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Coming up, some Republicans want to impeach Biden after November because of a call to Saudi Arabia.
I think there are actually several better reasons to impeach him.
Researchers at Boston have created a COVID-type virus with 80% lethality.
Is this something we want to be doing, this so-called gain-of-function research?
I'll provide an update on the arrest of Connix CEO Eugene Yu and Italian journalist Simona Mangiante joins me.
We're going to talk about Giorgio Maloney and politics in Italy.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Show.
The times are crazy in a time of confusion, division, and lies.
We need a brave voice of reason, understanding, and truth.
This is the Dinesh D'Souza Podcast.
Republicans are now talking at the leadership level about impeaching Biden, impeaching Biden if, as seems likely, Republicans win the House and there's a decent chance that Republicans will also win the Senate.
So impeachment becomes something that's quite real.
Now, I was worried, as I'm sure some other people were also, that Republicans would do what Republicans do, which is essentially talk big and then quickly back off the moment that they come into power.
They then go, well, you know, we...
We really don't want to be going down impeachment.
We've got a lot of legislative business to do.
No, there's actually no legislative business to do for the simple reason that whatever legislative business is done by Republicans is going to be vetoed by Biden.
So let's not fool ourselves and talk nonsense about passing legislation.
It's really not going to happen.
It's going to be a standoff.
What Republicans should do is use the power of the purse as leverage against Biden and And impeachment is very important.
Now, here's Ali Stefanik, number three House Republican, saying that one potential reason to impeach Biden is, quote, his illegal request that Saudi Arabia delay oil production cuts.
And she goes on to say, when there's an egregious abuse of power and high crimes and misdemeanors, that means anything is on the table.
Now, I can see why Elise Stefanik is saying this.
She's basically thinking, look, Biden makes a phone call to the Saudis and basically says, hey, listen, release the oil now because the midterms are coming up.
And that's certainly distasteful.
And she sees that there's a kind of a mirror with the Democrats going after Trump for what?
A phone call that he made to Ukraine.
So there's a kind of parallelism here, and I think this is really what Elise Stefanik is grabbing onto.
But she's grabbing onto it with typical Republican clumsiness.
By which I mean, I do not think it is an impeachable offense for an American president to call the Saudis and say, hey, listen, I want you to keep oil prices low.
Why? Because although that may politically benefit Biden in the short run, it also benefits the American people.
Oil prices are lower.
So to actually try to impeach Biden over that seems to me, well, it seems to me particularly silly when there are so many other good reasons to impeach Biden, of which I can think of several.
Let's start with the Biden family corruption.
I'm not talking about, quote, Hunter Biden, because the corruption really isn't Hunter Biden.
Hunter Biden, yes, it's true, is using Joe Biden's name, but who put him up to it?
Who told Hunter Biden? Is Hunter Biden smart enough to go, I'll go to China, I'll meet with top Chinese officials?
Chinese officials will not meet with Hunter Biden if the path to do that wasn't cleared by Joe Biden.
Not to mention the fact that Joe Biden is deploying his brother Frank Biden, his other brother James Biden.
All of these people are racketeers collecting money all over the world.
By the way, not just in China and the Ukraine, also in South America.
So there's a whole Same thing here with smoking gun information coming right off of Hunter Biden's laptop, but in addition corroborated by the Biden family's own business partner, Tony Bobulinski, this is where the Republicans could go.
That's impeachment cause number one.
Impeachment cause number two, the border.
Immigration law does not allow Biden to have an open border.
He's doing it. He's basically saying, I'm the president.
I'm the head of the executive branch.
I'm just going to do it.
This is a good reason to throw this guy out of office, or at least to make the attempt through impeachment.
What about weaponizing the FBI and the DOJ in the blatant manner that he's done?
And I'm not only talking about using their power to go after...
Republicans, but also to not use their power to go after bad guys on the Democratic side, essentially allowing much worse crimes to go unexamined, uninvestigated, with no arrests and so on.
This is another fertile ground for impeachment.
What about destroying the U.S. military and Biden's actions in Afghanistan?
What about weaponizing the government to go after people's basic civil liberties?
Think about it. Plagrantly against the Constitution.
So here we have a menu of crimes to pick from, a menu of high crimes and misdemeanor almost seems like too weak a word for it.
