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unidentified
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Coverage that's straight down the middle. | |
| Election night, Tuesday at 6 p.m. Eastern, only on C-SPAN. | ||
| Your democracy, unfiltered. | ||
| Watch America's Book Club, C-SPAN's bold new original series. | ||
| Today with our guest Pulitzer Prize winner, Stacey Schiff, author of biographies, including Ben Franklin, Samuel Adams, and Cleopatra. | ||
| She joins our host, renowned author and civic leader David Rubinstein. | ||
| So writing a second book on Franklin, you must admire him. | ||
| I assume you don't want to write two books on somebody you don't admire, but you do admire him. | ||
| I feel as if he is in all ways admirable in so many ways. | ||
| Just the essential DNA of America. | ||
| His voice is the voice of America, literally. | ||
|
unidentified
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Watch America's Book Club with Stacey Schiff today at 6 p.m. and 9 p.m. Eastern and Pacific, only on C-SPAN. | |
| Two guests joining us for a discussion not only on the shutdown, but the impact politically of that in studio. | ||
| Alex Gangitano, White House reporter for Politico, and then joining us from New York, a politics reporter for Semaphore, David Weigel. | ||
| And both of you, thanks for giving us your time. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| Dave, let me start with you. | ||
| What's shutdown being at day 30 plus? | ||
| What's the political impact so far? | ||
| It has not been part of the daily conversation, the shutdown itself in these races. | ||
| The way it has manifested is that, one, the administration has threatened to cut funding for programs like the Gateway Tunnel. | ||
| That's been an issue in New York and New Jersey, and use the shutdown as a reason for that. | ||
| Two, it's affected people's economic well-being. | ||
| It's affecting, as we speak, the 42 million SNAP beneficiaries. | ||
| Democrats are talking about that. | ||
| If you are a cynic and think that the Democrats could end this, but at the moment have the political upper hand, I think there's some basis for that because they are telling their voters that the way to end this shutdown is for Republicans to give Democrats what they want. | ||
| And they're expecting their voters not to blame them for actual economic pain in their lives. | ||
| That's what I've seen on the trail. | ||
| I've not seen voters turning on Democrats because they refuse to vote for the CR. | ||
| And Alex Gangitano here in D.C., with Dave being on the trail, the White House looking at this whole thing, the facade is they're not worried about it, but what's the reality? | ||
| Yeah, I think for the past three weeks, we've been hearing from the White House that the American public is going to blame Democrats for this, so we're not too worried about it. | ||
| And that's been their messaging even before the government officially shut down, during the shutdown, is that it's Democrats' fault that we don't have a clean CR passed. | ||
| And the American public's going to realize that. | ||
| There has been polling that's indicated that the American public is starting to shift more towards blaming Republicans, blaming the White House. | ||
| Then on Thursday night, the president changed things up. | ||
| We saw a bit of a messaging shift, and he called for Republicans to, quote, go nuclear, which means to eliminate the filibuster in order to reopen the government. | ||
| That's something that a lot of members, including Republican Majority Leader John Thune, quickly poured some cold water on. | ||
| And in talking to sources around the White House, it seems as if the president knows they're not going to eliminate the filibuster. | ||
| He knows how difficult that would be, but wanted to convey his frustrations with the situation. | ||
| I think when he was away on his seven-day Asia trip, he was hoping that Thune would figure this out and the government would reopen and they'd be able to, you know, arm wrangle some five Democratic senators. | ||
| They weren't able to. | ||
| And so the president was airing those frustrations on True Social there on Thursday night. | ||
| So I don't think much will come out of that, but I think it points to the fact that the White House thought this would be a lot shorter of a shutdown. | ||
| We're told they were looking at maybe a 10 days or so, and then they could get some moderate Democrats to change over to their side. | ||
| And now at day 33, they don't really know what other path to go here. | ||
| Does it suggest that there's going to be more of a direct involvement going forward, given the president even signaling that kind of idea of changing rules to get it done? | ||
| That's right. | ||
| This was the first time the president really got personally involved. | ||
| We also saw Vice President Vance on Thursday earlier that day meet with aviation leaders to talk about the impact on the travel industry. | ||
| So I think we are gearing towards a White House president in particular that is going to get more involved, especially as they look at polling, saying that Trump's the one that Americans are increasingly blaming here. | ||
| I think they want to then get more involved. | ||
| If that means inviting Democratic leadership to the White House, I think that would be a stretch before the government reopens, but we could see a move like that. | ||
| Dave Weigel, even to the president suggesting to change rules to get it done, and like Alex said, you know, that's a cold water poured on that. | ||
| What does it suggest is where they are politically as far as the ability to get something done to resolve this issue? | ||
| Not a lot has changed. | ||
| The White House has polling it prefers. | ||
| Democrats have polling they prefer. | ||
| We've seen in some very minor movement away from Democrats during the shutdown, but the only electoral tests happening in the country are happening in New Jersey and Virginia and New York, et cetera, on Tuesday. | ||
