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Dec. 4, 2014 - Sargon of Akkad - Carl Benjamin
06:26:02
A Conversation with #GamerGate (04⧸12⧸2014)
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Hello everyone, as usual I have my beautiful assistant Cerberus here to help me organize well to do the person who does all the organizing in fact.
So thanks a lot for joining me man, really appreciate it.
You're right, no problems at all.
I take it you're currently sending the link to people.
Yep, I'm currently just going through those that have done the right procedure.
There are still those that still don't understand how it works still after this is the fourth time now that we've done this, isn't it?
Yeah, I think so, man.
Okay, yeah, so for anyone who doesn't know, do you want to tell people what you'd like them to do?
Yeah, if you want to get on, I've only had about nine people add me today with messages.
What you need to do is add me on Twitter.
My handle is at curves101.
Just shoot me a DM and I'll send you a message basically.
If there is somebody already in the Hangout chatting, just please mute your mic.
It's not an open sort of forum discussion.
It's everybody gets an allotted sort of time.
We're open to run for about four hours at maximum, depending on the number of people basically that we get in.
So everybody should have around sort of 10 to 15 minutes just to have a chat.
If you can as well, just be ready, have your microphone ready, have Google Hangouts installed, just to make everything easy, basically.
Yeah, and if there's just a thing you'd like to say, then that would be great.
Just come on, say your piece, and then if you don't mind, you'll have to leave just to make space for other people.
I always feel really rude saying it, but it's the only way to properly manage it so everyone gets a good amount of time to talk.
So until we get the first person in, what I'm going to do is tell everyone about ScrumpMonkey's Boycott's Goal of the Day, which I am going to tweet now.
So if you listen to this in future, don't worry about it.
When I figure out how Twitter works, there we go.
And then I actually look at what it is.
Apparently it's Daddy Warpig, which is YouTube user DaddyUnderscore Warpig.
I don't know what he's promoting him for particularly, but go check him out.
I'm sure he's a worthwhile dude.
Otherwise, I'm sure ScrumpMonkey wouldn't have recommended him.
Okay.
This is exactly how YouTube works out.
There's three invites out there at the moment.
I've posted a bloody pic that I keep on getting those retweets from the new Star Wars trailer.
There was a pic that I saw yesterday online of the new lightsaber, but somebody had basically done it as a Christmas tree.
And that seems to people are more interested in that at the moment than they are anything related to Gamergate, which I found was quite amusing.
I hate that lightsaber.
I hate that crossbar.
It's fucking stupid.
Just know.
Just know.
It kind of just looks like a longsword and a broad sword.
I kind of like that.
I'd have to see more of it basically before I pass judgment.
But I could imagine you singeing your hands on it.
It looks like the sort of thing I'd cut your wrist off.
You know, think about how they spin it around.
Think about Hanakin Skywalker and fucking Open One spin their fucking lightsabers around.
Too fucking dangerous.
No, no, not having any of it.
It's bollocks.
I hate it.
And Macintosh is like, oh, look, this Star Wars trailer doesn't have any white people in it.
Isn't that wonderful?
I'm like, fuck the white people.
Jesus Christ, man, look at that stupid fucking light.
There is no way Anakin Skywalker is going to be dual-wielding these, you know, spinning them around like they're fucking...
No, just... no.
I do like the photoshop with Jesus Christ in the background as well with his Christ-powered lightsaber.
That one did look quite rude.
Yeah, I saw the video.
Good God.
Just back to normal lightsabers.
I was actually kind of hoping that they wouldn't have any lightsabers in the intro, just because then, you know, it could have been like, hey, we've actually got an exciting and interesting story with compelling characters that aren't Liam Neeson.
Yeah.
But no, apparently it's just flashy lightsabers.
Although there wasn't that much lens flare, so that was a good thing.
Oh, that's coming.
You know that's coming.
I can't know Star Wars for Ursula.
Pissed me off more than anything.
Where the fuck is everyone?
Well, we've got the first person here, Artic.
I'm sorry, I remember I was going off on there.
And so, yeah, let's get it going then.
Hello.
How's it going?
Can you hear me all right?
Very well.
How are you?
Cold as hell right now, but I'm doing good.
Whereabouts are you?
I am from Wisconsin in the States, so it is freezing out here.
Yeah, okay.
Is there anything you particularly you wanted to talk about?
I guess I wanted to talk about some of the stuff you've been doing with gaming and academia.
Because, well, I went to school about six years ago, college here.
And I do have to say that there is a huge push to push this type of cultural thinking.
But I think the big difference for me was the people who were pushing it were a lot more subtle about it.
Yeah?
How so?
Well, they actually didn't, you know, just go, oh, if you don't think this way, you're a misogynist.
No, they actually, you know, try to challenge you in what you were thinking.
Right, so it's all sort of the hugbox mentality.
No one should be challenged on their beliefs.
Everyone should be given a nice big hug and a participation ribbon.
Pretty much.
I hate that.
What?
Was that me?
Sorry, I live in the ghetto.
Say that again.
I was just wondering if that was me making that noise.
No, no, some dickhead on a really loud motorbike.
What were you going to say?
Ah, I wasn't going to say it.
But yeah, well, once I got to college, I was pretty impressionable and I'm going to sound like a hipster, but I think I pretty much was a social justice warrior before that even became a thing.
Really?
So you're sort of out of the cult?
Yeah, I was definitely really into it, mainly because of just social pressure just from the professors and the students who ate that up like nothing.
That's exactly what I'd expect the culture to be like in there.
It really was, and I fell for it hook line and sinker.
And it wasn't until about probably seven years ago that I started questioning everything and that whole worldview that they built me up on just came crumbling apart.
Really?
And do you want to tell us a bit more about that?
Because that's actually something really interesting that's like really, really pertinent to the current political situation, isn't it?
So, yeah, do you want to just tell us about the events, just quickly if possible?
The first part of it was can't remember exactly what was going on, but there was a huge push for something.
And one of the people in the group who was just as liberal as everybody else started kind of saying, well, maybe if we changed it a little bit like this, we could do it better.
And they just pounced on him.
He had no chance after that.
What happened?
Did they bully him out of the class or what?
Well, side of the class, but they, yeah, they pretty much bullied him out.
They said they have to do it this specific way and just start going, if you're not going to agree with us, just get the fuck out.
They're such tosses, aren't they?
That's awful, man.
That's fucking awful.
Yeah, that really just kind of sparked in me.
It's like, hey, guys, I think that was right.
But what really blew my mind out of it.
Oh, sorry.
Sorry, I think that was my chair squeaking.
Really sorry about that.
But what really blew me out for that was, well, I was trying to get a place to see if I wanted to work at it for part-time and pay for school.
And getting a little bit personal and heavy here, but a woman that worked there did sexually harass me.
And everything that was being told, it's like, oh, women have it rougher than men.
It's like, this ain't right.
So were you kind of like ostracized because of that or something, or what?
What happened was I was cornered and hand down the pants.
It's like, do not want, get away from me.
Christ.
But I mean, like, how did other people react to it?
I went to HR and they said, oh, don't worry about it.
It's fine.
It's like, no, it's not.
Yeah, how could that be fine?
What?
I went to a lawyer and he said he would do it.
So I went back and they said, okay, we'll make this right.
But pretty much after that, it's like, yeah, I'm not working here.
After that, I don't want to.
Yeah.
And then after that, I swirled down into a depression as the entire world that I had built up from this mindset just crashed.
And I don't know how personal I can ask you into this.
I don't want to go for it.
Well, just how long did that last for?
And what did you do?
How did you feel?
Oh, well, when it first came down, let's see.
I think it lasted about two years.
First thing that happened was I just started drinking.
I had to drink, otherwise, I couldn't fall asleep.
Or I would just cry myself to sleep because of it.
And really what happened then was if I wasn't drinking, I was just hiding from my friends.
The only reason that I actually came out was because they wanted to play some video games or have me run an RPG.
I'm sorry to hear that, man.
Yeah, it took a long time for me to recover from that.
And how did you recover?
What did you do exactly?
Well, first I had to admit myself that there was a problem.
And then I just went and got help from psychologists, found up, I have to get depression pills, basically.
Yeah.
Is there anything they sort of specifically said about what you've been through?
I mean, if you want to answer any of these questions, please don't.
I'm trying to figure out how to say it best right now.
That's okay.
They didn't really mention anything like brainwashing, but I think they were kind of hinting at it in just the way that they asked me how much I believed what I was being taught.
Okay.
And right after that, it's like, oh, I don't really believe anything right now, so holy crap.
Man, that must have been fucking difficult to go through.
It was that I was out of it for about three and a half years.
I was a wreck.
Well, how did you find yourself coming to Game Again then?
Well, like I said, the one thing that actually pretty much kept me alive from doing something stupid was my friends like playing Monster Hunter.
They liked playing Dungeons and Dragons.
So did I.
So they would come to me and say, hey, let's play.
And that was the one thing that I found enjoyable.
And so I see these people start shouting out, oh, you're just a hate-filled nerd.
It's like, what the hell are you talking about?
Well, whereabouts do you live?
What area necessarily?
Or city, perhaps?
I live in a very liberal city.
Right.
It's actually kind of 50-50, but the left voices are a lot more vocal around here.
And I did go to a liberal arts college.
So there is a pretty big women's studies program.
I bet that was fun, wasn't it?
Surprisingly enough, I got away without taking one.
Really?
You know, I've heard talk of them making these things mandatory.
In the UK, they want to make mandatory consent classes, which I can't imagine are going to be anything but this sort of, you know, pushing this sort of philosophy on people.
I'm going to be generous in terms of philosophy.
I could probably ask some people, but I don't think the school I went to has that right now.
And the mandatory thing, that's the general education thing where they keep telling you, oh, you have to take so many credits in just random departments, basically, just to kind of give a feel of what you want.
But they probably made gender studies courses mandatory now after I left.
Fingers crossed, they didn't.
But honestly, it seems really weird.
The culture of it seems so like it seems to have sucked enough people into it now that it, I mean, this is just coming from my impression, so I'm probably talking shit.
But, you know, it just seems like it's kind of sucking people in due to peer pressure now.
That's pretty much how I felt when I first got into this.
Yeah.
And, well, I think with what Gamergate's showing us is that thankfully some of the people are getting out just because, like I said, I was gone into it because the people who indoctrinated me were subtle.
They weren't, you know, just overt like these people are, just shouting horrible insults at people.
Yeah, one thing I found from it is from reading the academic side of things, it does seem insidious.
You know, it's very clearly a very active agenda.
And they look for as many ways as possible to crowbar it into places where you just wouldn't think of it.
You know, it's just a critical mass, someone said in the comments.
And it seems to be the life obsession for some of these people.
I mean, all they do is, you know, they're gender studies professors.
So, you know, obviously they're fucking, they just talk about it all the goddamn time and talk to other people about it all the goddamn time.
You know, they must be the least fun people to fucking hang out with.
I know I saw a couple of them just walking around campus, and yet that was pretty much true.
Like, killjoys.
The most fun professor I had was a polyscythe professor who would challenge everybody.
He called himself an extreme moderate.
He was violently in the middle.
Oh, I love that guy already.
That's exactly how I describe myself.
So, yeah, if you had any political spectrum that he wanted to talk about, he would challenge you.
He would actually make you think.
He was easily my favorite.
That's awesome, man.
I'm really glad to hear that people like him still exist.
Thankfully, he's still at that school, so shining hope there.
The amount of time until he gets run out for pre-rape or cultural appropriation or something stupid.
But yeah, thanks a lot for coming on, man.
I really appreciate it.
No problem.
Cool.
Yeah, I think that's been about 10 minutes, hasn't it?
So we better move on to the next person.
Yeah.
That's right.
We've got Eric in the chat.
He's next.
Cool.
Hey, there's all gone.
Thanks, Arctic.
Hey, Eric, how's it going?
All right, yourself?
Very well, thanks.
What would you like to talk about?
Well, first off, what you just mentioned earlier about the guy being the radical moderate, I like to refer to myself as a political non-Euclidean, which here in the United States translates to left.
Are you sure it doesn't translate to none of the above?
I mean, I consider it none of the above, but technically speaking, I lean somewhat left in the United States, which is still radical right in Europe.
The way politics here is in the United States, it's ridiculous.
But one of the things I wanted to talk about, if my gracious host would permit me, is issues about privilege.
Particularly, the one privilege none of these people are willing to talk about, class privilege.
Go ahead.
Yeah.
See, I grew up phenomenally poor here in the United States.
And I think a lot of these people don't realize what poor means.
I mean, we've heard about Brianna Wu and her $200,000 that she pissed away on an animation company.
Here in the United States, there are people, and I know this because I was one of them, who grew up without access to clean water.
There are schools where there are children who their county-issued school lunch is the only meal they're getting that day.
And so what you have is to survive.
This is a thing that happens in the United States.
And it happened to me within five miles of one of the most wealthiest cities in the United States.
So there are serious issues with class inequality in the United States.
And when I grew up as a kid being poor as fucking dirt, I was friends with little black kids and little Asian kids and little Hispanic kids.
I had a friend who, their father was transgender.
My brother is gay.
Down here at the bottom, the thing that separates the social power structure has nothing to do with what you look like.
It has nothing to do with what you put your genitals on.
It has everything to do with who has money.
And so when I see people like Brianna Wu, Zoe Quinn, all these people with what to me is fabulously wealthy, from my cultural perspective, is fabulously wealthy, sitting here telling me, I have privilege.
Not only do I have privilege, but those people over there, those people, they are your oppressor.
They are the people keeping you down.
When I'm sitting here thinking, you look an awful lot like the people who kept me down because you're the ones with the money.
And I'm not saying that it's comparable to that Zoe Quinn is like the Koch brothers or whatnot.
But you have to understand that when I grew up, I worked jobs that were absolute shit.
Backbreaking stuff.
And I did it so that people in those social positions could get the luxuries and amenities that they enjoy on a daily basis.
And they're telling me, the person who looks like my oppressor is telling me that all these other people who look just like me, who had the same upbringing I did, they're the ones that are actually going around oppressing people.
It's fucking infuriating.
I'm with you there, man.
Honestly, my parents both grew up on council estates.
So to hear these people sit there and tell me how fucking privileged I am when Macintosh's dad owns a fucking house on San Juan Island and Lipschitz's dad is a bloody multi-millionaire and Wu's parents are millionaire entrepreneurs that give a 200,000 to start a fucking business.
It is fucking infuriating.
Fuck these people.
And like not directly related, but Sui Park.
Do you remember her?
Oh, yeah.
And that interview she said where she's not going to enact the labor of educating someone on a position.
Of course she's not.
Do you know what labor is?
Have you lifted a finger in your life?
Look at her hands.
What was that?
Look at her hands.
There are no fucking calluses on those hands.
Yeah.
And the way the logic must go is, well, what's the hardest thing she's had to do?
Write a term paper.
Well, that was hard.
That must be labor, right?
So defending your ideas or is there a concept of hard work?
So they're not going to do it.
They're not going to work for the man for free and enact that labor.
It was fucking mind-boggling.
And Lifshitz had a tweet, I think it was last month, about how privileged and entitled we all are.
What does his dad do again?
He's the president of the Gare Group, which is a multi-million dollar, multinational.
I'm not even sure what they do.
I think they might actually trade in weaponry.
Yeah.
His father's a multi-million dollar arms dealer.
He doesn't just deal with arms.
The thing that I used in the video was he'd purchased the organization had purchased $170 million hotel in Manhattan.
So obviously they're not small by any stretch of the imagination.
Precisely.
But what a lot of this business reminds me of is particularly the early heavy metal music scene in Detroit and in Liverpool.
Working class music, right?
And it got a lot of pushback here in the United States.
I don't know if you're familiar with the issues we had with what was called the PMRC, the Parents Media Resource Council.
Remember that?
No, I did.
Oh, well, we had a big deal way back when, where you had a committee made up mostly of politicians' wives, real upset about all this dirty music going around, and that something needed to be done about it.
And what it was, is you had they made up all these different qualifications for things that were damaging to the youth and needed to be censored.
And they came up with this, you know, the sticker that is on all the albums these days that's parental advisory explicit lyrics or whatnot.
The thing is, Frank Zappa goes before the PMRC and gives his testimony about the value of art and the dangers of censorship and how this is, who is this up to to decide what is art and what is obscene.
And his next album, Jazz from Hell, gets the sticker on it.
The thing is, it was an instrumental album.
There wasn't a single lyric on the entire thing.
So it was obviously just a statement then.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was obviously trying to silence people who opposed censorship.
And we hear the business happening with GTA 5 in Target, Australia.
Yeah, it's fucking disgusting, isn't it?
They want to tell us that they're not here to take anything away.
They're not here to censor anybody.
But what ends up happening?
What ends up happening when you normalize that kind of behavior?
Yeah, especially the ⁇ I think social media is really, really giving them power as well.
Because it's not very hard for 40,000 feminists, which is probably like every feminist in Australia, to sign this petition to make a political statement, which is what they did.
I mean, this isn't really going to affect GTA's sales at all, is it?
I mean, Rockstar is whatever, probably.
But it makes these feminists, it gives them a political win, and it's a precedent.
It's something they can say, hey, these people did it.
Now you have to do it too.
So I don't think an inch should be given.
And the whole movement depends on precedent and public perception.
That's why they're going after Brad Wardell so hard.
There is no story there.
There is no story with Brad Wardell and the hiring the artist thing.
Saying, hey, submit an application.
There is no story there.
But you're seeing people, the same people, pushing that story that they have to know on some level.
They have to know it's bullshit.
Because it doesn't matter what the facts are.
It matters how history remembers it.
And the message being pushed is if you are a content creator and you don't toe our line, bad things are going to happen to you in the press because we...
It's like the argument you hear in the United States about different social stuff.
Don't be on the wrong side of history.
They're arguing the future, the future state of things to tell you you're wrong.
You're not wrong now, but you're going to be wrong in the future, and you don't want to be wrong in the future, so agree with me.
It's fucking scary, isn't it?
It really, really is.
No, I'm totally with you there.
It's one of those things that I try not to think about too hard because, I mean, come on.
And the porn thing in the UK, just banning certain acts in pornos.
And it's like, okay, look, I know it's something that's very hard to defend because everyone's like, oh, he's defending porn, but why?
You know, none of these acts are done between people who don't consent.
What's the fucking problem?
But for some reason, some group of goddamn Puritan housewives have somehow got nagged their way into government or something and been like, right, okay, now we can ban these things.
I don't even know who's done it.
I didn't know this was coming.
It's our Ratings Council that's done it again, under pressure from God knows who.
It's like Mary Whitehouse version 2.
I'm going to look into it for this week in Stupid when I get around to doing it.
And I'll find out because I'm actually really pissed off about this.
Well, the feminists aren't happy because face sitting's been banned.
They're up in arms about that.
So you might have a mutual ally at some point with the feminists.
My God.
I was very amused to read that.
But there's a thing, though, because there's a precedent in media, and especially new media, here in the United States, to adopt voluntary censorship, essentially.
You had the Hays Code, you had the Comics Code, you have the MPAA and the RIAA and the ESRB.
And all of those have ultimately led to lower quality art, just flat out.
And the problem becomes that now we have a censorship movement in the form of the quote-unquote SJWs who aren't aligned with the traditional censorship boogeymen.
They're not the far-right moralizers that your young people are going to ignore.
They are the young people.
And that's where things get dangerous because video games are a very young medium.
When it comes to our development as art, we're still stuck with the great train robbery and stuff that are the very early stuff that was just a guy taking off his hat.
It's still very early in the medium.
And now to have the young people hopping on the bandwagon saying that we should police ourselves with the implied threat or we'll do it for you is really scary for what it means for art.
I totally agree.
I think that these kids seem to be trained in self-censorship in this sort of social justice culture, don't they?
If it offends someone, you can't possibly say it because offending someone is somehow the worst thing you can possibly do, which I can see why they hate me, frankly.
So yeah, I don't know what really can be done.
I guess it's just going to be the people who can't stand to be offended and then the normal people who don't really care.
Sorry to do this.
We've got to move on, unfortunately.
But thanks for coming on.
Yeah, thanks for coming on, Eric.
No problem.
Love talking to you.
See you later.
Take Emma.
Bye.
It's Elric next in the lineup.
How's it going?
Hello.
It's going pretty good.
How about you?
Really well, thanks.
I wouldn't agree with that guy before me about being raised poor and just staring open mouth at how much money is being wasted by people who just don't have a concept of it.
There is no concept of scarcity in that world.
They're just straight up, sure, why not?
Let me piss away another $100,000.
I'll just get my parents to bail me out.
I'll just find something else to happen.
I'll cry victim on the news and somebody will give me money.
Do you reckon they bleat about privilege all the time?
Do you think that's why they bleat about privilege all the time?
Because they've got so much of it.
I agree with a couple of the people I've said that it's more like it's showing off how it's a holier-than-thou thing.
Oh, definitely.
It's definitely competition.
Look at how much better I am than other people because I can admit all of my faults and privilege and things.
And because I can admit, and because I'm such a flawed human being, well, obviously I'm so much better than you, you who can't admit your flaws.
Yeah, that's I think that, and I think that it's not necessarily admitting flaws either, because it's more a way of invalidating things that poor people work for.
Most people who don't have trust-to-n parents actually have to work to get what they want.
And so when they get it, it's really, really unfair to tell them that they're privileged.
Yes, they are.
Don't get me wrong, they are, but it's completely justified because privileges are something you earn.
And if people have fucking earned them, then they deserve those privileges.
And it pisses me off more that these rich kids want to take them away on the basis that the rich kids didn't earn the same privileges.
Not my fucking problem that you didn't earn it.
Not my problem that you feel guilty about it.
Fuck yourselves.
And it is kind of it's ridiculous that people are trying to make you feel bad about things that you've bought with your own sweat and blood.
Yeah, absolutely.
And it's one of those what was it?
I had a point somewhere back there.
I get caught up in this stuff too.
There are certain things that kind of they've always been in my mind, but I've never really known how to articulate them properly.
And then that just kind of triggered it to really come out.
Sorry about that.
Please go on.
Oh, no problem.
I do a lot of for the most part, I mean, I'm doing all this stuff by the seat of my pants.
I didn't realize that it had gotten this bad.
I had just been, you know, you think it's someone else's problem until they show up at your front door.
Yeah.
And I think we're about three steps before that point.
They're showing up at other people's doors.
They're showing up at your friend's doors, and you're going, wait, we do something about this or we die.
I'm genuinely wondering when it's going to get to the point where they enact laws about people allowed to not be offended.
So it is, it's literally forced self-censorship or legal penalties.
Well, here's something interesting.
In California, they have amended the code for rape law to say that let me see if I can remember it correctly.
That kissing without permission is rape.
And it does not require that kissing had happened.
It requires that just somebody said that it happened.
being on the wrong side of a person a woman petty enough to say he kissed me without my permission will get you thrown out of college it's not even interpersonal relationships or something say again It sounds like they're trying to stop interpersonal relationships or something like that, just like, you know, like 1984 style.
You weren't supposed to fraternize.
Mm-hmm.
And it sounds very much that sort of Puritanism.
How dare you do something without express written consent?
I think one of the social justice warrior type people said that the idea, and they said it straight face, like this is a good thing.
The idea is to make men so afraid of sex, so afraid of personal infotimacy, that the woman has complete advantage.
They can do whatever they want without fear of consequences because all of the consequences are off-loaded.
Wow.
And that's how far they have to go.
Where did you hear that?
Let me find this here.
I looked up the California code to begin with, but I don't quite remember where I had the social justice warrior stuff.
Right, okay.
Well, how about instead of spending the time to look it up now, do you want to tweet it to me and I'll retweet it so people can see it?
Yeah, sure.
I'll put a note on that.
have that on a tab.
But the whole, there was a blog a while ago I'd end up following called the American Conservative, and I don't normally take any political positions.
I just kind of it's not that I don't have them it's that I've never paid enough attention before this point to articulate them.
Yeah.
And it's uh he makes the point that it's all of this stuff is somewhat dependent on resource scarcity.
He makes the analogy between wolves and rabbits.
Wolves live in a world with constant pressure for survival.
They have to make sure only the best wolves are in the pack.
They have to evaluate threats and make decisions about their lives based on a world of toil.
And rabbits have none of that pressure.
They are in a world of fields of grass everywhere.
They do not have to look for food.
The only thing they have to do is run away from things when they run away from danger when it shows up and go back to eating the grass.
And it's an evolutionary strategy kind of to say.
That's quite an interesting point, actually, because I had a thought the other day that I haven't really explored yet.
But I was wondering to myself if I mean the level of abundance that we have now is pretty much unprecedented.
For the average person, and I was thinking that maybe this whole social justice thing, maybe it's an inevitable consequence of an abundance of resources in a society.
Maybe this happens no matter what society it is, no matter where it is, if people live with enough luxury for long enough, this sort of thing happens.
That's actually what this guy makes the point of, is that at first you're in a dangerous world and so you have the castle, you build up the wall, you have the moat, and you work really hard to protect yourselves.
And due to all of that effort, life becomes easier and people, generations, start going, well, you know, we haven't been attacked for like a month or two.
I want a new house.
Let's take down one of these walls and build a house.
And enough people do that to erode the things that were keeping them safe and the things that were providing that value in the first place.
I've actually made that sort of argument myself in conversation.
It's maintaining the systems that made you great that makes you great.
Will Durant summarized basically Aristotle's philosophy by saying excellence is not an event or an act, but it's a habit.
It's something you do over time.
And I really agree with that.
I think that we'd probably better let other people go now because it's getting a bit of a cue.
So thanks very much for coming on.
Really appreciate it.
Thank you very much.
Great fan of your work.
I think it was a really great point that you made, man.
Honestly, I really do.
Thank you.
Take care.
Cheers.
Okay, next up is Radu.
He was next up.
Hello, Radu.
Hi.
Hi there.
How are you doing?
Very well, thanks, mate.
How are you doing?
I'm pretty good.
I'm sorry, this is the first time I'm using Hangout, so I hope I'm doing everything correctly.
I think you're doing fine.
What would you like to say?
All right.
Well, first off, I'm going to preface by saying I've completely lost all my train of thought.
I've had so much shit planned for what I'd like to talk about as I've been watching these streams.
So I guess I'll just have to start in bad form with an apology if I'm about to rant.
And I'll just hang it as best I can.
Now, I'd just like to say that, to begin, I am a 20-year-old white shitlord, and I live in Romania, and with that being said...
Hang on, you don't sound anything like VMO.
No, I don't.
I grew up basically learning my English from a lot of cartoons and movies and video games.
I think VMO is the liar, and he's actually just an Italian.
Yeah, I think he's Italian as well.
I think he's lying.
Sounds Italian.
Sorry, go on, mate.
Sorry.
Yeah, no worries.
Yeah, pretty much I've been gaming since I was about three, so I don't know, as far as I can remember, which is also where I've picked up my English and a lot of other info that I'm actually very thankful to gaming for in general as a medium.
And living up where I've been, you know, growing up, where I've been growing up, I'd just like to give a huge fuck you to all these people who are talking about privilege because they have absolutely no idea what it is like to actually be subjected to any sort of lack.
I mean, As you're probably aware of the nature of this country, without ranting too much and then going into other side routes that are probably not relevant to Gamergate, it's not exactly the most abundant place in the world.
But we try and make do, and this is probably why a lot of people here have got a sort of a knack for figuring shit out by themselves, and why also a lot of us are pretty much taught to use our brains and think for ourselves and try and overcome any obstacles that are pretty much placed in front of you.
Now, about I'm not sure, let's think of something relevant to talk about.
I work in a large IT company at the moment, which is also American, and incidentally, is like 70% women, including most of management.
So I must confess I'm not entirely sure where to start on this whole feminism issue.
I've been pretty much with Gamergate since it began.
And I must say, even before that, I was a big fan of Rock, Paper, Shotgun for a while.
At least as the violence in gaming Jack Thompson thing was raging and was a big thing.
And I really liked the guys back then, and for the reaction, however they stood up for gaming and stuff like that.
But as time went by, they started getting more and more into this feminist thing.
And I admit, maybe it's just the location I'm in.
At least that was my initial opinion.
I was trying to not take things at face value and then sort of analyze for myself.
I didn't really get where they're coming from.
And the reaction just got more and more dubious as time went by.
Yeah, I found they just got it really is something that is increasingly hysterical, isn't it?
It is, it really is.
And you know, I actually voiced my opinion on a comment on their website at one point saying that, you know, like maybe, guys, can you lay off the feminism wrangle?
I mean, it's kind of forcing it a little bit and not really adding anything to the contribution.
And without, you know, without going into too many details, a guy named John Walker, which I believe is the owner of the site, went into a huge tirade and locked the comments and I believe banned me at one point.
That's good of him.
Yeah, which is really charming of him.
But in any case, I want to say that I feel extremely offended, you know, indirectly maybe because I've not been the target of anything so far, but like being said, even indirectly by a group of people that I cannot think for myself and cannot make my own decisions, not as a consumer, but as a human being, and to decide what is moral and what's not.
And that's just insulting my intelligence.
And I feel that's one big part of why everybody is so outraged by everything.
Yeah, I totally agree.
I can't believe that they did it.
It's ludicrous.
You keep reading about how these people are going to one day wake up to the real world and realize that they're being shit lords and whatever.
And real life is going to hit them in the face.
Like, are you kidding me?
Like, what sort of world are you living on where these are actual issues?
I mean, you keep it's enough to open your eyes.
You know, take a walk on the internet side of things for a little bit, and you keep finding all sorts of amazing and inspiring articles about this guy or this girl with no legs that's actually an Olympic swimmer and some sort of and all sorts of people.
And what I'm trying to say, the people that overcome huge challenges on a daily basis when they have incredible, incredible disadvantages compared to the other people in their same field that they operate in.
And you're trying to tell me, sitting here from your San Francisco, I don't know, villa or whatever you are, that you are actually undergoing some sort of stress or you're you're trying to overcome some really serious difficult difficulties because your HTML game is not being received well enough or whatever.
Yeah, you can fuck off with your Twitter PSD basically, isn't it?
I just don't believe it.
You know, one thing that I occurred to me the other day that was interesting about them is what they seem to do is they like you said, they've got their like fancy San Francisco houses and apartments and stuff.
And they do, they do I've, you know, I've seen like their their, like public information and they do travel to the sort of third per third world parts of the world.
And I think that then what they do is they travel back to the first world and see that the poor people in the first world don't have it as bad as the poor people in the third world and somehow kind of conflate the the issue and then and like, conflate themselves with the poor people in the first world because they also live in the first world, because it is, it is a whole.
You know, it's another step down in the scale of poverty, but that doesn't mean that people in the first world who are poor aren't struggling, because they obviously are yeah, but it's incredibly hypocritical of them.
And then, and to and to harken back at your previous point with the previous speaker, which I forget the name of and apologies for that, I do not agree that.
Uh, you know, a lack of challenge eventually leads to this kind of behavior, to like social justice warrior bullshit.
I think it's.
You know if, if you give a uh, if you give a guy enough resources, you know enough abundance of everything, I think that would rather you know when you're talking, talking about and you know no offense intended a normal guy or girl or whatever.
It's going to just stimulate them to branch out into other areas of interest to them.
Right, it's going to stimulate the create, the creativity of a person.
It's going to make them want to involve themselves in something you know and um, and actually increase their own self-worth, if you will, or value, bring value to themselves as well as others.
You know, maybe you know research or paint or write or whatever.
I think it's more the case of um upbringing or culture or, you know, having uh set the expectation that they're perfect and infallible.
That's very, very interesting actually.
Yeah, I mean, if you're growing up being told by a system that you cannot fail and there's no fail, let's like I mean education or school right, nobody's failing everybody's, you know, nobody's uh, uh stupider than anybody else.
Everybody's perfect in their own little way and there's nothing wrong that you can do.
I think eventually that just leads to a sort of in um internalized narcissism that they cannot really escape and you know, I can't really help but feel some, but feel some kind of pity for them because of that, because I really do believe that most, maybe not all of these people, but a lot of these people, especially the ones that are, you know, the most radical and activist about the entire thing.
I really don't think they can think in another way.
I, I agree, and I what.
What I meant was, is it inevitable that a culture like this springs up when you have such plenty?
Um, not that it's inevitable that it takes over um, but inevitable that it comes to exist?
I think it's less about the plenty and and more about the fact that they're, you know people, are not stimulated to want to succeed, to better themselves.
It's it's, it's the mentality of, of putting the bar really low rather than raising it really high and and telling somebody jump higher.
You know, what I mean is, does that, is that like a natural outgrowth of having plenty?
It might not be like a direct, necessarily a direct, necessary cause, but like, is it something that may be a consequence of just no matter what the culture you know, this sort of culture like springs up within it and has to be dealt with.
Maybe I guess that's a valid point, I could concede to that.
I mean, I don't know.
I'm not saying that I know or anything.
I'm just that it's just a point, isn't it?
Might be true, might not be.
That's also true.
If you'll allow me, I would like to read something for you guys.
I think we should probably make it fairly quick.
Really quick.
One minute, Tops.
It's basically an editorial that was posted in pretty much what is the biggest public video gaming media publication over here.
And I think it goes like to it will like to showcase the attitude of people that are actually kind of distanced from the whole culture side of this, you know, this entire argument.
I'll try and select some relevant pieces from it.
I know I'll post it to Twitter at one point, but tweet me and I'll retweet it.
Okay, sure.
It's basically an editorial.
It involves something about a game called Ollie Ollie.
I won't want anybody to think I'm doing the game any promotion or whatever.
In any case, can I go ahead?
Yeah, yeah, please.
But you know.
Okay.
I'm just going to read a passage from it, right?
A couple of sentences.
It went back when Sarkeesian showed up on Colbert's show.
Right, so the basic guy basically confesses to not really knowing what Gamergate is or caring, to be honest, but he gives off his attitude, you know, his impressions.
He goes on to say that the presence of Anita Sarkeesian on Colbert's show leaves him unimpressed.
Feminism in video games does not interest me.
I claim to be able to distinguish a willingly sexist product on my own from one that falls within the normal patterns of the industry, just like I'm able to tune my own food after I stick it in my mouth.
Sarkeesian is just another spark of a consumerist society oversaturated with opinion and much too little action.
A consumerist society that feels the need every now and then to gobble up Sarkeesians and aggressive theories.
Listen to her speak and consider the level of conversation to be the apogee of intellectual productivity within the gaming commentator case, I dare you.
Colbert is funny.
Anita cannot name three sexist video games without condemning the entire industry.
Is there something wrong with me?
Blah blah blah blah blah.
In any case, the closing thing, and the thing I'd like to close with as well, is that he says in this segment of the video game industry, there's no sexism, only sex.
There are no women and men here, only gamers here.
Nobody fires up the threats, only invitations to orgiastic lewdism.
Game on because fuck it.
Hmm.
Well, I like that attitude.
Yeah.
In any case, thanks a lot.
I hope I didn't rant too hard or frustrated in anybody.
Thanks a lot for the opportunity to come on and speak my mind.
I'll drop off and leave it for somebody else.
Thanks for coming on, man.
Take care.
Bye-bye.
Thanks.
Next one up is Caligula himself, apparently.
Hello, Caligula.
How's your horse?
Sorry, can you hear me?
Is that going robotic for anyone else?
Yeah, he is literally a transformer at the moment.
I'm sure that's ruined a perfectly good joke, hasn't it?
Yeah, it did.
If you want to sort out your bandwidth, we can move on to somebody else.
Yeah, we'll yeah.
Try and sort it out, man, and then come back when you're ready.
Who is next?
Thomas Owens is next.
Thomas, hey guys.
Hello.
Hello.
Good evening, sock puppets and gentlemen.
Yeah, I've just come on.
I'll try and keep this quick because I know this is a bad clog.
I'm Harby Badai on Twitter, if anyone at all recognizes that name.
I just wanted to talk about the sort of almost simultaneous rise of two separate strands of news articles.
The Blackstorm Trooper news storm about the internet becoming incredibly racist and kicking it off.
And the obviously GTA issues with it being taken off the shelves in Target.
And I think a couple of other stores have also done the same now.
New Zealand.
And I know Kotaku have wrote an article which I've only scanned, to be honest, basically defending the decision in as many words.
And I wanted to sort of mention reading the KIA post by Von Monologue.
I think I got that right.
One of the websites that I've ran the story is the Daily Mail.
Anyone from the UK will know that The Daily Mail is an upstanding, incredibly ethical newspaper.
I've actually pulled up just a few things in the past that they've claimed that were proven false.
Like primary school denied pupils water on the hottest day of the year because of Ramadan.
And disabled babies were being euphemised under the Liverpool care pathway.
That's a strong claim, Daily Mail.
Quite a strong claim, which didn't quite stand up to investigation.
