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Dec. 2, 2015 - Art Bell

02:23:29

Art Bell MITD - Open Lines San Bernardino Shooting

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01:04:32

dr john liebert

11:47

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Speaker	Time	Text
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hi, Desert and the Great American Southwest.
		I bid you all good evening, good morning, good afternoon, wherever you may be in the world's 25 time zones.
		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		My name is Art Bell.
		As always, the rules are the same.
		No bad language and one call per show.
		That's it.
		Those are the rules.
		The show, however, is going to be a little different tonight.
		We were going to have Charles Osman on, and I think we're going to reschedule Charles for a later date because I think we're going to do open lines.
		Now, I know some things.
		I a few things.
		I watched the coverage of the attack all day long on CNN.
		And I thought from the beginning that it was terrorist.
		And I think a lot of the people on CNN thought so too, and then really, really played it down.
		I'm not sure how many of you saw the coverage, but let me read you what I have, okay, as we consider what we'll talk about tonight.
		There were at least two heavily armed attackers that opened fire on a banquet at a social services center for the disabled on Wednesday.
		Really?
unidentified		A social services center for the disabled?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that a place to commit mass murder?
		Apparently so.
		14 people are dead.
		Probably a dozen others seriously injured.
		We don't know how, you know, we don't know how some may die.
		Some may recover, hopefully.
		It looked as though these guys were on a mission.
		Well, retraction.
		One guy, one girl, and maybe a third.
		Hours later, I mean, they just went in with AR-type rifles.
		First, they said, oh, earlier in the day was AK-47, right?
		Then later in the day, it changed to weapon.
		Hours later, people, police rather, hunting for the killers riddled a black SUV.
		You may have seen that happen just, but not live, actually.
		Cameras came on it to see the bullet holes in the body lying on the ground.
		With gunfire and a shootout, two miles from the late morning carnage, a man and woman with assault rifles, handguns, and assault-style clothing were killed.
		They were in the vehicle.
		It may well be that a third ran.
		They're still trying to figure that out.
		They don't even know if a third person had anything to do with the crime.
		There may only be two.
		Either way, CNN is not been naming anybody.
		I'm not going to be that careful because the Associated Press is.
		And so I'm not afraid to quote them.
		The latest on the mass shooting at a social services facility in San Bernardino, California, all time local 740 is when this ran on the Associated Press.
		A law enforcement official has identified Syed Farouk as one of the suspects in a mass shooting in Southern California.
		The official who was briefed on the case was not authorized to speak to the media about the ongoing investigation, but spoke to the AP, I guess, on condition, of course, of anonymity.
		Police say two suspects, a man and a woman, were killed in a gun battle.
		Well, I've already said this.
		Now, I've got some additional information that my producer quickly dug up.
		And this is so that I'm crediting properly here, New York Daily News exclusive, they say.
		Apparently, this Syed Farouk has a dad, said Syed is 30.
		He now knows, of course, he was linked to the slaughter that left 14 dead at the Inland Regional Center in San Bernardino.
		His father was shocked to learn of his son's possible involvement in the attack.
		He said, I haven't heard anything.
		The elder Farouk told the Daily News he was very religious.
		He would go to work, come home, pray, come back.
		He's Muslim.
		The shell-shocked dad said his son worked as a health technician inspecting restaurants and hotels, graduated from La Sierra High School in 2003.
		After police announced the two suspects, male and female, were dead following the car chase with shootout, into shootout, rather, with the police.
		The FBI began a search of the nearby Redlands apartment linked to the younger Baruch's family.
		So this is a fluid, ongoing story.
		Very, very fluid.
		Changing by the minute.
		But clearly, this is a Muslim who was involved.
		And so I think now you can, you know, nobody likes to racially profile.
		But, you know, it looks pretty clear to me.
		Now, CNN was doing a good job of coverage.
		I've got to give them credit today.
		And I, you know, sort of trash them a lot on the air, but I watch them a lot.
		I think they're the most in-middle to watch.
		And so I did watch Their coverage, and it was credible.
		As far as I know, they probably still have not named one of the dead suspects.
		But knowing that name and knowing then his history, or a little bit of history, that we could sort of scratch up on him, I think, you know, you hate to jump to conclusions, but this would appear to be a Paris-type attack, except in California, right?
		This time it's in California.
unidentified		So, let's see.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This would be the most dead since they killed the kids, right?
		Sandy Hook.
		And it would be the worst terrorist attack since 9-11, right?
		So at this hour, there's no way of knowing, you know, if what is suggested here by the man's name and the style of the attack, you know, the military garb, the high-powered ARs, the pipe bombs.
		They went through it pretty carefully on CNN and one person after another, except for one young lady who said she didn't care if she was wrong, said it's terrorism.
		International terrorism.
		And now it kind of looks that way.
		You know, you can't know until you know absolutely, but boy, it sure looks that way to me.
		So I guess I want to talk to you a little bit about this and see what you think.
		Now it's come to America.
		What is terrorism?
		Well, in this case, it was shooting a bunch of people who were just needing to do a little bit of good, right?
unidentified		I would say.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, it was a center for the disabled, right?
		So it's not exactly, it's just simply a soft target.
		That's how they come for us.
		Soft targets.
		And boy, baby, we're soft.
		I'm sorry, but it's true.
		I credit the police, the FBI, everybody who's down there doing their job.
		They are doing a great job.
		And two of the suspects, if it's only two, are dead.
		That's good.
		But this is terrorism now in America.
		This means you could walk into a supermarket.
		You could go to a crowded get-together football game, whatever.
		And if this has now come here, and it probably has, I'm not saying definitely, but it's sure looking that way to me, I think there are a lot of things we could talk about tonight, like what you think we ought to do, for example.
		So far, our role in what's going on in Syria, you know, in the middle of the caliphate, so-called, so-claimed caliphate, it's not much.
		I mean, we're bombing.
		And oh, by the way, the British just announced that as of at least tomorrow, a vote, I think it was in Parliament over there, 397 to 223, they will begin bombing in Syria as well.
		So now we'll have British jets over Syria, along with the French jets, the Russian jets, and the American jets.
		So that whole thing is going to get even more dangerous.
		But now we've got another problem.
		Now, if this is what it looks like it might be, I think it's time that we decide what we're going to do.
		This is now, it's about the homeland, right?
		It's about our homeland.
		So I don't think that what we're doing, we have a few special forces troops on the ground, and they spot targets and stuff like that.
		And maybe now a few more will be more in a fighting mode.
		But our president is very, very, very, very, very hesitant to send people on the ground in Syria.
		And I do get it, you know.
		Dangerous as hell, right?
		However, this is the homeland.
		I've sort of lived in a little personal terror for, I don't know, a while now.
		People doing stuff, firing rifle rounds off, threatening phone calls, you know, just someone out there outside, immediately outside my window.
		That's terror.
		So I know how it feels.
		And if this kind of thing continues, everybody's going to feel it.
		This would be a different situation.
		This is, well, since 9-11, which was a horrible, surreal event.
		But I don't know, somehow this is more personal.
		If that's what this is, is terrorism.
		It's way more personal.
		I mean, it doesn't matter.
		Think about it.
		What do you do?
		You go to football games occasionally?
		You get into crowds every now and then?
		Do you go to the grocery store?
		This is in San Bernardino, it just happened, right?
		So, again, I'm not saying absolutely what it is or isn't.
		I read you the name of the suspect.
		And every guy they had on CNN who was from the FBI, you know, usually they're retired FBI guys, right?
		Because the ones currently working for the FBI can't really comment.
		They're not allowed to.
		But the retired guys said, oh, boy, does this look like terrorism.
		When you have these kind of FBI assets deployed, this sort of number, yeah, this is probably terrorism.
		And now that we know the suspect's name, Syed Farouk, we know from his father that he was very, very religious, hadn't seen him much lately.
		I guess he's a recent divorced guy.
		But that's just a description of who probably did this, the suspect who killed these people.
		The reason he killed them is because of the propaganda coming out of, I should say possibly, and I mean that, coming out of Syria, the propaganda to just begin to go out and kill, go to places and take a high-powered rifle and kill.
		So I thought earlier tonight, after all of this and after learning what I have now learned, that it would be kind of, I really wanted to talk to Charles Ossman, but it just seemed not the right thing to do.
		And every now and then I do this, when something comes along like this, and I'm telling you, if it's what it is, this is really, really, really big.
		Because all of you out there are going to have to embrace the possibility that the war has come to our shore now in this manifestation of just walking in and killing at random, getting as many dead as you can.
		I wonder what they were doing, remaining in the car, remaining close by.
		That's a mystery.
		What they may have been going to do is to hit another place, you know, before they encountered the police.
		Well, it didn't work out, thankfully, that way for them.
	But that's a working theory.
	Nobody knows about this for sure.
	But I've told you to this hour what I can tell you.
	And now I will ask you what you think we should do.
	Are you satisfied with the few airstrikes we've been conducting?
	How many of these will have to happen before you decide that there is going to have to be massive action?
	They've been predicting this now for, boy, a long time.
	On the networks, all the talking heads have been predicting.
	We're really surprised it has not yet come to the U.S. Well, now it has.
unidentified		Maybe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let me give out the numbers, and I would like to have you comment about, I don't know, what you think of this, your opinion so far.
		I'm sure many, if not most, watched the coverage, didn't you?
		And then I want to know what you'd like to do.
unidentified		What do you think we ought to do?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Here it is on our soil again, but this time, again, I say it's different.
		Horrible as the 9-11 disaster was, this is a different kind of terrorism.
		This random killing.
		And I guess in a sense, that too was random, right?
		But expect it now.
		Grocery stores, you know, places where people meet?
		Happened in Paris.
		It sure happened here.
		So anyway, here come the numbers.
		I'm going to give you all the numbers.
		Anybody is welcome to call in any way they can get in.
		The national number is area code 952-225-5278.
		Once again, that's area code 952-225-5278.
		Are you writing that down?
		The first time caller line is area code 775-285-5800.
		775-285-5800.
		You may also use the Roswell entrance point.
		That would be area code 575-208-7787.
		I've got to have Ross do more work.
		Again, the special event line that I'll open for all of you, 575-208-7787.
		Skype, of course.
		Here's the way it works.
		If you've got a smart device of some sort, doesn't matter, Apple, Android, whatever, download Skype.
		When you get Skype, Skype is free, right?
		Go to your store and get it.
		It's free.
		And then when you do, you'll learn how to add people.
		A little plus sign when you go into Skype once you become familiar with it a little bit.
		And what's cool is this.
		After you've downloaded Skype, you can add us.
		If you're in North America, we are MITD51.
		It doesn't matter.
		Uppercase, lowercase.
		M-I-T-D-5-1.
		Outside the U.S. You know, it would be very, very interesting to hear from outside the United States tonight.
		Come to think of it.
		I guess they might want to comment on this kind of terrorism now apparently or seemingly arriving here in the U.S. right here in my backyard, I might say.
		I mean, for me, it's just over the hill.
		San Bernardino is just over the hill.
		So it's close.
		Anyway, if you're elsewhere in the world and would like to comment on what has happened thus far, we are at MITD 55.
		That's midnight in the desert 5-5.
		So that's what we're going to do tonight.
		We're going to comment on the world situation.
		Both what's going on in San Bernardino, unfortunately, and what's going on in Syria.
		We'll talk about all of it.
unidentified		We'll talk about all of it.
		bungalow.
		Midnight in the Desert doesn't screen calls.
		We trust you, but remember, the NSA well, you know.
		To call the show, please dial 1-952-225-5278.
		That's 1-952-CALL-ART.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, and since this is a special night, one more time, I'm going to remind you we have every line is full here, so still, we don't ever give these numbers.
		So our first time caller line, even though I just gave it, I want to give it again, it'd be a way to get through area code 77285-5800 or the Roswell entry point.
		Area code 575-208-7787.
