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Dec. 10, 2024 - The Charlie Kirk Show
31:43
Stay Far Away From the Syria Quagmire
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Hey everybody, it's on The Charlie Kirk Show.
Syria, why are we getting involved?
Well, we shouldn't.
We explain the Syria conflict from our analysis, then bring in KT McFarland as well.
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Here we go.
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It was a remarkable weekend here in beautiful Palm Beach.
We had over a thousand of our top donors here and great friends.
We raised a record number and very, very thankful for all of you who contributed.
Just blown away, actually.
blown away by the generosity, by the spirit, by the commitment.
You know, some people would say that there would be kind of a retreat, that people would rest on their laurels.
We did not get that sense at all.
Instead, our donors and our top friends and supporters doubled and tripled down on the effort on saving the country.
They are more emboldened than ever before.
So we just want to say for all of us at Turning Point USA, thank you for digging deep and continuing to pour into our efforts on our high school campuses, our college chapters, TPUSA Faith, Blexit, Turning Point Academy, and then of course on the Turning Point Action side, continuing with the Chase the Vote initiative, voter registration.
We went through a whole presentation for our top investors, and they seem to receive it rather favorably.
So thank you so much for all of you listening.
I know many of you guys listen to the podcast.
All the gifts were greatly appreciated.
And now we are thrilled to also report at Turning Point we have over 400,000 donors.
400,000 people that donate.
So very, very big and substantial gifts, but also people giving $5, $10, and $15.
So this weekend was just remarkable and gives us the ability to sprint into 2025 uninterrupted and continue to grow and to scale all of the necessary programming so that we can reclaim our republic.
Some remarkable news happened this weekend.
While we were doing our event at Mar-a-Lago and presenting to donors, I was keeping an eye on this story that I've cared about for the last decade.
Now, I'm by no means an expert, but It doesn't require expertise to necessarily understand this from at least a 30,000-foot view, which is Syria has fallen.
And for those of you that remember, back almost 14 years ago was the beginning of the Syrian Civil War.
That was during the Arab Spring.
And the Syrian Civil War received a lot of attention.
Bashar al-Assad was especially cruel in how he would fight the Syrian Civil War against the rebels.
And this was going on for years and years.
And they said, oh my goodness, is Assad going to fall?
Is the regime going to topple?
And of course, Russia would come in, the very, very close to Syria for pipeline reasons and many others, and would always have Bashar al-Assad's back.
And there were many moments throughout the last 14 years where it looked as if Bashar al-Assad was on shaky ground.
But the last five to six years...
It seemed as if the Syrian civil war has kind of become a cold war.
The rebels were largely in exile, that they didn't have a lot of gusto, they didn't have really what it took to be able to eventually topple the Assad regime.
Now remember, the Assad regime is a family dynasty dating back 50 or 60 years.
It is a total dictatorship.
Now, by no means am I a fan of Bashar al-Assad, nor are you.
You must understand that these rebels are not exactly the most admirable people that you could be supporting.
In fact, you could make a very, very good argument that the rebels are worse than Bashar al-Assad.
And this weekend, the regime of Assad has fallen and the rebels took over.
Now, we have Casey McFarland joining us to kind of go through some of the details associated here.
But the first takeaway is, is there a good guy and a bad guy in this equation?
Like so much of the warmongering in the Middle East, it's actually far murkier than the people in Washington, D.C. would tell you.
The new rulers of Syria are a radical Islamic terror group We're good to go.
Now, these are the new leaders of Syria.
And we've seen a pattern.
We saw this largely in Iraq.
We saw this in Libya.
And we're probably going to see this in Syria, where the equation is something as the following.
You have a strongman, brutal dictator like Saddam Hussein or Muammar Gaddafi, and the West doesn't like that person.
Fair enough.
However, when you replace that person, what do you get from?
Well, with Saddam Hussein, you got the rise of ISIS and, of course, American taxpayers that had to pour hundreds of billions of dollars to rebuild Iraq and didn't even do a good job of that.
In Libya, we got a Libyan civil war.
And now in Syria...
What is going to replace it?
Well, the leader of this new group, this new government, is Abu Muhammad al-Julani.
He was a member of al-Qaeda in Iraq when they were blowing up US troops.
Now, there's several operative questions here.
The most important and most significant is, is this a concern to the United States of America?
Is it really matter who is controlling Syria for our immediate interests, for what we care about?
While our own border is open, our currency is being jeopardized, as American strength is being put in large question.
And why are some people in Washington DC, including the Biden administration, trying to favor the rebels over Bashar al-Assad.
