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June 12, 2023 - The Ben Shapiro Show
53:14
How Screwed Is Trump?
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Well, this week, Donald Trump is supposed to show up in court in Miami for his actual arraignment on 37 charges, ranging from obstruction of justice to mishandling of classified documents.
We need to go through the actual indictment.
The actual indictment, the text of the indictment dropped late on Friday afternoon.
And the indictment is not good for President Trump.
Let's be frank about this.
Two things can be true at once.
One, Trump clearly mishandled classified material.
So have Joe Biden.
So did Mike Pence.
So did Hillary Clinton.
Trump also, if the allegations in the indictment are correct, is going to have a tough time rebutting charges of obstruction of justice.
The indictment is really, really detailed.
Now, again, Hillary Clinton did pretty much the same thing and got away with it.
And this is why I suggested the last week two things can be true at once.
Trump's behavior in this matter has been abysmal.
And two, he should not be prosecuted based on the Comey standard, which was established in order to exonerate Hillary Clinton.
Here's the thing that the American people are not going to be able to sustain.
A Department of Justice, where when a Democrat is in power, a Republican gets prosecuted.
And when Republicans are in power, a Democrat does not get prosecuted and nobody gets prosecuted.
Or alternatively, If the Republican is in power and Democrats get prosecuted and Democrats who are in power Republicans get prosecuted, the stakes are wildly raised for every single election because you now know that if the opposition party is in power, you're in actual danger of going to jail.
And this is a really scary thing for the vast majority of Americans.
It's banana republic type stuff where Hillary Clinton gets exonerated by James Comey.
And then five minutes later, Donald Trump is being hit with the exact same indictment.
But this time, he may go to jail for literally decades for pretty much the same activity in which Hillary Clinton engaged.
Now, if you're Jack Smith and you're the special counsel who's brought in to investigate this case, that really is not a question for you.
A lot of people are upset with Jack Smith for bringing in the indictment.
This isn't on Jack Smith.
This isn't on Merrick Garland.
It isn't on Joe Biden.
Jack Smith is the special counsel.
It is his job to look into whether a crime was committed.
And if you look at the indictment, what he thinks he has established, It's very hard to say that he should be not bringing an indictment against Trump, but Merrick Garland is the sitting Attorney General of the United States, and Joe Biden is the sitting President of the United States, and they're the ones who are going to have to decide whether the indictment is actually brought or not.
The Attorney General of the United States gets a recommendation from the Special Counsel, and then it's his DOJ that decides whether to go forward with the case, and that does involve factoring in other questions, like what is the political ramification of prosecuting the former President of the United States and the current frontrunner for the opposition party?
That is a question for a political appointee like Merrick Garland.
It's not really a question for Jack Smith.
So again, many things can be true at once.
In order to understand the case itself, because the temptation is going to be on both sides for Democrats to say Trump should go to jail and Hillary shouldn't have gone to jail.
There was no distinct, there was a distinction, a massive distinction.
Hillary was clearly innocent.
Trump is clearly guilty.
Trump should clearly go to jail.
That's not true.
And the temptation on the right is going to be to say that Trump did nothing wrong here, that everything was perfectly on the up and up, that the indictment itself is a sham, and that's not true either.
The things that are true are one, if you read the indictment, and if they prove what is in the indictment, Trump's behavior is egregious and probably violates the criminal law.
And two, this case should not be brought specifically because you cannot have the appearance from the DOJ.
That they will exonerate any Democrat, but they will convict any Republican.
You cannot do that.
If you do that, then the DOJ loses all legitimacy.
At that point, it becomes just a political tool.
So we're going to start today by going through the actual indictment.
So you know, as people who are following the news, what is actually in the indictment, not the rumors.
I'm going to read you the indictment.
I'm going to read you large chunks of it so that you actually know what Trump is being charged with and what he allegedly did and what they have evidence of.
Now, again, these are all allegations.
They're going to have to prove all of this in court beyond a reasonable doubt.
Trump has, just like every other criminal defendant, a presumption of innocent until proven guilty.
I will say, however, that the indictment in this particular case is significantly more damning than the indictment in the Manhattan DA case, Alvin Bragg's ridiculous case up in New York.
That case where Alvin Bragg is trying to claim that Donald Trump violated campaign finance law on the federal level and therefore it can be laundered into a state law violation that amounts to a felony, even though it's really a misdemeanor in the state of New York.
And anyways, it's beyond the statute of limitations.
That whole case is ridiculous on its face.
On its face.
That is not the case with this particular indictment.
Again, it's perfectly within bounds to say Hillary Clinton did the same thing.
There's no reason she shouldn't be in jail.
What you cannot say is that Donald Trump did nothing wrong here because that is not true if the indictment has any level of credibility to it at all.
Okay, so Trump is supposed to show up on Tuesday in court along with his alleged co-conspirator, Walt Nauta, who is an aide who is kind of moving boxes around for him.
And the Trump team is creating a defense.
Its defense is largely rooted in a non-legal defense, right?
It's a political defense, which again, is going to be the double standard, which is true.
The double standard is true.
There is 100% double standard.
It is also true that Trump is going to have a very tough time in a courtroom explaining his behavior here.
We'll get to what is in the indictment in just one second.
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Okay, so let's begin with the documents that actively were in Trump's possession.
So according to this indictment, which again was released late afternoon on Friday, So in other words, the original sort of argument that Trump was making, which is that it was basically a signed letter from Kim Jong-un that appears not to be true if the indictment is correct.
States and foreign countries, United States nuclear programs, potential vulnerabilities
of the United States and its allies to military attack and plans for possible retaliation
in response to a foreign attack.
So in other words, the original sort of argument that Trump was making, which is that it was
basically a signed letter from Kim Jong-un that appears not to be true if the indictment
is correct.
If the indictment is correct, this is highly classified material.
If Donald Trump is leaving around in his ballroom documents amounting to specific American retaliatory
plans in case of say an Iranian strike in the Middle East.
Well, that sort of stuff should not be hanging around in Donald Trump's ballroom.
Obviously.
And it turns out that one of the key witnesses in this particular case is actually Trump's lawyer.
