CSPAN - Washington Journal 10/01/2025

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Oct. 1, 2025 07:00-10:00 - CSPAN

02:59:55

Washington Journal 10/01/2025

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Main

doug collins

05:05

jasmine wright

cspan 14:09

john mcardle

cspan 39:46

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chuck schumer

sen/d 03:37

donald j trump

admin 03:31

hakeem jeffries

rep/d 00:48

wes moore

d 02:22

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al green

rep/d 00:04

maxine waters

rep/d 00:03

patty murray

sen/d 00:08

sarah elfreth

rep/d 00:02

sean duffy

admin 00:04

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Then, Maryland Representative Sarah Elfrith talks about the shutdown's impact on the federal workforce and Democratic budget alternatives.
		Also, Veterans Affairs Secretary Doug Collins discusses the shutdown's impact on his department and veterans' care.
		And later, notice White House correspondent Jasmine Wright and Roll Call Editor-in-Chief Jason Dick review the policy and political ramifications.
		Washington Journal starts now.
		Good morning.
		It's Wednesday, October 1st, 2025, day one of the latest federal government shutdown.
		Some 800,000 federal employees are expected to be furloughed and non-essential government services halted after a last-ditch effort last night failed to gain enough Senate votes to keep the doors open.
		The most recent federal shutdown during the first Trump administration lasted 34 days and it's unclear this morning how long this one will last.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		But we're getting your thoughts on the shutdown on phone line split as usual by political party.
unidentified		Republicans, it's 202-748-8001.
		Democrats, 202-748-8000.
		Independents, 202-748-8002.
		A special line for government employees.
		Federal workers can call it 202-748-8003.
		That's also the number you can send us a text on.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Also, on social media, it's at c-spanwj on x.
unidentified		On Facebook, it's facebook.com/slash c-span.
		A very good Wednesday morning to you.
		You can go ahead and start calling in now at precisely midnight last night.
		Democrats and Republicans took to social media to blame each other for the latest federal government shutdown.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Here's Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer's midnight video, followed by that from the official count of House Republicans.
chuck schumer ▲ ● ▼		It's midnight.
		The Republican shutdown has just begun because Republicans wouldn't protect America's health care.
		We are going to keep fighting for the American people.
unidentified		That was the blame game last night on social media, and it continues in the political websites this morning.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		First from the right in Breitbart, the headline there this morning, Schumer shutdown begins with no end in sight.
unidentified		And then from the left, it's Huff Post, shutdown.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		GOP digs in on health care.
		Three quarters of a million furloughed asking the question, are layoffs incoming.
		We're getting your thoughts this morning on the Washington Journal.
unidentified		It's day one of the government shutdown.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		We are seven hours and just over two minutes into the latest federal government shutdown.
		As you're calling in, we're going to be joined by Steve Newcomb of Axios via Zoom this morning.
		Stephen Newcomb, how do we know if we're in for a short-term shutdown or something longer?
unidentified		Good morning, John.
		I don't think we know yet.
		I mean, I think, you know, you have to take a step back and look at what the push and pull and the pressure points on each party and each party leaders are right now.
		I mean, for Republicans, I think the reality is that the polling shows that the public, at least before the shutdown, said that they would blame Republicans, usually the party who is in power, that is in power, does shoulder a lot of the blame for a shutdown.
		So if that sort of public sentiment continues to skew that way, I think that that puts pressure on Republicans to come to the negotiating table.
		also think that you should keep an eye out for a couple of the moderate Republicans in the Senate and how they react to any of the firings, the layoffs, the furloughs that President Trump and Russ Vogt and his administration decide to sort of implement during the shutdown.
		And then on the Democratic side, you know, I think that they need to, one, have a conversation within themselves, how long and how comfortable are they willing to let this go on?
		This is not something usually the Democratic Party would embrace.
		And then again, look at some of those moderates, Gary Peters, the Democrats last night that voted for the bill in the Senate.
		There's probably around seven or eight of them that you could keep an eye on and sort of pay attention to what length they're willing to take this shutdown.
		Is it a week?
		Is it two weeks?
		Is it two weeks?
		Do we get closer to a month like we did in 2019?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That bill in the Senate was a continuing resolution to keep the government funded at current levels into November.
unidentified		And it was supported by two Senate Democrats.
unidentified		That would be John Fetterman and Catherine Cortez-Masto and Angus King, the independent from Maine, who caucuses with Democrats.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The Republican leadership hopes to keep putting that bill back on the floor and try to peel off more votes.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Why do they expect they might be able to get more than those three that caucus with Democrats on putting that on the floor one more time?
unidentified		Yeah, I think they see it as sort of a war of attrition.
		I think you're looking at folks like the Democratic senators from New Hampshire, Maggie Hassen, Gene Shaheen, Gary Peters in Michigan, who's retiring, who voted to fund their government last time.
		There's a number of other moderates, Jack Reed and Rhode Island.
		So I think they see it as sort of an attrition thing.
		They continue to put this on the floor.
		Maybe Democrats will break.
		But I would be shocked for them to flip their votes today or anytime later this week.
		I think they'll vote through the weekend as well.
		But something else to remember is that the Senate is just going to go about its business at this point as well.
		I mean, we're just sort of settling into this shutdown at this point because later today, the Senate will be in, yes, voting on the funding bills, but also voting on nominations and sort of continuing the agenda that Senate Republicans have set up in the Senate.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Can you explain the politics behind the health care subsidies that are at the heart of this latest shutdown fight?
unidentified		Yeah, so the heart of it at this point is that Democrats want an extension of these expiring Affordable Care Act subsidies that are set to expire at the end of the year, which studies show, and I think insurers at this point have already communicated, is going to lead to an increase in premiums for a lot of folks across the board.
		And Republicans, including Republican leadership, I think have even acknowledged that, yeah, this is something that eventually the Republican Party will have to come to the table on because the polling is so bad for them on these types of cuts.
		And they don't want to pay for it in the 2026 midterms.
		But the line so far from Republican leadership has been, yes, we can negotiate on these things, but only with the government open.
		And we will not include these ACA subsidies in any conversation that has to do with this government funding saga and the shutdown.
		Obviously, Democrats have tried to insert that as an issue at the negotiating table when it comes to the shutdown.
		So we'll have to see if Republicans are willing to re-engage with Democrats on the issue of these subsidies in the context of reopening the government.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What will you be watching for today?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		We're expected to hear from leadership on both sides starting just around the time this program ends at 10 a.m. Eastern.
unidentified		What are you looking for?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What signals are going to determine the politics of this?
unidentified		I would see how Chuck Schumer, the Senate minority leader, responds this morning.
		I think that last night, right around the time of the shutdown, commencing right after midnight, he and House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries put out a statement that was pretty much going after the president in a pretty personal manner, saying that he was unhinged.
		I wonder if Democratic leaders continue to make that sort of a central part of their campaign in the shutdown, the erratic behavior of the president, the videos he's posting online.
		So keep an eye on Democratic leaders and what they choose to message and how clear and the clarity of that message in getting it across.
		And viewers should keep an eye on Axios, some of the best source reporters on Capitol Hill.
		It's axius.com.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Stephen Newcomb is the co-author of the Hill Leaders newsletter.
unidentified		We'll let you get to your first day of the government shutdown and check in with you down the road.
		Stephen Newcomb.
		Thanks, John.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Taking your calls this morning, getting your thoughts.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Again, we are seven hours and now nine minutes into this latest government shutdown.
unidentified		I want to hear especially from federal workers, 202-748-8003 is that number.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Otherwise, phone lines split as usual by political party.
unidentified		Lori's up first out of the Tarheel State of North Carolina.
		Democrat, good morning.
		Good morning.
		My question is, why do the part, the two-party system, have to play the regular workers and the senior citizens and the lower-income people against the rich?
		It's a ping-pong game, which the people always get hurt.
		The federal workers always get hurt.
		But the people holding office never even get scared.
		They don't even feel the singer the fire.
		My check, my Social Security, I worked and earned, and today it's not in my account.
		Why is it not there?
		Because of the government shutdown.
		And I'm not the only senior that's going to be hurt by this.
		People have to live.
		We have to pay our bills.
		We don't have any recourse.
		We don't have a golden pot to pull out of.
		So why does the federal government and both all sides not use the people against each other, but just come together and accept the fact that they're hurting.
		Both parties are hurting the American people.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And Lori, my understanding is that essential services and social security checks do still go out.
unidentified		Have you talked to your financial advisor, your bank, about your check and your concerns?
		Unfortunately, I'm one of the ones who don't have financial advisors.
		I can't afford to pay a fee for somebody to watch my money.
		When the federal government promised me if I put into that golden pot, that I could pull out my money when it was time.
		Now where is it gone?
		They locked it up behind the door because they don't want to come to the table and see that American people get help.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Lori in North Carolina.
		This is John out of Ohio.
		Republican, good morning.
unidentified		Hey, John.
		Yeah.
		My thing is, all of the American people aren't that smart because, you know, I'd like to see these negotiations supposedly on air.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		You want to see when they sit down and talk to each other, have it not happened behind closed doors?
unidentified		Exactly, because who knows who's telling the truth?
		We're always talking about the truth, right?
		What is the truth?
		The only way the American people will know is by actually seeing what's on the table, what they're actually talking about.
		And I'd like to see a resolution.
		Absolutely.
		Don't want people out of work.
		You know, that's my take on most of it.
		That's about as much as I can do, but, you know, yeah, that's what I want to see.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's John in Ohio.
		Jamie Raskin is a Democratic congressman from Maryland.
		A lot of federal employees in his district.
		He put out in the run-up to this potential and now actual shutdown that's happening, a guide on what does and doesn't happen during a shutdown.
		When it comes to Social Security, just going back to the first caller's comments and concerns about her check, Social Security checks should be mailed out as normal.
unidentified		This process is automated and remains unaffected by the shutdown.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		However, new applications and individuals needing to update their information could experience delays when it comes to Social Security checks.
		His what to know during a federal shutdown from his website, raskin.house.gov.
		Stephen, Lexington, Kentucky Independent, you're next.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		Thank you for letting me speak.
		And John, it's always a pleasure to talk to you.
		I just want to remind everybody that our politicians in Congress and the Senate, they are still getting paid and they still get their checks no matter if the government is shut down.
		So they don't care because they're still getting theirs.
		Long story short, Republicans, they have every single part of power.
		They can just reopen the government if they wanted, but they're being greedy and they're not helping the American people.
		They just want to take it all.
		So it's all lies.
		We can see between all the facade and all the lies.
		It's ridiculous how they're doing this to the American people.
		And at a time where things are the most expensive, people need two jobs now.
		People need to ask their parents.
		I'm a millennial.
		I'm a millennial.
		And we are struggling.
		It is definitely a two-tier economic system where the older people, which most of the people listening on C-SPAN, are elderly receiving their little happy Social Security checks, regardless of what's going on with millennials that have kids, inflation.
		It's wild right now.
		So, yes, it is a wild time, and Republicans need to grow up and reopen the government.
		Your politicians are still getting checks.
		Thank you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Stephen in Kentucky.
		This is Glenn in Texas, Republican.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hey, good morning, C-SPAN.
		Yeah, I agree with people on the net, too, that anyone that's on Social Security will still receive the check because it's direct deposit.
		All the government employees that they're talking about are all direct deposit on their money paydays.
		Check Schumer is the biggest liar that has ever been in Congress.
		His days are numbered.
		Republicans are trying to keep even keel up in the nation.
		Trump's big beautiful bill says there will be no cuts in Medicare, Medicaid, and anything else out there.
		So my point is the Democrats are the pit of hell.
		They all need to be reprogrammed some way or shape, Katie Fowler.
		So I don't care nothing about the Democrat Party.
		They all want to do criminals.
		Schumer wants to have all this money to have the new candidates to campaign on and get the illegals eligible to vote this coming 26.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Glenn in Texas.
		We're going to be hearing from congressional leaders.
		Expected to begin at 10 a.m. Eastern today after this program.
unidentified		Speaker Johnson and Senate Majority Leader Thune set to hold a press conference, and we will show that here on C-SPAN Live when it happens.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		We're also expecting Minority Leader Jeffries to give a press conference today.
		11 a.m. Eastern is at least the planning for that.
		We'll watch what happens throughout the day, and especially watch what happens from the White House today and President Trump.
		It was President Trump yesterday warning Democrats about what the White House could do if there is a shutdown when it comes to management of the federal government.
		This was President Trump from yesterday.
unidentified		The Democrat Party, when they have a 33% favorability rating on average in recent months, and they're willing to shut down the government over health care.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		They are shutting it down.
		We're not shutting it down.
		We don't want it to shut down because we have the greatest period of time ever.
		I told you, we have $17 trillion being invested.
		So the last person that wants to shut down is us now.
		With that being said, we can do things during the shutdown that are irreversible, that are bad for them and irreversible by them, like cutting vast numbers of people out, cutting things that they like, cutting programs that they like.
		And you know all, you all know Russell Vogt.
		He's become very popular recently because he can trim the budget to a level that you couldn't do any other way.
		So they're taking a risk by having a shutdown because because of the shutdown, we can do things medically and other ways, including benefits.
		We can cut large numbers of people out.
		We don't want to do that, but we don't want fraud, waste, and abuse.
		And, you know, we're cutting that.
		But they want to have illegal aliens come into our country and get massive health care at the cost to everybody else.
		And we don't have it.
		And that's, I would say, the number one reason that they want to strike is to get illegal immigrants health care.
		And, you know, Gavin Newsom wants that too in California, and it's destroying California.
		We can't have that.
		We're not going to let it happen.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		It was President Trump yesterday from the White House.
		We'll watch to see statements from the White House today, and of course, Capitol Hill as well.
		Yesterday, after those statements by President Trump, Senate Minority Leader Chuck Schumer responded, especially to the point about irreversible cuts.
		This was Chuck Schumer yesterday.
chuck schumer ▲ ● ▼		And before I get into my substance of remarks, I just heard something that Trump said.
		Here's what he said.
		We can do things during the shutdown that are irreversible and bad for them and irreversible like cutting vast numbers of people out.
		Well, there it is.
		Trump admitted himself that he is using Americans as political pawns.
		He is admitting that he is doing the firing of people, if God forbid it happens.
		He's using Americans as pawns, as I said.
		Democrats do not want a shutdown.
		We stand ready to work with Republicans to find a bipartisan compromise, and the ball's in their court.
		When he says he will do things, he is taking ownership.
		He is taking ownership.
		It's just like in his first term when he said he will own the shutdown.
unidentified		It's just a point I want you to make.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Chuck Schumer, yesterday, taking your phone calls this morning as we are in day one of this latest federal government shutdown.
		This is Donovan in Royal Oak, Michigan, Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		I appreciate you guys having me.
		The only thing that I have to say in regards to this entire shutdown is that everyday Americans are genuinely being hurt by this, you know, whether you're Republican or Democrat.
		And I wish that the Congress would take a second, take a deep breath, take a step back, and realize that America is better than this.
		And we're more, the constituents are more important than somebody having a hard line in the sand and saying, no, it's not going to happen.
		And it's a power grab from either side.
		You know, the Democratic side, they're fighting just to show that they're working for their constituents.
		We have to do something.
		So we have to fight against the Republicans.
		And the Republicans, I don't want to say they're taking a bow to the president or the executive branch, but in some ways, shapes, and form, for the last six months, hey, they have been on board with the executive branch.
		And lastly, on that point, we forget that the Constitution was created with separation of powers for a reason.
		You know, the president shouldn't be dictating what any party does.
		They should be, both parties should be actually fighting on behalf of the constituents they represent.
		So when you hear the president say we can dismantle or fire federal employees, who is he saying we?
		Is he talking about the executive branch and the Republicans, or is he just talking about the executive branch?
		Because when you look in the Constitution, when it says the word we, it says we, the people, who give the power to the government.
		So if he's not talking about we as in the people, this is what the people want, then I think it's an overreach of power or just a misstatement.
		And yeah, that's my perspective on it.
		So hopefully these guys can come to the table and really consider their constituents on both sides and say, hey, there's a deal that needs to be done that won't harm America as a whole.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Donovan in Michigan.
