Knowledge Fight Interactive Search Tool

All Episodes

Previous Next

Oct. 20, 2006 - Art Bell

02:37:11

Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Invisibility - Open Lines - Dr. Roy Spencer - Global Climate Change

Large

Audio Only |

Scroll

Time	Text
	From the Southeast Asian capital city of the Philippines, Manila, good day, good morning, good afternoon, good evening, whatever the case may be, wherever you are, I'm Art Bell, filling in for George Norrie, who is taking a well-deserved night off.
	My God, if you'd ever done five or six nights of talk radio a week, you would understand how much, occasionally, you need a little time off.
	So, I am here to fill in for George tonight.
	I've got a few things that I want to cover before we get to our first hour guest.
	We can play pretty fast and loose here because we've got open lines after Roy Spencer.
	He's going to be here talking about our climate.
	So, just a few things I want to cover.
	Number one, my webcam photograph tonight.
	Is an interesting one indeed.
	At least for me.
	And perhaps for some U.S.
	amateur radio operators.
	You know, I'm a ham radio operator.
	And as you can see, by the way, my webcam is in a different place.
	You'll see at the top of the website, coastcoastam.com, it says Arts Webcam.
	It's usually over on the left-hand side.
	Right now, tonight, they stuck it at the top.
	Now, that is my lifetime membership in something called PARA, the Philippine Amateur Radio Association, and I hope that's what you're getting.
	That's not what I'm getting, but I hope that's what you're getting.
	That's what I put up there.
	As you can see, I am D1W60BB.
	How about that?
	Pretty cool.
	I'm very proud of that.
	So, licensed by reciprocal agreement now to operate here in the Philippines.
	Next step, put up an antenna.
	Easier said than done.
	We're on the 19th floor.
	That's just one floor from the roof of a building here.
	And speaking of the 19th floor, last night, Oh, I forget the time, but it was pretty late, you know, 1 o'clock or 1.30 in the morning or 2 o'clock, something like that.
	Anyway, we had an earthquake.
	Now, it rocked and rolled.
	This was about only a 5.6, something like that, about 90 miles south of Manila, but on the 19th floor of the building.
	Now, they even felt it down on the main floor, but up here on the 19th floor, It was kind of like an amusement park ride.
	The building, of course, is modern and meant to withstand that sort of thing, but it still had the amusement ride kind of feeling to it, if you follow me.
	The back and forth.
	You know, we're 200 feet in the air, swaying back and forth.
	Hmm.
	Isn't this fun?
	Aaron came running in and said, oh my god.
	And I said, no, it's just an earthquake.
	It'll be all right.
	And it took a while to settle down.
	And we rocked back and forth for a while.
	So there you have it.
	Here's something I want to cover.
	This is very important.
	Unbelievable.
	The internet hoax, the horrible hate, the Filipino hate letter that has circled the world more times than commercial airliners put together, has once again circled the world, but unfortunately, and here's where I'm going to need your help, as you can see by clicking on it, the damnedest thing has happened.
	It seems as though another newspaper here in the Philippines, another newspaper here in the Philippines, has decided to just pluck this article off the internet and print it in their newspaper!
	This is dated, let's see, where's the date?
	October 18th.
	So, just a couple of days ago, this was printed in the A whole chronicle, B-O-H-O-L, chronicle, and you can read this hate letter.
	Of course I did not write it.
	Now, there is something you can do for me.
	If you'll note at the bottom of this horrid little piece of garbage that somebody wrote, By the way, just a little history.
	This, years ago, was traced by the FBI to somebody who sent it from a computer at UCSD, the University of California at San Diego campus.
	Somebody went into the library many years ago and sent it out under my name.
	And it's gone around the world a million times.
	And now this newspaper has decided to, to me, I mean, the Philippine Inquirer, which was the big national newspaper here in Manila, did that years ago.
	Picked it up and just published it without checking anything.
	If they'd gone to Google and put in Philippine hate letter or letter in Art Bell, they would have known it was false.
	If they'd gone to my website, they would have known it was false.
	If they'd done almost any checking at all anywhere, they would have known it was false.
	But no.
	They just plucked it off the internet and printed it as though it were truth.
	Now we have demanded a retraction, but in the meantime, at the bottom of this horrid little letter, just printed, you can check the date yourself, there is an opportunity for people to give feedback.
	Feedback to the journalist who wrote this.
	And I would dearly love it if you would make your way to coast2coastam.com, click on this, and then give them some feedback.
	Oh, please give them some feedback.
	I am so sick of this.
	It is so dangerous for me and for my family to have this sort of thing running around in the first place.
	But now to have it in print in a newspaper here in the Philippines once again!
	It's so incredibly dangerous that, well I just hope you will take a moment and go up there and give them some feedback.
	I'll leave that to you.
	So there you have it.
	That's up at the top of the website.
	You'll find it very quickly and then if you click on the second link provided, Why, you'll see the entire history of the letter, but the first link is just their website portion of the newspaper, and fortunately they did
	Allow for feedback.
	So you just put in your name and email address and do me a favor and give them some feedback.
	We are going to have a first hour.
	I can play a little fast and loose with time here because we're going to have open lines.
	And by the way, when we do go to open lines later, we're going to have a specific topic we're going to deal with.
	She realizes that the world appears to be on the verge of optical invisibility.
	I'm sure many of you have read the article on the website.
	If not, I will certainly recite it for you when we get to it.
	But I thought we might have some fun tonight with open lines.
	Invisibility has always been something I've loved.
	In fact, I just read a very old book By H.F.
	Saint, which was turned into a movie with Chevy Chase and Daryl Hannah, remember that?
	The Invisible Man.
	If you ever get an opportunity, if you ever get an opportunity to get hold of the book, the movie was okay, the book was awesome!
	Absolutely awesome, and I just had re-read this, and all of a sudden, here comes this article about optical invisibility, so we might actually have the opportunity To become invisible.
	So when we talk in open lines a little later, I would like to know what it is you would like to do should you be given the opportunity to become invisible.
	Anyway, we'll get to that later.
	Looking quickly at the news, President Bush says, I won't change strategy in Iraq.
	President Bush conceded Friday that right now it's tough for American forces in Iraq, but the White House said he would not change U.S.
	strategy in the face of pre-election polls that show voters are, well, upset.
	My thinking was it wouldn't be much of a policy, would it, if he changed it just for the election?
	North Korea North Korea showed signs Friday that it could be backing away from its nuclear showdown with the world.
	Even staged a show of domestic support in Pyongyang.
	Tens of thousands gathered and Kim Jong-un apologized.
	He said, sorry.
	You know, when he comes to nuclear detonations, sorry, I don't know, just doesn't seem like it does it.
	Nuclear detonations in Sari.
	They don't go together.
	I don't think.
	And then this.
	Rumsfeld, rather.
	Iraq must take over security.
	The Iraqi government is going to have to take over its country's security sooner rather than later, according to our Defense Secretary.
	Now, that sure sounds like Vietnamization of the war to me.
	I'll get a lot of hate mail because I say that.
	People can't figure me out.
	It depends on the issue.
	Sometimes I'm pro-administration, sometimes I'm very anti-administration.
	And, you know, in this case, on the one hand, we're not changing policy because of the elections.
	On the other hand, we're talking about getting out.
	You know, turning it over to the Iraqis.
	The Iraqization of the war.
	Then one more little item here before we go to break and then our guest.
	Global warming study predicts wild ride.
	This is in the AP National News.
	The world, especially the Western United States, the Mediterranean region, and Brazil will likely suffer more extended droughts, heavy rainfalls, and longer heat waves over the next century because of global warming, according to a new study.
	So I've got a guest coming up on climate in a moment, whose name is Roy Spencer, no minor Functionary in this area.
	Roy Spencer, in fact, is a principal research scientist at the University of Alabama in Huntsville.
	He has been Senior Scientist for Climate Studies at NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center in Huntsville, Alabama.
	He directs research into the development and application of satellite passive microwave remote sensing techniques for measuring global temperature, water vapor and precipitation.
	Dr. Spencer is the recipient of NASA's Medal for Exceptional Scientific Achievement.
	And the American Meteorological Society Special Award for his satellite-based temperature monitoring work.
	He is the author of numerous scientific articles that have appeared in Science, Nature, Journal of Climate, Monthly Weather Review, Journal of Atmospheric and Oceanic Technology, Journal of Climate and Applied Meteorology, Remote Sensing, that's not like remote viewing by the way, Reviews, Advances in Space Research, and Climate change.
	Dr. Spencer received his PhD in meteorology from the University of Wisconsin in 1981.
	We will speak with him in a moment.
	Well I sure like this title in the AP News.
	This hour, a global warming study predicts wild ride.
	Dr. Spencer, welcome back to the program.
	Hey Art, glad to be with you.
	If I remember correctly, you and your boss disagree on some minor points with regard to where the climate is going, but in general, you agree.
	Is that fair?
	Well, I think it's safe to say that virtually everyone in this business, including us so-called skeptics, believe there is global warming.
	I know lately Al Gore has taken to calling us global warming deniers, but global warming skeptics don't deny global warming.
	We just deny the source of it.
	We aren't convinced that mankind is totally responsible for it, or maybe even half responsible for it.
	I don't know if it matters.
	I think that was my point to you the last time we spoke.
	I mean, what's the diff?
	Whether we're doing it or whether it's a natural cycle, the implications of it on humanity, since everybody almost now agrees it's real, we ought to be concentrating on that.
	Well, there's no question that we ought to be concentrating on adaptation to some extent, because, you know, we need to be prepared for it, like you said, in either event.
	It just is that if it's natural, it's just as likely that it'll start cooling again, based on past climate history, whereas if it's man-made, then, you know, we keep pumping carbon dioxide into the atmosphere, and that's going to continue for many decades, and things will just keep getting worse.
	I guess I see more of a distinction for the importance of whether it's natural or man-made than you do.
	Well, okay, fair enough.
	But even if we're just contributing, I mean certainly at some level we're contributing to gases in the atmosphere.
	I don't think anybody could really honestly argue we're not, could they?
	No.
	I'd like to say it's kind of hard for the earth to not know that there's six billion people living here.
	Yeah, exactly.
	And we are putting gases into the atmosphere.
	Now, we can argue until we're blue in the face about how much effect that's having.
	One thing we can see is that, oh, for example, at the North Pole, well, gee, most of the ice appears to be going away.
	And in fact, we're going to be able to navigate the North Pole pretty soon here with a ship.
	In fact, maybe even now.
	Well, the warmest temperature anomalies anywhere on Earth right now are at the North Pole, and that's something that our satellite data shows, as well as the surface thermometer data, that the amount of warming we've seen in, let's say, in the last 30 years or the last 50 years, is greater at the North Pole than anyplace else.
	Why is that?
	Well, no one knows for sure.
	I mean, if you believe what I call the global warming alarmists, it's mankind putting carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.
	Now, the surface thermometer data that we have in the past suggests that the 1930s were just as warm around the North Pole.
	And, of course, back then we really didn't know how much sea ice there was up there because there weren't that many people to get around.
	And, of course, we didn't have a satellite By the way, I'm head of a NASA team of scientists, one of which does that ice monitoring work with instruments on Earth-orbiting satellites.
	Why do you think that Dr. Hansen, who's the top guy at NASA, is so alarmed?
	Jim Hansen, I understand where he's coming from.
	For one thing, he's a climate modeler.
	You know, he puts the physics of the climate system Well, he's done a pretty good job of explaining climate variations over the last century.
	Warming up until about 1940, then some cooling until the 70s, and then warming since then.
	The trouble is, is a lot of us believe what he's been doing is an exercise in curve-fitting, since we don't understand natural climate variations.
	What we do understand is that we're putting carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.
	The theoretical basis for global warming is reasonably well understood, and so everybody tends to interpret what the climate system is doing in terms of man-caused activity.
	So, you know, to sum it up, he has come up with an explanation for the current warmth that is entirely based on man-produced pollutants.
	Now, I would say that yes, that is one possible explanation, but there are also other possible explanations.
	For instance, the change in cloudiness.
	Cloudiness?
	Yeah, it's hard to believe, but clouds actually affect the average temperature of the Earth.
	Oh, it's not hard to believe at all.
	Now, how much effect does the ocean have on our weather?
	My answer, as a pedestrian, would be quite a bit.
	Oh, it's a huge effect because the oceans can store at least a thousand times more heat than the atmosphere can.
	So what they do is they tend to moderate climate influences.
	You know, if there's a warming tendency for the Earth, the oceans will absorb a lot of that heat and lead to very little warming.
	But the flip side of it is They can store so much heat that a small change in ocean circulation, just due to the chaotic behavior of the ocean, can lead to climate change.
	And that's something we have very little understanding of.
	Another thing that's disturbed me, and this could well be out of your field of expertise, but But I guess it would relate to it.
	There's an article saying that they're now counting about 200 of what they call dead zones in the ocean.
	That is to say, where no animals, no fish, no, you know, nothing above microbial size lives.
	It's just all dead.
	Dead zones in the ocean.
	Now, on the face of it, that seems possibly worrisome.
	Well, of course, as a scientist, the first thing I would ask is, um, how did we, how do we know they weren't dead before?
	And if we do know they're caused by mankind, how big are they?
	Is it something we can live with?
	I mean, after all, humans produce pollution.
	Uh, we can spend some of our wealth to clean up after ourselves to some extent, but it is impossible to not pollute.
	So at some point you have to decide, How much trouble are we going to go to to fix something?
	Are we all going to go back to living in caves to minimize our influence on the environment?
	No.
	I don't think so.
	No, no, of course we're not.
	However, that leads to another sort of discussion we could have, and that is the muzzling of a lot of climate scientists.
	I just wonder about that, including the big man there at NASA.
	An awful lot of articles have been muzzled.
	I mean, a lot of scientists have been muzzled.
	Hold tight where you are, Doctor.
	We're at the bottom of the hour.
	That worries me.
	Even the people that I know that Dr. Spencer, to some degree, or perhaps even a great degree, disagrees with, they've been muzzled.
	And you've got to wonder why.
	And the only answer I've been able to come up with is because, well, somebody's figured out we can't do a damn thing about it anyway, so why alarm all of you?
	I'm Art Bell.
