CSPAN - Washington Journal 09/23/2025

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Sept. 23, 2025 09:15-10:04 - CSPAN

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Washington Journal 09/23/2025

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pedro echevarria

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michael froman

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unidentified		I'm an independent and I feel like neither one of these parties is, you know, doing a good job in regards to representing what most Americans feel and think.
		I'm a conservative person in some ways, but I also have some liberal leanings as well.
		And it is heartbreaking to me when both sides demonize, literally demonize the other side.
		And that demonization gives some people the license to literally go and kill.
		And I mean, as a society, we are responsible to take a look at that and say, wait a minute, you know, this is not how this is supposed to work.
		And one thing that people don't realize, too, is words, words have power and they can reach far into people.
		And I'm just disturbed by all of it because, you know, whether or not it's President Trump and somebody trying to kill him, that's heartbreaking.
		That should never happen.
		You have Nancy Pelosi's husband that got blutched and attacked with a hammer.
		Should never have happened.
		You got a young man with large talent being assassinated in front of a crowd of people.
		Should never have happened.
		But I really think both sides, I mean, none of these parties, you know, I wish we had a third independent party that could represent me and maybe the other 65 or 70% of Americans that have conservative and liberal leanings.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		And I apologize.
		Thank you for calling and sharing your thoughts this morning.
		We have run out of time for this segment.
		Thank you to all who participated in this open forum.
		We'll talk about this idea of both sides coming together to resolve issues, whether it be issues like polarization, whether it be issues like gerrymandering.
		Two former members of Congress who work under the umbrella group issue one.
		Joining us for this discussion, we will hear from Democrat Tim Romer, Republican Charles Gustani as they join us next on Washington Journal.
		We'll be right back.
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		Washington Journal continues.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Two former members of Congress joining us on Washington Journal to talk about a variety of issues.
		They all, they appear under the umbrella group Issue One.
		We'll talk about that in a second.
		We're joined by Tim Romer, the Issue One on the Reformers' Caucus.
		He serves as their co-chair in studio.
		Joining us via Zoom, Charles Bustani of Issue One.
		He's also a caucus member of the Reformers Caucus, former representative for Louisiana.
		Mr. Romer, a former representative of Indiana.
		To both of you, thanks for giving us your time today.
unidentified		Good to be with you, Pedro.
unidentified		Good to be back on C-SPAN, and thank you for all you guys do to connect America and try to bring us together.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Let me start by letting the viewers see where you're coming from.
		Issue one.
		Remind viewers about what it is.
unidentified		So Issue One is a cross-partisan, non-partisan, bipartisan organization, not-for-profit, that works on one issue and one issue alone.
		How do we unite Americans behind our Constitution, our country, put country before party, and strengthen our democracy?
		Try to make sure that the people, we the people, are in charge, not the power elite, not the bureaucracy, we the people.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Bustani, let me follow up by that by saying the Reformers Caucus.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Can you elaborate a little bit on that?
unidentified		Well, the Reformers Caucus consists of a number of bipartisan former members of Congress, the U.S. House, U.S. Senate, but also we have, broadly with Issue One, we have former cabinet secretaries, governors, former senior military officers, and the like.
		We all come together around those principles that Tim just laid out.
		Secondly, I would just say the Reformers Caucus specifically is looking at Congress because we're very concerned that one of the problems we have in our constitutional setup is that Congress is a weaker body now given the executive branch and the powers that the executive branch are exerting.
		And this has been going on a long time under both parties.
		So we're looking at how do we strengthen Congress because it's the most representative body in our Constitution, responsive to the people of the United States.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		And we'll talk about those issues directly related to Congress.
		Mr. Bustani, because Mr. Romer talked about unity.
		You talked about it.
		How would you describe the current state of the United States when it comes to unity in light of even the last week or so when it comes to this idea of polarization?
unidentified		Well, I believe polarization has really gotten to be extreme.
		It's dangerous.
		We've already seen violence and both parties are part of this.
		At least partisans, extreme partisans in both parties are a part of this that are fueling it.
		And the temperature needs to be lowered.
		And so the question then becomes, how do we lower this temperature?
		And there are a number of things we can talk about.