		Robert is in Spartanburg, South Carolina.
		Republican, good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I think this shutdown needs to end.
		And the Senate needs to get their app together and pass every bill they have that's sitting there.
		And the House needs to get their app together and pass every bill they have.
		I think that would be reasonable.
		And Michigan just passed a seven-day extension because they were heading for a state shutdown as well.
		And I've been watching that as well.
		I used to live in Michigan, but thank you for letting me speak.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Robert in South Carolina, Shirley Stratford, Connecticut.
		Good morning.
		Line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, John.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Good morning, C-SAN.
		I am so disappointed with the Republicans right now because every time they do something, it's to back up their own lives.
		I'm a small business owner, and I had to buy my own insurance.
		And I'm telling you that I got a letter recently with my insurance going up because of the anticipation of the government shutdown.
		And I know for fact that when I didn't have insurance, medical insurance, I had to go to the local clinics and I had to pay on a sliding scale.
		And when I went to the clinics, that's where I saw undocumented immigrants at the clinic paying for their own medical care.
		They don't get medical care from programs because I couldn't get medical care from programs.
		And I know they're not telling the truth.
		The Republicans aren't because they spent, Trump has indoctrinated the Republican people.
		And for eight years, he told the same lies over and over again until if you tell a lie long enough, it becomes the truth to you.
		And I know for a fact that I often wondered how did Jim Jones get people to follow him to their death?
		And this is how he does it.
		You tell the same lies consistently over and over again until people begin to believe it.
		Undocumented immigrants have done nothing to this country but put this country in a good state of affairs.
		It takes, it's a process to become an American citizen, and that's what they were working for.
		I've seen ICE agents going into the courts where immigrants that are undocumented go for their regular appointments to go through the process of becoming a citizen.
		They love this country like we do, and they have to go through classes that they have to pay for to know more about our country than we do.
		And I am disappointed on how people allow themselves to be indoctrinated and to be lied to and believe that lie.
		Go out to the clinics and see that that's where you find undocumented immigrants getting medical care.
		And the Democrats are fighting for us all to keep our medical care affordable so that we can all live.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Shirley in Stratford, Connecticut.
		The headline from the Washington Times today focusing on the blame game here when it comes to the shutdown.
		Partisan blame game heats up as the shutdown begins.
		Republicans have particularly tagged this, the Schumer shutdown, pointing to House Minority Leader Chuck Schumer, including Congressman Eric Burleson, Republican in Missouri, posting the Schumer shutdown song on his ex-page last night.
unidentified		Trillion dollar schemes they're scheming.
		Got the roof on no redeeming.
		It's the Schumer shutdown.
		Uh-oh, NPIs cash grab borders bleeding.
		Chuck's demands bring chaos seething.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The Schumer shutdown, just one of the many social media posts last night by members of Congress as the shutdown hit, including this one as well from Congresswoman Sarah Jacobs, Democrat from California, on the lights going out in Washington because of the shutdown.
unidentified		It's past midnight in D.C., which means Donald Trump just shut down the government.
		Here's what that means for you.
		No food safety checks on what's in your fridge.
		Longer TSA lines and fewer air traffic controllers on duty.
		National parks locked up or trashed without park rangers.
		Passports and visas stuck in limbo.
		Farmers and small business owners cut off from federal loans.
		Cancer trials and disease research on hold.
		Disaster relief delayed when communities need it most.
		And service members, Border Patrol agents, FBI agents, all working without pay.
		This is all Donald Trump's fault.
		Republicans control the White House, the Senate, and the House.
		So if they want Democratic votes, they have to come and talk to us.
		We're not going to rubber stamp Trump's agenda and support health care cuts.
		Democrats are ready to talk.
		But until then, this shutdown is on Republicans.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		She talks about talking their talks stumbling, as the Wall Street Journal notes in its lead story headline this morning.
		Federal shutdown is set as talks stumble.
		With the deadline near, Senate rejects competing bills to extend the funding.
		That vote happening late last night.
		Here's the headline from the Washington Post this morning.
unidentified		Funding dries up as the clock runs out.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And the clock is now seven hours and 27 minutes into this latest government shutdown.
		The last one during the first Trump administration, that one lasted 34 days.
		We'll see how long this one lasts.
		We're taking your phone calls this morning.
		Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, phone lines as usual, and a special line for federal employees.
		202-748-8003 is that number.
unidentified		Kevin, though, independent out of Windsor, Connecticut, you're next.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		Yeah, the medical stuff is going through the roof.
		I'm retired.
		I'm paying higher insurance costs.
		Now that the prescriptions gain tariffs, now I'm paying higher on prescriptions.
		You know, I mean, the mega Republicans are really whopping it to the American people.
		Like, next year it's going to be Social Security.
		Right now, if anybody makes $176,000 a year, they don't have to pay into Social Security.
		That's on Social Security website.
		I mean, this country's in bad shape with the mega Republicans.
		They get lied to.
		They're so gullible.
		Like last lady said, you know, you don't lie so long.
		They believe it's the truth now.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So, Kevin, on the paying into Social Security, people who are making money still have to pay into Social Security.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		You're just talking about the limit at which they don't have to continue to pay after that, right?
unidentified		Yeah, the 6%.
		Like if a guy working 80,000, 80,000 a year, he takes his 6%.
		And somebody makes like $500,000, they can make that 6% up in one month.
		There's a fraud right there on Social Security.
		Nobody's paying into it.
		You know, the rich always gets their way.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Kevin in Connecticut.
		This is Russ in Pennsylvania, Republican.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, sir.
		I just want to thank Hakeem Jeffries and Chuck Schumer for shutting down the government because they fulfilled Donald Trump's campaign slogan of shrinking government.
		And I also wanted to say about the caller Shirley.
		She said about indoctrination.
		The Republicans were indoctrinating people.
		Does she remember Russia, Russia, Russia by Adam Schiff?
		And a guy named Donovan said about we the people.
		We the people voted unanimously for Donald Trump in the election.
		And I just can't understand these people that want to deviate from the truth.
		That's all I have to say.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Kevin, you talked about thanking Jeffries and Schumer.
		What do you make of Donald Trump's truth social posts about focusing on Hakeem Jeffries and attempting to lampoon him?
		Is maybe the word to put it.
		There it is on his true social post, and a new one featuring Hakeem Jeffries from last night went up as well.
unidentified		Well, I called Hakeem Jeffries last night and the tank left him a voicemail.
		And I wanted to know where he got the Sombaro from because I wanted to buy one too because I thought he looked good in it.
		And I didn't know he could grow a mustache that quickly, but I thought he looked real good in that mustache.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Do you think the.
unidentified		See, I mean, you got it on TV right now.
		I asked Hakeem Jeffries, where did you get that hat?
		Because I want to go buy one.
		Please give me a call back.
		But see, that's the problem.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Do you think videos like that help in this process here in the negotiations?
unidentified		Help in the process?
		No, it's just a joke.
		See, nobody can take a joke no more.
		This country is so evil in so many ways that nobody can take a joke anymore.
		You do not think that is funny.
		A mariachi band with Donald Trump playing all those instruments and Keith Jefferson.
		That is funny.
		Come on.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Kevin in Gainesville, Florida, taking your phone calls this morning.
		It's just after 7.30, and we are day one in the government shutdown.
		Go ahead and keep calling in phone lines for Republicans, Democrats, and Independents.
		That number for federal employees to call in.
		We especially want to hear from you this morning, 202-748-8003.
		Whether you are furloughed or considered an essential employee and need to be on the job, we'd like to hear how the shutdown is impacting you.
		As you continue to call in, we are joined via Zoom now by Maryland Democratic Congresswoman Sarah Ellsbrith.
		Congresswoman Ellsbrith, your district located between here in DC and Baltimore, you have something like 44,000 federal employees in your district.
unidentified		How many of them are furloughed today?
		Do you know?
		I don't have the number of how many are furloughed.
		We are going to have a lot of essential employees.
		I represent a number of military bases and other folks who are going to be deemed essential, which is why even before this shutdown, we filed a bill.
		Myself and Senator Alsa Brooks from Maryland, joined by our colleagues from Virginia and across the country, filed a bill to help support those essential employees.
		There's a little bit of a gap in our policy right now.
		While everybody's going to receive back pay, furloughed employees can apply for unemployment insurance to help get through this shutdown because over half of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.
		But essential employees cannot apply for that unemployment insurance.
		So our bill, Help Feds Act, was filed on Friday, and it's not going to obviously be ready for this shutdown, but we're preparing just one of the lessons learned.
		How can I support my constituents and federal employees across this country moving forward?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What's your message to federal employees who are trying to plan out how long this is going to last, whether this is going to be another 35-day shutdown as it was during the first Trump administration or one of those shorter, just a couple days shutdown before a deal is made and the government reopens?
unidentified		Yeah, I don't know how long this is going to last.
		And first of all, I just want to say to federal employees, thank you.
		They're not hearing that enough from this administration.
		I appreciate your service to the American people.
		I represent 44,000, as you said, but while they're my neighbors and they're important to Maryland's economy, these are folks who are providing essential services for Americans across this country.
		They answer the phones at Social Security.
		They support folks getting appointments at the VA.
		They inspect food through FDA and USDA.
		So they support those essential services that taxpayers have paid for across this country.
		So I just want to say thank you.
		You don't do it for the money.
		I know that you do it out of service, a sense of service for this country.
sarah elfreth ▲ ● ▼		And I appreciate you.
unidentified		And I've heard from many folks in the district.
		We were in district all week before I was in D.C. this week trying to find a deal.
		I've heard from many folks who wanted us to shut the government down, wanted us to stand strong.
		A lot of people have lost their jobs during the Doge cuts, have seen the chaos of this administration, and want us to stand up for them.
		And that's what I'm doing.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Does a shutdown turn the keys over to Rust Vote and the Office of Management and Budget to have further cuts to the federal government, further firings during this shutdown?
unidentified		It's something I'm concerned about.
		I think I've been concerned about Rust Vote since he was nominated for OMB director.
		This is a man who does not respect federal civil servants.
		He's made many comments as the architect of Project 2025.
		He has shown his utter disdain and disrespect for civil servants.
		So I've been weary of him since then.
		I'm also just deeply offended at the president and votes threats to federal workers.
		I've been doing budget negotiations and deals in my seven years, first in the State House, now in Congress, and I've always found that the first person to threaten normally has the shorthand in this negotiation.
		But it's also just, again, deeply offensive to the American people and it should concern everybody that threats are being lobbied about using civil servants as political pawns.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		On doing negotiations and deals, what do you say to Republicans who have said it's okay to have a debate about these health care subsidies at the heart of the shutdown, but doing it during a shutdown is irresponsible.
		That Democrats should have voted for a continuing resolution, kept the government open, and we can also have that debate saying Republicans voted for continuing resolutions during the Biden administration.
		That what's happening today is irresponsible and pointing the fingers at Democrats for allowing this to happen.
unidentified		Well, first of all, let's be clear.
		We've been in a continuing resolution since I've been to Congress.
		We have not been able to pass a budget.
		And so we've all been working towards a solution here.
		This is not something, this healthcare crisis that we are lurching towards is not something that can wait seven weeks.
		People, it's October 1st.
		People will be receiving in their mailbox notices about their premiums for their health insurance going up on January 1st, in Maryland's case by 13%.
		And this is in the midst of the most drastic Medicaid cuts in the history of this country.
		This is in the midst of the president just denouncing tariffs, 100% tariffs on pharmaceuticals coming from overseas.
		We are in the middle of a healthcare affordability crisis.
		We cannot wait seven weeks to solve it.
		The insurance marketplace is already sending those notices out to people.
		They are not going to wait to increase those premiums.
		And so it's something we have to address right now because those ACA tax credits expire on December 31st.
		So I would love a deal.
		And let me be clear: this impacts 15,000 people in my district, but it impacts millions of people across this country.
		And I'm trying to apply to the better angels of the natures of my colleagues across the aisle because their constituents as well are going to suffer from Congress's inaction.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What's the plan today?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What are you hearing from Democratic leadership on when you will meet with them and when we decide on the next steps when it comes to congressional action?
unidentified		Yeah, so I live in Annapolis.
		I'm home right now.
		It's 7:30 in the morning.
		I'm going to head up to the state house to do a press conference with my governor announcing supports for federal employees, many of which I voted on when I was at the State House.
		And then I'm heading to DC to meet with the Democratic caucus.
		We are there.
		Republicans have been home for the last week and a half, but Democrats have been back in Washington for the last three days, ready and willing to work towards a bipartisan budget deal and vote to avert, well, now reopen the government.
		We've been working to avert it for the last two days, but now it's about how can we come together on a bipartisan budget deal?
		That's what the American people want of us.
		How do we work together?
		And I'm looking for that olive branch from the Republicans.
		I'm not yet seeing it, but I like to say that I'm in this business as an optimist.
		I couldn't get through every day and make this drive to D.C. every day if I weren't.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And then before you go, I think you were on the line listening into that caller just before you and I started chatting.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The two videos now that President Trump has posted about Hakeem Jeffries, the sombrero, the mariachi band, your reaction?
unidentified		I have not watched them.
		They are maybe they are funny.
		I mean, the gentleman had a point about humor, but this is, I don't think this example, the president utilizing his social media to poke fun in frankly racist ways at Democratic leadership.
		A, it's beneath the Oval Office.
		And B, if we're talking about a deal and trying to be serious here, that doesn't achieve a deal.
		That exacerbates the situation.
		And again, it's just been beneath the office.
		I don't understand this, President.
		As a man who's known for making deals, this is utter foolishness.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Congresswoman Sarah Elfrith, a Democrat from Maryland.
		It's the third district of Maryland.
		We'll let you get your day of work here.
		Thanks so much for the time this morning.
unidentified		Thank you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Back to your phone calls.
		It's day one of the government shutdown, taking your calls onlines for Republicans, Democrats, Independents, and a special line for federal employees, 202748-8003 is that number.
		This is Alan out of Brooklyn, Democrat.
unidentified		Go ahead.
		Good morning, and thanks very much.
		There's so much to say here.
		First of all, as to that joke video, we really must have in government some ability to rely on the words of our leaders, take them seriously so they cannot choose when to say, I meant a statement in jest or sarcastically and when I meant it seriously, because that allows them to avoid accountability for everything they say.
		We have to remember that there has been massive bribery and violation of emoluments rules, conflicts of interest involving foreign business investments in the range of billions of dollars, and we have no idea what kinds of commitments have been made by this administration to assist other governments or serve their interests before the interests of ours.
		So when Trump is negotiating, supposedly to avoid a shutdown, he may very well have an interest in allowing this shutdown and other activities of his, like his tariffs, to hurt the country for the benefit of other countries.
		I don't know which, but it could be China, Russia, Iran, the Arab states, who knows.
		But as long as we don't know exactly what the terms of these various bribes and investments are, we're at the mercy of people who basically do not have our best interests at heart.
		We also have to remember that we don't live in a real democracy as long as we have an electoral college that does not weight the votes of all citizens equally.
		And I did a calculation assisted by AI a few months ago showing that while the smallest and largest states in the original founding 13 colonies had a ratio of maybe one to four in terms of voting power per capita in the Congress and the Senate when you calculate that there's just two senators per state.
		Today, based on population changes, the lowest to the highest states have a ratio of one to 40 in terms of voting power per capita.
		People in California, New York, populist Democratic states get a fraction of voting power in the Senate per person as people in very sparse states like Wyoming or Utah, which are usually red and Republican states.
		Until people understand that, they will not have the determination to remove these impediments to real democracy because this government does not represent the will of a majority.
		Whether our president is being bribed and serving a foreign power or not, he is not serving a majority of our people.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		It's Alan in Brooklyn.
		This is Rip out of Fredericksburg, Virginia, Republican.
		Good morning.
unidentified		If you ever want to realize how foolish America is, just watch C-SPAN.
		You know, really ridiculous what's going on in our nation.
		I hope we shut down.
		God, I hope we shut down.
		You have to realize that everybody that's getting laid off, it's like a vacation.
		You get your money back.
		If you had anything together and were able to, in any way, gain enough money to just do something, you've got a month off, maybe.
		Free.
		You get all your money.
		Same thing.
		The Postal Service was famous for doing it, and they'd fire somebody to go to arbitration.
		If they'd give them their job back, they'd get all their money back.
		So I said this a long time ago.
		We have over 100 million illegal immigrants in this nation.
		John, you kind of got after me for saying that a year ago when I said it.
