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May 16, 2021 - Jim Fetzer
56:49
Kelley Watt, Sandy Hook: A Mass Illusion (5 December 2020)
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This is Jim Fetzer, your host.
Welcome to the False Flag and Conspiracies 2020 virtual conference.
I'm very glad you could join us.
The concept of a false flag originated in pirate days, when in targeting a vessel, they would fly a friendly flag, and only when they were close enough To attack and board when they bring down the false flag and run up the skull and bones.
So the term false flag has come to refer to any deceptive action for which a party other than that officially assigned responsibility was in fact carrying out.
We have a history of false flag attacks, particularly here in the United States.
Especially since 2012.
But some obvious cases of our recent history include the assassination of JFK, which has blamed on a lone, demented gunman, a former Marine Corps corporal, who was actually a mediocre shot, and where the records have been withheld From the American people on the grounds of national security, which raises the anomaly that if the official account were true, there would be no national security aspect to it.
Similarly, 9-11.
We were told 19 Islamic terrorists attacked the country under the control of a guy off in Afghanistan in a cage.
But it would turn out that Osama Bin Laden was actually our man in Afghanistan, responsible for the transfer of the Stinger missiles to the hands of the Mujahideen that they would use to shoot down Soviet helicopters and planes and drive them out of that nation, which has never been conquered, whether by Alexander the Great, the Soviet Union, or the United States, where withdrawing our troops appears to be a very appropriate Action to be taking in relation to the longest war in which the United States has ever been militarily engaged.
A few notes about the program for today.
Tony Meade had an unchangeable conflict, it turned out, belatedly, so he will speak at 4 p.m.
Instead of this morning, I will fill in His place.
In addition, in the evening, James Tracy, his appeal of his Sandy Hook lawsuit, his dismissal by Florida Atlantic, was denied, and it's very difficult for him to cope with, and he's not really set to address it.
Therefore, He has been replaced by Scott Bennett, who previously was going to be presenting on Sunday, where Scott will be talking about grand theft election and the 14th Amendment.
We begin this morning with our first speaker.
I'm very pleased A woman by the name of Kelly Watt, who's proven to be very original and penetrating in her Sandy Hook research, making a number of very fundamental disclosures, having something to do in part with her background, as having her own home and commercial cleaning service, which led her to initially ask,
Knowing that blood is a biohazard and has to be disposed of in a very meticulous fashion from the original source where the blood was located to its ultimate disposition and began raising questions about it with the state of Connecticut, which no one was able to answer.
Kelly, it's a great pleasure to have you here today.
Welcome to False Facts and Conspiracy in 2020.
Well, thank you.
It's early here where I live in Tulsa, Oklahoma, and I've had out of town guests and things happening.
So, um, bear with me.
Okay.
And, um, anyway, so I'd kind of like to get started because whenever I tell people that I'm a Sandy Hook researcher, the first question they ask me is, how did you, what made you interested?
What got you involved in this?
And I came to realize through speaking at quite some length with a New York Times reporter who was interviewing me for a book she's writing.
We kind of, after I gave her in-depth interviews, it was my love of children.
I've always been involved with children's activities, selling a lot of children's clothes, working at children's stores, teaching gymnastics, being a campfire girl leader before I even had my own children.
Um, everything I've always done has been centered around children.
So when Sandy Hook came up, I was working full time, uh, in residential and commercial cleaning business that I've owned for 26 years.
And, um, because I work days and because I work nights, when Sandy Hook happened, I didn't get to see a lot of the television coverage because I wasn't home.
So it was in this the the supposed shooting happened on December 14th of 2012 and um and so it was a so it's about January like maybe three weeks later it was really cold and um I was up at our up at the lake and it was I usually go fishing but it was too cold so I decided I'm gonna look and see what happened to those four children and to um Kind of catch up on the story.
So the first thing I did, I got out my iPad and I typed in Sandy Hook School Shooting.
And the first video that came up was Anderson Cooper on CNN.
And so I clicked on his video and he just happened to be interviewing or not interviewing, but he was talking about Dr. James Tracy, the professor from Florida's Atlantic University.
And in talking about how he didn't think that this really happened and that he taught media and I believe communications at Atlantic University.
So, I was just really interested in that.
So, I cut off of Anderson Cooper when I heard him say that this professor didn't believe that it happened.
I thought how interesting and he had mentioned his blog site.
So, I got off and went to Dr. Tracy's blog site and he didn't have very much at the time.
In fact, all I recall that he had was the video of a press release that he had transcribed and you could watch the actual press conference of Dr. Wayne Carver, the Connecticut State Medical Examiner.
