CSPAN - Washington Journal 04/05/2025

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April 5, 2025 07:00-10:03 - CSPAN

03:02:58

Washington Journal 04/05/2025

Participants

Main

tammy thueringer

cspan 31:52

Appearances

amy klobuchar

sen/d 02:01

brian lamb

cspan 01:42

chuck schumer

sen/d 01:17

jerome powell

01:38

john thune

sen/r 01:08

maggie hassan

01:52

mark carney

can 00:47

Clips

bill christison

00:22

frank bisignano

00:13

joel skousen

00:11

john mcardle

cspan 00:17

lee hawkins

00:17

Callers

bulldog in unknown

callers 00:07

kieran in kentucky

callers 00:16

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Speaker	Time	Text
unidentified		Coming up on C-SPAN's Washington Journal, we'll take your calls and comments live.
		Then a look at the impact of President Trump's tariffs on the auto industry with Reuters' David Shepardson.
		Then John Hope Bryant, founder and CEO of Operation Hope, joins us to discuss his organization's efforts to increase financial literacy.
		Washington Journal starts now.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		This is Washington Journal for Saturday, April 5th.
		According to a new Gallup poll, the economy tops the list of Americans' worries.
		Concerns about health care and the environment are up significantly, and worry about Social Security is at a 15-year high.
		At the same time, concerns about crime, drug use, immigration, and the availability and affordability of energy have decreased.
		To start today's program, we are asking you, what's your top concern for the U.S.?
		Here are the lines.
		Republicans 202-748-8001.
		Democrats 202-748-8000.
		And Independents 202-748-8002.
		You can text your comments to 202-748-8003.
		Be sure to include your name and city.
		You can also post a question or comment on Facebook at facebook.com slash C-SPAN or on X at C-SPANWJ.
		Good morning, and thank you for being with us.
		We'll get to your calls and comments in just a few minutes, but wanted to give you some more information from that recent Gallup poll.
		It says that Americans' top ranking worries are pocketbook issues, including the economy.
		That's 60% worry a great deal, health care costs 59%, inflation, 56%, federal spending and the budget deficit, 53%, and the social security system, 52%.
		Meanwhile, half of Americans are greatly worried about hunger and homelessness, and 48% each are concerned about the way the economy and wealth are distributed in the U.S. and the size and power of the federal government.
		Crime and violence, the quality of the environment, the possible terrorist attack on the U.S., illegal immigration, and drug use are toward the bottom of the list, while Americans exhibit the lowest concerns about unemployment, the availability and affordability of energy, and race relations.
		Race relations, the issue evoking the least amount of worry, has been declining since it peaked at 48% in 2021.
		That main issue, the top concern is the economy, and that was the topic for Jerome Powell yesterday as he spoke.
		The Federal Reserve Chair from the Wall Street Journal, the article says, Federal Reserve Chair Jerome Powell said the U.S. economy was likely to face a period of higher prices and weaker growth than seemed possible a few weeks ago because of larger than anticipated tariff hikes announced by President Trump.
		It says that in 2019, the Fed preempted potential fallout from Trump's trade war with China by cutting rates before weakness was evident in the economy.
		But Powell hinted that the current situation would be different because inflation has been elevated in recent years and because the current round of tariffs is much larger.
		The central bank this time could wait to cut rates until signs of economic weakness are more apparent.
		Powell said the central bank didn't need to be in a hurry to cut rates, repeating language he has often used to signal a rate cut isn't on the table.
		At the Fed's next policy meeting, which is May 6th and 7th.
		Yesterday's policy meeting was where Jerome Powell made those remarks.
		Here is a clip from yesterday.
jerome powell ▲ ● ▼		Looking across many indicators, the labor market appears to be broadly in balance and not a significant source of inflationary pressure.
		This morning's jobs report showed the unemployment rate at 4.2% in March, still in the low range where it has held since early last year.
		Over the first quarters, a quarter, payrolls grew by an average of 150,000 jobs per month.
		The combination of low layoffs, moderating job growth, and slowing labor force growth has kept the unemployment rate broadly stable.
		Turning to the other leg of our dual mandate, inflation has declined sharply from its pandemic highs of mid-2022.
		It has done so without the kind of painful rise in unemployment that has often accompanied periods of tight monetary policy that are needed to reduce inflation.
		More recently, progress toward our 2% inflation objective has slowed.
		Total PCE prices rose 2.5% over the 12 months ending in February.
		Core PCE prices, which exclude the volatile food and energy categories, rose 2.8%.
		Looking ahead, higher tariffs will be working their way through our economy and are likely to raise inflation in coming quarters.
		Reflecting this, both survey and market-based measures of near-term inflation expectations have moved up.
		By most measures, longer-term inflation expectations, those beyond just the next few years, remain well anchored and consistent with our 2% inflation goal.
		We remain committed to returning inflation sustainably to our 2% objective.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yesterday, before Jerome Powell's comments, President Trump posting this on Truth Social: This would be a perfect time for Fed Chairman Jerome Powell to cut interest rates.
		He is always late, but he could now change his image and quickly.
		Energy prices are down, interest rates are down, inflation is down, even eggs are down 69%, and jobs are up, all within two months.
		A big win for America.
		Cut interest rates, Jerome, and stop playing politics.
		The economy coming in as the top concern among Americans for issues in the U.S. For this first hour, we want to hear what your top concern is.
		Again, the Lions Republicans 202-748-8001.
		Democrats 202-748-8000.
		And Independents 202-748-8002.
		We'll start with Otis in Orange Park, Florida, Line for Democrats.
		Hi, Otis.
unidentified		Hello, good morning.
		Now, my concern is this year.
		The economy.
		President Trump and his Republican Party have gaslit or trying to gaslight the American people.
		And about a bunch of them believe in him.
		You can't say that tech putting tariffs on the entire world, in a sense, is good for America.
		All they have to do is stop dealing with America.
		But we, they, people saying take him for his word, we're going to have to have some pain.
		What type of pain?
		The people with money, they can sustain the pain.
		When you broke, you can't sustain it.
		And most of the people are going to get hurt.
		It's going to be his Republicans who are going to give this guy every inch of rope he asks for.
		And it's not fair.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Otis, how do you think you're personally going to be impacted by the tariffs?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		What do you think is going to impact you the most?
unidentified		Well, the only thing going to impact me right now is that my family members are going to struggle a lot more.
		I can withstand this pain more so than a lot of other people.
		But my family members are not able to withstand the pain that America is about to feel.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Otis and Florida.
		Ernest in Massachusetts line for independence.
		Good morning, Ernest.
unidentified		Good morning.
		My top concern right now is the backdoor cancellation of Social Security.
		They're dismantling the infrastructure of Social Security so that they can get rid of Social Security.
		And we know that's what the plan is.
		And after they get rid of Social Security, they will give rich people, billionaires, and corporations a big tax cut.
		In fact, they will pay no taxes.
		And my other concern is about the thousands and thousands of federal workers that have lost their jobs.
		And they're going to depend on unemployment and things like that, which ultimately comes from the states.
		And they're not going to be able to get any benefits at all.
		And I'm really concerned about that.
		I'm concerned about all the people that lost their jobs.
		I'm concerned about Social Security.
		And it's terrible.
		It's terrible what's going on.
		And I'm an independent because the Democrats became too liberal and the Republicans became too corrupt.
		And that's why I'm an independent.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That's Ernest in Massachusetts.
		Let's hear from Danny, Louisville, Kentucky, line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Danny.
unidentified		Good morning.
		That's a lot to cheer on.
		But, you know, what I worry about is the Democrats getting in power and really destroying the country.
		Like basically almost did this last four years.
		I mean, I can't believe anybody thought that Joe did a good job.
		I don't even believe he was president.
		I believe somebody was behind the scenes doing the stuff, you know, maybe Nancy Pulsey or Barack Obama.
		But, you know, I ain't really worried.
		I think Trump's doing a good job.
		Yeah, it's going to be rough for a little bit, but we've been in such a mess of four years, didn't get really nothing done but going down in the gutter.
		You know, I mean, I make less than I get only less than $1,000 a month, you know, and I ain't worrying about it because really, if you're poor, just trust in the Lord.
		He'll get you through.
		He takes care of me.
		He's been taking care of me for years.
		You know, I mean, I lost my sight 17 years ago, but he takes care of me.
		He gives me the strength to get through.
		If I just trust in the Lord, you'd have no problem.
		But I hope the Republicans stay in power for at least the next 10, 12 years until I'm ready to go.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Danny in Kentucky, let's go to Bob in Utah, line for Democrats.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Bob.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'd like to say that the Republicans seem to be able to think the Democrats the way they want people to look at us.
		And we sit back and not say anything about it.
bill christison ▲ ● ▼		I'd say 90% of the Democrats don't believe in late-term abortion.
unidentified		They believe in women's rights when it saves their life.
		And there should be a limit on abortions.
		And we believe in that.
		And I'd say 99% probably don't believe in men being in women's sports.
		Yeah.
		We don't believe in that.
		And it just goes on and on.
		Yeah, the Republicans paint us as socialists and communists.
		They don't even know what a socialist or a communist is.
		And the Democrats don't fight back.
		I'll tell you what a communist is.
		Look at Kim Poo-young or Kim Jong-young.
		That's a communist.
		Look at Bernie Sanders.
		Now there's a socialist.
		That's a socialist.
		And I don't think Bernie's a bad guy.
		Do you guys?
		So, Democrats, come out and say what you believe.
bill christison ▲ ● ▼		Don't just let the far left step out and say what we want because we don't want that.
unidentified		We like social security.
unidentified		We like overtime pay.
bill christison ▲ ● ▼		Every benefit we've got, Democrats and Republicans, is shared it with people.
unidentified		Now, you tell me what a Republican's ever done for a working man.
unidentified		They don't wake up, Democrats, and for God's sake, start fighting.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Bob in Utah.
		Robert in Cincinnati, Ohio, line for independence.
		Good morning, Robert.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I was calling to express my dismay with what I saw going on live on the Capitol floor in the Senate hearing.
		I don't know if that's the correct word that was going on last night where Democrats were bringing amendments to the discussion of the Robert, can you turn your television down in the back?
		Yes.
		Let me mute.
		Okay.
		Is that better for you?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yes, it is.
unidentified		Okay.
		The issue that I saw with the amendments being brought to limit what the budget proposal was is that they were attacking the tax cuts that are to be renewed in 2026 for payments going to the most wealthy without saying that,
		you know, you should keep the tax cuts for everybody making under $400,000 a year, but eliminate the tax cuts that are going to those making over $400,000 a year.
		And I would have loved to have seen all the Republican senators get on record with voting down that amendment, which basically is saying, oh, well, you know, the majority of the tax cuts to the wealthy are what are driving up the deficit.
		The majority of the tax cuts to those making less than $400,000 a year is not driving an increase in the deficit.
		So there's a hybrid proposal that the Democrats were trying to make, that independents and Democrats should try to make.
		And the only person proposing some sort of hybrid way of looking at these tax cuts was Angus King.
		And I wasn't on long enough to see Bernie Sanders make his pitch.
		But the bottom line is that the working class of America, those making less than $400,000, should keep the tax cuts that were set up, which allow us like a $16,000.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		So, Robert, there's a lot of issues in there.
		Our topic for the first hour is your top concern.
		So, how does that amendment that you're talking about, how does that tie into your top concern?
unidentified		My top concern is about how the proposal to hold on to the tax cuts for everyone is going to demand that those tax cuts for the really wealthy are going to have to be clawed out of Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Robert in Ohio.
		Another Robert, this one in Virginia Beach, Virginia, line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Robert.
unidentified		Hey, Marlene.
		My top concern for you guys is just the big city violence that we've had since the pandemic.
		And it seems like, you know, the Democrats ignored it.
		I think we have to vote Republican for law and order.
		Just yesterday, Thursday, New York City, we had a pro-life activist was assaulted in the streets.
		There were two Fox News shows that covered that story.
		Again, that's my point.
		Just it's time to stop this big city violence and vote red Republican for law and order.
		Thanks.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Robert in Virginia Beach, Virginia, and Robert mentioning crime and violence.
		That showed up on the list of biggest concerns for Americans.
		47% saying that it was a great deal.
		It was a great deal of concern for them.
		Let's hear from Robbie in Florida, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Robbie.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Good morning.
		Let's see.
		My top concern is I'm trying to figure out what multiverse we're living in right now.
		There is so much going on.
		I guess let me address some of the earlier callers when they're saying, you know, Republicans are this and that and Democrats are this and that.
		You know, Republicans like to say that Democrats are evil.
		They drink the blood of children, you know, do things with kids.
		Two weeks ago, up north, they try to do that TDS bill, and the guy who is proposing it the next day gets arrested for having chats with an underage trans kid who's actually a cop.
		Yet, you know, is that worth projection?
		They try to throw it on Democrats, but it always ends up being on the Republicans.
		Our health issue with RFK, I like the guy.
		I think he's a smart guy.
		He has a great housing plan.
		You know, I love his stuff with the whole food stuff.
		But Republicans, come on, this guy doesn't believe in, you know, HIV, AIDS, the whole vaccine stuff.
		You had that kid in Texas with the measles who passed away, and his parents are like, yeah, we still don't believe in the vaccine.
		You had the tariffs from Trump and this guy, I'm sorry.
		First, the Penguins tried to turn the kids gay, and then now the Penguins are screwing us in tariffs.
		Like the multiverse is getting screwed up here.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Robbie in Florida.
		This from Time magazine, the headline is: He's going to tank our economy.
		Trump's tariffs draw strong reactions in Congress.
		The article says that less than a day after President Donald Trump imposed a wave of new tariffs on dozens of countries, members of Congress from both parties are grappling with what to make of a trade strategy they fear could tank the U.S. economy, drive up consumer prices, and destabilize global markets.
		It says that the fears Democrats seized on the market reaction to underscore what they see as a reckless economic policymaking, those fears were fueling a stronger GOP pushback against Trump than seen in his second term thus far, though those speaking out still represented a minority in those parties.
		It says that Trump's tariffs quickly triggered a significant sell-off in the stock market, with major indexes on track for their worst day since 2022.
		It was yesterday on Capitol Hill that Senator Amy Klobuchar spoke about President Trump's imposing those new tariffs.
amy klobuchar ▲ ● ▼		This is devastating for the street.
		They've never seen a market like this.
		It's really bad, but you got to take it from Wall Street to Main Street.
		And what these tariffs do is raise taxes on American families by nearly $4,000 a year.
		What do they do with cars?
		$3,000 increase for average family to buy a car.
		New homes for young people, $20,000 on average for a new home.
		It hits everyone in our economy, but perhaps those that are most scared right now are people who are depending on their savings, not in the long term, but immediately.
		Seniors depending on their savings.
		This might not mean much to Elon Musk, but it means a lot to average families.
		It means a lot to the people I met with in rural Minnesota on my 14-county tour when they would come up, show up at these things, never gone to a political event before, and say, because of what's happening with Canada now, I've lost a market.
		I don't think I can make it anymore.
		Our economy is a global economy, and he is cutting us off from the rest of the world.
		Just ask anyone of those 70% of Canadians that have canceled their trips to the U.S.
		It's not just manufacturing and farming, it is also our service industries.
		It is people in hospitality, it's those small cafes, it's those hotels.
		They are all going to suffer.
		That is the impact of the tariffs.
		And all we need is for our Republican colleagues to stand up.
		Four of them stood up when Senator Kaine and Senator Warner and I put forward the amendment and the resolution involving Canada.
		We passed that.
		So they need to stand up to all of this.
		If they truly believe in capitalism, they need to put their votes where capitalism is.
		And that is that competition works, our world relationships work.
		And Donald Trump is taking us backwards to the Great Depression.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Back to your calls, asking you, what's your top concern for the U.S.?
		Let's hear from Mark in Massachusetts Line for Independence.
		Hi, Mark.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I think Trump's reckless economic tariffs and just his reckless nature in general is by far the biggest.
		You know, this guy on what, day one, he pardons 1,500 felons who everybody saw on TV break into the Capitol.
		They all had trials or pleas or whatever.
		And the fact that people couldn't see this guy, I luckily divested myself because I knew this guy's a complete nutcase.
		But, I mean, This tarot thing, there's absolutely no.
		I mean, the fact that he says, I'm glad you played that clip from Jerome Powell.
		The fact that he on social media yesterday, while he's on the golf course, well, the market's down 2,500 points or whatever.
		And by the way, they say Monday is going to be a lot worse.
		So, like, Black Monday again from 1987.
		But, you know, he's saying, don't play politics, Jerome, to lower the interest rates.
		Hey, dude, Trump, you're creating it.
		You're tanking the market, the economy.
		Like, how's that going to help us?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Mark in Massachusetts, Judy in Illinois, line for Republicans.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Judy.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I would like to say: if the Democratic Party knew all this stuff, why weren't they helping us before this all happened?
		Why did they do this to us?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Judy, what's your top concern?
