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Jan. 9, 2018 - The Joe Rogan Experience
03:05:15
Joe Rogan Experience #1061 - Tom Papa
Participants
Main voices
j
joe rogan
01:56:47
t
tom papa
58:10
Appearances
Clips
j
jamie vernon
00:57
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Speaker Time Text
unidentified
Three, two, one...
Happy New Year, Tom Papa!
See how happy you get?
joe rogan
Thank you for the gift.
tom papa
You're welcome.
joe rogan
I've always wanted one of these.
tom papa
It's amazing.
joe rogan
Not really.
tom papa
It is.
joe rogan
I got two things that I really don't want today.
One was herpes.
unidentified
No.
joe rogan
One was Yeezys.
unidentified
You'll love them.
joe rogan
He got me the wrong pair and I said, take these back.
These are yours.
You keep them.
And he came back and brought me the right size.
He insists.
First he brought me the wrong size.
tom papa
What's wrong with them?
joe rogan
They're fucking preposterous.
tom papa
Let me see them.
joe rogan
If you were Brendan Chobb, they're the perfect thing because they're in.
This looks like something from the 90s.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like some kind of shoe from the 90s.
Now, what level of outrage would there be if I started wearing these to run the mountains?
tom papa
What if they were really comfortable and you liked them?
joe rogan
Is that what's going on?
So you think that if I put them on, I would all of a sudden love them and I would get it.
tom papa
Those are street?
unidentified
Maybe.
tom papa
Are those for the street?
joe rogan
Does he have, like, a bird heel where you have, like, an extra hook in the back of the heel?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, why does it go, like, a normal heel?
Like, here's a normal heel.
tom papa
Right.
Flat.
Flush.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's flat.
This, like, goes out at an angle.
unidentified
This one does, too.
joe rogan
That does, too.
tom papa
It's the boost.
unidentified
It's the stylish shoe.
It's the bottom.
It's part of the Adidas.
tom papa
Is it the style or is it the feel that you really like?
unidentified
The feel.
Well, both.
Honestly, both.
But these are really comfortable shoes.
joe rogan
The Boost is super comfortable.
Is this an Adidas made shoe?
Oh, so Adidas makes the Yeezys?
jamie vernon
Yeah, and there's just no Adidas logo on there, so it's hard to tell that.
tom papa
You're starting to like them.
You're starting to warm up.
joe rogan
Well, it's weird how they have this military style number thing on the side, like some fucking Korean missile.
What is that?
unidentified
I couldn't tell you what it stands for.
tom papa
I've seen multiple things.
jamie vernon
It could just be supply, or it could be an acronym for something.
tom papa
Yeah, they look like they're from the 90s.
unidentified
It does, right?
Enjoy them.
joe rogan
Thank you, sir.
Why an accordion?
Are you a monkey?
No, the guy has the accordion.
The monkey dances.
tom papa
The monkey dances.
I love the sound of the accordion.
And I just saw it.
And I just wanted to bring something to the new studio.
I like how you have a lot of weird shit here.
And this is weird.
That somebody loved this sound so much that they decided, let's make an instrument out of it.
joe rogan
Yeah, are there like real complicated ones of those?
Big.
Do people play them in orchestras and shit?
tom papa
No, I don't think they ever made it into the orchestra.
joe rogan
So it's never been like a really respected piece of musical instrument?
tom papa
Zydeco, New Orleans, Buckwheat Zydeco, you ever hear that guy?
joe rogan
Sure, yeah.
tom papa
Polka, a lot of Polish polka.
joe rogan
Do you remember Zamfir, master of the pan flute?
tom papa
Of course.
joe rogan
What happened to that poor bastard?
Like, he had a whole marketing team behind him.
They're like, dude, no one's done this.
No one's done this, but we're gonna do this.
Master of the pan flute.
DVDs, CDs, VHS tapes.
We're gonna sell it all.
tom papa
There's literally no competition.
joe rogan
There's nothing.
tom papa
You can do this.
joe rogan
You're Zamfier.
He's the Tony Hawk of the pan flute, right?
And here he is.
Give me some volume on this guy.
tom papa
Look at the chest hair.
joe rogan
And the chain.
Gold chain.
20 million records?
tom papa
What?
unidentified
He looks like a guy that works in the deli.
joe rogan
That is a very forgettable sound.
It's a recorder.
It's like one of the things you learn when you're in fourth grade and they teach you music.
That goofy flute-like thing.
I never paid attention to the recorder because they gave me the recorder and I go, how come I don't see this in bands?
Get the fuck out of here.
I'm not going to spend some time learning an instrument that no one plays.
tom papa
You had to though, and you had to carry it in your sock.
Don't you remember?
You had to put it in your sock.
They didn't even have cases.
They'd just give you an old tube sock from your dad and put it in there.
joe rogan
That's right.
No one makes a case for the fucking recorder.
tom papa
No!
You have to put in your dad's sock.
joe rogan
And it didn't make any sense either that it was, oh, he's got it?
tom papa
Oh, this is Jethro Tull.
joe rogan
But he plays a flute, right?
jamie vernon
Well, it said pan flute when I typed it in, but it's just a flute, rock flute.
joe rogan
Well, he's a bad motherfucker.
tom papa
Yeah, Jethro Tull's...
unidentified
He's good and crazy.
joe rogan
What a freaky looking dude.
tom papa
He looks like he lives in a hollowed out tree.
Right?
joe rogan
He does.
Oh my god.
tom papa
Scurries out when you walk by on the trail.
Hello!
joe rogan
Has anybody else figured out how to use the flute in rock and roll music besides Jethro Tull?
tom papa
Uh, yeah, there's been some flute.
There's been, uh...
joe rogan
But not like him, right?
No.
Where it's a part of it.
tom papa
The lead.
He's the lead guy.
joe rogan
Isn't that weird how a band will come along and they'll just figure out how to do something that no one's figured out?
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Yeah, exactly.
No, we're going to do this.
joe rogan
Yeah, we're just going to throw a flute in the mix.
And then everybody's like, I like it.
tom papa
It kind of works.
Should we get a flute?
I was doing this show last weekend and this guy had an oboe.
In San Francisco, he's one of the oboists in the world.
And he's playing this instrument.
It's very melancholy, just beautiful.
But it really was occurring to me, like, why?
Who built this?
Who thought this sound was so important?
When?
That they decided, we're going to make an instrument so we can recreate this feeling and this sound for all those instruments.
joe rogan
Boy, if you gave me a pen and a paper and told me to draw an oboe, I'd be fucked.
tom papa
Yeah, it's not what I thought it was.
I was like, oh yeah, I'll see that.
joe rogan
Before you pull up a picture of it, let me think of what it looks like.
I'm thinking of a trombone.
I'm thinking of a thing where, but it's definitely not that.
unidentified
I thought it was way bigger.
joe rogan
Okay, pull it up.
Let me see what the oboe is.
tom papa
Straight up.
joe rogan
Oh, it looks like a flute.
tom papa
Yeah, it's straight.
It looks almost like a clarinet.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah, a clarinet.
That's what I'm thinking, not a flute.
tom papa
That looks more clarinet-ish.
joe rogan
That looks pretty badass.
tom papa
Oboe and pop.
joe rogan
That's in Waterworld?
unidentified
I don't know.
joe rogan
Not the movie, right?
tom papa
That's not a good example.
unidentified
You know what's fucked up?
joe rogan
Waterworld's a terrible movie.
Waterworld's a terrible movie, but they have a damn good theme show at Universal.
It's very good.
tom papa
It's really good.
joe rogan
But it's amazing.
It's like nobody watched that fucking movie.
It was a gigantic flop.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
But still, in 2018, they put on a jammin' live show with Waterworld.
So everybody's like, wait, what the fuck is this based on?
unidentified
Right.
joe rogan
This is some sort of dystopian world where, like, everybody is drowning, right?
The water's risen to the top of everything, and there's baddies and good people, and then there's stunt people that are risking their lives as explosions and fire.
Flying jet skis.
I went to see it with my family.
unidentified
It's hot.
joe rogan
We got fucking drenched, by the way.
If you're going to go to see this, don't go during a cold day.
It doesn't matter good or bad seats, man.
That shit goes up into the 15th, 16th rows.
tom papa
Look at that.
That is good production value.
joe rogan
It's great because it's like a play, but it's fun to watch.
It's very enjoyable.
tom papa
That's all Kevin Costner had to do, was just do this.
He didn't have to make that gigantic movie.
joe rogan
Well, that movie just...
tom papa
Dennis Hopper?
joe rogan
That movie was a...
I had some friends that worked on it that were stunt people in the movie, and they were just talking about the amount of money that, like, whenever you're filming anything involving water, like, you're fucked.
Everything is insanely expensive.
tom papa
Right, right.
joe rogan
Everything is...
tom papa
Your cameras, your...
joe rogan
It's all underwater.
Everything's water.
It's wet.
Everything's wet.
The whole thing was crazy.
And it sucked.
It did suck.
tom papa
I tried to watch it actually recently.
joe rogan
Fucking terrible movie.
tom papa
It's got a cigar.
It's a cool idea that the seas have risen and now you have to live on this boat.
joe rogan
Yeah, but he's in a fight for his life and shit, and he's got a fucking cigar in his mouth.
tom papa
It's one of those movies.
Yeah, and they have weird comedic guys, and then Dennis Hopper looks cool, but it's kind of weird.
joe rogan
Yeah, see?
These guys are about to shoot him, and he's got a cigar in his mouth.
Look, everybody's dirty, but it's wet out.
Get in the water, you fuck!
You dirty, stinky bitch!
There's water everywhere!
tom papa
That's a great point.
Why are they filthy?
The whole place is a tub.
joe rogan
It's because it's a rip-off of Mad Max.
But Mad Max, the dystopian Mad Max movie, was made in a place where there's no fucking water.
tom papa
Here in the desert.
joe rogan
They had a reason to be dirty, you fucking plagiarists.
tom papa
Just jump in the water.
joe rogan
See, he's fighting for his lifer and he's got a cigar in his mouth.
Spit the cigar out, you cunt.
You're gonna get shot.
unidentified
Jesus.
joe rogan
Jesus Christ.
tom papa
I did like that boat, though.
That was a pretty cool boat that he could control the whole thing.
joe rogan
It's bad, but it's not nearly as bad as the postman.
The Postman was another dystopian movie that was a colossal failure starring Kevin Costner.
I'm not shitting on Kevin Costner.
I'm a huge Kevin Costner fan.
I love that guy.
But he was in a couple of stinkers that kind of tanked him for a long time.
The Postman from 1997 is one of the worst movies in the history of bad movies.
So bad that I will get high and watch it occasionally just for the fucking yucks.
tom papa
I've never even seen this one.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah, in the future.
tom papa
Oh, and that's Simeon Ribisi, whatever his name is.
joe rogan
Yeah, whatever, Giovanni Ribisi.
unidentified
Giovanni Ribisi.
joe rogan
Yeah, you get kicked in the head there.
In this movie, like...
tom papa
Who is he?
joe rogan
Kevin Costner has to deliver the letters.
It's like this big thing.
In the future, there's no post office anymore, so he's got to be like the postman, but they're trying to kill him.
Look, they're going to fucking get him.
He's got to run across the bridge.
tom papa
He's like, I've got letters.
joe rogan
He's got the mail.
What are you doing?
The fuck are you doing with these letters?
I gotta bring them.
tom papa
It's important we communicate.
jamie vernon
Is this all because the Dances with Wolves was so good?
unidentified
They tried to redo it?
joe rogan
No, this is nothing like Dances with Wolves.
tom papa
Get them back in the woods.
joe rogan
I think this is based on a novel.
If I remember correctly.
See if that movie, The Postman, is based on a novel.
I think it's based on a science fiction or future fiction novel, if I remember correctly.
tom papa
I never even heard of that movie.
joe rogan
Oh, it's so bad.
It's great.
Yeah, it is made of a book.
Okay, yeah.
So yeah, it's about, I think it might be like post-nuclear war or something.
tom papa
Who's trying to stop them?
joe rogan
People don't like mail.
unidentified
Guess what year it takes place then.
joe rogan
Let me guess.
unidentified
2014. 13. Oh my god!
tom papa
That's great.
joe rogan
The other day we were looking at Blade Runner.
Blade Runner was 2019. Yeah.
tom papa
Oh really?
joe rogan
The original one was 2019. Wow.
Next year.
Flying cars.
Robo people.
tom papa
So off.
Not so.
Well, we might make it.
We're going fast.
joe rogan
The thing is, whatever does happen will happen so fast, we'll wish for something like Blade Runner, where there's some sort of intermediate world where the technology and the people coexist.
Right, because we're just gonna be Yeah, we're just going to be plugged into it, like the Matrix.
tom papa
It's just going to be slow, and then all of a sudden.
joe rogan
It's going to be just, if you go back to 1994, which is essentially when most people started logging on to, you've got mail, right?
That's 24 years ago.
Okay, that's not a long time.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
That's a tiny, brief little moment in human history, and in 24 years, the world's radically changed the way it gets information.
unidentified
Completely.
joe rogan
Completely, right?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Now, go 24 years from now, it's probably gonna be accelerated tenfold from that point.
Like, the moment artificial intelligence happens, the moment autonomous cars start happening, the moment the boring company actually has tunnels going through the bottom of L.A. All of it's going to be fucking bananas.
tom papa
I had a guy from Tesla Energy at my house yesterday.
And they bought SolarCity, so it's no longer this solar company.
They're now Tesla Energy.
Tesla Energy is now the car, the trucks.
The batteries, the power wall, generators, and the solar.
And this guy comes in like he's from the future.
He is dressed like a future guy in this, like, black-fitted thing.
He's kind of like those shoes, but in white.
And he just kind of comes in.
He's really sharp and, like, really clear and just goes through the thing.
joe rogan
He's probably on Adderall.
tom papa
And their thing is that they're going to put solar on the roof, and then you have your power wall.
You're still connected to the grid because you've got to...
They have to for political reasons.
But their whole thing, they want to create Tesla neighborhoods where everybody starts feeding off of each other.
They're just completely autonomous Tesla neighborhoods.
joe rogan
That's a good point what you just said, though, about that it's politically motivated, the reason why they have to stay on the grid.
tom papa
It's the only reason.
joe rogan
It's the only reason.
tom papa
They don't need it.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
But in order to get things passed, like have that big battery in your house, they wouldn't let that happen unless, because that really would mean that you're completely cut off, and the politicians are like, no, all that's not happening.
joe rogan
Isn't that crazy?
Because...
That's a more efficient way to do it.
You're getting the power from the sun.
It's cleaner.
It's better for everybody.
And yet they're still like, no.
No, we want to keep these jobs.
We want to keep this system.
We want to slow down progress.
We don't want everybody to have to radically readjust.
tom papa
Yeah.
And the costs for energy are just going up so quickly that in like three years what you pay in Southern California is almost going to double.
joe rogan
Three years?
Really?
tom papa
Yeah.
Yeah.
joe rogan
Wow.
tom papa
Because they have to reach benchmarks by 2020. Did you see what Tesla did in Puerto Rico?
joe rogan
No.
What did they do?
tom papa
I remember him saying he was going to do this, and then there was no news coverage about it.
But their whole infrastructure was wiped out during the hurricane.
Like, completely.
That old, archaic electric shot.
He had all these power walls.
They're giant batteries about the size of the flag.
And they just store all of this energy, like a year's worth of energy you can store.
And they were about to be shipped to customers here in the U.S. who bought them, who want them in their house.
You know, it was backup generators, basically.
They're supposed to ship in January.
They're not shipping now until April because he decided these people in Puerto Rico need energy, took all of those Powerwalls, shipped them to Puerto Rico, and has built this new infrastructure for Puerto Rico.
Hospitals are running on Tesla.
Schools are running on Tesla.
Neighborhoods are running on it.
And it was this quiet little story, like nobody...
This is a kick-ass company that went in and literally is saving this island.
joe rogan
Listen, fuck Oprah.
We need Elon Musk to run for president.
I'm tired of people saying Oprah.
The last couple of days have been hell for me.
I love Oprah.
Don't get me wrong.
I think she's a wonderful woman.
I think she's a powerful force of good and positive energy.
tom papa
But she ain't no Elon.
joe rogan
But she also brought us Dr. Oz and The Secret.
We have to remember what this lady has done.
tom papa
She has to be held accountable.
joe rogan
I forgive her, but, I mean, cut the shit.
The secret is a particularly egregious offense.
tom papa
What, you don't, you just...
joe rogan
You don't believe?
tom papa
You don't believe?
unidentified
Believe?
Believe?
tom papa
I want to be rich.
I am rich.
joe rogan
I imagine myself flying.
I can fly.
I will beat my wings until I take off.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
It was one of the more—I won't say disturbing, but it was confusing when that was taking hold of people.
I had friends that were telling me that the secret is real and that they imagined they were going to fulfill these childhood dreams that they had had.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
About whatever, being a fucking astronaut, whatever it would be.
There was a couple people that I knew that were trying to tell me that the secret was going to be the thing, and that they had a vision board, and they had photographs, they put pictures up of the things that they wanted, like them in front of large crowds and shit, and I'm like, oh boy.
tom papa
Them in front of large crowds.
joe rogan
This is so not how it works.
tom papa
Yeah.
But there is a kernel of it that works.
joe rogan
Yep.
tom papa
Positive thinking, you wanting something, you envisioning it.
But that's a little component in just how you live your life.
It's not just sitting in your place and wishing it so.
joe rogan
It's like saying, I am going to be a bodybuilder because I drink water.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Where do I start?
You should drink water and it will help you if you want to be a bodybuilder.
But I've talked to all these bodybuilders and the one thing they have in common is they all drank water and they knew that if they drank water they would be giant.
They'd be giant, huge people.
tom papa
That's all you gotta do.
joe rogan
Okay, but did they also perform reps to failure?
Did they also take steroids?
Did they also do these exercises?
Squats, deadlifts, curls, you know?
Did they do all that stuff too?
Yes, but the water...
tom papa
Why aren't you a believer?
joe rogan
This is what it's like.
It's because they're saying, like, no, these people...
They believe that they can do these things.
They had this vision and they focused on this vision and it came to fruition.
You know what they also did?
They also busted their fucking ass and got lucky and were in a business or career that they had some talent in and figured out what that career is and figured out how to navigate the very weird waters of social interaction and skill acquisition and success and failure and how to learn.
And luck!
That's the big problem is you're dealing with complete sampling bias.
You're only asking people that are in the mansions, Tom Papa, how did you do it?
I mean, I see you here.
You have this place.
It's as big as the White House.
You have a giant lawn.
Did you always know this was going to be your reality?
tom papa
I saw it and I just put it on my vision board.
What the fuck?
Obviously it doesn't stick around.
It became a fad because all these people at some point had to take the board down.
joe rogan
Well, and unfortunately some people died because there was a story I was reading about Oprah, unfortunately, where this woman had terminal cancer.
And she had stage 3 breast cancer and just decided that through the secret she was going to imagine herself a healthy person.
And then, you know, she eventually wound up dying from it because she didn't get treatment.
tom papa
Yeah, I know.
joe rogan
I mean, she stopped conventional medical treatment.
tom papa
But what part of...
So how far do you go with positive thinking?
Because I see you as a fellow that...
I would think positive thinking plays into your life.
joe rogan
Well, what does that even mean, really?
Like, do I think positive?
I think in a positive way.
I try to be positive.
But when you're trying to accomplish something, whether you're trying to You know get better at something like say if you're playing a game like what if let's say golf like say take up golf and you want to be a really good golfer like you start thinking about golf like how do I get better at golf you have to learn you have to pay attention to instructional videos you have to maybe seek out coaching you have to play some games and lose you have to choke under pressure you have to examine the mental game like what is wrong
with my mental process when I approach a shot what is wrong with this what is wrong and then Become obsessed with the idea of succeeding in that.
And I think that can apply to everything.
I certainly believe in positive thinking, but that was like mystic nonsense.
tom papa
No, that tips over and it discounts all the other stuff that you have to do.
joe rogan
There's something to the law of attraction, but it is one component to this gigantic There's this sort of spectrum of factors that have to be taken into consideration when you're trying to succeed at something.
Positive thinking is one of them, but it's also the understanding of how to eliminate laziness, how to discipline yourself, how to write down goals.
How to make incremental steps towards improvement.
How to recognize failure is not just the end of all your hard work but in fact the beginning of a new breakthrough because you understand how to never do this wrong the wrong way again and the consequences of doing things wrong.
It's like there's a lot of...
There's a lot of factors in getting better and succeeding at things, and they boiled it down to the easiest one, which is dreaming.
tom papa
Right.
Right, exactly.
joe rogan
And that's why it's sold, but Oprah sold it.
I mean, she was one of the big ones, man.
tom papa
She was all in.
joe rogan
She was fucking 50 years old at the time.
I mean, this is not a young woman who was selling this.
How old is Oprah now?
unidentified
75. 89?
joe rogan
No, she just ran a marathon in four hours.
tom papa
Did she really?
joe rogan
She's 67?
unidentified
63. She ran a marathon?
joe rogan
Yeah, so let's think of when The Secret came out.
I want to say that was like 2006-ish.
unidentified
2004. 2006, okay.
joe rogan
So 12 years ago, she was 50 years old.
How the fuck do you not know when you're 50 years old and worth a billion dollars that that's not how it works?
tom papa
That it's hocus pocus.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's not hocus pocus.
And to sell that to people is crazy.
And that's a book that sold, I think I was reading it, sold somewhere in the neighborhood of 20 million copies.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
Is that what it says, yeah?
unidentified
Jeez.
joe rogan
That's crazy.
tom papa
Well, you want an easy way.
You want something that's easy.
Everybody wants, you're in trouble, you're feeling whatever, and they want something to come, something come and help me.
I mean, it's where religion comes from.
It's just, please.
There's that thing inside of us that's like, I want to believe.
If I believe, is that enough?
joe rogan
It is a lot like that.
Yeah.
There was...
One of Trump's spiritual advisors, he's got some spiritual advisor, some woman who was telling people to send her money.
Send her money for January.
There was some whole article about it.
But it's basically essentially the same thing.
It's like the idea is that, what is she saying?
Donald Trump's spiritual advisor, Paula White, suggests people send her their January salary or face consequences from God.
tom papa
No.
Is that true?
joe rogan
She's attractive too, which is interesting.
tom papa
Is that true?
joe rogan
Yeah, look at her.
Bam, I'll give you money.
What do I gotta do?
tom papa
Alright, I'll do it.
joe rogan
What do I gotta do, Paula?
tom papa
How much do you need?
joe rogan
I don't know if that's a good picture.
Maybe she just looks good when she's screaming.
tom papa
Yeah, she looks good.
joe rogan
But, um...
tom papa
Yeah, I would love for some really...
