Alex Jones, William Hammond, Butch Paw, and Dr. Paul Craig Roberts dissect biblical justifications for resisting tyranny, citing Romans 13 and historical uprisings against Rome and English kings to argue that obedience to unjust leaders makes them gods. They critique mainstream pastors for brainwashing believers into submission while predicting an inflationary recession driven by Federal Reserve liquidity injections, a trillion-dollar trade deficit sold to China, and rising global powers like Russia. The discussion condemns TSA abuses as fascist thuggery, labels evangelical leaders thugs, and warns of a social-engineered crisis requiring active resistance rather than waiting for the rapture. [Automatically generated summary]
Dr. Paul Craig Roberts is coming up in 15 minutes.
For TV viewers, we just started transmitting, streaming live for PrisonPlanet.tv members.
Folks watching this later as an archive, we had a caller earlier that said, well the Federal Reserve rules over us, it's private, but isn't that what the Bible says we should do?
I mean, you know, it's don't stand up against slavery, don't not take the mercury-filled shots, don't not drink the fluoride water, whatever government says is God.
And I wanted to call my uncle, who's one of the best Bible scholars I know, William Hammond, and have him comment, but Butch Paw, who's a talk show host right here on the network, a pastor, He's also an expert on this and made some documentaries about it, called in.
So we've got this segment and part of the next before Dr. Roberts comes on, because I wanted to address this now.
And I wanted to go to my uncle, William.
Go ahead and just spend a few minutes giving people verses or try to explain to this person that it's... I mean, I'm not even a Bible expert.
The whole Bible is about standing up against tyranny.
All through history, both in the Bible and with most theologians, there's been the concept of just war, just resistance, unjust war, unjust resistance.
And the Word of God is pretty clear that wars, just wars, involve defense, whereas unjust wars and unjust resistance involves aggression or open rebellion for rebellion's sake or for material reasons.
So, in the Word of God, we see that we're always juggling with this, and we are to obey.
Romans 13 has that kernel of truth.
However, when the government is clearly violating every single tenet of the Word of God, and that which the Constitution and the nation was established upon, right down to our right to life of our unborn babies, and our right to defend our own lives, then we know That we're bumping up against unjust activity and the activities of an aggressor.
There is a scripture that says at the end in the kingdom that the swords will be beaten into plowshares, but there's also an Old Testament scripture calling for a just war that says, beat your plowshares into swords.
And Jesus himself said at the very end of his ministry, When he was advising his disciples and his apostles, he said, if you've got two coats, sell one and buy a sword.
So he recognized that there was going to be terrible resistance to truth and righteousness, and it wasn't to be taken lying down doing nothing.
Okay, now stop there because I'm going to bring you guys back.
Butch, give them some verses.
unidentified
Well, if you go to 2 Kings chapter 11, you'll find in there very clearly where Jehodeah, the high priest of the day, the preacher, the head preacher, dethroned an unjust leader, a queen, and had her killed for daring to strip authority over righteous government.
And as your uncle just mentioned, Romans 13 tells us to obey powers, but if you read down in verses 3 and 4, those powers are to be ministers of God to our good.
That word ministry, it means deacon.
The government itself is to be a deacon to glorify God and edify the good of the people.
If it ceases to do good, it ceases to be righteous government, and then we are required, by God's law and His commandments, to resist that evil by all means necessary.
Why did they do all that if they were to follow and grovel to government?
And by this extension, the Founding Fathers are bad.
Fighting Hitler was bad because it's all of God, isn't it?
unidentified
Well, if people just take time to look the Bible for what it says and quit trying to weasel away around this, they are accountable for the evil around them.
If we are not fighting evil, we're not doing the will of our Father.
Well, you're aiding it and the blood is on your hands.
I want to talk behind the scenes for the internet listeners right now.
We're going to skip this break.
Everybody else will be right back.
Guys, I know this is on really short notice, but, I mean, it's crazy.
All the prophets are being killed, put in prison.
They're refusing to do what evil kings say in Israel, outside Israel, Babylon, Egypt.
According to them, they should have done what Pharaoh said.
They should have done what all of them said.