So my advice to Elise Stefanik and the Republicans is, listen, we've got five different causes to impeach Biden.
Maybe begin five impeachment proceedings.
Don't worry about the Saudi Arabian phone call.
That was obviously politically opportunistic.
But in my view, there are better reasons to go and impeach Jomentia.
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You got to use promo code DINESH. This story I saw in the New York Post.
I believe it first appeared in the Daily Mail, which is the London paper.
Daily Mail often breaks important stories.
But I didn't see it in much of the US media.
I don't know if it's because they didn't know about it.
They're just looking for things like, let's get Herschel Walker and Or, if they knew about it, they decided, let's not stress this one because it might upset the political apple cart.
Now, the article, More Lethal Strain of COVID Created in Boston University Lab.
Researchers at Boston University have developed a new COVID strain with an 80% kill rate.
And now let's think about this for a minute.
First of all, an 80% kill rate?
What? We're talking about 8 out of 10 that get the virus, die of it?
Think of what this would do to the world if this kind of a virus were released.
Now, I mean, think about how COVID got out.
It now seems likely scientists continue to investigate, to debate, and not with sufficient intensity, by the way.
Debbie and I often talk about this.
Debbie is like, what's happening with the investigation of where this virus really came from?
How did it get out?
What were the motives behind it?
Or was this just negligence?
Did it in fact come from a lab?
It looks likely that it did.
It came out of the Wuhan lab, not out of a wet market.
That theory, which was once treated as dogma, now at least has a competing theory.
But so here's the point.
What are we doing with this gain-of-function research where we're taking viruses, playing with them?
Apparently what the Boston University researchers did is they took the Omicron variant and they took the original virus.
The original Wuhan virus, if you will, and they mixed them together and they created, in a sense, a more lethal variant, which kills, now it turns out, kills 80%, not in humans, because they're not doing human trials, but in mice.
So, yes, it's not humans, it's mice, but let's think about it.
When you give the Omicron variant to mice, they have a very mild case of COVID, which means that the reaction in mice is mirroring the reaction in humans.
So similarly, it's quite possible that this new strain that's been created would have a high degree of lethality in humans.
Now, it's both more lethal and it's also very infectious.
So it is, in fact, a very deadly combination.
Now, Boston University, as soon as the story came out, a lot of people raised concerns about it.
In fact, one lawmaker, this is Senator Roger Marshall, Republican of Kansas, We're good to go.
Boston University has come out basically saying that they think that the article originally from the Daily Mail and then echoed elsewhere.
I'm actually looking at an article that reports on this in the New York Post.
Boston University says, well, this is being somewhat misreported.
This isn't exactly what we did.
It's not strictly speaking gain-of-function research.
But then Boston University goes on to say, quote...
Ultimately, this research will provide a public benefit by leading to better targeted therapeutic interventions to help fight against future pandemics.
So that is actually the rationale for gain-of-function research, which is to say, let's...
Play with these viruses.
Yeah, we're going to make them more deadly.
We're trying to sort of dissect them and figure out what makes a virus more deadly so we can create better ways to counter and perhaps to vaccinate against these viruses.
So the argument for gain-of-function research is that it is benignly motivated.
It's aimed at producing better medicine.
But of course, you have to weigh those benefits, such as they are, with the risks, which is that you, first of all, you haven't created the medicine yet, and you're creating these viruses first.
What if the virus gets out?
And what if it gets out?
Well, you say, well, we have really good protocols, Dinesh, to prevent that from happening in the United States.
Yeah, but there are these high-security biolabs all over the world, not just in the United States.
This, by the way, is a biolab that's called BSL-4, level four in terms of the degree of security.
And so if we're going to authorize these labs to do this kind of stuff, who's going to take the responsibility for the risks? What if the virus does get out? Think about it. The virus got out of China, and as far as I can see, there's been no accountability.
There's been no real attempt to hold China responsible.
The World Health Organization has completely dropped the ball if it's not, in fact, in bed with China on this.
In bed with China, I mean in terms of concealing Chinese responsibility and preventing full accountability.
The Biden administration is taking no steps to insist upon it.
So what we have here is very damaging consequences and no accountability.
And under those circumstances, it seems to me that this kind of research, if accurate, if this is actually what's going on, extremely problematic.
It needs, as I think this Roger Marshall says from Kansas, it does have the potential to create havoc.
