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June 5, 2023 - Triggered - Donald Trump Jr
01:21:03
Brett Favre On His Life After Football and Why He's Talking Politics | TRIGGERED Ep. 39
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Guys, welcome to another big episode of Triggered.
And this time we're shifting gears a little bit today.
Not pure politics, not going that way, but we're talking with legendary NFL quarterback Brett Favre about his career, his life after football, and why he's actually now speaking out about politics.
So we'll get into it a little bit, but I think it's going to be a little different and I think it's going to be a lot of fun.
And before we get into that though, I just want to take a couple seconds here.
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So, now, joining us, NFL Hall of Famer, legendary quarterback, Brett Favre.
Well, guys, this is an awesome one.
Super excited to have Brett Favre on here.
Legendary Hall of Fame NFL quarterback.
20 years in the league.
And Brett, when we got on, we were just chatting a little while ago.
You talked about literally you're now recovering from back surgery.
That's got to be pretty rough, but I guess 20 years in the NFL, now you're paying the piper a little bit, huh?
Yeah, I thought I was John Wayne while I was playing.
Maybe I was to a certain extent, but now I'm reaping the benefits or lack thereof of 20 years, actually 19 straight without missing a game.
I sort of say that braggingly, but my background disagrees.
I think you have the most consecutive starts in NFL history, right?
Like 321 straight starts?
Yeah, and trust me, if I had to give advice to the younger guys, that's not a record that you probably want to accomplish.
I'm proud of it.
But, you know, when you're in the moment, you don't think about what it's going to be like at 50 or 55 or 60.
Yeah, I mean, when you think about that, I mean, yeah, that's, you know, in a 16-game season, that's a lot of years in a row to start in a position where some really large men are trying to hurt you each and every play.
I mean, that's got to be brutal.
Yeah, you know, when I broke the record, I think it was 118 starts.
I forget who we were playing, but we were playing in Green Bay.
And it was... Less than 10 years in as a starting quarterback.
And the record was held by a guy named Ron Jaworski.
And he was at the game.
He presented me with the ball.
They stopped the game. And I remember thinking to myself, it's only been 118 games?
I mean, that's the record?
You know, I never really thought about records.
It's certainly not a starting record.
I just, I enjoy playing.
The more I played, yeah, I would get hurt, broke a thumb on my throwing hand.
You would think that would sideline me.
I took a chance and played the next week, played great.
So it's sort of like brought it on myself.
You know, it's like, okay, if I can do it with a broken thumb, I can do it with a sprained ankle.
I can do it with a torn knee ligament.
I can do it with a separated shoulder.
And again, you don't think about it in the moment.
But I really felt like then and as I look back at my career that I was really, you know, and maybe I got a jaded view of myself, but I think I was a great teammate.
I wasn't perfect, but I was reliable.
And I think that's important, especially in football.
You can count on me being there each and every week.
Well, you know, it's interesting.
I see that so much, you know, in my life today, you know, having people that you can actually count on.
When we delve into the world of politics, you know, the loyalty, especially as someone who was a lifetime New Yorker, right?
It was all of a sudden, now you're in politics, even though they knew my politics prior, you know, People, they flip, they change.
All of a sudden, you know, decades of friendship no longer matter.
So I think actually being that steadfast and loyal teammate probably actually means a lot more to most.
And when you talk about, like, you know, being in the game like that, I mean, if the prior record was 118 games and you did 321 straight starts, I mean, you didn't just, like, beat the record by a little bit.
I mean, you almost tripled it.
I mean, that's pretty serious.
Yeah, I don't know if that is just...
Hard-headedness, dumb luck, or just I don't think skill really is involved in breaking.
My head coach when I went to Green Bay was a guy named Mike Holmgren, great coach.
He had two names for me.
He never called me by Brett.
It was either Billy Bob or John Wayne.
You can imagine Billy Bob usually was when I didn't do anything Yeah.
Particularly worth bragging on.
John Wayne was when I dove for a first down.
Three guys, you know, hit me at the same time as I crossed the goal line or whatever.
But fortunately, as my career was further and further into the years, it was more John Wayne and less Billy Bob.
Was that because of experience?
Did it allow you to do that differently where you sort of just understand intrinsically what's going on?
How did that change? You know what, Don?
I started four years in college and was a quarterback for four years.
And we had really good success, but this was in an era where you didn't pass very much.
Now, going even further back in high school, I played for my dad.
And the younger generation doesn't even know what the wishbone is, but the wishbone was a running offense.
The quarterback ran, the quarterback blocked, he pitched, he ran options.
What he didn't do was throw, maybe two, three times a game if we were lucky.
So my point is, even though I started four years in college and two years in high school, I was behind in the passing The terminology, the ins and outs of reading defenses, reading fronts.
I just really kind of relied on not knowing it at the time.
I really relied on just natural ability.
I could dodge and move and make the first and second guy miss and make a throw from anywhere.
And that was sort of my game.
So as I moved on to the pro ranks, Mike Holmgren, his first year as a head coach of Green Bay, was my first year in Green Bay.
So we were there together. He had just previously been the offensive coordinator for San Francisco for many years.
Coach Joe Montana first, then Coach Steve Young.
Two of the most perfect quarterbacks you'll ever find.
Did he inherit me?
A little raw, to say the least.
But... You know, he was patient with me, thankfully, because there was many times that he could yank me out and said, I just had enough.
But I was learning. I mean, I was actually learning as I was playing.
I wasn't watching. And if I had to do it over again, I'd do it the same way.
I know it's kind of like going to negotiate a deal in China and you just learn Chinese the day before, you know?
Yeah, it's a little hard.
You're at a little bit of a disadvantage in that one.
Yeah. Yeah, it can work, but it's hard.
So, yeah, in that 20 years, I mean, you talk about, again, going from the running game to the passing game.
In the 20 years, how did you see sort of the evolution of the NFL? And what's really changed since you retired?
Because it does seem to be evolving beyond the game itself, not just sort of the way the refs are handling things.
And I'll ask you about that as well later on.
But, you know, what's that evolution been like?
Well, in my 20 years, and I've thought about this many a times, how did it change in my 20 years?
And I don't think it changed in that 20 years near as much as it's changed since I retired, which has been 13 years ago.
So in 13 years, the game has changed tremendously.
You can't... The physicality of the game is really...
The only time that guys can be physical is on game day.
Whereas when I play, you practice...
Not necessarily the quarterbacks, but linemen, linebackers, running backs, receivers.
They did a lot of hitting.
Yeah. It wasn't uncommon to have fights and, you know, injuries in practice.
Who am I to say it's right or wrong?
But now you see a more prolific league in regards to scoring points.
And I'm sure the league doesn't want games to end 3-0 or 7-6.
Yeah. They want to see the wow factor.
They want to see 52-50.
So, they've limited...
When I played, there was no limit to how many times you could practice in pads.
Now, I think the maximum number of days that they can practice in pads from day one to the end of the season is 15.
So, you see a decline in tackling and defenses.
Yeah. And more scoring because defenses are behind.
It does feel like that.
