Dinesh D'Souza - A LINE IN THE SAND Dinesh D’Souza Podcast Ep1200

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Oct. 29, 2025 - Dinesh D'Souza

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A LINE IN THE SAND Dinesh D’Souza Podcast Ep1200

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	Is the conflict between Israel and the Palestinians the revival of an ancient conflict recorded in the Bible?
	The nation of Israel is a resurrected nation.
	What if there was going to be a resurrection of another people, an enemy people of Israel?
	The dragon's prophecy.
	Watch it now or buy the DVD at thedragonsprophecyfilm.com.
	Coming up, I'm going to argue the turning point USA has itself reached a turning point where it needs to define what it stands for, and they need to make the right decision.
	The one and only Peter Navarro joins me.
	We're going to talk about his prison experience and how he's feeling about the prospect of holding the bad guys accountable.
	If you're watching on YouTube, X or Rumble, listening on Apple or Spotify, please subscribe.
	Hit the subscribe, the follow, the notifications button.
	I'd really appreciate it.
	This is the Dinesh D'Souza Podcast.
	The times are crazy.
	In a time of confusion, division, and lies.
	We need a brave voice of reason, understanding, and truth.
	This is the Dinesh D'Souza podcast.
	Yesterday on social media, I posted some texts that Charlie Kirk sent to me, which was immediately following my debate with Nick Fuentes.
	And those have kind of dominated a lot of the social media discourse.
	And I showed Debbie this morning, I'm like, I'm trending on Twitter again.
	And Debbie goes, that's because you never get off your phone.
	So I go, no, that's not the reason.
	The reason really is that we're witnessing something very strange going on here on the right.
	And that is an effort, I would call it, to mainstream anti-Semitism, to mainstream Jew hatred, and to mainstream a type of criticism of Israel.
	Not criticism of just the government or criticism of Israeli tactics.
	It's rather an effort to sever America's connection with Israel.
	It's an effort to demonize the Israeli government, which let's remember is an elected government.
	It's an effort to ultimately say that Netanyahu and not Hamas is the real villain of the hostilities in the region.
	Now, the primary architect of this mainstreaming is, in fact, Tucker Carlson.
	So some people are taking their eye off the ball.
	They think that the issue here is Nick Fuentes, is should Tucker have interviewed Nick Fuentes, is the question of what's wrong with having a conversation, Dinesh?
	Look, I do not take the view, I've never taken the view that Nick needs to be suppressed, that no one should talk to Nick Fuentes.
	I myself debated Nick Fuentes, but the key point is I challenged him.
	I was on the other side.
	I'm not on the same side as Nick Fuentes.
	And so that's why we have arguments.
	Did you notice that in the Tucker Carlson conversation, there are very little arguments.
	In fact, at one point, Nick makes the outrageous statement that he's a fan, quote, a fan of Stalin.
	You would think Tucker would jump out of his seat.
	Nobody on the right can be a fan of Stalin.
	Stalin killed more people than Hitler.
	Stalin was a communist.
	You can't put Stalin anywhere except on the far left.
	And so when you have a so-called conservative praising Stalin, you know something's up.
	But for Tucker, it was no problem.
	Well, you know, interesting.
	Let's circle back to that.
	He never does.
	So, what is Tucker doing here?
	He's being press secretary.
	He's being great uncle, a very avuncular tone, almost like Nick is the fiery anti-Semite, and Tucker is the sort of closet anti-Semite.
	You know, it's, I think of Tucker in relation to Nick, sort of the way I think of Qatar in relation to Hamas.
	So, Hamas is right out there.
	We're going to kill all the Jews.
	We're going to slaughter the Israelis.
	Mom, I killed 10 Jews.
	That's Hamas.
	Qatar is not like that.
	Qatar is like, We actually would like to negotiate a settlement.
	We think that we need to understand what drives Hamas to doing these things.
	Debbie goes, My Middle Eastern accent is very, very poor.
	This is not impressive.
	I don't sound like a sheikh.
	And this is probably true.
	But nevertheless, the intellectual value of what I'm saying stands.
	What I'm getting at is that Nick is like Hamas.
	He's like, you know, at one point, he even suggested that the Jews need to be all killed off.
	Tucker is more like the Tucker wants to be like the more mainstream anti-Semites.
	Well, I'm just, you know, I'm just wondering if we need to sever our relations with Israel.
	I just wonder if Netanyahu needs to be imprisoned for life.
	I'm just asking.
	I'm not taking a position.
	In fact, that could go the other way.
	So the point of my releasing these texts was, first of all, to show that the problem here and the specific reason for releasing the texts is that Tucker is quite clearly trying to become, you could say, the new Charlie Kirk.
	And I don't just mean that he's trying to, he's trying to, in some ways, broadly replace Charlie Kirk in the culture.
	I mean, he's trying to actually become the face of Turning Point.
	And some people at Turning Point seem to be kind of okay with that because Tucker is the headline speaker in their upcoming summit.
	And so they are opening the door, maybe paving the way.
	But of course, Tucker is not Charlie.
	And a very good proof of that is their attitudes to Nick Fuentes.
	So Charlie hates Nick Fuentes.