The research should be paused while the risks and benefits are investigated.
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Or go to balanceofnature.com and use discount code AMERICA. John Durham appears to be...
The worst, dumbest, most ineffective prosecutor in the United States.
I say appears to be because this is a guy who doesn't seem to be able to win a case.
He brought Democratic cybersecurity lawyer Michael Sussman up before a jury and And the charges were very narrow.
He accused Sussman of lying, not conspiring against Trump, not being part of a larger web or circuit with the Hillary Clinton campaign.
It was a very narrow accusation against Sussman.
And the jury goes, nah, and they acquitted Sussman.
And you might think, well, okay, that sometimes happens.
Juries are juries. And so here comes John Durham, now accusing a former Brookings Institution fellow, this is Igor Danchenko, of several counts of lying to the FBI. Now, the lies are clearly documented, and there are several of them.
And clearly, what's going on here is that this was all part of the fake operation of cooking up the Steele dossier.
By the way, Danchenko was one of supposedly Christopher Steele's sources.
So, you have a kind of network here of lies.
The judge throws out one of the lying charges and keeps the others and those go before a jury and the jury goes, no, and acquits Danchenko.
Wow. Now, you've got to realize how strange and unusual this is in federal trials.
By and large, the rate of conviction in these federal trials is about 95% to 99%.
Almost everybody who is accused gets convicted.
Now, you can argue about why they get convicted.
Is it because they're bludgeoned into plea bargains?
Is it because people just believe the government?
Is it because it's the politically pro-government atmosphere in Washington, D.C.? But interestingly, here is Durham, and in the few charges that he's brought, I mean, let's remember, Durham has sort of one very minuscule success,
and that is he was able to get former FBI lawyer Kevin Kleinsmith to admit that he falsified a document while they were applying to the FISA court.
But again, it wasn't even Durham who found that out.
That was revealed by the Inspector General, Michael Horowitz, and Durham merely went ahead with that, and of course he got a kind of a plea from Clinesmith.
We got a favorable outcome on that case.
But here he is, and he loses the Sussman case.
He loses the Danchenko case.
And the question is, what's going on here?
Now, one possibility is that you've got a very left-wing environment in D.C. It's the D.C. jury.
And the D.C. jury only cares about lying on one side of the political aisle.
They don't care if their team, if you will, is lying.
And they're like, we're just going to let our guys off.
That's a possibility. But I want to raise a second possibility, which is much more troubling.
And that is that John Durham was brought in by Bill Barr.
Let's remember, Bill Barr is a bad guy.
And he brings in Durham.
Why? What if Bill Barr brings in Durham not to go after the bad guys, but to protect the system that produces these bad guys?
In other words, what if Bill Barr brings in Durham to protect the FBI and the DOJ and the deep state and tells Durham, go after some of the small fry.
You know, it's a little bit like they used to say about the mafia.
Keep the mafia bosses in place.
We'll hand you every now and then a small local guy.
You can kind of lock him up and then you can claim credit.
We're going after the mafia.
But of course, you're actually in league with the mafia and the top mafia bosses are chuckling and laughing about it.
So what if Durham goes before these juries and these juries see that, yeah, Sussman lied, but he lied to an FBI that put him up to it.
He lies to an FBI that knows he's lying.
And the same with Danchenko.
Yeah, Danchenko provides false information.
Why? Because the FBI wanted him to.
The FBI subsequently hires him and brings him onto its own payroll, even after they know that he lied.
So in other words, we're dealing not with a liar, but with a lying system.
And so, John Durham was kind of aware of this.
Apparently, in his closing statement, he says, well, you know, I'm not here to defend the FBI. I'm not here to talk about whether what the FBI did was right or wrong.
But see, that gets to the heart of the matter, because the FBI solicited this dossier.
The FBI worked hand-in-hand with Steele and with Sussman and with Danchenko.
I guess what I'm saying is it's really the FBI that should be Prosecuted here.
And the fact, maybe what the jury did is the jury is aware that this guy, Durham, is actually covering up for a corrupt establishment and looking for petty fall guys.
Yeah, let's give him Sussman.
Let's give him Danchenko.
The real bad guys, of course, come under federal cover and federal protection.
So, I wonder if that is the true meaning of the Danchenko verdict.
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Feel the difference. As you probably know, the CEO of the election software company, Conic.