unidentified		My top concern is the market.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		What specifically is your concern about them?
		Are you invested?
		Oh, we lost Judy.
		We'll go to Henry, San Diego, California, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Henry.
unidentified		Hello.
		My top concern is the middle class.
		I believe it's been for the last 12 years.
		It's getting terrible.
		You know, it's too rich to be poor and too poor to be rich.
		You know, the economy is too expensive for the middle class.
		It's good for the lower class and it's good for the upper class, but the middle class, we are one getting hurt, both the Democrat and the Republican.
		I don't think they care about the middle class.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Henry, do you consider yourself middle class?
unidentified		Yes.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		And that's something that you're struggling with?
unidentified		Yes.
		I did 20 years in the Navy.
		I still work for the Navy as a contractor.
		Me and my wife, we still work.
		We have six kids.
		We got them through college.
		And like my son, my daughter, she's going, my youngest daughter, she's in college.
		And my youngest son, he's trying to get his PhD, you know, and we still, we just barely making it.
		I'm living off, you know, I'm working, and plus, I got to live off my pension.
		And, you know, I see all this, like the cuts for people that have low income.
		We don't qualify for low income, but we they consider us upper class.
		But honestly, living in San Diego, you know, we make over $100,000, but we just barely making it.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Henry in San Diego, California.
		And looking at the Gallup poll way that income and wealth are distributed in the U.S., 48% finding that is a great deal of concern for them.
		24% say it's a fair concern for them, while 14% say they're only a little concerned by it.
		13% say not at all.
		Let's hear from Joey in Atlanta, Georgia, line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Joey.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I just wish that these people that are calling would just take the time and listen to what they're saying and listen to what this president is trying to do for them.
		This country is going into a path that is going to destroy America.
		If people are worried about their social security, they should understand that what this president is doing, he's actually doing to preserve it and to make it strong for all those who need it.
		We need to stop listening to the lies.
		We need to stop acting like evil people.
		We need to start praying for this president.
		We need to start getting excited about what he's thinking about the prosperity of this country.
		We need to stop listening to people who just want to destroy America.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		So Joey, how does that tie it to your top concern?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Wrap it up into a top concern for me.
unidentified		Well, I'm concerned is that there's so many people that are calling and they just have no clue about what they're complaining about.
		They're nervous, they're scared, they're angry, but they're angry and they're scared and they're nervous about the wrong things.
		This country is going bankrupt.
		If we don't do something about our spending average, if we don't bring in unfair trades with other countries, how is it possible that it's fair for us to have to pay all these taxes while we send our products to these countries?
		And then when they send their products to us, that it's not the same way.
		How could that be fair?
		Just think about that.
		If people would just stop and think about what they're trying to do, it's just, it's unbelievable how people just can't stop and say, this doesn't make any sense.
		It does make sense when it's a plain, even, fair game for everybody.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Got your point, Joey.
		That was Joey in Atlanta, and he mentioned the budget and federal spending.
		This from Politico says that Senate Republicans adopted a fiscal blueprint Saturday, that was early this morning, that for President Donald Trump's, quote, one big, beautiful bill, what comes next is anyone's guest.
		It says the Senate voted 51 to 48 on a budget resolution that unlocks their ability to pass a party line bill this year that will combine an overhaul of the tax code with borders, energy, and defense policies.
		GOP senators Susan Collins of Maine and Rand Paul of Kentucky joined all Democrats and independents in opposing the resolution, though other Republicans still have concern, still have concerns that will need to be addressed before passing the final bill.
		Says now the budget plan needs approval in the House, where Speaker Mike Johnson can only afford to lose three Republicans without having the entire effort unravel.
		House fiscal hawks are displeased with the Senate's framework and are threatening revolt.
		The federal deficit in budget is one of those top concerns for Americans.
		Recently on this program, Bipartisan Policy Center Shai Akabus joined us and discussed the X date and the federal deficit.
		Here's a clip.
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Why are we approaching an X date when there are Doge cuts going on, which is said to be reducing government and government spending, tariffs collecting money right now, and we're in tax season?
john mcardle ▲ ● ▼		Isn't this the time when the U.S. government collects all the money for the year?
unidentified		Yeah, it's important to take a step back and understand that we have a huge fiscal problem as a country.
		That $36 trillion number is far too big for most Americans to comprehend, but it's a lot of money.
		We are paying just an interest on the debt, about $100 million every hour.
		So that's $100 million that are not going to fund all the things that the government does that we want it to be doing, Social Security benefits, Medicare, et cetera, et cetera.
		That is just going to pay the interest on the money that we have borrowed.
		And at some point, it will become a larger and larger drag on the economy.
		It will mean that interest rates are going up because of the amount of debt that we have to borrow.
		That will be felt by consumers across the economy.
		It's already being felt in ways that are more difficult to see.
		But eventually that will become a challenge that is felt by all and that people can clearly see as a result of the growing debt if we don't get this under control and make the necessary changes to spending and taxes to contain it.
		Now, the way that this affects the debt limit is we are running a roughly $2 trillion annual deficit, meaning the gap between what we're taking in and what we're sending out.
		We're taking in about $5 trillion a year, and we're sending out about $7 trillion a year, roughly a $2 trillion difference.
		That means that we are accumulating debt each and every month, pretty much.
		The exception is in April, when we do tend to run cash surplus as a result of the tax season.
		So we don't expect the debt limit X date to arrive in April because we'll be taking in more than we're sending out.
		But pretty much every other month, we're sending out more than we're taking in.
		And that eventually means that we will reach a point where we run up against this borrowing limit and Congress needs to act to allow the Treasury to continue borrowing to meet all of our obligations.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Just under 30 minutes left in this first hour of Washington Journal asking your top concern for the U.S. We're taking your calls.
		You can also reach us on social media or give us or shoot us a text.
		These texts coming in for us, Denita in South Haven, Mississippi says, my top concern is the instability of the Department of Education.
		Funding was pulled for teacher training and funding is threatened to be pulled from universities.
		I'm concerned that these issues are causing emotional distress for the students.
		Tammy from Erie, Pennsylvania says, my top concern is how climate change has been affecting the national and global economies.
		I think we need to adjust our expectations.
		I don't see how our GDP can sustain our national debt with natural disasters.
		I think this nation's debt is a lost cause at this point because we have passed a tipping point.
		And Barb in Longrove, Illinois says, the top concern for the U.S. is the economy.
		Our country is entering a global trade war, which will affect prices and types of products we can purchase.
		Back to your calls.
		Let's talk with Matt, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Matt.
unidentified		Hey, Tammy.
		Good to talk to you.
		My major thing is health care.
		My wife's a retired federal employee, and she took her health care into retirement with her.
		And this affects all retired federal civil service and, I might add, postal employees.
		And now the Republicans want to turn my wife's health plan, federal health plan, her federal Blue Cross into a voucher plan.
		Right now, she's paying self-only standard option about $400 a month.
		I predict by the end of Trump's term in 2028, I could see my wife paying $1,600 a month for health care.
		And that doesn't include, just think of all the federal and postal retirees that have family plans.
		And, you know, this is going to be a disaster for health care in this country.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		You were talking about a change to a voucher program.
		Are some of those changes already going to effect?
		Tell me more about it.
unidentified		Okay, the way it works is like this.
		Let's say you're a single woman and you work for, I don't know, IRS, and you're on federal Blue Cross Blue Shield Standard Option.
		The total premium is, let's say, $24,000 a year.
		Right now, Uncle Sam pays three quarters of that, and the federal employee pays a quarter.
		That's going to be reversed.
		Under the voucher plan, the employee is going to be given a voucher for like $10,000.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		And Matt, that voucher program has been approved and is moving into effect?
unidentified		It's going to be part of the reconciliation bill that the Republicans are working on now.
unidentified		So it's just a matter of time before it in fact goes into effect.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Matt in Philadelphia.
		John in New Jersey, line for independence.
		Good morning, John.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm calling to react to a couple of sort of pet peeves that have turned into talking points.
		On line one is about bringing manufacturing jobs back to the U.S. and pointing to trade imbalance, say with China.
		I've, in the course of my job, had to visit manufacturing companies in China, and I can guarantee you that U.S. workers would not want to work under those conditions or get the pay that they get.
		So that's number one.
		Number two, you know, the question of why Europeans and other countries don't buy U.S. cars.
		It's because we got gas.
		We got petroleum in the ground.
		We build gas guzzlers.
		They're generally cheaper to manufacture.
joel skousen ▲ ● ▼		Certainly pickup trucks are cheaper to manufacture than a really tiny car with high-tech engine and stuff like that.
unidentified		So we don't build cars in the U.S. that are attractive to people in countries that don't have cheap gas.
		And in fact, U.S. car companies opened European car companies just to build the cars that Europeans are willing to buy.
		That's what's really going on there.
		And I think it's been misrepresented.
		That's all I have to say.
		Thanks a lot.
		And thank you to all the people that call me.
		I love to listen to you guys, even the ones I disagree with.
		I'd love to sit down and have a beer with a few of you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Well, thanks for listening, and thanks for keeping an open mind, John.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We'll go to Charlie in Superior, Wisconsin, line for Republicans.
unidentified		Hi, Charlie.
		Good morning.
		It's really hard for me to dwindle down my top concern for the U.S.
		But if I were to name just a few, I would say, first of all, national relations.
		I feel like the whole notion that we're going to annex Greenland and, you know, the way we're reacting to the war in Ukraine and the war in Gaza, as a Republican who voted for Trump to erase some of the Biden stuff, it's very, I was very disappointed with what I saw this late in the game.
		And if I were to give a second one, I would say the economy.
		These recent tariffs that Trump has planned to impose, I don't agree with them, to say the least.
		And I just want to make it a point that sooner or later, we're going to be, we're going to, when we go to vote, we probably, our vote is probably going to be along different party lines, and I think that's okay.
		I mean, I live in Wisconsin, and as a Trump voter, I voted for Susan Crawford personally because I didn't want any influence from Elon Musk to be in the Wisconsin Supreme Court.
		So I will say just on these next midterms, come the next presidential election, just vote for, vote for, we share more policy ideas than we think, so just vote for whoever will bring us back to normalcy, bring us back to normal America.
		In fact, I know that across the bridge in Minnesota, there's a Democratic candidate for the U.S. Senate.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Dan in North Bend, Oregon, Line for Democrats.
		Hi, Dan.
		Dan, are you there?
unidentified		Yes, hello.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Dan.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'd like to first thank you for the show.
		It's very informational to hear all sides' views.
		I would like to address that I have a question about folks who have been laid off by the Doge cuts.
		I think they can apply for and receive their unemployment, but the folks who've been fired with Tony Poor performance reviews, I think they are just completely unable to receive anything unfairly.
		And I just wonder if other people share that view of what has happened.
		And I'd like to just go straight to my top concern.
		I'm a disabled person who receives less than half of what is considered the poverty level to survive.
		And for 15 years, I've managed to keep a roof over my head.
		And if I lose my Social Security disability, I'm living in a 22-year-old car with a serious fluid leak on the exhaust.
		I'm not too happy with the way our government is handling things, especially since there seems to have been a lot of turn-the-blind eye gerrymandering on the Republican side.
		And I'm so sad that to have to have seen that and know that it goes on.
		And my hope is that somehow they can find their hearts, those involved on both sides of the aisle, to do the right thing for the American people.
		And I'm not talking about the wealthy ones it doesn't matter for.
		I'm talking about like people like me.
		Okay, that's all I had to say.
		And thank you so much.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Dan in Oregon.
		Dan talking about Social Security being his top concern.
		That was the top concern for 52% of Americans in Gallup's new polling key issues and 52% finding it's a great deal of concern for them.
		24% saying it's a fair amount.
		They have a fair concern about it.
		While 16% say only a little, 8% say not at all.
		It was during a recent confirmation hearing for President Trump's nominee to head the Social Security Administration, Frank Bizignano, who answered questions about concerns over potential cuts to Social Security.
		Here's that clip.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		Elon Musk has referred to Social Security as a Ponzi scheme.
		That's in quotes.
		And he recently called for cutting up to $700 billion from Social Security and Medicare.
		That could mean cutting one-third of these programs.
		Social Security operates, as you know, on simple math.
		To achieve a one-third cut, you'd either have to take away benefits for one-third of the people currently receiving them or cut the payments that they're getting by one-third.
		So, Mr. Bisignano, which is it?
		Are you going to throw one-third of the people off of the program or cut their benefits by a third?
unidentified		Neither.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		That's good to hear.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		So, if the president and the Congress decide to cut these benefits, you're going to stand up for the beneficiaries.
unidentified		Well, if Congress decides, I mean, ultimately, these decisions get done in the Senate Finance Committee, it's a collaboration.
frank bisignano ▲ ● ▼		It's not the Commissioner's job to make that decision.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		So, do you oppose cutting one-third of Social Security benefits?
unidentified		I think the President has made it very clear that he has no objective, and he's made it very clear to cut any benefits from Social Security.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		Yet he has Elon Musk, who, until he was told he couldn't buy a court, running rampant through Social Security, and he's making, he's laying off staff and making it much more difficult for people to get benefits.
		That's inconsistent with the President's pledge.
		If you are confirmed, will you commit to stand up to Elon Musk and Doge and stop them from cutting one-third of Social Security benefits, which Musk has already said he wants to do?
unidentified		Well, I've worked for Tony Terciano.
		I've worked for Jamie Diamond.
		I've worked for Henry Kravitz.
		I've worked for Sandy Weill.
		I've worked with them.
frank bisignano ▲ ● ▼		I have the ability to lead the agency in the manner that this Senate Finance Committee wants me to do that.
unidentified		And I don't know of any thought that I have about cutting one-third of the benefits of Americans or even entertaining anything of that sort.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		Well, I appreciate that.
maggie hassan ▲ ● ▼		I think I will echo the ranking members' request that we get a commitment from you, that you will keep Doge out of Social Security, because one of the things we're seeing since this administration took over is steps that are making it harder and harder for people to apply for benefits, get benefits, and really working to slow things down, which is one way, of course, of slowing benefits, slowing benefit payments, and reducing costs at the expense of beneficiaries.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Just about 15 minutes left in this first hour, asking you for your top concern for the U.S. Let's talk with Ken and Littleneck, New York, Line for Independence.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Ken.
unidentified		Mayor.
		I recently heard on C-SPAN that only Congress has the right to establish tariffs, not individual people like the President.
		So given that he's responsible for crashing the Dow 6,000 points in a couple of days, why is no one following up on that?
		It seems to me that it's clearly illegal that he's doing that.
		Why is no one doing anything about it or even talking about it?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Ken, you said you heard that on C-SPAN G-member the event or who said it?
unidentified		Not exactly, no, but I distinctly remember that they pointed that out.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Ken in New York.
		Kevin, Princeton, Indiana, line for Republicans.
		Hi, Kevin.
unidentified		Yeah, the previous caller is exactly why I'm calling.
		And my biggest top concern for the U.S. is the uninformed group of individuals in this country that really do not understand what is going on.
		And they are reactionary.
		They're emotional.
		They have no basis of understanding of economics or the world order that's been established.
		You know, real leadership, in my opinion, is disruptive.
		And status quo that we've had for years is destroying this nation a little bit.
		I say a little bit, a lot, $2 trillion a year in deficits.
		It's little bitty knife cuts that are destroying us a little bit at a time.
		And, you know, these Democrat socialists, they just have enough If they would have enough interest in the American people to get behind this president and his policies, I think we can right the wrongs created by the global socialists and both parties over the last 50 years.
		You know, this global socialism has devastated our middle class, in my opinion, in the U.S.
		It's been nothing more than redistribution on a global scale.
		And if the U.S. taxpayer and consumer have been providing the world, in my opinion, a hand up, now the world must stand on their own as far as I'm concerned.
		We have no choice as a nation.
		If things don't get straightened out in the next four years, this experiment in self-governing is over and the world will be entering another dark age.