| I talked to DNC Chair Ken Martin this week. | ||
| He was confident, one, that they sweep these elections, and two, that even labor unions and labor leaders who want the shutdown to end were actually willing to give Democrats more time on this because the other, we're talking about the Senate rules. | ||
| The other thing that Democrats want as a condition of funding the government is some guarantee that the White House is not going to sign off on funding and then refuse to spend it or send a resistance package to the Senate as it did this summer that unwinds the funding. | ||
| That's a promise they want. | ||
| That's really broken down the entire process. | ||
| Forget about the other political externalities, the elections, but the fact that for the first time since the early 1980s, you've got a White House saying, even if we might approve Democratic spending we don't like and then cut it, that has really broken the faith that Democrats have and that's broken their sense that there is going to be political damage if they don't act. | ||
| This was not there in March. | ||
| In March, they thought if we shut the government down, it's going to enable Russ Vote and the rest of the administration to shut down agencies. | ||
| The administration doing that without congressional approval, doing that even for programs that were funded, that's really hardened the Democratic position. | ||
| And I can't imagine the White House agreeing to that condition. | ||
| If they did, that would move votes. | ||
| Again, our guest with us, if you want to ask some questions about matters of politics, whether it be shutdown politics, election politics, here's how you can do either 202-748-8,000 for Democrats, 202-748-8001 for Republicans, and independents, 202-748-8002. | ||
| If you want to send us a text, 202-748-8003. | ||
| Dave Weigel is in a sense there is now it's the idea of saving face, depending on who gives first when it comes to resolving this issue. | ||
| Some of that. | ||
| The Democratic base would be very disappointed. | ||
| And that's I'm speaking mostly about kind of white liberals and the people who've been rallying around Democrats this year at No Kings rallies, et cetera. | ||
| They'd be very disappointed if Democrats, at the end of the shutdown, get nothing for it. | ||
| And could Democrats save face in that situation? | ||
| I'm not sure. | ||
| You already see a mood in party primaries, in candidate recruitment, in fundraising, a mood of real disappointment with Democratic leadership, polling that says that Democratic voters don't think their party is fighting hard enough. | ||
| Now, that's frustrating if you're Chuck Schumer, you're Hakeem Jeffries, because you don't have many tools. | ||
| It's less frustrating for a governor like J.B. Fritzker, and you are able to resist the Trump administration. | ||
| But for Democrats in Washington, anything, any resolution to the shutdown that puts them where they were in August, that reopens Congress without anything that they wanted and doesn't close this door to recessions, yes, they would face a lot of anger from their base. | ||
| That definitely is spurring them to keep this going. | ||
| And you saw Republicans looking for a couple of off-ramps, maybe after No Kings rallies, maybe after elections next week. | ||
| This administration is not acting like one that cares about the optics of a shutdown, and Democrats are responding to that. | ||
| I think the images of the Halloween party at Mar-a-Lago probably embolden Democrats to keep this shutdown going for another two days and make their point. | ||
| I was in New Jersey last night with Barack Obama's speech for Mikey Sherrill. | ||
| Make the point that, hey, voters, which of these parties is the one looking out for you? | ||
| It's not them. | ||
| As long as they get those political visuals and those arguments out there, Democrats really don't mind keeping this going. | ||
| Follow up on the optics then from the White House's perspective on it. | ||
| Yeah, that's exactly right. | ||
| I mean, those visuals, I think, the White House is trying to lean away from, is trying to say, well, this was just the president spending time with his close friends at his Palm Beach resort. | ||
| And I don't think that they truly realize the impact that those have on everyday Americans who were worried about losing their SNAP benefits, who are worried about losing their Affordable Care Act subsidies. | ||
| I mean, these are all real life issues that affect both Democrats and Republicans. | ||
| And the way the White House is acting is largely like this is business as usual. | ||
| We're going ahead. | ||
| If the president wants to go to Mar-Lago on the weekends when it's chilly at his Virginia golf course, he's going to go. | ||
| And I don't think that they right now are really assessing the damage that those images, him sitting next to Secretary of State Mark Arubio at Mar-Lago Halloween, a room full of wealthy Americans, how that could impact what the American public is viewing this as. | ||
| Another thing I think that is worth mentioning is the White House is looking at this as the public will see how many issues there are with the Affordable Care Act, and they will want the president to come in and overhaul the health care system. | ||
| Why save an Obama-era law that the president has for years since his first term been eyeing trying to get rid of? | ||
| So I think that's what they're hoping the end result of this will be is say, look how bad this is. | ||
| Look how the Obamacare subsidies didn't work out for all of you. | ||
| We didn't come in and save it because we want to find a better way to do this. | ||
| Of course, that's a huge uphill battle. | ||
| Do Republicans in Congress have an appetite to deal with that? | ||
| Do they have the votes for something like that? | ||
| But I think that's part of their strategy too: if Obamacare fails, it fails. | ||
| And if people see that it's not working for them anymore, then they can be, you know, the hero that comes in. | ||