I would love for the day where there's some real powerful spiritual...
Individual who doesn't ask for money.
joe rogan
Well, that's not even a real powerful or spiritual individual.
It's a huckster.
tom papa
I know.
That's what I mean.
Like, it would be so great if some...
Like, so you listen to some people.
Like, I watched...
I was doing some gig, and there was this black preacher, and he was out on stage, and he's talking, and it was like he's really entertaining, and he had a couple nice things that he was saying, and then, please, send me your money.
And it was like, imagine if a guy showed up Well, there is.
Who?
joe rogan
There's plenty of those people on Instagram.
tom papa
Who don't ask for dough?
joe rogan
Yeah, they're just trying to get...
Okay, like Gary Vee, for instance.
Gary Vee's whole thing is about hustling.
Gary Vee's like the anti-secret.
He's anti the secret.
And when you look at what Gary Vee does, Gary Vee is all about...
I was sick for several days.
tom papa
I was fighting something all last week.
joe rogan
Yeah, I got the flu.
I got the flu.
I thought I had it.
I left here.
I'm diverting.
Let me just get back to this Gary Vee thing.
tom papa
Okay.
joe rogan
But with guys like him...
tom papa
I do want to talk colds.
unidentified
He sells books, so I don't know if he's the best example.
joe rogan
He sells books?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, but he's not asking for money.
unidentified
Right, right, okay.
joe rogan
I mean, he's actually, and he's actually a guy who's, he's experienced some success as an entrepreneur, and I listen to people, how do I say this without being mean?
There's a lot of people that are giving advice Online, because people react well to it.
Because they're giving advice, because when they give advice, people respond to it, and they say, this is amazing, and they'll like it, and they'll give them positive feedback and love.
But their advice is at least...
A certain percent of it is just nonsense.
They're just talking.
unidentified
Right.
joe rogan
They're just trying to say things they've heard before, or they're trying to somehow or another put together a sentence that sounds like you'll get some likes.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
You know what I mean?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
There's a lot of that.
tom papa
You just gotta believe, guys.
You just gotta surround yourself with positive people.
joe rogan
Chris D'Elia makes fun of those people in a hilarious way.
He's great at it.
tom papa
Is he?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
About comedians who do it?
joe rogan
Not just comedians who do it, but just people who do it.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
Here's the thing, sometimes people will say things that are real, that are really inspirational, and that's great too.
It's just knowing horse shit.
You gotta know horse shit.
A lot of people don't know where the horse shit is.
The secret is horse shit.
See, that's the problem.
Gary Vee is inspirational and motivational.
I guarantee you there's a lot of people out there that have done things in their life that they might not have done because of Gary Vee.
Because he's a hustler, because he's really got a lot of energy, and he's like, just fucking put down your phone.
Go out there and get things done.
Sleep an hour less.
Sleep a fucking hour less.
And he'll just tell you, like, do this, sell that.
And he gives you practical advice about how to get started and get things done.
It's like the opposite of the secret.
tom papa
Does he hold seminars?
joe rogan
I'm sure Gary does shit like that.
tom papa
It sounds like Tony Robbins.
joe rogan
Sort of, but he's more like...
He's like a younger, more energetic hustler character.
Crystal Lee, what does this say?
Play this.
Give me some volume.
unidentified
Hard work.
joe rogan
Hard work.
It says you can do anything you put your mind to except most things.
Perseverance.
He's got an eagle on his shoulder.
Never backing down.
Not stopping.
tom papa
Remaining focused.
unidentified
Never quitting.
joe rogan
Meanwhile, he does all those things as well.
This is from his last special.
Meanwhile, he works hard.
tom papa
It's really funny.
joe rogan
The funny thing is, Chris actually does work hard.
tom papa
I literally...
Well, yeah, that's the kind of...
Yeah, I mean, Kevin Hart now has moved into that realm.
He has so many people listening to him, and all of a sudden, they just...
You know, he's...
I love him.
He's hilarious.
He's a really good guy.
I've known him for a long time.
But now he's got so many followers and he has so many people listening that he's starting to do that.
He's not just telling jokes.
He's doing crunches and telling you you've got to believe.
And I said to my daughter, my daughter was like, is he a comedian?
She asked me.
She was showing the thing.
I said, yeah, he's really funny.
I said, but this is a different thing.
I said, do you think I can make videos and just tell people to live better?
Would they like that?
No, Dad.
joe rogan
Well, I'm guilty of that, too.
I've done that, too.
But there's things that you know that you've experienced and that you've done that you want people to know about.
But it's not everything I say.
The problem with some people...
unidentified
Well, that's the key.
joe rogan
All day, you're inspiring people?
That's all you fucking do?
unidentified
Right.
joe rogan
All you do.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
All you do is give out advice.
tom papa
Advice, yeah.
joe rogan
That's it.
What do you do?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Do you just advice give?
tom papa
No, there's a thing about...
There's a thing about Kevin, there's a thing about you, that you watch somebody, they're interesting, you like them, and they're getting shit done, and you're like, I'll take advice from this guy, I'll hear what he has to say.
There is that element.
It's when it becomes...
joe rogan
Bullshit.
tom papa
Bullshit.
When it becomes, no, you have to listen to me because I have all the answers.
unidentified
Right.
tom papa
And God talks to me, and that kind of stuff.
joe rogan
Well, there's songs that...
There's love songs that you hear that hit you and you go, wow, why does that resonate so much?
Why is that so profound?
And then there's songs where you're like, shut this stupid fucking nonsense down, right?
It's like there's this pop, music-y, plastic, hollow, empty bullshit that also has a lot of those same words in it, right?
Like, what is the difference?
tom papa
And that millions of people like.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Yeah, but they're dumb as fuck.
tom papa
Well, that's...
But it's the same thing.
You've got all these people that still buy into the horseshit.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
There is a big herd of people out there that you can, if you just start doing...
If Chris just stopped being a comedian and started posting videos like that all the time...
joe rogan
Oh, he would kick ass.
tom papa
He'd get followers.
joe rogan
Well, if he really wanted to, if Delia really wanted to be an inspirational guy, he's a handsome fella.
He's got a great voice.
He's got a lot of energy.
He's dynamic.
He could do that.
unidentified
He's fit.
joe rogan
He could do something like that if he wanted to.
tom papa
Kevin, the same thing.
joe rogan
The thing is, though, Chris can do other things.
A lot of these inspirational fucks, they really can't do things.
They're not doing anything.
They're not producing any great works.
They're not doing any interesting art.
They're not creating any interesting music.
They're not making any funny comedy.
What they're doing is just trying to...
unidentified
You know, there's a lot of people out there that don't think they can do it, but you can.
joe rogan
It's in you.
It's a flower that must be watered with the love of the gods.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Oh, you cunts.
There's so many of them.
They're overwhelming.
tom papa
They are.
joe rogan
So their business...
Is not getting money from you necessarily.
Their business is in you paying attention to them and then as you pay attention to them and to their social media, their social media page grows and then they can do like speeches at these...
Have you seen those self-help conferences?
tom papa
Oh yeah.
joe rogan
Some people go on boats.
They go on a cruise ship.
tom papa
Yeah, the Tony Robbins stuff.
joe rogan
Everybody on a cruise ship is just giving different kinds of advice.
tom papa
Yeah, speeches and everyone, get in here, we're going to have a session.
And it does help people.
There are people that they do help.
joe rogan
Yes, true.
Some of it works.
tom papa
I mean, if you're lost and you don't know what's going on and you've been a loser for a while and you take a couple of his tips, Yeah.
And you start working and writing shit down and going and have some self-confidence.
It can help your life.
joe rogan
But there's some of these guys that all they're doing is just trying to figure out a way to give people advice when they've never done shit themselves.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And it's not worth listening to.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
But yet they're there.
Yeah.
But is that any worse than an open mic-er?
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
Is it?
I mean, if someone...
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
What I want to do is...
I'm sorry.
If someone says, what I want to do is I want to become a motivational speaker.
I want to really help people.
I want to really touch people.
But right now, I kind of suck at it.
It's like you don't just start out as Tony Robbins.
tom papa
No, that's right.
Yeah, you're just starting.
And it's like a trainer.
It's like a boxing trainer who's never really want to fight.
It could just be like an old guy who's just...
joe rogan
Some of those guys, most of them, in fact, are former fighters.
tom papa
Are they?
joe rogan
Yeah.
It's very rare that someone's a boxing trainer.
tom papa
Pacquiao's guy?
joe rogan
What, Freddie Roach?
tom papa
Yeah, was he a good boxer?
joe rogan
Yeah, he was a famous professional.
tom papa
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah, he's got Parkinson's because of it.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, he's got trauma-related Parkinson's disease from his time in the ring.
tom papa
Angelo Dundee?
joe rogan
He fought, um, uh, shit, uh, what the fuck's his name?
The Puerto Rican guy.
tom papa
Hagler.
joe rogan
Stop.
Hector Camacho.
tom papa
Oh, Camacho?
joe rogan
Yeah, he fought Camacho.
He fought a lot of big-name guys.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
He was a big deal in terms of journeyman fighters.
Freddie Roach and his brother Pepper Roach was also a known guy in the world of boxing.
Yeah, Freddie was legit.
tom papa
He was a legit guy.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah.
He was a legit pro.
tom papa
Are there trainers that just train people that they just became trainers and weren't boxers?
joe rogan
They definitely have some experience.
Usually they have some amateur fights.
It's very, very rare that someone becomes a respected boxing trainer without having any competition experience.
It just doesn't seem to make any sense.
Some of them, they realize early on that they're better at coaching than they are at competing.
Whether it's because of physical dynamics or whether it's, you know, they just don't like getting hit.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
You know?
tom papa
They know the limits.
joe rogan
Or some people just are really good at teaching others.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
You know, that's a weird thing, too.
In the world of jiu-jitsu, it's very common.
Because in jiu-jitsu, there's a lot of people that get really good at understanding and, like, one of the guys that's going to be here next week, John Donaher, is world famous for it.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
He's very famous for being one of the greatest coaches in jiu-jitsu of all time, but as far as I know, very little experience in terms of actual competition.
But he's, as a coach, unparalleled.
He's universally regarded as one of the great coaches alive.
tom papa
Wow, that's impressive.
I got my 12-year-old a heavy bag for Christmas.
She's wrapping her hands.
She's got gloves.
joe rogan
Get someone to teach her how to do it correctly.
tom papa
Yeah, my buddy Matt's coming over.
He's a trainer.
He worked under Angelo Dundee for a while and opened his own gym.
My good buddy, Matt Biamonte.
And he's gonna come teach her on Thursday.
joe rogan
That's good.
tom papa
Yeah, it's pretty cool.
joe rogan
It's a good way to get out aggression too.
tom papa
That's why I got it for her.
She would just get angry.
She'd be doing schoolwork and be like, this is bullshit.
And I'm like, and she's like, I want to punch something.
She started like punching pillows once in a while.
So now I got her a bag.
unidentified
How much of you is Italian?
tom papa
All of it's Italian except for my one grandfather was German.
joe rogan
Angry people.
tom papa
The Germans or the Italians?
joe rogan
Both.
Mostly Italian.
tom papa
Sicilian is the dominant part.
There's a little temper there.
joe rogan
Angry people.
That's in her genes.
She wants to fucking feed knuckle sandwiches to people.
unidentified
She really does.
tom papa
She's like this beautiful 12 year old girl who just wants to punch.
My sister's that way too.
joe rogan
I stopped dating Italian girls when I was 21. Last Italian girl I dated took a swing at me.
I was like, I'm good.
tom papa
Did you really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Did you deserve it?
joe rogan
Nope.
But I saw it coming.
I was like, I can't believe this is happening.
She's actually trying to punch me.
tom papa
She's going to punch me.
joe rogan
She's going to fucking punch me.
I saw her shoulder pull back.
I'm like, there's no way this is actually happening.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I was fighting at the time, so I was used to people punching me.
So I was just pulling her shoulder back.
I'm like, this can't be really happening.
I don't believe this is happening.
Oh my god, it's happening.
And I had to tuck under it.
tom papa
It's funny.
joe rogan
But I think she just wanted attention.
I don't think she actually...
I think she's pretty sure that it wasn't going to land.
You know, that if she threw a punch at me that I was just going to...
Because if she really wanted to hurt me, she'd fucking hit me when I wasn't looking.
That's what people do.
They don't just look right at you, you motherfucker.
But then again, when people are in the height of some sort of fucking Sicilian love rage.
tom papa
Right, exactly.
You don't want to mess with that.
joe rogan
Yeah.
The screaming and the yelling and the throwing things around.
That's also very East Coast.
tom papa
Oh yeah.
joe rogan
I've talked about this ad nauseum, but I really believe that that's the echoes of those fucking barbarians that came over on boats from Europe and didn't even know what America looked like.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
They didn't even have a photo to look at, and these fucking cave people just pulled up on rafts and started fucking immediately.
They started baking bread, rolling up pasta, and banging each other.
tom papa
Hey, I got bread for both of you.
joe rogan
Oh, you have two loaves.
You're an animal.
Tom, Papa, you're a god amongst men.
tom papa
There you go.
This is for you.
joe rogan
Do you eat the bread?
tom papa
I've never given you the bread.
I never gave Jamie the bread.
I'm like, he's probably going to appreciate it more.
joe rogan
How long will this stay good?
Because Sunday's my cheat day.
tom papa
Sunday?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
You'll be good.
joe rogan
Or should I just postpone my cheat day or move it to today?
tom papa
If you keep it in paper, you'll have to toast it up.
joe rogan
What's the best way, though?
To eat it today is the best way?
tom papa
To eat it today or tomorrow, actually.
Tomorrow, Thursday.
joe rogan
Tomorrow's better?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Why's it better?
tom papa
Because it just came out.
joe rogan
So it's not good right away.
tom papa
It is.
It's if you want that warmth.
It is.
But really, it gets even better a day after.
joe rogan
You know, that's the case with tuna.
I did not know that.
I always thought that if you bought sushi, that you're supposed to get fresh sushi.
They just pulled it out of the water.
They're going to slice it up for you right now.
But no, if you go to a real master sushi maker, that sushi sits.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
For how long?
joe rogan
Fucking weeks sometimes.
unidentified
What?
joe rogan
I know.
tom papa
Just the tuna?
joe rogan
I watched some documentary on some sushi master.
tom papa
Oh, the hero?
joe rogan
No, it wasn't that.
It wasn't that guy.
But that guy, that's a great one too.
tom papa
It's really good.
joe rogan
I was like, somebody, what we're talking about is Jiro, is that how you say his name?
tom papa
Hero or Jiro?
joe rogan
Jiro or Yiro?
How do you say it though?
Do you know?
It's spelled with a J. Let's say Jiro.
Jiro dreams of sushi.
I was like, I'm not gonna watch a fucking documentary on a guy who makes sushi.
tom papa
Cut the fish.
joe rogan
Smush the rice up.
You're done, dude.
tom papa
Give me some edamame.
Get this party started.
joe rogan
This ain't like some complicated casserole that you're putting together.
But wow.
You watch it and you go, oh, okay.
I'm ignorant.
tom papa
This guy's an artist.
joe rogan
Yeah, there's way more to this.
tom papa
Oh my god.
His whole soul is in it.
And it comes out.
Yeah, amazing.
joe rogan
And his tiny ass little restaurant that's about the size of this room.
tom papa
Yeah, no interest in getting bigger.
unidentified
Nope.
tom papa
No franchising.
unidentified
Nope.
tom papa
Just doing this.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
So well that people are going to come.
joe rogan
There's something to that, man.
tom papa
Oh, it's the best.
Doing one thing really well.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
My God.
It's the best.
joe rogan
There's definitely something to that.
There's something to, especially, like, the mindset of every day trying to learn how to make that egg dish perfect.
Yeah.
That one egg dish that one guy said he worked on for a year.
tom papa
Crazy.
joe rogan
A fucking year on eggs.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Just completely doing it over and over and over.
My bread thing is probably your bow thing, the bread thing.
You do just start to focus on this one thing and trying to do it well and it becomes a part of you.
You're starting to put yourself into it.
It's not just making bread.
It is a practice.
It is something that for a couple of years I've just gone down that wormhole.
It's a good thing.
joe rogan
The wormhole.
tom papa
Yeah.
Doing that one thing.
I really, I feel like that sometimes with stand-up.
It's like, we have all these other things that are always going on and pulling us in different directions and stuff, and it's like, if you could just focus purely on just, if that was the only, if you weren't taking any phone calls on anything else, you weren't podcasting, you weren't writing scripts, you weren't peering on whatever, like, would that make a difference?
Like, would you be...
joe rogan
Yes and no.
Because I think...
That stand-up requires a certain amount of dedication and a certain amount of time on stage, but I think it also requires a certain amount of living.
I think you need to do other things.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
And although podcasting seems like a job and a distraction, one thing it is unquestionably is an exploration of ideas.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
At an unprecedented level.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like you're exploring ideas without looking at your phone, without talking.
Just you and I are talking for three hours.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
When does that ever happen in life?
tom papa
Yeah.
No, it doesn't.
joe rogan
There's a lot of ideas that I come up with through stand-up or in stand-up that came out of podcasts.
unidentified
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
For sure.
tom papa
Yeah, a lot.
Yeah, your mind's active.
joe rogan
Yeah, so I think that...
tom papa
Yeah, and writing's similar.
Writing's the same kind of a thing.
joe rogan
Yeah.
But I also think doing stuff is important, too.
Not just the actual sit-down talking part of the podcast, but actually going places.
tom papa
Being active.
joe rogan
You have to experience things.
You have to watch documentaries.
You have to go to a museum.
You have to go see things.
You gotta go talk to people.
You gotta go on adventures.
You gotta go travel.
tom papa
Yeah, it's filling up the well.
joe rogan
Yeah.
You have to think of your brain almost like you're CrossFit.
Not CrossFit.
What's that?
What's that word where you...
Cross training?
I guess that's what I'm working for.
When you're doing a bunch of different kinds of things.
tom papa
Multitasking.
joe rogan
No, no, no.
Different types of athletic activities that will enhance your sport.
Let's say if you play hockey.
You don't just do hockey.
You also are involved in the box jumps.
You're doing a lot of sprinting up hills.
tom papa
That's a good way to look at it.
joe rogan
Yeah.
All these things enhance this one activity.
And it's not just all you have to do is just skate all day and you'll become the best skater.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Well, maybe, or you could get better at the motions of skating by strengthening your legs with weightlifting, or by doing this, and you can accelerate your curve by doing yoga, or you could, you know.
tom papa
Yeah, yeah.
joe rogan
I think that there's something to that with comedy, at least for me.
tom papa
Yeah, no, I agree.
I mean, when I'm really actively writing other stuff, whether it's scripts or whatever, My writing for stand-up improves.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
It's a muscle.
Yeah, and reading, by the way.
Reading, writing stuff, it all feeds the act.
When you then shift your focus over here back to the act, you're better because of that stuff.
But I do sometimes think, like the sushi guy, but what if the output was only geared towards that?
The input I get Doing all that stuff, but would there be a difference?
joe rogan
Maybe.
I mean, maybe there's something to that.
tom papa
I don't know.
joe rogan
I don't know anybody who does it that way, though.
unidentified
Well, Regan.
joe rogan
Yeah, but Regan plays golf and drinks and does a lot of other shit.
tom papa
But he's not creating other art.
He's not writing scripts.
joe rogan
He also doesn't write right.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
He writes kind of in his head.
tom papa
Uh-huh.
joe rogan
And then goes on stage and works on stuff.
tom papa
Right.
Right.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Which I'm torn on.
I mean, I know it's very effective.
Some people do it amazingly well, and that's how they've created incredible works of art.
But I never give that advice.
Whenever anyone asks me, I say, you should do both.
You should write down things.
You should write on a computer.
You should write, or however you like to write.
But you should also fuck around on stage.
You should do both.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's what I think.
tom papa
Yeah, no, I do too.
I can't just show up on stage and hope it's going to happen.
joe rogan
Well, there's some ideas that I've had that I'll, like, literally, like, have in my car, and then I'll bounce them around by myself a little bit, and not having ever written them down, I'll go on stage, and then it'll just catch fire.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And it'll become a bit, and there's some bits that have made it to specials that I've never even written down.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I just knew how to do them because I did them a bunch of times, and...
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
But most of them not, though.
Most of them not.
tom papa
Or at least, I always feel like...
I'll bring an idea up on stage that hasn't been written down yet.
There's something there.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
There's something going on, but then I bring it back to the shop and we'll play with it.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
And then it becomes this back and forth.
joe rogan
Here's one example.
This is a bit that I bounced around.
I was thinking about in the car, and then I brought it onto stage in a completed form, and it never really changed.
There's a bit about Bigfoot.
I said, here's what you don't find when you go looking for Bigfoot.
Black people.
You're more likely to find Bigfoot than you are black people looking for Bigfoot.
You just find hordes of unfuckable white dudes out camping.
That's what she finds.
That's who goes looking for Bigfoot.
It's not an African-American pastime.
And that bit came out in the car.
I made myself laugh.
And then it never changed.
It just became that.
I don't think I ever wrote it down anywhere.
I made it into my 2014 Comedy Central special.
tom papa
That's a little gift.
joe rogan
But that's rare.
Those are the rare ones.
tom papa
It is rare, but man, it'd be nice if they all came that way.
joe rogan
There's been a few.
Usually for some reason they're one-liners too like that.
tom papa
It's so funny.
It's just complete.
joe rogan
Some of them just form themselves complete.
tom papa
Those are best too when it makes you laugh.
Like there's things that you just think in your head, yeah that's pretty funny, that is a funny thing.
And then you bring it up on stage and it becomes really funny.
But when it really just truly makes you laugh, that's great.
joe rogan
Yeah, it is great when there's something that just clicks to the point where you just start giggling and you're just like, get the fuck out of here.
Those are my favorite kind of jokes.
tom papa
Yeah, because that's why you started making people laugh as a kid in the first place.
It was just having fun.
And sometimes as an adult, you've got all this other stuff in your head.
It's like, you do have to kind of remind yourself, this is fun.
This is silly shit.
This should be giggle enjoyable, you know?
joe rogan
Yeah, it should be.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
It should be.
tom papa
Sometimes it can be feel like, you know, because it comes out of writing.
The other stuff that does come out of writing Writing can be a grind.
Writing is insular.
It's by yourself.
You're just in there alone.
It's not this joyful place most of the time.
You're not writing like...
joe rogan
But it's not painful.
tom papa
It's not painful, but it is a practice that is different than just being with your buddies talking about Bigfoot.
joe rogan
Yes.
Yeah.
And those are the fun ones, right?
The Bigfoot ones are the ones that come out of nowhere with no effort and they kill.
