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Jan. 11, 2025 - Info Warrior - Jason Bermas
56:25
Is It Over For The Great Reset?
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Welcome to Making Sense of the Madness.
We've got a great show lined up for you today.
We've got prolific author and radio host Mark Gober.
The show is Where Is My Mind?
The book is an end to the upside down reset.
You're not going to want to miss it.
buckle up and get ready to make sense of the madness.
And we are back.
Mark, thank you so much for joining us.
For those not familiar, how did you get into this arena?
You know, a lot of people out there are now familiar, I would say much more familiar with the idea of globalism, global governance, private-public partnerships, post-COVID-1984 nightmare.
Head organization, at least the vocal organization, is the World Economic Forum.
You have a slew of other globalist organizations out there, from the Council on Foreign Relations, the Royal Institute on National Affairs.
I would argue the Bilderberg Group is probably at the apex of that.
But the World Economic Forum in Davos is where they put out their talking points, where they do their pre-planned press conferences, and where...
A lot of this outward globalism is coming from.
My journey actually started in 2016. I was working in Silicon Valley.
And prior to that, I was working in investment banking in New York.
So I had a very mainstream background.
And I started looking into the nature of reality, the nature of consciousness, and basically the scientific evidence for spiritual phenomena.
But then when 2020 hit, I found there were many people who I agreed with on the concepts from my prior books.
Basically going along with the narrative of what the mainstream press said.
So I was trying to reconcile, how could this be?
These are people who are really intelligent, I really respect them, and yet they seem to be falling for an authoritarian agenda.
So what I did in this book, an end to the Upside Down Reset, is to just let people know what it is.
Because many people have heard of it, and some people will say it's a conspiracy theory.
It's actually not a conspiracy theory.
This is an explicit plan laid out initially by Klaus Schwab of the World Economic Forum and then Prince Charles.
This was in June of 2020.
And then there was a book that Klaus Schwab co-wrote called COVID-19, the Great Reset.
So this is very real.
Yes.
And that's after he wrote the Fourth Industrial Revolution.
Revolution.
You know, it's funny that you say that, that you were looking at stuff with spiritual awakenings.
You know, I speak on the Reawaken America tour.
It's no longer, you know, out there.
But in the last one I was at, I met an apprentice of Alex Gray.
And I've always been a big Tool fan.
I love the artwork.
And this guy had artwork that was very reminiscent of that.
He had been mentored by Alex.
He had stayed out there.
And like I said, after the COVID-1984 nightmare and starting to question certain things, he was no longer welcome.
And you would have thought that somebody that, you know, was on the fringes, if you will, about accepted reality, spirituality, would be much more open-minded.
And as far as the Great Reset goes, I've been doing this almost 20 years, and even I. When I heard this term, the Great Reset, and they were doing forums, I remember somebody telling me about the initial virtual forum that they did with Henry Kissinger and Eric Schmidt, and I'm like, this can't be real.
And then I clicked on it, and they're all talking about a Great Reset, and I'm just like, this is over the top.
Why do you think they came so strong with their messaging this time around?
Because we've had buzz terms before, probably the biggest one out there, the New World Order, right?
And, you know, just kind of like that Great Reset, it was dismissed as a conspiracy theory by many, even though you had George H.W. Bush literally do a New World Order tour, literally hand Schwarzkopf, Colin Powell, Dick Cheney and others glocks with the New World Order commemorative edition on them after the Gulf War.
But total conspiracy theory, Mark.
Yeah, well, what happened with covid is that there was a global shutdown.
And what Klaus Schwab and his colleagues said very clearly was that this is an opportunity to make the world a better place.
This is actually a key point that I talk about in the book and into the Upside Down Reset is the language that they use is compassionate.
It sounds really good, like they're going to make the world better.
They're not talking about taking away rights.
That's not the way it's positioned.
But if you read between the lines, you can see that it's a wolf in sheep's clothing.
And we see this very often, especially as I describe in the book on the left, where compassion is such an important thing, which is good in many ways, but it can be weaponized where people then fall for things because they're very caring and they don't realize they're being fooled.
So let's talk about that, because this entire agenda, Is enveloped in this idea of benevolence, right?
When we talk about things like equity or diversity, right?
Inclusion.
There's nothing necessarily bad about those words, although I would argue equity before all this was a financial term.
Nobody used it in any other way.
You would use things like equality.
They come at you like, oh no, not only are we here to fix it, we're here to hug everybody and love everybody and we just want the same thing for everybody.
But the truth of the matter is, we've never had a quality of outcome in...
Any type of society, no matter whether you go all the way to the far left communist or the far right, as far capitalist and meritocracy as you could get, it's just never happened.
There's always going to be divisions amongst...
People of economic and socio-status.
Now, I would also argue that a lot of this agenda resides in the idea of actually separating us through identity politics and things like gender and race, which are totally and completely irrelevant when you're trying to build a society based on a meritocracy that would be of a positive nature.
