CSPAN - Washington Journal 04/10/2025

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April 10, 2025 07:00-09:00 - CSPAN

01:59:52

Washington Journal 04/10/2025

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mimi geerges

cspan 25:06

paul tonko

rep/d 16:37

rich mccormick

rep/r 10:13

Appearances

brian lamb

cspan 00:41

donald j trump

admin 01:17

hakeem jeffries

rep/d 00:45

jamieson greer

admin 00:40

mike johnson

rep/r 00:43

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jim marrs

00:28

peter navarro

admin 00:10

scott bessent

admin 00:25

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Support C-SPAN as a public service, along with these other television providers, giving you a front-row seat to democracy.
		Coming up on Washington Journal this morning, we'll take your calls and comments on tariffs and the GOP budget live.
		And then New York Democratic Congressman Paul Tonko, a member of the Budget and Energy and Commerce Committees, discusses tariffs and Democrat strategies to counter the Trump administration.
		And Georgia Republican Congressman Rich McCormick, a member of the Armed Services Committee, on the budget and Republican efforts to advance the Trump administration's agenda.
		Washington Journal starts now.
		Join the conversation.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
		It's Thursday, April 10th.
		President Trump announced a 90-day pause on reciprocal tariffs for all countries except China, which he increased to 125%.
		News of the pause sent the market soaring.
		The S ⁇ P 500 rose 9.5%, its sharpest single-day gain since October of 2008.
		And on Capitol Hill, Speaker Johnson postponed the vote on the budget bill, acknowledging that there were too many Republican holdouts to pass the measure.
		This first hour, we'll get your thoughts on either or both of those topics.
		Here are the numbers.
		Republicans, 202748, 8001.
		Democrats, 202-748-8000.
		And Independents, 202-748-8002.
		You can send us a text to 202-748-8003.
		Include your first name in your city-state.
		And you can post your comments on social media, facebook.com slash C-SPAN and X at C-SPANWJ.
		Welcome to today's Washington Journal.
		It's a two-hour show.
		The House is set to gavel in at 9 a.m.
		We'll start with a tariff pause.
		Here are the headlines of the major national papers, the New York Times.
		Trump pauses many tariffs for 90 days, but not on China.
		The Washington Times has this, U-Turn on Tariffs rallies markets.
		And USA Today says Trump puts brakes on reciprocal tariffs.
		He keeps 10% across the board, boosts tax on China to 125%.
		The Wall Street Journal says Trump backtracks, pauses many tariffs.
		And the Washington Post tariffs paused amid warnings and worries.
		This has the three major indices, the NASDAQ in pink, the S ⁇ P 500 in green, and the Dow in blue.
		Here is April 2nd, declaring Liberation Day.
		President Trump announced the tariffs, and then you could see what happened to the market.
		And here is where it closed yesterday on April 9th at the very end here.
		Let's take a look at what President Trump told reporters at an event outside the White House yesterday on why he's pausing the tariffs.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		Well, I thought that people were jumping a little bit out of line.
		They were getting yippy, you know, they were getting a little bit yippy, a little bit afraid, unlike these champions, because we have a big job to do.
		No other president would have done what I did.
		No other president.
		I know the presidents.
		They wouldn't have done it.
		And it had to be done.
		What was happening to us on trade, not only with, you know, if you look at it, not only with China, but China was by far the biggest abuser in history.
		And others also, but somebody had to do it.
		They had to stop because it was not sustainable.
		Last year, China made $1 trillion off trade with the United States.
		That's not right.
		And now I've reversed it.
		It's for a short period of time, but we made $2 billion.
		We're making now $2 billion a day.
		And somebody had to do it.
		Roger actually said it.
		Charles Schwab was here a little while ago, one of the great financial people, and he said, he's been waiting for 40 years for somebody to do what I did over the last month.
		And if you didn't do it, you wouldn't have a country.
		It wouldn't be sustainable.
unidentified		So I'm honored to have done it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here is what the Washington Post says about this.
		It says, the 18 hours that changed Trump's mind on trade.
		From Tuesday evening to Wednesday afternoon, Trump and his trade advisors spoke to several Republican lawmakers and top foreign leaders who raised concerns about the faltering global markets.
		It says that Washington woke up Wednesday to the highest tariffs on foreign goods in a century and to a bond market flashing warning signs that President Donald Trump's bid to remake global trade could spark a far bigger crisis.
		Trump's advisors were still projecting confidence that his effort to restructure the world's economy and sweep away generations of globalization was foolproof.
		Despite the S ⁇ P 500 wiping away 12% of its value in a week, one senior White House official said that Wall Street didn't understand Main Street and that Main Street was still backing the president.
		It says hours later, Trump partially backed down, escalating his trade war with China, but lowering many of the tariffs he had just imposed on the rest of the world.
unidentified		Stock markets soared.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And we will also hear from Speaker Johnson.
		He spoke to reporters right outside, right after postponing the vote on the budget bill yesterday.
		Here he is.
unidentified		Both of these chambers will work together.
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		We have been very cooperative today.
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		Just most recently in the last several hours, you should know, Leader Thune and some of his committee chairs met with some of our members and had a thoughtful dialogue.
unidentified		This is all part of it.
		So everything is moving along just fine.
		We have a little bit of room here to work, and we're going to use that.
		That's right.
		Can you commit that you guys are going to have a vote on this budget before you go on recession?
		Well, that's certainly my intention because I think it's really important for us to do that before we leave, that we have a resolution to this or a plan to get to that resolution before everybody leaves for the district work period.
		And, you know, Passover is Saturday.
		I don't have any intention to have us here working this weekend, but if we have to come back next week, then we'll do that.
		We are going to get the job done.
		Are the senators, are the Senate leadership on the Republican side, are they receptive to these ideas?
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		They fully understand.
		I mean, Leader Thune and I talked multiple times today, talked to some of the key leaders over there who are most attuned to this process and have been leading it thus far.
		They know exactly what we're doing and why and what the conversations are, and they've been very helpful in that regard.
unidentified		So I'm very encouraged.
unidentified		This is not an us versus them prospect.
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		There's no animosity between the chambers, and there's no animosity between anybody in this room.
		This is a productive part of the legislative process.
		We work in the greatest deliberative body in the world, and this is how it happens, especially in a time when you have a small majority, small margins.
unidentified		I know you said that you spoke to the president.
		I did.
		But did the president speak to the other folks in the room?
		No, there was just too many voices, too many people in the room, so I stepped out and talked with the president.
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		Here was his message.
unidentified		It's very positive, very encouraging.
		I gave him an update of where we are.
		He's obviously very closely monitoring all of this.
mike johnson ▲ ● ▼		There's a lot at stake here.
unidentified		He was on his way to another event, and I was trying to get back in the room to finish it, but we had a good discussion, very positive.
		He said, let's just get the job done.
		I said, yes, sir, we will.
		So that's where we're left to be here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And we are taking your calls on either or both of those topics.
		The House canceling the budget vote yesterday and President Trump issuing a 90-day tariff pause.
		Talk to Jared first on the line for Democrats in Wilmington, Delaware.
		Good morning, Jared.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good.
unidentified		So I just wanted to touch on the two things that seem to be intertwined.
		So I don't know which came first, the chicken or the egg, but Trump had to put a pause on that.
		Obviously, the economy was going crazy.
		Obviously, he's trying to sell it as though he did something great.
		Just keep in mind, people, the economy hasn't recovered from when he first made these tariff announcements.
		You know, Dave Portnoy, one of the Trump's supporters, lost $20 million.
		He's back up maybe like $12 million, but he still has a ways to go.
		And I think Mike Johnson, you know, putting this bill to the side is probably what drove Trump to make these changes because if you read his tweets or follow his quote-unquote truth, he said that now was the perfect time to get the bill done.
		Well, he doesn't have the votes.
		We knew he didn't have the votes.
		We know that already.
		So he's telling people to buy, which I think actually was him manipulating the markets.
		But they're letting him get away with anyway.
		Nobody's going to check him.
		We gave up the House, the Senate, and the White House.
		So yeah, we just got to go along for the ride.
		But Donald Trump is out there manipulating the markets, selling losses, his wins.
		And he's the same president as last time.
		We just got to get through these four years and be done with it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Jared.
		And let's take a look at the Truth Social Post.
		The president posting this yesterday.
		He says, based on the lack of respect that China has shown to the world's markets, I am hereby raising the tariff charged to China by the U.S. to 125%, effective immediately.
		At some point, hopefully in the near future, China will realize that the days of ripping off the USA and other countries is no longer sustainable or acceptable.
		Conversely, and based on the fact that more than 75 countries have called representatives of the U.S., including departments of commerce, treasury, and the USTR, to negotiate a solution to the subjects being discussed relative to trade, trade barriers, tariffs, currency manipulation, and non-monetary tariffs, and that these countries have not, at my strong suggestion, retaliated in any way, shape, or form against the U.S.,
		I've authorized a 90-day pause and a substantially lowered reciprocal tariff during this period of 10%, also effective immediately.
		Thank you for your attention to this matter.
		Here's Donald, South Bend, Indiana, Democrat.
unidentified		Yeah, hi.
		Hi.
		I'm just laughing right now because, look, I'm like two, three years before I retire.
		And all I just want to do is just retire and live, you know, reasonably well, you know.
		And I'm going to just give him the win on this, whatever, you know, so he doesn't wreck the economy.
		And I'm going to just say one more thing.
		You know, he's putting the tariffs on Mexico.
		So, you know, he's trying to keep people from coming in from Mexico into the United States.
		So he's putting tariffs on Mexico, which, so that's going to devastate their economy and put people out of work.
		And so what are those people going?
		What are those people going to do?
		You know, it's just crazy.
		But, you know, I'll just, yeah, like the previous caller said, I'll just try to make it through these next four years and hopefully we come out okay.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Donald.
		And this is Elvin on Facebook.
		It looks like the speaker cannot muster enough votes from his own party to pass a bill.
		And President Trump has folded when it comes to tariffs.
		Let's take a look at the Treasury Secretary, Scott Vescent.
		He spoke to reporters about the reasons this pause was implemented.
scott bessent ▲ ● ▼		And we saw the successful negotiating strategy that President Trump implemented a week ago today.
unidentified		It has brought more than 75 countries forward to negotiate.
		It took great courage, great courage for him to stay the course until this moment.
		And what we have ended up with here, as I told everyone a week ago, they're in this very spot.
		Do not retaliate, and you will be rewarded.
scott bessent ▲ ● ▼		So, every country in the world who wants to come and negotiate, we are willing to hear you.
scott bessent ▲ ● ▼		We're going to go down to a 10% baseline tariff for them, and China will be raised to 125 due to their insistence on escalation.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And back to your calls.
		Here is Samuel, a Republican in South Pasadena, California.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Oh, good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Well, I want to talk about the 90-day pause and everything.
		I think it's a great idea because it'll make these countries think about how they're going to work this out and everything.
		And man, that stock market.
		Boy, what a that was a great thing that happened there.
		Anyways, I think Trump is very intelligent, and I was happy to see Trump be president because, well, he's a businessman, and we didn't want no Democrat in there or somebody in there doing all these politics, you know.
		And I don't even think Biden was even running this country.
		And I'm just glad that Trump's doing the right thing.
		And the other topic was what was the other topic?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		About the pause on the sorry, the budget bill being postponed.
unidentified		Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
		Right.
		Yeah, you put a pause on that because there's still a lot to do right now.
		But he has time and everything.
		But I think they're going to work something out and everything.
		But they're just trying to get that market up and get this country back up to where it should be.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Samuel, on the tariffs, do you think that the 90-day pause should be extended?
