Is Russia/Ukraine Really A War Between The East & The West? - Right Now Talks To Nina Byzantina
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There's no manual for parenting apart from maybe don't use your kid as part of an experiment
and don't take them to watch grown men seductively squatting in women's lingerie.
Now apart from that, parenting is a long list of trials and errors and lessons learned.
For me, I've got a simple approach.
Make sure they've got everything they need but not necessarily everything they want.
Because one bowing to every whim would basically bankrupt me.
But it would also leave me with spoilt and entitled adolescents.
Not to mention it would strip them of any desire to strive for anything.
Now, I know what you're thinking.
That's not a maverick approach to parenting.
In fact, it's very much the normal way of doing things.
Or at least it was.
But I can't help but think now that that rule has been flipped on its head.
See, You can't have everything you need now, at least not in many, many people's homes.
Three meals a day in a warm house, they're a distant memory for a lot of people in this country, as the excuses continue to mount up for the destruction and inflation of everything.
If it's not the Rona, it's Russia, it's climate change, none of which is true, of course, it's government policy.
Or rather, it's their master's policy that's destroying everything, because the price of gas is lower now than it was before Russia and Ukraine kicked off, but you won't be seeing that reflected in your energy bills.
And the WEF pawns in Westminster will do nothing to make sure you do see that.
So you can't have everything you need, but you can be whatever you want.
Scotland recently passed a law to say that as long as you live for three months as your new self, then you can simply become the gender you wish.
Self-identification, I think they call it.
Then, of course, you'll have access to changing rooms, bathrooms and sports teams of those people that used to be the opposite sex to yourself.
I mean, What could possibly go wrong there?
The erosion of women's rights has been going on for a while, and this is just another nail in the coffin.
And it makes me think, what happened to appropriation?
Because if I had dreadlocks, I'd get pelters.
The usual Twitter police would be out trying to get me fired from my job, but I can stick on a pink beret, call myself Govinda, and I'm suddenly allowed to take a dump in the cubicle next to your 14-year-old daughter.
It's normal.
Now, I thought the normalisation of madness had peaked in 2020, but it's showing no sign of stopping.
Sorry, I'll excuse the smell of burning.
I've been living the last three months as a frying pan.
Welcome to Right Now.
It's been difficult to find solid sources when it comes to Russia and Ukraine.
When you have Ukrainian MPs tweeting pictures of a child taken from the cover of a 2013 novel and claiming that they're from a Russian artillery attack, you'd be forgiven for taking the whole war with a pinch of salt.
Nina Byzantina is an independent analyst with a history PhD focusing on modern and contemporary Russia, culture and US foreign policy.
Nina joins us now.
Nina, thank you so much for joining us.
With the Ukraine-Russia situation here in Britain, the UK media is very much on the side of Ukraine.
Zelensky is the new poster boy.
There's obviously going to be more to it than that.
Wanting to not sort of talk for four and a half hours, what is the situation that started the war in Ukraine and what's the situation like now?
Well, I would go back to the collapse of the Soviet Union, where the Soviet Union dissolved along the lines of the republics.
But those lines did not necessarily reflect the sort of ethnic and religious constituents in the country overall.
So, for instance, Ukraine as a Soviet Republic was put together from lands that were formerly majority ethnic Russian.
So, for instance, the Donbass region and Crimea a little bit later in the 1950s.
When you have that kind of a massive geopolitical catastrophe, there are going to be consequences.
And we saw some of those consequences with the Chechen wars in the 1990s, the ethnic cleansing going on in Central Asia around the same time, and so on and so forth.
So that was kind of a ticking taking time bomb that was that was set and eventually obviously came to fruition in the 2000s and especially in 2014 regime change in Ukraine and there was an earlier instance in 2004 there was a so-called orange revolution where that first attempt was made so
It's a really complicated issue.
So obviously, what you're seeing in the media in the Western establishment is very caricature-esque, I would say.
And you just have to go back pre-2022 to see that even, you know, BBC coverage was a little bit more balanced.
Well, yeah, I mean, they had, you know, a celebrity here in the UK called Ross Kemp going out and hanging out with Nazis in In Ukraine, and it was shown on the BBC as completely normal.