And so I clicked on that and I started watching that.
And I was just, I couldn't believe what I was watching.
That a medical examiner in a 20 minute press conference Didn't seem to have a clue as to what he was talking about.
I started counting the amount of times that he said the word, uh, in a 20 minute press conference, he said the word, uh, uh, 150 times.
So to me, if a person really knows what they're talking about, you really don't need to say the word, uh, that many times.
So that just bothered me.
And then the content that he was saying, uh, the press conference, People were, reporters were saying, Dr. Carver, Dr. Carver, could you tell us what the kids were wearing that day?
And he just replied, he laughed and chuckled as he did throughout the 20 minutes.
And he said that they were wearing cute kid clothes.
And they asked him what caliber of bullets were used.
And he said, That he was an expert and he knew more than his peers in this field.
But every time he was asked to testify about it in court, he was told to sit down.
So he was going to leave that question to the state troopers.
Then he was asked how many of the children were boys and how many were girls that had been killed.
And he didn't know the answer to that.
Even though he just finished their autopsies.
So, things to me just were not adding up.
So, I keep looking, I keep researching, I keep going to YouTube looking at videos of the whole event.
I went to, by this time a few more days had passed and somebody had put up a video of the people that had gathered.
I thought it was really odd because instead of the police and everything telling people To, you know, pick their kids up at the school or whatever.
They were told everybody stay away from the school.
Don't anybody go near the school.
Ambulances, don't go near the school.
Fire trucks, don't go.
FBI, search and rescue, everybody stay away from the school.
And they centered the whole thing up the road at the firehouse.
And by this time I'd seen a video of the crowds walking In and out of the firehouse.
They would go in one door and out the other door and just recirculating people, using the same people over and over to make it appear that there was a huge crowd there.
And so when I saw that video, I called the fire department in Sandy Hook and told them who I was.
And the first question they asked me was, did I vote for Obama?
And again, I'm thinking this is weird.
I'm not calling about Obama.
I told them I'm calling about The people at the firehouse, and why does it appear that they're walking in circles in one door and out the other?
They said, are you a conspiracy theorist?
And I said, again, what does this have to do with my question?
So they finally hung up on me, which led me to start making more and more phone calls at this point.
And so one of the phone calls that I decided to make, being in the cleaning business, commercial and residential, was, like Jim pointed it out, At the beginning of this interview that they have to dispose of blood in a very specialized manner.
And so I was curious as to who got the contract to clean up this biohazard that was inside Sandy Hook School, because I had understood that the children remain deceased in the school the whole day and were not removed until after midnight.
So I called the The first call I made was to the Environmental Protection Agency in Connecticut.
They put me on hold when I asked them the question as to who got the contract to clean up the blood.
They told me, they put me on hold.
They sent me from person to person.
Everybody I asked, they sent me to somebody else.
So finally, somebody said, I would suggest that you call Lieutenant Paul Vance with the Connecticut State Police.
So he was the spokesperson for the Connecticut State Police.
So I called Lieutenant Paul Vance, told him who I was, and I asked him, who cleaned up the blood at Sandy Hook?
And he said, what blood?
And I said, well, 26 people were murdered there, supposedly, that blood.
And he said, are you a conspiracy theorist?
And I said, no.
And he says, well, I stepped over those dead babies.
To which I replied, I don't think you did.
So after that conversation, he told me to call the Major Crime Squad of Western Connecticut to get the answer as to who cleaned up the blood because he did not know.
So I called the Major Crime Squad of Western Connecticut and they couldn't tell me either.
So I started calling the press.
Then they did an article as to who got the contract to clean up the blood.
They said that it was the FBI.
So I called the FBI in Oklahoma City and said if there was a mass shooting, a serial killing, and there was, you know, hazardous materials, biohazards, Who would clean up the blood?
I said, do you all actually, FBI agents, do you guys actually go there with string mops and hazmat suits and do that yourself?
And he said, oh, absolutely not.
He said, we would call in a service that's highly trained to do that, such as Aftermath.
And if you go to the website of, say, Aftermath, which is a company that cleans up biohazards after suicides and shootings and stuff like this, It's a very, very, very specialized field.
You have to have extensive training, psychological and emotional and otherwise, you get paid a ton of money to do it because it's a job nobody wants.
So, just, you know, things we're not adding up.
So, I start making more and more phone calls.
I start noticing more and more things.
I start noticing that these parents are giving interviews and none of the parents have any Kleenexes in their hands.
Most people, when they cry, are going to talk about their children who have passed away.
I just attended my ex-husband's funeral last Sunday, and we've been divorced since 2004.
I bawled like a baby.