Yeah, a lot of great points there.
I wrote in the book about the distinction between leftism and liberalism, because liberalism would say things like we should judge people on the basis of their character, the content of their character, not on the basis of superficial things like race or gender, for example.
Or liberalism would say that we should allow people to speak their minds.
And what we have with leftism...
It's basically a distortion of all that.
It's, you know, you should be able to speak your mind as long as we subjectively do not deem that to be hateful.
So that is one of the reasons I wrote this book is I do feel like there are people who might be quote unquote liberal and they don't realize that people who feel like they're on their side are actually getting pulled into a really dangerous direction.
And I also want to comment on this notion of equity or equality.
One of my favorite quotes is from F.A. Hayek, who's a Nobel Prize winner in economics.
And he talks about how human beings are by definition unique, meaning that we're all different by definition.
Therefore, if we wanted to make people equal, we would have to treat them unequally to get them to that point of equality.
So it ends up in a paradox like so many of these ideas.
Again, These notions, you know, I've been doing this a long time, and I remember the Zeitgeist films.
You know, they went viral many years ago.
The first one actually put a portion of my film Loose Change in it.
But then the second film was just so much based in what I would say is collectivism.
Right.
And when you look at the root of communism or any of the socialism, that's what you're really getting to is collectivism.
And, you know, there's a lot of tools or ideas in that film that I think are great.
In other words, if we had vertical farms in communities, great.
If we were utilizing 3D printing more for homes, great.
I'm a big believer in, you know, doing what Eisenhower did in this country with the highway system, with a mass railway system that we haven't had, Maglev, using that type of technology.
But at the end of the day.
There is just no way that every human being is going to feel equal.
I could have the same house as you.
I could have the same car as you.
I could have the same amount of property, the same amount of income.
I still might want to bang your wife.
That's never going away, everybody.
There is always going to be competition.
There is always going to be conflict, and that is just something we have to accept as human beings and try to mitigate the negative aspects through what I would argue is more speech and communication and more dissidence, not less. and that is just something we have to accept as And unfortunately, this movement has tried to create less of that through censorship and authoritarianism.
I totally agree with you.
And you're reminding me of something I wrote about with regard to the term diversity.
Because it sounds like a good thing, but number one, sometimes you don't want diversity.
Let's say there's an emergency where there's a cyber attack.
We need a lot of coders in that situation to help.
We don't necessarily want as much diversity.
We want a lot of people with very similar skills.
But also the word diversity gets distorted in so many ways because it usually or it sometimes just is directed toward only certain things.
So, for example, the great economist Thomas Sowell, he said that if you want to talk about diversity, why don't you talk about how many Republicans are in the sociology department in colleges?
Well, listen, I'll say it like this.
It's funny because I had Dr. John A. Gentry on yesterday and he's kind of a CIA spook guy, but he was at, you know, the University of Georgetown and they let him go.
And look, I've been politically homeless my whole career.
I hate both sides.
I think there's a lot of rhetoric coming out of the right that is nice and it sounds great.
We'll see where we go in this second Trump administration.
I do think some of the appointments have been rather good in comparison to what we've seen in the past.
I am excited about the Tulsi Gabbard appointment.
I am excited about the RFK Jr. appointment, etc.
If they can get in, Kash Patel, we'll see.
But when we are talking about that right or left paradigm, There was more of a reasonable nature on the left, say, during the second Bush administration.
They were the free speech crowd.
They were the anti-war crowd.
In fact, even in 2008, when we're talking about totally vapid politicians that will say anything...
Every single person up there in the primary said they were closing Guantanamo Bay, said they were getting us out of Iraq.
That's Obama.
That's Joe Biden.
That's Hillary Clinton.
That's John Edwards.
Down the line, and really the only two people I would argue that were actually genuine when talking about that, were Dennis Kucinich, who recently lost an election, and Mike Gravel, who passed away some time ago.
But there were really, No Republicans outside of Ron Paul, who was viciously attacked when he tried to run for president in 2008. A lot of people forget that.
Hey, Sean Hannity, remember when you were calling him a Paul-tard?
Remember that?
I certainly do.
So there's almost been a flip where I can look to about a half dozen, a dozen people.
In the conservative movement, I would say Thomas Massey's the best one out there right now and actually genuine.
And I'm like, okay.
And now on the left, I literally have nobody.
I mean, I have no—I had Tulsi Gabbard.
It's gone.
She's done.
So we're in a really odd spot because if this administration doesn't deliver or if it's stagnant in four years, what do we get?
And does the political paradigm reverse again?
At the same time, this agenda just pushes forward.
Now, you make a really important distinction here of basically it's liberty.
It's about those who want to be free and those who think that government has a right and should be able to tell us what to do.
I think that is the spectrum that we're really talking about.
