May 22, 2018 - The Joe Rogan Experience
02:32:35
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| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| Four, three, two, one. | ||
| Robin Black, ladies and gentlemen. | ||
| What's up, buddy? | ||
| Hey, man. | ||
| It's great to see you. | ||
| Are you fresh back from Singapore? | ||
| I am. | ||
| Yeah, I was in Singapore like 48 hours ago. | ||
| Did they make that special shiny silver one for you? | ||
| Because that looks like that's designed for you. | ||
| No, I mean, yeah, it does kind of look like it's designed for me, which is why I wanted it. | ||
| Yeah, it's a rock and roll one championship, one FC championship. | ||
| So what's it like over there, man? | ||
| So let me explain to everybody. | ||
| One FC is like the Asian version of the UFC. It's a gigantic organization that has been going on for how long now? | ||
| 2011. So solid seven years and really high-level fights over there. | ||
| Amazing, amazing fights. | ||
| Singapore itself is... | ||
| Is wild. | ||
| So I went over there to chat with them. | ||
| So Chatri Sityatong runs it. | ||
| And he and I had been chatting. | ||
| And I love kind of how they see martial arts. | ||
| So they don't call it even FC anymore. | ||
| It's just one championship. | ||
| They don't even use the word fighting, really. | ||
| It's martial arts. | ||
| And the way I see it and the way I study martial arts and share it is an art form. | ||
| Like painting or yoga or, you know, things of that nature. | ||
| Less spectacle. | ||
| That's always how I've seen it and always how I love it. | ||
| And that's how they see it. | ||
| And that's how they present it. | ||
| And it's presented from this sort of inspirational, own your history kind of way in Asia. | ||
| And that was what attracted me to them right away. | ||
| I mean, it's definitely an art form. | ||
| It's values-based. | ||
| Like, they're kind of seeking to inspire people through these athletes and artists. | ||
| It's pretty fucking cool. | ||
| Really? | ||
| So what's motivating them to take this sort of radical approach? | ||
| So it's wild that you say that because to me this is the approach. | ||
| So I think what we do or the way that we present it in North America is radical. | ||
| I think martial arts is an art form. | ||
| Martial arts is this inspiring thing. | ||
| I mean, you take, say for example, Aung Laun Sung. | ||
| He is their 185 pound and 205 pound champion. | ||
| He's from Myanmar. | ||
| They have never had a world champion in any sport ever in their history. | ||
| I don't think they've had a gold medalist in the Olympics. | ||
| They've never had that. | ||
| This guy's a two-division champion. | ||
| And when I talked to Chhatri about it, and he was talking sort of about why he sees it this way and why he's proud to present it this way, he's like, he knows without question that there are kids, and he won his 205-pound title in Myanmar, in a stadium in Myanmar. | ||
| And he said he knows without question there's a kid in there going to become a lawyer one day because of that. | ||
| And they can feel it, and it's real. | ||
| It's not like a marketing strategy. | ||
| Like, this is how they see martial arts. | ||
| And it's how martial arts is viewed in Asia. | ||
| Martial arts, I get to travel so much now. | ||
| It's viewed different in Russia. | ||
| It's viewed different in Brazil. | ||
| How's it viewed in Russia? | ||
| Russia's wild, man. | ||
| I got to work for ACB. You know, ACB, awesome. | ||
| Another big organization. | ||
| Another big organization. | ||
| So in Russia, it's very masculine. | ||
| And it's about victory and about showing your power and your strength. | ||
| And Russia is like that. | ||
| You know, it's a reflection kind of of Russia. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| The martial art thing I absolutely agree with you on, that it is an art form, but I also think it's a fight. | ||
| Like, Gilbert Melendez versus Diego Sanchez. | ||
| That's an art form, but it's a fight. | ||
| That was a fucking wild fight. | ||
| And there's no way that's just art. | ||
| That's art and a fight. | ||
| It's both things. | ||
| But a fight is art. | ||
| It's an expression of who you are. | ||
| It is, in a way. | ||
| It's an expression of your personality, your individuality, your heart, your fearlessness. | ||
| 100%, but it's a fight. | ||
| I'm not scared of the word fight. | ||
| No, I'm not either. | ||
| I like it. | ||
| I like that word. | ||
| But it is an art form. | ||
| Fights are art. | ||
| Yes, definitely. | ||
| Anderson Silva's second fight with Chael Sonnen, the way he landed that knee to the body on the ground, that is just art. | ||
| That's art. | ||
| I mean, if you go back to Lyoto Machida just landing that front kick on Vitor Belfort, that's art. | ||
| Especially for someone who practices martial arts, you see the beauty in that. | ||
| Oh, it's like a flower blossoming or just a sunrise or just something perfect. | ||
| The impossibility of it is what's so beautiful. | ||
| Like, these guys are so unwilling partners, and they have such, like, a desire to accomplish what they want to accomplish. | ||
| To kick that guy in the face from that position. | ||
| Vitor has a lifetime of this. | ||
|
unidentified
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Mm-hmm. | |
| A lifetime of being able to not let you do that. | ||
| And for you to first be willing to be free enough to try it and to express it in that moment, it is definitely art. | ||
| But I'm with you. | ||
| Fight doesn't intimidate me at all. | ||
| A fight is a beautiful thing. | ||
| We fight for things all the time. | ||
| It's a metaphor for life itself when you fight. | ||
| I think people, rightly so, are concerned with the idea of violence against someone who's an unwilling participant. | ||
| And that's how they think of fighting. | ||
| They think of it as this thing that they want nothing to do with. | ||
| They don't want any violence in their life. | ||
| They don't want anybody to hurt them. | ||
| And I completely understand that. | ||
| I understand that position. | ||
| But that's not what it is when it's a competition. | ||
| I mean, it's a tired expression because I've said it too many times, but my perception of what fighting is is high-level problem solving with dire physical consequences. | ||
|
unidentified
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Big time. | |
| And the physical consequences are what make it so special. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| No question. | ||
| The hard times make the good times better. | ||
| And the possibility that bad things can happen to you. | ||
| And do sometimes happen, even to the great ones. | ||
| I mean, you see great fighters have been KO'd and come back, and there's something about that where you realize, like, hey, even Fedor can get knocked out. | ||
| I mean, hey, even Anderson Silva. | ||
| Can play cocky and get caught by that Chris Weidman left hook. | ||
| I mean, this is just the game. | ||
| And, you know, I think in Asia in particular, but there's different pockets of how this is viewed and how the philosophy of connecting to martial arts and fighting is viewed. | ||
| And in Asia, you would see, a certain amount of the fighters would see losing badly It's an opportunity, a chance, because to come back and win again or to come back and show that you're able, you were given the gift of trying and failing. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| I do know what you mean. | ||
| Yeah, that's a great way to approach it. | ||
| It's a great way to look at it. | ||
| You know, I mean, there really is a lesson. | ||
| That the average person can take in their life. | ||
| Like every time a person does have a bad thing happen to them, that terrible feeling is an opportunity to rise from the ashes. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And winning, when you're just winning at everything and things come easily to you, I'm sure it still feels good. | ||
| But when you've gone through really hard times or when you've been challenged by something or you've dropped lower, the high of the success is so much higher. | ||
| It's so much of a longer journey. | ||
| Personally, when we spoke before and when we talked about CM Punk when he was fighting the first time, I was like, this is stupid. | ||
| This guy is pushing, stacking himself into a position to try to not fail by making the challenge so difficult that even if he fails, he don't really. | ||
| But this is fully different now. | ||
| Like now I'm cheering for him because he was humiliated. | ||
| Like he was – he didn't just fail. | ||
| He was humiliated. | ||
| He in front of everybody was shown to be – people would judge him as weak or people – the judgment that he would feel is bad. | ||
| And he said, I'll go do it again. | ||
| He – We are now in a completely different context because that's a guy who epically failed in front of everybody and then dealt with that and now says, I will try the journey again and this will make me a better person. | ||
| And now I fully endorse this. | ||
| I'm cheering for him now. | ||
| Well, he's now fighting a fighter who's commensurate in talent. | ||
| And there's nothing wrong with being a beginner in martial arts. | ||
| But there's something wrong with thinking that you can be a beginner and fight Mickey Gall. | ||
| Big time. | ||
| It was a foolish venture. | ||
| And my approach to it was this is going to be a very good lesson for people that are fans of positive thinking and they think that's enough. | ||
| That shit is not enough. | ||
| If you weigh 110 pounds, you get positive. | ||
| To the bank, Francis Ngannou's still gonna punch your brains out. | ||
| There's just no way around it. | ||
| And a guy who has really very little experience in martial arts and has rudimentary control of his body. | ||
| I mean, that's what I saw when I saw him training. | ||
| When I saw him training, I was like, oh my god. | ||
| He didn't belong there. | ||
| He did not belong there in that context. | ||
| But he belongs here. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And everything's contextual. | ||
| Just because I thought that was stupid, it was stupid. | ||
| It was stupid. | ||
| But that doesn't mean in this context I can't look and go, there's a guy who doesn't need to come back. | ||
| He doesn't need to try again. | ||
| He doesn't need to go into the gym. | ||
| And I've been there. | ||
| You're in the gym and everyone's going, oh man, you did good. | ||
| I didn't do good. | ||
| I fucking failed miserably in front of everybody. | ||
| And then show up there, clean the mats, and work really hard and say, I'm going to try it again. | ||
| And yes, that fight still, him and this guy, still should take place somewhere else. | ||
| 100%. | ||
| It should. | ||
| It shouldn't even be on the Tuesday Night Contender show. | ||
| No. | ||
| No, it shouldn't. | ||
| It should be in some amateur event somewhere. | ||
| That's really what they are. | ||
| They're guys learning how to compete. | ||
| They're in the first fight in the pay-per-view. | ||
| It's fucking crazy. | ||
| But that has nothing to do with them. | ||
| That is a reflection on the company. | ||
| That's a reflection on the choices that the machine makes. | ||
| They probably also gave him a juicy contract in order to make that valid or viable. | ||
| You have to make money off the guy. | ||
| But that, again, I think it makes it deeper and harder and more chances to fail epically And I lost twice in a row and then still wanted to fight again and still because I really wanted to. | ||
| And it was important to me and it meant something to me. | ||
| And I was going to change as a human being by doing it. | ||
| And I was ridiculed. | ||
| I can relate to what he's going through. | ||
| But I did it on a little show in Winnipeg, Manitoba. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| I would never have put myself in that place to look bad. | ||
| But here he is, and here it is, and I'm cheering for him as a human being in a weird situation that has put himself into a deep, dark, hard spot and saying, my way out of this is to try really hard and really go in. | ||
| And the chance, all of that... | ||
| I would want for him, if I knew him and he was my friend, is to fight your way through some adverse situations. | ||
| To be able to be in it and find when it's hard, you discover, yeah, I can handle when it's hard. | ||
| I can get up when I've been dropped, or I can fight through not being able to breathe. | ||
| If he loses and does that, it will have been worth it for him. | ||
| No matter how much ridicule he'll take, it will have been worth it for him. | ||
| What was really weird watching him walk to the cage was that he was approaching it like a pro-wrestling fight. | ||
| Because he had done so many of these pro-wrestling matches that he was walking to the cage with pro-wrestling mannerisms and everything. | ||
| And I was watching this and I did an internal head shake. | ||
| Like, oh, fuck. | ||
| You can't... | ||
| It was a terrible idea. | ||
| On everybody's part. | ||
| Whoever on his side said that he could fight Mickey Gall, you're out of your fucking mind. | ||
| Watch that kid fight once. | ||
| That kid is very good on the ground. | ||
| Very good. | ||
| Big and strong and young. | ||
| Stand-up's not bad either. | ||
| You know, and he's tough as shit, and he's smart, he's clever, and he's mean. | ||
| He's a mean fucker. | ||
| And that is, at that stage, he was maybe 1-0, I think, or maybe 2, but it's still the lowest level that there is in the entire elite world of fighting. | ||
| It didn't matter. | ||
| It was the way he won. | ||
| Like, you saw it. | ||
| You saw the way he took that guy's back, and the way he sinks hooks in. | ||
| And when he was on top, and just delivered with like, yeah. | ||
| But that's how it... | ||
| And you're 100% right. | ||
| If somebody's watching that, that is the reality of thinking, I'll put myself in a situation that I can't win, but I've got guts and heart and I believe I'm going to do it. | ||
| You get the metaphorical version of that punch in the face if you go through life like that. | ||
| Yes, you do. | ||
| And you know what? | ||
| You shouldn't do it in fighting because you don't want those punches in the face if you can't avoid them. | ||
| If you're in a situation where you want to prove your toughness and you want to battle it against someone who's of your skill level and try to figure your way through the maze of this contest, that makes sense. | ||
| What doesn't make sense is getting punched in the face unnecessarily. | ||
| And when you fight, in my opinion, when I looked at that fight, I was like, Mickey Gall's gonna smash him. | ||
| This is just how it's going to go. | ||
| There's very few fights where I can tell you this is absolutely gonna happen. | ||
| Like, here's a perfect example. | ||
| Rafael Dos Anjos against Colby Covington. | ||
| I don't know what the fuck's going to happen. | ||
| No idea. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| They're going to get in there. | ||
| They're going to throw down. | ||
| Let's see. | ||
|
unidentified
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Let's see. | |
| Mickey Gall versus, you know, I forgot. | ||
| CM Punk. | ||
| What's his real name? | ||
| Phil... | ||
| Jackson? | ||
|
unidentified
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No. | |
| Hartman? | ||
| What's his fucking name? | ||
| Phil... | ||
| Whatever. | ||
| CM Punk. | ||
| What is it? | ||
| Jamie? | ||
|
unidentified
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Brooks? | |
| Brooks. | ||
| Brooks. | ||
| Phil Brooks. | ||
| Sorry, Phil. | ||
| I was like, well, this is a terrible idea, because he's just going to get... | ||
| You can only get punched in the face so many times in your life. | ||
| You have a number. | ||
| Whatever the number is, everybody's different. | ||
| Mark Hunt's number seems to be extraordinarily high. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| There's some people that could just take it. | ||
| It's true. | ||
| But, you know, you don't want it when you can't avoid it. | ||
| And he's not going to avoid it in that fight. | ||
| He's going to get smashed. | ||
| Unless Mickey caught a crazy arm bar early in the fight, and that was what he gave him. | ||
| Other than that, he's getting his face smashed in. | ||
| And you should not do that if you don't have to. | ||
| I remember when we spoke about it, it's unconscious incompetence. | ||
| And that, if you don't know what you don't know, like... | ||
| It's a really fucking weird place to be. | ||
| And we go through life that way a lot of times in a lot of different contexts until you find out, you know, conscious incompetence. | ||
| We're like, oh, fuck, I don't know anything about this. | ||
| He wasn't even at that point. | ||
| Now he's at that point and he has a lower level thing. | ||
| And, you know, it was a mistake to start down this road, but you're down it now. | ||
| You're on it now. | ||
| I guess. | ||
| It seems to me that, I mean, he's taken, what, two years since that fight? | ||
| Has it been about two years? | ||
| He's getting there, yeah. | ||
| And we've subsequently got to see Mickey Gall in some contests against some really tough guys and beat them. | ||
| Yeah, beat some good guys. | ||
| And we got to see, like, okay, this kid is fucking for real, which is what we suspected all along. | ||
| But we don't know anything about Phil. | ||
| We haven't seen him spar, we haven't seen him train, but from what I saw... | ||
| When I first saw him training, when I first saw him sparring and moving around, I was like, God damn, there's a lot of work to be done. | ||
| First steps of Everest work to be done. | ||
| We're not talking about a guy who has a deep background in martial arts, like Brock Lesnar. | ||
| Wrestling is absolutely a martial art. | ||
| He was a legit top-of-the-food-chain amateur wrestler. | ||
| He was a fucking monster. | ||
| And a physical monster. | ||
| And a psychological monster. | ||
| Fighting is skills, for sure, but it's your body and it's your mind. | ||
| And when you are a heavy competitor, when you focus, when you're able to focus in the deepest, most fearful conditions, Brock Lesnar did that. | ||
| Physically, when you're aware, like you said, when you're aware of where your body is in space and how to control it, that can take a lifetime. | ||
| So it's a weird one. | ||
| I think it's something you also develop as a child, as a young kid. | ||
| When you're in your developmental years, 13, 14, 15, your body's growing, and it's growing into whipping kicks and punches and shooting takedowns and landing chokes, your body develops that way. | ||
| When you're a full-grown man in your 30s, and then you're starting to throw roundhouse kicks and front kicks, and your body's all goofy and shit and doesn't want to listen right, it's not pliable, it's not elastic, you're a different animal. | ||
| You can... | ||
| Still learn anything. | ||
| At 50 years old, you can take up anything in the world. | ||
| You can take up anything, and you should. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah, you should. | |
| But you shouldn't, you know, go in the NFL with it. | ||
| Or if you start playing piano when you're 50, you should learn to play piano and show all your friends that you know the song. | ||
| Right. | ||
| But you can't go, like, you know, be in a concert piano scenario where you're going to fail. | ||
| And doing it and saying, you know, I believe doesn't I agree. | ||
| Yeah, I think it is, too. | ||
| But you can't be a 34-year-old man who's never boxed a day in your life and have a goal to, in 12 months, fight Lomachenko. | ||
| No. | ||
| It's never going to happen. | ||
| If it does happen, it's going to be a disaster. | ||
| And there are giant exceptions. | ||
| One in a million of things where people do things. | ||
| But there's always some other explanation. | ||
| And often it is, as a youth, they created the neural pathways and the physicality and the connection to their body. | ||
| I did gymnastics when I was a kid. | ||
| And I loved it. | ||
| It's a great base. | ||
| Yeah, I loved it. | ||
| And, you know, it helps you physically understand where your body is. | ||
| And so later on in life, I was always at least okay at sports because I understood how to move my body in space. | ||
| And I understood where my hand was compared to my foot and how I balanced. | ||
| And to learn that as a child, somebody who was a master of something as a kid who at 30 picks up another thing and has some really advanced learning abilities, there are exceptions. | ||
| We see rare exceptions, but you're right. | ||
| I mean, reality is still reality. | ||
| I wonder, too, if those exceptions are genetic. | ||
| I wonder if, like, maybe perhaps someone in their family was a great athlete and is transferred through their genes, which I am, as I get older, a firm believer in. | ||
| I just don't think we know enough about what transfers through genes, but there's some freaky shit I see in my kids, in particular, where I go, okay, that is my fucking personality. | ||
| There's something... | ||
| And I'm not teaching her to do this. | ||
| This is something that's in her, like this repetitive exercise, like doing things over and over again obsessively. | ||
| There's some weird shit that I'm like, I wonder if that's a neural pathway that's passed down through the DNA. It just seems like there could be A person who's never engaged in athletics, but maybe their grandfather was like a world champion boxer. | ||
| And then one day they put on the gloves and then they just sort of like start moving around and the coach was like, hey, what the fuck's going on here? | ||
| Where'd you learn how to throw your jab like that? | ||
| I'm forgetting Francis Ngannou's coach's name. | ||
| I forget his name as well. | ||
| Fernand Lopez. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| He's a wonderful guy. | ||
| A smart guy. | ||
| He's been around like the best of the best through Europe. | ||