		Of course, gerrymandering is one.
		Trying to find ways to restore trust in the American system of government and also understanding how we can bring both parties together to work on the problems that most Americans care about that are being ignored because of the partisanship.
		So those are some of the issues I think that are right there on the table.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Representative Romer, this idea of bringing the temperature down, bringing people together.
		He talked about what needs to be done.
		Why do you think it's happening?
unidentified		Well, first of all, I agree with Charles.
		I mean, I think he's absolutely right about rhetoric needs to cool down.
		We need to step back and appreciate the 250 years coming up of our country's birthday, the things that bring us together as people in a community, people that care about America and bringing back that American dream.
		Yeah, I probably grew up a lot like Charles did in Louisiana.
		I come from a family in northern Indiana.
		We had Democrats and Republicans in our family, you know, uncles, aunts that had different party allegiances and affiliations.
		We had great Christmas and Thanksgivings together, good conversations.
		Nobody boycotted each other.
		Nobody cut each other off.
		People listened to each other.
		And I think that's what most of America wants to do.
		When I served in Congress, I occasionally would, I know the Democrats sit on one side, the Republicans the other.
		There's this big divide aisle.
		I'd go over the Republican side, sit with Republicans during votes, try to figure out why are you here?
		What committees are you on?
		What's your family like?
		Where might we be able to work together in the future?
		Not everything.
		I understand both parties have different passions, Pedro, and we come from, you know, with different ideas.
		But that doesn't mean we start every conversation with, I'm right, you're wrong, and I'm not listening to you.
		Tone down, the rhetoric, no violence is permitted from either side.
		I thought what Erica Kirk said at that memorial in Arizona, forgiving the shooter, saying we need to come together as a country.
		I thought she had some of the most poignant remarks of anybody on the stage.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Bustani, I suppose that, like Mr. Romer, you remember your time in Congress, this idea of polarization, what you did to combat that.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Your thoughts on that?
unidentified		Well, like Tim, I crossed the aisle to get to know members.
		We had opportunities to travel together, to get to know each other better, including families of members.
		So that was a part of it.
		But I have to say, one of the most important things in Congress that could bring members together was the work of committees.
		When you work on a committee, you have to find ways to work together because ultimately you're working on legislation.
		And what I have seen in my time, the 12 years that I was in Congress, we saw a significant erosion in that committee process where the leadership really took control of legislation.
		Keep in mind, those who run for leadership positions come from the most partisan side of both parties because they have the luxury of being able to run for those leadership positions.
		And so legislation now has become much more partisan because it's driven from the top down from a leadership office rather than through the committees where there's a tendency to work in a bipartisan fashion because you know the members more closely.
		You've worked side by side with them.
		And so one of the things I did, whenever I introduced the bill that was going to go through my committee, the Ways and Needs Committee, I tried to find someone on the other side of the aisle to work with me on it.
		And oftentimes I was successful in that.
		And there's some things where you can't do it, as Tim mentioned.
		But bottom line is many of these issues, there are bipartisan solutions.
		That's what the American people want.
		And if we can get Congress to work better, restore the committee process, I think that would go a long way to lowering the temperature.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Let me invite people into the conversation.
		202748-8000 for Democrats, Republicans, 202748-8001.
		Independents, 202748-8002, Representative Romer.
unidentified		So, Pedro, you know, to Charles's important point there, reaching across the aisle, trying to figure out by listening, respecting, spending time with people in the other party.
		We do that at issue one.
		I was up on the Hill last week meeting with Democrats, Republicans, staff members, trying to figure out where is the commonality as 75% of Americans, 75% of Americans don't agree on anything these days,
		you know, let alone they're all opposed to gerrymandering, which is the process of redistricting on steroids and supercharged, where partisans equipped with high-powered computers, looking for partisan advantage, pick who they want to represent them rather than voters picking who they want to send to Congress.
		Gerrymandering is rigging the system.
		So 75% of Americans say that we are opposed to gerrymandering.
		70% say it should be illegal.
		It should be illegal.
		It should be off the books.
		So issue one is up there talking to members of Congress, going out to talk to the American people, trying to make sure that we support this 75% of Americans.