	My guest is Dr. Roy Spencer.
	He's Principal Research Scientist at the University of Alabama in Huntsville.
	Has been the Senior Scientist for Climate Studies at NASA's Marshall Space Flight Center.
	And so he's obviously quite a guy to have on.
	I just wanted to get this in before the break and then we'll get his reaction to it.
	This is not Dr. Hanson who's complained bitterly about being censored.
	But instead, scientists at a world-renowned climate research lab in New Jersey say their discoveries are being hidden from public view because their conclusions on global warming differ from those in the Bush administration.
	Scientists, part of the research staff of the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration, say a spate of press releases, as well as a position paper reviewing various studies on the risks of global warming, have been squashed Quashed, actually, by officials of the Commerce Department.
	The researchers work at the Geophysical Fluid Dynamics Laboratory in Plainsboro, a small branch of NOAA, and the birthplace of the technique that uses computer models to forecast climate.
	They say the press releases and the position paper detailed reports linking intensified hurricanes to global warming, The reports also predict spells of intense weather like droughts, floods, and paint some warnings as irreversible.
	What can I tell you, the scientists say?
	We're simply telling them something they don't want to hear.
	That came from Richard Weatherade.
	That's an interesting name, a career scientist at the federally funded center.
	But the public is not being informed when these things are zapped.
	In a moment we'll get the doctor's reaction to that.
	Doctor, welcome back.
	Perhaps you'd like to... That's not Dr. Hansen making that comment.
	That's some other researchers back east.
	Just as a general principle, I wonder how you feel about these reports and so forth and so on being squished.
	Well, I do have some opinions on this since I worked for NASA for 14 years.
	I would say that all things considered, Scientists within the government agencies that do global warming research actually have very little to worry about being muzzled, mostly because these organizations, especially NOAA and NASA, in order to keep getting funding from Congress to study the global warming problem, there has to be a global warming problem.
	So typically what I've found is that agency administrators In Washington, we'll tend to spin things to make global warming look worse.
	Now, the people you refer to that were supposedly muzzled at GFDL, a modeling group up there, they published their results in Nature Magazine.
	I don't know specifically what happened in this instance.
	I know with Jim Hansen, the media made a much bigger deal out of the thing than they should have, because when I worked for NASA, I was told before doing Congressional testimony to stick to my area of expertise and don't get drawn into policy issues.
	Well, that's because they knew that my policy views did not help NASA sell its programs to Congress.
	Now, Jim Hansen, you've heard lately, you know, in the last year or so, claimed he was muzzled.
	Well, he had gotten used to saying whatever he wanted to say, and I think what happened there is the administration just reminded NASA to enforce its own rules.
	And its own rules are that we are not supposed to talk to the media unless we go through our management chain first.
	And in fact, that's one reason why I resigned NASA four years ago, was I just got tired of the constraints.
	So now I'm with the university and I can Pretty much say whatever I want to, and here I am on your show.
	Well that's true, but as you point out, no longer with NASA.
	Now if you were still with NASA, somehow I just don't think you'd be here tonight.
	That's true.
	So, it's not just Jim Hansen, though, Dr. Hansen making these remarks about being censored.
	This is an entirely different group.
	And, you know, they're claiming here, I could read on, but they're claiming they were denied the ability to do interviews.
	They simply were not allowed to do interviews and talk about their findings.
	Well, again, I don't have the specifics of this case.
	I can say That their bosses, you know, these people do have bosses that can tell them what they can and can't do.
	And I was in that position too.
	I don't know what the reasons are, why they were denied, you know, being able to talk to the media.
	But I do think that to the extent that anyone is being muzzled, that that is a mistake.
	I mean, when an agency puts pressure on its scientists, To say something or to not say something, that's a bad thing.
	It's a mistake because it makes us think the worst.
	That's right.
	Absolutely right.
	And it's just bad PR.
	And what about this?
	I've tried to consider why the administration or the powers that be, if you want to just look at it that way, don't want this talked about.
	And one of the possibilities One of the darker possibilities, it's my job to consider the darker possibilities, is that really this is happening, whether it be man-made or just cyclic, whatever.
	It is happening, and it potentially is really bad, and there's not a damn thing anybody can do about it, so there's no point in turning the economy upside down, going back to bicycles or whatever they would have us do, because it's gonna happen Anyway, so why bother to shake people up?
	Well, that is a very important point and most people don't realize something that you just said that I think too many people don't understand, which is that even if we decide that global warming is going to be very serious, let's say it's all due to mankind, there's no way to turn it around in the coming few decades because mankind depends on fossil fuels so much Conservation isn't going to help.
	Hybrid cars are not going to help.
	Compact fluorescent bulbs are not going to help.
	If we start embracing nuclear power again, that could alleviate some of the problem.
	But what we need is new energy technology.
	That's the only thing that's going to solve the problem.
	And that's where I really get upset with playing around with things like the Kyoto Protocol or the McCain-Lieberman Bill.
	These are just Efforts where bureaucrats can pat themselves on the back and say they did something for the environment or the planet, when in fact they're doing virtually nothing.
	Alright, let's take a moment and talk about real alternatives.
	Now, is it legitimate to complain that the administration, this and others, and none of them have really gone that far, some have been better than others from the point of view of environmentalists, I suppose.
	Basically none of them have really gone whole hog to try and get a major change that actually would have some effect.
	We all know we have energy problems.
	So what do you think?
	Do you think that there's any chance?
	There's a few things that are operating here.
	First of all is that we live with a free market economy.
	When we try to change things The way things operate with government-mandated policies, it usually turns out bad.
	Things usually turn out the best if we let the people decide through their decisions of what to buy and sell.
	That's usually the best for the economy, almost always the best for the economy.
	Now, that being said, the government is already investing billions of dollars, billions of your dollars, Into new energy technologies.
	Research into new technologies.
	And that's what we should be doing.
	Environmentalists make it sound like we're not doing anything.
	Well, we are.
	We're, in fact, putting a lot of money into the only place where the solution is going to be found, which is new technology.
	So, you know, I think the future actually looks more rosy.
	A lot of it, it starts to feel like Paul Ehrlich and his population bomb, you know, that by now most of humanity was supposed to have starved and all that, but mankind is amazingly resilient.
	As Julian Simon used to say, the most, the greatest natural resource this planet has is the human mind.
	And we're going to fix problems as they arise.
	Doctor, what do you see, make me feel rosy for a moment, what do you see on the horizon that really has a possibility of making the kind of change that we both know we need?
	Well, so far there isn't, that I can tell, there isn't any kind of magic, you know, silver bullet on the horizon.
	Nuclear, as I said, would help.
	There's so-called clean coal technology.
	There's actually a couple of test plants generating electricity uh... from coal and actually storing
	uh... or sequestering the carbon dioxide that's produced and pumping
	it deep into the ground
	uh... so that's one possibility is is that uh... clean coal technology which
	would be great for the u s because we have a lot of coal reserves
	uh... so there are some possibilities we've you know you've heard of the
	hydrogen economy uh... you know having uh...
	fuel cell uh... cars that run on hydrogen
	It never made sense to me, though.
	In other words, you can store hydrogen and then use that as fuel, but you need energy to create the hydrogen, and then you need the economy to store and distribute the hydrogen, and by the time you're all said and done, I don't know how much you've really done in terms of real change.
	I couldn't have said it better myself, Art.
	Really?
	That's very true.
	Most people don't realize we don't have a source of hydrogen.
	It takes energy to generate it.
	I think the way it might work well is if we used a lot of nuclear power, which is supposedly a lot safer these days, but let's not get into that.
	If we use nuclear power and then relied on the electricity to generate hydrogen, then we've alleviated that much more dependence on fossil fuels, because we're now using electricity to power our cars.
	Well, that's certainly true, but you know, the politics of nuclear energy development are just really pathetic, and I'm sure you don't think we're going to have very many new plants begin construction anytime soon.
	Well, no, but we do have existing plants, That can be brought back online.
	And where I live, part of our power is nuclear.
	Of course, you know, if we look to the French, you know, 70 to 80 percent of their electricity is nuclear.
	I think nuclear has gotten a really undeserved black eye.
	You know, coal kills a lot of people.
	You know, black lung disease, mining disasters.
	There were no nuclear power plant deaths until Chernobyl.
	Well, that's certainly true.
	Now, the only sort of kink in the whole idea of nuclear power plants sprouting up all over the place would be this damn terrorism business.
	I think nuclear plants, particularly as we make them in the United States and the Western world, Are just fine, unless you consider somebody who actually wants to damage one and has the means to do so.
	In other words, willful damage.
	Right, yeah, and I'm not an expert in that risk and how well that risk can be mitigated.
	I do know that most of the nuclear waste from spent fuel Has been stored in the containment buildings that the reactors are actually in.
	And those containment buildings, you know, they're kind of dome-shaped concrete structures.
	I'm told that those are supposed to be able to withstand the direct hit from a jet aircraft flying directly into it.
	And, you know, between that and just security, the heavy security around these areas, it seems like that's a problem.
	that could be pretty much solved. But you know we live in a risk adverse society
	don't we?
	I mean everyone is trying to avoid risk without ever talking about benefits.
	It is true.
	It is absolutely true.
	And God knows we need energy.
	And we need cheap energy.
	And our economy depends on that.
	People don't understand how closely energy is tied to all the rest of the economy and the price of almost everything.
	And by the way, it is notably interesting to me.
	That the closer the election gets, the cheaper oil seems to be.
	Now, that could be a gigantic coincidence, I suppose.
	But it always happens.
	Every time we get near an election, the price of oil falls.
	Have you noticed that?
	Well, oil is a global commodity.
	Its price is controlled by supply, demand, speculators that are speculating on future supplies, whether there's trouble in the Middle East that might Prevent supplies in the future.
	Nobody has control over the price of oil.
	I mean, I understand a lot of people think that the administration does or whoever, but no one does.
	It's all of humanity that has the control over price of oil, as well as OPEC.
	If they decide to cut back production, price is going to go back up.
	Theoretically, I could not agree with you more.
	It's a big world spot market and the price is the price is the price.
	But amazingly, I mean, it is an amazing coincidence that every time we have an election coming close, the price of oil does drop.
	Well, I had never heard that before, Art.
	Maybe you're right.
	Oh, no, it is so.
	It's amazing.
	It's just absolutely amazing.
	I mean, it is, you know, it's dropping right now.
	Yes, yeah, it's been dropping, yeah.
	Although I saw that OPEC just decided to cut production, so, you know, that's going to push prices back up to some extent, I would think.
	Probably after the election, though.
	I mean, it really is amazing the way it works, and I fully understand the market mechanics and how impossible what I'm saying really is, and yet it is happening, and it's happened before.
	Well, anyway, if Dr. Hansen is correct, let's do this.
	If you're wrong about the ice, for example, at the North Pole, you're suggesting that, well, perhaps the ice comes and goes cyclically.
	But if you're wrong on that, and in fact the North Pole is melting as it never has melted before, and none of us knows what's true here, but if that should be true, then what would that mean for us?
	Well, the concern about the North Polar sea ice cover is that as it melts, since ice, especially snow-covered ice, reflects sunlight, the more ice melts, The more sunlight comes in, that's called a positive feedback.
	If there's a little bit of warming that causes the ice to melt, the ice melting is a positive feedback which amplifies the warming because the ice was, when it was there, was reflecting sunlight back to outer space.
	So there is concern that if it did melt, that the polar region could warm even faster.
	Again, I'm using your premise, that I'm wrong, and that we are responsible for global warming, and that this trend is going to continue.
	Well, it's probably at least a 50-50 bet, since neither one of us has the ability to look back, and we didn't have satellites to know if it ever happened before, so it's kind of like 50-50, I would think, wouldn't you?
	Now, let me make a big picture comment.
	The climate system, weather, every drop of rain that falls, every gust of wind, are all acting as part of one huge process that is constantly trying to move heat from where there's too much to where there isn't enough.
	The atmosphere and the ocean are gigantic heat engines, and what they do best is find a way to get rid of excess heat.
	Is my belief that we aren't going to see much climate change due to whatever, because I believe that is fundamentally a stabilizing mechanism on the climate.
	Now, some people point to, well, you know, then how did we get the ice ages?
	I'm not sure that we have much of a clue at all what caused the ice ages.
	And I did say earlier in the show that chaotic changes in the climate system are possible.
	But, you know, given, like you said, you know, if it's going to happen, if there is the possibility, the best thing mankind can do is be ready for it, so that we can adapt to it.
	Boy, am I ever in favor of that!
	All right, well listen, Doctor, I'm not going to hold you.
	We've got open lines coming up, but I really, really appreciate your joining us in the first hour, and we will soon have you back to do an entire program.
	How's that?
	That sounds fine, Art.
	All right, Dr. Roy Spencer, thank you very much, and you have a wonderful night.
	We're going to move toward Open Lines.
	It's a Friday night, Saturday morning across North America.
	The sun is well down.
	It's good and dark.
	It's a good night for that kind of thing.
	And you know what?
	We're going to talk, along with Open Lines, a little bit about what you would do if you were invisible.
	I'm Art Bell.
	Yes, indeed.
	Here I am.
	It's my honor and privilege to be escorting you through the weekend, and again, filling in for George Norrie, who has a well, well-deserved night off.
	It's going to be a very interesting, for me, afternoon, and for most of you, the majority of you, night.
	Let me roll over very quickly once again.
	The webcam photo tonight is up at the top of the page, not on the side as it normally is.
	It is my lifetime membership in Para, and it came along with the licensing, the reciprocal licensing for Ham Radio that I received here, so art is now thinking about an antenna.
	And then below that, very, very, very important, really very important, another newspaper here in the Philippines has published that godforsaken hate letter That's been bouncing around the world for years since it was authored by some total jerk who went to the UCSD campus in San Diego and sent it out in my name, according to the FBI, and so why any newspaper would just
	Pluck something off the internet do no checking whatsoever I mean you all can try yourself put in the name art bell
	and hate letter or a Philippine hate letter and You'll immediately find out it's a hoax and and so that's a
	very least they could have done, but no they just published it
	And here I am in the Philippines so of course that means You know a lot of danger for my family here and I
	Hope you will take the opportunity to go down to the bottom of that letter even if you don't read it all it's pretty
	ugly and And and render your comments to them
	Give your comments to them.
