DEBRIEFED - Chris Ramsay - NEW Footage of a UFO out of Area 51 - IPN Live Montreal - UAP Gerb, GSP & Jesse Michels
Aired: 2026-03-20
Duration: 02:25:24


=== Aliens Admitted on Air Force One (08:17) ===

[00:01:08]  the whole nature of the Godhead, according to this idea, is to play the demon.
[00:01:15]  The first thing he says to himself is, man, get lost.
[00:01:34]  Settle down now.
[00:01:37]  How are we feeling?
[00:01:40]  Nice.
[00:01:41]  Give it up for Wes Barker, by the way.
[00:01:50]  Glad you guys are out here.
[00:01:51]  Thank you for coming all the way from wherever it is you came.
[00:01:54]  We met some of you, and I know a lot of you travel from outside of the city.
[00:01:58]  You're not all from Montreal.
[00:01:59]  So, yeah, thank you very much.
[00:02:01]  It means a lot to both Jesse and I that you came out.
[00:02:03]  Absolutely.
[00:02:04]  Yeah.
[00:02:05]  We met a lot of people from really far away places.
[00:02:08]  Yeah, there's a lady from Isle of Man that flew out.
[00:02:11]  I think her name is Elizabeth.
[00:02:12]  Where are you at, Elizabeth?
[00:02:13]  Yeah, she's crazy.
[00:02:14]  That's in the UK.
[00:02:14]  There you are.
[00:02:16]  We have a hard time seeing it because of these bright lights.
[00:02:18]  But yeah, it's so amazing to be here.
[00:02:21]  So amazing, obviously, that you guys came out to support the show.
[00:02:24]  And also, just have a good time talking about the thing that we all love, that we're all passionate about.
[00:02:29]  I'm very excited tonight.
[00:02:31]  How are you feeling, Jesse?
[00:02:32]  And you know, I would say normally this is a time to come together and talk about something that's normally stigmatized in society, and we can talk about it here.
[00:02:41]  It's a safe space.
[00:02:43]  But the President of the United States last night just tweeted, and maybe there's some weird ulterior mode of distraction thing going on.
[00:02:52]  Who knows?
[00:02:53]  But it doesn't make aliens, extraterrestrial life, Non human intelligence, whatever you want to call it, any less real.
[00:03:01]  And he tweeted to the Secretary of War, Pete Hegseth, that he needs to look into it.
[00:03:07]  And it's why, yeah, whatever on that stuff.
[00:03:10]  But like, you know, it's a wild moment.
[00:03:14]  It's a wild moment.
[00:03:15]  Yeah, it's absolutely, I mean, a crazy timeline we're in right now.
[00:03:19]  Jesse and I last night were filming a podcast, a spoiler alert, but we were just shooting a podcast late at night.
[00:03:26]  We went out for dinner.
[00:03:27]  We're like, oh, let's just like record a conversation.
[00:03:29]  And we started talking about, like, we literally started the podcast talking about the recent sort of Obama comment on aliens are real.
[00:03:38]  That's my Obama, by the way.
[00:03:40]  Thank you.
[00:03:41]  Thank you.
[00:03:41]  See, they like it.
[00:03:42]  Aliens are real.
[00:03:44]  But they want their money.
[00:03:46]  That's either here nor there.
[00:03:47]  But he, you know, and then we were both kind of saying, oh, it's kind of funny.
[00:03:52]  It's almost like he's taunting, you know, Trump, because that's how you want to get to Trump.
[00:03:57]  You tell him, like, you don't know where the aliens are.
[00:04:01]  You know, he's like, I know where they are.
[00:04:04]  We have all the aliens, right?
[00:04:06]  He's going to instantly find the aliens for us.
[00:04:09]  It's a very smart play on Obama's behalf.
[00:04:12]  You made up for it there.
[00:04:14]  Yeah, thank you.
[00:04:16]  And so we were talking about this, and then we were kind of talking about, oh, that's interesting that sort of through his comment on Air Force One, when he was just kind of saying, like, oh, it's classified information, he basically admitted to aliens being real.
[00:04:31]  Why would you classify aliens if they weren't real?
[00:04:34]  Yeah, implicitly he was saying that aliens are classified.
[00:04:38]  Exactly.
[00:04:39]  And then the crazy thing about the Obama thing is he went into a whole thing about underground bases at Area 51 specifically.
[00:04:49]  Which is oddly specific while seemingly forgetting the name of Area 51.
[00:04:55]  And then that's probably what implicitly Trump is saying is classified.
[00:05:00]  So it's like this hilarious kind of like meme warfare going on between presidents, and I'm all here for it.
[00:05:06]  I think it's true.
[00:05:06]  Yeah, and wasn't it under the Obama administration that Area 51 was a thing?
[00:05:10]  Like, wasn't that like when all that information sort of came out?
[00:05:14]  It is, and he definitely knows.
[00:05:17]  He definitely knew what he was talking about.
[00:05:18]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:05:19]  So yeah, we feel like he was.
[00:05:20]  He might have been playing 3D chess.
[00:05:22]  Yeah, with a podcast, clearly, you know, he knew all the questions going in.
[00:05:27]  Yeah.
[00:05:27]  And somehow this podcaster expressed total disinterest when he said, they're real.
[00:05:33]  This guy didn't follow up and say, how do you know that, sir?
[00:05:36]  Or just like, what?
[00:05:39]  Simple question, very simple.
[00:05:41]  Basic journalism.
[00:05:42]  He was locked into full NPC mode.
[00:05:45]  Yeah.
[00:05:46]  He's like, it was real.
[00:05:47]  Thank you.
[00:05:47]  Next question.
[00:05:48]  All right.
[00:05:49]  Insane way to move.
[00:05:51]  Yeah.
[00:05:52]  So, we were talking about this and kind of going back and forth about this sort of debate that a lot of us have had and these thoughts that a lot of us have had with this administration.
[00:06:02]  Is Trump going to be the disclosure president?
[00:06:05]  We hear these talks, even was it Lara Trump, his daughter in law, was sort of spouting that she had heard some conversations within the family that he had expressed interest in wanting to divulge this information.
[00:06:19]  So, it was kind of like culminating.
[00:06:22]  And as we're talking about this, What was the last thing we said before we were interrupted on the podcast?
[00:06:29]  I think it was literally something like, well, you know, we're cynical.
[00:06:33]  Like, we don't really need politicians to validate this topic for us.
[00:06:37]  Like, we know it's real.
[00:06:38]  Like, who cares?
[00:06:39]  Super ironic.
[00:06:39]  But at the same time, it would be nice to operate in a field that isn't completely stigmatized for the rest of our lives.
[00:06:45]  And, like, as we're saying that, you know, we get interrupted with the news.
[00:06:51]  It was crazy.
[00:06:52]  Yeah, so our friend Luigi Venditelli and another friend of ours who.
[00:06:57]  He might see tonight.
[00:06:59]  Keep the Keep the surprise.
[00:07:03]  But he was there and he stopped the podcast.
[00:07:05]  He's like, guys, you guys see this.
[00:07:06]  And he showed us this tweet and we read it out loud on the podcast.
[00:07:10]  We have like a live reaction to us reading it.
[00:07:12]  We're like, what?
[00:07:13]  This is insane.
[00:07:14]  He's saying aliens in an official capacity, saying Secretary of War.
[00:07:18]  And then Pete Hegseth retweets it with like, and he's the Secretary of War, by the way.
[00:07:26]  And he retweets it with like an alien emoji and a saluting emoji.
[00:07:30]  I'm like, what is this?
[00:07:32]  What is what was happening?
[00:07:32]  Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:07:34]  No, no, no.
[00:07:34]  Full matrix, like whatever timeline we're on, is yeah, I think it's epic.
[00:07:40]  So, yeah, we just thought that that was you know, and obviously, this conversation, uh, instantly, no matter what side you're on of the political spectrum, uh, instantly, there is a very clear and present obfuscation of certain files that are being you know discovered at the moment.
[00:07:57]  And so, obviously, yes, this might be a play to misdirect, but it's one of those things that.
[00:08:04]  It's you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube now that you've had this call to action publicly.
[00:08:09]  And the public's reaction was so, I mean, it was overwhelming on social media.
[00:08:15]  You see a lot of people in support and in solidarity with this idea.
[00:08:18]  That's going to cater to this guy's ego.
[00:08:20]  He's going to want to go further.
[00:08:21]  So I do think it's a net positive.
[00:08:22]  And I think you had some thoughts about how this will potentially even sort of help with the Epstein file situation.
[00:08:30]  Yeah, well, I think it's like the Epstein thing where it's like it's disappointing we don't know more.
[00:08:37]  But they telegraphed that they wanted transparency on the thing, and then they kind of flipped when they realized they were probably compromised on a lot of this stuff.
[00:08:44]  But we do know a lot more about it now than we did then because of people like Thomas Massey and Nancy Mace and a lot of these people in Congress.
[00:08:51]  And so the telegraphing of the thing and the official acknowledgement is always going to be the first thing.
[00:08:57]  And then, of course, it's this jagged, messy, annoying bureaucratic process.
[00:09:02]  But once you get that kind of boulder rolling down the hill, I do think that begets its own kind of momentum.
[00:09:08]  That's going to be really hard to stop.
[00:09:10]  Yeah, everybody is having their conspiracies come true except flat earthers.
[00:09:15]  Yeah, no luck for those guys right now.
[00:09:20]  I hear Bigfoot's around the corner, but I mean, it's going to be a while until we get to that other one.

=== The Bureaucracy of Disclosure (09:28) ===

[00:09:25]  But yeah, we're going to talk about this tonight.
[00:09:28]  We got a lot of guests being introduced.
[00:09:31]  I can't wait for you guys to see who we brought out.
[00:09:34]  It's going to be a lot of fun.
[00:09:36]  But before that, something we do in the cities that we're going to be visiting, in the city that we visited, which was Austin, is.
[00:09:43]  We reach out to you via email after you've purchased these tickets to fill out a sort of questionnaire and to see if maybe one of you wants to share your experience that happened to you.
[00:09:56]  And so you get a bit of a taste of like some local flavor and see what brand of alien might be in your area.
[00:10:02]  But also, hearing from the community I think is really important.
[00:10:06]  And, you know, I love playing these little, you know, recordings at the beginning of the episodes.
[00:10:11]  I think it's important to hear the stories that are not only read in books and in documentaries, but in people like.
[00:10:18]  Everyone here.
[00:10:19]  So, tonight we've sifted through a bunch of stories.
[00:10:22]  Thank you, everyone, for submitting.
[00:10:24]  Super brave of you to come out and talk about and be willing to get on a stage and talk about this stuff.
[00:10:29]  So, you know, thank you.
[00:10:30]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:10:31]  Give it up.
[00:10:37]  So, our first guests are local and they got a story to share.
[00:10:44]  So, please welcome Frederick and Kristen.
[00:10:47]  Please give it up.
[00:10:58]  Here you go.
[00:10:59]  You each have a microphone if you like.
[00:11:01]  You don't need to use it if you don't.
[00:11:02]  I don't know if you can corroborate the story, but I'd love.
[00:11:06]  You're loud enough, she says.
[00:11:07]  I don't think so.
[00:11:09]  Bonsoir.
[00:11:10]  Bonsoir.
[00:11:10]  Bienvenue.
[00:11:10]  Merci.
[00:11:12]  Hello, tout le monde.
[00:11:14]  Let's give another round of applause to this guy.
[00:11:17]  Okay.
[00:11:21]  So, first of all, I want to thank you for doing this.
[00:11:24]  Obviously, this is probably like a lot, right?
[00:11:27]  You know, we go from sharing a story with friends and family.
[00:11:30]  And personal story of some encounters.
[00:11:34]  It's not necessarily something you're prepared to share, so just the fact that you're here doing this is really, really cool, and everybody's here to support you.
[00:11:41]  So thank you for that.
[00:11:49]  So, I got three very, very special experiences.
[00:11:56]  We'll start from last year and we'll go back in time.
[00:12:01]  So, last year, me and Christine, we decided to rent a Mustang and go out in the desert in Las Vegas, do a little bit of gambling, and go to Rachel to visit the back gate.
[00:12:14]  And as we drive to the back gate, we're driving, listening to music, we see this freaking disc.
[00:12:22]  That shoots across the sky, and it's like we calculated with Google.
[00:12:28]  We were three miles away from it because you can see on Google Maps where we were.
[00:12:33]  So the thing flies and flashes and disappears, and we have it on video.
[00:12:42]  Wow.
[00:12:43]  And it's in front of the mountain, so you can, and on the video, you can see the hollow around the disc, so it distorts.
[00:12:50]  It's like one of the best.
[00:12:52]  I'm not a great cinematographer, like your production teams, but I did what I could.
[00:12:58]  Because you're not expecting to see anything.
[00:13:02]  And of course, I pan out.
[00:13:04]  That's incredible.
[00:13:07]  So let me ask you what time of day was this roughly?
[00:13:10]  It's like middle of the afternoon.
[00:13:11]  Middle of the afternoon.
[00:13:12]  After a burger at the little alien place there.
[00:13:16]  Yeah.
[00:13:18]  It's just middle of the afternoon.
[00:13:20]  And that's not the only thing.
[00:13:21]  So we got this on camera, and we've been trying to find people that are.
[00:13:27]  Like you guys were like.
[00:13:28]  To be able to fix a bit while we could.
[00:13:31]  To share it or to like enhance it or.
[00:13:35]  So we've been trying to find people.
[00:13:37]  But then we get to the gate, okay?
[00:13:40]  And we get out of the car and we start looking for rocks and stuff.
[00:13:44]  And I raise my eyes and there's like this black triangle.
[00:13:49]  It's about half a mile from us, maybe 50 meters of the ground.
[00:13:55]  It doesn't make a sound.
[00:13:57]  I go to Christina, like, hey, hey, look, look, look.
[00:14:00]  And the thing just went like and disappeared.
[00:14:03]  And it was, we didn't film it, it was too much.
[00:14:07]  Yeah, it's because whether it would have been anything, you would have heard it.
[00:14:12]  Like anybody who's been to an air show, you hear them from miles and miles away.
[00:14:17]  And like, we're not autistic or nothing, but we like rocks.
[00:14:20]  So we're looking at the ground.
[00:14:26]  Collect rocks.
[00:14:27]  So I'm looking for like a specific rock, and for him to have to say, Look up!
[00:14:32]  And we were just so stunned there.
[00:14:36]  Yeah, we were so stunned.
[00:14:37]  That you can see the difference with the mountainscape.
[00:14:40]  Yeah, right out there.
[00:14:41]  Do you see this?
[00:14:42]  Are you.
[00:14:43]  So, okay.
[00:14:44]  Within maybe 12 feet.
[00:14:46]  So many questions.
[00:14:46]  You might be here all night, folks.
[00:14:47]  So, initially, you see this thing zooming across.
[00:14:51]  Are you convinced that the thing that you saw initially wasn't the second object as well?
[00:14:55]  No.
[00:14:55]  We don't know.
[00:14:57]  That's the thing, maybe we'll never know.
[00:15:00]  And for those of you who don't know, Rachel Nevada is essentially the gate.
[00:15:04]  To Area 51.
[00:15:06]  So it's a very popular touristic sort of hub where people drive up to that gate, you know, storm Area 51, all this type of.
[00:15:13]  It's the last place you can get to without, you know, the Americans shooting you in the head.
[00:15:18]  So we saw that thing, that triangle thing, zoom off, and right after that, they have like some kind of sound cannon, and they started blasting us like it's so loud and so crazy.
[00:15:33]  So we just like, Get out of there, get in the musket.
[00:15:36]  Get the fuck out of here.
[00:15:37]  Get out of there.
[00:15:38]  Did you just say sound cannon?
[00:15:41]  Yeah.
[00:15:42]  Like a siren?
[00:15:43]  Like an alarm?
[00:15:45]  Like a really, really loud siren.
[00:15:47]  It was like inside of us.
[00:15:50]  There was a video shared last year about they were using this at a riot to separate the crowd.
[00:15:57]  Does anybody remember this video going around?
[00:15:59]  I see some heads nodding.
[00:16:00]  Yeah.
[00:16:00]  Where they split the crowd with this sound cannon essentially to like.
[00:16:05]  And so you think.
[00:16:07]  They were just trying to get you out of the area.
[00:16:09]  Yeah, for sure.
[00:16:10]  He says it felt like it was inside of him.
[00:16:11]  No, I like it.
[00:16:13]  It startles, so your heartbeat races so fast, you're not expecting to be like.
[00:16:18]  We were like high on adrenaline from seeing these two things, and you know, it was crazy.
[00:16:24]  So that's our.
[00:16:25]  And those were two different things for sure.
[00:16:27]  We saw it in the sky three miles away, and when we were at the gate, we saw it like half a mile away, and it zoomed off.
[00:16:34]  Do you think they were the same?
[00:16:36]  It's hard to say on the video, if you zoom in and you look at it, it's a disc.
[00:16:42]  Okay.
[00:16:42]  And then there's a triangle in the second.
[00:16:44]  Second, can we?
[00:16:45]  It's hard to see, like, okay, it's hard to see.
[00:16:47]  I'm very excited right now.
[00:16:48]  This is all very stimulating to me.
[00:16:50]  I don't know if anyone out there is also riveted by this.
[00:16:55]  Sick, okay.
[00:16:56]  Hey, he's got more, um, also.
[00:16:59]  But, um, what I want to do as well, maybe after we're done, if you want to go this way, and maybe Justin backstage or Yoni, uh, they can maybe have you airdrop it to them, yes, and then maybe we can plug it into one of these TVs that's here.
[00:17:15]  And you know, I didn't.
[00:17:17]  The screens are not that big, but maybe we'll be able to see what you see.
[00:17:20]  And then obviously, I'll take a deeper look later on.
[00:17:25]  But yeah, thank you for sharing that.
[00:17:26]  That's wild.
[00:17:27]  Incredible.
[00:17:28]  Wild.
[00:17:29]  So I've been with Christine for six years, and I had experiences prior to that.
[00:17:35]  And she's like, what kind of UFO nuts am I dating, I guess.
[00:17:39]  But anyway, I was hoping that she'd get to see something, and she got to see something in the desert.
[00:17:46]  In 2012, I was driving just up north in the Laurentian.
[00:17:51]  And this.
[00:17:52]  What town?
[00:17:53]  Prevost.
[00:17:53]  Okay.
[00:17:56]  So I'm driving in Prevost, and there's a car in front of me.
[00:17:59]  It's winter time, about this time.
[00:18:01]  And this car size, really bright blue thing flew like really low to ground past us.
[00:18:10]  And I was like, oh, wow, okay.
[00:18:12]  And the car in front of us stopped.
[00:18:15]  I stopped, and I'm like, did you see this?
[00:18:17]  And he's like, yeah, if I ever saw a flying saucer, that was it.
[00:18:20]  So I'm like, okay, I called 911.
[00:18:28]  I'm like, yes, operator, there's something that went in the sky that's really unusual, and that just stayed like that.
[00:18:39]  And the next morning, there were two big black helicopters hovering in front of my house and around the city looking for something.
[00:18:49]  So that told me that crash retrieval is probably like something for real.

