Why Did Zohran Win in NYC? Plus: Gazan Pulitzer Prize Winner Mosab Abu Toha on the Latest Atrocities
Pulitzer Prize-winning poet Mosab Abu Toha discusses daily life and survival in Gaza under Israel's siege and control. Plus: Glenn breaks down Zohran Mamdani's win in the New York City primary and what the young democratic socialist candidate's victory over Andrew Cuomo means for the future of the Democratic party. --------------------------------- Watch full episodes on Rumble, streamed LIVE 7pm ET. Become part of our Locals community Follow Mosab Abu Toha Follow System Update: Twitter Instagram TikTok Facebook
Welcome to a new episode of System Update, our live nightly show that airs every Monday through Friday at 7 p.m.
Eastern exclusively here on Rumble, the free speech alternative to YouTube.
Tonight, Zoran Mamdani, who had been a relatively obscure member of the New York State Assembly, scored one of the largest political upsets in New York City politics last night, arguably one of the largest upsets in American politics when he won the Democratic Party nomination for mayor of New York City against multiple candidates led by Andrew Cuomo back in February, just four months ago.
Cuomo had a massive polling lead.
He was backed by billionaires and been New York governor for 10 years until he was forced to resign amid scandals in 2021.
And he's a scion of one of the most beloved dynastic families in all of New York politics, with his dad, Mario Cuomo, having been a popular two-term New York governor who many thought would run for president and win.
Beyond that, the entire Democratic Party establishment and all big money was united against Zorond, behind Cuomo.
And Zorand was polling back in February at under 1%, just four months ago.
Yet he found a way not just to win the city ride waste, but to do so with a very sizable margin.
Many on the political right, including people who had never heard of him until about six days ago, and even more so in the establishment Democratic Party politics are absolutely horrified and even terrified by Zoran's win.
They're acting as though it's some sort of invasion by al-Qaeda and ISIS combined with Mao's China.
In fact, many on the right appear to think that Zoran, who's a leftist Muslim from Uganda, is some sort of unholy love child of Osama bin Laden and Joseph Stalin.
Establishment Democrats believe, as they did for Bernie's campaign in 2016 and AOC's win in 2018 and her emergence as a leader of the left-wing and the Democratic Party, that their future as a party will be destroyed by having a young candidate energize huge amounts of young voters, including young male voters, with an anti-establishment and economic populist agenda.
A range of views that are absolutely hated by their big donors who demand they adhere to corporatism, the kind of corporatism that most Americans on both sides of the aisle have come to hate.
There are a lot of caricatures being spread about Zoran and why he won, so it really is worth taking a clear look at what his campaign was and what it wasn't.
And more so, why did it galvanize so much unique excitement and turnout among many voters who don't typically vote?
And why in a city that does not exactly have a history of electing leftists, quite the contrary, why did it attract so much support his campaign from a wide range of voters?
You can ask that question, you should ask that question, you should understand the answers without having to love Zoran, hate him, or anything in between.
It's a completely separate question that we think is really worth asking.
What explains this extraordinary victory?
But first, we will talk to Mossab Abu Towa, who is a Palestinian writer and poet and scholar from Gaza.
He lived in Gaza with his family on October 7th, after which the massive Israeli assault on the Gaza Strip began.
His daughter is an American citizen, which enabled him and his wife to flee to Egypt with their daughter in December.
But along the way, he was detained and disappeared by the IDF and was released only under significant international pressure.
He wrote a series of essays for The New Yorker on the suffering and humanitarian crisis in Gaza, which won the 2025 Pulitzer Prize for Commentary, the awarding of which, needless to say, generated outrage and protest.
The war in Iran has really served to obscure and hide the still worsening crimes in Gaza over the last couple of weeks, and we think it's very important to talk with someone as informed as he is about the latest Israeli atrocities and what has been happening in Gaza.
Before we get to that, a couple of quick programming notes.
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For now, welcome to a new episode of System Update, starting right now.
As we just noted, Mossab Abu Towa is a Palestinian writer.
He's a poet, a scholar, and has worked hard on various libraries as well in Gaza.
He was in Gaza when Israel began its massive assault after the October 7th attack, and he was able to flee with his wife and young daughter who's an American citizen, though just barely.
He was there for about two months when he was able to flee.
He is now a Pulitzer Prize winner as a result of a series of essays he wrote last year in the New Yorker that chronicles and powerfully expresses the extreme human suffering and humanitarian catastrophe in Gaza.
And we are delighted to have him with us tonight to understand what has been happening there.
Mossab, it's great to see you.
Thank you so much for taking the time to talk to us.
Of course, it is my great pleasure.
Thank you so much, Glenn, for having me.
Absolutely.
So I wish we were meeting under better circumstances.
I wish we had something less depressing and horrific to talk about, but the world is what it is.
So I just want to get a little bit of understanding from you, since one of the things that you do is convey thoughts and emotions in words as a poet, as a writer, obviously now widely recognized one.
As somebody who's lived in Gaza, it's not new to you to be bombed by the Israelis.
Israel has been bombing Gaza, killing civilians many, many times over many, many years.
But I think it was very obvious for a variety of reasons, not just October 7th, but the composition of the current Israeli government, the obvious support the world was going to give them, that this is going to be far worse and quickly it turned out to be.
So you were in Gaza for about two months before you were able to get out.
What were those two months like for you and your family?
First of all, it is important to note that I was born in a refugee camp.
My parents were born themselves in refugee camps.
My grandparents on both sides were expelled from Miafa in 1948.
So I lived in Gaza all my life and I was a witness and a survivor of so many Israeli assaults.
I was wounded in one of the airstrikes in 2008-2009.
I survived by chance and I still have the wounds in my body, in my neck, in my forehead, in my cheeks and in my shoulder.
So surviving the genocide in Gaza was not the first time I survived the Israeli aggression.
In fact, I was in the United States between 2022, 2023.
I returned to Gaza in 2023 after I finished my MFA from Syracuse University.
And I then traveled to the United States again for a literary festival, Palestine Rites, which was held at UPenn in Pennsylvania, Philadelphia.
And I returned to Gaza 10 days before October 7th.
And I started my work.
I resumed my work as a teacher in Gaza.
Can I just interrupt you there?
Because that literary festival that you're referring to, shortly before October 7th, as I recall, there was a gigantic movement, this is before October 7th, to have that canceled simply on the grounds that people like you and other Palestinians were participating in speaking critically of Israel.
Can you just talk a little bit about that and then want to get back to what the experience was in Gaza?
Yeah.
I would like to say, Glenn, that, I mean, the criticism that me or other people are critical of Israel is not true.
We are not critical of Israel.
All we are doing is exposing, you know, the crimes that Israel has been committing, whether it's in the Gaza Strip or in the West Bank.
So I don't care if it was a different country, if it was a different people, I would still do the same thing because this is happening to me and to my people, to my parents, to my children, and also to my grandchildren.
So it is not that people in Palestine or Palestinians or even pro-Palestinian people who care about human rights, it's not that they are critical of Israel or whatever you call it.
It's that people are talking and advocating on behalf of the people who have been living under occupation for 77 years.
And this is perceived as a crime.
When you talk about crimes that are committed by a state that has been created in 1948 and that's been funded by, unfortunately, Western countries and also the United States until today, even as they are committing an ongoing genocide.
So it is shameful that the festival, some of the participants were cancelled or they were not permitted to be on campus at the University of Pennsylvania in September 2023.
But here we are in 2025.
Palestinian people, Palestinian writers, Palestinian journalists have been the main target of the Israeli airstrikes.
And Palestinian activists and pro-Palestinian activists have been canceled from so many places, even artists, even singers.
They were canceled from big events because of what they say about the Palestinian people and their right to exist and to exist with dignity.
Yeah, I mean, we covered so many censorship-based reactions to suppress pro-Palestinian speech, but I just thought it was important to remember that that's been happening in the United States well before October 7th, and in fact, just a week or two before at one of our great universities, the University of Pennsylvania, where apparently just the mere presence of Palestinian voices, in a view of a lot of people, justified trying to get the entire event canceled and did end up getting some of the people banned.
All right, so you went back to Gaza after that event, and shortly thereafter, the October 7th attack happened, and then followed by this massive Israeli air assault on Gaza.
Unlike, I think, anything that has happened in Gaza for a long time, despite how terrible and fatal so many of the other ones were.
Just in your own words, what was that like, just to be constantly surrounded by death, by the risk of death, by the fear that you would go to bed and not wake up?
How did you navigate that?
So it is important, Glenn, to note that Palestinians in Gaza have been massacred by the Israeli forces, the Israeli army.
Without, I mean, I was 21 years old.
Sorry, I was 31 years old when I left Gaza for the last time.
I've never, before October 7, I've never in my life saw an Israeli, seen an Israeli soldier.
Israel was bombing us from the sky.
Israel was firing at us from gunboats and warships in the sea, in our sea, just seven or eight nautical miles off our shore.
They were shooting at us.
They were killing us.
They were dropping bombs on us.
Without us seeing, I've never seen an Israeli, not even an Israeli soldier, never seen an Israeli soldier, an Israeli civilian, you know, in my life.
So we have been killed.
We have been abducted.
We have been injured.
