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May 29, 2023 - The David Knight Show

03:04:37

The David Knight Show Rebroadcast - 05/29/2023

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	Transcription by CastingWords
	Using free speech to free minds - You're listening to The David Knight Show.
	The David Knight Show
	The David Knight Show
	Thank you. Right, and joining us now, our guest is, if I'm pronouncing his name correctly, Charles Van Vick.
	Is that correct? Did I say your name correctly?
	That's very close, David.
	Thank you very much. Charles Van Vick.
	Thank you. Okay, that's as close as I'm going to get.
	I'll spell it out for people because your website...
	It's C-H-A-R-L-V-A-N-W-Y-K dot info.
	That's correct. It might be easier for people to find you if they look at the title of your books, because that's pretty easy to remember.
	Shooting Back was your first book.
	You've now got a new book, Reloaded.
	Is it Reloaded, Shooting Back, or...
	Yes, Reloaded, and the subtitle is Shooting Back Again.
	Okay, so Shooting Back and then Reloaded, and then the subtitle Shooting Back Again.
	And let's talk about this because the subtitle to your first book, Shooting Back, was about the right and duty of self-defense.
	Spoiler alert, after he went through this struggle, as I mentioned before, They played a key role in the St.
	James Massacre in terms of protecting about a thousand lives.
	So let's talk a little bit about your concern about it as a Christian missionary.
	Tell people, because you wrote this book long before we had any church shootings in the U.S., and now we've had several, I'm afraid.
	And so you were trying to warn Americans about what was coming.
	Take us back to...
	Before the St. James Massacre and what you were thinking as a Christian, what you went through in the process.
	Yes, David, it was quite strange because I'd been in the military in South Africa.
	All white men at the time during the apartheid days needed to do national service, and that included two years in the military.
	And I could understand theologically and biblically how...
	A man could defend his homeland and defend his family from that sort of perspective.
	But I really question the idea of carrying a gun in civilian streets and supporting yourself if somebody was trying to attack your family.
	Strange enough as it is, that was an issue for me.
	And let's talk about that because, you know, that really is the point of attack on the Second Amendment here in the United States.
	It's like, well, you know, the military can do it to defend the country and defend innocent lives because they've got the imprimatur of the government, but you as an individual shouldn't be allowed to do that.
	We see that all the time, even about the teachers in the schools.
	So you were there where we are right now in this debate, and what did you decide about that?
	Yes, so I really struggled with this issue, and then I read an article by Larry Pratt, who was the executive director at the time of Gun Owners of America, and he basically laid down a biblical foundation for Christian men arming themselves to protect their families, and as I said, in Civilian Street.
	So I thought it was an excellent article, really changed my mind on these issues, and then very soon after that, Wow.
	Wow. And I managed to do a U-turn and get away there as quickly as possible, drove to a police station to tell them what had happened, to report the issue.
	But then I decided straight after that incident that, you know, I was unmarried at the time, but I thought, I'm going to get a firearm now, and if anybody threatens to kill myself or my friends and my family in the future, I'm going to defend us with lethal force.
	So that's very much how it panned out.
	Did the police say, well, they were mostly peaceful, right?
	That's right. I understand.
	There's this argument that, you know, in fact, I had somebody previously on an interview in America saying to me, we can trust our politicians so we can give firepower to the state, but, you know, in Africa you can't.
	So I don't know how that's panning out.
	I don't know how that's panning out for you.
	Yeah, I don't really trust politicians to protect us.
	Of course, even people who are well-intentioned and who would risk their life to save other people, you know, they're heroes, but there's not always a hero around, right?
	So you have to act in self-defense.
	Talk a little bit about the challenges that you had as a Christian and what Larry Pratt was saying in terms of convincing people, because I've had a lot of Christians who have pushed back and say, no, you know, I can't do anything even in self-defense to harm somebody else.
	What was it that Larry Pratt said that convinced you?
	Larry Pratt quoted quite a lot of scripture.
	I'll quote that too.
	Exodus 22 verses 2 to 3.
	If a thief is found breaking in and is struck so that he dies, there shall be no blood guilt for him.
	But if a sun has risen on him, there shall be blood guilt for him.
	In other words, talking about a life-threatening situation, if you take a person's life when they're threatening your life, it's dark, you can't see them, you don't know what they're doing in your house, then there's no blood on your hands for that.
	But if it's broad daylight, you can see somebody's just stealing a loaf of bread, then you don't take their life for that.
	And then he also quoted Jesus Christ in Luke 22, saying, So Jesus Christ speaking to his disciples, telling them to purchase the greatest military weapon at their time.
	And, you know, some people argue that, you know, the Apostle Peter pulled out his sword and he took off Malchus' ear, one of the soldiers of the high priest, And if we look at that scripture, we see that Jesus actually tells him to put it back in its place.
	He doesn't tell him to get rid of the sword, because he had told him to buy swords.
	So, Larry did a really good job of taking one through these ideas in scripture.
	There are many more, obviously. But, you know, it would just be a very basic one.
	You shall not murder. We're not allowed to take a judicially innocent life.
	But straight after God gave that command, He sent out His people to go wipe out other nations.
	And so the whole idea is that there are times when a Christian might need to kill, but you don't take a judicially innocent life.
	In other words, we don't murder people.
	And so these are ideas that Larry was talking about, which I felt very refreshing, very encouraging, and it really changed my mind on this whole issue.
	I agree, yeah. I've often wondered if Peter had an open or concealed carry permit from the Roman government for his sword.
	What do you think? Well, some theologians that have written about this, you know, saying that the disciples were young people, they were teenagers, carrying the finest weapon of their time.
	And apparently, from what I could gather, it was actually illegal for them to be doing it under Roman supervision or Roman control.
	They weren't allowed to just have swords.
	So it seems like Jesus was doing something very disruptive at the time.
	Yeah, that's right. Yeah, the Roman Empire was in many ways a lot freer than the American Empire.
	They certainly didn't have biometric surveillance at the very least.
	It's interesting to see how things have devolved and centralized.
	But yeah, I think that even beyond those, my opinion, even beyond those excellent examples that you gave, I think it runs throughout the Bible, both Old and New Testament, that we are to defend innocent life.
	God is defined as the defender of widows and father to the fatherless and all the rest of the stuff, and that doesn't mean just helping them financially.
	That means literally defending people when you need to do that.
	And No, it speaks out constantly about injustice and, of course, people who are swift to shed blood, but we have a right and a duty, I believe.
	That's the subtitle of your book, Shooting Back, A Right and a Duty of Self-Defense.
	What year did that book come out?
	Oh, that's a difficult question.
	I think it's a good 15 years ago already, so it's quite a while back.
	So it's pretty old already.
	But David, I have to agree with you.
	You know, in 1 Timothy 5, verse 8, we can read, But if anyone does not provide for his relatives, and especially for members of his household, he has denied the faith, and he's worse than an unbeliever.
	And provision...
	It's obviously also the security.
	It's not just food. It's not just clothing.
	You also need to provide for the security of your family.
	So, yes, the book's quite old already, and the second book has come out, and Lord willing, I'm hoping to have a third book out for the commemoration, the 30-year commemoration, which is happening on the 25th of July this year.
	So, we'll see how that pans out.
	That's good. Yeah. As we're talking about this, I also think about Jesus.
	He says... If a thief is not going to enter in a home and start stealing stuff unless he ties up the strongman first.
	In other words, you're going to defend your family.
	Certainly, he's just talking about theft.
	We're talking about a physical violent threat to people.
	And when you did this, and this is the key thing, We had not had any shootings, I believe, in the U.S. Maybe there had been one, I don't know, but it wasn't a thing when your book came out.
	You were warning people.
	I remember the first time I saw the book was on WND's website, and you were talking about that this is coming to America, and it now has come to America.
	We've seen, unfortunately, several incidences of this, and we've seen that these incidents only stop I think?
	Sure, David. That was on the 25th of July, 1993, so it's just almost 30 years ago that that happened.
	Do you want me to give some detail about that right now?
	Yes, yes. Let's go into it.
	Tell as much about it as you want, kind of set it up, what was happening and everything.
	Great. So we were sitting in a church service in Cape Town, South Africa, when all of a sudden there was a noise at the front door of the church, and a terrorist stepped into the church.
	And as soon as I saw them come in and I saw their rifles, I thought that a play was taking place in the church.
	I had a young girl that was working for me at the time in the insurance industry, and she was a youth leader at the church.
	And she told me they were going to do a play for the youth, and they were going to have people dressed up as soldiers or as policemen.
	And they would take away the church youth leaders and accuse them of spreading the gospel when they weren't allowed to be doing that.
	So I had that experience.
	Wow. And they opened up fire with their automatic rifles, and they lob grenades into the congregation.
	So you can just imagine everybody got down as low as they possibly could onto the floor, trying to hide behind the benches, and they were, strangely enough, very, very quiet.
	And I realized only when the grenades were blowing up and the rounds were hitting the wooden benches and splinters were flying up into the air...
	I realized this is not a show.
	It's not an act. It's not a play.
	This is the real thing.
	And so I had a 38 special revolver, five shot revolver with me, sitting fourth row from the back of the church.
	The church is a very large auditorium, could sit about one seat, about one and a half thousand people.
	There weren't that many that night.
	It was a cold winter's night in Cape Town in the middle of July, which is our wintertime in the Southern Hemisphere.
	And I just took my 38th Special, took it out of the holster, which is on my ankle, And I knelt behind the benches.
	It was very much like a cinema, the church.
	It was very high at the back and low to a stage in the front.
	And I could kneel behind the bench and take two shots at the attackers at the front door of the church.
	I then realized that I was far too far away from them.
	Anybody that's listening or watching might know that the 38 Special...
	A snub-nosed revolver is not for shooting across a thousand people when you're in the fourth row from the back of an auditorium.
	So, David, I had to get down on my hands and knees and I leopard crawl.
	We call it leopard crawl. I don't know what you call it in America.
	You're on all fours and you get down as low as possible.
	And I leopard crawl to the side, to the aisle.
	And I ran out the back door of the church and the idea was to come in behind the attackers and shoot them in the back at close range to stop the carnage.
	And as I ran down the back stairs and I was about to round the corner, I realized then that they'd already left the church.
	So what I didn't know then was that one of my rounds had hit one of the attackers inside the church and so they ran back to their getaway car.
	So I came around the corner, I saw them and I jumped back behind the corner because one of them was standing at the back door of the getaway car and he had his rifle on his hip.
	Looking at the door they had come out from.
	So one of them had been hit.
	They ran out.
	They thought that maybe I'd become running after them through that door and he would have lowered his rifle and just blown me away.
	But I was behind him.
	So I took another three shots from stepping out from behind the wall and they jumped in the vehicle and drove off.
	And what came out afterwards at the Truth and Reconciliation Commission, which was a government...
	Thank you.
	This random person threw what we call a petrol bomb at them, which is petrol or gas inside a bottle which you light with a rag in it, and you throw it.
	And this thing exploded, and this car drove off as quick as possible.
	So, you know, all these strange stories start coming out later.
	Wow. Somebody's just driving around their car with what we call a Molotov cocktail.
	Wow. And they threw that at them?
	Yes, that's right. Yeah, that's it.
	Imagine that. You park outside a church, the next thing somebody starts shooting at you and throws a Molotov cocktail at your car.
	Anyway, so they drove off very quickly.
	Now, that happened in 1993.
	And then five years later, you know, the communists take over and in order to, because there's a lot of atrocities going back and forth on both sides, and so to try to shut everything down, I guess, or whatever, however you want to interpret these committees.
	They had these Truth and Reconciliation Commission where they would offer people amnesty for any crimes that they had done if they would talk about it from their perspective.
	And that's when you found out a lot of the stuff that was happening, some of it that you mentioned.
	I mean, what all did they say in the Truth and Reconciliation Commission?
	What was their motive in doing this?
	They had various motives.
	They argued mostly that they were under command and they were just obeying orders.
	But one of the young men argued that the white people that came to Africa stole the land, and so he didn't have a problem with Killing them in churches Because they came with their Bible And that's one of the stories that we hear in Africa You know,
	the white man arrived with his Bible And he gave Bibles to the local Africans And he stole their land while he gave them the Bible So this is an old story A story that's been going around in South Africa and probably other parts of Africa as well.
	So he was justified in his own mind.
	Reparations. What we call here reparations.
	That's why they're trying to build up now with, you know, the...
	The 1619 Project and all the rest of the stuff is a sense of entitlement, a sense that you are okay to take vengeance on people because of this injustice that happened centuries ago.
	So now you can take it out on people today.
	That's really what they're trying to build up here.
	So that's another element of this that we really haven't seen that much.
	We've seen a little bit of this.
	We just had a lady...
	Decided that she was going to steal something like $1,000 worth of food, and she defiantly said, this is my reparation.
	It didn't go down too well for her.
	But the day is coming when there's going to be violence, and they're going to feel completely justified in doing it because the government and the schools have been telling them this line for a very long time.
	And so that's what one of them said.
	What did some of the others say? Well, they were arguing that they didn't even know it was going to be a church, that they were under commanders who commanded them, and they just carried out and did what they were told.
	So some of them argued right up to the point of, until they arrived at the church, they didn't even know it was a church that they were going to attack, never mind the fact that the church was multiracial.
	So there were these sorts of arguments.
	They admitted to the fact that they murdered the people, which they did.
	There were 11 murdered and over 50 that were injured.
	And some struggled with it.
	I know the one chap that I actually hit with one of my rounds, he told me that he apologized to some of the survivors afterwards and That took place behind closed doors.
	And as he said to me, he said, this is politics.
	So you play one game in front of people or the cameras and then something else happens behind closed doors.
	So I wasn't involved in that, but that's apparently what happened.
	But a couple of the other interesting things that happened in the church was there was one young man with the name of Gerard Harker.
	He was 21 at the time and he fell on top of a hand grenade and took a full body blow to himself to protect the people around him and unfortunately his younger brother, 13 year old younger brother also died in the attack and Then there was another youngster, 17-year-old boy, Richard O'Keele, who had two young girls, Lisa and Bonnie.
	I'm actually friends with Lisa.
	And they all went down onto the ground.
	And Bonnie, who was so surprised, she sat up or stood up to see what was going on with the whole attack.
	And she didn't She was so shocked she didn't know what to do with herself.
	So Richard went up on his haunches and he pulled her down.
	And as he pulled young Bonnie down onto the ground, a bullet hit him in the back of the head while he was trying to save her life.
	And we also had a ministry to Russian sailors at the time.
	And one of them, with the name of Dmitry Makagon, was 23.
	He was traveling around the Cape on a large ocean liner ship, for want of a better word.
	And the ministry leaders at our church would fetch these Russian soldiers and bring them through to come and hear the gospel being preached.
	And so a bunch of them were in our church that evening.
	And one of them, Dmitry, had a hand grenade land on his lap and it blew off both his legs and one arm.
	But he survived?
	He survived.
	He survived that and the church brought his fiancée over from Russia and they actually ended with a fairy tale story by getting married in that church later.
	So there's some really interesting things that happened under those circumstances.
	Now, were you a member of that church, or were you just kind of visiting that church?
	Did you know these people, or were you just visiting that church?
	No, I wasn't a member, as in signed-up member, but I went to all the Sunday evening services, so I was a regular attendee, let's say that.
	I only joined as a member later, the denomination.
	They said at the time, I believe, that they thought there were multiple people shooting at them, and didn't they pick that church because they thought that it would be a soft target?
	That's correct. In fact, the leader, the commander of the attackers, said on a television interview with me, or no, sorry, it was a newspaper interview, and he said, this was a terrorist attack in the true sense of what terrorism is about.
	It was to instill fear in the whites in South Africa.
	And so he was very clear about it.
	And then he went further. He introduced me to a friend of his at Parliament, And he said, this is Charles von Beek who defended the people at the St.
	James Church massacre. And there we thought the church was a gun-free zone.
	But boy, did he have a surprise for us.
	So, I mean, to say it straight from the horse's mouth, he didn't mince his words.
	He didn't try to pretend it was something that it wasn't.
	He was very open about it.
	Wow. Wow.
	You know, when I look at this, it makes me think of David and Goliath.
	You know, he didn't have a sword.
	He had a slingshot with some stones.
	He had five of them.
	I think it was... Goliath had some brothers there.
	God can do amazing things, and certainly when we look at this and the way that God used you, you can see God's providence and care for a lot of people.
	I know a lot of people died. It was 11 people who were killed, 58 who were wounded, but it could have been many, many more And God used you and confounded them with just the things that you were ordinarily doing.