		And of course, by Skype.
		And again, I would like to hear what people outside the country have to say.
		It looks as though, in my opinion, it looks as though we have just experienced our first terror attack of this kind.
		You know, the go in and kill as many people as you can type deal, and then get ready to give up your own life.
		A few things about this incident that are strange.
		Anyway, I'm sure you'll bring all this up.
		Stephen, you're on first on Skype, I think.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Hey, Ark.
unidentified		How are you doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm well, doing all right.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Hey, I just wanted to mention, you know, a couple of the analysts on CNN said that this Farid's Saeed Farouk was at the banquet, and something happened at the banquet, and he was disgruntled and left and came back.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		And I just, so a bunch of them, or several of the analysts, thought that it may have been a combination of both, that something upset him, he was disgruntled, and then he was so close to jihad anyway that it just pushed him over the edge.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm not saying that isn't so.
		We have yet to know.
		All we know is, you know, the guy's name, a little bit about him.
		You know, apparently life was not great.
		He was divorced, according to his dad, very religious.
		And so, yeah, you're right.
		I mean, I've heard, I watched, trust me, every minute of CNN today.
		I thought they did a very credible job of covering it all.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, me too.
		I had NBC going too, and NBC was way out front on a couple of things.
		But yeah, I thought they were pretty good.
		I did want to make one other comment, and that's the tendency to do this real motto, we should send a bunch of troops.
		I think there's a reason why they attacked Russia, France, and the United States.
		They're trying to get their recruiting up.
		And the more it's the world against them, their recruiting goes way up.
		And so I just think with the presidential hopefuls who are out there talking about this stuff, it's really easy to slip into that macho, you know, we should send down the thunder.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I know.
unidentified		I know, I know, I know, I know you're right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		On the other hand, what would you have us do?
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think it's a subtler deal.
		I think there has to be some way to compel the Arab nations, you know, the nations in the region to get more actively involved.
		You know, the Jordanians have 90,000, the Turks have a million-man army, the Saudis have a million-man army, and yet it's us.
		And, you know, they're Arabs.
		So why are, you know, somehow they've got to get in the game and they've got to lead this.
		It's got to be, you know, the regulation.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, all right.
		Let me interrupt you just a little bit.
		I agree with you.
		Those countries need to be more involved in stopping ISIS.
		Okay, I'm with you all the way.
		But this is here.
		And once it gets here, on an increasingly frequent basis, people are not going to be patient.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Well, I agree with you.
		I think that's complicated, but attacking over there, that isn't going to make the people here easier to detect and prevent.
		So I don't.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I don't have an argument for that.
		It's true.
		I mean, what you're saying is true.
		But you can't sit on our butts either.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't, you know, I get the feeling we work really hard.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		I have a funny feeling that they, you know, the security services are working, you know, triple overtime trying to detect.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No doubt about it.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		I just.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The trouble is detecting and then stopping this sort of thing is damn near impossible.
stephen in skype ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		Yeah.
		I don't know.
		I just think it'll be a challenge.
		But you know, some I wonder if there, you know, there was some way that it could be more of a, you could communicate the message that it's not religious, it's not in their faith to do that sort of thing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, Thank you very much for the call.
		I think we should communicate that to him.
		I don't know if it'll make a difference.
unidentified		Sweet dreams are made of these.
		Who am I to disagree?
		I travel the world and the seven seas.
		Everybody's looking for something.
		For something.
		Music I stopped the no man on the way.
		And the bottom song forgot the world.
		The clock strikes 12, and Midnight in the Desert is pounding Package Your Way on the Dark Matter Digital Network.
		To call the show, please direct your fingertips into the dial 1-952-225-5278.
		That's 1-952-Call Art.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It is, and my other lines, happy to give them to you.
		We are in open lines right now.
		So if you're a first-time caller to the program, area code 775-285-5800.
		If you want to come through Roswell, it's area code 575-208-7787.
		Skype?
		Yes, indeed.
		MITD 51 and or MITD55 if you're outside of North America.
		And I really do want to hear from the rest of the world and what they think of the fact that apparently or seemingly or possibly, highly possibly, the same kind of terrorism that the world has been enduring, most recently in Paris, now is here.
		So we can talk about that.
		We can talk, if you wish, about Syria because that's where all of this is coming from, right?
		It's being encouraged from Syria.
		The radical Muslims out there are getting the message out, and it's being received.
		Obviously, it got received in Paris.
		And apparently, or may have been received here.
		So we have this as a beginning.
		And what's going on in Syria, I want to talk to you about that too, because, and again, the British are about to start bombing, because I'm telling you, World War III can start there.
		And oh, by the way, the very center of ISIS's ideology is to bring about the end of the world.
		That's what they want, the end of the world.
		They want it to end.
		They want to be the agents that brings the end of the world.
		That's really what they believe.
		Nobody would believe that.
		That's crazy, right?
		I guess not.
		So let's quickly go to John.
		Hello, John.
unidentified		Good evening, Art.
unidentified		How you doing?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm doing okay.
		Can you get good and close to your mic, please?
		Yeah, is that better?
		A little better, yeah.
		Are you like on a laptop?
unidentified		No, on my computer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, on your computer.
unidentified		On Skype and listening to you on tune in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I see.
		All right.
		Well, that's the usual way, or the one way anyway.
		So when you talk, are you talking into like a microphone of a, you know, like, I don't know, a camera.
unidentified		It comes with this cheap little camera that sits on top of the computer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, now it's probably not the best.
		Okay, we're going to try and experiment.
		Can you just pick that up, you know, that camera, and talk into it?
		All right, now talk into it.
		Is that any better?
		Oh, maybe.
		You see, I do that on the air so that everybody can hear how much better it is, and then they do it.
		So go ahead.
unidentified		All righty.
		Well, I'll tell you, I live here in Porum, and I find myself getting a little callous to these killings.
		You know, you had Sandy Hook, you got all these crazy things going on with all these assault rifles.
		And I don't understand why that we can have people that are on a no-fly list still be able to walk into a gun show and buy an assault rifle.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You listen to the president, huh?
unidentified		Well, yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He's absolutely right about that, of course.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If you're on a no-fly list, then hell no, you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.
unidentified		Well, I was talking with some friends today earlier when we just heard about this thing starting up in San Bernardino, and we got to talking about guns.
unidentified		And, you know, you go to some of the political meetings here in this town, which I'm sure you've attended and stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, people have no idea.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		This is still the Wild West out here, isn't it, sir?
unidentified		Oh, yes.
		It's kind of crazy.
		And, you know, I can understand the people that they're really far out right wing, you know, being concerned about their guns.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's guns everywhere here.
unidentified		I don't think we need assault rifles, you know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, if the guy trying to get you has an assault rifle, probably.
unidentified		You know, I hear the Republicans talking about, you know, well, if everybody had a gun, you know, this wouldn't happen.
		I don't know.
		You know, I just kind of wonder what kind of society do they want to build.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there aren't many people who carry guns in San Bernardino.
		I'll tell you that.
		Here in Peru, Nevada, you know, there's a joke going around.
		Somebody will walk into Walmart and some recent person who moved here from, I don't know, California, for example, will go into Walmart and they'll see some guy wearing a gun and they call the sheriff.
unidentified		Oh my God, look at this guy wearing a gun.
		Well, is he shooting people?
		No.
		Well, I know I moved here from Iowa and it kind of upset me the first time I started looking around seeing guns in restaurants and stores.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't think they're the problem.
		People wanting to use them to murder.
		That's a big, big problem.
		Oh, uh-oh, you suddenly disappeared, kind of.
		I'm sorry, your audio just sounded bad.
		I don't know what happened.
		I'm going to guess you might have pulled the wire, so I'm sorry if I had you do that.
		Truly, I am.
		Well, okay, so let's go to the phone and say, Missoula, Montana, you are on the air.
		Hello.
unidentified		Yes, hello, sir.
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		Hi.
unidentified		Hi.
		Thank you for taking my call.
		You're welcome.
		Thank you.
		So it's kind of interesting that I should follow that gentleman who you just spoke to.
		I think in light of recent events, well, I would strongly advocate for firearms training for American citizens who are able and basically able to defend themselves.
		They may need it.
		I would concur.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's going to be two gigantic groups of people calling tonight if it's going to get to be about guns, and that's going to be the people who believe absolutely in the right and the people who think all guns should be taken away.
		And I'm not sure I want to exactly have that fight tonight.
		I'm pro-gun.
		I own guns.
		I wouldn't be without guns.
unidentified		I don't want to get into that fight as well.
		In fact, I don't want to go there at all.
		It's just it seems to me that with the recent events that have occurred in the world, these incidents have occurred in areas where they are gun-free zones.
		And I'm sorry to say that.
		I know that might offend a lot of people.
		But it's just the facts are as they are.
		I work with two Marines who actually strongly advocate that young men, unfortunately, do not join the service at this very moment due to the fact that their services may be needed here in the United States to defend the homeland other than go overseas and fight.
		And I think that's a terrible way of looking at the world, but unfortunately, I am personally sick and tired of these cowardly acts and what is going on in the world.
		And I, for one, would strongly advocate that citizens who want to be in a world where they don't have to worry about walking in the street would take care of themselves in a responsible fashion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		I am pro-gun.
		In other words, I think if you look, it's the Second Amendment.
		It's your right to have a gun, carry a gun.
		If you pass, you know, for example, I have a carry permit.
		My wife has a carry permit.
		I went to school, actually I've been to school many times, and you find out, you know, when it's legal to shoot, when it's not legal to shoot.
		You find out how to safely use the weapon.
		You find out how to efficiently use the weapon.
		You have to fire.
		So you have to go through some preparation to get a carry permit.
		And I don't want to get into that argument tonight about guns one way or the other.
		I simply believe that we should be allowed to have weapons if we can demonstrate that we are responsible.
		The guy who called up and repeated what the president said is right.
		You know, if you are on a no-fly list, well, probably you shouldn't be able to buy a gun.
		That's reasonable.
		But it's the small picture.
		The big picture is what are we going to do about this?
		It's here now.
		I think, in spades, maybe I'm wrong, and I hope that I'm proven to be wrong.
		But I'd be just willing to bet you this is international terrorism on our porch.
		Hello there, Paul.
		You're on air.
		Hello, Art.
unidentified		Hello, sir.
unidentified		How are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm fine.
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		I believe you spent time in the Philippines and would be familiar with a martial art called Kempo.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I am familiar with it, yes.
unidentified		All right.
unidentified		I've had a lifetime familiarity with it, and it is a universal martial art where we do a lot of strategic thinking.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, give me some strategic thinking about this situation, whether it's what just happened or Syria, you know, the Caliphate.
unidentified		I think in both cases, we need to respond, surely, with extreme prejudice.
		We need to go in and we need to attack them for the same ferocity that they have demonstrated here.
		And I believe here we have.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, surely you are not suggesting that we go and randomly kill Syrians.
unidentified		No.
unidentified		I would only say, and I don't want to get into this gun thing either, because, as you know, I'm in Kentucky, and that speaks for itself.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Pretty much.
unidentified		I do want to say that Admiral Yamamoto discouraged the Japanese in World War II from invading the West Coast by simply stating, as he was educated here, it is a fight we can never win.
		They will fight from every hill, from every tree, from every street, from every window, because he well knew that we were an armed society.
		And I also, because of your time in Asia, would, and it's redundant to even say this to you, it's embarrassing, but I'm saying it to everyone out there.
		The most polite society known to history was the Samura-driven society, because sword fights don't involve prolonged television-type exchanges, nor do knife fights.
		Generally, three moves, someone's down.
		Four moves at the most.
		It also has to do with hand-to-hand combat.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And so you apply this to this situation now.
unidentified		I believe the more sane citizens, better armed, are the biggest deterrent we can have.
		We simply don't have the police.
		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's the argument all over again, and I'll take it and not say you're wrong.