But the larger points I just want to make about this is there are, I think a lot of us will already know, but there are a lot of news outlets which will lead a story purely on the basis of how many clicks they're going to attract, how many views they're going to attract, and even sometimes to generate controversy.
And I feel like with, for example, what Kataka have been saying about the GTA incident, it's the kind of story that reminds me a lot of what the Daily Mail do, which is to almost like write a reactive article knowing that it's going to bait pretty much every side of a debate, essentially.
That's why Jessica Valenti still has a job.
I have watched your This Week in Stupid series and I don't know.
Yeah, I'm sorry.
I can't give you any answers there.
It's the only explanation I can think of.
The Daily Mail are using her as like a clickbait journalist by accident.
She doesn't realize she's being used.
She's probably writing what she thinks to be ideologically sound and to genuinely help feminism.
And it just turns out that it's crazy and people are just reading it to see how crazy she is.
Are you suggesting she's a shield for the Daily Mail's poor ethics?
The Guardians.
The Guardians, The Guardians, yeah.
Well, it actually takes back to one of your other videos, which is the montage with a lot of comments by Leigh Alexander and John McIntosh, where I think it's Leigh Alexander who sort of makes a claim on a stage in front of lots of people that she will inject her own take into stories and she will modify stories to suit her purpose, Her sort of oh no, McIntosh definitely said that and Leigh Alexander's bias, and she has an agenda.
Okay okay sorry, sorry.
So they're all as bad as each other.
Yeah yeah, it's semantics really, but.
But it just takes me back to, you know the the point of, like surprise surprise, it is about ethics and journalism.
That that's why I'm here and my harassment of women is just a hobby.
That's separate from Gamergas.
But it's a deeper problem that, like I've seen with the Daily MAIL and other Newspapers, where they are happy to, I mean, in some cases, completely make up a story, it's a piece of fiction, or to quite severely modify the original information.
It's also happened, I can't remember the name of the lady, but she specifically requested that her incidents on Twitter shouldn't be used to attack Gamergas because she didn't receive harassment from Gamergas.
And it's still, if anyone knows the name, put it in the chat.
Was that the woman who was telling their mums?
Yes, yes, I believe it was.
Yeah.
That was quite a good strategy, actually.
Good old.
Excellent.
Yeah.
But I think there's something deeper with the Kotaku article and a lot of the other articles running, which is the claim, they still claim that Gamergas and Evan Sander Movement is still just quite a small group of people who make no real impact.
They still try to disregard us.
However, they're also writing articles very, very anti-consumer, you know, to quote sort of TB.
Which if I believed as a journalist that most of my readership still didn't know or didn't care about the likes of Gamergas, why would I run news studies that are essentially supporting the censorship of video games when my readership is mostly gamers who are dead, I think, but no?
No, no, I completely agree.
And I think it's because Gamergate, even now, when we're down to the grind, you know, we're not, we know, you know, all the exciting stuff's happened now.
We know what's going on.
Now we're just like building things, or I think we should be building things to start creating this count culture.
We're in the grind now and we're still getting 30,000 tweets a day.
That is that's fucking insane.
That's huge.
After three months, you know, that is seriously, it's crazy.
Yeah.
But yeah, I think we're probably better wrap it up there, mate.
Oh, okay.
No, can I just end with one very quick question?
Please, yeah.
Is Feminist Frequency an Eta Sarkeesian or her organization?
Feminist Frequency is the organization, a non-profit, that I suspect Macintosh probably co-owns with her, and he writes the scripts.
Okay, brilliant.
Thank you very much.
Bye-bye, guys.
Thanks for having me on.
Take care, man.
Who's next?
After Thomas Owens, it was Mike Carroll, Mega Man.
Should we see if Killigilla, are you there?
Yeah, Mike Clinton.
No, you're still a diseptic on.
Motherfucker.
Do you want to try again later or reset your router or something, maybe?
Yeah, I'm going to say that.
Cool.
Okay, man.
Just you've got the link, so just come back in when you're ready.
It's Mega Man Mike next.
Mike, are you there?
Hi, guys.
Right, I'm using the webcam microphone, so do I sound terrible?
It's my first question.
Okay, man, I can hear you.
Thank God for that.
The other microphone's buzzing like a crazy thing.
So, there are a couple of things that I wanted to sort of bring up.
That's all right.
King of Paul concerns me greatly at the minute.
Right, okay.
He seems to have gone off the deep end.
Like, I can see why, but it's a bit worrying when he's kind of, I'm getting an interview with Fox and he's all emotional and all this kind of thing.
You know, I'm a little worried about that because people are going off and getting really heavily emotionally invested.
And they're the people that are at sort of at the front lines, as it were.
They're the people that everyone can see.
Yeah, it's a bit I can understand what you're saying.
I think that the most important thing for now is make sure everyone keeps using Op Skynet to keep networking with each other.
So we've got less of a problem of individual big voices and being compromised in some way.
But one of the things, I tell you what, I like King Paul.
I like you.
I liked Aris.
He's a good bloke.
And the thing is, I think that it's just, there's been a lot of people coming out because, yeah, he's made mistakes and stuff.
And yeah, he gets info hat and he spoils the brigade.
But I don't mind any of that.
But I think that people go after him because maybe they can.
I don't really know why.
Maybe a big personal issue with him.
And I can understand why, you know, if you've got dozens and dozens of people who are supposed to be on your side, giving you some worse shit than the other side, I can understand why you'd end up getting really fucking defensive.
So you didn't apologize to mundane Matt either.
I know he's gone back after him again, but I can understand he's being really embattled.
So I honestly would say if you don't like someone, just leave them be.
That's the thing.
That's why I'm saying I'm not concerned in the way that I'm thinking he's going to go off and go do something silly.
I'm just concerned that he thinks we're all against him.
That's no good to anyone.
Yeah, I agree.
I agree.
I'm personally not against anyone.
No.
But the other thing was this 25 invisible benefits of being a male in gaming.
I don't.
Ugh, that video.
I showed it to a girlfriend, and it's just terrible.
We turned to me and said, but none of these things really actually happen.
That's because every might generally possibly can do.
Yeah, all these things technically are possible, but they're not really common.
So shut up, Macintosh.
Yeah, I mean, the thing is, it says that it's going to be taken seriously because there's a white male.
I'm not sure.
The comments are disabled.
I'm not convinced.
And the ratings as well.
Yeah.
I was like, well, surely you would show people that because you're a white male, everyone's taking you so seriously.
Like, I saw one of the other videos that someone had posted up on the H Ham board.
You know, this girl that was just telling them why they're stupid.
And think, well, this girl's literally probably got more likes than the other video I've got on YouTube.
Why would you?
Yeah, I.
But the thing is, it's their worldview, isn't it?
They can't.
There's never going to be a time that they believe that, you know what, it's not that bad.
No.
I would very much like that, though.
That would be nice.
If they're just, you know, it's not so bad.
Maybe we should just all get along.
No.
Well, I don't know.
It depends.
I've seen a few people in Call of Duty that can be that bad.
But that was it, really.
And I just wanted to come on and say hello.
And that's about it, really.
And because there's a massive queue, I'm going to let you guys do some other things with people that might be more interested.
It'd be great.
Okay, great.
Thanks for coming on.
No problem.
See you guys.
Kirbs, do you want to take this next one?
Because I've realised that I'm out of tea.
I should have got a fresh cup before.
That's fine, as long as you take the next one, because I'm out of Pepsi.
Yeah, of course.
Right.
Okay.
Shannon guys next.
Hello, Shannon Guy.
I'm here.
Oh, there we go.
Hello.
Sorry, my phone screen wasn't cooperating with me turning off the or turning on the mic.
No, that's fine.
No problem.
So yeah, what's on your mind?
Well, I wanted to say hi to both you and Sargon.
I was the one who sent him that picture this morning of Anita Sarkeesian and Macintosh and Brianna Wu smelling their farts.
Oh, yeah.
I saw that and it did make me giggle.
Yeah, that was a labor of love last night when I couldn't sleep.
But I just wanted to come on and kind of get an opinion on this because this is what I kind of think is happening with the SJWs coming into the gaming community.
I've seen somewhere, I can't remember where, but on Twitter, I have seen them talking about bringing down capitalism.
And I know they are big, you know, social Marxists or whatever you want to call them.
And it occurred to me that if you really think about it, the gaming industry is a multi-billion dollar a year industry.
So it's huge.
It's a big, you know, capitalist success.
And they want to bring down capitalism.
So first they tried to attack gaming from the outside, and that didn't work.
So I feel that they have infiltrated and are trying to make crappier and sheer games to turn people away from buying games at all and bring down the industry.
It could potentially be perceived like that.
I mean, at this point in time, I just think they're mostly trying to dictate the sort of social narrative, basically.
I mean, because as it currently stands, what we're seeing at the moment in Australia and New Zealand isn't something, I mean, just because of the cost of the games, et cetera, and Rockstar has already raked in a lot of cash.
What we're seeing there isn't historically any different from how they've actually reacted to games before.
So, I mean, it's from my point of view, it is more just like trying to work within the bounds of capitalism just to because they love the benefits of capitalism.
They don't actually really care about the social issues that much.
They just want to not appear.
It's about keeping up appearances, basically.
If that's the long-term goal, I don't know.
Who knows?
How does it feel in the United States?
That's just how it feels from my end.
I've been running a page on Facebook for the past two years called Liberal Lunacy.
And that's where I started.
I'm a conservative, more middle of the aisle.
I'm actually an independent, not a Republican.
And, you know, I've been fighting with these idiots for years because they've always gone after conservatives.
So I feel like I was priming for this fight for years.
And it always comes back to, or seems to come back to, tearing down capitalist ideals.
And, you know, at least that's how the climate seems to me in the U.S. I don't know about, and, you know, elsewhere in the world, I'm kind of, you know, an idiot American who doesn't know what's going on in the world a lot of the time.
But I try to.
Well, from the politics at the moment, they seem to, America seems to be pushing back at least.
I mean, the number of red states has increased quite dramatically.
So I don't think they're quite ready yet to give up on the American dream, just from what I see.
The scary part, the scary part about that is because what we called the red wave that just happened with the elections, right after that happened, the executive branch, Obama, to be specific, started pushing through the amnesty for illegal immigrants.
And I'm all for people coming into the U.S. through the right channels, but this is definitely not the right channels.
It's completely disrespectful to people who really did do the work and come in the right way.
I really believe the reason they're pushing for amnesty is because that freaked them the hell out.
That there's this big majority saying, hey, we're sick of your shit.
And so if they give all these illegals amnesty, they will be able to be American citizens almost immediately, have the right to vote.
And who do you think they're going to vote for?
The guy who gave them amnesty in his party.
No, I can see that.
So it's kind of scary climate.
I can see that.
I can see that it could be just a political maneuver in, you know.
But I mean, where I kind of, because I'm not too bothered about immigration, especially in our country as well, because we have a tendency in this country to want jobs that are above our station in life.
And, you know, it's actually the backbone.
Here in the U.S., the actual unemployment, not what they, because they do a bunch of weird math with statistics to fit their narrative that it's going down.
But the actual unemployment in this country right now is close to 11%, possibly higher in some areas of the country.
In some areas, like Detroit and stuff like that, it could be as high as 20%.
And if you talk to just a typical American person, people are desperate for any kind of job.
Good friends of mine going around and asking, can I do landscaping for you?
And what's really scary is one of my friends, her mother had to get some work done on her roof.
And so she hired a contractor and didn't meet any of the laborers until they were there.
All the laborers were of Mexican or Latin American descent.
None of them spoke English.
And they ended up covering up a vent on the roof for the furnace and almost killed my friend's whole family because they covered up this vent and carbon monoxide completely filled their house.
And that's one of the dangers when these people don't understand English.
They can't in no indirection.
No, I can understand.
It sounds like your topic has a lot of sort of broader sort of connotations with regards to your political leanings.
And it might be sort of more of a discussion for another time.
But I can definitely see what you were trying to say.
That's the idea.
That's why I came into Gamba because I am definitely a gamer and I love it.
And so I feel like I've been gearing up for this for years because of my political leanings.
No problem.
So it kind of ties in for me.
What was your website again that you were running?
Sorry?
That you mentioned earlier.
The blog, was it?
Liberal.
Yep, no problem.
What I'll do is I'll get Sargon liberal lunacy?
Yeah, I'll get Sargon to retweet it out, definitely, when we finish with the stream.
And if people want to go and have a look at the wider issues, especially from this type of perspective, it gives them that opportunity as well.
I think we have to unfortunately move on to the next one.
But thank you very much, though, for coming on, Shannon, as well, because I know you were waiting as well.
Hello. Seems that Shannon.
Great.
Well, now I've got to retweet a conservative website.
It's going to really make me look like I'm a centrist, isn't it?
Well, it gives people the opportunity to talk about it.
I'm joking.
Who's next?
Okay, who's next?
Sorry, it's just got a bit lost at the moment.
John Kelly is next.
Hello.
Hi, John.
How's it going?
Going pretty well.
I came on here to ask you some questions.
Do you mind answering?
Oh, no.
Go ahead.
Okay.
These questions pertain to mainly the future of Gamergate, like where we're headed and stuff.
The first question is: do you believe agenda pushing is enabled through corruption or corruption is enabled through agendas?
That's a good question.
Kind of a chicken and the egg thing.
I don't really know which came first with them.
I take it we're just talking about anti-Gamergate here, right?
Pretty much referring more so the corruption in games journalism specifically.
Yeah.
I imagine that the culture enables it because it's beneficial for them all.
It means that any of them can take advantage of it at any time.
And all they have to do is just say, yeah, I agree with that on Twitter.
So it's quite easy to allow them to continue working as they work.
No one rocks the boat.
But I couldn't tell you which way around it was.
Were they corrupt and then joined together to form this culture?
Or were they pretty normal and then joined this culture and became corrupt?
Couldn't tell you.
Okay.
That's a question that I often have conversations with about over the internet.
And some people say it's because some people say the ideology of what's frequently called the SJW mentality needs to be cut off at the root.
Others, like myself, say that it's the corruption that enables that agenda pushing to happen in basically games journalism.
It's hard to say.
It's really hard to say, isn't it?
I'd be able to just take a stance on it right now, to be honest.
It could be either.
All right.
Second question is: you've stated that Gamergate is essentially a counterculture.
What do you mean when you say that, and how does that help the consumer revolt?
As in, to clarify, how does the consumer revolt benefit from having a counterculture associated with it?
Okay, well, this is just my opinion when I answer these.
But I would think that having accounts culture gives a more ethical sort of culture a place.
Having a space for accounts culture to flourish would give this counterculture, which I assume purports to be a lot more ethical than the one it's leaving, a space to grow and flourish and find and set down roots and actually build something that might actually be worthwhile.
That's what I would say.
Okay.
Again, I don't know whether that even answers the question now.
Sorry.
It's okay.
Me personally, I agree that there is a counterculture associated with Gamergate.
I'm not sure if it helps exactly.
I do think it inspires people.
It's kind of like the consumer revolt has inspired people to make art, and what people have said against us inspires us to rebel against them.
So I do agree that there is a counterculture going on here.
I think it's actually a real benefit because I don't think that without account culture, a consumer revolt could have gone on for this long.
I think it would have fizzled out a long time ago.
Yeah, I would say it's more like a counter-subculture, if that could be a term.
Because we're not very big, but in the grand scale of things, we're only a few thousand compared to the millions of people in the globe.
But moving on to the next question, a project that I myself have been personally trying to get out there, and a lot of people have gone on board with, and it's taken off, is the Rebuild Initiative.
It's a letter-writing campaign to contact developers and games media trade unions, such as the Entertainment Software Association and the Electronics Merchants Association.
Basically, we want them to be able to speak out on the current state of journalism.
Because as you notice, there hasn't been a lot of AAA devs commenting on this, and when they do, they have to do so anonymously.
And there's even been very few indie devs spoken out, although we have gotten a lot more of them.
So, what is your opinion on the rebuild initiative?
And would you be in favor of it?
Well, do you want to tell everyone about the rebuild initiative?
So, I've heard definitions work from.
Sure.
One moment.
I'll post this in the side chat here for a moment, and then I'll read off of it.
Briefly.
One second.
Is it the Reddit post?
Yeah.
Yes.
Okay.
That was written by myself, and it was sticky for a while.
And like I said, it's taken a life on its own.
Okay, well, do you want to read out quickly just what the post is?
Okay, let me get to the right paragraph.
The rebuild initiative is a community-driven letter-writing campaign for gamers to reach out to game developers.
By contacting devs, we can invite them to the table to talk openly about the state of journalism.
Gamergate has been branded as a source of toxicity by the media, and as a result, has forced those who handle public relations to keep developers quiet.
By making an appeal through a letter-writing campaign, we can convince them to speak out.
Contact the Entertainment Software Association and the Entertainment Merchants Association.
They are both trade organizations who lobby to politicians and core on behalf of video games.
They will be instrumental in allowing the industry to come forward in the showbook of how games are reported.
This will not only help those who believe in the principles of Gamergate, but also help to improve the game's media market as a whole.
With better connections with the games industry, we will be able to create a more free and open market.
I think it's a good idea.
I definitely think that getting the publishers to talk directly to their audience is going to foster closer relationships.
And that means that they're going to be far more inclined to care about your personal needs than they are of your needs through the proxy of Kotaku or Rock Paper Shotgun, especially when these websites aren't working in your interest at all, especially in the case of Kotaku.
So, yeah, anyone who doesn't have an ethics policy or seems to have very questionable ethics, even with their policy, is definitely someone who's not on your side.
So, taking them out of the loop would be a good thing.
I agree.
And I don't believe that we should take journalists completely out of the loop.
ethical websites such as TechRaptor and Niche Gamer, etc.
And these other websites, if they do indeed reform, they should play the role of mediators, not gatekeepers.
If they can basically be the liaisons between us, the consumers, and them and the industry, we can basically establish better connections as a whole and it will basically make a better market.
Yeah, agreed.
Okay.
Two more questions.
In IA's closing statement, he said we should be completely on the offensive.
You have responded by saying we have done, if I'm not mistaken, your response was basically we've done pretty much all we can to attack.
Is that correct?
It's not that we've done all we can to attack.
We can continue to attack.
But the thing is, how exactly are we expecting them to fuck up?
The only thing I can think of that would be worse, that we'd need to get them to do now is actually to break the law.
I don't really know what else we can do.
They've displayed a complete dearth of ethics, a complete contempt for their audience, and frankly, a strong dislike of games as a medium.
I cannot understand why they are not out of the industry collectively.
But for some reason, they're not.
So, yeah, here we are.
What more attacking is going to get them to do?
Are they going to say they don't like games even more?
Because we already know that.
Are they going to say they don't like their audience even more?
We already know that.
What can they do short of breaking the law?
And how can we get them to break the law?
Well, I do think I get what IA was saying, because basically he knows that our enemies are stupid, and even though they've gone pretty silent on the issues of Gamergate for the most part, they will eventually fuck up.
And they will eventually do something that we will be able to call attention to, and they will have themselves under fire again.
Can you give me an example, like a hypothetical, of what you think that could happen?
Sam Biddle still works at Gawker.
So, like, as an example, like when he said bring back bullying, he could do that again, or someone else could.
Or they could be another.
What would happen if he does?
We could do what we did before.
Call him out on it, throw under attention, and get a whole bunch of advertisers to pull.
Well, I suppose, but can we not just do that with the existing one that he's sent?
I mean, he said bring back bullying.
Why can't we just keep emailing the advertisers about that one?
Looking over at GamerGate.me and under Operation Disrespectful Not and Operation Baby Seal, we've already been in the process of doing that, filing the already corruption.
On the Gawker side of things, we can easily just point out to the Ferguson article where they actually encouraged rioting and violence.
I mean, for me personally, that's just disturbing.
So I think that the I believe that the advertisers would be most effective if we focus on that particular article.
But I don't completely agree with IA on this one, because I think that your response was correct, and that it's about having to build a new media on top of the old one.
Like, yes, we can destroy the old guard, but something new has to replace it, otherwise we'll have the same old problems again.
I mean, I just want to say that if you want to go after advertisers, if you want to, you know, I'm still going into Diagra.
I haven't finished doing that.
I'm just busy.
If you want to go after individuals who have got genuine cases of corruption to their name and so need to be held to account for that, I totally agree.
Do it.
I just personally, I'm not necessarily going to be doing that other than what I'm already doing because I don't think it's going to have any more of an effect.
I mean, I think keep emailing the advertisers, of course, but I don't think we're getting I was hoping for them to say and do all of the things that they've willfully bragged and said and done, because I thought that was going to be them being quite a shocking revelation to what the outside world, and the outside world would suddenly peer in and go, This is crazy, you guys can't do this, you know, and there'd be so much press to fire them and all this sort of stuff, and various amounts of legal action, but no one really cares.
And if they're biased and corrupt, no one seems to give a fuck.
It's like, okay, well, fine.
So what's the next proactive step?
And well, the next proactive step is promoting pro-Gamergate sites to, you know, like goodgamers.us, their ethics policy was just spot on, absolutely spot on.
You know, and don't get me wrong, you know, I understand that there are going to be times when they're going to have journalists who do violate this ethics code, but I'm sure that they will actually be punished.
You know, that's the point of an ethics code.
But yeah, that's yeah, the new media is something I've been trying to heavily promote.
I do have one more question, but I do want to address this again because there was a bit, there was, how do I describe this?
There was a bit of a fervor over something I said on Hat Stream about a week ago.
I'm sorry, what's that week ago?
I'm losing track of time.
Monday, it was, where I used a word that I shouldn't have used, counsel.
Now, what happened when I said that word?
Yeah, it was me.
Sorry, guys.
Yeah, I admit that was the wrong word to use.
And what I meant was an open form to, like, actually, Oliver Campbell that same night actually said in much better terms what I meant to say: an open form for people who are heavily involved in Gamergate to come together and talk about the issues and exchange information in a transparent way, not in a form of dictating fashion like quote-unquote council implies, but rather as advisories.
One person on that stream even put it in an axiom is really eloquent.
We need less raid leaders and more quest givers.
That was my idea in a nutshell, essentially.
It wasn't to tell people what to do or to tell people how to go about it.
And I completely admit I delivered that idea completely wrong.
I was basically telling the audience what to accept and what not to accept.
And I even did make a blanket statement by saying that basically people, GamerKate doesn't act on its own.
They only follow leaders.
That's not true of everyone.
And also, another thing I'd like to clarify is: I was the guy who brought that up.
Not Monday, Matt, not Hats, not anyone else in the stream.
I've seen a bunch of people on Twitter and on the forums attack Monday, Matt in particular, for this idea.
Monday, Matt brought it up two months ago, recanted it, and then I brought it up again.
So if you want to attack me, you're more than welcome to, I guess.
I wish you wouldn't attack anyone for bringing up an idea, but you're blaming.
I think that there's no need to attack anyone for an idea because I like the idea of a Gamergate forum where anyone can sign up and make a thread.
And I have an idea, maybe we should try this.
And then people can read the idea.
And if it has merit, they can take it.
And being individuals, they can contribute to the idea however they want to.
And if they don't like it, you can just ignore it or comment and say, look, I think this is a bad idea because.
Disagreeing with someone doesn't have to be attacking them.
And yeah, so an open marketplace of ideas that is unaffected by anyone in the outside world.
There's no anti-Gamergate mod that they can't possibly get onto the gamergate.com or whatever website and then fuck with the forums because obviously it's going to be owned by someone who is Gamergate.
I think that would be a good idea.
Council, obviously, I think it's an idea that's been long discredited amongst most people in Gamergate.
So I understand that you meant it was the wrong word, so I'm not going to hold you to anything.
But yeah, I don't think anyone really wants it because it's obviously not how we like to work.
Okay.
We're going to have to unfortunately move on from that because it's been some time.
Okay, I did have one more question, but I could save it for a later.
Tweet it and I'll respond to it.
Okay.
It'll probably have to be I'll have to change it because it won't fit 140 characters.
But thank you for having me on.
No problem.
No problem.
Today is next.
Ted Too.
Yes.
Hello.
Hey.
Hey, how are you?
Yeah.
Well, I just want to get in today to get off my chest a few things.
I've been feeling disillusioned about the current state of Gamergate, especially what is happening on the Twitter front of Gamergate so far in what I feel like a very chaotic mess that is going nowhere.
For once, I am seeing a lot of cult of personality type popping up surrounding some of the more prominent voice, such as Roadstar or Remy Puns or Ivy Clover.
And I don't think this adds to the whole E-Celect e-drama thing.
They have been going on for quite a while sometimes.
And what is leading to is that instead of Gamergate being able to agree, to disagree with each other, like two, three months ago, it started to become a shouting match in Twitter where if you have dissenting opinion,
it's going to be descending into two or three different camps just flinging shit at each other, such as the case of Critical Kelly when she was trying to bring on some idea about boycotting and all she got was dogpiling from other people who vehemently disagree with her.
Yeah, I think I'm a bit concerned about it myself.
I think that's I did actually tweet.
Don't worry.
If you don't like someone else in Gamergate, just block them.
You don't have to talk to them.
I can understand, but using Critical Kelly as an example, there is a person who's well, who doesn't put her points across in the best fashion a lot of the time and can be quite aggressive and quite blunt as well.
So I think it's a give and take situation when you're communicating with people as well.
Just to put that in the middle.
I can understand that part, but like I said before, I've noticed we went from being able to agree to disagree and to talk like normal adults.
We basically have turned Twitter into a place where either two things happen.
One, the either e-drama or shit flinging from all over the place, either from King of Paul or from Critical Kelly or from other hello.
I'm wondering who it was that dropped there.
I think it was him that dropped.
Yeah, I think he's got a really great point, though.
I think one of the I think I do think one of the reasons that all of this happens on Twitter is because I think people wanted to be transparent.
You know, I genuinely think people wanted to have a lot of the issues dealt with out in the open so people could see that they've been dealt with.
But I think the consequence of that is this e-celebrity drama.
So I don't know, maybe we should just encourage people to take it to private messages because if they're having a bitch fest with each other, fuck it, I don't need to know.
You know, does anyone else need to know?
And another point I want to add it uh add is that uh it seems like all the actual work in Gamergate is relegated back to the IRC guys.
On Twitter, like on one side there's a shit flinging and on the other side I think it's basically just e-celepts stroking each other.
I'm sorry I have to say it now, but a lot of Twitter feed on my part is basically just one noted of notable notable voice, sorry, notable voice tweets something and then there's like one or two other notable voices jumping and commenting and agreeing on it and it's just make my feet feel like a big huge circle joke around all these voice or these people.
Meanwhile on the other hand the IRC guys having their own public room, their own work private rooms and they are the ones that do the big games.
They are the one that do doing the researching.
They are the one that doing the discussing.
And there's such such a disconnect between the front that is kind of make me very concerning.
And also and also the fact that it seems to go on a bit on the tangent about the whole council thing.
I personally don't like to use the word or the connotation of it, but I understand there's a little bit of coordination that should be going on between different people in Gamergate.
But it seems like we are we are the ECLAP and the separation between IRC and Twitter and all and other stuff is making a really big gap for people to come in coordinate and stuff and installing Gamergate as far as I'm concerned at this point.
I think that's a really good point actually and I think that's definitely a concern to address.
I mean if someone does create like a Gamergate forum that's literally just for Gamergate by GameGate then that's theoretically is that not like a that would be a good nexus point for everyone to meet at because I one of the things that I think is one of GameGate's get great strengths is that you've got so many people concerned in it who have got such a diverse range of skills because I bet most of those IRC guys probably don't want to have to fight the good fight on Twitter and make it a public you know Gamergate give it a public presence.
And conversely, I bet most of the people on Twitter who do that probably don't want to go to the IRC chat.
Although if you tweet me a link to the IRC chat, I'll retweet it so everyone anyone interested in going there can go there and you guys can all keep working.
And so and I think that you're right.
I think that these two camps should probably cross a bit more, just so they're all a lot more aware of what's going on.
I think you're probably right.
There's probably a lot of good information that's dug up by these guys that goes fairly unnoticed because they're not talking to each other enough.
So I'm wondering if just a forum somewhere.
'Cause I mean you can get a free forum from somewhere, can't you?
Probably doesn't take much for someone to sell.
I think there's a Gamergate forum but it's not very used as far as I know.
And one of the things is that wa well I think a week or two ago from the IRC guy was like, okay, we're gonna need to invite like all the notable Twitter, all the notable EC lab to a room where people can uh to an IRC room where people can discus where peop they can discuss and stuff.
And what happened is that we send out invite to a lot of people, to a lot of people, like Oliver Campbell and some other people.
And there isn't very there aren't many people that there wasn't any I'm sorry, there weren't any people that actually replied back.
I think some people were concerning about the whole IRC law getting taken out of context, and some people couldn't give a fuck really.
They don't even reply to that.
And at this point, I'm going to have to question whether or not the E-Select and the notable Twitter are actually doing any works outside of just tweeting and then stroking each other's dick on their profile.
Because at least I can remember a month or two ago, some of the people actually do work, they actually write Twitter longers, they actually engage neutral.
But at this point, all I'm seeing is that Twitter descended into a circle job, nobody actually do any work, and even worse, they retreat into their own little Skype room, and then they start talking trash to other people behind other people's back.
And it just facilitating a very toxic environment for Gamergate to thrive.
Okay, I'm not interested in tone policing other people.
Obviously, I don't, you know, I'm sure that nobody in Gaming Gate wants to harass or anything like that or is going to threaten anyone or anything like that because I'm sure that at this point everyone knows that any kind of threats or doxing or anything like that crap, that's the most counterproductive thing we can do.
That just gives them a fucking good reason to say what they say.
And I'm not saying that we can't be dicks because I'm a dick every goddamn day of my life.
So don't be afraid of being a dick, but conversely, remember what they are going to claim is death threats or harassment and stuff like that.
Don't let them get to you.
But I think that there's a really, I think you raise a lot of really great points there.
I agree.
There should definitely be a lot less e-celebrity shit going on on Twitter.
I'm probably just as guilty of it as anyone else.
So I'm not trying to say that I'm not a part of that.
I probably am like it.
But it is definitely something you're right.
I think it goes on too much.
And I think I'm going to this GamerGate.community is the forum that people someone's just sent me.
I really think we should start using it.
It looks nice, it's clean.
It could probably do with a few more boards.
I think if I were it's got gaming discussion, Gaming Gate News, and then a sub-forum of advocacy research and debate, which I think is fantastic.
Gallery of Rogues, which I think, that sounds harsh, but I think that that should be definitely something that the community sort of self-polices because some people will be on it and some people might be on it but might have to come off of it.
But it's the sort of thing that needs to be dealt with with care.
But I definitely think that we should start doing this because like you say, people go back down to the Skype groups and stuff and I mean they're going to anyway, but at least they've got a place to air their grievances with other people who are like-minded and may actually be able to offer good advice or something rather than just becoming these hugboxers or anything like that.
So I totally agree.
I think you've got a real good point there.
I also like to bring up one or other two points.
I'm sorry.
You've been a bit bit long.
We might need to move on because we've still got quite a few people.
I'll just get on this right point quickly.
One of the things that I would like to address is that it seems like Gamergate have been slipping from actually question, talk to each other to just basically just nodding head whenever these E-Celect or figure heads they like on that day They like on that day, say something that they really want.
Like, for example, uh, Toto Biscus on the uh our on the uh Koteku in action stream on Monday.
Like, uh, some of his opinions I don't I don't agree with, and I know some other people I don't agree as well, but I don't see anyone actually question question it.
I don't see anyone actually talk talk about it, which is a bit concerning to me because it's almost like we are starting to slip into the listen and believe thing that we are so adamantly against after like three months.
It's all it's almost like to me, it's almost like a case of becoming a monster that we are fighting against.
Well, I tell you what, if that is the case, if and if people are seeing that and they, you know, they genuinely agree with it, and I'm not saying they shouldn't, then we should definitely fucking address it because the last thing I want people doing is listening and believing.
Um, I mean, I every source that I use is in the description of my video, and I think if people can give their sources more often so people can fucking turn around and actually check them, double-check them, and make sure that we're not talking shit as a community and not doing the stupid listen and believe stuff.
I think there's a lot of fucking bonuses to that.
Um, right.
Um, we need to do that.
Thanks, man.
I think you make a lot of really, really solid points that I do completely agree with.
Thank you for having my time.
It's just an accident I'm really like to grind because I've been here for three months and I hate to see the thing that I have seen.
I have contributed to targeted shit.
But thanks for having me, and I really appreciate it.
And I hope you guys continue to have a really good stream.
See ya.
Cool.
Thanks.
John is next, and then we'll try Caligula after that.
So for John.
Hello?
Hello.
How's my audio?
Sorry?
How's my audio?
Yeah, I can hear now.
What would you like to say?
Just a quick question.
It's going to be short, this chat.
But do you encounter any SJWs in real life?
No, but that's because I don't really leave the house very much.
Occasionally, actually, one or two.
Yeah, I don't really.
I don't know if I could.
Maybe I've met somebody who called us SJW, but I wouldn't like to be very vocal offline, though, are they?
No.
When they go into a space that they know is not full of SJWs, I don't think they're very vocal.
I guess the only one guard think maybe being SJW was this comic book club I was at.
I think there's like one guy that I think might be an SJW.
That's this comic book club I was at.
But that's about it.
Like, I think if I talk to people and I personally think someone needs a piece of shit.
So I can't really hear you very well.
Sorry about this.
Hold on, let me change my audio mics.
Did you get that, Kurt?
I got something about a guy at the comic book store being an SJW.
That is literally all I heard.
All right.
Is it better?
Let me try again.
Is it better?
I can pick you up.
Sargon, can you hear it?
Yeah, I can hear you.
I'm just being told on Twitter that NeoGAF hacked that forum that was sent.
So possibly don't go to that one.
I don't have any further information though, so I've tweeted, I've retweeted the information that got hacked, apparently, but that's all I know.
But sorry, yeah, carry on.
Yeah, I was just wondering, like, you can you like imagine someone like Tesco or Game banning GJ5 because of these complaints happening recently.
Sorry, who who doing what?
Can you imagine someone like Tesco or Gain banning GTO 5 because of complaints?
Oh, um well, you'd bloody well hope not, wouldn't you?
Like, I don't know.
I mean, I guess the other question I have is: um, what are your thoughts on Jim Sterling?
I think that Jim Sterling is probably the victim of a hell of a lot of peer pressure.
Yeah, it's like you can agree with a lot of stuff, right?
But like, once you like him, like, say, like, stupid, he's like, oh, Anita's not gonna like steal games away from you.
It's like it's like really disappointing because you've like it's really disappointed in.
Like, don't you think?
Like, oh, yeah, I'm I watched Jim Sterling's general sort of Twitter behaviour when this all began, and he was like, oh, I'm just gonna stay neutral because I don't think he's really all that interested in talking about social justice and probably only has to because he's forced to because of circumstance and the people he's sort of fallen in with.
I mean, maybe he's full on SJW and I'm misreading the situation, but that's just the impression I got.
Yeah, I'm looking at his YouTube channel right now.
And unlike his suggested ones, he's actually got like the Alexandra and Matt Lee's on there.
He's got the Alexander and Matt Lee's on there.
Fuck yeah.
Yeah, and like if you go to his um you go to his likes playlist, he's got you know that um guy who made that stupid song like, yeah, not Jack Thompson.
I just play video games.
Yeah, yeah, I know that guy.
Like he's got he's thumbed up that in like video, like three or four of his other songs.
Like wow, maybe I'm wrong.
There's one called If It's Not About Terry Quinn, Stop Talking Belter.
And there's also one that's probably Matt Lee's like Sakis in the effects directly's commentary.
Maybe I'm completely wrong.
Maybe he's gone full social justice warrior.
But never mind.
Alright, I guess that's it.
That's alright, thanks for coming on the stream, man.
Thanks.
I'm a huge fan.
Oh, thanks.
Take care.
Bye.
Bye.
Who was next?
Caligula.
We're going to try Caligula again.
If he sounds like a robot, we'll have to try another time for him.
Pretty good.
Hello.
How's it going?
You got me?
So, how was your horse?
Well, you know, Tony Abbott is a great fine steed.
Is he a senator, though?
That's the question.
Oh, no, he's prime minister.
Close enough.
What did you want to say?
Yeah, he looks like a horse, though.
Well, I wanted to say that I think Gamergate, much like the assassination of Archduke Franz Ferdinand, is kind of the beginnings of a kind of cultural shift.
I'm sorry, I've been drinking.
Away from radical leftism and toward kind of abandonment of ideology.
I don't think that that's fully the case, but I think it's kind of the beginning of moving towards that for the average Joe Everyman.
I think it could be.
And I think that is something that is necessary, and it's certainly something I would want to be a part of, because I don't like radical anything.