	Charlie hates Nick Fuentes far more than I do.
	Charlie thinks Nick Fuentes is vermin and should not be platformed at all.
	And I only released the texts to highlight the distance between Charlie and Tucker.
	So the very guy that Charlie despised, and Charlie himself says to me, I've been trying to block this guy for six years.
	And Tucker is basically saying, I'm going to platform this guy.
	And it's not just I'm going to platform him.
	I'm going to softball him.
	I'm going to basically do a kind of cheerleading operation on him.
	And I'm going to bring him into, if you will, the larger fold.
	And I'm going to dare Turning Point USA to do anything about it.
	It's almost like FU Turning Point.
	Here I am.
	I'm going to do this.
	And what are you going to do?
	Cancel me?
	So Tucker is counting on the fact that the top brass at Turning Point, their board, Erika Kirk, Tyler Boyer, Andrew Colvett, all these people are cowering in fear of him.
	All these people do not see another way forward for Turning Point other than to be led by the Pied Piper, Tucker Carlson.
	And this, I think, would be a fatal mistake for Turning Point.
	In fact, I think this would be, quite honestly, the end of Turning Point.
	It won't be the end of Turning Point immediately.
	Turning Point has been raking in money.
	Turning point has gotten an ocean of global sympathy after Charlie's death.
	But let's remember those things don't last forever.
	At some point, it is the organization itself, what it says, what it does, who represents it, the way it positions itself in the culture.
	And I'm quite convinced that anti-Semitism is not going to be mainstreamed in the Republican Party.
	The Republican Party cannot afford it, won't stand for it.
	Trump won't stand for it.
	If J.D. Vance goes for it, J.D. Vance himself is going to go down in flames.
	So ultimately, what's happening here is not that Nick Fuentes is really being mainstreamed.
	What's really happening is that Tucker is putting himself outside the mainstream.
	And my proof of it is pretty simple.
	Name one mainstream conservative right now who's defending Tucker Carlson.
	None.
	All the mainstream conservatives are denouncing him.
	Now, there are a few people who are standing on the sidelines.
	They don't want to get involved.
	And I can kind of understand that.
	They don't want to be in the middle of this.
	But the only people who defend Tucker Carlson, like one guy today, I stand with Tucker Carlson.
	I'm looking at this guy.
	First of all, he has no shirt on.
	Second of all, he has the trademark baseball cap inverted so you can see the like adjusto strap to advantage.
	This is his kind of sartorial style.
	So yeah, you've got, you know, a bunch of like weirdos.
	You know, I stand with Tucker Carlson.
	Telling the truth, you know, he's really got the Jews' number.
	You're going to have some people like that who are basically the residual Tuckerites.
	And they're going to hang with Tucker.
	But I don't believe that there's any future in that for MAGA, nor is there any future in that for the GOP.
	I know a thing or two about being targeted by the government, but you know what?
	Don't give them a reason to target you.
	Owing the IRS back taxes, that's a good way to get targeted.
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	If you miss the October 15 deadline or if you owe back taxes, the IRS is ramping up enforcement.
	Every day you wait, only makes things worse.
	And here's the harsh reality: they have a lot of power.
	The IRS can charge a penalty of up to 5% a month.
	That's up to 25% of your total tax bill just for not filing.
	That's in addition to what you already owe.
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	So go ahead and call them 800-958-1000.
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	Let Tax Network USA help before the IRS makes the next move.
	If you're a homeowner in America, you need to listen to this.
	The FBI has been warning about a type of real estate fraud on the rise called title theft, and your equity is the target.
	Here's how it works: Criminals forge your signature on a single document.
	They use a fake notary stamp, they file it with the county, and just like that, on record, they own your home.
	Wow.
	Using your ownership, they can take out loans against your equity or even sell your property.
	And you won't know about it until foreclosure or collection notices show up in the mail.
	Now, this is why I've partnered with Home Title Lock so you can protect your equity and find out today if you're already a victim.
	Use my promo code, it's Dinesh at home titlelock.com.
	You'll get a free title history report and a free trial of their million-dollar triple lock protection.
	That's 24/7 monitoring of your title records, urgent alerts to any changes, and if fraud occurs, their U.S.-based restoration team will spend up to $1 million to fix it.
	Find out why I trust Home Title Lock.
	Protect yourself like I did.
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	Protect your equity today.
	Go to home titlelock.com, promo code Dinesh.
	Guys, I'm delighted to welcome to the podcast the one and only Peter Navarro who doesn't really need any introduction.
	He is an author.
	He is an economist.
	He's actually one of the, I guess, only three senior White House officials who remained with President Trump from the 2016 presidential campaign all the way through the end of his first term in office.
	He was director of the Office of Trade and Manufacturing Policy.
	And he's a noted China scholar, sought-after public speaker, also a professor emeritus at the University of California at Irvine.
	And the new book with a, well, kind of an unforgettable title, I went to prison, so you won't have to.
	Gee, I wish I'd read this book, Peter, before I was locked up myself.
	This is the subtitle here is A Love and Lawface Story in Trumpland.
	It's available on Amazon.
	Peter's website is justpeternavaro.com.
