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Sept. 22, 2025 - Dinesh D'Souza
01:01:00
ISRAEL AND CHARLIE Dinesh D’Souza Podcast Ep1173
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Coming up, uh Debbie and I were right up front at the Charlie Kirk funeral and memorial service.
We're going to discuss in detail several aspects of it.
Erica Kirk, Stephen Miller, Trump, the underlying themes, the prospects for national revival, all in there.
We also got back last week from a very memorable, almost sublime trip to Israel.
Connects, of course, with uh our support for biblical archaeology, but also with our new film, The Dragon's Prophecy.
So details on that also in today's podcast.
We're doing it actually as a conversation between me and Debbie moving off Friday podcast to today, but a lot to cover, so hang in there.
Hey, if you're watching on X Rumble or YouTube, uh listening on Apple or Spotify, please subscribe to my channel.
I'd appreciate it.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Podcast.
Thank you.
America needs this voice.
The times are crazy and a time of confusion, division, and lies.
We need a brave voice of reason, understanding and truth.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Podcast.
Guys, I was uh out all of last week.
We were in Israel, and then we uh came back and um we went to Phoenix for Charlie Kirk's funeral and memorial service, and we have a lot to talk about.
So I told Debbie, let's move up our Friday roundup.
Let's do it today, Monday, and um let's talk about everything that's happened over the past seven days and especially focusing on this um funeral service, which I think was well kind of a turning point.
So um before we get started, I do want to make an announcement about the new film, The Dragon's Prophecy, and that is that theater tickets are now available.
You can get 'em.
They're uploaded.
Now you can't get them at the theater, so don't go to the theater looking for theater tickets there.
We're doing this as a as movie buyouts.
And there's I don't know, three hundred and fifty, four hundred theaters.
The dates are October sixth and October eighth.
Kind of easy to remember.
Why?
Because we couldn't get them for October 7th.
By the way, movies do specials and stuff on Tuesday.
So Monday, October 6th, Wednesday, October 8th.
If you can see it in the theater, best way.
Great way to see it.
And but buy your tickets on the website.
You can buy tickets, you can buy for a group, you can go as a group.com.
That's the website, the dragons, plural, the dragon's prophecy, P R O P H E C Y prophecy film dot com.
Honey, let's talk about uh let's talk about the um the funeral service.
We we were exhausted from Israel, and we um but you said and I agreed this is something we can't miss.
We have to go.
Charlie was one of our colleagues on the Salem Podcast.
Uh he was also somebody who had we featured in two thousand Mules.
I did a bunch of screenings of the movie with him.
So we have been, I've spoken at a number of his conferences over the years.
I wouldn't say we were close friends with Charlie, but on the other hand, we were connected to Charlie in all kinds of ways.
Yeah.
Well, we've known him since he was in his early 20s.
Exactly.
We we met Charlie.
Well, I'm I met him before you did, but then I introduced you to him.
And this was really uh well, we'll talk about Israel a little bit later, but um this was kind of an adventure to get to this event which had a massive number of people.
Uh we went in a Salem bus with all the Salem hosts, or about 12 of us, I guess, or 13 of us in the bus, including the CEO of Salem, David Santrella.
And then what happened?
Well, so we so apparently the stadium was not that close, right?
So we had to take we took a shuttle.
Right.
Uh a private shuttle, and uh we turned on the street leading up to the stadium, and realized that the traffic was not moving at all.
And they, you know, they had basically said, we we got picked up at six o'clock in the morning, and they had said it at eleven, but they said, if you're not here by eight, no one's coming in.
And by the way, a funny tidbit on our airplane flight going to Phoenix.
We there was a couple sitting along with us, and they were well, they weren't a couple, it was two women.
It was two women uh by a couple, I just literally meant two people.
Two women were going together as buddies, and and not only that, but they were planning to uh go to the line at 2 a.m.
But they go, listen, we're not gonna go stand in line.
We have hired a uh a person.
I didn't even know you could do this.
I don't know how you find such a person.
Kind of like a DoorDash type, you know, situation, but it's a person that will stand in line for you.
Right.
So it's like you stand in line from 2 to 7 a.m. and then they show up and take that spot in the line.
So in any event, this shows you that for people trying to get general admission.
Now, we of course we were in a VIP section, Salem had reserved tickets, and uh as it turned out, we ended up like in the fifth row from the front.
So we actually had incredible, we couldn't have better seats, to be honest, uh, apart from being on the stage itself.
Yep.
Uh but the point being we had to get out of the car, get out of the van, and all of us all.
Yeah, we we decided we're like, is it faster to walk?
And uh one of the one of the Salem uh ladies goes, she goes, Well, I walk 14, I walk a 14-minute mile, and I'm like, ooh, that's fast.
We walk an 18-minute mile, and I don't know that.
Well, we it was two miles away.