| And Cameroon to France and these areas. | ||
| And he's seen the best of the best that that genetic crop of humans has to offer. | ||
| And then Francis Ngannou walks into his gym. | ||
| And you talk to – next time you see Fernand, ask him about this because you see his eyes light up. | ||
| Like that thing where there's like a color in the eye and he's like, you know, I just knew. | ||
| Like he said, I watched him do things and his awareness of his body and how he could physically express himself. | ||
| He said he'd just never seen anything like it. | ||
| You know, week one in the gym, he said first sparring session, he didn't really know how to fight yet. | ||
| But he said he saw him adapting and learning within the round against somebody who knew how to fight. | ||
| And you see it in his eyes. | ||
| He literally found a fucking unicorn that just strolled in off the street and came in. | ||
| And then he was like, man, if he has a work ethic, if he is like, you know, if he's passionate about this, if he can commit and learn and all that. | ||
| It goes physically, genetically speaking, this human being, the length of his bones, the speed of his neurology, all of these things, he said, you just knew. | ||
| And you see it in his face. | ||
| You're like, oh, fuck, that must have been wild. | ||
| It must have been wild to experience that when you have a lifetime of seeing athletes. | ||
| Yeah, it's like that scene in The Color of Money. | ||
| I don't know if you ever saw that movie with Paul Newman and Tom Cruise. | ||
| When Paul Newman hears Tom Cruise break the balls for the first time and turns around, he's like... | ||
| What the fuck is going on over here? | ||
| And he looks over and he sees this kid. | ||
| There's certain people that just have this crazy talent and when someone has been around for a long time as a coach and had a bunch of untalented or reasonably talented or very talented people, there's this big stew of humans coming to their gym and you see that one unicorn that steps in. | ||
| And he's also a case where his father, I mean, he didn't have a background in martial arts before he started training, but his father was a great street fighter. | ||
| And it's entirely possible that something was carried on through him. | ||
| Or something was present in both that allowed them both to be capable of doing that. | ||
| Rather than the learn to pass, because we don't know how that passes genetically from behavior. | ||
| We know that genetically we may behave similar to our parents or kids, but we don't know if that came from that. | ||
| But I'm always weirdly uncomfortable... | ||
| Thinking about genetics. | ||
| Why? | ||
| Because I don't like the idea that we're limited by them. | ||
| And I know that we're not on some level. | ||
| But we are. | ||
| But we are. | ||
| You and I are not going to play basketball against LeBron James. | ||
| But if we identify... | ||
| No. | ||
| No, we're not. | ||
| If we do, it's not going to go well. | ||
| True. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| No, there's doubt. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Definitely some truths. | ||
| I mean, I'm five foot six on a tall day. | ||
| Like, that is a genetic limitation that is undeniable. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Right? | ||
| But if we're looking at things and we decide that our genes... | ||
| Have you seen the movie Gattaca? | ||
| Have you ever seen that movie? | ||
| Man, I did see that movie a long time ago. | ||
| That's one of my favorite movies ever. | ||
|
unidentified
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Matt... | |
| What's that little fucker's name? | ||
|
unidentified
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Ethan Hawke. | |
| Ethan Hawke, thank you. | ||
| Ethan Hawke, yeah. | ||
| I always think of him as Uma Thurman. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| She's in it. | ||
| I know, but I think of him as Uma Thurman because he used to be married to her. | ||
| I'm like, oh, that's Uma Thurman. | ||
| That's not Uma Thurman. | ||
| But you know what I mean? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| In that movie, his brother is genetically superior to him. | ||
| But he beats his brother in these swimming contests all the time. | ||
| And at the end, his brother's like, how are you doing this? | ||
| And he said, I never saved anything for the swim back. | ||
| I was just going to swim to the other side. | ||
| And his brother's like, there is no fucking other side. | ||
| But it was a – I know it's a movie. | ||
| But it was a mindset, right? | ||
| And the truth is that – like talent, OK? So you're talented at certain things. | ||
| Jamie's talented at certain things. | ||
| Francis Ngannou is talented. | ||
| Talent multiplied by effort. | ||
| Equals skill. | ||
| Then skill multiplied by effort equals accomplishment. | ||
| So effort counts twice. | ||
| Effort counts fucking twice. | ||
| But then you get effort with a talented guy with freak genetics like a LeBron James or a Michael Jordan or a Brock Lesnar and then you get some crazy results. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Oh, big time. | ||
| And the guy who doesn't have the talent but had effort twice, effort was applied twice, will go as far as the man or woman will go as far as they possibly could. | ||
| They'll actualize their true potential by committing themselves to effort. | ||
| And not going, well, I can't do it, so forget it. | ||
| By applying effort over and over and over again, and then once you've developed talent, more effort to take that talent and do something, that twice-used effort will get you as far as you possibly can. | ||
| If you say, well, I'm not gifted, I'm not talented, so I won't put in any effort, you have no idea how far you can go. | ||
| So I absolutely cannot beat Francis Ngannou. | ||
| But by not thinking that I'm too limited by my genes and continuing to apply effort regardless of my genes, I can get to the best possible place I can as an individual. | ||
| Do you know what I mean? | ||
| So I think that you don't want to go down some road that cannot be accomplished, but you also don't want to not go down roads because you're not genetically predisposed to them. | ||
| I think effort can get you somewhere. | ||
| It definitely can get you somewhere, but I think what we're talking about here is what I love about life is that it's messy. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That there's not... | ||
| It's not one plus one is two. | ||
| There's not zeros and ones. | ||
| It's just there's a bunch of factors. | ||
| There's a lot of shit going on, man. | ||
| And that's why when something magical takes place, when you get a... | ||
| George St. Pierre, or when you get a Mighty Mouse, when you get someone who's like, whoa, look at that. | ||
| There's so many factors that lead you to be Gennady Golovkin. | ||
| There's so many different things have to fall into place. | ||
| Here's a guy, like, how about Michael Bisping? | ||
| Like, Michael Bisping is just one of the toughest motherfuckers ever. | ||
| That's just what he is. | ||
| I just found the perfect example. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But you found the perfect example. | ||
| Yeah, Michael Bisping is one of the toughest motherfuckers ever. | ||
| He's not extraordinarily talented in any one form of MMA. He's not like the fastest guy. | ||
| He's not the strongest guy. | ||
| He doesn't have this great background in Brazilian jiu-jitsu where he's just a world-class strangler and if he gets your back, you're fucked. | ||
| There's none of those things. | ||
| He's just tough as fuck and he's one of the most mentally strong guys. | ||
| Even Tim Kennedy, who was here the other day. | ||
| Tim Kennedy's like, God, I hate to give him a compliment, but he's so fucking tough. | ||
| You can't deny him. | ||
| You can't. | ||
| And that goes right back to this. | ||
| And I think this is at the root of questions about life. | ||
| Was Michael Bisping genetically tough? | ||
| Is he genetically mentally tough? | ||
| Or did he work really hard and just push himself through things? | ||
| And that one day when it got really fucking tough, he didn't give up, which taught him that he shouldn't give up, which taught him to go even further, which made him push himself. | ||
| Or was it, in all likelihood, it's both. | ||
| But Michael Bisping, free of that effort to continue to... | ||
| What's his name? | ||
| Think of the mentally toughest guy that... | ||
| I have a thing with names sometimes. | ||
| Even names I know I'll describe. | ||
| A guy's got a chain and he's howling and he does a power slam, but I can't think of Rampage. | ||
| I can't think of Rampage. | ||
| Big elbows. | ||
| You've had him probably on the podcast. | ||
| Tough, hairy chest. | ||
| Who am I thinking? | ||
| I'm 170 pounds, fought Damien Maia. | ||
| Matt Brown? | ||
| Matt Brown. | ||
| Oh, okay. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Matt Brown. | |
| Okay. | ||
| But that's the example. | ||
| I can literally say all these things, but the name will escape me. | ||
| It's a strange thing. | ||
| Well, it happens to me, too. | ||
| Take some alpha brain. | ||
| It'll help you. | ||
| It's also early in the morning. | ||
| Yeah, right. | ||
| I worked with John Ramdean for years, one of my best friends, and He would literally just see it in my eyes. | ||
| He's like, I won't have the name and I'll throw out one or two of those factoids and he always had it. | ||
| He'd be like Matt Brown. | ||
| That's why having good friends to work with is great. | ||
| They know your paths. | ||
| Yeah, but talking to Matt Brown on the phone, doing an interview with him, I said, you're one of the mentally toughest guys there is. | ||
| And he said, I don't think I am. | ||
| If I think I'm mentally tough for one moment, I will not do all of the things necessary to walk in mentally tough. | ||
| He said, he's like, I am not mentally tough. | ||
| The mental toughness is a result of all of the hard work and preparation that I have done to be able to do it in that moment. | ||
| And he heard it in his voice. | ||
| He had no doubt that this was so. | ||
| And I think he's right. | ||
| I think he's right. | ||
| I think he's right too, but he's also mentally tough. | ||
| Because he also does those things. | ||
| But one of the things about Matt Brown that separates him is that that guy empties out in the cage. | ||
| He separates himself from the pack because he's so ferocious. | ||
| Like, that guy's ferocious. | ||
| I remember when he stepped into the cage, we were watching. | ||
| I think we were doing a fight companion. | ||
| But we were... | ||
| Maybe we were wearing... | ||
| Anyway, when he stepped into the cage and fought Diego Sanchez, when he stepped into the octagon and screamed and roared, it was literally like an animal. | ||
| I mean, it was ferocity defined. | ||
| And that's just how he fights, man. | ||
| That guy just empties out whatever the fuck he's got. | ||
| He's not holding anything back, man. | ||
| He goes for it. | ||
| And that's why I think when we were talking about fight and art, to me that's an art of human expression. | ||
| Like, I think that is to be capable. | ||
| I mean, whether you're doing jazz or punk rock, it's human expression. | ||
| Whether you're Matt Brown or you're some elegant mover, it's still the same art at its root. | ||
| But you remember that elbow he fired on Diego Sanchez in that fight? | ||
| Like, it was there. | ||
| And these moments are there a lot when you're analyzing fighting and looking at it from that other perspective. | ||
| These fight-ending moments are there. | ||
| They're there way more often than these guys realize. | ||
| But when they spot them, like Matt did in that moment, this is, I have a free shot from an angle. | ||
| Time has slowed down enough that I see it. | ||
| I can see the little red arc of where it's going, and I'm going to end this fight. | ||
| There's a visceral, like... | ||
| It's... | ||
| Here it is right here. | ||
| Oh, look it. | ||
| You see it. | ||
| See? | ||
| Just like... | ||
| That is fucking art to me. | ||
| But watch the left hand, the reach... | ||
| And the hold, and it's like there is no doubt what's happening here. | ||
| There is no doubt what's gonna happen. | ||
| Diego Sanchez is another curious example because he's also a guy who is ferocious, like a ferociously tough guy. | ||
| But there's always been something about his movements that makes him come up short against the best of the best. | ||
| And I mean, you're talking about a guy who's so fucking mentally tough as well. | ||
| Like I always bring his fight against Jake Ellenberger, who is a brutal knockout artist at 170. And Diego really, I mean Diego fought at 145, remember? | ||
| And Diego really is a tweener. | ||
| He's like a little too small for 55. I don't know how the fuck he made it to 145. He basically starved his body away. | ||
| And probably did some irreversible damage, but his movements are always just shy of elite. | ||
| And I've always wondered, what is that? | ||
| It's almost like, even if you see that, go back to that clip again. | ||
| You don't have to. | ||
| It's okay. | ||
| But there's something about even the way he steps. | ||
| He's not stepping the way a T.J. Dillashaw steps. | ||
| You know what I'm saying? | ||
| I see it as his sort of intention. | ||
| He's over-intentioned. | ||
| God, that is so nasty and so perfect. | ||
| But he wants it badly. | ||
| Like, he's over-engaged. | ||
| I think it's psychological as much as anything. | ||
| I was in Albuquerque. | ||
| Look at the placement of the left hand. | ||
| There's just no doubt where this is going. | ||
| Yeah, it's perfect. | ||
| And it is the moment that Matt Brown created. | ||
| Like, he created that moment. | ||
| See? | ||
| Hair and chest. | ||
| That's one of my reminder cues, right? | ||
| So I watched Diego Train in Albuquerque, and I love the guy. | ||
| I was there interviewing Cub, who is my favorite artist probably to watch for many reasons. | ||
| I'm not really sure exactly why. | ||
| People can't tell you why their favorite band is their favorite band, but there are many things I can describe. | ||
| But I was there to interview him for Monster Zim. | ||
| It's a website in South Korea that when I became a freelancer, they were like, we'd like to give you some work. | ||
| I'm like, well, that would be amazing. | ||
| We'd like you to go. | ||
| He just fought Do Whole Choice. | ||
| We'd like you to go interview Mr. Cub Swanson. | ||
| I'm like, this is. | ||
| Badass. | ||
| It's like my favorite fighter. | ||
| They're going to send me to Albuquerque. | ||
| Then I hung out in the gym and analyzed them and watched and made notes about what I could. | ||
| And Diego trained super intense. | ||
| And he like does everything super intense. | ||
| And as much as he loves yoga and at different times yoga and meditation has allowed him to do it differently, that hyper intensity, I think, doesn't allow the sort of soft relaxation that's necessary to really do what you're describing. | ||
| You know? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I know what you're saying. | ||
| Like, one of the things that people don't understand about striking hard and, like, having real power is that you're not fully tense through the entire movement. | ||
| There's a lot of parts of striking where the momentum starts and you're almost, like, completely loose, like, up until instance before the point of contact. | ||
| And then it's bling! | ||
| There's this weird thing that real knockout artists have that you don't see in these fucking super tense windmill guys. | ||
| The windmill guys are too tight. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Totally! | |
| But a guy like Ray Robinson will throw a PAP! There was a Gene Fulmer, Ray Robinson KO clip from the other night. | ||
| I was watching it online. | ||
| I must have watched it like 13 times in a row. | ||
| But you watch him land this, I think it was a left hook. | ||
| But you watch the punch land, you're like, Jesus, like the snap that that guy had. | ||
| But that snap is not, it's not, it's not fully tense. | ||
| Here it is, right here. | ||
| Like look how loose and soft he is. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, supple. | |
| Yeah, soft. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Boom! | |
| Look at that. | ||
| Look at that left hook right there. | ||
| That one softens him up, ties him up. | ||
| But everything is like... | ||
| Oh, he's flowing. | ||
| He's swimming. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, it's just... | ||
| He was an amazing boxer, dude. | ||
| And you're talking about a guy who had like, what, a hundred and something fights, right? | ||
| He's almost gentle, right? | ||
| Like, soft is the right word. | ||
| There's a suppleness. | ||
| There's a calmness. | ||
| There's a relaxation. | ||
| And mentally, too. | ||
| You know that idea of... | ||
| There's a storm going on and in the middle there's this calm area. | ||
| That gentleness, that calmness has to be in your mind to allow you to do this. | ||
| And that's where Diego is... | ||
| Look at that. | ||
| Come on, man. | ||
| Just look at that. | ||
| That's fucking incredible. | ||
| That left hook, right here, here it is. | ||
| Yeah, and even just to create that moment and to see that moment, you know? | ||
| And to set it up and lay traps and see when the guy is moving his hands down, see when he's coming forward, see his patterns and tendencies. | ||
| Or make him do those things. | ||
| Yep, yep, yep. | ||
| But it's that kind of power in that left hook that does not come from... | ||
| No. | ||
| That's just this little twist that he does. | ||
| I'm like, come on, here it is right here in slow-mo. | ||
| Bang! | ||
| And it's his hip. | ||
| I'm sure you saw it, or I think you saw it. | ||
| I did a little breakdown of your kicks. | ||
| I did see that, yeah. | ||
| And that's what I was zooming in on, was this double pulse, and that's real. | ||
| That is the neurology of high athletic performance. | ||
| So I have these friends that I've gathered over the years, and I love what I do, man. | ||
| I'm happy every single day. | ||
| A big part of it is I've met these people that I have these conversations with. | ||
| And sometimes they're very long and deep. | ||
| And I have friends that are a PhD psychologist. | ||
| And this one guy, Dr. Stu McGill, do you know who he is? | ||
| No, I know that name though. | ||
| Yeah, you've probably heard that name. | ||
| I'm sure somebody has mentioned it because you're around different athletic types of all types. | ||
| He is the world's foremost expert in the spinal cord and neurology of athletic performance. | ||
| Spinal cord? | ||
| Yeah, the spinal cord and your neurology and your nerves and how your nervous system. | ||
| And George St. Pierre has worked with him a lot. | ||
| If you ask him about him this week, he would talk about him extensively. | ||
| So Dr. Stu and I became friends. | ||
| And it's a big compliment because he sought me out based on seeing my work. | ||
| And saying, that guy knows some things I want to talk to him, which was a fucking deep compliment to me. | ||
| And now we became friends and we chat all the time. | ||
| And one of the things we constantly talk about is the double pulse neurology. | ||
| And people talk about a fast twitch fiber. | ||
| It's not a fiber. | ||
| That's just terms we've started to hear. | ||
| It's a fast twitch neurology. | ||
| Fastball hitters have it. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| That neurology where you... | ||
| There's a pulse of tension and then a complete relaxation until the pulse of tension again. | ||
| The Bruce Lee's one-inch punch was the simple example of that. | ||
| But that is the neurology of high athletic performance. | ||
| And that's what I zoomed in on when I was looking at your kick because you can see it quite clearly. | ||
| There's the moment, there's the relax, and it ends up being more of a whip. | ||
| And Dr. Stu has all these incredible analogies because he's examined this in so many different angles and layers, which is the beauty of analyzing anything for years. | ||
| And he'll use terms like, you can't shoot a cannon out of a canoe. | ||
| And you think about that, and you're like, of course. | ||
| Because the canoe's all wobbly and shit. | ||
| Yeah, but if it's tense, and then it shoots, or you can't push a rope, right? | ||
| You push a rope, right? | ||
| And so, but you can whip a rope through tension, relaxation, and tension again. | ||
| And that neurology is the neurology of high performance. | ||
| And George, you talk to George about neurology, he'll go deep down some shit, George St. Pierre, because he studied this to understand himself and what he was doing at a high level with Dr. Stu. | ||
| But it is a fascinating thing because we often will say fighting is 90% mental. | ||
| Sipping this cup is 100% mental. | ||
| My brain told my body to reach out and do it. | ||
| My brain made the choice. | ||
| I activated everything. | ||
| It's all your brain. | ||
| Everything. | ||
| And once you get to a high level of performance, you know how to punch and kick and you train like crazy and you make the things happen by themselves almost by training so much they take so little attention and decision making. | ||
| It becomes about maximizing your nervous system. | ||
| How your nervous system. | ||
| And I think that's true of almost anything. | ||
| Is there something he's doing here? | ||
| Oh, there's Dr. Stu right there. | ||
| Who is he training with there? | ||
| George and Dr. Stu. | ||
| Oh, I couldn't see his face. | ||
|
unidentified
|
He looks like a black guy, to be honest. | |
| Who, George? | ||
| So he's got him whipping a ball around? | ||
| Yeah, I'm not sure exactly what he's doing or why there. | ||
| But I'll put you in touch with him often. | ||
| So it looks like he's got some heavy weight at the end of a rope. | ||