I mean, you see a lot of people watching football games.
They see sort of these weird flags on the play.
And I'm not accusing anyone of anything, but it almost feels like the refs are in there to keep that game close.
I don't remember there ever being as many sort of controversial plays in big games that even a journeyman sort of A fan like myself can watch and be like, wait a minute, that's bullshit.
There's something wrong there.
I mean, you know, are the referees calling fouls to change the direction of the game to keep some of that excitement that you're talking about to jack those scores up or keep it close?
I can't answer that with 100% certainty.
I think what I do think is with instant replay, you would think you would get it right.
Yeah, but they don't.
With instant replay, they're doing worse, it actually seems, right?
I mean, it seems to be an obvious catch for, you know, any particular play that's reviewed.
You watch them, you go, well, that's a catch.
I mean, my goodness. And they reverse it.
It's not a catch. And I think what's happened is the rules have been so skewed.
What is pass interference?
What is holding? You know, a catch was...
I mean, you didn't have to...
There wasn't a description of a catch in the dictionary.
But now it's like it's a full-fledged description that no one can figure out.
Yeah. I've seen a lot of that as well, even in the tackling.
You know, that's an illegal...
And I'm like, wait a minute.
How else are you supposed to actually play the game with some of those things?
I understand. We'll talk about concussions because I'd love to hear your thoughts on that.
I get some of it, but it is still a full contact game.
And sometimes the flags that I see and the calls that I see being made on that are also like, wait a minute, we're not playing flag football.
I mean, it is still the NFL and it's tackle football.
Yeah, you know, I think that's one of the things that have changed really most dramatically is hitting the quarterbacks, trying to eliminate...
Hits where either receiver is not paying attention, you know, he comes across the middle, and the ball's over his head, and he's kind of, you know, and I get that.
I think that's okay.
But like you said, they're kind of crossing into the gray area, like roughing the passer.
I don't know what the definition really is, you know.
Yeah. Blowing on the quarterback or, you know, whispering in his ear because I see flags that are what to me is a phantom hit.
And again, I think the rule changes are meant well, but executing the calls has been a little bit suspect.
Yeah. Well, so you have two daughters, but if you had a son, would you allow them to play the game today?
Do you think it's too dangerous?
How can that game get safer, especially for the young kids?
Because I'd certainly be reluctant if my kids wanted to play tackle, just given what I see.
I have three grandsons, Don, and the oldest is 13, the second is eight, and the third is six.
And they don't play football.
They haven't asked me to play.
I haven't encouraged them to play.
The middle grandson plays baseball.
The middle grandson and the oldest play soccer.
The youngest hasn't started playing anything yet.
And as long as they don't ask, I'm not going to encourage.
I would be so fearful.
And same thing if I had a son.
I would be so fearful of What lies ahead?
You know, we all can't be as lucky to have played football.
I should call myself lucky.
I've had a hip replaced in major back surgery in less than three months.
But concussions are very, very serious.
And we're just kind of scraping the surface of how bad they are.
And we just know that they're bad.
Yeah, I have a personal story to that.
You know, my best friend committed suicide almost five years ago now, and he played, you know, college ball.
He played in the NFL for a few years.
You know, really impressive athlete, but, you know, not maybe as big or as fast as some of the guys there.
And his thing to me, and it was, you know, he started multiple companies, smart guy, very cerebral, sort of thinking about it.
But he basically always told me, it's like, when I was practicing in college, in high school, if he hit someone and he didn't see stars, He wasn't hitting hard enough in his mind, right?
What he lacked for perhaps in, again, an elite athlete by any standard, but in his mind, he goes, well, what I lacked in this, I had to compensate.
The way I compensated was I used the weapon that I had stuck on my head You know, to play.
And, you know, he's since committed suicide.
You know, everyone believes it was CTE. It was something he was very open about, talked about, was on a lot of those medications.
I mean, his last text to me was eight minutes before he did it.
And it was just, you know, guy talk, breaking balls.
And then something else took over.
You know, someone else was in the driver's seat for a few seconds, and that's all it took.
So, you know, talk about that.
I mean, as a quarterback, In 20 years, how many concussions do you think you had?
And I think it affects people differently, obviously.
Some people can have a storied career with lots of rough hits and be fine.
Others, not so much.
Yeah, that's the thing about concussions I think that's really scary is there's no rhyme or reason.
You can have one concussion and that can be your demise.
And I can have multiple concussions and live a seemingly...
Okay life, you know.
How many concussions I had?
Had you asked me before I had this conversation with Dr.
I don't know if you saw the movie Concussion.
I did, yeah. Will Smith portrayed Dr.
Benjamin Amalu, who was the coroner.
We did the autopsy on several former Pittsburgh Steelers players and determined that they had what was, I think, an unknown at the time, CTE. And I asked Dr.
Amalu, I said, when is a good time for a teenager or an adult to play tackle football?
And he said, never. And I said, well, I mean, that's not really fair.
He goes, well, concussions are not fair.
And he said, let me just give you a couple of examples.
And I sort of laughed at him because of the, well, he said, the first example, a woodpecker.
You know, I'm thinking, where's he going with this?
And he said, a woodpecker, what's it do all day?
It bangs on a light pole.
It bangs on a tree just constantly.
But it doesn't get a concussion.
Why? Because its brain is encased in almost like styrofoam, for example.
And when the head or the beak hits the tree or pole, the brain stops with the hit.
As opposed to a human, when you hit something, your head stops, your brain keeps moving.
Yeah. You have to wear the concussion, the bruising of the brain.
The bruising of the brain is what the swelling is.
That's the problem. And you can wear all the helmet gear you possibly can wear.
But you cannot stop the brain from sloshing around, was his term.
Rams, you know, They butt heads.
Yeah, I mean, but they're built for it.
And so we're not built for it.
What needs to be done?
Because the game is not going to go away.
And I think the rule changes and the things that they're trying to do from a league perspective, saving guys by not practicing as much physically, Eliminating, you know, the bad hits. But there needs to be some type of drug or something that you can take that can alleviate the swelling because concussions are going to happen.
Yeah. And it's just, it is what it is.
As much as they've tried to curtail The number has gone up or stayed the same, not gone down.
So it's pretty scary.
So even with all the rules changed, even with the sort of advancement in sort of helmet technology and neck bracing and all that stuff, it's still gone up, actually.
Still going up or not going down below when all this started.
It's not going below what they assumed.
Part of the problem is you don't have to hit most concussions.
This may surprise people.
Most concussions occur or the highest percentage of concussions occur when your head hits the turf, the whiplash effect.
Not head-to-head combat.
Interesting. You know, yeah, concussions do hits, but concussion may happen.
But like Dr.
Amalu said, he goes, you know, like for a heavyweight boxer or a professional boxer, it's not the heavy blows that do the damage.
Yeah, they do damage.
You see him get up and he can't even...
Falls down, it's got noodle legs.
It's the jabs, the hundreds and thousands of jabs versus the five knockout blows that do the damage.
That's interesting. Yeah, I was talking, a friend of mine's a pretty, you know, high-level neurologist.