		I think it's preordained.
		It's going to happen.
		We can't sustain this type of debt.
		We have, in my opinion, less than 10 years as a nation before it collapses.
		If things aren't fixed socially and financially in this country, in the next four years, this system will collapse.
		And then all of these people that are complaining, that are uninformed about what is going on, are going to find that all their social programs, all their benefits, all their health care, all of that is going to go away and they're going to be destitute.
		So, yes.
		Kevin, take a look at the pressure.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Kevin, Congress right now is working on the budget, the next budget bill.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		How do you feel about what's in the bill and what the Senate just passed with the tax provisions, extension for tax provisions, things like that?
unidentified		Unfortunately, I can't answer your question because I haven't actually dove into the bill itself, but I can tell you that the basic premises of lower taxes for the American people are exactly what we need.
		We need people to have their own money and be able to spend it.
		They spend it better than the government.
		And that will help sustain our economy and offset some of these tariffs.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Kevin in Indiana.
		And Kevin mentioned tariffs there at the end.
		This in today's New York Times business section, it's a chart showing how much importers will face with the new cost, with the imposed new tariffs.
		It says it will cost an additional $714 billion to bring shoes, TVs, and all other imports into the United States.
		A new analysis of trade data shows as President Trump enacts an expensive wave of tariffs on America's biggest trading partners.
		It says in many cases, new tariffs are being placed on top of other new tariffs, part of one of the most aggressive plan American trade policies in a century.
		If the new tariff rates applied to everything the United States imported last year, the combined cost and tariffs to bring in all of those goods would be roughly 10 times what companies paid in 2024, according to a calculation from Trade Partnership Worldwide, an economic research firm in Washington.
		You can see the chart.
		It was $78 billion last year, and it is estimated $792 billion.
		That's including $78 billion from those existing $84, an additional $84 billion.
		For China, $61 billion.
		For Mexico, $42 billion.
		For Canada, $61 billion just for autos alone, $52 billion for autumn, bringing in steel and aluminum, and $413 billion in reciprocal tariffs.
		That's what President Trump just announced on Wednesday.
		That's the largest portion at $413 billion.
		Let's talk with Pete in Massachusetts, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Pete.
unidentified		Hi.
		My list is so exhaustive.
		I hope you'll give me a couple minutes.
		You know, top concerns.
		Well, my retirement, the incompetence of this administration, whether it starts with the ringleader, but Elon Musk, RFK Jr., excess.
		Rubio is a little weasel on the foreign stage.
		So those are some of my concerns.
		But, you know, obviously that everything he proposes is unconstitutional.
		I mean, the guy just called the tariffs, those have to be set by Congress.
		And there are bills pending right now that are trying to make it illegal that it has to be done by Congress.
		But Congress is totally spineless when it comes to standing up to this guy.
		Also, yesterday, for all you MAGA vets, how about he's playing golf while we have the dignified return of the bodies for American soldiers at Dover, Delaware?
		How does that grab you this Saturday morning?
		But so I don't know.
		I could go on.
		My list is so exhaustive, but this.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We'll leave it there, Pete.
		We're short on time.
		We'll get some other voices in.
		Edward, Keyport, New Jersey, line for independence.
		Hi, Edward.
unidentified		There's a POTUS being so.
		Thank you, Mayor.
		Anyways, my concern is a POTUS being so unhinged that he's using the word rape in a public address talking about our allies.
		I didn't feel raped when I could go to the store and get choose between a wine for $15 from Argentina, South Africa, or Sardinia, or 10 pounds of rice for 15 bucks from Vietnam.
		The main power in America came from letting populist nations use their cheap labor and make goods for us cheaply.
		And then we would brain drain those people.
		The top would come here, and we would have our high-tech sectors that we would profit from from goods and services.
		And my last concern is for all the restaurants and the bars and et cetera that I'm not going to go to because I refuse to support this regime in this nutcase.
		And I'm going to save my money and I'm going to travel outside the United States and buy all the luxury goods that I like.
		So good luck, America.
		Thank you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Edward in New Jersey, Wesley in Cleveland, Texas, line for Republicans.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Wesley.
unidentified		How are you doing, man?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Doing well, Wesley.
unidentified		My concern is, can you hear me?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yes, go ahead.
unidentified		My concern is I'm on Social Security.
		I live on $1,200 a month.
		I've got food stamps, $23 a month.
		I get my food stamps in the middle of the month, but what's $23 going to do?
		Nothing.
		Now, I understand the deficit.
		I understand that it's got to be fixed.
		It's got to be fixed soon, or we're not going to be around to worry about it getting fixed.
		But the problem I've got is with all these tariffs and everything going up, my Social Security, I'm barely eating now.
		And now they're talking about cutting Social Security.
		If I had all the money in the world, I wouldn't worry about Social Security either.
		But I don't have all the money in the world.
		I'm one of the poor people in this world that made this nation what it is.
		And the Democrats have gone and carried it to hell.
		Now, the first time Trump was in office, the first thing out of Nancy Pelosi's mouth is, well, time to start the impeachment process.
		She didn't say, congratulations, President.
		Time to start the impeachment process.
		And the whole time he was in office, first time, all he did was fight them.
		They didn't work with him one bit.
		Now he's in office.
		He's mad.
		He's taking it out on them.
		He's taking it out on us because of it.
		Now, I understand the tariffs, but you've got to understand that the people in the United States can't starve to death while everything's getting turned around.
		If he can't help us with a little bit more food stamp, a little bit more Social Security, then what's the native of all this going on?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Wesley, can I ask you a question?
unidentified		Yes, ma'am.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		How long have you been on benefits and how have they changed over time?
unidentified		I've been on Social Security since I was 62.
		I'm 71.
		I started out at $760.
		Now I'm up to $1,230.
		Now, everything's going up, up, up, up.
		Every time I go to the grocery store, I come out with a list.
		I have chickens to where I can have my own eggs.
		I have a garden where I can try to eat what I can grow.
		But if I can't afford to buy the plants or fertilizer or the water to tend it or the feed to feed my chickens, I'm fighting a losing battle.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Now it's Wesley in Cleveland, Texas.
		Let's talk with David in Florida, line for Democrats.
		Hi, David.
unidentified		Hi.
		Good morning.
		I'm thrilled to speak to you this morning.
		I was just going to say, you know, the thing that is really unsettling to me is you still have callers calling and saying, well, let's give Trump a chance.
		These Democrats, they should just back off or they did all these wrong things.
		People, we're witnessing this in real time.
		He is destroying, deliberately destroying our economy, as well as it's like aligning with our enemies and angering our allies.
		And so what he's doing right now is not just this tariff thing.
		It is injuring our academic institutions, our hospitals, our economy, everything about capitalism is under attack because of Trump.
		And what he's going to do next is pivot.
		Forbes was on one of these shows talking about, oh, we just have to increase the tax cuts for the wealthy people.
		It is insanity to think that you can complain about the debt and not think about these billionaires.
		We have hundreds of billionaires in the United States.
		One billion dollars is $1,000 million.
		Bezos Musk, they could use $1 billion annually and give it to their employees for pensions and health care, but they don't because they are hoarding wealth.
		And so the thing that is frightening to me is that you still have people calling in and saying, I'll take it.
		It'll be okay.
		Are you kidding me?
		You're the people who he's going to hurt, not me.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was David in Florida.
		And our last call in this hour is Kathy, Iowa, line for independence.
		Hi, Kathy.
unidentified		Hi, thank you for taking my call.
		I am an independent.
		I vote for Republican or Democrat, whoever has better policies.
		I will say that I do tend to agree with the last caller more than the gentleman who's growing his own food and depending on Social Security and thinking Trump's going to save the world at this point.
		I am mortified at how we look on the world stage, but we are, he is tearing our country apart.
		And the misinformation out there about what is happening with some people and them continuing to stand behind it and say, okay, please do take away my benefits and give them to the richest people.
		If those rich people wouldn't be living here if the tax did not benefit them, why do they not live in Europe or other places?
		Because they would pay taxes and there's better distribution of that.
		We need to have our Social Security benefits from somewhere.
		People have paid into those for their entire lives.
		They are not entitlements.
		You are getting something back.
		It was an investment in your future.
		And sadly, people are now willing to say, well, no, if those billionaires, they need money to be able to run their businesses.
		They do not need that much money.
		We have the mindset in this country has changed to a degree that is frightening.
		And now we have voted in someone who says he doesn't want to leave after this term.
		That scares the hell out of me.
		We are heading to dictatorship and he's crashing our economy in order to get us there.
		And, you know, every step along the way has followed Project 2025.
		Wake up, people.
		Wake up.
		You need to start standing up for your rights.
		Do not lay down and take this.
		Don't go say, I'm going to grow food in my backyard with my $1,000 check and give up anything, give up what you have so somebody else who already has lots of money can take more.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Kathy in Iowa.
		Our last call for this hour next on Washington Journal, writers correspondent David Sheperson will join us to discuss the auto industry and President Trump's tariffs.
		And later in the program, Operation Hope founder and CEO John Hope Bryant discusses his organization's efforts to increase financial literacy.
		we'll be right back.
unidentified		American History TV, exploring the people and events that tell the American story.
		This weekend, the Virginia 250 Commission commemorates the March 1775 speech by Patrick Henry, where he spoke his famous words, give me liberty or give me death.
		Event speakers include Virginia Republican Governor Glenn Youngkin, filmmaker Ken Burns, and VA 250 National Honorary Chair Carly Fiorina.
		Author Bruce Dorsey, with his book, Murder in a Mill Town, talks about an 1832 murder of a young pregnant woman in New England that captivated the country.
		Then watch American History TV series First 100 Days as we look at the start of presidential terms.
		This week, we focus on the early months of President Barack Obama's first term in 2009, including an $800 billion economic stimulus package and plans to close the Guantanamo Bay Detention Center in Cuba.
		On Lectures in History, University of Dallas history professor Susan Hansen on the legacy and cultural importance of the 1918 Pulitzer Prize-winning autobiography, The Education of Henry Adams.
		The author is a descendant of President John Adams.
		Exploring the American story, watch American History TV every weekend and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at c-span.org slash history.
		Book TV every Sunday on C-SPAN 2 features leading authors discussing their latest nonfiction books.
		Here's a look at what's coming up this weekend.
		At 7.30 p.m. Eastern, Vanda Kreft talks about the founding, graduates, and impact of the Catherine Gibbs School, which trained women for executive secretary positions during the early and mid-20th century in her book, Expect Great Things.
		Then at 8 p.m. Eastern, Arkansas Republican Senator Tom Cotton, author of Seven Things You Can't Say About China, argues that China poses a significant threat and that major American institutions refuse to talk about it.
		And at 10 p.m. Eastern on Afterwards, New York Times investigative journalist David Enrich argues the rich and powerful are using free speech laws to suppress dissent with his book, Murder the Truth.
		He's interviewed by author and George Washington Law School professor Mary Ann Franks.
		Watch Book TV every Sunday on C-SPAN2 and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at booktv.org.
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		Scan the code or visit c-spanshop.org during our cherry blossom sale.
		Washington Journal continues.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Joining us now to discuss President Trump's tariffs and the auto industry is David Shepardson, correspondent with Reuters.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		David, welcome back to the program.
unidentified		Thanks for having me.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Been with us many times and we always appreciate it.
unidentified		Thanks.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		President Trump did sign an executive order levying a 25% tariff on all cars and light duty trucks imported to the U.S. Tell us how much of an impact that's going to have.
unidentified		It's going to be a big impact, right?
		And it's super complicated, right?
		Because first you've got the steel and aluminum tariffs, the 25% that are already impacting the auto sector.
		And then you have the tariffs that first kicked in on vehicles imported from Mexico and Canada.
		So that took place about a month ago, but President Trump exempted USMCA compliant vehicles, meaning vehicles that comply with the trade rules from the trade deal that replaced NAFTA signed during his first term.
		So that means vehicles that have a certain amount of content from North America, at least 40 to 45% of the materials were produced by workers making $16 an hour.
		The new tariffs that took effect this week are 25% tariffs on vehicles all across the globe.
		And so now you have this two-tier tariff regime on autos that both affects cars from outside the U.S. and as well as the tariffs from North America.
		And then you have a third bucket of vehicles, which actually is getting hit by a couple different tariffs, right?
		So take a vehicle in Mexico.
		For example, it's two Infiniti SUVs that Nissan announced this week would no longer be imported to the U.S.
		Those are getting hit by the 25% fentanyl tariff that took effect about a month ago, as well as the new tariff.
		So you'll have about a 52% total tariff on those vehicles.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		And one of the things to note is that the 25% tariffs are on any vehicle not assembled in the U.S. How many cars are actually assembled in the U.S.?
unidentified		So it's about half and half.
		So the United States buys and produces about 16 million vehicles a year.
		Sorry, buys 16 million.
		About 8 million of those are produced in the United States, 8 million outside.
		Of that total, about 4 million are produced in Mexico and Canada.
		The other 4 million come from South Korea, Canada, the European Union.
		So this is going to be a major disruption to the industry.
		And for U.S. vehicles, these U.S. MCA-compliant vehicles, they'll be able to deduct the value of the U.S. parts.
		So we'll reduce that 25% tariff somewhat, but it will still have a significant impact.
		The experts anticipate roughly $4,500 per vehicle once the existing inventory sells off.
		So right now, you're still seeing some discounts on vehicles.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		So that was my next question.
		Ultimately, tariffs are about the consumer and what happens.
		If somebody was getting ready to purchase a new car, maybe researching and looking around, how much time could they have?
		When could we see that existing inventory be depleted and those tariffs kick in?
unidentified		So we already saw a big jump in sales just before the tariffs took effect, right?
		I think we saw maybe 100,000 more vehicles or some estimates were purchased at the end of March.
		So auto companies did have a better month than they had thought.
		So a lot of companies are offering discounts or promising not to raise prices.
		Ford and Sollantis are offering employee prices through the month of April at least.
		So I think, again, for certain very popular models, this might not last as long.
		But for the month of April, I think you should be able to get the vehicle you want without seeing a lot of price hikes.
		But again, as time goes on, I think dealers are going to be less likely to offer discounts, the same level of discounts that you might have gotten before, given that we all know what's coming, right?
		Higher prices, higher tariffs, as that inventory starts to run out.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We'll share our audience some graphics that give a better idea of the tariffs.
		10%, these are Trump's tariff plan.
		10% tariff on nearly all imports that went into, that goes into effect today.
		Higher reciprocal tariffs for China, 34%, Japan, 24%, and the EU, 20%, among other countries.
		That will take place.
		Those will go into effects next Wednesday.
		The 25% tariff on imported vehicles, that went into effect April 3rd, so this week.
		25% tariff on all steel and aluminum imports.
		That went into effect in March, and that's something that you also mentioned was going to be affecting the auto industry.
		And also a 20% tax on Chinese imports.
		That was previously announced in March, which means China now faces a total tariff rate of 54%.
		You have a recent article on Reuters, the headline, U.S. Senators Seek to Reign in Trump Tariff Authority.
		Does President Trump have the authority to put these tariffs in effect?
unidentified		So the short answer is yes.
		The question is how long, right?
		So the president is invoking emergency authority.
		He's declaring a national emergency, and in the case of cars, is relying principally on a 2019 report that was created during his first term under this section of the trade law called 232.
		And he is saying that the fact that the United States imports about 8 million vehicles a year is a national security risk because of the event of a war, that, say, World War II, what happened?
		The United States quickly changed its auto plants to build tanks, airplane engines, other armaments for the war effort.
		Given that the United States is importing a sizable number of vehicles, its industrial footprint is much smaller than it was proportionally, say, during World War II.
		So, you know, so as a result of that, it's clear under the law, he has the authority.
		The question is, how long can these tariffs take effect?
		And so under the other emergency authorities called IEPA, right, there are a lot of people who argue that this is temporary, that he's only allowed to do it for 150 days and there has to be a specific emergency and that they're not supposed to be a permanent change in the tariff regime.
		And so I do think there's a likelihood that you'll see more lawsuits.
		We've already seen one lawsuit about the tariffs.
		And what this proposal would say is would return the power of tariffs expressly to Congress.
		It's in the Constitution.
		Congress has the power to levy tariffs.
		This bill, which is getting, has gotten four or five Republican senators already, would say the tariffs would expire in 60 days absent an affirmative approval of Congress.
		Now, obviously it would take two-thirds of both houses to overturn a presidential veto, and Trump's, you would think, not going to sign a bill that would constrain his own authority.
