it but on Joe Rogan But it's like that was one of the things that compelled me to throw a lot of these videos up just off my phone You know like it's funny when I had When I had those songs, and maybe I still do, I haven't looked at the charts in a week or whatever, but I had stuff on iTunes that was like in the top two or three spots, other songs.
Those were just recorded off my Android phone, uploaded on YouTube.
I ripped the WAV file off the YouTube video and then just uploaded it through DistroKid.
And so people were buying, like the number two song on iTunes at one point, I think it was Ain't Got a Dollar, and that's just the audio from the YouTube video.
But I wanted to get all those.
I had a lot of these songs sitting around.
joe rogan
So it's from a microphone from the phone?
oliver anthony
Standard microphone?
From my front camera on my Android phone.
unidentified
Wow.
oliver anthony
It sounds pretty good.
I wanted to get all that up, though, because I really didn't know if I was going to be around to do it.
joe rogan
Can you pause that for a second?
Let's listen to that.
I want to hear that.
If you don't get freaked out and uncomfortable, listen to your own voice.
oliver anthony
That's okay.
No, I like it.
joe rogan
Let's listen, because I want to hear what that sounds like.
oliver anthony
This would be the, yeah, the Ain't Got a Dollar, the original version is a good example.
joe rogan
Recording off of Android phones might be the new thing.
oliver anthony
*laughs* You can tell it's very mono.
joe rogan
The new authentic.
Recording off of Android phones.
unidentified
I ain't got a dollar and I don't need a dime.
I got a little spot in the country where I spend all of my time.
When the sun goes down on this itty bitty town, we can light up the bowl and pass it around.
joe rogan
I ain't Listen, man, you don't gotta listen to nobody.
Tell them all to eat shit.
Shut the fuck up.
You can do whatever you want, man.
You just keep doing that.
You just keep doing that and do concerts.
oliver anthony
That's what got me uploading the songs originally.
I was like, I'll just go ahead and get something out there and then...
I mean, man, I was taking aspirin every day thinking like I was going to have a heart attack.
I was having all this crap.
joe rogan
So when you were recording these things and releasing them, what was the hope?
The hope was that people would enjoy them?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I was just trying to leave them out for the world in case like...
joe rogan
In case you died?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I guess in case either I died from a heart attack or like...
joe rogan
Do you know how huge these songs would be if you died?
I think that's like the most horrible rumor about Jimi Hendrix is that his manager was like a gangster had him killed.
His manager had him killed because he was going to leave and he owned the music while Jimi was alive and if Jimi died he would get the music and they killed him.
oliver anthony
Yeah, maybe I thought, like, I figured, like, that was the only thing I had that was worth anything.
And so, like, if I was going to be a shitty enough person to, like, leave, you know, leave a kid behind and, like, whatever, my family and whatever else, it's like, at least there'd be something there for them to be able to capitalize on and make that.
joe rogan
Were you...
Was your bad feelings come from...
Did they come from a lack of hope for your future?
Did you have, like, a sense of what would make you happy?
What you were missing in your life?
oliver anthony
No, like, it's...
joe rogan
Was it just overwhelming?
oliver anthony
The mind is...
I guess I'm a creative person, I guess you'd say.
For creative people in general, life is very imaginative anyway.
Again, it's like you and I could go to the same restaurant, sit down, order the same meal, have the same waitress, identical everything in a parallel time.
You and I would walk out of that restaurant noticing different things.
completely different.
Like the mind perceives things individually, right?
And so like, when you get into a bad headspace like that, your perception of what would otherwise be good things can become very bad.
And I don't know, I don't know the best way to explain it.
Because I'm not well versed on psychology or anything like that.
But that's the best way I can explain it is like, you don't understand sometimes what people are going through, even from the outside in, you know, You look at people who are not living life right, and you're like, I just wish he'd just get his shit together.
I don't understand why he's doing that.
And it's like, because maybe in his head, what he's looking at is totally different than what you're looking at.
The mind's very complicated, you know?
My understanding is even now with all the studies we've done and the technology we have, we understand the mind very little, but there's so much that goes into it and so much of our thoughts come from our gut biome and all.
There's millions of living things within us that I think influence the way we think and what we do.
It's a very complicated thing.
So yeah, it's easy for people to get off track.
It's hard to get back on the track when you get off.
That's why I say I was really just...
On paper, things were great, right?
I was married.
I have a great marriage.
I had a good job.
I worked my ass off, but I made good money.
What were you doing for work?
So the last six years I've been in industrial sales.
So I've worked outside sales for Because I was in the industry, like, working factory work when I was younger.
Had a bad accident.
Couldn't go back to that job.
And then during that recovery period, I went to work.
I don't know if I can say the place or not.
joe rogan
You don't have to say the place.
oliver anthony
Okay.
joe rogan
What was the accident?
oliver anthony
I fell and hit my head.
Oh, Jesus.
Yeah, I had internal...
I had, like, an internal fracture.
I remember riding in the ambulance on the...
I'd had seizures and all and passed out at the...
I was...
It's weird, because I can remember laying there and remember the...
ambulance and the EMT people coming in, everybody around me talking to me.
But like I could hear them, but I was just kind of in a dream.
And I do remember waking up in the ambulance on the ride.
I had like I had I remember I had blood coming out of my ear and maybe out of my out of my mouth or my nose.
But I remember I had blood on my I went and reached.
I had blood on my face.
I was clean shaven then.
But and I asked the guy in the back with me in the ambulance.
I'm like, man, I was like, is everything am I going to be all right or what?
And he's like, buddy, we're doing the best we can!
And I'm like, oh shit!
And that messed me up pretty bad.
I was in the hospital for two or three days, but even for the next year after that, my memory was trashed.
I had really bad balance issues.
It was difficult for me.
It just kind of jacked everything up.
I had a lot of inflammation and stuff in my brain, but that kind of...
And I question whether or not that had a lot to do with my mental health issues.
I've met a lot of people.
I've done four shows so far, and they've all been intimate settings.
And so I've taken hours after each one to give everybody a chance to talk.
And I've talked to another guy who had a bad head injury and has dealt with something really similar to me.
But I almost wonder if that didn't affect...
That kind of knocked a few screws loose upstairs with everything else that's went on.
joe rogan
So you got depressed after that?
oliver anthony
Yeah, for sure.
Before then, I was totally fine.
joe rogan
100% they're connected.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah.
100%.
I mean, it might not be the only factor that led you down that road, but 100%.
That's a major symptom of fighters.
When fighters get knocked out, when football players get knocked out, depression, major symptom.
Major symptom.
That's one of the real dangers of head trauma.
There's a lot of people who have had severe head trauma that go to take their own lives afterwards.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and looking back, I think that could be a big part of it, because I look back into my 20s, and a lot of it was very dark.
joe rogan
And that's after that?
oliver anthony
For sure, yeah.
joe rogan
I guarantee you they're connected.
I guarantee you.
And I guarantee you, like, if you got your system, like, if you had really good health care...
They could find some issues with your endocrine system.
A lot of times with people that have really bad head injuries, their pituitary gland gets damaged, and your body's not producing hormones correctly anymore, and you're just all fucked up.
Your cortisol levels are all fucked up.
oliver anthony
Yeah, because I would say that was the thing.
It was almost like my brain was stuck in this fight-or-flight type of thing.
And maybe that's what the writing helped, because the writing helped emphasize that more creative part of my brain to get me out of that headspace.
I loved my job I did because I was still in the field so I was still on job sites and industrial plants and hospitals me and so like I've I guess the reason that I've the reason I feel like other than just really divine influence again based off of just the experience I've had the last 60 days with my faith and stuff which is just And I'd love to touch on that some too, but I've had so many conversations with people the last six or seven years because it was my job to go almost kind of like how you talk to people in here every day.
I was going around and talking to Joe Schmo and Billy on job sites all day and every walk of life, not just blue collar.
Those are some just very authentic conversations you have with people because you're just a guy and they're just a guy and you're just talking.
joe rogan
You can still have those.
oliver anthony
The same message kept coming across, which is really what I guess I resonated in this song, but people are just so tired.
I think being in that position sort of gave me this unfair advantage to look into the world maybe On the inside.
joe rogan
I don't think it's unfair at all.
I think it's probably...
I mean, if you wanted to believe in fate...
You know, I don't believe in fate, but I should.
If anybody should, I should believe in fate.
I've had a pretty lucky life.
oliver anthony
Yeah, you have.
joe rogan
I don't necessarily think it's real, though.
But I also think if you believe it's real...
I think there's a lot of things that if you believe...
It's...
A lot of what's going on with human beings is the way the mind perceives things.
And it's kind of the software you're running.
That's why we seek out people who are inspirational.
Like if you watch a David Goggins video, you will go work out.