		Do you think that the tariff should be lifted, the reciprocal tariff should be lifted indefinitely?
		Or what are you thinking on that?
unidentified		Well, I don't think they should be released.
		I mean, they shouldn't be the tariffs shouldn't be brought up.
		I mean, I lost my train of thought.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That's okay.
		As a guy, we'll talk to Mary in Upper Marlborough, Maryland, Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thanks for taking my call.
		I am totally confused with these tariffs.
		One day they're up, one day they're down.
		And I think they need to maybe take a good look at the president because I'm thinking that he may not be too well.
		He's put a tariff on an island where no people live, and then he's putting a tariff on fentanyl.
		I think that he needs to step back and maybe have some medical evaluations.
		Thank you.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here is Ray in Arlington, Vermont, Independent Line.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hi.
		How are you doing?
		I think that the president and what he's trying to do for the country, and like he did in this last term, he served his presidency without charging the country for the money to pay him for working the office.
		And did we receive that in the past?
		No, we didn't receive that in the past.
		We had Biden who took more than he was supposed to take from other countries and accepting illegal money and stuff like that.
		But these people call in and they act like Trump's doing everything wrong when he's doing everything in front of everybody.
		And that may be a problem to them because they don't understand that change is needed and To stop taking and stop the government from taking money and funds from places that are hidden in the dark and that are illegal.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		This is a House hearing from yesterday with the U.S. Trade Representative, Mr. Greer, and Nevada Democrat Stephen Horsford brought up the 90-day pause.
		And this happened yesterday.
		Take a look.
unidentified		Mr. Trade Representative, are you aware that the tariffs have been paused?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		I am, yes.
unidentified		When were you made aware of that?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		Well, I understood the decision was made a few minutes ago.
		Sitting here.
		Under discussion.
unidentified		Sitting here, under discussion.
unidentified		So did you know that this was under discussion, and why did you not include that as part of your opening remarks?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		So typically what I don't do is divulge the contents of my discussions.
unidentified		What are the details of the pause?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		Well, my understanding is that because so many countries have decided not to retaliate, we're going to have about 90 days.
unidentified		No, excuse me.
		China increased their tariffs on the United States.
		Trump blinked.
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		What's the blink, sir?
unidentified		What do you know about this pause?
unidentified		What are the details of it?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		Well, the details, as I understand it, is that China continues to retaliate.
		Other countries didn't retaliate.
		The president, two or three days ago, said we wanted to negotiate with those countries that asked for meetings.
		That's what we're doing.
unidentified		What are the details?
		How long is the pause?
		How many days?
		How many weeks?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		I understand it's 90 days.
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		I haven't spoken to the president since I've been here.
unidentified		So the trade representative hasn't spoken to the president of the United States about a global reordering of trade.
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I have.
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		I just didn't have a hearing with you.
unidentified		But yet he announced it on a tweet.
		WTF.
		Who's in charge?
jamieson greer ▲ ● ▼		The President of the United States is in charge.
unidentified		And what do you know about those details?
unidentified		Well, as I mentioned, it looks like your boss just pulled the rug out from under you and paused the tariffs, the taxes on the American people.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And this was a tweet on X that Representative Stephen Horsford put out.
		He says, what it looks like when you're the country's trade representative testifying before Congress and you find out Trump changed his mind on tariffs.
		This is reckless governing.
		There is no strategy.
		And it's obvious this is amateur hour.
		Wonder what you think about that.
		Here's Steve, an independent in Ormond Beach, Florida.
		Hi, Steve.
unidentified		Hi.
		I'd just like to say that the past four years, everything, there was no transparency at all, zero.
		Biden was hidden somewhere.
		The media is now all coming out.
		All the truth is coming out now.
		The media is continuing to do the lie that they have.
		And even your media, I don't see the Republicans getting long term on here.
		Well, I'm an independent, actually.
		I was Republican, but I went independent many years ago.
		What I'm saying is Biden never signed anything.
		There was another penny signing everything, Biden.
		We have never had transparency for any president like we have had with Donald Trump.
		Donald Trump lives in a glass house.
		Donald Trump is the most honest president that has ever been out there.
		And yes, Donald Trump is going to make mistakes.
		He's a human being.
		Everybody does.
		Bidenomics has hurt the whole world, has the whole world in wars right now.
		Trump is stopping everything.
		And I don't know if I'm still on or not.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You are.
unidentified		I just want to say that Trump's doing a great job.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Steve.
		Here's Albert, Ashbury Park, New Jersey.
		Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Yes.
		My name's Albert Rowley, and I think Donald Trump just planned all of this so that the market would go down and he'd buy everything and wind up making himself a pot full of money.
		That's all there is to it.
		The man is as corrupt as all get out.
		Thank you very much.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here is Matt in Mart, Texas, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Matt.
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
		I think Donald Trump's doing an excellent job.
		He's beyond excellent.
		It should have been done 35, 40 years ago, what he's doing now.
		Nancy Pelosi, 27 years ago, she got up on the House floor and said that China was ripping us off, you know, but now that a Republican is coming out and saying, oh, it's all bad.
		It's all bad.
		Hey, it's unsustainable.
		We're $36 trillion, almost $37 trillion and dead.
		And you have to do something.
		And Trump's got the guts to do it.
		No other president had the knowledge or the guts to do what he's doing.
		And he's making these other countries, now they're coming, they want to cut deals, except China.
		And China is getting punished for it.
		I mean, they've been ripping us off for 35 years.
		You know, it's time, he's the only one standing up to them.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Matt, I heard what you said about China.
		Do you think that the reciprocal tariffs that have been lifted now for 90 days, do you think those should be made permanent?
		Because you said that that was for, I mean, the president said that's going to bring in income.
		So should that be put back?
		What are your thoughts on that?
unidentified		Well, I think that what he's doing, what Trump is doing, see, he can't cut deals with these people.
		It takes a long time.
		Say he gets two or three of them done here in the next few days with countries.
		That'll be a good thing.
		He's already cut a lot of deals already, you know, brought in almost a trillion dollars worth of business investment into America.
		But say he gets some big deals done with some of these other countries that are willing to deal.
		Evidently, there's 60 or 70 or 80 of them wanting to deal right now.
		But he can't see them all at the same time.
		But he's going to see as many as he possibly can.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Matt.
		And Carlos in Columbia, South Carolina sent us a text.
		He agrees with you.
		There is still a 10% tariff on all countries except for China.
		China is the biggest exporter, so Trump did not back down.
		The 90-day pause is to give time to negotiate and show that he is serious.
		He is playing chess, and the media and the rest of the world are playing checkers.
		Here's Casey in Hot Springs National Park, Arkansas, Republican.
unidentified		Hey, thanks for taking my call.
		So on the issue of 90-day tariff pausing, you know, Trump didn't change his mind.
		It's not about that.
		It's a long-term game.
		You know.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here is Marcus in Kalispell, Montana, Republican.
unidentified		Hey, thank you for taking my call.
		And in regards to, well, first, Trump moved at a faster pace than most presidents that we've seen, it seems like.
		And when he's moving this fast, decisions are going to be made quicker.
		And so in regards to Stephen Horsford of Nevada talking about how the U.S. trade representative doesn't even know what Trump's doing, I believe he definitely does know.
		And I like to think of all the countries as just a group of friends.
		And when you're the successful one and all your friends are mooching off you, I think it's okay to ask if you can mooch off them.
		And once Trump did that, A lot of them wanted to talk about, hey, we'll stop mooching.
		And everyone's done that except China, obviously.
		But now China apparently does want to negotiate.
		And I think it's funny how the panic was going on for weeks about his tariffs.
		And Trump didn't pause the tariffs.
		But as soon as he got a group of people that want to negotiate with him, he stops the tariffs or he pauses the tariffs.
		So you can't play in the stock market.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You don't think that it was the market that drove that decision?
unidentified		No, because everyone was saying, I mean, he predicted that it was going to be going down.
unidentified		But it went back up once, like I said, his plan started coming to fruition where people wanted to negotiate and start talking about free trade.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		But Marcus, the market went back up not when people said that they wanted to negotiate.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		It's when he paused the tariffs, the reciprocal tariffs.
unidentified		Well, why did he pause the tariffs?
		I don't think it was because of the panic that was happening for weeks.
		He paused the tariffs as soon, like I said, as he got a group of people that wanted to negotiate with him about these tariffs, a group of nations that wanted to talk about these tariffs.
		And once he said, or once he got that, he's like, all right, I'll pause the tariffs until we get something figured out.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Here is the Wall Street Journal.
		Here are the index performances since April 2nd, which is when the reciprocal tariffs were announced.
		So this, and this is today.
		So here we have the market, again, this is NASDAQ, S ⁇ P 500, and the Dow tracking pretty closely together.
		This is April 3rd, and this is April 9th.
		So that's where we are on the market.
		Here is Brenda, St. Louis, Missouri, Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I think Donald Trump changed his mind because the market was down.
		And when it gets into the bonds and different things like that, touching that, it's just that why would we believe Donald Trump is making all these negotiations and all of that when he walked around, he lied for four and a half years that he won an election that he knew he didn't.
		So all of a sudden, we're supposed to gravitate around this man that doesn't even know how to tell the truth about anything.
		And as far as him not taking money for working for the United States, he didn't have to take a payroll check.
		He was bleeding you from everything else.
		Thank you and have a good day.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And this is USA Today on their front page.
		It says, after a tumultuous week in global business and politics, President Trump made a sudden reversal, announcing Wednesday that he would pause his reciprocal tariffs immediately for 90 days.
		The 10% across the board levy would remain.
		He was raising the already sky-high tax on Chinese goods to 125%.
		Quote, based on the lack of respect that China has shown to the world's markets, U.S. stocks immediately shot up in response.
		China and the European Union had already unveiled stiff retaliatory levies Wednesday.
		The Asian trade giant vowed to impose its own 84% tariff on U.S. goods starting Thursday, up from the 34% previously announced.
		And here's the Ministry of Commerce from China saying, quote, if the U.S. insists on further escalating its economic and trade restrictions, China has the firm will and abundant means to take necessary countermeasures and fight to the end.
unidentified		That's from Wednesday.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here is Jerry, Richmond, Indiana, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Jerry.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I totally do not think Trump paused the tariffs just because of the stock market.
		You know, it was only down for, what, a week or not maybe not even that long.
		I think it's because all these countries stepped up and wanted to negotiate with him.
		So, you know, he dropped them down or paused them because, you know, people are willing to talk and negotiate.
		He more or less isolated China because of the way they're acting.
		And, you know, I can't believe people on the Democrat line can call in and say, you know, who's running the country?
		Or like the senator or congressman say, well, who's running this country?
		You know, that's what we all wondered the four years during Biden's administration.
		You know, and according to the new book that came out about the Biden administration, evidently no one knew who was running the country.