Yeah, well, I'm probably being way too idealistic here.
Quite possibly.
But it's not something to rule out, though.
It's not something I'd rule out.
Because most people in Gamergate really are left-leaning or central.
But it's more about libertarian versus authoritarian, isn't it?
Really, rather than left-or-right politics.
It's more about can someone else dictate to you what you are allowed to be and act like.
The amount of tweets I've seen around from Gamergate supporters have been that have just been, I was radically left, and now I'm kind of not so against the right.
The amount of tweets I've seen just in Gamergate from that, I think it is the beginning of a cultural shift.
Just that one statement.
I would like to think so, because I'm kind of sick of the bigotry against the right.
I really am.
They're not bad people just because they're right-wing.
Yeah, it's not immoral to be persuaded by a different politician.
Yeah, absolutely.
And just to hold a different political leaning.
Like, many of the people who vote right are not voting for social reasons.
I'd say at least half of them are voting for economic reasons.
Probably.
For a lot of that, it's probably just cultural.
And you've got to consider the fact that people just don't give a shit.
Many people just sign up to vote and go scroll all over the paper.
They just sign up to vote to say who I voted.
Yeah, quite possibly.
And the problem is ill-educated voters, but that's a different subject, really, so we better not go there.
Sorry?
You're going a bit robotic again.
Ah, for fuck's sake.
Russell Brand came out and said we shouldn't be allowed to vote.
Well, Russell Brand would say that, wouldn't he?
He's become obsessed with his own cult of personality, I think.
But again, it's not Gamergate, so we probably shouldn't go into it.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Another thing I wanted to say is there is never a worse time to quit smoking when you have to look at John McIntosh's tweets.
Oh, I love John McIntosh's tweets.
They brighten up my day.
I made a video last night where I just got drunk and yelled at him for 13 minutes.
You know, I don't think McIntosh is actually a pardon?
And we've got to that stage.
It's a good thing and that he's a good person because of what he does.
And I don't see him actually swearing at other people.
He just is brainwashed and doesn't know it.
I think that's what frustrates me most about him, though.
Like, if he called me a cunt, if he came out and said you're a fucking degenerate, I would have much more respect for him.
But I can't because he pretties it up with all this soft fucking language.
It's like, no, you want to call me a cunt?
Call me a fucking cup.
I don't think he wants to call you a cunt.
That's the thing.
I think that he thinks you're lost and confused and that his propaganda is the way and the light.
I think that's how he thinks.
I don't think he's aggressive or evil or thinks bad necessarily of people.
I think that he thinks we're misguided because we strive to be objective.
I kind of think that he believes he's some kind of hero protecting women from thinking for themselves.
Do you know what's interesting, right?
He often uses like if you look at his Twitter, he's got like an anti-Batman thing on there, which I find is very interesting because, I mean, coming from a wealthy family, you would think he should identify more with Batman than he does with the Howard Building mob who have we lost Sargon?
Yeah, I think it was getting to that stage in the show where Sargon actually is line goes spaghetti.
I think you actually share the same ISP as him because it was pretty awful as well.
Yeah, my internet has been spilling more spaghetti than Italian with Parkinson's.
Well, I'm just gonna have to.
We just had somebody take Sargon's space, so I'm gonna have to ask yourself if you would mind ditching.
Oh, yeah, no problem.
I said what I wanted to say.
No problem.
If anybody is actually waiting to get on after this guy, you know, frantically clicking the join button, please just wait until Sargon gets back, otherwise you'll nick his space.
It's all very technical, it seems.
And now I wish we had some elevator music for this dead air.
But we could move on to the fucking internet connection.
God damn it.
Can you just get that sorted?
Seriously?
I've tried.
It's been a month now.
I've not had a single fucking bite through this thing from talk talk I'm with.
I'm just going to have to cancel it and go with someone else.
It's just a month wasted.
Yeah.
They are pretty awful.
He's saying it's down with Batman, down with Batman with this braying mob outside of like Wayne Manor or something.
That's Macintosh's fucking Twitter.
It's like, man, you've got some serious identity issues, Macintosh, if that's the case.
But yeah, yeah, I don't think he's a bad guy necessarily.
I think he's just good.
Caligula had to leave to let you back in because somebody actually took your spot.
So we're moving on to the next person.
Which is Charming and it's cut off whatever the name is after that.
Charming Man93.
Yeah, yeah, there we go.
Hello?
Hello?
I'm gone.
I'm on set.
Hello?
Hello?
How's it going?
Hello.
You alright, Sargon?
Very well, thanks.
How are you?
I'm fine.
How's your internet?
Shit.
What did you want to tell me?
Hi, Cerberus.
Hello.
Sorry for the bit second delay, bit couple seconds of delay from me.
I didn't realize my microphone was turned off.
That's alright.
What did you want to say to everyone?
Oh, well, I'm Charming Man93 or CharmlessMan93 on Twitter.
Chris Mitchell at.
Have you favourited one of my tweets earlier today?
Did I?
About Jim.
I said the thing about Jim that he was going to release his new video has been the case every two months in the last two months on the Encyclopedia Dramatica.
Do you remember?
Yeah.
That's me.
And I'm also, I'm going to shield for about five seconds.
I'm also a podcast host.
Oh, okay.
Well, what's your podcast?
It's the avatar.
It's called Games, Vines and Videotape.
It's about films, obviously, games and internet stuff, yeah.
Okay, there we go.
Is there anything else?
We haven't got Mercedes Carrera coming on the next ep episode.
Sorry, who?
Mercedes Carrera, the pony.
Yeah.
Well, okay, that's anyway.
Other than Schilling you wanted to say?
Other than Schilling, I just wanted to talk about carry on talk about full Macintosh.
Oh, yeah, go on.
I found one of his tweets he's just done recently.
He said, I know it's hard for some gamers to accept, but many people can't find acting like violent misogynists, sociopaths to be especially fun.
I just thought I'd open it down and just say he's an endless source of entertainment.
He is, but it's like, okay, Macintosh, don't play it.
But I don't think he is brainwashed.
I think he's just doing this to pander to the audience, because him and Sarkeesian are con artists.
I think Sarkeesian's playing him.
We're not necessarily playing.
She probably might care about him, but I think that one of the I think she uses him for his he's a true believer.
I'm certain that he's a true believer.
And I'm certain that she's not.
So I think that she's just thinking, well, this is useful.
I'll use his skills.
Because he's not bad at what he does.
In fact, that's the problem.
If he was bad at what he does, he wouldn't be important.
But I mean, I might be wrong.
You might be right.
I don't know.
That's just the impression I've got.
Yeah, and I also think Jim Sterling isn't peer-pressured at all.
I mean, look, he wouldn't have left if he didn't disagree with the ethics policy that the Escapist brought in.
That's true.
That's true.
I hadn't considered that.
I tried watching him.
I tried watching the Jim Quisition.
I mean, I'll be honest.
I've probably watched and listened to a few podcast presenters that can be considered arrogant, but he's just arrogant.
The character he plays on the Jim Quisition, the sort of, you know.
But he comes across a lot in real life.
Doesn't he?
I've not really talked to him in real life.
No, just I've not talked to him, but I think that's genuinely him just amplified.
Oh, well, I mean, it's entirely possible that it is.
It's a real shame because he can do good work.
But what do I know?
He might well be a complete annoying social justice warrior.
Yeah, and what.
And he does look like it.
I'm trying to.
I'm sorry if I appear to be echoing.
It's my headphones.
They're loud.
Yeah, so anyway, I've noticed that, yeah, there's a horrible echo with me at the moment.
Okay, now it's gone.
I've noticed recently that there's been a pushback in the mainstream press against us.
Like, Sarkeesian is back in The Guardian, and Zoe Quinn is also there as well.
They're talking about them a lot.
I just think.
Yeah, and what you're going to do?
You're already losing.
Going back to your stupid trainer thought now.
Going back to the mainstream media to bail you out is not going to help.
And what's it like?
Sorry, go on.
Yeah, and what's annoying is that repeatable places like The Guardian are lapping all this up.
And I'm complete.
I'm probably one of the more left-leaning people in Gamergate.
I consider myself a socialist.
And to see The Guardian post this horrible stuff about rape culture and men and everything.
It's just sad to see that they've dropped so low.
Well, I think that these were places that were primed to be anti-Gamergate before Gamergate even happened.
They're hives of social justice.
Left and right publications, isn't it?
Yeah, Fox News, but I saw the Fox.
Was it Fox?
It was someone where they were going on about any Sarkeesian.
But I'm not surprised.
It was very much in the sort of Jack Thompson mold of things.
Oh, we're not Jack Thompson.
Then they go and ban GTA 5 in Australia.
Well, one change was.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.
And feminist campaigning.
That's GTA 5.
It's like, you're not Jack Thompson.
How about you shut the fuck up?
I'm not even against feminism.
I'm just against some of the people inside it.
Every time I think about it, I get angry and say, I hate feminism, but they're like, no, I don't, actually.
Yeah, I d I i it's not necessarily like what they what they claim the dictionary definition is that's you know everyone agrees with that.
It's their actions, isn't it?
You know, they shouldn't be doing these things.
It's authoritarian versus libertarian, I think.
Yeah, it's it's not left or right.
No, yeah, I've noticed that.
It's been quite a learning experience for this third-year history student.
Yeah, but um, was there anything else, mate?
Um, I was going to talk about um a little bit about the schism that's happened with Jim IA, not Jim Sterling, and King of Paul.
I need to rant a bit about King of Paul, less about.
Do you mind if we don't and rant on the on the forum or something like that?
I can do that.
Because that would be a better place for it than the stream, because there are lots of people waiting.
I will just say, keep it out.
I don't want to hear about this.
What, e-celebrity bollocks?
Well, I like e-celebs, but just their problems with each other.
Keep it out.
Yeah, yeah, I agree.
I'm starting to think, just take it to private messaging.
If you're arguing with them, just private messaging.
Also, I do have an issue with these people being called Marxists.
They pay more fascists to me than they do Marxists.
Wow, you know, communists can be just as totalitarian as I do.
Actually, my mum's boyfriend is a communist and he loves Sarkeesian.
He has the cheek to judge me as a gamer that we have a misogyny problem.
His work, not me.
And I was like, well, if you can't trust the BBC, you're very willing to trust a non-academic source.
And his big thing is academia.
Yeah.
And, well, no great fucking surprise there.
Listen and believe, my friend.
Listen and believe.
Thanks for coming on, man.
Thank you.
Take care.
See you later.
Okay.
Next is Duncan and then Edwin after that.
And I'm just going to go get a cigarette.
No problem.
It's Duncan.
How's it going?
Pretty good, Sargon.
How about you?
Yeah, really well, man.
I really like doing these communities.
It was nice talking to everyone.
I can just kick back, have a cup of tea and chat.
Yeah, I've been following this since the beginning, and I've been a fan of yours for a while.
Yeah, I was actually on Layman's Behind Gamergate stuff, and I've been on a few streams with V, so I'm getting more into the community.
Primarily, you're right.
It's an argument of authoritarianism versus libertarianism.
And I had a debate with this actually in some comments the other day with somebody, but both of us were actually pretty rational.
You can't have something fully libertarian or fully authoritarian.
They're both too extreme.
You have to have a mix of each.
In an ideal world, I would advocate for rational anarchy.
But the world's not ideal.
Yeah, I could see the argument for that.
But yeah, I don't think it will work in practice.
But that's the point entirely.
Yeah, like a lot of utopian things, isn't it?
Yeah.
Ultimately, the idea is that they're not using logic and reason.
And I hate that.
I've been a proponent of logic and reason all my life.
They're denying the scientific method entirely.
They're starting to try and censor science.
I mean, the whole shirtgate thing, side relation, obviously, but that was outright stupid.
Shaming people for a shirt that they wore.
Shaming people for the games that they play.
It's really an ego thing.
Yeah, I agree.
I think it's a way that they can feel superior to other people and win arguments without having to be smart.
Yeah, well, arguments, I don't like to call arguments arguments because at that point, what I figure as an argument is people screaming at each other and not listening.
And that's what they do.
They scream and plug their ears while the rest of us are like, well, no, come on, guys.
Pull your fingers out of your ears.
Let's speak this out.
And I don't necessarily agree with what Tedo said earlier about stopping the E-celeb circle jerks.
You like the E-celeb circle jerks.
I have no opinion one way or the other, but everybody should be allowed to express themselves.
That's ultimately what we're fighting for here: a freedom of expression.
That's true.
And the whole let's stop tone-policing each other thing.
I think you actually said, you know, I don't want to tone police anybody.
Same here.
I mean, people are going to say stupid shit.
The only time we should get on their case is if it becomes outright harassment, you know, like our Gamergate Harassment Patrol on Twitter.
If anything becomes less inflammatory, more actual threat, that's when we jump on them.
That's like, well, you can say stupid shit all you want, and we're just going to call you stupid.
But once you start being a harasser, we're going to get on you.
Yeah, I agree.
I mean, like, you know, calling them stupid, calling them faggots, calling them offensive names, call them all the offensive names you want.
You know, but don't keep going at them and threatening them or anything like that.
That's when it crosses the line, isn't it?
So it's, I mean, we are a counterculture.
We're a cultural revolution and a consumer revolt.
And honestly, this is just history repeating itself, except in the U.S. and other places.
I don't think you are mutually exclusive.
You can be a consumer revolution that is also part of accounts culture.
I don't see a problem with that.
There is no mutual exclusivity.
I mean, the cultural revolution is one part of it, and the consumer revolt is another.
We're the counterculture because we need to be.
Rational, reasonable, logical debate, the observation of fact is what's going to be the best basis for making decisions.
Yeah, I agree.
I completely agree.
That's really what I do think that we could do with a forum.
I've been told that that Gamergate forum, they were hacked, but it's been fixed, and they've got new security measures and whatnot now.
So I've been told that they should be good to go on.
And I've posted a thread there that, you know, just if anyone came there from the live stream, let me know.
So now I can go bullshit there with you.
It doesn't have to be anything major, but just somewhere where we can actually have a record of things that people can read.
That other people in Gamergate can go there and read the conversation, see how what you know.
Because a lot of the time for me, I don't really know where these operations come from.
So I'm always a bit, I'm always last on the sort of bandwagon to support operations because often I don't know where they've come from.
I don't know what the thought process was leading up to them.
And I don't necessarily have a good explanation of what people are trying to achieve with them.
And just a forum is a good place to do that.
I'm not saying that 8chan and Reddit and all these other places aren't good places to do it either.
But these are places that are moderated or can be affected by people who are outside Gamergate.
So there's always a risk there.
And I think 8-han, as much as I do love what comes out of H-chan, whenever someone sends me a link from H-chan, I always enjoy reading through it.
But I know the anon aspect is not something I personally object to, but I think that there are a lot of people and outside of GameGate as well, who not anti-GameGate, but just neutrals in the media and whatnot, that don't really want to engage with that.
And it gives them an angle of attack saying, oh, well, they're hiding their identity because they're afraid and because they're harassers and stuff.
And, you know, I don't think that, but that is what they say.
And if we had a place that was at least, you know, I mean, if people have accounts, then they could be held to account for what they say.
And I agree, because that way you can't get someone like Zoe Quinn anonymously posting and discrediting all of the H-han Gamergate board.
So I know I've gone on for a bit there, but I really had to say that.
That's fine.
I understand.
And it's true, getting rid of a little bit of anonymity, even if people are just using pseudonym usernames, which is what most people do on forums, it still makes people accountable.
Oh, only this one user could say that.
They don't have that password unless they were hacked.
Yeah.
Yeah, exactly.
Because this was my problem with Kotaku when WhatsApp's face was on the stream with Tolbiscuit.
He was going on about how he didn't want an ethics policy because it would allow people to nail him down for things that his journalists do wrong.
And I'm just thinking, that's the point, you dip shit.
You are meant to be nailed down when your guys do something wrong.
You're meant to be held accountable for your actions.
Consequences exist.
Yeah.
And this is no disrespect to HHN or anything like that.
It's just we can't have everyone working that way.
It's just not, you know, it's not like really that, you know, they know it, I think, as well.
So, you know, they're smart people.
I'll tell you what, I wish I could use H-Chan more.
I'm just shit.
I don't use it at all.
I really do like what comes out of it a lot of the time.
Yeah, it's funny.
The only other issue I wanted to bring up was this is going to relate to the Vokaroo that Jim left when he left a movement.
He said that people like you and Mundane Matt and everybody were becoming the things you hated by monetizing.
Monetizing is not a bad thing.
It's capitalism at work.
And you're trying to get paid for doing something you love.
I don't actually think he was talking about me and Mundane Matt.
I was under that impression initially as well, but people pointed out to me that he was actually talking about what was it, Review Mage or Review Labs or something?
I don't really know much.
Oh, that guy.
Yeah.
Yeah, I didn't really know much about it, so I think that was what he was really talking about.
I think he thinks that monetizing anything is evil.
I don't know why.
Maybe he's a white collar and has some money that he can sit on.
Social justice warrior.
It's not bad to monetize.
It's bad to monetize if all you're going to do is create drama where it doesn't exist to pull in the views.
The clickbait, one of the things that we've been saying, oh, you're posting untrue things to pull in views simply so you can get more advertising revenue.
That's the issue.
And that's all part of what we're fighting.
I have nothing against anybody making money off of doing something they love, so long as they're honest and transparent.
I feel exactly the same way.
That's actually, not to pimp my shit, but that's actually why I put the Kickstarter information at the end of my Necromance video, because I wanted people to know exactly the process that we've gone through.
Because we've got nothing to hide.
If you've got nothing to hide, I don't, and I would argue the complete opposite if we were talking about the government here.
But I don't actually see much of a problem about it.
Yeah.
Okay, well, I don't want to take up too much time.
Thank you very much for allowing me on the stream.
I know I was talking a lot there, but I was talking to people that I didn't want them to go away thinking, you know, without properly clarifying my position and being taken out of context, and because people read something, think it's an attack on them or something like that, and then they'll go berserk with it.
And I didn't want that to happen, and I didn't mean to talk over you, man.
Sorry.
Oh, it's all good, Sargon.
I love watching your videos for a reason.
You actually have a pretty cool voice, too.
Oh, thanks very much.
Take care, man.
Take care with you.
Christ.
It's okay.
I know who's next.
It's Edwin next.
Edwin.
Sorry, Edwin.
I completely forgot.
I'm not going to talk as much, I promise.
What did you have to say, Mate?
Aloha, Sargon.
Thank you for having me on.
I'll try and be brisk and coherent.
Just want to go back to the privilege aspect.
I think it's the social justice, rad femme side.
Ideological zealots want to paint Gamergate gamers as people of privilege.
More specifically, undue or unearned privilege.
If you have something that you didn't earn or you have something that's not your right, it's easier to take that from you.
Now, I'm a little bit of a statistical outlier.
I'm an older guy, not a hardcore gamer.
I play when I can.
I actually found out about Gamergate via your videos and via Thunderfoots videos.
So I've spent a lot of time in streams, forums, communities, got a chance to meet just a ton of different people with inside Gamergate.
And I don't have hard data, so this is all anecdotal.
But for the most part, people seem to be actually from the lower classes and lower middle class at best.
That seems to be my impression as well.
And it might serve Gamergate well with some of these different people putting together websites.
If there was some sort of metrics or some sort of informal Gamergate census to show that, hey, we are Joe average.
We're not people of privilege.
In fact, the people that are yelling at us the most, saying that we're the most horrible people, are actually people probably from the top 1 to 5% of privilege or economic status.
That's not a bad idea.
I mean, if you started, say, the poll sites, I can't remember the name of the damn things now, but you can create a poll and just get a link to it.
People can fill it out and you can collate the results afterwards.
If someone did that, I'd fill it.
I'd be interested in knowing.
I mean, it could all be done anonymously, couldn't it?
Yeah, and what that would do would be to remove that stigma that, you know, you guys are all just a bunch of rich, white, privileged kids with wonderful lives, whining about your little gaming communities.
And so we don't have to feel bad about taking anything away from you.
You're someone who should be attacked.
I think that's a great point.
I think it would definitely, like the political compass to show that it's actually libertarian versus authoritarian.
I think that would actually be a good resource, just a good fact.
Here's a study of, say, 1,000 or 10,000, however many people in Gamergate do the thing.
Most of them come from the lower middle class and below or something, 90% or whatever the percentage is.
That would definitely give people ammunition.
I think that's a good idea.
Yeah, well, it would take away, it would take that lever, rather, And show, okay, you're not trying to kick down and take down these big misogynist privileged people.
You're kicking Joe Average.
You're trying to take something away from somebody who may not have all that much to begin with.
Yeah, I agree.
I totally agree.
And I think that's one of the, you know, I really think that's one of the reasons that people are fighting so hard for this because gaming's the one sort of thing that they really have in a lot of people's cases.
And, you know, I can completely relate.
When I was a kid, you know, my main hobby was kicking the can out in the street with my mates or playing Doom.
So, you know, if someone had been like, yeah, we're actually going to stop you from playing Doom and we're going to take, you know, stop, you know, you're not going to get Doom 2 or Quake because these games are violent, I would have been fucking furious.
Not that I would have had any power.
It wasn't social media then, but it would have pissed me off to know it.
Sorry, I'm talking a lot.
Shit, sorry.
It's okay.
Okay.
So, and I've done much of the thing, much of the thing, and I've done a lot of work after seeing this.
Are you going a bit robotic there?
Sorry.
I'm going to stop and start that bit again.
No, is that robotic for anyone else?
Yeah, we're having a real problem with some people and Echoes as well.
Yeah, I can hear it.
Unfortunately, my internet source is some string and some coconuts in a way.
Well, you're back now, so what were you saying just then?
Just like you, I've talked to a ton of people.
And a lot of the people I've talked to that the Gamergate community has become very significant to them.
In fact, I've talked to a few people here recently who were very sad and had some dismay that Gamergate, you know, they were hearing things Gamergate is dead, Gamergate is lying dead.
You're going a bit robot-y, but I think I get what you're saying.
And I agree with you.
I think that there is a lot of personal investment by a lot of people.
And I think a lot of people are enjoying just being part of the community.
And I'm one of them.
I'm enjoying it.
It's nice talking to everyone.
It's nice having people to have shared interest with.
Because I'm sad and lonely.
Well, what I would suggest, what I would suggest, there are going to be some passive consumers of Gabriergate.
Meaning people that are going to tune into your stream, watch your videos, watch internet aristocrats videos, whoever.
You know, participate in the way you want to.
But if you're disappointed with Gamergate, what aspect of Gamergate getting you on something, man.
Honestly, you said you start getting to a point and it's starting to sound interesting and then you start going robotic and no one can understand you.
Well, I'll try and make it brief.
Yeah, sorry.
Examine what you can do yourself and then do it.
Be the speaker you want, be the leader you want.
Take the tangible actions with inside Gamergate that you can rather than relying on someone else to do it for you.
Thanks for coming on, man.
I totally agree with that.
Do what you can do.
Don't worry about what it is someone else can do.
Do what you can do.
And I think that the I think the greatest expression of that is the emails.
Because any one of you can send an email to the advertiser and whoever the latest boycott of the day is and say, look, I'm a gamer.
This has really hurt my life.
You know, I shouldn't be treated like this.
These people should be held to account.
And they're giving you a really, really bad reputation.
But yeah, that's my opinion anyway.
Thanks for coming on, man.
Thanks, Edwin.
The chat does appreciate your voice.
You went from sexy radio DJ to Megatron in the sense of gutting, actually, because he seemed like a very well-informed man.
We've had him on our streams for some conversations as well.
He is a very intelligent chap.
We are getting a lot of echo.
Is that from you as well?
No, I hope not.
I'll turn the thing down a bit then.
There we go.
Okay.
Based Isangi next, apparently.
Yeah, I don't really know.
Oliver Campbell gave me this nickname.
I really don't know what to do with it.
Just keep it.
Okay.
I mean, I don't really know how to pronounce it, so it's kind of a problem, right?
I don't know how to pronounce my own name.
Anyway, how are you doing?
Really well, man.
How are you doing?
Doing pretty good myself.
Can't complain.
I made a thing.
I just put it in the chat.
It's an infographic thing.
Looking at a lot of the survey data that's come out of Kotaku in action.
I know that's a thing that the last gentleman mentioned about measuring some things, about demographics, and a lot of this stuff was really well done by a lot of these people who have been doing surveys.
And it kind of got me to thinking, one big thing that's at the crux of this that people really aren't talking on or getting on that much, it's sort of like this battle between quantitative evidence and anecdotes.
So there are these claims that are going around and they are being supported entirely on anecdotal evidence.
So things like Gamergate's about women and trying to get women out of the industry or Gamergate's anti-feminist or Gamergates this or Gamergates that.
It's all based on anecdotes.
It's like pseudoscience.
And all these claims have been, you know, have been or can be proven.
I think they could all be proven false through quantitative evidence.
And I think that if we can present that, you know, I don't think that a lot of people are kind of turned off on the whole appealing to moderates or trying to, you know, I won't say convert because it has a bunch of connotations, but you get what I'm getting at.
Yeah.
Oh, I didn't want to say prozellitize when I was trying to talk to people about it either.
Yeah, yeah.
There's a really a nice word for getting people to buy into your ideological viewpoint.
There really isn't a cool word for that.
Someone needs to make one.
But seriously, though, there's a lot of quantitative evidence that has come out about Gamergate and how people in this movement feel and how they think.
And that's how the stuff in the 90s got killed.
That's what did it.
Empirical, quantitative research is what killed that.
Those claims of gaming causes violence and gaming is going to make the next serial murderer and all that crap that went on.
Yeah.
And I think that if this misogyny angle does turn into a thing, but little research that has been out, KNJW has put out a lot of cool stuff on it, it isn't really looking good.
So the the I don't know, I'm feeling a little hopeful on that, just because the empirical evidence and particularly when you're attacking diverse populations and you're going after groups, like you're going after Gamergate or you're going after gamers, you're going after people who do a particular behavior, the quantitative evidence, which is what you need to really make a claim against them, isn't on that side.
Do you have any thoughts on that?
Yeah, well, I think that's a really great point.
And you know, I hadn't even thought that that was what won it in the 90s.
I've just tweeted out that infographic about the misconceptions of GameGate.
Yeah, yeah, no, no, mate.
I think it's a really good thing because you literally got a pie chart breakdown of the primary concern of GameGate supporters.
68% collusion and corruption, which even the other people who support, you know, who are like censorship and freedom of speech is 16%.
Feminism of women in games is 4%.
Even biased reports.
Feminism and Women in Games 2.5.
Oh, is it 2.5?
Oh, yeah.
I should have done two purples.
That was a bad idea.
That's the thing.
I mean, I think that a lot of people's concerns cover a wide range.
And I think that there's a lot of overlap between these categories.
Because frankly, I'm concerned about all of these fucking things.
Yeah.
I don't like any of them.
Right on, man.
I think the corruption is probably my primary concern, though.
The corruption is allowing everything else to happen.
And I think that's why it's everyone, the majority primary concern.
But where were these statistics pulled from?
Yeah, so there have been a couple surveys of Kotaku in Action, and I linked to both of those.
One of them's a bit.ly link because the URL was super long and it would have taken up the entire bottom section.
But I put all the sources on the bottom.
Great.
And how many people took part in that?
That survey, the first one, there was one in October that that one's off of.
That one's 500, or it's like 460-something.
It's around 500.
There's another survey of Kotaku in Action that took place in November.
That one was about 1,000.
And then there was also a survey of Ghazi.
That was about 850.
We are more diverse than Ghazi.
And just for comparison to that, Curbs, you know, Adrian Schultz's papers, wasn't it about 27 people she was basing her conclusions off of?
Yeah, it was around about that number.
It struggled to reach beyond that.
It wasn't in the 30s or anything like that at all.
So for comparison, the academics at Digra, who use Digra, they are basing anything that they say on data that is far less reliable and a lot more tenuous.
So maybe Digra should go to Kotaku in Action.
Maybe.
But to be fair, maybe they should go to Kotaku in Action.
If they actually care about games and they care about understanding the people who consider themselves gamers, maybe they should talk to them.
I wouldn't be against it.
Everyone knows what they stand for, so it's not like they're going to go in and just SJW everyone.
Because frankly, I imagine the people in Kotaku in Action are a hell of a lot smarter than the people in Digra.
But that's only because I've read their papers that I think that.
I don't read to you Niger papers.
I don't want I like my brain cells.
Want to keep them attacked.
The classic one for me was Mia Consalvo conflating the two definitions of casual.
So she it allowed her to write the sentence that you can be a casual Halo player and a hardcore Farmville player, which yeah, whatever.
Yeah, cool.
I mean, by that logic, my mom is like the biggest hardcore gamer there is because she goes town on Candy Crush.
She's like level 80 billion.
Exactly.
The two definitions are does it irregularly or it's relaxing and serene.
So obviously in gaming, when we talk about casual, we're talking about games that aren't challenging, you know, that are more relaxing, like Farmville or Candy Crush.
You know, Halo is, by that definition, a hardcore game because, you know, you don't just chill out when you're playing it, do you?
I mean, you know what I mean.
It's a generalization.
No, I'm hitting what you're serving, man.
I'm hitting what you're serving.
But yeah, a couple other things I found.
It was pretty crazy.
Gamergate supporters, and they mentioned this in two of the surveys.
I picked the one from November because it was closest to the HuffPost YouGov poll.
More likely than the U.S. population, the general U.S. population, to both support gender equality and kind of weird, but also more likely to identify as feminists.
Really?
People in Gamergate?
Really?
People in Gamergate?
Over twice as much.
I never.
To be fair, but was there anything else you wanted to tell us?
We've got quite a few people waiting.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'm in a bit of a rush, too.
But just right quick, you know, the stuff we're seeing coming out now, I think that the things on the identity politics side of the house, it's getting pretty crazy.
You know, we're getting to a point where, and it's something that I've noticed quite a bit.
People are accepted on a demographic level, but then they get denied on a personal level.
So when I wake up in the morning, I'm not thinking, oh, I'm a Hispanic dude.
I'm waking up and I'm determining myself and thinking about myself based on my beliefs and based on my values and the things I care about.
Hopefully everybody listening to this kind of does the same, because if you're waking up thinking about your genitalia and your biology, that's kind of screwed up.
But the parts that get denied and the parts where the things where things are inclusionary and exclusionary, I think it relies on a very reductionist view of what it means to be human.
I don't think a really dense sentence, but there's a lot of truth to that.
Yeah, what I mean by that is that the parts that we self-identify with are what get denied.
And that is the barrier for exclusion.
Things like demographics, you know, that most people really don't self-identify with very strongly, that's where the line gets sort of cut off.
So you're dividing who can come in, who can and cannot come into a hobby or come into a group or come into a place of moral acceptance by this sort of standard.
And you're doing that based on the ways that people actually identify themselves.
And you're doing that based on the ways that people actually, things that people actually care about.
So on one level, it's inclusion.
And I'm not meaning this to say that getting more trans people into gaming or getting more women into gaming or getting more LGBTQ people into gaming.
Another fun fact, Gamergate supporters on KIA were over seven times more likely to be lesbian, gay, or bisexual than the general population, but whatever.
I don't say that's not important, but the places where people self-identify, that's where the lines are being drawn.
And I think that that makes this sort of progressive inclusionism, I'm using air quotes, you can't see them, really more exclusionary than anything.
Yeah, the identity politics angle is one of the things I despise the most to myself.
I just don't care about how they identify and how they look at the characters.
And most gamers don't either, and um their research proves it.
But I will honestly do that video.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's weird.
You see you see Anita Sarkeesian coming out talking about Bayonetta, about how it's this crazy thing, and then you go to a con and there are a hundred women dressed as Bayonetta talking about how awesome she is.
So, you know, I don't think that Anita, like people like that, are necessarily the best people to be representative for to advocate for the groups that it's weird.
You have people who fundamentally disagree with the people they're supposed to be advocating for.
I mean, because that Huffington Post YouGov survey in the infographic, only 23% of women even identify as feminists, and out of that, I think it's like seven, so like about a third, actually identify strongly as a feminist.
So there's a fundamental disagreement between the people who are supposed to be being advocated for and the people who are doing the advocating.
And that isn't okay, because I think it's cool if you want to have women, female gamers, have their opinions heard on things like gender inclusion.
I mean, hopefully, you know, the market could kind of work that out as a sort of inefficiency.
But I think it's cool, you know, if gay people want to talk about, well, there haven't been that many gay characters.
But look at the people who are doing the advocating and then look at the people who that's supposed to represent.
And there's this huge disconnect.
And that's where I think, again, the sort of quantitative things in looking at that would come into play.
Right quick, because I've got to go, and I think a lot of people want to talk.
It's kind of weird.
You know, people on that side of the fence care so much about cultural appropriation, but then they call their community gamergazi.
That's a good point.
I haven't thought of that.
Just saying.
Cool.
We can still work on that.
All right.
Peace out.
Thanks a bunch for having me.
Yep, you too.
Who is next, mate?
Armand.
I can't read the album.
Sorry, what was it?
Armand.
Armand?
I don't see him.
Armand Augustine Louis de Clancour.
Oh, there you go.
Pardon my French.
That's okay.
How's it going?
Well, let's just say that this statement about Gamer Ghazi has, oh my, it has triggered me so much.
Joking, of course.
As for the, of course, I mean, like, if it let me just continue what the base in whatever his name was, I'm sorry I did not follow.
What did he say was that so it's a gamergazi and it's supposed to like be very, shall we say, inclusive of everyone.
And like, okay, so imagine this.
There is an SJW or anyone who would like to join that and be anti-gamergate and so on and so on.
And so what if they are Christian?
How would they feel if they are supposed to join a thing like that?
So yeah, inclusion much, right?
Now, as for my topics, I would like to thank you first for having me here.
And also I would like to say a big thank you for learning teaching me how to use Twitter and Google Plus and YouTube and everything in, shall we say, span of an hour or two.
Because I was mostly like part YouTube and mostly Facebook user before I had to join your chat here via Twitter and by Serberus or Kirbs101.
Now as for my questions and topics I have prepared is just I was about to ask you about Gamergate opponents.
That is Anita Sarkeesian Zoe Quinn or Brianna Wu or whatever is her his or her name or whatever.
So the point is, first of all, that thing about them being so inclusive and so understanding of everyone is just basically because, hey, they are so bloody rich.
They come from a very important and very rich background.
And so then, oh, well, they pretend to be leftist and everything.
They are not.
They pretend to be tolerant and everything that they are not.
They pretend to be anti-racist.
And of course, I'm sorry, that was my cell phone.
And they are not.
Basically, they are some of the most racist, most intolerant, and most uninclusive people I've ever seen or talking.
Or anything they say is just so much full of poison and hate and some kind of anger.
It's just basically they are using some anger that they have.
Like, for example, I don't know, Zoe Quinn is a complete nut job.
I mean, everyone who has been on Facebook or wherever has seen Marjorie Nasrala.
I think I'm spelling that okay.
I'm sorry, I'm from Eastern Europe and my English is okay.
Don't worry about me.
Your English is great.
Because I was born in the States.
But the part is that that photograph, that woman, was saying about when she was going to take photos of Zoe Quinn for some other, I don't know, softcore porn or outborn.
Basically, some suicide girl stuff.
And of course, now the thing was that then Zoe Quinn was talking about how she stabbed a guy in the face who was trying to rape her and stuff like that.
So I'm just asking, okay, I've had some things that people around here, because I'm a part of a local goth community, so they like to talk, you know, talk behind your back and everything.
So they were talking some bad things about me.
And when I found out, I just confronted them and said, if you know all that, all those bad things about me, why don't you go and report that to the police?
So the same question could be applied to Zoe Quinn.
If she was being attacked by someone and if she stabbed him in the face in self-defense, then why the hell didn't she report that to local authorities, to the police?
What was she doing?
Talking shit, I think.
Yeah.
I really do.
I don't believe her for a second.
I think she's a natural born liar.
She's a woman in cheap clothing.
Don't believe her.
I've met people like her before.
Don't trust her.
But then I was like, what?
So that happened?
And like, everyone just dropped it.
And I was like, hey, why?
Let me just apply that to what Internet Resercat was saying is that we should go on defensive.
They make so many mistakes.
They shoot themselves in the heads.
They shoot themselves in the foots and feet, sorry, and so on and so on.
Yeah, but who's around to hold them to account?
None of them hold each other to account.
That's the thing.
They don't need to hold each other for account.
We should hold them for account.
We should also support them.
Because, for example, like there is, I don't know, Anita Sarkeesian saying that she was being harassed and that she reported that to the police and so on and so on.
And then there was Davis Rini, the guy who actually, his videos introduced me to the Gamergate and everything.
And he was just asking a local police representative or something I don't quite understand about their data, about if a native Sarkeesian did actually report any threats and so on.
And she did not.