You will go work out.
It will get you off your couch.
oliver anthony
I guarantee you.
When we were running, we were saying David Goggins quotes while you're running about carrying the boats and all that.
joe rogan
Who's gonna carry the boats?
David's the fucking man.
And there's another guy, Jocko Willink.
oliver anthony
I love him too.
joe rogan
Jocko has a video.
Find Jocko Good.
Find that video.
There's a video that I 100% legitimately play in my mind when I'm tired.
I say good.
I say it to myself.
I was in the cold plunge the other day, and I was being a bitch at like 2 minutes and 30 seconds, and I was like, good.
Listen to this video.
Have you ever heard this?
It's amazing.
oliver anthony
I don't think I have.
unidentified
Direct subordinates, one of my guys that worked for me.
He would call me up or pull me aside with some major problem, some issue that was going on.
And he'd say, boss, we got this and that and the other thing.
And I'd look at him and I'd say, good.
And finally one day he was telling me about some issue that he was having, some problem.
And he said, I already know what you're going to say.
And I said, well, what am I going to say?
He said, you're going to say good.
He said, that's what you always say.
When something is wrong and going bad, you always just look at me and say, good.
And I said, well, yeah.
When things are going bad, there's going to be some good that's going to come from it.
Didn't get the new high-speed gear we wanted?
Good.
Didn't get promoted?
Good.
More time to get better.
Oh, mission got canceled?
oliver anthony
Good.
unidentified
We can focus on another one.
Didn't get funded.
Didn't get the job you wanted.
Got injured.
Sprained my ankle.
Got tapped out?
Good.
Got beat?
Good.
We learned.
Unexpected problems?
Good.
We have the opportunity to figure out a solution.
That's it.
When things are going bad, Don't get all bummed out, don't get startled, don't get frustrated.
If you can say the word good, guess what?
It means you're still alive.
It means you're still breathing.
And if you're still breathing, well then hell, you still got some fight left in you.
So get up, dust off, Reload, recalibrate, re-engage, and go out on the attack.
joe rogan
That's what's up.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I love that.
joe rogan
Yeah.
That's software you can run in your mind.
You can run that.
You just need to listen to it and then apply it.
That's real.
Now, if you don't know that software, and if you know that there's a human being like Jocko out there in the world that's a real person that really does think like that, then you don't think it's possible.
But it is.
So you have to be seeing it.
So you see it, and now you know.
Run that software.
Run that software.
I don't know how much of people's depression.
I mean, I think depression has a mosaic of problems that's associated with it and a mosaic of causes, like a large pattern.
There's a lot of stuff going on that causes people to be depressed.
Some of it, in your case, may very well have been from a physical injury.
And I think that's a big factor.
oliver anthony
I had never considered that until now.
joe rogan
I think it's 100% connected.
100%.
Because it's totally in the literature.
You know, my good friend, Dr. Mark Gordon, he does a lot of work with traumatic brain injury patients.
And he runs this Wounded Warriors, it's called...
What is it called?
What is the thing that he works with those guys?
Warrior Angels.
And it's helping people with traumatic brain injuries.
And he's helped countless soldiers, fighters, football players, all these people.
And it's real similar with a lot of them.
They have no hope.
oliver anthony
Exactly, and I guess that's the thing that I've learned from this, again, from 18-year-old Chris that thought a lot of that was just made up, and people have given excuses to what I understand now about it.
Again, it feels...
That place that your mind can take you, it feels just as real as anything else.
Like, even if you tell yourself...
Like, you can tell yourself a hundred times that, oh, yeah, well, you still got a job.
You still have...
Everything's fine.
It's like, if...
I don't know, it's...
Your perception of reality becomes very distorted when you're in that place.
And it's...
Again, for me, I think a lot of it came down to I just knew I wasn't fulfilling whatever purpose it was I was here to fulfill.
joe rogan
You probably didn't have any energy because you had a head injury.
It's probably a major factor in it.
Major factor.
It's another major factor in people with head injuries.
They drink a lot because their dopamine is really low.
It fucks up everything, man.
And there's people that have traumatic brain injuries that are subconcussive trauma from playing soccer.
People play soccer and heading the ball.
It doesn't even hurt.
But you throttle your brain in the cage over and over and over again and eventually you have TBI. That's real.
You have real CTE symptoms for soccer players.
It's crazy, but the head is just not designed to get hit.
And I've experienced it with so many fighters, so many guys that I know that got knocked out, and then after the knockout, they're severely depressed, both because they lost.
Even if you lose by a decision, you get depressed.
It's a terrible feeling to lose in front of the whole world.
oliver anthony
Well sure, inherent loss in a lot of animals does that.
That's a whole other conversation, but one thing I did find from Jordan Peterson talking about the lobsters, it makes me think about the fighters, but it's like you lose that dopamine and that drive.
All those chemicals are very tightly regulated to your performance and your place sort of within the world.
joe rogan
What did he say about the lobsters again?
oliver anthony
So, yeah, if two lobsters fight the defeated lobster, he loses his drive and dopamine.
He's like, there's some ridiculous chance that he won't win another fight.
Like, he basically just becomes a bum lobster once he loses.
But they can give them the same medications that they give humans to combat that, like, whatever antidepressant or whatever.
So they're giving SSRIs to lobsters.
Then they're out there fighting.
You know, they give SSRIs to...
I've got some close friends in veterinary medicine.
They have cats and dogs that take SSRIs.
joe rogan
Oh, God.
Freaked out cats and dogs.
oliver anthony
But I can tell you my experience with SSRIs were not pleasant.
All it did was just make me very numb.
And I'm not...
I'm certainly, again, I'm not giving anybody advice on anything, but just in my personal experience, especially for a guy, when you're on SSRIs, he does a lot of things bad to you.
For one, if you're in a relationship, I hear this on both sides with men and women, but Good luck making love with your lover.
Good luck having sex, because that's out the window.
It messes with that.
It messes with your thought patterns.
It was very difficult for me to write music when I was on it.
That was a short-lived life.
The best thing that I found that helped me other than just then just jumping into this and Making this music happen like along the way was actually I found a lot of benefits out of CBD like even smoking CBD flower and so like that Surprisingly like I never really got benefits from the oil but I'd say if anybody is in a position like listening to this right now where you're having like daily panic attacks and you're just like You're just there.
If you're listening, you'll know what I'm talking about, but you're at that breaking point like I was.
I found smoking CBD joints, not ingesting it where it would go through my system, go through my liver and all, but smoking it just like you would smoke traditional cannabis flower, knocked a lot of it right out.
joe rogan
Interesting.
oliver anthony
No, it's not going to fix it.
There's an underlying issue that you've got to figure out and address, but it gave me some very good relief from that.
joe rogan
That's amazing.
That's really good to hear from people because it doesn't get you high either.
oliver anthony
Right, it doesn't get you high.
unidentified
It reduces inflammation.
joe rogan
Have you tried adjusting your diet?
oliver anthony
Well, I'm good now.
That's what's so funny.
Like, since this has all happened, I haven't had a...
Like, I'm telling you, again...
joe rogan
Because you're on top of the world.
oliver anthony
Well, yeah, but even before, like...
I have to be careful with what I say, because I don't...
Like, my shit stinks.
Like, I'm nobody special, and I'm not here to preach to anybody, but I'm telling you, like, giving things to God, for me, alleviated 99% of what, like...
I had a, like, I don't know how to describe it, but when you experience, and I mean, you've done things that I haven't, like with DMT and all, and that stuff's very intriguing to me, and so I'm open-minded to all that as well, like, I'm not, but, yeah, like, I had, when this,
when I kind of had this breakdown moment and decided that I was going to let whatever ego I had go, and just, at this point, it's like I knew I didn't have much left in for me anyway, and I wanted to serve whatever purpose it was that I was here to serve, it's like, You get this just overwhelming feeling in you.
I'm just crying like a baby, just this very warm feeling throughout me.
That really hasn't gone away since.
I'm not the guy that can play in front of 12,000 people on guitar.
I would be like...
I mean, I had never played a paid gig.
When we played the show at the farm market where Jamie Johnson showed up, that was my first paid gig.
I'm not a guy to go out and play live shows, but I can tell you I was so at peace being up there.
It just felt like that's where I was supposed to be.
And with all of this, it has been.
There's no way that Chris from six months ago could handle what's gone on the last two weeks, but I feel just so empowered from all of it.
I don't know.
I'm telling you, like, again, I'm not anybody special, and I'm certainly not here to preach to anybody, but just from coming from somebody who was just in a really just fucked up place, and I use that word with discretion, but in this case, it describes where I was.
