DEBRIEFED - Chris Ramsay - The Alien Conclusion According to 50 Years of Research - Grant Cameron - DEBRIEFED ep. 79
Aired: 2026-03-13
Duration: 18:19


=== Tim Taylor Heals Twins (05:03) ===

[00:00:00]  So that he said at that point, he could heal people.
[00:00:03]  This woman comes up to him, there's twins.
[00:00:05]  These women are twins, they're in their 70s.
[00:00:07]  One woman says, My sister here, she had a stroke.
[00:00:10]  She can't hear.
[00:00:11]  She's totally deaf.
[00:00:12]  Can you heal her?
[00:00:13]  And Chris is standing in front of the hotel.
[00:00:15]  Suddenly, a cell phone.
[00:00:17]  There's Tim Taylor.
[00:00:18]  Tim Taylor says, If you're ever in front of a hotel and someone needs a healing, go ahead and do it.
[00:00:21]  No way.
[00:00:22]  Yeah.
[00:00:23]  So he says, I don't know.
[00:00:24]  Wait, wait a second.
[00:00:25]  Hold on a second.
[00:00:26]  It gets weird.
[00:00:26]  This is so strange.
[00:00:29]  He puts his hands on her ears.
[00:00:31]  And he says, In the name of Jesus, I can't remember what he said, In the name of Jesus, I heal you, or whatever.
[00:00:34]  And this woman goes into my lecture, and she comes out of the lecture, and she says, I can hear, I can hear everything said, I can hear.
[00:00:43]  All the people from the conference go to this restaurant across the street.
[00:00:46]  This girl comes back, and she's distraught.
[00:00:48]  She's like, Holy, you can't believe what happened.
[00:00:50]  It was like a third person was in the conversation.
[00:00:52]  She says, It was like, Tim Taylor, Tim Taylor, Tim Taylor.
[00:00:56]  The phone was a transmitter phone that he had been given this phone.
[00:00:59]  I don't know if this is true.
[00:01:00]  He'd been given this phone, it was a transmitter phone.
[00:01:02]  Everything that he did was being recorded by somebody.
[00:01:06]  That summer, a rich business guy out of New Jersey has a cottage, built a big log cabin in Pennsylvania.
[00:01:14]  So I get invited, and the only guy with no money there.
[00:01:16]  Suddenly, Tim Taylor shows up, and it was my friend that invited him.
[00:01:20]  And then he says to Tim Taylor, Hey, we're going on a UFO dig.
[00:01:22]  You want to come along?
[00:01:24]  And Tim goes, Yeah, yeah, sure.
[00:01:26]  So they go to the Gerald Anderson case.
[00:01:29]  Okay.
[00:01:29]  And they're pulling up this mail.
[00:01:31]  And I still remember my friend.
[00:01:32]  Now he won't talk.
[00:01:33]  He's forgotten everything.
[00:01:34]  He's forgotten everything that happened.
[00:01:35]  Tim Taylor said, When they got some of this mail, he said, Is the real deal.
[00:01:39]  I had the download experience.
[00:01:40]  So we talked about downloads and he talked about the invention.
[00:01:42]  So he gets this invention, he's got 40 patents, and then he's in contact with the, oh, he calls them the beings or whoever.
[00:01:48]  He doesn't call them aliens, whatever.
[00:01:50]  And they give him these inventions.
[00:01:51]  So the first one came, he'd woke up in the morning with this idea in his head, and supposedly this company sold for 88 million or 100 million on NASDAQ or whatever.
[00:01:59]  And he said, The last thing I remember the night before was a hooded figure standing at the end of the bed.
[00:02:06]  So at one point, he pulls out his cell phone.
[00:02:09]  And he says, what do you think of this?
[00:02:10]  Shows me this photo of these two guys on a painting.
[00:02:13]  And these two guys are flying through space on this painting.
[00:02:15]  And they look like they got pajamas on.
[00:02:17]  One guy's older than the other guy.
