Behind the Bastards - Part Two: Peter Nygard: The Epstein of Fashion
Aired: 2022-10-27
Duration: 01:11:10


=== Trust Your Girlfriends (05:39) ===

[00:00:00]  This is an iHeart podcast.
[00:00:02]  Guaranteed human.
[00:00:04]  When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.
[00:00:13]  I vowed I will be his last target.
[00:00:15]  He is not going to get away with this.
[00:00:17]  He's going to get what he deserves.
[00:00:19]  We always say that.
[00:00:21]  Trust your girlfriends.
[00:00:24]  Listen to the girlfriends.
[00:00:25]  Trust me, babe.
[00:00:26]  On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:00:36]  I'm Lori Siegel, and this is Mostly Human, a tech podcast through a human lens.
[00:00:41]  This week, an interview with OpenAI CEO Sam Altman.
[00:00:44]  I think society is going to decide that creators of AI products bear a tremendous amount of responsibility to the products we put out in the world.
[00:00:51]  An in-depth conversation with a man who's shaping our future.
[00:00:55]  My highest order bit is to not destroy the world with AI.
[00:00:58]  Listen to Mostly Human on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
[00:01:07]  Hey, it's Nora Jones, and my podcast, Playing Along, is back with more of my favorite musicians.
[00:01:12]  Check out my newest episode with Josh Groban.
[00:01:15]  You related to the Phantom at that point.
[00:01:18]  Yeah, I was definitely the Phantom in that.
[00:01:20]  That's so funny.
[00:01:21]  Shari stay with me each night, each morning.
[00:01:29]  Listen to Nora Jones is playing along on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:01:37]  What's up, everyone?
[00:01:38]  I'm Ego Modem.
[00:01:39]  My next guest, it's Will Farrell.
[00:01:43]  My dad gave me the best advice ever.
[00:01:46]  He goes, just give it a shot.
[00:01:48]  But if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
[00:01:55]  If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
[00:01:57]  It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there.
[00:02:04]  Yeah, it would not be.
[00:02:06]  Right, it wouldn't be that.
[00:02:07]  There's a lot of life.
[00:02:09]  Listen to Thanks Dad on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:02:17]  Oh, yeah, it's Behind the Bastards.
[00:02:22]  The podcast, but I opened this episode with something that might kind of sound like an orgasm.
[00:02:30]  So, you know what?
[00:02:32]  Why don't you take that clip of, oh gosh, what was the movie?
[00:02:36]  Why are you doing that?
[00:02:38]  Meg Ryan has like a loud fake orgasm.
[00:02:40]  What movie?
[00:02:41]  When Harry Met Sally.
[00:02:42]  When Harry Met Sally.
[00:02:44]  Why don't you mix those together and put it up on the subreddit and be real quick?
[00:02:48]  Why are you?
[00:02:49]  Okay, first of all, why not doing this yourself?
[00:02:54]  Why not?
[00:02:54]  Because maybe Sophie and Dieter stare into the little of their own madness, then they'll turn around.
[00:03:02]  Maybe that's the healthy thing to do.
[00:03:04]  We're going to have to have a meeting.
[00:03:06]  We have so many meetings.
[00:03:08]  I know.
[00:03:09]  Isn't this the intervention?
[00:03:10]  I thought that was the...
[00:03:11]  That's why you had me on.
[00:03:13]  Good call.
[00:03:15]  Oh, more heavily armed people than either of you have tried.
[00:03:22]  Although, since we are recording in my house right now, you might be closer to my living room rifle than I am at the moment.
[00:03:29]  All I've got is my nine.
[00:03:34]  Oh, boy.
[00:03:36]  Margaret, Killjoy, Behind the Bastards, podcast.
[00:03:39]  Margaret, host, cool people who did cool stuff and live like the world is dying.
[00:03:44]  Author of We Won't Be Here Tomorrow.
[00:03:47]  See, that's how you fucking.
[00:03:48]  I'd say you do an introduction.
[00:03:50]  All right.
[00:03:50]  I can do it when I want to, Margaret.
[00:03:52]  Yeah.
[00:03:53]  Now, Margaret, is it not true that you are currently crashing in my house?
[00:03:59]  I plead that, no, yeah, I am.
[00:04:00]  Yeah.
[00:04:01]  How's that going?
[00:04:02]  Did we or did we not go to a Renaissance fair last weekend where we and then afterwards watched the Ed Harris George Romero movie Knight Riders?
[00:04:11]  Oh, it was amazing.
[00:04:12]  Both parts of this.
[00:04:13]  Absolutely amazing.
[00:04:15]  So is it also true that we got to hang on and it was super fun?
[00:04:19]  I know.
[00:04:20]  I love it.
[00:04:21]  I finally got to meet my co-workers at CoolZone Media by driving out to the West Coast.
[00:04:27]  It is.
[00:04:27]  And watching Robert buy a very large sword and being kind of jealous.
[00:04:31]  I did buy a very sword.
[00:04:32]  That's essentially the standard practice here.
[00:04:35]  Yeah.
[00:04:36]  Yeah.
[00:04:36]  Cool zone media.
[00:04:37]  I wanted you to buy a large sword so that I now have a sword fight in my backyard.
[00:04:41]  I know I almost did, but then instead I bought a really nice like handmade woolen cowl.
[00:04:45]  You did.
[00:04:45]  It is a nice cowl.
[00:04:46]  Yeah.
[00:04:47]  It is a nice cowl.
[00:04:48]  Your cowl will keep you warmer than my sword.
[00:04:50]  Yeah.
[00:04:51]  Although if we're attacked by saracens, then who's got the advantage?
[00:04:57]  Yeah, that's true.
[00:04:58]  That's right.
[00:04:59]  That's right.
[00:05:01]  Possibly still you, depending on what time of year it happens.
[00:05:04]  So, Margaret, I am, among other things, having to rejigger this script slightly because I had said it in my head the whole time as Nygard K. Even though I have been to many places that are keys and I know it's supposed to be pronounced key.
[00:05:20]  I still called it K in my head and I don't know why.
[00:05:22]  I don't know why my brain did that to me, but it feels like an affront.
[00:05:25]  Huh.
[00:05:26]  How is it spelled?
[00:05:28]  C-A-Y.
[00:05:30]  Huh.
[00:05:32]  So like the Florida keys are spelled.
[00:05:35]  No.
[00:05:36]  No, they're not.
[00:05:37]  They're spelled K-E-Y-S, if I'm not mistaken.
[00:05:39]  Yeah.

=== The Real Bastard (05:20) ===

[00:05:40]  None of it makes sense.
[00:05:41]  And I'm livid.
[00:05:42]  I'm just angry, Margaret.
[00:05:44]  That is the real bastard of this episode.
[00:05:48]  This is the dictionary.
[00:05:50]  This one's pretty bad, actually.
[00:05:51]  It might be worse than the dictionary.
[00:05:52]  The nomadic war machine geared towards destroying the Merriam-Webster dictionary or whoever makes things be pronounced ways.
[00:06:00]  I don't actually know who that is.
[00:06:01]  So Nygerd Key was the destroy society.
[00:06:08]  I guess this is now an accelerationist podcast.
[00:06:11]  Nygerd Key was not the only thing Peter Nygard named after himself.
[00:06:15]  His fashion company, his jet, his bottled water that he served at his compound, and a specific copyrighted shade of electric blue were all named after him.
[00:06:25]  And it's the shade of blue that he wears on himself all the time.
[00:06:29]  I bet his car is that color.
[00:06:31]  Oh, he wanted to.
[00:06:32]  I bet a lot of them are.
[00:06:33]  Yeah.
[00:06:33]  Yeah.
[00:06:34]  Now, before the stories broke that we talked about last episode and that we're about to talk in this episode, this all helped to solidify his legend as one of the most infamously wealthy Playboys of the fashion industry.
[00:06:46]  Peter tended to wear Nyigard blue v-necks with a V that went down further than I think ought to be entirely legal.
[00:06:54]  I found a really good shot of it where like there's a woman next to him who is wearing a V-neck or like a V-front top that like shows the most of her breasts and her belly button and it's only slightly deeper than his shirt.
[00:07:09]  Yeah.
[00:07:09]  Like he is he is almost showing as much chest as her.
[00:07:14]  Yeah.
[00:07:14]  He cuts it above his belly because he's shy.
[00:07:17]  Yeah.
[00:07:18]  Yeah.
[00:07:18]  He's a little bit shy.
[00:07:19]  I bet he wouldn't have done that 20 years ago.
[00:07:21]  Yeah.
[00:07:22]  And I think the whole of that is his old dress that she's wearing.
[00:07:25]  She's wearing his old clothes.
[00:07:28]  I just can't do it anymore.
[00:07:29]  Yeah.
[00:07:31]  It's interesting.
[00:07:31]  I also think that blue shirt he's wearing is the shade of blue he named after himself, which just looks like light blue.
[00:07:38]  Not that exciting a shade in blue.
[00:07:41]  I don't have any issues.
[00:07:41]  It's perfectly pleasant shade of blue.
[00:07:43]  It's blue.
[00:07:44]  It's blue, right?
[00:07:45]  It's blue.
[00:07:46]  You didn't invent like a new cut.
[00:07:48]  Like, it's blue, bro.
[00:07:50]  It's just blue.
[00:07:51]  Yeah.
[00:07:51]  Alternatively, if he had to dress up for a party or a social event, he tended to wear layers of elaborate costume-grade clothing that made him look like a cross between an elderly Fabio and an extra from Pirates of the Caribbean.
[00:08:03]  And boy, this next shot is quite an outfit.
[00:08:06]  He's got like a really, and this ascot is an electric blue.
[00:08:10]  Looks like it's silk.
[00:08:11]  He's got a tuxedo shirt, and then what looks like a, it's not quite a tuxedo jacket because it's a little more casual than that, but it looks like it's almost like a velour or maybe a velvet gray on the inside.