I've said before, and as we'll soon go through in the indictment, the worst job in America is being Donald Trump's lawyer.
The reason that is the worst job in America is because he frequently will tell you a thing, and then he will go out and he will absolutely contradict that thing.
He will change on the fly.
He will do everything that you as a lawyer tell your client not to do.
The first rule of lawyering is you tell your client to shut his mouth.
Donald Trump has never done that, not once, which makes it very difficult to be his lawyer.
Number two, if you are a lawyer, one of the first things that you also tell your client is if you have any critical communication to make, do not make it in writing.
Because if you make it in writing, it will be now discoverable.
Discoverable means that the other side, prosecution, they can see all that sort of stuff.
So if you have to do something bad, Make sure that you pick up the phone and you call somebody.
Here I am giving criminal defense advice, but here is the reality.
If you're going to do something bad, don't text that you're about to kill your neighbor.
It's a really bad idea.
Do not write them an email.
Don't write an email to your boss being like, I would like to embezzle.
How do I go about doing it?
Very, very bad idea.
Now, better thing is to not do the criminal thing at all, but...
Just as a lawyer, again, this is legal advice.
You don't want your client to be talking and you don't want your client to be texting.
Donald Trump does a lot of both of those things.
And it turns out in this case that one of his biggest obstacles is that he put his own lawyers directly in the line of legal fire, which actually flipped some of his own lawyers.
So here is the allegation of fact in the indictment.
And we are starting on page 10 of the indictment quote.
In January 2021, as he was preparing to leave the White House, Trump and his White House staff, including And now again, that's totally normal.
of his aides, packed items, including some of Trump's boxes.
Trump was personally involved in this process.
Trump caused his boxes containing hundreds of classified documents to be
transported from the White House to the Mar-a-Lago club.
And now again, that's totally normal.
People leave office, they bring with them a bunch of boxes.
From January through March 15th, 2021, some of those boxes were stored in the
Mar-a-Lago White and Gold Ballroom, in which events and gatherings took place.
Trump's boxes were, for a time, stacked on the ballroom stage, as depicted in the photograph below.
So somebody took a picture of the fact that he had kept all of these documents, including classified documents, on a giant stage in the ballroom.
In March 2021, Naoda and others moved some of Trump's boxes from the White and Gold Ballroom to the Business Center at the Mar-a-Lago Club.
On April 5, 2021, an employee of Trump's office texted another employee of that office to ask whether Trump's boxes could be moved out of the Business Center to make room for staff to use it as an office.
The second employee responded, quote, Whoa, OK, so POTUS specifically asked Walt for those boxes to be in the business center because they are his papers.
Later that day, they exchanged text messages again.
Trump employee two said we can definitely make it work if we move his papers into the lake room.
And the first employee said there's still a little room in the shower where his other stuff is.
Is it only his papers he cares about?
There's some other stuff in there that are not papers.
Could that go to storage?
Or does he want everything in there on property?
And the second employee said, yes, anything that's not the beautiful mind paper boxes can definitely go to storage.
Want to take a look at the space and start moving tomorrow at a.m.
After that text exchange between Trump employee one and Trump employee two in April 2021, some of Trump's boxes were moved from the business center to a bathroom.
You can see the picture right here of all of these boxes stored up in the bathroom and into the shower at the Mar-a-Lago Club Lake Room, as depicted in that photograph.
Now, so far, this is nothing different than anything that Joe Biden has done.
So far, what you're talking about is Joe Biden taking a bunch of boxes and shoving it in his garage next to his Corvette.
Or putting it at the Biden Center for Chinese Grift in Washington, D.C., or any of the rest of the stuff.
Is that good?
No, it's not good.
Is that usual?
Yeah, it's kind of usual.
The fact of the matter is that we now have multiple public officials who have taken classified documents and put them in places they ought not be, including, apparently, in the bathroom over here.
Well, it gets worse is the problem.
In May 2021, Trump directed that a storage room on the ground floor of the Mar-a-Lago Club be cleaned out so it could be used to store his boxes.
The hallway leading to that storage room could be reached from multiple outside entrances, including one accessible from the Mar-a-Lago Club pool patio through a doorway that was often kept open.
The storage room was also near the liquor supply closet, linen room, lock shop, and various other rooms.
And then all the boxes in June were moved to the storage room.
Now, again, you can see all these boxes lined up in the storage room.
By December, Nowda found several of Trump's boxes fallen and their contents spilled onto the floor of the storage room, including a document marked secret relative to U.S.
FVEY, which denoted the information in the document was releasable only to the Five Eyes Intelligence Alliance, consisting of Australia, Canada, New Zealand, the United States, and the United States, the United Kingdom, and the United States.
Trump Nowda texted one of Trump's employees, quote, I opened the door and found this.
Trump employee two said, oh no, oh no, and I'm sorry, POTUS had my phone.
One of the photographs now detected to Trump employee two is depicted with the visible classified information redacted.
So a bunch of this stuff had spilled onto the floor.
Now again, this is all clumsy and bad handling of classified information, and it is no different than Joe Biden keeping this next to his Corvette in his garage.
So they are bringing charges on this particular stuff, but this is not the distinction between what Trump did in terms of bringing home documents and what happened next.
In May 2021, Trump caused some of his boxes to be brought to his summer residence at the Bedminster Club.
Like the Mar-a-Lago Club, after Trump's presidency, the Bedminster Club was not an authorized location for storage, possession, review, display, or discussion of classified documents, according to the indictment.
On July 21, 2021, when he was no longer president, Trump gave an interview in his office at the Bedminster Club to a writer and publisher in connection with a forthcoming book.
Two members of Trump's staff also attended that interview, which was recorded with Trump's knowledge and consent.
Okay, so this is not a secret recording.
This is not somebody wearing a wire.
Trump knew that he was being recorded.
Before the interview, the media had published reports that at the end of Trump's term as president, a senior military official, this would be Mark Milley, purportedly feared that Trump might order an attack on country A, presumably Iran, and the senior military official advised Trump against doing so.
Upon greeting the writer, publisher, and two staff members, Trump stated, look what I found.
This was Milley's plan of attack.