He acts as, you know, a judge for a lot of, you know, sanctioned boxing matches as well as, like, UFC-type stuff.
And he actually, it was sort of interesting because you think of, like, you know, UFC, the MMA stuff, as being so violent.
But he goes, the boxers actually have much worse in terms of the concussion protocols because it's constant, constant, constant.
Constant, constant.
You could have an 8, 10, 12 round match and the amounts of hits in the UFC is like, there may be one and it just sort of puts you out and then it's over, or a few, but it is that constant repetition that you think, again, bigger gloves, not getting kicked in the head, and yet it's the boxers because of that constant repetition that actually fare far worse in the long run than perhaps the MMA guys right now.
Yeah, I think the term is second impact syndrome.
So a concussion, I don't know if there's an exact definition of a concussion, but it's swelling of the brain is what I like to describe it as.
So it can be minor, it can be major.
So you have a minor concussion, don't even really know.
Maybe a star just You know, a sparkler, a corny eye.
But you're able to function. You're able to talk.
You don't have a headache.
You're not groggy. But you go right back in the very next play, and you get another one.
Yeah. That is devastating, as I've learned.
And I think the term is second impact syndrome.
So what you're saying with the boxer, the repeated blows, I mean, they do their damage.
You're watching – You go, surely that doesn't hurt.
Maybe it doesn't hurt, but it's doing damage because there's swelling in the brain.
It's not going down with each jack.
Yeah, that's interesting.
Now you're sitting there at home on a beautiful fall Sunday.
Do you miss being out in that arena?
Absolutely, 100% no.
No. Wow. I thought that was going to be absolutely 100% yes.
You've been there, done that, you had enough.
Been there, done that, enjoyed it.
Knowing all the things I know now, would I do it the same way?
Probably. Which sounds ridiculous.
But I probably would.
But I accomplished way more than I dreamed of accomplishing.
I dreamed of playing professional football.
That or baseball was all I had.
And I was able to do it.
And do it at a I didn't imagine.
So when it was over, I was like, I don't miss it.
And physically, I was beat up pretty good.
So what made you get into it in the first place?
What was like, I'm going football.
I'm going that route. Well, my dad, growing up, I got an old brother.
I got a younger brother and a younger sister.
My mom and dad were high school teachers.
We all went to the same school.
First through 12th was all right there together.
So we all rode together.
We rode home together. My dad was the high school football coach.
I think when it was all said and done, he coached 35-plus years as the head coach at that particular school.
My mom was a special education teacher.
She did that for...
God bless her for 25, 30 years.
So, you know, you kind of do what your parents do.
Guilty as charged.
My dad was a mechanic or a rancher.
I probably would have gravitated more to that.
But after school, we went over when we were young kids and we We ran balls in.
We shagged fly balls in the summer for baseball.
And so that's really all I knew and where my comfort zone was.
I really wasn't exposed to anything else.
Yeah. When did you realize, like, hey, man, there's a chance I could play in the NFL? Did you ever envision that?
Did it just happen?
You know, you hear these stories about guys that they weren't even great, and then they just sort of blossomed at a certain point.
What was your journey like there?
If I would have known the odds, I may have not made it.
Yeah. But I was naive.
Naive served me well.
You know, not too many guys make it and don't throw, but five to ten passes in high school.
And I got one offer, one scholarship offer, and that was Southern Miss.
Obviously, it was an easy decision.
You go to the school that wants you.
But I knew, at least I thought I knew while I was in high school, There's three high schools in our county.
Still is. And not a big county.
Not big schools. Still not big schools.
So basically what I compared myself to was the locals.
And not only in football, but in baseball.
I knew I had something that no one within, you know, local paper territory or local news territory had.
I could throw Now, I didn't know who I was throwing it to, but I knew I could throw it better than anyone.
I was throwing the ball 75 yards.
Now, the game was way more than throwing it far.
Yeah. But I knew I had talent.
And the same was, if you asked me back then, what do you have a better chance of playing, baseball or football at the pro level?
I would have said baseball.
I played multiple positions, hit both ways.
Started as an eighth grader in high school.
There's a lot less thinking involved in baseball, if that makes sense.
I think you're also not worrying about a 350-pound dude about to run you over every time.
Absolutely. Just in terms of the process, that makes it a little bit easier, I think.
Absolutely. Absolutely.
But, you know, I went to Southern Miss to play both.
And really thought that, again, had you asked me as I was going into the school for the first day, what do you think you're going to play first at?
Baseball or football? I would have said baseball.
To think that I was the last guy that they signed a scholarship to the university that year.
I was the last guy on the totem pole.
As far as the quarterback room, a couple guys got hurt, a couple guys didn't play as well.
I got a shot on the scout team against the first string defense, ran around like a chicken with his head cut off, made a couple plays, threw the ball like 75 yards, and people were like, Whoa.
If we can harness this, maybe we got something.
That happens.
I mean, I remember I was having the conversation with a couple of friends.
I was in Massachusetts with some buddies recently, and I remember being with them like...
You know, almost 20 years ago now, I guess, when Drew Bledsoe got sacked and took him out of the game.
And, you know, these guys, you know, I call them assholes affectionately, but, you know, they're crying about what's going on.
And, like, you know, this unknown QB comes in, and it's Tom Brady, and they can't believe it, and they're pissed off.
And yet, at the time, who would have known that that would have been the start of another dynasty, you know?
So, yeah, you never know what's going to happen sometimes.
You never know. I mean, I... In regards to that situation or similar situations, I think there's more guys who, for example, Kurt Warner, undrafted, played in the Arena League, now he's a Hall of Famer, had a wonderful career.
Tom Brady was, I think, drafted in the last round, seventh round.
Who knows if he'd have gotten a chance to play, had Bledsoe not gotten hurt that night.
Yeah, you wonder how many guys are like rock stars that will never actually get to see that potential, that are never going to get to actually shine.
It's sort of a, you know, I get it, because it's interesting, because, you know, ultimately, you know, the NFL, it may be like the ultimate meritocracy, right?
Like, you ain't playing if you're not great, if you're not making those things happen, which is, Which is sort of interesting, given perhaps some of the political leanings that they have these days, because it's sort of the ultimate meritocracy, and yet that's not what they're pushing these days, sort of on the political side of things.
Yeah, you know, I remember my first five or six years, I was kind of feeling my way through, kind of, you know, from afar, just kind of gazing, kind of like sitting in an airport, you know, you just kind of study people and form opinions and things like that.
And It seemed like, to me, the guys that were drafted highest on the teams that I played on, and quite frankly, the other teams, failed more often than guys who were drafted last or were not drafted who actually succeeded.
But the thing is, the guy that was drafted, say, the first round, he's going to get two years for sure just because he was drafted.
Not because they're going to try to get their money's worth to prove that they made the right decision in drafting him.
Even if the guy behind him In a preseason game or came in and, you know, mop up effort and did well.
He's not going to get the chance right away.
They're going to milk the first guy until they just, like, they can't do it any longer.
I see that. I saw that all the time.