		How do we get Congress, how do we get Americans involved in this system, whether it's gerrymandering in Texas or California or Illinois or Maryland or Indiana, my home state, it should not be happening in the middle of a 10-year redistricting period.
		It happens every 10 years, not every two years.
		And the partisans should not be drawing the lines.
		Let the American people decide who the representatives are, not somebody with a computer drawing districts based upon Medusa's hairline or an octopus like figure.
		You know, let's keep our communities together.
		Let's keep communities solid.
		Let's keep neighborhoods together.
		Let's not get this distorted and rigged system going like it's trying to get going now.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		And before we take calls, Representative Bustani, I suppose then looking at Texas, that complicates that mission when it comes to bringing some type of unity when it comes to the topic of gerrymandering.
unidentified		Well, there's no question about it.
		And what we're seeing now is same is going in California and other states are starting to pick up that banner of gerrymandering.
		And it's a weaponization now that is truly dangerous, I think, and erosive to the functioning of Congress.
		So here's the issue.
		With gerrymandering, it's really a breach in the contract between government, our officials who are elected to represent us, and the voters.
		It's a breach in contract.
		And it's a corrupt bargain among the politicians who are doing this to retain power.
		So they draw maps with all kinds of weird configurations, as Tim laid out.
		It also leads to more partisan leadership, more partisan members of Congress, and a greater divide between Democrats and Republicans within the House, and certainly in the Senate as well.
		But clearly, that divide is polarizing America.
		It is preventing the kind of compromise that's needed to address the problems that Americans care about around a kitchen table every single day.
		And so the trust in Congress is at arguably an all-time low.
		People don't trust our government.
		They're even starting to question our democracy and our Constitution.
		And so gerrymandering and fixing this problem is critically important.
		It's not going to fix everything, but it's an important step among other reforms that are absolutely necessary.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		You just heard from a former U.S. Representative Republican from Louisiana, Charles Bustani, joining us via Zoom.
		Tim Romer, former U.S. Representative, Democrat from Indiana, joining us in studio for this conversation.
		Randy, Democrats line from Oklahoma.
		Starts us off.
		Randy, hello, and you're on with our guests.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning to you all.
		God bless America.
		We would love to all get along.
		Both sides do this, both sides do that.
		I think we need a starting point.
		And that would be for all parties involved to admit that we were lied to about the dossier and the COVID and the collusion and the diary and all the things that the Democrats accused the Republicans of, all the lies that they accused Trump of.
		We've got to come to a point where we all admit to the lies that we used to create this partisanship.
		The gerrymandering started in Michigan and in the Northeast where you have 30 or 40% of the population, they're registered Republicans and have zero representation.
		So the gerrymandering problem is not new.
		It's not created by the Republicans in Texas.
		It was created by my party, the Democratic Party, who have become so corrupt and so hate-filled that they won't admit when they've lied about someone to the point where he almost gets assassinated.
		We have to clear the slate.
		We have to stop lying and we have to stop letting news media perpetuate those lies.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Randy there in Oklahoma.
unidentified		Yeah, Randy, I think your point about history is a really critical and important one here.
		It goes back even further than you stated.
		Gerrymandering goes back all the way almost 190 years ago to a guy by the name of Elbridge Gary.
		It's called gerrymandering, who created as a, I think it was governor of Massachusetts these crazy looking districts in Massachusetts.
		Both parties do it, Randy, as you said.
		So what Charles and I and Democrats and Republicans and 75% of Americans are saying is let's stop it.
		This is something we agree on.
		Congress can do a couple things.
		One, Congress can pass minimum standards.
		You can call your Congressman and Congressmen and say, I want a law passed where there's minimum standards about numbers, geography, Voting Rights Act.
		Here are the minimum standards about how you do redistricting.
		And then secondly, Congress can pass laws saying, let's create independent commissions in the states.
		All states should have them.
		11 now do, Pedro, where judges and independent people from the political parties decide how those lines are going to be drawn in each congressional district.
		And then finally, states can pass laws saying, we're going to create our own independent commission.
		Again, 11 states have already done this, creating equality, parity, fair lines.
		We need all 50 states to do this.
