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Oct. 2, 2023 - The David Knight Show

02:51:29

The David Knight Show - 10/02/2023 - Rebroadcast

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	Where there's Kevin the Elephant.
	He comes across this vulture named Culture.
	And Culture tries to convince Kevin that he's a bird because Kevin loves to sing.
	And Kevin...
	Kevin eventually, culture gives him a beak and some wings, and Kevin tries to become a bird for a while, has a really hard go of it.
	He tries to fly and it doesn't go so well.
	But eventually, Kevin saves the day whenever he sort of embraces his inner elephant-ness and puts out a fire and sort of saves the town.
	And then he realizes, you know, he's perfect the way that he was made.
	And so that's a popular book.
	Little Lives Matter is on the Sanctity of Life.
	It's where you've got the island of free ice cream that covers sort of the dangers of communism.
	And yeah, so every book teaches really a traditional value, a pro-God, pro-American value.
	Some are political.
	We've covered the freedom of speech, Second Amendment.
	But a lot of them are really just wholesome traditional values that build their character.
	So our...
	I think we have to be deliberate about it.
	And that's the key thing. You know, we've been very passive about, you know, even creating any entertainment or creating any kind of books like you're talking about.
	We've let other people do it.
	And that's how we have gotten in the situation that we're in right now.
	These other people create this entertainment.
	And it was fine when I was growing up, like I said earlier in the program.
	You had Disney creating stuff like Johnny Tremaine and Davy Crockett and things like that, and embodying the kinds of traditional values that are going to be good for kids, good for families, good for cultures and societies.
	But now it's become very destructive, and we've just kind of taken a backseat and passively watched what other people are producing because in many cases, you know, the movies, they've gotten so technically proficient That it's turned into eye candy.
	So we just kind of passively sat there.
	But I think what you're doing is very important.
	You've got to deliberately portray these values for the kids.
	Yeah. Yeah.
	Our prayer is that we just think there needs to be a brand that parents can trust with their children's imaginations to not only...
	Enthrall them, but build their character while doing so.
	And so our strategy is, you know, kids love a world.
	They love the idea of world building and they love seeing storylines progress and characters progress.
	So that's what we did.
	We built this world, Freedom Island.
	We built the cast of characters, Team Brave, the good guys, villains like Culture of the Vulture, Blackheart, all these really fun characters.
	And then just have some really great stories.
	And so our first priority, whenever we're making any book, And this will be the case whenever the anime and television shows come and all that.
	We want it to be just top-notch entertainment because we want to grab...
	We want it to be gripping for the kids, for them to absolutely fall in love with it.
	But then, while they're being entertained, we...
	We communicate these lessons that build their character as opposed to leave them confused and demoralized, which is basically the status quo out there right now.
	That's right. Yeah, it is a very powerful thing to be able to do that in entertainment.
	And people are kind of disarmed with that, and so they're open to both good and bad as it's being portrayed in that.
	You know, I think about if you tell somebody something in the form of a documentary or something, that can be powerful and can be more powerful than if you write, you know, from my perspective, if I were to write an op-ed piece or something.
	If I were to do some kind of a mini-documentary, To make it visual for people, that gets it across to more people.
	If you do something that is a work of fiction, like a drama, that becomes even more powerful for people.
	And so I think that's an important progression.
	It sounds like you're going to be going in that direction as well.
	But we need to understand that kids are like sponges, and they pick this stuff up.
	And of course, Disney understands that.
	That is the The key issue, and they don't even really care whether they're going to make money.
	I mean, they've lost a billion dollars on these last eight movies, but they continue to go down this path because they're on a mission.
	But you're on a mission in a different way, aren't you?
	Tell us a little bit about that transition as you were an ophthalmologist and you decided that you wanted to do something positive.
	Yeah, so I was happily practicing ophthalmologist, and I was saved in early 2019, and then, so that changed my life completely.
	Right after I was saved, I met the woman who's now my wife, and we got married very quickly after that, and then a year later, we had our first daughter, and she The summer of 2020.
	And so when she was born, it's sort of like whenever you get a new car, you start to notice that car everywhere on the road because it's increased in your level of awareness.
	I had no idea that there was this war for our kids' hearts and minds.
	It's just something I never paid attention to.
	But after she was born, I started to see this war everywhere.
	You walk into Barnes& Noble, the first thing you see is the genderqueer stuff targeted for kids.
	You see it Netflix and Nickelodeon.
	Anyway, I was seeing it everywhere and it just...
	It stuck with me.
	For whatever reason, I couldn't get it out of my head as far as like...
	I thought it was just so wrong.
	And... And slowly, you know, enough sort of sleepless nights thinking about it, this idea for Brave Books and Freedom Island started to crystallize in my mind.
	And then the draw of how fun that would be to go on this journey started to outweigh the risk.
	It was a big risk, you know, with a newly married baby.
	And you've got a lot of time and money and training involved in being an ophthalmologist.
	That's very serious. And, you know, of course, that's a full MD. That's not an optician.
	That's a full MD. And, you know, so that's...
	Medical school plus a specialty and all the rest of the stuff, and you're just going to leave that because of the way God's changed your life.
	That's really amazing. That really is.
	He's working very fast in your life.
	You may wind up being the biggest tree on the island.
	I certainly hope that that is going to be the case with Brave Books and entertainment for kids.
	Well, yeah. The Lord's definitely done a lot in my life, for sure.
	But He's also done a lot for Brave Books.
	I didn't know what I was doing when we started Brave Books.
	I didn't know how to make a good story.
	I didn't know anything.
	I didn't know how to make an e-com store.
	Because... Yeah, we wanted to do the subscription, which means we couldn't sell books through Amazon.
	We had to do it through our own store and fulfill our own books.
	So there's a lot of stuff that I didn't know how to do, but the Lord just, every single step along the way, found the perfect person to bring into the team, and it's been incredible.
	How'd you get connected with Kirk Cameron?
	Um... We wanted to do a book very bad with Kirk Hammer because we just think he stands for everything our brand believes in.
	He's Christian first, but he's not afraid to talk about what he thinks politically.
	To us, it was a perfect fit and just sent enough emails to enough people and finally got a hold of his...
	I guess his manager, his assistant, and then connected us and gave Kirk the vision.
	And we were really small back then whenever we first had talked to Kirk.
	But he believed in what we were doing and took a chance on us.
	And it's been a great partnership.
	Yeah, that's great. It really has worked out well.
	And you've gotten a lot of press and deservedly so.
	And... I think when you look at this and you see this as rapidly as it is advancing, as you point out, you go into the Barnes& Noble or whatever, and you see all these books trying to groom the kids.
	I think it's probably the best way to approach this, but it is really a spiritual war, a mental war, taking every thought captive, and that's really where you are right now.
	You're really at the front line of this with the kids.
	I know how when I was a kid, it was such a big deal for me.
	It's very exciting when they would have the bookmobile come by to the store and we would have the book of the month club.
	And I think it's great that you're setting this up as like a monthly thing.
	It really gives the kids something to look forward to.
	And of course, you've got the bigger pictures.
	You point out these things are all being put together to create a larger world for these kids.
	What is the age group that you're really targeting this for?
	Sounds like they're kind of early elementary school.
	Yeah, yeah. I mean, right now we're doing picture books, so that's in that four to nine range.
	You know, it's probably ideal. Our vision is for the next 50 to 100 years when Christian conservative parents or grandparents, when their kids or grandkids hit three years old, three to four, they start their subscription and they get a picture book every single month for the next four plus years.
	It'll be 50 books, four years and two months.
	Mm-hmm. And kids love getting stuff in the mail, especially on a monthly basis.
	Anyway, they love it.
	But, you know, they're going to outgrow the picture books, you know, when they hit about eight, nine.
	And so the subscription will change to two chapter books a month.
	But they keep growing in this world that we've built with the characters.
	And the topics sort of age with the kids, you know.
	So once you get into the chapter books, you may start to hit some of those heavier topics, you know, that aren't really appropriate for kids or...
	Anyway, yeah.
	And by the time that they're done with picture books, chapter books, potentially some middle-grade young adult novels, and then live action, animated television, they'll have grown up in this world where every single thing that we put out builds them up, lets them know a little bit more about how the world works, about...
	You know, about good morality, good character, and yeah, we're...
	That's really something that's very needed.
	I know my son, who's producing my show here, we got started with him with some books that were for older kids and written back in the Victorian England time.
	G.A. Hinty was the author.
	And he would do these historical books, and my son loved history.
	And each one of them would kind of follow a pattern.
	You'd have some young man who was a central character protagonist, and he would be in some kind of historical situation.
	It could be a lot of them were battles that we didn't know anything about that people in Victorian England would have known about.
	But then there were other things that were pretty well known.
	One of them was about the battle of the Romans versus the Jews in terms of destroying the It's called For the Temple. And so that got him, I started out reading that stuff to him, and he learned to read, reading those, and then went through all of them himself.
	And that's the key thing.
	It's like an adventure. And one of the things that I really liked about those books, which I think you're doing in yours as well, is the characters, the character of the characters.
	And even the bad guys, even the villains had a better character than you usually see in heroes today in the books, right?
	We got to the point where Disney just wants to do villain stories now, right?
	Because that's a lot more interesting to them.
	And they like to put a dark angle on the protagonist, but it was very different going back into Victorian England.
	They had even the guys who were, again, they have initiated a war with somebody and they're attacking them, but they had a code of honor that you would see in the book.
	And that's the type of stuff...
	That I grew up with, the type of stuff that I try to get my kids to grow up with, and I think that's something that is really needed.
	You have to model those things for the kids.
	They have to be shown how that works.
	You can't just tell them that's not powerful enough.
	They have to see it acted out in a work of fiction or something like that in order to be able to really grab those values.
	That's what I think is really important about what you're doing.
	They need to see it in art, and they need to see it at home.
	I can write as many good books that build their character as possible, but if they're not seeing good morality, good relationships between moms and dads at home,
	then Then these books probably won't have a strong effect as if it was otherwise.
	So, you know, I'm a big believer that change doesn't start in the White House.
	It starts in our house. And, you know, as parents, we need to always be thinking, you know, How are my children going to take, you know, what I just said to my wife or how I treated them and just always try to be modeling great behavior?
	It's a challenge. I fall short a lot.
	That's right. Yeah, that is the challenge, and it's part of the growth for us as adults, I think, to have kids that are looking at us and looking up to us.
	That makes a change in the way that we interact, the way we see ourselves as well, and we want to do the best to model that for them.
	Now, Freedom Island Book Club, the monthly subscription thing, is that there now?
	Yeah. I know it's going to be growing, but it's already there now at this point, right?
	Yeah, you know, my creative team has a tough job.
	They have to write a new book every single month to make sure our subscribers get their book every month.
	Yeah, but no, it's there.
	You can go to bravebooks.com, and if you sign up today, you get Kirk Cameron's latest book, Pride Comes Before the Fall, for free.
	Tell us a little bit about that, because this is Pride Month.
	Yeah, yeah. Pride comes before the fall.
	Comes in June, right? What is that book about?
	It's actually not about the LGBT movement.
	It really is just talking about the dangers of pride.
	One of our characters gets a little prideful about his athletic ability and ends up Ends up sort of making a fool of himself, lashing out in anger, and ends up learning the lesson that it's much better to be humble and put others first as opposed to puff yourself up and be self-focused.
	Yeah, it's a great book.
	Kirk really did a great job with that book.
	I think really nailed the lesson for our kids.
	Yeah. Yeah, it surprises me.
	You know, I understand that it's good to have accomplishments and you can take...
	As we say, pride in the accomplishment, but the sin of pride, when you start thinking about yourself and elevating yourself, that's something God has always condemned and punished severely.
	And so it always kind of surprised me to see them having a month of pride, you know, and pride in what?
	Pride in what God condemns, which I thought was always kind of a strange thing.
	But you've got other authors besides Kurt Cameron.
	Tell us a little bit about some of the other authors that we might know.
	Yeah, Missy Robertson of Duck Dynasty.
	She wrote a book on the importance of family, did a book with Bethany Hamilton on overcoming fear.
	So she's the woman whose arm got bit off by a shark and ended up continuing to hurt her.
	The surfer? Yes.
	And she ended up winning the national championship a few years later.
	So her story is incredible.
	But yeah, at this point we've done 24 books, so over 20 authors, some really great people.
	Those are the ones that stick out top of mind.
	You've got Dinesh D'Souza and I guess his wife.
	What did they write a book about?
	They wrote a book about socialism and the importance of the free market.
	Cool. Yeah, that was a great book as well.
	And you've got the lady who does Libs of TikTok.
	What was her book about?
	Yeah. So that was a book.
	It was called No More Secrets, The Candy Cavern, and it was sort of a take on Little Red Riding Hood and the Big Bad Wolf, where this wolf in sheep's clothing...
	Tries to get all the kids to eat candy all semester and fattens them up.
	And he tells them, don't tell your parents, don't tell your parents.
	And then he tries to eat them, eat them all.
	But she ends up telling her parents and parents save the day.
	So, yeah, it's sort of like an anti-grooming, you know, just it teaches kids the lessons of Not keep a secret from your parents.
	And if anybody tells you to keep a secret from your parents, you definitely need to tell your parents.
	Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah.
	That's absolutely true. John Solomon.
	You got a book by John Solomon, who's an investigative journalist.
	What did he write about? Yeah, he wrote a book called Hidden Headlines that's on the importance or, yeah, the harmful effects of censorship and the importance of free speech.
	And it's a fun little mystery style book.
	Oh, that's interesting. Yeah, it sounds like you've got a real wide variety of things.
	I like the idea that you've got a monthly Book of the Month Club.
	And then, of course, this whole thing going on back and forth with the American Library Association.
	I think one of the things that people need to understand about that is that it gets federal funding, doesn't it?
	Tell us a little bit about that and its connection to the federal government and the amount of money that it gets.
	I mean, it gets quite a bit of money, doesn't it?
	Yeah, it gets over $200 million a year.
	Wow. Really, I mean, they don't do that much.
	It's not like that money goes to all the libraries.
	The libraries get their own funding.
	It's just a bunch of bureaucrats and ideologues at this point.
	It's another institution that's been captured.
	And yeah, they do not like brave books.
	Yeah. We've given them a lot of headaches.
	I guess it's understandable, but it's really not because they have a duty to help the libraries be a resource for all American citizens.
	For whatever reason, a lot of our government institutions have just viewed Christians as the enemy.
	Anybody who doesn't go along with This woke progressive agenda as enemies that need to be silenced.
	And it's really unfortunate.
	But we felt that we didn't want to sit back and just take it.
	You know, we wanted to bring awareness to another institution that's been captured.
	And then we've got some things up our sleeve that we hope can change the ALA for the better.
	And, you know, there really isn't even a reason for the ALA. It's another one of these examples of creating this overarching bureaucracy, massively funding it so that it can influence the people who are actually doing the real work at the local level.
	You know, de Tocqueville talked about democracy in America.
	He said, you know, if the people need a library or something, just come together.
	They need a volunteer fire department.
	You know, if they need a fire department, they all volunteer and they create one or they create a library, that type of thing.
	That's the way it used to always be, but now by the unlimited amounts of money that the federal government has, it can take over these institutions from the top down, and that's just another example of this type of corruption.
	But it's something that is very much a communist tactic, this march through the institutions, and it's very much tied into people like Pete Buttigieg, that his father, who has studied the life of Antonio Gramsci, the Italian Marxist, came up with that strategy.