		And, you know, and yes, so a Democrat saying he needs a, you know, whatever mental evaluation or whatever Trump does.
		I can't believe that they would ask that about him after praising Biden for four years.
		So that's.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here's Larry, Caldwell, New Jersey, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Larry.
unidentified		Yeah, good morning, Mimi.
		I would hope that the Republicans at some point in the next four years can stop blaming Biden for everything that Trump is actually fomenting.
		And I believe that his efforts to disrupt the economy and disrupt Wall Street are a prelude to what basically happened to the Second World War.
		There was a lot of pressure put on small countries that had no choice.
		And I think that's where he headed.
		And if he could stop spending so much money on golf, maybe Wall Street would do better.
		Thanks, Mimi.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And let's take a look at what White House Trade Advisor Peter Navarro said on the pause and what he thinks it will ultimately do for the markets.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		He was on Fox Business.
peter navarro ▲ ● ▼		This is one of the greatest days in American economic history we have had.
peter navarro ▲ ● ▼		I think we're going to call it the art of the reciprocal trade deal.
unidentified		And I'll tell you, all the nervous Nellies on Wall Street who try to undermine us consistently underestimate the power of the president to negotiate.
		What have we got here?
		We are at a place now where we have a broad-based 10% global tariff on.
		Well, we negotiate over the next 90 days with all of these countries who have come to us.
		And the mission, Charles, in these negotiations is to dramatically reduce our trade deficit, level the plane for it, get rid of all the tariff differentials, get rid of all the non-tariff barriers.
		Dow, 50,000.
		Charles, I've said this before.
		It's going to hit that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And we are taking your calls and also your Facebook and your ex-posts.
		Here are some posts from lawmakers.
		Here's Senator James Langford, Republican, who says President Trump is the dealmaker-in-chief.
		It's past time to get global trade barriers down and lower tariffs against American goods.
		Countries all over the world are coming to the table.
		It's time for China to do the same.
		Randy Weber of Texas says, after years of watching other countries take advantage of America, they're finally coming to the negotiating table because they know the game has changed.
		President Trump puts America first every single time.
		You can trust that he's fighting for the American people.
		Here's Congressman Greg Landsman who says, pure chaos, horrible results, trillions of wealth lost, jobs gone, prices skyrocketing.
		And Congressional Republicans are about to officially endorse this chaos with language preventing any attempt by Congress to revoke the emergency powers Trump has used to impose these tariffs.
		Representative Claudia Tenney says President Trump's Liberation Day was a masterclass in negotiation.
		The world finally recognized that they have been taking advantage of American businesses and they must level the playing field for American businesses.
		China chose to retaliate and they will pay the price.
		And this is Senator Tina Smith.
		Businesses don't want to deal with a country that turns tariffs on and off like a light switch.
		Here is Yvonne in Pompano Beach, Florida, Republican.
unidentified		Good morning.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		I have three points that I'd like to make.
		And, well, this is even one of them, but I can't believe the guy said spending money on golfing.
		Does he not realize many golf courses Trump owns?
		He doesn't have to spend a dime.
		And the other woman who suggested Trump be evaluated, I think that takes a lot of nerve considering what we just had in office.
		But they say that the Democrats' approval rating is at 27%, the lowest in history.
		And I think the 27% are the ones who call on this line for the Democrat.
		To my point, Trump sat for four years waiting and thinking about everything he was going to do before he got into office.
		I do not.
		Hello?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yes, keep going, Yvonne.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We can hear you.
unidentified		I'm sorry.
		I do not think that one thing that he is doing he has not thought of carefully and meticulously.
		People want to say he folded.
		I don't hardly believe that's true.
		I think Trump knew exactly what was going to happen.
		And for these next 90 days, do you people honestly think he's just going to be sitting on his hands?
		Or do you think he's going to be negotiating some of those 75 countries that have actually folded and want to make deals?
		I honestly don't understand the mind of the Democrats.
		So I'm going to tell you what Trump does.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yvonne, I want to ask you about this.
		So listen to what, this is the Wall Street Journal saying this.
		It says, wrote an article saying President watched TV heard dire warnings, then gave in.
unidentified		So this contradicts what you were just saying.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		It says that President Trump finally blinked.
		It took a week for the plunge in the stock and bond markets, along with a sustained campaign by executives, lawmakers, lobbyists, and foreign leaders to prompt Trump to roll back the 90 days.
		It says his instincts had changed course as he watched the bond market tank and listened to business leaders, including JPMorgan Chase CEO Jamie Dimon, express fears of a recession.
		It says the episode was quintessential.
unidentified		Trump.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		He took a drastic action, kept a close eye on the reaction, kept advisors and allies guessing, and then changed course.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What do you think of that, Yvonne?
unidentified		I think that that's a bunch of fogwash, and nobody's heard that come out of Trump's mouth.
		And secondly, I don't think Trump cares about the stock market one way or another.
		I really don't.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		But what about the fears of a recession?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I mean, surely he cares about the American economy.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sure he does.
		And I think that what he's doing is a part of that plan.
		He was not going to allow it to get butted so far.
		He wanted to get the attention of the people.
		As I have heard, his friends and people close to him that actually know him have flat out said that they know that this was part of what he had planned to do.
		That's one of my first points.
		And the second point is that, oh my God, I had it on the tip of my tongue.
		I lost my time.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That's okay.
		You can call in 90 days, Yvonne.
		Steve in New York, Democrat.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Well, I can't believe what I'm hearing.
		Donald Trump basically said he folded.
		Japan was selling the Treasury bills while he was negotiating with them.
		And we need China and Japan to buy our T bills.
		This formula, this tariff formula, was based on false information.
		They just had the author on TV for the past couple of days saying that they just botched the whole thing up and used the wrong numbers, wrong data.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Who are you talking about, Steve?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Who was just on TV?
unidentified		The author of the formula that they used to create the tariffs.
		His name is Barry Nieman, I believe it is.
		It's been on it.
		You can find it on the internet.
		I just want to go back.
		I mean, Joe Biden handed Donald Trump a very good economy.
		We had 3% GDP.
		We were doing better than anybody in the world.
		He didn't have to do all this stuff.
		He could have just made a few tweaks, let Biden's policies, the Chips and Science Act come into place.
		We're still doing the fixing up the bill to put in broadband throughout the country, fix the roads, bridges, stuff like that.
		It's only in its fifth year or fourth year.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		The infrastructure bill.
unidentified		Yeah, right.
		Right.
		And, you know, there aren't 70 countries looking to bow down to us.
		I mean, we're going to run an imbalance with a country like Sri Lanka.
		They make sneakers for us.
		You know, they can't afford to buy, you know, big, expensive billion-dollar computer systems, gas turbines, all this stuff.
		I mean, it's this victim mentality that he has and all these MAGA conspiracy nuts.
		You know, that everybody's taking advantage of us in all this.
		We took advantage of everybody for a century.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Are you in favor, though, Steve, of the hard line that President Trump is taking on China?
unidentified		It's a bit harsh.
		I mean, you don't want to kill China.
		You want to trade with them.
		You don't want to put people out of business.
		You know, they do some stuff, but you want to do that with the EU, with Japan, other places, you know, and just have some sort of a plan to do this stuff, not 140, you know, whatever it was initially.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		125%.
unidentified		Yeah, now we're up to that.
		I mean, you know, Howard Lutnick, I forget what he does there, but he was talking about Americans putting in screws on computers.
		This is the new economy here.
		I mean, you know, it's it's we don't want these things.
		I mean, we've the reason that there's a trade imbalance is because we're rich.
		We buy stuff.
		We're richer than anybody else, and we can buy more stuff.
		There's always going to be an imbalance.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		You know, we yeah, Howard Luttnick, he's the Treasury Secretary, sorry, the commerce secretary.
unidentified		Right.
		And he was on TV talking about there are going to be thousands of people putting in screws in the back of computers.
		That's the new manufacturing we're going to have.
		We don't want certain jobs.
		You know, we're a service-based economy, financial services, consulting services, banking services, software.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		But what about the people that can't do those kinds of jobs?
		What about them?
		I mean, they've lost out on this, in this new globalized economy.
unidentified		They have, and maybe they should be more open to being retrained, and we should do a better job of reaching out and, you know, with vocational schools and retraining and stuff.
unidentified		I mean, this happens every, you know, with every decade, with every, you know, things advance, and you need new skills.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		We've got that point.
		Chris in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, Independent Line.
		You're next.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		So I'm struggling with this whole tariff issue, mostly because, you know, you don't hear what they're going to do with all this extra money.
		Are they going to put it back into Social Security?
		Are they going to build a new system for what they say is sinking?
		Are they going to put it in the infrastructure?
		There's no talk of any of this.
		And I just want to remind all these people that think that he walks on water.
		This is a man that posted on Truth Social that COVID was under control.
		It wasn't a big deal.
		Meanwhile, millions and thousands of people were dying.
		It was so bad that he was handing out money.
		So, you know, now you want us to believe that this tariff game that you're playing, this war with China that you're creating for no reason, we should stand behind you.
		I question that, just like I question if I should drink bleach to get rid of COVID.
		I mean, this is the same man.
		Wait, let me just finish with one other thing.
		What I believe happened is he didn't have the cards, as he likes to say.
		He didn't have the cards.
		So he had to back down and do what Musk wanted.
		Because I watched the stock, Musk stock, go all the way down.
		I mean, it was hysterical.
		You know, this is a typical dog and pony show.
		And like the other caller said, millions of us are going to college.
		I have kids that are going to college.
		For what?
		To put a screw in a factory?
		I don't think so.
		I mean, this is the issues.
		They're so out of touch.
		The Republicans are all they care about is transgenders playing sports and the price of eggs.
		And the truth of the matter is, you all been sold on a bunch of bull crap.
		Because look at the numbers.
		Ask them, what's he going to do with all this extra money?
		Give it to Musk to go to Mars?
		It's very frustrating because, you know, you're trying to raise children in this society and make sure that education is important.
		And they think that everybody should be working in a factory.
		And why is that?
		They're 78 years old.
		They're lucky if they make it another 15 years.
		Okay?
		So, like, we need younger people.
		We need, you know, we need people that are in the 40 to 50 range, 40 to 60.
		This 78-year-old diner mentality that they think they know everything.
		I mean, it's just, it's just, it's not benefiting the country.
		It's tearing people apart.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And here's Butch, Sandwich, Illinois, Republican line.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you.
		Yeah, I think the tariffs are a way of bringing in money.
		You know, I heard that they're like bringing in $2 billion a day or something like this.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That's what the president claimed, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, and I agree with what the other guys said, you know, about whatever money we're saving, we should put, you know, in social programs or whatever.
		But I'm a Vietnam veteran, and here's I love my country, but here's what really bothers me is that we're having this deal with China.
		And you can correct me if I'm wrong, but don't we owe China like over a trillion dollars?
		Aren't we paying a trillion dollars a month on an interest on the national debt?
		Yeah, well, our national debt, yes.
		But, you know, why are we borrowing money from other countries?
		You know, we've got to get away from that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So are you talking about the national debt or are you talking about the trade deficit?