This is a guy named Eugene Yu.
He is a Chinese-American, born in China, educated in China.
He's been arrested in Los Angeles by the District Attorney George Gascon, kind of ironic, progressive, left-wing DA, who somehow has some people on his team that are going after Election fraud.
And this is what we're talking about.
Make no mistake.
Interestingly, the left, very worried about all this.
And so a lot of the people who were going after 2,000 mules, I'm thinking of people like Tom Dreisbach at NPR or Philip Bump at the Washington Post, the so-called fact checker, Ali Swenson at Politico.
These people have been very nervously trying to figure out how to handle this Connick situation.
Why? Because who blew the whistle on Connick?
True the vote. Catherine Engelbrecht, Greg Phillips.
In fact, Greg Phillips went before the grand jury in Los Angeles and laid out Some of the facts about Connick.
Now, the LA District Attorney's Office has done its own investigation and they filed their complaint.
And that's what I want to talk about because what they say very clearly is that, well, two things.
First of all, not only is Eugene Yu accused of violating his contract with Los Angeles and committing the crime of allowing access to US election data, specifically poll worker data, but we don't know the full extent of it.
To China, to Chinese companies, to Chinese officials, and undoubtedly to the Chinese Communist Party, which, after all, oversees everything that happens in China and has full access to anything that is done on a Chinese server.
So this is a horrible data breach.
And in fact, it is described as, quote, probably the largest data breach in U.S. history.
We're giving the Chinese away into U.S. elections.
Wow! Now let's talk about what this means.
What it means is that Chinese contractors were given, quote, super administration access.
And we have to focus on this word, superadministration, to understand what it means.
So here is Sam Faddis, who's a retired CIA officer.
He's a national security author.
And he writes this.
He goes,"...any individual with superadministration access to a system can effectively do anything inside the system." He or she can delete data, steal data, alter data, change programming.
Perhaps most importantly, that individual can cover his or her tracks because they can potentially also access and alter security protocols and programs.
Which has all these deep ties to various Chinese entities, is able to get a hold of this data and then grant that kind of access to unknown, quote, contractors in China.
So you can see why we're dealing here with something different.
Very serious. True the Vote, by the way, had said in the wake of 2,000 Mules that we're doing another related project, very close to 2,000 Mules, but different from 2,000 Mules, and here it is.
Now, when True the Vote first held public discussions about this, Connick sued True the Vote, and a judge issued an injunction against True the Vote in a civil case.
But boom! Right while that was going on, we have this big arrest in Los Angeles, and the judge in the civil case has basically now backed off and put everything on hold because he knows the criminal proceedings are underway.
I think it's also interesting that as I read the...
As I read the complaint, it's called felony complaint for arrest warrant coming out of the district attorney's office, Los Angeles.
There's a second charge in here against Eugene Yu that I was not really aware of, and that is embezzlement of public funds.
So not only is this guy potentially, potentially a traitor in the sense that here is a guy in America purporting to be a Chinese American, but evidently dealing with, and by the way, it's kind of amusing, but in his civil complaint against Trudevore, he goes, this questioning of me is extremely racist because I'm an Asian American.
So, you know, this is like that scene in the Godfather where they basically go, the only reason you're going after the mafia is because we're Italian.
Well, not really.
It's because you, you know, bribe people and run rackets and kill people and so on.
And so similarly here, this has nothing to do with the fact that the guy just happens to be Chinese.
It has to do with the fact that he happens to be a Chinese guy who's doing a lot of business and granting access of sensitive poll data in the United States to the Chinese.
But apparently along the way, he seems to be putting funds into his own pocket.
How much? Well, it looks like we're talking about something like $2.5 million.
And $2,645,000 is the amount specified in this complaint.
So we now have a case that has two parts to it.
The first one, of course, having far more to do with the public interest, which is to say, granting the Chinese access and perhaps even control over U.S. elections.
And number two...
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Oh yeah, spending more money and adding to the burden.
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Guys, we've just had a remarkable election in Italy and a smashing win by Giorgio Maloney with implications for Italy and for Europe.
I'm delighted to welcome a friend of Debbie's and mine, Simona Mangiante.
She's an Italian attorney.
She's former legal advisor to the European Parliament.
She was a candidate in the 2022 Italian elections.
