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March 16, 2025 10:01-13:07 - CSPAN

03:05:56

Washington This Week

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Main

batya ungar-sargon

newsnation 25:44

kimberly adams

cspan 33:01

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brian lamb

cspan 00:39

donald j trump

admin 01:15

jd vance

admin 00:31

keir starmer

gbr 00:35

meryl gordon

00:34

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patty murray

sen/d 00:04

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Speaker	Time	Text
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Called in today for Washington Journal.
		That's all the time we have for our show today.
		We'll be back tomorrow with another edition of Washington Journal starting tomorrow at 7 a.m. Eastern.
		We hope you'll join us and have a great day.
unidentified		Coming up Monday morning, we'll talk with Center for American Progress President and former Biden Domestic Policy Council Director Neera Tandon about Democrats' response to the Trump administration and GOP agenda.
		And then Taylor Popolar, Spectrum News National Political Reporter, reviews White House News of the Day.
		Also, editor-in-chief of the National Review Rich Lowry discusses the Trump administration and Republican agenda.
		C-SPAN's Washington Journal.
		Join in the conversation live at 7 Eastern Monday morning on C-SPAN, C-SPAN Now, or online at cspan.org.
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		Today we'll feature authors Jonathan Turley, Amanda Becker, Clay Risen, and Paola Ramos.
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kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		President Trump came into office promising to improve the economy, and last week he issued another round of tariffs as part of that plan, prompting retaliatory tariffs from U.S. allies.
		The fluctuations in trade policy and general uncertainty about the future of the U.S. economy have more and more Americans worried.
		And this morning, we want to know what you think.
		Are you optimistic or pessimistic about the direction of the economy?
		Our phone lines for Democrats, 202-748-8000.
		For Republicans, 202-748-8001.
		For Independents, 202-748-8002.
		If you'd like to text us, that number is 202-748-8003.
unidentified		But please be sure to include your name and where you're writing in from.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		And on social media, you can find us at facebook.com/slash C-SPAN and on X at C-SPANWJ.
		The Wall Street Journal is wrapping up some of the economic news of the week, including consumer sentiment numbers saying consumer sentiment sours.
		Uncertainty around the economy, tariffs, funding cuts, and jobs begins to take a toll.
		Consumer sentiment in the U.S. sank this month as worries intensify over what the tariffs, government layoffs, funding cuts, and immigration restrictions that President Trump has introduced might mean for the economy.
		The University of Michigan's Closely Watch Index of Consumer Sentiment nosedived another 11 percent to 57.9 in mid-March from 64.7 last month, continuing a downward trend that has taken hold since Trump took office.
		That marked the lowest level since November of 2022 and was much weaker than the 63.2 percent, 63.2 excuse me, that economists polled by the Wall Street Journal expected.
		Compared with a year earlier, consumer sentiment is down 27 percent.
		That aligns with some reporting in thehill.com, which found other polling, nearly half of Americans say the economy is worsening, and that's according to an economist YouGov poll.
		That poll took place between March 9th and March 11th, a period that included rough days for the stock market.
		On Monday, the stock market started the week with intense losses.
		That day, the Dow Jones Industrial Average closed with a loss of 890 points, dropping 2.1 percent.
		Since the start of the month, stocks have been dropping steadily due to underwhelming economic data and President Trump's tariff plans, but the sell-off escalated on Monday.
		Now, some details from that YouGov Economist poll.
		The people's view of the economy: 48% said that they think the economy is getting worse.
		26% say they think it's the same.
		19% said they think it's getting better.
		7% saying they're not sure.
		And again, a big component of how people are viewing the economy is what's happening with trade policy and tariffs.
		There's an Ipsos Reuters recent poll on that and how people view the tariff regime that is being rolled out by the Trump administration.
		57% find Trump's economic moves to be too erratic, only 37% disagreeing with that idea.
		On the question of whether people support tariffs even if prices were to increase, 49% disagree with that, only 32% agree.
		And whether or not American workers will come out ahead with tariffs, 31% agree, 49% disagree.
		That coming from a Reuters-Ipsos poll.
		Now then, when it comes to tariff, Vice President JD Vance was defending the administration's policies in a statement at an event in Michigan on Friday.
		Let's listen.
unidentified		And you see so many people attacking the president's economic programs and attacking the progress that we've made over the past seven weeks.
		You hear people saying, well, how dare Donald Trump impose tariffs on foreign countries that have been taking advantage of us for 40 years?
		And the answer is that unless you're willing to use American power to fight back against what those countries have been doing for a generation, you are never going to rebuild American manufacturing and you're never going to support the American workers.
		President Trump is done with leaders who talk, talk, talk.
		We are an administration that is going to do things for the American people and for American workers.
		Just think about this.
jd vance ▲ ● ▼		When foreign countries make it impossible to ship American cars into their countries, why have we had leadership that refuses to fight back?
unidentified		When we have foreign countries that use slave labor that undercuts the wages of American workers, why have we had American leadership that has refused to fight back?
jd vance ▲ ● ▼		When you let literal slaves make stuff cheaply and then bring it into our country, we all know, you all know, that destroys the wages of American workers.
		And so now we have an American media that says, how dare Donald Trump stand up for the American worker?
		I think I speak for the American worker when I say thank God for President Trump for finally standing up for the American worker.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Now some general numbers, the real clear politics average of Trump's approval on the economy right now, excuse me, the overall, yes, Trump's approval on the economy right now, 51% disapprove of how President Trump is handling the economy.
		44% approve.
		Let's hear what you all think, starting with Steve in Marble Falls, Texas, on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Steve.
unidentified		Hey.
		Well, listen, I just think on this past Ron, it's going to be a train wreck.
		He's, you know, taxing people by these tariffs.
		It's going to force inflation up.
		Then he's taking all the immigrants out of the country.
		There's not going to be anybody to pick the avocados and all that kind of thing.
		And I mean, you know, you just played that clip about JD Vance saying all this stuff about, it's just smoke and mirrors, really.
		He's lying.
		Most of that's lying.
		Now, there's some truth to it about government waste and all that sort of stuff.
		But you have to take a scalpel to it.
		You don't just take a sledgehammer and beat up everything.
		He's like a kid.
		He's like a kid.
		He just doesn't, they don't know what they're doing.
		I think they're really trying to take the government down and just take over like a dictatorship, like a Nazi regime.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Steve, have you felt any changes in your own personal economic life as a result of some of the moves that the administration has made?
unidentified		Well, it seems I don't think the impact is quite what it's going to be yet, but I haven't seen really anything go down much.
unidentified		Go up, if anything.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Let's hear from Duncan in Birmingham, Alabama on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Duncan.
unidentified		Good morning, ma'am.
		Can you hear me?
		Yes.
		I think the economy has been great under Trump so far.
		You know, it's been a lot easier to pay rents for us to go to the grocery store.
		Our kids are thriving.
		And in fact, the economy has been so well that me and my wife actually got some proceedings.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Oliver is in Falls Church, Virginia on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Oliver.
unidentified		Can you hear me?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I can hear you, Oliver.
unidentified		Yes, good morning, sweetheart.
		Thank you for accepting my call.
		I'm going to be quick.
		I know I'm on the independent line, I believe.
		I called in on that line because I divorced myself from the Democrats after what Chuck Schumer did to us this past weekend.
		Chuck Schumer has got to be replaced as the leader of the Democrats.
		We have to fight Donald Trump.
		He will take all our rights away and steal from the American people while he's telling them he's doing it.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Oliver, this segment is on whether or not you're optimistic or pessimistic about the economy.
		Obviously, whether or not the government is funded has impact on the economy.
		But more broadly, are you optimistic or pessimistic about where the U.S. economy is right now?
unidentified		Ma'am, listen, I'm very optimistic if we can get the Democrats to fight back against this push from that Vladimir Putin fan that we have in the overall office right now.
		Donald Trump is a disaster for this country, and the American people are going to regret one day what they had done by putting that man back in the White House so he'll have another place to hide if he has the attack, the capital attack.
		Again, he's got another kitchen in the White House he can hide in while it's going on.
		He's a disgrace.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's hear from Steve in Velucia County, Florida on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Steve.
		Are you optimistic or pessimistic about the economy right now?
unidentified		Oh, I'm pessimistic.
		I think, well, real quickly about the tariffs.
		I work for a small business, and we pay these tariffs.
		China doesn't pay tariffs.
		They're laughing at us.
		The government charges the couriers and the couriers turn around and charge us penny for penny.
		This is basically a tax on small businesses and a tax on consumers.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Steve, can you say a bit more about how your small business is being affected by the tariffs?
unidentified		Yes.
unidentified		It's increasing the price of what we import, and we have to import certain things.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Like what?
unidentified		And because there's nobody that manufactures them here.
		What kind of products are they?
		They're medical products.
		And before medical products were exempt, and now they're not exempt.
		Now that Trump's tariffs came in, they're not.
		And well, that's the first thing.
		But the second thing is, once these corporate tax cuts come into effect, the corporations are going to buy back their stock.
		Nobody's going to create jobs.
		It's going to inflate the price of their stock.
		People are going to borrow money because they know that that stock's going up.
		Then it's going to create a false picture of the stock market.
		And then the first recession that comes along, there's going to be another stock market crash, just like Reagan's stock market crash in 1987, just like the savings and loan debacle for George Bush, and just like 2008.
		And the only reason it didn't happen to Donald Trump in his first term is because the only reason the economy didn't melt down over these corporate tax cuts over the supply-side economics is because COVID beat them to it.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So, Steve, you mentioned back to the topic of the tariffs, that some of the inputs for the products that you sell are going to be subject to the tariffs.
		Who's going to eat that cost?
		Is that going to be your business?
		Is it going to be your customers?
		What's going to happen with that increased cost of those tariffs?
unidentified		Well, it's really putting a squeeze on businesses.
		I mean, you know, the people who import these products are, they're paying the penny of the tariffs.
		And then, you know, the small businesses have, or, you know, any business has to make a decision as to whether or not they're going to pass it on to their consumers.
		And I feel like a lot of that's going to get passed on to the consumers just because the businesses are getting squeezed.
		they have to pass it on just to stay in business.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		What are you going to do?
unidentified		I'm not the CEO of the corporation, and I can't really say what we're going to do, but I predict that a very substantial portion of all these companies are going to pass it on to their consumers.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Thank you, Steve.
		Let's look at the Wall Street Journal, which has a blow-by-blow of where things stand with the President's tariffs, including the tariffs on Canada and Mexico.
		There's a 25% import tariff on goods from Mexico and Canada that took effect March 4th, with an exception for energy products and potash, which received a 10% tariffs.
		Then those tariffs were suspended until April 2nd for autos.
		Canada responded by placing $21 billion in tariffs on U.S. items, including fruits and vegetables, appliance, and liquor.
		Canada also said it would tariff an additional $20.6 billion in U.S. imported goods in response to Trump's steel and aluminum tariffs.
		On the steel and aluminum tariffs, the Trump administration imposed a 25% tariff on all steel and aluminum imports on March 12th.
		Canada retaliated by imposing that additional levy.
		The European Union responded with a 50% import tariff on American whiskey, motorcycles, and motorboats starting April 1st, and additional tariffs beginning mid-April on American chewing gum, poultry, soybeans, and other goods.
		Trump responded by threatening 200 percent tariffs on alcohol from the EU.
		And there are even more going on with China and the European Union.
		President Trump spoke with CEOs last week at a business roundtable event here in Washington, D.C., defending the administration's use of tariffs.
		Let's listen to what the president said.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		The tariffs are having a tremendously positive impact.
unidentified		They will have, and they are having.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		We have car companies that are not building in Mexico now.
		They're building in the United States.
		Some of them, the plants were already started and they stopped construction.
		Now they're going to build in the United States.
		It was very unfair that they'd build in Mexico and sell them across the border with no tax, no nothing.
unidentified		They'd take away our jobs.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		They'd close up places in Michigan and all over the country.
		And they'd build them in Mexico.
		In many cases, they were owned by China, built in Mexico, owned by China.
		And that's all stopped now.
unidentified		They're all coming here.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		Honda is building a massive plant in different places, Indiana, South Carolina, but also in Michigan, a lot in Michigan.
unidentified		A lot of activity is happening.
unidentified		They're looking all over the place for places.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		And that's because there is a good spirit.
		There's a renewed spirit.
		And also, very importantly, the tariffs are, they don't want to pay 25% or whatever it may be.
unidentified		It may go up higher, maybe go up higher.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		Look, the higher it goes, the more likely it is they're going to build.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		And ultimately, the biggest win is not the tariff.
unidentified		That's a big win.
unidentified		That's a lot of money.
donald j trump ▲ ● ▼		But the biggest win is if they move into our country and produce jobs.
		That's a bigger win than the tariffs themselves.
		But the tariffs are going to be throwing off a lot of money to this country.
		And we've been ripped off for years by other countries, many, many decades.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Again, our question this morning is whether you're optimistic or pessimistic about the U.S. economy.
		We received a Facebook post from Karen Phelps who says, optimistic.
		We just went through four years of hell.
		I know it's going to benefit us.
		President Trump is doing what is best for America.
		Biden didn't or whoever was really running the White House.
		Gas is already down and noticed some other prices as well.
		Now, if all these radical leftist judges would stop blocking him, we'll be okay.
		And then Elena Holland says, optimistic, it's time to undo the destruction of the last four years.
		Let's, and actually, the Washington Examiner has some reporting on the prices.
		We actually got a Consumer Price Index report last week, and the White House celebrated those numbers, saying that they are moving in the right direction.
		With the White House cheered, a drop in inflation in February as President Donald Trump fends off growing scrutiny over his handling of the economy.
		The latest consumer price index released in a new report Wednesday showed annual inflation dropping from 3% in January to 2.8% in February, while core inflation, which factors out food and energy prices, was recorded at 3.1%.
		Both metrics registered a tenth of a percentage point below forecasts.
		Back to your calls.
		Eddie is in Millbury, Massachusetts on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Eddie.
unidentified		Good morning.
		As a Republican, I'm sorry to say I am very pessimistic because it's the obstructionist Chuck Schumer.
		He just wants to use the filibuster.
		And then the increase of 30% that Joe added to the employees, federal government employees, Donald is just trying to eliminate some of them.
		But it's the liberal judges that are stopping him.
		So how are you going to get things done?
		We have a $2 trillion deficit spending, and we can't stop it.
		Tariffs are necessary.
		President George Washington, in order to preserve the nation to support a military, added tariffs to Boston, to New York, Philadelphia on imported goods.
		And it was only released, only eliminated in 1914 with World War I.
		It's a way of taxing foreigners that we can produce it here.
		But it's going to be a tough job with too many obstructionists.
		Thank you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Next up is Ace in Louisiana on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Ace.
unidentified		Good morning, yes.
		Overall, I would say I am very pessimistic about the state of this economy because what Donald Trump is saying is that, oh, well, it's bringing more people in here.
		It's bringing more people into our economy because they don't want to pay 25% tariffs.
		But here is the thing that he does not realize.
		Our economy, and this is a hard pill to swallow, our economy is built off of exploitation of immigrant labor.
		It's just the hard truth.
		And yes, with some companies, while they may be more attracted to come back here, there are others who may decide, you know what, we're leaving.