	I'd surely appreciate that.
	Now, we've got open lines coming up.
	That means you can talk about anything you want.
	But, I do want to suggest a topic.
	This has always been a favorite of mine.
	I mentioned a little while ago, H.F.
	Saint wrote a book called Memoirs of an Invisible Man.
	It's an old book.
	It turned into a movie with Chevy Chase and Daryl Hannah.
	Interesting movie.
	The book, like in so many cases, was so much better, but the movie was also good.
	If you get a chance, read the book.
	It's an old book, but boy is it engrossing.
	And it combines now with new technology that's causing me to ask the question that I will ask in a moment.
	Harry Potter and Captain Kirk would be proud.
	A team of American and British researchers has made a cloak of invisibility.
	Well, okay, it's not perfect yet, but it is a start, and it did a pretty good job of hiding a copper cylinder.
	Now listen, in this experiment, the scientists used microwaves to try and detect the cylinder.
	Like light and radar waves, microwaves bounce off things, making them visible and creating a shadow, though it has to be detected with instruments.
	If you can hide something from microwaves, you can hide it from radar.
	A possibility that we'll have the military frothing At the mouth.
	Cloaking differs from stealth technology, which doesn't make an aircraft invisible, but reduces the cross-section available to radar, making it very hard to track.
	Cloaking simply passes the radar or other waves around the object as if it weren't there, kind of like water flowing around a smooth rock in a stream.
	The new work points the way for an improved version, now listen very carefully, that could hide people and objects from visible light.
	Conceptually, The chance of adapting the concept to visible light is good, quote designer David Schrieg, said in a telephone interview.
	But a researcher associate in Duke University's electrical and computer engineering added, from an engineering point of view, it is very challenging nevertheless.
	The cloaking of a cylinder from microwaves comes just five months after Schurig and colleagues published their theory that it should be possible.
	So, real invisibility may be just around the corner.
	They may learn how to make human beings invisible.
	And of course that brings up the age-old question.
	If you were invisible, what would you do?
	What would you do?
	If you had the opportunity to become invisible, my goodness, there is just a whole line of things that you could do.
	I asked my, and by the way, I asked my wife what she'd do if she were invisible.
	And she said she'd follow me around, make sure I didn't get involved with another woman.
	She knows better than that, or ought to, but that's what she said.
	Anyway, I'm kind of curious what all of you would do, given the opportunity to become invisible.
	Nevertheless, your comments are not at all bound by that suggestion.
	It's just that here we have, finally, we have the real story, and I think invisibility is so cool.
	Would I do some of the things that probably would be thought of as no-nos?
	Hmm.
	I've got to be honest.
	Yes, I probably would.
	Would I sneak into a girl's dorm and girl watch?
	Hmm.
	Maybe.
	And then there would be endless other things that one could do.
	Certainly one could become Really rich.
	I mean there would be endless opportunities in that area as well and so many others.
	So I thought it'd make a great question for open lines.
	Otherwise, anything you want to talk about is certainly fair game.
	Now...
	You may or may not hear some banging going on.
	I live in a condominium unit, as you know, and while they don't bang on the weekends, they are working on a condominium unit above me, and should you hear any large bangs, that's where it comes from.
	They probably are doing flooring work above me, and so we'll just have to live with it if it happens.
	Anyway, there you have it.
	In a moment, we're back.
	It's open lines.
	Anything you want to talk about, fair game.
	All right, this should be fun.
	A Friday night, Saturday morning across most of North America.
	And here we go.
	First time caller line, you are on the air.
	Hello.
	Hello?
	Hello.
	Is this Art Bell?
	That would be me, yes.
	Oh, wonderful.
	I have listened to you since 1991.
	Okay, thank you.
	And you saved my life by giving me something to listen to.
	Well, how did I save your life?
	You were ill at the time?
	Yeah, I had heart problems and things.
	Talk radio is absolutely wonderful.
	I mean it just it passes the hours on the highway.
	It gets you through an illness instead of dwelling on what's wrong with you.
	You can sink your mind into what we're talking about.
	It's all true.
	Yep.
	You pulled me out of some of the worst depression that a man could sink into.
	But one of the things I want to talk about is this global warming thing.
	Yes.
	Does anybody ever understand that when you have a stove, a wood stove, and you keep putting wood into it, it gets hotter?
	I think most people kind of get that, yes.
	Well, what about the sun?
	It gets more garbage thrown into it in this part of the galaxy.
	What do you mean by garbage?
	Well, it gets stuff that falls in there.
	Well, it's a constant nuclear fusion type reaction, so it doesn't really need a lot of fuel.
	I know.
	My friend, what I'm trying to get at is, I studied geology and paleontology and archaeology, and when I was a student in Pasadena, We went and studied the bristlecone pine trees and we found a real interesting thing happen about the amount of sun absorption that they got and there was a direct correlation.
	What was that interesting thing?
	A direct correlation between the amount of sun they get and There was more heat, they had more water, they grew bigger.
	They grew faster.
	And this stuff that Mr, what's his name, A.G.
	Gore, is running around saying, well it's because of our SUVs it's causing all this global warming.
	No, no, no.
	It's all the garbage in the universe that's being funneled into the big stove, which is called the sun.
	I see.
	Alright, so this gentleman feels that the sun, like a wood stove, continually gobbling comets and other planetary debris, like a wood stove, is getting hotter.
	And causing global warming.
	Well, that's a new one on me.
	But one never knows, I suppose.
	Let's go to the first-time caller line and say in Beaver Falls, Pennsylvania.
	Ron, you're on the air.
	Thank you.
	Nice speaking with you.
	Earlier I heard you speaking with the gentleman regarding nuclear power and whatnot.
	Yes.
	I do work with a nuclear power station at Shippingport, one of the first in the world, and them domes are created to keep any damage done.
	If an aircraft was to plow into it, it would protect the contaminated area.
	The fuel, used fuel poles is where they store the fuel, you know, the used fuel rod.
	The life expectancy of a nuclear power station of this particular is usually 40 years.
	However, we just replaced the three steam generators in the reactor head on a major overhaul here this last year.
	The fuel pole eventually will get full to where they won't be able to store it no more.
	Well, there's the problem.
	Right.
	There's the problem, Ron.
	You see, they're all getting full.
	Right.
	Well, my thought was they have these missiles that they can, they send payloads up to space
	and I can't see why they can't bundle them in that special epoxy that they used for like
	the Land Rover and all these other things, stick them in these spaceships and shoot them
	towards the sun.
	Well, there's an obvious answer to that.
	My last caller had the answer to that, then you would be stoking the wood stove, according
	to my last caller, and global warming would go berserk, Ron.
	Well, no, because like you say, the sun is actually nuclear fission and all of it would
	be going, would be disintegrating the uranium spent, uranium rods.
	Well, that was my last caller, Ron.
	The real problem with that idea is that, of course, one in X number of launches blows up.
	And if you had this very poisonous plutonium that you were launching and it blew up, there would probably be, well, a problem when it blew up.
	Well, they have this epoxy where they can actually encasel it to where If it was the drop, it wouldn't break it.
	It's like, how can I explain it?
	I don't know the term of it, but they can encapsulate it where it can't be damaged.
	But instead of dumping it in Yucca Mountain out in Washington, you know, they can ship this, head it towards the sun.
	I mean, It'll be many years before it ever would even reach there, but it would basically burn up before it even got there, which would reduce the nuclear waste in the world because there's only so much room in this world that we live in.
	And once you use up the room for nuclear waste, 10,000 years could go by and it would still be too radioactive to be worth Actually, Ron, even hundreds of thousands of years.
	No, I don't think that launching it to the Sun is really a spiffy idea.
	It has been suggested before, because as Ron mentioned, the Sun is, or I mentioned, is a giant fusion process underway.
	So if you could safely get it to the Sun, that would certainly make sense as a good idea.
	We cannot safely get it to the sun and launching it in a space vehicle is at best a risky idea and at worst would produce absolutely catastrophic results for, you know, all of us when the launch failed.
	So I don't think that would be at the head of the list of things to do.
	Let's go to this wildcard line and say, hello there Tom in Tempe, you're on the air.
	Oh, that's Tim Art, and it's a pleasure to talk to you.
	I've listened to you for years.
	Thanks.
	Sorry, Tim.
	That was me, not the screener.
	Your name is indeed Tim.
	Well, thank you.
	You know, I like to talk about the invisibility, and I believe that really the only way that we could get to terrorists in the Al-Qaeda, where they live, would be something like that.
	To find him and to do something about it, I believe that he is so protected that that would be the only way to really get in and get him.
	Don't you think?
	Oh my god, Tim, I forgot about this.
	Now, if we could become invisible, the terrorists could become invisible.
	And if you think we've got a problem now, imagine that.
	Oh my god.
	That'd be terrible.
	It would, but of course the United States would be first to have invisible people, agents, and so you're right, we could get them.
	Yeah, I think that'd work.
	And real quickly, what do you think of packet radio for hands?
	Um, I think that it's been superseded by newer technologies.
	Pack-It is actually kind of slow.
	And if you look into it, there's all kinds of new things.
	In fact, there are new ones coming out every day.
	Digital modes that are much, much faster than Pack-It.
	Is it affordable?
	Oh, of course, yes, of course.
	It's very affordable.
	I'm just saying that technology has marched forward and there are new technologies that are really amazing, just amazing, that can be used by amateur radio or the military or anything else.
	And not to get too technical about it, but here's the deal.
	Some of these technologies are so good That if the signal received, in other words, if the signal coming out of your receiver is so low and so buried in the static and the mess that you cannot even hear it with the human ear, computers on the other hand can dig that signal out below the noise level and print a perfectly intelligible rendition of what was sent.
	It's amazing.
	East of the Rockies, without a lot of time here, you're on the air.
	Hey Art, this is John from Springfield, Illinois.
	Hey buddy.
	Hey, how you doing?
	Why can't some of these remote viewers or psychics help you find this person that did this to you?
	That person had to brag to somebody or tell somebody that they did this to you.
	And even if they didn't, why can't they help me?
	You know, that newspaper printing that, if anybody does anything to you, they'll be just as complicit in the phone, whatever they're trying to do to you.
	Can you imagine how stupid that is to take something off the internet without checking, without doing any checking whatsoever, and just printing it?
	Aside from the obvious issue of, you know, the liability and the fact that I could own, don't want to own, but could own their newspaper if I wanted to sue them, Get out coast to coast, most wanted, and have people call in.
	I mean, it is so unprofessional.
	Yes, and you could write a book with the first time I heard Art Bell, you know, everybody has their own story.
	You know, the first time I heard you was probably in 1998, and somebody had called in and said, the Mormons were aliens, and the thing I heard when I was going through the radio, you said, oh no, not the Mormons too, and that caught me from that line.
	Well, they may be aliens.
	I was gonna say, if you put that antenna on top of your roof, you're not gonna get struck by lightning or anything.
	It'll be like a big lightning rod.
	It's interesting you should mention that.
	We're at the tail end here of the rainy season, and when I tell you that we've been getting smacked with lightning, boy, I'm telling you, we've really had some.
	So I've been very pleased that up until this point I have not had an antenna on the roof, but now that I have... You didn't get that weather in Nevada, did you?
	The typhoon, earthquake?
	Oh yes, well, we've got plenty of lightning storms, no typhoons.
	The typhoon, oh man was that scary.
	Okay sir, thank you very much and you have a good night.
	So that's West of the Rockies.
	Yes, the typhoon was quite an affair.
	If you can imagine, it was almost like a horror movie.
	The windows that we have, and they are particularly well-made, thick, typhoon-proof windows, and they were bending in, kind of like in a horror show.
	I almost felt like, and for a moment I did, I actually went up to the window and put my hand on it and pushed the other way.
	And in about 10 seconds I decided, boy is this stupid because if this window shatters, I'm going to be in little pieces.
	From Manila in the Philippines, I'm Art Bell.
	Here I am indeed.
	Robert in Port Orchard, Washington says, hey Art, why no webcam picture?
	There is a webcam picture.
	Would somebody confirm that for me please?
	Up at the top of the website, in not the normal place.
	It'll pop up in the normal place tomorrow night, but tonight because I'm filling in for George.
	It's up at the top of the website, the very top, so please let me know it is there.
	He says not.
	He goes on, if I were invisible, I'd head for the White House first, then set my sights toward Jodie Foster's hot tub.
	More in a moment.
	Alright, I'm getting some confirmation that indeed the webcam photograph is
	is being seen.
	On the fourth wildcard line, John in Long Island, New York.
	You're on the air.
	Hi Art, how are you?
	Just a couple of comments.
	First of all, being invisible, I'd have to hit the Playboy Mansion.
	You have to do that.
	That's a worthwhile endeavor.
	I can see spending a little time there, sure.
	And the other comment, I spoke to you once about a month or so ago, if you ever move
	back to the United States, move back to Long Island.
	Since you have a kid on the way, you got the best schooling, you got the best beaches,
	you got the best city in the world, you take a limo out to Manhattan, you take your wife
	to Tabbin-on-the-Greens, she'll love it.
	Well, if we do get back to the United States, I will certainly show her around the United
	States and that'll be one area we'll get to and we'll see what she thinks of it.
	Okay, good luck with your child.
	Okay, thank you, buddy, and take care.
	Yeah, the Playboy Mansion, it'd be worth roaming around in there a little bit.
	I mean, you know, invisibility, there would be a fun side to it, wouldn't there?
	Haven't you ever thought about it, being invisible?
	The memoirs of an invisible man were very interesting in that his invisibility, for example, did not hide.
	when he would eat certain things, the food could be seen going down, you know, suffocating
	down into the stomach where it mixed in some disagreeable kind of way and looked pretty
	bad until it was digested.
	That was one problem he had.
	Another was that when it would rain, it would indeed sort of show his invisibility or the
	outline of his person for a short time and I can see that sort of thing happening.
	This is not just idle chat.
	We're talking about invisibility, because scientists are actually very close to it.
	You can read the story, if you wish, on CostaCosaM.com, but what a mixed-up world it would be if invisibility actually came to pass.
	West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
	Hello there.
	Hello, Art.
