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Aug. 13, 2024 - Judging Freedom - Judge Andrew Napolitano
29:59
Pepe Escobar : Will China Help the Palestinians?
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Hi, everyone.
Judge Andrew Napolitano here for Judging Freedom.
Today is Tuesday, August 13, 2024.
Pepe Escobar, the great Pepe Escobar, will be with us in just a moment to talk about a very surprising and interesting development not covered in the Western press, Chinese diplomacy helping the Palestinians.
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Pepe, my dear friend, welcome here.
Safe travels, of course, but glad you're able to do a little pit stop and spend some time with us.
My pleasure.
Thank you.
I do want to speak with you about the Chinese diplomacy aiding the Palestinians.
But before we get there...
Can you shed some light on this?
How serious is this invasion of Russia by Ukraine?
Is it a serious military setback for the Russians as the Western press is portraying it?
Or is it just a PR stunt for negotiating purposes concocted by the Ukrainians?
Essentially, Judge, it's a costly PR stunt.
In the beginning, the public opinion in Russia, in telegram channels, military channels, public opinion in general, people were stunned, of course.
There was a lot of alarm.
A lot of people were saying, no, now they are invading us and Russia did absolutely nothing.
The Ministry of Defense did absolutely nothing.
Well, it was very easy to invade that part of the border because the border is protected basically by guards, by police, by Guardia, Russia and local police.
So it's very easy to cross.
Obviously, the Russians knew that this would happen.
They have the best electronic surveillance system anywhere.
So it took us a while to understand where this was going.
And after, what, six days or so, they let it happen.
They knew that troops were being diverted from Donbass to that border to cross all the way to the Kursk nuclear power station.
They let it happen.
And of course, there was a tremendous loss of face involved in all that.
But this was the price that had to be paid for organizing a trap for the Ukrainians.
And after six days, it's absolutely clear that this is a trap.
And the commanders at the front, the best commanders, were annihilated in a matter of a day or two.
The Russians started to attack the rear.
And now everybody that is in the middle is being more or less encircled, and they will be dealt in a counter-terrorist operation mode, that is, take no prisoners.
So is it fair to say that the Kiev invaders are now surrounded by Russian troops?
Essentially.
This is according to the best information from military correspondents on the ground.
The Russian Ministry of Defense is a much more complicated situation because there is, let's call it what it is, there is military censorship.
Certain issues are considered state secrets.
They are not available to independent observers, not even to military correspondents.
And they are slow.
They're usually very, very slow compared to what's happening on the ground.
But after a few days and after, people start to put together the pieces of the puzzle in terms of what kind of brigades were advancing, how many, etc.
Okay, it is serious in a sense because they advanced roughly 12 kilometers inside Kursk and 40 kilometers wide.
But it's a relatively small area.
It's nothing.
It's smaller than the city of Lisbon.
Just to give an idea to all of you.
Did this damage President Putin politically?
Yes, it does in a sense that the Minister of Defense was caught napping.
Let's go straight to the point.
How deep the problem is, how much aligned it is with Nobody knows for the moment.
But I'm sure there's going to be an extra purge after the situation is settled.
let's say in the next few weeks or so.
This is very complicated because the Ministry of Defence was totally focused on the way the And they were not paying attention to Sumy, Kursk, you know, these regions.
And the Ukrainians, of course, knew it.
And let's say, as a sort of desperate gamble, okay, let's go where it's not police and the Russians are not paying attention.
So if this was better organized, it could have been a major, major upset.
But it was not.
Even though they sacrificed some of their best commanders and brigades for this mini-invasion, let's put it this way.
Is there pressure on President Putin from those to the right of him, the more pronounced nationalists, to respond with a very heavy fist?
Yes, there is.
And the very heavy fist is that the whole region now is a part of a count.
It's directly involved and subject to a counter-terrorist operation.
Thus the take-no-prisoners subtext.
They're going to kill everybody in sight.
Especially because Ukrainian prisoners of war The past two days, especially, they were saying that they had orders to kill or at least shoot civilians in their legs.
