Behind the Bastards - Ben Shapiro's Unreadable Book is Still the Best Thing About 2020
Aired: 2020-09-03
Duration: 01:16:14


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[00:00:19]  Was this before he wrote his stories?
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[00:01:49]  This is for Vietnam.
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=== Nine Hours of Recording (03:23) ===

[00:01:53]  There's a fire coming to this country and it's going to burn out everything.
[00:01:57]  Listen to Saigon starting on April 22nd on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[00:02:14]  That's how we start the podcast.
[00:02:16]  Are you already recording?
[00:02:17]  That's how you want to do it.
[00:02:19]  I am now recording.
[00:02:19]  I hit recording as you were screaming.
[00:02:21]  Well, I was recording when I started making the noise.
[00:02:25]  I anticipated that the podcast would start with, that's the beauty of being professional.
[00:02:35]  I'm Robert Evans.
[00:02:36]  Welcome.
[00:02:37]  No, I don't like it.
[00:02:39]  I'm not doing it.
[00:02:40]  No one else is Robert Evans because nobody else gets to introduce my show atonally and wordlessly.
[00:02:49]  We have started then.
[00:02:51]  We have started.
[00:02:51]  Yes.
[00:02:53]  That's correct.
[00:02:55]  Hi, everyone.
[00:02:56]  Hello, America.
[00:02:58]  And parts of Canada.
[00:03:00]  And the UK.
[00:03:01]  New Zealand.
[00:03:02]  No, we don't let them on here.
[00:03:03]  Yes, we do.
[00:03:04]  Well, I love you guys.
[00:03:06]  There are some real strict geotags that disseminate.
[00:03:10]  Australia, I'm keeping my eye on you.
[00:03:13]  If you're good on the list, shape motherfuckers is what I think.
[00:03:17]  Hello, America, except the Celtics fans in Boston.
[00:03:21]  I don't say hi to you.
[00:03:22]  This has been quite the introduction.
[00:03:25]  It's the last day of August as we record this.
[00:03:28]  And August is a month.
[00:03:29]  We did it, kind of, maybe.
[00:03:31]  I mean, we'll see.
[00:03:32]  The missiles could all start firing anytime in the next several hours.
[00:03:36]  Yeah, we got like nine hours left.
[00:03:38]  Yeah, we got like nine hours.
[00:03:39]  Just sit in it.
[00:03:41]  But I did say, I don't know.
[00:03:43]  I started saying a few months back that August was going to be a really fucking horrible month.
[00:03:48]  And it's been a really fucking horrible month.
[00:03:51]  As I like this Saturday, like two days ago, I guess, less than two days ago, Guy got shot dead in the streets of Portland.
[00:04:02]  That was not good.
[00:04:03]  Looks like people are going to be escalating a series of heavily armed rallies between left-wing and right-wing demonstrators that are likely to degenerate in a gunfight.
[00:04:12]  So September might be even worse.
[00:04:14]  Probably is going to be.
[00:04:16]  So that's good.
[00:04:17]  I'm really tired of you being right, Robert.
[00:04:19]  Too much time until November.
[00:04:21]  So, folks, when things like this happen, and when I say things like this, I mean the complete collapse of democratic society into an authoritarian blood-soaked nightmare.
[00:04:35]  When things like this happen, we hear it behind the bastards, know of only one way to try to keep people's spirits up, try to maintain, you know, that fighting spirit that we're all going to need to get through this.
[00:04:50]  And that way is, of course, reading excerpts from Ben Shapiro's unbelievably terrible novel, True Allegiance.
[00:04:56]  Oh, yes, beautiful prose.
[00:04:59]  Gosh, describe it correctly.
[00:05:02]  My goodness.
[00:05:03]  Did I introduce the show or Katie and Cody, or did I just start shouting atonally?
[00:05:07]  No, I told you.
[00:05:08]  Yeah.
[00:05:09]  I can do it.
[00:05:10]  Okay, what is this show, Sophie?
[00:05:12]  This show is Behind the Bastards, and it's hosted by you, Robert Evans.