And we can get into left and right, and especially given everything that happened in COVID on the left in particular with the authoritarian ideals, it's easy to point at that.
And I think it's important to do so.
But really, we're talking about freedom here.
And if the government is telling people to do things that they didn't ask for, we have to ask questions about whether that's morally acceptable.
I actually wrote a book about this called An End to Upside-Down Liberty, because the more I look at the nature of government itself, the more I see it as something that is inherently tyrannical.
Not that every politician is bad, but the structure itself is an inherently tyrannical one.
So when we are looking to the future, we're less than two weeks out from Donald Trump being sworn in, this second administration coming in, making rather aggressive promises on the way in.
We'll, again, see what they can deliver on.
Obviously, a lot of people are looking to a reformation of the FBI and the other intelligence agencies.
I don't know that a reformation is quite possible.
I'd almost like to see an evisceration of most of those.
But at the very least, a mass declassification of the type of events that have really shaped not only our societal values and culture, but our foreign and domestic policy.
Now, you look at the assassinations of the 60s, RFK, MLK, JFK, etc.
Obviously, those should be on the table.
They should have already been declassified.
I don't know where getting them.
We should have gotten them years ago.
The one that really interests me is when Trump was asked on Fox News.
I know everybody's hooting and hollering about Epstein.
No one's getting any Epstein documents.
That's not real.
9-11.
Now, I don't know that we're going to get the 9-11 documents either, but Trump did say that he would declassify those.
And I recently actually had Giuliani on my program, which was a total shock to me.
And I got him to say they should declassify all the 9-11 documents and even make commentary on Building 7 at the end of the interview.
For those that don't know, Giuliani's right-hand man was blown up in Building 7. Michael Hess was blown up with another individual named...
Barry Jennings coming from the Office of Emergency Management on the 23rd floor, on the 8th floor.
Both were on television that day.
We hunted Barry Jennings down.
He actually gave us an interview back in 2008. Michael Hess wouldn't talk to us.
But again, we got Giuliani on the record.
When you look at 9-11 in particular, my argument is this.
Our entire foreign and domestic policy is based on the narrative they sold us on that.
Whether it's the Patriot Act, Homeland Security, the National Defense Authorization Act, the fusion centers that come after the fact, the censorship, you name it.
If we can't confront the truth about that and declassify that event, is there any hope of actually bringing back a constitutional republic and fighting this reset agenda?
I think it's essential for the citizens to know the truth about what happened in various events.
And there's this consistent theme that we hear, which is that the government knows what's best for us and will protect us if they don't think we're ready for something.
And you're reminding me a bit of Justin Trudeau's resignation speech, where he talked about, paraphrasing, that he wanted to do what's best in the best interest of Canadians, which is something that sounds good, and we hear that from a lot of politicians.
But how could an individual really know what is best for a very diverse set of people in the world?
It's actually impossible for a human being to know what's best for everyone else.
And I think that's a misconception that we've grown up with, with the notion that government is this benevolent thing.
And we need to wake up to the fact that it's often been very corrupt.
You know, we got to take a break, but I want to get into that parental aspect of government because I've never liked being treated like a child.
Even when I was a kid, I was resentful of the idea that somebody knew better than me or they could keep something from me.
You would hope with your parents it comes from a place of love.
But at the same time, there are a lot of really bad parents out there.
And by the way, there are a lot of really bad governments.
I don't know that there's any really great governments out there.
We're going to get into that and much more.
It's Making Sense of the Madness, and we will be back after this.
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So we kind of left off on the Idea of some kind of parental relationship.
Now, unfortunately, I do think that we live in a society where there are a lot of people that are grown children.
I hate to say it like that, but if you're not paying your own bills and you're on some type of welfare or social program, I'm not talking about, hey, I had to take part in this for six months or 18 months to get back on my feet.
If you're a lifer.
If you're someone that literally depends on the government for your health care and Medicaid, like I said, you can't pay the bills without some kind of agency.
You're a grown child.
You like being taken care of, unfortunately.
And often you are going to defer to the authority no matter how absurd, no matter how insane, no matter how dangerous that agenda is because you feel you have to rely on them to live.
On the complete opposite end of that spectrum, when you look at, like, the anarchist movement, I think it takes it too far, right?
Rugged individualism, I'm all into it, I get it.
But when you tell me we don't need a government or a military or a police force and that the non-aggression principle is going to work, that's not reality either.
We have to have a government, but there was a reason our founding fathers wanted to keep it small.
And have it in check.
There's a reason we have a constitutional republic and not a democracy.
You know, a lot of people start talking about the Constitution and democracy, and they don't even realize that you can't have an amendment to the Constitution without a first two-thirds vote and then a three-quarters vote.
That's not a democracy.
All right?
That's a system set up to ensure that actually not only is the minority heard, but if we're going to change something that is so important, we are going to have more than just a majority, but a majority twice over that is extreme.