So this was an anti-Russian civilian operation, and this has enraged Russian public opinion like, you know, like there's no tomorrow.
So everyone expects really a hardcore take-no-prisoners op.
Let's say, let's have an ending in the next 10 days or so, Max.
Wow.
Here's President Putin late last week.
No, I'm sorry.
Here's President Putin yesterday.
Yesterday.
Forget it.
After this, no more peace talks.
Cut number seven.
It seems obvious right now why the Kyiv regime Also why they denied any peaceful intermediaries from engaging in this conversation.
The Ukrainian government is following the will of the West and its masters in the West.
It's the West that's fighting us using the hands of the Ukrainians.
They're trying to improve their negotiating positions in the future.
But what negotiations could we even talk about with people who are attacking civilians, civilian infrastructure, or trying to create threats for nuclear industry facilities?
What is there to even talk about with them?
Oh, well, he's right, Pepe.
What are we going to talk about with people that are trying to kill our civilians, destroy our civilian infrastructure, and threaten our nuclear industry facilities?
Did, in your opinion, President Zelensky have the fanciful idea that he could take part of Russia and trade it in negotiations for the parts of Ukraine?
That are now Russian-occupied.
Absolutely.
And the people at the SBU, absolutely the same thing.
If we had a headline for the clip that you just showed, Judge, basically that would be the headline.
Putin declares Ukraine a terrorist state.
This is essentially what he did.
And so now, theoretically, gloves are really off.
And this is matching public sentiment, in fact, because this is an invasion of a sovereign part of the Russian Federation with civilians killed, civilians encircled, taken prisoners, killed, etc.
So it's crazy because we have practically a new red line being infringed week after week by Ukraine.
And the way that...
Because now the West and NATO Plan B is to turn this into a war of terror.
I wrote about that last week, basically saying that the forever wars are turning into wars of terror in Gaza and in Ukraine.
So now there's no sense in, you know, it has to be gloves off, especially because Russia has a window from now to, let's say, the next three months to collapse completely the 1,000 -kilometer-long front line in Donbass.
They have a real chance of that happening.
So, and the feeling that you get when you are in Moscow discussing with people close to power or diplomats or businessmen, this is an almost war.
And we need to go to the head of the snake and we need to solve this thing maximum to the end of the year.
Now it's pressing.
And so, you know, if we have a smoking gun proving that Russian intelligence and electronic surveillance knew about this Ukrainian move in Kurs and let it happen because they knew that the trap would be perfect and it would accelerate later on the collapse of the front, then this would be, I would say, a military masterpiece.
We still don't know that.
Okay.
Switching gears, what is...
What has China been doing diplomatically to help the Palestinians?
Why don't we know about this in the West?
Exactly, because it was not reported, especially in the West, it was not reported at all, right, Church?
This was very, very important.
It was in late July.
This was a reception of 14 Palestinian factions.
All of them.
The ones that people know.
Hamas, Front of Liberation of Palestine, etc.
Islamic Jihad, etc.
All of them invited to Beijing, meeting in person with Wang Yi, Minister of Foreign Relations, and with Xi Jinping, and signing formally a Beijing Declaration where they commit to fight for a unified Palestine and then a unified sovereign Palestinian state,
meaning essentially, okay, forget about all those internal squabbles, especially between Fatah and Hamas, work together for the benefit of Palestine as a whole.
And this was signed with the imprimatur.
Of China, with the personal guarantee of President Xi Jinping.
And that's what makes the assassination of Han Yeh, only a few days later, in Tehran, as a diplomatic guest of the Iranians, so serious.
Because the Chinese interpreted it as loss of face for China and a major slap on the face.
By Israel on China.
People who understand how Asia works and how the notion of respect and loss of faith in every aspect, especially diplomatically, is taken so seriously.
In the West, people have no idea how much of an affront is that.
And that explains, for instance, a phone call yesterday, this Monday.
Ali Bagheri Kani, the current, let's say, the caretaker, Iranian foreign minister, and Wang Yi.
On the phone, Bagheri Kani called Wang Yi, and Wang Yi said, look, China is totally behind you, totally behind Palestine, and totally behind Iranian sovereignty.
