CSPAN - Washington Journal 11/01/2025

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Nov. 1, 2025 07:00-10:01 - CSPAN

03:00:56

Washington Journal 11/01/2025

Participants

Main

brian blase

27:19

gina plata-nino

25:40

mimi geerges

cspan 34:01

Appearances

brian lamb

cspan 01:12

brooke leslie rollins

01:25

hakeem jeffries

rep/d 01:26

jb pritzker

d 00:45

kristi noem

admin 00:47

mark warner

sen/d 01:01

rand paul

sen/r 01:21

Clips

boyce upholt

00:21

brooke rollins

admin 00:02

dasha burns

politico 00:13

donald j trump

admin 00:04

jim marrs

00:09

louie gohmert

rep/r 00:02

stacy schiff

00:20

ted fraley

00:26

willie nelson

00:23

Callers

chris in arizona

callers 00:02

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		LAP and online at c-span.org.
		Coming up this morning on Washington Journal, along with your calls and comments live, we'll discuss government food benefit programs, including SNAP and WIC, with Food Research and Action Center interim SNAP Director Gina Platonino.
		Also, Paragon Health Institute President Brian Blaze talks about health care and the expiring Affordable Care Act subsidies.
		Washington Journal is next.
		Join the conversation.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Saturday, November 1st, day 32 of the government shutdown.
		Today also marks the first day SNAP benefits are suspended.
		However, yesterday afternoon, two federal judges ordered the Trump administration to pay out the food aid using emergency funds and potentially other sources.
		Also, today, open enrollment starts nationally for those seeking health insurance under the Affordable Care Act.
		Earlier this week, President Trump returned from a trip to Asia where he met with Xi's president, China's president, Xi.
		He also announced that the U.S. would resume nuclear weapons testing and has urged the Senate to end the filibuster in order to reopen the government without Democratic votes.
		Those are just some of the stories from this week, but this morning, we're asking for your top news story.
		Here's how to reach us: Democrats, 202-748-8000.
		Republicans, 202-748-8001, and Independents, 202-748-8002.
		You can send a text to 202-748-8003.
		Include your first name in your city-state.
		And we're on social media, facebook.com/slash C-SPAN and X at C-SPANWJ.
		Welcome to today's Washington Journal.
		Let's start with the Washington Post headline about those court rulings.
		Says the Trump administration must release billions in SNAP funds.
		Judge says officials must act, quote, as soon as possible to avoid prolonged interruption.
		A federal judge in Rhode Island said a Massachusetts judge also told the administration to consider contingency funds.
		Now, President Trump did respond to that on Truth Social yesterday evening, and he said this in part: Our government lawyers do not think we have the legal authority to pay SNAP with certain monies we have available.
		And now, two courts have issued conflicting opinions on what we can and cannot do.
		I do not want Americans to go hungry just because the Radical Democrats refuse to do the right thing and reopen the government.
		Therefore, I have instructed our lawyers to ask the court to clarify how we can legally fund SNAP as soon as possible.
		He continues, but let's take a look at what Department of Agriculture Secretary Brooke Rollins said yesterday.
		So, this would be before the ruling about those contingency funds.
brooke leslie rollins ▲ ● ▼		The fact that the Democrats are saying, but wait, USDA has money in their accounts.
		Why it is really their fault?
		I've seen it over and over and over from some of their leaders, is absolute false and it is a lie.
		We have been saying on October 10th, we sent messages out.
		On October 24th, we sent messages out.
		These benefits end on November 1st.
		Now, let me get down into a little bit of the details on that to better explain.
		So, there is a contingency fund at USDA, but that contingency fund, by the way, doesn't even cover, I think, half of the $9.2 billion that would be required for November SNAP.
		But it is only allowed to flow if the underlying program is funded.
brooke rollins ▲ ● ▼		It's called a contingency fund.
brooke leslie rollins ▲ ● ▼		And by law, contingency funds can only flow when the underlying fund is flowing.
		So for example, if the underflow, if today the Democrats say, oh, never mind, sorry, we'll open the government, and SNAP flows, Hurricane Melissa or one of the hurricanes hits, that's the contingency fund that we would use to send more money into the vulnerable communities that are harmed by a specific event like a hurricane.
		But it is a contingency fund that can only flow if the underlying appropriation is approved.
		And listen, even if it could flow, it doesn't even cover half of the month of November.
		So here we are again in two weeks having the exact same conversation.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That was Secretary of Agriculture, Brooke Rollins.
		The Ag Department is the one that administers the SNAP program.
		And we'll go to phones now.
		Ralph in Manoa, New York, Democrat.
		Good morning, Ralph.
		What's your top news story of the week?
unidentified		Yeah.
		Well, this week, one of the discussions is eliminating Senate Rule 22, the filibuster, and that would really be a bad idea because if that happens, the Republican lawmakers in the House and Senate would pass a national right to work law that would decimate 80 million American workers that are covered under the National Labor Relations Act.
		Now, although under the other major labor law, the Railway Labor Law, Railway Labor Act, where the Teamsters are covered under, there's no right to work division provision in it.
		Also, the Republican lawmakers would start to privatize Social Security.
		That would give them the votes.
		That's what they really want to do, turn Social Security, part of it, over their private sector and decimate Medicare.
		So to eliminate Senate Rule 22 would be a very bad idea, and I thank you for your time.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Ralph, and this is Joe in Bitterford, Maine, Independent.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Joe.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		I'm just jealous.
		Ralph beat me on the line here this morning.
		I thought I'd be first.
		I'm kidding.
		But thank you for taking my call.
		My point I'd like to make is it's pretty obvious now that the Republicans have nothing but lies if we discuss the shutdown.
		What the original go back to January in the big beautiful bill.
		The Republicans promised you they weren't going to touch Medicaid, I guess, except for the $800 million that they took right out of it.
		They lied to you, told you that they wouldn't.
		It's obviously now that Medicaid is going to be cut.
		No question about it.
		Republicans told you that Elon Musk and Doge was going to save you, I think it was $2 trillion jumping up and down with their chainsaw.
		Wasn't that fabulous?
		Turns out now, I'm absolutely positive, but I don't know the amount it's going to cost the American taxpayers are going to have to pay.
		All that money they said they're going to save never occurred.
		They never saved the money from Medicare.
		They never showed the fraud that they promised you they had.
		They never showed you Mike Johnson telling you there's some fat guy sitting on a couch getting everything, Medicaid, everything from, you know, handouts to holy what.
		And Elon Musk just signed a contract yesterday with SpaceX that it gives him $2 billion.
		So, you know, let's cut the clumpets here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Joe, I just wanted to correct something.
		You said $800 million cut from Medicaid for the One Big Beautiful bill is actually $900 billion with a B, and that's over 10 years.
		So, just a quick correction there.
		Robert, Indiana, Republican line, good morning, Robert.
		What's your top news story of the week?
unidentified		Our top news story is how much more forward can President Trump be?
		He takes his time to come out here and talk to the people.
		He holds nothing back.
		How many times did you see Biden?
		Very seven of them.
		And they say they're lying, they're lying.
jim marrs ▲ ● ▼		If they don't get this holding back up, yes, there's going to be a lot of people that's going to be hungry.
unidentified		And it's time that the Republicans stand their ground, get these crooked Democrats out of office.
		Schrember should be fired right now for insulting two Supreme Court judges.
		He threatened them.
		And he should be penalized for that.
louie gohmert ▲ ● ▼		It's time this country got back together.
unidentified		I'm 89 years old.
		I've worked all my life.
		And to hear these Democrats and independents put this country down, they need to be run out of this country.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Robert.
		Let's talk to Darrell in Columbus, Georgia, Democrat.
		Hi, Darrell.
unidentified		Hey, Mimi, how are you doing?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good.
unidentified		Good, good.
		I just want to say that my big news story for the week is those poor people that's on those food stamps about to get them cut.
		You got 42 million people that rely on that program, and they want to cut it out.
		And here's the big thing is, Mimi, those issues right there, they are in Project 2025.
		It's all in there.
		If people just take the time to read it, they want to cut the food stamps.
		I mean, it's all right there.
		And I mean, now he's saying that the judges told him to go ahead and reinstate it and go ahead and do it.
		Now he's going to come out yesterday and come out.
		He needs to check with lawyers.
		Well, he doesn't need to check with lawyers or everything else.
		He's doing illegal.
		So, I mean, go ahead and give these folks what they need and get this country back going.
		And he just, he just, he's just terrible.
		And that's all I got, Mimi.
		And one other thing.
		Yep.
		Tell Frank, Matt, Jim, John from Prairie or Perry, Texas, to stop calling in every other day.
		That's all I want.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Daryl.
		And regarding SNAP, we will have a program.
		We will have a segment right after this one.
		So at 8 o'clock, we'll have a segment dedicated just to SNAP.
		And we'll put on the screen a couple of points for you just for your information.
		There are, according to the USDA, 42.5 million people participating in SNAP.
		That covers 22.7 million households.
		And the average monthly benefit per person, 190.81 cents.
		And then average monthly per household is 356 and 68 cents.
		Here's Paul in Nampa, Idaho, Republican.
		Good morning, Paul.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I think my pick was actually the meeting between President G of China and President Trump of the United States of America.
		It was hopeful.
		There were some positive things that came out of it.
		Now, whether or not the Chinese hold on to their end of the bargain that they've discussed, veteran aims to be seen.
		But there was some talk at the very closing of it that had to do with denuclearization, which means the drawdown of nuclear weapons.
		And Just even having that mentioned in the meeting, I thought was very, very helpful.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, what did you think of President Trump announcing a restart to nuclear testing?
unidentified		Well, I think they have to test the ones that they've gotten that have been around for 45 years.
		Otherwise, they don't know if they're going to work or not.
		They're not going to work, then you got to can them.
		Just you're going to have to.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		You're going to have to.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here is CBS News with the headline.
		Here's what Trump says he and she agreed to in their meeting, and it's got a couple of headlines.
		So, tariff rates on imports from China.
		They talked about rare earth minerals, China to resume buying U.S. soybeans, and no paper deal on TikTok.
		So, those are the things that President Trump and on chips said that they did discuss semiconductor chips.
		That's on CBS if you'd like to see that.
		Here is what minority leader in the House, Hakeem Jeffries, said on Thursday about that meeting.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		It appears to most reasonable observers that Donald Trump was punked on the world stage by the Chinese Communist Party.
		The notion that Donald Trump has created all of this trouble for the American people, which he has, the Trump tariffs, are raising costs on everyday Americans by thousands of dollars per year.
		And earlier today, I also met with some small business owners and entrepreneurs who made clear to me in very real terms that the Trump tariffs are going to force many of them to shutter their businesses and abandon their dreams.
		Donald Trump created this massive inferno that's spreading all across the country and now wants to pretend as if he's a firefighter by putting out the damage that he has created and returning to.
		What a status quo, when you've already increased the expensiveness of life on so many working-class Americans and are forcing in real time farmers and small business owners and entrepreneurs to close their businesses.
		It was all a show, as far as we can tell.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That was from Thursday, and we're asking for your top news story of the week.
		We'll talk to Frank in New York Independent Line.
		Hi, Frank.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I'm thrilled and delighted that I got through.
		My question is: this: I'm a vet, and I was hospitalized last month for some surgery, and I didn't utilize all of my benefits, SNAP benefits, that is.
		What I'd like to know is if you can possibly get an answer to the following question: Is the money that is presently on my card from last month and any other month that remained?
		Even though there's a stop in new payments, is that money still available?
		Or is everything gone like Trump's mind?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, here's what I have on that: just a quick search that it says, yes, unused SNAP benefits roll over to the next month, but they do expire eventually if the account becomes inactive.
		So, it does look like you can, but you should probably check that.
		This is Forbes saying that SNAP benefits don't expire at first.
		Unused SNAP benefits from the month automatically roll over to the next month.
		So that's on Forbes, Frank.
		So you should be okay.
unidentified		The question, if you have enough patience, is this.
unidentified		How do you manage to keep a straight face with some of the callers?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I've been doing it a long time.
		That's how, Frank.
		Here's Otis, Orange Park, Florida, Democrat.
		Good morning, Otis.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		There are so many stories that could be number one, but the number one and number two story in mind for me is that the cancellation snap benefits and the tariffs.
		I think they go hand in hand.
		The snap benefits is for the poorest peoples in America who can't use it.
		So you must have some type of plan to help the poor when you actually say that you want a Nobel Peace Prize.
		And when your Nobel Peace Prize is geared for helping people, how can you say you want one?
		And then the second one is the tariffs.
		And he got so many deals that's going on that we got a deal here and a deal there.
		But what you've never seen is the verification of the deals.
		Show me the paperwork.
		Let's see details.
		He can never tell us about what's let us see what's in the details.
		Always say it's there.
		So the American people, stop.
		Stop.
		You always give this guy a reason.
		I got a saying when I was in the Army, the maximum effective range of an excuse is always zero.
		And you notice Donald Trump and the Republican Party always have an excuse of why something can't happen.
		Blaming everybody except themselves.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Otis, did you follow the Senate vote on rescinding those emergency tariffs?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Did you hear about that?
unidentified		Yes, I did.
		It was, I think, 5347.
		I think four Democrats pulled 5140 or something.
		Four Republicans came over and agreed with the Democrats just to get rid of the tariffs because they see it's not working.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So let's go ahead and watch that portion of that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So Senator Rand Paul, he's a Republican of Kentucky, was explaining why he co-sponsored that bill to rescind some of those tariffs.
rand paul ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'd say there's two categories of arguments here.
		One is the economic effect of tariffs, whether they're good or bad.
		And I think that's a big deal because it used to be known and the knowledge has somehow been lost, but it used to be known that trade was proportional to prosperity, that trade was a good thing, not a bad thing.
		It was pretty well generally known and that knowledge is being lost.
		The second argument, though, is whether or not one individual should be able to do this to emergencies.
		And when I heard there were emergencies, I thought, oh, you mean war or a tornado or a famine?
		I didn't realize that trade policy with over 120 some odd countries is an emergency.
		So it's a misuse of emergencies.
		And then built into that is yet another debate, and that's over whether or not we should allow emergencies to occur that can only be stopped by a supermajority.
		So we won yesterday, we won today, but if we were to win in the House, he would veto it, and then it would take a super majority.
		It would take two-thirds to stop an emergency.
		So I actually have a bill that reforms the emergencies and says if a president declares an emergency, it would actually take an affirmative vote by us to continue beyond 30 days.
		Then we would reverse this, and a presidential veto wouldn't have to be overcome.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Senator Rand Paul from Wednesday and any of those events, if you'd like to see them in their entirety, just visit our website, cspan.org.
		Do a search in the search bar, and that should come up.
		Bob is in New York in a Republican.
		Bob, how do you pronounce your city there in New York?
unidentified		Kachog.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Kachog.
unidentified		Kachog, after the Indians.
unidentified		We have many Indian names on Long Island.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Go ahead.
		You're on the argument.
unidentified		So a guy from New York called a while ago about the filibuster.
		Little education on the filibuster.
		It started in 1917.
		Before that, one senator could have stopped anything.
		Okay, so basically what goes around comes around.
		One time, one senator could have stopped anything.
		They put the filibuster in.
		At that time, it was, I think it was two-thirds of the Senate had to agree.
		And basically, that was because of World War I.
		A bunch of guys Wilson didn't like it.
		They didn't want to go to war.
		So they put this filibuster in to be able to pass legislation.
		1975, I think they changed it to three-fifths of the Senate.
		And now it's being used kind of like the guys that didn't want something done, okay, instead of just signing a, I mean, it makes sense to me if you should just simply stop the clock.
		If you don't finish your job on time, you get penalized, okay?
		So quite honestly, they didn't finish the job of the budget process by October 1st.
		They should have stopped the clock at 12.59 on September 30th and run with what's on the budget.
		You shouldn't have to have a vote to say you can do that.
		That's just unreasonable when you think about it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Bob, going back to the filibuster, what do you think?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Do you think it should be done away with or do you think it should stay or should it be reformed in some way?
unidentified		I have no problem with it being done away, but the problem is how you stop closure, okay, is the problem.
		How you stop a vote from happening.
		And you have to have compromise in the Senate.
		And that's the problem in the country right now throughout the Senate, the House, everywhere you go.
		There's no vision towards a compromise.
