Aug. 6, 2015 - The Joe Rogan Experience
01:32:08
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| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
| All right, ladies and gentlemen, Bobcat Goldthwait, better known as Bob. | ||
| Bob's here. | ||
| And Barry Crimmins, thank you very much for coming. | ||
| I really, really appreciate it. | ||
| Hey, Joe, it's great to be here. | ||
| Where are the drugs? | ||
| We got a lot of stuff. | ||
| But I'm mostly a pot guy, so if you want that, we got that. | ||
| But we got plenty of alcohol. | ||
| I know you enjoy that, sir. | ||
| When I was a kid, when I first started doing stand-up, You would go on stage and you would pull a Budweiser out of your blazer. | ||
| That was part of your jazz. | ||
| That was the old open where I'd walk out smoking a cigarette and then pull a beer out and take a big chug of it and say, I'm kind of a health nut. | ||
| That was the open. | ||
| You know, it was a very fortuitous, just amazing situation to be starting out in stand-up in 1988 in Boston. | ||
| It was such an incredible spot to be in. | ||
| Just total dumb luck where I decided to do an open mic night. | ||
| Dumb luck got me there. | ||
| Yeah, Dumla got you there, but for folks who don't know, you were one of the reasons why Boston became what it was. | ||
| And you and the community that you sort of established at the Ding Ho was the legendary community. | ||
| When I came along, it was already gone, right? | ||
| When did it end? | ||
| I think around 83, 84, something like that. | ||
| And then I went to Stitches and tried to maintain that. | ||
| But then, you know, I mainly became a comedy producer to get stage time and knew other comics needed stage time and also knew comics needed to be treated like someone when they walked into a joint house. | ||
| Because I'd been around the country and been treated like shit. | ||
| You stand in line. | ||
| You have 12 hours since you got in line and you get on for three minutes and then they tell you, you can't come back for three weeks. | ||
| And it's like, well, I fucking hitchhiked here and, you know, camping out to do comedy. | ||
| And now I can come back in three weeks. | ||
| Thanks. | ||
| And it's some gruff shithead with a clipboard who's nasty. | ||
| So anybody that walked in the ding, I tried to make sure they were treated well and given a fair chance. | ||
| And the thoughts that when we put our shows together, people who... | ||
| You feel like they're somebody, you're going to act like they're somebody and they're going to do a good job. | ||
|
unidentified
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I think the proof is in the remarkable amount of great talent that came out of there. | |
| Phenomenal amount. | ||
| I mean, it spawned. | ||
| No, just naming the open mic comedians. | ||
| All the greats. | ||
| Do you still remember? | ||
| Lenny the Loser. | ||
| Yeah, Lenny the Loser. | ||
| Charlie Gollum. | ||
| Joe Iosa. | ||
| Like, I owes you a nickel. | ||
| Oh, yeah. | ||
| And I remember... | ||
| He used to pump his arms when he did his act. | ||
| But he's doing his act, and the crowd was kind of... | ||
| Joe Iosa. | ||
| There was this really terrible thing where the crowd... | ||
| He's probably listening. | ||
| Well, yeah. | ||
| I doubt it. | ||
| So the crowd did this really evil thing one night. | ||
| Barry's hosting this open mic. | ||
| I don't know if you remember this. | ||
| And then they start laughing at him instead of with him. | ||
| And he thinks he's killing. | ||
| And the crowd's going, it's very evil and very Dada. | ||
| So he's having the set of his life not knowing that they're making fun of him. | ||
| Barry is upset by this. | ||
| And he walks out on stage and goes, I know what you're doing. | ||
| Now just stop it. | ||
| It's not nice. | ||
| Well, because I knew that he would keep... | ||
| And so I was like, Barry, get off the stage! | ||
| It's because it's the first time. | ||
| And it gets to the point where Barry's laying on the stage going, all right, John, tell your last joke ever at the ding-ho. | ||
| Tell your last joke ever. | ||
| Well, the problem with those kind of sets is when they get those laughs, those guys are going to stay in the business like four extra years just based on that one night. | ||
| Because that one set. | ||
| Yeah, there was a set at the Comedy Store where Joey Diaz went behind the stage There's a curtain in the original room at the Comedy Store and there's this woman who's on stage Who's just just whatever she doesn't have the gene just doesn't exist But she kept trying she was always there and it was one of those things But she would go on stage like midnight or something like that and she would mostly clear the room but She's on stage and Joey goes backstage behind the curtain and when she hits her punchlines He would open the curtain up and his pants would be down and | ||
|
unidentified
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So his dick and balls would be hanging out. | |
| And you know, Joey's 300 pounds, he's got this giant gut, and it's hilarious. | ||
| So every time she hits her punchline, he opens the curtain, and she's smashing it. | ||
| And as the set goes on, she gets more and more confident. | ||
| Because she starts to strut a little bit, and she starts to think, finally an audience gets my humor! | ||
| And she's fucking killing. | ||
| I mean, every time. | ||
| And the next time she went on stage, she bombed. | ||
| And she chastised the audience, telling them that this stuff killed last week. | ||
| And we were like, fuck, she'll never know. | ||
| Did she ever catch on? | ||
| Did anyone ever tell her? | ||
| I don't believe so. | ||
| As far as I know, no. | ||
| And if you told her, she would never believe you anyway. | ||
| She'd just put it in a folder in the back of her head. | ||
| Well, that's the thing, you know, that same thing that keeps us going. | ||
| What is that? | ||
| And there's folks that never have done well, and they keep going. | ||
| Well, that was that open mic night thing where people would get the phantom laughs. | ||
| People would hear phantom laughs. | ||
| That was pretty good. | ||
| Well, even to this day, this is the thing that kills me. | ||
|
unidentified
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These kids, you know, they... | |
| They find out about you, and they say, oh, thanks for what you did for comedy. | ||
| Here, I'm going to send you my latest set. | ||
| And it's them bombing in front of four people in a fucking pizza shop, and they say, what do you think of this? | ||
| I say, I think whatever money you have, use to buy this up and destroy it. | ||
| Are you fucking crazy? | ||
| This sucks. | ||
| And you've immortalized it. | ||
| You know, don't put shitty sets on. | ||
| You know, and by the way, kids, when you walk on the stage and no one knows who the fuck you are, how about opening with a joke instead of going, hi, how are you? | ||
| Like that golden moment when you can fucking take the stage and get somewhere where they're going, like, wow, how did you think of that opening? | ||
| How about saying something funny and that's maybe pertinent to where you are that shows you're on the same planet as the audience, but you're the funny guy. | ||
| That's why you're walking Just a suggestion. | ||
| Well, Boston has a very low tolerance for fucking meandering on stage. | ||
| Yeah, you didn't have a grace period as soon as you came out. | ||
| I think this is the best place to develop because of that, because you had to come out guns blazing. | ||
| You would learn everything else afterwards, but you had to get them. | ||
| And if you lost them, very few people would start bombing in Boston and recover. | ||
|
unidentified
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There was very little recovery. | |
| If you got lit on fire in the moments of your... | ||
| I mean, I would do it for fun sometimes. | ||
| Just to see, like, let's see what pit we can get out of today. | ||
| There'd be a cut man in the corner. | ||
| I think I did that subconsciously, but it was just shitty planning. | ||
| That's what it turned out to be. | ||
| Yeah, I wasn't like, that was going poorly, and then he really pulled it up. | ||
| It never happens. | ||
| Not in Boston. | ||
| Man, am I enjoying this interview after, you know, two straight weeks of, like, can we get up and talk about yourself all day? | ||
| Well, also, we were talking, it's, you know, the nature of the movie. | ||
| It's... | ||
| Oh, I've done it. | ||
| I've led us into it. | ||
| It's all about... | ||
| You fucking moron! | ||
| Don't worry about it. | ||
| We'll be fine. | ||
| Chipmunk and beers. | ||
| I can give you an example, so... | ||
| You know, the movie... | ||
| It's called Call Me Lucky. | ||
| Call Me Lucky. | ||
| I watch it a lot. | ||
| Oh! | ||
| Uh-oh. | ||
| Get him some paper towels, Jim. | ||
| I'm sorry. | ||
| No worries. | ||
|
unidentified
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There you go. | |
| Sorry. | ||
| So, yeah. | ||
| A little reminder of my visit, Joe. | ||
| Well, it's fresh beer. | ||
| It's what happens. | ||
| So, yeah. | ||
| So, Call Me Lucky. | ||
| He really doesn't want to talk about it. | ||
| We don't have to. | ||
| But we can, and we can get to it eventually. | ||
| I can tell you examples of what went horribly wrong. | ||
| You know what I mean? | ||
| It's like, we're doing those satellite things, and it's like, you're talking to Tate and Teabag in El Paso. | ||
|
unidentified
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Tate and Teabag again? | |
| And so, he's like... | ||
| You know, the movie deals with Barry talking and dealing with and... | ||
| Surviving. | ||
| Childhood rapes. | ||
| Childhood rapes, you know, when he was four. | ||
| And you could tell these guys are like, well, we talk about rape, but, you know, we're never serious. | ||
| You know, it's really creepy. | ||
| Fucking idiots. | ||
| It was the worst. | ||
| Some people are just not, they just, whatever, they can't... | ||
| They're just not capable. | ||
| In the morning. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, they just can't navigate anything that's complicated or serious or nuanced or really sensitive emotionally. | ||
| Some people just don't have the capacity. | ||
| They shouldn't. | ||
| You know, Ryan Seacrest. | ||
| If you're doing a fucking interview with Ryan Seacrest, it's great if you want to tell them what color you like. | ||
| What's your favorite color? | ||
| Line three. | ||
|
unidentified
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I like red, but sometimes blue. | |
| He's perfect for that. | ||
| I'm just kind of in awe of someone like him with an empire. | ||
| But I don't know what he does. | ||
| I'm not even being negative. | ||
|
unidentified
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He found a hum. | |
| He found a hum that secretaries tune into. | ||
| It's like a whistle that dogs can hear. | ||
|
unidentified
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And he hit that hum. | |
| It's like a drone. | ||
| It never goes too high and it never goes too low. | ||
| He never says, fuck this world! | ||
| What are we doing with that? | ||
| Never. | ||
| There's none of that. | ||
| Yeah, he's not threatening the old ladies and little girls. | ||
| I listen to his radio show in awe. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| His radio show's amazing. | ||
| Really? | ||
| For all the wrong reasons. | ||
| I mean, he's not a bad guy, by the way. | ||
| I've met him, I did his old show. | ||
| He has to be. | ||
|
unidentified
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If I used to say that, there'd be a comic. | |
| People would be like, ah, he's a nice guy. | ||
| And he'd be like, yeah, he has to be. | ||
| I'm funny. | ||
| I can afford to be an asshole. | ||
| But he's got that market covered. | ||
| That bland white guy always wears a suit market cornered. | ||
| He just knows how to nail it. | ||
| It doesn't bother me. | ||
| Because I did God Bless America. | ||
| People think I hate the American Idol and all that stuff. | ||
| I never really cared about it. | ||
| God Bless America. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Your movie was fucking awesome. | ||
| Oh, thanks, thanks. | ||
| And ruthless, and just ridiculous. | ||
| I watched it on a plane, and there's one point in time, I had to fucking, like, do this with my earphones, and go, fucking Jesus. | ||
| And then go right back in. | ||
|
unidentified
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Like, literally, wait till this one hits the planes. | |
| Yeah, well, I saw it. | ||
| I saw it last night. | ||
| I like you, like, someone leaning over, and there's a baby getting shot with a shotgun. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| It's a crazy fucking movie. | ||
| But you had a point, and you went for it. | ||
| I like to say it's a violent movie about kindness. | ||
| It really is. | ||
| I mean, that's all that Joel's character wants, is people to act right. | ||
| Right, yeah. | ||
| And it's not... | ||
| I don't even agree with... | ||