And you're like, I got this for free!
tom papa
Yay!
joe rogan
It's like you got some crazy skateboard that you're not worried about damaging.
Because you didn't work on it for a hundred years.
Yeah.
tom papa
No, writing's not painful.
But there is a thing, there is a mental part where you...
If you ever put it down for a while and don't do it, it's like you've got to get your head back into the space of doing it.
That could be a little painful.
joe rogan
Why is that hard?
tom papa
I don't know.
joe rogan
It is, but I don't know.
Have you ever read Steven Pressfield's book, The War of Art?
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
It's excellent.
It's so good that I bought stacks of it, and I used to hand it out to people on the podcast.
tom papa
Oh, really?
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, because I think most people, like when you say, like if someone says, like, what's the difference between guys who get things done and guys who don't get things done?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
This sounds so stupid and simple, but the people that get things done do things.
They actually do it.
They sit down and do it.
And there's something about the people that don't get things done that stops them from doing that.
Like, what is it?
And Pressfield calls it resistance.
And what he says is that you have to overcome resistance because that's what professionals do.
You sit down because you have affirmed that you are a pro.
And you sit down and you go over what you are going to do.
This is what I do.
I'm a professional.
I write.
And I'm going to sit down and I'm going to write and I'm going to summon the muse.
Whether the muse is a real thing or not, he treats it as it's a real thing.
And the concept is that you are going to summon this thing that you call upon to endow you with creativity.
tom papa
By doing the work.
joe rogan
By doing the work, yeah.
And that overcoming this resistance is the war of art.
tom papa
Yeah.
And what is the resistance then?
joe rogan
That's the question.
tom papa
Your negative thoughts, really.
joe rogan
It's not just negative thoughts.
It's resisting work.
It's not negative.
It's weird.
Something's stopping you from succeeding.
Something's stopping you from pushing forward and putting down those ideas.
tom papa
You want the easy.
You want to just sit on the couch.
In my office, I have a couch and I have a desk.
And the couch is, you know...
joe rogan
Nothing gets done on the couch.
tom papa
Nothing gets done on the couch.
Really.
It's about sitting there.
There was this great quote from this Israeli writer, who every time I say the quote I say, I always forget what his name was, and I should know it because I use the quote so often.
But he says that writing, the job of being a writer is the same as being a shopkeeper.
And it's your job to go and open the shop every day.
And some days nothing happens.
Some day you're just sitting in the shop like an idiot behind the desk, and nobody's there.
And then some days the shop is...
Buzzing with action and activity and people in and out and stuff is happening.
But all of those days when it's really busy and active does not happen unless you open the shop every day.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
That's such an easy way for my brain to kind of think of it.
joe rogan
That's a brilliant way of putting it.
tom papa
Just go and sit down at the place where you do the work and start doing the work.
It may not be great.
That's not up to you if it's going to be great.
It's up to you whether or not you sit down and start working.
joe rogan
Have you ever read Stephen King's On Writing?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's great.
tom papa
That was a good one.
joe rogan
Those are my two go-to books when I'm feeling like I need something to recharge my fortitude.
tom papa
That would be a good one to go back to and read.
I read that once, like a long time ago.
His just thing of you just, like what you're saying, you just have to do it.
You just have to do it.
joe rogan
He's right.
I mean, there's days that I'll go and I'll write for fucking hours and literally get nothing out of it.
There's nothing there.
tom papa
Nothing.
joe rogan
Nothing.
It's all bullshit.
tom papa
Nothing.
joe rogan
And if you judged yourself by that, you'd go like, God, I'm a fucking terrible writer.
tom papa
You'd be like, wow, I stink!
joe rogan
And then one day, you'll just sit down, and then you have your next ten minutes.
You're like, oh boy, there's something here.
I got something here.
I got sparks.
tom papa
Yeah, because you showed up.
joe rogan
Speaking of sparks, did you hear about this fucking bird that they found that starts fires?
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
They found a hawk that picks up burning embers and sticks that are on fire and flies them across rivers and creeks to start the fires on the other side so that it could force game animals to run away.
tom papa
Wow.
Brilliant.
joe rogan
Look at this.
Birds of prey are starting fires deliberately.
Kites and falcons are intentionally dropping smoldering twigs to smoke out mice and insects in Australia.
Jesus Christ.
tom papa
Jeez Louise.
joe rogan
Researchers have compiled a study of reports of wild birds spreading fires.
They believe the birds carry these burning twigs to unburnt parts of the bush.
The birds drop them in a bid to smoke out prey, blah, blah, blah.
tom papa
They also smoke three packs a day.
joe rogan
What does it say?
Researchers said birds could be the third force capable of starting bushfires.
That's incredible.
tom papa
It's clever.
joe rogan
Yeah, they're so irresponsible, these fucks.
They don't give a shit about fires.
unidentified
They don't care.
joe rogan
They fly away.
They're like, well, I'll fly where the fire isn't.
tom papa
I got a mouse.
The whole neighborhood's burnt down.
But he got a mouse snack.
unidentified
Geez.
tom papa
They're such assholes.
What douchebags?
joe rogan
Did you see that chicken that the researchers created that accidentally, somehow or another, through when they put it together, had the face of a dinosaur?
Have you seen this?
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Yeah, see if you can find that.
unidentified
What do you mean?
joe rogan
It's on my Twitter.
tom papa
That they made?
joe rogan
I don't know what the fuck they did.
They cross-bred it?
I briefly read the article.
I'm like, these motherfuckers.
And then I ran away.
tom papa
You got scared.
unidentified
It's got the face.
joe rogan
This chicken has the face of a fucking dinosaur.
It's got teeth.
It's a chicken with a dinosaur's face.
tom papa
So, who got the dinosaur stuff?
joe rogan
Here, pull it up.
tom papa
Who got the dinosaur DNA and put it in?
joe rogan
That.
tom papa
Oh, no.
joe rogan
Chicken, gross face of a dinosaur.
What?
tom papa
What?
On BBC Earth.
joe rogan
Dude, I've been telling people forever because of the fact that I keep chickens now.
Chickens are fucking monsters.
They're monsters.
tom papa
They have good eggs, though.
joe rogan
They do have good eggs.
But we have this idea of them as being these cute little, you know, cuddly little fluffy things that lay eggs and just peck around.
No, they're fucking monsters.
Pull up the top of the article, Jamie.
Go to the top of it and make it larger so I can read it there.
See what it says.
Blah, blah, blah.
Group of dinosaurs.
The idea.
Keep going.
Blah, blah, blah, blah.
To understand how one changed the other, a team has been tampering with the molecular process that make up a beak in chickens.
By doing so, they've managed to create a chicken embryo with a dinosaur-like snout and a palate similar to that of feathered dinosaurs like Velociraptor.
They're making raptors, these fucks.
The results are published in the journal Evolution.
The team's aim was to understand how the bird beak evolved because the beak is such a vital part of bird anatomy.
It's been crucial for their success.
The 10,000 or more species occupy a wide range of habitats and many have specialized beaks to help them survive.
tom papa
So they mess with the molecular makeup of the beak.
joe rogan
Yeah, and they made a fucking dinosaur-faced chicken.
tom papa
Well, that'll be good when they're running around.
That'll be great when they're at the petting zoo.
unidentified
I bet they would have better eggs.
joe rogan
Because my chicken's eggs are significantly better when I let them loose and they go fuck up.
They'll eat mice and they'll eat worms and bugs.
And then I'll get these dark yolks.
Like the last couple of days, they've been running around my yard all day.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, so the eggs that I'll collect tonight or tomorrow will be dark orange.
tom papa
Yeah, but when they're sedentary, they're lighter.
joe rogan
Well, they're just in the cage.
Well, they have a very large coop.
The coop is essentially for the 19 chickens.
17 now, a couple of them died.
17 chickens I have.
It's basically the size of this room.
It's a good space.
They got plenty of room to wander around and plenty of food, but when you ever see vegetarian raised chicken, they don't want that.
tom papa
Oh, no.
joe rogan
They'll eat that if that's all you give them, but they want to eat things.
tom papa
Like bugs and worms?
joe rogan
Bugs, worms.
tom papa
That's most of their diet.
joe rogan
But mice more than anything.
tom papa
Mice?
joe rogan
If they found a mouse, they fight for it.
It's one of the few things that they will fight for.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
One will grab the mouse and they will just chase each other and try to fuck that mouse up.
tom papa
How are those eggs?
After the mouse day.
joe rogan
Probably amazing.
It's hard to tell who's laying the eggs.
tom papa
So what do you do with all these eggs?
There's a lot of eggs.
joe rogan
You can have some.
You want some eggs?
tom papa
Sure, I'll take some eggs.
joe rogan
I'll give you some eggs.
I got some meat for you, too.
tom papa
I'm out of elk.
joe rogan
I got some.
tom papa
Do you?
I really started to crave it.
joe rogan
I got two this year.
tom papa
Oh, yeah, I know.
All right.
Serve it up.
joe rogan
Good to hear for the meat.
tom papa
Me and my dog are so happy when the elk comes out.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
I think I showed you a picture.
Did I send you a shot of you cooking?
I was cooking up the ground elk, and the dog was just like, we're doing this, right?
joe rogan
Yeah.
Grass-fed butter and ground elk with a little garlic salt.
It's really good with the eggs, too.
tom papa
Yes.
joe rogan
I like to mix it up in eggs.
tom papa
That's exactly what I do.
unidentified
Maybe put it on a little bit of the sourdough bread.
tom papa
Ooh, now you're thinking.
Take the sourdough, you put a lot of butter on it, just use it as the base and put that on top of it.
And then just cut it and eat it.
joe rogan
We need a friend with a vineyard.
unidentified
Ooh.
joe rogan
We need a friend who makes his own wine.
tom papa
That would be great.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
We live in the right state for it.
joe rogan
Yeah, I know a guy who does it.
tom papa
You do?
joe rogan
Yeah, yeah.
Good wine?
Uh...
I don't know.
I never had his wine.
I never had his wine.
He gave me a bottle.
What the fuck happened to it?
tom papa
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah.
It's a buddy of mine, I know.
tom papa
He didn't drink it.
joe rogan
No, he's in the real estate business.
tom papa
I drank a lot of wine the second half of the year.
joe rogan
Yeah?
A lot.
Too much?
tom papa
I started reading...
unidentified
No.
joe rogan
Confession time?
tom papa
No.
But I'm not drinking for January.
joe rogan
You're taking the whole month off?
tom papa
Yeah.
unidentified
Really?
joe rogan
Sober January.
tom papa
My friend was like, I'm just gonna...
We went out on the second.
He's like, no, I'm not drinking for the month of January.
And I was like, that sounds good.
I'm gonna do that too.
Not thinking.
And it's been a week.
And I'm like, this is stupid.
Which makes me think maybe it's not a bad thing.
I've never taken a whole month off since I started drinking as a kid.
joe rogan
You gotta do Sober October.
That's the move.
tom papa
Sober October.
joe rogan
Yeah, we all do it.
tom papa
Yeah?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
I don't know if everybody's gonna do it this year.
I doubt we're gonna get Bert to do it again.
Bert was in a goddamn frothy panic.
By the time November rolled around.
Holy shit, look at his face.
You know where he was getting his jollies?
He was going on Instagram feeds of people that were clearly losing their fucking minds.
tom papa
Oh, just watching them suffer?
joe rogan
No, he would send them to me, like comedians that were out of their fucking minds.
He would send them like, just check out her Instagram story.
I'm like, you son of a bitch.
And I go there, I'm like, oh my god, what have you done?
tom papa
Not from not drinking, just crazy.
joe rogan
Just being crazy.
tom papa
Just being crazy.
joe rogan
There are some people out there, and I don't want to out them, so I'll tell you off the air.
There are some people, you find out about their Instagram story, and you go, oh, there's a hidden little gem here online.
tom papa
Instagram is such a great tell for people.
I was going to work with this guy, and I asked my other friend, I said, do you know him?
He's a director.
I was like, do you know this guy?
And she's like, well, I don't want to say anything.
I'm like, what?
Just look at his Instagram.
I was like, oh, what an old man thing that I didn't think to do that.
So just go on the Instagram.
You're like, oh, they're a train wreck.
A train wreck.
Just seeing them posting all their insanity.
joe rogan
Inspirational stuff?
tom papa
No, this was just pure bad shit.
unidentified
Teaching you how to be the fully actualized person.
tom papa
I don't mean to shit on Kevin, by the way.
Kevin is one of those guys that gets shit done.
joe rogan
Who's Kevin?
tom papa
Kevin Hart, when I was saying Kevin Hart's thing.
joe rogan
No, he legitimately gets things done and also legitimately gets a thrill out of helping people get motivated.
tom papa
Exactly.
joe rogan
He does runs where he brings hundreds of people out running with him.
tom papa
It's insane.
joe rogan
He'd do like a 5K and everybody, y'all show up!
tom papa
Show up!
unidentified
We're running!
We're running!
joe rogan
And everybody will run with Kevin Hart.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
He's legit.
tom papa
Hey, how far do you run when you run with your dog?
joe rogan
No more than, well, Marshall doesn't like to, he gets to the point at the end of the run, he's only a year old, like two miles is about, because we're pushing a pretty good pace in the hills.
tom papa
In the hills, right?
joe rogan
Very, very steep hills.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
At two, and I don't bring any water for him.
tom papa
Oh no?
joe rogan
No, so at two miles, that's all I want to push him.
Because at the end, his fucking tongue is bright red, and he's like...
tom papa
Two miles up hills, that's a lot.
joe rogan
He's great for the rest of the day.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
The rest of the day, he's like, hey man, what's up?
He's just chill.
unidentified
He's the best.
joe rogan
He's such a good dog, man.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I love Golden Retrievers.
They're so good.
tom papa
Yeah, they are great dogs.
joe rogan
They're so food-oriented, though.
Sometimes to the point where being annoying.
tom papa
Yeah.
So is my lab.
joe rogan
Yeah, labs are too.
tom papa
Same thing.
joe rogan
Just a lot of dogs are like that.
tom papa
Yeah.
If they're active, they're hungry.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Their metabolism is quick and they want to eat and they just, yeah.
joe rogan
The good news is they're really easy to train with food because they love food so much.
Just give them like little treats and like he's, this dog that I have, Marshall, he's the best I've ever had as far as like listening to sit and stay and lie down and stuff like that.
And when I go running with him, I don't worry about him.
He stays close to me.
tom papa
That's cool.
joe rogan
He runs, and then he's ahead of me, and I go, hey man, slow down, and he'll just stop.
He'll wait for me, and then I'll come up to him, and then he'll start running again.
tom papa
That's great.
I've never taken her off leash like that, and I feel like it'd be a blast.
joe rogan
The only thing I worry about is rattlesnakes.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's an issue.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Because I don't think he knows exactly what a rattlesnake is.
tom papa
I bet the instinct would kick in.
If you didn't get surprised by it.
joe rogan
The instincts I'm worried about are the wrong ones, which are to get close.
tom papa
Oh, you think?
joe rogan
And get bit.
tom papa
Don't you think they'd be like all in ancient DNA of hearing that rattle?
joe rogan
I've had three dogs that were bit by rattlesnakes.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Because they went after it?
joe rogan
Yeah.
One of them got bit.
I brought him to the doctor, and I'm like, I think he got bit by a rattlesnake.
And the veterinarian's like, oh, you're going to play music?
tom papa
I'm going to play the sad music.
joe rogan
And the veterinarian, they're fine.
unidentified
He lived.
joe rogan
But the veterinarian was like, everything seems okay.
I'm like, I don't know, man.
I'm pretty sure the snake got him.
And he goes, well, you know, if he's acting funny later, let me know.
So I bring him home.
Hour later, his face swells up like a fucking basketball.
unidentified
I'm like, shit.
joe rogan
It just took a while for it to kick in.
And I thought I was doing the right thing by getting him to the vet in time.
I'm like, I'm going to just get him there right away.
Just throw him in the car.
tom papa
Beat the clock.
joe rogan
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And it took a while for the vet him to sink into his face.
tom papa
How long?
joe rogan
It took over an hour because I was at the veterinarian's office.
He got bit.
I had him there within 35, 40 minutes.
And then the vet's looking at him.
He's like, I don't see any marks.
I don't see any blood.
There's no clear...
He might have got mist or the thing might not have gotten any venom in him.
tom papa
That's weird.
joe rogan
Maybe he got lucky.
So I take him home.
His face is like...
That's what happens.
Their face wells up.
tom papa
Oh, it's brutal.
joe rogan
Yeah, and then it costs thousands of dollars.
It's very expensive.
What do they have to do?
They use anti-venom.
It's really expensive.
tom papa
Just to inject that?
unidentified
Mm-hmm.
tom papa
It's thousands of dollars?
joe rogan
Yeah, which is really bad for people that are poor.
You know, if you don't have any money to pay for that and your dog gets bit, it's a fucking tremendous stress.
tom papa
Oh, man.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Would they survive?
I mean, if it's that dose?
Some dogs survive.
Yeah.
Some dogs survive, some dogs don't.
joe rogan
Yeah, but some dogs die from it, for sure.
tom papa
Oh, that's a bummer.
joe rogan
It's really bad for them.
tom papa
I don't have a place to run my dog like that.
We've got, like, all streets around us, so it's like...
joe rogan
Yeah, you've got to drive him somewhere, man.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Take him to Runyon Canyon or something.
tom papa
Can you take him off leash in those places?
joe rogan
It's not...
The problem is you never know what kind of dogs you're going to run into.
Or coyotes.
tom papa
Or angry moms.
joe rogan
Yeah, that's true too.
Yeah, there's a lot of people like that.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, if you can go places that are less populated, those are the best for off-leash type activities.
tom papa
She would be so happy.
joe rogan
She's a lab too.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Sweet dogs.
tom papa
Wants to run.
joe rogan
And they're not like the kind of dogs, it's not like you're taking a Presa Canario, 120 pound demon dog and letting that thing loose.
tom papa
No, she's sweet.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Demon dog.
What was the name of that dog?
joe rogan
Presa Canario.
You've never seen one of those?
They're tanks.
They're this huge, fucking muscular looking...
Presa Canario?
There's a guy who's breeding some that I know.
He's making these brindle ones.
They look so crazy.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
They're like the ultimate guard dog.
tom papa
With a dinosaur beak?
joe rogan
The size of that thing.
tom papa
Oh, it's like a mastiff.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Super aggressive.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
unidentified
Oh, great.
joe rogan
Look at that black one above it.
Look at that.
tom papa
Great.
joe rogan
Get the fuck out of here, man.
Look at those shoulders.
unidentified
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
He's going to fuck you with that big dick, too.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
unidentified
Giant horse dick he's got between his doggy legs.
tom papa
I don't know.
joe rogan
Look at that face on that thing.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
Are these around?
joe rogan
Yeah, man.
They're real.
They're not dinosaurs.
tom papa
They have these?
Like, people have these at home?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, I know some people who have them.
My friend Mark has two of them.
Yeah.
tom papa
That is scary.
joe rogan
It's an enormous dog.
They're apparently very good, loyal watchdogs.
tom papa
Oh, they are?
They're nice to the family?
joe rogan
Well, it's all in who breeds them.
Look at the one where the dog's on a leash pulling.
Right there.
Like, a fucking build on that thing.
Just low.
What a nightmare if that was chasing after you.
unidentified
Fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck, fuck.
tom papa
What do you do when a dog comes at you and wants to bite you?
Just punch it?
joe rogan
Give him your arm.
If you know a dog's gonna attack you, if you know for sure, if you have the time, you feed him your arm and stab the shit out of him while he's grabbing your arm.
You're fucking right in the neck.
tom papa
Oh, yeah?
What if you don't have a weapon?
joe rogan
You're fucked.
Why don't you carry a weapon?
You should have a weapon, always.
tom papa
You should always have a weapon.
joe rogan
Yes, you never know when you're gonna be attacked by a dog.
tom papa
Do you have a weapon?
Oh, really?
Nice.
See, I told you.
joe rogan
You carry a lot of shit with me.
You get attacked by a goddamn dog.
tom papa
That's a dog knife.
joe rogan
You never know.
tom papa
Nice.
joe rogan
Coyotes, mountain lions.
tom papa
What do you do when you fly?
You got to put it in your bag?
joe rogan
Your teeth, like a pirate.
Don't even check.
tom papa
TSA pre.
joe rogan
No, I don't bring it with me when I travel.
unidentified
I just was opening boxes today.
joe rogan
I'm only kidding.
tom papa
Oh, you don't carry that all the time?
joe rogan
I'm an asshole.
I had to open boxes.
tom papa
Some people do.
Don't you think there's a lot of people out there next to you at the 7-Eleven that are carrying shit?
joe rogan
Oh, yeah.
I know a guy who used to carry a gun on his ankle.
He might still do it.
I don't want to say his name, but he was a guy who used to fight for the UFC. He carried a gun, and he's huge.
He's a giant man.
He carried a gun on his ankle.
He carried one in the small of his back.
He carried a knife in his front pocket.
On both sides, he had two knives that he carried all the time, and he carried a shoulder holster.
tom papa
Just to go to the store?
joe rogan
Everywhere he went.
Everywhere he went, he was locked and loaded.
Like, he was the wrong guy to fuck with in every single possible way.
260 pounds, enormous, trained, black belt, UFC champion.
Loaded to the hilt, carrying knives and guns all over his persona.
tom papa
The cool part about that, which I always like in the movies, is when you're done with your day and you're just unloading all that stuff on your dresser.
joe rogan
Clank, clank, clank.
tom papa
Just taking the strap off, taking that thing off.
That always seems...
I love that part of being a man, of just having all the stuff you gotta unload.
To then go to like Beyond Keys and Wallet to be like...
Gun, machete, other gun.
unidentified
Brass knuckles.
tom papa
Yeah, right, exactly.
joe rogan
Does anybody carry brass knuckles anymore?
Are those out?
tom papa
They mustn't, maybe.
Yeah, why not?
joe rogan
Yeah, it's not a thing anymore.
It's not like...
tom papa
I wonder if those are legal.
joe rogan
Like, that was something you'd hear about when we were kids.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Oh, they got brass knuckles!
tom papa
I guess because Bugs Bunny had them.
That's the only place we were hearing stuff was as children.
joe rogan
You don't hear about brass knuckles at all anymore.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Now words are what hurt.
tom papa
Get you some brass knuckles, see?
unidentified
People hurt with words.
joe rogan
Words are violence.
tom papa
Give me some brass knuckles, see?
joe rogan
Yeah, the old days, see?
tom papa
Yeah, the old days, see?
joe rogan
Why'd they talk like that back then, see?
tom papa
Because that's the way they spoke back then, see?
joe rogan
You had that coffee just sitting there for the longest time.
tom papa
It's still hot.
joe rogan
You didn't pour it.
tom papa
No, I had a bunch.
joe rogan
You had a little bit of it?
tom papa
Yeah.