		It's my way or the highway.
		And, you know, it's just what's driving the country.
		Abraham Lincoln said it best, a House divided cannot stand.
		And if we don't get our act together and start talking to one another in civil ways, okay, we are not going to be, and if we don't start following our own laws, we're not going to go forward.
		And, you know, my dad and my uncles, I mean, they saved the world years ago.
		And we're on the precipice of having our nation collapse because of a centralized thought process in our representatives.
		Instead of individual rugged Americanism, John Fetterman is obstinately a refreshing person in the Senate right now, plus the other two, I can't remember their names.
		I think one's from Nevada, one's from Maine.
		But they are refreshing because they're standing up for what they believe.
		And that's what our senators are supposed to do.
		Stand up for the country.
		They believe country first at this point.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Bob, got it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Ben in Granada, Mississippi, Independent Line.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'd like to get something clarified about the SNAP.
		Most of the, well, a high percentage of the SNAP People are people that's working that's on low income.
		They are wages are low.
		And the others are either on disability or on Social Security, but don't get enough Social Security to cover their needs.
		So my thought is, why not the people that he gave the tax break, give these people a raise, give them $15 an hour, and then what have to give them snaps?
		You just only have to give the ones that own disability or own Social Security, and, you know, their Social Security is not enough to cover their needs.
		That's my comment.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		A national minimum wage.
		Is that what you're asking for?
		$15?
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Pat Jackson, Tennessee, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Pat.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I listen to C-SPAN every day, and I listen to the Republicans and Democrats, and I've voted across the lines before.
		I'm an old woman, probably won't even be around for the next election.
		But I have to warn people.
		I have been through a whole lot of messes before in politics.
		But this has got to be the worst.
		And all the Republicans that are calling in, praising their president, I want them to look their grandchildren and their great-grandchildren in the face.
		And when they ask them, Paul Paul, why was it like when you were free to go to church, to go do what you wanted to do?
		Because Donald Trump, I promise you, will never, ever leave office.
		He will be there.
		He will be your ruler from now on.
		He's done tore the government down so he has total control.
		And Democrats, you might as well stay home because there'll be no more Democratic Party.
		He's done promised the Republicans that they would stay in office for the rest of their life.
		That's all I got to say.
		I'm sorry for this country.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Sue, Grand Rapids, Michigan, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Sue, what's your top news story of the week?
unidentified		Oh, well, another old woman here.
		She's right, really.
		Just have to comment on that first here.
		Trump is disappointing as president.
		You're talking seniors with a 2.8% Social Security notice in the mail.
		That's not my news point, but that's a reality.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		This is the tell me again, it's the increase for Social Security, cost of living increase.
unidentified		8%, which does zip $30, $40.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What is it usually, Sue?
unidentified		Put it in comparison for us.
		It has been in a similar realm, but when you make big promises about pulling people and helping people up, you got to mean it.
		You got to get in there and actually help seniors.
		That's not helping.
		Okay, but here's my other comment about news.
		And it somewhat reflects what the gentleman said about divided country and partisan politics, because what we don't talk about here is the influence of the globalists on our country and the politicians who seem to be compromised and are representing certain interests.
		And to make my point, I'm very concerned.
		I just saw you advertise on C-SPAN Republican Jewish Coalition at 1 p.m.
		All our money is going to the Jews, you guys.
		I mean, we have been.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Sue.
		Let's talk to Herbert Romulus, Michigan, Independent Line.
		Good morning, Herbert.
unidentified		Yeah, well, the lady in Tennessee hit the nail on the head, but that's a different story.
		I like to talk about the art of the deal, okay?
		Now, this deal they got with China, they just announced that China's going to buy 25 million tons of soybeans next year.
		Well, that's less than half what China bought Trump's last deal with them.
		They didn't even buy the full amount they were supposed to buy the last time.
		So I want to ask these farmers, how much do you think they're going to buy now?
		This is crazy.
		And on top of that, we're still paying a tariff, 10 percent or whatever it is from China.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Herbert, tell me about how much, do you know how much soybeans China usually buys or how much they did in the last administration?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Because I've got Reuters here saying that the agreement is that they buy 12 million metric tons of U.S. soybeans this season, according to Scott Besant, the Secretary of Treasury.
unidentified		And 25 million next year.
		Okay.
		In the 2015-2016 season, China bought, before Trump showed up, they bought 79 million tons of soybeans from the U.S. Ask the farmers how this works out for them.
		This is ridiculous.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Herbert, let's talk to Ernestine, North Carolina, Line for Democrats.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Oh, good morning.
		Good morning.
		I tell you, my main problem is everybody keeps saying this is the Democrats' fault.
		No, it's not.
		Trump closed this federal down.
		He did it because he's not going to let nobody go over his head to do nothing.
		He did it.
		So we're saying Democrats don't have anything.
		They're not doing anything but protecting the Democrat people because we ain't got nobody now to protect us.
		And they federal workers.
		Why are they still getting paid?
		And they done took the federal worker from the people that work federal.
		People work up under Trump, they are federal workers.
		They should cut off their insurance.
		They're not even working and still getting paid.
		And they federal workers they self.
		That means it's confusing.
		If they get their money, everybody else should get their money.
		You don't mess with people just despite what he's doing.
		A lot of spite or you hate somebody.
		And if it don't go your way, that's the first thing he'll say.
		I'm going to close the federal building down.
		I'm going to close the federal workers down.
		What he needs to do is get on Putin.
		That's why this bomb done started out.
		Pissed in these bombs.
		And he came out so mad with Putin.
		Him and Putin been talking about them bombs.
		So y'all need to keep a close eye on him.
		And he got the numbers too.
		Don't nobody listen to him.
		Everybody hardhead, they don't listen to him.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Ernestine.
		Let's take a look at what President Trump said about resuming nuclear testing.
		He was on Air Force One yesterday.
unidentified		Are you talking about literally resuming underground nuclear detonation attacks?
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		You'll find out very soon, but we're going to do some testing.
		Yeah, other countries do it.
		If they're going to do it, we're going to do it.
unidentified		Okay, you can't clarify whether you've been resuming it.
unidentified		I'm not going to say yet.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		I mean, I know exactly what we're doing, where we're doing it, but other countries are doing it.
unidentified		And if other countries do it, we do it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Perry next in South Dakota, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Perry, good morning.
unidentified		I think every week that goes by a problem with this recovery from the last administration,
		they had a perfect setup at the beginning of this whole thing, a seven-week period that if they would have approved it, they could have continuing resolution.
		And the House set it all up that way.
		And it was easy to do.
		Just say, okay, we'll take the seven weeks and we'll use that.
		And we wouldn't have had none of this.
		This whole thing is just recovery from a previous administration.
		It was unsustainable.
		It just came right down to where you have to grab hold of everything you can, including working with other countries on trust and that type of a thing.
		And that's the biggest story of every week because it is just more or less taken.
		This whole thing is not necessary.
		It isn't necessary at all.
		All you have to do is agree to take seven weeks and use it properly.
		Thank you very much.
		And I think C-SPAN is one of the finest things happening on TV.
		Thank you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, Perry.
		Olympia in Bronx, New York, Independent Line.
		Olympia, what do you think?
		What's your top news story that we're talking about?
unidentified		Well, good morning to you.
		There are so many things to talk about, but I'm going to stay on track because I'm a healthcare worker.
		And this, the OB3 with the cuts to health care funding, are just going to devastate everything.
		We really need to make sure that people understand that in hospitals, I live in New York, there are cuts coming down across all the hospitals.
		If we're short-staffed now, what's going to happen when people are laid off?
		Patients are not going to be able to be seen.
		And what about the patients who just can't pay to be seen?
		So people are not understanding.
		This is simply not about the ACA.
		It's about overall health care funding and how it's going to affect the pool of even those of us who have employer-provided health care, those who pay out of pocket, those employers who would have to pay out of pocket for their employees.
		This is a very serious thing, and folks think it's all about, you know, Democrats wanting to hold anything up.
		It's absolutely not.
		The OB3 was pushed through with no consideration for working class folks, working class folks like you and me, who have to get up at 7 and 6 o'clock in the morning and be where we have to be and wait on that next paycheck.
		So I just really want folks to understand it's not all about the ACA.
		While it is about the ACA, it is significantly about health care worker jobs.
		He's already dismantled.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Olympia, tell me more about the cuts that you're seeing at your hospital.
		So give me more specifics.
		Why would there be cuts?
unidentified		Why would there be layoffs?
		Well, in my particular hospital, because I work in the city, I work in New York City, there is a predominant use of Medicaid funds, right?
		People have less income or, you know, we've got poorer populations, maybe sicker populations.
		So there's a high acceptance of Medicaid funding.
		We are a safety net hospital.
		There's a high prevalence of asthma, diabetes, high blood pressure in these communities because of the environment.
		But there are other things that contribute to it as well.
		You've got cancer.
		You've got other things that people come to these hospitals for that can provide really good services.
		And we're there.
		And what happens when we're not there or we're not able to deliver a continuum of services or emergency rooms are overcrowded because here we go again.
		We can't get to our PCP care.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Olympia.
		And let's talk to Mary, a Democrat in Las Vegas.
		Good morning, Mary.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm going to try not to be so convoluted, but I've got to tell you, we have got to start connecting the dots.
		We have got a president who's just thrown due process out the window.
		He's bombing boats.
		The Democrats have been pushed aside from intelligence meetings.
		We don't know who these people are.
		I mean, the drugs are supposedly coming from China, but he's bombing probably fishermen out of the boats.
		We don't know.
		And now he wants to turn the military on his own people here in the United States.
		Even Stalin's secret police didn't wear masks.
		What's going on here?
		Now they want us, there's talk about them wanting to go back to where if you have, you know, like if you have a severe illness and you're in the hospital and you can't pay it, to start putting that back on your credit report.
		The Affordable Care Act may not have been perfect, but it was supposed to be repealed and replaced with something better.
		He said in his first term, a big, beautiful bill.
		Four years, nothing.
		It turns out when he got interviewed, well, I have a concept.
		Well, a concept isn't a policy.
		This is Project 2025.
		And now you had Doge go in and fire all of the inspector generals, so nobody could be held accountable.
		We don't really know what's going on except for what little trickles out.
		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Mary, I do want to mention what you started with, which was the Democrats being left out of that briefing.
		This is Fox News that says this headline.
		Senator Warner blasts Trump administration for excluding Democrats from briefings on boat strikes, quote, deeply troubling.
		Well, here is Senator Mark Warner, a Democrat of Virginia, speaking on Thursday about that.
mark warner ▲ ● ▼		Let me be clear.
		I've worked well with Marco over many, many years.
		I was proud to support him for Secretary of State.
		He looked me in the eye and promised me this.
		I hope that he assumed that promise would be carried out before he left the country.
		And I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt until proven otherwise.
		But if some lackey in the White House said, no, we can't share that, We can't open ourselves up to actual congressional oversight in any administration, including Trump one.
		That person would be fired.
		I think they know they screwed up.
		But saying they screwed up, if they say they acknowledge you screwed up, fire somebody.
		But the question I've got is, this is a pattern.
		This is not a one-off.
		And where in the hell were my Republican senators who we have worked on everything in a bipartisan fashion?
		Why didn't they say, isn't this a little bit weird that we don't have any Democrats in the room?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here's a couple of comments on text.
		Barb in Illinois says, the top news story of the week is the president's trip to Asia for the APAC summit.
		The various trade deals with Japan, South Korea, and China, as well as a peace treaty, was a positive move and helps international relations at this time.
		And David in Carolina Shores, North Carolina says, Republicans could end the shutdown simply by changing the filibuster rules, just as Trump instructed them to do.
		Their choice not to do so means that Republicans absolutely own the shutdown.
		And you can send us a text as well as calling.
		And here's Rip on the Republican line in Fredericksburg, Virginia.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Rip.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you're on the air.
unidentified		Go ahead, Rip.
		Thanks.
		I think we've run amok, and I don't think we're coming back.
		I think it's the United States has had its moment.
		And until everything is cleared out and only the things that we need are put back into place, I think that we have arrived at a station where there is no real coming back.
		The Republicans and the Democrats hate each other so much that it no longer is reasonable to think that we're going to come out of this without some kind of a I can't.
		If I said what I would say, you would cut me off, so I won't.
		So everybody just has to think about what that might be.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So when you say, get rid of everything and just take what we need what, what did you mean by that?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What kind of things do you want to get rid of?
unidentified		I've had hundreds of houses that were in such bad shape.
		The only way I was able to put them back into shape was to take everything out of the house and only put back in what I wanted in the house, and then the house was was livable.
		But that's what the United States is right, now that Biden destroyed the United States and you're talking about people when you say, take stuff out of the house, or concepts about yes ma'am, I do.
		I am talking about the.
		You know the illegal immigration destroyed the United States.
		We're not coming back from that, and and why?
		You would think we were.
		How did slavery work out for you?
		That didn't work out for you either.
		So it's, it's all uh, handheld together.
		It's a very disturbing thing.
		My generation from 1955 destroyed the world and the youth.
		The youth will never recover and have what I had.
		I had a most incredible, Incredible life.
		And we destroyed it.
		Thank you, Mimi.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Charles, Cleveland, Ohio, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You're next.
unidentified		Yeah, that gentleman was talking about, I believe he was indirectly, about all the various civil rights law, voting rights laws, all the laws that came that provided different ways of living in America.
		And he sees that as making America ungreat again.
		My comment is that the distraction going on by the distractor-in-chief is working for those who have been disciples of the Project 2025.
		Donald Trump is really tearing this country up to that.
		And he's doing it behind the scene by keeping you distracted.
		He's murdering the village of Waivers.
		He's watching our money go into the Middle East and murder people there.
		And so all these things are part of things that are within the Project 2025 because you keep you distracted.
		Some people call here, they know they see through that, they see through what's going on.
		They see through the complicity of the media, particularly the media, and how they allow this thing to happen.
		So the biggest story of again is continuing to see how people in our country continue to allow this Project 2025 to be implemented.
		And unfortunately, our Democratic leaders, gone are the days of Tip O'Neill, gone all the days of Ronald Reagan, gone are the days of in the media, Utley and Brinkley.
		We don't have the kind of oversight in this country to stop and to teach people what's going on.
		So I would advise people to continue to watch social media, continue to watch YouTube, and continue to watch independent media because you'll get the true story of what's going on.
		Thank you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Charles, here's Tony, Claypool, Indiana, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Tony.
unidentified		Hey, good morning.
		Thanks for taking my call.
		My story's got to be just Andrew.
		He's just Andrew now.
		I just think it's amazing that King Charles takes his own brother and he makes a stand against Epstein and everything that's went on.
		And over here, we have Mike Johnson.
		They won't do anything about it.
		They won't release the files.
		And over there, the king, his own brother, he took him down, and they're not doing anything over here.
		And I just think it's an atrocity that we're not doing anything about this.
		So to me, that's got to be the big story.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Tony, here is Fox News with the headline published just this morning.
		King Charles, quote, can barely tolerate former Prince Andrew after his scandalous behavior.
		It says that on October 30th, the monarch officially removed all royal titles, including prince, from his younger sibling.
		Buckingham Palace announced that the 65-year-old, who is no longer a prince or the Duke of York, will now be referred to as Andrew Mountbatten, Windsor.
		Here is Bob, hometown, Illinois, Republican.
