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Cody Wilson joins us to talk the Second Amendment and this groundbreaking Supreme Court case when it comes to quote unquote ghost guns, 3D printing, and more.
And then we've got Brian Reisinger of Land Rich, Cash Poor to talk about the current state of the EPA, smaller farms, big regulations, and supply chains.
You're not going to want to miss it.
Buckle up and get ready to make sense of the madness.
And we are now joined by Cody Wilson.
Now, Cody, this is a huge case.
You're here to talk about.
You've been in this quote unquote ghost gun arena, 3D printing technology arena for a very, very long time.
For those unfamiliar with yourself, how did you get into this?
And what was this recent argument before the Supreme Court?
Yeah, thanks.
Hey, it's good to be here.
I guess we got into this space by creating it.
They say if you want to do well in a market, you should make the market.
And so we created the first generation of 3D printed guns and ghost gun kits, so-called ghost gun kits.
We created those before they had that name.
And what a successful name that is.
I think progressive Democrats in the Biden administration have gotten a lot of mileage out of that term, ghost guns.
And so when they began in 22 to try to use the ATF to regulate components of guns in the mail, we were forced to go to court in Texas and forced basically ultimately to bring this all the way to the Supreme Court to try to push it back.
So with this technology, obviously with any other, it has accelerated, right?
3D printers were something of a rarity.
Now you can find them on eBay or any of these secondhand sites for a fraction of the cost.
You can literally get into this space for hundreds of dollars instead of thousands of dollars.
And if you do want the more professional stuff, that is also out there.
With the technology in general, where have you seen it go?
How far do you think it's going to be taken?
And what can we expect in the future?
This is right.
There were even back during COVID, there was a type of printer you could get from China, an ender printer, for only a few hundred dollars.
Now, that printer still required you to kind of fuss with it.
Some assembly required, right?
But since there's a line of printers called the bamboo printers, like the X1 comes to mind.
This is called the Bamboo X1.
This printer is so good and it really matches the hype that we heard even 10 years ago about just out of the box.
You can put a file on this thing and you can run apart and you don't really have to know what you're doing.
That's really something else.
That's something new.
It's changed the game.
People truly can 3D print things without really understanding the technology.
And so it does represent a big leap, especially when everybody kind of knows.
The open secret is if you're not using 3D printers to print gun parts, you're not really using them to do anything.
Well, as a guy that came up as a kind of 3D modeler and graphic designer and artist, us hobbyists out there also enjoy it for a multitude of other things.
But certainly when we're talking the Second Amendment self-defense, this was one of the first things that caught my eye.
Probably, man, it's got to be 15 or so years ago when the first printed firearm that was actually able to fire a bullet came onto the scene.
Now, I'm a Second Amendment guy and more of an absolutist than most.
Obviously, your average individual does not have and cannot have anything close to military grade.
However, what we're talking about in these firearms, in most, in the vast majority of cases, would not be military grade and would be more along the lines of what we see in self-defense or security or law enforcement on our streets on a regular basis.
No?
I think, yeah, in the popular understanding, sure, 3D printed guns aren't very commercial and they're not very military in the sense that they're kind of weak, right?
They break, they degrade quickly over time.
And so they're more suited to a kind of hobby use, a more hybrid use.
So the guns you make, they end up being more of the pistol caliber or like, you know, the carbine or something, not kind of heavy weapons, automatic weapons, if that's what you mean.
But, you know, as Second Amendment absolutists, we understand it's actually pretty difficult to draw the line between military grade and civilian use.
And in fact, you know, we don't necessarily have to.
But I'll say to make this point a little more vivid, the AR-15 is America's most popular rifle.
It has a dual use, you could say.
And 3D printers are used to make AR-15 receivers of some considerable durability.
So there's overlap on that rifle, for example.
So let's talk about some of that overlap because you kind of just alluded to it right there.
And you could argue it is kind of part of the argument that Alito makes when he says, look, I can put all these parts on a table.
It doesn't make it this thing and it could be something else.
When we are talking about 3D printed parts, there is a vast array of different weapon systems that obviously would not be 3D printed, that this could either substitute a portion of that weapon or be an addition.
Obviously, bump stocks come to mind.
It'd be very easy to 3D print a bump stock.
And we saw that kind of legal battle play out in front of our eyes and go all the way to the Supreme Court.
So I'd love to get your take, not only on the bump stock issue, but the kind of parts that you think, you know, could actually become like commercialized through 3D printing.
You know what I mean?
Because they are that persistent and probably in some cases already have with the upper echelon.
Yeah, the bump stock question is a great setup because like you said, that case was actually just decided by the court and it was a surprising decision.
It was like 6'3, the court decided that bump stocks aren't machine guns.
And so in a sense, it was like the Supreme Court legalizing a type of automatic fire assistance device.
Really unexpected.
And so people are thinking maybe the court will go, the majority will go toward us in this parts case for kind of the same reasons, even though it might be a disaster in terms of public policy, according to liberals.