I love coffee.
joe rogan
You do?
unidentified
Mm-hmm.
tom papa
Addicted.
joe rogan
Brennan Schaub told me that he drinks 12 cups of coffee a day and that he's been throwing up a lot lately.
And it's because of the coffee.
tom papa
Because of all the acid in his stomach, yeah.
joe rogan
But does coffee give you acid?
Is that what it does?
tom papa
Yeah, it's acidic.
joe rogan
Yeah?
Put in the beans?
tom papa
I guess.
joe rogan
And that fucks with your stomach?
tom papa
Yeah, if you're drinking how many?
12?
joe rogan
Apparently, yeah.
I was drinking 12 cups of coffee a day.
tom papa
Yeah, that's an addiction.
joe rogan
Can I play some music for him?
For his stomach?
tom papa
That's a big time addiction.
unidentified
12 cups a day can make you throw up.
joe rogan
Coffee is highly acidic.
And it can stimulate the hyper-section secretion of gastric acids.
Decaffeinated coffee has been shown to increase acidity to a greater degree than either regular coffee or caffeine alone.
So decaffeinated coffee is more acidic than anything.
Both caffeine and coffee stimulate gastric acid secretion and decaffeinated coffee raises serum gastrin levels.
tom papa
Ew, that's disgusting.
Back to your wine guy.
Yeah, let's find a guy.
Let's hook up with a guy.
joe rogan
Well, I do know one guy, Maynard.
unidentified
Maynard.
joe rogan
Maynard Keenan from Tool.
He's a friend of mine.
He's actually in town.
He has a vineyard.
He has a real vineyard in Arizona.
tom papa
That's right.
It's not in California.
joe rogan
He makes great wine.
tom papa
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
Oh my god.
Yeah, well he's an artist.
He's a weird motherfucker.
Super, super smart guy.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And makes wine the same way he makes music.
They made a Tool album and one of the songs was they wrote a song to the Fibonacci sequence.
tom papa
Uh huh.
joe rogan
What did you just pull up?
Yeah.
He wrote a song to the Fibonacci sequence.
tom papa
What's the Fibonacci sequence?
joe rogan
The Fibonacci sequence is a mathematical sequence.
The way it works is it goes like zero.
The next number is 1, and the next number is 2, and then 2 plus 1, which is 3, and then it keeps going like in this mathematical progression, and that's how they had the chord progression.
They had the chord progression link up to the Fibonacci sequence.
tom papa
Just for fun?
joe rogan
Because he's a fucking maniac.
But that same sort of attention to detail and obsessing on the intricacies of things, he's applied that to his wine.
His wine's amazing.
tom papa
Is it really good?
joe rogan
It's really good.
tom papa
What's the label?
joe rogan
Caduceus Vineyards.
tom papa
Caduceus.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Yeah, he has an Osteria, too.
He has a small restaurant.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Jeez.
joe rogan
That's crazy.
tom papa
This sounds good.
joe rogan
Yeah.
I think he gave me the flu of that fuck.
tom papa
Oh, really?
Oh, that's where the flu came from?
joe rogan
He told me he just got over the flu.
I'm like, oh, you shithead.
tom papa
Oh, thanks.
joe rogan
Because I was hanging out with him in Vegas, and I think that's right when I started to catch it.
And then I had a little bit of a cough, and then it got a little worse.
And then I really did myself in in the sauna.
I cranked the sauna up to 210 degrees.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Which is apparently too hot for people.
tom papa
How high are you supposed to go?
joe rogan
176 to like 190's apparently what people like.
tom papa
And you went 220?
joe rogan
I was at 210 for about an hour.
tom papa
Oh, jeez.
joe rogan
Not an hour, but...
tom papa
How long do you stay in there?
joe rogan
I was in 210 for at least 20 minutes.
15?
tom papa
15 minutes?
joe rogan
You know what?
I don't know how long I did it at 210. How long are you supposed to stay in?
Because I opened the door a bunch of times.
To get the right benefits, you're supposed to 20 minutes at 176 degrees at least twice a week is what they recommend.
But if you can get to four times a week, you're a lot better off.
tom papa
What's the main thing it does for you?
joe rogan
It increases a bunch of different things.
First of all, it makes your body produce something called heat shock proteins, which radically reduce inflammation.
Similar in a lot of ways to cold shock proteins that you would get from cryogenic chamber treatments.
tom papa
Can I ask a question?
unidentified
Sure.
tom papa
Why is inflammation, why is anti-inflammatory, why is it bad to be inflamed?
I mean, I know it sounds kind of...
joe rogan
That's the root of almost all diseases.
tom papa
It is?
joe rogan
Yeah.
Big cause of a lot.
Well, that was one of the things about this study.
I think it was a Norwegian study.
On the sauna, they showed a decrease in mortality, a 40% decrease in mortality amongst all causes of From people that use the sauna, I think three times or four times a week.
tom papa
What?
joe rogan
Yeah, meaning 40% decrease in stroke, heart attack, all these different various factors.
And they think that that's attributed to the heat shock proteins.
Dr. Rhonda Patrick.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah, she's the one who got me into it.
She's a frequent guest on the podcast and super genius.
tom papa
She came to a show of mine in San Francisco.
unidentified
Did she?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Oh, that's cool.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's nice.
tom papa
She's the coolest.
joe rogan
She's very cool.
We were just talking about she was on the Kardashians.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, Jamie was telling me.
tom papa
What's she doing on the Kardashians?
That doesn't make sense.
joe rogan
Teaching them how not to be inflamed.
tom papa
Oh, that's great.
joe rogan
Good for her.
Like, your lips are inflamed.
Are you sure you're not eating anything weird?
tom papa
Your breasts are inflamed.
joe rogan
What's going on with your butt?
Your butt is inflamed.
Are you guys not getting in the sauna?
If Kim Kardashian got in the sauna, she'd probably start sweating.
Like when you bathe something.
Like if you have a slow cook pork roast or something like that.
tom papa
Just all juicy.
joe rogan
You see those beads of juice come popping on top of it.
tom papa
Just putting a tray under her to catch the drippings.
joe rogan
Yeah, because you think about all that.
tom papa
The squeezins.
joe rogan
All that fat that they pull out of the sides and then suck into the butt, right?
And they pump that stuff in the butt to make the butt extra big, and then you put that butt in the oven, and that'll just get juicy.
tom papa
That's good eatin's.
That's good eatin's there.
I'll tell you what, that is some good eatin's right there.
joe rogan
Yeah, boil it down.
tom papa
So the heat proteins...
joe rogan
Heat shock proteins, yeah.
Cytokines.
tom papa
Help you with inflammation.
joe rogan
Yes, yes.
It helps your body fight off inflammation.
And it does it in a natural way instead of like non-steroidal anti-inflammatories like ibuprofen, things along those lines which are really bad for your gut health, really bad for your...
They say that ibuprofen should be taken rare, rarely if ever.
tom papa
Really?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's apparently terrible for your body, can cause strokes, and it also is really bad for your gut flora.
I had a buddy, my friend Cameron Haynes is an ultra-marathon runner.
He runs these crazy 200-plus miles and these nutty fucking things.
tom papa
Those are insane.
joe rogan
And he was taking ibuprofen on a daily basis.
Yeah.
tom papa
For his joints and stuff?
joe rogan
Got off of it after he listened to the Rhonda Patrick podcast.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And all of his joint pain went away.
And his joint pain was literally being caused.
He thought it was being caused by all his running.
It was being caused by his taking of the non-steroidal anti-inflammatories, which increased his body's inflammation levels.
tom papa
What?
joe rogan
Yes, which is crazy because it damages your gut bacteria because it's fucking poison.
He's taking 800 milligrams of this shit every day.
unidentified
Shit.
joe rogan
Your body freaks out.
I was telling him, like, dude, you're significantly increasing your risk of stroke.
And I sent him all these studies and findings on ibuprofen.
So he stops.
He gets off of it.
All of his joint pain goes away.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Literally, it was causing joint pain.
tom papa
So how is your gut connected to?
joe rogan
Inflammation.
tom papa
Inflammation.
joe rogan
Which is one of the reasons why people tell you not to eat bread.
It's why people tell you not to eat sugar.
Fine carbohydrates cause inflammation.
One of the ways they cause it is through the gut leakage.
tom papa
And when we say inflamed, what is inflamed?
joe rogan
That's a good point.
Let's pull that up in a way that I can describe it.
jamie vernon
I have an article right now that's about what is inflammation.
joe rogan
What is inflammation?
tom papa
I'm sorry if you're going over stuff you always go over.
joe rogan
No, everything you need to know about inflammation.
Inflammation is a defense mechanism in the body.
The immune system recognizes damaged cells.
Oh, these fucking pop-ups!
tom papa
Get out of there!
joe rogan
You cunts with the pop-up ass.
- Come on! - The immune system recognizes damaged cells, irritants and pathogens, and it begins the healing process.
When something harmful or irritating affects a part of your body, there's a biological response to try to remove it.
The signs and symptoms of inflammation can be uncomfortable but are to show that the body is trying to heal itself.
So, if you're in a constant state of inflammation because you're constantly taking in foods that your body is reacting to in a very adverse way.
That is what causes a lot of diseases in people.
And it also causes your body to...
You're feeding certain aspects of gut bacteria that are just not healthy.
tom papa
So the body is actually the same way they would fight a disease is fighting these foods that come in.
Or these medicines or whatever.
These foreign things.
Exactly.
joe rogan
A big thing with foods.
A big thing with alcohol.
You see people with puffy faces.
tom papa
Yeah, they get permanently puffed up.
joe rogan
They're just all fucking inflamed.
Everything's inflamed.
Their gut sticks out.
Their gut's inflamed.
tom papa
And is it your cells?
Is it your arteries?
Everything's just kind of...
joe rogan
Go back to that article.
tom papa
Puffed up with fluid?
joe rogan
Yeah, okay.
Chronic inflammation can eventually cause several diseases and conditions including some cancers and rheumatoid arthritis.
Infections, wounds, and any kind of tissue would not be able to heal itself without an inflammatory response.
So inflammation is a part of the body's immune system.
So what you're doing is you're in a constant state of damage.
When you're eating shitty food all the time.
So if you're constantly eating sugar and drinking sodas and fucking corn syrup and all that whole shit.
tom papa
You're putting these weird chemicals in your body and your body's freaking out.
joe rogan
So they're not making a distinction between inflammation that comes from a bruising or an injury where your body's trying to heal itself versus something that's happening internally from your consumption of shitty foods.
But there's so many inflammatory-causing foods that people eat on a daily basis, and we just think of it as food.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Pizza.
Pizza's delicious, right?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Fucking full of inflammation-causing bullshit.
tom papa
Why?
joe rogan
Well, first of all, the bread, which is unfortunately what you make.
But I think that your bread is sourdough bread, which is different because sourdough bread apparently has less complex glutens in it.
Right.
tom papa
I have friends that have gluten issues that can eat my bread.
Not to excess, but it doesn't bother them the way they process bread.
joe rogan
There's something about sourdough bread that is different.
tom papa
No commercial yeast.
The gluten structure is a little weaker.
joe rogan
Well, there's a great documentary that I've watched recently called What's With Wheat?
And it was all about how they changed wheat to make higher yield wheat, which you could grow more wheat in a shorter area and have a higher yield, and that the glutens in that wheat are much more dense and complex than the natural wheat that we used to eat 150 plus years ago.
tom papa
This bread that you're going to eat comes from this great mill in Utah that is pure It's organic, small crops, so you won't have a problem with this.
joe rogan
So it's like heirloom wheat?
Is that what they call it?
I didn't even know that was a thing until Maynard also told me about that.
They use heirloom wheat in his pasta that he makes in his pasta.
tom papa
Oh, interesting.
joe rogan
It's easier for people to digest.
tom papa
Yeah.
It's a little more expensive and a little harder to get, but it makes a difference.
And the flavor is so much better.
joe rogan
Yeah, I've been buying pasta when I rarely eat pasta, but if I do eat it, I buy it from Italy, and they have heirloom pasta in Italy, and just, you don't feel as fucking gross after you eat it.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That brick.
tom papa
Yeah, that punch in the gut.
joe rogan
That just fucking, like you ate a bag of rocks.
tom papa
So what is the, so the sauna, if you're eating all this stuff, Probably help.
And you're putting in there and you're...
joe rogan
It would help, but you're also dealing with your gut biome.
Right.
You're forcing your body to...
You're eating foods that are going to encourage the growth of certain types of gut bacteria.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
That live off of sugars and live off of...
tom papa
A friend of mine got the gastro surgery, and she was diabetic, and she had the gastro thing done, and her diabetes leveled out.
And she said it was, the doctor says, because of the bacteria, because of something that they did in taking something out.
Does this make sense at all?
joe rogan
Yeah, she probably had a terrible diet.
tom papa
Yeah, probably.
joe rogan
Which is also probably one of the reasons why she was so big.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
You know, there's different kinds of bacteria.
There's different types of diabetes, right?
There's diabetes that is caused entirely by diet, and there's diabetes that is genetic.
And the type of diabetes that is caused by diet is reversible.
It happens with a lot of people that wind up going on, you know, calorie-restricted diets and reduce the amount of sugar they take in.
Dean Del Rey.
Dean Del Rey was pre-diabetic.
Yeah, he went to a doctor and he had a real candy problem.
He's eating candy constantly.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Just hooked on sugar.
joe rogan
Yeah, and you talk to him now, he's like, sugar's the fucking devil, man!
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Sugar's the devil!
tom papa
He dropped a lot of weight.
joe rogan
He dropped a lot of weight and got really fit.
tom papa
Yeah, he looks great.
joe rogan
He's at the gym all the time now.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, he looks very healthy.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, Dean's never looked better.
tom papa
No, man, I don't eat that.
joe rogan
Yeah, he's like, sugar's the fucking devil, man!
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
He's not wrong.
joe rogan
No, he's not wrong at all.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I mean, sugar's great every now and then.
unidentified
Yeah, a little treat.
joe rogan
It's like a lot of things.
A little treat, you know, have a little tiramisu after a nice meal.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's what he used to look like.
tom papa
Wow.
Yeah, look, he looks inflamed.
That face looks inflamed.
joe rogan
Look at that thing right there.
It says, people ask me, how do I do it?
How do you not get tempted to eat sugar?
I keep photos like this around the house to constantly remind me, never again, fat Dean, fuck sugar, hashtag eat healthy.
tom papa
See, that's inspiration right there.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Yeah, well, yeah, you got a picture of yourself when you're almost dying of a disease.
It's very, very common for people to eat too much sugar for long periods of time and then go to a doctor and the doctor tells them you have diabetes.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
It's very common, and especially in America.
tom papa
Totally brought on just by your diet.
joe rogan
Yeah, yeah.
Your body's just freaking out.
You're constantly making it processed sugar.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Your insulin's jacked up, spiked all the time, and everything's fucking haywiring your system, and your body's like, hey, shithead.
tom papa
Stop with the Skittles.
joe rogan
You're not supposed to eat like this, you dumb fuck.
tom papa
You lardass.
What about intermittent fasting?
joe rogan
I do that.
tom papa
You do?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
I kind of like this idea.
joe rogan
I love it.
Yeah, I eat for 10 hours a day.
And some people say you should do 8 hours.
tom papa
Oh, every day?
joe rogan
Yeah, every day.
Well, I take a couple days off a week.
tom papa
Well, the Jimmy Kimmel, the Jimmy Kimmel, Jimmy wouldn't eat on, he would eat like 500 calories on Monday and Thursday.
And just like real...
Fasting, basically, on those days.
And then eat whatever he wanted on the other days.
And that's how he lost all of his weight.
joe rogan
So for two days a week, he eats a severely restricted amount of calories.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And the rest of the week, he can eat whatever he wants?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
That seems crazy.
tom papa
Does that seem crazy?
He said it's tricking your body into tricking your body.
And so the metabolism was like kicking in and I don't know what the specifics were.
But that's what he did when he dropped all that weight.
He wasn't exercising and that's what he did.
Mondays and Thursdays.
joe rogan
Why wasn't he exercising?
tom papa
He hates it.
Now he exercises and is fit that way and doesn't restrict his calories as much because he's physically doing something.
But I like the idea of not eating a day.
joe rogan
That whole, when people say I hate exercise, it's like people saying I hate brushing my teeth.
Like, shut the fuck up.
Just what are you, a baby?
I hate exercise.
I don't want to brush my teeth.
tom papa
Wait.
joe rogan
I hate it.
It's annoying.
tom papa
That's back to the couch.
joe rogan
I gotta breathe heavy.
You just fucking do it.
There's a lot of shit you don't like to do.
It's like, I don't want to write.
unidentified
Well, how the fuck do you expect the jokes to come?
tom papa
You big baby.
joe rogan
I don't like writing.
I like it just to come into my head.
Come on!
Come on, ideas!
unidentified
Just make your way into my head!
I want muscles from a pill!
tom papa
You sound like, what's his name?
Who just died?
The comedian.
You're a crazy person!
joe rogan
Oh, John Panette?
Oh, Kevin Meaney.
tom papa
Kevin Meaney, the great Kevin Meaney.
unidentified
How did Kevin die?
joe rogan
What did he die from?
tom papa
I think his heart.
He was just on his laptop in his living room.
joe rogan
He just had a hard time?
tom papa
Yeah, I think so.
joe rogan
Fuck.
tom papa
God, he was funny.
But he would wind up like you were just doing.
Like a crazy person.
I don't want to work out.
unidentified
That's not right.
tom papa
That's not right.
joe rogan
We're big pants people.
Dude, I saw Kevin Meany in 1988. He is so funny.
Me and my friend Diane DeRosa.
tom papa
Nice.
joe rogan
She was a friend of mine from high school.
Italian girl.
Yeah, we went to see him at Catch a Rising Star in Cambridge.
And this is like...
I think maybe I had done an open mic night or maybe I hadn't even gone on stage yet.
But I went to see him and I paid to see him.
It's great.
And he crushed so hard that it was unimaginable to me.
I couldn't imagine someone could be that funny.
tom papa
So funny!
joe rogan
Because he was in his prime then, and it was a, you know, maybe 180, 200 seat room, you know?
tom papa
Just killing.
joe rogan
Little ceiling.
tom papa
Just pow.
joe rogan
And he's on fire.
tom papa
No escape.
joe rogan
Oh, he was on fire.
Smashing.
That's not right!
tom papa
That's not right!
And then he would...
I'm open for him like at Caroline's when I was first starting and just watching him just like destroy.
And then he breaks into that coffee song.
Remember when he would do the coffee song?
This like Sinatra song?
All the coffee in Brazil or something like that.
He just jumped.
He's just killing talking about it.
And then all of a sudden he's doing this musical number.
Like Sinatra's.
He was just so comfortable.
All the coffee in Brazil, I think.
Something like that.
joe rogan
He was just so comfortable he could do whatever he wanted to.
He was so funny.
He hit that spot.
There's a spot that some comedians can hit.
The fucking bow tie.
tom papa
I don't care.
unidentified
He doesn't care.
I don't care.
tom papa
This is his first Tonight Show, I think.
unidentified
I don't care!
tom papa
I don't care!
unidentified
Shut up!
I don't care!
joe rogan
You'd have to be there to see it.
And also, you'd have to be there in 1988 to realize how crazy what he was doing was.
It was so weird.
But he got stuck.
He got stuck.
He went from being a fucking murderer on top of the world, killing in every place, But he got stuck with his act, where he had the same act for the longest time, and that act didn't work anymore.
tom papa
Well, this is back to what I was talking about, about taking your eye off the ball and doing other things.
He started doing Uncle Buck, he started doing some movies, and then, you know, at that time, those people weren't so conscious that you had to keep your act alive.
You know what I mean?
And, you know, you take five years off the road and then try and come back.
It's not easily done.
joe rogan
No.
Did he take that much time off the road?
tom papa
I don't know.
I'm just ballparking.
But I mean, you know his interests were other places at that time.
He was doing TV shows and doing all that other stuff.
It's hard.
You don't progress because you're not just in it doing that stand-up all the time.
joe rogan
Well, everyone was told back then, in particular, that you had to do something else.
That stand-up was a vehicle that got you to the big game.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And the big game was a television show.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
Or a movie.
Like, when I got news radio, one of the producers of news radio said to me, like, why are you still doing stand-up?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
You're an actor now.
tom papa
Right, yeah.
joe rogan
Like, you're on TV. I was like, what?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And I remember thinking like, oh my god, I gotta get to a comedy club right now before this makes any sense.
tom papa
I know.
joe rogan
The fuck are you talking about?
tom papa
I mean, the way we think is you do that stuff so more people come to see your show so you can keep doing your shows.
That's why you do that stuff.
It's not the other way around.
But that generation saw it as...
The stand-up was not something that you...
But also, to be fair, they didn't have theater shows and other avenues weren't kind of carved out where they could see stand-up as being a special thing.
They were just in these hard-ass clubs doing six shows a weekend.
joe rogan
That's true.
tom papa
They were like, get me out of here.
joe rogan
When did theater shows start kicking in for people?
tom papa
For the main, for like, just regular good comics, not, you know, fairly recently.
unidentified
Really?
tom papa
Yeah.
unidentified
Like when?
tom papa
Who else was doing theaters before, like, you know, in those days?
joe rogan
Well, there was always...
tom papa
Kevin Meaney, if Kevin Meaney was peaking now, he would be running off and starting to do theater shows.
But back then, it was just comedy clubs, and then...
Television?
joe rogan
Yeah, but some people did big places because I saw people in big places.
tom papa
Like what kind of places?
joe rogan
Like, uh, there was theaters.
There was definitely rock clubs.
tom papa
There was some of it, but there wasn't like an active touring.
joe rogan
When was the first time?
Man, I'm trying to remember the first time I did a theater.
tom papa
Not that long ago, I bet.
joe rogan
Mmm, shit.
tom papa
It wasn't like part of the touring business.
I mean, you had guys that were big that were doing it, but it wasn't like, you know, you couldn't have a guy that, instead of headlining at a club, could just go off and do a little theater.
It was different.
They were like...
Comedy was, you know...
It was also a slump.
All the clubs were closing down.
joe rogan
So you think like 10 years?
20 years?
How many?
15 years ago that started happening?
tom papa
Yeah.
Yeah, that sounds about right.
joe rogan
Huh.
tom papa
Sounds about right.
joe rogan
There was a slump, right?
There was a comedy slump.
tom papa
Yeah, when I started in 93...
Comedy had fallen on its ass.
joe rogan
Oh, you started right when it hit.
tom papa
Right at the end of it.
joe rogan
Because I started at the tail end of the boom.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
The boom was like 84, and I started in 88. Okay.