=== Ben Shapiro Debate (15:24) ===

[00:05:17]  That seems right.
[00:05:18]  I am your executive producer, Sophie Lichterman.
[00:05:21]  Anderson is our CEO.
[00:05:26]  Okay.
[00:05:27]  And then we're joined today by Katie Stoll and Cody Johnston of some more news, even more news, worst year ever, and just epicness.
[00:05:38]  That's good.
[00:05:38]  Okay.
[00:05:39]  Well done.
[00:05:39]  That was great.
[00:05:41]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:44]  On the horse, the horse, everyone has boarded the horse.
[00:05:49]  So I thought you were going to say the horse is in the back, and I got really scared that you knew a pop culture reference.
[00:05:58]  The horse in a bag?
[00:06:00]  No, I don't know any of that.
[00:06:01]  What I do know is that we just finished when we last left off.
[00:06:07]  And I recommend there's been like, what, now, three episodes of this beforehand.
[00:06:10]  We're just going through and we're just skimming Ben's novel and reading chunks of it because it's very funny.
[00:06:16]  The last chapter was Brett Hawthorne, combat general and prisoner of terrorist man in the city of Tehran, Iran, which, yeah, is.
[00:06:27]  Attacked by short terrorists.
[00:06:29]  Yeah, attacked by the bear of a man kidnapped by short terrorists.
[00:06:35]  So, yeah, Brett Hawthorne, kidnapped by terrorists.
[00:06:39]  He just had gotten thrown into the cell after having his big meeting with the bad terrorist guy, the evil terrorist, drifted off to sleep thinking of his wife, Ellen, or the TV show, Ellen.
[00:06:52]  That's unclear at this point.
[00:06:54]  It's unclear.
[00:06:57]  I choose, I mean, I'm praying for Ellen too, Brett.
[00:07:01]  We all are.
[00:07:03]  We all are.
[00:07:06]  Okay, so the next chapter is a President Prescott chapter, which is again Barack Obama but white.
[00:07:13]  Yes.
[00:07:14]  Barack Obama but white and mixed with a little bit of FDR and Hitler.
[00:07:19]  I'm Hitler.
[00:07:20]  Like, let's not forget the other parts.
[00:07:24]  Okay.
[00:07:25]  Were you asking, Katie?
[00:07:26]  I was going to say, did we decide a prototype for him, like a Kevin Costner?
[00:07:33]  I don't know if that's.
[00:07:35]  You know, it seems like Ben is patterning the president in this off of the kind of person who has not gotten elected ever in Democratic politics, but Republicans believe is like, yeah, he's like the fantasy Republican Democratic president, right?
[00:07:54]  So he's like a little bit of Bill Clinton mixed in with a little bit of Hitler.
[00:07:59]  That's what we get with President Prescott.
[00:08:01]  Yeah.
[00:08:01]  President Prescott always felt a surge of power through his body when he sat in the situation room.
[00:08:07]  This is where they had made all their biggest decisions.
[00:08:09]  It's where Kennedy read teletype during the Cuban Missile Crisis.
[00:08:12]  It's where President Barack Obama had sat watching SEAL Team 6 take out Osama bin Laden.
[00:08:17]  And this is where Prescott knew he'd be sitting at the head of the table while American special operations troops dispatched Ibrahim Ashami.
[00:08:25]  It is kind of unclear in this up until now.
[00:08:27]  I think this is the first Barack Obama reference we get.
[00:08:29]  Yeah, very unfair.
[00:08:32]  What the timing has been of like American history in Ben Shapiro's alternate timeline?
[00:08:38]  He's a visitor.
[00:08:38]  Right, is this just the president right after Obama?
[00:08:43]  Yeah, I think this is the guy where it is like, what if a random Democrat who was also Hitler got elected instead of Trump?
[00:08:51]  That's that's I mean, you could make a case that that is Trump in some capacities, but yeah, yeah, except for Trump, I don't think has ever been awed by the weight of a historical anything because he's not really capable of feeling the emotion of awe.
[00:09:08]  But anyway, yeah, so they intelligence figured out General Hawthorne's signal.
[00:09:14]  If you remember, he was like being on one of those terrorist videos and he'd like blinked the coordinates of where he was.
[00:09:21]  Heck yeah, he did.
[00:09:22]  Yeah, that's good.
[00:09:25]  So, yeah.
[00:09:27]  Hawthorne had spoken the pre-written message from Ashami just as Ashami had written it, prompting a national debate on whether Hawthorne should have complied with the propaganda requirements of the world's leading terrorist.
[00:09:37]  But intelligence kept the fact that Hawthorne hadn't complied under their hat.
[00:09:40]  Well, the rest of the world had watched Hawthorne's mouth.
[00:09:42]  Intelligence had watched his eyes, which is very funny to me because, like, every time anything vaguely like that's that's any that's vaguely a mystery occurs that involves like a video clip that's you know, anytime something like that goes viral, whether it's a murder or whatever, the entire internet sets to trying to solve it.
[00:10:01]  And if this guy had been blinking in Morse code while delivering like like there's a 0% chance that everything he had been saying wouldn't have already been like decoded by 17 year olds for sure we have internet would have figured it out.
[00:10:16]  Yes.
[00:10:17]  Yeah.
[00:10:18]  My favorite hooker would have figured it out.
[00:10:20]  Was that one sentence that you just read?
[00:10:24]  But intelligence kept the fact that Hawthorne hadn't complied under the.
[00:10:27]  Oh, wait, no, that's a few sentences.
[00:10:29]  That's a couple.
[00:10:30]  Okay.
[00:10:30]  That's a couple.
[00:10:30]  Okay.
[00:10:31]  Okay.
[00:10:31]  Good.
[00:10:31]  Good.
[00:10:32]  Yeah.
[00:10:32]  Yeah.
[00:10:33]  Good improvement.
[00:10:34]  Improvement, Ben.
[00:10:35]  Yep.
[00:10:36]  He hired a copy editor for this chapter.
[00:10:38]  Yeah, he must have.
[00:10:39]  So yeah, this he talked, Ben talks about how Hawthorne had taken the trick of blinking in Morse code from a Vietnam-era POW who'd blinked out torture, which is maybe a little bit easier than blinking out the coordinates airstrike now and then geographical coordinates.
[00:10:56]  Yeah.
[00:10:58]  It's very funny.
[00:11:00]  And also just that they would know like that that would be what the government would instantly agree.
[00:11:06]  Ah, yes, this captured person has called for an airstrike on the capital of a sovereign nation.
[00:11:12]  That's got to be what we do.
[00:11:14]  Surely.
[00:11:15]  Well, not only do we know that that's what he's calling for, we're going to do it.
[00:11:19]  Yeah.
[00:11:20]  We're going to launch.
[00:11:21]  Yeah.
[00:11:21]  Well, no, he does note.
[00:11:22]  Ben does note the message prompted a full-scale debate inside the White House.
[00:11:25]  It raised too many questions.
[00:11:27]  First, was Hawthorne's location correct?
[00:11:29]  How would he know where he was, given that prisoners were typically blindfolded and kept in windowless rooms before their executions?
[00:11:34]  If Hawthorne was wrong about the location in a heavily populated area of Tehran, the United States could end up with the blood of dozens on its hands and an international mess almost impossible to clean up.
[00:11:44]  They could blame it all on Iranian nuclear weapons, but after Iraq, the public wouldn't be buying.
[00:11:49]  That's not a reason.
[00:11:52]  Yeah, that's not the reason not to kill dozens of innocent people.
[00:11:57]  Yeah.
[00:11:57]  That the public might not buy it.
[00:12:00]  Right.
[00:12:01]  I guess it is.
[00:12:02]  Yeah, maybe we can't get away with killing the civilians.
[00:12:04]  Although, to be fair, he has written articles about how he doesn't care about civilian casualties.
[00:12:08]  So he sure did.
[00:12:09]  Isn't very surprising.
[00:12:12]  You know, it just occurs to me, Cody, because that article he wrote about how he thinks it's he thought it was stupid whenever people complained about civilian casualties in Afghanistan and it's fine to kill civilians in Afghanistan.
[00:12:24]  He was 17 when he wrote that article.
[00:12:26]  He was.
[00:12:27]  There's probably a pretty good essay to be written by someone smarter than me about Ben Shapiro, age 17, urging the nation to mass murder strangers in Afghanistan and Kyle Rittenhouse, age 17, taking his AR-15 across state lines illegally to shoot strangers in another city.
[00:12:45]  Yeah, probably something going on there, right?
[00:12:48]  Yeah.
[00:12:48]  Yeah.
[00:12:49]  So, yeah.
[00:12:54]  Second, even if Hawthorne was right, could the American aircraft breach Iranian airspace to take out a shami?
[00:12:59]  A strike in a populated area would require too much pinpoint accuracy for a missile.
[00:13:03]  Military aircraft would have to be utilized.
[00:13:05]  Such an attack would surely have grave ramifications for international politics, including ongoing nuclear negotiations with the Iranian.
[00:13:11]  Yeah, I think you're not going to keep negotiating with them if you bomb their capital, right?
[00:13:16]  I do suspect that would have an impact.
[00:13:20]  Love it.
[00:13:21]  It's logic and reason.
[00:13:22]  He's using logic and reason.
[00:13:23]  Yeah.
[00:13:24]  This is also incredibly boring.
[00:13:27]  It is really boring.
[00:13:28]  It's like basic stuff like, oh, they might shoot the plane down, and that would be a problem.
[00:13:33]  Like, he's tried to portray this dude as this feckless and wildly responsible president.
[00:13:38]  But then everything he's going through in his head is like, yes, these are all things you'd have to consider if you were going to bomb the capital of Iran.
[00:13:46]  Right.
[00:13:47]  Like, what are we spending our time on here?
[00:13:51]  Yeah.
[00:13:51]  Oh, Jesus Christ.
[00:13:52]  So, and then he has this thought go through the heads of this presumably like supposedly progressive democratic candidate.
[00:14:00]  The Israelis were sitting around waiting to strike Iran's nuclear facilities.
[00:14:03]  With the Americans taking action on Iranian soil, they could take advantage of the situation to double up with a brief bombing campaign, sinking any possibility of a nuclear deal.
[00:14:12]  It's like, I don't know.
[00:14:14]  Just very, very boring.
[00:14:17]  Yeah, boring.
[00:14:19]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:14:20]  It's not like, he's not doing like a very legitimate thought process.
[00:14:27]  No.
[00:14:27]  But also, it's boring.
[00:14:29]  Like, I don't need any of this.
[00:14:31]  I don't need to hear this internal debate.
[00:14:35]  Or if you're going to write a scene where they talk about these things and you have characters giving these viewpoints and then arguing.
[00:14:45]  Like, show me two more long paragraphs where he just goes back and forth about, like, this would be a good foreign policy triumph.
[00:14:52]  And people won't call me a coward.
[00:14:54]  But, you know, we could also just do it later.
[00:14:56]  And it's just, it's, it's, it's, again, like he said, have people converse.
[00:15:02]  Reveal things about the characters of the individuals in this administration by how they react and discuss the different possibilities.
[00:15:09]  Like, chances are, everyone would have a different viewpoint, and then I would learn something about each one of them based on their viewpoint.
[00:15:16]  Yeah.
[00:15:17]  Yeah.
[00:15:17]  Do the thing, like, watch a single episode.
[00:15:20]  I normally wouldn't say this, but watch a single episode of the West Wing, a show that has characters that argue about things, like what to do and do that instead of this.
[00:15:30]  Yeah.
[00:15:31]  That would be nice.
[00:15:32]  Yeah, I never thought like watch the West Wing would be like great advice, but just watch the West Wing.
[00:15:38]  Well, he wants to write television, so he should know that dialogue is an option.
[00:15:42]  He does, and it is.
[00:15:43]  It's one of the best options.
[00:15:45]  Yeah.
[00:15:45]  You could have dialogue in this moment.
[00:15:48]  Yeah.
[00:15:51]  Yeah, it's very, it just keeps on going.
[00:15:53]  In fact, Prescott had been leaning in the direction of leaving things be, but two factors had decided him on action.
[00:15:58]  First, Prescott wanted a taste of glory.
[00:16:00]  Just Prescott, Prescott, Prescott, like, Ben, write a book.
[00:16:05]  Write a book.
[00:16:06]  Yeah.
[00:16:07]  Like, have him be a character that does things.
[00:16:09]  Don't just like tell us.
[00:16:10]  Yeah.
[00:16:11]  Have him like Prescott proposes to do that.
[00:16:15]  And then one of the characters says, like, you just want, you just want it for the glory.
[00:16:19]  Or like, what?
[00:16:19]  Like, obviously not that exactly because that's bad.
[00:16:22]  But like, have people challenge him or something.
[00:16:26]  And then he explains why they're wrong.
[00:16:28]  Or he wavers because maybe they're right or something.
[00:16:32]  Or he has to ignore good advice and you like see him make a choice to like, yeah.
[00:16:37]  Yeah.
[00:16:38]  No, instead.
[00:16:39]  That sounds like a lot more work.
[00:16:41]  Yeah.
[00:16:41]  Or he could write an essay.
[00:16:44]  A really long, boring essay about it.
[00:16:46]  Like all the options.
[00:16:48]  It turns out the president decides to bomb a sovereign nation because that would make it difficult for Congress to turn him down about his work freedom program, the everybody gets a job program that he wants to ram through.
[00:17:02]  Yes.
[00:17:03]  Is that Congress loved?
[00:17:05]  Yeah, Congress famously is a huge fan of the United States randomly bombing the capitals of sovereign nations.
[00:17:14]  And so you get whatever you want as president.
[00:17:16]  If you are like, hey, guys, I just bombed Iran for no good reason.
[00:17:21]  What Ben is doing here is showing us a stunning understanding of our government and how it works.
[00:17:27]  What he's doing is showing us a stun, like he's just showing us a window into what he thinks the government should operate like, what he thinks people should do in order to get what they want.
[00:17:38]  Yes, that's what I actually meant.
[00:17:39]  Yeah, that really is what's going on here.
[00:17:41]  Yeah.
[00:17:43]  So the president, who again only cares about his signature piece of social welfare legislation, that's clearly meant to frame him as a Nazi because the work freedom program, our bite mocked Fry, you know what I'm saying.
[00:18:00]  Yeah.
[00:18:01]  He already had his, so while he's like getting his final briefings for the bombing of the capital of a sovereign nation, he's daydreaming about the work freedom program and he writes a slogan on his hand.
[00:18:13]  This is what Ben calls a slogan.
[00:18:15]  Protecting America from those who would harm it abroad and at home.
[00:18:21]  That's a lot for a hand on that.
[00:18:22]  That is a lot for a hand and a lot for a slogan.
[00:18:25]  That's a lot for a slogan.
[00:18:27]  It's that Simpson's giant hand character.
[00:18:29]  I'm tired of all these jokes on my giant hand.
[00:18:32]  If Trump had hired Ben to run his campaign, it would be making America a country that used to be better, better than it is currently because it's not good enough right now.
[00:18:43]  Would be good for us.
[00:18:45]  Yeah.
[00:18:45]  Comma, America.
[00:18:46]  Put that on a fucking hat.
[00:18:51]  Second, some right-wing bloggers had caught onto Hawthorne's signal.
[00:18:55]  Mostly they were kooky survival.
[00:18:56]  Caught onto Hawthorne.
[00:18:57]  So, okay, a bunch of right-wing bloggers had found out that he was signal.
[00:19:01]  Okay, so Ben does include the internet cracking the code.
[00:19:04]  That's good.
[00:19:04]  That is good.
[00:19:05]  That's good.
[00:19:06]  I gotta be fair to that.
[00:19:06]  He's talking about kooky right-wing bloggers, so that's good too.
[00:19:10]  Yeah, mostly they were the kooky survivalist types, the kind of folks who posted conspiracy theories on message boards, but the CIA informed Prescott that such information, once you got out, could jeopardize any sort of attack.
[00:19:20]  So that's that.
[00:19:21]  Okay.
[00:19:21]  I'll give Ben credit for that one.
[00:19:24]  That was been understanding a reality of the world around him and then using it to predict something in a fictional scenario.
[00:19:33]  Good job, Ben.
[00:19:34]  He did that.
[00:19:35]  All right.
[00:19:35]  So that's good.
[00:19:36]  Good sentence, Ben.
[00:19:39]  Yeah.
[00:19:39]  Already some of those nuts on Fox News had been making oblique references to the rumors.
[00:19:45]  Be nice to hear what that was.
[00:19:47]  Like, how do you make an oblique reference to people online believing that a U.S. general is calling for airstrikes on Tehran using horse code blinking?
[00:19:55]  Like, how do you, like, how do you slyly reference that?
[00:20:01]  I guess I'd like to know.
[00:20:02]  Yeah.
[00:20:04]  Right, like, that's another thing.
[00:20:05]  We're like, show me that.
[00:20:08]  Yeah, yeah, show me.
[00:20:10]  Show me these things instead of just telling me them in the least interesting way possible.
[00:20:14]  So, yada, yada, yada.
[00:20:16]  We talk about how he decides not to do an airstrike, and the CIA has its own thing that they tell him to do, and blah, So, yeah, now he's in the situation room.
[00:20:26]  We're back around to where we were at the start of this chapter.
[00:20:29]  He's sort of explained.
[00:20:32]  He didn't really, yeah, it's just wait.
[00:20:34]  So, like, we're still in the situation room, and nothing has really happened.
[00:20:38]  They've just described, like, they've just explained why we're here.