Read it and just show it.
It's interesting.
Later in the interview, Trump engaged in the following exchange, quote, Well, with Milley, let me see that.
I'll show you an example.
He said, I wanted to attack Iran.
Isn't it amazing?
I have a big pile of papers.
This thing just came up.
Look, this was him.
They presented me this.
This is off the record, but they presented me this.
This was him.
This was the Defense Department and him.
And the writer says, wow.
And Trump says, we looked at some.
This was him.
This wasn't done by me.
This was him.
All sorts of stuff.
Pages long.
Look, the staffer says, mm hmm.
Trump says, wait a minute.
Let's see here.
He says, I just found out.
Isn't this amazing?
This totally wins my case, you know.
Except it is, like, highly confidential.
And the staffer laughs.
And Trump says, secret.
This is secret information.
Look at this.
You attack and... And then he says, by the way, isn't that incredible?
The staffer says, yeah.
He says, I was just thinking because we were talking about it.
And you know, he said he wanted me to attack Iran and what... And he says, this was done by the military and given to me.
I think we can probably, right?
Declassify it.
And he says, see, as president, I could have declassified it.
And the staffer says, yeah.
He says, now I can't, you know, but this is still a secret.
Well, that's not great, Bob.
The reason that is not great, Bob, is because that is Donald Trump on tape acknowledging that he now has classified information in his possession, and he's revealing it to a non-classified source, and he is saying, I could have declassified it, but I did not declassify it.
So this blows two of Trump's defenses out of the water if this tape is accurate.
Okay, defense number one that Trump would theoretically use is, I didn't know that this was classified material.
It was just material there.
Now you're calling it classified, but I didn't really know, right?
Ignorance is in fact a defense under the law if you are using the intent standard.
If the idea is that you have intent to hide classified material, you have intent to mishandle classified material, you have to know that it's classified material in order for you to have the proper intent to hide it.
If I take this piece of paper right here on my desk and I just hide it, that's not a crime.
If it turns out that it's classified, And I didn't know it was classified.
It's still probably not a crime.
You have to have intent in order to do it.
So defense number one was going to be Trump saying that he had no intent because he didn't know it was classified.
Here he is on tape saying it's classified.
Defense number two is one that Trump has frequently used, where he says, I declassified everything when I left the White House.
I, by nature, declassified everything.
OK, the problem is that when you say things like, quote.
Quote.
He says, I could have declassified it.
I can't now, you know, but this is still a secret.
This is a direct quote.
See, as president, I could have declassified it.
Now I can't, you know, but this is still a secret.
I mean, at that point, you are admitting in full on tape, apparently.
On tape, you're admitting that you had the power to declassify and you did not, which means it is not declassified and you know it is classified.
Both of those things.
We'll continue with the indictment in just one second.
Again, I think it's important for everybody to have a clear picture of what's in the indictment so that they have a clear picture of the facts on the ground in this particular case.
And then we'll get to the political ramifications and the fact that, again, there is a DOJ double standard here.
And the DOJ double... Let's put it this way.
If Hillary Clinton had been prosecuted by James Comey, In summer of 2016.
If that had happened, it would be very difficult for anyone to argue that Trump should not be prosecuted on these grounds.
Because Hillary was not prosecuted on very similar grounds, it is fully within the realm of rationality to say the DOJ should not be prosecuting the chief political opposition to the current president of the United States on these grounds.
We'll get to more on this in a second.
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Okay, so back to this indictment.
In August or September of 2021, says the indictment, when he was no longer president, Trump met in his office at the Betminster Club with a representative of his PAC.
During the meeting, Trump commented that an ongoing military operation in country B was not going well.
Trump showed PAC representative a classified map of country B and told the PAC representative he should not be showing the map to the PAC representative and to not get too close.
The PAC representative did not have security clearance or any need to know classified information about the military operation.
So he started showing classified maps around to people, again, who were not actually, you know, under classification standards.
On February 16, 2017, four years before Trump's disclosures of classified information, Trump said at a press conference, quote, the first thing I thought of when I heard about this is how does the press get this information that's classified?
How do they do it?
You know why?
Because it's an illegal process and the press should be ashamed of themselves.
So what the indictment goes out of its way to do is quote Trump basically 2015, 2016, 2017, saying this stuff is prosecutable.
In other words, he knew that criminal activity is criminal.
Okay, but here's the problem.
So some of this goes to mishandling of classified material that's pretty egregious, right?
It is egregious to say, I could have declassified.
I did not declassify.
It is classified.
Here, I need you to write this in your book.
Right, that's pretty obvious mishandling of classified information.
Now, again, that is still, even that, even that, as egregious as it is, is within the boundaries of a wide variety of public officials who leak classified information to the press.
It happens on a routine basis.
That stuff happens all the time.
Where things start to diverge is when we get to the obstruction of justice charges.
Because here is just plain stupid.
Okay.
I got to say that Trump's behavior when it comes to the handling of classified documents, you could say before that it was foolish.
You could say before that it was messy.
You could also say that it was precedented, right?
Storing boxes in your bathroom.
Hillary Clinton literally had a private server in her basement and it was connected to a bathroom in Denver.
Okay.
There's that.
Also, when you say Donald Trump is showing around classified documents to various other players, that's bad.
It is, in fact, a violation of statute.
Also, that sort of stuff happens all the time.
I mean, the press is constantly getting classified information and then reporting on it.
So that stuff does happen.
When it comes to the obstruction, this is this.
Listen, all of this is self inflicted wounds by President Trump.
You know that the bad guys are out to get you.
You know there are people who want to see you in jail.
You know they spend all day long coming up with fake criminal conduct in New York, but there are people out there who just want you to commit a crime and they're begging you to commit a crime.
If you're a smart person and you do the smart thing, what you do is you make sure you don't.
You're very careful in your behavior.
There's a reason that public figures like me overpay their taxes.
I deliberately overpay my taxes.
Why?
Because I don't want the IRS coming after me under Joe Biden.
But Donald Trump, because presumably he thinks that he has, you know, kind of full-scale immunity, he acts in ways that are very foolish.
And that is particularly true when it comes to this obstruction stuff.