Yeah, I mean, yeah, you have the sunk cost.
Like, we have to recoup this.
We went all in. Absolutely.
I guess you see that a lot historically.
I don't even know recently, but like, with a lot of the Heisman Trophy winners, right?
That, you know, sort of, you know, some are great, but a lot has sort of underperformed what would have been, you know, going as essentially a number one player in the league.
Yeah, I played with a couple of Heisman Trophy guys, one in particular, Ty Dedmer, who actually had a really good career.
He was drafted by the Packers, great friend of mine, avid hunter, just a good dude.
He was one of the guys that, of the Heisman Trophy guys that I had met in person.
I've met a great deal. And I looked at him and I'm like, you do not fit the Heisman Trophy mold.
He looked like a janitor. He had a pot belly.
He was 185 pounds.
He had an average arm at best, probably below average.
But he had a high football IQ, and he was a great leader, and he was in the right system.
I would have bet the farm that he wouldn't have made it to the NFL as a week-in, week-out starter.
But yeah, he was traded to Philadelphia.
I think he was a starter for eight to ten years, had a good career.
But most of those guys don't make it.
They get a shot. But they don't make it.
Is it their product of the team that they played on?
Number one team in the country?
How can you play bad if you're playing for the number one team in the country?
I don't know.
But those guys often get a better shot to succeed just because of what they accomplished or where they rank.
That doesn't always relate to success.
When did you know...
Hey, it's time to retire.
Was there something that clicked in your head?
I did it three times, Sonic.
I feel like I could beat the crap out of my 25-year-old self right now.
You know what I mean? But at the same time, the thing I miss about youth is not waking up sore every day for no reason.
When did you know it was time?
Well, I thought I knew I did it three times.
It was much more difficult than I thought it would be.
The first time I retired, we had just lost the championship game.
We had a great year. It was year 16 for me as a Packer, year 17 as an NFL player.
We just lost a heartbreaker, the NFC championship game at home in Green Bay, colder than hell against the Giants.
We played pretty doggone good.
They played just absolutely great down the stretch, including our game, and beat us.
And it was a devastating loss.
I just remember when I went home back to Mississippi, the last thing I wanted to think about was football.
All I could think about when football was brought up, like someone said, oh man, tough loss.
Yeah. I didn't want to hear it.
And I assumed that come March, April, May, June, kind of like when you're in grade school, you can't wait for summer break.
And then, you know, a couple weeks before school starts back, you're kind of like, I'm ready to go back.
Strangely. Because you can't wait to get out.
I mean, you're chomping at the bits to get out.
That's sort of the tug of war with the NFL season as you progress in years.
Yeah, you see that a lot.
Guys, they're ready to retire after that last game, and then about two months later, they're like, okay, it's time.
I mean, I know we share something else in common, which is we like hunting and the outdoor stuff, and it's like that.
By the time you're getting sort of sick of one of the seasons, something else is coming in.
And then the second you're sick, it's something else.
So you love the general game and participating, even if you're getting...
Either tired or worn out from one aspect of it, you know, that desire always kind of clicks back in eventually.
Yeah, you know, you're absolutely right.
The first time I retired, the head coach, Mike McCarthy, who's the head coach of the Cowboys now, good guy.
We lost a heartbreaker.
I go home about three weeks after I got home, so it was early to mid-February.
He calls me and says, hey, man, you know, Hope you're getting over the loss.
And I wasn't.
You know, I wasn't feeling like...
No, let me back up.
One of the things that would prove to be the toughest decision that particular year on whether to retire or not retire, my best season as a Green Bay Packer, and I played 16 years there, was that season, the last season as a Packer.
So... If the team wanted me to go in a different direction, and I'm not saying they did, but just say if they did want me to go in a different direction so they could play their young quarterback Aaron Rodgers, which I totally get.
Or if I was thinking, go out when When you're not playing as well.
I mean, the writing's on the wall.
That wasn't the case for either team, either side, the management or myself.
Because I had my best year statistically in 16 years.
And I'm thinking, hell, I still can play.
Now, I didn't really have the heart for it come March, April, and May.
And I was waiting for that spark.
But they wanted an answer before that spark came.
So I gave them an answer that...
Ultimately, I changed and came back, but it was traded to the Jets.
Retired after that one year with the Jets.
I tore my bicep.
I was like, you know, do I really want to keep doing this?
And I felt like I didn't want nothing against the Jets, but I wanted to play against the Packers.
And I couldn't have played against them with the Jets.
So I retired. I had surgery on my bicep.
Whether I played or not, I had surgery.
The Vikings came calling.
I said, I really don't...
I was thinking to myself, do I really want to go through another training camp?
Learn a whole new atmosphere.
You know, Green Bay for 16 years, there was no traffic.
I knew where I was staying.
I knew where the... Where the places were that were busy if I wanted to go eat.
I had my hunting land that I had access to.
I had my comfort zone.
Do I really want to learn a new comfort zone again?
No, I didn't.
But I wanted to play at least against the Packers two times.
And the only way to do that was to assign with the Vikings.
So I came out of retirement, played, had a great year.
Came back for the second year.
It was a terrible year for the team, for myself.
And I knew if there was any...
I mean, it was 20 years.
But I came back and I was kind of like, I don't know, you know.
Had a bad year. And I said, the writing's on the wall for sure.
I mean, you know.
And I got beat up pretty good that year on top of the previous 19 years.
And I was starting to feel it.
So, like, recovering...
Normally, I'd get banged up on Sunday.
Come Wednesday, I felt pretty good.
Well, my last couple of years, I'd get banged up on Sunday.
And the next Sunday, I was just starting to feel like I was feeling better, just in time to do it again.
Yeah, that's a little different.
When you get to aggregate all the banged up through a 16-week season, it's a little bit more problematic, I guess.
Yes, absolutely.
What are your thoughts on, I'm seeing sort of the NFL trying to do this stuff, the expansion into Europe, you're seeing the European games.
Do you think that's going to work?
I mean, football sort of feels like a uniquely American sport, just like I don't understand cricket or rugby.
Do you think it can work?
Well, the best example or answer I can give is through my son-in-law, Alex.
Alex is from Manchester, England.
Team over, I mean, obviously a huge soccer guy.
Team over here to play soccer.
Got an NAIA scholarship at a small school here in Hattiesburg.
Met my oldest daughter.
They got married.
He sort of adopted NFL football.
He plays fantasy football and all that stuff, but he's a Man United guy.
And I've asked him, I'm like, you know, they're playing these games at Wembley.
You know, what used to be one, now it's like, seems like almost every week, the latter half or the middle third of the season.
Is it going to succeed?
He says, I think so. He says, look, we don't know people who live over there.
He said, I've learned a lot by being in the States.
But he said, they don't know a punt from a handoff.
But they love the novelty part of it.
And they don't care if it's the Cowboys and Raiders playing.
It could be Jacksonville and Cleveland.
They don't care. So I think as long as they don't overdo it, they kind of leave you kind of salivating for more.
However you do that, I don't know.