We walked, and and not only did we walk, but once we got there, oh yes, no one knew what was going on.
So they're like, go over here, go over there.
We probably walked an extra mile on dirt road just to try to find out how we get through.
And um uh and and finally one of the Secret Service guys like recognized.
Only because he recognized you.
That's the one.
And he's like, hey, this way.
And then everybody's like, we're with Dinesh.
So anyway, we we anyway.
So then our life became really easy at that point.
But um uh, but this event was I have to say, it's it's something we'll remember, right?
I mean, we'll look back on this and go, wow.
And and I think the event was very significant in our political life in the country generally.
Uh let's talk about um the event itself.
Uh I know some people watched it online.
Of course, if you're watching it online, you're coming and going, presumably you're not watching straight through.
And the event was extremely long.
Initially, I thought, you know, way too long.
And probably that is right.
Um, They just had an unbelievable procession of speakers, and it was like three hours into it, and the main speakers hadn't even come on.
Yeah, yeah.
But I have to say though, it was an amazing uh morning of worship.
It really was.
I mean, and they had marvelous, they had uh Carrie Job, they had who's the other guy, Chris uh Tomlin, and these guys were belting it out.
So this was just, I mean, it was like a revival.
Um, and I think very much in the spirit of Charlie Kirk that they did that.
I do think that when people come to these things, it's so somewhat similar to Trump rallies.
They it's so difficult to get there.
I mean, think about the the two women we talked about, right?
You're coming at so early in the morning.
You're not gonna come and do all that or figure out how to park and and and then get yourself in the stadium three hours before it begins, and you're not gonna do that for like a 90-minute event.
So as a result, this was like a seven-hour event.
It was seven hours.
Yeah, it was just a marathon.
When we got there, we got there about 8:30.
Yeah.
Uh, inside, they were already worshiping.
So they had started, uh, I'm assuming seven or eight, maybe, or maybe eight, uh, and they went on until 11.
Just worship, you know, and um, I mean, it was it was really it was quite amazing.
But let's uh what do you think?
If you had to pick out the single speech or the single item that you think is the most unforgettable, what would it be?
Erica Kirk, absolutely Erica Kirk.
And specifically her.
Oh, well, look, I I can't even imagine losing you, the husband, and then going on and and speaking to a crowd about your husband.
Right.
I I can't imagine how you could do that so fresh after the after the assassination, and and um uh just her her composure, and you know, I know she was I know it was hard.
You could tell that she was really You could tell she was struggling.
She was struggling and she was praying that she get through it.
But I think the most amazing part of her speech was when she said she forgave his assassin.
And I I think this was striking.
First of all, the impact on the crowd was electric.
I I bet the impact, even watching on TV or watching online was very strong.
It is, of course, the essence of the Christian doctrine, right?
It is agape, it is Christian love, it is um it is the unique aspect of Christianity, which is forgiveness, is not something that you find in other religions.
And to be honest, I mean, here's something interesting that Laura Loomer said.
She goes, I listened to this, and she goes, I'm like stupefied, right?
She goes, I cannot understand it.
I don't get it.
And now you're tempted to say, well, but what I'm getting at is that is actually a very natural reaction.
It's a natural reaction.
It's even a natural reaction if you're a Christian.
Right.
And that's another way to say that Christianity here is taking something that is very natural, which is the desire for justice and the desire for punishment, and even the desire for revenge, and and essentially saying this needs to be elevated from the natural to the supernatural, or to the even the unnatural.
I'll even go there.
And you know the proof that this has had a huge impact.
Let me just read you, Elon Musk.
He posted this after the event.
And I think this is the result of listening to Erica Kirk and the exact statement that you just mentioned.
He goes, forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
Wow.
So a key line in the Bible that not only encapsulates what Erica Kirk said, because she didn't quote that line, but it encapsulates the underlying rationale for that line.
Like, why is it that we as humans are called to forgive?
Answer because God himself does this.
God himself takes the unforgivable truth about human um blasphemy and human um obstinacy, human rejection of God, human desire to say, we like our plan for our life better than your plan for our life.
All of this is a scandal to God.
Nevertheless, God goes, all right, doesn't matter.
Um I forgive, and I'm offering it to you as a free gift.
So our forgiveness comes out of that.
If it wasn't for God's forgiveness, it would not be reasonable to ask that we do it too.
That's right.
That's right.
He does it, he does it for for us, and uh he expects us to do it as well.
Now, in a very, I would say funny and to me very appropriate.
Even though some people posted Erica Kirk and then they post Trump as if to say, you know, she's the angel and he's the devil.
Oh, Trump actually Trump actually, I think, in a moment of just extreme candor and the kind of authenticity that we've come to expect from Trump goes, yeah, Charlie even believe we should forgive our enemies.
He goes, I don't believe that.
Uh I want my enemies to suffer.