So now we get into the obstruction area.
And this is different materially than what we've seen from other people, except for Hillary Clinton.
Here is what the indictment says, quote, beginning in May 2021, the National Archives and Records
Administration, which was responsible for archiving presidential records, repeatedly demanded that
Trump turn over presidential records he had kept after his presidency. On multiple occasions,
beginning in June, NARA warned Trump through his representative that if he did not comply,
it would refer the matter of the missing records to the DOJ.
Between November 2021 and January 2022, NAUTA and another Trump employee brought boxes from the
storage room to Trump's residence for Trump's review.
On November 12, 2021, Trump employee 2 provided Trump a photograph of the boxes in the storage room by taping it to one of the boxes Trump employee 2 had placed in Trump's residence.
Trump employee 2 provided Trump the photograph so Trump could see how many boxes were in the storage room.
On November 17th, 2021, NowTo texted Trump employee 2 about the photograph, saying, quote, he mentioned about a picture of the boxes.
He wants me to see it.
Trump employee 2 replied, calling you shortly.
On November 25th, Trump employee 2 texted NowTo about Trump's review of the boxes, saying, quote, has he mentioned boxes to you?
I delivered some, but I think he may need more.
Can you ask if he'd like more in the Pine Hall?
This is another entry room into Trump's residence.
NowTo replied, quote, nothing about boxes yet.
He has one he's working on in Pine Hall.
Knocked out two boxes yesterday.
We're going to continue with this indictment in just one second.
And I think it's worthwhile for everybody to have a full fluidity with the criminal charging document here.
Because again, this is the most, it's going to be the most controversial prosecution in American political history.
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Okay, back to this indictment.
Trump employees are bringing boxes up for Trump to go through after the National Archives has requested months ago that he hands over all of the classified documents.
On December 29th, 2021, a Trump employee, too, texted a Trump representative who was in contact with the National Archives.
Box answer will be wrenched out of him today, promise.
The next day, Trump representative 1 replied in two successive text messages.
Hey, just checking on boxes.
Would love to have a number to them today.
Trump employee 2 spoke to Trump and responded a few hours later in two successive text messages.
12 is his number.
On January 13th, 2022, Nata texted Trump employee 2 about Trump's tracking of boxes, saying, quote, he's tracking the boxes and more to follow today on whether he wants to go through more today or tomorrow.
And this Trump employee replied, thank you.
Again, this is Trump employee two who's basically trying to work with the National Archives.
Now to send Trump employee two four successive text messages.
Quote, one thing he asked was for new covers for the boxes for Monday.
Can we get new box covers before giving them on Monday?
They have too much writing on them.
I marked too much.
So they replaced the covers of the boxes.
On January 17, 2022, Trump employee 2 and Nowda gathered 15 boxes from Trump's residence, loaded the boxes in Nowda's car, and took them to a commercial truck for delivery to the National Archives.
When interviewed by the FBI in May 2022 regarding the location and movement of those boxes, Nowda then made false and misleading statements as set forth in count 38 of the indictment, including falsely stating he was not aware of Trump's boxes being brought to Trump's residence, falsely stating he did not know how the boxes that he and Trump brought from Trump's residence to the commercial truck for delivery had gotten to the residence, So, when the 15 boxes Trump had provided reached NARA in January 2022, NARA reviewed the contents and determined 14 of the boxes contained documents with classification markings.
Specifically, the boxes contained 197 documents with classification markings, of which 98 were marked secret, 30 were marked top secret, and the remainder were marked confidential.
Okay, and then we get into the moving around of the boxes and the concealment of the boxes.
Okay, so May 23rd, 2022, Trump met with his attorneys at Mar-a-Lago to discuss the response to the National Archives subpoena.
Trump Attorney 1 and Trump Attorney 2 told Trump they needed to search for documents that would be responsive to the subpoena and then provide a certification that they had complied, that they'd handed over all the documents.
Trump then said, quote, I don't want anybody looking.
I don't want anybody looking through my boxes.
I really don't.
I don't want you looking through my boxes.
What if we what happens if we just don't respond at all or don't play ball with them?
Wouldn't it be better if we just told them we don't have anything here?
Isn't it better if there are no documents?
While meeting with the attorneys that day, Trump also said, quote, Attorney, he was great.
He did a great job.
You know what he said?
He said that it was him, that he was the one who basically deleted all of her emails, the 30,000 emails, because they basically dealt with her scheduling and her going to the gym and having beauty appointments.
And he was great.
And he said she didn't get in any trouble because he said he was the one who deleted them.
So this is Trump saying to his attorneys.
Effectively speaking, I want you to destroy the documents and then claim that you destroyed the documents by accident.
And therefore, I will be off the hook if the documents just disappear.
Trump related the story more than once that day.
So again, what you have here again, and this is just bad behavior by Trump, not particularly smart behavior by Trump.
Is Trump saying, I know what Hillary Clinton did was criminal and she got off because her lawyers were clever.
What if you are by clever lawyers, right?
On May 23rd, Trump also confirmed his understanding with Trump attorney that Trump attorney would return to Mar-a-Lago to search for any documents with classification markings.
The Trump attorney made it clear to Trump that he would conduct a search for responsive documents by looking through the boxes.
Trump indicated he wanted to be present and that Trump would change his summer plans to do so.
After meeting with his attorneys, Trump delayed his departure from Mar-a-Lago.
And then, apparently, between that meeting with his attorneys and when the attorneys were supposed to return to review the boxes, that is when Nauda removed, at Trump's direction, a total of 64 boxes from the storage room and brought them to Trump's residence.
Now, what that means is that Trump was effectively hiding this material from his own attorneys.
Again, I say it's a bad job to be Trump's attorney.
This is why.
Because the attorney said, we want to look through the boxes so that when we attest that you have turned over all the material, we can say we've seen all the material and you turned over all the classified stuff.
That's essentially what his attorneys want to do.
Trump says, great, come back in a week.
They come back in a week and Trump has now removed a bunch of those boxes and moved them elsewhere.
So then when they go through the boxes and turn over everything, they attest that they've turned everything over.
But Trump knows that's not true because he has removed the boxes.