But it seems to be, you know, having a team over there, though, would be a totally different scenario because the travel, the money you're going to spend to travel is unbelievably high.
Well, and beyond that, I would think the toll it takes on the players, you know what I mean?
I travel probably more than just about any human being in the planet.
I do, you know, probably 300,000 miles a year.
And, like, you go to Europe, you know, again, if you're looking to perform at an elite level, fine.
I can go to a meeting a little bit tired.
It's not going to change much. You get on the field with someone looking to take your head off, and you're a little bit slow because of jet lag or something like that.
I could see that being problematic.
I mean, you could take a California team and you send them eight time zones forward to the UK. Right.
I mean, I think in a seven-day-a-week scenario, I could see that being problematic and difficult to recover from.
Absolutely. I don't know if it's possible, Don.
I really don't. You know, once...
I never played over there.
We played a preseason game in Tokyo.
My gosh, what a long trip.
Right after the game, we showered and we flew home.
Luckily, I played maybe a series or two and I didn't get banged up.
That was 15, 16 hours nonstop.
Again, having one or two games or, you know, Chicago play a game, Green Bay play a game, San Francisco play a game, and then switch around the next year.
So, but not having a full-fledged schedule that teams have on.
Yeah, have every team play one game there somehow like that.
That way, you know, sort of everyone's at least at the same sort of, you know, disadvantage.
Now, you could argue that later in the season when it matters more, maybe it's a little bit more debilitating.
But, I mean, at least there's a little bit of, you know, straight lining.
You're spreading it out over everyone.
Yeah, you know, I think I wish I would have gotten a chance to play a regular season game over there.
Just to experience it.
I can't say that I would want to do it every year.
If they said, all right, Packers, you're going to go every year at least once.
I don't know if I would like that or not, but at least once I would want to give it a try.
Yeah, no, I think, yeah, it's got to be a cool novelty, even as a player, to be able to do that with a different fan base.
But yeah, so I remember, you know, when Dallas got their hockey team, you know, as someone who grew up sort of playing hockey, and you see, like, people went there.
It was the social thing. They went there for the fights.
No one really understood the art of the game itself, but it didn't matter.
It was still a thing.
So I imagine that's probably now.
People get it now, and they've been exposed.
So, you know, it'll take a little time to adapt, but they probably will get it eventually.
Yeah. Yeah, it's going to be interesting to see, like, what you just said.
You know, once they kind of get it, will they continue to get it?
Or will they say, well, Matt, I've had enough of that.
You know, it's not going to take soccer's play, so I'm going back to Man United.
So it'll be interesting.
Yeah, no, I think it'll be cool.
Listen, I think it could be important for the game and for the future of the league.
So speaking of some of that, that future of the league, what are your thoughts on now that college players being able to get paid off their likeness?
Some of these young kids coming in there could be making millions.
Do you support the idea of that?
Do you think it's great?
Are there downfalls? What are your thoughts on that right now?
I think everyone has an opinion on it, but I do think that there needs to be more regulation.
And maybe there is.
I just don't know if it's been regulated.
Yeah. Does the player get the money before he plays his first down?
Does he pay taxes on it?
What happens if he transfers?
Does he take the money with him?
Or does he give a portion back?
Yeah. I think teams that, for example, SEC, Southern Miss is in Sunbelt Conference.
Decent conference.
It's not the SEC. SEC, per team, When my daughter was a senior, she was getting recruited for volleyball.
We went to South Carolina for a recruiting visit, University of South Carolina, and their facilities were outstanding.
And the AD there, Ray Tanner, great guy.
I said, Ray, man, he said, this is a college athletic dorm.
So all golf, tennis, football.
And I'm like, that ain't no dorm.
That's luxury condos.
I mean, they had Chipotle.
They had, I mean, all kinds of stuff like in the, I think they called it Grotto or something there.
It was unbelievable. And I said, amazing.
And he goes, we got a problem that you don't have at Southern Miss, knowing that I went to Southern Miss.
And I sort of knew where he was going with it.
He goes, our problem is how to spend the money.
Your problem is how to get the money.
Yeah. I can see it creating a conflict where you actually get, A, while I love the idea of some of these kids being able to, I'm a capitalist, you know, obviously, and I think there's also sort of something messed about the schools controlling all of this money, making all of the money off of them, but I think Now you get this situation where you could really almost make the leagues totally uncompetitive because two or three schools are going to get everyone.
I think you probably already have a little bit of that problem just because, you know, where it maybe puts them for the future.
But you start adding the money component to that.
And it's like I could see four or five schools basically getting every recruit and no one else getting anything.
And you just have these sort of steamroller leagues that, you know, I think could just be bad for the game.
Well, you're seeing it now.
I mean, the SEC dominates.
Obviously, Alabama and Georgia have dominated, I mean, the last ten years.
I don't see that changing.
If it does change, those two will still be in the thick of it.
There will be a new SEC team that will emerge.
Ohio State will be there.
Your other suspects, a couple West Coast teams, you know, maybe a Texas, Oklahoma, maybe a TCU. But the pool is pretty small.
You know, my question is, who pays the NIL? Like Southern Miss doesn't have any money.
Their TV contract in 2017 was $250,000 per team for the Conference USA TV contract.
The same time, the SEC contract per team was $60 million payout per team.
That's hard to compete against.
So, you know, Every college player gets a stipend.
The stipend at Ole Miss and Mississippi State is quite a bit more than it is at Southern Miss.
You can't fault the player.
Same thing with NIL. If somebody's going to pay a player $10 million before he plays a snap, You can't fault the player.
No, of course not. Hey, like, I mean, that's the, yeah, of course not.
I think what's going to happen, Don, is you've got a head coach who's making, let's just say $3 million.
There's coaches making a lot more, but just making $3 million a year.
And he's got a rookie, I shouldn't even call him a rookie, fresh out of high school guy, who's making more than he is.
And let's say this kid's got a bad attitude.
He's like, I'm not practicing.
You know, I don't feel like it today.
As the head coach, do you not only deal with that, but start the kid because the boosters, whoever's paying the NIL, I want to see my guy play.
So you're in a huge conflict.
I didn't even think of that aspect of it, but you're right.
I could see that being very problematic.
Yeah, I don't know how it plays out.
I don't know who wins that.
Does the booster or...
Is NIL only You know who wins?
It's the money. The money always wins, I think, unfortunately.
I can see that being scary.
Speaking of which, the other big one that you see right now is the sports gambling.
It's everywhere. Every time you turn on the TV, it's filled with commercials, in-game information about betting.
They're talking about lines during the game.
It's sort of interesting to see, considering it was illegal.
Just a few years ago.
How do you think that's going to change the game?
Well, I was never...
I mean, I was a lot of things, but I was never a gambler.
Yeah. When they built casinos here in Mississippi, I would go in there and I would throw like...
12 white chips down.
And if you didn't know anything, you'd think, man, that guy's high roller.
It'd be $12. Exactly.
You know, I never got the gambling thing, thank goodness.
But I think I just find it hard to believe that a player could bet it.
On the game that he plays in.