[00:08:23]  It's a vampire extra.
[00:08:25]  He looks like he's playing Vampire the Masquerade tonight.
[00:08:28]  Yeah.
[00:08:29]  Like, he looks like he's doing vampire LARPing.
[00:08:32]  Yeah.
[00:08:33]  Except for he has an incredibly deep tan, and no one who has ever played Vampire the Masquerade had a tan.
[00:08:39]  That's true because they would die if they were exposed to that.
[00:08:41]  They would die.
[00:08:41]  Exactly.
[00:08:42]  That's just not very good Kfabe.
[00:08:46]  Do you call it Kayfabe and LARPing?
[00:08:48]  Because you should.
[00:08:49]  I don't know what Kayfabe is, but I also am a poser about LARPing and that I write about it sometimes, but I'm really a tabletop girl.
[00:08:59]  Well, I mean, yeah, that I get.
[00:09:02]  But you do have a nice set of Renaissance bear clothes.
[00:09:06]  That's true.
[00:09:06]  I kind of just wear them anyway.
[00:09:08]  No, Kayfabe, Margaret, this is important for you to know.
[00:09:11]  K-forfabe is a wrestling term, and it's the practice of like maintaining the illusion that like whatever it is, whatever ridiculous shit you're doing in your wrestling storyline is completely real.
[00:09:23]  Like if you hate a guy, that you actually hate each other, that if the character is like a bad guy, that he's a real bad guy.
[00:09:29]  Yeah, like that's Kayfabe.
[00:09:30]  Okay.
[00:09:32]  Wrestling is fascinating from a cultural standpoint.
[00:09:36]  And also, he does kind of look like a wrestler because of how much skin he shows and precisely where he shows it.
[00:09:43]  From what I can discern from a truly unfortunate amount of time spent looking at photos of this man, he tended to go shirtless much more often in his 50s and 60s in the early aughts, which were the height of his party days.
[00:09:54]  One photo shows him wearing a vest and nothing else.
[00:09:57]  Skin is red as a stop sign, hair down past his shoulders, and Robert De Niro standing next to him looking absolutely miserably.
[00:10:07]  Robert De Niro does not want to be in this photograph.
[00:10:10]  It is an amazing shot.
[00:10:14]  Oh, no.
[00:10:15]  I scrolled down.
[00:10:16]  Please tell us about the next.
[00:10:18]  Bob De Niro does not want to be there.
[00:10:21]  No.
[00:10:21]  And here's a photo of him at around the same time, slightly less red, but just as shirtless, with a camo jacket over his naked chest and a parrot, a live parrot on his shoulder.
[00:10:32]  He has his arm around Sean Connery.
[00:10:35]  Sean Connery.
[00:10:36]  That's what I thought I was.
[00:10:38]  And Sean looks perfectly comfortable.
[00:10:40]  Sean Connery was meant to be there.
[00:10:43]  This is what he was born to.
[00:10:44]  He's living his best life.
[00:10:46]  The look on his face is the, I'm posing with a fan the way I do this every day, and my life is fine.
[00:10:52]  That is his look.
[00:10:54]  Unlike De Niro, who is like, in the process of being aware of the family, why are you having someone to get this man away from me?

=== Famous People Present (14:51) ===

[00:11:00]  I came down here and there's no walls between the bedrooms.
[00:11:03]  I would like to go home.
[00:11:04]  I need to leave.
[00:11:06]  Sean Ponnery is like I've never actually seen walls in a bedroom.
[00:11:14]  Peter bragged constantly about his sexual partners and libertine lifestyle.
[00:11:18]  He joked in one interview that celebrity was, quote, the worst 20 minutes of my life.
[00:11:23]  Workers at the key say his nightly routine was to have them light torches at sunset and play the theme from the Phantom of the Opera before he and his guests engaged in pamper parties.
[00:11:35]  How you doing, Margaret?
[00:11:36]  Jesus Christ.
[00:11:37]  I mean, like, it's one of these things where it's like, if everything he did was consensual and sort of nothing, he did.
[00:11:43]  Again, yes, of course.
[00:11:45]  I'm just like, all right.
[00:11:47]  Like, I have partied with a much less wealthy version of this guy who didn't commit sex crimes.
[00:11:54]  Yeah.
[00:11:54]  And, like, it's kind of exhausting, but more or less harmless, right?
[00:11:58]  Where it's like, oh, you like theatrics and big groups of people cuddling.
[00:12:02]  Yeah.
[00:12:03]  And everybody drinks terrible mixed drinks, but nobody has a bad time.
[00:12:07]  It's just kind of a lot.
[00:12:12]  Now, of course, one of the, and this is one of the ways in which you can tell like that what's going on here was not in fact a cool thing.
[00:12:23]  Basically, all of the guests are extremely young women.
[00:12:26]  The only other men that Peter would ever invite were like celebrities that he wanted to impress.
[00:12:31]  Yeah.
[00:12:32]  Now, obviously, we don't know precisely who attended these parties or what they did, but we do know that his frequent guests included Michael Jackson and George H.W. Bush.
[00:12:43]  Cool.
[00:12:47]  What a party.
[00:12:48]  You could have done cocaine in the fucking Bahamas with Michael Jackson and George H.W. Bush and then committed the kind of crimes that make God damn your children.
[00:12:57]  Like, what a lifestyle.
[00:13:00]  And this is why I get so mad at all the like Pizzagate type shit.
[00:13:05]  Yeah, there's plenty of this happening for real.
[00:13:07]  Yeah.
[00:13:10]  Obviously, we don't know what George H.W. Bush got up to, but George H.W. Bush has some allegations against him, as does Michael Jackson.
[00:13:19]  Now, that said, I actually am less inclined to think Jackson engaged in anything while hanging out with Peter than George H.W. Bush, because I think Jackson was kind of more private about it, if I understand him kind of correctly.
[00:13:30]  But who knows?
[00:13:31]  Who knows what went down?
[00:13:33]  It is always possible, as was sometimes the case with Epstein, that a lot of these famous guests were not introduced to anything illegal at Nygard's compound, right?
[00:13:43]  You can bring in a lot of young adult women for parties and a lot of, well, the drug parts would have been illegal, but not actually be committing any serious crimes that are certainly going to get you penalized.
[00:13:54]  And if you've got super famous people coming over to your house, like George H.W. Bush, that's probably the smarter thing to do, especially since George is going to have members of law enforcement who have to be tailing him, right?
[00:14:07]  And that's probably more likely for Nyigard than for Epstein.
[00:14:11]  While the deceased financier made much of his fortune and reputation from providing wealthier and more powerful men with young women and girls, Nyigard was more into celebrities as far as we know, just for the clout.
[00:14:23]  Again, I have no interest in defending anyone here, and it's possible his friends who include former President Bill Clinton as well.
[00:14:29]  Oh, oh, Slick Willie is at the fucking Nygard key too.
[00:14:32]  Don't get me wrong.
[00:14:34]  It's very possible, if not somewhat likely, that they got up to some shady stuff.
[00:14:38]  But also from every story we get, Peter is a wildly jealous man.
[00:14:43]  And all of the allegations of rape and sexual assault focus on him and his use of wealth and his fabulous compound to lure young people into his bed.
[00:14:53]  And so I do think it's entirely possible that as far as the actual illegal sex trafficking stuff, that's just Peter because he doesn't really like the idea of sharing.
[00:15:02]  He doesn't want to be like an Epstein figure.
[00:15:04]  He actually made money for himself, right?
[00:15:06]  He wants to be the guy getting the thing, you know?
[00:15:10]  Yep.
[00:15:11]  A lateral move, if I've ever heard one from an athlete.
[00:15:15]  Yeah, I'm not trying to make like a major moral decision here.
[00:15:19]  I'm not trying to separate them, but I think there is kind of a difference between what they were up to.
[00:15:24]  Pamper parties tended to occur on Sundays, and most of the female guests were women who lived elsewhere nearby in the Bahamas or who were visiting as tourists from somewhere else.
[00:15:33]  A decent number of them were local women and girls.
[00:15:37]  Nyard would send his staff out into the cities nearby to invite women and again, girls, back for free massages, manicures, horseback rides, and an open bar.
[00:15:47]  The New York Times talked to six of his employees who recruited people at shops, clubs, and restaurants to come and party.
[00:15:54]  Quote: One time he was like, I don't know where you find these girls from, but there's pretty girls in the ghetto as well, recalled Freddie Barr, Mr. Nygert's personal assistant in the early 2000s.
[00:16:04]  You need to find pretty girls in need.
[00:16:08]  Cool.
[00:16:09]  Cool.
[00:16:10]  Eventually, his staff compiled an invitation list provided to the Times with the names of more than 700 women.
[00:16:16]  Former workers said they photographed guests when they arrived, uploading the images for their boss's perusal.
[00:16:23]  Only those who were young, slim, and with a curvy backside, which Mr. Nygard called a toilet, were supposed to be allowed inside, according to the ex-employees, including Mrs. Taylor.
[00:16:35]  So it's basically a private version of the origin of Facebook.
[00:16:39]  Yeah.
[00:16:39]  Yeah.
[00:16:40]  He did kind of make his own because he was already rich just for him to like molest people with.
[00:16:46]  Yeah.
[00:16:46]  Terrible and grotesque.
[00:16:48]  The actress Jessica Alba, who attended a Nigerd party while filming Into the Blue in 2004, later described it as gross.
[00:16:55]  These girls are like 14 years old in the jacuzzi, taking off their clothes.
[00:16:59]  She said on a press tour, and here's the thing: first off, I don't know much about Jessica Alba.
[00:17:03]  Kudos to her for saying something at all.
[00:17:06]  Yeah.
[00:17:06]  Because, number one, that's pretty unsparing.
[00:17:08]  That is a direct allegation that he is like doing inappropriate things with children.
