| Speaker | Time | Text |
|---|---|---|
|
unidentified
|
And coming up, we'll hear from President Trump in the Oval Office that's expected to begin soon. | |
| The President is expected to address the new U.S. jobs numbers out today, showing the labor market growing by 151,000 jobs last month, just short of economists' expectations. | ||
| The unemployment rate ticked up to 4.1%. | ||
| The Associated Press reports some analysts say they expect layoffs ordered by Doge to show up in the report in the coming weeks or months. | ||
| We'll also have live coverage from the White House this afternoon when President Trump is scheduled to hold a cryptocurrency summit after signing an executive order yesterday to create a national strategic reserve of Bitcoin. | ||
| We'll have that live here on C-SPAN at 3 p.m. Eastern. | ||
| You can also watch on our free app, C-SPANNOW, or online at c-span.org. | ||
| Joining us this morning at our desk is Christine Berzina. | ||
| She is the managing director of Geostrategy North at the German Marshall Fund here to talk about the U.S. pause on Ukraine aid and transatlantic relations. | ||
| Let's just begin with the German Marshall Fund and remind our viewers what is this group. | ||
|
unidentified
|
The German Marshall Fund is a transatlantic organization that was founded 53 years ago and it champions democracy, prosperity and security as the cornerstones of the transatlantic relationship. | |
| We're here in DC and we also have seven European offices. | ||
| And what is the German Marshall Fund take on President Trump's position on aid to Ukraine? | ||
|
unidentified
|
We're waiting and seeing what this actually means. | |
| The German Marshall Fund certainly wants there to be a strong and healthy relationship across the Atlantic and we absolutely want to see a whole and prosperous Ukraine also in the future. | ||
| This means that we are curious to see how the situation will evolve and want Ukraine to be on the strongest and also most secure footing moving forward. | ||
| This does not mean that war should keep going by any means in the long duration, but we are very worried that Ukraine could not have what it needs in the short term. | ||
| But again, this pause as we understand it and as I understand it is simply a pause on funding and it is a highly fluid situation hour by hour, frankly, this week. | ||
| It doesn't sound like the European leaders are going to wait and see. | ||
| I want to show a headline from the Washington Post front page below the fold this morning. | ||
| Europe scrambles to bolster its defenses. | ||
| The EU countries move to raise military spending as Trump shifts alliances. | ||
| What it says is that the EU leaders broadly agreed to move forward with plans intended to unlock hundreds of billions in extra defense spending in the coming years, but a military spending spree won't be easy. | ||
| I want to show our viewers what the president of the European Commission had to say earlier this week on when she unveiled this plan to boost European military spending. | ||
| The question is no longer whether Europe's security is threatened in a very real way or whether Europe should shoulder more of its responsibility for its own security. | ||
| In truth, we have long known the answers to those questions. | ||
| The real question in front of us is whether Europe is prepared to act as decisively as the situation dictates. | ||
| We are in an era of rearmament. | ||
| And Europe is ready to massively boost its defence spending, both to respond to the short-term urgency to act and to support Ukraine, but also to address the long-term need to take on more responsibility for our own European security. | ||
| Christine Berzin, it sounds like she almost agrees with President Trump in a way. | ||
| Europe needs to do more. | ||
| Putting aside what he has decided, or this pause, did Europe need to do more? | ||
| Was this a long time in the making? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Absolutely. | |
| And so what you heard from President von der Leyen is a very clear acknowledgement that Europe has not done enough for its security and defense since the end of the Cold War. | ||
| And there have been many warnings about the fact that the world is becoming more dangerous from Russia since 2014, but really across the globe. | ||
| There are many actors that seek to destabilize and hurt both Europe and the United States. | ||
| And Europe has to step up. | ||
| It has to spend more. | ||
| And we're seeing that right now. | ||
| Europe has been very good at pronouncements across the decades, but in the summit that was in Brussels yesterday, and in a lot of the ad hoc formats, meaning the various leaders coming together in small groups, we have seen incredibly strong signals for increased funding. | ||
| And frankly, over the past few years, even before Trump came into office, again, we have seen a significant increase in European defense spending. | ||
| What in the last few days we've seen as an evolution is a question of how do they come together and use some of the European mechanisms. | ||
| So not just each country's individual national budget, but how do they come together, perhaps borrow together, open collective funds so that the European Union as such, because that's what von der Leyen is president of the Commission of, how can they work together to make acquisition of weapons, but also to recharge the defense industry more quickly? | ||
| Why haven't they done this so far? | ||
| Even though there have been warnings, there has been recognition. | ||
| What has stopped European nations from taking this action? | ||
|
unidentified
|
Well, many have. | |
| And then there are laggards as well. | ||
| There are very different threat perceptions across the European Union and across European countries. | ||