| I agree with about 90% of the things that he's mad about, but, you know, because that clearly wouldn't work, it's not a good plan. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| When I came up in Boston, what I was going to say, when I was talking about you getting on stage with the beer bottles, you had this thing that you represented when you would go on stage. | ||
| This is a guy who stood for something. | ||
| And a lot of people didn't. | ||
| And I didn't. | ||
| We were all just kids. | ||
| You're finding your way on the stage first. | ||
| I was one of those kids at first, too. | ||
| I'm sure. | ||
| No need to qualify it, but there was a very distinctive... | ||
| Feeling a very distinct feeling when you got on stage like this is this is a serious person This is a guy who is a stand-up comedian a very funny person But this guy stands for shit the way it's this is this is this is what's right And this is what's wrong and when shit's wrong you pointed out and then you know I followed your career Through the time you did that the it was a cassette at the time I think with Randy Credico and who else was on it with you? | ||
| Which one? | ||
| You guys did a whole political series. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Oh, Coretico Tingle went. | ||
| Tingle, right. | ||
| Was it just you three? | ||
| No, there were several other people. | ||
| Bev Mickens, and I'm blanking only because I, you know. | ||
| Yeah, you've done so much. | ||
| I'm like, Barry, where are you? | ||
| I'm going to Nicaragua. | ||
| It's too common. | ||
| I'm like, who books that? | ||
|
unidentified
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Boston comedy Is that a Barry Katz gig? | |
| No, it's not a Katz gig It was a Sandinista gig, actually Billy Downs involved in that at all? | ||
| No, we got paid I always loved Billy But, you know, to me And I think, you know, it was It was reflective of the way Guys were speaking about you in the documentary That's, you were an important part Of that comedy community Because you were, you know I think comedy communities are only as strong as the strongest link. | ||
| You could say they're only as weak as the weakest link, but not really in comedy because there's always going to be open micers. | ||
| Essentially, there's a weird thing like you're not a comic until you're getting paid, but they're all comics. | ||
| We all were open micers and aspiring, whatever distinction you want to put in the beginning of it. | ||
| But the strongest member of the community is really where the community lies. | ||
| And that's where the standards are set. | ||
| And so you were a very, very important guy to me when I was coming up. | ||
| Joe, that means a lot. | ||
| It means a lot to me. | ||
| I wasn't... | ||
| I mean, those thoughts didn't really crystallize. | ||
| I was just trying to do what was right and I was trying to do what I wanted to be in the situation that, you know, I wanted to provide the situation that I wanted to be in myself. | ||
| And I was immediately rewarded for that with who came in and the blossoming of all that talent. | ||
| It worked. | ||
| It was great. | ||
| And we had a really nice run. | ||
| Sometimes, like, I don't want to... | ||
| You know, we've done enough Ding Ho reunions. | ||
| It's like going to your Little League reunion. | ||
| Well, we're a really good team, but we didn't even win the fucking championship, you know? | ||
| But it's great seeing all those people now and then and whatever. | ||
| But we really... | ||
| You know, we really did it together. | ||
| It was just a matter of just providing this sort of one opportunity. | ||
| And then, I did the same thing I wanted everybody else to do. | ||
| I developed at what I was good at. | ||
| What I was good at was talking about what was going on. | ||
| What was your first time meeting him? | ||
| Were you nervous? | ||
| I'd never met him. | ||
| Did you see him or did you hear about him? | ||
|
unidentified
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I see him. | |
| I got the fuck out of the way. | ||
|
unidentified
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I didn't want him to see my ass. | |
| I never met you. | ||
| Maybe, hi, what's up? | ||
| Joe, I knew you, and I knew what you were doing, and I liked you. | ||
| Thank you very much. | ||
| It never ended. | ||
| I'm on your show, and I know I get to tell the truth here. | ||
| I knew what you were doing, and I saw the spark there, and then I heard what else you were doing. | ||
| Oh. | ||
| Now Joe's found... | ||
| And you know exactly what I'm talking about because you fucking do it, brother. | ||
| You do it. | ||
| You found what you're supposed to be talking about. | ||
| You found what you're supposed to be illuminating people about. | ||
| And then you found a way to become tremendous at it. | ||
| And I couldn't be happier that I played a little role in helping to create stage time in a scene somewhere where somebody like you came out of. | ||
| So thanks, man. | ||
| You did me right. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| You definitely did. | ||
| But that fear you were talking about never went away. | ||
| I'd have an HBO special, and the phone would be ringing, and I'd go, that's fucking Grimmins. | ||
| You would, but you would actually say, you would go, hey, you made a really good point here. | ||
| Why the fuck are you picking on Bruce Willis? | ||
| He's just an actor. | ||
| And we'd just go down the line, and I'd go, okay. | ||
| It'd be back and forth. | ||
| Well, I felt that last night when you came up to me after my set. | ||
| I was like, thank God I didn't know he was in the room when I was up there. | ||
| Oh, Jesus Christ. | ||
| Right when I got off stage, I was like... | ||
| I dodged that bullet. | ||
| Every movie I make, too, I'm like, oh, I hope he likes it. | ||
| Oh, man. | ||
| I really like the new one. | ||
| Now, when did you know... | ||
| When did you find out about his... | ||
| By the way, did you see... | ||
| We're doing this live on the air. | ||
| Did you see the New Yorker piece today? | ||
| Holy fucking shit, is it a Valentine? | ||
| The New Yorker, and not a tiny piece. | ||
| I'm thinking if you get a little blurb in the New Yorker, you're doing it. | ||
| Anyway, so... | ||
| I'm in a pretty good mood. | ||
| I just wish I had my kettle drum with me so I could play it. | ||
| New Yorker! | ||
| He wants a kettle drum. | ||
| That's nice. | ||
| Like Henny Youngman. | ||
| Oh, okay. | ||
| Good evening. | ||
| I was thinking like those Jamaican guys, but that's like a drum. | ||
| That would be a nice surprise for me. | ||
| Someone could surprise me with the... | ||
|
unidentified
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It's not going to happen. | |
| Maybe. | ||
| Maybe. | ||
| We never know. | ||
| Depending on if we do well in a word season. | ||
| So you were saying, when did you find out about the traumatic history? | ||
| When did you find out about the childhood rape, which was a major part of it? | ||
| You didn't reveal it until about an hour into the film. | ||
| The idea isn't like a spoiler alert thing or anything. | ||
| I wanted people to... | ||
| No one will be allowed out of the theater at the 30-minute point. | ||
| Yeah, you know, because tonally I give clues that something's coming. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And, you know, he talks about some things. | ||
| So you can tell, and other people do. | ||
| But I, you know, I get a little weird if people think that I was trying to manipulate him. | ||
| I wanted people to meet him, know who he was, so they could empathize with him. | ||
| I wouldn't say manipulate. | ||
| I would say you set it up beautifully. | ||
|
unidentified
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Oh, thanks. | |
| It was great. | ||
| It was very compelling, captivating. | ||
| But, you know, knowing Barry and knowing about the story because of you telling me about it, I had no idea. | ||
| No one had any idea. | ||
| Well, he told me before he went to the Judiciary Senate hearing. | ||
| Well, I told you before I went public at all. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And, yeah, before you did it, talked about it on stage. | ||
| But he said that he found My reaction was, what was it like? | ||
| He was like, alright, because I said, you know, like, oh, there's a reason you're such a dick. | ||
| I was like, I've been betting on this all along, because he's going, like, everyone's going, like, Crimin is an alcoholic, and he could tell I would just use it as coolant, you know, it wasn't like I could turn up missing for days, it was just like, you know. | ||
| I really did, though. | ||
| I was running hot, man. | ||
| I was running real hot. | ||
| I was always going, no, man, he doesn't have the werewolf. | ||
| His personality doesn't change. | ||
| He stops for long periods. | ||
| Twain said, when the others drink, I like to help. | ||
| So there was this anger and pain in my friend that I knew for all these years, and when he told me, it wasn't like, I just was like, oh. | ||
| It was an awful relief, I would say, would be your response. | ||
| Yeah, I was like, oh. | ||
| Inside, I'm like, and then I went into panic mode. | ||
| I go, well, what do I do now? | ||
| And then I thought, oh, maybe I won't talk. | ||
| And let him talk. | ||
| And that's a point that comes out in the film, and People, I would be telling friends about it, and they would be saying to me, well, have you talked to anyone about this? | ||
| Yeah, I fucking thought I was talking to you, man. | ||
| You know, I guess not. | ||
| Oh, I gotta go pay somebody $200 to be put on pharmaceutical dry ice until I stop talking about it. | ||
| That's your plan, right? | ||
| Well, listen, shithead, I'm gonna keep talking about it. | ||
| Not to you. | ||
| Goodbye. | ||
| You know, thank you for helping me edit my friends list. | ||
| This guy listened. | ||
| You've been living in upstate New York for how long now? | ||
| About the last 10 to... | ||
| No, for this millennium. | ||
| What made you decide to go up there? | ||
| You know what? | ||
| It's the internet. | ||
| I can do what I want. | ||
| And if I have to go work up here somewhere, I've got to go to an airport. | ||
| So I go to Rochester or Ithaca or Elmira or wherever. | ||
| But I get to sit there. | ||
| It's so peaceful. | ||
| So I hope you come visit me, Joe. | ||
| I would love to. | ||
| Because it's really fucking tremendous. | ||
| How far away is it from New York City? | ||
| About four and a half, five hours. | ||
| So that's how you do it? | ||
| You fly in New York? | ||
| I fly or I drive. | ||
| I don't mind driving there sometimes because it's sort of You kind of get in game mode and you get out of game mode on the way back. | ||
| So I like that. | ||
| But my house is like, I finally have the ideal place to do some acid. | ||
| Ah, I see. | ||
| Ah, yeah. | ||
| If the parents come home, they're me. | ||
| It's hard to get good acid, I hear. | ||
| It's fucking terrible. | ||
| It's awful. | ||
| Goddamn government. | ||
| I mean, you know, for Christ's sake, well, I think they figured out too many people got smart after that sort of came through. | ||
| Oh, they certainly did. | ||
| I mean, the 1970s, the sweeping act, when they made all the psychedelics illegal, they made stuff that wasn't even psychoactive illegal. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| They just tried to make everything illegal. | ||
| They just didn't want anybody experimenting with anything that's going to make another Timothy Leary. | ||
| My friend Tim Walco said about cocaine is how I feel, too. | ||
| It's like... | ||
| You know, I don't like to do, I don't like to stay up, I don't do coke, I don't like to stay up late and complain about my Little League coach. | ||
| So, I was never a coke guy, and you know, in Boston it was bad. | ||
| I wasn't a coke guy, but I used to say to people, if you want to get high, I'll get some acid. | ||
| You know, and see if we're looking for the dealer at midnight, you know, because I'll reach into my little drug pocket in my jeans and pull out another ten hits if we need them, you know, but we don't, and you won't. | ||
| The cops wouldn't even know what it was. | ||
| But you'll actually get fucking high, you know, and that's the thing. | ||
| You're not going to like... | ||
| My only acid experience as well was when I was a total mess and I was drinking and taking other drugs at the same time. | ||
| Right. | ||
| So then you wake up. | ||
| Well, I didn't wake up. | ||
| I just beat the alcohol and coke war off in jail, in the Watertown Jail. | ||
| Oh, man. | ||
| And I'm still high. | ||
| Watertown Mass? | ||
| Yeah, still tripping balls. | ||
| And I remember, I remember like this, I thought it was the wall or I don't know. | ||
| I just saw this thing going, going, he! | ||
| The three stooges were in the next cell. | ||
| Well, that's what it was. | ||
| Like, I figured it out later on. | ||
| It was some dude was snoring, but I was convinced it was... | ||
|
unidentified
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Because you were tripping? | |
| It could have went on five minutes or an hour. | ||
| I'm not sure. | ||
| But I remember looking at this thing on the wall going... | ||
| Well, psychedelic drugs can definitely make you interpret sounds in a strange way. | ||
|
unidentified