		We're changing operations, and we're going to switch over to some country like, say, oh, I don't know, Thailand, for example, Thailand, Vietnam, something like that.
		And moreover, with these, my bad, my bad, hold on.
		I get nervous, my first time calling you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		That's okay.
unidentified		Well, thanks for being a first-time caller.
		You're welcome.
		You're welcome.
		Overall, he's talking about how, well, this is going to bring American jobs.
		It's going to basically be some sort of national, almost industrial revolution, if you will.
		But he doesn't realize that, you know, somebody's got to put food on the table.
		Somebody's got to, you know, build stuff for us.
		Somebody's got to do all these things.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Melvin is in Richmond, Virginia, on our line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Melvin.
		Good morning, Kimberly.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		Kimberly, I always look forward to seeing you on Sunday mornings and when my 30 days is up to getting calls to call and speak with you.
		But I digress.
		Kimberly, the subject is whether I am optimistic or pessimistic on this economy.
		Of course, I'm pessimistic.
		This economy is in trouble.
		It's in deep trouble because we have a guy in there who is his one job is to line his pockets with money and do it by taking away the money from the American people.
		And the sad part is that Americans were never taught economics.
		So therefore, they don't have any understanding as to what a tariff does.
		A tariff is a tax and a tax on the people because while he may raise the price on imported goods, the money that comes from that gets passed on to the consumer.
		And then, of course, that tax goes into the coffers that he can then use to give tax cuts to the rich.
		We are in bad shape.
		If anybody looked at the actual economics of the past week, we see the stock market is down.
		I mean, the stock market on December the 12th was about $45,000 for the Dow Jones Industrials.
		And this week it lost, it was down to almost $5,000.
		The price of gold is up.
		It's over almost always has set a new record of $3,000.
		And the only optimistic thing that you can take away from this, as being a person who really can't do anything at all about it, is that his supporters, his mega people, are going to be the ones that will be affected the most by this.
		So, yes, I'm very pessimistic about this economy.
		You know?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, Melvin.
unidentified		Thank you for taking my call.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Looking forward, there are many other people who have a similar outlook on tariffs in particular as what Melvin expressed in terms of how they might affect general Americans.
		This is from that economist YouGov poll with 60% saying that tariffs will hurt the average American, only 13% saying they will help.
		21% are not sure, and 6% say that there will be no effect.
		Donald is in Raleigh, North Carolina, on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Donald.
unidentified		Good morning, Kimberly.
		I'm optimistic.
		I don't really have a lot of faith in Donald Trump, but I've done well financially.
		And I think if the American people start saving, as soon as they get a job and become an adult, they'll put theirself in a safer position.
		So that's the way I see it.
		And I think we're going to be all right.
		I've got a positive attitude.
		So let's just keep on doing what we got to do, America.
		Just get that dictator out of there.
		All right, have a good day.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Steve is in Indio, California, on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Steve.
unidentified		Yeah, good morning.
		With respect to the tariffs, a large portion of that will be offset by exchange rates.
		So, the tariffs aren't going to be quite as much as what we see.
		And with respect to the overall economy, we're going to go through a bit of a rough period here until the reciprocal tariffs are in place.
		And then, when that occurs, probably sometime in the next six to 12 months, the economy is going to boom.
		And so, I'm very optimistic about the economy.
		And although I'm over 90% in cash at the point in time, over the next six months, I'll be going 100% into equities.
		So, I think we have a very, very positive outlook.
		And I think everything is going to turn out to be all peaches and cream.
		Thank you for taking my call.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Steve mentioned how tariffs might affect exchange rates.
		Yahoo Finance has a bit more information on that: how tariffs affect exchange rates between countries and currencies.
		Tariffs influence exchange rates by altering trade flows and affecting the demand for currencies.
		Tariffs can favor a stronger domestic currency by reducing imports and improving trade balance.
		A positive trade balance increases the demand for the domestic currency in international markets.
		Here's how it works: when a country imposes tariffs on imports, it often reduces the volume of goods coming into the country.
		This can decrease the demand for foreign currency.
		This is because fewer imports mean fewer payments to foreign suppliers.
		In turn, this reduced demand can lead to a stronger domestic currency relative to the foreign currency.
		For example, if the United States imposes high tariffs on goods from China, U.S. businesses may purchase fewer goods from China.
		Consequently, there will be less demand for China's currency, potentially weakening it when compared to the U.S. dollar.
		However, retaliation by China, such as imposing tariffs on U.S. exports, could create counterbalancing effects.
		David is in Denison, Texas, on our line for Republicans.
		David, are you optimistic or pessimistic about the economy?
unidentified		I'm extremely optimistic about it, and I recommend everybody to read No Trade is Free Trade by Bob Lighthizer, Trump's current ambassador, free trade top guy.
		And he was the top guy in the previous administration and responsible for shepherding most of the negotiations regarding China, South Korea, Japan, and many other countries.
		This is an extremely complicated situation.
		And right now, what we've got is a guy that's been president and in partial control because he keeps getting hit with ridiculous lawsuits, keeps getting that hasn't had time to affect anything.
		This tariff situation is far worse than what most people think, but it's not going to hurt us.
		It's going to hurt everybody else.
		We're running a trillion-dollar-plus deficit to the world.
		That is money coming out of the United States and going elsewhere.
		We are having a wealth transfer.
		We've been experiencing a wealth transfer for decades now.
		It's especially accelerated since the Chinese were led into the World Trade Organization around 2000.
		The news reports, all they're asking is, how is this going to hurt America?
		They don't ask anything about how this is going to hurt the rest of the world and why we have scenarios where the other countries always cave to Trump and these things really quickly.
		The current tariffs with China and Mexico weren't about trade.
		They were about the drugs.
		The trade part starts on April 2nd.
		That's when the issues regarding reciprocal tariffs come into play.
		Mexico, we buy 80% of Mexico's exports.
		We are responsible for 80% of their economy.
		If we had something happen between us and Mexico that caused us to stop that or do something that caused their exports to go way down, they're shutting down half their country.
		Same for Canada: 77% of what Canada sells to the world, they sell to us.
		We get 17% from Canada, 17% for Mexico.
		They will be in deep stuff so fast, there's no way that they can win a trade war with the United States.
		The same thing for China.
		They are a total export economy.
		They're in a deflationary state.
		They've been going downhill for three years.
		Their economy is so upside down.
		They are not a market economy.
		We need to have different trade rules for dealing with non-market economies, aka communist economies.
		It's not the same thing.
		Plus, if Trump deals with the fair trade part of this, which is incredible that we could be at such a point after all these decades, where we're just as a quick example, please, when Germany exports a car to America, say it's a $50,000 car.
		That's what the value, that's what they are selling it to America for.
		They get a rebate on their value-added tax, which is how most of Europe finances their governments is this value-added tax, which ultimately ends up being on average about 20%.
		When Germany exports that car to America, we charge them 2.5%.
		They get a 20% rebate at least on the value of that car for taxes they've already paid to Europe because they want to increase their exports.
		That means that that $50,000 car in Germany is landed in America at $42,500.
		We export a car to them that costs us $50,000.
		It gets a 10% tariff, not 2.5%, which adds $5,000.
		They charge us the VAT, which adds another $10,000.
		So our $50,000 car becomes $62,500 there.
		Their $50,000 becomes $42,500 here.
		That's why we have no Chevrolets in Germany.
		It's an impossible situation that's been developing over the years.
		Trump is the first one to deal with this.
		He's been consistent about this for 30 years in his speeches and conversations.
		He understands the global economy in this respect.
		We have had our trade policies.
		The biggest thing that happened was when the United States signed on to the World Trade Organization in 1994.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		David, I think we've got your idea.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I'm going to go ahead.
unidentified		Please, one more quick thing.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Real quick, David.
unidentified		That took tariff, that took the control of our using tariffs to control things out of our hands.
		We had to go through them to do anything.
		Up until then, we had control of our economy like that, and that was what was causing things to work out better.
		The Reagan, the guy mentioned 1987, the stock market.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, David.
		Let's go to Roy in Miami, Florida on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Roy.
		And can you turn down the volume on your TV, please, Roy?
		All right, we're going to try to come back to Roy.
		Stephen is in Pinnacle, North Carolina, on our line for independence.
		Good morning, Stephen.
		Stephen, good morning.
unidentified		Can you hear me?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I can.
unidentified		Okay.
		Three quick things, if you would, please.
		I've been in the real legitimate media industry for 70 years as a paid byline.
		My specialty is business and trade publications.
		I've seen it all.
		I suggest a quick review: go to the Lakeland Ledger, Voice of the People section, July 2nd, 2018, and look at an article I had: public calls for illegal families.
		Just for your own FYI, I attend market centers.
		Ask your business people if they know what they are.
		That's where the world does business, business.
		I've been through it all.
		I've seen the ups.
		I've seen the downs.
		I've known Donald and his family since 64.
		He knows what he's doing and he's doing what has to be done.
		I'm very optimistic.
		I'm very optimistic.
		I'm in the middle of North Carolina, beautiful country.
		I watched our furniture industry go down the tubes because of the last 30, 40 years, well, whatever, you know, the drill.
		I'm watching it come back.
		So, to answer your question, I'm optimistic.
		We have a businessman in charge, not a politician.
		And by the way, you are sitting where you are because 40 years ago, Marilyn Nason kicked the doors open in the communications centers in New York and helped let women in.
		Good luck to you, my love, and take care and be careful.
		Thank you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Les is in Sandy, Oregon on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Les.
unidentified		Hi, good morning to you.
		Good morning.
		I'm optimistic this morning.
		Anyhow, being a farm boy, the economy really took care of the cattle situation, strawberries and stuff in the United States.
		Well, when these presidents in the past say, well, we've got to get food from another country or something, this is where the farmers and ranchers go down the hill and they lose their farms.
		I have friends that own nurseries, and the Democrats have put them where they lost their money.
		And so this is where we're heading in the past, and he's trying to straighten it out.
		And so I'm for him because he knows what he's doing.
		And like the gentleman from Texas, he is a businessman.
		He knows what he's doing.
		So I'm going to let you go.
		Bye-bye.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Lori is in Hamburg, Pennsylvania, on our line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Lori.
		Hi, I'm optimistic that the American people can get this straightened out.
		I'm very pessimistic about what Trump is doing right now, or Trump and his team members, because his cabinet members are made up of people that want the system to fail because they don't want to be, they don't want to have regulations on their goods.
		And the reason that we had so much manufacturing in the country after World War II is because the rest of the world was pretty much decimated.
		They couldn't build manufacturing.
		So when the time came, I mean, it's a global economy now.
		If you look back to 2012, the conservative rationale for budget, for beauty budget cuts is an explanation of why we're going through these consequences right now.
		They cut social programs, health, education, and they brought in a new age of austerity in 2012.
		And that was when Obama was done.
		They cut taxes on the wealthy because everybody else was supposed to pull up their bootstraps.
		Throughout history, the underclass of people have been used to push for smaller government.
		And also, over in Germany, they pay a very high price for their vehicles over there.
		I don't care.
		I don't know what they're charging for the tariffs here to come in, but they pay very high prices, but they also have health care.
		They have a huge social safety net for all of them.
		My husband works with people that live in Germany because his company is world is a global company.
		It bothers them sometimes when their prices are so high, but the rest of their lives are stressless.
		Their government is there that protects them.
		They all have health care, and they want to privatize that here.
		Well, they have privatized it.
		The privatization of the hospital, the hospital is burst, and then they closing, they filed bankruptcy.
		And it's not working because healthcare is not something you can profit off of.
		You can't say, I mean, look at the kid that's in jail now.
		I don't want to mention it because I don't want to get into that.
		But that affected people.
		People acted in a way that they shouldn't have, but they have been feeling hardship and been struggling for so, so long because a lot of our programs were taken.
		We've been living in anti-social spending project that was started under the extremism of the new Republican Party.
		And we have been struggling.
		So, yes, we're mad.
		Yes, we were angry.
		And Trump used that anger.
		And used that anger.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Gene is in Virginia on our line for Republicans.
unidentified		Good morning, Gene.
		Good morning.
		Yes, this is rough times.
		I am pessimistic mainly because of the way that we've gone about things.
		And if you have, I mean, tariffs, you've got people losing jobs, you're laying them off, they're being mentally abused by getting their packages or their workplace items and being marched out and escorted out their workplace that they've committed and done.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		You're talking about the layoffs in the federal workforce?
unidentified		Yes, yes.
		I mean, you know, that's going to really have an effect on them.
		I'm retired now, retired from the Army, and I'm fully retired now.
		But I really feel for them.
		Just seeing things like that, it's painful to me, so I know it's painful to them.
		I was never a supporter of the gentleman or the man that's in charge now.
		However, and the vice president, he as well, he's saying, speaking the other night, talking about, you know, the things that are done.
		He's inexperienced.
		Just look at the facts, people.
		Look at the facts.
		And Congress is who I look to.
		Congress is going to have to fix this.
		All of Congress.
		They're going to have to work together.
		They are supposed to be the one in charge.
		We have three legislative branches.
		Now, come on, we got to get back to basics.
		But look at what's going on.
		If you've got 80,000 people you're laying off, let's just say from the VA, that's 80,000 people that are unemployed, that are going to have to find employment.
		If you're putting tariffs on these other countries and these other countries are putting tariffs on us, we have to supply and demand.
		I've often said also, if we want to see how successful of a businessman, then look at Atlantic City.
		Atlantic City never recovered.
		They never recovered.
		But 80,000 people from one organization, the VA, that's 80,000 people on the economy.
		80,000 people that circulated a dollar within our economy or an economy somewhere else.
		I used to order offline overseas, you know, to these companies clothing.
		I don't anymore because what they've done now is they upcharge the price of the clothing, which I'm going to now have to pay in order to get that item from overseas.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's move on to Rod, who is in Lewisburg, Tennessee, on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Rod.
unidentified		Hello.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Hi there.
unidentified		Hey, I'm 65 today.
		I'm disabled.
		I'm in the hospital.
		Thank you.
		And I draw about $1,300 a month.
		We're not supposed to draw a lot more.
		I got two or three.
		I'm optimistic because I believe Mr. Trump is trying hard to give America back to Americans and build us up for we'll have something to be strong again and won't be kicked around by other nations.
		And his best friend's the richest man in the world.
		So, you know, he's pretty smart.
		So he's helping them and they're going to be fine.
		And I want to say something.
		These foreigners come over here and the government gives them the money to buy stores, restaurants, hotels.
		Why did they do that?
		None of their people ever served in our military or died for our country or anything.
		Why don't they help the disabled people?
		I love to own the store, you know.
		And another thing, when I first got disabled at 37, they sent me a thing, says I'm supposed to draw $1,500 a month.
		And they kept calling and said, oh, it'll be three or four years before you go in front of the judge.
		Can you wait that long?
		Four and your kids.
		And I finally had to settle for $900 a month for us to live.
		The government ripped me off.
		That's the way the government is.
		Social Security Disability stove $600 a month from me and what $1,500, $7.50 a piece for both my kids.
		My children couldn't have had a decent life.
		Life would have been easier on me, but they did not give me what I was supposed to get.
		They cheated me.
		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Elise is in Portland, Oregon, on our line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Elise.
		Well, good morning, and thank you.
		I want to acknowledge the previous caller.
		I'm also disabled.
		I'm 70 years old, and I live on Social Security.