	He said, this is the way we're going to win in modern society.
	We're going to take over all the institutions.
	And that's what we see happening.
	And it's typically done with massive amounts of federal funding, either taking over, creating new institutions that can then bribe people.
	I think that's a big part of the problem, even with the Department of Education, but certainly with the American Library Association.
	I think most people did not have that on their radar to understand what was really happening and how much they can control if they control what people see, read, and think.
	That's the key thing about all these totalitarian agendas, isn't it?
	Yeah, I think that's a great point.
	And I think that we do have to fight the corruption of our institutions, but I also think that we need to build our own institutions.
	That's right. And that's what I'm not seeing enough of From the Christians and the conservatives.
	Just not enough creativity, boldness, and gusto to go build new things.
	There's so many things that we could be building right now.
	We could build our own schools, our own school systems.
	There's such a need for that.
	Yeah. We're good to go.
	Why is it that Christians don't want to create this type of stuff anymore?
	And talking about those types of institutions, but also entertainment.
	We're now starting to see that happen.
	We're having some really top-notch Christian films that are coming out.
	The one about George Foreman, we just saw that recently.
	That was an excellent film.
	And so, you know, there's some good films that are being made out there, finally, and people are stepping up to the plate.
	That's what you're doing with Brave Books.
	It's very important to have that because you've got to have that model of what this should look like.
	You know, you can't just sit on the sidelines and say, no, that's not right.
	You've got to show people what the right way is, I think.
	Yeah, exactly. You can't just have something that you're running from.
	You have to have something that you're running to.
	And yeah, our forefathers, they built all sorts of institutions.
	Whether it was Christian churches building all sorts of philanthropic endeavors like hospitals.
	Yeah, that was a Christian thing.
	And now... There's too much of just sitting on the sidelines and complaining and not enough, getting our hands dirty, rolling up our sleeves and building stuff.
	And the world needs it.
	Yes, absolutely. Well, I certainly take off my hat to you.
	You have... Put your life on the line and you're building something that I think is going to have a lot of positive influence for kids and getting them at an early age.
	Everybody understands. At least we should understand because the other side understands how important it is to get kids at an early age and to instill their values.
	And so parents need to be instilling their values, instilling their faith and their values.
	their societal values in the kids.
	And I think that's a great tool, what you've set up there with brave books.
	Again, it's brave books.com.
	And you've got information there about the August 5th event, I guess, then people can keep an eye out for that to see what's going to be, what your next move is going to be as the American library association is trying to shut down books.
	Right.
	Right.
	We've got, we've got information on our site, brave books.com to help people host their own story hours, And so a lot of resources that you can use at bravebooks.com.
	And yeah, but if you're not going to host your own story hour, a great way to support that, what we're doing to fight for our libraries is to go and subscribe to our Freedom Island Book Club.
	Yes, yes. Looks like a great program.
	And again, you know, think about that if you're a grandparent.
	Get it for your grandkids. You know, always can chip in on that.
	Trent, it's great talking to you.
	I really love what you're doing.
	There are brave books, and you're right.
	More people need to step up and take the initiative.
	We had a wonderful country here at one point in time because we had the founders who did step up and they put their life on the line and their fortune on the line, and that's what you've done.
	And you're founding something that I think is going to be very important.
	Thank you so much for joining us.
	Thanks for having me, David. The Common Man.
	They created Common Core to dumb down our children.
	They created Common Past to track and control us.
	Their Commons Project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
	Please share the information and links you'll find at TheDavidKnightShow.com.
	Thank you for listening.
	Thank you for sharing. If you can't support us financially, please keep us in your prayers.
	TheDavidKnightShow.com We're talking with the author of a book named The Pledge
	to America, One Man's Journey from Political Prisoner to U.S. Navy Seal.
	His name is Drago Juran, if I'm saying that correctly.
	Am I saying that right, Drago?
	Does that get the last name right?
	Yes. Thank you, Travis. And he has had an amazing life, and it is an amazing book.
	And when I saw this, I thought, it's kind of like a Navy SEAL version of Pastor Artur Pulaski.
	People who've grown up in communism have a love for liberty that, unfortunately, most of us who have grown up in America just don't appreciate enough.
	And he's had a lot of experience as a Navy SEAL. He was a member of SEAL Team 2, SEAL Team 4, and then was a BUDS instructor at the Navy Special Warfare Center in Coronado, California.
	So he's got a lot of experience.
	But I want to begin, Drago, with your beginning in communist Poland.
	Tell us a little bit about that.
	You were a child there. What was it like growing up in that country?
	Well, like you mentioned before, I was born, I grew up in a communist country.
	And, well, let me clear it.
	We call it communist countries.
	Every country behind the iron curtain in Eastern Europe was branded a communist country.
	Well, none of these countries were actually technically communist.
	They were all communist.
	They were all socialist states run by communists and other perverts.
	So, this is something that people here in the United States do not understand well.
	Talk a little bit about that distinction between socialism and communism.
	Well, in socialism, you actually can own property, although all infrastructure, the major economical infrastructure is owned by government.
	And because they let you have a little small business on the side, doesn't mean that they don't control it either.
	And like I mentioned in my book, when they destroy business of my uncle who did not go along the party line, along the communist ideology, So they went to destroy his machines, they destroyed his business, and there is nothing he could do about it.
	In a communist country, you don't own any property.
	There's other differences, but this is the major one that I think would be the easiest to explain.
	It is kind of interesting because, you know, both the Nazis and Stalin called themselves socialists.
	And Hitler criticized Stalin for saying, hey, he took over the property and he's going to try to run these things.
	I'm going to let these people run it.
	I'll control them. I'll let them run it.
	At the very end, I'll take it from them.
	Yes, it happened.
	It happened under Stalin, it happened under Adolf Hitler, it happened in Poland under communists like my father and other socialist states.
	So they basically control the narrative and they let you have some business but as long as you are going along with them.
	If you do not, then you do not have the business, you end up in prison very likely.
	So what ages were you when you were in Poland, and how did you get out of Poland?
	Well, by the time I was 21, in Poland, communists imposed martial law, and they jailed around 25,000.
	There are different estimates, from 25,000 to 60,000 Polish citizens in one night.
	They were hunting them on the streets.
	The government was hunting them.
	In their apartments were places they were living.
	So this is...
	I was already involved in Solidarity Trade Union.
	Initially it was a trade union.
	It became a social movement where almost 10 million polls Out of 36 millions at the time, 32 millions at the time, were members of this trade union or more social movement.
	So communists were losing grip.
	They were losing control of it.
	And they were desperate to keep that control.
	Killing didn't help.
	Terror signs the second war didn't help a lot.
	So eventually they resulted to martial law.
	This is how I got involved directly.
	Because when they jailed these activists, when they imprisoned the entire families of people opposing socialism, we had decided we had to do something.
	At least we can print the real information what is happening in Poland, because everything was heavily censored.
	And scrutinized.
	So people did not have information what is happening in Poland.
	And we eventually, because it was outside of the censorship, outside of the communist narrative and fake news media, we were arrested.
	And I received three years' prison sentence.
	So I was released on amnesty with most of political prisoners after John Paul II came to Poland a second time.
	And then the persecution started.
	I was not the only one. Everybody opposing socialism at the time was being persecuted this way or another way.
	For me it became very dangerous since I was already a convict Let me ask you, how long were you in jail before they...
	Almost two years. Almost two years.
	I think a year and a half.
	Wow. So you did almost the entire sentence that they had given you, and it was for the crime of printing information, having kind of like a...
	Yes, printing bulletins and leaflets, actually.
	Wow. It's interesting, you know, when we look at this, it's interesting, isn't it, to see what has happened over the last couple of years and how the hallmark of an authoritarian government is to try to control information and then to be able to identify people and hunt them down, as you're saying, as they hunted down people and arrested about 25,000 people one night.
	I'm thinking how easy that would be for them today since they have all information on all of us.
	It's much easier for them to get that rather than to have to try to rely on a network of human informants, right?
	They can just do it.
	They can scan everybody based on your viewing habits and what you say on social media and that type of thing, which is really concerning, isn't it?
	You're right. People who control information control minds.
	And this is why there is two things that socialist state will attack and will try to get control of.
	One is the information.
	Two is they will try to destroy family values and moral values.
	Because the nation that is divided is easier to control.
	The censorship and, of course, the big hallmark of totalitarian state is fraudulent election.
	That's what happened in Poland.
	And I know it very well.
	My father was a high-ranking communist in Polish government.
	So I know a little bit from behind how that thing worked.
	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So, you get amnesty, and you've been sentenced and served nearly two years in prison.
	You get put out of jail, but you know that it's not going to end there.
	And this is all happening, what, when was that happening?
	It's a little bit before 1980. 1983, 1984, 1985.
	The martial law was imposed in December 1981.
	And by the time I was released, I was still in effect.
	And being terrorized and my family being terrorized, I decided to leave Poland at the time.
	I went to U.S. Embassy and I asked for help.
	What happened? Your father was in the Communist Party.
	I mean, probably didn't go too well for him, having a son who was opposing the Communist regime.
	What happened to your family there?
	My father was at the time not with us.
	He left us when I was seven years old, so he really didn't have much to do with us.
	So he was immune, especially he denounced everything that happened in Poland as far as the solidarity, trade union movement is concerned, and patriotic Poles who were opposing socialism.
	He was on the opposite side.
	And he really didn't care what happened to me.
	So, yeah, he was not affected by this.
	I see. So, you got out of jail because of the general amnesty, because of the Pope coming there, Pope John Paul.
	And then you realized you got to get out of Dodge.
	So, you go to the U.S. Embassy, and they accepted you, right?
	I guess? Yes. I had all the documents with me, what happened to me in my court case.
	And when I presented to them, my visa, my emigrational visa was processed in an accelerated way.
	And I was out of Poland, I think within three months.
	Usually it takes a year to even get such a permit from Poland and from the U.S. Embassy to enter the United States.
	At least it was at the time. So within three months, I was out.
	Before we talk about what happened in the U.S., tell people a little bit about what life was like in Poland, the poverty or the, you know, I'm sure under the communists it was a lot of poverty, always is.
	You know, what was it like growing up there as a child?
	For me at the time, I didn't know any better.
	I look at it right now and I see how poor we were, but at that time I was happy.
	My father, my mother, who took care of us because I had two siblings, And we didn't understand the poverty until later on when we had a chance to see a little bit how people live in the West.
	And also I had the chance to live in Warsaw with my father for a short time so I could see the information Placed in the U.S. Embassy walls and fans would actually read about it.
	And also I started to listen to Voice of America, Radio Free Europe, and that was eye-opener.
	But also it was very risky because you could go to prison if you listened to these radios in Poland at the time.
	As a matter of fact, I was not even...
	When I started listening to it, I think I was maybe like 13, 14 years old, I could be placed in an orphanage.
	My mother could lose custody of me and my siblings because of that.
	Matter of fact, they were threatened by that.
	It happened that when I was in the fifth grade, When it was imposed that everybody in Poland will learn Russian language.
	Of course, we oppose it.
	And I didn't want to learn Russian language.
	At that time, it was not so much political.
	I just didn't want to learn another language.
	I had enough problem with Polish.
	So I say to the Russian language teacher, why do we learn that?
	We don't need to learn. Besides, Russians are occupiers.
	The Soviet Union is politically occupying Poland.
	And while I didn't realize how dangerous these words were, apparently, so I was immediately pulled out of the class.
	I was brought to a principal's office.
	They call police. Police, first they went to my mother.
	She was a teacher in different schools, so she drove up there.
	They basically kidnapped her.
	They drove her back to my school.
	They sat us down. They tried to explain and threaten her.
	They say, if she does not instill more love for socialism, we will be taken away from her place in the government custody, and then we can learn to be proper...
	Good socialist citizens.
	Of course, my mother was scared.
	She cried. I didn't understand really why this thing is happening.
	But it was my first exposure to secret police, to persecution, and to the method that socialism works.
	And you know what? Please remember, too, my family opposed that socialism because they survived quite a few of those socialists.
	They survived Joseph Stalin's Socialism.
	They survived Adolf Hitler's Socialism and Second World War, National Socialism.
	Then they survived Leonid Brezhnev's Socialism.
	So, in Poland, they called it democratic socialism, with thousands of people like that in prison.
	So, when you're listening to this, and you could get in trouble if you listen to Radio 4 Europe, how did you do it?
	The way we did it is, my mother was scared to death, so she brought a bunch of pillows, as many as she could find in the house, because I told her I'm going to listen to it.
	She padded me out and then I got under the pillows because she was so afraid that one of the neighbors may hear it.
	And in Poland at the time, it's not much different.
	What happened in East Germany and Stasi, secret police, I'm sure you heard about it.
	Oh, yeah. So she was so afraid that one of the neighbors can hear and then also report us to police.
	And that could mean disaster to my mother, to our family.
	We would be separated from her, very likely.
	What was it that caught your attention?
	Was it the Western music?
	What was it? No, what got my attention was my uncle.
	I was mentioning earlier that the communists in socialist state destroyed his business.
	So he decided to open his own business.
	He was making bricks and cedar blocks.
	But the quality of his work was so high that people stopped buying from government factories.
	They were going to him and purchasing the bricks, the cedar blocks from him.
	So somebody complained to the Communist Party.
	And they definitely, the police first visited my uncle, told him to scale down.
	The best even shut down and joined the government factory and helped up there.
	My uncle didn't agree with it.
	He says, no, I'm running my business.
	I cannot scale down because if I do scale down, I won't be able to make it.
	So he continued with it.
	And so the first thing that happened is the gangs of young...
	A man came and destroyed his machines and threatened him.
	So if you continue with it, we're going to kill you.
	So he said he didn't care about it.
	It was just young goons, young socialist goons.
	And he decided that he's going to do it again.
	He's going to rebuild the machine.
	He did. They ruined it again.
	By the way, when he went to police to complain, he was arrested, beaten up, tortured for the nights in the home, all beat up.
	So, he rebuilt it.
	I think it was repeated twice.
	Eventually, he ran out of the resources to rebuild his factory, his machines, and he had to move on.
	But please remember, too, that a very prominent feature of socialism is the villain And the unregulated groups of people fighting these villains.
	So in Soviet Union, villains were kulaks, the wealthy peasants.
	In Adolf Hitler's Socialist Germany, they were Jews.
	And we know how it ended up.
	In Poland at the time, there were also Jewish people, but also intelligentsia and anybody who was wealthier.
	So they create these groups of young people from factories, from schools, and that's supposed to be spontaneous.
	They call themselves anti-fascists and anti-Nazis.
	So my uncle, because he built this business for himself, he was branded fascist and Nazi.
	By these groups.
	They were not formal groups created by the government, but they were secretly guided and supported by socialist government.
	And that was very scary for many citizens in Poland.
	And these young, misguided people are almost a feature in socialist state.
	If you look in 1917, the Bolshevik Revolution, there was the same thing.
	There was not Lenin and Stalin carrying out the atrocities, killing and robbing people.
	There were those young pioneers and young people who were directed or instigated by Communist Party, by Socialists.
	We need to be very careful about it.
	We see the same thing now, you know.
	We see the same thing. They always organize the same way.
	And, you know, youthful idiots, you know, is what I call them.
	They call them useful idiots.
	I call them youthful idiots.
	There's nobody that's more useful than a youthful idiot.
	But, yeah, that is the same.
	They keep using the same patterns over and over again because they work.
	And that's one of the things that's really...