=== A Blue Saucer Over Prevost (10:24) ===

[00:18:54]  Wow.
[00:18:54]  So, this was what year?
[00:18:57]  That's probably 2012, 2013.
[00:19:01]  Whoa, I'm thinking of Luigi right now.
[00:19:05]  He's somewhere in the audience, but he'd be interested in that as well because that was around his time looking into some phenomenon in that specific area, which is really interesting.
[00:19:15]  And also, when I was a kid, about seven years old in 1985, I think, I got really freaked out about, I guess, a dream or something about big eyes, big bright light, and long fingers, okay?
[00:19:35]  And it stayed with me.
[00:19:37]  And you know, that book Communion, the faith there, when I saw that for the first time, I was freaking out.
[00:19:42]  And I got freaked out by it since my young adulthood.
[00:19:48]  And my parents remember after I got freaked out by this, there was in the snow, there was a big circular thing by my house, like a big imprint in the snow.
[00:20:01]  And my mom recalls something, also my dad.
[00:20:06]  But the weird thing about this is that if you don't mind, Jesse, if you can just feel my ear right there.
[00:20:16]  Can you feel it?
[00:20:18]  A little lower.
[00:20:19]  There you go.
[00:20:20]  Right there?
[00:20:21]  Yeah.
[00:20:23]  You squeeze it.
[00:20:24]  You see that there's.
[00:20:24]  Oh, yeah.
[00:20:25]  There's something in his ear.
[00:20:27]  Yeah.
[00:20:28]  Okay.
[00:20:30]  Whoa.
[00:20:32]  So I got kids.
[00:20:35]  I got kids, and I was fooling around with magnets.
[00:20:38]  Wow.
[00:20:40]  Just full and rough magnets and Okay.
[00:20:50]  This is crazy.
[00:20:51]  Yeah, these are just magnets.
[00:20:52]  By the way, this submission was given to us like a few hours ago.
[00:20:56]  Yeah, literally.
[00:20:58]  We had no idea any of this had to be done.
[00:21:01]  So, this, you gotta find a sweet spot where the magnet.
[00:21:11]  Hopefully it works.
[00:21:24]  Sometimes it takes a little bit.
[00:21:26]  Or I got all night.
[00:21:27]  But it takes.
[00:21:27]  My mind just sticks to my ear.
[00:21:31]  What's crazy, it's the same place that with Strieber, at which you know, you were here.
[00:21:37]  You were inspired by communion.
[00:21:39]  Yeah, I felt his, and it's, I think, in the same spot.
[00:21:42]  It's very close.
[00:21:43]  Can I try to connect it?
[00:21:45]  I mean, maybe I'll.
[00:21:49]  Yeah, do you need any help?
[00:21:51]  I could solve this one, hold on.
[00:21:54]  Whoa.
[00:21:57]  So, yeah, it's probably nothing.
[00:22:00]  That's a mic drop.
[00:22:13]  Wild.
[00:22:14]  Fred, can I call you Fred?
[00:22:17]  Fred, that's wild.
[00:22:18]  This is so interesting.
[00:22:22]  There are so many questions that I have here, but it's almost like I don't know, maybe you can talk to this too, but like once an experience or always an experience or like.
[00:22:32]  There is this part of the phenomenon that seems to reoccur.
[00:22:37]  It's never like a sole phenomenon.
[00:22:39]  And even if that is just another sighting or another two sightings, like sightings aren't that common, you know.
[00:22:47]  And for you to drive up to Rachel, Nevada in broad daylight, for them to be doing some weird test flights, it seems improbable to me.
[00:22:56]  So I don't know what it is you saw there.
[00:22:59]  And then this other witness corroborated sighting that you had with a phone call to 911, and then obviously, you know, this childhood stuff.
[00:23:06]  I mean, At what point in your life did you start taking an interest?
[00:23:12]  Was it reading that Whitley book for the first time?
[00:23:14]  Was it seeing the cover?
[00:23:17]  I think I was always aware of the vastness of the universe somehow.
[00:23:23]  And I always knew there's like lots of life out there, but that they come to visit us.
[00:23:33]  I don't know.
[00:23:33]  I guess that childhood experience really stuck with me.
[00:23:38]  The fact that we got like two sightings, we got another one too.
[00:23:44]  I think last summer it was an orb.
[00:23:47]  So a big, bright orb, there's not much to make of it.
[00:23:51]  And Christine, like when you met him, were you skeptical?
[00:23:57]  Like how did you feel?
[00:23:59]  Like what was your conviction level of this stuff before and after meeting him and then before and after having that sighting?
[00:24:04]  I'd be curious to know.
[00:24:06]  I don't know.
[00:24:07]  It's not skepticism for sure.
[00:24:09]  I guess I've always had that.
[00:24:12]  Like, the naiveness of believing, like, blind, not blindly, but like, there's always a critical thinking.
[00:24:19]  Like, I guess that's your consciousness.
[00:24:23]  I respect your beliefs.
[00:24:24]  And the more I'm like, but I'm going to stick with you because if I'm going to have the chance to see an alien or anything, a phenomenon, it'll be next to this guy for sure.
[00:24:35]  Yeah, I might start hanging around.
[00:24:37]  Yeah, sometimes I'll just go next to his ear and I'll pinch it.
[00:24:39]  I'm like, hello, are you listening?
[00:24:43]  Hey, what you guys do in the bedroom, I don't want to know.
[00:24:45]  No, seriously.
[00:24:47]  You guys are so, so awesome for doing this.
[00:24:50]  I want to stay in touch.
[00:24:53]  So I'll get your contact information.
[00:24:54]  I do want to learn more about these cases.
[00:24:56]  Jesse, do you have any other questions here?
[00:24:59]  I do.
[00:24:59]  I want to know if you have any hypotheses as to what this implant might be used for.
[00:25:05]  Do you have, like, Whitley has a sense of, you know, the function that it serves in his life.
[00:25:10]  And I think for him, it's a very important one.
[00:25:13]  Do you feel that?
[00:25:15]  Okay, yes, I do, actually.
[00:25:17]  For the longest time, when I got to accept this, it was about biologists tagging penguins in Antarctica.
[00:25:29]  Well, I'm the penguin, kind of thing.
[00:25:31]  But after learning a little more about it, I feel that sometimes I do get downloads, I get ideas, like we have business together, and sometimes I feel I got it from, I don't know if it's from that or what.
[00:25:53]  I don't know, but I feel it helps me in my life.
[00:25:56]  Is there anything that comes to mind that's particularly striking where it changed your life?
[00:26:01]  I've hardly ever met in my life anybody who can manifest and that it becomes a reality like this guy.
[00:26:11]  Interesting.
[00:26:13]  And subconsciously, completely subconsciously, to the point that I got to tell them, watch your words.
[00:26:19]  So cool.
[00:26:20]  It's wild.
[00:26:20]  This last December, I went to Tichuacan in Mexico, the big pyramid, and I went there trying to.
[00:26:35]  Trying to see if I could connect it to the Wi Fi or something.
[00:26:40]  Does it move around?
[00:26:42]  You know, Whitley has this thing where he tried to remove it and it like moved around in his ear.
[00:26:48]  Is that true with you too?
[00:26:50]  I don't think it ever moved around, but.
[00:26:52]  If I put the magnet on it, it does something.
[00:26:58]  I can feel it.
[00:26:58]  It gets tingly.
[00:26:59]  I can't leave the magnet on for too long.
[00:27:02]  And one time I put the magnet on and the magnet kind of snapped in half and went off.
[00:27:08]  So that's kind of weird.
[00:27:10]  Did you ever consider getting an x ray and checking it out?
[00:27:14]  Well, actually, if you take a flashlight and you flash it in, you see there's like two little rods.
[00:27:20]  Oh, they're cylindrical.
[00:27:24]  Kind of, yeah.
[00:27:25]  There's two little lines.
[00:27:26]  Would you be open to getting an x ray?
[00:27:28]  I guess so, yeah?
[00:27:30]  Yeah, okay, let's make it happen.
[00:27:32]  I'd be curious.
[00:27:34]  If you're open to it, yeah.
[00:27:37]  Cool.
[00:27:40]  Is there a doctor in the house?
[00:27:42]  Scalpel.
[00:27:46]  And here's another question about the implant.
[00:27:50]  And this is something actually we talked about today.
[00:27:52]  We touched on it together.
[00:27:53]  We were kind of discussing this because we thought the phenomenon was interesting.
[00:27:56]  If you had the opportunity to take it out, would you?
[00:27:59]  I used to want to take it out, but now I think it helps me in my life.
[00:28:06]  I want to keep it.
[00:28:07]  That's what everybody says.
[00:28:08]  Yeah.
[00:28:09]  We were talking about this.
[00:28:10]  We thought, how strange this phenomenon of these implants.
[00:28:13]  We've talked to a lot of experiencers and read a lot of the cases.
[00:28:17]  And not only is the tech evasive, but the people are also seen to be evasive in wanting that procedure.
[00:28:25]  And the biggest answer is that A, don't fix what isn't broken.
[00:28:30]  Like, there's a reason it's there, whatever that is.
[00:28:32]  And then, B, they feel that it helps them in some way.
[00:28:35]  This is not a new idea.
[00:28:37]  So, yeah, interesting.
[00:28:40]  Interesting.
[00:28:41]  All right.
[00:28:41]  Well, listen, you guys have been absolutely stellar.
[00:28:45]  I am.
[00:28:47]  Yeah.
[00:28:47]  Thank you.
[00:28:48]  Amazing.
[00:28:48]  Guys, it's not nerve wracking at all.
[00:28:52]  Give it up for Frederick and Christine.
[00:28:54]  Thank you for sharing your story.
[00:28:55]  Thank you so much.
[00:28:59]  Thank you.
[00:28:59]  You can take the water if you like, and you can leave the mics there.
[00:29:01]  Thank you.
[00:29:04]  And if you guys want to just go backstage, yeah, we'll get the video off you and we'll try to play it after.
[00:29:09]  Okay?
[00:29:09]  Thank you.
[00:29:11]  All right.
[00:29:12]  Wow.
[00:29:14]  I hear all the murmuring and the hushing, you guys.
[00:29:16]  It's interesting, right?