She's also an interviewer in the political documentary called The Everlasting Present, which is about the modern history of Ukraine.
She's an entrepreneur.
Her company is called Agape by Simona.
And by the way, the website, agapebysimona.com.
You can follow her at at Simona Mangiante on Twitter.
Simona, I noticed a notable omission from your bio.
No mention of your role in the movie Trump Card.
We were just delighted.
We were delighted to have you in that movie.
You did a great job.
Thanks for joining me on the podcast.
Simona, you gotta enlighten us here about what's going on in Italy, because many people think, and I guess I, me too, that Europe had become so secular, has sort of moved away from its Christian roots, not a whole lot of Europeans go to church, and that if there's a European conservatism, it's going to be mainly on economic issues.
But here comes Simona Mangia.
I'm sorry, here comes Georgia Maloney.
She runs on being a woman and a Catholic.
She runs on Christianity and nationalism.
I think a lot of people were a little surprised that that proved to be a winning formula in Italy.
So, what's going on here?
Absolutely, Dinesh. You'll summarize it perfectly.
First and foremost, thanks for having me, and a light introduction for the Trump card to you, the master of that.
So I thought that Giorgio Meloni has been an overwhelming victory.
People didn't see it coming.
They labeled Iran any possible degrading target.
They called her a fascist.
They called her A dictator, which actually is nothing further from reality.
Her victory is nothing more, nothing less than incarnation of Italian values deeply rooted in our DNA as Italians, because besides and beyond our political affiliation, we all We're born and breed God, family and country. This is what our culture is made of.
So to me, as an Italian, their victory was not surprising.
It was conceived as a threat by the rest of the world because, of course, the world is trying to confuse us about our identities, about our roots, about our religion.
It's easier to mold and control people.
We have seen it in America, first and foremost, with the Democrats' agenda, we're trying to promote everything to confuse people about who they are.
So, coming this woman, don't forget, this is the first time we have a female prime minister.
Now, of course, I'm not a feminist in the Conventional, liberal interpretation of feminism.
But still, imagine if it was a Democrat winning or a liberal becoming a Prime Minister.
It would have been an incredible pride in this community.
But here comes Giorgia Meloni, and the first thing they say is that she's Mussolini in a skirt, which was honestly a caricature, a paradox.
And it takes away from what our victory truly represents.
And it represents the win of those values that, as you mentioned, have been corroded by the secular tendency of Europe to take away all our roots from our history.
We don't need to forget our roots are Judeo-Christian, and they tried to, first and foremost, They create a society that doesn't look like us.
They try to import institutions like gay marriage in Italy, which even Giorgio Medoni is okay with.
We just are against adoption of kids.
We don't want to change our institution in order to actually implement one single principle, which is respect of diversity.
Respect of diversity doesn't imply changing our institution.
One single value we're promoting in Italy right now is respect for any sort of diversity, independently by your sexual orientation, because diversity can manifest in many ways.
So we should talk about racial diversity, sexual orientation, and many other things we need to teach our children, which doesn't imply going to school and tell them that they can be a man or a woman and they can decide their gender.
This is something we strongly object as a deformation of our society.
Giorgio Velloni was very crystal clear about that.
And her message was strong.
She wasn't afraid of being labeled as a fascist or a dictatorship, because all of us know our history.
And none of us, including our representative from the Democrat Party, ever dared to call Giorgio None fascist.
You know who does it?
American press or international press, that see in those values, in the wind of those values, a threat.
They see in those values a threat.
Let's take a short pause.
We'll be right back with Simona Mangiani to talk more about Giorgio Maloney and the implications of her victory in Italy.
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I'm back with our friend Simona Mangiante, Italian attorney, entrepreneur, also former legal advisor to the European Parliament.
We're talking about Giorgia Maloney.
Simona, you know, Italians are famous for being very family oriented and I can understand that Italians would see a threat to the family as being something that was, you know, alien to the Italian values.
But let's talk for a moment about Christianity.
It seems to me that what you're saying is that even though some Italians may not be so religious in, for example, going to Sunday Mass, nevertheless, they cherish their Catholic and Christian heritage.
And so, for example, if you had a kind of Italian antifa walking around the streets of Rome and knocking down statues, Italians would go crazy because that's their history, that's their culture, those are their values.
Absolutely correct.