		We do.
		And every single thing that's going on right this second is a direct and direct relationship to what Biden did to our country.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The only reason I asked about that.
unidentified		Everybody says, well, I hope this doesn't happen.
		I hope that it's already happened.
		We're done.
		America's done.
		Rip, the only reason I ask about the 100 million number is because there's something like 330-some million people in this country total.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		100 million illegal immigrants would be a whole lot and a lot higher than some of the stats that I've seen.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So I guess where did you get that number?
unidentified		From think tanks have been thrown around for years.
		100 million.
		The general think tank has been throwing it around for years.
		But bottom line is that they told you we had 9 million people for what, 15, 20 years, they told us we had 9 million illegal immigrants.
		No.
		You know, look, we've been lied to all the time.
		It's never going to stop.
		Lying is a tremendous problem in our nation.
		It's not going to stop.
		Everybody does it and can get away with it.
		And it's a game.
		The people who are the enemies of our nation are our politicians.
		Every problem that has taken place in the United States is a direct result of a voted-in individual who has made a choice for us.
		So hope you have a good day, John.
		God bless you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		It's Rip out of Fredericksburg, Virginia.
		We head out to California, Garden Grove.
		This is Jamie, Line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Hello.
		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Bottom line, I used to be an Independent.
		I turned Republican when I saw our country going downhill.
		The lies, the cheating, the stealing.
		We, the people, voted for this in November.
		We watched our country trashed and burned the last four years with lies, and now we're finding out what was being done in the back rooms.
		We, the people voted for this in November, and that was all across the spectrum.
		All race, all creed.
		We voted for this.
		And now the Democrats are tantruming, and they're getting violent.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So, Jamie, I just ask if, as you're calling in as a Republican, make sure you call in on the right lines, just so it's fair to folks on the various lines we have.
		You're calling in online for Democrats, but we'll take your point and want to head now to the Department of Veterans Affairs.
		We're joined by the Secretary of the VA, Doug Collins.
		Secretary Collins, good morning to you, sir.
		Thanks for the time.
		Can you just tell us what's happening at the VA this morning under a shutdown?
		There's a whole lot of people who work at the VA.
unidentified		How many are furloughed, and what is and isn't happening for veterans today?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's good news and bad news, John.
		I think from our perspective, the funding for the VA for our hospitals, our benefits, and disabilities are all continuing to function.
		We're on in a multi-year appropriation.
		So, if you're a veteran out there and you have especially medical needs or you need to get to our hospital or clinics, they're open, they're running.
		Where it's going to be affecting us, especially in the short run, is our regional offices for disability claims.
		New claims are getting questions answered are going to be closed.
		Our counseling, our BRE issues for people getting their vote rehab, how they get into new careers, those are going to be limited.
		Our outreach is going to be limited.
		As it goes further, there could be other things shut down, especially when it comes to getting questions on GI Bill, loan guarantees, those kind of things.
		But right now, we're sitting here watching a very sad situation in which our veterans across the country, not just at the VA, but are going to be affected this.
		many who work in the federal government, many who are affiliated with businesses who do business with the federal government.
		So I think that's the bigger issue we have with our veterans right now.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The New York Times on their chart about who's working and who's not.
		The VA, the largest agency outside of the DOD, some 450 or 60,000 employees, they have it about 15,000 employees being furloughed.
		Does that sound about right to you?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		That's probably about right, yes.
		And I mean, there's different ways we look at it.
		So yes.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So what's the message to veterans watching this morning and a little nervous about what that means?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Call their congressman, tell them to pass the CR.
		I mean, this is an issue that, I mean, very bluntly, this is a shutdown in the making caused by really right now about five more Democrats in the Senate who would vote for a continuing CR, which they voted for in March, to continue it for seven weeks to continue the policy discussions that we have.
		This is a truly self-made problem in Congress and especially right now in the Senate that is keeping us from that.
		I think the veterans, though, as we have just said, especially with their health care, especially with their mental health care, our call lines, our 401, our 1-800, my VA 411 lines are going to be open.
		The vet crisis line is going to be open.
		Our vet centers are going to be open.
		So we're going to continue to minister and work for our veterans to make sure they have what they need.
		But there are many veterans who work in the federal government.
		It is sort of surprising to me that the same folks on Capitol Hill who were so upset with veterans and veterans working in Capitol Hill when they were discussing how we were reorganizing our department seem to be very silent now that those same veterans are going to have to be furloughed because they won't continue the government funding.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Are you expecting the Office of Management and Budget to step in and let go more people in the VA during the shutdown?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Is that something that could impact VA employees?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Not at this point.
		I think we're working with OMB to make sure that we're focused on our employees and we've been working with them all along.
		I think the great thing that we have had is we've been able to reshape our force through folks who took early retirement in that process and we've reshaped it.
		It's been publicly reported about 30,000 over the past nine months and at the same time.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		30,000 fewer employees?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Yes, fewer employees since the first of the year.
		Now I have to say that and also caveat at this before anybody starts saying that it's affected veterans service.
		Our wait times at our hospitals, our C-Box all have gone down and we've also shaved off almost 50% off of a backlog of disability claims that were over 125 days old.
		And I have to report also that yesterday, as of yesterday, we did 3 million disability claims.
		The previous record was 2.4 million.
		The VA is working efficiently right now and we're working it through with some great employees.
		I'm very proud of them.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		You have the unique perspective of having seen these funding fights on the congressional side when you're in Congress and now as the head of an agency.
		What sticks out to you?
		What would you tell the folks who are on Capitol Hill going through the politics of this as you go through the day-to-day impacts?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, John, it's a great question.
		And I've thought about this a lot over the last little bit.
		I look back on it a little bit differently and also been involved in Daniels.
		When you make demands, especially at times like this, it's going to be very difficult to get those.
		Those policy discussions should have happened earlier in what is frankly a broken appropriation system.
		But I mean, really, the one thing that people need to alert themselves to now is that we're at a time in which, again, you're in a CR.
		We've been in the CR for a continuing resolution for a while.
		This is simply extending that for seven more weeks.
		The discussions that I've seen many of my former colleagues on the Democratic side wanting to talk about health care and the Obamacare issue does not expire until the end of December.
		And they're using this right now to hold the American people hostage over this issue.
		And the realization is, is what they're asking for is about like if you had a house that was valued a million dollars on the market and somebody said, I'll offer you $50 for it.
		Are you going to take that offer seriously?
		This is what they're offering is cutting out $50 billion for rural health care.
		I'll say it's taking and adding back stuff that has been already done.
		I think this is the problem we're having.
		There's no negotiation when your offer is not reasonable.
		And that's the problem we're seeing right now.
		So I would just tell them, get in a room, solve it.
		Remember that they work for the American people as we all do.
		And I think they will at some point.
		This is a lot of times posturing, but it is unfortunate posturing because it's about people that get hurt.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		When you say you think they will solve it, do you think they will extend those health care subsidies dating back from the Affordable Care Act?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		That's the great thing about not being in Congress.
		That's their problem to figure out.
		I think what they need to do is pass the CR, get us continuing on.
		We've done this many times before, especially from the perspective over the last few years.
		You put this further down the line, then deal with the issues.
		I think, frankly, passing a clean CR, adjusted for inflation, is the best way to do this.
		If you need more time, get more time and then solve those issues through the regular process.
		We've gotten too adept at spending through non-regular processes, which has caused a lot of the issues we have.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And then finally, Secretary Collins, where are you going to be today?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What does the day look like for you under a shutdown?
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely packed.
		We're here at the office.
		I got meetings all day today.
		I'm going to be with media all day today.
		And I appreciate you letting us come on to share the fact that our veterans are first here at the VA, that we're going to continue our health care.
		We're going to continue processing their disability claims.
		And I've got workers who are willing to come in and be a part of that.
		So that's what we're going to be doing today, full steam ahead here at the VA.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Well, we'll let you get to it, Veteran Affairs Secretary Doug Collins.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Always appreciate your time, sir.
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		Take care, John.
doug collins ▲ ● ▼		It's good to see you.
unidentified		Take care.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Back to your phone calls on government shutdown day one.
		We are seven hours and 52 minutes into this latest government shutdown.
		The most recent one lasted about 35 days, and we'll see how long this one lasts.
		We're expected to hear from Democratic and Republican leaders this morning in the 10 a.m. and 11 a.m. Eastern hours, and we'll bring it to you here on C-SPAN when it happens.
		We'll also bring you any activity from the White House.
		And we're taking your phone calls in this first hour.
		Line for Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, and a special line for federal employees.
		This is Joseph in South Carolina, Independent.
		Go ahead.
		Joseph, you with us?
		Got to stick by your phone, Joseph.
		This is Kevin Venn out of Gainesville, Florida, Republican.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning, America.
		My comment would be: wow.
		I sit here and listen to all these people, like the lady from Connecticut, how ill-informed they are.
		They want an extra trillion dollars for three months to help the illegal immigrants that they let in.
		Please, thank goodness the Republicans are in charge now.
		Take care of America.
		Thank you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Kevin.
		We'll try Joseph again on that line for independence.
		Joseph, you there this time?
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		I am directly affected by the shutdown.
		My granddaughter is a senior staff member for a Democrat congressman.
		He happens to be a senator.
		But right now, I would be happy to have Newt Gingrich and Zip O'Neill present to negotiate this problem.
		I think health care is a much, there's a much bigger picture that we don't even understand.
		But fortunately, I think we have a president that is going to attack the issues and train our next president to be a little more civil in his approach.
		And I don't agree with making fun of congressional leaders or the president of the United States.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Joseph in South Carolina.
		The caller before brought up the issue of undocumented immigrants and health care.
		Chuck Schumer taking on that topic and that charge by Republicans on the Senate floor yesterday.
		Here's a bit of what he had to say.
chuck schumer ▲ ● ▼		And then I spoke to Speaker Johnson directly in the room.
		I told him because he can't debate health care, because he knows it's not, the American people are on the side of wanting these increases, even Republicans, I told them to stop making up stories that too many Republicans are lying through their teeth.
		They say, oh, the Democrats want undocumented immigrants to get health care, to get the federal dollars of health care.
		That is utter bull.
unidentified		And they know it.
chuck schumer ▲ ● ▼		The law, the law, prohibits undocumented immigrants from getting payments from Medicare, Medicaid, or the ACA.
		There's no money, not a penny of federal dollars that are going there.
		So why do they bring this up?
		Because they're afraid to talk about the real issue, which is health care for American citizens, health care for people who need the health care and can't afford these premiums.
		Let me say it again.
		Undocumented immigrants cannot receive premium tax credits by law.
		So they should stop these lies and address the real issue, which of course they're afraid to do.
		A standard Republican MO.
		A standard Republican MO is to make something else up because the American people are on our side.
		Now, this week, here's what House Republicans sent out guidance to their members.
		They said, quote, not to make out health care because Republicans lose that argument.
		They're right.
		Their position is callous, malicious, unpopular.
		So they're not only refusing to talk about health care, but apparently when they do, it's only to spread misinformation, to spread lies.
		I said this to Speaker Johnson in the Oval Office yesterday.
		I told him it was total bull, I think that's the word I used, to say that we want undocumented immigrants to get federal benefits, that it can't happen by law, and nothing we've proposed in our bill changes that.
		He sort of smirked.
		That's it, because he knows the truth.
		He knows the truth.
		And they're lying to the American people, these Republicans who use this, because they know how unpopular their position is.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Senator Chuck Schumer on the Senate floor yesterday.
		The Senate will be back in session today.
		We've been showing you live shots this morning of the Capitol and of the National Mall.
		There's a shot of the Martin Luther King Jr. Memorial on the National Mall.
		The National Mall, one of those places likely to be impacted by the federal shutdown, as Congressman Jamie Raskin of Maryland notes in his guide for navigating a shutdown, here's his note about national parks.
		The Department of the Interior will likely close most national park sites during a shutdown, recommending that those who want to visit verify the status of any attraction before visiting.
		Indoor facilities like the Smithsonian Museums and the National Gallery of Art on the Mall will operate as normal through October 6th, he notes.
		When it comes to visiting D.C., some popular attractions will be affected.
		All individuals interested in attractions in D.C. should reach out to the Office of the Attraction for Day of Information, just some getting around D.C. guidance from Congressman Jamie Raskin, who lives just across the border of D.C. in Maryland.
		His navigating the shutdown list that he put out on his website yesterday.
		Back to your phone calls.
		This is Furman in Sanston, Virginia.
		Democrat, good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, sir.
		Thanks for having me.
		Glad to be on the show today for America.
		I've enjoyed watching your show for some time, and I'm glad you're trying to get American people involved by what's going on.
		But the real common sense problem we're having is people have lost sight of humanity and how to govern our nation.
		I mean, they talk about what the American people want.
		What we want is civility and stability and good communication.
		I'm waiting for the day when we'll see real Republicans, real Democrats work for everybody in our nation.
		I mean, what happened to the idea of, you know, Republicans present the things that they're strong on or want to go forward.
		Democrats present the things they want.
		And instead of laughing at one another and mocking one another, they stand strong against each other and they don't do anything for the people.
		And I think people are delusional.
		If they think that right now that our country is designed, lean for or against one party, they have that all wrong.
		We're not for one party.
		We're in a phase right now.
		If we're not careful, there won't be a future America as a democracy in the Republic we all stand for.
		And it's a shame that veterans today are at home.
		I'm a veteran, served proudly for eight years, loved this country, love God, love obeying the law.
		I love D.C., and I love what America was designed and stood for and where we are now.
		But it's a shame that we let petty things get in the way.
		I agree with one of the earlier callers that said it's time you stop poking the bear and making fun of one another and go to the issues.
		Americans are not interested in some barrel hats by the president or Mr. Jeffries or whoever else they're mocking.
		We're interested in getting things done.
		And how are you getting things done when you keep pouncing on what you got successful on?
		Speaking of Republicans, they pounce on how poorly immigration was handled by the Democrats, yet they never pounce on what people really are worried about right now.
		And that's their jobs, that's their cost of living, their medical care.
		Education in our country is eroding by the millions and billions.
		And I also want to point out something I heard a couple days ago that no one's talking about.
		How do you take money from American people who need health care, veterans and civilians, but you'll give $20 billion plus to Argentina for them to do their things?
		And they're not a democracy as we know it.
		And yet you won't take care of your own people.
		How do you vote Republican or Democrat when Democrats and Republicans allow these kind of things to happen?
		And where is the voice of Democratic people today?
		Why won't they stand up and shout to the rooftop?
		It is not legal to pay illegal immigrants for medical rights and things of Medicare Make A.
		It's just not legal.
		They cannot get access to that.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Furman, got your point.
		Furman, our last caller in this first section of the Washington Journal today, but stick around.
		Plenty more to discuss when it comes to the shutdown.
		And in our next hour, we'll be joined by Roll Call Editor-in-Chief Jason Dick and White House reporter from Notice, Jasmine Wright.
		Your questions, your comments, right after the break.
		Stick around.
		be right back.
unidentified		So you interviewed the other night.
		I watched it about two o'clock in the morning.
		There was a little thing called C-SPAN, which I don't know how many people were watching.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		Don't worry, you were on primetime too, but they happened to have a little rerun.
patty murray ▲ ● ▼		Do you really think that we don't remember what just happened last week?
patty murray ▲ ● ▼		Thank goodness for C-SPAN, and we all should review the tape.
unidentified		Everyone wonders when they're watching C-SPAN what the conversations are on the floor.
al green ▲ ● ▼		I'm about to read to you something that was published by C-SPAN.
sean duffy ▲ ● ▼		There's a lot of things that Congress fights about, that they disagree on.
unidentified		We can all watch that on C-SPAN.
		Millions of people across the country tuned into C-SPAN.
		That was a major C-SPAN moment.
		If you watch on C-SPAN, you're going to see me physically across the aisle every day, just trying to build relationships and try to understand their perspective and find common ground.