The court might still have to just have its hands tied and interpret the statute to mean, well, no, parts of guns aren't guns.
Only guns are guns.
That seems to be how the statute should be read.
But, you know, is the 3D printing question the biggest part of this?
I mean, it's in the conversation, but it seems that what the court had narrowed on and what the ATF had settled for trying to regulate was just what can you sell the public.
So when they wanted to regulate bump stocks, they said, well, this just is a machine gun, even though it wasn't.
And when they wanted to regulate the components that we sell and other people sell in commerce, they say, well, these are just guns.
You know, it's close enough.
And close enough, you know, maybe that works in other conversations, but I don't know that it works in interpreting the Gun Control Act of 1968.
I would have to agree with you.
Let's get into this case right now because, you know, you have Alito, and I think correctly so, making the argument, for instance, that a pen and a piece of paper do not make a grocery list, that a set of ingredients does not necessarily make an omelette.
So, specifically, first of all, take us through the journey of getting to this point because I'm sure that was a long and difficult one.
People don't understand when you get into this federal court level that it is essentially going to decide what our rights are going forward on this issue.
That is pretty much the apex of our judiciary system.
Totally.
And, you know, the way we got there, I won't say it was fast, but as these things go, this is about the fastest ride I've ever taken up the top because we won the whole way.
The plaintiffs came into the Northern District of Texas, and they were lucky they got a judge who decided to throw the whole rule out entirely, vacated nationwide.
Say it violated the statute, violated the APA.
That's unusual, first of all.
And so, as soon as that started happening, the ATF was kind of in a panic and started petitioning the Supreme Court for emergency relief over and over.
And then, again, we're lucky to live like I am to live in Texas.
And then that means our appellate court is the Fifth Circuit Court of Appeals.
It's a very conservative court of appeals.
And again, they upheld throwing out the rule, at least partially.
And so the ATF panicked.
So this was about the fastest ride to the Supreme Court I think you can take.
It took less than two years, I think, and all told to get up there.
That's pretty quick, especially in my case, in cases like ours, which are controversial, tend to kind of lose on procedural grounds for a long time because the judges want to kick the can.
You know, I have a case in the Third Circuit that I'm going up to next month.
That case, we've been fighting that case for 60 years and it's barely moved.
So if that gives you a sense of what it's like.
No, absolutely.
I know exactly what you're talking about.
You're literally talking about 100 meters than a 5K marathon.
That's really the comparison that people need to understand.
Two years is extremely quick.
Now, that tells me that the federales, the Injustice Department, the lobbyists and political agenda to push more regulation is trying to fast track this, not the other way around.
Otherwise, this would have taken a dozen years to get out there.
So ultimately, yes, we have seen, in regards to the Second Amendment, some pretty good decisions by our Supreme Court.
But I would also say that I trust them like, no, sorry.
I think they're garbage on a lot of issues.
You look at the 2020 election and the idea that the president doesn't have standing to bring forth evidence of a corrupt election.
That's ridiculous.
And then I would say even more egregious this year and certainly did not get enough play in the mainstream media was Missouri versus Biden, where you had the state Supreme Court and say, well, I mean, there's no doubt that the government was colluding with big business here and that this is absolutely 100% illegal.
Now, I'm naive and I'm thinking to myself, well, at least the Supreme Court will have to look at the evidence and show who they are.
Nope, no standing.
They just pulled the no stand.
I mean, that's the world we live in.
So this actually gets heard.
That shows you the administrative state wants it to be heard for some reason.
But at the same time, like I said, on the Second Amendment, they've been pretty good.
What's your outlook right now?
What's your 40,000-foot view of this whole process and where it goes?
I share your mind on this.
I can understand from a like a pop culture point of view, you can label the Supreme Court conservative, whatever that means.
Although we understand Justice Roberts is something with swing vote.
And then it seems, at least in this case, that we've never really had a majority.
Like Justice Amy Coney Barrett seems to have been doubtful about the effects of overturning the rule the whole time.
So it never felt to me and still doesn't, especially after the arguments, doesn't feel like we have a majority of the court.
If I just have to be honest about it.
Now, I was shocked when Bruin was announced.
That's a major, heavy-hitting Second Amendment decision in originalist terms, right?
Thomas wrote that opinion.
That's in terms that I would have never expected the Second Amendment to have been defended.
And yet, lower courts, lower federal courts still ignore it.
So, you know, I've told people not to be like totally black pilled, but I've told people that even when the Supreme Court gives you the decision you actually want, like your fantasy football decision, that still doesn't mean the Ninth Circuit or, you know, like New York or Connecticut's going to care.
And then what do you do?
So, yeah, it's questionable.
So you think you're going to get the favorable decision, but it's going to be policy as usual, obviously, in a place like New York.
I'm a former New Yorker.
I left her in the COVID-19 44 nightmare.
And I can tell you firsthand that in order to get a handgun permit, you better be in law enforcement.
You better be in security.
You better be a veteran.
And even that process is a long one and pretty arduous.