kristi noem ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Bob.
unidentified		Good morning, Mimi.
		Love C-SPAN.
		Thank you.
		My top news story of the week is, I don't know, Arctic Frost or Arctic Freeze, where Senator Grassley exposed a bunch of shenanigans regarding, I think, 400 and some odd Republicans.
		They tapped their phones and whatnot.
		But I got good news for Rip.
		This is a great country.
		We've survived worse than Trump.
		Trump is, in my opinion, Trump is the best president in a long time.
		And these elite libs like Senator Warner and Representative Jason Crow.
		If they're okay with letting them drug bolts come in, every drug ball comes in kills 25,000 Americans.
		I'm glad to see Trump and Hex Department of War bomb them boats out of water.
		That's a terrific idea.
		As far as they get five more dumbs to cross over in the Senate, people get their checks and kids and households get their snap.
		It's just five holdouts.
		That's all the Republicans need.
		Cross over, open the country.
		Thanks, Mimi.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Bob, let's go back to the activities in the Caribbean and the Pacific regarding those alleged drug boats.
		There was an aircraft carrier group that was moved into that area off the coast of Venezuela.
		What do you make of that?
		Would you be in support as a supporter of President Trump of taking further action and possibly attacking Venezuela directly?
unidentified		Absolutely.
		Flexing our muscles is a good thing.
		The sooner we get Maduro out of there, the sooner elected president can take over.
		That's a very important country.
		They've got a lot of assets, a lot of things to go and go along with them.
		And Maduro, he's one of the biggest terrorists ever lived.
		I'm in favor.
		Okay.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here is Laura in Massachusetts, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Laura, what's your top news story of the week?
unidentified		Well, the top news story, my gosh, it's never ending, is it?
		There's so much to say, but I think my top story, I would say, would be Kamala Harris going all over the place talking about her, you know, promoting her book of 107 Days or whatever it is.
		And listening to her, she so still doesn't get any of it and why the Democrats lost.
		And that's the biggest issue.
		You know, we can keep blaming Trump for every single thing, every obnoxious thing that comes out of his mouth, his greed, his just lack of, you know, just common decency.
		I mean, we can blame him for every problem we have in this country, but the reality is it's the Democrats that gave the election to him again because they don't get it.
		Mamdami Mandani in New York gets it.
		He gets it because the Democrats, the elitists, the MSNBC show people that go on that show and go on and on about how, you know, they're worried about the polls and this and that.
		And they just forget the whole reason why they're there.
		And that is just, that is to represent the people.
		And that doesn't mean just the 1%.
		That means all the people in this country.
		And they have lost their way.
		And I don't think it's going to get better in this country until the Democratic Party really changes.
		There needs to be a T Party removal, basically.
		Like there needs to be what happened with the Tea Party needs to happen with the Democratic Party.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Laura.
		And regarding former Vice President, this is CNN with the headline.
		Kamala Harris opens up about, quote, complicated relationship with Biden, including when he, quote, greatly disappointed her.
		That's at CNN if you would like to look at that.
		Here's Joe, Oklahoma City, Democrat.
		Hi, Joe.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
		You do a fantastic job.
		You're my favorite host.
		I've got a couple of news stories.
		I'm going to make them kind of quick with points.
		First, the person that was calling in that thinks it's okay to just go in and kill a bunch of people because they have gold and stuff.
		Well, he's got it right.
		It's not about the drugs.
		Venezuela doesn't produce any fentanyl, which causes all the overduces.
		They're small players, maybe a little bit in the cocaine business.
		It's about the oil people.
		They're wanting to kill for oil.
		I think that's very unchristian.
		The other thing I will say is that people in New Jersey and Virginia, as much as I'm not a fan of the Democrats or any other, if you want your state ruined, like some of these red states, you better get out there and vote to make sure the Democrats win in that election.
		The only thing that's going to be a little bit of a buffer to Trump.
		And then the people keep saying, Trump, Trump, Trump, Trump, you know, he's like in a power grab.
		Let me remind everybody: if in 2016 he controlled the military like he does today with a radical right-wing lunatic like Heg Seth, he wouldn't have left.
		Now, on to my actual, my personal story is the number of farmers that are going out of business right now.
		We have an epidemic of farmers filing bankruptcy.
		What's interesting is Trump's kind of driving those bankruptcies through the tariffs.
		The real interesting thing is the billionaires, the hedge funds, including the vice president, J.D. Vanishes.
		He's got a company he's tied to called Agra Acres that's buying up a lot of these farmers when they get desperate and they have to sell off their farmland.
		You know, so billionaires control the food.
		So we really need to, as Democrats, not a super proud one, but at least they believe in science.
		We need to get out and vote.
		We've got to win in New Jersey and in Virginia, especially in New York.
		Or, you know, those, if you want your state ruined, just keep voting Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Joe.
		And regarding what Joe mentioned, this is Fortune magazine with the headline.
		This is from October 4th.
		It says, farm bankruptcies are soaring amid low crop prices, while Trump considers bailout of up to $14 billion.
		That's a Fortune, if you'd like to read that.
		And here's Linda in Mountain Home, Arkansas, line for Republicans.
		Hi, Linda.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I want to talk about the closing of the government.
		This is the same budget bill that Joe Biden put in place in January of this year.
		All the Democrats liked it.
		They voted for it for three years in a row.
		Chuck Schumer voted for it, and he got in trouble.
		So therefore, when they passed it in September and it went to the Senate, all the Senate had to do was pass it, and then they had all of October, November to work on health care.
		But oh no, we can't have AOC coming right after us again.
		Not so fast.
		It's Chuck Schumer's shutdown.
		And as far as the snap food goes, Trump's going to feed those people.
		Everybody in America is going to feed those people.
		But get this: this is the only time the Democrats won't sue him and take him to court for doing it because they know that they caused it.
		Everything he does, they take to court to see if it's legal.
		But this one, and so I don't blame Trump for wanting the legality checked out before he issues the check.
		And the check will be probably two weeks late.
		And I feel for those people and everybody, myself included, everybody will tip in and give to feed the people.
		But the Democrats own this, and they own it strictly because of politics.
		AOC does, I think she's giving up on Senate.
		I think she's going for president, which I don't care.
		She can.
		She's kind of like New York.
		They ought to fit right in.
		She is the megalick.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We got it, Linda.
		Here's Terry in Papua Beach, Florida.
		Democrat.
		Hi, Terry.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hello.
		The $40 billion he gave Argentina, that's our tax money.
		He's draining our pool.
		It doesn't make any sense.
		He's breaking America so him and his rich friends can own everything.
		And I just feel for my grandchildren.
		Hard as we worked.
		I just wanted to say that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Terry.
		And here is Chris in Fairfield, New Jersey, Independent Line.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning to you.
		Want to make a quick comment regarding there's so many stories that's going on in our country.
		It just doesn't stop.
		I have been a person right in the middle all my life.
		My family was Democrat.
		I grew up raised in New York.
		You don't even want to talk about what New York is going to turn into.
		On top of that, I've now moved to New Jersey.
		I've been here now for almost 30 years now, raising a family.
		Please take a look at what's going on in New Jersey.
		You have to ask your question.
		It's called common sense.
		What is happening in the states with the most trouble?
		Look at what's running the states.
		Look at the government and ask yourself: what are they doing for the people as a whole?
		Not just the 1% that the Democrats keep targeting.
		This is why they lose on every issue.
		It's about all the people.
		That is my comment.
		You have a wonderful day.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Chris, are you voting in the elections next?
		We lost him.
		They are having an election in New Jersey for governor.
		And this is Jack in Washington, Pennsylvania, Republican.
		Hi, Jack.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Yeah, you had a liberal caller call in earlier about the amount of imports of soybeans that China had.
		He said in 2019 that China had imported 90 million tons from the United States compared to the 12 million that they're going to import now.
		That was twisting the facts quite a bit.
		I looked it up.
		China imported 88.5 million tons of soybeans in 2019, but 57% of that was from Brazil.
		Actually, they only imported 16.9 tons of soybeans from the United States.
		So they, in typical liberal fashion, they twist the facts and they don't give all of the information to people.
		But I did have some facts that you can rely on.
		And that is over 90% of the Republicans voted to keep the government open, and over 80% of the Democrats voted to keep it shut.
		Those are the facts, and I wish you would tell that to people when they call in and try to blame the Republicans or Donald Trump.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay, and this is Bloomberg with more information on soybeans and how much China buys.
		This is bloomberg.com.
		Soy sees biggest monthly gain since 2020 as China buys cargoes.
		It says soybean futures notched their biggest monthly gain in five years.
		That's the futures index.
		As Beijing moves to boost purchases of American farm goods following a trade truce, China bought at least four U.S. soybean cargoes after a summit between President Donald Trump and his counterpart.
		Cargoes are for shipment later this year and in early 2026.
		The total volume is about 250,000 tons.
		Said people from Milliar asking not to be identified because they're not authorized to speak to the media.
		The soybeans will be shipped from the Pacific Northwest and U.S. Gulf.
		U.S. Secretary of Agriculture Rollins said in a post Thursday that the Asian nation agreed to buy at least 12 million tons this year.
		Sales would rise to 25 million tons annually over the next three years.
		Here's Tina, Imperial Missouri Independent Line.
		Hi, Tina.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I just wanted to make a comment that I feel like a lot of people are missing that we're this whole financial government shutdown.
		And it's all about what we keep hearing in the media and from the politicians.
		All of last year, we operated under a continuing resolution.
		And my, what gets me going is that they're not talking about a real budget, or at least I'm not hearing that.
		And everybody had time.
		All the politicians had time to do their jobs and negotiate with one another, work with one another, and get a real budget in place in advance of the end of this fiscal year.
		And they chose not to.
		They chose not to work together.
		Real leaders work together.
		Doesn't matter if I like the person sitting next to me.
		Doesn't matter if I agree with the person sitting next to me.
		I have to work with the person sitting next to me.
		I have to find a way to adapt and overcome.
		And our leaders are not doing that.
		And all the while, they're getting paid.
		And military and government employees are not.
		And that's, they have no skin in the game.
		They don't care because they can continue to play games while other people have to go to work and not get a paycheck.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Tina, just a point of clarification: the military did get paid again yesterday, October 31st.
		That was their second time during the shutdown.
		There were funds reallocated within the Defense Department to pay the troops.
		And that's it for this segment.
		There'll be more time later in the program for your calls.
		But later this morning on the Washington Journal, we'll hear from Paragon Health Institute President Brian Blaise about health care and the expiring Affordable Care Act subsidies.
		But next, after the break, we'll talk with Food Research and Action Center interim SNAP Director Gina Plato Nino about government food benefit programs, including SNAP and WIC.
unidentified		We'll be right back Tuesday, a critical election night on C-SPAN.
		From coast to coast, key races that could shape America's future.
		In New York City, a hard-fought mayor's race in the nation's largest city.
		Governor's races heating up in New Jersey and Virginia.
		And a California constitutional amendment that could shift the balance in Congress.
		All the results, all of the speeches, coverage that's straight down the middle.
		Election night, Tuesday at 6 p.m. Eastern, only on C-SPAN.
		Your democracy, unfiltered.
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		This Sunday, with our guest Pulitzer Prize winner, Stacey Schiff, author of biographies, including Ben Franklin, Samuel Adams, and Cleopatra.
		She joins our host, renowned author and civic leader David Rubinstein.
		So writing a second book on Franklin, you must admire him.
		I assume you don't want to write two books on somebody you don't admire, but you do admire him.
stacy schiff ▲ ● ▼		I feel as if he is in always admirable in so many ways, just the essential DNA of America.
stacy schiff ▲ ● ▼		His voice is the voice of America, literally.
unidentified		Watch America's Book Club with Stacey Schiff.
		Sundays at 6 p.m. and 9 p.m. Eastern and Pacific, only on C-SPAN.
		And past president, why are you doing this?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		This is outrageous.
unidentified		This is a kangaroo corporation.
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		Washington Journal continues.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back to Washington Journal.
		We're joined now to discuss government food aid is Gina Plata Nino.
		She is Interim SNAP Director for the Food Research and Action Center.
		Welcome to the program, Gina.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Thank you for having me.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So first, could you tell us about the Food Research and Action Center?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What's your mission and how you guys are funded?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yes, we're known as FRAC, and we work to improve the nutrition, the well-being, the health of individuals who are suffering from poverty-related hunger.
		And we do this through equitable partnerships, by working with state partners all across the country.
		And we're a nonprofit organization funded by grants from philanthropy and other organizations.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I want to start with the latest news, which was the rulings by several judges, a couple of judges, asking the Trump administration to pay out SNAP benefits for the month of November out of contingency funds and possibly other funding.
		Can you tell us a little bit about that?
		What prompted that and how that would work?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yes, so to start off, we didn't need to get there, right?
		FRAC and other organizations have been telling the administration even before the shutdown happened about asking about what their plan is.
		USDA, the U.S. Department of Agriculture, As contingency funds, what is at issued here, and reserves that they can utilize in order to be able to pay benefits.
		Benefits today should have gone on time if the secretary and the administration had acted accordingly.
		Last Friday, USDA sent out a memo that violated the Hatch Act because it was incredibly political, but it also said that the contingency funds that advocates like ours had been saying for weeks to be utilized for SNAP so that benefits could go out on time were only in case of an emergency and that department lacked the authority,
		which is something we know is not true because they have utilized those funds to already pay some administrative expenses and had utilized the reserves to pay for other priorities of the administration.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Gina, are you saying that they have used that during this shutdown?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		They have used some of those contingency funds?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yes, they have utilized some of the contingency funds to pay the administrative cost expenses for the states.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		So the federal government pays 50%, the state pays 50%, but they did utilize, it's our understanding that they did utilize some of the contingency funds to pay administrative state share expenses.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So what are they saying that that contingency fund is used for or should be used for?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		In the memo specifically that they cited last Friday, it said, that this two Fridays ago, specifically said that it was in terms of a disaster.
		And so about a dozen attorney generals that said, we need answers.
		What do you mean you can't utilize this?
		No response from USDA.
		So then they on Tuesday, they file a lawsuit led by the Attorney General of Massachusetts, Andrea Campbell, asking that USDA utilize its authority that Congress had given them, that is in the Nutrition Act, which is what governs SNAP, and utilize those contingency funds in order to fund SNAP benefits.
		And you're right, there were two lawsuits.
		It was the one by the Attorney Generals, but there was another lawsuit also filed by national nonprofit organizations along with municipalities and other state nonprofits that also said, please utilize this contingency funding.
		And you also terminated some waivers that states were depending on, ensure that those continue onto the end.
		On Thursday, the hearing for the Massachusetts one, because it was filed in Massachusetts, was heard.
		And the judge gave an inkling.
		There was a lot of oral argument where the judge seemed to be asking questions as to why USDA didn't think it had utilized the authority, what it had done in the past, and said that it would issue an order on Friday, which she did.
		And then the Rhode Island hearing also happened on Friday.
		Both are similar and different in a way.
		Both specifically have given USDA, it captures the whole of the nation, because even though the states asked for the injunction during all your argument, the judge seemed to say that this would apply as a whole.
		And that's the way the SNAP program works.
		You can't choose and pick over states.
		It would apply as a whole.
		And so the judge seemed to say USDA has until Monday, the administration has us till Monday to decide how they're going to utilize the contingency funds in order to fund SNAP.
		And the Rhode Island one, the one that was heard in Rhode Island, actually goes a little bit further and says that USDA should also find a way to figure out if they can utilize the reserve funding so that they can fully fund SNAP.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Because currently we do know that the contingency funds are not sufficient to cover the full month of SNAP and so that's what I was going to ask you, Gina, because it's about $9 billion to cover the entire month and there's about $5 billion in reserves.
		So how would that work?
		Would it just be maybe a little bit more than two weeks?
