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Feb. 1, 2024 - Dinesh D'Souza
48:41
COME AND TAKE IT Dinesh D’Souza Podcast Ep760
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Coming up, I'm going to discuss something that's been talked about a good deal.
Is Biden really going to be the nominee for the Democratic Party in 2024, or is it going to be someone else?
Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick joins me.
We're going to go into it on the border and talk about how Texas can thwart Biden's effort to flood the country with illegal aliens.
Hey, if you're watching on Rumble or listening on Apple, Google, or Spotify, please subscribe to my channel.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Show.
The times are crazy. In a time of confusion, division, and lies, we need a brave voice of reason, understanding, and truth.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Podcast.
Is Joe Biden really going to be the Democratic nominee for president in 2024?
It might seem like this is a silly question because the Democrats are pushing forward with Biden.
He's announced his re-election.
They have effectively cut off the ability of any other candidate.
To effectively compete with Biden.
We have Republican primaries going on, and there are Republicans who say, oh, it's over.
Trump has already got it figured out.
But Trump has got to win the Republican primary.
He might win it decisively, but there is a primary going on.
And right now, it's pretty much between Trump and Nikki Haley, even though Trump is way, way ahead.
But there's no real Democratic primary going on.
And instead of raising questions about this, the press has been kind of eerily cooperative with the Democrats.
It's almost like they get a daily memo or a daily call or a daily signal.
This is what we want to – this is what we – and we here means the Democrats plus the media – I want to say today.
And as a result, you have it being treated as a normalcy that Biden is just going to coast to the nomination.
But nevertheless, there's a lot of speculation to the fact that Biden might be eased out.
He might be replaced.
Something might conveniently happen to him, or he decides his health is bad, or He just, they just kind of wheel him out of there.
Remember, he keeps saying, they tell me this, they told me I have to leave now.
So it's kind of like, they told me I can no longer be on the ticket, and he's off, never to be heard from again.
Or he falls off the podium, and nobody knows where he goes.
Anything like this could happen.
And there's some people who think it will happen, and they go, well, that's because it's going to be Newsom Dinesh, or it's going to be Michelle Obama, and Interestingly, the people who say it's Newsom seem really sure it's going to be Newsom, and the people who think it's Michelle Obama, really sure it's going to be Michelle Obama.
Now, let's start with Michelle Obama for a second.
Debbie was making the point just a moment ago that, why would Michelle Obama even want to do this?
Because isn't Obama already running the country?
Aren't the Obamas calling the shots from, you know, in a ventriloquist way?
Biden's their ventriloquist doll?
He's not as animated as a ventriloquist doll.
Ventriloquist doll normally move faster than Biden.
They don't look around like, what's my place on the stage?
But nevertheless, the point being that the Obamas already exercise this influence.
And they don't need to have, in some ways, the you go front and center, you also become a target.
People start attacking you, humiliating you.
Now, I have a second reason that Debbie didn't mention.
And that is a reason I've been highlighting off and on in my posts over the years.
And that is Michelle Obama is just an unbelievably stupid individual.
She is not very intelligent.
Now, it seems bad to say all these things.
And I say them, I actually don't say them sort of willingly.
I say them unwillingly.
But I say them because they're true and they have to be said.
Now, it's not often that you've got somebody at this level of government who is a semi-illiterate.
But if you've ever heard Michelle Obama speak, she never makes any sense.
And if you go back and look at her intellectual pedigree, it's all fake.
Oh, when she went to Princeton, Dinesh.
This is like saying that Claudine Gay went to Andover.
How'd she get in? Claudine Gay went to Stanford.
How'd she get in? Claudine Gay went to Harvard.
How'd she get in? So when you have this kind of affirmative action escalator that is another form of the Peter Principle, right?
It elevates people to their level of incompetence.
And that's been the case with Michelle Obama.
She's been coddled all her life.
To a degree, it's also true of Obama.
Obama himself is not that bright, but he's cunning.
He's got a street cunning and he also has a certain fakery.
He's a con man and he's actually good at being a con man.
He's good at stoking the fires of resentment.
He knows how to do those things.
The point I want to stress here is that the reason I think it will be Biden is because I think that the junta, the gang, the mafia operation running the country right now, make no mistake, that's what we have.
We have an unknown group of people who are calling the shots using Joe Biden as their figurehead.
Think about what a cozy arrangement those people have.