What does that mean?
Translation, that whatever Iran does, What does that mean practically?
Does it mean public relations?
Does it mean Chinese military assistance?
Does it mean Chinese troops?
No, it does not, Judge.
It means total diplomatic support.
Total geopolitical support, but the ones who are doing the heavy lifting in terms of military support are the Russians.
Why?
Because this is part of the Russia-China strategic partnership, comprehensive at all levels, including military, and including something very, very important: the strategic partnership that both of these BRICs have with Iran.
So we have a series of interlocking strategic partnerships.
Iran-Russia, Iran-China, China-Iran.
So helping Iran diplomatically and geopolitically is China's modus operandi in this particular Palestine-involved setup.
And Russia is also involved militarily.
all those Russian cargo planes that landed in Iran these past few days, especially last week.
And the fact that most certainly we don't have a smoking gun yet, but it's almost certain that the Murmansk system of jamming electronic, NATO's electronic and Israeli electronic set up all across the spectrum to the...
So this is really, really, really serious.
Of course.
What you have just described.
Yes.
It's the American State Department, the American Department of Defense, and the White House know about it.
I'm talking about the interlocking diplomatic relationships.
From and after the Beijing Declaration uncovered in the Western press, does the U.S. government know about this?
Do they grasp the seriousness of it?
If they do, Judge, they don't let it know.
So there are two possibilities.
Either they know vaguely about it and dismiss it.
Which is something that you can understand from the point of view of American exceptionalism and considering the other and the others as low lives, essentially.
Or they actually don't know because they don't understand the details.
And this is quite possible considering that they're on the ground intelligence in terms of how the politburo works in China and how the Supreme Court works.
It's very, very sketchy.
The hard-right members of Prime Minister Netanyahu's government are still calling for the obliteration of Gaza.
Finance Minister Smotrich said just last week we should be able to starve the two million of them to death.
I'm not sure the world would allow it, but we should be able to do it.
If this genocidal, maniacal attitude gets any worse, what will the Chinese do about it?
They will be forced to do something, let's say, one step beyond mere diplomatic and geopolitical support.
Because we can read what's happening in West Asia.
As a segment of the war against the BRICS.
Three of the major BRICS are directly involved.
Iran, Russia, and China.
China with diplomatic geopolitical support.
Russia even with military support to Iran.
The interlocking strategic partnerships.
And Iran at the vanguard of the axis of resistance.
So the response to the assassination of Han Yeh.
It will be led, and not exactly led from behind by Iran, but it will include Hezbollah.
It will include Hashtal Shabir from Iraq.
It will include the Ansarallah Houthis.
So it's an axis.
And Iran is more or less, let's say, the organizer of this axis.
This all goes back to General Soleimani.
No wonder General Soleimani was assassinated.
Because the people with the brain in the Pentagon, they knew how crucial he was to organize all that.
Everything that is happening in front of us now.
Will Beijing be supplying military hardware to Tehran?
We don't think so, at least at the moment, at this stage.
Because Russia is doing it.
And the Iranians don't ask.
The Iranians are very proud of all their accomplishments.
For instance, if you look at what the Iranians are presenting this week at the Army show in Russia, well, they have their latest drone, stuff that nobody else has, for instance.
Missile defense and all that.
The Iranians have everything it takes.
What they don't have, there are two things.
The latest hypersonic missiles.
That the Russians have and the Iranians are still perfecting.
And a system like the Murmansk, which is a mega jamming device.
And if they got this, which is practically certain that they got through these shipments these past few days, that's all they need.
Everything else they produce internally, which is quite impressive when you compare also to North Korea.
Everything that North Koreans have, they produce internally.
To take a step back from the granular conversation we've just been having and ask you to share your thoughts comparing and contrasting the Chinese diplomacy and interlocking relationships and alliances with the American Congress's rapturous embrace of Prime
Minister Netanyahu calling for more genocide.
Well, it's the perspective of the day after or maximum next week with the perspective of a civilization state with 5,000 years of diplomacy behind them.
And the fact that they see what do these forever wars mean?