	Yes, hi.
	Hi, Mr. Bill.
	Mr. Bill?
	From Tucson, Arizona.
	OK.
	You're in the Philippines tonight.
	You're a long ways away from Tucson.
	I wanted to ask you, Art, I know that from hearing from George that you're going to be doing the Halloween show on Tuesday night.
	Ghost to Ghost.
	Ghost to Ghost.
	And I had to ask you because you are halfway across the earth from where I'm at here in Arizona.
	Do you see a phenomenon happening in the Philippines concerning Halloween.
	And the reason I asked that is because I took my daughter out to dinner the other night, we had a little simple Mexican meal.
	And we drove to all the neighborhoods here in southern Arizona, we took a three and a half hour drive.
	And we noticed something that was I thought was phenomenal and kind of extraordinary.
	It seemed like neighborhood after neighborhood house upon house was decorated with Extravagant lights and presentations and you could tell these people had spent a lot of money presenting the spirit of Halloween and we've never seen this in Tucson except for the time of the year which is called Christmas.
	Because we have a special neighborhood here in town.
	Well, are you sure they're not actually decorating for Christmas?
	They start that earlier and earlier now.
	Right, right.
	Is the phenomenon in the Philippines, because I know that people around the world do celebrate Halloween, otherwise known as Samhain, have you noticed anything extraordinary going on there?
	Because here in Tucson, things are just, we've never seen this before.
	Well, maybe Tucson has turned to the dark side, sir.
	Well, that's why I was wondering, because, you know, you're on the other side of the earth, and I thought, well, this would be a great time to call Art.
	And I've talked to my brother in Apache Junction, and also my sisters in Houston, and they've also noticed the same thing.
	Maybe like in the body snatchers, you're one of the only ones not affected, but all of those around you have turned to the dark side.
	And if I were you, I wouldn't go to sleep.
	Well, thanks Art.
	I was hoping to get a little more of an in-depth question, but you know what?
	I'll take that.
	I have no idea how to answer that.
	In our building, there's going to be a traditional Halloween celebration where the kids go from condo to condo in hopes of candy and or whatever else is available.
	However, I honestly don't know how Halloween is celebrated or not observed here in the Philippines.
	I will, during the next break, ask my wife and we'll see what she has to say.
	First time caller line, no, sorry, wildcard line, you're on the air.
	Aloha, Art.
	This is Storm from the Kingdom of Hawaii, the place that now has a whole new meaning to the word rock and roll.
	Yeah, we did some rockin' and rollin' ourselves here last night.
	On the 19th floor, a 5.6, 90 miles south of us, was a very, very Disquieting?
	Yeah, disquieting, that's a good word.
	Well, see, the one we just had Sunday was the second one we've had in as many months.
	We had one almost a month, I mean almost a day to the month of 3.1 off the southern tip
	here in Oahu.
	And that was...
	Do you worry at all that one of the islands, if not more, could suddenly, well I don't
	know, sink?
	Thank you.
	Highly unlikely, Art.
	These are more like sea mounds than anything else, gradually built up by volcanic activities.
	There's a five-mile stretch over on the Big Island by volcano, which is really in the danger of slipping, which I understand has happened quite a few times through the But the possibility of the entire island dropping, not all that good.
	The volcanoes over here have a rather unusual characteristic to them.
	One is that the reason they don't go boom is because they have a low silicone content to the lava.
	That means there's no massive buildup of gas behind a crystallization in between eruptions.
	Right.
	Right, that's the reason they don't explode.
	Right, but what I, you know, I listened to the seismologists talking about this earthquake and what they said was that it was the weight, that's the weight of the volcanoes on the earth beneath the ocean that caused that earthquake.
	And, you know, if you think darkly, well, you can imagine that the weight of the islands could suddenly sort of cause a break down below and then Yeah, they were complaining.
	Actually, there was a very short story when it first happened that they said there was a slip of the tectonic plate that actually caused it, that it wasn't volcanic in nature.
	Not true.
	Not even close to being true.
	You're telling me it was volcanic?
	Oh, definitely volcanic.
	That's a new one.
	I hadn't heard that.
	Well, that's because unlike the Ring of Fire, right, where the majority of the Earth's volcanoes Reside on the planet?
	Right.
	Those are all on fault lines.
	The volcanoes formed here is due to a thin spot in the crust as each landmass slides across it.
	Again, that's my point.
	If it's a thin spot and it's because of the weight, now where can I find out it's documented that it was volcanic in nature?
	That would be Volcanic Natural Park over on the Big Island.
	No, no, I mean, where is it written that they've discovered it was volcanic in nature, that earthquake?
	Oh, actually, they're not admitting to that.
	Oh, I see.
	You see, if you... So this is your theory?
	You have a danger of hurting the tourist rate, because then it would be a greater possibility of one happening again soon, since we have the most active volcano on the planet.
	Ah, people, listen, people tend to forget about these things pretty quickly after they happen.
	For example, last night's earthquake here.
	Again, we're on the 19th floor, so you know, you really feel it.
	These buildings are designed to sway and be earthquake resistant.
	I almost said earthquake proof, but nothing is that.
	So earthquake resistant would be the appropriate way to put it, I suppose.
	Let's go here and say hi to Chris in Los Angeles.
	Hello.
	Hello, Art.
	It's a privilege to be on with you.
	I am unaware if you have mentioned anything about the Crop Circle conference that's taking place in November.
	I have not.
	There's some very interesting people that have been on your show who will be there, like Linda Howe and Well, I can well imagine.
	I think I've interviewed almost everybody who has anything to do with crop circles.
	What do you think crop circles are, sir?
	What is your theory?
	Well, I still have an open mind to that question.
	I have a feeling that, in the beginning of my thoughts, I believe that the UFOs were probably the answer.
	And now I'm thinking it could be possibly other levels of consciousness here.
	No, I think you're correct.
	If I had to make a guess about what I thought it was, sir, I would say that I think it's collective consciousness doing it.
	And as you well know, I have a great deal of faith in the fact that collective consciousness is a real power.
	Consciousness, even as a singularity, is a real power.
	And when multitudes or millions of minds are working on something, I think that it's a gigantic power, one not to be tampered with.
	You know my view on that.
	But it's entirely possible that that's where they're coming from.
	Us, the monster from the id, as it were.
	Okay, let's try wild card line three.
	You're on the air.
	That would be Tony in LA.
	Art Bell, boy do I have a ghost story for you.
	Are you ready for this one?
	Well, we're close enough to Halloween, so why not?
	Okay, Art, my great-grandfather came to Los Angeles in 1866 and in 1882 he built a building.
	That is in Little Tokyo.
	I don't know if you've been to L.A., but I'm actually one block from Parker Center, and I'm two blocks from L.A.
	City Hall.
	Of course I've been there, yes.
	I still own the building.
	It's a National Historic Landmark building, and with my 17-year, we'll put it mildly, very rocky marriage, I've lived in the upstairs of this building for 11 years, which used to be a dance hall.
	Four years, Art, and I'm a retired police officer now, as a matter of fact.
	Four years, people have said, aren't you afraid of being in that haunted building that I have?
	Yeah, blow it.
	I'm not listening to you.
	There's no haunting.
	It's, you know, if it was, it would be my family.
	Let me cut to the chase.
	I had a tenant downstairs that was there with a video store for 16 years.
	And they had the largest collection of adult Asian videos in the city of LA.
	Now, before every caller now starts calling in and jumping on me, oh, the policemen selling porn, I'm the landlord, okay?
	What they do, it's legal, it's on them, not on me.
	And the kids that work there were actually, like, these Japanese national, like, rock and roller kids, and I truly believe that they were on drugs.
	And anyway, they used to say the same thing, is the building haunted, and I was like, okay, I don't want to hear it.
	I evict them.
	The guy that owned it goes bad.
	I evict him.
	He runs back to Japan, everything else.
	I'm stuck with all this porn.
	I start cleaning the place up.
	I'm sitting there, five, six o'clock in the morning, cleaning it out.
	Some girl in the community says, let's just sell it at a dollar a video.
	So I start selling it.
	I have never had a problem in this building in my life.
	I feel very warm, very centered in the building.
	I mean, I'm like a trendsetter in loft living.
	If you follow me on that, I mean, it's a big deal in L.A.
	now.
	Well, I was doing it 11 years ago.
	Art, I'm in the building, and all of a sudden, I mean, when I'm selling these videos, a dollar apiece, and this is the truth, and I have work vice, every sick idiot in the world starts showing up, and they want to take the video boxes to go to the bathroom, if you're following me.
	And that's when stuff started happening.
	The electricity stops working in the building.
	I mean, the block is live, but you turn the lights on, and they turn themselves off.
	All right, I'm wandering around the back of the building, which used to be a great-grandfather's blacksmith shop, and somebody smacks me in the back of the head, except there's nobody in the building except me.
	This stuff starts.
	So I then... I'm trying to go through this very quickly.
	I then start getting contacted by people in the community saying, well, yeah, people stopped going to the building because there was this very, very old man and very, very old woman that would stand in the corners in the adult sections and stare at them.
	And I thought, oh boy, this isn't good.
	Make a long story short, you had a guest by the name of Dr. Larry Muntz, and I actually dealt with him in 1997.
	The guy from Ghost Expeditions?
	Yes.
	I actually had dealt with Dr. Larry Muntz.
	Reference, this is no joke, it can be confirmed, about a Los Angeles police station that was haunted.
	We were having some problems in the station, and I'm not going to go into it, and Dr. Muntz had come in and run his tests and brought in his people and everything else, and the site of this actual station, the city got the property, Because an old woman had been raped and murdered on the location.
	I mean, that's legitimate.
	It's not just a made-up story.
	It's the truth.
	And there were some other things going on there, and Dr. Muntz dealt with it.
	So I called Dr. Larry Muntz, and he starts looking into everything, and he even said, you know, that this building is haunted, but the strange thing was, and you'll love this story, it's haunted, basically, by my relatives, and he said it's the most friendly haunting that he's ever met, because I'm going to tell you when One of my family members, they're thinking it's my great-grandmother.
	And again, I don't believe in ghosts, but I know what was going on and what's been happening in the building.
	It's a very warm, friendly feeling.
	Even to this day right now, after everything that went on, I'm not scared.
	Even when I got smacked, I wasn't scared.
	Well, what do you mean you don't believe in ghosts?
	Art, okay, my family on my dad's side are Jewish.
	My mother's side were Christians.
	I'm a graduate of Pepperdine University.
	I even went back eight years ago to learn Hebrew to a Bible college here in L.A.
	All fine, but again, you've been through this, you've experienced it, how can you not believe in that which you have actually experienced?
	I'm using the word ghost very loosely because I don't know what other word to use.
	The place obviously is, quote, haunted, because I have a lack of better words.
	I believe that there's energy, I believe that there's family, and after listening to you for like 20 years, if you're a cop and sitting in a police car, you know, writing reports and stuff, you've listened to Art
	Bell and I've heard all the people saying when they go to die, their family members
	show up and then that's scared, that is the only thing that probably scared me, thinking why
	would my great-grandmother be hanging around, maybe I'm getting ready to go. If you
	follow what I'm...
	Well, I do.
	All right.
	Well, thank you, Tony.
	Look, so there you have it, an ex-cop.
	I mean, look, I hit him with that because after you've actually experienced, it's kind of like UFOs, if you've seen something directly above your head so close you could throw a rock at it, how can you not believe in what you've seen with your own eyes?
	East of the Rockies, not a lot of time, but you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hello?
	Yes, hello?
	Hey, yeah, I'm very glad to be on right now, man.
	I'm a huge fan of yours.
	I listen every weekend.
	I've got a story similar to the last caller, but it's about ghosts, but I don't know if you've ever heard of it.
	It's called the doppelganger phenomenon.
	Oh, well, I know what that is.
	It's your own experience?
	Yeah, yeah.
	See, it's been happening a lot lately to me, and I don't know.
	Okay, very quickly, explain.
	See, this morning I was brushing my teeth, I looked over and at the corner of my eye, peripheral vision, I saw myself.
	It was like a dark, I don't know, it disappeared very quickly, but it was like a dark version of myself.
	Oh, that is weird.
	I've been seeing it a lot lately.
	I don't know what causes it, just like I'll wake up and look in the mirror and be right behind me, you know?
	A version of yourself.
	I kind of like that.
	It's pretty scary, I don't know.
	Well, it is kind of scary, and I wonder if it means, if it's kind of a warning to you, that something or another is about to happen as your time shifted a little bit.
	I don't know.
	Anyway, interesting stuff.
	You're the first person who's ever said to me, I looked around and saw a version of myself.
	That's definitely a new one.
	Anybody else experience anything like that?
	From Manila in the Philippines, Southeast Asia, I'm Art Bell.
	Yes, ladies and gentlemen, we are getting close to Halloween.
	And in an absolute tradition, I will be here on Halloween, and we will do what we call Ghost to Ghost.
	Very tradition, big tradition on this radio program.
	I'm Art Bell, more of all of you in a moment.
	Thanks to the wonder of call screening, I can say, it's the devil himself.
	J.C.
	I think it's J.C.
	Excuse me?
	Hello?
	How dare you call me the devil when you know that you are the devil!
	The devil's mouthpiece!
	For heaven's sake.
	Yeah, the devil's mouthpiece.
	That's what you always called me.
	No, I'm not.
	You, yes you are.
	It is a symptomatic symptom of the sickness that is surging and boiling up in this nation at row after row and house after house is decorated to celebrate your master's birthday!
	My master's birthday?
	How do you know they're just not celebrating an early Christmas?
	And what in the world is wrong with a carved out pumpkin, JC?
	Because a carved pumpkin is an invitation for demonic possession!
	It is?
	Yes, it is.
	It's a symptom of satanic worship.
	And that's why they put a candle inside.
	That's right.
	So it'll draw the Satan from the flames.
	They create like a mini, tiny inferno.
	It's a mini replication of hell to draw forth demons into your household and into your body.
	So in other words, when they put a little smile on the pumpkin, that's really an evil smile.
	That's exactly how the devil operates.
	He smiles at you.
	He says, look at all the wonderful, salacious things I have for you to enjoy.
	I'm your best friend.
	I'm your buddy.