They're accountable to nobody.
They can, in a sense, go to war with Iran and call a strike on Iran that would threaten World War III, and you don't even know who they are.
And I don't know who they are.
And we can speculate it's Obama, but we don't, in fact, know.
Those people running the country like the fact that you've got a mumbling, bumbling stage idiot as their front man.
They don't want Newsom.
They don't want Michelle Obama.
They don't want anybody who's going to come in there and sort of take charge and say, all right, from now on, you guys can advise me.
I appreciate it, but I'm going to be making the decisions.
I'm going to decide what we're going to do about the new, who's going to be nominated for the new chairman of the Fed.
And I'm going to be negotiating on the Hill.
And I'm going to be approving my own speeches.
And I'm going to be running the rudders of foreign policy.
They don't want that.
They've got an arrangement where they have maximum power with minimum accountability.
And for this reason, as long as Joe Biden is even minimally viable, if he becomes completely unviable, they may decide, listen, we're going to be losing this power anyway.
The guy is hopeless.
No amount of even, even our shenanigans, even our cheating, even our fraud is not going to be enough to save Joe Biden.
Then they might in desperation start looking around.
But I think that as long as they think that there is a pathway to success and that they have this under control.
Hey, we got the media.
Hey, we got the mules.
Hey, we got all these other new schemes that the Republicans are too dumb to even think of.
They're going to be like, we've got a really great arrangement with Joe Biden.
And for as long as possible, we, the junta, we intend to keep it.
Precarious elections in Taiwan, a crazy man in North Korea, Iran increasing its aggression.
There's a lot of global instability as we plunge into primary season.
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comes a riveting new film, Letter to the American Church.
The film explores the parallels between 1930s Nazi Germany, Mao and Stalin regimes on the one hand, and the infiltration of cultural Marxism in America today.
The church's decision to stay out of politics undermines the very message of the gospel and its power to transform human existence.
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Join Eric and several leading voices of today as they explain how America and her church are at the precipice of destruction and need to wake up and take action.
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The film is not yet rated.
Guys, I'm really happy to welcome back to the podcast our friend Dan Patrick, Lieutenant Governor of Texas.
You can follow him on social media.
He's on x at Dan Patrick, the website danpatrick.org.
First elected Lieutenant Governor in 2014, re-elected in 2018.
Dan, welcome. I believe you just got back from the border.
What's the latest that you saw and what are the new developments that you can tell us about?
Great to be with you again, Dinesh.
So last Friday, I went down to the border to Shelby Park, where there's been a lot of attention recently.
Governor Abbott was in India actually on a state visit.
And I went down there for two reasons.
First of all, I've been down there many, many times over my years in office.
But I wanted to go down that specific day because the Biden administration had said, we're going to cut the wire because the Supreme Court had said, at least on a temporary ruling, they could cut the wire.
And I wanted to be down there, number one, to show support for our great men and women in the National Guard and the Department of Public Safety.
And number two, just to be there unless, in case rather, the Border Patrol or the White House decide to send someone down to cut the wire and...
The good news is the Border Patrol made the decision not to cut the wire.
And had they, Dinesh, very clear, and the court ruling would have allowed this, by the way, we would have replaced the wire.
As soon as they snipped it, we would have repaired it.
We have more wire than they have wire cutters.
And we didn't want a confrontation.
We don't want a confrontation with the federal government.
They should not want one with our men and women down there doing our job to protect Texas and protect America for them by securing the border.
And so that's why I went on Friday.
Here's a great statistic, Dinesh, on this.
Shelby Park is like a pear-shaped little park that goes out to the Rio Grande from the Eagle Pass area.
A few months ago, 2,000 to 3,000 people a day, Dinesh, were crossing there.
Two to three thousand a day.
When I was there Friday, when I left at three or four o'clock in the afternoon, it was zero for that day.
And yesterday, I think there were six or seven that tried to cross.
So we effectively, with the concertina wire and those containers, ship containers you see beneath it in the videos and the photographs that people have seen, it's really been effective.
And why would the Biden administration want to come and cut the wire?
They said in case of an emergency, well, we're there to To save anyone in the river, and we do on a regular basis.
So they did not come down.
It was a good decision by them.
Again, we weren't looking for a confrontation.
We just wanted to uphold our constitutional rights, and we believe constitutionally we have a right to protect our citizens and our country on the border.