		Call your congresspeople.
		Call your senators.
		Tell them you're one of the 75% of Americans that agree on things where we can find common ground, as Randy says, work together to solve problems in America, and make our country back, you know, back to we the people, where we're in charge, not somebody drawing lines on a computer that has partisan interests.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Pistani.
unidentified		Yes.
		Well, I agree with everything Tim said.
		Now, I'll get right to a couple of points that he did not mention.
		I believe with the commissions, it's very important to lay out standards for who can be on these commissions so that we don't create partisan, you know, overtly partisan commissions.
		You can't eliminate it completely, but you want people who really are going to focus on doing the right thing in building out or drawing up these maps.
		And then secondly, it's important to recognize that the maps in the states that don't have commissions are drawn by state legislatures.
		And those state legislatures gerrymander their maps.
		And so it has to be addressed at the state level as well.
		And I believe the commission approach that Tim laid out with standards and some guidelines, especially for congressional elections coming from Congress, is critically important.
		Gerrymandering should be made illegal.
		Congress should make a firm statement declaring it illegal and then lay out the standards for how our maps should be done every 10 years according to the census.
		But the bottom line is this.
		Gerrymandering and redistricting in midterm is really egregious, and that has to stop.
		That needs to be made illegal now.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Let's hear from John.
		John's in Georgia, Republican line.
		Hi, John.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I think gerrymandering is a mute point.
		And let me explain that.
		I don't think the representatives that are elected by the people actually represent the people.
		And I'll give you a couple of examples.
		Trump carried the state of Georgia.
		Georgia has two Democrat senators.
		Neither Democrat senators voted for his bill when it came up in the Senate.
		There wasn't a single Democrat senator from a state that Trump won that voted for the bill.
		In Arizona, there are three districts that Trump carried that sent Democrat representatives back to Congress.
		What do you think those representatives are going to do?
		Are they going to vote for Trump's bills in which the people voted for?
		No, they're going to vote for the party.
		Until we get rid of party politics, it's not going to change.
		The party controls everything.
		And that's the problem.
		People put the politicians put party in front of people all the time.
		We wouldn't have this division if the people controlling the party were not so partisan.
		You got to take the money from the party out of the individual elections and get the representatives back to representing the people.
		Right now, that's not happening.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		That's John and Georgia.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		We'll let Mr. Bistani go first.
unidentified		John, thank you.
		Clearly, campaign finance reform needs to be a part of this as well, along with reforming the gerrymandering or eliminating gerrymandering.
		It's important to recognize, number one, that Congress, the Senate, the House, that is an independent branch of government.
		And the separation of powers between the legislative branch and the executive branch is critically important for our system to provide checks and balances and oversight to prevent abuses and corruption.
		Both bodies are capable of corruption.
		Both need to be called into check by the other.
		This is why strengthening Congress is critically important because Congress is weak right now.
		It's the weakest branch of the government.
		And in the Constitution, the founders of this country who wrote this Constitution intended for Congress to be an equal branch and a strong branch, just as a strong presidency is needed.
		We need balance.
		And this is what issue one is working on.
		Issue one is at the forefront of looking at reforms to try to make this balance appropriate so that politicians respond to the people.
		There's transparency.
		There's oversight.
		We're doing this by trying to get rid of gerrymandering.
		We're doing it to try to improve campaign finance reform.
		We're trying to do a whole list of things at issue one to try to bring that transparency and accountability back to our United States government.
		Otherwise, there will be no trust.
		And if there's no trust, we lose our democracy.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Roemer.
unidentified		Yeah, I think John's critical, critical sentence that I embrace 100% is partisans and the party should not be in control of redistricting and thereby make it gerrymandering and take it out of the hands of the people and put it in the party's hands.
		John and I agree on that.
		I would say put it in the hands of independent, nonpartisan people who have the interests of the voters and our citizens and the Constitution.
		John, country over party on redistricting.
		I think that's key.
		You know, Pedro, you and I were joking around before we got on air about, you know, let's talk about sports or football for a while.
		Here's a sports analogy on redistricting and gerrymandering.
		Imagine if when we go to watch our favorite college football team, whether it's Charles's LSU Tigers or my Notre Dame Fighting Irish, and the referees had determined the outcome ahead of time.