He goes, I don't wish them well.
Uh and then he goes, Charlie's probably a little upset of me right now.
I love that.
Uh but you the reason is we don't want a Christianity so removed from natural human feelings and emotion that people look at it and go, well, that's not that's so otherworldly that we cannot be expected to live like that.
No.
We want a Christianity that begins with outrage at what this guy did.
Uh and and and and broadened with outrage as to what he meant for all of us, the the kind of silencing that he hoped he could achieve.
And by the way, Trump is not wrong to see the butler assassination attempt and the lawfare and the attempt to lock him up as part of the same thing.
He's right.
Because it is.
It is, it is part of the same thing.
Yeah, absolutely.
Um, there are some people who said, here's a contradiction, Christians.
Uh, you've got Trump saying this, and you've got Erica Kirk thing that, and and the assumption of it was that Christians have to choose.
They have to choose between the true Christian way, Erica, or they have to change, uh, choose between the MAGA cult, namely Trump.
And I think, I don't know if you agree, that this is a false choice.
Yeah, oh, absolutely.
Well, first of all, uh to be a Christian encompasses a lot of different stages.
I kind of liken it to a child growing up, you know, from childhood, teenagehood to adulthood.
There are some very immature Christians, and then there's some very mature Christians.
And I think that um that our journey as Christians actually is a is that way.
It's a spectrum that way.
Um I know that when my father died when I was 17 years old, I blamed God.
And that's because I wasn't really a Christian.
I mean, I wasn't, I didn't really believe the way I do now.
That there that there is an underlying architecture, that there is a supreme ruler of the universe, that that there is someone who might see the overall picture better than you could.
It's hard to say it's hard to admit hard to admit those things and hard to recognize those things.
Even even when I was worship leading, um, you know, I I I thought I was a better Christian than I was then because I I you know accepted Jesus and I and I basically you know reached out to God, asked him to forgive me because I had been such a you know dummy in in blaming him, and you know, and I knew I was his child, and I knew that it was that God's will, that we never can understand God's will.
We just never can.
There is always a purpose, and we just don't know it.
And as Christians, as uh, you know, as we mature in Christianity, we we accept those things that we didn't accept when we weren't truly mature in in our faith.
So I think Erica is is really elevated to a a level that I aspire to be.
And you're saying even most Christians would have a hard time getting there, particularly to see a husband.
That's right.
I mean, we have seen you know of another case where uh where you're talking about people whose own family has been killed.
Well, yes.
Uh and yet they're able to find find it in their heart to forgive.
Yeah.
I want to make a little different point, and that is that there is a difference between our role as individuals and as Christians, as citizens, and the role of the state, or the role of an official who is in the position of overseeing the state.
You can call it a magistrate.
Because remember, Trump is in that Trump is an individual, but Trump is also in that role.
He's the chief executive officer.
He's also the head of the executive branch of the government.
So I would put it this way, that Jesus wants us to forgive.
And he wants us to forgive in part for our own sake, right?
We let go of that.
We let go of that burden, which otherwise will torment us and haunt us and really destroy us.
So we forgive for that reason.
We also just forgive because we're commanded to.
So we just in obedience to God and in gratitude to God.
So this is nothing to do.
There's some people, by the way, who are like, well, the shooter hasn't repented.
This is irrelevant.
Forgiveness has nothing to do with the shooter repenting at all.
And I'm surprised at the number of Christians goofballs who have been claiming that somehow forgiveness is conditional, not so.
No.
Now, let's turn to something though a little bit different, and that is the role of the state.
The role of the state is to enforce justice.
That is its actually highest role.
The state is not God.
The state is not there to extend, if you will, uh you could call it agape.
Now the state can temper this justice with mercy, so that if the, for example, the person is extremely contrite, or if there are mitigating circumstances, you say, all right, you're not going to get the death penalty, you're going to get life in prison.
All of that is conditional upon the circumstances and the attitude of the perpetrator, right?
Earthly justice.
Earthly justice.
And earthly justice doesn't does not extend further than that.
So I think to say I forgive you as an individual, I forgive you as a Christian.
Uh I don't hold it against you.
I'm recognizing you also as a child of God, and I recognize that ultimately, in at the in the ultimate sense, it's going to be God who's gonna judge what's happened here.
But the state is in a much more um, I would say limited role.
The state's role is you have committed a crime not just against Charlie Kirk, but against the state.
And and and this is very obvious in this case that this shooting is aimed at uh sending a political message.
So there are lots of other putative targets and even putative victims, including, by the way, the two of us.
In fact, there's a surprising number of people who yesterday and and and in the days in the in the surrounding days have been saying to us, watch it, be very careful.
The DSA guy, as we're flying back, is like Dinesh, really keep an eye out.
You know, this is this is a as you know, I've I've been paranoid about this for years.
Yeah, you have uh because I know how evil they are.