	Well, they work. And also, please remember that socialism will not sustain itself without terror, without censorship, and without fraudulent elections.
	So, to impose socialism, the terror is necessary.
	There is one thing, though, that Joseph Stalin made one big mistake, because he relied on terror only.
	Well, if he had the knowledge that we have today, if he had access to computers and understood social science, he would not only resort to terror, but he would also flood the republic, the states, or the countries he invaded with people who have no loyalty to that country.
	Yes. That way he diluted the patriotism, attack patriotism until there is none.
	So there was very, very...
	Normal for socialist state to attack patriotic polls, to attack patriotism itself, because it was on the way to instill this international socialist communist cabal.
	Of course, another tactic that we see happening heavily now in our country as well.
	Yeah. Well, I hope we will not go that way because it is easy to vote yourself or to fall.
	Actually, it's hard to vote because people don't vote for communism, but you can fall into the traps of socialism and communism, but pretty much you have to shoot your way out of it.
	I was very lucky.
	Because at that time there was no technology like we have today that can control your every step, every move.
	If communists had that type of technology then I think Poland would be still communist, I mean socialist state run by communists.
	But again, I don't think this is the socialism or communism is the goal.
	The socialism and communism is just a tool to control society.
	This is the best way to control society through terror, through different mechanisms and the And then basically the elites, the socialist elites, they can't have a lifestyle.
	As Poland and other socialist countries, people were starving.
	The socialist elites, they never had to.
	They were these oligarchs, what we call them today.
	Yeah, it's always a way of having elitists running an authoritarian regime, and that's the commonality.
	What they use in order to trick us and deceive us into this step-by-step, that can change from time to time, but as you point out, With the technology that they have now, if we do not stop some of the things that are being done, it's going to be very difficult for us, and the world has never seen the kind of oppression that these people are capable of doing to these totalitarians at this point.
	Well, let's pick up with your story now.
	So you listened to Radio Free Europe.
	I started listening to it because you were upset about what was being done to your uncle.
	Yes, to my family.
	Because he was... It happened then quite often that he was just swiped from the street, brought to police station, beat up, held overnight, and just let him go.
	So he was the one who explained it to me about Polish history, about the Radio Free Europe, BBC, Voice of America, where to listen, one can learn about the real Polish history, because...
	The socialists, they destroyed all the monuments they were not going along with, they were not supporting their socialist communist narrative.
	They twisted the history, they censored the history to the point that we, growing up in Poland, did not know A lot about the Poles fighting Second World War on the Allies side.
	We were only, when I was growing up, I only heard about these heroes of Soviet Union, heroes of Polish...
	Satellite army in the Soviet Union, whose input into the Second World War was nil, almost nothing, versus the army that was fighting war on the ally side from Great Britain, We didn't know much about it.
	They were hiding it. And then when people came back, some of these veterans from Second World War came back to Poland, to socialist Poland, they were promptly executed or put in prison, most of them.
	Wow. Until today, there are still unmarked graves of these Polish patriots, these Polish veterans coming back from the Second World War.
	Many graves cannot be found.
	They are still looking for it.
	There are still people missing from the socialist era in Poland.
	So, yeah, this is how I learned about it from Radio BBC, Radio Free Europe, that my uncle, who was tortured by communist state, turned me on to it.
	My mother was petrified, but I think it was the right thing to do.
	I learned a lot about Poland, about what is really happening in Poland.
	That's great. So you're how old when you get to the American Embassy and get approved?
	How old were you when you got to it?
	I was 24 years old.
	Wow. Okay. So then...
	23 years old, basically. No, I was 23 going 24.
	And so you didn't get into the military until that.
	That's kind of a little bit old to get into the military.
	You had quite a career in the military.
	Tell us a little bit about that. How did you get into the military after you get to the United States?
	Well, I came to the United States in 1984.
	And... I had a great life.
	You know, I started as a janitor.
	I was cleaning toilets. I was cleaning classrooms, schools.
	And I learned English.
	Because when I came to America, I didn't speak English.
	I did not have anything but the bag of clothes I came in with.
	So... I started a lot from the janitorial work, but I didn't expect anything better.
	But I believe that when I learn English, when I learn more about America, I can definitely go progress and get different jobs and do something else.
	And I did. But I started as a janitor, then...
	I progressed slowly to work in the parts department of the dealership.
	Then I became a mechanic working for Saab and Mercedes.
	And I was doing great.
	I mean, I love life.
	I started skydiving then.
	And then the first Persian war broke out.
	I became U.S. citizen at the time, so I believe that this is my moral obligation to support my country the best I can.
	I'm American, so I went and joined U.S. military, just because, again, that was my moral obligation to do so.
	So I drop everything, my work, my friends.
	Well, I announced that I'm going to join the Army.
	That was kind of a little bit convoluted because I didn't know how to do it.
	I described it in the book.
	But eventually I ended up in the Navy and ended up in the SEAL teams.
	And I never intended to serve 20 years.
	My intention was to serve America during the war.
	Hmm. And then return to my life, my good life that I had.
	It just happened. I never returned.
	I stayed 20 years.
	Well, that's amazing that you enlist in your mid-20s or something.
	Oh, yeah. I was 32.
	I was 33. That's way too old.
	But you know what? I was doing so well, I guess, in boot camp.
	I graduated as a number one recruit from the entire graduation group.
	Then I did also graduate at the top of my class from A school, the trade school in the Navy.
	So when I asked for my orders to go to CL training, it took maybe a few months, but eventually I ended up in BADS as a student, as a trainee in the CL program.
	So you had no intention of getting in the Navy so that you could become a SEAL. You just got in to do your duty.
	Yeah, no, my intention was not about the SEALs.
	I didn't really know much about the SEALs.
	I didn't hear about them until I met them actually in Memphis, Tennessee.
	So... My intention was just to serve the Navy.
	And serve the American in the Navy.
	And it just happened that I ended up in the SEAL teams.
	And I'm very proud of it.
	Oh, yeah. But, you know, there's one thing I need to stress here.
	That I'm as extremely proud as I am being Navy SEAL. I think that is something much more important for me than being just a Navy SEAL, being an American citizen.
	This is something that is so precious.
	That's something that you don't see me wearing the Trident, the Navy SEAL Trident in my lapel, because I wear an American flag.
	An American flag encompasses the SEAL and everything else that is good about America.
	Good for you. Good for you.
	That's a great message.
	It is amazing.
	Tell us a little bit then. What was that like?
	You're going in and, again, you're quite a bit older than all the rest of these other people.
	- Well, that's such a grueling program to go through.
	A lot of people can't handle the physical aspects of it.
	You must have been in excellent shape in your 30s and you-- - I don't know if I was in excellent shape, but I was definitely determined to succeed.
	But yes, you are right.
	I was like almost four years Five years over the age limit.
	So I had to obtain a waiver from the Navy.
	Wow. And I think what helped me is just my performance until that point within the Navy that such waiver was granted to me.
	So, yes, you're right.
	I was 32 years old, and it was literally kicking my butt physically more than mentally.
	Mentally, it was not really nothing that tough.
	And my attitude was also different.
	I didn't go up there to try.
	Like I used to hear it all the time.
	Well, I'm trying to be the best.
	I'm trying this.
	I'm trying that.
	Well, I didn't go there to try.
	I just went there to become a CEO.
	Yeah, that's great.
	I love the attitude that you have about all of this stuff.
	your career as well as your country.
	Tell us a little bit about, you said you had time as a SEAL, you saw combat.
	Any stories that you want to relay to us about your time in the Navy SEALs and what it was like?
	Well, it was the greatest time in my life and it had a huge impact of my life today.
	So, yes, I joined.
	I was an older person, but once I made the SEAL teams, there was not really much difference.
	I was treated the same way like anybody else.
	You know, there's one more thing, because I see so many divisions in our nation happening right now.
	When I went into the U.S. Navy, when I became U.S. citizen, The first thing I learned is that we all have only one color.
	It's red, white, and blue. There is no other color we should be concerned about.
	All of us are Americans and in the heart we are red, white, and blue.
	We don't see other colors.
	So... And when I came to, of course, my language barrier was not very helpful for me at the time.
	So I had to put extra work in my English as I was mastering my Navy SEAL skills.
	And eventually the second war broke out and I deployed to Iraq at the time.
	And that was actually one of the longest deployments I ever made because As the West Coast SEAL platoons were deploying and were active in the war, the East Coast was preparing itself for the war.
	And me and my SEAL platoon deployed to South America.
	In the middle of my deployment, I was called that, hey, you need to go to Baghdad.
	We're going to send you to interface our guys with police special forces, GROM. And you're going to be spending three months up there.
	So after six months total deployment, because in the Navy we do six months deployments most of the time.
	So after six months you come back, you join your new platoon and start over.
	Well, three months passed, and I was still there.
	Nobody called me, so I kind of enjoyed what I did.
	I believed it was so important.
	So I didn't say anything either.
	So instead of three months, four months, five months, six months, seven months, eight months, eventually my night vision broke out and broke down.
	So I had to call my command.
	It was like, what are you at? I'm Baghdad.
	Okay. How long have I been there?
	Like, almost a year?
	Nine months? A year in deployment?
	Oh, well. Okay, you need to come back.
	They just forgot about you. They just forgot about you.
	So I came back, and I went on to help out another SEAL platoon.
	I went with just for two weeks, but it happened four months later.
	My SEAL team was calling me and saying, hey, you need to come back because we are going back to Iraq.
	So you just come back and go back to Iraq again.
	So I came back.
	Then after a short workup, we went back to Iraq again.
	So it was pretty intense back-to-back deployments.
	You say your night vision broke down.
	You're talking about your device, not your eyes, right?
	Yeah, I'm sorry. My night vision goggles broke down, and I had to call my command.
	I said, hey, I need a new one. Can you send me a new one?
	That's a funny story. That's funny.
	They don't know that you're there. Yeah, yeah.
	Who was there?
	I say, okay, well, you want the night vision.
	Where do you want them? I say, like, Baghdad.
	Oh, okay.
	What do you want else with it?
	Do you want a suicidal bomb vest with it?
	They thought I'm just Iraqi trying to elicit.
	I think this is what he thought.
	There's a new guy in the armory.
	He said, do you want it?
	Yeah. So I had to kind of like straight him up.
	Explain it to him. That's funny.
	Well, you know, the thing is, we listened to your story and the things that you went through.
	And Poland, you know, the experiences that you had with authoritarianism, totalitarianism, the brutal police state, the mass arrests of people and all that type of thing.
	You came to this country, you valued freedom.
	And that used to be the common thing that we would see with people who would come here.
	A lot of people would come here from Europe in the early 20th century, had nothing but the clothes on their back, just like you.
	They came here because they wanted freedom.
	And that's a big difference, you know, and it is, I guess, one of the things that I'm concerned most about as I listen to people who have lived under communism and they talk about the eradication of history, the eradication of monuments, the rewriting of history, the radicalization of youth to the institutions that have been taken over.
	And, of course, that is essentially the plan that they have, you know, taking over these institutions and taking over the minds of kids from a very early age.
	It is very concerning to see that, and I think that's got to be one of the most important aspects of your experience, the experience that you can bring to us, telling us what we can fall into if we're not careful, why America is not this evil presence that is what is being sold to the kids in the institutions today.
	Everything is about demonizing America, and...
	And I think that's a key thing, the love that you have for the country, the commonality, the melting point aspect of this, and it is something that's really been, I think, deliberately set aside.
	I think it's very important for people to see a book like this.
	I'm glad that you did. Tell me the title.
	You talk about your Pledge to America.
	What is your Pledge to America?
	Well, when I came to America, from the first day, I had the help of American people.
	See, America is built on goodness, on personal freedom.
	There are so many good things about American people that when I faced this, when I was embraced by America, I told myself that I will be the best American I can be, the best American citizen I can be.
	I want to be a better American citizen today than I was yesterday, and I will be a better American citizen tomorrow than I am today.
	That's my pledge.
	That's what I believe.
	That's how I live.
	Now in my family.
	But you are right. The attacks on family, on patriotism, is very common.
	This is something new to America and people really do not understand the tactics of communists and socialists.
	So... What they will do, and now we are in the face of desensitizing, normalizing poverty, poor living conditions, normalizing perversion, normalizing debauchery.
	And people do not...
	So what they do is a very slow process.
	And with the help of fake news media, with the help of all kinds of perverted organizations or outright enemies of the United States...
	Slowly what is happening, the older generation that knew freedom, they knew what the freedom was, they knew how good it was, how great America was, they are fading away.
	So basically what communists do, they just wait it out.
	They want to wait out and fade these people away, make them disappear and bring the young, new generations back.
	Already indoctrinated into socialism and socialist way that don't know any better, any different.
	And this is how slowly they subvert America.
	This is the process called desensitization and normalization of poverty and perversion.
	It is kind of interesting, as you pointed out.
	I've heard other people say this, not just, you know, coming from another country, but I've heard people say this about growing up in America.
	You know, we were poor, but we didn't know it, you know.
	And I think people look at, you can not know that you're free.
	You cannot understand the good things that you have until you lose them as well.
	And I think that's kind of what we are in America right now, is that we were free, but we don't recognize it.
	We have good things that were given to us by previous generations, but we don't recognize it.
	And they're doing their best to make sure that we don't know that and to change the narrative of that.
	And I think that's really where we are.
	Especially the new generation don't know it.
	That's what is very important for them.
	This is why there's these attacks and these attempts to hijack our children.
	This is a very dangerous process and it's not well understood in American society.
	That's why we need to be very vigilant because we can lose Freedom, very quickly, if we are not vigilant, the freedom that we have is not passed to our, President Reagan said, is not passed to our children in our blood.
	They need to learn it.
	We need to teach our kids.
	And this is a very important part for the parents, too.
	If school gets perverted, if school basically is trying to hijack our children, Parents need to step in, and parents must be able to educate their kids the way they want it.
	So this is why you can see right now so much stress, so much pressure, especially in democratic states, to kidnap our children away from parents and indoctrinate them in the socialist way.
	Again, I don't think that socialism is a goal in America.
	Socialism is just a vehicle.
	It's a tool to subdue the society, to control the society.
	We must not allow it to happen here.
	America is not socialist state.
	That's right. It's just the argument they use to solve that.
	Please remember, America is not socialist state.
	Not yet, and we must make sure that that doesn't happen.
	That's right.
	And it is a fight for the next generation, and if we can turn the hearts of the fathers towards the children, that'll make all the difference in the world, or if God does it, that'll make the difference in the world.
	And, you know, it is the type of thing they have marched through the institutions, and one of the last institutions, one of the most important institutions, is the schools, and they've now marched through those schools But we still have an opportunity where people can take control of their children's education.
	If they understand what is happening, we still have that freedom to do that, which is still an amazing story.
	I had a listener who contacted me how they fled out of Sweden because they wanted to homeschool their child.
	And it was illegal there, as it is in many European states, to even homeschool your child.
	So we have a choice.
	You know, you can put your child in a private school.
	You can homeschool your kids.
	You don't have to send them to the institution that's been taken captive.
	And that's the key thing.
	We're going to have to fight for this.
	And I think your book, giving people an idea of what it is like to live under communism, your appreciation for freedom and for America, I think that is really key.
	And that may be one of the most important things that you fight for right now.
	You know, we don't want to have to shoot our way out of it, as you said before.
	It's really important to fight this war at the beginning, isn't it?
	Yes, the book was written because...