| There are ones like France, which has a nuclear fleet, that have had to make sure the investments keep going in that. | ||
| And there are also countries that are tiny, like Luxembourg, that haven't really seen the purpose exactly. | ||
| So we are needing to have all of them move up currently in their defense spending. | ||
| Let's get to France. | ||
| Here's the French President, Manuel Macron, delivering a televised address on Wednesday, outlining the future of European security and its commitment to Ukraine amid a pause by the United States. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Peace cannot be achieved by abandoning Ukraine. | |
| Peace cannot come at any price. | ||
| And it cannot come from Russia dictating the terms. | ||
| Peace for Ukraine that come with the collapse of Ukraine. | ||
| And we have seen this happen in the past. | ||
| We can't forget that this invasion started back in 2014 and that there was a ceasefire that was agreed to in Minsk. | ||
| And that same Russia did not uphold the peace, the treaty, the ceasefire agreement. | ||
| So we cannot have stability without robust guarantees. | ||
| We cannot take them at their word. | ||
| Ukraine has a right to peace and security for itself. | ||
| And it is in our interest and it is in the interest of security in Europe. | ||
| And that is why we are working closely with our British, German allies and many other European nations. | ||
| That is why you have seen me in these past few weeks engage with numerous people in Europe, in London, to draft the commitments that are the base requirements for Ukraine. | ||
| us to sign a peace agreement where Ukraine will no longer be invaded by Russia, we have to do so by supporting the Ukrainian troops in the midterm. | ||
| It may require further European forces to be deployed. | ||
| I want to believe that the United States will stay by our side, but they will need to be. | ||
| But we need to be ready if that were not the case. | ||
| Whether we come to peace now or in somewhat distant future, Europe needs to be able to better defend itself and to deter other forms of invasion. | ||
| Whatever the case may be, we need to arm ourselves more. | ||
| We need to bolster our defense positions. | ||
| We need to deter. | ||
| And that is why we uphold NATO and our partnership with the United States of America. | ||
| But we need more. | ||
| We need to reinforce our own defense and security capabilities. | ||
| The future of Europe is not going to be decided by Russia or by Washington. | ||
| Christine Brazin, did the French president just say Europe needs to prepare for war? | ||
|
unidentified
|
There's the eventuality that there could be war. | |
| And frankly, if you prepare for war now, there won't be war. | ||
| This is the funny thing about deterrence. | ||
| Why do we have militaries? | ||
| Why do we consistently invest in making sure that we have arms that can protect our citizens? | ||
| Frankly, so the bad guys don't think they can get away with bombing or invading us because it's going to hurt them so much. | ||
| So what is the purpose of preparing for war? | ||
| It's making sure that you never, ever have to use those weapons. | ||
| And that is more of the mentality that Europe is catching up with. | ||
| That is why American defense budgets have been so high. | ||
| That is why the American people and the American military was so successful throughout the Cold War, because no one decided to poke at the U.S. to test how real it was. | ||
| That is what Europe is understanding that it has to do. | ||
| And even in countries like Germany, which have a very strong anti-nuclear sentiment, there is a big question about, well, maybe nuclear weapons might actually be necessary, because maybe a show of strength is the best way of being safe and never having to use a single bullet. | ||
| What have we heard from German leaders this week? | ||
|
unidentified
|
So German leaders this week are really looking at some of the financial mechanisms for how to improve their defense spending. | |
| When there was the full scale of an invasion of Ukraine in 2022, the Germans said they had an era shift in which they gave a lot of lump sum money to increase their defense spending. | ||
| But they were so far behind that it made them simply less behind. | ||
| What the Germans are doing this week are saying they're going to structurally change their budgetary process in order to be able to invest more long term. | ||
| So not needing their parliament to say, yes, we approve X billions every single time, but to say we can structurally invest a higher percentage of our budget in defense needs. | ||
| There's very strict fiscal control. | ||
| You can't really run big deficits in Europe at all. | ||
| And so this will change that when it comes to defense, so that there is a bigger willingness and ability legally in Germany to invest in defense. | ||
| How big of a shift is that for Germany? | ||
|
unidentified
|
This is massive, right? | |
| So they talked about the big era shift again in 2022, three years ago. | ||
| The financial shift, because you have to understand how incredibly important austerity is in Germany. | ||
| The word for debt is the same word as the word for guilt. | ||
| So psychologically, the idea of opening debt, you know, credit cards, all of this is quite icky, right? | ||
| This is not quite the relationship with these same issues in the United States. | ||
| And so the notion of being able to take on more debt for defense and Germany has simply not seen the military as a primary mode of global operation for a good reason historically, but today is different. | ||
| And so for them to want to change these complicated austerity measures and structurally be willing to take on more debt, I think that is the big era shift in Germany. | ||
| And where is Britain in all of this? | ||
|
unidentified
|