| Yeah, and I guess engaging the core through the use of, you know, probably asking him to only engage certain things to counterbalance the movement. | ||
| I'm surprised to see George wearing your typical running shoe when he's training with the thick heel and... | ||
| You know, I'm still surprised to this day when I see, when you talk about neurology and activating muscles and tissues, like there's so many athletes that still train with those big cushy-bottomed running shoes. | ||
| I mean, I think that is crazy. | ||
| Big time. | ||
| It's weird. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| It's weird. | ||
| I mean, you should be doing that kind of shit barefoot, especially a fighter. | ||
| You fight barefoot. | ||
| You should be wearing nothing on your feet. | ||
| The only thing connecting you to a stable surface is your foot. | ||
| I agree 100%. | ||
| Sometimes when we're trying to make sense of these things, we go to multiple different sort of perspectives of it. | ||
| So I'll take what I learned from Dr. Stu, and he's just my friend now as well, so I like hanging out and chatting with him about way out there aspects of these things. | ||
| But you talk to Erwan LaCour as well, who has a different sphere of connecting to this kind of thing. | ||
| And Erwan starts with the foot. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| And you've had Erwan on the... | ||
| Yes. | ||
| And he starts with the foot and everything else. | ||
| It makes sense, right? | ||
| I go to throw a punch and the important part is going to be my foot through the leg, through the hip, through the core and relaxed until the moment that it hits. | ||
| But it all starts with the foot. | ||
| Nick Kurson is the same way. | ||
| When I asked Nick Kurson about training athletes, what's the thing that he thinks fighters should work on the most? | ||
| He's like, foot strength. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Hmm. | |
| I was like, wow. | ||
| And I thought about it. | ||
| I'm like, well, of course, right? | ||
| That's how you push off. | ||
| That's how you move. | ||
| If your feet are weak and they get tired, you can't move well, which I've experienced. | ||
| I'm sure you've experienced. | ||
| When your feet are weak and tired, if you don't run and then you try to run, one of the first things you get tired are your feet. | ||
| The very worst injury I've ever had in my life by far was plantar fasciitis of both feet. | ||
| My last fight. | ||
| And I was through training and everything. | ||
| And then I had my fight in Montreal. | ||
| And the whole strategy was put... | ||
| Getting to a place where I could be safe and use better knowledge of the situation to fatigue the other guy. | ||
| So a lot of the seven or eight minutes of the fight took place with me pressuring him against the fence. | ||
| Just driving off both feet, pressuring against the fence to try to land things or create lines for different weapons. | ||
| And it's only eight minutes, but eight minutes of intense drive from my feet. | ||
| And then we went... | ||
| On vacation the very next day and that night we grabbed margaritas and we walked around the resort and my feet were destroyed for acutely for three or four days like I couldn't walk and the inflammation was so unbelievably bad it was like bricks and even for months after it was really good Did you ice them? | ||
| I tried to ice I would ice or I would get in immediately into the cold pool and spend the day in the cold pool drinking tequila in hopes that it would help and it kind of did I guess Yeah, foot pain is, I mean, that's one of the things that hurt Dominic Cruz in his comeback fight when he fought TJ Dillshaw. | ||
| You notice he was, like, kind of limping a little. | ||
| We were attributing it to the leg kicks. | ||
| He said that's not the case. | ||
| He said what was going on was he had plantar fasciitis because, you know, he had multiple injuries that he was receiving. | ||
| Recovering from during that training camp and when he got knee surgery and he came back from that and he tore his groin he tried to like really ramp up his training he was doing a lot of sprinting and a lot of different things with his feet you know because obviously he's very footwork intensive with his fighting and he fucked his feet up man his feet just weren't in condition to do the kind of stuff that he used to be able to do and the first thing he got was plantar fasciitis Schaub had it too he told me it was one of the worst things he's ever had me too Think of this for | ||
| the big picture meaning of this for Dominic. | ||
| So you got somebody else and they're going about fighting and their career as a martial artist, a competitive fighter, one way. | ||
| And Dominic goes about it a different way. | ||
| And through Dominic's choices, Moving, training, footwork, he avoids a lot of the damage that these guys will take. | ||
| But you can't avoid, something's going to go. | ||
| So instead of getting kicked a lot and punched in the head and taking all those things, the training necessary to make that not happen fucks up something else. | ||
| You can't get away from it. | ||
| You're going to work yourself until your body gives up. | ||
| Even Dom, brilliantly finding a way to work outside of taking the damage that they take, still could not get away from damaging his body. | ||
| TJ Dillashaw vs. | ||
| Cody Garbrandt, the rematch, is one of the most intriguing fights of the year for me. | ||
| I'm really, really curious about that fight because I know those guys were tightly matched in the gym, and I know that Cody cracked him with a big right hand before TJ put him away. | ||
| And he was stunned. | ||
| Yeah, he was stunned. | ||
| He got rocked. | ||
| And I believe when Cody cracked him, it was towards the end of the round. | ||
| He was. | ||
| Yeah, and so he had an opportunity to recover. | ||
| I mean, who knows if he had caught that right hand the first minute of the round, what had gone on. | ||
| But when TJ recovered from that and then landed that head kick and then knocked him out and put him away... | ||
| You got to see, like, what a high-level, high-stakes game these two guys are playing. | ||
| And, you know, TJ has, through Bang Ludwig, has really radically improved his movement, his footwork, his angles, his approach. | ||
| He's so versatile. | ||
| With his ability to switch stances, his ability, I mean, he's constantly cutting angles and striking as he's switching stances, and there's so much information coming at you if you're fighting him. | ||
| Your brain's overloaded if you're not used to that. | ||
| And even the guys who used to train with him, I believe in alpha male, are not used to what he's doing now. | ||
| I agree. | ||
| Because it's at a far higher level. | ||
| That said, Cody still has a fucking missile in his right hand. | ||
| It's so goddamn fast. | ||
| His hand speed is so fast. | ||
| And his fluidity and efficiency in his boxing is so good. | ||
| This is a very, very interesting fight for me. | ||
| That's about as good as it gets right now, like from the raw materials of those guys and the skills that they have. | ||
| But I am definitely with you as far as my deep curiosity of the choices of the coaches. | ||
| And you talk to some of them, different ones. | ||
| I've got a few key friends that I talk to on a very regular basis. | ||
| And so what it will take... | ||
| What we would decide to do to train to make our guy the best or try to be the best in the world in 10 months, if we take a different strategy and we start to build them to be the best in the world in three years, it's a different game. | ||
| And that's what Dwayne's done. | ||
| Dwayne has said, we will, and it's fucking hard work for Dwayne, too. | ||
| Like, that's the thing that people won't necessarily appreciate. | ||
| They'll be like, oh, he's a brilliant coach. | ||
| That's nonstop, constant searching and examining and trial and error and reinterpreting his language of understanding where the chaos is and understanding, you know, can we make this guy believe something's happening or are we too deep in it that he doesn't think that and it fails? | ||
| Like, what levels of misdirection are too deep? | ||
| How good is he? | ||
| And when I talked to them leading up to that one, it was like the conversation was about making Cody believe and anticipate something wrong. | ||
| And that's the root of all combat, right? | ||
| Like you make me think this is coming. | ||
| coming and I do this and you kick me in the body. | ||
| And the layers, the multiple layers, like you just said, overloading the ability to – you're trying to catalog what's coming and how you chunk that, we don't necessarily understand. | ||
| So your brain may be going, "Okay, this is all the stuff from the left, which happens when this happens," or the legs are doing this, or you're running algorithms in I don't know what yours is. | ||
| I don't know how you categorize my threats. | ||
| I don't know whether you categorize anything from my right hand or anything in combination. | ||
| Or if you're watching the patterns of my shoulders, I have no idea. | ||
| So Dwayne and anybody else playing with this concept is trying to figure out how you'll read this and use that against you. | ||
| And to me, that's the layer of complete mind-blowing nature. | ||
| Like, what did you say? | ||
| Chess with dire consequences or problem solving? | ||
| I said high-level problem solving. | ||
| Think of how fucking hard those problems are now. | ||
| How many there are. | ||
| That's the game. | ||
| And it can be done at this level because their skills are so good. | ||
| Their minds are so good. | ||
| They're physically so good. | ||
| They're capable. | ||
| They're fearless. | ||
| They're confident. | ||
| They have all of those raw materials. | ||
| And now we're playing a game that most of us cannot comprehend. | ||
| And they've also sparred countless hours together so they understand each other. | ||
| And they've told each other lies for long periods of time. | ||
| Lies on lies. | ||
| I one time went with... | ||
| I worked for a company called The Score Fighting Series. | ||
| It was a brilliant show. | ||
| Like it was kind of Canada's Bellator. | ||
| Like it was on the same network and they aired Bellator. | ||
| And it was very, very good. | ||
| Developmental league stuff. | ||
| And that company brought in Forrest Griffin... | ||
| And then a bunch of poker players. | ||
| And they were on a train together, and contest winners on the thing got to ride on this train with Forrest Griffin and a bunch of high-level pro poker players. | ||
| And I was there, and that was the first time I met Forrest, and he's a killer smart dude. | ||
| But you watch these poker players who are all riding together, and they all know each other, and they are just telling each other lies all the time, trying to tell stories about things that represent the fact that they are conservative when really they're risk takers, or trying to tell each other things that make them think they're crazy, but really they're calculating. | ||
| They are telling each other lies ongoing, and they're gambling with each other. | ||
| It's completely degenerative. | ||
| But that's the kind of thing that's happening on some level with the high-level fighters, too. | ||
| Making them think certain things about what they will do or believe they'll do. | ||
| Almost everything they say, the fans and the audience, we should assume is a game chip. | ||
| It's like a something to make the other one believe something that might in that moment let me land that kick if he thinks that I'm, you know, whatever, right? | ||
| It's manipulative stuff. | ||
| And at that level, that is just so unbelievably fascinating. | ||
| It really is. | ||
| It really is. | ||
| And the stakes are so high. | ||
| You know, the kick lands, you're a hero. | ||
| The kick misses... | ||
| If you get caught with a left hook, you're a loser. | ||
| You know, there's just so much at stake with every single choice you make and all those choices have to be almost subconscious or semi-conscious because you've got to be in the Zen state. | ||
| You've got to be flowing. | ||
| So everything has to be prepared. | ||
| You have to have... | ||
| While you're in there, you have to have no regrets. | ||
| You have to be able to just flow. | ||
| And you have to be able to capitalize on any movement, any opening you see. | ||
| You've got to pounce. | ||
| And you have to be in condition to execute all these things. | ||
| So you have to have had the physical discipline and the mental fortitude to push yourself through training to a level that you probably didn't think you could get to. | ||
| And I want to pounce with the opening, but what if it's a lie? | ||
| Right, right, right. | ||
| Like, what if Matt Brown's line on that thing was actually, that one would be hard to be a lie, but there are other ones where it feels like that one little opening, but instead TJ's going to catch you or Cody's lined you up to draw you into something. | ||
| Well, Cody's so goddamn fast, too. | ||
| His hand speed is so ridiculously fast. | ||
| I go back to the Thomas Almeida fight, and Almeida's really never been the same again. | ||
| Almeida, going into that fight, was undefeated, was thought to be the dark horse in the division, like, look, a future world champion. | ||
| And Cody lit him up like a Christmas tree. | ||
| And the way he did it was so definitive that you're like, Jesus, like, there could be no doubt this guy has real world championship potential. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| You know, and... | ||
| I think that the Dwayne Ludwig factor is so fucking huge. | ||
| I really, really do. | ||
| Me too. | ||
| And I've seen Dwayne's work. | ||
| Dwayne, unlike a lot of guys, has notebooks, like binders, full of ideas, and his system is a very declared system. | ||
| It's not like loosely based, like, we always work off the jab, we got good footwork. | ||
| No, it's None of that, no. | ||
| Like, there's a system to his, like he has a belt system to his style. | ||
| And his style is based on, for people who don't know, Dwayne was a world-class kickboxer. | ||
| World-class Muay Thai fighter. | ||
| I mean, he fought Ramon Deckers. | ||
| I mean, he fought some of the best of the best. | ||
| Had some amazing fights in both MMA and in kickboxing. | ||
| I mean, he was a really talented guy. | ||
| And then transitioned on to being a coach. | ||
| And the obsession that he has towards coaching, is really at a higher level than even his obsession towards fighting and he talks about that that his passion is teaching people he loves it he loves being able to mold students and he's found the perfect muse or the perfect willing uh participant in tj And TJ and him have a very unique friendship and a very unique student mentorship sort of relationship. | ||
| It's really, really interesting to watch the two of them together. | ||
| It's wild now. | ||
| The super gym with 20 guys. | ||
| And then you've got... | ||
| And Dwayne has tons of athletes too, but a commitment and connection to TJ. Then you've got Matt Hume and Demetrius. | ||
| You've got a few of these guys who are just like... | ||
| We will funnel all of my experience through everything through this super athlete. | ||
| But like you talk about those books, the only way that you get to a point of this level of mastery that we're talking about is that you must go down some fucking road for six months that amounts to nothing. | ||
| So that you learn that road isn't the road. | ||
| And the only way, and you can't give up too early, and what if by going down it long enough, some different concept about how you switch your feet in a certain moment. | ||
| You think maybe that ain't it, but you have discovered that by pushing through some of these concepts long enough, you find it, so you stick with it long enough, and it turns out, no, Dwayne, or anybody else reaching that level of mastery, has gone down some rabbit hole for months or years and discovered the only value they got out of it was, well, no, there's lots of value, That wasn't the rabbit hole. | ||
| And the process of searching this rabbit hole has made me better at searching rabbit holes. | ||
| So those two values, some of the stacks of his books are things that didn't work. | ||
| And he will probably appreciate those just as much as any of the ones that did. | ||
| There's also TJ's approach is really interesting to me because TJ is obsessed with improvement and knowledge and he keeps talking about his fight IQ and you know him and Dwayne, I've been around them, I've trained with them, I've worked out with them, I've watched him coach TJ and I mean they're constantly working on the minutia, they're constantly working on finite details and improving every single aspect and Tightening things up. | ||
| And it's really interesting. | ||
| And TJ's a fucking open book, man. | ||
| I mean, you can talk to that guy about anything. | ||
| And he's considering it. | ||
| He's thinking. | ||
| And he's like, oh, okay. | ||
| I see what you're doing. | ||
| I see what you're doing. | ||
| He's a guy who's always trying to take in information. | ||
| So, these are the things when we do watch this kind of thing, whether it is martial arts or even jazz or football or whatever, there are these lessons that are there. | ||
| We should do that. | ||
| We're supposed to go through life doing that. | ||
| We're not supposed to look at T.J. Dillashaw and go, wow, isn't that crazy? | ||
| If we do that, our lives will get better, right? | ||
| I got to work for TSN in Canada, which is like ESPN in the States. | ||
| Myself and Aaron Brodenstetter are like the two-person division that talks about UFC and fighting. | ||
| And when George was fighting Michael, they went and said, you know, could you approach your friends with George and his people? | ||
| Could you approach them about doing a half-hour-long documentary on him about his comeback and training and stuff? | ||
| And I did. | ||
| And at first, George was open to it, and Rudolf, his manager, was like, oh god, I hear the word documentary, and I know what that means. | ||
| It's going to be months, and there's going to be cameras, and it's going to be a distraction. | ||
| I said, I'll just travel with George, and I have the best producer, Simon, the best producer we have. | ||
| And we'll just travel with him. | ||
| And they said yes. | ||
| And so I got to travel with George for a month, six weeks, off and on New York, LA, Montreal, life, eating ice cream, training with Freddie Roach. | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| That must have been interesting. | ||
| When is this going to come out? | ||
| It did come out before. | ||
| So mostly in Canada. | ||
| But I'm going to send a message. | ||
|
unidentified
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How do I get that? | |
| I'm going to send a message immediately after we get off here to Simon and the rest of them and say, where is that right now? | ||
| And then I'll tweet it out. | ||
| You could learn a lot from a guy like that. | ||
| Oh man, it changed my life. | ||
| Really? | ||
| Yeah, because you don't get to be around the greats of the greats and study them. | ||
| And we're friends, so I can talk to him. | ||
| Like, we hang out. | ||
| I got to fucking train karate with his team. | ||
| Like, point karate. | ||
| So he'd be, oh, Robin's training with us today. | ||
| What kind of point karate training do they do? | ||
| And do they do this to practice blitzing? | ||
| And just think of this. | ||
| You were big on point karate like 2012, 2013. And I didn't disagree, but I didn't really get... | ||
| There it is. | ||
| There it is. | ||
| Oh, fuck. | ||
| It was so magical to see. | ||
| And I wasn't just like, how does he kick? | ||
| I'm like, how does he think? | ||
| And why does he do the things he does? | ||
| And what's his motivation? | ||
| And it really made me a better human being getting to do that. | ||
| So what I didn't really connect to, sometimes there's something so simple, and we don't see it because we're deep in whatever we're in. | ||
| But the idea of point karate, people right away say, well, they're just touching each other. | ||
| It's like, true. | ||
| So if I'm training to just touch you, I'm not training to hurt you. | ||
| Okay, that seems like that's not valuable. | ||
| Yeah, but you're training to not let me even fucking touch you. | ||
| If you can't get touched by me, how hard, impossible is it for me to hit you clean? | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| If your movement and your defensive systems and your management of the distance between our weapons and targets are such that I can't fucking touch you, how can I hurt you? | ||
| If I can't even touch you with my glove. | ||
| Well, the thing is, Here's what I think about point fighting and what I think was valid about it. | ||
| If you're just doing point fighting with a point fighter, it is extremely frustrating. | ||
| I fought in point fighting tournaments when I was competing. | ||
| I came from a full contact Taekwondo background. | ||
| And we fought in these tournaments and the object was to knock people unconscious. | ||
| And you would fight, you know, there were three minute rounds and you would fight and you would try to kick people into another dimension. | ||
| I fought very similar in Canada. | ||
| There was a lot of people that I trained with that openly dismissed point fighting. | ||
| And the reason why they openly dismissed point fighting was because they would stop every time someone would get touched. | ||
| And I would be like, well, in the real world, or everybody would say, in the real world, you don't just stop when you get touched. | ||
| You keep fighting. | ||
| And so with our techniques, a lot of it, you would hit someone once, and they would counter, and then you'd set up the big shot afterwards. | ||
| Like, this is part of the thing. | ||
| And if the referee kept stopping you, then you would never get anything done. | ||
| But my thinking once I got into MMA was... | ||