	I'm the one who gave you information when God wouldn't give you information.
	I'm the one that gave you, that gave you sex and pleasure and pornography and drugs and rock and roll and food and all the things you can enjoy.
	Wait a minute.
	What's wrong with sex?
	Everything is wrong with it!
	Sex is dirty, it's disgusting, it's...
	JC, you know what, that's why Edna took the car and split.
	No, it's because the devil distorted her deceptions and created her to become one of his disciples.
	And she was distorted.
	Sex is not meant for pleasure.
	People have got it all wrong.
	You know, that's why she left.
	That's why she left, JC.
	She had had it with you.
	Obviously, you probably... Because I wasn't going to give her sex!
	There you go.
	But that's implying that we were in that kind of a relationship, and we were!
	And you know, she was actually a big supporter of yours.
	She sent me countless emails, JC.
	She did!
	And she was a supporter of yours, and I guess she just finally, well, she wasn't getting enough.
	No, this is a message from God, is to say that if anyone's so righteous as to be in the service of God's ten-star, ten-star, and I would recognize, ten-star general that I am, can be dissuaded and deceptive and And pulled away into satanic service, then you know that you're in danger as well.
	And it's a wake-up call from God that he's gonna... Listen, there's punishments coming, Mr. Bell.
	You think these earthquakes aren't coming from God?
	Like earthquakes from God?
	Yes, to punish.
	So I take it the Hawaiian people have misbehaved?
	Yes, because they do exotic dancing and they're always naked on savage islands like that where they don't put their clothes on.
	Savage islands?
	Now wait a minute, you're saying the hula is evil?
	Yes, it's a satanic sexual ritual to worship satanic gods.
	It's not American, is it?
	Uh, well, yes it is.
	Actually, Hawaii, believe it or not, J.C., actually was admitted as a state sometime.
	I don't recognize them.
	You don't?
	Well, no, because... What about Alaska?
	No, because Alaska is a sleeper state for Russia.
	That's another thing I want to talk about, is that the Russians... That's a trick!
	The Alaskans are all Russian sleeper agents, and they've got a foothold in our nation, and they're going to invade down through Canada.
	You watch, Mr. Bell.
	It's already happening, and that's a problem with Canadians.
	And Alaskans, they can look and act like regular Americans, and they're regular Mexicans because they're actually smart!
	JC, let's get the view of an Alaskan on that.
	In Fairbanks, Alaska, Jeff, you're on with JC.
	Hello, you Alaskan traitor!
	Oh, did you hear that, Jeff?
	Yeah?
	Are you guys actually Russian agents?
	Agents of the devil?
	Yeah, how much vodka have you drank tonight, you Russian, ruski, communist, Well, I'm French, actually.
	You hear that, JC?
	He's French.
	You French freak!
	Oh, JC.
	Be nice.
	I am being nice.
	I'm trying to help him.
	Here, I'm letting you talk to my audience.
	Somebody from Alaska.
	Defend yourself, you Frenchie!
	Come on, now!
	What you got?
	Bring it to an American!
	Let him have it, Jeff.
	I don't know what to say to this guy.
	I think J.C.
	stands for just crazy.
	How dare you?
	How dare you insultate me in such a manner?
	Insultate you?
	He's insulted me, Mr. Bell.
	The fact that Edna split is obvious evidence to, I think, all of us that even in your personal life... By the way, do you know where she went?
	I have no idea.
	Last I heard she was hanging out with truck drivers and truck stops.
	Really?
	We're tracking her though.
	We're gonna find her and bring her back home to the Lord.
	And in the meantime, I am looking for a new servant.
	And they can reach me at boiling... Wait a minute!
	Wait a minute!
	You trample upon all women when you say something like that.
	What do you mean, servant?
	Well, women need to get back in the kitchen, back to the kids, and do what they're told.
	Listen, women are... This is another reason why God is angry at America, because women, they don't know their place anymore.
	Let me tell you, a woman is best when seen and not heard, but not seen wearing salacious things like Women these days, I go out to the mall and they've got belly button rings and skirts and shorts so small, I can't believe what I see!
	And they need to cover up!
	Women need to cover up and shut up!
	And it's great when a woman is working at home and cleaning the kitchen and raising the children.
	And doing her man's bidding.
	Who is that?
	Ann Coulter?
	Is that her name?
	That had that book recently?
	Yes.
	She's a wonderful conservative, but where's her husband?
	I don't know.
	Where's Edna?
	Robin, in Boulder, Colorado.
	You're on the air with Jaycee.
	Any comments for Jaycee?
	Permission!
	Oh, Lordy!
	Wait!
	Woman!
	Woman!
	Permission to speak!
	Jaycee, let Robin say something.
	I had to give her permission first.
	You had to give you permission to speak, Robin.
	Well, I live with a cat and um...
	You hear that, JC?
	Yes, you live with a cat. Continue.
	And she helps me in the kitchen.
	She does.
	But mostly I like to, you know, wear the pants.
	Are you a lesbian?
	Because it sounds to me like you're a lesbian.
	Well, actually I am.
	Oh my God, I knew it, I knew it.
	Thank you so much.
	See, God gives me all the information I need to know.
	Now wait a minute, Jay-Z.
	What do you have against lesbians, for goodness sakes?
	Because they rampage across America and they hate men.
	Now, let me tell you... Wait a minute, wait a minute, Tracy.
	That's not necessarily true.
	It might be, but it's not necessarily true.
	Robin, do you hate men?
	Oh no, and by the way, my friends say... Have you ever been in a kiss fight with a lesbian?
	Let me tell you, they'll take you to task.
	I'm sure, I'm sure that if she could have a shot at you right now, she'd... How about that, Robin?
	Well, I'm kind of a... What's wrong with you?
	Away from men.
	I'm kind of a mouse.
	I don't do much rampage.
	Oh, you're right.
	That's a lie.
	How many girls have you tried to steal away from men?
	How many married women have you tried to seduce in your time?
	With a Tupperware party?
	Come on over for Tupperware.
	Not too awful many.
	I'm kind of old for that now.
	I know what happens at lesbian Tupperware parties.
	Lesbian Tupperware parties?
	Yes.
	Well, you tell me.
	I can't disclose those kinds of salacious details on the airwaves.
	There's something called the FCC and I don't want to violate their laws and rules!
	I had never thought about having a lesbian Tupperware party, but now that you've given me that idea, I might have to give that a try.
	Yeah, it's a way to make money.
	JC, you just gave her a very capitalistic idea, a lesbian Tupperware party.
	Look at how you are so deceptive, Mr. Bell, because you could turn the Lord's words around and turn them into satanic propaganda.
	You truly are in the devil's mouthpiece.
	This is an example right here of why you are so evil.
	And Missy, look, what you need to do is take off the flannel shirt, get into a church, and find a man.
	All you need is the right man that will change you back.
	I'm sure that Robin would say that lesbianism is simply as natural to her as heterosexuality, well, I won't say is to you because you don't want anything to do with sex, but to most other people, Jason.
	You're implying against my heterosexuality, my manliness?
	I'm a woman, I have control.
	I just wanted to say what I'd do if I was invisible.
	What would you do if you were invisible, Robin?
	I'd come to the Philippines and I'd be your bodyguard.
	So that nobody would be jumping on you or anything.
	I appreciate that, and there you have it, JC.
	What?
	See, that was a very nice young lady.
	No, she's a disgusting...
	Disgustated sinner, in my opinion.
	And she is going to be thrown personally by me into the blowing pits of sewage out in the afterlife.
	Oh, now you've elevated yourself to the position of God.
	Oh, no, I'm going to be right there with God.
	Only God can throw somebody into the pits of sewage.
	Excuse me?
	Only God can toss somebody into the flaming... No, no, no, you misread, Mr. Bell.
	That's going to be one of my jobs, is to help God out.
	I've been advising God on all this plan.
	And I'm going to be there with them, throwing people into the blowing pits of sewage.
	That's one of the great things that I'm looking forward to.
	You think a great deal of yourself, don't you?
	I do.
	How do you know, JC, that God approves of the kind of, I don't know, nasty rhetoric that you spew every time you get... It's not nasty.
	Because I speak to God directly.
	Oh, right.
	Yes, I do.
	How do you think I got the New Revelation, Mr. Bell?
	I haven't seen the new revelation, that is to say... You've seen some of the new commandments when I sent them to you.
	Ah, that's true.
	Do you want to review some of those for the audience?
	At this time I'd like to speak to more of the audience so I can... Alright, alright, then alright.
	Let's see, Timothy in San Francisco, you're on the air with Jay-Z.
	Oh, good evening Art, and God bless you and love your family.
	Well, thank you.
	You're very most distinguished radio talk show host.
	I've been listening to you for a while.
	Hello!
	Hello!
	Timothy!
	You're on with JC.
	Yeah, you're on with JC.
	You're calling from San Francisco, aren't you?
	Yes, yes.
	The homosexual capital of the world.
	Yeah, I'm a real queer.
	Yeah, I'm a queer.
	Yes, I can tell that.
	I can tell that.
	I didn't even have to say it.
	I'm a queer, yeah.
	Yeah, right.
	So why don't you act like a gentleman and grow up a little bit and, you know... Who are you to tell me what to do?
	Listen you, you no good, no good...
	Pervert!
	You sound from Sicko!
	Why don't you just go back to your bathhouses and your little opium dens out there where all you sickos smoke medical pot and get together for hedonistic orgies of evil!
	I have three PhDs and a member of the Council for Relations.
	Your book smarts don't mean nothing to me, Mr. PhD!
	I'm a philosopher and I have a- Your big brains aren't gonna mean a darn thing when you're a psychologist!
	Wait a minute, wait a minute.
	One at a time here.
	J.C., give the guy a chance.
	I like to psychoanalyze you, J.C.
	I'm doing research.
	You're a psycho.
	Pardon me?
	Well, go ahead!
	Now, J.C., has it occurred to you that you call everybody a psycho?
	You call everybody evil?
	Yes, I do!
	Yes, but there's a little pathology here, buddy.
	If everybody's evil, that might mean... I mean, you should consider that you're the different one, J.C.
	No!
	No, I'm the only one walking the righteous path!
	It's terrible to be... It's like being locked in a world You're the only one running an angry path.
	You're on a totally angry path.
	I have a right to be angry!
	I'm watching my country be destroyed by hippies!
	You're gonna, by hippies, you're gonna have a heart attack, JC.
	Listen, let me tell you that the hippies of old with the long hair, now you have hippies that got things in their faces and they're all dressed in black everywhere you go.
	What do you think would happen if I took your blood pressure right now?
	You took my blood pressure?
	That's right.
	My blood pressure would probably be through the roof as it should be because I'm angry!
	Not enough Americans are angry to defend us against satanic onslaught of evil!
	Alright, Los Angeles and Patrick, you're on with J.C.
	Hey, how are you doing?
	I'm okay.
	J.C.' 's not so good though.
	Yeah, he sounds a little wound up.
	I think it's those homoerotic tendencies he has.
	You know, J.C., this caller makes a good point.
	You wouldn't dare to say that to me.
	It would figure if someone from Los Angeles, the pornography capital of the world, where your own police are selling pornography in Japantown.
	It figures.
	Oh, you heard that last call.
	You know, JC, I think the caller makes a damn good point.
	You protest an awful lot.
	Excuse me?
	You protest-eth an awful lot about people of other sexual proclivities.
	Right, if I don't protest, who will?
	I think it's like the Catholic priest that goes into the priesthood to hide his homoerotic tendencies.
	I think JC's got the same thing going on.
	How dare you accuse me of being a Catholic!
	That's disgusting!
	I never!
	I never!
	I am not a papist puppet!
	Well, I'll sacrifice a goat for you tonight, J.C., but... Oh, I'm sure you will, you sinning, salacious, no-good... I really, I really called to tell... Are you gonna, are you gonna have relations with that there goat first?
	Probably.
	I knew it!
	That's how they do it in Los Angeles!
	The goat aside for a moment.
	This might interest you, JC.
	Invisibility just around the corner.
	Caller, what would you do if you could become invisible?
	Well, the first thing I would do is I'd take my wife and we'd go to Las Vegas and make a lot of money.
	And then the second thing I'd do while I was there, I would go to Area 51 and see exactly what's going on.
	That's another thing!
	There's no such thing as Area 51!
	And Las Vegas is another sin-filled city that God is going to smite the first chance he gets when Armageddon comes!
	And it can't come a minute too soon!
	You really think Las Vegas is evil?
	You honestly think it's evil?
	Las Vegas is the gambling capital of the world!
	People go there to gamble!
	And watch stage shows!
	Elvis perform there!
	And you have never gambled, JC?
	Never!
	Never?
	I have never gambled.
	Sounds like sex.
	Alright.
	I've never done anything sinful in my life, Mr. Bell.
	Never done anything sinful in your life?
	I'm pure righteous light.
	Dave, just down from Alaska.
	You're on with JC, if you can handle it.
	Oh, no problem.
	Hey Art, this is downtown Dave.
	I used to call it quite a bit in the 90s.
	Yes.
	And congratulations on your new marriage.
	I gotta tell you, I'm a little jealous of you and Major Ed Daines.
	I see, well thank you.
	And I'd like to talk about your marriages more in the future, will ya?
	Okay.
	But right now, JC's here.
	Hey JC, are you washed in the blood and what's your least favorite scripture?
	Excuse me, my least favorite scripture?
	I'd probably say the Book of Mormon.
	No, no, we're talking about the Bible.
	We gotta get some common ground here.
	You just can't be such an isolationist.
	Excuse me, Ward, if you're talking about the Bible, I love the entire Bible, but my favorite scripture is Revelations.
	No, no, no, he asked you for your least- Wait a minute, Jersey.
	No, your least favorite one.
	Yeah.
	I don't have any least favorite parts of the Bible.
	Well, you do.
	You're trying to get me to insult the Bible.
	There's no bad parts.
	I'm telling you, it's a good read from cover to cover.
	No, it's all good, but you know, the fact is, I'm trying to see Jesus in you, and I think Jesus, uh, don't talk as much as you do.
	Listen, listen, you are- you first have no way to judge me.
	Oh, I'm a Christian.
	Hey, I'm a born-in-the-butt Christian.
	Hey, you know what?