=== Showing Not Telling (05:13) ===

[00:20:42]  Okay.
[00:20:43]  As opposed to weeks of debate or days of debate, you know, had ended with, like, you know, he knew that it was time for action.
[00:20:49]  You know, sometimes you just can't listen to other people's arguments.
[00:20:51]  You have to make a well, because also, like, you, like, just in terms of, like, storytelling, that's it.
[00:20:57]  That's the chapter that you write, right?
[00:20:59]  Like, you, like, here's why there happens about the debate.
[00:21:04]  Like, it's here all the things that are happening on television.
[00:21:06]  Here's the debate.
[00:21:07]  The cryptographer or whoever who figures it out and informs the government, and then you have, like, the meeting, and, like, now, this is again, if President Prescott and his administration are characters, if there's characters in here that we, like, we can engage with and be interested by, even if they're the bad guys or if they're incompetent, if they're characters, but they're not characters.
[00:21:29]  No.
[00:21:29]  They're, yeah, they're just, like, there for Ben to.
[00:21:33]  Yeah, they're little wax sculptures.
[00:21:34]  They're little action figures for him to play with.
[00:21:38]  Yeah, they're little action figures.
[00:21:39]  That's exactly right.
[00:21:42]  Yeah, so he sends in, I guess, a wet work team to go get this guy out somehow.
[00:21:50]  Yeah, the CIA.
[00:21:52]  Okay.
[00:21:53]  So that's great.
[00:21:54]  So he's told that the CIA's success odds are less than 25%, but he sends in a CIA team anyway.
[00:22:04]  I bet they're successful.
[00:22:06]  Thanks for the money.
[00:22:06]  Let's see here.
[00:22:08]  Now the CIA operatives, dressed in local garb, set a quick burning charge on the outside of the ironwork door.
[00:22:14]  It flared brightly, but the alleyway, but in the alleyway, there was nobody to see it.
[00:22:18]  One of the operatives gently nudged the door open with its foot.
[00:22:21]  For him, spread a dark hallway.
[00:22:22]  No lights came in order.
[00:22:24]  Check, whispered one of the men.
[00:22:26]  They crept down the hallway.
[00:22:27]  Visibility no greater than 10 feet ahead.
[00:22:29]  To the sides ran door after.
[00:22:30]  Yeah, okay, so Ben's trying to write an action scene.
[00:22:34]  The guy identifies himself as police.
[00:22:37]  Yada, Just a bunch of guys doing a boring special forces type raid thing.
[00:22:45]  Yeah, I don't need to.
[00:22:46]  So the team finds Brett and he's blinking wildly.
[00:22:54]  Well, kind of.
[00:22:54]  Yeah.
[00:22:55]  So the cracked cement tore into the soles of Brett's feet, gashing them.
[00:22:58]  But Brett hardly felt it.
[00:22:59]  He hadn't moved this fast since high school football.
[00:23:01]  Get the fuck out of here.
[00:23:02]  He screamed at the Americans standing 20 yards above him on the stairs.
[00:23:05]  They know you're here.
[00:23:06]  Get out.
[00:23:07]  He heard the sound of a couple of safeties being switched off, and then he saw the guns pointed directly at him.
[00:23:12]  Run, you morons, he shouted.
[00:23:14]  The operatives were blocking the stairs, standing there idiotically.
[00:23:16]  Then again, he had time to think.
[00:23:18]  He was covered with blood from head to toe.
[00:23:20]  He didn't have time to explain the blood, however.
[00:23:22]  He didn't have time to explain the bodies of Yusuf and his fellow thug.
[00:23:25]  So we don't get any explanation.
[00:23:27]  He's killed a bunch of people.
[00:23:29]  Brett has, and I guess freed himself.
[00:23:32]  I'm like, what the what?
[00:23:33]  What is happening?
[00:23:34]  We haven't had another chapter of him.
[00:23:35]  So this is just, yeah, they're just letting us know that, like, without, yeah, he feels like that.
[00:23:40]  He's already been working to get out.
[00:23:43]  Oh, here we go.
[00:23:44]  The next page or two is him explaining.
[00:23:46]  Again, Ben keeps doing this thing where like he's trying to, he'll have an action scene and then he'll spend two pages explaining all the things that happened before that action scene that he was just at.
[00:23:55]  And he keeps doing it this way instead of just telling a story.
[00:23:58]  I hate when people do that.
[00:24:00]  Not just because Ben Shapiro does it, but I hate in general scripts or stories and stuff where you're like, you have to stop and be like, did I miss something?
[00:24:09]  I don't like that.
[00:24:10]  I don't like it.
[00:24:11]  Yeah, because he wanted, he didn't want to like write a complicated scene where like this team breaks in and Brett has to like free himself like as they're sort of coming in and like clearing the building and its tents.
[00:24:22]  So instead, like he has them just greet him.
[00:24:24]  Brett's already freed himself.
[00:24:26]  They meet him having freed himself and he warns them that it's a trap.
[00:24:29]  And then we go back for two pages and explain how he freed himself before this all happened so that we can return to the present.
[00:24:37]  Unbelievable.
[00:24:38]  And if you're okay, so if you're going to do that, fine.
[00:24:42]  Don't go back and explain it.
[00:24:44]  Just keep moving forward.
[00:24:45]  Yeah.
[00:24:46]  Like if you want to do the thing where like, oh, he's, he was already breaking out and that's, that's okay.
[00:24:52]  Move on.
[00:24:53]  Yeah.
[00:24:53]  In the last chapter on a night where like, and then, you know, Brett began to, you know, saw away at like his cuffs or something, like as the guard moves away or something.
[00:25:02]  And then like, oh, and then we see him, he's freed himself.
[00:25:05]  Clearly, this was set up before.
[00:25:08]  I don't need you to go back two pages and disrupt the flow of the narrative to explain it.
[00:25:11]  We explain it all in detail.
[00:25:13]  In boring detail.
[00:25:15]  Very boring detail of him killing these two Pakistani teenagers or Iranian teenagers.
[00:25:21]  Yeah.
[00:25:22]  Also, just the phrase standing there idiotically.
[00:25:26]  Just right, and they were just standing there.
[00:25:30]  Sure.
[00:25:30]  He can infer that they shouldn't be standing there like that doing nothing.
[00:25:35]  You don't need to tell us that they're being idiotic about it.
[00:25:38]  Yeah.
[00:25:38]  Yeah.
[00:25:39]  It's, and also, I should note here that Brett Hawthorne stabs the teenage boy guarding him through the eye when he is on the ground.
[00:25:48]  Where'd he get a knife?
[00:25:50]  Oh, I don't know.
[00:25:51]  It happens.
[00:25:51]  I'm not going to read through this whole stupid fight.
[00:25:53]  But he stabs a teenage boy to death in the eye.

=== Financial Literacy Month (04:03) ===

[00:25:56]  That's important for Ben to have happen.
[00:25:58]  What?
[00:25:58]  Robert.
[00:26:00]  You know who won't stab a teenage boy in the eye?
[00:26:03]  Your mom?
[00:26:05]  In America's current political climate, I can imagine almost anyone stabbing a teenage boy in the eye in the right circumstances, actually.
[00:26:13]  Way to make it real.
[00:26:14]  Yeah, well.
[00:26:15]  That's fair.
[00:26:17]  Politics.
[00:26:19]  But it's time for an ad break, not politics, Robert.
[00:26:23]  It is time for an ad break.
[00:26:28]  I went and sat on the little ottoman in front of him.
[00:26:31]  Hi, Dad.
[00:26:32]  And just when I said that, my mom comes out of the kitchen and she says, I have some cookies and milk.
[00:26:40]  This is badass convict.
[00:26:42]  Right.
[00:26:43]  Just finished five years.
[00:26:45]  I'm going to have cookies and milk.
[00:26:49]  On the Ceno Show podcast, each episode invites you into a raw, unfiltered conversations about recovery, resilience, and redemption.
[00:26:57]  On a recent episode, I sit down with actor, cultural icon Danny Trail to talk about addiction, transformation, and the power of second chances.
[00:27:05]  The entire season two is now available to Bench, featuring powerful conversations with guests like Tiffany Addish, Johnny Knoxville, and more.
[00:27:13]  I'm an alcoholic.
[00:27:18]  I'm a guy.
[00:27:20]  Open your free iHeart radio app.
[00:27:21]  Search the Ceno Show and listen now.
[00:27:28]  I feel like it was a little bit unbelievable until I really start making money.
[00:27:33]  It's Financial Literacy Month, and the podcast Eating Wall Broke is bringing real conversations about money, growth, and building your future.
[00:27:41]  This month, hear from top streamer Zoe Spencer and venture capitalist Lakeisha Landrum Pierre as they share their journeys from starting out to leveling up.
[00:27:50]  If I'm outside with my parents and they see all these people come up to me for pictures, it's like, what?
[00:27:55]  Today now, obviously, it's like 100%.
[00:27:58]  They believe everything.
[00:27:59]  But at first, it was just like, you got to go get a real job.
[00:28:03]  There's an economic component to communities thriving.
[00:28:06]  If there's not enough money and entrepreneurship happening in communities, they fail.
[00:28:10]  And what I mean by fail is they don't have money to pay for food.
[00:28:13]  They cannot feed their kids.
[00:28:14]  They do not have homes.
[00:28:15]  Communities don't work unless there's money flowing through them.
[00:28:18]  Listen to Eating Wild Brook from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:28:27]  Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, chairman and CEO of iHeartMedia, and I'm kicking off a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing.
[00:28:35]  Math and Magic takes you behind the scenes of the biggest businesses and industries while sharing insights from the smartest minds in marketing.
[00:28:42]  I'm talking to leaders from the entertainment industry to finance and everywhere in between.
[00:28:46]  This season on Math and Magic, I'm talking to CEO of Liquid Death, Mike Cesario, financier and public health advocate, Mike Milken, Take To Interactive CEO Strauss Zelnick.
[00:28:57]  If you're unable to take meaningful creative risk and therefore run the risk of making horrible creative mistakes, then you can't play in this business.
[00:29:06]  Sesame Street CEO Sherry Weston and our own chief business officer, Lisa Coffey.
[00:29:11]  Making consumers see the value of the human voice and to have that guaranteed human promise behind it really makes it rise to the top.
[00:29:21]  Listen to Math and Magic, stories from the frontiers of marketing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:29:28]  On a recent episode of the podcast Money and Wealth with John O'Brien, I sit down with Tiffany the Bajanista Alicia to talk about what it really takes to take control of your money.
[00:29:39]  What would that look like in our families if everyone was able to pass on wealth to the people when they're no longer here?
[00:29:45]  We break down budgeting, financial discipline, and how to build real wealth, starting with the mindset shifts too many of us were never, ever taught.
[00:29:55]  Financial education is not always about like, I'm going to get rich.