That guy found a lot of peace, like, from this book.
joe rogan
From looking at things in a different way.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
From looking at things through the eyes of Scripture.
oliver anthony
Well, yeah, and I think for me, it was like I had been in church growing up, and I had been exposed to all that, but...
I'd found a lot of theatrics and a lot of politics in church and in religion when I was younger, and so it just immediately turned me off to it.
joe rogan
So if you can, take us to what was the day you picked it up?
What was the feeling that you had?
What caused you to act?
What was it like when you did it?
oliver anthony
Yeah, I mean, I'd been reading it here and there, off and on, and I had for, like, off and on for a long time, like, because I, again, I was introduced to it as a kid, but it was really just like, um...
I remember I went to the ER for everything that was going on.
I mean, I thought I was seriously going to die.
Like, I was having shooting pains up under my jaw, down in my wrist, in my leg.
Like, just cardiovascular 101 symptoms.
Of course, I'm 31. I had been, like, I could run four miles without stopping, no problem.
So, like, I knew my heart was strong.
joe rogan
You were just freaking out.
oliver anthony
Yeah, but I went and did that, and I remember being in the truck after that, just like...
And I just, yeah, I just had a breakdown moment.
I was just crying and was just...
I just felt hopeless, like almost the way a child feels hopeless when they, you know, like you can't find your parent or something, like a four-year-old that can't find his parents or something.
I was just like, just didn't have anything left in me.
I don't know, I just...
I just decided, like, right then and there, I was like, I know I can't do this anymore, but I know that I can...
I know there's things that I need to do, and I just told God, I was like, just let me do it.
And I'll give all this shit up.
I'll give up the weed, and I'll quit getting drunk, and I'll quit being so angry about things, and I'll just...
Like I'll just call it good whatever I've done up from from up until I was 30 or whatever 31 like I will just call that good and I'll start over again and I'll make him the focus and not me and I just tried to Tried to let my let my ego and everything that I was Just let that go and just focus on because because obviously like It's not just me.
I've seen it with even other people I know and I see it with celebrities and everything but I don't know I just feel like we're in such a weird place right now in the world that I feel like God's working through inadvertently through certain people to get to get his point across.
joe rogan
So take me to what what you did.
Did you start reading the Bible?
Like what did you do?
oliver anthony
I just changed my perspective I quit worrying about me, and I started worrying about what it is that I'm supposed to do.
It talks in the Bible about being a servant and giving up, I guess, my desire and my will and whatever it is that I want to do.
I don't know the best way to describe it, but it's about It's about trying to use what I have as a tool versus doing what I can in the moment to give myself whatever satisfaction that it is I'm trying to get, you know?
It's about trying to let go of your ego, I guess, in a way.
I mean, people pursue that mentality without faith.
I mean, it's the idea of there being something bigger than you.
But I think inherently all human beings idolize something.
Like, it talks in the Bible about false idols.
We all have false idols.
Like, whether it's our phone or it's a celebrity or it's...
Something we do or it's our addiction to food or drugs or whatever but like it's very difficult for a human to be the biggest thing on their hierarchy There's always something above us right because we're always in pursuit of something bigger than whatever it is in that moment and I think for me it was just about Taking everything else all the distractions and all the other things in my life away and just ensuring that at least and look I'm We all sin and we all do stupid things.
We're all just people.
Nobody's special or righteous.
People sometimes act like they're special and righteous, but we're all just the same thing.
But it's just about trying to make that my idol.
Make God and the concept of what it is that He wants done on this earth my idol versus anything else.
We all serve some master, whether we realize it or not, so why not let it be the master that is above all?
joe rogan
So when you made this transformation in your mind, did you then start reading Scripture regularly?
What did you start doing that was different?
oliver anthony
I guess it's like now I don't read it because I feel like I should read it.
To be a better person, it's like now I try to read it for the guidance within it.
And I'm still in the infancy stages of a lot of this.
I've read a lot of Psalms, Proverbs, and Ecclesiastes, and Luke.
There's other good books, but just trying to I don't know, like, trying to restructure, I guess, on a granular level, like, I guess, the neural pathways in my brain that have certain habits and certain ways of thought, like, I've tried to retrain that to, you know, like, there's things it says, like, and I'll be very brief with this, I promise, but, like, one thing, ironically, it's Proverbs 4.20, which I thought you would like.
unidentified
Ha, ha, ha.
oliver anthony
So if there's anything better.
unidentified
Perfect.
oliver anthony
Read it.
Preach.
Keep corrupt talk far from your lips.
Let your eyes look straight ahead.
Fix your gaze directly before you.
Give careful thought to the paths for your feet and be steadfast in all your ways.
Do not turn to the right or the left.
Keep your foot from evil.
joe rogan
That's pretty fucking profound.
oliver anthony
But the whole book of Proverbs is like that.
It's not preachy.
It's not what you think.
It's good guidance.
It's like good guidance that you would want a father to give to his son.
joe rogan
What do you think it comes from?
If you had to guess, where do you think the Bible comes from?
It was an oral tradition for who knows how many years before they ever wrote it down.
Yeah, what do you think these stories come from?
oliver anthony
What I Believe that people come across in different points of time and I think they are given messages that need to be delivered And I'm not in any way trying to parallel me to anyone in any of these books by any means, but I do think that...
Throughout history, like even beyond from what's been written in this Bible, there's been important people that came along and said important—or maybe not even important people.
Sometimes it's the lowly of the low that come along and just say things that need to be said.
And if I could— To me, it's like there's no question that this is an intelligent planet we live on, in an intelligent solar system.
Everything is just much more immense than any human on Earth would admit.
Like, even people in science, so much of science is based on theory.
Like, it's this very elegantly written way of thinking, but ultimately, if you take it down to its, like, on a granular level, it's very, it's all, in many ways, based on theory, and so...
I think the earth is far more intelligent than we realize in the systems that we live in.
Like, I just don't think somebody just pulled all that out of thin air.
I do think that in May, maybe it's...
I've been waiting for my time to bring up the aliens, because I... But anyway, but no, but in all seriousness, it's like, for me, I just, I believe that...
If you read through it, so much of it is so timeless.
And so much of it, if you read about the rich and the poor and the wicked and the way, just the inherent human behavior that existed at the time when these books were written back then, it's so parallel to what goes on today.
Like, to the point that you wouldn't, if you just read it out of context and didn't know it was scripture, a lot of it sounds like something somebody wrote two hours ago and posted on a vlog or whatever.
It's like, it's...
To me, there is no other book like it.
joe rogan
Have you paid any attention to Graham Hancock and Randall Carlson and their theories about the restarting of humanity?
It's a really fascinating field of inquiry and discussion because it's now starting over time to be backed up by more science because there was always this curiosity like when did the human race first invent civilization?
And the current theory is that it was about 6,000 years ago.
It's Mesopotamia, Sumer, and these areas, which is where we found the first written language, like first mathematics, cuneiform language.
But what they believe is that's a restarting of civilization and that very likely civilization existed at a very, very high level somewhere around 11,800 years ago.
And that what caused the end of the ice age also caused just a mass destruction all throughout the universe or all throughout the earth rather of Particles from space slamming into the earth that the earth goes through these comet storms Periodically and it happens.
I think it's every June and every November and when they go through these Clouds of comets, occasionally we get hit by big ones.
And there's a lot of evidence for this.
And what they believe is that when you're looking at the ancient Egyptian structures, when you're looking at some structures in Turkey and other parts of the Middle East, you're looking at things that are older than 12,000 years old.
oliver anthony
Yeah, and I agree with that.
I think that it's obvious that technology existed that we don't know anything about today.
joe rogan
Just the construction of the pyramids alone leaned you to that.
Like, somehow or another, they were able to do that.
And they were able to do that with immense sophistication and insane capabilities.
The ability to move stone from hundreds of miles that weighs Tons!
Massive stones cut perfectly, stacked on top of each other.
2,300,000 of them that are perfectly due north, south, east, and west.
oliver anthony
Yeah, that's the craziest thing is that they could understand that at that scale.
joe rogan
The technology was almost...
We don't understand what they were doing.
It's alien.
And not alien like non-human beings.
I think there were human beings that made it.
But I think to us, they went in a direction with their technology that's very different than we did.
We went in this weird direction of internal combustion engines and silicone chips and all these different things.
I think it's very likely that they had comparable, if not better technology, but it moved in a completely different direction, whether it was using sound or vibration or some other completely undiscovered technology that we have yet to invent that was wiped out when civilization was knocked into barbarism.
And I think that's one of the reasons why you go back in early history, people were so fucking savage.
Because I think that the people that survived that 11,800 years ago event I think whatever was left was like fucking Walking Dead.
And I think people lived a horrible life for a long time.
I think it was thousands of years of this until we emerged from that and finally started reinventing agriculture and cities and all these different things again.