[00:17:12]  Yeah.
[00:17:13]  On a press tour.
[00:17:14]  Jessica Alba's pretty based, actually.
[00:17:16]  Yeah, I don't know.
[00:17:17]  I know very little about her, but she went and said something, and fucking nobody else did.
[00:17:21]  Like very, very little.
[00:17:24]  Very few people at her level of kind of clout and influence said anything about what Peter was doing.
[00:17:30]  Yeah, for sure.
[00:17:31]  A lot of them were aware of some of it, right?
[00:17:33]  Yeah.
[00:17:35]  So good for you, Jessica Alba.
[00:17:38]  You get the behind the bastards seal of doing good stuff.
[00:17:43]  Yeah, I mean, like, at what point is this the first person who's like coming forward and being like, there's 14-year-olds in this hot tub?
[00:17:50]  Or this is obviously there were allegations.
[00:17:53]  We just went through that history of like because the Winnipeg Free Beacon or whatever it was reported on a number of allegations.
[00:17:59]  A number of women made allegations.
[00:18:01]  Yeah.
[00:18:01]  There were some donuts.
[00:18:03]  I'm thinking of the kid thing more specifically, but I guess in his mind, as far as I public person with any kind of platform to allege that Peter Nygard is doing inappropriate things with children on his compound.
[00:18:21]  As far as I can tell, it's Jessica Alba's the first person to do that.
[00:18:25]  So again, like seriously, kudos to her because very few other people did.
[00:18:30]  And fucking Sean Connery probably knew, right?
[00:18:32]  Maybe De Niro did too.
[00:18:34]  Although, to be entirely fair, it does not look like Bob De Niro wanted to be next to Peter Nyger.
[00:18:39]  So he may not have, he may have shown up once and been like, this seems like it's going to be a bad thing.
[00:18:45]  Yeah.
[00:18:46]  I don't know.
[00:18:46]  I don't know Bob De Niro.
[00:18:47]  I think her example makes it clear that we can probably assume a number of famous people were at least present for some fucked up shit, even if Nygard wasn't trafficking children specifically to them, right?
[00:18:58]  They could have been aware.
[00:19:00]  Peep, if Jessica, Jessica Alba, I don't believe Jessica Alba is the only celebrity who witnessed stuff like this.
[00:19:05]  Yeah.
[00:19:06]  Right.
[00:19:06]  She's just the one who said something.
[00:19:09]  Now, some people did allege to the times that Nygard also tried to stop his employees from inviting black people to the key.
[00:19:16]  For whatever it's worth, I don't actually think that's true.
[00:19:19]  Yeah.
[00:19:19]  There's photos of his parties, and a number of the people there are black.
[00:19:24]  Allegations also, like a number of the people who accused him of abuse are black women.
[00:19:29]  And I think people who were black women who were like children at the time of the abuse.
[00:19:34]  I don't know that I think that one is true.
[00:19:36]  I'm not saying he's not racist.
[00:19:37]  I just, it doesn't seem like he discriminated in that particular way.
[00:19:40]  Right.
[00:19:41]  Nyigard, for his part, has claimed for years that one reason his wealthy neighbors hated him is he blames them for cooking all of this up and faking all of this, which we'll get to in a bit, that they hated him because he's not racist.
[00:19:53]  And I'm going to quote from Vanity Fair here.
[00:19:56]  Nygert's supporters say his parties do stand out because they're full of people who wouldn't otherwise be in Lyford Key.
[00:20:02]  He has poor kids and athletes out to his house every day, says his best friend, Carlos Mackey, who is the host of a sports program on a local TV.
[00:20:10]  He's a philosopher, a visionary, a genius, but his heart's as big as Shamu the Whale.
[00:20:15]  Nygert is well known throughout the Bahamas for his financial support of the country's Olympics running squads, among many other charities.
[00:20:21]  Wendell Jones, the publisher of the Bahama Journal, says, the residents of Lyford Key say they don't appreciate his flamboyance when what they don't like is the fact that he invites so many black people over.
[00:20:30]  Peter Nygert is a force for good.
[00:20:32]  This is from an article back before all of the things that we're about to talk about, have talked about broke.
[00:20:38]  But that's the way, like, obviously, those are people who he has influence on, who he's got talking to the press for him, right?
[00:20:44]  On his many personal websites.
[00:20:47]  And on his many personal websites.
[00:20:48]  And these are the kind of things they're saying.
[00:20:49]  He's like, no, he's a philanthropist and a policy and a philosopher.
[00:20:53]  And, you know, he, it's just they're racist, actually, because he's so not racist.
[00:20:58]  And that's why his neighbors don't like him.
[00:21:00]  Now, the job of Nygert's employees and some of the women that he dated was to find girls that he liked the most at parties.
[00:21:06]  And once things got kind of loud and chaotic and people weren't really paying attention, to get that particular targeted person drunk and either drug them or convince them to just take drugs.
[00:21:18]  And as you're kind of dosing and be like, hey, you know, you know what we should do is like, if you really want some good cocaine, we can go up to Peter's bedroom.
[00:21:23]  That's where he keeps the good stuff and we'll do some blowout.
[00:21:25]  Yeah.
[00:21:26]  Yeah.
[00:21:28]  Nygert denies all this and says that no underage girls were allowed at the key.
[00:21:32]  He provides affidavits from a former employee who called Peter the Bahamas most generous and honest expatriate.
[00:21:38]  Nygert's house manager, Rachette Ross, told the New York Times that as social media became more prominent, his staffers would use Facebook posts to promote parties and even send messages directly to women offering free dinners, massages, pedicures, and boat rides.
[00:21:52]  Sometimes he rated his new guests A, B, C, or D upon entry.
[00:21:57]  Ross says that his primary judgment criteria was, again, whether or not they had a, quote, nice toilet.
[00:22:03]  He uses that a lot.
[00:22:04]  You can't avoid seeing it.
[00:22:06]  Yeah.
[00:22:08]  There are allegations that he drugged people's drinks.
[00:22:11]  There are allegations by one of his former employees that a woman escaped from the property and was brought back by the local police.
[00:22:20]  The person who made those allegations.
[00:22:22]  This is where it gets messy, though, because the person who made those specific allegations, which is a minority of the allegations of sexual harassment and assault, also herself claims to have been a victim of Nygard and to have been drugged by her girlfriend.
[00:22:36]  But this person also, so here's where it gets kind of weird because the person who like makes those claims also has been accused by other people who previously accused Peter of sexual harassment of having that she bribed them.
[00:22:55]  And this is what gets us into kind of the next messy stage of things, right?
[00:22:59]  So this woman, Ross, makes a lot of, she claims Nygert had her family dog killed.
[00:23:04]  And the New York Times did find evidence that Nygert wired her $10,000 and emailed her, I sent you money for a new dog.
[00:23:11]  But we don't really know, like, this is where it gets all, because again, this is this, this is what we're getting to is like, there's a lot of messiness here.
[00:23:20]  And so the fact that I don't want to discount Ross's allegations, but also Ross is alleged by other women to have bribed them to have claimed that Nygert assaulted them.
[00:23:33]  And again, those are like two of the dozens of women who have accused him.
[00:23:36]  So I don't think that says anything about the legitimacy of the allegations against him.
[00:23:40]  But it does mean that like we do have to kind of wonder is Ross a little bit, right?
[00:23:44]  Because this is trying to like muddy the waters by getting someone to go do this.
[00:23:51]  Well, I don't know.
[00:23:52]  We're getting, there's another part of the story that's critical to understand why finding out kind of exactly what was going on in Nygrid Key is so messy.
[00:24:01]  Cash payments were the near-billionaire's favorite way of dealing with problems.
[00:24:05]  He was heavily involved with the Progressive Liberal Party of the Bahamas, who he kept happy with constant liberal payoffs to officials.
[00:24:12]  When more than $10,000 was required, he would try to do things like have larger quantities stuffed into fresh fish and shipped to whoever he was trying to befriend.
[00:24:21]  That's kind of fun.
[00:24:24]  As I noted earlier, Peter is really scared of aging.
[00:24:28]  So the one thing that caused him to seriously alter his fashion habits was getting older.
[00:24:32]  This is not something he agreed to do without a fight.
[00:24:35]  And I want to quote now from the New York Post, which normally I wouldn't use here, but the allegations they're quoting here appear in a number of other places that are just annoyingly paywalled.
[00:24:43]  And this is kind of an easier place to get them.
[00:24:45]  Quote, Nygard, obsessed with staying young, ended up establishing his stem cell research company in nearby St. Kitts.
[00:24:52]  The alleged purpose to use aborted fetuses from his pregnant girlfriends to provide him with fresh stem cells.
[00:24:57]  Nyigard seemed to suggest that something like that could be afoot when he talked about the technology behind his treatments publicly.
[00:25:03]  I may be the only person in the world, he bragged, who has my very own embryos growing in a petri dish.
[00:25:08]  One of his girlfriends, Suelin Miadros, wrote in her 2014 memoir about a trip she took with Nygard to Ukraine where he was having stem cell research done.
[00:25:16]  He asked, Suellyn, do you know what the best stem cells are?
[00:25:19]  She writes, she did, embryos.
[00:25:21]  Correct.
[00:25:21]  She says Nygard responded.
[00:25:23]  If you got pregnant and had an abortion, we could use those embryonic cells and have a life supply for all of us.
[00:25:27]  You, your mother, and me.
[00:25:29]  A lot of people are doing it.
[00:25:33]  So again, that's, that's, that's.
[00:25:36]  Woo boy.
[00:25:37]  I never even thought of that one.
[00:25:39]  That's a new one for me.
[00:25:41]  Yeah.
[00:25:42]  A new way to be a misogynist.
[00:25:44]  That is, that is certainly not a thing that I had heard about a person doing before.
[00:25:51]  Although I guess I'm not.