=== Secrets in Antarctica (15:30) ===

[00:29:18]  And this is one of those things that I find so interesting as well about researching this stuff is that if you're new to the subject, I guess where you look is very spread out and Everybody has an opinion about things, but the more you scratch the surface, the more people you talk to, and the more you read, the more you find that these things are pretty common.
[00:29:46]  And the stories are connected, overlapping, and these people are just like everyone else.
[00:29:53]  They're just normal people.
[00:29:55]  You can tell by just the vibe that, you know, and I think if you don't look into it enough, you dismiss it out of ridicule, all of this whole subject, but the second you start talking to people, you realize, oh, these are kind.
[00:30:09]  You know, normal, truthful people who are just sharing their experience, and uh, it's amazing 100%.
[00:30:15]  Yeah, they were so awesome, and uh, but simultaneously, you also see how you know, in Fred's case, he is the common thread like the likelihood of those you know, experiences that are high strangeness by most accounts happening to one person over you know, a long period of time.
[00:30:37]  It's clearly him, he's clearly attracting this sort of stuff, and I find that fascinating too.
[00:30:41]  And to be a deeper Cut on what the phenomena is.
[00:30:45]  It's based on the individual.
[00:30:49]  What do you categorize that as?
[00:30:52]  Especially the Rachel Nevada one, I feel like that one's super, super interesting.
[00:30:57]  I mean, the low flying craft with the corroborated witness is really interesting too, as is the sort of alleged, I said, proposed abduction perhaps or something there, the experiencer thing.
[00:31:11]  But the Rachel one, I think, is really interesting because it happens, I mean, on that range.
[00:31:17]  Well, and it's a, to me, it's such a clue as to like what we're talking about with the phenomena because that's basically at Area 51.
[00:31:25]  And so you could assume because it's at Area 51 that it's like some deep black military program or whatever, but it's happening to him.
[00:31:34]  And so the fact that it's happening to him, again, given the history, makes you realize it's probably not, right?
[00:31:39]  It's probably like actually.
[00:31:41]  Not from here.
[00:31:42]  Yeah, not so much a coincidence, but like a synchronicity.
[00:31:46]  Totally.
[00:31:47]  And Area 51 was built specifically at the Nevada test site where there were more nuclear detonations in the United States, more tests than anywhere else.
[00:31:57]  And so if you think about where you get these sort of trippy portals of activity, it's places like that.
[00:32:04]  And so I don't think it's actually a coincidence that Area 51, where we do house all these spooky defense assets, is co located there.
[00:32:13]  I don't think that's a coincidence.
[00:32:16]  Super interesting, man.
[00:32:17]  I'm completely fascinated by things like this, especially experiencers who are very credible and who seem to have a repeating sort of experience.
[00:32:26]  And the experience doesn't necessarily repeat in the same way.
[00:32:29]  It's just kind of like the phenomenon itself is sort of amorphous or morphing and following the experiencer.
[00:32:36]  And we hear about this a lot, which makes it to a lot of people who hear these stories sound less credible.
[00:32:43]  But to researchers, we actually think, oh, there might be more credibility to this.
[00:32:47]  To his first sighting, if he's having other phenomena happen, because that seems to be the case.
[00:32:51]  100%.
[00:32:52]  You have these sort of super experiencers, as you might call them, where they just seem to attract the thing over and over again, and it's fascinating.
[00:33:01]  Yeah, it really is.
[00:33:02]  I mean, that's the other thing I could spend the whole evening interviewing a lot of people in this room because those stories were fascinating.
[00:33:11]  And a lot of them are personal accounts.
[00:33:13]  We read some NDE accounts of near death experiences and what they experienced through that, whether it's connecting with entities.
[00:33:21]  There was another lady in the crowd, I forget her name, but she also was.
[00:33:26]  I think we reached out, but we didn't get a response.
[00:33:29]  But she was talking about when she was a child, she was at camp and she was following this light in the forest and then sees this lady made of like sparkling light, and it was illuminating the things around the camp that she could clearly see with her eyes.
[00:33:44]  So it's like all sorts of incredibly strange but incredibly personal testimonies that I'm very happy that you guys were willing to share with us tonight.
[00:33:51]  So thank you once again.
[00:34:01]  I was going to ask, do we have the tablet of the QA back there?
[00:34:06]  Oh, it's here.
[00:34:06]  I got it here.
[00:34:07]  My bad.
[00:34:09]  We did ask you guys to ask some questions.
[00:34:10]  I know there were some problems with some type of password at first, so we had that fixed, and a lot of you responded to those comments.
[00:34:17]  And I want to answer as many of these as we can, so I'm going to periodically sift through and randomly just prompt one of these questions, and we'll get through as many as we can tonight.
[00:34:29]  All right, yeah, easy one here.
[00:34:34]  I like this.
[00:34:35]  Seat number 24.
[00:34:36]  We got Mr. Murphy here who says, What the hell's going on with Antarctica?
[00:34:42]  And why is it aliens?
[00:34:46]  No better person to ask about that than this guy right here.
[00:34:50]  So please, Jesse.
[00:34:51]  Oh, man.
[00:34:52]  I mean, it's such a hard thing to know exactly what's going on with Antarctica, but something weird is definitely going on with Antarctica.
[00:35:00]  You have Operation High Jump in 1947.
[00:35:03]  Which is a documented account of Admiral Richard Byrd, who takes this large American fleet down off the coast of Patagonia, Argentina, going towards Antarctica.
[00:35:16]  Obviously, Hitler had a long standing interest in Antarctica.
[00:35:19]  His kind of nominal reason for that was there were butter rations for the war, and Antarctica was a source of margarine, which makes absolutely no sense.
[00:35:29]  We have, you know, like the U.S. has defense contractors there, like Raytheon has stuff going on.
[00:35:36]  There's a guy named Eric Hecker.
[00:35:38]  Who says that there's a neutrino detector and emitter that caused the Christchurch earthquake, which is, you know, I don't know what to make of that.
[00:35:47]  It's really crazy.
[00:35:48]  And then you have Linda Moulton Howe, of course.
[00:35:50]  Do you want to tell that story?
[00:35:52]  I'm not too familiar with the story, but I know she wrote a whole book about it, but she also documented the entire thing as she went there on a solo mission to kind of find out what happened.
[00:36:04]  But she told me the story in person at Contact in the Desert.
[00:36:08]  It was a couple of Navy guys, and they go underground.
[00:36:11]  And it's this kind of like Nordic.
[00:36:14]  And it's been hypothesized that there are actually like geothermal vents where the temperature in Antarctica is like completely livable.
[00:36:23]  So it's a very interesting place.
[00:36:26]  And it was made a no fly zone in 1957 as part of the International Geospatial Year in this very weird sort of way where, you know, I don't quite know why it was made a no fly zone.
[00:36:38]  And that was a year of actually record UFO activity.
[00:36:41]  There was a lot of UFO activity from 1952 to 1957.
[00:36:45]  Seems to stop in 57 very, very strangely.
[00:36:48]  And, or, you know, go down, obviously.
[00:36:51]  It continued.
[00:36:52]  But, and then all of a sudden Antarctica is just this no fly zone internationally.
[00:36:56]  Very strange.
[00:36:57]  Yeah, that is strange.
[00:36:58]  I think that's probably one of the most important facts about Antarctica.
[00:37:01]  It's like we, you know, our enemies, sort of Russia and China, and we're kind of like in this sort of like cold AI war or whatever.
[00:37:12]  We don't really know what's going on.
[00:37:13]  But one thing we can all agree on is no one should go to Antarctica.
[00:37:18]  Like, they're all part of this treaty.
[00:37:20]  And we can all agree, set our differences aside, no one is allowed to go there.
[00:37:25]  Like, that for me is a really curious thing.
[00:37:29]  It's weird.
[00:37:30]  Yeah.
[00:37:31]  If it was just America being like, you can't go here, I'd be like, all right, Americans being Americans.
[00:37:34]  But if it's every, you know, all of these nations together agreeing finally, like, on something that we all should not go visit this place, I think that's.
[00:37:44]  Interesting, to say the least.
[00:37:46]  Yeah, it's very interesting.
[00:37:47]  And then to get one step wackier and weirder, you obviously had this longstanding interest of the Nazis in, like, the, you know, you had the Thule Society and the Ananerbe and these kind of esoteric orders.
[00:38:01]  And theosophy.
[00:38:02]  Theosophy and anthroposophy.
[00:38:04]  And yeah, exactly.
[00:38:05]  They were into Madame Blavatsky, who had these sort of esoteric world root races.
[00:38:11]  And so you have the Hyperboreans, the Lemurians, the Atlanteans, and.
[00:38:16]  You know, obviously, they had extremely racist ideologies and I think identified with these hyperborean people that were like living possibly in Antarctica.
[00:38:25]  Yeah, exactly.
[00:38:25]  Or the Atlanteans, even.
[00:38:26]  Or the Atlanteans.
[00:38:27]  You know, who are these like blonde, blue eyed, sort of tall figures that we tend to associate with the Nordics.
[00:38:34]  And so, yeah, there's definitely a connection to be made there.
[00:38:37]  And then you have all these Nazis ending up in Argentina.
[00:38:40]  Like you have all these German beard towns there that came from that kind of emigration.
[00:38:45]  So, I don't know.
[00:38:46]  A lot of loose threads.
[00:38:47]  Yeah.
[00:38:48]  How long did it take?
[00:38:49]  It didn't take too long before we got to Nazis.
[00:38:52]  Not too bad.
[00:38:55]  It always goes too long.
[00:38:56]  Yeah, the Nazis, the reptilians.
[00:38:57]  We'll hit all the bingo cards tonight.
[00:39:00]  You want to introduce our first guest?
[00:39:04]  Okay.
[00:39:05]  We have the unofficial historian of the UFO Legacy Program, a man who knows basically the entire org chart of how these UFOs are collected in crash retrieval programs, reverse engineered.
[00:39:21]  He is an absolute.
[00:39:23]  Just well of information.
[00:39:25]  The information density of this guy is just, we're so lucky to have him.
[00:39:31]  Give it up for UAP Gerb.
[00:39:32]  I was going to say they got to him.
[00:39:41]  They finally took him.
[00:39:43]  They got him.
[00:39:44]  Yeah, I knew it was going to happen.
[00:39:47]  Welcome, Sam, UAP Gerb.
[00:39:49]  How are you feeling?
[00:39:50]  What a beautiful theater.
[00:39:51]  It's great to be here.
[00:39:52]  Thank you guys so much for having me.
[00:39:54]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:39:55]  It's our honor.
[00:39:58]  What a beast.
[00:39:59]  You know, Gerb's been hanging with us in the last few days, and he was actually there last night.
[00:40:05]  He was the one who, during our podcast, interrupted it so graciously, and glad he did with this tweet from Donald Trump talking about how they're going to start looking at aliens, UFOs, ETs, UAP, the whole thing.
[00:40:18]  And I thought it'd be really interesting to get your take from inside, because obviously, as this happens, it sets forth in motion these cogwheels, right?
[00:40:29]  And something I joked about yesterday I'm like, there's probably people throwing tarps over Tic Tacs right now, and like, Shoving bodies in the back of the freezer, like we gotta hide this shit, you know?
[00:40:38]  So, what, knowing how sort of the, you have this mapped out vision of the program, knowing how that works, what do you think that sets in motion?
[00:40:49]  What type of effect does that have on the current program, do you think, in your opinion?
[00:40:55]  Well, first of all, the story of how both Luigi Venditilli and myself interviewed the podcast was pretty funny because we saw the tweet and we were kind of talking about it off in the corner while you and Jesse were recording.
[00:41:06]  So, We were kind of nudging each other, hey, how do we approach this?
[00:41:09]  How do we approach this?
[00:41:10]  And like two idiots, not knowing what to do, we just stood right off camera by you guys for like two minutes before we finally butt in.
[00:41:17]  But I.
[00:41:19]  So polite.
[00:41:20]  So it's interesting to me.
[00:41:23]  It's definitely a big step, including Pete Hegseth and immediately Burleson, Rep. Mace, the White House automatically start retweeting this statement by Trump.
[00:41:34]  As far as affect on the program, as of now, I'd be hesitant to think that.
[00:41:40]  The legacy programs are throwing tarps over tic tacs or sealing up entrances to subterranean facilities or possibly burying some sort of craft that are enormous or some sort.
[00:41:51]  I think, if anything, there'd be a reassessment on historical records held.
[00:41:55]  Like something we chatted about last night is, and this is something Dylan Borland said in his testimony you know, you could look at old Atomic Energy Commission records held within DITRA, the Defense Threat Reduction Agency, that concluded some UFOs were of non human origin.
[00:42:10]  Ideally, I'd want to see quick movement to try to get records like that, sensitive classified records, and so legacy programs cannot destroy such things.
[00:42:19]  So, you think right now what they're doing is like bonfires and shredders, and they're probably getting rid of a lot of paperwork, is what you're saying, because that's where it starts.
[00:42:26]  Well, that's what they should, but you also have to think I would think it relatively reasonable that the legacy program structure, at least certain legacy programs, would have kind of safeguards in place for maybe a rogue precedent or a turncoat precedent.
[00:42:38]  So, it's going to be an interesting couple of weeks, especially if we actually do see follow up on this, which that's going to remain to be seen.
[00:42:47]  So, what's the next logical step for you?
[00:42:51]  You're in charge of the program at this point.
[00:42:53]  They've elected UAP Gerb as the, I don't know, senator of UFOs.
[00:43:00]  I don't even know.
[00:43:01]  The czar, whatever you want to call it.
[00:43:03]  And they're putting you in a position right now, and they're like, go team, go.
[00:43:07]  Unlimited budget.
[00:43:09]  What do you do?
[00:43:10]  What's the first thing that you do?
[00:43:11]  And maybe we'll wait to put out this podcast, not to signal to whoever's hiding shit what it is they're going to do because they're listening.
[00:43:18]  But what would you do?
[00:43:19]  So, if I'm on the side of transparency and good, or I'm on the side of legacy programs?
[00:43:25]  Oh, that's interesting.
[00:43:26]  Because if I'm on the side of transparency and good and I have all this budget, I think the thing you need to do to get legacy programs, UFO crash retrieval, reverse engineering programs under control is not just brute force a disclosure, but instead figure out a way to transfer oversight of the programs back under traditional oversight channels.
[00:43:45]  That means The programs once again serving the American people, serving the Congress, serving the government, and not these rogue breakaway programs that answer to random deputies within the Secretary of Defense and random agencies tucked away into private pockets and so forth.
[00:43:59]  So, you need to find enough people within the programs to be able to turn or trade up against their superiors and turn those and get kind of a rising tide of people within the legacy programs that would adhere to a shift of oversight.
[00:44:10]  And you've got to give them the carrot or the stick.
[00:44:12]  You got that?
[00:44:15]  Take notes, right?
[00:44:18]  This guy, man, his brain is different, I tell you.
[00:44:21]  But so is yours, Jesse.
[00:44:22]  And I want to hear your thought as well do you believe that restructuring sort of oversight into these different official channels is the way to go with this type of information?
[00:44:35]  Or, because there is a whole other camp of people who believe that immediate action and storming these deep underground military bases, you know, and just revealing the stuff is the play here.

=== Weaponizing Physics Breakthroughs (03:02) ===

[00:44:48]  What's your take on that?
[00:44:51]  I kind of like what David Grush said when I interviewed him, where he said, you know, in the nuclear world, you have nuclear trade secrets, which are like, you don't want a kid to be able to blow up the world from his bedroom, right?
[00:45:04]  Like, you don't want certain off the shelf components, you know, turned into weapons.
[00:45:10]  You don't want things that are, you know, made mass accessible that could be extremely destructive, you know, and then obviously national security, you know, is a consideration.
[00:45:20]  Having said that, You have nuclear physics taught at every school in Canada, the US, anywhere you are.
[00:45:29]  And that should be the case with this.
[00:45:31]  The government has no say over whether we should have access or don't have access to ontological truth, to metaphysics and physics and how reality works.
[00:45:43]  And if they're hiding any sort of asymmetric data on that that doesn't fit into the buckets I just mentioned, it should be immediately public.
[00:45:54]  Used in civil side infrastructure to make our cities better, to make our lives better.
[00:45:59]  And so, yeah, that should be the case.
[00:46:03]  Do you think we have that?
[00:46:04]  Do you think they have that, or are they still trying to figure that out?
[00:46:08]  I do think we have that.
[00:46:10]  I mean, you know, I think, you know, you mentioned Dylan Borland, who talks about the power source of the UFO being, you know, the most important.
[00:46:18]  I think maybe Jeremy Corbell kind of inferred that from the interview.
[00:46:21]  I've done a lot of research on this mid century inventor named Thomas Townsend Brown.
[00:46:26]  Take a shot.
[00:46:30]  22 minutes on the dot.
[00:46:33]  And I'm just like, the amount of smoke around this guy literally, and I say his name ad nauseum, and I know it's a running joke, but it's like, you literally think about the logical implications for a second of what we're even saying with the experiment, and he's experimentally unifying the field.
[00:46:51]  It's literally like a stepwise leap in physics, and you can create gravitational perturbation or lift.
[00:46:59]  With electromagnetism, which is not a thing.
[00:47:03]  You need chemical combustion, which, if you think about our current space travel, most of the fuel in any rocket is the payload of the rocket itself.
[00:47:12]  It's literally like the mass of the rocket.
[00:47:14]  And so it's extremely inefficient.
[00:47:16]  Like, you can't go interstellar with it.
[00:47:18]  And there's no real arguments against that.
[00:47:21]  It's like basic first principles physics.
[00:47:23]  So, yeah, I do think that.
[00:47:26]  Yeah, no, great answer.
[00:47:27]  I do see the other side of it, though, where any of these sort of Greater truths that lead to physics breakthroughs could also be argued that they could be weaponized in some way.
[00:47:42]  Is that a fair argument, though?
[00:47:45]  Yeah, it's somewhat fair, but I think the gaslighting needs to stop.