So I think the 6,000 year ago mark, I think...
If I had to guess, I would imagine that is the first example of a rebuild of civilization that took thousands of years to emerge from horrific slaughter.
oliver anthony
It wouldn't surprise me if all that doesn't happen again.
joe rogan
It could easily happen again if we get hit again.
oliver anthony
That was one of the initial things that really intrigued me reading.
I think it talks about it in Ecclesiastes, but that everything that's happened under the sun has already happened before and will happen again.
That generations that are yet to come will be forgotten about those that come after them.
I think just in the same way that we have a summer and a fall and a winter and a spring, it's like I think human society, just because of our human nature and our pursuit for...
Whatever it is that we just love to create and develop.
So we shoot all the way up to the top and then some tragedy comes along, whether it's self-inflicted or from comets or whatever, and then there we go right back down to the bottom.
We start over again.
Yeah, like there is a lot of weird things like they've discovered a lot in South America recently because of the new technology like the civilizations that existed down there that we had no idea.
joe rogan
Graham Hancock's talked about that too.
oliver anthony
Who knows what's went on even just on this ground in years past that we'll never know about.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah, for sure.
Well, we know quite a bit about Texas, which is a fascinating story and it's of its own.
But, you know, what's really fascinating about Texas is they were dominating, like these nomadic tribes were dominating this land for hundreds of years where people couldn't even settle down.
There's an amazing book called Empire of the Summer Moon that's all about Texas and the Comanches and the Texas Rangers.
Crazy stories.
Just crazy.
But I think what the Bible is saying rings true.
And that if people, you know, they just understood the history of the past from when they wrote the Bible, they had to have known massive catastrophes.
They believe that's what the story of the flood is from.
The flood from Noah's Ark and even from the Epic of Gilgamesh, which is even older.
It's like they have these similar kind of stories and they think that these similar kind of stories relate to the immense flooding that occurred after impact.
They think that after impact, well, they know that at one point in time, the United States, half of it was covered with at least like a mile of ice.
Some places it was more than a mile, which is just insane to think.
oliver anthony
To think now, yeah.
joe rogan
Standing here and looking straight up for a mile, covering ice.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
I mean, how can you even wrap your head around that?
It's so difficult to even imagine.
oliver anthony
And what's even, yeah, it's crazy to think about it existing then, but also that...
I guess when I talk about the intelligence of whatever system it is we live in, the fact that the Earth is able to self-correct itself over a period of time.
And even today when we see cycles and things happening, I'm sure that we could destroy the Earth with some of the technology we have now.
I fear that this sort of proxy war that we've involved ourselves in doesn't escalate into something bigger because...
We could wipe society out indefinitely.
joe rogan
We were talking about this yesterday with Peter Berg.
He's a director, actor.
He's a guy who did Lone Survivor, made that movie, made that painkiller show that's on Netflix.
And he did a tour of one of those battleships, and he saw the missiles that could carry nuclear warheads.
He's like, what the fuck?
One of these ships could literally wipe out the whole Earth.
It's so bonkers.
It's so bonkers that these things exist.
And that there's thousands of them.
oliver anthony
Thousands of them ready to go.
joe rogan
Thousands of them ready to just flatten the planet.
That probably has happened before.
And if I had to look at things with the most optimistic perspective...
My most beautiful optimistic perspective is that's what the aliens are here for.
That's the beautiful one, is that life exists everywhere in the universe and that it's a very complicated process of evolving from territorial apes to becoming these intergalactic travelers that have no ego and don't display irrational behavior and work for whatever purpose.
Because that's where it gets weird.
It's like if you don't have emotions, You don't have jealousy and envy and love and lust and all the things to fight against and all the things to fight for.
If you don't have those things, like what is purpose?
What is our purpose as humans?
It's very terrifying for us.
It's one of the reasons why we're most scared about technological innovation.
Where it comes?
That's Terminator.
You know, that's everything.
All these things that we create that wind up killing us and that we are somehow or another purposeless if we don't have all these things that we cling to, like love.
Fear and anxiety and jealousy and all the stuff that we want.
We want to be praised and loved and all these different things that motivate people to succeed and do things in life.
Without that, what are we?
That's a big question.
But with it, how dangerous are we?
We do use it in so many different beautiful ways like your music or like a great book.
There's ways that people use this that are beautiful.
But it's ultimately the reason why life is so scary.
It's ultimately why during the period of mass communication, during the period of exchange of information worldwide, which has occurred from the start of the 20th century to where we are in the 21st century, we've never had a time where we could communicate with mass amounts of people better.
But it's still, we're at the verge of nuclear catastrophe.
We're still in this very terrifying place where one group of people for some reason or another opposes.
Like, I don't know anyone in Russia.
I don't know anyone in China.
The idea that somehow or another China is my enemy or Russia is my enemy, like, how?
How did that happen?
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, the people there aren't.
joe rogan
Exactly.
oliver anthony
Their establishment's an enemy of our establishment, right?
joe rogan
The idea that what the human mind is capable of in creating great art and great music is also capable of dominating massive groups of people through tyranny.
We have to be very careful because that same thing that makes us this emotional being that wants all these weird feelings, that's the same thing that leads us down the road to tyranny.
And I bet that exists everywhere in the universe.
And I bet the aliens, if they're coming down here, They want to be very careful with the species while it's going through this transition.
Because I bet this shit is very touch and go.
And I bet every now and then, some fucking Putin-type character goes, oh yeah?
Yeah, NATO? Fuck you!
I have cancer!
Fuck you!
oliver anthony
That's all so complicated, because...
joe rogan
Scary.
oliver anthony
All that starts with someone's imagination.
On the other end of that, though, to your point, that's what I find so important about freedom of speech and the ability for people to have good, honest conversations, because you can imagine...
The mind is just as capable of creating good as it is evil.
I think right now maybe we're creating a little more evil than we are good.
joe rogan
Oh, I don't think so.
oliver anthony
I think things can turn around just as quickly as they've turned bad as far as on a global scale.
joe rogan
I don't think we're creating more evil than we are good.
I think if you look at the statistics of history, human history, we're moving in the right direction.
Even though there's a lot of struggle, it's not like a perfect curve.
It goes up and down.
But over time, if you look at just violent crime and horrible things that people do to each other, it's down.
Almost everywhere in the world where it was a hundred years ago.
And I think it's moving in that general direction.
I just think it's messy.
Human beings, we fuck up a lot to get better.
I was having a conversation with a friend about Nordstrom's closing in San Francisco.
They get robbed so much, they're just like, we have to close up.
San Francisco is so crazy.
It's so fucking crazy.
The person I was talking to was like, good.
They'll have to reassess now.
They have to realize their policies are crazy and they're going to have to put someone in here that fixes it.
And I'm like, yeah, or it becomes like a third world city.
Like some crazy, like violent, crime-ridden city that's controlled by gangs.
Like that could happen too.
oliver anthony
See, to me, I perceive that as being a symptom.
What do you think the problem is?
I mean, I know the easy answer is it's the people that run the government in California that have made it into this atrocity that it is that it wasn't maybe 15 or 20 years ago.
But there's also a big problem, too, with homelessness and drugs.
joe rogan
Well, cynical me wants to think that there's a conspiracy.
Cynical me wants to think that if you create more problems, more crime, more confusion, then people will give in to more control by the government to somehow or another mitigate those problems that exist everywhere.
There has to be a solution.
This is the only solution.
You have to have a digital ID. You take it everywhere you go.
Everyone has a cell phone, so everyone has a digital ID. That way we'll catch everyone when they're doing all these crimes.
That's scary.
Because they're not just going to use it for that.
And then they're going to make up crimes.
They're going to decide that you saying things that they don't like that may even be true, like malinformation.
Like, that's a crime.
And then they'll shut down your social media.
Yeah.
Look, we saw that during the Twitter files investigation from when Twitter first was purchased by Elon Musk, and he let these journalists go over all the emails.
They're like, holy shit, the FBI is telling people to delete tweets.
This is nuts.
oliver anthony
Again, it goes back to freedom.
Yeah, I can see that there is a power at be that wants to limit free speech.
joe rogan
Sure.
People that have money, that are making money off of suppressing information.
oliver anthony
And free speech is such a precious thing.
If we have something precious, a resource that needs to be protected more than anything right now, it's freedom of speech.
joe rogan
It's a very important thing for this country.
And, you know, I've said it many, many times, but it's the reason why this country has created so much culture.
Sure.
oliver anthony
And you've seen that spread out throughout the world.
Like to your point, like 100 years ago, a lot of the even a lot of these countries they're dealing with.
They've got radical politicians that are locking them down and taking away their rights.
And like, yeah, all that's happened within the last 10 or 15 years, maybe.