I mean, Dan, the idea that we can replace the wire faster than they can cut, it seems to me very brilliant and also very consistent with the Supreme Court decision because am I right in saying that while the Supreme Court lifted an injunction and thus permitted the Biden administration to cut the wire, The Supreme Court did not order Texas to do or not do anything.
It didn't say you're forbidden from putting up new wire.
And so Texas is completely within its rights and is not flouting the Supreme Court decision, contrary to what some people have argued on social media.
Yes, you make a brilliant point, Dinesh, as you always do, by the way, because many people misread that.
The Supreme Court just simply, again, a temporary order, this case will be heard fully in a later point, that they were able to cut it if they felt there was an emergency.
And, you know, the other point I made is, why would President Biden, Dinesh, I want to send Border Patrol.
By the way, Texas and Border Patrol rank and file all the agents.
We work very well together.
They want our help.
We need their help. We're doing this together.
In fact, they're so under man and out man, what I said when I was at Shelby Park, why would Biden want to thin out his troops anymore on the border?
He doesn't have enough by his own doing, not because of Congress.
You know, I saw Biden yesterday say, well, you know, I need Congress to pass a bill.
And I've been asking, look, He has done nothing to secure this border since he became president, Dinesh, except reverse every executive order that President Trump put in place in the last year in office that actually secured this border.
The last year President Trump was in office, we had somewhere around 400,000 crossings all year that year.
In December, we had 300,000 crossings in one month.
So Biden is about 2 million or more every year.
Trump had it down to 400,000 or less.
And why would Biden want to come and thin out his forces, put border patrol there while we already have it secure?
We're going to put wire across the entire border.
We're working on it every day.
You know, our borders, I've told many people that actually don't realize this.
It's more miles than the distance between Atlanta and Portland, Maine.
We have about 1,250 miles that we have to secure, and it's very zigzaggy.
It's not a straight line like Atlanta to Portland, Maine, but it's very zigzaggy, and it's hard to cover at all, but there are hundreds of miles that we can cover, and that's what we're going to do.
I mean, this problem has reached catastrophic proportions.
Is this something, in all honesty, that should have been done two years ago?
Because it became pretty obvious from the beginning that Biden was going to do a complete somersault, a complete reversal on Trump.
This is a problem that goes back two years now.
Obviously, it's escalated over time.
Is your view of this that the action is sort of better late than never?
Or was there some rationale for not doing it before?
No, we've actually been doing it pretty much since Biden took over office and made clear he was not going to secure the border.
You know, we had hoped in Texas that we could work with them on a reasonable basis And once they took office and and settled in for example, they left millions and millions worth of wall Lying flat on the border that Trump had paid for and was going to put up and so we for example Were negotiating with them to buy that material instead of starting all over and they wouldn't do that And so very quickly in the first several months of that administration
We realized they weren't serious about securing the border at all So to give you a sense of how we've been ramping up when I was a senator in 2007, let's go back in time The border wasn't an issue to most Americans as it is today The Texas legislature had no money in the budget for border security back in 2005.
We passed a two-year budget.
So when I came in in 2007, I recognized the problem.
We put $100 million in the budget.
And I was able to increase that as a senator up to a little over $200 million.
When I became lieutenant governor in 2015, we increased that to $800 million.
And since the last four years, we've increased that to $2 billion per year.
I'm talking about per year. So we passed a two-year budget.
We just increased it to $4 billion of our Texas taxpayer money.
So zero in 2005, hundreds of millions, and now we're in the billions to do the job.
So we have been ramping this up.
Our state police, we've added hundreds down there.
Our National Guard we put in place.
We've been putting this wire out for some time.
And then we also had this development that someone brought us this idea of putting buoys in the water.
And they've been very effective.
So this has been an ongoing process, and we're going to continue to do more.
Like I said, we're going to continue to string this wire out everywhere that we can.
There's some areas of no-man land in the mountainous area where no one crosses.
But where we can, which is mainly from Brownsville, Texas, for those who don't know, that's on the coast with the Gulf of Mexico, over to the Laredo area and a little beyond up to El Paso.
That's where almost everyone is coming through.
That's what's happening. So, no, we've been on this for quite a while.
I mean, in a way, it's kind of maddening, though, Dan, isn't it?
I mean, here you have Texas.
And to some degree, I mean, when the Biden administration goes to the Supreme Court and says it's the federal government that's responsible for border security, I think you and I, in principle, would say, well, yeah.