		And, you know, you were going to lose the game no matter what your players did on the field.
		Trust in football would go down.
		You wouldn't attend the games anymore.
		The system falls apart.
		That's what gerrymandering is.
		They're rigging the system for one party or the other to win elections.
		And what's the outcome in addition to trust going away in the system?
		The outcome also is the polarization of Congress.
		Because when I first ran, Pedro, I ran in northern Indiana from a swing district, meaning either a Democrat or Republican could win.
		Out of 435 seats in 1990 when I first ran, I was part of about 160 or 170 out of 435 that either party could win from one election to the other.
		Today, Pedro, we are down to about 40 to 50 swing competitive districts in the United States Congress.
		Only about 11% of our congressional seats can be actually won by either party.
		So most of us are going to vote with the outcome rigged ahead of time.
		No wonder people are ticked off and disappointed in the system and not trusting it.
		Let's stop gerrymandering so that when we go to the polls and I want to vote for a Democrat one year or independent another year or Republican, I know that person might be able to win.
		Not that it's rigged ahead of time.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		George joins us in Kentucky.
		Democrats line for both of our guests.
		George, hello.
unidentified		Thank you very much, and good morning.
		First of all, to the first caller, Russia was very much involved in the 2016 election, but that's set aside.
		I think you have to look at the long etymology and the long origins and history of a lot of this polarization.
		FDR had a backlash, a kind of anti-communist backlash.
		Anybody who took the side of labor or the working poor or social economic justice was depicted by a McCarthyism as communism, wanting to take our economic freedoms away.
		Now, you had a lot of entrepreneurs who peddled that propaganda.
		They wrote books, pamphlets, the John Burke Society.
		They made movies and documentaries, and they went on speaking for us.
		They made a lot of money promoting McCarthyism to everybody that's a political liberal or leans a little left or whatnot, takes a side of workers or the working poor or social justice, depicting, like Bernie Sanders is not the equivalent of Joe Stalin.
		And we hear that all the time on Fox.
		It laid under the surface for a couple decades.
		It rose back to service with the syndicate of Newt Gingrich becoming the House Speaker.
		And him and his lieutenant, Tom DeLay, they got together with their groups to no longer treat your opponents as opponents, but political enemies.
		We're no longer working with them.
		We're going to be for everything they're against, against everything for.
		We're going to fight them everything no matter what.
		And then you had Fox and Rush Limbaugh and Glenn Beck.
		And then from there, all the overheated rhetoric that they want to take all our freedoms away and they're ruined the country.
		That's the origin.
		We need to end McCarthyism.
		Thank you very much.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Mr. Romer.
unidentified		I'd just say, you know, one of the things I'm reading in terms of history is I'm rereading David McCullough's 1776 as we go into the 250th birthday of America next year.
		And Pedro, it is so compelling about our story as America.
		We fight the most powerful army and navy in the world.
		We have less than a percent chance of winning.
		Our soldiers barely have muskets and boots on their feet, many of them feet wrapped in rags.
		And we win.
		And we gain our independence.
		And we write those marvelous words, we the people.
		Let's not rehash history and go back looking for things that divide us.
		Let's look at things that unite us.
		E pluribus unum, from the many one, what can we do as we go into America's birthday to bring America together?
		I think most of America wants to tone down the rhetoric.
		They don't want to see any more violence in America.
		They want to celebrate the birthday coming up.
		We're not going to agree on everything.
		What are some things we can agree on?
		Let's get rid of gerrymandering.
		Let's work together to have coffee, dinner, lunch with somebody we disagree with in our local community and listen to them for a change and learn something new maybe.
		Let's do some of the big and the small things going into the 250th year where issue one is trying to look to, you know, what can we do to unite America, put country over party, honor our Constitution and our heritage and our history, and continue to make that American dream alive for more and more people.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Bustani.
unidentified		Well, I agree with Tim, and I would just add this, George.
		You know, we're all Americans, and we all want what's best for our country when it comes down to it.
		Secondly, this country has a remarkable capacity to self-correct when we veer off to the right or to the left or on some crazy tangent.