Our houses have been destroyed on top of our families without us seeing who these people are who have been killing us, without seeing, I mean, they see us from on a screen.
They see us as dots, black and white dots moving on the ground, or maybe structures on the ground.
And lately, they have been filming us, you know, through their drones, people who are trying to get aid.
You know, there are so many videos of people who try to go back to their homes to collect food.
And then there is a footage of an Israeli drone missile hitting them and killing them.
So I lived in Gaza all my life, and I've never seen an Israeli soldier.
I was wounded, and I don't know whether that soldier knew or whether that Israeli pilot who dropped the bomb in 2009, knew that they killed seven people in that airstrike, and they wounded a 16-year-old child who became a Pulitzer Prize-winning Author.
So when Israel attacked Gaza, it's not only a military attack.
Israel did not only drop bombs, they did not fire bullets at people, unarmed people, but they also shut off electricity, shut off water, shut off food trucks.
They control everything.
So it's not like Israel just attacked Gaza militarily.
No, they blocked everything.
Even as we are talking, people do not have not only enough food because we always talk about the lack of food, the lack of water, the lack of shelter, but there's lack of medicine.
One of the relatives of my brother-in-law who was wounded in a strike that killed his brother 20 days ago, and I wrote about him in my last piece in The New Yorker, he was at the hospital, at Ashifa Hospital, and the shrapnel covered his body, and his arms and his body was wrapped in gauze.
And he complained to the doctors that he has some pain in his body.
And you know what they gave him?
They gave him something like Tylenol.
Something that you take when you have a headache.
There is no medicine in Gaza.
And even there is no healthy food.
The kind of food that is entering Gaza is canned food.
You know, it's canned beans, canned peas, sugar, frying oil.
There is no fresh food, not only for people to grow normally, but even for those, the dozens of thousands of Palestinians who were injured, there is no healthy food, fresh food, like vegetable, like fruit, like meat, for them to heal.
So people in Gaza are dying several, several, several times.
And if you allow me, I mean, because now we are talking today in Gaza, it's 2.20 a.m.
It's Thursday today, June 26th.
As we are talking, just in the past hour, Israel bombed a tent in Khan Yunis, killing five people.
And before that, yesterday, they killed 101 people all over the Ghastreb.
Of these people was a whole family from Abdahdu family.
And I wrote their names on my social media.
I mean, we don't get to know the names of these people who are killed.
The father is named Hasalah Dahduh.
His wife is Salwa al-Hadu.
Their children are Ahmed, Assan, Abdallah, Assan, Mustafa, Assan, Allah, a daughter.
And the brother of the father was killed, and then there was a nephew.
So the Israel attack on Gaza is not by killing him, but even by bombing the internet, bombing the electricity, not allowing people even to report.
So there is difficulty in reporting, not only by not allowing journalists, international journalists, you know, to go to Gaza, but they are also bombing every means that Palestinians can use to report on their miseries and their suffering and their demise.
So that's why it is very important to talk about what's happening in Gaza and also in Palestine every day.
Israel is killing people in Gaza, in Palestine, every day.
That's why every day we have to speak, to talk about Palestine.
You know, one of the, and there's a lot of, obviously we could talk about, we cover a lot, the atrocities pretty much on a daily basis or close to it on this show.
But I do want to get to that as well, just some of the more recent things that have been happening that, as I said, have been even more covered up than usual, not just by the lack of media in Gaza, international media, and the lack of internet, but also by so much attention paid to what was happening in Iran.
But one of the things I'd like to ask you is one of the ways that, because I had John Mearsheimer on my show yesterday and we were both talking about how is it that the world can watch what's going on in Gaza, even to the extent that we get to see it?
How is it that the West that's paying for it, that's enabling it, can watch what's happening and it's just no one seems to mind.
Nobody seems to care.
Nobody seems bothered by it.
It just kind of goes on.
No one is even close to stopping it.
We just saw Trump order Netanyahu to turn the planes around from Iran, which obviously Biden could have done, Trump could have do at any time, and they just won't.
I'm trying to figure out like how can this be?
And I think one of the ways that that happens is the language of dehumanization.
So I think a lot of Americans have this perception of what Gaza is, what Palestine is, radically different than the reality.
And I was interested in the work that you've done in creating libraries in Gaza.
You're obviously very well-spoken.
You just want to pull as a prize for your writing in English.
I've had Gazans on my show before who are very similar, highly educated, well-spoken.
There's a whole network of, there were at least of Gazan universities and advanced centers of learning that are all now destroyed.
Gaza had one of the highest literacy rates in the world prior to October 7th.
Some of the best doctors that are respected all around the world as specialists in their field.
Can you talk about what Gazan society and Gazan culture is like and how it has been just so completely destroyed in the last 20 months?
Sure, yeah.
I mean, before I answer your question, I would like to highlight the fact that for two years now, not a single student in Gaza went to school.
In fact, the schools have become shelters.
As we are talking just half an hour at the same time that Israel bombed the tent in Khan Yunis, Israel bombed a classroom on the third floor of a school called Amr ibn As in a Sheikh dude in Gaza city.
And two or three people were reported to be killed.
So two years, no schools.
So anyone who was five years old when Israel attacked Gaza on October 7th hasn't gone to school for two years.
So this five-year-old child, if my children were to be there at the moment, my five-year-old child would have missed his first grade and second grade.
And for two years, students have missed their high school diploma tests.
So two years.
So people in Gaza are missing not only their lives, but even those who survive, they are missing a lot in their own lives.
The Gaza Strip lies on the beach of the Mediterranean.
See, Gaza is rich for its plants and the trees.
One of the best places in Gaza is a city or town called Bit Lahia and is very, very famous for strawberry farms.
My father-in-law is a strawberry farmer, and they used also to plant corn, onion, watermelon, oranges, and they used to even to, I mean, when it is allowed, you know, to export some of the strawberries to the West Bank.
But, I mean, Gaza is very beautiful, even though it has been under occupation since 1984, 1948.
It's been under siege since 2007.
Israel controls how much food gets into Gaza, how many hours of electricity is available in Gaza, how much medicine is allowed to enter Gaza, what kind of equipment, medical equipment, you know, get into Gaza, how many books get into Gaza.
Because when I was trying to build the Edward Saeed Public Library, two branches in 2017, 2019, and unfortunately, Israel destroyed the two libraries just like they destroyed all the universities in Gaza.
So Israel was in control of the entry of these books into Gaza.
Sometimes the books would be delayed by months.
It usually takes eight weeks for any box or any package to enter Gaza.
So Israel was controlling every single aspect of our lives in Gaza.
But despite that, we managed to make Gaza as much beautiful as we could.
But, you know, this campaign of destroying Gaza is non-stop.
Israel has been blowing up the houses in Betlahiya.
70%, this is an old statistic, 70% of Gaza has been either destroyed or damaged by Israeli, not only Israeli airstrikes when white people are sleeping inside, but even the houses that people had to leave because Israel announced them to be combat zone.
Israel has been systematically blowing these houses up.
And there are so many videos of Israeli soldiers, you know, documenting the blowing up of neighborhoods, of schools, of, you know, of their Bulgozars, you know, destroying a hospital in North Gaza, just next to the Indonesian hospital in Betlaya.
So Israel has been systematically destroying everything in Gaza.
So the question is not about when will there be a ceasefire in Gaza, although the ceasefire is just a beginning of a bigger change in Palestine.
But the question is, even after this ceasefire, Israel is trying to make it impossible for people to live again.
So let's say there is a ceasefire today.
There are no schools in Gaza.
70% of the population in Gaza do not have homes.
They are living in tents, even though they are living in tents, including some of my family members.
These tents get to be bombed.
Just a few days ago, Glenn, my neighbor was killed in an airstrike when Israel hit a group of people walking next to it.
She was inside her tent, and these tents are, you know, they are pulled up in the street, on the street.
So she was killed while she was inside her tent.
Her mother is still critically wounded, and all her brothers were wounded.
So Israel continues to destroy, to decimate as much of Gaza as possible.
And there is a systematic destruction of the refugee camps in Gaza.
Something that I wrote about in one of my pieces in The New Yorker is that Israel is not only destroying Gaza, you know, the cities and the villages and the towns, but they are also destroying refugee camps.
So, you know, the refugee camps after 1948, you know, it was a group of tens here and there.
And then, you know, their refugee status continued for years and years.
People started to build rooms from concrete.
And then over the hills, they started to build multi-story buildings.
So the refugee camp sent into a small city.
So Israel currently destroyed most, I mean, much of the Rejabale refugee camp, the largest refugee camp in Gaza.
So these people are now who were, you know, who lived in the refugee camp or people who were born in refugee camps like me and now are living in tents on the street, maybe sheltering in a school, in a hospital.
These people are now dreaming of returning to the refugee camp.
So this is the fault of the world.
This is the fault of the world because they left the Palestinian people to live in refugee camps.
They left them without protection.
And they not only left them without protection, they continue to support, to fund Israel's genocide.
And they, you know, like the United States cut its funding for UNRWA, which has been responsible for the delivery of aid and for the education of so many people, including me.
So this world is not working properly, really.
It's very strange for us to be watching this even 20 months after the start of the genocide and for me to watch it from here, from the United States.