=== Awkward Conference Talk (15:20) ===

[00:29:59]  That's great.
[00:30:00]  It's about creating an atmosphere for you to be able to take care of yourself and leave a strong financial legacy for your family.
[00:30:10]  If you've ever felt you didn't get the memo on money, this conversation is for you to hear more.
[00:30:16]  Listen to Money and Wealth with John O'Brien from the Black Effect Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:30:29]  We're back.
[00:30:30]  Oh my God.
[00:30:31]  I, for one, am excited about the next chapter, which is going to come after this.
[00:30:37]  So yeah, we also, during the president's chapter, we went back to, so we cut to the CIA team freeing him.
[00:30:45]  Like that was a, so we start with the perspective of the president, we move to the perspective of the CIA team, and we immediately go from that to the perspective of Brett Hawthorne, which is how we end the episode without any sort of like clear break.
[00:30:56]  It's bad.
[00:30:57]  It's horrible right now.
[00:30:58]  If you're going to divide your chapters up into characters, it's victory.
[00:31:02]  That's what I'm saying.
[00:31:03]  Do the thing that you set up the book to do.
[00:31:06]  And you don't have to do that.
[00:31:08]  You don't have to.
[00:31:08]  You said you're going to do that.
[00:31:09]  You have to keep doing that.
[00:31:11]  Otherwise, it's very confusing and awkward.
[00:31:16]  Yeah.
[00:31:16]  So I, okay, but we, no, we do get back to, we do get out of, so Brett tells the operatives to run.
[00:31:24]  Run, you morons, he shouted when the operatives finally recognized General Brett Hawthorne dressed in an orange jumpsuit and covered with blood.
[00:31:31]  They turned and ran.
[00:31:32]  They just run like he tells them to run.
[00:31:34]  And these trained CIA operatives, just run.
[00:31:37]  Yeah.
[00:31:38]  They smash their way down the hallway.
[00:31:40]  No time for discretion now.
[00:31:41]  No time for discretion.
[00:31:44]  They smashed their way down the hallway as the basement exploded, rocking the ground beneath them.
[00:31:48]  Two of the men fell.
[00:31:49]  Brett vaulted them, yelling at them to get up, grabbing one by...
[00:31:53]  Good God, what a sentence.
[00:31:55]  Two of the men fell, semicolon.
[00:31:58]  Brett vaulted them, comma, yelling at them to get up, comma, grabbing one by his bulletproof vest and virtually throwing him down the hallway with his good hand, period.
[00:32:10]  What does that mean?
[00:32:11]  That might be the worst sentence yet.
[00:32:12]  I don't know.
[00:32:13]  That is a real sentiment.
[00:32:14]  How do you virtually throw someone?
[00:32:17]  I don't know, but I'd like to find out because there's a lot of people I'd like to virtually throw.
[00:32:22]  Yeah.
[00:32:24]  I am very upset about that.
[00:32:30]  Ben has no idea how to use the active or passive voice.
[00:32:32]  So the very next sentence is, civilians' heads popped out into the hallway as the explosion registered, semicolon.
[00:32:38]  They pop out.
[00:32:38]  They pop out.
[00:32:39]  They popped out.
[00:32:40]  They pop out.
[00:32:41]  They pop their heads out, Ben, maybe?
[00:32:44]  Brett looked over his shoulder to see them engulfed in the flame that poured down the hallway like water through a flooding pipeline.
[00:32:52]  You know, maybe there's another piece of secret Ben Shapiro understanding in the fact that the civilians don't take an action.
[00:33:01]  Their heads just pop out and then they die, but it's not their action.
[00:33:05]  Their heads just pop out into the hallway, whereas Brett gets to have a direct action.
[00:33:10]  He looks over his shoulder because he is a human being.
[00:33:15]  Everyone else is just pop out their heads.
[00:33:17]  Yeah, they just pop out their head.
[00:33:18]  Their heads pop out.
[00:33:19]  No, they don't pop out their heads, Cody.
[00:33:21]  Oh, no.
[00:33:22]  Their heads popped out.
[00:33:24]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:33:26]  I just.
[00:33:27]  Yes.
[00:33:28]  Yes.
[00:33:28]  A blast of heat rocketed him through the door at the end of the hallway.
[00:33:32]  The other operatives sprinted ahead.
[00:33:33]  One man behind him screamed inhumanly as the fire caught him.
[00:33:38]  Injurious.
[00:33:38]  Yeah, I'll bet it was.
[00:33:40]  Brett turned back, pushed the man down into the dust, smelling his sizzling flesh as he tried to put out the flames.
[00:33:46]  The man's screams finally stopped as he fell unconscious.
[00:33:49]  One of the other operatives grabbed the burning man by one arm.
[00:33:52]  Brett grabbed the other.
[00:33:53]  Together they ran down the alleyway into the darkness.
[00:33:56]  And then we're back into the situation room.
[00:33:59]  Because this is the president's chapter, after all.
[00:34:02]  Yes, this is.
[00:34:03]  The chairman of the Joint Chiefs turns back to the president and says, they knew we were coming, Mr. President.
[00:34:08]  They knew we were coming.
[00:34:09]  What do you mean? Prescott asked.
[00:34:10]  You were just watching.
[00:34:12]  The explosion.
[00:34:13]  And then how do you think our guys got out of there so easily afterwards?
[00:34:16]  The Iranians must have known Ashami was there.
[00:34:18]  They've been housing him.
[00:34:19]  They just didn't want to fight us directly.
[00:34:20]  That's all.
[00:34:21]  They were expecting Ashami's thugs to take our guys out.
[00:34:23]  And when that didn't happen, they backed off.
[00:34:25]  That's a lot of conclusions to draw, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, based on a chaotic video.
[00:34:33]  Seems like it's your job to not do that, but Ben needs to inform the audience very directly of what just happened rather than, yeah, because he's not sure that his prose is clear.
[00:34:45]  Yeah, you got to clarify a bunch.
[00:34:48]  Yeah.
[00:34:51]  So, but of course, the president thinks the general's silly for being disturbed by this and tells him to just take the night off because they rescued Brett Hawthorne, so everything's fine.
[00:35:02]  Everything's fine.
[00:35:04]  Everything's fine.
[00:35:05]  The people are stabbed and burned.
[00:35:06]  Everything's fine.
[00:35:07]  So this is Ellen's chapter.
[00:35:09]  Starts in Austin, Texas.
[00:35:11]  She's obviously happy that her husband, Brett Horton, is coming home.
[00:35:16]  Yeah, he's on his way back.
[00:35:18]  Oh, okay.
[00:35:20]  Prescott, the president, has just called her to tell her that her husband's coming home.
[00:35:26]  She notes that he expected praise from her and she had to dutifully give it to him.
[00:35:31]  Which is kind of funny, just given where we are.
[00:35:33]  Yeah, because he's like Barack Obama, such a maniac.
[00:35:38]  He requires the praise.
[00:35:40]  Yeah.
[00:35:41]  Yeah.
[00:35:42]  So she's very happy that her husband's coming home.
[00:35:45]  She hasn't seen him for a year.
[00:35:48]  Prescott's doing a big old victory lap, yada, yada, yada.
[00:35:52]  It wasn't enough for the president to make political hay off of her husband's rescue after abandoning him in Afghanistan.
[00:35:57]  And now he turned Brett's homecoming into a case for widespread troop withdrawals.
[00:36:00]  She should have figured that would have been the next shoe to drop.
[00:36:03]  Really, a deep understanding of America, that's how this country works.
[00:36:08]  Yeah.
[00:36:10]  You gotta love that Ben is so disconnected from the basic reality of the things that he gets angry about that he thinks the Democrats have ever supported troop withdrawal in any meaningful way from Afghanistan as opposed to what happened under Barack Obama, the guy who was president not all that long ago, whose record in Afghanistan you can read about.
[00:36:29]  The guy he's lampooning, the guy he's trying to make a point about.
[00:36:33]  Yes, who massively surged U.S. troop presence in Afghanistan for years.
[00:36:38]  Yeah.
[00:36:40]  Cool.
[00:36:41]  I, yeah, take your word for it, Ben.
[00:36:44]  Yeah, good work, Ben.
[00:36:46]  Yeah, so Prescott talks.
[00:36:50]  Yeah, we're just going through her being disgusted that Prescott wants to take, bring American troops home from other countries.
[00:36:57]  And again, like, this is all just like, and I don't have the book in front of me, thank God.
[00:37:02]  But I imagine that what you're reading right now is just Ben describing her thoughts and feelings generally, like over a vague sense of time.
[00:37:13]  Along with describing what the president is doing.
[00:37:16]  And write a scene.
[00:37:19]  Write a fucking scene, Ben.
[00:37:20]  Yes.
[00:37:20]  Have her reaction between them.
[00:37:23]  You know, write her sitting and watching TV with her family around her, and they all react differently.
[00:37:29]  And that gives her something to actually interact with as a person.
[00:37:32]  And we can see her mental state too.
[00:37:34]  That'd be great.
[00:37:35]  That'd be great.
[00:37:36]  Maybe write her watch on television when news is announced.
[00:37:40]  Yeah, she's watching it with her mom and her dad or aunts or cousins or whatever.
[00:37:44]  And some of them are like, oh, that's such a nice thing for the president to say.
[00:37:48]  And she gets angry and she snaps at them and screams at them and reveals her feelings and also the fact that she's on the fucking razor's edge.
[00:37:54]  And then you have a character.
[00:37:56]  Like a scene.
[00:37:56]  Like a scene.
[00:37:58]  Like a scene in a thing that people might want to read.
[00:38:01]  Robert, I just wrote a book.
[00:38:04]  I wrote a book and it's bad, which is why I didn't publish it.
[00:38:07]  There you go.
[00:38:09]  Yes.
[00:38:09]  But like, it's just like it's like so much of this reads like him summarizing what he wants to happen.
[00:38:15]  It's his summary of a book.
[00:38:18]  Robert, you think your book was bad?
[00:38:20]  The one that I read?
[00:38:22]  Yeah.
[00:38:22]  That wasn't bad.
[00:38:24]  Okay, well, this is not the picture of the book.
[00:38:26]  I read something nobody else did.
[00:38:28]  It is good.
[00:38:29]  I feel special.
[00:38:31]  It's not the topic of discussion now.
[00:38:34]  The phenomenal writer, Robert Evans.
[00:38:35]  He's been Shapiro's terrible book.
[00:38:38]  You also have a published book that everybody should buy instead of.
[00:38:41]  I do have a published non-fiction book, but it's very different.
[00:38:43]  Non-fiction and fiction are completely different.
[00:38:46]  It's phenomenal.
[00:38:46]  You all should buy it.
[00:38:48]  Yeah.
[00:38:49]  But so.
[00:38:50]  Big fan.
[00:38:52]  Yeah.
[00:38:52]  Bubba gives Ellen the morning off because her husband's getting back from Afghanistan, which doesn't seem like a lot of time to give her off.
[00:39:04]  How generous.
[00:39:05]  Yeah.
[00:39:06]  Just the morning.
[00:39:06]  They don't even like won't even let him have a nooner.
[00:39:10]  Yeah.
[00:39:10]  I might give her.
[00:39:11]  You know what?
[00:39:12]  If I'm the boss, you might get a weekend for that.
[00:39:15]  Yeah.
[00:39:16]  Take a four day.
[00:39:17]  Have breakfast with your husband.
[00:39:20]  Your husband was kidnapped and tortured in Iran.
[00:39:23]  Take a three-day, you know?
[00:39:24]  Take a three-day.
[00:39:25]  Just a couple of you.
[00:39:26]  Go down to Galveston, catch a flesh-eating virus.
[00:39:29]  It's the only thing to do in Galveston.
[00:39:32]  Monday, though.
[00:39:32]  You're back in this seat, or I swear to God, I will fire you and your family will starve on this.
[00:39:37]  You're going to actually have to stay late on Monday to make up for the time that you took off.
[00:39:43]  Yeah, I'm going to need like a couple of double shifts Monday.
[00:39:46]  Let's say Monday through Thursday next week to make up for the weekend.
[00:39:49]  Yeah, there we go.
[00:39:50]  I think we fit it out.
[00:39:52]  The phone rang.
[00:39:54]  Ellen hastily checked her bedside clock.
[00:39:56]  It read 7:56 a.m.
[00:39:58]  She'd overslept.
[00:39:59]  She'd taken a sleeping pill to calm herself down after the president's speech.
[00:40:02]  Bubba had given her yada yada yada.
[00:40:06]  The determinedly cheery ring continued.
[00:40:09]  She leaned over, picked up.
[00:40:10]  Ellen Hawthorne, she said groggily into the phone.
[00:40:13]  It's me, baby.
[00:40:14]  We get it.
[00:40:15]  You're tired.
[00:40:16]  Yeah.
[00:40:17]  It's me, baby.
[00:40:18]  Involuntarily, tears sprang to her eyes.
[00:40:20]  She hearingly listened.
[00:40:22]  We could just say tears sprang to her eyes.
[00:40:25]  What is the other option here, Ben?
[00:40:27]  She forced tears to her eyes during the phone call at 7:56 in the morning.
[00:40:32]  Whatever.
[00:40:32]  Oh, God, you're all right, Brett.
[00:40:34]  We don't have time, baby.
[00:40:36]  I'm here.
[00:40:36]  I'm fine.
[00:40:37]  I can't tell you where I am right now for security reasons.
[00:40:39]  We're not in American airspace yet, but I need you to call Bill.
[00:40:43]  She immediately snapped to attention.
[00:40:44]  Brett didn't need the loving wife right now.
[00:40:46]  He needed the partner.
[00:40:47]  She'd put on that hat so many times, it sprang to her without delay.
[00:40:50]  What's going on?
[00:40:51]  I need you to conference in Bill.
[00:40:53]  He'll know.
[00:40:54]  Why can't you call him directly?
[00:40:55]  I can't explain.
[00:40:56]  I'm your only call.
[00:40:57]  They're monitoring it.
[00:40:58]  You got it.
[00:40:59]  So I guess, like, if you're a general who gets kidnapped and tortured in Iran, like somebody who gets arrested by the cops, you get one phone call.
[00:41:10]  Yep.
[00:41:10]  Yep.
[00:41:11]  Also, I just like in such a short paragraph, so many times he indicated that she was acting hastily and immediately.
[00:41:21]  Snapping to attention very quickly.
[00:41:23]  Like, yeah, that's the phrase.
[00:41:24]  We get, it doesn't matter.
[00:41:26]  Cares.
[00:41:27]  So the bill that they're talking about is some general named Bill Collier that we haven't met before, I don't believe.
[00:41:33]  But yeah, so again, her husband uses his first and only phone call, presumably, to have his wife call another man to deal with problems for him, which I do find funny.
[00:41:45]  Bill, this is Ellen.
[00:41:46]  I've got Brett on the other line.
[00:41:48]  I need to conference you in.
[00:41:49]  Do it.
[00:41:49]  Which is, again, now this is the stuff, Ben.
[00:41:52]  You don't need to write out.
[00:41:54]  You can just say she added him to the conversation.
[00:41:57]  You like, click the thing on her smartphone.
[00:41:58]  Like, we don't need to hear her conference in this other guy into the conversation.
[00:42:04]  Yeah.
[00:42:06]  The most unnecessary dialogue juxtaposed with like no dialogue that we desperately want.
[00:42:12]  Yes.
[00:42:14]  So there's some stupid movie greetings between this old grizzled general who I think is the mentor to Brett and Brett.
[00:42:22]  And then Bill, I need you to get your boys on something.
[00:42:24]  I need them to find a known associate of Ashami's.
[00:42:27]  Name's Muhammad.
[00:42:29]  Narrow it down, Ben.
[00:42:33]  I need your boys to find a guy.
[00:42:35]  He has the most common name on planet Earth.
[00:42:40]  Did you find John yet?
[00:42:42]  I don't know who you're talking about, bud.
[00:42:45]  I don't have his last name.
[00:42:47]  He's named Joe.
[00:42:49]  Well, why don't you give me something tougher to do?
[00:42:51]  Like, find a specific Mexican named Juan.
[00:42:54]  He's coming here to the United States.
[00:42:55]  He's about 5'9, 140, skinny, maybe 17 years old.
[00:42:59]  Another 17-year-old.
[00:43:01]  You just stabbed one to death, Ben.
[00:43:02]  What is wrong with you?
[00:43:03]  I want to know.
[00:43:04]  Why is your dad?
[00:43:06]  17-year-olds.
[00:43:08]  It is weird.
[00:43:09]  I don't like it.
[00:43:11]  Skinny, maybe 17 years old.
[00:43:13]  Blue eyes, angular face, sharp big nose.
[00:43:16]  Get your boys on it.
[00:43:17]  There's not much time.
[00:43:19]  So we're looking for a big-nosed boy named Mohammed.
[00:43:24]  I can't.
[00:43:28]  Get me all the Mohammeds with all the noses you can find.
[00:43:32]  Give me every nose you see.
[00:43:37]  Oh, God.
[00:43:39]  Then he hangs up.
[00:43:40]  That's all the info he gets on.
[00:43:42]  Okay.
[00:43:43]  He could have said, I love you to his wife.
[00:43:47]  No, no, he's still on the line with Ellen.
[00:43:49]  This was a conference call.
[00:43:53]  He wants General Brett Hawthorne to only have one phone call for story reasons that are unclear as of yet.
[00:43:58]  But he also needs him to talk to multiple people.
[00:44:00]  So we're doing this awkward bullshit.
[00:44:02]  I just thought when he hung up, you met Brett Hawthorne hung up.
[00:44:06]  All right.
[00:44:06]  He's still on the line.
[00:44:08]  I think he also wants Ellen and Brett to be like a badass Patriot team, but the only thing he can think of her to do is to act as the center of a three-way phone call.
[00:44:20]  So that's worth noting.
[00:44:22]  Like, we're talking like that's some Star Trek 1960 bullshit, right?
[00:44:27]  Right.
[00:44:28]  Before, you know, anyway, I'm sure Ben thinks it's a big deal.
[00:44:33]  Are you okay, honey?
[00:44:34]  Ellen asked after she knew Collier had clicked off the line.
[00:44:37]  She could hear him sigh audibly.
[00:44:39]  If she could hear him sigh, Ben, then by definition, it was audibly.
[00:44:43]  That's so few.
[00:44:45]  Okay.
[00:44:46]  She could hear him sigh.
[00:44:47]  There's the sentence.
[00:44:48]  You could, okay.
[00:44:50]  I don't know, sweetheart.
[00:44:51]  He sighed.
[00:44:51]  Yeah, he sighed.
[00:44:53]  He sighed.
[00:44:53]  He sighed.
[00:44:54]  So many ways to cut words out of this.
[00:44:56]  Yeah.
[00:44:56]  That don't help.
[00:44:57]  Yeah.
[00:44:58]  I don't know.
[00:44:59]  Well, it's like they say brevity is the soul of like, you got to use the words, right?
[00:45:03]  Yeah.
[00:45:03]  Oh, brevity is the soul of all the words, colon.
[00:45:06]  The words that you got to use, comma.
[00:45:08]  You got to use them so that people understand what you're saying.
[00:45:11]  The words, that is, the words that you use brevitarily.
[00:45:16]  I love that.
[00:45:18]  That Shakespeare quote.