| Okay, yeah, but if you can do that and do the other things, it's like people dismiss Taekwondo because they're like, well, Taekwondo, you know, you get taken to the ground, you get your legs kicked out. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| But if you have takedown defense... | ||
| And you know Muay Thai, you can wheel kick someone into another fucking dimension. | ||
| And we saw that with Edson Barboza versus Terry Edom. | ||
| We've seen these Taekwondo techniques manifest themselves in MMA, and you realize like, oh, these are some of the most powerful things you could do to a person inside a cage. | ||
| When you see the point-fighting style, like the Raymond Daniels or the Michael Venom Page, this ability to blitz, if they can do those other things too, this is another level. | ||
| There's something to it. | ||
| So as a fighter, I wasn't willing to dismiss point-fighting because I had been lied to already. | ||
| When I went and took Taekwondo and then started kickboxing, first American kickboxing above the waist, First thing I realized was how easy it was for me to get punched in the face. | ||
| I was like, oh, okay. | ||
| Now if I'm trapped in this ring, and I can't go anywhere, and someone's throwing punches, and I don't understand how to get away from them, and I'm used to this Taekwondo style of having your hands down low, I'm getting fucked up. | ||
| So I've been lied to. | ||
| Taekwondo is not the best martial art. | ||
| None of them are. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| None of them are. | ||
| There is no best martial art. | ||
| But there is something absolutely legit about that blitz, that karate blitz, that some of these guys can do. | ||
| And I fought some really good guys in those karate-style tournaments, and I got an ass made out of me. | ||
| I mean, you don't know what to do. | ||
| And you get kicked, and then the referees point, and you're like, ugh. | ||
| You don't have a chance to fire back because they're separating you guys and I really absorbed those lessons and I was like in MMA that ability to close the distance because in MMA there's so many guys and Connor talked about this there's so many guys that have this Muay Thai stance and they're presenting this very predictable target they're standing right in front of each other and I think This stance, | ||
| and especially the forward stance, is one of the reasons why Vitor has been caught and knocked out twice with front kicks. | ||
| Because he squares off. | ||
| Vitor explained this to me in, like, shit. | ||
| 1997, when I was training at Carlson Gracie's, he was explaining that some kickboxers are going to have a hard time in MMA, even though they're really good kickboxers, because the MMA stance, you really have to square off. | ||
| You can't stand like this. | ||
| You can't stand like a boxer. | ||
| And a kickboxer is a little more open than a boxer, but then MMA is a little more open than that. | ||
| He's like, you almost have to be square. | ||
| But that square leaves you open to front kicks to the face and then turning side kicks and side kicks to the body. | ||
| Think about what Vitor has been dropped with. | ||
| Jon Jones dropped him with a side kick to the body. | ||
| Sakuraba dropped him with a turning side kick to the body. | ||
| Two front kicks. | ||
| Two front kicks to the face. | ||
| It's because he presents this square thing. | ||
| But to him, this is sprawl and throw punches and throw the blitz that he used on Vandalie Silva. | ||
| And it worked through much of his career. | ||
| He either won with it or lost with it. | ||
| And I respect that thinking. | ||
| But those types of doctrines is literally... | ||
| And in martial arts, in day-to-day life, in anything, if you think anything is the thing, you're totally wrong. | ||
| Because if we all agree it's the thing, then we're all acting like it's the thing, then we all start ignoring other things, and those things will work. | ||
| So if you have to, if MMA, you have to square up. | ||
| All of a sudden, some Connor comes out with a different thing, and you were wrong. | ||
| Wonderboy Thompson. | ||
| The guard is the one that is glaring to me right now. | ||
| I've talked to some of the smartest and the best, and we do this over and over again. | ||
| We do it in everything. | ||
| Remember when you cannot cross your feet when you do an armbar? | ||
| Do you remember that earlier? | ||
|
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Like, what the fuck? | |
| What are you talking about? | ||
| Now everybody does. | ||
| Head kicks don't work in MMA. This has been going on forever. | ||
| So any absolute decision that this is a fundamental rule is completely... | ||
| That's where you're gonna get fucked. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, how about the low calf kick? | ||
| Benson Henderson was, in my opinion, the first guy to bring it to MMA. And he started doing that back in the day, but not at the effectiveness, the level of effectiveness that we're seeing now. | ||
| That low calf kick is fucking people up. | ||
| It's really interesting. | ||
| And then they'll adapt, and then it won't work. | ||
| But that adaptation will put something else available. | ||
| I think the problem with the low calf kick is that you really can't condition the lower part of your leg the same way you can your thighs. | ||
| And I think it's going to keep working. | ||
| But then we have to not get hit by it. | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| So we'll make a change to not get hit by it. | ||
| Once we do, that'll force us to do something else that someone will take advantage of. | ||
| It's amazing how quickly it works. | ||
| Like if you see a guy get hit with a brutal leg kick, like it takes one or two and then they start to feel it. | ||
| There's something about the first low calf kick you see guys wobbly. | ||
| Like that muscle is like... | ||
| Really, the insertion at the bottom is so small, and it's taking so much work, like it's carrying so much. | ||
| These are when things work beautifully. | ||
| And again, I used to take anything we'd talk about, and I'd bring it back to fighting. | ||
| Now I tend to take anything in fighting and I try to figure out what it means in life. | ||
| Like I've kind of, over time of study, I've started to do that, right? | ||
| And this is true of this kick and it's true of anything. | ||
| It's like, it works best when the physiological truth, that calf is small and weak and thin, works with the systemic issue. | ||
| He's got his foot there and the way he's standing is such that you can hit it. | ||
| Those two things together are making that thing work right now. | ||
| You can't change the strength of the calf. | ||
| So the only thing we can change is how available that calf kick is if we don't want to get hit with it. | ||
| So we must change that. | ||
| And if we do, we've changed a lot of different things. | ||
| And now something else is available that Dwayne or Duke or somebody else is already planning how to take advantage that you've made that adaptation. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| And that is, for me, what is eternally fascinating about martial arts. | ||
| But again, those are the lessons of life that are there. | ||
| If you can't see that the world around you has changed dramatically and you act as if it's the same, you get fucked up. | ||
| You will get fucked up. | ||
| You know, I bring this to Paul Daly versus John Fitch because that fight was extremely frustrating to Paul Daly and frustrating to a lot of people that were watching it, too, because John Fitch was just able to take him down and kind of do what John Fitch does and hit him on the ground and kind of beat him up and controlled the position. | ||
| And, you know, at the end of the fight, Paul's yelling, boo! | ||
| It was so strange, you know? | ||
| But... | ||
| This is a guy that if you just stand with him, he's going to fuck you up. | ||
| Like, if you just decide to trade shots with Paul Daly on your feet, he's got a left hand that is a goddamn nuclear missile. | ||
| Basically, everybody he hits with that thing goes night-night. | ||
| That's scary. | ||
| Even Lorenz Larkin, who's a seasoned striker, he got clipped by that left hand. | ||
| The ability to generate and create that amount of impact is... | ||
| It's elegant. | ||
| It's elegant, yeah. | ||
| It's like our human bodies and minds don't do all that many things that are that unbelievably beautiful and rooted in our history as human beings. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| This is at the basis of what it was to survive and protect and expand and stuff. | ||
| And you see it right there when Paul Daly hits somebody. | ||
| It's unreal. | ||
| The opposite of that scenario is Johnny Hendrix was fighting Stephen Thompson. | ||
| And Johnny Hendricks wanted, when Steven would come in, he wanted to drill him with hooks and uppercuts and then get to his body and take him down and do what John Fitch did. | ||
| But Steven's like, you're not doing that. | ||
| And after he kicked him and beat him up at distance and then finished the fight, Johnny was being interviewed and he's like, well, it wasn't my name. | ||
| And Johnny's a classy guy all over the length of his career. | ||
| He sometimes gets heat, but who cares, right? | ||
| The opinion of other people shouldn't matter to Johnny Hendricks. | ||
| But Johnny said after, he's like, well, I was kind of hoping he'd come in and trade a little more. | ||
| It's like, why the fuck would he do that? | ||
| That's not his style. | ||
| That's a ridiculous thing to hope for. | ||
| And that's what you want. | ||
| He wants to do what you don't want. | ||
| The whole goal is to do something that benefits him in this scenario and does not benefit you, which would be exactly what he did. | ||
| Which is what brings me back to the Paul Daly-John Fitch fight. | ||
| This is the answer to that style. | ||
| The answer to that style is take you down and not ever let you get up and force John Fitch's game on you, which is what makes fighting so interesting. | ||
| If John Fitch had just decided to go cowboy and bite down his mouthpiece and just wing punches at Paul Daly until one of them went to sleep, that would have been a great fight for Paul Daly. | ||
| Great fight. | ||
| When Nick Diaz and Paul Daly did that, remember that? | ||
| I mean, that was pretty epic. | ||
| And that only happens, again, you're creating a moment, and it only happens because Nick was motivated by who he is in that moment. | ||
| He wasn't motivated by strategy even, necessarily. | ||
| He's like, fuck you! | ||
| Fuck you! | ||
| Exactly. | ||
| And that, however people will look at that, that is, again, it is an expression of the individuality, the authentic truth of who Nick Diaz is. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That's why that's art. | ||
| We were just talking art and fight. | ||
| That's a fight. | ||
| This was a great... | ||
| And he got clipped. | ||
| That's a fight, but that's... | ||
| Let's watch a little bit of this here, man. | ||
| Yeah, look at this. | ||
| Because he just kept the pace. | ||
| He's just refusing. | ||
| Yeah, Paul just got too tired, too quick. | ||
| He was winging big shots. | ||
| And look at Nick just... | ||
| Right there. | ||
| See, he got clipped. | ||
| That's his left hook you're talking about. | ||
| This is over. | ||
| Okay, it's over. | ||
| There, we're done. | ||
| No, because Nick won't be done. | ||
| Yeah, well... | ||
| I mean, who knows? | ||
| Maybe if Paul was in better condition, but this is the end. | ||
| The end is Nick just battering him. | ||
| It's crazy that he beat him in a striking contest. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But he did it with Will. | ||
| He was always a great boxer. | ||
| Yep. | ||
| But, I mean, and again, this is a metaphor for life. | ||
| Like, you got a wall. | ||
| That was one of the greatest victories ever. | ||
| Yeah, it's fucking unbelievable. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It really was. | |
| That was the quintessential Nick Diaz fight. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Look at him, look at him. | |
| Yeah, I know, right? | ||
| Ah! | ||
| And there are people who don't like him. | ||
| I love that guy. | ||
| Me too. | ||
| Because what we're searching for, I think, is we're trying to be authentically who we are. | ||
| I think that's all we're doing. | ||
| That's what Nick Diaz is. | ||
| Whatever the fuck you think he is, he is authentically Nick Diaz. | ||
| And the metaphor to me is Paul Daly is a wall. | ||
| And you can. | ||
| You can dig under it, or you can go around it, or you can trick somebody to give you a rope, or you can climb it, or you can dissemble it. | ||
| And Nick's like, fuck it. | ||
| I'm going to go through it. | ||
| I'm going to go through it. | ||
| And there are many ways to choose to live your life, and that's how Nick Diaz lives his fucking life. | ||
| And that's beautiful. | ||
| What sucks is that he hasn't fought in forever. | ||
| I mean, he hasn't fought since the Anderson Silva fight. | ||
| That's crazy. | ||
| And it's crazy that they suspended him from marijuana when Anderson Silva tested positive for steroids in that fight, and he got a shorter suspension than Nick. | ||
| That's a reflection. | ||
| That's a cultural, leftover cultural reflection. | ||
| Well, it's also that Nick refused to pay the fine. | ||
| Because that's Nick Diaz being authentically Nick Diaz. | ||
| He's like, yeah, you're not getting that money from me. | ||
| See ya. | ||
| You can admire that. | ||
| Some people will look at that and go, dude, just pay it. | ||
| It'll go this way. | ||
| And he's like, no, fundamentally who I am, I cannot do that. | ||
| I will get negative consequences in my life, but I will be authentic to who I am. | ||
| But Nick is like 36 now, I think. | ||
| How old is Nick Diaz now? | ||
| 34? | ||
| He's 34 now. | ||
| That's it? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Oh, dude, his first fight in the UFC, I believe he was 20. Wow. | ||
| You know, when he fought Jeremy Jackson, like way back in the day, he was 18. Wow. | ||
| You know, I mean, he's been around, man. | ||
| You know, he's been around. | ||
| So he's still, like, literally in his physical prime. | ||
| And this is crazy, considering the fact that I want to say the Anderson Silva fight was three years ago. | ||
| Yeah, probably. | ||
| Yeah, it feels right. | ||
| Somewhere around there. | ||
| I would love to see him back in there again. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| You've got to do what you want to do, though. | ||
| If he really, truly, that's what he wants to do, he'll find a way to do it. | ||
| And if he doesn't, George, you've got George coming in. | ||
| I asked George, so at work they're like, hey, can you see what's up with George and this Nate Diaz thing? | ||
| I'm like, I'll ask, and I'll ask honestly as a friend, and he knows that I'm also employed by somebody, so we'll have a little conversation about it. | ||
| But I will never, ever sacrifice a friendship or a long-term relationship to find something out. | ||
| Yeah, that shit is not good for you. | ||
| And I don't care about Twitter beefs, and I don't care about breaking news and all that. | ||
| It's just not interesting. | ||
| It's not anything to do with my life. | ||
| But I'll go ask George. | ||
| So I asked George, who we are friends. | ||
| We talked yesterday. | ||
| And we will – he will tell me the truth. | ||
| And then – and something as simple as, oh, you know, nah, that's fucking bullshit. | ||
| Maybe not in exactly those terms, but he would say. | ||
| But when I asked him about it, he's like, no, bro, I haven't signed nothing. | ||
| And I looked at that and like, oh my god, that's George trying to be deceptive. | ||
| Like, George would normally go, ah, it's BS, man, that's not happening. | ||
| I know I haven't signed anything. | ||
| Well, I know they've offered him Nate Diaz. | ||
| But that was George, who's shitty at being deceptive, trying to be deceptive. | ||
| Like, he, yeah, so like you said, they've offered it to him. | ||
| They've offered it to him. | ||
| And by saying I haven't signed it means he's considering it to me. | ||
| I think he's considering it, but I think he's also considering Khabib Nurmagomedov, and then there's always the great Irish leprechaun. | ||
| I think those are the two big fights. | ||
| The two big fights are Khabib at 155 or even 170. GSP wants the winner of Conor McGregor vs. | ||
| Khabib, not Nate Diaz. | ||
| Insider drops bombshell. | ||
| And this is May 19th, Saturday. | ||
| Yeah, I'm sure he wants that, but that fight would have to take place first, and who the fuck knows when Conor or Khabib would fight afterwards. | ||
| If it's Conor, it might be a decade later. | ||
| I mean, who the fuck knows what that guy's going to do now? | ||
| When you give a guy like Conor $100 million, you know, I mean, this is what happens. | ||
| He's throwing dollies at bus windows and losing his fucking mind. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| What's the matter, Jamie? | ||
| That UFC insider was shot. | ||
| Was it? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, it was on his podcast. | |
| I just saw that. | ||
| I just scrolled down. | ||
| It says UFC Insider. | ||
| Why don't they just say Brendan Schaub? | ||
| Everybody knows who Brendan Schaub is, you fucking idiots. | ||
| That's fucking funny. | ||
| He's some obscure insider. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| Some obscure... | ||
| Well, I'm sure he does want that, but if they offer him a fat paycheck, and they really should, if they want... | ||
| Look, the UFC's in a weird position. | ||
| They bought the company for $4 billion. | ||
| I don't know what it's worth, but I would guess it's probably not really worth $4 billion. | ||
| They have a giant monthly nut. | ||
| It's fucking huge. | ||
| The monthly nut that they have to make caused them to fire I mean, there's a lot going on and there's been some, you know, great fights and it's obviously still incredibly popular, but you want to make those big pay-per-view bucks. | ||
| You need the big name stars. | ||
| GSP was always a big name star, became even bigger when he came back and beat Bisping and won by a finish and got him on a rear naked choke and put him to sleep. | ||
| He's still a giant star. | ||
| However, he hasn't fought in a while, vacated the title, doesn't have the title anymore. | ||
| So it's not as big of a deal to the public's eyes. | ||
| Is it though? | ||
| It is. | ||
| It is. | ||
| People are dumb as shit, man. | ||
| The funny thing to me is like, I always feel like, and I always feel like... | ||
| A lot of these mechanisms, title shots, rankings, belts, you know, Twitter beefs, they were intended to be there as a short-term solution to give people a talking point until they got deeply invested and connected. | ||
| And I think that was... | ||
| But yet somehow these sort of extra outside distractions became the focus. | ||
| Who the fuck cares who's the number eight guy? | ||
| And who cares if these guys are mad at each other on Twitter? | ||
| And the belt itself is a mechanism for discussion. | ||
| What matters is the fight. | ||
| And I know that it's like... | ||
| Yeah, but you're obsessed with fighting. | ||
| Most people, if you show them what's really going on there and contextualize the fact that these two human beings have dedicated their life and taken all of the knowledge in human history to put on the line in this moment of severe intensity and consequence, you won't care as much about whether somebody has an interim title. | ||
| You won't. | ||
| No, I won't and you won't. | ||
| But the average Joe Blow buy a pay-per-view once a year is going to care. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Maybe. | |
| That's the idea behind stripping Tony Ferguson. | ||
| I mean, why strip him? | ||
| Why take away his interim title? | ||
| Let him keep the interim title. | ||
| If you want to strip Conor, just strip Conor. | ||
| Strip Conor, and then Tony's obviously going to go through surgery. | ||
| Tony didn't do anything wrong. | ||
| He fell and hurt himself. | ||
| But I think at the root of it is an incorrect philosophical belief. | ||
| So if I talk to people at the UFC, and I talk to them periodically... | ||
| And I'll discuss something with them about, you know, and it's generally at different times been like, hey man, you can see the work that I'm doing and you can see people like it. | ||
| Could I contribute something X or Y? And then I'll mention, you know, they will then say, well, you know, You've got like a really unique way of approaching it. | ||
| We think, you know, we've got so many casual fans watching on Fox or on these TV stations. | ||
| It's just such a casual audience. | ||
| And I think about it and it's like nobody questions that. | ||
| The percentage of people that are a casual fan that is watching anything is very close to zero. | ||
| Very close to zero. | ||
| Do you think so? | ||
| Yeah, because the casual, the not actively choosing what to watch is being on a Netflix search. | ||
| Or is somebody put something on and I go and see what The Rock is cooking in his kitchen. | ||
| You know, what's your dog's name? | ||
| The Gold Dog? | ||
| Marshall? | ||
| I go and see what fucking Joe is feeding Marshall. | ||
| Nobody's watching something they're not interested in ever in our society. | ||
| We are all constantly and consciously choosing what we consume at all times. | ||
| And if we're sitting there with our boyfriend or girlfriend or husband or wife and they're watching it, we're somewhere else. | ||
| By feeding this non-existent casual audience and really believing they exist despite all the evidence that there is no such thing, you are now giving less attention Importance to your actual audience who is ready to go deeper, ready to see something more meaningful, ready to be brought somewhere different. | ||
| There is no casual audience of almost anything in our modern world. | ||
| I like what you're saying, but I disagree. | ||
| Because people are watching and they don't know what the fuck they're watching. | ||