Independently by our practicant, observant, you are as a religious person, you are respectful of your roots.
That's what we are made of.
As I said, this victory, which was truly overwhelming, represents the fact that our values haven't been corroded by this agenda.
I don't think Antifa would survive long in Italy.
That's a matter of fact.
And it's independently by your political affiliation or political ideology, because there are the roots that you need to preserve, and it's a value that is important.
And as I said, the victory of Giorgio Meloni represents that, and we've been threatened also by some leaders in the European Union, which saw in the victory of those values a threat to what they're trying to push, which is a secular Europe.
But our society, we are the seat of the Vatican, we know that, and we breed those values and we grew up, every in each Italian grew up with those values.
So for us, looking at the United States right now, which has also been a leading country in the world, the Biden America has weakened the image of the United States as a whole because we can't look up to a society which is afraid to define its roots and to protect its roots.
So we are pretty proud.
I'm really proud of the victory of Giorgio Meloni.
We are opening up a seat of our party here in America.
We already have a few. Just to keep talking about those talking points, those values that we need to defend, the society that we need to protect.
And Christianity is a huge part of Italian society.
Our welfare always says it's family.
It's not this distorted way to conceive the government controlling you by giving you monthly allowances.
This is a form of control.
Our structure of protection is first and foremost family, so we will never take family away from the Italian scene, the Italian way to conceive society.
It's the first pilaster Of our society.
And that's why Giorgia Meloni coming into the plaza of Italy and talking straight to Italians about those values, she literally won by landslide.
Simona, what about the issue of nationalism or patriotism?
Again, this is something that is, you know, Americans have traditionally been seen as patriotic, but you don't see Europeans by and large in European countries waving their country's flag and so on.
Now, Italy, of course, has a glorious heritage, of course, going back to ancient Rome.
And so, in some ways, the slogan, Make Italy Great Again, which, of course, mirrors Trump's Make America Great Again, makes a lot of sense.
If you were to say, Make Italy Great Again, I mean, it seems like that's what Giorgio Maloney did, and it seems like it struck a chord with the Italian electorate, right?
It's absolutely.
First and foremost, she's always important in the slogan.
From America, she's always been one of the biggest Trump supporters in Italy, forever.
Ever since her name was not even well known in Italy, I was already talking about Giorgia Meloni as one of the biggest Trump supporters.
She's been hosted by Baria Bartinomo multiple times, so she's been at CPAC. So even when she wasn't known as much, she was looking up at Trump America, at Trump as president.
And emulated this model, imported this model in our country.
Now, what's wrong about protecting your identity?
What's wrong in promoting patriotism?
What's wrong being proud of your roots and defending them?
This is another distorted agenda of the liberal world that would like us to lose our identities in a sort of globalism that doesn't represent who we are.
We can coexist respectfully, still being proud of our national values.
This all comes to being a patriot, love your country, protect your country, protect your identity in the world, because it is important in this globalist agenda to protect your identity and know who you are.
So that's really the sense of make Italy great again, like make America great again.
We would like to, first and foremost, retrieve this pride of being the descendant of the great Roman Empire in a certain way.
And build our foundation on Christianity, which makes us absolutely great and we should be proud of our values.
We shouldn't try to emulate secular, other secular countries in Europe.
They're trying to confuse us.
We will never be comfortable in a society which promotes gender fluidity, that teach children To dress a little boy, to dress like women.
We can confuse people.
We're creating a weak society in the future.
We should stand to our grounds.
And then, of course, our personal choices have to be respected far ahead.
But it doesn't mean that we need to change our institution, deny our religion, and cancel culture what's going on in America just to redefine and rewrite our history.
That's not the way it works.
We are our history.
We can progress from our history.
We can move forward from our history, but we should first and foremost be able to say who we are.
Simona, great job.
Very interesting. It seems to me that the left is dissolving identity at the global level, but they're emphasizing identity politics, as you know, with race and gender, sexual orientation.
It seems like what Giorgio Maloney is doing is coming up with a different definition of identity.
I'm an individual. I'm a woman.
I'm a Christian. I'm an Italian.
Thank you so much for coming on the podcast, Simona, and helping to clarify what these things really mean.
Thank you. Thank you so much Where'd that money go?
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Circe warns Odysseus that when you reach Trinachia, the island of the sun god Helios, Do not kill and eat the cattle of the sun god.