So Britain is a first mover. | |
| It is not in the European Union. | ||
| So we did not see Britain be active yesterday in Brussels. | ||
| They chose to exit the EU. | ||
| But they had a very important leadership role over the weekend, and Britain has a really good line to Washington right now. | ||
| President Trump and the Prime Minister, Kier Starmer, of Britain, seem to have a very productive relationship, and they are checking in as the Europeans come to some forward-leaning suggestions. | ||
| And so last weekend, the Brits brought together not only the European Union Europeans, but they brought together Turkey, a NATO ally, Canada as well, to think through what the non-U.S. allies can do in order to help Ukraine. | ||
| The Brits are very eager to have this leadership role. | ||
| They're also a nuclear power. | ||
| So their strength is well respected in Russia. | ||
| Their finances and their budgets aren't as strong because of domestic budgetary concerns in terms of the growth of their economy. | ||
| But in terms of appetite and leadership, they're doing very well. | ||
| Why will it take Europe so why does it take them longer to respond? | ||
| And is it going to happen fast enough for Ukraine? | ||
|
unidentified
|
I think that Ukraine has some time. | |
| On the one hand, we don't know when this war is going to end. | ||
| It could be relatively soon. | ||
| We have the anticipation that already next week there will be conversations between the U.S. administration and the Ukrainians. | ||
| So we don't know if we're talking about a war that is going to go on for another three weeks or three months. | ||
| And if everything falls apart and if Russia chooses not to stop firing, because frankly, what is making this war go on? | ||
| It is the fact that every single day Russia chooses to fire missiles and shoot at Ukrainians on their territory. | ||
| They did again last night. | ||
|
unidentified
|
They did last night. | |
| So it's not as though the Ukrainians are starting this fight by any means. | ||
| It's the Russians who every day make an active decision to shoot at Ukrainians in their countries, in their cities, in their capital. | ||
| So we don't know how long Russia will choose to keep doing that. | ||
| But Ukraine, even with the pause in American aid, still has resources it needs. | ||
| In terms of the front line, the American aid is not as important. | ||
| What is necessary is a lot of the drone warfare. | ||
| And they have their own domestic manufacturing that is able to provide them with the drones to keep doing that. | ||
| And so, yes, the Ukrainians have European support right now. | ||
| They have arms that are necessary. | ||
| It does get a little bit shakier. | ||
| But for the Europeans, it's incredibly important for Ukraine to be on really strong footing as it goes into the negotiations. | ||
| And it's not that the Europeans want the Ukrainians to keep fighting for fighting's sake. | ||
| And it's a question of how strong Ukraine is when it goes in. | ||
| And in the four-point plan the British put out over the weekend or led the announcement of over the weekend, the point of putting Ukraine in the strongest possible position was there. | ||
| And that's why the European leaders in Brussels yesterday had a strong financial incentive of over 30 billion they would like to give this year to the Ukrainians. | ||
| 30 billion this year is what they are talking about doing. | ||
| With that number in mind, take a look at this New York Times. | ||
| How soon could Ukraine forces start to buckle without U.S. weapons? | ||
| It could be as little as four months, say analysts, as Europe scrambles to plug the hole in support left by President Trump's suspension of military aid. | ||
| Take a look at these numbers. | ||
| The United States has sent $67 billion of military aid to Ukraine. | ||
| Europe has sent $65 billion to Ukraine. | ||
| Those are all the countries, other countries, $4 billion. | ||
| Christine Berzina also mentioned talks between the United States and Ukraine picking back up. | ||
| I want to show our viewers what Steve Witkoff had to say. | ||
| He's the White House Special Envoy. | ||
| He talked with reporters outside of the White House yesterday. | ||
| Well, President Zelensky sent a letter to the president. | ||
| I think the president thought that it was a really good, positive first step. | ||
| And from that, we're now in discussions to coordinate a meeting with the Ukrainians in Riyadh or even potentially Jeddah. | ||
| So the city is moving around a little bit, but it will be Saudi Arabia. | ||
| And I think the idea is to get down a framework for a peace agreement and an initial ceasefire as well. | ||
| That was Steve Witkoff at the White House yesterday. | ||
| Let's go to calls. | ||
| Daryl in Caldwell, Idaho, Independent. | ||
| Hi, Darrell. | ||
|
unidentified
|
Good morning, Greta. | |
| Good morning, Christine. | ||
| My daughter, I spell the same way your name, K-R-I-S-T-I-N. | ||
| But the thing I'm looking at is that here you've got a situation where Russia and Ukraine were at the point of signing an agreement back in 2022. | ||
| But then all of a sudden, here comes Boris Johnson and Joe Biden interfering and putting money in. | ||
| So it's like now you've got a case where I myself being independent, I look at the fact that here's Biden's son Hunter working at Brisma, making $80,000 a month. | ||
| And then Ukraine is famous for being the most corrupt country on the planet Earth. | ||
| So now we start shoveling money in. | ||
| And Donald Trump labeled Lezinski as the world's greatest salesman. | ||
| And now here, because we've stopped getting money, now all the European nations have decided to jump in. | ||
| And it's just impossible for me to understand. | ||
| Russia's got 6,000 nuclear weapons. | ||
| The United States got 6,000. |