=== Why We Keep It Secret (15:27) ===

[00:47:51]  And who's the arbiter of that, A?
[00:47:54]  And then B, look at where the world is headed now.
[00:47:59]  Everything with fuel and that blows stuff up is headed towards the Middle East right now.
[00:48:06]  Coming from the US.
[00:48:07]  We're in a really scary, weird time, right?
[00:48:10]  And given that, you got to throw the Hail Mary.
[00:48:14]  I think, again, this is not knowing the exact dual use implications of some of these things, but I don't get the sense, because I poke the bear a lot, like Gerb does on the program stuff, I think I do on the kind of science stuff.
[00:48:27]  I don't get the sense anybody's even thinking about this, even making the calculation, like, oh, is China or Russia at parity with the Western world or whatever.
[00:48:37]  Oh, if they are, maybe you let this stuff out.
[00:48:39]  I seriously don't even think there's like a decision making framework around this stuff, which is insane.
[00:48:46]  Yeah.
[00:48:48]  Huh.
[00:48:48]  All right.
[00:48:50]  I think we figured it out.
[00:48:54]  All right.
[00:48:55]  Well, Gerb, let me ask you this.
[00:48:58]  You're inside the program now.
[00:49:00]  You're sort of MJ1.
[00:49:03]  You're this, you know, overseer of all the secrets and keeper of, you know, the most guarded technological advancements mankind's ever seen.
[00:49:13]  What is your reason?
[00:49:18]  For keeping it a secret?
[00:49:19]  What is your number one reason for keeping it a secret?
[00:49:22]  Because it seems to me, and this is an argument I heard recently, which I thought was really interesting, but it's almost like a secret for secret's sake.
[00:49:31]  Like they're so used to keeping this secret that, like, it would be harder logistically to just let it out.
[00:49:39]  They would cause such a hell storm of a paperwork nightmare that, like, they would just keep the secret for secret's sake.
[00:49:46]  Or do you think there is some other, you know, real truths that, you know, Regarding?
[00:49:53]  I probably think it's a combination of both.
[00:49:55]  For one, as far as what I understand about UFO crash retrieval and reverse engineering programs, how they exist in the modern day, the onset and makeup of programs is so siloed and so compartmentalized and so scattered into the wind, there's not one general consensus on program direction and so forth.
[00:50:12]  So, all of these programs have in the past taken advantage of special access program secrecy reforms to kind of hide themselves and morph to SAP security structures and hide under program offices.
[00:50:23]  And hide under program executive officers and so forth.
[00:50:26]  But if we're traveling back to like the MAG 12, which most likely existed under Eisenhower and the 5412 committee and on through the 303 committee for a while and then maybe disappeared in the time of SAP reforms and so forth, I do think kind of like what Jesse said with Grush about nuclear trade secrets, Dave Grush said it the best here that the reason for these programs is feudalistic dominance and asymmetric warfare advantages.
[00:50:48]  If we're thinking about the modern day structure of legacy programs starting about 1947 with Roswell, even though maybe they do go back before that, You know, the World War II just ended, the Cold War has just begun, there's rising tension with the Russians.
[00:51:00]  We're setting up the lash up radar arrays all throughout the southwest United States to test new nuclear weapons and nuclear secrets, and suddenly a craft crashes with small bodies that aren't human.
[00:51:10]  It's obscenely frightening, and immediately, what sort of leverage of technology can you gain from both the beans and the craft?
[00:51:20]  And, you know, possibly there are some other weird secrets out there that certain elements of the programs don't want out.
[00:51:26]  You know, I'm not really well into the subject of a Or, like, the hybridization stuff people talk about.
[00:51:32]  But maybe there really is some creams to put to, like, a Red Scare 2.0 if there is revelations of non human intelligence among us that people might start suspecting their neighbors are weird hybrids.
[00:51:43]  Who knows?
[00:51:44]  Yeah.
[00:51:45]  Or maybe they're on this stage right now.
[00:51:47]  Yeah, that is interesting.
[00:51:51]  I mean, that would shock the world, I think.
[00:51:53]  And, you know, there is the argument, the age old argument of, like, oh, it's just going to tip the scales.
[00:51:59]  Everybody's going to go panicking, running in the streets and burning down buildings.
[00:52:03]  Stock market will crash, like all that stuff.
[00:52:05]  But as we get closer to the truth and as more people are accepting some of this, due to podcasts like the ones we have and other people out there and documentaries that are being made, S4, The Bob Lazar Story, like these, yeah, these documentaries that are coming out are paving the way for sort of reducing that stigma globally.
[00:52:30]  And making it okay to just chat about at the water cooler.
[00:52:34]  And I think that that ontological shocking truth doesn't really apply as much as it did in the 50s.
[00:52:42]  And so I find it hard to argue.
[00:52:45]  I think that's like, again, like an old argument that just doesn't really.
[00:52:49]  Like nowadays, if I told, like yesterday Trump tweeted, we're going to look for aliens.
[00:52:52]  In a week from now, if he doesn't follow up, everyone except, you know, the people in this room are going to move on.
[00:52:58]  They're just going to be like, yeah, it doesn't matter what's next.
[00:53:00]  What's going on?
[00:53:02]  What's, you know, what's Miley Cyrus up to?
[00:53:04]  And like, what's the, you know, I don't know, you know, it's like, what's the next thing?
[00:53:08]  And like, Aside, I got to say from the Epstein files.
[00:53:13]  And I think that that's good that we don't let that one go.
[00:53:15]  I think that, and everyone's done a great job just like pushing that in people's faces and not letting it go.
[00:53:21]  And I think we just need to apply that energy to what's happening also with UFOs.
[00:53:26]  Yeah.
[00:53:32]  Jesse, do you have any questions for our friend Gerb here?
[00:53:35]  Yeah.
[00:53:36]  So there's obviously a big documentary called The Age of Disclosure.
[00:53:41]  And, you know, it was, you know, number one on Amazon Prime and stuff.
[00:53:46]  And they kind of present a specific narrative when it comes to the UFO legacy program.
[00:53:53]  What did you think about that documentary?
[00:53:55]  Do you take it at face value or do you think there's something else going on?
[00:54:00]  So, yeah, if you're talking about the age of disclosure and the legacy program, singular and monolithic, the documentary painted out, I think that's absolutely bollocks and a total purposeful misdirection by select characters in the.
[00:54:13]  In the program, in the documentary.
[00:54:15]  Now, some people have kind of lashed out at me and said, Hey, these guys are former counterintelligence and government agents.
[00:54:20]  How do you know more than them?
[00:54:21]  And I've never been read into any of these programs.
[00:54:23]  I don't, of course, I've never worked in them.
[00:54:26]  I do think I have a keen understanding of at least some legacy program structures.
[00:54:33]  And the documentary presented the crash retrieval portfolio.
[00:54:34]  No discussion of exploitation, reverse engineering, but this crash retrieval portfolio, existing essentially under the head of the CIA's Directorate of Science and Technology.
[00:54:43]  The DST has become infamous in UFO lore as of late.
[00:54:47]  Deputy directors of the DST, including Glenn Gaffney, Doug Wolf, Don Myerix, and so forth, being involved in the programs.
[00:54:55]  Under that, according to the documentary, are three elements on an equal playing field, and that's the Department of Energy, prime contractors like Northrop Grumman, Raytheon, Lockheed Martin, and then the Air Force.
[00:55:06]  I think this is a perfect example of characters in the documentary wanting to delegate who catches the live hand grenade.
[00:55:12]  For example, the question must be asked why isn't the National Security Council painted as the head of this top down legacy program structure right here?
[00:55:20]  Because there you go, you have James Clapper in the documentary.
[00:55:22]  Dave Grush recently went on Megyn Kelly and said James Clapper was not only aware of the issue but also ran the crash retrieval issue with his PDDNI, Stephanie O'Sullivan, under the Obama administration.
[00:55:35]  And of course, he's in the documentary.
[00:55:36]  And of course, Clapper had a close relationship with Elizondo.
[00:55:39]  So it's very strange.
[00:55:41]  I also want to ask let him cook.
[00:55:45]  This guy's cooking right now.
[00:55:46]  I want to ask you just for context for the audience because you said you didn't have any access to the programs themselves.
[00:55:54]  But you really are kind of as close to the metal as it gets on the civilian side.
[00:55:59]  How many people have you personally spoken to who have worked on craft or seen bodies?
[00:56:06]  And I want you to split those up.
[00:56:08]  So, how many who have worked on craft and how many have seen, you know, alien bodies?
[00:56:12]  At this point, individuals who have claimed to be involved in the legacy programs, near a dozen.
[00:56:18]  And I'm referencing a dozen of the people I have very high conviction in.
[00:56:22]  And of course, more have tried to reach out to me or something.
[00:56:25]  My rule of thumb is I don't really talk or hear about people who reach out to me with wild claims.
[00:56:31]  All of these near 12 individuals I'm talking about here, I've spent up to two years trying to track down and vet.
[00:56:36]  So, you know, recently in an Air Force project, I talk about something that's referred to by people in the programs as the hidden wing, which is ostensibly a UFO test and evaluation program within the Air Force that focuses on UFOs of non human origin, alien reproduction vehicles, and derivative technologies, human made airframes featuring one or more components of NHI technology.
[00:56:58]  And this individual there, I have 50, 60, 70 of his military documents, met with him numerous times in person, know the people he worked for, worked under, and so forth.
[00:57:08]  So that's the kind of diligence I try and.
[00:57:10]  So, okay, just to be crystal clear here the people that you've met, you've hunted down.
[00:57:17]  You don't accept people coming in with information that is automatically red flag number one.
[00:57:22]  You are finding these secret programs and these tests, you know, sort of departments that do these trippy tests with like UFOs and whatever.
[00:57:30]  And you're seeking out these people.
[00:57:33]  And over a course of a few years, what do you do?
[00:57:36]  You befriend them?
[00:57:38]  You write them?
[00:57:39]  How do you, like, you just contact them?
[00:57:41]  You reach out?
[00:57:41]  You knock on their door?
[00:57:43]  Like, what's the, yeah, what's that dance look like?
[00:57:46]  Well, I try and be rather direct.
[00:57:48]  A good example of that directness is Brad Sorensen, you know, the 1988 Fluxliner case.
[00:57:54]  And I had to kind of learn some hard lessons there because I emailed him saying, like, hey, you know, I really understand the testimony of the late Mark McCandlish.
[00:58:00]  I'd like to meet you in person.
[00:58:02]  Maybe we can talk a little more.
[00:58:03]  And I immediately got death threats back saying, you're never going to see it coming.
[00:58:06]  You and your family are never going to see it coming.
[00:58:08]  So I had to learn some hard lessons there to play a little bit of a song and dance.
[00:58:12]  So now when I meet people, I'll be a little direct, not super direct.
[00:58:17]  I'll usually approach them from not a cell phone line, that's my direct line.
[00:58:21]  Email them or write them, and after time, start to understand them as a person.
[00:58:27]  And then I'll usually try and go visit them or see them in person, hear their testimony, get their military documents, try and understand their testimony in the larger grand scheme of what I understand to be an accurate or semi accurate layout of legacy program structure, and work from there.
[00:58:42]  And then, your videos, and if you've never seen any of UAP Gerb's videos, go check them out.
[00:58:46]  They're incredibly informative.
[00:58:48]  They're very dense, obviously, as you can tell by how he's speaking about these programs, incredibly knowledgeable.
[00:58:54]  I think what's interesting is that all of these people that he's talking to are individuals that seemingly have no communication with one another.
[00:59:04]  They're from different departments, different states.
[00:59:07]  And he is piecing together what this legacy UFO program, this crash retrieval program that's been existing since the early 1900s, has been doing through the testimony of these people.
[00:59:22]  He's been able to accurately create a chart.
[00:59:26]  Of what's going on, where these UFOs go, what we do when we reverse engineer them, where the components go, what privatized corporations or government contractors are partaking in all this.
[00:59:37]  And it's such a web, a complicated, very dense web of confusing compartments and names, but you do such a good job of like parsing through all that information and piecing it together.
[00:59:51]  So, first of all, I want to commend you on like all of your work because it's really hard.
[00:59:56]  It's hard to understand.
[00:59:57]  Understand, yeah.
[01:00:04]  And then, secondly, what's happening now because of this is that you are meeting with people who won't necessarily come forward.
[01:00:15]  A lot of these people won't ever come forward.
[01:00:17]  You might get a deathbed confession, it's like the best you can hope for.
[01:00:22]  And so, obviously, we have to just rely on secondhand testimony from yourself.
[01:00:27]  But I do want to bring it back to Jesse's question because I think you were a little evasive.
[01:00:34]  Bodies.
[01:00:35]  I want to know about the bodies.
[01:00:37]  What's going on?
[01:00:38]  How many of those people, specifically, how many, if you count your head, had said that they've seen either live or deceased non human entities?
[01:00:49]  I'd say probably three.
[01:00:51]  Yeah, three.
[01:00:53]  And what conviction level are you that what they're saying is true?
[01:01:00]  Pretty darn high, especially down to some of the locations where these bodies might be stored, kind of hidden in plain sight in some scenarios.
[01:01:09]  It's not going to be in the underground facilities under Area 51.
[01:01:12]  It's going to be in nondescript places of business that one might not necessarily expect.
[01:01:18]  And I do find there to be tremendous value in those statements.
[01:01:21]  I do a tribe credibility to them.
[01:01:24]  Really?
[01:01:26]  That's really interesting.
[01:01:27]  It is interesting.
[01:01:28]  You're saying these bodies are not in some like vat 19,000 feet underground.
[01:01:35]  They're hiding in what, privatized places?
[01:01:39]  Like places that are not military?
[01:01:40]  Maybe some like gray warehouses that I'm sure you could track a shell LLC to another shell LLC to another shell LLC and just find a really weird chain of command through.
[01:01:51]  Are we talking grays?
[01:01:53]  What sort of bodies are we talking about?
[01:01:55]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:01:55]  As far as the bodies, the one common thread from these three people are small beans of.
[01:02:02]  You know, palish, grayish skin, wrap around almond eyes.
[01:02:04]  Just kind of the classic thing.
[01:02:05]  Like, I attribute very high probability to, like, the gray alien, as it's known.
[01:02:12]  Did they say anything about the bodies that stood out to you as far as any of the physiology, number of fingers?
[01:02:18]  Is their blood red?
[01:02:20]  One of the most powerful ones for me is Jonathan Weigant, of course, who I got to know very well.
[01:02:27]  One of the interesting things about his testimony is he talks about a body of a non human, and he's not one of the three people, by the way, but this just reminded me of it.
[01:02:36]  But when he observed a crash retrieval in Peru in 1997, he discussed seeing almost like an arm blown out of a hatch, and this arm was grayish in color.
[01:02:46]  It had, I think, three or four fingers, I can't quite remember.
[01:02:49]  What's interesting about Weigand's testimony is for years afterwards, he was essentially visited by these beings he observed in his dreams.
[01:02:56]  And again, the classic gray shape.
[01:03:00]  No talk of tall whites, Nordics, mantids.
[01:03:04]  No, and that's not like trying to discount those.
[01:03:06]  That very smell made me real.
[01:03:08]  Yeah, I really wanted those ones to be.
[01:03:12]  I still think they're a thing, but whatever.
[01:03:14]  It's neither here nor there.
[01:03:16]  They could be a thing, just not in cryogenic chambers.

=== Reptilian Dreams and Gray Beings (16:09) ===

[01:03:19]  Yeah.
[01:03:20]  Or maybe they're just like, they know how to fly the craft better.
[01:03:23]  I don't know.
[01:03:24]  They're just better drivers.
[01:03:28]  What about, okay, this is a fringe one.
[01:03:34]  What's your conviction level on like a reptilian thing?
[01:03:38]  I know it sounds weird, but the more I look into this stuff, the more I hear information about this.
[01:03:43]  And obviously, it's been around for a while.
[01:03:45]  You got David Icke writing, you know, the original sort of like books on it.
[01:03:48]  I've read through some, you know, shady, but.
[01:03:52]  Highly entertaining documents online with the Lacerda files.
[01:03:56]  But my conviction level grows over time as I hear, I speak to people too who tell me interesting things about these things.
[01:04:03]  What's your gestalt on that?
[01:04:05]  I mean, I've heard some interesting stories about reptilian style beings from people I trust very much, but I don't have any direct exposure or specific incidents.
[01:04:16]  People you trust, are these some of the people you sought?
[01:04:21]  I don't think so.
[01:04:22]  Okay.
[01:04:22]  Because I don't want to claim anything wrong there, but I don't think so.
[01:04:25]  Okay, fair enough.
[01:04:27]  All right.
[01:04:28]  It's a maybe on the reptilian.
[01:04:29]  It's a maybe on the reptilian.
[01:04:31]  It's good enough.
[01:04:31]  It's where I'm at with them, too.
[01:04:32]  Fair enough.
[01:04:34]  Yeah, really interesting.
[01:04:37]  What's that?
[01:04:38]  Somebody just said Erica Kirk.
[01:04:40]  Erica Kirk.
[01:04:40]  I can see it.
[01:04:48]  She's something.
[01:04:49]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:04:49]  I can definitely see it.
[01:04:51]  Definitely reptilian tendencies, I would say.
[01:04:55]  I would say personality wise, highly reptilian.
[01:04:56]  Very limbic.
[01:04:56]  Yeah.
[01:04:58]  Yeah, interesting, man.
[01:05:06]  So, out of these people that you're currently speaking to, I suppose you're still speaking to a lot of them?
[01:05:13]  Yes.
[01:05:13]  How many are you in active communication with?
[01:05:17]  Five, I'd say, right now.
[01:05:18]  Five people, and these people have all had firsthand experience with either tech, UFOs, or bodies, or all three.
[01:05:28]  It doesn't seem to be all three, except for a rare instance, kind of like we're talking about with the compartmentalization of the.
[01:05:33]  Programs, I think it's relatively rare that biologics would cross over with recovered craft or craft derivation outside of actual UFO crash retrieval encounters.
[01:05:42]  What's one point of connection that you found with these people that you've spoken to that in your mind sort of corroborates and increases your conviction on their testimony?
[01:05:51]  Because just three people telling you about three different programs, you know, that can seem sort of anecdotal, it can seem almost sort of anomalous.
[01:06:00]  What were you able to connect?
[01:06:02]  Because your mind works differently.
[01:06:05]  Between these cases, that leads you to believe that they might be true?
[01:06:09]  The hidden wing out of Air Force test and evaluation is the highest confidence thing I have ever spoken about, in my opinion.
[01:06:15]  And that's a test and evaluation program, again, that is housed predominantly at Edwards Air Force Base, the Nevada Test and Training Range, the Utah Test and Training Range, that quite often derivative vehicles are actually physically driven up from Air Force Plant 42.
[01:06:30]  I am ultra high confident on that.
[01:06:33]  You had multiple sources sort of confirm that?
[01:06:35]  Yes.
[01:06:35]  Wow, that's interesting.
[01:06:38]  Did you hear the guests that were here just prior?
[01:06:42]  Were you in earshot?
[01:06:44]  I came up when you guys were talking about the ear, and I hear you guys saying, Can I touch your ear?
[01:06:47]  So it was a little bit of a weird thing to walk in on.
[01:06:49]  Yeah, Frederick, yeah.
[01:06:51]  What do you mean?
[01:06:53]  Yeah, so Frederick and Christine, they came up here and talked about a few sort of sightings that they had, but the first one was really interesting.
[01:07:01]  I thought you'd be really interested in this.
[01:07:03]  They were driving up to Rachel, up to the gate at Area 51.
[01:07:08]  And they have a video.
[01:07:09]  We're going to see the video soon.
[01:07:10]  I don't know if you guys backstage have managed to pop it up on one of these screens, but whenever you get the chance to do that, go ahead and we'll just defer to that.
[01:07:19]  But they have footage of what they claim to be, if you zoom in, what they saw with their eyes is an object that looks like a disc at mountain range level, sort of like going by really fast and then just taking off.
[01:07:33]  And it has sort of this like halo around it.
[01:07:35]  They're working on it now.
[01:07:37]  And immediately after, so they get out of the car, they're filming this.
[01:07:43]  All of a sudden, there's this giant black triangle, and he's like tapping, you know, his partner.
[01:07:51]  He's like, You gotta look at this.
[01:07:52]  And they both see it.
[01:07:53]  They both see both things right at the gate.
[01:07:55]  What do you make of that?
[01:07:57]  What is that?
[01:07:58]  And then they were blasted with a sound cannon.
[01:08:01]  It was a sound that they felt almost consumed them and like was inside.
[01:08:05]  Like it was more than just an alarm.
[01:08:07]  It was like rattling their heart, like their organs to get out of there, kind of thing.
[01:08:12]  Really?
[01:08:12]  Yeah, like almost like they were being warned by perhaps a presence inside the base.
[01:08:16]  Like a directed energy weapon or a discombobulator weapon.
[01:08:19]  I swear if I thought, I didn't want to say it, but it felt like this, you know, they call it the discombobulator now.
[01:08:26]  Yeah.
[01:08:27]  Right.
[01:08:27]  That's what I was thinking.
[01:08:28]  Whoa.
[01:08:29]  It felt like it was inside of me.
[01:08:30]  I was like, what?
[01:08:31]  And it scared the crap out of them so much.
[01:08:33]  They got in the car and got the hell out of there.
[01:08:35]  Well, that's kind of interesting because I've recently stumbled across some 20, I think it's 2020 encounters of individuals who have claimed to get pretty close to different sites in the Mojave Desert out in California of some.
[01:08:46]  Sensitive aerospace locations, and essentially, the couple people have claimed when they get close to the security perimeter, they start to feel super nauseous and hot and throw up and need to leave the area right away.
[01:08:57]  So, that's interesting from 2020 and how that lines up with the thought of the discombobulator and so forth.
[01:09:04]  Directed microwave running through your autonomic nervous system and jamming it.
[01:09:08]  It is kind of wild that it happened like broad daylight, though.
[01:09:12]  Yeah.
[01:09:12]  Is that something you've ever heard of through testimony?
[01:09:17]  That they're doing these broad daylight black triangle tests on these ranges?
[01:09:21]  Yeah, because at a place like Area 51, you can clear the flight line for a classified test, right?
[01:09:26]  And, you know, I don't specifically think a lot of craft are held at Area 51.
[01:09:30]  I do have confidence that a lot of triangles are ours.
[01:09:33]  So I would not be surprised if there was a test and evaluation test in the middle of the day.
[01:09:37]  What would be surprising is the craft, of course, seemingly going near those individuals.
[01:09:41]  Did you say it kind of approached towards them?
[01:09:43]  No, I think it took off at, like, incredible speeds, but it wasn't too far, and it was, like, 50 feet off the ground.
[01:09:49]  I've heard stranger things at the Nevada test site about triangle craft.
[01:09:53]  Midday test of almost Vanta black triangles taking up vertically from a cleared flight line that don't disturb any of the dust around them, seemingly instantaneous acceleration right off the flight line.
[01:10:05]  Just fascinating.
[01:10:08]  Oh, here we go.
[01:10:08]  Whoa.
[01:10:09]  So it's playing now.
[01:10:15]  Nice.
[01:10:17]  Oh my God.
[01:10:20]  Did you see the craft on the left hand side?
[01:10:22]  You see it?
[01:10:24]  It's like kind of out of the frame.
[01:10:31]  I have like the best vantage point compared to you guys.
[01:10:33]  Okay, we're watching again.
[01:10:34]  Hold on, I gotta get up here.
[01:10:37]  It's on the left, it's gonna be hard for you guys to see.
[01:10:40]  We've got a hit.
[01:10:40]  Right there, right there.
[01:10:41]  Oh, wow.
[01:10:42]  Clearly it is.
[01:10:43]  It's wild, yeah.
[01:10:44]  Right there.
[01:10:45]  Whoa.
[01:10:45]  I think we need to like pause and zoom in.
[01:10:54]  There you go.
[01:10:54]  Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[01:10:55]  We've got a hit.
[01:10:58]  So wild.
[01:11:00]  Look at that.
[01:11:01]  That's insane.
[01:11:02]  Whoever's back there, I mean, right on.
[01:11:06]  I don't know who's manning this replay, but sick.
[01:11:10]  Yeah, that's way too low for an airplane, right?
[01:11:17]  No, that's like a really good video, it's pretty impressive.
[01:11:27]  Look at that.
[01:11:47]  And that's it.
[01:11:48]  And it restarts.
[01:11:50]  Wow, interesting.
[01:11:52]  Very interesting.
[01:11:52]  I mean, is that the same craft as what they've seen after?
[01:11:56]  That's a good question.
[01:11:57]  Thank you, by the way, whoever's back there.
[01:11:59]  Yeah.
[01:12:02]  Really interesting.
[01:12:03]  I mean, it clearly.
[01:12:05]  Zoom in again on that, Jason.
[01:12:06]  That could be the triangle.
[01:12:08]  I'm just going to say that.
[01:12:09]  Yeah, it could be.
[01:12:10]  That's what I'm saying.
[01:12:11]  It could be the same thing that they observed afterwards.
[01:12:14]  In fact, that almost looks.
[01:12:16]  I mean, what do you think, Herb?
[01:12:17]  You're closest to it.
[01:12:19]  It looks like a pretty large object.
[01:12:21]  It does.
[01:12:23]  But it doesn't necessarily look.
[01:12:25]  It looks like it.
[01:12:26]  There it goes.
[01:12:27]  We would think it would be a disc from our vantage point, but it could be a triangle.
[01:12:31]  Yeah, right.
[01:12:32]  Just a flat.
[01:12:32]  And I mean, that makes a lot of sense if you see a triangle up close afterwards.
[01:12:38]  I mean, it would be highly anomalous to see two different.
[01:12:41]  But I'm not discounting the fact that it might be.
[01:12:44]  It's just really interesting.
[01:12:45]  Look at it right there.
[01:12:45]  That's crazy.
[01:12:47]  That's a good video.
[01:12:48]  No, it's a really good video.
[01:12:49]  Yeah.
[01:12:50]  I mean, it's.
[01:12:52]  This is what we're working with, right?
[01:12:53]  They're not declassifying anything.
[01:12:54]  We got this in FLIR videos.
[01:12:56]  Yes.
[01:12:56]  Okay, now it kind of looks like a disc.
[01:12:58]  I'm not going to lie.
[01:13:00]  Oh, yeah, yeah.
[01:13:03]  I don't know.
[01:13:04]  Whoa, look at that.
[01:13:05]  Yeah, it's clearly.
[01:13:08]  I don't know.
[01:13:09]  Yeah, it looks dark to me.
[01:13:10]  I don't know if it's not glinting any light.
[01:13:14]  That's awesome.
[01:13:15]  Very interesting.
[01:13:16]  Well, thank you for sending that our way.
[01:13:20]  Intriguing, right?
[01:13:22]  I wanted to.
[01:13:24]  Let's go to a few questions here because I do have some more questions I want to get to so that we cover some of these.
[01:13:30]  I got one question here which is really interesting, and I'll throw this one out to both of you.
[01:13:34]  Maybe start with Jesse.
[01:13:36]  What is the most credible evidence you've encountered so far that connects consciousness to nuts and bolts machinery?
[01:13:44]  It's a really good question.
[01:13:45]  It's by Tim.
[01:13:47]  Tim, thank you.
[01:13:48]  That's a really good question.
[01:13:49]  I mean, you have all of these, and Gerb can definitely speak kind of intimately to this.
[01:13:57]  Michael Herrera, who he's gone very deep with and done some amazing videos with, he's on this, was it Operation, is it Katana, where he gets redirected to Indonesia, and then he sees basically these psionic assets being loaded onto what he saw as this ARV craft, this derivative material, reverse engineered, eight gone Vanta Black craft.
[01:14:22]  And so you have that, and then you have the Jake Barber stuff where you have these psionic assets that seem to be sort of summoning this craft in the form of this Skywatcher and stuff.
[01:14:33]  And so you just have this, I don't know, a lot.
[01:14:36]  And then you have obviously Chris Bledsoe's story.
[01:14:38]  And maybe in isolation, each of these stories I might even say is you can't say an N of one story is definitely true.
[01:14:49]  But in aggregate, you'd start to develop this pattern of these.
[01:14:54]  Honestly, psionic assets that don't seem to be treated particularly well in the legacy program.
[01:14:59]  So, just backing up how this stuff seems to work, which is really kind of gnarly and weird, is they'll recruit, sometimes in third world countries, these psionic assets, people who have propensities for higher extrasensory perception, who are hypersensitive, and they'll do stress inoculation.
[01:15:20]  And so they'll put them into heightened stress states, and then they'll have them engage in these sort of protocols to attract craft.
[01:15:28]  And then they'll use, you know, if it can't get any more dystopian than that, they'll use high powered microwave weapons, directed energy to essentially down the craft.
[01:15:39]  And you just have a lot of these stories that seem to come out.
[01:15:43]  Did I miss anything as far as.
[01:15:45]  I mean, there's also the story of these helmets that are being used.
[01:15:49]  So, like, that consciousness can't successfully interact with the technology that's being retrieved because, I don't know, there's.
[01:15:59]  We haven't developed it enough, perhaps, or whatever that is.
[01:16:02]  Or, you know, there's these theories of the microtubules interfacing with whatever this morphic field is, and that we, you know, can fly the craft via just our brain waves, but that the bodies recovered might have an enhanced version of that.
[01:16:18]  And to sort of have that same version, we hear stories of these helmets or sort of headbands being applied to these psionic assets.
[01:16:29]  I think Danny Sheehan, who's done, you know, an incredible.
[01:16:33]  Just sort of researching and kicking down doors and looking into the UFO stuff.
[01:16:39]  He said to me on the podcast that these psionic assets are being fitted with these sort of helmets or these headbands, and their brains are literally being fried because they're like cranking it up and trying to amplify whatever sort of minimal psychic connection that they do have.
[01:16:59]  And you have all these like Lockheed guys who you would expect to be like super nuts and bolts, kind of materialist reductionist, like, you know, just make basic conventional aerospace stuff.
[01:17:10]  You would expect them to be very conventional in their physics understanding.
[01:17:14]  Coming out, especially at the end of their careers, and doing speeches about extrasensory perception, psi abilities.
[01:17:20]  Jim Ryder, who is this guy who has now been outed multiple times as the guy who was head of Lockheed Martin, he was a VP of their space systems.
[01:17:31]  He was trying to transfer materials of this specific craft to Bigelow Aerospace to be studied in 2008.
[01:17:38]  There's this crazy speech that he gives.
[01:17:40]  You can look it up on YouTube.
[01:17:41]  It's called Garment of the Gods.
[01:17:44]  He's going through, he's saying, like, you know, in Russia and China, they just take extrasensory perception for granted and sigh for granted.
[01:17:51]  Here it's this big fight.
[01:17:53]  And, you know, I've met some of these, like, you know, engineers, and they're super into random event generators and affecting random quantum mechanical processes with your mind.
[01:18:02]  And then you hear about the craft itself not having a control panel.
[01:18:06]  You know, down to the Bob Lazar story, it's like there's some sort of mental interface.
[01:18:11]  So, but you're.
[01:18:14]  No, I think you said it perfectly.
[01:18:15]  To kind of add what you were saying there, remember, Dr. Eric A. Walker, who's been implicated for decades as a critical member in 1950s UFO crash retrieval groups, was approached in the 80s, early 80s.
[01:18:26]  I think it was William Steinman or Henry Azza de Hell who somehow managed to get him for a quick interview where he actually admitted to being at the 1965 Kexburg, Pennsylvania UFO crash.
[01:18:35]  And, you know, when he's being playful and so forth, he also says, What do you know about either?
[01:18:39]  I can't, he might have said seven cents weirdly, but what do you know about the sixth sense?
[01:18:43]  Unless you know about it, you would never be admitted into such programs.
[01:18:46]  I'm also a big fan of SAIC, Science Applications International Corporation.
[01:18:51]  The NSA West, a big think tank that I think for decades, far before it spun off Lados, has been pretty integral to UFO programs.
[01:19:00]  They, of course, continued the Stargate program, remote viewing, and kind of PSI stuff programs from SRI in the 90s.
[01:19:06]  And I think back to a great quote Dave Grush had, I talk about this all the time on Joe Rogan.
[01:19:11]  He and Joe are talking about PSI stuff and the weirdness of PSI.
[01:19:15]  And Dave Grush says, well, what if some of these PSI programs and remote viewing programs were started and used as a way to unlock something we have sitting in the hangar?
[01:19:23]  So that was a really interesting bridge between consciousness and nuts and bolts for me, hearing Grush speak about that.