At the end of the day, you'll probably get it then.
But otherwise, good luck.
You better have all those people writing those letters of character for you.
And then you better know somebody on the inside.
Now, that's the other thing.
We have a system of outward corruption when it comes to finances.
And this can't be a cheap thing to fight.
Lawyers are not cheap folks.
I would also imagine that you do have a lot of volunteer work because of the scope of this and the Second Amendment issue.
But when we're talking about funding on the other side, their resources are infinite.
If they don't get the decision that they want, they're going to come at it from another angle.
How long do you expect to go to court?
Well, the easy answer here is until I can't, you know, and it's been that way now for 10 years.
I never expected to be able to be a defender or a plaintiff for 10 years, but here I am.
And so I suppose I'll keep going.
But it's not exactly like what I planned to do 10 years ago, right?
But people have reminded me over the years that, well, actually, no, that is what you plan to do.
You printed a gun, you put it online.
You created the way of doing that.
And you should expect to be sued now for the rest of your life.
That's probably true.
And if you're a Second Amendment-related company or organization, you should expect to be challenged now forever.
Therefore, like to your point, there are organizations like the Farmers Policy Coalition and the Second Amendment Foundation.
They are organizational parties of this case, this one that went to the Supreme Court.
Cardio Miracle Controversy00:02:51
And that is very useful, right?
It wasn't just like, I was an intervener plaintiff in this case.
Two businesses had to go out of business on the way up in this case.
So there's real costs.
There's real toll.
Everybody's chipping in.
And it's easier to do when there's multiple plaintiffs.
But there are many cases where my company is the only defendant or the only plaintiff.
And I don't know.
You go month to month, you just figure it out.
It's a crazy, it's a crazy way to live.
It's kind of like a cold civil war.
And people don't realize it's not just at the federal level where, oh, we're fighting the administrative state.
It's also states versus states where, you know, like I'm in Texas.
California has begun to pass laws where that just target my company and companies like mine in our states, where it's just a battle between two states and they try to keep it out of federal court.
This is a totally new situation from like maybe 20 years ago.
We got to take a break, but I want to get into where the future goes.
I mean, listen to what the man just said.
I expect to be in court the rest of my life.
Folks, take it from a guy who's been in this arena for almost 20 years.
Everything I've done is to stay out of a courtroom for the rest of my life under any circumstance.
We're going to take a break.
We're going to come back.
More making sense of the madness after this.
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Why We Left Google00:14:20
And we are back.
And, you know, I saw you kind of laugh there, but that's a real thing.
You know, I'm one of the guys that made the loose change films.
A lot of people kind of just kind of slandered us.
I'm one of the first, I am the first guy that ever had his own show on Infowars.com all the way back in 2009.
The InfoWarrior, as they expanded, I can't tell you how many times pre-Sandy Hook, Jones is like, they'll sue us into the ground, Burmese.
You can't put it in.
Yeah.
And I healed those words.
He was right.
Listen, he wasn't wrong.
What you said, I think we're joking about it, but the gravity of it shouldn't be lost on people.
Because look, the Second Amendment is there, not in large part, in pretty much all parts other than self-defense of the Fourth Amendment of you and your family to protect you from the government and ensure you can say what you want and think what you want.
We have seen a massive pushback on what you can say or think in this society.
And for you to articulate the fact that on the firearms end, this is going to be a battle that is essentially eternal.
I think you're correct.
Okay.
But where do you think the Second Amendment goes in the next two cycles, Trump or not?
You know, I know there's a lot of hopium out there about Trump, but quite frankly, the technology only gets better on the authoritarian or military end.
There's a certain, like, kind of as we talked about, capstone for the people and the demonization of American citizens and the outward, you know, use now, not only of the Justice Department, but DHS, domestic terror.
You know, we're talking about Tina Peters is doing nine years in prison as an auditor for doing her job.
I mean, she didn't change anything.
She took a digital image of the facts of that machine and is doing nine years for that.
We've seen people now go to jail for their speech, politically targeted.
You could hate Steve Bannon.
What did he do?
Refuse to be part of a show trial on January about a January 6th insurrection that's not real.
So the scope has changed.
Where do you think our Second Amendment and this country is actually going to be in the next 48 years?
Gosh.
I don't disagree with anything in your setup, by the way.
I think those are all the right statements and that's the right framing of the question.
But, you know, I'm in Austin, Texas, so I drive around and I do think about what happened to Alex Jones.
And it's essentially something like, well, they'll create a phenomenon in the name of national security and then impress upon us through the media, because it's a media-led government, that that phenomenon was so dangerous that speaking about it or disinformation about it, if you will, is so damaging that whoever did it or instigated it needs to be destroyed financially, if not otherwise.
And that's exactly what they executed with Alex Jones.
That was new.
There's like there's ontological stuff happening there that's new.
And they got away with it scot-free.
And they'll get away with it with me and other people.
Like, I don't want to be like some kind of martyr, but it's like, what chance do I have?