	You know, well, I can't hit them from here, even though you had.
	And you crawl around the side and take some more shots.
	They think they're under fire from multiple people.
	It truly is amazing to see how God used you to protect those people.
	Yeah, it was actually a real honor because, you know, under the circumstances, you know, I had one interviewer once ask me, were you scared?
	I said, of course I was scared.
	So he said, well, I would have piddled in the pew.
	But, you know, the idea is that...
	When you have these circumstances, I had been trained in the Defence Force for the two years that I spoke about earlier.
	So we've been trained how to deal with chaos around us, grenades going off, lots of gun noise.
	And so I don't want to say, you know, once...
	Train to keep your cool, to be able to think clearly under those circumstances and to react appropriately.
	So by God's grace, I'd forced to be trained in that banner.
	And so, you know, you just did what your muscle memory and was trained to do.
	It was John Wayne who said, you know, courage is being scared but saddling up anyway, you know, and that's basically what you did.
	That's right. You know, if you're not scared, you don't really have good situational awareness about what's going on.
	So, scared is one thing, but, you know, having the courage to take it on is another thing instead of just hiding.
	I was just going to say, we've seen that even with some police who have shown up.
	Unfortunately, some of these school shootings like Uvalde, Texas, they showed up, there's a massive number of police, and they all were there with their stuff.
	They refused to go in and do anything about it.
	Finally, Some officers from, I can't remember what it was, is it Border Patrol or something like that?
	SWAT team guys showed up.
	But I mean, they were there for so long doing nothing that you had parents who heard about it who went to the school and went into the school and got their kids out While this shooter hostage situation was still there.
	And so there was plenty of time for them to do something about it, but they didn't do it.
	So it's not just sometimes a response time for people to get there, but it's whether or not they're going to put their life at risk to try to protect other people.
	And that is a courageous thing to do.
	That is something that you did.
	So what was your message in general?
	Tell us a little bit about your first book, and then we'll talk about Reloaded.
	Shooting back, what did you want to get across to people?
	Was it really about the fact they had a right and a duty or how to do it, the necessity to do it?
	What was your core reason for writing that book?
	The book was written, David, to Christian men.
	So the idea was to give them the biblical theological basis to own a firearm.
	And a firearm is just an instrument.
	So the idea is actually to defend the family.
	Whether you're going to use a baseball bat or a firearm is really irrelevant.
	The issue is, are you going to protect your family or not?
	So I want you to give Christian men a biblical basis to protect their families and to take it further and say to them, this is not just a right, you know, a God-given right.
	But this is something you have to do.
	You have to protect your family.
	You actually don't have a choice as a godly man.
	So it's a right, but you also have a duty, a God-given duty to provide for your family, and that includes the security of your family.
	And we've...
	I've seen all over Africa, gun-free zones are the most horrendous places.
	We've seen 700,000 people murdered in Rwanda that was a gun-free zone.
	I've done mission work or I do mission work in the Democratic Republic of the Congo, which wasn't democratic or republic, although things are getting much better now.
	But, you know, I've had my colleagues over there, they've had colleagues, pastors that have been buried alive by rebel soldiers.
	And I said to them, Why didn't the deacons pull out their firearms and say to the rebels, go ahead, make our day?
	And he said, well, we were completely disarmed.
	I said, well, who disarmed you?
	Was their law passed in parliament?
	He said, no, it doesn't work like that in the Congo.
	The president just sends the army in and they just go door to door and they just disarm everybody.
	That's the way it's done. Wow.
	And I said to him, you know, I showed him that if there were godly Christian men around with firearms, they could have stopped the pastor from being buried alive by their soldiers.
	And the accusation against the pastor by the rebel soldiers was that the prayers of the saints, the prayers of the church, were so powerful that it was changing the war in a negative direction against them.
	Now, I don't know about you, but I've never been accused of changing a wall by my prayers.
	But, you know, these guys are really hardcore prayer warriors, and the way the soldiers want to deal with them was to kill them and bury them alive.
	That's a pretty good commendation.
	I've heard some really amazing stories in third-world countries like that of things that have happened when people are praying.
	But that is a pretty good commendation.
	A horrible way to die, certainly.
	And of course, this is in 1993.
	Earlier today, I was talking about Waco, and it was three months after Waco had happened, and everybody was still kicking that stuff around.
	So the St. James Church Massacre really didn't get that much attention here in America at the time, because we were looking at the aftermath of what happened with Waco just a couple months earlier.
	Tell us a little bit, where are you now?
	Are you still in South Africa?
	Are you in the U.S.? Where do you live now?
	Yes, I'm in Cape Town, South Africa, so I still live here.
	My family's been here since the late 1600s, so we born and bred Africans, and probably going to stay here for a very long time until the Lord takes me home, as they say.
	Yeah. Tell us what it's like now.
	What has it been like?
	Because I know there's a lot of issues with the taking the farmers land, the white farmers, and a lot of concern about that.
	I've talked to some people several times in the past who are living there.
	Incredible amount of violence being done to white farmers.
	So what is it now that they've had the truth and reconciliation and everything is just all, you know, flowers and roses for everybody, right?
	Or is it? No, well, that is not as it is.
	It's absolutely chaotic here, David.
	There's pandemonium.
	Things are falling to pieces.
	But I just want to add quickly about not being in America, not visiting.
	Unfortunately, your government is protecting you still in America, not allowing us who are unvaccinated to visit yet.
	I know. No international guests are allowed to visit America.
	So you've been very well protected from the rest of us in Africa.
	It's amazing. I talked about this last week when, you know, they theoretically took off this emergency order.
	It's like, okay, so then can the people in the UK were saying, so now can we, people, those of us who are unvaccinated, can we now go to America?
	It's like, no. That's the major cause.
	Well, I often say to people in the rest of Africa, you know, we in South Africa are following you.
	We will look like you very soon.
	So maybe in America you're going to be looking like South Africa soon.
	But let me give you just a bit of background to your question.
	We've been plagued with just Loads and loads of crises since Nelson Mandela's communist cadres have taken over the country.
	We have the murder of the pre-born, which Nelson Mandela introduced into South Africa.
	We have massive, massive unemployment, up to 50 and 60 percent in certain age groups.
	The poverty is devastating.
	We have insufficient electricity capacity in our country.
	In fact, in the next 30 minutes, our electricity will be going off in the area we're in at the moment, in this church building.
	We have contaminated water supplies.
	Sewer failures are happening.
	Disastrous public hospitals.
	We have rampant crime, as you've just mentioned.
	So there's literally, the society is literally crumbling around us.
	The Mandela government that took over, they didn't just fail to maintain what they inherited.
	They actually caused major regression.
	And so we're going backwards in South Africa.
	Our real GDP has been shrinking since 2014.
	And we're about 10% poorer than we were in 2014 right now.
	18 million people, one third of our population...
	It's living below the poverty line.
	Malnutrition is common.
	We're plagued with the crime, looting, vandalism, and it's chaotic out there.
	In fact, two of my children have just flown off to Europe to go work there, and we're ecstatic about it.
	It's Praise the Lord.
	They've got jobs, and second of all, they're living in a society where they don't have to be concerned about leaving their home.
	And even at our home, my one son went running on a field one day, and he was attacked there.
	We've had a grocery store that's been attacked down the road.
	I've had an elderly neighbor who saw burglars in our house, and they tried to run over with their getaway car.
	Another neighbor was murdered.
	I can carry on and on.
	Another one The farmers, you know, they have a campaign of terrorism to try to drive them off of the farms, and they're even more isolated than you are in the suburbs.
	I've just heard horrific stories about what is happening to the farmers.
	Yeah, you're 100%, Dave.
	Let me tell you a little bit about the farmers.
	The main challenge with the farm murders is the severity of the torture that takes place that accompanies these attacks.
	And it is horrendous.
	I'm talking about burning their victims with blow torches, using clothing irons and putting it on their bodies, and burning women's breasts with clothing irons, pouring boiling kettle water onto people, onto their bodies, slitting their throats.
	Drilling a hole through their skulls with an electric drill.
	Wow. That most of the people walk free.
	They don't even get caught and no justice is meted out.
	And of course, even though apartheid was covered from front cover to back cover by the press all the time, before Nelson Mandela got in, after this beloved Marxist took over and these things started happening, complete silence here in America about all of this stuff that is happening.
	I'm absolutely amazed and appalled whenever I talk to somebody from South Africa and we talk about how society has been deliberately destroyed there.
	And we see a little bit of, you know, kind of a leading edge of this in a lot of the big democratically controlled cities with Soros appointed district attorneys where there is no punishment for people.
	They're encouraged in a sense to get violent, but that's just the very, very beginning of You are living through, what if we don't stop this and the big cities will become commonplace here in the U.S.? And what I think that they really want to do in terms of reparations, I think that's where they want to take all this stuff.
	You said abortion, as we call it, the murder of children, that was made legal.
	It was illegal before the Marxists took over?
	Well, they had it in the special cases, but it's not just the Marxists.
	It's Nelson Mandela personally forced this through Parliament.
	So we don't have a democratic system in the sense of Western democracy the way you think about it.
	We elect a party.
	And on the percentage of the vote that they get, that party gets that percentage of seats in Parliament.
	And the party leaders appoint people to sit in those seats.
	So if any of the people that they've appointed as Members of Parliament in their seat...
	Wow.
	Wow. And, you know, try not to do it and we'll see what happens because he controlled the seats.
	And so apparently the Catholics in the party didn't go to Parliament on that day and they were fined for not being there, but they didn't lose their seats.
	And the rest followed, they towed the line.
	They did what they were told.
	They didn't want to lose all the money they were making.
	I mean, the country's poor, everything's going down the drain, and they're getting fat salaries and living it up and driving nice cars and got government housing with electricity that works.
	So, yeah, very difficult circumstances for us with that kind of parliamentary system, but that's the way it stands at the moment.
	You know, it is...
	To give you an idea of just how ignorant America is about what is happening there, when you had the indictment of Donald Trump, Marjorie Taylor Greene, who was a big Trump supporter and a Republican, goes to New York, and in an overview she says she compares him to Nelson Mandela.
	I thought, this is a conservative Republican who is absolutely clueless about what she's talking about.
	She might as well compare him to Che Guevara or something, right?
	Perhaps Che Guevara might have been able to do the things that Nelson Mandela did, but he is celebrated as a hero by people outside of South Africa, on both the left and the right, and it is profoundly ignorant for these people to be held up that way.
	You also created a civilian gun rights group as well, didn't you?
	Yes, I was involved with a group that we established called Gun Owners of South Africa, and they are running full steam ahead.
	I've spent much more time in my ministry, traveling to different countries, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Zambia, Congo, Cameroon, doing mission work.
	So I was part of the instigators to get the organization up and running, and we've got some really, really good people that are running it at the moment, and they're doing an absolutely wonderful job Let's call it to preserve our privilege in South Africa to own a firearm.
	It's not a right according to our constitution.
	Even although it's a God-given right, our constitution creators think they could override God on this matter.
	Well, even though ours is recognized in the Declaration of Independence as a God-given right and also in the Second Amendment, we have politicians who believe that it is a privilege that should be taken away on every occasion, and those are people in both parties who believe that.
	Tell us a little bit about the second book, Reloaded, and didn't that just come out recently?
	Yes, it's actually a few years old already, but I'll give you a bit of a background to that.
	I was at a course that we were running, a Christian mission course, and I had to go into town, away from the place we were staying at, to go and prepare a radio show.
	And I had a former terrorist.
	In fact, he was a former unit commander of the group that attacked our church in 1993 at the St.
	James Massacre. And he had come to faith in Christ.
	And he said to me, please, could you drop me off in Kaya Litra, which is a very large, we call it a black township at the time, a very large area of grouping of people.
	There's probably one and a half million to two million people staying in the area.
	And he asked me if I could drop him off there.
	And I said, sure, jump in the car.
	I'll go drop you off, no problem.
	And as I dropped him off in Kailitsha, I got out of the vehicle as a pickup.
	And we have like a canopy, a fiberglass canopy that you build over the back of your pickup.
	And so he was sitting in the flat bed of that with a canopy over.
	And he was shouting to me as I did a U-turn, telling me where I need to park.
	So I parked the car to drop him off, and I got out of the car to open up the canopy so that he could get out and grab his bags.
	And the next thing, there were two people standing behind me.
	I could sense them. And as I turned around, I saw these two characters.
	They both had guns. The one wasn't...
	I couldn't see his firearm at the time, and the other one had his gun in his hand, and he wasn't pointing it directly at me.
	It was just off slightly to the side of me, and he said, I want your gun, I want your cell phone, and I want your wallet.
	Very specific about what he wanted.
	Could he see your gun?
	No, no. He just assumed that you had it, right?
	So it looked like I'd been taken into a difficult situation there by the person in the back of the vehicle, and these people seemed to have been waiting there for me.
	So it appeared to be an ambush.
	So I lied to him.
	I said I had no gun, and I handed over my wallet to my cell phone, and their body searched me.
	I kid you not, David, their body searched me, and they didn't go down low enough to see my firearm in my ankle holster.
	Wow. And so they were convinced that either I or my passenger was armed.
	And so after body searching me multiple times, they left me and they went to harass my elderly person that was with me in the car.
	He was sitting alone in the car at the time while I was out in the front of the single cab, Bucky, we call it a pickup truck.
	And they started bothering him and their body searching him and they asked for his phone.
	He said, I don't have one. They asked for cash.
	He said, I don't have any. I'm going to do a radio show now.
	I'm not carrying cash and money and things with me.
	They said, give us your gun.
	He said, I don't have a gun.
	And so these two attackers, both with their guns in their hands now, were looking in the car, opening up the cabinets in the car, searching everywhere, body searching him.
	And this gave me time to then pull out my gun.
	And I went below the car window so they couldn't see me and I went to the front of the car and I shouted at them to distract them from bothering my elderly passenger and I opened up fire at them.
	And they were really good.
	They were running in a zigzag fashion to get away from me.
	So they were well trained.
	They knew exactly what they were doing.
	But to my surprise, this is a shanty town where I dropped them off.
	And the next thing, they had had a sentry standing around amongst the metal housing there, and he opened up fire at me.
	So they had a sentry protecting them.
	So this was a fully organized...
	A crime that was taking place right over there.
	So I had to duck and avoid bullets that were coming straight from me from a distance between the housing, the little metal housing there, and jumped in the vehicle and we drove off and went to a police station to report the incident.
	So that's why the second book is called Reloaded, And then shooting back again.
	It's not the first time it happened again.
	So that's the background to the writing of the second book.
	Wow. And you said you thought that maybe it was an ambush.
	The elderly passenger you had there, who is now a Christian, he wasn't a part of that, was he?
	Or do you think, perhaps?
	No, not at all. Not the old passenger that was with me that they were body searching, not him.
	Only the person in the flatbed at the back.
	So the person who asked me to please drop him off in the area, he's the one that did that.
	Oh, I got you. There were two passengers.
	I didn't catch that. So there's one in the back.
	The guy in the back was the one that was...
	That's right. He's the one shouting, telling me where to park and that sort of thing.
	So that's what happened there.
	But one of the interesting stories, if you don't mind, I'd just like to tell you one of the quick stories about a farm attack that I mention in my book.
	It's actually a lady in South Africa called Silke Kaiser.
	She mentions this in her book about farm murder.
	She's a polygraphist.
	And so she goes to the farms and interviews the farm laborers and that after a farm murder or a farm attack has taken place, But she tells the story of a man with the name of John, a farmer, him and his wife living on a farm alone.
	He gets up 3 o'clock in the morning to attend his chickens every morning, and he takes two staff members with him in to go deal with chickens in the morning.
	He doesn't carry his gun in the morning.
	He thought if anybody wants to steal chickens or eggs, they can take it.
	He's not going to kill somebody over a chicken or an egg.
	Mm-hmm. So off they go into the chicken coops and the next thing him and his two staff members are accosted by four gunmen.
	They take the two farm workers and they tie them up and two of the attackers remain there with the two victims and the other two take John into the farmhouse, into the kitchen and they tell John to call his wife Elise.
	So he shouts her name.
	She's still busy sleeping in bed.
	And he wakes her up.
	And they're an Afrikaans-speaking farming couple.
	But he used an English word.
	He called her Lavi.
	And what everybody didn't know was that Lavi was a pre-agreed password for alerting their spouse to there being trouble on the farm.
	So here the two bad guys are with a farmer in the middle, they're both on his side, they're both standing with guns, and they step into the passage and stand by what we call in South Africa the rape gate.