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Yeah. | |
| That's why those South American shamans have those songs that they sing while you take ayahuasca. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| The whole idea behind it. | ||
| I've never taken ayahuasca, but I've done DMT, which is the same thing. | ||
| It's the active ingredient. | ||
| And when you do it with those songs, like you see the songs dance. | ||
| Wow. | ||
| It's very, very bizarre. | ||
| It's insane. | ||
| Have you done that with the songs? | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| They're called Icaros, the South American Icaros. | ||
| I've only done it one experience. | ||
| We tripped several times during the night because it's only like a 15 minute experience. | ||
| So we tripped like four or five times during the night to these songs, but they're incredible. | ||
| And these songs, you know, they're recorded live. | ||
| As a guy who's been sober for 34 years, I'm listening to this like it's a vacation you took. | ||
| I'm never gonna go to Bora Bora. | ||
| Goldthwait said to me last year, I've been sober for 33 years. | ||
| I think I'm ready to start dating. | ||
| I think he was wrong. | ||
| This is the songs. | ||
| This is all recorded in the jungle while these people are just deep in the trance of the mother. | ||
| And this guy will sing. | ||
| This is just him starting it off and whistling. | ||
| There's a bunch of them. | ||
| But they're beautiful. | ||
| I listen to them sometimes when I'm driving in my car and I can almost trip. | ||
| Because I remember this experience of being on them. | ||
| Can I get copies of that? | ||
| Yeah, I'll get you a copy of it for sure. | ||
| Is that on iTunes? | ||
| I don't think it is. | ||
| I bet it's not. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh man, that's great! | |
| I love that guy. | ||
| You should see it when these geometric patterns are dancing to that sound spinning around you in infinity. | ||
| It's very, very bizarre. | ||
| LSD was my other drug of choice. | ||
| Friends were my drug of choice, but LSD, back in the day, Let's do some more. | ||
| I almost have something figured out. | ||
| Let's go in there one more time. | ||
| And you know what? | ||
| I never tell this story, but I'm thrilled to tell it to you. | ||
| I was the rat-a-dare of LSD. You know who rat-a-dare was? | ||
| He was the guy who jumped, who parachuted in to put out oil derrick fires. | ||
| I didn't know who that was. | ||
| Have you heard that expression? | ||
| Not Adair. | ||
| He parachuted in to put out oil fires? | ||
| Yeah, and he would lead a team and they would go in and they would put out, yeah, look it up, Red Adair, I'm sure you can find it. | ||
| Oil fires? | ||
| Yeah, like an oil well would blow up and you'd go in and it's like, oh the fuck, is it going to go in here and deal with it? | ||
| When someone would be bumming out on acid, I would get the call, they're bumming out. | ||
| And in those days, in the early 70s, If they bum out, then they could end up going to the doctor, a hospital, or whatever, and then suddenly they're blathering, they'll turn in everybody, and nobody's doing anything. | ||
| We just all got some acid. | ||
| One person got the acid, but they weren't a drug dealer. | ||
| They were just the obtainer of the acid, you know, but that's who gave it to me, and that person could end up in fucking Attica or something. | ||
| So... | ||
| I would get these calls from people like they're freaking out, and I got this reputation for being good at helping people who are freaking out doing acid, and I would go in and go like, okay, what'd they do? | ||
| They did these. | ||
| How many did they do? | ||
| They split one. | ||
| Give me two. | ||
| I've got to get in there quick. | ||
| And I would get in there, and then I would, like, have them laughing in a while, and, like, I would do stuff like, get me a Temple Orange, just get me one, you know? | ||
| I'd, like, eat this, wow, isn't it? | ||
| See? | ||
| It's okay. | ||
| You're on a planet that these things grow from trees. | ||
| It's an amazing place. | ||
| Put on an album. | ||
| What do you like? | ||
| Come on. | ||
| There's an old Joni Mitchell. | ||
| See those things? | ||
| I know what's freaking you out. | ||
| Those hieroglyphics you think are almost words, but you can't quite read them, and now you're getting frustrated. | ||
| No, it's just a cool thing. | ||
| It's like looking at a beautiful Egyptian crypt carving thing or something. | ||
| Obviously you can't read Egyptian, but you kind of get the point they were making. | ||
| Don't worry about it. | ||
| It'll be an hour later, we're all laughing, and the next morning we're at breakfast, and it's cool. | ||
| But that's when I was the Red Adair of LSD. Is freaking out on acid like freaking out on mushrooms where you're just trying to control it and you get scared of the experience where it's taking you and you try to resist? | ||
| I think it's probably maybe a little worse. | ||
| And plus, I mean, you know, there's shitty acid out there sometimes. | ||
| Although then it wasn't that shitty. | ||
| It's hard to make, right? | ||
| You've got to get a bunch of stuff and they monitor that stuff. | ||
| It's very difficult. | ||
| It was, you know, to me, it was my favorite. | ||
| I... You know, if I can ever get a hold of it, I'll do it. | ||
| But Bob calls me in the movie a lifelong LSD enthusiast, like I'm doing it all the time. | ||
| It's blowing great credibility to Mike. | ||
| In this age of drug McCarthyism, how many people they've ruined just by the hand. | ||
| I'm sorry I made you look bad. | ||
| Oh, you fucking... | ||
| Sorry. | ||
| There wasn't a lot of guys doing it in Boston. | ||
| You were one of the primary acid enthusiasts. | ||
| By then it was hard to find, but I would do it once in a while. | ||
| From the 60s it was a big deal. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I was at the University of Miami. | |
| We literally had an oil drum full of yellow sunshine. | ||
| Oh my god. | ||
| Yeah, it was unbelievable. | ||
| How much is that? | ||
| An oil drum? | ||
| But you only need a drop, right? | ||
| Yeah, there was a lot of them. | ||
| I mean, we just kind of, someone was in some sort of trouble and they needed somewhere to put it and then they disappeared and we just sort of inherited it and it was like, you know, I don't know. | ||
| And then everybody just left with like baggies. | ||
| They weren't even baggies then, but just like fill up your pockets with ass and go... | ||
| Is it break down? | ||
| Does it only last for a certain amount of time? | ||
| Well, I had enough. | ||
| I had plenty of friends. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Jesus Christ! | |
| There's things like Grateful Dead concerts where they needed a lot of help, so it was alright. | ||
| So, ten years ago you decided, fuck it, I'm going back to where I grew up? | ||
| Is that what the deal was? | ||
| Basically, I mean, you know, 15 years ago now. | ||
| But, yeah, I mean, I love the country. | ||
| You know, I mean, it really... | ||
| Soothes me. | ||
| And I finally just sort of noticed, cut myself a break, you know, I've taken enough of a, you know, I've been through enough shit, and it just soothes me to be there with, you know, with a dog, and I just love the terrain, and it's so verdant there. | ||
| I mean, I love it out here. | ||
| It's so great to come here, especially to see my friends like you two doing so great and having succeeded. | ||
| It's a completely different It's a good thing to come to LA now than it was when I first came to LA and we were all trying to get our foot in the door. | ||
| But it's really nice. | ||
| It's serene. | ||
| And it's a really nice place to sort of rake myself into a pile and my thoughts into a pile and then distribute them and reflect. | ||
| And come, I want to have something to say, but be perfectly fine for being missing for a week or two at a time. | ||
| Well, there's not forced input up there. | ||
| No. | ||
| That's the beautiful thing about being anywhere where there's very few people. | ||
| There's just less input. | ||
| When people come to my house, like a car will drive by when they first get there. | ||
| Six hours later, another car will drive by and they go, I don't know where all this fucking traffic's coming from today. | ||
| I'm just really sorry, man. | ||
| Well, it's actually two dirt roads to get to his house. | ||
| Must be fun when it snows. | ||
| And if you go past, there's a young gal with a giant sow on a chain. | ||
| Do you know what I'm talking about? | ||
| She's got a chain. | ||
| There's a woman walking her pig. | ||
| It probably weighed like 500 pounds. | ||
| Do you know what I'm talking about? | ||
| Yeah, that pig was killed in a horrible accident. | ||
| Car accident? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, the car was basically total. | |
| Jesus Christ. | ||
| We have a joke about how Barry can ruin anything. | ||
| I saw a pig. | ||
| It's dead. | ||
| Moving on. | ||
| So when 2000 rolled around, I guess, you decided to just, once the internet started kicking in, you made a conscious choice to try to go somewhere that's a little bit more peaceful? | ||
| Yeah, absolutely. | ||
| And I heard you talk a little bit about, but have you thought about doing a podcast? | ||
| I mean, you know, it just seems as if anybody was right for it. | ||
| Me and Kaz and I are going to, Paul Kozlowski and I are going to do it, and it's going to be called Over to the Podcast, which is the upstate, the defeated tone. | ||
| Does Paul live up there, too? | ||
| Yeah, he just moved back. | ||
| He just come back. | ||
| Really? | ||
| Jesus Christ. | ||
| Yeah, I'll speak to you in an upstate home for like 193 inches of snow last year. | ||
| I just sat in my house and worked on my alcoholism until I could get that door open again. | ||
|
unidentified
|
That's where I... What is Paul doing these days? | |
| A lot of art. | ||
| People buy his art, and then we're trying to get the podcast going, but he's been pretty busy because he's been swamped with art orders, and I've been pretty busy. | ||
| After he hit that pig. | ||
|
unidentified
|
That's right. | |
| It was a performance piece. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It was a performance piece. | |
| Well, yeah, man, you could easily do a podcast up there, and if you ever do, please do let me know, and I'd be happy to promote it, and I would listen to it every week. | ||
| Thank you, man. | ||
| I listen to you all the time, and you just... | ||
| Really, again, to have even helped rake the dirt that you grew out of is terrific. | ||
| Thank you very much. | ||
| That's an honor. | ||
| You certainly did. | ||
| Like I said, you were the strongest part of that. | ||
| You and I have had some little Twitter conversations back and forth over the years about the community and what it's like now. | ||
| Because Boston is... | ||
| It's making a little bit of a resurgence. | ||
| I keep hearing that. | ||
| And Rick Jenkins is trying to do something in that Chinese restaurant. | ||
| It's kind of ironic that it all started out at the Ding Ho. | ||
| That it goes back. | ||
| It's definitely, there's some sort of connection between comedy and MSG. It's just, you can't deny it. | ||
| But back in those days, the MSG would make you pay the comics. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Ooh. | |
| I don't get it. | ||
| Well, we paid it to Ding Ho. | ||
| Oh, I get it. | ||
| Oh, Rick doesn't pay people? | ||
| No, I don't think he makes enough money, too. | ||
| I understand that. | ||
| Well, they don't advertise, right? | ||
| Isn't that part of his fun thing? | ||
| It doesn't let people know there's a show going on. | ||
| It's like a poker game. | ||
| Let them figure it out. | ||
| Yeah, if you're invited, it's okay. | ||
| But no, he's done a great job. | ||
| He's been there longer than any. | ||
| He's probably the longest-running comedy club in Boston history. | ||
| We shot some of the movie there. | ||
| Yeah, I saw. | ||
| The stuff with Barry now. | ||
| Because, you know, I didn't want to do that. | ||
| I didn't want to do that thing in documentaries where they have the triumphant return, because that's always... | ||
| It feels very cooked. | ||
| But I just wanted to show that Barry was alive and still relevant, and that's why. | ||
| And it ended up being great. | ||
| It was Bradley Stonese for the DP who suggested it. | ||
| And it ended up really good because Barry ended up narrating a good portion of the movie from the stage, you know? | ||
| Like when he says, you know, we went back, we went to that basement where... | ||
| Where I was raped as a kid, you know, that was not something that was cooked. | ||
| It was something that I was going to film the space where these things happened because I thought that would be powerful and I didn't want to do reenactments. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah, neither did I. You know, what the fuck? | |
| Jesus Christ. | ||
| I would have been testifying in front of another committee. | ||
| What the fuck? | ||
| Oh, my God. | ||
| Jesus. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Goddamn. | |
| Fuck. | ||
| So when we got there, Barry and I, well, before we got there, we had a big argument. | ||
