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May 4, 2025 - Judging Freedom - Judge Andrew Napolitano
25:38
**[SPECIAL]** MEDEA BENJAMIN (#CodePink) - Why the Government Fears Peace.
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Hi everyone, Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom.
Today is Monday, May 5th, 2025.
Medea Benjamin, founder of Code Pink, stalwart defender of peace and free speech, is here with us today.
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Medea Benjamin, a pleasure to welcome you back to the show, my dear friend.
Thank you for joining us.
What does Code Pink do?
We have been fighting against war.
I go back to fighting against war from the days of Vietnam, as is the Code Pink co-founder, Jody Evans.
So we've dedicated our lives to trying to stop people from killing each other.
And Code Pink started after the 9-11 attacks when we thought that there were other ways to deal with the attack, go after the individuals who attacked us, not used as an excuse to invade Iraq, to have an ongoing occupation of Afghanistan.
And to get the U.S. involved in all kinds of wars, as well as domestic repression here at home.
So we've been pretty consistent in our position against war over many years.
Why do you suppose Senator Charles Grassley, the chair of the Senate Judiciary Committee, wants Code Pink investigated?
Other than the fact that you're throwing in his side, which is a great thing, but why the machinery of investigative authority should be put upon...
Well, Judge, we have been maligned in the Senate for the last couple of months.
Not just by Senator Grassley, but it started out with Senator Tom Cotton, who in a hearing with all the members of the Intelligence Committee, Tulsi Gabbard and everyone, Keish Patel, said that we were funded by the Chinese Communist Party.
Two days later, Senator Banks, in an education hearing, said the same thing.
And then we saw Senator Grassley say it and call on the Attorney General to investigate us.
So insane on one level it's laughable because we have zero money from the Communist Party.
We don't even know people in the Chinese Communist Party.
And yet this seems to be the most recent way of attacking us.
And yes, we are a thorn in their side.
We're, I would say, the only group that is there on a regular basis calling them out on their support for...
The ongoing slaughter and now the starvation of people in Gaza, they don't like us there.
They wish that there weren't this attention that we're putting on to their taking money from AIPAC, from all of these lobby groups, the weapons manufacturers.
And so this is a tactic that they're using, but it has zero base in reality.
Is the grip that AIPAC and other entities in the donor class in America have on members of Congress, both houses, both parties?
Judge, it's really scary.
I am in Congress almost every single day.
And every day there are groups there.
Like today it was a group called Christian Leaders for Israel.
There are all kinds of Christian groups like Christians United for Israel.
There are all kinds of Jewish groups like AIPAC and many, many others.
Every day they are there in Congress.
But that's just the visible part.
What we don't see is behind the scenes all the money that is exchanging hands.
We know that AIPAC bragged about putting $100 million into the last election and being able to take out Cori Bush and Jamal Bowman.
And that was a warning.
AIPAC has been doing for many years, putting the fear of God into members of Congress that they don't want to be attacked.
And so we see ridiculous bills coming before Congress, like the Anti-Semitism Awareness Act that would make it illegal to criticize Israel and to say things like the Jews killed Christ,
the anti- BDS or Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions legislation that would make people involved in boycotts subject to up to a year in jail and a million dollar fines.
I mean, luckily now we're getting some Republicans who are speaking out against these and they're being pulled back.
But this is the kind of ridiculous legislation.
Horrible is the policy.
The fact that after over a year and a half, we continue to support Israel's slaughter and now starvation of the people in Gaza is just outrageous.
And the only reason we can say that it exists is because the Congress and the administration and the Democrats and the Republicans are really in the pockets of these lobby groups.
Congressman Thomas Massey, Republican of Kentucky, who is notoriously not in the pocket of these groups, has actually said that most of his colleagues on Capitol Hill actually have somebody from AIPAC either working in their office or monitoring them.
Do you know of any evidence for this?
Absolutely.
And I love that he called them the babysitters.
Right, right.
He's very down to earth and very funny.