And people don't get that aspect of it.
So how do we move back in that direction of small government, checks and balances, et cetera, when we've created a welfare state of people more than happy, you know, not even coming at it from the benevolent angle, it from the benevolent angle, because you certainly have those people.
But the angle that if I don't do this, I'm not going to survive.
I think it's a big challenge, Jason, because once government grows, the incentive for those in the government is to keep their power.
It would take someone who's extremely altruistic to want to actually take, to reduce his or her power within government.
So I know there are questions about whether limited government is something that can be contained properly.
And I think what we've seen in the U.S. is that, of course, the U.S. has done extremely well, but we've lost the notion of limited government.
It just seems to grow and grow.
You know, you mentioned Trudeau's resignation.
Incredibly unpopular person.
I mean, I don't know anybody, you know, other than the Simpsons championing Trudeau on their television show that was like, all right, awesome, Justin.
Instead, you had a lot of people, especially during COVID-19, extremely upset.
Now, people don't understand.
Canadian politics, they don't understand that this doesn't ensure they're going to get an election, etc.
This is parliamentary rule.
It's quite a different system.
But this guy was a mouthpiece, a poster boy.
This is a guy that praised people like Xi Jinping, which I would argue China is the model of globalism.
There is no doubt about it.
Social credit score, total surveillance, one state party, etc.
And he wasn't able to main power.
However, that doesn't necessarily mean they're just not going to install somebody else.
They might not even get an election.
Even if they get an election.
Who knows what their elected officials are going to do?
And at the same time, I would imagine that Trudeau is going to shift into something on the peripheral of either the World Economic Forum or some type of think tank or economic subsidiary of them.
So what are your thoughts?
Yeah, I'm skeptical that the Trudeau news is going to be a panacea, because like you say, likely someone else will be installed who has very similar ideals.
But I do think the reason that some people have liked Trudeau is that his demeanor is often one that sounds like it's compassionate.
Of course, there have been some exceptions, like when he spoke about those who have questioned vaccines.
He said that they're often racist and misogynist and extremist.
So there are comments like that.
And he was involved in freezing people's bank accounts with the trucker convoys.
So there are clearly authoritarian things.
But if you just watch him talk and you didn't know anything else, he comes across as a nice person.
And I do think that many people are swayed by the superficial aspects of a politician.
I mean, look, he's a pretty guy.
I'm not going to lie.
He's got dreamy eyes.
And unfortunately...
People do, you know, get fooled by people's physical appearance, and we do gravitate to those that are more attractive.
I just think he was just over-the-top cartoon.
I mean, dressing like Aladdin.
That one video where he's at camp in blackface.
I mean, the blackface wasn't even the worst part.
The fact that he'd stuffed his shorts with an anaconda snake was just as bad.
It was just over-the-top, and that's the leader of your country.
Give me a break.
I would say that that's more of the traditional outward puppet, right?
You got this government guy that's somewhat well-spoken, good-looking, delivering a message.
We saw the complete opposite of that in this country.
They literally installed a dementia patient the last four years.
I mean, what does that say about our country?
Because, you know, we talk about the World Economic Forum.
It's not like Donnie T didn't go over and speak there, although I would say his January, I think, 2019 speech was pretty aggressive against globalism there.
But Joe Biden wasn't running anything.
I mean, even showing up to these events, it was a bad joke.
I would argue that when we are talking about modern-day globalism and that type of...
Diplomacy that somebody like John Kerry actually ran much more of the country than Joe Biden did.
When I think about people who have been supportive of Joe Biden and Kamala Harris, often it's not because they love them so much, but rather the alternative is so abhorrent, the hatred that they tend to have for Trump.
I think hatred is an accurate word.
It outweighs everything else.
So then they feel justified in, well...
He has dementia, but at least it's not Trump.
I think you're right and that's scary.
I remember in 2020 or 2021, within a year of the presidency, I had Kevin Roos of the New York Times on my other show.
And the New York Times doesn't come on my show willingly.
The only reason they came on the show is that they had done a hit piece on Loose Change.
And whenever I do interviews with the mainstream media, I instruct them that we're taping the entire interview.
And if you don't want me to put out the raw tape, you come on my show after the fact and you defend your article.
You know, you got to do at least a half an hour with me.
So, of course, when they first came on, they tried to pull the, oh, we can't tape.
And I'm like, then I can't do the interview.
Like, this isn't, we're not, it's not a negotiation.
Either we do this this way or we don't do it at all.
I don't, it's not like I need the press.
I'm not, you know, a fame monger.
So we do that.
And of course, they don't want the full interview out.
So Kevin Roos comes on the show.
And one of the first things that I ask him, I go, do you actually believe that Joe Biden runs the country?
And he tried to take it and spin it into some QAnon sense that I was suggesting that Trump and the White Hats were in control.