So that just to address that, I think that later on the police station did actually get back to him and tell them that they did.
I think that it was just the person on the phone he was on the phone to.
Couldn't find anything at the time.
I think it did surface that she had reported something afterwards, just for the sake of accuracy.
No, just yeah, afterwards.
After she put her video and his video and so on.
Yeah, right.
Yeah, we can't prove that it wasn't.
Okay, so let's take that one out of the equation.
But let's take these things like Zoe Quinn did and like what John McIntosh is saying and the one who said that I wasn't following, who said that bullying should be reinstated or something.
Let's forget all of that.
Put that into something.
Yeah, Sam Biddle.
Now I'm looking at the chat.
Okay, thank you.
So let's just gather all of that.
And when we put that all together, can't we like just go to the national television or something, like trumpet that or something like 24-7?
If they are tweeting and spamming every single social media there is, honestly, then I agree with you.
I completely agree.
That's why I made that Listen and Believe video about the culture in gaming.
That sounded so much like 1984.
Exactly.
It's coming out of their fucking mouths.
And they are just, yeah, I'm biased.
I've got an agenda.
I don't care about you.
I'm a propagandist.
Fuck everyone else.
You know, all this sort of shit.
And it's just like, don't people outside of this listen to that and think they're crazy?
You know, but I guess they're just not that bothered.
Or, you know, I would love to continue attacking them, but what can we fucking do?
We've done it all.
They've given us all the ammunition we need, and we can't use it.
We need to keep it up and keep it constant.
That is the thing that will keep this movement actually alive and that will eventually disprove what Internet Desert said about Gamergate dying.
And furthermore, now let me go to Brianna Wu.
Okay, so let's talk about.
Well, I think that what we should actually do is wrap up there.
How about what I tweeted the forum, so why not go make a post on the forum about the subject?
Because then other people can discuss it with you without keeping everyone else waiting.
Okay, okay.
I'll just wrap it up with short things about them being completely authoritarian and totalitarian.
And that's the point about now you wouldn't need to know a Slavic language, but I would try to explain it completely now.
There is a word in our language which is Isto, which means the same, when someone is the same.
And that is almost as sounds like IST and fascist and communist and so on.
So basically the point is there's a joke when the World War II ended here in Eastern Europe and there was a line drawn between Yugoslavia and Italia.
And Yugoslavia, our former country, were here, became communist.
And Italia was still going through the radical process of de-fascification or something.
I don't know.
And the point is that so there are two guards on the side of each fence.
And the one is young at the other.
You're a communist, communist, communist.
And the other one is wearing, you're a fascist, fascist, fascist.
And the thing is that the only thing that's echoing in the mountains is that very word for the same.
Isto, isto, isto.
They're all the fucking same.
And they're all totalitarian.
They're leftists or whatever.
They're un-inclusion.
They're complete total racism.
They're a pretension of being so superior to everyone that they who represent all the black people or the transgender people or everyone.
That is actually their authoritarian positions.
We should also attack that as well.
Yeah, I attack their ideas without a doubt.
But the thing is, I think we've done it, but I think that if you can gain some advantage doing it, do it.
Argue the toss with them.
Make them feel stupid.
Because it's easy to make them feel stupid.
Calling Zoe Quinn her first name seems to make her freak out, which is funny as fuck.
You know, we're just saying hello, Chelsea.
No, someone should just, like, also make public of what she was doing.
Like, there's also another saying here that, let me just translate it.
Do you want to post it on the forum?
Yeah.
Yeah, we've got to move on, unfortunately.
Okay, no problem.
All right.
Take it easy, man.
Okay, thank you.
Bye-bye.
Bye.
Okay.
Matt is next.
Matt, are you there?
Can you hear me?
Sorry about the long way.
It was two Matts.
Which one was it, Kurt?
It was the Matt with the actual picture.
Okay, Matt with the actual picture.
Me, then.
Yes.
All right, nice.
So yeah, I've been listening to you guys this entire time.
And that's not the first time.
And now I know that the echo is not coming from me, so that's cool.
Are you guys still getting an echo?
Yeah, it's coming from you, Sargon.
Oh, is it?
Shit, sorry.
How about now?
That's not bad.
Yeah, that's better.
All right.
So I've been through Gamergate from the start to the end, and it has been insane.
Alright, the things we've seen with people that we have seen have just been mental.
It's crazy.
So what I just want to bring to the table is a little bit of an analysis from a guy that have the.
It's always awkward to mention, but like, I don't remember things pretty well.
But logical stuff, it goes haywire, okay?
So it's kind of crazy when I see these kind of insane people and how deep it goes.
So for you people who don't know, I'm Norwegian.
I live in Norway.
We are not feeling Gamergate at all.
It doesn't happen here.
No effect.
No footprint at all.
It's interesting.
Norway's quite progressive, isn't it?
Oh, yeah.
There's almost no athletes.
Are they anti-Gamergate or are they just indifferent entirely?
No, like we are so far beyond Gamergate and being that mentally screwed, we don't even detect it.
Like people are just using their common sense and I have probably never in my entire life met a social justice warrior in real life and I live in the city.
Like nothing of it at all.
And it's kind of interesting to see as well because the closest I would come to articles that were supposed to be fabricated regarding Gamergate in Norwegian, they're just like shitty students that are probably younger than me.
I'm 20 years old.
They probably just ripped it off of the wiki, which is completely corrupt, by the way.
And they have just used Google Translate to copy it.
And the cringy part is that the shitty errors when you do that are very apparent for me being Norwegian.
So I'm just taking, you know, you know, like England, so that's why I'm here.
No, that's a hell of a good thing to hear, because given Norway's proximity to Sweden, I do worry about it.
Yeah, we are still a little bit secluded.
And we've got a song that's literally called Swedish Retards in some kind of sense.
Yeah.
And the band is called Primavera, and it was hilarious.
And the Swedish people loved the song for some reason.
It's better.
Yeah.
It's a bit old, though.
Yeah, it's interesting.
Okay, well, thanks for coming on and telling us.
It's good to know.
Yeah, I actually have one more thing, but I'm not sure.
How pressed on time are you really?
Pretty pressed, to be honest.
Yeah, we're going to backlog.
You know what?
I don't think I'll save it for now.
I was going to dwell into some really, really proper stuff just to show off how absolutely uncorruptible Norwegian people are in this matter.
But I guess the common sense just is not as strong down there or whatever.
I guess it's not.
I'd be interested in reading it on the forum.
I know I'm pimping this forum.
I don't really have any connection to it or anything like that.
Other than I've just posted on it.
Well, I said my memory is shit, so you better send me some kind of link or Twitter.
I don't know.
I'll tweet again.
And if it's shit, tell me, guys.
I don't know.
I don't have time to look into it right now.
Well, should be fine.
Okay, cool.
Yeah, you guys, have a nice day.
Yeah, you too, man.
Take care.
Later.
Okay.
MC.
MC.
Hello.
MC Dumbledore.
Hello.
How's it going?
Yeah.
Hello.
Can you hear me?
Yeah, I can.
That's a lovely, lovely picture you have.
Oh, thank you.
I feel honored.
So, how are you?
Really well, thanks.
What would you like to tell everyone?
Well, there's currently this petition with about 46K of people who signed it, which wants to force Target and came out in Australia to withdraw the game GK5 because it's misogynistic.
They were successful.
It's already happened.
Yeah, everyone knows about it.
And the thing is really scary for me because I live in Germany and Germany and Australia are very similar with censorship and removing stuff like that, blood gore, all that.
And the thing is, it could become also a thing here in Germany, which, yeah, and what they're doing is just censorship.
It's bullshit.
You would think, you know, given the history of Germany, that would be something that the German people would be very, very skeptical of, the idea of censoring like that, because that sort of thing leads you down the wrong path, doesn't it?
Yeah, but the thing is, you, well, not everybody might know it, but censorship still exists, maybe not in the form of what happened before, but there's still censorship and freedom of speech partly, especially from the right side, from the extremists.
But that's not the topic now, but the thing is, what those SJWs are doing is the same thing what censorship.
The censorship in, well, the thing is, it could easily spread.
The thing is, Australia and Germany are pretty much similar.
They're almost the same with the age rating and all that stuff.
The thing is, also, Germany's currently, Merkel, female prime minister, is pretty left, I would say.
And the thing is, she well, not she directly, but the Commission, the USK, which is dealing with censorship of video games, well, the Goa stuff like that.
The thing is, there is uh they even want to redecide about games like GKA five being even published in Germany.
And I think this could well this petition could be also a factor in that happening.
I've got no doubt that it'll be used as a precedent down the line.
That's my biggest problem with it.
I mean, Grand Theft also doesn't need to be sold in Target.
They don't need it, but it's the principle of the thing, you know.
Yeah.
Exactly that.
Was there anything else you wanted to say, mate?
Pardon?
Was there anything else you wanted to tell everyone?
Pardon?
I can't hear you because my internet is acting up.
Well, should we wrap it up there then?
I just wanted to share this.
Thanks for coming on.
I think it's very important that I didn't realise how close to Australia's laws, Germany's laws were, and I didn't realize they were considering doing the same thing.
It's pretty shitty.
It's really stupid.
I agree.
I agree.
I think it's fucking shitty.
Thanks for coming on, man.
Yeah, I'm a huge fan.
Thank you for having me there.
Thanks.
Anytime, honestly.
Take care.
Bye.
Who's next, Kirbs?
Okay, next is it going?
Sargon of Akkad, my bro.
I cannot tell you how long I have waited to talk to you.
I've been trying to talk to you for the better part of three months, as a matter of fact.
I just combination of not having enough time and other things I haven't been able to talk to you.
So I have a couple things I'm going to touch on.
But the first biggest thing, you had Tato on earlier.
This is the first time that you've had two people that are from any of the Gamergate IRCs on your stream, myself and Tato.
And I will say this about the IRCs, Burgers and Fries and the other one, the other big one, which is Gamergate.me.
Every major operation, you were asking, like, where does Operation Baby Seal?
Where do these things come from?
That is where everything starts.
From there, we go out onto HN, we go out onto Twitter, we go out onto other sites.
But the beating heart of Gamergate right now are those IRC channels and, of course, the HN board/slash Gamergate.
So we would very much like to see some of you guys quote-unquote e-cellips.
We would like to see those IRCs.
If you really want to get a lot more insight into some of the things that's going on, I would say definitely try to drop in, try to spend some time in some of these IRCs.
We'd love to have you guys.
That's a great idea.
I actually, just before you came on, just retweeted the problem.
I mean, it's more that I don't know that these things exist than anything else that I don't.
Yeah, that's our fault.
People in the IRC quickly, then.
Tell us about the timber of the character and what the people in there are trying to achieve and what they consider themselves to be like on the whole.
Pretty much most of the people that are in the IRCs are the largest contributors in Gamergates.
People like Drybones and others are in there.
All of the primary archive operations where we're out going, you know, trying to archive people's tweets, trying to catch people and things like things like the stuff that Full Macintosh, things like things that these people say, where we catch it, where we archive it, where we write stories about it.
Because we actually have our own gaming press now, obviously Gamergate.me, and we're working on several of your sites right now.
All of that goes on in there, essentially.
So new digging operations.
We have a really big thing going on right now.
We're looking into IGDA and some of their financial connections, and actually there's a lot of – I think everyone is going to be pleasantly surprised.
We have found some very, very interesting connections between them and some other nefarious organizations.
and so that would be coming out in a few days on Gamergate.me.
That's fucking awesome, because I really, really want...
IDGA is the one with the block bot, right?
Yes, sir.
Yeah, fuck those guys.
I want to see the dirt on them.
But one thing, can I make a request?
Because a lot of the time I get people coming to me with, I get people coming to me with information, and I have to explain to them that I'm not a journalist.
I don't break news stories.
Of course.
I don't do that.
I'm just one guy with a YouTube channel.
On my YouTube channel is my job.
So I can't break news stories that people might go, oh, that's slanderous and libelous.
All I can do is comment or report on things that other people have done.
So if you want me to be able to use it, write a blog post somewhere.
Just find WordPress or something cheap or whatever.
Just write a blog post, put all the information out, put your sources out as you would have normally, and then twice it happened or just send it around the game, get hashtag or whatever, because then I can use it because that's a source that I'm referring to.
I'm not breaking any news.
Right.
Yeah, you're not just breaking it.
Yeah, we can definitely do that.
What we're working on right now is GamerGate.me, obviously, is probably the big one where we would be doing things like that.
And we're working on better articles that have a lot more sources in them, that have a lot more, basically substance in them.
So that way you can quote it and be like, oh, well, this isn't, you know, just because it's on GamerGate.me doesn't mean it's baseless.
Like it will have all that stuff in it.
So yeah, we're definitely working on that.
But yeah, you asked about the character of the people in IRC.
Honestly, it's like a brotherhood, man.
It is absolutely, everyone there is 100% dedicated to this thing.
A lot of us don't sleep sometimes for days.
I haven't slept, but maybe 10 hours in the last four days because of some of the things that have been going on.
These guys are real dedicated heroes, right?
Yes, that's absolutely right.
And that's one of the big things that Tato was hitting on, sort of the disconnect between e-celebs.
Every time there's been e-celeb drama, we've had to deal with a lot of, not in IRC, but on mediums like HN, a lot of infighting and stuff.
And in fact, I will say one thing on this.
When IA left, the damage that did was pretty bad.
It was worse than a lot of people think.
A lot of the threads that we have dedicated to email campaigns and digging campaigns and stuff like that ground to a halt because people were arguing over that incident.
And so I actually have started making my own videos and holding my own streams similar to this one we use Google Talks.
And I had one last night in which I pointed out one thing that I would like to say again.
To all A-celebs out there, if any of you guys get frustrated at some point and you want to leave like IA did, that's absolutely your right.
But please, please, for those of us who have put half of our lives, it seems like, into this thing, don't throw up your hands and say, oh, the movement is shit.
Oh, it's this.
Oh, it's that.
On the way out.
Please, please don't do that.
And don't do what King of Pole has been doing lately.
That kind of stuff causes so much derailment.
You have no idea how damaging that can be.
So the one thing I could ask is please, if you yourselves are decided to leave at some point, God forbid, because I think you're the best.
Of all of them, I think you're the classiest, most professional one.
I have to say that.
But if any of you guys decide to leave at some point, please don't turn around and say, oh, this is wrong with it.
That's wrong with it.
I mean, I respect his point that we need to be on the attack more.
That's true.
But some of the other things he said were very damaging.
And I would ask, please don't do that again.
But I did want to hit on some real subject matter, I guess.
Big thing.
I put this link up here.
Yes, sir.
Link me a forum post that I can retweet or something.
Absolutely.
Just because the amount of people we've got waiting.
Yeah, I definitely see that.
I'm going to go ahead and just get this really quick.
So obviously, there was a lot of drama in the past 48 hours regarding the A Chan board slash GG.
It changed hands, and then basically everybody fucking left and went to a new board.
And then the BuzzFeed had the audacity to come out with this article today where they were like, Gamergate's troll headquarters got destroyed, basically.
Pretty hilarious.
It didn't get destroyed.
Everybody just migrated to a new board.
But the reason why this is relevant, something really cool happened.
Between some of the infighting, some of the other things that have been going on, a lot of our major campaigns had slowed down over the past couple weeks or so.
With the creation of this new board, everything's like a magic button.
We are running hotter and faster with more new people coming in than since the beginning of the movement, basically.
The beginning of the whole thing.
Fucking up.
What's the new board?
The new board is, I'm going to put it in the chat here.
That's the new board.
That's where everybody's at right now on Achan.
And since that board went up, we had people who had pretty much anybody that had become disenchanted with Gamergate for whatever reason.
Just for the people listening, it's just slash Gamergate slash.
Yes, that's correct.
That is the new board.
And everybody that had become disenchanted with things or the way things were going, you know, the accusations of tone policing and other things, everybody came back.
We've had people from Paul, we've had people from V, we've had people from K, we've had people from 4chan that never had any interest in Gamer.
More people coming over from 4chan.
So it's been really a renaissance in the last 48 hours.
That's partly why I haven't slept.
It's been very, very busy.
But everything's fired up again.
All of our email campaigns, new operations, new digging, everything is fired up.
It is an absolute hub of activity.
It actually was the top board on Achan a while ago, I think a couple days ago when it first went up.
And Hobiels actually tweeted about it at infinitechan.co.
He tweeted about it and pointed out that it was the fastest, I think it's the fastest any board has risen on that site ever from the time that it went up to the time that people migrated to it.
It pretty much went to the top of the board list within two hours, the first two hours of being up, and it's stayed there since.
So there is an absolute hub of activity there.
If anybody wants to get in on a lot of the new stuff that's going on, go there, go to the IRCs.
It's a really good thing.
So for anybody who's been feeling that Gamergate was slowing down or decaying or any of that, that was maybe true a couple days ago, but we are absolutely running hot right now.
Everything is back.
Gamergate is alive and well and is getting to be fast, getting to be bigger than it has ever been before.
I just want to put something to you, Zan.
I don't think if somebody actually leaves, they should be completely silent on why they're doing so.
I don't think, you know, because that just lacks introspection.
If they see some problems with the movement, they should definitely have the ability to call them out.
If that's how they feel, we shouldn't censor people.
I do agree, but the flip side to that is that there's a difference between legitimate criticism.
And I'm not saying that Internet Aristocrat didn't have legitimate criticism.
He absolutely did.
And trying to burn the place out and ending on a fucking Hitler quote.
Come on, Jim, you dick.
Yeah, I can see the damage that was fucking selfish, man.
You know, you know it, you twat.
What pissed me off, though, is I don't fucking not like him.
It's just that, you know, oh, you're a dick, man.
It hurt me a lot when that happened because I was somebody that really inspired me to do a lot of this work.
I've only just now started making my own YouTube streams and started talking, you know, and actually speaking out.
But between you and him, that was my inspiration to do more than just the behind-the-scenes stuff and actually come out into the open and start talking about this stuff.
Okay, man.
Well, how about it?
Yeah, yeah, we're after that.
Tweet me like a board post or a YouTube channel or something.
I'll retweet it.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
Appreciate you having me on.
It was great.
Not a problem.
Thanks for coming on.
Really appreciate it.
And you guys, you really are the unsung heroes.
So, you know, don't get discouraged.
And we're sorry that we don't give you enough attention.
I'm sure we all are.
But yeah, great.
Thanks a lot, man.
Thanks a lot.
I appreciate it.
No problem.
Okay.
James is next up.
Hello, James.
He was there.
Okay.
Well, who's next?
And we'll get back to James.
Okay.
Next should be Nick.
Nick, are you there?
And we're still getting a bit of echo from you as well.
Sorry.
Okay, how about now?
That's okay.
Well.
Hello, Nick.
What isn't it?
You're up, Maves.
How's it going?
Can you hear me?
Yep.
Are you guys getting echo from me?
I'll try and fuck around with some more.
Your actual voice output now has gone completely crap.
Can you not hear me?
I can hear you now, but there is echo.
Right, okay.
I'll grab my headphones.
Yeah, sorry, you carry on, mate, and I'll grab the headphones.
No problem.
You're right, Nick.
Yeah, how's it going?
Not too bad.
What would you like to talk about?
Really, I've just got a load of shit that I want to spill out about Gamergate that I've been wanting to get out for a while.
Okay.
And I basically got no evidence for it.
I'm just pulling it straight out of my own ass, and I only represent myself.
So here we go.
No problem.
All right.
So basically, what I've been thinking is like this whole SJW culture has become a kind of thing where they're sort of becoming the useful idiots of online censorship, really.
And well, I kind of think of it more as SJW, I don't like that kind of term as much as a more sort of victim-based communitarianism, that sort of thing.
It makes more sense to me.
And basically, really, I think the media are kind of rolling with it.
They're rolling with these kind of SJWs to a large extent.
And I think you can understand that a bit more when you sort of realize that it kind of plays into the whole thing of online anonymity and the whole attack on online anonymity, really.
And I think that argument and that discussion is worth having.
But while it's sort of frameworked in a kind of misogynistic kind of way, and they just concentrate on that, and they don't concentrate on the sort of just general dicks online, then it's always going to kind of be a fruitless and pointless argument.
And it's going to involve this kind of type of culture.
No, I can.
I understand.
I mean, the quote-unquote social justice warriors, which I really hate that sort of term, I mean, a lot of the people that came out in favour or anti-Gamergate, as I've said previously, have had a lot of fire from political correctness, from like Joss Whedon to anybody, basically.
And it's just a real sort of easy political sort of scoring system, you know, for people to redeem their careers or just to be on the side of moral, you know, to be on the side of morality, basically.
So Any impropriety can be just brushed aside by joining with the vocal majority that want to sort of silence any sort of criticism.
I mean, is that what you're trying to sort of intimate there?
Well, no, I totally see where you're coming from there.
They're basically gomping, aren't they?
They're basically letting everybody know that they're this good open-minded person who's trendy and with it and progressive and whatnot.
But I think there's a definite sort of academic undercurrent under this, and there's a political undercurrent under this.
Especially when you consider that online gaming culture is kind of like a seen as a bit of a problem for power structures.
Anything that has a sort of free exchange of ideas.
I mean, when you look at things like Anonymous and Occupy and the sort of boards on 4chan and Reddit, they're all kind of very deeply mixed up with gaming and online culture.
It's all very much the same thing.
It's like online culture is almost like indistinguishable from gaming culture.
Yeah, it's very anarchic and you know, you know, just and I think that's what they, that was, that's what they fear sometimes basically is just like yeah, I guess I guess what you're saying with the, you know, the freedom of expression, the freedom of opinion, it's they are genuinely afraid because it, it it does call into question the power structures that exist, you know, outside of the, the internet, and they're trying to police it, and they have been, you know for,
with SOPA in the United States, and there are lots of bills that have actually, you know, come to the floor in the UK that have failed, you know, due to the House OF Lords.
Thank fuck for those peers, you know, those old bastards who have a better understanding than, it seems, than their younger contemporaries.
So yeah, I can definitely, definitely see some of the, some of the arguments that you are saying.
Yeah, I mean, it's to me like what's at the root of the whole kind of thing is that they're treating a large and really miscellaneous and diverse group of people as homogenous, as the same sort of thing and and that sort of thinking is, you know it, it's.
History is littered with fucking terrible examples of shit like that, where people have thought like that, and terrible things have happened afterwards and I'm not trying to be like overdramatic about it, you know, but still it's it's shoddy thinking.
No, it is indeed.
I don't know if Sargon's back yet has he got his headset, which I don't know if he wanted to.
But what about sort of trying to separate sort of politics though, from because a lot of the argument at the moment is that people want to separate politics from gaming?
Do you think that that's achievable or?
Well, I think it is.
I mean, the thing is though, it's interesting to me because gamers are kind of the most progressive bunch out there.
I mean, they're the, you know, they're the young demographic, they're the most progressive demographic there are, they're the most multicultural demographic there are and, as well as that, like you know, online gaming you mix with everybody from around the world, and so, of course, there are clashes, but you know there's it's a it's also a really level playing field in terms of the sexes and everything like that.
You know, anonymity is completely and utterly optional and you're on a level playing field.
There's no difference from anybody else in terms of you know what you're doing, what you're playing, you know it's it.
Gaming should be seen as like a champion of fucking.
You know everything that they're for and it seems really odd that they're singling out and attacking gaming.
Oh, sounds like Sargon's back.
Sorry, you're a bit quiet okay, I want to get my through some sort of wrong microphone.
Sorry, okay.
Can you hear me now?
Yep, it's a little bit more quiet.
Well no sorry, it's a little bit quiet, but it's getting better.
Sorry, okay.
Um, I'm probably using the wrong microphone, It's okay.
It's okay.
That would do.
Yeah, okay.
Yeah, I think I'm using the head set microphone now.
Sorry, everyone.
I'll fuck around my equipment.
Yeah, I just want to say I actually really reject the accusations of misogyny in all forms.
I don't see anyone hating on, you know, Zoe Queen Brana, who's any Sarkeesian because they're female.
It's that's not the case at all.
It's because they're twans.
This is the problem.
And twants can come in any gender, any race, any shape or size.
It's nothing to do with hatred of women.
It's everything to do with the fact that these individual people are dickheads.
At least that's what's in my opinion, isn't it?
Well, absolutely.
I mean, you only have to go on David Cameron's Twitter or Piers Morgan's Twitter to see that any given fucking Sunday.
And you'll see them getting the shit trolled out of them for the most basic innocuous things that they're tweeting.
And so it's everybody.
Everybody gets it online.
And you just, you know, you have the balls to just put up with it and ignore the dickheads and engage with people that you like to engage with.
If you're a normal person.
Completely wrong.
I'm just working on my microphone, guys.
Sorry.
I don't know what the fuck I've done.
Is that any better?
It's a little bit better, but one second.
You guys carry on and I'll probably carry on waffling.
Do you have the control room?
You can basically boost your.
If it's not any better, fuck.
It does work.
Let me just try one more time.
I'll keep fucking around.
No problem.
Is there anything else that you want to add there at all?
Yeah, basically, I want to just add is I'm a bit of an old geezer with all this, really, but I have been sort of around from the start of it.
And I just want to just sort of express my gratitude to all of GameGate, everybody involved, and all the Easter legs that kind of helped kicked it off and sustain it, really.
Because it's been a fucking breath of fresh air, and you wouldn't believe the kind of progress and the sort of pushback that Gamergate's done.
And whether they know it or not, they're laying a foundation for the pushback for the coming attack on online anonymity and all these kind of things that I'm pretty sure are on the way.
I agree.
I agree.
Ah, I'm back, aren't I?
Yeah, you're about it.
Yeah, I've got the right microphone working now.
Sorry about all that, guys.
Yeah, I agree.
I think it probably is.
But we should probably wrap it up there and move on to the next person, shouldn't we?
Thanks a lot, guys.
But anyway, see you later.
Thanks for coming on, man.
I really appreciate it.
No problem.
I think James's mic is now working.
James, how's it going?
Well, we all have microphone problems, James.
Okay, we'll go for the next person, then James can go after if you can get it.
Yeah, which will be Lol's God.
Hello, Lolzgard.
Sorry for the long wait.
How's it going, guys?
Really good, man.
How are you?
I'm pretty good.
I'm a big fan of your video, Sargon, so it's an honor to talk to you.
Don't worry about it.
But yeah, I'm right now in college and I've just started that.
And it's really interesting to see the effect of this social justice warrior movement in not just gaming culture, but in everything.
Because you can't even really walk around the campus without seeing signs of it's time to stop saying boys will be boys and it's time to stop excusing men from doing things.
And there's no self-awareness to it.
And it's really blatantly obvious that it's like targeting guys only.
There's no mention of women in these situations.
Yeah, it's men that need to be held accountable for their actions.
Yeah.
And, you know, people were saying earlier that they've never seen social justice warriors in real life.
And, you know, I was the same way to that too.
But then I started, then I actually have started to run into people that I know personally that think this way.
And not about, you know, about Gamergate and all this kind of thing.
And I just, It's kind of a scary way of thinking to me because these are people that, not just with Gamergate, but with anything, just won't do the five minutes of research to actually understand what they're talking about.
And like, I yesterday I had a conversation with a friend who basically told me that, you know, even though I said that Gamergate was all about, you know, ethics and journalism, and I explained, you know, the backstory to it, she basically was like, well, video games are sexist, so you're, you know, talking about that is invalid.
And it's like that kind of logic that's really driving a lot of things.
And in the United States right now, it's definitely showing through with stuff like Gamergate.
And I definitely.
That's the self-censorship, isn't it?
That's the self-censorship right there.
It's like, oh, I don't think I don't want to talk about it.
It's invalid.
It's like, yeah, there are no invalid topics.
There might be stupid topics, but there are no invalid ones.
It's definitely showing up with a lot of different things, too.
Like for anybody in the U.S., this incident in Ferguson, Missouri that's been occurring, on both sides of whether you agree with what happened to this police officer or not.
Both sides are just refusing to acknowledge anything that the other side has to say and just getting angry.
And it's just a really scary way to go about it.
And it just seems that the other side can say that they know what their opponent's motivations are.
I always find that very suspect when people start doing that.
And I know I'm guilty of doing it myself.
I know I am.
But I really am trying to believe them when they tell me that they're biased and they have an agenda.
If that's what they're saying and that's what they're saying to each other, I believe that they're telling the truth.
I don't think that there's any need to give them the benefit of the doubt that they are actually sane.
Yeah, I agree entirely.
Like with this girl that I had a conversation with in specific, she originally kind of started as very well thought out.
And I hate to say this because it sounds very derogatory, but she just kind of turned into a Tumblr social justice lawyer kind of thing.
And she just kind of started saying, you know, when I brought up the, like someone talked about it earlier, the banning of, or yeah, the banning of GTA 5 in Australia.
She basically started talking about how, you know, oh, well, you know, games like that do need to be banned.
And then we, and me and a friend of mine eventually were like, whoa, whoa, whoa, you can't censor how someone thinks just because you don't like it.
And then she was like, okay, that's true, but we need to put trigger warnings for sexism and sexual assault on games like this.
And then we spent another like, you know, 15 minutes explaining to like her begrudgingly refusing to budge on the issue to say that even if that was something to occur, nobody in their right mind would put a label on their game saying that it's sexist.
Like that is social and like economic suicide.
We were basically talking about how we should let the market dictate whether certain ideas and games should exist.
And, you know, if these people who are anti-Gamergate are going to talk about how things like, you know, Mario Saving Peach is sexist, then I, you know, or how unrealistic bodies in video games offend them.
I'd love to, for them to, you know, show the people who they're against what they mean.
Like to make a game that represents what they want to see in gaming as opposed to telling other people what they're playing or watching or doing is not right and that they need to change it to fit these people's type of perspective.
I agree.
I don't think that they should have any right to enforce their views on anyone else.
And I do think that the free market should be the one that the thing that decides whether an idea is a good and popular one.
Yeah, and the worst part about it was when I was talking to her about things like that, she was trying to make a lot of implications about my personality based on how I disagree with her on a point.
Like, I think I said something to the extent of, you know, you can't censor a game like GTA because you don't agree with its views.
And she said, oh, well, you're for the objectification of women and things.
I said, I never said that.
You're putting these words in my mouth.
I thought that came out of your mouth.
Yeah.
Yeah, you're accusing me of these things.
And I think that it's also really sad just the bad representation that Gamergate has in just any form of media out there.
Like you go on the news and you see people like Anita Sarkeesian showing up or these kind of people showing up and saying their piece, but you never have someone from Gamergate to represent.
I actually find it's an interesting thing.
The people I've spoken to outside of it who aren't gamers don't give a fuck.
They just don't care.
Majority of people don't care.
Yeah, and they've already got their impression of what gamers are.
And generally in their mind, gamers are just, you know, in their mind, they probably think of them as losers and just dismissive.
They're like, well, who cares?
Let them play their stupid video games.
They're not hurting anyone.
They're just sitting alone playing video games by themselves, you know, like Lisschitz would say.
And so, you know, on the whole, they generally don't care.
So I don't really think they're actually doing the damage that they think they're doing to the reputation of gamers as a whole.
Because for people who aren't gamers and who don't care about gaming, which is most people, it can't get much worse.
You can say anything that's like, yeah, whatever, whatever.
We just don't care.
So I don't think it's as bad as people think, you know.
Yeah.
I definitely think that there are a few places that we can clear things up with all that.
I'm looking right now.
I looked at it the other day and I'm looking at right now the Gamergate controversy Wikipedia page.
It talks a lot about just harassment on these people and it doesn't really focus on the objective of the movement.
And I think that if someone was able to go in and, you know, rewrite this a little more non-biasedly, you can equally represent both sides of what they're saying.
But I feel like right now...
It would be the party by the feminists, though, didn't it?
Oh, no, yeah.
It's just like majority of it is just going on.
There's a big section going on about how people are harassing people like Anita Sarkeesian.
And it's not even talking about the fact that a lot of these, there's been some of these, not with Anita Sarkeesian specifically, but there's been a lot of these threats that people have issued that have been proven to either be not true or fabricated, even made by the person who's saying they're getting threatened to add to this.
And it's just, you know, it's not a very good representation of it.
Yeah, no, I agree.
I agree.
But thanks a lot for coming on, man.
Thanks a lot for sharing.
Yeah, yeah.
Thanks for having me.
No, anytime.
Seriously, anytime.
Thanks very much.
Yeah.
You guys have good rest of your night or whatever time of day it is there.
Yeah, you will be.
Thanks a lot.
Come on, man.
We've got a.
Oh, sorry.
Sorry.
No, no, what were you going to say?
No, no, you go first.
I was going to say that should we stop taking people onto the stream now?
Because you needed to go about midnight, didn't you?
Yeah, that's right.
I was just going to say, I have done stop doing that.
And coming up to the last 40 minutes or so.
Okay.
I noticed that Monday Matt's here.
Did he come through the queuing system?
He did come through the queuing system.
Didn't get any celebrity fucking special privileges.
No, no, no, no.
Thank you.
I'm a plebe like the rest of you guys.
Okay.
I wait in line.
I wait my turn.
Good.
I was going to say, do you want to wait till the end?
Because when Kirbs goes, we can shoot the shit and talk about stuff if you want.
Absolutely.
Yeah, I'll kick it till the end.
You guys do your thing.
Yeah, so everyone else, because they've all been waiting, and you get to go on loads of streams.
Who's next then?
It's Lord and then Skygear after that.
Hey, Lord Kiblington, how's it going?
Good.
Doing good.
Not completely out of my face like I was last time.
That's why I ended up kind of being just like a babbling moron.
I do recall some kind of babbling moron.
I'm going to assume it was you.
Yeah, it was the one, I believe it was like a green hour.
Anyway, I'm wasting some time here.
I was also saying, like, last time, I had no idea who the hell you were.
So like after I started watching your videos, I was like, oh shit, this guy's onto stuff.
And also, I remember the last one about the Rape Culture UK.
I watched that and you citing those things about rape statistics did help me out with an argument, and I ended up just getting nothing but flack from a social justice warrior then sending their fucking entire horde at me.
One of them just came to me and just like, yeah, this idiot just went and gave me this ultimatum saying, go attack you or can't be friends.
And it was, whoa, well, okay, fuck off.
You ain't my friend anymore.
You're a dick.
So they're actually actively encouraging, well, that person was actually encouraging a cyber mob, a harassment campaign against you.
And it's actually hilarious.
It is, isn't it?
I had the same thing happen with Pixie Jenny.
She encouraged a cyber mob against me, and it was just, oh my god, do you people think I'm actually going to get PTSD from Twitter?
I think that they honestly thought it was going to have an effect.
I know, but yeah, as I was saying, like in the little private chat here, I've got a good story about being harassed in real life over this.
Oh, I didn't get time to tell in the last story.
How it goes is I was in a supermarket, which I can't name because we had an agreement with a manager to not press charges.
But right, I was in a supermarket, she'll remain unnamed.
I was with some of my friends, just buying some stuff, and I was talking about Gamergate out loud.
And I mentioned I was in favour of it.
And then this person, a social justice warrior, just happened to be transsexual as well.
That will become important later.
I will explain in a bit.
They overheard it and decided, right, they want to go take me down a few pegs.
So they start speaking with mutual friends who work there as well, and they know that I ran friends with them.
So they find my Reddit account, which is now deleted.
So they start digging through all of my Reddit account and then find links to me talking about BDSM and whatnot.
So they then equate that BDSM equals rape.
So, you know, it's going to get good.
I'm sure that there is a quite large community there that's probably going to disagree with that notion.
Oh, yeah, I can pretty much tell you all of them do.
Yeah, there is professional.
There's a goddamn safe word in there.
Yeah.
That's absurd.
Real rape and rape play.
Right, but anyway, so a few days later, I go back to the store because I decided I want to go get some booze because it was Friday night.
I just happened to go to the checkup that they're serving.
They reject my ID because it's got like my new female name on it, but it's still got my old picture on it.
And to be honest, I look like a freaking murderer on that.
Seriously, it's not my words.
This is how people have described it.
You look like a murderer who's just out of prison.
I believe you.
Not a fine.
Right, so they rejected the ID and I was like, well, you know, it's legit.
Go get your manager.
So if a manager comes around and looks at it, it's like, yeah, this is legit.
Turns to, I was like, well, I expected you, of all people, would have known that this is a legit ID.
And you could just see they're getting really angry now.
Because one, they didn't get to deny me.
And two, I'm now being challenged by their manager.
And what did they do?
They screamed, well, I won't serve a rapist.
Exactly.
I'm just like, wait, what the fuck?
What the hell is wrong with you?
Then they spill the beans about digging through my personal information.
And the manager is just like, alright, stop right there.
I've had enough complaints from people about you.
Now I've got concrete evidence that you've been harassing and stalking customers.
Walk out, empty your locker, and never come back.