Now, if the guy, I'm not saying it's right or wrong, but I just find it hard to believe.
And I know that there's crazy things that go on out there.
If I were ever going to bet, I was going to bet on myself.
I see that as okay.
Yeah, listen, your incentives are aligned, so I can see that, but I also see it sort of ripe for the other side when it's just so clear, so easy to, yeah, you can shave a point, you miss one pass.
It's much easier to play back.
Yeah. On purpose.
Hey, Brett, put me in, coach.
I can play bad in the NFL. I could be a total disaster.
Absolutely. I could not shine.
That's something that will never happen.
I would never be good in the NFL, but I could be really bad, so maybe this is my chance.
Yeah, I think that's where maybe gambling...
I think that there was a story not too long ago where a college basketball team was...
It was missing free throws and shots on purpose.
Yeah. Because they were – and I can't think of the team, and maybe I'm wrong.
But, you know, if you think about it from that perspective, that, okay, I control the game as a quarterback.
I control the game as a pitcher.
At least while I'm in, they can always pull me.
Yeah. You know, I can walk the first four batters and guarantee that one run is going to come in.
You know, especially when someone says, hey, I'll give you a million dollars if you keep the score under 30 points.
When you're controlling or have a great deal of control in scoring and not scoring.
So is the fact that gambling is seemingly everywhere now make it even more of a problem or a more pressing issue?
I don't know. Yeah, I guess they could always find a way to do it if they wanted to, even prior to it being just so readily available.
But yeah, it feels like potentially it's more ripe for the issues.
But I do get it. I mean, I remember, you know, in college, you're sitting there like, you know, even if you're putting 50 bucks on a game, it made it That much more exciting because there's something more at stake, especially if you're watching some random game that you don't have a dog in the fight.
You're not watching your college or your favorite pro team or whatever it is.
It changed the dynamic of that.
So I certainly understand both sides of it, but it does seem a little bit scary.
Yeah, it does. Again, unfortunately, I dabbled in drinking and pain pills.
Thank goodness I didn't dabble in gambling, too, because three strikes and you're out.
Yeah, that would be problematic.
You saw it happen to some of the people, whether Pete Rose, if you're talking baseball and stuff like that.
By the way, I think Pete Rose should be in the Hall of Fame, especially after what they've legalized and how things are...
Looked at and perceived in today's game.
Oh, I think it's one of the craziest things in the world, but yeah, I think it's one of those where I guess the league's trying to teach him a lesson, but he was betting on himself too.
It's like, I get there's a rule, but there's no incentive for fraud there.
Yeah, the guy's like, hey, I'm going to get the hit, the winning hit.
I'm going to bet on him. Yeah.
It's better than, okay, I got an opportunity to win this game, but I'm going to strike out on purpose.
Yeah. The first and the last.
Yeah, two different deals. As you've been watching, I mean, you're, I guess, one of the few sort of, you know, you've always been sort of conservative.
It's always been pretty clear where you stand out there.
But, you know, the NFL itself as a league really likes to signal, you know, Everything's super liberal.
Do you have conversations with some of the coaches or the players?
Are they on that side or are they just like, oh crap, I can't believe we're doing it and it's the league?
What do you see going on in the NFL right now?
Some of this stuff seems so extreme.
Yeah. It's like, I don't know who they're catering to because it certainly doesn't feel like it's catering to their fans.
You know, I get there's definitely some players, you know, that believe in some of those things, probably not all of it.
You know, what are your thoughts there?
My thoughts are strictly that.
My thoughts, I really haven't had in-depth conversations with present players and, for that matter, present coaches.
But my impression is, There's an enormous amount of fear of saying or doing anything that will disrupt the other side.
You know, cave into something that you don't necessarily believe in because you're fearful that you're going to get tons of backlash.
That's my perception of how things are playing out.
Yeah, because I'm watching some of these things, and I'm like, I don't get it, because it doesn't feel like they're speaking to their fans, and so they're fearful of someone who has nothing to do with the business model, in my opinion, but maybe I'm wrong.
Now, you've also been...
I've certainly noticed in recent weeks, you've actually been a little bit more out there talking about politics.
You commented on...
On Tucker's firing, you'd mentioned, you know, that America was in much better shape under Trump.
I don't, you know, I think that's pretty obvious.
I don't think there's a metric out there that would disagree with that statement.
But, you know, what's behind sort of being more vocal about it these days?
Well, I think the opportunity to speak on it came up.
And when given the opportunity, I haven't like Searched out opportunities to talk.
I usually just mind my own business, but if I'm in a position where I'm asked about it, I'm not going to be like most and be scared to say what I feel.
I'm not saying I'm right.
I feel like I am, to a certain degree.
I think some things that we're arguing over and talking about, it seems like daily, are so Ridiculous.
Ridiculously insane.
I can't believe we're even having a conversation about guys being able to go in the girls' bathroom.
I know there's way more to it than that.
But I mean, I got daughters.
Yeah. Yeah, my daughter's the same way.
My daughter's an athlete.
She's, you know, a sponsored athlete, young kid, but, like, she's out there.
She works her... Like, if she was playing against...
She's a golfer. And if she was playing against the guys, I'm saying, I can't even think about it.
Like, I wake up some days, Brett, and I'm like, I have to be, like, the star of the Truman Show.
Like, they must be videoing me just, like...
Like, I feel like I'm an unknown actor in a movie that's punking me.
Yeah. Because, you know, five years ago, you think about the things that are out there on a daily basis that people are trying to make really serious.
Like, we would have been laughing that, like, it's a parody.
It's a caricature of itself.
Yeah. And again, I think that the left, in my opinion...
It's together more than the right.
And what I mean by that is they collectively speak their mind, right or wrong, they speak up, they seem like they have each other's back.
Again, right or wrong.
Where the right seems to be, for the most part, as some might call them, conservative.
Just mind my own business, pay my taxes, go to work, do the things that I'm supposed to do, and it'll work out.
I don't know if that's the case anymore.
I think you're right.
I think it's great to have someone like you out there speaking about who, again, I think You know, you sort of know that you've been a conservative your whole life.
You see it in the actions, but I think more of us need to speak out.
That's what we do. We can have most of what we want in a deal in Washington, but we blow it because one guy doesn't like one aspect.
The Democrats take every little win that they can get.
It's 51% there.
Fine, we got it. We take the win.
And tomorrow we start on the remaining 49%.
And we chip away at it.
They chip away at it. They chip away at it.
We can just blow everything over one thing that doesn't even matter all that much to the vast majority.
So we don't play that game as well.
And I think it's because you're right. We don't get together.
We don't sort of agree, hey, this is what gets us to that next step that we can get to where we want to ultimately be in the end.
We blow it before we ever get to first base.
Yeah, I think. And I certainly wasn't raised on politics.
We didn't talk politics.
We talked football and baseball in my house growing up.
And we don't talk politics now.
I usually catch grief from my kids or some family member that, would you just give it a rest, don't say anything?
We get hate mail.
We get these vicious DMs.
