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July 20, 2015 - Art Bell

02:37:31

Art Bell MITD - Graham Hancock

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	♪♪♪ ♪♪♪
	♪♪♪ From the high desert and the great American Southwest,
	I bid you good morning, good afternoon, good evening, wherever you are in the universe, the world.
	world.
	We're covering it all with a brand new program called Midnight in the Desert.
	I'm Art Bell, and it is my pleasure to be here.
	It's going to be an interesting evening.
	The first thing we're gonna do is cover the genesis of the name of the program.
	Now, let's think about it a little bit.
	Midnight in the Desert.
	Where have you heard that before?
	Midnight in the Desert.
	Midnight in the Desert.
	Let me think about that.
	Oh, yes!
	There's this lovely gal in Nashville.
	There's this lovely gal in Nashville who, uh... I'm hearing music.
	I wonder where that's coming from.
	That's really strange.
	Now it's gone.
	Alright, this lovely gal in Nashville who sang it for me, and her name is Crystal Gale.
	Crystal, welcome to the program.
	Well, thank you for having me on.
	I'm so excited.
	I guess now I should reach back, I should tell everybody that one day One day you came to my house here in Nevada.
	You came all the way to Pahrump, Nevada, and handed me a song on a CD.
	And it blew me away.
	And then, Crystal, as time went on, and you said, I sang this for you, here you go, it's yours.
	And as time went on, I fell more and more and more in love with the song.
	It's the last song I play every single night.
	And so, first of all, I guess I would like to ask about the genesis of this song.
	Did you write it yourself?
	I wrote this with Mike Lautermilch and then my husband Bill.
	But Mike and I started out the song.
	We listen to your program all the time, as you know.
	And we just started thinking about it and we said, you know, we've got to come up with something.
	And it just came.
	and we wrote it and we decided we had to bring it to you.
	Krystal, when you write a song, does it most times just come or are a lot of them struggles
	to write?
	Yeah, a lot of it can be struggle.
	But the ones that I like are the ones that just come easy and this definitely did.
	But you know, it just felt right and we wanted to do this.
	Boy, it does feel right.
	It feels right for... By the way, you'll be interested to know, we had a great vote on this website, and Midnight in the Desert won out hands down.
	Everybody wanted the program to be called that.
	Everybody wanted the theme to be that.
	This is great.
	So... Well, we are very honored.
	Very, very honored.
	I'm very honored.
	What are you doing these days?
	Well, we're still working out on the road doing different concerts and been in the studio working on a classic country album that's in the mixing process and will be out soon and just having fun, you know, in my career.
	I've been all over the world, made so many wonderful friends and love it.
	And I'm still making more.
	All right.
	I want an honest response here.
	When you go out on the road, Man, you're really on the road.
	I mean, you're from spot to spot to spot to spot all over the country.
	Does that wear one down after a while?
	Definitely, it can wear you down real fast.
	It just depends.
	You know, when I was younger, definitely we could go day after day after day and then you get a little older and it was like, okay, let's slow this down.
	But you know, once it's in your blood, you love it.
	We enjoy being out there, and as you know, my sister Loretta Lynn, I mean, she loves it.
	She's still out there singing, and it's just incredible.
	And I've got to say, we're going to be at her ranch on September 5th with the Van Leer girls.
	Really?
	My sister Peggy and Loretta and I will be all together there, and we have so much fun.
	How come so much talent gathers in one family?
	You know, I don't know.
	My mother would sing.
	My father, I think he sang and played the guitar.
	Mom had a twin sister that they'd sing around at socials.
	It was a part of our upbringing.
	In Kentucky, everybody gathered on the porch.
	We didn't have the video machines and everything else.
	Oh, I know about Kentucky.
	I do.
	It's really laid back.
	There's so much beautiful farm country.
	There are horses all over the place.
	It's gorgeous.
	It's a great place, a wonderful place.
	You know where I am, out here in the middle of cactus country.
	I love the desert.
	So you honestly really did, you used to listen to the show, huh?
	Oh yes, yes.
	That's incredible.
	You know, I never know who's in the audience, I never know who's out there.
	That's right, well we listen.
	Love it.
	And it inspired that song.
	Somehow I can imagine you all listening as you're on a bus or on something going from one gig to another.
	Definitely that.
	At home as well.
	You know when you enjoy something and I enjoy what you talk about.
	All the interesting things.
	Well, when I, I played this, you know, I'm married again.
	I played it for my wife and she just absolutely fell in love with it.
	And then I told her that I actually met you and I showed her your picture and she about fell over.
	So, um, I've got to ask you about your hair.
	Um, you're world famous for your hair.
	Your, uh, there was some rumor or something.
	I don't know.
	I heard from somebody that you were at one time thinking of cutting it.
	No.
	I have been cutting it back some.
	It's not quite as long, but... No.
	It's hard to get rid of something that's been with you as long as it has, so that's one thing.
	But, you know, I do dream about having short hair, you know, where I can just wash it and go.
	How hard is it?
	I mean, when I saw you, it was at your ankles now.
	I can't even imagine hair that long, but it's part of your trademark now, so I'm sure anybody connected with you is also saying, no, don't cut your hair, right?
	You know, some have said through the years, cut it, and some have said no.
	You know, I owe my long hair to my American Indian heritage.
	I'm Cherokee, and it just grows so fast.
	I had no idea you had Cherokee hair.
	I cut my hair from 9 to 12 inches off a year.
	Nine to twelve?
	Yeah, you know, it just grows so fast.
	I don't know how long my hair would have been if I'd never trimmed it.
	In other words, you might be trailing it like a bridal thing.
	Yeah.
	When I started stepping on it, I said, that's too long.
	So that's when I cut it back.
	So nine to twelve is like how much it grows in a year?
	Yeah, you know, I think the normal is like, for most people, I think it's about six inches.
	But I started measuring my trimmings through the year, and it was from 9 to 12 inches.
	Well, it's absolutely gorgeous, and I think that's why when you appear somewhere, they frequently get television shots or, you know, photo shots of you from the rear to show your hair.
	Yes, they have.
	Well, again, it is my distinct honor and pleasure to have the show named Midnight in the Desert.
	I'm in love with that song.
	You know, if I weren't entangled, I'd be in love with you, too.
	Oh, man.
	All right, so I had to do that.
	I had to do that at the beginning of the program.
	There's just no two ways about it.
	What a wonderful lady.
	And I'm not kidding you when I say she got on an airplane, came all the way out here, came to my house, had lunch, and handed that to me and said, here, this is for you.
	And I listened to it once and I said, oh, thank you so much.
	And, you know, it kind of ended there for a little while.
	And then I started listening more and more and more to the song.
	And the more I heard it, the more I began to fall in love with it, really in love with it.
	So that's how this show became what it is.
	And the good people at Belgab, that's a website that kind of follows the show, voted this as what should be the name of the program.
	And so that's how it happened.
	That beautiful, talented lady is the reason.
	All right, I'm going to go through, I think, a couple of rules for the show, because that's all we've got is a couple.
	Actually, maybe only one.
	The rule we have here is no bad language.
	No bad language.
	Now, tonight, we're welcoming a whole bunch of affiliates to the show.
	So, be aware that you're not only on the internet, but you're on broadcast radio as well.
	And I could go through a list, and I will at some point go through a list of all the affiliates.
	Those of you who have joined us, I say, welcome.
	And again, the only rule I have is really no bad language.
	There's no need for it.
	You can say what you have to say without saying a bad word.
	You can be dramatic and have emphasis without saying a bad word, right?
	So, do that, and keep in mind that we've got children, eight, people up to 80 listening.
	They both go through the roof if you've got a whole bunch of bad language.
	I think a lot of internet radio shows think, ah, we're on the internet now!
	We can really swear up a storm!
	And they do.
	So, what you're hearing now is a digital audio revolution, in my opinion.
	The world has changed beneath our feet.
	There is nobody, nobody who loves radio more than myself.
	But clearly we are in the middle of a digital revolution.
	Everybody's carrying around these cell phones.
	I've got an iPhone sitting right here.
	Whether it's an Android or whatever you've got, it's pretty much plastered with you all the time, right?
	Half of you have most of your lives on the thing.
	I know I do.
	And when it's out of my reach, I get a little fidgety.
	Any of the rest of you like that?
	Even when it's in the charger.
	It's like the charger has it.
	I don't.
	And I reach for it to look at a weather forecast or what have you, and it's not there.
	All right.
	So, oh, there is one other thing.
	There are many ways to call the show.
	We have a public number, which is area code 952.
	225-5278.
	That's 952-225-5278.
	You can use Skype in North America.
	That means US and Canada.
	You simply kind of make like you want to make me your friend on Skype and you enter MITD-51.
	That's MITD-51 as in midnight in the desert, right?
	If you're overseas, anywhere outside North America, it's M-I-T-D 55.
	That's M-I-T-D 55.
	Now, when you call, we prefer you use a headphone mic.
	If you can find a headphone mic, that would be glorious, because then you'd sound good.
	If you've got one of those little cameras on your computer, pick it up when you call and talk into it.
	Just like you're talking into a microphone.
	What you don't do is stand five feet back from the computer and yell at the computer when I come on.
	That never works.
	Always sounds bad.
	No exceptions.
	Just doesn't work.
	Now, on your iPhone you can add me and then you can call me.
	It's that simple from anywhere in the world.
	Alright, all of that said, I think that I'll go into this break this way This, of course, is the lady you just heard, Crystal Gale.
	I'm Art Bell, and this is Midnight in the Desert.
	Midnight in the desert Shooting stars across the sky This magical journey Will take us on a ride We're filled with the longing, searching for the truth.
	Will we make it till tomorrow?
	Will the sun shine on you?
	Midnight in the desert, and we're listening.
	Well, there's nothing I can do.
	I'm sorry.
	You can die. You can die.
	Every little dot on your life.
	Ooh, you see that girl.
	Watch that scene.
	Dig in some feet.
	Friday night and the lights are low.
	Looking out for a place to go.
	Where the red and the white music, really made me scream.
	Wanna take a ride?
	From the High Desert and the Great American Southwest, this is Midnight in the Desert, exclusively on the Dark Matter Digital Network.
	To call the show, dial 1-952-CALL-ART.
	That's 1-952-225-5278.
	That's the number, alright.
	He stumbled a little there at the end.
	5278 is what he meant to say at the end.
	And that's the way to call.
	Good evening, everybody.
	I am Art Bell, and I am back after a two-year hiatus.
	At the bottom of the hour, we're going to be joined by, or after the news at the bottom of the hour, Graham Hancock.
	And Graham is an amazing, amazing guy.
	I'll tell you all about him.
	If you've never heard Graham, well, you're in for quite a treat.
	I've got a few thank yous to do, since this is an inaugural show.
	I'm going to repeat some of what I said last night.
	Now, I needed really, really good audio to do a show like this, or to even contemplate doing a show like this, and so I called the Telos company.
	They are the leaders in getting audio from point A to point B, and getting phones working, and all that kind of stuff.
	And the company Telos said, well, you know, Our chief engineer lives right there in Pahrump, Nevada.
	I about dropped the phone.
	What?
	So I hooked up with Joe, who happens to be a ham operator like myself.
	Needless to say, he talked the company into providing us with the best gear that exists on planet Earth for getting sound from point A to point B, or telephones, or whatever.
	And so thank you, Telos, and thank you, Joe.
	Keith Rowland, my webmaster of You know, this bothers me a little.
	Probably bothers Keith, too.
	What is it, about 30 years, Keith?
	We've known each other, I think.
	Something like that.
	So, he's doing it all down there.
	Well, I'm doing it all here and he's doing it all there.
	Dr. J, my new producer, and by the way, Paul, my old producer.
	That sounds bad, right?
	The old guy.
	He's fine.
	Dr. J is my new producer and doing a great job.
	I want to thank The Bell Gap website.
	This is a website comprised of people that might chew your arm off or might give you a kiss on the cheek.
	It's really hard to say.
	They're sort of what I describe as vaguely lovable.
	It's a great site.
	You know, if you're not... Well, there's two sites listed at Artbell.com.
	Incidentally.
	Two sites.
	Here's the deal.
	Belgab is the wild, wild west.
	The other website listed, which claims the name of the show, is a little easier going.
	So, if you don't feel like you would even put your head into the lion's den, you're going to want to go to that one.
	If you're unafraid, You know, I make these people sound bad.
	They're actually bright people.
	They're people who have really helped spread the word of the show.
	And, you know, it's a little acerbic at times, but Belgab is a place you might want to try.
	Belgab.com.
	Then there's Las Vegas Net.
	LasVegas.net.
	We did a test show last night, and as I mentioned last night, Internet is crucial to virtually everything I do.
	Without Internet, there is no me.
	The phones come in by Internet, Skype comes in by Internet, my program goes by the Internet, so I am Internet-dependent.
	Last night, we did a little test show.
	We had storms up on the mountain between here and Las Vegas.
	That's where the microwave sends the internet, right?
	And these storms caused a gigantic rain fade.
	I mean, it came, it's 9,000 feet up, folks, and it came down so hard that even the microwave signal simply didn't make it through.
	And when that happened, of course, an hour and a half or an hour and whatever it was, three quarters into the show, Things began going bonkers.
	So that's why you do tests.
	We ironed that out.
	We ironed out a whole lot of other things.
	And hopefully all will run smoothly tonight.
	That's not wood.
	That's sort of metallic, but it looks like wood.
	It's wood-like.
	Probably doesn't count at all.
	Let me find... There we go.
	That's real wood.
	All right.