	Peter, nice to have you back on the podcast.
	I really appreciate it.
	Give us a little bit of a window into this, into the trajectory of your new book, because I think, yeah, go ahead.
	Let's start there.
	Before we get going, I just want to let your audience know that I've always been a big Dinesh fan.
	I love the podcast, but also, as a filmmaker myself, made one.
	I'm just very in admiration of how you go about your craft.
	It's really hard to put out a really high-quality movie and also get it into theaters and things like that.
	So everybody, keep your eye on Dinesh's movies as well.
	I went to prison, so you won't have to.
	mentioned the title.
	It's actually a tagline from my speech on July 17th at the Republican National Convention.
	What was remarkable about that speech is it was literally the night of the day that I left the Miami federal prison.
	And it was a bit jarring for me walking out of a federal slammer, getting on an airplane and winding up on that stage.
	I had no idea.
	how I would be received, but it was just a beautiful greeting.
	My fiancé came on at the end and everybody was just so warm and welcome.
	But I went to prison so you won't have to is basically a statement about this.
	If we don't hold them, and them I'm talking about is everybody who tried to put President Trump in prison and who put me in prison.
	We don't hold them accountable, Dinesh.
	They're going to do it again and again and again.
	And in I Went to Prison So You Won't Have To.
	It's three stories.
	One, it's about the lawfare and weaponized justice that was waged against me.
	And that part of I went to prison so you won't have to.
	I name names.
	It's James Comey, who has now been indicted.
	It's Brennan, it's Clapper, it's Page, it's Strzok at the FBI, it's Rosenstein at the FBI, it's Adam Schiff on the Hill.
	It's all of these district attorneys who went after Donald Trump in these favorable jurisdictions on baseless charges.
	Letitia James has now been indicted, but she also got Alvin Braggs out there.
	You got Jack Smith at the DOJ.
	So I think what happened was my case was so public.
	The first thing they did was make a circus arrest of me at Reagan Airport.
	The first chapter of I Went to Prison So You Won't Have To describes in detail how I was busted out for a misdemeanor, Dinesh, out at the Reagan National Airport with my fiancé.
	They could have easily just called me and said self-surrender like they allowed Comey and Bolton to do, I might add.
	They didn't do that.
	The only person they called was CNN, just so they'd have all of that.
	The problem with my first chapter is I have to revise it for the next edition because Senator Chuck Grassley has been getting all this whistleblower stuff from the FBI.
	And it shows that this guy, this FBI agent who led the five agents who grabbed me, and Walter Giordina, this was like a guy who's part of a massive conspiracy over an eight-year period to not just get me, but Trump as well.
	Dinesh, they had 12 FBI agents out at Reagan National Airport that day surveilling me.
	It's like subject gets in an Uber with his fiancé, goes to Reagan.
	It's like, this is what they do.
	And so I went to prison so you won't have to.
	It's basically a statement about how I think my case, in addition to some of the others, particularly President Trump, Steve Bannon, and others, I think raised public awareness about the dangers of putting power in the hands of radical Democrats who believe in the ends justify the means.
	They have a twisted view of what their ends are.
	They saw Trump derangement syndrome as something that was actually truth to them rather than derangement.
	And I think I like to think that two things, that President Trump would have won certainly in a landslide anyway.
	But I like to think that my case might have got him a few votes, particularly the Battleground States, because before the Democrats went on their weaponization jag, it was basically going to be about an election about the economy and the border.
	But it became also an election about weaponized justice and things swung in favor of Donald Trump.
	So that's part of the book.
	The other parts, we share that common experience being in prison.
	What's it like being in there?
	And then my favorite part of the book is a love story between me and my fiancé.
	I mean, it was terrible.
	It's like at the airport, they just ripped her from my arms, perp walked her, and she had to endure four months of me being away at very uncertain times, went through all the trials.
	She stuck by me.
	And it was a beautiful thing.
	Peter, you said something earlier that I want to go back to.
	You said if we don't take action, they will keep doing it.
	Yes.
	And I want you to dwell on that a little bit because, as you know, there is a contingent of people on the right.
	In some ways, I would call this like the Mike Pence philosophy, but I'm going to state it this way.
	It is that, you know, what the Democrats did was deplorable and regrettable, but we need to be better than them.
	We are people of principle, even if they are not.
	And so the last thing we ought to do is to go after them because to their weaponization, we will be adding our weaponization and thus we will put ourselves on a nonstop treadmill of weaponization back and forth and it will never end.
	We've got to be better than that.
	But we've got to not go after them and hope that they learn a lesson from us in civility and decency and adherence to sort of high principle.
	What do you say to this prevailing sentiment that I don't think it's the mainstream of the MAGA movement, but it's not unrecognizable to you in the Republican Party, is it?
	It's OK, there's two things to say about it.
	First of all, there's the New Testament and there's the Old Testament.
	The attitude you're describing, Mr. Pence, dear Mike, is New Testament, kind of turn the other cheek, kumbaya.
	Yeah, it's a leap of faith to believe they won't do it, not just again, but again and again and again, based on everything we know from history.
	And I'm an Old Testament guy and I'm an Old Testament guy, both from a justice point of view, but also as an economist.