		I have many friends who are millionaires who are so optimistic about the economy because of the tax breaks.
		So Trump and his administration are taking money from the most vulnerable, the poorest people of our country, to afford tax breaks for the wealthy.
		And I was astounded.
		I did not know that there was a cap on the Social Security tax number at $174,000 or more.
		So all the Congress people don't pay anymore for social media.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Elise, I just want to explain what you're talking about for folks, which is you're talking about the cap on how much of someone's income can be taxed for Social Security purposes.
unidentified		Yes.
unidentified		Could you explain that better than I did?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		So, basically, when it comes to paying Social Security taxes on income, only a certain amount of income is taxed.
		And I believe that number is, as you mentioned, up to $174,000.
		People making more than that will not pay Social Security taxes on that extra income beyond that threshold, meaning that this overall pool of taxable income available to feed into the pot of money that funds Social Security is smaller than it would be if everyone's income was taxed equally.
unidentified		Yes, and that is the point.
		I moved from Florida two years ago from a very wealthy area, and all my millionaire friends are just elated because they had far exceeded the threshold that you saw that are, you know, that you explained.
		And the, you know, with all the and I'm just my dad was fought for four days after enormity four days.
		They went through the Depression, and I have never been so worried to have a Trump person in our country.
		I'm terrified.
		I think he's going to come after, well, I think I will be okay.
		He's going to come after all the younger people and people who don't understand economics, what Trump's doing to our allies.
		Canada, I live in Florida.
		Canadians are our friends taxing Canada.
		And Trump is, he won't be happy until he is king of the entire world, and that will never happen.
		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Tony in Iowa City, Iowa, on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Tony.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I kind of wanted to bounce off the last caller with the economic situation.
		I'm very optimistic.
		I'm not a millionaire or a billionaire.
		I'm, I guess you could call me lower middle class, but it took the last, I'd say, eight years to really look at the graphs.
		And I was very skeptical of Trump and his policies, especially because, well, I wasn't watching C-SPAN, I was just watching the mainstream news.
		And they were just constantly negative.
		And I didn't feel like I could get the truth.
		So I dug into it.
		And it seems like 2019, if you look at the numbers, things were on a very solid upward trajectory.
		I mean, everything was coming down with gas prices.
		It all started making sense.
		And I mean, hindsight is 2020, I guess, but nobody can say that what happened in 2020 was hindsight because nobody saw that coming with the pandemic that just crashed basically the world's economic situation.
		But if you take a look at 2019's numbers, there were tariffs, there were policies in place that were working, and I'm hoping that history is going to repeat itself.
		It's not going to be instantaneous.
		But I know gas prices aren't down a whole lot, but they're down a little bit, and so are egg prices.
		And so just I'd say give the guy some credit when you see positive news.
		And yeah, go ahead and be skeptical.
		But all of these tariffs are temporary.
		They're just temporary negotiating tools.
		They're not permanent.
		Trump's not trying to take over the world.
		He's just trying to balance everything.
		Sorry to minimize his anyway.
		I'm getting an echo here, so let me let you go, but thanks for taking my call.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So Tony was talking about the outlook on prices for things like gas and eggs.
		The measure of that is generally considered to be inflation expectations.
		And that economist YouGov poll that I mentioned earlier asked about that question as well.
		And 47% of the people polled thought that prices are going to be higher in the next six months.
		24% is saying that they expect prices will be lower.
		15% saying that they think it will be about the same.
		14% not sure.
		Again, that recent economist YouGov poll.
		Quarter is in Frankfort, Michigan, on our line for independence.
		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning, Kimberly.
		I hope you're doing okay today.
		I'm glad you brought up the prices of gas and groceries before I got on because that's part of my bone to pick with Trump regarding the economy.
		Stuff is not getting cheaper.
		Gas, in fact, in Michigan and Wisconsin, especially in northern Wisconsin, has gotten a lot higher.
		The price of eggs has not been helped at all.
		And, you know, people are still struggling so hard here to make a living.
		Let me put it in perspective in terms of what I do, how my life kind of goes.
		So I work at a pretty obscure small job.
		I'm a security guard at one of those children's pizzerias.
		And, you know, the guy who was training me told me like the animatronics get really quirky at night.
		And little did I know, one of them just started walking.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Mike is in Reston, Virginia, on our line for Democrats.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Mike.
unidentified		Yeah, hi.
		Good morning, everyone.
		I am very pessimistic.
		I think that Trump is not a strategic thinker, or he's not a thinker at all.
		I think if you look at the stock prices, it's been down almost 10%, 15%, because the market does not like instability and don't like ignorance.
		Plus, he said, on the first day, I will reduce prices.
		And on January 20th, he said, the golden day start today.
		Now the Republicans are telling us to wait six months, one year.
		And now people going back to work from the office, it's costing everybody for parking, gas, transportation, $5,000 almost, $4,000 to $5,000 a month.
		It's not a year.
		What did he do?
		Look at the prices.
		Everything is going up.
		It used to be $2.99, the gas.
		Now it's $327 in Virginia.
		Everything is going up.
		The market is going down.
		The gap, income gap is stable for the lower class and the working class.
		And the income for the rich and the billionaires is skyrocketing.
		And this is what's happening.
		They're cutting spending in order to give tax cuts for the rich, for the billionaires.
		And we warned you about Social Security and Medicare.
		Now they're cutting spending in order to give the tax cut for the rich.
		When is it going to stop?
		When are we going to learn that the Republicans do not work for people?
		They work for big companies and for the billionaires.
		Look at what they did to the healthcare.
		I'm paying, what, $1,000 a month, and then the company match it, and then I have to cover the deductible $3,200.
		This is insane when the Republicans, they never work for you.
		They never.
		They always want to cut down services for the people.
		Government is not supposed to be for profit.
		Government is supposed to be for services.
		Consumer, the one, the agency that he closed, the Consumer Finance Protection Agency, was making money, was making money for the government.
		The forest rangers were making money for the government, yet he cut it down.
		Department of Education, which we should have connected education all over the country, he dismantled it.
		FEMA, that helped the hurricane victim.
		He wants to dismantle that too.
		I don't know what he's thinking, but I think we have no government anymore.
		The Democrats that voted for him, Mr. Schumer, Mr. Schumer, you're a coward.
		And all the 10 senators that voted with him, they're coward because the Republicans do things they don't care what other people think.
		But we always tolerate and say, yeah, let's work together.
		But they are screwing people all the time and you're doing nothing.
		Democratic Party is finished with this vote to pass the bill.
		I'm sorry, but the economy is heading down and Trump doesn't know what he's doing at all, period.
		And people advising him, they're afraid to advise him.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I'll go to a couple more folks for this segment, but several people have mentioned the prices of eggs.
		I want to point to this ABC News article, which reports that the national average wholesale price of eggs dropped for the third week in a row.
		This is a story from March 14th.
		The average wholesale price fell to 4.5 dozen per last per dozen last week.
		The USDA said the national average wholesale price of eggs dropped for the third week in a row as high prices caused falling demand and bird flu outbreaks hit a lull, according to the U.S. Department of Agriculture.
		The average wholesale price fell to $4.15 per dozen last week, down by $2.70, according to a weekly USDA report released on Friday.
		Just two weeks ago on February 28th, the average wholesale price was $8.05 per dozen.
		The combination of prices scaring off customers slowed bird flu outbreaks and a later Easter this year is resulting in less demand.
		Edwin is in New Bern, North Carolina, on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Edwin.
unidentified		Good morning.
		What I see is, you know, the Republicans are trying to do what's best for the country.
		The Republicans are supposed to be fiscally fiscal, you know, respond ability, but the last CR that just got passed added an additional $2 trillion to the $7.5 trillion that we're going to spend this year.
		And we're only going to take in $5 trillion.
		As a person that's worked 31 years for the Federal Service in Finance and Accounting, I like the idea what Doge is doing, but Doge is doing the job that Congress should be doing.
		There's an act that was enacted in 1974, the Empowerment Control Act, a federal law.
		It tells the president that he can not like an item, but it has to go back to Congress.
		We are going to be, in this first year, $9.5 trillion.
		Edwin, it's a little bit hard to hear you now.
		And also, in the first term with Trump, where was Doge at?
		Where was Doge?
		And he ran up the checkbook to $8 trillion.
		And I think the people on both sides, this is what needs to happen.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So, Edwin, it's getting a little bit challenging to hear you.
unidentified		Let's go to Troy in Brimley, Michigan on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, Troy.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning.
unidentified		Good morning.
		How are you?
		Good, thanks.
		My biggest question, I guess, I'm neither optimistic or pessimistic, kind of in the middle right now.
		All these tariff funds that are supposed to be coming in, he says it's a lot of money.
		What's it going to be used for?
		Where's it going to go?
		That's my question.
		Thank you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Lewis is in Salisbury, North Carolina on our line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Lewis.
		All right, talk of the morning to you.
		I'm pessimistic.
		And let me explain why one to me.
		There is a gentleman that's in the White House right now that is convicted of fraud.
		It's just like asking a fox to guard the chicken house as security.
		All I know is this: when it comes down to the tariffs, a lot of people is misunderstanding or comprehending of what tariffs mean.
		Now, when they go off and tell you that it's going to do a 25%, even 100%, they're saying this is what you are going to pay, not the government.
		You're going to have to pay when prices are continually to go up.
		What happened when he said, oh, I'm not dealing with 2025 project, but as you can see, he is definitely going by the playbook.
		I don't understand why America are not complaining.
		Now, I voted for Kamala.
		Now, I'm going to let you know now, I voted for Kamala because Kamala already told us, and Walt already told us that they are going to try to destroy the Constitution.
		Now, if you look at what they're doing, they're trying to clip the heels from America.
		They're going after Social Security.
		And that gentleman who said that Chuck Schumer was a whatever, let me tell you what.
		If the Democrats wouldn't have voted for this, the government would have been shut down.
		Oh, man, you would have gave them a free run of our government to shut everything down.
		You probably wouldn't get a check next month.
		But I know this.
		We are going to see what they cut in Social Security, Medicaid, and Medicare, and you're going to see who is it going to affect.
		It's going to affect all of you old white people who are Social Security who voted for Trump.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Tony is in Texas on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Tony.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I'm a first-time caller.
		And I wanted to let you know that I am optimistic about the economy.
		Will prices fluctuate up and down?
		Yes.
		Will oil help to drive down costs?
		Yes.
		And hopefully that will continue on, even though the markets are swaying around.
		That's what the market does.
		It looks at supply and demand.
		But as jobs get created in the United States, it also helps with our national security.
		Bringing those jobs back home helps us to be independent as a sovereign nation.
		So, again, that's I'm optimistic.
		I believe the economy is going to improve and turn around.
		Is it going to improve tomorrow, next month?
		Who knows?
		Probably within six months to a year, but it's going to take time.
		We didn't dig ourselves into a deficit in one or two years.
		So it's going to take a bipartisan effort, in my opinion, in Congress to help reduce our spending because we've got a spending problem and we're going to have to cut costs.
		And Doge is the way we're going to do that.
		And that's why they're trying to cut the bloat, if you will, out of the federal government.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Well, thank you, Tony, for being a first-time caller.
		And thank you to everyone who called in this segment.
		Coming up next, we're going to hear from Batia Ungar Sargon, who is the author of the book Second Class, How the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women, talking about why she thinks Trump's economic policy will help working class Americans.
		And later, we'll have Katrina Vandenhoevel, editorial director and publisher of The Nation magazine, who will join us to talk about Ukraine-Russia peace talks and how Democrats are responding to the Trump agenda.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		All weekend, C-SPAN's Book TV will be live from the Tucson Festival of Books.
		You'll see discussions on a variety of topics, including America's changing political landscape and global competition for natural resources, plus viewer call-ins with some of your favorite authors.
		Today we'll feature authors Jonathan Turley, Amanda Becker, Clay Reisen, and Paola Ramos.
		The Tucson Festival of Books, live all weekend beginning at 1 p.m. Eastern on C-SPAN 2.
brian lamb ▲ ● ▼		As a follow-up to our recent podcast regarding the life and times of Anne Frank, we asked author Alexandra Ritchie to tell us more about the horrors of World War II and Poland.
		Ritchie, a citizen of Canada, now lives in the city which is the title of her book, Warsaw.
		Her focus is on 1944 and what was called the Warsaw Uprising.
		In her introduction, she writes, Himmler and Hitler had decided that the entire population remaining in one of Europe's great capital cities was to be murdered in cold blood.
		Himmler referred to Warsaw as the Great Abscess, which was to be completely destroyed.
unidentified		Author Alexandra Ritchie, with her book, Warsaw 1944, Hitler, Himmler, and the Warsaw Uprising on this episode of BookNotes Plus with our host, Brian Lamb.
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		Washington Journal continues.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back.
		We're joined now by Batia Unger Sargon, who is the author of Second Class, How the Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women.
		Welcome to Washington Journal.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Thank you so much for having me.
unidentified		It is such a pleasure and an honor to be here with you and your viewers.
unidentified		So from the title of your book, who are the elites?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		It's a great question.
		It's something that sociologists struggle to define.
		We know that there is a class divide in America, which is tragic, of course, because we like to think of ourselves as a classless society built on the American dream and the idea that, you know, your hard work and your talents should take you as high as anybody can go.
		But unfortunately, over the last 50 years, a big divide has opened up between Americans with a college degree who have much more access to that top 20% and the American dream, and Americans who work with their hands for a living.
		And ultimately, in the book, the way that I define working class is an American who works full-time, who works in an industry that does not require skills that you learn in college, and who is locked out of the top 20%.
		That's how I define working class.
		And elites in my book are people who are in the top 20%.
		And the reason that's important is because the top 20% today controls over 50% of the GDP.
		And this is in marked distinction to the 70s when the largest share of the economy, over 50% of the wealth in this country, belonged to the middle class, which is how we like to think of this country and really how economists like to think of a very healthy society.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		What are some of the ways that you lay out in your book that this group, these working class Americans, have been betrayed by the elites?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, great question.
		So effectively, working class Americans today are making a little bit more than they made in the 70s.
		The problem is they've been locked out of the American dream.
		So the price of a home, of an education, of health care, and of a retirement, things that are really basic, basic things, the most modest version of the American dream, the price of these things has skyrocketed by 300 to 3,000% since the 70s.
		So working class Americans are making the same amount of money, but they have been locked out of not just prosperity that we have in this country to the nth degree, but the most modest version of the American dream.
		So how did that happen?
		And I argue in the book that successive administrations had a kind of handshake agreement based on ideas like free trade, which shipped very good working class jobs that secured working class Americans a middle class lifestyle overseas to China and to Mexico to build up their middle class.
		We then defunded vocational training, which is of course another avenue that a working class American who works but doesn't have a college degree can have access to the American dream.
		Plumbers, electricians, HVAC repairmen, these are really good jobs.
		And then we had this handshake agreement between both parties to endorse mass immigration.
		And so, all of those service industry, hospitality, janitorial services, landscaping, a lot of other sectors which are now heavily employing illegal immigrants, these sectors also saw massive downward pressure on the wages of working class Americans.
		We forget that in the 70s, a manicurist in America could be a homeowner, you know, just based on her labor.
		And of course, it's very hard to imagine that now.