		What do you think is going to happen with that?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Well, we've been saying this that there is this fund called Section 32 that the Secretary of Agriculture has tapped in to fund WIC, right?
		There is over $30 billion worth of reserves that the Secretary can easily tap into, has the authority to do so in order to offset so that full benefits will go in.
		So there's two things that can happen.
		We don't know how the administration is going to respond, but it takes a while, right?
		Because it's not as simple as turning on a switch.
		The states have to do this issuance files where they say, this is how many people are eligible.
		This is how much they're entitled to.
		They send that to something called an EBT processor vendor.
		There are two main ones in the U.S. that pretty much have half and half of the states.
		Those EBT processors capture all of the cases and say to the Department of Agriculture, this is how much money we need in order for individuals when they swipe their card to have benefits in the card.
		USDA takes those numbers and says, okay, here's your letter of credit.
		Take it over and begin.
		Then the EBT processors have it.
		And so when that person walks into an eligible participating EBT retailer and they scan their card, that money is transferred.
		So it's not as simple as that.
		If USDA says, nope, we're only going to use contingency funding, then it's going to take another level of steps because then USDA will have to figure out how they're going to prorate, meaning how they're going to give less than the amount that people are entitled to, most likely 50%, and will have to do added calculations.
		I will flag that this process may take a little bit longer because we do not know how many people have been terminated or furloughed from USDA because unlike other shutdowns, the Office of Management and Budget directed the agencies to terminate individuals instead of being furloughed.
		So we don't know how much on the back end and how quickly the department can act, but we do know that we just don't know at the point like what USDA, how is going to respond at this moment.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Can we let's take a step back, Gina, and talk about the SNAP program and kind of who it covers.
		We're going to put on the screen some information from the USDA about fiscal year 2025 benefits and how many people it covers at about 42.5 million people are covered by SNAP.
		Can you give us an idea of the type of people who receive SNAP benefits and usually how long do people stay on it?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		The majority of SNAP users are children.
		They make up the biggest bucket, followed by older adults and then followed with people with disabilities.
		They are parents, they are children, they are veterans, they are unhoused individuals, they're a youth aging out of foster care.
		The main reason that people are in this program is threefold.
		Number one, I lost my job.
		This economy has been tough.
		When people lose their job and don't have a support system, they need to be able to keep paying their bills to be able to stay afloat.
		The second reason is my wages have been reduced.
		And the third reason is I have a family member to take care of.
		I can't work full-time or there are things that are prohibiting me.
		All of these things are interrelated to the economy.
		When the economy is strong, people are not in SNAP because there are jobs.
		Food doesn't cost as much.
		Shelter doesn't cost as much.
		And you can see that through various years that the program has been utilized.
		When the economy is strong, we are not.
		We're at a point that our economy is not doing that well.
		We haven't recovered since the pandemic.
		And so there's a higher unemployment rate.
		There is, and when I say unemployment rate, majority of people on SNAP are working part-time.
		And the latest labor statistics show that people were looking for full-time job, but they could not find it.
		Even though they're working, a lot of these individuals make less than $1,100 a month because they're part of the gig economy, meaning there is not enough funding for them to be able to supply for their families.
		So, in order to be able to pay shelter, which takes up to 70 to 80 percent of their income, leaving very little money for anything else, they rely on this program in order to feed their family.
		Most people are in the program ranging either from six months to 24 months, depending on how dire the situation is, but it's not a permanent program.
		People are not in the program for their lifetime, they're there because they have falling off hard times and they rely on this program so that they continue so that they continue with their well-being and can be able to move through and receive economic mobility.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Gina, they do have to recertify every so often, but that recertification period is different for each person.
		That's determined.
		It could be six months, it could be three years that they would have to come back and recertify and say that we still qualify for SNAP.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		And it's different also by state, right?
		There's some that do three months, they do six months, they do a year.
		But in general, there's constant checking that individual circumstances are currently the same.
		Also, individuals who have wages, which is a majority of the individuals, and the back end is constantly checking that wages have not gone up because if it does, it flags it for the state agency, which then contacts the individual and then they have to submit verifications.
		It is the most regulated quality control program that we have among all federal programs.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And I'll just let people know that if you'd like to join our conversation about federal food aid, you can give us a call.
		The lines are Democrats 202-748-8000, Republicans 202-748-8001, and Independents 202-748-8002.
		We also have a line set aside for SNAP recipients.
		So, if you are on the SNAP program, please do give us a call.
		A special line is set for you.
		That's 202-748-8003.
		And, Gina, I want to ask you about work requirements because you mentioned a lot of people that are on SNAP are working, but the one big beautiful bill did make those, I guess, put in new work requirements.
		Can you give us an idea of what those are and how things are going to change as a result of that bill?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yes, since 1996, under the Personal Responsibility Act, individuals who are 18 to 49 had to show that they were, and they were called, as they are called, able-bodied adults without dependent, which is a misnomer because there are many individuals who have disabilities that just haven't been able to prove them.
		But they can only get SNAP for three months in a three-year period if they cannot show that they are working at least 20 hours a week.
		In 2023, under the Fiscal Responsibility Act, that was expanded from 18 to 49 to 18 to 54, but they were giving certain caveats, certain protections for those who were unhoused, those who were veterans, and those who were youth aging out of foster care, because there's plenty of data that shows that these particular populations are incredibly vulnerable, and it's really difficult for them to show that they're constantly working those 20 hours a week.
		There's some people who are at 17, 18.
		It's really difficult.
		The HR1, the reconciliation law that you just mentioned, in the summer, it was expanded to those who are up to 64.
		It took away the protection.
		So that means that veterans, housed, youth aging out of foster care now fall under this category.
		And then also for the first time in history, parents, caretakers of children 14 and up also have to meet these requirements.
		There are some exemptions you have.
		You can show that you have a disability.
		If you are going to school, that could be one of the ways that could be exempted.
		And there are states that may exempt if they need something called unfitness, but it's an incredibly hard program that the disability community has been calling out for years.
		That many individuals who have disabilities also fall through the gaps because it's so difficult to prove to submit verifications in order for eligible people to receive SNAP.
		So, as a whole, it just costs the state agencies money and resources because they have to touch the cases constantly to ensure that the right people are in the program, that people are submitting, that they're saying, okay, you utilize one month.
		So, what is going to happen is that beginning actually today, many individuals applying moving forward will be held to this requirement.
		Once they recertify or they do their interim report, once they have a touch base with the agency, they will be told you're no longer protected.
		It doesn't matter if you're homeschooling your child.
		It doesn't matter that you, grandmother, have retired and are on a limited income.
		You can't find other jobs.
		You're 63.
		You have to go back to the workforce and show that you're working at least 20 hours a week because helping your daughter taking care of your granddaughter doesn't count.
		So, it's incredibly burdensome.
		It's going to cost once it's implemented as a whole.
		The Congressional Budget Office estimates that over 2 million people will be losing benefits every month.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's talk to callers and we'll start with Bob in Racine, Wisconsin.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Democrat, good morning, Bob.
unidentified		Hello, C-SPAN.
		I love C-SPAN.
		Ms. Petro, I like your comment on this.
		All the Republicans have to do is say we're going to vote one vote to open the government, negotiate, and then we're going to bring it back to 60 votes after that.
		I mean, do they think we're in how do you look in the mirror when you're getting money and then millions of people are not getting food stamps?
		How do you face yourself?
		I mean, they already worked six months, not even a year.
		I would like your comment and I thank you, C-SPAN.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Gina.
unidentified		Gina, any comment on that?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		You know, I'm just going to say that we don't have to wait for the shutdown to open.
		Don't want to apply on that.
		This never had to happen, right?
		The secretary made out in her plan to say that these funds could be utilized.
		Other shutdowns, including first Trump administration's 2018 to 2019 shutdown, didn't cost this.
		They actually issued benefits earlier.
		All the secretary had to do was tell the state agencies, submit your case files.
		We're going to utilize our contingency reserves, our contingency funds, and our reserves, just like we did for WIC, just like we have done for other priorities.
		On November 1st, you will get your benefits on time.
		And even now, they don't have to wait for the lawsuit.
		They don't have to wait for Republicans and Democrats to agree.
		They can just do their job and feed the American people.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Michael is in Pennsylvania, aligned for Republicans.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Michael.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Just one question.
		I have, I'm on SNAP benefits, the EBT portion of the SNAP.
		I don't get cash.
		But I was wondering, I still have credit on my card.
		And I was wondering, because nobody can seem to tell me, not even the cashiers, am I possible to use my SNAP card?
		I'm not worried about if they're going to put when they're going to restock the card, but I was just wondering if I can still use my card as it is.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Michael, You have leftover, is that what you're saying?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You have leftover from last month?
unidentified		Correct.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay, go ahead, Gina.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
		You can utilize it.
		The problem is that unfortunately, USA hasn't communicated with the states, and the states didn't know how to communicate.
		But yes, this goes to you and anyone who may be listening.
		If you still have funds in your card, you can continue to utilize it.
		Retailers haven't been contacted.
		You know, state agencies should have put on various information on their website, but your card continues to be active.
		And if you have any funds, even a dollar, you can still utilize your card and purchase whatever items you may need for food.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Gina, this is a card.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		It kind of works like a debit card where there's a certain amount put on per month, and then you just draw it down.
unidentified		Nobody gets any cash for no one gets any cash.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		And you can only purchase at certain participating ABT retailers.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		There are about over 260,000 across the country.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And what can you actually purchase with those cards?
		You know, I understand that you can only purchase food you can't purchase, you know, like cleaning supplies or things like that.
		No tobacco, so no cigarettes or anything like that.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, no alcohol and no hot fruits.
unidentified		Right.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		So that rotisserie chicken, that potato salad, that maybe help, you know, people with mobility issues so they can't cook, people with disability, older adults, who don't, who lack, who may lack the muscle mass, unhoused individuals who could really, they can't cook a bag of potatoes.
		You know, they can buy hot food.
		It has to be food that they themselves then go home and prepare it.
		It doesn't take into account the individuals may not necessarily have a kitchen or the ability to be able to cook that food.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And what about unhealthy food and drinks?
		So junk food, right?
		What's usually called junk food or sodas or sugary drinks, that kind of thing?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		There's no definition currently.
		You know, there's a previous administration that said what healthy is, but there's no current definition.
		Individuals can just buy the food that's more culturally and dietary and needed for their own needs, just like, you know, you and I and any individual with a paycheck will buy the food that is needed for them.
		But I will flag that SNAP recipients, their diet is no different from the rest of Americans.
		They do have to sometimes in these difficult times buy items with more caloric intake because the benefits are not enough.
		They're less than $6 a day.
		And with food being what it is so expensive now, people have to make tough choices to ensure that while this program is supposed to be supplemental, this may be a person's whole budget.
		They have to make sure that they last longer.
		And in many places where SNAP recipients reside, they're called high-need, low-access areas.
		There are very few places where they can find fresh produce or more accessible food that they can meet their needs.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's talk to Judith in Melrose, Massachusetts, a SNAP recipient.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Judith.
unidentified		Morning.
		I just have a statement.
		I'm 74 years old, disabled, and don't go to the grocery store.
		I usually have a helper that comes in once a week to help me.
		But she cannot handle any money because of her job.
		And so the stamps are the only thing she can help me with.
		But if I don't have the stamps, I have no food.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So are you saying you're disabled and are not able to go and buy the food yourself?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And your aide is also not able to go and buy it for you?
unidentified		With the rules that she has to help me with, she cannot handle any money.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I see.
unidentified		So what do you do?
		Well, I let her use the food stamps.
		She can do the food stamps, but she can't handle money money.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay, got it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So you are able to have your aide go and buy the food for you?
unidentified		Right.
		Only if I have the stamps.
		If I have no stamps, then there's no food.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Judith, have you run out as of today?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Do you have enough on your card?
unidentified		For this month.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		For this month, yes.
unidentified		I mean, if it's going to go on longer and longer, I'm going to be in serious trouble.
		And then I look and I see what he's doing to the East Wing or the West Wing or whatever wing it is.
		He's putting a multi-million dollar structure in there when there's people starving.
		They're going to be starving if this program doesn't get put back in order.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Judith.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Gina, what do people do if they do run out and those funds are not replenished in time?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Ma'am, I'm so sorry to hear that.
		Massachusetts, it's difficult.
		The first thing is, you know, there's a reason why people rely on these benefits because it's needed, like this situation that is being discussed.
		Specifically for Massachusetts, they have the United Way 211 and older adult senior centers may be able to assist.
		I know that the governor has also allocated some additional funding for food banks, but that doesn't necessarily resolve your issue.
		The issue would have to be that the cards would be able to go into your card.
		I'm not sure if Meals on Wheels or other programs may be able to help you, but I defer to you.
		I don't know if you can share the contact information.
		I'm happy to connect them with various people in Massachusetts that may be able to assist.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, we'll tell people that they can find you on FRAC.org, so FRAC.org, if you'd like to reach out to Gina's organization for any additional information.
		Lester, Washington, D.C., Democrat.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Lester.
unidentified		Look, my question to Ms. Nino is this.
		Will she explore some of the myths behind SNAP?
		For instance, the majority of the people who get SNAP benefits are in places like West Virginia, Ohio, Pennsylvania, the rural part of America.
		But yet these same people go out and vote for Trump.
		Okay?
		But Ms. Nino also pointed out how this administration has pretty much politicized food, which is a violation of the Hatch Act.
		So she alluded to that.
		We have an affordability issue in America.
		We have a food insecurity issue in America.
		But yet Donald Trump wants to give $20 billion to Argentina.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Lester.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Gina, about where do SNAP recipients live around the country?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		So it depends.
		So I'm going to answer this.
		SNAP recipients are all across the country.
		There is a higher rate of poverty and a higher rate of hunger in rural areas that do tend to be in red states.
		The issue is that in many of those states, because while it's a federal program, states have the option to administer it in ways that make it more accessible for individuals or creates additional barriers.
		So in many of those states, the state agency decides to make it more difficult, more people who jump through additional hoops.
		So there may be less access in those places.
		But as a whole, many of those places do have a higher rate of food insecurity, a higher rate of hunger, and a higher SNAP utilization.
		It is across the whole board.
		While sometimes states like California do come out, we have to realize that they do have a lot more population.
		Some of like the most populous states and also largest SNAP recipients are California, followed by Texas, followed by Florida, and then Pennsylvania.