They don't um they don't solve things with debate, they solve things with violence.
And um, and I've seen it.
I you know, uh when when the times I I went with you to campuses, campuses, you've seen it, yeah.
I just I saw it in those kids' eyes, you know, there's a lot of evil there.
Uh yes, they can they can they can be helped, yes, but I don't know that they want to be.
They're so indoctrinated, and uh, you know, I've I've often said that these professors, a lot of these professors are actually the reason why all these kids are the way they are.
They they're the ones who they plant the not just the seeds, they conduct the um indoctrination, the brainwashing.
Yeah.
And then they let the students who are less mature, less able to process that kind of information.
Well, very similar, by the way, to the to the Islamic radicals, right?
You take a 19-year-old and you tell him, listen, you know, you've got this, you've got this um evil regime that is out to kill you.
And uh you have to strap on a suicide bomb or a suicide vest and go strike out at them.
And you promise them the, you know, the virgins, the uh immediate entry into paradise.
Now, if it was all so easy, why don't you do it?
But they won't do it.
Have you seen this?
Has a single one of the Iranian mullahs done it?
No.
Has any member of parliament done it?
No.
Uh are the leaders of Hamas sitting around by the way in uh in in in nice uh hotels in Qatar.
Do they do it?
No.
So the point being here, I think what you're saying is that the professors are in a similar role.
They are I made the analogy the other day about uh Charles Manson.
I said it's like Charles Manson's family.
He was the instigator, and and the the kids did the killing.
This is a great point.
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Because let's let's go into it.
There are lots of people on the left who are saying in social media Who's they, Debbie?
Right?
They're like, who's the they?
One guy did it.
He bears the responsibility.
Now, first of all, we don't even know if one guy did it.
Uh, I do not think I suspect, and I'm here I am in the realm of conjecture, but it's conjecture based upon well, we might as well get into it since we're here now.
This text exchange.
Very suspicious text exchange uh between the suspect, uh, Tyler Robinson, uh, and his so-called, you know, boyfriend, the trans woman, so-called.
His love, as he calls it.
So you have this really weird text exchange, and the essence of it, which I'll I'll just paraphrase, is something like, you know, on the shooter, to which the trans kid goes, what, what, what?
And the guy goes, oh yeah, it's me, and the guy goes, I had no idea.
So it goes on like this.
And and and so there are people, by the way, wackos, who will uh look at this and they go, the FBI wrote it, or the deep state wrote it, or the Mossad wrote it.
We're gonna come back to all of this, so don't go into this right now, because we have a lot to say about it.
But let me just say this part about it, and that is what I think makes sense of that artificial exchange, is that was devised, I suspect, by the shooter, to remove the responsibility of both of anyone else, including, by the way, potentially the other kid, the the boyfriend.
This way, all the blame falls on one guy.
And he's got documentary evidence that the other guy's like, what what?
I had no idea.
Really, it's you.
Um, it's a way of saying, all right, now that we've done this, and perhaps you knew about it, and perhaps others knew about it, I'm willing to take he's taking the fall.
And we've seen cases Where you know a couple will do uh a murder together, and then the the man will take the full responsibility.
So this is not unheard of, and I'm sure that the FBI knows they're they're probably probing all this right as we speak.
Wasn't he on some uh some chat social media chat?
Well, this is something that I think is huge, and and and here's what I mean.
There are evidently posts on Discord.
Discord, that's it.
Right?
There are evidently posts where several people, more than one, said something really big is going down like tomorrow.
They knew.
So they knew about the assassination before it happened, and that immediately would make them accessories before the fact.
You can be an accessory before the fact or an accessory after the fact.
An accessory after the fact would be like you knew about the body, you know, you didn't uh report it, but before the fact is you knew that this was going to go down and you said nothing.
That's a crime.
So all of this, I'm I am just I can't wait to see how all of this unfolds.
But let's come back to what the left is saying.
The left is saying, why are you saying they?
Uh why are you blaming the left?
So I want us to zoom in and try to put our finger very clearly on what is the responsibility of the left.
What do you think it is?
Um I think it's many, many things.
I think it's academia.
I think it's Hollywood entertainment comedy.
Uh I think it's the media.
Because what they do, or what they did is they created, and and you know, and the reason I I think this is even with some of my so-called friends uh on Facebook, you know, basically they said, well, he had it coming because he was a racist, he was a fascist, he was a homophobe, all these things.
And so therefore, because he was all those things, which by the way, he was not, but they were indoctrinated to believe he was all those things.
And so they thought he was all those things, it was somehow okay to take him out.
All right, but that's after the fact.
In other words, that is the unseemly post-assassination jubilation.
Right, but but the people that so this this kid, right, that committed this crime was listening to these people beforehand.
This is what I'm getting in.
I want to go into.
So he is a product of this cultural whirlwind of information.