	So many of us have security gates inside our homes.
	Wow.
	that closes off our bedrooms from the rest of the house.
	In other words, if people break into our lounge and they steal our TV, they can take it at night, but we don't want them to come into our bedrooms and accost our family.
	So he and these criminals were standing by the rape gate, and Lovey, Elise, comes out of the bedroom.
	She's armed, and they were expecting her to give in straight away when she would see the guns being pointed at her husband.
	But what they didn't know that Elise was an expert shot for She had grown up with guns.
	She had grown up with guns. And not just that, she'd worked for a shooting range for 15 years.
	She trained other people how to shoot.
	So she emerges from the bedroom carrying a loaded firearm.
	She takes a shot at the first perpetrator and hits him twice in the chest.
	Both bullets just narrowly miss his heart.
	Then she moved the gun slightly to the right and she shot the second thug in the head and killed him instantly.
	Wow. So the first thug tried to run out, trying to breathe.
	His lungs were damaged by the bullets.
	He got out of the door and they found his corpse later under a bush outside.
	So the one attacker had already committed two other farm attacks.
	He hadn't murdered anybody yet, but his specialty was torturing his victims.
	And so they obviously cleaned up that evening, and the other two accomplices that had held the farm workers down, they fled the scene very cleverly.
	So this is one of the attacks that didn't work out for the bad guys.
	And praise God, That these were not pacifist Christian farmers who believed that they would make the environment safer for the bad guys to operate.
	Praise God that Elise was ready and armed and that she could shoot straight.
	Yes. Well, that is an amazing story.
	You're there in South Africa.
	You said you're going to be there the rest of your life.
	I understand because I've talked to other people who said, nope, we're staying.
	We're not leaving. But what is the hope that you have?
	How do you see this happening?
	I mean, are you in a mutual community of self-defense and you know that you're under siege by this large majority?
	Is there ever Is there a hope or a plan that you're somehow going to restore some kind of an ordered republic there and a rational government that's going to keep peace and order?
	What is it that you see in the future there?
	Yes, I believe strongly in that the gospel of the kingdom of God is what changes hearts and minds of people.
	And if I didn't believe that, I wouldn't be a Christian missionary.
	So I've seen that happen in nations.
	I've seen people that have come to faith in Christ.
	They've submitted not just their personal lives, it's affected their family lives, it's affected their churches, it's affected their businesses, and it's affected their countries.
	And we've seen nations changing because of people turning to God and obeying His word and His law.
	And I believe that that will happen in the future.
	Maybe in the next generation.
	Maybe I won't see it.
	But there's a scripture in the Bible that says that the earth will be filled With a knowledge of the glory of the Lord as the waters cover the sea.
	So I think we're fighting a winning battle.
	We're not going to give up.
	We're going to carry on. And if the only thing I do is be a splinter in the fingers of the bad guys, then I'm happy to carry on doing that as we preach the gospel and disciple the nations.
	That's a great witness.
	And, you know, it's great to hear that.
	You have such confidence, and it is well-placed confidence in the power of the gospel to not just change individual lives, but to completely reorder society.
	And we have seen that throughout history.
	And so it is so good to hear somebody who is living their faith and knows that they have the only power that is going to be there to transform society.
	That's great to hear. I interviewed someone who was now doing the work here in America, and it was in Zimbabwe where there was a farmer who...
	He said there were three different ways that people could do it.
	They could run away. They could fight.
	He said the people who fought died for the most part, trying to resist the takeover of the Marxists in Zimbabwe.
	He said though he lost his farm, he taught them how to farm.
	And as part of that, he used that as an opportunity to give them the gospel and to change lives in the community.
	And what you're doing is exactly the same thing.
	Sorry? We're busy building a mission base in Zimbabwe right now in an area called Gwai River.
	It is very difficult. The people are really poor.
	They're struggling for their lives.
	And Zimbabwe is moving towards an election this year.
	And so things get really dangerous now.
	So if American listeners can please pray for Zimbabwe, we'd really appreciate that.
	Sure. Absolutely. Do you have a missionary site that you'd like to tell people about?
	Yes, my website, or shall I say my blog you can get to is shootingbackbook.com.
	Shootingbackbook.com. You'll get to my blog there and you can purchase the books from there and that sort of thing.
	And then as you spelled out my name earlier, it's a bit complicated, but you're able to find your way around if you get my name at the blog.
	Okay, good. So it is shootingbackbook.com.
	Is that correct? That's correct.
	That's correct, David. Thank you.
	All right. And I'll put that in the interview there.
	I'll have a link to that. That's a lot easier than your name is for people.
	I was somehow able to find you on that website.
	It had been years since we had talked.
	And, of course, I guess people can find your book on Amazon, but it'd be better to go directly to you because Amazon takes a big kick, and we don't like the things that Amazon does with all the money that they do is the key thing about that.
	Yeah, I think... I think they're going to be taken to Amazon anyway through my site.
	Okay. All right.
	So shootingbackbook.com will take you there.
	And again, the missionary group, is there a website that you want to tell people about with that?
	Yeah, they'll get to my mission work also from the same site.
	So it's charlvanwick.info, not pronounced that way, but the way it's spelled, charlvanwick.info, and then shootingback.com, and they'll be able to find my ministry and about my books on those sites.
	Well, it is always a pleasure to talk to you.
	It truly is amazing where God has put you and the way that he is using you.
	And you are an example to so many people.
	And also, a warning, a harbinger to what may be coming to this country if we're going to allow the radical Marxists to use race as a weapon.
	We know that in America, this has been the tactic that they have found more effective.
	It was Bill Ayers and the Weather Underground who said at the very beginning when they were trying to create a Marxist communist revolution here in America and they were bombing buildings and doing other things like that.
	They realized that it wasn't going to happen on by dividing people economically into different economic classes in America, but they could do it by dividing people racially.
	And so they stopped bombing buildings and they went into education.
	And now the white skin privilege that they were setting there has now become one of the fundamental things.
	But it is also everything that we see happening throughout the educational system.
	It is a plan to take everything down.
	It is great always again to talk to you, Charlotte.
	And thank you so much for coming on and telling us about that.
	Again, the book is shoot.
	You'll find the website with a book links to the book as well as to the missions there.
	If you want to help them in Zimbabwe, shootingbackbook.com.
	And I know that you're going to have a big, you've already had a big impact on a lot of people's lives.
	David, thank you very much.
	And eternal things are going to happen as well.
	Thank you so much, Charles. David, it's been a privilege being on your show.
	Keep up the good work, and thank you very much for having me.
	Thank you. Thank you. All right, folks, that is the show for today.
	That is quite a testimony, quite a life that Cheryl has had, and it is an inspiration to us as well as a warning to us that we have both a right and a duty to protect ourselves and innocent people.
	Thank you for listening. Thank you.
	Thank you.
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	It's the David Knight Show.
	All right.
	Welcome back.
	Our guest is Glenn K. Beaton.
	He was a token conservative, says, of the Aspen Times.
	He was a columnist there for seven years before being fired by email.
	One Christmas Eve, because of their dismay, he had become the most popular columnist in the 140-year history of the newspaper.
	His column often generated more clicks than front-page news.
	Since then, he's taken a show on the road.
	He has nearly a million readers of his blog at theaspenbeat.com.
	He's practiced law at the Supreme Court.
	He's been an aerospace engineer for Boeing.
	He's worked as a roustabout in an oil field.
	A lot of different things.
	He's an accomplished amateur mountaineer.
	He's summited the Eiger as well as a Matterhorn.
	There you go up the Eiger.
	Watch out for that guy that's limping.
	He could be coming for you.
	And a full member of the Mountain Rescue of Aspen, Colorado.
	And, of course, Aspen is a place that has always fascinated us, the wealth, the celebrity, the beauty of the place.
	But he's going to tell us what is happening there.
	Thank you for joining us, Glenn.
	Good morning, David. Good to be here.
	It is interesting to look at it.
	And, you know, when I look at your book here, and of course the book I should mention is High Attitude.
	Attitude, not altitude. High Attitude, the liberal takeover of Aspen.
	It just came out April the 18th.
	So you'll be able to find that book.
	But he says it's ugly truth about Aspen and other resorts and what the rest of America should avoid.
	And I think that when I look at this, and you talk about the wealth effect and the stratification that is happening there, it does look to me like what they have planned for everybody, this concentration of wealth in 2030.
	Talk a little bit about what is happening there in terms of the wealth effect.
	Well, Aspen has really gone crazy in the real estate department especially.
	You know, the price of housing now is somewhere between $3,000 and $6,000 a square foot.
	It's not at all unusual to see slopeside mansions going for literally $100 million.
	So you have the billionaires have sort of driven out the millionaires.
	Mere millionaires can't really afford Aspen very well.
	Unless there's a sizable group of people.
	In fact, it's 45% of the voters in Aspen are in taxpayer-subsidized housing.
	So this subsidized housing is really extreme.
	It's not just mildly subsidized.
	You get a place that's worth probably $2 to $4, maybe $5 or $6 million for a dime on the dollar.
	I lived next door to one of these projects for several years.
	It was almost slope side.
	The real fair market value was probably five or six million dollars.
	And I looked up to see what they had paid for it.
	They'd paid like two hundred ninety two hundred seventy thousand dollars.
	So there's this huge polarization there between the billionaires and the I say ordinary Joes that are in the subsidized housing.
	Now, I have to mention that the subsidized housing Ordinary Joes aren't exactly Budweiser light drinkers.
	They're even today's Budweiser light drinkers, if there are any left.
	The income cutoff for getting into the taxpayer subsidized housing is $300,000.
	And the net wealth cutoff is a million dollars.
	So they're literally putting millionaires with up to $300,000 income into taxpayer-subsidized housing that they get for dimes on the dollar.
	Wow. Now, you might wonder, how do you get this gig?
	Yeah, that's my question. Yeah, what do you have to be to get that, and who do you have to please?
	Right. Well, basically, the truth of it is you have to be an insider.
	They say that it's all determined by lottery and that you have to be working in Pitkin County, the county that includes Aspen.
	But in fact, the insiders, the politicians, the newspaper editors, the employees of Aspen Skiing Company seem to win a lot of these lotteries.
	I'm not saying the fixes in.
	I'll just say that these people are very lucky, it seems.
	So that's how you get in.
	And now they have 45% of the city in there.
	So you have these sort of moderately, I can't even call them low-income people.
	As I say, they're up to $300,000 a year with a million dollars net worth.
	Yeah.
	Yeah. The ones that are getting the subsidy think that they ought not have a $3 million house that they bought for $300,000.
	They ought to have a $7 million house that they buy for $100,000.
	You know, once you start giving people free money, once they're on the dole, they're never satisfied.
	They want more of it.
	That's right. And, you know, we've seen this type of thing happening in New York and San Francisco and other places like that.
	Aspen is one of the most extreme examples of this.
	And I think it is the direction that we're going.
	You say, when you talk about the wealth effect, you say the problems of Aspen are not due to poverty, they're due to wealth.
	You know, we all aspire to having more money, and yet it's this concentration of wealth, isn't it?
	Isn't that ironic? It seems like the more material assets the culture has, the worse it has in moral assets and ethical assets.
	But that's what's happened up in Aspen.
	You know, there's no accountability because there's endless taxpayer money.
	The people with a $100 million sloped side mansion, you can imagine what their property taxes are.
	And they use virtually nothing in services because they're only out there three weeks a year and their kids are going to school in the New York prep schools.
	So it's all free money to the politicians and they spend it, spend it, spend it.
	There's no accountability. You know, maybe we need to have that recession that the Fed keeps promising us.
	I don't think that's going to affect them, though.
	You know, I've heard it described as, just in general, what has happened with America in terms of our prosperity.
	You know, prosperity is a good thing.
	But it seems like I heard somebody say, once the love of money is the root of all evil.
	And I think we love it so much it becomes kind of a disease.
	I've heard it called affluenza.
	And it's this concentration.
	You know, I grew up in Tampa when Tampa was not a big area.
	And it was, you know, a very...
	It's a suburban place.
	It's changed quite a bit from when I grew up there.
	And my wife was from New York, just outside of New York City.
	And I would go up there, and that was where I first saw that kind of concentration.
	And it seemed like you had the people who were unbelievably rich, and everybody else was just trying to scrape by.
	And it was so alien to me.
	I'd never seen anything like that before.
	But now that is happening everywhere, and I think that is really what they're trying to set up in every community with these cities.
	Yeah, you know, I don't really have a lot of sympathy for the billionaires, but I think I sympathize with the billionaires more than I do the people on the housing dole.
	At least the billionaires arguably earned their money.
	These people on the housing dole just never have enough.
	They want free money. You give them free money.
	They want some more free money to justify the free money that they already got.
	It's kind of ironic, their argument.
	They don't realize the inherent contradiction in it.
	But they say that the reason that they're not rich is because they're not greedy.
	And so they need to take money from the people who are greedy, who are rich, because they're morally superior to them because they're not greedy, and so they deserve more money.
	Yeah, it's like a hate crime.
	I know your motivation. I know what you're really thinking, and I deserve to take this from you because you're evil, and I'm not.
	Talk a little bit about the celebrity aspects of it, because that's the other aspect of Aspen that's covered in your book.
	And there's been some amazing incidents with some celebrities.
	You mentioned Hunter S. Thompson.
	Talk about that. Well, Hunter S. Thompson moved to Aspen like in the late 60s.
	He was one of the ones who came early on.
	And he came just about when Aspen was going to pot.
	I say that in all senses of the word.
	And it went to stuff worse than pot after his arrival.
	He was a character. I'll give him that.
	I don't think he was a particularly good writer.
	And I go into that a little bit in my book.
	But he was legitimately a character.
	He ran for sheriff of Pitkin County at one point.
	He actually won the popular vote in Aspen City Limits, but he lost countywide.
	So that gives you a sense.
	And, of course, he wanted to legalize drugs, except that he wanted to put in stockades anybody who was selling bad drugs.
	So he was after the traffickers, but not the users.
	It wasn't clear from his analysis how the users were supposed to get their drugs if he criminalized the traffickers.
	But anyway, that was his shtick.
	I guess it's like Supreme Court Justice who says, I don't know how to define pornography, but I'll know it when I see it.
	I guess he knew that about bad drugs, right?
	Yeah, right. Thompson ultimately killed himself in a way that was not very classy.
	He was not fooling around.
	He got his gun out in the kitchen, and while his daughter and son-in-law were in the next room, he blew his brains out.
	When he was on the telephone talking to his wife, So they didn't find his body right away because when they heard the gunshot, they thought it was just another liquor bottle hitting the floor, which apparently happened with some frequency in their kitchen.
	But ultimately, well, I should say, you know, in 10 or 15 minutes, they wander in there and they found him without his brains.
	For his funeral, Johnny Depp handled the funeral.
	At Hunter's request.
	So for his funeral, there were all these celebrities, you know, John Kerry, the list goes on, the typical woke crowd.
	For the finale of the funeral, he had his cremated ashes shot up in the air by a cannon to spread over the ground below.
	He was a character, kind of a jerk.
	Kind of like SpaceX in Port Isabel.
	Yeah. Except not as much fireworks, right?
	Yeah, and then there's all the other celebrities.
	You know, the list goes on and on.
	Charlie Sheen got arrested for beating up on his girlfriend, or was she a wife at the time?
	Whatever, it's all the same.
	But he got arrested for that.
	When he was either stoned or drunk or high or some combination of those things, he ultimately had to serve 30 days in jail, but he was already credited for time served, so he served virtually no time in jail.
	And he was ordered to go to anger management therapy for another 30 days, which, as I said in my book, I suspect just pissed him off.
	Yeah. That's funny.
	Of course, there's also a connection to Ted Bundy there that you mentioned in the book.
	Oh, yeah.
	Ted Bundy, about halfway through his killing spree, which is to say he killed maybe 15 or so women, he shows up in Aspen.
	And he kills a woman after doing what he did and throws her in the ditch for bear food and flees the state.
	So years or two later, the investigators were putting together dots.
	Bundy, in the meantime, had been arrested in Utah and he was serving time.
	No, he wasn't serving time.
	He was incarcerated. He was jailed temporarily in Utah awaiting trial.
	And they put together some dots and decided that he was a suspect in that case, in the Aspen case.
	So they extradited him from Utah back to Aspen, and he was put in jail.
	But he was given library privileges.
	Well, you can imagine what happened with his library privileges.
	The library, they didn't bother to lock.
	So here they have this accused murderer with library privileges in an unlocked library.