But in general, like the whatever craziness that we established here, like arguably the first country, I guess you'd say, in modern history that had some form of democracy and some form of involvement of citizens deciding what it is they want, what the world they want to live in.
Like that's spread out.
Like you see, most all countries have some sort of you don't see a lot of kings and dictators running countries anymore.
They have an election cycle now, whether or not it's all credible or not.
I don't know.
But the idea that like sovereign people can live in a land and decide what it is that they want for themselves is something that like has not existed.
It has not existed for a very long period of time in the world.
the world and it is precious that we hold to it and I guess going back to my point earlier about the federal government and state and local level it's like I just think there needs to be more strength within local communities as far as people making decisions and uniting with one another and you know I had I've had a lot of When an ugly ginger's walking around, everybody's like, oh, is it that guy?
And so I've had a lot of people stop me on the street and in parking decks and at the airport.
At the hardware store and like you know how many times I've had now I've at least a dozen times now I've had people tell me that they're talking to people they haven't talked to in five or six years that they got pissed over politics about and just this message that's coming out has given them like I know a guy in my own personal life he hasn't talked to his brother in six years because they disagreed over Trump and Biden and and even prior to that like they just left and right and which one was the Biden guy?
The guy I hang out with is...
Because, obviously, I live out in the country.
I own guns.
The people in my neck of the woods are not...
Despite what they may say on a news organization somewhere, a lot of the people I hang out with in the area of the country I live in is stereotypically red, right?
Because a lot of people will vote, no matter what other...
Influences there are.
A lot of people will vote conservative just because of their Second Amendment rights, which is very much under attack in Virginia.
You know, like you remember when you're at the sanctuary cities and all the counties that decided, well, even if the federal government bans this, we're not going to enforce it type of a thing, which is crazy to see, like in our time.
But yeah, so he voted.
He was a big Trump guy, and he watched his certain news organization, and the other guy was for Biden, and he watched his news organization.
And so they just basically picked up whatever narratives they got from each other's news, and they would just...
You know, they let that destroy literally a...
joe rogan
A friendship.
oliver anthony
Yeah, they were brothers, you know, biological brothers.
And so...
joe rogan
So dumb.
oliver anthony
That's not good for us as a country.
joe rogan
Well, it's not a wise thing to just apply to your life as a human being.
You can have people in your life that have disagreements with you.
I have people in my life that disagree with me on so many things.
Absolutely on politics.
Absolutely.
You know, especially like when I was a Bernie Sanders supporter.
You know, there's so many people that are like, you're a fucking idiot.
Like, listen, I would like to try it that way.
Let's try some guy who doesn't want war at all.
Let's try some guy who wants to take a certain percentage off speculation trades in the Wall Street where they're doing these and they're running a tiny fraction of a penny for each one of them.
And he's saying it would generate an insane amount of money that could be applied to education, that could be applied to healthcare, you could give people free healthcare, you could give people free education.
Well, why wouldn't we do that?
If you got some guy who doesn't want to divert money to these fucking forever wars and instead wants to apply it to communities, I was like, let's give that a chance.
Maybe it won't work.
I don't know jack shit about politics, but I sincerely believe the guy.
And I'm like, that to me is at least an option for change.
And that guy had been the same guy his whole life.
He had been always pushing for that his whole life.
He's kind of gotten tired in his later years, but that's just understandable.
He's kind of like...
oliver anthony
Yeah, so you believing in someone shouldn't suspend your friendships or relationships with other people.
joe rogan
Yeah, but it's just you're hanging out with dummies.
People should have, like, I have many friends that are Trump supporters.
I have many friends that wholesale believe in the Democratic Party no matter what.
It's a million times better no matter what anybody says.
oliver anthony
And no matter what anybody says about the Biden family, the Trump family, I've seen a lot of people change that now, though, in recent years.
Like, even people who were hardcore conservatives and hardcore Democrats, like, I don't think whatever a Republican, a Democrat, was represented at some point in time is anymore.
Like, both sides have...
I mean, like I said, I love freedom of speech and I love the Second Amendment, but...
There's a lot of things that I see that I don't, like, I mean, you gotta think, I'm 31, so I was in fourth grade at 9-11, so we've been, we were in endless war from 9-11 on, and, you know, even when we shouldn't have been, like, so both sides have, like, just picked up on things and ran with it, but they use certain emotional triggers to, like, keep their fan base happy, you know?
Like, oh, they're gonna take your guns, and the other side, they've got all their emotional triggers, and there are things that they're trying to feed their audience with, but I guess, like, at the end of the day, It doesn't help either side.
In my opinion, no one can go into that position in politics in the White House or anything else for that matter at this point because of how just inefficient and how large the federal government is.
I don't think anybody can go into those positions.
Overnight save everything.
They can certainly make big influences.
I mean, you saw when Trump was in office, the economy was rocking.
But then other things he did, you know, like warp speed and all that, there was a lot of controversy around all of that.
joe rogan
Well, he would have to be a vaccine scientist to even understand what they were doing.
And imagine being him, and this is not to defend Donald Trump, but imagine being him and being in control of all of it.
You're in control of the economy.
You're in control of foreign relations.
You're in control of the biggest military the world has ever known.
You're in the public eye.
You're tweeting about your ex-girlfriend being horse-faced.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I don't think one person can do it.
joe rogan
There's so much shit going on in that guy's life.
Do you think that he had the time to investigate the efficacy of the COVID vaccines that were this novel mRNA technology that had never been applied to hundreds of millions of people?
And you had to trust the CDC and Fauci and all those people.
How could he know?
unidentified
How could anybody know?
oliver anthony
And that's a good example of why I don't think we can or should rely on one person to save us on all those issues.
It's something we've got to work out on a personal level.
joe rogan
Well, it's insane.
It was invented back when people lived in tribes.
So you had a tribe of 50 people?
You want that old guy.
He's got a lot of scars on his face.
He knows how to run shit.
He knows what to do wrong.
He knows what to do right.
He survived.
All of his brothers died.
You know, like those guys are the guys you want teaching younger people.
It's like you were talking about with older folks.
That was the whole idea of a tribal leader.
Like this is the greatest warrior.
This is the smartest chief.
This is the person who's like, they can lead us and they want nothing but good for us because they love us because they know us.
But I don't know you.
He don't know you.
None of them care.
He just wants to get up there and say his speech the right way, and then they give him ice cream, and then he sits down.
Do you see that woman who's the White House press secretary?
I don't know if this is true, so we should find out if it's true.
Did she or did she not accidentally delete a Biden tweet from her account?
So it was a tweet, when I ran for president, this and that...
oliver anthony
Oh, and she accidentally posted it on her own.
joe rogan
She accidentally posted it on the wrong...
I want to find out if that's true, though, because that could be Russian disinformation, because that's true, too.
Here's one of the reasons why free speech is so important in this country, given the parameters of social media, is because we know that foreign interests are interfering with our discourse.
We know it.
It's proven that there's troll farms they have in Macedonia.
I'm sure they have them in China.
They have troll farms where people create accounts and then they argue with people about stuff.
And they'll post links to fake stories and they'll post fake information.
They may even post fucking AI voice swap shit.
But what they're doing is trying to get people arguing about stuff, trying to get people to diminish their faith in democracy, trying to get people at each other's throats from the right and the left.
It's manipulated.
unidentified
It's real.
oliver anthony
And think about who that benefits.
joe rogan
Investing in America means investing in all of America.
When I ran for president, I made a promise that I would leave no part of the country behind.
So she did do it!
She really did tweet it from her account.
Is that real?
Oh my god!
Oh my god!
She really did do it!
Oh my god.
That's so crazy.
So, of course, when you read his tweets, it sounds like her.
She's got a very politician way of doing it.
She's like an AM radio DJ. An AM radio DJ version of what a press secretary is.
Like a politician.
Because, you know, AM, all right, here we are on the drive.
I'm Mike, and I'm with The Rock.
You know, or whatever, the fucking sidekick.
oliver anthony
And maybe that's what attracted people to Trump, and maybe what attracts people to like, um, see, like, thank God I haven't, especially now, at least I've got a good excuse not to keep up with politics anymore, because I've got a few other more important things on my plate, but I think that's what attracts people to like that rough, raw, authentic type of speech, like it's not clean cut, and it's not professional, but it's, At least, like you said, even with Bernie, which, who knows, I don't know anything about Bernie, but...
joe rogan
He's not polished.
oliver anthony
But at least what he's saying is, like, at least you feel like he actually...
Like, at least he actually believes it.
joe rogan
He believes it.
oliver anthony
Because, you know, you can look at politicians over a 15-year span, and, like, they'll quote something from, like, oh, good God, I think anybody, any politician from the 90s is going to have a lot different opinions on emotional triggers that we talk about today.
unidentified
Bro.
joe rogan
Politicians from the 90s, from the Democratic Party, sound like Nazis.