=== Audible Sighs and Airstrikes (03:28) ===

[00:45:19]  Yep, yep.
[00:45:23]  All right.
[00:45:23]  So she hears him sigh audibly.
[00:45:26]  All right.
[00:45:26]  She hears him sigh audibly.
[00:45:28]  I don't know, sweetheart.
[00:45:29]  I don't know what I'm doing here.
[00:45:30]  Why I'm doing it.
[00:45:31]  What they did to my guys in Afghanistan.
[00:45:33]  I know, sweetheart.
[00:45:34]  I know.
[00:45:35]  That's not a conversation.
[00:45:38]  Ellen, I wasn't supposed to live.
[00:45:40]  That wasn't the message I gave.
[00:45:42]  I blinked airstrike.
[00:45:43]  Not tactical mission.
[00:45:44]  Not rescue.
[00:45:45]  Airstrike.
[00:45:46]  Are you bummed that they used a surgical method that rescued you and didn't kill dozens of people?
[00:45:52]  Also.
[00:45:53]  Like Ashami was gone.
[00:45:54]  The bad guy was gone.
[00:45:55]  The airstrike would not have...
[00:45:57]  Okay.
[00:45:58]  Also, he's like mad.
[00:46:00]  He's like, I shouldn't be alive.
[00:46:01]  I said, airstrike.
[00:46:03]  I wanted him to bomb Tehran.
[00:46:05]  But you escaped.
[00:46:06]  You did the escaping.
[00:46:08]  Yeah.
[00:46:08]  Yeah.
[00:46:09]  You were also going to, like.
[00:46:10]  You stabbed that 17-year-old boy to death.
[00:46:13]  Right.
[00:46:14]  Like, if you're not going to be able to do that.
[00:46:14]  You saved those CIA agents.
[00:46:16]  It's unbelievable.
[00:46:18]  Yes.
[00:46:19]  But, sweetheart, you're alive.
[00:46:21]  You're coming home.
[00:46:21]  I know you feel guilty.
[00:46:22]  I know you never meant to leave your men behind, but you alive is better than you dead.
[00:46:26]  Me alive is better than Ashami dead.
[00:46:28]  He was there, Ellen.
[00:46:29]  He was there.
[00:46:30]  I gave him the location.
[00:46:31]  I knew they'd have time to take the shot.
[00:46:33]  But there's no explanation as to why, because they've like film and edit a video and then put it out and he's a terrorist, whatever.
[00:46:38]  But Prescott, damn him, didn't have the balls.
[00:46:40]  He just didn't.
[00:46:41]  And now Ashami's out there planning.
[00:46:42]  He's smart, Ellen.
[00:46:43]  Smart as hell.
[00:46:44]  And he steps ahead of us.
[00:46:45]  We were lucky to get out of there alive.
[00:46:47]  If it hadn't been for a stupid thug named Yusuf, we'd all be a 17-year-old thug.
[00:46:50]  We'd all be dead.
[00:46:51]  And Prescott wouldn't have an international incident, wouldn't have an international incident on his hand anyway.
[00:46:56]  Dead Americans and their body parts spread all over Tehran.
[00:46:59]  Damn the man.
[00:47:00]  Damn him.
[00:47:03]  Again, like the reason to hate this president is that.
[00:47:07]  He did do an airstrike.
[00:47:08]  He didn't immediately jump to an airstrike based on a man blinking.
[00:47:13]  Very cool.
[00:47:14]  Yeah.
[00:47:16]  So she's happy that her husband's coming home.
[00:47:20]  Oh, God.
[00:47:21]  I have to read this part, even though I think it might actually kill me to say.
[00:47:25]  Oh, no.
[00:47:26]  Like, I don't know that I'm going to live through this.
[00:47:28]  She found tears in her eyes again.
[00:47:30]  Her man, her strong, unwavering man, so ready to die.
[00:47:34]  That's not a sentence.
[00:47:36]  Not a sentence, Ben, but you're coming home, sweetheart.
[00:47:39]  You're coming home.
[00:47:39]  On the other end of the phone, she could hear her husband exhale.
[00:47:42]  You're right, he said slowly.
[00:47:44]  I'm coming home.
[00:47:46]  Take a bullet for you, babe.
[00:47:47]  She said, take a bullet for you, sweetheart.
[00:47:50]  The line kicked, clicked dead.
[00:47:52]  What?
[00:47:52]  Yeah, that's how they end all their phone calls.
[00:47:58]  I know.
[00:47:59]  I know.
[00:48:00]  It's the worst thing I've ever seen on paper.
[00:48:03]  With authority, I can say this.
[00:48:05]  With conviction.
[00:48:07]  If I made it this far, I would slam the book down here.
[00:48:12]  If I made it this far, you wouldn't have.
[00:48:14]  No, but oof.
[00:48:16]  Yeah, I've read just straight up Nazi propaganda that was less pain-inducing in its prose than that sentence.
[00:48:27]  Like, Jesus.
[00:48:29]  It's a real slog, man.
[00:48:31]  Yeah.
[00:48:32]  We have to take another break, don't we?
[00:48:35]  Yeah.
[00:48:36]  Yeah, in case you're listening, I am comparing this unfavorably to the Turner Diaries.
[00:48:42]  Yeah.
[00:48:44]  Don't worry.
[00:48:44]  He's also written articles that read like the Turner Diaries, too.