So let us identify the key messages from the left that this kid could not help hearing, and not only that, we know from the messages that he left in his own writing or on the bullet or on the ammunition.
We can prove that he was influenced by these messages because he repeated them, right?
So I would put it this way.
Well, let me just read a quotation from Senator Chris Murphy.
This is before the assassination.
We are in a war right now to save this country.
And so you have to be willing to do whatever is necessary.
I highlight the word whatever, because whatever means there's no limit.
You just do what is necessary in order to save the country.
Now, let's add another element to it, which is all too familiar to people.
And this is come not only is this coming from the left, this has been coming from the left since about 2015.
So for a whole decade, continuously, repeatedly, persistently, the left has said Trump is a fascist, MAGA is a fascist cult, and they're saying it now.
They haven't stopped.
They haven't abandoned that premise.
So let's put together Trump and MAGA are fascists, along with to save our country, we have to fight this fascism.
We have to do whatever is necessary to stop it.
So here's my conclusion.
From the shooter's point of view, and granted, you this is the point of view of somebody who is mentally unhinged or mentally unbalanced, but he's going to go.
The left has supplied the theory, and I am putting it into practice.
In other words, I am Taking their words seriously.
These are people who might irresponsibly mout certain things.
I am responsibly seeing it through.
I'll give an example.
There's a famous uh scene in um Crime and Punishment where Raskolnikov is in a restaurant, and and Raskolnikov is toying with the idea of whether it is right to kill someone completely innocent and take their treasure and use it for the public good.
Think about this.
This is sort of like would such a crime using a kind of utilitarian standard be a good thing.
So he's thinking about this and he it turns out that on the next table, two Russian officials are having this exact same conversation in connection with a specific person.
And one of them goes, This woman is a money lender, she is sly, she exploits people.
If if her death would be wonderful for society, uh it would be a contribution to the social good.
And then the other guy, the the older official goes, Well, would you do it?
And then the guy goes, uh uh, no, no, and the guy goes, Well, would you do it?
And the guy goes, Well, I'm just saying, and the other guy goes, Well, if you wouldn't do it, why are you just saying?
But so Raskolnikov takes it to heart, and he basically goes, that's right.
If you really believe it, you need to do it.
Right?
And you see what I'm getting at here?
You see how close it is from this ideology to the actual carrying out of a political assassination.
Now, and of course, in crime and punishment, the assassination is not political.
Um, but it is it it does have an ideological motive.
Yeah.
So in that sense, there is a political dimension to it.
Well, even I'm sorry, but even these pro-Palestine demonstrators, free Palestine, they do it.
And they've done it more than once.
You showed me the latest example.
A kid goes into a wedding and shoots down people and he yells free Palestine.
I mean, these people are so brainwashed, brainwashed, that they're doing it because they think that they're doing the right thing.
I mean, you know, and and they could have mental issues, but what I'm saying is the indoctrination is so great that I they are willing to do anything.
And they are mirroring what the suicide bomber or the Hamas terrorist will do in Jerusalem.
Right.
They're willing.
So this is the difference between martyrdom, right?
So Charlie Kirk is a martyr.
He's a he's a modern-day Christian martyr.
The Islamic bombers and these these free Palestine people are martyrs in the in for their cause, but they're the ones doing the harm.
They have a totally different think of it.
They have a radically different idea of martyrdom.
They do.
Their idea of martyrdom is I go inflict maximum damage on an innocent person.
Yes.
Uh, and but I myself get blown up in the process or shot.
Even this kid, this Robinson kid, he was willing to be a martyr for his girlfriend or boyfriend, whatever he is.
In the Muslim sense.
In the Muslim sense, yes.
He's willing to go into the battlefield himself, take on Charlie because he's been brainwashed all these you know years or months or whatever.
And he's will because he he doesn't know if they're gonna shoot back at him.
In fact, I think this was one of the reasons that his dad, you know, he agreed to go in in the police with his dad because he didn't want to be shot or he didn't want to be killed, or he also offered the other interesting thing is he offered essentially, I believe from the reports, he offered to kill himself to his dad.
Right.
He said, I can kill myself, and his dad was like, No, you you know, we have to take you in.
And so he he ultimately uh agreed to that.
Now, there are people who watch from the left, they're watching this uh service that we went to, and they go, This was a hate rally.
This was a Nuremberg rally, uh, this was a uh fascist demonstration, this was a militarization of Christianity, and then of course, in a more moderate note, they go, This is not uh a gospel of unity.
So let me let I'll let you talk about the fascist element of it, but let me start off by addressing this issue of unity.
Because, you know, first of all, the left aggressively divides the country.
Second of all, when there is a division that looks bad for them, they call for unity.
So we have this powerful event.
People are giving their life to Christ.
People are signing up for the Republican Party.
People are like, I'm done with the Democratic Party.