I was up at the podium giving a eulogy, and I went through six or seven Kleenexes.
These parents, none of them have Kleenexes.
So again, I'm thinking this is too weird.
Nothing's adding up.
I start looking very closely at the parents and what they look like, And I came to the conclusion these are not parents of six-year-old children.
The parents have, the men have receding hairlines, they have wrinkled faces, weathered faces, they have gray mustaches, or they're completely bald-headed.
The women are dressed very, the women are dressed like they're in their 40s, late 40s or 50s.
You don't see women with messy buns.
You don't see You know, uh, Tory Burch jewelry on them or anything like that.
No designer clothes, no holes in the jeans.
They dress very, you know, pearls.
They dress very, uh, just like a, uh, a 50 or 60 year old woman would dress.
And I started noticing this in all the parents.
So I thought that was weird.
So one day I was home doing some research on Sandy Hook.
And I got really interested in Chalk Hill School.
And Chalk Hill School was the school that was located seven miles away from Sandy Hook in Monroe, Connecticut.
And they said in the newspaper that they'd opened up on January 3rd.
And remember, the school shooting happened on December 14th of 2012.
And they had to renovate a school that had been closed for quite some time.
And it was called Chalk Hill.
And so the newspaper articles that they ran on Chalk Hill, they talked and mentioned things like because they were renovating it from a middle school and they were going to make it accessible now to the students of Sandy Hook since their school was closed now due to the shooting.
The kids had to go to school somewhere, right?
So the children went to the school called Chalk Hill.
It said in the newspaper that because it had been a middle school and they were turning it into an elementary school, that they use volunteers to come in and paint the school.
And they managed to get all these parents in there working at the school.
Now, keep in mind, it was during the Christmas season.
It was 11 days before Christmas.
It was very, very cold.
There had just been a mass shooting of elementary school students and their beloved teachers, including their school principal.
And these parents all got together and started, you know, painting the walls and lowering the toilets.
And one article said they lowered the toilets and another article said they put in risers so the kids could reach the toilets.
They lowered the basketball goals.
They did all this work on this school so I decided that I was going to call Chalk Hill because at this time I'd come to the conclusion that there was no Sandy Hook, that the school I learned by this time had been permanently closed years before.
So I'm thinking there can't be anybody at Chalk Hill if there's nobody at Sandy Hook.
So I called Chalk Hill first to see if I could enroll my children.
I told them I was moving there and I purchased a house across the street.
And what did I need to do to get my kids enrolled?
And they said, Oh, you can't, your kids can't come here.
This is only for Sandy Hook kids.
And so, because I knew there weren't any Sandy Hook kids.
And so I knew that this had to be a lie.
So I decided to research.
Chalk Hill School and to see because there are so many discrepancies about the school the things that have been done to it in the in the local newspapers.
So and I'm thinking parents can't go in there and scrape lead paint off built off the walls and repaint it and do all this fixing up of Chalk Hill.
It just there's no way parents could do that during a time of crisis and everything.
They hadn't even buried the the town's children.
And yet these parents are over there supposedly slapping paint on the school and getting it all, you know, fixed up to open on January the 3rd.
So I called Chalk Hill and, well actually near me, I used to walk this park and they were, there was a school that had been, it was a middle school and it had been changed into an elementary school.
It was called Eisenhower International School.
So, as I would walk the park over a six-month period, you know, I was thinking to myself, boy, they've really been there a long time renovating the school, and yet Sandy Hook, Chalk Hill, got done in three weeks.
They renovated their school because the school in Tulsa near me was also a middle school, and it had been turned into an elementary school, and this went on for months and months, if not a year, and yet Chalk Hill's done in three weeks and ready for down to the So I called the Tulsa Public Schools to get some figures on how much it cost to renovate the school, how long it took, and I was told to call the school bond department.
The bond department handles all that.
So I talked to the head of the bond department and he told me that They've been working on the school, you know, for like six months and that he told me how much it cost and I said, could a school be opened that had been closed and was a middle school and they were changing it to an elementary school?
Could that be done in three weeks time during a Christmas holiday using volunteers?
And he said, ma'am, he said it would take three weeks just to get the permits.
He said there's no way that work could have been completed in three In three weeks.
So what school are you talking about?
Is this in Tulsa?
And I said, no, I explained that this was Sandy Hook Elementary School in Connecticut.
And he said, it's impossible.
There's no way that school could have been ready and renovated.
So, um, I called Chalk Hill and I was just going to kind of let them know of the research that I'd done and that there's no way that was an operating school.
And so I placed this call to Chalk Hill and said, I'd like to speak to somebody in the bond department.