	When I share my story, I heard most of the time, oh, the communism, socialism is so bad, you know, you need to write the book.
	I don't want to write the book about how bad socialism and communism are.
	Most of the people know it.
	I want to use this book as a prism, as a lens.
	When people read it, they can see how great...
	America is. How unique America is.
	We can love this country.
	We can build it. We can make it better even.
	But we need to love it first.
	What disturbs me is the hate I see towards America from our own citizens.
	You know, I was hunting Terrorists in Middle East.
	And I have to admit that I haven't seen so much hate towards America from these terrorists like I see from some of our citizens here in America.
	This is very disturbing. This is something that we need to address.
	And this is coming from our educational institutions, our schools.
	Especially the higher education was hijacked by Marxists and communism.
	And this is something very disturbing that we need to address and address fairly quickly.
	I agree. And I think it's very important for books like yours to talk about you don't want to focus on the negativity about how bad communism is, but talk about what's right with America.
	And that is a big part of what is missing right now.
	You look at it in the arts.
	You look at it in education.
	It's one of the reasons why Brave Books and Kirk Cameron were doing that.
	They want to show people a positive vision.
	And we see some movies that are now being done by some new movie studios showing people a positive vision.
	Disney, when I was a kid, was showing us positive stories about the American Revolution or about Davy Crockett or whatever.
	We were proud of our history.
	They focused on the freedom aspects and the commonality of man and the opportunities that were a part of America, the beauty that is there.
	And that's what is missing and that's what needs to be recovered.
	I'm glad that that's the focus of your book.
	Because we consciously need to give people a vision of what to aspire to and a vision of what is right with America, what we can fix.
	Certainly we want to know, but we also want to know what is right with America, what is beautiful, and celebrate that type of thing.
	That is something that really is missing.
	I'm glad you're focusing on that in your book.
	We need to unite. We need to unite as Americans, definitely, and do not allow these divisions to happen.
	The enemy of the United States will use these divisions to destroy America the way it is.
	I'm not concerned about a bunch of Chinese guys landing on our beaches or parachuting on our land.
	That's not going to happen. But I'm concerned about America being attacked from within.
	And there is a program, and I think some people are aware of it, but it's not generally known that the best way to dismantle America is from within, to purchase a political party and politicians, and then just guide them through or demand this or that, and eventually the America we know will stop exists and will have a totalitarian state, very dangerous and dangerous.
	Again, this is not here now.
	We just must be vigilant that it doesn't happen.
	You're right. Yeah, the greatest danger is the danger of rot from within and decay from within.
	I mean, look at the White House now.
	Sorry? Look what happened.
	I mean, this family turned the most cherished institution, the most cherished place in the world, into a crack house.
	I mean, how was that?
	That's right. Yeah, and then how is it that they get away with it?
	You know, that's the other part of this.
	Well, how they get away with it, I know because I experienced it in communist Poland.
	My father, who was a communist, he used the same tactics and he used the same influence to protect his assets and his things.
	So that's something that we need to be careful about here.
	That's true. Yeah, even as we look at the judge who came back against the Bidens in terms of censorship and said, you know, no, this is not going to stand.
	You've set up an Orwellian ministry here of censorship, even as that was happening.
	You had people in mainstream media saying, no, we want the government to censor.
	We want the government to control speech.
	That's the danger that we are right now.
	It is really pervasive, and so that's why it's important for people to get your perspective.
	I absolutely agree with what you're saying.
	Where's the best place for people to get your book?
	I'm sure you can find it on Amazon, and you've got a website there.
	Yes, my website is right above my head here.
	That's where you can actually go and find a little bit more information.
	There will be some posts that didn't make into the book that I'm going to go out and expand on it.
	I think it's important. So yeah, you can purchase it on Amazon, in the bookstores like Barnes& Nobles, Books A Million.
	And yeah, it is available now.
	Okay. And let me tell this to people.
	I'll have it in the notes for the show, but pull his website up there again, Travis, so I can read this off to people who are listening to the podcast.
	It's D-R-A-G-O-D-Z-I-E-R-A-N.com.
	So it's Drago, and the last name is D-Z-I-E-R-A-N. The book is The Pledge to America.
	Sounds like a fantastic book.
	Thank you so much for what you've done for our country.
	What you're doing now is really important.
	It was wonderful, Seth. Thank you.
	Holding a mirror up.
	Thank you so much. I appreciate it.
	And showing people what is right with America, showing people what we need to preserve, that is one of the most important things you could do.
	do.
	Thank you so much.
	Thank you, sir.
	The Common Man.
	They created common core to dumb down our children.
	They created common past to track and control us.
	Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
	Please share the information and links you'll find at thedavidknightshow.com.
	Thank you for listening.
	Thank you for sharing.
	Thank you.
	Matt Trujala is on with us.
	His book is The Doctrine of the Lesser Magistrate.
	I just, and I said last week, Matt, thank you for joining us, by the way.
	Hey, good to be here with you, David.
	I told my wife, I said, we've got to get Matt back on again, because somebody sent me a letter, and they said, well, I'm studying in such and such a class, and, you know, They've got some really strong stuff here from Romans 13 and from 1 Peter that's really bothering me.
	And he says, I remember you talked about this, and so I gave him your information.
	You can find the book at defytirants.com.
	Is that correct? Did I get that right?
	That's correct. Good, yeah.
	Get it there. I mean, you can get it at Amazon, but, you know, cut Amazon out of the loop here and go straight to Matt.
	He's got some additional goodies there for you if you go to defytirants.com.
	But before we talk about that, let's talk a little bit about California.
	You went there with an event and trying to get...
	Fathers to stand up in protection of their sons and daughters in California against the insanity that's being pushed there with this drag queen stuff.
	Tell us a little bit about that. No, I wasn't there myself.
	Oh, I thought you were. What it was, was in Glendale, which is northern Los Angeles, A suburb of Los Angeles.
	They were pushing the drag queen filth, the transgenderism, the usual sodomite bucket of filth upon the students there.
	And these Armenian fathers came out.
	And there were hundreds of them.
	Because they were having none of it.
	Well, Antifa came out.
	And Antifa wanted to protect, supposedly, the school board from these Armenian fathers.
	They support every leftist dog thing that happens in our country, of course.
	They're the street thugs for the thugs who wear the suits at the lawmaking assemblies, right?
	Yep.
	And so they ended up in a fistfight that was unbelievable.
	And police were there, scores of police, trying to break this up.
	It was pretty incredible.
	In fact, there's another meeting coming up in Riverside this evening.
	And Antifa's...
	We hung up there for a second.
	Yeah, I've talked about this many times, and I had a cameraman...
	Those Armenian fathers...
	Yeah, we froze up there a little bit.
	So repeat what you just said there.
	I thought we'd lost you for a second.
	So they're having another meeting tonight, is what you're saying.
	They're having a meeting tonight, and Tifa's bringing in hundreds of people they're saying this time.
	Wow. And so we'll see what happens this evening.
	But for me, David, it was just refreshing to see fathers and men act like fathers and men.
	That's right. There's a cameraman that I met at the DNC. He was working for NPR at the time, but he was a listener to a program that I did.
	And so he saw me and he came over and introduced himself to me.
	We've been talking since then.
	He's from Armenia.
	He's an Armenian Christian.
	And, of course, that was the first place where we had the term genocide talked about.
	And it was in Turkey where the Turks tried to kill all of the Christians there in that Armenian genocide.
	They're very strong. They understand what persecution is like.
	They've been hardened in the fire of trials and persecution.
	And these guys are not going to put up with that kind of stuff.
	And so he was telling me all about this.
	He says, you've got to cover this.
	And I did mention it, but I didn't talk about it a great deal.
	But you always see, as you pointed out, you always got the Antifa people always allied with this kind of stuff.
	And that's one of the reasons why I call it, Matt, I call it the Sodom-Go-Marxist curriculum because it's kind of like Sodom and Gomorrah.
	Except it's the sodomists and the Marxists unified, pushing in the schools the critical race theory and all the rest of this Marxist stuff, along with the degeneracy that seems to come hand-in-hand with it, always.
	Yes. Yeah, in fact, I'll send you over some clips after the show, the footage of the battle that took place there with these fathers and these leftist thugs.
	Because it's very powerful to see what took place.
	And we should remember, too, Armenia was the first country to embrace Christianity as a nation when Gregory converted King Teradadis to the Christian faith.
	So this was in 301 AD. They were the first...
	Because you understand, David, the early churchmen and the early missionaries, they understood that God's law and word was for the individual, but it was also for nations.
	And they would regularly quote some...
	Two, to the magistrates themselves.
	Because God's Word does speak to every area of life, including the area of civil government.
	And so the churchmen and the missionaries knew they had a duty to bring God's thoughts regarding civil government to the civil magistrates.
	That's all been lost on churchmen in our day, of course.
	And that's why we're in the morass we're in now, where evil is now good and good is evil.
	And yeah, have you noticed?
	We live in an insane asylum.
	Yeah, that's right. Just from a practical standpoint, you know, I mean, even when Nisha said God is dead, he was looking at it and saying, that's going to be bad.
	I don't believe in God, but things are going to get really bad.
	And they did. You know, we had Nazi Germany and the rest of the nation was devastated by that.
	Even from a pragmatic standpoint, your law is going to be based on something.
	It's going to be based on some moral foundation, some religion or something.
	And, of course, secular humanism is a kind of religion.
	They've got their gods and they fiercely worship them, don't they?
	But, you know, you're always going to have some kind of system of values that are going to be there.
	And we can see what happens, the total chaos and anarchy, as well as the depravity that happens when you remove that.
	It's one of the reasons why, Matt, you know, I was absolutely amazed to see Ted Cruz jump in.
	Of course, he was virtue signaling for politics and saying, well, I don't like this Ugandan law.
	You know, they're going to put people in prison for homosexuality and they're going to execute people for aggravated homosexuality, whatever that means.
	He didn't bother to look it up. That means that these are people who are pedophile rapists.
	And rapists, people who are raping people who are on drugs or disabled or anything like that, that's what they called aggravated homosexuality, and giving them the death penalty.
	And he got in an argument with a pastor who said, look, this is God's principle.
	And he goes, well, are you going to stone kids for disobeying their parents and that type of thing?
	He says, well, what you're saying is that God's law...
	It's wrong. That God got it wrong when he set up these different dividing lines.
	And I think that's where we are right now.
	Ted Cruz has been completely silent as you had a massacre of Ugandan kids by Muslim terrorists.
	They have an organization that came from a neighboring.
	It's right there on the border.
	But it's an organization called the ADF, and they came in and they burned alive 40-some-odd students in a Christian school that was there.
	And he's been totally silent about that, as has the Biden administration.
	But they were completely upset about the fact that they passed a law to intimidate homosexuality that was there, and has not been enforced at all.
	But they were absolutely livid about that, have nothing to say about Christians being mass murdered, burned to death by Muslim terrorists there in Uganda.
	Same country. Yeah, no, the ganging up on Uganda was absolutely despicable to see by conservatives and by churchmen, overwhelmingly, from America, condemning what's going on in Uganda.
	Meanwhile, over in America, we're talking about children mutilating their genitals.
	And here's something I've run into again and again, David.
	You know, I have a lot of interaction with the magistrates and I've been at a number of things as invited guests where people are running for school board.
	And then they have Q&A. And when you watch the Q&A, they're all running because everyone, where I go anyway, they're running because this has gone too far.
	You know, now we have genital mutilation of children.
	But they all start out this way.
	Here's what they say, David.
	They say, now I have nothing against gay people and I have nothing against gay marriage or gay couples.
	But, and then they go into that, not realizing the only reason we're talking about children's genitals being mutilated is because you've already impugned the law of God regarding homosex.
	Yeah, that's right. You cannot separate the two.
	We're here talking about mutilation of children's genitals because, in all our arrogance and pride, we've spit on the law of God and said, no, like you said, we know better than you, God.
	We're smarter than you.
	And so we're going to legalize what you called something to be criminalized.
	That's right. And I saw along that same line, Matt, people, somebody on the left went back and found that in 2020, on Trump's campaign website, he was pushing pride clothing here.
	All the rainbow stuff here.
	Make America Great Again in rainbow colors and Make America Great Again rainbow cap that's white instead of red.
	I have another one, Trump Pride 2020, repeated over and over again in different colors.
	The responses that I saw to that, Matt, were people defending Trump and they said, well, what you all don't get is we're not hypocrites because this isn't about being pushed.
	I don't see any children's sizes there.
	It's like, really? Are you that clueless that you don't understand that?
	When I looked at that and I saw those people's responses to it, I told my wife, I said, you know, I remember when it was a groundbreaking thing that Elizabeth Taylor broke up Debbie Reynolds' family, right?
	And my parents were naive about it in the sense that they didn't understand just how bad all of Hollywood was, Debbie Reynolds included.
	But, you know, that was something that was out there very publicly.
	And they would not go to Elizabeth Taylor movies.
	I couldn't go to Elizabeth Taylor movies.
	They were going to ostracize and boycott her movies because of that.
	That's where people were at that point in time.
	And that was a heterosexual thing.
	But you start with that kind of an attitude...
	Yeah. And by taking the sex out of the bedroom and putting it up on the big screen and putting it out on the streets in front of kids and all the
	rest of the stuff. This is what we've been facing my entire life.
	And I look at this and it's like, you know, we've normalized this for a very long time.
	Why are we surprised that it's gotten to this point of degeneracy?
	Because it's been about sex for a very long time.
	All my life they've been going down this path.
	Absolutely. And I think it's noteworthy.
	In 2016, the log cabin Republicans, which of course is the sodomite arm of the Republican Party, which, by the way, the Republican Party's headed in 2024 to redo their platform where they include homosex into their family values.
	And they're doing that at many state-level parties also.
	But in 2016...
	Yeah. The Log Cabin Club did not endorse Donald Trump, even when he was just up against Hillary.
	They didn't endorse him. But they did in 2020.
	Yes. And so we see this shift that took place where Donald Trump decided to go with the whole homosex horde.
	And he is looking to wicked men to help him get elected.
	And unfortunately, most Christians and conservatives are willing to support someone who isn't supportive of wicked men in order to save themselves from evil.
	That's right.
	And so they vote for the lesser of two evils.
	And of course, we've seen how that's gone.
	I've listened to that for the last 40 years of my life.
	We got to vote for the lesser of two evils.
	And I've noticed the lesser of two evils just keeps getting more evil.
	And look where we're at now.
	The lesser of two evils gets greater and greater evil.
	It is. And you point out in 2020, Melania cut a video, I've played it here many times, where she's bragging about the fact that Trump came in supporting same-sex mirage.
	You had Tiffany saying he's always loved the LGBT. You had Rick Grinnell cut an ad for him saying, you know, I'm homosexual.
	He put me in as, I think, as Director of National Intelligence or something.
	He said, I couldn't get that job under Biden.
	You know, listen to what Biden used to say about this stuff.
	Of course, Biden has changed as well.
	They've all moved on that issue.
	And at the same time that Biden held his big gathering and party at the White House, passing a bill to a federal law to legalize same-sex marriage, you had at Mar-a-Lago, you had Trump throwing a big party for all of them. you had Trump throwing a big party for all of Carrie Lake was there as well.
	I mean, it's just when are people going to wake up to where he is on any issue?
	You know, it's not just even that issue.
	It's on guns.
	It's on the vaccine and all the rest of this stuff.
	It's just amazing to me.
	To see how this goes.
	But at the same time, I want to get your comment about this.