		But I do think it's sending a message that a lot of Republicans want President Trump to get to a deal, right?
		Do you not want these tariffs to be in place permanently given the huge price hikes you would see over time versus making this into our new way of life where everything's 10% minimum, as you said, and things like everything from China would be 54%.
		Obviously, President Trump views these as a long-term way to prod American manufacturers to produce more goods in the United States.
		The question is, is he, the Republican Party, and others willing to tolerate the short-term pain, short-to-medium-term pain, of how long it would take to actually get these goods and the supply chains moved to the United States.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		David Shepardson, Reuters correspondent, is our guest for the next 35 minutes or so.
		If you have a question or comment for him, you can start calling in now.
		The Lions Republicans, 202-748-8001.
		Democrats, 202-748-8000, 8,000.
		And Independents, 202-748-8,002.
		David, on Thursday, Canadian Prime Minister Mark Carney announced his country will impose a 25% tariff on U.S. vehicles.
		We want to show you that announcement.
		We'll talk about it on the other side.
mark carney ▲ ● ▼		Canada will respond to the U.S. auto tariffs.
		And today I'm announcing that the government of Canada will be responding by matching the U.S. approach, by matching the U.S. approach, with 25% tariffs on all vehicles imported from the United States that are not compliant with CUSMA, our North American Free Trade Agreement, and on the non-Canadian content of CUSMA-compliant vehicles from the United States as well.
		Our tariffs, though, unlike the U.S. tariffs, will not affect auto parts because we know the benefits of our integrated production system.
		And they will also not affect vehicle content from Mexico, who is respecting the CUSMA agreement.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		How is that going to, that Canadian tariff on U.S. vehicles, how is that going to impact the American auto industry?
unidentified		Well, it was really interesting, right?
		Because as you heard the Prime Minister say, he's carving out Canadian auto parts, right?
		And that's one of the hugely important things, right?
		Auto parts production, right there.
		In Michigan, there are a thousand auto parts suppliers, significant ones.
		In Canada, the U.S. relies intensely on those auto parts companies.
		So he doesn't want to do anything that would further incentivize American auto companies to more quickly shift production of parts from Canada to the United States.
		Now, it's interesting.
		I think it's about 8% of vehicles that are not compliant.
		And it's basically aiming to punish companies that have the least footprint in Canada, United States, the ones that are not compliant, the ones that are more bringing things from South Korea, Japan, the EU, and not meeting those value requirements.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		And when could the auto industry see the impacts?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		When could the American auto industry see the impacts of those Canadian tariffs?
unidentified		I think almost immediately.
		I don't know if it's not in effect now, it will be effect very soon.
		And again, I think it's a similar cadence, right?
		People have inventory, but you will see, like you saw in the case of Nissan, quick companies parking vehicles, not bringing them in, and taking immediate steps because these are very expensive.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk with some callers.
		We'll start with Robert in Waldorf, Maryland, Line for Independence.
		Hi, Robert.
unidentified		Good morning, ma'am.
unidentified		How are you doing?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We're doing well.
unidentified		Okay.
		Look, the media, and since this whole thing is broke, I don't think it's fair to just talk about the tariffs that the president is imposing on these countries.
		They never mentioned the tariffs that these countries have been posing on us for the past 30 to 40 years.
		I mean, Trump's basic business mindset is to make it cost-effective to bring these jobs back to the United States.
		The politicians and all these CEOs of these corporations have moved all these jobs away to make it cost-effective for them to be more profitable to screw over the American worker.
		And that's what they've done over the years.
		These politicians have sold their vote to allow these people to impose all these tariffs on us.
		They've allowed China to take all of our jobs.
		They've allowed China to take all of our products.
		And what Trump is doing is just pure, straight-up business that makes it cost-effective for these companies to move their business here to make it profitable for them to do it.
		If they want to keep them overseas, it will not be profitable.
		So for the media to sit here and say Trump's evil, let's mention the tariffs that China's put on us, that Europe has put on us.
		Those numbers, look at those tariffs.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Okay, got your point.
		Got your point, Robert.
		We'll get a response from Dave.
unidentified		I think the caller really accurately sums up President Trump's position, and there's a lot of validity to this argument.
		It's true that with the ascension of China to the WTO and NAFTA and USMCA, we saw a significant shift of auto production, especially auto parts production, to lower-cost countries, notably Mexico, and then obviously China and other countries in Asia.
		And so, and the caller's correct that the United States imports about half of its vehicles.
		This is the most profitable auto market in the world, and there are very few markets that have the same level of openness that the United States does.
		And certainly, many of the countries have significant non-tariff barriers as well as some tariffs to U.S. vehicles.
		Now, it's worth mentioning: the United States has a 25% pickup truck tariff that has protected the United States market for more than 60 years.
		It's called the chicken tax.
		It was put in place temporarily in the 60s in response to West Germany putting taxes on our frozen chicken, and it's still there to this day.
		But I do think the fundamental question here is President Trump's goal is, as the caller said, to more level the playing field and to make it more economically incentivize American companies, auto parts, and manufacturers to build their vehicles here.
		The question is, it will be more expensive, and it will take a long time to move factories, potentially two, three, four years.
		Is the White House willing to tolerate significant pain, lower sales, higher costs, economic disruption for this longer-term goal of moving more production here?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Nancy, Bowling Green, Kentucky, Line for Democrats.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Nancy.
unidentified		Hey, good morning.
unidentified		How are y'all?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We're doing well, Nancy.
unidentified		Okay, great.
		No, my question is: I'm 65.
		When this began, I worked for a company called Fruit of the Loom.
		And we were getting, they were manufacturing stuff in, you know, like El Salvador.
		And we were cutting out the El Salvador label and sewing in a made in the USA.
		And these were Army contracts because we were making t-shirts for the United States Army.
		So I'm a product of this long ago.
		I could see this coming that the people that wanted to make the monies, I mean, they've already made money, you know, doing this outside the country years ago.
		Now, Mr. Trump is trying to give them more money with the tax bracket.
		And when I hear that Social Security is an entitlement, that was my 401k, the Social Security was, but it was the FICA.
		I was only making minimum wage, so I didn't invest.
		I didn't take more money out to invest in anything.
		I was barely making it as is.
		And now that I've gotten older, I'm making even less.
		So I always thought that there would be a better time where you could maybe get ahead and move ahead.
		But the older I get, the more I know that's not never going to happen.
		Well, again, I think this caller makes some really good points about the fact that the dichotomy is American consumers benefit from these low-cost consumer goods, right?
		We don't make, we only make 2% of the clothes that we use in this country.
		You know, sneakers, televisions, right?
		You know, toys.
		You mentioned fruit of the loom.
		So the question is, at one point in the United States, about 40% of jobs, maybe 35, 40, 50 years ago, were manufacturing jobs.
		Say that number is like 8% or 9%, right?
		So our economy has shifted dramatically away from producing goods.
		And there have been many sectors of the economy, many areas of the country that saw substantial declines in employment.
		Certainly Michigan is an example, my home state, of where there was an enormous economic disruption and you saw a huge number of jobs go away.
		The question is now: are we willing to pay much more for these goods if they're shifted here, right?
		And if a car was built in the United States, as AutoCommittee pointed out to the Commerce Secretary, it might cost three, four, or five times as much as it does here.
		That's separate from this issue of tariffs, which are going to raise prices.
		So how do you thread the needle between finding ways to incentivize companies to build more here while also not overly increasing American prices?
		And so it's a hard balancing act, whether you're President Trump, Democrats, and Congress.
		And I think that there's still left to be determined where it all shakes out.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Another headline of yours, Stellan, is to temporarily lay off 900 U.S. workers as tariffs bite.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Tell us what temporary means and how others in the auto industry are reacting.
unidentified		This is a really interesting anecdote because it got a ton of attention because it was the first example of a negative impact on American workers, right?
		So because of these 25% tariffs that took effect, Stellantis, which used to be Chrysler, used to be Fiat Chrysler.
		This is a company that's been bought and sold multiple times at one time.
		Daimler owned it.
		It was called Daimler Chrysler.
		That's off the subject.
		So Stellantis decided to temporarily close the plant in Windsor, Ontario, just across the river from Detroit, that makes minivans for a few weeks, as well as a plant in Mexico because of the tariffs.
		And as a result, it decided to temporarily lay off 900 workers at five transmission other plants that provide parts for those factories.
		And so it's a good example of how the integrated supply chain, and a lot of Democrats said, say, see on day one, the Trump tariffs are hurting American workers.
		That's certainly true.
		And will at least be, Stellantis has said, as long as those two plants are closed, we don't, I mean, and this two to four week period could be extended.
		On the other side of the ledger, you have Nissan, which we talked about earlier about stopping the infinities.
		Well, they had planned to go from one, so from two to one shifts in Smyrna, Tennessee, building the Nissan rogue, and then take or backfill the need for rogues with rogue SUVs produced in Japan.
		Well, as a result of this, they're not going to do that.
		They're going to keep those two shifts in place.
		Now, a lot of workers already accept early buyouts.
		It's not clear what the employment impact of that is.
		But I think the big thing to remember is there's no easy answers as winners and losers, and the economic disruption of this is going to be way more complicated than just tariffs equals more U.S. manufacturing.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Rick in Hayward, Wisconsin, Line for Independence.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Rick.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I don't know.
		This is kind of a complex subject, and I'm for the workers and all that stuff.
		But my message is to Ford.
		I've never owned a foreign vehicle.
		I don't know much about Nissan, but, you know, whatever's going to be the affordable vehicle.
		My question is this.
		Why do we have a backup?
		Every vehicle has a backup camera, a dashboard full of who knows what technology.
		Isn't there, what's the point of making all that stuff?
		Why don't they make a vehicle that doesn't have a backup camera and power windows and all these things?
		I don't need any of that.
		I'm on my third Ford F-150 since the late 90s, probably.
		And fortunately for me, I was able to buy, you know, two of them new.
		The one I have now is getting very old, but I can't afford a $50,000 vehicle.
		There's no way.
		So I wonder what you have to say about that, the technology aspect of it and how much that's costing.
		Thank you.
		Perfect question.
		So first on your auto safety question, because I also cover that.
		So that was mandated by Congress, something called the Cameron-Gill-Branson Act, that because a little boy was killed by a driver backing up in a driveway, mandating these backup cameras to try to reduce deaths of pedestrians, especially children and senior citizens, you know, who are slower and shorter and aren't able to be seen as well, especially from drivers like the F-150.
		If you're sitting up a lot higher, it's harder to see a smaller child behind a car.
		So it is mandated in all vehicles.
		In terms of pricing, you're absolutely right.
		The average new car price is $47,000 a year.
		The average income of a new car buyer is, I think, $115,000 a year family income.
		It's almost twice the median family income.
		So affordability of vehicles is a very big issue.
		And it does, it is a question here.
		And one of the reasons that the car companies are very nervous is not just that those new, people who can afford to buy a new car won't be able to pay that extra money, but it's about the perception of your wealth.
		If your 401k is going down, even though you're not going to spend that money for 10, 20, 30 years, you feel less wealthy, you might be more reluctant to buy that vehicle.
		And as a result, and again, this goes to tariffs.
		The other issue is people are going to put off buying a new car if they can, right?
		So I don't get six more months, a year out of my old clunker.
		I don't know.
		I'll get it repaired.
		And so as a result, you're going to see fewer used cars entering the market.
		I mean, the day the tariffs got announced, Hertz's stock price went up about 20% because they sit on such a big, you know, big inventory of used cars.
		And so this could have downstream effects.
		Fewer used cars equals higher used car prices, equals fewer prices for replacement parts, higher prices for insurance, for your repairs.
		So the entire ecosystem of autos could see a dramatic impact in these tariffs, not just at the new car lot.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk with Chris Stowe, Massachusetts, Line for Republicans.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Chris.
unidentified		Hey, how's it going?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We're doing well, Chris.
unidentified		Sure.
		Awesome.
		So what are we talking about today?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We'll go to Deborah in New York, Line for Democrats.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Deborah.
unidentified		Hi.
		My concern is that, you know, with these tariffs going on, the market going down, I am retired.
		I live on Social Security and a small IRA, which probably after this week is non-existent.
		But how does somebody my age who was looking at, okay, I can make it, all of a sudden, you've turned this into, and I will hang up as soon as I finish saying this, where I don't know where my money's going to, you know, how far my money's going to go.
		I know the price of tomatoes went up 20 cents in one day at my local grocery store.
		And so I mean, you know, what do we just keep taking things out of our diets?
		Is maybe the government going to come out with some ways for us to, you know, okay, well, if you're on a limited budget, eat, you know, dirt or something like that.
		I don't know.
		I'm going to hang up and let you respond.
		Thank you.
		Well, I've got three kids, so I am certainly very cognizant of the grocery prices.
		I spend a lot of, our family spends a lot of money on groceries too.
		And your caller's right.
		One of the first impacts are going to be the price of produce, you know, tomatoes, you know, bananas, avocados, coffee, you know, other vegetables.
		We don't produce enough, especially in the winter months in the United States.
		So there will be very fast impacts.
		And obviously there's not a lot people can do.
		I mean, if you want fresh produce, people can buy things ahead.
		And I do think we are seeing Costco's, Walmarts, and others are reporting some level of people trying to buy non-perishable goods ahead of time that are concerned about the prices.
		But long-term, that's the thing.
		There's a lot of uncertainty.
		We don't know are these tariffs going to stick, right?
		And if they do, if there's a 10% tariff across the board, right, for all countries and higher in some places, there's certainly going to be higher prices people are going to pay.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Tom in Havertown, Pennsylvania, Line for Independence.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Tom.
unidentified		Good morning.
		My point is that there was a time for protective tariffs in the United States.
		And we had industry to protect back in, let's say, the late 70s, 1980s, when all of the manufacturing started disappearing from the United States.
		And I believe it was President Reagan who said we could become more of a service economy than a manufacturing economy, and that that would be fine.
		And it wasn't fine.
		And it's the mess that we're in now.
		But now is not the time because especially the way that these tariffs are being rolled out.
		And Peter Navarro was on TV saying this is not for negotiation.
		These are permanent tariffs that are not going to go away.
		And a half hour later, the president said, well, let's see what China says they're bringing to the table.
		And maybe we can negotiate if it's something really good.
		That kind of chaos and mixed messaging is going to make any responsible CEO unwilling to invest the kind of money and time it takes to rebuild infrastructure for manufacturing in the United States back, because it would be stupid to invest the planning and the money if these
		tariffs are not permanent and going to be bankable.
		I think the caller hits on a good point.
		So auto companies want certainty, right?
		They want to know what the rules of the road are.
		And we've had in recent years sort of this shifting back and forth beyond tariffs.
		And I think this is right, that before companies are going to invest, they want to know what the tariff landscape is, but also about the environment, right?
		So right now, the Congress is considering repealing the California waiver, which is something the Biden administration gave them to allow them to impose a requirement that by 2035, about a dozen states want to ban internal combustion engine-only vehicles, right?
		We have electric, hydrogen, and plug-in hybrid.
		They've got at least 50 miles of battery power range alone.
		So there's a push in Congress to repeal those now.
		It's not clear if they'll be able to or whether it's legal given the rules under the CRA.
		But I do think if auto companies get more certainty about where we're going in terms of electric vehicle policy, you could see some shift in production, maybe increasing some of the internal combustion production in the United States.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		The current average, we heard a caller earlier talk about he doesn't have $50,000 to spend on a new vehicle.
		That's about right.
		The average cost of a new vehicle is $48,000.
		Bank of America estimates that the tariffs could cause those prices to go up as much as $10,000.
		Do we know if the automakers would pass everything on to the consumer?
		Is there any hope?
unidentified		I think the answer is no, not all of it, probably, because this is a hyper-competitive market.
		I mean, what other industry can you go and get so many different options, so many different cars, right?
		I mean, there's so many permutations of vehicles, right?
		So it's very, very competitive.
		However, the auto companies have a relatively thin profit margin normally.
		I mean, they can't eat that level of cost.
		So they're certainly going to pass on some.
		There are some estimates that say the U.S. could see a $1 to $1.5 million reduction in auto sales if this went on indefinitely.
		So, you know, we don't know what the actual numbers are.