	Well, I guess maybe the door was locked, but the window wasn't.
	And Bundy was an enterprising enough individual that he was able to crawl out the window.
	Gee, who would have thought? So he crawls out the window, and he resumes his killing spree.
	He ultimately confessed to this crime just before he was executed down in Florida.
	How many more people did he kill after he got out of the...
	Another 15 or 20.
	Wow. Another 15 or 20.
	Wow, that's amazing. Yeah, he was a very intelligent person.
	I use him as an example many times.
	I say, you know, we look at people and we can't imagine how evil they are.
	And he's one of the best examples.
	Very intelligent, very, you know, great personality from what it all said in terms of the way he could come across people.
	Nobody can imagine somebody could be a monster like that.
	Yeah, he was a charmer.
	You know, that was part of his M.O. He charmed people, and that's why they got in the car with him.
	Also, the Kennedys, they have a presence there in Aspen, right?
	Tell us a little bit about that. Well, the Kennedys go way back to JFK, but more after that, after he was gone with Jackie Kennedy and then the sons.
	Jackie Kennedy was a pretty good skier.
	She cut quite a striking figure on the slope.
	The sons and grandsons and nieces and nephews and so on were a little bit less striking.
	A couple stories are told.
	One of them is purely factual, Michael Kennedy.
	Was engaged in some hijinks skiing.
	So he was skiing down Aspen Mountain.
	And the Kennedys and their friends were reckless skiers, basically.
	He was playing football on skis.
	So, you know, one of them would ski ahead and the other would throw a football to him.
	Aspen Ski Patrol asked them to stop this game.
	It was obvious that they were doing this.
	They did it all the time.
	So they were sort of notorious for this.
	So Aspen Ski Patrol asked them to stop playing this game.
	But they didn't revoke their lift tickets.
	They didn't give them any warnings, anything like that.
	The Ski Patrol tends to look the other way when it comes to these sorts of shenanigans by celebrities.
	So they resume their game.
	And so Michael goes out for a pass, as they say.
	He turns around. So he's skiing backward and looking to catch the ball.
	Well, he skis right off the slope into a tree.
	No helmet. He was probably dead before he hit the ground.
	Wow. So, fortunately, he didn't ski into another skier, or we could have had two dead people.
	Yeah, that is Sonny Bono.
	When Sonny went off the slopes and hit a tree, was he in Aspen?
	No, he was somewhere in California.
	I want to say Tahoe, but no, maybe he was in Mammoth.
	But no, it was not in Aspen or Colorado.
	Wow. Yeah, I had a regular listener who was sending me stuff about Aspen going back into January of 2021.
	And he was talking about how bad the lockdowns were there.
	And he said, we've got two classes of people.
	We've got billionaires and slaves.
	And I'm assuming that the slaves are not the people there with $300,000 income and a million dollar net worth.
	I mean, the people who have that kind of money and that kind of net worth are not waiting tables and...
	Serving pizza, right?
	So what happens to the people who are the slave class?
	Where do they live? Well, a lot of them are in this taxpayer-subsidized housing for, you know, dimes on the dollar, and they want to make it pennies on the dollar.
	A number of others come from what we call up here Down Valley, in other words, down the Roaring Fork River outside of Aspen, sometimes as much as an hour commute.
	They complain about that.
	The typical commute is more like a half hour.
	They complain about that, though, saying that this proves the need for more taxpayer-subsidized housing within city limits, which, by the way, costs about $1.5 million per unit because they don't like the commute.
	I can't help but put that together with the commute of the average American.
	I looked that up. The commute of the average American is about 30 minutes, and you don't get to go through the beautifully scenic, boring Fort Valley.
	You're likely to be on the Jersey Turnpike or something.
	I know. I had a half-hour commute.
	Actually, I had an hour commute when I was in Texas, but I could turn it into a half-hour early morning when I was going there.
	But yeah, it was not beautiful.
	I've been to Aspen. I've visited there.
	I just drove through to look at it.
	It is a beautiful place.
	And of course, things were pretty tough there in January 2021, weren't they?
	What my listener was sending me, they were talking about how you had to pass your PCR test and all the rest of the stuff, even to get into the area, even more so than you would at other ski resorts.
	Well, there's an interesting story about that, too, involving Candace Owens, the conservative commentator.
	She came to Aspen during the height of that, and she's sort of a mask skeptic, but she decided, well, you know, I'm going to Aspen, and that's the rule.
	I'll follow the rule, even though I think this is all kind of baloney.
	So, you know, I'll mask up, and I'll get the advanced tests, too, which they were requiring at the time.
	So she goes to the local tester.
	This was before at-home tests, so you had to go down to a clinic or somewhere and get the test.
	She goes down there to get the test, gives them her name.
	They look her up and realize who she is.
	She's this conservative, happens to be black, political commentator, and they refuse to give her the test because they say they don't like her politics.
	Really? They even said it out loud?
	Wow. Yeah. Yeah, they said it was in emails.
	And so they initially sort of disputed this, and so she produced the emails, and the emails were clear as a bell.
	They showed that they were going to refuse to administer the test because they didn't like her politics, particularly on this masking issue.
	The irony to this is...
	Here they are endangering the community under their own standards, which say you have to get tested and wear the mask and so on, to drive home some sort of political point with somebody who's skeptical about that.
	But that's the way they are.
	They're willing to endanger the greater population in order to drive home a point against an individual that they don't like.
	Now, you're working in this environment and, you know, you're taking them on, as you said, the token conservative there.
	I mentioned things got pretty rough between you and them.
	Tell us a little bit about that. What was that like to be in that kind of an environment where they refuse to give you a test because they don't like your politics and you're writing columns there in that town?
	What was that like? Well, they wouldn't have hired me if they'd known how well it would go.
	So they hired me to be their token conservative.
	I was supposed to be kind of like...
	What are they? The Washington Generals against the Harlem Globetrotters.
	Remember how the Harlem Globetrotters just had this bogus team whose job was to lose every game, and they succeeded in losing every game.
	You weren't supposed to beat the Globetrotters, and they never, ever did.
	I was supposed to be the Washington Generals on the newspaper, the token conservative who was only there in order to get mocked.
	Well, as it turned out, though, the column took off, as you said at the outset.
	For a while, I was – actually, at the end, I was generating more clicks than front-page news.
	Sometimes I would get picked up by some of the national sites, realtor politics, you know, whatever, and I'd get tens of thousands of clicks.
	Well, the whole circulation of the Aspen Times is only about 5,000 clicks.
	So there I was, just making a name for myself, and I was getting death threats.
	Not everybody liked me.
	I got a ton of clicks, but I also got death threats.
	My car windshield was smashed in broad daylight at the grocery store once.
	I got so...
	Well, for my mugshot for the column, I used a very blurry old picture with my head kind of turned in the hope that they wouldn't recognize me.
	But I still would get recognized around town and get these dirty looks.
	My general policy was when I made a restaurant reservation, I'd never made it my own name because I didn't want them to know that they were preparing and serving me before I ate the food.
	And then they'd see who I was when I gave them my credit card.
	So, you know, maybe I exaggerated the danger, but I did feel endangered.
	Wow. It always works if you tell them Donner Party.
	You know, that's always good for us. Whether you tell them my name is Donner, they say Donner Party of three, and the table is ready.
	We'll have you over for dinner.
	Well, you know, it is interesting to look at it, and, you know, let's talk a little bit about how it got that way, because, you know, When we lived in Texas, we'd go to a lot of places in the west and northwest, up in Colorado, or we'd go up into Washington State and Oregon.
	Beautiful places, and most of them have been taken over, certainly the urban areas, taken over by the rich people, by the liberal people.
	They've marched through the institutions.
	They've marched through the beautiful areas because they've got so much money.
	That is the thing that we're seeing happening everywhere.
	Even here, we're now in Tennessee, you have to, you know, all the problems, We see happening in politics.
	They're coming from the big cities.
	They're coming from Nashville. They're coming from Memphis.
	They're coming from Knoxville. And so you see the cities everywhere are going.
	Any thoughts about, you know, we can talk about Aspen in particular, but any thoughts in general about why that is?
	Well, in Aspen, at least, and I think to some extent elsewhere, too, because I think Aspen is kind of a canary in the coal mine, culture-wise.
	In Aspen, a big part of it, I think, is drugs, which really came around in the late 60s and then the 70s and continued from there.
	Colorado, you may know, has legalized marijuana, but Aspen, it was essentially legal long before they legalized it in Colorado.
	The legalization in Colorado came through a citizen's initiative, and it won, I think, something like 60-40 or 55-45, something like that.
	Well, in Aspen, the margin was like 80-20 to legalize pop.
	And so they did.
	But even before then, it was everywhere.
	I don't know if you ski, but a ski gondola goes up Aspen Mountain.
	It's a pretty small enclosed space.
	It's about the size of a small.
	Well, you get into a ski gondola, you typically share it with several other people, and it would be very common for them to light up in this closed space, which I thought was kind of rude, especially if children are with you.
	The policy of the local sheriff, this is interesting, I think he's just following the desires of his constituency, but the policy of the local sheriff is that drugs should be legalized of all kinds, you know, heroin, fentanyl, you name it.
	The Drug Enforcement Administration is active, as you might imagine, up in Aspen, and they don't really think drugs should be legalized, or at least if they do, they're willing to enforce the law as it's written in the meantime.
	So they will do their drug bust from time to time.
	People often think, oh, gee, we're cleaning up drugs.
	Well, no, these drug busts aren't a sign that we're cleaning up drugs.
	It's a sign of how much drugs is out there.
	But when the DEA does a raid, typically their policy throughout the country is they'll give a heads up to local law enforcement just so they know what's coming down in case there's any turmoil.
	In Aspen, they don't do that.
	And the reason they don't do that, they're fairly candid, is they're afraid that the local law enforcement will tip off the dealers.
	There have been several instances where it appears that that's happened.
	Hmm. Well, it is interesting because, you know, and my son, as you're talking about, the enclosed gondola, he says, yeah, nothing like getting a contact high before you go downhill skiing.
	Maybe that's what happened to Michael Kennedy.
	I don't know. Yeah, keep in mind, you're about to do something that is inherently a little bit dangerous.
	Yeah, exactly. And there you are getting...
	I guess you will.
	You're getting high. Yeah.
	You climb mountains. I don't imagine you get high before you climb the mountain.
	That's not a good idea. Even if you're going to do it afterwards, do it afterwards, but not before, right?
	I'll take the high on top.
	The Rocky Mountain High.
	But I don't know about John Denver.
	Anyway, the...
	You know, when we look at this, I think that brings up an interesting point.
	I've talked about it many times.
	And we saw this happening throughout the COVID nonsense, I call it.
	And that is, you know, the local sheriff and the local authorities can make things better or they can make things worse.
	And they have a lot of power.
	And there's also, I think, you know, one of the things that's interesting...
	I talk a lot about the Constitution and the Tenth Amendment and how we can nullify things as a peaceful alternative to secession or something.
	We're just not going to enforce that law.
	We've seen the left do that over and over again with medical marijuana or other types of marijuana, and people need to understand that that's a viable thing to do in terms of gun control legislation.
	Or in terms of right now we've got a lawsuit that's just been filed here in Tennessee where Biden says, no, you can't stop the mutilation and sterilization of kids surgically and chemically.
	And so, you know, the Tennessee law says we're not going to do that to kids.
	He says, no, we're going to make you do that.
	It seems to me like if you look at the, you know, they could be a good example for us regardless of what you say about the drug stuff and how it has, you know, messed with the community.
	But from a legal standpoint, They have illustrated the power of the Tenth Amendment, even with Jeff Sessions in there.
	He never did take this to a direct conflict because I think they didn't want people to realize that the Constitution So the states and local authorities have that kind of power.
	So I think that's one good thing that could come out of it, that we look at it.
	But, you know, when we talk about how these enclaves turn into these liberal enclaves, that may be part of it.
	It may be their connection to the government that can channel them cash, right?
	Because that's one of the things I thought about.
	What do you think about that type of thing?
	Certainly there's perhaps money being made out of drugs, but also when we look at...
	You know, how we've got this concentration of wealth there.
	A lot of these people are heavily involved with government in one way or the other, whether it's favors with the drugs or whether it's some kind of crony capitalism.
	Is that what is causing this kind of concentration of wealth and power in these cities against us?
	What do you think?
	Yeah.
	You know, there's a elite establishment and Aspen is neck deep in the elite establishment.
	And they, they all kind of engage in this group think in a couple of months, there's the annual Aspen ideas festival coming up where they've been doing this for, geez, I don't know, 60 years or something.
	It started out as a great thing.
	It was founded by a Chicago industrialist, Walter Pepke, who moved to Aspen and sort of re-founded the place after the quiet days in the interim between the Silver Bust in 1891 and World War II. So there was this great thing that happened, but now you look at what they're doing, and the idea is it's like all stale ideas.
	Let's talk about global warming.
	Madeleine Albright came out more times than I want to remember.
	She must have had a group raid or a vacation raid at the Sheridan or something.
	When they have a debate, their typical debate is going to be...
	What they see as balance.
	Well, their balance is going to be somebody like Don Lemon and Paul Krogman on the left and Paul Ryan and Mitt Romney on the so-called right.
	Forget about getting somebody like Tom Cotton or Ted Cruz for all...
	For sure, forget about getting Donald Trump.
	It's all rigged.
	It's all biased.
	And you get kind of fed up with it.
	One of the things, one of the people who's knee deep in all this establishment stuff is Aspen Skiing Company.
	They're the dominant employer in the Valley.
	They're not a huge company. They do maybe $100 million a year.
	They're owned by the Crown family out of Chicago, which also owns General Dynamics.
	Huge family worth probably $10 billion.
	This is not the biggest jewel in the Crown's crown.
	But anyway, this guy is so political and so woke, you wouldn't believe it.
	He wrote, well, he's upset by the fact that there aren't very many black skiers in Aspen.
	In fact, there aren't very many black people in Aspen.
	I don't know of a single black person who lives in Aspen.
	I'm not trying to be racist here.
	I'm just telling you what I know about, I personally know, I could be wrong, about the demographics.
	I've been around, and the nearest black person that I know is a friend down valley about 20 miles.
	But anyway, the head of Aspen Skiing Company was just...
	that there weren't more black skiers.
	So he managed to entice a black skiing group.
	There's a black skiing group, a national group, to come to Aspen, and he dubs it Black Ski Week.
	Okay, fine.
	I don't have any objections to that.
	But he sends around a memo to all 1,000 of their employees instructing them how to behave around black people.
	Did they get the Jamaican ski team or what was it, the bobsled team or something like that?
	The Jamaican bobsled team, yeah.
	Well, so in this memo, first, I think it's kind of outrageous that he felt the need to send a memo around to his employees telling them how to behave around black people.
	Yeah. I think they know how to behave around black people.
	You behave decently and courteously in the same way you behave around white people or whatever.
	But no, he said you have to see their blackness.
	You have to not be colorblind.
	And don't dare tell them such things as, oh, the restaurant doesn't open until 5, so come back then.
	Because they might interpret that as an act of discrimination.
	Don't tell them, oh, you can't park here.
	This is only for valet parking.
	Because they might interpret that as an act of discrimination.
	Well, I don't think he thinks very much of black people either.
	I don't think a black person is going to interpret, oh, the restaurant doesn't open until 5 or no, you can't park here.
	It's only for valet. I don't think an ordinary black person is going to interpret that as an act of racial discrimination.
	And how is this policy really supposed to play out?
	Suppose you own a restaurant.
	And a black person comes knocking on the door at 4 o'clock and you don't open until 5.
	You're supposed to let them in and serve them food even though the staff's not there?
	Yeah. It's crazy.
	They must not have gotten that memo about when Candace Owens was there, right?
	She did not get the black red carpet treatment, I guess we call it.
	She laughed the whole thing off.
	You know, she could have played the race card.
	She could have done all kinds of things.
	But she just, she literally laughed, shrugged her shoulders, said, yeah, whatever.
	And that is the case. I mean, we know that if the same thing happened, you know, been a conservative place, and it's like, we don't like your politics, so you can't come in.
	If it was a black liberal that was told to, they would say it was all about racism.
	And so she's not pulling that card on them.
	Because we know that liberals can never be racist, right?
	They can be condescending, they can be hateful, but they can be all these other things, but they can never be racist, right?
	Well, that's right. And the flip side of that is conservatives can never not.
	That's right. You're guilty as charged.
	Talk a little bit about the Aspen Institute, because that's what a lot of people hear about.
