Dark Journalist - Dark Journalist And Roger Stone: Deep State Disclosure!
Aired: 2020-05-11
Duration: 01:51:00


=== The Political Nature of Prosecution (15:29) ===

[00:00:00]  It's great to be here.
[00:00:01]  It's an amazing crowd with us already there in the ideas room, the chat.
[00:00:06]  Of course, I'm joined by Miss Olivia.
[00:00:08]  Hi, everybody.
[00:00:09]  And we have a very special guest.
[00:00:11]  Roger Stone is with us.
[00:00:12]  Roger, it's great to have you here.
[00:00:13]  It's great to be here.
[00:00:16]  I know what's on everybody's mind.
[00:00:17]  We have so many things to talk with you about today, but what's on everyone's mind is your case and the state of the case.
[00:00:24]  Now, we just saw that the Justice Department has dropped charges against General Flynn.
[00:00:31]  And so the first question, I guess, is, is that the canary in the coal mine for a lot of the Mueller investigation prosecutions that they were so politically motivated that they're falling apart?
[00:00:41]  And how does that relate to your case?
[00:00:43]  Well, it's an excellent question.
[00:00:44]  I mean, first of all, I'm particularly glad to be here because for 16 months, I had been unconstitutionally gagged by the judge in my case.
[00:00:54]  Her argument was that I should not be allowed to defend myself, particularly on social media.
[00:01:00]  Because my defending myself would have a tendency to taint the DC jury pool.
[00:01:06]  Yet the fact that the Washington Post and CNN and MSNBC would piss on me every day, that of course had no effect on the jury pool.
[00:01:16]  The judge had no evidence for her theory.
[00:01:18]  In fact, the evidence is to the contrary.
[00:01:21]  If you looked at Google Trend, the only time the number of people looking up my name on Google spikes is when the judge attacks me.
[00:01:30]  So when I, when I, Challenge the constitutionality of the gag order, the DC Circuit Court, the Chief Judge, Beryl Howell, assigned it to a panel of three judges appointed by Barack Obama.
[00:01:49]  They sat on it for four months, four months while I was sustaining damage.
[00:01:54]  And then they ruled, not on the constitutional issue, but said procedurally, I had to ask Judge Jackson to remove the gag order.
[00:02:04]  which he had placed on me before I could take it to the circuit.
[00:02:08]  It took them four months to decide that.
[00:02:11]  You know, there is no justice in the District of Columbia for a Republican or a Trump supporter.
[00:02:20]  And it was reflected in the makeup of my jury and a lot of the subsequent things that happened at the trial.
[00:02:28]  You raise an excellent point, though, because if the Mueller investigation was illegitimate, Then, how can the charges against me by an illegitimate investigation be considered legitimate?
[00:02:43]  The fruit of the poison tree argument.
[00:02:46]  Interestingly enough, one of the reasons in the sentencing memo that the four prosecutors, who you've read 100 times, were non political career line prosecutors, that's false.
[00:03:01]  One of them worked for Hillary Clinton at the State Department, one of them worked for Barack Obama in the White House.
[00:03:07]  They were all ideologues, every one of them.
[00:03:09]  None of them were career line prosecutors.
[00:03:12]  That was BS.
[00:03:14]  But one of the reasons they argued that I needed a greater sentence was because I wouldn't stop questioning the legitimacy of the mother investigation.
[00:03:24]  That hasn't aged terribly well.
[00:03:29]  But I'm in a different place than General Flynn.
[00:03:31]  First of all, General Flynn pled guilty.
[00:03:34]  I had the quaint notion that I could be acquitted on the facts.
[00:03:40]  I didn't know.
[00:03:41]  When I was charged, that the judge would systematically prohibit any powerful line of defense.
[00:03:50]  So, for example, the first five pages of my indictment say that the Russians hacked the DNC and gave the information to WikiLeaks.
[00:04:01]  I was denied the opportunity to use forensic evidence and expert witnesses to disprove that.
[00:04:07]  It is not true.
[00:04:09]  It is provably not true.
[00:04:11]  The FBI admitted in discovery in my case that they relied on a draft redacted memo from CrowdStrikes.
[00:04:23]  Which is hardly a neutral observer.
[00:04:25]  It's an IT company owned, now it's public, but started by two Hillary Clinton supporters, members of her finance committee.
[00:04:34]  The prosecutors filed what's called a SURE reply with the court saying, the Mueller investigation has additional proof that the Russians hacked the DNC.
[00:04:45]  We just don't have to produce it.
[00:04:47]  Well, that's because it doesn't exist.
[00:04:49]  And I was prohibited at trial from proving that, selective prosecution.
[00:04:56]  In the end, after CNN, MSNBC, The New York Times, The Washington Post, and the rest of the fake news crowd predicting that I would be charged with treason, conspiracy against the United States, mail fraud, wire fraud, money laundering, violation of the foreign contributions ban, unauthorized access to a government computer, additional cyber crimes,
[00:05:25]  including the receipt and dissemination of stolen data, Accessory to a felony after the fact, aiding and abetting a felony, I was charged with none of those crimes because,
[00:05:40]  despite the proctological examination that they gave me, looking at all my emails, all my text messages, all my phone calls over a two year period, they could find no evidence of any of that, including Russian collusion.
[00:05:56]  So, Andrew Weissman fabricated an indictment charging me with lying to Congress.
[00:06:03]  It is alleged that I lied to Congress about the Trump campaign's interest in the WikiLeaks disclosures.
[00:06:12]  Donald Trump, the candidate, discussed his interest in those disclosures 142 times in September and October.
[00:06:19]  There was no underlying crime for me to lie about.
[00:06:23]  So, what would be my motive in lying?
[00:06:25]  Why would I intend to lie?
[00:06:27]  It's interesting that we now know that the Mueller's dirty cops shared the fruits of their Fourth Amendment disclosures.
[00:06:38]  A violation of all of my data with Adam Schiff, who then would fashion gotcha questions.
[00:06:47]  And every question that I was accused and charged with lying about was asked by one person Adam Schiff.
[00:06:55]  How coincidental.
[00:06:57]  Last week, the House Intelligence Committee declassified all the testimony.
[00:07:03]  I urge people to go read my testimony.
[00:07:06]  If you want to hear a lie, you can hear Adam Schiff insist that the FBI did inspect.
[00:07:11]  The DNC servers.
[00:07:13]  And then Congressman Jackie Spire rhymes with liar.
[00:07:18]  She agrees with it.
[00:07:20]  That's a lie.
[00:07:20]  But you see, they can lie with impunity because they have the protection of being a member of Congress.
[00:07:27]  Wow, incredible.
[00:07:29]  And the actions against you in this case, it seems literally like you're in the crossfire of them trying to get at Trump.
[00:07:39]  And it seems like your major crime is that you didn't provide any testimony against Trump.
[00:07:45]  That is exactly right.
[00:07:46]  So they fabricate the lying to Congress charge.
[00:07:51]  Under the false statement law, to lie to Congress or to lie on your oath, you have to both have intent and it has to be material.
[00:08:00]  So, an email between Steve Bannon and I, in which we discuss an article in that morning's Washington Post, that's not material, but that's an example of what I was charged with.
[00:08:13]  And none of this made any sense starting from the beginning.
[00:08:17]  I'm sure that you remember the manner in which I was arrested.
[00:08:21]  Yes.
[00:08:22]  The special counsel's office knew I was represented, spoke to my lawyer on the phone January 24th.
[00:08:28]  On the morning of January 25th, in the pre dawn hours, 29 SWAT clad FBI agents carrying assault weapons bring this giant battering ram up to my front door.
[00:08:42]  They have a bunch of really mean looking dogs on leashes.
[00:08:47]  They completely surround my house.
[00:08:50]  They arrive in 17 armored vehicles.
[00:08:53]  There's a government helicopter overhead.
[00:08:56]  In those days, I lived on a canal.
[00:08:57]  There are two FBI boats on the canal.
[00:09:01]  There are literally frogmen holding assault rifles to arrest me for a white collar, nonviolent process crime.
[00:09:12]  When all they had to do was to tell my lawyer I was being charged, and I could have saved the taxpayers $1.1 million.
[00:09:22]  Instead, we had to stage this circus.
[00:09:27]  To make me look like some kind of desperado.
[00:09:30]  The government claimed they defended their actions because they said I was a flight risk.
[00:09:37]  They knew I had no valid passport.
[00:09:40]  They also knew I had no firearms, so I wasn't dangerous.
[00:09:44]  And thanks to CNN, I have the most recognizable mug on the planet.
[00:09:50]  Where was I going to go?
[00:09:53]  Three hours later, when I was arraigned, they just proved that was a lie.
[00:09:56]  Because they didn't ask for a cash bond, which means they never thought I was a flight risk.
[00:10:02]  They additionally said that they had to arrest me in this manner because if I knew they were delivering a search warrant, I might destroy evidence.
[00:10:12]  It had been reported for almost two years that I was under investigation.
[00:10:16]  If I was going to destroy evidence, I destroyed nothing.
[00:10:20]  Why would I have waited until then?
[00:10:23]  Again, just ridiculous.
[00:10:25]  But the worst thing about this is, in fact, that CNN.
[00:10:30]  Was allowed to set up 25 feet from my front door and film my arrest.
[00:10:37]  Now, CNN insists that they were there based on a journalistic hunch.
[00:10:43]  In fact, based on security cameras, which I have the film of, CNN showed up exactly 14 minutes before the FBI.
[00:10:53]  That they were tipped, there is no doubt.
[00:10:56]  Why does the FBI refuse illegally to hand over all email between CNN and the FBI in the weeks and days before my arrest?
[00:11:04]  Why is Christopher Wray resisting that when he knows what the law requires?
[00:11:10]  There's little chance that this was happenstance.
[00:11:13]  I now know that my street, which is a dead end street, had been blocked off and that no other media was allowed in other than CNN.
[00:11:23]  And you can see in the camera footage that members of the FBI arrest team go talk to the CNN crew several times.
[00:11:31]  So clearly they are working together.
[00:11:34]  What's the point of this?
[00:11:36]  To intimidate me?
[00:11:38]  I'm Sicilian.
[00:11:39]  I was not intimidated.
[00:11:41]  To depict me for a jury and for the public as some kind of drug warlord or some kind of gangster.
[00:11:50]  It just, the whole thing makes no sense.
[00:11:53]  And to this day, we don't know who approved this raid.
[00:11:59]  We can't get the answer to that question.
[00:12:01]  Senator Lindsey Graham insisted that he would get an answer.
[00:12:05]  He wrote a stern letter to the FBI demanding an answer.
[00:12:08]  They have never responded, he's never followed up.
[00:12:13]  The acting attorney general, whose name escapes me at this moment, from Iowa, who had stood in for sessions after he was fired, he said on TV he would get to the bottom of who ordered this.
[00:12:25]  We still don't know who ordered it.
[00:12:27]  It was just an outrageous circus and a real eye-opener, I think, for people.
[00:12:37]  And it probably backfired.
[00:12:38]  I think people understood the political nature of this prosecution.
[00:12:44]  And it all came to a head.
[00:12:46]  On July 24th of 2019, when prosecutors went to my lawyers and proposed a deal, they had records showing that I had spoken to candidate Trump on 29 occasions in 2016 in which our phone calls lasted longer than a half hour.
[00:13:10]  And they said that if I would come clean and if I would confess that those calls were really about Russia and WikiLeaks, Well, they'd be willing to work things out, maybe even recommending no jail time to my judge.
[00:13:27]  I said no because it would be a lie.
[00:13:29]  Yeah.
[00:13:31]  This is what they were looking for.
[00:13:33]  There's no question about it in this case.
[00:13:35]  And also, the pre Dawn raid sends out that chilling effect as well to all those other people associated around Trump in some fashion that this is coming for you next.
[00:13:46]  Pardon me, Marco Rubio there.
[00:13:50]  Exactly.
[00:13:52]  One thing I'm curious about in relation to all this is they had originally proposed this incredible sentence for you, which was seven to nine years.
[00:14:02]  Yes.
[00:14:03]  There's an op-ed piece today by Jonathan Kravis, one of the prosecutors, who poses as a career line prosecutor.
[00:14:13]  In fact, he was the deputy, or probably he was the associate White House counsel under Barack Obama.
[00:14:19]  He prosecuted three top aides to Congressman Ron Paul.
[00:14:25]  It's the same dirty tricks there.
[00:14:26]  He violated all of their rights.
[00:14:28]  He is a partisan.
[00:14:29]  He's not a non-political career prosecutor as he poses.
[00:14:34]  And their sentencing memo accuses me of things that I was not convicted of.
[00:14:42]  It specifically accuses me of being involved in foreign interference in the election when I was neither charged or convicted of that, and there was never any evidence produced of that.
[00:14:54]  They claimed that I threatened a federal judge by posting an image.
[00:14:58]  that included crosshairs.
[00:15:01]  When I have an affidavit from two grand jury witnesses that one of the prosecutors, Michael Mirando, told them point blank, we knew it wasn't a crosshair.
[00:15:11]  We knew it was the watermarked logo of the organization that created the image.
[00:15:17]  They claim, for example, that a book I wrote on the mother investigation violated their gag order, when in fact my book was published on February 9th and the gag order was put in place on February 12th.