	There has to be a cost of weaponizing the Justice Department against your enemies.
	If there's not a cost, then you will free ride on it whenever you get a chance.
	And so here's what I would say to Pence.
	It's like everybody I served with in the Trump White House, every single person, the nation, at the senior level that I served with, was a victim, a target.
	We're not victims.
	It's like we're soldiers.
	We were targets and paid prices.
	Now, if you take like Chief of Staff Mark Meadows or the great Dan Scavino, who's President Trump's one of the closest advisors, or Stephen Miller, the price they paid was millions and millions of dollars in legal fees.
	They didn't have to go to prison, but they had to pay a bunch of legal fees.
	They had to deal with the anxiety and all that with the indictments and things like that.
	Mike Flynn, $7 million.
	Okay.
	And then you have Bannon and I going to prison for four months each.
	And then you have Jeff Clark and John Eastman losing their livelihood.
	They're taking away their bar cords.
	You got Sidney Powell and Jenna Ellis had to get on their knees and grovel and plead guilty.
	Mike Lindell threatened with bankruptcy.
	Rudy Giuliani.
	So, Mr. Pence, I liked you, Mike, when you were there, but you betrayed us on January 6th.
	Mike, you got to understand that if they get power, that's what happened in 2018.
	Pelosi got power.
	Now, the other thing, and this is the buried lead division.
	I didn't do anything wrong.
	All I did was honor my oath of office and obey the Constitution.
	I got a subpoena from the legislative branch of the government.
	I'm in the executive branch, according to George Washington's Doctrine of Executive Privilege.
	50 years of Department of Justice policy, a cross-party line, it was my duty to refuse that subpoena to protect executive privilege because executive privilege is critical to efficient presidential decision-making.
	The Supreme Court has said so.
	You need candor and confidentiality in the decision-making process, and you don't get it.
	So, I committed no crime, I committed no crime.
	Full stop.
	Now, you take James Comey, say James Comey.
	What's coming out in Senator Grassley's whistleblowing revelations is this eight-year conspiracy I talked to you, if you talked to you about it.
	It's like we found out that Walter Giodina, the FBI agent who put me in leg irons in 2016, was the same guy, the same guy, Dinesh, who read the Steele dossier.
	Everybody acknowledges now, right, left, center, that the Steele dossier was done by a guy named Christopher Steele.
	It was paid for by the Hillary Clinton campaign.
	It was totally fabricated, and it was designed to basically smear Donald Trump with a Russia hoax.
	Okay?
	Now, that went to the FBI.
	Walter Giodina was one of the ones who read it, according to whistleblowers.
	And he said it was real.
	He said that it was actual.
	And because after his vetting, that begat what?
	Operation Crossfire Hurricane.
	And then that begat the Mueller report.
	And then Comey, again, at the beginning of that, with Giordina being one of the catalysts, he knew damn well that thing wasn't real.
	And so what you have is all these people.
	I mean, you go across those eight years.
	You have these operations.
	You had Crossfire Hurricane, Mueller Report.
	You have this thing called Operation Crimson River, which was again a totally false allegation that Trump took money from the Egyptian government.
	It's like crazy.
	You have Arctic Frost, which is their news this week about, which all of these things were licenses to hunt Trump people.
	Right.
	The Arctic Frost was the surveillance, right?
	Of Congress.
	Licenses.
	You could grab their emails, their messages, phone records.
	You could surveil them.
	You could do anything you wanted in a fishing expedition to see what you could come up with.
	Plus, they were ways of smearing people.
	For example, the Crimson River one, the Egyptian fake one.
	Besides being a fishing expedition, what the FBI used it for is right before the election, they leaked it to the Washington Post and got bad headlines for Trump.
	So again, what we're talking about, you asked me a really essential question.
	It's like, should we New Testament, let bygones be guidelines, be the better folks and hope that the Democrats don't do it again, or should we go full Old Testament as a way of holding them accountable so they won't do it again?
	And there's no question.
	And Comey committed a crime, in my judgment.
	He was involved in election interference and he was involved in an insurrection attempt to overthrow the government.
	And over those eight years, lots of folks shift, I mean, shift that guy, I don't know how he's in the Senate.
	So we got a fight on our hands.
	I really hope that when people read the book, I went to prison so you won't have to, you'll understand what it's like for them to come for you.
	Because if they can come for me, if they can come for you, if they can come for Bannon, Trump, everybody I serve with you, damn well, they can come for you.
	And it's not pretty.
	Even if they don't get you behind bars, they take your money and they take your time and they take your life.
	And that's the message.
	Now, the book itself, I went to prison so you won't have to.
	Once I get in prison, it's like part Kafka, but it's part Joseph Heller.
	It's a little vlogged in there.
	It's funny, sad, dark.
	It's like 120-day arc of what it's like to lose your freedom.
	I mean, one of the things, the first, it's like, just you experienced, like, how do you get your financial house in worry?
	How do you make sure when you're out, the mortgage gets paid and this, that, and the other thing, the bills, whatever.
	And I didn't know, nobody told me this.
	I lost my social security as soon as I went behind bars.