And when I started, it's like people are like, oh, you started about four years too late, kid.
tom papa
Right, yeah.
joe rogan
But there was still plenty of work.
tom papa
Yeah, there was a lot.
But it was all clubs.
At 93, it was over.
joe rogan
Oh.
Did you get discouraged?
tom papa
No, because it was good for me because...
Everybody's quitting.
Yeah, everyone was quitting.
And I was there.
I was working for free.
I wasn't looking to make money.
I was just doing it.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
So all of a sudden, I was able to just...
If you had a car and would drive the headliner to a club, you could get on stage.
joe rogan
Well, there was also this weird attitude that some people would have that, like, they were getting screwed.
Because the work was going away.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like you were getting screwed.
And I remember thinking like, wow, what a foolish way of looking at things that is, that you are personally getting screwed.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Because this entire industry was oversaturated with a bunch of hacks.
tom papa
Hacks.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Real hacks.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Someone was talking about, is there going to be a bust now?
Because there's been so much comedy out there and stuff.
Yeah.
It's not a dearth of shitty comedy now.
joe rogan
No.
tom papa
There's a lot of comedy, but it's a lot of good comedy that's progressing and moving forward.
joe rogan
The art form is booming.
tom papa
There's a lot of different voices.
There's a lot going on.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
There was a bust back then for a reason.
People had 40 minutes of material, and they just pounded people with it relentlessly.
joe rogan
And they never wrote.
tom papa
And they never wrote anything else.
No, it was shitty.
joe rogan
Yeah, and there was a lot of these formula guys that would go, you know, they would just have some fucking, like, really obvious premise, and they would work it like a comedian would say!
unidentified
They had a way of talking like a comedian.
joe rogan
What is this?
unidentified
Mutual of Omaha's Wild Kingdom playing out in my kitchen?
tom papa
Yeah, yeah.
And it was really funny for a while.
joe rogan
Something's happening now where French comics are getting exposed for stealing American comedy verbatim and translating to French.
And there was a video that came out today that showed Dave Chappelle and then some French comic ripping him off.
Jerry Seinfeld and then some French comic ripping him off.
And not just ripping him off, but ripping him off with the same hand motions.
tom papa
Doing his act in French.
joe rogan
Just doing his acting French.
As if they were the only human beings who spoke both English and French.
This was something that we had heard about forever from the Montreal Comedy Festival.
tom papa
Oh really?
joe rogan
Yeah, because the Montreal Comedy Festival, not the people that performed there, but we would perform in Montreal and we would talk to guys who were comics that spoke English and French.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
And a lot of the guys that spoke French, sometimes they would tell you they did French shows.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And I go, oh, what's that like?
That's weird.
Like, you do French shows and English shows?
And they go, it's interesting, but there's a bunch of comics that are famous only in the French-speaking world of touring comedy.
And they just steal from American comics and just say their stuff in French.
I go, no.
They're like, oh yeah, it's blatant.
unidentified
Wow.
joe rogan
And there's a handful of comedians that were making a living, touring for years, just stealing everybody's shit.
tom papa
I love how they steal from the biggest guys.
It's so stupid.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Yeah, I mean, literally, this is...
Wow, they're getting a guy from 2004. So they're going back.
This is like hashtag me too.
tom papa
That's hilarious.
joe rogan
That's hilarious.
tom papa
Look at you.
joe rogan
Copy comic mix.
tom papa
Oh no.
joe rogan
Yeah.
85 or 86 to 2005. Well, that's Gad.
Do you know him?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
How do you know him?
tom papa
They call him the Jerry Seinfeld of France.
joe rogan
Well, he took that shit literally.
tom papa
He's good friends with Jerry.
joe rogan
Yeah?
Well, stealing Jerry's shit.
tom papa
Oh man.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's interesting.
And they're using hashtag copycomic and hashtag copycomicmix.
I wonder if this is like French-speaking comedians who don't do this, who are like, enough is enough, you fucks.
And they're mad and they're coming out with all this.
tom papa
Yeah, maybe.
Maybe.
There is a real thing.
I was thinking the other day, I heard you talking with, I think it was Neil.
joe rogan
Brennan?
tom papa
Yeah, and you were talking about Jenny.
joe rogan
Richard Jenny, yeah.
tom papa
Who I love Jenny too.
joe rogan
One of the greats.
Most underrated comedian of all time, I think.
tom papa
So great.
But when you listen to his stuff, it is very much of the time.
I think all comedy is very much of the time.
joe rogan
Sure.
tom papa
It really, like even our stuff from 15 years ago is of that moment.
And you listen to Jenny and he's...
He's so funny, but he's definitely of that ear.
If I were to try and turn my 15-year-old on to him, it wouldn't fly.
joe rogan
I don't know.
I think if you made your 15-year-old listen to a steaming pile of me...
tom papa
Yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah.
15-year-old boy or a girl?
tom papa
Parts of it, girl.
Parts of it.
And this isn't a knock.
joe rogan
I know what you're saying.
tom papa
You know what I mean?
It's just comedy is very much of the give and take of the culture and what's happening.
And some stuff holds up and some stuff because Richard is the first guy to do the lobster in a tank thing.
joe rogan
See, but he wasn't even.
He wasn't even.
There was a guy in Boston that was doing it even before him.
It was a guy named Don Gavin who had a fucking hilarious bit about a lobster in a tank.
tom papa
Oh, really?
Don Gavin's like the king.
joe rogan
He was a monster.
A monster.
tom papa
But see, what happens is...
He breaks that.
He breaks that code.
He comes up with that bit.
And then 15 years later, we've seen shades of it.
So then by the time my kid hears it, it's like, oh, that old thing.
And they don't realize at that moment when Don Gavin comes up with that on his way into the club.
It's genius.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Right?
joe rogan
Yeah.
No, yeah, for sure.
And a bunch of people had similar premises back then.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
There was a bunch of bits about game shows.
There was a bunch of bits.
Right.
There was a lot of different bits that people just had their own take on these individual things.
tom papa
Yeah, yeah.
Gavin was so funny.
joe rogan
Oh, he was a monster.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
He's one of those guys that never left Boston, though.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Boston was a dirty mistress.
She fucking kept you around.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Crushed your dreams.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
It was so good there that they stayed.
tom papa
Stayed.
And had long careers, though, right?
joe rogan
Yep.
But they should have been monsters.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Don Gavin should be, in my opinion, he should be right up there with all the greats.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
People should know him the same way they know Robin Williams and all these other stand-up comics that are huge.
Maybe even bigger.
tom papa
Such a natural.
Such a natural.
joe rogan
So good.
Especially at the time.
Oh my god, in 88 when I first started.
tom papa
Oh really?
joe rogan
He would show up, half-cocked, drink in hand, go on stage, and just crush to the point where you couldn't believe how good his timing was.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And he had that fucking Boston way of talking about things.
Yeah.
tom papa
That Irish kind of...
Right?
joe rogan
Yeah.
On a vacation, I went to Puerto Rico.
I loved it.
But fucking...
So many Puerto Ricans.
I don't even know how they afford it.
It's so expensive.
tom papa
Hey, I'm a vegetarian.
I eat meat and shit, but...
unidentified
It's like the timing of it.
joe rogan
Everything was a throwaway, and every tag was a throwaway to another tag.
You were laughing at shit you couldn't believe you were hearing.
tom papa
So brilliant.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
And then it really becomes, you know, there's certain stuff.
Like, I'll see, like, the old...
I was watching old Jack Benny on YouTube.
And some of it really is as funny as sitcoms that are out today.
joe rogan
Really?
tom papa
Yeah, some of it nails it.
But most of it is...
Like I said, it just kind of dates itself.
joe rogan
I was watching an ad for these Jackie Gleason DVDs.
So I guess Jackie Gleason had a show.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I didn't know you had a show.
tom papa
Yeah.
And The Honeymooners was a part of that show.
joe rogan
Oh!
tom papa
It was like a bit.
unidentified
A sketch.
tom papa
It was like a sketch.
Yeah.
joe rogan
So it was a variety show.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And they're playing this ad for a DVD for the variety show.
So my wife walks into the kitchen.
I'm watching this on TV. She goes, what the fuck are you watching?
And I'm like, look at this.
This is like a time machine.
You get to watch what people thought was amazing in 1960 or whatever this was.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, look at that.
Killer.
tom papa
The Jackie Gleason Show.
joe rogan
The Jackie Gleason Show.
tom papa
Look at all the characters.
Yeah, and look, there's the Honeymooners at the bottom.
joe rogan
Joe the Bartender.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Wow.
tom papa
Fenwick Babbitt.
joe rogan
Reggie Van Gleason III. What the fuck?
tom papa
Yeah, just doing a whole bunch of characters.
They called him the greatest.
He called himself the greatest.
joe rogan
CBS TV. The best.
Wow, how weird.
tom papa
Yeah, that was his show, 8 to 9 o'clock on Saturdays.
Brought to you by Schick.
joe rogan
And they all smoked.
tom papa
And Clarets.
joe rogan
See if you can find a clip from it.
unidentified
Oh, the best.
joe rogan
It's so weird to watch, man.
They all smoked.
They were constantly smoking while they were on the set.
They would light up and they're doing their sketches and they had a cigarette in their hand while they were doing sketches.
tom papa
A lot of them were sponsored by the cigarettes.
joe rogan
Oh, that makes sense.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Jack Benny Show, they would stop and just start talking about it.
joe rogan
Due to the nature of the rare kinescope recordings utilized in this tape, picture quality will vary in comparison to modern video technology.
However, because of the historical significance of the subject matter, they are included.
tom papa
Very nice.
This is it, man.
This is the beginning of television comedy.
joe rogan
Damn.
Look at what it looks like.
American scene.
tom papa
Yeah.
unidentified
Wow.
tom papa
It's basically a poster.
You're just pushing it on a poster.
joe rogan
Does it say what year this is, Jamie?
tom papa
52?
joe rogan
62. 62. So this is right around the time where he was in The Hustler.
tom papa
Oh man, was that the best.
unidentified
Look at this.
tom papa
Look at that giant pack of Marlboro cigarettes.
joe rogan
Wow, what does she say?
Back it up a little bit so I can hear what she said about Marlboro.
Give me some volume and back it up.
The music.
tom papa
It's so great.
I love this stuff.
unidentified
New York City, the entertainment capital of the world.
Marlboro cigarettes.
You get a lot to like with a Marlboro.
And Lester Cream shampoo now in cream, lotion, and liquid.
joe rogan
I bet those gals would love to come back and do some fucking Me Too speeches.
Imagine what kind of Me Too shit was happening back then.
Those were cave people.
tom papa
Art Carney was with him.
unidentified
Wow.
tom papa
Played Norton.
In front of a live audience.
joe rogan
Boy, there was nothing to look forward to back then.
I mean, you'd get laid a couple of times, and then before you know it, your wife was pregnant and you had a bunch of kids.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And then you're just paying your bills.
tom papa
Give me a goddamn laugh.
unidentified
Look at this.
joe rogan
These gals running around.
unidentified
It's just...
tom papa
Yeah, you'd have a little, uh...
This was showbiz.
I mean, this came from, you know, how you did a show.
joe rogan
Now, no disrespect, but do you think Jackie Gleason got to bang any of these chicks?
tom papa
Absolutely!
62?
joe rogan
In 62, right?
tom papa
I'm the greatest!
joe rogan
But, I mean, he probably could barely get it up.
tom papa
He was chain-smoking.
joe rogan
Chain-smoking.
tom papa
Drinking.
Big drinker.
joe rogan
Hammered all the time.
tom papa
Big time drinker.
joe rogan
And by this time, he was probably deep into his 40s, right?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
He was probably grossly unhealthy.
tom papa
Yeah.
How funny was...
joe rogan
So, 62. How old do you think Jackie Gleason was in 62?
tom papa
Here he comes.
joe rogan
Here you go.
tom papa
Look at that face.
joe rogan
Wow.
tom papa
He was the greatest.
joe rogan
It certainly was an original, right?
tom papa
Oh man, yeah.
joe rogan
Didn't give a fuck.
Look at him.
tom papa
Energy.
joe rogan
Pinky ring.
Let me hear some monologues.
tom papa
He's getting laughs.
He hasn't opened his mouth.
unidentified
I got 38 more weeks to go.
Imagine 38 weeks of this.
Your coffee, Mr. Gleason.
Thank you.
How sweet it is.
It takes a sip and she walks away.
joe rogan
Probably a sponsor.
tom papa
That was the joke.
unidentified
Ladies and gentlemen, we've got a long show.
We want to get it all in.
So, Sam, a little traveling music.
And he dances.
tom papa
Look at that.
joe rogan
There was no hip replacements back then.
tom papa
Wow, this is so weird.
You had to dance, you had to sing, you had to tell jokes.
joe rogan
But it's weird to watch.
Look at her.
Wouldn't you love to go back in time and bang some hot lady from 1962?
I bet it was just different back then.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
It was wild.
When was birth control?
When did birth control come out?
tom papa
60s.
joe rogan
So I feel like that's where people changed.
What they are.
Because back then, there was this mad desire, right?
But there was also insane consequences.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
If you had sex with someone, you're like, oh, we might have a kid!
We might have a person!
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
This drive, this pull, this cyclone of lust that leads you to this one person.
tom papa
Ramifications.
joe rogan
Not just ramifications, but life-changing, life-altering results and consequences, right?
tom papa
Then the pill comes and you have the sexual revolution.
People started banging everywhere.
Women were in control of their own destiny.
joe rogan
Yeah, but just changed what it means to have sex.
It became this weirdness.
tom papa
It became for pleasure.
It wasn't just to, yeah.
I mean, it was always for pleasure, but yeah.
joe rogan
It was always for pleasure, but the odds of that pleasure biting you in the ass.
Like, people must have just...
Assumed you're going to have a few babies mamas by the time you get to a certain age.
Right?
tom papa
But as a woman, if you had a baby out of wedlock, you were ostracized.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
You were seen as, you know, bad news.
joe rogan
That is crazy, right?
tom papa
Yeah.
You were seen.
The guy wasn't...
It was nothing.
No reflection on him.
He wasn't even in the picture.
She's just like a whore.
unidentified
Fuck.
joe rogan
What a shit deal for women that is.
tom papa
Yeah.
Yeah, it's pretty bad.
joe rogan
Yeah, but there's some people that argue that the pill and that changing the nature of sexual intercourse changed the way women interact with men, which changed the way women sort of like view themselves.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And that this is not necessarily all positive.
I always found that to be a confusing argument.
I don't follow.
The argument being that it's natural for a woman to be very selective about who she has sex with.
And that it's natural for a woman to want a guy who's going to shit together and all these different factors in place before she allows the man to procreate with her.
Right.
The pill comes along and then all of a sudden women could just have one night stands and they could be like the chicks from Sex and the City and just bang up a storm and have no consequences.
tom papa
Like a guy.
joe rogan
Yeah.
But this led to a deeply unfulfilling narrative that a lot of women sort of found themselves repeating.
It's a very tortured conversation because I'm not a woman.
Because I don't know what their actual design is.
tom papa
No, but that also can be said of men.
I mean, just that scenario.
Just to have sex, just to keep banging and have no emotional connection.
I know guy friends that end up in a very lonely place because of that, you know?
joe rogan
Well, think of this way, right?
If you're 20, and that's the case.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Everybody's like, ah, he's having a good time.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
If you're 60. Yeah.
And that's the case.
Like, ah, that poor bastard.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
All he does is get hookers and brings them back to his mansion.
tom papa
Yeah, it seems.
joe rogan
They do coke and they dance.
It's like, do you remember- They do coke and they dance.
tom papa
I love the picture of a 60-year-old guy just- Dancing in a lonely place with one girl.
joe rogan
I picture, like, Jack Nicholson with his hair all fucked up, you know?
tom papa
Yeah.
A whole bed-handed.
joe rogan
Psychedelic furs playing.
Love my life.
tom papa
With a robe.
unidentified
It's a new robe.
joe rogan
Yeah, here we go.
tom papa
It's so funny.
joe rogan
Oh, it's that fucking old dude in Italy, Gianluca Vacci.
Yeah, that guy's hilarious.
tom papa
It's great.
joe rogan
Do you know who this guy is?
tom papa
No, he's in good shape.
joe rogan
Well, he got rid of that gal and got a couple more since then.
But he's 50 years old, and he's like the super millionaire, and he makes these videos of him and girls dancing on yachts and shit.
But he's got, like, weird tattoos.
Like, he's got an ankle bracelet tattoo.
Like, he's got writing around his ankle that he apparently, like, taped over.
So then he wears, like, ankle bracelets to cover the fact that he's got this weird ankle, like, writing tattoo.
How old is this guy?
He's 50. He's in great shape.
tom papa
He's in pretty good shape.
joe rogan
Oh, dude, his Instagram is hilarious.
His feed is all, like, him dancing.
And doing weird shit.
But he's got like writing all over his body and tattoos.
He's a very strange character.
tom papa
That is a strange cat.
joe rogan
But he's become, from these videos, this enormous social media celebrity type character.
tom papa
Oh really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
What's his name?
joe rogan
Gianluca Vacci.
tom papa
Gianluca Vacci.
Party man.
He's like the most interesting man in the world.
joe rogan
He's a DJ, too.
He does, like, international DJ stuff.
So he flies around his private jet all over the world.
tom papa
Of course he does.
joe rogan
Probably banging tens, doing coke, dancing.
Sad existence.
tom papa
But is he happy?
joe rogan
I don't think so.
Look at those girls.
How could you be happy?
That's the thing.
It's like, how come that's sad if he's 50 and not sad if he's 20?
It's weird.
tom papa
Well, yeah, it's always your own shit.
It's your own projection.
unidentified
Sure.
tom papa
I mean, he seems like he's pretty heavy.
joe rogan
Looks like he's dancing and he's doing backflips into the water.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
There it is right there.
Yeah, he's got weird writing all over his body.
tom papa
Oh, no.
joe rogan
Yeah.
He's also showing his dick root.
tom papa
Oh, jeez.
joe rogan
That's that weird thing that the young fellas do.
tom papa
Yeah, you show the bones.
joe rogan
It's not a good look, the dick root look.
tom papa
It's so gross.
joe rogan
It's like, I know what you're doing, man.
Stop.
Look at the Captain America one.
Click on the Captain America one.
He tries too hard sometimes, and some of them are just really weird.
First of all, look how tan he is.
How he doesn't have skin cancer is fucking amazing.
tom papa
Oh, man.
unidentified
Yeah, look at this.
tom papa
He's dancing like Captain America.
He's got a shield and a head thing on.
joe rogan
Meanwhile, 6,723,840 views.
tom papa
Oh my god.
It's crazy.
joe rogan
It's so stupid.
More people watch that than watch any hit movie this year.
tom papa
That's so insane.
joe rogan
God!
tom papa
You never know what's going to hit kids.
joe rogan
There's this fucking show that my seven-year-old loves.
And the show's called Haters Back Off.
And there's this girl named Miranda something or another.
She's a YouTube sensation.
tom papa
Oh, Miranda Sings.
joe rogan
Yeah.
She's a YouTube sensation for doing stuff really badly on purpose.
Pretending that she's killing it.
And she's got this Netflix show that I watched with them.
And the fucking show is not a bad show.
It's an interesting show.
It's weird.
It's almost like a female Napoleon Dynamite type situation.
tom papa
She's talented.
joe rogan
But my daughter, who's seven, loves it.
And she does a Miranda impression.
This, like, something hilarious about, like, whatever she's nailed.
tom papa
That's great.
joe rogan
But some of the shows, like, she had this one about being famous and about, like, refreshing, like, constantly refreshing her page to find out how many likes and thumbs up and thumbs down.
unidentified
She got it.
joe rogan
It was super depressing.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Because she was crying.
tom papa
Oh, man.
joe rogan
And her mother's screaming at her and telling her how selfish she is.
And the whole thing is, like, it's really weird.
tom papa
She just lives in Studio City.
She's just like a...
Actress in the valley.
joe rogan
She was.
She's balling out of control now.
tom papa
She sells out everywhere.
She does live shows.
joe rogan
What kind of live shows?
tom papa
She comes out and sings like Miranda and all these young girls just pack the place.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Packs the place.
joe rogan
There's weird money in these things.
tom papa
She's funny.
That's very Groucho Marx kind of old school.
She has these big cartoon lips.
Good for her.
joe rogan
She puts the lipstick all the way around on the outside of the lips.
Yeah.
tom papa
My kids were imitating her for a while.
joe rogan
6.5 million Instagram followers.
It's pictures of spaghetti in her butt and stuff.
It's so weird.
Her making weird faces.
tom papa
You guys.
joe rogan
Meanwhile, she's nailing it with seven-year-olds.
She was sick from school yesterday.
She watched it all day.
She fucking loves it.
tom papa
I was on the Tonight Show once with Miley Cyrus.
This was like, I don't know, eight years ago or something.
And she's so famous.
The point was she was just completely huge, you know.
And my kids came along because they wanted to meet her.
My kids were little.
I was like, wow, she's really nailing it.
She's huge in show business and stuff.
And then my kids come up, can we take a picture?
And she's like, yeah, okay.
And she had to squat down to take pictures with these two little people.
I was like, that's the price she has to pay.
unidentified
What?
joe rogan
Taking pictures with little people?
tom papa
Squatting down and taking pictures with little people.
joe rogan
It's bad for the lower back.
All the squatting and posing.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
We were talking about...
By the way, a bunch of people got mad because we were talking about that Logan Paul guy who had taken photos or videos with dead people.
tom papa
Yeah, the suicide people.
joe rogan
People were mad at the way we were discussing the Logan Paul thing.
People were saying I defended him.
I don't think I defended him, did I? I don't think I did.
I don't remember.
We were high as fuck.
It was me and Red Band wearing NASA outfits.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Don't take it seriously, by the way.
I read into it more.
I didn't know exactly what he did, but I read into it more.
Apparently, he was mocking the bodies.
Their hands were bloated and blue, and he was making fun of it all.
tom papa
Yeah, he's a bad guy, apparently.
jamie vernon
He made a super cut of everything he did in Japan.
joe rogan
He did a bunch of other things on top of that, apparently, that we weren't aware of.
tom papa
He's a creep.
joe rogan
He's trying to be outrageous.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Trying to get attention.
tom papa
Totally.
And it's working.
He's got a ton of people.
joe rogan
It's the same thing though, right?
It's like these people that you're like, what do they do?
How do they have...
He's got what?
And you find he's got how many millions of this and that?
tom papa
No, exactly.
joe rogan
The guy's brother is the other one who lives next to a friend of mine.
Bought a $7 million house.
20 years old.
