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Dec. 2, 2025 16:47-17:01 - CSPAN
13:58
Washington Journal Larry Sabato

Larry Sabato, co-author of Campaign of Chaos, analyzes 2026 election trends, citing Trump’s 36–42% approval (Gallup/Nov) and Democrats’ 14-point generic ballot edge (Marist NPR/Nov). Virginia’s legislative shift—51 to 64 seats—and redistricting risks favor Republicans, with a potential 10-seat gain if the Supreme Court weakens minority protections. Sabato defends U.S. election integrity despite calls questioning turnout margins like North Carolina’s 100,000+ vote discrepancies, attributing down-ballot losses to voter "falloff." The episode underscores how early polling and legal battles could reshape 2026’s political landscape, with partisan narratives clashing over fairness and strategy. [Automatically generated summary]

Participants
Appearances
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larry sabato
01:46
p
pedro echevarria
cspan 02:25
Clips
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david rubenstein
00:04
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jodi picoult
00:09
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Speaker Time Text
unidentified
Controversial and moral issues.
Her books include The Storyteller, 19 Minutes, and Her Latest by Any Other Name.
She joins our host, renowned author and civic leader David Rubenstein.
david rubenstein
People come to you and say you've changed their views on certain social issues because of your books.
unidentified
That's why I write.
jodi picoult
You know, it's to start a discussion.
And you can't always have a discussion with people.
unidentified
Some people just aren't ready to hear it.
jodi picoult
But there are a lot of minds that you can change one mind at a time.
unidentified
Watch America's Book Club with Jody Pico this Sunday at 6 p.m. and 9 p.m. Eastern and Pacific.
Only on C-SPAN.
pedro echevarria
We welcome back to the program Larry Sabadeau of the University of Virginia.
He's their Center for Politics director, also the co-author of the book Campaign of Chaos, Trump, Biden, Harris, and the 2024 American Election.
Larry Sabado, thanks for giving us your time once again.
unidentified
Thank you for having me, as always.
pedro echevarria
Let's look at 2026.
What are important things to consider?
Even though it's still a ways away, what are things to consider right now when it comes to next year?
unidentified
You always want to look first and foremost at the presidential approval rate.
What is the job approval of the incumbent president?
And that is scoping in lots of things, such as the condition of the economy, whether people are happy or unhappy with living conditions domestically.
If there are any really major international operations that directly affect and involve American troops, these are things that have an impact on the vote.
And you look at the trends over time.
pedro echevarria
So Gallup, in its recent snapshot, this was the November 28th.
When it comes to approval rating specifically for the president, 36% approval, 60% disapproval.
Those are numbers are right now.
They could change, but looking at those numbers right now, what does that portend?
larry sabato
Well, if that was the job approval on Election Day 2026, next November, then Democrats would almost certainly take over the House, regardless of what happens with redistricting in all of these states.
And they'd actually have a shot at the Senate.
It would be difficult, but not impossible.
unidentified
So obviously, Republicans have to hope that isn't the number then.
And of course, let's remember now, Gallup is a very good pollster, been around a long time, gold standard, but that is just one poll.
And the average of the polls that are considered nonpartisan right now has Trump at 40, 41, 42%.
That isn't good either, but it's a lot better than 36%.
So a lot can change, and you also have to remember to use polling averages.
pedro echevarria
Another snapshot.
This was from Marist NPR, November 10th.
This is specifically talking about Democrats.
And in that poll, they said Democrats hold a 14-point advantage, that largest since 2017.
Have you seen those type of trends as well?
unidentified
I've seen Democrats doing better in what's called the generic ballot.
larry sabato
If the election were held today, would you vote for a Democrat or Republican in your district or for the House of Representatives or your state for the U.S. Senate?
unidentified
That's generic ballot without using names and bringing in personalities.
Yes, that has been trending toward the Democrats.
They started very low, actually, at the beginning of Trump's term.