I go, no, I'm talking about the fact that we've had presidents in the past.
That maybe didn't run everything.
I mean, you look at George W. Bush.
Obviously, Cheney, Rumsfeld, Wolfowitz, Condoleezza Rice, they're running a lot.
He's an outward puppet, but he's still golfing and saying, watch this swing.
He's still there.
He's coherent.
I go, the other guy can't talk.
He's not running anything.
I go, that doesn't bother you?
He's like, well, he's the president.
And I'm like, what do you mean he's the president?
He can't talk.
And he just would not concede.
That there was anything mentally wrong with Joe Biden and instead wanted to talk about how things I talk about are dangerous.
But it's okay to talk about things like UFOs and Bigfoot because obviously those have a lot to do with globalism and the World Economic Forum.
Absolutely ridiculous, sir.
Yeah, well, you're reminding me a bit of the Kamala Harris-Joe Rogan interview that didn't happen because she wanted to do it in D.C. and presumably have some control over it.
So there is this thing we see, I think it's more on the left, where they want to control the narrative.
They don't want the facts to get out, perhaps.
And they present a straw man of individuals and policies.
And some people just fall for it.
They listen to whatever the New York Times headlines are, whatever it says on CNN or MSNBC, as if that is the truth.
And if you question the expert class, then you are a conspiracy theorist.
That's the mentality.
Now, this is ultra alarming, especially in a digital age where censorship happens with an algorithm and AI within microseconds.
Right.
There used to be a time period where.
Where you could put something out and it actually had a chance of going viral.
No matter what it was.
Those days are long gone.
Now we're in a place where regular bans are real.
Shadow bans are real.
People are worshipping the number one military defense contractor in the world, Elon Musk, like he's some bastion of free speech.
He's censoring people.
I mean, I just want to say this.
Free speech is like the lowest bar, everybody.
And we're not even there on any of these platforms.
You can talk about freedom of speech over freedom of reach.
He put Linda Iaccarino, another WEF progenitor, as the head of the organization.
You've got to pay to get a checkmark.
And now the only reason I'd pay, I don't care about the goddamn checkmark.
I don't even care about the reach that it supposedly gives me.
It doesn't give me any more reach.
It's the fact I can't post videos or live stream on that platform unless I pay the damn fee.
That's it.
And that's the only reason I do it.
We have now taken social media from a place where they were begging you to come in, create content, and share revenue with you and have free speech.
Two, you pay to be on the platform.
If you're lucky, we might let you monetize it.
And if you're lucky, we might let your followers, the people that chose to look at your stuff, see any of your content.
That's a recipe for disaster, especially when you are not allowing...
Other players to actually come into the mix.
You've monopolized it.
We saw what happened to Parler.
People could argue Rumble's on its way up.
Again, I mean, Peter Thiel money.
You're telling me that there's not going to be censorship?
You're telling me they're not curating content?
Of course they are!
They've already hired people!
They're paying people to produce content there, so there's no real meritocracy even on there.
Is Rumble better than YouTube?
Sure.
Can I make a living on Rumble as opposed to YouTube if it...
Was it a fair trade?
Absolutely not.
Like, if it was fair, I'd be making money on YouTube again.
Yeah, you're preaching to the choir here.
I've had to deal with this myself.
Obviously, when I write books, I mean, I've written seven, including the one we're talking about and into the Upside Down Reset.
And I do think that the books or posts that I put out about them are probably deprioritized.
I actually heard from someone the other day.
He interviewed me on his show.
His name's Quentin Santacola.
And he was very nice.
He decided to write positive reviews on Amazon about all my books.
But for some reason, this book on The Great Reset and the leftist vision for society, he was unable to post a review.
And Amazon actually warned him.
He might actually face penalties or something just because he wanted to write a positive review.
Fantastic.
I just love it when things – and there's Amazon.
There's another company.
And here's the problem with these companies.
None of these companies came up in a fair capitalistic manner.
We picked winners and losers.
Amazon was in the – It wasn't in the black for years.
I mean, it basically sold books at a loss and was subsidized by the government.
Tesla's another story.
Like, if Tesla...
It was an actual car company and had to compete.
No mas, everybody.
It's not the first EV company.
It won't be the last, but it was one picked by the establishment to set the agenda.
We're going to take a break.
We're going to come back.
I want to delve more into this great reset and what it means for the future of technology, technologies such as artificial intelligence, automation, and even in the realm of transhumanism.
We'll be back with more.
We're making sense of the madness after this.
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Now, Mark, one of the aspects of this whole idea of globalism, a new world order, a great reset, Is the aspect of technology.
Now, I don't consider myself a Luddite.
In fact, I'm an uber dork.
I got a whole little set right here next to me.
I'm taking stuff apart.
I'm thermal pasting this and that.
I like technology.
But I understand that technology is a tool like any other.