=== Embryonic Cell Supply (05:37) ===

[00:25:52]  Again, he's like the sleazier version of more famous guys.
[00:25:55]  Yeah.
[00:25:56]  He's like Jeffrey Epstein, but without like the veneer of philanthropy.
[00:26:00]  He's Peter Thiel, but without like the image of Wall Street cunning.
[00:26:07]  Like he's he's all of these, he's he's all of the worst aspects of all of the rich demons who infest our world.
[00:26:13]  It's kind of amazing, actually.
[00:26:17]  Yeah.
[00:26:17]  But you know who's not the archon of the darkest parts of wealth.
[00:26:24]  Anderson.
[00:26:26]  That is correct.
[00:26:28]  Anderson doesn't even know what a stem cell is.
[00:26:31]  No.
[00:26:32]  She does not.
[00:26:33]  Honestly, not really, doesn't really know what Ukraine is.
[00:26:38]  I don't think dogs recognize geographical boundaries.
[00:26:41]  No, yeah.
[00:26:43]  Well, actually, they kind of do.
[00:26:45]  I did.
[00:26:45]  I did.
[00:26:46]  Yeah, if you take them on walks around the edge of Ukraine, they'll know not to leave Ukraine.
[00:26:50]  She did kind of just whisper, you know, fuck Vladimir Putin under her breath.
[00:26:55]  Well, that could be about a number of things.
[00:26:57]  Yeah.
[00:26:58]  I think we should all mull this over while we let these ads soothe our tired souls.
[00:27:04]  Yeah, Anderson, tell us what you think.
[00:27:12]  10-10 shots fired, city hall building.
[00:27:15]  A silver .40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene from iHeart Podcasts and Best Case Studios.
[00:27:23]  This is Rorschach.
[00:27:24]  Murder at City Hall.
[00:27:25]  How could this have happened in City Hall?
[00:27:27]  Somebody tell me that.
[00:27:28]  Jeffrey Hooker.
[00:27:30]  July 2003.
[00:27:32]  Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest.
[00:27:36]  Both men are carrying concealed weapons.
[00:27:39]  And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead.
[00:27:48]  Everybody in the chamber's ducks.
[00:27:51]  A shocking public murder.
[00:27:52]  I screamed, get down, get down.
[00:27:54]  Those are shots.
[00:27:55]  Those are shots.
[00:27:56]  Get down.
[00:27:56]  A charismatic politician.
[00:27:57]  You know, he just bent the rules all the time.
[00:28:00]  I still have a weapon.
[00:28:02]  And I could shoot you.
[00:28:05]  And an outsider with a secret.
[00:28:07]  He alleged he was a victim of flat down.
[00:28:10]  That may or may not have been political.
[00:28:12]  That may have been about sex.
[00:28:14]  Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:28:27]  There's two golden rules that any man should live by.
[00:28:31]  Rule one, never mess with a country girl.
[00:28:34]  You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes.
[00:28:37]  And rule two, never mess with her friends either.
[00:28:40]  We always say, trust your girlfriends.
[00:28:44]  I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends.
[00:28:48]  Oh my God, this is the same man.
[00:28:50]  A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.
[00:28:55]  I felt like I got hit by a truck.
[00:28:57]  I thought, how could this happen to me?
[00:28:58]  The cops didn't seem to care.
[00:29:01]  So they take matters into their own hands.
[00:29:03]  I said, oh, hell no.
[00:29:05]  I vowed I will be his last target.
[00:29:08]  He's going to get what he deserves.
[00:29:12]  Listen to the girlfriends.
[00:29:14]  Trust me, babe.
[00:29:15]  On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:29:24]  Hey, I'm Nora Jones, and I love playing music with people so much that my podcast called Playing Along is back.
[00:29:30]  I sit down with musicians from all musical styles to play songs together in an intimate setting.
[00:29:35]  Every episode's a little different, but it all involves music and conversation with some of my favorite musicians.
[00:29:40]  Over the past two seasons, I've had special guests like Dave Grohl, Leve, Mavis Staples, Remy Wolf, Jeff Tweedy, really too many to name.
[00:29:50]  And this season, I've sat down with Alessia Cara, Sarah McLaughlin, John Legend, and more.
[00:29:55]  Check out my new episode with Josh Grobin.
[00:29:58]  You related to the Phantom at that point.
[00:30:01]  Yeah, I was definitely the Phantom in that.
[00:30:03]  That's so funny.
[00:30:04]  Share each day with me each night, each morning.
[00:30:13]  Say you love me.
[00:30:16]  You know I.
[00:30:17]  So come hang out with us in the studio and listen to Playing Along on the iHeartRadio app.
[00:30:22]  Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:30:25]  I'm Laurie Siegel, and on Mostly Human, I go beyond the headlines with the people building our future.
[00:30:31]  This week, an interview with one of the most influential figures in Silicon Valley, OpenAI CEO Sam Altman.
[00:30:37]  I think society is going to decide that creators of AI products bear a tremendous amount of responsibility to products we put out in the world.
[00:30:44]  From power to parenthood.
[00:30:46]  Kids, teenagers, I think they will need a lot of guardrails around AI.
[00:30:49]  This is such a powerful and such a new thing.
[00:30:51]  From addiction to acceleration.
[00:30:54]  The world we live in is a competitive world, and I don't think that's going to stop, even if you did a lot of redistribution.
[00:30:58]  You know, we have a deep desire to excel and be competitive and gain status and be useful to others.
[00:31:05]  And it's a multiplayer game.
[00:31:07]  What does the man who has extraordinary influence over our lives have to say about the weight of that responsibility?
[00:31:14]  Find out on Mostly Human.
[00:31:16]  My highest order bit is to not destroy the world with AI.
[00:31:18]  Listen to Mostly Human on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

=== Rich Guy Destroys Another (15:28) ===

[00:31:30]  All right.
[00:31:31]  And we're back.
[00:31:32]  Oh, man.
[00:31:32]  Anderson had a really good joke.
[00:31:34]  She did.
[00:31:35]  She did.
[00:31:35]  I think that might get you canceled in some parts of Twitter, but then you can get a Netflix special where you really lean into it and eventually get paid $25 million to do another Netflix special about what a brave truth teller you are.
[00:31:51]  Yeah.
[00:31:52]  This is how Sophie can finally retire.
[00:31:56]  So Anderson shares.
[00:31:58]  Yeah.
[00:31:59]  It's here we should probably deal with some very sketchy aspects of the story because two of the women who spoke with the Times and accused Nygard of sexual assault have now recanted their claims.
[00:32:09]  Now, obviously, this comes after 10 other unidentified women filed a federal lawsuit in 2020 against Nygard, which prompted an FBI raid on his Manhattan office and eventually his arrest.
[00:32:20]  Again, none of this should state to like muddy the waters of the overall allegations against him.
[00:32:26]  It just makes it kind of hard to know the specifics in certain cases.
[00:32:31]  While the Times reporting still holds up, they spoke with more than a dozen other women who have not recanted.
[00:32:36]  I would be irresponsible not to note that the two women who recanted claim they were paid to lie by Ross.
[00:32:40]  Ross denies this and took a polygraph test, which does not particularly mean much to me either way.
[00:32:46]  Yeah.
[00:32:47]  But it's a profoundly messy case.
[00:32:49]  And this is due in large part to a bit of the story that we have not talked about yet, Margaret.
[00:32:53]  The decade-long turf war between Peter Nygert and his neighbor, a billionaire, which is ultimately what helped to bring him down.
[00:33:01]  So we're past the bad parts.
[00:33:05]  Well, it's all bad, but we're past the parts that are like soul-crushing.
[00:33:08]  And now we're into the part where two rich guys destroy each other.
[00:33:11]  Hell yeah.
[00:33:12]  Or at least one rich guy destroys another.
[00:33:14]  Either way, it's fun.
[00:33:16]  So the community that Nyard lived in, as we've mentioned a couple of times, is called Lyford Key.
[00:33:20]  It was created as a planned community for the Uber rich by E.P. Taylor, a Canadian beer brewing millionaire.
[00:33:27]  Taylor planned Lyford as a winter community and built his dream out of a 3,000-acre plot formerly owned by Sir Harold Christie.
[00:33:35]  The manors that were constructed for the first wave of owners in the 50s and 60s had names like Tra-La La, Safari, Tea Time, and Out of Bounds.
[00:33:45]  So I suspect some sex crime stuff might have been happening in Lyford Key prior to Peter Nygert moving in.
[00:33:53]  In 1962, when JFK flew to the Bahamas to talk with British Prime Minister Harold Macmillan, they both stayed in Lyford Key.
[00:34:01]  At Tra-La.
[00:34:03]  Probably at Tra-La La or maybe at Out of Bounds.
[00:34:06]  So did, at varying points in this period, Henry Ford II, Aga Khan IV, the Prince of Monaco, and Sean Connery, who went on to own a home there.
[00:34:16]  The Heinzes and the Mellon family also had homes there.
[00:34:20]  It was a veritable who's who of the bluest bloods in the world and a handful of celebrities for good measure, but celebrities like Sean Connery, who are like at least of a certain level, you know?
[00:34:29]  So why the Great Lakes?
[00:34:31]  Because I have this other idea.
[00:34:33]  Okay.
[00:34:35]  If all of the who's who are in.
[00:34:37]  Anyway, so please continue.
[00:34:39]  I think we dropped them in the Great Lakes, kind of like George C. Scott at the end of that movie where they're hugging the bombs, but they're not on there by choice.
[00:34:48]  Okay, intercontinental billionaire missiles.
[00:34:51]  Yeah, exactly.
[00:34:52]  Exactly.
[00:34:52]  That way the president really thinks before he fires them, but hopefully not too hard.
[00:34:56]  Yeah.
[00:34:58]  Yeah, but it's time.
[00:35:00]  So at first, Lyford Key is like classy and pretty high profile, right?