[00:02:19]  And then he shows me another photograph of these balls all going down this tunnel.
[00:02:22]  And then he shows me another one, this eclipse thing where the eclipse is taking place.
[00:02:25]  And then he shows me this photograph, you know, it's like a screen on the outside of a building.
[00:02:29]  And then he shows me the catcher.
[00:02:30]  He shows me this.
[00:02:30]  This is 999 Sepulveda Avenue.
[00:02:33]  And then he says, you know what this is?
[00:02:34]  He said, this is where the jump room was.
[00:02:36]  If I had known who he was, I would have paid attention.
[00:02:47]  Hey, Chris.
[00:02:47]  I'm a U.S. Navy Medical Corps officer.
[00:02:51]  I've been in for a while now, and I watched your video on the anatomy of an alien, the EBOs, and I thought it was really interesting because the person speaks like a scientist.
[00:03:05]  So, as in any dialect, that person has a similar dialect to somebody who does biological research.
[00:03:12]  While in initial training to become a Navy officer, I had.
[00:03:18]  The privilege to serve with a few people going to that same location.
[00:03:24]  They were microbiologists.
[00:03:25]  And if you know any of the connections, they were also Mormons.
[00:03:28]  So I thought that was interesting.
[00:03:30]  During the time, I got sort of to know that person as an acquaintance and made a joke about alien bodies.
[00:03:38]  And that if it were true to send me this nonchalant text that we've never texted each other before, that I would reply to with the wrong number.
[00:03:50]  In that regard, they.
[00:03:51]  Text me about two to three months after we had finished training with just that.
[00:03:57]  And could they have been messing with me?
[00:04:00]  Yes.
[00:04:00]  But I don't know.
[00:04:03]  One way or the other, it's a data point.
[00:04:05]  Thanks.
[00:04:05]  Welcome, Grant Cameron.
[00:04:07]  Thank you very much.
[00:04:07]  It's an honor to be here.
[00:04:10]  Well, it's an honor to have you, sir.
[00:04:12]  As you know, I'm just sort of you've been this trailblazer, especially for Canadian UFO researchers, but honestly, just UFO researchers worldwide.
[00:04:23]  You know, your career spans decades and looking into, you know, UFO insiders, government insiders, presidential papers, exploring the phenomenon from the nuts and bolts aspect all the way to the non physical and sort of consciousness based aspect of the phenomenon, which is something I'm looking forward to touching on.
[00:04:46]  As I'm sure that's kind of like the peak of your research, which is really interesting.
[00:04:53]  So, yeah, thank you for making it all the way out here.
[00:04:55]  I appreciate you.
[00:04:56]  Well, it's an honor to be here and to be in the SCIF.
[00:04:59]  And it's just, hopefully, you have a high enough security clearance to take what I can give you.

=== UFOs Touching The Rock (12:27) ===

[00:05:04]  Not nearly high enough.
[00:05:05]  And there's not many Canadians.
[00:05:06]  So I appreciate the work you've done.
[00:05:07]  I mean, you've done a tremendous amount in a very short time.
[00:05:10]  So, because usually we see it as American phenomena and there's not many Canadians.
[00:05:15]  So I congratulate you on what you've done here.
[00:05:18]  I'm very impressed.
[00:05:19]  Thank you so much.
[00:05:19]  That means a lot coming from you, Grant.
[00:05:21]  It really does.
[00:05:21]  And you know what?
[00:05:23]  To get it started, we were at lunch and you presented me with this here stone, this piece of What looks to be maybe some slate of a Canadian mountain range, I would assume.
[00:05:36]  Well, it's not mountains.
[00:05:38]  It's flat, but it's a lake area, like the lake area near Carnora, Ontario.
[00:05:47]  And why is this particular rock so special?
[00:05:51]  So, this is one of the more famous, I guess there's two big famous stories the Shag Harbor in Canada, and the second one is this one, the Falcon Lake.