Jesus should have done what the high priest and Herod said.
I mean, this is unbelievable, and it's taught Everywhere, to not even warn people, because that's speaking out against the government, to take your shots, let them kill you, do whatever they say.
unidentified
It's insanity, it's unbiblical.
And I'll make one comment, your uncle can talk all he likes to, because this is a point that is so, so important today.
That if we render to Caesar what is not Caesar's, on my website, PastorButch.com, there's a three hour video, anybody can watch for free, entitled, Render to Caesar Explained.
If we give unto Him what is not His, we make Caesar our God, we deny our God, and hell is our damnation.
And going back to my uncle, do you want to make some more comments here?
unidentified
Well, not only is the Bible on our side, but history is on our side as believers, because in a practical sense, Christianity would not exist today if no resistance had taken place throughout history.
Look at what the Romans tried to do to the believers.
Going back to The Founding Fathers, going back to the Bible, Paul was somebody who hunted down and killed Christians until he got knocked off his horse and became Paul from Saul of Tarsus on the road to Damascus.
So there it is that Christians weren't following orders, he was going around hunting them down.
unidentified
Exactly.
They were resisting the civil authorities and the church of the day, and the church of the day, very good point, the so-called church, because they would not go along with the customs of the church.
They said this is not right.
Christ is the Messiah.
They were being persecuted by the church and by the civil authority.
Paul himself was Saul of Tarsus, went around hunting down and killing Christians because they wouldn't submit to the civil or the religious authority.
And then of course he got knocked off his horse on the way to Damascus, saw the light, was imprisoned.
I mean, how did Paul end up?
How did the other disciples end up?
My uncle, William Hammond, and of course Basher Butchpaw, Genesis Network host at 8 o'clock at 9 central, I want my uncle to have a two-minute closing comment and then Butch, then we're going to get Dr. Paul Gregg Roberts on right now.
unidentified
Thank you.
We were looking at the historical perspective and we've come down to the Inquisition, which was a coldly calculated move for about 800 or 900 years to totally wipe out true Christianity.
If there had been no resistance, again, Christianity would not exist today.
And moving to the tyranny of the kings of England, had there been no resistance to the kings, There would have been no America because the people came here to found this place looking for freedom of faith.
Look at Martin Luther.
If he had not been, not Martin Luther King, Martin Luther of the Reformation, if Martin Luther had not been backed by the arms of the German princes, there would have been no Reformation.
It would have been swept away in a few days by the papal armies.
So there was a lot of resistance there.
And finally, I'd like to say That when Jesus comes back, and it's very soon, it's at the door, he's not coming back as a lamb.
He's coming back as a Lion of Judah with 10,000 times 10,000 saints with a mighty sword to wipe out his enemies completely at the Battle of Armageddon.
I would call that total resistance, wouldn't you, Alex?
And that really is, thank you, that really is the crux of the problem, that you have tens of billions of dollars, 26,000 now, they're done a double that number by next year, FEMA pastors, we told you this one was secret, it's now public, trained to tell their flocks, turn your guns in, go to FEMA camps, let the government take your children.
I mean, this is right out of Nazi Germany, Soviet Russia, and that's why, one of the main reasons we can't get this country moving, Is that the churches are bought and paid for by these corporate interests and are out there spewing the line of this government.
And I am just completely blown away by it.
Every time one of those people calls in and says, if you're a Christian, you're supposed to not stand up against tyranny.
And it's just totally crazy.
Number one, I had a financial guest on, talking about financial news, and this guy calls in saying, you know, we basically shouldn't even criticize the Federal Reserve.
Because God says don't.
I mean, I just can't handle this anymore.
I mean, it's just so crazy.
Now, if you want to go off in a ditch and be a slave, go ahead.
Just get out of my way.
Get behind me.
Do we have Dr. Roberts?
He's all set.
Okay, thank you so much.
Got late today with our guest.
I appreciate all the guests moving back ten minutes, because Ron Paul was going to be on earlier.
He had to move it to the middle of another interview, so that is why we're a little bit behind.
