Judging Freedom - Judge Andrew Napolitano - Pepe Escobar : Triumph In Shanghai.

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Sept. 4, 2025 - Judging Freedom - Judge Andrew Napolitano

24:11

Pepe Escobar : Triumph In Shanghai.

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	Hi everyone, Judge Andrew Napolitano here for judging freedom.
	Today is Thursday, September 4th, 2025.
	Pepe Escobar joins us now.
	Pepe, before we start, where on the planet are you?
	Well, you should know, Judge, and all our audience.
	I am uh time zone crazy, seven hours ahead of Moscow.
	I'm in Vladivostok in the Russian Far East, which is right beside me.
	All right, so it's nine o'clock in the morning here in New York, and where you are is 11 o'clock at night at night, it's almost Friday.
	Yes, it's almost Friday.
	Wow.
	Wow.
	Well, thank you, Pepe.
	Thank you for these long days, and thank you for accommodating uh the show's schedule.
	What has been your perception of the mood in Beijing in Vladivostok in the Shanghai cooperation organization as they gather?
	Well, Judge, this is one of the most important weeks.
	Uh not only uh in recent memory, we can say, because the whole it was we can call it the Russia-China Week and the Eurasia Week.
	It all started on Sunday in Tianjin, the port city, which is an absolutely uh an economic miracle, 14 million people, a powerhouse, uh 100 kilometers away from Beijing for the annual summit of the SEO, the Shanghai Cooperation Organization.
	Everybody was there, the top BRICS leaders were there.
	Shi Putin Modi, Peseshkin from Iran.
	So this was enormous, and it was as important as the BRICS summit in Kazan last year.
	So we we there is a direct parallel because the BRICS last year in Kazan, they stepped up, and this year the SEO also stepped up.
	So these are the top two multilateral organizations on the planet.
	are starting to coordinate and organize in minute detail our collective drive towards a multipolar, multinodal As Ambassador Chavez uh Freeman uh describes it correctly, a different world, and that's why this summit on Sunday and Monday in Beijing in Tianjin was so important.
	And on the next day, uh Vladimir Putin was received as a mega guest of honor at the Zhang Hanai in Beijing by Xi Jinping.
	That's the official residency of the presidency of China.
	It's an old imperial palace.
	When you are invited to the Zhang Hanai and you have uh state meetings, this the top of the top of the top of the top of the top level, you know, right.
	So uh and all that translated to the parade in Beijing, which was extraordinary on the third, uh, on Wednesday, which was the day that the forum here in Vladivostok where I am started.
	So it's all it's all interconnected, it's uh geo-economic, uh trade, business, geopolitical tsunami of information, of contacts, of uh organization of bilaterals, trilaterals.
	We had for instance a trilateral between uh Putin C and Modi at the corridors of the SEO summit in Tianjin.
	So it's gonna take quite a while for all of us to the whole thing to subsidize, and we start to look at uh the configuration of the global chess board now is completely different.
	So as I understand it, the original idea of uh bricks uh was economic, whereas the original idea of Shanghai cooperation Was uh security.
	Exactly.
	Are they melding together?
	I mean, you're talking about the same countries, the same human beings, verbal threats hurled at them by the president of the United States, absurd tariffs hurled at them by the president of the United States, which is resulting, correct me if I'm wrong, in unifying BRICS and Shanghai.
	Take it from there.
	Unifying it even faster than they were already doing it, Judge.
	Uh, they were already unifying it at uh very progressive level last year, prior to the summit in Kazan, and then after that, and then the Brazilians picked up the presidency this year, it was a bit slow for a while, but then typical Brazilian style at the last minute, they they made it.
	The summit was a real success in the end, and that was picked up by the SEO as well.
	The SEO gained momentum this past few weeks, especially prior to the summit in China, and when China organizes a multilateral summit, it has to be impeccable, and it has to peck a punch.
	And this one was particularly important because President Xi Jinping, he announced a global governance idea, which is uh I would say the headline for the for the global governance is uh how to bury the rules-based international order.
	By saying that, wait, wait, wait, wait.
	Say that again.
	How to bury the rules, space internet?
	What is what does that mean?
	Well, uh, you should ask uh Jake Sullivan judge, or you should ask uh Tony Blinken.
	This is what they used to say for four years.