Yeah, it's got to be almost impossible.
You know, just to underscore the point too, which I know I don't need to tell you, but for people who are watching, I mean, the control of Gaza by the Israelis, including it probably intensified since they removed troops, which they had there in 2005.
The control that continued was so great that the Israelis had phrases like really macabre, horrific, dark phrases like mowing the lawn, which meant let's just go in and kill some Palestinians or let's put the Palestinians on a diet when they would cut back the amount of food that they allowed in into Gaza.
So this has been the mentality going on for a long time.
I wanted to just to ask you something.
Obviously, we talk a lot about the number of people in Gaza who have been slaughtered since October 7th.
The Israelis are now open about the fact that they want to make Gaza uninhabitable, to force people to leave, to kill them until they leave, to destroy civilization until they leave.
Then it's at least a policy of ethnic cleansing.
One of the things I think about a lot, though, is for the people who do survive, who are able to survive the genocide, survive this ethnic cleansing, this onslaught, I have to think about how is it possible for them to have a future.
Here in Rio Janeiro, I live in Brazil, in Rio Janeiro, which is a city, especially in poorer areas that has a very high level of violence, drug gangs and the like, very high murder rates.
And I know some people who grew up there and they talk about, you know, one time when I was seven years old, I saw a dead body on the ground.
Or twice when I was in my teenage years, I saw a gun shootout.
And they talk about how psychologically scarring that is for life, like to be exposed to those kind of horrors even once or twice while you're growing up.
And here you have this massive civilian population in Gaza, 50% of them are children.
And the last two years, their lives have been nothing but bombing and destruction and murder and fear of death.
And, you know, just psychologically, how do you think that the people who are there who do survive it will be able to overcome that and at some point return to a normal semblance of life?
Well, this is a very hard question to answer.
It's very obvious that a population that's been trying to survive, I mean, I don't like to say that people live in Gaza.
No, people are trying to survive in Gaza because there is a difference between living in Gaza and trying to survive a genocide.
So these people for 20 months at least, they haven't lived a single day without suffering, without looking for food, looking for medicine, looking for water.
I mean, you know, Glenn, people, I was in Gaza during the first two months.
I remember walking in the street, you know, looking for water to fill a bucket of water, you know, for my children or for my wife, you know, to wash the dishes, maybe to have a shower, you know, in the school because there are no services in the school shelters, by the way.
I remember walking in the street and seeing five-year-old children, you know, standing in line to fill a bucket of water for their families or children maybe 10 years old.
I saw some of my students standing in line, you know, to get a pack of bread.
And that was in October and November 2023.
That was before Israel tightened its genocide.
So these are children, you know, five years old or seven years old.
These are no longer children.
These children are not practicing childhood.
So this is a very dangerous reality and it should also be a signal that there would be a very dangerous future for these children.
50% of the population in Gaza are children.
So the question is for the Americans, for the Europeans who have been funding Israel's genocide and ethnic cleansing of the Palestinians in Gaza and also in the West Bank.
So what do they expect of these Palestinians once this genocide comes on in?
So what kind of people are the world expecting to see in the future?
That's a question that I don't have an answer to, but I'm sure that these people, Palestinian people who have been living in Gaza, who have been surviving the genocide in Gaza, these will no longer be normal people.
I'm not a scientist, I'm not a psychologist, but I think people in the world, especially officials and politicians and decision makers, they should think seriously about this.
What kind of people are we going to see after the genocide comes to an end?
What kind of people are we going to see, you know, who have been living under occupation?
I don't have an answer to that, but if you think about it, I think there are many answers.
Yeah, I couldn't agree more.
A couple more questions.
There's this old phrase, it's often attributed to Stalin.
I'm not really sure.
I don't think anyone is sure if he's really the one who said it.
This idea that when one person dies, it's a tragedy.
When a thousand people die, it's a statistic.
And we often talk about, oh, 50,000 people are dead or 108,000 people are dead in Gaza.
And so often, as you said, the names of the people aren't very well known.
We purposely don't talk about them.
We don't humanize them.
One of the people who was killed after October 7th is a friend of yours, Rafat Alalir, who was a very well-known and accomplished poet.
He has a book, If I Shall Die, a poem that was turned into a book after he died, that became a bestseller in the United States and the West.
And it's really remarkable.
I got a copy.
I read it.
I really encourage people to do so.
But he was killed in an airstrike in December, so just a couple months after October 7th.
And he was killed in his house in an airstrike along with his sister and several of her children.
And then, I guess, I don't know, what is it, five months later, his daughter and his eldest daughter and his grandson were separately killed in an airstrike on their home as well.
Just kind of give you a sense for the amount of families that are being wiped out.
And he was English speaking.
He participated in the American discourse.
And one of the things that happened, I think people have really overlooked this, and I want to make sure it's not forgotten.
I want to get your views on this, is that after October 7th, as we know, there were all these lies that were told about what was done in Israel, that children were killed by putting in ovens, which obviously invokes the Holocaust by design, that babies were cut out of the wombs of their mothers, none of which ended up being true.
And Rafat on Twitter, responding to these kind of insane lies that were being told, mocked them.
And we had the tweet on October 29th where he said, with or without baking powder, obviously mocking the idea that they were killed in ovens, which turned out to be a complete lie.
And Barry Weiss, who obviously has a big platform, immediately seized on that, put a target on his back.
And she said, here is Rafat Alier joking about whether or not an Israeli baby burned alive in an oven was cooked, quote, with or without baking powder.
An obvious distortion of what he said.
The claim that Barry Weiss made that babies were killed in an oven was a complete and total lie disseminated by the Israeli government.
And then he went the next day and said, quote, if I get killed by Israeli bombs or my family is harmed, I blame Barry Weiss and her lies.
Many maniacal Israeli soldiers already bombing Gaza take these lies and smear seriously and they act upon them.
And then about a month later, he was dead at a targeted bombing of his home.
Lots of human rights groups believe it was deliberate.
Can you just reflect on him and his work, but also how you see that killing and Barry Weiss's role in at least spreading these lies, if not helping to target him?
Of course.
So first of all, Rifat was a professor of English and Comparative Literature at the Ezekiel University of Gaza, where I studied, where I did my bachelor's degree.
He was somewhat like a mentor.
He was one of the founders of We Are Net Numbers, which is a group that is dedicated to mentoring emerging writers in Gaza and also in the West Bank and also in the refugee camps in Lebanon, Jordan, and Syria.
So Rifat introduced me to that project in 2014-2015.
So in fact, Rifat was killed in his sister's house in Gaza City.
His sister Asma, she lived in Gaza City and he also lived in Gaza City, but he evacuated his house.
So Rifat, by the time he entered his sister's house, he was bombed in that apartment.
He was killed along with his sister Isma' and two and four nephews, along with one of Rifat's brothers.
So Rifat was known for his satire.
Of course, he and me and other Palestinians would never believe that any Palestinian, whether it's Hamas or other people, would burn babies, put people in ovens or behit babies.
I don't know what, I mean, it's even an evil person wouldn't do that.
So of course he thought that this is a lie, this is a joke or something.
And there is no evidence that that happened.
And it was proven to be a lie.
He was absolutely right.
It did not happen.
It was a complete fabrication.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, if you go back, you know, if you go back to Rifaat's social media accounts before October 7th, you would see a lot of jokes, you know.
So that was one of his jokes and it was used against him.
It's like one of my, you know, one of my posts when I say, when I commented about an Israeli hostage, you know, Emily the Mary, and I said, how on earth is this soldier a hostage?
While other Palestinians who have, like me, who were abducted from checkpoints, from hospitals, from school shelters are called prisoners or are called detainees.
Right, so they're put in detainees, without any charges, and convicted of nothing, and those are prisoners.
And yet people who are active IDF soldiers found in tanks, found in combat, who are taken as prisoners of war, those are all hostages.
Yeah, so that was one of my questions.
And then that was used against me.
Oh, actually, after I won the police, oh, he is denying his status as a hostage.
This is an anti-Semite.
And she called me a Holocaust denier.
So it's really irritating, you know, and it's really ridiculous even to call someone like me a Holocaust denier, someone who has never talked about the Holocaust.
In fact, I have some of the books that are about the Holocaust that I, you know, relate to, that I feel very outraged when I read about the experiences of the Jewish people at the hands of Europeans, not Palestinians.
So Rifaat's tweet, and I remember that post, you know, when Barry Wise posted that, you know, to just, you know, to get a lot of hate, more hate for Rifat.
Rifaat was a Palestinian poet and a seist, a fiction writer, an editor of a book called Gaza Writes Back, which he published in 2014.
And the collection is an anthology of short stories by some of his students at the ESIN University of Gaza and other students from other universities.
So it's been devastating that Rifat was killed in his sister's house.
And then a few months later, as he said, his daughter, Shayma, was killed with her baby, who Rifat himself didn't see because his daughter was still pregnant with that baby.
So Shayma was killed with her baby, Abd al-Rahman, and with her husband, an engineer called Muhammad Ziyam.
And by the way, Glenn, there's something that people don't know, which is that that poem, If I Must Die, which is the title of that book you referred to, in fact, that poem was written in 2011.
Right.