		I'll not say you're wrong.
		Look what's going on in Chicago.
		Chicago is a you really can't get a gun permit kind of place, right?
		Just like San Bernardino.
		Pretty much the same way, right?
		You want a permit to carry in San Bernardino, you better be a celebrity or have a lot of money or really have a serious reason to want to carry a gun.
		Look what's going on in Chicago again.
		Number of it's just crazy.
		So I understand the argument, folks.
		Ben Dorrigan, you're on there.
unidentified		Hello?
		Hi.
		Hi, Art.
		Art, this is a terrible day.
		Yeah, it is.
		It's a terrible day.
		I'm just praying for those people who lost their lives today.
		Well, I'm glad I live in the desert because I live actually in a smaller town than up the road, Redmond.
		And something like that can't happen here because we haven't been...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course it can happen there.
unidentified		Yeah, but not for long.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And again, you're going to make the same argument, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Because everybody up there is toting a weapon.
unidentified		But I'm going to take it a step further and say we really need to sort of export this out to the country.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm not looking.
		Okay, sir.
		Just pause for one moment, please.
		Everybody.
		Hold on, sir.
unidentified		Hold on.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Accept the fact that I agree with you that people who can demonstrate sanity and accuracy should be allowed to carry guns.
		I don't need that argument.
		And I agree with you.
		It may well be that if people down there had been armed, they would have been taken out more quickly.
		I don't know.
		So I accept that argument.
		So let's not argue the gun thing, okay?
unidentified		Okay.
unidentified		Well, then I'll just say I think these soft targets need to be hardened, and we need to do it on a national level.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, there's a job for you.
unidentified		Well, it's just going to have to happen because this is just going to continue to happen, and I think it needs to be nicked in the bud.
unidentified		Just get the Army out there and be there for a while.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You want the Army on the streets?
unidentified		Well, I don't know.
		National Guard, maybe.
		Or the police.
		Believe me, I was at Ground Zero on 9-11.
		I was up the West Side Highway a little bit over by the Intrepid and headed down there when it all happened.
		I saw it all happen.
		And when that was happening, there were planes everywhere flying over the city, flying over New Jersey, along New Jersey.
		And I was praying for an F-16 to come.
		And that's how people have to think.
		They just have to think this person with this AR-15 is necessary here.
		Because certainly, if anything ever happens, they're going to be glad they're there.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, that's true.
		Do you have any thoughts on other than, you know, you mentioned military or streets?
		A lot of people would object to that.
		In fact, once you start talking about that, there are going to be a lot of people that say, well, look at that, a false flag type deal done so that we can put military on the streets and control every movement of the American people.
		I guarantee you there are people dialing to say that right now.
unidentified		I understand that.
		I mean, I follow some of the conspiracy theories out there and false flag ideas.
		I did a little studying on 9-11 because I was so close to it.
		But really, you can see a false flag in anything.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, that's right.
		You can.
		They also think that Sandy Hook was false flag.
		I get that all the time.
unidentified		Yeah, yeah.
unidentified		But the thing is, the people getting killed are real.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
unidentified		And the forces out there that can stop this sort of thing are there, too.
		It's just that we're not seeing it realistically right now.
		We're still kind of like in a bubble here, in kind of a PC bubble, and it's crashing down around us.
		So at some point, we're going to have to get real.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, the bubble's about to break.
		I'm telling you, if this is our future, the American people will demand that a lot of things happen very quickly.
		And, boy, I'll tell you, brother, what's going on in Syria right now is so dangerous.
		And I don't mean, well, I do mean for every single soul that I'm speaking to right now, it could be World War III.
		And remember, those guys in black, sir, that's what they want, is World War III.
		The end of it.
unidentified		Well, I heard your show on global thermonuclear war, and I really have to have confidence that nobody's crazy enough to do that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But they are.
unidentified		I really do.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But, sir, they are.
		That's what you're not getting.
		They definitely are that crazy.
		That is the center of what they believe.
		They want to bring about the end of the world.
unidentified		I understand that, yeah.
		Well, I heard a great interview the other day.
		It was this person on the street he interviewed, and they asked what the solution would be.
		And he said, Let's just go over there and make it so the Syrians can go home.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And on that note, I've got to go not home, but to a break.
		Okay, so I'm sorry, there have been several people calling internationally, and I haven't gotten to you yet.
		Please call again.
		And that it's going totally berserk on Skype.
		So if you want to get in, I'll give you the numbers.
		I'm Mark Bell.
		is Midnight in the Desert.
unidentified		The End
		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		To call the show, if you're East of Midnight, call 1-952-Call Art.
		If you're west of midnight, call 1-952-225-5278.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all right.
		Top the hour, and let me tell you all, those of you I know some join at this hour.
		I observed the CNN coverage of what's occurred in Southern California today, beginning to end.
		About 20 minutes ahead of airtime, the Associated Press ran a story with the name of one of the dead man.
		It's Syed Farouk.
		Now, his dad has commented to a New York source that he was a very religious man.
		Prays a whole lot.
		Goes to mosque a lot.
		He is, according to the article we read from New York, a divorced fellow.
		Probably not in a great frame of mind.
		And his dad is shocked, of course, as most dads are when they find out somebody had something to do, you know, did something like this.
		They just go, oh my God, it can't be.
		Bottom line here is that, you know, terrorism has arrived.
		The personal, mindless kind of go into a grocery store or crowded arena and commit mayhem kind of terrorism is right here.
		So what do we, you know, I've canceled my guest.
		I'm sorry, it wouldn't be.
		Charles Osman was going to be here on and we're going to get him here.
		I promise you, we're going to reschedule Charles, but this is so important.
		Charles was going to talk about AI, artificial intelligence, and I'm asking you what you think we ought to do.
		And I'm getting some pretty surprising answers, I would say.
		So overseas, Joe, you're on air.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, hi, Joe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where are you?
unidentified		I'm in China.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		China?
unidentified		Wow.
		Yeah.
		I'm in Shenzhen, China.
		Can you hear me well?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, that's the factory town, right?
unidentified		Yes, it is.
		Yes.
		I'm here.
		I'm listening to you all the time.
		I'm so glad you're back on the air.
		You're a great man.
		I want to tell you a little story that I had.
		A couple of years ago, I was coming back from Poland, and I was sitting next to a man, and he was well-dressed, and he wanted to buy me a drink.
		Well, I know that they usually don't have a lot of money.
		And then he started to talk.
		He says, I'm a lawyer, and I'm from Russia.
		And he said, I hope, I wish that we would have guns.
		Otherwise, these people would have never done this to us.
		And he was talking about the Communist Party.
		I was really shocked when he said that to me.
		But I just wanted to...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I agree.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We need guns.
unidentified		Yeah, it happened in Croatia, too.
		Russia didn't attack them because everybody had a gun underneath their bed.
		And Tito said, okay, you want to come?
		He says, I've got 8 million men.
		They'll hit the streets.
		And they didn't attack and take Yugoslavia, Croatia at that time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know where you live.
		You know where you live.
		You can't have a gun.
unidentified		Oh, no, not here.
unidentified		But they have the real, real bad people have guns.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They always do.
unidentified		Yes, they do.
		And they'll kill you, you know.
		But the police are afraid to go where they're at.
		There's a little like, even in a big city like this, they call it a village.
		And they will attack the police.
		But they deal with them swiftly.
		You know, they put a bullet in their head.
		So I'm careful here.
		I teach English.
		I'm your age.
		I haven't given up.
		I haven't died yet.
		So I'm still working, and I think it's a good job.
		Yeah, essence of life.
		But I just want everybody to cheer up a little bit.
		Life isn't easy, and we have a great country.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		May I ask you a question?
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Are you getting good news there in China?
unidentified		Well, I would like to tell everyone that they love Obama.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They love the Chinese love Obama?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
unidentified		Oh, of course, because he's weak.
unidentified		But they really like Putin.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't want to get you in any trouble, but I mean, when I say are you getting good news there, I doubt you get CNN, for example, right?
unidentified		Yes, I can listen to CNN, anything.
unidentified		I got VPN, and that's how I can get out and Watch football games and all of that stuff, yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, now wait a minute.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They don't let football in?
unidentified		Well, they do, but it's a lot easier to get this in there.
unidentified		But they won't let a conservative station in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, no, huh?
unidentified		Fox is banned.
		Really?
		CNN isn't, but Fox is banned.
		You know, they're conservative.
		Like, the University of Chicago is very liberal, and they love the University of Chicago.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So Fox is banned in China.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		CNN isn't.
unidentified		Right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Incredible.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Incredible.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So if you've got CNN, then you're getting the news and you know everything that's happened here, right?
unidentified		Yes, I know everything's happening.
		My heart goes out to those people that got killed.
		I fought in Vietnam and I understand violence, and I still believe we should have a right to bear arms.
		It's really important for us.
		So our government can't take us.
		I'm not a paranoid human being, but you never know what can happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Listen, I'm with you all the way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that seems to be the argument that everybody wants to make.
unidentified		And everyone should have a brave heart.
		We have to be tough.
		We have to be strong.
		And we have to go forward.
		We can't go backwards.
		We can't feel sorry for everybody and bullies.
		My God, I don't know what's happening with our country.
		They don't have bullies here.
		They don't care about that stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, they probably shoot the bullies there.
unidentified		Yeah, and lawyers, you go to the zoo here and fall in a pit with a lion.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They shoot lawyers there?
unidentified		Oh, yeah, they have lawyers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, I mean, I said they shoot lawyers?
unidentified		No, no, no, no.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's what you said.
unidentified		No, no, they don't shoot lawyers.
		At least I don't think so.
		But they don't sue everybody here.
		And, you know, everybody's responsible for themselves.
		There's no socialism here.
		It is all they're capitalists, and they're growing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's pretty much pure communism, actually, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, it's modified communism.
unidentified		Yes, capitalism and exhilarating.
unidentified		If you came here, you would see all our buildings here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I've been there.
unidentified		Yes, it's amazing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How's the traffic, by the way?
unidentified		It's awful, but I'm right outside of Hong Kong.
unidentified		Hong Kong is really blazingly or terrifically crowded.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
unidentified		But it's different.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hearing about this horrible thing that's happened in San Bernardino does not surprise you.
unidentified		No, it doesn't.
		I mean, we have to be vigilant.
		We have to all be vigilant, not just sit there and take it like sheep.
		We have to be vigilant.
		We have to be aware.
		And we have to be protective of all our people.
		So I think we'll win in the end.
		I really have a lot of faith in our sense of waking.
		It's not just like the Japanese did in Pearl Harbor.
		I just think that we'll come out of this, but we will lose some people, I think.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I appreciate your call all the way from China, mainland China.
		See, that's what's really cool about this setup we've got.
		People can communicate to us from anywhere in the world.
		And so you don't just get the U.S. sort of take on it.
		You get the world's take on it.
		So if you're out in the world there, you want to call us, we are M-I-T-D-55 on Skype.
		That's M-I-T-D55.
		Calls are just slamming in.
		Actually, can't get a clear line.
		So let me try this.
		Somewhere in Wisconsin, I'm thinking you're on air.
unidentified		Well, hello.
		Is this Richard?
		I mean, is this Belf?
		Thanks.
		I think you're talking to me, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I don't know.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Richard's not here.
unidentified		Oh, yeah, Richard.
		Good, good, Mr. Belt.
		It's really an honor to talk to you.
		I just wanted to make a comment about the Founding Fathers.
		You know, they were single-shot pistols and muzzle loaders because they weren't these automatic weapons.
		Okay, so I'll just, I mean, I think we should get back to, you know, culture and the arts.
		And, you know, not this mentality of, you know, the hero.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're a little hard.
		You don't have a real good connection, sir.
		Either that or you're overly excited.
		I can't tell which.
unidentified		Well, I guess it's that.
		I've never talked on the radio before.