I'm like, well, I get it, but if you don't speak up when given the opportunity, I think that the days of I wake up, I do what I'm supposed to do, I do the right thing, I go to work, I'm hard work, I pay my taxes, and I expect that everyone else does the same thing and we just live in harmony.
Those days are over.
So if we don't start speaking up and uniting, it's gonna be even worse than it is now.
Listen, I think 100%.
I mean, you know, perhaps no one knows that better than my family, or certainly my father, and maybe me over the last few years.
I mean, you know, the Russia, Russia, Russia stuff, only because, you know, there's now a little bit after the Durham report, and it's like, oh, you mean I wasn't committing treason?
I'm so shocked to hear this, folks.
But, like, my own lawyers say, you can't go on TV. They're going to put you in jail.
Treason is a crime punishable by death.
Like, you can't talk about it.
But I also couldn't sit back And take the hits and let them lie about me day in and day out.
I just had to say, hey man, maybe I'm putting myself in further jeopardy.
Maybe I'm taking a risk.
I don't care. I have to fight back.
So I understand just how difficult it is not being able to talk about it when you know they're doing the hits and they're planting the stories and they're under gag order too, but they're making sure that someone else is doing the dirty work.
They're de facto hiring the hitman.
That sucks. It's a shitty situation.
Well, this may be a surprise to...
A lot of people, and it may not be.
It shouldn't be. But don't read or believe everything you read and see or hear.
Yeah. Well, I think now, I mean, anyone who's been watching for like the last six or seven years understands that just because someone says something doesn't mean there's like, there's not even a pretense of like, that has to be at least a little bit accurate.
Like these days, they're just making this stuff up out of thin air.
And they can get away with it.
That's what's so scary.
Yeah, well, listen, they tried overthrowing my father as a president.
That's pretty clear. And they're kind of going to get away with that, too.
And, you know, other people, you know, you saw the guy that, you know, did the meme about Hillary Clinton, like that guy's going to go to jail for 10 years.
But like the CIA director with a sitting vice president, a sitting president could frame the incoming duly elected president of the United States.
And like, oh, well, it's fine. That's just politics.
It's like, yeah. No, it's not.
Like, I remember when that was, you know, election interference.
I remember when that was conspiracy.
I remember when that was treason.
I remember when, you know, now that it's them doing it, all of a sudden the definitions change.
Well, it's to fit their, you know, agenda.
You know, that's what I think about growing up, and I'm like, did the news that, which was very little, that I watched and My family watched.
Was it what somebody wanted us to hear or know?
Like it is nowadays.
And that's what I try to tell people.
I'm like, you're hearing, if you're watching the news, depending on who you're watching, which 99.9% of the news is left.
So there's a huge agenda and they control the narrative.
The best way to squash that is don't watch it.
Don't listen. Yeah.
Have you ever thought about running for office yourself?
Absolutely not.
You know, when I played golf with your dad, I had a blast.
And in spite of what people may think, there was no agenda.
We had a good time.
Listen, people don't get that.
He's pretty fun on a golf course.
It was all about the golf game.
He was, all right, you're going to play with me.
We'll play these three.
He got us an ice cream sandwich at the turn.
What guy does that?
What president does that?
Granted, it was hot.
It was like 95 and humid.
But we had a blast.
And no agenda. And I thought it was such an honor to be invited to play golf.
Now, if Joe Biden offered me...
Now, I know that's never going to happen because he doesn't play golf.
I have a feeling that's not going to happen.
There was a time where we all should have respected that seat, that position in our government, the head of the country.
But there's such a disconnect across the board now.
I mean, it's really sad.
It really is. So, you know, as an avid outdoorsman, now that you have your Sundays and your weekends free, you know, what was that like being a hunter growing up, but basically knowing that, you know, 90% of hunting season, you're out there playing football the whole time.
I mean, that was all football.
Yeah, you know, me and my little brother, we had 410.
We had a 20-gauge.
We had a 22-gauge.
But what we didn't have was a lot of game.
We grew up in the woods.
The thing that we probably shot at the most was alligators and gar and big turtles and things like that, which most people don't get to enjoy those.
Eventually, they had an alligator season.
But when I got to Green Bay, there was not really anything else to do but hunt.
Especially when the time changed.
Golf courses closed about November 1st.
Yeah. That dark about...
People hunt season, when hunting got right, about 4.15, 4.30, it was dark.
So, if I got out of practice early, I had a 30-minute drive to the woods, and I was in the tree stand.
And what better place to really start out your, I mean, where I really got into deer hunting.
I hunted growing up in Mississippi, but it's hot.
It's humid. Yeah.
You're just okay.
It's buggy, the deer are small, and you're in the swamp the whole time.
It's fun. Then you get dropped off in Wisconsin, and you're sitting in a tree, and a 300-pound buck comes walking out, and you're like, that's a moose.
Yeah. And it's cold.
The leaves are really falling.
I mean, the little creeks are iced over.
I mean, that's where I really got hooked on the hunt.
It just feels like a slice of Americana, you know what I mean?
I can imagine the Wisconsin, like you're saying, just that depiction of the fall, being in a tree stand, checking that out.
Are you bow hunting or gun hunting, or a little bit of both?
When I was in Wisconsin playing, I primarily bow hunting.
Gun season was only nine days.
And, you know, you're one and done.
Bow season lasted a long time, started September 15th.
It ended... January 3rd.
So if you were like meticulous and patient and you said, okay, I could have killed that buck.
I could have killed that one.
But I'd rather hold out for a bigger one than I killed last year.
If that's what your preference is, then it was perfect.
You know, you had the woods to yourself.
You had...
Ample amount of time.
Gun season, it seemed like everybody was there.
Yeah, and I've done it because that's where my first gun season was, you know, Pennsylvania public land gun season.
And, you know, there's a component, you may be dodging some bullets.
Yeah, it gets a little different.
But yeah, the Bo's season, and especially again, doing the high stress position that you're in, the brutality of the game of football, to be able to just sort of sit in a tree and decompress for a few hours.
I mean, that's got to be the ultimate...
Relaxation. I always encourage, like, you know, anyone I can get into the outdoors, people who haven't had an opportunity to experience that, try to be a mentor and create that next generation of hunters.
I mean, you know, that's what, you know, I'm not saying I was an angel, but the outdoor stuff kept me out of so much other trouble, mischief I would have, you know, gotten into, you know, as a kid.
And it's that ultimate decompression.
It just lets you just sort of collect your thoughts.
It's just awesome. I wish everyone could experience that.
It's definitely the best medication.
That I could have ever had.
To be out, and I grew up in the country, grew up in the woods.
We didn't have neighbors, so I sort of was raised that way.
But being in a tree stand, putting a climber up, shimmying up a tree, turning around, watching squirrels play.
I remember one of the first times I'd never seen a porcupine until I was in Wisconsin.
Mississippi doesn't have them.
And there's one like shimmying up a tree next to me.
I wasn't like scared.
It was going to jump over and dart me with quills.
But I'm like, this is like being front row seat to Marlon Perkins, you know, One of his famous shows where he sends Jim out to wrestle an eagle off the cliff.