And the left is like, hey, what about unity?
Right?
So, first of all, the just the hypocrisy of it is just shameless.
But I want to make a different point, and that is that even though we give lip service to this idea of unity, you not only is unity not our goal, it shouldn't be our goal.
It has never been our goal.
It was not Washington and Jefferson's goal.
It was not Abraham Lincoln's goal to give him his due, even though I have a very um jaundist view of him.
It was not FDR's goal, it was not Reagan's goal.
So let's let's uh let's explore this a little further.
When America went to war with Great Britain, it completely divided this society.
Lots of people did not want to do it.
Lots of people were on the British side because they were like, we're under the British, but the British are not doing anything particularly bad to us.
What are they raising the tax from like one and a half to one and three quarter percent?
You want to go to war over that?
Are you out of your mind?
Many of these people ended up fleeing to Canada, they were called Tories.
So there were a lot of disenchanted Americans in the American Revolution.
Number two, Lincoln could have avoided the Civil War by preaching unity.
In fact, lots of people said, in the name of unity, you need to find a compromise.
Let's just take the Mason Dixon line and extend it all the way to California.
So south of the Mason Dixon line, we allow slavery.
Um, and north of the Mason Dixon line, we uh allow we have all the states be free.
And Lincoln said no.
So Lincoln allowed the division.
I would say he even sought it.
FDR.
FDR actively divided the country, but he divided the country so it was 70-30 in his favor.
Uh Reagan divided the country.
Reagan did not hesitate to boldly articulate a whole set of views.
Quite honestly, 40% of the country did not agree.
So what Reagan did was he got 60 on his on his side, the Democrats had 40.
That's how Reagan won 44 states in 1980.
That's how he won 49 states in 84.
He created a division that favored him.
And that's what we're doing right now.
We are creating a division that favors us.
Why?
Because look at the issues, right?
Are there can you find a real constituency of Americans who believe that men can become women, that crime in cities is actually a pretty healthy thing and bringing those rates down to zero.
I mean, Trump mentioned at the service, and this is Trump, he's gonna go off track, he's gonna go off his script.
He talks about Chicago, he goes, the mayor over there thinks 11 murders a day or even 11 murders over a weekend is like not bad.
Like, hey, we're down to 11.
We used to be like at 17.
And Trump is like, well, how about zero, right?
How about stopping these murders?
So this is not a feature of ordinary life in the city.
And he goes, Democrats will resist that.
Democrats want to keep the border porous and let people come pouring in in terms of we'll get future voters that way.
Um Democrats also, as we talked about just now, they they create this atmosphere in which they see extreme action as somehow legitimate by any means necessary.
We don't believe that, by the way, right?
Uh it was noted uh at the service that even after Charlie is assassinated, there was no fear of Republican riots.
There was no fear of counter-assassinations.
The left never said, hey, listen, all of us need to walk around now with bulletproof vests.
I never saw a single person posting to that effect, which means that they know it too.
They know too in their hearts that we are not like them.
And we are better than them.
And we are more decent than them.
And we don't approve of the if if there was someone on the manga side who did that, I submit that there would not be a single MAGA defender of that person.
No, absolutely not.
And and you're right.
I mean, uh, look, uh I I just based on the people that I know that are on the left versus people that are on the right.
You know, you you just kind of it it's so to me, anyway, it's so obvious that it's good versus evil.
I mean, it just is.
Uh a lot of people that I know that are on that other side are extremely agitated and and just you know down people, they're they're they're not friendly, they always have a beef with something, they're you know, they get irritated easily.
It just they're so dark.
You know what I mean?
I thought one of Erica Kirk's best lines, probably not her not her most remembered because her most remembered has to do with forgiveness, was where she said, you know, you have these lost boys of America.
Lost boys, yes.
Right, and they are uh they don't feel they have the opportunities their parents did.
They feel that America has sold them short, they have accumulated a lot of debt, admittedly in part by their own uh uh bad judgment, but also because the university's conned them into taking on this debt, expecting the federal government to bail them out and to pay it.
Uh but these young people are frustrated, they're angry, they don't have good relationships.
And Erica Kirk was like, Charlie wanted to try to help those people, including the guy, including the kind of guy that killed himself that that killed him.
So this is I think the largeness of our project.
Uh, but it also is the tragedy of it, because when you try to do that, think of it.
That that's what got him killed.
Because there are people who are in the dark side.
Uh Elon Musk, by the way, uh, put that very well.
He goes, Charlie represented the light and he was killed by the dark.
That's right.
Boom.
I mean, that's a hundred percent.
Talk about a succinct statement of what of what happened.
Yeah.
Now, I had planned for us to talk about uh about um the um this whole crazy business of what Tucker said and the Jews and uh hummus.
I I'm gonna defer this to tomorrow.
And I'll I'll address it.
I'll address it.