=== Aliens as Craft Extensions (03:00) ===

[01:19:28]  Yeah.
[01:19:29]  And you have a guy like Hal Putoff, who started the American Psychic Spy program, Stargate, just kind of popping up at the forefront of ufology and UFO science.
[01:19:39]  And you have to ask, what is that connection?
[01:19:41]  There's clearly some conic.
[01:19:42]  He wrote a paper on microtubules.
[01:19:44]  He did, yeah.
[01:19:45]  Which is also really interesting because there is this document that came out a few years ago that was allegedly written by a molecular biologist who worked on.
[01:19:57]  Some alien bodies.
[01:19:58]  Do some of you watch that video?
[01:19:59]  I did a read through that by round of applause.
[01:20:02]  Of you.
[01:20:03]  All right.
[01:20:04]  Really interesting stuff because there were so many different parts about the alien that were interesting, whether it's the skin secreting this excretory sort of thing, they're pooping out of their skin, we find out.
[01:20:21]  And that smells like ammonia and sulfur, which is super interesting for many reasons.
[01:20:26]  We hear about these cases.
[01:20:28]  But then it also talks about their organs, how the brain is 20% bigger, they have a larger lung sac.
[01:20:35]  So that it can feed the brain because it's larger, it needs more oxygen, and et cetera.
[01:20:40]  It has like the esophagus, which is separate from like the throat, I think, and like all sorts of different physiology, you know, sort of anomalous things that you would expect an alien to have.
[01:20:51]  But then he said the number one thing that he was being told, his mission, which was paramount to anything, was to figure out like the microtubules.
[01:21:03]  And he suspected in this document when he wrote it, which by the way, a lot of other Molecular biologists have taken a look at and said, no, this guy knows what he's talking about.
[01:21:12]  And this is, you know, prior to modern, sort of more robust GPTs and stuff.
[01:21:17]  So, yeah, he said that he thought this was how they flew the crafts, was that interface.
[01:21:25]  And that's why it was paramount because a lot of these things, I think, based on testimony, based on even Bob Lazar, what he says, these things are sitting in a hangar somewhere and they're just like, they're just there.
[01:21:38]  And they can't really do anything with them.
[01:21:40]  They maybe take them out for a little joyride.
[01:21:42]  But they can't do what they've seen them do when they had bodies on board.
[01:21:47]  And that's why we hear these stories of the pilots or these sort of drone bodies or whatever these aliens are, that they are not only pilots, they are an integral part of the craft.
[01:22:01]  Like they are an extension of the craft.
[01:22:03]  And you hear other stories through these things where these bodies leave the craft, and if they get to a certain distance, they get sick and die.
[01:22:13]  And so you're like, oh, this is like a vital part, and also a failsafe.
[01:22:17]  If you're throwing stuff out there that, like, oh, we got the bodies, and you're like, yeah, you just basically destroyed the keys to this craft.
[01:22:24]  It's like a bit of a fail safe for them, too, which I think is interesting.

=== The FFRDC Bridge Role (08:38) ===

[01:22:28]  I want to play a bit of a game with Gerb here.
[01:22:33]  I brought a little, all right, we'll see how he does.
[01:22:37]  This is the acronym game.
[01:22:40]  Gerb is known as the king of acronyms in this space, and I'm throwing him some low balls, right, because I do want to see him get a win here.
[01:22:48]  Watch, just okay.
[01:22:50]  He's gonna get this one, but watch him perk up when he reads the.
[01:22:56]  Are you ready?
[01:22:57]  Here we go.
[01:22:59]  That is my favorite.
[01:23:01]  Can I phone a friend for this one, though?
[01:23:03]  This is the FFRDC Federally Funded Research and Development Center.
[01:23:08]  Bingo, yes.
[01:23:09]  And what is so fascinating about this?
[01:23:11]  This sounds like the most boring acronym I've ever heard.
[01:23:13]  So, FFRDCs are the missing link in kind of the legacy structure people like to talk about.
[01:23:20]  You know, there have been ultra spooks like Hal Puthoff that like to state that UFO legacy programs are held within the contractors to avoid from FOIA.
[01:23:27]  I think that's nonsense.
[01:23:28]  I think that's absolute nonsense.
[01:23:30]  I think that the role of FFRDCs within the legacy programs is to serve as the bridge between the government customer, you know, the government agency, whether it be elements of the Air Force, the CIA, what have you, and then the Northrop Grumman's and Lockheed Martin.
[01:23:43]  Most FFRDCs, you know, including the MITRE Corporation, DOE, NNSA National Labs, Sandia, Los Alamos, Lawrence Livermore, and so forth.
[01:23:53]  These are GOCO structures, government owned, contractor operated.
[01:23:56]  So, this means this is the perfect gray area, especially like a DOE national lab, to house a craft where the government customer can have both plausible deniability and still strict access to the craft.
[01:24:07]  And thus, the FFRDC can then act as the arbiter of knowledge and access to the contractor to get access onto the program.
[01:24:14]  In fact, I'm very confident that on a contractor level, at like a Lockheed Martin level, it's only specific roles within the contractor that have sort of a wide knowledge of the scope of legacy programs and what they're dealing with.
[01:24:25]  This would be corporate directors for special programs, SAP security directors, men like Terry Phillips, and so forth.
[01:24:32]  But I have a feeling that's the only one I'm going to get.
[01:24:38]  Huh?
[01:24:38]  I have a feeling that's the only acronym I'm going to get.
[01:24:41]  No, no, no.
[01:24:42]  We're giving you low balls today.
[01:24:44]  Like I said, I like to see you get excited about this stuff.
[01:24:47]  We got this one here.
[01:24:49]  Round of applause.
[01:24:52]  Yeah, see?
[01:24:53]  That's what we're dealing with here.
[01:24:55]  DITRA, the Defense Threat Reduction Agency, but there's no I.
[01:24:59]  Oh, there's no I. There's no I. See, we threw you a curveball.
[01:25:04]  But what's interesting about DITRA, just a study in the realm of legacy programs.
[01:25:09]  Wait, what does it stand for again?
[01:25:10]  Defense Threat Reduction Agency.
[01:25:11]  Defense Threat Reduction Agency.
[01:25:12]  So the interesting thing about DITRA, of course, is you have Dylan Borland speaking about old records concluding that most or some UFOs were extraterrestrial, housed within the Atomic Energy Commission under DITRA.
[01:25:26]  But also, DITRA is the latest evolution of something called the AFSWP, the Armed Forces Special Weapons Program.
[01:25:33]  Project which was formed in between 1947 and 1948 at Los Alamos Z Division, which of course is Sandia based, which would become Sandia National Labs, a DOE NNSA national lab.
[01:25:45]  But what's interesting about the AFSWP, it was a founded joint venture under it was the Navy and some element of IC, I think, and this included being founded under James Forrestal, you know, an alleged Majestic 12 member.
[01:25:58]  But what's also another interesting connection, one of the figures most associated with the 1953 Kingman, Arizona crash.
[01:26:04]  Dr. Ed Dahl, who, according to a primary witness of the craft, Arthur Stancil, called him to the actual crash retrieval scene.
[01:26:12]  Dr. Ed Dahl was one of the most prominent figures in the AFSWP, spearheading most of its sensitive projects at the time.
[01:26:18]  So, DITRA is a really interesting evolution of the AFSWP.
[01:26:20]  All right.
[01:26:22]  You heard that?
[01:26:24]  That.
[01:26:25]  DITRA.
[01:26:25]  All right.
[01:26:30]  So you get this one.
[01:26:33]  Oh, it's the National Something Command Center.
[01:26:36]  It's under the Pentagon.
[01:26:37]  Oh, we got them, folks.
[01:26:38]  We got them.
[01:26:40]  Ladies and gentlemen.
[01:26:41]  Jesse.
[01:26:42]  National Military Command Center.
[01:26:44]  Ah, that's right.
[01:26:45]  Yeah.
[01:26:45]  And Jesse, can you fill us in?
[01:26:46]  You know, I don't know much about it.
[01:26:48]  It's like one source I spoke to.
[01:26:52]  This is actually, I think I can say this because I'm anonymizing this person.
[01:26:56]  He said that, remember that like crazy Chinese spy balloon?
[01:27:01]  And then you had like some other possible UFO flyovers, specifically.
[01:27:05]  Yeah, we had one shot down over Canada, actually.
[01:27:07]  Yeah, Alaska.
[01:27:08]  And then I've heard rumors that the thing that was shot down over Alaska was actually kind of an anomalous object and might have even reassembled itself and flew in Canada after that.
[01:27:20]  So there were emails about that on the NMCC, and I guess they got deleted.
[01:27:26]  So, yeah.
[01:27:27]  Interesting.
[01:27:28]  National Military Command Center.
[01:27:29]  Weird.
[01:27:29]  Yeah.
[01:27:30]  All right.
[01:27:32]  This is one of your favorites, too.
[01:27:34]  I even know this one.
[01:27:37]  Round of applause.
[01:27:39]  Anybody?
[01:27:40]  Okay, a little bit more.
[01:27:43]  Oh, it is an all time classic Air Force Office Special Investigation.
[01:27:47]  Air Force Office Special Investigation.
[01:27:48]  But if you want to get specific with legacy program stuff, you look at AFOSI slash PJ, which is the Office of Special Projects.
[01:27:54]  These are the spooks of the spooks that guard Air Force Special Access programs.
[01:27:57]  Yeah, these are potentially aliens.
[01:28:01]  Maybe some, but definitely.
[01:28:02]  That's what I'm saying.
[01:28:03]  No, like the Men in Black type guys.
[01:28:08]  There are definitely vicious humans, including Terry Phillips and his predecessor, now who handles the role, Liam Russ, who are certainly humans, even though they may be a little vile.
[01:28:14]  Sketchy, spooky territory when you're talking about these guys.
[01:28:18]  If you ever get a knock on the door and they show you a badge, and that's when you know, oh, it just got real.
[01:28:24]  And we have UFO spokespeople who are former Air Force Office of Special Investigations.
[01:28:29]  Who's that?
[01:28:30]  Dodie.
[01:28:30]  Rick Dodie.
[01:28:31]  Yeah, Rick Doty, right.
[01:28:33]  Exactly, yeah.
[01:28:34]  Don't play dumb with me, Chris.
[01:28:35]  All right.
[01:28:35]  I'm trying to get him on the pod.
[01:28:38]  All right.
[01:28:40]  Don't speak ill of him, please.
[01:28:42]  How about this one?
[01:28:46]  Oh, gosh.
[01:28:47]  I don't know.
[01:28:48]  I feel like I recognize it, but I don't know.
[01:28:50]  Anybody?
[01:28:50]  No?
[01:28:51]  That's the Buy the It's Probably Nothing merch.
[01:28:54]  Oh, that's why I recognize it.
[01:28:57]  I really thought you'd get that one.
[01:28:59]  I do have one that I think you're going to get.
[01:29:02]  You tell me if you recognize this one.
[01:29:07]  Can I say it?
[01:29:08]  Yeah, what's this one?
[01:29:09]  It's the greatest UFC fighter of all time, George St. Pierre.
[01:29:13]  Rush!
[01:29:35]  Thank you, guys.
[01:29:39]  Let's go.
[01:29:39]  Thank you.
[01:29:41]  Thank you, guys.
[01:29:45]  Bienvenue, Georges Saint Pierre.
[01:29:47]  Merci, c'est gentil.
[01:29:49]  Merci.
[01:29:51]  So good to have you here.
[01:29:52]  Thank you so much for coming out.
[01:29:54]  It's your hometown.
[01:29:55]  Thank you, sir.
[01:29:58]  This is really exciting to have you here talking about UFOs, anomalous activity, UAP.
[01:30:04]  Yeah, thank you for being here and joining us today.
[01:30:08]  I'm very happy to be here.
[01:30:09]  I've watched a lot of your shows online and learned a lot.
[01:30:14]  And to get to meet you for the first time, I met Chris before a few times, but to meet UAP Gerb, Jesse, I mean, for me, it was a great opportunity, too much of a good opportunity to say no.
[01:30:30]  Oh, I appreciate that.
[01:30:32]  Thank you.
[01:30:33]  What an honor.
[01:30:34]  I think what's interesting with you, George, is that you are an incredibly intelligent person.
[01:30:43]  You're someone who's curious.
[01:30:45]  You have this insatiable curiosity for especially ancient civilization stuff.
[01:30:51]  You have a crazy mind for paleontology as well, which a lot of people don't know about you.
[01:30:57]  And so, outside of the fighting, being a champion, it feels like you're just doing side quests now because you've conquered that world and now you're like, what else is left, I guess?