[00:05:59]  This is 1967, 10 days before the Six Day War begins.
[00:06:04]  And there's a geologist out, uh, looking for metals and stuff like that.
[00:06:08]  And he tells a story where he's sitting there having lunch on sitting on a rock.
[00:06:13]  And all of a sudden he hears the geese all go sort of crazy and he looks and there's these two UFOs hovering over this sort of a small little lake.
[00:06:20]  And, um, he watches and the one disappears and the one comes and lands.
[00:06:24]  And it would be about maybe 75 feet from where he was sitting on this rock.
[00:06:30]  And, uh, so he looks at this and he thinks it's American, American space, uh, you know, test craft or whatever.
[00:06:37]  The door opens on this thing.
[00:06:39]  And I always go when I talk to people about UFO sightings, when they have UFO sightings, and this falls in the same category, although it's very bizarre, is when you ask people, what was the UFO doing?
[00:06:48]  It wasn't doing anything.
[00:06:49]  And this wasn't doing anything either.
[00:06:50]  It just landed and the door opened up.
[00:06:52]  And this guy was a Polish guy.
[00:06:53]  His name was, I'm going to forget his name, Mikulak.
[00:06:56]  Yeah, Stephen Mikulak.
[00:06:58]  So he walks up to this thing and the door is open.
[00:07:02]  You can see this light coming out of it.
[00:07:03]  And he says, okay, Yankee boys, come on out.
[00:07:05]  Are you in trouble?
[00:07:06]  You need some help or whatever?
[00:07:08]  And there's no answer.
[00:07:09]  And then he goes in Polish, he goes in Russian, he knows all sorts of languages, and nothing really answers.
[00:07:14]  And he sort of looks in and you can see these lights and these walls are sort of very thick and whatever.
[00:07:19]  And at that moment, the door sort of closes and he's got his, he's got a rubber glove on because he's prospecting.
[00:07:25]  He's got his rubber glove on and the craft lifts off the ground and starts to rotate.
[00:07:32]  And as it rotates around, there's a grid, which makes no sense whatsoever.
[00:07:35]  A grid on the side of a flying saucer and this hot air comes out and it starts his, his, uh, Shirt on fire, his glove is on fire, and he ends up with this burn patch like a checkerboard on his, on his, from this grid pattern.
[00:07:49]  And the thing flies off and he's throwing up.
[00:07:52]  He's, you know, really trying to get back to Winnipeg, and he, he managed to get back to Winnipeg.
[00:07:58]  And it becomes one of the more famous stories.
[00:08:00]  Blue Book comes up to investigate it.
[00:08:02]  It's investigated ruthlessly by, he was down at Mayo Clinic, and this burn would come back on his chest.
[00:08:08]  This sort of weird stuff that happens in ufology and in paranormal, where It, it goes away, then it comes back.
[00:08:14]  Oh, I didn't know that.
[00:08:15]  I didn't know that it came back.
[00:08:16]  Yeah, we'd come back all the time.
[00:08:17]  Every couple of years, this would come back.
[00:08:19]  So he had, it was down at the Mayo Clinic and people recovered his records and stuff like that.
[00:08:23]  And, and it was a very, very famous case in Canada.
[00:08:26]  Some people call it the Canadian Roswell.
[00:08:28]  So there's been nobody at the site because it's a very remote site.
[00:08:31]  It's off Highway one, just before you get to Falcon Lake.
[00:08:34]  Uh, but you need to go in by horseback.
[00:08:36]  Even today.
[00:08:37]  Even today, yeah.
[00:08:38]  Well, I guess you could walk down the path.
[00:08:39]  It's in a forest area, a real thick forest area off the highway.
[00:08:44]  Yeah, that's a testament to how far we've come.
[00:08:47]  Yeah, yeah.
[00:08:48]  There are places in the world that we still can't get to without a horse, which is wild.
[00:08:52]  So there's a guy by the name of Rob Freeman, if you know him, he has the big camera array.