They sound like Nazis.
oliver anthony
What does that tell you?
joe rogan
When Biden passed the crime bill in 94, there's this famous speech that he gives about locking people up so that his wife is safe and so that they're safe and that I'm safe.
And it sounds like right-wing, like, Proud Boy speech.
Fucking crazy!
It sounds like a patriot speech.
Would you worry about militia saying?
oliver anthony
I know very little about any of this, but my understanding is even...
I know for sure with Hillary Clinton, but I think even with Obama, originally their stance was very much against gay marriage, and then it flipped around...
joe rogan
She didn't support gay marriage till 2013. Yeah.
2013. So, like, how can those...
Bro, pass them cigars.
You're going to bust out your first cigar ever on the podcast.
oliver anthony
Yeah, so this is exciting.
So, like I said, a fan gave me these at a show.
But, yeah, so that's the thing.
I just hope to see...
joe rogan
A fan gave you these?
How do we know they're not lace with plastic?
oliver anthony
I'm gonna let you try it first.
joe rogan
God damn it.
Oh, they're sealed.
It definitely has to be real if it's sealed in plastic.
And it says it's from Cuba.
So it must be from Cuba.
oliver anthony
I should have brought the note with him to give the guy a shout out.
That's my fault.
But he's a cool guy.
joe rogan
Well, hey, cool guy.
Thanks for the cigars.
I hope you're not poisoning me, bro.
We're gonna find out shortly here.
These are supposedly the real ones from Cuba.
But you know how hard that is to get?
Is it?
Yeah, there's a lot of fake ones.
It's one of those things where, for whatever reason...
oliver anthony
How do you tell the difference?
I don't know.
joe rogan
I'm not a cigar aficionado.
I like cigars.
I can't even open a box.
I suck.
I'm not a...
I like them, but I don't know jack shit about them.
Like my friend Bobby Kelly, he knows a lot about cigars.
He can tell you all that shit, and he can answer all these questions.
But I know the good ones.
They just taste good.
And they feel good.
Like there's something about, you piece of shit.
oliver anthony
Sorry we should have done this.
joe rogan
It's okay.
unidentified
I'm trying to figure out what I'm doing wrong.
joe rogan
I'm just trying to slice open this little cover with my sweaty hands.
Come on, bitch.
God damn it.
This is hilarious.
Maybe he set us up.
Yeah, maybe he did.
Maybe it's a bomb.
Maybe it is.
He's given us a bomb.
Maybe it's a sign.
oliver anthony
Yeah, maybe it's a sign that we...
joe rogan
I'm trying to preserve the looks of this box.
I'm out the window.
oliver anthony
Oh, I'm not worried about that.
joe rogan
Yeah, but everybody likes boxes.
In the cigar world, people like, they like the whole thing behind it.
They like cutting the cigar and smelling it, and they like knowing that it came from someone's hands.
And it's just hilarious.
oliver anthony
They like the experience of it?
joe rogan
Yeah, I don't know why I can't get into this box.
This is brutal.
It appears that this is a fake box.
oliver anthony
We'll have to plan that out better next time.
joe rogan
Yeah, man.
For real.
Let me give this to Jamie.
unidentified
He'll figure it out.
jamie vernon
I think I see the seal in a different spot.
joe rogan
Do you?
jamie vernon
I think the top flips up.
joe rogan
Oh, you're right.
God damn it.
That's hilarious.
That's how dumb I am.
How do I not know this?
It's up here.
unidentified
So these bitches need to cut it along this way.
joe rogan
I thought there's a line in it, and I thought that that line was the seal.
oliver anthony
This will be like a perfect YouTube short of us trying to get the box open.
joe rogan
No, it'll take too long.
jamie vernon
It's not short anymore.
joe rogan
It's not short.
This is way too long.
This is pathetic.
Come on, bitch.
jamie vernon
Maybe they've been packaged away for 50 years.
joe rogan
No, these can't be that old.
oliver anthony
There you go.
Look at that.
Awesome.
joe rogan
Bro, I split the box.
This bitch does not want to open.
jamie vernon
Is that the wrong side?
joe rogan
I don't know.
unidentified
It isn't anymore.
Now it's the right side.
joe rogan
There we go.
oliver anthony
Oh, look.
There you go.
jamie vernon
It's the wrong side.
joe rogan
Jesus Christ.
oliver anthony
Beautiful.
Awesome.
joe rogan
Alright, smell that.
That's what you gotta do.
You gotta smell them.
This is what they do.
They take them, they put them by their nose.
That smells good.
oliver anthony
Look at that.
joe rogan
Now we're gonna have to find out if these are fake.
jamie vernon
How do you know?
unidentified
Um...
joe rogan
Bill Burr says you just know.
You know, I got some real ones.
Yeah, you fucking know.
oliver anthony
Are you supposed to leave this on or slide this off?
joe rogan
That's personal preference.
A lot of people leave them on.
Let's slide them off.
They seem a little ostentatious.
A little ridiculous.
For a regular guy like yourself?
oliver anthony
Yeah, for Joe Schmel like me.
joe rogan
Now, real cigar people, you're going to have to do that by yourself because you've got to kind of suck on it while you're doing that.
Real cigar people will tell you what you're really supposed to do before you even suck on it.
oliver anthony
That's fancy.
joe rogan
Is roll the flames around the end.
So you should probably do it correctly because I didn't.
They'll get mad.
Yeah, you do that.
You get it a little cooked.
oliver anthony
Kind of get it a little burned up.
joe rogan
Get it a little cooked.
There you go.
Now, put it in your mouth and light it and suck on it at the same time.
And then you get a nice, nice bowl.
oliver anthony
Yeah, I feel like I need to get some bull horns for the hood of my truck now.
joe rogan
Bro, these might be legit.
Can I see that?
unidentified
Here we go These are good You think they're good?
oliver anthony
I mean, they seem good to me, but I wouldn't know the difference.
joe rogan
Yeah, like I said, I'm not an expert.
I don't even know how to open a box.
But, um...
They're good in that they're smooth.
They're very smooth.
So if it really is from Cuba.
There's only like, it's a very small area where they grow these Cuban cigars.
What is it called?
Abalto Viejo Abalta or something like that?
What is the area of Cuba?
But it's a very, like, surprisingly small area where they grow the best cigars.
And it's just something about the soil that makes, and the climate and everything's perfect.
But they grow really good cigars in Nicaragua.
They grow really good cigars in the Dominican Republic.
It's kind of now, it's like...
oliver anthony
It's funny because I've never really been interested in the cigars, but you know who?
One of my favorite guys on YouTube is Dry Creek Wrangler School.
I don't know if you've watched that guy.
joe rogan
Yeah, I have watched that guy.
oliver anthony
I love watching him, and he's kind of gotten me interested in trying him out.
joe rogan
Well, now you're trying him.
Vuelta?
How do you say that?
Vuelta?
Vuelta Abajo.
That's the area.
So that one area just has bomb ass soil.
And they figured out a long time ago they grow the dopest cigars there.
Do you know that when the embargo happened with Cuba, JFK ordered a shit ton of cigars before the embargo?
What a dirty bird.
oliver anthony
He knew.
joe rogan
What a dirty bird.
Even the one guy that we love the most, that was his insider trading.
That dirty bird.
He went out and got like, how many boxes did he get?
jamie vernon
1,200 cigars.
joe rogan
1,200 cigars.
1,200.
I know that there was like an auction at one point in time for his humidor.
I think it actually still had some of his cigars.
See if you can find that.
Maybe I'm imagining that.
jamie vernon
Humidor auction pops up.
joe rogan
JFK Humidor option?
jamie vernon
2017 that went on sale.
That's right.
$575,000.
oliver anthony
Dude.
joe rogan
Imagine what a baller you have to be to be sitting there with your tiger dick tea, smoking rhino horn.
What other things do you have, like a thousand-year-old bottle of wine?
oliver anthony
If I hold onto my boots long enough, maybe that's what they'll sell for a hundred years from now.
joe rogan
No, you have to keep them, man.
You have to just get them resold.
Come on, man.
You already broke in the best part.
If you can get a good pair of boots and break them in.
My favorite boots are made by this company, Origin.
This is a company that Jocko is a part of.
And they make everything American-made.
The factories in Maine, everything.
The leather, the cloth, the threads, everything.
And they make handmade boots, handmade jeans, jiu-jitsu gear, hunting gear.
It's fucking awesome.
It's all under Jocko's leadership and Pete, the other guy who runs it.
oliver anthony
I'm excited.
I hope to meet Jocko one day.
He's another YouTube guy.
joe rogan
I'd love to do that.
oliver anthony
I'd love to go do a hunt or something like that.