Alex Jones was making real money, you know, and he can't beat him.
It's in the same way, it's kind of like Donald Trump.
You don't have to like Alex Jones.
Donald Trump's a billionaire and they're going to ruin him for trying to be president.
You know, okay, well, what chance do we have?
And you say the next two cycles, well, okay, let's say Trump wins.
Fine, the Supreme Court stays good and some of the ornamental aspects of this constitutional republic stay in place.
But if anything, it's like you almost want Harris to win so that the mask is fully off and your Supreme Court won't stay conservative for one more cycle.
And then you'll get decisions which pay lip service to the Second Amendment.
Like, well, of course, you have the right to keep and bear arms, but the founders, they didn't really anticipate like this type of laser gun or something or drone warfare.
And, you know, obviously those types of weapons aren't protected.
But it's very easy to see how this will go because you see it kind of workshopped in district courts in the East and West Coast all the time right now.
At least it's easy for me because that's my kind of, you know, it's my work, my daily work.
But I think this extends to every other aspect of the administrative state, as you mentioned.
It's sue and settle, like liberals sue to advance policy.
The court can only take 60 to 80 cases a year.
So all this stuff kind of just continues on autopilot with its own inertia, momentum.
And it almost doesn't matter who, you know, fills the official ceremonial positions of power.
So in large part, I agree that, you know, the president can only do so much, right?
I've always said there are varying degrees of puppetry.
But as far as the mask coming off, the mask's not fully off with them installing a dementia patient that wasn't even rocking in the primaries and then putting the other woman there and literally invoking democracy again and again and again,
yet obfuscating the actual democratic process of who was going to win in the primaries by not having any and then pulling back the dementia patient to install somebody that got less than 2% In the last, I mean, I think the mask is totally off for the vast majority of the people that aren't just under mass psychosis, right?
That just, for some reason, listen, I'm not in love with Trump.
I just want, I'm not rocking MAGA hats.
I think Assange, terrible policy, Pompeo, Bolton, terrible people.
I go down the line, Matt is a terrible decision, but they cut him off from anybody that was half decent and went right after them.
Flynn's not perfect, but he actually did want to change.
Same with Bannon, right?
So I'm hoping, and he's got the right people around him this time.
I think Ramaswamy, all these people aren't perfect, but an inventive way to take on the administrative state is to cut it in half on day one.
You got to do stuff like that.
If you want to, Trump, you're almost 80.
Go and swing it.
Social Security number style, take all of them out.
The country's not going to end.
The media is already hate you.
And don't get me wrong.
They'll go into overload.
Oh, my God, mass unemployment.
Yeah, because we don't need you.
We don't need all of these bureaucracies.
And then in the next three to six months, like Ramaswamy said, get rid of them.
And the way you get rid of them is you declassify everything and you just show everybody what we're going to bleep that out.
What monsters they are.
Because, you know, and that's the thing.
We do need the JFK, RFK, MLK documents to show you why you need a Second Amendment.
And then the 9-11 ones, you know, and the 9-11 ones in particular to show you how this Leviathan of a surveillance and authoritarian techno-state came into fruition because they had all the tools in the toolbox previously.
They were already spying on you.
Anybody can look it up, Hepting versus ATT.
They were already recording everything.
They just needed to legitimize it and put in things like Deutsche Land Security, et cetera, that weren't there prior.
And, you know, Homeland Security has done so great to secure our borders.
You know, I mean, it's a bad joke.
So I know I went on a rant there and I cursed folks.
I usually don't do that.
What have you seen?
Yeah, I mean, I see the grays coming in your beard like mine.
I'd say you're probably about 10 years younger.
I'm 45.
You look about 35-ish.
Wow.
Thank you.
I mean, what have you seen in your generation?
What's been the scope of this?
And I would say this, you also have a front row seat to show you how the executive or the federal state can come after somebody.
Yeah, a lot of people, even now, still don't have the state in their lives.
And I think COVID was a way of changing that.
A lot of people woke up to the fact that the state wanted to be in their lives in a big way.
And still, we all just kind of were asleep to what happened.
We would rather not talk about the COVID years and just pretend like it's all kind of still continuing without some kind of sea change.
I'll say, by the way, you know, Loose Change was a huge influence on me in my generation when we were in college.
And I think what tells you about the difference between then and now is you couldn't post something like Loose Change Now on YouTube, at least, right?
It would never have made it.
Well, hold on, let me stop you.
Also, there was competition then because YouTube is actually one of the last tech companies that wasn't started by InQ Tel or the executive state.
It was actually absorbed by Google.
And really, Loose Change didn't go viral on YouTube because they only had the 10-minute videos.
You had to have a director's account, et cetera.
But Google Video was competing.
You could put up a four-hour video and we allowed everybody to do it.
And now we were in the top 10 out of the top 100 seven times.
And then down the line, people putting it in other languages, et cetera, from the competition that would buy YouTube for $8 billion.
So they still needed, remember, that was the don't be evil years of Google when they absorbed all this.