		But, you know, the superior warrior mentality, you know, right makes right, and that everything could be solved with a gun instead of into pets.
		They thought that 6,000 monasteries...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hold on for a second.
		I want to ask you a question because I can see where you're headed, okay?
		If you were in charge, and you're going to have to make this fast because you don't have a good connection, but if you were in charge, sir, and you could be a dictator and say, here's what's going to happen.
		Yeah, we're facing these people now who are going to come in and kill us in crowds and that sort of thing.
		What do we do?
		You're in charge.
		What would you do, sir?
unidentified		Well, I guarantee you, if all these hundreds of millions of guns that were in the country were banned, that this would have never happened.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		All right.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		And so there you go.
		Finally got the other side of it.
		Do you really think that's true?
		Are we going to end up in a gun rights argument tonight?
		Is that how this is going to go?
		He's obviously in favor of having all the guns taken.
		Said if they were all taken, boy, this wouldn't happen.
		Counter-argument, of course.
		Lots of gun-free zones.
unidentified		Right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Where you can't carry a gun?
		You can't own a gun even.
		A few places where you can't even own a gun.
		But wait, that's where all the crime Keeps happening.
		But we're not talking about crime right now.
		We're talking about mass terrorism, right?
		Roxanne, you're on the air.
unidentified		Oh, now you're on the day.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sorry.
unidentified		Definitely a sad day, my dear.
		But you know, Syria has a really big problem with refugees, and I really feel for them too, as well as terrorists that are killing the people here in America.
		But I'm thinking, you know, let's just get the president out of there.
		He's not wanted by anyone, really.
		He's not doing the Syrians any good.
		He ought to step down.
		He ought to get and relieve all those Syrians, get the ones that want out of there out, and let's just surround the country and just do like you do with a game of risk, you know?
		Well, wait a minute.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Wait, stop.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You said the president has to go.
unidentified		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Which president are you talking about?
unidentified		In Syria.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In Syria.
		Pasha.
		Al-Assad.
unidentified		Yes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		Well, you agree with the rest who watched CBS.
		I'm sorry.
		I'm wrong.
		It's us.
		We want him out.
		The only problem with that is, okay, I want you to address something for me if you really feel that way.
		If we get rid of Assad, I think it's probably doable.
		We could do it.
		But shouldn't we first look next door to Iraq?
		Because we got rid of that guy, right?
		And how did that turn out for us?
unidentified		Yes, but we didn't have Russia and China on the back door, did we?
		We didn't have World War III ready to start, did we?
		You know, I live next to the missile silos.
		If I see one of them boogers come up, I know it's the end, you know?
		So I'm not scared, but I'm seeing a lot of people on the internet talking about guns, talking about false flags.
		I'm tired.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know, I know.
unidentified		I'm proud of it, too.
		But, you know, I'm trying to get real here.
		Let's just clean it up, get everything out of there, ISIS, everybody, clean the borders up on Iraq, and let's get Iran on a good note.
		And let's say, hey, you know, I know the people in Iran.
		They're really nice people.
		It's the government that's doing their game or whatever with whoever.
		And they have their fingers in every pot.
		And they want this big pipeline of oil to go through Syria.
		Remember that?
		And so now everybody's saying, oh, well, that's why we're there.
		Well, we've got hundreds of thousands of refugees that have left everything they know.
		And we're not talking about just poor people.
		We're talking about people that own land.
		We're talking about people who love their land, who've been there for generations.
		This hurts, you know, them.
		So let's get rid of the bad boys, okay?
		And let's surround it with love.
		I don't know any other way.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, everybody else has been talking about guns.
unidentified		I know.
		And I knew you opened that can of worms.
		I knew that was going to happen.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm sorry, I didn't mean to do that.
		I mean, these people are calling on their own.
		I did not, you know, all I said was, what do we do about it?
		And the answer for everybody is, get your gun.
unidentified		Well, you know, get your gun, but use your brain.
		Guns don't kill people.
		People kill people.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right.
unidentified		That's a little overused.
		He was wonderful tonight.
		He made us laugh.
		That was the first laugh I had all day.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He did.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And he's a pretty brave soul, too, because they don't like you anyway.
unidentified		No.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He's brave.
unidentified		But anyway, I want to shout out to Art Bell Time Travelers Group on Facebook and also for people to get into artbells.com to buy the archives.
unidentified		They're worth every penny.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
		That's very sweet of you to say, and I agree with you.
		The archives are very worthy indeed.
		You can listen anytime you want to.
		And, of course, you can use the wormhole, which I guess I should be paying attention to, right?
unidentified		So let me take a look.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course, Art, you're going to have just gun debate callers.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People have lost the ability to think outside the talking points of the fascist talking heads on both sides.
unidentified		Ooh.
unidentified		The, um...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The gun argument that everybody should have a gun.
unidentified		Listen to me.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I agree with you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's not prolong the agony of this.
unidentified		I agree.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		If there were more guns by people who were sane, who were willing to carry one, because let me tell you something.
		It's not actually that much fun to have to carry a gun.
		It's quite a pain in the butt, quite literally.
		Any cop will tell you after the, I suppose, thrill of being able to carry a gun when they first become a cop, it quickly gets very, very old.
		I don't like carrying a gun.
		I'm authorized to do so, but I don't like it.
		On all kinds of levels, I don't like it.
		So I'm not going to argue with you about guns.
		Yes, of course it would help if more people had guns, knew how to use them properly, and then maybe fewer would die in these mass incidents.
		The big question is, what we're going to do about these mass things that keep occurring?
		This, I believe, is the beginning.
		By the way, one of you out there might update me.
		Have they yet on CNN decided to call it terrorism, suspected international terrorism?
		I had to leave coverage about, what, two hours ago?
		Even though I've got up-to-date and up-to-minute information, I don't know what they're saying.
		Okay, let's go to Dutch.
		Hello, Dutch.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hey, Art.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		It's great to finally talk to you.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		I have been listening since Charlie was a regular.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, my God.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Hey, I think you're right.
		I don't want this to turn into a gun debate.
		I think people need to think a little bit larger.
		It's a war.
		It finally happened on sacred, precious American soil.
unidentified		But the battlefield is here.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		It's San Bernardino.
		And that's the mindset we have to realize.
		The war has come to America.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		Well, let's just assume that most people, rational people, and I shouldn't assume this, but most of them are going to think that people having guns who know how to use them might save some lives.
		But the bigger question is how we're going to address this, what we're going to do in Syria.
		And that's where it's got to be addressed.
		It will continue here, but the genesis of this is without question in Syria.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The genesis is in what they believe, ISIS believes, and they want the end of the world.
		And they want us on the ground.
		They want our troops to fight.
		I know they want all that.
		Should we give it to them in spades or not?
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Let's take a step back.
		Yes and no, but let's take a step back, right?
		And I don't want to get political either, but...
		Whatever.
		The Obama administration, their narrative on Benghazi, right, we all know that it was a lie, right?
		They'll write that on the television on Sunday and told a lie and sold us that narrative.
		And it's not true.
		So here's the thing.
		What right-minded, thinking person on the planet is going to believe the narrative coming out of the administration right now?
		So we can't even trust the information coming from the national leadership.
		What we heard about Libya was...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		You said it was a lie.
		And, yeah, you know, kind of it was a lie.
		It was a spin.
		And, yeah, I think you're right to say it was a lie.
		And so we know our government does lie to us, right?
unidentified		I guess we have that disingenuous instead of lies.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We have that as a base, that they spin things the way they want them spun.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Yep, true.
		So how can we trust them with Libya, with Syria?
		How can we trust the narrative?
		So sending troops in under lies, disingenuousness, and false narratives, we're never going to get the people behind the real problems in the Middle East as long as it's knee-jerk reaction to the battlefield in San Bernardino or the battlefield and wherever it is that continues to happen in the United States.
		So the knee-jerk stuff is going to get us in trouble.
		It's not strategic thinking.
		It's not tactical thinking, right?
		It's knee-jerk stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Give me some strategic, tactical thinking.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		All right, so let's say that you looked at rather a military decision versus a political decision.
		The strategic agility in the military mind would suggest that the no-fly zones work.
		They also, one area Obama is probably right, you want to avoid World War III at all costs.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'll go for that.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		So, you know, how do we avoid Chamberlain's mistake and appeasement?
		You know, how do we do that, right?
		So what we do is we leverage our technology.
		We leverage our technology in the Middle East when with the Russians, and we create no-fly zones.
		And when we draw a red line, we stick to that red line.
		So maybe right now, Assad is the lesser of two evils.
		And so how do you prop up that government, make it safer, do no fly zones, and make this a real military issue, whether it's on the borders of Turkey, Syria, or Iraq?
		You know, that's the thing.
unidentified		So hold on, hold it, hold it.
		Stop, stop, stop, stop, stop.
		Stop.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Let's talk about no-fly zones for a second, because you said we should have a no-fly zone, right?
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, so let's say we announce no-fly zone and the Russians fly.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		What would you do?
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		So again, we come back to Chamberlain's problem.
unidentified		How do we...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, and we have a no-fly zone because you decreed it so.
		Now, the Russians just violated the no-fly zone.
		What do you do, Mr. President?
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Well, if there are American lives in danger, all right, if there's a real situation where American lives are in danger, you react one way.
		But if you take a look at the missile Cuban crisis, our planes took damage, our planes took bullets from the Cubans, but the pilots were ordered to not get shot.
		And by being ordered not to get shot, in essence they didn't report being shot, then they prevented a huge crisis in Cuba back in the 60s.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, and so then how would you move that thinking into a situation, Mr. President, where your no-fly zone has just been violated?
		Russia's flying jets like crazy, like they are right now.
		So what do we do?
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		So if American interests and lives aren't at danger and you break the no-fly zone, then you don't react militarily.
		Something happens behind doors, a conversation.
		You pick up the phone along those lines.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's not a no-fly zone.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Well, okay, so it's not that you ignore it again.
		We come back to Chamberlain, right?
		Do you appease an incident?
		Do you appease a tiny, itty-bitty, isolated incident?
		Or do you appease a policy that's protracted And can lead to dangerous places.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Mr. President, don't draw lines that you're not going to react to if they're crossed.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		Well, the first time American interests are attacked, whether it's Russian or Chinese or Iraq or Iran, then we have to react.
dutch in unknown ▲ ● ▼		But if there's no danger, then if it's an error or even if it's just a snub nose, sometimes you have to turn the other cheek and let it be able to work behind the scenes.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		I appreciate your call.
		And I can see that turned cheek.
		Yes, sir, sir.
		There'll be some reaction to that.
		Guarantee.
		Hi, you're on the air.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Art.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		How are you doing tonight?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you're listening, right?
unidentified		Yeah, it's kind of a sad.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		It's a sad evening tonight.
unidentified		It is.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		I've gone through enough with 9-11.
		I mean, I was, again, an NYPD veteran for 25 years.
		My name is John from New York.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		John, I hear the New York in you.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I have the slight twang of an accent, so to speak.
		But, yeah, I went through a lot with 9-11.
		I worked with the FBI Anti-Terrorist Task Force.
		I retired from PD.
		I still work in law enforcement in the city, though, within the city.
		I work in lower Manhattan, so there's always a threat down there of something going on.
		And I noticed a lot during 9-11 that working with the FBI, closely with them, and seeing what their mentality was, there was a problem in New York.
		The people couldn't handle the security that was involved in trying to stop stuff like this from happening.
		The tension level was through the roof at that time.
		I would come in, and you're probably familiar with Matt.
		Have you been here before?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Absolutely, yes.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		So I used to drive down in the patrol car, and we'd hit the 70s.
		This is like the day after 9-11, September 12th or so.
		We'd drive down through 72nd Street.
		Everything above 72nd Street was one big party.
		You had people in all the bars and the clubs.
		It was their way of venting.
		They were smoking, drinking, acting like nothing happened.