That'd be pretty cool.
joe rogan
Have you hunted before?
oliver anthony
Yeah, well, that's what a lot of guys in the comments were saying on the Richmond North of Richmond video.
They're like, I don't think that tree stand is going to be We're very good this year with all that screaming and shouting y'all were doing it out there.
Yeah, I hunt on my land and I let people come in and hunt it.
I don't run dogs or anything, but that's real popular in Virginia, so we'll do our thing at early season and then we let the club come in and run dogs at the end of the year.
You know, that's very controversial in Virginia.
There's like...
You want to talk about Coke and Pepsi politics, that's definitely part of it.
People are very opposed to running dogs, and you've got some guys that it's such a long tradition.
Those two clash together.
But as far as any of the big game, like the stuff we were checking out, I'd love to experience that once.
joe rogan
That'd be crazy.
So do you use dogs to catch deer?
oliver anthony
They run the deer.
joe rogan
They run the deer.
oliver anthony
They use them just to get the deer moving, which, again, I don't know enough about it one way or the other.
But Virginia's got a really healthy deer population, all things considered.
joe rogan
I just think people think it's cruel.
People think it's cruel when they do that with mountain lions, too.
But I was trying to explain to something, listen to somebody, if you don't do that, you don't get mountain lions.
You're not going to find them.
They know you are coming long before you have any idea they're there and they're gone.
And they're smart.
oliver anthony
See, I don't know if I'd want to kill a mountain lion.
I think I just want to, like...
See, this is one thing people give me hell about, but, like, we've got...
On my property, we've got coyotes and bear and bobcat, and we get them on camera a lot.
Like, there's a huge bear we kept getting June and July.
I was like, man, I don't think I'd want to shoot him.
I think I'd want to just admire him and let him go.
I don't know.
Like, I'm just funny about that.
Like...
joe rogan
Well, there's nothing wrong with not wanting to shoot an animal, you know, and if you don't want to shoot a bear.
Look, I've eaten bear.
I've hunted bear.
Bear tastes good.
You can eat bear, but it's not my favorite thing to eat.
It's not, but it is also an animal that has to be managed.
The thing about biological management, this is the uncomfortable truth of it, you have to have a balance.
There's wildlife biologists, they observe populations, and they want to enact some sort of a balance of predator and prey.
And when you have an overabundance of predators in areas that are, like when you have hunting that's off limits, you create a really dangerous imbalance.
And they did that in all places in New Jersey.
The governor of New Jersey ran on this platform of stopping the bear hunt in New Jersey because a lot of people in New Jersey they live in urban environments like Newark and you know like Hackensack and like that's where the population is and like we don't want you vote I mean voting to kill bears why would you kill bears what they don't understand is like rural New Jersey has the highest bear per capita in the country.
There's more black bears in New Jersey than any other state.
Which is so nuts, per capita.
oliver anthony
I wonder why that is.
joe rogan
Because they're fucking everywhere there, and there's not a lot of hunting.
So they had a bear season, and this governor came in and stopped it.
It was part of the things that he ran on.
And then when he got into office, he realized after a while, like, oh my god, we have to kill these bears, because human-bear interactions are growing up.
A kid at Rutgers got killed by a fucking bear.
He was out in the woods near the campus, and he got fucking slaughtered.
oliver anthony
See, I always wonder if I'm going to get...
I think the bobcats psych me out more than anything.
I always...
The bear, I'm okay with.
Like, I feel like they'll leave me well enough alone, but...
joe rogan
Until they don't.
oliver anthony
I remember even when I first bought the place, like, right after I closed on it, because I'd had...
My house before that, I had a house with five acres and, like, had the little homestead thing going, and we had, like, you know, some basic stuff, horses and chickens and...
Well, that's cool.
But I knew I wanted more land, and with the way everything is, like...
They're not making any more of it.
So I said, I'll go ahead.
And that caused a lot of controversy with my better half and I because she thought I was crazy that I was selling our comfortable house we're living in to go buy a land and stick a freaking camper on it until we can afford to build something.
But man, I remember my first weekend, it was Memorial Day weekend of 2019. It was like the first time I slept out there.
I knew what a coyote was, but I'd never heard a bobcat at night.
It was me and the dogs, and we were tent camping out there, and it was like 2 in the morning.
It was a bobcat right on us, doing the noise they make.
joe rogan
What is the noise like?
oliver anthony
Sounds like a demented baby crying.
I don't know.
It'd be cool to hear if people haven't heard it.
We ended up leaving in the middle of the night because my dogs wouldn't stop barking.
The bobcats are the only thing out there that really freaks me out, like one of them jumping on you.
joe rogan
I don't think they attack people, though.
Let me hear this shit.
unidentified
Whoa.
oliver anthony
It sounds a lot wilder than that.
Let me get it going.
joe rogan
They live up to 12 years in the wild.
oliver anthony
Yeah, that.
joe rogan
Jesus Christ.
jamie vernon
Whoa.
joe rogan
I saw lynx once in Canada.
It's fucking cool.
It's just weird to see some wild cat up in Alberta in the woods.
I was like, whoa, that thing is fucking cool.
They have cool paws to get around the snow.
It's just wild that there's a cat up there.
When you think about cats, at least I do, I always think about warm environments, like tropical cats.
oliver anthony
I'm excited to...
joe rogan
What is this one?
Bobcat attacks coyote?
Oh, jeez.
jamie vernon
I stopped it before I saw it.
It ran away.
I thought you got him.
joe rogan
Whoa, try to get him.
Wow, bobcats try to kill coyotes.
jamie vernon
He's just hiding in the fucking grass.
joe rogan
Look at him.
unidentified
Look at that little killer.
joe rogan
He's just trying to kill anything he can.
Imagine having instincts like that.
Everything that comes close to you, you want to eat?
That's a cat.
You know?
oliver anthony
That's one thing I am excited with the opportunity I've been given with all this is I do want to travel more and get out into nature and different places.
This is my first time on the...
I've never left the East Coast.
joe rogan
Oh, really?
oliver anthony
This is my first time in Texas, but this is my...
unidentified
Holy shit!
oliver anthony
This is my first time any farther west than...
I think the farthest west I've ever been is Tennessee, so I'd love to go.
And I don't know what'll happen with me next year.
Everybody wants to pull me in 10 different directions, but I've always just been drawn to nature and being connected to it.
I'm sure we'll do some big shows and we'll do some things next year, but my heart is just pulling me.
I'm just excited to go experience...
The first time I go to Wyoming and stuff, that's going to be it for me.
Just getting to see that experience.
I've seen it on the internet.
It's pretty stunning.
I've watched all these videos in Canada.
One of my favorite YouTubers is Camping with Steve.
It drives my wife crazy.
Anytime we want to watch something at night, I always want to watch camping with Steve, but he's a guy up in Canada, and he goes and does all these obscure different types of camps, different places, but just some of the area he explores up there in Canada is just awesome.
I've got to try it out for myself.
joe rogan
Wilderness like that, when you're looking at mountains and stuff like that, it's some kind of medicine for the human mind.
It's something about the awe-inspiring beauty of it and just the vastness of it.
It sets you at ease in some strange way.
It also is very lonely.
It's weird because you realize, oh, I'm not important at all.
unidentified
When you're out there in the woods, you're like, Yeah, well, you realize, like...
oliver anthony
Yeah, and maybe that's part of what I was trying to convey earlier in my words, too.
But it's like you realize that, yeah, there's...
Whatever problems and issues you've...
In your mind have sort of perceived to be top-ranking, like, they really are irrelevant, you know?
joe rogan
Yeah, they really are irrelevant.
oliver anthony
In the bigger scheme of things, like...
It's a beautiful thing when you can...
Because you find...
You really find peace in that.
unidentified
But...
oliver anthony
Yeah, there's something about being out in nature.
I don't know.
Like, I've read all these things about...
You know, there's this whole kind of hippie spiritual side to being out in nature, but there really is something just very peaceful about it.
And I found that even on my property, being able to just be out there in the woods just helped me tremendously with everything.
You know, I've been reading about these different...
These different healing centers and camps and things that they're using for people that are just getting out of rehab centers or PTSD or whatever.
They have some of these non-profit organizations where they take people out into that environment.
They found a lot of benefit in it for people.
I'm looking forward to getting the experience in different parts of the country.
Even outside of the country.
I think if I get anything out of this, if there's anything I'm really excited about, it's just getting to camp different places.
joe rogan
That's cool, man.
That's a beautiful thing to look forward to.
That's smart.
You've got your head on right.
This is going to be fun for you, dude.
You're going to have a good time.
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
You're going to have a good job.