Republicans, if anything, were a little bit ahead.
larry sabato
But it's been trending Democratic.
unidentified
I wouldn't say massively so.
On average, right now, it's about 4% in the Democratic direction.
That's good, but not great.
It certainly isn't enough to win the Senate.
It may be good enough to win the House, depending on how the balance of power turns out with all these state re-redistrictings.
pedro echevarria
How much of that do you think is a factor at this stage right now, the redistricting effort?
unidentified
Well, it's going to make a big difference if the election is close and competitive, all right?
Because we're talking about the advantage for one side of maybe an additional five to ten seats.
Part of this also is how the Supreme Court rules on Section 2 of the Voting Rights Act.
larry sabato
If they implode or explode Section 2, which tends to favor Democrats and incumbent Democrats who are minorities, then Republicans could gain another 10 seats out of that.
unidentified
So I'm not saying this couldn't add up to determine the results.
On the whole, though, Democrats have had a fight-back strategy that has minimized so far the Republican advantage in re-redistricting.
I would say Republicans have an advantage, but it's maybe three, four, five seats, whereas it could have been 10-plus seats so far.
pedro echevarria
Larry Sabado giving us his time, talked about politics.
You could ask him questions: 202748-8001 for Republicans.
Democrats, 202-748-8,000 for Democrats and independents, 202-748-8002.
For independents, you can text us at 202-748-8003.
Mr. Sabado, how much weight do you put in those governor's elections in Virginia and New Jersey?
Democratic wins for both.
Some saying not so much.
Some saying maybe it's a sign.
How much weight do you put in them?
unidentified
It's certainly better to win than lose.
And it's even better to win in landslides.
And those landslides were not predicted.
The good polling, the nonpartisan polling, showed the Democrats winning, showed certainly Spanberger in Virginia winning by a very wide margin.
Less so for the Democrat in New Jersey, clearly ahead, but not ahead by as much as Spanberger.
Well, they both won in landslides, unpredicted by the polls, and they had coattails that were substantial.
In Virginia, for example, Democrats went from a bare majority of 51 seats in the lower house of the state legislature to 64 seats in the lower house of the state legislature.
They haven't been there since the late 1980s, back when Democrats used to run the state legislature easily.
pedro echevarria
Today, a special election in Tennessee for Mark Green seats, we have a Republican running or a Democrat running.
A lot of people looking at this as possibly an indicator of things to come.
What do you take away from today's special election when it comes to how we look at the future?
unidentified
The most important thing to know is who wins.
larry sabato
But the second most important thing that often is revealing or more revealing than who wins is what's the margin and how has the margin for the winner changed since the last presidential election just a year ago?
unidentified
Now, Trump won easily throughout Tennessee.
It was an overwhelming victory for Trump.
And in that particular district, Tennessee 7, he won by 22 percentage points.
So we're all going to be looking at the results.
I tend to think, I wouldn't put a lot of money on it, but I think the Republican will keep that seat.
But we're looking to see, is it 22 points or is it 11 points or is it five points?
larry sabato
Is it a squeaker?
unidentified
That will tell you more about the environment today than anything else.
But let's always remember the election, the midterm election is a year away.
A million things can and will happen, and people have to be patient.
pedro echevarria
We have people patiently waiting.
Talk to you.
This is Rob in Virginia, in Richmond, Virginia.
Democrats lying.
You're on with Larry Sabado.
unidentified
Hello.
Good morning, Mr. Sabado.
I also have your, I want your opinion.
I think C-SPAN probably should have a guy called Nathan Taylor from, I don't know if you're familiar with Election Truth Alliance, but he has been doing statistical research and models from countries that manipulate elections.
And it shows like for all the swing states he's been doing statistically, it seems like North Carolina, for instance, he said like 100% of all the counties had a higher turnout for Trump than anything else.
Is there something that should be looked into?
Because it seems like it seems that like who's also doing something about telling you like voter like hand counts versus the regular computer manipulation, things like inconsistencies.