		You got past 72nd Street, and the city was a ghost town.
		It was like a morgue all the way down to Ground Zero.
		I spent four months down there working with this mess.
		And you could see that the tension level was so high.
		I mean, I saw a side of New York I never expected to see.
		You had people that were extra nice.
		They would cry, come up to you, and just hug you and thank you for helping.
		They'd fight over who's going to buy you a cup of coffee in the morning.
		The problem you had is that shortly after 9-11, the tension level was so high, they had no way to relieve it.
		Even the psychologists within the city were comforting each other because they didn't know how to handle it, went back to their old ways of doing things.
		They started to act like nothing happened.
		See, what you need to do in a country like this, you have to look at, and I use an example of Israel because they're a pretty good example of continuous terrorism.
unidentified		They are.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, they are.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's a prime example.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		And their security methods, to me, are some of the best you're going to get in the world.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They are?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, they're able, if you notice, and I hate to say it this way, but they don't smile that much when you see them.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		They're very serious people, a very serious group.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I found Israel to be an interesting place.
		Boy, you walk down the street and you see young kids with automatic weapons slung over their shoulder.
		You know, it's just like part of everyday life.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Well, exactly.
		That's what you're getting there.
		And if you listen to them when they had the latest group of attacks happening at the bus stops, they were encouraging their citizens to carry their weapons.
		Anybody that has a weapon we want you to carry.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
		Hey, listen, I'm coming up on a break.
		Can you hold on?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Sure, definitely.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I'm coming back to you in New York.
		Ex-New York TV knows what he's talking about.
		This is Midnight in the Desert, and we will be back.
		Okay.
unidentified		Okay.
		Midnight in the Desert doesn't screen calls.
		We trust you, but remember, the NSA.
		Well, you know.
		To call the show, please dial 1-952-225-5278.
		That's 1-952-CAL ART.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's hilarious.
		There was a little breakup in that.
		And actually, the way it was this time, when he mentioned NSA, it was like on the phone.
		Sorry.
		Finding a little humor in an otherwise horrible day.
		Horrible.
		We're talking about what happened in San Bernardino today.
		I followed every minute of it.
		And I've got a, I guess now retired cop in New York.
		Is that right?
		Retired, right?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Yes, retired, but still active in law enforcement.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		I have another job with the city in law enforcement.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You'd never really give it up, right?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		No, once it's in your blood, if you enjoy what you're doing, to me, I like helping people.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		So, I mean, I have a master's in psychology and just about finishing up a Ph.D. in clinical psych.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		So we have, I'd love your comments.
		I mean, I think this may be the beginning of these kinds of attacks, you know, on just crowds and just shooting a bunch of people, as many as you can.
		That's what we're facing, probably influence from Syria or maybe influence from Syria.
		It sure looks that way.
		Anyway, would you say if you could mandate what would be done, you would do?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Well, the first thing I would do is I would have to get the people of this country used to very heavy increases in security, which, again, the tolerance level in this country in general, I mean, it's a free country.
		Nobody likes military-style tactics.
		Nobody likes having to go through metal detectors all the time.
		But if you start looking at the type of attacks that are going to be happening, I've been saying it since 9-11, and the FBI task force I worked with at the time said, it's going to happen again, it's going to happen here, it's just a matter of time and when it's going to happen.
		And this was back then.
		And again, New York City, NYPD is very good at breaking stuff up before it happens.
		But it's still eventually going to happen.
		So me, I would start implementing where you're going to have to have security, armed security at loads of places.
		You're going to have to have armed security at schools.
		Any place where there's large gatherings of people, you're going to need metal detectors.
		The other thing is, I mean, what do you do with the subway system?
		Well, you could have metal detectors at the subway entrances because all you need to do is hit a couple of subways, couple of bridges, and a couple of locations at the same time, like they did in Paris and California type of thing.
		It'll bring the city to a standstill.
		As it is with the traffic jams in these big cities, they have enough trouble getting around.
		Picture an attack like that and eliminating a tunnel or a bridge or something.
		That's all you need.
		So they'd have to increase heavy security in that sense, metal detectors.
		To stop in the frisk laws that the mayor of this city just stopped, which I don't agree with that, you have to start increasing it because since he stopped it, the crime rate in the city has gone through the roof.
		And if you have a suspicion that somebody may be carrying something, there are many mornings, because I get up at 5 a.m., so I'm out early with the crowds.
		There are many mornings where I'll go to work and I'll see something because I take buses and trains to get to work in Toloa, Manhattan, if I'm not doing field work.
		So I'll see something on the subway.
		I mean, one day I saw boxes of metal stuff underneath the benches they have in the subway system.
		Other people just walk by it like nothing's going on.
		I'll stop.
		I'll call it in.
		I'll let the motorman know.
		I'll say, look, get PD down here.
		I'll call 911 myself, have them come down and shut the station down and let the bomb squad come in.
		This is stuff where people are not used to doing.
		I mean, they're not aware of their surroundings.
		They don't pay close enough attention to it.
		That's part of the problem you have.
		And people don't like to live like that.
		And I understand it.
		It's a factor of life that, I mean, it's changed a lot since when I was a kid growing up in the 60s and 70s, you know, 70s pretty much.
		You know, I was a kid growing up.
		Things were different back then.
		You know, you had your little things going on, but not to this extent.
		Now, what's changed that brought all this on?
		That's another thing you have to look at.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I want to look at that.
		I mean, you're right.
		So you're saying, look, get ready for it.
		Life is going to change in ways you may not like.
		It's going to have to.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		It is.
		There's no way around it.
		And until you get yourself prepared for that mental state, like I said, I saw it with 9-11 big time.
		And I saw how they returned to, like, they had security in the tunnels, the Holland Tunnel, Lincoln Tunnel.
		You had security where if you were PD or anybody with federal, you'd identify yourself and they'd let you go through the tunnels because the tunnels were off limits to anybody but emergency personnel.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sure, and I know they're prime targets.
		Look, we don't have a lot of time, but I do want to ask you about this.
		What would you think we should do in Syria?
		God, it's so dangerous over there.
		It's getting worse by the minute.
		And that's, frankly, where all this is coming from.
		This caliphate is where all this stuff is coming from.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Well, it's coming from Syria, but understand that prior to Syria, you had other countries that can't stand America and our beliefs and everything else.
		So you already have tons of terrorists that are pocketed in this country that people don't know about.
		They're homegrown.
		They're in the country.
		They have American passports.
		Now, you could go in and eliminate Syria.
		You could go in and take Bashad out and do what you have to do with this.
		But the problem you're going to have is Russia.
		Russia, you don't want to start World War III.
		That's another disaster you want to try to avoid.
		So it's a real, it's a chess game out there.
		It's a chess game in Syria because of the position that Russia's taking on things.
		China's taking on things.
		What do you actually do?
		Do you send the troops in?
		That might be an alternative to eliminate the Syrian problem.
		But you're still going to have all these people in this country that are already here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think originally we were all in favor of taking out Assad.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But, you know, I wonder if we thought it through, because we took out the leader there in Iraq, and that just didn't work out.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		That backfired.
		It wasn't a good thing.
		So you have to come to an agreement.
		They really should sit down with Putin, talk things out.
		But you have to look at, okay, is taking out the Syrian threat going to eliminate the threat to this country and the rest of the world?
unidentified		No.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		You have to wait.
		That's the factor you really need to take a close look at.
		What could be done to protect American lives, to protect French lives?
		You want to protect your citizens of your country.
		Now, do you close all immigration for a time?
		Because I'll be honest with you, there's really no way to completely vet a citizen from another country if they don't have any records on them.
		There's no way to safely do it.
		I don't care how many people from the NSA or the CIA and everybody else you have investigating them.
		Because now they're saying, well, we're going to do three years of vetting to get them in.
		It doesn't work that way.
		If you don't know their background, you're taking their word for stuff.
unidentified		So is that an answer to it?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		It's a tough spot.
		It's a really tough spot.
		And the only thing I could see logically to do, seriously, is prepare the people in this country.
		Now, in the meantime, if you get a sought out and do what you have to do there, all right, that may knock some of it down.
		But you still have to worry about the fanatics that are already here.
		Because in my view, there's a fine line between religion and fanaticism.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Boy, is there?
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		There's a very fine line.
		And believe me when I tell you, you could tell right away who's going to cross that line.
		With me, it's a gut feeling after all the years of doing what I've done.
		But if you watch closely, you'll see who gets angry with religion.
		Religion's supposed to be a peaceful thing.
		It's not supposed to be a violent thing.
		The ones that get angry and have such hostility That they want to hurt people, those are the ones you have to look at.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, they want the end of the world.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, they want the end of the world because they're going to get their seven virgins and be in paradise and everything else.
		And they have a view of life that is totally different from the majority.
		Now, what's the right view?
		You know, everybody could say, oh, it's my view is right.
		Their view is right.
		It's not even that.
		It's a matter of who's going to act on their view and take action to stop what's going on.
		But if this country would wake up more and get the security going, and if they could handle it, they really need to be able to handle an increased security level.
		Because I know New Yorkers in general were very resilient people in this city, but they walked around.
		When I was working with the FBI group, the terrorist task force, they said to me, John, you know, I got to tell you, they said in the last week, the security level in the tunnels have dropped.
		That was the point I was trying to bring out, that there was a while where all you had to do was hold up a badge.
		They weren't stopping you, weren't checking your ID cards.
		This was in the week after the attacks.
		They were letting anybody that held something up go through without checking them.
		And they said, this is not the way to be.
		And I agreed with them 100%.
		He said, you know, this is why you can't, people in general, not just New Yorkers in general, do you think people in where you're located in Nevada, do you think they could handle increased security?
		Could they handle metal detectors?
		Would they like to see that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think they could handle metal detectors, but if it gets to the degree that it is in Israel, not so much.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		Exactly.
		And like I say, I use New York as the example because that 72nd Street was the benchmark for me.
		When I saw them relieving stress by drinking and smoking and increasing their partying and then going to a ghost town down below, you could see the tension levels were through the roof.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Look, you're a caller.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're one of the best callers I've ever had, but I'm going to have to go become a regular caller.
john in new york ▲ ● ▼		I called last night for the first time in a while, so I'm glad I've had you back on the air.
		I spoke to you during Todd's visit last night.
		It was very interesting.
unidentified		I enjoyed the evening.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you, and thank you, brother, for calling.
		I mean that.
		All right.
		Very quickly, John, thank you to my producer, John Liebert.
		MDPC is a forensic psychiatrist and the author of Suicidal Mass Murders, a criminological study of why they kill Arts of Darkness, why kids are becoming mass murderers, and is a specialist dealing with the homizotically insane terrorist attacks that are going on.
		And so here he is, if I press the right button, I hope.
		John, Doctor, welcome to the show.
unidentified		Thank you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's good to have you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And I take it you've been following the news in your line of study all day like crazy.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Yes, I have been able to follow it very closely since about noon today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So, okay, what do you make of it so far?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		It's very different than the hundreds of cases that I've been studying and following since 2008 when I first began researching and writing about the subject of suicidal rampage murders.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know that this is an accurate figure, but I heard on CNN earlier today that out of the last 200 and some odd incidents of the type you just described, almost all of them were committed by single mentally disturbed people.
		And so that makes this, of course, very, very rare.
		Is that a fair statement?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
		With the exception of 911 and the Boston bombings, those, I believe, are a category unto themselves.
		The Fort Hood shootings, Major Hassan, and I would say that Dylan Roof down in South Carolina is a little bit off the meter too.
		Not sure about him.
		But the rest of them, for the most part, including this last guy in Colorado Springs, these people are diagnosable and more likely than not psychotic.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So generally, a single crazy person.
		This was at least two, possibly three.
		I'm not up on the latest news, but I know that it's...
		Two.
		Syed Farooq, who is dead, and Rashid Malik, I believe it is, also dead.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Correct.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And you're thinking, we talked just before you got on the air, that they're married?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		That's what the police chief said in the last hearing.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay.