In 2011.
And that poem was dedicated to his daughter, Shayma.
The one who died in that airstrike with her infant son.
Right.
Exactly.
So the poem, Murifa'at re-shared the poem after October 7th.
So that's how people came to know the poem.
So just imagine in that poem, he's telling his wife, his daughter, if I must die, you should live to tell my stories, to sell my things, to make a kite.
That's the meaning of the poem.
If I must die, let it bring hope, let it be a tale.
And we, you know, truth tellers, writers, poets, journalists, we should write the tale of those whose voices were taken away from them by killing them and their families.
So that was his message to his daughter, who unfortunately was killed in an airside.
So in that poem to me, it's very clear that the I and the you was killed.
That's why the you must become a collective you, that every one of us, the free people of the world who care about the human beings, especially those who have been living under occupation and siege and apartheid for decades, not for months, not for years, for decades.
We should be the voices of these people, especially because we know what's happening or what has been happening.
Yeah, Mossad, I know you have time constraints.
It was such a pleasure to speak with you.
I think your voice is uniquely valuable and important to be heard by as many people as possible.
So we're definitely going to be harassing you to come back on the show.
I had a lot more to talk to you about, but I want to respect your time as well.
But super appreciative for you to come on.
It was great speaking with you.
Thank you so much.
I appreciate you and you.
All right.
Have a good evening.
*music*
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nothing else has helped go to coatefense.com and use code glenn for 15 off your first order that's coat defense.com code glenn so i want to talk about the extraordinary victory and it was truly extraordinary last night in the democratic party primary of zaran mandami who has uh really uh vanquished a political
dynasty in the cuomos in the cuomos um and i just want to get into that deeply because there's a lot of being said about it that i think is obscuring the truth rather than illuminating it but also there are very important lessons to be drawn about the current nature of our political dynamic i just want to note though in in relation to that last segment that shortly before we went on air donald trump i guess he just learned for the first time that benjaminahu is facing extremely serious corruption charges and is on trial for those corruption charges these are not
things like an accounting uh scheme to cover up payments to a porn star or anything else like donald trump was accused of this is hardcore real corruption it is you know it would have probably gotten him out of office a long time ago had it not been for the various wars that he started lots of people believe that's one of the reasons why he needed these wars to stay in in office uh and right before he went on air president trump put out a a quite lengthy and
passionate spirited uh statement on true social in which he essentially said uh i know that benjamin netanyahu is now being called to return to his trial on monday this is an outrage i'm not reading this verbatim i'm just uh but i read it several times and so i'm very accurately summarizing it he said these trials should be canceled and or prime minister netanyahu should be completely pardoned and then he went on to say bibi netanyahu
and i just fought a very tough important we secured a very tough important victory against what he called israel's long-time enemy iran not the united states' long-term enemy but israel's long-time enemy iran so he's essentially saying we just together fought a war against israel's enemy which is of course exactly what that war was and the reason why it was fought and then he went on through this long lengthy uh expression of outrage over the fact that bibi netanyahu is facing criminal charges and at the end he just he said the
united state just saved israel and the united states will also now save bibi netanyahu so trump himself is describing this war as one against israel's longtime enemy and that the united states just saved israel so there's a lot of people who get extremely outraged when you observe that oh it seems like this is another war for israel being fought not for the united states interest but for israel against israel's enemy not the united states and yet president trump apparently sees it that way as well based on what he's saying and
instead of focusing on the people that he promised to protect and work for namely the forgotten american worker remember them he's right now back to trying to interfere in the israeli court system and the israeli domestic politics by demanding that his very close friend bibi netanyahu be pardoned because he fought a good war i i don't really understand the relationship between those two things but that is what president trump said all right uh mandani's
uh victory last night uh zaran mandani is extraordinary for a lot of reasons as i said at the beginning back in february so i'm not talking about a year ago i'm talking about three months ago four months ago all the polling showed andrew cuomo with this gigantic lead obviously he has massive name recognition part of a beloved political dynasty i mean mario cuomo was probably for those who didn't live through that time in the 80s was probably the most beloved democrat in in a long time people were
desperate for him to run for president he kind of notoriously refused to decide he kept dragging people along saying you're going to decide soon and then at the end he would just say i'm not going to run people were so thirsty for him to run he was a very he was a great speaker an absolutely stirring orator uh came from this italian working class background spoke kind of the language of the working class uh you know the kind of thing that is political old and now and and and back then was too but then he had these two sons andrew and
chris and chris ended up parlaying that that last name and those connections into being a journalist and his other brother Andrew was basically groomed to be president of the United States from a very young age.
He went around with his father everywhere, just the absolute classic Nepo baby.
And then he got all sorts of positions in Democratic Party politics because of his dad.
At a very young age, he was made a cabinet secretary in the Clinton administration.
This is like in the early 1990s.
He married a Kennedy, Carrie Kennedy, Carrie Kennedy Cuomo.
So you see, the entire thing was being shaped from the very beginning to groom Andrew Cuomo as part of this political dynasty based on the nepotistic benefits he got from being Andrew Cuomo's son, not just to be governor of New York, but to be the president of the United States.
That was absolutely where Cuomo is headed.
He was supposedly, remember that liberals turned him into the hero of the COVID crisis, saying only he was acting with the level of aggression necessary.
And all of that came completely crashing down because he had a litany of women who credibly accused him of sexual assault, sexual harassment.
And this was a couple of years after Democrats made the Me Too movement, one of the North stars of their politics, believe women and destroyed the lives and careers of a huge number of people based on far, far less than what Andrew Cuomo faced.
His brother also ended up getting fired from CNN because he was plotting with his brother about how to discredit these female accusers while he was still on CNN.
And then it turned out that his greatness on COVID, which was his greatest strength that was going to jettison him to the presidency, ended up being one of his worst disgraces because he kept a bunch of old people locked in nursing homes.
A lot of them ended up dying as a result.
We covered all that before.
But suffice to say, nonetheless, four years later, he comes back with much less ambition.
He was already the governor of New York for three terms.
He resigned in the middle of his third term, having groomed to be president.
Now they kind of convinced him, look, you're 67.
The only thing there is for you to do is to run for mayor.
He clearly thought it was beneath him, wasn't particularly excited, thought his victory was inevitable, and it looked like it was.
Who's going to beat a Cuomo in Democratic Party politics?
And not just because he's a Cuomo, but he has all the billionaire money behind him.
And at the time in February, when I really started paying attention to Zaran's campaign, because I could kind of tell it had the big potential to really take off.
I could just tell he had a lot of political talent that he was forming a campaign that could really connect.
You don't know for sure, but I noted at the time that it seemed very interesting to me that what he was doing.
It was very different.
You could see he had a lot of political talent.
It reminded me of AOC, where say what you want about her now, and I have mostly negative things to say about her.
There's no denying that she has a kind of charisma and a political talent as well that was very obvious the first time he looked at her in 2018 before she was kind of grinded down by Washington.
But anyway, still, I mean, even though I was interested in and could see the potential, I had never imagined that he would actually win.
I just thought, like, oh, this is going to be a political star.
He's probably going to end up like attracting a good amount of left-wing voters, but never imagined he would defeat the Cuomo dynasty and all the billionaire money behind it.
And as Zoron started increasing in the polls and then clearly became like the main threat to Cuomo, huge amounts of billionaire money, largely afraid, in part about Zoron's democratic socialist policy, kind of the type of democratic, it's not communism, it's democratic socialism of Bernie Sanders and AOC.
I know people want to call it communism.
It just isn't.
But obviously people on Wall Street hate it.
It definitely means things like increasing taxes on the rich, redistributing resources to working class and poor people.
It is that philosophy that people on Wall Street hate, that big billionaires hate, but also he's a very outspoken critic of Israel, which in New York, with a very large Jewish population, a very large pro-Israel faction that's very powerful, is typically not something you can be.
I mean, even the Democrats who won, like Ed Koch and Bill de Blasio, have been typically pro-Israel.
I mean, that's just a red line for any politician who has ambitions in New York.
And he had said things like, you know, he supports a boycott and divestment sanction.
He's talked about globalized the intifada.
Interestingly, unlike people who when they run for office have their past quotes dug up and are confronted with them and they repudiate them immediately, like Kamal Harris did, where she repudiated basically everything she said she believed when running for president in the Democratic primary in 2019.
And they brought it all to her when she was running in the general election.
She didn't have to run in the primary because they catapulted her to the nomination.
And she basically repudiated, oh, I don't believe that anymore.
I never said that.
And it just showed how fake she was.
Mamdandi did not do any of that.
He was asked, like, do you still support globalizing Intifada instead of running away from it?
And he said, yeah, I do, but I think it's often distorted.
It doesn't mean anything more than a struggle, a resistance, not blowing people up.
He supports boycotting Israel.
He didn't repudiate that.
He was asked whether, given Benjamin Etyahu's indictment and the warrants for his arrest issued by the ICC, whether he would have him arrested if he came to New York, and he said he would.
So obviously a lot of billionaires like Bill Ackman, whose primary loyalty is to Israel, were desperate to make sure Imam Dani didn't win.
I promise you, Bill Ackman does not care about zoning laws or the efficiency of services in New York.