		And welcome forward to everybody watching at home.
		We know C-SPAN covers this live as well.
		We appreciate that.
		And one can only hope that he's able to watch C-SPAN on a black and white television set in his prison cell.
		This is being carried live by C-SPAN.
		It's being watched not only in this country, but it's being watched around the world right now.
		Mike said before I happened to listen to him, he was on C-SPAN 1.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		That's a big upgrade, right?
unidentified		There are many ways to listen to C-SPAN radio anytime, anywhere.
		In the Washington, D.C. area, listen on 90.1 FM.
		Use our free C-SPAN Now app or go online to c-span.org slash radio on SiriusXM radio on channel 455, the TuneIn app, and on your smart speaker by simply saying play C-SPAN radio.
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		Download it for free today.
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		Washington Journal continues.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		A roundtable conversation now on shutdown day one.
unidentified		We're joined by Jasmine Wright of Notice, White House correspondent there, Jason Dick of Roll Call Editor-in-Chief.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jason Dick, day one of a shutdown.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		At what point will we know whether this is going to be many days or a short shutdown fight like we've seen in the past?
unidentified		I think we'll know fairly soon.
		It seems like neither side really has any incentive, at least right now, from their own perception, to make a deal, any kind of quick deal.
		Democrats think that they have the public on their side, and they're citing that insurance companies are going to start informing people today that their rates will go up for those who are on the exchanges.
		This is what the big fight is over the shutdown.
		So Democrats certainly have an, you know, they think that they can wait that out and let that sort of sink in.
		Republicans saw some signs that they can get some Democratic support last night for their own proposal.
		They had three Democrats, John Fetterman and Catherine Carrington.
		And Angus King, an independent who caucuses with Democrats, cross the aisle and support it.
		We'll have a couple more votes today in the Senate that will Republicans hope that they can get a few more Democrats.
		But it seems like right now we're in a little bit of a stalemate.
		And then, of course, Thursday, the Senate's not going to be in session.
		So be it because of the Yom Kippur Sor.
		I think it's going to be a little while before we have any kind of breakthrough.
		But there's also no negotiation that we know of that's really taking place.
		So there's nothing substantive.
		Nobody's giving ground.
		They're just sort of taking potshots at one another.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		I want to come back to that vote last night in a second.
		But Jasmine, what are you watching for from the White House today?
		The president, of course, has the bully pulpit.
		What do we know about his schedule today?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, well, when I left the White House last night around 6.30 p.m., people were pretty much nonchalant.
		They were kind of filing out.
		Now, of course, there are going to be some furloughs in the White House.
		We are going to see Caroline Levitt, the White House press secretary, speak today at 1 o'clock.
		Will be kind of the first time that we are, as scheduled so far right now, going to see the White House kind of come out in full force against the Democrats, who I think they genuinely believe will bear the brunt of this shutdown.
		I've talked to a lot of White House officials over the course of the last few days who have kind of gone back to that tried and true tradition, which is that the party who does not vote for the clean CR gets blamed for the shutdown.
		Now, the Democrats absolutely do not believe that.
		They think that they have a lot of leverage right now, and they think that, like you said, that the people are on their side.
		But the White House says that they've been planning for weeks on how to address a shutdown should it come.
		And so I think you're going to start to see some of that planning happening right now.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What do we know about the president's schedule in the days to come?
unidentified		Is he going to be sticking around D.C. and fight this fight in D.C.?
unidentified		Is he going out and taking his message around the country?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What do we know?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		I haven't heard anything about travel.
		The president has, I think, as a lot of people have seen over the last few weeks, have been spending his weekends in D.C.
		I think you can probably expect that to continue.
		But, you know, the president did three different press surveys yesterday.
		I don't believe he has any open events on his schedule today, but obviously that can just change.
		He calls reporters into the Oval Office all the time.
		But he has been kind of very on message on this, although yesterday he did say that a shutdown could be a good thing.
		And he did, you know, basically say that they could cut a lot of programs that Democrats like.
		They could cut medical benefits.
		But relatively, he's been kind of on message saying that the Democrats will bear the brunt for this.
		And so that's the White House's position.
		I think you're going to see them try to really nail that in the wall today.
		But the question is, is how long does it last?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jason, did come back to that vote last night to the clean CR to keep the government funded.
		This was the one that was passed by the House and the Senate is put on the floor a couple of times now.
		So Captain Cortez-Masto of Nevada, John Fetterman of Pennsylvania, and then Angus King of Maine joined Republicans in that vote.
unidentified		Rand Paul joins Democrats in voting against it.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Can you just talk through the dynamics there?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And are there other Democrats, who's the most likely Democrat that Republicans could peel off next to try to get to that 60 number to pass that legislation?
unidentified		Yeah, I mean, the politics are kind of interesting for those four that went across the aisle.
		For Rand Paul, it's fairly simple.
		He says that he will oppose continuing resolutions, period, full stop.
		And he's sort of adhered to that for the most part in the recent past.
		So Republicans have to put that in their calculus that they may not be able to get Rand Paul.
		So they have to get one more Democrat to get to 60, to cut off debate or even if it came to 59, Rand Paul's not going to be the 60th for them.
		I mean, I can't speak for Rand Paul, but we'll see.
		Things never change until everything changes, right?
		For the Democrats, it becomes a little more interesting and is more individual.
		Angus King is very much an institutionalist.
		He's a governor.
		He has his own sort of power base.
		He's been around Maine politics and the United States Senate for a long time.
		He was a former staffer before he got into public office.
		He doesn't really believe in shutdowns in the same way that some people have come to think of them as political leverage for getting their agenda.
		Catherine Cortez-Masto, she's like, listen, this causes measurable harm.
		This is the sort of thing where we can disagree on things, but the basic functioning of government is a good thing, and shutting it down has harms.
		And Fetterman, I think Fetterman understands the politics of his state very well.
		I'm sorry, his Commonwealth, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, very well and knows that there are going to be, I mean, Pennsylvania is a quintessential swing state.
		There are probably about half the people who are going to think the Republicans' way and half the people with the Democrats' way, or maybe a third, a third, and a third think everybody's to blame.
		And Fetterman has been upfront in saying we should not not shut the government down either.
		There was a little bit of drama on the floor last night in terms of other Democrats that might be persuadable.
		New Hampshire's two senators, Gene Shaheen, who's retiring and also doesn't have to worry about a primary or anything like that.
		And then Maggie Hassan.
		They're both former governors.
		They're both, you know, they're also coming from a Democratic leaning state, but it's very much a swing state.
		And there was some chatter that they almost voted for it, but ultimately did not.
		So if they could get that, that gets them to 57 if they retain Fetterman and King and Catherine Cortez-Masto.
		And then it starts, we'll just see what public pressure is on that.
		And I'd just like to say that regardless of how this plays out politically, there's no way to tell, right?
		I mean, we have a pretty divided country in terms of the opinion.
		Democrats think that they have a good argument.
		Republicans think they have a good argument.
		Everybody's on message.
		But there is not just measurable harm in terms of like, oh, you know, the Washington Monument elevator isn't going to be running or something.
		The Congressional Budget Office yesterday estimated that it's going to cost about $400 million a day in order to make whole the people who are furloughed in the federal government.
		So we're talking about around 750,000 people.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And that's something by law that will happen.
unidentified		Right.
unidentified		That will happen.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		These people will get back pay.
unidentified		Correct.
		And to the tune of, you know, so the federal government's going to spend $400 million a day for people to stay at home.
		Yeah, to not work.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Speaking of votes, last night's vote, take me to a different vote, Jasmine Bryce Wright, Russ vote.
		Yeah.
		And the factor he could play in over the coming days and especially weeks if this goes on that long.
unidentified		Yeah.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think the alarm first came last week when the Office of Management Budget, the office that he leads inside of the executive, released a letter to the agencies basically saying to prepare for potential reduction in forces rifts.
		And that kind of put it on the radar that the White House could use this lapse in government funding to institute some pre-planned rifts that they would probably already come in the fall, but would put during the shutdown because it makes it easier.
		Obviously, we know that the way that they make up the government right now is, is a lot of people have been laid off, and some of those layoffs are kind of stuck in the federal judiciary as these kind of frontline judges decide whether or not those are kind of legally binding layoffs.
		Also, other agencies that had laid off a lot of people in the beginning of the year had tried to invite folks back because they realized they didn't have enough workforce.
		And so the question is, one, where could these kind of reduction in forces come from?
		But this is a very real thing.
		The president talked about it yesterday in the Oval Office.
		And this is kind of a baby of Russ Vote, who is somebody who is really principled in the idea that government should be much smaller, that the federal government has gotten too swollen, too fat, too much fraud, and too much waste.
		And part of that cut could come from the actual federal workforce.
		And then we can talk about all of these kind of programs that the president has hinted at that they could cut that would be more democratic programs.
		He said programs that Democrats are in favor of that Republicans have always wanted to cut, but they haven't been able to, that this shutdown could potentially give them the opportunity.
		Now, the biggest question is whether or not this is a threat to get Democrats to come to the table.
		Obviously, it did not work because we are currently in a shutdown right now, or whether or not these are actionable things that they have been planning to really try to turn up the heat on Democrats now that we are in a shutdown to try to get them to come back to the table.
		But the White House doesn't seem in a position like they are wanting or feel inclined to negotiate.
		When I was in there yesterday, I continued to ask, how long can you suffer?
		And the answer was, is that we'll take this day by day.
		And so I think that they are certainly planning things, whether or not they come to fruition or how large, because you know that they have been inviting people to come back to the government is one thing.
		But certainly Russ Vote kind of, I think, has just this mega plan in the executive building ready to institute it now that the shutdown is happening.
		And it's whether or not the White House has a summit for it.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Two of the best in the business joining us this morning, Jasmine Wright of Notice, White House reporter there, and Jason Dick of Roll Call Editor-in-Chief there.
		Your phone calls are appreciated this morning, especially for federal employees.
		Special line 202748-8003 is the number for federal employees.
		Otherwise, lines for Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, as usual, Jason Dick, as folks are calling in, a reporter that you and I know pretty well, Paul Kane over at the Washington Post.
		He's writing about the shutdown in today's paper.
		With the Senate's center hollowed out, a long shutdown may be here.
		Paul Kane, wondering who would actually be the one to do the negotiations here?
		Who are the people that can come together in Congress to actually come up with a plan to end this shutdown, saying there's not much of a center anymore to do that?
unidentified		Yeah, that's right.
		I think Paul's absolutely right in this is that in the recent past and over the last course of the last couple of decades, when there was a particularly difficult topic that leadership was sort of locked up on, you'd see these bipartisan gangs, they like to call themselves.
		I don't know why they've settled on gangs, but whatever.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Gang of 8,000.
unidentified		Gang of 12, you know.
		And so they formed usually about an equal number from each party and formed to get through, say, the nuking of the filibuster in the early 2000s over judicial nominees or immigration, something that didn't bear a lot of fruit.
		And these gangs have basically have faded.
		I mean, there was a group that was working on immigration last year and it sort of withered.
		They thought that they had a plan to address immigration, to address border security and immigration processing.
		And Trump said, told the Republicans, don't make a deal with Democrats.
		This is a good issue for us in the 2024 elections.
		That was the last sort of, I think, legit effort on a bipartisan basis to come up with something.
		And I'm not, there are negotiations on appropriations bills happening among appropriators in the House and Senate.
		I'm not trying to belittle those.
		But to our friend P.K. and his analysis of this, I think it's right.
		There isn't an obvious Joe Manchin, Kirsten Sinema, Lamar Alexander, Bob Corker who's going to assemble people and say, we need to show the leadership that is missing here and find a way forward.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jasmine Wright, does President Trump have a favorite negotiating partner among House or Senate Democrats?
		And if not, President Trump.
		What about JD Vance, who served in the Senate?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I don't know if President Trump would say he has a favorite.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		True Social the other day that he had just met Hakeem Jeffries for the first time when they were in the Oval office on Monday trying to do their first bicameral meeting of this actual entire negotiation process.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And that went in an unusual direction in True Social Afterwards.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and then it ended with a video, which not a lot of people thought was very helpful to the situation.
		And he's obviously had a very long history with Chuck Schumer, but he's been extremely critical of Chuck Schumer, as has Chuck Schumer been extremely critical of him.
		So I'm not sure that President Trump would identify Chuck Schumer as his favorite.
		Now, JD Vance is a different story because he has been off and on Capitol Hill as vice president repeatedly over some of these deals, but certainly, obviously, he served as a senator.
		I would argue, though, that Republicans have basically been negotiating with Republicans.
		This White House hasn't seemed incredibly inclined to bring in Democrats in on a lot of these issues.
		I think that that has led to where we are today, saying that they weren't involved in negotiations just a few months ago.
		And so I don't think that there is a lot of shared love between any type of House or Senate Democrat negotiators with this White House because I think that they feel genuinely cut out of the process.
		And if they do make a deal with the White House, a lot of them have complained to me over the last few weeks is that they believe that Donald Trump then, once they have a handshake deal, can go and just alter it on his own or do the rescissions that they promised they wouldn't do and all those types of things.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So Jason Dick, with Mitch McConnell no longer in Senate Republican leadership, who does Chuck Schumer most likely turn to if he says, okay, it's time to make a deal?
unidentified		That's another great question because it's not obvious.
		I mean, there are some people on the Republican side who, if you look at the way that they have addressed what's happening right now, they're not kind of going for the throat.
		They're not, you know, like saying things like we saw on some federal websites that the radical left was shutting the government down, that kind of thing.
		I'm thinking of people like James Lankford, you know, who has frequently brought up that we, you know, legislation, his own legislation, that would prevent government shutdowns from happening.
		It would basically kick in an automatic CR as they're negotiating.
		You know, that, I think the most recent version of that got around 30 some odd votes, so it hasn't gone anywhere with his colleagues.
		But he's somebody, I think, who believes in the process.
		He was part of this immigration group last year with Chris Murphy and others.
		John Curtis, if you look at his, he's the freshman senator from Utah who took Mitt Romney's place in the Senate.
		His release, his statement was very not conciliatory, but like, let's work on this together.
		Let's figure out a way that the public and the institution can work better.
		And I want to be a part of that solution.
		And he was in the chair also for some of this debate yesterday on these two resolutions and does not come across in appearance or in statement as some sort of fire breather.
		So maybe those are a couple of people.
		But again, I don't have any, there hasn't been any public outreach to Republicans in such a way.
		There's just been sort of vague, like, let's all work together.
		Another person who may be, you know, someone who can work on things, I mean, they, you know, Democrats frequently look to Lisa Murkowski and Susan Collins to make deals.
		On this, they seem very much, you know, like on the area of like, hey, let's just get the CR pass first and then we can talk about policy differences, which is actually remarkably similar to Cortez Masto's statement.
		And then Jerry Moran, you know, yesterday, the senator from Kansas, he also said, I get it, you know, we have policy differences and we should debate them and have a robust sort of consideration of them.
		But can we we're almost done with the you know actual appropriations bills.
		He's an appropriator and he's like can we just pass the get the CR, buy us some time, finish the appropriation bills, and then we can get onto these issues because there are a lot of Republicans who feel that the ACA subsidies issue is something that they can possibly get a deal on.
		So those are people who have had sort of public reaching out, but it's not clear that they're going to be able to make that leap to embrace some of Democrats' demands.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The public reaching out to chat with you two, including Bruce in South Carolina up first line for Democrats.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Bruce, you're on with Jasmine Bright and Jason Dick.
unidentified		Hey, good morning, everybody.
		To Jasmine's point, Jove's point, America can't trust the Republican Party in what they say when they're going to make a deal because they break it thanks to our new president, Trump.
		I'd like to make an analogy.
		Thumb said yesterday that all they have to do is sign this deal and move on.
		And in several weeks, we'll be able to renegotiate and talk about the Affordable Care Act.
		Fact of the matter is that they lie every time they make a deal and promise they take it back.
		And I'll give you a quick analogy, and I'll get off the phone and listen to it on air.
		If I went for a ride in a car with a used car salesman, and I heard a loud knocking noise, I like the car, but I hear a loud knocking noise, and I say to the salesman in the car with me, I'd like to buy it, but you've got to fix this car before I buy it.