| I've done it with people. | ||
| I've unfortunately watched fights over friends' houses before because I happened to be there. | ||
| And then, you know, there'll be people sitting around watching. | ||
| Why doesn't he just do this? | ||
| But they still chose to watch it. | ||
| They still made that choice. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They're barely paying attention. | |
| Yeah, but they made that choice. | ||
| Yes, but they're barely paying attention and they don't know what the fuck they're watching. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I'll accept that. | |
| So a guy like you comes in talking about artistry and all this. | ||
| They, I think... | ||
| You are great. | ||
| I love your approach, but I think your approach in their eyes is a little bit too esoteric and complex and maybe they balanced out better with someone like me. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| Especially the last year or so, I've looked at it like trying to force something. | ||
| I'm not happily saying that I would be in a relationship with you and accept what you are. | ||
| I'm saying, I think we should be in a relationship, only I want to change you. | ||
| And that's not right. | ||
| That's not right. | ||
| I'm literally saying, I'm not saying, put a role here, tell me what that role you need, and I'll do it. | ||
| I'm actually saying, I think it should be different. | ||
| And that's why it's not a good fit. | ||
| And that's why I say a one championship is a more logical fit for me. | ||
| Because it's younger in its evolution, but still growing. | ||
| I think, I agree with you, but I think it goes back to the money. | ||
| Because I think there's so much money involved in the UFC that they have to make money every month. | ||
| I mean, They're in a tricky situation. | ||
| It's like if you're a guy and you make $500 a week and you really like this car. | ||
| Goddamn, that Corvette is so nice. | ||
| I really like it. | ||
| Well, how much is the lease? | ||
| The lease is $1,000 a month, but you only make $2,000 a month. | ||
| How are you going to do that? | ||
| Well, if I only pay $500 a month in rent. | ||
| I can kind of pull it off. | ||
| You're like, yeah, I guess you can. | ||
| But you've got to watch every penny, and you've got to be cautious. | ||
| And I think you can put yourself in these traps, and then you have to really micromanage everything you do. | ||
| Like, we've got to make money, but we've got to make money, but we've got to make money, instead of... | ||
| We gotta do what we like and put together what we like and do the best possible version of what we like. | ||
| A perfect example is this podcast. | ||
| I don't have a boss. | ||
| There's no overhead. | ||
| I have a couple employees. | ||
| It's very easy. | ||
| There's no worries. | ||
| So I don't give a fuck if I have... | ||
| You want to talk about stuff? | ||
| Or a sleep expert? | ||
| I'm not going to have anybody on that I'm not interested in talking to. | ||
| And I'll talk about whatever the fuck I want to. | ||
| I don't think, I don't know if people are going to be interested in this. | ||
| I need that advertising money. | ||
| I need to say... | ||
| Because of that, I think it's one of the reasons why the show's been successful because it honestly represents my thinking. | ||
| It's like I'm allowed to pursue my interests and have these conversations and let it be pure. | ||
| I think if the UFC took that exact approach, I think the product would be better. | ||
| And I think if they had someone like you breaking down the artistry of specific techniques, the air quote casual fan would be more educated and they would learn more about it. | ||
| And you get some of that from Dominic Cruz when he does his breakdowns on Fox and some of the other fighters who do breakdowns and when Daniel Cormier does wrestling breakdowns and breakdowns, specific techniques of why they work and why they don't work and what someone's doing right or wrong. | ||
| You get educated. | ||
| And I try to do the best I can, too, when it comes to the ground in particular, which is what I think is the most confusing aspect of MMA for the casual fan. | ||
| But I think we should approach the entire sport in the most illuminating way possible. | ||
| And I think a guy like you and your approach is very valuable. | ||
| And I love your breakdowns. | ||
| I'm a big fan of them. | ||
| That's why I retweet them all the time. | ||
| I just think you have a very unique and passionate and not just a passionate approach, but it's genuine. | ||
| Like, I know you. | ||
| I've talked to you when the cameras are not on and you're just as interested in this stuff. | ||
| I really am. | ||
| And I think we're just going through. | ||
| Thank you, by the way, man. | ||
| I think we're going through whatever you're doing, if you're trying to seek some kind of mastery, and if you realize you're really early in it, you can do it by studying yoga. | ||
| Some people do. | ||
| Some people do it. | ||
| They go to church twice a week. | ||
| You're just looking to try to grow. | ||
| And if you do it with something that you're deeply fascinated in, eventually you kind of learn about connections in all things. | ||
| The study of martial arts or the study of yoga or the study of jazz or whatever teaches you about connections and all things. | ||
| And my life is so fucking good. | ||
| And these little moments where I'm like, I don't know why these guys, I don't work for them. | ||
| That doesn't make any sense. | ||
| It doesn't make any sense for me to think that because I get up in the morning and I make my wife and I coffee and I sit in my kitchen. | ||
| And I fucking analyze fighting. | ||
| I sit down, and I look at it, and I look for moments, and I look for things that I think people will find fascinating. | ||
| I look for things that will teach us something about life. | ||
| And I look for these, and I make them. | ||
| Then when I make them, people seem to like them. | ||
| And then that gets me jobs commentating, where I fly off, and I get to... | ||
| I mean, I got it so fucking good to try to... | ||
| Square peg my way into a large corporation because years back I dreamed about working there. | ||
| Sometimes you change your dream. | ||
| Sometimes it's okay to change your route and find... | ||
| The world changes constantly. | ||
| Yeah, don't be afraid to be flexible. | ||
| And, you know, the idea of holding on to a dream for your entire life despite your interests is pretty ridiculous. | ||
| It is, yeah. | ||
| I mean, there's things that I wanted to do when I was young that I don't want to do anymore. | ||
| You should follow your interests, period. | ||
| As you change and grow, I talked about my waning love for Taekwondo when I realized that it wasn't really the right way to go. | ||
| When I first started doing it, I thought it was the most effective martial art. | ||
| Once I realized it wasn't, I lost interest. | ||
| I lost interest in competing in it. | ||
| It just didn't seem like the thing to do anymore. | ||
| And I think that as you grow as a human being, you should have other interests. | ||
| And I think the ones that are the most intriguing and the most passionate Or you're the most passionate of. | ||
| They're going to give you the most reward if you pursue them. | ||
| If you're more passionate about music than you are about accounting, but you decide to stick with accounting because it's what's paying your bills. | ||
| I'm like, man, that's a dark road. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It is. | |
| That's a soul-sucking road you're going to go down. | ||
| It feels scary for somebody in that setting to change. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes. | |
| Because in the short run, it will be painful, but in the long run, it will be so valuable. | ||
| And less painful. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Listen. | ||
| 20 years of way less pain is such a great trade for two years of pain. | ||
| But if you're that guy with that Corvette that you got that lease on and you could barely fucking make those payments, you cannot take any chances. | ||
| You have to just work those extra hours. | ||
| Well, if I just put in two hours of overtime every day, that's still only 10 hours of work a day, but that was two hours at 20 bucks an hour. | ||
| You start doing those calculations and that's how you get fucked. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| And that's how you get trapped. | ||
| And next thing you know, you've got a family, and you've got kids, and you definitely can't move, and you've got a mortgage, and you definitely ain't pursuing any music dreams now, motherfucker. | ||
| That's true. | ||
| And this is the trap that life leads? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| You know, I watched... | ||
| So I do a one-man show now. | ||
| So I built with a friend. | ||
| I built a one-man show. | ||
| It's like... | ||
| Oh, you're in a theater setting, right? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| How do you do that? | ||
| Do you use video and photographs? | ||
| Right now it is, as we put it, four punch-drunk TED Talks. | ||
| So it's four story-driven parts of life that take you on a bit of... | ||
| In theory and in practice so far, people seem to be inspired or find it compelling. | ||
| People have cried at them before, which is really quite moving. | ||
| Those people should go to a doctor. | ||
| They maybe should. | ||
| Especially, yeah. | ||
| But I did it. | ||
| So I decided I wanted to do that. | ||
| I decided I wanted to get up and tell stories and hopefully entertain people or inspire them or take them somewhere. | ||
| And I did it partly, I watched your show, and then I would have never in a million years, or when I saw you in Vegas, would never in a million years thought I could do that. | ||
| Because it's clearly a lifetime of training, and development, and improvement, and trial and error, and thousands and thousands of repetitions. | ||
| And you look at that, and you don't look at an Olympic gymnast and say, I can do that. | ||
| And that's kind of so I didn't think of it at all. | ||
| But then I saw Brendan do his show, and it was awesome, and I realized he only started working on this two years ago. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| And all he represents is hard, hard work, sacrifice, and drive to learn. | ||
| And that's possible. | ||
| Yeah, what Schaub is doing is what I said to him is you are essentially using an athlete's work ethic and applying it to an art form. | ||
| And that's what's awesome about it. | ||
| He's a funny guy who realized, like, I can do stand-up. | ||
| I just need to put the time in. | ||
| And, you know, I've seen that guy kill. | ||
| I mean, kill. | ||
| And he's been doing comedy for, like, two years. | ||
| That is inspiring. | ||
| You should be aware when you see that that that means something you work on for only a couple years is possible if you're driven. | ||
| And smart and really committed. | ||
| And that's what I took out of his show. | ||
| Plus, he explained to me the process. | ||
| So I decided I'm doing it, right? | ||
| So I booked about five months ahead in Winnipeg, because there was a UFC in Winnipeg, and that's my hometown, to do a small theater. | ||
| And I'm like, okay, five months. | ||
| And I'm like, what the fuck do I do? | ||
| So I called up a good friend of mine, Graham. | ||
| So when you booked it, you didn't have a show? | ||
|
unidentified
|
I didn't have a show. | |
| Wow! | ||
| Yeah, I didn't have a show. | ||
| Maybe six months. | ||
| That's a good way to force yourself? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| But I had one plan. | ||
| I was going to call up my friend, Graham Isidor, who is a playwright and a writer for Vice and a bunch of other stuff. | ||
| And very smart and interesting. | ||
| And we're good friends, but we have very different perspectives. | ||
| And I said, I booked this show. | ||
| It's in six months. | ||
| I need 40 minutes. | ||
| It's got to be... | ||
| And he has told some of my stories in Vice before. | ||
| Getting drunk with sumo wrestlers and different stories. | ||
| Dude, how much do you weigh? | ||
|
unidentified
|
About 156. And you got drunk with sumo wrestlers? | |
| It was scary. | ||
| Oh no! | ||
|
unidentified
|
It was joyous! | |
| You've never seen anything like that. | ||
| Oh my god, they're so big though. | ||
| Oh, you should see it. | ||
| Do you know who Biomba is? | ||
| No. | ||
| Okay, so if you ever see a sumo on TV, that's Biomba. | ||
| So he's the guy in the Geico commercial, skating, being a figure skater. | ||
| He's like the Tiger Woods of sumo wrestling. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| And he is a genius. | ||
| He's a world champion, but he's also an entertainer. | ||
| So he lives in Hollywood, and he's very, very booked. | ||
| He lives here? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And he sumo wrestles. | ||
| Yeah, there he is. | ||
| He's from Mongolia, but he spends a great deal of time here working as a television personality and an actor and whatever. | ||
| He doesn't just look fat. | ||
| That guy looks jacked. | ||
| Go to that one where he's doing that muscle pose. | ||
| That one right there? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| See, that's like the shoulder muscle through all that fat. | ||
| That guy looks like a tank. | ||
| Well, people don't realize, but underneath there is like you. | ||
| Or underneath there is like TJ Dillashaw. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| There is a muscular person underneath all those additional layers of fat and flesh and skin. | ||
| There's a powerful athlete in that. | ||
| Is there a real benefit in being that fat? | ||
| Yeah, force, power generation. | ||
| Like, momentum, the ability... | ||
| I mean, if the other guy is that big, and our goal is just to smash into each other until one of us is taken from the platform, and you're not that big, it's going to be very difficult. | ||
| So it's like an arms race of size over generations where they just got bigger and bigger out of necessity. | ||
| Because if you're bigger, I mean, what am I going to do? | ||
| Right. | ||
| We could, in theory, maybe I could use your size against you, or I could use technique and strategy and smarts to take you off. | ||
| But I could be big and also do that. | ||
| So why not be also big? | ||
| So arms raced to that point. | ||
| And there are little guys. | ||
| Who's that guy that's with him? | ||
| That guy's gonna get killed. | ||
| I think he's an impractical joker. | ||
| But yeah, Viamba is like, he's the most famous sumo guy in the world. | ||
| And I got wasted with him at the World Combat Games in St. Petersburg, Russia. | ||
| So I got to commentate it. | ||
| So I was in St. Petersburg and I absolutely love, I found a niche where I get to commentate like real traditional martial arts a fair bit. | ||
| I've done Taekwondo and Karate at the Pan Am Games and I did the World Sumo Championships or the World Combat Games. | ||
| I do the World Wushu Championships which is Kung Fu and San Da. | ||
| And so I've carved out this niche where I get called for these and develop expertise in these different areas and get to experience them and see the little details that change when you change something. | ||
| And so I got to commentate Sumo. | ||
| And then after, he seemed to like me and he's kind of like, you, we drink. | ||
| And it was something, man. | ||
| What does he drink? | ||
| Vodka. | ||
| Well, you're in Russia, too. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, right, right, right. | |
| You're in Russia. | ||
| I love Russia. | ||
| Do you? | ||
| I really do. | ||
| I love the Russians. | ||
| I love their view of combat and of martial arts and stuff. | ||
| They're very straight. | ||
| Like, you know, when you negotiate to commentate or to do some work, they're just straight. | ||
| This is what we can pay you. | ||
| This is what we expect of you. | ||
| If you do that, we're all going to be happy. | ||
| Frank Mir does commentary for them over there, right? | ||
| Yes, he does. | ||
| He's very good. | ||
| Frank Mir, I would hope that someone would hire him in America. | ||
| They can't afford him. | ||
| Is that what it is? | ||
| He's getting paid way too well. | ||
| In Russia? | ||
| In Russia. | ||
| Really? | ||
| No kidding. | ||
| Good for him. | ||
| He said that's why he couldn't do a deal with Bellator. | ||
| No shit. | ||
| And his deal with ACB, who he loves and respects, he's become sort of partners in there with Mr. Haseev, who runs it, where Frank is now a partner of the presentation of it for American shows. | ||
| He'll be part promoter. | ||
| And I think Frank may even get away from some of the commentary. | ||
| As much as he's good at it and loves it, I think he's interested in some of the other aspects of it now. | ||
| But yeah, they pay very well. | ||
| And they pay the athletes very, very well. | ||
| You can be a guy that had a couple of UFC fights or a Bellator fight or two. | ||
| They'll give you $60,000 U.S. cash in your hand in an envelope at the end of it. | ||
| Interesting. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| That's great. | ||
| Well, it's always great that fighters have more options. | ||
| I know Bellator has become a viable option to a lot of fighters. | ||
| Guys like Ryan Bader are making good money over there now. | ||
| And Roy McDonald, obviously, who's their champion now. | ||
| I just think we need more of those. | ||
| I know that Oscar De La Hoya is getting into the mix now, but just the approach that he's making... | ||
| It seems to me to be ridiculous. | ||
| It's an old-school promoter's approach. | ||
| Get some big name and then invest all your time in that big fight. | ||
| But that's the same thing you were just talking about, the UFC, the challenge they face now is that we need another big one. | ||
| We need another big one. | ||
| It just seems like... | ||
| That approach, like, we just, we know, okay, if this wasn't the approach, would this be the ideal approach? | ||
| No. | ||
| It's never the ideal approach. | ||
| The ideal approach is to do the best fights possible. | ||
| The ideal approach is not necessarily to make the most money, or to have the, like, the most spectacular, like, like, When they were really promoting Ronda Rousey in the rematch or the fight with Amanda Nunes and didn't promote Nunes at all, I was like, I'm a huge Ronda Rousey fan. | ||
| Everybody knows that. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Me too. | |
| I think she's a legend. | ||
| I mean, what she did for women's MMA, she essentially was the reason why the UFC decided to have women's MMA was one woman. | ||
| Every single woman fighting now owes her that debt. | ||
| It just passed her by and it happened so quick. | ||
| You know, but... | ||
| Amanda Nunes, I was thinking, even before Holly Holm beat her, Amanda Nunes was the big threat. | ||
| I'm like, that girl can knock you fucking dead with one punch. | ||
| She's such a ruthless striker. | ||
| And she's a Brazilian jiu-jitsu black belt. | ||
| I'm like, this is a terrible matchup for Ronda, I thought. | ||
| Because Ronda's hands, although good, and getting better, really was starting to look like a polished striker. | ||
| Still doesn't have nearly the kind of power that Nunes has. | ||
| And the ability. | ||
| Like, Nunes is... | ||
| She can take it as well as receive it. | ||
| We've just seen Ronda sort of have these blitz moments with, like, Bech Cohea and, you know... | ||
| Kind of drove through the bricks. | ||
| Just smashed through. | ||
| But when you see the overall game, like, versus Holly Holm, then you get to see, oh, there's a lot of limitations here in trying to smash through the bricks. | ||
| If the bricks aren't there, and the bricks head kick you, you know what I mean? | ||
| There's a lot going on there. | ||
| So we're seeing the layers upon layers upon layers. | ||
| So what happens after you get to the first layer? | ||
| Oh, well, you don't have a second layer. | ||
| This is your layer. | ||
| Your layer is straightforward, move ahead. | ||
| You know, coaching is to blame as well. | ||
| There's a lot of things there. | ||
| But the fact that they weren't even promoting Amanda Nunes. | ||
| You have the very first ever openly gay women's MMA champion in the UFC. From South America. | ||
|
unidentified
|
From South America. | |
| All these interesting aspects of her. | ||
| And she's a fun girl. | ||
| She's interesting. | ||
| You know, and she's a fucking killer, man. | ||
| She's a fucking killer. | ||
| And they showed it in that fight. | ||
| They had an opportunity to make another star. | ||
| Instead... | ||
| They didn't make this other star, and then you look at her most recent pay-per-view, I heard the numbers were abysmal. | ||
| Really? | ||
| See if you can find out what the numbers were, because someone told me, I think it was Shop told me, there were 85,000 pay-per-view buys. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Wow. | |
| That's scary! | ||
| You should be... | ||
| But at that point, you have to stop and wonder, is there anything we could do strategically different? | ||
| Like, just because something worked all the way along in any business or in anything you're doing, there might be a time to take a slightly different approach or to change one of the fundamental beliefs of how we do business or something. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| What you can't do is just go, well, hopefully the next one will be good. | ||
| I mean, you watch that happen all the time. | ||
| There's some massive change in your business or in life. | ||
| That change, at first people deny that it's there. | ||
| Right? | ||
| They deny. | ||
| And then they say it's a niche. | ||
| And then they say it's a blip. | ||
| And then by the time that it's actually in the heat of something scary or challenging happening, you've wasted two or three years that you could have used adapting to be ready for it. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| No, I do know what you mean. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I mean, I think that... | ||