		So, these three things I argue in the book were major ways, among other things, the offshoring of manufacturing, mass immigration, and defunding vocational training that effectively locked very, very hardworking people out of the most modest version of the American dream that people in the elites and the educated elites take for granted.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Why, excuse me, how was President Trump able to appeal to this group in particular during the 2024 campaign?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		It's such a great question.
		People remember his record.
		And when you look back at the first administration, you already see some of the real basics of the Trump economy, which was what he was trying to do and what he continues to try to do is take an economy which was, as we just described, an upward funnel of wealth from working class Americans into the pockets of the asset rich of the elites and turn that spigot around so that it's turning down.
		How did he do that?
		Well, he controlled the border.
		So he limited the supply of labor and created a tight labor market, which resulted in higher wages for American workers.
		He already imposed tariffs on steel and aluminum, an industry that pays working class Americans $88,000 a year.
		That's starting to get towards a middle-class salary.
		So he started a trade war with China.
		He stopped this race to the bottom for working class wages.
		And a lot of working class people recognize that.
		If you think about what President Trump inherited, the GOP before Trump was a party that was socially conservative.
		It was based on free trade and free markets and trickle-down economics.
		And it was into foreign interventions.
		It was very pro-war.
		And what Trump did was he sort of reversed all that.
		He's much more isolationist in nature, although he believes in supporting our allies when it's in our interests.
		He's a protectionist.
		He doesn't believe in free trade.
		He thinks it hurts the working class, even though, of course, it makes rich people richer.
		And he's not a social conservative.
		He's a social moderate.
		He took the pro-the anti-gay marriage and pro-life language out of the Republican platform for 2024.
		And if you think about who is the last president that that sounds like making massive interventions on behalf of the working class, anti-war, pursuing peace, refusing to engage and become entangled in foreign entanglements that have nothing to do with us, and then respectful of religion, socially moderate, but not so socially conservative that you alienate the kind of normy middle.
		This sounds a lot like FDR.
		And I think that's how President Trump really captured the working class.
		He took the Democrats' pro-labor economic agenda right out from under them, which is why it's been so hard for them to come up with an alternative to him.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		You mentioned the trade policies and the tariffs that President Trump has put out.
		I want to go back to a Reuters Ipsos poll that was recently out on Thursday showing that 57% of those surveyed think that President Trump is too erratic in his recent economic moves.
		53% disagree with the statement that tariffs are a good idea even if prices increase.
		Only 31% agree with the statement that when the U.S. charges tariffs, American workers come out ahead.
		Why do you think there's this disconnect between what you're saying these policies will do for working class Americans versus what people believe they will do?
unidentified		Well, first of all, those first two numbers in the 50s, that's much higher than I thought.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		You look at the stock market, which of course is really angry at President Trump because the people who are asset rich, who have all of these stocks, they love free trade and they love open borders because it very much rewards the wealthy, it rewards the asset rich.
		So the fact that almost half of Americans can see through this and still support the agenda, man, that makes me proud to be an American, right?
		People are really paying attention to what they believe rather than what they're seeing and what they're being told.
		The reason that there's so much, I think, hesitation about this and worry about this is that we have this class divide.
		And the class divide is mapping onto the political divide.
		So it used to be the Democrats were the party of labor and the Republicans were the party of the country club.
		This is now, it's gone like this over the last election.
		So Wall Street, for the third election in a row, gave much more money to Democrats than they did to President Trump.
		The top three management consulting firms, 75% of their donations went to Kamala Harris rather than to Donald Trump.
		95% of some hedge funds donations went to these Democrats.
		We know that the Democrats now represent nine of the 10 richest counties in America.
		We know that President Trump won with people who make under $100,000 a year and the Democrats won with people who make over $100,000 a year.
		We know that Silicon Valley, 75% goes to Democrats.
		We know that 65% of Americans who make more than $500,000 a year now are represented by Democrats.
		So we know that the Democrats are really representing their base now is that asset rich class that has benefited from the selling out of the working class in very real economic ways.
		It has been an upward funnel of wealth into the pockets of the Democrats voters.
		So of course they don't approve of this.
		Now American Compass, a really wonderful think tank, they did their own polling.
		They polled only GOP voters and their polling found that 77% of GOP voters support tariffs even if they raise prices in certain industries, which by the way, there's a lot of evidence that that price increase is very minimum.
		I mean we're talking 1.8% inflation to 2.2% in the first administration, very small.
		But 77% say even if it raises prices, we support it because it will help our working class neighbors and it will help us.
		Of course, most working class Americans now are represented by Republicans.
		And so I think the fact that the class divide is mapping onto the political divide explains a lot about why you're not seeing more mass support in polling.
		Although it is early days, you know, the president's been at this for six weeks.
		I think things are going to calm down very significantly.
		And I actually agree with the Americans that say that this has been a bit too chaotic.
		Hopefully there will be a much calmer way of instituting these tariffs, which I think are going to help a lot of working class Americans.
		I think the reason it's been so chaotic is that there are so many things that Trump is trying to accomplish with the tariffs.
		And he's being very nimble and he's trying to use them strategically to achieve all these different goals.
		And we can get into those if it's interesting.
		But yeah, hopefully the chaos will sort of settle down and we can get back to thinking about what we owe our fellow Americans who have less than us.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		You mentioned the many Americans represented by Republicans, particularly working class Americans.
		And as Republicans in Congress move forward with their agenda, particularly when it comes to the extension of the 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act, which is something they've prioritized, they're looking for cuts throughout government.
		And there have been a lot of, there's been a lot of reporting that there will be cuts to Medicaid as a result of some of these policies that they've put forward.
		I want to point to an article on Fox News about a Trump voter donning a MAGA hat in a warning to House Republicans against Medicaid cuts.
		Let's watch this ad, and then I'd love to get your thoughts.
unidentified		I look after seniors here at the nursing home.
		Most of them pay for it through Medicaid.
		So if Congress goes through these big cuts to Medicaid, some of our residents will probably have to leave.
		Most of them will have nowhere else to go.
		And look, I'm a Republican.
		I voted for Donald Trump.
		But Medicaid should not be a political thing.
		They need to know cutting it will hurt all of us.
		Congressman Valladale, we're all counting on you to stop these cuts to Medicaid.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Now that ad is supposedly going to be going out to target several vulnerable Republicans.
		And just for a bit for more information about what that ad is talking about, here's an article from NBC News that Republicans can't meet their own budget target without cutting Medicare or Medicaid.
		The budget office says the House GOP has ordered the Energy and Commerce Committee, which oversees Medicare and Medicaid funding, to cut $888 billion in a bill to advance Trump's agenda.
		But according to the Congressional Budget Office, that would be a problem because when Medicare and Medicaid are excluded, that committee oversees a total of $581 billion in spending, much less than the $880 billion target for cuts, the CBO said.
		I'd love to get your thoughts on that.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Donald Trump promised throughout the campaign that he's not going to touch Medicare, Medicaid, or Social Security.
		He has continued to promise that in the last six weeks.
		I don't see any reason to doubt that that's his base at this point.
		I mean, you know, a lot of those people voted for him.
		I think they should not cut them.
		People rely on that.
		Vulnerable Americans rely on those entitlements.
		Now, one of the things I found when I was reporting my book Second Class, I was traveling around the country and interviewing working class people from all political backgrounds.
		And I have to tell you, waste and fraud and abuse in these entitlement programs was something that they told me they saw everywhere.
		Most of the very hardworking people that I interviewed knew people who they felt were scamming the system through these entitlement programs.
		And they were, of course, very, very upset about that because they work really, really, really hard.
		And then they have this neighbor who they know is sort of scamming the system.
		And they felt that that was really like, I didn't go into that expecting to find that.
		But people would tell me again and again, you know, the people who deserve help don't get it.
		And then there's so many people who they feel are just choosing not to work, who are able to scam the system.
		So to the extent that the cuts come from fraud and abuse, I think that's something that should be bipartisan supported, right?
		I mean, wouldn't we all want the fraud and abuse to be stopped?
		But people who actually need these services, I'm very happy that the president keeps promising he has zero intention of cutting from people who require these services.
		And I think we're seeing that even with Doge.
		You know, I'm not the biggest fan of Doge, but I think that they have course corrected.
		You know, some of the people who were fired were then rehired.
		We do need a deep audit of so much of the waste.
		That's, I think, what for President Trump, it means to put Americans first, that our taxpayer dollars go to things that as a society, we think they should go to.
		And of course, if they do cut these entitlement services, there's going to be an election in two years, and Americans can voice their dissent.
		And that's what makes this the greatest country on earth.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's get to your questions for Batia Unger-Sargon about the economy and how President Trump's policies are affecting Americans.
		Let's start with Patrick in Florida on our line for independence.
		Good morning, Patrick.
unidentified		Well, I thought this was a showaber book.
		Of course, you never give the resume of people who write these books.
		Just a few things.
		When Carnegie owned his steel mills, it was a 72-hour work week under brutal conditions.
		You talked about the American dream if you work hard.
		Women didn't even have the right to vote to the 1920s.
		A bank could legally refuse a mortgage to a woman up to the 1980s.
		And of course, black people have had it so great in America.
		You're selling this fake stuff of after World War II through the 50s and 60s that one person could afford a stay-at-home mom, a couple kids.
		And you never mentioned France of the G7 has the highest rate of the household forming, which means they can afford their mortgage, Ford kids, for college.
		And one more thing.
		Let's say you get to this family of four.
		A sole breadwinner in America that has a family of four makes $80,000, $60,000 in deductions.
		The tax rate on $20,000 is about $2,500.
		So overall, they have an effective rate of 3%.
		Wow, they need a break.
		Citigroup reported earnings about a month and a half ago.
		Record earnings, $20 billion stock buyback, dividend increase.
		Yeah, they need a tax cut.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		All right, Patrick, you've raised a lot of points.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I want to let our guest respond to some of them.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		I think he was objecting to the Trump tax cuts.
		I don't support tax cuts on the rich.
		I don't really understand why that would be something.
		I think I agree with Patrick, why that would be in our national interest right now.
		I think what Trump is thinking is he wants to offset some of the market volatility by giving, you know, people at the top something to feel hopeful and excited about so that they'll want to reinvest in our country.
		Trump knows those rich people better than I do.
		So, you know, it could be that he's right about that.
		I will just point out that in 2017, when he first instituted this tax cut and ever since, the percentage of the tax cuts that went to working class and middle class Americans was much higher.
		So if you were in the top 1%, you only saw 1% to 5% tax cut.
		But if you were in the working class or the middle class, you saw between 15% and 25% tax cuts.
		Now, of course, if you're a billionaire and you get a 1% tax cut, that's a lot more money than if you're making $80,000 a year and you get a 20% tax cut.
		But if you're making $80,000 a year and you get a 20% tax cut, that means a lot to you.
		So that would sort of be how I would defend it.
		Yeah, we do need revenue.
		We do need to be able to pay for these services and balance this budget.
		And I agree, I don't think that they're going to find enough waste, fraud, and abuse in Medicare, Medicaid, and Social Security to make up that windfall.
		And I don't think they're planning to do cuts to people who actually need to be on those entitlements.
		So I guess I agree with Patrick.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		The other point that Patrick was making that drawing these comparisons to post-World War II America and the economy of that time isn't necessarily what we want to be doing because of some of the systemic inequalities that existed at that time.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Well, we definitely shouldn't bring back the systemic inequalities.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		We should only bring back the good stuff.
unidentified		You know, this, you know, I agree with that as well.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, things were not great.
		Think we should like go back to the social mores of the 50s where women had much fewer choices.
		I do think that we have culturally and economically degraded masculinity, and we've hurt our young men because they don't see role models and they don't see a culture that respects them for being providers.
		And I think that that's very dangerous and sad.
		And that's something that we could look towards correcting.
		But I don't think that we have to, it's not an either or, you know, I think that we should have a society that respects everybody.
		And I think that these cultural and economic pieces go really hand in hand.
		I think, you know, working class life has been, we've been taught to see it as somehow degraded.
		I think that's what happens when you bring in millions and millions of people to work in industries who are not citizens.
		It conveys to the American citizens who work in those industries that their job is not respectable.
		It's not respectful.
		It's not worthy of an American citizen.
		And we've done that while at the same time, there's not a single industry in America, including agriculture, that is a majority done by illegal immigrants.
		It's just not true.
		So every time a politician says, well, who's going to pick the crops?
		They are insulting millions and millions of American citizens who do those jobs.
		Every time somebody says, well, nobody wants to clean toilets, the vast majority of people who clean toilets in America are our fellow Americans.
		Like, why would you talk about your fellow American who is working so hard at a job that we all rely on in such a degrading way?
		So I think those pieces really go hand in hand.
		But of course, we don't want to bring back any of the bad stuff from our past.
unidentified		Gordon is in Kansas City, Kansas, on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Gordon.
unidentified		Thank you for taking my call.
		I think that tariffs are going to make everyone pay taxes.
		40 million don't pay any taxes.
		That's not right.
		And I'd like to tell them that the gravy terrain is over and Trump's going to give them something that they never had, a job.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Did you have any follow-up thoughts to that?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		It's very interesting because you do, there is this thing that happened in terms of how the Democrats think about the economy, where they sort of decided to lump in working class people with poor people.
		But when you talk to working class people, they very much feel like their economic interests are in tension with the dependent poor.
		So the Democrats became the party of the very, very credentialed elites, the top 20%, and then the poor, right, who live on these entitlements.
		And that's a very convenient combination because people who are wealthy, they don't mind paying higher taxes when they're Democrats.
		I think they feel a little bit of guilt about their good fortune and who it came at the expense of.
		So their answer is: you know, let's ship all the manufacturing to China.
		We'll import people, you know, from failed socialist states like Venezuela to do the service industry jobs here for much cheaper.
		And then everybody will have a sort of basic income, universal basic income, and live in public housing and have snap benefits if they're not wealthy like us.
		Who could object to that?
		That's kind of the Democrats' model for the economy, as far as I can tell.
		And the Republicans who are now the party of the working class, they really understand why working class people that doesn't appeal to them.
		Working class people don't want to live off the government.
		Like the caller said, like they want to make their money.
		They want independence.
		They want the freedom to make choices based on the fruit of their own labor.
		They work really, really, really hard.
		And this view of it's very much in tension with where the Democrats are at, which is why I think they're really struggling to find their way and to find a voice and to find even policy to compete with what President Trump is putting out there.
		Because it's not that he sort of bamboozled working class people into voting for him.
		He offered them exactly what the Democrats were offering them when the Democrats were the party of labor, which is dignity and the American dream.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Jerry is in Sewell, New Jersey on our line for Democrats.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Jerry.
unidentified		Good morning.
		I am a registered Democrat and I voted for Donald Trump.