		And he says, well, I'll tell you what.
		Young man, let's go back to my office and sign these documents, and you can have the car in your name.
		And when my mechanic comes back from vacation in a couple of weeks, about seven weeks, we'll get that car fixed.
		Would you buy that car?
		Would you buy it?
		Because that's what Thumb and Collins and the President are saying.
		They are saying, buy this deal, and then we'll fix it.
		And they're lying because immigrants are not entitled and never have been entitled to health care in our country if they're undocumented.
		That's the fact.
		Google it, check it, call your congressmen, your senators, and find out what the truth is because that's the truth.
		They're lying to you.
		They're taking away your health care and they're raising the premiums.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Got your point, Bruce, in South Carolina.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jasmine Wright, what did you want to pick up on there?
unidentified		Yeah, well, this is Hakeem Jeffries' point fundamentally.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		I was at the White House on Monday when they came out to the sticks.
unidentified		I talked to reporters, didn't take any questions, by the way.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Where to the sticks?
		To the stakeout right in front of the West Wing building that you would see Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries there Monday afternoon.
		And Hakeem Jeffries basically made the point that they are no longer accepting handshakes for these type of deals when they're talking about ACA subsidies.
		So basically, this idea that you sign a clean CR now and then you have a handshake agreement to really talk about the ACAs down the line.
		Hakeem Jeffries says that that's unacceptable.
		Now, I think interestingly, in that stakeout, they talked about how President Trump seemed more open to dealing with ACA subsidies.
		JD Vance, in different language, of course, kind of mirrored that Donald Trump said that he would be open to kind of discussing health care.
		But, you know, I think that you kind of run into the problem of you're open to discussing health care, but you don't want to negotiate on the front end.
		Now, you don't want to negotiate on the back end.
		So when does a negotiation happen?
		And it's kind of like both sides are waiting for the other to blink, both the White House and Republicans and Democrats, and it's unclear when they do.
		But yes, this is Hawkeye Jeffrey's point: is that they cannot trust the White House to fulfill a deal fundamentally, in part because of obviously they've been emboldened by the Supreme Court decision on rescissions that allowed them to take billions of dollars of already planned foreign money, congressionally allocated foreign money and other things that have emboldened to act unilaterally without Congress.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And Jason Dick, isn't this the argument by Democrats that we can't trust the deal?
		Why they say that this is different than in the past when Democrats were in charge and Democrats said it's irresponsible to shut down the government.
		It's okay to have a negotiation, but we have to keep the government funded and then we'll have these negotiations.
		Why they're saying this is not hypocrisy this time to have this shut down and negotiate for ACA subsidies.
unidentified		Yeah, I mean, and the issue, you know, as Jasmine was, you know, great analysis of it too, is that there is a trust gap.
		You know, that in the past, you know, if you had a deal on something, and appropriations bills need to clear a 60-vote hurdle, you know, to cut off debate.
		So that takes a lot of give and take among both parties because one party rarely has that many votes.
		So you have to cooperate across the aisle.
		So you get a deal that gets 60 votes in the Senate and it gets signed into law.
		And that's, you know, Article 1 of the Constitution says that Congress has the power of the purse and that the executive must faithfully execute the laws.
		And the executive branch, you know, particularly Rust Vote, has a different view of that.
		They think that they do have the authority to impound money.
		They think that the Budget Control Act that governs this stuff is unconstitutional.
		And so they're withholding funds unilaterally, or they're sending other, you know, a package that only requires majority support in the Senate to claw back money that's already been appropriated.
		So without those kind of guarantees that this kind of stuff won't happen again, Democrats say, why should we trust what you say?
		And so, you know, to caller's point, there's a level of trust that's not there anymore on deals.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Let me head to Raquel in Papado Beach, Florida, line four Democrats.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Hi, John.
		Hi, guys.
		Good morning.
		I'm kind of nervous, so please bear with me.
		I just have been living this country.
		As you can hear, I'm an immigrant.
		I have been living this country for 20 years.
		I have always been a green card holder.
		18 years back, I used to live in upstate New York, and I had my daughter.
		And I qualified.
		Yes, I qualified for Medicaid.
		And I'm sorry, I qualified for Medicaid.
		And after one month of my daughter being born, I lost Medicaid.
		So I just want to clarify something for the Republicans and for Donald Trump.
		We don't get health insurance.
		I have been married to an American.
		I was a green card holder back then.
		Now I'm a citizen.
		Three years later, I had my daughter.
		We moved to Florida.
		As I said, being married to an American and being a green card holder in Florida, I did not qualify for Medicaid.
		I went to a place, I don't recall now because it has been so many years.
		Well, I had every visit, I had to make up minimal payments.
		But yes, John, I'm sorry, I'm so nervous.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		No, Raquel, thanks for sharing your story.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		You bring up a key part of this fight, The charge by Republicans that what Democrats are fighting for here is health care subsidies for illegal immigrants.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's the crux of this fight.
		And so they're kind of playing with the language here a little bit, to be kind.
		Basically, what the Democrats want to do is that they, in the One Big Beautiful bill, Republicans successfully narrowed who is eligible to receive these ACA subsidies, who's able to receive these health care benefits.
		And what Democrats want to do is basically go back and revert that.
		Now, that would include, and you correct me if I'm wrong, but that would include, I believe, folks who have temporary protected status and folks who are in this country legally, even though they are not American citizens.
		So they are not by definition illegal immigrants.
		They are not undocumented immigrants.
		And so it would include, again, TPS folks and other folks, but it would include undocumented immigrants.
		And so the Democrats are saying we just want to open it back up to where it was.
		Republicans are saying that would include undocumented immigrants, but that is not true because legally, undocumented immigrants are not eligible for health care in this country.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jason, you want to add?
unidentified		Yeah, I mean, and we should just note that unauthorized immigrants are not eligible for public subsidies, public health care.
		I mean, they can buy health care if they want on their own, and many of them do.
		Or they get it through a spouse or something like that.
		So it's, yeah, I think that that's spot on.
		And this has been an issue that the Republican Party feels that they have an advantage on, like their messaging.
		Democrats have played a lot of defense on it.
		And it's hard to get across in soundbite territory what you just said and what Maquell was saying on the call because it's just not that easy.
		It's very easy to say they want to give subsidies to illegal immigrants.
		It's a little more complicated to say, actually, I am authorized to be here.
		I have a green card or I have temporary protected status.
		I mean, like, that doesn't fit into.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And then there's all emergency services at hospitals.
unidentified		Yeah, that doesn't fit into a tweet.
unidentified		And I think that the problem is that there is so much communication and argumentation and quote-unquote debate happening via social media, and it doesn't really get at the complexity of people's real lives.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Speaking of social media, just one of the posts from last night, there were plenty of posts about the lights going off in D.C., members tweeting out exactly at midnight about the shutdown.
		But here's one of the posts about the blame game for the shutdown.
		Eric Burleson, Republican of Missouri, on the Schumer shutdown.
		Since 1976, the government has shut down 20 times.
		But how about a shutdown in this world of social media and memes and messaging and artificial intelligence?
unidentified		To be like fussy and stodgy about it, it doesn't help.
		It's nonsense.
		It's, you know, the intent, what's the intent here?
		The intent is to sort of get their position to let their followers know that the other people are not serious.
		But again, does this help us get to a solution?
		I don't think so.
		I mean, like, this, you know, when you're talking about people starting today who are not going to be paid for doing air traffic control or border patrol or TSA or in the military, you know, I mean, when you're talking about like that, those are actual consequences.
		And while it may feel good and fun to mock people on social media, it doesn't help actually solve an adult problem.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jasmine Wright.
		So that context with Donald Trump and his penchant for his true social posts.
		And he had another one last night about Hakeem Jeffries.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, and I imagine that they will continue to happen, even if probably they settle on a decision for the shutdown.
		Donald Trump is a prolific true socialer, prolific social media.
		He has leaned into the use of AI to create videos.
		He's consistently posting sometimes to let people know what's happening and other times, I think, to poke at his rivals.
		And I think that the Democrats have kind of gotten stuck into this pattern in which they're responding to Donald Trump's true socials.
		Again, kind of being on the defensive versus making an offensive messaging.
		I mean, I think that we have to kind of look at it from, if you're looking at it from a political lens, the Democrats are under a lot of pressure from their base to make sure that they are in a fighting position against Donald Trump.
		After the march shutdown was narrowly averted, Chuck Schumer got the brunt of pushback from his base who felt that he kind of rolled over to Donald Trump.
		And so I think that, yes, we are talking about health cost subsidies.
		We're talking about people's real-life premiums going up, but I think you can't really divorce the amount of pressure that Democrats are under when it comes to looking like they are fighting against Donald Trump.
		And so, yes, they're going to use social media.
		They're going to do a 24-hour live, but also so are the Republicans.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		A 24-hour live.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Explain what's going on with that.
unidentified		There's a feed sort of, you know, show.
		Again, I might have to defer a little bit on this.
		But I mean, there's a feed that the Democrats have to show like sort of the consequences and to make their points, you know, is the upshot on it.
		And I can't imagine how popular that is.
		And boy, if you draw the short stick on having to, it's kind of like, you know, freshman senators who have to spend a lot of time in the chair presiding over the chamber because they're the low people on the totem pole.
		Again, who is paying attention to this stuff?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Who's their audience?
unidentified		Yeah, what's the audience?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Young people watch lives.
unidentified		Yeah, I don't, I can't imagine.
		But again, they're sort of, when you're competing on social media with Donald Trump, you've already kind of lost.
		He's very good at it.
		So maybe I don't have advice.
		I like to identify problems but not solve them necessarily as journalists.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		I'm journalists.
unidentified		And I can say that if this is the proposed solution, somebody somewhere else came up with that strategy.
unidentified		I think that we're still stuck with the problem, though.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		More colors.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		This is Dave out of Lynchburg, Virginia Independent.
unidentified		Dave, thanks for waiting.
		I was just going to comment that Rand Paul probably has the only real supportive opposition saying that both Democrats and Republicans want to add $2 trillion or $3 trillion to the debt with their plan where he wants a,
		I think he's got some kind of plan, which is a penny plan or something like that and reductions, which I've kind of been an advocate for for a long time is why don't they just get the cabinet people together and say, look, this is how much we're overspending.
		Everybody has to go through and go through their budgets with their teams and cut their budgets by X number of percent so that we can get to a balanced budget.
		You know, we're cutting all these things in government, all these things that maybe we should have to do without so we get a balanced budget so we go forward, so we start paying down the debt so our children will not have to deal with this.
		I mean, what's the end game?
		How do we get out of the debt?
		And could you have a clip from Rand Paul's plan when he spoke out on the floor that you maybe can play so that we can react to it?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Dave, thanks for the call from Lynchburg, Virginia.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jasmine Wright, do you think this shutdown fight, if it goes another 35 days like the one did in the first Trump administration, does it get us any closer to a balanced budget amendment or some way to solve this problem in the future to keep this from happening?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Dave, I hate to be pessimistic, but I do not believe so.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		I do not believe that this administration is like Republican administrations in the past.
unidentified		They have not had a major focus on balancing the debt.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		The president says that what is going to take care of the tariffs, sure, it could be some legislation here and there, but it's going to be all of the revenue that he believes that he is making for the country, and that includes via tariffs.
		That includes taking portions of companies and having them effectively pay the United States to be able to operate.
		That includes kind of deregulation, all of the ideas towards bolstering the economy that this president has said he is interested in doing and has kind of, at least in some parts, been trying to effectuate over the last nine or so, ten or so months, now that we're in October.
		And so I don't think that you are going to see a legislation passed with input of the president on how to balance the budget if the shutdown goes 35 days or if the shutdown would end tomorrow, because I think that that's just not their focus.
		They feel that they can bring down the debt in other ways.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		It was 35 days back during the first Trump administration, 2018 to 2019, was that timeframe.
		A three-day shutdown in 2018, a 16-day shutdown under President Obama in 2013.
		There was that 21-day shutdown back in 1995 and 96, and so on back down the line.
		20 shutdowns since the 70s.
		And here we are in another one.
		We are eight hours and 41 minutes into this shutdown.
		About 15 minutes left with our panel this morning.
		And Nelson's in Hollywood, Florida, Republican.
		Nelson, go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Can you hear me okay?
		Yes, sir.
		I believe that what's going on now regarding a government shutdown has become the status quo.
		I think we're going to be seeing this on a regular basis in the future.
		I'm 76 years old.
		I'm a combat wounded Vietnam veteran.
		And I like my entitlements.
		And I think that is part of the problem is that we Americans are addicted to our entitlements.
		And consequently, we are suffering the results of that with the national debt that is continuing to grow.
		I believe Donald Trump is trying the best he can to deal with that.
		But you see now that the Democrats won't even agree to a continuing resolution.
		Unless we Americans are willing to stop demanding an ever-increasing crescendo of entitlements, this scenario will simply get worse because the budget will get worse.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Why do you think this is going to be the norm?
		You said this is going to be happening more often.
		It hasn't happened in about seven years.
unidentified		I believe it's going to become the norm because of the increasing deficit that the United States of America has.
		There's going to continue to be battles between the two parties regarding how to spend money that doesn't exist.
		And we are not facing that reality.
		The norm of the government of the United States in the future will be to continue to shut the government down and to see who plays chicken first in order to come to any kind of resolution.
		The only way that we will be able to stop this is if we stop demanding an ever-increasing amount of entitlements and if we start cracking down on the tremendous amount of fraud that exists.
		I live in South Florida.
		My wife is an immigrant.
		My parents were immigrants.
		We are surrounded by immigrants.
		And we know for a fact that there are a lot of folks who are on Medicaid that have no business being in Medicaid.
		They hide their money and pretend that they're poor.
		There's a lot of lying, a lot of fraud, and that's also part of the problem.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Well, Nelson, let me take those topics up, Jason Dick, on fraud, waste, and abuse.
unidentified		So I've got to, I want to back up just a teeny bit and just say that there is the good news for Congress about moving past the status quo that Nelson describes, and I think that he actually is on to something, that we may see more and more of these sort of entrenched disagreements that lead to shutdowns if we're not careful.
		But the good news is that there actually is a process by which Congress and the administration can deal with this, and it's called the budget and appropriations process.
		The president submits a budget, the Congress adopts the budget resolution, and then they begin to use that authorized money through that to fund programs through individual appropriations bills.
		This year, we're operating on a full year continuing resolution already because of what happened in March and what happened at the end of last year, where Congress blew their deadline, big shock, last year, past last year's fiscal year.
		They passed a continuing resolution after the election.
		People made the decision.
		I don't want to use the passive voice there, but people made the decision to only punt this into March so that Republicans, fully united Republican government, could deal with the leftovers of the fiscal year that would be six months in at that point.
		They punted again by doing a full year continuing resolution for the most part.
		There were a couple of exceptions to the rule.
		And that's where we're at right now.
		Congress hasn't passed and the president signed any individual bills for this fiscal year.
		And what did Congress spend their time doing?
		They spent their time doing a big package of tax cuts that the Republicans said, we ran on this and we want to pass this legislation on border security and tax cuts and so forth.
		That's their right.
		But everything's an opportunity cost.
		They didn't do the process that's already been set up over the last quarter, half century to do it right, and that's where we're at.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And it's not like it's new that they're not doing it from the Pew Research Service.
		Congress's chronic inability to follow its appropriations process is hardly new.
		In fact, in the nearly five decades that the current system for budgeting and spending tax dollars has been in place, Congress has passed all its required appropriations measures four times, fiscal 1977, 1989, 1995, and 1997.
		Hope for the future?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Well, hopefully, right?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Hope springs eternal.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Let's be optimistic here.
		But, you know, Congress is by a ton of different measures.
		Both the House and the Senate are becoming more partisan.
		More people are leaving both sides of the Capitol that have kind of this depth of knowledge of what it means to be bipartisan.
		More people are coming in that don't know exactly what it means to work across the aisle.