| He says, look, I'm going down there. | ||
| Because I just kind of wanted him to put it in perspective, but I didn't want him to go down in the basement. | ||
| Because I also was afraid, you know, I was worried for my friend. | ||
| I've seen him go into shock. | ||
| I've seen it. | ||
| I saw it coming on when we were even there. | ||
| Oh, it came on. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, but even before you got out of the car, you know, before you got out of the car. | ||
| But I know how to operate in a state of shock. | ||
| That's how I did the child pornography investigation, and that's how... | ||
| You know, they make their own worst enemies. | ||
| The child pornography investigation was a huge part of that movie. | ||
| And the fact that you... | ||
| I mean, I think if it was going on today, I think AOL would have gotten a lot more fucking trouble. | ||
| Yeah, I think it would have been a much, much bigger story. | ||
| But it was also... | ||
| Let's explain what happens. | ||
| So Barry discloses that he was raped as a kid on stage during a benefit for children, basically. | ||
| It was for the Southern Poverty Law Center, but I was speaking up about what happened in Los Angeles, and everyone was knocking. | ||
| It was after Rodney King, and everyone was knocking these kids. | ||
| I'm trying to get rid of this show. | ||
| I'm not looking at it. | ||
| And so at that point I just sort of put my whole life together and I just wanted to say, you know, kids come from somewhere, man. | ||
| These kids, they come from somewhere. | ||
| These guys come from a place where right up the street from their squalid condition are some of the richest people in the fucking world. | ||
| And they see it and they don't know what to do and guess what? | ||
| Oh gee, they want some stuff? | ||
| What a surprise! | ||
| So I was speaking up for them, and it was this long rap, and then at the end of it, I said, everybody comes from somewhere. | ||
| I came from somewhere, and then I told my story. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And I talked about a disclosure. | ||
| But he had planned on that that's how the set was going to go, because Sweeney wanted to close, and Barry's like, I don't think you should close. | ||
| He insisted on it. | ||
| I went, well, all right. | ||
| So Barry talks, you have any con? | ||
|
unidentified
|
No. | |
| I've never said follow that to anybody, but in so many words, I did that night. | ||
| So while he was looking for it... | ||
|
unidentified
|
What's that? | |
| You want more, Barry Crimmins? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Let's go, let's go. | |
| That's a jackhammer and an ambulance. | ||
| It's Mass Avenue. | ||
| So when Barry was looking for other survivors, he became aware that AOL was allowing pedophiles to exchange... | ||
| Child pornography openly in their chat rooms. | ||
| Not just exchange it, but back then, the more you used, the more you paid. | ||
| So they were profiting. | ||
| It wasn't like today, you can get online all day long. | ||
| Thank you for making that point. | ||
| So it was a big deal. | ||
| So it was a lot of money. | ||
| Millions. | ||
| Millions. | ||
| So they're playing it dumb with me because one nut is bothering them and they just, well, thank you for your being a good citizen of the AOL community, but we have to balance in, as Bob noticed, our corporate growth along with First Amendment rights. | ||
| Are you fucking kidding me? | ||
| These people are exchanging pictures of children being raped. | ||
| There's no First Amendment right. | ||
| I don't give a fuck about your corporate growth. | ||
| Fuck you. | ||
| Keep it up. | ||
| And then right before they asked me to testify, or when I was already invited to testify two days before, AOL contacts me and says, you know, would you like to get together and meet? | ||
| They were going to come up with the bribe. | ||
| And I went, you know what? | ||
| I'm going to see you Tuesday at the hearing or whatever day it was. | ||
| So what do you think? | ||
| I would have loved to meet with them or hear you meet with them just to see what their plan was. | ||
| I wanted to talk to that guy now, but he wouldn't be in the movie, the attorney for AOL. What's he up to now? | ||
| What's he up to now? | ||
| Sucking Satan's dick somewhere? | ||
| He's busy. | ||
| Okay, listen. | ||
| He's not an attorney anymore. | ||
| Well, maybe stop sucking Satan's dick. | ||
| He's running Paramount. | ||
| No, no. | ||
|
unidentified
|
So you guys keep talking about this. | |
| I'm going in the man's room. | ||
| So Barry, after Barry testified, he wrote an article in the Boston Phoenix that I thought, and this was in 95, and I thought it read like a Frank Capra movie. | ||
| I'll film more of the holes of the story. | ||
| Who's Frank Capra? | ||
| Frank Capra, It's a Wonderful Life, Mr. Deeds, all those kind of... | ||
| So Barry... | ||
| Basically, he didn't even pose his kids. | ||
| He just signed on his kids. | ||
| And that's all it took. | ||
| And he got all this evidence against these guys. | ||
| And he basically embarrassed AOL on the floor of the Senate. | ||
| But he pretended to be a child to get to lure these child guys. | ||
| Yeah, but it wasn't even that much. | ||
| It wasn't that much. | ||
| You know, it wasn't really that much of a bait. | ||
| It was pretty easy. | ||
| We're two kids and we're on and our parents don't because he played as if he was a girl and a boy. | ||
| And it just came pouring in. | ||
| It wasn't like he was entrapping these guys. | ||
| They were just pouring in. | ||
| And he spent almost a year downloading all these things. | ||
| He lost 100 pounds. | ||
| Yeah, it's not in the movie, but he had given the evidence over to the feds, and the reason it's not in the movie is that there was arrests that were made directly because of the stuff that Barry had handed over, but the feds weren't interested in being in the movie, I think, because Barry kind of did their job for them. | ||
| So, where is he? | ||
| So, he begged me to make the movie. | ||
| No, so... | ||
| So I thought, this reads like a Frank Capra movie, and I asked Barry to write a screenplay, but this was right when you just said he had lost 100 pounds, and I was like going, Barry, this article you wrote for The Phoenix is tremendous. | ||
| I think it's a picture, you know, and... | ||
| We can make money! | ||
| And by the way, you have no idea how to write a screenplay. | ||
| So Barry, what was your motivation, like when you knew that they were trading pornography? | ||
| Child pornography. | ||
| Child pornography, excuse me. | ||
| I don't care about it. | ||
| And you decided the way to catch them or the way to gather evidence on them was to pose as a child. | ||
| Well, no, what I did, I needed a reason to be in the room, okay? | ||
| If I was in the room as an adult, they would... | ||
| Be suspicious. | ||
| If I wasn't sending child pornography back to them. | ||
| So I needed to be a child. | ||
| Right. | ||
| So then they're going like, look at the fun you could have. | ||
| That's what they're literally doing and approaching me with. | ||
| You know, Doug Stano wrote a whole book about it. | ||
| About baiting. | ||
| He used to do it all the time. | ||
| Like back in the old days, he used to call it baiting. | ||
| And he used to publish it on his website. | ||
| Baiting child porn people. | ||
| Baiting pedophiles. | ||
| I gotta meet Doug. | ||
| I've never met him. | ||
| He's the best. | ||
| I'd love the fuck out of that dude. | ||
| Fuck you. | ||
| Yeah, I'll fly him in. | ||
| You tell me where you're going to be. | ||
| Let's do it. | ||
| Okay, great, great. | ||
| It's a crazy thing that when you were doing this, it's sort of analogous to how people got away with pedophilia and how they got away with child molesting back in the day, because it was something that was almost, it was just pushed aside. | ||
|
unidentified
|
The word taboo. | |
| Who works in the favor of the perpetrator. | ||
| That's why we have to break silence. | ||
| That's why we have to be kind of specific about different terms. | ||
| Like people say to me, wow, you admitted you were raped. | ||
| I didn't fucking admit anything. | ||
| I was raped. | ||
| Guilty people rape. | ||
| I didn't admit anything. | ||
| It's like, you admitted they robbed your home. | ||
| You admitted you were held up at gunpoint. | ||
| Well, I disclosed. | ||
| I chose to disclose. | ||
| Not everyone Sort of has the wherewithal to do that, or the makeup to do that, but fortunately I did. | ||
| So I disclosed, but I didn't admit anything. | ||
| And they tell you, the deep dark secret. | ||
| No, I dealt with it when I could, and I talked about it when I could, in a fashion that I tried to make as accessible as possible to other people. | ||
| So people would know, like, look at this guy. | ||
| This guy's sensible. | ||
| This guy's got something to say. | ||
| This guy seems to be lucid. | ||
| And now he's saying this. | ||
| But it took a toll on him. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| And so it was a hard time for me because, you know, here was Barry and I saw how ill he got and I was making Police Academy 4. It was really taken away from my time on the set. | ||
| So you lost 100 pounds while you were doing this? | ||
| Well, I also became a vegetarian and stuff then. | ||
| So there's a variety. | ||
| People draw whatever conclusions. | ||
| And there's some stuff in the movie. | ||
| I mean, I just hook people up to begin the movie. | ||
| And then I didn't say, hey, remember to say this. | ||
| I just backed off. | ||
| And I didn't loom while Bob was making the movie. | ||
| I thought it was enough of a task. | ||
| So I tried. | ||
| The one thing I could do is I just kept saying to people, it's Bob's. | ||
| It's about my life. | ||
| It's Bob's movie. | ||
| And Bob's movie about my life is something I'm very... | ||
| I'll put my money on the right, you know, the right spot on the table. | ||
| And I knew that coming in. | ||
| I knew he would do me right. | ||
| But there's parts in the movie that my daughter has a problem with because the one is the basement because it looks like I asked him to or kind of manipulated him. | ||
| And we had a fight about that. | ||
| Yeah, it went the other way. | ||
| The fight was, I'm going down there, you go through a problem, not around it. | ||
| You can film this or not, I'm going down there. | ||
| You don't have a problem with that. | ||
| Because she didn't like me looking like a manipulative guy. | ||
| Right. | ||
| And she didn't like the scene with your sister. | ||
| Who, again, and my sister, I don't tell anybody. | ||
| I just said, Bob's making a movie about my life. | ||
| And at one point in the movie, she says, Well, you know, I knew you were going to interview me, but I didn't know there would be cameras here. | ||
| It's a fucking movie, Mary Jo Black. | ||
| But she's my sister and she literally saved my life. | ||
| I very well may have saved my life. | ||
| It was close because the degree of violence and just the physicality of things and whatever. | ||
| She's so important to the movie because people want to discredit victims of abuse and to have a witness. | ||
| And that's about as much time as we should give those people. | ||
| Yeah, but I just wanted to show them that we're ironclad. | ||
| Oh yeah, absolutely. | ||
| That's why it was key. | ||
| I mean, she did me a big solid, not just you. | ||
| So Barry went into... | ||
| Well, the original Big Salad is what I'm talking about. | ||
| You know, when she walked in, if she hadn't... | ||
| Who knows? | ||
| Maybe that day, maybe if that guy wasn't stopped, maybe I was just about to be... | ||
| It's so evil, too, because the girl that was involved as well, the babysitter that lured you in and brought the guy over, and then the girl was trying to stop your sister from getting away. | ||
| Yeah, I mean, it was her or us. | ||
| My fucking heart was pounding when I was watching that. | ||
| My hands were sweating, and your sister's crying. | ||
| It's like, whoa! | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Whoa! | ||
| It's... | ||
| And then cut to good evening. | ||
| There's a very bright young comic from upstate New York. | ||
| Well, that's like when Barry was in the basement, you know. | ||
| And to me, what he says there is very... | ||
| You know, it proves that he's not living in it, that he's bringing the message back to the tribe, you know, very Joseph Campbell kind of stuff, you know, that's the, you know, the end, it's a great fourth act. | ||
| And so he says, he says to me, he goes, I totally blacked out. | ||
| I don't know what I said. | ||
| Is any of it, thinking about the movie, which is very sweet, he goes, was any of that usable? | ||
| And I said, I don't know. | ||
| I'm playing yackety sax the whole time you're down in that basement. | ||
| He goes, yeah, you can animate it. | ||
| But, you know, people get weirded out by that. | ||
| But how else are two guys that genuinely love each other? | ||
| We had to keep making plenty of jokes as I went along through some of the... | ||
| Yeah, of course. | ||
| Jokes that only he can make and then I can get away with a little bit because I'm close to that album. | ||