		There's also a story out there that they were divorced, that he was divorced from her.
		So I guess we'll find out ultimately what is true.
		But, you know, what does this, to you, fit?
		What fits when we look at what we've seen so far?
		Is this probably internationally inspired terrorism?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		I think it's internationally inspired terrorism.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Is it internationally controlled terrorism that remains to be seen?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Either way, though, it's the same end effect, end effect, somebody going out and just killing a bunch of innocent people.
		So whether it's influenced or directly controlled, I kind of doubt it's directly controlled, and that's only a guess on my part.
		But either way, it goes back to the same sort of place.
		I mean, back to what's going on in Syria.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		It goes back to Paris, I think.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		There was a woman involved in that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, it could well be.
		Could well be.
		You're right.
		There was a woman involved in that.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		She committed suicide, too.
		I consider the suicidal mass murderer.
		These people could have easily gotten out of town.
		They had plenty of time.
		They were at the right place.
		I was really quite surprised that they hung around.
		They had to know that they were going to die.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Do you think they did know they were going to die?
		And do you think there's a chance?
		Chance they were going to try and commit another attack when they got?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Oh, I think that they planned to have another attack, but I don't think that they planned to live.
		I mean, I don't think that they were, you know, I don't think that they were, you know, completing their, had completed their mission.
		But if they really wanted to do some national damage, make a footprint nationally, you know, they hit the intersection of 215 and Highway 10.
		And I was expecting to read about them passing through Phoenix on our evening news.
		That would have been just about the right time.
		It's not that hard to get from that intersection to Phoenix in that amount of time.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They could have made it to where I am.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		If they had gone up 215, they could have.
		If they had gone east on 10, they could have come where I am.
		Okay, I have a big selected their target based on logistics.
unidentified		That does not appear to be correct.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Doctor, you're an expert at this sort of thing, and the United States has a very large number of, you know, what I call headshakers, mass murders, where generally the person committing is going to, they know they're going to end up dead, and usually by their own hand.
		It's almost unique to America.
		It's mostly involving males, not so many females involved.
		So it is unusual from that point of view.
		Here is my question for you.
		I also, as an adult, have lived many years in the Philippines, where conditions are much worse economically than here.
		And when I say much worse, I mean people survive like on $2 a day.
		But they don't have mass murders other than military action once in a while.
		They don't have mass murderers.
		And there's some cultural difference between here and there that I would love to see examined that.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Is that true in the south?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of the Philippines?
		Yeah, you go down to the southern part of the Philippines, and Abu Saeef may well grab you and chop your head off.
		But what I'm, you know, that's a political, contentious, military kind of thing.
		What I'm talking about is people who just decide to go berserk and go out and kill as many people as they can before they are themselves killed.
		Yeah, there's not much of that going on, Doctor.
		And I wonder why in that, you know, it's 94 million people or more now.
		So it's a big sample.
		Why don't they have it?
		And we have so much of it.
		Any thoughts?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, if you're looking at it from the perspective of transcultural psychiatry, comparing one society and culture to another, you know, you can dial back to the Society Islands back in the, there's a literature out of there back in the 70s during the Vietnam War when we were, again, during that period of time, we were interested in violence.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Doctor, I'm sorry, we have a very short break.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A few minutes.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Okay, go ahead.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		A two minutes, and I'll bring you right back.
		So stay right there.
		Think about what I said and see if you have an answer.
		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		With us at the moment, Dr. John Liebert, who's an expert on this sort of thing.
		You're right back.
unidentified		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		To call the show.
		If you're East at midnight, call 1-952.
		Call Art.
		If you're West of Midnight, call 1-952-225-5278.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm on the line with Dr. John Liebert, who is an expert on this sort of thing.
		That is mass murders and terrorist attacks.
		He's back on, and if you want to expand on why there might be this incredible difference in what's going on in America, I'd love to hear it.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Sure.
		Well, of course, this is, you know, theoretical.
		I've never thought of comparing the Philippines with the United States.
		However, I think that it's a valid comparison.
		What you're saying could very well likely be true.
unidentified		I mean, well, I take your word for it.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		The Society Islands, when they were studied back in the days of Vietnam, another time, a period of history when we had riots on campus, Vietnam, etc., violence was a big issue in psychiatry, so we were studying it at that time, and now we're studying it again.
		But at that time, we were looking at the Society Islands.
		I believe it's French Polynesia now, and that was really basically before the tourist industry had moved in.
		It was a little bit more pure culture.
		And in comparing the United States society to the Society Islands of that time, there was close to zero in the way of assault, close to zero in the way of mental illness.
		They just simply did not have the problems we're talking about.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I get it.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		And the theory being that there were three factors, symmetry, intensity, and competitiveness.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		The Society Islands, people did not compete.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, let's leave those islands for a moment and leave the Philippines as well, Doctor.
		Let's talk for a second about Japan.
		Japan is one of the most intensely, from a business perspective, it's one of the most intensely competitive countries in the world.
		I know Japanese very well, and they're really, really competitive.
		But they too almost never commit mass murder.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Well, of course, they had that very bizarre incident with a sarin gas.
		That was a cult.
		And, of course, again, you have to get screened out.
		We have a little bit more transparency here.
		But, yeah, I would say that Japan is probably, I'd feel safer walking around the streets there.
		But you've got synergy there.
		Japan, they're pretty, you know, except for the Korean population, which is pretty small, they're all Japanese.
		You know, I think that what's the North Korean population of almost entirely North Korean.
		I know, but that's like 1% of the country.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You mean in terms of population factory in Japan?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Very tiny.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it's very small.
		Other than that, they're all Japanese and tourists.
		And so you've got, you know, like the Society Islands, you've got symmetry and, you know, a synergistic population.
		Our population, for better or for worse, is, you know, I mean, it's almost like a national mission today to be diverse.
		I mean, look what's going on in our university campuses.
		You can't go on to the University of California campus or Harvard campus and give a lecture on turning back the clock and reducing the diversity on campus.
		I mean, you'd get run off the campus.
		And so, for better or for worse, our population is not synergistic.
		We're moving in the other direction.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you think it's our individuality that is the culprit?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Well, I think there are many, many factors involved.
		But you were comparing the Philippines to the United States from a sociological or the cultural point of view.
		I'm just addressing that.
		There are other factors in the United States, but if you're looking at it from the point of view of other nations, I mean, we're moving towards diversity on our campuses.
		It's almost like an academic mission.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But you're laying out diversity as really the basic problem.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		No, I don't think it's the basic problem.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		It's a cultural problem because you're referring to the Philippines.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, okay, you can drop the Philippines.
		Look, it's 94 or better.
		You're 100 million people.
		They're about 90% Catholic, 86%, something like that, Catholic, actually.
		That's why I compare the Philippines, because I live there and I know it.
		So they just don't have these kind of mass murders.
		And I'm just curious if you might have a thought about, you know, they're pretty individual over there.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		I do think that the analogy to the Society Islands is a factor.
		The asymmetry, the asynergy, the competitiveness, and the intensity of interpersonal relations that you have in the tropical areas that aren't too affected by modernism and tourism,
		they have a lower incidence of this type of behavior.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Almost zero, actually.
		But don't get me wrong.
		You can get your pocket picked.
		There's plenty of crime that goes of that type, but not the violent crime, not the mass murder.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		But there's a purpose in that.
		It's robbery.
		And that's very different than what we're talking about.
unidentified		It is.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, then let me ask you this.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In the 80s, President Ronald Reagan more or less emptied out the psychiatric hospitals.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		That's a whole different issue.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, is it really?
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Why is it a very different issue.
		Why?
		Well, because public psychiatry, for a number of complex reasons, doesn't exist anymore.
		And we used to have state psychiatric institutions, some of which were better than anything we have now for the seriously mentally ill.
		And then we had some horrible places.
		But there was a movement, a store, to shut down the institutions because they were so horrible.
		So there were some activists, mostly psychiatrists, just a few.
		And then there was John Kennedy, got into office.
		And he had a great deal of concern and burden with his oldest sister, Rosemary, who was mentally ill and institutionalized, had a frontal lobotomy.
		And he was easy.
		He was a very soft touch for this group that wanted to close the state institutions and replace it with a better system.
		And I mean, the timing couldn't have been better or it couldn't have been worse.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Is that what we did?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		We replaced it with better.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		We got rid of the state institutions and we replaced it with a federal mental health system that really did get up and running because the President of the United States was fully behind it for personal reasons.
		And the only problem is that this mental health center, mental health system was not designed properly.
		It didn't do what it was supposed to do.
		It didn't take care of the seriously mentally ill.
		It became sort of, you know, a place where, you know, anybody could go and become a famous psychoanalyst and have their own little practice and that kind of thing.
		And it didn't do what it was supposed to do.
		It didn't take care of the patients who were dumped out of the state institutions.
		Reagan enclosed the institution so much as he did support the elimination of involuntary commitment.
		That's another issue.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, all right, Doctor, I'm still out of time.
		I've got to run, but I want to thank you for appearing on the program tonight.
		And we may well come back and consult you as we continue to discuss this.
unidentified		Thank you.
dr john liebert ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, but it is true that our public psychiatric system is basically gone.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah.
		Thank you.
		Thank you, Doctor.
unidentified		Trust me, I get that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Most of the mass murders are frankly done by very mentally ill individuals.
		So there, at the very last, he sort of got to the point I was trying to get to somewhat earlier.
		Hello in Las Vegas.
		You're on the air.
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		Art, good evening.
unidentified		How are you?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm okay.
unidentified		How are you?
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		I'm confused.
unidentified		I don't know what our zeitgeist is going to be this week.
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		I'm trying to wrap my head around the idea of putting things into three different columns.
		9-11, the Boston Marathon bombing, the Times Square SUV, the Ford Hood.
		That was Islamist Jihad.
		Then we get down to Columbine, Virginia Tech, Aurora, Sandy Hook, Oregon Community College, University of Seattle, and on and on and on.
		All right.
		Now, these were, I presumably, these were white young men.
		And let's take the presumption that they were a Christian family of some sort or Christian beliefs.
		Third column, you have Charleston, South Carolina, you have Ferguson, you have Chicago, you have Cleveland.
		This is a racial issue.
		It's still, all of this, in a sense, is a community form of terrorism.
		Where San Bernardino falls into, I have no idea, because this could be merely a very emotional, upset Middle Eastern man who's very down on his luck and goes, okay, I'm going out.
		I want to be famous.
		I've been nothing all my life.
		I knew a lot of Saudis and some guys from Abu Dhabi when I went to college.
		Great guys, but tremendously emotional.
		Generous to a fault, but also extremely volatile.
		And sometimes took things the wrong way.
		And we're immediately ready to either draw blood or give you a bottle of scotch.
		It was one way or the other.
		Then there's something else that was, you were talking to this doctor.
		Do you remember way back when we had an issue in Northern Ireland with chin pain?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes.
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		And, okay, this went on for 87 years with the, and that was vicious, that was as vicious warfare or as bad a terrorism as you can imagine any other place on earth.
unidentified		Right.
joe wbet in las vegas ▲ ● ▼		You know, Clinton brokered the deal in 94.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Right, okay.
		So your point, overall point is?
		Well, I will give you that, sir, but I'm telling you right now, this is the beginning of a new level.
		Something, well, the New York cop, I thought, made a very good point.
		He said the American people are going to have to get used to a level of security that they can't even imagine.
		And we're not going to take to it well.
		And I agree with him.
		We're not going to take to it well at all.
		And yet, I'm not sure what the alternative is.
		So I'm leaving it up to all of you, just taking calls.
		You've seen what's, you know, occurred.
		You probably have your own view of what's going on.
		And Dale's been waiting a long time on Skype.
		Dale, hi.