| What you gotta do when you have a champion that has spectacular results, like Amanda Nunes, you gotta hype the shit out of her. | ||
| Invest. | ||
| Yeah, invest, hype the shit out of her. | ||
| And that would have made the Ronda Rousey fight, I think, even bigger. | ||
| If you show her smashing Misha Tate, you show her, you know, smashing Sarah McMahon, you show what she's capable of. | ||
| Like, she's a fucking monster. | ||
| For sure. | ||
| For sure. | ||
| And you talk to Mike Brown or anyone there who's been around the greats, and they talk about it. | ||
| But this level now, where they are, the brilliance of what we've seen, it's another example. | ||
| If you think that only fighting to stand up when you're in guard is right, or only keeping somebody down is the game, and the only thing you have to worry about is they'll stand up, they'll submit you. | ||
| As soon as you don't recognize where you are in the change of the river of life and time, you sometimes get fucked up. | ||
| It's a fascinating thing. | ||
| I know I literally was just in Singapore and I just spent days with this company, but they see the world differently. | ||
| Is simply they're a values-based company that believes in the values of these things and tries to show people and share martial artistry for the greater good. | ||
| And it's not some business. | ||
| It's what they truly believe. | ||
| They truly are going about and making choices. | ||
| And when Chhatri says, I would not hire Conor McGregor because of what he represents, He's dead fucking serious. | ||
| What does he represent that you wouldn't hire him for? | ||
| His idea is, and what he sees, and I shouldn't speak for him at all. | ||
| He's a brilliant man, by the way, this guy. | ||
| He was a homeless kid with a single parent that later became educated and then moved to America and went to Harvard and then started managing corporate funds and became a Muay Thai champion. | ||
| And this is all easily documentable. | ||
| This is who that individual is. | ||
| And he's lived that life based on honor, respect, teamwork, excellence, that mind. | ||
| That is what built that company. | ||
| And one is a billion dollar company now. | ||
| It's a billion dollar company. | ||
| It's in 1.7 billion homes in Asia. | ||
| This isn't some mythological idea. | ||
| This is a guy who's built a massive company based around these values. | ||
| And that's a different thing. | ||
| But what does he say about calling? | ||
| Oh, sorry. | ||
| Yeah, I go off on these. | ||
| No, it's cool. | ||
| So he looks at it as the things that he says and the way that, and again, I shouldn't speak for him. | ||
| This is what I've gathered. | ||
| Throwing things and creating conflict and controversy as your currency is not something to be proud of. | ||
| That's an interesting way of putting it, as your currency. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, I get it. | ||
| You know? | ||
| And that sounds because – and I'm not quite – although I've drank the Kool-Aid, I believe in what they're doing and I see it as real, not only because my values line up with it, but I think they are going to grow dramatically as a result of some of these – the way they see the world. | ||
| But not only that, but I'm still also immersed here. | ||
| And I like Connor. | ||
| I think of – I work for TSN because Connor fell out of a march to a red carpet to shake my hand while my boss was watching. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| Some of the most interesting moments I've had are with that guy and some of the most interesting, many dozens of hours of trying to figure out what's happening and research and growth has happened by studying that guy. | ||
| And I see the games that he is willing to play as part of his strategy for success as a fighter and success trying to be successful for his family and his future. | ||
| I see it all connected. | ||
| So I don't dislike him. | ||
| But I respect this idea that conflict and controversy are not good for... | ||
| I understand that, but I also understand psychological warfare, and I think that Connor's a master of that, and that has a huge factor in victory. | ||
| I mean, this is something Miyamoto Musashi used to his advantage. | ||
| You know, if you read the Book of Five Rings, what Connor's doing is fucking with people's heads to To the point where he has space in their head, and then Connor goes into the cage like loose as a goose, relaxed and calm. | ||
| So he's letting you know, I don't give a fuck about you, but you give a fuck about me, and I'm going to fuck you up right now. | ||
| And you're like, no, you're not. | ||
| You better not. | ||
| You can't. | ||
| This is too much. | ||
| And Jose Aldo is the perfect example. | ||
| Aldo was so out of composure. | ||
| Aldo charged at him with that just leaping left hook and just got fucking waylaid on the way in. | ||
| And Eddie Alvarez, the greatest game day performer, one of the great game day performers we've ever seen. | ||
| And I talked to Eddie. | ||
| Eddie's one of my favorites. | ||
| And I admire and am inspired by Eddie Alvarez. | ||
| Michael Chandler, too. | ||
| You know, those two are like the same guy. | ||
| Yeah, almost. | ||
| But Eddie was like, the plan was to wrestle a lot and stay at distance barely at all. | ||
| And I stayed at distance almost the whole time and barely wrestled. | ||
| Like, he's just like, it was real. | ||
| And by not accepting it was real, coming in, and suddenly you find yourself in there and it's real and you feel different and you're... | ||
| You know, your mind is working differently, and your hormones are working differently, and who you are in that moment is different. | ||
| And you're like, holy fuck, it's real. | ||
| Had I prepared for it to be real, I could be in a different state right now. | ||
| But I denied that this was going to be real, and now it's fucking real. | ||
| It's real. | ||
| That's interesting. | ||
| It's real. | ||
| I also think you got clipped early. | ||
| I think that's a factor. | ||
| You get caught on the chin like that and your legs give out real quick and your brain doesn't work right anymore. | ||
| Your body doesn't work right anymore. | ||
| I think that's a factor. | ||
| The ability that Conor has to land those sharp shots that come out of nowhere and blitz you and come at you so fast. | ||
| And just drop those shots on you. | ||
| I mean, his left hand is a fucking laser beam, and he's so good at landing it. | ||
| That's that double pulse. | ||
| That is the definition of it. | ||
| He's so good at landing that shot. | ||
| And he's also good at landing a bunch of other shit, too, man. | ||
| I mean, he'd pick you apart. | ||
| He's a real dynamo. | ||
| I just... | ||
| I hate to see things like what happened in New York in Brooklyn. | ||
| He threw the dolly at the bus and smashed the window. | ||
| It's so fucking stupid. | ||
| All that thuggish shit running in with a bunch of other guys and everyone screaming. | ||
| What did Khabib do? | ||
| He smacked your friend in the face because your friend was talking shit. | ||
| Even the way he smacked him was pretty gentle. | ||
| You know? | ||
| And Artem called him a coward. | ||
| And he said he doesn't fight and Conor's a real fighter. | ||
| He's like, listen, man. | ||
| He's Russian. | ||
| You're Russian. | ||
| You guys got to sort this out on your own. | ||
| That is how they sort it out. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And look, it was a pretty calm sorting out, in my opinion. | ||
| I mean, they didn't stomp him. | ||
| They didn't beat his ass. | ||
| But once we get to that point, I mean... | ||
| I get it. | ||
| Yeah, once you're doing something and I'm responding, which he responds, that happens every day in gangs and wars in Northern Ireland and Ireland and all types of religions. | ||
| That's been going on forever. | ||
| Nobody ever wins when that happens. | ||
| It just perpetuates it. | ||
| And when you watch it, and then there'll be a lot of people, you see this scenario and like Khabib's fans or friends or supporters and Connors and they're like, he did this, now he We did this. | ||
| They're both wrong. | ||
| And nobody... | ||
| Everybody always... | ||
| When somebody does something bad to somebody else, they almost always feel like something was done bad to them. | ||
| Very few people instigate. | ||
| They always perceive something happen. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| They perceive a slight. | ||
| And, you know, some people, you do one thing to them, and then they're like, okay, motherfucker, now it's to eternity! | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| Like, okay, well, that doesn't make any sense either. | ||
| Now you look like a fool. | ||
| Like, you know... | ||
| You just can't throw a dolly at a bus, you know, filled with other fighters, because it's so selfish. | ||
| I mean, all those people that got cut, you know, I mean, Ray Borg got cuts in his eyes. | ||
| I mean, the whole thing is a disaster. | ||
| So my theory, based on bits of information that we have, Is that Connor on some level, I mean, it reinforces constantly. | ||
| If your kid does something terrible that we know is bad and you give him candy every time, they're going to do bad shit. | ||
| Give her candy every time she does something bad. | ||
|
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|
Reward! | |
| Connor's been rewarded. | ||
| He gets richer, more famous, more influential, belts, and he's been given candy. | ||
| Right, right, right. | ||
| Every time he's done this. | ||
| And it works. | ||
| And, I mean, there is parallels in the political system in America. | ||
| There's parallels all over the world that by acting out in these strange ways, it's so bizarre and unsettling that we reward it, you know? | ||
| It'd be a good name for a band. | ||
| Candy for bad behavior. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That'd be a good name for a band. | ||
| It's a punk band. | ||
| It'd totally be a punk band. | ||
| But that's what's happening, right? | ||
| And so now we take it, and then you add the strategy element that you're talking about, right? | ||
| So he's looking at it, and it's like, okay... | ||
| Khabib would be a great fight. | ||
| I'd like to fight in Russia. | ||
| He likes challenges. | ||
| This is hard, but let's do it. | ||
| Now, if I create some viral controversy, which I did with Pauly Malignaggi, who's... | ||
| Do you know Pauly? | ||
| I've only talked to him on Twitter. | ||
| I don't know him personally. | ||
| I fucking love Pauly. | ||
| I like him as a fighter, and I love him as an analyst as well. | ||
| And I like him as a dude. | ||
| I really do. | ||
| But... | ||
| So he created that and it worked. | ||
| And he's like, okay, on what level he's strategizing this? | ||
| He's like, let's go do some pushing and shoving with Habib and his guys. | ||
| Some giving the finger, it'll be caught on cameras. | ||
| One thing we know about Conor, he's always late. | ||
| It's always late. | ||
| He didn't plan to get there when they're on a bus. | ||
| He planned to get there when they're in the hall. | ||
| He planned to get there when there's a bunch of people around and security and it's easy to manage. | ||
| Little pushing, little shoving, a couple of cameras. | ||
| And all of a sudden, his $5 million payday is a $12 million payday in Russia and everybody's going crazy. | ||
| It'll work. | ||
| It's brilliant. | ||
| But he's late. | ||
| So he shows up there on the bus. | ||
| Now the cameras are out. | ||
| And what's he going to do? | ||
| He's got to perform. | ||
| He came there to perform. | ||
| He came there to do a thing. | ||
| We showed up. | ||
| And now it goes sideways. | ||
| And that's the most likely scenario. | ||
| Is that it was a, let's do it. | ||
| It'll feel right for us as defending our friend. | ||
| But also it'll have some inherent value when the cameras come out. | ||
| And nobody will get hurt. | ||
| I think you're probably right there. | ||
| He's got a good point. | ||
| But, obviously, it's a terrible thing to do and stupid. | ||
| You know, there's a way to manage that. | ||
| But then these people say, well, you know, now it becomes like the WWE. And, you know, there's people that love real fighting that have a real hard time with these fake WWE-style scenarios where you know that... | ||
| Whether it's Colby Covington, he did a promo recently where he had a girl by the pool and the girl sat in his lap and she obviously had a planned script and seemed kind of corny. | ||
| There's people who think that's great and there's people who fucking hate it. | ||
| I'm the hate it. | ||
| Yeah, I'm the hated too. | ||
| I don't... | ||
| I mean, I don't have a real problem with pro wrestling. | ||
| I joke around about it all the time, and I get the fact that people like it. | ||
| I don't like that kind of shit bleeding into MMA. I think it's dumb. | ||
| It's bad. | ||
| It's also... | ||
| I mean, again... | ||
| If you're viewing it as inspiring artistry with which there are lessons to fucking live your life on one hand, and that's how I truly see it and interface with it and experience it and share it and want to see people get to feel that. | ||
| And then on the other hand, you're putting together these weird scripts to sell pay-per-views. | ||
| But I mean, wrestling, that stuff came up in wrestling because it isn't inherently real. | ||
| It needed those extras. | ||
| It needed all that stuff. | ||
| If we understood how brilliant Colby Covington was, if we understood how brilliant of a combat sportsman he was, he wouldn't have to do that. | ||
| But he's doing that and that's what got him a title shot. | ||
| So on the other side of the coin, we're wrong. | ||
| Well, no, if we understood, he would get it based on that. | ||
| But we don't understand. | ||
| We, the royal we, don't get it. | ||
| It's like, I'll see people talk about fighting after, and they'll be like, and some people, this is their idea of covering a fight, or fans, or people, and everybody's entitled to their own thing, but they'll be like, yeah, the show is kind of a lackluster affair, not a lot of finishes. | ||
| Fuck it, you had 20 brilliant athletes interact and your opinion of how it did or didn't excite you is super valid to you. | ||
| But that's not what we were watching. | ||
| Right, but what I'm talking about is like what got him a title shot. | ||
| What got him a title shot is being an asshole. | ||
| Because of the reality that we live in, that's what he had to do. | ||
| Right, I mean like what he did in Brazil after he beat Damien Maia, said this is a shithole. | ||
| That's literally what got him the title shot. | ||
| I mean if you really stop and think about it, he's ranked, what is he, ranked number three? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| He's only beaten Maia. | ||
| I mean, he's beaten some other people, but in terms of top 10 contenders, in terms of like real world-class fighters, there's a lot of guys that are out there that have fucked up a lot of other people. | ||
| Like, Wonderboy was like, how is this guy fighting for the title, for an interim title, and I'm not? | ||
| After he's gone through those two big fights with Tyron Woodley, beating Jorge Masvidal, beating Johnny Hendricks, beating all these different fighters, Colby beat Damian Maia, and that's really the big name on his resume. | ||
| But it's also because he's going to be fighting Rafael dos Andros, who's a Brazilian. | ||
| He said a lot of stupid shit about Brazil. | ||
| Brazilians hate him. | ||
| Brazil's a giant market. | ||
| It's an easy sell. | ||
| And this is what he's talked himself into. | ||
| And it's a tough fight. | ||
| Don't make no mistake about it. | ||
| The guy that beat Damian Maia is a tough fucking fighter. | ||
| Colby's a tough guy. | ||
| And again, you talk to Dean Thomas or Mike Brown, and they, two years back, when they were talking, and I'm Jorge Masvidal, That's one of those special artists to me. | ||
| And so I'll be asking, you know, like when I'll see Mike or Dean or these guys or anybody around that, I'm like, hey, how's Jorge doing? | ||
| What's he working on? | ||
| What does he change this? | ||
| And they'll talk. | ||
| Oh, and he's always training with Colby. | ||
| He's a fuck. | ||
| He's deadly. | ||
| He's one of the greats in the gym. | ||
| The two of them are first there, last to leave. | ||
| You've heard about how good he was under that public surface. | ||
| But I see what you're saying. | ||
| Based on what we've created, he doesn't have much of a choice if he wants to achieve his goals other than doing it this way. | ||
| And the guys who are good at it, Chael, obviously, Chael is really good at it. | ||
| One of the best ever. | ||
| And he's an entertainer. | ||
| And don't you love Chael? | ||
| I love Chael. | ||
| I fucking love Chael. | ||
| And yet, this is something I find distasteful about this art form is that game. | ||
| Yet somehow Chael is so lovable. | ||
| I love Chael, right? | ||
| But it's because there's a natural love of that kind of performance. | ||
| And Colby, and I've played around with it a little bit when I played in a band where you would be rude and arrogant and play that kind of game. | ||
| It's not, it's hard. | ||
| It's hard. | ||
| It's hard to do. | ||
| It's hard to be convincing. | ||
| It's also hard to be hated all the time. | ||
| That's real. | ||
| You will feel the hatred of all Brazilians who truly hate you, even though you were playing a game. | ||
| And they get fucking real about that shit. | ||
|
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Real! | |
| Brazilians are extremely patriotic. | ||
| Very nationalistic. | ||
| You talk shit about Brazil, you better duck. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And they don't get the joke. | ||
| And in fact... | ||
| Even if you were to talk to somebody like a stereotypically passionate person we're talking about here, and you said it's a joke, and they'd be like, you can't make that joke. | ||
| Their point isn't that I don't care if he was kidding. | ||
| The fact that he was willing to do that is so disrespectful to all of us that we must slit his throat. | ||
| And that's what they'll chant when he goes to walk out there. | ||
| And they mean it. | ||
| Yeah, they do mean it. | ||
| But meanwhile, he just doubled down. | ||
| He didn't give a fuck. | ||
| Even after he got hit in the head with a boomerang. | ||
| Still, doubling down, swinging for the fences. | ||
| What other choice, I guess, do you have? | ||
| Well, look, it has got him to the dance. | ||
| And if he wins two Saturdays from this one, or one Saturday, how's it going? | ||
| Next one is Till and Wonderboy. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| That's another one to talk about. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| But if he wins, he will have a belt. | ||
| I mean, it's not the real belt. | ||
| I mean, it's an interim belt, but it guarantees him a shot at the real belt. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| So it gets very interesting. | ||
| I know that my look at these sort of systems and the areas around it, I have a negative bias. | ||
| It's not about that. | ||
| And I know that's negative to me. | ||
| About the bells. | ||
| Yeah, or the rankings or the beefs or whatever. | ||
| But the belt cannot mean what it meant before. | ||
| By the nature of once upon a time, there were only ever 27 of them, and now there's been 340 of them. | ||
| By nature, it cannot be as valuable as it once was. | ||
| And when there's two in yours, it inherently cannot have the value because scarcity is where value comes from. | ||
| Yeah, it's really just a promotional tool. | ||
| It's a marketing tool. | ||
| And it's a questionable one. | ||
| You know, there's a real good argument that it's a bad idea to have these interim title shots. | ||
| Because, you know, like, okay, well, what's the rules? | ||
| You just decide when to have an interim shot? | ||
| Especially with a guy like Tony Ferguson, right? | ||
| He beats Kevin Lee, spectacular fight, triangles him off his back. | ||
| Lost to Noah. | ||
| Lost to nobody, won the interim title, and then you strip it because he falls down during a promotion? | ||
| He trips on some wires? | ||
| I mean, it's not like he went and did something stupid outside of fighting. | ||
| He was just doing a promotion and tripped on some wires. | ||
| Freak accident. | ||
| And really, if we move away all other things and just look at the systems at play and how and why it's there, if he had another 2 million Instagram followers, that would not happen. | ||
| You're right. | ||
| And that's it. | ||
|
unidentified
|
You're right. | |
| It's strictly that. | ||
| That is true, right? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| If Tony was a giant, huge star, there's no way they would strip him. | ||
| No. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| But by not being... | ||
| Because he's a character. | ||
| He's an oddball. | ||
| He's unique. | ||
| He's one of a kind. | ||
| We should celebrate that. | ||
| He's one of a kind. | ||
| He's an individual. | ||
| He's different than everybody. | ||
| That's a good thing. | ||
| Also, if you're going to strip Conor, which they did, and you have Khabib fight for the title, the true title, and, you know, look, that's arguable whether or not you should do that. | ||
| It should probably be two interim fights or two interim titles. | ||
| Which would be cool. | ||
| He's not beating the champion. | ||
| If he didn't beat the champion, he beat Al Iaquinta. | ||
| How is him beating Al Iaquinta more valid than Tony beating Kevin Lee? | ||
| That's crazy. | ||
| It isn't. | ||
| It's crazy. | ||
| It doesn't make any sense. | ||
| I mean, no taking anything away against Al, but Al took that fight on fucking one day's notice. | ||
| That's even more ridiculous. | ||
| And awesome. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And awesome. | ||