[00:35:05]  Those are not little names.
[00:35:06]  The Mellons, the fucking Carnegie fan, like those are those are significant fortunes.
[00:35:12]  Yeah.
[00:35:13]  But things started to change kind of as the years went on.
[00:35:15]  And I'm going to quote from Vanity Fair here.
[00:35:17]  Today's roster is sleepy by comparison.
[00:35:20]  Aside from Sean Connery, who nearly half a dozen James Bonds ago shot Thunderball in several other films here, there are scores of semi-anonymous businessmen or their progeny.
[00:35:29]  Bacon and Nygard's neighbors prefer to keep a low profile.
[00:35:32]  Count and Countess de Ravenel of France, the Brazilian reinsurance magnate Antonio Braga, Jane Lewis, the wife of the English inventor Joe Lewis.
[00:35:41]  It's quiet money, says David McLaughlin, a New York financier, second generation Leifert and chairman of the Liford K Club.
[00:35:48]  Long before the puddle, Nygert clashed stylistically with much of the Glyford K establishment.
[00:35:53]  He threw a lot of parties and was always doing construction.
[00:35:56]  And that puddle is kind of the beginning of an issue between him and his neighbor, a guy named Bacon, who we're going to talk about in a bit.
[00:36:03]  But Nygert is kind of for these blue bloods who are again quiet money, Nygert is a nightmare for them.
[00:36:10]  Yeah.
[00:36:10]  He's got about $800 million in personal wealth.
[00:36:14]  And he's got a couple of U.S. presidents who he's at least friendly with.
[00:36:17]  So he's too rich and powerful to force out, right?
[00:36:19]  You can't kick this guy out of your fancy rich people community.
[00:36:22]  But he's also, he's like gross, right?
[00:36:25]  Like he's not, these guys are all doing sketchy shit, but they're not doing sketchy shit in their fake Mayan temples, wearing fucking electric blue spandex bodysuits or whatever.
[00:36:37]  But they paid extra for walls.
[00:36:39]  Yeah, they have walls in their bedrooms where they're also, I'm sure, committing crimes.
[00:36:43]  Yeah.
[00:36:46]  But yeah, so he's hated.
[00:36:47]  He's denied entrance to the Lyford K Club, which is a golf.
[00:36:51]  Yeah, right.
[00:36:53]  They won't let him in the club.
[00:36:55]  And yeah, most of his neighbors insist he clashed with them from the start.
[00:36:59]  But Nygert is adamant that everything was fine with him and his neighbors until he met his next door neighbor, Louis Bacon.
[00:37:07]  Now, Louis Bacon is a New York City hedge fund billionaire.
[00:37:11]  Invented one of the most addictive forms of food.
[00:37:13]  Yeah, he did.
[00:37:14]  He did create Bacon after inventing the pig, which previously, a lot of people don't know this, but prior to his invention of the pig, all pigs had actually been ducks.
[00:37:28]  That's the way it worked.
[00:37:29]  Look it up.
[00:37:30]  Google it on Wikipedia.
[00:37:32]  Incarda.
[00:37:34]  So obviously, Nygard incorrectly gets referred to as a billionaire a lot.
[00:37:38]  He's not.
[00:37:39]  I think he tops out at like $750 million, which is still quite a fortune.
[00:37:42]  But Bacon is a real billionaire.
[00:37:45]  Like he's actually got more than a billion dollars.
[00:37:48]  And he's widely seen as one of the most powerful men in the financial industry, right?
[00:37:52]  Like he's, I'm sure he's got even more than that now because it's been a good couple of years for the finance industry.
[00:37:58]  The two men have very different personalities.
[00:38:01]  While Nygard is showy and ostentatious and likes these big, lavish, gross parties, Bacon is quiet and comparatively introverted.
[00:38:09]  His main interest outside of his job seems to be hunting.
[00:38:13]  And he's one of those hunters who raises a lot of money for conservation, right?
[00:38:16]  Like he pays to protect a lot of lands and stuff and all that good thing so he can go shoot birds on it or whatever.
[00:38:23]  So he's about to go, since he's about to go to war with Nygert, who's an actual monster, it would be easy to portray Bacon as a hero.
[00:38:30]  Obviously, I don't think he is.
[00:38:32]  He's a man who got wealthy running hedge funds, which is generally not a business I find particularly ethical.
[00:38:37]  But I don't think there's any evidence.
[00:38:40]  And I, in fact, I think it's probably unlikely that he's any kind of systemic, systematic sexual predator or abuser of his employees.
[00:38:47]  And I think it's particularly unlikely because Peter Nygard tried desperately to dig up like dirt this guy.
[00:38:54]  And like the thing he wound up finding is that like one of his ancient ancestors a long time ago was like a Klansman, but he had another ancestor who fought for the union against the Confederacy.
[00:39:05]  So it's like this whole like, yeah, he probably had a bunch of rich guys in his family and they did all sorts of shit.
[00:39:10]  I don't know.
[00:39:10]  Yeah.
[00:39:11]  He didn't find any evidence that this guy had done anything like the things that Nygert had done.
[00:39:17]  Right.
[00:39:18]  So obviously by comparison, he does look quite good.
[00:39:21]  The two had problems over a shared roadway and like there's this fucking puddle as a result of like this kind of thing that's in between their properties and upkeep on it's a little bit unclear.
[00:39:31]  Because libertarian assholes aren't willing to pay for shared infrastructure.
[00:39:35]  Right, right, exactly.
[00:39:37]  And this is just kind of them bickering over this kind of thing between their two properties until in 2005, Nygert attempts to add parking to his property by laying a 15 by 20 foot slab on the property line, specifically Bacon's side of the property line.
[00:39:56]  Now, now you fucked up, Peter.
[00:39:59]  All of the sex crimes, all of the horrible violence that you've done to at this point, I mean, the allegations are hundreds and hundreds of women, like nearing a thousand.
[00:40:08]  Yeah.
[00:40:09]  None of that got you in trouble, but you fucked with a rich guy's property line.
[00:40:16]  I can't even imagine if I had this kind of money, I would not live in such a way that neighbors would exist.
[00:40:24]  Right.
[00:40:24]  What the fuck, man?
[00:40:26]  Like, how are you?
[00:40:27]  How do you have this much money?
[00:40:29]  And he says it's because it's the most beautiful place in the world.
[00:40:32]  It's like, I'm sure the Bahamas are very pretty, but there's other islands, man.
[00:40:36]  Like $750 million.
[00:40:38]  You can make it work.
[00:40:39]  Yeah.
[00:40:40]  What is wrong with you?
[00:40:41]  Vanity Fair writes: quote: Bacon responded by suing Nygard and obtaining a court injunction to remove it.
[00:40:47]  Two years later, Bacon dealt with his long-standing irritation with the noise from Nygard's parties by installing industrial-grade speakers at the edge of his land and pointing them at Nigerd Key at night.
[00:40:57]  We hired a sound consultant in the UK to see if we could somehow muffle the sound from Niger's by emitting a counter sound, but that proved terribly complicated.
[00:41:05]  So we went and got four huge rock concert speakers to play something loud in response.
[00:41:10]  Bacon's architect Peter Talty says.
[00:41:12]  It was horrible squawking sounds that would drive you out of your mind, says Eric Gibson, Nygert's former property manager.
[00:41:18]  In a legal filing, Nygert's lawyer characterized them as military-grade speakers that blare dangerous pain-inducing sound waves towards Mr. Nygert's home.
[00:41:28]  It was supposed to create white noise on my side, but that didn't work, Bacon says.
[00:41:32]  What it did to his side, I wasn't really interested in.
[00:41:38]  Honestly, that's pretty cool.
[00:41:41]  That's pretty cool.
[00:41:44]  And also, what a whiny baby, Peter.
[00:41:46]  Military-grade speakers.
[00:41:48]  Come on, man.
[00:41:50]  Like, fucking hire, I don't know, what's a kind of band a guy who looks like him would probably listen to.
[00:41:55]  Besides Jimmy Buffett.
[00:41:57]  Yeah, hire Jimmy Buffett to come play a counter sound.
[00:42:00]  You can you can afford it.
[00:42:02]  No, Jimmy Buffett would never work with this man.
[00:42:06]  He's he's a fundamentally moral actor.
[00:42:09]  That's that's what I choose to believe about James Buffett.
[00:42:12]  Um, as a conservationist, Bacon was also enraged at the fact that Nigert had started dredging up sand from the seafloor and moving it to physically expand the size of his property.
[00:42:24]  He's making his chunk of the islands bigger by stealing the sea.
[00:42:28]  What are you the dust?
[00:42:29]  The bottom of the sea.
[00:42:30]  Yeah.
[00:42:32]  He kept a suction dredge on a floating platform, destroying underwater habitat and adding to his coastline every day.
[00:42:38]  In the time he lived there, Peter expanded his property from 3.25 to 6.1 acres, destroying 84,000 square meters of seafloor in the process.
[00:42:49]  What the fuck?
[00:42:50]  I know.
[00:42:51]  Such a weird crime.
[00:42:53]  Peter, just buy a different spot.
[00:42:56]  I know.
[00:42:59]  Unbelievable.
[00:43:00]  A local ecologist interviewed in 2015 by Vanity Fair says the environmental damage was extensive.
[00:43:06]  Nyigard, to counter this, pointed to a study that he paid to commission that said it was all fine.
[00:43:11]  Again, these are rich guy crimes, right?
[00:43:14]  So you don't just fuck the seafloor up.
[00:43:16]  You pay a scientist to say it's okay.
[00:43:18]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:43:20]  It's amazing.
[00:43:21]  Stock systems, like build a beautiful, weird shanty town on, but I don't know, whatever.
[00:43:27]  You have a number of options with all of that money, Peter.
[00:43:30]  Bacon, who was also influential with the local government, brought their attention to the matter.
[00:43:35]  Inspections and injunctions and all sorts of unpleasant legal shit followed.