=== Curiosity Meets Ancient Civilizations (04:52) ===

[01:31:07]  But now you're going after the really big questions.
[01:31:10]  What started your curiosity into, especially specifically, the UAP UFO world?
[01:31:18]  When we talk about UAP and UFOs, I was always curious to know the answer about are we alone in the universe?
[01:31:27]  And I think the universe is so big that, I mean, it's a generic answer that I'm giving, but it's true.
[01:31:33]  It's so big that it's almost impossible that we're alone.
[01:31:37]  And I myself, at one point in my life, saw something in the sky.
[01:31:42]  That I couldn't explain.
[01:31:44]  I was not alone.
[01:31:44]  I was with Rashad Evans, who was a UFC champion.
[01:31:48]  I was with Mike Van Arsdale in the car, and Ali Abdelaziz, who managed a lot of great athletes in the sport, Khabib Nurmagomanov and Islam Makachev.
[01:32:00]  And there was another guy, his name was Alessandro, but I lost track with him.
[01:32:06]  I don't know what happened with him, but we were five in the car and we saw something and It caught my curiosity, you know, because I know what I saw was very weird, you know, it couldn't be explained, you know, by, oh, this is a star or this is a satellite.
[01:32:26]  And yeah, it was a phenomenon, a legit unidentified anomalous phenomenon.
[01:32:34]  This was something that was corroborated with everybody that was there.
[01:32:37]  You had other people in the car with you that also, you know, you've heard them on record go, no, that was.
[01:32:43]  Strange.
[01:32:45]  It took off.
[01:32:46]  Like it came super low to you guys and it had like multiple lights.
[01:32:49]  And where was this, by the way?
[01:32:51]  Because that's also interesting.
[01:32:52]  It happens, I think if I remember correctly, it was in Albuquerque, right?
[01:32:57]  In Albuquerque, but it was like about 15, 20 years ago.
[01:33:03]  And when it happened, what is weird about it is that we all clearly saw something.
[01:33:12]  But what I've realized is that.
[01:33:15]  The way it appears to me from my perspective seems to be different from the other guys that I was in the car with from their perspective.
[01:33:24]  Because I heard their interviews, the way they describe the incident, and it's not how I witnessed it.
[01:33:33]  You know, I thought to me it was sort of like a greenish triangular shape, light coming towards us as we were in the car, and it came, it changed direction, and then it changed a second time direction and it skipped.
[01:33:49]  And it lasted for about maybe 15 seconds, but I heard other guys that were with me in the car describing something different.
[01:33:58]  It was like orbs, and it lasted for a minute.
[01:34:02]  So that's why this thing is so weird.
[01:34:06]  It seems to have a different feel for different people.
[01:34:11]  Yeah, that is interesting.
[01:34:12]  The skipping is interesting, too, because Bob talked about this skipping.
[01:34:18]  That was one thing that was never mentioned before, but when he was out at Area 51, With, I think, Gene Huff and John Lear.
[01:34:27]  They were watching, and I think there's a video of this as well on an old camcorder, and they see the light.
[01:34:32]  You know this video I'm referring to, and it goes and it kind of like skips.
[01:34:37]  Yeah, when I talked to Bob Lazar, his theory was that when it flies locally, it stays like this, but when it goes in a long direction, and I'm talking long direction, it's only theoretical that it flips its belly towards.
[01:34:54]  Where it wants to go, and when it changes direction because it goes a long way, it appears from our perspective that it's skipping.
[01:35:02]  Maybe from the occupant, if it's theoretically something that is piloting it, it's something different.
[01:35:11]  But from our perspective, that's his theory.
[01:35:14]  That's so strange.
[01:35:15]  It's so strange.
[01:35:16]  Jesse, do you have any questions for George?
[01:35:20]  I do.
[01:35:21]  So, outside, first of all, this is such an honor to.
[01:35:25]  Even be in the same room with you.
[01:35:26]  I'm a huge fan, and this is so cool and surreal, as it should be for all of you.
[01:35:32]  And you're just the coolest, humblest guy outside of your interest in these topics.
[01:35:38]  But I want to know outside of your personal experience, are there any stories, whether they're UFO crashes, a whistleblower coming out, that you've seen kind of in the open source media world where your conviction has really grown in the whole topic, where you've gotten really excited about a specific story?

=== Meeting Defense Department Insiders (05:12) ===

[01:35:59]  Well, I met different people in my life and.
[01:36:03]  Because I'm a UFO enthusiast, you know, I want to believe there is something, but the logical part of me needs strong evidence.
[01:36:18]  And when I had a chance to meet Bob Lazar and I talked to him, I believe that he believes what he's telling me.
[01:36:30]  I really do.
[01:36:31]  However, I don't know if, from his perspective, What he described, it's really what it is.
[01:36:41]  But I believe that he believes what he's telling me.
[01:36:44]  And I had a chance to meet different people, to talk to them.
[01:36:47]  I've been fooled before, you know, many times.
[01:36:51]  But, you know, unless Lazar is one of the greatest actors in history, I believe that he believes what he's telling me.
[01:37:04]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:37:05]  I think that's been our experience too.
[01:37:08]  Yeah.
[01:37:11]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:37:12]  Now, what's interesting too is that you told me once on the podcast that we had that you had sort of developed this relationship with some department people, some people of the Defense Department, or in and around these programs, or at least adjacently tied to through an event that you went to in the United States, which was like this private event.
[01:37:36]  Sort of higher ups in these military ranks among yourself and some other fighters that were invited to this event.
[01:37:45]  And it's so funny because, like, the way you told the story was like you're sitting around a table and, you know, kind of everybody's like, kind of, you know, feeling out like what's going on.
[01:37:56]  And being, you know, George and just being like, dude, I got one opportunity to ask this question.
[01:38:01]  Yeah, it was in Washington and I was sitting at a dinner with different people around a table.
[01:38:08]  And a lot of these people were part of different programs, like, Program that they can't talk about, like secret programs.
[01:38:15]  And I was thinking that if there's an opportunity in my life that I can ask the big question, it's right now.
[01:38:26]  I might never have this opportunity ever again.
[01:38:29]  And to the risk of making a fool of myself, I asked the person in front of me.
[01:38:39]  Talk about that subject.
[01:38:43]  I see that all the attention of the table sort of switch and turn towards us of our conversation.
[01:38:50]  And I asked her, Is it like I told her that I've in the past so, uh, what I can describe as a UAP?
[01:39:01]  And then after I asked her, I said, Are we alone or is it a possibility that there's people that have this sort of technology here that crashes or they retrieve that sort of technology?
[01:39:19]  Is it me or I'm crazy?
[01:39:21]  And she looked at me and she said, You're not crazy.
[01:39:24]  And then it sparked a different conversation with different guys around the table.
[01:39:28]  And there's one that was on the other side of the table.
[01:39:31]  He looked at me and he says, You know, and he was one of the guys that.
[01:39:35]  He works in a secret program too, and he says, in a different field, but he says to me, he says, George, there's things that I just don't want to know.
[01:39:44]  I'm not ready to learn, and I'm good with that.
[01:39:48]  He said that, that he didn't want to know.
[01:39:49]  He said that to me in front of everybody on the table.
[01:39:52]  So, right away, like if there's people that know about that stuff, these are the guys.
[01:39:56]  You know what I mean?
[01:39:57]  But they're always limited in how far they can go, how much they can discuss.
[01:40:03]  Do you keep in contact with some of these people today?
[01:40:06]  Yes, I do.
[01:40:06]  I do.
[01:40:07]  And every time there's something that comes out, I. My phone rings and I got.
[01:40:11]  I'm always ahead of the curve with the news.
[01:40:14]  However, I'm so busy that I'm not always looking at my phone.
[01:40:18]  But sometimes when I have time, I look at my phone and I look at the last few messages and it's all updates on stuff that's happening.
[01:40:26]  Like the tweet that Donald Trump sent, I think it was yesterday.
[01:40:32]  I received that from them.
[01:40:34]  Yeah, and I got your text too.
[01:40:36]  I was like, immediately, you're one of the first people.
[01:40:40]  Yourself and then our friend Brigham as well.
[01:40:43]  Both of you right away were on the ball.
[01:40:45]  What do you make of that?
[01:40:47]  Is that for you?
[01:40:48]  Because a lot of people feel like this tweet was some type of misdirection, and that's a valid feeling for a lot of people, especially with the Epstein files being possibly related to Donald's obviously involved in the Epstein files, and then him bringing out Alien seems to be some coincidence or cover up.
[01:41:08]  What do you make of that tweet, and how did that make you feel when that came out?

=== Clearances and Note Takers (09:55) ===

[01:41:12]  Yeah, that's the thing.
[01:41:13]  He's under a lot of heat now, from what I understand.
[01:41:18]  And maybe, and there's different ways to see it.
[01:41:22]  Maybe it's like if I'm falling, I'm gonna make everyone fall with me.
[01:41:27]  And I'm like, you know, it's a desperate move.
[01:41:29]  Or maybe it's a distraction, or, you know, like to create a distraction, you know, from what he's under the heat for.
[01:41:39]  So I don't know how to interpret that.
[01:41:43]  It's interesting because, like, you're, I feel like you're answering like a fighter.
[01:41:47]  And you're like, I'm gonna take you down with me.
[01:41:48]  We're gonna go to the ground.
[01:41:50]  You know, that's the thing.
[01:41:52]  In this, in the world that we live in, the scientific method demands evidence, like strong physical evidence.
[01:42:01]  And for me, sometimes the anecdotal evidence are just as strong.
[01:42:11]  Like you have a guy that is dying on it, he's about to die on his bed.
[01:42:15]  He knows he's gonna die.
[01:42:17]  And when he says it, like he's, for me, this has, maybe not for it.
[01:42:23]  A scientist, but for me, someone who talks like on his deathbed about, hey, this, this happened, you can trust me, it happened, and then it dies.
[01:42:31]  For me, it has a lot of strength.
[01:42:35]  Yeah, I think, yeah, not just for you.
[01:42:37]  I think for most people, like that's like the highest form of almost evidence because witness testimony is important.
[01:42:45]  Absolutely.
[01:42:46]  It's, in fact, enough to put people in jail.
[01:42:50]  And somebody on it, of course, that's powerful.
[01:42:52]  Maybe I'd shoot that question to you guys.
[01:42:56]  What's like some deathbed confessions that you guys feel are like really strong?
[01:43:01]  I think a great one is Walter Hotz of the 509th Bombardier Group out at Roswell Army Airfield at the time, who near the end of his life he gave confession and actually swore in affidavit that the story of the flying saucer that crashed at Roswell was retracted under Roger Ramey and a fake cover story of a weather balloon and the story was retracted was put there.
[01:43:22]  I think that's a really powerful testimony.
[01:43:23]  And of course, there have been numerous deathbed confessions and near end of life testimonies Near end of life testimonies given about Roswell.
[01:43:30]  Yeah, speaking of Danny Sheehan, there's a guy, Albert Stein, whose real name was Oscar Wolf.
[01:43:37]  And this guy was present at Underground at Area 51.
[01:43:40]  So, you know, like literally per the Obama statement, during what he said was an alien interrogation.
[01:43:47]  And he was like, you know, behind the glass of an interrogation room and he saw this, you know, taking place.
[01:43:53]  And I think he was like the note taker or something.
[01:43:55]  You might know some of the details.
[01:43:56]  Yeah, no, he was on his deathbed.
[01:43:57]  He invited Danny Sheehan.
[01:43:58]  You're familiar with Danny Sheehan, yeah.
[01:44:01]  You had an interview with him.
[01:44:02]  Yeah, incredible guy.
[01:44:04]  And this guy, you know, if you don't know Danny Sheehan, he was like a lawyer who helped out with the Watergate scandal, Iran Contra, like a really, really important figure in just U.S. history in general.
[01:44:16]  This guy's been around, you know, for a long time doing incredible things.
[01:44:19]  So, you know, just him telling the story, I think for me is very credible.
[01:44:23]  But he was asked to come meet Oscar Wolf in this hospital.
[01:44:27]  And he was, according to Danny, all tubed up, you know, just on his last legs, kind of, this is it.
[01:44:33]  And he goes, I'm going to tell you something I didn't even tell my wife, right?
[01:44:36]  Which again increases conviction because you're like, whoa, why, you know?
[01:44:42]  And he goes, I had a friend who was part of the same church as me.
[01:44:47]  And this was a really like sort of niche sort of sect or church.
[01:44:54]  It was like the universal church of God or something like that.
[01:44:58]  It was like a very specific sort of church.
[01:45:01]  And the guy who went to church with him happened to be.
[01:45:06]  A very cleared higher up at Area 51.
[01:45:10]  You know, somebody who has a lot of clearance.
[01:45:13]  This guy, Oscar Wolf, also had clearance.
[01:45:17]  His job, if I remember correctly, had something to do with the program in some tangential way, but like paperwork.
[01:45:28]  Anyways, he gets a call from him.
[01:45:29]  This is him telling the story.
[01:45:30]  He says, Come down to Area 51.
[01:45:35]  We got to show you something or this.
[01:45:37]  Come down to this test site in Nevada.
[01:45:38]  We've got to show you something.
[01:45:39]  So he flies them out, gets there.
[01:45:41]  They drive to S4, which I thought was really interesting too, because that's like another corroborative piece of evidence there of driving from down to Papoose Lake.
[01:45:52]  And he says, We go into this door, we take an elevator, we go down below ground, and they get out of the elevator and start walking down the hallway.
[01:46:02]  He says, I see two hangars that are open underground with.
[01:46:08]  Levitating discs like flying saucers.
[01:46:11]  And he's telling Danny this.
[01:46:13]  And he goes, and then we walk and we turn into a smaller room.
[01:46:16]  And there was a glass.
[01:46:18]  And on the other side of the glass was, you know, what you would describe as like an alien, like a gray, sort of big headed, almond eyes, sitting at this table.
[01:46:30]  And the officer who was with him says, You know, this being communicates telepathically.
[01:46:40]  Do you want to ask it anything?
[01:46:42]  And he tells Danny, He's like, You have to understand, I was terrified of this thing.
[01:46:46]  He's thinking demon.
[01:46:49]  He's thinking, you know, in this religious view, because they were both sort of religious men.
[01:46:54]  He's like, I don't want to have anything to do with this thing.
[01:46:56]  And so the officer goes in the room and he comes out with cue cards after a while.
[01:47:00]  And these little cue cards.
[01:47:02]  They have, it's a stack of cue cards of all the questions that people have asked it.
[01:47:08]  And he remembers sifting through it and seeing one which was like, Why are you here and where are you from?
[01:47:15]  Which is a great question.
[01:47:17]  We all want to know.
[01:47:17]  And its answer on the cue card, so whoever translated this, whoever received this information, said, We are from this galaxy, although different parts of the galaxy, and we are here to monitor.
[01:47:33]  The behavior here on earth, that is our job type deal.
[01:47:36]  And the next question was, Is there a God?
[01:47:39]  And the answer that he received was, There is, but not what you think, right?
[01:47:44]  Which I thought was interesting.
[01:47:46]  My head goes to like AI or like, What is that?
[01:47:49]  Yeah, and then he tells Danny this, and that was sort of the end of the story.
[01:47:53]  And he goes, Yeah, I've never told my wife this story.
[01:47:57]  So it was a deathbed confession?
[01:47:59]  He died shortly after, yeah.
[01:48:01]  Is there a.
[01:48:02]  Is Werner von Braun allegedly.
[01:48:06]  Added deadbed to the mission?
[01:48:08]  Is it a rumor or is it true?
[01:48:10]  You know, his assistant or secretary, Carolyn Roslin, I think is her name, she told Stephen Greer, so maybe you have to take this somewhat with a grain of salt, but I think a lot of his stories are actually legit.
[01:48:26]  And she said that Wernher von Braun said that there would be a fake alien invasion at some point in the future and to prepare for that.
[01:48:35]  You know, when people were Freaking out about 3i Atlas, I thought that was it.
[01:48:40]  I was like, no way, that's what he was predicting, but it turns out to not be true.
[01:48:45]  But, I mean, to me, also, Harold Malmgren, I think, is a really important deathbed confession where you have a guy at the end of his life who clearly served at the highest levels.
[01:48:59]  Do you remember this?
[01:49:00]  Do you remember?
[01:49:00]  So he was a LBJ, JFK, LBJ, Nixon and Ford advisor, essentially.
[01:49:08]  And served at the highest levels of American diplomacy.
[01:49:13]  And at the end of his life, he says that he held UFO material in his hands that came out of the plume of a blast called Bluegill Triple Prime in 1963 in October.
[01:49:24]  And what's crazy is he is saying this happened.
[01:49:29]  And it was given to him by, by the way, Jeff Bezos' maternal grandfather, who happened to be the Albuquerque Atomic Energy Commission director, which is nuts.
[01:49:37]  And he says, hold the material in your hands.
[01:49:41]  And it's this weird, almost like an initiation ritual or something.
[01:49:46]  And what's crazy is there's so much circumstantial evidence around that actually happening.
[01:49:52]  You have the general there, this guy, General Starbird, flying back that night.
[01:49:56]  Like in an emergency, like you know, haste or whatever, back to the US.
[01:50:02]  You have a FOIA request, Freedom of Information Act request to the National Nuclear Security Administration with the words UAV, UFO, UAP directed to the NNSA.
[01:50:16]  And they say, sorry, but we can't give you the responsive records.
[01:50:20]  We have to, you know, consult with the relevant subject matter expert, implying that.
[01:50:26]  There are documents with those words, with those acronyms, which can only refer to UFOs from that series, from those high altitude nuclear tests, the Starfish Prime series.
[01:50:36]  Tom DeLong also talks about Starfish Prime UFO events.
[01:50:42]  There's a guy, David Noble Whitecrow.
[01:50:45]  There's so much evidence.
[01:50:47]  And then you have this guy at the end of his life saying this.
[01:50:50]  So, yeah, to me, spending time with him, he just pattern matched to this guy who was so on top of everything.
[01:51:00]  Everything when it came to elite global politics, where I'm like, this isn't a guy who's like becoming mushy brained at the end of his life.