		Now, one of the reasons why I voted for Donald Trump is the Democrat Party has become an embarrassment to watch them say that they defend women and they're for women when you see that they want men in women's sports to degrade the women that are in the sport.
		Watching them out there singing.
		I mean, they're in a group singing.
		Come on, people, get a grip.
		And when I listen to the Democrats call in, all they want to do is go back, go back to slavery, go back.
		Well, we can't make that up.
		First of all, most of the people in this country right now have outlived all that, and we're not concerned about that.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		And another thing.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I was wondering if you had any questions for our guests related to the economy.
unidentified		Yeah, the economy is already getting better.
		If you notice, eggs are coming down.
		Gas here in New Jersey is coming down.
		The fact that he's bringing, what, about 12 companies back, billions, billions of dollars being invested in this country.
		See, the news media don't want to discuss this.
		This is why I don't even like Seedman anymore, because they don't discuss the good.
		They only want to take him down.
		He's here six months.
		They want to blame him for what's been happening for the last four years.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Bhatia, what do you think of what our guest, our caller had to say?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		So first of all, I think the GOP, Jerry is exactly how President Trump won.
		He convinced millions of Americans across the country who were Democrats two years ago that he had their best interests at heart.
		And that is, I think that's a very important piece of this puzzle.
		If the Republicans, you know, go too far to the right on some of these cultural issues, they could lose voters like Jerry who have been really impressed with the economy, but also I would say the social moderation that President Trump brought to the GOP.
		I found that a lot when I was traveling around the country and interviewing people.
		I think Jerry's so right.
		Trump has already attracted $1 trillion in investment from companies promising, vowing to reshore manufacturing.
		You know, his tariff program is very smart because it accomplishes five different goals.
		He's been using tariffs in order to get things out of Mexico, for example, on the immigration front to help control the border, to help control the flow of fentanyl.
		He wants to generate revenue with tariffs.
		National security.
		How can we say that we have any national security when our greatest adversary, China, produces all of our pharmaceuticals?
		I mean, it's so obvious that we have to do this.
		He believes that America has been treated like a PATSI.
		We have all of these trade deficits, countries that put 20% tariffs on our products and we put no tariffs on theirs.
		I mean, how is that even fair?
		And then, of course, the reshoring of manufacturing and how that's going to help rebuild and revitalize America's working class.
		We all agree that NAFTA was a disaster for working class Americans.
		We all agree that we destroyed our manufacturing base, that working class Americans are dying deaths of despair because they don't feel that they have a pathway to the American dream.
		And yet everybody wants to kick the can down the line of whose job it is to fix this.
		And I would just encourage people just to think for a minute, what if this is actually what President Trump is trying to do?
		I mean, he may not succeed, but that I think is what this agenda is all about.
		And I think it's very hard for people to understand that on both sides because the right is so used to defending free trade and the left is so used to attacking President Trump.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Christina is in Oakland, Michigan on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Christina.
unidentified		Thank you very much for taking my phone call and please give me some time.
		I saw this lady on Bill Marhar the other day and she's very young.
		I'm in my late 70s.
		I've seen and done a lot.
		I've also got divorced when I was very young with four young children, went back to college because of the federal nursing loan I got.
		She uses the word elite and yet Donald Trump and Elon Musk, are they not elite?
		I haven't heard them talking about raising minimum wage or anything for working people.
		Donald Trump, I remember during his first term, said some company from China was moving into, I believe, Wisconsin and going to create all these jobs.
		Well, it never happened.
		It never happened.
		Donald Trump says a lot.
		Do we know, I'd like to know if she knows how he got rich and how he cheated people that built his buildings, didn't pay them, filed for bankruptcy, and they're the ones that went out of business.
		So I'm just not sure she's got the facts straight.
		And the words, the way she uses them, I really, really question.
		I think in this country, we have to start actually talking about words because I hear about socialism all the time.
		Well, FEMA is socialism.
		Because here in Michigan, my tax money goes to FEMA, but we in Michigan never get any of it.
		It's always to the red states that don't want taxes.
		So I'm kind of confused.
		I think we have to start with some definition of words.
		And the way she uses elite, to me, is totally, totally wrong.
		I thank you for letting me speak my, and there's a lot more I'd like to say, but I know you don't have time.
		You want to have other people.
		So thank you very much for listening to me.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So Christina raised a couple of different points in terms of what President Trump has done for working class Americans, particularly when it comes to the minimum wage, the idea of defining elite simply based on college education and those types of things.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		And there were a couple of other ones, but I'll go ahead and let you respond.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Thank you so much, Christina.
		Yeah, I would define elite not just, you know, college educated, you know, 11% of people working in the service industry have college degrees.
		They're probably not very rich.
		But somebody who has achieved, you know, made it into the top 20% based on skills that they acquired in college.
		It used to be that, you know, going to college or going to vocational school, you know, or working in manufacturing, there was a sort of a commonality, a common middle class.
		But now there's been a real divide that's opened up between people who have that college education, who have a shot at the American dream in a way that working class people don't as much.
		Yeah, Donald Trump's rich.
		Elon Musk is rich.
		That's true.
		It is really mysterious that somebody as wealthy as Donald Trump would have developed this affinity for the working class.
		People like to say, who have sort of suspicious of him caring about working class Americans?
		Well, he's so rich, he's a billionaire.
		His singular achievement in the first administration was a tax cut for the rich.
		You hear that a lot.
		But it's not true.
		He very, very significantly controlled the border, just like he's managed to do, you know, in a month of being president this time around.
		He got the inflow of illegal immigrants into this country down to almost zero at this point.
		Really, really, really low.
		And what that does is it immediately raises wages for working class people because it limits the supply of labor.
		Labor is like everything else.
		It adheres to the ironclad law of supply and demand.
		The more you have of something, the cheaper it is.
		And the less you have of something, the more expensive it is.
		And we should want our working class neighbors to make a living wage off of their work.
		And so he controlled the border, which is very unpopular with his fellow elites who want millions and millions of illegal laborers to work for them.
		And then he started the trade war with China in the first administration.
		Now, of course, we're seeing this trade war on steroids.
		And it's very interesting to me because the people who say he only cares about rich billionaires like himself, what is their answer to why he's doing this?
		What is their answer to why he's allowing the stock market to contract?
		He's allowing his fellow elites and rich people and billionaires to get very upset.
		I mean, billionaires hate tariffs.
		They love free trade.
		It makes them much, much wealthier.
		So what is the theory of mind in the Democratic Party now for why President Trump is doing this?
		Well, they'll say he's purposely tanking the economy.
		Okay, why?
		Why would he want to do that?
		And it just sort of ends there because they really don't like him.
		And so they think he's acting like a psychotic person.
		He's doing it because he has a theory that this is how you restore the American dream for the working class.
		And working class people of all races can see that and they take it seriously.
		Now, again, we don't know if it's going to succeed.
		We should all be praying that it does because we should all want our country to be amazing and we should want our neighbors to have prosperity, to have the same prosperity that we do.
		You know, so we should pray that it works.
		But if it doesn't, you know, we'll have another election and then the working class will have their say again.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Berto is in North Bergen, New Jersey, on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Berto.
unidentified		Hi, good morning.
		I'd like to say something about Social Security.
		I understand 6.2% of wages go into Social Security tax, and 6.2% are paid by the employer.
		Now, what about if we had a system where only 1% were paid by employees and the other 5% were invested in the stock market, and the employers paid instead of 6%, they would pay 11% and were given tax breaks on planted equipment.
		Maybe that would stimulate the economy and have people invest for the long term in dead-end jobs where they don't want to work.
		And perhaps maybe Mayors could be empowered to lift the minimum wage beyond the state and the federal level.
		So I'd like you to God bless Israel.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		It sounds really smart.
		I'm not qualified to say what, but it sounds very, very smart.
		I do want to address the minimum wage question.
		Donald Trump is not very invested in the minimum wage.
		I think what he's trying to do is create an economy that through capitalism rewards working class labor rather than say we're going to have this arbitrary number, which if you think about it, a national minimum wage does not make a lot of sense because, you know, there are certain places in America, Seattle, New York City, Los Angeles, San Francisco, where $25 an hour is not a living wage.
		You cannot afford to be a homeowner on that.
		But, you know, there's less than that would be considered a minimum wage in West Virginia, where you could become a homeowner on much less than that.
		So it doesn't really make sense to have a sort of national standard, I don't think.
		And also, you know, the goal is not for people to be working minimum wage jobs for the rest of their lives.
		The goal is for the market itself to elevate people based on things like limiting the supply of labor, tariffs, which make the product of the American worker competitive once again in the global economy in a way that it's not because when we import so much from China, we're effectively in a race to the bottom in terms of wages.
		So I think that's more how the protectionist mindset works is, you know, let's stimulate the economy with these tax cuts.
		Let's get rid of free trade and open borders and really protect the labor of the American worker so that their employers are incentivized economically to pay them more rather than being forced to do so by the government.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		John is in Baltimore, Maryland on our line for Democrats.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, John.
unidentified		Hi, thank you so much for taking my call.
		I grew up in Allentown, Pennsylvania in the 70s, and it was a wonderful place.
		We had Bethlehem Steel and Mac Truck.
		I lived in a little town where we had our own textile mill, little textile mill, little industries in our little town.
		It was great.
		And I feel like a dollar that was produced by manufacturing got passed around through the town.
		It was different than a dollar of subsidy or something.
		So I did want to ask if you, I have this definition of elite, that an elite is someone who makes decisions for other people who's not really affected by those decisions themselves.
		And this way it's different than an elite tennis player is just a really good tennis player.
		But an elite, in this definition, I think is the appropriate definition.
		Like all the economists, I don't trust them.
		They make all these decisions.
		They're not affected by them.
		What do you think of this definition of elite?
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		I love it, John.
		That's so smart.
		And I think you're really getting at something, which is, you know, the death of expertise.
		You have all these people with millions and millions of degrees, and they'll all tell you, you know, mass immigration raises the GDP, so it's good for America.
		And what they won't tell you is, yeah, it raises the GDP, which is getting concentrated at the top with the wealthy because the people who employ illegal immigrants instead of Americans get to keep 50% of what they would have had to pay an American.
		I love that.
		I mean, I think it's even further than that, John, which is it's not just that they don't have to pay for the consequences of their actions, but that they are able to benefit in real economic terms at the expense of their working class neighbors.
		And they then dress up that economic benefit as some sort of higher moral virtue.
		I think we saw that throughout the pandemic.
		You see that a lot with the immigration conversation.
		You see that a lot with the environmental conversation.
		Great comment.
		Thank you so much.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Batia has mentioned this several times, but I'll point also to a USA Today article with similar data.
		America's top 10% controls 60% of the wealth.
		The bottom half holds just 6%.
		And that is according to a report from the Congressional Budget Office.
		Left-leaning think tanks produce regular updates on growing wealth inequality in America.
		This analysis comes from the nonpartisan federal agency, one whose findings regularly inconvenience both Democrats and Republicans.
		That report illustrates the role of things like Social Security in shoring up the wealth of middle class and working class Americans.
		If you subtract Social Security from the equation, the top 10% control nearly 70% of the nation's wealth, and the bottom half holds only 3%.
		Let's go to Regina in Denham Springs, Louisiana on our line for independence.
		Good morning, Regina.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		I guess the one concern I have is that I feel like your book is misleading.
		And the reason why I say it's misleading is because the elite has never cared about the working poor or the working class.
		From the inception of this country, it has always been to exploit working people and for the elite to maximize their dollars.
		It wasn't until after, before World War II, to where the elites had to pay more into the system to help establish programs to help the working poor and working class.
		And to me, all of this is just going back to what this country was originally from the beginning when the working poor and working class struggled to make ends meet.
		Now, I understand that Trump is doing a lot of things to try to reverse that, but I really don't see that happening because the elite never cared about working poor or working class at all.
		And there's an excellent book that individuals can read.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		We're just about out of time.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I want to let our guests respond.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Thank you so much for that question, Regina.
		I totally agree with you.
		I just want to point out one thing very quickly, which is, you know, the top 10%, the top 20% are people who make more than $135,000 a year, right?
		So the top 10% is, it's people who are in the knowledge industry.
		We're not talking about billionaires.
		We're talking about people who are working knowledge industry jobs, people who are in the credentialed class, who are controlling over 60% of the GDP.
		It's really food for thought.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, that is all the time we have for this segment.
		Thank you so much to Batira Unger-Sargon, who is the author of Second Class, How Elites Betrayed America's Working Men and Women.
		Thank you so much for your time this morning.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		Thank you so much.
batya ungar-sargon ▲ ● ▼		God bless you and all of your viewers.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Now, coming up next, we're going to have a conversation with Katrina Vandenhoevel, who's the editorial director and publisher of The Nation magazine, who will join us to talk about Ukraine-Russia peace talks and how Democrats are responding to Trump's agenda.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		We'll be right back.
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kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back.
		We're joined now by Katrina Vandenhoevel, who is the editorial director and publisher of The Nation magazine, here to talk about Ukraine and the conflict with Russia, as well as domestic politics.
		Good morning, Katrina.
unidentified		Good morning, Kimberly.
unidentified		Glad to be.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's start with domestic politics.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		As the editorial director and publisher of a pretty influential progressive magazine, what's your take on the Democrats' response to the Trump administration thus far, especially in light of the recent intra-party shutdown fight?
unidentified		You know, I'm not surprised the Democratic Party at this stage is a coalition party, and it has different forces within it.
		Chuck Schumer, former Senator Chuck Schumer, will take one direction.
		And Bernie Sanders and others in the party, and surprisingly, a fair number like Michael Bennett, Senator Michael Bennett, moderate forces have chosen to show some life in the body politic and stood up to this kind of there was it's not just a continuing resolution, Kimberly, as you know, but it involved control of the process, cutting out Democrats entirely.
		So I think it's a good thing that you have this division moving forward.
		And I think those who seem to have, you know, stood up and said to the Republicans, no, are going to have a better shot at speaking for issues that millions of Americans care about.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Well, what do you think of the broader response by the Democrats to the Trump administration policy so far?
unidentified		It's taking the Democrats, and again, when we talk about Democrats, it's interesting.
		At the nation, there's a lot of railing against Democrats.
		And I remind people that, you know, the largest caucus in the House is the Progressive Caucus run by people like Pramila Jayapal or Greg Kazar.
		These are people who share the values in many ways of the nation, in many instances, fighting inequality, fighting for universal health care.
		And these are the issues that I think animate the Democratic Party and give it a frame and give it purpose.