		I believe I saw somewhere that there are maybe 200 or so members right now that have never gone through a shutdown before.
		And so this is kind of new territory to them.
		So as Congress changes and some of that mentality of we need to work across the aisle, we need to broker these deals.
		We need to kind of suck up and make an agreement that we may not like, but it will keep the government functioning.
		A lot of that experience and knowledge is kind of leaving the Congress.
		And now a new Congress is coming in on both sides where they don't necessarily have that relevant experience.
		And so I think that there has to be a conversation nationally.
		I don't know who leads that or I don't know how it goes really.
		Again, we identify problems, not solutions, about how does the country start to work again in a bipartisan fashion.
		And I just don't know if the impetus or the interest right now is there.
unidentified		And to add to that, too, just with the latest example of somebody saying, I think I've had enough of this place.
		David Schweikert, Republican from Arizona, from my hometown of Phoenix, he decided he's going to leave Congress at the end of this term and run for governor.
		I mean, he perhaps sees an opening or perhaps he just doesn't want to be in Washington anymore.
		Who knows?
		You know, what the calculus is there.
		Not the most bipartisan of members, but somebody who is very intelligent, knows policy.
		He is one of the more articulate members about science and about very chewy policy topics.
		I noticed it because partly because more than 30 years ago, when I was an intern at the Arizona House of Representatives, David Schweikert, a very young David Schweikert with a full head of black hair, was the majority whip in the Arizona House of Representatives.
		So this is somebody who's been in public service for a long time at the local level.
		He also was a Maricopa County attorney, district attorney.
		I mean, he's a smart guy.
		He knows his stuff.
		And he's said, I don't need to be here anymore.
		I can do more good running for governor.
		And he has a very contested primary, including against another member, another member of the congressional delegation in Arizona, Andy Piggs.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Back to your phone calls.
		About five or ten minutes left here.
		This is Jason in Odenton, Maryland, Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm a government employee and I've been impacted by the shutdown.
		I am so fed up with this nonsense.
		You know, my mortgage is due, my bills are due.
		And these clowns in Congress or the Senate, they don't have no clue as to how it's going to impact me or other federal employees.
		And if you think, according to Jasmine, that the Democratic Party is going to get their wish list, especially Schumer, the do-nothing Schumer, is going to get their wish list on the subsidies.
		I don't think President Trump is going to budge an inch.
		In fact, three Democrats have already voted for the funding bill with the Republicans, and they're only waiting for five.
		So they have leverage the Democratic Party with Hucky and Jeffries and do-nothing Schumer don't.
		Thank you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And Jason, before you go, you say that as a Democrat, you're calling it on the line for Democrats.
unidentified		Yes, I say that as a Democrat because I'm sitting at home and I should be at work.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Do you think in terms of who gets the blame here?
		It sounds like you want Democrats to make that deal, open the government back up, and then have these arguments.
		Is that a fair description of where you sit on it, Jason?
unidentified		Yes, because it's impacting me right now.
		I'm the one who's going to suffer, not Schumer.
		Schumer is still going to get paid.
		Just open the government back up and then negotiate.
		That's how you negotiate.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Jason, thanks for the call from Odenton, Maryland.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		An interesting look at where the blame falls, and it may not be where Democrats think it's going to fall, and it may not be where Republicans think it's going to fall.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I mean, this is the White House's perspective, right?
		That Democrats, because they did not sign the Clean CR, are going to face the brunt of it.
		Just to be clear here, Jason, first of all, very sorry that you've been furloughed.
		I mean, that's just, you know, such a terrible thing that I can't imagine having to deal with.
		But, you know, there are very few times where the party who decides to shut down the government actually gets what they want, just traditionally.
		Just when you look at the wholesale amount of shutdowns that there have been, obviously, Ted Cruz is a very good example when he shut down the government in 2013.
		And so, you know, I think that Democrats are hoping to get to use whatever leverage they believe they have to effectuate a change with the ACA subsidies.
		But I think just traditionally, that typically doesn't happen.
		And so, you know, obviously the Democrats have said repeatedly that the base is with them, but I think that Jason makes a good point that it may not be all of the base.
		And the question, I think, for Democrats is: where does their support go as this as the government stays shut down?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		I'll try to get a couple more calls in before we lose the two of you.
		Marge in Marblehead, Massachusetts, Independent.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning, John.
		Good morning, John.
		I appreciate very much the articulation of both of your guests, Jasmine and Justin, and thank them for their time and that's okay.
		Go ahead.
		Okay.
		We have the other, Jason.
		I'm a 40-year listener and occasional caller.
		You know, the problem I have with both sides is that they twist language.
		Language is beautiful.
		You can make it sound like any, you know, you can make an argument on any topic.
		And here's the deal.
		So Schumer says, no, there's no money going for health care for undocumented.
		Okay, well, what does that mean?
		Is that insurance?
		Okay, well, that's a valid statement.
		The Republicans go, well, we're going to strip $1.4 trillion or whatever the number is, because you're paying for undocumented.
		Here's the bottom line.
		Both sides are right, but they're also wrong.
		The Emergency Medical Treatment and Labor Act, E-M-T-A-L-A, requires emergency rooms to take care of whoever shows up.
		And that means undocumented.
		And who is subsidizing that?
		Well, guess what?
		I'm looking in the mirror right now.
		As a taxpayer, we are subsidizing that.
		And as a taxpayer, and I might add, an independent with completely zero representation in the Commonwealth of Massachusetts, because of the wonderful gerrymandering over years, the Dems have just totally washed out Repubs and independents in the state, but that's a sidebar issue.
		I'm paying for that, and I don't like it.
		So I appreciate the fact that the REPUBs are trying to straighten that out and cut that.
		And that's what they're cutting.
		And that's a valid argument.
		And Schumer's argument, of course, is valid too, because no undocumented can't get health insurance or something or Medicaid or whatever.
		So that's my point.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So March, do you think there's an easy solution here?
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		I beg your pardon.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Do you think there's an easy solution here?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Is there an easy deal to be made?
unidentified		Well, I agree with the dude in Maryland that called the poor guy out of work and all the other thousands of people that are not working.
		Of course, they are getting paid.
		But the fact of the matter is I believe that Schumer and McKeem Jeffries are wrong to be stubborn about this.
		I think, you know, I know we've been living under a CR the entire year.
		I get it.
		True.
		But the fact is that, you know, humans need to negotiate.
		We need to come to terms with a valid agreement that both sides can live with.
		I mean, this isn't the 1860s.
		We should be able to come to terms with something because we out here are the collateral damage.
		We're the ones paying for all of this, regardless of who's sitting there in the White House.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Marge, thanks for the call from Marblehead, Massachusetts.
		Before we lose our panel this morning, just did want to note that there's plenty happening today that you both will be covering, I'm sure, including right around 10 a.m. when this program ends.
		Speaker Johnson, Senate Majority Leader Thune are going to be having a press conference.
		We're expecting a Democratic press conference in the 11 a.m. hour.
		So what will you be watching for as the day goes by?
unidentified		I have to admit that it's, we do need to pay attention to what these leaders say, but this is not must-see TV.
		What we're looking for is what is going on behind those scenes, behind those press conferences.
		I can almost tell you, and Jasmine can tell you, what's going to come out of Thune, Johnson, Jeffries, and Schumer, the law firm there, and their talking points.
		But what I want to know is, is anybody else saying, here's where we're going to give, here's the off-ramp, here's a way we get people back to work, here's a way that we get a promise to debate.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Is there a conversation, right?
		Is there going to be a conversation happening with senior advisors at the White House?
		Is there going to be a conversation happening with President Trump?
		We know he likes to be involved in these conversations.
		He likes to be a part of the deal-making.
		They call him the deal-making president.
		You know, what is actually the Democrat to Republican pipeline on having a conversation and potentially, you know, maybe Thune said no negotiations, but just kind of trying to de-isify some of these relationships so that they can get to a point where they maybe could start to negotiate.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Two great places to follow the shutdown.
		They include Roll Call, the newspaper of Capitol Hill, rollcall.com, and Notice, newsoftheunitedstates, notice.org.
		Jasmine Wright is a White House correspondent at Notice, and Jason Dick, of course, editor-in-chief of Roll Call.
		Always appreciate your time.
unidentified		Thanks for having me.
jasmine wright ▲ ● ▼		Thanks so much.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Coming up in our final hour of the Washington Journal, we turn this program over to you to talk about the shutdown.
		Phone lines are open for your calls, lines for Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, and also that special line for federal employees, 202-748-8003 is that number.
		Go ahead and call in, and we will get to those calls right after the break.
unidentified		I'm Dasha Burns, host of Ceasefire, bridging the divide in American politics.
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john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And you're seeing a live shot here in Washington, D.C. That's the Navy Memorial with the National Archives behind it.
		And it is day one of the latest federal government shutdown.
		The last shutdown taking place during the first Trump administration lasted about 35 days.
		This one so far has lasted nine hours.
		And there doesn't appear to be an end in sight, though.
		We'll be watching what congressional leaders have to say.
		Republican leaders set to speak in just about an hour from now from Capitol Hill.
		Democratic leaders set to have their remarks in the 11 a.m. Eastern hour.
		We'll be covering them both here on C-SPAN.
		Here's some of the headlines from today's newspapers from the front page of the Wall Street Journal.
		Federal shutdown is set as talks have stumbled.
		This from the Washington Post, the funding dries up as the clock runs out.
		And then from the Washington Times today, partisan blame game heats up as the shutdown begins.
		It was last night on social media that members of the House and Senate took to their ex-feeds right around midnight to post their pointing their fingers at the other party for the cause of this shutdown.
		Here's two of those.
		First, John Houstead of Ohio Republican, his post last night.
unidentified		Hello, I'm John Houstead, and I serve as your U.S. Senator.
		As of today, America is in a government shutdown.
		That means some services Ohioans rely on will be affected, and government employees, including the brave men and women of our military, will be without a paycheck.
		Those are the consequences.
		In the Senate, it takes Republicans and Democrats working together to keep the government open.
		That's how the rules work.
		We did it in March together, and there's no reason we can't do it again now.
		Americans expect Congress to do its job.
		Republicans aren't playing games.
		We offered a clean plan to keep the government running with no changes in policy or funding.
		Exactly the same budget Democrats supported 13 times under President Biden.
		This time, they rejected it.
		But I'm not giving up.
		I'm working with my colleagues to reopen the government as quickly as possible, but Republicans can't do it alone.
		And it's past time for the Democrats to join us and do what's right.
		Ohioans get up and go to work every day, and they get the job done.
		Congress should do the same.
		We should get our job done and reopen the government.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Senator John Hustead, Republican of Ohio, his post.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And this is Senator Corey Booker, Democrat of New Jersey, about one minute after midnight last night.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		We just went into a shutdown because Republicans refused to work with us to deal with the health care crisis that they created.
		Donald Trump and Republicans control the House of Representatives, the Senate, and the White House.
		They need to do their job and put forward a budget that will help Americans.
		I've heard from New Jersey's all over my state that they are struggling with health care costs and the rising costs of pretty much everything.
		And Republicans are refusing to work with us to do something about it.
		But we are going to continue to stand and fight to try to help Americans.
		And really, this should be a bipartisan commitment to doing the things necessary to help folks who are struggling right now have access to health care, have more affordability in their lives, and less of this kind of reckless politics on behalf of Donald Trump.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		On social media, we want to hear your thoughts this morning.
		Phone lines for Democrats, Republicans, and Independents, and that special line for federal employees, 202-748-8003.
		Jim's up first.
		It's Oil City, Pennsylvania, Republican in the Keystone State.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		Hello, can you hear me?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		Okay.
		So this is all kabuki theater.
		We have people arguing over how much more debt to incur while we are already drowning in a sea of debt, both in the government and personal.
		Most people can't make it to the next paycheck.
		And what's going to happen when there's a total financial collapse?
		This dollar continually becomes worth less.
		Prices rise either because of demand for the good or devaluation of the means of exchange.
		I really wanted to talk to Jason Dick because I went to high school with a guy that greatly resembles him.
		I wonder if he lived in Old City.
		That's all I have to say.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		I think he grew up in Arizona, but he'll be back on down the road, Jim.
		This is Laura in Brooklyn, New York.
		Democrat, good morning.
unidentified		Hi.
		How are you?
		First of all, I want to say to Americans that we have to stop buying the lies.
		I am a Democrat, yes.
		I do recognize when Republicans do tell the truth, but on this, they are lying.
		They are telling lies.
		The Republicans have been the gatekeeper of Donald Trump since he took office.
		They allowed Donald Trump to commit financial crimes.
		They have allowed Donald Trump to just do things that are just, as far as I'm concerned, you know, ungodly.
		And they've been the gatekeeper.
		The Republicans didn't need Democrats to fire government workers.
		The Republicans didn't need Democrats to close down government departments.
		The Republicans didn't need Democrats to do anything.
		They are the gatekeepers who held the door closed while Donald Trump and Doge destroyed America and has increased our debt.
		And let's not, and they're supposed to be constitutionalists.
		If they felt if they were constitutionalists, then how come their monument clause of the Constitution means nothing to Republicans?
		And as for the health care for illegal immigrants, they are not entitled.
		It is against the law.
		They do not get public dollars for health care.
		Let the truth be told.
		Donald Trump and the Republicans have cut Medicaid, cut Medicare, and gutted all the programs that a lot of people need, including their constituents.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Laura in Brooklyn.
		This is Gary in Maine, Independence.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I just wanted to make a point of the stupidity of the American people that we're willing to spend half of all our tax dollars on the War Department.
		Now, the War Department is there basically to kill off people.
		The other half of our money goes towards helping people.
		Now, the biggest problem we got right now, they're arguing about health care.
		I just became a Medicare recipient, and I didn't realize how much the insurance companies had their hand into Medicare.
		The fact is that half of all our Medicare money goes directly to the insurance companies because I'm Medicare and I pay $185 a month.
		And that $185 a month covers 80% of my health care.
		I got to pay another $260 a month to cover the other 25%.
		I'd gladly pay the $400 a month to have Medicare cover me completely.
		But the insurance companies are so deeply involved in this.
		The Medicare advantage, that basically is an advantage for the insurance companies.
		They get that $185 that I would have paid into Medicare goes directly to them.
		Then I don't know how much extra people have to pay or how it works.
		I already know my insurance on my 20% coverage is going to go up next year because they told me four months ago that it's going to go up.
		So I don't understand why they fight over this.
		We've got to get the insurance companies out of the health insurance companies out of this health insurance because when you have for-profit health insurance, you're not going to get good coverage.
		You're not going to get good health coverage when you go and apply or go to the hospital or go to your doctors.
		The only way they're going to save money on health insurance is to get the insurance companies out of it completely.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Well, Gary, we'll take your point.
		You started by talking about U.S. spending on the military.
		The number that you cite, not quite accurate.
		The total U.S. spending this past year, about $7.4 trillion.
		$930 billion of that goes to defense spending.
		A trillion of that goes to interest on the debt.
		$1.5 trillion to Social Security payments.
		$1.7 trillion to Medicare and Medicaid.
		Those are the four biggest drivers of spending.
		Currently, the U.S. national debt, the accumulation of deficits over the years, $37,550,153,200,300,000 and counting.
		The numbers keep ticking up there.
		U.S.deckClock.org is where you can go for a breakdown of U.S. national spending.
		This is Lisa in Alexandria, Virginia, Republican.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I want to say that it's been since 1996 since we actually had a budget bill passed.
		So I think it's time that both sides, Republicans and Democrats, stop this game of CR.
		Well, we're going to battle it out to the end until we get this, until we get that.
		Their job is to go there and pass the budget.
		That's their core job.
		So I think that this should say something to both sides, Republicans and Democrats, that the people that love to play these games, let's vote them all out because you send people up there and they get there and they think, well, it doesn't matter that the employees are off because we're going to pay them.
		Well, your mortgage company is not gone away.
		Your cardinal company is not gone away.
		So they need to understand that the American people is blaming them both and Democrats to hold out and sit down the way they said that they don't believe in shutdowns.
		This is like, okay, well, the election's up next year, and you might not be going back.
		That's all I have to say.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		The last time Congress passed all 12 of its appropriations bills on time and they were enacted by October the 1st, back in 1997, it's only happened four times in the modern appropriations process, 1977, 1989, 1995, and 1997.
		Usually it's some form of continuing resolution or an omnibus bill that packages in several of these dozen appropriations bills that are supposed to be passed separately or some version thereof.
		The Pew Research Center, a great place to go to take a look at congressional spending over the years.