Well, I hope that story isn't complete bullshit, man.
Oh, I wish it was, but it's too funny not to be bullshit.
It's just, I can't believe it actually happened.
I thought these people this psychopathic were not real.
I thought they only existed in Southern California.
You would think that they would be able to sort of understand when they're in a position where they're not able to enforce this kind of psychotic opinion.
Yeah, but the thing is they expected the anti-discrimination law to protect them.
It doesn't protect you when you're trying to discriminate someone of the exact same minority as you.
Especially when you've been stalking and harassing them to their face, to your manager's face.
Yeah, and I was saying that they went and dug through all of their personal information.
And I was just like, wow, what an idiot.
Well, it wasn't just public information.
If it's stuff you've personally put on the internet, then technically that's not illegal.
If you find it, you can find it.
And speaking of that, the stuff that I'm saying that on this website, most pictures, I think I might legally have to take them down because of that stupid law that came into effect on Monday.
Thing is, taking sexual pictures.
It's just trying out outfits, which I won't speak anymore about.
No, no, that's fine.
I'm not in any...
It's outright illegal now for your safety.
I absolutely fucking hate that.
Honestly, I can't believe this has happened.
And it's not because it affects me or anything.
It's just fucking wrong.
And it pisses me off that these goddamn New Age Puritans are somehow fucking calling the shots.
Oh, ban things together.
Old man who's seen a few photos of some kinky porn.
Eww, ban it all.
It's probably their wives who've seen their husbands looking at it, felt insecure.
Yeah, exactly.
I've got to ruin this for everyone now.
No, piss off.
But speaking of that, that brings me up another point.
This isn't quite related to Gamergate, so if you want me to shut up about it, I will.
Yeah, do you mind if we don't?
Because we've seen people in the queue.
Okay, I'll bring up some things that are actually related.
I know that we've talked about the Target in Australia banning, well, just removing GTA 5 from Mrs. Shelton.
That looks like it's going to be one domino going down.
And the social justice world see that as a success.
Honestly, I see that as there's going to be a big backlash quite soon.
Yeah, I agree.
The whole public are seeing that we're starting to take things off the shelves.
People have played Grand Theft Auto for years and years.
Maybe not GTA 5, but it's been there.
GTA has been all around for ages and ages.
I think what I might do is ask people towards the end of the year to tweet me basically every stupid or offensive thing that they've seen feminists do, and I might compile it into a this year and feminism video.
Just all of the absolutely retarded or totalitarian things that they've been doing.
Just to put it in context for everyone.
Look, each individual one isn't so bad.
and they might be bad, but they're not like the end of the world.
But when you put it together, it really gives you just the...
It just shows you how mad they are.
It just shows you how mad they are.
You can see.
You can't even see.
It's fucking...
But yeah, anyway, I think we'd probably better wrap that up.
One more thing to speak about regarding one literally who and them accusing Gamergate of poisoning their dog.
Yeah, if anyone didn't see this.
Brianna accused Gamergate of poisoning her dog.
I don't think it was actually Brian at Will.
I think it was someone called Sam who has been tweeting at me a lot recently.
She said that her dog has either got something wrong with it or has been poisoned.
And this sound guy was like, oh, well, that'll be Gamergate or something like that.
And I was just like, okay, yeah, just one.
Why the fuck not?
Gamergate caused the extinction of the dinosaurs as well, if I recall correctly.
Oh, yeah, so.
Yeah, but yeah, basically it was stupid, wasn't it?
Oh, yeah, without a doubt.
Yeah, thanks for coming on, man.
You as well.
But seriously, she needs to get some serious goddamn mental help.
It's getting quite scary.
I'm worried.
I am genuinely worried about it.
I don't give a shit about her ideologies, but she needs help.
She looks sad and desperate, doesn't she?
You know?
Well, Gamergate, please leave me alone so I can treat my dogs.
Put down the iPhone.
Leave me alone.
Well, I'm sitting there.
Keep giving me attention so I can get my Patreon box.
Yeah.
Anyway, man, nice one.
Take it easy.
Cheerier, bye, all yes.
Cool.
I believe James, is it James?
Yeah, James Shells.
You back?
I'm guessing not.
Damn it, James.
Get your equipment together.
Who's next?
It was Sky Gear and then Action.
Okay, Sky Gear.
How's it going?
Hello?
Hello?
Well, first, sorry for my English.
That's okay.
The spaghetti.
I want to talk...
Ah!
Hello?
Hello?
Hello, yeah.
Sorry.
Sorry, sorry, sorry.
Yes.
I don't know if someone talked about this, but about the people that see Kim that are in Gamergate for just the SGW and those people that are in Gamergate pure for the ethical aspect of game.
Sorry, I don't know if I kind of missed that.
Can you just say that again, please?
Sorry.
You can hear me now?
Yeah, I can hear you much better now.
No, is someone talk about the I don't know if concern about the people who just in Gamergate for the SGW stuff and people that are just for the ethics gaming stuff.
And I see some people saying that it's not okay to center on one or the other, just one or other.
I don't know.
Sorry.
It's okay.
Sorry.
Well, I want to say I have a point of view about that because I'm Gamergate basically most for the SGW.
I really worry about how they want to control pretty much the media, how they want to control all the conversation.
The censor aspect.
I hate that.
I think it's a really legitimate concern.
Are you concerned about the ethical side at all, or do you not bothered about that one?
No, no, no, no.
I think it's the most important fight that Gamergate had.
If you want to fight the censorship, if you want to fight this ideology, you need a fair plane.
Right now, we don't have a fair plane because all journalists are corrupted and colluding with these people.
So the fight is almost like a big boss.
They have a shield.
And right now we are tearing down the shield first to expose the eye policy, the weak point of the boss.
I definitely think that the social justice culture that they swim in is a major problem.
It is also a weakness, I think.
That was what you were trying to say, yeah?
Yeah, because if you have a dialogue with those people, I believe that if you sit down and talk with those people, they just will ruin their soul.
They have no point.
They have no subjective.
They have no facts to back what they are saying.
They pretty much are racist, white racists, heterosexual racists, are pretty much abigots.
And people see that.
I agree.
I agree.
But I think this really important right now to have the fair plane.
The fighting for For the ethics in game journalism, if someone is worried about that, because I don't know, I worry sometimes that people just focus too much in SJW stuff, SJW stuff, and yes, it's important to laugh to get some lows of that, but if we don't focus on having a better ethics and game journalism,
we cannot fight them because they control right now the narrative.
Yeah, yeah.
I think basically it's just important to keep doing what we're doing.
I think we're fully into the grind at the moment.
I think everyone's aware.
This is where we actually get our metal tested, you know?
Yeah.
Now, I don't know if it was that why internalists could go out of Gamergate, but I think they actually think the game journalist problem was not important.
It was just the Tumblr SGW stuff, the only important thing.
And I think there are people that think that way.
I agree.
I think that everyone's entitled to have their own reasons for being a part of GameGate.
And I don't think anyone should be castigated or ostracized for those at all.
The thing is, they're all legitimate concerns.
If you look at that breakdown, the pie chart, if you look at them, there isn't anything on there that I'm not concerned with.
So, you know, I don't even know which one is my primary concern.
It probably depends on the context that I'm currently dealing with it.
But yeah, was there anything else you wanted to say, mate?
Ah, yeah.
There is a game site called alternative.gamergate.comity that have the all alternative sites that was going around.
Also, have some YouTubers are considered neutral or good or good, like Total Disk and Boogie, Broad Peels, and that.
I don't know.
If people want to check that out.
Yeah, what was that again?
If you want to tweet me, I'll retweet it.
What was the name of it?
Alternative GermanGate.community.
I will put in the chat.
Give me a second.
Yeah, okay, put it in the chat and I'll tweet it out.
Here.
Okay.
Well.
Alternative.
Yeah, okay, I'll tweet that.
Everyone keep fighting.
Keep fighting the corruption and the stupidity of JWs.
I really think that it's a long ride to fight that out.
To fight for that.
Okay, thanks very much for coming on, man.
Thank you.
Not a problem.
Take care.
Who was next?
It was action that was next.
Action Bastard.
Love the name.
What?
What?
You sound like a Dalek who smokes a lot.
It sounds like the lizard people arrived.
I think we have to sort out your equipment, mate.
We'll come back to you, okay?
Oh, no, you're not to be working.
So long as you can have what I'm saying, at least not really.
Did you I can't really hear you?
I think he's using a voice.
I'm afraid.
Yeah, sorry.
I really sorry, man.
Who was after Action Bastard?
It was Benjamin and then Eve Dogg, and then finally Sarah after.
Well, I'm not going to remember that order.
Benjamin, how's it going?
Well, let's see here.
So I am going to an Intel hackathon tomorrow to try to see if there's any interest in either technology for disabled people using a lot of gamer type products like Oculus Rift and the Myo band armband that detects where your fingers are and stuff, and separately trying to see if we can perhaps put a free speech satellite into outer space.
Mercedes Carrera said that she would give us all the proceeds from some of her GG related porn.
How much do you think it would take?
How much do you think it costs to do that?
It's basically a CubeSat, 1U, which is 10 by 10 centimeters, weighs 1.3 kilograms or 3 pounds, and to get it into geosynchronous orbit is around $30,000.
But the one that we want is actually three of these cubes put together.
And believe it or not, we're actually going to send Gamergate ants into outer space if we get this kick-started.
Well, good luck to you.
Man, you know, that's actually not the sort of thing I'm going to be putting my money to, I'm afraid.
That's fine.
That's fine.
And then today I sent the first salvo of legal nastograms regarding the social justice warriors.
I posted a nice little thing that shows an 8chan that shows just the sort of person that we're dealing with in that regard.
But, you know, I just also wanted to say that there's been a lot of drama that's been going on.
I hope we can all find common ground and start actually working on building ourselves up rather than tearing each other down because I think that's kind of inherently toxic.
Yeah, I mean, I think that legitimate criticism and harsh criticism, it's perfectly valid.
But just being a dick for the sake of being a dick, you know, don't get me wrong, I can even see the appeal in doing it.
Sometimes it's a lot of fucking fun, especially if you don't like the person.
But, you know, just that it's about you if you do that.
You know, you're not doing it for anyone else.
You're not doing it for any great good.
You're doing it for your own fucking pleasure.
So, you know, bear that in mind, I reckon.
Yeah, and then I guess the reason why I was doing this whole satellite thing is because, you know, the whole banning on Twitter and the locking down of social networks and censorship sort of bugs me the wrong way.
And so I feel as if we need to have a layer on top of the internet to protect people's anonymity and from doxing and that stuff.
And that's kind of why I thought about this.
I guess that and Shirtgate.
My friend from NASA, Amy's, called me about Shirtgate and was kind of appalled.
Yeah.
I've just tagged you in a tweet, actually, because someone suggested some sort of CubeSat guy that you should use, a service that puts satellites in space, which I didn't even realize there were commercial ones like that, really.
I guess they should have thought about it, but I didn't.
We were actually considering ISIS because ISIS is actually a company that launches satellites in outer space.
Oh, yes, I've heard about them because they've got the name ISIS.
They're unfortunate, aren't they, really?
Yeah, kind of funny and brilliant at the same time.
Yeah, it is.
That's all I've got to say, really.
But good one.
Thank you all for your attention.
Okay, man.
Well, thanks for coming on.
Sorry for the long wait.
No problem.
Take care, man.
Okay, it's James next.
Hang on, hang on.
James has just come back.
Noise from him.
So go on, James.
Are you there?
Hey, can you hear me?
Yes, finally.
Fantastic.
Most eagerly anticipated person coming onto your Google Hangout.
Thanks for having me.
This better be good.
It's mild.
It's adequate.
I'm not a hardball gamer.
I suppose I'd be a retro gamer, but I'm coming to this from a perspective of a science teacher and somebody who's encountered feminism, third-wave feminism from a perspective of an atheist or a secularist.
I guess my collision started with science teaching and the suggestion that the reason that there aren't as many women in science or undergraduate science is because of sexism or cultural Marxism or something like that.
One of the things I wanted to say was that a previous speaker was asking the question, is corruption enabling this cultural Marxism or is cultural Marxism enabling the corruption?
My view is that the corruption is from the fact that there are a small proportion of people who are very self-righteous activists and these people are likely to take roles where they can influence culture.
And these people have such a strong belief about culture and its woes that they are willing to do almost anything to bring about change, including participating in journalistic corruption, as you've noticed in Gamergate.
As for the non-gamer online media involvement, I think that that's purely a capitalist reason.
You've got an industry that obtains profit from ad revenue.
Ad revenue is dependent upon clicks, and clicks are dependent upon controversy.
So I think that's about it, really.
There's no conspiracy there.
I can believe it.
But I was very interested that this particular Hangout has been focused.
You've mentioned it many times about the difference between libertarian and authoritarian views.
And I think that that's the key issue here.
And that's the key issue that I've noticed within trying to be a science teacher for the past 10 years and encountering this sort of third-wave feminism in my own science teaching.
Sorry, what?
It's a nightmare, isn't it?
Yeah, yeah.
Well, it's particularly antithetical to science because, as the Royal Society's motto goes, take nobody's word for it.
That's intrinsically anti-authoritarian.
And another quality of a scientist is a general fallibilism, a belief that we might be wrong in some way, but third-wave feminism seems to be extremely certain.
It's a religion, man.
It's a religion.
look at how they approach it.
They say believe all the time and they take spiritual comfort from it.
I swear to God.
Well, yeah, I don't know.
I'm hesitant because as a science teacher, I've also been involved in atheism and secularism.
I think that religion is a very particular set of beliefs, but I agree with you that there is a certain approach to authority that religion shares with these social justice warriors.
And I think that the atheism and the secularism group have a lot in common with the gamer group in the sense that we are both the most inclusive, the most objective selection of people that you could name.
However, we do have a gender skew.
And this is very annoying to the social justice warriors that they see this as a purely cultural phenomenon.
It couldn't possibly be anything to do with genetics or disposition or free choice at all.
And I find this very interesting.
I myself have last year I sent two very competent physics students, undergraduates, female students to MIT and to Durham University to study physics.
So I promote women in physics.
I suppose I have to make apologies at the beginning that I'm certainly not a misogynist or have any bias.
Don't worry, I don't need you to say that.
And I don't think anyone else does either.
Sure, absolutely.
That you feel obliged to say that is absurd.
Quite right.
But I think that there is a predominant view that it's entirely a cultural reason that there is a bias between the genders.
And from my perspective as a science teacher, I'd like to draw your listeners' attention to a particular debate which was between Steve Pinker and Elizabeth Spiegel, which I think is quite interesting.
It's called Science of Gender and Science.
And Steve Pinker, a neurobiologist, I suppose, a geneticist as well, has a very keen understanding of genetics and how this affects the mind evolutionary psychology, I suppose.
I haven't read it, but I've just googled it, so I'm going to tweet out that just so people can check it out.
Yeah, in summary, I suppose he makes a good case for the simple recognition that there might be a non-zero contribution of biology.
And just to say a non-zero contribution of biology is a controversial position because most people take an absolute nurtured position that what exactly does that mean, just for people listening and myself.
Oh, okay.
Well, that's quite right.
It means that when we see, take my field of physics education, when we look at people going into undergraduate physics and we notice that there are very many more males than females in the past 30 years since second wave feminism where the cultural debut of gender division between the sexes has been obliterated and people have free choice to do what they wish.
When we look at the gender divide we notice that there are more men than women.
How can we explain this?
Now, cultural Marxists, social justice warriors, will say this is purely a cultural phenomenon, that there is some wrong against women that needs to be solved.
And then there may be some value in that, but this is an empirical question and we should think about it empirically.
There is perhaps an evolutionary contribution, a genetic contribution.
There might be some dispositions that bring people to choose one thing over another thing.
And that's not to say that it's right or wrong.
That's a naturalistic fallacy to say that what evolution dictates is morally correct.
I don't subscribe to that, but it certainly explains what happens.
I agree.
I agree.
I completely agree.
In fact, that's actually one of the things that I've said before.
People have natural inclinations, and it's only through this kind of social conditioning that I think what we're seeing happen is occurring.
And again, it's not that it's right or wrong.
Exactly, as you said, I don't think necessarily an evolutionary norm is a moral thing, but it's something that has to be considered.
I don't think it can just be dismissed like they do.
They just absolutely dismiss it out of hand.
Quite right.
And Steve Pinker very eloquently states the problem, I think, that on one side we have People like you and I who say that there may very well be a non-zero contribution of biology or free choice, and the other side that say that it's absolutely a nurtured position, that it's entirely culture.
I think that's absurd.
I can't see how that could be.
Quite right.
And I think that there's another problem with that position, that even if it is entirely culture, that makes the idea that there is one side to blame the males and the other side that the victims, the females, incorrect because culture surely would influence the males as much as the females.
So they're just as blameless as the other.
No, I totally agree.
And it's the same sort of thing if you look at non-human primates like chimps and stuff.
It's the males that go on regular patrols around the chimps' territory.
It's the males that go and fight the other battles.
Why, you know, it's hardly likely that male chimps have got together and conspired to oppress female chimps, is it?
No, quite right.
And the very idea that it's entirely cultural, I think is undeniably ideological.
From my perspective, this is an empirical question.
I think it would be decided by research.
However, there is a very large proportion and very activist proportion of people who are willing to suppose that it's entirely cultural and then relentlessly pursue it.
I agree.
I think that it's the cornerstone of their ideology.
And if it's proven to be false, which I think it has been, then everything unravels.
So that's why they have to go full Macintosh and start denying reality.
Quite right.
And let's see what happens when these people deny reality.
I think the atheist and secular risk community are about a year ahead of you guys in having to confront this kind of crazy behavior.
And these so-called cultural experts seem to have absolutely no comprehension of the understanding of an individual.
For instance, let's take Richard Dawkins, somebody who I don't fully agree with, but I recognize is a very competent academic.
For social justice warriors, it's black and white.
He's either perfect or he's evil.
Yeah, they do.
And again, this is why I'm so willing to classify this philosophy, whatever they do, as a cultural religion, because only these sort of people use terms like good and evil.
You know, for most other people, these aren't very useful terms, are they?
No, quite right.
And for nuanced academics such as Christopher Hitchens, Richard Dawkins, Sam Harris, Ian Herci Ali, they find it very strange to be questioned in such a way.
Especially Ian Herci Aloui, who you might think is the most feminist person alive today.
Well, I'd say, can we?
I think we should wrap this up because there are still other people waiting.
But what's your Twitter handle?
I'd definitely be interested in talking to you about this sort of thing again.
Oh, well, I'm not a big user of Twitter.
In fact, I only just logged in so I could join this Hangout.
But I think it's James Denny Big Number.
So you can check it out.
I'll send it to you on the chat.
Hello?
Hello?
Yeah, do you want to put it in the chat maybe if you don't want to make it a public?
Yeah, sure.
I'll put it in the chat.
Yeah, okay, great.
Yeah, thanks a lot for coming on.
It's nice to speak to someone who is a scientist and also has experience of these things because I think you've probably a wealth of valuable information.
So if you do log into Twitter from time to time, I may have messaged you to see if you want to have a hangout or something.
So we can just have a conversation on one-on-one and talk about these sort of things and see what you think and see what we can come to, you know?
Oh, that'll be great.
And I'd like to say finally that although I suppose secularism and atheism are about a year ahead of you guys, I think Gamergate has done a much better job of proposing this stuff.
And you're to be confashed.
Thanks very much.
Do you hear that, GameGate?
You're doing a great job.
Thanks very much for coming on, man.
I really appreciate it.
Thanks.
Bye.
Don't forget to put your Twitter thing in the chat.
Will do.
Cool.
Cheers.
Bye.
Who was next?
Eve Dog, and he's the next trap.
Okay, so if you needed to get off, mate, I know it's coming up to midnight now.
I don't mind, because we're not getting new people in, I can just go through the list one by one now.
That's fine.
It's not saying you need to fuck off or anything.
No, no, I don't mind.
I do actually need to fuck off, so that's fine.
I will catch you later on.
Okay, man.
Take it easy.
Thanks a lot for helping, man.
I really appreciate it.
I can't do this without you.
So honestly, I really appreciate it.
I'm sure everyone else does, too.
No problem.
Take care, buddy.
Can you hear me?
You guys can hear me.
I can hear you, yeah.
Okay, I can't hear Sargon.
Sargon's not speaking right now.
Yeah, if he is, it's not working very well.
Okay.
I didn't want you to think that nobody was here.
Sometimes his internet cuts out.
Possibly.
It could have been with Cerberus leaving his shit tin can internet decided to kick in.
Yeah, I could figure.
So I guess in the meantime, just what's on your mind, man?
How's it going?
Boy, do I have some news for you guys.
I've got a man on the FBI that's been helping me basically trying to work out those Freedom of Information Acts forms.
And I did basically what I did, I turned him in for a search for Anita Sarkeesian, Brianna Wu, Zoe Quinn, and both Davis Arini and Jordan Owen.
And I have found out that from the papers that I got today in the mail that Zoe Quinn had been sending threatening tweets to herself, as well as Anita and Brianna Wu.
Wait, you have confirmation of that?
Yes.
Can you provide that confirmation?
Huh?
Can you provide that confirmation?
Well, I don't have a scanner for the papers, but I...
Can you go over that again for me, please?
Yeah, yeah, go over it again for Sargon.
He's got to hear that.
Thanks for picking up, Matt.
Just as the guy left, my internet connection dropped, obviously.
Okay.
Okay, Sargon.
Basically, your suspicions of Anita sending that tweet to herself, the one about raping her with a poll or whatever you did in this week and stupid or something.
Yeah, I did.
Well, I got documents from the FBI, filled out that Freedom of Information Act form, and it's confirmed she did send that one.
Okay, I would recommend getting your camera phone, which I'm sure you have once everyone does, and taking a picture of those documents so they're as readable as possible, and then tweeting them.
Actually, this is the phone I've got.
Oh, motherfucker, you've got to be joking.
I can't help it.
It's fine.
I'll tell you what, right?
I'll tell you what.
Hold it up to the fucking camera so we can try and read it.
And I'll try and read off it if you want.
Oh, you know what?
There's actually a repository of these FOIAs online, I think.
That's great.
Someone tweet them.
But seriously, let's see what you've got.
Okay.
Let's see here.
Because, holy shit.
Holy shit.
Fuck.
Damn it.
Here's what you do.
You log out, you take a photo, you log back in.
Yeah.
That's the best thing right now, probably, instead of trying to find something.
You're not fucking with us, right?
I mean, you.
No, I'm not fucking with you.
I got a man in the FBI.
He's a friend of mine from when we were little kids.
He went into the Air Force, and he's like one of the top interrogators they got.
What's the F-O-I-A Pete?
Sorry, F-O-I-P-A number.
I don't have that on me right now, but if you can get it and get a copy of it, then definitely tweet it at me.
Yeah, I'll send you a tweet.
Never mind.
But anyway, there was some other news that I found out about Davis Arini and Jordan Owen.
Someone on Gawker, one of the different websites, I didn't recognize the web address, has been planting sort of, I don't want to say a bug, but a tracker on them.
How exactly do you know this, and how exactly does it work?
Well, basically, whenever they post something on the internet, it's basically one of those search bots that looks for a specific name and everything, right?
Right.
And then whatever gets put up, like a video, it tracks the location of where they're at.
Right.
Okay.
And I don't know what the intention is for this, but that was just one of the things that I found out about Jordan Owen and Davis Arini.
Well, I think it might be worth alerting them to that.
I've been trying to, but I haven't gotten an email back from Jordan Owen.
I would recommend just tweeting them to let me know.
Okay.
Since you've come on the stream, it's public knowledge now.
Yeah.
But anyway, there was also.
I wanted to talk about Phil McIntosh or Fole McIntosh or whatever his name is.
Oh, yeah.
Jonathan.
I think he is brainwashed completely.
I mean, the funny thing is, if he were a character in a movie that was completely brainwashed like he is, I would have to say he's like a character from, I think it's Tommy Boy, the one where the character's like, I was born a poor southern black man.
I forget who the actor is in that, but that's who he sounds like if he was brainwashed by Black Panthers or something.
But that's what I found out.
Well, I mean, that's what I figured out.
Yeah, yeah.
He is definitely a true believer.
I've got no doubt.
Yeah, and one other thing, I've been on Xbox Live here lately, and I've figured out some of the things that these anti-GGers are doing.
They're actually starting to get into the games themselves.
Like not hacking them, but getting on and playing them.
Yeah, basically.
And they've basically been hacking the shit out of other players and making them lose and then gloating about it.
Sorry, it's not going to last very long.
They're going to get bored and be like, I hate this fucking game.
Well, funny thing was, I'm off the floor with them.
About 50 to 12 is what the final score was.
In Halo Reach multiplayer.
And the funny thing was, they tried launching warthogs in those jump pads and everything, and it didn't work.
Right, well, I expect everyone to go kick Eve Dog's ass on Halo now.
Yeah, if anyone wants to know my gamertag, it's EvDog1992.
I've also been trying to get Jordan Owen and Davis Arini on either the Colbert Rapport or The Daily Show or Colbert's new show when he replaces David Letterman.
Hmm.
I'd be very interested to see that happen.
Yeah, because I really want to see their documentary go whole hog on this whole issue because I think they're doing a really good job from what I've seen.
Yeah, they do seem to be doing a pretty good job, actually.
I was quite impressed at them going to speak to Jack Thompson.
That hadn't occurred to me.
That was a genuinely good idea because, holy shit, the social justice warriors actually make him look reasonable as shit.
So, you know, that is just, it puts everything into perspective, especially the hysterical way they're like, oh my God, they're speaking to Jack Thompson.
And it's like, yeah, you dipshits.
And listen to what he's saying.
And then listen to what you're saying.
Holy shit.
Yeah.
If anyone hasn't seen it, Dr. Random Mercam's, I think you know him, Sargon.
I do know.
I like Dr. Miranda McCam.
He posted a video where he's making fun of that one song that douchebag Johnny did for the feminists.
We are not Jack Thompson one.
Yeah.
And basically he just nails the guy forward.
It's basically what you could do with a keyboard in basically church where you just hit chords instead of individual notes and whatnot.
It's just real easy.
Hell, I even showed it to my brother and he could play it on the guitar just fine.
So I think the thing that people are probably going to want to know most about then is this freedom of information request.
And you understand that we can't just take anything on faith.
No one can take anything on faith.
So it's not something that anyone can believe or even continue to follow up until you provide the evidence.
Because the evidence is the king in all of these situations.
It's the Trump card because that's what everyone needs to be able to change their worldviews.
So honestly, get that as soon as you can because that is such an important thing.
If Anita Sarkeesian sent these threats to herself, it undermines everything she has ever fucking said.
Everything she has said becomes suspect.
It's just like the satanic verses with Salmon Rusty.
Everything about the Quran became suspect.
Everything just her bollocks become suspect, if that's true.
So you've got to get it to us.
You've got to get and make sure that we can verify it and all this sort of stuff.
Yeah, the thing is, is that she only sent one threat to herself to start the cascade effect.
Well, that's all we can prove anyway.
Yeah, she didn't send more than one.
All I've got is just the first one that she sent to us.
Still enough.
That's still more than enough.
Yeah.
Zoe Quinn is, like, I don't know how many sock puppet accounts she's got or whatnot, but she's been trying to troll herself, which is really just cynical.
I could believe it, but again, we need to see the evidence before we can go down this road.
Yeah.
Do you see that?
Do you see that link in the sidebar where it says fall.fpi.gov?
I'm going to tweet that just so everyone can see it.
If you go there and you have the number, you can type it into the field and it will give you the FOI request.
You don't have to take a picture of it.
Okay.
Right, yeah.
Yeah, do that.
Seriously.
All right.
Besides, I'm at work right now.
This is the only place I got internet, so I won't be here until next week.
So that's when I'll post it, okay?
Okay, man, but seriously, get on that as soon as possible.
I will pay you to go to the photocopy you place.
I swear to God.
Yeah, send your app to the nearest Starbucks.
The nearest Starbucks, the nearest Target, the nearest Walmart.
Anywhere those places have free open Wi-Fi right now.
I'm in Brookville, Indiana.
I'm basically in the bum fuck of nowhere.
Is there a Walmart?
There's always a Walmart.
They're within 30 feet of each other in America across the board.
There's one in Connorsville, but that's about a 45-minute drive.
I think I can make it, though.
Is there a McDonald's?
McDonald's?
No, it has free Wi-Fi.
Yeah, I've got one in my town.
Yeah, find your nearest McDonald's.
I guarantee you they have free Wi-Fi.
Tweet me the FOI number, man.
And if anyone on the forums or in the IRC or anything can somehow Google it or dig it up in however you guys do it, then let's get on it.
If there's a freedom of information request out there that says Anita Sarkeesian sent threat to herself, we shouldn't just rely on one man to get that information to us.
We should all be, or anyone who can should try to be able to find it.
Basically, I got it from that.
I got the idea from the dude that was on your other stream the other time that mentioned the Freedom of Information Act and how he was in the military and Rogue Star was in the military and how they were given this information by phone or something.
I forget which stream that was, but that's where I got the idea.
And I contact up my old friend from basically childhood and I talk to him about it.
And he basically helped me get out the forms and whatnot.
Okay, man.
Well, nice one.
Honestly, thanks.
I can't go any further right now because we need to see the thing.
But seriously, get on it, man.
Sarah is just so fucking important.
Yeah.
All right.
I'll see you.
Thanks for coming on, man.
Take it easy.
You too.
Okay, Duck.
So, Sarah.
Sarah.
Is that how you pronounce it?
C-E-A-I.
Am I pronouncing that?
Yes, Sierra.
Sarah, hello.
How's it going?
I recognize you.
You should.
I've been here three times.
All right.
Well, I don't have anything as big as the last guy, so now everything I say is going to seem just lackluster.
Well, you know, it's nothing until it's proven.
So, you know, I guess that's true.
You know, so that's the thing.
We need that proof.
Yeah.
Okay.
Well, I wanted to talk about something that's been completely different than everybody else.
We keep hearing the thing, don't touch the poop.
And it's basically saying, hey, these social justice warriors are a lost cause.
Don't bother with them.
And I don't agree with that.
And I'll tell you why.
Believe it or not, I used to be a social justice warrior.
But your hair is normally colored.
How could that be?
I had orange hair once when I was like 14.
No.
And I used to watch Anita Sarkeesian's videos, and I used to listen to her.
Did you believe?
Yeah.
Yeah, I did.
I believed her.
And, you know, I was poop because I would go on the internet and I would yell at people over things, over stupid things that I didn't understand.
And it's really horrible to admit, actually, it's an embarrassing.
You know what?
It's fine.
I'm pretty sure that the very act of being able to recognize your own faults puts you head and shoulders above anyone who is currently a social justice warrior.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's what people tell me.
But the point I'm trying to make with all this is if we didn't have people who touch the poop, you know, I would still be a social justice warrior because I found Thunderfoot.
I found the amazing atheist.
I found an internet aristocrat.
I found you, Sargon.
And you guys showed me the light, as the case might be.
And if you guys hadn't touched the poop, I would still be a social justice warrior.
I think it's not so much that we shouldn't talk to the social justice warriors.
I mean, obviously, Brianna Wu and Anita Sarkeesian and Zoe Quinn and all of them, they're a lost cause.
But the moderates, we could still reach.
I mean, I was...
That's true.
Yeah, so touch the poops sometimes.
I mean, you don't have to touch it all the time, but you might be able to.
It's not practical, isn't it?
Yeah, because when I first heard Internet aristocrats thing about, oh, just fight, fight, fight, I was like, no, dude, you can't.
Because, you know, if you're just attacking people and I mean, eventually, yeah, you could force them over to your side if you're attacking them constantly, but it's not going to be genuine.
They're not going to genuinely be on your side.
But if you convince somebody, if you persuade somebody, they'll come over to your side willingly.
And that's kind of what you and everybody else that I mentioned did.
I mean, they gave evidence, they proved everything that they were saying, and you don't get that from the social justice warriors, and that's what swayed me.
So, yeah, that's basically what I wanted to say.
That's great to know because it shows other people exactly how this can be done.
Because, I mean, to a certain extent, do you feel like it might be something like deprogramming?
Yeah, I definitely say that because when I was first watching Internet Aristocrats' videos, I was angry at him.
You know, I was ready to rip his head off.
But then that was probably me realizing what I had previously thought didn't make any sense, and that's why I was getting angry.
But after I listened for a while, and after I started listening to other people who had his same ideas, it started to make sense.
It started to come together in my mind.
And since then, I've learned to question everything because the social justice warriors, they lie.
And I didn't see that because I assumed, and I think a lot of women do this actually.
They assume that another woman would not treat them that way because us women were taught our entire lives to always trust women.
You don't trust the men.
You trust the women.
And so we grow up thinking that women would never lie to us, would never actively try to hurt us.
But these social justice warriors do.
And a lot of women, I don't think they know how to deal with that.
I think that there's a lot of parallels with the racism, the label racist, and the Muslim rape gangs.
It's not that anyone is more predisposed or anything like that.
It's just that it provides a shield.
Like saying, oh, well, it's obviously got to have been men.
It's the patriarchy, all this sort of stuff.
It provides a measure of protection.
So the people who do want to abuse this shield it gives them can do, and they can't get, you know, it's a lot more difficult to sort of call them to account for it.
Yeah, I think that's true.
I don't have anything else that I wanted to say unless you have a question or something.
Well, it's the sort of thing I think that I'd like to discuss with you later.
What was your Twit handle?
Or you can put it in the chat if you don't want to put it on the stream.
Yeah, hang on.
It's the sort of thing we may well maybe talk about in future.
Okay.
Well, no, no, no.
Honestly, it's a very, very interesting thing for someone to have known that they were full-on social justice warriors.
I think, I mean, a lot of them obviously may know that they're social justice warriors.
But it's more that I don't think that they'd ever be ever really be willing to admit to themselves that they're wrong.
And so for someone to have been persuaded by the videos of us guys on this side, I think that's probably a rare case, but I think it's something worth talking about in future.
So possibly with what was the name?
Was it James?
Yeah, James with the terrible internet connection.
Yeah, because, again, he seems quite knowledgeable and informed on the subject as well.
So I think that could be quite an interesting thing to do.
And it's not that we want to victimize or anything like that.
We just pick your brain and see if we can help anyone else in the future.
Oh, geez, don't say that.
I know you're not trying to victimize me.
Jeez.
Well, the fact that you even have to say that is awful.
I know.
It's fucking stupid, isn't it?
It's fucking awful.
Well, I might add one more thing that I think might be influencing a lot of women to think that men are the bad guys.
It's all these bogus statistics that are being printed in sociology books of all places.
I hate sociology, by the way.
It's like the pit of disgust in academia.
Oh, the humanities.
I hate sociology.
But there's all these bogus statistics being thrown around, not just in sociology books, but even the president throwing around false statistics.
One in four women will be arrested.
All that crap.
Yeah, I know.
And women, they listen to that stuff because they think, oh, well, if it's a statistic, it has to be well researched.
But no, it doesn't have to be.
It all comes back to ignorance about things like that.
You're taught to listen and believe by other women.
And when a woman or someone who supports women comes out and says something, you're going to believe them because you've been conditioned to do that.
And it's really sad because I've been backstabbed by women a heck of a lot more than I've been backstabbed by men.
Well, you know, if I said it, I'd be a misogynist, and I think you might be too.
Oh, yeah.
Internalize misogyny.
Oh, without a doubt.
Yeah, yeah.
The feminists are against you now, I'm afraid.
Thanks a lot for coming on.
And I'm following you on Twitter now.
So if you send me a private message and let me know what your availability is like, because honestly, I think it is important stuff.
Well, I don't have a job, and my husband works all day, so I practically never leave the house.
So I'm always here.
Great, okay.
Whenever you're free.
Okay, great.
Send me a private message on Twitter because otherwise I'll forget, basically.
Okay.
And yeah, and we'll definitely arrange a time.
Okay, thank you.
Cool.
Take care.
Bye.
Bye.
Right.
Benjamin.
Yes, sir.
Did you have more to say?
I'm just digging into the FOIA stuff right now.
Okay, well, do you and Matt want to have a quick conversation while I grab a cup of tea and then me and you'll have a nice chat and just shoot the shit, Matt?
All right, sure thing.
Sound good?
Yep.
Yeah, yeah, sounds good.
Awesome.
Cool.
I'll be back in a second.
Well, how have things been, Matt?
Okay.
Ah, fuck.
Got to move my microphone.
Yeah, I'm always busy working on stuff.
If you ever need someone to dig into some research for you, oh, yeah, yeah.
Keep that in mind.
Mostly the stuff I do is a lot of topical commentary.
That's why I think this South Park from this week was pretty on point.
I was laughing at a lot of it.
Oh, yeah.