	While we've got a moment, I'm going to pick up, I think, a call.
	And I'm going to go to, um, well, let's see.
	Let's go to Illinois.
	Hello, Illinois.
	Are you there?
	Yes.
	Extinguish your device, please.
	Done.
	Done?
	Great.
	Okay.
	What is your first name?
	Rose.
	A Rose by any other, right?
	Yeah.
	What part of Illinois are you in, Rose?
	Iuka.
	Iuka.
	Population, 600.
	Really?
	That's a very small town.
	I'm out in farm country.
	So does everybody sort of know everybody in your town?
	I imagine they do.
	Yeah, it's like everybody knows everybody.
	Okay, well, listen, welcome to the program.
	Do you have any thoughts, suggestions, ideas, criticisms, anything?
	No criticisms, I love him.
	I cried when they took his show off the air.
	My husband, I was screaming and yelling at him, he's not on, he's not on, that other radio show's on.
	I mean, I've been listening to Bart for years.
	Well, yeah, but you're talking about him like he's in the third person.
	Well, he was gone for a little while, and I missed him very much.
	He was, and he missed being here, too.
	But listen, just for the record, I'm Art.
	This is Art.
	Oh, my God!
	No, just Art.
	Oh my god, I got a smoothing it! Oh my god! Now what have I always said, Rose?
	I've always said I don't have a call screener.
	Yeah, but usually they say that and somebody else picks up.
	Oh, my Lord!
	Rose, I... Oh, Art!
	Oh, my God!
	I love you and your family!
	I swear, the day that you signed off the air, I go, no, no, he's going to be back on.
	That other radio show was on.
	I screamed at my husband, he's not on!
	I sat down and cried.
	It was like somebody stabbed me in the heart with a knife.
	I've been listening to you for years.
	Rose, you know, you've really got to get a recording of this program.
	I hope you have joined us as a time traveler.
	And a copy of it.
	You know, if you're a town traveler, you can get a copy of the show.
	So my husband paid for a subscription to the show?
	There you go.
	There you go.
	Because you've got to hear your voice, Rose.
	You've got to hear your voice when you figured out it was me.
	I just can't believe it!
	Oh my God!
	I love you and your family and your daughters and your wife are just beautiful.
	Thank you, thank you, thank you.
	So very much sorry about Mona.
	Oh, thank you.
	All right, so Rose, Rose, Rose, what would you like to hear on the show?
	I mean, what is almost your favorite topic?
	Well, I have two of them.
	One is what's going on with the Earth and the planets, how they're changing, and the volcanoes and the earthquakes.
	The other one is UFOs, and I've seen one.
	Rose, let me first address the first thing you said.
	We now have, it'd be a great book title too, but I'm not going to write it, The Quickening on Steroids.
	The Quickening on Steroids.
	That's right, we do.
	Alright, now briefly, you said you've seen a UFO.
	Welcome to the club.
	Tell me about it real quickly.
	Okay, at the time I was living in Kansas and I went out to take my dog out and I looked up at the sky and the moon and the stars were gone.
	I ran back in the house, got my daughter, drug her out on the porch and I hollered, look, look!
	And she looked up and she goes, what?
	I said, where's the moon?
	Where's the stars?
	Right.
	And then my neighbors across the way, they came out of their house, and we were all pointing at the sky, and that thing was dead silent.
	Massive!
	So big!
	So huge!
	What about the shape?
	And it took off with a blink of an eye, and no noise.
	Okay, but what about the shape?
	It was... It wasn't round, like a saucer or nothing.
	Kind of like an arrowhead shape.
	An arrowhead?
	Yeah, you know how an arrowhead is kind of shaped?
	Oh, sure.
	It was kind of something like that.
	And it was just pitch, the whole bottom of it was pitch black until it took off.
	And then multicolored lights were all at the bottom.
	Multicolored lights at the bottom?
	So it isn't like it was, not like it was on a rainbow firing itself off on a rainbow or something?
	No, it was like when the thing powered up and took off.
	There were like these multi-colored lights, and my daughter's speechless.
	I grabbed her and I was shaking her, trying to snap her out of it, because she was terrified.
	All she was saying was, and pointing at it.
	Really?
	Yeah, so me, some of my neighbors, and then shortly after that we moved here.
	Rose, is there Is there anything that makes you think that it was, you know, from somewhere else?
	Well, I don't think we have anything.
	I mean, this is a huge trailer park that I was living in.
	Right.
	We got nothing that big.
	Nothing.
	Was it silent?
	Dead silent.
	Not a sound.
	Dead silent.
	You know, that's true.
	No noise of any kind.
	All right, well, I gotta go.
	I gotta go.
	I'm out of time.
	Bless your heart.
	Thank you.
	Thank you.
	Take care, Rose.
	Wow.
	That was a call to remember.
	You're listening to Midnight in the Desert.
	I'm Art Bell and we're gonna have fun.
	Rising up, back on the street.
	Did my time, took my chances.
	Went the distance, now I'm back on my feet.
	Just a man and his will to survive.
	So many times, it happens too fast.
	You trade your passion for glory.
	Don't lose your grip on the dreams of the past.
	You must fight just to keep them alive.
	Let your feet have a dagger.
	It's the thrill of the fight.
	Rising up to the challenge of our yonder.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	The Associated Press says scores of low-flying planes circling American cities are part of a civilian air force operated by the FBI and obscured behind fictitious companies.
	The AP said it traced at least 50 aircraft back to the FBI and identified more than 100 flights in 11 states over a 30-day period since late April.
	They were orbiting both major cities and rural areas.
	At least 115 planes, including 90 Cessna aircraft, were mentioned in a federal budget document from 2009.
	For decades, the planes have provided support to FBI surveillance operations on the ground, but now the aircraft are equipped with high-tech cameras and, in rare circumstances, technology capable of tracking thousands of cell phones, raising questions about how these surveillance flights affect Americans' privacy.
	The FBI says the planes are not equipped or used for bulk collection activities or mass surveillance.
	They say the surveillance equipment is used for ongoing investigations, but generally without a judge's approval.
	The Earth could be headed for a mini ice age, according to researchers.
	A new study claims to have cracked predicting solar cycles, and says that between 2020 and 2030, solar cycles will cancel each other out.
	This, they say, will lead to a phenomenon known as the Maunder Minimum, which has previously been known as a mini ice age, when it hit between 1646 and 1715, even causing London's River Thames to freeze over.
	The new model of the sun's solar cycle is producing unprecedentedly accurate predictions of irregularities within the sun's 11-year heartbeat.
	It draws on dynamo effects in two layers of the sun, one close to the surface and one deep within its convection zone.
	Predictions from the model suggest that solar activity will fall by 60% during the 2030s, two conditions last seen during the mini ice age that began in 1645.
	NASA has released an online tool known as Mars Trek, which aims to provide a Google-like experience so that users can explore the Red Planet's terrain.
	The zoomable map provides detailed views of landmarks such as Olympus Mons, the largest known volcano in the solar system, measuring more than 15 miles above its surrounding surface.
	Other notable features on the map include Valles Marineris, a canyon that runs across one-fourth of Mars' surface and measures about 90 miles wide.
	Across the map, gigantic rift valleys fracture the surface over vast distances.
	Huge outflow channels tell the stories of floods in Mars' distant past, when water flowed across its surface.
	Studying these landforms reveals how Mars' environment has gone through tremendous changes over time, and helps us understand how life might have possibly survived there to the present.
	The tool also provides users with the option of using a 3D view, which rotates the red planet to reveal its north and south poles.
	This is Dark Matter News.
	A University of Alaska spokesman has advised in an email that control of the High Frequency Active Oral Research Program, better known as HAARP, would be transferred from direct federal control to their institution in August.
	Currently, the Air Force Research Lab has control of the HAARP facility until August 11th.
	After that, the university will have access to the site under the terms of an agreement between the University of Alaska Fairbanks and the Air Force.
	The officially reported purpose of the HAARP installation was study of the ionosphere.
	The facility has a complex array of radio equipment meant to generate heat in the upper atmosphere from about 37 miles to 620 miles above the Earth's surface.
	But the mysterious nature of some of the experiments put the HAARP facility at the center of plenty of speculation.
	The troubling factor in this story is that although the Air Force is ostensibly transferring control to the civilian university, the bulk of the funding is still coming from the Pentagon.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	In the last episode, we learned that there is a new type of dark matter.
	It's called Dark Matter.
	And we're going to look at it.
	We're going to look at it.
	Midnight Matters are best handled by those that understand how to move in the darkness
	like Bart Bell.
	To call the show, please dial 1-952-CALL-ART.
	That's 1-952-225-5278.
	Midnight in the desert!
	5 5278 midnight in the desert. It's a brand new program ever. And I'm so very glad to be here.
	I can't even begin to tell you how glad I am to be here.
	It's been a long two-year wait, and it's been a long two-year wait for Graham Hancock, too.
	Graham Hancock is a British writer.
	He's a journalist.
	He specializes in very unconventional theories involving Ancient civilizations.
	You don't think we were the first, do you?
	Stone monuments, megaliths, altered states of consciousness.
	That's a favorite of mine.
	More ways than one.
	Ancient myths and astronomical astrological data from the past.
	One of the main themes running through many of his books is a positive global connection with a mother culture.
	From which he believes all ancient historical civilizations sprang.
	His work has been rejected by many scientists.
	They call it pseudo-archaeology.
	What a rotten word.
	Pseudo-archaeology.
	Graham, welcome to the program.
	All the way from, I believe, London, right?
	Actually, the city of Bath in southwest England, about 100 miles west of London.
	Bath.
	I hope Bath was not a to our London line? Probably is, but it's okay, we'll live
	with that on.
	I'm glad to have a London line, I'm glad to have you on it, and listen, I am so sorry,
	Graham, really truly sorry about your being, you were going to be on the next night two
	Yeah, you stood me up, Art.
	I know.
	I felt so, God forsaken guilty about that.
	I really did.
	So, it's been so long.
	Here's where I want to start if I can.
	This has been a lifelong, pretty much lifelong journey for you.
	I guess I want to ask you how it began.
	In other words, what set you on this path?
	Yeah.
	Really, I got onto this path by what certainly felt like and seemed to be a series of accidents.
	I really had no interest in Ancient mysteries at all if we go back to the 1970s and 1980s I was very much into current affairs.
	I was based in East Africa I was based in Nairobi in Kenya.
	I was the East Africa correspondent for the Economist in the in the early 1980s and that was a a A responsibility that took me regularly to the war-torn, famine-hit country of Ethiopia, right to the north of Kenya.
	It was on my beat, and I used to go there regularly as a journalist.
	And in Ethiopia, I stumbled across a non-current affairs story that Ethiopia claims to possess the Lost Ark of the Covenant with all its powers.
	that it can still strike people dead, that it is still a thing of fire, and initially this just seemed to me,
	at one level, like a fantastic claim being made by an obscure country in the Horn of Africa,
	and at the other level there were intriguing elements about it that made me wonder what lay behind it and whether it...
	Uh-oh. Well, that was awfully quick.
	We lost him awfully quickly.
	And he was just talking about the Lost Ark of the Covenant.
	So I have no idea what just occurred.
	Nothing else is going askew here.
	So hopefully Graham will call back the Lost Ark of the Covenant now.
	I've seen all the movies.
	I'm sure you have.
	And I am intensely curious about the Lost Ark.
	I wonder A, if it, you know, still exists.
	And I wonder, B, if we were to lay our hands on it, would we be pleased that we did that?
	Really, what happened?
	I wonder what happened to our line.
	That is our London line.
	It pretty much should have stayed together.
	And again, I'm looking at everything else that I can look at.
	The Skype call's coming in and other calls coming in and everything looks alright.
	So, I don't know.
	This is one of those things that you don't expect.
	You certainly don't hope that, I mean, do hope ahead of time that nothing like this will occur, but it did.
	So, he will realize, he's probably going on and on, he'll realize that he's been disconnected and will call back.
	But there's just no reason for this.
	You all have seen the movies about the Lost Ark, right?
	And I was just prepared to ask him about that.
	Let's see, what should we do?
	We could take an additional break here and then I could call him.
	Or I could... I suppose I could just call him.
	I'm not against doing that either.
	So...
	Let's see.
	I wonder if it'll hold up.
	And I wonder how I dial from here.
	I wonder a lot of things.
	You should all know this is all new equipment.
	I repeat, new equipment.
	So, I hardly know what I'm doing.
	Though, in that case, I'm not exactly sure what I would have to do to call London from here.
	So, what we will do is we will take An additional break.
	That's what we will do.
	And that'll take care of one for later.
	So... We'll pause for a... No, wait a minute.
	Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait.
	I think this might be Graham back on the line again.
	It's me.
	That connection to London doesn't sound so good anymore.
	We just got cut off there.
	We sure did.
	You sound fine right now.
	Good, well let's carry on.
	Okay, we were with the Lost Ark of the Covenant.
	Yeah, and the bottom line was that it was that accidental encounter with the Ethiopian claim
	and my investigation of it over several years that led me to take an interest in ancient mysteries
	and to wonder whether the story we were being told about our past was actually true.
	I mean, previously I'd accepted that, you know, that what the historians and archaeologists said
	was based on science, it must be true, there was no reason to question it.
	And then I discovered in this specific case that there were lots and lots and lots of reasons to question it.
	And then I thought, well, if that's the case here in this subject, which I've now thoroughly investigated
	and found that archaeologists are missing a trick on, maybe it's true in other areas of the past as well.
	And that ultimately led me to my next book, and certainly my best known book, which was Fingerprints of the Gods.