They always had the intelligence ties, but they knew, look, right now when we're talking about X, I'm no Musk fan.
You know, the freedom of speech and freedom of reach go hand in hand.
There doesn't need to be an algorithm.
If I follow you, I see your post.
That's what the algorithm used to be, everybody.
That's why loose change could go viral because people would go down the line on their post and 26 people were posting this thing and you saw every one of them.
It wasn't curated for you.
But now it is.
I'm sorry I cut you off, but please continue.
No, no.
No, look, that's great.
What I have seen just in my time and just in this little cabin of Second Amendment activity, which was always downstream of Jones, by the way, I kind of cut my teeth on Alex Jones and he helped make my name.
I came onto his program quite a bit back, you know, 10 years ago.
And of course, I watched in 2015 how every tech company on the same day kicked him off of their platforms and their marketplaces.
He had the number one app on the Apple Store and the Google Play Store.
He had the number one app.
Okay.
And he didn't fake that.
Okay.
People wanted that content.
And they've had to manipulate not just guys like Jones.
They have to prevent guys like Jones from really becoming anymore.
And so it's a, maybe you can say it's a dead internet in ways that like matter.
You know, you cannot advertise.
Let's say the Second Amendment still lives in this country.
Everyone has the absolute right to keep and bear arms in this country, but you can't advertise about it on the internet.
You know, you can't sell a product about it on Google or Facebook or the channels that represent 80% of the internet commerce.
Let's say you want to put like one of my machines on Amazon or something.
Forget about it.
In fact, we all know it's patently ridiculous to even try.
This is a state of censorship, which is relatively unacknowledged.
And everyone just kind of abides by it and says, well, the First Amendment's about the government censoring you, not Amazon or Jeff Bezos.
Which is totally bull because they all have government contracts.
Google has partnered with NASA in quantum computing and AI, the most important things in the military-industrial complex.
Amazon, that owns the Washington Post, has also coupled with the data centers of Intel agencies.
Meta, okay, that's a Peter Thiel project.
Palantir, they go hand in hand in hand.
It's Johnny nonsense.
This argument needs to be a business.
Elon Musk, he's the number one defense contractor in the world.
Forget about the country.
Okay.
I mean, that's it.
What do you mean?
These aren't private companies.
Just because they're on the stock market and traded doesn't mean they're private.
We live in an outward techno-fascistic society.
They want to talk about technocracy.
No, it is a tech monopoly based in collectivism.
I couldn't agree more.
And I'll just give people some waypoints or some footnotes, right?
Like Assange was one of the first people to really spell this out because what he was trying to do with WikiLeaks really ran him up against not just Google, but the U.S. State Department, Eric Schmidt, and Hillary Clinton.
And he realized, oh, they're working together.
Okay.
And he wrote papers about how, you know, there's certain phone numbers you could call for Google, and a State Department agent would call you back.
Okay.
And it only continued from there.
We have reporters like Jacob Siegel.
Obviously, I should mention Glenn Greenwald, you know, Matt Taibbi, but Siegel comes to mind in this exact moment where he's done writing on this, what he calls the hoax of the 21st century, this idea of misinformation, disinformation, where the government is comfortable in a certain arrangement of public-private partnership.
They know that they can't launch, you know, they can't censor your show right now directly.
So they employ a number of NGOs and private companies to grade you, to rate you, to recommend you to other services, to derank you, you know.
And so it's an expression of public policy through private actors.
And this is unchallenged.
And like you said in the Missouri case, by the time you do get it before a court, there's not the necessary state or federal statutes to do anything about it, or there's not the will with the elite bar to do anything.
So I hope to be attached to a case in Texas under HB20 to target YouTube, for example.
And maybe when that happens, you and I can talk about it.
Oh, we'll be talking about it, brother.
It's been a great conversation.
Let everybody know where they can check out your work and support you.
Donor Deck and Challenge Coins00:02:37
Hey, thanks.
If you're interested in kit guns, like that were the subject of this Supreme Court case, you can go to ghostsguns.com.
If you're interested in downloading files for 3D guns, you can go to DEFCAD.com.
And what you see there is ghostgunner.net.
So thank you very much.
Thank you, guys.
We got to take a quick break.
We'll be back with more Making Sense of the Madness after this.
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And we are now joined by Brian Reisinger.
He is...
Is the author of Land Rich Cash Poor and our resident expert when it comes to everything family farms?
So, Brian, first of all, thanks for joining us.
False Choices In Farming00:08:41
For those that are unaware of who you are and your work, give us a quick synopsis.
Yeah, well, thanks for having me, Jason.
I appreciate it.
I'm a farmer's son.
I grew up on a farm in southwest Wisconsin in the Midwest, and I'm an author.
I'm a writer.
And as you said, I wrote Land Rich, Cash Poor, and I told the story of what's happened in our country.
Why have our farms been disappearing decade after decade in this country?
What's that doing to our food?
What's that doing to who we are as a country?
And I wove that with my family story.