		We know directionally prices will go up and sales will go down to some level.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Andrew, Middleton, New Jersey, Line for Independence.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Andrew.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		David, I want to know: is this cease tariffs, which to me is nothing more than a tax, is this going to have a ripple effect through the whole economy?
		Because not only people buying new cars, but let's not forget if you have a car that's 10 years old like I do, and you have to have it repaired in an auto shop, when he gets the ports for this, like they said, for instance, brake pads will go up as high as $35, $40.
		So he's going to pass that on to you.
		Now, one thing that we cannot have is just the service industry in this country.
		This country one time had manufacturing, technological jobs, and I don't think this is right.
		And we had a president, he's not my president, come on TV yesterday and says it's time to get rich.
		Well, who's going to get rich?
		People like Trump, people like Elon Musk.
		And right now, people are struggling with high food prices in this country.
		Go into any supermarket, go into any store, you're going to see higher prices.
		And I don't think this is right to play a tax game or a tariff game for China since 60% of the stuff coming into this country is coming from China.
		So, look, on the one hand, we do protect the United States market from China, right?
		Unlike, say, for autos, you're right that the caller is right that so much of what we get here is produced in China, but not cars.
		That's in part because of a series of actions, tariffs, other regulatory actions designed to prevent nearly all Chinese vehicles from coming to the United States.
		In fact, there's basically only a handful, the Buick Envision, the Lincoln Nautilus, that are actually assembled in China and produce here.
		But I think the caller, again, keeps hitting on this fundamental sort of two opposing ideas.
		We want low prices.
		We want, you know, consumers want to pay as little as possible.
		But if that's what the United States wants, then everything would be produced outside the United States in low-wage countries, right?
		Because it's almost every place cheaper to produce outside the United States, absent tariffs.
		Other countries have less strict environmental rules.
		It's easier to build plants and so on.
		So there is this question about how do we ensure that the United States continues to produce goods, essential goods, and at the same time provide consumers with lower prices.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We talked about Canada placing reciprocal taxes on parts of the auto industry.
		China also announcing that they are placing reciprocal taxes on the U.S. in response to President Trump's announcement.
		How is that going to impact consumers?
unidentified		Not so much on the auto side, at least not yet, but it's certainly going to start to hit across various sectors, right?
		People talk about like we had a story where it was about maybe the $2,500 iPhone, right?
		I mean, as a result, I mean, so there are a lot of consumer goods.
		I mean, so much of what we consume from China, consume comes from China, right?
		There's socks, right?
		There's so many different sneakers, right?
		There's so many different other industries that have moved to China.
		So I think obviously, like in so many things, you see inventory, like in some places, might last two, three, six months.
		But again, those prices are going to start to go up as time goes on.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Jerry in New Jersey, Line for Democrats.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Jerry.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I have a couple of questions for you.
		One, I just want to bring up something.
		Yesterday I heard that they said that when the interest rate comes down, because supposedly we're at 10% or something, and when the interest rate comes down, I think Trump's goal is to refinance the debt.
		Does that sound right to you?
		Because I think there's a couple of things going on here.
		It's not just about the tariffs for the country.
		I think he's trying to bring the interest rate down in order to refinance the debt to make it easier for our country.
		Now, the other question I have for you, I hear the news media, and this is C-SPAN and everybody, prices could go up, might go up.
		This could happen.
		That could happen.
		Everybody panic.
		And what if it doesn't happen?
		What if he succeeds in getting everything corrected?
		I see that Israel's going to zero.
		Vietnam's going to zero.
		I think Argentina's going to go to zero.
		So what if it reverses?
		Is the news media going to change all this?
		I don't quite understand.
		And the other question I have is, you know, the prices have been extremely high with Biden for four years.
		So what exactly are we talking about with prices going up?
		I never saw them come down.
		No, I think one of the reasons President Biden lost the election was voter frustration with high inflation, high prices.
		So that's certainly true.
		And I think the question is, is this the start of a negotiation?
		I mean, President Trump likes shock and awe.
		If you go back and read the Arden Deal, he likes to, you know, come out with a very aggressive position.
		And the caller is right.
		I mean, if he's successful and opts to negotiate and gets tariff rates down, that would certainly lead, you would think, to higher U.S. exports.
		The question is, though, does he want that?
		Or does he really want to sort of completely restructure the U.S. economy around more U.S. production and make us much more self-sufficient rather than have a market where we're exporting more as opposed to necessarily producing more for our own market?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Andrew, Rockville, Maryland, Line for Independence.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Andrew.
unidentified		Hi.
		I guess following up what the previous callers have both spoke about, the prices will need to be absorbed somewhere.
		The increased cost for the tariffs.
		Does the Trump administration think the tariffs will be affected in the short term?
		Or does he think that are they going to somehow argue that the government will absorb these price changes?
		Because if things then, and then my next question is, when the things get to be produced here, won't they still continue to be higher because you're going to be paying an American wage with benefits that are attached to it?
		And then my last question is, do you think that the Trump administration is actually committed to manufacturing, or is it simply part of his ploy to bring companies and countries to the table?
		Great question.
		So certainly on the question about pricing, you're absolutely right that shifting production here is going to result in people making higher wages and sort of, and directionally is going to lead to higher prices.
		In terms of what the money is going to be used for, obviously President Trump wants to use some of this tariff revenue to offset the cost of tax cuts that Congress is considering.
		But if you go back to the first term, a large chunk of the money, tariff revenue was used to provide farmers relief because they lost access to export markets, notably China.
		So you're right.
		In terms of whether Trump's truly committed to manufacturing, I would say yes, only because he's been talking about this issue for decades, right?
		He, you know, going back to the 80s, he really believes he wants to see more manufacturing.
		I think it goes back to a lot of states that voted for him, like notably Michigan, my home state, where when I was in high school, all my friends' parents, dads, primarily could go to the Chevy factory in town and the day they graduate from high school and get a job.
		And so there was this idea that if you worked hard, you didn't need a lot of skills, you could graduate from high school and get a well-paying job.
		And I think part of this is about trying to appeal to people who have felt like they lost out over the last 20, 30 years as the U.S. economy shifted away from manufacturing toward more services.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Michael in New Kensington, Pennsylvania, Line for Republicans.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Michael.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		And thank you for your guest.
		I think it's good that we have somebody with a little bit more of an optimistic view of what's going on here.
		But I think that we get too many doom and gloom around here, focusing on one thing, which is the price of the stocks.
		And I think that's a bad thing.
		I mean, it's obviously hurting me and a lot of people, you know, a lot of other people.
		But there are so many good things.
		If you look at what, if you look at some, if you look behind the curtain, Trump's trying to do a lot of good things here that if they come to fruition, and he's got a track record to prove that, he's a guy that seems to know how to capture the ship.
		And I think that if you look at the possible advantages of a permanent tax cut, that's going to help consumers.
		If you look at what they're doing with those, try to get rid of wasteful government spending.
		If you look at refinancing the debt, which was something that somebody else pointed out, he can do things in a hurry.
		And already those tariff prices have come down significantly in other countries, already 25 countries.
		And so we're seeing results.
		And you see all these companies coming back to the United States to improve our manufacturing base.
		I think it's true that President Trump has had some wins.
		There are so many examples of auto companies that have shifted some production back.
		I think the stock market reaction is in part because of just the deep uncertainty.
		And the fundamental question remains, is this a negotiation?
		Is this about getting deals?
		Or is this about a permanent change in tariff relief?
		There's so many industries like aerospace, like airplanes, right, that rely on free trade.
		And that if we get rid of the existing free trade rules so abruptly, we're going to face enormous amounts of pain in the short term.
		And are people, you know, are industries willing to tolerate it?
		Is the White House willing to tolerate it?
		As the caller said, a lot of it relies on getting this big tax cut bill done, which probably won't happen for a few months.
		And so will people be willing to tolerate the pay of tariffs for some period while Congress tries to get some sort of big tax relief bill done.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Jim in Idaho, line for Republicans.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Jim.
unidentified		Good morning, and thank you for taking my call.
		I'd like to say one thing that nobody seems to bring up is go ahead, Jim.
		One thing people don't seem to care about is our federal government's bank account is $30 trillion in the hole.
		And China owns that.
		And then you got Canada, letting China's military do winter maneuvers here.
		We got China buying up farmland here in the U.S.
		So hopefully the taxes this year will help fill that $30 trillion hole in the bank account.
		Certainly the accrued U.S. federal deficit is a huge issue for both parties.
		And it's sort of undergirding this whole debate on Capitol Hill about how much money can be used to pay for the existing Trump tax cuts that are set to expire and a lot of new tax cuts.
		Remember, President Trump wants to ban taxes on Social Security and taxes on new car loans and taxes on tips for service workers.
		So this is very expensive.
		And you're right, at the same time, lawmakers are grappling with an enormous amount of debt and enormous large interest payments on that debt that come due every year.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We have one last call for you.
		We'll talk with Reba, Maryland, Line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Reba.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Boy, did I come on at the right moment?
		So we do hear lawmakers talk a lot about the deficit.
		What we don't see is them saying they are going to appropriate the tax revenues that come in to the deficit, to the debt.
		We don't hear that.
		We hear them say that they're going to apply it to tax cuts.
		So I think this is a huge, huge shell game because most of the tax cuts are for the wealthy.
		There'll be some that's for the upper middle class.
		It's really interesting to look at charts about this.
		And any tax cut I get will be eaten up by higher food costs, higher goods cost, and the tanking of my investments.
		And we don't even know what's going to happen with Social Security.
		It's a shellgame.
		If they are really concerned about the deficit, they will take this double tax revenues from the double taxation and add it and pay off some of the deficit.
		So everybody watch out for that shell game.
		One final comment.
		I wish when people talked about on-showing factories, they wouldn't just talk about the number of factories, they would talk about the number of jobs.
		Because a lot of factories have very, very few people working in them.
		They're all robotic and they're all lights out.
		And it's just like we're not in the 1950s anymore, people.
		Absolutely right.
		Factories don't employ nearly as many people.
		American workers are much more productive in part because of robotics.
		You're right.
		And I think in terms of the deficit, right, it's easy for both parties to say, you know, let's give tax cuts or let's spend more money on programs that help people.
		It's a lot harder to make people feel pain, right?
		Cutting spending means cutting programs that people rely on, right?
		So in general, politicians are it's easier for them to give people the carrots rather than the sticks of deficit reduction.
		So there have been many times, you know, across both parties where people have talked about taking more difficult steps to pay down the debt.
		And, you know, it's a lot easier to, it's a lot easier to cut taxes and spend money than it is to take things away from people.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		David Sheperson is a correspondent with Reuters.
		You can find his work online at Reuters.com.
		David, thank you so much for being with us this morning.
unidentified		Thanks for having me.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Still ahead this morning on Washington Journal, Operation Hope founder and CEO John Hope Bryant will discuss his organization's efforts to increase financial literacy.
		But first, it's open form.
		You can start calling in now the lines: Republicans 202-748-8001.
		Democrats 202-748-8000.
		And Independents 202-748-8002.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		Sunday night on C-SPAN's Q&A.
		Journalist and musician Lee Hawkins, author of I Am Nobody's Slave, talks about the impact that slavery and Jim Crow have had on his family through multiple generations.
		Mr. Hawkins examines the relationship between the past violence experienced by family members, often at the hands of white people, and the way his parents raised and severely disciplined him.
lee hawkins ▲ ● ▼		All I knew growing up was that if I asked too many questions, if I said no to my parents, if I question any aspect of upbringing, and if I fell short of excellence, the price was going to be physical violence.
unidentified		Journalist, musician, and author Lee Hawkins.
		Sunday night at 8 Eastern on C-SPAN's QA.
		You can listen to Q&A wherever you get your podcasts and on the C-SPAN Now app.
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		As a follow-on to Stuart Banner's History of the Supreme Court, this week's Book Notes Plus podcast features a 2002 interview with Dennis Hutchinson, a University of Chicago law professor emeritus.
		The subject matter, the forgotten memoir of John Knox, a law clerk to former Justice James McReynolds, a native of Kentucky.
		Knox's year was the term beginning October 1936.
		In history, it is very rare that a law clerk at the Supreme Court has published an insider's view of the court or of a justice.
		Professor Hutchinson gives the background on where he found the memoir, which hadn't been published before.
		Justice McReynolds, as you will hear, was according to historians, arguably one of the most disagreeable justices ever to sit on the bench.
unidentified		An interview with University of Chicago law professor Dennis Hutchinson on the forgotten memoir of John Knox on this episode of BookNotes Plus with our host Brian Lamb.
		Book Notes Plus is available wherever you get your podcasts and on the C-SPAN Now app.
		Democracy.
		It isn't just an idea.
		It's a process, a process shaped by leaders elected to the highest offices and entrusted to a select few with guarding its basic principles.
		It's where debates unfold, decisions are made, and the nation's course is charted.
		Democracy in real time.
		This is your government at work.
		This is C-SPAN, giving you your democracy, unfiltered.
		Washington Journal continues.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back.
		We are on open forum for the next 25 minutes or so.
		We'll get to your calls and questions in just a few minutes, but wanted to give you some news.
		Last night, or I guess early this morning, about 2:30, Senate adopted a budget blueprint for Trump's agenda, but hurdles loom.
		That is the headline from Politico talking about that the latest on the budget, efforts to pass a budget.
		It says Senate Republicans adopted a fiscal blueprint Saturday for President Donald Trump's quote, one big beautiful bill.
		What comes next is anyone's guess.
		It says the Senate voted 41, I'm sorry, 51 to 48 on a budget resolution that unlocks their ability to pass a party line bill later this year that will combine an overhaul of the tax code with border energy and defense policies.
		GOP Senators Susan Collins of Maine and Rand Paul of Kentucky joined all Democrats and Independents in opposing the resolution, although other Republicans still have concerns that will need to be addressed before passing the final bill.
		It says now the budget plan needs approval in the House, where Speaker Mike Johnson can only afford to lose three Republicans without having the entire effort unravel.
		House fiscal hawks are displeased with the Senate's framework and are threatening to revolt.
		Last night, after the Senate passed that bill, Senate Majority Leader John Thune talked about it as well as Chuck Schumer's Democratic leader.
		Here are their remarks.
john thune ▲ ● ▼		We have this deficit, and you know, the way we're going to have to deal with that is to get more growth in the economy, generate more revenue because when the economy is growing and expanding, people are creating jobs, people are working, they're taking realizations, and they're paying more taxes.
		And that's what happens when you reduce taxes.
		And that's why it's so important that we extend and make permanent the 2017 tax law.
		This is what we're talking about here today.
		This is what this conversation, frankly, is all about.
		Now, Mr. President, one of the things that has been interesting in this debate, because I heard lots of conversation from my colleagues on the other side about massive new tax cuts for billionaires, but let me tell you what, if you vote against this budget resolution, you will be voting for.
		You will be voting for a $4 trillion tax increase on our economy and on the American people.
		Of that $4 trillion tax increase, $2.6 trillion will fall on people who make less than $400,000 a year.
chuck schumer ▲ ● ▼		In voting for this bill, Senate Republicans sided with billionaires against the middle class in total obeisance to Donald Trump.
		The odds of a recession in America are surging because of Donald Trump's tariffs, and Senate Republicans have gone along.
		In fact, they are aiding and abetting it.
		It's a brutal Republican pincer move.
		Donald Trump's raised costs on the one side, and Senate Republicans are cutting Medicaid and pushing billionaire tax breaks on the other.
		Tonight, Senate Democrats gave Senate Republicans the chance to hit the kill switch on Donald Trump's tariffs on Doge, on the attacks against Social Security and Medicare and Medicaid.
		At each opportunity, Republicans refused.
		If Republicans ever chose to snap out of their Trump hypnosis for even a minute, they could immediately use this Senate procedure to halt the tariffs, halt Doge, halt all of Donald Trump's chaos.
		They know deep down his policies are a disaster, but instead, Senate Republicans are chaining themselves to the MAGA anchor and leaping into the ocean.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Cy in Durham, North Carolina, line for Democrat kicks off our open forum calls.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Cy.
unidentified		How do you do?