Yeah. I mean, you're kind of like right there.
I remember like Meeks, things that I didn't see in Mississippi.
Yeah. Bartons, you know, not that I was hunting them.
Yeah. Just watching them.
It wasn't really about killing something, even though I wanted to kill a trophy buck.
Yeah. I spent a lot of, my wife's like, you must be the worst hunter ever.
Yeah. It's hard to explain that to people, right?
You sit there and like, I always say like, I've ruined a lot of amazing hunts by actually, you know, pulling the trigger or by, you know, by actually dropping the bowstring.
Not that I missed or not that it wasn't there, but it was like I was having, you know, there was an owl in the tree across, and I'm just sitting there being like, oh my God, I'm just totally in this thing.
No one knows what's going, you see what's really going on around you, and you appreciate the nature, the, you know, that sort of, you know, maybe my church, you know what I mean?
It's just total meditation, and, you know, then when it's game time, obviously, you want to perform and you do it, but it's like, man, I was having such a good time.
Now the real work begins.
I got to go gut a deer and drag it out of the woods and all this stuff.
And as you know, when you make that shot, it's over.
Yeah. You know, in Mississippi, you can kill a few bucks.
But most places, you're wanting done.
Yeah. So, you shoot one first day of bow season.
Granted, if it's the trophy you're looking for, great.
Yeah. But, you know, you're going to spend...
You can still go sit in a tree stand if you want, but it's not the same.
It makes you more selective.
Yeah, 100%. I do the sheep stuff out in the Yukon and stuff like that where you take a backpack for 14 days, you may see one animal.
Actually, the gentleman I was talking about earlier, my friend who killed himself, a big hunter, I remember we did a sheep hunt together where we were sharing a camp and everything like that.
I tagged out on day two and I was just like, Okay, well, I stuck around for 10 days till he tagged out, just put my, you know, left my rifle, you know, in the tent, was walking without a heavy pack and just, you know, hanging out with him in, you know, in the wilds of the Yukon.
And it was, this is a couple of weeks before his death.
And like, I just remember being like, The best experience ever because there was no more pressure anymore.
I'm just, I'm able to sit back and enjoy the, you know, all the aspects of that nature and the mountains and the hike and everything.
And it was incredible. And, you know, I got to have that extra quality time with him when, you know, even the outfitter's like, what do you mean you're staying?
Like, you tagged out on a sheep hunt.
Like, you go home. You don't just walk around the mountains for a hundred mile loop with, you know, frostbite and rain and sleet and snow.
It's like, I'm having a great time.
Like, this is the greatest thing ever.
I'm staying. Yeah, that's part of it.
I think what I tell people, it's really the experience.
Seeing some, like going to Colorado for the first time on an elk hunt.
All of a sudden you hear one bugle, and it's smoke coming out of his mouth.
I mean, it's just...
You know, some of the experiences that you get to see unbelievable places, you get to see different animals.
You know, like I grew up with alligators, so I assume everyone saw an alligator.
A good friend of mine moved to Green Bay to run some department store there, moved from California.
Well, they came down to Mississippi to visit, like after my first year.
They bought our house.
He got relocated in Green Bay.
We became friends. They came down to Mississippi for the first time, never even been even close to Texas, better yet.
Cross the Mississippi. Yeah.
We're riding down the road.
We're going to play golf. And he's like, he like starts panicking.
Like, I said, what is it, Rodney?
He said, what was that?
I said, what are you talking about?
He said, I saw something like in a ditch.
Then you turn around. It was an armadillo.
He'd never seen an armadillo.
I mean, I'm like, oh, God, those are...
They're everywhere, yes.
That's kind of like when I go to places, I'm kind of like that, you know?
Yeah. I remember seeing a black squirrel for the first time ever.
I mean, not that it's a big deal, but I was like, Should I tell somebody or what?
Exactly. That's awesome.
Listen, we'll have to do this.
You and I are going to have to share a deer camp or an elk camp or something like that in the not-too-distant future.
We'll do something like this just around the campfire, talking, hunting, and fishing, because that's another thing.
I think one of those great American tradition, something that if we could get every kid off their ass, away from a video game and into the woods, you know, learning the discipline, the patience, the perseverance that it takes to become, you know, sort of an accomplished outdoors man or woman, you know, I think we'd be doing them a major favor.
So maybe we have to do that, man.
I'd love to do it. I'd love to share the campfire with you one day.
Yeah, likewise.
I was going to tell you before we let each other go.
You've got to take me on one of these trips.
I read in your magazine, it may not have been the Yukon, but you went to Kazakhstan or somewhere.
Yeah, I was in Mongolia with my son living in a yurt with the nomads.
I started an outdoor publication because even hunting, like the NFL, even hunting sort of got a Apologetic.
They went a little bit woke. They're afraid to offend everyone.
I think we just have to have an honest conversation.
And so I started the Field Ethos Journal with a couple of buddies just to tell those stories so people can experience, you know, that kind of stuff.
Yeah, so people always ask me, what are the other things you're doing?
I'm like, that's one of them. So go check out Field Ethos.
But by the way, I'll text you later on.
I'll send you all the magazines and stuff like that.
You can see the other ones for yourself because, yeah, you're more than welcome to come on one of those with me.
I'd love to. I'd love to. I went mountain lion hunting in 2016.
Me and a buddy of mine who's a doctor here in town.
And it wasn't on my to-do list.
It wasn't on my bucket list.
But a friend of mine whose cousin Lived in Cedar City, Utah.
Had some tags.
He wasn't a hunter.
He invited me and somebody else.
So I got my buddy to tag along.
And I'm like, what do we do?
I don't know. It's a blast.
Just don't let them see the preachers, Brett.
Ask me how I know.
I write about it, but there's certain things you're not allowed to show anymore without cancellation.
But yeah, those are great hunts, and you're doing the elk herd and the deer herd a major favor when you do them as well.
But yeah, it's one of those.
We've got to work a little harder to get people to understand that one as well.
That creates the outrage cycle, as you know.
Well, it attacks someone jogging.
Oh yeah. It's crazy what they're doing in California and some of those things now.
But yeah, let's 100% do that.
I'll link up with you and we'll get something going for the fall.
Yeah, sounds good. Gotta get started ASAP. Let's do it, man.
Well, Brett, thank you very much for the time.
I really appreciate it, guys.
I hope you really enjoyed that.
I think that was awesome. And like I said, we'll have Brett back on.
We'll do a campfire talk about hunting one day, and we'll also talk about the other things going on when I know what will happen will happen.
Unfortunately, as you said, the process will play out.
It'll take a little bit of time, and they like to drag that out.
But there's no doubt in my mind that you're going to be all good there, man.
So thanks so much for doing what you do.
We really appreciate it. Thanks, Don, for having me.
Really, it was a blast. Likewise, man.
Okay, guys, that was really cool.
Thank you so much, Brett.
That was awesome. I think we'll have to do a lot more of that, just bring in a different perspective.
And again, for people who are like that, who necessarily maybe were Republicans for life, but haven't been all that vocal, actually speaking about these things is really important.
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