All Episodes
Previous Next
Aug. 2, 2017 - Clif High
30:42
clif interviews Reggie Middleton -part 2....
| Copy link to current segment

Time Text
Let's see, are we recording?
Yeah, okay.
So it says we have restarted.
Hopefully, I won't have to do much in the way of editing, but I'll smoosh these together.
So we were on to the idea of renting coins, and my idea was a couple of guys sitting around in a pub, one of whom happens to have a very token and comes up with an idea for a contract to go on out and purchase other assets using the smart contract.
And so he and a bunch of friends want to go together.
They provide the background liquidity pool there at the pub.
He walks off with their cash.
He goes and buys the coins or whatever, and comes back and makes the distribution later on.
And in that sense, they've rented his very token because they were using his access to the smart contract that way.
But there are other ways to rent them, I'm sure.
Yeah.
Yeah, the way we do it is we go the pure economic model, which is economic rent, which is basically it works on not necessarily scarcity, but I guess scarcity along certain lines.
Economic rent basically means to receive more value than is the fundamental value of the object that you're receiving, okay, that you're selling.
So the example I give is an accountant, an accountant that makes $100,000 a year, which is a decent salary in most parts of the country.
That's what it takes for him to get his butt out of bed and go to work.
That is par labor cost for him.
Now, another company comes along and wants to take over business from the company he works with.
So company AB comes and tries to take business for company A, and they know that this accountant has specific information that would benefit them in this market acquisition.
So they offer him $150,000 per year.
He jumps on board.
The $50,000 difference between $150,000 and $100,000 is an economic rent, okay, that that company paid.
With Veritasium, you have a company that comes in, let's say a big company, BlackRock, comes in, and they say there's this office park available in the Bahamas.
Probably not too many office parks in the Bahamas.
Let's do it somewhere else.
Let's say Toronto, Canada.
Okay.
And it's available through a Veritasium platform.
And the guy says, I'm looking to do business.
They want to buy these specialized Veritas tokens for this office park, but they don't have enough Veritas to access the contract.
So they have to go and rent a Veritas from somebody else because, say, it's not available anywhere else.
They can't purchase it directly from us for whatever reason.
So enterprising Veritas holders can now enter a contract where they pledge their Veritas, okay, or economically rent their Veritas to the contract, which means that they don't get it back, but they're open to create whatever terms with the deal, whatever terms you want for the deal.
So they say if it takes one to 100 Veritas to enter this deal and it deals for $100 million, that means there's 100 million tokens.
That means you need 1 million tokens to enter in the contract.
These guys say, I will give you the 1 million tokens, which is 1% of the deal, but we want 3.5% of the payout of the PL.
Okay.
Now, if the deal fails, you get nothing.
If the deal goes as anticipated, these guys now made a 350% gain on the monies that they put out.
What was that?
450%.
They get 3.5 times what they put in.
This is a capital gain style transaction.
Economic rent.
Now, on the other side, we're also offering contract rent.
From a programmer, programmer, programmatic.
Programmatic perspective.
That is going to come out maybe a few weeks later.
Hopefully not a month, but a few weeks later than economic rent because there are a couple of things we need to deal with.
But with the contract rent, this is much more of the accounting layman's perspective of rent where you lease a property out and you get paid either periodic income back or an amount minimum sum that is larger than what you leased it out for, which is basically implied interest.
Now, I don't want to stop.
I'm going to stop with the jargon because sometimes I get lost in the weeds.
Sure, sure.
But basically, you're talking about being able to use Veritasium at the end user's creativity constraint to craft passive income contracts.
Right.
And here, collateral comes into play because you need to have an financial incentive for the rentor to return the tokens.
If for whatever reason they choose not to return the tokens, they lose their collateral.
Now, the rentee can craft the contract any way they want in terms of filling out parameters.
You could request the cost of the rent.
You could demand a cost of the rent and change the debt.
You could demand a change in the amount of collateral.