	Every day we are defending the rules-based international order, which doesn't mean anything, never did, because it's still the empire of chaos making the rules, and there's no order, and now with Trump 2.0, it's even worse because there are no rules anymore, as we all know, and as all the leaders of the global south know, uh, there's no order, there are no rules, and it's the law of the jungle.
	And it's two days ago, the president, two days ago, the president of the United States ordered the United States Navy to obliterate a speed boat uh in the uh ocean in international waters because he believed it was uh carrying drugs ultimately uh destined for the United States.
	There's no legal basis whatsoever for that.
	Arguably was an act of uh murder.
	I guess that's an example of what you mean.
	There is no rule-based international order any longer.
	Exactly, Judge, and this is seen by all the major players in BRICS in the SEO, not to mention the major players, but the partners as well.
	The SEO has 10 full members that includes, for instance, Iran, India, and Pakistan, and uh Belarus.
	Uh, it has two observers, Afghanistan, which is being brought inside the SEO family little by little.
	They are tally, there's a Taliban delegation here in Vladivostok.
	I met them this morning, they came here to do business, and Mongolia, immensely important because of the finally China, Russia, and Mongolia clinched the power of Siberia to mega gas project.
	It's the largest energy project on the planet, and now they finally clinched the deal.
	This is the this is the Siberian two pipeline, or Siberia too.
	That's the ultimate longest pipeline uh on the planet.
	Do you think this came as a shock to the Trump people?
	Well, probably they didn't know much about power of Siberia too, uh, Judge, but uh the uh energy uh system and the energy uh multinationals in the US, they they very much know what that means, and people in Europe who deal with energy also understand the gas that originally would supply Europe via the Nord Streams,
	now it's going all the way to China via the power of Siberia, which comes from the Yama Peninsula, crosses Russia, crosses Mongolia.
	There is what they call an interconnector between the Russia side and China side arrives in China and goes to all the regions of China.
	So the gap that should power Europe is going to power China.
	Wow so former former German Chancellor uh Scholz shot himself in the foot.
	Yes.
	When he looked the other way, as the American CIA and Navy uh destroyed uh Nord Stream too, and Europe will permanently suffer cold or not so warm winters as a result of this.
	Not to mention paying absurd prices, Judge, and uh uh the latest meeting between that toxic medusa in Brussels von der Leyen and President Trump, it was uh I would I would say a serious suicide, in fact,
	because basically the Europeans committed to buy energy that the Americans don't have, by the way, 750 billion dollars in three years, they don't have that at extortionate prices instead of buying cheap Russian energy via the Nord Streams, and coming back to your previous question, Judge, it's very important because uh this distinction between BRICS and SEO.
	Now that it's true, the BRICS uh started as a geopolitical and also geoeconomic mechanism, and the SEO started as a security mechanism, but basically against terrorism.
	I think uh for you and for our audience is very important a few dates.
	The SEO was founded in June 2001, there was three months before 9-11, which solidified the concept of the war on terror, and yes, three months later, in a you know, in a small pavilion in a park in Shanghai, there was very low key, it was only Russia, China, and three of the Central Asian stands, right?
	They said, Look, we need to organize uh our anti-terror policy all across Eurasia because there are terrorists everywhere, and of course, I remember very well I used to travel in in those areas, including Afghanistan at the time, and it it was al Qaeda land everywhere, absolutely.
	So the original mandate of the SEO is we're going to fight against terrorism, separatism, and extremism, but over these past 15 uh 18 years, it started to evolve as an economic uh integration mechanism.
	So today the SEO is more about economic integration and economic projects than even fight fighting terrorism, because more or less they control what's going on in Afghanistan, in the border areas of Pakistan, in uh mountains of Tajikistan, where the for instance the Russians pay very close attention to everything, so it's much more integrated.
	So they what they really want is let's integrate uh Eurasia geoeconomically, and that's the parallel with BRICS because BRICS is doing this inside with Russia, China, India, Iran, etc., but also in Africa with South Africa, with the new African members, with Brazil.
	So this integration of the multipolar multi-nodal world now, it's obvious for anyone to see, even people who don't follow politics anymore, and this is what people saw in Tianjin, and this camaraderie between the leaders was very very important.