unidentified		I'm not sure what category that would be in.
		So like when you borrow money from another country, I don't know what category that would be put into.
		Okay.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Dale in Riverdale, Maryland, Democrat, good morning.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
		Good.
		Okay.
		Very interesting conversation today.
		I didn't get in till 7.15, so I might have missed something.
		But Steve really stole my thunder.
		He was talking about T-bills.
		The scuttle on the reason Mr. Trump turned around the tariffs is he had a late night meeting or early morning with some power people, and they told him the bond market is going the wrong direction.
		Now, I'm not a Wall Street guy, and I can't really discuss bonds in detail.
		But apparently, when the market goes down, the bonds become very attractive to investors, and they sell like hotcakes.
		But that wasn't happening.
		They were having a massive sell-off of these T-bills or bonds, as you call them.
		And that scared Trump, realizing that that would put us in a recession almost in a day.
		So that's why he backed off on it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		So, Dale, this is what Fortune says about that.
		It says Trump didn't care that the stock market was crashing.
		Bond yields were the, quote, pain point that finally got him to pause tariffs.
unidentified		That's why I called in.
		But while I got you on the line, I'd also like to clarify what I feel is the whole point of the tariffs in the first place.
		It's an offset to get his tax bill passed.
		And people seem to kind of ignore that.
		Now, I also have to say, I have one other really hot thing I would like to sort of tell you about if you don't know about it.
		Maybe a month ago, I accidentally found something on my television, a documentary, that completely changed.
		I'm an old guy.
		I mean, I'm pretty old.
		And it completely changed my perspective of this country and our whole system.
		The documentary is called The Invisible Doctrine.
		And it goes back to early 1450 in the world's history, talking about capitalism and brings you up to the present.
		And it sort of pulls the curtain back on what is happening to us and our society and this war that's going on between the billionaires.
		And Trump is the latest rendition.
		He's just a representative, really.
		He's not his own man.
		He is a puppet for billionaires.
		I mean, obviously, he's backed by billionaires.
		And unfortunately, I mean, it sounds conspiratorial, but he's essentially trying to crush our government in order to feed the billionaires.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So, Dale, where did you see this documentary?
		You said it's called The Invisible Doctrine.
		Was it on Netflix or on the cable?
unidentified		It's called Canopy.
		My library offers to Canopy and Hoopola as a free deal as being a member of the library.
		And you can get like 10 free movies a month.
		And it's something I've been doing for a while.
		And I was just doing a search on Canopy.
		I typed in Invisible because I kind of like science fiction stuff.
		And this thing popped up.
		It said the Invisible Doctrine on the documentary.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Thanks for sharing that with us.
		Here's Ray in Lawrenceville, Georgia, Independent.
		Hi, Ray.
unidentified		Hello.
		Good morning.
		Thank you for your show.
		I love C-SPAN.
		I'm amazed.
		Some of the callers just took my thunder.
		There are no factories returning.
		He's saying he's firing up factories.
		It's not happening.
		And people who live in that Fox News bubble, they're clueless.
		Tell them to give you the address.
		There's not one factory that's returning.
		Nobody in this country wants those jobs.
		When they talked about Trump spending money on golf, who cares if he owns the course?
		He charges the Secret Service for everything.
		It costs us millions of dollars.
		Every weekend, he goes down to play golf.
		And he was playing golf instead of receiving soldiers.
		And if Biden had done that, Fox News would have lost their mind.
		Get out of the Fox News bubble.
		You believe everything the man says.
		Biden, Biden, Biden, they want to talk about Biden.
		He's gone.
		He did what he could.
		He's an old man.
		He's gone.
		I'm an old man.
		I can't afford to lose my retirement.
		I'm down 15% because this clown doesn't know what he's doing.
		And when the bond market tanked, he had to get out because I wanted to switch to bonds.
		And when people stop buying bonds, there's no place to run.
		There's no safe haven.
		Get out of the news bubble.
		There's not 75 countries.
		There's no factories coming back.
		Nobody wants those jobs.
		Biden is gone.
		This is Trump.
		He doesn't have a clue.
		And anyone who views only Fox News, you don't have a clue.
		You don't want to admit you made a mistake.
		Thank you, C-SPAN.
		Have a good day.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And regarding the bonds, here's the article from Fortune about that.
		It says that President Trump didn't seem especially bothered by the epic fall in stock prices following his unveiling of extremely high and far, far loftier than anticipated tariffs in early April.
		Instead, his main focus is and has long been a different measure.
		He is obsessed with rates on 10-year treasury bonds.
		To him, this is the measure that matters because so many things are tied to that benchmark.
		It's a big factor in setting car loans, mortgage rates, credit card rates, and also determines the base rate that companies pay on their crucial long-term borrowings.
		And a founder of a chairman of Research Affiliates, a firm that overseas investment strategies puts it bluntly: quote, Trump cares more about the 10-year Treasury than about the stock market, he says.
		You can read that in Fortune if you'd like to see the rest of that article.
		Here's Dan Middletown, New York, Republican.
unidentified		Hi, how are you?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What do you think, Dan?
unidentified		You know, the way I look at this, look, I'm not pro-Trump, anti-Trump.
		I don't really care about the person.
		I care about the country.
		And everyone that's called in recently that said that, oh, those manufacturing jobs are never coming back here because people don't want to do that type of work.
		And particularly the gentleman who said that we're sending our kids to college for four years.
		They're not doing that so they can put cell phones together.
		Yeah, well, we have a major debt problem in this country, huge debt problem in this country.
		We also have our priorities out of whack where we're sending kids to school for degrees that are valueless, completely valueless.
		It's the largest transfer of wealth that nobody talks about.
		I can't say nobody talks about it, but it's just not emphasized enough.
		I think what needs to happen is action, some type of action.
		There was no action from the Biden administration as the country falls deeper and deeper into its intoxication with foreign debt, as the country falls deeper and deeper with its inability to produce or manufacture anything to maintain our ability to be self-sustaining, as the country becomes more and more intoxicated with foreign debt and now can't build anything, that is a huge, huge threat to our national security.
		These jobs have to come back to American allies or come back to the North American hemisphere, this part of the world, because I do not believe that China is going to stay out of Taiwan in the next two years.
		I think they're going to take them.
		We've got to bring those jobs back.
		Those jobs are coming back.
		For someone who says that people aren't looking for those types of jobs, I cannot tell you how many people I know who have college degrees.
		They're in debt up to their eyeballs.
		They're delivering packages or they're.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Let me ask you this, if you don't mind when you say bringing it back to North America.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Are you in favor of tariffs against Mexico and Canada?
unidentified		Well, I definitely think Mexico needs to be a better ally of the United States.
		The fact that they allowed the border to be open as it was is 50% on our fault and 50% on theirs.
		And so I definitely think that when Trump announced the initial set of tariffs against Mexico, it was guided towards trying to get them to address their border crisis.
		There does have to be a correction with Mexico to set some stronger standards on immigration, stronger standards on border control to keep drugs out, and potentially to set up more of a partnership, a them versus us scenario when it comes to the Americas versus China and Russia to a degree.
		As far as Canada goes, I don't really understand all of the rhetoric on Canada, but I think it has to do with kind of a geopolitical battle with Canada that Trump has always had and how it could affect national security issues and things like that.
		So I think he's trying to drive them to the table.
		They have vast resources, and he can't just go after one without going after the other.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Got it.
		And this is House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, who was speaking out against the budget bill on the House floor.
		He accused the Republicans of not caring about the financial state of average Americans.
unidentified		President Trump promised costs would go down on day one.
		Costs aren't going down.
		They're going up.
		Inflation is going up.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		Consumer confidence is coming down.
unidentified		And these reckless policies, including the Trump tariffs, are driving us toward a recession.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		And on top of it all, you are presenting a budget that's going to make things worse.
unidentified		So we stand here today in strong opposition to this reckless Republican budget.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		It's a cruel budget.
unidentified		It's a budget that will have catastrophic consequences on everyday Americans.
hakeem jeffries ▲ ● ▼		It's an assault on the economy.
		It's an assault on Medicaid, an assault on health care, an assault on nutritional assistance to children and families.
		It's an assault on older Americans, an assault on hospitals and nursing homes and community health centers.
		It's an assault on veterans, which is why we reject it because we're going to stand on the side of the American people.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And regarding that budget bill, Rocky sent us this on Facebook.
		Some Republicans grew a spine and weren't voting in favor of it.
		So Mike, the speaker, canceled it to try and save face.
		Meanwhile, Trump gave a speech to them basically mocking them for not doing whatever he wanted.
		This administration is a mess and an embarrassment.
		And here is James, New Kent, Virginia, Democrat.
		Good morning, James.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm calling because I just want to say that I feel that that 90-day tariff, it's a distraction.
		I feel that the American people are getting shifted around again.
		Donald Trump ran on lowering prices for groceries, gasoline, and he's done nothing.
		He's done nothing at all but putting us in a circle.
		We don't want to know which way to go.
		Every day we get up.
		The American people are stressing.
		I see all these independent people, Republicans calling in saying how great this man is.
		Great how?
		We are suffering right now in the United States of America right now with all the jobs being lost and everything.
		And he goes down that golfing every weekend.
		All the states right now out in the West is getting hit by hurricanes.
		He didn't go out there with a photo op this time.
		And I feel that American people are suffering because behind this man, you don't know what day he's going to get up and say something dumb and stupid and try to sell us tennis shoes, Bibles.
		He's trying to sell us $25 million credit card.
		This man is off the chain, and American people should realize that this man needs help.
		I feel as a United States Army veteran, this man is not a good president of the United States.
		And everybody wants to holler about Joe Biden, Joe Biden this, Joe Biden that.
		Joe Biden did all he could do at the time he was in office.
		And I feel that he done more for this country than just about Ronald Reagan did.
		Ronald Reagan was sick his last two years in office, but everybody, all the Republicans, forget about that.
		They said Nancy Reagan was running the White House.
		We need to get back on track here and let the House and the Senate help run the country.
		It's a three-party executive branch in there.
		All three of us.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Got it, James.
		Here's Jordan, Englewood, California, Independent Line.
		Go ahead, Jordan.
		Jordan, are you there?
unidentified		Good morning.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		Yeah, can you hear me?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yep, go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Can you hear me?
		Okay.
		Yeah, as far as the terrorists are concerned, Since the tariffs have started, trillions of dollars have left from the savings of people, and they're being used to go right into the pockets of the ultra-wealthy.
		That's why he was put here in the first place.
		There will not be, if we keep on this path we're on, there will not be a middle class.
		There will be the ultra-wealthy and there will be the poor.
		That's what MAGA means to me.
		That's what his goal is.
		He was put here to destroy this country.
		And I'm just being honest with you.
		He was put here to destroy this country.
		And if people continue to listen to Fox News, if people continue to listen to Fox News, this country is going to crumble.
		And the reason that he phoned it was because the CEO of Chase Bank got in his ear.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		J.P. Morgan.
unidentified		Jamie Dimon?
		The bond.
		Yes, and he changed course.
		He changed course when he heard that because he had to.
		But yeah, his goal here is to knock out the middle class.
		And it looks like he's really on that path.
		And I beg people to please stop listening to Fox News.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, we got that part, Jordan.
		And that's the time we've got for this segment.
		But later this morning, we'll be joined by two members of Congress.