But you haven't been doing your job.
And so here you have a responsibility that should be undertaken, just like national defense as a responsibility should be undertaken by the federal government.
It's almost like Texas is in the weird position of now having to allocate its own resources in order to perform a function that in some sense really belongs to Washington, D.C. But would you say that we're only doing it out of necessity because they flatly refuse to do it?
Yes, yes. It's not in some sense, in all sense.
They're not doing anything. Again, 2 million people.
And let me put this in perspective, Dinesh, because people hear these numbers.
When we say 2 million, 2.2 million have been apprehended.
We have 28 bridge crossings with Mexico to Texas, 28.
That's the people who are crossing the bridge.
That we're apprehended. They come in and say, we want asylum.
Now, 95% of those people don't qualify for asylum, but they come in, and the Biden administration lets them come in, and they go around the country.
They have no idea where they are, who they are.
Are they terrorists? Look, we've had almost 300 people captured on the terrorist watch list.
So you have these, when we say millions, they're the ones crossing the bridge just saying, you know, no mas, I'm here.
You know, I'm going to asylum.
Let me get into the country. Then you have, like Shelby Park, That was the area between the bridges.
There was a mile and a half between the bridges.
These are the people who don't want to cross the bridge because they don't want to get caught.
Maybe they're smuggling drugs.
Maybe they have a criminal record.
As I've said, we've got murderers, molesters, rapists, terrorists, kidnappers, carjackers, you name it, crossing the border within these millions of people.
And so... This is the issue.
Biden has done nothing at all about this.
That incident recently in New York City where illegal immigrants beat up two policemen.
First of all, that was the first thing that said the third world country that they're coming from?
They're now making America a third world country in our big cities.
Number two, the George Soros judges and DAs that let them out immediately.
So imagine this.
Times Square. You've been there.
I've been there. Many people watching have been to Times Square.
They beat up two cops on the ground.
They let them out immediately.
They're only in the holding tank for three hours.
The federal government has no idea who those people really are.
They don't know where they're going.
They don't know where they live. We'll never see them again.
It's outrageous what's happening to America.
Joe Biden is turning this country into a third world country.
When we come back, I want to ask Dan Patrick about the so-called deal that is cooking in the Senate to solve the problem.
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I'm back with Texas Lieutenant Governor Dan Patrick.
Follow him on x at Dan Patrick.
His website, danpatrick.org.
Dan, I've seen different numbers in terms of illegals, estimates here, estimates over there.
You're probably in as good a position as anyone to have a number.
Since the beginning of the Biden administration, January of 2021 to now, how many people would you estimate have illegally entered the United States?
My estimate is going to shock people, but I peg it somewhere between $12, $14, and $15 million.
As I said in the last segment, we have 28 crossing bridges with Mexico.
That's where you hear these numbers all the time when people read and hear the numbers of $2 million.
That's who turned themselves in.
Then you have the Gadawaves, which are another million or more.
Those are the ones we see that we can't catch.
We have thousands of cameras at our expense, by the way.
Border Patrol has some on the border.
So we see people, Dinesh, but by the time we get there, they're gone.
And I'll get back to that point in a moment.
And then you have the people, Dinesh, that we don't see.
Again, our border is 1,250 miles.
There are areas that people cross that we just don't see them.
I mean, they get in. So if you ask any law enforcement officer on the border, they will tell you for every one we catch on the bridge or we catch in no man's land, there's another one getting by.
So if we know 8 to 10 million have come across the bridges, That could be another 8 or 10 million total that we haven't seen.
That's 15 or 16 million people.
That would be, Dinesh, the sixth or seventh largest state in America if they all lived in one place.
The biggest state is California, then Texas, then New York, then Florida, Pennsylvania, Illinois, and then the next state would be the state of illegal immigrants.
Imagine that. Imagine that.
And these people, not just do we have the criminal element and the terrorist element in this.
I mean, we arrested someone from Lebanon the other day.
We've had people here from Syria and Iraq and Iran and you name it all over the world.
This isn't just South America, Central America, or Mexico.
When you look at that number, you realize of all the people who could be our enemies that are coming into our country and we don't know where they are.
There are 85 children, 85,000 children missing that have come across the border.
The Biden administration don't know where they went.
85,000 children.
But most of the people coming in now are of legal military age, 18 to 40.
