Art Bell - 20021002_Art-Bell-SIT-Rob-Riggs-Mysterious-Sightings-of-East-Texas
Aired: 2002-10-02
Duration: 01:37:18


=== Eastern Texas Forests (04:58) ===

[00:00:14]  To reach Art Bell in the Kingdom of Nye from West of the Rockies, dial 1-800-618-8255, East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
[00:00:24]  First time callers may reach Art at 1-775-727-1222 or use the wildcard line at 1-775-727-1295.
[00:00:35]  To reach out on the toll-free international line, call your AT ⁇ T operator and have them dial 800-893-0903.
[00:00:45]  This is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell on the Premier Radio Networks.
[00:00:50]  Well, all right.
[00:00:51]  Coming up in a moment, Rob Riggs.
[00:00:55]  You know, I note here, though, from people who are fast blasting me, Rochester was on here bragging about their snow mountain.
[00:01:05]  I'm being told here by people in the New York area that Buffalo is.
[00:01:11]  A trucker flashes me here, that Buffalo is trucking snow to Rochester for their snow mountain.
[00:01:20]  They certainly have snow to spare.
[00:01:23]  Right?
[00:01:24]  But they're trucking the snow all the way to Rochester for the mountain.
[00:01:28]  Is that really true?
[00:01:32]  All right.
[00:01:32]  Coming up in a moment, Rob Riggs, who is a journalist and the former publisher of a series of award-winning community newspapers down in Texas.
[00:01:43]  His interest is in ghost lights, wild man sightings, and related phenomena.
[00:01:49]  It all began when he was a child.
[00:01:51]  Of course it did.
[00:01:53]  When he heard tales about all of these things in his hometown of Sour Lake in Big Thicket Country, Riggs began writing about the subject more than 20 years ago while working as a reporter for the Kunth News.
[00:02:06]  Since then, his studies of the phenomena have been featured in the Houston Chronicle and the Beaumont Enterprise.
[00:02:12]  Riggs has also consulted on ghost lights for Waseda University in Tokyo and Harvard College Observatory.
[00:02:21]  so all of that immediately ahead okay here in the night time is mister ratings rob riggs Rob, how are you?
[00:02:50]  Good morning, Art.
[00:02:51]  Good morning, Rob.
[00:02:53]  Where are you?
[00:02:53]  I'm in Austin, Texas.
[00:02:55]  Oh, down in Austin.
[00:02:56]  Yes, sir.
[00:02:57]  All right.
[00:02:58]  We have an affiliate here that carries your show.
[00:03:01]  That's right.
[00:03:02]  That's exactly right.
[00:03:04]  And which one is that?
[00:03:06]  K-L-B-J-A-M.
[00:03:07]  Uh-huh.
[00:03:08]  K-L-B-J-L-B-J.
[00:03:11]  That means something.
[00:03:12]  L-B-J.
[00:03:13]  Lyndon Baynes, Johnson.
[00:03:14]  Darn right.
[00:03:16]  All right.
[00:03:18]  The thicket.
[00:03:21]  What do you mean by thicket?
[00:03:23]  What is thicket?
[00:03:24]  Is that just high weed country?
[00:03:27]  No, there is a region.
[00:03:31]  What a lot of people around the country don't realize is that the eastern, about the eastern quarter of Texas is heavily forested.
[00:03:39]  It is the western extent of the southern mixed forest.
[00:03:43]  Oh, there's no question about it.
[00:03:47]  Eastern Texas in general is green and pretty lush.
[00:03:52]  You know, everybody's, you know, they think of Texas as sort of semi-arid the desert.
[00:03:58]  And a lot of Texas is like that, but not the eastern part.
[00:04:01]  It's a whole different area.
[00:04:02]  Yes, it's basically like Louisiana, Mississippi, and the deep south.
[00:04:07]  Sure.
[00:04:09]  As a matter of fact, the forested areas of East Texas are roughly equivalent to the forested areas of the entire New England state.