		Up next, we'll talk with Representative Paul Tonko, a Democrat of New York, a member of the Budget and Energy and Commerce Committees, about tariffs and Democrats' strategies to counter the Trump administration agenda.
		And later, Representative Rich McCormick, a Republican of Georgia, member of the Armed Services Committee, discusses the budget and Republican efforts to advance the Trump administration agenda.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		Next, we watch a prime time encore presentation of our 10-part series, First 100 Days.
		We explore the early months of U.S. presidencies from George Washington in 1789 to Donald Trump in 2017.
		We'll learn about the decisions made and how they shaped the White House, the nation, and history.
		I am prepared, under my constitutional duty, to recommend the measures that a stricken nation in the midst of a stricken world may require.
		All I have, I would have given gladly not to be standing here today.
		My fellow Americans, our long national nightmare is over.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		This American carnage stops right here and stops right now.
unidentified		Each program includes historians, authors, and archival footage from the C-SPAN Video Library, providing rich context and analysis of presidential leadership during the critical opening stretch of new administrations.
		Watch First 100 Days, starting Monday, April 14th at 8 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN 2 or online at C-SPAN.org.
		Book TV.
		Every Sunday on C-SPAN 2 features leading authors discussing their latest nonfiction books.
		Here's a look at what's coming up this weekend.
		At 7 p.m. Eastern, journalist Michael Wolf provides his behind-the-scenes look at President Trump's 2024 reelection with his book, All or Nothing, How Trump Recaptured America.
		And then at 8 p.m. Eastern, Bard College History Professor Sean McMeekin talks about his book, To Overthrow the World, The Rise and Fall and Rise of Communism, which was selected as the Intercollegiate Studies Institute's 2025 Conservative Book of the Year.
		And at 9 p.m. Eastern, the New York Times' Annie Carney and Luke Broadwater, authors of Madhouse, chronicle the key events of the 118th Congress and the 2024 presidential election.
		Then at 10 p.m. Eastern on Afterwards, Oklahoma Republican Senator James Langford speaks about his faith, the challenges the country faces, and what he believes needs to happen to improve the country in his book, Turnaround: America's Revival.
		He's interviewed by Wall Street Journal congressional reporter Siobhan Hughes.
		Watch Book TV every Sunday on C-SPAN 2 and find a full schedule in your program guide or watch online anytime at booktv.org.
		Washington Journal continues.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back to Washington Journal.
		We're joined now by Representative Paul Tonko, Democrat of New York.
		He's a member of the Budget Committee and the Energy and Commerce Committee.
		Representative Tonko, welcome to the program.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, Amy.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Great to join you and your viewers.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Well, so let's start with that budget bill vote that did not happen yesterday evening.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I take it you would have voted no if it had happened.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		I think it's a reckless plan.
		It's one that really takes us down the road of hurt and harm for many of the people out there, the great many that I represent.
		And so, you know, this effort to provide for a huge tax cut for the very few, in this case, billionaires, and to get a bonanza tax cut at the expense of programs and financial impact on the great many of us is unacceptable and I think a disastrous outcome for our economy.
		I certainly think that this administration inherited a very sound budget, a best budget comeback of any industrialized nation post-COVID.
		And giving it a chance to work through would have made us a very secure economic status for this country.
		But instead, he's chosen to do all sorts of harmful measures that will really provide an inconsistent and unpredictable economy out there for many.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Nonetheless, the country is in debt to the tune of $36 trillion.
		So how would you address that, given, I mean, that the holdouts on the Republican side are saying that it doesn't cut enough.
		So it's not going in the direction that you would like to see.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think that basically the best way to cut the deficit is to put people to work.
		And I think that the successes of the 117th session of Congress under the tutelage of the Biden administration provided for sound investments in manufacturing, in an innovation economy, a clean energy economy.
		We saw it working.
		We saw hundreds of thousands of people employed to implement these programs and providing for sound union jobs that paid well and that offered opportunity for regional and state economies to start to really grow back.
		And I think that that formula was very scientifically based, very evidence-based, and provided a strategy that doesn't seem to accompany anything being done here.
		There's no plan, there's no strategy, there's no concept of where you're taking us.
		That blueprint isn't there.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So what is the Democratic strategy then?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Is it just simply to vote no on everything, or is there something that you're planning to do?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, there are things that we can work on if they would allow for Congress to have input.
		The Republicans don't even have input with this administration.
		They may take them to the White House and review the plans, but it seems like it's thumbs down on the congressional representatives that do interact with him.
		It's my way or the highway.
		And it's not the way the founding fathers and founding parents of this organization, of this institution, the United States government, it's not what they envisioned.
		They envisioned three distinctive branches of government with identified powers given to each.
		The power of the purse given to the Congress, to the House of Representatives, confirmed by the United States Senate.
		That doesn't take any kind of impact here.
		There's no reach to that sort of formula that was recommended by our framers.
		And so we can work in a bipartisan way on strategies, but let's have that dialogue.
		And it's, you know, it's one-way thinking with the White House imposed onto the majority Republican Party in the House of Representatives.
		They take it to the floor and then wonder why they don't have the votes.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Regarding the tariffs that President Trump announced last week and then paused yesterday as far as the reciprocal tariffs being paused on all the countries except for China, what was your reaction to that news and what do you think is the best way to go forward on tariffs?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, it was a Wild West approach.
		I thought it was very dangerous and offered a great bit of uncertainty in the market and it proved to be the case.
		I think what we really need to do if you're going to use tariffs as a tool to make certain that there are accompanying efforts for investing in manufacturing, investing in energy costs, investing in supply chains, making certain that that strategy to accompany these programmatic investments along with the tariff adjustment.
		But then again, his bilateral tariff approach, where you're dealing nation by nation, is certainly not in keeping with sound strategies for application of tariffs.
		So I'm hoping they abandon that effort of a unilateral approach and go forward with a more sensible plan.
		But no denying here that it rocked the economy worldwide and it's devalued stocks tremendously.
		I heard from so many constituents that were concerned about their retirement accounts, their retirement situations, that they had planned so well and then they were put at risk and we're still in a devalued situation of where we were just weeks ago.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So then what would be a democratic plan to bring back manufacturing jobs to the United States?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, go ahead.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		No, I think it's investing, it's retrofitting in technology.
		It's making certain that you hone the skills that are required in an innovation economy, you know, very specific skills that need to be accompanied not only through the matriculation at our universities and colleges, but through apprenticeships and mentorships that allow us to do those specific skill sets.
		I have many semiconductor investments going on in the 20th Congressional District in New York.
		We make certain that there are the corresponding workforce development programs along with incentives, tax incentives that enable them to retrofit the systems, to make certain that you invest in the technology.
		The semiconductor business is an expensive one, and we need to be competitive with nations out there that are likewise investing in semiconductors.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		If you'd like to join our conversation with Representative Paul Tonko of New York, a Democrat, you can do so.
		Our lines are Republicans, 2027-8001.
		Democrats, 202-748-8000, and Independents, 202-748-8002.
		You can start calling in now.
		Representative Tonko, would you be in favor of more targeted tariffs?
		Would you support that?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think targeted tariffs that have to be accompanied again by these other investments.
		But certainly this effort to go worldwide and do this 10% across the board and now this 125% with China is just like without a plan.
		And I think that the economy showed that.
		There was such uncertainty and such retaliatory efforts made by other nations that it really put our situation here in the U.S. at high risk.
		So targeted in a way that, again, is science-based and academic in its nature.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And there was a bipartisan bill put out that would require Congress to approve tariffs put by, imposed by the president.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Would you support that bill?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		Again, I think it was the envisioning that was offered by in our very humble beginnings that Congress has a say there, a strong say, that the directive should come from Congress, specifically the House, making certain that the power of the purse and tariff application are initiated by Congress and then implemented by the President.
		This concentrating all the powers, three branches of government, in the force of one being in this name, in this case, the name of Donald Trump, is a dangerous thing.
		It's an assumption of power and investing in one person.
		That is exactly what was worked against.
		It was part of the thinking, I believe, in the beginnings of the structure of this government.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, we'll talk to callers now.
		We'll start with Stephen in Wyndham, Connecticut, Independent.
		Hi, Stephen.
unidentified		Yeah, what a ride the last few eight days, I guess.
		Good morning.
		Good morning.
		My 401k has been cut down.
		My regular investment portfolio really slashed.
		What a ride.
		But you know what?
		I'm in it for the long haul, and I believe in the American economy.
		But a lot of this tariff stuff, I'll be quite frank with you, it's a little bit beyond what I normally study or my interest in.
		But I think everybody agrees that China is kind of a problem.
		And they're going to use nations to get around this and cutouts.
		And they have a like, it's like I saw an interview with Peter Navarro, whether you hate him or like him.
		He did have a good point about non-tariffs.
		So I think a lot of this is, oh yeah, and the salt tax that they pulled from New England and the Northeast, that was a real tax.
		They really raised my taxes last time.
		I'd like to see that solved.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Stephen, let's get a response.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Representative.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Sure, the salt issue is under negotiations.
		As we work as a Democratic caucus, there's a real effort to make certain that there's fairness there, that they bring it back to an appropriate level.
		And those negotiations continue.
		I don't know where the White House is on that right now because they don't always state their case very clearly.
		In regard to the 401k that you talked about, it's what I heard about so overwhelmingly in the last several days of this tariff war that was going on.
		And again, I think that the uncertainty that continues to exist here because of the record of this president in his short months in office here in the second term speak to a pause perhaps for the moment.
		But then the general public and I think the market is concerned that we could see applications coming back in the near future just in a whimsical way.
		And that Wild West environment that he's created with our economy has to be given a lot more certainty, predictability, and academic efforts made here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And Congressman, how would you address the unfair trade practices that China imposes?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think, again, negotiating through that and making certain that the tariff can be used as a tool, but in a way that is smart and not just, you know, just offering an across-the-board tariff on all these nations or on China in a way that isn't done with the appropriate level of negotiations.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Jim in Winter Park, Florida, Republican line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Jim.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Mr. Tanko, I'm sitting here and I'm just appalled.
		I think everybody that works in Washington, in the House, and in the Senate should be ashamed of themselves, Republican, Democrat, and Independents.
		You opened this conversation with two things that were completely opposite of one another that I want to attack.
		You talked about getting good jobs back in the United States with union work and union employees, and then you talked about making chips and being competitive with the world market.