=== Comparing to Turner Diaries (03:46) ===

[00:48:47]  He sure has.
[00:48:49]  Yeah.
[00:48:52]  But you know what doesn't read like the Turner Diaries?
[00:48:56]  The products and services that support this podcast.
[00:49:03]  I went and sat on the little ottoman in front of him.
[00:49:06]  I was, hi, dad.
[00:49:08]  And just when I said that, my mom comes out of the kitchen and she says, I have some cookies and milk.
[00:49:15]  This is this badass convict.
[00:49:17]  Right.
[00:49:18]  Just finished five years.
[00:49:20]  I'm going to have cookies and milk.
[00:49:22]  Come on.
[00:49:24]  On the Ceno Show podcast, each episode invites you into a raw, unfiltered conversations about recovery, resilience, and redemption.
[00:49:32]  On a recent episode, I sit down with actor, cultural icon Danny Trail to talk about addiction, transformation, and the power of second chances.
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[00:50:03]  I feel like it was a little bit unbelievable until I really start making money.
[00:50:08]  It's Financial Literacy Month, and the podcast Eating Wall Broke is bringing real conversations about money, growth, and building your future.
[00:50:16]  This month, hear from top streamer Zoe Spencer and venture capitalist Lakeisha Landrum Pierre as they share their journeys from starting out to leveling up.
[00:50:25]  If I'm outside with my parents and they see all these people come up to me for pictures, it's like, what?
[00:50:30]  Today now, obviously, it's like 100%.
[00:50:34]  They believe everything, but at first it was just like, you got to go get a real job.
[00:50:38]  There's an economic component to communities thriving.
[00:50:41]  If there's not enough money and entrepreneurship happening in communities, they fail.
[00:50:45]  And what I mean by fail is they don't have money to pay for food.
[00:50:48]  They cannot feed their kids.
[00:50:49]  They do not have homes.
[00:50:50]  Communities don't work unless there's money flowing through them.
[00:50:53]  Listen to Eating Wild Broke from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:51:02]  Hi, I'm Bob Pittman, chairman and CEO of iHeartMedia, and I'm kicking off a brand new season of my podcast, Math and Magic, Stories from the Frontiers of Marketing.
[00:51:11]  Math and Magic takes you behind the scenes of the biggest businesses and industries while sharing insights from the smartest minds in marketing.
[00:51:17]  I'm talking to leaders from the entertainment industry to finance and everywhere in between.
[00:51:22]  This season on Math and Magic, I'm talking to CEO of Liquid Death, Mike Cesario, financier and public health advocate Mike Milken.
[00:51:30]  Take to interactive CEO Strauss Zelnick.
[00:51:32]  If you're unable to take meaningful creative risk and therefore run the risk of making horrible creative mistakes, then you can't play in this business.
[00:51:41]  Sesame Street CEO Sherry Weston and our own chief business officer, Lisa Coffey.
[00:51:46]  Making consumers see the value of the human voice and to have that guaranteed human promise behind it really makes it rise to the top.
[00:51:56]  Listen to Math and Magic, stories from the frontiers of marketing on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you could get your podcast.
[00:52:04]  On a recent episode of the podcast Money and Wealth with John O'Brien, I sit down with Tiffany the Budginista Alicia to talk about what it really takes to take control of your money.
[00:52:14]  What would that look like in our families if everyone was able to pass on wealth to the people when they're no longer here?
[00:52:20]  We break down budgeting, financial discipline, and how to build real wealth, starting with the mindset shifts too many of us were never, ever taught.
[00:52:30]  Financial education is not always about like, I'm going to get rich.