| I fully licensed Bob to use my jokes. | ||
| But in any case, you know, I'm glad I went into that basement for a few reasons. | ||
| Number one was because other kids go in that basement. | ||
| I didn't want to We're good to go. | ||
| To say, any kid who's ever been in here or any kid who will ever be in here, I hope you have fun and you play with your friends and everything's okay and no one else ever gets hurt here. | ||
| Ever. | ||
| And that was really important to me. | ||
| And the other thing was I kind of, as silly as it sounds, as sort of crunchy granola as it sounds, In a way, well, I mean, I hadn't thought about that place for so long. | ||
| I wasn't going to walk up to the door and give it the kind of power that I couldn't walk in there. | ||
| I had every right to walk in there, and so I did. | ||
| And in a way, I walked in there, and I collected myself as a small child, and we all walked back up the stairs. | ||
| Beautiful thing in the movie where they talk about I'm walking up the stairs and then this county prosecutor from Cuyahoga County in Ohio says we've arrested over a thousand people for trading child pornography in Cuyahoga County and a lot of what he did is the basis of What's being done nationally about this heinous crime. | ||
| So, it's, you know, I mean, it's a fucking beautiful bow on like a ridiculous package. | ||
| And I'm, man, did we name the movie The Right Thing. | ||
| You know, I'm so fortunate. | ||
| What year was this that you were doing this with the AOL? 95. 95. So this was the beginning of the internet. | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| And like in the movie where the senators so proudly talk about how illiterate they are with computers. | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| I don't know who they're trying to appeal to there. | ||
| Is that supposed to make them folksy or something? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, it's just incredible that 20 years ago it was that easy to trade child pornography. | ||
| They were fearless about it. | ||
| And they actually would attack someone who challenged them rather than someone coming in and going like, holy shit, someone sees what we're doing, scatter. | ||
| At least that would happen now. | ||
| At least they know they're in some sort of danger. | ||
| Back then, it was like, well, this is a natural progression of things. | ||
| And plus, I'm just reading these guys. | ||
| And, you know, I will read what my enemy writes. | ||
| So, like, I studied Nambla and what they have to say. | ||
| And these fucking people, if you're not familiar with Nambla, watch the movie Powder. | ||
| It basically puts the entire philosophy of Nambla into a film that Disney paid for that was directed by a convicted child molester. | ||
| Really? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Abso-fucking-lutely. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Watch it. | |
| I didn't know that. | ||
| Oh, the boy had all the power, and he looks like Michael Jackson. | ||
| It's like so funny. | ||
| I thought Powder was about, like, a magic kid or something? | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| A magic kid has this power... | ||
| But the director directed a movie called Clown House. | ||
| It's a Nambla movie of the millennium. | ||
| Yeah, it was the movie, I think, Clown House. | ||
| And he was caught actively abusing children. | ||
| A child actor. | ||
| He was caught and went to jail for it. | ||
| And then Disney makes a fucking film with this guy. | ||
| Afterwards? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| What year was the film made? | ||
| Mid-90s. | ||
| To the internet. | ||
| This is Sean Patrick Flannery, right? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, I guess. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Wow. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| So fuck that guy. | ||
| Fuck him. | ||
| I know about him. | ||
| I know what his fucking movie's about. | ||
| It's the fucking Nambla philosophy put into a movie. | ||
| Like, this kid has power over everyone. | ||
| Everything's the kid's choice. | ||
| Fuck you. | ||
| Everything isn't the kid's choice. | ||
| You're a lying, fucking sack of shit, creep, fucking child rapist that Disney hired. | ||
| And when you look at Disney, and they let that guy direct the movie, just consider who might be behind the fucking goofy mask at their theme park. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Wow. | |
| That is crazy. | ||
| This is the guy? | ||
| That's right. | ||
| Victor Salva. | ||
| Look at that mustache. | ||
| Fucking relentless sex. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| I actually am friends with the number one goofy. | ||
| Boy, I don't know who got him in that right corner picture, but I like it. | ||
| American film director best known for directing the films Powder and Jeepers Creepers. | ||
| Jeepers Creepers? | ||
| That was that horror movie? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| That was a good movie. | ||
| Fuck. | ||
| But, um... | ||
| Attracted controversy for being a convicted sex... | ||
| Where is he now? | ||
| I don't know, but you better not be too close to me. | ||
| How is that? | ||
| He's directing the Full House reunion. | ||
| Fuller. | ||
| Really Fuller. | ||
| Fuller House. | ||
| Oh, my God. | ||
| Yeah, so there you go. | ||
| Hey, Victor, a little press for you today. | ||
| Vic. | ||
| Victor. | ||
| Vic, you fucking Nambla fucking proponent. | ||
| Fuck you, piece of shit. | ||
| Fuck Disney. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| So when he directed that movie, he was only like 37. He was only 37, convicted sex offender. | ||
| Wow. | ||
| What else did he direct? | ||
| He directed children into harm. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Look at that. | |
| Hold on. | ||
| Look at that Vice piece. | ||
| He loves convicting, loves terrorizing semi-naked youths. | ||
| What? | ||
| This is from 2012? | ||
| What is this? | ||
| Oh, my God. | ||
| Jesus, Larry and Joseph. | ||
| Oh, my God. | ||
| When people think about Padres, a sexually deviant film director, they are likely to imagine Roman plants giving sex with a 13-year-old. | ||
| But those stories are a bit tired and cliched now. | ||
| So for those of you with a thirst for horrible stories about film men abusing the power, we present mid-budget journeyman director Victor Salva. | ||
| Journeyman? | ||
| He's not a boxer. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| What does that mean? | ||
| Mid-budget journeyman? | ||
| Oh, what a weird distinction. | ||
| I know. | ||
| Just director. | ||
|
unidentified
|
In 1989, Salvo was jailed after molesting. | |
| I would prefer if you called me journeyman. | ||
| Okay, from now on I'm calling you journeyman. | ||
| Journeyman and Bobcat. | ||
| Clapton should sue these guys. | ||
| Clown house. | ||
| So he was jailed after molesting a 12-year-old star. | ||
| You know what? | ||
| And you know what? | ||
| So don't rent his movie. | ||
| Don't pay for his next defense. | ||
| And by the way, the Gary Glitter shit they play in every ballpark, that's his fucking defense one. | ||
| And I won't finish it, but hey! | ||
| You know that song? | ||
| He makes money on that every time a ball game's going on. | ||
| The plot's victims of Clown House are three prepubescent brothers led by the debutante Sam Rockwell who spent their time running hysterically around the enormous surprise. | ||
| Funny how he has three prepubescent kids in that film, too. | ||
| What the fuck? | ||
| What a piece of shit. | ||
| I can't even look at this. | ||
| How's this guy not in jail? | ||
| I thought when you go to jail for something like that, you go to jail for a long time, though. | ||
| Ah, you'd be surprised. | ||
| Well, that's... | ||
| I'm surprised right now, because this is... | ||
| Then he came out in Disney and let him make a goddamn movie that was the Nambla movie. | ||
| It's like, you know, the Nambla film festival outside of... | ||
| God knows what they would show. | ||
| So what is Namble's philosophy? | ||
| Basically, it's the kids' choice. | ||
| That's their ring. | ||
| Yeah, that's the kids' choice. | ||
| The kids make all the decisions. | ||
| You know, I used to think that Namble was something that they joked around about. | ||
| You didn't think it was a real thing? | ||
| No. | ||
| I used to hear Howard Stern talk about it. | ||
| Yeah, no, Nambla's real. | ||
| And it's not a joke. | ||
| But the thing is, it's like the Communist Party. | ||
| Nowadays, if you go to a meeting, you know, it's like 80% FBI agents, so enjoy yourself, Nambla, guys. | ||
| Remember the hilarious thing when they had a Nambla meeting at the San Francisco Library, and that film crew came in, and everybody walked out, like, crouching. | ||
| They're all, like, walking like Groucho Marx. | ||
| No, I didn't see it. | ||
| They wouldn't stand up. | ||
| You know, I bet we could find it. | ||
| Nambla San Francisco Library. | ||
| It's hilarious. | ||
| I just thought for sure if something like that happens, you go to jail for 100 years. | ||
| I mean, I don't understand how this guy could have been out at 40. Yeah. | ||
| That means at 37. So if he was convicted and then he was out at 37, he couldn't possibly have done more than, you know, 17, 19 years, right? | ||
| If he was 18. Well, he didn't do anything close to that. | ||
| What the fuck? | ||
| He did a little bit. | ||
| He did a little bit. | ||
| And then when they made the movie, though, here's the thing. | ||
| He wasn't directing that film at 17, 18, you know, I mean, he only did it a bit at a time. | ||
| Motherfucker. | ||
| You know, the movie they greenlit, that's the other thing that's weird. | ||
| They knew it was past, and then they greenlit that movie. | ||
| He was released on parole in 92, 15 months into his sentence. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Whoa. | |
| Yeah. | ||
| He laid low for a while, planning his next move. | ||
| What the fuck does that mean? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| Oh my god. | ||
| I mean, the register sex owner who'd recently been doing that was hired to make a film for Disney. | ||
| Selva's Disney film film was a straight potter, a freakishly intelligent albino boy with telepathic and telekinetic powers. | ||
| The film was marketed as a modern-day fairytale which starred such household names as Jeff Goldblum and was at the time decreed to be a sleeper hit after it cost $30 million worldwide, outstripping its modest $10 million budget. | ||
| Yeah, all I remembered was that, oh my god, you touched me and I've had better... | ||
| What does that say? | ||
| Jeff Goldman comes across Powder in an empty cafeteria and says to him, you touched me and I've had better sex than I've had in 10 years. | ||
| I want to be a friend. | ||
| Right, that's not creepy. | ||
| And this thing got good reviews. | ||
| You touched me and I had better sex. | ||
| Ah, man, we hit it. | ||
| That's what I love. | ||
| I was looking forward to doing this because I know we would hit some stripe, you know, some vein that you would completely dig, man, and you get it. | ||
| See, this is my work. | ||
| This is what I'm fucking up. | ||
|
unidentified
|
What the fuck? | |
| Yeah. | ||
| He takes Powder's hand as his hair, supposedly due to an electric current, begins to stand on end. | ||
| So the idea is that he's holding him, and the power of this child makes his hair stand up. | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| It's a fucking pedophile movie. | ||
| And caresses Powder's face and bald head for around 20 seconds. | ||
| What the fuck is wrong with Jeff Goldblum? | ||
| I don't know, Jeff. | ||
| What is wrong with you? | ||
| The fuck? | ||
| I don't care. | ||
| I don't need to meet movie stars. | ||
| Fucking, you know, come on. | ||
| I'm glad you're on the fucking rent.com horror ads now. | ||
| Apartment. | ||
| I'm glad it's falling apart. | ||
| Well, I'm not. | ||
| Good luck to you. | ||
| But what the fuck? | ||
| He was really good in Jurassic Park. | ||
| I didn't see that. | ||
| I missed that. | ||
| Can you imagine? | ||
| I didn't happen to see that. | ||
| He said he really liked Comey Lucky. | ||
| Did he? | ||
| Not really. | ||
| No, you're kidding. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| He's kidding. | ||
| He's totally kidding. | ||
| I know that kidding sound. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I'm sorry. | |
| Maybe he wasn't thinking that much. | ||
| Maybe the movie was made incrementally and whatever, so I'll give him a break. | ||
| But Disney should have fucking known. | ||
| Disney's whole business is based on kids, right? | ||
| So this is what the big kid studio, the fucking theme park people, they put this piece of shit out, and it's still sort of like honored as this critically acclaimed thing. | ||
| And I... I'm no guy who can... | ||
| Critics figure out shit that I'm not smart enough or I don't care enough to figure out. | ||
| They can follow avant-garde shit. | ||
| I don't know what the fuck they're talking about. | ||
| But this movie, I know the message better than anybody. | ||
| I know what it's about, and I know who they're appealing to. | ||