	The fact that you can have Modi Si and Putin holding hands and laughing in the corridors of the summit in terms of the optics for all around the global south, enormous power.
	Wow, what is the if there is such a thing, collective opinion out there of Donald Trump?
	Well, today, uh, for instance, I spent uh the day today at the forum here in Vladivostok, Judge.
	Uh, we had just just to give an idea of a normal day in Vladivostok.
	In the morning, you have an enormous round table about alternative payment systems, and you have Russians, you have Chinese, you have South Koreans, and then a few hours later, you have another gigantic round table discussing the future of the Arctic investments in the Arctic.
	Uh, Unfortunately, there were no Americans in the room because then they would understand how this is a Russian effort, but also a collective Eurasia effort.
	That's why there were Mongolians as South Koreans.
	There are no American observers at these meetings.
	No, no, but I was expecting.
	In fact, before I came here, I was expecting okay this year, because at least there is a dialogue between Putin and Trump, there's going to be a sizable American uh delegation.
	Not at all.
	Without any Americans there, is it possible to put your finger on the post?
	Is there such a thing as a collective view of Trump?
	I can imagine what Modi thinks.
	We know what Modi thinks about what Trump just did.
	He went from best friend to worst enemy almost.
	Yes.
	Um Trump issued a weird statement.
	Chris, can you put that full screen uh up?
	Uh the one that uh contains the comment about the conspiracy.
	Big this is the president of the United States.
	The big question to be answered is whether or not President Xi of China will mention the amass the massive amount of support and blood that the United States of America gave to China in order to help secure its freedom from very unfriendly foreign invader.
	He's talking about Japan and World War II.
	The overwhelming majority of that fighting was done uh by the Chinese, not by the Americans, but whatever.
	Many Americans died in China's quest for victory and glory.
	I hope that they are rightfully honored and remembered for their bravery and sacrifice.
	May President G and the wonderful people of China have a great and lasting day of celebration.
	Now comes the kicker, Pepe.
	Please give my warmest regards to Vladimir Putin and King John as you conspire against the United States of America.
	You must mean collectively, Xi, Putin, and Kim.
	When the Russians were asked what they thought of it, they regarded it as a joke.
	Here is what Ushakov said with a brilliant very good English translation, Chris cut number 16.
	On social media, President Donald Trump, I sincerely hope not without a touch of irony, indeed, not without a significant degree of irony.
	Expressed that he extends his warmest regards to Chairman Xi Jinping and respectfully requests him to also convey his very best and most friendly wishes to President Vladimir Putin and to the esteemed chairman of state affairs of the Democratic People's Republic of Korea, respectively, in a truly diplomatic gesture.
	And once again, I think not entirely without a certain degree of irony.
	He explicitly stated that supposedly these three individuals were actively plotting a significant conspiracy against the sovereign United States of America.
	Now, I want to say that no one was organizing any conspiracies, no one was scheming anything, there were no conspiracies.
	Moreover, no one even had such thoughts.
	None of these three leaders had such thoughts.
	Besides that, I can say that everyone understands the role played by the United States, the current administration of President Trump and President Trump himself in the current international situation.
	Was the consensus of Trump's bizarre statement that it was a joke, as Mr. Ushikov was indicating, he uses the word irony, or was the consensus that Trump is off the rails again?
	Well, Ushakov uh judge, he's an old fox and very sophisticated.
	And this was a very polite and very elegant non-response response, in fact.
	Yes, yes, it was very elegant, right?
	But but they are master and the old school in Moscow, they are masters at that, and they're being very patient.
	Everybody, Ushakov, uh Berussov, uh Peskov as a uh uh spokesman, everybody's being very patient.
	They know that Trump is under a lot of domestic pressure from neocons of all sides.
	They know that Trump doesn't see uh everything that's going on is strategically, he doesn't understand really the strategic states ahead, but the Russian way.
	Okay, let's give him uh another try.
	And when you look at the battlefield, which is the key issue here.
	Uh, today, for instance, I was talking to the the governor of Donetsk, Mr. Shet Certkov.
	I usually meet him during these summits, and I ask him directly the situation about and he gave me a Ushakov style of response, basically saying, Yes, we are advancing our own way, and we're gonna come to a point in the next few months where negotiations will be inevitable, and we all know what that means.