You asked your question, why would President Biden allow that to happen?
Yeah, I mean, that is the question, isn't it?
Because let's just do a little basic math.
I mean, we have approximately 300 plus million people in this country.
10% of that is 30 million.
Half of that is 15 million.
That's your number. So what you're saying is that we have added 5% to the population of the country.
Now, if you're thinking of it in terms of voting people, that's obviously a much larger percentage because not everybody in the country now gets to vote.
So this, it seems to me, is probably their rationale.
I can't think of any other rationale, even though some people poo-poo the idea of a great replacement.
Isn't there some logic to the fact that the Democrats must be trying to import, you can say, new future citizens because they are disappointed with the voting habits of the existing citizens who are already here?
Well, Dinesh, think about this.
They play the long game.
You know, 20 years is only five presidential elections.
And people can remember five presidential elections like it was yesterday, actually.
Go back 20 years. Go back to when George Bush was elected.
It seems like yesterday we were looking at hanging chads and look at the presidents we've had since then.
So it's not, they're playing the long game.
It's not that long. All the children that these 15 million are going to have.
That will be automatic citizens.
And will they say, hey, we love the Democrats.
It was Uncle Joe Biden that let my father and mother in.
No, this is their long game that they're playing.
And it doesn't take many voters to swing an election and swing states.
And something about these people are being smuggled.
Because we have this argument in the Constitution, you know, the Constitution says invasion.
And, you know, people are trying to fight invasion.
Well, Texas shouldn't be doing this. There's no army coming.
Of course there's an army coming. There's, again, 10, 12 million people that have come here, 16 million by the time Biden's out, potentially.
And here's the deal.
The drug cartels are the army.
They're not crossing with their weapons, but they're sending their soldiers, in essence, of the drug smugglers, the people smugglers.
But here's an alarming statistic, Dinesh, to show you how sophisticated this operation is for the cartels who are invading us.
We arrested in Texas 13,163 smugglers through last year, 104 in December.
13,000. 95% are U.S. citizens who are doing the smuggling.
The cartels are operating with the gangs in the streets who are U.S. citizens, the same ones who are smuggling and distributing the drugs, like fentanyl, that's the number one killer of young people.
And those 13,000, guess what happens?
Those smugglers, and they're the ones we've caught, U.S. citizens, 95% of them, they get GPS coordinates from someone on the other side, the cartels, telling them where to be at a specific time and day to pick up the people they're smuggling.
So the cartels get paid from the people they're pushing across the border, and then they pay a percentage of that to the gangs.
And if the gangs don't pick them up and they don't show up, then the cartels keep all the money and They don't care what happened to the person they smuggled over.
Not to mention the sex trade that's happening, the children that come here, the women that come here, they're raped as part of their bounty, the people that drowned in the river.
The Bible says in Revelations, the four horsemen of the apocalypse, the last horse, and death rode with them.
I would say the four horsemen of the apocalypse are Biden, Kamala Harris, Mayorkas, and Jean-Pierre.
They all are lying to the American public through their teeth.
And death rides with them because all of these people who have died of fentanyl, the MS-13 victims in America who have been killed, the police officers and law enforcement have been killed by people here illegally, the drunk drivers who have killed people who are here illegally, and all the people who have drowned in the river or died crossing the land, All of that death is all the four horsemen of the apocalypse of the Biden administration.
Despite their lies, it appears that the truth is getting out. It's unavoidable. Texans know about it. Most Americans can see. And there are some fairly horrifying images on X and other social media platforms. So I think that the secret is sort of out despite the lies. And so the Biden people seem to have thought, well, listen, we need to backtrack a little bit here, if only temporarily.
Why don't we find some Republicans and talk them into a deal that is, in my view, a very bad deal because it apparently sets some sort of allowance.
Once the number of illegals hits X, let's say 5,000, then we spring into action and shut the border down.
I want you to comment about not just the deal itself and what you know about what's in the deal, But why would Republicans at a time when this appears to be a pressing advantage for Republicans politically, somehow we've gotten past the media and the lying and the American people know what's going on, and then we sort of give away that advantage by saying, all right, let's make a bipartisan deal so Biden can say both sides have come together and resolve the issue.
Comment on what's happening in Washington, D.C. right now on all this.
So, I only know what even U.S. Senators know who served there know, and that's what we hear and what we're told and what's in the deal.