	And so I was like, I had that factored in, like paying my bills, and then I get out and it's like, I don't know, there's like $12,000 not there.
	And it's weird.
	You're like, you're like in a frenzy trying to get everything in order.
	And then you get there and time stops, right?
	There's no clocks in the prison.
	There's no mirrors in the prison.
	It felt super weird walking around without keys in my pocket or an iPhone.
	And it's like, okay, deal with it.
	And so I dealt with it.
	And it was the Voltaire thing.
	You know, once it's an experience, but don't do it again.
	Well, you know, I think this is really valuable to share with people through the book because I think for a lot of Americans, they find it hard to believe that something like this can happen in America, and they find it almost impossible to believe that it can happen to them.
	And I think what you're saying is once politics gets deployed in this militaristic way against political opponents, it can most certainly happen to them.
	It has happened not only to you, in a different way to me, to all the people that you've named.
	It's happened to January 6th defendants.
	It's happened to pro-life people.
	There was an unleashing of political targeting going on under Biden.
	And I would argue that one of the reasons that the left has the chutzpah to do this is they think that we are too Nambi-Pamby to do it to them.
	And so it's only if we strike back and say, listen, two can play at this game, and we're going to start holding you accountable for all the stuff that you did.
	And this brings me to my question, which is, yes, we have seen indictments against Comey and Letitia James and now Bolton, but so far that's it.
	Schiff is roaming free.
	Clapper and Brennan are roaming free.
	Another 30 people that you and I could name are roaming free.
	Does Pam Bondi need to sort of like get turn up the treadmill to a higher inclination and start moving faster on these things?
	Or are you happy with the pace at which it's going so far?
	Well, I love Pam.
	Take her out of the equation.
	In terms of Todd, Todd Blanche, he's doing a great job.
	Stanley Woodward's the number three there who was my attorney.
	But I think the record shows that so far we haven't moved as fast as you and I would like.
	I think that's fair to say.
	Now, the question is why?
	I don't know that.
	I'm maybe behind the scenes.
	There's 100 indictments lined up.
	Thank God for Senator Chuck Grassley, because every week now, he's getting more information that's being released.
	I mean, I want to see, for example, all the notes that emails, notes, messages from my prosecutors, Elizabeth Loy and John Krab.
	You take a guy like John Krab.
	He gets up there during my trial when he's talking to the jury and he goes, no one's above the law.
	It's like, wait a minute, I didn't break any law, John.
	And then we find out now from the whistleblowers, Krabb was actually involved in all a lot of these other operations.
	So he's a central figure.
	I mean, what I would like to see is I'd like to see Giordina, Crab, and some of these middle echelon players be held accountable and flip them.
	So then we find out the real story of Merrick Garland, Matt Graves, go up the chain.
	That's what needs to happen.
	And I'll tell you what.
	One of the lessons I learned in the first term is you only got about 1,500 days.
	Okay, that's it.
	And if you lose, you're out.
	And you turn the keys over to bad guys.
	And if we lose, for example, the House in 2026 and that lunatic, Hakeem Jeffries, gets in there as the majority leader, the first thing they're going to do, Take this to the bank, America.
	It's just start handing out subpoenas to everybody in the White House.
	Take that to the bank.
	And things will be grounded out.
	Why do I say it?
	Because that's exactly what happened when Pelosi grabbed it in 2018.
	So, yeah, let's get on with it.
	And you've got your 30.
	I got my 30 and then some.
	But, you know, ultimately, for me, what matters is settling good law.
	I don't know if you know the term, but that's the term in the legal profession.
	I have a case that's still on appeal.
	I don't know if you know this.
	I did my time.
	There's no reason for me to appeal the case other than to settle good law.
	But we have oral arguments before the appeals court in the district in December, December 18th.
	And we don't expect them to rule in our favor.
	And I'll tell you why.
	This is how screwed up the legal system is.
	Imagine this, Dinesh.
	I'll take it back in time.
	It's in the book.
	I went to prison, so you won't have to.
	I get convicted.
	I go to my sentencing hearing.
	I got a four-month sentence.
	Okay.
	Guy could have should have Democrat judge, Obama judge, he should have gave me probation.
	Just would have been easy.
	No, four months.
	And I file an appeal so that I can stay out of prison pending appeal.
	Okay.
	That is the norm for white-collar misdemeanors where there's major constitutional issues involved.
	Of course, you let the guy out, right?
	Of course you do.
	And of course, they didn't.
	And it was three judges, two of them, Patricia Millet and Cornelia Pillard.
	Okay.
	Now, who do you think is going to be on my panel to hear the case after ruling back then that I had no grounds for any appeal?
	Who do you think they put in charge of my appeal now?
	Those two women.
	Okay.
	That's how screwed up it is.
	This idea that there's any kind of random draw where you get a fair, I mean, it's crazy.
	I didn't even get a fair trial.
	Dinesh, by the time I got to the jury, they'd stripped me of every single defense.
	I literally, my defense attorney had nothing to say because they'd taken that away.
	I never imagined they could do that.
	So, yeah, let's get on with the show.
	Hold these people accountable because they will do it again.
	I went to prison, so you won't have to.