And, or I actually told them I wanted to speak to somebody about the renovations and they said, you need to call the school board.
So I looked at some of the school board members and I thought, no, no, that's not who I call.
You call the bond department.
So, because I'd made a little note on a sticky note and put it in my, and had it in my kitchen to Call the Tulsa bond department.
And that was the number that I was, that was the department I was supposed to call when I'd called the Tulsa public schools.
So I had written that on a sticky note and I had it in my kitchen.
So I called Chalk Hill and I just said, I need to speak to the bond department.
And she, um, they, they didn't put me through to the bond department for some reason.
I can't remember.
It's been a long time, eight years.
So I, um, After that, I couldn't get through to talk to anybody in the bond department, and about four hours later, I'm sitting in my living room doing research on Sandy Hook, and I get this loud pounding on my front door, and I hear some men's voices hollering my name, and I thought, what in the heck?
So, I went to the front door, and there's three men standing there, and they opened up my Glass storm door, and they asked me if I was, if my name was Kelly, and I said yes, and they entered my home.
They came into my living room and asked me what I had done that day, and I said, I cleaned a home, and what, who are you, and what's this about?
And I was scared.
I was just petrified.
I've got these three men standing in my living room asking me what I've done.
I was speechless.
I couldn't even think.
I couldn't have even told you my name.
You know, I was just so confused by the whole thing.
And they asked me again, what did you do today?
And I said, I worked.
And they said, did you call Sandy Hook?
And I said, yes, I did.
And they said, and what did you say?
And I was so I was shocked at all this.
I was just stunned.
I was speechless.
Like I said, I couldn't even have remembered my name.
And they said, you called them and what did you say?
And they said, we have it on recording.
You were recorded.
And I said, well, because I can't think right now, could you, if you just play like just a little bit of the recording, then I will remember it.
So they played it.
A little bit of it.
And I said, Oh, okay.
Yes.
I know exactly.
Yes.
I called and asked for the bond department and they said the what?
And I said, I called to ask for the bond department.
And they said, you mean you did call and threatened to, to, uh, to use a bomb?
And I said, no, I said, there's even a note in there in my kitchen that says call Tulsa bond department as a reminder.
And you can go in there and see that little note.
And so, They were very, very embarrassed and they left quickly after that.
They did a real quick look at my house.
They didn't even go upstairs or anything.
They said, well, just when we drove up, we didn't think that this looked like a house that would be building a bomb or anything.
So, um, you know, just one thing.
And then another time I was sitting there researching again and I get this message that pops up on Google Plus and it said that Lenny Posner, which was one of the fathers of a deceased child, supposedly at Sandy Hook, it said he was following me on Google Plus.
So, I hit the reply button and I said, why are you following me?
Is it because you know that I don't believe your story and I don't believe that these kids died and that Sandy Hook was even in existence, was operating?
And he Proceeded to tell me that he was the father of a dead child and he had shoveled sand on top of the son's grave.
And that he indeed have, he did indeed have a son who passed away.
And I said, I just don't believe that there's too much evidence that shows that this didn't happen.
Um, there's just too many things.
And he said, no, he told me, you know, it happened and we talked and sent emails back and forth for like six months.
And, um, you know, like, and we got to be, you know, friendly with each other, but he knew every day I would confront him and say, you're lying.
I don't believe a word of what you're saying.
And yet he continued to call me.
We had text messages.
We emailed.
He sent me a video one day that said it was a movie, a Mel Gibson movie called Conspiracy Theory.
And I returned an email to him with a movie called Big Fat Liar.
And we laughed and joked about that and so one day I asked him if he would be willing to do a polygraph and I told him that I would pay for it and we were going to do it in a location in Florida.
So in Fort Myers.
So he agreed to do that.
And I called polygraphers and I had to make quite a few phone calls before I could find one that was willing to do it.
But I did find one and he told me that he would do it.
So, and I said, you know, you'll have to fly to Fort Myers.
And he'd agreed to do that.
Well, as it got closer to the time we were supposed to do it, he decided to cancel.
And I asked him why he was going to cancel.
And he said, because he didn't like to fly.
So I remembered on his Google Plus page, there was a picture of him and he was sitting on the beach sipping a margarita.
And I asked him, when was that picture taken?
And he told me it was six months after his son had supposedly died.
And I said, how did you get to Jamaica?
It was either Jamaica or the Bahamas.
And I said, so how did you get there?
And he says, I flew.
And I said, see how you lie?
I said, I thought you didn't like to fly.
So you can fly to sip a margarita on the beach in Jamaica six months after your son's death, but you can't fly to Fort Myers, Florida, which was where he was living at the time in Florida, but you can't fly to Fort Myers for a, for a polygraph.