[00:04:18]  That's a lot of forests.
[00:04:20]  Yeah, so just to give people an idea of the scale, I know when some people hear that there's a Bigfoot in Texas, they immediately think, well, how could there be a Bigfoot in Texas?
[00:04:30]  Well, because we have a lot of suitable habitat.
[00:04:35]  Obviously.
[00:04:36]  I mean, if Bigfoot is real, then he's going to require the kind of area that you're talking about to be able to evade death or capture.
[00:04:47]  Correct.
[00:04:48]  Now, the Big Thicket is what is a name that has traditionally been given to the southern end of the East Texas piney woods.

=== Mysterious Dimension Sightings (15:48) ===

[00:05:00]  This is roughly between the Trinity River, the lower Trinity River, which is just east of Houston, about to the Louisiana border.
[00:05:13]  And the region is about 67, some of the original Bigfoot research that came out in the 60s and some of the classic Bigfoot books.
[00:05:25]  And a number of the different research teams reported being in Bigfoot country, actually hearing them, and in some cases, actually hearing them walking around in their vicinity and not being able to see them.
[00:05:40]  See, to me, that would be different than being in another dimension.
[00:05:45]  if it was just invisibility or somebody writing out you could think they're going to another dimension obviously to operate are suddenly invisible but you're suggesting well they might have no you're suggesting you know you seem to be suggesting invisibility in this dimension and that And the ground shakes and the twigs break and they make footprints, but there's nothing to see.
[00:06:07]  But they may also be able to do, I mean, that may be like an intermediary, you see, between being in this.
[00:06:18]  Because what they may be dealing with is elements of perception and ambient energy fields involved with perception that we're basically ignorant of.
[00:06:30]  And this is something our neuroscientists are just beginning to understand about how parts of the brain work in terms of how we organize the perception, the perception of an external objective reality and the temporal lobe and so on.
[00:06:49]  This is what Dr. Persinger has done, some admirable work in terms of how the temporal lobes work in regard to organizing our perception of external reality.
[00:07:03]  And his theory is that something interferes with that process, and usually he postulates that it's these unusual energies.
[00:07:14]  You know, like I say, and Swan says that the first thing that will happen is there will be a sense of an unusually strong energy field in an area before the wild man shows up.
[00:07:25]  We see in a certain spectrum.
[00:07:27]  Yes, exactly.
[00:07:28]  We see in a certain spectrum, and I think it has something, may have something to do with vibrational levels.
[00:07:33]  And if something begins vibrating at a frequency that takes it to a level beyond our vision's capability, to us it would become invisible.
[00:07:43]  Right.
[00:07:44]  Exactly.
[00:07:46]  And the reverse would also be true.
[00:07:49]  Like if you were suddenly subjected to an energy field and your mind and your mind became entrained to an energy field that raised the vibrations, you might then be able to see something that you would not normally be able to see.
[00:08:06]  That's right.
[00:08:07]  Right.
[00:08:07]  That's exactly right.
[00:08:08]  All right, now there are other reports.
[00:08:11]  There are reports in the thicket of something called a ghost light.
[00:08:17]  right now that's interesting uh... when you uh... what is it goes like please Okay, there are about now all the people that I have mentioned to you before, these other researchers, particularly Paul Devereaux and David Clark from the UK, have written about what are in the English-speaking world are normally called ghost lights or mystery lights.
[00:08:45]  And these are typically spherical lights, usually about the size of a basketball, usually of an intense bluish-white luminosity that tend to occur and recur in the same areas over long periods of time.
[00:09:08]  They call it the standing ghost light phenomenon.
[00:09:12]  And they tend to be highly localized or to occur within an area of, say, a few miles.
[00:09:21]  Now, Michael Persinger and Lauren Coleman and a number of others have documented about 40 locations in North America where there are long-standing standing ghost light locations.
[00:09:43]  And there are a number of them also, Art, in the UK.
[00:09:48]  They're all around the world.