		So can't say there's one Democratic response to Trump.
		There are those who, like Bernie Sanders, have launched an anti-olig tour across the country and are seeing big crowds in places like Omaha and in states like Iowa and Wisconsin.
		So I think that shows there's interest from people listening, hearing congresspeople, political figures speak to the issues that matter in their life.
		A lot of talk about the center.
		What's the center?
		The center is, you know, what the center of people's lives.
		It's not just these pundit, the pundit commentary about centrism.
		So I think the Democratic Party is having a struggle because the whiplash of Trump, every day, three things coming forward, which for any, I think, cause outrage.
		But it's going to be a long haul, but there is a different kind of resistance that is maybe more strategic and less in the streets that we're witnessing.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Turning now to foreign policy, your magazine has been calling for a ceasefire and a negotiated settlement in the Ukraine-Russia conflict for the past two years.
		What's your assessment of President Trump's actions in this regard?
		And do you give him credit for bringing both sides to the table?
unidentified		Well, you know what the Nation magazine feels about Donald Trump.
		Every day we have criticism of so much of what he's done.
		But I think in this instance, it is important to understand we go to a negotiation with the president we have, distrust, but verify to play on the famous mantra Russian saying that Reagan used many times in his negotiations with Gorbachev.
		Not that Putin is Gorbachev, but I think the negotiated settlement at this stage, Kimberly, is a way beyond the endless killing, the war of attrition.
		Ukraine could be stable, prosperous, secure if the negotiations are conducted in ways that one fights for.
		And I think that we're looking at not World War II, Kimberly.
		So many people, I think, use the maximalist narrative that we're on the cusp of, you know, we're in World War II and that Trump is an appeaser of Putin.
		But it's more like World War I, a war of attrition.
		It's a meat grinder.
		Ukraine has lost 10% of its population.
		Russia is losing many of its population.
		So I think that if you can have a tough negotiation, and again, it's just beginning, it's going to take time, but the key will be a secure Ukraine.
		What will be the security arrangements that provide for that?
		But war, endless war, more war, is going to destroy Ukraine.
		And there's a hope that, and among many, that it would destroy Russia.
		I don't think Russia is going to be undone by this war, but I do think Ukraine could see real an end point that would be very dangerous for Ukraine.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		With the changing U.S. policy towards this conflict, European leaders are adjusting their policy as well.
		Here's a story in CNN, Putin's response to Ukraine, ceasefire, not good enough, UK Prime Minister says, as Kyiv allies seek to pressure Russia.
		This is referencing a meeting of the Coalition of the Willing, a group of Western nations that have pledged to help defend Ukraine against Russia.
		And that group held a press conference yesterday following that meeting.
		And British Prime Minister Kier Starmer made some comments about the outcome of that meeting.
		Let's listen.
unidentified		President Zelensky has shown once again, and beyond any doubt, that Ukraine is the party of peace.
keir starmer ▲ ● ▼		Vladimir has committed to a 30-day unconditional ceasefire, but Putin is trying to delay, saying there must be a painstaking study before a ceasefire can take place.
unidentified		Well, the world needs action, not a study, not empty words and conditions.
unidentified		So my message is very clear.
keir starmer ▲ ● ▼		Sooner or later, Putin will have to come to the table.
unidentified		So this is the moment.
keir starmer ▲ ● ▼		Let the guns fall silent, let the barbaric attacks on Ukraine once and for all stop and agree to a ceasefire now.
keir starmer ▲ ● ▼		And let's be clear why this is so important.
unidentified		Russia's appetite for conflict and chaos undermines our security back here at home in the United Kingdom.
		It drives up the cost of living.
		It drives up energy costs.
keir starmer ▲ ● ▼		So this matters deeply to the United Kingdom.
unidentified		That is why now is the time to engage in discussion on a mechanism to manage and monitor a full ceasefire.
		Kimberly, I was going to say that in Europe, you find, especially among the British leadership, the French leadership, to some extent the German leadership, an attempt to build their credibility and restore their popularity on the backs of this war.
		Mr. Starmer is not sending himself or his family, as I understand, and Mr. Macron has talked about the French Foreign Legion going to fight.
		But I think the Europeans are going to build up their defense, their weaponry, military Keynesianism to restore their economy, but it's going to hurt their economy.
		And in the desire to form a deterrent to the United States, this coalition of the willing and how ironic that it's called coalition of the willing though is the term for the British forces and the U.S. forces going into Iraq, a failed war, that Mr. Starmer has suddenly become Winston Churchill.
		I think he too ascribes to the view that Putin is Hitler, that Putin will ravage Europe.
		He hasn't presented evidence, but he is neither presenting evidence against going to the table.
		And the fact that Russia is talking about a ceasefire of a broader kind doesn't mean you're not going to get to a table with the two foes, adversaries.
		Why not give it a chance?
		Why not give diplomacy a chance?
		Diplomacy has been demonized in these last years as appeasement.
		And I think that needs to be overturned as a way of thinking.
		So I think Starmer is, again, using this conflict, this war, to buttress his support.
		But you know what?
		It's not a big issue in the UK, nor is it a big issue in this country, I hate to say.
		There's a reason President Obama didn't pursue the war as Biden did, because he knew that it was a security regional conflict.
		This is not about taking over Europe, which NATO and Mr. Starmer would like it to be seen as.
		But that will ravage the economies.
		It will create austerity, scarcity, and it will lead to what we're witnessing, Kimberly, a resurgence of right-wing populist parties in Europe who are playing partly with this war, partly with failed economies, failed establishment, holding accountable establishments which have not produced for the people.
		It's an anti-system moment.
		And this war is not going to provide Mr. Starmer a support in this anti-system moment.
		But he's playing the Churchill card, playing it hard.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		But there are many watchers of this conflict who agree with Starmer's assessment that Russia is not a trustworthy negotiating partner.
		There's an opinion piece in the dispatch about Russia's long record of broken pledges and treaty violations.
		You are also a longtime observer of Russia.
		How trustworthy is President Putin as a negotiating partner, especially in these current ceasefire talks?
unidentified		Distrust but verify.
		Negotiations diplomacy is not about playing footsie with a friend.
		It's going to battle at a negotiating table with an adversary.
		Talking about broken promises, I mean, after the fall of the wall, reunified Germany, the promise to Russia, and this is documented in the National Security Archives by participants in these negotiations, was that NATO, which has acquired so much resonance as it should, would not move one inch eastward to the East.
		NATO is now on Russia's borders.
		So, you know, NATO, people say, well, NATO, yeah.
		It has a real meaning.
		And all of the Soviet Russian presidents, leaders, from Gorbachev to Yeltsin, now Putin, were vigorously opposed to the expansion of NATO.
		So I think that's very important to mark.
		And again, you don't go to a negotiating table with those you're friends with.
		You go to hammer out what is possible, not ideal, but what is possible.
		And I think that's been lost in the demon.
		I mean, Putin, I've been going to Russia since 1978.
		Putin has been in power way too long.
		He was appointed by the Yeltsin team, then elected, but appointed in order to give immunity to Yeltsin's family.
		Dedemocratization began under Yeltsin, who shot the parliament in 1993.
		There's a history that is so difficult to express in such brief times.
		But Putin wanted to be.
		He was the first leader to call Bush after 9-11.
		He wanted to be part of the West.
		But it's so I think these negotiations are preferable to the continuing destruction of both countries and the demographic crisis.
		Let me say finally that I have a friend who's a political prisoner in prison, and he's calling for an addition to the negotiations from his prison, saying that all political prisoners should be released, Russian and Ukrainian.
		So there are many demands larded onto this negotiating process, but the first one is to try ceasefire and then build out a security architecture that could work for both countries.
		Tough, but doable.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Should Ukraine be prepared to give up land for peace?
unidentified		That is a negotiation.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So what do you think?
unidentified		I think you could, short of giving, you could have autonomy.
		You could have frozen conflict.
		You could negotiate something that is not just territorial concession.
		And I think that's doable.
		I think what's also under, you know, the four regions are Russian-speaking, have been part of the East.
		And the former president of Ukraine, Paroshenko, who preceded Zelensky, went to war with the East of Ukraine, calling those there terrorists.
		You know, Mr. Zelensky is a hero in many ways, standing for his country, becoming his country.
		He embodies his country.
		But the reporting on Ukraine until recently has not expressed that it's martial law.
		The press there, like in Russia, worse in Russia, is suppressed.
		There are internal battles.
		This needs to be understood.
		Now, the minerals have added a new dimension.
		And it's so, Trump is so, he's an extractive neo-colonial empire nut, but it has made it an interesting, it's an interesting development.
		And in fact, the minerals could be a provision for security for Ukraine.
		If the West is in Ukraine with attempts to gather minerals, such as gather, but extract, that too could be a provision of security for Ukraine.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		We'll be turning to questions from our audience in just a moment.
		Just a reminder, Democrats can call in at 202-748-8000.
		Republicans at 202-748-8001.
		And Independents at 202-748-8002.
		I want to turn for a moment before the calls to a little bit of looking at the media.
		You have a recent piece in The Guardian.
		Can the free press be saved?
		It will take a new movement of responsible readers and benefactors to protect independent media.
		And we can't really talk about this without the latest news.
		As reported in NPR, the bloody Saturday at Voice of America and other U.S.-funded networks, this is that journalists who showed up at Voice of America to broadcast their programs were effectively locked out.
		All full-time staffers at the Voice of America and the Office of Cuba Broadcasting, which runs radio and television Marti, were affected.
		More than 1,000 employees.
		The move followed a late Friday night edict from President Trump that its parent agency called the U.S. Agency for Global Media must eliminate all activities that are not required by law.
		In addition, under the leadership of Trump appointees, the agency has severed all contracts for the privately incorporated international broadcasters it funds, including Radio Free Europe, Radio Liberty, Radio Free Asia, and the Middle East broadcasting networks.
		Your piece in The Guardian was mainly about the changes at the Washington Post and sort of the private media, but in combination with what's happening at Voice of America, I'd love for you to answer your own question.
		Can the free press be saved?
unidentified		Well, certainly these latest actions have the stench of authoritarian leaders shutting down media.
		And I think that what we're witnessing is an administration that has great interest in delegitimizing the media as for a state that holds anything accountable.
		This administration wants to be free of any guardrails, whether it's by the court or by the media or by Congress.
		So I think it's a very dangerous moment.
		I do think it's interesting.
		I was watching last night a documentary about Catherine Graham.
		Of course, the Graham family owned the Washington Post for many years until it was sold.
		They sold it to Bezos.
		And they too, the Graham family during Watergate, were faced with the issue of whether four of the TV stations owned by the Washington Post would be taken away by the Nixon administration as a result of their Watergate reporting.
		The Graham family, Kay Graham, Ben Bradley, stood up to these forces.
		So it's just saying there are examples of owners of papers understanding what's at stake.
		But we do see a kind of on bended knee capitulation, early capitulation, anticipatory capitulation by some of the media owners.
		In terms of VOA and Radio Free Europe and Radio Marti, it's ugly to close down media this way.
		There is a question about what the role of VOA or Radio Free Europe is.
		During the Cold War, it was very important for Russians sitting in kitchens to listen to these alternative sources.
		It is again, but for a period during Glasnos, the opening of the media, many people, at least in Russia, were more interested in their own papers.
		Now they need alternative news again.
		But it's not a good sign.
		It's not a sign that's going to give one hope, but it does give a sign that people have to understand the importance.
		They don't have to, but understand the importance of an accountability check on a government that has no purpose or no use for guardrails or for accountability.
		So it's another sign of danger ahead and another sign where journalists can play a role.
		And readers, the boycott of the Washington Post, those who gave up their subscription, is substantial.
		Is that the way one wishes there were other methods of holding media accountable?
		But media malpractice brought us Trump to some extent.
		And I think there's a reckoning that is underway.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's get to some calls.
		Ben is in Georgetown, Kentucky, on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Ben.
unidentified		Good morning.
		Thank you.
		With all the illegals that were coming to the country for the last four years, how will you employ those people?
		Will they be taking half of my grandson's job?
		And then both of them will be on gentleman assistance and social programs.
		How do you foresee that happening?
		I'm not sure I get your question in terms of taking your grandson's job.
		I do think that there was a day without immigrants in Los Angeles years ago, and I think in Texas, and things came to a halt.
		So in terms of the possibility of having a humane immigration system and your son not losing a job, I think it's possible.
		I think there's a lot of hysteria, moral panic about immigration.
		I think it's a legitimate issue, but not the way it's framed.
		And I think, I do think that it's the Democratic Party is coming to terms with whether you can have a kind of social democracy and an open immigration policy.
		But what we're witnessing now is a cruelty that is not consistent with effective immigration.
		And so I just, I raise that as a response.
		Kerry is in Colorado on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Carrie.
unidentified		Yes, a couple things I wanted to point out that I believe are fallacies to the premise that she's making.
		First of all, the 80-20 rule, even though it's tried and true for many reasons, in this case, I think 20% is really the fallacy.
		Most of those people.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry, Carrie, which topic are you referring to specifically?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Kerry?
unidentified		Well, the author is stating that 20% of the people are really controlling and they're considered the elite.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So, Kerry, that was our previous guest who's actually moved on.
		We have now with us Katrina Vandenhoevel, who is the editorial director and publisher of The Nation.
		And she's talking about Ukraine as well as domestic policy.
		Did you have a question for her?
unidentified		No, I don't.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay, we're going to move on then.
		Let's go to Miriam in Farr, Texas on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Miriam.
unidentified		And can you turn down the volume on your TV, please?
unidentified		Is it already lowered?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I think so.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, please.
unidentified		Okay.
		Yes.
		Well, on the one hand, Trump is like a symbol of destruction, of taking our rights away.
		And when our other guest, I forgot her name, when the guest speaks about creating some type of negotiation with a country that is all about dictatorship, where Putin doesn't even like, doesn't have the democracy for his own citizens.
		And yet she wants us to create some type of negotiation with a country that's the opposite of what we stand for.
		It just doesn't jive.
		Sooner or later, what happens when there's a president that is like a Democrat that is not going to be putting up with Putin's BS and Putin decides to forget about the negotiations or the treaties or whatever he signed and he goes and he continues to invade after another president?
		Why not deal with the issue right now as hard as it is so that we can put a stop to him?
		Because the negotiations are happening, but we're not going to let him dictate what he wants.
		Of course not.
		And negotiations.
		To your good caller.
		You're a good caller.
		Negotiations aren't about giving away.
		They're about figuring out how countries can live together.
		And we've negotiated with authoritarian nations before.
		I mean, the ending of the Vietnam War was not pretty.
		The alternative is endless war, endless conflict.
		And in the case of Russia, we had some great negotiations with the leader, Mikhail Gorbachev, who was the most committed anti-nuke abolitionist.
		The concern I have about your caller is let's think of this.
		You have two nuclear armed powers, Russia and the United States.
		The last remaining scaffolding of arms control expires in February 2026.
		The unraveling of arms control is a long story, but it's certainly a bi-country case.
		So I think there are issues about no one is a friend.
		People, countries have interests.
		It's odious often, but it's the case.
		And I think that view of diplomacy as appeasement is something I referred to earlier.
		Diplomacy has been demonized.
		Maybe we need a better word, but this is not a favor for Putin.
		This is about security.
		Now, do I wish we redefine security as Gorbachev had, so that it's not about military might, but it's about treating pandemics and healthcare, nuclear proliferation, climate?
		Yes, but we're not there yet.
		That'll take time and negotiation and vision.
		So I defer to your guest, but I'd ask her to think again about the alternatives to diplomacy, tough diplomacy.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		What do you think both Putin and Zelensky are trying to get, you know, as a final outcome here?
unidentified		I think for Zelensky, it's critical that he have face-saving measures, that he be remembered, because I don't think he will win a new election if and when it's called, that he stood for his country.