=== Selective Prosecution and Fabricated Evidence (14:52) ===

[00:15:29]  You can go to Amazon, look at the publication date.
[00:15:32]  But facts don't matter in this process.
[00:15:35]  And I'm just giving you two examples of falsehoods.
[00:15:39]  Then there's the other one.
[00:15:40]  Stone needs to be assigned additional time because he won't stop questioning the legitimacy of the Mueller investigation.
[00:15:48]  Well, we know the Mueller investigation was entirely illegitimate.
[00:15:53]  My trial was a Soviet style show trial.
[00:15:57]  Lying to Congress?
[00:16:00]  That would be, in my case, selective prosecution.
[00:16:02]  Let's see.
[00:16:03]  Clapper lied to Congress.
[00:16:04]  Brennan lied to Congress.
[00:16:06]  Comey lied to Congress.
[00:16:07]  McCabe lied to Congress.
[00:16:09]  Sprock lied to Congress.
[00:16:10]  Hillary lied to Congress.
[00:16:12]  Mueller himself lied to Congress.
[00:16:16]  This list goes on and on, but I was prohibited from making that argument that I had been singled out for prosecution.
[00:16:24]  As I said earlier, I was prohibited from using forensic evidence and expert testimony to prove that the Russians didn't hack the DNC and give the information to WikiLeaks.
[00:16:37]  And even though it is the underlying premise of my indictment, the government said it was irrelevant and the judge barred me from even raising it.
[00:16:48]  I was not allowed to question the conduct of the special counsel's office, the FBI, any member of Congress, including Adam Schiff, and if it's Schiff, flush it,
[00:17:04]  or the Department of Justice, when in fact there's misconduct by every one of them in the Flynn case, but the misconduct in my case remains under seal and could not be raised.
[00:17:21]  So it was an extraordinary experience.
[00:17:25]  It's like fighting a prize fight with both hands tied behind your back.
[00:17:30]  Absolutely.
[00:17:32]  The Justice Department at a certain point even said, well, this sentencing is ridiculous.
[00:17:37]  Let's try to get some kind of a reduction.
[00:17:39]  Well, that's actually not true.
[00:17:42]  So the name of the left that Barr interceded to help Stone, the original sentencing memo recommending 79 years was never withdrawn.
[00:17:53]  It remained.
[00:17:54]  And the new prosecutors who replaced the four political prosecutors who resigned made it very clear to the judge that we were not abandoning the seven to nine recommendation.
[00:18:06]  That's the high side.
[00:18:07]  They said the low side was three to four years, but it's really up to your honor.
[00:18:12]  So I was not cut any breaks, number one.
[00:18:16]  Number two, the woman who ran the investigation into me for the Mueller team, but who had departed before trial.
[00:18:26]  Was a woman named Jeannie Ray.
[00:18:29]  Jeannie Ray was a partner at Robert Mueller's law firm.
[00:18:34]  Jeannie Ray represented the Clinton Foundation in the stolen emails case.
[00:18:39]  Jeannie Ray lied to a federal judge in that case, saying that all the email had been released when it hadn't.
[00:18:47]  And she gave the maximum contribution allowable to Hillary Clinton's campaign for president.
[00:18:53]  So she's directly involved in the stolen email case, but the judge says in my sentencing that one of my crimes was seeking.
[00:19:02]  but never finding the missing Hillary emails.
[00:19:05]  If that's not a conflict of interest, I don't know what is.
[00:19:09]  Mueller, when he babbled his way through his congressional testimony, claimed that he never knew that Jeannie Ree represented Hillary Clinton, ergo his law firm represented Donald Trump's opponent.
[00:19:23]  How could he investigate Donald Trump when his law firm represented Trump's opponent, Hillary Clinton?
[00:19:32]  And we now finally, because they finally declassified it, that Rod Rosenstein's scope memo to Mueller giving him authority is based on a series of falsehoods, based almost solely on the phony Steele dossier, but has no additional proof of Russian collusion.
[00:19:56]  And it is interesting that in my case, when I saw the CrowdStrike memo, Mark Elias, the Clinton lawyer who hired Fusion GPS to create the Steele memo, appeared in court to object to my having the memo, and the judge ruled that I was not entitled to it.
[00:20:21]  Wow.
[00:20:23]  Incredible.
[00:20:24]  And what they wound up with, first of all, you don't see four prosecutors quit all at the same time.
[00:20:30]  That never happened.
[00:20:31]  So obviously, there's a political.
[00:20:33]  Yeah, I think what really happened here is not the way they try to depict it is.
[00:20:37]  We recommended seven to nine years for Stone.
[00:20:40]  Our superiors tried to soften the sentence and we quit in protest.
[00:20:46]  I don't think that's what happened.
[00:20:47]  I think they told the people, the senior officials, that the range would be lower.
[00:20:53]  They hoped to get this memo in and have no consequence.
[00:20:58]  I think when the professionals looked at what they had done, they realized that they were unsupportable claims.
[00:21:05]  Foreign interference?
[00:21:06]  Really?
[00:21:07]  I should get extra time for foreign interference.
[00:21:10]  There was no evidence of that.
[00:21:11]  It's just one of many examples.
[00:21:14]  So the whole notion that Barr has politicized the Justice Department.
[00:21:20]  No, Obama politicized the Justice Department.
[00:21:24]  Where's the indictment of Loretta Lynch?
[00:21:27]  Where's the indictment of Eric Holder for fast and furious, for gun running, or for refusing a congressional testimony?
[00:21:37]  The people who have politicized the judicial system are the Democrats.
[00:21:41]  They also politicized Our intelligence agencies.
[00:21:45]  They knew that they were using fabricated evidence.
[00:21:49]  They lied to a FISA court judge in order to get permission to surveil people who supported Donald Trump and to surveil his campaign.
[00:21:59]  The New York Times reported on January 20th, 2017, inauguration day, page one, above the fold, that Roger Stone was one of four Trump associates who were surveilled by the Obama administration. during the 2016 election.
[00:22:20]  The government denies that.
[00:22:22]  The New York Times refuses to withdraw it.
[00:22:24]  They insist that their sourcing is, they have double sourcing, which they say is solid.
[00:22:30]  I have reason to believe that I was under surveillance far earlier than the government has admitted.
[00:22:37]  But even in their request for a search warrant, again, this fellow Aaron Zelensky, not a career prosecutor, deputy counselor to Hillary Clinton at the State Department, A protege of Rod Rattenstein, a guy who just bullies witnesses and lawyers, just threatening that I am the government, he bellows at one of my associates.
[00:23:07]  This guy's headed for.
[00:23:08]  Sounds like Gavin Newsome.
[00:23:09]  Yeah, I mean, it's beyond belief.
[00:23:12]  He alleges to a judge that he has evidence and probable cause to investigate Stone for that litany of crimes treason, conspiracy against the United States, mail fraud, wire fraud, counterfeiting.
[00:23:24]  The murder of Abraham Lincoln.
[00:23:25]  I mean, it was just, he had evidence of none of these things.
[00:23:29]  What he had was my Twitter feed.
[00:23:32]  And it is absolutely true that a source who was Randy Krediko told me that WikiLeaks would have major disclosures in October and they would rock the race.
[00:23:43]  That was the extent of my knowledge.
[00:23:46]  There was never any evidence or any proof that I knew about the source or the contents of the WikiLeaks disclosures.
[00:23:54]  There was never any evidence that I received anything from WikiLeaks and passed it on to anyone else.
[00:24:01]  Yes, I did have a Twitter direct message back and forth with somebody claiming to be Julian Assange.
[00:24:10]  Because he's unverified, there were 100 people claiming to be Julian Assange.
[00:24:14]  But that conversation took place a year after the election.
[00:24:19]  And the contents of it are benign.
[00:24:21]  They have nothing to do with the 2016 disclosures.
[00:24:25]  But the AP headline says that this exchange proved the Trump campaign's interest.
[00:24:32]  Avid interest in the WikiLeaks disclosures.
[00:24:35]  Really?
[00:24:35]  A year after they had already been released?
[00:24:38]  It's just typical of fake news.
[00:24:41]  So it is, the whole experience is almost Kafka esque that in the blink of an eye, you can lose not only your right to speak, but your home, your savings, your insurance, your ability to make a living, because I make a living by writing and speaking, but I'm now gagged at that time.
[00:25:03]  It really is hard for you to believe that this can happen in America.
[00:25:08]  And the judge ruled for the government in all the pretrial motions except for one.
[00:25:15]  The government claimed at trial that Predico was not my source.
[00:25:20]  At least three exculpatory witnesses testified to the grand jury David Lugo, a filmmaker, Tyler Nixon, one of my lawyers for whom I waived the privilege.
[00:25:34]  and Kristen Davis that they that Randy Kretico told them or Randy Kretico said within their hearing that he was my source.
[00:25:45]  David Lugo produced an email in which Randy Kretico threatened to put a bullet in his head if he talked to the feds.
[00:25:54]  But Mr. Kretico was not charged with witness tampering.
[00:25:57]  I was because I allegedly threatened to steal his dog.
[00:26:02]  And I did I did threaten to take his dog.
[00:26:05]  If you read the email before that one it says are you feeding that dog?
[00:26:09]  I'm going to report you to the state.
[00:26:11]  But they didn't show the jury that email.
[00:26:16]  So the whole thing is absurd.
[00:26:20]  They already had a narrative in mind.
[00:26:24]  The morning I was arrested, I was arrested at 6 a.m.
[00:26:27]  At 7 a.m., the Mueller team blast emailed my indictment to everybody in the media, also posted it on their website.
[00:26:36]  Unfortunately, it wasn't unsealed until 9 30 in the morning.
[00:26:40]  So the opening act here by the government was illegal.
[00:26:43]  But Judge Jackson had no problem with that.
[00:26:47]  Amazing.
[00:26:48]  And what's fascinating about this is that over and over again, it seems like they're using you as the ability to get through to other people.
[00:26:56]  Like they want to go after WikiLeaks, so they're trying to use you to do that.
[00:27:00]  They want to go after Trump, so they use you to do that.
[00:27:02]  So they've been using you as this kind of fall guy for these situations.
[00:27:07]  Right now, the status of your trial is that you didn't get a retrial, and you're facing 40 months.
[00:27:15]  In prison.
[00:27:17]  So they postponed my surrender date to May 30th.
[00:27:23]  Originally, the judge ordered within three weeks, but because of the COVID 19 crisis, it has been extended to May 30th.
[00:27:32]  It is, they said, the Bureau of Prisons people said, subject to further revision depending on what's going on with coronavirus.
[00:27:41]  I have filed a notice of appeal.
[00:27:44]  I will win on appeal if I get in front of an honest tribunal.
[00:27:49]  But an appeal could cost me $2 million and take two years.
[00:27:53]  The chances of the judge allowing me to remain at liberty or stay the execution of my sentence until appeal are rather thin, to say the least.
[00:28:05]  I could appeal that decision to the D.C. Circuit.
[00:28:07]  I'll probably get the same panel who essentially upheld the unconstitutional gag order.
[00:28:14]  So I've been very forthright in saying that, yes, my family and I are praying.
[00:28:20]  For executive relief, whether it is the commutation of my sentence or whether it is a pardon based on the fact that I was wrongly convicted.
[00:28:29]  When the forewoman of the jury is proven beyond dispute to have attacked me by name in 2019, what she would do is she would take her Facebook links and post them on Twitter.
[00:28:44]  As soon as the trial was, well, during the trial, her social media platforms were on private sittings.
[00:28:50]  So there was no way for my lawyers to know about this, even though the judge said her decision that my lawyers had an obligation to know.
[00:28:58]  That was impossible.
[00:29:00]  After my trial, she closed the Facebook page that she had since 2008 and she opened a new one.
[00:29:09]  When we asked for the right to subpoena the deleted material from Facebook, we were denied that right.
[00:29:17]  So across the board, whether it was Jonathan Turley on the left or Judge Napolitano on the right, Or Alan Dershowitz, somewhere in the middle.
[00:29:28]  No legal scholar thought that the denial of a new trial was based on either the facts or the law or the Constitution.
[00:29:39]  And I believe that I would get a new trial on appeal if I don't die of coronavirus first.
[00:29:48]  Right, right.
[00:29:49]  They mentioned all that.
[00:29:50]  They've been letting all these people out because of coronavirus.
[00:29:53]  And here they are wanting to put you.
[00:29:55]  How old are you, Roger?
[00:29:56]  I'm 67 years old, but I'm a vigorous 67.
[00:30:02]  I've actually had a history of some respiratory problems.
[00:30:05]  I had very bad asthma as a child, and I had some damage to my lungs.
[00:30:11]  But I'm in pretty good health, and I was tested.
[00:30:13]  But just the same, the president tweeted correctly that this was a miscarriage of justice.