		It's also depending on population.
		A smaller state is not going to have a higher amount of individuals because it really is populations and access and needs, and how easier the state agency makes it people for making the program accessible.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Gary is a SNAP recipient in New Rochelle, New York.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Gary.
unidentified		Yeah, I'd like to say good morning and agree with a couple of people out there.
		The woman who's 94 who can't get to the store.
		I have a friend who picks me up and takes me to the store.
		It took me seven years to get off a walker to a cane.
		And I managed to get to the store now, you know, with them, you know, three times a month.
		And so that's not that problem.
		I agree with the guy from DC about the $20 billion, which is two months' worth of food stamps that went to Argentina of our taxpayer money without any congressional approval.
		But what I really wanted to ask you about is the return, the rate of return on the dollar for food stamps.
		I was under the impression that the agriculture department and the people who actually grow the food actually benefit more than $1 per dollar that is put in to our food stamps.
		Could you address that, please?
		And I'll take it off the air.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Gina.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Happy to.
		For every dollar spent for SNAP, it translates to up to $1.80 in local economy.
		Last year, it brought over $110 billion of federal dollars that went into our municipalities.
		This also translates, just looking at small grocers, not as a whole, the 266,000 retailers.
		It brought seven, almost $8 billion in states as small grocers and retailers, over 240,000 direct jobs and 135,000 indirect jobs.
		That means cashiers, the people who transport the food, over 10 billion in wages.
		That means the cashiers in there, those individuals who live there, property taxes, right?
		Because people, those retailers who are in there, they either lease or buy property, that property taxes going to your municipality that allows your city town manager, your mayor, to utilize it to be able to fund your basic needs.
		And that brought up about $2.6 billion in tax revenue indirect and almost $2 billion in local taxes.
		And this is just small grocers.
		But as a whole, yes, the money goes from USDA basically into retailers who then go and spread it out through wages and multiplying throughout our local economy.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We got a question for you, Gina, on text about Governor Westmore in Maryland, who signed an executive order, created a state of emergency in order to pay SNAP benefits, asking, is that legal?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And anyway, how does that work?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		So other governors have also had to do the same.
		So the way it works is, remember how I mentioned that the state agency sort of holds those files and have the contract with this EBT processor.
		The EBT processor can say the state agency can go to the EBT processor.
		We need to utilize a different type of funding.
		Remember, state agencies never, the state never touches the federal money.
		They never see it, which is why they haven't been able to tap into it.
		So if states have reserves, which many don't, and they're really looking and digging into finding other money to feed their families and their state, they can just, they will speak to their ABT processor who will manage it so that they can issue funds to those individuals.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And the idea of declaring a state of emergency, is that necessary in order to pay those funds?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Not necessarily, but governors have to act in their own way.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		It depends on their constitution.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's go overseas to England on the Republican line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Paul, you're on the air.
unidentified		Hi, Mimi.
		And I'm Ms. Aniji.
		Can I just say, what do you think people who can't eat can't afford to eat, have they got every basic right to eat?
		Do you think so, Ms. Nito?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Paul, I'll get to that question, but I just wanted to ask you about England and how that works.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		How does England handle food insecurity among its citizens?
unidentified		I said that certain benefits people have these days and they have a certain benefit to survive on.
		Food banks as well, of course, in Britain as well.
		They have food banks currently as SNAP in Medica.
		So they have a sort of food banks a year, I think.
		So I suppose.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Gina, he's asking if it's a basic right for people to eat.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		I think we can all agree that it's a basic right for people to be able to have access to food.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		And our country made that agreement in the 70s when it decided to span the program nationwide to ensure that families, children, and older adults, everyone in America had the right and the resources to eat in order for our country to be able to thrive and have a strong workforce.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Covington, Kentucky, Line for Democrats.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Mike, you're on with Gina Plato Nino.
unidentified		Yeah, I have three quick points.
		Number one, I think the Republicans, they're just trying to hold this money so that they can see how long it's going to take people to have to start losing grocery stores.
		Number two is that people that are diabetic, they have to have food to eat or they can't take their medicine.
		And number three, I don't think there's going to be a run on toilet paper because you got to eat to make turns.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Any comment, Gina, on the diabetics that need to eat?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		This is one, you know, unfortunately, the bill that you mentioned, the HR1, also got it.
		You know, billions of dollars from also Medicaid.
		Snap is the people on SNAP are less likely to be in the emergency room.
		They save an average of $2,000 a month in medical and medical issues because food, the worst health outcome is hunger.
		So when individuals don't have access to food, they go to the ER more, which increases state and federal costs in terms of when people visiting these places because they are not having their basic needs.
		And now it's even more dire because that bill also pretty much weakened the system for individuals to be able to access health care.
		So it's very important that the administration do its job and release those funds so that families can have the food that they need at the table.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Now, Gina, the Republican side, of course, is that they're saying if Democrats would just vote to pass a clean CR, then SNAP would be fully funded and we wouldn't have this problem anyway.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Does your organization take a position on whether or not that you advocate for one solution or another to the government's shutdown?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		We take a position that the Department of Agriculture can act the same way that it did for WIC, the same way that it's doing for Argentina, the same way that it's doing for certain special farmers, for them to utilize the contingency and reserve funds as in their authority.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		This has nothing to do with the shutdown in terms of the way that people are being held as political pieces, but ensuring that individuals are able to access what they need so they can tap into a contingency, they can tap into reserves, they don't need to wait for the government to reopen.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Dan in Glenside, Pennsylvania, Independent Line, you're on the air.
unidentified		Yeah, thanks.
		I'm with the Marine Corps League and everything.
		And when the holidays come up, we often have, we give out gift cards for supermarkets and stuff.
		And with the SNAP program, it's really putting a strain on our finances.
		Pre-COVID, we were able to maintain maybe a $25,000 balance.
		We're lucky if we can keep five, six, or $7,000 balance anymore.
		If there's anybody out there that wants to donate, we'd appreciate it.
		Thank you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And, Gina, your thoughts on if people want to help, how do they do that?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What's the best way for people to help?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		I can contact your state.
		Each state is different.
		They have set up different funds.
		Different philanthropic organizations are trying to work.
		I do know that food banks are overloaded.
		They have been overloaded since the pandemic.
		To put this burden on them to solve the solution is just, it's inhumane.
		It's not right.
		There's just not enough food and not enough people to be able to distribute this food.
		So I would say contact your local community, your state, your mayors to see which organizations are giving out those resources for people.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Jim, Republican, Wildwood, Florida, good morning.
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
		Again, I'd like to say good morning to all my Democrat communists out there that say no kings, no kings.
		And then all they want is governments become their God.
		I mean, they just be on end of health care, food.
		All these people that are out there marching around with their signs saying no kings.
		Take all that money.
		All you guys group together, start food pantries, eliminate the big, wasteful, out-of-control federal government.
		Why don't you just do that?
		And it's just unbelievable that people, you know, my brother lost his job back in the Rust Belt in 1982.
		He went out and found other work.
		It didn't pay as well.
		He lived with his means.
		Me and my wife worked our bust out our butts.
		We had two kids, not three or four.
		Plus, we have a father and a mother in the house.
		I'm sorry.
		You're lazy.
		You're a drunk.
		You do drugs.
		You don't go to school.
		You need to start stepping up.
		The federal government cannot provide everything for the American people.
		They got to take care of the big picture.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Jim, let's get a response.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Gina.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		You know, everyone's entitled to their opinion, but the facts don't lie.
		We do know that the reason why we're in this situation is that tax breaks for the billionaires of this country and high corporations is what's paying these, is what was exchanged in order to cut down Medicaid, in order to cut down SNAP.
		Like I said, majority, 80% of the households have individuals who are working.
		They are just not making enough because jobs are not out there.
		The gig economy is real.
		And if we really want to take that five-year-old and tell him that he's lazy because he's going to school and not having a job, then we really need to look at what our country is doing because people are working two to three jobs.
		And I can say this because as a legal services attorney for many years, I saw many clients who said, I'm just not making enough and I have to go through this incredibly burdensome process.
		It is a lot easier in this country to get a loan for half a million.
		It takes you 60 seconds to get pre-approved than it is for you to get SNAP.
		You have to jump through various hoops.
		Some applications take over an hour.
		You have to disclose so much information.
		And the people on this program are the most vulnerable Americans.
		There are veterans who have fought for our country, who don't have resources, who are living on the streets, and they have the right to be able to have food and the resources that they need like everyone else in America, not just billionaires and not just very wealthy corporations.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Jeffrey in West Virginia line for Democrats, you're next.
unidentified		Yes, I'm on the air.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you are.
unidentified		Yes, I'm from West Virginia.
		Like you said, there's a lot of rural counties down here.
		And I didn't know until I seen on TV that West Virginia is the number one state for SNAP benefits.
		And they just love Trump, but they love him, but don't even realize they're going to be affected the most.
		I'm not on SNAP, but when I did apply for SNAP, like the young lady just was saying, you guessed there, they want you to go through a bunch of hoops and hoops and fill out all this paperwork.
		And then when they said it was approved, they said $23.
		So I just said, forget about it.
		But I just hate to see what's going to happen if people don't get the stamps here in West Virginia.
		You think they're going to sit by and let their kids starve?
		Are they going to go into Walmart and Kroger's and start stealing?
		Thank you very much.
		But West Virginia is the number one state in the United States with SNAP benefits, and they love Trump.
		Have a nice day.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Gina, any comments on that?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		That's unfortunate that people have to be put in very dire situations.
		I do think, you know, again, individuals should look at what not, you know, I hate to say this because food pantries are really at capacity.
		And for every meal that a food pantry provides, SNAP provides nine.
		But I would say to the people in West Virginia, if they are number one for the president, call them and tell them that he has the power right now to tell the secretary to issue contingency and reserve funds so that they don't have to suffer.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Gina, I want to ask you about fraud in the SNAP program.
		Is it possible for somebody that's on the SNAP program to sell their card or to otherwise game the system?
		What are the big issues when it comes to fraud in SNAP?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		SNAP is one of the most rigorous programs, quality control.
		Like the gentleman before said, you have to go through so many hoops.
		They have one of the lowest percentage of fraud.
		When we do see it, the big fraud that we do see is something called skimming, is these criminals who have been stealing people's EBT numbers.
		And when people go to the grocery store and swipe their card, no money is there.
		And this has cost our country and states billions and billions of dollars because the EBT cards don't have a chip like our credit cards do, where like people can't just steal that information.
		And once those monies are stolen, they're not given back.
		There was an opportunity this past December to ensure that individuals will get money back that had been stolen from them.
		But Elon Musk put in a tweet, don't do it.
		And so the whole omnibus that was being discussed sort of fell through the ground.
		And so now individuals who are being victims of this fraud, of this skimming, criminals across the country stealing their benefits of these vulnerable Americans have no recourse.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's David in Chadbourne, North Carolina, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, David.
unidentified		Good morning, Mimi.
		Good morning, Ms. President.
		I just, I got a couple questions.
		The first thing is I knew an elderly person.
		She was a widow, and she was getting assistance from food stamps.
		She was getting $15 a month.
		And she was drawing Social Security off of her husband.
		And her monthly living from that was like $560.
		So she's getting $15 a month, food stamps, $560 From the social security program.
		And I'm seeing other people getting $2,000.
		Young people, and this woman was in her 80s.
		And so, my question is: how does that work?
		And how does that justify?
		I understand there's a lot of paperwork you got to fill out, but how do they come to that conclusion?
		And then also, my second question, Minnie, you touched on it earlier, was fraud.
		I'm sure that there's fraud in that system.
		And I was just wondering, what are what kind of, what do you guys do, Ms. Flatanina?
		What kind of actions do y'all take to ensure how proactive are you to ensure there's no fraud in that system?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		David, go ahead, Gina.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		So I think that was a two-part question.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Was it about the amount that the individual was getting?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		How is it determined how much you get for each month?
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		So again, it depends on the state.
		And some states have something called categorical eligibility that allows, for example, older adults or people with disabilities that they can claim up to 200% of their income, but the net income has to be 130% for the most part, which again, it is very low.
		When I say 100%, it's very low.
		It's the poorest of the poorest.
		And so it depends on what your wages you bring in, whether it's through Social Security or whether you are working.
		And that is calculated based then also on what are your expenses.
		So that's why no SNAP benefit in no case is ever the same, because my circumstances may be very different than your circumstances.
		So they look how much I pay for, you know, if I'm paying utilities, how much I pay for rent.
		And so when you do, if I have medical expenses, if I'm an older adult, if I have disabilities, they look at all of those expenses deductions and then they come up with the number that individuals get.
		But like I said, on average, it is about less than $6 a day.
		And yes, for the most part, older adults who are receiving Social Security get very little, as you can tell, even if they are getting Social Security, because you really have to have very low income in order to receive SNAP benefits.
		And then the second question is: we are working incredibly hard with at the state and at the federal level, trying to call on elective officials to pit the chip cards that we mentioned.
		And like I said, this is the most rigorous, quality controlled program that there is.
		And we're just trying to make sure that it's strengthened to protect individuals as well.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, that's Gina Plata Nino, interim SNAP director at the Food Research and Action Center.
		You can find them online at FRAC.org.
		Gina, thanks so much for joining us today.
gina plata-nino ▲ ● ▼		Thank you for having us.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Next up on Washington Journal, we'll talk with Paragon Health Institute President Brian Blaise about health care and the expiring Affordable Care Act subsidies.
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		We'll be right back in September, 1975, 17 days apart, two women, one in Sacramento and the other in San Francisco, attempted to assassinate President Gerald Ford.
		The first attempt on September the 5th came from Lynette Squeaky Fromm, the Charles Manson follower, spent over 30 years in prison, is out on parole, and is 76 years old.
		The other attempt came on the non-entrance side of St. Francis Hotel in San Francisco on September the 24th, 1975.
		The shooter, Sarah Jane Moore, served 32 years in prison and died almost 50 years to the day on September the 24th, 2025.
		Author Jerry Spieler wrote the book Housewife Assassin in 2009.
		She talked to and exchanged letters with Ms. Moore on several occasions.
		Here's her up-to-date story about the woman who tried to kill President Ford.
unidentified		Author Jerry Spieler, with her book, Housewife Assassin, The Woman Who Tried to Kill President Ford, on this episode of BookNotes Plus with our host, Brian Lamb.
		Book Notes Plus is available wherever you get your podcasts and on the C-SPAN Now app.