So it's up to you in terms of your risk and reward perspective requirements to create the contract anyway you want.
So you have a large amount of collateral needed or charge a high price, etc.
That is much more of an income-style transaction.
So depending on how you want to go into the deal as a rentee, you could go for a capital gain style or you could go for an income yield style.
This allows you to have a productive use of Veritas, or you could just hold on to it.
Or you can use it for its primary purpose, which is a utility, and you can use it to build things of value.
The rental contracts are the segue into our financial machines.
We call them Vedris, V-E-A-D-I-R, basically Veritas, Autonomous, Direct.
I forgot all the gotcha.
They sound scary, though.
But basically, these financial machines are autonomous smart contracts that go and purchase other digital assets.
Okay, any purchase of the digital assets in an attempt to create as much value as possible.
These financial machines, they consume our proprietary research and potentially research of others.
If we feel it passes muster, it does this autonomously and it then either pulls the trigger on an asset purchase or does not.
Now, that's the output of the financial machine.
On the input side, are those who want to partake in sharing in the purchase of these digital assets?
Okay, so you will put your financial capital in, but in order to gain entrance, you need, of course, Veritas tokens.
So with these financial machines, smaller players can get in, but the bigger players also want to get in as well because they want to do things like buy and sell distressed credits in Greece or Portugal or office parks in Chicago or mortgage-backed securities or you name the pure digital assets, physical assets, etc.
You know, the sky's the limit.
These are self-contained value transaction vehicles.
These vehicles will actually trade because now, part of in part because we can't get conventional exchanges to accept our token for whatever reason, despite the fact we're number one for a while, fastest growth, et cetera.
We are building our own digital exchanges in partnership with larger partners.
On these digital asset exchanges, you have these vehicles, financial machines, and various tokens and sub-tokens trading freely.
So you'd be able to buy and sell venture capital startup tokens.
You'd be able to buy and sell distressed asset tokens.
You'd be able to buy and sell digital asset tokens.
Okay, let me intrude there and sketch it out so people get an idea.
Here's a really goofy idea.
So I've got my friend Jacques in Spain.
He finds an ancient boat that's got a sunken galleon kind of thing that's got all kinds of stuff in it, wine and old Roman coins and this sort of thing.
But he needs the capital to do this treasure hunt.
So he could set up a contract itself and give limited shares based on what he thought would get in there, minus the government and all of this, work out all the math.
And then so Jacques' treasure hunt contract basically would be tokenized and could therefore be traded.
And the value of people, people could speculate, well, he'll get it all and he'll make this amount and I'll get this share or maybe he won't.
So I'll sell mine now and get what I can out of it.
And it'll be based entirely on their emotional perception of how Jacques is doing.
So basically what you're talking about is being able to tokenize performance to the point where the tokens themselves can be sold thereafter.
Right.
And the partners that I'm discussing, one is the Jamaica Stock Exchange.
This is one side of the spectrum.
Very small exchange, but very entrepreneurial.
Actually, they did a deal with us that shows they are willing to actually go a step above and beyond.
And they were the best performing exchange worldwide in 2015 on top of it.
They are a Caribbean state or they are domestic in the Caribbean country.
Think about the potential of a digital asset exchange such as this going through Jamaica.
Let's just assume, hypothetically, Reggie and Al convinces them to eliminate taxation, all taxation of foreign capital going into the country of Jamaica for the purposes of trading on this exchange.
Now you have an offshore captive style like Grand Cayman or Bermuda, but for digital assets and digital assets available worldwide.
Think about the amount of capital that will flood into Jamaica.
Think about the amount of assets that will be available.
A phenomenal change in the way things are done.
Another partner that we haven't signed the, you know, we haven't signed the actual contract yet, but they're very excited.
We're very excited.
We're well on to multiple meetings with the very, very top.
This is one of the top 10 exchanges in the world.
Several trillion dollars.
Okay.
Over $1 trillion.