		That is the beauty of our democracy.
		It's got the kind of flexibility that is necessary to self-correct and to continue to improve.
		That's who we are as Americans.
		We're not divided into these parties where we see the other side as an enemy.
		That's what we have to get away.
		We have to fight back against that.
		And each and every American has an obligation to do their part in their community to push back on that kind of extreme partisanship.
		That's why, as Tim mentioned, we need to come back around to some of the things that we can do collectively together to make it happen.
		Fixing gerrymandering is clearly one of them.
		Campaign finance reform is another.
		If Americans demand changes and improvements in these areas, we can fix the problems that are afflicting our democracy and certainly afflicting our government and restore trust in our government.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Let me ask you both then, Mr. Pitsani, to that point when it comes to working together.
		We're at a point possibly where the government may shut down.
		There are attempts to restore regular order as it is to pass bills.
		What are you seeing happen in Congress about the ability not to pass all those appropriations bill to depend on things like continuing resolutions and the like?
unidentified		Well, Pedro, that's unconscionable in my mind that Congress doesn't get these appropriations bills done.
		In my 12 years in Congress, it happened once.
		And it was a real sore spot with me because that is a fundamental spelled out obligation in the U.S. Constitution for Congress to manage the spending of the United States.
		And if Congress can't even do its basic function of budgeting and setting up the spending appropriately at levels that are needed to keep our government running, that is a failure.
		And it's unacceptable.
		And no American should accept that.
		And so this is another area where we at issue one are trying to make improve or trying to push for creating a process that gets this done and restoring Congress's obligation to the power of the purse.
		Because without that, then it becomes an opaque black box where the executive branch decides what it's going to do with money, how it's going to spend it, who it's going to favor, who it's going to not favor.
		Congress needs to be doing that.
		It's a power that's spelled out in the Constitution, and the American people should accept nothing less than that.
		Mr. Robertson is working on an issue one.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		And we started this conversation without this thing about Congress taking back its power, especially at this time.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Your thoughts?
unidentified		Yeah, Pedro, great question.
		I mean, I think, you know, in our Constitution, Article 1, Section 1 is not the executive branch.
		It's not the president.
		It's not a king.
		It is the people's branch, the Congress, the Senate, and the House together that is elected at the state and the local level.
		Congress, whether Biden's president, whether Trump's president, whether Obama's president, whether Bush is president, Congress has got to perform its constitutional role of representing the people.
		It needs to have its say on what money is spent on, whether we go to war, whether a military can go into a city.
		Let's have Congress exert its constitutional responsibility and say in that.
		When I served in Congress, Pedro, I served with both Democratic and Republican presidents.
		I didn't serve under them.
		I served with them.
		And we are a co-equal branch of government as the people's branch in the House of Representatives.
		I would go to the White House and meet with a Republican president and talk to them about what their ideas were about a government shutdown.
		And we would try to compromise each other's interests.
		Okay, we need this.
		We need that.
		What are we going to resolve at the end of the day?
		I'm hoping that the President of the United States will sit down with the Democratic leadership and they will talk to one another.
		They haven't even talked to one another about what each side wants.
		Democrats want to talk about, hopefully, cost of living increases and these tariffs increasing the cost of everything across the board from toys to corn.
		Let's talk about those things and see if we can't come to a reasonable compromise.
		That's what our Constitution is framed upon.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Former Representatives Tim Romer and Charles Bustani on with this conversation.
		They are with the group Issue One.
		Let's hear from Walter.
		He's in Butler, Indiana.
		Republican line.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thanks for taking my call.
		I'm an old New Yorker that ran away from Democratic lifestyles because I couldn't afford to live out there.
		I came out to Northeast Indiana.
		I don't want to thank you for what I'm going to say.
		I was a 20-year combat medic, so I do love my country.
		I had skin in the game.
		And with that being said, all of these politicians, there's money and division, okay?
		When you folks go to Pennsylvania Avenue, you get into the click, you get into the country clubs, you put on a kabuki theater of and you all argue.
		And with an ignorant population, which we have today, it's very easy to make these people susceptible to the Kool-Aid you're drinking.