[00:08:56]  Right.
[00:08:57]  He has all these cameras and stuff.
[00:08:58]  And I think he was down at the Monroe Institute doing some stuff there.
[00:09:03]  And he does the blindfold reading, which I think is really, really important.
[00:09:06]  He does the stuff with people seeing through blindfolds and stuff like that.
[00:09:09]  Right.
[00:09:09]  That's his latest research.
[00:09:11]  But anyway, he was, he was doing a film project.
[00:09:13]  He was in Manitoba.
[00:09:13]  He wanted to do the Charlie Red Star, which was my case.
[00:09:16]  And then he said, well, do you want to, we want to go to Falcon Lake.
[00:09:19]  So I said, yeah, I'll go go to Falcon Lake.
[00:09:20]  So we went there and there's a tour guide that has a farm there or horses just off the highway.
[00:09:26]  And, um, he lends, takes tours in there.
[00:09:29]  And when we got to the site, there was, uh, he identified the fact that there had been less than a hundred people since 1967 who had actually been to this site.
[00:09:37]  And so he's the crew, film crew is filming and, um, Rob Freeman's filming and this tour guide, Is explaining this whole thing, and I'm sitting there and I'm, you know, sort of bored.
[00:09:49]  I'm walking around, and suddenly I see that the rock is all fracturing the top of the rock.
[00:09:53]  I'm thinking, well, this is a case where the UFO landed and there was no tripods.
[00:09:58]  So it was actually sitting right on the rock.
[00:10:00]  And so these pieces of rock, and then I fill up my pockets and I figure, oh, I could sell these for like 50 bucks a piece at a conference, you know.
[00:10:10]  And then I look at my assistant, she's picking up rocks, she's putting them in her pocket.
[00:10:13]  You know, that's filming is going on.
[00:10:15]  And so from time to time, I give it out.
[00:10:16]  So this I brought for you.
[00:10:18]  And it, it, it, the key thing is the UFO was actually touching the rock that you have there.
[00:10:22]  It was sitting right on the rock.
[00:10:24]  And they had, I think, slight radiation, not really radiation.
[00:10:28]  They had some stuff, but the weird thing they had, which you see a lot.
[00:10:31]  I wrote a book on it on a ports and manifestations.
[00:10:34]  So what they had is this metal, this silver metal that appeared in the cracks, like, uh, like angel hair type.
[00:10:40]  No, like actual metal.
[00:10:42]  Okay.
[00:10:42]  Yeah.
[00:10:42]  Actual pieces of metal that was in the cracks.
[00:10:45]  But they didn't discover it, I think, till 68.
[00:10:47]  They went in for another investigation in 68.
[00:10:50]  That's when they found the metal.
[00:10:51]  But you'll find that all the time.
[00:10:52]  And I always refer to that as sort of the weird part of the UFO thing.
[00:10:55]  I think, I say, do you think a UFO crossed a thousand light years, came to Earth, and then pieces started falling off the UFO?
[00:11:02]  Come on, give me an extra.
[00:11:03]  I even talked to Hell Put Off.
[00:11:04]  I said, Hell, I said, you know, this is a port.
[00:11:07]  This is not pieces of flying saucer.
[00:11:09]  This is not things breaking off the flying saucer.
[00:11:12]  They're dropping this stuff on purpose to inspire you to do something and to make you wonder what's going on.
[00:11:18]  Yeah.
[00:11:18]  The whole theory, well, Thing that makes you that's right, on curious, and so you'll research.
[00:11:24]  I said, You even know because you had the experience with Uri Geller, and that was a story that Uri Geller in '72 they were doing research with him.
[00:11:31]  And so, uh, Edgar Mitchell held put off, and Uri Geller went for lunch.
[00:11:36]  And uh, Uri Geller is eating ice cream, and suddenly he says, Oh, what?
[00:11:40]  and he pulls this thing out of his mouth, and his lip is cut.
[00:11:43]  And they look at him, and then Edgar Mitchell says, That's my flight pin.