		Just call him because I really missed the days when Republicans understood facts.
		Matter of fact, I remember when Reagan gave a nice speech about tariffs and the truth of the matter.
		The fact is, every time they've been implemented, it's driven our debt into the like it screws the economy over.
		Moreover, that's Republicans speaking the truth of the matter.
		So, yes, I'm a Democrat call him, but why don't y'all read history, Republicans?
		I remember the days when they actually liked facts and cared about our economy and cared about each other and people.
		I mean, this is harming everybody.
		And what really is killing me is the idea that Trump knows what he's doing.
		Our last major stock market crashes have happened under him.
		There's no excuse anymore.
		I mean, matter of fact, he even said it in the 80s when he lost the ability to take loans out from American banks that Democrats are too smart for this.
		So I don't understand how the Republican Party doesn't see themselves as in a cult believing lies.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Cy.
		We'll go to Larry in Nebraska, line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Larry.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I have three little short deals.
		I'll make them quick.
		One, Social Security will not be cut or taken away.
		I heard this from 1976 when I was 18 years old, and my grandma and grandpa worry about Social Security being taken away by the evil Republicans.
		And it never happened in all those years.
		It never happened.
		Number two, I was wondering where Jesse, I think he was a black gentleman on your program.
		He's always been my favorite.
		I haven't seen him for a while.
		Could you tell me where he's at?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		He is teaching.
		He's at a university here in Washington, D.C.
		And Larry, it hurts my feelings when you say that he's your favorite when I'm sitting right here.
unidentified		Oh, I'm sorry.
		Oh, also, too, one more thing.
		Hello?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, go ahead, Larry.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Easter is coming up here in a couple weeks.
		And I'm going to ask my Democratic friends out there, on Easter, could you keep your hate down for one day on Easter?
		Just keep, don't, don't preach your hate for one day, and let's enjoy Easter.
		That's it.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Larry in Nebraska.
		Benny in Michigan, line for independence.
		Good morning, Benny.
unidentified		My call.
		Now, I've been an independent.
		I voted Republican.
		I voted Democrat.
		I voted independent sometimes.
		But I've never, ever seen anything as bad as this.
		When you put the bank robber in charge of the banks and you expect something different than what most people would see, then you vote for people like Trump.
		I voted for Reagan.
		I voted for Bush Sr.
		But I understand the dangers we're facing now.
		A long time ago in the United States history, a famous man named Benjamin Franklin came out of a building.
		People asked him, what kind of government we have?
		And he said, a republic if you can keep it.
		And right now, that means a lot for people who are Republicans, independents, not necessarily Democrats.
		You have to start thinking differently.
		This man is a danger to our country.
		He lets people like the Tate brothers back in the United States, white supremacist who run white slavery rings.
		He lets the person on the computer complex made $400 million selling drugs.
		He gave him a pardon.
		This man is not necessarily in his right mind.
		And I would ask people to think about this before they vote again.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Larry.
		Let's talk with Crystal in Wilkesbury, Pennsylvania, line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Crystal.
unidentified		Good morning.
		What triggered me to call was one of the guys said, look at Trump's track record.
		Look at what he's done.
		I'm originally from New Jersey.
		Trump decimated Atlantic City.
		I mean, he ruined it.
		Okay.
		Trump had seven bankruptcies.
		So that's Trump's track record.
		What Trump is doing right now is hurting everyone with their retirement savings, with prices going up.
		And the Republicans complained about the price of eggs for a whole year.
		And now they're loving what Trump does.
		It is hurting everyone.
		Trump, like the guy said, Trump is a Trump.
		Trump, I don't want to call any names, but to me, he's a fool.
		And that's just the way I see it.
		And I'm going to sit back and not spend a dime in these stores for all of these stores, Amazon and Target that wanted to go his way.
		I won't spend a dollar in those stores.
		I won't spend a dollar right now.
		So I'm going to sit back and save my money and watch him destroy us because I don't know one Republican that has gotten us out of a deficit or made the economy better, and Trump is no different.
		Thank you so much.
		Have a good day.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Crystal in Pennsylvania.
		This headline from the Associated Press, China hits break on TikTok deal after Trump announced wide-ranging tariffs.
		AP sources says that President Donald Trump on Friday said he is signing an executive order to keep TikTok running in the U.S. for another 75 days to give his administration more time to broker a deal to bring the social media platform under American ownership.
		The order was announced as White House officials believed they were nearing a deal for the app's operation to be spun off into a new company based in the U.S. and owned and operated by a majority of American investors, with China's ByteDance maintaining a minority position, according to a person familiar with the matter.
		It says, but Beijing hit the breaks on a deal Thursday after Trump announced wide-ranging tariffs around the globe, including against China.
		ByteDance representatives called the White House to indicate that China would no longer approve the deal unless there could be negotiations about trade and tariffs, said the person who spoke on the condition of anonymity to discuss the sensitive details of the negotiations.
		About 15 minutes left in open form.
		Let's talk with Chris in Ohio, Line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Chris.
unidentified		Hello.
		Yeah, I'd like to say that, you know, everybody likes to blame this on Donald Trump.
		And, you know, things were bad before he got in office and they're going to get a little worse before he turns things around.
kieran in kentucky ▲ ● ▼		You know, you look at The food industry, they're paying kids in McDonald's and Burger King $15 an hour, where those used to just be transition jobs, kids in high school, just getting out of high school, senior citizens.
unidentified		And now they're paying them a salary where, you know, I didn't make a whole lot more than that when I went out on Social Security.
unidentified		And, you know, it's it's they want to blame everything on him about it.
bulldog in unknown ▲ ● ▼		But, you know, yeah, a hamburger at McDonald's is probably $4 now, and there's nothing to them.
unidentified		I don't know the exact price, but just stuff like, you know, the economy was terrible.
		I mean, food was expensive in the grocery stores.
		You're going to blame Donald Trump on the bird flu why eggs are so high.
		Then go ahead, I guess.
		But we definitely need tariffs because it's been a long time coming.
		These other countries are dumping all their crap here.
		And, you know, God, every time I buy something that's made in Bangladesh, Laos, Cambodia, I guess we're paying them back to rebuild them after the war.
		But I don't know.
		That's just it's it's terrible that everybody's against him.
		Now we have Democratic news, we have Republican news.
		So pick your channel because one's gonna bash and one's gonna be for.
		And that's something we never had.
		It was always like an even playing field.
		They just told you the news.
		They didn't have to try to sway you one way or another.
		And that's a real big complaint of mine now also.
		But that's about all I have to say.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Chris in Ohio.
		Let's talk with Sean in Virginia, Line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Sean.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Daniel Sean.
unidentified		Yes, can you hear me?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yes, go ahead.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I wanted to say this, that I work in the public sector as a public service worker.
		I do work for social services.
		And my biggest issue with this, and I state that because I want to be fair, it's important to know what I do for a living.
		I really, and this is going to sound unrealistic, but what I really would wish to see, I would really wish to see President Trump be in a situation where his assets were frozen for at least 120 days, where he had no access to any of his monies in his companies.
		And I would like to see him live on what a lot of my clients have to live on.
		I think that you can make decisions where you're in a certain position and you never had to worry about where your next meal was coming from or how you were going to feed your children.
		I look at the way that he talked and treated people with disabilities through the years because I'm, you know, I read tremendously.
		I'm a big reader.
		And as the president of the United States, you really are supposed to be concerned about people as a whole.
		Not a certain select people, but people as a whole.
		That's why we're Democratic.
		That's why people die to get here because we were the Democratic country that was a place for people to come and be able to live in freedom.
		And what he's doing and what he's proposing and what he's, you know, suggesting, you know, I get that he thinks that by bringing more manufacturing back in, that that's going to make it better for everybody.
		But this is a person that has not seen what I've had to see in 26 years of doing what I do.
		And so when you talk about cutting Medicaid as an example, there are people that work every day that are minimum wage that are barely making it, that depend on Medicaid because they can't fo for afford regular insurance.
		So this is what I'm looking at.
		I hear what everybody's saying about, you know, well, the prices are high, and they are high.
		But I just wish that he would have that personal experience of living for at least four to five months like a lot of my clients.
		And they're not all people that aren't working.
		A lot of my clients here they do work because I work with workforce through social services.
		But the way that the economy is, they can barely make it.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Your point, Sean.
		We have just about 10 minutes left in open form and wanted to give you a program note for an event happening later today.
		This afternoon, progressives, progressive and activist organizations will hold a rally to protest President Trump's policies and billionaire Elon Musk's influence on the administration.
		Democratic Representatives Jamie Raskin and Maxwell Frost are set to attend along with activist leaders that will be taking place at the Sylvan Theater on the National Mall.
		You can watch it live right here on C-SPAN at 12 p.m. Eastern.
		You'll also be able to find it on C-SPAN Now, our free mobile video app, and online at c-span.org.
		Let's hear from Diane in Manchester, Missouri, lying for Republicans.
		Good morning, Diane.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		I know you let that last lady talk, and I really appreciate it if you would let me say a few things.
		I've been watching your show, and I notice it's always lately since Trump got into office has based Trump.
		But I just want to let you know, we had a president that we don't know who was in charge.
		At least we know who's in charge of the country.
		We know he's trying to make America better.
		And I wish people would be more considerate of that than the scam of the last four years under Biden's administration, who was, you know, all of a sudden all these things are coming out and the liberals are admitting he was not coherent and was not making the was not doing his job, but other people were, but people always bash Trump.
		But he's there.
		He's up there.
		He's talking to the people.
		He's doing what he can to make America better.
		And I just wish people would be more considerate of that.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Diane in Missouri.
		Lenny in Huntington, New York, lying for independence.
		Good morning, Lenny.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you today?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Damn.
unidentified		Good.
		Hey, Donald Trump's policies are ridiculous, narcissistic, obnoxious, and he's bringing the country down so that he can be the savior of the country in the future.
		Now, my peeve, my pet peeve, is not with him because we have a Congress that's supposed to be a check and a balance on the presidency, and we have a judiciary who seems to be doing their job, but the U.S. Congress is lame.
		They're spineless.
		They're backing every single thing that he does.
		I'm furious with my own congressmen because they have put no stops on this man.
		They vote for everything that he wants, good, bad, indifferent.
		Where are they?
		They got to stand up.
		They try to put through a bill.
		I don't know what happened to it after the Senate.
		They try to put through a bill to stop the tariffs on Canada.
		Canada's the greatest friend that we have in this world.
		They're the best financial partner.
		They're the best manufacturing partner.
		They have resources that we don't have that we get from them.
		And he's maiming them.
		Come on.
		Where's Congress?
		You know, the Senate voted 51 to 47 to stop the tariffs, but then the House got it.
		And the representatives there, I don't know what they did with it.
		Where does that stand?
		What are they doing?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Lenny in New York.
		Don in Iowa, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Don.
unidentified		Hello.
		I just wanted to comment.
		You know, under Biden, our stock market went up over 10,000 points.
		We were recovering from a pandemic.
		And when Trump's reign ended, we were in bad shape.
		And I'm just saying at least he let professionals handle the economy.
		And I have a question.
		If Biden were to dismantle our government, conservative judges, evil or bad, aspirations of taking Greenland, renaming the Gulfs, wanted to take the Panama Canal, initiated tariffs and crashed our economy.
		What would the Republicans be saying right now?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Don in Iowa.
		Jim in Virginia, line for Republicans.
		Hi, Jim.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		I've been listening for a few minutes, and I'm just not astounded, but understanding that Trump bashing is a thing of the day.
		I'd like to say that with our national debt, that the Doge movement, cutting waste in government, is the appropriate thing.
		I see waste after waste after waste.
		It's been on television, billions of dollars.
		It's on DEI and transgender and all kinds of things.
		And I think this has been long coming.
		If we're going to address our national debt, we have to start cutting money.
		And I think as a taxpayer, I should not have to pay taxes when I worry when I do my tax and aware as whether or not I'm going to get a deduction or I get audited and they'll throw out something that I maybe missed in my calculations and get fined.
		And the government takes my money and just gives it away like it's cookies and sugar or grapes and with no accountability.
		I think it's a long overdue and I think this Doge movement is the right direction.
		Thank you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Jim in Virginia, Larry, Ohio, line for Democrats.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Larry.
unidentified		Yes.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Larry, you there?
unidentified		Yes, I'm right here.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Larry.
unidentified		You're on.
		Okay.
		I'm calling to find out how come Trump is trying to cut Medicaid and Medicare because I'm handicapped.
		And my father worked and died in the Army to help so I can have my medical benefits when I got older.
		I'd like to know why Trump is trying to cut this because this is very serious to me because I ain't the only one in my family who's handicapped.
		I got nieces and nephews are handicapped also.
		I feel that Trump is trying to hurt Medicare, Medicaid, and other things to help handicap people who are not handicapped.
		I believe that Trump should be, like your lady said, Trump needs to be taken out of office because he's a danger to the United States and the world.
		I believe that he's doing the wrong thing.
		Like your lady said, because Trump is not thinking like a real president.
		He's acting childish like an eight-year-old kid.
		I feel this way about what he is doing to government, to everybody's life and mine.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Larry in Ohio and Larry talking about potential cuts to Medicaid, Medicare.
		This headline in this morning's Washington Post, it says, cuts to life-saving health programs among CDC layoffs.
		It says that hundreds of employees who worked in programs at the Center for Disease Control and Prevention were laid off on Tuesday, part of a widespread job cuts across the Department of Health and Human Services designed to streamline the federal bureaucracy.
		It says the programs have a lower profile than CDC's infectious disease investigations on the ongoing measles outbreak in Texas and New Mexico or last year's E. coli illness from contaminated onions on McDonald's quarter pounders.
		It says, but these efforts reflect the ways the CDC's portfolio has broadened over time to include a wider range of health issues as leading causes of death in the United States have shifted over decades from infectious diseases to accidents, suicides, overdoses, and chronic illnesses.
		Employees who were laid off worked on measures to prevent drowning, gun violence, and smoking.
		Scientists researched asthma, climate change, and worker safety.
		Health and Human Services Secretary Robert F. Kennedy Jr. and GOP health policy analysts have said that they want the Atlanta-based CDC founded in 1946 to fight malaria, to focus on infectious diseases.
		As part of a sweeping job announcement on Tuesday, about 2,400 CDC employees, almost one in five, were terminated without consulting the CDC's senior leaders.
		Numerous officials said that is the largest workforce reduction in the agency's modern history.
		Let's talk with Mike in California, line for independence.
		Good morning, Mike.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Yes, what I wanted to say about these tariffs is what's going to happen is my belief is that these other countries, they're going to find other trading partners and they won't come back after this.
		And what we're going to be stuck with is too much of everything that we can't get rid of.
		We can't sell it.
		And I believe that we're going to go into a recession by the end of this year.
		So you people need to save your monies because it's going to be hard going pretty soon.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Mike in California.
		Jasmine in Illinois, line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Jasmine.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Doing well.
unidentified		Good.
		My thing is about the transgender thing that they have on TV.
		I don't remember what day it was this week, but that Democrat, black man that got on there and was cussing on TV like that, I don't think that was right.
		I just don't.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Jasmine in Illinois.
		Let's hear from Richard in California, line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Richard.
unidentified		Hello.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Richard.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Are you there?
unidentified		Yeah, I'm here.
unidentified		Is this a real person on other recording?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Nope, I'm real, Richard.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead.
unidentified		Okay, I was just watching your show, and I was just thinking, you know, I see all these people.
		I was listening to your show, and I'm a senior citizen, too, and I'm worried about my Medi-Cal and my Medicare and my Social Security and stuff, because the way they're talking about Trump wants to cut us all out.
		And I worked for over 40 years, man, and I'm too old to go look for another job.
		I wish I could, but I'm too old.
		I'll be 75 this year.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Richard, what did you do before you retired?