		Remember that there was at the earliest moment question of whether he would leave for security's sake, leave Ukraine.
		But so face-saving and produce a Ukraine that is secure, stable, and even prosperous.
		For Putin, it's face-saving too, but it's also a security dilemma for Putin.
		It's not about conquering the Baltics.
		NATO has been a force that I think many Americans don't understand, the encroachment of NATO.
		So for Putin and I think the Russian leadership, it's a measure of face-saving, speaking to their citizens about what has been, quote, won or not lost.
		And it's also a security dilemma.
		The key thing for Russia is that NATO not, that Ukraine not become a member of NATO.
		That's the key thing.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Gary is in Bellepree, Ohio on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Gary.
unidentified		Hello.
		Good morning, America.
		Question for the guest.
		I know during the Second World War, when the Germans invaded Russia, a lot of the Ukrainians actually sided with the Germans.
		And I wonder if you think that has anything to do with the way things are right now with the situation there.
		So it's an interesting question.
		There's no question that there's a strong element of neo-Nazism in Ukraine, Banderites, other legacy forces.
		The question is how much Zelensky relied on them in the previous years and how important they remain.
		The one thing people don't focus on is that there's been a civil war in Ukraine for many years where Poroshenko treated the citizens of the eastern part of Ukraine as terrorists.
		The danger that a civil war might re-erupt is not on the agenda.
		It's all about Russia, the U.S., the West, Ukraine.
		But there is a danger and the forces of neo-Nazism could re-emerge as a stronger force if there is a civil war.
		But that is an important comment.
		But the problem I defer to your caller is that when it's raised, the issue of the history of neo-Nazism in Ukraine, you are called a Putin puppet, when in fact there's a legitimate issue to be looked at.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Sharon is in North Bend, Oregon on our line for Democrats.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Sharon.
unidentified		Hi.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		I basically had a couple of observations about the war in Ukraine and the effort to stop the war.
		And I'm sorry, I'm hearing a lot of Russian talking points coming from your guest.
		And I think it would be very easy for most people to take a cursory look at what's happening in Ukraine and come to some of those conclusions.
		But I hope she'll look deeper.
		What's happening, I think, and I thought it for quite some time, Ukraine has been moving from an oligarchy and an overriding Russian influence in their country to a democracy.
		And it has been horrific getting from here to democracy.
		And I won't dive into the history.
		We don't have enough time for it.
		But at the same time that America is being moved from democracy to oligarchy and authoritarianism, I mean, a lot of people don't want to see it, but it is happening now.
		And here's Ukraine between a rock and a hard place.
		Trump is very hostile to Ukraine.
		And I hope people are able to actually see it.
		And it's on a personal level.
		Lord knows why he does what he does.
		You know, I'll leave that to the hedgehog.
		But if I might.
		He is hostile to Ukraine.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Sharon, let's let Katrina respond to some of the points.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		And I'm not hanging up on you, but I just want to let Katrina.
unidentified		No, no, I mean, I take seriously what you're saying.
		I think it's a very, first of all, I believe that an end to the war will lead to more democracy, more prosperity, more security in Ukraine, which we all seek.
		At the moment, the danger is that there's martial law because of the war with Russia.
		There's media suppression because it's wartime.
		And I don't think, and the economic situation in Ukraine is miserable.
		The demographic crisis is miserable.
		It took John McCain and Lindsey Graham, Lindsey Graham, to call on Ukraine to lower its fighting age because the Ukrainian government rightly didn't want to put young men.
		So there's 60 and 70 year olds fighting in Ukraine in order to maintain stability.
		I think the idea that I'm doing Russian talking points is a measure of how scrambled and destructive our politics is.
		And I do say, and I don't call you out on this, but this is a long time trend where you call people names in order to defame their views.
		This happened during Iraq, during Vietnam.
		People would be called names because they sought a peace of security.
		But I think it's much more complex than Zelensky is a hero, that Ukraine is a democracy.
		And we'll see how it evolves.
		But if more war has never made a country more democratic, I spent many years working with Russian dissidents, feminists, writers, thinkers, journalists.
		And I guarantee you, I know these times in Russia or in this country in such critical times do not produce more democracy, do not give space to dissident voices.
		I fear they give space to people who say, if you disagree with the prevailing line, that you're doing Russian talking points, which is destructive of our democracy, which I care most about.
		Sharon, did you have any follow-up questions?
		No, they're not questions, just opinions.
		I disagree wholeheartedly with, I'm absolutely against war.
		Who the heck's for war?
		Well, Putin's for war.
		He's all for it.
		But these people are fighting for their lives.
		And if Russia manages to roll over them, which if he doesn't do it this week, he'll do it next week or three years from now, he has to be put on his heels.
		And I don't, and Donald Trump says, forget about NATO.
		We don't need no NATO anymore.
		Forget about looking after our allies.
		We don't need no stinking allies.
		We're talking about, I hope we're seeing it at more than 30,000 feet.
		We're talking about spheres of influence where he's turning his back on Europe.
		So Europe knows that they don't have the umbrella anymore that they had with knowing that you could rely on the United States to just be a balance of power.
		So, you know, these are anti-with these.
		These are anti-system times.
		There's a lot of rethinking about institutions that ostensibly provided security.
		Let the Europeans determine their security.
		I mean, it was always de Gaulle's idea of an independent France.
		They have nuclear deterrent.
		But in doing so, I simply want to say to your Kohler, as they turn in Europe to investing war in weapons, it's not going to help their society.
		Investing in weapons doesn't build more security.
		It builds more insecurity.
		And you know who gets rich?
		Those who lobbied for NATO in the very beginning were not about security.
		They were people who worked at arms manufacturers.
		I'm not reductionist.
		I believe there's a need for security.
		But how you define security can mean endless arming up, or it can mean a path to thinking anew about how we can be a secure country and world.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's go to Keith in Denver, Colorado, on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Keith.
unidentified		Good morning, and thank you for taking my call.
		I understand what your guest is saying, but let me say one thing, and then I'll go to the point that I originally had.
		Someone previously talked about the neo-Nazism that was extant in Ukraine prior to this period.
		I think this is an interesting argument because we have neo-Nazism here in the United States at the highest levels of our political structure.
		But that's not what I was calling about.
		I was really calling about the issue about perpetual war.
		Clearly, Putin and Russia have invaded Ukraine, a sovereign nation.
		Now, Ukraine had abandoned its nuclear ambitions per treaty with President Clinton, Prime Minister Tony Blair, there was another signatory, as well as President Yeltsin of Russia.
		They were to abandon their nuclear ambitions so long as there was going to be peace.
		Russia is in breach of that agreement at this present time.
		Now, to say that Zelensky is not the hero that we think, of course not.
		I think that there are complexities to every person in the world.
		But at this point, there is a right to defend itself that Ukraine has.
		And they're asking the United States, and they're asking the West, they're asking NATO to intervene or intercede on their behalf.
		Now, the President of the United States, for whatever reason, appears to be completely Antithetical to 80 years of United States foreign policy since the Truman doctrine, that we either protect nations that are sovereign and that we stop the growth of communism or expansionism.
		And that's what Putin essentially is.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So, Keith, I want to pause you for a moment because a similar point was raised by J.D. Redding on X asking how many times has diplomacy been given a chance to Putin?
		How many times?
		Katrina, these two comments kind of dovetail with each other.
unidentified		So I'm not disagreeing that Putin invaded Ukraine, but the issue of 80 years of a foreign policy, I think your caller was referring to how we've kept the peace or kept the stability, kept the security.
		I think, you know, the coalition of the willingness I mentioned before was a name given to those countries who went into Iraq.
		I do think that there's a need, a desperate need, to think anew, and we're not talking about abolishing NATO, but a new security architecture that is less militarized.
		I come back again to Gorbachev.
		How did he emerge in that system?
		Think of that.
		But he did, and he spoke of a different structure in Europe.
		He spoke of a common European home stretching from Vladivostok to Lisbon, demilitarized, but with provisions for security review.
		And I spoke earlier and I was kind of joking, but the great mantra: trust but verify, distrust but verify.
		What are the alternatives to endless war if we don't try to deal with the issues that contribute to war?
		And I think you're going to see an attempt to find a solution, a ceasefire, a negotiated solution to Ukraine-Russia.
		Now, Europe, and particularly the Baltic countries, which have had, did have World War II disaster, horrific history with the Soviet Union, are virulently opposed to anything other than building up NATO and the European deterrent.
		I am just raising the question of whether that is the best way to move toward being a prosperous, secure, and stable country.
		I don't see it.
		I see more war.
		I see more weapons, less providing for citizens through what is true security, health, housing.
		A series of issues that often get lost in the rush to build weapons.
		Harry is in Tampa, Florida, on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Harry.
unidentified		Yes, thank you for taking my call, and I appreciate Mrs. Vandenhoeville's informed commentary.
		You're obviously a very educated, well-spoken editor of the nation, but I think you're making a fallacy.
		You're falling into a fallacy and making a mistake when you assume that negotiations with someone like Vladimir Putin can proceed as they would with any other respectable world leader.
		You're talking about a man whose name is going to go down in history next to Pol Pot, Adolf Hitler, and Joseph Stalin.
		You are not talking about just a generic leader of a major power in this world.
		That's not who and what this man is.
		This is somebody who commits war crimes.
		He bombs hospitals like he did last week in Ukraine while the ceasefire negotiations are occurring.
		And yet, you sit here talking about negotiating with him as if he's going to just honorably and logically abide by the same thing.
		You cannot, you need guardrails from here to Paducah.
		But think of those we've negotiated with.
		First of all, we went to war with Stalin.
		If you want to go to the Roosevelt House in New York, check out the photos of Churchill, Stalin, and Roosevelt.
		I'm ready for Roosevelt to be capped and Stalin wiped out.
		But you don't go to negotiate with the idea that your negotiating partner is going to play footseed.
		I mean, we have negotiated with tough countries.
		Vietnam, the hatred of North Vietnam among many Americans because of the loss of, what, 58,000 men, soldiers.
		So I think there's a fallacy here, if I might throw it back at you.
		The idea of diplomacy has become for too many appeasement.
		And may I point out that there is a country, Russia, and this is truly heretical.
		Putin is often a referee.
		There are hawks in Russia, primarily in the Donbass region, who think he's capitulating.
		He's a referee of a political system, which we never pay attention to because in America, often media fixes on a person.
		So Zelensky is Ukraine.
		We don't see some of the larger forces.
		Putin, I would submit that his war in Chechnya, the Second War, was horrifically brutal, but it ended.
		And their guardrails, Chechnya and its leader, are still ugly forces.
		But you can't, what is the alternative?
		I mean, this is where I spoke about this maximalist view of the Russian invasion and Russia did invade.
		But is it going to go to the Baltics?
		It can't even pay many of its pensions in Russia.
		I mean, look how failed Russia was.
		It thought it would conquer Ukraine in two days.
		Look, I mean, it's struggling.
		It's a meat grinder of a war.
		It's not World War II.
		It's World War I, where 70,000 men were often killed over a weekend in a place like Yps.
		No wonder Europe heralds World War I, marks World War I in ways we do.
		We don't.
		But the loss of memory about World War I is stunning on the part of Europeans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Well, that is all the time we have for this segment.
		Thank you so much, Katrina van den Hoovel, who's the editorial director and publisher of The Nation magazine.
		Thank you very much for your time.
unidentified		Thank you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Coming up next, we're going to take more of your phone calls after the break in open forum.
		You can start calling in now, Democrats at 202-748-8000.
		Republicans at 202-748-8001.
		And Independents at 202-748-8002.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		Sunday.
		Tonight on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A, New York University journalism professor Meryl Gordon, with her book, The Woman Who Knew Everyone, talks about the life of socialite and democratic fundraiser Pearl Mesta, dubbed the hostess with the mostist.
		She was close to three U.S. presidents during the mid-20th century and was known for throwing parties that brought political elites together.
		Social climbing is a lot easier if you have money.
meryl gordon ▲ ● ▼		And Pearl quickly realized when she went with her husband to Washington, who was an advisor to President Wilson during World War I, Pearl realized there was a huge dichotomy in Washington between people and influential government figures who had no money, but a lot of power.
unidentified		And she discovered if she gave, she bought boxes at charity galas, if she gave debutante parties for the daughters of the underfunded, she could have a lot of really influential friends.
		Merle Gordon, with her book, The Woman Who Knew Everyone, tonight at 8 Eastern on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A. You can listen to Q&A and all of our podcasts on our free C-SPAN Now app.
		Mr. Speaker, on this historic day, the House of Representatives opens its proceedings for the first time to televised coverage.
		Since March of 1979, C-SPAN has been your unfiltered window into American democracy, bringing you direct, no-spin coverage of Congress, the Supreme Court, and the White House.
		Is this Mr. Brian Lamb?
		Yes, it is.
		Would you hold one moment, please, for the president?
		It exists because of C-SPAN founder Brian Lamb's vision and the cable industry's support, not government funding.
		But this public service isn't guaranteed.
		All this month, in honor of Founders Day, your support is more important than ever.
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patty murray ▲ ● ▼		To the American people, now is the time to tune in to C-SPAN.
unidentified		Your gift today preserves open access to government and ensures the public stays informed.
		Donate now at c-span.org slash donate or scan the code on your screen.
		Every contribution matters.
		And thank you.
		Washington Journal continues.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Welcome back.
		We're in an open forum, ready to take your calls.
		Some of the other stories that we've been following include this one here in Bloomberg, that a judge halts Trump's wartime powers plan to speed deportations.
		A federal judge blocked President Donald Trump's plan to ramp up deportations of undocumented migrants over a centuries-old immigration law.
		The decision came hours after Trump invoked powers under the Alien Enemies Act of 1798 in a proclamation Saturday targeting Trende Aragua, a Venezuelan gang also designated a foreign terrorist organization.
		The law was once used to justify the internment of Japanese Americans during World War II.
		Many of Trende Aragua's members have, quote, unlawfully infiltrated the United States and are conducting irregular warfare and undertaking hostile actions against the country, Trump said in the proclamation.
		The president also argued that the operation is engaging in mass illegal migration to the United States in a bid to harm the country's citizens, undermine public safety, and support efforts by Venezuela President Nicholas Maduro to destabilize democratic nations.
		James E. Boseberg, Chief Judge of the U.S. District Court for the District of Columbia, issued the order to stop Trump's deportations.
		Quote, I do not believe I can wait any longer and am required to act, the AP cited Boseberg as saying during a hearing Saturday night.
		Boseberg had earlier issued a temporary restraining order blocking the deportations of five Venezuelans under the wartime statute.
		The judge's order disregards well-established authority regarding President Trump's power, Attorney General Pam Bondi said in a statement after the ruling.
		Let's get to your calls in open forum.
		Dave is in Maryland on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Dave.
unidentified		Yeah, I just like to say I'm really worried about our democracy.
		The people in office right now, the Republicans, are just totally tearing it up.
		They're not doing anything that's constructive or going to help the citizens of this country.
		They talk about Joe Biden.
		I mean, we had the strongest economy under Joe Biden, the number one economy in the world.
		And under Trump, he's tearing it up.
		Where who knows what our economy is going to be?
		We're alienating our allies.
		We're siding with countries like Russia, North Korea, Iran, against Ukraine.
		And it's ridiculous.
		And I think people ought to take note that it's, you know, it's not going to be pretty in the future.
		They're getting rid of all the government workers, people who were doing a good job, they labeled as unfit so they could get rid of them easier.
		So, yeah, I do worry about our democracy under Trump, who's off the rails, and he really doesn't care because she's not going to be running again.
		Those are my comments.
		Thank you.
		Mike is in Rockford, Illinois, and our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Mike.
unidentified		Good morning, Kimberly.
		You're my favorite.
		C-SPAN, shout out to you for what you do with the student cam, the two-time winner.
		Totally bring tears to my eyes.
		Heck of a job.
		Two points that the media is missing and not answering the right questions, and two points that the media is not talking about at all that will help our country a lot.