	Wait a minute, JC, listen to this man.
	Hey, the power of life and death are in the tongue.
	Art Bell knows that, and that's why he's got so much life, because he's got a great tongue.
	He's got a forked tongue.
	He's got a devil lizard tongue that he sits there and he flicks out at the microphone and sends his evil out over the airwaves to corrupt America.
	The fact is, you know what, are you part of the answer or part of the problem?
	I am the solution to the problem that plagues America.
	The sin that bubbles up in the streets, in the boring pits of sewage, is going to consume all sinners one day, for it thrives when God proclaims victory over the enemy and says, I cast you down, sinner.
	I cast you, collar down, down, down.
	Beneath my feet, get beneath me, Satan.
	I stomp on you and step on you, and you have no power here.
	Otherwise, it's been a great half hour.
	JC and Caller, thank you both.
	Mr. Bell, one more thing.
	Very quick.
	Your friend, Dr. Tess Gerstin, and her devil book, I'm going to preach against her when she calls, so she better be ready.
	Bye-bye, JC.
	I'm Art Bell and this is Coast to Coast AM.
	Well, that was enough of that, and we'll get back to whatever it is you want to talk about very shortly.
	That man has a lot of pathology at work there.
	It's a great morning, a great night, a great day, whatever the case may be, wherever you are.
	It's all of you, all the way to the very end of the program this night.
	And by the way, of course, I'll be here for the weekend as well.
	I'm Art Bell.
	Well this is Coast to Coast AM.
	There is actually an article that backs up what I'm saying about invisibility.
	It's strange and unusual as it may seem.
	You can read it for yourself on coasttocoastam.com.
	They're very close to a technology that they claim actually might make things and people invisible.
	What would you do if you had the opportunity to be invisible for a day or a week?
	Well, I guess nobody would really want a lifetime as in Memoirs of an Invisible Man, but given even a little short experience at the game, what would you do?
	All right, let's go... It's such a hard choice.
	Let's go to this wildcard line and say, Sage, you are on the air.
	Hey, this is Sage calling from Oakland.
	Hi, Sage.
	Hi.
	Actually, I was on hold to...
	Well, first I would ask him, what does he know about Oakland?
	I assume probably not much.
	I was so disappointed when he...
	Oh, what would you have said?
	I mean, what attack would you have taken?
	Well, first I would ask him what does he know about Oakland?
	And I would say probably not much.
	As far as JC is concerned, I think every location save the one he's in is evil.
	Well, this is what I would say to JC.
	Um...
	First of all, I actually feel sorry for him because I don't believe that he had any faith or a God, because if he had faith and a God, he wouldn't feel so responsible to play God or dish out people's karma or He speaks for God, you know?
	Well, he seems to have himself at the very right hand of God, casting people into the boiling pits of sewage.
	Yeah, well, see, my God is so righteous that nothing I could say or do could compare to His righteousness or His will.
	You know what I'm saying?
	My thinking is that JC should be praying that God has a sense of humor.
	Oh, yes.
	You're right on.
	I mean, I think that that was actually probably the most disrespectful display.
	Well, at least he's equally disrespectful to all.
	Listen, if you had an opportunity to be invisible, dear, what would you do with it?
	Say you were invisible for a day.
	Oh my goodness.
	Wow.
	What we're after here is the naked truth.
	In other words, what you really would do.
	Well, I really like that idea.
	That sounded fabulous because I definitely am a gambler, a gambling addict.
	Oh, you are?
	At least I wish I could be.
	And if I was invisible, I think I would be the best gambler.
	You'd be good at it.
	You could reach out and stop the little ball on the number you wanted.
	Oh, everything.
	I would probably find things I could gamble on.
	But I think ideally, or like the better me, would want to do something good.
	You know, like save the world.
	Sounds like you're in a beauty contest, you know, saving the world.
	Well, thank you.
	Sorry to cut you off a little early.
	I think, isn't that what every beauty contestant says?
	Peace, world peace.
	They want world peace.
	They always want world peace.
	All right, let's go to the International Line and Ontario with Rob.
	Hey, Rob.
	How you doing, bud?
	Hi.
	Thank you, sir, for your time.
	This is great.
	This is really a privilege to speak with you, and thanks a lot for putting JC on, because you scattered my thoughts.
	I thought I had everything figured out that I wanted to ask you, but I actually thought of a few things that I wanted to ask JC.
	Uh-huh.
	Well, I can't... There's no way... There are some callers that I feel I could actually speak for.
	JC is not one of them.
	No, is he a person or is he just a character?
	Oh, no, no, no.
	A lot of people ask that.
	A lot of people think that J.C.
	is, you know, a put-on, but he's not.
	I mean, he is a put-on, but he's not an arranged put-on.
	J.C.
	just happened, and he's been calling the show now for years.
	I know, he's tried to disguise his voice.
	I actually thought about imitating a relative of his, or maybe doing a counter-rebuttal guy, like Rob the Awoken and ask JC with some hardcore questions.
	A lot of people think he's Phil Henry.
	I don't think so.
	Yeah, he's very closed off.
	I don't believe in a God that would maliciously create existence that would have even a hell at that.
	I think everybody has a chance to better themselves in so many ways.
	You do have to wonder about a God that would create JC though and turn him loose.
	I've met similar people.
	He's got a character, a personality trait that could fall under the seven.
	I think there's seven.
	Is it not?
	In psychology?
	Yes.
	And he's very close.
	He's stayed stuck.
	I can almost tell you what religion.
	I don't want to put anybody down.
	But he's not even willing to believe that there are other planets or the possibility of other existence out there.
	He would say, oh, it's from hell, let alone invisibility.
	Ooh, that's too much.
	It's too much for those minds.
	You know, Invisibility, I've been thinking it would really turn the world on its tail.
	I mean, you could never be sure that you were alone, you could never be sure that you had privacy, you could never be sure of anything if Invisibility becomes... maybe there should be a law against it.
	I think it's on its way anyway.
	I've taken thought, and this is very humbling to be on the air with you, because this is one of the few shows that I think isn't sold out to the veto powers that be, and it really has made me Put in my place for someone like me who thinks they have an answer for everything, in a generalized sense.
	But invisibility, if you think of it in the Predator sense, like the movie, Predator?
	You can bend light.
	If you cram enough energy and create an electromagnetic field, you can bend light.
	So it makes total sense to me.
	And on top of that, it's just another tidbit of information that's being released slowly to not really...
	Civilization, because it's too much, but it has been there for quite some time.
	For me, it would connect with the Philadelphia experiment.
	Okay, well here's something to think about.
	And I just read this story tonight about how close they are to invisibility.
	They've actually made something invisible to microwaves, and so they say making it invisible to light may not be a big deal.
	It may be viable.
	It may be something they can really do, and fairly soon.
	Now, if This is a public story, which it is, you know, out in the Associated Press and so forth, then you have to imagine that in the secret labs in our government somewhere, they've had invisibility for some time.
	I totally agree.
	Chew that one over a little bit.
	Hey, they had the stuff for some time before they released that information.
	They had the Blackbird plane, they had Mach before they released it.
	That's just like Gene Roddenberry, the guy was a genius, the prime director of ...was to not dump too much information on a civilization, because they can't handle it.
	You gotta wait for people to catch up.
	And for me, the Middle East... I won't say just the Middle East, but those that are less evolved in their spirit and their knowing are being locked down right now, because the rest of the goodies are coming out because the Church doesn't have control anymore.
	I know.
	Actually, I just watched Star Trek 4 again last night, and one of the things I noted about it was that they violated, kind of with a chuckle, they violated the Prime Directive.
	Now, the Prime Directive is That you will not do anything that would disturb or enhance a civilization in any way whatsoever.
	In other words, if you're back in time, for example, you would do nothing that would disturb the even flow of time.
	Which is, should not be disturbed, will not be disturbed by anybody who happens to be tromping around.
	But in Star Trek 4, you look for the instance yourself.
	They violated the Prime Directive themselves.
	So, there you have it.
	Let's go to, all the way to Arkansas, Conway, Arkansas, I think it is, and Debbie.
	Hi, Debbie.
	Hi, how are you, Art?
	Quite well.
	It is a pleasure to talk to you.
	I've tried to get a hold of you so many times.
	Well, here you are.
	I listen to you every weekend.
	The first question is, and I asked your screener too, is JC real?
	He is real.
	Well, let me qualify that.
	He's real in the sense that, and I promise this is true, we don't set him up, we don't put him on, he is not contracted to be on or any of that baloney, he is just like any other caller to this program.
	Now, otherwise, he's not really quite normal, obviously.
	He is so hilarious.
	He is, isn't he?
	And I, you know, years ago I used to think, Yeah, it's a Phil Henry, or it's somebody like that, with some put-on deal.
	But I have come to believe, and I've had private emails from J.C.
	and his errant wife, Edna, and believe me, they're real.
	I mean, I'm sorry to have to say that, but... He's got a wife?
	Had a wife.
	She apparently, according to J.C., has run off with a trucker.
	But with his attitude about sex, you know, I mean...
	He is just so laughable.
	Okay, the reason that I called, that was really fun for you to put him on with the audience tonight.
	That was cool.
	Yeah, that was fun.
	The reason I called is, I think if I was invisible, I'd get behind some of those closed government doors and see what's really going on.
	Oh, yes.
	I'll call her earlier said it, you know.
	Somebody said there's no, oh it was J.C.
	said there's no Area 51.
	He's absolutely wrong, there is.
	And to be able to just go across where it says lethal force will be used, they've got a sign like that up there if you go beyond this point, and to just tromp along invisibly and really go see for yourself what they've got there, boy wouldn't that be a gift.
	But do we really want to know?
	Like you were talking about earlier, you know, if there's nothing we can do about any of this that's going on, do we really want to know?
	No, I want to know.
	I do want to know.
	Do you really?
	Yes, I do.
	I want to know.
	I want to know what's inside those hangars.
	I would like to stroll right past, you know, all the guard gates and whatever all else they've got for security and take a look.
	Just take a look.
	Not do anything untoward.
	Just take a look so I would know.
	But wouldn't it be hard to keep it a secret?
	Yes.
	Yes, I'm the kind of person, and I'm sure you've noticed, no matter what, I just sort of say what's going on in my life.
	I have a hard time not doing that.
	I'm very open.
	You do, but you know what?
	It makes you more like a, to me, you're a celebrity.
	I mean, I listen to you every single weekend, but it makes you more like a family member, more like, you're just like everybody else.
	I try to be more like everybody else.
	Years ago, I decided, actually, I don't like this whole celebrity thing.
	I've never liked it.
	I love doing radio, and I love talking to people, and I love doing the program, but I don't like the celebrity part of it.
	I've never liked it.
	And by the way, congratulations on becoming a new dad.
	Thank you.
	You're welcome.
	And thank you so much for taking my call.
	All right, take care.
	Erin is going through a little morning sickness bout.
	I guess that's fairly normal.
	And according to her, why one moment she's hot, the next moment she's cold, everything smells a little different.
	And not so good.
	Not the way it used to.
	So I've been assuring her, no, it's normal, you are not.
	And so whatever it is that's changed in your body, it's not that hamburger, it's not that beef, it's not that orange juice, it's just, you know, whatever it is that makes people have that, well, it's pregnancy.
	A wild card line, Dave, you're on the air, hi.
	Okay, I'm using the black phone, so it might not pick up that good.
	Um, but anyway, what I would probably do is find Bin Laden out in the, just go out in the desert and probably find Bin Laden and just put an end to this and then probably anyone that took his place, I'd do the same thing.
	Yeah, I was about to say, even if you got Bin Laden, I don't think it would put an end to it.
	We have an entire part of one religion that has decided that we will either convert and be with them and believers or we will die.
	So if we kill Bin Laden, which by the way I'm all in favor of, I don't think that it's going to change what's coming.
	No, because you know, I learned being in the military, when you knock one out, one steps up and takes his place, and that's why they call them sleeper cells.
	I've got one thing I'd like to say before I get off the phone.
	Have you thought of getting up with JC and putting out a Best of JC CD for your callers?
	I suppose we've got enough material by now to do something like that, huh?
	We've actually recorded a lot of the Op Bell shows here at Fort Bragg, and I actually got a nice little collection of them, but I know since We've just recorded them.
	Nobody sells them or anything.
	But it would definitely be something you might want to think about because everybody on the bass, when they first come in, we'd love to play it to them.
	They just flip over it and they can't believe this individual is actually real.
	Well, by now I would think we have as much as two or two and a half hours collectively of JC, and I think that would be too much for anybody.
	In fact, 30 minutes was kind of pushing the limit, I thought.
	First time caller line, you are on the air.
	Andrew in Wisconsin someplace.
	Art Bell, is this really you?
	It's really me.
	How are you doing tonight?
	Oh, quite well.
	Good.
	Listen, I just wanted to talk to you about you and all your experiences.
	With all the special guests you've had and your amazing life that you've already lived.
	I have lived an amazing life, it's true.
	You really have.
	I mean, you're in the Philippines now?
	I am.
	And how is it over there?
	How is it over here?
	Uh, that would take a whole show.
	It's like being in a different dimension, sir.
	That's the only way I can shorten it.
	Everything is so very different.
	I think that every American, it would do America good.
	The American taxpayer would be well served, in my opinion, to buy a round-trip ticket for any American citizen who would like it to go to some very different foreign country and experience it and then go home.
	Just for that short moment of time.
	Well, just, you know, 21 days, whatever, three weeks, just for a little while to see what the rest of the world is like.
	And I think it would be, it would make America a better place.
	You know, much in the same way as those who join the military and get to travel around the world have a very different perspective on the world than those who just sit at home.
	You are so right.
	You are so right, Art.
	And by the way, when you say you're calling on a black phone, what do you mean?
	A black phone?
	What is that?
	My cell phone is black.
	Oh, you have a black cell phone.
	Well, if J.C.
	were still here, he would tell you that that's evil.
	Jesus Christ?
	No, J.C., the caller, J.C.
	You may think of himself in that way.
	I'm sorry, I thought you meant, you know, J.C.
	No, not the real one, no.
	All right.
	Have you experienced any supernatural experiences in the Philippines?
	I have not yet, although the Philippines is an extremely supernatural place.