	Somebody will have to sue me for false title if we don't hold these people accountable because it all hinges on accountability.
	Peter, every word you say, I endorse and agree with 100%.
	Guys, I've been talking to Peter Navarro.
	The book, check it out.
	I went to prison so you won't have to, a love and lawfully story in Trumpland.
	Peter, as always, thank you for joining me.
	Brother, you do good, man.
	Appreciate it.
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	Hey guys, these days, a really important issue in our country is the issue of health and specifically the issue of obesity.
	I really don't know how we became a country with this kind of an obesity problem, but I've got a guest.
	Her name is Ellie Hirsch.
	She's a certified nutrition expert.
	She is a health and wellness advocate, and she is here to throw some light on this matter.
	Ellie, I came to this country a generation ago.
	It seems like something has happened to America and to Americans.
	Namely, we as a people have doubled in size, or maybe that's an exaggeration.
	We've certainly inflated like a balloon.
	And now it looks like there's all kinds of remedies being offered for that.
	I see that Trump is talking about, I'm going to lower the prices on Ozempic.
	I'm going to make sure that these pharmaceutical companies provide it at better prices.
	Let me ask you first: you know, is that the remedy that is being offered out here?
	And I want to explore if there's a better way to tackle these problems other than just basically doing the Ozempic solution.
	Yeah.
	So, I mean, basically, he's in talks with Novo Nordisk and with Pfizer because he does want to make it more affordable for Americans.
	But, you know, and it's great, patients first, right?
	And healthcare first and health and wellness first.
	However, you got to get to the root of the problem, okay?
	You can't just be reactive.
	You have to be proactive.
	So.
	What do you think is the root of that problem?
	Is it simply the fact that we have, are we just eating more?
	Is it just the country is so prosperous that people are now eating four times as much as they used to?
	Is it that the food that we're eating has too many preservatives?
	Are we eating the wrong types of food?
	I mean, I'm guessing it's some combination of all of this, but what is the kind of diagnosis for how we got to this point as a country?
	I mean, even when you go to Europe, you'll see an occasional overweight person, but they're rarely ridiculously obese.
	And second of all, the population at large does not appear to be facing this problem.
	But contrast this with any American airport where you look around and it's a little bit of a frightening sight, I have to say.
	It's extremely frightening.
	And it's really the standard American diet, right?
	So everything is over-portioned.
	So we're over-consuming everything.
	The food is over-processed.
	There's fast food everywhere.
	And I think, you know, America has really provided an environment that makes it too easy to consume these high-calorie, low-nutrient foods and while reducing physical activity, right?
	I mean, everybody works from home now, right?
	There's screen time, technology.
	It's more of a sedentary lifestyle.
	And it also starts with health education, which right now there's a lack of.
	I think that we're focused on treatment instead of prevention.
	Even, you know, the doctors, it's medical schools actually dictate less than 1% of their total lecture hours to nutrition.
	So it's not coming from above.
	It's not filtering down.
	But the good news is there are natural solutions to reduce obesity, and we don't need to resort to dangerous pharmaceuticals like Ozempic.
	And I think part of what you're saying too, Ellie, is just that these pharmaceutical companies, in a way, they kind of love it, don't they?
	Because to the degree that it's not just a few people who are facing problems and need drugs, but rather everybody does.
	The pharmaceutical companies go, well, look, we're here to provide it.
	And then particularly if you can get the government to cover the healthcare costs, this just becomes a way of shoveling money from the taxpayer over to the pharmaceutical companies.
	There needs to be really a way out of this.
	Now, I'm looking at a study here, and it's on a website called SciTech Daily, Science Tech Daily, I guess it is.
	And it says this: Kimchi diet reduces body fat by 31.8% in pre-clinical study.
	And I was kind of jolted by this because 31.8% is a pretty big number.
	It is a very large number, and these type of studies are very exciting.
	And it's really due to its influence on the gut microbe.
	And it's not just obesity, right?
	It also helps with cardiovascular health.
	It's all related.
	So there is a direct line between your gut health and your heart health.
	And it's called the gut-heart axis.
	So there was also another study that recently came out that shows Kim Chi lowers triglycerides, blood glucose, blood pressure, and then LDL cholesterol, which is the bad one.
	And listen, heart disease is the number one killer still in the U.S. and worldwide.
	And wouldn't you know it, a contributing factor of heart disease is obesity.
	And, you know, obesity impacts our internal health and well-being, but like you mentioned, also impacts our appearance.
	I mean, just look around, right, in the U.S. And so, kimchi helps our appearance in more than just one way.
	So, it's also shown to improve the health of our hair and our skin.
	And there's just something different about people who consume kimchi.
	And you can see it within the Korean population, you know, because it's a staple in their diet.
	We've all heard of the Korean glass skin.
	I mean, the beauty industry is just loving that, all the products that are out there now.
	And the Korean population lives six years longer than the average American.
	And not to brag, but I'm about to turn 50 and I think I look pretty good.
	And I'd have to say that, you know, even kimchi has been proven in labs to slow the aging of human cells.
	So it's very, very exciting.
	I mean, this is kind of eye-opening, right?