On June 1st, 2022, Trump spoke with his attorney by phone and asked whether the attorney was coming to Mar-a-Lago the next day and for exactly what purpose.
The attorney said he was going to review the boxes.
On June 2nd, the day Trump attorneys were supposed to review Trump's boxes, Trump spoke with Nauda for 24 seconds and then, later that day, Nauda, an employee of Mar-a-Lago, moved 30 boxes from the residence to the storage room.
In sum, between May 23rd and June 2nd, before Trump's attorney reviewed Trump's boxes, Nowda moved 64 boxes from the storage room to Trump's residence and brought to the storage room only 30 boxes.
So 34 boxes basically went missing.
So, this is a problem, okay?
This is where you get into the obstruction situation.
Because the lawyers then said to the subpoena that they did a diligent search conducted of the boxes moved from the White House to Florida, that any and all responsive documents accompanied their certification, and according to the indictment, these statements were false.
Because, among other reasons, Trump had directed now to remove boxes before Trump's attorney's June 2nd review.
So, in other words, when they went back to the government, they said, we've turned over all the documents, Trump already knew that he retained all those documents, right?
So that's where the obstruction charges are coming from.
Okay, that is essentially the case.
So the case that we have here is twofold.
One is the mishandling of classified material.
And that breaks down into he took classified material home and he stored it in his bathroom.
Again, no different from Joe Biden in the garage.
And then you have the Trump was waving around the documents and saying that they were classified in front of people who did not have classification clearance and he was admitting in those conversations that he had not actually declassified that material so he knew it was classified and he was showing it to other people.
Now, again, bad looks very much like many government officials who end up leaking to the press and some of those people do get prosecuted.
So as far as we are aware, we're not sure that Hillary Clinton actually took those classified materials and was showing them to people who did not have classification standards.
Huma Abedin was her aide, so maybe she was emailing him, but it ended up on Anthony Weiner's computer, so you could speculate that maybe she was doing something similar.
And then you have the obstruction.
The obstruction is that he went to his own attorneys.
And I mean, this is just, I'm sorry, this is a self-inflicted wound.
It's a gaping hole.
You go to your own attorneys, you have them testify to the government that they cleared all the documents, and then you hide more documents from your own attorneys.
And then you get caught on that.
Just forget about Hillary for a second.
That on its own is bad.
Now, what did Hillary do?
Hillary bleach bit her own computer.
Hillary literally took a program and cleared her own computer of all the documents that were being searched for.
And they were only found later when they ended up on Anthony Weiner's computer.
So, this is why I say the double standard is very much in play here as a political argument, as a legal argument.
And the question is whether that's going to make any difference.
So, Bill Barr, who is Trump's former Attorney General and a person who actively launched the investigation into the origins of the Trump-Russia probe.
He said that it was a bullcrap probe in the first place and launched an investigation into its origins.
He's been very critical of Manhattan DA's prosecution.
Bill Barr went on Fox News and he said like, look, I read the indictment and it's not great.
What about this chief argument that comes up for the president's allies and his legal team that this should have been handled under the Presidential Records Act, not this Espionage Act charge and other federal statutes that were used here?
Well, it started out under the Presidential Records Act and the archives trying to retrieve documents that Trump had no right to have.
But it quickly became clear that what the government was really worried about were these classified and very sensitive documents.
I was shocked by The degree of sensitivity of these documents and how many there were, frankly.
I do think we have to wait and see what the defense says and what proves to be true.
But I do think that even half what Andy McCarthy said, which is if even half of it is true, then he's toast.
I mean, it's a it's a pretty it's a very detailed indictment and it's very, very damning.
So again, we're not really sure what the defense is going to be at this point.
I've just spelled out to you what's in the indictment.
We haven't yet to hear from the defense.
The defense may blow apart the prosecution's case.
We don't know yet.
And we're going to have to see what that looks like.
But the indictment itself, they have text messages, they have recordings, they have pictures.
They have a lot of stuff.
Well, Donald Trump responded to Bill Barr.
He's not responding to the indictment in sort of specific fashion at this point, but he is responding to Bill Barr because the basic rule is that if you have ever worked for Donald Trump and then you cross Donald Trump, then you become an enemy, whether you're Kayleigh McEnany or whether you're Bill Barr.
Here is Trump going after Bill Barr for those comments.
This thing is a disgrace and virtually everybody other than a lowlife like Bill Barr, who I, as you know, I terminated because he was gutless.
He wouldn't do what you're supposed to do.
But everybody says this is a Disgraceful indictment.
It shouldn't happen.
It was done for political reasons, but it was also done, I guess, to cover up the kind of a massive crime that's now being revealed by the Republicans in the House.
It's incredible when you look at what happened, when you look at the kind of money that flows into the Biden family and to Joe Biden, by the way.
OK, so as a political matter, what Trump is saying here is exactly right.
I mean, the fact is that you don't see the DOJ going hard after Hunter Biden here.
You didn't see the DOJ go hard after Hillary Clinton.
The double standard is a political argument.
It's not actually a legal argument.
So we're not sure what the defense is going to look like here.
In fact, Trump's defense team is currently in flux.
According to The Wall Street Journal, he has now replaced one lawyer with another.
Former federal prosecutor Todd Blanche was going to lead the defense now.
He's already parted ways with two other lawyers who represented him through the special counsel investigation.
He's going to bulk up the legal team.
But the defense team in flux, it remains unclear, according to the Wall Street Journal, exactly how Trump will confront the criminal charges.
It will likely reprise a number of arguments his lawyers have made in their long legal battle to head off the prosecution in the first place.
Even many big kind of legal Trump defenders, like Alan Dershowitz, have said the indictment against Trump is very strong here.
The real question is going to be what the defense is and also, again, that political double standard.
A defense lawyer with expertise in national security, Rob Kellner, said one of the big challenges Jack Smith faces is persuading every one of those 12 jurors it could be a criminal offense for Trump to share documents that a couple of years before when he was president he would have been free to share.
But again, that's not really a legal defense as much as it is a political defense.