		The two points first, Doge has a task of selling assets to agencies that they go into.
		And the media first reported on this, but they're not saying what they're selling.
		What I figured out is they're targeting data data centers, and they want to convert the data over to the XAI or whatever privately owned, corporate-owned AI computer.
		And that's where the golden goose is: our data.
		They're going to download it and then sell it back to us one page at a time.
		And nobody's really talking about that aspect of it as the golden goose, our data is going to be sold back to us.
		That's one point.
		The other one is these hulums and hood rats that turn the FBI from the FBI to the FB crazy ice with no background checks and nobody in the cabinet besides the Oval Office doing all the background checks and all the top secret clearance.
		And at the same time, the committee of 12 Republicans and 10 Democrats is passing these same people through.
		Very, very great areas that the media needs to get down on.
		We're almost being distracted and desensitized.
		And the last two points I want to make about positive things in our country is Tesla came out with a generator that's hydrogen generated for cars that's coming out this year.
		They also have the generator for the home with electrical panels for the roof.
		Once Tesla combines these, you can be off the grid and live in the city with what they have at hand.
		And that is not being talked about at all.
		Number two thing they're not talking about is the new chip that came out of Microsoft as the quantum chip that does not have to be frozen no longer at a 40 below zero.
		And now you can put that, and that's going to make computers, cell phones, like HREC tapes.
		And nobody's talking about this new chip that Microsoft came out with.
		And there's so much more I can talk about.
		Thank you.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Mike also mentioned the student cam competition, which we do here at C-SPAN.
		You can find those entries at studentcam.org, as well as the winners.
		And if you'd like to watch the video announcement of the winners, that's also on our website, c-span.org.
		The theme this year for the student cam was your message to the president, what issue is most important to you or your community.
		And that, again, is at studentcam.org if you'd like more information on that.
		Ted is in Raymond, New Hampshire, on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Ted.
unidentified		Yes.
		Yeah, one of the things I wanted to call in and ask the lady when she was talking about Ukraine is one of the biggest exports Ukraine has to the world is grain, food supply.
		That was on the coastal.
		I could understand why Putin wants to invade it.
		Once you control food sources, you pretty much can almost control countries.
		As with Donald Trump, wants those rare minerals or ores.
		And another point I wanted to make was she never mentioned North Korea soldiers in there and their influence on the fighting.
		When Ukraine gave up its nuclear weapons, it gave up a lot of its own personal protection.
		Now one of the deals Putin wants to make is that European countries and Ukraine put their arms down and reduce troops like in Poland and that.
		It seems to me once Ukraine gave up their nukes, he saw an opening and just took it.
		Even though Trump says Ukraine invaded Russia, we know the truth.
		So any country that gets rid of their nukes, at least you got a deterrent.
		It'd be wise to keep them and watch our southern borders for Russia's influence, because Russia said at one time it wanted Ukraine back because it was part of Russia.
		Well, what's this difference if he says, I want Alaska back.
		You didn't pay enough for it.
		And we'd go to war for that.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		A few other stories were following this hour.
		Dozens reported killed after Trump orders decisive strikes against Yemen's Houthis.
		Dozens of people have been reported killed after U.S. President Donald Trump ordered decisive military action against Houthi rebels in Yemen, opening a new salvo against the Iran-backed group that has targeted shipping lanes in the Red Sea.
		President Trump posted on Truth Social about this issue, and he was saying, today I have ordered the United States military to launch decisive and powerful military action against the Houthi terrorists in Yemen.
		They have waged an unrelenting campaign of piracy, violence, and terrorism against American and other ships, aircraft, and drones.
		Joe Biden's response was pathetically weak, so the unrestrained Houthis just kept going.
		It's been over a year since a U.S.-flagged commercial ship safely sailed through the Suez Canal, the Red Sea, or the Gulf of Aden.
		The last American warship to go through the Red Sea four months ago was attacked by Houthis over a dozen times.
		Funded by Iran, the Houthi thugs have fired missiles at U.S. aircraft and targeted our troops and allies.
		These relentless assaults have cost the U.S. and the world economy many billions of dollars while at the same time putting innocent lives at risk.
		In other more uplifting news, NASA's stuck astronauts welcomed their newly arrived replacements to the International Space Station.
		This is a story in the Associated Press.
		Just over a day after blasting off, a SpaceX crew capsule arrived at the International Space Station on Sunday, delivering replacements for NASA's two stuck astronauts.
		The four newcomers representing the U.S., Japan, and Russia will spend the next few days learning the station's ins and outs from Butch Wilmore and SUNY Williams.
		Then the two will strap into their own SpaceX capsule later this week, one that has been up there since last year to close out an unexpected extended mission that began last June.
		All right, back to your calls and open forum.
		Rick is in Chicago, Illinois on our line for Democrats.
		Good morning, Rick.
unidentified		Hi, how are you today?
		Good, thanks.
		I have a couple questions.
		Why hasn't anyone come out with what was in the discussion between Putin and President Trump during the Helsinki meetings?
		And why has all of the former administrations been excluded from briefings?
		Why do you think that is, Rick?
		I think they made a deal to divide up Europe.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Was that all?
unidentified		I also have a question.
		Why are there such a move on Greenland?
		What is the strategic value of Greenland?
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		Odu is in Massachusetts on our line for Republicans.
		Good morning, Audu.
unidentified		Good morning, Kimberly.
		You're looking beautiful, as always.
		Thank you, C-SPAN Washington Journal, for taking my call.
		I would like to start off by saying there's a lot of smart people that call into this great program that C-SPAN gives us.
		And I'm glad they don't charge us a dollar just to state our statements.
		Thank you, C-SPAN.
		Anywho, what's on my mind today is I want to know why nobody is coming out on the floor to talk about how they're going to help the Trump on the national debt.
		This is ridiculous.
		The number one threat to this country is the debt.
		The Dirty Dog Democrats has really shown we the people what the Dirty Dog Democrats stand for.
		I think the presidential address really said a lot.
		The Dirty Dog Democrats spent over $10 trillion in the recent past years.
		Barack O'Brien administration printed so much money, it should be against the law to print so much money.
		I applaud Doggy and Elon's Musketeers for opening and sniffing out the books to our horribly Iran Washington department about what's going on with those books.
		We have a president in office who is looking to give us more than 10 cents and stand up to dictators who are looking to abuse America.
		Living in this dark blue deep state Democratic stronghold, Polcahantis, Jim Bug, McGovernment, China Plant Wu, who spent $650,000 of mass tax money to sit in front of Congress, moving on to New York, Chuck Smook.
		All the Democrats should be behind this president to support our country to make it affordable.
		The weak-kneed Democrats should stop crying like someone is stealing their money and talk more serious business of making America affordable.
		We the people are sure as hell don't need people like kids, food, froster, boy, bathroom diddler, tweak.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		So looking at the national debt, the Peter G. Peterson Foundation tracks this number pretty carefully.
		What is the national debt today?
		That is $36,219,409,281,300,748 and counting more than $100,000 for every single person in America.
		Next up is Jill in Chicago on our line for independence.
		Good morning, Jill.
unidentified		Yes, I would like to refer back to the first guest you had who was talking about the elites and what's happened to the working men and women of this country and referenced the woman who called in and was saying how we needed to put some context in it and look back into history.
		I've been around long enough to have watched, I call him Donald Trump because he thinks everybody's a chump except him.
		If you look at the history of him, he's done this repeatedly.
		He got, you know, made himself, was rich.
		You know, his dad set up in New York.
		He finally couldn't do any more real estate deals in New York because he kept filing for bankruptcy on the developments that he was doing in New York.
		So then he left New York and went to Atlanta.
		And, you know, basically made a big thing about how he was going to hire, you know, small family-run businesses to redo the casinos and everything that he was built there.
		And then he did exactly the same thing.
		You know, he'd sign a contract with a small electrical firm and, you know, for hundreds of thousands of dollars, he'd add stuff to it.
		And then he'd tell the people, well, you know, you signed a contract for this much.
		If you want any more from me, take me to court.
		And he, again, filed bankruptcy.
		He always, he does a really good job of talking it up like he really wants to help the working people.
		And even the apprentice was like, you know, another round of that where he's just this real slick businessman who wants to give hardworking people a chance.
		That's his thing.
		It's happening all over again.
		You know, the one example that, and I can think of everybody's, you know, wonders why he's not worried about the stock market falling.
		Well, the elite love it when the stock market drops because then they can buy back stocks.
		You know, the multinationals and the elite rich of this country can buy back a bunch of stock and get that much more rich and leave that much less for the working people.
		It's not something new, but we really do have to put it in the context of what's happened to the, I'm a, you know, tail end of the baby boomers.
		We had a solid, wonderful middle class in this country, and it has been destroyed and gutted by people like Donald Trump, the elite who think that working people are chumps to be taken advantage of.
		And it's sad to see it again.
		And I want to point out, I am truly an independent.
		Since the Citizens United ruling came through, both parties are Republicrats.
		The best thing this country could do to save our democracy is to leave both parties behind and start thinking about some new directions to go that are really meaningful to restoring the middle class of this country.
		Okay.
		Sandy is in Long Lake, Wisconsin on our line for Democrats.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Sandy.
unidentified		Hi.
		First, I would like to respond to a gentleman that I think was before this lady.
		God says you seek and you shall find the truth.
		Maybe he better research that again about who spent how much in office because he's wrong.
		Donald Trump has spent more.
		Either way, I would like it if people would start looking in their Bible and see what is going on in this world because Trump is part of the devil scheme, if you don't mind me saying, sorry.
		I feel sorry for the people in this country because if they don't stand up and speak up like the Republicans did to our government's office, January 6th, we're in a world of hurt.
		A very scary world of hurt, and not just for the United States.
		And Donald Trump has no right taking other people's property, countries, or anything else.
		And that's all I have to say.
		I'm sorry.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Lattell is in Atlanta, Georgia, on our line for Republicans.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Lattelle.
unidentified		Yes.
		Hey, how you doing this morning?
		Good, thanks.
		That's great.
		And I would like to comment in regards of Dr. Ugal, even though that she's no longer on.
		I think that I think America needs to define its position, its vantage point in regards to Moscow, Russia, and Kiev and Ukraine.
		Meaning, what purpose or what purport will the support of any kind really, truly, in all honesty, serve America if in fact that the President Putin, as well as that of Zelensky, I'm sorry,
		may not show efforts to return support to the United States.
		And secondly, in regards of independent media, do that independent media or the list of independent medias, the primary medias are that of CNN, the nation, et cetera.
		However, haphazardly speaking, is independent media, even though I do use Facebook and it serves as an independent media, I do not think that some of the operations of independent media are reflecting the best interest of the current president,
		nor reflecting the best interest or the preciseness of the last administration, which somewhat added theft in taking away from Mr. Donald Trump's first term of office.
		And thirdly, not to be long-winned, why is it voided from media the stance that the federal government holds against African Americans equal protection under the law?
		Thank you.
		Isaiah is in Minlothian, Virginia, on our line for independence.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Good morning, Isaiah.
unidentified		Yes.
		I'd like to make the comment that if we as a people observe what's going on in the world today, we would see our current situation and president doing to the United States exactly what the KGB and Putin did to Russia.
		And that is, as the Soviet Union dissolved and went away, they decided to build its replacement by selling off or auctioning off all of the assets of Russia to these oligarchs.
		Donald Trump, MAGA, those that support him and them are doing the same thing in the United States.
		And after they finish totally destroying and breaking down the U.S. as we've known it for 250 years, the oligarchs here are going to do the same thing that the oligarchs in Russia did.
		They will end up owning all of the assets of the United States, and all of the debt will be to the public, which is basically we, the people.
		And that situation is going to last way past any of our lifetimes.
		There is no democracy in this country.
		We could argue it never has been.
		All right.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		Let's hear from Joe in Iowa on our line for Democrats.
unidentified		Good morning, Joe.
		Hello.
		Yes.
		First of all, I want to say just everybody, the last few callers are so insightful and intelligent.
		It doesn't matter what party they come from.
		And I wish I could be as articulate.
		But some of the things that I wanted to just point out, if I could, is more looking towards the future, somewhat what the last gentleman did after looking at some of the past.
		And just a reflection on, for example, one of the ladies was talking about, one of the previous callers was talking about how Trump was basically handed his fortune from his dad, which was true.
		And then he lost so much of it and filed bankruptcy multiple times.
		He doesn't even know what the term collateral damage is when it includes people's lives that he destroys along the way and through his path.
		And it is really kind of despicable to think about that because he doesn't really give a damn who he hurts or pushes out of the way to get to where he wants to be.
		And I find it kind of interesting that not only him and the richest man in America, I mean, just the obvious here, are sitting in the White House dictating how our country should be run with the money that we spend or do not spend or whatever they're hijacking and possibly nefariously saving for themselves.
		And nobody can see this or the Republicans can't see this.
		It just seems like they're turning a blind eye.
		And I think we should also reflect on, for example, since Elon Musk is in charge of some of the biggest space exploration and so forth with the multi-billions that he owns and can basically buy our support in space,
		referring to NASA and the connections he has there, we should really look at what his objective is there.
		And we all know, I mean, I feel that he's looking for a way to be able to possibly, I know this is far-fetched, but possibly colonize Mars for his family, for the elite, et cetera, when Earth goes to crap because of all the environmental issues that they're causing.
		And that's just some of my take here.
		Sorry if I seem a little far-fetched, but I just, I can't help but look at it that way.
		Thank you.
		Well, thank you to everyone who called in today for Washington Journal.
kimberly adams ▲ ● ▼		That's all the time we have for our show today.
		We'll be back tomorrow with another edition of Washington Journal starting tomorrow at 7 a.m. Eastern.
		We hope you'll join us and have a great day.
unidentified		Coming up Monday morning, we'll talk with Center for American Progress President and former Biden Domestic Policy Council Director Neera Tandon about Democrats' response to the Trump administration and GOP agenda.
		And then Taylor Poplar, Spectrum News national political reporter, reviews White House News of the Day.
		Also, editor-in-chief of the National Review Rich Lowry discusses the Trump administration and Republican agenda.
		C-SPAN's Washington Journal.
		Join in the conversation live at 7 Eastern Monday morning on C-SPAN, C-SPAN Now, or online at c-SPAN.org.
		Up next, President Trump's nominees to serve as ambassadors to Canada, Japan, and Mexico testify before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee.
		And then President Trump and Irish Prime Minister Mikhail Martin speak to reporters before meeting in the Oval Office.
		After that, they hold a St. Patrick's Day celebration at the White House.
		And later, representatives of the U.S. military testify about a stopgap funding bill approved by the House in a hearing of a Senate Armed Forces subcommittee.
		Sunday.
		Tonight, on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A, New York University journalism professor Meryl Gordon, with her book, The Woman Who Knew Everyone, talks about the life of socialite and Democratic fundraiser Pearl Mesta, dubbed the hostess with the mostist.
		She was close to three U.S. presidents during the mid-20th century and was known for throwing parties that brought political elites together.
		Social climbing is a lot easier if you have money.
meryl gordon ▲ ● ▼		And Pearl quickly realized when she went with her husband to Washington, who was an advisor to President Wilson during World War I, Pearl realized there was a huge dichotomy in Washington between people and influential government figures who had no money, but a lot of power.
unidentified		And she discovered if she gave, she bought boxes at charity galas, if she gave debutante parties for the daughters of the underfunded, she could have a lot of really influential friends.
		Merle Gordon, with her book, The Woman Who Knew Everyone, tonight at 8 Eastern on C-SPAN's Q ⁇ A. You can listen to Q&A and all of our podcasts on our free C-SPAN Now app.
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		Democracy Unfiltered.
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