But good, because you know how I feel about that.
I know how you feel about it.
And and what I'll I'll but I do want us to talk about Israel and then so let's let's let's pivot to that.
In fact, this is sort of our segue into that.
Yeah.
But let's briefly talk about our trip um uh and and how meaningful it was and how it also tied into the themes of the film.
So we're donors to the um the pilgrimage road, as people who follow this podcast know.
And by the way, in response to a couple of my Israel posts, I've had not surprisingly people on the on social media go, oh come on, Dinesh, you're being paid by Israel.
Everybody knows you're being paid.
No.
And I'm thinking to myself, how stupid can you be?
You know what I mean?
We have been donating a large amount of money every year for since 2022.
For three years, yeah.
For three years, that's how we get invited as VIPs to go to this uh opening of the pilgrimage road.
By the way, this was uh uh the the Israeli Knesset was there, Netanyahu was there, uh Marco Rubio was there, people from the States.
So it was essentially a small group of us, like 150, maybe 200 at the most in the whole world who were there for this this momentous event.
Uh and so my point, The point I was trying to make is simply this.
You know, it's Israel isn't paying us, we're paying them.
It's crazy to accuse us of being somehow in the pay of Israel.
No, we're actually giving them money, not the other way around.
Now, that being said, talk about the event, and I also want to mention a couple things I did while I was there in relationship to the film.
Well, I mean, the the event itself was was remarkable.
And it wasn't just the speeches, right?
Because they they were remarkable too, but it was it was the Broadway type style production that they had.
They they had these singers, they sang the hallelujah chorus, I was singing along.
I mean, there's they opened with that incredible Verdi piece, which is the I think it's called the Chorus of the Hebrew Slaves.
Just haunting, beautiful.
And they had some Hebrew music as well.
There's a piece I'm trying to try to find.
It was it's Jerusalem, but it's I think it said like Yerushalem.
Yerushalem.
Yeah.
In Hebrew.
Yes.
Just like magical um invocation of the significance of this place.
And um, and um so this was a wonderful event.
Now we went all the way for that.
Um, but we also wanted to do some stuff basically exposing the ideas of the film to some key people in in Israel.
So I did an interview with the Jerusalem News Service, which your friend uh set up, uh Barbara, yes, and then I also did ILTV, which is a kind of English language uh channel.
I did CBN, the Christian Broadcasting Network.
This is Pat Robertson's uh network, which has of course an office in Jerusalem, and uh so we did a bunch of those sorts of things while while we were there, and uh so it it brought home to us the way in which um Israel,
the physical land of Israel, the people of Israel, and of course the archaeology of Israel are politically, culturally, morally, religiously like of a peace with the founding of America because I use the phrase Athens and Jerusalem.
One of the points I uh try to make is that Athens does not need a defense because of course you have the the um Greek uh tragedy in the theater, you have the foundation roots of democracy.
So we know that Athens has a precious legacy, and that legacy is not that controversial, but what is controversial is Jerusalem because Jerusalem represents Yahweh, it represents the Bible, it represents the Ten Commandments, it represents the moral demands that God makes on man and specifically on us.
Uh a lot, I think, of atheism, a lot of rebellion, a lot a lot of even agnosticism.
Why does someone want to be agnostic?
Not because there isn't a whisper in their conscience or their heart about God, but but they don't want to be under the sovereignty of God.
They don't want God to make the rules that they need to live under.
That's right.
Right?
So this is Jerusalem.
This is why Jerusalem is divisive.
And this is by the way, initially, remember how I talked about how Washington and Lincoln and FDR and Reagan were divisive?
The most divisive person in all of human history is Jesus Christ.
Yeah.
Divisive, as divisive now as he was then.
2,000 years ago.
Right?
Yeah, for sure.
And and this is to me also, let's I mean, this to me is the coming right back to the um the memorial service for Charlie, and a lot of people commented upon the fact that so there was such a uh kind of devotional tone to it, even from people you think of as being pretty secular.
You know, here's Tulsi Gabbard, who knew that she was a Christian, but there you go.
Pete Hag said, even Trump.
Um this was a Trump Jr.
Trump Jr.
Um now the point here being this that the that it's one thing for American political figures to invoke God.
Reagan invoked God.
Um even Bill Clinton invokes God, right?
Uh God bless America or a generic appeal to God.
It's a whole different thing to invoke Jesus Christ and to specifically invoke Christ.
And I forget who it was who was emphasizing Christ Marco Rubio.
Marco Rubio like knocked it out of the park.
There were so many good speeches.
I mean, I loved I actually loved Stephen Miller because I think Stephen Miller brought the evil of the left out.
It's one thing to have a revival, it's one thing to talk about grace, but again, just as Christ is divisive, you have to call out evil.
And there were a few speakers.
I mentioned Jack Basovic, I'd mentioned Benny.