	Tell people what that is about, and that's where you get a lot of the celebrities, the big political figures coming in, I guess, on a regular basis.
	Well, the Aspen Institute was founded by this fellow I mentioned before, Walter Pepke, who came out from Chicago.
	And he had this whole Chicago mafia.
	I use that, obviously, in the colloquial sense.
	And this very charming wife, Elizabeth, who became the grand dame of Aspen after he passed away.
	But he started this back in 1949.
	He intended it to be a celebration of the 200th birthday of Wolfgang van Gogh, the German poet.
	And so he did.
	And it was a huge success.
	He had music there as well, mostly Bach, Beethoven.
	There was this big German connection.
	That's racist. I was just talking today about how they just up in Washington, they completely decided in one school district, said we're not going to have any music where you have wind instruments or violins because that's racist.
	So we're going to shut down. I saw that too.
	Can you believe it? Yeah, I can believe it.
	So he starts this racist organization to have Mozart and Bach.
	And then what happens? Yeah.
	Well, it takes off.
	The guy's very well connected, and so is his wife.
	His wife was, I think, the daughter of a romance literature professor at the University of Chicago.
	So she had all these connections, too.
	Mortimer Adler came out, wound up spending most of his summers in Aspen for the rest of his life, and the Institute took off.
	Pepe lost some money on it initially, but he didn't care.
	And it took off.
	He established a campus for it, which is about a mile from downtown within walking distance.
	And they've been doing this yearly ever since.
	Ultimately, it became more and more woke, politically correct first and now woke, to the point where I think it's a little bit of a woke joke.
	Mm-hmm. But for a while, it was a fabulous organization, and so was the Aspen Music Festival.
	The Aspen Music Festival has a school, so they rent a campus from one of the private schools during the summer when the private school is out of session, and they bring world-class youngsters, anywhere from typically teenagers to young 20s.
	It's a wonderful thing because these guys wander around town with their instruments and they'll set up tin cups on a street corner and play just fabulous music, mostly classical, some jazz, a little bit of swing.
	I can't talk about that without mentioning that the music director Another very woke person now, unfortunately.
	He noticed that a lot of the musicians, in fact, practically all of their classical musicians were not black.
	A few of the jazz musicians were.
	And some jazz musicians came out to play.
	I think Miles Davis came out once.
	John Coltrane might have come out once.
	But anyway, he was dismayed by the fact that not enough of the students were black.
	And in the string instruments, they tended to be Asian.
	So he decided to basically establish voters now for black kids.
	Yeah. Admission to the music school now is based largely on the color of your skin.
	You don't get credit for being Asian, though, because there's already too many Asians in his view, at least in string instruments.
	But you do get credit for being any color, I guess, other than white or Asian.
	Wow. So if you're Asian, you need to learn sax or something, right?
	Go against type.
	Personal preference of what people like to play, that doesn't count into any of this stuff.
	Merit doesn't count into any of it.
	It is the ultimate racism to determine everything based on people's skin color, isn't it?
	And that's where we are now.
	It is kind of interesting to see how this has unfolded in Aspen.
	It is a cautionary tale for us.
	We live not too far from the Smoky Mountains here.
	I think it's a beautiful area. I certainly hope the liberals don't come in here and take it over.
	Maybe what we need to do Do as much as we can to make it more redneck, you know?
	Start flying Confederate flags everywhere just as a repellent to these people, you know?
	Oh, I'm not going back there.
	Shoot all your Bud Light cans.
	Yeah, that's right. It was great talking to you.
	It sounds like a fascinating book.
	Again, the book is High Attitude.
	And that goes along with the drug stuff, I guess.
	High Attitude, the liberal takeover of Aspen.
	It just came out, and I guess people will find that.
	Amazon, any other place you have a website that you sell direct to that?
	My website is theaspenbeat.com.
	I'm also on Substack.
	Okay, good. Look for Glenn K. That's Glenn with two N's.
	Glenn K. Beaton.
	You can find him at aspenbeat.com and also on Substack.
	It's great talking to you. It's a beautiful place.
	Just one last go.
	Are you still in Aspen or did they run you out of town?
	They kind of ran me out of town, but not very far.
	I sold my house in downtown Aspen to a billionaire, and I'm building a house outside of Aspen.
	So I'm not in the city limits.
	Good, good. As you move just a little bit, you know, you can make kind of an arbitrage there by selling the thing that's closer in, and you move further out, that'd be a good deal.
	And you can still be there close to the mountains.
	It is a beautiful area up there.
	I love Colorado. It is a beautiful area.
	I just had to handle the politics that were there.
	It is still a spectacularly beautiful area.
	I tell you where I live, but God knows I don't want that.
	That's right.
	No, don't tell anybody.
	It's enough to say that you're in Colorado.
	They'll probably fare you out now.
	If they have a liberal version of 4chan, they'll figure out where you are.
	They figured out where Shia LaBeouf was in no time, so we don't want to give them any clues.
	Thank you so much.
	It was great talking to you.
	The Common Man The Common Man They created common core to dumb down our children.
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	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
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	Joining us now is Catherine Austin-Fitz, and you can find her Solari report at Solari.com.
	Always a pleasure to have Catherine on.
	She gets the big picture.
	Thank you for joining us, Catherine.
	Thank you, David. I'm so excited to hear that you're in Tennessee.
	Yes, I'm excited to be here.
	Love it here. Let's talk a little bit about you.
	Just recently on Solari.com, you just had an article, the Second Amendment and 2024 elections.
	How do you see this as tying into the election?
	So I was inspired.
	I was listening to Bobby Kennedy's speech when he launched his campaign for president on April 19th, and he didn't mention the Second Amendment.
	So I wanted to send him an email to say, look, you know, we need you to come out for the Second Amendment.
	But I thought... I'll write an article and post it.
	At the same time, we were having an enormous fight in the Tennessee legislature over the Second Amendment with the governor trying to propose red flag laws.
	And the governor is now, the legislature finished without addressing this, and the governor is now trying to propose a special session.
	Hopefully that won't happen.
	But what you see in Tennessee right now is you see the extraordinary effort to chip away at the Second Amendment and I wanted to write a piece for Bobby but for everyone about why this is so important because many citizens do not connect the dots between the Second Amendment and their financial transaction freedom or their property rights or their incomes and what they don't understand is
	if you lose the Second Amendment We are going to watch all these other things collapse in short order because if you look at what is blowing the establishment down from literally confiscation of real estate or confiscation of property rights or compromise of human rights, one of the biggest barriers is the fact that the population is well armed.
	Mm-hmm. And well-armed, and many of those people who are well-armed are well-trained in their constitutional rights.
	So the Second Amendment of the Constitution protects our right to bear arms, and that right to bear arms protect many other freedoms in the Constitution.
	will go away.
	I noted in the article that Jamie Dimon, the CEO of JP Morgan Chase, recently wrote a letter to shareholders and said that the time has come to exercise eminent domain, not just by government, but by businesses and not-for-profits to get what we need to do renewable but by businesses and not-for-profits to get what we need to do renewable energy investments Now, what I will tell you is that has nothing to do with climate change.
	It has to do with implementing an electrical grid that can implement digital concentration camps.
	So, you know, whether it's confiscating the land or whether it's trying to implement CBDCs, you know, I've always, I've said for many years, if I was Jay Powell, I would not pass, try and get the legislation passed to implement CBDCs unless I pulled in the guns.
	So I think the fact that Americans are well-armed and well-trained to use firearms is a major protection of our freedoms.
	And so I wrote the article because it's time we have to really talk about this.
	And people who haven't been engaged in protecting the Second Amendment need to get engaged.
	I agree. I've said many times that it is mutually assured destruction, like the mad policy that we had during the Cold War.
	Neither side wants to do a first use of this.
	Hopefully, they don't want, we don't want to do it.
	But it is there as a deterrent.
	And of course, the founders understood that as well.
	They talked about how firearms are a restraint against evil, a restraint against tyrants.
	And so you really don't want to do something that's going to trigger that because it will destroy everything.
	And it's a very effective deterrent.
	That is why it's there, but also to protect us.
	You've got a story about your particular personal story about a firearm and a dodgy situation that you were in.
	Tell us about that. Right.
	So what I always stress to people who don't understand this issue is how extraordinary the statistics are about how effective guns are for protecting the honest citizen.
	So if you go back and you look at the History 1 book I always recommend is a little bit dated now, but still very good, called Point Blank.
	By a criminologist, in fact, from Florida, Gary Gleck, and it does an excellent job of explaining why honest citizens are really advantaged by owning firearms, and particularly women.
	To me, this is something all women should care about.
	So I tell the story of my argument.
	Let me step back, David.
	When I travel internationally, I can't tell you how many times I find myself in conversation with people who think that the supporters of the Second Amendment in the United States are gun nuts, and they can't fathom why we would be gun nuts.
	And, you know, they'll say, oh, you have this terrible problem with those people that are gun nuts.
	And then I say to them, I'm one of them.
	I'm one of those gun nuts.
	And they're shocked.
	They say, I can't fathom why you would be.
	At which point I explain what I explained in this article, which is in every county in America, you see a balance of power between the drug gangs and the drug cartels and the organized crime cartels and the honest citizens who are well armed.
	What people in New Zealand or people in Nova Scotia don't understand is, because they're not sitting with the same level of drug cartels in their neighborhoods that we are with ours.
	What they don't understand is the minute we lose our guns, there is a standing army ready to move in on us like that.
	They don't understand that delicate balance of power.
	So I tell the story, to give an example of that, I tell the story of I was being hassled by a local, it appeared to be one of the local gang members, and he was sort of casing my house.
	I'd come home from Memphis with a SUV full of groceries, and I had the backup, and I was walking one bag in, unpacking it, and then coming back, It was very late at night.
	And I live in a rural area.
	So I come out, and he's casing my house in the car.
	And he sees me, and then he drives over to local policeman's house when he sees it's empty.
	This local policeman was at his mom's house that weekend.
	He comes back, and he starts down my driveway.
	Now, I was literally...
	Three long strides away from being through my front door, and my gun was loaded sitting right on the desk inside the door.
	So I knew, now in Tennessee, you're never going to shoot anybody unless you believe your life's threatened, and you're in the house.
	So, you know, my plan was immediately to head into the house, and there wouldn't be a gunfight unless he was foolish enough to come in the house.
	Anyway, but he was clearly, you know, his feeling and his attitude was very aggressive.
	And I just got mad.
	I just, you know, I was not in the mood to be hassled.
	And I thought, okay, you know, you want to have a fight?
	We're going to have a fight. And I stood in the driveway and I was very clear in my mind exactly when I had to start moving towards the house and exactly what I was going to do, especially if he chased me into the house.
	I knew I would be fine, you know, because I've had excellent training.
	And he got just about a half a foot from where I was going to head into the pick up my gun.
	And suddenly it was remarkable.
	I could feel his fear.
	You could cut the air with a knife.
	Of his fear. He was really afraid.
	Now, a lot of these guys are on a tight leash, and they're not used to real fights.
	Do you know what I mean? They're kind of bully situations.
	But anyway, so I could feel his fear, and I felt no fear at all.
	I knew I was going to be fine.
	And no matter what he did, I was highly confident I was going to be fine.
	And... Suddenly, he started to back out of the driveway and drive away, and he was scared.
	But the reason he was scared was because I was confident, and I was confident because I had a gun.
	And I knew I was going to be fine in any situation.
	Now, if I had not had a gun, you know, who knows what could have happened.
	And what I try and stress on people, you know, we have a great sheriff.
	And it's really important, as you know, to have a great sheriff.
	But our sheriff is 25 to 45 minutes away.
	And I have neighbors.
	But when you're in a situation like that...
	You can't call your neighbors, besides they're asleep.
	Do you know what I mean? Yeah, that's right.
	I've got a story from my, not from my experience, but from my grandfather's experience.
	Back in Tampa, early part of the 20th century, when they still had streetcars, he was a streetcar conductor.
	And he always carried a gun, but he had another job.
	He and his brother-in-law would go around.
	They would, it was in some low-income areas, and people get paid on Friday.
	They would send them around to collect money.
	the rent on friday and that made them a target because everybody knew that they were picking up money from people back in those days everybody was paying cash his brother-in-law was murdered and the police didn't find him he found him he was murdered with a hatchet and they stole the money and then he was um still doing the same job shortly after that he comes back to his car and he's a He saw a guy curled up behind the front seat and he pulled out his gun.
	He pointed at him. He said, if I ever see you again, I'll shoot first.
	But that was never reported.
	That was nothing ever happened as far as the statistics are concerned.
	Of course, they weren't really keeping statistics back then on that kind of thing.
	But that's a good example of something, how it can be used.
	To deter evil, in the same way that just the population having guns is a deterrence to what the government might want to do in terms of tyrannical, unconstitutional things, or just full-on confiscation, as Jamie Dimon's talking about.
	One of the other links I put into the article was a great chart.
	When I was in Washington, one of the groups that the congressional staff would tell you was the most effective on gun control is a group called Jews for the Preservation of the Owner of Firearms.
	And they have a chart up on their website, they have a very good website, and they have a chart up on their website of all the genocides that immediately followed gun confiscation.
	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.
	Mm-hmm.
	It was very brutal. I remember seeing the pictures of them, you know, attacking people that were out there by themselves on the beach or having people who didn't have a mask and they had a lot of armed police tackle them, surround them.
	They had mounted police.
	They would forcibly put the mask on them.
	It was crazy what was happening in Australia.
	Right, and it was unthinkable.
	Australia's always been called the lucky country, and the quality of life in Australia, you know, as of 2019, was much higher than the United States.
	So it was unthinkable that such a thing could happen in Australia, but I assure you it wouldn't have happened if they hadn't won in the guns.
	Let's talk a little bit about what's happening in Tennessee, since you are a part-time resident here and I am a resident here, and we're very concerned about what is happening, but I think it is something that has national implications for people.
	Absolutely. We had this horrific shooting here.
	There is a feeling that something needs to be done.
	Many of us are looking at this feeling that this is appeasement.
	I know that the red flag law that's been proposed by the governor is a little bit different from some of the other red flag gun laws that are out there, but it is still a red flag gun law.
	And these things have, as we see, the...
	The story is about the IRS getting aggressive with people.
	You were talking about, you sent me an article about the IRS and how many agents...
	They're out hiring. They're out hiring in all 56 people who carry guns.
	That's right. And so we know that something like that has a possibility.
	I remember back in the 90s, the Washington Post did an article about what had happened with a family over the mother's delinquent Department of Education loan.
	And so the Department of Education had a SWAT team.
	And in that article, they said we had seen that they had purchased all this SWAT equipment.
	We couldn't figure out why the Department of Education was doing it.
	Well, they had her address.
	She had left the family. She wasn't even living there.
	They came at the, oh, dark 30 hours, and they pulled everybody out of the house, but the father down on the ground, face down on the ground, where is she?
	That type of thing. And it's that kind of abuse of power that always has the opportunity to happen when you've got a bureaucracy, because you can always have some energetic Barney Fife that's going to do something like that.
	And so it's a dangerous thing to put a red flag law out there, and it is really a sign of appeasement.
	And I think that beyond the gun issues, It is going to be something that is going to invite the kind of takeover that we saw with Tennessee 3, if you will.
	And it is an effort to corrupt and to shut down that institution.
	So I think it's very dangerous on many different levels.
	Well, first of all, what I would say is that I think what needs to happen, you know, if you want to take an action that's productive, whenever there's a school shooting, I think you need to get to the bottom of the truth of what really happened.
	Mm-hmm. And I don't see that happening.
	That's right.
	We haven't seen the manifesto.
	We don't know anything about motivations.
	We don't know what the individual is going through.
	We know that she was getting some psychological help, and we do know from past experience that in many of these cases, they give them SSRI drugs, and we know what happens with the SSRI drugs It can actually make people more suicidal.
	It's a factor in a lot of murder-suicides.
	I've talked many times to an organization, SSRIStories.com.
	They've collected over 7,000 of these stories.
	If somebody varies their dosage because it's creating some other kind of side effects, it can make people go into a – they don't know what they're doing.
	One instance, a guy goes – Oh, but here's the other thing.
	Sorry, go ahead. You know, these people can be mind controlled and programmed to kill.
	Yeah, yeah. Or it can happen just because of the drug.
	One kid went in and he was pointing the rifle at his class and then pointing at himself.
	They finally were able to get it away from him.
	He had no recollection of what was happening to it.
	So that is one of the key things that is typically done when somebody has a psychological issue and we see that that is exploding now in the school.