unidentified		I was a mailman, letter carrier.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Richard in California.
		Ken in New York, line for independence.
		Good morning, Ken.
unidentified		Good morning.
unidentified		How are you?
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing well.
unidentified		Okay.
		A few calls ago, I just turned the TV on.
		Somebody on the Republican line was mentioning that Trump and Musk were trying to find waste in government.
		Well, is he aware that every time Trump flies from Washington to Florida to play golf, it costs $3.1 million?
		I think that's pretty obvious waste in government.
		Why doesn't he just stop that?
		He'd save us $150 million a year.
		Thank you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Ken.
		Let's talk with Gary in Dallastown, Pennsylvania, line for Republicans.
		Hi, Gary.
unidentified		Hi.
		I just want to make a statement.
		I've been to Trump last three times.
		And at this point, I think the sniper screen is: Trump is after power.
		He wants to do everything, caring about America, loving America.
		It doesn't have nothing to do with that anymore.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Gary, are you still there?
unidentified		Yes, I'm here.
		He obviously, it's a power trip for him now.
		Everything's an executive order.
		Okay, two-thirds of America are against what he's doing.
		This tariff thing should have been based in over a 40-year period and not the hardened economy.
		Economists have hurt a gun.
		And I think he should have faced us in.
		So at this point, in my opinion, it's a power trip.
		He wants power, and that's it.
		Thank you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was Gary in Pennsylvania.
		And our last call for this hour or for this segment will be Juan in New Jersey, line for Democrats.
		Hi, Juan.
unidentified		Hi.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Juan.
unidentified		Yeah.
unidentified		I'm going to tell you what I feel.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Yes, you're on, Juan.
unidentified		Okay.
		I feel that the tariff situation should have been a decision made by all countries shown exactly what the tariffs are and what they're charging and come to a medium, a conclusion that helps everybody in the world.
		The world is not being helped by just throwing out numbers out there and racing up the tariffs.
		We need to have a concession of the world.
		Well, okay, you know, this is all I could afford.
		And, well, help the ones that need it.
		And the other ones that are overcharging, well, you know what?
		Okay, then you have to Pay more.
		If we want to have a world of peace, we need number one God and number two, peaceful concessions.
		That's what we have diplomats for.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		That was one in New Jersey, our last call for open forum next on Washington Journal.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		April is National Financial Literacy Month, and Operation Hope founder and CEO John Hope Bryant will be with us to discuss that and his organization's efforts to increase financial literacy.
unidentified		We'll be right back next week on the C-SPAN Networks, the House and Senator in session.
		The House plans to take up the revised Republicans 2025 budget resolution following its passage by the Senate.
		Also, Jameson Greer, the United States Trade Representative, testifies on the president's agenda after he imposed tariffs on several U.S. partners.
		First, on Tuesday, before the Senate Finance Committee, and then on Wednesday before the House Ways and Means Committee.
		Watch live next week on the C-SPAN networks or on C-SPAN Now, our free mobile app.
		Also, head over to c-span.org for scheduling information or to watch live or on demand anytime.
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		c-span democracy unfiltered as a follow-on to stuart banner's history of the supreme court this week's book notes plus podcast features a 2002 interview with dennis hutchinson a university of chicago law professor emeritus The subject matter, forgotten memoir of John Knox, a law clerk to former Justice James McReynolds, a native of Kentucky.
		Knox's year was the term beginning October 1936.
		In history, it is very rare that a law clerk at the Supreme Court has published an insider's view of the court or of a justice.
		Professor Hutchinson gives the background on where he found the memoir, which hadn't been published before.
		Justice McReynolds, as you will hear, was according to historians, arguably one of the most disagreeable justices ever to sit on the bench.
unidentified		An interview with University of Chicago law professor Dennis Hutchinson on the forgotten memoir of John Knox on this episode of Book Notes Plus with our host Brian Lamb.
		BookNotes Plus is available wherever you get your podcasts and on the C-SPAN Now app.
		Saturdays, watch American History TV's 10-week series, First 100 Days.
		We explore the early months of presidential administrations with historians and authors and through the C-SPAN archives.
		We learn about accomplishments and setbacks and how events impacted presidential terms and the nation up to present day.
		Today, the first 100 days of Barack Obama's presidency.
		In 2009, he became the first African-American president and set a record inaugural crowd of close to 2 million people.
		After near collapse of the American economy, President Obama signed a nearly $800 billion economic stimulus plan and a bill on fair pay.
		He also began to lay the groundwork for landmark health care legislation, the Affordable Care Act, or Obamacare.
		Watch our American History TV series, First 100 Days, today at 7 p.m. Eastern on American History TV on C-SPAN 2.
		Washington Journal continues.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Joining us now to discuss efforts to increase financial literacy is John Hope Bryant.
		He is the founder, CEO, and chair of Operation Hope.
		John, welcome to the program.
unidentified		I'm honored to be with you.
unidentified		Thank you.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We will start with your organization.
		It was something you founded years ago.
		Tell us about Operation Hope, why you started it and its mission.
unidentified		Well, I was in a family that had built considerable wealth for some, for a family that did not have college education, didn't come from wealth.
		They had done pretty well for themselves in South Central Los Angeles.
		They own their own homes, businesses, they own a gas station, etc.
		But unfortunately, my dad confused making money with building wealth.
		And at the end of the day, he confused cash flow with profit.
		And our outflow exceeded our inflow.
		And when your outflow exceeds your inflow, your overhead will be your downfall.
		We had too much month at the end of our money.
		And my mom and dad really got into domestic disagreements over money.
		Number one cause for divorce today is money.
		They divorced.
		I saw two murders before I was nine years old over money in Compton, California.
		My mother went and reset our lives and got very financially literate, financially focused on her own, raised her credit score to 854 and working an hourly job.
		Now, my dad owned a business now.
		She worked an hourly job and ended up being a millionaire.
		When she passed away two years ago, she was a technical millionaire, having bought and sold seven homes on an hourly job working 32 years.
		My dad, I ended up having to take care of him even though he was a business owner.
		So that proved to me that it's not what you make, it's what you keep, and that financial literacy was incredibly important.
		I got my first course when I was nine years old in financial literacy, and it stuck with me.
		So fast forward to today, I believe this is a civil rights issue of this generation.
		I believe it's as important as the right to vote, and we know how important that is.
		I believe if Dr. King was alive today, this would be the work he'd be doing to advance this work.
		As he, when he was assassinated 57 years ago, yesterday, I was in Memphis yesterday for his memorial anniversary, as you well know.
		He was focused on the poor people's campaign, which was about all people who are poor, including poor whites.
		There's more poor whites then and today than poor anybody else.
		So this is everybody's issue, including the middle class, which we can get into in a moment.
		And so I founded Operation Hope, and it's 32 years ago after the Rodney King riots in LA.
		And it started out just serving a local community.
		It's now the largest financial coaching, financial literacy coaching organization in America.
		It has 1,500 locations in 42 states.
		The only nonprofit allowed to operate inside of a bank branch in U.S. history, thanks to the federal banking regulators.
		We're getting the banks out of the no business, back into the yes business for average people in the country.
		The average person watching your broadcast would be our client target.
		Getting the credit score up 54 points, getting the debt down $3,800, getting the savings up $1,200 to $1,500.
		Somebody making $48,000 to $50,000 a year.
		Allowed the bank to go from, I'm sorry, we can't give you credit to yes, prime credit, what would you like?
		So it's more than that, but that's the baseline to give, to create economic plumbing for the bottom half of the country, a private banker, if you will, for everybody.
		And I just really think this is critically important now to everybody.
		I started out with this.
		This first began.
		It was minority communities.
		Frankly, it was black communities and brown communities in South Central.
		Today, what I found, Tammy, is that if you're making $100,000 a year, half of those people are living from paycheck to paycheck.
		70% of the country is living from paycheck to paycheck.
		And this country's economy, which most people don't know, the biggest economy in the world, is 70% of consumer spending.
		If you're making $250,000 a year, people would call that wealthy by any definition, or at least rich, there is a difference.
		A third of those are living from paycheck to paycheck.
		And he goes on and on and on.
		So we are almost singular in our work.
		There's no one else doing what we do at our scale.
		And we are now employers.
		We're in employers as well.
		And John is coaching all 100,000 Delta employees.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		It is a critical issue, as you mentioned.
		And April is National Financial Literacy Month.
		When we hear that term, financial literacy, explain what that means, what it entails.
unidentified		It's the language of money.
		I mean, C-SPAN has such a distinguished and honorable and important mandate and mission in this country.
		And consistently, you have been giving people a light on the heel on this topic with me over years.
		And I thank you for that.
		But most people don't understand that this is a free enterprise or a capitalist democracy.
		That the first entity that governed in this country was not a government, actually.
		It was a corporation.
		And the government actually got its talking points, if you will, on how to create a governing structure from the first corporation, which is a trading corporation out of Europe, out of Britain, I believe.
		And so this is a free enterprise democracy, a capitalist democracy, big C, big F, little D.
		And so if your day is not about God or love, your day is about money.
		I mean, look at what's going on in the country right now.
		Look at the conversation.
		Look at the recent elections.
		It's really, if you break it down, an economic conversation.
		And so this is the language of money.
		It's the stuff that no one's ever taught you.
		And people, I was listening to some of the callers, they just want some of their financial dignity back.
		They're not begging.
		They're not looking for handouts.
		They want, they say, look, we had a deal.
		We had an agreement.
		I worked hard and should not be able to retire in dignity.
		But it's what they don't know that they don't know that may be killing them.
		But they think they know because no one taught you financial literacy.
		And if you're a minority, it's worse.
		So, I mean, this is everybody's problem.
		But as I often say, when mainstream America has a headache, black and brown folks have pneumonia, even though we're all sick.
		So the good news is for me that I can now get everybody's attention during Financial Literacy Month because everybody's feeling the heat, the pain, the discomfort of a tightening economy.
		And now we can focus on, hopefully, making something positive out of this.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Our guest, John Hope Bryant, founder and CEO of Operation Hope.
		Our discussion is focused on efforts to increase financial literacy.
		If you have a question or comment for John, you can start calling in now.
		Our lines for the segment are broken down regionally.
		If you are in the Eastern or Central time zone, it's 202-748-8001.
		If you were a mountain or Pacific, it's 202-748-8001.
		And John, something you mentioned is that people want their dignity back and that it's a right, something that they weren't taught.
		And data from last April from the World Economic Forum shows that financial literacy in the U.S. has hovered around 50% for eight consecutive years now.
		Why?
		Why aren't people being taught what they need to about finances?
unidentified		Well, first of all, Tammy, the teachers are financially illiterate.
		I mean, that's not an indictment or a statement of criticism.
		It is a critique of our priorities and what we have focused on as a country and its priorities.
		We've not taught the bottom half of society about how this system works.
		For instance, let's go to the group that is most affected by all this because we lead every negative indicator you can imagine.
		The folk that was enslaved on American soil, African Americans, no fault of their own.
		They were taken from someplace else and brought here.
		Okay, so there's a responsibility to now give them freedom.
		Yes, that happened to Abraham Lincoln and teach them financial literacy.
		That was the Freedmen's Bank, 1865, March 3rd.
		Well, within a month of Abraham Lincoln created that bank, the bank was, that he was assassinated, the same month, by the way, as Dr. King, April.
		I think that was April 8th, and Dr. King was April 4th.
		And 100 years before Dr. King, and the mission fell away at the country.
		And the 40 Acres in the Mule was reversed two years after Lincoln's assassination.
		The bank failed for mismanagement and fraud from mainstream interests in D.C. who saw it as a piggy bank for themselves.
		And that within eight years, the bank was gone.
		So with regard to black American story, literally no one taught people how to be free, like quite literally.
		Same with poor whites.
		Same with Native American Indians, which, by the way, are the three groups that have the worst indexes of, I mean, poverty, African Americans, the highest death rate, white males, 18-year-olds, the highest death rate of any group in the country, and Native American Indians, last time I checked, alcohol.
		So these folks were left out of the free enterprise system.
		And if you think about the people who progressed, if you're upper income, Caucasian or whatever, you learned it at the kitchen table.
		Your dad was reading the Wall Street Journal or your mother was talking about mortgages and car notes and making financial decisions in the stock market and her 401k or his business interests or so on and so forth.
		And so the kids getting this active lesson from upper income households.
		And so that's literally the story of this country is we've never prioritized it.
		We've never taught it.
		Look at the schooling system.
		We're still giving people summers off.
		I'm just giving this as an example of how priorities are misaligned.
		Well, summers off was tied to an agricultural economy.
		We haven't had a primary agricultural economy, so you can go and farm.
		This is why people were giving off in the summer kids.
		We've had that in 100 years, sorry, 150 years.
		But we're still giving summers off to everybody.
		What we need to be doing is financial literacy here in Atlanta, Mayor Audrey Dickens has given a Hope Child Savings account to every child in kindergarten.
		Now that may sound silly to some of your viewers and listeners, but the studies have proven you give an account to a kid in kindergarten, no money in it, just the aspiration and the lesson, and they're 25% more likely to go to college.
		You put a couple hundred dollars in that account, that kid is 75% more likely to graduate from college.
		So all 10,000 kids, we have 10,000 accounts in Atlanta public schools.
		Now we're going to embed that with financial literacy.
		And I think also we need to be teaching AI literacy to our entire, almost the entire population, by the way, because that's going to be the new economy in five years.
		These are the two priorities that are dominant today, and no one's teaching either one of them.
		So it's what we don't know that we don't know.
		The teachers were never taught financial literacy.
		I got it in school, Tammy, because a volunteer banker, thanks to the Community Reinvestment Act, which is a great piece of legislation, bipartisan.
		A volunteer banker who happened to be Caucasian, I was nine years old in Compton, came into my classroom, Caucasian male.
		This is really important because all of my friends had a negative experience with Caucasian males as a police officer, shoving them against a patrol car.
		I had a positive experience.
		This banker taught me financial literacy.
		And I said, excuse me, sir, came in once a week for six weeks.
		What do you do for a living?
		And how did you get rich legally?
		And I was completely serious because in my neighborhood, that was just crazy.
		This guy had a suit on and a legal car in the parking lot.
		He said, I'm a banker, and I finance entrepreneurs.
		I said, Tammy, I don't know what an entrepreneur is, but if it's legal and you're financing it, I'm going to be one.
		And I am an entrepreneur today.
		I operation hope is my philanthropy, but I run businesses.
		So this needs to become a national priority.
		I was able to get President George Bush and then President Obama to make financial literacy federal policy during their administrations.
		So it applies to the federal government, at least technically, by executive order.
		But I want Congress to do it now.
		I want Congress to codify this, make it legal, K through 12, make it a mandatory thing, and fund it so that this is taught in schools in a way that everybody, well, even the teachers can get a lesson then.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		We have callers waiting to talk with you.
		We'll start with Michael in Gainesville, Florida.
		Good morning, Michael.
unidentified		Yes, good morning.
		You know, when I taught science to middle school, I was amazed to learn that they had no idea what the word science even meant.
		So I had them learn auguries of innocence, you know, to see the world in the grain of sand.
		And I wondered how much of, you know, to listen to Mr. Bryant speak, my gosh, I hope that he doesn't stop with kindergartners and that he conveys some of what he's conveyed to us this morning to them as they age because it influences our culture.
		Right now, for example, if I were to ask most people, does competition and capitalism optimize outcomes, they're going to say yes.
		And the truth of the matter is no.
		An economy is like a body, and you need to maintain homeostasis.
		And there's such a thing in economy known as tragedy of the commonance, which means you can have a cancer that continues to grow within the body, but the body dies.
		So showing that growth isn't proof of anything being optimized unless it's in conjunction.
		And cooperation is actually a big part in every cell of our bodies.
		There's a mitochondria that used to be free living.
		So when we say, well, it's a natural part of evolution and the natural order, no, the natural order says that cooperation and love, if you study what Darwin really wrote about, he wrote as much about love.
		He didn't write about competition.
		And so we need to educate about science.
		Science ties in with the economy.
		And let me end with how you teach matters, because if every child doesn't get an A when you teach it, then you're promoting colonialism because the whole point of educational colonialism was to separate the wheat from the chaff.
		And no child is chaff.
		It's worth them knowing that every child needs to know it.
		There's no hurry.
		The goal isn't to separate the keepers from the losers.
		You don't hold out information to children like you would a ball to a dog or to a mechanical hare to a greyhound.
		That's not the purpose.
		You know, if you teach, just like I hate to say it, but like Mrs. McMahon says, let teachers teach.
		You wouldn't teach a child to take the garbage out and be happy if he got 80% of the garbage taken out.