	Because it's funny because sometimes people, my wife is from Venezuela, I'm from India, and sometimes people think that the reason that we don't have more wrinkles is sort of purely the product of like ethnicity.
	Like, okay, you're Asian, or okay, you're from a different part of the world, and therefore you have less or more melanin and so on.
	I think what you're saying is that there is a very important dietary component to all this.
	The Koreans actually eat right.
	Now, I assume one solution for us all is to go eat Korean food, but there is another solution.
	You represent a company called Brightcore, and I've been advertising Brightcore, so I want to be very upfront about it.
	But the reason I advertise Brightcore is because here is a kind of superfood, namely kimchi, that gives you all kinds of benefits like in one shot.
	And I think one of the things that you guys do at Brightcore is you figure out how to take the kimchi and kind of capsulize it.
	So talk a little bit about what Brightcore is offering.
	How do you incorporate this?
	How do you incorporate kimchi, like Brightcore style, into a daily diet?
	We're so proud of Kimchi 1.
	And so basically, yes, we've taken all the benefits of eating fresh kimchi and created a convenient capsule.
	There's no hassle, there's no mess, no taste, no odor, three capsules a day, right?
	Because the importance of daily consumption.
	And also, it's 100% made in the USA, non-GMO, all natural, and it's virtually sodium-free.
	And what I love about it are the success stories that we hear from our customers and even my personal clients as well.
	So you're going to see improved digestion, which leads to improved regularity.
	You're going to have increased energy and metabolism.
	You're going to have stronger, thicker hair and skin, less wrinkles, right?
	And it even strengthens your immune system because approximately 70 to 80% of your immune system is located in the gut.
	So people are getting sick less often.
	And in general, everyone's just feeling and looking better.
	All right.
	So we come now to the final part where I think my viewers and listeners are going to say, all right, this all sounds pretty good.
	I've been trying to fix myself in 15 different ways.
	And you're telling me how I can do it kind of in one way from the inside out, so to speak.
	Can you tell my viewers and listeners if you have a good deal for them and what it is and how they go about getting it?
	Sure.
	We have a great deal.
	So you can get 25% off your order of kimchi one today using the code Dinesh.
	And you go to mybrightcore.com backslash Dinesh.
	That's mybrightcore.com backslash Dinesh.
	Or you can call 888-927-5980.
	And we want you to call for so many reasons.
	We want to talk to you, make sure the product is right for you.
	We love talking to our customers and building relationships.
	Plus, when you call in, you get up to 50% off your order, plus free shipping.
	And the first 100 callers get a free collagen sheet mask, which is fantastic.
	It's full of hyaluronic acid and collagen.
	I use it every day, and it definitely helps my skin look hydrated and beautiful.
	And again, that number is 888-927-5980.
	All right, guys, 25% is pretty good.
	50% is even better.
	So I think you should call Ellie Hirsch.
	Thank you very much for joining me.
	Sure.
	I mean, an early chapter of Life After Death, The Evidence, a book that I encourage you to get.
	I think you're going to really like it.
	It's also one of those books that is timeless.
	It's not going to be obsolete anytime, not as long as there are human beings walking on the face of the earth.
	And so it's a book that you should keep read and then keep on your shelf and also share.
	Now, we're talking about why ancient people believed in life after death.
	And here's anthropologist Pascal Boyer.
	When people find supernatural causes, it's not because they have ignored the work of mechanical and biological causes, but because they are asking questions that go beyond these causes.
	It's tempting to see ancient people as somehow, you know, they didn't have the science we have, and therefore they looked for supernatural causes as a substitute for natural causes.
	And the point being made here by this anthropologist Boyer is: no, they recognize that there is a natural cause, but they don't think that that cause is sufficient.
	It's kind of like saying, My kid is ignorant.
	He doesn't know anything.
	So I know the cause.
	He doesn't read.
	He doesn't go to school.
	He skips school.
	That's the cause.
	But why does he do those things?
	Like, why doesn't he read?
	What is it about reading that offends him?
	Why does he not want to stay in school?
	I'm looking for a cause that goes beyond the kind of material or obvious cause.
	And that's what we're saying here.
	In other words, the ancient people understood that there is something kind of terrible and numinous, numinous here, referring to something transcendent or larger than life.
	There seems to be another kind of reality that is behind the world we live in, and yet it intersects with that world.
	And the point about death here is it links these two worlds.
	It links the world of this life with the world of the next life.
	And one of the reasons that ancient peoples revered their ancestors, they were constantly invoking their ancestors.
	My ancestors believe this, and they believe that.
	Why?
	Because the ancestors are, in a way, now connected to this other dimension.
	They did live on earth, but they now inhabit a different realm.
	And so, in some ways, you can say they have the widest possible perspective on things.
	This is why we should revere them, because they have access to a realm of experience that we don't, or at least we don't as of now.
	We will after we join them.
	So, the idea here, the big idea, there is a world behind the world, and the world behind the world is in fact the real world.
	The world we live in is a world, I'm going to say, not that it's a false world, but I'm going to call it a world of appearances.
	And what I mean by appearances is that we live in a world where things appear to us.
	That appears to me to be a tree, that appears to me to be a sun.