	When I was talking about marriage, we just had promise keepers.
	This is after I saw this stuff and I was talking about, yeah, you know, we've been on the slippery slope, Hollywood and culture and all the rest of this stuff for a long time.
	We now have promise keepers kicked out of a rejected by Christian school.
	They're going to have a meeting there.
	They said, well, we don't like your take on biblical marriage.
	This is a school that portrays itself as being Christian in Nashville, which is rapidly becoming like Austin, in my opinion.
	I want to look at it. But They said, we don't like your position on traditional marriage.
	Promise Keepers is a men's organization to underscore that, you know, what they're having is a rally, you know, to tell people, you know, remain faithful to your wife and to your family and all this kind of stuff.
	And now you've got a Christian school.
	Belmont University in Nashville doesn't want them there because of that.
	Yes. Now, when you read the book of Genesis and you go into the Sodom and Gomorrah account, one of the things you notice is that when evil is tolerated within a culture, it affects everybody.
	It impacts all the people.
	I mean, you even look at Lot's own sons-in-laws and daughters.
	They mocked him for what he was saying and about leaving and all that kind of thing.
	His wife wanted to look back one last time to see if the mall was still there.
	You know, and she turns into a fuller of salt.
	And so you see the bad effect.
	And then what happened with Lot afterwards, of course, you see the bad effect of it all.
	Evil has to be confronted.
	You have to engage. One of the things I tell people is you have to speak.
	And you need to go to the school board meetings, you need to go to the county board meetings, to the statehouse, and you have to denounce these evil things.
	Because if you don't speak, evil just invades and pervades and takes over every inch of territory.
	Most people are afraid to speak.
	I'm telling you, we have to speak.
	We need to honor God in our speaking.
	And so it's extremely important that people begin to do that.
	I did a sermon recently this month called Sodom in America.
	And I gave people three things to do in that sermon.
	You know, I kind of went through some of the history, especially for the younger people, and I found out most of the older people don't know a lot of the history I talked about either, some of which you were mentioning also, about Marlago and stuff.
	And so in there, the three things I said is, number one, we need to properly define love to this nation.
	So I shared a story.
	I was out at Pride Fest here in Milwaukee the day before this Sermon two weeks ago.
	And three young guys came up and they said, you know, what's wrong with two people loving each other?
	And I said, well, you have to define what love is.
	And I said, love is defined by the law of God.
	And if you divorce the ethic of love from the law of God, you can use the ethic of love to justify anything, including two men or two women marrying each other.
	The law and word of God defines what love is.
	Jesus said, When he was asked what the great commandments were, he said, to love the Lord your God with all your heart, mind, soul, and strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself.
	And then he said this, as he continued to talk, he said, upon those two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.
	Love is defined by the law and word of God.
	That's something not only lost on this complete culture, and I explained to him, you know, how to love your neighbor is seen there.
	You don't commit adultery, you don't steal their stuff, you don't covet their things and all this type of stuff.
	And The church also has lost this, David, where they don't even know how love is defined because they've thrown the law of God under the bus also.
	So in a complete and sane asylum at this time.
	Yeah, and as Christ said, if you love me, keep my commandments.
	And we're not talking about...
	And that's the other thing, too.
	Everything is about sex.
	And so people think love, sex, love, sex.
	But it was C.S. Lewis, I think, that had the four different loves.
	You understand that in the Greek language, it's like the Eskimos have...
	20 different words for different types of snow, right?
	Well, the Greeks had four different words that are translated with the one English word, love.
	And so you had phileo, which is like brotherly love, like Philadelphia.
	You had storge, which is like a family love.
	You had... You had eros, which is sexual love, and then you have agape, which is the kind of unconditional love that God shows us, that we show children as parents and that type of thing.
	These are very different concepts, and you can have brotherly love with somebody, but that's completely different from eros.
	And so, again, we have lost this and this dumbing down of the culture, but the thing that I think is interesting is the fact that In Promise Keepers, they were talking about several different types of love, you know, for your wife.
	So you've got Eros, you've got Storge, the family, and all this kind of stuff.
	Even a brotherly type of love, even agape.
	All that is involved in the marriage because that's a picture of our relationship with Christ.
	And yet, you know, the Promise Keepers are not allowed in a Christian university now to talk about that.
	Because they're totally focused on erotic sexual love, and because they want to have license to do whatever they wish with that, and they've completely lost the plot.
	It's just amazing. Yes, it is amazing.
	One of the things I wanted to mention to you, David, is there's a revolt of the counties going on, and it's exciting to watch regarding this doctrine of the lesser magistrates.
	Good. People have flooded into county and local government, and that was one of the three things I had in my sermon from two weeks ago on three things we can do.
	The second was fishers of men.
	First, define love properly.
	Second, be fishers of men.
	And then the third was this matter of continue to take over counties, take over the GOP, county by county by county.
	The structure is already there.
	If you try to start a third party, you're up against a huge wall because those two parties have structured things so that they will – it's been tried before.
	No one's broken through the cabal in the past.
	Let's put it that way.
	And even at the state party level, they've got a lot of walls in that as well.
	It's a fight just to get at the county level, and it will be a fight to get at the county level, but you pretty much forget about it at the national or state level, as well as a third party.
	I know because I've been in that third party thing.
	I know how they've got the barriers set up there.
	Yeah. Same here.
	I've had that experience.
	So I say, take the apparatus that's already there, take it over.
	And like here in Wisconsin, we've seen, we've taken over eight county parties in the last year.
	And by truly people who love Christ, love freedom in the true sense of the word.
	Very encouraging to see it's happening in Minnesota.
	It's happening in Michigan, big time in Michigan.
	also in other states around the nation.
	So I think what I've been seeing is the fact that this reformation or this revolution is taking place at the county level.
	And when you look at the history of the founding of our nation, of course, that started at the county level.
	You know, you had the Suffolk Resolves that were published in September 9th of 1774.
	Other counties immediately joined suit, Mecklenburg County on down the line and declaring it.
	So it started at the grassroots county level, the entire American Revolution.
	It wasn't like these big guys got together over in Philadelphia and started there.
	And then it trickled down.
	It had all started at the county level.
	And here we're seeing the same thing now.
	Right now, out in...
	vote to leave Oregon and to join Idaho.
	And this is the furthest in my lifetime that I've seen such efforts get this far, where the Idaho legislature has already accepted the fact that they're willing to entertain these counties coming into their state.
	Of course, Oregon has to agree to let them go, and we know what leftists are like.
	But it's all tuning up for a battle.
	All tuning up for a battle.
	Well, we need to show them the path.
	Everybody's frustrated with this, and they need to understand there is a way to do that, and that's where your book is so valuable.
	You know, you're talking about we've got to stand up and we've got to speak out.
	We had a lot of people standing up and speaking out over the weekend.
	At the L.A. Dodgers, you had over 1,000 people show up.
	The stadium was empty while they were doing their perversions down there and playing their baseball game.
	But there's only one...
	I saw an article over the weekend.
	It's only the Texas Rangers that have not joined into this Pride celebration.
	They call them the Lone Rangers now because they're the only Major League Baseball team that hasn't done that.
	All the rest of them have.
	And so these people showed up to...
	To protest this decision.
	And so there's anger.
	There's protests about this.
	But they don't know what to do.
	And that's why your book is so valuable.
	And what you have to say in terms of taking over the county level and everything.
	But for people to understand how this has fit into history.
	And that's what you do such a great job with in your book.
	Talk a little bit about that.
	Because it's been a while since you've been on.
	Give people the...
	Cliff Notes version of where it's coming from, the doctrine of the lesser magistrate.
	Yeah, well, the doctrine is simply that when the higher-ranking civil authority makes unjust or immoral law, policy, or court opinion, the God-given right and duty of the lesser authority is to not obey, rather to interpose against their lawlessness.
	Mm-hmm. And that's really what we saw expressed in the Declaration of Independence.
	You know, I always thought it was interesting that they would have us memorize it up to the point...
	Use the sword against me.
	What's that? Yeah. Yeah, where it says, you know, if it is, you know, the purpose of the government is to protect our God-given liberties, and it is the right and duty of the people to alter or abolish that government when it becomes destructive of those liberties, they would not have us memorize that.
	It stopped at that point.
	But that's embedded into our Constitution, and you point out, and you begin your book with that story about use the sword against me.
	Tell people that story. Yeah, that was Emperor Trajan and giving a sword to a subordinate.
	He said, use this sword against my enemies if I give righteous commands.
	But if I give unrighteous commands, use it against me.
	That's right. So the doctrine is succincted in one statement.
	And he's not a Christian.
	So the duty of the lesson is... He's not even a Christian, showing that this doctrine is natural to man.
	It's found in non-Jewish, non-Christian nations, of course, seen in the Old Testament, seen in the New Testament, seen throughout Western civilization.
	It's found in Scripture.
	John Knox wrote the foremost treatise on the doctrine of the Lesser Magistrates, citing over 70 passages of Scripture to show that the doctrine is sound in the Word of God.
	So we've seen the interposition of lesser authorities again and again.
	We have 90 sheriffs right now defying the governor of Illinois and the entire state legislature over their infringement of the Second Amendment rights of their citizens and their counties regarding assault weapon ban.
	So we're going to the NSA. This Sunday, David, the National Sheriff's Association...
	Oh, okay, that one. I thought you were talking about the National Security Agency.
	Yeah, no, not that.
	So, the National Sheriff's Association, they're having their national convention in...
	Grand Rapids, and we're going to be there.
	They've actually secured me to give the sermon for the prayer breakfast that they have, which I'm honored to do, and of course, you'll probably get an idea of what I'm going to be talking about from the Word of God.
	And so, but we plan on getting the book into every sheriff who's there at this gathering's hand because we view it as massively important that we're at such a state in our country now that the guys who carry the guns need to understand that they're not just robots for the state.
	That's right. And that they need to think about the things they're being told to do and that their duty, their sacred duty, is interposition.
	When the superior authorities are acting lawlessly.
	Yeah, that is so important.
	And again, as the sheriffs are there, as the doctrine of the lesser magistrate, nullification and non-commandeering, those are peaceful vetoes.
	I'm not cooperating with you.
	I'm not doing this, right?
	And of course, they're going to try to escalate things into a fight.
	But I think that's where we need to, you know, nullification is where this needs to go because there's so many laws that have taken that over.
	And for people who are listening, this goes, as Matt was talking about, Trajan, the Roman emperor, was saying, you know, use the sword against me if I give unrighteous commands.
	It is something that we are going to see coming at us in many different ways.
	And people need to understand this is tied into our Western civilization, and it's there for a very good reason, and it needs to be preserved.
	And, of course, Christians need to understand the importance of this from the standpoint of resisting evil.
	And that is very clearly defined, you know, what evil is and what our responsibility is to protect people from that.
	So it's a very important book.
	And it is, again, a quick read.
	It's very dense in information.
	I'd highly recommend that book to anybody.
	And it is something that we have a lot of confusion that's being put out there.
	And I started getting into this and found you when we had Todd Friel.
	Arguing that on the cusp of these Biden vaccine mandates, saying, well, you know, you got to do whatever the government says.
	And if the government tells you to wear pinwheels on your head, you wear pinwheels on your head.
	And it's like, no, you don't.
	I played clips of that on my show and argued with him over that.
	But, you know, I couldn't get him on the show.
	But, you know, that's what they've been told for a very long time.
	And I, you know, years ago, we would have that type of thing.
	And I said, well, if that's your understanding of the Bible, I think that's wrong.
	And you say, well, the only thing that we don't do is obey the government if it tells us it interferes with the way that we worship.
	And I said, no, those people who are telling you that are going to let the government interfere with their worship.
	And they did. And they had done that even before Todd was talking about the vaccine mandates.
	Yep. Yeah, no, the standard has always been when the state commands that which God forbids, or forbids that which God commands, we're to obey God rather than man.
	So if the state, you know, contradicts the law of God, we're to obey God rather than man.
	And when it comes to the lesser authorities, their duty before God is to stand in interposition against his lawlessness.
	Mm-hmm. Against the lawlessness of the superior authority.
	Also, if they surpass the limits of their authority, they're to be opposed.
	And that whole matter?
	Yeah, no. We don't put pinwheels on it.
	In the United States, it doesn't even get to that level.
	Because the doctrine of the lesser magistrate and the right of the people to stand for their God-given rights is encoded into the Declaration of Independence and into our history and our law, Once you have somebody take an oath to the Constitution and they violate that oath, they're now illegitimate stewards of that.
	They're unfaithful stewards. They've delegitimized their authority.
	They may still have a lot of force to command against you, but they have no legitimate authority.
	And so just from a civil standpoint, that type of approach that's been taken by Todd Friel and so many other people before him is just not sustainable.
	It doesn't even apply in our country at all.
	That's right.
	Yeah, the law and word of God limits the authority that civil magistrates possess and our constitution, national and state constitutions, all limit the authority that they possess.
	If you allow someone to exceed the limits of their authority, it goes to their heads and tyranny grows in the nation.
	If you oppose their tyranny, then they can do one of two things.
	they can either realize, yeah, my authority does have limits and I'll back up, or they're forced out of their lair and they have to show their fangs, and then people more readily see them for the tyrants they are.
	So it's extremely important that when they contradict the law or word of God or impugn the Constitution, since we live here in America, as you're saying, or exceed the limits that have been placed upon their authority, that we don't say, yeah, if he tells us to put pinwheels on our heads, we put pinwheels.
	Absolutely not. Men fought, bled, and died for the freedoms that we possess.
	Who are we to glibly throw them on the ground and let them be trampled?
	Our duty during our time is to help preserve them for the memory of our forebears and also for our progeny that come after us.
	That's right. Yeah, I have a listener who says, so what about when the king was trying to kill all the babies?
	You know, Mary and Joseph get out of town.
	Or, you know, another one that comes to mind is Paul.
	You know, he says, yeah, they were trying to arrest me, and these guys lowered me over the wall in a basket and everything.
	You're not to submit to that type of thing.
	And even Paul would demand due process.
	You know, it's like, hey, you're not allowed to do this.
	You know, I'm a Roman citizen.
	You're not allowed to do that to Roman citizens.
	He stood up for his rights before these people.
	Yes. Yeah. Absolutely.
	Another one that's famously talked about is that we always obey unless we have to personally sin.
	That's not the standard of Christianity down through the ages.
	And you even see it in recent times that it's not the standard.
	Like, no one told Corrie Ten Boom that she had to mistreat Jews or put them in a death camp and She didn't have to personally sin, yet she still hid Jews, which was against the law, in her house.
	Look at the abolitionists during the 1800s.
	No one told them they had to own a slave.
	No one told them they had to beat a slave.
	They didn't have to personally sin, yet many Christians helped slaves make it out of slavery in violation of the Federal Fugitive Slave Act.
	Because that isn't the standard.
	The standard isn't we always obey unless we have to personally sin.
	The standard is if the state commands that which God forbids or forbids that which God commands, we obey God rather than the state.
	That's right. Extremely important to understand.
	And we have a little seven-minute animation video on Romans 13 at our website, Defy Tyrants, that you can share.
	And also we have the appendix from my book, Where I talk about Romans 13 is right there on the homepage of our website, defytirants.com also.
	And you can share that with people anywhere, because this is a topic that comes up all the time amongst Christian friends, with pastors, elders, with family.
	So you can just grab these things and send it to them, and they're short.
	Seven minutes on the one thing.
	My appendix, you can read it in 15 minutes.