[00:43:39]  They're kind of, it's my opinion that they're kind of bribing and counterbribing the local government, right?
[00:43:45]  Now, this was more or less the situation in 2009 when an accidental electrical fire destroyed a lot of Niger Key, including Peter's biggest, stupidest pyramid.
[00:43:56]  This was a problem, but one well within Peter's financial means to rectify.
[00:44:01]  But when he sought the permits necessary to replace his home, the local government refused.
[00:44:06]  This is when, the New York Times alleges, the war began.
[00:44:10]  Quote, Mr. Nygard sued over changes his neighbor had made years earlier to their driveway.
[00:44:15]  Then he sued the government, saying it was colluding with Mr. Bacon to force him off the island.
[00:44:19]  The allegations became more bizarre.
[00:44:21]  One street protest in Nassau featured men in white hoods and placards proclaiming, Bacon is KKK.
[00:44:27]  New websites funded by Mr. Nygard claimed Mr. Bacon was responsible for several murders.
[00:44:32]  Court records show.
[00:44:33]  A video made by Nygard's staff, according to a former contractor, superimposed Mr. Bacon's face on the collapsing Twin Towers.
[00:44:42]  Oh my.
[00:44:43]  He 911ed him.
[00:44:45]  He 9-11.
[00:44:47]  He 9-11ed him.
[00:44:50]  That doesn't even make sense.
[00:44:51]  At least there's like, oh, yeah, he's got a family member who was in the clan.
[00:44:54]  Let's like turn him into a racist or whatever.
[00:44:56]  Like, what does that even mean, Peter?
[00:45:01]  And then he painted a big tunnel on the cliff, but it wasn't a tunnel.
[00:45:06]  And it drove a tunnel at all.
[00:45:08]  Bacon drove his car right into it.
[00:45:10]  Nearly killed him.
[00:45:12]  No, I do feel confident that Lewis Bacon would not have fallen for that trick.
[00:45:16]  No, I think he is the roadrunner in this situation.
[00:45:19]  Peter is absolutely the wily coyote.
[00:45:23]  Yeah, Bacon goes right through that fake tunnel, and then Peter Niger tries to run into it, but he hits his face on it, and then he gets blood all over his blue shirt.
[00:45:32]  So I'm quoting again from the New York Times.
[00:45:35]  Mr. Nigerd was a formidable opponent.
[00:45:37]  Police officers and local journalists dined at his home.
[00:45:40]  One later admitted in court that Mr. Nygert had paid him to smear Mr. Bacon.
[00:45:44]  Mr. Nigert also had allies in the Progressive Liberal Party, which he wanted to legalize stem cell injections.
[00:45:49]  He bragged he'd given the party $5 million during the 2012 election campaign, legally, as the Bahamas has no campaign finance laws.
[00:45:57]  After it won the election, a Nyigard YouTube channel posted a video featuring six ministers visiting his estate.
[00:46:03]  He threatened or sued media outlets that investigated him.
[00:46:05]  He slow-walked lawsuits, filing countless motions and requesting delays, exhausting his foes.
[00:46:10]  So I also should say, I don't know that anything legally that happened here was bribery because you could just give money to political parties in the Bahamas, right?
[00:46:18]  Which is probably more what's happening.
[00:46:20]  It's just they found a place where they could just give as much money to people as they want until things happen.
[00:46:25]  So that's the actual reason why they're all cramming onto this island.
[00:46:29]  That's, I think, a big part of it.
[00:46:30]  I think there's a number of things in the Bahamian legal code that make it enticing for guys like Nygert, particularly.
[00:46:37]  Yeah.
[00:46:38]  So this would have been an insurmountable obstacle for any other person going up Peter Nyert.
[00:46:44]  But again, Bacon has more money.
[00:46:47]  And in fact, Nygert has now picked a nemesis who has nearly double his net worth.
[00:46:51]  Peter could pay protesters and buy articles on newspapers.
[00:46:54]  He could pay to have websites made.
[00:46:55]  He can bribe entire political parties.

=== Starting a Billion Dollar Fight (10:28) ===

[00:46:58]  Bacon can afford to do all that too.
[00:47:00]  Not to say that he does.
[00:47:01]  That is not an allegation that he, in fact, did do those things, but he could afford to.
[00:47:06]  It's simply a statement of their relative levels of wealth.
[00:47:08]  What Bacon did do is form a non-profit called Save the Bays, which targeted Nygard Key for a number of environmental abuses.
[00:47:16]  He also hired as many lawyers and private investigators as he could find vaguely near the Bahamas.
[00:47:21]  And I think flew in some other guys from the FBI and Scotland Yard to help.
[00:47:26]  They've found evidence for a defamation lawsuit, which was filed in 2015.
[00:47:31]  And it is allegedly through this process that some of Niger's former allies began deserting him, allegedly because the money is a lot better on the other side.
[00:47:40]  Although this is why, and this is, again, why it's hard to know precisely what happened, right?
[00:47:43]  Because there's so much fucking money flying around here, right?
[00:47:46]  So many people who were saying, like, so I can't tell you for certain precisely what of the things that Peter is accused of happened, just that these allegations go back like 50-something years.
[00:47:58]  So, and there's at this point hundreds of people involved.
[00:48:02]  So, I don't think that's at all in question.
[00:48:04]  It's just like when you get down to the specifics of like what was going on in his house parties and how bad was it and how many famous people were involved.
[00:48:12]  Well, there's a lot of fucking allegations flying.
[00:48:14]  Yeah.
[00:48:15]  And a lot of them have money behind them.
[00:48:16]  And it's really hard to tell exactly what went down.
[00:48:20]  Well, but the guy who invented the pig, he also probably paid his employees better or like treated his employees better.
[00:48:26]  It probably wasn't like you went on that KKK march, but your white hood wasn't tucked in properly.
[00:48:33]  So that's $25 less than I'm going to pay you.
[00:48:35]  Like, that's not a way to keep your paid protesters.
[00:48:38]  No, no.
[00:48:39]  You get the feeling that Bacon knows how to keep his people happy as opposed to Nygard, who apparently makes an enemy of everyone he knows for more than about five minutes.
[00:48:47]  Yeah.
[00:48:49]  Anyway, I'm going to quote again from the Times.
[00:48:52]  Two self-described former gang members, Livingston Toggy Bullard and Whistler Bobo Davilma, told the Bacons investigators that Mr. Niger had hired them for dirty work, like torching his ex-girlfriend's hair salon and staging anti-Bacon rallies, according to court records.
[00:49:07]  The men claimed Mr. Niger had given them a hit list that included Lewis Bacon and Mr. Smith.
[00:49:12]  Mr. Niger has denied this.
[00:49:14]  Mr. Bullard and Mr. Davilma, working with the Bacon investigators, hatched a plan to videotape Mr. Niger.
[00:49:20]  The private eyes acted like secret agents using encrypted phones and dropping cash for the two men in a box behind a post office.
[00:49:26]  Eventually, the Bacons paid the two about one and a half million, mostly for secretly recording five meetings with Mr. Niger.
[00:49:32]  The videos turned up no sign of Mr. Niger's plotting murder.
[00:49:35]  I can't get into killing, he said in footage obtained by the Times.
[00:49:38]  But the investigation did find photos of Peter looking at very young women from his car and saying stuff like, Do you see those toilets? and lamenting all of the people that he hadn't yet had sex with.
[00:49:50]  And I think this is apparently what turns the Bacon family on to the possibility that Peter might be having sex with underage people.
[00:49:58]  So in late 2015, they hire a security firm to, in the Times's words, push American law enforcement to investigate whether or not he'd done some sex trafficking.
[00:50:09]  Now, the firm that they hire is run by a guy named Jeff Davis, who claimed to be a 10-year veteran of the CIA who run what he'd called the ghost program, which is not a real thing.
[00:50:22]  Doesn't exist.
[00:50:23]  I've seen some movies about it, though.
[00:50:25]  Yeah, yeah, Ghost Protocol.
[00:50:29]  Bacon was conned by this guy and spends like $6 million, which is very funny.
[00:50:34]  All of this is extremely funny, but again, it is part of why it's like kind of hard to know the precise details of what happened.
[00:50:39]  Which is like me.
[00:50:40]  He's spending 600 bucks, to be clear.
[00:50:42]  Yeah.
[00:50:43]  This is not, this is not going to.
[00:50:45]  Bacon's not like hurting for money because he burned $6 million on this con job.
[00:50:50]  It's all really funny.
[00:50:52]  And it's, but it's also like, again, it's hard to part of why I emphasize the early stuff, his mistreatment of workers, the outright criminal behavior there, all of the rape and sexual assault allegations against him from people who were extremely young going back further than even the 1980s.
[00:51:08]  This goes back to the very beginning of his career because Once you hit this period where he's fighting with Bacon, tens of millions of dollars in disinfo were just flying around.
[00:51:19]  So, like, nailing down what happened is very, very touchy, right?
[00:51:23]  Yeah.
[00:51:24]  And I'm being so careful about what I say here because, like, this is, even though Nygert is kind of probably down for the count, this is a fight between two very, very rich men.
[00:51:34]  And you don't want to be uncareful when you talk about Toto.
[00:51:38]  Who may have done what, right?
[00:51:40]  Yeah.
[00:51:41]  But you know who's always careful when they make allegations about sex crimes.
[00:51:48]  This is going to be an ad for Bacon, isn't it?
[00:51:50]  I hope it's an ad for Bacon.
[00:51:52]  The bacon industry would never do anything like that to us.
[00:51:54]  Oh, no, I mean the guy.
[00:51:56]  Oh, well, honestly, he seems like he's in the clear for that one, too.
[00:52:02]  But yeah.
[00:52:04]  Anyway, there you go.
[00:52:13]  10-10 shots fired in the city hall building.