		Hey, Art.
unidentified		How are you doing today?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Everybody asked me that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Sore back a little bit, and the knee's bothering me, and, you know, my right toe, I don't know about that.
unidentified		Put some of that lumen light on it.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Go ahead, sir.
unidentified		So I got a little bit different take on this than the police officer had.
		And my thinking goes back to the days of the neocons where we thought that our best security lay in basically controlling everything.
		And I don't think that worked out well.
		I think what we need to do is mind our own fences, build a wall, seal the border, let people through who have acceptable documentation.
		And I take the other gentleman's point that that's going to be a problem.
		But we should start by slamming the door and then gradually letting more and more people in.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, I think that is probably what makes Trump so popular, taking that point of view.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And as these things keep happening, I think that this is like cha-ching, cha-ching, cha-ching, voters going to Trump, I would think.
unidentified		Probably.
		And then I would purge the suspicious people who've entered from Syria and that area of the world, known trouble spots for the last two years.
		And again, be very conservative about that.
		And then I don't think the police are going to be able to protect us unless we activate the National Guard and we become like any other European state with people with machine guns all over the place.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I know.
unidentified		And I don't think everybody carrying weapons would that's not controllable.
unidentified		We're going to have the liberals running around.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, yeah, look, we've got the Second Amendment.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		People are going to own weapons.
unidentified		How about concealed carry?
		Let's encourage people to get the training.
		Agree.
		Yeah.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I agree with you.
		100%.
		You're not going to get any argument with me.
		If somebody knows how to handle a gun, they've got a clean record, let them carry a gun.
		And maybe they stop something like this.
		And now in San Bernardino, in California, probably nearly, well, lots of cops, of course.
		We saw them all.
		But, I mean, in terms of people in that area who might have had guns, almost zero.
unidentified		Yeah.
		Yep.
		Yep.
		There'll be weak spots, of course.
		And then I don't think we need the oil out of the Middle East anymore.
		I would try and gradually stop invading countries there and let the Russians run things.
		It's their backyard.
		Let's let them take a lead.
		And I'm sure Putin would jump at that if we went over the market.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		He has jumped at that.
		He has jumped at it.
		But at the time, he said, let the Russians go bomb the hell out of ISIS, right?
		The trouble is that they're not bombing ISIS.
unidentified		Yeah, they're helping us to death.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That's right.
		Exactly right, sir.
		And then on top of all this, and more important even than this, awful as it is, you know, we're kind of on the edge of the possibility of a world war here.
unidentified		Yeah.
		And I don't, you know, my thought on that is like, Turkey, you shot down a Russian plane.
		Yeah, I know it was over your airspace.
		I know this.
		I know that.
		But you don't shoot down Russian planes.
		So, you know, staying out of World War III, that has to be the bottom line.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, so now we've got Russia that has brought these horrid, hardly accurate missiles in.
		Hitget Mach 5.
		And what happens if, I don't know, if they shoot down an American jet?
unidentified		Then we say you're sorry, and we go on.
		Yeah.
		Yeah, I mean, we're not going to get the people.
		Then the guys, the pilots flying that plane, would want us to not start World War III.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I don't want to start World War III, but I'm telling you, it's in the soup over there.
unidentified		Yep.
		Yep.
		You are right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And so what do we do here back in the homeland?
		Do we turn it into Israel?
		I've been there.
		It's kind of uncomfortable, actually.
unidentified		Yeah.
		No, and that's why I don't think the police can solve it.
		I don't think that's the right tool.
		I think the right tool is becoming situationally aware, getting the training to conceal carry, and more people doing that.
		We have to arm ourselves, as they say, because no one else here will save us.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, no, you're wrong.
		Everybody's saying it.
		Thank you.
		Everybody's saying it, right?
		Of my callers tonight, I would say, and I think I'm being conservative, that about 80% of them are calling for as much gun ownership as possible.
		I'm not necessarily against that idea.
		I just don't think that it's going to solve a lot.
		It makes you feel better.
		But if we have to fear going to the supermarket or going to a baseball game or a football game or just, you know, going on downtown into an area where there's a crowd, something that would attract people who want to kill for no reason, well, no reason that we in the West understand very well.
		How about that?
		Let's go on the phone to Anchorage, Alaska.
		Hello.
unidentified		Art.
		Yes.
		Art Bell timeless.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I don't know about Timeless.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I feel the clock ticking, sir.
unidentified		No, no, no, Art.
		You've resided this long, hundreds of thousands of people you've talked to and helped, and I think you're timeless.
		Now, real quick before I forget, the first thing I want to do is let them know my heart goes out to those people that were innocent and got hurt, okay?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Of course, yes.
unidentified		I think that sometimes we forget that.
		The next thing I want to say to you, Art is that, you know, I love talk radio for a multitude of reasons.
		My friends have turned home to hear your show, and they said, geez, Paul, why don't you hear me to get to Art Bell?
		It's just a talk show.
		And I told them, you know, in your world it is, but in my world, when you talk to Art Bell, there's about 100 other alien races out there, and some of them are just coming out of light wart speed, and they're all reaching over to switch on the switch for the Art Bell talk show.
		So if they are out there, I want them to hone in on my frequency, and I want to make contact, goddammit.
		So, you know, on the more lights, I just want to get that out there, okay?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		Well, if you get there, sir, ask them about their culture.
		Ask them how it's working for them.
		Ask them what they're doing about this kind of problem.
		Or, since they probably don't have this kind of problem, ask them why they think we do.
		Quake, your turn on Skype.
unidentified		Good evening, Art.
		Calling from Canada, and I just want to offer a bit of solidarity to our best neighbors down in the south there.
		Really sorry that this stuff is going on, and it's a damn tragedy, to be honest.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It sure is.
unidentified		I just wanted to bring a little bit of history on the subject surrounding ISIS.
		There's been a lot of misconception, and you've been saying a lot that they're trying to bring about the end of the world and doom cult.
		And that's just not factually true.
		It's not what they're based around.
		It's not what they're based around here.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		No, sir.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's true.
unidentified		Okay.
		What they want to do is spread Islam across the entire planet.
		And while us in the West, you know, we can see that as definitely it's the end of our world, they're not trying to bring about some sort of end of the book of Revelations.
		And I'm going to quote directly from their Hadith.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I'm going to quote directly from anybody can quote from anything.
		The fact of the matter is, that is what they want.
		They have made their own interpretation that includes bringing about the end of days.
unidentified		There's nothing in anything that is written in the world.
		You will not read.
		There's nothing in any of their literature which states that.
		I don't think that that's what they're going for.
		I just wanted to clear that, that they want to spread Islam as far and wide as they possibly can around the world.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, certainly they do have had the attitude that either you convert or you die, right?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They've had that attitude.
unidentified		And they're done with the converting part because they're also killing Muslims.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I think, sir, that they have concluded that we're not going to convert.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And that leaves us with the die part.
unidentified		Indeed.
		And secondly, I wanted to point out that there's definitely going to be no Russia versus the United States or Warsaw Pact versus NATO because Putin, as despotic as he seems and as much of an iron grip as he seems to have on Russia, if you look at his popularity with the Russians, he's constantly polling at 80, 90% because they like the smart moves that he's playing.
		But they understand that if you go to war with NATO, if you go to war with the United States, Putin will be flat on his butt outside of the Kremlin in less than 12 hours.
		There's no way the Russian people would go along with that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, it would only take one insane moment.
		I'm not convinced that Putin is completely sane.
		Are you, really?
unidentified		I think he's actually quite sane.
		He might be one of the sanest of the Western leaders right now.
		I mean, you don't get to survive 25-plus years in the KGB and then the FSB.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The way you survive in the KGB.
unidentified		And as Putin had said, if you're a KGB, you're always KGB.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
		I believe you.
		And the way you survive is taking out those who disagree with you.
unidentified		That's a little bit sociopathic and not psychotic.
unidentified		And it's the sociopaths that seem to make the best leaders and not the psychopaths.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They make the best leaders, huh?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, okay.
unidentified		All right.
		Anyways, thanks for having me on, Art.
		There's a whole lot to talk about, but I don't want to take on the air.
		Just no sorry about that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Leave me with that, sir.
		Associopaths make the best leaders.
		I'll accept that.
		I'll accept the fact that you said that.
		Let's go to North Day down south in Florida, I think.
unidentified		Hi.
		Hello.
		Is this me?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, only you know that for sure, but it sounds like you, sir.
unidentified		Okay, good.
unidentified		Well, it's a pleasure and honor to talk to you.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
unidentified		Listen to your ears.
		Okay, this is a rather interesting situation because I think that all the Muslims that were grown in North Africa and the Middle East, that Obama has set these things up, plus Soros, they spent billions there with non-governmental organizations and movements, and then they set the fire.
		And they're pushing them up into Europe as well as Obama supporting ISIS by leaving the weapons there for DOM and things.
		A lot of things have resulted in Obama spreading Islam more than any other caliph in centuries.
		So they're moving up into Europe.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I'm not sure it's fair to say that Obama left the weapons there knowing that they would be taken by these guys in black.
		How could he possibly have known that?
		I'm not a gigantic Obama fan, but after all, sir, this war and those weapons and that money that they got their hands on, all of that stuff, you know, that was kind of there already.
		And the Iraqis turned tail and ran, and that's how they got it.
unidentified		Which was to be expected.
		And I think some of our military expected that, but there was nothing they could do.
		But this whole thing has resulted in tremendous stress throughout Europe and the United States.
		We've brought in, since 9-11, 3 million Muslims, plus she wants another million or more.
		And Hama Abaddon says she wants as many Syrian refugees as possible.
		That's Hillary's main advisor.
		It's all part of Hijrah, which is Muslim conquest by immigration, which is how they started Islam when they took over what's called Medina now.
		They made a peace treaty, and then halfway through they slaughtered two of the three tribes.
		This is to be expected.
		I mean, I think.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, so cutting through everything as quickly as I can, you think Obama is trying to spread Islam as best he can by his own actions.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		In other words, you think he's Muslim, right?
unidentified		I don't know if he's Muslim or not, but by his actions, he's done these things.
		Either he's incredibly incompetent or he's following somebody's instructions or he's intentionally doing it.
		It's just that the end result is what's happened.
		Different decisions made since his first day in office would have resulted in an entirely different world.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, I can't stand behind all his decisions.
		That's for sure, and I don't.
		All right.
		Bottom-of-the-hour break.
		So we're talking, you and I, all of us talking about what has happened today and where it's going.
		If you want to join in, area code 952-225-5278.
		National number.
		Outside the country, M-I-T-D55 on Skype.
		Love to hear from you outside the country.
		We'll be right back.
unidentified		We'll be right back.
		I need to come to America.
		Never looking back again.
		Welcome to America.
		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		To call the Joe.
		If you're east of midnight, call 1-952-Call Art.
		If you're west of midnight, call 1-952-225-5278.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Now, Eye of the Storm.
		Something to think about.
		Good evening, good morning, good afternoon, wherever in the world you are.
		I'm Art Bell.
		This is Midnight in the Desert.
		We're talking about what happened in San Bernardino and a lot more.
		Actually, we're talking about why it happened, and we're talking about what to do about it.
		Everybody seems pretty much in favor, well, save one guy, of gun control.
		So, you know, it's kind of useless to go down that road.
		We can, if you wish, but I'm hoping not.
		Hold off the false flags if you can.
		And back to the phones we go.
		Hello, Bill.
unidentified		Hey, how you doing, Arn?
		I'm doing okay.
		I'd like to tell you about how I'd like to agree with the person who spoke about how mental illness played a big part in what happened tonight.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How's that?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		How did it?
unidentified		Well, desperation, it takes a certain kind of person with a certain kind of disposition to do something like that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, that's for sure.
unidentified		And it takes a certain kind of desperation, and that desperation is very prevalent in our society.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, I want to back up for a second.
		I don't want to have it thought that I'm saying that what happened tonight was a result of mental illness.