| It's a long road ahead for something like that. | ||
| But it's interesting when I talk to folks that that's part of their strategy. | ||
| Politico's Alex Gangitano with us, as well as semaphores David Weigel. | ||
| Let's hear from James. | ||
| James in Ohio, Democrats line. | ||
| Hello, you're first up. | ||
|
unidentified
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Okay. | |
| I got a couple of things going on, but one I'd like to ask: I would like to see C-SPAN have a show one day where we have so many people that have worked for the government, that work for the post office, and the facilities that the Republican Party wants to close down and they vote Republican. | ||
| I would like to have a program for Jeffson's people to call in and explain why they vote Republican. | ||
| Now, I think right now the shutdown is going like it should go. | ||
| I think the Democrats need to stand up and maintain their position. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| James in Ohio, thanks for the suggestion. | ||
| Dave Weigel, maintain that position, hold the line, so to speak. | ||
| Yes, that's what the Democrats are hearing every day from their base. | ||
| The only point I would add, the caller didn't bring it up, but Republicans are, while they're probably over optimistic about the shutdown ending and Democrats giving up, they are every week finding something else to talk about. | ||
| And when it comes to healthcare subsidies and SNAP, in both cases, they've tried to make this about immigration. | ||
| They've tried to say, SNAP most recently, you've seen Republicans who were like John Corner, who's facing primary challenges in Texas, say, well, Democrats want to keep SNAP going because they were finally going to get to see how many idle workers and how many non-citizens are benefiting from this. | ||
| They're trying to make lemonade in some way, if that's not too blasé a way of put it. | ||
| But Republicans are adjusting in the same way Democrats are, and they have a base and they have a conservative media infrastructure that is encouraging them to not just keep this going, but as it goes, try to explain your policy position in a way that gets voters on your side. | ||
| They've been doing that. | ||
| Putting Mexican sombreros on Democrats is a crude way of saying they were all doing this for illegal immigrants. | ||
| They've kept up versions of that all month. | ||
| Alex Gayatano and the caller mentioned workers in D.C., we saw one of the largest unions call for a clean CR. | ||
| We saw a lot of pushback against that. | ||
| I suppose that the Republicans take this as a stride as well as far as a strategy going forward. | ||
| Unions and that union in particular that represents federal workers, that was a very welcome thing for the White House because they, you know, unions are something that this Trump type of politics has been trying to appeal to, more working class voters within the Republican Party. | ||
| And once they saw that a union like the AFGA or GE was willing to side with them, quote unquote, in terms of saying we need a clean CR, they took that as a win. | ||
| We saw some unions that work around the travel industry calling for the same. | ||
| We saw Teamsters president Sean O'Brien, who was very active during the campaign, call for the same. | ||
| They took that as a win. | ||
| I think, though, what these unions were saying is we just need the government to reopen. | ||
| And if a clean CR is the way to do it, that is the easiest path forward. | ||
| That is the way to get this done immediately. | ||
| Whereas not so much of Republicans are right, Democrats are wrong. | ||
| But of course, that's been the White House has been so consistent in saying we just need a clean CR. | ||
| Even if you ask them questions of how do you feel about somebody losing their SNAP benefits potentially as a result of this, what can the White House do to come in and help air traffic controllers ahead of the Thanksgiving holiday? | ||
| Is there any discretionary funds that you can use like they did to pay the military troops? | ||
| And I think it's been very telling that their answer has been it's up to Democrats to reopen this government. | ||
| And they're not looking, unless a judge is going to step in, like we saw with the SNAP issue, they're not really looking for other ways that they can step in and make this more comfortable for people. | ||
| We saw a lot of Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy that week. | ||
| I suppose that's a sign there as far as their concerns are. | ||
| Yes, they are more focused. | ||
| I mean, when I was talking early October about the issue of Thanksgiving travel, that felt like a long ways away. | ||
| Republican sources didn't want to talk about it yet. | ||
| Then we saw Duffy really stepping up his media presence last week, talking with travel leaders. | ||
| I mean, I think they're looking at this. | ||
| If we don't have an off-ramp for the next three weeks, that really impacts, I mean, federal workers, non-federal workers, Americans just trying to go see their families. | ||
| So I think they're seeing that as now a real issue. | ||
| And it's evident by the fact that Duffy has been much more public. | ||
| Let's go to Marshall in Florida Republican line. | ||
| Good morning. | ||
| You're on with our guests. | ||
| Go ahead. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes, good morning. | |
| What I was wondering, everybody's blaming Trump for this, but I believe if you stop and think, I think it's the Congress that is holding everything up, not Trump. | ||
| And my question I like to ask is, why are the Republicans and the Democrats going home when we have troops out there? | ||
| We have people out there that's not getting paid, but yet they can go home, they get paid, and they get to eat. | ||
| But why can't they work over the weekend? | ||
| They should be made to work over the weekend until this thing is resolved. | ||
| This is ridiculous. | ||