No doubt.
And so I guess you were talking about this whole council thing, and I guess people gave you too much shit for it because I kept saying something along the lines of we need an open source project type management thing where people can easily contribute to projects, not like a government of gatekeepers.
Yeah, well, it was poorly worded, and that was my bad.
It was poorly worded.
I agree that I think we need more organization in terms of where to push things.
Maybe not as a group, as a whole, but like the smaller little ops that are working, honestly, I thought more about it, and they're kind of just doing the right thing.
It's like one person has a suggestion, and then if some people want to help out with that, they kind of do their own thing.
It doesn't speak for everybody, but it does allow for progress to be made, which I think is definitely better than just kind of sitting around and stagnating.
So I think that's probably the best bet.
That's where my thoughts on it are for right now.
And for the most part, I think that's kind of how it's going to continue on the longer path is going to be by people continuous, like maybe not a huge big push, like this GTA 5 thing out of Australia, I think has been really good because that's given a lot of people kind of something to work towards, like as a collective.
Because not everyone is going to be digging into the FOIA stuff, right?
Like they're not going to be looking into that.
It's a new skill.
I mean, there is Code USA software, and he's trying to teach people how to code games.
Oh, yeah, no, yeah.
He's got an Indiegogo kicking off right now.
He's got five days left.
This is funny, too, because full disclosure, I'm friends with Andrew, the guy who is running it.
So I've been keeping eyes on this for a while.
But he said that if he hit 4,000, he would eat ghost peppers on a stream, and they're at 4,031.
So he's going to eat ghost peppers on the stream, and it's going to be glorious.
I'm hoping he does, actually.
I really want to see this guy do it and everything.
So I think that'd be pretty good to see him do that.
And that's also, you know, that's like a different approach than like, oh, give me money to start a website or a podcast.
This is something that's like, I'm looking to raise money so I can teach people how to do this sort of stuff.
And that's, I think, another aspect of it that comes with it as well.
Because I keep saying, you know, GG has become a bit more of a community.
It's still a consumer revolt, but it has its community roots now.
People are attempting to build assets from within.
They're attempting to push everything forward.
That definitely echoes what a lot of people have been saying for months in terms of, I guess, our ideologies and what we see for the future.
And it's having a positive effect, and that's good.
That's really good that that's happening.
So can I do some shilling for a moment?
Yeah, sure.
It's not my stream.
I can't stop you if you want to.
So I guess, you know, the idea that I had with Code Free is that, you know, a lot of these big players have money, and it would be to teach people how to use, for instance, the Autodesk tools because you can do everything from 3D print to design circuits.
And one part of this whole big thing at Intel is to try to say, hey, we're GG.
We're not just man-hitting misogynists.
We're also gamers enabled to help people with disabilities.
We're also free speech advocates who want to help prevent people from getting doxed or people in the Middle East from being oppressed by real oppressive regimes, not the patriarchy.
And I hope I don't get lynched, but there is always that remote possibility because, you know, Portland.
Well, you know, Portland, see, yeah, I grew up there before all this shit hit, right?
Like, I left 15 years ago, just a couple days ago.
I was like when I officially left Portland, and it was not like that when I was a kid.
But now everyone has a really amazing facial hair, and I feel jealous.
Yeah, what sort of happened was it was bump nowhere, and we were all fine with that.
And then everyone's like, oh, you let people do what they want.
Well, we should move there since you let everyone do what you want.
And now they're like, why aren't you doing what we want you to do?
I thought the whole reason of coming here was that I wasn't going to get judged for being a non-vegan.
Yeah.
Let me just pause real quick.
I put a pin what you're saying.
Travis S in the chat, your comments about the Skype thing.
I will be addressing that in a little bit, so stay tuned.
But I am reading what you're saying.
Yeah, we're going to talk about that.
Okay.
Cool.
So was there anything, just any last comments you wanted to leave with people, Benjamin?
No, I mean, I guess I was saying that I'm open sourcing the designs of all this stuff.
And if people want to help design stuff and build stuff, I'm always down.
And if you need someone to give you some help with your programming code, you can get in touch with me too.
It's better than banging your head against a wall.
Cool.
Okay.
Do you want to give people your Twitter address?
Yep.
I am at endomorphosis.
Okay.
Do you want to spell it just quickly, just in case?
Oh, yeah.
Sorry.
E-N-D-O-M-O-R-P-H-O-S-I-S.
Great.
Okay.
Thanks.
Thanks for coming on, man.
No problem.
Bye.
Take it easy, dude.
See you later.
Right.
So, yeah, let me just thank everyone for coming on.
So we do appreciate everyone coming on.
And then we can have a quick chat.
Sure.
Thanks for everyone coming on.
I don't know.
No, no, I'm tweeting.
You're tweeting it.
Okay, because you went silent all of a sudden.
And I'm like, what the fuck are you doing?
Sorry.
You're like, hold on, my T is getting cold.
No, no, I've got a thermos sort of mug.
Oh, well, now you finally upgraded.
Yeah, yeah.
They sold me some like four quid down the down the thing.
But why don't you tell everyone about the Game Gate Council, Matt?
Right, okay, okay, yeah.
This has been going on a lot this last week, and it's been not going to lie, slightly frustrating.
Yeah, it's just, here's the deal: a lot of people talk in Skype.
We do.
A lot of people talk.
It's not just the, what, like one or two groups that I, the calls I hang out in or whatever.
It's a lot of people have discussions on there.
And it goes around.
People jump from room to room to room to room to room.
Everyone's having conversations.
There's some that are 24-7, some that are just like four or five people.
This is how it is.
People want to talk.
Twitter's not always the best place.
And you go in there.
One of the things that comes out of that is it's very similar to what Total Biscuit said a long time ago, which is when you go into these rooms, like he's got, you know, when you talk about the game journal pros list, there was, he mentioned that there is a Skype group or a group he's a part of that is full of YouTubers that are probably of the upper echelon, those like the ones that are very prominent in gaming right now.
How are we not on that?
Son's a bitch.
We've both only got, you know, I'm at 41,000 subs.
You're like at 39,000 subs.
We're very close.
We're very neck and neck, but we're not there yet, Sargon.
We need to.
We're not like them.
We're not like them.
Once we hit 100,000, we'll be okay.
I think we'll be able to edge in at 100K.
So if you haven't subscribed to either of us, why not?
Anyway, chilling aside.
No, but people talk.
People talk.
And then what Hebe was saying was that they go and they vent.
They vent because they get frustrated.
And one of the things that's happened over the past few months is that people get frustrated, right?
And that was one of the things I was mentioned earlier was people in these Skype calls kind of shit talking and whatever.
And it's like, it happens, but it's just venting.
It's just venting.
It's all it is, is because people have disagreements on Twitter perhaps or Facebook or GG or Reddit or wherever.
People go and they talk.
And that's just part of what it is.
Usually, it's just harmless fucking venting, as all breaks down to.
The point I want to bring up is because this is going to come out in probably, I don't know when the hell, but whenever Ralph gets around to doing it, because I know he's got it.
A couple weeks ago, you guys all know that there was that big thing, big how to do with Kingapole coming after me in the Skype group and making all these claims.
All that drama aside.
I was upset when that happened.
And I went into a Skype group and I said a couple things.
Now, one of the rules of the Skype call is no recording.
Well, one person was recording, and he recorded me saying a couple things.
And it's not like all I said was that I'm going to bury King of Pole.
I'm going to make sure no one talks to him.
I was just venting.
I was frustrated.
I was pissed off.
It was stupid.
That's all it was.
After that, I fucking said, screw it.
I'm done.
I'm not even going to talk to the guy.
I'm out.
And then Paul and I worked our shit out on Twitter, and we're fine.
That's the truth.
Well, this guy recorded it and then sent it around to multiple people in an attempt to get it out there.
And thankfully, thankfully, and I won't say who, but thankfully some people saw through the bullshit and cut it down.
But somebody still gave it to the Ralph retort, which I like Ralph.
I don't necessarily like everything he writes, but I think he's a nice guy.
So it's like, you know, him and I have talked about this already.
But I want to put this out there.
And the fact is, you know, it's like, because if this came out without me addressing it to an extent, it would just be bad.
And it's not like, basically, it's just venting at shit posting.
What the fuck ever?
You know, it.
Yeah, no, I understand.
I think at this point, hang on, we're getting echoed, and I've got my headphones on, so it must be coming from you.
I've got no sound in my room at all, man.
Fuck.
All right.
I don't know what's happening then.
Tin Gan Internet.
Yeah, I think it is, man.
It really is.
But at this point, I think that if anyone's still sticking around and is still dedicated to Game Agate, then come on, for fuck's sake.
Well, one of the problems is this E-celeb stuff that gets thrown around.
And it's like, I find the term to be a little bit disingenuous because multiple people have different definitions for it, right?
So it's like some would say like you, me, Paul, IA, Jenny Barrage, a few others.
We're e-celebs because we're kind of more prominent figures inside of this entire thing.
Some would equate it to be those who simply touch the poop and cause shit for the sake of causing shit.
And I think the two get kind of conflated.
It's like there are people that are more vocal, that have been able to attract an audience and that are always talking about it.
And they tend to catch a lot of shit as what happens with any kind of scenario where you have people that are more popular than others.
And that's a lot of what it boils down to.
I think that when it comes to those of us who talk about this and everything, people want specific things from us, right?
They want specific things.
They want us to do, I don't know how many messages you get a day from people with ideas for stuff that's going on or leads all the time.
I get them all the time, and a lot of times it's great.
It's fantastic.
I love it.
I love that people want to share the information and be to my own ego.
Ask my opinion on things.
I like that people like what I have to say.
But at the same time, it's like there's some responsibility that comes with that, in my opinion, now.
And as a result, there's some pressure maybe that builds up simply because it's like now you're not just talking to your friends, talking to a small audience.
You have a much larger audience.
People have different demands.
And that maybe kind of builds up.
I mean, look at IA's reason for leaving.
He felt like he was dogpiled for the lazy stream, right?
That was one of the things that really kind of like kicked him out of GG and everything.
It definitely put him in the camp of people who were kind of being reticent about it.
Yeah.
And the thing is, though, the thing is, it's not that people are being dishonest, which I feel is a lot of what it boils down to.
You know, like if I read stuff about me on GG all the time, and a lot of it's just baseless, and I'm like, really?
Like, okay.
You know, I think part of what it boils down to is there's a distrust amongst people.
And that is partly why we're here.
We distrust the gaming media, right?
We distrust all of these people.
That's why Gamergate started.
And I know that people want to inherently trust those of us who are more, I guess you could say, vocal and making sure that we're accurate, that we're verified, that we're on point.
They hold us to a higher standard.
And we may view that as being somewhat unfair, but that's also the nature of the.
Oh, I know.
I think they absolutely should.
I completely agree.
But I also think that attacking people because you have heard something is just as bad as the social justice war is really.
No, I agree.
I agree.
Nothing they do is based on evidence.
And if you don't, you know, if you're not looking at the evidence of wrongdoing right now, then attacking someone just because someone told you something is a bit.
Well, and that was the thing, too, the other day with being on HatStream.
Somebody went over to Kotaku in Action and posted a thread saying that I said that we're starting a Gamergate Council, that we're working on a Gamergate Council.
I never said that.
And when I confronted the author of the post about it, his response was, oh, I didn't actually listen to the stream.
And I was so mad.
I was so mad at that.
I was like, what in the fuck?
Like, if you ever want to talk about someone getting ready to fucking bail, I was at the point.
I'm like, fuck this.
I'm going to burn this bitch down all my way out the door.
This is ridiculous shit here.
It's like, you didn't listen to what I had to say.
You're going onto a forum with 22,000 people.
Other prominent members, I'm not going to name names.
They were on Twitter fucking verifying this shit as if it's legit when it's not.
And it's like, have we gotten to a point now where it's like one person hears one thing and then they go, that's it.
That's everything.
And then there's no investigation.
I mean, we were burned by the Anita Sarkeesi and Zoe Quinn shit from back on September 9th, right?
With what that previous guy was saying about the FBI stuff.
I want that to be true.
I really want that to be true, but I'm not going to get my hopes up.
I'm very dubious about it, because someone tweeted me and pointed out that he said that he goes on Xbox Live a lot and doesn't have an internet connection.
Yeah.
Yeah, I caught that as well.
I caught that as well, which is why I was listing off places with free Wi-Fi that any place in the Midwest would have.
It's like, if you need to find the internet, the internet is readily available.
I've driven through neighborhoods trying to find open Wi-Fi sources before.
Yeah, I have trouble believing it as well.
The thing about the...
Sorry, I'm getting...
I don't know where it's coming from.
Okay.
Is it now?
I'm not hearing it.
I think it might be your headphones.
It just must must just be me.
Can you hear me okay, though?
Yeah.
I can hear you.
Oh, yeah, I can hear you just fine.
Yeah.
Okay.
That's cool.
Yeah.
One thing about the accusations of the council and stuff.
A, the guy who brought that up came on the stream earlier.
I don't know whether you heard it.
Yeah, John Kelly, I heard him.
Yeah, I heard him.
Yeah, yeah, and he apologized.
He didn't mean to use that term.
And I think we all know that that's definitely something that no one really wants to do because it's unwise at best.
And, you know, but this is the problem.
Like, if, you know, a false accusation can stick if people just keep repeating it.
And, I mean, Anita Sarkeesian actually made this point, and it's one of those few points that she's actually right on.
You know, some people have made like fake tweets and stuff, and they've stuck to her.
And, you know, I don't want to defend Anit Sarkeesian of all people, but that isn't fair.
You know, if she's not going to be doing those things, there is plenty of stupid, retarded shit that she says that we can nail her for.
Nailing her for false things that she can prove are false is, well, it's a bad fucking thing, isn't it?
It undermines us.
And again, that comes with the two people come in, you get your third-party trolls.
And what we have to remember is because Gamergate is an open tag, anyone can use it.
It's like you look at who was that guy the other day, like David Gallant guy, Gallant.
And he was tweeting out like, oh, I'm going to make it so GamerGators can't get Steam codes for my really low-quality game.
And, you know, and then he kept hashtagging at Gamergate, right?
Like, signal boosting the fact that he wanted GamerGators to see that he was attempting to smite them somehow.
And so as much as you said earlier, we get about 31,000 uses a day right now, which are quite a few.
And if something comes up, that number spikes.
But it's like a lot of the times it's people who are in, you know, that are on the opposition that are using it as well.
So it should go to remind everybody that we are being watched constantly.
And what we do will end up on GamerGazi where all they do is shit post or it ends up being misrepresented on some of the literally who's accounts, right?
And things like that.
And so then it's like they do that to get the reaction out of us, right?
Which is not hard because it's not hard to react to something like that that you feel so passionately about.
And when they're shit posting, it's really annoying.
But we've got to remember, though, that what we're doing here is trying to reform the status quo.
And at this point, if that means leaving it behind and focusing on new stuff like base gamer or good gamers or other things like that, YouTubers, whatever, then that might be the best bet.
We have to stop paying attention to these other people because we're just simply giving them what they want.
And it's hard to do because you see stupid things and you just want to make a quip.
You just want to be, you know, it's hard.
I fight that all the time.
I spent an entire day trolling the shit out of Pixie Jenny and Quinn and there was some other guy.
Not even trolling, just asking them questions that I knew would be very uncomfortable for them until I got PixieJenny.
Oh, sometimes it's a lot of fuck again.
But the thing is, though, there's a fine line.
There's a fine line between doing that.
And it's like the other night with the GTA 5 thing and whatever.
I did a video about it and a Twitter user came in and was saying very opposite to what I was saying.
And I felt that it was very ill-informed.
And we got into this big thing.
And then Adam Baldwin jumped in on it and started kind of dogpiling her a little bit.
And we shouldn't have done that because she's definitely on our side.
And it's the in-fighting that is causing problems.
And the in-fighting is causing bullshit.
And sometimes it's very difficult to separate yourself from that, even though you want to, like, it just kind of creeps up on you sometimes.
Because it's Twitter and it's 140 characters and there's no tone, a lot of things can easily be taken out of context.
And as a result, it just can spiral out of control.
But information travels so fast, it's very easy to want to jump on the bandwagon without verifying.
And we've got to hold ourselves to that higher standard.
And it's tough sometimes, but you've got to do it.
I agree.
I totally agree.
I think we definitely need to be what they are not.
Just reasonable and rational, especially if actually discussing things with them.
Which that was actually my favorite bit about talking to Quinn was I wasn't throwing insults or anything.
I didn't need to.
I just needed to ask her uncomfortable questions.
And that caused her to completely lose her fucking shit.
She was worse than Paul.
Spaghetti everywhere.
And it's not hard.
It's really not hard.
I mean, if you look at if you just like, allow me to play Devil's Advocate here for a moment.
If you look at everything that she's gone through as well since August 16th, it's very easy that that trigger is just like it's a hair trigger.
You could just, you know, a slight breeze will set it off.
And I think a lot of people have that going on right now because it's like, I will fully admit, dude, I spend a lot of time not gaming when I want to game.
And I'm on Twitter, I'm on Facebook, I'm trying to find stories, I'm looking for things to talk about, I'm looking for things that's going on, and it's taken a lot more of my life up than I think I kind of want to give for the sake of mental health.
You know what I mean?
And so it's really difficult to like step away from it to separate myself from it.
And I think a lot of us have that problem as well because we're dedicated, we're passionate, we want things to succeed, so we want to throw everything we've got, go 155%.
And it causes, well, there's a price you pay for that, you know what I mean?
And patience sometimes is that.
No, no, I agree.
And, you know, it's the thing is, with a lot of these people, right?
For example, I would probably recommend most people stay away from Pixie Jenny.
She's very, very good at what she does.
And it's only because, you know, I got publicly humiliated by her on that stream that I had to learn her tricks bloody quickly.
But now, every time we've had interactions, she's descended into insults first.
So I know that I'm winning.
Yeah, Pixie Jenny's, you know, she's an interesting person is the best thing I think I can say.
Just like Arthur Chu is an interesting person.
But if, I mean, again, it's probably advisable not to talk to any of these people.
But if they say something on Twitter and it leads you into a question that you can ask them, because asking questions, I don't think is any form of harassment.
So, you know, if you can ask them a question saying, well, why is it the case that, I don't know, you can sleep with Arnott and Grayson and they don't have to do anything, like recuse themselves or anything like that.
And, you know, just get her, it'll just wind her shit up and let her fuck herself up, really.
And that's the thing, too.
The other side, they perpetually have spaghetti spilling out of their pockets all the time.
It's just, and it's always documented.
But sadly, they got to a point where they can almost very easily deflect it now.
It's like, we know who these people are.
Yeah.
You know, we absolutely know who they are.
And we know that they're not going to really change.
And so that's where I think a lot of the stagnation comes from is we know what kind of person we're dealing with from like the old people to the new people that come in.
And it makes it difficult because it's like you're not getting through to anyone when it's like there's that fight.
So yeah, that becomes a bit of a pain in the ass.
Yeah, I know, I know.
But if they're feeling belligerent on Twitter, sorry, guys, there wasn't an interview I had with Zaquin that I saw in the chat.
It was Twitter that I was talking to her.
If they're feeling belligerent and say something stupid, then I'm not above asking them questions to make them look like a fucking fool.
Fuck them.
Well, the thing is, though, and I think there was, you know, someone said, like, these people went to college and then they got out of college and their ideas were never challenged when they were in college.
You know, and I think that's one of the things that our society, and I don't know if it's just America or just modern society in general, we fail to challenge ideas.
And sometimes we fail that by either ignoring or over-challenging.
And it's like, as far, it's hard to find that middle ground to where the constructiveness will come from.
But it's like, it's like the guy said earlier, there was like that, what was the hardcore moderate.
Is that what he said?
Yeah, yeah, militant moderates.
Yeah, or violently moderate, I think was the term.
And it's a great idea, too.
It's like you've got to have that person.
You have to have that person in your life that will sit there and go, like, okay, but what if?
And get you to think about every aspect.
Because if more of us were to do that, and myself included, believe me, at times it's very difficult to do that.
And I think we would probably gain different perspectives.
So, I mean, I've gone and I've read, you know, like a lot of the Twitter accounts from people on the opposition.
I've read their blogs.
I've watched their videos to get an idea from maybe what mindset they're coming from and try to find a level of genuineness that's in there, right?
And it's, I mean, even on our own side, too.
It's like you've got people like people like the shit on Davis Arene because of the personification he puts out there, right?
Yeah.
And that's his character.
That's his character.
That's what he's playing.
But I've seen videos of him where it's just him talking about something that he loves.
Like it was something with the Sarkeesian effect, and it was talking about the camera equipment.
It was like a 30-minute video.
And I just sat there and I watched it, and I was actually kind of just really impressed with it because this was him being genuine, right?
This wasn't him putting on an act.
And I feel like a lot of us kind of put up those characters when we go to our online persona, when we do our stuff.
And that sometimes might send off the wrong vibe or the wrong message.
And me personally, I like to be as genuine as possible, even with my own faults and everything.
So that's kind of the way I see it.
I can't be bothered with characters and stuff, but I don't begrudge other people for them.
And some of them are really good.
No, no, no.
Sometimes you have to.
I'm really enjoying Commissar of Gamergate, actually, recently.
His Macintosh impressions are fucking good.
I actually have not seen those.
Just search for him on YouTube, Commissar of Gamergate.
And he did a parody.
He does satire.
It's really good.
Some of them are a bit hit and miss, but some of them are really, really good.
And the latest one he did was about the 25 privileges, where he was just doing his impressions of each one.
And it was genuinely funny.
I genuinely liked it.
It was good stuff.
Definitely recommended.
We have a lot of great things coming out of the Gamergate side.
A lot of funny people.
Yeah.
A lot of great commentators.
And what's good is it's also moved away strictly from just the journalism part.
I mean, it's still about journalism, but like Shirtgate.
That's a worthwhile thing to get mad about.
It's definitely, I mean, it's obviously about journalism.
But like I said, the problem is if it was just that they were being unethical in journalism, then great.
But the problem isn't a massive culture of social justice that's entirely corrupt.
So we can't, you know, it is the primary God, or it was the primary God, but you can't.
It's foolish to lead out the other things that are clearly influencing the problem.
Or so I think, anyway.
No, I think that we need to always be focused on changing that.
And I mean, look at who's updated their ethical policies.
Those wouldn't have happened without the push from Gamergate.
I mean, as much as we want people to issue apologies or to be fired in some cases, I don't think that's going to happen.
And so it would have happened by now.
I mean, people have been literally fired for less.
Oh, gotcha.
That's what I was saying in my video to internet aristocrats.
What more needs to be done?
They're not going to fire any of them.
They're all on the same team.
They all protect each other.
And it's that kind of cultural collusion.
And the Game Journal Pros.
I mean, the YouTubers, I can understand because they're individuals who run their channels.
And it's about individual personalities.
And, you know, I'm sure that they don't claim to be journalists as well.
You know, I'm sure they claim to be YouTubers and Let's Players and that sort of thing.
And if they do anything that's approaching journalism, then great.
But they're not obliged to because they're not journalists.
And that's the big difference for me anyway.
Well, a lot of the people that work in the industry as journalists aren't journalists either.
They come from this place that's not from being a gaming enthusiast.
That's another thing, isn't it?
Look at Leigh Alexander.
She has a fucking acting degree.
She doesn't.
And yet she's the editor-at-large for Gamba Sutra.
What?
Fucking absurd.
And she doesn't like games.
She does not like fucking games.
I've watched her lo-fi let's plays, right?
And it pisses me off because she's got a sexy voice.
But and the thing is, right, they're not bad to watch as in themselves, right?
But they're not gaming videos.
What they are are videos of Leigh Alexander.
She looks, she sounds as if I would sound if I was on an archaeological dig.
You know, I would be picking up like, you know, a piece of pottery or a sword or whatever we were digging out of the ground and being like, fuck, isn't this interesting?
Look at this interesting thing.
What might have been used for?
All that sort of stuff.
She's not getting enjoyment out of playing the game.
She's studying them as if it's a historical artifact, you know, of a foreign bygone culture or something.
And that's, you know, it's ignoring it.
She's not even bad at it.
You know, she's not bad at it.
But it's not gaming.
It's not gaming.
It's anthropology.
That's what I think she does.
And there's nothing inherently wrong with that perspective, actually, and it's like almost there's a place...
See what I think a lot of the people on the opposition don't understand is there's a place for everything, right?
There truly is.
There's a place for everything.
If you want to take gaming and an anthropological study and really dissect it from that perspective, fucking cool.
If you want to sit there and be PewDiePie and start talking about throwing Pokemons at everybody, fucking cool.
I mean, apparently it works for the guy, fucking 4 million a year.
I watched a video of his the other day of Far Cry 4, and it really makes me want to get Far Cry 4.
It's because Far Cry 4 looks amazing.
I know, I'm actually on Craigslist right now trying to sell Alien Isolation and a couple more games so I can then go to Target and buy Far Cry 4.
The reason why I said Target is because it's on sale.
Oh, I'm not going to get anything for Christmas this year, so I have to buy it myself.
But that's what I'm doing right now.
I'm like on Craigslist.
Like, who wants to buy my shit?
But no, I mean, that's the thing with Let's Plays.
Like, Let's Plays, they really do sell.
I was watching Let's Plays of This War of Mine, and I picked it up.
You know what I mean?
And now that Steam has Steam broadcasting, I need to actually grab my Steam key and hook it up to my account, and then I can do broadcasting from there because that's just the way of the future when it comes to gaming.
That's what people want.
They want to see other people play games.
Like you say, you watched a video of Far Cry 4.
Now you want to go play it.
I watched a couple of Assassin's Creed Unity, and that's what prompted me to go buy it.
Yeah, the games got faults, but it was that core gameplay that I saw that I was like, you know what?
I really want to experience this.
And I like the game.
Not all of it, but I like most of it.
But that's the purpose of it all.
That's kind of why we're here.
And we understand that now we're seeing this changing of the guard from the new media now to the online media.
I don't really know if we have a name for it.
I don't know what you'd want to call it.
I'll tell you all.
Far Cry 4.
I don't normally play new games.
I know that doesn't sound like a crotched old man.
But a lot of people have been like, hey, do you want to do games journalism?
You'd probably be good at it.
And I probably would be good at it.
And this, I put my video about Necromancer up today.
And, you know, like, most people have been really, really, really, really positive.
And I really appreciate that.
I really do.
And I don't want to say I don't want that because it's nice.
And I don't want people to feel that I'm telling to fuck off or anything.
But the most useful comments are the ones that are, you know, this is what you need to change.
Because I've been really, really close to it for a really long time.
So people, like, I don't even have a formation thing in there.
And I was just, someone said it, and I was like, oh, fuck it.
How?
You know, you've got little squads of dudes.
How have I not got formations?
I'm such a fucking tool.
It's, you know, I play, I play Rome to a war and medieval all the time.
How did I not think about formations?
You know, it was stuff like that.
Really, these were easily the most useful comments, you know.
Yeah, and conversely, there were a couple of people saying, Well, honestly, it kind of looks like a game that was made for 8K.
And I was like, Okay, fair enough, man.
Well, you know, it looks shit.
And I'm like, okay, cool, man.
That's, you know, that's fine.
You know, but that's the reason I don't want to be a games journalist is because for me, most games are shit.
It's not that they're bad games, it's just I don't like them, and I'm, you know, I don't want to play them all day to do a review on them, you know, to spend the time doing a review on a game.
And that's where, yeah, like, I think part of the problem is you go into these reviews and you're looking at it from like the, you know, it's like you stop looking at the game from a fun perspective and you're trying to break it down critically.
And I think that's what a lot of the old websites tend to force that narrative because they're coming from an old media perspective.
Like on the sites I worked for, it was like, here is your review structure breakdown.
You have to, you know, gameplay graphics, sound, fucking story, then like overall, right?
And I'm all, and I told my boss at the time, I'm like, why don't we just ditch like everything but the overall?
Like, no one reads that shit.
Like, fucking just focus on what you liked, what you disliked, and then leave it at that.
Yeah.
You know, and that's, and that's what a lot of people, that's why the Let's Plays, I think, do too well because you get to see in real time kind of what people, what people like, what they dislike.
Yeah, I think Let's Plays are the best way to do it.
If you can't do demos, let's plays are a great next best thing.
But I think we all can agree that we need more demos and less like season passes/slash DLC.
Yeah, yeah, especially on that one.
I'm not so bothered.
I mean, I buy, I don't want to say indie games, but I buy like discounted games on Steam because I'm a Jew.
And I'm not an actual Jew, but I'm just cheap.
But I buy, you know, cheap games because I don't trust that the games won't suck.
I just don't trust it.
And so if I'm going to buy a game, if it turns out to suck, I'd rather pay like $10 for it and then be like, yeah, and you know what, fuck it.
It's not a great loss, so it sucks.
But if more actual demos that weren't like, what was Alien Colonial Marines style?
And that's the thing, again, these AAA companies, they'll fucking, apparently, they'll bullshit out a demo.
And I'm thinking, well, Jesus Christ, okay.
You know, now I can't even trust their fucking demos.
So I'm very reluctant to spend vast amounts of money on something that I'm probably going to find shit.
So it takes me a long time to get into a game.
And getting this back to Far Cry 4, this is why I'm actually going to get Far Cry 4.
And I'll probably do like a Let's Play of My Own of it because I tell you what, the cover art is just insane.
It is probably the best cover art I have ever seen for anything.
If you just spend, I was tempted to do a video on it, you know, and I'm like, look, I just don't know anything about Far Cry 4.
I don't know anything about the other games that they've never been something I've been interested in.
But that cover up, this blonde guy and a Western guy in a pink suit with his hand on an Asian guy's head who looks terribly traumatized holding a grenade with the ring of the pin on his finger.
And that is just, come on, that screams, tell me more.
What I love too was the social justice warrior reaction to it because they all thought that Pagan Min was white, right?
And they're like, what is this straight white man doing?
He's killing the indigenous peoples of this land.
Exactly.
And he's the bad guy.
And then, like, the guy from Far Cry 4 is like, he's not white.
And then, well, the main character must be white.
Main character is not white.
Well, you must.
You kill elephants.
Yes, weaponized packoderms.
Think actually that was Jonathan McIntosh that claimed that made that weaponized Pachyderm's line.
I think that's fucking brilliant personally.
I use that shit all the time when I describe the game to my friends.
Yeah, is he Asian too?
Is he?
Sorry, someone in the chat just told me he was Asian.
I didn't realize he looks kind of white.
But I wasn't even really thinking about that.
It was more just the charisma of the character.
Just the way he sat, the way he's looking, what he's wearing, what he's doing, he looks amazing.
And I want to fucking know more.
The thing with the Far Cry games is they have good villains, at least Far Cry 3 and Far Cry 4, Vaz and Napagon Min.
And you can remember their names off the top of your head, which shows you that they're good villains.
And that's part of the, I think, the appeal is, and that's what it is, too.
You look at the way social justice warriors work when it comes to the AAA title things.
I mean, they've been really shitting on Ubisoft this year.
I mean, granted, Ubisoft deserves a fair amount of poop on its face for a number of things that it's done.
I think Assassin's Creed doesn't have enough women in, though.
Yeah, it's like the stuff that they're complaining about makes no sense.
Yeah, exactly.
And it's like I was looking over last night.
I don't know if you saw, I put up a Vine, because I've been fucking around with Vine.
So I took a snippet of that song from the Song of Day guy.
And it's like, he's like, we're not Jack Thompson.
We love video games.
And then I immediately cut that in with Anita saying, I'm not a fan of video games.
And like, put that there right because look at the juxtaposition of this.
This is taken in her apartment.
She shows up in that video in the end, you know, and then it's like, no, this is still, there you go.
Like, you're not going to be able to walk away from this.
You're not going to be able to not see this.
Yeah, that's exactly why I did the thing.
It's like, are you a gamer?
Yeah, I'm a gamer.
I'm not a fan of video games.
Ball looks like you're a gamer, Annie.
No one believes.
See, you have the patience to edit that shit for a video.
I just do a six-second vine and I'm content.
I'll retweet it.
No, no, no, it's fine.
It's fine.
I mean, the point is, the point is that these people, they make all these outlandish claims about how they hate the industry.
They hate the culture.
They hate the games.
They hate the people.
They hate everything about it.
And then you're like, well, then why don't you fucking leave?
Your response is they get all hurt and they get all like, you know, doughy out.
And it's like, no, but I love video games.
No, the fuck you don't.
Like, name me three.
I love the thing from Colbert Report.
Name me three games.
Do you know what I'm doing?
Really?
That's like.
I was disappointed in Anita on the Colbert report when he was like, Can you name three games?
And she looked at what Fluster's done.
I'm just like, Anita, I know you can name three games.
I have listened to you make talks where you have named three games.
So why, you know, but it was the way that it just completely flung her.
It was just, how can that flunk?
I can name three football teams, and I'm not a football fan.
I don't like football, you know?
So it's just.
It's just, but that's their mindset, though, is they want to come in, storm through the front gates, kick down the door, demand change, and then every time there's a pushback, they're just like, no, we're here to save you.
Like, I mean, it's precisely their war is not on the culture.
It's an all-out war on the culture.
It is.
And the thing I love about Twitter is they think that no one reads their Twitter.
And they get offended when people read their Twitter, which is insane to me.
If I tweet out something humorous, I want all of you fuckers to see it.
You can't put something in the public space and then get mad when the public sees it and calls you a fucking idiot for it.
Yeah, totally agree.
Someone in the chat pointed out that they said, look at Matty Bryce's Patreon account.
And I did.
And holy shit, it's just Matty Bryce is creating games criticism.
Underneath it, it says.
But didn't Matty Bryce leave games and not write about games?
Underneath it, it says death to video games.
And she's getting a grand and a half per article, which I think she does like four a month or three a month.
Well, yeah, and Patreon, and as you and I both know about Patreon, it's very much a very convoluted system in terms of how they broke that down.
And it's not necessarily the most representative of how much money you make.
Yeah, it's not.
I'm going to actually, I need to do a new channel trader because the one I've got is like six months old, and it's me rambling because I didn't really know what I was doing, and I was worried that I wasn't going to be able to justify with my work people giving me donations.
So I don't feel that way now.
I do genuinely think I earn any money that people want to donate to me.
And none of it's mandatory anyway.
So it's all.
No, of course not.
I mean, I was actually just approved today for the YouTube fan funding.
So if you want to, I'm not saying donate.
I'm saying if you want to see what that looks like, go to my channel and it's on my channel and you can see what it looks like.
And that's going to be coming soon.
Again, not promoting donation, just pointing out that if you want to know what it looks like, I get called a shill enough, so fuck that.
I know, I know.
But I mean, all this, you and I do YouTube all the time.
We do our stuff.
We make our money doing our stuff.
It's a lot of core gamergate.
So I'm not, I'm not sure.
Yeah, yeah.
And that's another thing, too, is I think that when it comes to a lot of the infighting we've had lately, it's just it's people, there are some people out there, like the Todo guy was earlier talking about the IRC.
And like, you know, the IRC guys are really the ones in the fight.
And it's like, now you're trying to claim that you're more in it than other people.
And I think that's kind of what they were trying to say.
I heard, no, he was honestly, he was on the hat stream the other day saying basically the same thing.
And that's what I took from that.
But I think I'm not trying to say that they don't do their work.
I'm just trying to say that it's like everything is a group thing, right?
Yeah, I think what it is, is I think they weren't getting the kudos they deserved.
Yeah, the recognition.
Because, you know, like the guy said, they do, you know, these guys are the hardcore who are going to grind to the anchors they want to fucking win.
These are the guys that we're talking about.
Oh, yeah, no, and they're good at what they do.
But it's like, it's kind of like there's people that I've seen that have been pushing for this sort of thing where it's like they feel like they're underappreciated because they, and then they look at people like you and me who make videos and have audiences that we're the problem, that we're the enemy.
Going back to what I said earlier, the person who recorded me in that stream that has it is of that belief structure.
You know what I mean?
And it's like, I'm not going to say who it is, but it's like, that's their belief structure.
I'm like, look, you could talk to me.
If you want to, you know, if you have something you want to say, I'm an open person.
It's like, we're not trying, we don't need to have these kind of hierarchies and shit.
Like, that's why I like these conversation streams you do.
Because it's like, oh, you want to come on in?
Just send me a message.
Come on in.
Let's talk.
Well, he's the one who makes them happen, man.
I couldn't do this on my own.
Yeah, no, no.
I don't even know how much hell it must be for him to do them either.
Yeah.
I don't want to send a message saying thanks.
No, no, I know what you mean.
I know what you mean.
Yeah, I really understand that as well.
I really do.
Because it's all about what people have to say.
And it's one of those things, a good idea is a good idea, and that's where it comes from.
That's the important thing to remember.