So that was just more weirdness.
And, um, You know, just things, everything I started looking at and reading and videos, nothing was added up.
Nothing was adding up.
So I did more, I was trying to find areas of research that nobody had looked into, such as the Box Tops for Education Program.
And these are little box tops that you used to be able to clip from, now it's all digital, but at the time you clip them from boxes of Cheerios and Nature Valley granola bars and such, and the schools would collect these to raise money for playground equipment.
And so I decided to go to their website and type in, you know, it asks you what school are you looking for and look for the results of how much money they'd raised.
And Sandy Hook had raised zero money.
Which would be odd for an elementary school.
All the other schools in the nation participate in this program, and they all raise money, but nothing at Sandy Hook.
So, I just tried to really look at every aspect of this.
I called the media, every newspaper.
I mean, not just Connecticut, but everywhere.
And I was told the Connecticut newspapers threatened to sue me if I called them again.
I would ask them, why aren't the parents?
I said, if you're going to try to pull this off as though this were real, you need to at least place Kleenexes in parents' hands to make this more believable.
And one week later, Senator Joe Manchin had a meeting in his office, and he had six of his family, Koch families, in his office, and they were sitting around a coffee table.
And in the center of the coffee table was a box of posh puff tissues.
Senator Joe Manchin reaches over and acts like he's crying.
And he says that he has a grandson and he feels their pain and they pass the box of Kleenexes around making it a major prop.
So, and I just really felt like that was done because I'd just been calling them about the Kleenex issue and telling them to, um, you know, they had to use Kleenexes if they were going to try to make this seem like it really happened.
So just one thing after another kept happening.
And, um, I asked this father, Lenny Posner, I said, if your son really passed away, I would like to have a couple of documents.
And he asked, he said, well, I've just moved and they're all in storage.
And he said, what are you wanting?
And I said, well, I'd like to have a report card and I'd like to have your son's death certificate because they were sealed.
And I would like to have a picture of your wife as she is in the hospital holding both twins because this Lindy Posner's son who supposedly was killed had a twin sister.
And I said, I'd like to see a picture of your wife in the hospital when these twins are, you know, were born.
So the very next day, even though they were in storage, he managed to send me An email, and in the email was a copy of the death certificate.
And it was missing, I believe it was missing a file number.
And it was missing the signature of the county registrar.
And the report card, it had the school's address on it.
And it said Sandy Hook Elementary School.
And it had the, I believe it was 15 Dickinson Drive.
I could be wrong on that number.
It was Dickinson Drive and the word Dickinson was spelled wrong.
It was spelled D-I-C-K-E-N-S-O-N when the name of the street that it was located on was supposedly D-I-C-K-I-N-S-O-N.
So I'm thinking, okay, that's weird that that would be misspelled on a report card.
And so just nothing, nothing was adding up.
And the more phone calls I made, Everybody in the newspaper, before they started like not taking my phone calls, would just say, you know, there's nothing to see here.
Move on.
This happened.
You know, it happened.
We don't want to talk to you.
I was literally shut out by every newspaper.
I called papers in New York, New Jersey, Kansas.
All over the United States, you know, offering up evidence.
And I said, can I send you photos?
And they were like, no, I could just tell that there was a media blockout.
The media, I was thinking, had to have been involved in this because they're all, nobody's wanting to discuss any of this.
And that's just not with journalists who should be questioning things.
The fact that there wasn't a journalist in the country that was interested in asking any questions.
And I thought it was very strange that the shooter's name was Adam Lanza and his father's name was Peter Lanza.
And the school shooter killed himself and committed suicide, killed 26 people.
And nobody in the country except for the New Yorker is interested in interviewing the parents.
I mean, the parent of this serial killer.
You know, the BTK killer, Dennis Rader.
John Wayne Gacy, Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, every serial killer, Manson, they interview the parents because they want to get inside the mind of a serial killer to find out what makes them tick.
The only parent that they're not interested in interviewing is Peter Lanza.
Nobody's ever seen him.
There hasn't been any photos taken in eight years.
He worked for, I think, General Electric.
No suspicious secretary or, you know, anything like this ever took a picture of him in the cafeteria, in a restaurant, working in his cubicle.
There's never been a picture of Peter Lanza, I don't think, but one that anybody's ever published.
Oprah Winfrey's not interested in interviewing this parent.
Anderson Cooper's not interested in interviewing him.
you know nobody's interested he hasn't given nobody's talked to Peter Lanza except in a news in a in a new yorker magazine article where he still was not seen so i found that very concerning it's just been one thing after another for eight years i'm still researching Sandy Hook because i i just i just don't think that it happened i just think that's too You know, it's just too much of a hoax.