I'm very honored to have former Wall Street Journal Associate Editor, best-selling author, the father of Reaganomics, head of policy, Department of Treasury.
That was number two under Ronald Reagan, and syndicated columnist with a great syndicated column group out there.
You can just simply Google the name Dr. Paul Craig Roberts and see his stuff in hundreds of great publications.
Liberal, conservative, libertarian, anybody who is informed reads Dr. Roberts' columns that come out several times a week and we link to those over at Infowars.com and PrisonPlanet.com and his second edition The tyranny of good intentions is out, and I hope everybody will get it.
And he's with us for the rest of the hour, and we're going to be taking your phone calls at the bottom of the hour at 1-800-259-9231.
So much has happened since he was last with us a few weeks ago.
Hey, just a side issue before we get into the economy and Conyers blocking a real impeachment hearing coming up this Friday.
We had Kucinich on yesterday.
What do you think of all these mainline Christians that call into shows, I'm sure you've heard them, I know you've written about them, saying, do whatever government says, Romans 13, don't fight tyranny, torture's good, kill all the Iraqis, it's of the Lord.
Now they're getting so crazy, Pastor Hagee saying Jesus isn't even the Savior.
I mean, I know you don't get into religious stuff, but the point is, it's really getting wacky right now.
In fact, I even heard a guy on the network yesterday on another show saying that Ahmadinejad wants nuclear war, has a bomb, is going to nuke Israel, Israel's defenseless.
Pat Robertson got up yesterday, we have the clip, and said they're going to get the A-bomb, Israel has to hit them, it's of the Lord, and this is the same group that lied about Iraq.
I'm saying, I understand the kingpins are just manipulating their minions and are secular, but my point is, how do they get all these little church ladies to just be complete pea brains?
So, Alex, it's part of getting the population ready for the assault on Iran.
This is Israel's... Look, everybody who's knowledgeable and informed knows that Israel has turned down.
It's now on the decline.
The United States is on the decline.
In fact, we're totally dependent now on the Chinese to finance the daily operation of our own government.
So we're both on the decline.
Our power is evaporating before our eyes.
Israel has twice been defeated by the Hezbollah militia, the famed And Marble Israeli Army got its ass kicked twice, driven out of Lebanon by a few thousand militia.
The power's on the decline.
This is their last chance.
Bush, assuming he doesn't pull a fast one, will be gone in six months.
So right now they got their finger on the button.
And they're going to push and push and push and try to get the situation where Their attack on Iran will be tolerated.
And so that's what they're using the churches for.
I don't think that they live in a factual reality.
So, I think that if they want to do it bad enough, they'll fool themselves with But they can't.
But I think it will leave, it will accelerate the collapse of American power and Israeli power.
And if we think that our invasions of Iraq and Afghanistan and the Israeli bombings of the civilian Lebanese population and their murders in Gaza and the West Bank have radicalized Muslims, just wait.
Until we nuke Iran.
And then, most likely, all of our puppets will fall in the Middle East.
Israel will probably be exterminated.
Americans won't be able to borrow a dime.
They'll have to close down most of the government.
Also, take your phone calls at the bottom of the hour for Dr. Paul Craig Roberts.
1-800-259-9231.
His new book is out, The Tyranny of Good Intentions.
Get it at bookstores everywhere.
unidentified
Have you ever felt like the United States government knows way too much about your financial affairs?
I continue to hear stories about property seizures, frozen bank accounts, confiscation of stocks and bonds.
It makes me wonder if the U.S.
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Bases Falling Apart00:07:33
unidentified
And okay, fine, now I'm telling you what's happened to gasoline is happening to food, your grocery bills.
Well, don't you know they bragged on how disconnected they were?
They would create the reality and we'd have to go find out what it was.
So they don't accept any limits.
They think they're omnipotent.
And it's so hilarious, because these are the guys that can't occupy Baghdad.
These are the guys that have to allow the Chinese to pay their salaries, and lend us money to pay Social Security wealth, and lend us money to buy fuel for the planes we use to bomb Civilians in the Middle East and Africa and wherever.
And yet they think they're omnipotent.
We already decided, didn't we, that they were insane.