So we've got personal experience with this issue as well.
And it's to your point, it's something that's affecting the entire country day in and day out.
Now, when we're talking about the EPA, look, I'm always skeptical of government organizations.
I would say there's always corruption, there's always overreach.
At the same time, I can understand for certain standards and regulations surrounding our food supply, our medical supply, but certainly after the COVID-19 nightmare, I would question organizations like the CDC and FDA much more heavily.
Tell us about the EPA.
And overall, before we even get into this story about this new regulation that's probably going to cause a lot of closures, what is your viewpoint as somebody that's probably had to deal with them your entire life on some level?
Yeah.
You know, the issue with the EPA, like so many government agencies, is so often whether we, whatever we want to take the intentions to be, let's, you know, allow for the moment that they're good intentions.
It is the law of unintended consequences.
And what so many farms face is the way that regulations from the EPA as well as other agencies are constantly increasing the costs of what it takes to be able to make a living.
And when you have farms that are already so close to the edge, it is an incredibly difficult thing to be layering on additional expenses.
Now, the challenge is that gets bumped up against things that people care about.
People care about the environment.
Farmers care about the environment.
They care about the land, right?
People care about health.
People care about these different things.
And so what ends up happening is when you have government agencies that end up being heavy-handed, end up having, you know, quote-unquote solutions that are cookie cutter or that don't allow for individual circumstances on the ground, you have these massive unintended consequences.
And it ends up hurting many of the same people that is intended to help.
So let's talk about this.
What are these new rules under the Environmental Protection Agency that is going to cause a lot of these closures?
Because, you know, I've seen a lot of the over the drone footage of some of these establishments.
And look, it looks a little gross, right?
I would say that there are certainly some farms that are pretty egregious.
And I want to ensure that that's not getting into my water supply.
At the same time, I live here in Iowa on the Illinois border, right off the Mississippi River.
And quite frankly, it's not the farms that I'm concerned about.
It's the massive amount of PFAs in my water supply that this same agency is supposed to be protecting me from.
Yet crickets every, oh, I guess the chemicals over there don't matter so much.
So it does seem like a system of picking and choosing winners, manufactured outrage, et cetera.
But I want to get your take on these rules in particular.
And I want to get your opinion on those that may be putting others in danger.
Yeah.
You know, it is the classic example of the dilemma that the American people are put in when we have a need to make things are done in a healthy and safe way.
And people care more than ever about where their food comes from.
Talk about that a lot on this show, and they care about it for good reason.
And, you know, these rules at the same time, they end up being the kind of thing that create barriers and can increase costs.
And so, we're trying to balance these things.
Here's the issue that we have: this country is really being put, and all of our citizens are being put in a place of having a false choice where they have to decide: well, do I care about health and environment, or do I want to push back against government overreach?
And the reality is that the reason we're in this position is because the disappearance of our farms and the integration of so much of our food industry has meant that when we have a couple of large distribution centers or processing centers or a really large farm, something like that face challenges or problems or end up being part of a problem or end up having a government-fueled problem, whatever the issue may be.
It has such a massive impact on our food supply.
And so, when you see the outrage and the frustration over what's going on with the EPA, part of the issue is that we have an industry that has such a vulnerable supply chain.
There are so few ways for food to get from the farm gate to the dinner table unless people take themselves outside of that system and buy locally.
There are so many barriers that can get in the way that food prices are through the roof, our food supply becomes suspect.
And these are the kinds of consequences that we have just because of a government agency maybe not getting the balance right on a regulatory issue.
You know, speaking of taking the food supply into your own hands, I can't encourage people to do that enough.
Now, I understand there may be some people that feel trapped, but listen, even if you live in Chicago, you can drive to where I am.
You can get, you know, again, I get an eighth of a cow and I get a quarter of a hog.
Usually last me, in fact, right now, it's in October.
I usually re-up in January, got a few steaks left.
All the ground beef is gone, they're vacuum sealed.
They take to I had some T-bones, folks, to die for like actual bone-in, whole nine.
Uh, the marble was incredible.
Something, if you were eating that at a restaurant, you'd be paying $65 for that steak.
Even if I'm buying at the grocery store, I'm paying $15 to $25 a pound for that same steak when you can get it in both.
Now, I still have the option of going to Target, Walmart, Hy-V in my area.
We've even got a natural groceries and a fresh time.
So, there are options, but you want to keep those options.
So, I guess when I look at this particular regulation, I don't think it's going to be a concern for the big boys.
In other words, the ones that are backed by the Gates Farms or something like a Smithfield that's now owned by China, essentially, they're always going to pump the money into these new demands.
However, like you said, the mom and pop shops, people like yours that have been around for generations, these new regulations that may not even be benefiting us.
You know what I mean?
And when I say us, I mean the general populace, it may be paying lip service.
I just, again, want to remind people that when COVID was going on, a bunch of celebritards like Jennifer Lopez and Robert De Niro De Niro had a seal for you because they had the right air filtration system, and you were way safer walking into that coffee shop than the one down the road that was dirty.