So you know it's not one of them.
Several trillion dollars.
They have, you know, basically an implicit okay from the regulatory authorities to sandbox the activity and we can get going almost immediately once we come to terms.
Now you can trade this Jots, assuming that it passes most of the analysts.
We create a token, we decide we will actually tokenize it and list it.
Now you could trade Jot's treasure discovery hunt via ticker right next to Facebook and Google on screen.
It is basically worldwide and backed by, actually not even backed by, but owned in part and controlled by one of the largest exchanges in the world, several trillion dollars worth of activity.
Now, when I explain what we were doing, and I'm not going to give names yet because I'm not disrespecting my partners, they'll never do business with me again, of course.
But now you see at what level that we're working on, and now you see why I think it's trivial when even having a discussion about something like a white paper.
I know it annoys the crap out of me.
It does me too.
I asked the same question over and over.
And things like access to, you know, source code.
You know, after a while, you know, it does irk me as well.
So maybe I need to just, you know, desensitize myself.
But you understand what level of Veritasium we're looking at work on.
And we're working to partner with many exchanges.
We don't compete with exchanges.
We actually accent the ability of exchanges.
But from the cryptocurrency land, we're forced to compete with you if you don't do business with us because we will want liquidity just like everybody else.
And so now we are forced into the exchange business, unfortunately.
But since we're doing this and we have these powerful partners, we will list all digital assets and we will expand the universe of digital assets past simple platform tokens, past simple cryptographic style entity tokens into the entire world.
So the entire world, if we have our way, will trade through Veritasium tokens.
Extremely efficiency with extremely low cost, low friction, maximum transparency, zero counterparty risk, zero credit risk.
You're looking to go.
Well, just coincidentally with that, I mean, way back when, when I was doing these crypto reports off of my data sets, Veritasium pops up because, of course, the Latin, right?
You can't weyatasium.
You can't really get away from it.
And so the ability to highlight it and track it through my data sets was pretty good.
And we've crossed a couple of temporal markers that I don't really mind at all telling people are out there.
There was one in which I had, I don't know if I spoke about it in that first report where I mentioned Veritasium or not, where you guys would have a bit of a hiccup in the get-along and that has passed us with the recent fiddle-farting around from whoever and the tokens and it met all the linguistics.
And so now we're on to this big push that in our data sets is a pretty good arc in terms of performance and in the price of the U.S. dollar terms of the tokens through to the extent of the short-term data, which is about mid-next year.
So it's kind of like, well, you've got this hurdle behind you, and now it's a little bit more smooth sailing for you in the future.
There's one other thing I needed to go back to just to be absolutely certain we've killed this bugger, and that is all of the issue with the shares.
Now, I understand we're not talking, or not shares, excuse me, the coins that are the non-securities that remained unsold.
I understand we're not talking a business model like the network providers, so to speak, and their business model of growing.
But a lot of the small purchasers of Veritasium are concerned because they think it, oh, well, it's a pump and dump or all these could be dumped in and flood the market because they're thinking about it inappropriately.
They think that such a thing would be used to manipulate a captive market.
But your purpose, well, A, as I understand it, you didn't have the market take-up that you expected.
So you've isolated the others that weren't sold, the other tokens that weren't sold, and you intend to feed them out as business builds.
And, you know, by the time you're doing stuff on the Mars commodity exchange, maybe you will have burned up those that you've got now.
But basically, it's not any form of a, oh, I'm going to wait until it gets to this price and then dump them on the market sort of a thing.
Not in your interest at all, correct?
Well, let me address, I'll try and put this to bed.
I'm going to start at a very basic level, and I'm going to offend a lot of people.
And this might not be the best thing to say from a populations perspective, but everybody knows that I'm honest.
Okay, I'm a capitalist.
I'm in here to create value.
So if that's a problem for anybody, this is not the venture for you.
It's simple as that.
Okay.
I put 51% of tokens up for sale initially.