=== Funding the Defense Fund (07:27) ===

[00:30:22]  The makeup of my jury included not a single Republican, not a single Trump supporter.
[00:30:28]  Not a single military veteran, not a single union member, not a single person with a high school education or less, but three lawyers, four alumni of the Obama or Clinton administration, a number of people with direct ties to the Justice Department or the FBI.
[00:30:50]  You know, it was hard to believe that on a random draw, you wouldn't come up with at least one Republican.
[00:30:58]  Juan Williams, the Fox News, the Five, said, There were Trump supporters on Roger Stone's jury.
[00:31:04]  No one, there weren't.
[00:31:08]  Well, and I think she's right on the law.
[00:31:11]  The judge basically said that the political views of a juror were not grounds for their dismissal.
[00:31:18]  But to deny that my case is about politics or about the presidential election is exceedingly unrealistic.
[00:31:27]  So, you know, I am out here trying to make up for lost time.
[00:31:33]  I was gagged for 16 months, and therefore, most Americans don't even know what flimsy charges I was convicted of.
[00:31:43]  They don't know how biased.
[00:31:45]  Uh, the judge and the jury were in my case.
[00:31:49]  They don't know realize all of the impediments that I had to mounting a vigorous expense.
[00:31:56]  I raised 2.2 million dollars from 65 000 individual Americans to pay for my initial legal defense.
[00:32:05]  An appeal, if I end up needing one, is going to be another two million dollars.
[00:32:10]  People who want to help me can go to Stone Defense Fund.com At Stonedefensefund.com.
[00:32:18]  If you want to sign a petition to the president urging him to pardon me based on the fact that I did not receive a fair trial and was therefore wrongly convicted, you can go to freerogerstone.com.
[00:32:33]  Almost a half million people have signed a petition to the president at that site, about another 250,000 on a site someone else started.
[00:32:44]  And millions of people are praying for me and my family every day.
[00:32:50]  And every bit counts.
[00:32:51]  It doesn't matter whether it's $5 or $500, every little bit helps.
[00:32:57]  I have no choice but to appeal to the president's supporters and my own friends in this epic fight for justice.
[00:33:06]  I am not going to plead guilty to something I'm not guilty of, and I'm not going to testify falsely against the president of the United States to make this all go away.
[00:33:17]  It's amazing.
[00:33:18]  It is really like a Kafka esque nightmare because.
[00:33:22]  If someone were to look at those charges and you look at a number of other cases, there's no way that anyone would serve that kind of time.
[00:33:31]  And so the charges are so transparently, if you look at it, it's just related to this rolling back of the 2016 election.
[00:33:39]  It's something that they haven't been able to do, either with the impeachment or with the Russian collusion.
[00:33:45]  But to go back there into 2015, which is when you were advising Trump, it seems like quite a reach to try to pull you into this, into the center.
[00:33:55]  It seems very personally directed.
[00:33:57]  Not only that, but it's kind of interesting that in May of 2016, I was approached by a man who identified himself as Henry Greenberg.
[00:34:09]  And I really did not want to meet with Henry Greenberg, but one of my friends insisted that Greenberg had access to negative information on Hillary Clinton that might be useful to the Trump campaign.
[00:34:21]  So I met him in a cafe in Florida.
[00:34:24]  He was a Russian national with a thick accent.
[00:34:28]  And he said he had access to information.
[00:34:31]  He didn't say emails, negative information on Hillary Clinton.
[00:34:36]  And I said, well, I have no idea whether it has any value.
[00:34:38]  I couldn't tell you until I saw it.
[00:34:40]  And he said, well, that's going to cost you $2 million.
[00:34:43]  And I laughed.
[00:34:44]  I said, well, I don't have $2 million.
[00:34:46]  And even if I did have $2 million, that's not how I would spend it.
[00:34:50]  And he said, no, you don't get it.
[00:34:52]  It's not your money I want.
[00:34:53]  It's Donald Trump's money.
[00:34:55]  And I said, no, you don't get it.
[00:34:57]  Donald Trump would never pay $2 million.
[00:35:00]  For opposition research.
[00:35:01]  And the meeting was over.
[00:35:03]  I learned afterwards that Henry Greenberg was an FBI informant, that he was only in the country on an informant's visa because he was convicted of a violent gun crime in Russia, and that he had nine consecutive informant visas signed by the head of the FBI office in Miami.
[00:35:25]  In the Mueller report, this is mentioned in a sentence.
[00:35:30]  They don't use his real name.
[00:35:32]  They know his real name, but they use a criminal alias that he uses.
[00:35:35]  And they say it could not be established that he was working for the Russian government, but they fail to mention that he is indisputably an FBI informant.
[00:35:46]  Then later, after the election, out of the blue, I'm contacted by a fellow named Patrick Byrne, who was then the chairman of Overstock.com, and somebody whose libertarian ideas I very much liked.
[00:36:07]  And he invited me to come out to Utah.
[00:36:09]  Give a speech to a meeting, paid me a small honorarium.
[00:36:15]  The speech turned out to be a small group of his friends for dinner.
[00:36:19]  And then after dinner, Colorado is a state where marijuana is legal, while we were relaxing, he drilled me about WikiLeaks and the Russians and the campaign.
[00:36:31]  I didn't tell him anything because I didn't know anything beyond what I've always said.
[00:36:36]  Then subsequently, when he was visiting New York, he invited me to come for lunch.
[00:36:42]  It was really kind of the same routine.
[00:36:44]  probing questions.
[00:36:47]  Mr. Byrne came forward several months ago and admitted that he had been working for the FBI, that he regretted it, that they had used him to spy on that Russian woman, Marina Butina, who they claimed was a Russian spy, and that if he ever said everything he knew, he could blow the whole Russian collusion thing wide open, and then he left the country.
[00:37:16]  So I believe the FBI, just as they tried to set up General Flynn, just as they set up George Papadopoulos and Carter Page, they attempted to set me up twice, but Mueller didn't find that worthy of mention in his report.
[00:37:33]  I think we have to be clear.
[00:37:35]  The people who set up General Flynn, who thank God has now been cleared, and I'm praying that the judge will dismiss the charges because I think he is a very great man and a patriot.
[00:37:47]  The people who set me up.