		In his book, The Great River, Boyce Upholt talks about the history and geography of the Mississippi River.
		And Sunday, on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A, he discusses how government-built infrastructures have transformed the landscape and ecosystem, and in turn, how the Mississippi has affected the population living along its banks.
boyce upholt ▲ ● ▼		I often talk about the Mississippi River being essentially a forgotten river at this point, right?
		We know the name and we know about Mark Twain.
		And most of us think of it as being this economic thing where we know there are big boats out there, but people don't know what it looks like, don't know how beautiful it is, don't realize that it is an iconic landscape.
		It's as beautiful as Yellowstone or Yosemite in my mind.
unidentified		Boyce Upholt with his book, The Great River, Sunday night at 8 Eastern on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A. You can listen to Q&A and all of our podcasts on our free C-SPAN Now app.
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		Join us for remarkable coast-to-coast coverage, celebrating our nation's journey like no other network can.
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		And pass president nomination.
		Why are you doing this?
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		Fridays, C-SPAN presents a rare moment of unity.
		Ceasefire, where the shouting stops and the conversation begins.
		Politico Playbook chief correspondent and White House Bureau Chief Dasha Burns is host of Ceasefire, bringing two leaders from opposite sides of the aisle into a dialogue.
		Ceasefire on the network that doesn't take sides.
		Fridays at 7 and 10 p.m. Eastern and Pacific, only on C-SPAN.
		Washington Journal continues.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Joining us now to talk about the expiring ACA enhanced subsidies is Brian Blaise.
		He's president of Paragon Health Institute.
		He was former White House National Economic Council policy advisor under the Trump administration.
		Brian, welcome to the program.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, Mimi.
unidentified		Great to be here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Just if you could tell us about Paragon Health Institute, your mission, and your funding.
unidentified		Sure.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Paragon has been around now for just about four years.
		We are focused on evaluating how government health care programs are working and designing solutions that empower patients and inject competition, really get at a lot of the bad incentives that emanate from government programs.
		We are a nonprofit, so we are funded by a pretty broad set of individuals and foundations, and we do not accept any corporate funding.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So we're one month into the government shutdown.
		The ACA enhanced subsidies are at the center of that funding impasse.
		What do you want to see happen to those subsidies?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think those enhanced subsidies have led to enormous problems and that Congress should allow them to expire.
		They have one, they're very expensive.
		Keeping them would be over $40 billion a year in cost.
		They're also very inflationary.
		They put upward pressure on health care prices and premiums.
		They have led to enormous fraud in the Obamacare program.
		And they are payments that go directly to health insurance companies.
		And I think it's really important to know for the vast majority of enrollees in Obamacare, they are covered by the original subsidies.
		Those subsidies don't expire.
		And for the vast majority of them, they will have access to a health insurance plan for less than $75 a month.
		And the government will be covering the majority, the vast majority of the cost, again, for the vast majority of enrollees.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So as far as the estimates on how much premiums will go up, what are you thinking as far as how much they'll go up if these enhanced subsidies are done away with or expire?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So there's two ways to think about it.
		There's a percentage premium increase.
		There's also just what the raw premium increase is.
		Because of these enhanced subsidies and because there's been very lax income verification, about half of the entire market now has a fully subsidized plan.
		So the enrollees aren't paying anything for it.
		That's been the main driver of this tremendous amount of improper enrollment and fraud.
		And really a lot of people that don't use their health plan for anything.
		So for most of those individuals that are now paying zero, they will go from paying anything between $10 and $60 a month for their coverage.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Based on their income, you mean?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That would be based on income?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So the subsidy is a function of income.
		So the lower income enrollees receive a greater government subsidy.
		The vast majority of Obamacare enrollees are low income.
		75% of them are below 250% of the poverty line.
		Now, 250% of the poverty line is about $40,000 for an individual, but they receive giant subsidies, and those subsidies are part of the original Obamacare law.
		They're not going to go away.
		So for the average enrollee in that category, once these enhanced subsidies expire, the government is still going to be picking up 70 to 90% of the premium.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Now, you said that these subsidies go to the health insurance companies.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Explain how that works, because I thought the subsidies were tax credits for the individual.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, so thank you for that question.
		So the subsidies, it's complicated.
		People estimate their income and the subsidy amount is a function of their estimated income.
		So I'm going to right now, we have the 2026 open enrollment.
		I'm going to estimate my income for 2026.
		I'm going to get a subsidy amount that's based on that estimated income.
		But every month that I'm enrolled, the government is sending a check to the health insurance company on my behalf.
		So this goes directly to the health insurance company.
		At the end of the year, when I file my taxes, so in the spring of 2027, there's a reconciliation process and the amount that was advanced to the insurer is then reconciled with the amount that should have been advanced to the insurer.
		And there might be an overpayment.
		There might be an underpayment.
		But there's tremendous opportunities for gaming here because if the insurer receives too much money, in many cases, The government says, okay, the insurer can keep the excess money.
		We'll either write it off, which happens a lot, or we'll go after the individual for any overage.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian Blaise of Paragon Institute is with us to talk about ACA and the expiring enhanced subsidies.
		If you'd like to ask him a question, you can go ahead and call us now.
		Democrats are on 202-748-8000.
		Republicans 202-748-8001.
		And Independents 202-748-8002.
		If you're on the ACA, if you're insured through the Affordable Care Act, we'd really like to hear from you as well and hear about your experience.
		We have a line set aside for you that is 202-748-8003.
		That's the same line you can use for texting us your comments as well.
		Brian, who qualifies for the ACA?
		How does it work?
		Who is typically on the ACA as opposed to other types of insurance?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Great question.
		So the Affordable Care Act had two parts of its coverage expansion.
		So we're not talking about people that have employer-sponsored insurance, which is most people get their insurance through their employer.
		We're not talking about Medicare.
		We're also not talking about Medicaid, even though the Obamacare, the Affordable Care Act, contained a massive expansion of the Medicaid program.
		What we're talking about is the individual market for health insurance.
		So this is generally people that are of working age who don't get coverage through their employer and who don't qualify for a government program.
		So the Obamacare significantly impacted the individual market.
		It contained a host of regulations.
		So it required insurance to cover procedures, to cover conditions that it didn't have to cover in the past or where there was flexibility around.
		It contained regulations on how that insurance could be priced.
		And all of that increased the price of individual market health insurance.
		Now, in order to make the market work, there was an individual mandate, which was a tax penalty on people who didn't buy the required coverage.
		And there was a set of large subsidies, which were largest for lower income enrollees.
		So Obamacare launched in 2014, significant premium increases in the individual market.
		And really, the individual mandate proved to be ineffective.
		It didn't bring a lot of people into the market.
		So it was one of the sort of big thoughts of what was important for the Affordable Care Act, which played out very different in reality.
		That individual mandate penalty was eliminated in 2019, and it didn't affect the market at all.
		What really is the underlying characteristic of the market is it is enrollment was very low and it was only people who received really giant subsidies or people that expected expensive medical conditions to enroll.
		That was the state until 2020.
		In 2021, the Congressional Democrats used reconciliation and they passed an extension, an enhancement of the subsidies.
		So it increased the generosity of the subsidies and it lifted a cap that had existed at four times the poverty line.
		In 2022, the Democrats and the Inflation Reduction Act, again using reconciliation, so there were no Republican votes for the enhanced subsidies ever.
		They extended those enhanced subsidies through 2025.
		So that's the issue that's before us right now is that the Democrats, they set this subsidies to expire, the enhanced subsidies to expire after 2025.
		And the question is, you know, is that going to happen or not?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Now, the argument is that a lot of people are going to be priced out of the Affordable Care Act if those enhanced subsidies are allowed to expire.
		How many uninsured Americans are there in the country currently?
		How many do you expect will lose health insurance coverage if these subsidies were to expire?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So there are approximately between 20 and 25 million people without health insurance now in the U.S.
		Now, a lot of them qualify for a subsidized coverage but don't enroll, actually the vast majority, or they're unauthorized immigrants.
		According to CBO, if the under current law, so current law has these expanded subsidies expiring, there'd be about 3.5 million fewer people with health insurance.
		But I would caveat that number and say, you know, one of the things that we have found in our research is there are tremendous numbers of these Obamacare enrollees that didn't use their health plan for anything.
		So 35% of all Obamacare enrollees in 2024 didn't use their plan a single time.
		No doctor visit, no prescription, no lab test.
		And what you have is the insurer sending the large, or the government sending the large subsidies to the insurer on behalf of, on an annualized basis, 8 million people that didn't use their health plan a single time.
		So the number of people who would lose their insurance is less than half the number of people that don't use the plan for anything.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's talk to callers.
		We'll start with Ron in West Chesterfield, New Hampshire, Democrat.
		Good morning, Ron.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Good morning, Mr. Blaze.
		I'm honored to get to speak with you this morning.
		I have a couple of questions and a comment here.
		I'm wondering, you know, seeing these two segments back to back, one about the SNAP and now about the ACA, it really kind of puts in perspective what's kind of going on here.
		The mass public, the general public, needs some kind of health care.
		They need some kind of food security because not everybody can take care of that on their own.
		My neighbor for SNAP, he was a veteran, but he's 78 years old, can't get out, you know, so he has meals on wheels delivered.
		That's part of SNAP.
		And with the ACA, I mean, what really is the Republicans' plan for health care for our general masses?
		Just if you get sick and you can't afford your medication, you can't afford your operation, die.
		You know, that's their plan, that's their health care plan.
		You know, if there's a problem with these things, if there's a problem with SNAP, if there's a problem with ACA, my gosh, fix the problem.
		But don't kick everybody off their insurance.
		You know, it's hard.
		And people that don't use their insurance are probably afraid to go to the hospital unless they absolutely need it.
		That's my deal.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So Ron, let's get a response.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian Blaze, go ahead.
unidentified		Hey, Ron.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		It's honored to talk to you this morning as well.
		So on the sort of first comment on SNAP and ACA, I mean, I think the question is, what kind of safety net should we have?
		And unfortunately, a lot of these programs, and we just did, we've spent a lot of time earlier this year working on the Medicaid program.
		And the Medicaid program is the biggest welfare, the social safety net program, and it has lost its way.
		It no longer focuses on serving the most vulnerable.
		Is largely geared towards advantaging able-bodied working-age adults with much higher payments on behalf of them.
		And really, there's so much corporate welfare in the program where big insurers and big hospital systems are profiting from a welfare program to just an excessive degree.
		And it has turned the idea of a safety net program to protect the most vulnerable upside down.
		What's a Republican plan?
		I will tell you what I think the free market health plan should be.
		The first principle is to remove government policies that distort the market and that protect inefficient incumbents and increase prices.
		And there are so many government policies largely that emanate from what Medicare does, but also within the tax code that we need to significantly reform.
		I think we need to expand choice for Americans.
		They should have more options for how to finance their health care and they should have more control.
		The American patient only controls about 10% of the spending in health care.
		The vast majority is controlled by government bureaucracies and by intermediaries like health insurance companies.
		And so you have a healthcare system that is designed to serve the intermediaries and not the patient.
		And the third, I think we need to seriously think about how government subsidizes health care.
		And I'll bring this back to the ACA.
		We are subsidizing the health insurance industry.
		These are giant subsidies that go directly to health insurers.
		And then the theory is some of this is going to trickle down to the patient.
		I think what we need to do is say, yeah, we're going to subsidize health care for lower-income Americans and those who are the most vulnerable.
		But let's figure out how to do it in a rational way where the patient has control.
		And I'm a big fan of trying to figure out how we can redirect subsidies away from funding the system to funding the patient.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We've got a tweet for you that says, sorry, this is a text from Steve in Tampa.
		Please ask Mr. Blaze if the subsidy should be sent directly to the individual's health savings account based upon their projected income rather than going to the insurance companies.
		This would allow the participants of ACA to use the subsidy as needed.
		What do you think of that?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Well, I love that question.
		So thank you.
		And it allows me to mention Paragons.
		Our first policy paper that we produced in the summer of 2022 was called the HSA option.
		And this would take a portion of the Obamacare subsidies.
		It's called the Cost Sharing Reduction Program.
		And that program sends subsidies to the insurer for the insurer to reduce deductibles and co-payment amounts.
		And we want to give enrollees the option to take an equivalent subsidy amount under their control as an HSA.
		But I think fundamentally, I thoroughly agree with that caller that we need to figure out how to fund the patient and empower them through things like health savings accounts rather than again just directing all of this money towards the healthcare industry.
		One of the problems with directing, there's a lot of problems with directing the money to the healthcare industry, but they focus on lobbying and they spend so much of their resources not on creating value for patients, but on trying to secure the most political power to get their way with where this money goes and to restrict the competition that they face.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Cynthia is in Sacramento, California, and she is on the Affordable Care Act.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Cynthia.
unidentified		Yes, hello.
		Hi.
		My bill is going to go from $423 to $723 as CIS tax credit goes away.
		This big, ugly bill that President Trump has, he's funding millionaires and billionaires.
		And then you're saying that you're funding the insurance companies.
		And if there's an overage, you're willing to send the amount, the extra amount to the patient.
		Okay, what if people are on fixed income and the insurance company is being charged this excess money and can use it as a write-off?
		I mean, these CEOs are making a ton of money off of us and they're laughing all the way to the bank while these people are suffering.
		So what is that going to do to people like me that is on a fixed income?
		If my bill goes from 423 to 723, these CEOs are laughing all the way to the bank while I'm out here scrounging.
		So what's going to happen while this big, ugly bill is just fixed to take care of?
		And I'm sorry, people like you, because you're a president, so I know you're making a ton of money in what you're doing.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So Cynthia, let me ask you: are you going to be able to absorb that change, the extra $300 per month for your health care?
unidentified		I don't know.
		No.
		I don't know what I'm going to do.
		I don't know.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		I got to figure that out.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian, your response.
unidentified		Yes.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So the one big, beautiful bill.
		So a couple of things.
		And Cynthia, I am sorry for the situation that you face and the rising premiums.
		The one big beautiful bill has nothing to do really with this part of the ACA debate.
		What the One Big Beautiful bill did was really protect the programs, restrict eligibility or enrollment to those who were eligible.
		And then it made a host of important reforms on the Medicaid side to protect the program for the most vulnerable and to get at the corporate welfare.
		You mentioned CEOs laughing.
		I would say they are all like, if we want to reduce health care prices and health care costs, generally we should do the opposite of what the healthcare industry is lobbying for.
		And they are lobbying very hard to continue these enhanced subsidies.
		They're doing that because they know that leads to higher health care prices, higher health care spending, and higher profits for them.
		The ACA is a fundamentally flawed program.
		You've got 35% of the enrollees that made zero claims, many of whom had no idea they were enrolled because of fraudulent actions by unscrupulous brokers and agents that were able to maximize commissions and maximize enrollment because they were able to get so many people signed up and not have them pay any of the cost.
		And then you also have a lot of fraud on the high end, which is driven by this combination of the Obamacare regulations that don't give insurers incentives to reduce health care spending.