He has about nine or ten estates all over the world.
To the extent he lives in New York, he lives in a $30 million duplex apartment very high above Manhattan.
He chauffeur around in cars and the like.
That's not his interest.
His interest was in stopping somebody who was critical of Israel.
And he put huge amounts of money, as did other billionaires, into PACs for Andro Cuomo that largely just attacked Zoran Mamdani as an anti-Semite, all the rest.
And none of it worked, even though usually those things guaranteed to work in any major Democratic race.
Hear from the New York Times how they described it.
This morning, Mamdani's success in mayoral primary reverberates beyond New York City.
Quote, Zoran Mamdani, a little-known state lawmaker whose progressive platform and campaign trail charisma electrified younger voters, stunned former governor Andrew Cuomo in the Democratic primary for mayor of New York City on Tuesday night, building a lead so commanding that Mr. Cuomo conceded.
Mr. Mandani, a 33-year-old Democratic socialist from Queens, tapped into a current of anxiety around New York City's growing affordability crisis.
Quote, tonight we made history, he said in the words of Nelson Mandela, it always seems impossible until it is done.
My friends, we have done it.
Mr. Cuomo acknowledged his apparent defeat in a concession speech.
Quote, he won, Mr. Cuomo told his supporters roughly 80 minutes after polls had closed and said he had congratulated Mr. Mandani.
With 93% of the results in, Mr. Mandani was the first choice of 43.5% of voters.
Mr. Cuomo was in second place as the first choice of 36.4%.
Quote: This is the biggest upset in modern New York City history, said Trip Yang, a Democratic strategist.
The race had been volatile and bitter, with the two leading Democrats offering starkly different visions of the city and reflecting a generational divide in their party.
Mr. Mandani embodied energy and charisma, attracting droves of young left-leaning New Yorkers.
Mr. Cuomo represented the party's older guard and ran a conservative Rose Guardian campaign, limiting his public appearances to churches and synagogues and supportive union halls.
I want to really delve into that because there's a lot there that is incredibly important as commentary on our politics, just as much as Bernie Sanders almost defeating Hillary Clinton would have defeated Hillary Clinton in 2016, taking down the Clinton dynasty had the DNC not cheated, not rigged the election in the words of Elizabeth Warren, to make sure Hillary won.
Also Donald Trump's destruction of the Bush legacy and dynasty and Obama's victory and vanquishing of the Clinton machine in 2008 as well.
All of these have a lot in common, even though they seem ideologically disparate.
Here's the results from the New York Times, the primary election results.
This is a borough-by-borough breakdown.
I'm sorry, this is just the results itself.
Let's show these.
There you see Mondani with 43.5%, Andrew Cuomo with 36.4%, Brad Lander with 11.3%.
Just to be clear, there is ranked voting in New York City, which basically means that every round, the person in last place gets eliminated, and then their voters who didn't just vote for that candidate, but also ranked the other candidates, whatever candidates remain who are ranked highest on the list, those votes go to that candidate, and you keep doing it until somebody is eliminated.
But given the size of Mandani's win here, I mean, he almost got a majority just on the first ballot alone.
the third place candidate brad lander who would have been eliminated last endorsed mondani and he had 11.3 it was basically impossible to get there's And that's why Cuomo didn't say, oh, it's not over, which he could have.
He just conceded.
He's like, yeah, I lost.
And in fact, the whole time Cuomo was saying, even if I lose a Democratic primary to Zoron, which it started to become at least possible that it would happen, he vowed, I'm going to run as an independent.
And we've seen things like this.
In Buffalo, there was a similar left-wing, kind of Bernie Aoc type candidate who defeated the incumbent, a Democratic Party establishment candidate, in the primary.
And obviously in a very Democratic city like Buffalo, it was assumed she would win, but the establishment incumbent ran as an independent, ended up beating her in the general election.
So that was the idea was with Cuomo, even though I lose the Democratic primary, I'm still going to run as an independent and I'm going to win.
Even if Zond happens to sneak past me in the Democratic primary.
But Cuomo told the New York Times last night, you could tell he wasn't going to run.
When they asked, he said, yeah, I'm reevaluating.
I have to speak to people.
I mean, that's not what a candidate intending to run says.
And then today it was confirmed that Cuomo won't run.
I mean, this was a humiliating defeat.
And the big problem for people who are desperate to defeat Zoran Mandani is that there are the only other alternatives are the incumbent mayor Eric Adams, who's extremely unpopular, swamped with all kinds of corruption scandals, has run the city very poorly, very unpopular.
And then the Republican candidate Curtis Sleewa, who's basically a guardian angel, that kind of vigilante group that has been on subways and the like protecting people from crime.
He's had a nice little career for himself in the media, but he's, you know, this is a very Democratic city.
They did elect Rudy Giuliani in the late 90s into the 2000s.
He was the mayor on 9-11, but Giuliani was a very unique political figure.
He was viewed as very kind of a liberal Republican, very pro-gay, pro-choice.
And it was coming out of a kind of dark time for New York City where there was a lot of crime, a lot of degradation.
And then you had Michael Bloomberg, who was an independent, certainly not a Democrat, but he was a multi-multi-billionaire, so he won three terms.
But in general, New York elects Democrats.
And especially when you have this scandal-plagued mayor and this not really serious Republican alternative, it's hard to see how Mondani doesn't win this election.
Bill Ackman today was suggesting there's some legal way they're exploring to try and get some new candidate into the race.
You know, good luck with that.
But in any event, this is a massive victory.
Now, here is the neighborhood by neighborhood breakdown, just to give you a little bit of a sense.
Borough by borough this is.
So in Brooklyn, Zoran won by 17 points.
And that was where the most votes came from, total, 358,000.
In Manhattan, Zoran won by 5%.
In Queens, Zoran won by 7%.
In the Bronx, which had relatively small amounts of votes, and Staten Island, whose voting was basically invisible, Cuomo won by 18% in the Bronx and 9% in Staten Island.
9% in Staten Island, that's to be expected.
It's a largely white, ethnic, conservative, Republican voting island.
So 9% is actually pretty slim.
The Bronx is filled with a lot of black voters and Latino voters who tend still to be very tied to the Democratic Party.
They always voted for Clinton in large numbers, Biden in large numbers.
They don't like left-wing challengers who are unreliable or not known to them.
And so that's not really surprising either.
But you see the citywide, borough-wide victory that Zoran achieved.
If we go to the next slide here, this is these are neighborhoods with the largest Jewish concentration of voters.
So the upper west side and upper east side of Manhattan are kind of the classic, very affluent concentration of Jewish establishment Democrat liberal voters, the kind who vote for Hillary, the kind who vote for Biden.
They're just normally Democrats, but very, very wealthy ones.
And they're white and Jewish, very big Jewish population.
On the upper west side, Cuomo only won by 5%.
On the Upper East side, which is like old money, like just the cradle of old money Manhattan wealth, Cuomo won by 16%.
But then you go into these Brooklyn neighborhoods, which are high concentration of Jews, and three out of four of them, Flatbush, Mandani won by 16%, Crown Heights, Mandani won by 26%, Williamsburg, Mandani won by 27%.
Not really surprising, those Jewish voters tend to be younger, more left-wing, but he won a lot of Jewish votes.
The only exception was Borough Park, which has a lot of Orthodox Jews, conservative Jews, which Cuomo won by 70 points, 80 to 11.
But there weren't that many votes from there, only 8,000 votes, so ultimately it didn't make a difference.
So you see, Mandani had a lot of success with Jewish voters.
The primary, the highest-ranking Jewish elected official in New York City, Brad Lander, who's the city comptroller, campaigned with Mandani.
They endorsed one another on this ranked voting to keep out Cuomo.
And it's very difficult.
You know, when I watched Democrats trying to convince Americans that Donald Trump was this like Hitler-like figure, this vicious dictator who was going to put people in camps, you know, one of the reasons why it was so hard to do that, why it was so obviously destined to fail, was because Trump doesn't code that way.
He doesn't read that way.
Americans watched him for four years in the presidency, and even the ones who didn't like him didn't see Adolf Hitler.
And so this attempt to try and turn Zoran Mandani into a raging anti-Semite, I mean, we showed you a few of these tweets throughout the week, just absolutely insane ones from people saying his election would be an existential threat to New York Jews.
What is he going to do?
Like, round them up from synagogues and put them in concentration camps?
Is that what Zoroan Mandani is going to do?
And the reason it doesn't work is because you just listen to the guy for three minutes and you see that he is not anything resembling that.
He has a lot of policies, especially culture war ones with which I'm uncomfortable.
His economic policies are ones that obviously a lot of people are going to have problems with.
But the idea that he's like Osama bin Laden or like Joseph Stalin, that just doesn't work.
If you just listen to who he is, how he speaks, what he says, there has to be some alignment with the smears and with the person in order for it to work.
Now, here was Emerson College polling.
This is the last poll taken before the election.
And it said Mondani catches Cuomo in the ranked choice voting.
The final Emerson College poll, survey of the New York City Democratic mayor election, finds former governor Andrew Cuomo leading with 35%, followed closely by Zuran with 32.
Now, as I said, the way New York City works is you keep going, eliminating candidates, dispersing their votes until somebody gets a 50%.