[00:11:48]  What's my flight pin doing in your mouth?
[00:11:51]  And he said he'd lost the flight pin in Houston two years before.
[00:11:55]  And so he pulls this thing out, and they're looking at this weird, this flight pin is in Yuri's mouth.
[00:11:59]  And so they go back to the SRI, and then Yuri's in another room.
[00:12:05]  So I can't blame Yuri for this.
[00:12:06]  Yuri's in one room, and Edgar Mitchell and Hal put off are sitting in the other room.
[00:12:10]  And all of a sudden they hear this tink, and they look around, and the back half of the flight pin is on the floor.
[00:12:14]  Oh, wow.
[00:12:15]  And so, this is that's why I said to hell, this is strange.
[00:12:17]  This is this weird stuff that they do time slip stuff.
[00:12:20]  So, I wrote a whole book on this whole thing about uh, uh, ports of manifestations.
[00:12:23]  You'll ask experiences, you know, they'll say, Oh, I just had this one UFO sighting.
[00:12:26]  I say, Hey, uh, anything ever uh, fly around your house or fall out of the ceiling?
[00:12:32]  Yeah, can you hang on and go and bring back all this stuff?
[00:12:34]  Oh, yeah, that's fallen in coins.
[00:12:37]  And we hear about liquid, you know, coming from these orbs.
[00:12:41]  Uh, even Chris Bledsoe, you know, there are pictures that he's shared of molten metal on the ground and you know.
[00:12:48]  You hear a lot of stories about things like that, but then, you know, initially you wonder why?
[00:12:54]  Like, what's happening here?
[00:12:55]  Is it shedding its skin?
[00:12:57]  Is that just some property of how it instantiates?
[00:13:00]  But then the theory, and I love this, is something I wanted to bring up as well your theory of wow is really interesting because it kind of neatly, in a way, ties together most of what we're experiencing here, which is this idea that it is here to inspire you.
[00:13:18]  It's instantiating in any It's kind of interacting with your consciousness to determine how to instantiate.
[00:13:26]  And then when it does show up, it's meant to have you question things or to inspire you to create, like almost like a muse would.
[00:13:33]  And I think that's really interesting when you look at the phenomenon from that lens, because then it becomes more about what is this trying to teach me rather than why are they here?
[00:13:43]  And I think that's just more profound and aligns a lot more with the experiencer experience, for lack of a better word.
[00:13:50]  In the fact that they feel like it happened for a reason, like there was a message there, that there was some type of direction or guidance that was being attributed to them by these founders.
[00:14:03]  And it's never a full message because a full message is left brain.
[00:14:06]  It's we're here to bring you freedom and democracy, Jesus and McDonald's.
[00:14:10]  What they're doing is freedom and democracy, Jesus and McDonald's.
[00:14:13]  They're doing the right brain thing.
[00:14:16]  It's a symbol.
[00:14:16]  You're never going to figure it out.
[00:14:17]  They don't give you the full answer, they just give you a breadcrumb.
[00:14:20]  So they do weird things like the one.
[00:14:22]  With Gary Nolan, I remember I first saw it when Gary Nolan and, and Hal started doing all the analysis on the metal and they had the Ubatuba piece.
[00:14:28]  Right.
[00:14:28]  And they had two fragments of the Ubatuba piece and the one piece was completely normal and the other one had all these isotopes were all messed up.
[00:14:35]  And it's the same metal.
[00:14:36]  It's the same, comes from the same craft.
[00:14:38]  And I can just say, let's see whatever intelligence is just laughing and say, man, look at this.
[00:14:42]  Look at the expression on his face.
[00:14:43]  And you see these and they're so weird.
[00:14:46]  That's the thing.
[00:14:46]  It's like a crop circle or they want it to be really, really weird.
[00:14:49]  I sometimes I call it the Jesus circus where if Jesus hadn't walked on water, fed 5,000 people, raised Lazarus from the dead, I'd never heard of the guy.