		Actually, one of the key distorting Obamacare regulations is called the medical loss ratio.
		And that caps, effectively caps insurer profits at a portion of the premiums that they collect in, which means they can only get more profits when premiums go up and spending goes up.
		So we have a very inflationary structure.
		I think we need to stop subsidizing a total of a fundamentally flawed structure and look at reforms.
		And I think reforms are built on, again, deregulating and empowering patients.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Gay in Pumpton Lakes, New Jersey, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Gay.
unidentified		Good morning.
		With all due respect, the gentleman from New Hampshire really took away my thunder.
		But the point I want to make here is that rhetoric rules supreme.
		Why was the ACA put in effect to begin with?
		Well, it was because millions upon millions of working people did not work for companies that provided health care.
		They were working every single day with no health insurance.
		So the ACA came into effect to help those people with a subsidy.
		It also took away pre-existing conditions that exempted people from getting, or the rates were so high they couldn't afford health insurance.
		So the ACA helped with that.
		In addition, it allowed parents, working people, to keep their children on their health care for up to 20 age of 26.
		We've got to get away from rhetoric.
		This gentleman, for all due respect, is owned by a private equity.
		What does that say?
		That says profit.
		And once you put profit into health care, poor people are going to die, really.
		And I like his answers.
		Sure.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Brian Blaise.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So again, I'll say Paragon does not take any corporate funding.
		And actually, most of the corporations are opposing in opposition to the policies that the Paragon is supporting on health care reform because we're trying to take on the establishment and inject competition and innovation into the healthcare sector.
		The caller raises that there were problems with health care before Obamacare.
		And that's true.
		Like there were problems with Obamacare.
		There were a lot of good intentions behind Obamacare.
		And it was America since World War II has really been built, our health insurance has been built on employer provided coverage.
		And that has some benefits, but it also has some drawbacks.
		When people, it's the health insurance is the only major financial product that the employer purchases on our behalf.
		And that is not a gift from the employer.
		That is out of what would be worker wages.
		So we have a construct where the employer just has so much control.
		And people that didn't have employer sponsor insurance, many of them had, they had an individual market for health insurance coverage.
		If people did have pre-existing conditions, there was an issue with some of them not being able to get coverage.
		My problem is that Democrats in 2009 blew up that they over-exaggerated the severity of that problem.
		And then they created a very complicated construct to address that problem.
		And that complicated construct has now, we're 10 years, we're 12 years into this.
		We know that there's significant problems.
		The cost, the Washington Post said the problem with Obama, the Affordable Care Act is it was never affordable, right?
		It was sold as it was going to lower family health insurance premiums by $2,500.
		Health insurance premiums have soared, deductibles have soared, and a lot of the coverage doesn't cover the best doctors and hospitals in regions.
		So the program is fundamentally flawed, and it is time to stop just pouring bad money after good money and propping up a program that doesn't deserve more taxpayer money.
		Instead, we should think: how can we reform it, expand options, and best use the taxpayer dollars?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And can you talk a little bit more, Brian, about what you mean by these free market approaches, how you would like to reform healthcare in this country?
		You talked about expanding choice, but how does that work?
		A choice of what?
		A choice of companies?
		I mean, if they're all expensive and people can't afford it, it doesn't matter how many choices we have.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So one thing we need to do is expand options outside of the ACA.
		So, for example, when my family moved to Florida about five years ago, we were covered by a short-term limited duration plan.
		So, short-term limited duration insurance are products that are not subject to Obamacare regulation.
		So, they're much more flexible and they're much more affordable.
		And my family was able to get a short-term plan, and we paid about a third the premium that we would pay for an Obamacare plan for a plan that covered far more doctors and providers in our area.
		Now, unfortunately, the Biden administration restricted the ability of my family and other families to purchase products that are free from a lot of the under free from the underlying Obamacare regulation.
		So, we need less regulated health insurance options for people to purchase.
		We also need more options for employers.
		So, the Trump administration did something called Association Health Plans, which enabled small businesses to join together and offer health insurance and gain some of the economies of scale that larger employers receive.
		I mean, another thing that the Trump administration did, which it's sort of the thing I was most proud of for my time in the Trump administration, was move away from the model where the employer has to select the plan for all their workers to a model where the employer provides a contribution.
		And then the employee takes that contribution, which is tax preferred, and buys a plan in the individual market.
		So, right now, an Obamacare plan that works best for them.
		Really, we just need to allow the market to innovate and develop products that make sense and that provide value to people.
		And when you have a strict set of government rules, you prevent the supply side of the market from innovating in a way that will provide consumers with more value.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, here's Howard, Indianapolis, Indiana, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Howard.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Yes, my wife has ACA insurance coverage.
		And in terms of public policy, I have to say health care is the most frustrating public policy issue, in my opinion.
		This gentleman here seems very bright, and I appreciate what he does.
		But I'm very discouraged by the fact that he's connected to a nonprofit health institute.
		Yet, all of this discussion has been about a financial instrument, and that is insurance.
		Healthcare is not an insurable product, it is an essential resource.
		This whole complex model of insurance-based coverage is just ridiculous.
		I don't understand why this gentleman isn't advocating for a single-payer health care system where every American has a right to health care.
ted fraley ▲ ● ▼		And this government is the richest country in the world's history.
ted fraley ▲ ● ▼		All of our, we have the currency of our country as a fiat currency where we can promote legislation through our Congress, Senate, and have the president approve the treasurer issuing funds sufficient to fund anything we want for health care.
unidentified		So we get out of having to charge individuals.
unidentified		So in my view, there would never be a charge to an individual for health care.
kristi noem ▲ ● ▼		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Let's get a response, Brian, on single-payer health care.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So first of all, we don't have a free market for health care.
		We have nothing close to a free market for health care.
		I wish we would move more in the direction of a free market for healthcare.
		I encourage the caller and viewers to look at, it's produced from AI.
		It's called the Chart of the Century.
		And what it does is it starts at 2000, it goes to 2025, and it shows price changes over time for major sectors of the economy.
		And then it shows inflation and it shows wage growth.
		And you want to know the main area that we've seen the price inflation over the last 25 years, it's healthcare, specifically hospital prices.
		Hospital prices have risen more than three times faster than inflation since 2000, and other medical care is right behind it.
		The problem is, and the other fastest growing part, price part, is education.
		What are the two areas where government is most involved in?
		It is healthcare and it is education.
		When government comes in, it does so with good intentions, but it also comes in with a whole bunch of regulations and then a whole bunch of financial instruments and subsidies.
		And it has the reason that healthcare is so expensive is because the government is so involved with the healthcare sector.
		If we want to get health care less expensive, we have to reduce the government policies that have so distorted the market.
		I think I agree with the caller on the criticism, some criticism of health insurance.
		I think people should have health insurance.
		I think health insurance, health insurance should be more insurance where it is protection from low probability but high cost medical expenses and where you have a pool of individuals, many of whom will not need significant health care services in the coverage period, but some of whom will, and they share risk.
		That is a, we do that in so many other parts of our finances.
		We do it from homeowners insurance, auto insurance, life insurance, health insurance, it makes sense as well.
		Unfortunately, health insurance now, we funnel every payment that we make in healthcare through health insurance.
		And that raises administrative costs, burdens, separates the consumer from the provider, and just leads to a host of distortions.
		And one of the central problems with Obamacare is it mandated this inefficient health insurance design in the individual market.
		And that's what I think people need freedom from, is that one size fits all inefficient health insurance design.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Floyd is on the independent line in Fredericksburg, Indiana.
		Welcome, Floyd.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Two weeks ago tomorrow, at the end of one of your open forums, an insurance agent came on.
		He said he's a licensed insurance agent.
		And he said in Colorado, there is an omni-selection that you can get on.
		And illegals, non-citizens can get on and can get silver ACA, which is a no-cost insurance.
		And it's a secure site that the government can't get in and see what's going on.
		He said there's about 7,600 people on there that are illegals.
		And I wish you could find that clip and play it, but it's at the end of the last call on one of your open forums.
		It would be two weeks ago tomorrow that it was called in.
		So I guess there's some proof out there that the illegals still do get ACA in certain situations.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Floyd, you said illegal immigrants, but you also said non-citizens.
		Are you saying that those are the same thing?
		Because there's permanent legal residents that are not American citizens that do qualify for the ACA.
unidentified		Yeah, illegal citizens can get on there.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Illegal.
unidentified		Okay.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian, comment on that.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So there were provisions in the One Big Beautiful bill that restricted Medicaid and ACA plans to U.S. citizens and certain categories of lawful residents and it prevented Medicaid spending for illegal, unauthorized immigrants.
		This was one of the key things that came up actually in like the first week of the shutdown was a back and forth over because the Democrats proposed repealing all of the provisions, the health provisions of the One Big Beautiful Bill.
		And it does turn out the federal government does subsidize health care for unauthorized immigrants.
		And the One Big Beautiful Bill took steps to reduce that level of subsidization.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian, let's drill down a little bit on that because Democrats are saying that that's not true, that illegal immigrants, undocumented immigrants are not qualified in any case for Medicaid or ACA.
		The question is, the One Big Beautiful bill took Medicaid away from some documented immigrants, including refugees, asylas, parolees.
		Those survivors of human trafficking as well, those would lose their protections of either Medicaid or ACA.
		Is that correct?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, so when I'm talking about unauthorized immigrants and the OBPP, the One Big Beautiful Bill reforms, I'm talking about two different provisions.
		One is for emergency services in Medicaid expansion stage, which is most states, unauthorized immigrants were, the federal government was reimbursing 90% of their expense, which is much higher than the expense that it was reimbursing for traditional enrollees, so pregnant women, children, people with disabilities.
		So really, that disparity is immoral and makes no sense.
		And the One Big Beautiful bill ended that disparity so that the federal government wasn't paying higher reimbursement rate for health care services for unauthorized immigrants in the emergency room.
		The second, and this gets into, and Paragon did a paper called Addressing Medicaid Money Laundering.
		So it's a bit complicated, but states design schemes where they can give the appearance of an expenditure, and then they submit that basically as an invoice to the federal government, and the federal government reimburses states.
		So, the state of California designed one of these schemes.
		They were able to get like $15 billion of federal money for free with no state expenditure.
		And the very next year, they expanded Medicaid to all unauthorized immigrants in the state.
		So, that was using federal funds for unauthorized immigrants, Medicaid.
		The One Big Beautiful bill restricted that money laundering scheme that states were deploying.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And it also restricts any non-legal permanent residents from getting onto Medicaid and the ACA.
		So, refugees, as I mentioned, asylees, parolees, survivors of human trafficking.
		That's correct.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		I think it is most categories of legal non-citizens are not eligible.
		I don't know all the categories.
		I know there are some exceptions.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Daryl in Shepherdsville, Kentucky, Republican line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Darrell.
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Yes, I listened to a gentleman here about a while ago about these immigrants coming here in the United States.
		He left one thing out.
		See, the government is still down, and the Democrats want to spend $1.5 trillion on them.
		$200 billion for medical health care for them.
		And American people have to suffer with the consequences right now because some of them can't get health care.
		President Trump has lowered down our prescription for all American people.
		And that's why this gentleman right here is not helping the American people.
		He's making it worse.
		I think that the Democrat is holding it over our heads.
		And the people right there, they're suffering right now because of his health care.
		It's in their bill of the Democrats.
		And we're trying to get things rolling for Republicans.
		That's all I got to say.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Brian Blaise's last comment.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		So the original continuing resolution that the Senate Democrats put forward, and I think the one they continue to put forward, would repeat, so it would extend the temporary COVID era subsidies, enhanced subsidies that we spent most of the time talking about.
		That's about a $400 billion cost.
		And then they would repeal all the health care provisions in the One Big Beautiful Bill.
		So that's about a $1.1 trillion cost.
		So that's where the caller got the $1.5 trillion.
		Now, he also mentioned $200 billion.
		So there was a White House report that was put out that said that the One Big Beautiful bill provisions reduced federal health care spending on non-citizens, including unauthorized immigrants, by $200 billion.
		So if the Democrats were successful and repealed those provisions of the One Big Beautiful Bill, we would be expanding federal health care spending on the unauthorized immigrants and non-citizens.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And those numbers that you cited are for over 10 years, correct, Brian?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
		Over 10 years.
		And that's what we do for Washington: use the 10-year budget window.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, that's Brian Blaise.
		He is president of Paragon Health Institute.
		You can find more on them at paragoninstitute.org.
		Thanks so much for joining us.
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We're wrapping up today's program with Open Forum.
		So if you'd like to give us a call and share your thoughts, you can do so right now.
		Democrats are on 202-748-8000.
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		And Independents 202-748-8002.
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unidentified		Why are you doing this?
brian blase ▲ ● ▼		This is outrageous.
unidentified		This is a kangaroo.
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mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back to Washington Journal.
		We are in open forum.
		Looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
		We'll take your calls shortly.
		But first, I wanted to let you know that right after this program, in about 25 minutes, we'll have Ceasefire.
		And this week, we have Democratic Congressman Scott Peters of California and Utah Republican Senator John Curtis.
		They discuss the government shutdown, the future of health care, and ongoing foreign policy challenges.
		We'll also hear from Democratic strategist Anna Greenberg and Republican strategist Brendan Buck, who unpacked some of the top stories of the week, including President Trump's recent overseas trip to Asia.
		That is coming up later this morning right at 10 o'clock a.m. Eastern right here on C-SPAN.
		So the calls now to Brent in Cedro Woolley, Washington, Democrat.
unidentified		Hi, thank you for taking my call.
		I was originally calling about the ACA, but anyway, I'll just change that because your guest is gone.
		I would like to just point this question towards basically all you Republicans.
		You know, we have seen weeks and months of ICE abusing people, beating people up, just all sorts of cruelty going on.
		Now, my question for all you Republicans, you know, that are always calling in and blaming going all the way back to Obama or Biden or whatever.
		Do you feel good about yourselves now?
		How is your life better?
		How is your life better watching all this cruelty being inflicted?
		Is it better because maybe your dark heart has gotten darker or just what has gotten better with your lives?
		Tell me that.
		Just call in one thing.
		Tell me one thing that has actually gotten better since we're beating up Mexicans and being cruel to human beings.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Brent.
		And on Thursday, it was Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker who had asked the Department of Homeland Security to suspend or pause immigration operations in Chicago over the Halloween weekend, which is this weekend.
		Here's a portion of what he said, and then the response from Secretary Christy Noam.
jb pritzker ▲ ● ▼		The Department of Homeland Security claims their highest priority is to protect children.
		So today I have to ask them, please live up to those ideals.
		I've sent a letter to Christy Noam and to the Department of Homeland Security leadership asking them to pause all of their federal agent operations for the entirety of the Halloween weekend.
unidentified		I'm asking for basic human decency.
unidentified		I think their response will be revealing.
jb pritzker ▲ ● ▼		They've disrupted everything for more than two months already.