So they predicted, and this is kind of a shock poll, that even though they predicted Mondani was ahead by the end, in the first round of voting, Cuomo would have 35 and Zoran would have 32.
Wildly underestimated the excitement and enthusiasm for Zoron.
He got 43.5% of the vote in that first round.
And then it says still, since last month's poll, Mandani gained 10 points on the initial ballot test, rising from 22 to 32%, while Cuomo gained one point, 34 to 35%.
So he had huge momentum.
Cuomo had capped out.
Quote, over five months, Mandani's support has surged from 1% to 32% while Cuomo finishes near where he began, the director of the poll said.
In the ranked choice simulation, Mandani gains 18 points compared to Cuomo's 12, putting him ahead in the final round for the first time in an Emerson poll.
So the writing was sort of on the wall.
The betting markets had caught up to this, had given him a lead.
But I just want to indicate to you, look how improbable this is.
I mean, this here is just four months ago.
Four months ago.
This is Andrew Cuomo at 33%.
Look at how steady he stayed.
He never really moved from that 35%.
That was his ceiling.
That was the people who were going to vote for him from the beginning, and that never changed.
Here was Brad Lander, the aforementioned Jewish elected official who was the city controller, who kind of climbed from 6%, 10%, 13%.
He already won a citywide race, was kind of known.
But you look at this yellow line here, which is just on a complete steep upcline, which is, it began in February, where he was at 1%, less than 1%, and then he ends at 35%.
I mean, look at that momentum.
Look at the more people heard him.
The more people were attracted to him.
And again, he didn't do this with advantages, institutional advantages.
The entire Democratic Party established Bill, they kind of swooped in Bill Clinton and all these old Democratic establishment types to endorse Andrew Cuomo.
Not one major Democrat endorsed Cuomo.
AOC did, which is to be expected.
But then you also had huge, enormous amounts of money, $25 million at least in a pro-Cuomo, anti-Zoron pack.
So he was swamped with money, billionaire money.
You cannot win in New York City without Wall Street and or the real estate developers being behind you.
Both of them were behind Denor Cuomo.
That's why it's so miraculous, aside from the fact that no one really knew who he was.
Hear from the Financial Times two days ago why Wall Street fears a 33-year-old political outsider.
Quote, Wall Street has a new enemy, a little-known 33-year-old Democratic socialist who is standing for mayor in New York City.
Zaran Mandani, who represents part of the borough of Queens in the state legislature, has pledged to raise taxes on the rich to fund free buses and child care, as well as city-owned grocery stores.
His surge of popularity against former New York governor Andrew Cuomo, a long-time fixture of the political scene who resigned in 2021 After facing accusations of sexual harassment, which he denies, has alarmed the city's business elite, who have joined forces to prevent the newcomer from winning the vote.
A lot of liberals have this monolithic view that everybody on the right has the same exact views of everything.
There are no divisions.
And of course, you pay attention to right-wing politics.
You know there are major ideological rifts and divisions and debates.
We saw it with the Iran War and many other issues already.
H-1B visas, all sorts of things.
But a lot of people on the right see the Democratic Party as this monolith as well.
They think like Chuck Schumer and Hillary Clinton and Joe Biden and Nancy Pelosi are the same as like AOC or Bernie or Zoron, and it's completely untrue.
New York City doesn't elect socialists.
They elect when they elect Democrats very established.
Ed Kotz was a very centrist member of Congress for a long time, very pro-Israel, very always at war with the left wing of the Democratic Party, kind of the classic New York City mayor, very outspoken, loud, kind of charismatic in his own sort of way.
And even Bill DiBasio had, who was considered more progressive, had very close relations with the New York City large developers, even though Wall Street didn't like Bill DiBasio.
So it's hard to overstate what a sea change this is, even if you think New York City is successful at Luffling Paul.
It's not.
I mean, it is in little places, but a citywide election, that's not who wins in New York City.
Here, just to give you a sense of the funding gap, I just want to, I'm doing this because I want to underscore to you how improbable this victory is, what a reflection of it is.
It is of a remarkable seat change in how American voters are thinking about politics or thinking about elections, what they respond to, what they don't respond to, not just on the left, but on the right, not in Democratic Party or the Republican Party, but across the spectrum.
Andrew Cuomo, here, you have three types of funding, his campaign funding directly, his matching public funds, and then allying super PACs.
He had at least $35 million, $35.6 million.
In second place was Siron with 9.1, almost entirely small donors.
So look at this gap.
You're talking about a gap of $25 million, $25 million for a citywide race.
And that's why people are describing it as such a major upset.
Now, just so you don't think I'm like hopping on some train once it left the station, pretending that I knew all along, I've watched Joe Run for quite a while now, but I'm going to show you the reasons why.
But back in February, when again, he was at less than 1% of the polls, I just wanted to draw people's attention to him, even though nobody was paying attention then, because I could see the kind of campaign he was running.
I, for the first time, understood what his political talent was.
It's just like a native inborn thing that you either have or you don't.
And he definitely has it.
He's a very effective political speaker, a very effective orator.
But he just kind of has an energy that people find attractive and appealing.
And to be clear, I hate the fact that if you analyze somebody's political appeal in a positive way, people are like, oh, you're a cheerleader for him.
You must love him.
I went through this with Donald Trump for so many years.
I would say liberals don't understand Trump's appeal.
He's funny.
He is charismatic and exciting.
And he vessels and channels anti-establishment hatred, which is the driving force in American politics and American political life.
And you should understand that about him.
I can admit that the people I can't stand most, Dick Cheney, are very smart.
I can acknowledge that attribute of theirs about liking them.
So what I'm saying here is it's important to understand why Zoran had this political appeal.
It doesn't mean you like him or hate him.
It's a completely separate question.
So back in February, I wrote this, quote, this New York City Assembly member and New York City mayoral candidate is doing a lot of interesting things, pretty much taking the best of Bernie 2016 and leaving out the rest.
And it'll be interesting to see how much support and enthusiasm he generates.
And I wrote that above a tweet of his where he was announcing this pretty significant small donor collection of $2.82 million.
He says more New Yorkers have donated to our campaign than any other.
And now their small dollar donations will be turbocharged because it's our matching fund.
So it was clear to me something was happening there.
I'm not suggesting I knew he was going to win.
I just knew that there was a lot of potential there.
People should pay more attention to him.
And so the question is, okay, why did this happen?
So I just want to show you a video that was probably the first thing that really attracted my attention to him and why I thought he was just a very different kind of Democrat.
He did something AOC, actually, this is something AOC did and got credit for.
It was after the 2024 election.
Trump, there were a lot of people who voted for Trump in her district and who also voted for AOC.
And you can tell that because AOC won by a much larger margin in her district against the Republican challenger than Kamala did in her district.
So there were a lot of people who voted for Trump and then voted for AOC.
And she went onto Instagram and other places and said, I want to talk to you people who voted Trump and for me.
And I want to understand why did you vote for Trump?
She was really seeking to understand it, which anyone who does that, I give credit to them.
Instead of just saying, oh, they're all racist.
I already know why they're racist.
They're fascist.
They were driven to scapegoat minorities or whatever.
I mean, AOC knew that these people in her district in New York, who switched massive numbers to Trump, aren't white nationalists.
A lot of them are black.
A lot of them are Latino.
A lot of them are working class or poor.
And you'd be an idiot not to try and understand that.
November 15th, just barely, not even two weeks after the 2024 election when Trump won, this is what Zoron did.
And I remember seeing this, and that's when I thought to myself, okay, this is someone doing something really interesting.
This is at a time when, you know, Joy Reed and MSNBC were telling everybody that Trump won simply because white voters are too racist and misogynist to vote for a black woman, which is a very self-glorifying, pleasant narrative to tell yourself.
But here's what Zoron did.
He went specifically to the neighborhoods in New York City that had the biggest swing from Democratic voters to Trump.
They weren't the upper west side and the east side.
They were poor neighborhoods, working-class neighborhoods, racially diverse neighborhoods, or even predominantly black or Latino neighborhoods, immigrant neighborhoods.
And all he did was go around and ask them why they voted for Trump, and the things that they told him clearly shaped what he decided to do when forming his own campaign and the issues that he wanted to emphasize.
In other words, he went to speak to the people of New York and asked why they were dissatisfied and then formed a campaign to speak to what their dissatisfactions and desires were.
Imagine doing that.
He didn't go to consultants or political strategists or whatever.
He really just went and talked to voters.
Listen to what happened.
Listen how he did it too.
Did you get a chance to vote on Tuesday?
I didn't vote.
And why did you not vote?
Because I don't believe in the system anymore.
And did you get a chance to vote on Tuesday?
Yes!
And who did you vote for?
Trump!
Ah, the million-dollar question.
Trump.
Trump.
Donald Trump.
Well, actually, the early voted, I voted for Trump.
Honestly, I didn't vote.
You voted for Trump.
I voted for Trump.
I vote for Trump.
Me too.
Before I vote Democrat, at this moment, I voted Donald Trump.
Hillside Avenue in Queens and Fordham Road in the Bronx are two areas that saw the biggest shift towards Trump in last week's election.
Even more residents didn't vote at all.