One of the key figures who is going to be testifying here, presumably, is going to be Trump's lawyer, Evan Corcoran, who is the person who is cited in that document I was talking about as Trump attorney number one, the person who is going and telling the National Archives, I turned over all the documents.
And then meanwhile, Trump was fibbing to him and moving the documents around behind the scenes.
Corcoran, according to the Wall Street Journal, figures prominently in the government's case that Trump conspired to obstruct justice and caused a false statement to be made to federal authorities.
Corcoran's compelled testimony, former lawyer Tim Parlatori and three others wrote, was clearly a suboptimal and constitutionally dubious substitute for a more complete search of the property under consent.
Trump's lawyers could seek ahead of trial to challenge evidence from Corcoran.
They could try to prevent Corcoran from testifying.
Somehow.
Again, I'm not sure exactly how they would achieve that.
Now, Trump does have one advantage in this case, presumably.
It has been assigned by lottery to Judge Eileen Cannon, who's a Trump appointee, to the federal court in South Florida.
Cannon is very controversial because she previously presided over a lawsuit that Trump brought in this case in which he got a special master appointed to go through the documents before the FBI was allowed to go through the documents.
That was eventually overturned by, I believe, the 11th Circuit Court of Appeals.
So she's going to be the judge in this particular case.
The left is, of course, very upset about all of this, about that particular judge being appointed.
When we get to Trump's response to all of this, in particular, in just one moment.
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Okay, meanwhile...
So President Trump is now responding to the indictment.
He responded over the weekend.
And again, the political arguments that he is making are fine.
I mean, they are totally well within the boundaries.
I agree with many of them.
And the notion that the weapons of law enforcement have been turned against him since he declared in 2015.
I mean, that's obviously true.
Also, two things can be true at once.
Just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they're not out to get you.
Also, just because they're out to get you doesn't mean that you should do dumb things that may be criminal.
It's not a smart thing to do.
Don't step on rakes.
Does that mean that he should be prosecuted again for the 100th time?
Hillary Clinton was not, so Donald Trump should not be.
However, did Donald Trump create this wound for himself?
He did.
All he had to do was give the documents back.
That's literally all he had to do.
When the National Archives called up, he should have figured, listen, there's a bunch of people in the deep state who hate my guts and they're waiting for me to screw up on this.
Why don't I just give them back the documents?
What is so vital in the documents that he cannot give them back?
Why?
That's the question people should be asking, especially going into Republican primaries.
Is this the kind of judgment that you think is likely to be successful in waging an all-out battle on behalf of American values, especially inside the deep state?
Is the best thing that you can do to walk directly into a trap created by your political and legal opponents?
Is that the smartest thing you do?
Anyway, here is President Trump.
He was mocking the charges over the weekend.
Donald Trump is indicted and they take one charge and they turn it into 36 charges.
You saw that.
Everybody was amazed.
I'm an innocent man.
We will prove that again.
Seven years of proving it, and here we go again.
Very unfair.
Trump also said that this has been great for his poll numbers, which it has been because the general rule is that when people feel that Trump is being victimized by the law enforcement apparatus, it's very good for his poll numbers inside the Republican Party.
Now, is it good for his poll numbers in general?
No.
I mean, is it going to be great for him in a general election?
Presumably no, especially because there's every possibility that if he picks, if he gets a jury that is not friendly to him, he could theoretically get jail time.
So we could have the historic opportunity to vote for a person who is currently sitting in prison when we vote in 2024.
And I'll be honest with you, on a sort of pure excitement level, my excitement for that would be really high.
Again, do I think Trump should go to jail for this?
No.
If that happened, would it be one of the weirdest and most amazing things to happen in the history of the Republic?
Well, yeah.
I mean, if the major political candidate taking on the current incumbent of the United States was sitting in jail and we're voting for him and then he had to pardon himself, that would be fascinating.
I mean, we are living in a weird alternative universe in which God's writing this season is very strange.
It's a strange writing by God, this season of Trump.
We're in like season six of Trump and the writing has gotten a little bit It's a little bit wild.
We're close to jumping the shark in season six of Trump here.
In any case, here was President Trump talking about the poll numbers.
As far as the joke of an indictment, it's a horrible thing.
It's a horrible thing for this country.
I mean, the only good thing about it is it's driven my poll numbers way up.
Can you believe this?
I mean, driven his poll numbers way up among Republicans.
So 80% of Republicans said they would vote for him even if he is in prison, which of course is correct.
I mean, if he's the nominee, you're going to vote for Joe Biden?
Does that guy seem like an upgrade to you?
He's done a horrible job.
However, here's the problem for him in a general election.
Are you likely to be elected under that position?
No.
According to a new ABC Post Trump indictment poll, 61% say document charges are serious, including 38% of Republicans and 63% of independents.
Again, don't worry about what Republicans think and what Democrats think.
Think about what independents think.
Over 6 in 10 independents think these are serious charges against Trump.
And when you look at the number who believe that Trump should be charged in this particular case, what you see is that 48% believe he should be charged and 35% believe he should not.
His approval rating is currently at 31%.
Are these numbers likely to go up or down as this case continues?
Probably they're not likely to go up.
So this is the problem.
It's also a problem for Republicans.
Again, every day that Republicans spend talking about Trump's various activities is a day they're not talking about Joe Biden's various activities and all the bad stuff that Joe Biden has done and the potential corruption that Joe Biden is embroiled in and the FBI whistleblower document that really should be the big story in the country.
Lindsey Graham was getting ripped up and down yesterday for making the comparison of Trump to Hillary, and he's right on this.
Again, two things can be true at once.
He is right that Hillary Clinton should have been charged.
Also, you cannot simultaneously make the case that Hillary should have been charged and Trump should not be charged unless you are basically willing to say that Hillary should have been charged, she wasn't.
And because she wasn't, Trump should not be.
That's the case that I'm making.
Is that once you set the standard, the standard is the standard.
You don't get to change the standard because Republicans are the crosshairs.
However, what Trump wants Republicans to say is that he did nothing wrong.
Well, you can't simultaneously say that Trump did nothing wrong and also Hillary did something wrong.
That is not a plausible case to make.
Here is Lindsey Graham trying to defend Trump here.