	1995.
	All right, let me back up just a little bit.
	I can't leave the Lost Ark just yet.
	Is it your view, Graham, that the Lost Ark still exists somewhere in the world?
	Yes, absolutely.
	And if Ethiopia doesn't have the whole thing, it's certainly got a large piece of it.
	There are some indications that it got broken or damaged during the last couple of thousand.
	years and according to my reconstruction it's been in Ethiopia since about 400
	years before Christ now this is a this is a controversial claim but but all the
	dots join up and and you know there's extraordinary backup to what the to what
	the Ethiopians are saying and the role that the Ark of the Covenant plays in
	their culture is really extremely puzzling I mean this is the only culture in the world which has a living tradition of actually worship of the Ark of the Covenant.
	Everywhere else it's a forgotten relic.
	In Ethiopia it's part of the beating cultural heart of that of that country and every church has a replica of the Ark
	of the Covenant and it's holy of holies and it's really
	the more you get into it the more extraordinary it seems that that this could just be based on nothing
	there's something there's something going on and it's intimately connected
	to the story of the Ethiopian Jews you know this is a story that has been
	not well enough told in the world the realization that there
	there has is an ancient Jewish community in Ethiopia which has roots that go back deep into Old Testament times
	uh... and and And these Ethiopian Jews who call themselves Beta Israel, which means House of Israel, they're often referred to by outsiders as the Falashers.
	The vast majority of them have now been moved to Israel during the crisis of the civil war in Ethiopia.
	In 1991, the Israelis mounted a rescue mission and took most of the Ethiopian Jews out of the country.
	But I knew them before that exodus and I traveled in their villages and I talked with their priests because the Ethiopian Jews have priests.
	This itself should be an indication of how curious and strange their religion is.
	Modern Judaism does not have priests, it has rabbis.
	But these Ethiopian Jews were practicing a very ancient form of Judaism, even sacrificing rams, which is forbidden, again, in Talmudic Judaism.
	So, intriguing story, and one thoroughly worth investigating, and one that woke me up to the mysteries of the past.
	If you had access to the Lost Ark of the Covenant, would you hesitate to open it, given the opportunity?
	Yeah, I'd absolutely hesitate to open it.
	I think we're looking at a piece of lost technology, and there are some indications that it has gone rogue.
	Rogue?
	Rogue?
	Rogue.
	That it kills its keepers.
	There is an old tradition in Ethiopia that a single monk is appointed as the guardian of the Ark.
	Once he's appointed to that position, he can never leave the precincts of the chapel where the Ark is kept.
	And I got to know a number of these guys over a period of several years, a number of them because once appointed as guardian of the Ark, their lifespan tends to be very short, like two years, and they develop cataracts over their eyes, and they complain that the Ark is doing this to them, but that it is their fate, their burden, their responsibility to be the keeper of the Ark.
	That might imply some sort of radiation?
	I think it does, and I speculated on this as I was researching the subject.
	It's one of the things that turned me on to the possibility that the story of our past may be badly flawed, because the art does sound like a piece of technology.
	That's right.
	If you read the biblical accounts, and of course I didn't confine myself to the biblical accounts, there's an incredible, incredibly rich heritage of the legends of the Jews, and of other extra, what they call extra-biblical sources, sources outside the Bible, which are filled with references to the Ark, and eerily, again and again and again and again, what you find these references are describing some sort of awesome weapon that strikes people dead with
	bolts of fire. You need only reach out your hand to it and a bolt of fire will leap
	out from it and break you down. That's capable of flight that that inflicts
	cancerous tumors upon the Philistines on the one occasion when the
	Philistines capture the Ark from the from the Israelites. There's really
	strange passages in the Bible that describe the the way they opened it which was a
	terrible mistake, the way they filed past it and looked into it, and how 50,000
	of the citizens of a place called Ashdod were killed with cancerous tumors
	by exposure to the And of course, you know, the scholars just dismiss all of
	this as ancient fantasies, but there's a remarkable consistency in the stories.
	And I began to wonder whether we are looking at a legacy or a heritage of earlier technology,
	which has somehow been preserved in Ethiopia and preserved elsewhere in other countries.
	We keep coming across these hints and myths of a lost technology.
	And if there's a lost technology way back in the past, then there's a problem with history,
	because history and archaeology see the evolution of human civilization as pretty much a kind
	I mean, there might be a few... Well, if there's a lost technology, then there's a lost civilization that developed it.
	Exactly.
	There's a lost civilization behind it.
	Let's put it this way, there's an unexplained mystery behind it, because the model that we are taught in schools and universities, and that is largely favored by the mass media as well, the model of mainstream history, does not have any room for any lost civilizations.
	Historians and archaeologists, I find, May I ask you a very controversial question?
	they do some incredible work on the other hand they're very pompous about
	their findings that i convinced that they had that they've got the whole
	story when they should know that the next ten of the spade uh... could change the story entirely
	and i think that's what's happening around the issue of civilization may i
	ask you a very controversial question you're welcome to say no
	uh... the bible of course is seem to be here thought to be a very historical and many
	would argue extremely accurate or totally accurate document.
	How much of the Bible do you think is the real McCoy?
	I think it should just be looked at as a repository of information from the remote past.
	And as such, there's no need for us to distinguish it from the incredible scriptures and religious ideas preserved in hieroglyphs by the ancient Egyptians.
	Where those ideas often touch on the remote past of mankind, or the texts of the Sumerians in Mesopotamia.
	Or for that matter, the ongoing tradition of Hinduism in India.
	Hinduism is based upon the Vedas, and the Vedas are lost books going back into the remote... The origins of the Vedas are really a deep mystery.
	What we're looking at in the Vedas Is the latest recension of a very ancient oral tradition that may have been passed down for more than 12,000 years.
	And I think that's the case with the biblical texts, with the ancient Egyptian texts, with the Sumerian texts as well.
	They're best looked upon as archives of knowledge.
	So I don't place the biblical texts any higher than the ancient Egyptian or the Sumerian or the Indian texts.
	I placed them alongside those texts as a route into the past, that this is one of the ways, if you think of it as a wormhole in the fabric of space-time, that through these documents we can begin to enter and gaze upon and penetrate the mysteries of the past.
	Well I ask myself, Graham, all the time, how much of it I believe, and I do this because even relatively recent history, written supposedly, you know, perfectly as it occurred, depends on who wrote it, whether they're the ones who won the war, and I mean, history is just, you know, even modern, relatively modern history comes out six ways from Sunday.
	Yeah, no, totally.
	I don't think we should automatically believe anything in any ancient text.
	We should just use it as an aid in order to inquire into the past.
	History is a story, first and foremost.
	It's a narrative, and the biblical texts are a narrative, and they are written to support a particular point of view, but that doesn't mean that there isn't good stuff in there.
	Oh, no, there is!
	I mean, there's stuff that everybody knows Human beings, I think, just know, as a natural matter of being a human being, the right and wrong way to treat somebody else, for example.
	So, a lot of it is that kind of common sense, and you can believe it.
	Yeah, well, the ethical stuff, you know, is an aspect of all ancient texts.
	No harm in listening to that.
	But, Graham, I want to know, did the miracles really occur?
	Did the sea really part?
	All of that, I want to know, and we all do.
	Yeah, I think that what is being captured in some of these accounts, again it comes back to this issue of the technology that we don't understand, the faint hints and traces of some system of manipulating physical matter which is not the system that we use today and which appears to be miraculous but is in fact an ancient science. I think that to me that's
	what it all comes down to in the end, that we're dealing with the fingerprints of an ancient
	science and that this science goes back to a civilization before recorded history began. Now, I
	have to say that at the root of it all is mystery, not history.
	And when we seek to explain this, we should keep an open mind to all possibilities.
	Another possibility that many people like is the ancient astronaut.
	All right, hold it right there.
	We're at a break point, and we'll be right back with Graham Hancock.
	I'm Mark Bell.
	Welcome to my channel.
	One of the four beasts saying, come and see.
	And I saw and behold a white horse.
	♪♪♪ There's a man going around taking names.
	you And he decides who to free and who to blame.
	Everybody won't be treated all the same.
	There'll be a golden ladder reaching down when the man comes around.
	The hairs on your arm will stand up at the terror in each sip and in each suck.
	This just seemed the exact right time for this song.
	disappear into the cluttered ground.
	To reach Midnight in the Desert via Skype worldwide, if on a computer, please be sure to use a headphone mic
	and call MITD-51.
	That's MITD-51.
	This just seemed the exact right time for this song.
	I fell in love with this song and...
	I don't know.
	Somehow, discussions of the Bible, The Lost Ark of the Covenant, all of it, with Graham Hancock, and it seemed just the right time for that song.
	Graham, welcome back.
	Thank you.
	Your new book, by the way, is Magicians of the Gods, right?
	Yeah, Magicians of the Gods is not published yet.
	It'll be published in the fall, and it is the sequel to Fingerprints of the Gods.
	And when I say a sequel, I am not referring to an update of Fingerprints of the Gods.
	This is a completely new book.
	20 years have passed since I published Fingerprints of the Gods, and there have been enormous developments in the world.
	Since then, both in the field of archaeology and in the field of understanding what happened to the Earth between 12,800 and 11,600 years ago, which is the period I've always focused on.
	In the book, I'm sorry to interrupt, in the book you suggest that a giant comet may have hit the Earth about 12,800 years ago, is that correct?
	Yeah, that's right.
	And that's not my suggestion.
	What I'm doing there is picking up on really extraordinary discoveries in science that have taken place really since 2007.
	This is all very new information.
	We have a group of around 30 scientists from all around the world, from major universities and research institutes, who've been looking at what they call impact proxies.
	This information has got out in a small way to the public, but it's never been put together into a coherent case that has a bearing upon the origins of our history.
	And that's one of the things that I'm doing in Magicians of the Gods, is I'm putting all of that information together for the first time.
	See, it used to be held that the last time we had a major What they call a cosmic cataclysm on this planet was 65 million years ago.
	Dinosaurs.
	Dinosaurs.
	What they call the KT event, when what is calculated to be an asteroid about 10 kilometers in diameter smacked into the earth in the Gulf of Mexico Created a global firestone, destabilized the crust of the Earth, sent huge plumes of volcanic smoke rising into the upper atmosphere, changed the climate completely, and in the process rendered extinct the dinosaurs that had been the masters of our planet for, you know, hundreds of millions of years before that.
	Now, the view of science was that impacts on this scale, what you call extinction-level events, are very rare. They happen approximately once every hundred
	million years. Although how anybody could seriously expect the universe to be as
	predictable as that, I cannot imagine.
	Like every hundred million years, the alarm clock rings.
	But this was the view. And that while it is known that the Earth is in the path of small
	objects, meteorites, that they enter our skies all the time, little shooting stars, they
	light up, they're very pretty to look at. We don't feel endangered by these. They're the
	size of a speck of dust and they're not going to do any harm to the Earth.
	Historians, looking at the story of human civilization, you know, anatomically modern humans like us, at least according to the mainstream view, are supposed to have existed for only the last 200,000 years, and civilization, according to the mainstream view, is only supposed to be about 5,000 years old.
	So if you're dealing with timespans of 200,000 years or 5,000 years, why need you concern yourself with timespans of hundreds of millions of years?
	This is the essential point of history.
	So history doesn't take account of cosmic cataclysms.
	And that's why, with this rigid view that the last one happened 65 million years ago, that we're not going to see another cataclysm for about another 35 million years, that's why history ignores cataclysms.
	But the group of scientists who I mentioned began to Put together the information, they began to realize there were certain anomalies in the data.
	They began to realize that something horrendous had happened to the Earth much more recently than that, incredibly recently, actually just 12,800 years ago, at the beginning of an episode that geologists call the Younger Dryas.
	Now, geologists have been aware that the Earth plunged into a very radical climate shift at that time, 12,800 years ago, and they've been aware that there were extinctions Which were associated with this time period, but they'd never put it all together.
	They thought the extinctions might have been the result of human activity.
	Hunters, for example, hunting down the great herds of mammoth in North America.
	And they didn't realize that there might have been another cause for this, and that's what the new science has gradually revealed.
	That the Earth was hit 12,800 years ago.
	And it was hit by at least eight large fragments of a giant comet.
	And those fragments included fragments that were a mile in diameter.
	In other words... In other words, this baby is circling around again.
	Well, the point is that what all this comes back to is that the comet that was responsible for the cataclysm 12,800
	years ago.
	The Earth has had several encounters with its debris stream.
	Those first impacts 12,800 years ago, and I'm summarizing, you know, eight or nine years of
	really intense science here, which is thoroughly documented in the new book.
	That the first impacts were largely on the North American Ice Cap.
	This was the Ice Age.
	North America was buried as far south as New York in ice that was, you know, two miles deep.
	This is why craters were not found.
	Because those impacts on the North American Ice Cap were on the ice itself.
	And therefore the craters formed in the ice.
	And the vast heat initiated by these gigantic impacts.
	These objects are coming in at close to a hundred thousand miles an hour.
	The vast heat liquidized huge areas of the ice cap, causing enormous flooding.
	And part of my research with a fantastic catastrophist researcher called Randal Carson, who traveled with me, we made a big journey across North America, across Oregon, across Washington State in particular, the channeled scablands of Washington State, unbelievable landscapes, the Coulees, upper and lower Grand Coulee, just these huge gouges in the earth.
	We now know that these features were caused by cataclysmic flooding at the end of the Ice Age, and the old explanation for that flooding just won't fit anymore.
	The only thing that really makes sense is the impact of several fragments of a comet on the ice cap.