[00:09:50]  Let me lay something on you, okay?
[00:09:51]  Let's see if this makes any sense to you.
[00:09:55]  There have been some new discoveries in physics.
[00:09:59]  I listened to a physicist interviewed by Woodley Streeber on Dreamland who has measured what are called plasma balls that are very much like these balls of light you're talking about.
[00:10:13]  That wouldn't be Professor Otsuki, would it?
[00:10:15]  I believe it is, yes.
[00:10:17]  I've met Professor Osuki.
[00:10:18]  Well, at any rate, he has demonstrated scientifically that these plasma balls are able to either keep their energy static or actually increase it.
[00:10:31]  Now, if you think that, you know, and that's just impossible from a physics point of view, unless it's a thermodynamic electrodynamics theory.
[00:10:40]  It just can't be.
[00:10:41]  If it's some freak of nature that created this plasma ball, one could understand that perhaps, but it would obviously lessen quickly in intensity, you know, and burn out in the atmosphere.
[00:10:51]  But this is what they, honest to God, they're discovering, that these things maintain or increase the amount of energy they use to continue to be this ball, this plasma ball.
[00:11:01]  It's the damnedest thing.
[00:11:02]  Well, you're exactly right.
[00:11:03]  Now, Art, people have been seeing these ghost lights in the big thicket since at least the turn of the century.
[00:11:12]  In the 1960s, an old newspaper editor down there in Kuntz started writing about it, and he called on scientists in the area to come out and study the phenomenon and try to explain it.
[00:11:24]  Well, they came out and rather lamely tried to pass it off as swamp gas.
[00:11:33]  Swamp gas.
[00:11:35]  Now, to this date, Art, as far as I know, there has never been any serious study of the Big Thicket ghost light by any American team of physicists.
[00:11:48]  But in 1989, I participated in a research on Bragg Road with Professor Otsuki of Waseda University, Japan.
[00:11:58]  Oh, no kidding.
[00:11:58]  Yes.
[00:11:59]  And he concluded that there were plasma balls on Bragg Road.
[00:12:05]  He also said, interestingly enough, now there is another ghost light location in West Texas called the Marfa Lights.
[00:12:12]  Oh, yes.
[00:12:13]  It's quite famous.
[00:12:14]  Sure.
[00:12:15]  He told me that in his experience, there were more sightings of what he called ball lightning or plasma balls in Texas than anywhere in the world.
[00:12:28]  Yeah, that sounds right.
[00:12:30]  Between the ghost light in West Texas and the ghost light in...
[00:12:33]  All right, you can go to virtually any town between Houston and Beaumont, and a lot of people even in the big cities, either heard of...
[00:12:46]  Before we return to that, can you help me out with something that I really do need help with?
[00:12:51]  All my life, I've heard everything in the world dismissed as swamp gas.
[00:12:56]  Swamp gas.
[00:12:58]  Do you live near the swamps?
[00:13:00]  The big thicket is in the swamps.
[00:13:02]  He's in the swamps.
[00:13:02]  Okay, so then what is swamp gas and what is it capable of doing?
[00:13:07]  Well, do you know Patrick Wiege?
[00:13:09]  No.
[00:13:10]  Well, he wrote a book called Swamp Gas Times about his studies of UFOs.
[00:13:16]  And my response to that is, you know, if all the, I've been interviewing people and studying these phenomena for 20 years, and I don't know of anybody who's ever seen swamp gas.
[00:13:27]  What?
[00:13:29]  Are you serious?
[00:13:30]  Yeah.
[00:13:30]  I have never seen a photograph of swamp gas.
[00:13:33]  Well, I haven't either.
[00:13:36]  I haven't either.
[00:13:36]  I'm not sure it actually exists.
[00:13:38]  I think it's a government conspiracy.
[00:13:41]  Well, so there's never been a case of, like, a story in a local paper there.
[00:13:45]  Oh, my God, swamp gas situation bad last night.
[00:13:48]  No.