Just under 2 million were taken.
We don't believe in burning tokens.
It's like burning money or burning inventory.
No company in the right mind would burn inventory unless inventory is no longer valuable.
We took the tokens back in inventory.
And we're going to do the same thing we would have done in ICO, which is why we limited to 51% sale.
We're going to sell the tokens.
The tokens are a product.
Don't confuse the tokens with stocks or securities.
That's not what they are.
Now, you take a pool of stocks.
They have to share.
You take a collection of stocks.
These stocks share a common pool of earnings.
Hence, the more stocks that you have, the less earnings each stock gets.
And that's called dilution.
Their earnings share is diluted.
The less stocks that you have, the greater the share your stock gets.
That's called increasion.
Now, a lot of, and a lot, I'm not saying a few, a lot of ICOs are playing a creed of dilutive game by purposely looking to limit the availability of the tokens, hence increasing the perceived value, but actually just increasing the price temporarily of the tokens.
We don't play that game.
We're purely value-driven.
Okay.
But with that being said, you know, we're out to sell.
The more tokens we sell to the right customers, the more valuable each and every token holder becomes from their Veritas token and the utility value in it.
Think of the network effect.
Okay.
Number one.
Number two, if we don't sell all of them and re-execute and building value into the tokens, then still the more valuable each token holder becomes because of the increase in utility value because you can do more things with it.
But looking at this from a stock perspective or some type of security perspective, you know, you miss the entire boat.
Outside of being wrong, right, you don't understand the value proposition of Veritas, so you never be able to make best use of it.
It's my assertion, right, that the utility value of Veritas is more valuable.
It will be greater than the capital appreciation value of Veritas.
That's saying a lot because we launched Veritas priced at $1 on April 25th, which is my father's birthday, due to the Ether peg.
We priced it in Ether officially instead of US dollars.
But I priced it at USD.
I chose the Ether price to make it one U.S. dollar.
As it creeped up, the initial sales came out at $1.33.
I think it's trading at just under $200 now, maybe like $190, something $180.
From $1.33 to $180 is well over 100 times in just two months.
So you would think that that is a very strong return.
That is nothing compared to utility value of Veritasium, where you get to literally change capital markets in itself to make to go from a hub and spoke model, central bank, money center banks, national banks, regional banks, and then mom and pop stores.
Okay, you change that model, rip it up, and go to pure peer-to-peer capital markets where you have untold amounts of value unleashed.
Now, that might seem pie in the sky to many, and that 100, 130 times return in a couple of months may seem more tangible, but take it from the guy that engineered this token and engineered it from a financial engineer's perspective and not from a computer engineer's perspective.
You're just scraping the surface, simply scraping the surface.
It's the utility value that you go for 100%.
If you don't understand utility value, dig in more, ask a lot of questions.
I love to talk.
So I'll, you know, as much as possible.
I just don't respond well to someone trying to cast his versions from a position of A payments versus simply asking, I don't get it, how does this work?
Right.
I understand.
And unfortunately, we're right at that point in our shift into the new sci-fi world where the language is also intruding because people naturally have been trained to think in terms of share markets, IPOs, et cetera.
ICOs are an entirely different critter entirely.
And we're into a situation where, well, even the idea of smart contracts.
I'm reviewing all of these ICOs that are coming on out, and I keep running into this continual thing repeatedly.
It doesn't matter what language, what country.
Oh, hey, we're going to have an ICO.
We're going to have legally enforceable smart contracts.
And as soon as I read that in the first part of their abstract, I throw it away and go on to the next one.
There's absolutely no point in the software world where the contract is executed by the software to involve lawyers, and smart contracts, by their nature, disintermediate lawyers instantly, which is probably why Veritasium is so valuable.
It got rid of that entire layer.
And so Universe said, well, you've got to be worth at least this much simply because there's no lawyers involved in the damn contracts.
But we also have to acknowledge that, you know, there are people that see these things as the capital appreciation.