These are immortal cattle.
They're not meant to be eaten.
Odysseus recognizes this.
He agrees. But when his ship arrives at this island, initially Odysseus says, let's just go past it.
We don't even need to stop here.
But his men say, no, we've been tossed and turned on the sea.
We really need to stop.
In fact, they have just lost a bunch of their men.
Remember when they went in between Scylla and Charybdis?
They tried to stay closer to Charybdis, the kind of treacherous whirlpool, but the monster Scylla reaches out and basically gobbles up six of Odysseus' best men.
So they're traumatized, they're tired, and of course they're also hungry.
This becomes the problem because they...
They stop at the island of the sun god, this guy named Eurylochus, who's kind of Odysseus' second in command.
He persuades Odysseus, let's at least stop and rest.
Odysseus goes, do not touch those cattle, and the men agree.
But what happens is that the weather is so bad that they can't set back out at sea.
They've got to stay longer on this island, and basically hunger begins to overtake them.
They become famished.
And so while Odysseus is sleeping, what do they do?
They take the cattle of the sun god and they start chopping these cattle up, roasting the skin and the flesh.
And it's very difficult to do because these are immortal cattle.
So as they try to roast the flesh, the flesh is literally jumping off and moving.
Why? Because it's alive in a sense, kind of a very creepy scene by Homer.
And Odysseus wakes up in a beautiful detail.
Homer says he was woken up by the meaty smell of cooking.
And he looks and he's horrified to see what's happened.
And so these guys immediately get onto the ships and take off.
But here's the problem.
The problem is that they have angered the sun god and there are going to be consequences.
So what does the sun god do?
He goes to Mount Olympus.
He goes to the committee, if you will, of the gods.
He goes to Zeus.
And he says, Zeus, this is too much.
These people have tried to kill my immortal cattle.
They need to be severely punished.
You need to send a horrible thunderstorm, blast their ships into pieces, and basically throw them onto the open sea.
And Zeus agrees.
He says, yeah, this is a bit too much.
I'm going to have to do this.
I will, quote, I will immediately smite their ship with my thunderbolt and smash it up.
Now, right here we have a little bit of what would seem to be a narrative problem, which is to say, here is Odysseus.
Let's remember, he's narrating this to the Phaeacians, and he's describing how his men ate the cattle of the sun god.
Now, Odysseus is there, so he can obviously say this.
But how does Odysseus know what happens outside of his own experience?
How does he know, for example, that Helios, the sun god, went to Mount Olympus?
How does he know what Helios said to Zeus?
How does he know what Zeus said back to Helios?
It appears that Homer here has sort of lost track of his narrative, and it appears like he is now, even in the first-person narrative of Odysseus, relaying things in Odysseus' mouth that Odysseus couldn't possibly know.
And just when you begin to think this, you look at the text and you realize that Homer is ahead of you.
He's already thought of this.
And so, as soon as Odysseus narrates this, he says, I heard this from the beautiful Calypso who had been told by Hermes.
So, in the narrative, we're going to now follow Odysseus as he leaves Stranachia, the island of the sun god.
He's going to be battered by the sea.
He's going to be washed up on Calypso's island.
He's going to be there for seven years.
That's basically how the Odyssey begins.
So we know about that already.
We know Odysseus is going to spend seven years on Calypso's island before he actually gets home.
And guess what? Odysseus says that at that time, Calypso told me that this is what happened.
How did Calypso know? Because she was told by the messenger god Hermes.
So, in other words, what I'm saying is that Homer, at no point in the Odyssey, loses sight of the question, how could Odysseus possibly know that?
He solves that problem for us as readers by saying the reason Odysseus knew this is that he was told this by Calypso.
So this is Homer kind of, you may say, crossing his T's and dotting his I's, making his narrative completely coherent.
And sure enough, as Odysseus and his men are back at sea, The mast was broken backwards.
It struck the pilot in the stern.
It smashed his skull.
His bones were crushed.
All the men fell overboard and they were swept away.
So Zeus unleashes a terrible thunderstorm, lightning, bolts, ships turning over.
And this explains how Odysseus ends up alone washing up on Calypso's island.
Let's remember, Odysseus has had to give an account for how he lost all his men so that the narrative as it picks up is only Odysseus on Calypso's island, only Odysseus getting back to Ithaca.