	So perhaps The Tennessee legislature should take a look at what is happening in the schools.
	Why do we have 30% or so, a third of young girls, talking about suicide, ideation?
	Whether or not they try to do it.
	That is something that we never had in schools before.
	Why is that happening? But you have kids ingesting lousy food.
	You have kids ingesting lousy media.
	You have kids being put on pharmaceutical drugs at a very young age.
	You have kids being abused for a variety of reasons.
	It goes on and on and on.
	And, you know, what we're talking about is debasing our children, poisoning our children in a variety of ways.
	And whether they act up because they're disturbed or they act up because somebody's...
	I mean, make no mistake about it.
	Kids can be mind-controlled and programmed to kill.
	Oh, yeah. So, you know...
	Go check out Hollywood.
	There's scores of movies on this exact same topic.
	So we don't know.
	I don't know what happened in Nashville because there was no time to know it.
	All of a sudden you just had well-financed activists demanding gun control.
	At the same time, the head of JPMorgan Chase is proposing that our real estate be confiscated.
	That's right. So the reason that gun control is being encouraged is You know, and the push for it is being financed doesn't just relate to people who want the schools to be safe, because there are many things you can do to make the schools safe that we're not doing.
	It relates to the fact that you have very powerful, wealthy people who are trying to centralize political and economic control.
	You know that, and I know that, and they are using this as the tip of the spear to get it.
	Now, all you need to do is create a law that says, oh, we get to do the following with a dangerous person.
	Well, who gets to say who's dangerous?
	Mm-hmm. And the issue is the person is dangerous.
	Just going in and taking the gun doesn't really change anything.
	When we look at the lesson of the Waukesha Christmas Parade back in November 2021, we had the same number of people killed.
	Six people were killed, and we had 62 people who were injured.
	You had a dance company of grandmothers, the dancing grannies.
	You had kids as young as eight years old that were killed.
	From eight to 81 were the ages of the people who were killed.
	You had this individual who did this steering the car targeting people.
	I mean, he wasn't just speeding through a crowd and happening to hit people.
	No, he was turning the car to the SUV to hit people.
	Why didn't we come after 2010 Ford Escapes, which was a murder weapon?
	Why didn't we say that we've got to have a background check?
	Why didn't we say, you know, if you've got a problem, maybe we're going to confiscate your car?
	This guy had actually used, just a few days earlier, he had actually used his vehicle to assault his girlfriend.
	And he had a violent history.
	He had multiple convictions.
	And after he had convictions and was a felon, Right.
	Right. So if you go back to the balance of power, in almost every county in America you have a group of well-armed drug gangs and organized crime gangs and then the honest citizens.
	Gun control does not remove guns from the criminals.
	That's right. Gun control removes guns from the honest people, from the citizenry.
	And at which point, we are outpowered, not just by the government, but I'm not worried about the government because those organized crime gangs are there right now and they are on a tight leash.
	And if you follow the chain of command upstairs, they're working for the guys at the top and it's within 24 hours they're going to move in.
	Yeah, I agree.
	I agree. Yeah, he talked about how pervasive it is from top to bottom.
	That's how HSBC began, right?
	Hong Kong, Shanghai Bank, the opioid wars, and they've had a lot of convictions in terms of doing money laundering.
	I remember Matt Taibbi, before he became famous for the Twitter files and other things like that, was writing for Rolling Stone.
	He talked about how HSBC... Was too big to jail because they had already been convicted multiple times.
	I had the whistleblower who was working inside there after the first time they were convicted for doing money laundering for drug cartels and for terrorist groups.
	And he was part of that group and they hired a bunch of people who had no law enforcement experience.
	But he was curious and he took it seriously and he found that they had this list of places and people and organizations that were supposed to raise a red flag.
	And he found that they had intentionally misspelled a word here or there or inserted a space or something.
	And he blew the whistle on that.
	And, of course, they fired him.
	But that was part of what Matt Taibbi was looking at.
	And this is an old, old story.
	I mean, just take a look at what has happened to opioid production in Afghanistan after we left.
	It's plummeted to nothing.
	In 2012, the Department of Justice, Eric Holder, and this is interesting.
	Remember that name, Eric Holder?
	Yeah. So Eric Holder let HSBC skate on criminal violations, you know, pay a fine and skate.
	Mm-hmm. And if you look, John Titus made a fabulous video about this.
	It's called All the Plenaries, Men.
	You can get it at his Best Evidence channel on YouTube.
	And he describes basically how the Bank of England interceded and they were able to extend the sovereign immunity of the systemically important banks through the BIS to cover HSBC. So HSBC is completely skates Protected by Eric Holder,
	Attorney General of the United States, who shows up in Tennessee to basically target and attack the Tennessee legislators, including threatening lawsuits against them, Eric Holder.
	Yeah, the guy who was there when they were too big to jail.
	Remember, Eric Holder was the guy who made sure the Mexican cartel drug gangs could have weapons to kill DEA agents, right?
	So that was Fast and Furious.
	That's Eric Holder.
	Covington and Burling, don't remember that name.
	Yeah, when you talk about gun control, talk about that.
	That was an obvious false flag.
	Even the New York Times said Fast and Furious was a false flag.
	And they had that as part of the UN Arms Trade Treaty.
	They were trying to say, well, we've got to control traffic going across the border of small firearms.
	So that means that we're going to have to have registration, full registration of all firearms and ammunition and that type of thing in the U.S. so that we can know where it came from and we can backtrack it.
	So it was a backdoor way.
	To do what they wanted to do, and it blew up with the DEA agent getting shot with that.
	It's very interesting, David.
	Speaking of having personal stories, I remember being out in L.A. when Fast and Furious broke.
	And I talked about it on a big radio show and explained why, you know, my personal experience with Eric Holder.
	If you want to understand my personal experience with Eric Holder, read my online book, Dylan Reed and the Aristocracy of Stock Profits.
	So I talked about how, why I believe Eric Holder is up to his eyeballs in the criminality.
	And I fly home to Memphis.
	I get off the plane and I come down to baggage claim and there's a Mexican guy who Who's tracking me?
	He's shadowing me. He's following me.
	And I thought, huh?
	Really? Because, you know, the word was that, you know, the Mexican cartels were, you know, Memphis was a hub.
	So, but I didn't know a lot about it at the time.
	So I thought, well, this is not...
	You know, this is not good because this guy's following me.
	You know, he's shadowing me.
	So he's like a spotter.
	You know how they have spotters?
	Okay, so I get my bags.
	It's late at night. My car is all the way back in the parking lot up on the top level at the Memphis airport.
	And I start down the row.
	You know, nobody around.
	It's dark. It's empty.
	And I'm not caring because I just flew in from L.A. So my gun's at home.
	And suddenly I see another Mexican guy peek out from behind my car all the way down the road.
	Wow. And I thought, I'm not caring.
	And I went back into the airport and was able to find a policeman, you know, one of those guys on a bicycle in police, community policing.
	And I said, you've got to walk me to the car because there's a guy, you know.
	So I need a gun, so you're going to be my gun.
	And the guy took off.
	He took one look at the policeman coming along and he took off.
	As many people say, we carry guns because the police officers are too heavy.
	So you've got your own police officer, right?
	Well, needless to say, I was glad to see him.
	I was glad he was available.
	But, you know, we are living.
	At one point, I made Yellowstone the movie of the year on the Solari Report.
	And I got a lot of criticism.
	People run in and said, that show is really violent.
	I said, really? Have you lived in America?
	You must live in a different country than I live in.
	Yeah, that's done very well.
	So what do you think, you know, what could we say to these legislators if any of them are listening?
	I'm very concerned about the signal that it sends in many ways.
	You know, whenever you try to appease tyranny, you always get more of it because they see it as a sign of weakness.
	And that's going to be true. You can't comply your way out of tyranny.
	That's right. It doesn't work.
	So here's what the citizens of Tennessee need to do.
	We need to get the governor out of the corner.
	The governor's been put in a corner, and so he's going to punch a hole in the dam in a way that's going to make us much less safe.
	Mm-hmm. So the question is politically, how do you get the governor out of the corner?
	I feel sorry for him because he's got, and I talk about this in the articles, if you look at all the different armies, you know, the vested interests have landed on his head, whether it's protesters, whether it's media, whether it's dirty legislators.
	You know, you've got a couple of dirty, dirty legislators in Tennessee, and you've got this army just going at him, and so it makes it so he wants to look like he's doing something, right?
	So he needs to feel like we need to take action.
	So get the governor out of the corner.
	Call the governor's office, write them an email, write your state senator, write your state representative, you know, your House representative, and say under no circumstances will you compromise in any way the Second Amendment.
	No red flag laws.
	No, no, no. The Tennessee Firearms Association has a lot of good posts, and, you know, if you're looking for templates or things to say, But you just, you have to make this clear.
	If you do a search for Tennessee General Assembly, you can get easily the contact information for your state senator and your state representative.
	If you don't know who they are, you can find out who they are.
	You want to know them.
	Yeah. It's a great group of people.
	You have really fine people in the Tennessee legislature.
	But you make it absolutely clear you will not tolerate any compromise in the Second Amendment and no red flag laws.
	And, you know, if there is enough pushback, then you're going to help get the governor out of the corner.
	Because what the governor can say is, you know, look, I tried to do what I wanted to do, but there's just too much...
	There's too much pushback.
	I can't get this done politically.
	And all you have to do is make sure no special session.
	Just say, no special session, no special session, because then there's nobody in Nashville to pass some rotten thing.
	Yeah, I agree. And we don't realize the power of that letter.
	I remember we homeschooled our kids.
	And so I remember back in the early 90s when it was still kind of a new thing and it was shaky and the teachers unions were coming after it.
	And they were going to shut it down.
	It was a Democrat-controlled state.
	And you had a massive letter-writing campaign by a small minority of people.
	Homeschooling was not that big then.
	And they stop that powerful teachers union.
	You can have an effect if you contact these people because most people never bother to do it.
	And so that means already that you have an outsized, you know, the people who are interested in government are the people who are going to be writing and that's the way they perceive this.
	They know, well, these are the people that are going to be likely voters, likely donors or whatever, but they listen because you took the time to write to them.
	And I think that's very important that we make that heard, that, again, take the pressure off the governor.
	Send him a letter saying we don't want to have a special session.
	Send the same one to your other representatives in the House and the Senate.
	And I think that is very important for them as well because we do have a good group of people there in Tennessee right now.
	We've had a lot of good things that have been done economically as well as constitutional carry.
	And we don't want to weaken the Republican Party.
	And it's going to weaken the Republican Party with voters if they see this as a betrayal, isn't it?
	If you look at all the people who are moving to Tennessee because they want what Tennessee has, the last thing you can afford to do is then destroy the thing that's attracting you.
	That's right. We don't want to all move back to California and New York.
	I definitely don't want to move to either of those places.
	Let's talk a little bit about CBDC and some things that are being done here in Tennessee.
	Because as you pointed out many times, a central bank digital currency is really the end game.
	We can get there in a lot of different ways, but that is the most direct way, the fastest way to get us there in terms of a surveillance state, in terms of a lockdown lockdown.
	Open-air prison. CBDC takes us there directly.
	And so that is a key thing to be concerned about.
	Talk about how you see this currently.
	I mean, we've had a couple of presidential candidates who have talked about this.
	I think on the Republican side, we've got DeSantis.
	On the Democrat side, we have RFK Jr.
	We've got, I think, Ramaswamy has also talked about it.
	There's a lot of silence about it, but some of the people are now noticing this, and I think it really needs to be One of my favorite comments on CBDC, I have an article at Solari, so my website is Solari.com.
	You go to Solari, you have an article called, I Want to Stop CBDCs, What Can I Do?
	And it's a great collection of actions you and your family and your friends can take that can make a huge difference in turning the ship.
	Of course, the big one, as you know, David, is use cash.
	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. So, but in item number 11, I say bring transparency, and I give a list of six videos, all of them short, that really show you what a dire thing CBDCs are.
	Yes. And one of those videos is the president, you know, the Federal Reserve System has 12 private banks.
	The flagship is the New York Fed, but there are 11 other banks around the country.
	And it's got the president and the Minneapolis Fed saying, well, I can understand why the Chinese would want CBDCs because it gives them complete control and surveillance, but I cannot imagine why Americans would ever allow this to happen.
	Yeah, that is the president of the New York Fed whose claim to fame was giving away trillions of your dollars during the bailouts.
	And even he said, no, you can't do this.
	Well, he said one of the things he said was, look, I can send money electronically to anybody, and that's what they're trying to sell is the first phase of this this summer coming out with what they call FedNow.
	It's that, oh, look, we've got a novel idea.
	You can send cash to people 24-7, 365, and do it instantly.
	He says, we've already got that.
	We've got a lot of private things that do that.
	That doesn't really solve anything, but it's the first step.
	The second step, of course, that's what they call the wholesale part.
	That's where they get the banks there with the Fed, and the whole thing is...
	The purpose of it is to have central control.
	Central control of everything and make it direct.
	And that's the next step with FedCoin.
	They've even got a name for it already, what they want.
	And when we talk about it, they'll say, oh, we're not doing that.
	We didn't say we're going to do that. They've named it already.
	They know it's just a phased rollout.
	One of my favorite videos in that group is Richard Werner, who is the top academic scholar on central banking and banking.
	In Malmo, Sweden, in May 2022, I was there, I was on a panel with him, describing the fact that one of the heads of one of the European central bankers told him that CBDC was going to be a chip and they were going to put it in your hands.
	Well, we just had, you know, just a couple of days ago, we had those Russian comedians who had called up Jerome Powell, and he's talking to them, he's talking to Zelensky, but they had done that a couple of months ago with Ursula von der Leyen of the European Central Bank, and she said...
	Yeah, with Christine Lagarde.
	Yeah, I'm sorry, Christine Lagarde, sorry.
	But she was saying, yeah, we're going to basically outlaw cash.
	People can take the risk, but if we catch them with it, we're going to send them to prison.
	That was pretty amazing.
	That is the plan. And they're going to roll it out there.
	They want to roll it out here. When Biden came in, he picked a Marxist, Saleh Omarova, and she had a paper about how they were going to redefine everything over a year ago in March.
	You had Biden putting out directions to all the different bureaucracies in one of four areas.
	Report back to me how you're going to implement all this stuff.
	How are you going to redesign the financial system?
	How are you going to enforce this?
	So, Department of Justice and FBI, how are you going to enforce this?
	How are we going to write the code?
	And the fourth one, Catherine, was climate.
	And that's the way they're going to sell this.
	That's the way they're going to take down their competition, private crypto coins.
	They see that as a competition.
	I can steal your real estate because my owning it instead of you is good for the climate.
	Exactly. Yeah, that's right.
	Absolutely. Yeah.
	Right. So... The Amarova, who didn't get confirmed, thank God, and you can thank Senator Kennedy of Louisiana for that, but Amarova wrote, and she published it in the Vanderbilt Law Review, she wrote a paper on CBDC and said the great thing about it is if you're worried inflation, you can just freeze everybody's accounts.
	Right. Just like the truckers in Canada.
	Right. So you can freeze their accounts.
	This wasn't a particular thing I've heard, but my problem is it's taxation without representation.
	They want to raise taxes, they just come take the money out of your account.
	That's right. Well, we do have that as well as regulation without representation because most of the rules, they're passing rules instead of writing laws, right?
	So we get regulation and taxation without representation.
	We don't have any due process.
	We don't have any presumption of innocence.
	They don't have to find you guilty. They can just take your stuff.
	Here's the thing. We still do have the consultation and it's worth something.
	If you take it down, David...
	You know the speed at which...
	And that's why they have to get gun control.
	You cannot take the Constitution down if we are well-armed.
	If we have the Constitution and we are well-armed, that has been, for decades, that has been a huge wall between us and the abyss.
	That's right. And we cannot let it take...
	People think, oh, well, I'm not a gun owner.
	I don't care. You know, I once said to a very progressive friend of mine who was dependent on Social Security to live, I said, how do you like your Social Security check?
	And she said, I like it.
	Well, I said, you better support the Second Amendment, because if you don't, you won't get a Social Security check.
	And she says, what does one have to do with the other?
	She literally didn't understand that when you shift the balance of power and that standing army moves in on us, they can cancel everything, including Social Security payments.
	That's right. And we've already had a taste of this.
	You know, we've had the lockdown.
	We tell Main Street and middle class, I'm sorry, you're not essential.
	And we're going to shut down the small business that you've had for long, just like that, overnight.
	Well, but it wasn't just shutting them down, it was stealing them.