		And then you go to the country clubs, and the only way we get into the country clubs is if we're cutting the grass or serving you martinis.
		This show is over.
		It's all been run by corporations over the last 75 years.
		We owe $38 trillion in debt.
		And the American dream that we keep talking about, the revolutionary war and all that, that's just to get sentiment and people up because it's all about money.
		Every time you have division, you write books, you go durka-durka, you talk about stuff, you make money on both sides.
		And with an ignorant population, this is what we got.
		The country is done.
		It's bankrupt.
		It's run by corporations.
		We owe $38 trillion in debt.
		And the whole thing is over.
		And the politicians or band members on the Titanic asking the ignorant population what song to sing.
		This whole thing is.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Okay, Walter, we're running close to time, so you put a lot out there for the guests, Mr. Romer.
unidentified		Yeah, Walter, all due respect to you living in Indiana.
		I hope the Hoosier State is treating you well.
		But certainly you're not getting out in your neighborhood much if you think all of our Hoosier voters and people across America are ignorant voters.
		In fact, I couldn't disagree with you more.
		American voters are sharp.
		They are smart.
		They use their common sense.
		I wish they'd vote more often, but I couldn't disagree with you more on that concept.
		Two, I think the American dream is waning, but very alive.
		We need to restore that American dream.
		We can do that and resurrect that ladder.
		I grew up escalating that ladder, education, hard work, respect for community and family.
		And I occasionally got some help from government on a student loan that I repaid.
		We need to restore and rebuild that ladder for the American dream.
		And lastly, the one area where I'd agree with you on money, money, money.
		Too much of it in American politics.
		We need to clean it up.
		We need to make it so that anybody can run for office.
		They don't have to be a billionaire to run for office like it is today.
		Too many of our senators and congresswomen have wealth and can buy the office.
		Issue one works to try to restore integrity in that process.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Pistani.
unidentified		Well, let me just say that Tim is right on all the things he laid out.
		I agree with him.
		We can't lose faith in the American dream.
		Our country is going through some difficult times right now, but it's been through difficult times in the past, and we can self-correct.
		The bottom line in all of this is the self-correction will come from the people.
		If you want the system to go on and continue to collapse, let's just keep doing what we're doing.
		We at issue one are trying to bring the American people to understand that it's within them to make the changes.
		So we as voters have to demand that those who we have elected must take on these reforms.
		This is why at issue one, what we're trying to do is lay out some specific reforms that start that self-correction process.
		And we can restore this American dream.
		You know, Winston Churchill said you can always count on the Americans to do the right thing after they have exhausted all other options.
		We've exhausted a lot of options.
		It's time to do the right thing as Americans and start embracing a reform agenda.
		And we at issue one want to help the American public understand what that agenda looks like and how we can get it done.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		We have about five more minutes with our guest, Jackie in Connecticut, Independent Line.
unidentified		Hello.
		Good morning.
		Thank you so much for taking my call.
		I want to thank C-SPAN for its steadfast work over the years and doing its part to inform our society.
		I definitely want to tip my hat to these two gentlemen for taking a stance for the Constitution, for the American way.
		And the calls that I've been hearing this morning are so interesting because two of the gentlemen, Republicans, that were talking about how partisan we are and how things are so divided and we can't seem to get past this are part of the reason why we are so divided and have these issues.
		And gentlemen, I tip my hat to you because you've been so graceful this morning in not mentioning the elephant in the room, and it's Donald Trump.
		We are so far away from our constitutional norms, and this isn't something that's happened overnight.
		It's been a slow process.
		Citizens United.
		That's the reason why we have so much dark money in the system.
		And that situation has seemed to be overlooked by the Republican Party.
		As an independent that has voted for Republicans, that has voted for Democrats.
		We see the partisan divide.
		And the person who is increasing that divide, the commander-in-chief is supposed to buy this constitution, is supposed to be providing for the peace and tranquility of the country.
		He's doing just the opposite.
		He fired his White House counsel because he didn't want to know what the law was and how he might have been in violation of the laws.
		Anyone who can support what has happened in January 6th cannot seriously talk about partisanship.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we're almost out of time, so we'll call her.
		Thank you.
		We'll have to leave it there.