Even the principal's name, who was supposedly the first person to have seen the shooter walk into the school and, you know, start his killing spree, was the principal.
And her name was Dawn Hoaxsprung.
This happened at 9.32 in the morning, was the hoax sprung in the dawn.
I mean, just, it's so weird.
Everything about this whole story.
None of it makes any sense.
I can see it.
There was some anomalies and things happening here and there, but when you have so many things, uh, the school itself was just dilapidated.
The bushes were overgrown where children couldn't even, the school only went to the fourth grade K through four.
So we're talking short little children.
They couldn't even see out the windows because the windows were stacked up with so many items and, um, They, you know, even for a safety escape, to escape from the windows in case of a fire or to be able to open the windows to get in fresh air.
You couldn't because they were, the windows were blocked with just stuff.
And the stuff, I believe, had been picked up off the floor when the floodwaters were rising during Sandy Hook, Hurricane Sandy and Hurricane Irene.
And they just picked everything up and put it on the windowsills where it had been left for years because the school was closed.
Tell us how you parted with Lenny and the observations you made about the photographs of Noah.
Okay, so another researcher and I had been, Lenny had put up a, let's see, was it?
Let me think about this.
It's been a long time, Jim.
Yes, he had started a foundation called...
No, it was like a foundation called Noah's Ark.
And a friend of mine had made a donation.
And the reason she made the donation was because she felt in the future that there would be a class action lawsuit.
So she wanted to give money to this organization so that she could be part of a class action lawsuit, you know, later down the road.
And Lenny returned her money.
I can't remember now why he returned the money, but...
What was your question?
I'm sorry.
Well, remember, you said you wanted to make a donation to the website.
And he thought that was peculiar because you didn't believe he actually had a son who died at Sandy Hook.
And you told him that was because you felt there'd be a class action lawsuit and you wanted to be a part of it.
At which point, even though you'd had 100 hours of conversation, he hung up in disgust.
Right, and that was the end of our conversation.
We never spoke again after that.
Tell us about the observations you had made about photographs of the young Noah in relation to his older stepbrother, Michael Vabner.
Yes, yes, that was really interesting.
Again, I was at the lake and I decided to go look at I decided to go look at his stepson, Michael Babner's Facebook page and see if he had one.
So, I opened it up and just BAM!
There's this picture of him and it looks exactly like an older version of Lenny Posner's six-year-old supposed dead son.
In fact, on Google Plus, Lenny had posted all these pictures of his son.
And his son repeatedly was wearing like, oh, he'd be wearing like Superman clothes, Batman clothes, superheroes.
And then I'll be darned if I didn't find a picture of this Michael Vagner standing like in a Marvel Comics Museum or something, standing next to a Superman outfit.
But no, the pictures on his Google page and everything of this son It looked exactly like Michael Badner, and I have a picture of it somewhere.
If I can, can I just hold up, like, I want to show you some of the pictures of some of the fathers.
Now, these are supposed to be parents of six-year-old children.
Sure, just hold them up.
Well, I don't know.
Let's see.
Okay, so this is Jesse's father, and I don't know if you can see that or not.
Okay.
So he's got gray hair, which is typically parents of six-year-olds, you know, they don't have gray hair.
Here's another picture of him.
Let's see.
Yep.
Not the typically this one right here.
Yes, yes, yes.
Um, get another one here.
Oh Oh, and while I'm looking.
Just real quick, here's a picture of inside of Sandy Hook.
This is supposedly an operating school 11 days before Christmas.
You see the bulletin board?
Yeah, it's empty.
There's nothing there.
Here's a picture of the window sill with all the junk in it.
Yes.
You see the windows?
Yes.
There's no way children could see out those windows.
Here's another picture of the junk.
Yes.
It's just more junk in the window.
Yes.
Let me see if I can get another picture of some of these parents.
Let me add that if anyone has questions for Kelly, you can put them in the chat.
This is another, Father, you can see the grain temples.
or alternatively you can email them to me at Jim at moon rock books calm Jim at
moon rock books calm this is another father you can see the grain temples
yes the parents appear to be far too old to have six year old or seven year old
kids in the first grade.
This is one of the mothers and she's already got crow's feet.
This is not the mother, I don't believe, of a six-year-old.
This, I do not believe, is the mother of a six-year-old either.
You know, she's starting to get age spots.
It's just...
Just, um, I don't know.
It's just, it's too unbelievable.
The evidence doesn't match up.
Oh, here's a picture of Lenny Posner and you can see his, the gray in his mustache and the receding hairline and the gray temples.