Now that's a conspiracy theory, of course, that there's Nazis there.
What's public opinion like in Russia?
Because what we're told in the UK is very much kind of Putin just went mad and invaded.
And actually, one newspaper alluded to the fact that he had COVID, which made him mad and he invaded.
Yeah, I think Putin is being diagnosed with multiple illnesses by just watching his videos, so it's pretty amusing to watch that coming from the press.
But the conflict really heated up in 2014, so the Maidan, which in the West is officially called the Revolution of Dignity.
people such as myself would refer to it as a violent regime change and it was
quite violent took place between late 2013 and February 2014 and there was a
unrest in much of the east in in Ukraine at the time so not just the Donbass but
also I guess today it's called the Ukrainians call it me pro we would call
at Dnipropetrovsk, so that whole sort of chunk in the east.
In some places there are mass protests, in other places people were actually taking over the local and regional administrative buildings, so it's quite serious.
The government of Ukraine, so the acting president, Turchinov, decided to initiate what he called an anti-terrorist operation.
So he basically decided to crack down on this unrest in a violent way.
And then Poroshenko was the first post-coup president who was elected later that year.
And he escalated the situation as opposed to trying to give the protesters what they wanted, and they didn't really ask for that much.
They wanted to be more federalized.
They wanted to have their language rights acknowledged, their culture acknowledged, and so on and so forth.
So, in terms of what Russians perceive this as, well, most Russians have been watching, you know, their own people killed for the past eight years.
So, Many Russians were surprised that earlier interventions did not take place and of course the Russian government had attempted to keep Donbass as part of Ukraine on the terms that they were asking by using the Minsk 1 and Minsk 2 agreements that
I recently have been in the press because both Angela Merkel and Hollande have publicly stated that those agreements were basically not meant to reintegrate those regions into Ukraine but to arm Kiev for a future conflict.
So I would say the majority of Russians have been pretty upset by the fact that their, you know, sort of ethnic, religious, cultural kin has been, you know, living in this volatile situation.
I think the death toll pre-February 2022 was about 14,000 and that does include not just civilians but also militants, but you have to understand that some of those or many of those people really were locals that picked up arms to defend their villages.
Is the support still there in Russia now?
In the sense that we were told, you know, and I keep reiterating saying we were told because I know we were lied to massively by the UK media, but we were told that it was basically supposed to be an in and out, you know, put the kettle on, I'll be back in 20 minutes kind of a military Manoeuvre by the Russian military, but actually that you know, we're months and months later So is the kind of support waning or Russian people?
I know we're all in now Well, I would say from what I'm seeing, there's actually a lot more diversity of opinion than the official Western media would admit.
But the interesting thing is that even those that I know personally who are critical of the Russian government, their criticism comes from the other side.
It's not acting decisively enough.
So they want more action and they want this conflict resolved in a more decisive way.
And of course, what we've seen from the Russian actions to this point, so it's almost been a year now, is that it's really been sort of Casualty averse which is why I think I'm not a military analyst, but it looks to me like that's why the government did not Dedicate a larger number of people to what it called a special military operation from the onset But of course Russia has also been fighting different armies I mean there are many analysts who have now stated that including those on the West that the original Ukrainian army has been obliterated Sometime in the summer and what we're seeing now are
So-called mercenaries coming from the West and you know, some have referred to them as allegedly NATO troops.
So places like Poland and again, I'm not a military analyst.
I'm just looking at public sources.
So the situation has been quite dynamic and I'm not sure to what extent the the Russian forces and the leaders initially anticipated the amount of aid including bodies coming into Ukraine.
when this first began.
But I would say the Russian population by and large, and of course there's a little bit of dissent, there's some disagreement, but many, many people from what I'm seeing want things to be more decisive as opposed to more cautious.
It feels to me that Russia is almost in a war against the West.
Already.
Or rather, the West is in a war against Russia and it's kind of just not been declared by either side.
But as you say there, the fact that the Ukrainians, you know, are obliterated and so you have NATO forces in there.
Britain is just sending billions and billions of pounds worth of arms on what feels like an almost daily basis.