	So I'm going to summarize very quickly.
	We have impacts 12,800 years ago.
	The science for it is impeccable, if not yet fully out into the public domain.
	Then there's another encounter.
	You see, what we're dealing with here is a comet that may originally have been 200 kilometers in diameter, a giant thing like the size of a small planet that is drawn in to the inner solar system.
	That's really, really big.
	Just one quick question.
	I keep my ear to the ground on the Internet, and these things come and go.
	I'm telling you, but there is this gigantic group of people right now that believe something like what you're talking about.
	That is probably pretty close to the horizon.
	They're talking even September.
	I don't have a clue.
	I just know there's a gigantic buzz about it right now.
	If you want to comment on that, fine.
	Well, I can only tell you the science of it, which I've gone into in depth in Magicians of the Gods.
	I can only tell you the science of it.
	And what the science looks like is this, and let me just go back to this original scenario.
	A huge comet enters the inner solar system about 30,000 years ago.
	It is captured by the Sun and it begins to go into an orbit that crosses the orbit of the Earth.
	It's subjected to all kinds of gravitational pulls.
	Comets are not as massively solid as asteroids.
	Comets are huge amounts of rock bound together with ice.
	And what happens with these gravitational pulls and the passage of time is that this giant comet begins to break up into fragments.
	Some of those fragments might be 20 miles across.
	Others might be the size of your fist.
	and it begins to form a debris stream.
	Imagine a huge donut spread around the solar system.
	That's the debris stream of this comet.
	And in it, there's lots of small stuff, which isn't dangerous,
	and there's a lot of large stuff, which is hideously dangerous.
	12,800 years ago, we are hit by about eight large fragments of this comet with the epicenter of the cataclysm
	on the North American ice cap.
	And continent-wide wildfires across North America and the massive extinction of what
	are called the megafauna, the large animal species of that time.
	World climate changes.
	Huge amounts of ice water from the ice cap have been released into the ocean.
	This interrupts the Gulf Stream and it causes a radical fall of world climate and we go into a deep freeze that lasts 1,200 years.
	Actually, I believe Britain would be some of the first to go, wouldn't it?
	One of the first to go.
	If those ocean currents change, you guys are going to freeze.
	Of course.
	Many people don't realize what a huge role the oceans play in maintaining the stability of climate.
	And if you interrupt these great conveyor belts that take warm water from the equator and bring it up into the cold northern latitudes, if you interrupt that, then you don't just affect the Atlantic, you affect the climate of the whole world.
	Now the mystery is that this episode, which began 12,800 years ago, ended equally suddenly 11,600 years ago.
	And the answer to this mystery appears to be that more fragments of that comet hit the Earth, that we crossed the debris stream again 11,600 years ago.
	This time the impacts were in oceans, most likely the Pacific Ocean, the biggest ocean on the planet.
	Tsunamis?
	Tsunamis for sure, but also a greenhouse effect.
	Huge amounts of water vapor are thrown up into the upper atmosphere, and this creates the perfect greenhouse conditions, which then explain why the Earth, in a matter of a generation, undergoes a warming of more than 10 degrees centigrade.
	And all of what's left of the ice caps just melt, and you have huge flooding.
	This is 11,600 years ago.
	The point is, I'm not a big fan of doom and gloom and cataclysmic scenarios, but I think we need to be aware of our cosmic environment.
	And the point is that the astronomers and other scientists who've worked on this say that the debris stream of that giant comet is still in
	orbit.
	As a matter of fact, it's well known to all of us.
	The Earth passes through the debris stream of that giant comet twice a year.
	And that debris stream is, these days, is known as the Taurid meteor stream
	because it seems to come to... it seems to come at us from the direction of the constellation of Taurus.
	That's an illusion, but that's why it's called the Taurid Meteor Stream.
	I'm sorry, go ahead.
	I'll just finish this thought.
	The alarming thing is that calculations suggest that there are still many large objects in the Taurid Meteor Stream.
	Some of them are known, like Comet Encke, which is five kilometers in diameter.
	Others are theoretical, but when they backtrack the orbits of the meteor stream to the original giant comet, The inescapable conclusion is that there is at least one object with a diameter of 20 miles still out there and still crossing the orbit of the Earth every year.
	And it's really just a matter of luck.
	It's like crossing a six-lane highway blindfold.
	We've just been crossing that highway twice a year and missing the traffic but sooner or later we come into an area where the traffic bunches up and then there is a danger of an impact and some of the astronomers who worked on this think that that danger is a real and present danger and that it could confront us in Any time between now and about the year 2040.
	I wonder if we'd see it coming out.
	You know, we look for these things, Graham.
	We really do, amateurs particularly.
	But, but, but, we might not see one coming directly at us out of the sun.
	That's the problem.
	We're not looking for these things.
	The amount of money that NASA is spending on the research for Earth-crossing objects It's absolutely minuscule.
	And as you know, to pick up on what you said, coming from the direction of the sun, we have no eyes on that at all.
	And we're looking at a situation here where actually, we as a civilization could prevent this cataclysm.
	There is no reason for doom and gloom.
	If we saw it coming.
	But we can see it coming.
	It's something that we should be taking an intense interest in.
	Instead of the petty squabbles that divide us all at the moment, the ridiculous wars over ancient religious ideas which people have received as children and never questioned, the territorial conflicts, the greed, the stupidity, the hatred, the fear and suspicion being manipulated in society by the powers that be.
	If the civilizations on this planet were to put their heads together and say, all the evidence suggests that there is a real and present danger from the skies, what can we do about it?
	The answer is we could do plenty about it.
	There's no need for another extinction level event.
	We have to grow up first.
	Maybe we should be crowdfunding NASA and just say, use this money please to find what May cause an ELA.
	Graham, Graham.
	I'm with you, brother.
	I know, I know.
	The wars have got to stop.
	Hold it right there, Graham.
	We'll be right back.
	Graham Hancock is my guest and this is Midnight in the Desert.
	And if it's bad, don't let it get you down, you can take it.
	And if it hurts, don't let it get you down, you can take it.
	And if it's bad, don't let it get you down, you can take it.
	And if it hurts, don't let them see you cry, you can take it.
	Hold your head up high Hold up!
	Hold your head up!
	Hold up!
	Hold your head up!
	Hold up!
	That should jog a few memories on.
	What is that, folks?
	Does that remind you of somebody?
	Michelle?
	Oh, yeah!
	Dreamland!
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	To call Midnight in the Desert, please dial 1-952-CALL-ART.
	That's 1-952-225-5278.
	Actually, no need to call right now.
	We've got Graham on, and as you can hear, he's got a very great deal to say.
	So hang in there, and we'll get to your calls, but you might as well rest now.
	There's no point in everybody's dialing.
	I can see all the Skype's going, all the phone lines going.
	Just relax and listen.
	My guest is Graham Hancock, and here he is again.
	Graham, welcome back.
	Thank you, Art.
	All right.
	So, you know, with all the Internet rumor going on right now about something really gigantic coming.
	You know, usually I cast these things off, but this one seemed particularly, I don't know, constant.
	The drumbeat of something, something, people feeling something's coming.
	I guess they always do to some degree, but... Well, I just think that, I think we have to take a different perspective on this.
	We live in a very dangerous cosmic environment, that's a fact, but we do not need to embrace gloom and doom, and we do not need to project a cataclysm upon ourselves.
	In other words, we do not need to manifest these things by dwelling upon them in some sort of extraordinary masochistic We need to take a practical position to living in a dangerous cosmic environment, especially when the scientific evidence, never mind about the cultic evidence all over the internet, when the scientific evidence
	That's exactly where I was going, Graham.
	encounter with more fragments of the same giant comet that devastated the
	earth twelve thousand eight hundred years ago we need to take a practical
	view of this can we do something about this and the answer is yes absolutely we
	can do something about it if we'll focus attention on it and that's where I come
	to this issue of human behavior right now because the world is full of hatred
	and fear and suspicion that's exactly where I was going Graham I was going to
	ask you and this is a really really critical very important question
	In your view, is mankind now any more or less warlike than we always have been?
	I actually think that we are much more warlike than we've always been.
	I think it's getting worse and worse because the same atavistic primitive urges that led to those bloody medieval wars with swords and spears are still at play.
	We still haven't grown up, we're still infantile, and we are now equipped with really dangerous toys.
	Yes.
	Which can cause absolute havoc and chaos in the world.
	Actually, never mind a comet, you know, we're perfectly capable of wiping ourselves out, of taking this beautiful garden that the universe has given us to play in, and turning it into a hell world.
	And we're in the process of doing that, and I can't help feeling that there are powers at work which are manipulating us to think in this way, which are pressing those Primitive buttons in our, you know, in our deep reptilian brain, and not allowing us to begin to think clearly and openly.
	If we thought clearly and openly, we wouldn't have a single nuclear weapon on this planet.
	They're just such deadly, dreadful, dreadful things.
	But, you know, we do.
	If we thought clearly and openly, we wouldn't be allowing the destruction of the Amazon rainforest.
	Obviously, our society is just, you know, a little bit insane, absolutely crazy, and behaving in a psychotic manner.
	And then, looming on the horizon, is the danger of cosmic cataclysm.
	And that's a danger if we were to pool our resources, if we were to work together, if we were to stop hating and fearing each other, and actually realize that we are one human race, one family, all brothers and sisters, All with the same hopes, all with the same fears.
	We don't need to fight each other.
	If we could take that line, then we could look at the challenges that face humanity, amongst which is the challenge of a dangerous cosmic environment, and we could do something about it.
	We could use our brilliant science for positive rather than negative ends.
	Any idea, Graham, how we create that change in humanity?
	I think that there is a change of consciousness underway.
	I am very aware of this.
	The Internet is the key factor.
	The Internet is an instrument for liberation.
	Dark forces are seeking to control it and to limit its liberating powers, but what the Internet is doing is it's joining people all around the world into communities of ideas.
	Not communities based on skin color, or the religious belief that we happen to have been born with, or of our ethnic roots.
	Well, that's the upside of the internet.
	But to do with the communication of ideas.
	Now I realize lots of negative things are happening on the internet as well, but this Ability for people all around the world to communicate with one another instantly, to share ideas, and to expand those ideas, is a great instrument for awakening.
	And I see that awakening taking place all around the world, and I see it particularly in the youth.
	It's small still, it's a small flickering flame, but it's growing.
	And, you know, we reach a point of critical mass, perhaps soon the big corporations any longer, we're going to take matters into our own hands and make a
	better world and i think that's coming i feel very optimistic for that
	i'm not as much of an optimist as you are and and while what you point out
	about the internet is certainly true it is also teaching teenagers uh... or encouraging them to you know
	become radicalized do something awful here and or go to syria and join up with
	the you know, the bad guys.
	It's a good thing.
	Yeah, well, you know, we have some bad guys on our side, too, if we're going to think in those terms.
	Oh, no, we do.
	I agree.
	I really don't want to think of myself as a member of a particular nation.
	You know, I'm not.
	By the way, when I say that, I instantly realize there's a button that gets pressed.
	I am not in favor of one world government, OK?
	I am not in favor of any bloody government.
	I hate government.
	government is an old phase of human activity.
	Our next phase is going to have a much smaller role for government.
	So when I say that I don't see the point of nationalism, I don't see why I should automatically owe allegiance
	to somebody else just because they happen to be born on the same piece of land as me,
	I'm not arguing for one world government.
	I'm arguing for an awakening of the human species where we realize for the first time our full potential
	instead of allowing it to be harnessed and channeled and narrowed down by sectarian interests,
	which include of course, death cults.
	Like ISIS, yes.
	I can't bear the fact that that hideous death cult has stolen the name of an ancient Egyptian goddess, you know?
	It's appalling.
	But it is a death cult, and yes, it's using the Internet, but many forces for love are also at work on the Internet.
	So we have both sides.
	Very quickly, you don't want a one-world government.
	You don't want really any government at all.
	As little as possible.
	Yeah, we have such little time here.
	What would you have?
	I don't know.
	I just know that what we've got now is really bad.
	And it isn't serving the human race anymore.
	I don't think to recognize that, that we have to create a roadmap for the future.
	I think it's enough to say what we've got now is a broken model.
	It doesn't work anymore.
	It's allowing millions of people around the world to starve, to go to bed hungry every night.
	It's allowing the proliferation of nuclear weapons into dangerously irresponsible hands.
	It's allowing pollution on a gigantic scale to eat away at the lifeblood of the planet.
	I don't think I need to recognize the need for change.
	Once we recognize that, the exact direction that change will go will be up to us.
	All right.
	Graham Hancock, hold tight.
	We'll be back to you.
	He is our guest, and this man has a lot to say.
	I'm Art Bell, and this is Midnight in the Desert.
	Riders on the storm, riders on the storm, Into this house we're born, into this world we're thrown,
	Like a child we're born.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	The owner of Jordan Lobster Farms said he can't bear to sell or cook a massive lobster that is nearly a century old.
	The crustacean is so big, employees are surprised by it and customers would rather take pictures with it than eat it.
	I've heard of these enormous lobsters, but I've never seen one, so it's a real treat.
	It's humongous!
	That one, you have to kind of use your whole body weight to just lift it up, so that was crazy.
	While it's difficult to tell a lobster's exact age, based on its weight and size, fishermen say this one is roughly 95 years old.
	Experts say lobsters at the deepest part of the ocean often live to be a century old.
	Owner Stephen Jordan is no stranger to large lobsters.
	Restaurant owners and diners routinely come to his wholesale and retail business for ones that weigh 5 to 10 pounds.