And that's the phrase that he used.
Yes, and it is so true.
The APAC, you know, you really have to give them credit because it's not just the money.
It's also the intense organizing that they've been doing for many years that happens not just at the national level, but more importantly, at the local level.
And they have people at the local level.
Who are constantly visiting the home offices, know the staff people personally.
They are helping to write the bills that are coming up in Congress.
I don't know if you remembered, there was once an APAC person who joked that he could get 80 members of the Congress to sign a napkin that they brought, that they write the legislation.
And so, yes, they are embedded.
There are a number of the people from APAC who are now on the staff in congressional offices.
And, you know, let's be honest, it's not just APAC.
The military-industrial complex is so embedded in the offices.
I don't know if you know this, Judge, but there are...
In so many offices, especially in the important ones like foreign affairs and appropriations and armed services, there is a, quote, fellow coming from one of the branches of the government that we, the taxpayer, pay for, and they are in those offices for an entire year giving advice,
helping to write bills, and, of course, helping to make contracts that eventually go to the contractors that they end up working for when They leave those offices.
So it's so corrupt.
And this happens no matter which party controls either House of Congress.
Absolutely.
There are a handful of members of the Democratic Party who have said they're not going to take money from AIPAC, who refuse to have this kind of cozy relationship with the big lobby groups.
But they are the exception.
And when you go up to leadership, you'll find that they are among the largest recipients.
I mean, the number one recipient from AIPAC through his career was Joe Biden.
Right, right.
We know that.
Do you know about this legislation offered in the House by Representative Mike Lawler, Republican of New York?
Which, as I understand it, I don't know how it could possibly be enforced.
And thanks be to God, it looks like they pulled it from the vote today because they don't have enough votes to support it.
Would have punished you if you had a choice.
Between dealing with an Israeli company and a non-Israeli company, and you chose the non-Israeli company.
This is profoundly unconstitutional, but this is what Congressman Lawler proposed.
Are you familiar with this nonsense?
Absolutely, and we've been fighting against it in Congress, and we were so excited yesterday to see the tweet by Marjorie Taylor Greene saying that it was pulled, and then we saw Tom Massey saying the same thing.
So, yes, we...
We can't imagine, you know, the bills that are being put forth are so absolutely ridiculous.
And we go into some of these hearings and it's like, you know, you can't believe what you're watching, what you're seeing, what you're hearing.
And this issue of making everything be about anti-Semitism.
You know, I am Jewish, just like many of the people you have on your show, like Max Blumenthal.
And I see that the number one issue that is creating anti-Semitism.
is the genocide in Gaza.
And that if the U.S. only stopped supporting Israel, we would see a tremendous decrease in anti-Semitism, not only in the United States, but all over the world.
And yet you can't even say that in Congress.
They won't listen to you.
And they've had about maybe 12 hearings or more on this issue of anti-Semitism.
In fact, there's a movie that Congress members are showing tonight in the Right, right.
And then our Muslim students who you know have been whisked away in the middle of the night and put in detention centers, And they're the ones that need the help, and yet there's not one hearing that is focused on them.
Here's an encounter you had recently with a conservative Republican and Congresswoman Nancy Mace from South Carolina.
What do you have to say today about the starvation of children in Gaza?
They're a self-hating Jew, right?
Is that what you are?
You hate Jews?
I am a Jew, so I'm certainly not.
You hate Jews, you love Hamas.
You guys are domestic terrorists.
You support domestic terrorism.
That's also silly, but on a more serious note.
Do you have concern about the starvation in Gaza?
I know you love Jews.
We all love Jews.
What about the children who are starving because Israel has not let in food for the last two months?
What about all the Jews that have been murdered by Hamas and civilians in Gaza?
You guys are disgusting.
You're okay with the collective punishment of two million people?
I support the Jews all around the world.
Even you!
Your self-loathing Jewishness.
What is this nonsense about self-loathing?
If you are anything, it is not self-loathing.