A hammer can build a house.
It can bash your head in.
And unfortunately, when we're talking about these powerful tools, Of artificial intelligence, number one, I think they've been monopolized.
Number two, I think that the technology is well beyond what we are seeing in the public arena.
But number three, I feel like it is now being walled off in any arena that would be super helpful to humanity and instead is being corralled into enslavement in the sense that all this stuff is programmed.
Garbage in, garbage out.
If you're Google...
And your first image product from text-based AI is creating black Nazis.
When you type in 1930s or 40s German soldier, we got an issue.
We got a big issue.
I use Photoshop almost daily.
Most of my thumbnails now involve some type of AI. Constantly.
Prompts do not allow me to put this or that.
I mean, the censorship on AI prompts already is quite alarming.
So when we are talking about this Great Reset, like I said, Klaus's previous book is the fourth industrial revolution.
Where do you see these technologies going right now?
And where do they need to go, again, if we want more of a freedom-based society?
Well, I want to give some context.
In my book, An End to the Upside-Down Reset, I try to break down what's written in the book, COVID-19 and the Great Reset.
So what is the agenda actually positing in terms of how to shape society?
And to me, it's a very comprehensive shifting of society, even though Klaus Schwab didn't break it down this way.
I think it could be broken down this way based on what they've written.
And the six categories that I write about are politics, economics, environment, technology, metaphysics.
And so I think technology is one of the really important ones because of this transhumanistic movement.
So on the one hand, like you say, technology could be used for very good things.
But on the other hand, it can be used for censorship.
I've actually been playing around with AI a bunch, ChatGPT and others.
And it's amazing some of the things I see, like on Google's Gemini, for a period of time, if you asked it, what is an election?
It wouldn't respond.
So it's like, if these things are supposed to be truth tellers, they shouldn't be politically biased.
Well, you know, just getting into AI really quick, you know, even Grok, which is, again, supposed to be on the free speech platform.
I asked Grok about myself.
I figured, hey, I'm on this platform.
I've got almost 50,000 followers.
I've been here over a decade.
You know, I've got a lot of work out there.
What will it say about me?
So, you know, I just typed into, who is Jason Burmus?
Lied about me in the first sentence.
Literally lied about me in the first sentence.
Said that I had questioned whether or not certain people existed.
In other words, that I just said that people were amazing.
It's a wild ride on Jason Burmes' page.
I'm like, wait a minute.
What people has Jason Burmes questioned the reality of?
And then all of a sudden it starts talking about 9-11 and Flight 93. And I go, wait a minute.
He questioned whether or not any of the people on Flight 93 existed?
And they're like, well, no, he just questioned whether or not the United 93 event had happened the way that we were told.
And I'm like, so he's never said that people don't exist.
And then I guess by the fourth prompt I posted it, it had to admit it lied.
But it took four different prompts for it to be, oh, looks like I made a mistake.
Well, why is it you made a mistake out of the gates with the first thing you said about somebody?
That's programming.
That's going outside of an honest, large language model that's trying to get at the root of the truth.
And when you look at the history of companies like Google that were basically created and shepherded by In-Q-Tel of the CIA, DARPA, NASA, I mean, they've got those contracts to this day.
The people out there that aren't concerned about NASA and Google working together on artificial intelligence and quantum computing...
Don't really understand the gravity of that situation.
Can you speak to that?
Because there's a great example of the public-private partnership that is, you know, the talking point amongst the World Economic Forum.
You know, I would argue that even this country, we've been in a techno-fascistic society for quite some time.
If these people get their way, forget about technocracy.
We're talking authoritarian technopoly, in my opinion.
Yeah, P.J. O'Rourke famously said, when buying and selling are controlled by legislation, the first things to be bought and sold are legislators.
And that's what seems to be happening in all these quote-unquote partnerships where the government's being bought off and it looks like it's benevolent, but really it's just a form of cronyism.
So I totally agree with you on that.
And I also just want to mention NASA because I wrote a book recently on cosmology.
And NASA was founded by Wernher von Braun.
He was one of the leaders.
And he was a Nazi SS officer.
So this is just fact.
I'm not talking conspiracy.
He was brought over in Operation Paperclip, okay?
So I ask AI, should the public trust an organization that was founded by a Nazi SS officer?
And it would say, absolutely not.
Absolutely not.
And then I say, so you're saying we shouldn't trust NASA? And then it backtracks.
No, well, you should definitely trust NASA and so forth.
So it's not an objective technology right now.
But I do think, Jason, there's going to be a lot of incentive for entrepreneurs to come up with a true...
Truth-telling machine?
Because that's what consumers are going to want.
They're going to want an AI that's going to give them the truth and not a censored truth.
But will it be allowed?
I don't know if you saw Mark Andreessen lately, and I had not been aware of him until he did the Rogan podcast, but...