| So that's my question is why aren't they working over the weekend instead of going home and enjoying theirselves while everybody else is out there trying to figure out where their next meal is going to come from? | ||
| Okay. | ||
| That is Marshall there in Florida. | ||
| Alex Gangatano, is there this idea that the White House could, and the president shielding himself any political impact from what we're seeing? | ||
| No, I think him traveling on a long trip, you know, he obviously wasn't going to cancel that. | ||
| It was a very important trip for him. | ||
| But, you know, he separated himself from Washington last week. | ||
| And I think in the hopes of getting Republic, telling Republican leadership, figure this out while I'm gone. | ||
| Again, I think they did not think that this would persist as long as it has. | ||
| And so that he wouldn't have to shield himself from this. | ||
| Congress would sort it out. | ||
| But I think Democrats do, in terms of the strategy that they're going with, they do have the upper hand in the optics of the House and Senate leaving for the weekend because they can say, we're not in charge right now. | ||
| It's, you know, Johnson and Thune telling their members, go ahead and go home. | ||
| We'll figure this out on Monday. | ||
| Even with yesterday's November 1 deadline looming so heavily on Americans on what does it mean for us as we enter into a new month? | ||
| The House went home and the Senate went home and they would resume business as usual on Monday. | ||
| So I think Democrats are using that. | ||
| We've seen all over social media them saying, look, I'm walking around the hallways. | ||
| I don't know if you've seen those videos. | ||
| There's been a member saying no one's here. | ||
| It's because Johnson's not making his members come in and try to work out a solution here. | ||
| So I think Democrats are hoping they have the upper hand on those optics. | ||
| Dave Weigel, how do you look at Speaker Johnson's role in this, keeping House members home while things are at a stalemate back here? | ||
| You know, Johnson's made a couple of decisions, stuck to them, and put the onus on Democrats to reopen the government every single time. | ||
| His public relations strategy is to have daily press conferences when the House is in pro forma session, get into the news, get their arguments out there, respond to questions, but not bring the House back. | ||
| And it's not very imaginative. | ||
| This is what Republicans did early in the year, vote through a CR in the House and refuse to come back, expecting Democrats to just be jammed in the Senate and vote on what they produce. | ||
| The Johnson idea here is you bring the House back, what could happen? | ||
| Maybe there's bipartisan support for some piecemeal funding measure. | ||
| The caller was talking about military payments, something like that. | ||
| That's usually popular. | ||
| That would pass. | ||
| He's not doing that. | ||
| He is sticking with the president's position on this, which is the hallmark of the Johnson speakership is he is a attendee of the president, doing what he thinks the White House wants, in touch with the White House. | ||
| He has a few members like Kevin Kiley in California who have criticized this, but not many. | ||
| In 30 odd days, they've not had any Republicans break rank and say, I'm getting hammered back home about this. | ||
| They are generally saying, yes, let's jam Democrats. | ||
| It's worked before. | ||
| It'll work again. | ||
| Dave Weigel, let me follow up with that. | ||
| We showed folks this morning, Representative Marjorie Taylor Greene expressing her concern. | ||
| Senator Fetterman out of Pennsylvania expressing his. | ||
| A lot of reaction towards that from the bases themselves. | ||
| What do you think about the impact of that? | ||
| Does it serve as a means of moving things along or is it just an irritant for those who are involved in the parties? | ||
| It's more of the latter. | ||
| And I think what was significant in the last week was you had half a dozen labor unions I mentioned earlier come out and urge Democrats to end the shutdown. | ||
| Ending it now would mean no concessions, no reforms, nothing what they asked for. | ||
| And the response from Democrats, including the DNC chair, who's the first union card holding leader of the DNC, was to say, no, we're going to hold out longer. | ||
| And so you've not seen Marjorie Taylor Greene move the party in her direction. | ||
| You've not seen Tom Matthews' criticism of the bill move anyone in his direction. | ||
| Most, we're talking, you know, 215, 16 House Republicans are just standing patent and doing what the Speaker and the president want. | ||
| So very little movement, the pressure from members going rogue on that has really not done anything. | ||
| Same with the Democrats. | ||
| Fetterman has established himself among Democrats as somebody who will vote with them when it matters, but will criticize their strategy, including on Fox News. | ||
| They don't love it. | ||
| Democrats in the Congress don't love it, but he is not pulling other people along with him. | ||
| Mia's next. | ||
| Mia in Maryland, Independent Line. | ||
| Hi there. | ||
| You're on with our guest. | ||
| Go ahead. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Hi, good morning. | |
| In reference to the elections and this shutdown of the government, you know, I heard a congressman speaking the other day, and he was saying that they're not getting any pay raises. | ||
| And, you know, so because people were calling them out because they're like, well, people are about to start starving because these food stamps have ended as of yesterday. | ||
| You guys are going home on the weekends, which we just heard another caller say, we've got to have the only government where you're allowed to go home, continue to get paid while your own citizens are suffering with inflation and having a loss of supplements that you somehow brainwash a great number of our citizens into believing that are entitlements that we don't, you know, that people don't deserve. | ||