But if indeed this is the deal that Republicans are making in the Senate, first of all, it's not going to pass the House.
Mike Johnson's already said that.
But every voter in every state should vote.
Look at how their U.S. senator is going to vote on this deal.
And if they vote for it, I think you need a new U.S. senator.
We should not make this deal.
And I'm not saying for political reasons.
I'm saying for practical reasons.
Because they're talking about letting 5,000 in a day and then shutting it down.
That tells you two things. First of all, 5,000 a day is $150,000 a month.
That's still close to $2 million a year.
What have we accomplished? Number two...
When Biden says, after 5,000, I'll shut it down.
What does that tell you? He can shut it down.
I mean, if you can shut it down at 5,000, you can shut it down at 3,000, you can shut it down at 500.
You'll never get the zero. But my point is, he's admitting, I want the world to hear this.
The Biden administration admits they can shut it down.
They just want the number.
Where do you want me to close the door?
And so this is a terrible deal.
And by the way, the reason the Biden administration is now awake Two reasons.
Number one, we've spent a fortune in buses to blue states.
A brilliant move to send these buses because it's putting the pain in Chicago and Denver and New York and Philadelphia, Washington, D.C., you name it.
That brilliant strategy.
They're feeling the pain. But number two, in Iowa, of all places, in the middle of the country, what was the number one issue in the caucus?
Border security. What was the number one issue in New Hampshire?
Far away from the border. Illegal immigration.
The Democrats know they have a problem.
And by the way, the Biden administration now is working with Mexico, we believe, we think we know, in ways of getting the Mexican government to help him slow down the amount of people coming.
It looks like Mexico is finally getting into action.
And look, this will just be temporary.
So don't be fooled, America. Don't be fooled.
Look, Americans have to pick a side in this election, no matter what anybody thinks about any candidate.
The Democrat, progressive, leftist, Marxist position of chaos in our country and having all of these people come in and chaos in the streets.
And by the way, who's going to educate all these people?
That's going to cost taxpayers and their schools.
How about the emergency rooms that will be jammed?
Forget the ones who are here actually to get a job and aren't criminals.
The millions of people now we have to take care of.
Where are they working? Where are they living?
What's going on? They gotta go to school.
And so this is a leftist Marxist movement and policy that Biden's a puppet and he's implementing.
I don't even think he knows what he's doing anymore.
He's just a puppet out there.
And so you have to pick a side, America, in this election in November.
You're either with the country and with our Constitution and with secure borders, or you're not.
It's really that simple. Sometimes you hear people say, and this is what I want, I object to, and I think you will too, you know, that we can't solve these problems because we're dealing with a uniparty.
Both parties are in this together, and the presumption is that they're equally culpable.
I think here's where the flaw lies.
Republicans have many times failed to solve a problem.
But who is the cause of the problem?
The cause of the problem, it seems to me, is coming from the left.
So you can fault the Republicans for ineffectiveness, at least in the past, in remedying some of these problems or tackling them head-on, but that's not the same thing as deliberately or by design inflicting the country with these problems that are having a ruinous effect, as you say, not just on the border itself, but throughout the country.
Yes. I blame both parties.
Look, I'm a loyal, conservative Republican.
But I blame both parties.
But I agree with you. It's mostly at the fault of the Democrats.
But both parties, you know, George Bush had a majority of Republicans his first couple of years, and nothing happened.
Obama had a majority of Democrats his first couple of years, nothing happened.
Trump, when he came in, had a majority.
And I'm not blaming this on Bush or Trump in their first years in office.
I'm talking about Congress.
You didn't have enough strong Republicans in Congress.
You had too many rhinos and moderates who just wanted to go along to get along that they didn't help their Republican presidents who ran.
It took Trump a couple of years to get the money, because remember, Congress kept shutting him down money.
So we've had this, but that was at the end, Democrats wouldn't give him any money.
But we've seen both parties But the party that you're absolutely right, the party that has pushed this and pushed this and pushed this forever, have been the Democrats.
And the only person that came in and stopped it was Donald Trump.
I mean, the reason they don't like Donald Trump and the Democrats hate Donald Trump, there are really two reasons.
Number one, he was serious about draining the swamp.
And you just, you know, you don't walk in the Oval Office, just like I did walk in the lieutenant governor's office, even though I'd been a senator for eight years.