	And that is always the proof text that they put up to people.
	But again, you talk about, we mentioned a couple of things in the New Testament.
	Of course, there's many things throughout the Old Testament that were that way that you've talked about in the past, giving some examples.
	Give an Old Testament example or two of people refusing unjust orders.
	Yeah, I mean, you look at the Hebrew midwives.
	They were told by Pharaoh to kill the male Hebrew children.
	Instead, they disobeyed and made sure the male Hebrew children were born.
	And God commended them for it, blessed them for it.
	And so they were told to do something which was against God's law and word, murder someone.
	But then you can look at another historical example from Scripture in the Old Testament.
	Daniel. Daniel wasn't told to do something evil, but he was told he couldn't do something good.
	He was told he couldn't pray to the Lord.
	And he prayed anyway.
	And he did it right there by his window.
	And he did it three times.
	Nobody could misinterpret what he was doing.
	And so, again, that's the standard.
	If the state commands that which God forbids, like in the I agree.
	I have a comment here from Aaron Moss.
	He says, To get you to go against your conscience.
	And I think that's a big part of that.
	You know, that was a part of, you know, we looked at this coercion stuff.
	Oh, we're not forcing you to do this, right?
	We're giving you an alternative. You can either lose your job, your career, get kicked out of the military, whatever.
	But it's your choice, right?
	And that's one of the more insidious things about it, was to force you to violate your conscience, I think.
	Absolutely. Before I came out, me and my wife were listening to your show for 30 minutes leading up.
	And, you know, we were just reminiscing and we had so much laughter, you know, and...
	Of the things you were saying because it reminded us of just how crazy everything was in regards to what was going on.
	And that was a huge mistake by Christian people, is complying, because tyranny is built plank by plank.
	Yes. And if you agree with one, if you accommodate yourself to the plank of their tyranny, that gives them the convenience of building the next plank of their tyranny.
	Mm-hmm. You cannot appease tyrants.
	You have to defeat them.
	And so this matter of conscience is used.
	I never wore masks during the entire time.
	Didn't fly for 27 months.
	I couldn't. People would say, it's just a mask, Matt.
	I say, it's not just a mask.
	That's right.
	This is part and parcel of a huge evil.
	And we like to use the word all the pretendemic nonsense, right?
	Because it's hard for us to wrap our minds around such evil, but it's really evil.
	That's right.
	It was incredible, massive evil.
	And the tyrants haven't gone home.
	Everybody's back to their food and drink.
	They're thinking...
	Yeah, froze up there for a second.
	Oh, I absolutely agree. I absolutely agree with what Matt said, and I believe it was evil.
	I refuse to wear the mask under any circumstances.
	Sorry, you took a break there and just came back.
	We missed a little bit of what you were saying there.
	Back up just a little bit because it froze.
	Sure, yeah.
	You're talking about it being evil with a mask, and that's when we lost you.
	Yeah, it's not just a mask.
	It's part and parcel of a huge, massive evil.
	And so you have to take a stand against it.
	And that's why I did.
	We would not put a mask on.
	Nobody in our family did.
	Our church stayed open the entire time.
	I preached my first sermon nine days after Trump made the national emergency, denouncing the entire thing, both biblically and just scientifically, because at that time, they hadn't censored all the good guys who devoted their entire life to epidemiology and virology, and you did your due diligence.
	I spent 52 hours of study that week.
	They were all debunking.
	There were plenty of men debunking the thing right away from the beginning.
	Yeah, I'd seen them practice this for 20 years, ever since 2001.
	I even had somebody who was a cybersecurity guy say, hey, there's a lot of chatter about a dark winter, too.
	And it was about a year and a half before it happened.
	And so, you know, when I saw them talking about lockdown and we got to produce a vaccine, it's like, this is the script that they rehearsed for 20 years.
	And so it was pretty clear to me.
	And it was also, I saw wearing the face mask the same as if I were to put a pride flag on my car.
	I refuse to do any of that.
	I watch people driving around, husband and wife, in a car, with the windows up and their masks on.
	And so I went everywhere that I could with my convertible top down and no mask.
	I was getting lots of stares from people.
	I never got sick with any of this stuff either.
	So, you know, I was sucking in lots of virus air, I guess, everywhere I went.
	But yeah, I refuse to do that.
	We're loving the talk you were doing about it all.
	You talk plainly, so we got a lot of laughter how you express yourself on those things.
	They just need to be said.
	And then at times, some of the videos and things...
	It's just grievous. It is.
	It is amazing. And you go back and you look at it, you know, like all this panic about, oh, we got to have mass graves in Central Park and everything.
	You know, they put that stuff out and then they pull it back and then they don't revisit it and they bury the denial.
	They bury the retraction and they don't bury anybody in Central Park.
	And I'm glad they did.
	But I mean, the whole thing was a sham from the beginning.
	All of this stuff was just this big theatrical production and a pox on anybody who had anything to do with it.
	They all knew and they still know and they're still trying to divert people to other things as well.
	But it's always great to have you on and it's very important for people to take a look at this.
	And it is very important for you to do things at the local level.
	You know, get your relationship right with God and your family and your community and start doing this stuff at the county level.
	If you want to get involved in politics, everybody wants to focus on presidential politics.
	And, you know, there's a lot of juicy theater and all of that, especially now.
	But the reality is that real life is done in the trenches with day-to-day hard work, and that's the way we're going to take this country back from the ground up.
	That really is true.
	And you need to have a framework of history and of religion and the rest of the stuff that Matt gives you in this book to really give you the guidance of where to go with this.
	Just as you were talking before, Matt, we've got to show people, you know, it's not enough to condemn what is ugly and degenerate.
	We need to show the truth that's out there, and we need to model that for people.
	And so it's not enough just to condemn this tyranny that we've suffered for the last three years that is still grounded at the top level, and they're adding more structures at the level above that at the WHO. It's not enough just to speak against that tyranny.
	We have to have...
	An idea of what it should look like.
	We've got that in the Constitution.
	But how do we accomplish that?
	And how has it been done in the past?
	And that's one thing that your book puts in there for sure.
	It's very important. Absolutely.
	It gives people hope and something to do.
	That's right. That's right.
	Well, thank you so much for coming on.
	I wanted to have you on as a reminder to people.
	It's always great talking to you.
	Again, it is defytirants.com where you can find this book.
	You can also find it on Amazon, but go to his site.
	And it's always good to try to get out of that controlling structure of amazon.com.
	Thank you for joining us, Matt.
	Appreciate it. Hey, thank you, David.
	God bless you. Thank you. Always great to talk to you.
	We'll be right back, folks.
	The Common Man .
	They created common core to dumb down our children.
	They created common past to track and control us.
	Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
	Please share the information and links you'll find at TheDavidKnightShow.com Thank you for listening.
	Thank you for sharing.
	Thank you.
	TheDavidKnightShow.com Welcome back.
	Joining us now is Carolyn Cece Blakeman.
	She goes by the name Cece to her friend, she says, known by most.
	She's a political blogger, artist, researcher.
	She is media director and task force coordinator for a group called Former Feds Group.
	And I want to talk about that organization a little bit, but I really want to begin with her personal experience and how people who are associated with this organization are coming together to inform people about the hospital protocol that kills so many people and to try to draw attention to that and talk about her personal experience.
	So joining us now is Carolyn Blakeman.
	Thank you so much for joining us.
	Hi, thanks for having me on.
	Well, I appreciate what you're doing.
	I appreciate what your organization is doing.
	Briefly, just tell us, former Feds group, these are people that are all kinds of individuals who have worked for the federal government and now retired.
	Is that correct? Well, our founder is a former federal prosecutor of 21 years.
	And around 2000, early 2000s until 2016, he was really seeing the corruption going on in the government.
	Like you were saying, I was listening to your show earlier.
	These agencies have been captured.
	They're compromised.
	So the DOJ and the FBI that he worked for and loved for years was completely being corrupted and he wasn't going to go along with that.
	So he got out and started his own law firm called the Former Feds Group and then started a nonprofit foundation in 2016 called the Former Feds Group Freedom Foundation.
	And now he fights against government corruption.
	Good, good. And I want to talk about the mission and the agenda because it closely aligns with what I have been talking about for a long time.
	And you see the problem with the pandemic and how it's been locked in there.
	Other things like civil asset forfeiture.
	So there's a lot we can talk about.
	But I want to begin with the hospital protocol aspect because this is one of the things that's right at the forefront.
	And we all understand how this pandemic has been used To literally destroy healthcare in this country.
	It's so perverted.
	Tell us your personal story about this.
	Well, in 1995, I'd lost a daughter.
	She was killed. And when the pandemic, plandemic, I should say, was announced, I freaked out.
	The thought of losing another person I loved...
	Just terrified me.
	So I went into obsessively deep dive into research to try to figure out a way to save my friends and my family.
	And what I figured out very early on in 2020 was that there was working protocols, but they weren't telling us about them.
	That's right. You know, different... I studied protocols across the world.
	And so I knew early on that ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, high-dose vitamin C... Those worked.
	And I flew to Mexico and I bought up as much ivermectin hydroxychloroquine as I could find.
	In November 2020, my husband and I both caught COVID. We immediately took ivermectin hydroxy and we had symptoms for three hours.
	And that was the moment I was like, oh my gosh, they're killing people.
	This is what everybody's freaking out over.
	This is treatable.
	Of course, I'm a blogger and an artist.
	No one's going to believe me. I'm not a doctor, right?
	So my husband's aunt and uncle both get sick, and I'm advocating so hard.
	Do not let them go to the hospital.
	Do not let them get remdesivir.
	Of course, to no luck, they both got it.
	They both died and both had kidney failure as a result of the remdesivir.
	So I was just on a mission.
	One of my blogs I wrote early on, I think it was about September of 2020, Found its way up to a former federal prosecutor, our founder.
	And at the time, he was suing Facebook for censorship of early treatments.
	Because we were trying to get these treatments out to the people so they knew not to use remdesivir to go to the hospital.
	That there weren't working early treatments.
	We were getting taken down and censored in Facebook jail and Twitter accounts going down.
	So he asked me to be on the Facebook suit.
	We were going to sue them for censorship.
	And At that point, I knew my calling, and I said, I have to get in this fight.
	They're destroying this country.
	They're killing people needlessly.
	And it's not going to stop unless we stop them.
	So we formed our task force, which is mostly victims that have lost someone to the protocol across the country.
	And we started documenting these stories.
	We knew we had to get them on the record.
	I'll preserve the historical records and not let these people be forgotten.
	And in the beginning, we really didn't know what we were going to use it for, but then eventually we were like, okay, we need to make this a big project.
	We need to make a large searchable database that's going to house all this data and all these stories and all these cases of people being killed in hospitals so that Law enforcement or attorneys or whoever can come and try to get these people justice can have all this data spot.
	So now we have almost a thousand cases in our database.
	They all have a folder with all the details of the case.
	It has a written account of what happened in the hospital.
	We do a live video recorded testimony.
	And it's all searchable by state and by drug, by date.
	It's really a pretty incredible project.
	It's called the COVID-19 Humanity Betrayal Memory Project.
	And you've got a website for that.
	Give people the initials, the acronym of it.
	Yeah, it's cbmp.org.
	CHB. CHBMP.org.
	Okay, good. And we'll put that in the description as well for people if they're listening to the podcast or they're watching the video.
	And that's a key thing.
	What you're doing now is you're building a database that hopefully will be used in cold case prosecutions.
	Because this is murder and that never goes away.
	There's no statute of limitations on murder.
	And even though the people may be dead, if you've got the information there, you can go back.
	It's done all the time by cold case inspectors and detectives who do that.
	They go back and they get the information and then they open that up.
	And what we need to understand is that the coordination of this project of mass murder, when we do these cold case prosecutions, the central part of this is going to be the institutions.
	And so these institutions have to be altered or abolished that have done this type of stuff to us.
	That's the amazing thing.
	When you look at FDA, that was one of the most cynical things.
	You were saying nobody would listen to you because you're a political blogger and stuff like this, but it was critical thought that was killed as well early on.
	You could look at this and you could say, wait a minute, you've got some drugs here.
	People have been using them for 60 or 70 years.
	We know what the safety protocol is.
	The only question is, does it work in this particular case?
	So why wouldn't we allow people to try that?
	They do that all the time with off-label uses of drugs, and the FDA doesn't have any problem with it.
	Instead, they create this social media platform A campaign to label it as horse medication.
	What a bunch of horse, you know, excrement that was.
	Well, here's the thing.
	It was such a fear campaign that caused people to lose their ability to think critically because they instilled fear so badly.
	I mean, think about the sophistication of the psyops to convince everybody to run out and get an experimental, brand new, Technology, mRNA shot with zero safety studies.
	I mean, everyone knew it was experimental, it was brand new.
	So, I mean, you really, you know, people were fighting to get the first one.
	I mean, At what point does common sense come back into play and say, wait a minute, maybe I should think this through or wait until some safety studies come out.
	But it didn't happen that way.
	That's right. And Dr. McCullough, he just testified on a state legislator that the latest estimate is 600,000 Americans have been killed by this toxic so-called vaccine.
	Yeah. That's more than we lost in the Civil War.
	I know. Yeah.
	It's amazing. And yet Trump is out there saying he saved a couple hundred million lives and all the rest of this stuff.
	It's like, are you kidding me?
	It's just, I cannot believe this stuff.
	And I knew it was a rigged game for sure at the beginning because I had all these issues.
	I knew about Dark Winter and the germ games and all this stuff.
	They'd been practicing for 20 years.
	But, you know, I thought it was a big smoking gun.
	I couldn't get people to report it.
	When I talked about the American Hospital Association, AHA, in August of 2020, said to the center, the CMS, the people that run Medicare and Medicaid payments for the hospitals, they said, wait a minute, you said you're not going to pay us if we don't have a test to go along with our diagnosis that this person's got COVID? You told us at the beginning that you didn't have enough tests and they didn't really work.
	And you told us to do a clinical diagnosis and you need to pay us that money.
	And I looked at it and was like, what money?
	They were giving them the bonus of $13,000 per patient, $39,000 that they put them on a ventilator.
	Then they charge them on a daily basis for that.
	Remdesivir is amazingly expensive.
	But if you had somebody who was a COVID patient, they got a 20% bonus on top of that.
	I mean, I've called it financially incentivized medical malpractice ever since then.
	Because that's what it's been. Yeah.
	The average for each COVID patient across the country is 280,000.
	Wow. If you follow the COVID protocol, that's COVID in minutes using remdesivir, putting them on a ventilator and listing it as a COVID death.
	Each patient, you get an average of $280,000 for each patient.
	And you wonder why these hospitals are now death chambers.
	I mean, they really are. They're ventilated gas chambers.
	And because the stories that we have in our database are absolutely unbelievable.
	I mean, I've done personally over 100 interviews myself.
	And I always say I can't be surprised anymore.
	And the next one, I'm shocked.
	You know, it's just these are absolute torture.
	And abuse...
	I mean, it goes way past medical malpractice.
	This is absolute medical battery and torture.
	I mean, they're not fed. They're not in fluids.
	They're not cleaned.
	They're ventilated when they don't need to be because they're agitated.
	That's not why you ventilate a patient.
	You know, they're getting these horrible bacterial infections that they don't treat, where it eats off half their face.
	They're forging DNRs.
	They're isolated. They have no advocate.
	They're told they're going to die.