	Now, these are appearances to our senses.
	These are things that we see from our perspective.
	But we're very well aware that these appearances could be different for other types of creatures.
	How do you know that a bat, which navigates by the way, in a very different way than we do, it uses echolocation to move, it doesn't see in the way we do.
	So, obviously, the world appears to a bat completely different than it appears to us.
	And yet, for the bat, that's reality.
	Just like for us, it's reality.
	And the point I'm getting at here is that this is not really reality per se.
	We don't have access to the world as it is, to use a phrase borrowed from the philosopher Immanuel Kant, and something that we will get into philosophically much later.
	We have access to the world as it appears to us.
	Just to grasp the single critical distinction, I think in some ways this is the most important distinction in modern philosophy, namely the world as it is, what Kant calls the noumenon, with the world as it appears to us.
	That is the phenomenon.
	The phenomenon is the things that we experience in the way that we experience them.
	All right, now, let's turn to what the ancient peoples and also what the three great Abrahamic religions, Judaism, Christianity, and Islam, have had to say about the afterlife.
	And there is, as I mentioned, a kind of official and an unofficial teaching.
	The official teaching is that we have life after death through bodily resurrection.
	And the unofficial view, which is the alternative view, and I'm not actually choosing right now between these views, I'm just giving them to you, is that the body perishes, but the soul lives on, the immortality of the soul.
	Now, I alluded to this a little bit yesterday, but it is commonly asserted by atheists that life after death is some kind of a religious concept.
	And this is not so.
	Life after death is also a philosophical concept that develops very clearly in the fifth century BC, right along with the birth of philosophy itself.
	Here I'm quoting the philosopher Leo Strauss.
	Transcendence is not a preserve of revealed religion.
	This is a very important notion because what Strauss is saying is that in revealed religion, you get the idea that there's a transcendence, there is a God that transcends the world, there's a world beyond the world, and all of this is true because God said so.
	That's the meaning of revelation.
	It's being revealed to you.
	But Strauss is saying that philosophers, without leaning on revelation at all, have come up with this idea through reason alone.
	In ancient Greece and Rome, the most interesting ideas about the afterlife did not come from the temple.
	They came from the philosophers.
	Let's look at Greek religion.
	It had a very, I would call it, weak and diluted concept of the afterlife.
	In Homer's Iliad and Odyssey, the gods are immortal, but mortality is the defining feature of what it means to be human.
	Not to say that when humans die, they kind of disappear, but rather they go to a shadowy, insubstantial underworld called Hades.
	And really just a few, the fortunate few, usually heroes who are offsprings of the gods, people like Achilles, they make it to the Isles of the Blessed.
	And this is pretty much all that Greek religion had to say about the matter.
	And so if you want more, and quite honestly, a more interesting discussion, you have to go to Greek philosophy.
	Now, yesterday, I talked a little bit about the Socratic argument for the survival of the soul.
	And what I want to say is that for Socrates, this is what made death palatable.
	You wonder why after Socrates was convicted, Socrates, by the way, was charged with two crimes.
	One is impiety, by disregarding the Greek gods, and two, corrupting the young.
	Now, these charges are actually both false.
	Socrates was not impious.
	He, in fact, kept the sacrifices of the gods.
	I don't know if he believed in the gods, but he was sufficiently respectful of them that he did what the other Greeks did.
	And so he was not, in fact, impious.
	Now, he did raise questions, which cause people to think for themselves.
	And this is hardly a form of corrupting the young.
	In fact, this is actually what I would call educating the young.
	And this is why Socratic instruction is what we need in our universities today.
	But for these crimes, these so-called crimes, these bogus charges, Socrates is sentenced to death.
	And he drinks the hemlock.
	And one of the remarkable things about Plato's apology, Plato's apology, is the account of the death of Socrates.
	He drinks the hemlock really cheerfully.
	And he gives some reasons for it, things like, you know, I don't want to run away from Athens because I'm an Athenian.
	And so you get the impression that Socrates would rather live his life in Athens.
	And if there's no life in Athens, well, then there's no life for him at all.
	But that's only part of the story.
	I think the real part of the story is that Socrates believed that your soul lives on after death.
	And for Socrates, your soul is the most important part of you.
	In some of the key arguments in the early books of Plato, Socrates makes the argument that nothing bad can ever happen to a good man.
	Very somewhat shocking thing to say, right?
	Because bad things do happen to good people all the time.
	Socrates denies it.
	Why does he deny it?
	Because Socrates basically says that we are body and soul, and our soul is really the core of who we are.
	Our body is like an attachment.
	It's like a possession.
	So we could lose it.
	You could lose your arm.
	You could get sick.
	You could lose your possessions.
	Even you can have a family tragedy.
	But Socrates goes that your soul remains untouched.
	It remains inviolate.
	The only way to harm your soul is for you to do something shameful, for you to do something bad.
	And as long as you don't do that, your soul is unharmed.
	And this is the part that Socrates thinks lives on, the best part of you.
	Not all of you lives on in the Socratic view, but the best part of you, the essence of you, the real you, which is to say the immaterial you, is the part that lives on even after you die, even after you have taken the hemlock.
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