So, of course, that means they're a huge danger to us.
I don't think people, short of taking up arms and doing what Thomas Jefferson said that we needed to do every 200 years, And of course, he lived in a time of very slow change.
So 200 years, he would probably shorten that if he was around today.
Other than, you know, overthrowing the government, starting over, there's nothing we can do because they don't listen to us.
The people don't count.
Bush has made it clear there's no interest in public opinion.
The Democrats aren't either.
I mean, the electorate tried to stop it when we elected the Democrats in 2006, and the Democrats did nothing.
And I don't want to get people too, you know, down and give up.
But I think we've reached the point now where it's out of our hands.
The question really is how the rising powers view this.
The rising powers are China, Russia, India.
In 20 years, they'll rule the world.
We'll be nothing.
And the question is how will they view this?
Do the Russians want radioactivity on their borders?
Do the Chinese want all their energy investments destroyed in Iran?
Do the Europeans want this with their large Muslim populations who will probably be radicalized by it?
And whether or not any of them do anything, and whether they all say, well, look, let's just let the fools go ahead, because this is the best way to get rid of America.
Yeah, I think maybe that's... I think that's what the Chinese decided, that rather than interfere and get in a conflict with us that might re-energize us in some other way, They'll just let us go on dry doom.
You know, nobody tried to stop Hitler from marching into Germany.
When he did that, the British Churchill said, well, now we've won.
So, I don't think anybody will stop us in order to save the Iranians, because they haven't got anything against the Iranians, but they've got a lot against us.
And if we self-destruct, it's easier.
Yeah, they don't like us anyhow.
I mean, we're always bossing people around, criticizing them for sins that are a fraction of our own sins.
So, I don't think anybody We'll stop us in order to save the Iranians, because they haven't got anything against the Iranians, but they got a lot against us.
And if we self-destruct, it's easier for them.
They don't like us anyhow.
I mean, we're always bossing people around, criticizing them for sins that are a fraction of our own sins.
We're gonna come right back and finish up how you see this unfolding.
And, uh, taking phone calls, stay with us.
unidentified
We're on the march.
The Empire's on the run.
Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.
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We're going to be on your phone calls here in about five minutes.
I wanted to first get, Dr. Roberts is an expert on the economy.
He was the engineer of one of the biggest boom times in U.S.
history during the 80s and the early 90s.
And of course, he added up the Department of the Treasury policy.
He called the shots there.
Really honored that he spent so much time with us and we appreciate that.
Your call is coming up in a moment after I ask him where he thinks the economy is currently with these bank runs and commodities and the rest of it.
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And before we go back to Dr. Roberts, I do want to then also remind everybody that Dr. Roberts has a best-selling book now in its second edition, The Tyranny of Good Intentions.
You need to get it to see how they're setting up a total police state here in the United States.
It's in bookstores everywhere.
In fact, I was at the bookstore about a month ago and saw a stack of them sitting there.
So be sure and get that.
Even if you know all about this stuff, get it and give it to somebody that reads in your family who's not fully awakened.
Because that's the only way to stop this is educating people one step at a time.
Dr. Roberts, briefly, because I want to go to calls while we have you for people who want to talk to you.
The economy, give us a rundown with your expertise on the current state of affairs and where you see it going.
So now we're going to start giving them, instead of giving them seven, eight hundred billion dollars a year of what we have, A trillion dollars.
That's our companies, you know, all the natural resources, we're selling the toll roads to them, so they get the revenues from toll roads, the real estate, anything we can offer them.
The only question is, will the paper collapse completely before they can buy it all up?
In a way that might be good.
Last question, we're going to go to calls.
They are announcing, and it's in the housing bill, and I've got the bill right here, we had Ron Paul on about it today, that every credit card transaction will instantly be uploaded to the IRS.
Major gas companies, ABC News reports, are going to make you register with a credit card to be able to buy gas, to track everything you're doing.
They're hiring more police, more checkpoints, more tickets.
Newborn baby will be visited by CPS.
That bill is about to pass.
Turning carbon taxes, harassment.
Government is just, as you know, tripled in the last eight years.