=== National Guard Footage (15:43) ===

[00:52:34]  That's great.
[00:52:35]  It's about creating an atmosphere for you to be able to take care of yourself and leave a strong financial legacy for your family.
[00:52:45]  If you've ever felt you didn't get the memo on money, this conversation is for you to hear more.
[00:52:51]  Listen to Money and Wealth with John O'Brien from the Black Effect Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcast.
[00:53:05]  We are, we are back.
[00:53:08]  We are back in reading Ben Shapiro's roll, roll, roll book.
[00:53:14]  I don't know.
[00:53:16]  I do want to think, let's take a moment before we dive back into this story to think about the fact that Herman Kane died from COVID-19 after attending a Trump rally.
[00:53:26]  And now the people who run the social media accounts he used to tweet from when he was alive are tweeting that it's not a real virus.
[00:53:35]  And that's pretty great.
[00:53:37]  That's a hard pivot, but I'm here for it.
[00:53:40]  Yeah, it's wild.
[00:53:42]  Not that convincing, but it is art.
[00:53:45]  It is art.
[00:53:47]  It says literally everything that matters about the time we're in right now.
[00:53:53]  No one even really cares.
[00:53:56]  Like, it's not something people give a shit about.
[00:54:01]  It's gone.
[00:54:02]  It's said and done and gone.
[00:54:04]  It's one of those stories that takes my already full cup a little bit over the edge in such a way that you're like, I'm mad about it.
[00:54:15]  I have to let it spill.
[00:54:17]  I have to let it roll down the side this container and evaporate.
[00:54:21]  Ooh, that was a little bit of a poetic metaphor.
[00:54:26]  A poetophor.
[00:54:28]  A poetophore?
[00:54:31]  Let's get back to this bad device.
[00:54:36]  Let's get back to you.
[00:54:37]  I keep yawning, and it's not because of you guys.
[00:54:40]  Oh, no.
[00:54:41]  It's because I didn't sleep well.
[00:54:42]  No, it's the book.
[00:54:43]  Are we still in the Ellen chapter?
[00:54:48]  God, yeah, we're up.
[00:54:49]  I think we're a...
[00:54:50]  Yep, we are still.
[00:54:51]  Okay.
[00:54:52]  Because they're still on the phone, or like they just hung up.
[00:54:54]  They just hung up.
[00:54:55]  Cutest way possible.
[00:54:57]  Soups adorbs.
[00:54:59]  And then the next paragraph just lets us know that Bill Collier got a call from his wife a minute and 29 seconds later and he let it go to voicemail because he was tracking down the man named Mohammed.
[00:55:12]  How does Ellen?
[00:55:13]  And then we're back to, I don't know, that paragraph just happens with no understanding of like how we're aware of that.
[00:55:21]  Anyway, it just is there.
[00:55:22]  And then we're back to Ellen in a separate paragraph.
[00:55:24]  He's like, he's writing spark notes for his book.
[00:55:27]  Doesn't it like that?
[00:55:29]  Unbelievable.
[00:55:30]  Yeah.
[00:55:31]  The first phone call Ellen received came from Bubba, which it didn't.
[00:55:35]  He told her to turn on the television.
[00:55:37]  When she did, she saw the George Washington bridge tilting in low motion.
[00:55:41]  Oh, so there's been a terrorist attack on the bridge.
[00:55:45]  Yeah, so, wow.
[00:55:46]  And this just is all one paragraph, that the George Washington Bridge has been blown up and the president's vowed to take care of the perpetrators.
[00:55:53]  One single paragraph.
[00:55:55]  And that he's mobilizing National Guard troops to go to New York City.
[00:55:59]  One paragraph.
[00:56:01]  We learn all of that information after, yeah, just outstanding.
[00:56:07]  If I'm reading this book, I'm skipping a lot of paragraphs.
[00:56:11]  So I might have skipped that one.
[00:56:13]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:56:14]  Then you'd go right to...
[00:56:15]  Then she heard a knock at her door.
[00:56:17]  Then being after realizing that another 9-11 had just occurred and the president had already reacted to it and the National Guard had been mobilized.
[00:56:25]  Then she heard a knock at her door.
[00:56:26]  When she opened it, Bubba was standing there.
[00:56:28]  His face looked gaunt, ashen.
[00:56:30]  She ushered him into the living room where he settled his bulk into her leather couch.
[00:56:33]  I get a call from Prescott.
[00:56:35]  He wants our boys out here.
[00:56:36]  They're ASAP.
[00:56:37]  I know.
[00:56:37]  I saw it on the news.
[00:56:38]  I won't send them, Ellen.
[00:56:40]  She shuddered involuntarily.
[00:56:41]  You know by law that you have to.
[00:56:43]  The National Guard can be mobilized by the president once a national emergency has been declared.
[00:56:48]  Under posse comatatus, that isn't totally clear.
[00:56:50]  But this ain't about law anymore.
[00:56:52]  It hasn't been for a long time.
[00:56:53]  We pull our troops off that border and I'll have more dead ranchers on my hands, more children floating in that river.
[00:56:59]  I don't have the stomach for that.
[00:57:01]  I do believe there might be enough National Guardsmen to both clean up from a bridge being bombed in New York and to do whatever bullshit they're doing on the border.
[00:57:11]  We kind of have a lot of them.
[00:57:13]  Is the whole National Guard on the border?
[00:57:16]  Just all of them, huh?
[00:57:18]  Every hand.
[00:57:19]  Unbelievable.
[00:57:22]  No, perfectly believable.
[00:57:23]  I misspoke.
[00:57:24]  Very believable.
[00:57:26]  Yeah.
[00:57:27]  So, okay, so it's just, okay, so it's the governor of Texas is not sending his state's National Guard to help New York because they're needed at the border.
[00:57:34]  That makes more sense.
[00:57:35]  Okay.
[00:57:37]  Yeah.
[00:57:38]  These other people.
[00:57:40]  Yeah.
[00:57:40]  They're the only thing standing between us and a full-scale invasion.
[00:57:44]  The invasion is slow motion.
[00:57:47]  Yeah, the invasion.
[00:57:48]  Yeah.
[00:57:48]  Yeah.
[00:57:49]  And the response to that is the invasion is slow motion.
[00:57:52]  That situation in New York isn't.
[00:57:54]  Which I guess has just been doing some straight-up fucking white supremacist shit right there.
[00:58:02]  Wow.
[00:58:03]  Yeah.
[00:58:03]  It does seem.
[00:58:04]  Slow-motion invasion.
[00:58:08]  They're going to infect us.
[00:58:10]  Yeah.
[00:58:12]  That's good.
[00:58:14]  She glances at the television.
[00:58:16]  The rescue pool crew was pulling another body from the water.
[00:58:19]  A young girl wearing a Disneyland sweatshirt.
[00:58:22]  It was footage Ellen knew from 9-11 that they'd only showed a day during live coverage.
[00:58:26]  Then the psychiatrist would explain to the network brecht, Jesus.
[00:58:31]  Yeah, what's going on?
[00:58:33]  So Ellen is, you know, guilt-ridden because she cares about what's happening in New York City, and she watched 9-11 happen in person, I think.
[00:58:41]  And she's horrified that her boss isn't going to send troops to help with the explosion that just happened in New York.
[00:58:49]  And so she turns back to the TV.
[00:58:50]  And I'm going to read the sentence here.
[00:58:52]  The rescue crew was pulling another body from the water, dash, a young girl wearing a Disneyland sweatshirt, period.
[00:58:59]  It was footage, comma.
[00:59:00]  Ellen knew from 9-11, comma, that they'd only showed a day, comma, during live coverage, dash.
[00:59:06]  Then the psychiatrist would explain to the network brass that showing such images was triggering, comma, and the pictures would disappear to spare the sensitivities of the American viewer.
[00:59:16]  God, that's a sentence.
[00:59:18]  How did she know?
[00:59:20]  Also, what?
[00:59:22]  She knew from 9-11, because in 9-11 they showed horrible, bloody footage, and then they stopped showing horrible, bloody footage all the time.
[00:59:29]  News agencies show things that are not footage from 9-11 of dead people, and that's bad.
[00:59:34]  Might be a really dumb question of mine.
[00:59:40]  But did people end up in the river in 9-11?
[00:59:46]  I don't think so.
[00:59:46]  I don't know.
[00:59:47]  I don't think the river was a big part of 9-11.
[00:59:49]  This is I mean, it's just like, I don't know if you're not.
[00:59:52]  Yeah, it's badly.
[00:59:53]  The whole thing is bad.
[00:59:54]  The whole thing.
[00:59:56]  Yeah.
[00:59:56]  Yeah.
[00:59:57]  I think, I think I know what he's saying, but not because of his writing.
[01:00:03]  That's fine.
[01:00:04]  We don't need to understand it.
[01:00:06]  Let's give it away.
[01:00:08]  Like 9-11 happened.
[01:00:10]  They showed footage, and that was damaging psychologically, and she knows that.
[01:00:14]  And so when she sees this new footage of this new terrorist attack, it makes her think, like, oh, they shouldn't be showing this footage, right?
[01:00:21]  Is that what he's saying?
[01:00:23]  I think that she's saying that there's footage from 9-11 of somebody being pulled from a river.
[01:00:29]  And they're playing.
[01:00:30]  No, that's not.
[01:00:31]  She's just saying that the footage from 9-11 that was very gory didn't get played enough after 9-11 because psychiatrists explained that that's triggering and they wanted to spare people's sensitivities.
[01:00:44]  And the idea is that, no, we should always be aware of how bloody 9-11 was and never stop showing people horrible footage from it.
[01:00:52]  That's what is happening there.
[01:00:53]  We shouldn't have had to think about this sentence so much anyway.
[01:00:56]  It's a bad sentence, which is why we use time trying to figure it out.
[01:01:00]  Yeah.
[01:01:01]  So at the end of this, Bubba's like, you know, look, I'm not going to send the National Guard.
[01:01:06]  And Ellen's like, what's the president going to do if you turn him down?
[01:01:08]  And Bubba's like, well, he's not going to send the National Guard after me because they're all in New York.
[01:01:12]  And that's basically where this ends.
[01:01:15]  So next is a chapter.
[01:01:17]  So we have learned nothing about Ellen.
[01:01:20]  Very little.
[01:01:21]  Excellent.
[01:01:21]  Very little about anyone.
[01:01:22]  A pretty cool wife?
[01:01:24]  I don't know.
[01:01:25]  Everything in that chapter that happened just happened to Ellen.
[01:01:28]  I said she was a little bit more.
[01:01:30]  How many chapters are there left?
[01:01:32]  Enough for a few more episodes.
[01:01:34]  That's for darn sure.
[01:01:36]  We're about to be...
[01:01:37]  We're about like 40% of the way through part two collapse.
[01:01:41]  And I don't know what this book's about.
[01:01:44]  Of the book is the end of the beginning.
[01:01:46]  I don't know either, Katie.
[01:01:47]  Oh, he went with the end of the beginning, didn't he?
[01:01:51]  Yeah.
[01:01:51]  Yeah.
[01:01:52]  Ben wanted to write this into a series, but then it was unreadable.
[01:01:56]  But then it was bad.
[01:01:57]  Yeah, it was a horrible book.
[01:02:00]  Don't call your shot like that, buddy.
[01:02:02]  No, don't call your shot like that, buddy.
[01:02:06]  So, Soledad chapter, she's in Minot, North Dakota now from South Southern California, which is quite a trek.
[01:02:16]  They're not close, not close places to one another.
[01:02:19]  Close.
[01:02:20]  Yeah, they made their way to the farm gradually.
[01:02:25]  They'd made their way to the farm gradually.
[01:02:27]  At first, there were only a few.
[01:02:28]  Friends and family of the militia members, an agglomeration of survivalists and nuts.
[01:02:32]  I don't belong here, Soledad thought.
[01:02:33]  Then she realized that they were here because of her.
[01:02:36]  Minot, North Dakota, lay near the banks of the Souris River, a mid-sized town of 40,000 just south of the Canadian border.
[01:02:42]  It was truly the middle of nowhere, Soledad thought.
[01:02:44]  They'd moved north, then north, then north some more, out of the populated areas, out where it would take a lot of manpower to track them down.
[01:02:50]  They'd nearly been tracked down in California.
[01:02:52]  The authorities still thought they were there, having originally believed mistakenly that they'd been burned during the fire at the ranch.
[01:02:59]  By the time investigators caught on to the fact that they were still alive, they were in Idaho.
[01:03:02]  Every few days they moved until they reached Mino.
[01:03:05]  In Minot, Aiden had allies and friends.
[01:03:07]  His parents had come from there before moving south, and he still had a pack of relatives.
[01:03:11]  Yada, yada, yada.
[01:03:12]  This is, again, we're just going to like tell you, summarize an exciting journey across the country while being tracked by federal agencies in a couple of paragraphs because we don't have time to fuck all this shit.
[01:03:24]  Yeah.
[01:03:26]  Why do we want scenes in a book?
[01:03:28]  He should just write blah, blah, blah, et cetera, et cetera.
[01:03:31]  Yeah, yeah, we just wound up there.
[01:03:33]  So, okay.
[01:03:35]  They're hunkering down with Aiden's family along with a bunch of an undetermined number of bikers and survivalists and militia members who we're going to be able to do.
[01:03:45]  Are they going to be the guys that decoded Brett's message?
[01:03:49]  Probably, right?
[01:03:50]  We're probably going to learn that.
[01:03:51]  Yeah, they've got a plan.
[01:03:54]  They start recruiting people, local boys who didn't want to be sent.
[01:03:58]  Oh, boy.
[01:04:00]  Yeah.
[01:04:01]  They're all 17.
[01:04:02]  Yeah.
[01:04:03]  Yeah.
[01:04:04]  People who didn't want to get called up to the National Guard, but I guess legally were supposed to get called up and instead join a militia, which I believe is treason.
[01:04:14]  I suspect you could, that's at least like modest treason.
[01:04:21]  Yeah.
[01:04:22]  Mild treason.
[01:04:23]  Mild treason.
[01:04:25]  So, yeah, she starts recruiting people and building a base in North Dakota and builds up eventually a small force of nearly 40.
[01:04:34]  Soledad knows all of them.
[01:04:36]  She had a gift for connecting with people.
[01:04:38]  It was the same gift that made her a staple of the evening news coverage.
[01:04:42]  And she was truly interested in all of them.
[01:04:43]  It flattered most of them.
[01:04:45]  All of them were grateful for a place to go.
[01:04:47]  Again, we just hear this.
[01:04:48]  We don't meet any of these people, obviously.
[01:04:50]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:04:51]  No, we're reading a constant montage.
[01:04:54]  Yeah.
[01:04:54]  Look, he's writing a great epic.
[01:04:56]  We don't have time for the nitty-gritty or for pleasantries.
[01:05:00]  Yep.
[01:05:01]  So we learn about her little posse.
[01:05:03]  They're starting to run short on money.
[01:05:06]  Yada yada.
[01:05:09]  Yeah, it's pretty boring stuff.
[01:05:11]  We're just about how she goes to a bar after buying groceries to sit and watch the news sometimes.
[01:05:21]  God, I'm so glad I know that detail.
[01:05:23]  Yeah.
[01:05:24]  What?
[01:05:24]  Great.
[01:05:24]  So he learns from.
[01:05:27]  I know nothing about this person from that.
[01:05:29]  And again, Ben uses this detail of this.
[01:05:32]  Aiden's the secret service man who shot down the helicopter.
[01:05:36]  Okay, right, right, right.
[01:05:37]  So he goes to a bar after buying groceries to have a beer and like watch TV and catch up on the news coverage because they don't have any internet access or television where they're all hiding out.
[01:05:49]  And this is mainly an opportunity for Ben to spend several more paragraphs talking about the foreign policy impacts of the raid on Tehran and Ibrahim Ashami's attack and all of that stuff.
[01:06:00]  And his victory speech is a terrorist.
[01:06:02]  So it's all just more like news dumping shit as opposed to.
[01:06:08]  I mean, I guess this is a little bit of something, right?
[01:06:11]  This is actually an improvement for Ben.
[01:06:12]  I'll give him that.
[01:06:13]  Because normally, Ben just tells us where a character is, spends several pages talking about things that just happened that we don't see off screen, and then moves on to like the narrative.
[01:06:23]  And in this case, he's attempted to weave this info dump, which we get every chapter of one of these info dumps.
[01:06:29]  He's attempted to weave it into the narrative.
[01:06:30]  Because at least here, Aiden's sitting at a bar getting angrier and he like shatters the bottle in his hand, cutting it because he's so angry at the news.
[01:06:39]  This at least does build something of a character and shows him like it's a little bit better than just giving a dump of things that happened.
[01:06:48]  Yes.
[01:06:49]  Yeah, it illustrates a viewpoint and like an emotion and reaction from a character.
[01:06:54]  It is still a montage, though.
[01:06:56]  Yeah.
[01:06:57]  It is still a montage.
[01:06:58]  And then Aiden's flipping channels after breaking the beer and cutting his hand.
[01:07:02]  And he comes across MSNBC covering the streets of Detroit and our friend Levon.
[01:07:10]  You remember Levon, the crack dealer, who's friends with...
[01:07:13]  Oh, boy, do I?
[01:07:14]  Yeah, whatever.
[01:07:15]  Yes.
[01:07:16]  Yeah.
[01:07:17]  Things could get this could get out of control, the reporter said, a hopeful gleam unmistakably shining in his eye.
[01:07:22]  This morning, a leader of the uprising, one Levon Williams, posted a list of demands on the website of the Fight Against Injustice and Racism movement.
[01:07:30]  That's what they're calling the FAIR movement.
[01:07:32]  Here's what we know about Levon Williams.
[01:07:34]  He's a graduate of the University of Michigan with a degree in African-American studies.
[01:07:37]  No police record.
[01:07:38]  Model citizen by all accounts.
[01:07:40]  Owns a barbership on Eight Mile Road.
[01:07:41]  According to public interviews he's done.
[01:07:43]  He came back to the community in an effort to bring prosperity home.
[01:07:46]  The shooting of Kendrick Malone.
[01:07:48]  So yeah, we just have this other character who hasn't had any direct connection to Detroit, learning about the things happening with one of the other characters in Detroit through the news at a bar, because that's how you write a thrilling novel.
[01:08:02]  So now we're just playing an interview with one of the other characters that a character who has not met that character is watching on TV in a completely different location that has nothing to do with great, incredible writing.
[01:08:15]  Whose chapter is this?