[00:14:56]  Right.
[00:14:56]  And that's what they're doing.
[00:14:57]  They're doing this weird thing where.
[00:14:59]  So you talk about it.
[00:15:00]  Yeah.
[00:15:00]  So you talk about it.
[00:15:00]  And you would have cases like we had the one, one of the most bizarre ones I had was a woman experiencer in the Tucson area.
[00:15:07]  And she came into her bathroom and there was a pile of dirt in the middle of the bathroom floor.
[00:15:13]  And it had these little white discs in it.
[00:15:15]  And it's like she's looking at this thing.
[00:15:16]  She photographs it.
[00:15:18]  She brings in the researcher and he looks at it.
[00:15:20]  And then they go to the restaurant, and then they're sitting at the restaurant, and somebody leaves the thing, come back, and they say, Look under your chair.
[00:15:26]  She's got another pile of dirt under her chair.
[00:15:28]  And it's these kind of weird things where it makes no sense.
[00:15:30]  Or they put the dime, a lot of those dimes.
[00:15:33]  I remember I was actually talking to that researcher, and he said, Can I show you something?
[00:15:36]  And he reaches over and he gets this thing full of dimes.
[00:15:39]  I said, I know the dime story.
[00:15:40]  Everybody talks about dimes.
[00:15:41]  Their mother, dead mother, is bringing them dimes.
[00:15:43]  And people would find I used to volunteer at Ronald McDonald's house.
[00:15:47]  And one of the people that was a cleaner there said, My mother has dimes.
[00:15:50]  All the time in here, I find dimes on the windowsills and stuff like that.
[00:15:54]  And she believed it was her mother.
[00:15:56]  But it's this weird sort of thing where they want it mysterious.
[00:15:59]  And it's guiding you in almost like a synchronistic fashion where if you're open to it, you'll kind of start seeing a pattern.
[00:16:07]  And otherwise, you won't even see it at all, which again, you know, kind of favors the experiencer over the skeptic in terms of witnessing the phenomenon.
[00:16:15]  Yeah.
[00:16:15]  So, the way I sort of see it is there's two different levels.
[00:16:19]  I always say that science doesn't work, they think they work on proof, but I say they work on belief.
[00:16:23]  So, what you have is you have a hypothesis.
[00:16:25]  Yeah.
[00:16:25]  Which is a guess.
[00:16:26]  Right.
[00:16:27]  Nothing more than a guess.
[00:16:28]  I guess it's this.
[00:16:29]  It looks like this.
[00:16:30]  You do some experiments, you do some observations, you do a conclusion, and what do you do?
[00:16:34]  Make a guess.
[00:16:35]  You make another guess.
[00:16:35]  Yeah.
[00:16:35]  Make another guess.
[00:16:35]  And you can make another, and you either time, each time you get closer and closer and closer.
[00:16:39]  The difference with the experiencer and stuff is if you had the experience, like you were talking about out of body experiences and stuff, people who have these non local experiences, they won't say, well, I think it was this.
[00:16:48]  I'd say, I know.
[00:16:49]  Right.
[00:16:50]  There's a knowing.
[00:16:50]  There's a knowing.
[00:16:51]  It's called a knowing.
[00:16:52]  Even in the field, it's called a knowing.
[00:16:53]  Yeah.
[00:16:54]  And that's what happened to me in 2013 when I had this download experience watching Colin Andrew.
[00:16:59]  Give a lecture on crop circles, which I wasn't interested.
[00:17:01]  So the contact modality was I was daydreaming.
[00:17:04]  Before we continue with today's conversation, I'd like to point something out.
[00:17:10]  You see, I'm sitting here talking to a researcher.
[00:17:14]  Someone who spends years digging through archives, documents, records, chasing information most people never see.
[00:17:21]  That kind of work requires curiosity.
[00:17:24]  But here's the irony while researchers are digging into hidden systems, there are companies quietly digging into us.

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