=== Pyramids, Vibration, and Hermes (14:36) ===

[01:51:07]  He's not losing his marbles.
[01:51:08]  Sharp.
[01:51:09]  He's very sharp and on top of it.
[01:51:11]  I think it's interesting too, Jesse, that he chose you.
[01:51:14]  And I do think that that means something too.
[01:51:18]  Right?
[01:51:18]  You're at the end of your life and you want to speak to people.
[01:51:21]  You're not saying, oh, UFOs are real.
[01:51:24]  I've seen bodies.
[01:51:25]  It's not this like crazy headline.
[01:51:27]  But he gives you all these in between truths and sets you on a path, you know, to look down what he's saying.
[01:51:34]  But he chose you to do that.
[01:51:36]  He didn't choose, you know, some other buddy, somebody who's in politics or somebody who's got a podcast about this or Joe Rogan, even.
[01:51:45]  He chose you, and your interest just happens to be in UFO, tech, science.
[01:51:53]  I think that speaks volumes as well.
[01:51:57]  It's sort of in between the lines, if you catch what I'm saying.
[01:52:01]  You wanted to have someone worthy to carry the torch.
[01:52:04]  That's right.
[01:52:05]  Yeah, I believe so, too.
[01:52:06]  Thank you.
[01:52:07]  I don't know what to say.
[01:52:08]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:52:13]  Out of all of the sort of, because I want to talk about your interest in sort of paleontology and ancient history and stuff like that.
[01:52:23]  Now, I'm not well versed in this, and I'm self admittedly, I need to be more and I need to look into this more, but I love the fact that you're interested in it.
[01:52:30]  I know Jesse's had some really interesting, you know, sort of run ins with this topic via especially the NASCAR mummy stuff.
[01:52:40]  But is there anything in and around ancient aliens or ancient.
[01:52:45]  Sort of civilizations or tech that specifically stands out to you as more anomalous?
[01:52:51]  Oh, there's a ton of it, and I had a chance to travel in different locations.
[01:52:56]  I went to Baalbek, Lebanon.
[01:53:00]  They have a place called the Temple of Jupiter.
[01:53:04]  It's Roman construction, but the real mystery is the platform on which the Roman construction is on.
[01:53:15]  They have Stone that were carved and carried from a quarry that is about 500 meters.
[01:53:25]  And we're not talking about a flat surface, there are hills and like 800 tons.
[01:53:33]  They call the Triliton, and these rocks are not even on the bottom of the platform, they're like on top of it.
[01:53:43]  It's crazy.
[01:53:44]  And I've been there with Jimmy Corsetti, and you could clearly see.
[01:53:50]  The temple of Jupiter and the platform on which the construction is made with two different techniques.
[01:54:01]  You know, you could clearly see the way they cut the rock, the size of the rock, and even the erosion on the rock is different.
[01:54:11]  You know, you could see I have pictures that I could share with.
[01:54:15]  And Baalbek is, if I'm not mistaken, there's those like they're massive obelisks, right?
[01:54:21]  That are like kind of perfectly cut.
[01:54:22]  And if you look at these things, like I think you sent me a picture of one of these, and like you stand next to it, you look like a little Lego.
[01:54:28]  There's even rocks that were carved that were still in the quarry.
[01:54:34]  Like it looks to me like the construction was stopped abruptly.
[01:54:41]  Like something happened, like maybe, I don't know.
[01:54:44]  Like most of the mainstream archaeologists say they still don't know who put those rocks.
[01:54:52]  They know that the one on top is Roman, but they say that.
[01:54:56]  The main explanation is, oh, they carved the stone, but they were too heavy, they decided to leave it there.
[01:55:03]  But it doesn't really make sense.
[01:55:04]  It doesn't match the erosion, it doesn't match the.
[01:55:06]  No, no, it does not.
[01:55:08]  I mean, a lot of the explanation that you find ignores a lot of the data, you know?
[01:55:17]  And when you look at things through the eyes of an archaeologist, you know, you look at it differently than from the perspective of an engineer.
[01:55:27]  From the perspective of a mason, someone who knows how to work stones.
[01:55:33]  So it's very interesting.
[01:55:35]  And it takes a lot of courage sometimes to say, I don't know.
[01:55:38]  It takes a lot of courage.
[01:55:40]  So, I found also that in archaeology, especially, there's a lot of emotion attached to an idea.
[01:55:51]  And they're willing, in order to prove that their idea is right, to derail, maybe not derail from the truth, but to ignore a certain aspect, a certain element that they cannot explain.
[01:56:07]  Do any prominent archaeologists come to mind when you say that statement?
[01:56:11]  It's true on both sides.
[01:56:14]  I'm talking about it's true on the mainstream archaeology, and I believe it's true also on the guys that are saying, oh, this is alien.
[01:56:22]  Like, no, this is for me a cap out conclusion.
[01:56:25]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:56:26]  It needs further investigation, but you cannot make a conclusion if it does not answer all the, you know, a conclusive answer if it does not check all the marks.
[01:56:38]  Yeah, yeah.
[01:56:41]  And it does not.
[01:56:42]  Sorry to say that, but Baalbek does not check all the marks.
[01:56:47]  The pyramids in Egypt do not check all the marks.
[01:56:50]  Sacsaywaman does not check all the marks.
[01:56:54]  Machu Picchu does not check all the marks.
[01:56:56]  And I can go on and on and on and on.
[01:56:58]  Let's go.
[01:56:59]  Let them cook.
[01:57:00]  I agree with you.
[01:57:02]  And I think it's so, so cool that people that have your reach, your following, your presence, and your influence are publicly talking about this stuff.
[01:57:11]  Because I think it's really important that we shift that mindset of just being resigned to these.
[01:57:17]  Crappy explanations that we've been given instead of being curious and you know, questioning these things a little bit more.
[01:57:23]  You told me one thing that was really interesting once as well.
[01:57:26]  You got to visit the pyramids and you got a pretty cool tour of inside the pyramids.
[01:57:32]  Can you tell me about that?
[01:57:33]  Yeah, absolutely.
[01:57:33]  So, I what convinced me, you know, when we talk about objective And subjective.
[01:57:41]  Something objective is something that I can prove, material, you know, like I can prove you something.
[01:57:48]  Subjective, I cannot really prove it because it's in my mind.
[01:57:53]  I've read a lot about the pyramid, and I'm not an archaeologist, but I had a chance to go on site and to get a special access.
[01:58:03]  I went in the great pyramid of Giza, and I was given a An opportunity they blocked the exit when I was in the room where the square, the box was, and they told me to lay down in the box.
[01:58:19]  I lay down in the box, I did, yeah, yeah.
[01:58:23]  And the guy that I was with, I was with Jimmy Corsetti, and the guy that I was with, he went on the corner of the room.
[01:58:29]  I didn't know what he was doing, but when I was in the box, I experienced a vibration like a very positive vibration, something that made me feel very, very good.
[01:58:40]  I don't know what was going on.
[01:58:43]  I felt it for a few seconds, and after it was done, I sort of stood up.
[01:58:49]  I'm like, wow, what was that?
[01:58:50]  That's incredible.
[01:58:51]  I feel like it sort of feels very good, you know?
[01:58:54]  I don't know what it is, but it feels very good.
[01:58:56]  It's a very good harmonic vibration.
[01:58:59]  And the guy was in the corner of the room, and he told me that he did the mmmm.
[01:59:06]  Like, just, I couldn't hear him, but it convinced me.
[01:59:10]  Like, when I talk about objective, but this one is a subjective evidence for me.
[01:59:16]  That it has something to do with vibration, or there's something that we do not understand about what's going on, the mechanism of the pyramid.
[01:59:26]  So, are you familiar with these new synthetic aperture radar scans coming from this Italian team that seems to imply that there are column tubular structures that are hollow with coils wrapping around them?
[01:59:45]  I think there are eight in total, and they go a kilometer deep.
[01:59:48]  Below the pyramids, they look like an energy grid.
[01:59:50]  Are you familiar with it?
[01:59:51]  Filippo Biondi, yes.
[01:59:53]  Exactly.
[01:59:54]  When it came out, I was very skeptical because I was like, man, it's too crazy to be true.
[02:00:01]  But then he did the test with five different satellites and he runs it more than, I think, like more than hundreds of times.
[02:00:10]  And the same thing always came back.
[02:00:13]  And one thing that you can be sure about this the satellite and tomography, it's very accurate.
[02:00:20]  However, they don't know what it is, but it's very accurate.
[02:00:22]  Yeah.
[02:00:23]  They test it in different locations.
[02:00:25]  They know it's accurate.
[02:00:26]  So there's something.
[02:00:27]  We just don't know what it is.
[02:00:28]  We don't know what it is.
[02:00:29]  It doesn't mean it's alien, but it just needs further investigation.
[02:00:33]  And it's very frustrating because it feels to me that.
[02:00:37]  Yes, yes.
[02:00:39]  I want to maybe push you a little bit and speculate as to because you have all sorts of.
[02:00:44]  You have these columns below the pyramids, maybe.
[02:00:47]  Again, we don't know.
[02:00:48]  But you have the fact that we've never found tombs in the pyramids, so it wasn't a tomb.
[02:00:53]  There's hieroglyphics underneath Dandera that literally translate to Stargate.
[02:00:59]  That, like, literally, like the main Egyptologist that shows people around Stargate.
[02:01:03]  The Air Force consulted on the movie Stargate with Kurt Russell, where the pyramid is literally a time travel portal.
[02:01:10]  It maps to Orion's belt, and then you had a Kundalini awakening inside the pyramid.
[02:01:15]  Do you think?
[02:01:16]  Well, I really did feel a very pleasant, harmonic vibration.
[02:01:24]  Like, I only stayed there for a few seconds because I couldn't.
[02:01:31]  Block the way for the tourists for a long time.
[02:01:34]  So they gave me a permission to do it, and I had to do it fast.
[02:01:39]  And I really felt something that I never felt before.
[02:01:43]  It's really, if you ever have a chance to experience that, you need to do it.
[02:01:48]  It convinced me to my core that maybe there is something that we don't understand.
[02:01:53]  And maybe Khufu was there, even though they never had the evidence, but I'm sure it was not the purpose of the construction.
[02:02:01]  I mean, there's something about it that we don't understand.
[02:02:03]  I agree.
[02:02:04]  And what's interesting there is that, you know, these ancient civilizations, a lot of them, and I think the Egyptians too, correct me if I'm wrong, but had, you know, great reverence for the dream state, right?
[02:02:15]  And gleaming information from that dream and translating it into, you know, whether it's a vision or whether it's this or that.
[02:02:23]  Now, you think about astral projecting and sort of, you know, how that works.
[02:02:29]  As someone who's had multiple out of body experiences through, you know, active meditation and pursuit, The one thing that I will say that I felt, and that so many others who've had these out of body experiences have felt, is a vibration.
[02:02:46]  It is, it's almost like you're getting, like you're a tuning fork.
[02:02:51]  You know, the tuning forks that when you slap them, that's, it's kind of this like hum, this low electrical hum through your body that feels nice.
[02:03:01]  It's almost euphoric.
[02:03:02]  You're like, wow, it's a good feeling.
[02:03:04]  And so I would even question if these entire chambers, were nothing but a way to communicate with something that lived in the astral plane or to even fetch knowledge from, you know, perhaps some ethereal, I don't know, library or something and bring that back in.
[02:03:26]  It's always fun to theorize, but I also believe that there's a lot of knowledge through human history that was lost.
[02:03:36]  Maybe some of that knowledge was built by us, but maybe was given to us.
[02:03:43]  Are you guys familiar with Hermetics?
[02:03:44]  Hermetics.
[02:03:45]  There are seven principles in Hermetics.
[02:03:49]  And it's very old.
[02:03:52]  I mean, the evidence of it dates to the Renaissance, but its roots are far back as pre dynastic Egypt.
[02:04:02]  And some of the, you talk about vibration.
[02:04:05]  Vibration is one of the principles of Hermetics.
[02:04:08]  Nothing is immobile, everything moves.
[02:04:11]  As within, so without.
[02:04:14]  Yeah, the mentalists, everything is in the mind.
[02:04:16]  The universe is a construction in the mind.
[02:04:19]  Correspondence as above, so below.
[02:04:22]  Everything, you know, you take something very small like my veins, it's similar, it's called the fractal.
[02:04:30]  It's similar to a tree, the branch of a tree, then the rivers that split.
[02:04:35]  It's the same thing.
[02:04:37]  There's also the polarity.
[02:04:39]  Everything has a polarity.
[02:04:41]  Everything has a rhythm, a cycle, you know, in life is a cycle.
[02:04:45]  There's different cycles, some are shorter, some are life, from our cellular level to the To the size of the universe, there is also masculine and feminine, masculine and feminine, and there's another one is the causality nothing happened for nothing, there is always a cause, and those principles date from a very, very old times.
[02:05:09]  And now, with science, we realize that a lot of it is true, you know.
[02:05:14]  And how did they know that back then, you know?
[02:05:16]  Yeah, fundamental laws of our reality, of our physical reality, seem to tie back to Hermes, Trismegistus, and this.
[02:05:24]  Hermetic, you know, these hermetic principles.
[02:05:26]  Even today, I constantly, when things happen, you got to think, man, you know, as above, so below, as within, so without.
[02:05:34]  Like, if you're happy and content on the inside, you feel better.
[02:05:39]  You feel better, you become healthier.
[02:05:41]  People around you start feeling better, et cetera, et cetera.