		They cannot be aligned.
		When you have a union shop, the union shop is a middleman between the business and the employee that makes money.
		And they drive the price of everything through the roof.
		That is what got us into this trouble in this country for the past 50 years.
		And you people just keep playing the game, talking your sides.
		And when we're building chips and we're paying people $30 and $40 an hour to be in a factory building these chips, and then you turn around and say we're going to be competitive with countries that can do them for $4 or $5 an hour, it's not going to work.
		We'll never get from behind this gun.
		So the only way to fix this problem is to drive the price of everything that comes into this country up to where we can pay union rates.
		And the people are going to have to suffer for it.
		And you clowns in Washington, D.C., don't.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Jim.
		Let's go ahead and get a response.
		Go ahead, Congressman.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you, Jim, for your question.
		I disagree.
		I think that efficiency is a very critical component here.
		We had a hearing this week.
		We heard from Micron.
		They are priding themselves on creating the most efficient produced chip, a high-memory chip, which is their hallmark.
		And it's being done with union labor.
		I think that union labor provides for good training and good benefits.
		We want these jobs to be sound and grow an innovation economy that is sound.
		We can do it because the product that we get, I think, can provide for great efficiency, as was indicated at this hearing by Micron.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Carlos, Albany, New York, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Carlos.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Carlos.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Oh, good morning.
unidentified		Oh, okay.
		I just wanted to say that I think that When Camilla Harris was there, that if Biden would have stepped down a year earlier and she would have stepped in, you know, I think we would have had a better shot of having her, maybe giving her a year to prove herself as a standing president.
		Maybe she would have got voted for.
		And then the other question I had was that, you know, I'm retired and I have extremely, I have a lot of, and cold pace are insane.
		I mean, you're gambling with you need something or you don't need it, and the cold pace, and that's terrible.
		And the third thing that I have is that since I still love to work and I can't, well, I got to was disabled, but I work anyway because I'm allowed to work.
		And I work, I'm only allowed to work 20 hours a week.
		I mean, I work, my season starts for six months.
		And, you know, I was working on the public work program.
		I was able to work 40 hours last year.
		I mean, people that are in Social Security, all these jobs are coming available.
		Why can't we work 30 or 40 hours for a short period of time, even though we're retired and we're collecting?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Well, a lot of questions in there, Carlos.
		I will start with the Harris campaign.
		I agree that more time for her would have been a benefit, but she did talk about plans that she had to lower costs, costs for groceries, costs for housing and utilities.
		She did identify that in a plan.
		And candidate Trump in that effort was talking about lowering costs on day one and making many pledges about the economy, all of which have been broken as promises.
		Costs have not gone down, they've gone up.
		You know, confidence of the consumers out there has gone down, not up.
		I think that the tariffs that they're looking at, albeit 10% at the moment, but all that war on tariffs will cause steel and timber prices to go up, making housing more unaffordable.
		So, you know, I think it's his walking away from a plan and she having a great plan, but did not have enough time to develop that, I think, with the American public.
		And, you know, again, I think had the integrity that she would live up to those promises if she had been elected.
		In regard to the co-payments, look, we have made a great effort with the Affordable Care Act, which is at risk right now with these cuts that they're asking to apply to health care through Medicaid cuts of $880 billion,
		provide for less affordability, less accessibility, again, in direct contrast to what was pledged by this Trump campaign that is now breaking promises with the American public.
		So I think that these efforts need to continue for us to battle against the draconian cuts that are part of this budget offer that's coming from the Trump White House.
		The Trump tariffs are a huge concern, even though they've had this pause.
		So we've got work ahead of us that is very important to the affordability of households to do their thing to achieve their American dream and make life affordable.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Congressman Tonko, there is a vote expected later today in the House on the SAVE Act, which is the Safeguard American Voter Eligibility Act.
		It requires proof of citizenship to register to vote in a federal election.
		Where do you stand on that and why?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		I oppose the SAVE Act.
		I think it's making it more difficult for people to vote.
		Look, the system, the last few elections have been under great scrutiny.
		They were some of the most clean as a whistle efforts for elections that we've had in the history of our nation.
		There is a lot of sentiment, I think, or underlying statements made with this bill that there are people voting illegally.
		It is currently illegal to vote if you're not a citizen.
		There have been those checks out there.
		This is just making it more difficult for people to vote.
		For instance, with women, if they've changed their name, as many people do, women do when they marry, they would have to produce additional information, passports, birth certificates, what have you, in order to be able to qualify to vote.
		I think this is going to be adding more burden to vote.
		We need to encourage voting across the country to strengthen our republic and to advance the efforts of democracy.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Phyllis, a Republican in Durango, Colorado.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Phyllis.
unidentified		Good morning, Phyllis.
		Good morning.
		Paul, I would like to know, you're sitting there giving all kinds of very good tactics to tackle the problem.
		And President Biden was in there for 47 years, and he knew what it was.
		So why didn't you all try to tackle it just like Trump is trying, only your way?
		But I never, Trump is in the public eye constantly.
		And I never saw the administration before this do anything about it.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I thank you for that question, Phyllis.
		I appreciate the Biden administration and what they did.
		They put a great focus on a tax cut for the great many of us in the working families category, the middle-income community and those looking to ascend the middle class.
		That was their focus.
		And as they did tax cuts, they did them with a pay-for.
		So there wasn't an added impact on the deficit.
		The trouble with the 2016 tax cut was that it was not paid for and that 83% of that package went to the top 1%.
		And so you're not helping well enough the great many of us in the categories that I just described.
		It was a bonanza outcome for billionaires.
		And unfortunately, they did not pay for that tax cut.
		So it required borrowing of some $2.4 trillion, which then was one of the most impactful growths of the deficit of this nation in our country's history.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Dennis in Delphos, Ohio, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Dennis.
unidentified		Hi, how are you doing?
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Dennis.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		How are you?
unidentified		All right.
		Here's my question.
		Basically, what we got here, we got corporate greed.
		Corporations in this country sold us out.
		They sold us workers out.
		They transferred our jobs to China.
		They gave China all our technology, our knowledge on how to do things.
		And of course, the Chinese, they've used it for their military.
		And look at Trump.
		All the stuff that he's peddling on TV.
		It's all made in China.
		He's not making any of that stuff in America.
		So basically, he's a total fraud.
		This guy is a liar.
		And if the American people really look at this guy, they're going to realize that everything he talks about is a lie.
		Everything he says, he whiplashed the stock market back and forth, back and forth.
		People's 401ks have been crashing.
		It's a shame that this man's sitting in the White House.
		That's all I got to say.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I agree.
		There's a lot of uncertainty that he's promoted.
		There's a lot of gimmickry and certainly not a person of his word.
		As we've seen here, without the efforts made to reduce costs, I think that it is important for us when we make these investments to provide as great a guarantee that they're implemented in a way that helps the American worker and keeps the investments here at home.
		We added language like that to the Chips and Science Act, which was an incredible investment in a growing sector of our economy that is worldwide.
		And I think the efforts to provide more guarantees that those investments be made in the American worker and American plants will prove very successful.
		But a lot of the undoing, you know, the Chips and Science Act was a tremendous effort that was done in the 117th session of Congress.
		And now you see great efforts to dismantle that.
		I'm very concerned because if we're not competitive, if we're not making certain these dollars invested are maintained here in the U.S., then we're going to fall behind in what is a critical race globally.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Doug in Las Vegas, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Doug.
unidentified		Hello.
		Good morning.
		Thank you for having me on.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Doug.
unidentified		Listen to the calls.
		I got one thing that I'm going to add, and then I'll do my thank yous.
		Everybody on both sides of the table has got to realize that politicians' jobs is mostly to lie to you and make you believe that they're helping you.
		Okay, anyways, forget that.
		My reason for calling, I want to thank both parties.
		I want to thank the Republican Party for the last election.
		The one thing I voted for was to close the borders.
		They did it.
		I want to also thank the Democratic Party for the last election before that, when Mr. Biden was elected.
		I love them because they both fulfilled their basic promise of the election.
		The Republicans, well, Trump, not the Republicans, but Trump, he wanted to close the borders.
		He's done it pretty quick.
		Joe, I loved when he won.
		I didn't vote for him, but I did listen to the election.
		And for the whole election, I heard they wanted $8 oil.
		I loved it.
		I made a lot of money on them.
		I'm sad that they won.
		But since they did, I figured, well, I'll make enough money to retire.
		And I did.
		So I do appreciate that last election when they gave us the $8 gas.
		Although they never got it to the $8 they promised.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Doug.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think that, you know, when you speak of the border situation, this country still needs sound immigration reform that has a guaranteed pathway to citizenship.
		And I think we need to make that a priority.
		In my opinion, I think that the opposing party has used this as an issue and they don't want to give it up.
		There have been opportunities to, like we saw in the last campaign, do sound immigration reform.
		It was rejected because candidate Trump stepped up and said, don't deal with the issue.
		We need it for political fodder in this campaign.
		That's disingenuous.
		So I think we need to go forward and invest in sound immigration reform.
		We're a nation of immigrants.
		We need people power for a lot of situations for the hospitality industry, the health care industry, the farm industry, agriculture.
		So, you know, I think we can come out with a win-win situation if we put our hearts and minds into the effort.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Talk to Michael in Jacksonville, Florida, line for Democrats.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Michael, you're next.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Michael, good morning.
unidentified		Hi, this is Michael Breen.
		I'm Jacksonville, Florida.
		I'm a transplant from New York.
		I had a hair salon, and all the company products that I had were made in America.
		And with his last administration, he put me out of business because the color tubes were made in Canada, and then the color was made in China, and then they were assembled in the U.S.
		So back then, all the prices rose and then it started the initial inflation with hair, and I'm sure all the women customers out there can show.
		So I had gone up to $90, but then that put me out of business.
		And now the hair color is up to $300 for women.
		And it's putting my first hair fallen out of business that there were nine women working there.
		And that business is going to close in the end of this month.
		So all these products that we sold out back in the 80s are now coming home to roost because, yes, Americans wanted to pay the cheaper prices.
		And now, you know, we were running to China.
		And now we're trying to get him back here.
		And you're not going to get a white kid out in the fields to pick greens or do anything.
		And those days are gone.
		Anyway, I'll be quiet, but just to let you know that all these products that we use are now made in these companies and assembled in the U.S.
		So I'm still going to pay the tariffs.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Congressman Tonko.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's a complicated issue.
		It's why, again, there has to be a strategy applied as we reach to a toolkit here that has tariffs within that toolkit.
		You know, just like a hammer can help build a home, it can also help destroy that home and level it.
		So, you know, you have to apply it appropriately, correctly.