	But this one officially weighs in at a whopping One of our fishermen, John Price, was in the Bay of Fundy, and he shipped it in.
	He didn't even tell us.
	He told us to look in the crate.
	We opened it up, and it was like, whoa!
	Jordan said it's been about a decade since he's seen a lobster this big.
	He plans to donate it to the Long Island Aquarium.
	It's almost like a dinosaur, you know?
	You like to see it continue on, and I think they would take good care of it.
	I think it's a nice thing for him to do, that the kids get to see it.
	It's more cool to watch it and look at it than eat it.
	The new movie Selfless released this month is a provocative psychological science fiction thriller.
	An extremely wealthy man dying from cancer undergoes a radical medical procedure that transfers his consciousness into the body of a healthy young man.
	It will take a few days, but it gets easier.
	How does that new body smell?
	Death has some side effects.
	Consciousness has been defined as individual awareness of your unique thoughts, memories, feelings, sensations, and environment.
	Your own unique consciousness lives in a series of brain cells or neurons which, when fired in certain patterns, cause you to recall memories and emotions, even smells and sounds.
	A study conducted at UCLA by lead researcher Martin Monti used MRI scans to study how the flow of information in the brains of 12 healthy volunteers changed as they lost consciousness under anesthesia with propofol.
	They concluded that consciousness does not live in a particular place in the brain but rather arises from the mode in which billions of neurons communicate with one another.
	So will it ever be possible to accurately map an individual's intricate and totally unique consciousness and upload it into another mind?
	According to ASAPSCIENCE, the short answer is yes, it will become possible one day.
	Scientists continue to research this field and have begun to locate the true storage location of consciousness within our brains.
	This is Dark Matter News.
	Researchers have discovered the world's oldest fossilized sperm.
	According to the new study, the cells date back some 50 million years.
	The sperm fragments were found and trapped in the wall of the fossilized worm cocoon in Antarctica.
	Sperm cells are rarely found in fossil record as they tend to be short-lived and have delicate structures that don't fossilize well.
	The researchers A research team from Sweden, Italy, and Argentina used a scanning electron microscope to look at the specimen's surface, which revealed the presence of the sperm cell fragments from a 50-million-year-old clitorata.
	Researchers suggest that the sperm fragments are similar to that of a group of leech-like worms found on the shells of modern crayfish in the Northern Hemisphere where they feed on dead organic matter.
	Further studies on the cocoon could reveal a great deal of information which has been overlooked by paleontologists who tend to focus on relatively hard structures like bones and shells.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	This is a video of the Dark Matter News.
	So relax, sit down, relax, enjoy.
	Graham Hancock.
	Actually, we have clear sailing all the way to the top of the hour.
	Graham, we're back on.
	Welcome.
	Okay, that is a number, but actually we don't invite you to call just yet. So relax sit down relax enjoy
	Graham Hancock, we're actually we have clear sailing all the way to the top of the hour Graham. We're back on
	welcome Thank you. All right
	Yes, there's so much to talk about I'm just brimming with this stuff at the moment, because I spent the last three years working on this new book, gathering the evidence, putting it
	Putting it together, I try to make data, complex data, as accessible as possible to open this up in a way that anybody can follow and understand.
	And in the process, I have to understand that data myself and really get on top of it.
	I think that's maybe the advantage of being a journalist rather than a scientist.
	I don't claim to be a scientist, and when the archaeologists call me a pseudo-archaeologist, I have to laugh, because I don't claim to be an archaeologist, and I don't want to be an archaeologist.
	I want to be an independent mind who's looking at the past.
	So for three years I've been working on Magicians of the Gods.
	The book is now finished.
	It's at press.
	It's going to be published in Britain on the 10th of September.
	It's going to be published in America on the 10th of November and if I can just do a little
	commercial if anybody is interested just go to my website GrahamHancock.com
	and it'll immediately take you to a page where you can learn more
	about magicians of the gods. You can do as much commercial as you want, no problem.
	So what are people going to say about this book? Are they going to say
	it's... I don't know.
	I honestly have no idea.
	You know, when I published Fingerprints of the Gods in 1995, I had no idea then what sort of storm was about to break over my head.
	I was really quite innocent and naive in this field.
	I had no idea How many toes I would be treading on, or how savage would be the reaction that followed.
	Well, how savage for magicians?
	You might as well make your prediction now.
	Well, I suspect it's going to be pretty tough, you know, and I'm having to brace myself for that.
	You know, I'm like anybody else.
	I don't want to be hated.
	It's nice to be liked.
	And when, you know, when people attack me personally, not just my work, not just what I say.
	Oh, that's different.
	You know, the attacks on me, personal attacks on me, suggesting, you know, that I'm, that I'm, I mean, there's just all kinds of, there's all kinds of ways that the debunking industry, those of us who are working in the field of alternative history and alternative science are constantly subjected to this barrage of debunking.
	Now, I don't, I don't and can't object to that.
	Well, look, if they move from the scientific, if they move from that over to your personal life or you, then it just means they don't know how to attack you on what you've said.
	Yeah, well, it does.
	And that, you know, that is a very, very common thing, unfortunately.
	And the, you know, the argument is that those of us who are working in this field are simply exploiting a gullible public.
	And I reject that, absolutely.
	I'm working in this field because I'm passionate about it.
	I feel that it, and I know that that's true of many of my colleagues working in this field.
	We feel passionate about it.
	We feel that there's information that needs to be shared and exposed about the past.
	And that's primarily why we do what we do.
	All right, we've got to talk a little bit about the pyramids, just because so much has happened.
	As you know, I had my tour of the pyramids, courtesy of your old buddy Zahi Awass.
	Yes, Zahi, good old Zahi.
	He talks up a storm, though.
	He's a great talker, and yeah, amusing to be shown the pyramids by him.
	Well, you're a great talker, too, and I imagine if you two got together, you'd probably come to fisticuffs.
	Well, we did get together in April, and it did kind of come to this.
	Really?
	Yeah, I've got the links to that on my website as well.
	We had a debate scheduled, but the debate, Zahi at the last moment refused to participate and got wildly angry, and they really behaved in a very strange manner.
	But fortunately, some of it was recorded on mobile phone, and it's out there on the Internet now.
	Zahi got into some trouble.
	He got arrested, he was accused, I guess, of trying to get things out of the country, when I always thought Zahi had been trying to get them all back into the country.
	Do you have any comments on that?
	No, I can't really comment on that.
	I haven't looked into depth in that.
	I'm more interested in Zahi's extremely negative impact on people's thinking as an archaeologist.
	That's really where I think he does the most damage.
	Championing of a redundant mainstream view, which he, you know, he is now trumpeted as the world's most famous Egyptologist.
	He even has his own clothing line, you know.
	Oh, now does he?
	Which he signs with the Zahi Hawass signature.
	He's got his own Indiana Jones hats.
	He's got his own safari suits.
	All of that, all of that kind of thing.
	He has become a very, He's a very famous public figure and he's an outspoken voice in favor of the mainstream view.
	In other words, that there is nothing mysterious in the past of ancient Egypt.
	And I think Zahi is doing all of us a disservice by spreading that view.
	All right, I'm going to tell you what he did when I was there.
	Go for it.
	He took me, of course I got to lay on the sarcophagus and all that stuff, but then he took me to an area where he showed me graves, he showed me inscriptions, he told me these are the people, the workers, who built the pyramids.
	And it was pretty extensive.
	What do you think I was looking at when he was describing all of that and we were standing there?
	Well look, there's no doubt that there was a massive amount of construction work at Giza quite apart from the pyramids.
	Giza is a gigantic construction site that's thousands of years old, where huge projects have been initiated and put underway.
	So certainly there will be workers' villages there.
	Certainly there were workforces there.
	Certainly we can find traces of those workforces.
	But were those the very workforces that built the Great Pyramid?
	That's another question.
	By the way, I'm not one of those who seeks to divorce the Great Pyramids entirely from the ancient Egyptians.
	I think we're looking at a very nuanced sight at Giza.
	And again, I go into this in Magicians of the Gods.
	We're looking at a sight that's not a simple sight.
	You know, there are two simplistic views of Giza.
	One is that it's all Thousands, 12,000, 15,000, 30,000, hundreds of thousands of years old, or that it was made by aliens or whatever.
	I think that's a very simplistic view.
	And the other is the mainstream Egyptological view that it was made entirely by the ancient Egyptians in the period from 3000 BC onwards.
	I think both views are wrong.
	I think we're looking at a very complicated site.
	I think that elements of the site are remotely ancient, and other aspects of the site were the work of the ancient Egyptians.
	The ancient Egyptians store themselves as the inheritors of And as the continuers of a very ancient tradition that had come down to them from the gods.
	Now we may argue about who or what those gods were, but we can't argue that that's what the ancient Egyptians said.
	And they said that their uncanny abilities to manipulate stone, and the ancient Egyptians were brilliant stone cutters and stone carvers, were a legacy of the knowledge of the gods.
	So we can see the ancient Egyptians as the continuers of a tradition and I trace that tradition
	back 12,500 years in such monuments as the subterranean chamber beneath the Great Pyramid. Of
	course the Great Sphinx is more than 12,000 years old and Robert Schoch's excellent geological
	work on the Sphinx going back to the 1990s has long ago made that case.
	The megalithic temples at Giza, the base courses of the Great Pyramids, but I think the pyramids themselves were completed by the ancient Egyptians, and I think they were using the same almost magical scientific techniques to do that job that had originally come down from a lost civilization.
	Do you just miss the ancient alien theory now?
	You know, it's a very interesting and also complex issue, and I don't dismiss it entirely.
	Let me, if I have a moment or two, tell you my views on this.
	Please.
	I think there's no doubt that the universe is filled with life.
	I don't think that human beings are just the only kind of life form in this vast and immeasurable universe.
	And I think there's compelling evidence for contact with other intelligences, if you like.
	And I think there's compelling evidence that that contact takes place now, and that it has taken place throughout human history.
	But what those other intelligences are exactly, that's not been settled yet at all.
	At the moment, we happen to be a spacefaring civilization, or we've begun to be.
	We've started sending spacecraft to the Moon, even to Pluto.
	We're exploring our immediate cosmic environment.
	Well, we've kind of started to back away a little bit, to be honest with you.
	Well, yes, we have.
	But the notion is not new to us any longer.
	Since the 1950s, 1960s, we have been... The idea that planetary beings can explore their cosmic environment isn't a strange one to us anymore.
	It's something that we've done ourselves.
	And therefore, when weird things happen and strange beings appear, and they may even appear to be in craft of some kind, we automatically jump to the conclusion that these must be visitors from other planets.
	Well, it could be more complicated than that.
	We shouldn't arrive at our conclusion before we've done the work.
	It could be that we're dealing, for example, that we're dealing with some kind of interdimensional connection.
	That this is much more mysterious and much more complicated than simply physical beings a bit like us crossing interstellar space in high-tech spaceships.
	Maybe what they're actually crossing is the veil between dimensions.
	Maybe that's why they're so elusive.
	Maybe that's how they can dip in and out of human culture.
	I have no doubt that something's going on.
	Well, actually, modern physics backs you up on that.
	Sure, it does.
	You know, I think we're just beginning to realize How mysterious the nature of reality actually is.
	We're just beginning to get that.
	This thing we call reality that we access through our five senses is very complicated and multi-layered and deep and perhaps endless.
	And that there are many different levels of vibration and many different levels of quote-unquote reality and that they all intersect and interact.
	So I think we should keep an open mind to what is behind the phenomenon that we are presently labeling as ET contact.
	I wrote a whole book about this called Supernatural Meetings with the Ancient Teachers of Mankind, where I set out my view.
	There's no doubt that something's going on, but let's keep an open mind as to what it is.
	Now, when it comes to the ancient astronaut question, I can only tell you this.
	That I have spent 25 years traveling around the world's most mysterious archaeological sites.
	I've climbed the Great Pyramid five times.
	I've dived to the bottom of the ocean looking at structures and ruins underwater.
	I've traveled the world for a quarter of a century and nowhere, not in any single ancient archaeological site, have I seen something that could only be explained By high-tech aliens doing it.
	By the way, this is only slightly related, but anything new on Yonaguni in Japan?
	Okinawa, actually?
	Yonaguni was 2002.
	I haven't been back since then.
	And, you know, in the way that the academic community does, they've just moved on and they ignore that, ignore the fact that there are gigantic man-made structures under the ocean off the southwest islands of Japan.
	That's the case.
	My point is, all of these mysteries from the past, which I have really an intimate and detailed knowledge of, I don't need the kind of level of technology that you need to cross interstellar space in order to explain them.
	A much simpler, much more elegant explanation is that we are a species with amnesia, that there has been a forgotten episode of human history, that there was an advanced civilization in the past and that that advanced civilization, human civilization, Lies at the source of all the archaeological mysteries
	which doesn't do away with aliens and other intelligences I would believe that civilization was in contact with them
	just as we are but I don't think that those alien and other Intelligences built the Great Pyramid. I think the Great Pyramid
	was the work of human beings And what do you think the purpose of the Great Pyramids
	would be?
	Multi multi-dimensional
	Many, many things.
	But one thing the Great Pyramid is for sure is a gigantic instrument that works on human consciousness.
	You can see this effect at work In the faces of all of us who are drawn to the Great Pyramid.
	People come from all over the world.
	It's like a beacon.
	Even in these troubled times in Egypt.
	And Egypt is going through very troubled times at the moment.
	That beacon reaches out and calls to us.
	And we all... So many people feel that at some time in their lives they need to make contact with the Great Pyramid.