[00:52:16]  A silver .40 caliber handgun was recovered at the scene.
[00:52:20]  From iHeart Podcasts and Best Case Studios, this is Rorschach, murder at City Hall.
[00:52:26]  How could this have happened in City Hall?
[00:52:28]  Somebody tell me that!
[00:52:29]  Jeffrey Hood did.
[00:52:31]  July 2003, Councilman James E. Davis arrives at New York City Hall with a guest.
[00:52:37]  Both men are carrying concealed weapons.
[00:52:40]  And in less than 30 minutes, both of them will be dead.
[00:52:49]  Everybody in the chamber's ducks.
[00:52:51]  A shocking public murder.
[00:52:53]  I scream, get down, get down.
[00:52:55]  Those are shots.
[00:52:56]  Those are shots.
[00:52:56]  Get down.
[00:52:57]  A charismatic politician.
[00:52:58]  You know, he just bent the rules all the time.
[00:53:01]  I still have a weapon.
[00:53:03]  And I could shoot you.
[00:53:06]  And an outsider with a secret.
[00:53:08]  He alleged you a victim of flat down.
[00:53:11]  That may or may not have been political.
[00:53:12]  That may have been about sex.
[00:53:14]  Listen to Rorschach, murder at City Hall on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:53:27]  There's two golden rules that any man should live by.
[00:53:31]  Rule one, never mess with a country girl.
[00:53:35]  You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes.
[00:53:38]  And rule two, never mess with her friends either.
[00:53:41]  We always say, trust your girlfriends.
[00:53:45]  I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends...
[00:53:49]  Oh my God, this is the same man.
[00:53:51]  A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist.
[00:53:56]  I felt like I got hit by a truck.
[00:53:58]  I thought, how could this happen to me?
[00:53:59]  The cops didn't seem to care.
[00:54:01]  So they take matters into their own hands.
[00:54:04]  I said, oh, hell no.
[00:54:06]  I vowed I will be his last target.
[00:54:08]  He's going to get what he deserves.
[00:54:13]  Listen to the girlfriends.
[00:54:14]  Trust me, babe.
[00:54:15]  On the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:54:25]  Hey, I'm Nora Jones, and I love playing music with people so much that my podcast called Playing Along is back.
[00:54:31]  I sit down with musicians from all musical styles to play songs together in an intimate setting.
[00:54:36]  Every episode's a little different, but it all involves music and conversation with some of my favorite musicians.
[00:54:41]  Over the past two seasons, I've had special guests like Dave Grohl, Leve, Mavis Staples, Remy Wolf, Jeff Tweedy, really too many to name.
[00:54:51]  And this season, I've sat down with Alessia Cara, Sarah McLaughlin, John Legend, and more.
[00:54:56]  Check out my new episode with Josh Grobin.
[00:54:59]  You related to the Phantom at that point.
[00:55:02]  Yeah, I was definitely the Phantom in that.
[00:55:04]  That's so funny.
[00:55:05]  Mary stay with me each night, each morning.
[00:55:14]  Say you love me, you know.
[00:55:18]  So come hang out with us in the studio and listen to Playing Along on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:55:26]  I'm Lori Siegel, and on Mostly Human, I go beyond the headlines with the people building our future.
[00:55:31]  This week, an interview with one of the most influential figures in Silicon Valley, OpenAI CEO Sam Altman.
[00:55:38]  I think society is going to decide that creators of AI products bear a tremendous amount of responsibility to products we put out in the world.
[00:55:45]  From power to parenthood.
[00:55:47]  Kids, teenagers, I think they will need a lot of guardrails around AI.
[00:55:50]  This is such a powerful and such a new thing.
[00:55:52]  From addiction to acceleration.
[00:55:55]  The world we live in is a competitive world, and I don't think that's going to stop, even if you did a lot of redistribution.
[00:55:59]  You know, we have a deep desire to excel and be competitive and gain status and be useful to others.
[00:56:06]  And it's a multiplayer game.
[00:56:08]  What does the man who has extraordinary influence over our lives have to say about the weight of that responsibility?
[00:56:15]  Find out on Mostly Human.
[00:56:16]  My highest order bit is to not destroy the world with AI.
[00:56:19]  Listen to Mostly Human on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.
[00:56:30]  We're back.
[00:56:32]  Anderson said another cancelable thing.
[00:56:35]  Oh boy, he sure did.
[00:56:36]  And Anderson.
[00:56:38]  He.
[00:56:41]  Wow.
[00:56:42]  If you're going to accuse her of doing something wrong.
[00:56:47]  Oh, but it was actually, it wasn't an it wasn't an actual bad thing that she said.
[00:56:54]  I regret starting this bit.
[00:56:57]  Yeah, because I almost fed into the bit by being like, yeah, she made a comment about her appreciation of Rhodesian pattern camouflage, but then I decided not to.
[00:57:07]  And I feel bad that I have led us to the chain of events that has taken us to where we are.
[00:57:11]  Margaret, this was your fault.
[00:57:13]  This was all, what a disaster.
[00:57:15]  I recognize that.
[00:57:16]  This is the podcasting equivalent of starting a fight with your neighbor who has one and a half billion dollars.
[00:57:23]  Because Anderson can actually do no wrong.
[00:57:25]  Let's be honest.

=== Regretting the Bit (13:43) ===

[00:57:26]  That's right.
[00:57:27]  That's right.
[00:57:28]  And Peter Bacon can pay to have done no wrong at the very least.
[00:57:32]  And Anderson.
[00:57:33]  And Anderson loves to eat bacon.
[00:57:36]  So here we are.
[00:57:37]  Yeah.
[00:57:37]  Yeah.
[00:57:38]  Exactly.
[00:57:39]  Full circle.
[00:57:40]  And anyway, let's get back on the old train.
[00:57:45]  So as when we left off, Lewis had just gotten conned out of $6 million by the ghost program CIA guy who was, I think, just a con man.
[00:57:55]  And the guy who conned him told Bacon that Niger had put hits out on his family and like actually got like hooked Bacon up with bodyguards who drove him and his family to safe houses.
[00:58:05]  And what must have been a very exciting afternoon for everybody.
[00:58:09]  Bacon eventually realizes he's been had.
[00:58:11]  And the FBI and Homeland Security both did launch investigations, but they didn't go anywhere into Peter.
[00:58:18]  So Bacon and his brother decided to put together a lawsuit in 2017, patterned off of some of the most prominent Me Too cases, right?
[00:58:25]  They're kind of paying attention to what's happening.
[00:58:27]  They know there's no there's smoke and fire with Peter Niger, right?
[00:58:31]  Because they do have, and at this point, stuff is online.
[00:58:34]  They've found the old allegations, right?
[00:58:36]  They've got people who are able to see the shit that had happened in Canada, find those old Winnipeg, whatever, newspaper articles and stuff.
[00:58:42]  So they put together a lawsuit.
[00:58:44]  They get their private investigators to introduce 15 Bahamian women to American lawyers to do like sue Peter out of New York.
[00:58:52]  And I'm going to quote from the Times here.
[00:58:54]  One woman, now involved in the suit, told The Times she was 14 when she met Mr. Niger at one of his stores in 2015.
[00:59:00]  She has a photo with him that day.
[00:59:02]  She said that she was later invited for a modeling interview at Nigerd Key, where he assaulted her.
[00:59:07]  She said that she had never told anyone what happened.
[00:59:10]  Another woman in the suit said in an interview that she was 14 when she attended a pamper party in 2011 after her mother asked Mr. Niger to sponsor her in a beauty pageant.
[00:59:19]  Is this what my life can be?
[00:59:20]  She recalled thinking of the models in the room.
[00:59:23]  Her glass of wine never seemed to empty, she said.
[00:59:25]  Later, she recalled she swallowed pills that Mr. Nyigard told her models took.
[00:59:29]  Then she said he took her upstairs and, you know, drawn by the money and promise of modeling gigs, she later returned, recruiting other women, she said.
[00:59:38]  Tamika Ferguson found her way to Niger Key in 2004 after being kicked out of high school.
[00:59:43]  An orphan from a poor neighborhood, she said a DJ had invited her to a pamper party.
[00:59:47]  She drank too much and ended up in a bathroom barefoot in her bikini, she said.
[00:59:51]  When she emerged, her friends had gone.
[00:59:53]  Mr. Nigerd steers her upstairs, and I don't think I need to finish that.
[00:59:58]  Yeah.
[00:59:59]  So the Times has photographs of this woman in that woman took of herself in Niger Key.
[01:00:07]  Three people, a former Niger girlfriend, an ex-employee, and a guest said that they remembered her here.
[01:00:11]  So this is, again, these are all been backed up.
[01:00:14]  These are very, for all of the stuff that is kind of murky, there's a lot that's extremely clear, right, in terms of the allegations against Niger.
[01:00:21]  Now, but back to the things that are complicated.
[01:00:24]  The investigators and lawyers that are putting together this lawsuit were paid by a nonprofit called Sanctuary.
[01:00:30]  Mr. Bacon was a generous donor to Sanctuary.
[01:00:33]  There are claims from people interviewed by the New York Times that Bacon or entities which received funding from him gave money to a number of women in exchange for going forward against Niger.
[01:00:42]  Peter would probably say that they were paid to lie.
[01:00:45]  It's worth noting that several of these women claim the money was necessary to keep them safe from Niger, which is certainly not without merit, right?
[01:00:51]  Like, again, it's very messy, but I get that point, right?
[01:00:55]  Like, yeah, you're being asked to go up against a very rich man.
[01:01:00]  You don't want no backup there, especially in a place like the Bahamas, where it's really easy to buy the law and buy the government.
[01:01:08]  So it's a mess of a case.
[01:01:10]  I think there's plenty of clear reporting, though, about what happened and about what Peter did.
[01:01:14]  And I don't have trouble believing in his guilt.