| And awesome. | ||
| I mean, it was a great fight, too. | ||
| It was really fun. | ||
| Well, there's there's a bunch of yeah, it was really fun and I like Ally Quint is another one of these guys. | ||
| How can you not be inspired seeing a guy that's like Life is traveling along and all of a sudden you have this one shot at something. | ||
| You're not ready You don't have you haven't prepared in the ways you want but you know what I'm gonna go for right that's a life lesson you know and there's also like There's a forgiving nature to this machine that is kind of admirable. | ||
| Like, Al has created problems. | ||
| Al has had conflict with that company. | ||
| And then they were still like, you know what, let's do this. | ||
| You know why they did it, though? | ||
| They did it because they wouldn't use Paul Felder. | ||
| The fucking Athletic Commission and all their ridiculous... | ||
| I mean, all their... | ||
| They decided that Paul Felder isn't ranked high enough. | ||
| You don't know shit. | ||
| They don't even know where rankings come from, which is a bunch of people hanging out who kind of watch fighting a bunch and making an arbitrary choice and then combining it. | ||
| Do you know what a first-class noticer is? | ||
| Have you ever heard this term? | ||
| A first-class noticer in business or any number of things is somebody who, over time, you start to see the different systems and how they interact with each other. | ||
| And you are one. | ||
| You clearly are a first class noticer. | ||
| You see big picture, small picture, combine how the outside right now you're like, well, the commission did this, but Paul Felder did that. | ||
| Rankings are this way. | ||
| And you're able to pull all these things together and look at it, right? | ||
| And if you look at any of these things from that perspective of how the systems all work, the whole thing barely makes sense. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| Paul Felder is brilliant. | ||
| And he's a dangerous fight for anybody at 155, including Khabib. | ||
| And committed and mentally strong and a striver. | ||
| And he's a world-class striker. | ||
| And his striking is fucking deadly. | ||
| And he's not just a striker in terms of punching, like Al. | ||
| He's a really nasty kicker. | ||
| I mean, Al can kick, no doubt about it. | ||
| But Paul is a bit more achieved. | ||
| He's got more weapons. | ||
| More complex. | ||
| He's like spinning back fists and elbows and knees and nasty leg kicks. | ||
| And, you know, went three hard rounds with Barboza, went toe-to-toe with him. | ||
| I mean, he's that good. | ||
| He's that good on his feet. | ||
| And smart. | ||
| Yeah, very smart. | ||
| He's a great analyst for such a young one. | ||
| So you're like, how is that possible? | ||
| Because that's really hard. | ||
| And it's a different skill set than just being a good fighter. | ||
| There's language and being able to rationalize things and all these different things. | ||
| But you look back and he did it on the small leagues. | ||
| Which he didn't need to do. | ||
| He pursued because it was of interest to him. | ||
| He pursued it to get good at it because he loved it, which means he's predisposed to thinking that way. | ||
| So now you also have a thinker, a fighter, an incredibly dangerous striker, a guy who can play complex games in it, and you, in your infinite wisdom, don't think he can fight Habib because somebody somewhere said that he put a seven next to his name instead of a three. | ||
| There was a lot of real problems with the Athletic Commission, and we won't go into depth with them. | ||
| I don't want to cause any problems. | ||
| But they had some real issues. | ||
| They're young. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They're new. | |
| Yeah, there's a lot of nonsense that was going on behind the scenes. | ||
| But I think that what was interesting about that fight was we got to see Al step up, we got to see Khabib have some issues with striking, and we got to see... | ||
| I mean... | ||
| What I don't like about it is the whole championship thing. | ||
| What I don't like about it is he didn't beat a champion to become a champion. | ||
| They just sort of set this fight up. | ||
| Al wasn't preparing for that fight. | ||
| He was preparing for a three-round fight. | ||
| And then Tony gets stripped. | ||
| All those things I don't like. | ||
| Yeah, because they don't make any sense. | ||
| Yeah, they don't make any sense. | ||
| They don't really make any sense. | ||
| Because if we have some kind of value root of what we're about other than the necessity to sell things based on the same marketing that we've used, we wouldn't have to be in that situation. | ||
| But we find ourselves there. | ||
| And when you're on the bottom of half guard, you just have to work your way out of half guard. | ||
| And that's what that machine has to do. | ||
| And that's what Habib has to do. | ||
| They got an artificial stand-up. | ||
| Yeah, exactly. | ||
| They couldn't work their way out of half guard. | ||
| They got stood up. | ||
| Yeah, I don't know. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Wonder Boy and Till. | ||
| That's a big fight. | ||
| That's a Saturday. | ||
| That's chaos. | ||
| That fight is very interesting to me. | ||
| I am very, very, very interested in that fight. | ||
| Me too. | ||
| Yeah, I want to see what happens when Till fights Wonderboy because I was stunned by how easily Till ran through Cowboy. | ||
| And Cowboy, in all fairness, is not, in my opinion, a real 170. He's a tweener. | ||
| I think Cowboy would be a 165. And I think maybe his struggles to make 155 maybe should be 10 pounds heavier. | ||
| And I think that 10-pound weight class thing is real. | ||
| I think that's where it should be. | ||
| Every 10 pounds. | ||
| Darren Till is a fucking huge guy. | ||
| So is Steve. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| They're both very tall and strong. | ||
| But Till regularly is well over 200 pounds. | ||
| He's walking around at like... | ||
| You know, fucking 205 and shit and cutting down to 170. That's a good one, man. | ||
| It's a really, you know, there's so many little oddball variables and unknowns, right? | ||
| Like, we literally, when we go and we look at these, the more you've studied and analyzed and commentated fighting for 20 years of your life, the more you realize how little we actually know. | ||
| Like, we have about 2 or 7 or 18% of the actual information. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| And we're trying to work with it. | ||
| And the big one, so when Cody fought Dominic, I was like, I just don't see how he can win. | ||
| I don't see how Cody can win. | ||
| And then somebody would say, well, why'd he say that? | ||
| He knocked out all these guys. | ||
| I'm like, well, yeah, it's hard to get to Dominic. | ||
| And we've never seen evidence of him doing well after those minutes. | ||
| The evidence isn't there to see it. | ||
| Of course, 100% wrong. | ||
| But you have to go by what evidence you have. | ||
| What have we seen or what information have we gathered that can allow us to make this decision? | ||
| To me, Cody Garbrandt did not have, there was no evidence he could beat Dominic. | ||
| And then, boom, beats up Dominic and you're blown away. | ||
| And that's an exciting feeling. | ||
| And that is, I think, what's at play here. | ||
| Is there any evidence that Darren Till can do what Rory McDonald couldn't do and Jorge Masvidal couldn't do and get to a guy who has that movement, that blitz thinking, that karate, those karate instincts we were talking about? | ||
| We've seen no real evidence of that. | ||
| That doesn't mean he can't do it. | ||
| It doesn't mean he can't do it. | ||
| But the evidence isn't there. | ||
| I don't know about that. | ||
| I was stunned by his ability to close the distance on Cowboy, that nasty left elbow that he landed over the top, the way he put him away. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| I think that's pretty good evidence that he's a fucking monster. | ||
| I agree. | ||
| And his fights previous in the UFC as well, although they didn't have a lot of fanfare behind him. | ||
| You know, stunning results. | ||
| And then you talk to people that know him, you know, talk to people that know his striking acumen and people that have seen him in the gym and understand what he's been through in his life. | ||
| And he's a young guy. | ||
| I think he's only 25. How old is Darren Till? | ||
| I'm pretty sure he's 25. He's also never lost, right? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Never. | ||
| It's a fucking beast, man. | ||
| Yeah, and you see the pictures even. | ||
| Yeah, 25 years old. | ||
| That's wild, man. | ||
| But what I'm saying is, I would not be the slightest bit surprised if he could do it. | ||
| Because we've seen enough over time to know that what a 23-year-old is capable of, they'll see the whole game differently. | ||
| They'll see their understanding of where they are in relation to the other guy is so different that one day, all of a sudden, all these 25-year-olds are just so fucking good, and we don't really have the language to explain why. | ||
| Can we just say, oh, he was able to close the distance on Stephen Thompson? | ||
| If he does, we'll say yes. | ||
| But then the question will be, how? | ||
| When nobody else could do it, how and why could he do it? | ||
| And that's always what obsesses me. | ||
| If you see him do it, there is now, the explanation isn't he was better at closing the distance or his range management was excellent. | ||
| That's true for a bit. | ||
| But then my next question the next morning will be like, how the fuck did he do it? | ||
| What changed now? | ||
| What about the entirety of the game itself, the systems of the relationships of two fighters? | ||
| What changed in such a way because of his behavior? | ||
| And that's where it gets to me really, really wild. | ||
| Because right now, nobody gets to Stephen Thompson. | ||
| And I mean, nobody really at all. | ||
| Tyrone has knocked him down twice and had him really badly hurt in both fights. | ||
| There's 50 minutes. | ||
| 50 minutes. | ||
| Yeah, but those are the moments in the fight where they engaged. | ||
| See, the problem with those two Tyron Woodley fights is Woodley fought Wonderboy the right way. | ||
| That's how you gotta fight him. | ||
| You don't engage, and when you do engage, you gotta be absolutely convinced you're gonna land. | ||
| And Tyron did, and did land, and hurt him. | ||
| I mean, you looked at those two fights, Tyron is the one who's the wrestler, but he's also the one that hurt Wonderboy. | ||
| Wonderboy never hurt Tyron in those fights. | ||
| Tyron had him very close to being out. | ||
| I just wonder if Wonderboy is starting to slip. | ||
| You've got to wonder. | ||
| You've got to wonder if all his years of combat sports, all of his years of kickboxing. | ||
| I mean, you've got to remember this guy has one of the most spectacular kickboxing records ever. | ||
| I mean, what is he, like 57-0 or something like that in kickboxing? | ||
| And then he gets into MMA and he loses to Matt Brown. | ||
| He gets kind of beat up on the ground. | ||
| Comes back, has some really good fights, and, you know, has been in there with world-class fighters and beaten some world-class fighters. | ||
| But he's also, I want to say, he's 34, 35, right? | ||
| Yeah, he's getting there. | ||
| And those are a lot of fights. | ||
| Although, until those three examples, he didn't really get hit all that much. | ||
| But it's still the wear and tear on your body. | ||
|
unidentified
|
How old is Steven Thompson? | |
| Find out how old Wonderboy is. | ||
| The hips. | ||
| I want to say, he might even be 35. Yeah. | ||
| The hips and the knees and the shoulders and that whole thing. | ||
| And there's also that he developed mastery in what he does. | ||
| And once you've developed that elite, elite, top level of reached your highest potential, it's hard to keep going. | ||
| And then the masses start to close that distance. | ||
| The general young kid start, you know, a kid at TriStar, like some of their young guys, they have that, and they've had Thompson in there for years, and Faraz has been able to study people like that up close, and they all studied Lyoto. | ||
| Now the young guy can do a lot of those things at a much higher level than fighters that came before them. | ||
| So your level of mastery starts, you plateau to a point that it's hard to go beyond. | ||
| It's really hard work, and sometimes it requires you to get a little shittier. | ||
| For a bit to go past that plateau, to weaken or get worse by having to re-examine what you believe and the way that you train or the way that you fight. | ||
| To break through a plateau, you've got to kind of be willing to go backwards a bit. | ||
| And when you're fighting Tyron Woodley's other world, you cannot go backwards. | ||
| So it kind of stalls you there. | ||
| But ultimately, the big question also is, is there some other strategy that hasn't yet been done that is a Stephen Thompson beater? | ||
| And that low leg kick you talked about, so I cannot get to your – so what would I prefer when I'm fighting Stephen Thompson? | ||
| Body lock. | ||
| If I can get to the body lock, I'll rip him down. | ||
| To get to a body like I got to touch him. | ||
| That's really hard. | ||
| He stops me from doing that. | ||
| Or I got to hit him or kick him. | ||
| But when I do that, he moves away and hits. | ||
| What if I can just get to the edge of his sort of bubble of that hot range where he can hurt you? | ||
| And maybe that low leg kick is a part of that. | ||
| Maybe that low leg kick just getting on the outside of it where you're still somewhat safe, but you can smash him up a little bit. | ||
| Maybe there's a weapon that hasn't been used. | ||
| Well, this is also arguably the best striker that Wonderboy's ever faced in MMA. Arguably, right? | ||
| I mean, Masvidal is a very talented striker as well, but Wonderboy is a master of that front leg, and that front leg is a real tricky one. | ||
| Because that karate style that he uses, he keeps his hands down low, he stands totally sideways on you, and you've got to get past that front leg side kick. | ||
| And Johnny couldn't get past it. | ||
| Hendrix got lit up by that front leg side kick and then front roundhouse kick to the face right afterwards. | ||
| It's just, there's a lot going on with that front leg if you're not used to that. | ||
| And then if you get too obsessed with it, the back leg comes. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Till is a way better master of distance. | ||
| He understands distance and strike and knows how to close that distance with explosive power. | ||
| Very interesting. | ||
| Really interesting. | ||
| And before he fought Cowboy, his successes were fighting at distance and smashing guys who came in. | ||
| So he does do that game. | ||
| He does. | ||
| By doing it, you understand it on a different level. | ||
| You connect to it. | ||
| He does it in a Muay Thai way, whereas Wonderboy does it in a karate way. | ||
| And Wonderboy is fantastic at moving his waist back and forth like a snake. | ||
| Tony's really good at that, too. | ||
| Yes. | ||
| Tony Ferguson's really fucking good at that. | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| And that, so when I get to go study sanda and kung fu and wushu, there are, you know, some of my friends are like, well, you know, like, enjoy it. | ||
| I'm like, No, there's going to be some brilliant shit to learn over here. | ||
| And some of that long fist stuff, like people will often say, well, Kung Fu's not super relevant. | ||
| Some of that long fist reaching where I move my body through space to reach you, which people would say is dangerous, you get countered. | ||
| The answer is don't get countered. | ||
| The answer isn't discard a valuable weapon. | ||
| And so you see some of that. | ||
| Tony does that stuff regularly. | ||
| Really, really, really well. | ||
| He does a lot of kung fu. | ||
| It's really cool. | ||
| He does. | ||
| See him work with the Wing Chun dummy? | ||
| Yeah, that's cool, man. | ||
| Yeah, he does a lot of that stuff. | ||
| Wing Chun, too. | ||
| When I'm sitting in your guard wanting to beat you up, tell me that isn't Wing Chun, just we're attached. | ||
| That's what that is. | ||
| That's what that is, right? | ||
| Yeah, I mean, there's techniques in every single art that are like an established, realistic art that are valuable. | ||
| And there's got to be something in Wing Chun that people are missing. | ||
| For sure. | ||
| It's there. | ||
| I mean... | ||
| Arts like that, people would look at and might discard because they would think they're limited to only this scenario. | ||
| Well, that scenario happens. | ||
| I'm in your guard and I want to fight. | ||
| That's that scenario. | ||
| So that thing may not be useful to fight Frank Mir, but that thing will be useful in a context when you're fighting a guy like that. | ||
| Well, how about John Jones' use of you grab his wrist and he comes over the top with an elbow? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I mean, that is hand trapping. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, for sure. | |
| I mean, it really is what it is. | ||
| Or when he glovered Teixeira. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, yeah. | |
| That's limb destruction. | ||
| Yep, yep. | ||
| That's old school limb destruction. | ||
| How and why that hasn't been... | ||
| Rabbit-holed a lot more. | ||
| Although you do start to see that in that moment where I get to four points and I'm going to stand up and you just kind of decide, okay, that's all right, we'll get back to the fence. | ||
| In that process of standing up, a lot of guys throw a fight-finishing kick there or just at least take that chance to smash your leg with one. | ||
| There's free shots that exist in these moments and Jon Jones is a master of finding them. | ||
| He really is. | ||
| Yeah, I hope they figure out what the fuck they're going to do with him soon. | ||
| I don't know where they stand now in terms of his suspension or what have you, but here's my ultimate goal, my hope, my dream, is that Cormier fights Stipe for the heavyweight title, and somewhere around then they announce when Jon Jones' suspension is up, they announce Jon Jones versus Brock Lesnar. | ||
| Oh, man. | ||
| Love it. | ||
| I love it. | ||
| I mean, look at their body types and look at what they are and where they come from. | ||
| I mean, I love it. | ||
| But I know you've sat down with John and stuff. | ||
| What did he feel like? | ||
| Do you know what I mean? | ||
| What read did you get from him? | ||
| Did you feel like he was saying the things that he thought you wanted to hear? | ||
| Or did you feel he was being honest and genuine? | ||
|
unidentified
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He's... | |
| Definitely both. | ||
| He's being honest and he's also had some things that he planned out. | ||
| I like John a lot. | ||
| I really love that guy. | ||
| But I think he surrounds himself with a bunch of knuckleheads. | ||
| I think he's around too many people that are of bad influence and I think he's a wild man. | ||
| And I think when he's a wild man around other people that are sort of indulging that stuff with him... | ||
| This is the word that I get not just from what I know, but from the people that know him very well. | ||
| Is that he's just around the wrong people. | ||
| You know, he's got bad influences. | ||
| And, I mean, if you can identify that, then you must change it. | ||
| Yeah, it's not to take any personal responsibility away from him either, because I'm sure he also makes for a bad influence to them. | ||
| I mean, if the fucking baddest man on the planet can live like this, I'll live like this too. | ||
| Fuck it. | ||
| Let's do more coke. | ||
| You know, let's party harder. | ||
| Let's drive fast. | ||
| Let's go drunk. | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| You know, I don't know what the answer is for a guy like John, I really don't know. | ||
| He's got to have that come to Jesus moment. | ||
| Or not. | ||
| Maybe he just keeps doing what he's doing and keeps beating everybody's ass and people keep forgiving him and hopefully he doesn't wind up in jail. | ||
| But he should for sure get a driver. | ||
| For sure get someone to fucking drive him around. | ||
| That's a good band-aid but it's not going to be the problem solver. | ||
| The truth is I think I mean, we get to live the life that we want. | ||
| We get to choose the things that we do. | ||
| To a certain extent. | ||
| Yeah, to a certain extent. | ||
| I know free will is something that you've discussed, and it's a fascinating concept. | ||
| But to some degree, we are authoring our own lives. | ||
| And if it isn't going the way that you want it, small, tiny changes can push it a different way. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It's a matter of whether or not he's willing to make those changes. | ||
| And right now, I'm sure he just wants to get his license back. | ||
| But when I see him having these battles back and forth with Chuck Liddell online, I'm like... | ||
| You gotta walk away from that. | ||
| Chuck Liddell is an old warrior who's clearly taking too many shots. | ||
| Calling him an old man and saying all this stuff. | ||
| It's like, just be the better man in this situation. | ||
| You're at the top of the heap right now, at the top of your game. | ||
| You don't want some young guy doing this to you 15 years from now, talking to you that way. | ||
| These are the dark days. | ||
| But when we turn the TV on, I don't care if you watch CNN or Fox or CNBC or whatever, or the NFL or hockey or fighting or whatever, a lot of what we see is a bunch of heads who somebody has said, you choose different sides, or they know that's what they should do, and then they just argue. | ||
| And we watch it, we're taught it, we see it every single day all the time. | ||
| Does that drive you crazy? | ||