		This is Mike in Washington, D.C., Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'd just like to say I'm a federal employee or soon to be off because of the DRP.
		I just feel as though this whole process that we're dealing with a bunch of cowards on the Democrat side and also the cowards on the mainstream Republicans because the mainstream Republicans, if not for Trump and Musk, would not be going for much of this.
		But for the Dems, my issue with the Dems is the fact that, honestly, I believe the shutdown should have happened back in March and April when Trump came in and started doing all the cuts with positions and Chuck Schumer just caved in.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Mike, what do you think is going to be what's going to happen with cuts this time around the potential for the Office of Management and Budget at least threatening to make cuts on its own, firing federal employees rather than furloughing them?
unidentified		I actually believe that they'll do it.
		And then it will be the same as what we started to see recently.
		Stories were coming out where I believe the Department of Labor started calling people back to the office who they forced to take the DRP.
		They're going to see they're taking a sledgehammer to something that they should have taken the scaffold to as a federal employee.
		I'm not saying there isn't any waste, but I believe when you do something like that, even with this whole thing with healthcare, you should take a scalpel to it.
		You should actually study it.
		Donald Trump and his staff has not been in office long enough to actually do any real types of studies, nor these congressmen.
		And the last thing I'll say: what the change should be now is that there's a shutdown, Congress and the president, any of their staff, they should not be paid.
		And, Mike, just remind folks what the DRP is: deferred resignation program.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And you took it?
		You took that?
		Yeah.
		Why did you take that?
		And when did you take it?
unidentified		I took it.
		I was one of the first group of probationary employees.
		In February, they were cut.
		They were brought by the courts.
		As soon as the courts brought us back in, they essentially issued it again.
		I just was able, in my office, I had someone who was in the HR office who communicated to my supervisor.
		I was the kind of employee they were looking to take it because the way the separation from the federal government, the way that works, is if you're there for many, many years, you can have severance one week per year for the first 10 years, two weeks for 11 through 20.
		If you're less than that, probationary, you pretty much get one week or two weeks, depending on how long you've been there.
		And so it was the option of going to unemployment, getting $444 a week, versus taking the DRP and taking a chance with the economy, trying to find another job.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What do you think you're going to do, Mike?
unidentified		Look for another job.
		I have skills.
		I can do other things.
		But I'm thinking about this across the country because I'm in the DMV.
		There are opportunities going to come around, come about.
		But what I believe people don't understand, including Republican leaders, is as more this goes on with these cuts and it starts hitting home in their home states.
		There is going to be a back.
		There's going to be a back.
		There's going to be something that's come back even against them with these upcoming elections.
		Mike, do you mind saying what agency you're leaving?
		No, I do not want to say what's going to happen.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		No worries.
		Totally understand.
		Mike, thanks for the call from here in D.C. Tina.
unidentified		Thank you for having me.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Farmville, Virginia's next.
		Democrat, good morning.
		Tina, you're with us.
unidentified		Oh, yes, I'm sorry.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead and turn down your television for me, please.
unidentified		Okay, I'm sorry.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So go ahead with your comment.
unidentified		Well, I was just calling.
		I was worrying about how the DMV and yes.
		Hello, my name is Tina.
		I've always been worried about.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And Tina, I promise you, it works better when you turn down your television and just listen through your phone.
		We'll try again.
		And this is Matt in Bath, New York, Republican.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		I wish I could have talked to the guests, especially this Jasmine.
		First of all, this has nothing to do with health care.
		It has everything to do with Chuck Schumer being scared to death of being primaried by AOC.
		The Democrat Party has let the far left take over the party.
		It's plain and simple.
		Meller say about Chuck, the Democrat DeCalden that's upset with the Democrats.
		He's not an anomaly.
		There's a poll that New York Times put out.
		Overwhelmingly, the Democrats were against a shutdown.
		Chuck Schumer tried to say that the New York Times, of all papers, had a biased poll.
		That's a big joke in itself.
		They even said when he said it, people laughed.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So I think I have that poll.
		It's in today's paper, the question that was asked: what is closest to your view?
		And it was asked among members of all parties, but here's the Democratic response: that the Democrats should or should not shut down the government if their demands are not met.
		47% of Democratic respondents to that poll saying that they should shut down the government, 43% saying that they should not.
		And then just a few in the middle with no answer to that question.
unidentified		Well, that does make sense to me because the New York Times put out a poll that it was overwhelmingly the Democrats were against it.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So, overall, if you count all respondents, just 27% of Democrats, Republicans, and independents saying that they should shut down the government.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		65% of all respondents, Democrats, Republicans, and independents, saying they should not, overwhelmingly, that they should not.
unidentified		Okay, yeah.
		See, that's where words make a difference.
		And the third thing, you had to call her the 20-year immigrant that's now a citizen, and she's still on Medicaid.
		That proves the Republicans' point right there.
		She's been in this country 20 years, and she's still basically living off of my tax money.
		Now, what part of that don't I understand?
		It's ridiculous.
		And the other thing about public funding: well, California pays for sex changes, everything.
		Now, I know it's not a federal plan, supposedly.
		They're a Medicaid plan that they're spending like $6 billion on a year on illegal immigrants.
		But let's be real here: money's fungible.
		So, the money that they're spending out of their so-called money, they're making up with it in other ways from federal money.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Matt in Bath, New York.
		This is Robert in Jackson, Missouri, Independent.
		Good morning.
		You're next.
unidentified		Yes.
		Good morning, John, and thank you for this wonderful show, too.
		I had several questions here.
		How long do you think this shutdown will last?
		And what about the impact on the entire national economy is my second question.
		And also, with the shutdown and the $37 trillion debt, do you think foreign banks will be looking at that with great seriousness about how much we owe to different nations and banks across the world there?
		And I'll hang up and listen to you.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Robert, I'm not sure anybody knows how long this will last.
		That's one of the big questions right now.
		The most recent one during the first Trump administration lasted about 35 days.
		We'll see what happens in the days and perhaps weeks to come.
		In terms of impacts, I can tell you that the expectation is that somewhere between 750 and 800,000 federal employees are set to be furloughed.
		And they are in agencies around the country and agencies across the federal government.
		The agencies that will be impacted the most, the New York Times with the breakdown, the Environmental Protection Agency, about 89% of their 15,000 employees are expected to be furloughed.
		87% of the 2,400 people left at the Department of Education.
		81% of the Commerce Department expected to be furloughed.
		The agencies that will have the least amount by percentage of employees impacted, Homeland Security, just 5% of their employees expected to be furloughed.
		And the Department of Veterans and Affairs, just 3% of their employees.
		That's the New York Times today.
		By the way, by the way, press conference is happening around the country already this morning.
		Let me take you to Maryland Westmore, the governor of Maryland, speaking with reporters this morning about the shutdown.
wes moore ▲ ● ▼		Agencies to employ contingency plans that will help to make sure that federal programs can continue to operate in our state for now.
		We will ensure that state employees supported with federal funding continue to get paid for as long as possible.
		Federal programs administered by the state will continue to support working families through Medicaid and SNAP and TENIP.
		We will also provide greater flexibility to Head Start programs and ensure that veterans maintain access to essential resources.
unidentified		But I do want to be very clear.
wes moore ▲ ● ▼		The longer this unnecessary federal government shutdown goes on, the harder it is for us to keep services going.
		We will continue to monitor the situation closely and we will adjust accordingly.
		Second, we are working with the private sector to shield federal workers impacted by this shutdown from eviction, foreclosure, and utility shutoffs.
		This morning, I sent letters to the state judiciary and our state utility companies reminding them of their statutory legal protections for federal, state, and local government employees who are not receiving a paycheck or are at risk of eviction or foreclosure.
		And third, we are protecting and expanding emergency assistance programs for federal employees.
		If you are a furloughed worker, you may be eligible for unemployment insurance.
		Those eligible for unemployment will repay the funds once they start receiving a paycheck again.
		We've also worked with our credit unions and also our banks to offer financial assistance and payment flexibility for Marylanders who are affected by the shutdown.
		We are extending support for our landmark, feds to eds programs, connecting Marylanders with federal government experience to a fulfilling career in education.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Maryland Democratic Governor Westmore speaking with reporters right now from Maryland, Maryland, Virginia, and Washington, D.C., where roughly one in five federal workers and one in four private government contractors live.
		So plenty of Marylanders set to be impacted by the shutdown.
		Again, somewhere between three-quarters of a million and 800,000 federal workers expected to be furloughed during this shutdown.
		And again, we don't know how long it will go.
		This is Pat in Keyport, New Jersey, Republican.
		Pat, your thoughts on the shutdown.
unidentified		Hi, John.
		I heard, I turned on the TV in time to hear the woman, the congresswoman from Maryland that you were interviewing.
		And her excuse for the shutdown, this can't wait seven weeks.
		Well, can't Congress walk and chew gum at the same time?
		They should never have closed the government.
		They should never have held it up on this issue.
		She said, they're getting their notices.
		People on Obamacare are getting these notices next year's premiums.
		Well, why couldn't you say, okay, we're going to work on this?
		You brought the issue to the public by threatening a shutdown.
		Let the government work.
		You don't have to wait seven weeks to pass a bill.
		Congress should be able to do this.
		And I just wish, John, that you could play what Kimberly played on Sunday, which was Chuck Schumer's message to the president.
		He should look in the mirror when he said it.
		He is shutting down the government because he can't get what he wants.
		Thanks.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Pat in Garden State.
		We'll head to the Empire State.
		John in Syracuse.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Well, it's obviously on the Republicans.
		They control the government.
		I mean, the mega, you can, you make people can spin it any way you want.
		You control the government.
		It's on you.
		And everyone says that they control the presidency, Senate, and Congress.
		They also control the Supreme Court.
		They control everything.
		So don't try to spin it any other way.
		Now, I heard the Ohio Congressman say that they just want to continue it like they did in March.
		Now, my question, and I'd like maybe if C-SPAN could educate the public on this, what's in there now that wasn't in the March?
		Were these cuts also in the March continuation appropriation bill or whatever it's called?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What cuts are you talking about?
unidentified		Trump put them in there and they're new.
unidentified		So I would like to know what's different in this one than the one that was in March.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So, John, what cuts are you talking about?
		So a continuing resolution simply keeps the government funded at the same level it was before the resolution is passed.
		It extends the timeframe for that same level of funding.
		That's what a continuing resolution means.
unidentified		Well, these cuts to Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, Obamacare, were they also in the continuing resolution that was continued in March?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So the health care subsidies that you're talking about, different legislation.
		It's when they're expected to run out.
		And that timeframe is looming, John.
		But that's a different piece of legislation than the budget resolution, the continuing resolution to fund the government.
unidentified		Well, all I know is people don't want cuts, John.
		They don't want cuts in health care, especially health care.
		You've got to give people health care.
		And if you're going to cut that to, you know, be it Obamacare or Social Security, Medicare, whatever, you're going to lose elections.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		John, when you say you've got to give people health care, expand on that for me.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Do you think people who are in this country illegally should have health care?
unidentified		Absolutely not.
		And they're getting it.
		You hear the Democrats say that they can't get Medicaid.
		But if these illegals show up at emergency rooms, they don't get turned away.
		They don't get Medicaid, but just show up.
		Your kids got a cold or something.
		Show up in an emergency room and you'll get treated because nobody gets turned away from emergency rooms.
		And somebody's got to pay that bill.
		Biden screwed up.
		The Democrats screwed up and they let all these illegals in here.
		And you hear it on the Washington Journal.
		Every day people call in on the Republican side complaining about the illegals.
		That's the reason I voted for Trump.
		That's the only reason I voted for Trump is he closed the border.
		Otherwise, I hate Trump.
		But, you know, that's why I voted for him.
		The stupid Democrats opened the border in the cost of the election.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's John in Syracuse, New York.
		It's a bit of a viral clip that's been going around, especially among Republicans.
		An interview that happened on the steps of the Capitol, Maxine Waters, the Democrat from California, answering a question from reporters about who should and who shouldn't have health care.
		She was Steve Scalise, in Republican leadership in the House, one of those who tweeted out that clip.
		And we will show it to you in just a second.
		And as we'll pull that up for you, this is Bill in Kentucky, Republican.
		Go ahead.
unidentified		Yeah, I'd like to say that I am behind the Republicans 100%.
		They're trying to do it the right way.
		And the Democrats just fight, fight, fight.
		And I'd also like to say about the video that Trump put out with Hakeem and Mexican Sombrero and stuff.
		I think that was hilarious and 10 times better than anything Jimmy Kimball has ever put out.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Bill in Kentucky.
		Let me show you that Maxine Waters clip that Steve Scalise sent out along with several other Republicans.
		Again, Maxine Waters on the steps of the Capitol.
unidentified		Are Democrats demanding health care for illegal aliens?
unidentified		That's right.
maxine waters ▲ ● ▼		Democrats are demanding health care for everybody.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That clip making its way around the internet, along with the clip that President Trump put out, the Truth Social post, that has now been two different posts focusing on Hakeem Jeffries and showing Hakeem Jeffries in a sombrero.
		The most recent one, a Donald Trump mariachi band rising up behind him.
		So plenty of social media videos making their way around amid this debate over the government shutdown.
		This is Bob in hometown, Illinois.
		Republican, good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, John.
		I love C-SPAN.
		Three things, if I might touch on.
		Federal employees are basically getting a paid vacation.
		Every how long it takes, they can do side jobs and go out of town and go out of country.
		I don't feel sorry for any federal employee that doesn't have enough nest eggs saved up to ride out a shutdown.
		And the Florida caller saying immigrants do receive benefits is totally accurate.
		Anybody that doesn't believe that is very naive, and these politicians that repeat that are not being honest when they say that.
		And the third thing, the final topic, Alan from Brooklyn came up with quite a few conspiracy theories about Trump that I haven't seen on the internet.
		His parents once had a lot of fun with him growing up with his vivid imagination.
		I wonder how he feels about Biden spending millions of dollars through the TSA, following people through the airport and following them all over.
		I don't know if you got that story yet, John, but I saw that yesterday after Matt Taibbi spoke at Congress, the story about the TSA following people around.
		That's pretty interesting.
		And I'm here in Illinois, and our governor is not doing us a very good service by he's taking taxpayer money for the immigrants and hiding the immigrants, hiding the illegal immigrants.
		They're criminals.
		Forget about the say hiding these people out.
		Let the feds take the bad people out of the states and then there'll be a lot of money left for regular people.
		Thanks, John.
		I love C-SPAN.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Bob, a Republican in the land of Lincoln.
		We'll head to the Yellowhammer State.
		This is Bill in Alabama, Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Bill, you with us?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Got to stick by your phone, Bill, in Alabama.
		It's just after 9.30 on the East Coast.
		Speaking of Alabama, I want to mention some other non-shutdown news, including one focused on Tuskegee, Alabama.
		This is the obituary that appears today in the New York Times.
		George Hardy, a retired Air Force Lieutenant Colonel who was one of the last surviving combat veterans of the Tuskegee Airmen, the all-black squadron in the segregated U.S. military during World War II, and who subsequently flew 45 missions in the Korean War and 70 in the Vietnam War, died on September 24th in Sarasota, Florida.
		He was 100 years old.
		His death at his home was announced by the National Office of the Veterans Organization, Tuskegee Airmen.
		And Colonel Hardy, a Philadelphia native, was 19 and had never even driven a car when he began aviation cadet training in September of 1944 at Tuskegee Army Airfield in Alabama.
		By early the next year, in the closing months of the war in Europe, then 2nd Lieutenant Hardy was assigned to an Army Air Force base in Italy, from which he flew 21 missions accompanying bombers to their targets over southern Germany in early 1945.
		George Hardy was 100 years old.
		One other piece of non-shutdown news for you, it has to do with presidential libraries, specifically a Trump presidential library.
		This from the Washington Post today, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis and his cabinet on Tuesday voted to donate a prime piece of land in downtown Miami next to the iconic Freedom Tower for the Donald J. Trump Presidential Library.
		The vote came after a surprise move by the DeSantis administration to take over the vacant lot from Miami-Dade College.
		The plan drew backlash from many in Miami's Cuban-American community who say the tower known as the Ellis Island of the South represents the opposite of Trump's mass deportation campaigns and tough immigration policies.
		Donald Trump's son Eric, who's on the board of trustees for his father's library, celebrated the move on social media saying consistent with the family's DNA, this will be one of the most beautiful buildings ever built, an icon on the Miami skyline.
		That's a picture of the Freedom Tower and the lot next to it there is the expected site then of a future Donald Trump presidential library.
		This is Shelley, Springfield, Virginia.