	The doctors discriminate against them, and we know that the medical charting system is in on it, too, because, especially with Epic, we've had three supporters come forward and say, they don't let you pick On the drop-down menu, a place to say that the patient is vaccinated.
	The two choices that you get are unvaccinated or vaccination status unknown.
	So that data goes to the CDC so they can keep up their narrative.
	It's the pandemic of the unvaccinated.
	When really, all those patients were chapped.
	I mean, the whistleblowers that worked the COVID ICU told us, several of them.
	And there's not even a place to list their vaccine.
	And the doctors have been vaccinated.
	So they're discriminating them.
	They're tweeting horrible things about unvaccinated patients that were monsters.
	And, you know, they clearly don't care whether we live or die.
	And it's just really this narrative.
	And people have just bought into it, hook, line, and sinker.
	And the media's got blood on their hands, our politicians, the...
	The drug companies, I mean, there's so many people that are complicit in this plan.
	Yeah, I remember the story that I just saw a couple of months ago about the guy who designed the Millennial Falcon for Star Wars died out of this type of thing.
	And, you know, he's kind of famous as a famous toy designer as well as designing for that movie.
	And he went into the latter stages of this and they kidnapped him medically and put him on a ventilator.
	And he, you know, it blew out his lungs.
	And then at some point his wife was able to get back there.
	But now he was so severely damaged from the ventilator, he managed to survive.
	But he's so severely damaged from that that he needed a lung transplant.
	And so they put out a call.
	That's when I saw the information.
	Put out a call to people who knew him, fans of Star Wars and stuff.
	You know, let's get some money together so we can get him a lung transplant.
	But his wife said he'd been medically kidnapped as well and given this, you know, maltreatment, typical of what you see with a lot of people.
	But again, it was at the end of it.
	So she was able to get in as they started to pull this stuff back.
	Tell us a little bit about your personal example and what was happening to your relative in the hospital.
	Kidnapped. No advocate.
	Not told about remdesivir being...
	The fact sheet, the mandated fact sheet that the doctor is supposed to show the patient clearly says, we don't know what all this does, has shown to cause kidney failure, liver failure, multi-organ failure.
	If anybody, any person in their right mind read this, they would pass.
	They'd say, no, thank you. I don't want this drug.
	That's right. We have...
	Probably 70 lawsuits going right now.
	And they're not suing based on medical malpractice.
	They're suing on constructive fraud, which means that the fiduciary, the doctor, had an obligation to tell the patient what they're using, putting in their body, and they're not.
	Not a single person that we've interviewed out of 1,000 victims has ever seen that piece of paper.
	And it says it on there, you must show your patients this, to give them...
	Allow them to have a choice whether they want to take this experimental EUA, Emergency Youth Authorization Drug, that killed 54% of the patients in the previous trial, the Ebola studies.
	So they're not arguing what it did to the person in the lawsuits.
	They're arguing that they never got a choice.
	Informed consent went out the window.
	Oh, yeah. And we have actually gotten past the PREP Act in two of our cases.
	Wow. So that's very helpful.
	Yeah, it is truly fraudulent.
	That should never be protected. It is fraud.
	Yeah. Absolutely. Everything that Fauci did about that was fraud.
	As you pointed out, the Ebola cases and stuff.
	He tried to sell this for AIDS. He tried to sell this for Ebola.
	And in all these cases, they said, it's not effective.
	It's very harmful. Their patent was about to expire.
	And he took it under his wing to make sure that this thing got through because, you know, they didn't want to lose the money on this.
	And they were charging people a lot of money.
	But it was absolute total fraud.
	And, you know, even his study where he pronounced it the standard IKEA, you know, he did not, it was not peer-reviewed, and it was just one week after there had been a study coming out of China that was very negative about remdesivir, and they got that taken down within less than 24 hours, and a week later he puts his study out, and he changed even what they would say for a therapeutic.
	You know, therapeutic, you're supposed to get better.
	But he says, no, they don't get any better, even in his data.
	He couldn't make it clear that it showed that nobody got better.
	But he said, if they got better, they got better 30% faster.
	Some nonsense like that. Yeah.
	Absolutely crazy. It's all fraud.
	And he has a pattern of this.
	He did this during the AIDS epidemic with Factrum.
	But... You know, if you look, if you take a deep dive into the EUA and you see the study that it got approved based on, that study was founded by Gilead, which is the manufacturer of remdesivir.
	So we also have a class action against Gilead.
	And we found a way around the PREP Act with that, too, by filing false advertisement, claiming it does something it didn't do.
	And it's misbranded and mislabeled.
	And, you know, It doesn't work.
	So why you're saying it does and pushing it and incentivizing hospitals to use it with large amounts of money, you know, it's And of course, I'll fill in for people who don't know the PrEP Act is something that's put in 2005 for in case, you know, they've already been practicing for four years to do this stuff.
	In case we have some kind of, you know, an emergency or something, we're going to lock everybody down and put out a vaccine.
	And for the vaccines that come out, you're not going to be able to sue us.
	And it was far more restrictive than even the...
	The legal immunity that Fauci put in in 1986 in that Childhood Vaccine Act.
	And so that's a big part of the reason why this had to be an emergency, why they had to maintain all of that stuff, and everything had to be shut down.
	We only had vaccines, and there was not going to be any charges against it.
	So that has been very, very restrictive.
	I think the maximum that anybody can get is something like $250,000 or something, and only a few people have gotten any compensation.
	So the fact that you could get around the PrEP Act Kudos to you.
	But again, it is fraud.
	And fraud should never be...
	There was a big issue, as reported by a pharmaceutical trade magazine, Stat News, a big issue about the fact that Pfizer was essentially blackmailing three South American countries.
	One of them eventually went with it, but two of them did not at the time.
	Argentina and Brazil.
	And so they were saying, you know, they were trying to essentially blackmail us into holding them harmless against any kind of fraud or manufacturing, negligence, in addition to allowing them to put out an untested emergency vaccine.
	They wanted to be held harmless against fraud and negligence as well.
	And that is not the case here in the United States.
	And so that's one of the bases, I think, that people need to come after these people.
	We were talking about earlier about how Fauci is going to have to maybe pay back a year's worth of salary because they didn't follow the rules in terms of reappointing him.
	Well, payback means that we have lawsuits that are going to come against these people for malicious fraud.
	And that needs to go to the pharmaceutical companies, but also needs to go to the physicians and to the hospitals, especially because these hospitals are big corporations as well, aren't they?
	Oh, for sure. And, you know, another cause of action, speaking to that, is one of the attorneys got very creative and listed a cause of action as practicing medicine's license because the administration is telling the doctor what the doctor has to do.
	So the doctor is no longer practicing medicine.
	So many of our interviews, he'll flat out say, you know, my hands are tied.
	This is our protocol.
	I have to use this.
	The hospital says so.
	Well, the hospital administrators aren't doctors.
	That's right. And the pharmacies aren't doctors.
	And they're telling the doctors what they have to use and what they can't use.
	And that is practicing medicine without license.
	You know, they're not allowing doctors to be doctors anymore.
	That's right. And, you know, unfortunately, so many doctors are going along with it for job security or I'm worried about losing their license, which they are doing.
	But we have just an army of brave doctors that have come out and fought for medical freedom and treated patients correctly and saved lives, like Dr.
	Witcher, who's running for governor of Mississippi.
	We need to get him in the office because we've got to change this leadership.
	We've got to tear down these agencies and rebuild them.
	And get these corrupt politicians and corrupt agencies out, or we're going to lose this country.
	That's right. Yeah, you had...
	With what happened in your family, and it's your stepfather that died, right?
	And your mom was nearly killed by this.
	Is that correct? That's Charlene.
	She's our New Jersey state chair.
	Oh, okay. She's one of our... Yeah.
	She has a horrific story.
	I mean, they're all horrific.
	But she's...
	You know, all...
	Some of us came forward to tell their stories and then they were like, how can we get involved?
	How can we help? They're grieving so hard, but they're fighting just as hard.
	And when we started our task force, we wanted to put the real strong fighters in a state chair position.
	And Charlene in New Jersey was that person.
	And man, they have organized and they've got the billboard up.
	And now we're starting to use that billboard campaign across the country.
	We also have this commandment campaign that people put, I don't know if you can see them, to wake people up.
	COVID hospital deaths, question mark, may not be from COVID. Because a lot of people don't even know that they didn't die from COVID. They died from this protocol.
	Yeah. So we need everybody to wake up and...
	Maybe they didn't die from COVID. And then they contact us.
	We can look at their medical records.
	We have an amazing new medical record review system.
	The task force members who lost his 33-year-old pregnant wife to the protocol has built, coded himself, and it's called the RIP system, RIP, rest in peace, but it also stands for Records Investigation Platform.
	And we can help people understand that COVID didn't kill these people, that the hospital protocol did.
	That's right. And we build those numbers up, and then we have a fighting chance.
	But we have to raise awareness is a big part of this.
	The cell boards, the magnets.
	We also have these amazing...
	I haven't taken mine off in four months.
	It's a medical alert bracelet.
	And it says, I'm allergic to remdesivir and fentanyl and barcetanib.
	The three main drugs they use to kill you in the hospital.
	Because it's not enough just to go to the hospital and say, I don't want these things.
	They'll still give it to you. But if you say...
	If you're wearing something that says, I'm allergic to it, that's a medical legal directive.
	Wow. And one of the attorneys came up with this idea.
	I think we've sent out close to 4,000 of them across the country.
	Boy, everybody should get one of those.
	Everybody, because you're stopping the protocol yourself, plus you're saving lives, and it's funding the Gilead state to stop Remdesivir.
	So it's just...
	Well, that's great. So you've got a database of cases.
	You've got, and people can find that at chbmp.org.
	You have the medical alert bracelet.
	That is amazing.
	Everybody needs to get that. And you've got magnetic signs.
	And let's talk about this billboard project here, because that's something that you put up in New Jersey.
	And so give us an idea of the status of that and what your plans are for that as well.
	Yeah, so the New Jersey team came up with this idea.
	One of the brothers of a victim there funded the first one and sponsored the first one.
	It's a digital billboard.
	It's in a very high traffic area.
	It says the same thing as our magnet.
	So people could read it fast and say, oh, maybe they didn't die from COVID and contact us and we can educate them.
	And now we're looking at to do it in every state.
	You know, different people can sponsor businesses or individuals, but we just...
	A big part of winning this is getting people to understand what happened.
	It's a hard psychological barrier to cross.
	My government's lying to me.
	My doctors are lying to me.
	Everyone's lying to me. And a lot of people just don't want to believe it or can't.
	Especially the older generation, they're just like, you know, doctors are the heroes.
	Well, I hate to break it to people, but you've been lied to.
	Most people have been betrayed when it comes to this.
	They had an agenda. And I, you know, I can put my tinfoil hat on and tell you it's depopulation, in my opinion, because it is, especially with the vaccines.
	They're either going to get you with the vaccines or they're going to get you with the protocol.
	They're going to try to get you.
	I agree. And we don't win this unless we educate the general public and give them the strength and the support to accept what's happened.
	And come forward and help us fight it because the time for the straddling defense is over.
	We have to pick a side. They're coming after our kids.
	They're coming after everybody.
	And they literally...
	Want to depopulate us, and they literally are going to do it any way they can through these, you know, manipulation of this medical tyranny is what I call it.
	I agree. So the boards, the magnets, the bracelets, any way you can.
	The websites. We also have a project called We the People 50, which we're going state to state to get the jabs pulled, recalled, because we've learned recently from four independent labs that are contaminated.
	So you could even be pro-vaccine, but are you pro-contaminated vaccine?
	Nobody wants contaminants in their products, right?
	Or you look at how effective it is.
	I mean, you know, they've had the active ingredients that varied from 3 to 100.
	I think it's micrograms or whatever.
	But, you know, whatever the unit is, it's varied by a factor of 33.
	Pretty amazing, you know, the fact they got no quality control.
	There's been no testing, no verification of any of this stuff.
	We don't know about its safety or its efficacy, and yet, you know, now we're getting a pretty good idea of all this stuff.
	So that's another key thing.
	That's what I've been saying. It's not enough just to stop pushing this stuff.
	You've got to have these things withdrawn from the market.
	So I'm really glad to hear about that.
	We the People 50 is your project.
	Yep, and we're going through the AG's office or the County Commission.
	Through their consumer product protection statutes.
	Because just like contaminated baby food or contaminated dog food, they need to be recalled out of the consumer stream.
	Well, the Consumer Protection Agency and the federal government is now focused on airsoft rifles.
	They've got to get rid of those. Not these jabs.
	And we've told the CDC and FDA they're contaminated.
	Our scientists and doctors have, but they're not listening, so we had to take it to the people.
	Yes. Good. Absolutely.
	That's great. I love what you're doing.
	Let's talk a little bit about former feds, because you talk about, here it says on your mission statement, To restore America and the Western world to those conditions existing and considered normal prior to the emergence of the pandemic crisis and unconstitutional mandates that accompanied it.
	I could not agree with that more, and you've got some great bullet points if people want to go.
	And again, the website is formerfedsgroup.org.
	Formerfedsgroup.org. And I'm assuming that if people go there, they're going to find these other projects as well, like the We the People 50 and the chbmp.org.
	There's going to be links to those as well, right?
	Yeah, there's links to those.
	Go ahead. Sorry.
	We were founded in 2016 and we mostly did humanitarian projects around the world, several in Vietnam.
	But when the pandemic came out and we saw the literal crimes against humanity and the destruction of our Bill of Rights, we've changed our entire focus to focus on Mm-hmm.
	you know all of our rights have just first amendment second amendment you know 14 they're all going away i mean our founder represented january 6 political prisoners who were literally in solitary confinement for over two years without being convicted of a crime because he would not take a vaccine an experimental vaccine wow that's north korea level yeah it is you know and it's what
	Because there's this merger of corporations and governments where the government is going to push you to take that corporation's product.
	And we see that in China.
	That's been one of the key aspects of the Chinese communists, is this kind of economic fascism that they have.
	But I see the primary objectives, and you now focus these primary objectives onto what's happened with the climate crisis.
	COVID and as well as the climate, I call them MacGuffins because they're just basically whatever they want to tell people to push them always to the same endgame solution.
	But you talk about the FDA death protocol.
	These are your primary objectives, and you've got seven of those.
	And then you've got some secondary objectives.
	And I was interested to see that in the secondary objectives, the very first one that you talk about is civil forfeiture abuses.
	This is something I've been talking about for decades, and I can't get people to talk about it.
	We had Megyn Kelly when she was at NBC at the time.
	She came to interview some of us at the news organization I was working at, and she said, when she interviewed me, I said something about civil asset forfeiture, and she stopped and said, what's that?
	She had no idea.
	She's a lawyer.
	She's, you know, Megyn Kelly doesn't know what civil asset for it.
	We got a big communication problem here because, you know, people just are not talking about it.
	So I'm glad to see that that's number one on your secondary objectives.
	Your key things are the thing that has really been attacking us, this COVID pandemic and all the rest of the stuff.
	You've also got stuff there about anti-human trafficking efforts.
	But, yeah, talk a little bit about some of the secondary objectives that are there.
	You know, all of this stuff is all related.
	It's just to destroy our country, to take away our rights, to turn us into a slave state.
	You know, Rosa Corey wrote a great book about the Agenda 21, Agenda for the 21st Century, the UN. It fits right perfectly in there, and she talks about civil forgery and how they want control over everything, land, water, air.
	Behind the green mask.
	Behind the green mask. Great book.