And the reason is they have this romantic idea that anybody but Assad would be better.
And that is not the case.
Instead, you have two ugly forces that are fighting it out in Syria, and Christians are now in a lot of trouble in Syria.
The Christian population is going to be targeted.
They are going to be largely massacred.
Al Juwini has made some maneuvers to represent himself as a moderate.
Now, if that's correct, great.
However, we should be clear.
This man is a lifelong terrorist who has migrated from country to country for the sake of terrorism and Islamic extremism.
And now he finds himself in Syria.
And even some members of the U.S. Congress, including Republicans, are celebrating that this terrorist is now controlling a rather major country.
I mean, Syria is a big, big country.
With a lot of Christian history, with a significant Christian population, yet we were told for years by Lindsey Graham and by John McCain and the warmongers in the Republican Party that the rebels are the best people ever, the Kurds are wonderful, and that we need to give them armaments, and that as long as we fight Assad, things are great.
It's not that simple.
The D.C., Uniparty warmongering machine oversimplifies highly complex tribal histories, cultural battles, to try to make it seem as if it is a black and white, good versus evil circumstance, when in reality, the truth in foreign policy is almost always found in the nuance.
Our support for Syrian rebels caused Christians to fall from about 10% of Syria's population to just about 2% of Syria's population due to the ethnic cleansing and genocide.
Syria is one of the oldest Christian communities on the planet, and now it's on the brink of extinction.
So be very careful which side you are cheering for here.
Again, nobody here is pro-Assad.
He's cruel.
He probably used chemical weapons.
Not a good guy.
However, these situations tend to get us overly involved because of the mythologies that are told by our politicians.
So they put forward a myth on cable news.
Bad guy falls, good guys rise.
We feel as if we need to send armaments, money, support.
What I'm telling you is it's not our problem.
It's not.
It's a tragedy that...
A lot of Christians are going to be hurt and we should try through any way possible of rescue efforts and getting them out.
However, it's not our role to involve ourselves militarily.
Every war in the Middle East is longer, more complex, more expensive, and more morally fraught than the people in DC will tell you.
So we should stay out.
And maybe...
Instead of hubris and pride, the correct and the necessary attitude is a little bit of humility.
We don't know.
We don't know how to fix it.
We don't know who's better.
We don't know who's worse.
And maybe we should put our own citizens first instead of a conflict that we can't even properly articulate.
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So this guy I think I've met before, can we get that picture of Joe Wilson from South Carolina?
I mean, I'm sure he votes in ways that I would like, but you must call out nonsense and quite honestly BS in your own party when you see it.
So Joe Wilson, next to an American flag and a Ukrainian flag, separate issue.
I mean, when Blake sent this to me last night, I was...
Speechless would be one word for it.
So this is Joe Wilson, who puts on social media, not just mentioning it, but he's holding up the rebel flag, saying, celebrating December 8th as the day the brutal Assad regime fell.
Hashtag free Syria.
With a photo of him with the flag.
And you have to just wonder.
Again, I've met Joe Wilson before.
Nice enough guy.
Obviously, much more of a neoconservative than I ever would have thought.
And it's just the arrogance it takes to do something like this.
He also tweeted this over the weekend.
He's getting a lot of attention.
The Assad crime family has terrorized the people of Syria for over 50 years.
Their reign of terror is over.
Okay.
I agree.
They probably are a crime family.
I mean, almost every single...
Dictatorship in the Middle East has some sort of mafioso tendencies.
But no one's debating that.
That's a completely separate issue.
The road ahead will not be easy, but the Syrian people have shown tremendous perseverance and hope from the beginning, even as the world failed them.
Okay, this is...
Again, I didn't go to college, but you just have to pay a little bit of attention to have the fundamental misunderstanding.
The equation in the Middle East, whether it be what we did in Iran to displace the Shah, again, Saddam Hussein in Libya, is typically this.
And there's almost not been an exception.
The strong man falls because we want to spread democracy.
The radical Islamic factions are more willing to use outforce terror, brute force, intimidation, and they tend to be very, very charismatic.
Like, very charismatic.
And so they use Wahhabism or some sort of sister of that, of extremely radical Islamic interpretation of theology to rally the masses, and you get something way worse than what you had before.
And so I'll be honest, Joe Wilson, your tweet here is not going to age well.
And you're a Republican.
Again, I'm sure you vote for stuff I like, but acting as if with 100% guarantee You can know what is coming next is going to be good.
Not only is there no evidence of that, there's evidence to the contrary.
And we go further into more and more of these social media postings of people calling for increasing military action.
Remember, Trump won based on America first, not Syria first.