That's, I think that he's the grandfather.
And I will show you a picture of Michael Babner and Noah.
that I think is one and the same.
So here's a picture of Noah in his little Batman costume.
Hold on just a second.
I want to do a side-by-side comparison.
Again, if anyone has questions for Kelly, just put them in the chat.
So, you know, and just looking at all the videos that were, and the fact that they've all been
removed, and the fact that the book was removed from Amazon, nobody died at Sandy Hook, when
there's other conspiracy books that are allowed to be sold.
Just that one just doesn't make sense.
You know, why is there such a... You can't talk about this.
You can't ask questions about this.
It just...
We do have two questions.
One is whether you could say more about the medical examiner, Wayne Carver.
And the other is, do you have any idea why there appear to be parents who reside in Newtown who still believe the shooting was real?
Say that again?
Say that again?
Here's yet a third question, Kelly, and I'll change the order.
What about the photograph of Noah that showed up in Pakistan two years later?
That's right, on the Memorial Wall.
Right.
That's right, yes.
And I asked Lenny about that, and his answer was, ask the mainstream media.
A second question is about how can residents of Newtown Still seem to, some of them, sincerely believe the shooting was real.
Well, one, it's a word called propaganda, and two, somebody sent me early on, because I do get asked this question a lot, like, how can, how could they pull this off?
And the answer is really very simple.
Look at the Manhattan Project.
This, a man who was interested in what I was saying, sent me an old black and white video of Hanford, I think it's pronounced Hanford, Washington, which is where they did some of the Manhattan Project.
And it was an old government video in black and white.
And they were interviewing people who lived in these different cities around America as they were working on the atomic bomb in Tennessee, in Manhattan, in Hanford, Washington.
They said these people that they were interviewing, they were in, you know, 90s now.
And they were saying, you know, when we worked there on the atomic bomb, we had no idea what we were doing.
We were just doing what our government told us to do.
We were patriotic Americans.
We were told not to ask questions and we didn't.
We respected that.
And it was not until we dropped the bomb and read about it in the newspaper.
We're like, wow, that's what we were working on.
They said it was so compartmentalized that the person on the left didn't know what the person on the right was doing.
And they were able to keep it top secret because they were told to or they would be let go.
Yeah, but in this case, they're talking about, you know, residents of Newtown, not necessarily of the subdivision Sandy Hook, who still believe it was real.
They weren't participants, they just received the news and were affected.
Do you think maybe there's just a lot of social pressure in Newtown to conform to the official narrative?
I'm sure there is, because there's pressure outside of Newtown.
Let me add, by the way, for the benefit of our audience, that someone I've interviewed several times, Rebecca Karnes, who's actually got her own blog called the Newtown Rooster, now has a show on Revolution Radio.
Where from 11 a.m.
to 1 p.m., Monday, Wednesday, Friday, is my show, The Raw Deal.
But on Tuesday and Thursday, Rebecca Karns now has her show, and it was only In the last year and a half or two years that Rebecca had the breakthrough as a resident of Newtown, that this was a sham.
And I just highly recommend that you consider, you know, checking out Rebecca because she's really good on this.
You can find her.
She has blogs on at the Newtown Rooster, but I've also published several of her blogs at jamesfetzer.org.
So if you go to jamesfetzer.org and put in Rebecca Karn, C-A-R-N-E-S, you'll get several of her statements about it as a Newtown mother, a parent, who came to the realization that they had been played.
Kelly, we had an additional question from the chat room about Wayne Carver and his role.
Could you say something about Wayne Carver?
Wayne Carver is now deceased.
Lieutenant Paul Vance is retired.
But, but Wayne Carver was, he was of course very instrumental in all this because he was the medical examiner.
But if you just go, you can still see his video, his 20 minute press conference.
It's too unbelievable because in the middle of his press conference, out of, there's no context.
He says, the residents, he says, I hope the residents of Sandy Hook don't have this kind of crashing down on their heads later.
Out of nowhere, he says that.
Was that letting the people know that this didn't really happen?
What would come crashing down?
And nobody in the media said, Dr. Carver, Dr. Carver, what did you mean by that?
That was such a strange statement.
Could you please explain yourself?
And to this day, that question has never been brought up.
What did he mean by that?
Nobody's ever asked him.
But before we go, I want to show.
So here's the picture.
Here's a picture of Noah that we found.
Well, doing it too fast.
Okay, so here's Noah, and then here's the picture of Michael Vagner.
Now, I just want you to notice some things about this picture.
Notice his ear, you know, kind of looks like the shape of a kidney, the inside of his ear.