He essentially came out and said that the Defense Department told them that it was not going to be allowed, that AI was going to be a walled garden.
And he responded, but wait a minute, isn't the math for AI already out there?
And he says, we don't care.
He goes, if we have to, we'll just reclassify it the same way we did large sections of physics during the Cold War.
So Andreessen's like, wait a minute, I had no idea that you were classifying large sections of physics during the Cold War.
But again, if you look at what the United States government and other governments have done post-World War II, you just made a great point.
We brought in a ton of Nazis.
Now, we talked about declassification.
I don't know where we are since 2013, but Annie Jacobson wrote the definitive work on Operation Paperclip.
And one of the things she starts out with is that as of that writing of that book, just on Paperclip alone, they had...
600 million documents that were still classified on that.
That's over half a billion documents on Nazis create not only just NASA, they were integral in the creation of the Central Intelligence Agency out of the OSS as well.
All right, everybody?
So, you know, we got to talk about our actual history and our actual past, and we can't do that unless we confront it with reality, with mass declassification.
We got to take one more break.
When we come back, I want to hone in on something you talked about earlier, Prince Charles.
I always talk about the absurdity of the idea that we live in a free country or a free world.
When we have royal bloodlines in 2025, now I get it, a lot of people want to sit there and say, oh, the royal family doesn't have any power.
Bull snap, of course they have power.
But...
On top of just the European royalty, you have the Saudi Arabian royalty.
I mean, there are plenty of kings, queens, and princesses out there in 2025. I don't know how you have a society foreign by the people when you have rule by bloodline, especially by the bloodline of Prince Charles, that can't get enough neo-feudalism.
We're going to get into that and so much more.
Final segment of Making Sense of the Madness after this.
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And we are back.
Mark, you mentioned Prince Charles and his announcement of the Great Reset, even talking about climate lockdowns.
One of the most jaw-dropping moments for me.
Was at the 50th WEF. It's not really the 50th.
It's only really been around, you know, it's an extension.
But they did the 50th.
And they had Prince Charles come out and they literally put a crown graphic in the background over his head that was in the colors of the 17 SDGs.
But it gets better.
So they were in prongs of three.
Right?
So there was three sections of six on one side.
There were three sections of six on the other.
But as you know, there's only 17, not 18, of these.
So what they did is they did the five, but the middle one they split into two.
So they made sure that they had six points on each top.
Number one.
How absurd is it that we have royalty in this time period?
Number two, how absurd is it that we're crowning royalty with SDG crowns in 2020?
And then number three, you talked about spirituality, cosmology.
What is these people's obsession with numerology and the occult when it comes to these matters?
Well, first of all, I think there's a tendency among the public, because we were trained since children, to revere the authority figures, especially the king or the prince.
So there's a bit of conditioning that needs to be unwound for us to ask questions and say, should we trust what the prince is saying?
Should we trust the sustainable development goals?
Should we trust the concern about climate in the way that they describe it?
And with your question about the occult, it is something that I have gotten into in my later books, because it comes up everywhere.
I don't claim to understand it, but there seems to be people in a position of authority who know special things about how reality works.
And sometimes the symbolism comes out.
I don't claim to know exactly how it all works, but there is strange symbolism that repeatedly occurs.
And there you see that picture of Charles with the WEFSDG crown right there.
It's just, again, you can't make this stuff up.
Where do you see us going?
You know, because I do think that there has been somewhat of an awakening with people, especially after COVID-1984.
Unfortunately, I think that a lot of people have kind of still fallen into that left-right paradigm looking for political saviors.
They don't have the ability.
To cognizantly criticize people that they have aggrandized and hero-worshipped, I think that's a problem.
I think you've got to hold Donnie T. accountable.
I don't trust benevolent billionaires like Elon Musk, etc.
And even if we get the best of the best, in other words, a rollback of some of the DEI policies, bringing back energy independence, etc., etc., certain aspects of this are rolling forward.
Cryptocurrency, blockchain technology, smart contracts, like I said, automation, AI, they're all pushing forward.
So where do you see us going in this country and in overall society and why?
I think where we end up is really going to depend on the individuals and the extent to which they willingly wake up.
Because what I found is that people...
If they're not interested in waking up, they will dismiss evidence no matter what because it contradicts their worldview.
And I've seen this very strongly because of my mainstream background.
Like I said, I went to Princeton, worked in New York finance in Silicon Valley, so I was in the belly of the beast.
And there are a lot of people I know who are very intelligent in many ways who are still buying the narratives.
So that part gives me a reason for discouragement.
And yet at the same time, the number of people who are awake to all this stuff in 2025 versus 2020, it's remarkable what's happened, myself included.
You know, talking to mainliners, you know, I hearken back to this conversation I had last year with – she was my best friend in high school.
She was the valedictorian.
You know, her and her husband have cushy government jobs.