You are trying to save innocent human life, and she calls you self-loathing.
You know, it's sad on so many levels, Judge, but I am just feeling so much anger and anguish about what is happening and about all the children that are being...
Subjected to malnutrition.
I'm a nutritionist by training.
I spent time all over the world trying to stop children from dying in my arms from hunger.
And I'm seeing that now happen in Gaza.
And I see that it's because of a policy, a human-made policy.
And so when we go to these people and confront them, it's with all sincerity.
It's to say, please stop.
Punishing the children.
We just had a call last night with a group called Doctors Against Genocide, and they had doctors on from Gaza, and it was so heartbreaking to listen to them telling us that the healthcare system has totally collapsed, that cancer patients can't get any medicines.
If you have a kidney failure, you're not going to get dialysis.
If you have a heart attack, you're not going to get treatment.
And that children are wasting away.
This is so inhumane, so wrong.
And yet when we confront members of Congress, they reply to us with these ridiculous things like we are supporters of Hamas or self-hating Jews.
Or you're funded by the Chinese Communist Party, and therefore you need to be banned from Capitol Hill.
I've often argued that there's a class of speech that the government hates and fears.
And that's the speech it wants to suppress.
And the First Amendment prohibits the government from evaluating the content of speech.
Congress shall make no law.
Doesn't no law mean no law?
They would just as soon suppress your speech as have to deal with you like Nancy Mace just did.
That's so true, Judge.
And that's why they...
Are trying to have us investigated.
They're trying all kinds of lawfare lawsuits against us and other groups like us.
They are trying.
Of course, we see what they are doing to the students in the universities, which is just unthinkable.
And yet it's happening.
So we are so disturbed about the huge chasm that exists between.
What is right and moral to do, what the majority of Americans show in the opinion polls that they want to happen, and what our government is doing.
And now Israel is proposing to deal with this humanitarian crisis because they're getting a lot of pressure by a new scheme.
I don't know if you've been following them, but they're talking about letting only 60 trucks in a day.
It used to be 600 before October 7th, and it was 600 during the ceasefire.
And they would be distributed by armed guards that are U.S. contractors.
And of course, all the humanitarian organizations in the U.S., the U.N. are saying, no, we can't do this.
This violates all humanitarian principles.
But this is what Israel is now proposing.
Here's you confronting arguably one of the architects of the slaughter in Gaza.
a member of the Netanyahu regime by the name of Itamar Ben-Gavir.
You are responsible, you kill baby, you kill baby, you kill baby, you are a racial, you are a war criminal, you are war criminal, you are a war criminal, you are a war criminal, you have abuse hatred, you are a war criminal and you are hurting all the people.
My religion, my religion as a Jew, you are creating the anti-Semitism.
I never supported 9/11.
Baby killer, extremist, racist, ethnic leader, war, eclectic, genocide.
Get out of our house!
We don't want you here!
What is the basis for this absurd argument you support 9 /11?
Well, I guess it's because they say you support Hamas, and Hamas are Muslims, and 9-11, Muslims.
I think it's part of that attack, kind of attack.
But I do want to say, Judge, that Ben Gavir is the one person in the Knesset when they brought up this horrible plan about only letting 60 trucks in a day.
He is the one who voted against it.
And you know why?
Because he says there should be no humanitarian, no aid, no food.
Why is it that normal international law and international norms are not enforced against Israel?
Well, I just want to say one more thing about Ben Gavir before we go there, which is it was so insulting to see him not only in our Congress, but meeting with important people in Congress, like Brian Mast, who is the head of the Foreign Affairs Committee.
Oh, God.
Brian Mast parades around the House of Representatives wearing an IDF uniform.
Well, that's right, but he has a very important role right now.
He met with four different members of Congress, and he met in Mar-a-Lago with two members of Congress who were very important, with Congressman Emmer, who was number three in the Republican Party.
So it is so disgusting that somebody like Ben Gavir would be getting a reception in Mar-a-Lago and then in the Congress.