	There are many things going on here that would be in the realm of the supernatural, and I may do an entire show on it one of these days soon.
	I hope you do.
	I bet you we'd all enjoy that.
	All right, thank you very much for the call, and let's see if we have time to squeeze one in.
	Let's go to Marty in Washington State.
	Hey, Marty.
	Well, hello, Art.
	Hi.
	Hi.
	Congratulations to you and yours.
	Thank you.
	And I really thank you for creating such a nice format for even people like JC to get on.
	Well, there is no other format quite like this, as far as I know, in the world.
	No, there certainly is not that I've ever heard of.
	Anyway, I wanted to regale you with what I would do if I was invisible.
	Very quickly.
	I would use my powers of invisibility to go and have a chat with mentally ill in North Korea.
	He said he's sorry for the nuclear detonation, and when it comes to nuclear detonation, sorry just doesn't get it.
	I'm Art Bell.
	Open lines, anything you want to talk about is fair game.
	We are talking about invisibility because it's actually on the horizon.
	If you could say something like invisibility is on the horizon, it really is.
	They've already made a thing invisible to microwaves, and so it's just a matter of moving into the light spectrum, and they're really saying the chance of adapting the concept to visible light is good.
	Cloak designer David Shurig said in a telephone interview that, well, from an engineering point of view, quoting him, it's very challenging, but nonetheless It's on the horizon.
	Can you imagine being invisible?
	What would that do to our economy?
	What would that do virtually?
	To all of life.
	Something to think about.
	What would you do if you were invisible?
	I'm not.
	I'm Art Bell.
	Good evening, I'm Art Bell filling in for George Norrie who has a well-deserved,
	well-earned night off and then makes a good three-day weekend for him.
	I'll be here, of course, on my normal Saturday and Sunday.
	Going just a little north of where I am right now on the international line to South Korea.
	Alan, you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hi, Art.
	How are you doing today?
	Just spiffy.
	How do you like your new working hours?
	Um, they are a bit different, but the way I arrange it, Alan, is we've got nice mini blinds and curtains, and I darken it down in here, and you wouldn't know the difference.
	Yeah, I was wondering what JC looked like.
	You know, I keep, you know, when I hear him, my picture of, remember the late Michael Jetter?
	There's some, there's some things, Alan, that you don't want to know.
	So, I saw your name in Tess Gersten's book.
	Oh, you know, I heard that Tess had a new book out and that she had mentioned me in her book.
	In what context did she mention me?
	The Art Bell Show.
	What it is, is there's a gruesome murder and, well, can I say a little bit?
	Yeah, sure.
	Decapitation and Rizno, Jane Rizno, is saying, like, You know, the person was probably conscious for about a minute or two after they were decapitated.
	Oh, God.
	And the other person said, where did you hear that?
	She goes, well, I was listening on the Art Bell Show and blah, blah, blah, blah, like that.
	I'm a real Tess Gerritsen fan.
	She wrote a book called Gravity.
	Oh, turn me on to her, yeah.
	Have you read Gravity?
	Oh, I loved Gravity.
	What a completely, I was so blown away by that book.
	Any of you who have not yet read Gravity, you absolutely have got to read it.
	It's one of the best science fiction reality slash really cool, keep you on the edge of your seat kind of books you've ever read.
	Hey listen, since you're in South Korea, how was the reaction there when they lit one off in the North?
	Initially, everybody kind of spazzed out initially, but then the Koreans Surprisingly, it's like business as usual.
	Actually, around the world it's pretty much that way.
	I expected a much bigger U.S.
	reaction, but everybody seems like they're going to let it slide.
	That's the way, you know, really it's just like you could not even tell that anything happened over here, you know.
	And this morning I'm reading the Korean Herald and the party in power, the party that's in power right now is the Yuri Party.
	And they're very liberal, very ultra-liberal.
	And they sent an envoy up to North Korea and said, well, we have some businesses we're doing with you and that's not going to change, because you guys are actually pretty good guys, you know, we trust you.
	And I'm reading this and I'm going, God, Lord, you've got to be kidding!
	Yeah, I'd have the same reaction, you've got to be kidding!
	I note that today he has said, I'm sorry, and I thought, you know, when it comes to nuclear detonations, sorry just doesn't get it.
	I think he's sorry that it was a fizzle, that's what I think.
	You gotta keep in mind, like they said it was half a kiloton, well that's 500 pounds.
	We have conventional 500 pound bombs.
	A 500 pound bomb would probably take out a good portion of a Walmart, but that's about it.
	Well, I'm not sure if that was actually 500 pounds, or it might have been.
	I know it wasn't what they expected, although it did produce, what, a 3, I'm sorry, a 4.2 as measured in Florida, so that sounds like more than 500 pounds.
	Yeah, could be.
	With authors, what are you reading lately?
	Um, you know, I'm reading a book called Altered Carbon right now.
	I read an awful lot of science fiction.
	Oh, a friend of mine read that, where you can upload your consciousness.
	That's exactly correct.
	Yes, yes, he was raving about it.
	They talk about sleeves.
	Instead of bodies being called bodies, they're called sleeves.
	In other words, something you just wear for a short time and nobody ever really dies.
	There's a little chip implanted and when you die they just dig it out and you're put into a new sleeve.
	And of course you can change from male to female.
	It doesn't matter.
	It's a very interesting book.
	But I'm always reading something.
	I'm an avid reader.
	Same here.
	If I could be invisible, Yes.
	I think I'd probably go up north and do a Dexter, if you have seen that Showtime TV series yet.
	No, I haven't.
	Meaning?
	Ah, okay.
	Dexter is the Showtime series.
	He's a cop, but he's also a serial killer.
	But the hook is, he only kills the people that really deserve it.
	So he only kills bad guys.
	So he does what the courts are unable to accomplish.
	Yeah.
	Okay, sir.
	Well, thank you and take care and good night.
	Yes, good night indeed from South Korea, just a bit north here.
	Let's go to Cape Cod, Massachusetts, and Greg.
	Hello, Greg.
	Good morning, Art.
	This is Greg.
	I'm calling you from Cape Cod.
	I'm sitting on my deck enjoying your show in the most absolute spectacular meteor shower I've ever seen.
	Oh, no kidding?
	Yeah, they're just coming every three or four, every few seconds.
	It's unbelievable.
	I did have a comment on the invisibility thing, but I did, I was hoping I'd get on with J.C.
	Like that other guy, I loved his, you know, his J.C.
	stood for just crazy.
	I was going to throw one in and say J.C.
	stood for, you know, jilted communist, but because he's so anti-American.
	I don't think we're gonna ever get past lesbian Tupperware parties, but that's just me.
	That was funny.
	Oh, and we know he's listening right now, right?
	Of course.
	So I could tell him that, don't judge, let ye be judged, and he'll be punished seven times for it, right?
	Well, that'll get him dialing.
	Okay, my invisibility thing was, I'm with you, I have to admit, and he'll love that, I'd have to go into a, like a, Playboy shoot for one of my things on my list and the other one would be to sneak into Wall Street to get the tips to make the really big money and stuff like that
	The implication of that being that I guess that all the people who make the big money at Wall Street have insider information.
	I've always wondered a lot about that and also what constitutes, what really constitutes inside information?
	In other words, inside information is a tip, right?
	It's a tip that a stock is going to do something good.
	I guess the difference between a legal bit of inside information and an illegal bit of inside information is simply how good the tip is.
	That's something to think about.
	In Los Angeles, Jim, you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Good evening.
	Good evening.
	I started off wanting to follow up on something I told you about a couple of months ago, but given other events of the evening, I think I should If one had the chance to be invisible, I think it's very likely that most of the really cool stuff has already been painted with or covered by the same invisibility-creating substance.
	So that would kind of... I've got to set the sights a little bit lower, and I think I might just have to visit one of those lesbian Tupperware parties.
	I'm a red-blooded American guy.
	And I'm not going to be invited to one, so... No.
	No, so you'll have to forever wonder or become invisible and actually visit one.
	Yeah.
	Can you imagine, though, actually becoming invisible?
	For example, I guess you would be able to see nothing of yourself.
	Somebody suggested you wouldn't have vision, you wouldn't be able to see, but I don't think that's true.
	I think you would be able to see.
	You would simply be invisible to everybody else.
	I'm not sure quite how that would work.
	But I guess another element of that is, if you do have the ability to manipulate what is seen to make it invisible, then presumably it wouldn't be long before a company is going to market a suit that you could wear that might make you look 20 pounds lighter.
	And I suspect that would be a pretty good moneymaker.
	Now, I hadn't considered that aspect of it, but people who are really fat, or really skinny, or really short, or really ugly, well, it would certainly even us all out, wouldn't it, invisibility?
	It could.
	And, you know, I guess another element of that would be, you know, if you live in the city and you just went out and bought a nice car, and you're a little worried about its, you know, Disappearing, broken windows, that kind of thing.
	Dress it up.
	Or, more to the point, dress it down.
	Dress it down?
	Like a 77 Impala with five shades of rust.
	There you go.
	Can you imagine how much fun you could have with invisibility on Halloween?
	It's a good one.
	Oh man, you could just scare the... Anyway.
	But, I mean, I guess that's another L.A.
	element.
	Halloween is kind of a year-round event.
	Yeah, that's very true.
	But can you imagine on Halloween how much fun you could have?
	You know, with the little tykes that would come to your door.
	Oh my God, you could have a blast.
	Having things move through the air, that sort of thing.
	Maybe an axe.
	I guess in this day and age, you'd never get away with that, would you?
	East of the Rockies, you are on the air.
	Mr. Bell.
	Mr. Bell, indeed.
	Thank you, sir, for taking my call.
	This is Remo from calling in West Virginia at the bottom of a coal mine.
	At the bottom of a coal?
	Really?
	Yes.
	You're actually at the bottom of a coal mine?
	Yeah, it's an abandoned coal mine and we cleaned it up, walled it in, and I live down here.
	You live in a coal mine?
	And you have a phone line down there?
	Yes, we have everything down here.
	Water, electricity, gas, the whole nine yards.
	I'm curious, what motivated you to move into a coal mine?
	To get away from the outside world.
	Well, I guess, let me rephrase.
	Are you worried about some natural or unnatural disaster which you would live through being down there?
	Well, I feel I'm safer here in case of a unnatural disaster.
	That's true.
	Do you have your entire family down there or are you by yourself?
	There's just my wife and myself.
	My children are grown after they left home.
	How do you, out of curiosity, how do you present that idea?
	You know, hey hon, listen, how about moving down into a coal mine?
	I mean, how do you put that to your wife?
	Well, actually she was very open to the idea.
	She's a wonderful person.
	I'm sure you're familiar with women who understand how men feel, and it just seemed like the right thing to do.
	I wonder if any woman really understands how a man feels, or if any man really understands how a woman feels.
	There's degrees of understanding, but we are such different creatures, men and women.
	Nevertheless, your wife, would you say she went along with it?
	It was your idea, right?
	It was my idea, and she went along with it.
	Fortunately, she's a wonderful person.
	And accepts me and my ideas and doesn't ask a lot of questions.
	She just goes along.
	Be a safe place to have a lesbian Tupperware party.
	Oh my God, I wish I could.
	Let's invite them all down here.
	All right.
	Well, let's see.
	Do you have different rooms or is it just like one sort of long...
	It's, it's, it's very, um, gosh, how can I explain this?
	Yes, there are different rooms.
	It's, um, it's all split off and you, you come down the main corridor and it's, uh, it's only about, uh, 250 feet down the main corridor and then it splits off into three different sections and there are two chambers in each of the three different sections.
	Uh, we have plumbing and electricity and it's, it's, you know, we live in the real world.
	Right up here with the rest of the folks.
	I don't know.
	How far below ground is it?
	Just under 200 feet.
	200 feet?
	Just under 200 feet.
	It's 197, 196.
	Depends on who did the survey.
	My God.
	What's the temperature?
	Is it a very constant temperature?
	It depends on who did the survey.
	My God, what's the temperature?
	Is it a very constant temperature?
	It stays about 74, 75 degrees year round.
	Wow.
	Oh, it's wonderful.
	I have never talked to... I've talked to a person who lived in a missile silo, but you're the first coal mine.
	If you know someone who wants to trade, I'd swap right now.
	You're a coal mine for a missile silo.
	All right, well it's out in the air, you never know.
	But the main reason I called you was about shadow people.
	We see them down here all the time.
	And I wanted to ask if your listeners had anything, any information, or if you did, why is it that all of the shadow people that we see wear hats?
	Oh, that's not unusual at all.
	No, it's not, and that's what I don't understand.
	Why are they always wearing hats?
	I truly don't know the answer to that.
	All I know is that you're absolutely correct.
	And one night, we had an expert on, a Native American expert, and we talked about shadow people, and we had people actually draw and submit sketches of what they had seen.
	And I would say in about 85 or 90% of the cases, they were wearing hats.
	I'll just sort of leave that question open for the audience.
	What do you think, folks?
	Why do you think shadow people, I mean, after all, out here in the real world, how many people wear hats?
	Not that many.
	Eighty-five, ninety percent of the shadow people do.
	And there is one definitive difference between wherever they are and here.
	So, I don't have the answer to that, but it's in the air now.
	A wild card line, you're on the air.
	Dan in California.
	Hello, Art.
	How you doing?
	Just great, sir.
	That's great.
	I've listened to you since, shoot, 91, I think.
	Gosh, I wish people would stop saying that.
	I've listened to you since I've been a baby.
	Every show has been so interesting.
	I mean, it's kept me up half the night for years.
	But I had a question about, I think his name was Oates.
	He had reverse speech.
	Did he?
	I've never heard anything about him.
	He just seemed to have disappeared.
	Well, actually, he did.
	The last I heard, he was in Australia.
	Was that a fact?
	His reverse speech experiments?
	You know, I was never able to really determine what I felt about reverse speech.
	Whether I felt it had a lot of validity, some validity, or none at all.
	I never really came to an absolute conclusion about it.
	It was pretty interesting.
	With the cloak of invisibility, I think Well, they already took care of Bin Laden, but the North Korean dictator, I'd like to haunt him for a while, maybe pull the rug out from under him a couple times.
	Well, you know, he's already over the edge and paranoid enough right now, so I think if you were to start in on him, there's just no telling what he might do.