They're going to retire at 55, et cetera, et cetera.
I hadn't talked to her in years, and we're sitting there talking, and she gets to, do you think the election was stolen in 2020?
And I'm like, yeah.
I wasn't even close.
And she rolls her eyes at me, and I'm like...
I'm like, she's like, oh, the court case was like, they didn't even look at the evidence.
And I had to explain to her no standing.
And then at the time, the Oppenheimer movie was the big movie, right?
So they were asking me about it.
I'm like, you know, I like Christopher Nolan.
I hadn't caught it yet.
And I said, honestly, one of the reasons that I haven't looked into it is I hadn't heard whether or not they included the Bohemian Grove.
At all in the film.
And they looked at me all funny and I'm like, oh, just so you understand, you know, the entire nuclear project was based out of the Bohemian Club and recruiting Oppenheimer and others and then discussions at the Grove.
And then I had to explain the, you know, 40-foot owl god as their deity and the whole nine.
And again, I get that funny look.
But then I see her like scrolling on her thing and she goes, huh.
The SR-71 club.
And then there's the picture of all these old men at the club and how they were the ones that brought in that.
I'm like, yeah, it's kind of a big deal.
You know what I mean?
They're like, no, that wasn't in the movie.
I'm like, yeah, I don't know that I'm interested in it.
Why is it?
And by the way, the Bohemian Grove has actually gotten a lot more mainline play over the last decade, probably due to people like Alex Jones and others.
But there's a full feature-length movie out there called Late Night with the Devil from last year.
Which is heavy on the Grove.
Really, that may be one of the best horror movies of the year last year.
The Simpsons last season talked about Montgomery Burns and his relationship to the Bohemian Grove.
The Owl is in vogue.
So more and more people know about this stuff.
But at the same time, it's kind of been relegated either to the overtly, like, Cartoon-y supernatural, right?
Like every rock star's in the Illuminati, blah, blah, blah.
And it moves away from the real political revelance that they're picking winners and losers here.
This is a place where Reagan, Nixon, Eisenhower, even Bobby Kennedy Jr. went to get the approval of the Western establishment.
So when you look at organizations like that, what do you think?
Part of me says I really don't know enough to claim that I can speak to details, but there are a lot of very strange things, like what you mentioned, that something's going on, and it is hard for people to believe.
I know when I first started researching that this could be going on, and it's influencing the direction of our world, and we don't hear about it in the mainstream press.
I lived in Silicon Valley.
I never heard about this stuff at all.
There's a level of secretiveness that could be kept secret.
That is hard for people to wrap their minds around.
So if you were to give a suggestion to anybody out there on how to ride this wave of the upcoming future of, I would say, predatory globalism.
You know, I mean, that's what they want.
And we've seen it established in nation states like China and others.
I only see its influence trying to expand.
How do they push back against that and remain independent?
To me, it all starts with awareness that if we in our own consciousness see through the deception, see through the wolf in sheep's clothing and the weaponization of compassion, then we will necessarily make different choices.
And if enough people start to make those different choices where we say no to things that are inherently tyrannical, that seems to me to be the solution.
Because the system is going to do its thing.
It's hard to think that we can bring the systems down, so to speak.
But if people have a grassroots approach where they shift their own consciousness...
You know, in a way towards truth, I think that over time that could be a really good thing for society.
We got a couple minutes left in the broadcast.
What would you like to leave the audience with and how can people support your work?
Well, first, Jason, thank you so much for all that you do, and thank you for having me on the show.
I would just leave your audience with my website, which is my name, markgober.com, M-A-R-K-G-O-B-E-R dot com.
And I've written seven books, so they span the topics of consciousness and the afterlife, spiritual awakening, political and economic theory.
I wrote about the UFO contact phenomenon and spirits.
Great Reset, of course.
Medicine, a challenge to the allopathic approach, and also a challenge to conventional cosmology.
So if that is of interest to any of the members of your audience, all the books are in hard copy, Kindle, and Audible formats.
And if the consciousness work, which we didn't really get into, is of interest, I produced an eight-episode bingeable podcast series in 2019. It's still out there.
It's called Where Is My Mind?
And I hear from people all the time that they still hear about it, and it talks about the afterlife and the scientific evidence for psychic phenomena.
And that is called Where Is My Mind Again.
Apple Podcasts, Spotify and all the major players.
Well, those are certainly subject matters that I have delved into and are of great interest to me, especially the UFO contact phenomenon.
I'm extremely skeptical of extraterrestrial life, and I would say that the majority, if not all, of the quote-unquote UAPs that have now been rebranded as are government operations and technologies.
But that is a discussion for another day.
Mark Gober, thank you so much for joining us.
Thank you guys for watching this show on Patriot.TV five days a week, where the truth lives.
Remember, to this guy, it is not about left or right.
It is always about right and wrong.
I absolutely love you guys.
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