Trump has said repeatedly that he did nothing wrong.
Do you believe that?
Donald Trump, you may hate his guts, but he is not a spy.
He did not commit espionage.
What he did is very similar in my view to what Hillary Clinton did.
People in the Clinton case took a hammer to a blackberry and destroyed it.
They wiped clean with bleach bit emails.
They said they were all personal, but some of them actually were classified and it wound up on Anthony Weiner's computer and not a damn thing happened to her.
Okay, so again, Lindsey Graham is right about all of this, right?
He is correct about all of this, but the best case that you can make for Trump at this point is that they didn't prosecute Hillary.
When Trump was leading a chance to lock her up in 2016, then, you know, it's awkward.
It's awkward.
Jim Jordan, good congressperson from Ohio.
I like Jim a lot.
But Jim was stuck in a similar situation on CNN, trying to say that Trump, maybe Trump did declassify this material.
And then Dana Bash at CNN is like, well, I mean, he literally said on tape he didn't declassify the material.
And this is a problem.
Dana, the standard is clear.
The standard is Navy v. Egan, a 1988 case.
Unanimous decision from the court that Justice Blackmun wrote the opinion, and it said the President's ability to classify and control access to national security information flows from the Constitution.
He decides.
He alone decides.
He said he declassified this material.
He can put it wherever he wants.
He can handle it however he wants.
That's the law.
Do you have evidence?
That the president, when he was president, now former president, actually declassified these documents before he took them?
I go on the president's word, and he said he did.
And the Supreme Court said that's what counts.
So we can have all the things Jack Smith wants to say, but everyone sees this for the political operation it is.
The standard is the standard.
I didn't set the standard, the Constitution and the Supreme Court did, and they did it in a unanimous fashion, and it was opinion written by Justice Blackmun.
So that's the standard.
Now again, that would normally be Trump's defense, and Jim Jordan is right.
The problem is he was caught on tape literally saying, I could have declassified it, but I didn't.
Which makes things kind of awkward.
Trump has a habit of putting his defenders in awkward positions over and over and over.
Trump's own lawyer tried to make the argument that he only had mementos, and he didn't.
I mean, I'm sorry, but those are not mementos.
We saw a picture that's been widely publicized, right?
Of a box that's flipped over.
What's in that box?
Newspaper articles.
Pictures.
Things that are mementos.
Things that he has a right to take.
So, if I'm someone with documents that I have a right to have as the president who left the White House, do I want people rummaging through my personal items?
No.
So I think you have to remember, again, like I said, there's context to everything.
That context will be brought out on defense.
And that's going to be our opportunity.
We have not had an opportunity to give our side.
And that's the image right there that I'm discussing.
It's newspapers.
It's pictures.
It's mementos.
Okay, except that, again, according to the indictment, we'll see.
Maybe they can make this case.
According to the indictment, Trump himself is saying that there are secret documents, including classified maps, and including secret documents inside the DOD, that he was revealing to non-classified sources.
So, here is, in summation, the indictment is a problem for Trump.
If this gets in front of a jury, which presumably it will, it's anybody's guess as to which way this is going to go.
When it comes to whether the indictment should have been brought in the first place, that is a question for Merrick Garland and Joe Biden.
We live in a country where it is a good idea to prosecute your chief political opponent on exactly the same behavior that A candidate of your party was exonerated on in 2016.
That is really the political question.
Once it gets into a court, though, this is very dangerous stuff for Trump, and it's a self-inflicted wound for Trump.
He didn't have to do any of this.
When the documents were asked for by the National Archives, he should have returned them.
Not because the National Archives deserve them, not because they're the most wonderful people in the world, but because out of an abundance of caution, if you know people are gunning for you, why wouldn't you just do the thing?
Especially because it's not like Trump had a special use for these papers.
I mean, we know what Trump wanted them for.
He wanted them because he wanted them.
As I've been saying literally since the beginning of this entire peculiar situation.
The reason that Trump did this is because I like documents.
He wasn't doing it to distribute to the Chinese.
He wasn't giving it to the Russians.
There's nothing nefarious.
He just wanted the documents.
In the same way that Donald Trump likes putting his name on big gold letters on buildings, he wanted these documents in his possession because they were his.
Is that foible of personality a smart idea to humor in the middle of a situation in which your political opposition hates your guts and wants you in jail?
No, it isn't.
And it does speak to judgment when you go forward into a primary.
You would think that Donald Trump understands his opposition better than literally anyone since he's the person who's being targeted by them.
If you know that, don't you have a moral obligation to your own supporters and to your own agenda to guard yourself?
To be careful so they can't do this to you?
Well, we'll see how all of this plays out.
Alrighty, meanwhile, the fix is in.
Hey, somebody has to win and somebody has to lose in this culture war.
We used to believe in the United States there was such a thing as neutral.
There is no such thing as neutral anymore in the culture wars.
The reason there's no such thing as neutral is because neutral used to be, you live the way you want to live and I'll live the way that I want to live.
And when it comes to the teaching of children, we will restrict that to writing, reading, arithmetic.
How you raise your kids will be a matter of baseline morality.
And that's pretty much it.
We'll all leave each other alone.
And then the left decided that they have a new religion and it must be propagated to every person in the United States.
The left, quite rightly, pointed out that the default position in the United States was Judeo-Christian morality.
That was the default silent background to American life.
And that had to be dispensed with.
It had to be done away with.
And the only way that could happen is through sheer silencing.
Silencing and public pressure and shouting and screaming and legal cram downs.
That's the only way that the current culture could be destroyed and replaced with this new counterculture, pride progress, progressivism.
And we're seeing it play out in real time and it is hideous.
And it also means that everyone who thought they had the luxury of standing aside and just washing their hands of it and saying, whatever you do, you do wrong.
That luxury has now gone away.
You cannot wash your hands of this because the battle is upon you, whether you like it or not.
We're seeing it online.
So apparently, YouTube has now been going through literally all of the accounts over at Daily Wire and they've been looking for strikes.
When I say strikes, what I mean here is they've been looking to basically get rid of all of the various accounts that are associated with Daily Wire.