	You the Ukrainian front will collapse absolutely, and it's a matter of months, and these are people who know the terrain, Judge.
	And this collapse uh will occur on Trump's watch.
	You can blame Biden all he wants.
	I don't think anybody would believe that it's Biden's fault now that Ukraine collapses.
	He's been in the White House uh nearly eight and a half months.
	We don't even know uh how many billions of dollars in equipment and military equipment is still going there, but we know the pipeline is still going, and we know Pepe.
	I don't want to get too far afield here, but and we know Pepe that he has authorized 3500 medium range offensive missiles that can reach Moscow and St. Petersburg.
	Now, according to Ritter, they're not gonna arrive for a while, they haven't been built.
	But what is the message sent to Putin when Trump publicly authorizes these things?
	Absolutely, and the Russians, because they are very cautious and they're still giving uh Trump the benefit of the doubt, they're gonna see how this missiles are going to be used by the increasingly absolutely desperate I would say terror entity in Kiev, SPU, G U R, everybody, the people who really control the show, not uh the puppets, Zelensky.
	So, but if we have a serious attack, for instance, in Moscow or in St. Petersburg with some of these missiles, then the game changes instantly, and they're ready for that as well.
	But the Russians Putin is saying uh this judge practically every day, he was saying that in China every day.
	He repeated today here in Vladivostok and tomorrow, Friday, it's the plenary session here in Vladivostok with Vladimir Putin, and there's gonna be a QA after that.
	Everybody is very very curious.
	What is gonna talk about yes?
	Here's what Putin said uh yesterday about Ukraine.
	This is profound Chris Cut number two.
	And after we, at the insistent urging of our Western European colleagues, withdrew our troops from Kyiv, the situation immediately changed, and we were told almost verbatim now.
	We will fight until either you tear our heads off or we tear yours off.
	I don't remember whether I've ever said this publicly or not, but that's roughly how it sounded, only in cruder terms, but quite openly and oddly enough, in a sort of cumradly way.
	So now it's either us or you.
	Well, and this all continues.
	Wow, yes, that this is he never speaks in these terms uh so bluntly.
	Yeah, he's recounting what the what the Ukrainians said to uh our friend Sergei uh Lavrov when Putin at the request of Biden and company withdrew his troops.
	If you remember this very early on in the war from uh Kiev, rather than expressing gratitude, they threatened in very very crude ways, and he revealed that yesterday.
	It's profound that he revealed it, don't you think?
	Yes, and and this was part of the conversation with Xi Jinping as well.
	Uh, this one on one in Beijing, one day after the SEO, and one day before that absolutely outstanding military parade in Beijing was very significant.
	It lasted for a few hours, and they just of course they discussed the war in Ukraine in detail as well, because Putin is always briefing Xi about the war in Ukraine, right?
	Uh, in the in the beginning, uh uh listening uh to our uh uh Chinese academic circles, they were saying, yes, there's some diffidence in China about what do the Russians really want to accomplish in Ukraine, but now they understand it finally because she now finally gets the big picture as well.
	Yes, Judge, please.
	Pepe, uh So forgive me for asking you this, and you don't have to answer if you don't want to, but I keep seeing beautiful women walking behind you.
	Where are you at 11:30 at night in Vladivostok?
	Well, Judge, this is this is the Far East in action.
	This is a beautiful hotel that was built by the Japanese and then was uh bought because of sanctions.
	Was built by a Russian billionaire.
	And this is one of their restaurants, which happens to be absolutely outstanding with a view to the bridge and the cargoes passing by.
	The girls are fantastic.
	I explained to them, I need you managed to combine business and pleasure better than anyone I know.
	God bless you, my dear friend.
	Thank you for joining us.
	Thank you, Judge.
	All the best from the Far East.
	We'll see you next week.
	I don't know where will you be next week.
	China.
	All right.
	We'll see you from China next week.
	Thank you, Pepe.
	Safe travel.
	Thank you so much.
	Thank you so much.
	Wow.
	What a great man.
	A full day still ahead of us at one this afternoon on the killings outside of uh Venezuela, Anya Parampole.
	Uh two this afternoon, Colonel Lawrence Wilkerson at three this afternoon, Professor John Meersheimer at 3:30.
	New time from what we originally posted at 3:30 this afternoon, Colonel Douglas McGregor.

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