Like, that's the type of stuff we're talking about with these regulations, no?
Yeah, you know, love their movies, but the American public doesn't need them advising them on where to get their food and how to make their choices.
And you said it exactly right with the EPA.
Issue is that these regulations are designed to catch the big actors.
They may be designed even, you know, to make sure that they only catch the bad actors.
But the reality is that all actors are impacted, and it is those smaller operations that have the hardest time.
It's a perfect comparison to there's a long-running rule called the Waters of the United States rule that the EPA had.
And what they were trying to do is make sure that certain waters that were considered navigable, like you could, you know, take a boat down them, were regulated properly.
Well, it was being applied in a way that you could have a crick running through, you know, the back 40 of the small family farm, and it was suddenly going to be regulated in that way.
And it was really problematic.
So, this is just a classic repeat of that stuff.
And you're absolutely right about the way out.
People have the option to do what you're doing, you know, buy half a cow, buy a quarter of a pig, that kind of thing.
And then also, there are so many ways that we can help fuel local options.
Local Options Galore00:03:26
Stop by our local butcher shop, stop by local farmers' market.
You know, and you can also go to some grocery stores.
They will carry local options when pressed.
So, I don't want to say that the grocery store has to be the enemy here.
You can go and you can go to your local grocery and say, Hey, here's the kind of stuff that I look for.
Here's, you know, if everybody's talking about that, it's going to create new options for consumers.
It's going to create new entrepreneurial opportunities for farmers.
That's the only way we get out of this.
We are caught in this trap where we have to choose between: do you care about your health and your environment or do you want your food?
How do we ask the public to make that choice?
Well, I hope that the Maha crowd does get in there.
I think, you know, a lot of people are now understanding that there are a multitude of things in our food, in our preservatives, that are not allowed in other countries for a very good reason.
And, you know, you mentioned some of these smaller companies kind of doing their own thing.
Quickstar is one of them.
I absolutely love Quickstar.
They have their own dairy farm.
I like the dairy I get there.
I like getting butter there.
And by the way, it's the only place that I can get a steak anymore at three in the morning since COVID because everything else is shut down.
We're going to take a quick break.
We're going to come back.
Final segment of the show.
We're going to talk about those supply lines that have been alluded to.
You're not going to want to miss it more making sense of the madness after this.
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Working Class Divide00:09:32
And we are back.
Now, Brian, you were talking about supply chains earlier.
And we recently had this strike that was actually resolved rather quickly.
First of all, let me stump through these guys for a second.
Because, you know, I'm not a conservative.
I'm not a liberal.
I'm a realist.
I'm also a realist about technology, but they saw they were being automated out.
They also realized that in the last four years, inflation is well above 30%.
I mean, in real world terms, it's not 3%.
It's not 9%.
It's not coming down.
Eggs are more.
Milk is more.
I do the water test.
I often talk about it.
You get a gallon of bottled water in most places for 88 to 98 cents.
Now it is a buck 40.
Do the math, everybody.
It's water.
Okay.
So these guys at, honestly, I think they kind of got a raw deal.
And, you know, everybody's like, whoa, 63% over five years.
They already took 30%.
That's like a little bit more than a 10% margin.
It's going to take them three years to get to this level of inflation when we don't know what the economy even looks like in the next three years.
And we are living in a new world of automation that is changing our supply chain, that is changing our way of life in farming as well.
You know this, drones, different types of equipment that are now autonomous.
Autonomy is coming in that regards quickly.
But had they maintained this strike, this could have been catastrophic for the supply chain via food.
Another great reason to live here in Iowa.
I'm 15 minutes away from the largest truck stop in the world where the supply chain literally runs through the middle of the country.
I'm not sweating it, but others should, should they not?
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, the long shortman strike was really the near miss of food disasters that we could have had.
You know, in COVID, we saw what happens when that supply chain locks up, right?
Where the farmers can't move their goods and where people can't find what they need in the store.
The longshoreman strike had the opportunity to be or the threat to be the same thing with food imports.
So we import so much food into this country, which is a whole other related issue.
We import so much food.
And a prolonged strike could have suddenly put us in a position to not be able to bring in the food that we need to bring in.
Now, long term, we should address that by restoring our farms, entrepreneurial opportunities, switching to local and regional food markets, right?
But in the immediate sense, if you suddenly halt imports like that, food prices, food abundance, all of these things, food security, are going to be in serious jeopardy.
So we're very fortunate that it got headed off as early as it did.
And to your exact point, Jason, this is a great example of a way that our country ends up pitting working people against working people.
Why?
Because farmers were looking at that strike saying, boy, I hope they don't do that because I got to get my food exports out of the country.
And I don't want the whole food system disrupted and all kinds of issues that would have been caused.
And the union were saying, hey, we got a wrong deal.
So why do we have farmers and workers at odds over this?
This is another example of where the disappearance of our farms, the challenges, the vulnerabilities that our food system have are making people having to make these kind of untenable choices that they shouldn't have to make.