| And they're putting their fucking horse shit in our face and asking us to like it. | ||
| Well, you know what? | ||
| I don't like it, Disney. | ||
| I don't like it, Salva. | ||
| Go fuck yourself. | ||
| I vaguely recollect that this was an issue that someone had brought up to me before, but I never investigated it, or maybe it was in conversation at the comedy store or something like that, and I never looked into it, but goddammit, this is fucking crazy. | ||
| There's fucking jelly in this beer. | ||
|
unidentified
|
What do you mean? | |
| Jelly? | ||
| What do you mean? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Blackberry... | |
| I don't drink at fucking Knott's Berry Park. | ||
| Can I see what it says? | ||
| What is it? | ||
| What the fuck is it? | ||
| Taste it. | ||
| No, I don't think so, Phil. | ||
| He's moving on. | ||
| These Nuevos are really good. | ||
| I've got to try a Nuevo. | ||
| These are great. | ||
| It's from New Mexico. | ||
| Local beer. | ||
| All right. | ||
| So thank you, man. | ||
| That's the great thing about doing your show, and I've listened to you go off on these riffs for so long. | ||
| I've got to watch it at no o'clock in the morning because of Don Gavin. | ||
| Cut the shit, big guy. | ||
| I gotta watch at no o'clock in the morning because I'm on a dish and it uses up too much bandwidth to keep watching. | ||
| But if I'm up at no o'clock in the morning, I'm checking out what you've been doing and you fucking kill me, man. | ||
| And it's great. | ||
| And that's why I was so... | ||
| I mean, I didn't approach one... | ||
| I don't think... | ||
| I might have approached a couple, but like a very few people I approached said, can we come on and do your show? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| You're one of the only ones, man. | ||
| Thank you very much. | ||
| You're the last one we're doing. | ||
|
unidentified
|
This is it. | |
| I'm done. | ||
| Thank you very much. | ||
| It's an honor for me. | ||
| And I knew I could trust you for me arriving as test pattern boy at the end of fucking 100 interviews. | ||
| Like, well, let's go back and now, you like to call it a rape barrier? | ||
| Is that what you... | ||
|
unidentified
|
Is it a sexual assault or a rape to you? | |
| I'm going to go ahead and use that word, rape. | ||
| Is that all right? | ||
| One thing that really sort of kind of defines you and how you approach things. | ||
| Very good beer. | ||
| It's very good, right? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes. | |
| Nuevo. | ||
| You said that if that guy was alive, that you would want to show him that he didn't break you. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| You know... | ||
| I would show him that my personal revenge would be to behave decently towards him and even advocate for him to be in a situation confined and segregated from any possibility of being near children. | ||
| Where he was treated in a humane fashion. | ||
| And if he weren't, I would tell him he could tell me and I would do something about it because I became a human rights activist and not a rapist, not a human rights offender. | ||
| And so you didn't win. | ||
| The light that was extinguished in you was never extinguished in me. | ||
| It survived and I'm so fortunate that it did. | ||
| I would have probably said that and then killed him. | ||
| For sure. | ||
| I stomp spiders. | ||
| I'm not a big fan of poisonous things. | ||
| Yeah, well, I understand. | ||
| I understand. | ||
| I didn't experience what you experienced, and you have obviously... | ||
| I couldn't be consumed by it. | ||
| Of course. | ||
| Well, you're a very strong person to go that path and to go that route and that's indicative of who you became and that's one of the reasons I think, ironically, like why you became such a strong leader and this powerful person is because you overcame something un-fucking-bearably traumatic very early in your life and you developed this intense sense of right and wrong. | ||
| I think this is a great time to tell people they should follow me on Twitter. | ||
| At Crimmins, C-I-M-M-I-N-S. Let's see the record we can set for followers right now at this moment. | ||
| At Crimmins on Twitter. | ||
| He was talking about me, Barry. | ||
| Oh, man. | ||
| So I seized the moment. | ||
| This has been the weirdest, hardest movie to promote. | ||
| More than the Bigfoot movie? | ||
| Because Bigfoot, it's scary and it was fun. | ||
| Here, you guys talk. | ||
| I've got to show Joe a picture that I think he's going to dig. | ||
| Oh, is it the lizard guy that lives in... | ||
| No, no. | ||
|
unidentified
|
It's the fact that... | |
| Hey, hello, all of Joe Rogan's followers, all you crazy goddamn... | ||
|
unidentified
|
What would you describe your politics? | |
| I'd try not to. | ||
| Okay, good. | ||
| I'm trying not to define it. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, shoot. | |
| I can't get on the interweb. | ||
| My politics are wait for the aliens to land. | ||
| My politics are never trust anyone who wants to be in charge. | ||
| That's perfect. | ||
| Anybody who wants to be president shouldn't be president. | ||
| It's fucked. | ||
| I have an idea that people, it should be like jury duty. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| And then, you know, hey, I'm going to go try to do us proud for a week. | ||
| I mean, like I ran the ding-ho and did that shit. | ||
| I could have parlayed that into something, but I just knew we needed something. | ||
| I didn't want to be fucking in charge. | ||
| Fuck that. | ||
| I want to do my shit. | ||
| I think it should be by height. | ||
| And I don't want anyone to have to approve of it. | ||
| By height. | ||
| Yeah, there you go. | ||
|
unidentified
|
By height. | |
| How did the ding-ho, well, I'm out. | ||
| How did the ding-ho wind up closing? | ||
| Chun-Li lost the tax money in a Mahjong game. | ||
| For real? | ||
| I sold out four shows on Saturday night. | ||
| I went over to pick up my notebook on Monday. | ||
| There's fucking plywood on the door. | ||
| And the ultimate dinghole not here. | ||
| Because the joke is, I used to call the club. | ||
| I'd be out on the road, and I would call in on Saturday night to see him. | ||
| And this old guy, Henry, is like an 82-year-old Chinese guy who took the takeout orders on the phone. | ||
| And I would call up, and I would say, Hey, Henry, it's Barry. | ||
| Barry not here! | ||
| And this is back in the day. | ||
| You've got to get another $2.85 and change. | ||
| Henry! | ||
| You know? | ||
| I want to order! | ||
| Sean Lee on the phone. | ||
| You know, I would have to figure some way to break through his... | ||
| So it turned into my friend, the late, great John Brown. | ||
| You know, the man who wants... | ||
| The man who wants... | ||
| Ah, you fuck. | ||
| The man who wants puked in a wishing well. | ||
| The Patterson Kremlin photo? | ||
| Yeah, it's Barry. | ||
| How about the one with you? | ||
| Okay, how about yours? | ||
| I was watching the movie, editing, and I was like, holy crap. | ||
| That's the holy grail for me. | ||
| Well, there's a lot of Bigfoot sightings in upstate New York. | ||
| Well, that's my thing. | ||
| I just do movies about a hairy, mysterious man that live out in the woods. | ||
| I was on some point, but it doesn't matter, because Bob had to mock. | ||
| You were talking about calling up the ding-ho, and then you had to trick him. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, yeah. | |
| So it became ding-ho, not hero. | ||
| I don't remember the rest of it. | ||
| What was that? | ||
| Still, it wasn't enough of a prompt, Joe. | ||
| It's gone. | ||
| I have a compartmentalized memory. | ||
| And plus, I've had a lot of concussions because I played a little ball in my day. | ||
| Oh, man. | ||
| Back in the day when spearing was, you know, legal. | ||
| Yeah, and widely practiced. | ||
| Yeah, man. | ||
| Did you enjoy Fran Salamita's documentary? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Sure. | |
| Fran was a big help in our movie. | ||
| He gave us footage that wasn't used in that, so that was a big help. | ||
| It was the first real chance for me to go on record about a lot of stuff. | ||
| And then some of that was stuff Bob ended up using in our film. | ||
| So yeah, I enjoyed it a lot. | ||
| You are in this position now with this film coming out to help a lot of people. | ||
| I think this film is not just going to tell your story and open up a lot of people's eyes as to the AOL situation. | ||
| But I think a lot of people. | ||
| You're such a powerful guy. | ||
| I'm hearing from them, Joe. | ||
| I'm sure you are. | ||
| And they know how to find me. | ||
| Find me and I'll do what I can. | ||
| I give everybody as much of a chance as I can. | ||
| There's a lot of what's sold to abuse survivors that I think is horseshit and that's basically they get quote-unquote empowered and I hate that word because it takes the strength out of the word power. | ||
| What sounds more like power? | ||
| Power or empowered? | ||
| Empowered is like making them wear Birkenstocks or something. | ||
| So I'm not that big on empowered. | ||
| But they, like, I did my friend Sam Cedar's podcast a couple weeks back, and he said, I don't want to give away what the movies are. | ||
| I said, listen, man, it's not that kind of movie, and it hinges largely on the fact that I survived rapes as a child. | ||
| Well, I heard from several people who said, you know, you really should have had a trigger warning on there, and it's like, What the fuck do you think I was doing? | ||
| What the fuck do you think I was doing when I said it hinges largely? | ||
| I was warning you that what it was about right there, but someone has empowered you to have a way to take issue with me because I'm not completely basing. | ||
| You know, the whole world isn't based around me. | ||
| Even though I got raped when I was four years old, everybody shouldn't be thinking in terms of that all the time because they've been through their own shit and they're dealing with their own shit and they're trying to survive. | ||
| So if I can make them more sensitive to this issue, if I can show them that it matters to them, that they deal with other people who have been through this kind of trauma and we want to reduce it as much as absolutely possible, that's good. | ||
| But after that, if I'm going to find a way to set up a situation where I'm always the injured party and I prove again and again that I'm persecuted and no one's thinking in terms of me, then I'm never going to get fucking healed. | ||
| I'm never going to get fucking healed. | ||
| And I try to help other people. | ||
| When I help other people, I realize how far along I've come. | ||
| And I realize there's really something in it for me to do that. | ||
| And it's not like I'm this altruistic guy. | ||
| It's like I'm saving my own life. | ||
| You know, like that AOL investigation that took such courage to do it. | ||
| No. | ||
| What would have taken courage was turning my back on those kids and walking away going, oh, I don't want to know what's going on in there. | ||
| How would I live with that guy? | ||
| How would I live with myself then? | ||
| But, you know, it was nice everyone said, oh, gee, what he went through when he was doing that investigation. | ||
| What about the kids in the fucking pictures? | ||
| That's what I want everyone to know about. | ||
| Thanks for caring about me, but it's the kids in the pictures I give a shit about. | ||
| It's the kids that are suffering right now. | ||
| Somewhere within the sound of my voice, someone, you know, I mean, in this broadcast, like, where this is on, someone in the next apartment or wherever, some kid is going through this shit. | ||
| Have the courage to know about it. | ||
| That's all I ask for you. | ||
| Have the courage to know about it. | ||
| And save the contemporary children. | ||
| So you don't have to deal with a bunch of fucking maniac abuse survivors when... | ||
| That's all. | ||
| And if anybody can defuse the term... | ||
| James Brown's cape guy's coming in now. | ||
| If anybody can defuse the term trigger warning, you're the fucking guy. | ||
| Well, thanks. | ||
| Jesus goddamn Christ, stop. | ||
| We're going to develop a nation of permanent children. | ||
| Like, if anybody can tell their story and doesn't need a fucking trigger warning, it's you. | ||
| This idea, I don't need trigger warnings. | ||
| If you're going to show me something, show me something. | ||
| And if I don't want to see it, let me know what it is before you show me. | ||
| Tell me what the... | ||
| We all knew what the documentary was about. | ||
| No need a goddamn trigger... | ||
| This fucking term is disgusting. | ||
| It's a disgusting term. | ||
| It does damage... | ||
| It just sets people up to stay in the pit, you know, to wallow. | ||
| It's empowering them to wallow. | ||
| Like, well, I've got hurt again because the whole society... | ||
| It's like, sorry about that shit, man. | ||
| But I'm telling you what, I know you're in a pit of your own shit. | ||
| I know you're used to the temperature and the smell of it doesn't... | ||
| You're used to that and it doesn't bother you that much anymore. | ||
| But when you stand up and they... | ||