I'm going to pull up Donald Trump's Truth Social here, which, by the way, he was in Europe when he offered this.
And I bet a lot of people were in his ear trying to say, you know, we got to get more involved in Syria.
We got to get more involved in Syria.
We got to get more involved in Syria.
I'm going to read Donald Trump's Truth Social here.
He was very busy this weekend.
I'm going through this.
A lot of memes.
Here it is.
This is one of a couple.
He says, Where close to 600,000 Russian soldiers lay wounded or dead in a war that should never have started.
Now, let me just say, Donald Trump mentioning how many Russians have died is actually rather morally courageous in D.C. because everyone seems really afraid to say that both sides are losing human beings.
Anyway, I found that to be noteworthy.
Russia and Iran are in a weakened state right now.
One, because of Ukraine and a bad economy, and that is actually true.
One of the reasons why Assad fell is because of how Russia, Iran, and Syria's economy has fallen apart.
Likewise, Zelensky and Ukraine would like to make a deal to stop this madness.
They've ridiculously lost 400,000 soldiers and many civilians.
That's a million people unnecessarily that have died.
There should be an immediate ceasefire and negotiations should begin.
Too many lives are being needlessly wasted.
Too many families destroyed.
The world is waiting.
He also posted previously, even beyond that, more forcefully, I'm trying to find it here, when he said, this is not our fight.
And he's right.
It's not our fight.
And the president understands that That you must prioritize the homeland here.
Actually, here it is.
Thank you.
It's very, very long.
But he said, look, let me kind of capture this.
The United States should have nothing to do with it.
This is not our fight.
This is all caps.
And when Donald Trump goes in all caps, listen carefully.
Let it play out.
Do not get involved.
He says here, opposition fighters in Syria made an unprecedented move.
Outskirts.
Because Russia's tied up in Ukraine, Obama didn't force the red line in the sand, but now, like possibly Assad himself being forced out, do not get involved.
Everybody, that is a phenomenal sign for this incoming administration.
Because you better believe there's clamoring neocons on Capitol Hill that want Donald Trump to say that we're going to have airstrikes and all sorts of military intervention.
President Trump says, no, this is not our fight.
President Trump is showing the promises he made on the campaign trail are things that will be acted into policy.
This is not our fight.
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Okay, everybody.
We have now KT McFarlane with us.
I've known KT for quite a while.
KT, welcome to the program.
It's been too long since we had an opportunity to chat.
So KT, I would love your opinion on what's happening in Syria and whether or not you believe America and our government, our military should get involved.
For that sakes, no.
I mean, President Trump had it just right.
Let this play out.
And, you know, the people whispering, the military-industrial complex neocons whispering in Joe Biden's ear.
I don't know if he's even paying attention.
But they're now bombing.
They're trying to bomb ISIS. Come on.
We don't belong in the middle of anybody's civil war, and we sure don't belong in the middle of a multi-sided civil war.
Let this play out.
See where the opportunities and the dangers are.
Help our friends Israel.
Let Turkey know, which is probably the big outside player in this, that we're ready to talk if that's an opportunity that comes along.
And then when President Trump comes into office, continue to pressure Iran economically.
Iran is now pre-wounded, as President Trump said.
They've lost Hezbollah.
They've lost Hamas.
Their economy is not great.
It wasn't great before.
It's going to be a lot worse now.
Because President Trump's energy policy will push the price of oil down, which is their major revenue source.
And then he's going to reimpose the sanctions on Iran.
So Iran will be really wounded, economically particularly.
And Iran has a great population, well-educated, internet savvy.
And the population of Iran, every 10 years or so, pops up and tries to overthrow the mullahs.
And the Obama administration and then the Biden administration, oddly enough, sided with the mullahs.
I think President Trump will side with the people of Iran.
I do think that Iran's leaders have to look at what's just happened to Haibas al-Assad and his son Bashar al-Assad.
They've been toppled in a matter of minutes because their own people didn't stand up to them, stand up for them.
And you've got to think that the mullahs look at that and think, yikes, could we be next?
So, can you explain for the audience, because I want to make sure we don't pass over this, can you just explain what you mean by a multi-sided civil war, Turkey's involvement, who are the rebels, who are the Kurds, who is Assad?
Take a little bit of time here just to educate our audience.
I mean, most Americans would struggle to probably Find Syria on a map and even, you know, know Damascus versus Aleppo.
I mean, even a presidential candidate, Gary Johnson, didn't know Aleppo.
So just kind of take some time.
What is the significance of Syria?
How did Assad get into power?