It just seems to be about to divide again and get even bigger like a bacterial infection.
and they just seem to just giggle and laugh and put black uniforms on and wave tasers at us and put up more cameras and just cackle and put skulls on the sides of police armored vehicles.
I mean, it seems like total mental meltdown.
It appears like when cancer is racing through the body right before death.
I mean, is that what you see this as?
What's going to happen to all the thugs and all the scum and all the...
uh... credit card business and and all of them purchases going to the government and investing every child is born by child protect what is the point of all this?
They attract people that want to abuse people, but they ain't got enough guts to go join the Marines and actually have to go somewhere and get shot back at.
So they like to have power where their victims are powerless.
So they're cowards.
They know it.
All bullies are cowards.
And so it's this massive bureaucracy that protects them.
So that's the kind of people that take those jobs.
When you create those kinds of jobs, you're creating homes, places, employment for those kinds of people.
I'm calling because I heard, I just checked out this guy named Jeff Rents last night, and he had a guy named Benjamin Fulford, and he's some big-wig Forbes guy or something.
Yeah, I don't know about that, but Fulford did write for Forbes and he says that the Asian Mafia, which is basically the heads of the Chinese and Japanese governments, are threatening the New World Order.
We shouldn't be attacking people with no provocation.
What I want to ask you guys though is Explain to everybody out there what it means when it says that those are with Israel, God is with them, those are against Israel, God is against them.
It's all the data processing jobs, all the computer software jobs.
It's any A job that's tradable, that is, that doesn't have to be done hands-on, like a barber or a dentist or awaiting a table or fixing a drink.
You don't make a living at that job.
The reason they're doing it is because it dramatically lowers their cost of production and they then can pay themselves a multi-million dollar It's a short-term thing for them, but does destroy the goose that lays the golden eggs.
unidentified
What happens when China calls in their loans?
What happens when they stop taking American dollars?
Well, like you said, this isn't like a man who beats his wife every night with a tire iron, and she's finally leaving, and he really tries to intimidate her when she's got everything loaded up, and he pulls a gun out and threatens to shoot her.
I just wanted to call in and make the point, it's funny how the people that are saying that you should follow the government and do whatever they say, they say follow those laws, are the same ones that actually reject the laws of God, but they say you've got to follow man's laws, but don't follow God's laws.
They're the funny Christians that go out and have abortions and get, you know, get divorced five or six times.
And I'm not even judging those people.
The point is, they're the ones that do that, and they're the ones that'll steal from you in business.
I mean, I grew up around a bunch of big Dallas preachers in the neighborhood I lived in.
You know, upper middle class.
My dad.
And I saw him partying, and I saw him with the hookers next door, and I saw him with all the... And I'd see him on TV the next, you know, the next day on Sunday on Dallas television.
And I guess the church has been against the war, too, so that's a... Generally, they are against destruction of human life, whether it's war, abortion, capital punishment.
John, were you able to find that little sub clip of that ABC News piece where they're going after the World War II vets and the 15-year-old girls and then beating their chest, screaming, I have power, I have power.
Well, you know, the Communist Chinese, their population is revolting and taking over cities every week, and they try to cover it out in the news, but the Chinese have a lot more spirit than we do.
We just got to figure out in the next few months at short notice if we can get a venue big enough to do this.
So that's up on the site.
We're going into very bad waters here, but a lot of people are waking up and we can say no to this.
We got a bunch of sick social engineers doing all this by design, bringing us into a global crisis by design, and we had to learn to say no.
My mom called up.
She never calls the office.
I don't think my mother's ever called the office in a decade plus of a radio show, said, wish your uncle a happy birthday, because he was on the show earlier today.
I didn't know it was your birthday.
Happy birthday.
It's also Burmese's birthday.
So, you guys all have the same birthday there.
All right, take us out of here, John.
I don't hear my illustrious bumper music.
I do want to encourage all of the listeners to please remember rebroadcast with Ron Paul and everybody else.
Jim Mars with his new book on the Nazis.
It's all up on Infowars.com.
Retransmission on the audio starts right now for internet listeners.
For everybody else, back live tomorrow on the MNFM Dial.