Who are the targets?
For a long time, the targets were the lands of Islam and even Islam itself.
And for the past two and a half years, the main target is Russia.
And the next target will be them, China.
They read American internal politics very, very well.
Not only the Politburo, but the main Chinese think tanks.
You know, at the main universities or the Chinese Academy of Social Sciences, they have America and America specialists at the highest level.
And many of them spent a long time in the U.S. and in the West, and they understand the West very, very well.
And they understand the logic of the forever wars, in fact.
So they are thinking ahead, just like they do.
Five-year plans in sequence, for instance, you know, only a few days ago they were planning everything until 2035.
They have to plan the next stages of this forever wars, which will include them directly.
Not only South China Sea, not only provocations using Taiwan, but provocations with Chinese neighbors and another example, which just happened.
What just happened in Bangladesh, which was a color revolution, where the two main targets of this color revolution are India and China.
At the same time, two BRICS again.
So they understand that this is a war, the forever wars now are forever wars against the BRICS especially, and the most important BRICS.
The most important BRICS are four BRICS: Russia, China, India and Iran.
And the Chinese understand that.
And the main problem for the BRICS is that inside BRICS and inside the SCO, they need, let's say, a concerted position and a concerted diplomacy, geopolitical and geoeconomic offensive.
Well integrated among them, and that includes these strategic partnerships.
They know who they are up against.
They know the crisis in the US and in the West as a whole.
They know about the pyramid of derivatives.
They know about all that.
But the difference is the Russians are on the front line because there is a hot war on their Western borders.
And for the Chinese, the war is still very, very far away.
But why they are Unite, and we are behind you.
Here is Russian Foreign Minister Sergey Lavrov.
This is just a few weeks ago, but with a, I think you'll agree, excellent grasp of America's view of its own hegemony.
He's at the UN.
When the United States entered the world stage in Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya, how did it end?
What peaceful changes for the better occurred there?
Now when they repeat like a mantra, we will support Ukraine for as long as it takes.
I'm curious, how long will it take?
Like in Afghanistan, where it took 20 years to realize that you lost, or in Iraq, where you also left, although now you are trying to stay despite the Iraqi parliament's decision that the US should withdraw its troops.
Or like in Libya where the state collapsed and now everyone is trying to piece it back together.
A multipolar world is a reality.
It's not something someone invented.
He's got an excellent grasp on what's going on.
Last question.
You and I have not spoken since Prime Minister Netanyahu received 58 standing ovations in an hour-long speech at the U.S. Congress, a response that our colleague and friend, Professor Jeff Sachs, described as rapturous.
Yes.
And the longest of those, it was terrible, the longest of those standing ovations was when he condemned the freedom of speech, condemning the demonstrators outside the building.
How did the world, not the West, the rest of the world, Especially around here,
in Southeast Asia, in Asia as a whole, in Central Asia, in West Asia, for obvious reasons, across Eurasia, most of Africa and great parts of Latin America.
This was the graphic illustration of a perpetual wag the dog, in fact, where we don't know who the dog is and where the tail of the dog is and which way they're going.
This was really tragic from the point of view of the image of America as a beacon of fairness, freedom, liberty, etc.
One situation like this, just take 58 standing ovations to destroy your record, practically forever, in fact.
I think the U.S. will never recover from what happened.
You cannot endorse a genocide in the 21st century, period.
And this is what we saw.
My dear friend, Pepe Escobar, thank you very much.
What a pleasure.
I almost forgot how much I missed you.
You were in Como.
You were in Como.
Come on.
So good.
Thank you very much, my dear friend.
I hope we can catch up with you next week.
Absolutely.
Thank you very much.
Thank you all.
All the best.
Wow.
A great conversation that I'm privileged to have.
Previewing the rest of the day.
All times Eastern, of course, U.S. At noon, Colonel Lawrence Wilkerson.
At 2 o 'clock, Matt Ho.
At 3 o 'clock, Colonel Karen Kwiatkowski at 5 o 'clock, the aforementioned and always worth waiting for, Professor Jeffrey Sachs.
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