	Yes, exactly. Because if you look at the extraordinary explosion of wealth of the people who picked up that market share on those assets, I mean, that was a steal.
	That was not a pandemic, it was a steal.
	Because you get the Fed printing and ejecting $5 trillion in it, a lot of it going to their pals, where they're shutting our businesses down, stealing the market share and picking the assets up cheap.
	That's a steal. Yeah, half of the money that was part of the PPP that was supposed to help the small businesses afterwards, half of the money, more than 50% of the money, went to less than 5% of the companies because they redefined what a small business was in a very cynical way.
	One of the things that I was interested, I had never realized because I was not getting any PPP money.
	There was an anecdote in RFK Jr.'s speech about a small businessman that had fought really hard to get his business established and was in the process of losing everything.
	They threw him a little bit of money.
	It was $17,000, and he had to spend it within a short period of time.
	And I thought, you know, I've always looked at these stimulus checks and as PPP, as universal basic income.
	We're going to take everything from you.
	We're going to give everybody universally.
	Everybody gets a check, a welfare check.
	I mean, that's full of Marxism.
	But then there was the time aspect of it.
	You've got to spend it by this amount of time.
	I said, oh, so it wasn't just universal basic income.
	It was also a taste of CBDC because they can put time limits on the currency as well with that.
	So let me, after you finish talking to the governor and your state senator and your state representative about the necessity of protecting the Second Amendment, then you want to talk to them about the necessity of protecting financial transaction freedom.
	Yes. The reason we had Richard Warner write a great memo on State Sovereign Bank, if you go to Solari.com, just do a search for Richard Warner or Sovereign State Bank, you'll pick up his memo.
	And we're going to publish it in a hard copy later this year.
	And we've made some hard copies and distributed them around the legislature.
	What the state needs, David, is the ability to collect taxes and spend money, because the Tennessee state is a big part of the Tennessee economy.
	It needs to be able to do that without being able to control or be shut down or shut off by the New York Fed member banks.
	Yes. So this gets down to raw political power.
	If they can stop or control your transactions, including with CBDC or the FedNow system, whether for the state, whether for the local banks in the state, or the citizenry, then they've got us over a barrel.
	But if we have financial transaction train tracks that can work no matter what, and they can't stop us from transacting or controlling, that's why we've written this thing on the importance of the state having financial transaction freedom.
	We talked about a sovereign bank like the Bank of North Dakota, but there are other ways to achieve it.
	Now, there are a couple reasons why you want this.
	We just saw the head of the New Zealand Central Bank give a speech after the cyclone and say, thank God we had cash.
	Because if we hadn't had cash, the entire economy would have shut down.
	And this is why you need cash.
	And I said to my partner, John Titus on Money and Markets, I said, I guess he didn't get the memo.
	Anyway, but... Nobody wants cash in the globalist organizations.
	That is the enemy. Well, but here's the thing.
	You know, there are multiple reasons.
	It's not just political control.
	Things go wrong. The electrical system goes down.
	You have a blackout. You need to have transactional options.
	That's right. You know, I get back to transactional freedom.
	That's number one. We saw the power grid go down in Kentucky, remember, for three weeks?
	Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. You've got to have cash.
	That's right. You need the state to protect the sovereignty of its citizens, and sovereignty of its citizens and of itself depends on transactional freedom.
	So talk to your state legislators and the governor about, okay, what's your plan to assure us Financial transaction freedom in Tennessee, no matter what, no matter what the scenario threatening our transaction freedom, how are you going to make sure we are a sovereign state and we are sovereign citizens in a sovereign state when our transactional freedom is threatened?
	Absolutely. Yeah, we have to have some way to get out.
	Everything that they want to do is about centralized control.
	And that's one of the reasons why they're saying, well, you can't.
	In Germany, the people are starting to rise up.
	They're starting to rise up in several countries in Europe because they realize that, and we've seen this here in the U.S., we've seen Biden as well as the New York governor.
	Say, we're going to stop you from having anything that's other than an electric appliance, anything other than an electric heat pump, anything other than an electric car.
	They want to turn everything into reliance on the central grid so they can then shut that down.
	That's the trap, and they're trying to do that with the central bank digital currency.
	They're trying to centrally control everything.
	So we need to have...
	measures where we're going to support people's ability to use cash to use crypto and also to have some kind of a state financial institution that is going to be outside of the central control that is key Right.
	And you've had a group of really excellent legislators in Tennessee working steadily to provide more options.
	They've taken the sales tax off of precious metals, and now they've authorized the treasurer to make purchases.
	Mm-hmm. The state to start purchasing precious metals.
	I'd love to see Tennessee have a buoyant depository.
	Because I think that would, again, just offer more options to the citizenry and the state.
	Especially if they had a depository as well as a publicly owned bank.
	And I know that a lot of the small banks don't understand that.
	They think it's going to be competition for them.
	Right.
	there's about six times the number of independent banks that there are on average throughout the US and so it's had just exactly the opposite because it's going to provide them the ability to have liquidity to have a secondary market and it's going to be something that is outside of the central control issue which is going to shut down and I'm very sympathetic with the banks because the last thing you need is a government bank competing with private
	What you need is you need a wholesale bank that is there to support and protect the banks from, you know...
	National and international enemies.
	Truly enemies.
	And so, because the health of your economy is going to be multiplied by the health of your small banks.
	So you need to do everything you can at the state wholesale level to protect those banks.
	And that's why, if you look at North Dakota, not only is it not competing against the small banks, but the small banks are very much represented in its governance and management to assure the That there is the communication you need and the governance you need to make sure it's working for everybody.
	That's right. And I think it was a brilliant thing.
	I think Senator Nicely called it the Tennessee Reserve System.
	So they understand that this is something at the wholesale level.
	It's not in direct competition with them.
	Just like the North Dakota bank is not in competition with the small and medium-sized banks.
	So you can deal with the Federal Reserve System or you can deal with the Tennessee Reserve System.
	We need to have choice. We need to have – we can't have freedom if you don't have choice, right?
	If we centrally control everything, that was what the founders of this country were so afraid of.
	They knew it was going to be consolidation.
	Centralization is what we call it.
	That's why they split the federal government into three competing, you know, checking checks and balances and why they split power between the federal government, the states and the people was over all of that stuff.
	And we need to do the same type of thing.
	We need to have as many different ways in the financial system and in energy and all the rest of these things instead of centrally controlling everything. - Right, exactly. - Well, it's been very interesting to talk to you Always is. And thank you so much for what you're doing.
	And again, you can find the reports that Catherine Austin Fitz has at Solari.
	That's S-O-L-A-R-I. Solari.com.
	You can find the Solari Report and many interesting articles on culture and all kinds of things that she's got there.
	So it's a great site.
	And just understand that we are, I think everybody knows that things are changing pretty quickly.
	And they can accelerate.
	Just because everything is changing very quickly doesn't mean it can't go even faster.
	So we need to get out ahead of this.
	And we need to put some, you know, firm up the support and make it a little bit easier for the people who are representatives in your state.
	If you don't live in Tennessee, But if you live in Tennessee, now is the time.
	If you live in Tennessee, get on the horn and tell these guys no special session.
	That's right. No, no, no, no, no.
	Absolutely. Absolutely. Thank you so much for joining us, Catherine.
	Appreciate it. Thank you, David.
	It's always a pleasure. And again, I'm so excited to learn that you're a fellow Tennessean.
	Not as excited as I am.
	I love it here. Thank you.
	Have a great day.
	You too.
	The Common Man.
	They created Common Core and dumbed down our children.
	They created common past to track and control us.
	Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
	Please share the information and links you'll find at TheDavidKnightShow.com Thank you for listening.
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	TheDavidKnightShow.com Welcome back on the line with us.
	We have Mitchell Nicholas Gerber.
	The website is stoporganharvesting.org.
	And he has worked on this for 22 years.
	He says he's right now, he's about five hours away from the Chinese border.
	Risking his life. Because you know what is happening.
	If they're going to take prisoners and remove their organs while they're alive, and of course we have known that and heard that for the longest time as well.
	We know that happens with babies as well, as I said earlier in the program.
	So if you are exposing this stuff, you absolutely are risking your life.
	It is a real honor to have you on.
	Mitchell, thank you for joining us.
	Thank you, David. The pleasure and honor is all mine.
	Well, thank you. You said you've been working.
	This is your life's work. You've been working on it for decades.
	How did you get involved in this?
	You know, Dave, to fail to support the good and to fail to expose the evil in this world is unacceptable.
	What is a man who cannot make the world a better place?
	So when I became an American citizen many years ago, I was studying at the University of Georgia.
	I was about to intern at a very prestigious investment firm and I was very stressed out.
	I was very anxious.
	I was running a couple of student organizations and I was just very stressed out and I visited a human rights fair, a culture fair in Athens, Georgia, and I was very intrigued by the ancient Chinese way of medicine and how they conduct themselves in terms of relieving stress and anxiety and to get the body and the mind to a very healthier way of life.
	And I came across this ancient spiritual practice, very similar to Tai Chi, yoga, martial arts.
	I was a very big Bruce Lee fan when I was a child growing up at the martial art movies.
	But this was intriguing to me.
	I was very attracted to these exercises that I learned, I practiced in the park, called Falun Gong or Falun Duffin.
	I brought a couple of clips you can play just to introduce to your audience what this is all about.
	And before we do...
	I learned these five exercises, and I am a God-fearing man.
	I do believe in God.
	I come from a Judeo-Christian family, so I don't want anything that's cultish or secular or anything that's forceful.
	So I was a little bit skeptical and hesitant, and I heard about yoga at the time.
	I was about 21 at the time, David.
	And I was very intrigued by these exercises, Falun Gong, ancient Chinese meditation.
	What is this? One of the Chinese guys that was there took me to the park with a couple of other students at the university and we started to learn these exercises and immediately I thought, wow, this is terrific.
	My whole body started to feel unblocked.
	I had a bit of a pain in my back, in my shoulder because I used to work out a lot.
	And immediately I felt relieved.
	It was incredible, David.
	I'm not a superstitious man, but...
	All these, the area surrounding my shoulder was just popping open, and my whole body felt warm.
	I said, well, this is pretty profound.
	After a couple of minutes of practicing, I've never experienced this.
	I've been to chiropractors, I've been to foot therapy, massages, but nothing as powerful as Rejuvenating as this or opening as this.
	So I looked more into it. I went back to the booth.
	They had a little booth at the fair or festival.
	And I realized that this became the largest spiritual movement in China.
	Following Gong, also known as following Dafa.
	And, however, these people were brutally persecuted.
	And after a momentary comfort, I turned to the rise and I was quite cringed out by the pictures I was seeing of all these people, from professors, students, military people, politicians,
	celebrities that By practicing this in China, you were being tortured, brutally persecuted, and sent to labor camps for an outrageous amount of time, just for upholding your spiritual beliefs and practicing these exercises, namely following God.
	So I was very intrigued, and this took me on my journey for 21 years, exposing the CCP's brutal persecution and then forced organ harvesting, which we can get into a little later in the interview, I don't know anything about Falun Gong.
	I mean, we'll play the clip that you sent.
	But, you know, you're talking about it as a spiritual aspect.
	And I know that there's been this discussion in Christian circles about yoga, for example.
	A lot of people look at that and say, well, it's just exercise aspects.
	But other people say, no, it's got a lot of significant religious and spiritual aspects to it as well.
	And you talk about that.
	I know that the Chinese government doesn't like Falun Gong.
	I've been seeing that for the longest time.
	And, of course, you know, they've attacked the Uyghurs, the Muslims in other areas.
	There's been tremendous persecution against Christians as well.
	And I think they do all of these different things.
	They get political prisoners, whether you're a political prisoner or whether you're a religious prisoner of, you know, Christian or Muslim or Falun Gong.
	They will come after you and, you know, imprison you and confiscate your organs, you know, kill you, take the organs out while you're living.
	So there's been a lot of stories about that for the longest time.
	And I do want to get into the evidence that you have for this.
	And there is a doctor that's also working with you.
	I think he is testifying before Congress today.
	Is that correct?
	Dr. Elbertotti, yes.
	He was the surgeon who came with me.
	I brought a coalition to the British Parliament in 2018.
	He's very busy. He's actually writing a book and testifying in the British Parliament about the Uyghur genocide.
	And I brought to a child traffic report in the British Parliament, David, Dr.
	Enbatotti, who was a surgeon turned bus driver in London.
	I wish I had him on the show.
	He would have really inspired your listeners with the evidence.
	He tells about the Chinese story about how he was forced by the CCP to do a live organ harvesting on a Falun Gong practitioner.
	The man was shot and was brought to him, just bleeding out, and the CCP and the PLA, the military director, was forced to take out the organs of the man.
	And he did, and he was full of grief.
	He was an upcoming surgeon, and he fleed from China to the UK. So yes, there's 52 pieces of evidence.
	We've been doing this since 2006, when the organ harvesting allegations surfaced.
	And they are toxic allegations, but have been confirmed, and we can get into that absolutely not.
	Sure. Yeah, let's talk about that.
	You sent some clips.
	Did you want to play the following gong story clip that you sent?
	Absolutely. That was an award-winning documentary by Scoop Films, two Emmy Award producers.
	And I think it will bring a great context to what we're talking about to your viewers.
	Okay, so let's take a look since most of us don't know who the following gong is.
	We'll take a look at this. Hang on, folks.
	We'll be right back. This is a congressional resolution, talking about a campaign of persecution of Falun Gong.
	It starts with that. In the late 90s, Chinese government surveys said up to 70 million people were practicing Falun Gong daily.
	Health bills were decreasing, crime rates were falling, and morality was rising.
	So why were these people targeted for elimination and organ harvesting?
	Mona Ye was one of the millions meditating in parks every day.
	There was a park across the street from my house.
	Because the first exercise site couldn't hold so many people anymore, it divided into the second, the third, the fourth.
	So at every street corner and in every park, you could see people practicing Falun Gong.
	There was one different kind in society.
	There was many policemen and military.
	It was just a fundamental part of society at that time, and everybody knew somebody who practiced.
	Falun Gong is a traditional practice of self-cultivation, a practice of slow-moving exercises, meditation, and studying of the principles of truthfulness, compassion, and tolerance, and trying to adopt those into your life.
	While morning exercises had always been popular in China, Falun Gong brought more than just health benefits.
	For thousands of years the Chinese people have believed in Buddhas and Daos and becoming an immortal.
	Falun Gong really dared to talk about these things.
	And immediately people took it to heart.
	Oh, the true ancient good things of China have come back.
	However, after 50 years of political campaigns to destroy traditional beliefs, any revival of spirituality was seen as a threat to communist rule.
	Since I was 11, I experienced all of the Chinese Communist Party's campaigns.
	Group after group of good people were targeted.
	There was no faith, no truth.
	Falun Gong stood in stark contrast with communist ideology.
	So it would be very hard for it to be tolerated by the CCP. With more practitioners than members in the Communist Party, the Party Chief, Jiang Zemin, saw it as a threat to his power and overruled the government's support of Falun Gong.
	The Jiang Zemin issued an order to set up a special office called 610 Office in charge of the nationwide campaign of persecution.
	Known as China's Gestapo, the 610 Agency was above the law and could use any and all means necessary to achieve its sole mission to eliminate Falun Gong.
	The nationwide campaign began July 1999.
	Well, that's interesting, and this fits in a pattern that we've always seen from Marxist dictators, authoritarian dictators, but even with non-Marxist dictators.
	They always see religion as either an ally to control the people or as a competitor to them.
	I always like to think of it as these dictators believe that they're God and they don't want any competition.
	And that, you know, so as a religious aspect, I guess from that documentary, they were saying they're bringing in aspects of Buddhism and other things.
	They've been very active to suppress the Buddhists and Tibet.
	They've been active to suppress the Muslims and the Uyghur ethnic group.
	And of course, the Christians and Falun Gong, Anybody that has any kind of religion that might be competition to their governmental religion, and that's the key thing, Marxism is a religion, and these people think that they're God.
	Anything like that, they have to eradicate it, but it's been amazing how brutal that has been, hasn't it?
	Absolutely, David. And adding to your point, we have to understand what the CCP is.
	It is an imposterous cult.
	We call it the Red Devil that was backed by very evil globalist entities in that time under Mao Zedong.
	And ever since Mao Zedong and the Great Cultural Revolution, At least 100 million innocent Chinese have been killed.