So for instance, kudos to Veritasium because my buddy Joe, JSNPF, was able to buy a house on the capital appreciation from Veritasium within a month.
And he's rather staggered by this, as are a lot of people that had that capital appreciation.
Now, I'm really thrilled about the idea of the using of the very tokens.
And I can see where their price in US dollars or Ethereum might be absolutely immaterial to those people that are going to need them for specific market actions later on.
They won't care what it costs because not having them will cost them a whole future of business as opposed to a little tiny bit of money.
And, you know, that's really its utility.
Right.
And I'd like to say once again, I've been preaching and espousing from the very beginning.
You know, we're not selling securities.
You see what SEC is now coming to the forefront.
I don't know what they're going to do, but I try to make it very clear.
We're selling utility software with advisory and consulting on top of it.
Believe it or not, now, which is, you'd think it'd be easier to convince a retail user versus a corporate user, but the institutional user gets it.
They really, really get it.
You know, the last few meetings I had, you know, I sat down and the discussion started with, I have no idea why we would discuss Bitcoin when I'm the senior partner of distressed credits of XYZ fund, you know, with $24 billion in assets, et cetera.
That's how the conversation began.
You know, an hour later and having an hour conversation or two and a half hour conversation with these guys is a feat in of itself because usually after 10, 15 minutes, they say you have to go.
An hour later, they're in total fascination because now they understand what the true power and utility of this technology is.
Throughout the vast majority of most of these meetings, we don't even discuss the actual tech from a technical perspective.
The big meeting with the big exchange, we glanced over it once.
He said, notice I didn't even ask you about the tech.
As I was getting up out of my seat and walking out, we had a technical discussion on the nitty-gritty.
Okay.
It is very, very important for anybody who wants to really benefit from Veritasium to understand utility value.
Capital appreciation is a byproduct of the utility value.
And like I said, I'm not going to lie, you know, if I got 100, I can't do the math, but let's say that 180, if I had 150 times return in two months, I may be focusing more on the optics versus the actual mechanics.
But that's not the way to do it.
And when you do it, it also tends to cause you to think of this as something that is not, IE, an investment.
You know, it's an investment in utilitarian future and capability, not a financial investment.
Sure.
In a sense, it's like being able to buy a portable generator for $5 now, six months ahead of the winter, when you wouldn't be able to get it off the shelf after the power is gone no matter what, because their cash registers wouldn't even work.
Right.
And someone who knew that this winter was coming, you know, think of winter is coming.
We'll see him in the show again, Game of Thrones, right?
Someone who knows winter is coming can go and they can buy that generator from you for $500.
And you say, wow, this guy's a sucker.
He's going to give me $500 for a $5 generator.
You made a 100 times return, right?
You're very happy because you're thinking of it in terms of, you know, financial speculation.
When winter gets here, okay, your family starts to go wayside.
Your health fails, you fear death.
Now you realize the utility value of that generator, and it was worth more than five, considerably worth more than 500, consuming more worth than 5,000.
So 1,000 times return still pales to the utility value of the generator.
I'm asking everybody, look at the utility value.
Exactly.
And just one more quick thing on that.
My grandfather, prior to World War II, started hoarding tires in his garage.
He saw it coming, and he knew rubber would be affected.
He's out here on the Pacific coast.
And so by the time the rubber prohibitions and everything and the restrictions came into place, he had a whole garage filled with tires of all kinds, which he sold out over time and made a lot of money and was not particularly a gouger about it or anything.
But he profited on his foresight.
But then he was, I remember him telling me, you know, he said that when he had about a third of those tires left, he stopped selling those things because they started to be real useful as his own tires ran out.
And I see that coming, and that's when the hoarding effect comes into play.
That's why Veritasium would never really be a currency, even though it was never a spouses of currency in the first place.
And there was no correlation.
But for those who like that term digital currency, which I don't like, I think in terms more of a digital commodity, that's more of a feeling of Bitcoin, Ethereum, et cetera.