But if you look it up, if you're not familiar with him, it's Nathan Taylor from Election Truth Alliance, because, you know, states like North Carolina, like if you look, he was saying something about, like, if you look at the past elections, like 2016 and 2020, the difference between the governor and the final count, the governor and the presidential, it's like maybe 20 to 30,000 votes between 2016 to 2020.
And this last election was over 100 and some thousand difference less.
So I like your input from that.
pedro echevarria
Thank you, sir.
Mr. Sabata, to the topics of election security, election reliability.
unidentified
Look, I start from this premise, and I really do believe it.
And it's not simply a pro-American position, but we have the best election system in the world.
And I'm not forgetting about places like the UK.
We've worked harder at it for longer.
larry sabato
I have more confidence in the systems that we use, the machines we use, the methods of involving both parties or multiple parties, depending on the state or locality, in supervising the elections and counting the ballots and all the rest.
That's not to say that there is never any instance of fraud, but on the whole, we have a very solid system that people can and should have confidence in.
unidentified
Now, as to your question here, it's always worth examining.
And I welcome, I think most people in this field welcome people examining the statistics of the election, the way they're conducted.
There are always improvements that can be made.
And you look over the course of American history, we've had tremendous improvements.
There was once very substantial fraud in some areas of the United States.
You couldn't really trust the election results.
I don't think that's true anymore, at least in the vast majority of places.
larry sabato
So that's the point I want to make to you and everyone else.
unidentified
Have confidence in your election process.
If you see a problem, whether it's individual to a precinct or it's something you question about a statewide vote, make that known.
There are plenty of ways to do it.
There are more ways now than there ever have been because of social media.
If there's substance to your complaint, I believe that changes will be made.
Reforms will be made.
larry sabato
So we need to have confidence in our system overall, even as we question parts that we think can be improved.
unidentified
Now, as to the specifics of that gentleman's suggestion, I'll look up the person he was referring to.
One thing that he did mention that I recognize is that people voting for governor versus people voting for president.
You have something called ballot drop off, sometimes called ballot falloff, in which people come into the ballot place and maybe they only want to vote for president.
And you have a percent or two or three that just vote for president and they leave.
They don't vote for governor.
They don't vote for Congress.
They don't vote for Senate.
They don't vote for sheriff.
larry sabato
Probably sheriff's the most important thing you can vote for if you're interested in your own welfare.
And that is a consistent phenomenon.
unidentified
We've seen this for decades and decades and decades.
I don't encourage that.
I want people to vote for everything on the ballot.
On the other hand, if they haven't studied the races and the candidates, in some cases, maybe it's better if they don't participate.
But do your homework in advance of voting, and that way you can vote for every available office.
pedro echevarria
In California, Democrats line, we'll hear next from Andrea.
unidentified
Hello.
Hi.
I'm listening to all this, and it doesn't surprise me.
As soon as the Democrats have an advantage, we are put in a spotlight.
I live in California.
I live with a majority of them are Republicans.
We all had a fair shot.
We all did our due diligence.
We voted.
It lost dramatically.
Nobody remembers that, right?
But as soon as the Democrats are having an advantage, we sit back and we're now pointing fingers at everyone.
What they're doing is wrong with ICE.
And trust me, it's all coming out the way it should be.
The whole grand scheme of things happens the way it's supposed to.
Trump is not honest.
His whole cabinet does what they do.
They get away with it over and over and over again.
But you know what?
We are coming back stronger than ever.
The Democratic Party, we're united front.
We don't backlash with the insults and talk about people and say the Dems, the liberals.
Pointing fingers is what they do best, and they do it well, but we don't go down like that.
pedro echevarria
So, Andrea, Andrea, Andrea, if I may ask, since you're in California, how did you vote on Prop 50?
unidentified
I voted the way I was supposed to vote.
pedro echevarria
Which means what?
unidentified
I don't need to disclose what I voted.
pedro echevarria
Okay, that's Andrea in California.
Mr. Sabado will take her comments and you work through them.
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