=== Vulnerabilities in Biden's Presidency (15:15) ===

[00:37:49]  The people who tried to set Donald Trump up are the same people.
[00:37:55]  They are the criminals.
[00:37:57]  They are the ones who are guilty of treason.
[00:38:00]  And the reason they oppose Donald Trump so strongly, having known him for 40 years, it's very easy to explain.
[00:38:09]  Nobody owns Donald Trump.
[00:38:12]  He is the first man to get to the White House owing nobody, not Wall Street, not the banks, not the oil companies, not high tech.
[00:38:22]  He owes.
[00:38:23]  Nobody.
[00:38:24]  He was the ultimate outsider candidate.
[00:38:27]  He answers only to the American people.
[00:38:30]  And he ran on a platform which completely threatens the status quo.
[00:38:35]  Both parties have been ruled by, or I should say, the country has been ruled by a two party duopoly, the elites of which believe the same thing.
[00:38:47]  Endless war, foreign war, where our inherent national interests are not clear.
[00:38:52]  Erosion of our civil liberties, where the government is collecting metadata on our phone calls, our emails, our text messages.
[00:39:01]  Immigration policies that cheat the people who are waiting in line to come here legally and reward the people who come here illegally and also make our streets and neighborhoods unsafe.
[00:39:13]  One size fits all trade policies that have shipped our jobs overseas and destroyed our economy.
[00:39:21]  fiscal policies that just make the debt as far as the eye can see.
[00:39:26]  At the same time, tax rates are confiscatory and they discourage entrepreneurial activity.
[00:39:34]  This is what the neocons and the two-party duopoly have brought us.
[00:39:39]  And Trump threatens all of that.
[00:39:42]  I've known him 40 years.
[00:39:44]  I met him when I went to New York to work for Ronald Reagan's campaign to organize New York State, and we became good friends.
[00:39:51]  I subsequently have worked on and off for him.
[00:39:54]  For 40 years, he is completely independent.
[00:39:59]  He is fearless.
[00:40:02]  He is the toughest guy I've ever met.
[00:40:04]  Look, I work for Richard Nixon and Bob Dole, both great American patriots, both very tough guys.
[00:40:10]  Trump is tougher than both of them.
[00:40:12]  He has incredible stamina, he has incredible energy, and he's very stubborn.
[00:40:18]  And I mean that in a positive sense, meaning when he sets his mind to a goal, he will not be deterred from it.
[00:40:26]  And he didn't run for president for the aggrandizement or because he wanted a bigger house or a bigger plane or hail to the chief.
[00:40:37]  This guy had the greatest life in the world.
[00:40:40]  He could play golf whenever he wanted to.
[00:40:42]  He has a beautiful home in Palm Beach.
[00:40:44]  He has the most amazing apartment in New York.
[00:40:49]  He loves his grandchildren, he loves his family.
[00:40:53]  And instead, he trades it in for a tsunami of vituperation and hate.
[00:40:59]  Ginned up by the fake news media every single day.
[00:41:03]  When he comes out and correctly recommends a specific medication for a treatment for coronavirus, because he has a small investment in a fund that has a small investment in the company that makes it, they accuse the guy of profiteering.
[00:41:19]  When it turns out that he made 29 bucks, that's how much he made.
[00:41:24]  So, this is not for him.
[00:41:27]  Some guys, George Bush, George H.W. Bush comes to mind.
[00:41:32]  Had to be president in order to be someone.
[00:41:36]  Other men, like Ronald Reagan, become president because they want to do something.
[00:41:42]  If you go back to an interview that Trump gave to Oprah Winfrey some 15, 20 years ago, she says, What about you, Donald?
[00:41:49]  Would you ever run for president?
[00:41:51]  Would you ever run for public office?
[00:41:53]  Do you think you'd ever run for president?
[00:41:55]  And he says, No, I don't think so.
[00:41:58]  Unless things get so bad that I have no choice.
[00:42:02]  That time came in 2016.
[00:42:05]  He will already go down in history as one of our greatest presidents only because he revitalized our economy when everybody said that that was impossible.
[00:42:15]  Manufacturing jobs would never come back.
[00:42:18]  We had the lowest unemployment in American history.
[00:42:22]  We had the fastest wage growth in American history.
[00:42:26]  We had billions of dollars coming back in the country to be invested here, to expand businesses here, create jobs here.
[00:42:35]  We had a record stock market.
[00:42:38]  Remember, after they told us that Trump was elected, the stock market would crash.
[00:42:42]  On the other hand, we had a record stock market.
[00:42:46]  Now, all of this has been destroyed by this Chinese virus.
[00:42:51]  But my point is a simple.
[00:42:53]  If Trump knew how to do it once, he knows how to do it again.
[00:42:57]  He understands low taxes and less regulation breeds economic activity and growth.
[00:43:03]  It's not a secret.
[00:43:04]  Reagan knew it.
[00:43:05]  John F. Kennedy knew it.
[00:43:07]  Unfortunately, Barack Obama and Bill Clinton didn't know it.
[00:43:11]  So I have every confidence.
[00:43:15]  That once America is open again, he can get the economy roaring again.
[00:43:21]  But he's going to need four more years to do it.
[00:43:24]  I do think you'll see some significant improvement before the election.
[00:43:29]  But the election itself is, for anybody who is a true political scientist, very hard to read.
[00:43:37]  We don't know what the level of geographic dislocation will be.
[00:43:42]  In other words, we don't know what sections in the country.
[00:43:44]  People will be able to vote as they normally do, and other places perhaps they don't.
[00:43:50]  We do know that 12 states have a specific state constitutional ban on mail in voting.
[00:43:58]  Right.
[00:43:58]  We also know that another 35 states require the presentation of a photo ID to vote.
[00:44:07]  So a national mail in ballot law cannot override the state constitutions.
[00:44:15]  would be immediately challenged in the courts.
[00:44:18]  Trump has always been a states' rights man.
[00:44:21]  He, for example, favors states' rights on the question of the legalization of cannabis.
[00:44:26]  He says leave it to the states.
[00:44:27]  If the people of the states vote for it, or if their legislature approves it, then they should have it, which I think is the correct position.
[00:44:36]  So we just don't know what the logistics of the election are going to be.
[00:44:43]  Joe Biden is the weakest Democrat that they have dominated since George McGovern.
[00:44:49]  He puts the word dem in dementia.
[00:44:53]  Not all there.
[00:44:55]  I almost feel sorry for him, except for he's so incredibly arrogant.
[00:45:00]  And I really think he has a number of very significant vulnerabilities.
[00:45:07]  First and foremost is the $1.4 billion that his son took from China.
[00:45:13]  Who would give a guy who never managed a dollar in his life $1.4 billion from the Chinese central bank, controlled by the Communist Party, only days after?
[00:45:23]  Joe and his son Hunter visited China on Air Force Two.
[00:45:28]  I argue that Biden is bought and paid for by the Chinese.
[00:45:32]  He said publicly the Chinese are no threat to us.
[00:45:35]  That's obviously untrue.
[00:45:38]  And then there is his role in turbocharging the war on drugs.
[00:45:44]  It's kind of ironic that African American voters revived his candidacy, but that's because they're unaware of the fact that the person most responsible.
[00:45:55]  For the mass incarceration of black people in this country, for the harsh mandatory penalties for the first time nonviolent crime of possession of small amounts of drugs, is Joe Biden.
[00:46:09]  He used to call it the Biden Bill, also known as the 1994 Crime Bill.
[00:46:14]  He still defends this law.
[00:46:16]  The war on drugs was Richard Nixon's biggest single mistake.
[00:46:22]  It has destroyed families.
[00:46:24]  It has destroyed lives.
[00:46:26]  It has cost taxpayers now.
[00:46:27]  billions to incarcerate people for nonviolent crimes.
[00:46:32]  It has rehabilitated no one.
[00:46:36]  It has been one giant ignominious racist failure.
[00:46:42]  Drug abuse is a public health problem.
[00:46:44]  It is not a criminal justice problem.
[00:46:47]  Well, that's where we got the whole super predator.
[00:46:50]  Yeah, I'm talking about drug dealers and drug traffickers.
[00:46:53]  I'm talking about the end user.
[00:46:55]  The housewife who gets caught with a quarter of an ounce of marijuana in her bag should not go to prison for 25 years.
[00:47:02]  Thank you, Biden.
[00:47:04]  Now, whether the Trump campaign understands how simple it would be.
[00:47:09]  To communicate that message through urban radio, because reaching African American consumers in this country is very efficient and can be done.
[00:47:19]  But that is one of his greatest Achilles' heels, in my opinion.
[00:47:24]  Well, you've been so deep in the political gang since, well, 68, your youth for Nixon.
[00:47:31]  So that's some 50 years of experience.
[00:47:36]  What are the odds that Joe Biden will actually stand as the candidate against Trump?
[00:47:40]  Well, I do think there are some impediments.
[00:47:42]  First of all, There's no question that many in the Democratic Party recognize how weak a candidate he is.
[00:47:50]  While they may have some long term affection for him, and he definitely benefits greatly from being Barack Obama's wingman, they really realize that he's a very weak candidate.
[00:48:04]  And their fantasy, I think, is Andrew Cuomo.
[00:48:08]  Because some of the late primaries, like New York, have now been canceled, it is conceivable. that Biden could get to the convention, whether it's viral or whether it's, you know, actual, without enough votes to be nominated on the first ballot, in which case I would predict that his candidacy will very quickly erode.
[00:48:31]  Basically, they had to grab Biden in order to stop Bernie Sanders.
[00:48:35]  Bernie Sanders has now been cheated twice out of the nomination, and twice he has endorsed the candidate that cheated him.
[00:48:44]  That's not a man of principle, in my opinion.
[00:48:47]  I used to like Bernie Sanders in the sense that he's not phony.
[00:48:51]  He's a genuine 100% communist, and he admits it.
[00:48:55]  But he's not a man of principle.
[00:48:57]  If he could support Hillary Clinton after what she did to him, I really don't understand that.
[00:49:02]  I really don't.
[00:49:04]  It's amazing.
[00:49:05]  And the speed, it looked like it was his nomination, of course, for a long time during this round of the presidential election.
[00:49:13]  And the speed with which he got out of the race and everyone coalesced around Biden was extraordinary for a candidate who had done so well up to then.
[00:49:21]  Well, but that, you know, again, they feared that Bernie Sanders would be an extraordinarily weak nominee, which he would.
[00:49:29]  Socialism cannot be sold to the American people.
[00:49:33]  And he is unapologetic.
[00:49:36]  Look, saying you are a democratic socialist is like saying I'm a meat-eating vegetarian.
[00:49:41]  Okay?
[00:49:42]  They don't go together.
[00:49:44]  But Bernie makes no apologize.
[00:49:45]  He's a collectivist.
[00:49:48]  And they knew that that would be a disaster.
[00:49:51]  So they were even willing to go with Joe Biden.
[00:49:54]  As limited as he is.
[00:49:57]  And he's going to continue to make mistakes.
[00:50:01]  Plus, just because of the coronavirus phenomena, he's kind of been dealt out of the news cycle.
[00:50:10]  And that might actually be advantageous because they can't hide him during a presidential campaign.
[00:50:18]  And if you let him speak, he is going to say crazy things.
[00:50:22]  But you can let him do those videos in his basement.
[00:50:26]  One thing that's interesting about all this, just because you've had this deep knowledge of the presidential races over the years, if there were going to be a Hail Mary candidate on the Democratic side to replace Biden, is there anyone that you would see as kind of a frontrunner for that?
[00:50:43]  I have said this previously, although there is a catch.
[00:50:47]  There's no question in my mind their strongest candidate would be Michelle Obama.
[00:50:52]  But there is a legitimate legal question because the Constitution requires you to be a legal resident of the United States for 15 consecutive years prior to the election.
[00:51:04]  And she and her husband changed their legal residence to the Cayman Islands for a brief period to save on taxes.
[00:51:13]  So it is conceivable that she doesn't meet the constitutional requirement.
[00:51:20]  This idea that she would take the vice presidency on a Biden ticket, I think, is a fantasy.
[00:51:26]  Why would you hitch your wagon to that?
[00:51:29]  And if Hillary Clinton takes the vice presidency on a Biden ticket, Joe will need a food taster almost immediately.
[00:51:37]  No question about it.
[00:51:39]  The trending on Twitter today was Obamagain.
[00:51:44]  And this is fascinating because it is coming around, as we were talking about, like with the Flynn case, et cetera.
[00:51:52]  So this might be something that opens up, including your case, into the campaign for the fall, where You know, so many of the prosecutions start to fall apart because they will obviously be uncovered as politically motivated.
[00:52:08]  Where do you see this impacting the campaign for 2020?
[00:52:11]  Well, first of all, the hero of this story is Richard Grinnell, the acting director of information, DNI, who finally declassified the documents that the president has been ordering declassified now for a couple years, but the bureaucrats dragged their heels because they know what they show.
[00:52:34]  Brunel is the hero in this drama.
[00:52:36]  He has finally brought the truth to the surface.
[00:52:39]  And it is abundantly clear that not only Barack Obama, but Joe Biden were present and involved in the planning of the illegal operation to spy on the Republican candidate for president and then the president elect of the United States and then the president of the United States and fabricated evidence in an effort to stage what is essentially.