You don't walk in the first day and be able to wave a magic wand and get everything you want to get done in the first week.
It takes a little bit of time.
And it didn't take Donald Trump much time at all, quite frankly, faster than any other president.
I think Donald Trump's the greatest president we've ever had.
Ronald Reagan, fabulous.
I love Ronald Reagan. I have a bust of him sitting on my desk behind the camera here.
But Donald Trump actually, you know, he went in there and drained the swamp.
So they hate him for that, and they know that's what he'll do again.
And now he will, in the second term, he will hit the street running on the first day, because he's now had those four years and he knows.
The second thing they hate Donald Trump for, you have to understand that the Marxist left is socialist, Dinesh.
And I know you know this, but I want to be sure the people watching know this.
They've been on this march.
This didn't happen overnight for decades.
And the first thing they did was take over our education system.
We now know they prevailed in higher ed, and they're working hard in K-12 in many areas.
The next thing, take over the media.
They own the media in this country.
I mean, MSNBC, CNBC, the newsprint, ones that are left, they're all just propaganda arms of the leftist Democrats.
But what's the third wing?
The third wing they had to take over to control everything was Supreme Court.
And they're angry at Hillary Clinton.
That's why they don't like her either and have cast her aside.
They can't believe she lost to Donald Trump because they were counting on election night in 2016.
They were counting on we're going to now have a 6-3, 7-2 liberal court.
And it wouldn't have mattered what any red state legislation we passed in Texas or anywhere else.
Supreme Court would have overruled it all.
So to take over a country, you have to get the education system, you have to get the media, and you have to get the highest court.
And that's why they hate Donald Trump, because he alone stopped them from getting that court.
Can you imagine where we'd be today if Hillary had won?
Can you imagine? Remarkable.
Thank you very much, Dan Patrick.
Really appreciate your coming on the podcast.
Thank you.
Yes, sir. Thank you, Dinesh.
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I'm discussing Harry Jaffa's book, Crisis of the House Divided, a study of the Lincoln-Douglas debates, and we're going to plunge into the case for Douglas.
But before we do that, I thought an overview of the general difference between Douglas and Lincoln is very important.
So we can kind of keep that in mind as we go into more detail about what Douglas believed and who he was and how he came to his views and so on.
Now, historians, unfortunately, have a very bad tendency when they look at old debates, and that is they act like they are above the debate.
They act as if both parties sort of didn't really know what was going on.
They act as if the differences that were important to the people in the debate didn't really matter all that much.
And this is the sort of pretend superiority We're good to go.
So there's a whole bunch of historical work on the Lincoln-Douglas debates, and it kind of goes like this.
Lincoln exaggerated his critique of Douglas because Lincoln acted like Douglas was pro-slavery, whereas, first of all, Douglas was really not.
And second of all, Lincoln himself wasn't all that anti-slavery.
Lincoln himself admitted that slavery could continue in the southern states.
So this...
Great accusation by Lincoln has to be taken with a grain of salt, needs to be sort of moderated.
And similarly, Douglass made accusations against Lincoln.
Lincoln was an abolitionist.
Lincoln favored miscegenation or interracial marriage between the races.
And this was an exaggeration on Douglass' part because Lincoln...
Actually professed that, no, I'm actually not defending those things.
That's not what this debate is all about.
And so the idea is that Lincoln and Douglas were, in fact, closer to each other than either man let on.
And this is the, let's call it the debates were no big deal position.
Which, of course, is the natural inference from this school of scholarship because, truly, if two people are debating and they're acting like there's a major difference between them, and in fact there isn't, well, then you have a sort of a pretend debate because, in fact, the two parties are much closer.
But it's not just that this is a misleading position that they're putting forward before the American people, but it's actually very pernicious, isn't it?
Because if you have two parties or two sides and they actually agree or they're very close to agreeing and yet they widen the differences between each other and let's just say provoke the country to such a degree that you have a divide in the country that leads to a civil war.
Think of the level of irresponsibility that is being alleged against these two statesmen.
Now the historians who say this don't carry it that far.
They don't follow their logic to its conclusion, but the conclusion is kind of unavoidable.
Now, Lincoln and Douglass believed that there were very important differences between the two of them, and these differences had nuance to them, to be sure, but nevertheless, there was an irreducible core of what Douglass was saying that Lincoln could not possibly agree with, and there was an irreducible core to what Lincoln was saying that Douglass could not possibly agree with.