		Line for Democrats.
		25 minutes left getting your thoughts on the first day of this shutdown.
unidentified		Hi, John.
		My name is Shelley.
		I've worked for the federal government since 1987, actually.
		And this year, this summer, I was forced to retire due to the cuts, the federal government.
		But I have a lot of experience over the years going through shutdowns.
		And despite what people say, oh, it's a paid vacation to fellow workers, that's not what this is.
		It's very demoralizing.
		Your work doesn't get done.
		You're not allowed to work, by the way.
		And the fellow who just called in, I think a caller before me, said that, oh, you can go get another job while this is happening.
		No, you can't.
		That's against the ethics rules, right?
		If you're employed by the government, you cannot get another job.
		And so it doesn't help anybody.
		It wastes money.
		It's very expensive to shut down the government and then to bring it back online again, so to speak.
		So this is not, you know, a good way to run your government.
		The Republicans have had, since March, all the time that they needed to pass spending bills.
		And they didn't pass a single one.
		They are in charge of the House right now.
		They have the Senate.
		They have the White House.
		And they passed nothing.
		So, you know, what are federal workers supposed to do?
		Like I say, it was always very stressful for me.
		I used to have to get loans during these processes to replace my paycheck.
		Even if you do get the back pay, your bills are still due, right?
		And you don't plan for this.
		You plan to do your job and get paid as you always did.
		So that's my comments about this.
		I find this extremely stressful.
		Currently, the federal workforce is already very demoralized by all that's been going on since January.
		Nobody feels good anymore.
		And bad, people not feeling good, people feeling demoralizing leads to bad work.
		It doesn't lead to good work and efficiency.
		It leads to bad work because people are scared.
		How do you get your job done when you're scared, you know, 24-7?
		So those are my thoughts.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Shelly out of Springfield, Virginia.
		This is Mike, Valley Center, California, Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hey, good morning.
		Hey, I feel Trump is going to use executive actions to expand executive powers.
		And also on the meeting of the generals and the admirals, I think he's assuming them to be used against protesters and political dissidents.
		I think Trump made a statement that he wants his generals to be like Hitler's generals, and that's so that they will do anything that he says.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		When did he make that statement?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		You're saying yesterday?
unidentified		No, no, no.
		This is before.
		You can look it up.
		I think he told that to another general.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Well, Mike, let me show a little bit of Donald Trump from yesterday addressing that gathering of 800 or so generals and admirals in Quantico, Virginia.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		Last month I signed an executive order to provide training for a quick reaction force that can help quell civil disturbances.
		This is going to be a big thing for the people in this room because it's the enemy from within, and we have to handle it before it gets out of control.
		It won't get out of control.
unidentified		Once you're involved at all, they all joke.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		They say, oh, this is not good.
		You saw it in Washington.
		We had gangs of trend day-aruged, we said 10, 12, 15 kids.
		And these military guys walk up to it, and they treat them with disrespect, and they just got pounded.
		They just got pounded.
		The gang just pounded.
		Then thrown into paddy wagons and taken back to their country.
		Some are so dangerous, we don't want to even do that because we don't want to.
		Some of them, they're stone-cold murders.
		We don't have the confidence, even though they're not coming back very easily.
		We don't have the confidence.
		We put them in jails.
		But these service members are following in a great and storied military tradition from protecting frontier communities to chasing outlaws and bandits in the Wild West.
		And our history is filled with military heroes who took on all enemies, foreign and domestic.
		You know that phrase very well.
		That's what the oath says, foreign and domestic.
		Well, we also have domestic.
		George Washington, Abraham Lincoln, Grover Cleveland, George Bush, and others all use the armed forces to keep domestic order and peace.
		Many of our leaders used the military to keep peace.
		Now they like to say, oh, you're not allowed to use the military.
		And you know what the people say?
		The people in those cities where they're being raped and shot and beat up?
		You know what they say?
		We love the military.
		Do you ever see where they interview the people on the street?
		I've never seen somebody say they don't unless they're radical and paid off because a lot of these insurrectionists are paid by Wetherisoros or other people, but they're paid by the radical left.
		So today I want to thank every service member from general to private who has bravely helped us secure the nation's capital and make America safe for the American people.
		It's amazing.
unidentified		The whole world is watching.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		I was President Trump from yesterday in Quantico, Virginia to the caller before that clip on the Hitler's general comment.
		I want to just go back to the AP story on that from October of last year.
		It was Donald Trump's longest-serving chief of staff making that claim during the 2024 campaign.
		John Kelly, the retired Marine general who worked for Donald Trump in the White House from 2017 to 2019, making that claim in an Atlantic story.
		Kelly has long been critical of Trump, they write at the time and previously accused him of calling veterans killed in combat suckers and losers.
		Still, they write, the warnings came just two weeks before Election Day.
		And John Kelly telling the Atlantic, he commented more than once, you know, Hitler did some good things, Kelly recalled.
		Kelly said he would usually quash the conversation by saying nothing that Hitler did, you could argue, was good, but Trump would occasionally bring the topic up again.
		In the interview with The Atlantic, Kelly recalled that when Trump raised the idea of needing German generals, Kelly would ask if he meant Bismarck's generals, referring to Otto von Bismarck and the former chancellor of the German Reich who oversaw the unification of Germany.
		Surely you can't mean Hitler's generals, Kelly recalled asking Trump, to which the former president responded, yeah, yeah, Hitler's generals.
		So I think that's the story that the caller was referring to, the comments by General Kelly.
		This is James in Albuquerque, New Mexico, Republican.
		Good morning.
		You're next.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Yeah, first of all, I won't believe anything Kelly says.
		He's just a bureaucrat.
		Thank him for his service.
		That's good.
		But I don't believe these people, the Democrats, are constantly lying to the public, the politicians, the media.
		They're constantly lying.
		They've been doing it for years.
		It's just unbelievable the lies they put out there about Trump and MAGA.
		And, you know, the bottom line is not one penny should be going to illegal aliens of our tax dollars.
		Not one penny.
		And how about let's cut the politicians' pay?
		How come that never happens?
		Let's cut both sides.
		Take their pay away.
		Take their medical care away.
		The problem with the politicians in Washington on both sides, and I'm a Republican, I'm a conservative, is that both sides are corrupt.
		Both sides.
		The politicians in the House and the Senate.
		They're all corrupt.
		There's no such thing as an honest politician.
		They do nothing but lie to the public.
		I'm sick and tired of these judges.
		Why don't they cut the judges' pay?
		These corrupt judges, half of the judges in this country are corrupt.
		Our government is so corrupt that they put us, they try to tell the public, oh, everybody's going to die if you don't get a paycheck or we're going to shut the government down.
		Let's start with the Senate and the House in Capitol Hill.
		Let's cut their pay.
		Let's cut their health care.
		Let's shut them down first.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's James in New Mexico.
		This is Joe.
		It's Granton, Pennsylvania, Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Yeah, how are you doing?
		I want to make a few points there.
		First, I believe the guy in the White House is a dictator.
		He already told his generals if they don't like what he's saying, they should leave and they're going to lose the rankings.
		That's one thing.
		And another guy that was on there before said he works for the federal government and he's going to lose his house if he doesn't get paid.
		Well, he should have kept his money and had something in the bank for later on.
		I work for the federal government as a contractor, and I did lose my pay, but they all got reimbursed for their time.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		And a lady talking about reimbursed after a shutdown, but federal employees who get furloughed by law get reimbursed.
unidentified		That's what you're saying, Joe.
		That's a fact.
		And, you know, we understood what was going on.
		But don't forget, it's this guy in the White House that shut the government down twice.
		They're saying that the Democrats don't want to negotiate.
		What did the Republicans give us?
		What did they negotiate on?
		They didn't negotiate on nothing.
		And one other thing is the lady that says she doesn't want anybody to get health care free.
		What about the white person?
		They're talking about all these Mexicans and everything like that.
		The illegals.
		But what about the white person that loses their job and can't afford a health care?
		All right.
		Thanks for having me.
		Bye.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Joe in Pennsylvania.
		This is Kerry in Champaign, Illinois, Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, John.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Kerry.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		What's on your mind about the shutdown?
unidentified		What do you think?
		I think that the shutdown is a terrible thing, and that the Republicans are the ones that are in control.
		They can control all this.
		And people keep thinking about the Democrats.
		I'm like, how is it the Democrats when the Democrats don't even have, they don't, like Trump said, they don't have the cards.
		Trump has all the cards.
		The Republicans have all the cards to change this and reverse everything that's happening to us since Trump took over as president.
		And this is what gets me with people when they call in here.
		They keep complaining.
		And they keep complaining about the Democrats, the Democrats.
		I don't hear anything about what the Republicans are doing for you because they're the ones that's going to shut this government down.
		Trump is not helping any people.
		They took away vaccines.
		You got Kennedy, he's not even a doctor.
		And then we got a bunch of people that keep calling in.
		And Trump is running the biggest con on everybody.
		And so are the rest of the Republicans.
		I'm not Democrat.
		I'm not Republican.
		I'm not either one of them.
		But what I do pay attention to, I pay attention to the budget, and I pay attention to policy.
		And the Republicans have bad policy.
		Last year at this time, this wasn't going on.
		Has anybody noticed that yesterday when Trump was on the stage, him and Hegseth, that they're planning to attack the American people, but no one seems to care.
		We're talking about the Democrats, the Democrats.
		They're coming after us.
		They're coming after all of us.
		And if we don't unite and come together as a people, we're going to lose this country of what we have because we built everything up to be a great country, but we're tearing it down, fighting with each other when we're letting one side, the Republicans, take everything, our rights.
		But we believe the Republicans are right.
		I don't see how that's possible.
		Why are people keep calling in, complaining about the got your point?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's Carrie in Champaign, Illinois.
		We're going to be hearing more from Republican leaders in just about 10 minutes.
		News conference expected, and that's where we're expecting to go at the end of this program today.
		Speaking of Republicans and House Republicans in particular, they've been meeting over the course of these past 15 minutes or so with Office of Management and Budget Director Russ Vote Jake Sherman of Punch Bowl News pointing that out in an ex-post this morning saying that Vogt is expected to talk to House Republicans today.
		Excuse me, they haven't been meeting.
		They will meet with Russ Vote today at 1 p.m.
		And he's expected to talk with House Republicans about layoffs, departmental cuts, the administration signaling that they will use the shutdown to reshape the government and benefits.
		So that's one of the many meetings that's happening on this first day of the shutdown.
		We'll look for more news on that after the expected 1 p.m. Eastern.
		Jake Sherman on X.
		This is John in Montgomery, Alabama.
		Democrat, good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, John.
		Two things here.
		I think we need to figure out, and America don't know the laws for the immigrants that come to this country.
		And Reagan had one he signed in 1986.
		Need to pay attention to the laws that we have on the book that govern the illegal aliens.
		The number two thing is with this shutdown, I believe that we should, if you elect a Republican president and a Republican Congress, we should let them do everything they want to do.
		And that's whether the Democrat or Republican, then you would know what these laws are going to do to you that they pass by, or they pass in these Congress because we're always going back and forth.
		Nobody wants to cut Social Security, but Democrats did Social Security.
		Nobody wanted to cut the Medicare, but Democrats did the Medicare.
		If the Republic wanted to get rid of these programs, I believe we should let them get rid of them and then go on, and that way we'll know where the blame lies.
		And then you'll know who's on your side and who's not on your side.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's John in Alabama.
		This is Frank out of Florida, Independent.
		Good morning.
		Few minutes left here in today's program.
unidentified		Good evening.
		Thanks for having me.
		Basically, just basically, Trump may be a dictator, but he knows how to run corporations.
		Our government is corporations.
		I don't believe the federal workers are being persecuted.
		They know about productivity.
		The problem with the federal government is the union.
		When you have the union there, you are not running your people.
		The union is.
		That is our biggest problem.
		And they have an excellent pension program, better than most of the corporations.
		Corporations pay half the Social Security.
		But Trump is doing a good job.
		And he's pointing out: you look at the fat military that we have.
		They are overweight.
		Our governor here in Florida now is starting to dig into how the money is being spent that is given to the local governments.
		We need to clean the slate.
		I hope it's not too late before the Chinese come.
		Look at their aircraft carriers.
		In five years or less, they'll take over Taiwan.
		We need people in the military and be proud of our military.
		But the union is a problem.
		If Trump was a lawyer, he would have it made.
		Because to me, lawyers are legalized extortion.
		The state of Florida, the lawyers are running our automobile insurance.
		Look at them on TV.
		They got me $400,000.
		An uninsured motorist, if you hit him, he sues you after he pays a fine.
		We have to change things.
		Things aren't bought up to the Capitol in the proper manner.
		Trump is cutting.
		It deserves to be cut.
		Wake up, America.
		We're losing.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		That's a point.
		That's Frank in Florida on federal unions news from the Hill newspaper.
		Federal government labor unions yesterday sued to block the Trump administration from conducting any mass layoffs during the government shutdown.
		Employees are usually temporarily furloughed during a shutdown, except for exempted workers who receive back pay after a shutdown ends.
		But Trump and the White House Budget Office have suggested permanent firings could be on the table.
		The lawsuit filed in federal court in San Francisco alleges that the Office of Management and Budget misinterpreted federal law governing shutdowns when it issued its recent memo suggesting agencies should use this opportunity to consider layoffs for programs that lapsed funding and that aren't priorities of the president.
		This is Mary Alexandra, Virginia Independent.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		Just a couple of thoughts on health care that people have been referring to.
		I'm an emergency room nurse and I've been doing this for about 20 years.
		Just wanted to say that most of the folks that I see are not undocumented individuals.
		I also wanted to just point out the distinction between uninsured and undocumented.
		We see a lot of folks in the emergency room that are without insurance and they are often U.S. citizens.
		So there's really no evidence that can back up the claims that emergency rooms are being overtaxed by undocumented individuals.
		And I also wanted to point out, somebody brought up Mtala.
		I really appreciate that.
		But it's generally not the taxpayers that are going to fund an uninsured individual that comes into an emergency room.
		Hospitals will absorb that cost.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So that's the Emergency Room Treatment Act that the previous caller brought up.
unidentified		Yes.
		So when someone comes into an emergency room seeking care, we are required by law to provide that care no matter what.
		And that will sometimes generate a huge bill.
		But the earlier caller, I believe she was from Massachusetts, was referring to then, I believe, the state picking up or tax dollars.
		That's not Medicaid.
		That is an uninsured person, perhaps.
		And yeah, I mean, I'm not going to speak for all hospitals, obviously, but usually those bills can't be paid.
		They're just not paid.
		And hospitals have ways to assume those costs.
		Some things people can look out for.
		Most of the past 10 to 20 years, hospitals have had patient advocacy departments.
		You'll see those going away.
		They're now patient relations departments.
		So I just really want to encourage people to think of hospital chains that are pretty much taking over small primary care practices.
		Different regions of the country have different chains.
		Out west, perhaps Providence Healthcare.
		Here in the DMV, we have Inova, MedStar.
		So to consider yourself a consumer as much as a patient.
		And these are corporate entities.
		I think another caller brought up health insurance companies and the problems that for-profit health care bring.
		So I just wanted to put those points out on the table That, yeah, there are lots of layers to this, and we do not assume the cost for people that do not have health insurance directly.
		If they walk into a multi-million dollar health corporation emergency room, the hospital is going to eat that cost.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Mary, how long have you been an emergency room nurse?
unidentified		Almost 40 years, and I've worked in six different states.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Mary, thanks for what you do.
		Thanks for the call.
		This is James in Walden, New York.
		Republican, good morning.
unidentified		Yeah, I'll make this quick because I know time is short.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Might have a little bit more time, actually, James, because I think we might be waiting for the beginning of this Republican press conference.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		So go ahead.
unidentified		Okay, so I applied for Medicaid in New York State.
		Of course, I got denied.
		But on the Medicaid, the notice number for this application was U33FYN8297.
		On page 18, it says to get Medicaid, you'll get it automatically if you are pregnant or an undocumented, well, they say undocumented, but I say illegal immigrant applying for medical coverage because of a medical condition.
		So they do get Medicaid.
		Illegals do get it.
		Because what the state will do is tell the federal government, hey, we need money because, look, you know, we spent all this money on medical health here in New York State.
		So give us, you know, a refund or whatever.
		So they do get it.
		I have proof right here on this application, on this Medicaid application.
		They do get it.
		I don't know.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		James in New York.
		This is Thomas.
		Daytona Beach, Florida.
		Democrat, good morning.
unidentified		Yes, sir.
unidentified		How are you doing this morning?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Doing well.
unidentified		Listen, the guy just called back about 20 callers.
		You had a woman call him.
		She said she'd been in this country 20 years.
		And she said she got Medicaid for her when she was pregnant.
		She got Medicaid.

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