Do you think maybe that's why the Russians haven't acted quite so decisively?
Because actually they're aware that actually We're kind of not fighting Ukraine, really.
We're sort of, you know, we're fighting NATO in reality.
Well, I think there are multiple aspects to this conflict.
There's obviously this direct military conflict that has been going on since 2014.
Unlike what the Western media would tell you, it did not begin in February 2014.
22.
Obviously, it escalated at that stage, but it's been going on for almost nine years now.
But of course, there is also the economic component, the cultural component.
So, some have referred to this as the Third World War, you know, for what it's worth.
But obviously, looking at, I don't know how many packages of sanctions there are now.
What is it on the ninth package that the EU has released?
I think I've lost count.
But obviously that component is very, very important.
And it's kind of a longer game.
I think that both sides are playing.
So we're sort of the official Western establishment, NATO countries.
led by the Anglo-American transatlantic bloc versus Russia and its supporters.
So that is kind of a longer game and I think And from where I stand, it seems like the Western establishment thought that sanctions would be more harmful to Russia than how, you know, the effects that they have had.
And of course, you know, there are have been some effects.
Obviously, companies have pulled out of Russia in this big virtue signaling moment.
Massive amounts of Russian money is being essentially held hostage abroad.
So all of those things are important.
Inflation does, you know, does exist in Russia, but it's done a lot better because it's such a commodity powerhouse.
So I think we need to not just look at the immediate military situation on the ground, but all these other components.
And I think the economic one is one of the almost more important ones.
Absolutely.
Because it's affecting people in the UK, certainly.
People are freezing.
People can't afford their energy bills.
Everything's being blamed on the Ukraine-Russia conflict, which is nonsense, but at least it's an excuse that's there for our government to allow people to freeze.
And I'm asking you to do a whole crystal ball job now, but how do you see this ending?
Because this has got to be the only conflict in my life.
I mean, granted, I'm not that old, but I've lived through a few wars.
This is the only one I remember where there's no talk of peace, like no one wants to know.
To the point where actually the Western media, there were two news articles, one in the US and one in the UK recently, that was actually saying, we need to be careful about Brokering some peace with Putin.
That's the first time I've ever heard that.
We have to be careful about peace.
You know, it's extraordinary.
So it doesn't feel like they want to end it.
So how do you feel that it will end?
Well, remember last April there were negotiations between Moscow and Kiev and then Boris Johnson traveled to personally intervene and the peace negotiations were pretty much gone at that stage, which was a good indication of what The Western establishment really wanted for this conflict.
And again, there are multiple levels to this you have the Western military industrial complex that gets to use Ukraine as a testing ground for its weapons by using the bodies of Russians and Ukrainians, which is You know, use whatever adjective you'd like to describe this.
I think I don't want to be censored here for saying what I really think about that.
But I think there are also some other issues like the Western establishment or parts of it view it as something that needs to be won.
And of course, Russia perceives it as an existential threat because it's right on its borders and its own people.
Ethnic Russians or cultural Russians, not necessarily ethnic, have been slaughtered for the past eight years.
So Russia perceives this as a matter of survival.
And I think for the Western establishment, specifically the Anglo-American side, that kind of Overseas of the rest of the EU, which is subordinate like places like Germany for them.
It's a matter of maintaining global hegemony and obviously Russia.
It has a pretty close relationship to China as well.
So for them, this is a way to ultimately challenge China, which obviously is a much larger economically stronger country than Russia.
So, you know the way I perceive this is I mean, unfortunately for Ukraine, it currently is a failed state.
And I don't really see it getting much better.
I mean, some analysts have predicted that Ukraine would be partitioned between the former historic lands, let's say, that belong to Poland or some lands that belong to Hungary, for instance, and then lands that historically were part of Russia.
Others have said that this might be a frozen conflict that will sort of simmer for years and years because it benefits multiple sides.
But I think the pivot to Asia is definitive.
Multiple countries.
You're right.
It doesn't feel like it's going to be over anytime soon.
That's for sure.
No, which is unfortunately not great news for the start of 2023.
But there we go.
But Nina, thank you so much for joining us.
I've been trying to get you on the show for ages, so I'm stoked to have you on.