		And, you know, I'm certain there's going to be a lot of discussion on this topic as we go forward with this session.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		That's Representative Paul Tonko, Democrat of New York, a member of the budget and the Energy and Commerce Committees.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Thanks so much for joining us today.
paul tonko ▲ ● ▼		My pleasure, Mimi, and always a treat to be able to join you on the show.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Up next, Representative Rich McCormick, a Republican of Georgia, joins us.
		He's a member of the Armed Services Committee.
		He'll discuss the budget and Republican efforts to advance the Trump administration agenda.
		We'll be right back.
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		Richard Ovary is a British historian who has spent most of his professional life writing books about war, primarily World War II.
		Professor Overy's current work is called Reign of Ruin, Tokyo, Hiroshima, and the Surrender of Japan.
		Liner notes on the cover of the book say, quote, with the development of the B-29 Super Fortress in the summer of 1944, strategic bombing, a central component of the Allied war effort against Germany, arrived in the Pacific Theater.
		1945, Japan experienced the three most deadly bombing attacks of the war.
		Professor Richard Overy is 77 and lives in Great Britain and Italy.
		He has written close to 30 books.
unidentified		Author Richard Overy with his book, Reign of Ruin, Tokyo, Hiroshima, and the Surrender of Japan on this episode of BookNotes Plus with our host, Brian Lamb.
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		Washington Journal continues.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back.
		We are joined now by Representative Rich McCormick.
		He's a Republican from Georgia and member of the Armed Services Committee and also the Science, Space, and Technology Committee.
		Representative, welcome back to the program.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Good to be with you.
unidentified		Thanks.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So yesterday, the vote on the budget bill was postponed.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		How would you have voted if that vote did take place?
unidentified		Well, the way it was in the political climate, I would have voted no.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		We didn't have the votes for it, and we needed more reassurances on the cuts that we need to sustain our budget and our deficit reduction.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		I think we have a long ways to go yet, but I think today we're going to have some reassurances publicly from the Senate and from the presidency, and I hope that helps it move it forward.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What kind of reassurances are you looking for?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Can you be more specific?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that we can lock in the 1.5 trillion.
		That's the hard number.
		I know that when the Senate came out with their budget, they had $4 billion in cuts.
		That's just not satisfactory.
		I know they said we can fix that in the reconciliation and rescue process, but I think we wanted more reassurances to make sure that we didn't get out of line from what we had originally intended.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And your views on the tariff, the Trump tariffs, as far as the reciprocal tariffs and then the pausing of those reciprocal tariffs for 90 days.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Actually, I'm really pleased with the way the tariffs turned out so far.
		I had many, many concerns.
		I have constituents who basically have car dealerships that were going to have a really hard time with the tariffs from Germany.
		I had some that had built batteries in Vietnam and were bringing it over.
		They specifically avoided China because they knew that was a problem and that 46% tariff there would have really crippled their business.
		Several other people with several other businesses and several other places, those didn't come to fruition for several reasons.
		First of all, to have 50 countries come to President Trump and say, let's go zero-zero, to have the EU come and say zero-zero, to have Japan, Israel, India, Vietnam, Cambodia, all kinds of nations coming and saying, let's make a deal.
		That's very beneficial to all of us.
		Because when you get rid of tariffs, you have better free trade, more competition, that forces the price points down.
		Actually, it would be deflationary and help our economy simultaneously.
		So it was a bit of a game of chicken, but Trump definitely won that.
		As far as pausing all tariffs right now, I think that's a separate issue, but I think it had to do with the bond market, but also the fact that we have so many countries actually willing to make a deal right now.
		So I'm really excited about that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Do you think that that would have happened had there not been that announcement that many economists were calling drastic as far as those initial tariffs being put in place?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		No, I think really, if you think about, I saw the market, the market's always going to react to all kinds of things.
		But the fact that it was already a done deal.
		A European Union had already come and said, let's do zero-zero tariffs.
		I mean, that's phenomenal to see the major players, all the major economies in the world other than China, had already come to the table and say, yeah, let's make a deal.
		I think the hard work had already been done and we're on the right path.
		So I think it was a reaction basically to something else.
		And I think maybe just realizing that we have them in a very good place to make a deal with us and benefit the entire nation.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Audrey Fahlberg of the Conservative National Review said this about the conflicting messaging on tariffs.
		Quote, for several days, the White House has projected conflicting messages about the strategic end game of the President's trade policy.
		Is it making tariffs permanent to fundamentally restructure the American economy or using them as a negotiating tactic to bring tariffs down towards zero?
		The president has offered little clarity on the matter.
		Pressed on Monday whether the tariffs are permanent or negotiable, he said, quote, they can both be true.
		What do you think of that, Congressman?
		Do you think those tariffs should be permanent to restructure the economy fundamentally, the American economy, or should, is this a negotiating tactic?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm one of those free market trade guys, so I hope they are permanent.
		I hope they are zero-zero.
		I think that's what creates the greatest competition.
		I think the United States, when it's unhampered by unfair trade regulations, does quite well.
		And we've proven that over the amount of time that we've been in a major economy.
		If you think about it, we have the largest economy by far.
		We're approaching $30 trillion in GDP.
		The next nearest is under 20.
		That's China.
		And then everybody else starts at about $5 trillion, which is Japan and Germany.
		It goes down from there.
		So whatever we've been doing historically has worked, but I think we can even do better without the reciprocal tariffs that people, sorry, not even the reciprocal tariffs, the unfair tariffs that we've had placed on us historically.
		I think it's about time that we got to a fair trade point, and that's only going to benefit the United States.
		So I hope it does become permanent.
		I hope it is zero-zero.
		I'm not real big on protectionist tariffs.
		I don't care if it's on steel or anything else like that because I think it harms the climate.
		It encourages unions to force prices up and ultimately can put businesses in a very disadvantageous place.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		If you'd like to join our conversation with Representative Richard McCormick, Republican of Georgia, you can do so.
		He'll be with us for about 20 minutes until the House gavels in.
		The numbers are Republicans, 202748, 8001.
		Democrats, 202748, 8,000.
		And Independents, 202748, 8,002.
		Congressman McCormick, I want to ask you about the SAVE Act.
		It's expected to come up for a vote today in the House, and that requires proof of citizenship in order to register to vote in a federal election.
		I take it you support that.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
		I don't see why anybody would want to vote in our elections if they're not citizens.
		I don't think they should vote in our elections if they're not citizens.
		I think the great majority of Americans believe that you should be a citizen to vote.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And that is already illegal to vote if you are not a citizen.
		The criticism of that bill, though, from the Democrats is that it is making it much harder for legal American citizens to vote.
		In other words, only about 50% of Americans have a passport.
		You would have to find your birth certificate.
		Your name would have to match.
		So married women would have to show additional documentation in order to vote if they've changed their name after marriage.
		What do you make of those criticisms?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Well, first of all, it's pretty easy to change your ID.
		It's extremely easy, especially in today's digital ID era.
		It doesn't take much.
		First of all, most people don't require any of those things.
		If you change your name through marriage, most people change it on their driver's license too.
		But if you didn't, all you have to do is bring in any form of ID, any form of ID that you have, which you have.
		You have all those things you just mentioned.
		But the average person doesn't have to do that because the average person doesn't change their name.
		You can either change your name on your ID, your driver's license, or bring in another form.
		So it's pretty darn easy.
		I mean, everybody has a form of ID.
		Everybody.
		Everybody has a birth certificate.
		Everybody has a passport that travels overseas.
		And if you don't have that, you had a driver's license, you have a birth certificate, you have so many different forms of colour.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Well, but a driver's license would not be sufficient.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		That's not true.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So you're saying that you have.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		You have a driver's license that has your name on it is absolutely sufficient.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Because that does not prove American citizenship, though.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So you can have a green certificate.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		So you're right.
		If you're correct.
		So that's not how it's going to work, though.
		No.
		So if you are not, you're supposed to have an ID that identifies you as somebody who's a foreign national.
		You shouldn't have a driver's license that allows you to claim U.S. citizenship.
		There's supposed to be a special mark on your driver's license that designates you as not a citizen.
unidentified		And I think that's something that most states have.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		I want to ask you, since you're a practicing medical doctor, you're also from Georgia, which is where the CDC is located, about cuts to the HHS and health care, sorry, the staffing at HHS and also research funding.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		So federal research dollars going towards medical breakthroughs and biotech innovation.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, so it depends on which one you're talking about.
		I haven't seen the specifics yet.
		A lot of the details have not been hashed out.
		When you're talking about cuts done by bureaucracies, obviously we don't have purview over that.
		I'd like to see what the president's going to ultimately do because sometimes they pause things and then they re-up it when they see the fallout on that.
		In other words, I saw with the CDC, the CDC was pressuring us to hire over 200 new employees just for their viral area of research, and that was over COVID.
		I didn't think that was necessary.
		I told them it wasn't necessary.
		And I'm an ER doc and actually my former attending is one of the senior members of the CDC.
		So we can have those debates all day long.
		If you're talking about cancer research and stuff like that, I think it's very important we continue to invest in things that will benefit all Americans.
		But we have to make sure the right people are in the right place at the right time, especially given our budgetary concerns.
unidentified		So NPR is reporting here.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		The headline is on top of layoffs, HHS is ordered to cut 35% of spending on contracts.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Are you comfortable with that, Congressman?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Depends on which contracts.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		I haven't seen all the contracts.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, let's talk to callers.
		Here's Steve in Maitland, Florida, Republican line.
		Oh, we lost Steve.
		Never mind.
		Here's Teresa in Buffalo, New York, Democrat.
		Good morning, Teresa.
unidentified		And good morning.
		Just want to make a statement, but also a question.
		So much money is being used, and the budget is such a big thing these days.
		How is it that Trump is allowed to personally use so much money for himself?
		And then on top of that, how do you explain a budget then added $100 million for a birthday for one person?
		So why isn't the budget being considered how much money is spent in military on President Trump's personal agenda?
		And how can we allow $100 million to go to someone's birthday?
		Can you explain that to me, sir?
		Yeah, I'm not aware of any $100 million birthday.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Teresa, what birthday celebration are you talking about?
unidentified		Trump has an agenda of having a birthday, military birthday.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Oh, this is the Army's birthday and the military parade for D.C. That's what she's talking about.
unidentified		Yes, and when have we decided to spend so much money on something that's pretty much not going to help the American people?