| It is insane. | ||
| And why any government workers would be furloughed or not getting a paycheck while Congress continues to get paid, continues to go home to their home states is completely insane. | ||
| It is completely insane. | ||
| And if people don't wake up and start voting like they have since, forget voting your conscience, because we know that some people are easily manipulated. | ||
| If people don't start voting with common sense, looking at people's records, paying attention to what politicians say and how they vote, we are never going to be able to vote out these pariahs that are destroying our country. | ||
| I am so dumb. | ||
| Mia there and Marilyn, Dave Weigel, we'll start with you. | ||
| You had said short term, not much impact, but look to next year at midterms, even more impact, no impact. | ||
| What do you think? | ||
| Oh, on shutdowns, the recent history of shutdowns is that they are not very well remembered a year after the fact. | ||
| And you could write the ads that the Republicans are going to run next year right now. | ||
| They're going to say, they've been saying Democrats have voted against troop funding. | ||
| They voted to give health care to illegal immigrants. | ||
| The litany, the 32nd ad that's already running against Mikey Sherrill in New Jersey mentions some of what she has done by not voting to extend the government's funding. | ||
| But we did this in 2013, 2014. | ||
| There was a shutdown. | ||
| Democrats tried to make Republicans own it. | ||
| They had a very bad midterm. | ||
| Republicans won. | ||
| And that also, the history of this, every shutdown, there is both more capacity by Congress to say, what can we do to ameliorate this, pass some bills, make it worse, more by the White House to say, how can we move money around, make this a little bit less painful, and more of a memory by their political strategists that voters will not remember this. | ||
| If the shutdown was happening in September 2026, would it play out differently? | ||
| Probably. | ||
| But right now, I don't encounter many people on either side who think this is going to change how the parties are going to run next year and how it will be remembered. | ||
| It will require, if Democrats want to win, quote unquote, the shutdown in the long term, it will probably require a year of them attacking Republicans consistently and getting people to think, okay, Republicans are the party that cut snap benefits, and I'm against that. | ||
| And if the same flipped Republicans, if they wanted to win it, it would be a year of hammering Democrats and saying everything they do is giving money to illegal immigrants, which is their message already. | ||
| It's been their message under Trump for about nine years. | ||
| Dave Weigel is in New York City. | ||
| We'll pivot a little bit, Dave Weigel, because New York City, Virginia, and New Jersey are going to be closely watched come Tuesday. | ||
| Besides who wins, what's the importance of these races? | ||
| For Democrats, the New Jersey and Virginia races, both states that they won in the presidential election, they want to come out of those with chits and say, this is the beginning of the resistance to the Trump administration. | ||
| He has lost the consent of the govern. | ||
| Democracy suggested that he should change course. | ||
| They're already saying that. | ||
| If you listen to former President Obama's speeches over the last day in Virginia, New Jersey, that's part of their message. | ||
| That's the message of the surrogates who are going after these Democratic events. | ||
| The New York race is very different. | ||
| If you're watching television in New York, too, you see this really cannonblast of negative ads from anti-Zorhan Mamdani pacts. | ||
| It looks a lot more like a Republican versus Democrat election instead of a Democrat, former Democrat and Republican election. | ||
| And you saw Obama again, the center of him, talking to Zoron, letting it be known that he talked to Zorhan Mamdani and trying to own the idea, if Momdani wins, that Democrats have figured out they need to work on affordability. | ||
| So that is the thing they will say. | ||
| Democrats at this moment assume that they will win both of these states' governors' races and Momdani will win in New York to finesse the Mamdani situation. | ||
| They're going to say the country is still unaffordable. | ||
| Trump didn't fulfill his campaign promises and voters just said so. | ||
| Now, if they don't win some of these races, it's going to be a little bit more complicated. | ||
| And I think there will be some immediate blame on the left wing of the party. | ||
| That's already where they're starting to go. | ||
| Immediate blame and saying we should have had a much more coherent message. | ||
| And in New Jersey, for example, where Momdani has become a bit of an issue for Republicans, they'll say that I'm sure there'll be a conversation about the Democrats went too far left. | ||
| That's not where most of them think the election is going to go. | ||
| They think they're going to win. | ||
| Alex Gangatano, same question, but how's the White House watching these races? | ||
| Yeah, I think on Virginia and New Jersey, I think the White House was hopeful that they would be a little closer, that the Republicans there could have done a little bit better. | ||
| I don't think they thought that they would necessarily be able to win a state like a New Jersey race, but Virginia, maybe they were hopeful there. | ||
| Now I think we're hoping that the margins, they're hoping that the margins are a little more narrow. | ||
| And I think they'll look at those two races as we either need to step up our game. | ||
| The White House is really confident that the popularity of Trump, although it's a popularity among his base, but that that's all Republicans need in order to do well in the midterms. | ||
| And I think these two races will show them that's not all Republicans. | ||
| Riding the Trump coattails didn't work for his first midterm during his first term, and it might not work in this one either. | ||