=== Gilgamesh and Hermetic Truths (15:24) ===

[02:05:43]  And that goes out and out.
[02:05:45]  And there's so many instances of this that I'm sure, like, a lot of people in the audience also feel like when you're negative, well, guess what happens?
[02:05:51]  You're going to attract negative.
[02:05:52]  Like, these are all fundamental properties, it seems, of consciousness, of life, of everything else.
[02:05:56]  And so, what you're saying is that you think that.
[02:05:59]  A lot of these ancient practices were, you know, I guess upheld or, you know, counted on these types of principles.
[02:06:07]  I believe it's a reminiscence of a knowledge that was lost from a past.
[02:06:13]  I believe it's very plausible that we were at some point of time, our ancestors had different knowledge.
[02:06:21]  And there's tons of evidence of that.
[02:06:23]  You don't have to go very far.
[02:06:26]  Just look at Greek fire.
[02:06:28]  Greek fire was a weapon used by the Byzantine Empire.
[02:06:34]  It was so fair, like people were afraid of it.
[02:06:41]  They kept the cocktail secret.
[02:06:42]  You can research it, it's called Greek fire.
[02:06:45]  And the way the historian described it, they were using a flamethrower during naval warfare.
[02:06:52]  And the person that was getting caught with fire, even if it jumped in the water, it continued to burn.
[02:06:58]  So, dying while you're burning, dying, burning, it's like the most painful death that you can have.
[02:07:08]  And they tried to recreate it.
[02:07:10]  They think it was some kind of petroleum because it sticks to you and you keep burning.
[02:07:14]  But they don't know exactly how it was made.
[02:07:17]  But it's a real thing.
[02:07:19]  It's just an example of it was a weapon used in ancient times by the Byzantine Empire.
[02:07:23]  And we still don't know how to recreate it.
[02:07:27]  We don't know the formula.
[02:07:28]  And it was like the atomic bomb, it was very secret at the time.
[02:07:31]  Oh, that's really interesting.
[02:07:32]  And a lot of knowledge were lost, like when the Library of Alexandria burned in Iraq.
[02:07:39]  A lot of knowledge were lost there as well.
[02:07:41]  Well, so over time, I believe a lot of knowledge sometimes is lost.
[02:07:47]  Could be catastrophe, wars, and you know, the people who make history are the ones that wins the war.
[02:07:56]  Definitely true.
[02:07:57]  And now we're finding out, like, I think Hillary Clinton was interested in Gilgamesh's tomb.
[02:08:02]  Did you hear about that?
[02:08:04]  She was interested in what?
[02:08:05]  Gilgamesh's tomb.
[02:08:06]  The tomb of Gilgamesh.
[02:08:07]  This lady, I swear.
[02:08:10]  See, the legend of Gilgamesh is he was like a giant from, you know, elsewhere.
[02:08:17]  Yeah, and then we hear, you know, the story of the Afghan giant.
[02:08:20]  Like, everybody's familiar with that lore as well.
[02:08:22]  I think there's like a new interview about the Afghan giants recently out.
[02:08:26]  So, right.
[02:08:27]  Like, there's like some special forces guys saying, like, they fought the giants in Gilgamesh.
[02:08:31]  Red hair with six fingers.
[02:08:32]  They lived in a cave.
[02:08:34]  Yeah.
[02:08:35]  Ripping people in half.
[02:08:37]  Sick story.
[02:08:38]  I'm so inspired by your knowledge.
[02:08:40]  It's true.
[02:08:40]  It's amazing.
[02:08:42]  Yeah.
[02:08:42]  People don't know, man.
[02:08:45]  Yeah.
[02:08:45]  Listen, guys, I think it's very important what you guys are doing because you're giving a lot of credibility and it's very important things that deserve more investigation.
[02:08:58]  And you're very, you know, the way you articulate very well and the way you present yourself and you present the evidence.
[02:09:08]  People sometimes in the UFO lore complain, oh, there's no evidence.
[02:09:13]  There's tons of evidence, but evidence is not proof.
[02:09:17]  Proof, you know, there's tons of evidence, there's tons of video, uh, document, but there, you know, it takes more for to prove it, you know, yeah, absolutely.
[02:09:28]  And it's also thanks to guys like this guy here who's doing a lot of the legwork.
[02:09:34]  Um, he's a human encyclopedia.
[02:09:37]  Oh my god, yeah, you had your first UAP Gerb experience in live downstairs before the show, they were hanging out, and then, like, you know, just one question, you could just see Gerb just light up, and George is like.
[02:09:51]  Whoa, like you guys spent time together.
[02:09:54]  You know, what was your first impression of Gerb?
[02:09:57]  Because you met him today, you guys, you know, you got to hang out a little bit.
[02:10:01]  Like he's like a computer, basically.
[02:10:04]  In 1945.
[02:10:06]  How the hell do you remember all that stuff?
[02:10:09]  Damn.
[02:10:09]  I'm very impressed by your performance.
[02:10:12]  It's amazing.
[02:10:13]  Wow, that's an honor, George.
[02:10:15]  You guys, what you guys do, it's amazing.
[02:10:23]  I'm a big fan of your work.
[02:10:25]  I'm just a UAP enthusiast.
[02:10:28]  I know a little bit more than the average Joe, but I don't know as much as you guys.
[02:10:36]  I just love to learn.
[02:10:38]  I learn a lot from your channel, what you guys do and put on social media.
[02:10:44]  And like I said, you add a lot of credibility because the way you dissect every case and bring the data available to everyone, it's fantastic.
[02:10:55]  It shows that it deserves more serious investigation.
[02:10:59]  One of the really cool things I found you do is, you know, based upon the work like maybe Jesse, Chris, or I do, you internalize the content, you think it through, and then you ask really poignant conceptual questions and kind of further discussions on things.
[02:11:13]  I think it's super important.
[02:11:16]  I reach a point in my life that, You know, I was a professional fighter, but I reached a point that I worked really hard for my freedom.
[02:11:30]  And when I was never really free, but I'm at this point that I have enough freedom that I can use the spare time that I have to try to investigate on things that I want to know.
[02:11:44]  And for me, it's very interesting.
[02:11:46]  It's like going back to school, but I'm able to choose.
[02:11:50]  What I want to learn from.
[02:11:52]  You know what I mean?
[02:11:53]  And that's why I love spending time with you guys.
[02:11:56]  Well, you earned it.
[02:11:56]  Two belts, multiple title defenses.
[02:11:59]  Here we go.
[02:12:00]  One thing you guys didn't know about Gerb, maybe.
[02:12:04]  All right, this guy also trains MMA six days a week and tie, I believe, tie or whatever, kickboxing.
[02:12:11]  A lot of jujitsu.
[02:12:11]  Jiujitsu mostly.
[02:12:15]  If you get him going on MMA, he has the same sort of tism for the MMA.
[02:12:23]  For MMA stuff, I swear that for the recovery stuff, like he'll tell you, oh yeah, UFC 91, it was this guy and this guy.
[02:12:31]  And then he'll be like, oh, and that city had a crash.
[02:12:33]  And then this guy, he'll just go on and on and on.
[02:12:35]  It's pretty impressive, man.
[02:12:36]  Yeah, you have a very impressive memory of details.
[02:12:40]  It's unbelievable.
[02:12:42]  It's wow.
[02:12:43]  Wait, I want to test.
[02:12:45]  Can we test his UFC knowledge right now?
[02:12:49]  Put you on the spot.
[02:12:50]  Okay, do you have a UFC question for him, maybe?
[02:12:54]  I'll start with an easy one, okay?
[02:12:56]  And I will get a harder answer.
[02:12:59]  Oh, I like this.
[02:13:01]  First one Who was the first ever UFC champion?
[02:13:06]  Hoist Gracie.
[02:13:06]  Okay, that's a good one.
[02:13:09]  Quick.
[02:13:09]  I'm telling you.
[02:13:11]  Confident.
[02:13:12]  Okay.
[02:13:13]  Who fought Hois Gracie twice and in the second fight managed to do a draw with Hois?
[02:13:24]  Was it Ken or Frank Shamrock?
[02:13:26]  Ken Shamrock.
[02:13:26]  Okay, Ken Shamrock.
[02:13:27]  Oh my God, he's good.
[02:13:28]  And I'm going old school.
[02:13:30]  This is a long, like, I'm from a different generation.
[02:13:33]  I'm older than you, and you know the answers.
[02:13:35]  This is amazing.
[02:13:36]  All right, all right.
[02:13:38]  Who would be your dream matchup in a fight?
[02:13:43]  My dream matchup would actually be you versus Islam Makachev.
[02:13:48]  Oh, that's great.
[02:13:49]  Which I think you would win, you know, without.
[02:13:51]  I think I'm too old to win that one.
[02:13:54]  In my prime, I'm not what I used to be, but in my prime, I think it could have been a very interesting fight, yeah.
[02:14:01]  Because it's like people talk about the super fight that never happened was you versus Habib Nurmagamadov.
[02:14:06]  But I think Islam's better than Habib.
[02:14:08]  So I think that you versus Islam would be a better fight.
[02:14:11]  Yeah, I think it would be interesting, you know.
[02:14:14]  In my prime, though, now I'm 44.
[02:14:16]  I went to training today.
[02:14:18]  I'm not what I used to be, but in my prime, I could have done some damage, you know?
[02:14:22]  I don't know if you've seen it, but there's unfounded rumors, just nonsensical rumors swirling around that you're returning for the White House card here in May for the UFC.
[02:14:34]  Yeah, absolutely not.
[02:14:36]  No.
[02:14:36]  Come back.
[02:14:36]  No, no, no.
[02:14:37]  What if they read you in on some of the secrets?
[02:14:41]  Bro, your contract goes GSP gets top secret clearance, tour at S4.
[02:14:47]  Are you taking that fight?
[02:14:50]  Listen, it would need to be a very deep secret.
[02:14:56]  Hey, let's not know.
[02:14:59]  There's one thing that excites me more than, you know, like a lot of, you know, it's a prize fight, we get paid, but one thing that excites me way more than money is knowledge.
[02:15:09]  Knowledge could be something that brings me back.
[02:15:13]  Yo.
[02:15:14]  All right, let's make it happen.
[02:15:16]  Who would be, oh, sorry.
[02:15:19]  I was just going to say we should note the fact that you, Khabib, and Islam were in the same car together viewing a UFO, which is insane.
[02:15:28]  Like, you literally have three of, you know, easily the greatest fighters of all time seeing a UFO together.
[02:15:36]  The problem when you're a professional fighter and you say that you've seen something like a UFO, people right away they write you off, oh, it's brain damage.
[02:15:45]  It doesn't help with my credibility.
[02:15:48]  Yeah.
[02:15:48]  It really doesn't help.
[02:15:50]  Yeah, I, you know, they say the same thing about me, but I haven't been in any fights, so I don't know what that says.
[02:15:57]  One question that I think a lot of people would like to ask you is each of you, if you were given an opportunity to meet someone, to interview that person, and he would be injected a cocktail of truth, he cannot lie, who would it be?
[02:16:13]  Alive or dead, or both?
[02:16:17]  Both, both.
[02:16:18]  Okay.
[02:16:19]  Dead or alive in history.
[02:16:21]  You want to take this one first?
[02:16:22]  Dead, I'd say President Dwight Eisenhower, because I think he established so much of the legacy program structure.
[02:16:29]  That would be interesting.
[02:16:29]  I agree.
[02:16:30]  Yeah.
[02:16:31]  Ike, yeah.
[02:16:32]  I'm going to think.
[02:16:34]  You go.
[02:16:34]  Well, so we were talking about this earlier, you and I, and I loved your answer, which was Putin.
[02:16:41]  That's the most.
[02:16:42]  And the reason I thought about it since you said that, which is.
[02:16:46]  You know, this is a guy who has, you know, ruled his country for, you know, a very long time.
[02:16:52]  You know, there was like, I think some Medvedev was like a fake president at one point, but he was like always in charge.
[02:16:58]  And so it's, you don't, you know, the US president, they call him like a temp, you know, he's like, he's not given the goods, you know, in many cases.
[02:17:05]  Maybe if they come from an intelligence background, they know a little bit more.
[02:17:08]  But they also have like so much else on their plate.
[02:17:11]  And at some point, you have to think that somebody with that much dictatorial control, And that much kind of intimate understanding of what his generals know really understands what's going on.
[02:17:25]  I would have loved to hear the perspective of George Bush Sr.
[02:17:31]  It's great.
[02:17:31]  I think it would have been interesting as well.
[02:17:35]  Yeah, I mean, I'm flip flopping between a lot of politicians for sure.
[02:17:39]  There's like, but I think.
[02:17:41]  No, I think.
[02:17:44]  He says, Justin Trudeau, no amount of truth serum, dude.
[02:17:51]  No, Dan Burrish would be mine.
[02:17:56]  Ah, that's uninteresting.
[02:17:56]  And, like, he's still alive, you know, and apparently somewhere in Canada, you know, he's, yeah, yeah.
[02:18:11]  I would love to, with truth serum, you know, because that's the one thing he said a lot of.
[02:18:18]  Really incredible things that obviously corroborate a lot of other things that have happened, but he's a legitimate molecular biologist.
[02:18:24]  He was like, he's a very bright person, and he has some of the trippiest stories revolving around not only interaction with a being that he sort of befriended over time, but also time travel stuff and converging timelines.
[02:18:43]  And in his own words, like Hillary becoming president would have been like the end of our timeline, which I think a lot of people agreed with.
[02:18:52]  Even people didn't know about Dan Burrish.
[02:18:55]  So, yeah, Dan Burrish would be mine.
[02:18:58]  Do you guys believe that all these nations worked together behind closed doors?
[02:19:03]  Because if you watch certain documentaries, they make it look like, okay, we're in a secret war to gather information about this against China or Russia.
[02:19:14]  Are they all together behind closed doors?
[02:19:18]  Like it's a group that sort of controlled the world, economics, or technology?
[02:19:24]  Technology, or what do you got?
[02:19:25]  What do you got?
[02:19:26]  What's your thought on that?
[02:19:28]  It seems like there's at least a Five Eyes Nation type coordination on UFO crash retrieval organizations between you know us and you guys, the US and Canada, kind of the Anzac region, and so forth.
[02:19:39]  And it seems like in years prior, there have been kind of mutual agreements with the then Soviet Union.
[02:19:45]  You know, in the 1970s, under the SALT treaties, there was an agreement with the Soviet Union to alert each other if there were ever UFOs in kind of each other's skies so they wouldn't be confused with nukes.
[02:19:55]  In fact, there was a direct line.
[02:19:58]  To the Kremlin or to the White House that would use flash codes like Molink222, Molink333 to just say, hey, Soviet Union, there's UFOs in our airspace or UFOs over your waters.
[02:20:08]  It's not us, it's them.
[02:20:10]  And that's in writing.
[02:20:11]  That's in writing, UFOs.
[02:20:14]  Yeah, we have to coordinate on unknowns, exactly, in sensitive airspace, which is wild.
[02:20:19]  And then there are rumors from Harold Malmgren on his deathbed and Danny Sheehan that JFK actually had a family friend, this guy, Norman Cousins.
[02:20:29]  Who we know for sure was back channeling with Khrushchev, and it was probably around some nuclear detente and disarmament.
[02:20:36]  But they both speculate, and both of them have intimate knowledge and connections on the Hill and with very elite people, that JFK actually wanted to do sort of a joint space effort around this issue, around UFOs with Khrushchev, and that the people around him didn't want that.
[02:20:55]  And then you also, of course, Bob Lazar talks about there being Russians on the base and then on S4 Area 51.
[02:21:03]  And they make a certain discovery and then they have to kick the Russians out.

=== JFK's Backchannel Diplomacy (04:17) ===

[02:21:07]  So I think my guess is it's sort of not a clean answer.
[02:21:11]  It's been this sort of like cloak and dagger diplomacy game of obviously when you figure out something, you have some asymmetric advantage, you have to conceal it, but then it's also used to coordinate at times.
[02:21:23]  And it also means that if they aren't working together, that they're all independently concealing a secret, which is a hard pill for a lot of people to swallow, but there's a whole deep dive into why that might be the case also.
[02:21:34]  Like if you have China, we're not communicating with.
[02:21:37]  You know, it's a vast country.
[02:21:39]  There's a lot of activity down there.
[02:21:41]  They've obviously run into this thing too.
[02:21:44]  Why is it that they haven't disclosed it, right?
[02:21:46]  Have you ever considered the possibility?
[02:21:48]  I'm not saying that's what I believe, but I'm just trying to put out there what could it be that maybe it's the alien that is pulling the string.
[02:21:59]  I think you have to conclude that ultimately.
[02:22:04]  Actually, it's funny.
[02:22:06]  You mentioned George H.W. Bush, Bush 41 being an amazing interview.
[02:22:09]  I agree.
[02:22:10]  He was the director of the CIA for a very long time.
[02:22:13]  I just interviewed Eric Davis, who's this kind of interesting.
[02:22:17]  Spoiler.
[02:22:19]  Yeah, spoiler.
[02:22:20]  It was actually a debate between Eric Davis and Eric Weinstein on like UFO physics, which was really crazy.
[02:22:27]  And Eric Davis says that he had direct conversations with George H.W. Bush about the Holloman landing in 1964.
[02:22:35]  And so this was this landing, you know, at Holloman Air Force Base, and this being comes out and he's like, you know, I think seven feet tall and he looks like a Nordic being, but he has like an Egyptian headdress on.
[02:22:45]  Yeah, like tall whites type deal.
[02:22:47]  And there's like a video out there.
[02:22:48]  And so literally, this is a conversation that Eric Davis says he has.
[02:22:53]  You know, with Bush 41.
[02:22:54]  But what was the last.
[02:22:56]  I was considering the possibility, maybe we talk about who's.
[02:23:02]  They're pulling the strings.
[02:23:03]  Who's pulling the string?
[02:23:04]  Is it a different nation or is it the alien or whatever?
[02:23:09]  So Eric Davis literally says in front of Congress, he says, the NHI themselves are controlling disclosure, which if you're saying that you have craft that defy physics, you're saying these things can, you know, enter our bedrooms at night and implant us with, you know, chips.
[02:23:26]  You're saying that they're running circles around us.
[02:23:29]  Obviously, the conclusion is you can have an org chart that is fully human when it comes to all the stuff that Gerb's mapped, this parallel chain of command.
[02:23:38]  You're building these sort of alien reproduction vehicles and exotic craft.
[02:23:44]  But at the end of the day, as far as disclosure goes, of course they have to have coordination abilities that are controlling how the stuff comes out, for sure.
[02:23:53]  I would think so too.
[02:23:54]  And I think that there's a lot to say about these cases, the whole.
[02:24:00]  Sort of keel approach, or you know, the men in black being NHI in some cases.
[02:24:05]  Like, you hear a lot of cases where these sort of gaunt looking, weird, strange sort of men in black that work for the OSI or and show up at the door.
[02:24:14]  So, at least in some capacity, if not working alongside, working independently to also try and quell or control, you know, the subject.
[02:24:24]  It seems that way.
[02:24:25]  They're walking among us, they're walking among us.
[02:24:28]  Yeah, that's what it seems to be.
[02:24:30]  Yeah, definitely trippy, huh?
[02:24:32]  It is.
[02:24:33]  All right.
[02:24:36]  Well, GSP, yeah, give it up, please.
[02:24:39]  Thank you.
[02:24:39]  Thank you, man.
[02:24:42]  George St. Pierre, ladies and gentlemen, thank you so much for joining us tonight.
[02:24:52]  Thank you.
[02:24:55]  Thank you to UAP Gerb.
[02:24:57]  Give it up for him as well.
[02:24:58]  And I want to thank Frederick and Christine.
[02:25:02]  Thank you for coming up and sharing your story.
[02:25:05]  And thank all of you for coming out tonight and supporting this show.
[02:25:08]  It means the world to us.
[02:25:10]  And it means the world to us that you're following everything we do.
[02:25:13]  And you're so passionate about this.
[02:25:15]  We got to speak to some of you.
[02:25:16]  I love you guys.
[02:25:17]  I think you're awesome.
[02:25:18]  And let's keep this thing going.
[02:25:20]  And let's push for disclosure, at least for some of the answers.
[02:25:23]  Thank you guys and good night.