Okay, I don't know if you can see that.
And then notice the bushy eyebrows.
The dark color hair.
Notice how his eyes go down on the corners of his eyes.
They kind of slope downward.
Notice the angel bow in his mouth, the roundness of his face, the shape of his nose.
Okay.
And then when we go back here again, look at the inside of the ear shaped like a kidney.
Look at the bushy eyebrows, the sloping down of the eyes, the angel bow of the mouth, the color of the hair, the nose, the roundness of the face, Is that or is that not that person right there?
Even the color of the eyes.
I know you shared those photos with several friends and they all agreed, oh yeah, that's him grown up.
Are you okay?
You've done that.
Oh, absolutely.
I would show people, I'd be in a restaurant and say, not even telling them what I was taught.
I said, like, do these two people, do you think this is the same person?
And they're like, well, yeah.
And Absolutely.
For sure.
No, no, there's no similarity.
No.
And this is supposed to be his stepbrother?
That's wonderful, Kelly.
There are a couple more questions, particularly from Chad, that I'm going to address in relation to my sequel here to Kelly's presentation, which is just wonderful to give you the flavor of what she encountered when she went about doing Just a citizen's inquiry calling up Paul Vance and saying,
You know, who took care of the blood?
And he says, what blood?
He says, what blood?
Because there wasn't any blood.
Kelly, that was just devastating.
And the fact that you had these conversations with Lenny, and they gave you a copy of a death certificate, and it not only had no file number, it had no town certification, it had no state certification.
And the fact that, you know, you Discovered, discern this similarity between Noah and Michael Vavner.
Just wonderful stuff, Kelly.
You've just been an inspiration to so many.
Jim, I don't think the death certificate had a state seal on it, did it?
Like an embossed seal?
No, no, no.
No, no, no.
It had no certification.
I'll be addressing that myself when I follow your presentation.
I think you did a wonderful coverage, Kelly, and it's so important to have citizen journalists because the mainstream has completely been an abject failure about all of this.
Seth, by the way, also mentioned that he had heard a report, as have I, that when Wayne Carver was in Las Vegas, he admitted to some fellow gamblers that the whole thing had been a hoax.
I'd heard that too, that he'd said that.
Somehow the truth will out.
Wayne Carver now is no longer among the living and therefore cannot be subject to any further interrogation or questioning which may be very beneficial to the official account.
The fact that anybody would believe this story just shows to me It just tells me that people are very naive because if anybody looks at the pictures and watches a few videos, there is no way.
Like the people, the parents that supposedly showed up at 9 30 in the morning in one of the richest counties in America are showing up at a school shooting when they should be working on Wall Street.
You know, these people were corporate raiders.
They were bank presidents.
They were producers and they show up in At 9.35 in the morning or 10 o'clock in the morning, they're showing up with hoodies.
You know, they're showing up with UGG boots on, bandanas, baseball caps, sweatpants, jeans, tennis shoes.
Where are the dresses, the skirts, the knee-high boots, the, you know, the hosiery, the men in suits?
Where are the suit and tights?
Nobody shows up like that.
These parents in the richest county that should have been at work or on their way to work are dressed very, very casually with name tags.
The fact that the school parking lot was not in compliance with Americans with Disabilities Act, the handicapped parking spaces were still painted with yellow handicap signs instead of the blue and white mandatory Signs and signage on a six-foot-tall pole, you know, it has to say like ban accessible or handicapped parking in blue and white.
They didn't have those.
There weren't any, there wasn't a sign out front of the school, but like most schools have magnetic signs or electronic signs that say, you know, PTA meeting tonight at 7 30, report cards distributed this week, teacher of the month, whatever, no signage outside the school, cracks in the sidewalk, You know, that was a lawsuit waiting to happen.
The school was such a dilapidated mess.
Even the town newspaper, the Newtown Bee, said Sandy Hook was a, quote, toxic waste dump.
Love it, Kelly, love it.
One final question.
William Fox asks, have you subjected to any further forms of harassment or intimidation, any other visits from men in suits?
No, no, that was the only thing in eight years.
Nobody's ever called me other than a New York Times reporter who's writing a book about this, and I've given her some very in-depth interviews.
So, I don't know when her book's coming out, but she believes that it happened despite hours and hours of me telling her all this.
It's just unbelievable.
I'm like, I said, you know, Elizabeth, there's no way Kelly, you've been absolutely sensational.
We got another joining here and I'm seeking to put him, uh, you know, where he ought to be.
Kelly, I just want to thank you.
That was simply sensational.
Okay.
Thank you.
Thank you so much.
I greatly appreciate it.
Okay.
Bye-bye.
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