| So I think that will be a bit of a wake-up call for them. | ||
| I think, though, the Mamdani race is a really important one for Republicans because they're very eager to paint the Democratic Party as the far left extremist. | ||
| However, they've been doing that over the last year. | ||
| They've been using the issue of Democrats want to give health care to illegal Americans as part of that narrative. | ||
| I think then him winning in New York City gives them that opening to say, this is what the future of the party is going to look like. | ||
| Forget about someone that is more politically aligned with a Mikey Sheryl. | ||
| Democrats are all moving towards that. | ||
| We've even seen them use some messaging around that Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez is actually the leader of the party, not Senator Schumer. | ||
| You know, some very or not, you know, Jeffries. | ||
| They're trying to paint that as, you know, the parties getting taken over by some folks who think the same way as the potential future mayor of New York City. | ||
| So I think it gives them some fodder there. | ||
| I'm not sure how that will play. | ||
| We are a year out from midterms, but I think they're almost excited to have him win and be able to use that against Democrats. | ||
| It's really interesting to watch. | ||
| We heard Dave Weigel talk about former President Obama on the trail, President Trump's in Florida. | ||
| What's the message there? | ||
| It's been very interesting, especially in Virginia, a state that was maybe the most possible for them to win that race. | ||
| He's really distanced himself from the Republican candidate there. | ||
| I think maybe he wasn't the candidate who they thought could be, you know, the person that Trump wants to rally behind, like a Youngkin was more friendly with him. | ||
| So that's been interesting that he's not using his star power at all to help any of these races. | ||
| We've seen the New York, the New Jersey candidate align himself with Trump really closely, but we still haven't seen the president want to help him. | ||
| So I think it's been telling also that maybe they aren't telling the president, go step in and help here because they're seeing these are two races that we could potentially lose. | ||
| And maybe let's distance ourselves a little bit. | ||
| This is Betty. | ||
| Betty is in Kentucky. | ||
| Democrats line. | ||
| You're on with our guests. | ||
| Hello. | ||
|
unidentified
|
I blame Trump completely, totally, 100% for all of it. | |
| He is taking over our country and people are sitting back and letting him. | ||
| I'm so proud of the Democrats that stand up for him. | ||
| I saw this in another country and then he took over his dictatorship and Trump is doing his best and doing very good. | ||
| Anybody knows he's tearing down the White House and he tells everybody everybody's dick to donate and they're not donating. | ||
| They're taking it off their income tax. | ||
| And we ended up paying for it again. | ||
| So, I mean, get wake up, America. | ||
| We're headed for dictatorship bad, and you ain't got enough sense to know it because these guys and Republicans don't have a backbone. | ||
| They're not going to butt him in any way. | ||
| They're going to do whatever he tells them to do because they're scared of him. | ||
| Money talks. | ||
| Okay, Betty in Kentucky. | ||
| Sidebar discussion. | ||
| How is the White House managing the ballroom story? | ||
| Yes, the ballroom story. | ||
| They are running with it. | ||
| They think, no, this is a great move. | ||
| We're not worried about the media presence or the media backlash. | ||
| We did see them more present, though, on social media. | ||
| A lot of the aides pushing out the narrative of, you know, we saw over history, a lot of other presidents have come in. | ||
| Truman built the balcony, have come in and made their touch on the White House. | ||
| This is just the same as that. | ||
| They also, as our caller brought up, are, you know, leaning into, they gave out a list of here's companies that have donated to the ballroom renovation and the president himself, we don't know how much money he's given, but really trying to make clear that this is not the American public paying for it. | ||
| So I think they still think this was all a very good idea. | ||
| They're not worried about the optics of it. | ||
| I do wonder how much of it was a Washington story that, I mean, it was very evident when we all would go to work at the White House and there was a ton of machines and dust and debris and everything. | ||
| Also, how it wasn't very clear that they were going to completely demolish it in order to build up. | ||
| And now it is completely demolished. | ||
| And before they start building. | ||
| So I think objects-wise, there was some concern how much we saw them on social media talking about the history of White House renovations. | ||
| But I do think they stand by that this was a great idea and that Trump is a builder at heart and that this he will go down in history as somebody who added this great thing to the ball rock. | ||
| Dave Weigel, how much of this is just an inside Washington story? | ||
| Do you think hard to say, although the first polling on this did find most of the country against it and for complicated reasons? | ||
| But it's a normal experience for people to have demolition going on near them and not like it, to not like change if it's not going to be promised to be better what they had. | ||
| The East Wing was not the most hallowed and beloved part of the White House, but the using the word optics again, the idea the administration is doing this, even with private funding, some of which it does not disclose during a shutdown, has emboldened Democrats and has not been that popular. | ||
| There are supporters of the president who like that he's doing this. | ||
| There are people watching this and saying this seems like a lot of work on a building that most Americans are never going to get to see on a design that the president himself approved of while more important things are happening. | ||