Um, but I also I think Stephen Miller was the one who just let him have it.
And he did it with a kind of old testament fury that I thought was just downright magnificent.
This is by the way, when people keep talking about it's a Nazi rally, they always bring up Stephen Miller.
By the way, who's Jewish, right?
So you have a Jewish Nazi according to the left.
They're not but well, yeah, but I mean I think it stung them.
That's why they had to come back with this, oh, it was a Nuremberg rally.
And I've even seen them try to take Stephen Miller's face and stick it on like a Goebbels costume.
Oh my gosh.
Right.
So this is but but don't be too worried about this.
Is a helpless bitter flailing against a highly successful and powerful event.
So anyway, to sum up, guys.
Um well, and I wanted to go back a little bit to Israel, and you didn't let me know.
Oh, no, no, go ahead and go for it.
But so we actually experienced for the very first time a siren, and we had to go into a a bunker.
Oh my gosh.
We were eating a very pleasant dinner at the King David Hotel with our good friend Zevorn Steve.
Yes, who by the way organized the whole uh pilgrimage road event the next day, we're eating dinner with him.
Yeah, friends.
Yes.
We all had to get up.
We got up and went went to through the kitchen and into a I guess it's it's a some kind of a bunker.
It's like a landing.
It's a yeah.
And uh it we were there for about ten minutes.
Well, it was interesting how the you know the the Israelis were like, you know, like welcome to Israel.
No, you know the in the amazing part is I actually felt safer in Jerusalem than I feel like going to downtown Houston.
Isn't that well I I think it's actually downright it's true.
It's true.
And the reason it's true is you can you can walk the streets of Jerusalem at ten at night and you have other well-dressed people on the road.
You have it's all well lighted.
Uh you don't see people where you look at this guy and you go, I've got across the ro across the street.
It doesn't happen.
And so you feel that sense, which by the way, this is this is what it is like to live in a good city.
Right?
And we used to have cities like that in this country.
Uh and maybe there are a few still left, but not many.
Not many.
And um I mean, we live in a really safe area, and I don't think I would feel comfortable doing that at eleven o'clock at night.
Even where we are.
Even where we are.
Yeah.
No, but I had not only did I have peace about crime in general, but I also had peace about, well, we're not gonna the you know the people are like, oh, be careful, you know, they're they're they're shooting bombs at you guys and all that.
I I just tell the uh little exchange that you had with the young Oh the waitress.
Yeah, where you said, how do you do it?
Yeah, well, um I I was upset because we got word that our the the man who who composed the music for our movie is not doing well.
In fact, he may pass away, you know, because what he has is is incurable.
Um so I was crying and she was like very concerned.
She comes over, she goes, Well, what's the matter?
You know, and I told her, and she goes, Oh, I'm so sorry.
Is there anything I can do?
And you know, and she just had such a pleasant demeanor, and I and then I said, I go, how do you do it?
Living here, you know, with all this danger, constant.
And she goes, Well, we just it's we just have to.
We have to.
We have to live like this.
We have to be happy.
Right.
We have no other uh I think she said, we have no other choice, right?
Which by the way is a great line out of out of also the Poseidon adventure where a young woman loses her brother, of course, you know, the consumed by the water, he's just taken by the flood and he's killed and she's inconsolable.
And um and an older man is like come on, we got you gotta go.
You we gotta go.
We gotta keep moving.
And she's like, I can't go, I can't move.
He was like, How do you expect me to go on?
His answer is the same.
He goes, Well, we kinda have to.
You know, there's we don't have a choice.
We don't have a choice.
This is in life when these things happen, it looks like you've been like pulverized by life itself.
Yep.
Uh but guess what?
You there's yeah, there's no alternative but to get up on your feet and and and move on.
That's what these people are doing.
Well, if there's anything that comes out of these two adventures that we went on last week and and this week.
Yes, exactly.
Uh she has no other choice, right?
And and I think that I you know, I want to become a better Christian.
I really do.
I think that this weekend really inspired me to be a not just a better Christian, a better person, which actually falls in line with being a better Christian, but um, I see hope.
Uh I see people professing their faith uh when they were too afraid and ashamed to do it.
In unusual places.
That's right.
And so unfortunately, out of tragedy, um, or fortunate out of tragedy.
The silver lining is I feel like we we're seeing a revival in our country that we needed.
We desperately need it because we need that light to overcome the darkness.
I'm very happy that our film, which by the way was made before this, um, could not have obviously anticipated any of this.
But nevertheless, it has that uplifting spirit.
It's very consistent.
Uh it doesn't hesitate to show the dark side, it actually shows the author of the dark side.
Uh it goes into the root of all this, but on the other hand, it is uh a film that is is eye-opening, exhilarating, but in the end, I think also very hopeful, very encouraging, and I think will make you want to be at the end of it uh a better person too.
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