	Under the one-child policy that was actually blueprinted by Planned Parenthood, and I think it's very important before we end tonight to show how it relates to the American Republic that is now under siege and attack by the CCP. The same kind of cultural Marxism,
	radical leftism, woke ideology that started in China At the turn of the century after World War II, when China was completely open to a cult infiltrating into its 5,000 years of culture, decimating it intentionally, and installing an anti-God, anti-Christ, atheist cult that conquered in order to kill.
	And there's a great documentary and publication from the Epoch Times, a stellar newspaper out of New York City, That's published in, I believe, 2008 or 2009.
	The communist specter is ruling our world.
	And you can download, you can read it, and you can listen to it.
	Read it, watch it, or listen to it.
	Which is very interesting because, and I just want to read this to you if I may.
	America is the light of the free world and is tasked with the divinely given role of policying the globe.
	U.S. military intervention proved instrumental in determining the outcomes of both world wars.
	During the Cold War facing the menace of nuclear holocaust, the United States successfully contained the Soviet bloc until the disintegration of the Soviets and the Eastern European communist regime.
	And the success of the American experiment with liberty and enlightened governance has spared the world from mass destruction and domination by tyrannical regimes.
	The American founding fathers applied their knowledge of Western religious and philosophical traditions to write the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution of the United States.
	And these documents recognize as self-evident the rights bestowed upon man by the creator, by God himself, starting with the freedoms of belief and speech and established the separation of powers to guarantee the Republican system So the freedom of the West runs directly counter...
	To the goal of communism, while masking itself with beautiful visions of a collective, egalitarian society, communism aims to enslave and destroy humanity.
	And David, the Communist Party, it goes on to say, did not directly take power in Western countries, but the specter aimed to conquer the West through subversion.
	And that is what we're seeing, especially on the radical left, the deception, the manipulation, the twisting of values.
	And this is where I understand why, after all these years exposing the Chinese Communist Party, how much of a threat it is to our own republic.
	It's not a democracy.
	It's not socialism.
	It's a republic. And for the republic, by the republic.
	For the people, by the people.
	And that is why the CCP, not only harvesting a live Falun Gong, who were the first people, the heroes of China, I believe, for my investigative research research, Yeah, that's absolutely true. When we have a pattern of deception, and of course this was a deliberate thing running through Hollywood.
	Running through university institutions, the Marxists love to take over universities.
	That's always been a fertile ground for them in educational institutions.
	But the Frankfurt School that they put in to deliberately push the communist values, and now we see it happening on social media in a weaponized way.
	But let's talk about The organ harvesting aspect of it, some of the evidence that you've laid out here that you guys have discovered as you're investigating this.
	Tell us what is the evidence that you've seen besides testimony from people.
	There's other interesting circumstantial evidence, I guess we could say, of this going on in a massive way.
	Tell us a little bit about that. Absolutely.
	First of all, why Falun Gong was persecuted in China?
	It grew to become the largest spiritual movement, David, in all of Communist China between 1992 and 1998.
	The massive popularity and rapid growth outnumbered the Chinese Communist Party's membership by 30 million people.
	I'm living in a Communist country.
	And an independent spiritual movement or just free-value mind is not allowed in a communist country.
	And they will completely destroy it and crack down on it.
	Also Falun Gong was completely independent from the Chinese Communist Party's control.
	The principles are also, just like Christianity, are incompatible with a very atheist, impostuous cult that believes in destruction, murder, nepotism, inciting hatred, and decimation of the traditional values, and to disconnecting the spirit of the individual to godly and to disconnecting the spirit of the individual to godly grace.
	The fourth reason why Falun Gong was outlawed is because of the leader, the evil head of the CCP, which were the two presidents prior to Xi, Jiang Zemin.
	And not many people know about Jiang Zemin, who just passed away about maybe two months ago.
	He unleashed a war against Falun Gong because it became so powerful and so popular among the Chinese people.
	Millions of dollars of healthcare costs were being reduced.
	Illnesses and deaths were We're being reduced in terms of the medical communities.
	It was labelled as the crime-fighting practice of the Chinese people.
	But because of a jealous and hateful regime's sinister control mechanism over innocent people, they labelled it as a cult, a CIA-backed cult.
	Who are terrorists, who want to destroy people, who try and blow up subway stations.
	This was the propaganda machine of the CCP to demonize Falun Gong and label them as a cult in order to turn public opinion against them, round them up and send them to over 250 concentration camps, David, called the Laogar system.
	And... So unbeknownst to me, from 2001 to 2005, we didn't realize that the forced organ harvesting was going on until in 2006 when David Kilgore and David Mattis, two attorneys,
	one was a crime prosecutor of the Canadian Parliament, David Kilgore, who unfortunately passed away, and David Mattis, who is a Winnipeg lawyer in human rights and genocide law, came out and exposed the crimes of...against the CCP in 18 hard-hitting points.
	And so before I go into that, may I share the second clip with the audience, just to go into the evidence as you would like.
	Is that the one the world needs to know?
	The worst crimes in history began taking place in hospitals throughout the country as organ transplants suddenly began to skyrocket.
	We've been asked to investigate allegations that there has been harvesting of organs of Falun Gong in China.
	Our bottom line conclusion after considering everything as best we could was that the allegations are true.
	I began conducting comprehensive interviews with medical professionals, Chinese law enforcement personnel, and over 50 refugees from the Laogai system.
	But I estimate that 65,000 Falun Gong were murdered for their organs from 2000 to 2008.
	Essentially what organ harvesting means is they're taking Falun Gong practitioners, literally like cattle, holding them in prison camps, testing their blood and other vital organs, and when someone comes into the country that needs a heart, a liver, a kidney, they find a match, they take the Falun Gong practitioner, extract their organs, of course killing them in the process.
	People who are expecting this to sort of just be solved naturally by all we have to do is sit back and they'll fix it.
	This is wrong. The West has to take a role.
	And the one role the West can do is say, these are our values.
	We cannot go beyond this.
	There are certain lines we can't cross.
	This is a red line. That's an absolute red line.
	Enver Toti, the surgeon turned bus driver, says it's been 20 years since he removed the organs from that live prisoner.
	It remains a mystery why so few people have ever heard about the thing he says he cannot forget.
	This is my experience.
	This is a real true story.
	If you keep silence, this tragedy will continue.
	People, they just don't want to touch this evil.
	Because if you touch this evil, maybe at the end of the day, you may not be able to tackle the consequences.
	That is my guess.
	So, yeah, David, I was going to say that those of the gentlemen, those of the main investigators, Ethan Gutman, who is an investigative journalist from America, he wrote a ten-year investigation called The Slaughter, his book, and he is now actually going around the world with Dr.
	Invertotti, David Matz, and others, and exposing the crimes.
	And I just wanted to share with you, there is a There are over 290 reported audio testimonies and over 763 pieces of data of evidence that show the participation of some senior CCP officials, 45 presidents, directors and doctors from over 40 organ transplant hospitals in organ harvesting from fallen lung practitioners.
	We also have the Which is kind of interesting.
	I wish I could show this on screen with you.
	But these are the values from the China International Transplantation Network Assistance Center.
	And it was founded in the Transplantation Institute at the first affiliated hospital of China Medical University.
	It's been taken down, but some of the prices, for example, how much is your body worth?
	For a kidney, the profit for one kidney is $62,000.
	Liver is between $98,000 and $130,000.
	And this is on demand, David.
	This is not just kind of a kidney in the bathtub story.
	This is on demand. You have a large, millions and millions of Falun Gong practitioners locked up in these concentration camps.
	So, for example, I'm an American buyer, or, you know, I can be an American buyer, I can be from Pakistan, from Saudi Arabia, anywhere.
	And it's also including Big Pharma, the medical associations, etc., etc.
	And I would call and I would say, listen, I heard Falun Gong organs are the freshest and the most healthiest.
	I need something. And the doctor will say, no problem.
	Come to China. So I'll fly to China, to Shanghai.
	They'll forcefully blood test you.
	Forcefully blood test you.
	And they'll find a match.
	And they'll take the poor victim out of the camp.
	Fly him. Do the organ harvesting while alive.
	They'll give a little bit of a...
	to sedate very little to sedate the the victim the following on practitioner extract the organs while alive because the more fresh organs the better the price yeah and then they'll burn and they'll take the victim and I'll throw them in the crematories the boiler rooms ovens of the hospitals and then fly the organs are on ice to the doctor to the buyer and they will do the surgery and get a red envelope of cash and
	And like I said, kidneys and pancreas is $150.
	Our heart is between $130,000 to $160,000 on demand.
	So I was almost imagining it's a grotesque restaurant where you take a lobster out of the tank and cut it up right there and then.
	It's that sick. It's that evil.
	It is amazing. Yeah, we've talked many times in this program about the slippery slope that we have in terms of redefinition of death for an organ donor here in the United States.
	And we're going to redefine what we say somebody is brain dead or something.
	I want to change that definition so we can get the organs.
	And so people are aware of the...
	The motivation to bend the rules, to fudge the stuff here, but this is just ruthless mercenary stuff of the sort that we saw with Fauci and the NIH getting the baby parts for their humanized mice experiments and things like that, putting out the orders for Planned Parenthood.
	But this is ultimately where we go if we have a corrupt authoritarian regime that doesn't value human life.
	And also sees itself in competition with every religion that is there.
	Let me ask you, before we get any further into the evidence here, though, one of the things I was thinking about in terms of Falun Gong was a situation in Turkey.
	Was there some well-known leader that perhaps the Chinese officials felt concerned about?
	I know that they have focused on, like, the Dalai Lama, for example, and in Turkey, you had both Erdogan And another Islamic religious figure, Fatala Gulen.
	Both of them were working together for a while to kind of bring back a fundamentalist Islam in Turkey.
	And then Erdogan saw Fatala Gulen as competition because his side of the movement started growing and he wound up being removed by the CIA to the U.S.
	But, you know, there's always this type of thing where a lot of dictators will embrace a religious leader until they see that they are competition for them.
	We just had in Ukraine, for example, they created a new version of the Eastern Orthodox Church to ally it with the Ukrainians instead of with the Russians.
	And so there's always been this temptation to combine religion with politics and or to see any religion.
	Typically, the Marxists see any religion as competition to them.
	Was there anybody that was, was that a factor in them coming after Falun Gong?
	Was there some person who was getting, becoming famous in that?
	Or was it just a kind of a large movement?
	Was that what it was? Mostly because it was the largest movement, but the founder, Mr.
	Li Hongzhu, is an honorary teacher who was nominated for five times a Nobel Peace Prize and also incredible awards around the world.
	He introduced the practice.
	He was a humble teacher in China.
	Introduced this type of Qigong spiritual movement, type of Tai Chi movement, mind and body practice named Falun Gong, also known as Falun Dafa.
	And he grew to the people.
	He immigrated to, I believe, America in around 1994, 1995, I believe.
	I'm not really sure. Or 1996 could possibly be.
	But he started this movement, and it grew to become the largest spiritual movement in China, David, and that's the reason why.
	The number of people outnumbering the number of Chinese people in the CCP, CCP officials, was about 30 million people.
	I mean, you saw hundreds...
	Tens of millions of, hundreds of thousands, tens of millions of Chinese people from all walks of life, from the highest ranking Politburo members of the Chinese Communist Party, the military, more than half of upper class society were practicing Falun Gong at the time, which really threatened the control mechanism of the Kabbalist type of leadership, which was Jiang Zemin and his cabinet, the Two presidents prior.
	But not many people know about Jiang Zemin, a very ruthless, evil dictator of China.
	And that's the reason why he outleashed an absolute war on Falun Gong.
	And he put a bounty on Mr.
	Li's head of over $400 million.
	But I'm also very disappointed on the Uyghur side as well in the Muslim world because they've been doing a lot of business with the CCP. And when you do a lot of business with the CCP, the first thing the CCP will say, see no evil, hear no evil, and speak no evil publicly.
	You can say it in your boardrooms all day long.
	But if you do, the contract between a multi-billion dollar deal in terms of steel or slave labour or any kind of supply in China will depend on whether you keep your mouth shut of the violations of the CCP. So I'm very concerned,
	yes, when people have turned their backs, God-fearing people, supposedly, turn their backs on the genocide and the murder and deny that the Uyghur Muslims are being persecuted and even go so far as to collude with the CCP in calling and demonizing Uyghur Muslims terrorists or house Christians terrorists or Tibetans terrorists, even the Falun Gong particularly, the largest victims of the organ harvesting.
	It just kind of makes you wonder where their hearts and souls are and if you even can call them godly.
	Well, it's the money. And, of course, part of the China price, the cheap prices of goods that we get here, has always been slave labor.
	It's always been based on slave labor, as well as currency manipulation and intellectual property theft, all these different things.
	I mean, it is a criminal regime.
	They killed, as you pointed out, probably 100 million of their own people in the Great Leap Forward, starving them to death.
	But let's talk a little bit, and I'll say this, too.
	You know, we talk about the Muslims.
	You see that happening in the Christian side of it.
	They said, we'll let you set up the church of the three-person self, but we will tell you that you've got to cut certain things out of the Bible.
	You can't say this, you can't say that.
	So you had a group of people who decided that they would cooperate with this authoritarian government that would set parameters about what they could believe and say.
	And we saw within the last few years now, those churches that were allowed to exist, then you had the underground church that would not compromise, the house churches.
	But this church of the three-person self that was recognized, just in the last few years, they've been tearing down their church buildings and coming after them in one way or the other.
	You cannot appease these tyrants.
	And so, you know, you cannot work with them.
	You cannot appease them at all.
	Let's talk a little bit, though, about what is really happening with some of your evidence about...
	The fact that this is being done to criminals, that is, other than the testimony, you talk about the waiting times.
	Tell us a little bit about the waiting times in the U.S. versus the waiting times in China, for example, to get organ transplants.
	Absolutely. And that was what, well, very well said about what you said about, I'm making a differentiation about the CCP churches and the underground churches.
	It's a totally different, that's why people are deceived.
	The CCP and these kind of tyrannical governments and regimes, I won't even call them a government, they were an imposterous cult that infiltrated and took over the governments, just like we've had traders in our republic.
	They have violated the Constitution in so many ways.
	They created a deception and an illusion that China is free, there's no organ harvesting, we're actually lifting up all the millions and hundreds of millions of Chinese people out of poverty.
	It's absolute hogwash.
	And to add to that, in terms of the waiting times, I'll share with you the seven types of evidence that prove the existence of an enormous living organ donor pool.
	So the wait time, you said, the wait time for a donor organ is extremely short, and there are a surprising number of emergency organ transplants as well.
	Now, going back to the, and I have it with me, The waiting times.
	Take a listen to this.
	The United States Department, David, and I just want to bring it up, but the United States Department of Health and Human Services says the average...
	Sorry, it's just loading.
	According to the data published by the United States Department of Health and Human Services, the average waiting period for organs in the U.S. is two years for a liver, Wow.
	Wow. Wow. During the three weeks you are there, then that means someone is going to schedule an execution as you are there.
	So, I mean, it's unbelievable.
	Here, the original, the Oriental Organ Transplant Center in China, two weeks.
	The Organ Transplant Institute of the People's Liberation Army is only one week for a liver transplant.
	So this is insane.
	And they do it on a kill-to-order, state-sanctioned kill-to-order on demand.
	That's what makes it so evil.
	But I have a third clip as well, David, if you'd like to know about the evidence in the United Nations.
	Actually, the China Tribunal was set up to expose this even further with Jeffrey Nisqc, who was the leading prosecuting attorney for Slovano Milosevic of the Yugoslavian dictator.
	And he was accompanied by six tribunal members from the US, the UK, Malaysia and Iran, bringing expertise in international human rights law, transplant surgery, international relations, Chinese history and business to the forefront.
	So there's absolutely no doubt.
	I mean, I know people have a right to be skeptical.
	But at this point, when all this evidence is confirmed over a 22 year period, I mean, if anything, just, you know, do the research, do the work, take responsibility.
	But unfortunately, you still have trolls, you still have agents, you still have disinformation, and people are ruthless because they're all in the pockets of the CCP.
	The common man.
	They created common core to dumb down our children.
	They created common past to track and control us.
	Their commons project to make sure the commoners own nothing.
	And the communist future.
	They see the common man as simple, unsophisticated, ordinary.
	But each of us has worth and dignity created in the image of God.
	That is what we have in common.
	That is what they want to take away.
	Their most powerful weapons are isolation, deception, intimidation.
	They desire to know everything about us while they hide everything from us.
	It's time to turn that around and expose what they want to hide.
	Please share the information and links you'll find at TheDavidKnightShow.com.
	Thank you for listening. Thank you for sharing.

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