| And the other thing I would say is Democrats are looking at this and they do imagine themselves being back in power at some point, looking at a president that just kind of blows past the rules that Congress has set up to do this sort of renovation. | ||
| It usually is a complicated process. | ||
| There's funding passed in the House and the Senate. | ||
| There's a commission that works with both the Congress and the president. | ||
| Watching Trump blow past that, that is the umpteenth example of something they're thinking they might want to do if they get if they get the presidency again. | ||
| Not the renovation, but not going to all those stakeholders and slowing themselves down, just acting. | ||
| Semaphores, Dave Weigel in New York, Alex Cantitano of Politico joining us here. | ||
| Gerard is joining us from Ohio. | ||
| Republican line, you're on. | ||
| Go ahead. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Yes, I see this government shutdown is centered around the health care issue. | |
| My proposal is that everybody pay 10% for the health care. | ||
| If you're getting benefits, you get 10% less. | ||
| If you're paying into Social Security, you get 10% less. | ||
| If you have a pension net, you pay 10%. | ||
| Everybody pays 10% and covers the cost of healthcare. | ||
| And it's not a free item anymore. | ||
| It's everybody pays for it. | ||
| And I'm proud to be in Ohio. | ||
| And my senator, John Houston, is not taking his senatorial pay while the shutdown is going on. | ||
| Thank you. | ||
| Dave Weigel, as far as the idea of Republicans coming up with some type of health care solution, you talked about this earlier, and Democrats have consistently said, well, where's your plan? | ||
| Where are Republicans on this overall as far as changing aspects of health care? | ||
| Well, you can tell that they didn't want to run on it in 2024. | ||
| That says a lot. | ||
| Really, since the Republican Party failed to repeal the Affordable Care Act in 2017, it has moved off their agenda. | ||
| They are making changes to it, significant changes, and that's some of the tech of this fight right now. | ||
| For example, they're rolling back subsidies that were part of the kind of post-Supreme Court version of the Affordable Care Act. | ||
| They're trying to reduce the number of people who use Medicaid, expanded Medicaid in the states. | ||
| That is an attack on the Affordable Care Act, but those are both things that will move people off of health insurance onto not having health insurance. | ||
| And there really isn't a Republican plan. | ||
| I'm not trying to be unfair to Republicans because they do have pieces of legislation. | ||
| There are members who have plans. | ||
| There's not a popular Republican health care plan they like to run on. | ||
| They didn't run on it last cycle. | ||
| They didn't run out in the 2022 midterms. | ||
| They're tugging their collars a bit when they're asked about it right now because the Democratic plan for health care, in short, is raise taxes mostly on the rich to make health care cheaper and add people to Medicaid. | ||
| The Republican plan is a private sector idea that would be more expensive. | ||
| And you've already seen Republicans talking about bringing back high-risk pools. | ||
| Definite eight years ago flashback for all of us who covered the effort to repeal the ACA. | ||
| They moved away from the high-risk pools because they were not politically popular and they started to run on other issues. | ||
| So a Republican party that fights the midterms over a health care plan versus one that just goes back to the table and keeps pounding it about immigrants. | ||
| That party they're very comfortable running elections on. | ||
| The healthcare party, they have really lost their sea legs and have not tried to get them back in eight years. | ||
| We've heard Republicans say to Democrats, let's have the conversation about it. | ||
| But is there anything moving forward, Alex Gantital, about making something out of that conversation? | ||
| Right. | ||
| I think Republicans right now don't quite have the appetite for it because I don't think they have a plan. | ||
| I remember when Trump was running in this cycle, he said he had the ideas of a plan. | ||
| They would look, I think, to Trump and say, if you guys want to put something out, we will support you. | ||
| But there really isn't something right now. | ||
| And I do think there is a question because Obamacare has been such a focus of this president from his first presidency and trying to get rid of it. | ||
| How much of it is the fact that he doesn't like that Obama's name is on it and that's his signature policy of his predecessor versus I have this great idea of how to overhaul it. | ||
| So I think Republicans, until the White House comes out with here's our concrete agenda for how we're going to overhaul the health care system, they're not interested in moving forward with even talks because they want to look to Trump if he wants to do something himself. | ||
| Sure, they'll be supportive of it. | ||
| Harvey in California, Independent Line. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Hello. | |
| Hello. | ||
| Good morning. | ||
| I'd like to take a broader perspective. | ||
| First of all, what's happened in here is the wealthy oligarchs don't want to pay for the poor's health. | ||
| That's wrong. | ||
| They want to take away food and all this. | ||
| Okay. | ||
| The big picture is that we've fouled our nest, that climate change is real, and that 20% of 50 million deaths in the year come from air pollution and a million to 2 million in the United States. | ||
| This is Lancet magazine, 200 years out of London. | ||
| And the cost of that is $10 to $12 million social costs per. | ||
| That's equal to the whole GDP of the country. | ||
| We can live on our solar income. | ||
| And we got to Elon Musk's interview on Rogan 2054 about a year ago. | ||