=== Move or Die Now (05:52) ===

[01:08:18]  This is Soledad's chapter also.
[01:08:20]  That's what I thought.
[01:08:21]  That is exactly what I'm talking about.
[01:08:22]  Yeah, we've moved on to someone completely different listening to an extended interview with someone else completely different because this is a well-written book.
[01:08:33]  Yeah, because pages go by, and we're talking about Levon's theories for how the police force should be redone.
[01:08:40]  And like, it's just amazing.
[01:08:45]  Yeah.
[01:08:46]  Soledad sitting on the porch of a cabin.
[01:08:49]  We're back to her.
[01:08:50]  Oh, back to her.
[01:08:51]  That's good.
[01:08:51]  Okay.
[01:08:52]  Yeah.
[01:08:52]  Yeah.
[01:08:52]  She's sipping tea.
[01:08:55]  An old, a grizzled old recruit named Ezekiel Pope, who's black and comes from Los Angeles, comes up to talk to her.
[01:09:03]  I'm sure he's got some wisdom here.
[01:09:06]  Yeah, I can't wait.
[01:09:08]  Yeah.
[01:09:09]  He was a lieutenant colonel and he'd been called into his superior's office just after the New York attack, told to round up his men and get ready to ship out to New York.
[01:09:17]  For some reason, he'd come to Soledad instead.
[01:09:20]  So he just, again, it's another dude committing some treason to go hang out in North Dakota with an unclear goal.
[01:09:27]  Again, like, for some reason, he did this.
[01:09:29]  Talk about it.
[01:09:30]  Just like have her, like, show me.
[01:09:33]  Yeah.
[01:09:33]  I can't.
[01:09:33]  Have her explain.
[01:09:34]  Have him explain why he's doing.
[01:09:36]  Like, she's, you know, having a long, dark tea time of the soul because she's brought all these people out here and everything's getting worse and she doesn't know what to do.
[01:09:43]  And this guy says, you know, I followed you for this reason.
[01:09:46]  You know, here's what happened to me.
[01:09:47]  And like, I decided, like, wherever you were going to go, that's where I was going to go to.
[01:09:51]  And, like, then she knows she has the confidence to do the thing that's necessary next.
[01:09:55]  Or whatever.
[01:09:56]  Like, fucking.
[01:09:57]  And we, the reader, understand and are slightly more engaged with what's going on.
[01:10:04]  Yeah.
[01:10:05]  But instead, like, we make, it's made very clear by Ben that Soledad actually has no control or agency in this situation.
[01:10:14]  Aiden said, Aiden said he hadn't given reason for deserting, but that he's, but he said that Ezekiel was trustworthy.
[01:10:20]  Soledad had no option but to trust Aiden's judgment.
[01:10:23]  Ezekiel looked over the snow falling silently into itself.
[01:10:26]  He wore heavy work gloves on his hand and an M4 slung over his shoulder, a maroon scarf around his neck.
[01:10:31]  Soledad gestured at the gun.
[01:10:33]  What's that for?
[01:10:33]  We're gearing up.
[01:10:34]  Gearing up for what?
[01:10:36]  Well, you tell us.
[01:10:37]  After all, you're the terrorist, mama.
[01:10:38]  That's what they're calling you now, you know.
[01:10:40]  Ever since the escape, she felt sick to her.
[01:10:42]  So they're just like picking up guns for no reason and saying, like, okay, we're all going to go do something.
[01:10:47]  You have to tell us what.
[01:10:48]  Like, but it's not up to you to tell us to get armed in the first place.
[01:10:52]  We're just all going to get armed and then tell you it's time to figure out something random to do.
[01:10:56]  I don't know.
[01:10:56]  None of this makes any sense.
[01:10:58]  Unclear.
[01:10:59]  This isn't how people act.
[01:11:01]  Yeah.
[01:11:02]  That's how they act and breads.
[01:11:05]  Ben's brain.
[01:11:07]  Yeah.
[01:11:08]  I hate this book.
[01:11:10]  Yeah.
[01:11:11]  So this guy tells her that the best defense is a good offense.
[01:11:14]  And when your force is small, concentrate it and hit them while they're weak.
[01:11:18]  And she asks, who are they?
[01:11:19]  And he says, the same people who shut down your farm, the people who attacked you, which are back in California and they're in North Dakota.
[01:11:31]  And he tells her that they have to move or die now.
[01:11:34]  And it's very unclear as to who he wants her to shoot or why or who they could shoot that would improve their situation or how it would be related to her farm being destroyed in South in Southern California.
[01:11:46]  But that's where this ends.
[01:11:47]  Yeah, is him saying we've got to move or die and we have to hurt the people who hurt you who are thousands of miles away.
[01:11:54]  It's good.
[01:11:54]  It's a great chapter, Ben.
[01:11:56]  It is a great chapter.
[01:11:58]  And you know what?
[01:11:59]  I think it's about time that we call this one A Day at the Beach.
[01:12:04]  Yeah, I think so.
[01:12:06]  Our next chapter is a Lee-On chapter.
[01:12:08]  I'm sure that's going to be fun.
[01:12:09]  I'm looking forward to that.
[01:12:11]  I'm excited now.
[01:12:12]  We'll get back to this.
[01:12:13]  Don't worry, friends.
[01:12:14]  By the time we get to this next, it might just be a full-on civil war, like the one Ben perfectly predicted here.
[01:12:23]  And once.
[01:12:24]  What a nice escape this has been.
[01:12:27]  It is a nice escape.
[01:12:28]  It's a nice escape into a world of people being very wrong.
[01:12:35]  Yeah.
[01:12:36]  On purpose, seemingly.
[01:12:38]  Yeah.
[01:12:39]  Katie Cody, would you like to plug your pluggables?
[01:12:42]  Oh, you know it.
[01:12:44]  More than anything.
[01:12:46]  You guys can check out our other stuff over at Some More News, which Cody hosts and I produce.
[01:12:53]  We have a podcast called Even More News.
[01:12:56]  And we also co-host Worst Year Ever with Robert.
[01:13:00]  We sure do.
[01:13:02]  Cody Gillespie.
[01:13:03]  We sure do.
[01:13:05]  Yeah, we got a Patreon.com/slash some more news.
[01:13:10]  You can follow me on the social medias, Dr. Mr. Cody and Katie Stoll at Katie Stoll.
[01:13:17]  Yeah.
[01:13:18]  Those are the things.
[01:13:20]  Robert is irritating on Twitter.
[01:13:23]  We have social media at BastardsPod on Twitter and Instagram.
[01:13:27]  We have a Deep Public Store.
[01:13:30]  And that is all.
[01:13:32]  This book is draining.
[01:13:34]  Yeah, I don't have energy.
[01:13:36]  I feel like I just died.
[01:13:39]  Could be everything, but I think it's the awesome.
[01:13:43]  It's also fucking Monday.
[01:13:44]  It's fucking Monday on the unnecessarily long month of August.
[01:13:50]  So long.
[01:13:51]  All right.
[01:13:52]  Podcast over.
[01:13:53]  Love y'all.
[01:13:54]  Wear a mask.
[01:13:54]  Wash your hands.
[01:13:55]  Bye.
[01:13:56]  End of the beginning.

=== Podcast Over on Monday (02:04) ===

[01:14:10]  You know the famous author Roll Dahl.
[01:14:12]  He thought up Willy Wonka and the BFG.
[01:14:15]  But did you know he was a spy?
[01:14:17]  Neither did I. You can hear all about his wildlife story in the podcast, The Secret World of Roald Dahl.
[01:14:24]  All episodes are out now.
[01:14:25]  Was this before he wrote his stories?
[01:14:27]  It must have been.
[01:14:28]  What?
[01:14:29]  Okay, I don't think that's true.
[01:14:31]  I'm telling you, I was a spy.
[01:14:32]  Binge all 10 episodes of The Secret World of Roald Dahl now on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[01:14:41]  Hello, gorgeous.
[01:14:42]  It's Lala Kent, host of Untraditional Ila.
[01:14:45]  My days of filling up cups at sir may be over, but I'm still loving life in the valley.
[01:14:49]  Life on the other side of the hill is giving grown-up vibes.
[01:14:52]  But over here on my podcast, Untraditionally Lala, I'm still that Lala you either love or love to hate.
[01:14:58]  It's unruly, it's unafraid, it's untraditionally Lala.
[01:15:02]  Listen to Untraditionally La La on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.
[01:15:11]  Most people out here think that taking care of one another is important.
[01:15:15]  And most people would step up for a neighbor going through a tough time.
[01:15:19]  Most people around here help out friends and family when they need it.
[01:15:22]  But the funny thing is, most of us won't look for help when we need it.
[01:15:26]  Talk to someone if you're struggling with mental health because most people out here really care.
[01:15:31]  Find more information at loveyourmindtoday.org.
[01:15:35]  That's loveyourmindtoday.org.
[01:15:37]  Brought to you by the Huntsman Mental Health Institute and the Ad Council.
[01:15:41]  This is Saigon, the story of my family and of the country that shaped us.
[01:15:46]  From iHeart Podcasts, Saigon.
[01:15:49]  You don't think I'm serious about a free Vietnam?
[01:15:51]  One city, a divided country, and the war that tore America apart.
[01:15:56]  For Vietnam.
[01:15:56]  They're pouring petrol.
[01:15:58]  Freedom for Vietnam.
[01:15:59]  There's a fire coming to this country and it's going to burn out everything.
[01:16:03]  Listen to Saigon starting on April 22nd on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
[01:16:11]  This is an iHeart Podcast.
[01:16:13]  Guaranteed human.