Bought a $7 million house.
tom papa
Yeah, killing it.
joe rogan
In Calabasas.
tom papa
Killing it.
No, he's one of those people that, you know, love him and hate him equally.
But even the people that hate him still have to see what he's doing.
It's like that kind of thing.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's super confusing.
Yeah.
tom papa
Celebrity.
And he's outrageous, I guess.
I don't know anything about him.
joe rogan
It's also just access.
Everyone has access to YouTube.
So what YouTube is now is like a television show that you keep in your pocket.
tom papa
Yeah.
You can just constantly...
Yeah.
joe rogan
There's a video that I posted yesterday of...
Poor bastard.
This fucking guy raised a squirrel.
I saw that.
tom papa
The cute little squirrel.
joe rogan
They rehabilitated it, and they got the little squirrel, and they said, hey little squirrel, everything's gonna be fine.
tom papa
He's like putting it back into nature.
joe rogan
Hey, it's time.
It's about time, little guy.
And he puts the little squirrel on the tree, and he's like, you just, you go about your way.
tom papa
Good luck, little fella.
joe rogan
This is where you live now.
And he's got the squirrel on the tree for all of 15 seconds and a cat comes along and jacks him with ridiculous speed and fury.
I'm gonna hear the volume.
This is my favorite part, the screaming.
Here we go.
unidentified
Stop! Stop! Stop! Stop! Stop! Stop!
tom papa
Oh, that cat just...
joe rogan
That cat was on that fucker so fast.
tom papa
The cat climbs up the tree, grabs him, and just takes off.
joe rogan
Just ran with him in his mouth.
And that's like you...
It's more than you doing that with a cat.
Like, if you had a cat in your mouth, the cat would be smaller in your mouth than that hamster or that squirrel would be.
That's how big the fucking cat is.
It's so wrong.
unidentified
Ugh.
joe rogan
Here it is.
Oh, bitch!
That's a wrap, son!
tom papa
Almost a million people saw it.
joe rogan
Cats don't give a fuck.
They don't give a fuck.
tom papa
My cat's a killer.
joe rogan
Oh, dude, they're ruthless.
tom papa
Ruthless.
joe rogan
Ruthless.
tom papa
Just kills everything.
joe rogan
Anything they can.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Have you ever seen the numbers for how many things cats kill in North America?
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Billions of birds.
Billions.
Billions of mammals and billions of birds.
tom papa
What's so gangster is they kill them and don't even eat them.
joe rogan
No.
They just kill them.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
They just like the sport.
Food's easy.
Cats that live in the wild or indoor pets are allowed to roam outdoors kill between 1.4 billion to as many as 3.7 billion birds in the continental U.S. each year.
So there's a new study that escalates a decades-old debate over feline threat to native animals, and it shows this cute little cat with a bird in its mouth.
They're monsters.
tom papa
Yeah.
And just brings them and drops them in my kids' beds.
joe rogan
Look at this question people also ask.
Do cats kill birds?
I keep leaving my birds and they're dead.
Fluffy would never do that.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Fluffy's a Sweeney.
unidentified
Fluffy...
tom papa
I didn't see a feather in its bowl.
My cat drops rodents in my children's hair while they sleep.
unidentified
Oh no!
joe rogan
That's so disgusting!
tom papa
In her bed.
joe rogan
Oh my god.
tom papa
Dropped a rat in my daughter's bathroom.
It took a leak in her shower cap.
joe rogan
Really?
To mark his territory?
tom papa
No, the rat was just scared shitless and we couldn't catch it.
It was like behind the toilet and stuff and we finally got it out and my daughter the next day goes to put on her shower cap and it's just filled with pee.
joe rogan
Rat pee?
tom papa
Rat pee!
joe rogan
You can fucking die from that.
tom papa
Disgusting.
joe rogan
Did you know that you can get leprosy from armadillos?
tom papa
Of course I don't know that.
joe rogan
It's one of the few ways that a human can contract leprosy from an animal.
Leprosy is apparently 95% of us are immune to leprosy, but you can get leprosy from armadillo.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
Yeah, so if you eat an armadillo, cook the shit out of it, folks.
Wear rubber gloves.
How armadillos can spread leprosy.
tom papa
That's a dinosaur too, isn't it?
joe rogan
Look at that.
Tank-like creatures are the only mammals besides us known to carry leprosy.
tom papa
Oh my lord.
joe rogan
Yeah, apparently though, those things taste pretty good.
People eat armadillos.
tom papa
They do?
joe rogan
Yeah, yeah.
They open them up and it's kind of a fatty meat and you grill it and people marinate it and grill it.
It's all in your head.
I mean, why is a lobster delicious and that thing's gross?
tom papa
Because it walks on the road.
Because you see its beady eyes at night when you're driving to Vegas.
joe rogan
Okay, but why is a deer delicious then?
Because deer's walking the road too.
tom papa
They're not as delicious.
joe rogan
Deer?
tom papa
Yeah, I don't like deer so much.
joe rogan
How dare you?
tom papa
You like deer?
joe rogan
You're not cooking it right.
tom papa
Yeah, probably not.
joe rogan
How come you're eating elk?
That's a deer.
tom papa
I love that elk.
joe rogan
It's a giant elk.
A giant elk is a giant deer.
tom papa
They taste different though.
In fairness, I haven't had deer in a long time and I didn't know how to cook.
joe rogan
Well, also it's how people take care of it is a big issue.
There's things called tarsal glands that exist on the deer's legs that are particularly active when they're horny, which is when a lot of times when you hunt them, which is called the rut.
And those tarsal glands, if they're not handled correctly while you're skinning the deer, you can leak some of that stuff on the meat and it'll greatly taint the way the meat tastes.
tom papa
Oh, maybe I had some of that.
joe rogan
Yeah, there's that.
And then there's also people don't take care of it.
Like, for the moment they kill it.
Like, how long does it take before it's actually cooled down and dressed?
tom papa
This was like in New Jersey.
I'm sure nothing was being done correctly.
joe rogan
That's the problem.
Nothing was done right.
That's where I was born.
unidentified
Trust me.
Yeah, me too.
joe rogan
Nothing was done right there.
tom papa
Born and raised.
I know exactly who killed it.
unidentified
And he's an idiot.
joe rogan
What part of New Jersey were you born in?
tom papa
I was born in Passaic.
joe rogan
Oh, okay.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, New Jersey deers are probably polluted too.
tom papa
There's a ton of them.
A ton.
They're really, I mean, it's really, they're everywhere.
joe rogan
Well, New Jersey has an interesting situation now because the new governor has decided to stop bear hunting.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
New Jersey has the highest population of brown bear per capita in the country.
unidentified
Shit.
tom papa
Geez.
joe rogan
New Jersey does.
Which people don't, that doesn't make sense to them.
Bears?
You're like, wait a minute.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
You say bear in New Jersey?
Yeah.
New Jersey has enormous bear populations.
tom papa
Huge.
And we were talking about it over the holidays.
My sister had a...
Her dog was going crazy at this woodpile, and my sister went and put a big tarp over it.
The next day, the dog's going crazy again at the woodpile.
And she's like, why is he going so nuts?
And she goes outside to get the dog, and a big-ass bear comes out from under the tarp.
Just in New Jersey just starts like coming out.
She was so thankful that she didn't just like poke her head under there.
joe rogan
Well, we've played videos these two giant bears battling it out in Far Rockaway where they tackle over each other and they slam into these garbage pails and garbage goes flying.
They knock over a mailbox and they go right out into traffic and fur is flying all over the place.
tom papa
It's like a drunk fur.
joe rogan
Yeah, they're fighting for garbage.
They fight for access to these areas where these people drop their garbage off.
tom papa
Like turf.
joe rogan
Yeah.
And this new governor, because Chris Christie is such a slob.
People hated him so much.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And he was the Republican, so they hired this ultra-liberal, social justice warrior-type new governor who's decided he has this ideological opposition to the bear hunt.
Even though the bear hunt in New Jersey is really strictly controlled by wildlife biologists, they've done it to try to keep the populations healthy.
And there was also the situation that happened in Rutgers a couple years ago where a kid was killed by a bear.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, one of the students.
unidentified
At Rutgers?
joe rogan
Yeah, at Rutgers.
Yeah, sad.
One of the students was wandering through the woods with his friends, and they got fucking attacked by a bear, and a bear killed one of the kids.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
Took a picture of it before it killed him, too.
tom papa
This happened at the Stress Factory?
unidentified
Right next door, in the parking lot.
joe rogan
Vinnie Brand was there.
He had the phone and everything.
tom papa
He was doing phone calls to the bear's den.
unidentified
Yeah, we got your daughter down here.
tom papa
She's really drunk, sir.
joe rogan
So the wildlife biologists put a number, like, you know, the bears can be healthy and conflicts with people can be reduced if we have, you know, the bears reduced to a certain amount.
Like, it's not an issue of they're endangered.
tom papa
Endangered, yeah.
joe rogan
They're not endangered in any way, shape, or form.
It's the opposite.
They're overabundant.
But this is a problem with people when it comes to bears, or what my friend Steve Rinella likes to call charismatic megafauna.
And that people look at animals and they anthropomorphize them and start thinking of them as being yogi and boo-boo and our little friends that live in the forest.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
And they don't realize, like, no, these are animals, man.
You can't have animals that are giant predators in close proximity to human beings without monitoring and having wildlife biologists, stoic creatures, We're good to go.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
And they did in British Columbia because...
tom papa
They're not endangered?
joe rogan
No.
tom papa
No?
joe rogan
No.
tom papa
There's a ton of them up there?
joe rogan
There's a ton of them.
Not only are they not endangered, but the people that voted on it are the people that live in Vancouver, where there are no grizzly bears.
But Vancouver, even though it's the population center of British Columbia, it's where all the people live, it's by no means representative of what most of British Columbia looks like.
unidentified
Right.
joe rogan
Most of British Columbia's woods and forests.
Those people have to deal with fucking grizzly bears.
Like real grizzly bears.
tom papa
So they said they're not allowed to hunt them at all?
joe rogan
They're not allowed to hunt them anymore now.
Also, it's a big part of their economy because there's a lot of these people that made a living by guiding people on these grizzly bear hunts.
tom papa
Oh.
joe rogan
And it's going to also devastate the economy when it comes to their moose and elk hunting populations, too.
Because a lot of people went there to moose hunt, elk hunt, and deer hunt, but the bears, if the populations are going to go up, the bears are going to start eating more moose and elk and deer.
tom papa
So what's their reason?
joe rogan
Animal rights activists have infiltrated the government and these people that are like leaning left and have sort of a delusional perception of what wildlife is.
They've decided to push these laws through that people didn't vote on by the way.
This is not like something that was a giant statewide vote and people decided to end grizzly bear hunts.
tom papa
Well what's crazy about the Jersey thing is that He just got in office, and the bear problem is this year it's been a problem.
That's while you're hunting.
joe rogan
Well, I think that people are doing it for the right reasons.
I think they're wrong, but they're doing it for the right reasons.
They're doing it because they think that hunting is cruel.
And they're doing it because they think that these are trophy hunts and that there's no merit to it.
But what they don't understand is you're probably going to have to hire people to kill these bears anyway, which is what we do in California.
In California, mountain lion hunting was outlawed in the 1990s, but since then they've spent millions of dollars killing mountain lions every year.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Not millions every year, but millions overall.
tom papa
Like a crew to go get them?
joe rogan
Yeah, they send out professional hunters with dogs, usually, to go after problem mountain lions.
And the ones that they go after, almost all of them have pets in their stomach.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
That's what they eat.
Yeah, they eat dogs.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah, it's a big part of their diet.
I mean, it's fucked up.
People are like, well, no, we're in their world.
Yes, but it's not their world anymore.
Just like it's not...
You know, this isn't where the fucking dinosaurs live either, stupid.
tom papa
Yeah, we build homes all through here.
joe rogan
Shit changed.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And right now, we live here, and I'm more concerned about us than I am with the goddamn mountain lions.
And they just ate fluffy.
Mountain lions just ate fluffy, you fuck.
tom papa
Are there a lot of mountain lions?
Like, is the numbers big?
joe rogan
California has good numbers.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
My friend works at Tahone Ranch, and they have...
Tahone Ranch is just outside of Bakersfield, which is only about an hour and a half from here.
And they have what's called a trail camera that's posted out in front of a pond.
And out of this one pond, they got pictures of 16 different mountain lions.
tom papa
Wow.
Do you ever run into them when you go up on your runs?
unidentified
No.
joe rogan
I've seen mountain lions twice in my life.
One I saw in Colorado and one I saw in Santa Barbara.
I saw one in Montecito in a car.
I was driving.
tom papa
It was driving?
joe rogan
Yeah.
It had tunes on.
It was listening to Miley Cyrus.
I was in the car, and I saw this thing that I thought was a coyote.
It was running across the road, and I went, oh, look at its tail!
I saw this big, thick, bouncy tail, and I'm like, oh my god, it's a cat.
And I realized there was a mountain lion.
tom papa
Geez.
joe rogan
It was weird.
tom papa
It was weird.
joe rogan
But I'm looking at something for a second, you know, two seconds maximum.
tom papa
Right, yeah.
joe rogan
It was like, boom, boom, what?
unidentified
Oh, fuck.
tom papa
It's a cat.
joe rogan
What do you got, Jamie?
Oh, Jesus Christ!
Wildlife camera catches uncollared mountain lion roaming the Hollywood hills.
tom papa
Oh, my God!
That looks terrifying!
joe rogan
Look at the size of that fucker!
tom papa
That is like, yeah, that's like from Africa.
joe rogan
And this is just a couple months ago.
It's October 31st.
tom papa
That's right by Paulie Shore's house.
joe rogan
It is Pauly Shore.
Pauly Shore turns into that at night when no one's watching.
tom papa
That's why all the lights go down.
joe rogan
That's why he's hardly working.
Most of the time he's just out there eating things.
tom papa
That's crazy.
That's like something you'd see on safari.
joe rogan
That's a big one too, boy.
Look at the muscles in that fucker.
tom papa
This is Halloween 2017. Yeah.
Crazy.
joe rogan
That is a...
tom papa
Uncollared mountain life.
joe rogan
Yeah, that means they don't even know where this one came from.
tom papa
Oh my god!
I mean, that's the Hollywood Hills.
That's like right next to people's homes.
joe rogan
Well, I used to take my dog to a dog park up there.
A dog park that's off of Laurel.
There's a dog park at the top of Laurel, like right when you go down, if you're coming up over Studio City, right when you go down, there's a dog park out there, if you go to the right, and one of the, they had a big sign there that said, be on the lookout for mountain lions.
If mountain lions attack you, fight back.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
What in the fuck am I looking at here?
tom papa
Jeez.
I just want to go for a run.
joe rogan
I'm just here to, it's Hollywood!
I'm my dog!
I'm taking my dog to the park!
tom papa
I just want to see some girls and throw the ball around.
joe rogan
Yeah.
And a lot of that is just because of our attitude about these animals.
And that's also why you see very few deer in California.
So there's like pros and cons, right?
The pro is you very rarely get in accidents with deer.
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
That's so uncommon in California.
tom papa
Yeah, that's true.
joe rogan
And it's because of mountain lions.
tom papa
I always figured they just weren't indigenous to the area.
joe rogan
Oh, no.
They're everywhere.
There used to be way more of them when I first moved here.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah, man.
When I moved...
I moved to the Valley in 94, and I see deer all the time.
All the time.
I see them in the Hollywood Hills all the time.
tom papa
I have never seen a deer here.
joe rogan
I saw them a couple days ago out in Thousand Oaks area.
tom papa
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah.
But they're very rare in California.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Anywhere else...
Like this, like if you're in Long Island, Long Island has a giant problem with deer.
They're everywhere.
They hire snipers to go take care of them.
They do.
tom papa
They're all over New Jersey.
They're like a pest.
joe rogan
Everywhere.
tom papa
It's like mosquitoes in a way.
joe rogan
And it's because they don't have any predators like mountain lions or coyotes.
Very few coyotes.
tom papa
So the natural order is why we don't see them out here?
joe rogan
They've kind of got a point, and that point is you can let the mountain lions take care of the population, and then when the mountain lions come into a problem, when they become a problem, they can get something called a depredation permit, which a woman got in...
The Malibu Mountains, because she ran an alpaca farm, and one mountain lion killed, I think, 10 or 11 alpacas and a goat.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
In one session.
tom papa
In one session?
joe rogan
And it was the same thing as we were talking about cats, with house cats.
They just killed it.
Didn't eat it?
No.
Just had a good old time.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
Alpaca pen, couldn't help himself.
Still jacking all of them.
tom papa
Jeez.
joe rogan
When this woman got a depredation permit to kill the mountain lion, she got a ton of death threats from people.
They were saying, you fucking bitch, I'll kill you.
You touch that cat.
And then she's like, fuck this.
I'm not doing anything.
She felt very exposed.
People knew where she were.
They knew where her farm was.
tom papa
Geez.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
That's scary.
joe rogan
Fuck.
Yeah.
People get really nutty, man, when it comes to animals.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
They get a weird, like, but it's certain animals, right?
Like, these people have this weird thing about that squirrel, and then the cat came along, killed that fucking squirrel.
Guess what, bitch?
You've been feeding that cat!
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
That's yours!
You made that monster!
And you let that thing roam around outside, which is just you're asking for it to kill everything it runs into.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Because that's what they do.
tom papa
That's what they do.
joe rogan
Yeah.
And it's probably super charged up about it, too, because it gets to do it all the time.
tom papa
And the pride in front of its family to do it for the family.
That's what they like the most.
joe rogan
Yeah, that cat did that in front of you because that's what he wants you to see.
tom papa
Right.
Hey, look at me.
It's scary.
joe rogan
It is weird.
tom papa
Hey, I saw the tank.
joe rogan
You want to try it someday?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
When do you want to try it?
tom papa
I don't know.
unidentified
When can I? Well, we'll work something out.
joe rogan
We'll come up with a time where you can come in.
I should have had you come in early today.
You could have done it before the podcast.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
How long do you go in there?
joe rogan
I like to do at least an hour.
Last time I did it, just a couple days ago, I did two hours.
tom papa
Just float in there for an hour?
joe rogan
Yeah.
Yeah, just climb in, relax.
tom papa
Do you listen to music or silence?
joe rogan
I silent.
I do silence.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I like it like that, yeah.
tom papa
I'd like to try it.
joe rogan
Yeah, we'll do it next time, for sure.
tom papa
That'd be cool.
joe rogan
For sure.
tom papa
This facility is amazing.
joe rogan
It's pretty crazy, right?
tom papa
It's so great.
joe rogan
I figure, fuck it.
Why not, right?
tom papa
It's so great.
joe rogan
To me, it was one of those things where I was like, alright, if I could just do whatever I wanted to do, what would I do?
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
And then I go, wait a minute.
I think I can do whatever I want to do.
Like, I should just do it.
tom papa
It's really great.
Jamie sold me a gym membership.
I'm going to start working at it.
joe rogan
Oh, I didn't know.
Did you get a key fob?
The gym equipment actually comes this week.
tom papa
It's insane.
It's like a gym.
Can I have an apartment?
joe rogan
Well, it'll be a real gym next week because Rogue Athletics is outfitting it like a real gym.
There's going to be a rowing machine.
There's going to be an Airdyne bike.
There's going to be a squat cage and a full range of kettlebells and fucking steel plates and all that jazz.
tom papa
Oh, man.
They're doing the whole thing?
unidentified
Fuck it.
Look at this.
tom papa
This is awesome.
joe rogan
Well, you can go to the gym and get annoyed, or you could just work out here.
tom papa
Why not?
joe rogan
Yeah.
Just come on by.
tom papa
What's the sauna?
Could you put the sauna in a house?
joe rogan
Yes.
tom papa
You could?
joe rogan
For sure.
Yeah, if you have the room for it.
And they have varying sizes of saunas.
That's a pretty big one.
tom papa
Yeah, that is pretty big.
joe rogan
Quite honestly, that one's too big for me.
I mean, I've only gone in by myself.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
But you could have a couple people in there in that one.
So the idea of that one was, what was that room?
Was it like a closet before that we turned into a sauna?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah, right?
Yeah.
We just decided, like, this is a spot, like, that wide.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Okay, put it there.
Can you get one that size?
unidentified
Oh, really?
joe rogan
And apparently they make them all sorts of different sizes.
tom papa
Oh, they do?
joe rogan
Yeah.
And it fit perfect.
Dude.
Here's the thing.
I've been dealing with tendinitis in my elbow, and it's really been kind of annoying.
Tendinitis is a weird one, man.
Have you ever gotten it before?
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
I have what they call golfer's elbow.
It's the inside where tennis elbow is the outside.
It's been annoying me for a few months now, and it comes from overdoing chin-ups.
I was doing too many chin-ups.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
And I was being a meathead, where I was just pushing through.
It would start to annoy me, and I would just keep going.
tom papa
Right, yeah.
joe rogan
But one session in the sauna significantly reduced...
Like, the pain in it.
And then the second session did the same thing.
And then I did it again yesterday, and I'm like, I barely feel that tendonitis now.
tom papa
For real?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
So just getting the inflammation out?
joe rogan
Yeah, I think it just has an overall effect on inflammation throughout your whole body.
tom papa
That's pretty cool.
joe rogan
Yeah.
You got a spare set of underwear?
You can climb in today.
I'm going in right after the show.
tom papa
No.
unidentified
What is this one, Jay?
jamie vernon
It's like a personal infrared.
These are like probably $1,500 I think or less.
unidentified
Oh really?
tom papa
You just throw it in your house.
joe rogan
And they also make them where you lie down in them.
tom papa
That's ridiculous.
joe rogan
They have one where you lie down in it like a suit.
And you zip it up, up to your neck.
Like, see that one with the blue down there, where that lady's lying down?
Let's keep going.
unidentified
Uh-huh.
joe rogan
Scroll down, scroll down.
That one with the blue.
Your cursor's right...
Yeah.
That.
tom papa
That's ridiculous.
joe rogan
Yeah.
You climb in.
That's like the old...
tom papa
That's like the old Brady Bunch kind of thing.
joe rogan
Yeah, but it heats up your body, and it's apparently really good for you.
tom papa
Really?
You look like...
She looks like the blueberry in Willy Wonka.
joe rogan
That's her pussy.
Her pussy is...
tom papa
Oh, my God.
It's on fire.
She's on fire.
unidentified
It looks...
tom papa
I like a nice sauna.
joe rogan
It's great.
tom papa
Hot.
I don't like the steam so much.
joe rogan
I think there's benefits to steam too, but the real benefit of the sauna is the fact that you can get to 176 degrees in the dry heat.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Your body can tolerate it.
But if you got to 176 degrees in steam, your fucking nipples would burn on fire.