And like all these things, I don't consider myself above or below anyone in this.
I just consider myself a person with different skills to other people in GameGate, you know?
Yeah, that's the way I see it.
People out there, like I do my own looks, my looks into things, you do your looks into things.
We have different perspectives.
I think we all want the same thing.
Yeah, and we can't get away from that.
Yeah, and the reason I brought Mattie Brusse's Patreon isn't because she's got a Patreon.
I actually think that Patreon is such a fucking good idea because I'm not really a fan of advertising.
Not that there's anything technically wrong with advertising, but the problem that I think happens is that you look at, like, I know everyone hates Kataka, and I never go there, but it was someone told me to go there, and I looked at their news page, and holy shit, it's just one great advertisement.
It's just adverts everywhere, and you don't have any news, and you have to scroll down to get the news.
So you're just smacked with adverts.
And I don't like that at all.
That's Gawker, baby.
I know, I know.
It's fucking borker all over.
And that's how they operate, though.
Yeah, but the thing was, you know, I'm like a 90s kid, so I'm just kind of, you know, I'm not a fan of adverts.
And I like Patreon.
Patreon is a fucking great idea.
You know, people can literally get around the need for publishers, get around the need for advertisers, and directly fund the people who are doing good work that they want to see continued done.
I think that's completely legitimate.
The problem is that the journalists and the developers are funding each other, and there should be a professional fucking device.
And for me personally, that's one of the things I like about Google AdSense is because it's non-discriminatory, in my opinion.
And the thing is, the thing is, people don't understand, there's a lot of misconceptions about AdSense in terms of how much money you make because a lot of people think like, oh, like you and I make bucket loads of money.
I've heard that from people before, like, oh, you probably make $3,000, $4,000 a month.
And I'm going like, yeah, you know, like, okay, whatever, man.
Like, just, you're fucking funny.
That's why I'm actually going to do my channel intro again.
I'm literally just going to get screenshots of Patreon and show people what's going on.
Yeah, well, you know, I was going to do a video at Patreon as well, but I can just say it here first because the amount of money that says that you make on the page is not representative of how much money you actually make.
When somebody pledges to you on Patreon, they may put up a significant amount of money and then just not pay it.
And then until you, the user, actually remove them from your patron list, it still stays up on the page.
So if you look at people like Bryce or like Zoe Quinn who have that high number, you have to ask yourself how many of them actually are still getting paid that money because it can be a false number.
It could well be, but I honestly would think that these are the sort of people who've got the zeal to follow it through.
Oh, no, no, I agree.
I mean, I'm agreeing with you, but I wasn't going to follow up.
If you want to see a more accurate representation of how it should be, look at the Sarkeesian effect.
Jordan and Davis, they run that shit pretty fucking well.
Every month, they remove the people who are the one-time donors.
And if you watch, the number fluctuates.
Like, they had made nine grand, dropped down to seven.
Yeah.
So sorry for talking sharp, guys.
I mean, I'm not sure.
Sorry, yeah, I know, I know.
Sorry.
We're into this shit hardcore.
This is our DD stuff.
Well, yeah, kind of.
I'm really not that bothered about the money and stuff, but I'm bothered that people don't understand how it works.
So, I mean, just for a quick thing, what Matt's just said there is true as well.
And that's not the only thing as well.
It's basically people get to choose to pledge what they want to pledge, which I and I tell you, this is why I think it's such a great thing.
Because it means that if people want to, like, they can set a monthly limit to the amount that they give you, regardless of how many videos you do.
And I do it per video, so people can choose to either back something or not back something as they want.
You know, if I've done a video they don't like, then they don't have to back it, and they've got the freedom to do that.
And they can also set like, you know, they might set like a $5 monthly maximum.
So for the first video, you'll probably get the full amount.
But for every video after that, it's quite a steep curve downwards.
So, you know, I probably end up getting about a third of what or a quarter of what it actually looks like I should get per video, you know.
But I don't know why Patreon doesn't look that.
I don't know why it doesn't just say It's an odd system, but it's definitely one that I don't know if everyone in here probably wants to know about the intricacies of Patreon.
But I guess bringing you back to Gamergate, bringing you back to the topics at hand.
Travis S, then don't give me your fucking money, you dip shit.
It's voluntary for fuck's sake.
And Travis, if you don't understand the reason why Patreon is a good thing, then, you know, fine.
That's your problem, man.
Go ahead.
Hey, whatever you want.
I don't care.
You know, the fact is it's a very good thing for the use that it has.
But anyway.
Yeah.
You know, I mean, people, people, like, the thing is, both Sargon and I look at this like something we really want to do as a career.
Yeah, it's a choice.
And ultimately, we have to be able to survive off of that in order to continue doing it.
And we're not trying to say, give us money.
We're just saying this is the reasons why these things are here.
But it's that's also, I just want to put this out there too.
People have accused me multiple times of profiting off of GG and everything, like only being here for the money.
And I'm like laughing my ass off because I'm like, okay, that's not the case.
Anyway, it doesn't matter.
We care about the industry.
We care about the community.
We care about everything.
And that's just the other side of it.
And sometimes it's good to have that discussion, to be open, to be honest, to be frank about it.
And I'm not whorebagging.
I think they're killing us.
But I mean, ultimately, ultimately, though, it's like, I think that a lot of people.
You know what?
I really want to take a second to remind everyone listening because there's like 800 people listening right now, which is pretty cool.
You guys should all be really proud of yourselves.
And I mean that legitimately.
This thing, by all intents and purposes, probably should not have gone on as long as it has because of the way the internet works.
I mean, fucking Ferguson did not go as long as the Game Regate has.
There was that down period.
Everyone who's working on it, keeping the tag going, you guys are the true heroes of this.
I want you to know that.
Like, truly, it's not about Sargon or myself or others.
It's about all of us.
And that's precisely the point.
That's it.
And so it's like, you know, I don't say, I don't know if I say it enough.
I like to remind people that they're doing a good job because I think people need positive validation.
I think they need that to remind them why they're doing what they're doing.
It's so easy to get marred by the bullshit and caught up in the drama and the shit flinging because it happens.
But sometimes you just, you know, you need to know, like, you guys are doing a good job.
Yeah, I think they are too.
I really do.
And I'm genuinely impressed just even with all the shit that's going on, you know, the fucking shit.
It's not stopping people.
You know, it's not, you know, nobody's like, you know, pussy out because of it.
Well, one or two people are, but that's fine.
That's their choice.
You know, the majority, it's still 30,000 tweets a day, and that's just on Twitter.
You know, that's just one metric.
You know, there are thousands of people who don't fucking use Twitter for good reason.
I wouldn't use Twitter unless, you know, if I didn't have to.
And yeah, with good reason.
So, you know, it's really interesting, really interesting to see how different areas interact with each other.
And I really like the idea of using forums because I'm a big fan of forums.
I think there's a hell of a lot of value there.
And I'm not trying to take anything away from 8-Chan or anything like that, but there's something about it being anonymous that is both appealing and unappealing.
And it's, I personally find the layout a little bit complicated as well.
But that's because I'm old.
Yeah, you got to be pretty fluent in 4chan.
Yeah, you're not going to be able to do that.
I kind of get what A-chan's about.
I like what A-Chan is about.
Like that it feels a little bit better than 4chan and or half-chan.
I heard someone say a chan is now called Times or 2x4chan.
I've heard that as well, which I laughed at.
So it's I agree with you.
That's more or less what I was saying earlier about the public thing.
Some people use Twitter, some people use Reddit, some people use Achan, some people use IRC, and some people don't.
You and me, we're all over the place and whatever, especially me.
I'm everywhere.
But it requires a lot of people don't really want to be in all those places.
And so that's where I think the GamerGateQE said.community is at the site.
Yeah, it's GamerGate.community.
I've signed up and posted a thread in that might be good.
I'll check that out.
I'll check that out.
I probably put it in the wrong fucking forum.
But I like actual forms because you've got your own account.
And again, there's just something about that means that it makes it more difficult for agent provocateurs to come in and fuck with things, you know, because it's not anonymous.
And then when some random account comes up, it's got one post and it's all this bullshit, then boom, troll.
See, it's so easy to nail.
It's so fucking easy.
And, you know, I know, I just prefer that.
And I find the, you know, it's like a standard forum and it looks so much easier to fucking navigate for me.
But that's probably some old and useless.
You know, it's not any kind of thing.
Yeah, I think it's like, I wouldn't be surprised if there was like a Gamergate Snapchat group or something.
You know, just like you know, sign up for it because I like, and that's the thing, because different time zones as well, man.
You know, if someone I know or like or I want to talk to sort of thing has posted something, then I can go back and read it after the fact rather than just not being able to catch them online or anything like that on Skype or something like that.
Yeah, I need to sign up for that too and get my name out there.
I'll tweet it to you.
Yeah, tweet to me.
Yeah, definitely do that.
No excuse.
Yeah, it's there.
I sent it.
God damn it.
Like, fuck it.
All right, fine.
No, I think that we're on the right track and everything.
And, you know, like, I have friends who are gamers, hardcore fucking gamers, that read about it.
And, like, they know of my involvement, but they're like, they're still apprehensive.
But they're starting to kind of come around finally.
And I think that a lot of people are going to look at the fact that this is, you know, for a three-month misogynistic movement, we're doing pretty good.
Apparently.
Yeah, no, no, I think that the hard-headedness and just the, you know, just to keep banging your head against the wall until the wall gives way is what's happening.
And I, you know, yeah, it's like people I know, I don't think anyone I know actually thinks that, but I think that they were on the fence until they saw just, look, I'm continuing to do this because, you know, I know that this is the right thing to do because I've looked at what's gone on and looked at who the opposition are and looked at who Gamergate is.
And it's very self-evident which side I would want to align myself with.
And it's certainly not those colours.
So, you know, it's I think that the fact that three months later, this is still here.
And I personally have never considered going anywhere else.
Fuck it.
But that's because I don't get attacked like everyone else does.
Yeah, what is your secret, man?
You're that mild-mannered British guy.
You're just like, let me get a spot.
Let me mild-mannered.
You're pretty mild-mannered.
You're pretty mild.
Unless you get Pixie Jenny on there, you're pretty mild-mannered.
You just admit it.
You're like our Clark Kent.
You know what I mean?
Like, you're just our Clark Kent.
You're mild-mannered.
You know, reporter by day.
I think I'm a complete twat.
But yeah, you know, it's yeah, I think Gamergates are doing a really bad job of being misogynistic movement.
We've got far too many women and trans people and gays and minorities and whatnot.
You know, we're not the white supremacist hetero monsters that they think we are, and it sucks.
But yeah, I don't know what the secret is, man.
I just don't know.
Cracks me up, man.
Yeah, they keep trying, but they've also stopped at this point in time as well.
They've stopped.
They've really had to stop.
Now we're seeing more reports from people that are like, maybe it's not such a bad idea.
I've seen a couple.
It's not such a bad idea, sorry.
Like Gamergate.
Like, you know, some people are now being a little bit more positive towards it and stuff.
I mean, it's like, you know, there's these kind of things, they don't happen overnight.
And we've proven that now.
And, you know, I think that we could coexist in an environment with the opposition where they just do their fucking thing and then we do our thing.
And we're still on point with them.
Maybe keep them.
And they're on point with us too because we need to have that go back both ways.
You know, and I know it's a hard thing sometimes because you don't want them to call out your shit.
But if you're going to call out their shit and then you're being shitty, expect to get called out.
I get called out all the time for crap I did a year ago.
I go out of my way to address criticism, especially if it's criticism of my ideas.
Honestly, I know I don't have to.
I think that's what kind of pisses them off the most, right?
Because some random social justice warrior with like 10 followers on YouTube will make a video that will get like he'll put Sargon of a CAD total twat or something as it.
And that'll get like, you know, a lot of hits, a lot more hits than it would have gotten normally, I think.
And then someone will send it to me and I'll go there and I'll listen to it.
And if it's valid criticism, I'll say, look, okay, yeah, that's a fair point.
I didn't think of that.
And if it's bullshit, I'll be like, no, no, it's bullshit because this, this, and this.
And then they get angry at me because people go there and, you know, they have used my name in the title of the video.
And they complain that people who like my channel go there and watch the video and then address, you know, assess it for themselves.
Because I swear to God, if there's one thing that my fucking followers don't do, it's listen and believe.
They call me up on shit all the time.
I just don't have five minutes apiece.
No, trust me.
Trust me.
I've got a fair amount of supporters out there that do the exact same thing to me.
And then sometimes they get a little bit mad when I do it right back to them too, because it goes both ways.
But no, I mean, well, we were talking the other day, and there was that guy that took one of our conversations from back in August, like the six-hour conversation that we had.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Like every minute or something.
Yeah, I saw that.
What's the point?
No one's going to watch that shit.
I don't know.
But the funny thing about that, too, is somebody on 4chan found that.
And then because my name was tagged in the title and didn't have your name attached to it, they were like, oh, look at what Mundane Matt's attempting to shill.
And I'm like, like, really?
Like, it says a conversation with Mundane Matt.
No, don't get me wrong.
I'm a narcissist, but I'm not that much of a fucking narcissist.
And this is the thing, too, is when things like that come out, a lot of people tend to just immediately believe them.
Thankfully, those who are immediately believing them are shot down pretty quick by others going, yeah, this isn't his.
He didn't do this.
Yeah, why would he do this?
It makes him look like a dick.
Yeah.
I mean, there's enough things I say that make me look like a dick.
Let's just leave it at that.
But you've got, you know.
Sorry that we're just talking about e-celebrity shit, man.
I know that everyone hates it.
The thing is, I don't actually think we actually talk about ourselves that much.
No, not really.
Yeah, someone's just the ape guy like Sargon.
Oh, my God.
Bewildered Ape is just the loneliest.
He's the guy.
He's the loneliest motherfucking guy I've ever seen in my life.
I've seen him trolling on practically everyone's fucking videos.
And it's just like, man, you do not have a life, do you?
One of the things I don't think people realize, though, is like we read the comments and we see a lot of the same people, some pros, some against, and it's pretty funny because you'll see some people that are actively attempting to troll constantly.
It's pretty funny.
I get the feeling they think they're fighting the patriarchy or something.
What are you going to do?
Do you think that Bewildered Ape coming on and commenting on my video, I'm going to like, you know what?
I give up on the YouTube thing.
He's right.
I'm just not making good videos.
I'm not changing people's minds.
I'm not making good arguments.
Holy shit.
I'm just going to quit.
I think I'm doing an alright job.
So it's like.
Yeah, no, it's just, it's, you know, they say the other side says, oh, we're trying to run women out of gaming.
That's a lie.
Then you've got, you know, they try to run Jennifer Daw out of gaming.
That's a fact.
Yeah, they did.
And what did Gamergate do?
Game against the game?
No, no, no, Gamergate didn't do shit.
It was easy.
They were just mad at Total Biscuit for being like, that's going to be a game that I might play.
And it looked like, what do you say?
He says something.
It was like something cute.
He called it something cute.
And he was like, you know, giving some support for it.
And then they attacked him for that.
They attacked the ethics of that.
They're like, are they friends?
Are Jennifer Daw and Total Biscuit?
Are they friends?
I think they're secretly fucking.
Are they fucking?
Oh, my God.
Are they Will Beaton Felicia Day?
You heard it fair first, guys.
I've been making that joke for years.
But no, I mean, it's like, yeah, that's the thing.
We're making up the rumors right now.
The saddest thing in the world, right?
And this actually really fucked me off.
I was having a stream the other day, and I can't remember who it was.
It was with a woman.
I can't remember who it was now.
I'll have to check my fucking thing.
Oh, Jenny Barrows.
Sorry.
I was with you on that.
Yeah, about Bass Gamer.
And because it's very similar to suggestions Total Biscuits made, he'd come into the stream and he was listening and he was in the chat.
I was like, oh, you know, mate, this is very pertinent to things you've said and your opinions and stuff.
I think that you would be an amazing person to talk to about this.
Would you like to come on the chat?
Come on the stream and have a chat.
And he was like, no, mate, I can't.
Just for being in the chat, I'm a misogynist now.
And it's just like, for fuck's sake, why would he have to feel that way?
You know, why, for fuck's sake, talking to a woman about her project and he feels like a misogynist for just being in the chat, that is just bullshit, isn't it?
Yeah.
I mean, his level of involvement is much more heavily scrutinized than ours and everything.
And I think that's because of where he stands.
And I think some people are shocked.
And you've read like Matt Lee's, you know, use his sponge hair to write tweets about how Total Biscuit is hurting the industry.
Oh, and he's got an axe to grind and all that sort of shit.
Oh, yeah.
You know, I would argue that Matt Lee's by disabling comments is hurting himself from any kind of constructive criticism and maybe hairstyling tips.
But you've got like, you know, I mean, he gets all that shit.
Look at the shit Boogie got.
I mean, you know, and then I look at like Angry Joe, and I'm like, I get frustrated looking at Angry Joe.
And I know where he stands on Gamergate as a whole because of his girlfriend and shit.
Is he just pussyworked?
I don't want to say that, but as a result, I was part of his top 10 gaming controversies 2013.
Yeah, I was.
Yeah, yeah.
It was number three.
Because number three was Anita Sarkeesian, so I was writing there and shit.
And like, Joe and I talked about it, and it was cool and everything.
But it's like I look at this, I look at some of the stuff, and then I look at what he gets mad about, and I'm like, you're actively avoiding talking about these issues.
Yeah, and I think that when you are a prominent member like this and your fan base is demanding a response because they want to know your opinion, I almost feel like you're somewhat obligated to tell them whether they want whether they agree or disagree, not in a way that is like going on Twitter and making an ass out of yourself, but making an official statement where you address your points.
Because I think that the longer it goes without addressing those issues, the more of a problem, more pressure builds.
And so it's like you've got the, you know, he's coming up at the end of the year.
He's going to be doing his top gaming controversies of the year and stuff.
And if he avoids Gamergames.
Oh my fucking, he can't.
He cannot possibly.
He can't.
But at the same time, have a more important fucking gaming controversy than gaming.
Yeah, I know.
I know.
There is nothing in all of gaming history that is more important than Gamergate.
For fuck's sake.
Just come on.
No, and that's really true.
And that's really true.
And I feel that I just know he's going to do it.
I know he's going to skirt the issues.
And I know he's going to pull from mainstream media.
And I know what he's going to do.
And I'm like, I know him and Boogie are friends.
And I know that they talk.
And I'm like, dude, you've got to like, you know, not that we need validation.
And that's the thing.
They think we need validation.
It's like, it's not that you need validation.
It's like, it's that whole notion of how do you get someone to look at something objectively?
And that's the hardest part because if you push too hard, it comes across as you're not being objective.
And you're not, you know, you want them to see it from your perspective.
And that's one of the hardest parts of this entire debate is like they push, we push.
They push, we push.
And then a lot of stuff gets lost in translation.
And it just causes a lot of problems.
And that's always the tricky part.
I want to talk about Andrew Green Joe, actually.
I like Angry Joe.
And I know a lot of people are like, I hate Angry Joe or whatever.
But the thing is, I don't keep up on gossip much.
So all I know is from what I've watched from his videos, I've been subscribed to him for a while.
And I really, really like his angry reviews.
I liked his Angry Rome review, Rome 2 review, especially.
I love the you don't fucked up.
For me, if he doesn't say that, okay, that's effectively his recommendation.
Fuck the score he gives at the end.
It's whether he's like, you know, you're done fucked up.
Because if he doesn't do that, then I know that they didn't fuck up the game.
Because ultimately, I listened to the whole fucking Rome review and I was just like, yeah, I'm with you on every fucking point.
And his Mountain Blade one as well.
He did a Mountain Vlade thing where he was talking about the Napoleonic Wars mod or something.
Completely with him on all of these points.
As far as I can tell, he's a fucking gamer.
And, you know, I think I would probably enjoy hanging out with him and playing games because, you know, he seems to care about the same things in games that I care about.
So, you know, he was concerned about the same mechanic problems that Rome 2 had and all that sort of stuff.
And, you know, he seems like the sort of guy I'd probably get on with.
And he seems like a fairly, you know, funny chap.
Well, I don't know about funny, but he seems all right.
And I like, you know, I agree with a lot of what he says.
And so I don't want to go at him for, you know, being pussy whipped or feeling that he has to keep his head down because he'll get mountains of shit.
And I'm sure he will, you know, because these big, you know, that's the thing about people like Adam Baldwin.
They take a hell of a lot of shit from a lot of people outside of anti-Gamergate, anyway.
And so, you know, I think I'm pretty fucking small on the grand scheme of things.
So, you know, I don't really get, I get shit, but I've got like dipshits giving me shit.
You know, I don't have mainstream media giving me shit.
So, you know, it's, you know, just, it's a different scale, I think.
And I think that I tend to forget that.
And I think a lot of people tend to get that.
Yeah, when you get to the point of having like when you are as big of a face and all this as in YouTube culture, I mean, YouTube culture and gaming and all that.
Like, Joe is not someone who's like a small fry.
You know, like, Joe, you know, Joe can now get shit done.
And I think he's good.
Like, I like his reviews.
I like a lot of his stuff.
I will admit I did laugh when he did the $7 video.
But I understand his frustration, but at the same time, just I'm laughing because I'm all like, there's like a fucking 50-inch big screen TV right behind you.
Okay.
You know, you're not hurting, motherfucker.
To be fair, again, this is the thing.
I think he earns it.
You know, I think he's.
Oh, no, no, no.
And that's, I agree.
I completely agree.
I completely agree.
It's one of those things where it's like, just I get his frustration because we've both experienced what he's talking about.
And yeah, but it's like you get to the point, like Total Biscuit, Total Biscuit didn't need to say anything, right?
He didn't need to say anything whatsoever.
And he did.
And as a result of that, we are where we are.
I honestly want to say that if TB had not come in and validated a number of reasons why we're here, then we would not still be around as much.
We wouldn't be as big.
He brought in a lot of people into the fray.
Same with Boogie, except Boogie got a lot of shit, and the stuff that they were doing to him was really fucked up.
Yeah, I kind of want to give Boogie a hug.
He looks like he's in Las Vegas this weekend, and him and I were talking for the PlayStation Experience.
And he's like, I was like thinking about trying to get out to Vegas.
It's like 300-some miles from where I'm at.
And he's like, yeah, if you come on out, we'll chill.
And I'm all like, oh, I'd love to go meet Boogie.
And I'm looking at, like, right now, I'm looking at rental car prices, and I'm like, ah, goddamn.
I just want to just address the chat.
Nameless Assyrian.
I like your username, by the way.
It was a conversation with GameGate.
Now it's me and Monday Matt shooting shit.
If that's not your thing, man, then that's cool.
Thanks so much.
Oh, if you have questions about Gamergate too, feel free to ask.
If you guys have questions, you want to know our thoughts on that.
Honestly, I'm quite enjoying just shooting the shit and talking about stuff.
Well, we do this a lot, too.
We tend to get these long conversations at 6 o'clock in the morning, my time.
Yeah, because it's just nice to talk to someone about this sort of thing who they know the thing.
And I like doing this with the chat, though, because I like seeing everyone's comments, even the guys that are winding us up.
That's fine.
I see somebody mentioning main event or event status.
I like Event.
I don't know if you've heard of him, Sargon.
No, what's the deal?
He's another YouTuber.
He does a lot of videos.
He'll do 45-minute videos.
He does a lot of gaming, a lot of gaming culture and stuff.
On 8chan, he's like their messiah.
Every time he does a video, it's like right there on the top.
I do not have a micro-penis pack.
Sorry, they've obviously leaked our cloud photos, man.
No, no, I'm uncircumcised, so it just kind of hangs off the top.
It's good.
It gives it an extra girth.
Anyway, the point, you know, fuck it.
And so, no, like, event status, he does a lot of good stuff.
He does a fair amount of coverage.
He does talk about people, talk about what's going on.
And I like that he's involved in the fight.
I would like to see him kind of be more public about it.
That's the only thing I think he's not one for going on streams.
He's not one for getting involved in a lot of things like this.
I think he actually tends to avoid going in these streams and talking to people.
But I would like to see more from people like him the different viewpoints, you know what I mean?
Coming in to talk about these issues because I think that's how we can really address some of the problems, too.
It's like different perspectives.
But someone like him who doesn't want to, you can't really force a guy, but I'd like to see him do it.
Yeah, I agree.
But again, I don't want to pressure people needlessly.
It would be nice if they would ignore the social justice bullying, because I think a lot of it is down to bullying.
Like the other guy said, he was just a nobody.
And he had people, social justice warriors saying, you're going to be ostracized from this little social justice community that they have if you don't go and say something nasty to him.
And it's just like, wow, that's fucking horrible.
And that's just some rando on the internet.
Whereas, you know, if you've got 100,000 subscribers plus, then someone, you know, the big boys are going to notice you and they're going to start putting pressure on you if they think that you're going to succumb to it.
And I think the best thing to do is just say, you know what, fuck yourselves.
And the thing is, especially if you're on YouTube, because the YouTubers, they can't be touched by these cunts.
Their audiences aren't going to suddenly fucking up and disappear if they're just like, yeah, I think there's definitely a problem with ethics and journalism and now talk about the game.
People have been asking about Yahtzee and John Tron.
I like John Tron.
I didn't know who he was until GameGate started.
And looking at him, he doesn't look like the sort to be against social justice.
He looks kind of like he could be a social justice warrior.
And so I was a bit stupid.
And I watched his videos and I'm like, okay, he's funny as fuck.
Fair play.
He's awesome.
And Yahtzee is, well, Yahtzee's Yahtzee, isn't he?
I'm definitely take it or leave it with him.
I liked him when he first came on the scene, but after his shtick hasn't changed any.
I feel like it's just been the same old thing.
And it's not as funny anymore.
That's the sad thing.
Maybe I've just grown immune to his British wiles.
I still enjoy his videos.
I like his style and I like his content.
I watched one of his YouTube videos where he drowns out.
It was Rise of the Triad.
And he basically said, look, something about if someone talks about social justice, tell them to shut the fuck up and fuck off.
Which, frankly, is the opinion I would expect from him because he really doesn't come across as the sort who suffers fools gladly.
He's a bit up his own ass, yeah, but he's quite smart and he's good at what he does.
So you can understand why he would be.
Yeah.
So, yeah, and I think that it's his affiliation with the Escapist that really prevents him from.
Not that, I mean, maybe it's just that he doesn't give a fuck that prevents him from doing anything regarding game or having a stance on it.
But I would be surprised if the Escapist and his position there didn't have some sort of effect on that.
Possibly.
Possibly.
That's my opinion.
I don't know.
I'm just shooting the shit.
No, no.
I think that...
Well, the escapist has kind of proven with Archon that they're more than willing to look at things from all angles.
I mean, Christ all fucking mighty, Movie Bob is still employed there.
Yeah, yeah, they are.
Like, I mean, you know, you can bitch about Movie Bob all you want, but the fact fucking remains is that he has been, you know, he's with a site that's allowing his side of things to be said and as well as our side of things to be said.
And that's equality.
Yeah, that's what it is.
I would like to see The Escapist actually find someone who is pro-Gamergate, who is also a good in the same sort of vein as Movie Bob and Yahtzee, you know, a YouTuber who is pro-Gamergate and also makes extremely good videos.
And I'm not talking about me or you here when I say this, because no, no, no, no, no, of course not.
I like to find people who are more intelligent than me, which is why I talked to you.
Yeah, thanks.
I wouldn't say that's necessarily true, man.
But what I mean is, like, you know, someone like Jon Tron or whatever, not him, but you know what, just someone who's because I was looking through Yahtzee's videos, and I look back on the very first ones, and I swear to God, I can't understand how he got fucking noticed.
It must have been the goon thing or whatever, you know, because his first ones were just like Flashback, which is a game I love, so I'm not that surprised.
But it's got like 100,000 views of some guy doing a little thing on flashback.
It's like, really?
I mean, it was in 2007 or something, so maybe that was the only thing on YouTube or something at the time.
I don't know.
But, you know, and then he did like two episodes of Zero Punctuation, and then the Escapist picked him up.
It seems, anyway, I don't really know.
But yeah, I'd like to see something on that.
So find some relatively unknown talent who's part of Gamergate.
And if the Escapist were to take them on, I would take The Escapist a lot more seriously as a source.
Because, you know, I'm not even against the fact that they keep movie Bob on.
Yeah, I disagree with his views.
I think he's a great fat twat.
But at the end of the day, I don't think that he does a bad job when he's talking about his ridiculously pointless nerd culture shit.
You know, I don't really care what comic books did what in the 70s and how that reflects on comics in the 90s, as much as Bob hates the 90s and then what that means for changing Captain Marvel into a girl now or whatever it is they're doing.
I don't care about any of that, but he is good at it.
There's no denying he's good and he knows his shit.
It's just when he talks about anything that might be ideologically interesting to him that he loses his shit and goes full Macintosh.
Well, the problem with it is, though, is, and he said, I saw a post pop up earlier on Twitter.
It was part of his blog post.
And he talked about when he created the anti-thinker, he wanted to create the most extreme version of a gamer he could think of.
And now, and now he goes, oh, well, obviously, that's not extreme enough.
And I'm like, I think that's, and I think that's reminiscent, or at least representative, of his own mindset.
It's like he doesn't understand or he can't comprehend past his own belief structure of where these things are.
Yeah, I think it's very much emotional ties for him.
I keep seeing, oh, I've seen a quote of his, plenty, where he's like, if college didn't suck for you, you are the reason that it sucked.
And it's just, okay, well, he was bullied.
Okay, fine.
He's fat and useless.
Of course he was bullied.
But he was bullied by certain individuals.
I mean, I personally wouldn't have bullied Movie Bob at school.
I probably would have fucking played video games or Dungeons and Dragons with him.
And I think that's probably why I actually dislike him so much on a personal level.
It pisses me off.
He sits there going, oh, white men are so bad.
Call of Duty is so bad.
And it's just like, just shut up, you pussy.
You know, just stop fucking living out your fucking demons through your job.
Get over it.
For fuck's sake, Bob.
Yeah.
And Jim Sterling's probably exactly the fucking slave.
Jim Sterling.
Jim Sterling, I'm calling it right now.
When this thing is like a year down the road from now, right?
When we've won, officially won and everything, or at least we've migrated to something that we no longer.
It would become a concrete culture.
Yeah, it's a escapist.
You know, if you can get a definitively pro-Gamergate game reviewer who's talented on the escapist, that would show that it is a legitimate equal culture.
And I think it is.
And it would also show that the escapist is interested in being fair.
And since they wrote an ethics policy and changed a lot of it, I think they're capable of it.
I think that they should do.
And I don't hate the escapist.
Of all the people, of all the sites, of all of this, the escapist is lowest on the list of people I hate.
Yeah.
Sorry, yeah, go on.
No, no, I'm just saying, I think that I think that eventually Sterling will come over to our side because he'll get so frustrated with the bullshit from the other side.
Yeah, I agree.
Once because all these people will eventually eat themselves alive.
They'll turn on each other.
We've watched this happen right now.
It's with lower ranking people at the moment, but it's going to get to that point where it's going to be a lot higher.
And when that happens, Judas, someone's message, Judas Sterling is going to flip because he only goes for low-hanging fruit.
I like Judas Sterling.
That's good.
I do like that too.
But that's the thing, right?
I tell you.
One thing about Jim Sterling, right, is he is very much the product of English schools.
He is very.
I don't hate fat people, by the way.
I am fat.
But Jim Sterling, not as fat as Jim Sterling, though, or Bob.
I'm about half their size.
But Jim Sterling, his personality, just the way he operates, just the way he's an intelligent guy.
He's good at doing his journalistic research when he's talking about AAA companies.
And the persona, everything about him just strikes me as English school, where it's been rough in the playground because English schools are fucking rough in the playground.
If there is anything about you that can be used as an insult, it will be used as an insult over and over and over.
And you have to get the mental defenses and fight back.
You have to find something about your opponent you can use as an insult back to defeat them.
And I know it sounds harsh, but oh my god, it produces strong adults.
And that is what pisses me off the most about Jim is this fucking peer pressure that he has clearly succumbed to.
And he knows it's all bullshit.
Even if he's putting up the fucking, he tweets this, he likes that, and all this shit shit.
I think he knows somewhere deep in the back of his mind, he is fucking betraying his own principles.
I think he knows it.
And I think he hates it.
I think it eats him up.
And it fucks me off.
And I might be completely wrong.
I might be completely wrong.
I'm happy to be completely wrong.
But fuck it.
I'm sure that Sterling knows that there's something deeply rotten about what he is supporting.
I would agree with you there.
Good.
It fucking has to be.
It's like, you cannot live in the world that these people live in without, like, I mean, you know, there's that picture that you were sent earlier with like, you know, John and Anita and Brianna all sniffing their own farts.
Right.
And everything.
So that's just the truth of it.
It's like, that's what they do.
Oh, I just had somebody message me on Twitter about the tweet I put out earlier, the Adam Sessler supporting doxing.
And she's like, I have to question your agenda.
His words.
I'm showing you his own words.
He said these things.
Who said that?
Sorry?
Oh, I got this random tweet right now from a person about that.
Because I posted that vine earlier that had the Sterling, or not Sterling, sorry, Adam Sessler.
Show you saying he would dox people that he disagreed with.
Did he?
Fucking hell.
Yeah, he says that.
He's like, don't give me that First Amendment bullshit.
It's your right to say what you want.
It's my right to call you a fucking asshole, find your address, and put it out there.
Yeah.
Someone just tweeted, Sterling is weak.
He only appears strong.
That's true.
That is definitely true.
But the thing is, I do think that if he wasn't such a fucking pussy, he doesn't have to be like he is.
I think he knows better.
Whereas that's the difference between him and Movie Bob.
I don't think Movie Bob believes different.
I think Movie Bob genuinely believes the bullshit he puts out.
Whereas I think that Sterling is doing, I think he's doing it disingenuously.
And, you know, sorry, Jim, I'm fucking calling it, man.
You know better.
And if you want to fucking criticize me on that one, Jim, come on a stream.
I'll talk to you like you're a fucking human being.
I'm not going to fucking shout you down.
I'm not going to insult you.
I'm not even going to tease you.
There's a lot about your work I fucking like.
Come and talk to me, you dick.
But he won't, obviously.
Well, no, none of them will.
I think it'd be fun to have a conversation with.
I would love to have a conversation with Anita Sarkeesian.
I'm not going to lie.
Oh, God, me too.
Me too.
And the thing is, even if it was just, look, all you can do is ask questions.
I'd be like, okay, fine.
I'll just ask questions.
You know, whatever.
But someone mentioned Razorfist.
I fucking love Razorfist's channel.
I would love to have him on a chat and just shoot the shit with him, man.
He seems like a fucking badass guy.
I would need a dictionary.
Like, what the fuck did you say, dude?
Just boom.
He's on.
He's got a big vocabulary.
I mean, I know how to talk and shit, but I'm like, what the fuck did he say there?
This guy's good at Scrabble.
I guarantee you he's very good at Scrabble.
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, if Internet Aristocrat wants to talk, I'd fucking talk.
I'd fucking miss his videos, man.
Have you talked to him at all since he bailed out?
Yeah, I'd love to.
I don't think he will, obviously.
It'd kind of undermine the dramatic flounce if he did, wouldn't it?
So, well, a lot of people ask me if they think this alternate IA account that's running around.
Have you seen that at all?
You would have to be a fucking moron.
King of Paul verified it.
King of Pole verified it, as well as apparently Blackface Kermit.
I'm sure they did, but I think that they're getting run over on people.
Because if you look at the way that the thing tweets, the person running it is not nearly as intelligent as no, it's a very aggressive account.
Yeah, but it's a very, it's, it's, yeah, I don't think it's Jim.
I don't think it's Jim.
Yeah, I don't.
The person doing it isn't as smart as Jim, and it's obvious, you know, and so I don't believe it for a second.
It'd be funny.
I don't, yeah, I don't think he would have it.
He would be way more tactful, which is, I think, why a lot of people want him to come back.
They don't mind seeing this shit, provided it's funny.
Yeah, actually, I don't even care that he did what he did.
I'd forgive him.
I'm sure a lot of people would.
No, no, I think people want him to come back because they want the Tumblrisms video.
That's what a lot of people want.
His perspective on it.
People love him.
King of Paul verified it.
Don't go wrong, Paul.
I still like Paul.
I know a lot of people don't, but I like him.
But, you know, it's fine.
But anyway, what the fuck was I just going to say?
Shit, I don't know.
Something about IA, probably.
Okay, hold up real quick, real quick.
Kevka, there is no Gamergate Council.
There never was a Council.
Please let that die.
Because all it does is fucking hold everybody back.
Because it's a fucking stupid insult.
It does nothing.
It's been proven there's no council.
Let it go.
Thank you.