You know, let's talk about that because there's always an us versus them.
And it's usually tried to be framed by these bigwigs out there that somehow, you know, billionaires are the ones always oppressing them, et cetera.
It's this guy, but they're never named, right?
And then they have these large swaths and groups.
You're not supposed to like this person because they worship this God or they're this certain color or they own this business.
In fact, in previous shows, we've talked about kind of the competition within the farming, right?
Oh, he uses this grain.
It gets down to Coke and Pepsi level, folks.
You know, I worked at a pizzeria.
Like, my dude was so hardcore Coca-Cola.
Oh, you got Pepsi, huh?
Like, we'll walk out of this place.
It's that.
When, in fact, we should all be embracing this and supporting it and realize their hardship is our hardship on a certain economic level and then actually naming those billionaires and entities and saying, oh, wow, they're behind these lobbyist groups that are projecting this narrative and this agenda while oppressing the rest of us.
How do we get past those barriers?
Because everything these days is disguised, manipulated, hypnotized, et cetera.
Well, one of the biggest things is the American public has a pretty good BS meter and we need to trust our instincts and feel when we're being manipulated.
And when working people in farm country and working people on the docks are being pitted against each other, something doesn't add up, right?
And there are such better ways.
One example would be, what if we were to change the way trade policy works in this country, where yes, we are pursuing markets abroad.
We are making sure it is free and fair trade, both free and fair.
And we're really judicious about the imports that we bring in.
It's only the things, for example, like kiwi and bananas, right, that, you know, can't be grown as well in America.
We're really careful about those things.
We could have a totally different world because what we have right now, the world we have now, is we have farms disappearing at the rate of 45,000 per year in this country.
And at the same time, we're importing all this food.
Why are we wiping out our domestic farms and importing all this food?
Why not instead say, what do we need to do to get our farms able to have more entrepreneurial opportunity, be growing entrepreneurial ventures again, supply more of the food we need here in this country so we don't have to import quite as much and then be able to export more of it.
So rather than having farms disappearing and importing all this food that could be locked up by the strike by the longshoremen, why not be producing more food here, exporting more of it, not importing quite as much of it?
And at that point, farmers have growing economic opportunity.
And if the longshoreman strike, farmers can say, hey, let's meet their demands because we got to get this food out to market on the global market.
We're not going to have to be talking about the challenge to our domestic food supply by food not being able to come in.
So these are all false choices.
We could make these changes and we could support our domestic farm industry and food industry, support our domestic people who transport our goods, like the longshoremen, like the truckers.
All of us can be in league in this if we aren't set up with these false choices that the powers of the B leave us with.
Well, what are your thoughts on the fact that the unions used to be something that were mainly behind the Democratic Party?
And now we've suddenly seen this shift where we see the largest union out there, at least in name and face, Teamsters, speaking at the RNC.
Now, again, these aren't right or left issues to me, but many more conservatives have at least come around to the idea of unionized labor in certain regards.
I think there are some places where it's obviously a detriment, especially in our education system.
But in large part, that's because of government oversight and these kind of collusive elements where I still see a lot of labor unions somewhat at odds with these type of policies.
Yeah, there's a huge realignment going on in American politics around the working class.
And whether it is rural areas or whether it is urban areas and the working class there, and many of whom are unionized, the reality is that all across this country, from farmers to folks in trade unions in all corners of the country to folks in some of the major unions, some of the bigger organizations, they are recognizing that we're being pitted against each other in a way that we don't need to be.
And I'll be honest with you, to your point, I think both parties have had a struggle with how to deal with this.
Traditionally, Republicans had problems with unions, and the Democrats had them as part of their major voter turnout infrastructure.
But the reality is that a lot of the working class people are saying, hey, I don't see policies working for me.
I don't see this changing my situation.
And so in many ways, the working class is more up for grabs than they've ever been.
Some of them have been trending GOP very strongly, like in rural America.
Some of them have been maybe a little bit less so, but beginning to flirt with one side or the other in the way that some of the larger unions are.
And it's a reflection of the fact that working people in one way or another have found that the status quo isn't working for them.
So many of them are willing to try something different.
Brian, what would you like to leave the audience with and how can they support you and your work, sir?
Well, I appreciate it.
I think the biggest thing that I hope people can realize is that if we were to focus on making sure that our farms had new growing entrepreneurial opportunity in this country, we could create new opportunity for farms, but also have more variety, better prices, better food, fresher food for people all across the country.
We wouldn't have to worry about near misses like the long short and strike or anything else like that.
I hope people can keep talking about these issues.
They can get my book, Land Rich Cash Pro on Amazon or anywhere else you buy online or at your local bookstore.
They'll have it or they can order it for you.
And I hope that people just continue to talk about these ideas because if the American consumer makes a change, you can bet that the American system of capitalism is going to respond to it.
Absolutely, Brian.
Thank you so much.
And thank you guys for watching this show five days a week here at Patriot.tv, where the truth lives.