Now, let's look at what that is.
Now, the irreducible core of what Lincoln was saying is that slavery is morally wrong.
It is unjust.
It is the rule, it is the illegitimate rule of one man over another man without his consent.
A slave is taken not with consent but with force.
And that even though allowances might be made for slavery to continue...
that was nothing more than allowing a lesser evil.
So Lincoln conceded that slavery could be, under certain circumstances, a lesser evil.
And so he believed, for example, that it is not his right, either constitutionally or pragmatically, to intervene in the southern states, to force them to give up slavery when slavery had existed in the southern states since the founding.
The founders had allowed it.
They had made a constitutional arrangement that permitted it.
And so Lincoln's like, we got it.
I understand.
Lincoln actually later would compare it to having a child that is sort of entrapped or encircled by a snake.
And Lincoln's point is, it may not be very easy to get rid of the snake.
The snake is actually wrapped around the baby.
But Lincoln's point was let's admit it is a snake and let's admit that our goal is to get rid of the snake.
And if you pretend that the snake is nice or the snake is good or the baby has every right to have the snake, then you are completely delusional and you are completely in the wrong.
So this is Lincoln's irreducible position.
Slavery is bad.
Now, Douglass' position would appear on this to be absolutely indefensible because what's Douglass going to say?
No, you're wrong. Slavery is actually good.
But Douglass' position was, first of all, that the idea that no man has the right to rule over another man without his consent— This is not universally true.
And this might seem, again, to be outrageous, and of course Douglass would be quickly cancelled if he was making that claim today, but to show you that this is not a...
Here's Douglass. The civilized world have always held that when any race of men have shown themselves so degraded by ignorance, superstition, cruelty, and barbarism as to be utterly incapable of governing themselves, they must, in the nature of things, be governed by others by such laws as are deemed applicable to their condition.
Douglas is basically saying there are civilized people in the world and there are barbarians, and civilized people have a right to rule over barbarians.
Now you might say, wait a minute, this is a very illiberal position, but in fact it is not.
Here is the leading liberal of the 19th century, John Stuart Mill, the very apostle of freedom, the author of On Liberty, studied all across the world as a champion of liberty, and I'm now going to read from John Stuart Mill, 1859, from On Liberty.
Despotism is a legitimate mode of government in dealing with barbarians.
Liberty as a principle has no application to any state of things anterior to the time when mankind have become capable of being improved by free and equal discussions.
So what is Mill saying?
Mill is saying that you can not only imagine, there are conditions all over the world.
Debbie describes to me, for example, in Venezuela, there's a group of people, essentially aborigines, living in trees.
And these are people who have been there since time immemorial.
If you enter their territory, they will essentially subtract you from your head.
They will put your head on a stake or on a string and carry it around.
These are people who live off the land.
They have been untouched by 2000 years of Western civilization.
Now, does it make any sense to take people like that and say, hey, the 2024 election is coming up and we would like to find out what your views are on that subject?
John Stuart Mill says no.
Those people are incapable of self-government.
They are living in a state of barbarism.
And so, despotism, which is to say external rule over them...
is legitimate. And so, right here, we have, coming from the leading liberal of the 19th century, a sort of support for Douglass' position.
And I give this example only because I want to emphasize that, again, one of the things we're going to discover in this book is that many of the clichés and slogans that we take for granted in conventional debate were Called into question in the more sophisticated debate of the 19th century between Lincoln and Douglas.
If we say things like, monarchy is bad, we'll realize that not only were there people in the 19th century who were like, monarchy is bad, but under certain conditions.
Oh, monarchy is bad for this reason.
And remember that when you say monarchy is bad for this reason, what you mean is that there might be other circumstances in which this reason does not apply, in which monarchy would be not so bad.
And then when we go back to the ancient philosophers from Plato to Aristotle, we realize that they had a completely different view of monarchy, and it's not because we know stuff that they didn't.
They thought of all the things that we talk about today and yet they thought that despite all that there are serious problems with what we would now call the democratic system of government and they thought that these were problems that a monarchical system of government might under certain conditions remedy. So that's what this is the kind of voyage that we're undertaking.
We're going to be getting to the issue of a free society not because we want to be enemies of a free society.
We are friends of a free society.
We are advocates of a free society.
But we also realize that there are weaknesses inherent in a free society, and we want to remedy those.
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