| It drives me crazy when it comes to fighting. | ||
| The sports guy talk... | ||
| That drives me nuts when it comes to fighting because they have this sort of robotic, predetermined pattern of behavior that they apply to football and baseball. | ||
| I just feel like fighting is more personal, more intimate. | ||
| There's more on the line. | ||
| There's more at stake. | ||
| It means more to me. | ||
| And when I see that Dopey sports guy jock talk applied to fighting. | ||
| It makes me angry. | ||
| It makes me angry, too. | ||
| But for different reasons as well. | ||
| One is this doesn't apply exactly as you said. | ||
| And the other one is, does it even apply to football or anything? | ||
| Because it's ritualistic. | ||
| Like, it acts as if this show doesn't exist. | ||
| The reason it looks... | ||
| So we were talking about how things' meanings change. | ||
| Once upon a time, that was a professional speaker. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Now that is a rehearsed, over-strategized, constructed, artificial speaker. | ||
| In a world where someone watches the fucking Joe Rogan podcast or goes on and sees Dwayne training guys or watches a supermodel on Instagram or sees what The Rock is cooking, like I said, we see real people everywhere. | ||
| So now this becomes ritualistic and artificial. | ||
|
unidentified
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You know what it is, man? | |
| It's a strip club DJ. Hey, coming to the top stage! | ||
| It's like that predetermined sort of pattern of behavior. | ||
| They adopt this pattern. | ||
| And, you know, there's a lot of people that adopt that sports guy pattern. | ||
| And there's a lot of shitty writers that do it, too. | ||
| Sure! | ||
| And they apply that insulting style of writing to combat sports. | ||
| And some of them have never been inside a cage in their fucking life. | ||
| And barely even trained. | ||
| Most of them. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| No, it's... | ||
| If you... | ||
| If you have not been kicked in the fucking head in front of your mother, you have no right to criticize. | ||
| My mother never saw me fight. | ||
| I fucking got... | ||
| Oh, God. | ||
| I got... | ||
| I wouldn't want that pressure. | ||
| So a couple of punches happen and I get caught in a guillotine. | ||
| And I'm thinking I'm okay and I'm driving my shoulder in and then I start to go out and I'm just... | ||
| And I kind of hit him and then I tap. | ||
| And I look up and my mom is right fucking there. | ||
| She's right there. | ||
| And... | ||
| My mom, my family is wonderful, right? | ||
| Like, I got the best wife that humans have ever had, and my parents, and her parents, I'm surrounded by great people. | ||
| And I know that my mother literally was looking at me like, I'm proud of you, you know, don't worry, this happens. | ||
| But my memory has her going... | ||
| Well, she's probably just sad. | ||
| Sure she's going to shake her head. | ||
| She's sad. | ||
| Yeah, but if you haven't been through that, if you haven't experienced failure, if you haven't been carried out on a stretcher as everybody boos you or felt victory or been terrified, you cannot logically criticize them because you don't understand. | ||
| Even if you haven't done it, if you have some respect for it, I respect you. | ||
| Just understand what they're going through. | ||
| I don't think you necessarily have to have gone to war to be a war correspondent to understand it, to talk about it. | ||
| You don't have to have shot someone to be able to understand what people are going through, or at least try to comprehend it, but have some respect about it. | ||
| There's a way to criticize technique and movement without being insulting. | ||
| And I think this is a part of the problem. | ||
| The sports guy attitude is an insulting attitude. | ||
| It's a judgmental one. | ||
| Yeah, it's judgmental and mocking. | ||
| And I think they play to Johnny Lunchbox. | ||
| I think they play to dum-dums. | ||
| And it really hurts my feelings when I see that sort of strategy applied to covering mixed martial arts. | ||
| Yeah, and like I said, it acts as if, as less and less people consume this older, but valid interface, television, less and less, and more and more are consuming other things that are different and new and stuff. | ||
| It's bizarre that the old one starts to say, "Yeah, well, we still do it this way." You can't do it that way because people – now it looks weird and old. | ||
| Now it looks – its context has changed because we have seen thousands. | ||
| We've seen what Michael Chandler ate today and how he held his son. | ||
| And this guy is saying, "Well, you know, striker versus grappler." And it's just – Trevor Burrus: They haven't evolved. | ||
| Yeah, you have to. | ||
| You have to re-step in, and this applies to us all. | ||
| You have to re-step in, look at where you are and what its meaning is, and realize, oh, technology changed, the audience changed, the world changed, my life changed, the economy changed, the market. | ||
| All of these things have changed. | ||
| I'm still the same. | ||
| I'm a dinosaur. | ||
| That doesn't make sense. | ||
| I can't do that. | ||
| I must change. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right, right. | |
| But the reason sports television, the NFL, or many of these things, news, doesn't, is it starts out that there are innovators. | ||
| So in fighting, it was Dana White and the Fertittas, and you guys, and the vital, young, innovative creators. | ||
| And then as it grows, you need organized thinkers. | ||
| You need people who can organize and structure something so that it can grow. | ||
| The problem is they get really good at structuring hierarchies. | ||
| They get really good at structuring business in such a way that they are then in charge. | ||
| And then when it changes, you need those creatives again. | ||
| But these structure guys are there and they've built these formulas that they are then bound by. | ||
| Where it's like, well, of course we're starting with the opening shot, and then we're going to go, we're right here in Brazil, shot of Christ the Redeemer, and then we'll go, and here we've got a, oh, it's an unbelievable matchup with the winner gets the title shot. | ||
| Those are rituals. | ||
| Those are bizarre, formulaic rituals created when they mattered and they were valuable by highly intelligent people that were required to make this work. | ||
| But now you need different people. | ||
| You need a different thought. | ||
| You need the creatives back in, and they usually don't want that. | ||
| Yeah, I think I like your point about different approaches. | ||
| And I think one of the best ways to maybe perhaps have a different approach is to have more intense coverage of training footage. | ||
| And I think they're doing that with the Embedded series, those online things. | ||
| I'd like more people to check those out. | ||
| I think if more people got an understanding of how much is involved in this. | ||
| Like when people get injured and pull out of fights, like some people will freak out and complain and write a bunch of stupid shit. | ||
| Like, I don't know what happened to Mirko Krokop. | ||
| But you can't say anything bad about him. | ||
| He's a superhero. | ||
| He's a superhero. | ||
| If that guy pulls out of a fight, you gotta go, well, he obviously must be too hurt to fight. | ||
| And this is part of the game. | ||
| But I've read some ridiculous shit that people have said about Mirko. | ||
| I went to Canelo's page the other day. | ||
| Oh my god. | ||
| There's pictures of Canelo Alvarez and people are, you know, judging his body and saying he looks tiny now and there's all these emojis of pills and needles all throughout his entire Instagram post. | ||
| The comments are ruthless. | ||
| Just ruthlessly fucking insulting. | ||
| I mean, this is just the world we live in now. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It is. | |
| It is. | ||
| I did a breakdown on Vitor. | ||
| And, like, you know, you go in. | ||
| And Instagram, at least in my experience, is the least negative. | ||
| Because it's the newest. | ||
| What's the most negative? | ||
| Probably YouTube. | ||
| I agree. | ||
| Yeah, probably YouTube. | ||
| Because it's the oldest. | ||
| Is that what it is? | ||
| Yeah! | ||
| Because as things get older, a lot of negativity is around and positive people leave. | ||
| Positive people leave because they go on, they're on the early part of the technological adoption life cycle. | ||
| Positive people are innovators and early adopters and they go on to the newer thing. | ||
| And then you leave behind the people who were negative and made the whole place go septic, and then they just argue with each other. | ||
| I wonder. | ||
| I wonder if that's the case. | ||
| I've never really figured out what is wrong with YouTube comments, but they're so ruthless. | ||
| Like, whenever I have a liberal woman on, in particular... | ||
| Who you have on with an open mind and are interested in their perspective. | ||
| Some of them are my friends, like Abby Martin. | ||
| When she's on, I don't even fucking touch those comments. | ||
| Or Whitney. | ||
| When Whitney Cummings is on, I don't even... | ||
| I don't look at the comments, period. | ||
| But if I did, those would be the last ones that I would look... | ||
| Because they've looked at them before, and Whitney contacted me, and she's like, what in the fuck? | ||
| And I was like, don't read that shit. | ||
| It's like, don't taste the poison. | ||
| Wherever the positive people are, if you're going to spend time, and I like to because if 50,000 people watch me do a breakdown, that means a lot to me. | ||
| And if 60 of them commented, if I can schedule in the day 45 minutes, I'm going to take the time and thank as many of them as I can. | ||
| But only where the good ones, only where the positive ones are. | ||
| Not that I want to be reinforced at what I'm doing, but I'm not going to spend the time on people who are going through life so negative that I can't get through to them anyways. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Right. | |
| Somebody who's going through life looking for something and trying to either be inspired or learn something or be positive. | ||
| Those are the people that you should spend time with. | ||
| And it's also like the reverse of giving candy to your kid when they're bad. | ||
| It's like, don't go give those people candy when they're negative. | ||
| You want them to get away from that. | ||
| You want their lives to get better, which you will if they stop having that behavior. | ||
| Yeah, maybe. | ||
| Some of them are just so broken. | ||
| It's just like their structure is so poor. | ||
| The structure of their thinking is so poor. | ||
| And, you know, a lot of them are like shut-ins and there's a lot of people with mental illness that are just constantly commenting. | ||
| For sure. | ||
| And then there's the argument to kill the comments, but then people get furious at you. | ||
| We had an issue for a while, and it was an accidental issue. | ||
| And the issue was, during the stream, we don't allow the live chat. | ||
| Because it was always like, cunt, your mother's a cunt. | ||
| It's just poor shit. | ||
| Because people were just trying to get attention. | ||
| If we read that stream while we were doing the show, the show would be inexorably altered. | ||
| You know, you would be altered by like, what? | ||
| What are you saying? | ||
| Don't say that. | ||
| Like you would read it and then that would be the show. | ||
| The show would be these people as well as you. | ||
| Well, it's just not necessary. | ||
| Or valuable. | ||
| Because of the fact that we had the comments killed during the live feed, you couldn't chat during the live feed, when we would transfer it over to YouTube, the comments would be disabled, and people went crazy. | ||
| And I had a tweet about it, but look, I'm not disabling the comments. | ||
| I don't know what this glitch is, but they're going to figure it out. | ||
| But Schaub decided to disable his comments on purpose. | ||
| And dude, they fucking went crazy. | ||
| And they were attacking him. | ||
| But what are the numbers that give a shit? | ||
| Have you ever commented on a YouTube video? | ||
| Have you ever watched a YouTube video and commented on it? | ||
| I don't think I ever have. | ||
| I never have either. | ||
| I don't know anybody worth a fuck that has. | ||
| Like, that's the part of the problem. | ||
| It's like, I know there's some really positive comments and people who are healthy people who are just interested in debate and discussion about particular topics, but when you're dealing with all these negative people, like, what are the numbers? | ||
| If you have a million people watching a YouTube video, are we talking about a hundred people that are cunts? | ||
| A thousand? | ||
| Is it even? | ||
| I don't even think it's a thousand. | ||
| Is it two hundred? | ||
| It might not even be a hundred. | ||
| You might be dealing with like thirty cunts. | ||
| And they're the ones who are going to be mad that you disable the comments. | ||
| But does that really matter? | ||
| And is keeping that cesspool open, keeping that commode open for them to dump their fucking verbal diarrhea into, is that giving the kid candy for being an asshole? | ||
| Is it the same thing? | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| I once saw you stand and talk to 600 people who came to your show. | ||
| You had an in-depth conversation. | ||
| Chemtrails this and fucking fighting that with each of them. | ||
| In the eye, you spent for sure four hours when you took a bunch of your friends out for dinner and invited me, which was really cool. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| I brag about it all the time. | ||
| And then I saw you walk across. | ||
| That was four hours for sure. | ||
| Okay, two to four hours. | ||
| I don't know the exact number. | ||
| Then I see you walk across the casino, and in that time, you do it again for another half hour. | ||
|
unidentified
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As, you know, Joey Diaz is like, oh, bro, you know? | |
| And then we sit down, and somebody comes over as soon as you sit down, and they say, hey, can I? And you go, fuck off, man, I'm eating. | ||
| That's the guy who will tell the world Joe Rogan's an asshole. | ||
| Well, I didn't say fuck off. | ||
| I said, come on, man, I'm eating. | ||
| You can't just stop your meal every time someone comes over. | ||
| It's a rude thing to ask. | ||
| There was 800 human deep interactions, meaningful interactions. | ||
| That one can fuck off. | ||
| Well, I don't want to say fuck off. | ||
| I just think that people have this distorted idea of space. | ||
| That they should just be able to invade your space while you literally have a mouth full of food. | ||
| I mean, I've had it happen when I was feeding my daughter. | ||
| Have her in my lap. | ||
| Can I get a selfie? | ||
| You definitely can't get a selfie right now while I'm feeding my daughter. | ||
| Get the fuck out of here, man. | ||
| But that's just a misunderstanding of... | ||
| Space. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Of your personal space. | ||
| You're a human. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It is a strange thing. | ||
| I mean, I didn't watch... | ||
| My wife was asking me, because I was in Singapore, if I watched the Royal Wedding. | ||
| I'm like, no. | ||
| I don't get that. | ||
| I don't understand that at all. | ||
| I don't understand the motivation for doing it. | ||
| Me neither. | ||
| I don't even want to get into it. | ||
| But those are still humans. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yes. | |
| Those are still people. | ||
| And people don't understand. | ||
| That woman shits. | ||
| She does. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| They're people. | ||
| Can you imagine if the person asks you while you're feeding your daughter, if somebody did that, maybe the first time he'd be like, well, I can't believe this guy wants to take a selfie with me. | ||
| But after that, you're still living your human life. | ||
| The only one you have. | ||
| You just can't interrupt people while they're sitting at dinner with their family or with their friends. | ||
| They're just sitting there cutting food up. | ||
| They don't owe you that. | ||
| And you shouldn't ask for that. | ||
| That's just not the way to do it. | ||
| It's just not. | ||
| And you've got to know when people can't stop. | ||
| They just can't. | ||
| Just say hi. | ||
| Can't you just say hi? | ||
| No one can say hi. | ||
| Everybody wants to dress up their Facebook. | ||
| Everyone needs that fucking selfie. | ||
| It's just like... | ||
| We're in a weird space with that stuff, that whole social media shit, because people want something from you that they get up to. | ||
| It's not just that they're a fan and they want to say hi. | ||
| They want something from you to make them look cooler. | ||
| And it's like you can give them some currency. | ||
| It's like you're a Pokemon, and they can pick you up and get a point from it. | ||
| It's weird. | ||
| It really is. | ||
| Yeah, it is weird. | ||
| So I told you I was in... | ||
| Oh, shit! | ||
| Fabrizio Verdum got flagged. | ||
| And he was just going to fight in Russia, I think, against Olnyak. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| Well, that's not happening. | ||
| That's a wrap. | ||
| That's a wrap on that. | ||
| He's 40 years old, trying to compete in something that's a young man's game. | ||
| That's the thing. | ||
| It's like... | ||
| You can get mad, you can get outraged, and that's a reasonable result, a reasonable response if you want. | ||
| But if you rationalize, if you have empathy, it's like this guy still wants to do this thing that his body won't allow him to do, and so he's willing to bend the rules to attempt it. | ||
| He failed, and now he's going to have to pay the consequences. | ||
| Yeah, it's a month after his knockout loss to Volkov. | ||
| Right. | ||
| Volkov fucked him up, man. | ||
| That guy's dangerous. | ||
| That guy's fucking dangerous. | ||
| Big, long, tall, knockout artist. | ||
| The heavyweight thing is a whole other thing. | ||
| It's a whole other thing, man. | ||
| And when you get these seven-footers that can kick ass, like Volkov, that's a fucking nightmare. | ||
| What is he like? | ||
| He's at least 6'11", right? | ||
| It's scary. | ||
| Volkov's... | ||
| How tall is he? | ||
| He's a big guy. | ||
| He's bigger than Verdum by a lot. | ||
| So call it 6'6", 6'7". | ||
| Somewhere in that range, right? | ||
| And Verdum is, what, 6'4", right? | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| Somewhere around that range? | ||
| Have you ever met Brett Rogers? | ||
| Who's Brett Rogers? | ||
| The wrestler? | ||
| No, Brett Rogers fought... | ||
| Oh, Brett Grimm Rogers? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, fought Fedor. | ||
| Strikeforce. | ||
| Yeah, that guy. | ||
| That's the biggest person I've ever met. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Really? | |
| Yeah. | ||
| I don't know what it was about his frame, but I was trying to interview... | ||
| And he was only 6'9 or 6'8 or something, but it was the physical frame of him. | ||
| And I was just like... | ||
| It was so wild. | ||
| I saw Triple H in a restaurant one time, and I was like... | ||
| Whoa, like giant dude. | ||
| Yeah, these big athletes like this, like what the force that they can generate, like Ngannou, that ability to create that type of power and impact. | ||
| There's a crazy picture of Ngannou standing next to a professional basketball player, and Ngannou looks like a tiny person. | ||
| It's so weird. | ||
| Ngannou looks like I look when I stand next to him. | ||
| I mean, not quite as much contrast, but pretty ridiculous. | ||
| There it is. | ||
| Look at that. | ||
| What? | ||
| That's absurd. | ||
| Fucking crazy. | ||
| There's more always, but I have a Chihuahua. | ||
| I have a Chihuahua, and you have your dog. | ||
| You put them beside each other, and you're like, that can't be the same species. | ||
| I know. | ||
| It's weird, right? | ||
| Humans are just like dogs in that way. | ||
| We vary so wildly in our size. | ||
| Hey, listen, dude. | ||
| Let's wrap this up. | ||
| Tell people where they can get your breakdowns and your MMA stuff. | ||
| If you're from Dublin, Ireland, I'm there doing my one-man show June 22nd. | ||
| How often are you doing this? | ||
| I'm doing... | ||
| This will be the fifth, I think. | ||
| Nice. | ||
| And there was one practice, one sort of friends and family. | ||
| I learned a lot from it. | ||
| Then Winnipeg, then London, Ontario. | ||
| And I did because I knew, you know, hominic. | ||
| And I've got some good friends there that would be supportive. | ||
| And that was good. | ||
| Then I sold out a little venue in Toronto. | ||
| It went really, really well. | ||
| And then now Ireland. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Nice. | |
| So the 22nd in Ireland. | ||
| On my Instagram page, you can click through. | ||
| And John Cavanaugh is going to be my guest. | ||
| Beautiful. | ||
| Do you have a website that people can go to? | ||
| It's coming up. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Okay. | |
| Okay. | ||
| It literally could be coming up today or in the next couple of days. | ||
| I think it's robinblackmma.com. | ||
| And robinblackmma on Twitter. | ||
| Yeah, and Instagram. | ||
| And if you follow me on Instagram, I set out to do 100 breakdowns in three months, and I've done 118 in three months. | ||
| That's how you try to develop mastery. | ||
| You've just got to be prolific and try. | ||
| Well, it's also how you develop a great following, you know? | ||
| It's awesome. | ||
| Appreciate you, bro. | ||
| Thanks, brother. | ||
|
unidentified
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Thanks. | |
| Let's do this again. | ||
| Please. | ||
| Robin Black, ladies and gentlemen. |
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