		So so much money is being used for unnecessary to study cancer research.
		Just why are so much money going towards military and Trump's agenda?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, as far as the military goes, if you're talking about a parade, I don't know that it would cost $100 million.
		I don't know where that number comes from.
		I haven't seen that number.
		Military people are paid whether they do parades or not.
		We use gas for training whether we do parades or not.
		I'm not sure what the cost would be other than closing out the streets, which we have police officers who are already paid to do that too.
		So I'm not really sure where that cost is coming from.
		Not sure where your figures are coming from.
		I haven't seen that, so I really don't know what to comment on that.
		Sorry.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		The Washington Post says parachutists and maybe a military parade for Army's DC birthday bash.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		It says President Donald Trump intended to host one during his first term, but backed off amid pushback from the Army and D.C. officials.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, once again, we use money all the time for parachuting and for training.
		They can combine that.
		That's fine.
		That's not a real cost.
		That money is going to be spent by the military regardless.
		So it's not like it's going to increase the budget unless I misunderstand what's going on.
		I haven't seen the budget on that.
		I haven't seen the plans on that.
		I'm not sure where the money's coming from.
		I don't know what pot.
		That's a really detailed question I can't answer.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Joseph, Point Pleasant Beach, New Jersey, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Joseph.
unidentified		Good morning.
		How are you?
		How are you doing, sir?
		Thank you for your service.
		I just got a couple things I just want to say.
		I'm ultra, ultra MAGA, and I kind of get upset when I hear guys like Rand Paul talking about, oh, no tariffs, no tariffs.
		And you just said the same thing, you know, free trade.
		We're never going to have free trade.
		For the last 80 years, we've been supporting countries militarily.
		Canada, Europe, now Ukraine.
		It's never going to be free trade.
		If all the money that we're spending, the tariffs won't make up for that.
		And another thing, too, do you think I'm a New York City kid, so I didn't know this was going on.
		My wife is from Detroit.
		So every time I go out there, I see how decimated that city is.
		I had no idea that American companies were closing up shop in our country and then going to Mexico and Canada and then bringing those cars back into our country.
		You don't think Trump has a right to tariff those companies?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		So when you come to, I think Trump's ultimate goal is to get to zero-zero.
		It opens up markets overseas for us.
		The fact is we've been punished for selling things overseas because they think we have an unfair advantage by being America.
		But what this does is he put tariffs on them that were reciprocal.
		Actually, he would say that were less than what they put on us.
		So his ultimate goal was to get them to relent on their tariffs.
		So I think what he was trying to do is actually what worked, and that's what I'm in support of.
		He did something that a lot of people would never thought of doing because it was a game of chicken.
		Because if you have everybody else double down on their tariffs, then it could end in a trade war and nobody wants that.
		That's not beneficial for anybody.
		So I think what Trump did was genius.
		It got us to where we wanted to be.
		And if you're ultra-mega, you should be absolutely happy with what these results were.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here is Franklin in Washington, D.C., Independent.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Rich, I'm also ultra-mega.
		And I agree there's only two genders.
		And I also agree you guys have rightly focused on voter fraud, which brings me to a major concern of mine.
		It's why have we never seen Marjorie Taylor Green and Dog the Bounty Hunter in the same room?
		Are you concerned that Marjorie Taylor Greene is, in fact, the bounty hunter?
		And what are you going to do to investigate her broad?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Anyway, let's move on to Sharon in Bemidji, Minnesota, a Democrat.
unidentified		Good grief, huh?
		All right.
		Mimi, I have a question for C-SPAN real quick.
		And I've asked it, I think, every single time I call, is whatever happened to the roundtables where we can bring in two representatives from both sides and we can ask questions to both of them.
		But I can tell you, I've watched this show for 30 years, and it changed back in 2016.
		That's when we quit doing it.
		And I just don't understand.
		I really wish we could.
		I mean, we had the Democrat on half an hour ago, and now we got this guy on.
		I'm sure we'll hear something about, oh, what's our schedule?
		Blah, blah, blah, whatever.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		But you want a Democrat and a Republican on at the same time so that you can talk to both of them at the same time.
unidentified		We have to do that.
unidentified		We used to do that all the time.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		That's been noticed by the actually CEO of C-SPAN has approached me on that, and I'm okay with it.
		And I think most Democrats would be okay with it.
		There's several people that I have very friendly banter with all the time about bipartisan solutions.
		We're going to need something for Social Security, something for Medicare when it comes to these massive spending programs that we have to solve without, which we would have an automatic 21% cut to Social Security within the next 10 years.
		Same thing, you'll have 11% cut to Medicare.
		We're going to have bipartisan talks.
		I'm happy to do that on C-SPAN or any other venue.
		I've been on other venues where I do have that, and I think it's a very healthy thing to do.
unidentified		As long as it's not people yelling at each other, that's all I can't stand.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		That's not getting anything.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		As long as you don't yell at people, Congressman.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		And it looks like we lost her.
		I think she had something else to say, but hopefully she'll call us back.
		Here's David, Dennison, Texas, Republican.
		Good morning.
unidentified		I definitely agree with the idea of having two opposing views at the same time.
		I hate this format since it's changed.
		I hardly watch like I used to, also as far as the, look, one thing that this has helped raise is awareness that as people are talking about tariffs or taxes, tariffs are an expense and somebody passes it on.
		You've had people call in to say that the tariff raises a price to the importer in the United States that's paying it.
		Now, the exporter into our country is paying the tariff.
		Now, whether they pass it along or not, that's a different issue.
		The importer may or may not pay more as a result of that.
		And whether they pass their margin, reduce their margins, that's a different issue.
		But it's helped get it in the minds of people that tariffs are an expense and it might or might not be passed along.
		Taxes to businesses are expenses.
		No business pays any taxes.
		The consumer pays the tax in the context of the price that the business charges for its services.
		1817, David Ricardo, one of the preeminent economists of the day, writing in his book on political economy, made that point clear then.
		It hasn't changed yet.
		And right now, where some of the Republicans are talking about raising taxes on the wealthiest over 40% or 40%, you get beyond the laugh recover 25%, you get less of what you wanted.
		Trump is doing a great job, and I do disagree with our congressman here on one point.
		There is no such thing as free trade.
		Everybody's screwed things around forever.
		The WTO is responsible for the biggest part of it because we lost control of what we could do with tariffs and controlling our markets with the WTO.
		We gave up our power on that to the global market, to the globalists.
		And before that, with GATT, we used tariffs all the time.
		You've had people call and say, oh, we never used tariffs before.
		Tariffs were used all the time before the WTO.
		And we were able to control what was going on with it.
		We don't have that control now.
		We have to get manufacturing here.
		If we had a regular war with China, we would lose.
		We have no manufacturing.
		It's the exact opposite between what we were before World War II.
		We had the manufacturing capacity.
		We had no military.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		Let's just got the manufacturing.
unidentified		We've got the military.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		We got that point, David.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Let's get Congressman McCormick.
unidentified		Sure.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		When you talk about the World Trade Organization, China's been cheating since they joined about 20 years ago.
		When they came up with the Made in China Initiative in 2015, they started instituting all kinds of changes.
		They've been supplementing the businesses.
		That's why they put a lot of people out of business, quite frankly.
		They've been cheating.
		They've been taken to court.
		If you look at Catherine Ty's report as the trade ambassador, they've been cheating.
		They've been taken to court, I think, 27 times, lost every single case.
		They just get better at cheating.
		So I agree.
		The World Trade Organization has not been very good at policing their own.
		We'll have to do a good job.
		But that's why you do trade tariffs and stuff like that when people are cheating.
		But overall, I think you're right.
unidentified		It is a you accurately described what a tariff is.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		But a business does pay taxes and impacts the cost onto the customer.
		And we know that already.
		But I'm a minimal tax guy.
		I want to have free trade.
		Obviously, you're never going to have perfect free trade, but that's why we negotiate.
		That's why we have secretaries.
		That's why we have presidents that constantly wheel and deal.
		I mean, that's what we've been doing since the beginning of our country.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Willie in Sycamore, Georgia, Democrat.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Willie.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I'm calling to say that all these trade deals and the stuff that's going on here, what they're talking about, all they had to do is watch the golf course.
		All this stuff is a distraction.
		It's distracting with all this stuff coming up, what he's doing while he's over here doing that.
		You know, about the golf course and the Saudis coming in there to get money.
		That's what he's doing, distracting everybody.
		All of a sudden, after the golf course, then what do you mean, Willie?
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		What do you mean after the golf course?
unidentified		After he left the golf course Saturday with all them people going there, he met with the Saudis there and stuff.
		And that's what it's all about.
		All this terrorists and Congressman, do you know anything about that?
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Sorry.
		I'm a royalty player, not a golfer.
		Not sure what you're talking about.
		Sorry about that.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		All right, Mike in Bessemer City, North Carolina, Republican.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Yes.
		How are you doing, Mr. McCormick?
		I'm just about these tariffs.
		We need to do something because, like the previous caller said, you know, China has got, we've lost 90,000 manufacturers in this country, and we got to stand up.
		But one of the main things I want to address is I want the Republicans to be like the Democrats and grow some kahunas like that.
		Jamie Raskin always talking crap about Trump and Elon Musk and Jasmine Crockett the way he's talking.
		Y'all Republicans stand up and act like them.
rich mccormick ▲ ● ▼		Well, you'll see a lot of people standing up.
		We had fierce debate last night, but we tend to, I always say we shouldn't admonish each other in public.
		I think it's very important that we do our fighting behind closed doors.
		It's a biblical principle, but it's also, it keeps people from working against each other.
		We have a lot of fights, but we keep them amongst ourselves most of the time.
		The people, matter of fact, who go out there and display their fights publicly are usually the people who are not getting things done.
		When it comes to fighting the Democrats, I think you'll see plenty of fighting out there.
		But once again, the question is, what are we getting done?
		What are we bringing to the table?
		How are we actually solving problems?
		We were up pretty darn late last night trying to come up with some solutions, real solutions, to have the first significant cut in deficit spending since I've been around.
		I mean, this is something that's been, we haven't had a balanced budget since basically back in the 90s.
		And that was a long time ago.
		And we're really on a course for a collision with history.
		And I hope we get something significant done this time.
		And I think that that would be the first time in modern history.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Here's Mickey in Vineland, New Jersey, Independent Line.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I would like to comment that after World War II, they developed the Marshall Plan to rebuild countries that were devastated by the world, or by the war.
		And we rebuilt most of the world.
jim marrs ▲ ● ▼		And we rebuilt their industries and their infrastructure and their economies to where these countries, a lot of them, are equal to or above our own now.
jim marrs ▲ ● ▼		What we need to do is develop a Marshall Plan II to develop our own industries and economies and infrastructure and not only develop it, but maintain it.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Mickey, let's get a response because we're running low on time.
mimi geerges ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Congressman McCormick.

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