=== Counter-Narratives to Watergate Corruption (13:32) ===

[00:53:05]  A coup, a coup d'etat.
[00:53:07]  And it always made sense that it led to Obama.
[00:53:10]  There was no way that Susan Rice and John Brennan and James Comey were out there on their own hook.
[00:53:21]  Now, whether any of these people will actually be prosecuted is of great interest to me because every one of them has lied to Congress.
[00:53:29]  John Brennan got caught spying on a Senate committee that was investigating illegal torture by the CIA.
[00:53:38]  He essentially surveilled the Senate committee's computers.
[00:53:41]  When he got caught, he denied it.
[00:53:43]  That's a lie.
[00:53:44]  That's a material lie, but he hasn't been indicted.
[00:53:47]  James Comey, the inspector general, has now twice recommended his prosecution for crimes more serious than what I'm charged with, but the Justice Department has given him a pass.
[00:54:02]  So we're going to find out whether we really have a two-tiered justice system.
[00:54:08]  The problem, of course, is that the mainstream media, particularly CNN and MSNBC and the New York Times and the Washington Post, just as they told us for three years that there was Russian collusion, they will now try to debunk the facts that Obama is in this thing up to his hips.
[00:54:29]  They're just going to keep insisting it's not true when it is true.
[00:54:34]  The point, of course, is that Trump has the bully pulpit and silencing him is impossible.
[00:54:40]  So, I think the American people by election day will get it.
[00:54:45]  Amazing.
[00:54:46]  Now, what's fascinating, seeing as you have worked for Richard Nixon and knew him quite well, the crimes that he was removed for or resigned over seem to pale in comparison with what we're finding out about Obamagate.
[00:55:03]  Sure, because let's view a comparison.
[00:55:06]  In Nixon's Watergate scandal, a small group of men outside government. Broke into the Watergate and also broke into the psychiatrist for Daniel Ellsberg.
[00:55:20]  In the Ellsberg case, they rifled the files.
[00:55:23]  In the Watergate case, they planted bugs which never worked and which never collected any useful data.
[00:55:32]  And there is still, to this day, no evidence that Richard Nixon knew about or approved this operation in advance.
[00:55:40]  The only one who has said that he did was Jeb Magruder, who changed his story on his deathbed.
[00:55:48]  John Dean, it's important to understand, is the individual who conceives of plans, nurtures, funds, and then lies to Nixon for 19 months about the Watergate break in.
[00:56:01]  He's the architect.
[00:56:03]  He would have you believe that he's a whistleblower.
[00:56:06]  That is completely false.
[00:56:08]  If you read my book, Tricky Dick, The Rise and Fall and Rise of Richard M. Nixon, or if you read Silent Coup by my friend Len Kolodny, or the real Watergate by my friend Jeff Shepard.
[00:56:26]  And the most amazing book that has only recently been published is called Hague's Coup by Ray Locker.
[00:56:36]  You'll learn that Alexander Hague is dethroned and that Alexander Hague's assignment is to walk Nixon to the exit, which he did.
[00:56:46]  In the case of Obama, he actually used the government to do his spying.
[00:56:52]  Which is a far more serious crime.
[00:56:56]  And it is, and lied to a court, the FISA court, in order to do so.
[00:57:03]  So it really does make Watergate look like small potatoes compared to what the Obama people have been caught at.
[00:57:11]  It's incredible.
[00:57:12]  One book you left out there was Nixon's Secret, which was your.
[00:57:17]  Nixon's Secret is the basis for my book, Tricky Dick.
[00:57:24]  But the thing was that after I wrote Nixon's Secrets, I learned a lot of things I didn't know when I wrote the first book.
[00:57:31]  So I expanded very substantially the portion on Watergate because we now know, for example, that Judge John Sirica, who the media would tell you was a great hero, was having ex part time meetings with the prosecutors, which is entirely illegal, and basically wired the appeal for the Watergate burglars so that they could never appeal.
[00:57:57]  There's just an enormous amount of information.
[00:58:00]  About the corruption of the Watergate prosecution.
[00:58:05]  There's a guy named Nick Ackerman who often is on MSNBC with Ari Melbourne.
[00:58:14]  His claim to fame is that he was a former Watergate prosecutor.
[00:58:19]  He has accused me of treason and being a Russian agent.
[00:58:23]  And as soon as I am able, I will be filing the appropriate defamation claim against him.
[00:58:28]  Let me also mention he's a total asshole and a rabid partisan trying to pose as some.
[00:58:36]  non-partisan lawman.
[00:58:39]  He has said point blank that I am a Russian asset, that I transferred the emails, that I am a traitor.
[00:58:46]  My family was mowed down by Russian tanks in Budapest in 1956.
[00:58:53]  I have no truck for the Russians, believe me.
[00:58:56]  But there's a line.
[00:58:57]  Look, this is a rough and tumble business.
[00:59:00]  I've been a lot of names.
[00:59:01]  Fine.
[00:59:02]  But calling me a traitor is defamatory.
[00:59:05]  And even I, with my reputation, can be defamed.
[00:59:10]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:59:10]  Well, we know that Rachel Maddow and MSNBC were the ones who went way, way out on the Russian collusion story and just made stuff up on a weekly basis.
[00:59:20]  And all that stuff got thrown out and collapsed, and they were all predicting that this was going to put Trump in prison and there was going to be a constitutional crisis, and the whole thing dissipated.
[00:59:32]  In the meantime, they got all these ratings from a largely left leaning Democratic audience just to kind of feed them this fantasy.
[00:59:41]  Now, it's interesting to me.
[00:59:43]  Because you mentioned Watergate there, there is something in those books that you brought up that I think gets us to the idea or the crux of this deep state system, which is continuing to operate.
[00:59:55]  We're seeing it here in 2020 more vividly than ever, but it goes deep back there and it seems to be largely concerned with maintaining that presidential power.
[01:00:05]  And we could say that the deep state, therefore, kind of removed Nixon because he got out of their reach.
[01:00:11]  There's no question.
[01:00:13]  There are a lot of analogies.
[01:00:15]  Nixon's greatest sin.
[01:00:18]  Was that he did not turn out to be the cold warrior they thought he was?
[01:00:22]  He reached a strategic arms limitation agreement with the Russians, which the military industrial complex today we call them the deep state opposed.
[01:00:31]  He opened the door to China, which they opposed.
[01:00:34]  He ended the war in Vietnam, which they opposed.
[01:00:37]  He ended the military draft, which they opposed.
[01:00:40]  Good God, the man's for peace.
[01:00:42]  We got to get rid of him.
[01:00:44]  The difference is that in those days, there were only three television networks and a handful of national news magazines.
[01:00:51]  We didn't even have national newspapers, although the New York Times was influential.
[01:00:55]  The Washington Post was not yet influential.
[01:00:58]  But once the mainstream media of the day, which was amazingly monolithic, decided on a narrative, that was the narrative.
[01:01:07]  There was no platform from which to pose a counter narrative.
[01:01:13]  That's why they told us for almost 60 years now that Lee Harvey Oswald, a lone nut, killed John Kennedy acting alone.
[01:01:24]  Even in the Gallup poll today, 71% of Americans do not believe that.
[01:01:28]  And they shouldn't because it's not true.
[01:01:31]  There's a lot of alternative theories.
[01:01:33]  I've written a book on it The Man Who Billed Kennedy, The Case Against LBJ.
[01:01:37]  It's a New York Times bestseller.
[01:01:40]  I think I make a very compelling case that LBJ had the motive, the means, and the opportunity.
[01:01:46]  And I use eyewitness evidence, fingerprint evidence, and deep Texas politics to make my case.
[01:01:53]  But for a long period of time, going back to some of the early truth tellers, nobody would publish their books, nobody would interview them on radio, nobody would have them on TV.
[01:02:06]  There was no place from which to launch a counter narrative.
[01:02:10]  The rise of a robust alternative media based in the internet is what makes the election of a Donald Trump possible.
[01:02:21]  The media can't destroy Trump the way they successfully destroyed Barry Goldwater.
[01:02:27]  Goldwater.
[01:02:28]  He's a warmonger.
[01:02:29]  He's a nut.
[01:02:30]  He's a maniac.
[01:02:31]  He's mentally unbalanced.
[01:02:33]  He'll start a nuclear war.
[01:02:34]  He's an anti-Semite.
[01:02:35]  That's my favorite one.
[01:02:36]  The guy was half Jewish.
[01:02:39]  But there was no counter-narrative.
[01:02:41]  You remember the magazine cover?
[01:02:43]  1,000 psychiatrists say Barry Goldwater unfit to be president.
[01:02:48]  I mean, it's just, it's insanity.
[01:02:50]  They couldn't do that to Trump because he had the alternative pulpit of the internet to counter-punch.
[01:02:57]  And he's the greatest.
[01:02:58]  Counterpuncher in American political history.
[01:03:02]  That's why you see this giant move by Silicon Valley to censor the internet.
[01:03:09]  They want to put the toothpaste back with the tube.
[01:03:12]  And this poses great danger for the president's reelection.
[01:03:15]  Look, I'm a veteran.
[01:03:17]  I was banned on Twitter, now been three years for life.
[01:03:21]  I still don't even know what it was that I posted that I got banned for.
[01:03:25]  I do know that Keith Olbermann can advocate the violent assassination of Donald Trump.
[01:03:31]  Yet he still has his little blue check mark.
[01:03:33]  In my case, I think I hurt Jake Tapper's feelings.
[01:03:37]  And because of that, I'm banned for life.
[01:03:40]  Amazing.
[01:03:41]  And that censorship is something that I think the Trump administration should look into as well, because it's going to be an incredible disadvantage going into the fall if they keep this up and they're just throwing off these, you know, not even conservative voices.
[01:03:57]  I mean, you know, this is an amazing thing, which is they want to get rid of anything that gets out of this narrative that they.
[01:04:05]  Pushed so hard from the Zuckerberg side with Facebook and Twitter, which is, you know, Trump has to be crazy and he has to be a criminal and everyone around him has to be compromised.
[01:04:19]  Yeah, the problem, of course, is the hour grows late.
[01:04:24]  These big social media platforms are violating antitrust laws and they could be reined in, but the Justice Department under Jeff Sessions and Rod Rosenstein certainly didn't do it.
[01:04:36]  And I do think it poses enormous danger.
[01:04:40]  Back in the day when I had 550,000 followers on Twitter, I found it a lively place where you could actually have a spirited debate and some clever repartee.
[01:04:52]  Today, it's just a cesspool of hate.
[01:04:56]  After I was convicted in a kangaroo court, the judge left the gag on me post-conviction.
[01:05:06]  And her reason for doing so was to protect the witnesses and jurors.
[01:05:11]  Do you have any idea how many death threats I've received, my wife has received, my children have received, my grandchildren have received?
[01:05:20]  Literally thousands of really nasty death threats.
[01:05:24]  But the judge doesn't care about those.
[01:05:27]  I know of no credible threat against the jurors or the witnesses.
[01:05:32]  I'm not John Gotti.
[01:05:35]  But the judge finally, that God lifted the gag order.
[01:05:40]  When she wrongly decided my motion for a new trial.
[01:05:47]  There's still a list of people the government gives you when you're indicted that you're not allowed to have any contact with.
[01:05:53]  Half these people on the list I don't even know.
[01:05:55]  The other half are some friends of mine, but I'm not allowed to have any social intercourse with them whatsoever, even through third parties without explanation.
[01:06:04]  And that has been left in place.
[01:06:06]  So my friend Michael Caputo, who now works in the White House, a friend of mine for 30 plus years.
[01:06:14]  Very close to he and his wife.
[01:06:16]  I have not been able to talk to him now for almost two years.
[01:06:20]  Amazing.
[01:06:23]  You know, it's incredible.
[01:06:24]  The censorship aspect is major, but I want to go back to something which you were talking about and going all the way back and looking at the JFK assassination, which was your first book, really, on the alternative historian side.

=== Nixon's Indestructible Legacy (05:51) ===

[01:06:37]  And that is an excellent book.
[01:06:38]  I highly recommend it.
[01:06:41]  And getting into LBJ's role in all this and that kind of power politics aspect of the 60s.
[01:06:48]  When you look back there, something very interesting happened when you were speaking to Nixon that you recounted, which was that he, when Oswald was assassinated shortly after being accused of assassinating President Kennedy and Jack Ruby shot him, Nixon said something very interesting to you about Ruby.
[01:07:08]  Yeah, Nixon was watching television like many Americans.
[01:07:12]  He saw Ruby kill Oswald at point blank range.
[01:07:17]  He jumped out of his chair and he said, I know that man.
[01:07:20]  I know that man.
[01:07:22]  And it turned out that Jack Ruby, whose real name was Jack Rubenstein from Chicago, had been a paid informant for the House Un-American Activities Committee in 1947, and that Nixon had put him on the payroll at the request of Congressman Lyndon Johnson because Nixon had some leftover money in the committee budget.
[01:07:48]  And members normally did these things for each other as a courtesy.
[01:07:53]  In Nixon's case, Nixon said, well, if we're going to hire the guy, I'd at least like to meet him.
[01:07:58]  And Murray Schotner, who was kind of the eminence grease of Nixon's early career, brought Rubenstein, Jack Ruby, in to briefly meet Congressman Nixon.
[01:08:10]  Nixon also is quoted as saying that the Warren Commission was the greatest goddamn hoax of all time.
[01:08:18]  Now, Nixon was not at all retrospective.
[01:08:23]  He was always looking forward.
[01:08:25]  He hated to look back.
[01:08:27]  And you'd have a very hard time getting him to talk about the past, except when he had a couple cocktails.
[01:08:35]  Then he would become positively loquacious, and you could ask him about Eisenhower or Joe McCarthy or Venezuela, Caracas.
[01:08:45]  And when I asked him, who really killed Jack Kennedy, you could see him shudder, and he said, Dallas.
[01:08:55]  And I said, What do you mean, sir?
[01:08:56]  And he said, Let me put it to you this way.
[01:08:59]  Lyndon and I both wanted to be president, but I wasn't willing to kill for it.
[01:09:05]  And I recount that in my book.
[01:09:08]  Nick Rui, the late Nick Rui, who was Nixon's body man, was present when Nixon recognized Ruby.
[01:09:16]  He confirms that account.
[01:09:18]  No, I think Nixon knew exactly what happened.
[01:09:20]  It's odd because, of course, the murder of John F. Kennedy had the Inadvertent effect of blowing life back into the political career of one Richard M. Nixon.
[01:09:32]  But that was completely washed up, having lost by a hair to Kennedy, an election that I contend was stolen.
[01:09:41]  I outline that in both my books on Gibson in great detail.
[01:09:44]  But then a disastrous run for governor of California, which he made only to try to stay in contention as a future presidential candidate.
[01:09:55]  But then, in a very strange way, the murder of JFK, the murder of Robert Kennedy, the murder of Dr. King, And the Vietnam War clears a path for the greatest political comeback in American history.
[01:10:12]  And it is Nixon who says a man is not finished when he is defeated, he is only finished when he quits.
[01:10:24]  The greatness comes when you are tested, when you take some knocks, when you suffer defeats, when things don't go your way.
[01:10:33]  Until you have been in the deepest valley, You cannot appreciate the majesty of the highest mountaintop.
[01:10:41]  And I console myself with that, particularly these days.
[01:10:46]  As you know, and no, I'm not going to show it to you, I have a tattoo of Richard Nixon on my back, about the size of a grapefruit between my shoulder blades.
[01:10:56]  And people ask me, is it a political statement?
[01:11:00]  And I say, no, not at all.
[01:11:02]  What it is for me is a daily reminder that in life, when you get knocked down, you got to get back up.
[01:11:09]  The story of Nixon is a story of resilience, a story of persistence.
[01:11:14]  It's an American story of a guy who really was indestructible.
[01:11:19]  Even after the ashes of Watergate, he comes back and publishes 10 best selling books on foreign policy and becomes a trusted advisor to President Bill Clinton on Russia and China policy.
[01:11:32]  So he is still an inspiration.
[01:11:36]  Because of Watergate, he does not get credit, but this is the president who reached a strategic arms limitation agreement with the Russians.
[01:11:43]  who unilaterally saved Israel from destruction in the 1973 Yom Kippur War.
[01:11:49]  He is the president who desegregated the public schools.
[01:11:53]  He is the president that gave us the 18-year-old vote, who ended the military draft, who gave us federal revenue sharing, who launched the war on cancer.
[01:12:03]  I mean, this is a very consequential presidency.
[01:12:07]  Those are very moderate positions, too.
[01:12:11]  Progressives now would call Richard Nixon a progressive.
[01:12:14]  Actually, for a while, pushed a family assistance plan that was devised by Daniel Patrick Moynihan, which conservatives vigorously opposed.