		I have the feeling, sir, that what happened tonight is a result of somebody who believes in a new ideology spreading across the world very quickly now that's coming out of its home in Syria.
		That's what I believe.
		That's what I think.
		I don't think it's mental illness to be committed to an idea, horrible as that idea may be.
unidentified		Understood, Art.
unidentified		I meant that I was responding to the man that you had on, the doctor.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		The doctor, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, and he was kind of talking about that, and I kind of wanted to agree with him that it's a very strong, it's a very strong thing when people are desperate, especially single, you were talking about single men and that he's kind of down on his luck and his marriage and all that kind of stuff.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Oh, yeah.
unidentified		Yeah, and we don't know what happened, of course, but I'm just kind of agreeing with him that, like, I can see that the person that would have a disposition to do some crazy stuff that normally wouldn't be done, our society is kind of pushing people to be desperate, and especially men with no sort of outlet for their feelings.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
unidentified		I thank you for the call.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		And the comment.
		And please allow me to think about that a little bit.
		I mean, that's perhaps a general truth, but what's different here?
		Anybody want to try to comment on that?
unidentified		What's different here?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There are countries all over the world where young men are desperate, generally out of work, frequently divorced, a lot of women, problems, and they just don't do this.
		So what I'm searching for here, I guess we're having two different discussions.
		There is the mindless killer, generally white male, right, that we're talking about.
		And it is very prevalent in America.
		And yes, I am asking why is it so prevalent here in America as opposed to other countries?
		I think, however, you know, it's my opinion that what happened today is motivated by something else entirely.
		But I could be wrong about that.
		You know, we still have yet to hear from the authorities on what motivated these people.
		But I think I have a pretty good idea, and I think you probably think you do too.
		Lexington, Kentucky, you're on the air.
		Hello?
unidentified		Hello, R. Yes, sir.
unidentified		Lexington, North Carolina.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		North Carolina.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, see, I can't see the last part of it.
unidentified		Sorry about that.
		It's okay.
		It's an honor to talk to you.
		I have an opinion about what to do about this.
		You may or may not agree, but I'd just like to maybe say it.
		I think that we need to get our heads out of our cell phones, pay attention to what's going on.
		What's been going on the last two or three years?
		These Muslim extremists have been killing Christians, beeheading them all over the world.
		Beheading Christians and just killing Americans in different countries, tourists, that type thing.
		I think we need to get with the people that are with America, the other countries, our allies, and maybe close all of our borders just temporarily and get together and go over here and put boots to asses like we would back in the 70s, 60s, and 70s and just try to eradicate it because it's a disease.
		These Muslim extremists.
		That's just my opinion, and everybody may not agree with that.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, everybody may not, but that's what we're here for, to let you voice it.
unidentified		Well, I sure appreciate it.
		But I just feel like we need to take our country back.
		It just don't seem like the last few presidents we've had, the last four presidents, has had our best interest at heart by sending a lot of our jobs, a whole lot of our jobs, to other countries.
		It seems like we've been very passive whenever it comes to these extremists that are taking advantage of the Christian people all over the world.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, these are slightly different subjects.
		If you want to talk about economics, yes, jobs have gone to other countries, but that's because it's cheaper for the companies to do that.
		Simply that, I don't mix the two.
		You can say, yeah, there's not as many jobs here as there might have been, but is that why people are shooting up and become the Wild West around this country?
		I don't think that's it.
unidentified		No, no, sir.
		And I'm just saying it just seems like the country has went in a whole different direction.
		What I grew up in.
		I was born in the mid-70s, and things were a whole lot different.
		It was very easy to get a job.
		You know, in those days, it seemed like in the 70s, 80s, and even 90s.
		But things have just changed so much.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		But something else has gone on.
unidentified		It has to do with what happened today.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yeah, it doesn't.
		But Sir, again, something really basic has changed.
		There are plenty of societies with fewer jobs by far than we have here, and yet they don't go out and do these mass killings.
		So there's some other factor that we're not thinking about.
unidentified		I just think that the Muslim extremists, it's just what I hear and what I see all the time.
		It's the Muslims doing it.
		It's the Muslims doing it.
		Well, if it is, we need to get with our allies and stand together and just put an end to this.
		I mean, you know, I'm not saying drop a bomb, but, you know, just get half of each branch of each country's military together.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So would you say you're in favor of closing the borders, putting up walls, that kind of thing?
unidentified		Well, temporarily until, you know, some of this stuff, you know, until we eradicate, and we're never going to completely eradicate.
		There's a psycho born every day.
		But, I mean, you know, just try to knit this in the bud right now as it's getting started.
		We should have done this when 9-11 happened.
		And if we do that, these other countries, like one of your other callers was talking about, that hate America will set an example.
		You know, hey, maybe we need to chill out and not be so hard on America and quit some of this rhetoric about killing Americans and death to America, that type thing.
		Set an example.
		But it just seems like this generation of young men and women are not interested in not paying attention to what's going on around the world.
		Okay.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right.
		I really appreciate your call.
		I said there's a psycho.
		He said, didn't he?
		There's a psycho born every day.
		I think there's a psycho nurtured every day.
		You can talk about nature and nurture, right?
		They're not born psycho.
		The environment is what creates that, I'm quite sure.
unidentified		Hello there outside the country.
unidentified		Hello?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Hello, Steve, I think it is.
unidentified		Yeah, it's me or Jim.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Steve, you've really got to get close to the microphone or I can't keep you on the air.
unidentified		Okay, you got me now?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you're better, yeah.
unidentified		Okay, listen, I think that a big problem is in America, you know, I've been in Germany now for 25 years.
		And, you know, if you're down on your luck over here, you know, you still, they pay for your rent and they help you with food.
		In America, you don't have all that now.
		So if you're desperate and everything is going bad for you, you're going crazy because America is giving their money there and sending troops there.
		But in our own backyard, we're suffering.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you're essentially saying socialism is the answer.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You know, if people are down on their luck, we need to feed them and house them and give them a little money.
unidentified		Yeah, and give them some health insurance.
unidentified		There's nothing wrong with a good socialism.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		There's nothing wrong with that.
		Give them health insurance, too.
		Why not?
unidentified		Exactly.
		And with these guns, you guys need to stop the guns.
		Can you imagine?
		Just for example, you're in a parade.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Damn, guns just keep getting up on their own and shooting people randomly, don't they?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		It's outrageous.
unidentified		Now, Let me finish my thought.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Finish your thought.
unidentified		You're in a parade, and everybody is carrying concealed guns.
		Now, you have a few terrorists in there.
		They start shooting.
		So you pull out your gun and you start shooting.
		And somebody else sees you and thinks you're one of the terrorists, and they start shooting.
		And how many people are pulling out their guns and just shooting each other?
		It's not going to work.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So in other words, we'd kill each other, you believe.
unidentified		Oh, of course.
		That's all we're going to end up doing is shooting each other, friendly fires, because you thought they were the terrorists because you heard gunfire and saw somebody with a gun.
		You know, these are the things.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		So you think if we give them all the free stuff you talked about, that would just stop it, right?
unidentified		Yeah.
		I don't know if it would stop it, but we need to stop killing each other.
		And running around, everybody running around with guns.
		I don't see an answer.
		We're not going to play the wild, wild west.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, Steve.
		I appreciate your call.
		Thank you.
		The view from Germany.
unidentified		I don't think we can get that much free stuff out there, folks.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Fast enough.
		Marty from somewhere out there.
		Hello.
unidentified		Hello, this is Marty from the UK, Bristol?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, Bristol.
unidentified		I thought you mentioned guns earlier and restricted with what?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Okay, you're breaking up on me a little bit, Marty.
		Maybe you're not close enough to the mic.
		I'm not sure.
unidentified		Hello?
		How's that?
		Is that any better?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		That is a little bit better, yes, huh?
unidentified		Yeah, it was just the guns.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Marty, you're going to have to call me back.
		I'm sorry.
		That's all broken up.
		Dave, you're on the air.
unidentified		Well, thanks.
unidentified		This is from Longview, Washington.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Yes, sir.
unidentified		And hopefully I'm coming through clear.
		Most of the stuff that happened today was as a result of fear.
		People's reaction.
		You could see it in the kids and the bus and the adults.
		But the fear was because we didn't get any information.
		I think that was pretty clear that even the people reporting what was going on were saying, gee, you know, normally by now we get some information.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, I do agree.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		They withheld, CNN, for example, withheld a lot of information for a long time.
unidentified		And part of that is trust of the citizens here in the United States.
		I mean, there's been a lot of revolution in people's thoughts and actions.
		And, you know, I guess our leaders have lost faith in us.
		We can't fix that.
		They're going to have to solve that one themselves because we can't all afford to do, you know, civic projects every day.
		But people who do get involved in civic activities are less threatened by this because they know the people who are involved and they know that, you know, the right thing will be done.
		But there's no fear in my heart because I'm not afraid of what happens next.
		I came here on this earth to do something.
		I don't know what it is, but I'm here and I'm alive now, just like you are.
		You're filling a special niche.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I guess.
unidentified		Well, I think there's got to be dignity and there's got to be a purpose.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Dignity and purpose.
		I do agree with that.
		Yes.
unidentified		Well, bless you and all the Roswells to you, man.
unidentified		All right.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Thank you.
		Take care.
		You're on the air.
unidentified		Hello.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Portland, yes.
unidentified		Yeah, I'm actually driving up to Seattle right now, but anyway.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		You're in a truck?
unidentified		I am in a truck, yes.
		Okay.
		So I've been listening to quite a few of these people that are calling tonight, especially the guy from Germany.
		I had no idea that you had this many hippies calling you.
		The ridiculousness that comes out of some of these people's mouths is...
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I mean, in Germany, they do have a lot of social programs, after all.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Lots and lots of them.
unidentified		Yeah, and that's the thing.
		You know, it's like the people that say that are generally not the ones that are paying for it.
		The problem that I see with this entire philosophy and situation that's going on is the ideology clash.
		People don't seem to realize on my side, the U.S. side, I'm not in any particular religion, and I hate them all equally, to be honest with you.
		But the ideology that people are trying to change these individuals who have been forsped this violent, hateful rhetoric since birth is never going to happen.
		It's hard enough to try to talk sense into a Catholic to try to see that at least there might be a possibility that there isn't a God.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		Well, you know, this fanatical thing that's spreading is amazing.
		To me, it's amazing how quickly it's spreading, how quickly it's taking hold.
		How many people who were just sort of average Muslims, I guess, in life suddenly get grabbed by this extremist point of view and convert so instantly, you've got to admit it's fast.
unidentified		See, that's the biggest thing.
		And what happened today is really the canary in the coal mine.
		And to call anyone a moderate Muslim is to not understand takiyah.
		That's a word that is known throughout Islam.
		And everybody should check that word out tonight.
		T-A-Q-I-Y-Y-A.
		Check that out.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		We're so short on time.
		I'm sorry.
		Hello there somewhere on the phone.
		I can't really hear you.
		I'm sorry.
		And Phoenix, you're on here.
unidentified		Hello.
		Hello.
		Can you hear me now?
art bell ▲ ● ▼		I hear you.
unidentified		Okay, I think that we should do like we did to Japan and Germany when the ideology was bad.
		Just go bomb them with bullets, you know, bombs and bullets, take it over again.
		And then with the homeland here, people need to stop when they're told to stop by the policemen, And we need to obey the laws.
		It's just as simple as that.
		If we just listen to what the rules are and follow them, things will be great.
art bell ▲ ● ▼		All right, sir.
		Thank you very much for the call.
		All right, everybody, thank you for the show.
		I really didn't think, Charles Osman, thank you, buddy.
		We'll reschedule you, but there was no way to not talk about this tonight.
		And so talk about it, we did.
		And I'm quite sure there's going to be a very great deal of reaction.
		From the high desert, I'm Art Bell.

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