		Of course not.
		You have every child in my class got an A and they earned it and they knew the information.
		And it changes the relationship of the teacher to the student because now you're not their judge, you're their helper.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Michael, we'll get a response from John.
unidentified		Well, he said a whole lot in that comment in question.
		I'm not sure if there was a question there, but it was very thoughtful and very informative.
		I'm glad he's passionate about the topic.
		He, again, he covered a lot of ground there.
		Let me say this.
		Capitalism in and of itself is not a good thing.
		It's just a thing.
		But capitalism and democracy are horrible systems except for every other system.
		And even if you want to distribute money like a socialist, you've got to first collect it like a capitalist.
		And so we're stuck with an imperfect system that we've got to make perfect so that it speaks to all of God's children.
		There is good capitalism, Tammy, and there's bad capitalism.
		Good capitalism is where I benefit and you benefit more.
		I think that the studio that I'm in is an example of good capitalism.
		The facial product I use this morning, the car you drive to work.
		That's an example maybe of good capitalism.
		Bad capitalism is where I benefit and you pay a price for it.
		Slavery was an example of bad capitalism.
		Predatory lending is an example of that.
		And so on and so forth.
		Number two, context does matter.
		So I agree with the caller in that regard.
		And so it does matter who's teaching it.
		That's why the banker coming in that classroom was so important for me.
		What they're teaching, how they're teaching it, what their approach is.
		I mean, again, that banker said, I'm a banker and I finance entrepreneurs.
		He didn't say I'm a banker and I charge you a lot of interest as much as I can.
		He said, I finance entrepreneurs, which fuel the economy, which create jobs.
		And so the light came on in my head that we need to connect education with aspiration.
		And that's why I've worked with now 12 U.S. Secretaries of the Treasury, nine U.S. presidents.
		Five of them have honored me from our work from both parties.
		And I've been a commission advisor to three from both parties.
		I just met with Secretary Scott Bessett this week on financial literacy and trying to get this prioritized in the country and hopefully turn into policy.
		But we've agreed to work with each other throughout this year.
		And the country, as you know, Tammy, right now, is getting an active financial literacy lesson.
		I'm not sure if you want to go in there or not, but I'm happy to talk about it.
		But, you know, everybody needs to bone up on how the system works.
		People have been reading the Constitution, the Bill of Rights, and getting a civics lesson in the last few months, few weeks.
		But now they need to get an understanding very quickly of how the economy actually works because it now affects literally everybody.
		Good comments, a lot there.
		I would last say that he didn't exactly say this, but he was speaking about class.
		The word white, white, the racial word white, is a made-up word.
		Like, the world's 5 billion years old.
		This world was created 400 years ago in America because of class systems.
		Whites and blacks got along.
		People can go research this themselves.
		But for economic reasons of the people who are in charge, they decided to create dissension to separate.
		And we still have that separation today.
		It's time to have a new business plan.
		I've written one.
		We provided it with Dr. King's Memorial observation yesterday when I was in Memphis with the mayor and a bunch of leaders in the country who are bipartisan and black and white and rich and poor.
		People can go back and watch that.
		And we've provided a business plan for America as a construct.
		There's a business plan for black America, for rural America, for Latino America, for women, for Native Americans, for Asians, and for everybody about how do we grow an inclusive economy, one that's fair and equitable for everybody, where the latter is repaired.
		And so I hope I did his question or comment some justice.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk with Joe, also in Florida and Tampa.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Joe.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Hey, this is an interesting episode of your show.
		What I'd like to say is thank you for sharing your story and how you were motivated to get into financial leadership education, not just for yourself, but for the broader country.
		What I'd like to know right now is to the extent that you have these tariffs that the president just recently levied on all these countries, I think there's 185 countries, and some of these countries actually don't have people that live there.
		For example, you know, I think it was Head Island or McDonald Island, way down there in the Arctic.
		How do you think that these countries are going to react?
		And to what extent does knowing how the economy works would enable people to actually know exactly what to do?
		That's my first question.
		The second question has to do with the federal workers that are being laid off right now.
		Doge is saying that they want to save the country a lot of money.
		As a matter of fact, Elon Musk is supposedly going to be gone next month because he's not an actual federal worker.
		It's a temporary worker.
		They're only allowed to be there by I think 130 days to become actual federal workers or not.
		Now that you have direct contact with the Treasury Secretary, what steps do you envision or are you going to recommend to them to be able to help these federal workers?
		Because again, remember, the federal government is the largest employer.
		So to the extent that there'll be a lot of cuts in the federal budget and the federal system, how is that going to trickle down to the broader economy?
		I'll get up to listen to your comments.
		Thanks.
		It's actually a very good question.
		And I want people to become more financially literate so you do more than scream at your television set.
		I want you to write letters to your member, to your Senate, your U.S. Senate member, to your White House.
		I want you to know who to write to.
		I want you to be articulate and intelligent and thoughtful when you do write and informed.
		So let me see, I can take this very quickly, step by step.
		Let's deal with the restructuring of costs issue first.
		If you take 200,000 federal workers and say that they've come to the conclusion that they're not useful anymore, or we want to reduce costs, I mean, as long as you've done an assessment of each of these departments to assure yourself that, yeah, these are the people who are doing their job and these are folks who are not.
		So the people who are not need to go, which is, I think everybody would say it's reasonable.
		I'm not sure that's what's happening, but people would say that's reasonable.
		If you do that, great.
		But 200,000 workers is equal to about three or four days of interest payments on American debt, not principal interest.
		This is, again, I like math because it doesn't have an opinion.
		This is just a fact.
		So we've spent two months talking about Reducing employment in the country, but is that really moving the needle on national debt?
		I'll let the audience decide for themselves.
		What we need to do is take, yes, get the fluff out, you know, make the government efficient.
		Yes, it's actually the most efficient government, one of them in the world.
		Certainly has one of the best structures in the world.
		That's why we're the biggest economy in the world and the superpower in the world.
		What you need to do is take the bottom third of the economy, the bottom 33% of our populations, and repair the ladder and show them how to teach them how to become responsible capitalists, as happened to me, as I've discussed in this book, the pamphlet, the Business Plan for America, and let them go up the ladder.
		That is the American story for as long as we can remember.
		You start at the bottom, you have a chance to go to the top.
		Sam Walton, pick up a truck in the storefront.
		That's Walmart today.
		The guy who started UPS was literally a messenger rider on a bicycle.
		Goldman Sachs was a guy named Goldman and a guy named Sachs selling financial services door to door.
		Every big business was a small one.
		So let dreamers dream and add to the national prosperity.
		That's how you're going to really solve this: expanding GDP.
		You'll expand GDP 2% to 3%.
		This is financial literacy.
		If you empower the bottom to join the economy and have them not as a subsidy or not as an entitlement, but as an empowered contributing citizen, your comment about tariffs.
		I'm not going to get into what the Secretary of State would do or what our foreign advisor to the president, so I respect people's roles.
		I'm not going to deal with how a country would respond to this.
		I will say just a fact: a tariff is a tax on the entity that is receiving the goods and the consumers who then are going to get the price, in all likelihood, the price increase.
		So if these continue, in the short term, they can be used as a negotiating tactic.
		So I don't know what the White House's strategy is, but if they're successful, these will be over soon and they'll get some negotiating advantage off of whatever country they think is important to them.
		If these continue, the importer, the recipient of the goods, is paying not a dollar, in this example, they're paying $1.25, $1.50, whatever the tariff is for that country.
		It is not the country paying the tax.
		That business in America is paying it.
		That lowers their profit.
		What are they likely to do?
		Raise profits, raise prices in all likelihood.
		This is not my opinion.
		I'm just giving you the facts of the matter.
	And so you've got inflation that's sticky, and now you've got potentially higher consumer prices that may create a slowing economy.
	Now, I intentionally did not cover this with the Secretary of the Treasury.
	He's a good man.
	I really respect him and like him.
	We had a lot of stuff to cover in an hour.
	But the president's been talking about this since 1980.
	And to me, the train has left the station.
	He was going to do this, and now we need to see how it plays out.
	So it was sort of ridiculous for me to enter a debate where the discussion, where the decision has already been made, and put him in an uncomfortable position to answer a question that's not his, wasn't his question to begin with.
	So I think we've got to figure out what we can do.
	What do we have control over?
	We, you and me.
	We have control of our lives.
	We control it.
	I can't tell you that being positive is going to make you a success, but I absolutely guarantee that being negative is going to make you fail.
	I can't guarantee you that financial literacy is going to set you free, but financial illiteracy will set you from, will separate you from your wallet, or somebody's going to do it for you.
	So we need to empower ourselves.
	We need to read up.
	We need to become very articulate in these issues.
	That's why, again, I wrote this business plan for the country, for different groups in the country who've been challenged.
	We used, we stood in the back or in the foundation of Dr. King's unfinished work.
	Where do we go from here, his last book, just yesterday, to chart a course forward for those who need hope right now.
	And at the end of this month, we're going to try to inspire the whole country with Green Socks Day, by the way.
	Walmart has produced these socks at cost.
	And we're going to try to get the whole country on April 30th to not black or white, not red or blue, no friction, no drama, whether you're urban or rural, or black or white, or rich or poor.
	We're going to get everybody to put on a green sock, tag it Green Socks Day, and upload that to your social media platforms.
	And NASDAQ's going to put the best of those tags and experiences on their big board.
	And NASDAQ can help you ring the invite the best to come to ring the bell to New York Stock Exchange in May.
	So these are some positive things that are going on.
	Here's some things that you can do not to be frustrated and screaming at your television set that I think have a chance to make the country better, sustainably better.
	Because again, Tammy, this is the biggest economy in the world.
	And 70% of it is not rich people.
	It's not big business.
	It's not the government.
	70% of this economy is consumer spending.
	It's you and me paying a car note, paying for coffee this morning, going to breakfast, going on vacation, going to the barber shop, the nail salon.
	You have enormous power, you, to help to write the future for this country.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk with Ted and Cleveland, Ohio.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Ted.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I find your story very inspirational.
		Thank you.
		I am involved in a financial literacy business with Orrin Woodward and Chris Brady.
		I don't know if you ever even heard of those names, but they are incredible guys.
		And what there is out there right now, sometimes some people don't like it, but there's something out there called the media war.
		And there's some people that don't want to watch too much television anymore.
		They'd rather listen to audios, read good books, and go out and talk to a lot of people.
		When you're reading books like How to Win Friends and Influence People, The Magic of Thinking Big, incredible stuff.
		Many years back, I was involved with someone named Dexter Yeager.
		You probably knew who that was.
		That guy was something else.
		But anyway, I really appreciate you and your story.
		The only other thing I just want to squeeze in here is that when you purchase something with a credit card, too often, that percentage is driving people so far in debt.
		It's getting bad.
		And I don't mean to say this in a negative way towards people who use that to earn money.
		They're involved in that business, maybe.
		But in a way to save it, you've got to, we've got to be financially literate and not spend so much.
		Learn how to save.
		And that doesn't mean be a hoarded.
		But if you're in debt, you got to get out.
		And sometimes you even have to get rid of your cable TV because mine was out for a while.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Ted, we'll get a response.
unidentified		Just watch C-SPAN.
		Just watch C-SPAN.
		Once again, by the way, I really give kudos to C-SPAN for giving America a voice.
		I don't know anybody else who does this, by the way.
		It's very important for people to feel they have a voice and can articulate it.
		Yes, generally, I agree with the gentleman.
		You should not become a hoarder.
		You should not just slam your foot on the brakes and just say, I'm not going to do anything.
		That's not good for the economy.
		It's not even good for you.
		But you should make thoughtful decisions.
		Do you need to go to a commercial coffee company, retail store, five times a week?
		You can probably get a home coffee maker and make your own coffee three times a week and then go out as a special occasion.
		Do you need to go to a restaurant as often as you do?
		Well, you should probably still go to the restaurant.
		That's a small business.
		You want to support them.
		But you should probably be thoughtful at the beginning of your budget about how often you go out.
		If your outflow exceeds your inflow, then your overhead will be your downfall.
		Here's one for you, Tammy.
		There's a difference between making money and building wealth.
		This is a freebie for everybody.
		Making money is called making a living, literally making a living.
		As I said with the statistics on income, it doesn't matter how much money you make, you can spend it.
		But building wealth, you build wealth in your sleep.
		Stocks, bonds, home ownership, number one way you build wealth in America.
		Real estate in general.
		Small business ownership, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera.
		I want everybody listening to this to, I'm a landlord in my private sector business, but I want you to go from rent to own.
		I want you to own a piece of the American pie.
		There aren't growing any more land.
		I want you to be thoughtful and smart and think about buying into the stock market.
		Right now it's a bargain.
		If you have a long view and you buy good stocks, the history of this country is things go up.
		At some point, there's a recession.
		Things recess, reset.
		I have a podcast called Money and Wealth where I break these topics down, by the way.
		And then it resets above the line, right?
		So you go up, it resets, recession, and then resets above the line.
		That's stocks, that's real estate, that's GDP, or three things that have never gone down in the country long term.
		I'm not giving financial advice.
		I'm telling you, again, the facts of how things work.
		And historically, up until now, we've had these consistencies.
		So unless the whole game is over in America, we make such a bad mistake that the whole bet's off and somebody else leads the world.
		As long as we are still the biggest economy in the world right now, we're 25% of the world economy and we're about 40% of wealth in the world.
		There's a shot for everybody listening to this to go from the bottom to the top.
		There's a shot for everybody watching this to become literally an American success story in your family and your community.
		And I want you inspired by that.
		The short term is going to be tough.
		I am not convinced that Manufacturing, traditional manufacturers coming back home.
		I think that ship left the station, sailed 40, 50 years ago.
		But you will have high-tech manufacturing.
		Is that enough?
		Who knows?
		It will be artificial intelligence.
		It will be technology-driven.
		This is a consumer economy.
		That's not changing anytime soon.
		So, and even if you wanted to build factories, that would take two, five, ten years to get all that infrastructure in place and get people trained.
		So, there's going to be this period of disconnection and disjointment.
		There's opportunities there for those who are entrepreneurial.
		And then the country will literally rely more and more on the people watching C-SPAN to get us through this, which means you still need to support your small businesses, still go to your nail salon, and still go to your, I mean, when you go to get your hair cut, you're being a great American.
		When you go get your nails done or you go to the dentist's office, that's a small business.
		You're being a great American.
	So, I mean, we're sitting in a moment in history right now.
	But history does not feel historic when you're sitting in it.
	It just feels like another day.
	And, you know, we're a country that disagrees.
	I mean, you have protests and you've got prosperity.
	We disagree with each other, but we can do that without being disagreeable.
	You can support whoever your president is without necessarily agreeing with him.
	I mean, we only have one president at a time, so the election's over, support whoever it is.
	But that doesn't mean that you have to sit back and go, yeah, I agree with everything they say.
	Again, make your voice known.
	And sometimes people make mistakes, and then we've got to correct those mistakes.
	So this is all financial literacy.
	This is all understanding how the system works and then leaning into it and being the change you want to see in the world.
	That's my positive challenge to everybody watching: if you want to do something simple, do something for financial literacy in your neighbor or your community, put a green sock on on April 30th, upload it on social media, and take the quiz on financial literacy and teach in your local classroom.
	Download the business plan for America or for Black America or Latinos or whatever group you're super focused on, and go in your local community or in your household and start doing things to operationalize that plan.
	You can do half of this plan without even the government's assistance.
	You can do it all yourself.
	Raising credit scores alone, Tammy, will create $750 billion worth of wealth creation just for African Americans in the next 20 years.
	Just that one thing.
	I wish we had time to talk about the power of credit scores in this country because that's absolutely transformational.
	Again, it's within your power.
	There are things that you can do other than just being frustrated.
tammy thueringer ▲ ● ▼		Our guest, John Hope Bryant, Operation Hope founder and CEO.
		You can find out more about the organization online at operationhope.org.
		You can find out more about the organization as well as their initiatives and that Green Sock Day challenge that John mentioned.
		John, thank you so much for being with us.
		We did not get through everything, but we will make sure to have you back.

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