=== Establishment Resistance to Trump (02:48) ===

[01:12:28]  You compare that to modern presidencies, the only one who can actually compare, ironically, is Trump.
[01:12:35]  Trump rebuilt our military, Trump redid all the harmful trade agreements, Trump rebuilt our economy, which was absolutely structurally impossible, we were told.
[01:12:49]  He clearly, even if he were not to be reelected, and I think he will be reelected, but even if he were not to be reelected, he already goes down in the pantheon of great presidents, particularly in view of the implacable two party, corporate owned media opposition to him and attacks and vituperation that he sustains every single day.
[01:13:15]  What's amazing is that in the face of all that, he has accomplished as much.
[01:13:19]  As he has.
[01:13:20]  It is incredible.
[01:13:22]  And to come out of nowhere to do this is quite remarkable.
[01:13:28]  The other thing is, you make a good point, which is that it's not only Democratic opposition, it is establishment opposition, even Republican opposition.
[01:13:37]  Yeah, that's a key point that I think people make a mistake when they think of Republicans versus Democrats.
[01:13:44]  Right.
[01:13:45]  This is the insiders versus an outsider.
[01:13:48]  That's the real breakdown.
[01:13:50]  Party really means almost nothing today.
[01:13:54]  Many of the Republicans in Congress strongly support Donald Trump, not because they want to.
[01:14:00]  but because they have to.
[01:14:01]  Why?
[01:14:01]  Because back home in their district or their state, Donald Trump is far more popular than they are.
[01:14:07]  Let's take Lindsey Graham, who used to be, you know, the Sancho Panza for John McCain.
[01:14:13]  John McCain's role in pushing the phony steel dossier, an attempt to take Donald Trump out, has now been exposed.
[01:14:21]  When I was convicted, Meghan McCain tweeted, I hope Roger Stone rots in hell, to which I said, no, Meghan, I don't have any plans to visit your father.
[01:14:33]  In any event, Lindsey Graham converts to Trumpism.
[01:14:36]  Why?
[01:14:37]  Because Trump is wildly popular in South Carolina, far more popular than Senator Lindsey Graham.
[01:14:44]  So it's just a perfect example.
[01:14:46]  The establishment Republicans resisted Donald Trump to the extent that they could.
[01:14:52]  I give enormous credit to a small band of House Republicans like Matt Gaetz and Trey Gowdy and Mark Meadows and Jim Jordan.
[01:15:06]  And others who had the courage with the opposition of the House Republican leadership to break this whole thing wide open.

=== Choosing Ford for Leverage (06:09) ===

[01:15:17]  Those men all deserve an enormous amount of credit.
[01:15:22]  Absolutely.
[01:15:24]  I wanted to go back to something that you were talking about there with Nixon, though, and his comeback, which is interestingly enough, he actually will use his knowledge around the JFK assassination.
[01:15:39]  To deal himself a pardon with Ford in that whole situation.
[01:15:44]  And I've always found that fascinating.
[01:15:45]  That's something that you put on the record.
[01:15:48]  Can you go into that for us here?
[01:15:50]  Sure, it's very simple.
[01:15:53]  When the match of Nixon and Agnew was like oil and water, Nixon made an impulsive choice of Agnew for vice president because he had the dilemma of picking a running mate who was acceptable to both wings of the party.
[01:16:11]  You have to remember in 1968, the Republican Party still had a liberal wing, Nelson Rockefeller, George Romney, Bill Scranton.
[01:16:20]  And it also had a conservative wing, John Tower, Barry Goldwater, Strom Thurmond, Bill Buckley.
[01:16:27]  And Nixon was acceptable to both wings, but he needed a running mate who was acceptable to both wings.
[01:16:34]  Thurmond and the conservatives would not take a Mark Hatfield or a Charles Percy or a John Lindsay.
[01:16:44]  And the liberals would not accept a Ronald Reagan, for example.
[01:16:49]  So Nixon picked Agnew essentially because he was a cipher.
[01:16:55]  You really couldn't place him on the spectrum.
[01:16:58]  He was considered a liberal Republican, but he had faced down the black community over violence in the wake of Dr. King's murder.
[01:17:08]  And he and Nixon never really got along.
[01:17:14]  Nixon, I think, Thought Agnew was his life insurance policy in a way.
[01:17:20]  And when Agnew was removed for corruption, Nixon had to choose a new vice president.
[01:17:28]  Nixon was already in trouble in the Watergate thing, and he probably knew that his days were numbered.
[01:17:34]  There was great sentiment in the Republican Party to choose either Barry Goldwater or Nelson Rockefeller.
[01:17:41]  There was also a boomlet for George Bush.
[01:17:44]  But Nixon picked Gerald Ford.
[01:17:47]  And the reason he picked Gerald Ford is because he knew.
[01:17:51]  That as a member of the Warren Commission, Ford, at the request of Earl Warren and Alan Dulles, had taken the actual diagram in the autopsy and removed the bullet wound in the upper back of JFK to the back of his neck.
[01:18:14]  To accommodate the single bullet theory put forward by a young Arlen Specter.
[01:18:22]  In other words, Ford, who would later admit to the New York Times that he did this, had falsified the portions of the autopsy in order to justify the Warren Commission report.
[01:18:37]  When they asked Ford why he did this years later, he said, well, the country needed closure.
[01:18:43]  No, I think the country needed truth.
[01:18:46]  And basically, Nixon, according to Al Haig, who told me this when I interviewed him in Palm Beach, after he'd had a couple of highballs, He said, Look, this is easy.
[01:18:58]  Nixon took Jerry Ford because he had him by the balls.
[01:19:02]  He said, If I'm going down, I'm taking everybody with me.
[01:19:05]  And I know what you did on the Kennedy assassination.
[01:19:08]  So he chose Ford because he had leverage on Ford.
[01:19:13]  And then Alexander Haig brokered the pardon for Nixon.
[01:19:18]  Fascinating.
[01:19:19]  And that's a remarkable series of incidents.
[01:19:23]  And you actually think that Haig was deep throat.
[01:19:28]  you must read Ray Locker's book.
[01:19:30]  First of all, he said, I don't think that there is a Deep Throat.
[01:19:35]  I think Deep Throat is a composite of a number of sources.
[01:19:40]  Deep Throat is not mentioned in the Woodward and Bernstein book, All the President's Men.
[01:19:45]  He is not in the movie, All the President's Men.
[01:19:48]  He pops up later.
[01:19:50]  He's not mentioned in any of the Washington Post contemporaneous stories covering Watergate.
[01:19:55]  He pops up later, I think, as a literary device.
[01:20:00]  Then Bradley himself, the legendary Washington Post editor, expressed grave doubts as to whether he really existed.
[01:20:09]  By the time Mark Felt came forward, former FBI deputy director, and claimed he was deep throat, he was, first of all, he had had a stroke, he was non compas mentis.
[01:20:22]  But if you examine the timeline, he would not have still been in office and therefore in a position to have the information.
[01:20:30]  And Woodward and Bernstein were starting to get. pressed by inconsistencies in their story, so they embraced the idea that Mark Felt was Deep Throat.
[01:20:41]  He was mob.
[01:20:43]  There is more than ample evidence in Ray Locker's book, Haig's Coup, that Al Haig is at least the principal source known as Deep Throat.
[01:20:57]  And he details how Haig undermines Nixon at every turn at a time where Nixon is cornered and trying to defend himself.
[01:21:07]  So, I have a little doubt about it.
[01:21:11]  Wow, incredible.
[01:21:13]  And Spiro Agnew wrote a little known autobiography.
[01:21:19]  And I think the title of it was something like Get Out or Else.
[01:21:23]  Yes.
[01:21:24]  Go quietly or else.
[01:21:26]  Go quietly or else.