[01:01:18]  And apparently, neither did the FBI because they eventually decide they have seen enough and accuse him of sex trafficking, sex trafficking involving minors, rape, and racketeering after raiding his offices in 2020.
[01:01:30]  In 2021, Nigerd was charged by the Toronto police with multiple cases of sexual assault and forcible confinement from cases between the mid-1980s and the mid-2000s.
[01:01:40]  With the dam broken around him, more allegations flooded out, the earliest of which dates back to 1968.
[01:01:47]  There are at least 52 plaintiffs currently pursuing legal action against him in several cases, including a class action.
[01:01:53]  In 2018, Nygard Key was seized by the Supreme Court of the Bahamas.
[01:01:57]  The property is currently in ruins.
[01:01:59]  Peter Nygard remains in custody in Canada, awaiting extradition to the United States.
[01:02:04]  He says that his health is terrible and that he can't get the kind of food that he wants to eat while he's behind bars.
[01:02:09]  Oh, no.
[01:02:10]  Yeah.
[01:02:11]  I, again, don't really care what happens to this guy at this point.
[01:02:16]  Nope.
[01:02:17]  Not really.
[01:02:17]  As long as he's kept away from doing any harm.
[01:02:20]  His finances seem like they're in disaster.
[01:02:22]  His company is failing.
[01:02:25]  I wonder who's going to buy his property.
[01:02:27]  Yeah.
[01:02:28]  I think it's already been confiscated by the government, but yeah, I don't know.
[01:02:32]  I'll tell you this.
[01:02:33]  Don't get into a fight with Lewis Bacon, though.
[01:02:36]  Nope.
[01:02:39]  And honestly, like, credit to Lewis.
[01:02:42]  Apparently, nothing else was going to fucking take this man down.
[01:02:45]  Yeah.
[01:02:46]  And by God, it needed to happen.
[01:02:48]  I'm just, I'm just glad that it did.
[01:02:50]  Yeah.
[01:02:52]  Lewis, good work.
[01:02:56]  Although it is pretty funny that you got conned by the fake CIA guy.
[01:02:59]  Yeah.
[01:03:00]  A real hero.
[01:03:01]  That's pretty funny.
[01:03:03]  That is the most likable version in the story.
[01:03:05]  The guy who got a bunch of money for fucking nothing.
[01:03:11]  I could have made a money for nothing in the chicks for free joke, but in an episode like this, that wouldn't have been.
[01:03:18]  But I thought about it because that's a pretty good song.
[01:03:20]  I feel like there's just always that irony of like all of the like anti-sellout songs that are on the radio from like the 70s or whatever.
[01:03:29]  Is that an anti-sellout song, though?
[01:03:31]  I thought so.
[01:03:32]  Isn't it kind of just a like, it's making fun of, and it's not like anti-sellout, but it's like anti-music industry, which is like, I mean, to be fair, if I was engaged at a professional level in the music industry, I would absolutely write songs talking shit on it.
[01:03:46]  I mean, unlike, you know, my professional engagement in the podcasting industry, which I absolutely love my corporate overlords.
[01:03:56]  Well, it's interesting.
[01:03:57]  I don't know.
[01:03:58]  Now we're completely off the topic, but I've never sat down and looked at the lyrics.
[01:04:01]  But isn't it like some guys who work at like a furniture store or something being like, we're busting our asses all these days all day, and these guys just like half-ass some songs and they get all that money for nothing and the chicks for free.
[01:04:12]  I thought that was what the song was about.
[01:04:14]  You're probably right.
[01:04:15]  I yeah.
[01:04:16]  I think I'm well, but they also like, you know, wrote Salton's a swing, which was like way more of a like, it's much better to just go be the guy who plays at the bar every I, you know what?
[01:04:27]  The world doesn't need to know my opinion about dire straits.
[01:04:31]  Nope, this is what we're talking about.
[01:04:33]  Welcome to the Dire Straits Cast, a podcast where I, Robert Evans, a guy who only knows the song Money for Nothing and the Chicks for Free, which is probably not what that song is called by the Dire Straits, and Margaret Killjoy, who knows at least one other song by the same band.
[01:04:51]  Amazing that this podcast is in its seventh year.
[01:04:54]  I know, and people keep, no one actually listens, but we found a weird loophole where the advertisers keep it.
[01:05:02]  We just get automatically downloaded to your phone like that one U2 album.
[01:05:08]  Well, Margaret, how do you feel about Peter Nygert?
[01:05:11]  I feel very negatively about him.
[01:05:16]  I hate being reminded that people like him exist and are everywhere.
[01:05:21]  They sure are.
[01:05:22]  And they helped make NAFTA a reality.
[01:05:25]  I love it.
[01:05:26]  It is amazing that this is one of the guys who made NAFTA happy.
[01:05:30]  Yeah, like there is a world full of heroes who've dedicated their lives.
[01:05:34]  Like the Zapatista movement, right?
[01:05:36]  Like, you know, kicked off in response to NAFTA signing, right?
[01:05:41]  And there's these like world of unsung heroes who will dedicate their amazing lives to fighting this.
[01:05:45]  And then there's the guy who's like, I built a weird thing in the Bahamas so that I can sexually assault people because the whole thing was just so I could sexually assault more people.
[01:05:55]  And it's just like, yeah, I just helped destroy, number one, helped destroy like the unionized garment industry in two countries.
[01:06:04]  And number two, like roped people from around the world and particularly in Mexico into nightmarish working conditions and abuse in order to make enough money that I could build a fake Mayan city in the Bahamas and commit sex crimes in it.
[01:06:19]  That's Peter Nygard.
[01:06:21]  And he got taken down because he built a parking lot on a richer guy's land.
[01:06:26]  Yep.
[01:06:27]  What a real world timeline we're in.
[01:06:32]  What a good way for that to all go.
[01:06:34]  This is the best economic system the world has ever seen.
[01:06:38]  Again, Lewis Bacon, if you're listening and thinking of suing us, I have nothing but respect and happiness that you took him down.
[01:06:45]  He needed to be taken down.
[01:06:47]  I'm just frustrated that one of like five different countries' legal systems didn't do it first.
[01:06:56]  Outstanding.
[01:06:58]  Good stuff.
[01:07:00]  So I guess if you ever encounter a man with hundreds of millions of dollars who is horribly harming people, hope that he pisses off a richer man.
[01:07:09]  Or, or hear me out, you now know that they carry a lot of cash.
[01:07:15]  You could get the I'm gonna, yep.
[01:07:19]  Anyway, yep, uh-huh.
[01:07:21]  Yep, there's other ways to solve this problem.
[01:07:23]  30 straight bleeped seconds.
[01:07:25]  And then we roll out.
[01:07:28]  All right.
[01:07:28]  Margaret, you want to plug anything here?
[01:07:31]  I have a book called We Won't Be Here Tomorrow.
[01:07:33]  I have a podcast like Live Like the World is Dying.
[01:07:35]  I have another podcast called Cool People Did Cool Stuff.
[01:07:39]  And I have a dog named Rentraw, and I love my dog.
[01:07:44]  Great dog.
[01:07:44]  Solid dog.
[01:07:45]  Yeah, love, love Ren Traw so much.
[01:07:47]  Learned how to herd baby goats today.
[01:07:49]  Yeah.
[01:07:50]  A natural just immediately knew how to do it.
[01:07:54]  Yeah.
[01:07:56]  Speaking of things that are known, I have a book too.
[01:08:01]  It's called After the Revolution.
[01:08:03]  You can Google that and AK Press together.
[01:08:05]  You couldn't find a place to buy it or type it into any of the various book-related websites and stores that you go to.
[01:08:12]  They all sell it.
[01:08:13]  You can buy it and then it will be yours.
[01:08:15]  And then you will own a piece of my soul.
[01:08:18]  It's a cyberpunk carry out black magic or whatever.
[01:08:24]  Yep.
[01:08:25]  It also contains a complete manual on how to...
[01:08:29]  Oh, no, wait, that's a spoiler.
[01:08:31]  No, that's a spoiler.
[01:08:32]  And also a federal crime.
[01:08:34]  So we're going to just bounce for today.
[01:08:37]  All right.
[01:08:38]  Bye, everyone.
[01:08:42]  Behind the Bastards is a production of CoolZone Media.
[01:08:45]  For more from CoolZone Media, visit our website, coolzonemedia.com or check us out on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[01:08:55]  When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands.
[01:09:03]  I vowed I will be his last target.
[01:09:06]  He is not going to get away with this.
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[01:09:27]  I'm Laurie Siegel, and this is Mostly Human, a tech podcast through a human lens.
[01:09:31]  This week, an interview with OpenAI CEO Sam Altman.
[01:09:35]  I think society is going to decide that creators of AI products bear a tremendous amount of responsibility to the products we put out in the world.
[01:09:42]  An in-depth conversation with the man who's shaping our future.
[01:09:46]  My highest order bit is to not destroy the world with AI.
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[01:10:03]  Check out my newest episode with Josh Grobin.
[01:10:06]  You related to the Phantom at that point?
[01:10:09]  Yeah, I was definitely the Phantom in that.
[01:10:10]  That's so funny.
[01:10:12]  Share each day with me each night each morning.
[01:10:20]  Listen to Nora Jones is playing along on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[01:10:28]  What's up, everyone?
[01:10:29]  I'm Ego Mode.
[01:10:30]  My next guest, it's Will Farrell.
[01:10:34]  My dad gave me the best advice ever.
[01:10:37]  He goes, just give it a shot.
[01:10:38]  But if you ever reach a point where you're banging your head against the wall and it doesn't feel fun anymore, it's okay to quit.
[01:10:45]  If you saw it written down, it would not be an inspiration.
[01:10:48]  It would not be on a calendar of, you know, the cat just hang in there.
[01:10:55]  Yeah, it would not be.
[01:10:57]  Right, it wouldn't be that.
[01:10:58]  There's a lot in life.
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