They like Trump because they don't want the Palestinian, the brothers, the killed.
The war in Ukraine, the Democrats giving all the money and the war, it's no good.
The swing is because people want lower prices.
They probably believe that Trump would give them that.
Market crash.
Energy, gas, la comida, food.
Most of these people are working families.
They're working one, two, three jobs.
And rent is expensive.
Foods are going up, utility bills are up.
And that's your hope to see a little bit more of an affordable life?
Absolutely.
What Trump did in the first four years, Fordham Road saw something where Kamala couldn't do that.
There were young voters who didn't vote for her because of the genocide, and I wouldn't have voted for her if I did, but I did vote for her, obviously, because I have commented.
Can you tell me a little bit more about why you didn't vote?
Since you're out here, you know, Gaza.
Who should I vote for?
Either side will go ahead, send bombs from here to kill my brothers and sisters.
Palestine issue, and then other issues like Russia and then Ukraine.
He stopped that war.
That's why I voted.
You can't say you're a Democrat and stand for the genocide that's going on in Gaza, period.
Practically, I like Democrat.
I like Democrats, but I don't like this.
Gaza, I will look a lot like people that die.
Have you voted for Democrats in the past?
I have.
And what would it take for you to vote for a Democrat in the future?
Being able to pay attention to the regular Americans and their economic needs.
They should make economics the forefront of their campaign.
People were not really feeling it in their pockets.
I voted for Hillary Clinton in 2016.
I voted against Trump also in the 2018 midterms.
Insulting us, playing on our emotions.
All they do is shame you and they just want to use like glitzy campaigns and they get celebrities.
Like if you're speaking the things that people want to hear about, I don't care what color you are, I'll vote for you.
You know, we have a mayor's race coming up next year and if there was a candidate talking about freezing the rent, making buses free, making universal child care a reality, are those things that you'd support?
Absolutely.
You'd have my vote all day.
We need child care that is affordable.
Buses should be free.
The hike in the metro cards is like totally unaffordable.
So my name is Zoran Mamdani.
I'm going to be running for mayor next year.
Wow.
Yes, yes, sir.
And I'm going to be running on that platform.
Thank you.
I'm going to vote for you.
Your energy is...
My energy is getting up to inflation.
I mean, you know, that's a very good sampling of why a lot of people voted for Trump.
The Democrats want to send all our money to wars in Ukraine and Israel.
We can't afford things.
They only care about the wealthy.
And the things that they care about are obvious, the things that they would care about that they encounter every day in their lives, the bus fares and the cost of rent and the like.
And that's what his entire campaign was structured around.
Now, a lot of people found tweets of his from 2020 when he was in his mid to late 20s running for New York Assembly right during Black Lives Matter.
Tons of left-wing culture war nonsense, lots of extreme positions.
He was positioning himself for a very left-wing seat in the state assembly.
Stuff like to fund the police over and over, queer liberation requires defund the police, things that obviously if you're running in a citywide election, you're not going to run on.
And he didn't.
He ran a very economic populist campaign, despite being called a communist or a socialist or whatever.
I want to just show you this clip that I also found incredibly interesting.
So this is one that he did in January when, again, people really weren't paying attention to him.
And he posted a video with a tweet.
And the tweet said, quote, chicken is now over rice.
Now it costs $10 or more.
It's time to make Halal eight bucks again.
If you live in New York City, one of the things you see everywhere are street vendors.
Lots of people buy food from street vendors, like snacks, pretzels, or whatever, or all kinds of ethnically diverse food that you can eat from.
If you don't have time to sit in a restaurant, you grab something from one of these street vendors.
And especially in the more working-class neighborhoods, it's where people eat.
And people are complaining that these street vendors are, the price of that food is increasing.
If you're Andrew Cuomo, you don't need a fees.
You have no idea about any of this.
If you're Bill Ackman, obviously you don't have any clue.
You think that voters are going to vote on the fact that Zoran is not pro-Israel enough.
Voters in New York City, that's what they wake up and care about.
Just like the Democrats thought voters were going to wake up and care about Trump having praised a fascist or fascist or Hitler or whatever.
So removed from their lives.
Or Ukraine.
But Zoran, this is what populism is.
I saw people today, a lot of conservatives saying when I called it economic populism, oh, socialism is an Economic populism.
No, when you appeal to people's lives, when you tell them the rich and corporations are running roughshod over you, are preventing you from having a survivable or affordable life.
And that's what became his keyword, is affordability, which obviously a lot of New Yorkers are being driven out of New York City.
They can't afford it anymore.
Things are too expensive.
So look at what he did in this video.
You tell me if this is like some sort of Stalinist communist, at least in terms of how he ran his campaign.
He wanted to understand why chicken oval rice, halal, something that people eat every day in New York City, especially in more working-class neighborhoods, why that food has increased.
So watch what his analysis was.
New York is suffering from a crisis, and it's called halal inflation.
Today, we're going to get to the bottom of this.
How much does a plate of halal cost right now from this truck?
$10.
$10.
Chicken over Roy, Islam of Aray is $10.
$10?
Yeah.
When you're a street vendor, you have to pay for the food, the plates.
How much do you have to pay for your permit?
Before it was $22,000.
$20, $17,000.
How much does a license cost if you get it from the city?
I think $400.
And who are you paying?
The permit owner.
You're not paying the city?
No, no, no.
You pay the permit owner $22,000 just so you can sell this food.
Yes.
And who is this?
A random guy.
Have you ever applied for a permit?
Yeah, I'm applying and no come anything.
It's long wait.
Number 3,800 something.
After two years, you're number 3,800.
Yes.
These are the four bills that are sitting in the city council right now, which would give these vendors their own permits and make your halal more affordable.
So the laws that he's promoting here, the four laws are, number one, better access to business licensing, repeal criminal liability for street vendors, services for vendors, and reform the siting rules.
And it's almost like libertarian.
Like, oh, there's too much bureaucracy, too many rigorous permit requirements.
They have to pay someone else as a permit owner $20,000 a year, which obviously affects food prices.
Here's the rest of this.
Give these vendors their own permits and make your halal more affordable.
But Eric Adams hasn't said a single word about them.
If you own the permit, then how much would you charge for the plate?
$7.
$8.
$8.
Would you rather pay $10 for a plate of halal or $8?
$8.
$8.
I think $8 the way to go.
If I was the mayor, I'd be working with city council from day one to make halal $8 again.
Oh, how would it taste?
Tastes like $10, but it should be $8.
I mean, on top of the very kind of regular person appeal of that, talking about things that people actually care about a lot, things that are affecting their lives, talking about solutions to them in a very non-ideological way, there's also a lot of humor in there, a lot of kind of flair.
I mean, you want to watch.
It's not like a lecture.
It's not like an angry rant.
You look at this and it's not hard to see why he won.
Now, let me show you the counterattack, the way they thought the Androquomas of the world thought that they were going to sabotage him.
It's an amazing thing.
This is the New York mayoral debate.
There were, I think, seven candidates, eight candidates on the stage, and it was hosted by the local NBC News affiliate.
And just listen to this question that they thought was important for people wanting to be New York City mayor to answer and how they all answered it except for Zoran.
Mr. Cuomo?
Given the hostility and the anti-Semitism that has been shown in New York, I would...
Which foreign country would you visit first?
Gee, I wonder what they're trying to get them to say.
Which one might it be?
Like in Nigeria?
Norway, maybe?
Uruguay?
Probably Israel, right?
That's certainly how they all interpret it, except Zoran.
Watch this.
Well, given the hostility and the anti-Semitism that has been shown in New York, I would go to Israel.
Mr. Tilson, where would you go?
Yeah, I'd make my fourth trip to Israel, followed by my fifth trip to Ukraine, two of our greatest allies fighting on the front lines of the global war on terror.
Mr. Mamdani.
I would stay in New York City.
My plans are to address New Yorkers across the five boroughs and focus on that.
Mr. Mamdani, can I just jump in?
Would you visit Israel as mayor?
I will be doing, as the mayor, I'll be standing up for Jewish New Yorkers and I'll be meeting them wherever they are across the five boroughs, whether that's in their synagogues and temples or at their homes or at the subway platform, because ultimately we need to focus on delivering on their concerns.
Just yes or no, do you believe in a Jewish state of Israel?
I believe Israel has the right to exist as a Jewish state.
No, as a state with equal rights.
He won't say it has a right to exist as a Jewish state.
And his answer was no, he won't visit Israel.
I said that.
No, no, no.
Unlike you, I answered questions very directly.
And I want to be very clear.
I believe every state should be a state of equal rights.
Okay, thank you, Mr. Speaker.
So do you see how excited Andrew Cuomo got?
He really did base a huge part of his campaign on his loyalty to Israel, his love of Israel, his longtime support for Israel, his father's support for Israel, his family's support for Israel.
And you heard those voters that voted for Trump when asked why.
Did any of them say, oh, I think Democrats are insufficiently pro-Israel?
No, no one said that.
These people aren't waking up and thinking, I want to make sure my mayor is going to go to Israel as the very first foreign visit.
It was supposed to be controversial that he said, look, I'm the New York City mayor.
That's what I'm running for, not the Secretary of State.
I'm not thinking about foreign trips.