=== The System Beneath Obamagate (15:19) ===

[01:21:27]  Thank you.
[01:21:28]  I had an opportunity to meet and interview him in Baltimore for my book on Nixon.
[01:21:36]  He was quite engaging.
[01:21:37]  He was also quite bitter.
[01:21:40]  He was right.
[01:21:41]  All the governors of Maryland had been on the tape.
[01:21:43]  So why was only he prosecuted?
[01:21:45]  That was kind of his attitude.
[01:21:47]  In any event, I'm beginning to lose my voice here.
[01:21:50]  So.
[01:21:51]  This has been great, and I really appreciate it after 16 months of not being able to speak.
[01:21:56]  You know, Roger Stone, who can't talk, is like UCN Bolt that can't run.
[01:22:02]  This is what I do.
[01:22:04]  I have been subjected to an outrageous political prosecution.
[01:22:10]  I was prosecuted to squeeze me both personally, legally, and financially to turn on the president.
[01:22:18]  I have refused to do that.
[01:22:20]  I am committed to his reelection.
[01:22:23]  They would love me to be locked up during the 2020 election, so I am not free to do everything within my power to make sure this great president is reelected.
[01:22:34]  I will fight tooth and nail.
[01:22:36]  I am praying that the president will intervene.
[01:22:39]  There are certainly grounds for which he can do so.
[01:22:43]  The Washington Post is not going to love it, but nothing he does will make the Washington Post love him.
[01:22:50]  It has been a horrific ordeal for my family and for me.
[01:22:55]  And I guess lastly, I just want to thank literally the millions of Americans who are praying for us, who encourage us, who see the truth, and would like to see justice done.
[01:23:08]  It is that and my renewed faith in God that have allowed me to remain sane through this entire process.
[01:23:17]  I really believe justice will come, and I thank you for the opportunity to lay it all out.
[01:23:23]  Roger, it's been great to have you on here, and we'll get you back.
[01:23:26]  Hopefully, we'll get you back as a pardoned.
[01:23:29]  Man.
[01:23:31]  And that's something that we're very much looking forward to.
[01:23:34]  There's one last question I wanted to ask you in relation to Nixon and Trump, which is this letter surfaced from 1987 where Nixon was encouraging Trump to run for office.
[01:23:46]  To the best of your knowledge, what was that relationship with Nixon and Trump?
[01:23:51]  Well, I know a little bit about that letter because Nixon and Trump met for the first time the day before that letter was written in George Steinbrenner's box at Yankee Stadium.
[01:24:04]  And the next day, Nixon called me and he said, Well, I met your man because he knew Trump and I were friends.
[01:24:10]  And I said, Really?
[01:24:10]  What did you think?
[01:24:11]  And he said, I'm telling you, this guy has it.
[01:24:15]  If he ever runs for office, he's a winner.
[01:24:17]  This guy could go all the way.
[01:24:20]  And then if you find the letter, Nixon is very, very typically Nixonian.
[01:24:24]  Nixon says, Mrs. Nixon saw you on the Mike Douglas show and she thought you were superb.
[01:24:31]  Well, it wasn't Pat Nixon who saw him, it was Richard Nixon.
[01:24:35]  And then he encourages Trump to run.
[01:24:37]  There's an interview very recently in which Trump points to the many lessons he learned from Nixon's presidency that I urge you to read.
[01:24:49]  They were alike in the sense that they were pragmatists, but they were unalike in the sense that Trump is more like Reagan in the sense that he's a big picture man.
[01:24:59]  He has big, broad beliefs.
[01:25:02]  He's perfectly happy to leave the details to the minions.
[01:25:06]  He knows that low taxes and less regulation and a strong military and better trade relations, where we both benefit, are better for the country.
[01:25:17]  And he's perfectly willing to let the others work out the detail.
[01:25:21]  Whereas Nixon, having been in the House and the Senate eight years as vice president, was intricately involved at the tiniest level of his presidency.
[01:25:32]  So in some ways, Trump is a pragmatist like Nixon, but he's a big picture man like Reagan.
[01:25:40]  How close do you think the two were actually in terms of knowing each other?
[01:25:46]  Well, they lived in New York at the same time.
[01:25:48]  I think they had a lively correspondence.
[01:25:51]  At the request of Nixon, Trump flew to Houston to do a charity event with John Connolly.
[01:25:59]  And the Nixons and the Connollys and the Trumps spent the weekend together.
[01:26:07]  So, and I was not there, although I did help set up the trip.
[01:26:12]  I was told that Nixon and Trump closeted themselves in a hotel suite and talked politics for like eight hours.
[01:26:20]  You know, Trump will never be a politician.
[01:26:25]  He's a political figure, but he's his own man.
[01:26:28]  In other words, nobody tells Trump what to say, where to go, what to tweet, who to appoint.
[01:26:35]  Trump is very much his own man.
[01:26:37]  There's no Karl Rove in Trump land.
[01:26:40]  He is not handled or managed or packaged.
[01:26:44]  What you see is what you get.
[01:26:46]  I think that that's what the voters find refreshing and entertaining.
[01:26:51]  Trump is interesting because you never know what he might do.
[01:26:54]  Right.
[01:26:54]  No, it's not fake that he's not reading talking points written by some, you know, snot-nosed speechwriter.
[01:27:01]  So, you know, I think there was a collegial relationship.
[01:27:07]  This new interview published just the other day, of which Nixon, of which Trump speaks extensively about Nixon, is very much worth reading.
[01:27:18]  Fascinating.
[01:27:18]  Wow, incredible.
[01:27:20]  Roger, good luck.
[01:27:21]  And we'll be watching things closely.
[01:27:23]  Hopefully, we get you back here after you're pardoned, and we'll talk some more.
[01:27:27]  But great, best of luck to you.
[01:27:28]  Well, from your mouth to God's ears.
[01:27:30]  And please go to stonedefensefund.com and help me raise the funds I need to continue my vigorous defense.
[01:27:39]  Thank you, and God bless you.
[01:27:41]  Okay, great.
[01:27:42]  Great to see you.
[01:27:44]  Amazing.
[01:27:45]  And, Miss Olivia, it's extraordinary that we had Roger with us for this.
[01:27:51]  But how are the questions going on?
[01:27:53]  We have a bunch of outstanding questions saved for the next time we get Roger on.
[01:27:59]  Yes, absolutely.
[01:28:01]  And it's fascinating to me as well because there are so many things there to cover with Roger's trial and the amazing kind of background going on there.
[01:28:12]  And, you know, what I find very interesting is that when we're looking at Trump's presidency as a whole, we can look back through history and see Nixon.
[01:28:26]  We can see the JFK, the deep state opposition to JFK in the same light.
[01:28:33]  But you have a right side, a left side, whatever it happens to be.
[01:28:37]  It doesn't really matter because what we're talking about is an apparatus that is opposed to independent presidential power, which is what this comes down to.
[01:28:47]  And we're seeing it very much in the Trump case.
[01:28:50]  What's fascinating is with so many of those cases that were brought in Russian collusion, which we all know was a fantasy, and we said on this program from the start it was.
[01:29:01]  The amazing thing is that we were able to see with all of those charges and all those people being charged that as they collapse one by one, and Stone's case may be another one that collapses because it's built on nothing.
[01:29:17]  And remember, a lot of it has to do with going after and getting people like, for example, Julian Assange and WikiLeaks.
[01:29:27]  This is the amazing thing because they've tried to get at WikiLeaks through Stone, they've tried to get at Trump.
[01:29:32]  Through Stone.
[01:29:33]  And when you're looking at the political trajectory of the Mueller investigation, you can see that thread of the deep state control over the White House and the deep state attacks on the White House.
[01:29:46]  And that's whether or not you like Trump or not.
[01:29:50]  This is the nature of the fact, which is the Central Intelligence Agency elects themselves to be the arbiter and the decider of who we can have as the presidency.
[01:30:00]  This is what I think the Stone story here that he laid out for us today really gets at.
[01:30:06]  And, you know, we talked to Roger back when he put out the JFK book, and that was a great book, actually, going into LBJ's role in the assassination.
[01:30:17]  And there's more, obviously, to this story, but I think for our purposes today, what's great about what Roger came forward and said really was giving us some insight into that background of how this case came about, how he got charged, and the inner aspects of that relationship with Trump and Nixon.
[01:30:38]  We've reported on aspects of Trump and Nixon relating to the UFO file, relating to energy and exotic energy, and some of the deeper aspects of this.
[01:30:56]  And the amazing thing is, the more research that we do, the more that we see there's this whole area.
[01:31:02]  For example, Trump's uncle, who we've covered extensively on this show, and his role working with Vandiver Bush and the Kind of exotic technology that those two were working on.
[01:31:16]  And Trump's uncle being the protege of Vannevar Bush, you know, and Vannevar Bush being so closely associated with this exotic technology that we call X technology in this program, you have to really start to see that we're in an extraordinary era here with the revelations coming forward.
[01:31:34]  We have the foundation now to open this up.
[01:31:37]  And just in the middle of it, there is this, you know, just insane.
[01:31:42]  Coronavirus craze propaganda.
[01:31:44]  And don't tell me that a lot of that isn't motivated to swing this election as well.
[01:31:49]  And again, regardless of whether or not you're right or left or however you feel about President Trump, the idea of an invisible agency moving to create the circumstances where they can remove a president is absurd.
[01:32:04]  And we've seen it with impeachment and Russian collusion.
[01:32:08]  So, you know, and I don't care who the president would be in this case, who they were doing this to, even if it was Bernie Sanders.
[01:32:16]  You still have to sit there in awe and say, the American people just don't want to go for this hidden system running things as they have since 1963 and the coup d'etat against President Kennedy.
[01:32:28]  So we find ourselves in a very interesting position.
[01:32:31]  And I think that Stone, we get a real reflection on that now that his gag order is lifted.
[01:32:37]  And that's the extraordinary thing, I think, on our side of the fence.
[01:32:41]  But we are going to be coming back for you on Friday at 8 p.m., and we'll have X series.
[01:32:49]  For you at that time.
[01:32:51]  It is a deep state episode, so I guess this is our theme for the last couple of weeks and with Stone's interview as well.
[01:33:00]  I do feel that Obamagate trending on Twitter and the things that are coming to light there, the signaling by the Trump administration that he's going to take off the gloves and go after them now after hanging around and taking it for three and a half years, is very significant.
[01:33:16]  And we've seen a lot of different types of groups out there hoping for this stuff to happen, you know, and some of them fantasizing that it already happened and that he had already rounded up all these people and all the rest.
[01:33:30]  But the facts on the ground are that the Trump administration has not.
[01:33:34]  Been in a position to really fire back on us.
[01:33:37]  So, the case of General Flynn being freed and the case, you know, the things that are going on with Stone, the signals are there.
[01:33:49]  So, I'm going to predict on this program that Roger Stone is going to get a pardon because he was caught up in this maelstrom of the Mueller investigation.
[01:34:00]  And anyone who looks at that case deeply, you know, Whether you love Roger Stone or not, you would have to say that it was just a politically motivated hatchet job, and that the nature of the attacks on Trump and his people, you know, Catherine Austin Fitz likened it to a chessboard where you take out the pieces trying to get at the king.
[01:34:26]  And so that's the kind of thing I think when we're looking at the deep state and the activities that they've had so, you know, in the last 60 years.
[01:34:35]  Really, the last 70, 75 years in America.
[01:34:40]  But Professor Scott, who, you know, originated the term deep state, Peter Dale Scott talks about the assault on the presidency.
[01:34:51]  And the first assault on the presidency by the deep state was the JFK assassination, which changed the trajectory of so much.
[01:35:00]  And interestingly enough, as we were talking with Roger about Nixon, it comes back around too, because he benefited, yeah, but that same system.
[01:35:09]  Ousted him when he didn't want to do their bidding either.
[01:35:13]  And we can see that he used that knowledge that Ford had been part of this deep state operation to basically remove him.
[01:35:25]  And that was his dealing out to say, I want a pardon.
[01:35:30]  And as a result, that's how he gets off.
[01:35:32]  And that's how Ford gives him that pardon.
[01:35:34]  But then Ford, as a result of that, loses the election.
[01:35:37]  So this is the nature of those deep state wars.
[01:35:39]  And the more we can see that internecine warfare taking place, The more we can get a handle on what this political process is all about.
[01:35:48]  And then when you bring it down to the kind of totalitarian level that we've seen with them trying to take advantage of the coronavirus to chip everybody and have people walking around with masks, we've seen the most undemocratic things in this country recently with the protests and the beginning of the protesters.
[01:36:07]  You have to get to the root of where all of this is coming from.
[01:36:11]  And the root to where that is coming from, it's largely.
[01:36:15]  Sits, resides in the deep state.
[01:36:18]  And the deep state, you know, those intelligence connections, which is that aspect of the CIA that wants to control so much of American public life and around the world, you know, that gets together and colludes with these interests, like we're seeing with the large scale pharmaceutical interests.
[01:36:36]  You know, when you see people like Gates and Cuomo getting together, that's a deep state tete a tete.
[01:36:42]  So these are the things that I think we need to really be watching.

=== Uncovering the Deep State Roots (03:01) ===

[01:36:46]  And it was great to have a stone on.
[01:36:49]  Today, because I know he's been struggling with a cold, so we're happy to get him.
[01:36:53]  And I do feel like we'll get him back as soon as that part.
[01:36:55]  Yeah, you could tell his throat was really giving out at the end.
[01:36:58]  He was doing great, and I do recommend his book on the JFK assassination, which is LBJ, the man who killed Kennedy.
[01:37:07]  Because one of the things he points out is that four out of the six Watergate burglars, who were all CIA linked, were all present in Dealey Plaza during the Kennedy assassination.
[01:37:23]  Really odd to that.
[01:37:24]  So you see, when Professor Scott talks about deep events, We can see how they're linked because there's so much of the personnel involved in the removal of President Kennedy that are then used for the Watergate break in and so on and on it goes.
[01:37:40]  But this is basically the nature of what we're looking at in this country.
[01:37:45]  And at this point, you know, you get that impression with 2020 that it's either going to go one way or another.
[01:37:52]  Either that totalitarian arm has kicked in and they're really going to make their move, or they've overreached to such a degree that we're in a position to take.
[01:38:02]  All of this information and to take all that background from Kennedy's assassination forward.
[01:38:08]  And, you know, really, that's one thing that Trump had an opportunity to do and didn't, which was to release the JFK assassination records when they were mandated to be released October 26, 2017.
[01:38:20]  The fact that he didn't do it, I think, is something that he probably regrets.
[01:38:27]  And he has the ability to do it since the CIA are no friends of the Trump administration at this point.
[01:38:34]  I would do it.
[01:38:35]  The thing is, it's the law, and whether it suits his advantage or not, that type of information coming out to the public and giving those researchers the ability to sift through those files that the CIA have locked up.
[01:38:50]  And like I said, I don't think that's any, you know, it's not as if there's going to be something in those records that's going to say, hey, the CIA shot President Kennedy.
[01:38:59]  We know, you know, that the evidence has been gathered.
[01:39:02]  It's just that inside those records are personnel moves, it is the mapping out of these things.
[01:39:09]  And those records, in fact, belong to the public.
[01:39:12]  So I think this is how we need to look at these things.
[01:39:16]  And people could look at this historical incident and say, well, we've gone on 56 years, things have changed, whatever it happens to be.
[01:39:24]  Apparently, as much as things change, they stay the same.
[01:39:28]  And we're looking at a situation in America where the deep state is more powerful than ever.
[01:39:34]  I mean, they've had their ups and downs.
[01:39:39]  I think exposing that hidden history is really something that can change people's lives and the destiny of nations.