My account, Matt Walsh's account, Candace Owens' account, Michael Knoll's account, Jordan Peterson's account, Andrew Clavin's account, Brad Cooper's account.
These accounts have a combined total of 157 million views on YouTube.
Over the course of just the last month, about 20 million views a day, YouTube is attempting to kill these accounts.
Why?
Because all of us speak the truth when it comes to the question of men and women and whether men are women or vice versa.
So as Jeremy points out, last month, over the past few months, Daily Wire has received about 200 violations from YouTube across our accounts.
And these are violations going back years.
So they now have their little apparatchiks going through old videos looking for violations.
Last month, Matt Walsh was demonetized.
On Friday, Candace Owens and Michael Mulls were suspended for seven days after receiving their second strike, and Jordan Peterson was given his first strike three in 90 days and your account is terminated.
In the last 90 days, our accounts have received 104 violations for hateful and derogatory content, earning them limited monetization.
Again, nearly every one of these violations comes from our coverage of the trans debate.
Again, the basic idea here is supposed to be that if you say that a boy cannot become a girl, and that is absolute, sheer, anti-scientific garbage, if you say that, YouTube will ban you.
YouTube will strike you down.
As Jeremy points out, YouTube claims the ability to openly debate political ideas, even those that are controversial, is core to a functioning democratic society, but this is presumably, at the same time, that they are literally silencing, like preventing you from saying these things.
And if you say these things, then they strike you.
They hit you with a strike.
And even if you mention this stuff, by the way, outside of YouTube, they can hit you with a strike, apparently.
This is one of the things that they've been attempting to do.
And it's not just from YouTube.
YouTube is just the source where 25% of the population gets its news.
But it's not just YouTube.
The White House is pushing this stuff, too.
And the White House is pushing this at the top level.
I've seen no greater sign than the White House over the weekend that we have now seen the complete co-op.
We've seen ideological coup in the United States.
The Judeo-Christian value system has been completely destroyed in favor of pride progress, radical leftist gender ideology, individualistic nonsense.
Joe Biden put up this tweet, quote, today, the people's house, your house sends a clear message to the country and to the world.
America is a nation of pride.
Giant Pride Progress flag hanging from the center of the rotunda in the center sort of rotunda of the White House.
Looking out over the White House lawn.
Here's another picture of that from another angle.
You can see it's actually centered.
The American flags are on either side of the Pride Progress flag, but this is the regime.
Your new regime is the Pride Progress regime.
You will be ruled by it.
No longer is it a matter of whatever floats your boat, live your own life behind private doors, that's your problem.
No longer is that what the United States is.
The United States is a place where this is the official doctrine of the United States, is that boys can be girls, girls can be boys, and if you stand up to that, you may be in legal peril.
You could wind up in actual legal peril.
This is a country where if you say that marriage is between one man and one woman, you could be criminalized.
You could have your life taken away from you in a wide variety of ways.
Because that is the new regime.
Again, there is no neutral.
One, the American flag was put aside, and the Pride Progress flag was flown in its place.
As I pointed out, this is a coup.
It is a coup because, ideologically speaking, no American soldier has ever died for the Pride Progress flag.
Because no American soldier has ever served under the Pride Progress flag, because that is not the elected flag of the United States.
No law has ever been passed under the Pride Progress flag, because it is not the flag of the United States.
It is an ideological flag.
All you have to do to understand how sick and perverse this is is just replace the Pride Progress flag with the flag of the Vatican.
If you put that up there, everybody would recognize that this was a coup.
Put a Pride Progress flag there and everybody says, oh, well, you know, that's just neutrality.
That's secular neutrality.
It is not secular and it is not neutral.
It is a religious movement.
It is a fanatic religious movement dedicated to destroying all of its opposition through silencing and through, yes, the force of law.
And when you see that hanging, I mean, again, this is no shock.
You've seen Barack Obama all the way back in 2015, lighting up the White House in gay pride colors.
But when you see the Pride Progress flag, giant Pride Progress flag, centered above the seal of the President of the United States, while the American flag is shunted off to the side, in what could maybe be a violation of the flag code, when you see that sort of stuff, you recognize what is happening here.
The replacement of one ethic by another.
The complete destruction of one ethos and its replacement by another.
We all talk about courage.
over the weekend because they had a big pride celebration because of course it is pride month,
the most holy month in the secular catechism. And he made some pretty astonishing statements.
Here we go. We all talk about courage. Well, I see more courage in this lawn than I've seen
in any time in the recent past. He literally spoke in a military academy 10 days ago.
A military academy.
I've always made the joke that whenever we talk about courage and pride and all of this.
Oh, so much courage.
Oh, the massive courage of young people finding their own genitals and deciding that they wish to put them wherever.
Ah, the courage.
It's just like Normandy.
But Joe Biden basically says that part out loud.
All the memes have become reality.
When we make the joke that essentially the Republican foreign policy is a bomb with an American flag on it and the Democratic foreign policy is a bomb with a Pride Progress flag on it, Joe Biden just says the thing.
And here is Joe Biden saying that any anti-LGBTQ law, any law restricting, for example, genderqueer for third graders in school libraries violates our most basic values and that we have an obligation to spread those values around the world.
He has now replaced the sort of moral imperium of the United States, which used to be rooted In freedom of speech and property rights, for example.
Democracy, but while guarding individual rights.
He has now replaced that with the single litmus test is how you treat gay marriage.
Well, good luck with that.
Here's Joe Biden.
You know, when families across the country face excruciating decisions to relocate to a different state to protect their child from dangerous anti-LGBTQ laws, we have to act.
We have to act as a nation.
We need to push back against the hundreds of callous and cynical bills and laws introduced in states targeting transgender children, terrifying families, and criminalizing doctors and nurses.
These bills and laws attack the most basic values and freedoms we have as Americans.
That's not hyperbole.
It's a fact.
Our most basic values?
The most basic values of America are apparently alternative forms of sexual activity being spread to children.
That is it.
That is the most basic form of virtue in the United States.
Alrighty, guys.
The rest of the show continues right now.
You're not going to want to miss it.
We'll be getting into some stuff I like and some things that I hate as well.
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