| 30 to 35 minutes. | ||
| He said, 100 square miles, we can do everything in the United States with solar. | ||
| And Rogan said, was surprising. | ||
| Is that swords? | ||
| Yeah, with storage. | ||
| That's 25% of humanity's load. | ||
| Enough is enough. | ||
| And this is a continuing coup. | ||
| We should have stopped it five years ago. | ||
| And I'm outraged. | ||
| And I got severe health problems. | ||
| I'm a disabled union pipeliner from up in Alaska, it's both asbestos and all kinds of other crap. | ||
| And I've been on Medi-Medi and all this, and they're taking it off and losing EBT. | ||
| This is outrageous. | ||
| Okay, Harvey there. | ||
| Outrage of Harvey, but I suppose outrage on a lot of fronts that not only the White House is hearing, but in the politics world as well. | ||
| Yeah, I think there are a lot of conversations over how long can we keep the American public appeased with the fact that this is all happening. | ||
| You know, eventually something's got to give here. | ||
| Someone's going to have to blink. | ||
| And we thought the pressures of losing the affordable care op subsidies, the pressures of potentially losing SNAP benefits would cause somebody to sit down and say, negotiations need to happen. | ||
| We need to reopen this government. | ||
| It didn't happen. | ||
| November 1st has come and gone, and we are still in the government shutdown. | ||
| And both parties are still waiting to see who blinks first. | ||
| I will say it did sound like there was progress on Capitol Hill last week. | ||
| Foon even pointed to the potential of progress with some moderate senator Democrats trying, you know, wanting to maybe reopen the government, especially with the promise of talks moving forward if they were to about health care. | ||
| But then the president came out with the idea of eliminating the filibuster. | ||
| I don't know how much that changed some moderate Democrats' ability or desire to want to help and reopen the government. | ||
| Dave Weigel, anything to add? | ||
| No, I think we've explained how ridiculous the situation is over the course of this conversation. | ||
| I'm looking this week to see after elections how the conversation changes. | ||
| But again, both parties have different sets of data, different ideas of how this politically plays out. | ||
| I would look for more groups and more people who say they are personally being hurt. | ||
| They need this to end, which does, I'd say, help Republicans in calling for a quick end without any concessions more than it helps Democrats. | ||
| One more matter of politics than electoral politics for both of you. | ||
| Dave Weigel, we talked about the governor's races. | ||
| We talked about the mayor's. | ||
| Proposition 50 in California deals with the state, but what do you think about the larger impact depending on the outcome? | ||
| The impact is already being felt because Gavin Newsom, the governor, took a very big risk. | ||
| When Texas began to move on Donald Trump's suggestion to draw five new seats for Republicans, eliminate five Democratic seats, he acted the only way California could do that was this ballot measure. | ||
| The first polling on the ballot measure was not how they were going to word it and not very popular. | ||
| Every poll in the last month has shown them winning it. | ||
| And also, we were speaking to the president before. | ||
| He's not been involved in the New Jersey and Virginia races to a large extent. | ||
| He was not involved at all in California. | ||
| And money that Republicans thought would show up did not show up. | ||
| There was half a minute talking about Kevin McCarthy, the former speaker, whether he would put money in. | ||
| It didn't happen. | ||
| So it's already affected the Democrats. | ||
| This will be seen as an example of, I was talking about fighting earlier, a Democrat fighting Trump in an effective way. | ||
| And you've seen some impacts around the country in Virginia, again, before the election, without much worry that it was going to backfire, Virginia Democrats started to move a constitutional amendment that they could vote on next year that would allow them to draw out Republican districts. | ||
| The impact of this is Democrats saying we are on the mat. | ||
| We're not sure how to resist the president in D.C., but we can resist him in states. | ||
| Now, if there is an unfavorable ruling for the Voting Rights Act next year in Louisiana versus Cal A case, and Republicans go back and draw new districts, the whole map is in disarray. | ||
| But at the moment, the impact is that Democrats look at what was seemingly hopeless for them: Republicans going and drawing new seats in red states and say, here is some way we can fight back. | ||
| All it requires is just giving up a decade or so of being the party that supports independent commissions, taking politicians out of the process. | ||
| They are now looking at a much more unforgiving political situation and becoming a little unforgiving themselves. | ||
| The White House's interest in not only what's happening in California, but the larger issue. | ||
| Yeah, it's been really interesting to see, as Dave mentioned, the president has not been involved in California. | ||
| We know he has a personal foe in Gavin Newsom, and it is interesting that he doesn't want to take on Newsome just because it's Newsome. | ||
| I've been talking to folks around the White House. | ||
| It's been for two reasons. | ||
| One, the president's not getting involved in trying to take down Prop 50 and has kind of accepted that it's going to happen because Republicans still think they have the upper hand in terms of the redistricting fight. | ||
| That sure, Democrats can pick up five seats there because we got Texas, maybe North Carolina, wherever else. | ||
| And second, because the president thinks he has the upper hand on Newsom on other issues like crime and immigration. | ||
| So he doesn't need to take on this redistricting fight. | ||
| But it is just an interesting one because of this personal issue they've had. |