	He might, for example, push a button somewhere just to get rid of what he thought was a ghost.
	That's true, that's true.
	Being so close to the area where he's located?
	Well, we're not that close.
	Listen, I've got to scoot.
	Thank you very much for the call.
	But does it concern me?
	No, because I think that the Philippines would not be a prime target should he decide to use one of those nasty weapons that he has now developed.
	The Philippines would not be a prime target.
	But I'll tell you, when the earthquake started last night, You know, I thought for just a moment, could it be?
	From Manila, I'm Art Bell.
	Top of the day, top of the night, whatever it may be, wherever you are.
	Della in Bullhead City, Arizona says, hey Art, don't you find it interesting that everybody's invisible priorities concern sex and money?
	Not really, Della.
	After all, I don't think there's a whole lot of difference between the invisible world, or what people would do in it, versus the visible world.
	Those are the important things.
	Gary from Montreal, Quebec uh... echoes what many of you have said uh... regarding the
	hats and shadow He says, I believe that shadow people are always seen in hats.
	It's because...
	Well, it's because many people have signs in their windows that say, big discount on hats for shadow people.
	I've read the wrong one.
	No, most are saying that it's a time slip, and people from 1700 through perhaps the 1960s wore hats, and we are seeing a time slip.
	Let's go all the way to London, England, and say, hello there, Deborah, you're on the air.
	Good morning, Art.
	Well, yeah, I just want to say thank you.
	Because of my childhood, and the story I'm about to tell you, you present a forum that feeds my curiosity, interest, and wonder.
	Well, you're obviously, probably, I shouldn't say obviously, you sound like an American in Great Britain.
	What are you doing there?
	I fell in love.
	I was born in Charleston, South Carolina, lived in New York where I modeled for five years, and I've been in England for seven.
	And I've got a beautiful little boy.
	The things we do for love.
	Border Collie.
	I got the whole English thing.
	I've even already had my tea this morning.
	My goodness.
	What time is it in England right now?
	We've got 20 to 10.
	20 to 10 in the morning?
	You are what time?
	About 20 to 5 in the afternoon.
	Heavens.
	I presume you've adjusted well.
	I have.
	It's a big world.
	Anyway, go ahead.
	In any event, yeah, well, I grew up in Charleston, and my family lived in a house.
	Actually, Mr. Zaffis, John Zaffis, has helped my family with this.
	Because basically, my dad died in January, and things started to happen again.
	Basically, his dentures went missing before they were able to be put into his mouth, so he could be buried with them.
	And a couple of days after tearing the house apart, they showed up in the middle of the hallway, just out of the blue.
	And also he put a rose, well we are pretty absolute certain it was him that put a rose on a mirror that had just been cleaned.
	You know, it was like a perfect single stem budding rose.
	And I personally, here in London, I felt him basically wrap his arms around me and I've had dreams and things.
	In any event, he was plagued throughout his life.
	He grew up in a house in Charleston and It was built in the 1900s.
	You know, Charleston's incredibly historical and lots of... When you walk down the streets of Charleston, it's almost as though you're in another time.
	Yeah, it's changing now.
	It's developing greatly, but at the time, the house that they moved into was very shack-like because it was close to the Eliza Lucas plantation.
	And it probably was, once upon a time, slave quarters.
	In any event, my grandmother got a loan and she built it up with bricks on the outside and made it nice and raised her family there, but there was a cupboard in this place that was incredibly eerie.
	My mother, she once stood in it and she literally says that she felt, and the look on her face when she tells the story is quite convincing, That she felt these things just wrapping around her and, like, rushing past her.
	And my Uncle David, when he was younger, he had put a microphone in the closet.
	They were trying to get an EVP all the way back then.
	This is, like, you know, in the 70s.
	And they said that they heard something scratching and something sounded like something being dropped and knocking and things like that.
	But this microphone was on a stand in the middle of this room, nothing, you know, able to touch it, and there were no rats or mice or anything like that.
	But the house started off, as I said, as a shack, and the woman who had lived there prior to had shot herself in the bedroom, and the bullet hole was still there along with the blood on the floor.
	A woman prior to her had killed her husband and dragged his body to the railroad tracks, which were not very far, and my granddad shot himself in the chest.
	And, uh, all this was in the same bedroom, and I remember as a child growing up and seeing the bullet hole in the window.
	Um, my sister was taking some photos for me, because I've always been fascinated by the house.
	We had some wonderful times there, though we had some really creepy things happen as well.
	Very demonic things, like my grandmother and granddad, um, well, the man that she married after my granddad committed suicide, um, uh, she would be held down in bed, or feel things touching her, you know, uh, and I know you have, not a soft spot, but particular interest or understanding for people who have been attacked by an incubus or something like that.
	That actually happened to my dad, of which he said he was struggling as hard as he could and envisioned light and prayed.
	As he says, he could hear the hounds of hell and that something said to him that it was going to get him.
	My grandmother had ten pregnancies, nine of which actually survived, and I saw my sister, Darlene, killed, run over by a school bus when she was six.
	I'm not blood-related, meaning that I have a different dad, so I tell you what, I'm actually very grateful for that because there's a curse on that family.
	My aunt Well, I was about to say that anyway.
	Listen, I've got to run, hon.
	But that sounds like a curse.
	It really does sound like a curse.
	And I'm not sure, at all sure, that I would want to live in a house of that sort, where that much had occurred in one bedroom.
	I don't think so.
	And it reminds me of a couple of things.
	One is that I am going to be doing Ghost to Ghost on Halloween.
	And I do particularly enjoy stories of entity attacks.
	So if you have one of those type stories, get it ready.
	Rehearse it.
	Remember it.
	And I'm not suggesting or, in fact, I'm telling you don't make anything up.
	But there's nothing wrong with kind of rehearsing the way you're going to tell it.
	It's a little easier when you get on the air.
	Um, get your stories ready.
	When we do Ghost to Ghost, we do a very, very serious program.
	I do believe in ghosts.
	I do believe that spirits linger.
	I don't know why.
	I think that EVP, and by the way, we're going to be doing an EVP show pretty soon.
	I've been getting a lot of email about that.
	So, we're going to be doing another EVP show.
	They're actually going to get the EVP CDs over here by FedEx, which is probably the most reliable way to get something here to the Philippines.
	And we're going to do that show shortly.
	And by the way, if you want to reach me, I have email.
	I'm Art Bell at MindSpring.com.
	That's A-R-T-B-E-L-L at MindSpring, M-I-N-D-S-P-R-I-N-G, MindSpring.com.
	And I would love to get email from you if you have a really good, relatively short ghost story.
	You might begin submitting those, and I'll of course read some of them during Ghost to Ghost.
	First time caller line, Susan, you're on the air from California.
	Hi Art, how are you?
	Just fine.
	Good.
	I hate to ruin the invisibility theory about sex and money, which are both great, but where I would like to go first is to the Vatican and into the archives.
	That's a good one.
	I'd like to read whatever I can get my hands on, and then I'd like to The next rat, I think, would be the Dalai Lama, and I would want to know if he noticed that I was there, even though I was invisible.
	I'm curious, how much do you think really is hidden in the Vatican?
	Oh, I think there's so much.
	I think they've pillaged so much of the esoteric knowledge and kept it to themselves.
	I think they have a handle on a lot, you know, of what's going on currently.
	I think that's why they have Their own observatory, you know, and they're looking into the heavens for something.
	I could not agree more.
	There's obviously something going on with Mount Graham and they know something's out there or they know something's coming.
	They know something or they would not have pushed their way past every environmental objection and there were many to get that observatory there.
	Believe me, they applied some pressure.
	Right, and I believe that they know a lot More than just what's coming, you know, I think they know a lot about the past that's been kept from us, you know, as human beings, for whatever reason.
	I would just love to go there and look at the old manuscripts and be able to understand what they say, because I think that they've got probably most of the information that would really unlock a lot of keys.
	I think there's, as my Nana would say, something in the woodpile.
	And then the Dalai Lama and then the Third Mesa.
	The Hopi Third Mesa, that's where I'd like to go and just listen and be the fly on the wall.
	That for me would be like it.
	What kind of impact do you think invisibility would have on the world?
	I mean, everybody would get paranoid that they're not alone.
	Well, I personally think that most of the planet is paranoid anyway.
	Invisibility, you know, it's kind of like, you know, I once have been, well actually more than once because my friend owned it, to a nudist colony.
	And just being naked strips you of so much of the defenses that we have.
	So I don't know if it might not be a similar feeling of You know, if we're all invisible, it certainly reduces us to a common denominator.
	It certainly would.
	And you're certainly right also, by the way, about...
	And nudist colonies or nude areas.
	I went to a nude beach once and the novelty wears off quite quickly and I think a lot of people when they think of nude this or nude that they attach some sort of sexuality to it and that's really not the case.
	I mean perhaps in the first few minutes you know you're titillated a little bit but then with everybody being naked if anything It's kind of a killer, in my estimation, for sexuality.
	I guess that has to do with... Well, that's a whole other topic and a whole other show.
	Let's go to Canada.
	We don't have a lot of time.
	Linda in Canada, you're on the air.
	Hi.
	Hi, Art.
	Art, I've got to tell you this.
	You're open line tonight.
	You know, you're the captain of your helm.
	Believe me.
	It is great.
	Well, it's great to be doing it.
	Thank you.
	First of all, I want to know, is JC part of the New World Order?
	You know, I have yet to ask JC what he thinks about the New World Order.
	He probably imagines himself right at the very head of it.
	I was wondering.
	Also, on invisibility, I cannot help feel that this new way is the prelude to time travel.
	It could be.
	I believe that with this, they can come I don't know how far into the future and to the past.
	I'm starting to wonder if there's really anything at all that we can imagine that we cannot do.
	I mean, almost everything that we've heard about in science fiction, now here comes invisibility.
	Everything we've heard about that we always thought was laughable or interesting in science fiction is beginning to come true.
	Well, Art, I believe that I've been here before and I feel what I'm doing and I know you've been here before.
	The way you speak, the way you know, and I guess your mastering the way you speak with people and the things that you just lean into so naturally.
	I think that, well, I have two copies again of Edgar Cayce's Atlantis in my possession.
	I read it years ago, but now all of a sudden two come into my possession.
	I thought, is this a sign?
	And then when you had that guest on on the weekend that he said, A couple of generations ahead, he had this vision or knowledge that millions were going to be terribly demolished, abolished.
	Do you remember that?
	Demolished, perhaps, yes.
	Okay, demolished, and I thought, are we doing this all over again?
	I know that, like, this invisibility again hit a chord in me.
	me I thought okay now we're going into the upper echelons of the technology
	that is going to overwhelm people and are we going to handle it right? I think
	that we do do things again and again.
	I think that if you look at what's going on in the world right now, and I know everybody hates the parallels to Vietnam, but frankly more and more and more as the months and now years go by, what's happening in Iraq really does seem very much like Vietnam, the latest being the Iraqization of the war, turning more and more of the work over to the newly trained Iraqis.
	The whole thing feels, the world, not just that, and that's just one example.
	I think we're doing things again and again.
	Have we been here before?
	Well, probably, because we keep doing things over and over and over again, don't we?
	All right, let's go to California, and Beatrice, you're on the air.
	Hello, if I were invisible, I would first spy on the Illuminati and Black Ops to see what they're up to.
	And the second thing I would do is I would follow and scare JC.
	Whenever he's about to do something wrong or tell somebody off, I'd Say out of nowhere, do you really want to do that?
	In just the voice that you have right now, dear, all you'd have to do, here's what you'd do.
	You'd find J.C., which wouldn't be that hard.
	In fact, I'd help you if I could.
	And you would take several pieces of Tupperware and simply float them around the room in J.C.' 's area.
	I think that'd do it.
	He'd just go right off the edge.
	And that laugh, too.
	You'd have to bring that laugh.
	Yeah, that'd be a good one.
	But I wanted to point out that, in a sense, we already have visibility with people who practice astral projection and remote viewing and things like that.
	That may well be so, but the difference here is that, you know, with astral projection, you can't seem to do any material things.
	With the kind of invisibility they're talking about here, you know, you could take the piece of Tupperware and float it by Jaycee's nose.
	Yeah, that's right.
	That would be the difference.
	Yes, uh-huh.
	Okay.
	All right.
	Thank you very much for the call, and you have a good night.
	East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
	Hi, Art.
	Thanks for taking my call.
	I just wanted to point a couple things out.
	I'm a physics student at the University of Central Florida, and I wanted to point out a couple things about your invisibility, which is... It's not my invisibility.
	I'm sorry?
	It's not my invisibility.
	I'm reading a story here on the scientists that are doing this.
	Well, the current invisibility that we have, which is, it can make you invisible to things like radar, Visible light, microwave, and these are all forms of energy.
	However, though, it does not get you around your physical properties, which are things like, believe it or not, each and every one of us has a small gravimetric field, which can be detected.
	It's very, very difficult to do it on something as small as a human, but it can be done.
	I mean, obviously, it's a lot easier on planets and such.
	The other thing is, anytime that a physical entity moves through any kind of body, whether it's a body of water, a body of gas, or whatever, it leaves awake.
	And an example of this is if you've ever stood on the side of the road and had a big rig go by and you get that blast of air.
	Sure.
	And, you know, of course the other thing is, just simply by being comprised of matter and We actually make a small dent in the space-time continuum, which, once again, something as small as a human is extremely difficult to detect.
	I understand, Troy, the difficulty of all this, but it seems as though what is impossible today inevitably and almost absolutely becomes possible tomorrow or the day after.
	Oh, you're absolutely right.
	In fact, I was thinking about what would I do if I could be invisible.
	My answer is I'd go into the government vaults and find out what we really know, because I have a feeling that we've probably got technology already developed that we're not going to see for 20 or 25 years.
	All right, Troy, I've got to end it right there.
	Listen, everybody, this has been a blast.
	I'm Art Bell, and I have very much enjoyed filling in for George Norrie, and I'll be back tomorrow as well as the next day for the usual weekend fair.
	It's going to be a good weekend.
	So from Manila in the Philippines, Southeast Asia, you all have a good morning, afternoon, evening, whatever it is, wherever you are.

▲