=== Historical Patterns Remain Constant (02:24) ===

[01:39:47]  So, we're very happy to be able to do that with you here.
[01:39:51]  It's great to see so many people out there.
[01:39:54]  And Dennis O'Neill, it's great to see you.
[01:39:58]  Esoteric369, of course.
[01:40:00]  Carly from Dimensions and Beyond.
[01:40:01]  I guess some of our friends in the UK and in Europe got the ability to see us because we're usually on pretty late for them since it's, I think in the UK, it's five hours, isn't it?
[01:40:12]  I think so.
[01:40:13]  Amazing.
[01:40:14]  So, yeah, you guys, hey, it's only 10 o'clock at night for you guys.
[01:40:17]  Not bad.
[01:40:19]  And it's great to have our European viewers with us.
[01:40:22]  We will see you on Friday.
[01:40:24]  And Najat, it's great to see you out there.
[01:40:26]  Doyle Wayne.
[01:40:29]  And let's see, here's a couple Bethany Green, Bill Randall, Danielle Jorgensen, a cult fan.
[01:40:37]  There he is, the man, the myth.
[01:40:38]  Kate, it's great to see you.
[01:40:40]  Griffin Eagle, Truth Floa.
[01:40:44]  Fantastic.
[01:40:44]  Flower.
[01:40:45]  Oh, flower.
[01:40:47]  I thought it was Floa.
[01:40:48]  I think it's flower.
[01:40:51]  But then again, I'm from Boston.
[01:40:54]  Yes.
[01:40:54]  So I have some super chatters to thank.
[01:40:55]  Yes, please.
[01:40:56]  Okay, Eurythmia is fun.
[01:40:57]  Danielle Jorgensen and Gummy Bears, Tony O'Face, Bill Go Metz, Michael Collier, Matt M, Lisa Frequency, Carol Crumlish, GDNPB, Hot Sauce, Irie A, a cult fan, Carol Utley, Le Chat, John Brisson, Bo, Joseph Fabry, Able Bodied, and MyFlesh10.
[01:41:22]  Fantastic.
[01:41:23]  Thank you for your support.
[01:41:24]  We're very happy to be here with you today.
[01:41:27]  And I want to also thank Carolyn Goida for helping us with the show today.
[01:41:34]  Much appreciated and great information.
[01:41:39]  With her, we will see you all Friday for X Series 89 at 8 o'clock Friday night.
[01:41:47]  Probably more like 8 30.
[01:41:49]  Could help.
[01:41:52]  And I also saw Grandma Tippy Toes out there.
[01:41:54]  It's great to see you, Lee Beltman.
[01:41:56]  Thank you very much.
[01:41:57]  And have a great afternoon, everyone.
[01:42:00]  We will see you Friday.
[01:42:02]  Okay.
[01:42:02]  Thanks, everybody.
[01:42:03]  Thank you, Roger Stone.
[01:42:05]  And of course, Roger Stone's website, stonedefensefund.com.

=== Citizens Push Back Against Overreach (06:40) ===

[01:42:11]  You know, it's interesting because he has been somebody who's been caught in the crosshairs, and he comes from that hard tumble political world.
[01:42:19]  There's no question about it.
[01:42:21]  But I think the attempt to put him in prison for seven years.
[01:42:26]  I don't care how tough you are, that's scary.
[01:42:28]  No question about it.
[01:42:30]  And it's an incredible overreach just to try to punish Trump for.
[01:42:34]  You know, not being indicted for this phony Russian collusion charge.
[01:42:40]  And again, even if that had happened, you know, to Obama, I mean, he was the one who orchestrated it in this case.
[01:42:46]  But whether it's a Democrat, a Republican, a Libertarian, whatever, Americans should never put up with the intelligence agencies trying to call the shots and tell us, you know, who we should have in office and who should be running the show.
[01:42:58]  They've been calling the shots since 1963.
[01:43:00]  There's no question about it.
[01:43:01]  Things really did go well in Dean Plaza, as the CIA instructor was heard to say.
[01:43:08]  But we will see you all and have a great week.
[01:43:10]  We're watching all the developments with the protests around the country and around the world.
[01:43:14]  Incredible Berlin protest on this coronavirus lockdown.
[01:43:21]  And the lockdowns being so absurd, all I can do is encourage you go out, protest, use your rights as Americans, as world citizens.
[01:43:30]  Go out there and protest this because they have egregiously overreached.
[01:43:34]  And for whatever, however, you want to debate, The health side's up and down.
[01:43:39]  The lockdowns are the most unhealthy thing I can imagine for anyone.
[01:43:44]  And, you know, you try to pull that stuff for long enough with people and they start to see through you.
[01:43:51]  So I think that that's what we're starting to see beginning to happen.
[01:43:54]  And there ain't no way to spin that.
[01:43:57]  Yes.
[01:43:58]  Well, we're just beginning to rethink our government.
[01:44:01]  So that's what they've done.
[01:44:03]  That's true.
[01:44:04]  Yeah.
[01:44:04]  That's really true.
[01:44:06]  And they run the risk with the overreach of people.
[01:44:09]  You know, those people that normally go along with these routines and who sit there half asleep to the mainstream media and believe that there is a point where, you know, there's a turning point and it's a critical mass level where the overreach just becomes too egregious.
[01:44:25]  You know, you start seeing cops jumping on mothers and taking their kids and throwing them in the backseat and like throwing their dogs.
[01:44:32]  Yeah, I mean, it's too much.
[01:44:35]  And yeah, that baby carriage one was so disturbing.
[01:44:37]  But those are astonishing.
[01:44:38]  Separating mothers from their children when they're and the babies are crying and Scream.
[01:44:43]  It's traumatizing these children.
[01:44:46]  Yeah.
[01:44:46]  Well, and I've seen it, and with the couples too, they're just, you know, the approach on these people.
[01:44:51]  What kind of orders are those?
[01:44:53]  I can imagine if they have to walk up to somebody and say, follow this protocol or whatever, but to walk up to somebody and then jump on them and then sit on their neck, I mean, that looks like North Korea.
[01:45:05]  And there's no response for any health emergency, real or exaggerated.
[01:45:14]  That justifies that.
[01:45:15]  It does not.
[01:45:16]  It's not justified.
[01:45:17]  And we're going to see more and more Americans pushing back on that.
[01:45:21]  Protest here on uh two o'clock at the governor's house, and that's where it should go.
[01:45:27]  You know, it's one thing for these guys to send out their minions and be like, Hey, you know, deal with these cops or whatever, but the cops are just front men for bad policy.
[01:45:36]  So let's put the um, you know, I mean, they're bad actors in this case, the ones that we've seen who are really doing that kind of bullying, but it's the people behind them who are giving them license to do that that have to be called out.
[01:45:51]  And um, you know, we've seen it with in Michigan with Gretchen Whitmer, uh, certainly.
[01:45:57]  In the kind of insane Gavin Newsom, you know, him calling for martial law at a press conference.
[01:46:03]  I mean, it starts to feel like a Twilight Zone.
[01:46:05]  Well, I mean, I actually think that this is what we should be discussing on Friday our threat to our civil liberties.
[01:46:14]  No question.
[01:46:14]  And the incredible beast.
[01:46:16]  Oh, yeah.
[01:46:16]  Yeah.
[01:46:17]  No, we're, everything is getting kind of incorporated here.
[01:46:20]  And that's just the nature of the beast.
[01:46:23]  But it is something that we're all going through together.
[01:46:26]  And I think you're going to see more and more pushback, you know.
[01:46:29]  Because you can't do that to citizens everywhere.
[01:46:31]  Because at the end of the day, you know, they work for us and we get to tell them what we're going to do.
[01:46:38]  So, what do we decide to do?
[01:46:40]  You know, where's the digital democracy on this?
[01:46:43]  And if you're going to say that, well, you know, you have to take a mandated vaccine in order to have a job, then the citizens are going to push back and say, no way.
[01:46:52]  You know, so those states and those governors where they're going to be saying that are those countries, that's where you're going to see the pushback.
[01:46:59]  And, you know, I think that this is the crucial turning point that we're going to see this summer.
[01:47:06]  The good thing, the thing that I think should be encouraging for everyone is that the spirit of the protests is good because people want their lives back and they do not want to be controlled.
[01:47:20]  And for those, you know, for that group that wants to be controlled, you know, have a ball, but you're not going to enforce that on the rest of the citizens.
[01:47:27]  You know, it's interesting.
[01:47:28]  In therapy, they always say, in a relationship, like a romantic relationship, you get what you settle for.
[01:47:34]  This is a big line.
[01:47:35]  But it's true in any relationship, in government.
[01:47:39]  And are we going to settle for this?
[01:47:41]  And we have to ask ourselves if that's not acceptable to settle for this, what are we willing to do to sacrifice?
[01:47:49]  I think, yeah.
[01:47:50]  And it's interesting with this, too, because I believe that people have given it the great benefit of the doubt.
[01:47:56]  But they see the overreach.
[01:47:57]  Even people who are in favor of this kind of thing, they're watching the overreach and being like, ooh.
[01:48:02]  So I think it is turning into.
[01:48:05]  You know, kind of the Frankenstein monster.
[01:48:07]  And that might be by design.
[01:48:09]  But, you know, if I were just to take a pulse on the situation, it seems to me that it's teetering.
[01:48:17]  And that has to be good.
[01:48:20]  And so as we see things open up more and more and those crazy governors, you know, look like lockdown Nazis, then I think we start to see things moving in the right direction.
[01:48:31]  But I'll tell you, it's a long process.
[01:48:32]  And you mix that in with an election year, like we were talking about with Roger.
[01:48:38]  You know, you really have to look at that and say, this is going to be one for the record books because how are you going to keep people away from a voting booth?
[01:48:47]  This is going to be, you know, they haven't tried to do that since the thing was founded.

=== Pardons and Political Teetering (02:07) ===

[01:48:52]  So, when is Gigi coming back on?
[01:48:55]  We are going to have Gigi on this month.
[01:48:58]  And it's going to, we're working on the episode.
[01:49:00]  And she is, she's coming back.
[01:49:02]  It's been great.
[01:49:04]  Yes, we have a great guest lineup for the rest of May as well.
[01:49:09]  And so, thank you all for joining us.
[01:49:11]  Thank you, Roger Stone, Trump advisor and confidant for many years.
[01:49:17]  Along with Nixon and Reagan, the guy has incredible background, and we wish him the best of luck with getting a new trial or just a pardon, which is even better.
[01:49:27]  Let's cut to the chase.
[01:49:28]  Yeah, I mean, they already turned him down for a new trial.
[01:49:30]  So I would say, look, if Trump can, who did he pardon?
[01:49:35]  Rob Blagojevich, who was the governor who took a try to sell Obama's Senate seat there in Illinois, which is just SOP, probably.
[01:49:45]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:49:47]  But he served his time.
[01:49:49]  So, in this case, considering, you know, this is an interesting thing with Trump.
[01:49:53]  The way he got in really was people like Stone, certainly Assange with WikiLeaks, dishing out those emails every week showing the malfeasance and the corruption at the DNC and Hillary Clinton's campaign.
[01:50:07]  That's what got Trump the presidency.
[01:50:10]  And so, you can't leave those people just hanging out.
[01:50:13]  And I think that they should pardon, you know, immediately.
[01:50:18]  Assange should be pardoned and should not be extradited to the United States.
[01:50:21]  He's already been in prison long enough for the crime of publishing news.
[01:50:26]  I mean, that's what these guys do.
[01:50:29]  So, you know, we have to really take a look at that and say, what kind of country do we want?
[01:50:35]  So we will see you all on Friday at 8 p.m.
[01:50:37]  And Miss Olivia, you get the last word.
[01:50:39]  I'm really beginning to understand the French Revolution.
[01:50:42]  I never thought I'd get there, but I'm getting there.
[01:50:46]  Let's meet cake.
[01:50:48]  Wait, no, that's a German accent.
[01:50:50]  You have to do a French accent.
[01:50:53]  All right, everyone, we will see you Friday.
[01:50:55]  Thanks, everybody.
[01:50:56]  And it says end broadcast, but you know, never really ends.