What on earth is a NATO country, Turkey, doing involved in this?
What is Russia's involvement?
All of that.
Please, KT, educate our audience.
Okay, this is a really complicated chess game, and it's been going on for 50 years.
Russia, go back to the Soviet Union and the 1973 Arab-Israeli War.
Russia was all over the Middle East.
They were the major dominant player in the Middle East.
With Syria, they had relationships with all the Arab countries.
Russia leaves.
We kick them out.
The countries kick them out during the 1973-4 shuttle diplomacy negotiations of Henry Kissinger.
I was working for Henry at the time.
And at that point, Russia got pushed out of the Middle East.
United States became the major power affecting events.
We had relationships with Egypt, obviously with Israel, with the Saudis, with Jordan.
And so Russia's been out in the cold for 50 years.
When that happened 50 years ago, Bashar al-Assad's dad, Haifas al-Assad, he was head of Syria.
And Kissinger negotiated with him.
He negotiated with the Egyptians and the Jordanians and the Saudis and the Israelis.
Assad in Syria was always the toughest because Syria has not just one ethnic group.
They've got a lot of ethnic groups.
They have Christians.
They have various kinds of Christians.
They have Muslims, various varieties of Muslims.
They have just a lot of people there.
Now, that was 50 years ago.
Fast forward to today, what's in Syria?
Well, Russia's in Syria.
It got back into Syria and an involvement in the region, and Russia cares about it because Russia's been using Syrian ports and airfields To do the Russian operations coming out of Africa.
So Russia has an interest in it.
But at the same time, Russia's had to prop up a corrupt incompetent leader, Assad.
And the Iranians have an interest too, because they've used Syria as their transshipment point to get weapons from Iran into Hezbollah to kill Israelis and try to destroy Israel.
So Russia and Iran Outside powers have an interest in Syria.
They don't care about Syria, but they care about the real estate in Syria.
So they've cropped up this corrupt incompetent leader, Bashar al-Assad, for years.
Now Russia's weakened because Russia's preoccupied.
In Ukraine.
So Russia's pulled out troops.
It's pulled out equipment that's been propering up Assad.
The Iranians, they're really weakened too.
Why?
Because of Israel.
Israel has gone after Hezbollah and Hamas, the Houthis.
And so Iran is weakened in the region, and Iran is economically weakened.
Now, when Trump was in office the first time, he understood the power of economics.
And he understood if you could bankrupt Iran, if you could get them to the point where they have no real money, they won't have any money to pay for wars against Israel.
They won't have money to pay for terrorists, and they'll have a hard enough time staying in power and keeping their own jobs, some of us, because they have to feed their own people.
So if you look now, where is Iran, where is Russia?
Russia's preoccupied with Ukraine.
That's why President Trump over the weekend said, Russia's weakened, we could do a negotiation on Ukraine.
And at the same time, Iran is weakened for the same reasons.
Economically weakened and also thanks to Israel.
So the chess pieces are moving all around the Middle East.
Russia's going to be out of there.
We don't belong in the middle of the Civil War because there's a lot of different sides still fighting each other.
And who knows who comes out on top?
It could be a pro-Turkey group.
It could be an ISIS-Al Qaeda group.
It could be, I don't know, maybe there's Jeffersonian democracy.
I don't think so.
But it could be any one of a number of groups who are going to probably now fight it out.
And who knows who comes out on top?
Wait and see.
So that's a really important point that I want to emphasize here, which is the way the media is framing it is, okay, the government fell and now this new group controls all of Syria.
But that's not correct.
I mean, there's different pockets, right?
Different cities, different regions.
I mean, if you look at it, it's incredibly sporadic, right?
One group controls like 10% of the territory here and 5% here.
It's not as if just like one regime goes here.
It's very fluid and Can you help explain that?
How many groups are there?
Three, four?
And then there'll probably be subgroups and subterritories.
I mean, a very messy and fluid situation.
Yeah, I mean, probably one of the major groups is the one supported by Turkey, who says, well, we used to be al-Qaeda, but we're not really al-Qaeda anymore.
And then there's some...
Look, it's tribes.
They've been...
These tribes have been fighting each other since...
You know, before Islam.
I mean, there are tribal wars in the Middle East.
There always have been tribal wars in the Middle East.
We should not be in a position of trying to say, well, we like this one, we don't like that one.
We don't belong there.
Let them work it out.
You know, one of the reasons, if you go back again 50 years, why did we care about the Middle East in the first place?
Well, we cared about the oil.
We needed access to their oil.
And so for access to their oil, we had to pick and choose countries that we liked and didn't like in the Middle East.