But, you know, when you have the anticipation of true utility use, utilitarian value, and the potential for deflationary high gains, you know, the term itself is nonsensical.
So I would like for everybody, unless you're using an actual currency app, and there are those that can serve as a currency.
Dash is a perfect example.
You know, very, very well done.
But unless it's a natural currency app, you know, let's call it for what it is.
Let's change the nomenclature.
You know, it helps the beginners and newbies coming in.
And it also helps deal with regulators as well.
It's a very good thing to take control of the language.
I certainly agree with you.
And, you know, it's kind of a pain in the butt to stop and censor yourself all the time.
But it's worth it in the end.
Certainly is.
I'll sort of wind down now unless there's something.
We've covered all the major questions that I had.
Unless there's something else you really want to bring up and go into.
I don't want to keep you tied up here for days because we could go on and BS about all kinds of cool stuff about Veritasium because I've thought about it a great deal.
And it has been in my data for a number of months ahead of your guys' launch.
I didn't know what I was looking at, though.
My data comes to me in a form that's a fuzzy set theory and it goes to this emotional reduction engine thing I wrote.
And so I'm seeing it all as emotive values.
And so I was seeing all these hot emotive values around Latin language.
And, you know, it could have been, I don't know, some super duper movie or something that everybody was going to get whipped up about, something like that.
But it ended up turning out to be in the crypto space and was Veritasium, which was really cool.
I kind of thought that was just really neat.
But at this, just for Bix, you guys are, no, I can't ask that.
Sorry, that'd be unfair.
I guess that's it for me.
In terms of my questions.
Yeah, I'd like to just say, well, thank you for having me on.
I think you're a very intelligent guy.
Fifth is smart, in case anybody who's watching this video has a doubt.
He's a bright guy.
And I also like to say thank you to the Veritasium community.
They've been very supportive.
They've helped me with a lot of things.
The hacking incident that we had, they've been very supportive.
That's actually very irritating or past irritating for us.
But if you look at it from a macro perspective, it's a small blip in the world, in a row, because you see what we're dealing with.
But I want to say just thank you for the support of the community.
I want to say thank you for our prospective clients.
That blip is not going to be the last, you know, but in any case, it's going to guarantee to be many more blips in the world in the road because with successes come trip-ups.
And there's a large prominent magazine preparing to do a hit piece on us, basically.
And, you know, I don't want to go into details, but I don't believe they're being accurate or ethical at all.
We'll deal with that coming in.
But they called a lot of our clients and partners.
And I was concerned, especially with the language that was used.
And our clients have been very, very supportive.
Basically, they said, forget them, Reg.
You know, put your middle finger up to everybody and let's keep on have your back.
You know, a community like this, like that, potential and actual clients like that is what makes something like Veritasium possible.
So thank you to all prospective natural clients.
And thank you very much to the Veritasium community.
I love you all.
And, you know, you keep us going.
Okay?
Very cool.
Yeah.
And, you know, like I say, let's everybody take control of the language.
When the crap comes out, fling it back at them.
This truth is all this stuff.
It's purposeful obscuring of the truth to try and give a loud voice to a very small and inaccurate minority is how all this nonsense gets started.
So, you know, just okay, well, it's also, let me just come from my conspiracy perspective because, as the CIA says, paranoia works.
And it is true that when you disintermediate very large industries, there will be those people that decide they wish to play unfair in order to protect their turf.
And we can't say that you're running up against it now, but we can certainly say that it is within the realm of probability.
And I could even put potential in there.
So we know it's happening in the other ICO world.
And I suspect that a lot of that mainstream language memory is deliberate and on someone else's agenda because those people are too stupid to do anything on their own.
Well, if that's the case, then expect a lot of dirt to be flung because we're disintermediating and we're going full forward.
So, you know, if that's the cause of it, get used to it because there's a lot more time.
▲
Export Selection