| And then you go in the house and take a real shower and put on some clean clothes, you're not gonna believe how much better you feel! | ||
| So stop letting other people tell you that you have to expect the world to do the impossible and let's be telepathic about what the fuck you've been through! | ||
| Get to the point where you can stand up and tell them the story yourself when it's appropriate. | ||
| And don't put up with anybody who is truly being insensitive or snickering about any of this shit. | ||
| Fuck people who tell me. | ||
| People walk up to me all the time and tell me, like, well, you know, the good thing is those guys get arrested, you know, and Bubba will take a hit. | ||
| It's like, you're endorsing rape to me? | ||
| You're fucking endorsing rape to me, motherfucker? | ||
| I don't want anyone raped ever. | ||
| Not even raping. | ||
| Rape is illegal. | ||
| How about making jails lawful places? | ||
| How about that for an idea? | ||
| How about someone going to jail and realizing the law protects me sometime? | ||
| I'm not going to be raped. | ||
| I'm not going to be menaced here. | ||
| I'm going to... | ||
| And maybe they will start thinking about getting reformed. | ||
| But Jesus Christ, don't joke to me about rape. | ||
| Don't tell me you want them all killed and sweep them under that rug. | ||
| Because I was born without blood on my hands. | ||
| I don't want any fucking blood on my hands now, man. | ||
| So don't... | ||
| Guess! | ||
| These stupid ass fucking lightweight things and presume I'm going to sign off on them. | ||
| Because I don't want anyone else ever raped and if it happens, even if it's of a rapist, I'm opposed to it. | ||
| And I don't want them fucking killed either. | ||
| I want them to live with what they did. | ||
| Now this is a difficult, this is a difficult thought, and this is a difficult subject, but did you, after this was all said and done, horrendous moment in your life, many moments in your life, did you try to figure out what would create a person like the guy who did that to you? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Did you try? | ||
| I did figure it out. | ||
| How much time? | ||
| Yeah, and I can tell you what created him. | ||
| He was taken out of an abusive home. | ||
| He was put into foster care and abused many more times, and he was gone. | ||
| And he was gone. | ||
| And he was succumbed. | ||
| By the agony I was put through by him, I survived somehow. | ||
| I made it, so call me lucky. | ||
| I didn't become him. | ||
| I didn't become what I resisted. | ||
| I didn't pass along the poison. | ||
| Maybe I did in some ways when I was difficult or whatever, but mostly I didn't. | ||
| Mostly when I'm mad, I'm mad because it's like Hendrix. | ||
| A cry of love. | ||
| It's a cry of love that I make. | ||
| It's a cry of love. | ||
| My act has been a cry of love. | ||
| It's like I don't want the innocent hurt anymore. | ||
| I don't want people victimized because of greed and cowardice and bullshit. | ||
| I don't want that. | ||
| And so I do what I can to stand up to it. | ||
| Were there moments where you wanted to talk to him? | ||
| I would have loved to talk to him. | ||
| I would have loved to talk to him to show him that I didn't become a monster like he was. | ||
| I would have almost become an advocate for him in the sense that, like, well, let me know if they're mistreating you in here. | ||
| But he died in prison, no one claimed his body, and I don't know where his grave is. | ||
| If I knew where his grave is, I'd go put fucking flowers on it. | ||
| Not for him, for me. | ||
| The idea that someone could do that after someone did that to them seems insanely counterintuitive. | ||
| It's like if someone... | ||
| It's the only thing that saves you, but really saves you, really is redemptive and really saves you. | ||
| To me. | ||
| One of the things that you covered in the film that I thought was really a very powerful moment where you talked about this thing that you didn't become him, that you maybe if your sister didn't come down there and catch... | ||
| I could have been dead. | ||
| You could have been dead. | ||
| It was close, man. | ||
| It was close. | ||
| But also that you could have been one of them. | ||
| You could have been someone who would repeat that. | ||
| And that would have been worse than death. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| I would rather be a victim a thousand times than the perpetrator once, and that's not any bullshit. | ||
| Did you contemplate the mechanism? | ||
| Have you tried to understand the mechanism that turns an abused person into an abuser? | ||
| What is that? | ||
| I don't think I'm as nuts and bolts as you are, because I listen to you and I know what detail you go into. | ||
| So I understand how and what you're asking. | ||
| But I can't be... | ||
| There's enough of me that's been through enough that I can't be quite as thorough as you're asking me to be to answer that. | ||
| I get as close as I can, and I understand what happened, but then after that point, I'm not one of them, and I can't go far enough to say, well, then, of course, if you get past this point right here, then obviously this is the... | ||
| I can't do that. | ||
| That is what is too much for me. | ||
| Well, you know, one of the reasons I was interested in making the movie was when Barry, you know, told me that the guy had died in prison. | ||
| And I said, how'd that make you feel? | ||
| And he said, it made me sad. | ||
| And I said, because you didn't get any closure? | ||
| You know, you didn't get to confront him? | ||
| And he said, no, he died alone. | ||
| And I was really blown away by that, and I thought... | ||
| I should really make a movie about this. | ||
| No, I thought, well, this is like, you know, this is Jesus stuff. | ||
| You know, that's what this is. | ||
| So, you know, that really did motivate me to make the movie, you know. | ||
| And so the movie... | ||
| It was going to be a narrative with someone else playing Barry, and I thought about that for years. | ||
| He tried a stab at a script, I tried, and it wasn't until, you know, Robin Williams was my pal, and he suggested I make it as a doc. | ||
| This was just February 2014. And I said, I don't have any money. | ||
| He says, I'll give you some money. | ||
| You can start it. | ||
| Because he was a fan of Barry's and he knew Barry's story. | ||
| So that's really how the movie came together. | ||
| It came together really fast. | ||
| I didn't realize how long it takes to make a doc, you know. | ||
| Because when I was at Sundance, other directors are going, yeah, we started seven years ago. | ||
| Seriously, I started four years ago. | ||
| And I was like, I started February. | ||
| And they didn't go, hey, all right. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They're like, hmm, I hope it's okay. | |
| Well, good luck with that, Bob Scratch. | ||
| How difficult was it to even attempt to tell this story? | ||
| For you, as a person who loves this guy, and as we know, he's out of the room right now, he was so instrumental. | ||
| He was the foundation of that whole community, which I think is so important to you and me. | ||
| And help mold me, you know, because I met him when I was 16. Right. | ||
| So it's, you know, making a movie that's not a work of fiction with someone you love that you want them to like when it's done and you want people to like the movie and him for the same reason you like him. | ||
| It was hard. | ||
| It wasn't, you know, like people will talk about making a movie and they say that was hard. | ||
| No matter what, I never think, you know, but seeing that these are real people, I don't want to embarrass anyone. | ||
| I don't want to, I don't want to. | ||
| No, I know you don't. | ||
| And I was thinking about how hard I made your work. | ||
| There's footage, you know, what the fuck am I gonna do about that? | ||
| It's embarrassing. | ||
| Before this film came out, was there a time where you were trying to figure out how to tell your story? | ||
| No, I mean, I felt like I had told it a lot, and I felt like the trail was there and people could find it. | ||
| This is like the dream that it gets told this way. | ||
| But I didn't expect it. | ||
| I didn't presume it. | ||
| And I was completely honored and flattered that it was done, and then it was done so well. | ||
| But, you know, I mean, like, part of me doesn't give a fuck about my story. | ||
| I mean, I just, like, I, like... | ||
| I've learned as I grow up, I've learned not to take life personally. | ||
| You know, I'm just part of it. | ||
| And so, I don't expect it to stop for me and do it. | ||
| But it has in this sense because Bob stopped it and got the footage and sequenced it and put it together and thought these brilliant ways to approach it and then made this beautiful picture. | ||
| I mean, really, If it wasn't about me, I mean, I would be out crusading to get people to watch this. | ||
| It just seems immodest at this point, you know, because it's about me. | ||
| He made such a tremendous movie. | ||
| Well, there's a lot of folks. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I mean, Jeff Stryker, the editor, Clint and Charlie, our producers. | |
| They're your people that you put together, you know? | ||
| Bradley Stonecipher, who I've got to see while I'm in town, by the way. | ||
| Is he around? | ||
| I don't know. | ||
| We should figure that out. | ||
| How do you follow this? | ||
| We're doing a sequel. | ||
| Yeah, call me greedy. | ||
| I got a book coming. | ||
| What's the book about? | ||
| A lot of essays. | ||
| And then a lot of quips. | ||
| It's sort of dedicated to generation text. | ||
| You know, the people there are like... | ||
| I mean, I'm trying to hang in there, but it's like I read this shit out. | ||
| P-T-G-O-T-R-S-H-U. Half hour later, I'm going like, putting on other shoe? | ||
| What the fuck? | ||
| You've got time to tell me you're putting on your other shoe, but you're in such a hurry, you've got to abbreviate it so I can't figure out what the fuck? | ||
| So I have to be calm enough to try to convey this. | ||
| Okay, kids. | ||
| SMH is my least favorite. | ||
| Shake my head. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh. | |
| Fucking gross. | ||
| Yeah, no, and the whole emoji thing. | ||
| I'm a grown man. | ||
| It's like, come on. | ||
| I make smiley faces. | ||
| I'm so sorry. | ||
| I never did. | ||
| I knew to get him, I knew to wind him up. | ||
| Oh, they all send them to me, the whole crew. | ||
| Smiley face emoticon. | ||
| Yeah, I sent one to my friend Paul, and he's like, did you fucking send me a smiley face? | ||
| I actually texted enough women that I put smiley face emoticon on it. | ||
| I don't have any emojis, but I do look at the dot dot smiley. | ||
| Every time I upgrade my phone, they put like a million more of these things on there, and then I hit it by mistake. | ||
| Barry just sent me a Christmas tree that's puking. | ||
| I don't know if he's happy or mad. | ||
| It's a drunk Christmas tree. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I don't think he meant there. | |
| We're like, we're regressing. | ||
| Yeah, yeah. | ||
| We're just communicating with hieroglyphs. | ||
| It's 100%. | ||
| 100%. | ||
| I got a deer with an arrow in its face. | ||
| And a gun pointed at its head. | ||
| What the fuck does that mean? | ||
| A very depressed deer. | ||
| Guys wearing skins. | ||
| Yeah, suicidal emojis. | ||
| Like, how are guns and emojis? | ||
| Yeah, they are. | ||
| They are. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They're in there. | |
| Why are so many people communicating with guns? | ||
| We need the ones we need. | ||
| You know, the fart. | ||
| The pile of dog shit. | ||
| That's another one. | ||
| Flatulent. | ||
| Hey, can I do my Hercules thing on you? | ||
| Can people see it? | ||
| What's your Hercules? | ||
| Throw me the styrofoam boulder. | ||
| Who is the fool now? | ||
| I ask you, Joe Rogan. | ||
| What is that? | ||
| That's my old Hercules movie bit. | ||
| Oh, is it like synchronized? | ||
| No, everybody did it. | ||
| Yeah, but everybody... | ||
| No one... | ||
| They all do it now. | ||
| But I was in it first! | ||
| I ask you! | ||
| I don't... | ||
| That's unbombing. | ||
| It's more like kung fu movie stuff. | ||
| Well, no, that was later. | ||
| Oh, it was later. | ||
| So this is pre-that. | ||
| It was Hercules movies. | ||
| Uh-uh. | ||
| Throw me this stuff on Walter. | ||
| Who is the fool now? | ||
| Testicles. | ||
| I will get you sooner or later, my friend. | ||
|
unidentified
|
You will come around, and you will understand the point of this joke! | |
| This is not playing well on audio. | ||
| The vast majority of our listeners are just that. | ||
| Ah, good, good, good, good. | ||
| We maybe have like... | ||
| Less than 10% probably watch this. | ||
| Perfect. | ||
| It's better. | ||
| I love shit that doesn't work. | ||
| When you're on Upstate, when you're like... | ||
| So you go out and you do... | ||
| He's had too many beers. | ||
| He's had four beers. | ||
| Three is good. | ||
| When you're in upstate and you go out, you're doing these gigs, are you performing on a regular basis? | ||
| No, no, but I will be. | ||
| I mean, regular basis is something. | ||
| Because that was part of the film. | ||