Yeah, it was someone else who used the word council by mistake, basically.
But yeah, the thing with Jim, I always find it really interesting because he came across to me like someone who probably has actually covered Watergate.
Like he was, you know, in the 70s or something, got frozen in time.
And he even sounds like that.
He sounds like he could be an old announcer or something, you know, an old newsman.
So I've always had this kind of image of him in my head.
Obviously, you think he wears that fedora with the press sign in it?
I was hoping he did.
I doubt he did, obviously.
I bet you when he was a kid, he was on the street going, like, extra, extra, read all about it.
You know, that's how he got into journalism.
And then people watch by and he's like, ah, you fucking idiot, take the goddamn paper.
I'm sure he was.
I'm sure he's fucking trolling it up on 4chan or something.
But, you know, that's fine.
It's not hard to troll upon 4chan.
They're pretty fun.
Yeah, it's all of those things.
I mean, it's like IA does a lot of good stuff.
And that's what we've talked about this before, too, where you've got one of the great things about Gamergate as a whole is that it is inclusive.
It allows everyone from all walks of life to come in and be part of it.
Whereas the other side is if you don't walk and talk like a fucking duck, you know?
Yeah.
That's the thing.
Yeah, no, sorry, someone just tweeted me Angry Joe sucks.
Angry Joe and Gamergate.
I don't know.
It just seems like Angry Joe's pussy worked, really.
Yeah, I don't know.
So what was the guy on that Anita Keys in video that Macintosh did, who took the 3.3 million?
Oh, that would be Tim.
Looks somewhat like Devin Ferasi Schaefer.
Yeah, that's, yeah.
So I actually kind of missed what happened with him.
I only got informed about it recently.
Can you tell me what happened, what you know?
Because with Tim Schaefer?
Yeah, yeah.
Conflict information, so I'd like to.
Sure, sure.
From my understanding, Tim Schaefer runs Double Fine.
They are a very good game developing company.
They are.
The games are awesome.
Psychonauts is the shit.
A lot of their games are great.
But something's happened along the way.
I'm not too sure what it is.
Part of me wants to be able to get away from the game.
Ineptness and greed has, I think, has played a part.
They did a Kickstarter campaign looking to raise $400,000 to do Broken Age.
And they ended up raising $3.3 million somewhere in there.
And the game was delayed.
And I think they did another Kickstarter to get it done.
And they just released Act 1.
So they broke the game into two acts in order to sell it twice.
And they ended up, you know, they spent, I think, $120,000 a month to live and operate inside of San Francisco.
And yet they just laid off 12 employees the other day.
And this is coming right after.
Yeah, that's his words, too.
His words on his Twitter were like $120,000 a month.
And they, what was it?
They just, they had a big party, like this game Dev Days that they put on that was pretty elaborate from what I hear, or expensive.
And then you've got, what is it?
Then they just laid off more people.
And they're talking, and I've heard talks of another Kickstarter campaign to get Broken Age 2 off the ground.
And they're trying to get, you know, I think another Kickstarter campaign is like another game.
And they also had Space Base DS9 or D DSF9.
That was a game that they put together that they put out in early access.
It had been out for a while.
And then they said, okay, well, we're just going to finish it up.
We're going to release the 1.0 edition.
And then that's it.
We're dropping support for the game.
And so it's like, how much do people think has actually gone on the game?
I don't know.
I don't.
I mean, the Broken Age looks really good.
They got Elijah Wood to do the voice acting of one of the protagonists.
And so it looks polished, and I hear it's a lot of fun, but at the same time, it's like, you know, a game can be fun, but let's look at the business practices here.
Yeah, I mean, $120,000 a month just to exist in San Francisco.
Am I understanding that correctly?
Yeah, to pay their employees, and they have a small development team, too, apparently.
Okay, okay, that's the small.
Someone just tweeted me, Tim Schaefer is the George Lucas of video games.
I would say yes and no.
Lucas, you know what, we have Jar Jar, so fuck him for that.
But he also still helped push Star Wars to be something.
Whereas Schaefer is just like, I don't know what to do, everybody.
Why don't you just give me more money and I'll figure it out?
Yeah, I heard that they'd somehow run out of money on that project.
I'm thinking, well, if you ask for $400,000, you've got $3.3 million, and now you're out of money, then you have taken...
You've either fucked up dramatically, catastrophically, or you're...
What are you doing?
A bit funny about it.
Funny bits is going on.
Something's going on, you know.
Yeah, I know.
I laugh at that too.
It's kind of like Mighty Number 9.
They were looking for $900,000.
They raised over $3 million.
And then they've gone back to Kickstarter.
No, they went to Indiegogo to raise $100,000 for voice acting, for English voice acting.
And I've done translation work before for Tamagotchi.
I did 12 episodes of Tamagotchi.
We did it for like $1,200.
So this was like 36 characters, for like $1,200 and shit.
And so the point is, you don't need $100,000 to pay for fucking English voice acting.
Yeah, I do.
Fly some voice actor from Los Angeles or wherever to Japan is like $2,000.
There you go.
But yeah, you've got that.
And then now they're doing more DLC to try to, or no, they're doing another crowdfunding campaign in order to raise money for DLC.
The game's not even released yet.
It's early access has come out.
But they're trying to raise more money.
And it's just like, are you fucking mad in a fune?
Are you fucking psychotic?
I just can't believe how.
I mean, it beggars belief.
You cannot be so incompetent with money.
Or at least, I mean, I wouldn't have thought anyone could be.
It's not hard to put someone in a position that's going to be stupid with cash.
So it's really not.
The thing is, somebody needs to be paying attention to this.
And the people that aren't paying, the first, you know, when you raise a few times more than what you're looking for, you know, and you're up in the millions part of it, like, if you budgeted for 900,000, you stick to that budget and then you put everything else extra on top of that as you're working.
You know what I mean?
Like, I don't understand how they budgeted for 900K and yet they still squandered the rest of it.
Did Dina need a new fucking apartment or something?
I can only imagine.
I mean, all I can do is think of my own Kickstarter and think, right, okay, I had like £7,200, which is probably about $12,000.
And we scrimmed, don't get me wrong, we had to fucking barter with people and say, okay, well, we'll give you like 5% of the profits and all this sort of stuff.
But this is all in the contracts that we've got with the artists and stuff.
And we managed to get it.
It took longer than I was hoping for, but probably because of my inexperience rather than anything else.
But we fucking, you know, we managed to get the game.
I mean, everything that's needed to be paid for is paid for.
We're completely within budget, you know, not by much, but we're in budget and everything's paid for.
And it's now just about me not fucking up with the coding, really.
And I'm confident enough I can do what needs to be done.
So it really frustrates me to hear that someone gets 3.3 million and then sort of fucks.
I know.
I don't get it.
I mean, it's like, you know, I work a lot with crowdfunding in Hollywood for the independent side of things.
I've worked with a lot of people who have come to me over advice for that kind of shit.
And it's like, you know, I look at their business plan.
I'm like, a lot of people don't have business plans.
They don't have, I mean, that's where I give Jenny Barrage some credit here, breaking it down at least in that 20-page PDF.
There's a better cost breakdown.
I think, yeah, I thought she was in a hurry to start with, really, wasn't she?
I think that's yeah.
I think that she jumped the gun, in my opinion, but she's she's at least trying to make up for it now.
There was a guy who was trying to do a movie a couple years ago.
He was losing his sight.
Eventually, he was going to go blind, and he was trying to raise $100,000 to do a movie.
And nowhere on his Kickstarter campaign did it break down precisely what the cost was, right?
What was going to be going to what, and everything like this.
And a lot of people were looking at this as like, oh, I need to help this poor guy out that they were like, you know, shilling for his Kickstarter and everything for a while and like cramming it.
I was getting emails like daily from people about it and stuff.
And I'm like, look, if you want my help, I need to know more info.
I'm not going to market this out to people who would listen unless I have more info.
And the guy wouldn't give it and he eventually didn't make it.
But gaming's a little bit different.
Gaming's like, for some reason now, people are more willing to throw money at something probably because these people all know each other.
And I think that's part of it, too.
Is you look at all the websites that push the Kickstarter stuff, they're all friends of theirs.
Of course.
They were really pushing for Tim Schaefer to do what he needed to do with Broken Age because they all live in San Francisco.
He lives in San Francisco.
That's why I've said that it's very much a symbiotic relationship in terms of indie devs and games journalists because games journalists are tired of effectively shilling for AAA publishers, right?
I mean, that's true.
After a while, you'd get really upset if all you're doing is talking about Call of Duty 35 or the next whatever Madden game or whatever, and you want to see something more productive, maybe more fun and kitschy.
So you come across these indie devs that have something that might speak to your interests, and then they need help.
And so then you go, oh, well, I can use my place to give them help that they need to help get their product made.
And then there comes that kind of like self-importance, that whole over-inflated ego of, oh, well, I helped you.
I can help others.
And then I think that's where a lot of it boils down to is the indie devs know they need the journalists.
So they suck up to the journalists.
And the journalists don't want to feel like they're just working for the man.
And they want to feel some maybe, I don't know, some levity or gratitude for what it is that they do.
And so then they work with the indie devs.
And it's this weird kind of fucking cycle, you know?
Yeah, I think a lot of it is stroking the egos of the press as well, which is a problem.
They are so far up their own asses.
They think so fucking highly of themselves.
And just pisses me off.
They are not nearly as good at anything as they think they are.
You read their shit, and it's just shit.
It's tat.
It could be in any fucking tabloid.
It's just blog and opinion and bullshit.
And it's just like any idiot could write this.
And you're the idiot writing it because you know the people who own the publication.
You've got friends.
That's how you're there.
It's nepotism.
It's not merit.
And just to address fuge 269, we're going to fuck when I go visit America or he comes and visits England.
Well, apparently I'm still on track to come visit England.
So, you know, because I'm coming to you, you're the power bottom.
Okay.
Just want that out there?
I can't promise that, man.
No, no.
That's in the contract.
Power bottom.
I can't promise that.
Okay, fine.
But yeah, so I was looking at Base Gamer, and Jenny's only got just shy of 16,000.
So I find she's got 24 days left, so it's not undoable.
But have you seen anything media-wise going on with it?
No, I haven't seen anything at all, really.
Let's see.
She's posted the video.
I think my internet's just about to backflip.
It sounds like it's about ready to crap out.
Yeah, if it does, I'll be back.
But yeah, Karen, I can hear you for now.
Okay, yeah, I think that share positions.
No way, dude, I'm selfish.
You've got, I haven't seen much from her.
I know she's talked with other people, but it's like I haven't seen anything really written up on TechRaptor or Games Niche or anything like that.
Or niche gamer, I mean.
I haven't really seen anything.
But then again, I haven't necessarily been looking.
No, I haven't.
And I understand why they might be reluctant to fund, you know, cover a video game website, given that they are video game websites and they are competition.
So I'm not that surprised, but it's not the same thing.
You know, I mean, when we did the Hangout with it, I really don't see the point of including professional critics in any of it.
I would have thought it would have been much, much better if it was just literally community.
So anyone could log in, sign up for an account, write a goddamn review of something, post it, and then if it had several tiers to get to the front page or something, so it just gets upvoted or downvoted and goes through whatever vetting process by the public to get to the main page.
And that way you could actually have a community driven, and it would be like, you know, it would be user reviews rather than critic reviews.
And, you know, you'll get a whole slew of shit reviews, but you'll get the ones that are good, and the cream will rise to the top.
Yeah, and they tend to rise at the top, too.
Yeah, absolutely.
The cream will rise.
And it'll be entirely based on merit and it will be democratic.
And I don't see the need for professional critics on there at all.
I don't see the need for in-house critics.
I would completely understand if they had a section on there that was journalism, investigative journalism about the industry.
I think that would be a great thing.
But again, it's not necessary, and it's not necessarily something they should start with.
And I don't see it being in direct competition with niche gamer or good gamers or anything like that.
So I'm genuinely surprised that they aren't covering it just because it would be an extra tool in the community's arsenal.
They could reference popular reviews and the most liked or upvoted, even if it was just to get the voice of the people, the pulse of what the average gamer's thinking.
Yeah, I think, you know, I'm also, I think, at the point, I agree with you about the professional side of things, or like the big name critics.
You don't need them.
I know Rotten Tomatoes has their slight.
I mean, I think what it is when she says Rotten Tomatoes with having their select few that they choose from, like a pool that they pull from, it's kind of like, you know, I think what it is too is it's also going to create the system for journalists to go, oh, I want to be base gamer approved.
And then if you're base gamer approved, then you can submit your reviews to them and then they'll look at it, then they'll put it up on the meta site and everything, and they'll be able to kind of calculate that particular score.
And I feel that I agree.
I think that's a bit too much.
I just think that's a bit too much.
Fuck it.
Just do it as a Vox populate.
Because then that way you'll find people who are genuinely good at what they do.
And if you've got accounts on them, which they do have accounts.
If someone repeatedly posts like great reviews, really fucking good reviews, and they're constantly getting really upvoted, then review sites might want to employ them.
It'd be a way for people who are good at what they do to get attention and who can get into the industry based on how good they are, not because they fucking know someone.
It's about the doors that it opens and the things that would allow to do.
I guess I'm getting frustrated with it because I don't see much media attention.
I don't see her doing all that much.
And I find it kind of disappointing because I think it's a great idea.
I think that there are, if it was done in the way that I'm suggesting, I would be so behind it, you know.
But yeah, again, I just don't see enough from her.
And I think it's disappointing.
It's a little bit, yeah.
I mean, I mean personally, I would see it something like you have the page.
It's kind of like, you know, you would just do the thumbs up, thumbs down.
That's about really.
And then maybe you go, oh, well, here are, you know, users of Base Gamer who do let's plays, perhaps.
Maybe they've got their let's plays up here or their first impressions or a video from them about this.
And then that's posted up.
Anyone could add a let's play.
And then, yeah, put it on YouTube and then they get, you know?
Yeah.
Just categories, written reviews, video reviews, let's plays.
You know, you could have all these sort of things.
And they really wouldn't be that hard to do because it'd just be tags.
Yeah, it would just be tags.
And then, you know, having a broken down one to 100 score just feels so archaic to me right now.
Yeah, I agree.
The fiscal Ebert thumbs up, thumbs down.
It works for movies.
It also works for games.
Or if you really want to play it up, don't do the metacritic of the thing.
Break it down.
Break it down.
It's got a, you know, like what's the monetary value?
Is it 20 bucks, 40 bucks, 60 bucks?
Right?
Yeah.
I think that's a fucking fair assessment as well.
It's like, you know, people like, you know, that's how my friends and I do it.
My buddy buys a new game.
Well, he'll play it.
And I'm like, how is it?
And he's like, yeah, it's pretty.
He'll tell me what he likes about it.
I'm like, all right, full price.
I liked a rating system.
I liked it.
It's just four categories.
Just like, you know, it's really, you know, I'd strongly recommend it.
It's okay.
I'd kind of recommend it.
Ambivalent, or I wouldn't recommend it.
That's perfectly easy and readable.
And it's not like, you know, it's not like, oh, it's a 7 out of 10 or it's a 6.5.
It's like, yeah, what's the difference between 6.5 and 7 for fuck's sake?
Nothing.
It makes no difference to me whatsoever.
So I'm not a fan of the actual number reviews, but I think just recommended on a scale of 1 to 4.
Would you recommend it or would you not recommend it?
With a bit of middle in between, I think that's a great system to do it because it's got a bit of nuance, but it's also clean and easy to get to grips with, isn't it?
No, I agree.
I agree.
I think there's a lot of good things about it.
But I'd like to see, I mean, we both have our opinions, but I think at the same time, we need, you know, we can be critical, and that's fine.
But let's give Jenny the benefit of the doubt.
let's see what she comes up with if she's I don't think that her motives are I don't think she's like I mean she may well be trying to carve a career for herself but I don't necessarily blame her And it's not a bad thing that she's trying to do.
So, you know, I've put $10 in.
It's only $10.
If she fucks me, she fucks me.
It's fan fiction then, isn't it?
There you go, guys.
There you go.
There's your next Jenny fucks Sargon for $10.
Written by Milo.
Yeah.
Some people ask some good questions in the comments.
Let me just, John, my skepticism isn't turned off, man.
You know, I've.
I've been skeptical, and I am still skeptical, but I'm happy to take the risk.
It's about cost reward.
Someone else said it's high risk, high reward.
And it's like, yeah, that's exactly it.
I'm willing to believe that I may lose that $10.
But at the end of the day, if I don't kick in any money and if nobody kicks any money, there's no chance of getting an actual good site that I probably would actually review.
I would go on there and actually write my own reviews for video games.
The ones I particularly play.
Because my problem is, the reason I don't review video games is I don't join a website and become a video game reviewer and all this sort of stuff because I don't love the subject.
It's because I'm not interested in having to review things.
You have to review things when you're a video game reviewer.
I'm interested in doing it at my own leisure, as and when I feel like it, to things that I'm interested in actually reviewing.
And I'm not saying necessarily I want to give a biased review.
I'm happy to give an unbiased review.
For example, I would have given one to Rome 2, and I would have just given my list of categorical fucking complaints about the game based on my expectations given the previous titles in the series.
Just a quick thing.
Sorry.
If anyone's still tweeting curbs, stop.
We're not having anyone else on now.
We're just bullshitting.
We should have stopped days ago, but fuck it.
We're talking shit now.
We're just shooting shit.
We don't get to do this enough.
So, you know, fuck it.
But yeah, stop tweeting because he's not up now.
But yeah, so yeah, it's a risk.
I'm, you know, happy to get screwed by her if she takes my money and runs or fucks it up or whatever.
The potential outcome, I think, is worth the risk.
And that's just me.
I'm not saying to anyone else they should do it, but that's how I look at it.
Yeah, we talked about it and everything, like, what, last week, week before last, somewhere in there?
We talked about that and everything.
And I think that, you know, Jenny, you know, she's got a good idea.
And I think that we're at a point where we need to start creating in terms of how Gamergate is.
And that's going to be, you know, we've got to start somewhere because, you know, Escapist is a great place to have a conversation, but that's, I don't know, I mean, what more are we going to get from them?
You know, how is it going to benefit in the long run?
Yeah, they're not changing.
They're not coming back.
We've got to build things that outperform them now.
You know, when the video game websites that we all support are suddenly doing so much better than Kotaku and Rock, Paper, Shotgun, and Destructive and all that, then that's the proof in the pudding, isn't it?
Yeah.
I'm not going to lie.
If I could see Rock, Paper, Shotgun knock down a couple pegs, I'm okay with that.
I tell you what, someone's like, it's going to be crazy when Sagram reveals that he's indeed an East Sakisen.
I tell you, you're all going to be so pissed off at me when I appear in one of her videos.
Don't worry, I'm never going to appear in one of her videos.
No, he probably will never appear.
Well, I mean, I could probably appear in one of those things, you know.
I would love to have a conversation with her, though.
She would never do it.
It's so obvious she would never do it.
You know, there is just it could not happen because even like Colbert, when she was with him, he was as a parody asking her the questions that he thinks that we would want to ask in a parody way, but they were still the right questions in a way.
And holy shit, did she look like a tool?
I just thought she looked wrong all over on that thing.
She looked just like some fucking obviously like someone who doesn't care about games and is just trying to piss you know, fiddle with other people's fucking hobbies.
But yeah, so were you going to say something before I kept going off on one?
No, no, no, no.
I wasn't.
I wasn't.
Oh, here's something funny.
The new Twitter for Internet Aristocrat is saying that he's been confirmed by King of Pole and he's posted to Vogarus.
So let's give me a funny statement in the chat because I'm going to ask him to tweet or to Vokaroo a funny statement that's coming from this chat.
So to say something random and also probably offensive.
So do that.
Let's come on, chat.
Give us something good to work with here.
I don't think Sargon as part of the problem is going to work.
But nice try.
Yeah, no, no, you can do.
Well, whatever.
Just something, something that.
Something that, you know.
Yeah.
Actually, just as a quick side note, I talked about the PlayStation experience earlier.
I might actually go because I can rent a car for 50 bucks for two days.
And I can.
So what was that?
Sorry?
I was looking at the chat.
Oh, the PlayStation experience in Las Vegas?
Oh, okay.
I don't know about that.
Yeah, it's a two-day event because you've got the Games Award shows tomorrow.
And you've got the PlayStation experience after that.
And so I'm going to pricing it right now.
Because I really want to get out of the state at least once more before I move.
And wouldn't mind bombing over.
You know, it's 50%.
55 console peasants do.
That's what you console peasants.
Well, it's not just, it is just what I could meet Boogie2988.
So I'll tell him that he's a cool guy, man, because he seems like a cool guy.
Yeah.
And then I could do that.
And then it would.
That's not bad.
That's not bad at all.
Now, the thing is, though, I have to be careful how I approach that to my girlfriend.
Be like, so listen, babe.
Hang on, hang on, hand.
Someone said, Gen say, where is it?
Sargon, you ragging faggot.
It wasn't a flounce, it was a masterpiece.
Yeah, get and say that.
Okay, hold on.
Sargon, let me find it in the chat here.
Sargon, I'm not going to have him say Sargon loves circumcising black people.
No, no, no.
Let me find it.
I can't find it.
It's a chat movie.
Darren Wilson is my hero.
Nice.
See, this gets us to the tone policing thing, right?
And this is something I want to talk about because I can understand the arguments for and against, and that's kind of the problem with the whole tone policing thing.
I mean, I'm personally not the sort of person who likes tone policing.
I like saying shit because it's funny.
But I think there's a time and a place for it.
And often it's not on Twitter when you've got loads of people using that as ammunition against us.
It's just bad tactics.
It's just silly.
It hands them a victory.
And that pisses me off.
Not because, you know, I don't want people saying shit, but it's like, you know, you're giving them ammo.
Don't get me wrong.
I know that in a lot of ways, it doesn't fucking matter because no matter what happens, they're going to shout shit.
They're going to make shit up.
They always make shit up.
But what is that they're not going to say?
What haven't they already said?
Game against worse than ISIS, all this bullshit.
And it's like, so.
Well, it all came from one fucking idiot, too.
So.
Yeah.
It all came from that one guy.
Do me a favor.
Okay, because I cannot find that flouncing thing in the chat because it's moving way too quick.
If you have that, can you just post it in the Google Hangout chat?
I'll tweet it to his ass right now.
Let's see if we can get him to do it.
I've fucking lost it now.
Jesus, because the chat is going faster than I was.
There's like 900 people in there and they're all talking.
It's like, oh, shit.
I've lost it, man.
I've lost it.
Yeah, Sargon only shouts during anal sex.
That's not true.
I shot it other times.
Okay.
Yeah, so in a lot of ways, I can understand the arguments for and against tone policing.
And it's more about when you want to reach out to sort of mainstream media that suddenly you start to wish that maybe you had done a little bit of it because they kind of don't want to touch you.
So it depends what you want to do.
But I mean, yeah, fuck it.
Somebody tweeted it to me.
Thank you very much.
All right.
Okay.
There we go.
What have they tweeted?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Someone sent me the links.
Or someone sent me the shit.
All right.
The shit of what, sir?
Oh, someone sent me the quote to say.
Oh, yeah.
Someone tweeted me what was said.
All right.
What was it again?
Remind me?
Oh, it was Sargon, you raging faggot.
It wasn't a flounce, it was a masterpiece.
Yeah, that's a fucking good, good little quote that.
Give him say that.
All right, there we go.
Sent off to internet aristocrats.
Just come on the fucking stream and we can talk shitty dip shit.
Honestly, you know, I just don't care.
I don't, you know, I'm not a drama guy.
I just, you know, I found it funny.
I like talking to him.
So, you know, I don't fucking know.
Here, I'm posting the link in the thing in the chat.
Tweet it to Internet.
A there we go.
Tweet this to him.
If we bum rush him with it, then you got he can't he cannot hide from it.
His yeah, he can all kinds of raging fucking excitement.
Oh, shit.
I fucked up the name of the handle, though.
That's my bad.
You spanner.
I know, I do that.
There we go.
Okay.
It's like the I.
It's the L where the I is.
That fucked me up.
So.
I'll tell you what, the radical bites parody, that was amazing.
Also, the Space Cat gal.
That was good, too.
I missed that one, actually.
I didn't see that one.
Oh, it was instead of the L at the end of gal, it was an uppercase I.
Yeah, yeah.
And so it really was confusing to people because they didn't know what to think from it.
I think that was the one that was tweeting out the thing about the Spurging or whatever.
I missed that.
I'm glad it wasn't the dog one.
I'm glad that was genuinely her.
Like a fucking twat.
The Jonathan Macintosh one was just so fucking perfect, though.
I actually tweeted him saying, man, do you mind being more obvious?
It's misleading to people because you genuinely sound just like him because he's fucking crazy.
Yeah.
But yeah, I got banned anyway.
All right, let's see here.
Let's see if anyone does it.
I'm curious now because now we're going to bum rush him with this.
And I'll be like, what the fuck is going on?
Like, you know, we want confirmation.
We want confirmation from him legitimately.
Someone just posted that Matty Bryce sort of thing.
And I think people don't understand why I posted it.
Literally, she's got written on the deaths of video games.
I mean, don't get me wrong, I'm sure she's going to be like, oh, it's ironic.
It's like, yes, but unless you're around to tell people it's ironic and your side is facing accusations of attempting to kill video games, writing death to video games isn't going to persuade people who don't know you dumbass.
But yeah, so that's fine.
But someone was like, holy shit, is this real?
So I tweeted him the link.
He's like, yeah, it's fucking real.
People have got such retarded points of view.
Just all of them.
Every single one of them.
This is fun.
This is good times.
So yeah, it's so here's my question, Sargon.
What is your game of the year so far?
What do you think is the best game you've played so far this year?
The best game I've played, or the best game that came out this year.
Ooh, ooh, that's a good one.
How about both?
Ringo Hard Mode.
Okay.
Let me get my Steam up, man.
I don't know.
I don't actually, like I said, I don't play new releases because most of them suck.
So, including my own.
Well, yeah, sorry, I'm waiting for Steam to load.
I really don't know what I bought that came out this year.
When did I Divine Cybermancy come out?
I quite have no idea.
No, I don't know when that came out, but I'll assume that it's just games I've played this year rather than games.
Sure, yeah, let's make it easy.
Let's make it easy.
Games I bought this year, say, because that's a lot easier.
I got Left 4 Dead 2 a while ago.
I've only played a few hours of it so far, but that's not because I didn't like it.
It's more because I'm at time.
It's nice.
I liked Left 4 Dead 1 a lot, so it's just more of the same, but that's exactly what I wanted.
These are not objective reviews, by the way.
No, that's okay, because you're not a reviewer.
You're not a reviewer, so it works out alright.
These are just my personal opinions on these games.
Sorry, someone's yelling at me at the chat.
Where is it?
Dana Rana, Randa.
What is it you want?
Yeah, iDivine Cybermancy.
I don't know when it came up, but I really liked it.
It was, I got it for like four quid on Steam, and it was just, I got it because me and a friend of mine, we were looking for sort of cooperative campaigns to play.
So we were, you know, just looking around, it was sort of like four quid on Steam or something.
No, it gone down to 75p, in fact.
And I was like, well, why not?
You know, how bad can it be?
And it turns out to be a really decent little fucking indie game that I think is done by a French studio.
It's sort of cyberpunk-ish.
It's very cyberpunk.
What am I talking about?
And it's got loads of really great little mechanics, like all the hacking and cyber sort of.
They're kind of like, it's kind of like a 40k sort of atmosphere.
So they think of the, you know, it's a religious or magical sort of angle with the technology, but not in a shit way.
And it's just really good.
And there are lots of different ways to play it, and you've got lots of different kind of characters.
I enjoyed it.
I'd recommend it.
I divine Cybermancy.
It was cheap as shit.
Probably the best one I've played this year.
Or Endless Legends is pretty good as well.
Okay.
I haven't played any of those games.
Yeah, Endless Legends like.
Console Peasant.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, these are all, yeah.
And Endless Legends, a, you know, isometric, or probably not isometric, but top-down strategy game.
But it's got multiplayer campaign, again, which I like.
I like multiplayer campaigns.
More games should have them.
Skyrim for fuck.
Bethesda.
Whoever's making Skyrim these days, I don't even know.
Just fuck me.
Just, I don't care if I'm not the main character.
I will happily follow my friend around all of Skyrim because we'll sit there in the same room and make fucking cooperative decisions for fuck's sake.
I'm happy to just play.
I don't even care if I don't get to make my own fucking character.
Let me control fucking.
What's her name?
What was the woman you get to control?
Lydia.
Let me control her.
I don't even care.
I just want to run around slaying dragons with my friends.
See, I want that though, but out of State of Decay.
I haven't played State of Decay.
State of Decay is on PC now.
It was originally an Xbox game that came out, an Xbox Live Arcade game that came out last year, like June 2013.
And it was in the running for my game of the year, flat out.
Like, not even kidding you.
It's a zombie survival RPG.
The map is like the same size as GTA 3, which is pretty decent.
And it's got permadeath.
So you find characters in the world, you work with them, you level them up, and then if they die, they die.
They're dead, they're out.
And it's like makes it for some really intense moments, especially with one of your favorite characters, it just gets fucked because there's some of the super zombies that run around.
And some of them, if you're not paying attention, if you're not listening, you get screwed in quick.
And so it's a fun game.
It's like 20 bucks.
But they've been talking about wanting to do what's it called?
Wanting to do co-op.
They want to do a co-op thing.
And then if they do that, that would be a blast to have a zombie MMO.
That's kind of why I think Dead Island 2 might actually be as big as they want it to be because it's going to have more of the co-op because Dead Island 1's co-op was amazing.
The game was buggy as shit, but when you're playing with friends, you don't fucking care.
You're drop kicking zombies off of everything and drowning them and shit.
It's fucking tactical zombie survival, for fuck's sake.
I'm just going to grab a couple of questions out of the chat.
Yeah, yeah, go ahead.
Keep asking me.
Now I've lost the questions that I was going to answer.
That's the problem with the chat.
It goes so quick.
It does.
Yeah, I've got to scroll back up.
Yeah, Lacey or Lachy?
Yes, I agree.
The DLC on State of Decay is really good.
The stuff is awesome.
I really recommend it.
Cool.
Did I play Heroes of My Magic?
Yes, I fucking did.
I love Heroes of My Magic.
I played 2, 3, 4, and 5.
Five was easily the best looking, but I don't know.
By the time Five came out, it lost the luster a little bit.
I don't know what had gone wrong with it, to be honest.
I played it, and then I was like, nah, you know, I'll go back to four.
And then I played four a bit more.
What I like about four is you can control the heroes as a unit on the field.
I really like that.
It's fucking awesome.
However, the rest of four is really bizarre.
The characters stand in such weird ways in the animations.
I know that's a really petty thing to be critical of, but it just looks weird.
Everything about it looks odd.
I mean, the game itself was fine.
I enjoyed it.
But three is still the king.
It's the fucking best by a long way.
Hands down, no questions asked.
Don't know why.
It just got every little thing right.
Even though you don't have the heroes on the field, it was still fucking tits.
You know, just the tits.
I also play the other magic games.
Might Magic 7, where you're running around with a party of like four people, and you can talk to people in the world.
I know that's not the incredible thing, but the incredible thing is the world itself is really, really, really, really well put together.
And you need to speak to people to level up in certain skills, which gives you a reason to actually go to places.
And individuals, just like random peasants walking around, they'll have skills that they can teach you if you pay them, obviously.
And so, yeah, it's just a really fucking solid RPG game.
And it's kind of like first-person party.
So like I have the beholder, but you can just wander around.
And it was just the tits.
And yeah, so that's awesome.
I love my fucking old games.
I'm really looking forward to getting Legend of Grimrock.
I should have got it.
I've never got it.
And Legend of Grim Rock 2 is coming out, so I'm just going to fucking dive straight into that.
Very cool.
Yeah, I should.
I got to get into more PC games.
I'm not going to lie.
I catch a lot of shit for being a console peasant.
But I do pick up some games.
I bought Nidhog for the PS4, and I like it a lot.
I just wish I had multiplayer.
Or I had a second controller to do the multiplayer on that, but it's actually quite a bit of fun for a game.
I don't know if it was worth $15.
$15 for that game not having multiplayer, like online multiplayer?
I'm a little bit.
But the gameplay itself is a lot of fun, and I can easily pick up a stream and do a stream with it and everything and have a lot of fun with it.
So I'm okay with that.
But I really wouldn't mind.
That's why this war of mine, I really, really liked the Let's Play.
So I picked it up, and I think the game's a blast.
So there's a lot of good games on PC, and I'm kind of slowly working my way to that, I guess.
I just want to stress to everyone, there's really nothing wrong with being a console peasant.
It's just, you know, it's easy to wind people up about.
It's just a joke, you know, like everything.
It's just fucking joking, isn't it?
You know, there's, you know, play on the fucking system you'd like.
Just if someone tells you something you don't fucking agree with, you don't care, just fucking say, I don't care.
And do what you want.
But someone's like, Can New IA on Twitter is not him.
Of course it's not fucking him.
No, I don't think it's him.
Because a lot of people have tweeted that to him and it's nothing yet.
Yeah.
Boom.
I might actually see if my mum wants to get me off for Christmas or something.
And I might live stream it or something like that.
So I actually have a Twitch account.
But isn't oh, is there a reason we're supposed to be not using Twitch?
Are they anti-Gamergate?
No, Twitch is.
I don't think Twitch is anti-Gamergate.
I don't think Twitch has a horse in this race.
Okay, that's cool.
Because I set up one, and I was basically waiting for my internet to work.
But obviously, that's never going to happen.
But since I'll be at my folks, it shouldn't be a problem.
I think, well, now that you can do this tweet, the Steam broadcasting, that's going to, I think, blow up.
A lot of people seem to really like it too.
I haven't looked at that yet, but that's something I will definitely have to do.
Yeah, because I do own, for those of you guys who are wondering about me gaming on PC, I did actually pick up Day-Z.
I bought the Alpha or the Early Access, whatever, the standalone.
For when I can get a PC that will run it, I have that.
So that will be coming down the pipeline at some point.
Right.
Someone's just said, what do you think of the Anti-Gamergate concert in Montreal?
What?
Who in the what now?
Little Fatso has just asked that.
And I'm curious and I would like to know more.
Yeah, that is very weird.
I don't know.
Yeah, I have no idea.
Right, it's coming on half two now.
So I think we probably should give it a knock on the head because I'm getting a bit knackered, to be honest.
Right, it's also 4:30 in the morning where you live, right?
2:30.
2:30 is.
Oh, okay.
For some reason, I thought you were.
You're eight hours ahead.
That's right.
So it's not so bad.
No, no, it's not so bad, but I'm starting to flag a little bit.
But it's been really cool, man.
I've really enjoyed just shooting the shit with chat and with you and doing the stream earlier with everyone else on it.
It's been really cool.
And I think, honestly, I found myself feeling a lot more optimistic and a lot better about everything.
I don't know how about everyone else, but I don't know.
I'm just suddenly finding my spirits a lot more lifted than they were before.
Well, that's good, man.
That's all you can ask for.
Yeah, well, I hope other people did.
And, you know, we'll be doing another one of these streams at some point, probably next week or the week after.
It's really about when Kirbs can do it, to be honest.
He's the guy who does all the hard work here.
So it's about him, to be honest.
But again, don't dogpun him and make him do it.
It's just, you know, it's whenever he's got the time, because he's got a life and stuff.
He's got stuff he needs to do.
Don't make excuses.
I'm not.
I'm not.
You know, he's genuinely, he's volunteers the time and all that sort of stuff.
Good on him.
He deserves all the credit.
Cheers for coming on, man.
Cheers for yeah.
I guess final thing here is I'm currently buying my tickets for Sunday for PlayStation Experience.
I've already booked my car.
So I'm going to go.
Cool, man.
Cool.
I'm going to head out to Vegas.
Are you going to do a video and tell everyone how it went and whatnot?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
I'll be bringing some stuff.
I'll try to bring my video camera and definitely have my phone charged up and everything so I can take some video and shit.
But yeah, this is, it's really, I've been able to put it together.
It's not so bad.
It's only going to cost me like about probably maybe $100 for the tickets and the car rental.
It's just not that bad.
And that ain't shit.
That's fine.
I wanted to go and I can check out Uncharted 4 and meet Boogie2988, which would be a lot of fun.
And if anyone else is going, hit me up.
Cool.
Well, do that, guys.
And yeah, thanks for everyone turning up.
Even like guys, you know, sending shit.
I really like the banter, you know.
Really fucking enjoy it.
And I'm really glad that like 900 of you stuck around to listen to us talk shit about e-celebrity drama and fucking all this sort of bollocks.
It's been cool, man.
Cool.
Right.
Take it easy, everyone.
Thanks for joining us.
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