		Mr. Bustani.
unidentified		This is why checks and balances are really important and the separation of powers is important because over the course of our history, where one branch has assumed powers and done more or taken the country in a bad direction, regardless of who's in the White House, who's in Congress, the checks and balances matter.
		That's the beauty of our Constitution.
		And that's what we are standing up for at issue one.
		Let's restore that constitutional balance.
		Let's bring Congress back and hold them accountable to uphold their obligations under the Constitution.
		And this country will self-correct.
		But if we don't do that, it won't happen.
		And that's why it's up to us, we the people, to make this happen.
		And that's what issue one is trying to help facilitate.
		So thank you.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		Mr. Romer.
unidentified		Yeah, Pedro, I think what's so important today, too, I'm not a fan of President Trump, but rather than concentrating on what he's doing every day and whether that gets my blood pressure up or not, what can I do to make my community a better place?
		What can I do as an individual to make my country a better place?
		What can I do to unify the country?
		Issue one is trying to do that, trying to bring Democrats and Republicans together on some issues.
		Big money in politics.
		Your caller mentioned Citizens United.
		When I ran for Congress, most of my money came from fundraisers at the local level, fish fries, hot dog suppers, door-to-door individual contributions.
		Now people can write one billion dollar check for somebody to get elected.
		That's not the way our country should go.
		So let's try to focus more on what we can do at our community level, what we can do on campuses to bring Democrats and Republicans together and not be overwhelmed by who's in the Senate, the House, and the White House.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		The website is issue1.org and two representatives of that group joining us, former members of Congress.
		You just heard from Tim Romer, former Democrat from Indiana, Charles Bustani joining us, a former Representative Republican of Louisiana.
		And to both you gentlemen, thanks for the conversation.
unidentified		Thank you, Pedro.
unidentified		Great to be with you.
pedro echevarria ▲ ● ▼		That's it for our program today.
		A lot going on at the United Nations today, including President Trump addressing the General Assembly.
		Make sure to stay close to our website, our app, and the .org and C-SPAN, our channels to find and see that.
		That's it for today.
		Another edition of Washington Journal comes your way tomorrow at 7 a.m.
		We'll see you then.
unidentified		Today, we'll hear from Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell after the central bank cut interest rates last week, speaking at the Greater Providence Chamber of Commerce in Rhode Island.
		Watch live coverage at 1235 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN.
		C-SPAN Now, our free mobile app, or online at c-span.org.
		The United Nations General Assembly is holding its 80th session.
		Shortly, President Trump will speak to members.
		Right now, they're hearing from the presidents of Brazil.
		Live coverage from New York City on C-SPAN2 and on C-SPAN.org and on the C-SPAN Now video app throughout the day.
		In 1945, the United Nations was founded in the aftermath of World War II.
		This week, C-SPAN marks the 80th anniversary of the UN.
		We'll dig into the C-SPAN archives for historic speeches from U.S. presidents and world leaders delivered at the annual United Nations General Assembly in New York.
		Tonight, at 8 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN 2, we'll feature George W. Bush, who laid out the case against Iraqi leader Saddam Hussein and weapons of mass destruction in 2002.
		And then a 2006 speech by Venezuelan President Hugo Chavez, criticizing the United States, calling President George W. Bush the devil.
		And President Barack Obama in 2009 speaking to the body as the first African American to ever hold the office of U.S. President.
		He called for a new chapter of international cooperation amid the war on terror.
		Watch the 80th anniversary of the United Nations all this week at 8 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN 2.
		Next, a discussion with Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney on U.S.-Canada relations.
		He talks about recognizing the Palestinian state, trade agreements, and imposing sanctions on Russia over the Russia-Ukraine war.
		This was hosted by the Council on Foreign Relations.
michael froman ▲ ● ▼		Good afternoon, everybody.
		Welcome.
		And welcome to the Russell C. Leffingwell Lecture.
		I'm Mike Froman, President of the Council.
		It's great to have you all here, and we are privileged to have Prime Minister Mark Carney of Canada here.
		Inaugurated in 1969, this lecture was named for a charter member of CFR who served as its president, very important role, from 1944 to 1946 and its chairman from 1946 to 1953.

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