| Someone was like, I don't know how he makes money. | ||
| Someone was asking. | ||
| I'm about to. | ||
| I have a great new speakers bureau called Kepler Speakers in New York. | ||
| If you want me to come talk to you, I will for a fee. | ||
| And I'm going out and doing a bunch of shows and getting ready and I would like to, you know, I think there might be like kind of a valedictory performance. | ||
| And then I might be kind of done. | ||
| You know, maybe just find a little spot, a little lady, settle down in the country, and relax. | ||
| Do you have a desire to do stand-up again, or is stand-up sort of like too limited? | ||
| No, no, no, no, no, no, I'm happy to do stand-up. | ||
| I did it last night at the belly room of the Comedy Store. | ||
| It was fun. | ||
| And they were like, wow, you're allowed to do that? | ||
| Yeah, fuck yeah, you are. | ||
| You know, so it was cool. | ||
| And I love doing stand-up, and I love comics. | ||
| I mean, I fuck. | ||
| I love comics. | ||
| They're my brothers and sisters. | ||
| And you know what? | ||
| I put a lot on the line for them, and they put a lot on the line for me. | ||
| And sometimes people, like a lot of people come to me and they're like, I know I don't do what you do. | ||
| It's like, no, I'm supposed to do what I'm supposed to do. | ||
| And that's what I was saying to you before. | ||
| You've figured out what you're supposed to do, and you're so tremendous at it. | ||
| It makes the kettle drums in my heart go, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun, dun. | ||
| Joe Rogan, la la, dun dun dun dun dun dun, la la, dun dun din dun dun, la la, dun dun din dun dun, la la, dun dun dun dun dun dun dun dun. | ||
| But for you, that's why you fuckers got a few bucks. | ||
| Buy me a kettle drum. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| We'll get you a kettle drum. | ||
| I'm going to have one shipped to upstate New York. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Going to take it on the fucking back of a 500-pound pig. | |
| That's right. | ||
| Carried it into a town down a dirt road. | ||
|
unidentified
|
So... | |
| But my point is, are you going to tour? | ||
| Yes, I will. | ||
| And I will tell you, and you will pass it along to your people. | ||
| Is there a website that people can find out about what you're doing? | ||
| BarryCrimmage.com just got completely renovated by my friends at Slab Media, Jim Infantino, Catherine Infantino in Boston. | ||
| Today, we just launched the cleaned-up modern version of the website, because I had a wood-burning website before this. | ||
| And it has a calendar where people, look at that. | ||
| They will. | ||
| Sexy bitch. | ||
| Oh, there you go. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Distinguished beard. | |
| That's right. | ||
| That's right. | ||
| Okay, so there's an appearances thing in an account. | ||
| Look at this. | ||
| Modern. | ||
| Facebook, Twitter, the whole deal. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| Instagram. | ||
| You got an Instagram? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yeah. | |
| I don't use it much, but Twitter's kind of perfect for me because I'm a pithy joke guy. | ||
| So they played right into it. | ||
| For once, it came into my wheelhouse. | ||
| Stephen Wright would have been the awesome. | ||
| Mitch Hedberg. | ||
| Mitch Hedberg and Stephen Wright. | ||
| Do you know what Stephen did when he was using Twitter a lot? | ||
| He wrote a book. | ||
| Yeah, yeah, yeah. | ||
| He was writing a book. | ||
|
unidentified
|
What a funny prick. | |
| Read a book on Twitter, 140 characters at a time. | ||
| Imagine getting to know him for all these years. | ||
| I mean, he's like one of my dearest friends. | ||
| We don't see each other that often when we do. | ||
| It's just like, talk about just picking right up from where you were the last time. | ||
| And he came up and saw me out of nowhere. | ||
| That's why he knew in the movie, you know, when he says in the movie, it's like if Thoreau had a computer, because he was there. | ||
| I mean, he drove out to see me from Massachusetts just because he kind of wanted to get some context. | ||
| And, you know, Stephen, he's so honest. | ||
|
unidentified
|
He's like, I'm so glad now in my head I know where you are. | |
| It's just so great. | ||
| So he's back in Boston? | ||
| Stephen Wright is? | ||
| Well, he lives there. | ||
| But he goes out and does as many dates as he wants. | ||
| He lives in Massachusetts. | ||
| I'm not sure. | ||
| He lives kind of on 120. I don't want to say exactly where he lives, but it's up near the... | ||
| Not that far if you went to one of them. | ||
| Because he pissed off the Juggalos. | ||
| Did he? | ||
| No. | ||
| I keep hearing about the jungle. | ||
| I did the gathering. | ||
| How was it? | ||
| It was as horrible as you'd imagine. | ||
| Yeah, I would imagine it would be amazing. | ||
| It was insane. | ||
| It was insane. | ||
| There's no security. | ||
| There's no lights. | ||
| There's no... | ||
| Just people selling bath salts and fighting and... | ||
| There's a video of a girl just pulling down her pants and a bunch of guys just fucking her. | ||
| Have you seen that one? | ||
| Well... | ||
| It's probably just one video of many. | ||
| The Tila tequila footage where they ran out of Faygo to throw at her. | ||
| Because they spray each other with Faygo Cola. | ||
| So they just knocked over the outhouses and just started throwing human shit at her. | ||
| I stress human because... | ||
| Like, if you and I were walking on the street and you picked up some dog poo and hit me with it, I'd be mad, but later on we'd be pals. | ||
| We'd laugh it off. | ||
| I'd go, dude, what the fuck? | ||
| You hit me with dog shit. | ||
| But, you know, if it was like Hobo Duke, that would be a deal breaker. | ||
| We wouldn't be pals anymore. | ||
| Juggalo shit in that blue liquid. | ||
| Hobo Duke! | ||
| The Hobo Dukes. | ||
| That's the new band. | ||
| Old Hobo Dukes. | ||
| The Hobo Dukes. | ||
| Tonight with Hitler's Jism. | ||
| So, my opening act was Up Chuck the Clown, and he's driving me around the grounds in a golf cart, and the juggalos are getting out of the way, like, who are the millionaires? | ||
| So, this juggalo... | ||
| Runs up, runs alongside the golf cart, and then just starts punching the fuck out of Upchuck. | ||
| Oh, that's right. | ||
| You talked about it on the podcast. | ||
| It was a drive-by beating. | ||
| He just started whaling on him. | ||
| And he's like, fuck you, Upchuck. | ||
| Fuck you. | ||
| You know what really frosted my cake in this whole exchange? | ||
| I remember he was saying, you got nothing to worry about. | ||
| This is like a Dave Matthews concert. | ||
| And then he gets punched. | ||
| That's object to clown music? | ||
| With Jimmy Walker and Ron Jeremy. | ||
| Holy fuck Christ. | ||
| Yeah, that's Joel. | ||
| And, um... | ||
| No, but, like, the idea that, like, I'll talk to Bobcat in a language he can understand. | ||
| It's like a Dave Matthews concert. | ||
| I'm like, I wouldn't go see Dave Matthews. | ||
| I think he's trying to say it's safe. | ||
| It's chill. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Dave Matthews conscious. | ||
|
unidentified
|
You know what? | |
| I got to say this. | ||
| Krav, they were really nice. | ||
| But then Upchuck got hit in the head with a can of Faygo. | ||
| And they kind of slumped over the steering wheel unconscious. | ||
| And he's like, steer! | ||
| And so... | ||
| He wakes up, and I'm steering with a semi-conscious clown. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Oh, my God. | |
| I still can't get you to repeat. | ||
| I don't think I remember that game show story from Australia. | ||
| Oh, I can't remember that story. | ||
| I kept hitting this woman's buzzer. | ||
| I was on a game show. | ||
|
unidentified
|
And you go, Sophie! | |
| I didn't touch the buzzer! | ||
| He keeps hitting my buzzer. | ||
| I go, hey, lady, if you're going to lose, just lose. | ||
| Don't drag me into this. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Sophie! | |
| Oh, man. | ||
| Wow. | ||
| Hey, it's great for a Friday night here. | ||
| Unfortunately, it's Thursday, right? | ||
| What day is this? | ||
| I love that you don't know what day it is. | ||
| I never know. | ||
| Thursday. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Thursday. | |
| I never know unless I have gigs. | ||
| I have two gigs tonight. | ||
| You got two gigs? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Should we be wrapping this up? | ||
| Yeah, I got one at the W and I got one at the Comedy Store. | ||
| What time are you on at the Comedy Store? | ||
| 10.45. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| Can you get me in, man? | ||
| Fuck yeah, brother. | ||
| Don't worry about it. | ||
| Come on down. | ||
| Keep drinking. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I'll take a little nap. | |
| We'll wheel you in. | ||
| No, you know what? | ||
|
unidentified
|
This is the end of the tour, not to mention any other films. | |
| I understand. | ||
| This is like the 100th interview in 10 days or something. | ||
| I can only imagine. | ||
| I thought it was about you, Ray Barry. | ||
| It's unfortunate. | ||
| You have to do press for these things, but it's kind of a part of the thing, right? | ||
| No, it's important, and I'm thrilled, and I'm so... | ||
| Again, how much... | ||
| I mean, we just named the movie the right thing, because just look at what this fucking guy has done for me. | ||
| And he's also had a sort of... | ||
| And there's times when I've milked the fact that I'm watching him treat me with kid gloves, and I'm going like, you know, I may let this go on. | ||
| So August 7th, it's going to be this Friday, and that'll be all across the country? | ||
| No, no, it'll be in New York. | ||
| It'll probably show you if you keep scrolling. | ||
| New York, D.C., Austin, here in L.A. Oh, there it goes. | ||
| There's the... | ||
| Santa Ana. | ||
| IFC, New York. | ||
| Santa Ana. | ||
| Beverly Hills. | ||
| Washington, Angelica, Papa. | ||
| Vegas. | ||
| Yeah, okay, so it's all callmeluckymovie.com. | ||
| It's all available on the website. | ||
| We drop our T's in upstate New York. | ||
| I understand. | ||
| It's going to be available up there, too. | ||
| Look at that, stitches. | ||
| Powerful stitches. | ||
| Oh, yeah. | ||
| That's where I did my first open mic. | ||
| Really? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Who hosted? | ||
| Jonathan Katz. | ||
| Oh, wow. | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yeah, it was pretty cool. | ||
| Good old John. | ||
| Love that guy. | ||
| He's in the movie? | ||
| Yeah. | ||
| Yes, he is. | ||
| When is it going to be available, like on iTunes and all that stuff? | ||
| It will become, like, it'll be on... | ||
| Netflix, the whole deal. | ||
| I think Netflix, yeah. | ||
| You know, most of my... | ||
| Actually, all my movies end up on digital platforms. | ||
| So unlike those movies, though, MPI, the folks putting in out, you know, believe them, giving this one a little bit broader for theatrical run. | ||
| Nice. | ||
| Beautiful. | ||
| That's great. | ||
| Willow Creek was good, dude. | ||
| What happened with that? | ||
| Did it do well? | ||
| It did well for me. | ||
| It actually helped. | ||
| The same company that put that out said, when I said, hey, I want to make a movie about this guy, and it's about his child abuse, they were going, fine. | ||
| It was really cool. | ||
| Wow. | ||
| So Robin had given us the money to start the beginning of it, and then MPI, they were cool, man. | ||
| They were very supportive of what I do. | ||
| That's awesome. | ||
| Barry Crimmins, it's been an honor. | ||
| Thank you, sir. | ||
| Thanks for being here. | ||
| Thanks for being you. | ||
| You, unbelievable. | ||
| I'm so honored to be on your show, Bob. | ||
| First interview I got hammered at, and out of a hundred, I apologize. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I fucking apologize, but I was going to do it somewhere. | |
| I thought he was going to say, Bob, I've had it. | ||
| Don't apologize. | ||
| No more movies. | ||
| Go cram it. | ||
| You can take that sequel and shove it up your ass. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Now I'm hammered, and I'm not hammered, but I'm, you know. | |
| You're up there a little bit. | ||
| I love you, man. | ||
| And thanks. | ||
| You're the fucking greatest. | ||
| You're a beautiful person, Bob. | ||
| Honestly, a fucking act of friendship is one thing. | ||
| A documentary of it is quite another. | ||
| Thank you very much. | ||
| I love you, brother, and I'm most appreciative. | ||
| And thank you so much for having me on, Joe. | ||
| And I hope I get to come back and hang around and see what we fucking skip off on. | ||
| Absolutely. | ||
| Anytime. | ||
| Anytime. | ||
| Come on back. | ||
| I'm so proud to know you. | ||
| My honor, sir. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Thank you so much. | |
| Thank you very much. | ||
| All right, everybody. | ||
| We will be back. | ||
| What's today? | ||
| Thursday? | ||
| Wednesday? | ||
| Thursday? | ||
| We'll be back tomorrow. | ||
| All right. | ||
| Love you guys. |
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