Right?
You'd feel the wet.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
You'd basically be poaching yourself.
tom papa
Right.
My friend really believes in the steam.
He's a big drinker, and he steams every morning, and it just all comes out of him.
Comes out of him.
joe rogan
Yeah, it's how I feel.
Please.
He's dying.
Those big drinkers, they all have different ways of managing the big drinking.
tom papa
Yeah.
You just got to steam it out.
I'm alright.
joe rogan
I think sauna would probably help more if he could figure out a way to not...
I mean, I think he's probably getting some benefit from being in the steam.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
But I bet sauna would be even better for him.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
And it's, again, the same thing, reducing the inflammation.
tom papa
Yeah.
I'd like to be less puffy from inflammation.
joe rogan
Russians love it.
Five-time champion Timo Koukonen had become adept at enduring the tournament's 110 degrees Celsius, 230 Fahrenheit heat, lasting over 16 minutes in 2003. But he died, didn't he?
unidentified
The next guy died.
The guy he was competing against.
joe rogan
Wow.
This is a competition, right?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
World Sauna Championships.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
Woo!
What the fuck is wrong with people?
tom papa
Yeah, come on.
joe rogan
I'm the very best at cooking myself, but not dying.
tom papa
16 minutes.
That's not long.
joe rogan
230 degrees.
Let me tell you something, man.
I was at 210 degrees.
I can't even fucking imagine someone going 20 degrees hotter than that.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, my nipples were hurting.
And I was like, why are my nipples so hard?
Why are they so sore?
tom papa
Why did you do that?
joe rogan
I cranked it up, and then I came in here to do my ads.
And when I did the ads, I left it on too long.
It just got super hot.
jamie vernon
It says that this one guy goes in for bursts of 130 to 140 degrees Celsius.
tom papa
I just looked that up.
jamie vernon
That's 284 degrees Fahrenheit.
joe rogan
Four-minute bursts.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
joe rogan
280 degrees?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Four minute bursts.
So he's essentially doing like the opposite of the cryogenic chamber.
jamie vernon
Right, it says you can get what's called hyperthermia if you do this in a bad way.
joe rogan
Look at this.
Heavy bathers in favor of the hottest temperatures always wear felt caps and slippers because the wooden surfaces tend to get very hot.
Oh my god.
tom papa
That sounds adorable.
joe rogan
I cook things.
tom papa
A felt cap and slippers, they're going in like Robin Hood.
unidentified
But dude, I cook things at 250. Yeah.
joe rogan
All the time.
tom papa
No, yeah.
A lot of times when you cook like a potato, 150, pull it out of the oven.
joe rogan
I cook an elk steak.
I'll cook it at 250, and I put an internal thermometer in, and when it gets to 125 degrees, then I pull it, and I jack the temperature up, and I sear the outside.
tom papa
It's time to eat.
joe rogan
320!
It says 160 Fahrenheit is 320 for short spells.
320 degrees!
tom papa
So these people aren't, this is a whole nother psychosis.
This isn't about inflammation.
joe rogan
But isn't that just what people do?
tom papa
Always.
You can't just leave it.
joe rogan
You can't just leave it.
tom papa
You can't leave it alone.
We had a good thing going.
joe rogan
People that tattoo their eyeballs.
tom papa
Yeah, why?
joe rogan
Oh, it wasn't good enough to write you only live once in your forehead.
You have to tattoo your eyeballs black.
tom papa
He couldn't stop.
joe rogan
Yeah, you have to be like Toad from X-Men.
Why do you have to do that?
tom papa
Why are you putting things on your eyeballs?
No one wants you to do that.
joe rogan
But people can't help it.
They can't leave things alone.
If they get one piercing in their face, they want to get cheek piercings and nose piercings.
Look at this.
Guy got his fucking eyeballs turned blue.
Like, you remember when you were a kid?
No one had their face tattooed.
tom papa
Nobody!
joe rogan
No one.
And now, look at this, another one.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Full eyeball tattoo.
Soulless, it says.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
Oh yeah, you're soulless, bro.
Hey bro, you're soulless.
You got an umbrella like Mary Poppins on your cheek.
You stupid fuck.
He's got an umbrella on his cheek.
And what is that, a microphone over the top?
Is it a microphone or a razor blade?
tom papa
What do you do when your kids start asking to do it?
joe rogan
Tattoos on their face?
tom papa
Anywhere.
They say they want to be pierced, do they want to...
joe rogan
I have two full sleeves.
I would be a massive hypocrite if I told them not to get tattoos.
But I would definitely tell them, you really should think about the fact that you're going to keep the skin for the rest of your life.
If you want to get a tattoo, it should mean something.
Don't get anything done that's cheap.
Go to a real artist.
Think about it.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
You know?
tom papa
Yeah, you can't control them, I guess.
joe rogan
No.
I don't think...
Not only do I think you can't control them, but I think if you try to control them, you're going to do the opposite.
tom papa
Nose piercing?
joe rogan
Nose piercing seems easy.
You get it taken out, you put it back in, it's no big deal.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
I would rather nose piercing than a forehead tattoo.
tom papa
But they're so beautiful and pure!
joe rogan
Living la vida loca.
Right on your forehead.
tom papa
Yeah, I think...
My young one was like...
I like a little nose, like the little dot in the nose kind of thing.
I was like...
joe rogan
Could be worse things in this life than that.
tom papa
I know.
It doesn't really make me that angry, but she's so perfect.
unidentified
Perfect.
joe rogan
I get it.
tom papa
Oh, don't do that.
joe rogan
People like decorating themselves, though.
tom papa
Then we were buying something.
This was when we were in New York, and we were just walking around, and then I was buying something, and the woman at the register was...
Tons of piercings on her nose and her ears and, like, you know, like...
50 on her ear.
And I said, I said, did the nose one, did your nose piercing hurt?
This is right off our conversation.
Oh, yes, it really did hurt.
It was so painful, and they had to do it twice, and then it got infected, and it was just a terrible thing.
joe rogan
I got staph and gangrene, and this isn't even my nose anymore.
tom papa
I'm looking at my daughter like, see?
See what could happen?
She's like, I still want it.
No, you can't stop them.
joe rogan
People like decorating themselves.
tom papa
I know.
joe rogan
It's a weird thing.
tom papa
I have a bad one.
I have three.
I have a really bad one on my leg.
unidentified
What is it?
tom papa
It's a wizard.
unidentified
Is it?
tom papa
Yeah.
You want to see it?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
I'll show you.
This is my first tattoo.
It was a guy in New Jersey.
Who made it?
I just picked it off the wall.
joe rogan
That one's rough.
Has it got a candy cane in his hand?
tom papa
Well, the original one on the wall, he was watering a pot plant.
joe rogan
Hold on, let me get a picture.
tom papa
He was watering a pot plant.
And I was like, I can't do that.
That's reckless.
joe rogan
Hold on a second.
tom papa
You know what's really funny?
joe rogan
Pull the microphone down so I can see your face here.
tom papa
All right.
unidentified
Here we go.
joe rogan
Look at me, buddy.
tom papa
You know what's really funny?
joe rogan
What?
tom papa
So when we did this show for your buddy that helps the Congo Pygmies?
joe rogan
Justin.
Justin Wren.
tom papa
Justin on the back of his book.
It's exactly my tattoo.
joe rogan
He's got that?
tom papa
Him in a hat with his beard.
It all comes full circle.
I showed it to him that night when we did the show.
Did you freak out?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
He just sent me a text saying he's going to climb Mount Kilimanjaro.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
I liked meeting that guy.
That was great.
That was the best part.
joe rogan
Oh, he's the best.
Isn't he one of the nicest guys of all time?
tom papa
Love that guy.
joe rogan
I can't help but do things for him.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
He's just a gem of a human being.
tom papa
I just wanted to hang with him all night.
joe rogan
From this podcast, we've built more than 20 different wells in the Congo.
unidentified
Wow.
joe rogan
They've built hundreds of wells there now.
tom papa
It's amazing.
joe rogan
Just because of this podcast alone, more than 20 wells were built there.
tom papa
Awesome.
He was such a good guy.
Just one of those people instantly just kind of...
joe rogan
You could tell.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
He's a saint.
Legitimately like a saint.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
His book is pretty great.
joe rogan
And he's a fucking cage fighter.
tom papa
I know.
unidentified
How does that even make sense?
joe rogan
Couldn't be a nice guy.
tom papa
No.
He was really cool.
I wish I had a picture of the book.
It literally is my shitty tattoo is him.
joe rogan
How many other ones you got?
tom papa
I've got two more.
We've got one up here and one up here.
Those are good.
This was like a shitty spot for it too.
It was kind of like a coward wave on your calf.
It's just like...
There he is.
That's a picture!
That's my tattoo!
He's holding the thing.
joe rogan
Yeah, he's got a spear that he got from the pygmies and he's wearing a hat that they made out of leaves.
tom papa
Justin looks like my shitty tattoo.
joe rogan
What's on your shoulders?
tom papa
My wife's name is on here and over here is like this son with this quote from Walt Whitman on it.
These are the days that must happen to you.
From Ode to the Song of the Open Road by Walt Whitman.
joe rogan
These are the days that must happen to you.
tom papa
These are the days that must happen to you.
You shall not gather riches you'll scatter with a lavish hand all that you earn and achieve.
You shall not settle in one place but will leave.
But we'll leave to the silent leers and laughing of those you leave behind.
Basically, go out.
These are the days that must happen to you.
Be fearless.
Go.
joe rogan
Go.
tom papa
Just go.
joe rogan
Go.
tom papa
Be fearless.
joe rogan
Don't stay in the harbor.
tom papa
Don't stay in one place.
Don't stay in the harbor.
Go.
joe rogan
Do you keep touch with friends from back home?
tom papa
Yeah.
I've got a real tight group from grade school, high school.
joe rogan
Do some of them not...
Leave, not go anywhere, and you're around them and you get to see what that's like?
tom papa
A little bit, yeah.
joe rogan
That's a weird way of living.
tom papa
Yeah.
It is a weird way of living.
And I get nostalgic sometimes because I go back to that same place, you know, where I was a kid.
And...
On the one hand, it seems like, you know, you could have made that choice.
You could stay and...
joe rogan
Easy.
tom papa
Just stay there and be at the same spot and do the same thing.
And there's something very appealing and calm about it.
But it wasn't my nature.
I couldn't do it.
joe rogan
Yeah, there's always something appealing about something that other people are doing, though, isn't it?
tom papa
Yeah, for sure.
joe rogan
Like, you think about your own situations and the weirdness of your own existence, and you go, ah, wouldn't it be great if I was just a fucking cabinet maker in Belgium?
tom papa
Yeah, exactly.
joe rogan
That guy looks so happy.
tom papa
He has his coffee in the morning, he just makes his cabinets.
joe rogan
He goes to the same cafe every evening and has a beer.
tom papa
Yeah, and he's in bed at nine.
Perfect.
Him and his dog.
joe rogan
Perfect.
tom papa
Sitting at the bar.
joe rogan
I love his cabinets.
tom papa
Yeah, and he's like, oh, this is hell.
joe rogan
I wish I was telling jokes.
unidentified
Traveling around the world.
tom papa
You know, since I started baking this bread when I'm on the road, I'll go see these bakers.
Like, if there's someone really good in a town that I'm in and just go talk to them.
unidentified
That's crazy.
joe rogan
So bakers is like if you were a martial artist, you'd go train with somebody.
tom papa
Yeah.
I go and check out how they make their bread and see what they're doing.
joe rogan
So they let you in?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
You go, hey, I'm Tom Papa.
I make a little sourdough.
tom papa
Yeah, like, hey, you know, I'll tweet out that I'm going to come and then they'll bring me back.
And yeah, it's great.
joe rogan
So how do you find the good bakers in town?
Is there a website that you go to?
tom papa
No, you just like, you know, through Instagram and stuff, you start to see the ones that you really like and who they follow.
And you just start to see, like, who's doing the same kind of a thing, you know.
Because it's a very natural way of doing it, so it's not just like a big commercial bakery that's just cranking stuff out.
There's people that are real artists that are doing this stuff all around the country, all around the world.
But it's funny because I'll come in and be all bright-eyed and This is amazing.
So you're a baker and you just come in here and bake this stuff.
I mean, how great is it that you feed the community and everyone really loves what you do and you put your heart and soul into it and they look at you like, I'm up at 2 o'clock every day.
So I'm in a living hell.
joe rogan
I have flour in my eyelashes.
unidentified
Right.
tom papa
I can't stay up past eight.
You know what I mean?
It is.
It's always the other thing.
joe rogan
Yeah, well, they have to get up early, right?
tom papa
Yeah, man, because you walk in and want a sticky bun on your way to work.
At 7 o'clock?
Someone was up making that at 4. So it could be ready for you at 7. There's no way around that.
There's no way around that.
joe rogan
Someone has to make that shit.
tom papa
Yeah.
Yeah.
Those bagels?
Someone's in there cranking that out in the middle of the night.
joe rogan
There's a good little bakery down the street from here, in fact, that I don't...
I don't like to eat sweets very often, but they have these fucking chocolate croissants that are so ridiculous.
The pastry part is so buttery and flaky, and then the chocolate part is so rich.
tom papa
So good.
joe rogan
I can't get coffee there, because if I get coffee there, I will get one of those fucking things, and I'll feel like shit.
tom papa
I know.
An hour later, you're just like, what happened to me?
joe rogan
But while you're eating it, it's heaven.
It's just a rich chewiness.
There's a combination of the flaky, buttery pastry and the richness of the chocolate and the sweetness.
And then you're drinking your coffee at the same time.
You're like, this is perfect.
I don't need anything but this.
Fuck diabetes.
I'm not worried about diabetes.
I'm worried about life!
I want to live!
tom papa
Yeah, that's living, man.
It is the good stuff.
joe rogan
It's not bad, man.
It's just, it's not good for you.
tom papa
It's not good.
Anything in excess, right?
joe rogan
You know what I found, though?
tom papa
A little treat once in a while.
joe rogan
Can I tell you something I found?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
There's a company called No Foods, K-N-O-W, and they make waffles, chocolate chip waffles, and they make syrup.
With low glycemic index, very little sugar in the waffle, very little sugar, and it tastes good.
tom papa
What do you mean?
They come pre-made?
joe rogan
Yeah.
And you put them in the toaster, they're frozen.
tom papa
Like an Eggo kind of a thing?
joe rogan
Yeah, but they don't last very long, so you have to eat them.
You have to thaw them out and cook them pretty quickly.
unidentified
Ooh, that looks good.
joe rogan
8 grams of fiber, 12 grams of protein, 4 grams net carbs.
tom papa
Whoa!
joe rogan
Come on, son.
tom papa
4 grams?
joe rogan
That's right, bitch.
And I'm putting butter on those motherfuckers.
tom papa
No way!
joe rogan
And then they have their own syrup.
unidentified
No way!
joe rogan
Their own syrup is very little as well.
tom papa
Oh, that looks perfect.
joe rogan
Dude, I'm telling you, they got it nailed.
tom papa
Who are these people?
joe rogan
Smart people that are healthy that figured out a way to make, look at that.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
You can eat that.
I had that yesterday.
Felt great.
Worked out afterwards.
Felt like a fucking champ.
Didn't feel shitty at all.
Like, look at that.
You feel like, there's no way I can eat that.
There's no way!
There's no way!
tom papa
Do you gotta get them online?
Or do you get them in a store?
joe rogan
I ordered them online.
tom papa
Yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah.
And then they're very nice.
They found out that I like them.
They sent me a box of shit.
tom papa
What a treat!
joe rogan
We have some of their cookies here, too.
Try one of their cookies before you leave.
tom papa
Tom Papa needs some of those.
joe rogan
Yeah, man.
There's some stuff that you can eat that people have figured out how to do.
Those are the stores, places where they sell them.
unidentified
Oh, wow.
joe rogan
There's a bunch of places where people have figured out how to make food that tastes really good that doesn't fuck you up.
tom papa
Yes, of course.
joe rogan
But let's be honest.
Let's be honest.
tom papa
The United States of America!
joe rogan
Let's be honest.
tom papa
Yes.
joe rogan
Doesn't taste as good as that chocolate croissant.
tom papa
Well, no.
joe rogan
It just doesn't.
tom papa
Well, no.
joe rogan
It tastes damn good.
tom papa
But you could have that four times a week, probably.
joe rogan
Yeah.
You could have it every day.
But there's something about knowing that you're eating shit.
And you're like, I don't care!
No.
It's part of the thrill.
tom papa
The thrill, the joy during the holidays.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah.
tom papa
When we had Christmas cookies on the counter for like two straight weeks.
Just walking through, eating them like chips.
Like, I don't care.
It's Christmas cookie time.
That's heaven.
joe rogan
You know what I had the other night?
tom papa
It's a good time.
joe rogan
I had pumpkin pie with Cool Whip.
tom papa
Pumpkin pie with Cool Whip.
joe rogan
No one's even pretending Cool Whip's good for you.
tom papa
No!
joe rogan
It's not even whipped cream.
No one even knows what the fuck Cool Whip's made out of.
tom papa
They're not even pretending it's a food.
joe rogan
It's just like some weird fucking thick stuff that's white.
tom papa
Yeah.
Oh, that's good.
Where'd the pumpkin pie come from?
joe rogan
I don't even know.
I didn't even ask.
It was at my mother-in-law's house.
tom papa
Oh, man.
joe rogan
I didn't even ask a goddamn question.
I just wolfed that fucker down.
There's something about warm pumpkin pie, too.
tom papa
Oh, my God.
It's so good.
joe rogan
Pumpkin pies.
tom papa
So I fasted yesterday.
I didn't eat anything, really.
joe rogan
The whole day?
tom papa
Yeah.
I had a little broccoli.
I had some water.
joe rogan
Coffee?
tom papa
Coffee.
Yeah.
I had probably four cups of coffee.
And I didn't feel bad.
I felt pretty good.
When I woke up this morning, I was starving.
joe rogan
Yeah.
Well, once your body, if you can figure out how to do it for 45 hours, 48 hours, your body will kick into a state of burning fat.
Body will kick into a state of ketosis.
tom papa
48 hours straight?
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
It depends on the person.
Some people it's quicker, depending on if you're fat adapted, it's even quicker than that.
But I know when I'm in that state because my appetite kind of goes away.
tom papa
Yeah, that's what was weird.
I was like, why aren't I starving right now?
joe rogan
Yeah.
That's one good thing about when I was sick the last few days.
I hardly ate anything.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
I looked really sexy.
I was looking slim.
Look at myself in the mirror.
unidentified
I'm like, damn.
tom papa
Snot coming down.
joe rogan
I'm looking ripped.
I'm gaunt.
My cheeks are sucked in.
My eyeballs are dark.
tom papa
You can't breathe.
joe rogan
I'm getting thin.
unidentified
Sucks.
tom papa
It's funny.
joe rogan
There's something that girls do that guys never do.
They do this pose where they look at you like this.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Photos.
unidentified
I know.
joe rogan
They like have their butt facing you.
unidentified
Here's my ass.
tom papa
Yeah, my ass and my face.
joe rogan
When did that start happening?
tom papa
At the same time.
joe rogan
There was no photos like that from the fucking 70s and the 80s.
People just looked at you.
tom papa
We weren't wasting...
With no film, they had a chance to come up with that.
joe rogan
Children.
Fucking grown-ass children.
tom papa
Look at my ass.
joe rogan
Yeah, something about turning sideways.
tom papa
I know, it's so creepy.
joe rogan
Turning sideways and showing their butt and looking over their shoulder.
Like, hold on.
You know you're taking a picture, right?
tom papa
Right.
joe rogan
And you chose to stand in some super illogical way where your ass is facing the camera, not your face.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, you're looking over your shoulder.
This is how you chose to take a picture.
This is so crazy!
tom papa
It is completely insane.
joe rogan
But it's super common!
tom papa
Yeah, kids do it.
joe rogan
Kids pose that way.
Like this gal.
Look at that.
That's common.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Oh, 11 simple poses that will make you look more attractive.
tom papa
Oh, that's good.
joe rogan
Click on that link, please.
I need to learn these.
tom papa
Yeah, I need this.
joe rogan
I want to look more attractive.
tom papa
I do, too.
joe rogan
Here we go.
Turn your torso or the body from the waist instead of turning your neck.
I turn my neck.
I look at you like this.
I stand.
This is how I look.
tom papa
Whoa!
joe rogan
Like that?
tom papa
That's so sexy.
joe rogan
Stunning.
I like to just turn my neck.
And I do it quick, too, like this.
I just saw some shit.
tom papa
I'm definitely turning my torso.
joe rogan
Don't stand straight.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Create some space in your posture by keeping your hand...
tom papa
On your waist.
On your waist.
Oh, yeah.
joe rogan
Etcetera.
Oh.
tom papa
Look how skinny she looks.
joe rogan
Interesting.
I think the girl on the right looks great.
tom papa
That's a good one.
joe rogan
I won't find an issue with that.
Okay.
Fingers should be properly visible when you place your hands on the waist.
Oh.
tom papa
Don't hide your hands.
Show your hands.
joe rogan
Hmm.
Does that make you look better?
No.
The girl on the left just looks fucking better, stupid.
That girl on the left is hot as the sun.
Nobody gives a fuck if she even has hands.
Cross your legs or standing in a way that will make them look angular and create space in the posture of the lower body.
That girl needs a sandwich.
I'm not into that.
tom papa
Always lean towards the camera instead of away from it.
joe rogan
Yeah, that's what I do.
I lean towards the camera.
Like, hello.
tom papa
I think I'm like this.
joe rogan
This is like fucking rules.
They work.
Keep your arms away from your body when your arm is properly visible in the photo.
unidentified
What?
tom papa
Keep it not like this, but like this.
You don't want a terrible website.
unidentified
Like this.
joe rogan
You say it's terrible.
I'm getting great advice.
You fuck off, Jamie.
tom papa
We're going to look amazing.
How about when you take selfies?
I can't get a good selfie.
Life depends on it.
joe rogan
Look at this.
Tilt your head forward a bit to look sharp and slimmer.
tom papa
That's true.
joe rogan
I want to look sharp.
Dude, how about sharp?
tom papa
I want to look sharp.
joe rogan
How about this?
tom papa
Now just show me your ass at the same time and you got something.
joe rogan
It's like yoga.
You're doing yoga at the same time.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Right?
Okay.
Don't slouch and sit, but create angles when you're sitting.
tom papa
It's all about angles.
joe rogan
Look at that girl's back.
How is she even doing that?
tom papa
It's all about angles.
joe rogan
She's like the exorcist.
tom papa
I should have been doing this during the podcast the whole time.
joe rogan
What's the next one?
Don't sprawl your legs while sitting on the ground.