		Give the children and the families of Illinois a break.
		To Donald Trump and Christy Noam, show us this is about something other than you just causing mayhem on our streets and visiting cruelty upon our people.
kristi noem ▲ ● ▼		We're absolutely not willing to put on pause any work that we will do to keep communities safe.
		The fact that Governor Pritzker is asking for that is shameful and I think unfortunate that he doesn't recognize how important the work is that we do to make sure we're bringing criminals to justice and getting them off our streets, especially when we're going to send all of our kiddos out on the streets and going to events and enjoying the holiday season.
		We want to make sure that they're safe.
		And if you see even up here, we have individuals that we've picked up off the streets with our ICE officers and CBP officers that have assault against a child, child pedophiles, rapes.
		Those individuals don't deserve to be on our streets and we're certainly not going to let our kids be victimized by them.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Back to the calls now to Russell, Tempe, Arizona, Independent.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Russell.
unidentified		Hey, good morning.
		I just wanted to say thank you for what you guys do.
		You do a great job.
		From what I've seen, just, and I don't study a ton of this, but social media really has us turning on each other quite a bit.
		And even in the past week, there's probably been six to eight stories where it's complete fabrications on both sides.
		And it'll have 10,000, 20,000 people cheering it on or hating each other and stuff like that.
		And I wonder, you know, when do we get to that point where we realize we're being played?
		And it is from both sides, because I could say, you know, there's problems with both sides of this aisle right now, and we're caught in the middle.
		And, you know, with being told news is so fake, the last passion I think we have is journalists and teams of researchers.
		And I think people need to get back to that and maybe get offline and try to find their way back to trusting news organizations again.
		And that's why I'm so glad of what you guys do because you do represent both sides.
		But I fear that we are being pushed against each other.
		And most people, whether I disagree or agree with them online, we never talk about it in person.
		And I think we need to create that dialogue in person.
		And I just wonder how do we get back to that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Russell, and this is James, Canton, Ohio, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		How are you this morning?
		Good.
		I want to thank you for having Mr. Blaze on.
		But I'm a disabled veteran.
		I get 40% disability.
		I was forced into retirement three years ago.
		I'm only 66.
		But now the government is sending me things from the VA.
		They're trying to get some money back.
		They're trying to send me an unemployment form.
		What was your last three jobs?
		Why did you leave?
		Did you quit?
		Were you fired?
		I'm a disabled and service connected.
		But yet, Trump is trying to get money back from me.
		Now, I'm a Republican since 18.
		Like I said, I'm 66.
		And they're not doing nothing for me.
		And my wife's on her fourth cancer.
		They ain't helped me at all.
		My rent went up 50 bucks.
		I got a $47 increase.
		And then they cut our food, our SNAP benefits from $126 to $23.
		What is fair about that?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Why did your SNAP benefits go down, James?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Did anything change in your situation?
unidentified		No, ma'am.
		I got a $50 rent increase, but I got $47 on my Social Security from $1,483 to $1,550 because I got a $47 increase.
		And my rent went up $50.
		They cut us by $100 on our SNAP because you make too much money.
		And my wife hasn't worked in 14, 15 years.
		She's on her fourth cancer.
		But they said that's the government rules now.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And what are you going to do about food, James?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Do you have enough on your EBT to get through for the next few weeks?
unidentified		No, I don't.
		They cut me to $23 a month.
		How does two people supposed to survive?
		She hasn't worked in almost 15 years.
		I'm trying to live on $2,200 a month, $500 a month for this, $200 a month for gas, $200 a month for electric.
		No phone.
		I don't have it.
		I don't have a free phone from the government.
		I can't afford it.
		I got a landline through the TV.
		You just, you can't afford it.
		And then you go ahead and ask for help.
		Well, you make too much money.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, James.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Staying in Ohio to Babberton is Diane, Line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Mimi, and thank you for C-Spam.
		I'm just wondering the whole point of why the Democrats are holding out, and thankfully that they are, is because now they got to choose between food and medical care.
		Medical care is so important.
		Why doesn't anyone else listen?
		And another thing is, when it came to Trump's administration, the only one I see doing anything to help people of low income is Dr. Oz, because he has found rich people who are like an example.
		This one gentleman said that he had four nursing homes that were paid for.
		He didn't own any.
		That's a lot of fraud.
		That's where the fraud is coming from.
		And yes, last weekend, Sunday's paper, the Armagin Journal stated that out of 100 people, 96 of those women that are in prison have never done anything illegal that are migrants.
		And yes, it's illegal.
		It's a misdemeanor.
		Just like somebody speeding over a certain amount of miles or somebody stealing from a grocery store.
		The same thing.
		They should not be condemned to a situation where they can't eat normal food.
		It's frozen or it's poisonous.
		And yet you're going to put these people down that have worked very hard to make the United States better.
		Deplorable.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Diane, let's go to Silver Spring, Maryland, Line for Independence.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Al, good morning.
unidentified		Hi.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		I see a piece of news that is not talked about at all.
		New Mexico recently announced that they're going to have child care, free child care for everyone.
		Now, when the person running for mayor of New York said that, people thought it was communism.
		Now, New Mexico is a great place to live.
		So can you shine a little more light on what is happening in New Mexico?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		I've got this Reuters article up.
		Al, it says, this just came out.
		It says, in U.S. First, New Mexico launches free child care for all.
		It says that the program aims to improve education, child welfare in New Mexico.
		Other Democratic-run areas eye similar steps.
		And critics argue against free child care for wealthy families.
		If you'd like more information, you can go to Reuters for that.
		Here is Tommy in Kentucky, Democrat.
		Hi, Tommy.
unidentified		Yes, I'd like to make a couple of statements.
unidentified		One is, I would like to know, do they ever research these people that do all these decision-making and maybe who could be communists and who ain't?
jim marrs ▲ ● ▼		Seem like we got a lot of communists in our country anymore.
unidentified		And Trump is not capable, I don't think, of dealing with them, China and Russia and all of them.
		I do not think he's capable.
		And I'd also like to know how does he tear down a White House to get to build a ballroom.
		And overnight, when it took me about six months to build a self-central system on my property, I would like to know how he can do that.
		And I'd also like to know, how did Maxwell, the woman, how she getting that little light sentence after doing all she's done with these kids and having one kid to kill itself, commit suicide?
		And what are they doing?
		Prepping her to have her ready for that ballroom to get them little kids in there for the petapaws?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Tommy.
		Let's go to Tom, Kent, Ohio, Republican Lion.
		Go ahead, Tom.
unidentified		Hi there.
		How are you doing this morning?
		Good.
		Good.
		Well, I wanted to comment on the ACA briefly.
		Your Chiron read ACA subsidies expiring, but actually, it's just the enhanced ACA subsidies expiring.
		There are still subsidies there.
		And these are the subsidies that the Democrats said would expire in 2025.
		And now they're taking the old track that no new tax ever expires.
		So I think it's important to make clear that it's the enhanced ACA subsidies that expire.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, that's correct, Tom.
unidentified		And as far as the, I mean, there's so much misinformation out there, but just briefly, when you said, well, the asylees and the refugees, you mean they too will not get health care.
		And that sounds very sympathetic.
		But keep in mind, Biden let over 10 million people in, and all you had to do to be an asylee was say, I'm scared for my life.
		Meanwhile, they passed through Mexico where they should have asked for asylum there.
		Right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That is correct.
		They are, according to U.S. law, if you get into the country and you have a credible claim, so it does have to be credible.
		You don't just have to say, my life is in danger.
		You have to prove it in some way.
		But yes, you would be considered an asylee and you would be given a court date to appear before a judge to have that claim adjudicated.
		The problem is there's not enough judges and the system is so backed up that that could take years before you would actually stand in front of a judge and have that claim adjudicated.
		But during that time, you would be considered documented, right?
unidentified		In a practical sense.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, and that's where the disagreement is, Tom, is, you know, when one person says, well, those are illegals, technically, they're documented, right?
		So they are not technically in this country illegally.
		You see what I mean?
		But the Republicans will say, no, they're illegals because we had this big flood of people coming in and they were all just kind of let in.
		So, yeah, I think that's, it's very confusing.
		What did you want to say, Tom?
unidentified		Go ahead.
		Well, no, and I understand what you're saying, and it's very, you know, I mean, it's very politically correct.
		But you can't, if they travel through a country where they could ask for asylum there, aren't they supposed to ask for asylum in that country, which was Mexico?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, yeah, I'm not familiar with what international law would say, but as far as U.S. law is if you do get into the country, into the United States, you have the right to ask for asylum.
unidentified		Isn't it strange how we've gone to zero now?
		So there's nobody now asking for asylum.
		And it was just, it was mere, well, I mean, this could go on forever.
		I just politely disagree with you.
		My opinion, and many of the people I know, and of course we all hang out with our own friends, we get confirmation bias, is they can all leave.
		They can all leave, and then they can apply legally at a point of entry for re-entry into this country.
		But I thank you for getting, and by the way, you are one of the most fair hosts on C-SPAN.
		Thank you, Tom.
		I think you're doing a great job, and I appreciate it, and I hope you have a great day.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Appreciate that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		David, Independence, Louisiana, Independent Line, go ahead, David.
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
		How many people does it take to beat up Trump?
		Huh?
		The world may never know.
		But look here.
		There's a nice song.
		It's sympathetic to the Democrats.
		It's on the highwaymen.
		That's country people.
		Christophson, Willie Nelson, Johnny Cash, William Jennings, CDs from about 85.
		There's a song called Deport Taste.
		And it's called Plane Wreck and Los Gatos.
		And it almost makes you cry.
		But I wish Trump would make baseball great again and get rid of the little computer graphics in that strike zone and all, because I love watching baseball all my life, but it looks like some kind of pinball machine or something now.
		And tonight, I wish Trump would make my clock great again.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Casey in Lake Village, Indiana.
		And Democrat, go ahead, Casey.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Yes, I was just calling up about everybody talking about the immigrants coming to Chicago and Casey?
unidentified		Mentioned about how they got there by DeSantis and Governor Abbott sending millions of dollars to send the immigrants to them cities.
chris in arizona ▲ ● ▼		Now they're spending billions of dollars to get them back out.
unidentified		And I hear nothing about that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		And here is Denny in Grubville, Missouri, Independent Line.
		Denny, are you there?
unidentified		I'm here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Hi.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		I just wanted to comment about health care in America.
		All major countries in the world have universal health care and spend half what we do.
		Why don't America have universal health care?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And DeAndre, Baltimore, Maryland, Republican line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		DeAndre, are you there?
unidentified		Hear me?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I can hear you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Happy first of the month.
		Good morning, America.
		Good morning, C-SPAN.
		It's always a pleasure to call in here.
		So I just wanted to talk about real quick about the recent upsurge and algorithms online, where apparently Americans are, well, not all Americans, but a certain sector of Americans are afraid of, I guess, this Sharia law or some takeover of our country.
		And I just want to make it clear that it's November and Donald Trump's peace plan still hasn't gone through.
		Israel's still carrying out a barbaric genocide, and we can't get Israel to comply to any peaceful terms or negotiations.
		But this Mom Donnie in New York giving people a lot of, everybody's up in arms for some reason.
		But I don't see any foresight of America being colonized or taken over by Sharia law.
		I mean, I think we've already been colonized, taken over by the Zionist interests, and DeAndre, tell me more about what you're seeing online.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You're seeing an uptick in, I guess, people saying that Sharia is going to take over the United States.
unidentified		Correct.
		This is something that's just like it's a conversation that's trendy now.
		And I think it's because people are reacting to the fact that New York, the new possible mayor of New York, is going to be a Muslim.
		And like New York happens to be, you know, a lot of people look at New York as little Tel Aviv.
		You know, it's a lot of decisions are made out of there where the United Nations is held.
		So if a Muslim mayor was to, I guess, be the mayor of New York, people would like kind of, you know, they would, it's like they're losing their, you know, their special state, you know, of control and policymaking.
		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here's John in Asheville, North Carolina, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, John.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm listening to all this debate about the healthcare thing, and I agree with the other caller.
		I'm just saying that we've made health care a big business here as opposed to what other industrialized nations are doing.
		We're going to have to realize that we, despite all the talk, we all still like big government.
		But in my lifetime, I'm 65.
		I haven't seen small government aspirations of the American people, but national health insurance is probably with cost controls.
		The only thing that's going to solve this.
		If you're relying on capitalism and big business, that's what they do.
		That's what they do.
		But thank you very much, and you are an excellent host.
		I watch you as much as I can.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Thanks, John.
		Mark in Tulaire, South Dakota, Independent Line.
		You're on Open Forum.
unidentified		Thanks for taking my call.
unidentified		I was just wondering why the Republicans are so against the subsidies for the ACA when Congress gets subsidized for their health care.
willie nelson ▲ ● ▼		It seems like if the poor can't get a subsidy, Congress shouldn't be getting a subsidy.
unidentified		And the person talking about universal health care, I was married to a Canadian citizen at one time and had dual citizenship.
		We were in Washington, D.C., didn't have any insurance, and she had a gallbladder attack.
		We went to Canada.
		She paid $258 for a monthly insurance program, and they took out her gallbladder within five days, and there were no added expenses.
willie nelson ▲ ● ▼		So is it time that the U.S. goes with the rest of the world and has a one-price subsidy and her insurance payment, and that's it?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Jimmy in Alabama, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Jimmy.
unidentified		How are you doing, beautiful?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing okay.
unidentified		I tell you what, I've been sitting here listening to all this stuff, boy, I'll tell you what.
		To hear a Democrat come on, boy, I'll tell you what.
		I better just hang this down the phone up because what I'll say will bust a lot of bubbles.
		But start the war.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here is Terry, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Terry.
unidentified		Hi.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go right ahead.
		You're on the air.
		Yes, we can.
unidentified		Okay, I was just, I'm a nurse, and I was wanting to talk about health care.
		Okay, so we're having all this debate over insurance and insurance payments and subsidies.
		And what is coming to my mind is hello?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, we are listening.
		Go on.
		Keep going, Terry.
unidentified		Is the main culprit is the health care system.
		You know, there's so much fraud going on.
		You know, I've seen it.
		I've been a nurse for 35 years.
		And they need to start at the top.
		You know, if they would get the health care system in check and stop letting them rape the insurance companies as they do, they can work from there.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Terry.
		And a couple things for your schedule later.
		You know that there is a Virginia governor's race.
		Today, we're going to have former President Barack Obama speaking at a campaign rally in support of Democratic nominee for Virginia Abigail Spanberger.
		That's today, 2 o'clock from Norfolk.
		You can watch that live here on C-SPAN.
		And then later after that, it's a campaign rally for the Republican candidates in next week's Virginia governor's race.
		We'll hear from current Lieutenant Governor Winsom Earl Sears and Lieutenant Governor candidate John Reed and Attorney General Jason Mieres, who's running for re-election, as well as remarks from the state's current governor, Glenn Yunken.
		That's at 6:30 p.m. today here on C-SPAN.
		You can watch both of those on our app, C-SPANNOW, and online at c-span.org, as with all of our programs are on c-span.org.
		Well, that's all the time that we've got for today's program.
		I want to thank everybody for calling in and for watching.
		We will see you again tomorrow morning at 7 a.m. Eastern, as always, for another edition of Washington Journal.
		Now we're going to take you right over to Ceasefire for our program with our Republican and our Democrat.
		Here it is.
dasha burns ▲ ● ▼		Welcome to Ceasefire, where we seek to bridge the divide in American politics.
dasha burns ▲ ● ▼		I'm Dasha Burns, Politico White House Bureau Chief, and I'm joined today by two guests who have agreed to keep the conversation civil, even when they disagree.

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