	And let's ask ourselves why that should be.
	And I think it's because It works on humans.
	But first and foremost, it was designed to elevate and accentuate human consciousness.
	Okay, well, this is the absolute truth, my friend.
	I got to lay in that sarcophagus and I felt something very powerful.
	I don't know if it was my own mind, you know, sort of telling me I should be feeling that because I'm in this exotic place.
	But I felt something very strong.
	And, um...
	Me too.
	I've also had the privilege to lie down in that sarcophagus.
	And if you tone in there, you know, if you make a, if you make a, a note,
	it's just incredible what happens with the vibration around you.
	You can almost feel the veil between worlds thinning and feel yourself encountering other,
	other levels of reality that you might never have imagined were there before.
	There are many ways to alter human consciousness.
	And I've explored quite a number of those myself.
	But the Great Pyramid is, is an astonishing instrument for developing,
	I would say, for enhancing the potential of human consciousness.
	All right, I want to very quickly, because, you know, time is so short, I want to ask you about this, the Arab so-called spring.
	Yeah.
	What to say about it?
	Are you fearing the possibility of the destruction of so much that could be destroyed in Egypt.
	I mean, God knows, we have no idea what's going to happen.
	Even Italy is being threatened as this disaster spreads across... Yes.
	Well, unfortunately, in fundamentalist Islam, we have, within it, there are many great people in Islam, but within fundamentalist Islam, there is a kind of death cult operating at the moment, which hates the past.
	It cannot bear the past.
	Perhaps because it realizes that the past holds the key to unwinding the whole edifice of control that the mainstream religions represent.
	I don't separate Islam from Christianity and Judaism in this sense.
	Christianity, of course, has had to give way to the Enlightenment, but there are still fundamentalist Christians who would impose their vision on others, just as there are fundamentalist Muslims and just as there are fundamentalist Jews.
	At the end of the day, all these three religions worship the same God.
	You know, Jehovah, Allah, Yahweh, whatever you want to call Him.
	He's the God of Abraham.
	He's the same God in all cases.
	And unfortunately, I think the common point is fundamentalism.
	When people get so carried away with their beliefs that they're actually prepared to kill somebody else because of their beliefs, you know you're dealing with a true psychotic.
	And unfortunately these true psychotics are now in large numbers around the world and they appear to be dedicated to the destruction of our past.
	So when I say we're a species with amnesia, it's not just because we've suffered cosmic cataclysms in the past, it's also because human beings again and again have deliberately rubbed out the past.
	Christian mobs used to do that in Egypt in the 4th and 5th centuries AD.
	You go around the Egyptian temples, you'll see many of the figures pecked out.
	Somebody's taken a hammer and a chisel and just pecked them out.
	Well, that was Christians who did that, at a time when Christians were locked in the fundamentalist mindset, and this is what we need to free ourselves from if we're to move forward as a species.
	By all means, have spiritual values and spiritual beliefs, but never, ever, ever impose those values and beliefs on others.
	Alright, alright.
	The moment you do that, you're lost.
	Right, hold it right there.
	Graham Hancock is my guest.
	Can you imagine that?
	If those people haven't got their hands on Egypt in totality, this is midnight.
	It's midnight.
	All our time's on the clock.
	We're here but now they're gone.
	Seasons don't feel the same, but do the wind, the sun, the rain.
	We can be like they are.
	Come on, baby, don't feel the same.
	Baby, take my hand, don't feel the same.
	Baby, make it look right.
	Don't feel the same.
	Baby, I'm your man.
	It's not radio, but it is what's next.
	To cast your ray of light into the darkness, please call 1952.
	Call Art.
	That's 1-952-225-5278.
	I know everybody's doing it, but we've got so much ground we've got to cover.
	So much ground with Graham Hancock that I would ask that you hold your calls.
	And let's go back now to Graham Hancock.
	Graham, welcome back.
	You mentioned Consciousness.
	And when you do that, it's like opening the world for me, buddy.
	In all the years that I've spent on the radio, consciousness was the most interesting subject that I became drawn to from nearly every corner of discussion that I was in.
	And you mentioned other dimensions.
	Consciousness may be the key to those other dimensions if we can figure it out.
	Yeah, I'm convinced of that.
	I mean, whenever you have an issue of exploring reality, you have to remember that what you're exploring reality with is your consciousness.
	That's right.
	You know, your consciousness is therefore part of the equation.
	And it's not good enough simply to mount physical investigations of reality.
	Yes, we should be doing that.
	But we also need to investigate the instrument with which we are exploring reality, and that instrument is our consciousness.
	And when we start to investigate this mysterious instrument called consciousness that science, by the way, cannot explain, Mainstream science cannot explain consciousness.
	It's still the greatest mystery of science.
	We don't know actually what it is.
	When you start to investigate this using the tools that are available to us, extraordinary information starts to come out.
	I don't know about your audience, Art, but I need to say amongst those tools are those demonized substances, substances that our society hates and detests and actually sends us to prison for experimenting with, which are the psychedelics.
	You're a great guy.
	You do your own segues.
	It's just where I was going to take you.
	Let me back up a little bit.
	I heard, I heard a rumor that I'd like to confirm or deny on.
	Okay.
	I heard that you went long ago to a show somewhere and said that you felt That you had had enough marijuana.
	Oh yeah, I did.
	I did, actually.
	And that's absolutely true.
	But let's not include marijuana amongst the psychedelics.
	Although it is an intriguing consciousness-altering agent.
	And I'm very excited by what's happening in America, that the American people, state by state, Isn't it amazing?
	their independence and rolling back that absurd monstrous enterprise.
	Isn't it amazing? It's amazing.
	It's an incredible thing.
	I was in Colorado in May, and I just love the fact that there is a place where adults are actually treated like adults.
	Yes.
	Because in the rest of the world, adults are treated like children when it comes to their own consciousness.
	If there's anything that we should be sovereign over, that we should be able to make absolutely sovereign decisions over, it's our own consciousness.
	And yet, in all of the Western societies, the keys to our consciousness are held by the state.
	And if we explore our consciousness in non-orthodox ways, using, for example, psychedelics, then the state will ruin our lives and break down our doors and send us to prison.
	There's a grotesque abuse of human rights that's taking place under the name of the so-called War on Drugs.
	I'm not advocating drugs.
	I'm not telling people, go out and take drugs.
	What I'm advocating is adult responsibility.
	As adults, we should be able to make decisions about our own bodies, our own health, our own minds, and our own consciousness.
	We don't need the state to tell us what to do.
	So I'm thrilled that places like Colorado have rolled back this invasion of adult sovereignty, and have reimposed the right of adults to make decisions about their own consciousness regarding marijuana.
	Me too!
	Twenty years ago, I said, it's got to be legal, and people went, And then they talked about murders, and you know the whole thing.
	All the usual nonsense that's talked about to frighten us and terrify us, that's what governments do.
	They seek to press our fear buttons.
	And in the process they reveal themselves as liars.
	And that's what Colorado and the other states that have legalized marijuana are in the process of proving that all of those horror stories and all those horror predictions that were supposed to come out when marijuana was legalized turn out to be myths and that actually crime falls.
	Go, Graham, go!
	Useful projects, you know, the criminal gangs are put out of business, and all of it comes from respecting the right of adults to make decisions about their own consciousness, a right that should never have been taken away from us in the first place.
	All right, now I wish to ask you about something a little... Well, we started the question about marijuana, because this is... since you asked me it, I might as well answer it.
	Well, keep going, okay?
	Okay.
	And what happened was that I was a big user of marijuana for many, many, many, many, many years.
	I started late, actually.
	I started about the age of 37.
	But by the time I was in my 40s, I was smoking marijuana all day long.
	From morning to night.
	I was writing my books under the influence of marijuana.
	And it came to the point where I was smoking it 16 hours a day.
	Later on I turned to vaporizers and started using vaporizers.
	Much better for your lungs than combustion products from smoke.
	But I was abusing this herb.
	It's not the fault of the herb.
	It's me.
	It's my own personality, my own nature.
	I enjoyed it so much that I just wanted to do it all the time.
	And it began to have negative effects on my personality.
	And then I was in Brazil for a series of sessions with Ayahuasca, which is a powerful psychedelic that's been used in the Amazon for thousands and thousands of years.
	And during these sessions, I had a series of encounters with what I construed to be an intelligent entity.
	Many people refer to her as Mother Ayahuasca, the spirit behind the vine.
	And I was made clear to me that I had to change my relationship to cannabis radically.
	Otherwise I was really on a slippery slope.
	It wasn't serving me anymore, I was serving it.
	Well, was this for your new mistress, Ayahuasca?
	Well, you wonder about the conflict between the spirits behind the herbs.
	So here's what happened.
	I gave up cannabis for three years, and I feel I can now have a relationship with cannabis again, but never on that abusive level where I would do it 16 hours a day.
	I think, like any other powerful substance, it has to be treated with respect.
	and my problem was I wasn't treating it with respect. I've learned that lesson
	now and it was a lesson that I needed to learn. I think to some degree
	I would make the statement that I believe that marijuana in milder amounts perhaps than you're talking
	about contributes to creativity now.
	Definitely.
	Definitely?
	Really?
	Definitely.
	No doubt about it.
	Look, not for everyone.
	You know, we all have different body chemistry.
	Some people, marijuana doesn't serve at all.
	Just as there are some people that other medicines don't serve.
	But others, definitely there is a breakthrough in creativity.
	I don't think I would have written any of my books of historical mystery if I had not started smoking marijuana at the age of 37.
	Really?
	Back in 1987, just a couple of years before I began to work seriously on the book that became The Sign and the Seal.
	I was already doing that research, but when I began to think of it as a book, I have to say marijuana played a part in that.
	Fingerprints of the Gods, the book that I'm best known for, was written entirely under the influence of marijuana.
	I wrote from morning to night and I smoked from morning to night.
	Amazing.
	And I have no doubt that it loosens up creative processes in my mind, at any rate, but only if it's treated with respect.
	If I then, what I then went on to do was to make this the centerpiece of my life, and that was a mistake.
	And I was shown that mistake very clearly in a series of visions with Ayahuasca, and the net effect was that I quit marijuana for three years.
	All right.
	Now, Ayahuasca is something I have never done, so if you're able to do it, I would love you to describe your experiences with it.
	Okay.
	It's interesting.
	I mean, Ayahuasca is now becoming quite a feature in pop culture, and you have various pop stars and artists who are taking ayahuasca, it's been around for thousands and
	thousands of years.
	The archaeological evidence traces the use of ayahuasca in the Amazon back more than
	five thousand years.
	It probably goes back a whole lot further than that.
	It means the vine of souls in the Quechua language of the Andes.
	That's what ayahuasca actually means, the vine of souls or the vine of the dead.
	And its particular property is its ability to connect us with the realm of the dead and with the deceased.
	And very often it's the case when we lose someone close to us that we have unfinished business with them.
	And one of the things that ayahuasca can do is enable you to reconnect with that person in the realm of spirit.
	The other thing, it does many things.
	But first and foremost, let me describe the process.
	It's made of two jungle plants, the ayahuasca vine and a bush that is called chacruna in the Amazon.
	The botanical name is Cicotria viridis, and the leaves of that bush contain dimethyltryptamine, DMT, the most powerful hallucinogen known to man.
	Now normally DMT can't be absorbed orally.
	There's an enzyme in the gut called monoamine oxidase that neutralizes DMT.
	So if you try to drink DMT in any form, the monoamine oxidase in the gut will shut it off.
	And this is where, you know, we have to reckon with the very clever ethnopharmacology of the Amazonian peoples, because the other element of the brew, the ayahuasca vine itself, contains a monoamine oxidase inhibitor.
	It switches off that enzyme in the gut and allows the DMT in the leaves to be absorbed orally, producing a journey, an exploration of the far side of reality that can last up to four hours.
	Whereas DMT in its pure form, smoked, is a rocket ship to the other side of reality that will just take you there for like 12 minutes.
	and then you're back in this space.
	Ayahuasca allows a much longer, much deeper, much more reflective journey,
	a journey over which you have some control.
	If you don't like where you're being taken, you can object and stop the journey,
	or at least pause it.
	There's much more negotiation with ayahuasca.
	Tastes bad, horrible taste, one of the most ghastly tastes on the planet.
	Nobody need imagine that anybody is drinking ayahuasca for kicks.
	It makes you vomit, it gives you diarrhea.
	Oh my.
	It also, so at a physical level, it's very tough, but it also plunges you into this
	seamlessly convincing parallel universe where you do encounter
	what appear to be other intelligences.
	Now, Some scientists would say that they're just phantasms of our own minds.
	It's just our brain on drugs, and maybe they're right, but I don't agree with them.
	I think that what's happening is that the receiver wavelength of the brain is being retuned by DMT.
	And we are gaining access to other levels of reality.
	And those other levels of reality appear to have an interest in the planet.
	Other levels of reality, or do you think possibly other dimensions?
	Well, that's what I mean, really.
	By other levels of reality, I mean other dimensions.
	I guess we could define reality, perhaps, as this dimension.
	Yeah, that's what we call reality, is this dimension that we can access with our five senses, that we can weigh, measure, and count.
	That we can investigate with science, and so on and so forth.
	But the revolutionary possibility that is being raised by quantum physics, and that Ayahuasca raises at the level of experience, is that there are freestanding other dimensions that are aware of us, even though we may not usually be aware of them.
	Did you, in your opinion, did you encounter another intelligence?
	Absolutely, definitely so.
	This is what I feel I've encountered.
	It's a bit like an ancient Greek encountering the goddess Athena.