And I'm sorry, going back to your question now?
I don't even remember what the question was that I asked you before this, but I'll...
Why is Israel not subject to international...
Why is Israel not subject to enforcement of international norms?
How can they use starvation as a weapon of war when it's expressly condemned by treaties to which Israel is a party?
Well, and we've seen this happening since October 8th.
Well, we saw it way before.
I mean, Israel has been in violation of international law for decades with the occupation, and since October 7th has been in violation of so many international laws.
But let's ask a more important question, which is the violation of our U.S. laws, and why does the U.S. continue to support Israel when it's violating U.S. laws?
We have laws that we're not allowed to give to support to a country that is not allowing international aid, and international aid coming from the U.S. government.
You know all those trucks that are lined up on the Egyptian side of the Rafa border, many of them were financed with U.S. taxpayer money, and Israel is not allowing those in.
And so we are violating international law, our own laws, and of course Israel has been violating.
This gets back to the short answer to why.
It's because of the iron grip that the donor class has on Congress and even on the presidency.
As wealthy as Trump is, he accepted $100 million from Mrs. Adelson.
And Biden, of course, was notoriously wedded at the hip with whoever was the head of the Zionist regime.
The Freedom Flotilla and a ship called the Conscience.
What's that about and what happened?
Well, you know, there have been attempts since 2008 to break this siege of Gaza.
The siege of Gaza did not start on October 8th.
It has been ongoing.
And so since 2008, there have been attempts to take boats in.
In the beginning...
Some of the boats, very small ones, actually made it in.
But then Israel decided it would not allow any boats to come in and has been blocking them.
And in fact, in 2010, when there was a huge ship called the Mavi Marmara that had 550 people on board and there were other ships with it, which is why it was called the flotilla, the Israeli Navy commandos boarded that ship and killed 10 people on board.
This is a civilian ship.
And ever since then, there have been attempts to send ships in.
And Israel has boarded those, taken the people captive, hostage, taken them to jail, deported them, and confiscated the boats.
And so this is part of a long attempt to break that siege by sea.
And this boat, the Conscience, was supposed to have left from Malta.
It was anchored in international waters.
There were 12 crew members and six passengers on board, and there were dozens more passengers, including my partner, Ty Barry, who were scheduled to get on that ship.
They had smaller boats to take them out there, but the night before is when they were attacked.
And they were attacked by drones.
It seems very, very plausible that this C-130 plane that was Israeli, that has been shown to have been in the area, flying low, hovering over there, dropped the drones, which damaged the ship.
And now there are negotiations ongoing with the Maltese government to bring the ship into the port, to have it fixed, and to allow it to sail.
And is it true that they want to fix it at sea rather than bring it into a port?
That's true.
I never heard of that.
That's what the Maltese government initially wanted to do.
It seems like they are backing down and going to allow the ship to come into port to be repaired.
But there's a lot of negotiations going on.
And as you can imagine, both the U.S. government and the Israelis are putting a lot of pressure on the government of Malta.
To not allow the ship to set sail again, certainly.
And we need to have a flag for the ship because it had a flag from Palau.
That flag was pulled, just like in the past attempts.
I was on several attempts to get to Gaza by ship, one in Greece, one in Turkey.
And we had our flags pulled at the last minute by the pressure from the Israeli and U.S. governments.
Wow.
Medea Benjamin, you are a personal hero.
You are the incarnation of personal courage.
Thank you for your devotion to this cause.
You're very popular with the viewers of this show.
As you know, we hope you'll come back again and visit us soon.
Well, thank you so much for having me on, Judge.
And I hope people will look up Code Pink and join us in our efforts to stop the support for the terrible things that are going on right now in Gaza and to stop the wars like you have been trying to do on your great show.
Thank you.
All the best to you, Medea.
Thank you.
Great woman.
The personification of personal courage.
Coming up this afternoon at 2 o 'clock, Larry Johnson at 4 o 'clock.
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