	She's no longer living, ironically, either at 50 years old, but you can speculate on that.
	But she was a Democrat that came out and blew the whistle on all this because she was an expert witness in civil land forfeiture in California and in the domain.
	And she saw this very early on and she started warning people.
	And that's a really good book.
	I encourage your viewers to read it.
	But it's all about restoring our bill of rights.
	It's all about restoring our freedoms and bringing back our country to where we have small government and choice over our own bodies and our own decisions.
	And they are doing everything they can to Do that and turn us into a socialist, communist country.
	Whether it's medical freedom or education choice or your property, they're going to hit us.
	This is a very well thought out plan and it's been going on a long time.
	It has. And I remember you talk about Rosa Corey.
	She was early on in this, and she got awakened to this because of what was happening locally.
	And she realized that there was this tactic that was being put out by the Rain Corporation.
	I'm trying to remember what it was.
	But I talked to her at the time, and she was telling people, this is what they do.
	Delphi technique is what it was.
	So the Rand Corporation had this Delphi technique where they'd come and say, we want to do some things in your local community that's going to help you to be green and to preserve the environment and be environmentally friendly and things like that.
	And they would separate you up into different groups.
	The person who's running the group and the other people that were there were in on it.
	And they would essentially direct the conversation and do it in a way.
	This is what the Delphi technique was about.
	do it in a way to make people think that they had been a part of this consensus solution when they were completely being manipulated by the leader of that group and the other people in it.
	And that was at the time when this was still in – people would say, oh, that's just a conspiracy theory.
	There's no evidence that that's happening and so forth.
	And they were calling it Agenda 21.
	Sometime in the 21st agenda we're going to get everybody out of the rural and suburban areas and pack them into these super cities and so forth.
	And now, though, they have made it very, very clear.
	They've got a crystal clear time deadline and they've got a crystal clear agenda with 15-minute cities and all the rest of the stuff.
	They've now gone public with it.
	And time is really getting short because we're only about six and a half years away from when they want to have their new dystopian society in.
	So that's why it's very key what you're doing.
	And I can't thank you enough for what you're doing.
	I think you've got exactly the right things that need to be done.
	Publicizing this with billboards, setting up a cold case database stuff that's there.
	And you understand the big picture.
	We've got to get these vaccines out, and we've got to roll back all of these regulations that have been left behind for their new normal.
	They put these things in.
	They've gone kind of quiet on it, but they are going to bring them back, and they're going to bring them back on steroids and directed from the World Health Organization on a global level.
	They're going to be the ones, instead of Fauci, telling us to lock it down the next time.
	It's pretty amazing. People have got to understand this.
	Yeah. Yeah, I think this was just trial run, you know, to trial run, you know, where this isn't stopping.
	So we have to stop.
	We have to stop it. We have to realize that they're not doing this for our safety.
	They're not doing this because they care.
	They're doing this because they want control over us.
	And people need to take control of their own health care, do their own research, have the confidence to stand up against doctors, challenge them, ask questions.
	Ask them if they support the vaccine.
	If they do, then say thanks, have a nice day, and walk out.
	Find another doctor. I grew up thinking that what the doctor says, you follow those rules, you follow what he says, but that's not the case anymore.
	That's right. These doctors and stuff have been compromised, or they are complicit, or they are asleep.
	And they trust the system.
	Some of them trust the system so much.
	I've watched doctors harm themselves because they trust the system so inordinate.
	They don't question anything.
	This is not science. It's not even real medicine.
	If you're just going to do whatever the drug company tells you to take.
	One of the things I think is so important, again, the magnetic sign that you've got in your billboard.
	Are you sure that they died of COVID type thing?
	That is one of the key things.
	And even that was financially incentivized, Carolyn.
	They had a bonus to families from the federal government.
	If they said, your loved one died of COVID, it's like, well, no, but that's, you know, don't question it.
	We've got money here for you.
	And I'm not saying the people were, you know, saying, oh, okay, well, I'm not going to question it.
	I'll just take the money for the burial.
	But it is the sort of thing where just kind of subtly go, well, I guess it's the case.
	I wasn't there, and they're offering me this money.
	They just subtly bought their way into everything with this.
	So it's this uncertainty, the propaganda, the censorship to make sure that individuals are not going to be able to share information about this.
	Because, you know, as you pointed out, you're a political blogger.
	Nobody's going to listen to you. But With social media, if they had not shut down social media and people start sharing their stories, people will start putting two and two together and getting four instead of the five that they want us to get.
	And so they had to shut that down as a key part of that.
	The censorship was a key part of that as well because you don't have to have...
	A medical degree to see the fraud.
	It's critical thinking and it's the collective intelligence of the group.
	And that's what they had to do was to shut down the communication and the intelligence, the collective intelligence of everybody out there.
	Well, this is what I'm saying.
	Yeah, I'm seeing the same thing too. Everybody thinks it's just an isolated incident with them.
	And they're uncertain. And everybody feels isolated.
	Yeah. Yeah. And you want to go along with the group to make you not feel that way.
	And if the group of people that you're talking to are all, you know, brainwashed or sheep, then that's you're just going to follow that.
	People really have got to learn to start thinking for themselves that we've gotten lazy.
	You know, you think you can't do your own research because you're not a doctor.
	You don't understand it.
	I taught myself in, you know, a little while how to read a medical reporter or a medical study.
	So, you know.
	It's just, it takes effort, but people don't want to, they just want to be told, you know, take this, you're fine, you know, but it's not the case, and you have no one else to blame if you don't, if you just blindly believe people right now, because propaganda is real, and it's heavy. That's right.
	You know, even Agenda 21, they've changed the name four or five times to keep people confused.
	When that went to Agenda 2030, now it's sustainable development, now it's smart growth, you know, just to keep you.
	And they package it up to make it look like, oh, it's good.
	It's about fresh water and clean air and, you know, renewable resources.
	It's not about that at all.
	That's how they package it.
	But it's about moving us all into these city centers, control, green, everything.
	And I read the document.
	Even Larry Fink, the CEO of BlackRock, as I just were talking about earlier today, he says, we've got to stop using ESG.
	People hate, you know.
	And so they constantly have to, as soon as you figure out, oh, that's what they're talking about.
	They have to constantly keep changing the labels for all this stuff to keep us guessing as to what they're really up to.
	But it doesn't take too long to figure this out.
	But we don't have too long. They're accelerating all this stuff.
	And so that's a key thing.
	I can't thank you enough for doing this.
	And just to let people know, former Feds Group Freedom Foundation is a 501c3 corporation, so you can help to support them as they try to get the vaccines stopped in different places.
	And this has really been a sticking point with me and several other people.
	The fact that I know...
	You had VaccineImpact.com was talking about how we had three deaths in a previous flu vaccine thing decades ago, and that caused nine states to ban the vaccine.
	Now, why can't we?
	We got way more than that that have been validated with this.
	Why can't we stop that? So We the People 50 is about that.
	I really like that medical alert bracelet that you got.
	That's genius. But the key thing is to get people to question this entire narrative, the safety of the vaccine, the legal measures that were done, but also the idea that people who were in the hospitals were actually dying of COVID. They were being murdered by financial incentive, medical malpractice.
	Absolutely. Well, thank you so much, Carolyn.
	It's great talking to you, and I can't thank you enough for this.
	It's very important work. That cold case database that you guys are putting together, that's also very important.
	Thank you so much for joining us.
	Thank you so much for having me on.
	Well, thank you. We're going to be right back, folks.
	Stay with us.
	We're going to take a quick break, and we'll be coming right back.
	We'll be right back.
	We'll be right back.
	All right, welcome back. And we do have Jack Lawson on the line now.
	Again, Jack Lawson's books, CivilDefenseManual.com.
	That's where you can find these, Volumes 1 and 2.
	He only sells it in book format and he only sells them together because you've got to get the full picture.
	And he wants to make sure that if you have to use them, you will be able to use them.
	Because if you don't have internet or you don't have your computer up and operating, you'll still have the book that's there.
	Thank you for joining us, Jack.
	Good to talk to you again. It's always good to listen to you.
	Voice of sanity in a world of insanity.
	Well, it got pretty crazy last week when we started seeing this civil war in Russia.
	And of course, the consequences of that, they just keep pushing, pushing, pushing.
	And you wonder if somebody there, like Putin, is going to freak out and push a button and start a nuclear war.
	So that's why I wanted to get you on.
	I thought it was a great idea for us to talk about that because you have so many different chapters in these two volumes here talking about all kinds of things.
	I was just talking about How they want to ban food, for example.
	He talks about how we can save food and make sure you've got water for emergencies and other things.
	But also, you know, there's things there like preparing for a nuclear attack.
	And you've drawn on the expertise of a lot of individual contributors as well as your own experience.
	And you've had considerable experience as a soldier and in survival situations.
	But let's talk a little bit about the nuclear aspect and what individuals can do about that if something like that happens.
	Well, first, David, I'd like to say that I doubt any button being pushed is going to come from Vladimir Putin.
	I often have thought of P.T. Barnum and Barnum and Bailey Circus.
	I suppose the guy had nightmares that the clowns were going to take over the circus.
	But that's in essence what I think we have.
	We have a bunch of people that are detached.
	From the reality of what is going on, I think they have pushed and pushed.
	And I'm not supporting Putin.
	I'm just not supporting the woke people on the other side.
	That's right. Well, you've kind of got a little bit of a Bay of Pigs type of situation because Putin has now put some nuclear weapons in Belarus.
	And then Lindsey Graham and I think it was Blumenthal was with him.
	They come out and say, well, you know, just understand that if you try to use these in any way, shape, or form, it's going to be a big response from us.
	I mean, as you point out, they're the ones as likely as anything else to escalate this because they've been escalating this since the 1990s.
	They've been escalating this conflict.
	People have to understand one thing that, well, this is a complex issue, surviving nuclear wars.
	Quite simple, actually, but our nuclear arsenal is somewhere up around 60 years old.
	The Russians, Chinese, and I believe the North Koreans...
	Maybe Pakistan and France have been doing testing and perfecting the nuclear weapons.
	One thing that is clear to me now is that This is a real oxymoron, but they've actually...
	The other side, Russia, China, not so much North Korea, but Russia and China have created kind of a green bomb, if you want to say it.
	It's an environmentally friendly nuclear weapon.
	When I was in and went to nuclear weapons school, we had...
	It wasn't described then as a dirty bomb.
	It was described then as a nuclear weapon.
	But 60 years later, the weapons that I used to...
	I was putting nuclear arming packages on these things.
	I'd sit on top of these things...
	We had all this expensive scaffolding, but the bottom line was I had a sergeant down below handing me stuff, and this missile I worked on was six foot off the floor.
	So rather than assemble all of this expensive framework, we'd put a ladder up and sit on top of the bomb, and I would have to put the arming package on and take the arming package off.
	I'm getting a picture, Jack, as you talk about this, a Dr.
	Strangelove for you. Yeah, I've often thought of that.
	Only the missile wasn't going anyplace when I was sitting on it.
	I didn't have a cowboy hat either, like some people said.
	Yeah, it's a beautiful thing.
	It's epoxy-coated, rounded edge, about the size of a 30-gallon drum.
	There's a couple different kinds of them.
	I'm not going to go into that. What I want to get into is how people survive this if there is an exchange with what they have in their house.
	But the long and short of the thing is nuclear weapons, there's enough.
	When I went to school, it was under the MAD doctrine, the Mutual Assured Destruction.
	I don't know who comes up with these terms.
	They must have people sitting in an insane asylum someplace coming up with these terms.
	But it's a very accurate term.
	If they ever have a full exchange, it'll literally incinerate and remove us from the planet.
	But that's the big boom.
	People misunderstand what would happen during a nuclear exchange.
	And both sides have been talking about this.
	This is what bothers me.
	I think we're actually further ahead on the probability chart than we were during the Cuban crisis.
	Yes. We had a president that was, to me, is probably one of the last president Good ones, even though he was a Democrat.
	And hell, I was a Democrat back then, so I don't know.
	You know, it came to my senses, but...
	The nuclear exchange will be preceded by something called the EMP, that's Electromagnetic Pulse Event.
	It's also known in the military as the HEMP, High Altitude Electromagnetic Pulse Event.
	This is a 150-mile above the Earth, roughly, explosion that will cast gamma rays out of That will destroy every semiconductor that people have.
	Whether it's an LED flashlight.
	And there's caveats to all this.
	But the bottom line is our entire electrical grid and our entire communication system will go down.
	That is important to understand.
	People will... Literally hear a deafening silence.
	There will be nothing that's run by computers is going to be operating.
	Your cell phone might work, but the cell towers will not work.
	So that will be precise.
	There will probably be six, twelve of these set off over the industrialized Western world, and especially America.
	And what this will do...
	In the hopes of the enemy is destroy our ability to respond.
	Yeah. On a military basis, everything's GPS, everything is, you know, satellite guidance systems, all the weapon systems function off of this.
	So what you're going to have is not only the military capability destroyed, the Russians, after...
	The Russian Soviet Empire went down.
	We had atomic energy people over there, military people, concerned about their nuclear weapons falling into the wrong hands.
	And in the process of inventorying and talking to the Russian scientists, the standard of 50,000 volts per square meter was totally upset because the Russians said we've developed and have EMP nuclear weapons and this is a blast in the sky you won't hear it you won't taste it you won't smell it you won't feel it
	you may possibly see some sparking along the ground but this will take out everything that is electronic and we are heavily dependent on that Manufacturing and the ability for us to manufacture for the military is going to go out the window.
	That's preceding a nuclear attack.
	Then, I really don't believe that the Russians, I don't know about the Chinese, are going to target anything but military centers or manufacturing centers.
	And they know where every one of these is to this point.
	To the literal within a meter of what their GPS tells them.
	So the long and shorter thing is you'll have an EMP and then you may have You may just have an EMP, but you may have attacks on military, some political centers, and manufacturing centers.
	I don't think they're going to be out to just kill the average American person.
	Yeah, but of course, taking down the power grid, and that's one of the things that's worrying about North Korea, you know, you don't have to...
	Yeah. Close only counts in horseshoes and nuclear war, right?
	Except that you don't even have to be as close when you've got an EMP. You know, if you have a situation like North Korea, I guess it's one of the reasons why it's so worrying when they shoot a rocket up over Japan.
	You know, is this going to be an EMP thing or what are they going to do with this?
	And, you know, if they were able to do something like that, that would be a nice plausible deniability for China.
	Well, it wasn't us. It was North Korea that would do that.
	But whoever does it, or if it is done, that is something that is going to have very lasting effects as well, because some of the things that they're going to take out are going to be giant transformers as part of the grid that are very, very difficult to replace.
	There's only a couple of places in the world that make these things, and they have a very, very long lead time for manufacturing.
	And, of course, if this was a broader response and they took out the factories in Germany where they make these things, they forget about it happening for a very long time.
	So you basically wipe out the infrastructure to a large degree, and then you don't even have the tools really to rebuild it, because that's been taken away from you as well.
	So this could be something that would happen.
	An EMP strike would be devastating, perhaps as devastating as if there was an actual nuclear bomb that landed, because now all of society has been bombed back into the Stone Ages, and people are going to start starving, right?
	It's a good description, the Stone Age, because that's just about what it would be.
	Water systems won't run.
	Transportation and distribution of food, that's going to stop.
	It would be, I don't even like to think about the nightmare that that turned into.
	The Common Man The Common Man They created common core to dumb down our children.
	They created common past to track and control us.
	Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
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