Oh, see, so she touches the knees together.
Don't sprawl.
tom papa
Don't sprawl your legs.
joe rogan
Listen, honey, you can do whatever you want.
tom papa
Don't masturbate while we're trying to take a picture of you.
We didn't say that.
joe rogan
That girl's beautiful.
She can do whatever the fuck she wants with her legs.
No one's going to complain.
She can have them legs, like, fully spread wide, and people are like, uh, hey, you want to get some coffee or something?
tom papa
Do you want to take over my company?
joe rogan
Lower your forehead a bit.
And make up your mind.
unidentified
And look up.
joe rogan
Do I lean forward?
tom papa
Lower your forehead.
joe rogan
Or do I lower my forehead?
Then I'm not leaning forward anymore.
tom papa
Oh, right.
joe rogan
Look up a little to make your eyes look even bigger and more expressive.
unidentified
Oh.
tom papa
Oh.
joe rogan
Okay, no.
That girl's hot as fuck.
This is preposterous.
That girl would look hot no matter what she did.
tom papa
Yeah, just be hotter.
joe rogan
Yeah, be hotter.
Always put weight on the back leg while posing.
And hence.
Oh, and hence.
Creating an angular pose.
And hence.
That girl's like, but she looks like she's saying, what the fuck did you ask me to do?
Okay, what?
tom papa
What did you say?
joe rogan
That is not part of my job description.
That is not what I was hired for.
And I'm barefoot.
For fucking some strange reason.
I'm barefoot and angry looking.
tom papa
What did you say, white man?
joe rogan
You white motherfucker.
tom papa
I was reading a thing yesterday that had sleep patterns of successful people.
unidentified
Oh.
tom papa
Richard Branson, Bill Gates, people like that.
Right.
Obama.
Most of them, six hours of sleep a night.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Most between like the 12, 1 o'clock to like 6, 7 o'clock in the morning.
joe rogan
I think there's a balance between productivity and health.
And if you want to get more done, I would say that's probably the way to go.
But I don't think those people are pillars of health.
For fitness and people who exercise really hard and really tax your body...
tom papa
You need more.
joe rogan
I think you need eight.
tom papa
You need eight?
joe rogan
I do eight.
tom papa
You do eight?
joe rogan
I feel way better when I get eight.
tom papa
Yeah, six does not seem like a lot.
joe rogan
Is this all the different people?
Nikola Tesla got two?
Yeah, but he's too busy banging pigeons.
He's crazy.
tom papa
He was banging pigeons?
joe rogan
He was a super genius who was in love with a pigeon.
tom papa
What?
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
I never heard that.
joe rogan
He had a love affair with a pigeon.
Winston Churchill got like 100 hours of sleep at night.
unidentified
Da Vinci.
joe rogan
He was just drunk all the time.
tom papa
Trying to zoom in a little.
Are those dots mean hours?
unidentified
Yeah, that's when they slept.
jamie vernon
He slept every four hours, like a 20-minute nap.
Thomas Edison did something similar, too.
joe rogan
Da Vinci did that?
jamie vernon
Yeah, those little blue lines are when they were sleeping over the day.
joe rogan
That's crazy.
And Winston Churchill just slept like a bear?
tom papa
Because he was drunk.
He drank like crazy.
joe rogan
Richard Branson seems like he's getting, does that say six?
unidentified
Six.
tom papa
Yeah, 12 to 6. That sounds kind of reasonable.
joe rogan
Yeah, that's reasonable.
tom papa
But 6 is early to get up for me.
joe rogan
Well, if he's one of those get shit done.
tom papa
Donald Trump, three hours.
Yeah, 1 to 4. 1 to 4?
joe rogan
1 to 4. Come on, that's not real.
tom papa
That can't be true.
joe rogan
Is that real?
But he's on speed.
tom papa
One to four.
joe rogan
You know, that was the speculation about Trump from an article that was posted a while back was that he had a prescription for amphetamines in like the 90s.
And someone had prescribed him.
See where you can find that.
Trump prescribed speed for diet.
And he stayed on it for like eight years.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah.
It's been my...
When you talk to people that love Adderall and those sort of things, that you become incredibly productive when you're on that stuff.
And if you're one of those people that gets used to being incredibly productive on that stuff, Like, eliminating that is very hard.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
See, 1993, Harry Hunt's unauthorized biography on Trump, Lost Tycoon, corroborated the rumors, and went one step further.
The diet drugs, which Trump took in pill form, not only curved his appetite, but gave him a feeling of euphoria and unlimited energy.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
The medical literature warned that some potentially dangerous side effect could result from long-term usage that included anxiety, insomnia, and delusions of grandeur.
What?
According to several Trump organization insiders, Donald exhibited all these ominous symptoms of diet drug use and then some.
The supposed drug Trump took back then was tenuit Dospan, a drug with speed-like effects that's not unlike dexedrine.
These rumors say Trump stopped seeing Dr. Greenberg decades ago, but according to one source, to our source, the Donald Trump of today is on a diet drug called Phentermine.
And has been since at least April of 2014. He does not look like he's on a diet.
Fen-Fen.
He's on Fen-Fen.
Fen-Termine first gained notoriety in the U.S. under the name Fen-Fen.
A miracle combination of Fen-Termine and Fen-Fen.
Fenfluramine, another established anti-obesity drug.
The only problem was that patients taking the drug began reporting damage to their hearts and lungs.
Apparently the combination destroyed patients' body's ability to regulate the amount of serotonin.
Phentermine on its own, however, is still prescribed.
And while the US National Library of Medicine notes that most people take phentermine for a month or so at a time, since the drug is addictive, Trump has supposedly been taking continuously for over two years.
Well, listen, when people get used to taking pills, and speed in particular, they get used to that ramped up life.
tom papa
You can't wean off it.
joe rogan
It's very hard.
It's just very hard to just go cold turkey and be that guy who's just dull now.
tom papa
Yeah, right, exactly.
joe rogan
Think about how much energy he had while he was on the campaign trail.
Constantly speaking.
tom papa
Constantly.
joe rogan
Could never shut the fuck up.
tom papa
It was really impressive.
I mean, he was non-stop.
joe rogan
Right.
tom papa
72-year-old man, 73, whatever.
joe rogan
Doesn't it make sense?
tom papa
Yeah, absolutely.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Hillary was falling over.
joe rogan
I know.
And Hillary was on stuff, too.
She was on Provigil.
tom papa
What's that?
joe rogan
Provigil is a drug that was first invented.
They were trying to make a drug that was actually a performance-enhancing drug.
And then they had to come up with a reason for taking it.
Because you can't just say, hey, we made a pharmaceutical drug that enhances your energy levels.
So they came up with narcolepsy.
tom papa
Oh, really?
joe rogan
Yeah, I've taken it.
unidentified
Oh, yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah, it's great if you have to drive somewhere and you're tired.
Because it doesn't make you speedy.
And I don't think it makes you any smarter or faster thinking or anything like that.
But it definitely keeps you awake.
It gives you like a little elevated sense of energy.
tom papa
Oh.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
Doesn't sound so bad.
I mean, you'd have to take something to keep up those.
I mean, you know from just touring and stuff.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah.
tom papa
What that takes out of you.
Watch how they just were non-stop.
joe rogan
And he was probably on dye pills.
unidentified
Wow.
tom papa
Interesting.
And not getting skinnier.
joe rogan
I knew a gal going on that Fen-Fen stuff.
tom papa
Oh yeah?
joe rogan
Yeah, back in the 90s.
She was beautiful, but she was chubby.
She just had a bad diet and just liked the booze and she's probably 20-something or something.
And got on the Fen-Fen and I hadn't seen her in forever.
I hadn't seen her in probably like a year.
And then I ran into her and I was like, holy shit!
Like, what happened to you?
tom papa
Lost weight.
joe rogan
All of a sudden she was like 120 pounds and slim and gorgeous, and I was like, that is crazy!
tom papa
So it works.
joe rogan
Yeah, but then it started fucking with her.
And messing her body up, and heart palpitations and shit.
tom papa
Oh, jeez.
joe rogan
And then, a year later, she was bigger than ever.
tom papa
Jeez.
Well, I mean, if you think about taking an ibuprofen, if that messes you up, these drugs, the impact is huge.
joe rogan
Oh, yeah, man.
tom papa
Huge.
joe rogan
Well, I know so many people that are on Adderall.
tom papa
Yeah, I was just going to say, have you ever tried Adderall?
joe rogan
Never.
tom papa
Me neither.
joe rogan
I'm scared of it, but I want to.
tom papa
I know, me too.
joe rogan
I want to try it.
Jamie's going to bring in some for me.
tom papa
You take it?
unidentified
No, no, no.
joe rogan
It's a dealer.
unidentified
May or may not have.
tom papa
You sell it to children?
unidentified
No.
tom papa
What?
jamie vernon
I got a pill from a friend of mine that I wanted to use.
joe rogan
I never even used it.
tom papa
Oh.
unidentified
And I still just have it.
tom papa
Yeah.
Now, all this stuff really works.
Of course.
You ever take an Ambien?
joe rogan
No.
I sleep easy.
tom papa
I do too.
joe rogan
I got no problem sleeping.
tom papa
I was doing a show in the Middle East once, and my doctor gave me Ambien.
He's like, if you need help adjusting your time...
I didn't ask for it, he just gave it to me.
And, uh...
I don't really take anything, really, but I took it.
I mean, it just works.
You're just pretty awake, and then you just feel sleep just kind of calming over you like an ocean wave.
joe rogan
How did you feel when you woke up?
tom papa
Not good.
A little druggie.
joe rogan
Yeah, fuck that.
tom papa
Yeah, it wasn't like I woke up like, oh, I'm good to go.
joe rogan
I'd rather be kind of tired and then just go to the gym.
tom papa
Yes, exactly.
joe rogan
I'm just not into that drugged up feeling.
tom papa
No, because then it becomes a whole cat and mouse trying to adjust it.
joe rogan
I had a buddy who was going through a divorce and couldn't sleep at all, so he was taking two of those fucking things at night.
And everybody was urging him.
They were like, hey man, don't take that much.
This stuff is not good for you.
tom papa
I'm always afraid you won't be able to sleep normally.
unidentified
Or you don't wake up.
joe rogan
Take it and Night-night.
Choke in the middle of the night and just...
You're in the middle of some crazy dream about being in a gunfight with the cops.
That's the thing about Ambien.
Ambien people do things in their sleep.
tom papa
Yeah, like go buy ice cream.
joe rogan
I had a bit about it in my act about a friend of mine who made a turkey.
He got up in the middle of the night, preheated the oven, went to the store, bought a turkey, came home, made stuffing, mashed potatoes, and gravy, cooked it, ate it, went back to sleep, got up in the morning and called the police.
Someone broke into my house and made a turkey!
They're like, what the fuck is wrong with you, you fat piece of shit?
unidentified
Come to grips with your food problem!
joe rogan
It's a real story.
tom papa
It's a real story?
joe rogan
Yeah, a real story.
tom papa
And he didn't remember doing any of it?
joe rogan
No, he made a turkey.
tom papa
Oh my God.
joe rogan
He went to the store, dude.
tom papa
Yeah, like...
joe rogan
He bought a turkey.
tom papa
Dealt with someone at the register.
joe rogan
Bought a fucking turkey.
tom papa
Drove his car.
Oh my god.
joe rogan
This is so crazy.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
People are weird, man.
tom papa
I'm surprised no one's like killed someone on Ambien.
unidentified
Oh, they have.
tom papa
They have?
joe rogan
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
People have.
Yeah, people have murdered people on it.
And there was one guy who...
unidentified
That's...
joe rogan
Jesus.
He...
I want to say he killed someone in his family with a crowbar.
tom papa
Oh boy.
joe rogan
There was like some crazy story where he was on Ambien and he drove to someone's house and killed him with a crowbar and then drove home.
He had no idea he even did it.
tom papa
Oh my god.
joe rogan
Well, people react to different things in different ways.
You can never predict exactly how someone's going to react to heavy-duty pharmaceuticals.
tom papa
That's what I was worried about.
I'm like, I'm not taking this on the flight.
Fuck that.
Who knows what I'm going to do?
joe rogan
Freak out in the middle of the fucking ocean.
tom papa
Just wake up in prison, you don't know why?
joe rogan
How did I get here?
You know what you did.
I don't.
tom papa
Having to watch the video of you.
Trying to hump some businessman.
joe rogan
With a fucking cat in the hat hat on.
Beating someone to death with a nine iron.
tom papa
Pushing the drink cart.
joe rogan
Trying to get at the pilot.
Oh my god.
tom papa
Pretending to fly.
What a nightmare.
Ambien hasn't been around that long, right?
jamie vernon
This is 2013, so I was trying to look up.
There's something called the homicidal sleepwalking defense that's been used at least since 1987. Looks like it goes back farther than that.
joe rogan
Here's the Wikipedia on it.
Wow.
tom papa
Sleepwalking defense.
joe rogan
Wow.
Homicidal somnambulism.
unidentified
Or sleepwalking.
joe rogan
Sleepwalking murder.
The act of killing someone during an episode of sleepwalking.
Oh, man.
See, that's the thing.
If you were going to kill somebody, wouldn't you be like, hey, I'm fucking sleeping.
He was acquitted of killing the murder of his mother-in-law in 1987 after using the sleepwalking defense.
Now, let me just pause right there.
I would love to believe this man.
However, I have a wonderful mother-in-law.
She's a lovely lady.
But I have friends whose mother-in-laws are straight cunts.
tom papa
It's a real thing.
joe rogan
It's a real thing.
And it's just so convenient that this guy, he didn't kill his children.
tom papa
Not his wife.
joe rogan
He didn't go drive to his buddy's house and kill his best friend.
What does it say there?
Reportedly got up from his bed, still asleep, and drove roughly 23 kilometers to his in-law's house, broke in, assaulted his father-in-law, Dennis Wood, and stabbed his mother-in-law to death.
tom papa
Wow.
unidentified
Wow.
tom papa
Good on you.
joe rogan
After all this, he managed to drive himself to the police station.
Aside from a few isolated events, the next thing he could recall was being in the police station asking for help saying, I think I've killed some people.
tom papa
My hands.
joe rogan
Whoa.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
Well, that's what I would do, too.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
Go pretend.
joe rogan
You've got to plan this out.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Like, something blew up for you.
I don't know what it was.
tom papa
I went crazy, but you guys got to help me.
joe rogan
Yeah, like, if you know for sure you're going to kill them, like, there's no way I can not kill this person.
I need a fucking rock-solid excuse.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
What is this, nonbalombalism?
tom papa
And then he had wonderful Thanksgivings ever since then.
joe rogan
Oh man, to stay married after that?
How's that work?
tom papa
Yeah, probably.
She probably quietly is grateful.
joe rogan
Yeah, the dad pulls you aside and slips you twine.
Better you than me, buddy.
unidentified
Better you than me.
joe rogan
Some people do have weird sleepwalking things, though.
tom papa
Sleepwalking is a weird thing.
unidentified
I did as a kid.
joe rogan
Did you?
tom papa
Mm-hmm.
Like around kindergarten, I would come out into the living room just screaming and crying.
unidentified
Whoa.
joe rogan
And not have any recollection?
tom papa
No.
None.
I did have recurring nightmares that I remember.
joe rogan
What were they?
tom papa
The one very clear one was...
It was a blackness, you know, sometimes when you're sleeping.
You can feel the blackness, the space.
It was just very big, and you felt very small in it.
And there would be rumbling.
unidentified
And it would build.
joe rogan
Can I borrow that accordion?
tom papa
And...
And I would feel kind of pulled back a little bit in it.
joe rogan
No, I'm doing it silent.
tom papa
And then the turrets of two tanks would slowly come into the periphery on the left and the right.
And you see like the gun of the tank and the tanks would slowly start going towards each other from the left and the right.
And then they would fall down this hole and you'd get that feeling of falling.
And then sometimes I'd see the face of my father.
joe rogan
Sometimes I have dreams of falling off of things.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
What's that supposed to mean?
tom papa
That means that you're going to get money.
joe rogan
Powerful.
tom papa
Is that good?
joe rogan
Sometimes I do, though.
Sometimes I have dreams where I'm catching myself like I'm on a tree.
Like, oh, Jesus!
Too high up this tree.
Hang on.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
What am I doing on the edge of this building?
What am I doing on that cliff?
Get back to this.
tom papa
So I wouldn't connect the dream to the sleepwalking, but...
joe rogan
What do you think it is?
tom papa
I mean, I don't know.
It could have been connected.
joe rogan
Come on, dude.
You're a doctor.
tom papa
But I was...
I remember one time I was at my friend's sleeping over at my friend's house, and the next morning they were like, Tommy can't sleep here anymore because I did it at their house where they were just asleep, and then you got some kids screaming in the middle of the night, crying and screaming in the middle of the living room.
joe rogan
Yeah, but I've had kids do that at my house.
tom papa
You have?
joe rogan
Yeah.
You pick them up and you go, you okay?
You bring them to the bed?
You know, it's one thing once you have kids, too.
Man, it's so hard for people that don't have kids to understand this.
I've said this before, but when I was on planes before, I would be bummed out if a kid was crying.
Like, oh, fucking great.
This is a lot of fun.
Fucking loud, stupid kid.
Quiet your kid up!
But now, I'm like, ah, poor little kid.
tom papa
You don't even hear it.
joe rogan
But it doesn't bother me.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
Like, I'm upset.
I can't sleep.
It's like, ah, poor little kid.
You can look at kids so different once you have them.
tom papa
And the parents.
You have empathy for the parents.
You're like, oh, I've been there.
When you're going through that thing, it's just so rough.
But it really is an instinct.
There is no...
Like, when you hear a baby cry on a plane, there's not that thing you had when you were younger.
It's just like, get it out of here.
joe rogan
Yeah, that's a weird thing that people do have.
Like, I've seen it before where, like, young boys in particular do not like babies.
tom papa
No.
joe rogan
They don't like kids, and they're around them, and they're like, ugh.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
They roll their eyes, and it's like, to them...
tom papa
It's an instinct.
joe rogan
Yeah.
tom papa
And then once you have them, you would just, like...
joe rogan
But it's funny when you see, like, teenage boys around them.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
Especially ones that haven't been raised around kids.
tom papa
Maybe it's the instinct that they're going to have to, uh...
joe rogan
One day take care of one of those?
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Yeah.
And the party's going to end.
tom papa
They're going to be trapped.
joe rogan
The party's going to end.
And it's funny because, like, there are these chapters.
It's like, this is all coming full circle to what we're talking about with, like, Richard Branson on a boat, getting his dick sucked, doing coke.
But here's the thing.
There's a cycle, and if you hang in there long enough, it becomes cool again.
Like, if you're hammered and you're 20 and you're out there having a party, it's kind of silly and it's fun.
But if you're hammered and you're 60, it's kind of sad.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
But if you're hammered and you're 90, it's funny again.
tom papa
Yeah, absolutely.
joe rogan
He's got to hang in there.
tom papa
Absolutely.
joe rogan
But if you're a 90-year-old drunk, I go, how about you all just suck my dick?
Which, by the way, apparently the latest in the sexual harassment Olympics, the latest entry is Stan Lee from Marvel Comics.
tom papa
Really?
joe rogan
Yeah, he's 95 years old.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
He lives in some giant mansion, and he has a bunch of nurses.
He's trying to get them all to blow them.
tom papa
Of course.
joe rogan
Now, he says it's a shakedown.
He says they're all just trying to get money from him, which may very well be the case.
Or it may very well be the case that he is like a lot of 95-year-old dudes with 20 million bucks in the bank and about six months to live.
tom papa
Just getting it on.
joe rogan
What do you do?
You try.
You go for it.
You swing those fucking dice.
Come on, seven.
unidentified
Woo!
tom papa
Woo!
Stanley.
joe rogan
If he really can.
If you're worth...
Hold on.
Go back to that.
What does it say there?
Okay.
He bought someone...
Then it was revealed that someone had bought an $850,000 condo in his name without his knowledge.
unidentified
Yeah, that was last week.
I don't know if you heard about that.
joe rogan
No.
What happened?
He filed a police report after discovering that someone had stolen $300,000 from him.
tom papa
Wow.
joe rogan
Using a forged check.
And then it was revealed that someone bought an $850,000 condo in his name without his knowledge.
A fact that came to light when his team did a full audit of his accounts following the forged check.
Whether this is any way related.
Okay, so he might be being honest.
This might be in reaction to the shakedown.
tom papa
This guy has so much money that someone bought an $850,000 condo in his name, and he didn't learn about it until they were going over the books.
joe rogan
Yeah, he didn't learn about it until they found a $300,000 stolen check.
unidentified
Yeah.
joe rogan
That's a baller.
tom papa
Yeah.
joe rogan
Stan Lee balling out of control.
tom papa
Superhero.
unidentified
Out there kicking some fucking ass.
tom papa
Superhero!
joe rogan
Yeah, I'd like to think that he's not the guy who's trying to tell these maids to suck his dick.
tom papa
Nah, I doubt it.
joe rogan
I'd like to think that.
tom papa
Me too.
I want some heroes left.
A couple of those guys.
joe rogan
A few.
unidentified
But...
tom papa
Hang in there, guys.
joe rogan
One more time.
Tom Papa, let's wrap this bitch up.
Let's bring it home.
Tell these people where you're going to be performing your wonderful stand-up comedy.
tom papa
I'm heading out on tour, Joe.
joe rogan
Where are you going, Tom?
tom papa
I'm going to Raleigh, North Carolina.
joe rogan
Oh, you're going to Charlie Goodnight's?
tom papa
No, I'm playing the theater.
unidentified
Oh, someone's hashtag ballin'.
tom papa
Duke something energy center or something.
joe rogan
The Duke fucking Energy Center.
unidentified
Yeah.
tom papa
And then I'm going to Viejo, California.
joe rogan
Where's that?
tom papa
I'm going to...
I'm all over the place.
joe rogan
Where's Viejo?
tom papa
I don't know.
North of here.
Everything's north of here.
joe rogan
They'll tell you how to go.
tom papa
GPS. Yeah, GPS it.
Just go to TomPapa.com.
All my dates are on there.
joe rogan
TomPapa.com.
And away we go Tom, it's always a pleasure, sir.
tom papa
You too, buddy.
joe rogan
You're always a wonderful guest.
I always enjoy this very much.
tom papa
Me too.
I'm going to come back.
I'll bring some fresh underpants.
We'll go in the sauna.
joe rogan
We'll be back tomorrow with journalist Dan Harris, and he's going to get in the tank first.
He's got a meditation app and, I guess, a book.
Maybe just an app.
These wacky kids today don't even read anymore.
All right.
We'll be back.
Bye.
unidentified
Bye.
tom papa
Perfect.
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