If you fast forward today, we don't need their oil.
America, because of American resources and really technological entrepreneurial capabilities, we've realized that we have oil and natural gas in the rocks right under our feet.
And we have more oil and natural gas than any other country in the world.
We can power the world for hundreds of years just using our oil and natural gas.
And we can produce it cheaper, simpler, easier, safer, cleaner, better than any other country.
So our interest in the Middle East is no longer we need their oil for our economy.
Well, in fact, our interest should be we'll replace the Middle East as the world's hub of energy.
We'll not only have our own and be energy independent, but if you listen to President Trump, he keeps saying this word energy dominant.
Nobody's really picked it apart.
What he means by that is that we will be the world's major supplier of energy, not only for ourselves, but export it to all the world.
So our interests in the Middle East have now changed.
We care about Israel.
We sure want peace.
The Abrahamic courts are the way to go, which is peace between Israel and the Sunni Gulf Arabs.
Maybe that peace gets bigger under President Trump.
I do think so it will.
The thing about the Middle East, you think you know it, you don't know it because there's so many different tribes.
Well, no, that's exactly right.
And it's the more you know, the more you realize how little you know when you thought you knew it all.
So that could best summarize Middle Eastern tribal politics.
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KT, you've been wonderful.
Thank you.
I do want to ask you, though, about Iran and something that you said.
I'd love to just address some concerns that I would potentially have and work through it, which is, if the current Iranian regime falls, do we have guarantees that what will come after would necessarily be better?
I only say that because it seems in the Middle East, whatever is replaced is not always better.
It seems to get more radical, not more Western.
Please, your thoughts, KT McFarlane.
Yeah, I mean, the one thing we've learned from the Middle East is dictators get replaced, and it doesn't necessarily get better.
It usually gets worse, and various radical groups.
What happens in Iran?
Who knows what happens in Iran?
I've got to assume that if Israel was clever enough to do the attacks on Hezbollah and Hamas leadership, but particularly Hezbollah leadership in downtown Tehran, that they have sufficient connections with the underground in Iran of the people who want the pro-democracy movement, the that they have sufficient connections with the underground in Iran of the people who want the pro-democracy movement, the And so maybe that helps.
We do not belong with troops on the ground anywhere near this stuff.
And we should not be picking winners and losers.
So what happened, whether it was in Iraq or Afghanistan, go back to Vietnam.
Every time we get in the middle of somebody else's civil war and start picking winners and losers, we're always the losers.
We're not good at this.
And so if the Biden administration thinks they want to get in the middle of Syria now and somehow affect that outcome, don't do it.
And if anybody is saying, well, maybe we should go bomb Iran while they're weak, don't do that either.
Let regime change happen because the people of those countries want the regimes to change.
And that's what the argument should be with Iran.
You know, President Trump understood why Iran was powerful and how you diminish Iran in the first term.
He understood, again, it's all about oil, natural gas, revenues.
Once Iran, at the end of Trump's first term, Iran was broke.
They weren't giving money to Hezbollah and Hamas.
They were having enough trouble feeding Iran people.
When Trump took office on January 20th of 2017, the price of oil It was about $140 a barrel, $120 a barrel.
When Trump left office four years later, the price of oil was $40 a barrel.
So if you're Iran, you're Russia, your money comes from selling oil at those high prices.
All of a sudden, your revenue stream has been cut in half, cut by two thirds.
They didn't have the money to go to war in Ukraine.
Or they didn't have the money to go to war against Israel in the Middle East.
It's the same problem, whether it's Russia, Iran, Ukraine, Middle East.
It's all about the oil money.
And President Trump, one of the reasons he keeps saying drill, baby, drill, is he's going to take the price of oil, which is now, what, about $80 a barrel, thanks to Biden?
Donald Trump is going to unleash the American energy industry.
Oil and natural gas prices will go way down.
Iran is going to be broke.
At which point, let the Iranian people decide for themselves what kind of a government they want.
Chances are there's not much, I guess, worse than what they have now.
But maybe.
But let them decide.
It's their decision.
It's not our business.
I think that's prudent.
And we must remember that the Iranian mess that we have right now was brought to you by British and American intelligence.
We displaced a democratically elected Yes.
Masagde and put the Shah in, which then, of course, he was sick and unpopular.
And then we get the Ayatollah regime that we have right now.
KT, thank you so much.
Excellent.
And I hope to see you again soon.
Thank you.
Thank you, Charlie.
Thanks so much for listening, everybody.
Email us, as always, freedom at charliekirk.com.
Thanks so much for listening and God bless.
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