	You know, there's an intelligence that speaks to you and communicates with you.
	And I realize that, you know, anybody who's not had this experience may regard that as slightly lunatic.
	But I would say, you know, withhold your judgment if you get the chance.
	Have some sessions with Ayahuasca.
	It's available in the United States now.
	A couple of Ayahuasca churches from Brazil even function legally in the United States.
	The União de Vegetal and the Santo Deme.
	It's possible to have a legal experience with Ayahuasca on the grounds of religious belief in the United States.
	It's a very interesting experience.
	Now, I was not aware that you could do that legally.
	Well, you have to, at least in token, join one of these churches.
	When I say churches, they're the rather typical syncretic Brazilian spiritual traditions that mix together the aspects of many different religions.
	But both the União de Vegetal, the UDV, and the Santo Deme, have chapters in the United States, they have got Supreme Court exemption for their members to drink ayahuasca, because again, this is one of the great things about the United States, you know, is that there is this recognition that we do have certain rights, and those rights include the right to sacred space.
	Okay, hold it right there, we're going to break.
	So, in other words, praise the Lord, pass the ayahuasca.
	All right, hold it right there.
	Graham Hancock is my guest.
	Good morning, afternoon, evening.
	Whatever it is, wherever you are, this is Midnight in Jesse.
	I'm going to be a good boy.
	That's 1952.
	Call Art.
	Again, hold your calls.
	We're so deeply into this conversation right now that it is going to be difficult to take questions.
	However, I will say this.
	I've got a message from a Canadian.
	It just came in.
	Somebody up in Canada calls himself the Canadian Walrus.
	And he says, you know, your guest, Graham, has just lost all his credibility and respect in my book.
	And this person read your books and loved them.
	But now that they've heard that you wrote them under the influence of marijuana, all respect is gone.
	Yeah, I'm quite used to that.
	You know, it's unfortunately the case that the very large majority of our populations have been brainwashed.
	by forty plus years of mental conditioning exercise called the war on drugs and we now have At a social level, deep-rooted, knee-jerk reactions, which it's impossible for people to overcome.
	I mean, my view is if my work was valuable before it was revealed that I used marijuana when I wrote it, then it should still be valuable afterwards.
	I mean, the work is the work, you know?
	And perhaps it can be separated from the person who produced it.
	The work stands.
	If the work was good before, it should still be good.
	And if it can be, you know, if somebody can change their view, on the quality of a piece of work because of the mental
	state of the individual who produced that piece of work at that time,
	you know, that that person was exploring an altered state of consciousness.
	If that writes off the work, then nothing much I can do about it.
	No, I suppose not.
	I believe in being up front with my readers about who I am and what I do,
	and I think altered states of consciousness are important.
	I wrote my book, Supernatural, to show that the embracing of altered states of consciousness by our ancestors 30 or 40,000 years ago was undoubtedly what switched on the modern human mind.
	And some of the greatest thinkers of our time, I mean, I wonder if you're If the person who sent you that message has also written off all the work of Carl Sagan, you know, because Carl Sagan was a great advocate of marijuana and a very big user of marijuana, I wonder if they're going to write off the work of Francis Crick, the discoverer of the double helix of DNA, because Francis Crick regularly used LSD in the early 1950s and late 1940s.
	Well, we'll see if I get another message.
	Steve Jobs and Steve Wozniak.
	Steve Jobs, yes.
	LSD played a huge role in the creation of the Apple computer, so we can either shut our eyes and our ears to all these facts and just bow down to the war on drugs and to the war on our minds that it has involved, or we can think for ourselves.
	That's a free choice for every individual.
	Okay, so he now says he's turning off his computer permanently.
	That's okay.
	Just kidding, I added that.
	Alright, I want to know a little more about the communication you had under Ayahuasca.
	It obviously stopped you from the marijuana use or taught you something about that use.
	It interrupted my marijuana use and taught me that if I were to continue with it, it would need to be in a much more respectful manner.
	I realized that I am using a sacred medicinal herb here, not a crutch to lean on 16 hours a day.
	And that was a very important realization for me.
	Marijuana, in my opinion, is very valuable in stimulating creative insight, but it's also very seductive, and she can draw you down into this place where you really don't do all that much.
	I mean, these days I would not write a book under the influence of marijuana.
	I'd rather not spend You know, the entire day, puzzling over a single paragraph.
	Did that really go on?
	Yes, it went on.
	It went on.
	I write faster now, and I believe better.
	The inspiration is still there, but putting it down on words, I don't want to be smoking marijuana.
	Were there any other valuable communications while using ayahuasca?
	I'm very curious about that.
	Well, most important of all, it's well recognized amongst those who've drunk ayahuasca that you go through a kind of life review.
	You get to look at episodes from your life and your interactions with other people, not from your own point of view, but from their point of view.
	And this can show you that you may not have been as kind and welcoming and nurturing and as positive an influence as you imagined you were.
	I was going to say, it's a frightening thing to go through as a review of your own life.
	It's a frightening thing to go through and it's why ayahuasca is sometimes described as 20 years of psychotherapy in one night.
	And it's why people burst into tears in ayahuasca sessions, because you suddenly get it from the other person's point of view, that actually you hurt them really badly that time.
	Those words that you said, that you thought were perfectly justified, turned out to be a cruel attack.
	on another person, and you see that from that other person's point of view.
	So what it's doing is, it's not asking you to welter in self-pity about how negatively you behaved in the past.
	It's saying, listen, this is the truth about you.
	You want to do something about it?
	Well, now you know the truth.
	You can do something about it.
	You get to see yourself as you've never seen yourself before, and that gives you the You know, what you're describing sounds an awful lot like an NDE.
	Yes, a near-death experience.
	It's very similar to a near-death experience, and again, let's remember, this is the vine of souls or the vine of the dead.
	It is very similar to an induced near-death experience, and that sense of passing through a tunnel and of encountering spirits of the deceased is a very common part of the ayahuasca journey and again we're dealing with the mystery
	of consciousness here and I happen to believe that we should use
	uh all of these ancient plant technologies because that's what they are they're ancient plant technologies that have
	been used in shamanistic culture for tens of thousands of years
	We should deploy them to exploring the mystery of consciousness, which is truly the greatest mystery of all
	Really, outer space can wait, as far as I'm concerned.
	Let's get to grips with inner space first.
	Once we've settled all of that, then we might be more mature and in better shape to begin our exploration of the outside world.
	All right, I've really got to quickly ask you about this, and that is, clearly, no matter what you believe, global warming Man-caused, just changes going on that are somehow natural.
	It really is changing very quickly now.
	Well look, the world's climate, geology bears witness to the fact that the world's climate can change radically overnight.
	This has happened many times in the past.
	Before the last ice age set in, go back 130, 140,000 years ago and you find yourself in a time of massive climate instability with huge rises and falls in temperature.
	12,800 years ago, induced by comet impact, you have the extraordinary climate change of the Younger Dryas.
	Huge factors are at work in the climate of the Earth.
	It's a very complicated system.
	Undoubtedly, one of those factors is human beings, but we're not the only factor at all, and we'd be stupid to think we are.
	Do you think we're beginning something that, at least as humans, we've got a pretty delicate balance, Graham, and so are we moving towards something that is not going to sustain us?
	Well, as long as we remain motivated by green interest, yes, that's the case.
	That's true of the general damage we're doing to the planet, irrespective of the argument about climate change.
	I think we need, I've said already, we need to recognize there are many factors at work that influence the climate of planet Earth.
	It's a delicately balanced system and humanity is undoubtedly one of those factors.
	But what we need to do, I think what we need to do is focus less on climate and climate change as such.
	And more on our own behavior for the sake of looking at our own behavior.
	What is it we're doing in the world today that is really good and helpful for the future?
	And what is it that we're doing in the world today that's negative and destructive and dark?
	And the human project, regardless of issues like climate, the human project should be to fill ourselves with light and to eliminate the darkness as much as possible.
	So anything we do as nations that is damaging to this gorgeous God, another planet that we live on.
	Yes.
	It's something we should stop doing because it's right to stop doing it, regardless of what happens to climate.
	All right.
	All right.
	Listen, will you come back in this final segment and at least answer a question or two from the audience?
	Of course.
	I'd love to hear from the audience.
	All right.
	All right.
	If any of them are still with us after I... Oh, they are.
	They are.
	Stay right there.
	This is Midnight in the Desert.
	I'm Art Bell.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	Given the fundamental importance of our DNA, it is logical to assume that damage to it is undesirable and spells bad news.
	After all, we know that cancer can be caused by mutations that arise from such injury.
	But a surprising new study is turning that idea on its head with the discovery that brain cells actually break their own DNA to enable us to learn and form memories.
	Well, that may sound counterintuitive.
	It turns out that the damage is necessary to allow the expression of a set of genes called early response genes, which regulate various processes that are critical in the creation of long lasting memories.
	These lesions are rectified pronto by repair systems.
	But interestingly, it seems that this ability deteriorates during aging, leading to a buildup
	of damage that could ultimately result in the degeneration of our brain cells.
	These findings could have important implications because earlier work has demonstrated that
	aging is associated with a decline in the expression of genes involved in the processes
	of learning and memory formation.
	It therefore seems likely that the DNA repair system deteriorates with age, but at this
	stage it is unclear how these changes occur.
	So the researchers plan to design further studies to find out.
	Tales of black-eyed children began appearing on online forums in the late 1990s.
	Explanations as to what they are include alien-human hybrids, demon-possessed children and cryptoterrestrials.
	Regardless of their origin, one thing is certain.
	They're terrifying.
	Recently reports of black-eyed kid sightings have resurfaced.
	Black-eyed children have become a staple in conversations of the strange and unknown, and almost every reported encounter is eerily similar.
	Children as young as six years old to adult age approach people alone or with a partner and beg for help.
	Please let us in.
	Give us a ride.
	Follow us here.
	Permission to enter is always a legendary trait of a vampire.
	For some reason, these children frighten you.
	And as your hand reaches up to open the door, you see why.
	Their eyes are black.
	No iris.
	No whites.
	Just an empty, soulless void.
	Many are convinced that these children and people like them aren't human.
	At least not anymore.
	It is unspecified what happens should you comply with their demands, as no reports of the black-eyed kids have included that happening, possibly indicating the death of those that comply.
	Whatever these entities are, the fact is people around the globe are encountering beings that look human but are something else, something dark.
	Organizers of the Russian Town's annual Mosquito Festival said this year's event will include a Most Delicious Girl contest for women who don't mind bug bites.
	The festival features the contest with women in shorts and vests standing still for 20 minutes to allow the blood-sucking insects to feast.
	This is Dark Matter News.
	The world's first full head transplant could take place as soon as 2017 if the controversial plans by Italian neuroscientist Dr. Sergio Canavero come to pass.
	Wheelchair-bound Valery Spiridonov, who has the muscle-wasting Weirdnig-Hoffmann disease, has volunteered to have his head transplanted onto a healthy body in a day-long operation.
	The proposed surgery is highly controversial and its feasibility has been questioned by experts.
	But Dr. Canavero's plans also raise complex philosophical and ethical issues.
	A natural question is whether a living person with Spiridonov's head and someone else's body would be the same person as Spiridonov.
	If what matters to Spiridonov is mental continuity as well as having a healthy body, then it will not be possible to determine whether the surgery is successful in these terms until after the event.
	The impact of head transplants on our mental lives remains unknown.
	For Dark Matter News, I'm Leo Ashcraft.
	The clock strikes twelve and Midnight in the Desert is pounding packets your way on
	about Dark Matter Digital Network.
	To call the show, please direct your finger digits to dial 1952-225-5278.
	That's 1952.
	Call Art.
	And I'm the one called Art.
	Hi, everybody.
	This is Midnight in the Desert.
	My guest is Graham Hancock, and this is Hood Stuff.
	So, let's go back to Graham, and Graham, I know it's going to be hard, but try to keep it short.
	Sorry, like I say, I'm so brimming with new information, it's very difficult to keep it short, but I'll do my best.
	I can clearly hear that.
	Alright, let's give it a try.
	Somewhere in California, it's midnight and you're on the air.
	Yeah, hi Art, this is Ward calling in Running Springs, California, and I'm listening on 1050 AM in Loma Linda.
	Yes.
	And I just want to say, first of all, Uber Roswell to you, Art, for being back.
	Thank you.
	Yeah, and hello Bell Gabbers, but Graham, I had a question for you.
	I really respect how passionate you are, and you know, you were looking for an explanation, maybe the, you know, anthropologist or whatever, but you seem to be an explorer of consciousness, and I think you really kind of define what that term is, and You think you're either scaring the people out there, but you're not.
	You're really putting us on fire.
	I myself had an experience.
	I used to look at this stuff as sort of all New Agey and everything else, but the more I've gotten into biology, I feel like we're missing a connection that we're having between You know, between us and plants.
	I mean, they really are the yin to our yang.
	Absolutely.
	Plant intelligence, you know, we have to realize we're not the only intelligent species on this planet.
	You know, plants may manifest their intelligence in a different way, but the way that plants can affect human consciousness is quite extraordinary and, I believe, deliberate.
	So there is a connection, or there can be a connection.
	Somebody else, let me see, I get these messages while I'm on the air, and they really want to know, again, if you received any other important messages while on Ayahuasca.
	Well, yes, and it's the simplest message of all, you know.
	We need to set aside hate and fear and suspicion.
	We have to stop fearing one another, both at a personal, individual level and at national levels as well.
	And we have to manifest love.
	For too much of my life, I did not manifest love.