You're already making the right decisions.
oliver anthony
I'm having a good time now, so this is cool.
joe rogan
It's crazy overwhelming, I'm sure.
I mean, I can't imagine what it's like to be you.
I got a nice slow trickle of fame.
Yeah.
I got like snake venom.
You get a little bit more all the time, tolerate a little bit more, and you get to a point you can still be yourself.
That's where it gets weird.
You're just going to get a lot of people pulling at you.
But you don't have to listen.
oliver anthony
There's been a lot of good people come out of the woodwork, like big names.
joe rogan
That's got to be cool.
oliver anthony
People that have given me very good...
I don't want to say his name on here and disrupt his privacy, but there's one guy in particular that...
Well, everybody's seen me meet him at one point, if that gives you a hint at all, but he's just a really good dude.
joe rogan
I didn't see you meet anybody.
oliver anthony
Yeah, one of the shows, you know?
joe rogan
A show?
oliver anthony
Yeah.
joe rogan
At one of the shows?
Is that what you're saying?
At one of your shows?
You talking about Jamie Johnson?
oliver anthony
No, yeah, I can't say any names, but he's been a...
Yeah, he's just a...
He's everything you think he is, but he's just been a big help.
joe rogan
That's awesome.
oliver anthony
Like, almost kind of a...
I don't know if you'd want to say a father figure in the industry, but there's been some very good-hearted people.
joe rogan
Mentor.
oliver anthony
Despite all the craziness and all the people that have come out just clawing at me like that movie we were talking about at the beginning, there's been a lot of that.
There's also been a lot of just really down-to-earth people that just have the interest of me trying to preserve whatever it is I've created here and turn it into something To help me, keep me on the train tracks.
You know, it's just a while.
It has been a while, a couple weeks, but like I said, it's been a lot of fun.
joe rogan
You're handling it really well.
You are.
And you're handling the controversy and the criticism and the hit pieces.
You're handling it all.
oliver anthony
I love it.
joe rogan
Yeah, just leave it alone.
Let them talk.
They don't even realize they're working for you.
They're just making you more popular.
oliver anthony
Well, the thing is, yeah, I see a lot of the negative stuff online, but man, if you read through my emails and my social media messages and the people I've talked to on the street, there's no question that the majority of people perceive it in the way that I hoped that it would be perceived.
joe rogan
Yeah, no question.
No question.
You don't have to think about that.
No matter what you do, you can't make everybody happy.
No matter what you do, no matter who...
There's always going to be people that don't like it.
It's in everything.
In music, in comedy, in literature, in films.
There's always going to be people that don't like things you like.
There's always going to be people, and that's okay.
That's okay.
Just don't have to read it.
Like, the thing is about your...
things that people are gonna write about you now, like, you don't want to, like, inject that negativity into your mind.
So just don't read it.
You don't have to read it.
Like, it's...
So they don't, like, you said this, or they think you said of that, should have done this instead of that.
oliver anthony
Oh, yeah, no.
joe rogan
Shut up.
oliver anthony
Yeah, it's funny, though.
joe rogan
Like, I... But they're allowed to do that, too.
That's their job.
oliver anthony
That's their job, yeah.
And that's what I've said even with people at certain organizations that I strongly disagree with that have reached out trying to do interviews or even some of the people that have come out with the hit pieces and all.
I'm like, look, I respect what you're trying to do.
Same way with the people in the music industry that have approached me.
It's like, I don't necessarily want to work with your organization, but I respect you for what you're doing.
I mean, they're just trying to earn an income just like anybody else, you know?
joe rogan
And they're stuck in a system.
oliver anthony
Everybody's got a boss.
joe rogan
If you're doing a show on CNN, you're in a system.
That's what you're doing.
You work for a system.
There's no way around that.
You are part of a gigantic corporation that has a very specific kind of news that it does, and you're told how you're supposed to do this, and you're hired accordingly, and you know what your job is.
It's not it's not you representing you and I think what your music one of the reasons why I represented or what why resonated rather with people is because it represents them It represents humans like a real human being this isn't just some bullshit hit written by AI right is a real human why don't I read on the internet that it was a You probably could but I don't think you'd put the fudge rounds in there Yeah,
that doesn't seem like a I would be that creative It made those things rhyme It's a it's funny that that was one that was the most controversial.
oliver anthony
I really thought when I because it's funny like to just I guess if I just to tell the story about the song and how it was written it was like I had the first again this that song to me we weren't even I was I didn't even want to record that song when Draven from Radio WV came down he had hit me up on a Thursday about coming to do the recording And,
um, I'd watched a lot of Radio WV, like, um, Logan Halstead and a few of the, Nolan Taylor, like, those guys are just, they're some of my recent favorites, and they were all sort of debuted on his channel, and so I've been watching them for years, and, um...
A guy on TikTok got me in contact with him, and so he called me on a Thursday.
He wanted to come that Saturday and record, and I only had the first half of Richmond North of Richmond even written.
It was on my TikTok.
I was sitting in my bathroom, like, just half-heartedly singing through the...
I didn't even know if I was going to...
When stuff comes in my head, a lot of times I would just post part of it online, just like...
To get it out there, you know, very casually.
And everybody in the comments was like, oh, you gotta finish this one, whatever.
And then Draven was insistent that we needed to do that song because I didn't...
My top song in my head was Ain't Got A Dollar.
Ain't Got A Dollar and I Want To Go Home are like two of my favorites.
So I just threw the rest of the song together.
I finished it the day...
We recorded it around 6.30 on a Saturday and I had had the song finished at like 3 o'clock on a Saturday.
So it was very thrown together.
Had no idea that was going to be the one...
And Alex, I was a little reluctant to even record it because I was like, I'm not really an anthem song kind of guy.
A lot of my other songs are different than that.
So, I mean, I'm glad he had the insight to tell me to do it.
But, yeah, it's just kind of funny the way it was thrown together.
But really, I thought when we uploaded the song, I thought the controversy in it was going to be more around the first line and the second verse than anything.
About miners on an island somewhere, like I thought that was gonna be...
joe rogan
Well that one people got upset about too.
oliver anthony
I thought that was the one.
joe rogan
What's interesting is, people on the left got upset about that one.
Like why is he talking about miners on an island?
Why wouldn't you be talking about it?
That's a real thing.
That's horrible.
Like why would that be a thing that's controversial to sing about?
And why would it be like something that left-wing people would be upset about?
Like what?
What happened?
oliver anthony
I've seen it happen.
A lot of people like I Want to Go Home.
I've seen that one's got some million views on it and that's awesome.
Richmond, North of Richmond isn't really even my favorite pick.
I'll get a better version uploaded of it at some point.
Right now it's just off my phone.
I'd say my favorite song that talks about class and politics and the world and the way I perceive it is probably Dog on It.
Dog on it's probably my favorite out of any of them.
So I'm excited to get those songs released in a more professional format the way Richmond or the Richmond is.
I've got notebooks just full of stuff written down.
So I've got a lot of ideas of new songs that I want to work on.
So I'm really excited to get...
It's good that we did this interview and that we got to get on here and talk, but I don't want to talk a whole lot anymore, I don't think.
joe rogan
You don't have to.
oliver anthony
I'm not a talker.
I'm a writer, and so I hope moving forward that I'll just be able to communicate with people just through music and not worry so much about doing interviews and stuff like that.
joe rogan
Well, I think you made an excellent account of yourself.
People are going to understand who you really are, and it's a cool story.
It's fun.
I think more people are going to be behind you now than even before.
They'll get a sense of this is a magical thing for you, and it's beautiful.
And if it can happen to you, if you can pursue a dream and do this, other people can do things that are very similar.
oliver anthony
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, if there is a message to get out of all of this, it's just that you don't need anybody to do what it is you want to do.
Like, I'm just a guy that wrote some songs.
I recorded them on my phone.
I uploaded them through DistroKid, and like, here I am.
am and um it doesn't matter what your pursuit is like you don't need some big industry fancy schmanchy whatever to back you up to do it you just want you just got to go do it you know and i think there's so many people that are like and i know people like that that are very good at things but they say oh i'm not good and like the the fear holds a lot of people back from being successful you Your fear of failure will keep you from being successful all day long.
So I hope that if anything resonates out of this, it's that.
Just do what you want to do and don't worry about if people are going to like it or not.
They probably are.
joe rogan
And if they don't, make something better.
Go back and try again.
oliver anthony
Yeah, who cares if they don't?
joe rogan
Well, hey, brother, thank you very much for coming in here.
Congratulations on everything.
Enjoy the ride.
You're going to be fine.
oliver anthony
Yeah, no, it's fun.
joe rogan
We'll do it again in a couple years.
oliver anthony
Yeah, that sounds good.
joe rogan
All right.
Sounds good, brother.
Good luck to you.
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