I'm actually wanting to represent the people of New York City.
I'm going to stay here at home and talk to the people I'm supposed to be working for.
Why would I plan my overseas trips and make sure Israel is for?
A lot of them said Israel.
One of them said, oh, the Holy Land, Israel.
So that was supposed to be the kind of thing that they thought was going to sabotage.
And they have these old ideas in their head about what you can and can't do.
That's why Trump won, too.
He broke all of those rules that people thought were still valid and he proved they weren't.
Now, just a couple of things here.
First of all, I think one important part of what's driving all this, because the thing is, if you want to win in the Democratic primary in New York City, you can't just rely on left-wing voters like DSA, Democratic Socialists America, AOC, Bernie types.
That can give you a certain momentum, a certain energy, but you're not going to win a citywide race just with those kind of voters.
You have to attract a lot of normie liberal Democrats.
That's who lives in New York City.
They're mostly like normal, they're not like, they don't, they're not people who hate Hillary Clinton or Joe Biden.
These are not them.
There are some in like Brooklyn and Queens, but the majority of Democrats in New York City and most liberal American cities are very normal Democrats.
They love the Democratic establishment.
They love Pelosi, Chuck Schumer.
Chuck Schumer represents New York and has forever.
That's who they like.
You need to attract those voters.
And I think one of the main reasons he attracted so many of those voters as well, as well as the South Lake Bays, is that when you look at the approval rating for the Democratic Party, it's like 20%, 23%.
Republicans say, oh, look, they're more unpopular than any party, and it's true.
But a lot of the reason for that is that Democrats themselves are telling posters that they don't approve of the Democratic Party.
They've become convinced that the Democratic Party has this kind of aged, stagnant, listless, slow, uninteresting leadership base.
And it's true.
It's basically a gerotocracy.
And obviously, the debacle with Biden underscored that more than anything.
They were being told they had to get behind someone who was suffering from dementia.
And so they want this kind of new energy, this exciting energy.
That's a big part of it.
It was kind of a referendum on what Democrats want their party to be.
They don't want to be voting for a 67-year-old person in politics for 40 years who has billionaire money behind him as part of the Democratic establishment.
It was in the Clinton cabinet, have Bill Clinton kind of come in from wherever he is and be like, yeah, I'm endorsing Andrew Cuomo.
That's not appealing to these Democrats anymore.
They know that they can't keep going down that road.
So that's part of it.
But I really think a big part of it is that the primary division, not just American politics, but politics throughout the Democratic world, certainly something we've talked a lot about before, is the difference between someone perceived to be part of the establishment and someone who seems to be an outsider who hates the establishment.
There are a lot of people in the United States, millions, who voted twice for President Obama in 2008, 2012, who then voted for Donald Trump in 2016.
That's a reason why Trump won.
And people who continue to cling to this archaic, obsolete way of understanding American politics, if it's about left versus right, conservatives versus socialists, whatever, they can't process that.
In 2016, there were a lot of people who were saying to reporters, my two favorite candidates are Trump and Bernie Sanders.
And again, same thing.
Like, if you think everything's right versus left, you're like, what are these people?
They're crazy.
That makes no sense.
But when you see that things are about hatred for the establishment, a desire to reject establishment candidates and vote for outsiders who seem anti-establishment, you understand why Obama won.
Again, first Hillary Clinton and then John McCain.
This very young, previously utterly obscure, black man with a Muslim-sounding name.
That's very improbable.
Yet he won because he presented him.
I'm going to change the way Washington works.
We're going to change for whom it works.
That was his whole appeal.
Whereas, of course, John McCain nor Hillary Clinton could credibly claim that, and he rolled over them.
Same with Mitt Romney.
And then in 2016, the outsider candidate besides Bernie Sanders, who probably would have gotten the nomination of the DNCHe did, was Donald Trump.
This is the through line of American politics.
And in 2024, you first had Biden, then you had Kamala, just two completely insecure, uninteresting, clinging to a script, using strategist talking points and plans to win the election without a single passionate view or thought of their own.
And Zaran Mandani is obviously an outsider candidate.
Very unknown, very young, doesn't speak like those other candidates, certainly doesn't speak like Andrew Cuomo, doesn't have billionaire backing, is highly critical on a fundamental level of the political establishment.
That's a major reason why he won as well.
And then I really believe that one of the things that was like Trump's superpower was, as I said, that he didn't care that things he was saying were supposedly disqualifying.
He wouldn't retract them.
I remember in 2015 when he had a pretty sizable lead, people were shocked by it, but they thought, oh, it's just early.
He's, you know, this is the kind of voter, the kind of candidate Republicans flirt with but won't actually vote for.
They're going to snap into line at the end and vote for Jeb Bush.
And in 2015, he gave an interview that's now notorious where he said, when asked about John McCain, who never liked Trump, and he was asked about his heroism, and Trump said, I don't know that he's not heroic.
He got captured and crashed plane and got captured.
I prefer soldiers and heroes who don't get captured.
I think that's what makes you a winner.
And I remember the outpouring of articles over the next few days from all the deans of political reporting or whatever saying, okay, that's the end of Trump's campaign.
You can't criticize John McCain.
And of course they went to him, do you apologize?
He said, no, I don't apologize.
They meant every word I said.
And there were so many things like that.
Mocking that New York Times reporter has cerebral palsy, or I believe it was that, some sort of degenerative disease.
Over and over and over, the Access Hollywood stuff.
And his refusal to renounce his own statements, actions, and beliefs made him seem more genuine.
Even if people don't like the things he had said, the fact that he's saying, no, that's what I believe all of this is going to say, that is a big political asset.
And the fact that Zoran, who has a long history of passionate activism in opposition to Israeli aggression, Israeli settlements in the West Bank, Israeli assaults on Gaza, when he would say things like globalize the intifada, which he did, and he was confronted about that a month before the election, he's like, are you going to withdraw that?
He's like, no, I'm not going to withdraw that.
People distort what that means.
They try and make it seem like it means you believe in terrorists killing people with car bombs.
It's just a word, intifada, an Arabic word for struggle or resistance, including peaceful struggle and resistance for equal rights for the Palestinians.
And again, a lot of people may not like that term.
A lot of people don't like that term, but I think the fact that he was not running away from it, not apologizing for it, ran a pretty unique campaign, as I'm trying to show you, is also a major reason that he won.
And I just think, again, populism is nothing more than there's a system over here of powerful people, politically powerful, financially powerful people.
They do not have your interest in mind.
They don't care about you.
They're exploiting you.
They're abusing you for their own aggrandizement, their own wealth, their own power.
And I want to fight them on your behalf.
That's what economic populism is.
Go look at what Josh Hawley does, threatening to vote against Trump's bill because it cuts Medicaid, knowing that a lot of Trump voters, working class voters, rely on Medicaid.
Something really interesting about Josh Hawley, under the radar, every week he holds like House hearings, Senate hearings, and he summons executives of all kinds of industries, airlines industry, meat industry, bankers, and he just pounds them about like hidden fees or like gigantic executive pay given abuse of consumers.
And Josh Hawley has said the future of the Republican Party is a multiracial working class coalition, a working class coalition, which requires economic populism.
He stood with Bernie, Josh Hawley did, to stop the COVID bill from being passed when they were going to give out billions and billions of dollars to big business.
And he demanded that there be direct payments to all Americans.
And they got the bill.
They tried to stop the bill.
And it went to, they got $600 direct payment to Americans.
That's economic populism.
And then it went to Trump.
And Trump said, $600 isn't enough.
I'm vetoing it.
I want $2,000 payments.
Promising to represent the forgotten person.
That's what populism is, economic populism.
Not serving Wall Street, not serving bankers, not serving real estate developers, not endorsing establishment dogma, not tying yourself to old, staid, decaying people who've just been around for decades, who interest and excite nobody any longer.
That's the gold of American politics.
I don't think it matters at all to people if it comes from the right or the left.
And there are lots of things about Zoron.
Marjorie Taylor Green today posted the Statute of Liberty in a burqa.
Ari Fleischer said, New York Jews, you need to evacuate.
You know, it's a condemnation, as I said before, of like Joseph Stalin and Osama bin Laden.
You look at him, do you think, is that at all what he reads as, what he codes as, what he, is it what seems a convincing attack on him?
And so I think there's a lot of lessons here, not just for the Democratic Party, though, certainly numbers, but what American voters respond to and what they don't.
And in this case, the lessons are so powerful, so penetrating, that it drove the unlikeliest of people to crush one of the most powerful political dynasties in America,
the Cuomos, backed by every institutional advantage you could want and very poised to, I'm not saying it's certain, but highly likely, to become what a lot of people have long said is the second most important position in American politics, which is mayor of New York City.
New York City obviously is the center of American finance, American wealth, massive tourism, gigantic city.
And so that is an important position.
That's not a joke.
And the fact that a 33-year-old Muslim, self-identified democratic socialist was able to win, despite that history of statements, I think it's very important to derive a lot of lessons from that.
And I think anyone interested in understanding politics, let alone winning elections, would be studying him in a very non-judgmental way.
It doesn't matter if you hate him, doesn't matter if you like him, love him.
The lessons ought to be the same.
All right, so that concludes our show for this evening.
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