	Ayahuasca, more than anything else, has taught me that that's our central mission here.
	That's what we're actually here to do.
	And while we cannot change our past, we can make sure that we act in a more loving and positive way in the future.
	All right.
	Off to Hilo, Hawaii, we go.
	Hello.
	It's midnight.
	You're on.
	Yes.
	Aloha, Art and Graham.
	My name is Pete.
	Hi, Pete.
	Okay.
	Here on the Big Island, we have an actual church of the Ayahuasca.
	Where they actually do ceremonies and stuff like that.
	Yeah, excellent, which is again, you know, the Supreme Court has granted legal exemption for members of the ayahuasca churches to work with this extraordinary brew.
	Yep, they sure have.
	Okay, so my question is, in the ancient cultures and stuff like that, they used mushrooms and psychedelics and stuff like that.
	the neurological diseases that we seem to have now in our society like Parkinson's and stuff like that.
	Yeah. Did they have it back then? Because I haven't really been able to find anything that
	shows anything that... I think they had it much less.
	One thing that's come clear to me from my study of ancient civilizations is that the use of psychedelic plants was very extensive in the ancient world, and I think it led to healthy civilizations in the past, and healthy individuals.
	I think that our society today is the opposite of that.
	You know, we think we've got all the truth, but actually our society is just a little Pimple on the backside of history.
	You know, history is a gigantic, deep and ancient, and, you know, modern technological society, which has been fighting the so-called war on drugs for, you know, 40 years, is a really recent comer.
	And actually, it's our civilization that is the aberration.
	We are out of step with the human story.
	We are medicating our populations massively, often against their will, with deeply dangerous pharmaceutical drugs.
	And at the same time, we are denying our population access to the healing powers of ancient visionary plants that have been trial-tested in human society for thousands and thousands of years.
	And obviously, this is a huge mistake, and it manifests in what I call the unconsciousness and the insanity of modern technological society.
	Alright, let me try Skype.
	James, wherever you are, you're on midnight.
	G'day, this is James from Adelaide, Australia.
	Perhaps your first international caller from last night's test show.
	You are, we had many last night, but yes, from Australia, you're on with Graham.
	G'day, Graham.
	I actually got to meet David Hatcher Childress last week at my very first UFO conference in Melbourne, as well as Eric Von Daniken.
	I had a question regarding the ancient destruction that you talk about.
	Have you at all looked into the information in the Billy Meyer case regarding the great catastrophe of over 11,000 years ago and the destruction of Atlantis?
	I haven't looked into the Billy Meyer case.
	I've looked into an enormous amount of information on the destruction of Atlantis, and it plays an important role in my new book.
	But the Billy Meyer case has escaped me.
	Tell me more.
	Well, I think you pretty much know what Billy Meyer is about, right?
	And the sightings he had, the pictures he posted, and all the rest of that, right?
	No, I really haven't followed it.
	Oh, well then that's a whole other story.
	Let's go to Kaelin, is that right?
	Killeen Park?
	Killeen, is that right?
	Uh, Killeen.
	Killeen, I'm sorry.
	Welcome to the program, it's midnight and you're on.
	Uh, well Art, it's wonderful to be on the air with you.
	Thank you, thank you.
	It's a shame I'm not your first Australian call, I would have liked to be.
	I was wondering if Mr. Hitchcock, uh, was it Hitchcock by the way?
	No, Hancock.
	Hancock, Hancock, I'm sorry.
	I was wondering if Mr. Hancock had any opinions on the unearned bears.
	Uh, I can't pronounce it, it's German.
	Their work with psychedelics during World War Two.
	The use of psychedelics by the Germans in World War Two?
	What I can tell you is psychedelics are powerful agencies.
	They can be used for good or for ill.
	All is not sweetness and light in the psychedelic garden.
	The ancient Aztecs used psychedelics as part of their human sacrifice rituals.
	The fact that one uses a psychedelic does not automatically mean that one is a good person.
	It's the intention that is brought to the psychedelic experience that matters.
	And if very negative and dark intentions are brought to it, then the consequences can be extremely negative and dark.
	And it wouldn't surprise me if the death cult of the Nazis made use of these substances to enhance their occult powers.
	That is unfortunately the case with these psychedelic instruments.
	And they are used also in shamanistic cultures.
	There are healers, curanderos, And there are sorcerers, brujos.
	What matters is the choices we make and the intention we bring to the experience.
	If that intention is positive, it is filled with love, it is filled with light, then so also will be the experience.
	Dillon?
	Thank you very much, Mr. Hancock.
	That was an interesting answer.
	Okay.
	I wish I knew more about your work so I could discuss it with you.
	Well, there are... Wait a minute now, there are books.
	You'll find out all about it.
	Right.
	GrahamHancock.com.
	I'd like to have a look in.
	All right.
	Thank you, Art.
	Thank you very much, and take care.
	Let's go back to the phones, and you're on the air.
	Hi.
	It's midnight.
	You're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hi, Art.
	Hello.
	Hi, Graham.
	Hi there.
	Hi.
	I watched one of your interviews with Art probably a couple of years ago, and I was just wondering if I can ask a question about something you said, you can ask a question about anything
	you like.
	Yes, go ahead.
	Okay, I remember you saying something about the Sphinx, or a Sphinx in Egypt or something like that, and you said
	that there was like water marks on the side of it or something.
	Ah, okay.
	Yes, I was talking about what is called the precipitation-induced weathering of the Sphinx.
	The fact that the Sphinx, at some point in its long history, the great Sphinx of Giza, was subjected to thousands of years of heavy rainfall.
	You have not had that rainfall in Egypt in the historic period, in the last 5,000 years.
	You have to go back to the end of the last Ice Age.
	Okay, going to the Skype line.
	Triana, I think it is?
	twelve thousand eight hundred eleven thousand six hundred years ago you have
	to go back all that way to find the kind of rain in egypt that could have caused
	the weathering we see on the body of the sphinx therefore professor robert shock
	at boston university and john anthony west of championed this case
	for many years now therefore
	distinct must be more than twelve thousand years old okay going to the uh...
	as guideline uh... triana i think it is a little hello
	Triana, are you there?
	Jesus.
	Going once, going twice, and gone.
	So we'll go to the international Skype, and I think we've got somebody named Pete.
	Hello, Pete.
	Hello.
	Yes.
	Turn off your device, please.
	Okay, do you have a, where are you first of all?
	I'm in the Philippines.
	In the Philippines?
	I'm in Makati's old, in Art's old hometown of Makati.
	My first Philippine call.
	Okay, well you're on with Graham Hancock.
	Art, awesome, great, great to hear you.
	I have first a question about Makati.
	You used to live here?
	Yes.
	Where did you live?
	What building?
	Well, I'm not going to tell you what building.
	Bonifacio, Bonifacio Global City.
	That much I'll say.
	You won't even recognize the fort now.
	The fort is booming with construction.
	I'm sure it's changed, yes.
	First Avenue, if that helps you.
	Okay, great, great.
	I'm sure I can figure out from there.
	And where's your wife from?
	Is she from the province?
	No, she's from Mininau.
	Now, anyway, we've got a guest, so do you have a question?
	Quick question for Graham.
	I love traveling, and I love old temple complexes.
	I've been to the pyramids in Egypt.
	I've been to Chichen Itza, Nicaragua, Java, some places like that, Thailand, and Kauai.
	You've been to Barabudur in Java.
	Yes.
	Java is amazing.
	Do you recommend any other places in Asia especially that are powerful?
	The energy, I really like the energy feel, the thing you feel in your chest like you're somewhere special.
	Yeah, one word answer, Angkor in Cambodia.
	Oh, I've been there.
	Yeah, spent a week there and still didn't see everything.
	Amazing and majestic.
	And be there on the spring equinox.
	Be there on the 21st of March at dawn and you'll see something amazing happen.
	Yeah, I was in Tikal on an equinox and they light fires on the peaks of the temples and they all line up in a row.
	At night, and it's amazing to see, and then it lines up with the moon rocks.
	The ancients were masters of a lost science, of connection, of sky and ground, as above, so below.
	Okay.
	Well, thank you very much from the Philippines.
	That was sort of home.
	Let's go back to the phone lines and say, Royal Oak, I think in Michigan, you're on midnight.
	Hello, hello.
	Glad to be on.
	I'm listening through, I believe, 7490 on shortwave.
	It's coming in great here in Michigan.
	Yeah, hey.
	Yes, that's true.
	We're on shortwave.
	We're all over the place.
	I'm trying to get the call sign, WCBQ.
	I'm so glad you found us.
	Yes, so anyway, I'm glad to be on and enjoying the interview and your introduction.
	You mentioned the mother culture, and this was before we had our Australian callers, but it made me think of something in Aborigine practices, the symbolic death, sacred rebirth, basically the initiation rites.
	They kidnap, when a child comes of age, it's sort of a faux kidnapping into a cave, he re-emerges as sort of a symbolic rebirth, becoming an adult.
	And actually, of course, such rituals are found all around the world.
	Oh, yes, I was just going to say... As in being reborn, for example.
	Sure.
	Yes, it even plays into the rites of Freemasonry, all kinds of things.
	So my question was, these commonalities we see across, you know, geographic borders, is there a connection here?
	Is it something to do with Universal Consciousness?
	Is there something in our DNA?
	Do you have... No, I think it's certainly, certainly that's part of it, but I trace it back to a universal culture, that there was a global advanced civilization during the Ice Age.
	That it was all but completely wiped out in cataclysms between 12,800 and 11,600 years ago.
	But that there were survivors and that they passed down a common legacy all around the world.
	And we see the manifestation, the reworking, the reincarnation, the resurrection of those ideas in many different ancient civilizations, which appear to be unconnected.
	But if you go back far enough to the very roots You find that they are connected through the shared influence of a lost civilization.
	Okay.
	Boy, we don't have a lot of time left, do we?
	Hello there.
	You're on the air.
	It's midnight and you're on the air.
	Good afternoon.
	Oh, good morning, actually.
	Good morning from Scotland.
	Welcome.
	How are you doing?
	I'm doing very well, thank you.
	Wonderful to have you back on the air.
	Thank you.
	We don't have a lot of time, so hit us with a question.
	The question.
	All right, this is going to blow everybody.
	Would you comment on... Graham, thank you for coming on.
	Would you comment on the idea that there are two sphinxes and that, indeed, the sphinxes aren't lions but dogs?
	I definitely don't think the Sphinx is a dog.
	I think that's a mistaken idea, connecting the Sphinx to Anubis, the Psychopompo, Guide of Souls.
	I think the Sphinx has always been a lion.
	I think it was at one point entirely a lion, and that its head was reworked into human form during the historical period by Egyptian pharaohs, but that the body is much better.
	The connections of the Sphinx Really?
	the constellation of Leo at the equinox, takes us back to that epoch of 12,500 years ago
	when the world was going through a turbulent and traumatic change.
	So I have no doubt about the Leonine connection.
	Many ancient artworks show us two Sphinxes, and it wouldn't surprise me at all if under
	the sands of the desert a second Sphinx awaits discovery.
	Really?
	You really think there may be a second?
	Oh yes.
	it's very it's very likely that there's a second Sphinx.
	In fact, on the UK cover of my new book, I show two Sphinxes.
	The American cover is different, but the content of the book is the same in both cases.
	And let me ask, if the audience are interested in what I've said, And if you want to help my work, please pre-order Magicians of the Gods.
	Just go to GrahamHancock.com, go to the Magicians of the Gods page, and you'll see the possibility of pre-ordering there.
	You'll strengthen me, you'll strengthen my book, you'll give me a chance in the argument if you do that.
	Oh, I think there are many who will wish to do that.
	Very quickly, let me try Lewis on Skype.
	Lewis, hello there.
	You're on the air.
	It's midnight.
	Yes, go ahead.
	Oh, hi.
	I'm sorry, I'll make this quick.
	Okay, you're going to have to get very close to your microphone.
	Listen to me.
	Listen to me.
	You're going to have to get very close to your microphone.
	Thank you.
	Thank you for your patience.
	Go ahead.
	I want to know about Ganung Padang in West Java, Indonesia.
	If you could give us a quick update.
	Thanks for asking that.
	Gunung Padang is a 25,000-year-old pyramid in Indonesia, which has been explored and investigated as the result of the work of an extraordinary Indonesian geologist called Danny Hillman.
	And I have made three visits to Gunung Padang, extensive research visits.
	This is the most extraordinary site in the world today, and I cover it in depth in my book, Magicians of the Gold.
	Well, all right.
	It is, perhaps a little early.
	It's such a pleasure having you on the program.
	Graham, you've got to come back.
	You've absolutely got to come back.
	I would love to come back, Art.
	It's a delight to talk to you.
	It's been many years.
	It's great to hear your voice.
	I'm so glad you're back on the air.
	I wanted to give you that solidarity.
	I regard you as an old friend, a great broadcaster, and I'm so glad that you're back on the airwaves, sharing your wisdom.
	Thanks, buddy.
	We'll do it again.
	Okay.
	Good night.
	All right.
	That's it.
	That's it for tonight.
	We're just simply out of time.
	Thank you all very much.
	Have a wonderful night and we'll do it again tomorrow.
	We'll take us on a ride, filled with the longing, searching for the truth.
	Will we make it till tomorrow?
	Will the stars shine on you?
	Midnight in the desert, and we're listening.
	I'm less than a youth.
	Midnight in the desert, and there's wisdom in the air.
	I've been looking for the answers, all my life I've held you there.
	Oh As the world we live in threatens I'll be heeding all the signs Have we lost our intuition?
	Are we running out of time?

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