[00:13:49]  Local citizens observe strange swamp gas lights.
[00:13:55]  You know, you're talking about how these ghost lights cannot be explained and electrodynamic theory.
[00:14:02]  Well, you know, people trot out theories about earthquake lights and so on and so on and ball lightning, try to explain them.
[00:14:10]  But those are all discharge phenomena that are very short-lived.
[00:14:14]  Well, besides, it would behave as it should behave.
[00:14:17]  If it was lightning or something like that, you've got an initial charge.
[00:14:20]  Yes, they're discharging.
[00:14:21]  It creates this, whatever it is, and then it dissipates or even explodes, and ball lightning does that.
[00:14:27]  Right.
[00:14:28]  And the same with the swamp gas.
[00:14:30]  Those are very, from what I can tell, swamp gas is actually a very rare phenomenon.
[00:14:37]  But neither one of us have any evidence of swamp gas existing.
[00:14:44]  Well, that's right.
[00:14:45]  And yet it has been used to explain.
[00:14:48]  Yes.
[00:14:51]  Think of the oddity of that.
[00:14:52]  Something that itself has never been realized as real is used to explain other stuff that they can't figure out.
[00:14:59]  Exactly.
[00:15:00]  And by the way, Art, while we're talking, I would like to invite your listeners to go to my website, which is mysteriousdimension.com.
[00:15:10]  a minute let me see if we have uh... i would bet that on my website right now we would have your website Yes.
[00:15:19]  Oh, and we do.
[00:15:20]  Here it is, mysteriousdimension.com.
[00:15:22]  You go to my website, folks.
[00:15:24]  Go to tonight.
[00:15:24]  Click on to introduction.
[00:15:27]  And at the top, there will be a slideshow that gives you some pictures of the big picket.
[00:15:33]  And the first one is a picture of the ghost road.
[00:15:36]  Now this road is where the big thicket ghost light appears.
[00:15:41]  Wait a minute.
[00:15:42]  I'm on your website.
[00:15:43]  Yeah.
[00:15:44]  All right.
[00:15:45]  Go to introduction.
[00:15:46]  If I go to intro at the bottom of the page, I did intro at the top.
[00:15:52]  Oh, okay.
[00:15:52]  Here I am.
[00:15:53]  Do you see the road with the...
[00:15:57]  Oh, this is pretty cool.
[00:15:59]  This is what they call the ghost road.
[00:16:02]  This is where the ghost light appears in the big thicket.
[00:16:05]  This is pretty cool.
[00:16:06]  Yeah, especially the way it's presented here.
[00:16:08]  The pictures peel away from each other in three dimensions.
[00:16:12]  Oh, somebody did some really good work.
[00:16:14]  Yeah.
[00:16:15]  Yeah, the man named Ir Kennedy from San Marcus, Texas, designed this for me.
[00:16:20]  He's a real pro.
[00:16:21]  Oh, this is really cool.
[00:16:23]  Now, Art, the first picture is a picture of the ghost road where the light occurs.
[00:16:28]  And then there are some big thicket scenes.
[00:16:30]  Now, if you go down, scroll down, you'll see a picture that looks like fog.
[00:16:36]  Oh, yeah, I'm there.
[00:16:37]  You see that?
[00:16:38]  Yep.
[00:16:38]  That is a photograph of one phase of manifestation of the big thicket ghost light.
[00:16:44]  Wow.
[00:16:45]  It actually has different phases that it can appear.
[00:16:52]  Who caught these photographs as it manifested like this?
[00:16:55]  Wow.
[00:16:56]  My friend Bill Fleming and I, who is my associate researcher, done a lot of research down there with me, and I took this photograph.
[00:17:03]  Now, listen to this.
[00:17:04]  This is really interesting.
[00:17:07]  We went to the ghost road and drove about halfway down the link.
[00:17:13]  And in the distance, we thought we saw a light cross the road and go off into the woods.
[00:17:20]  So we drove up to about where we thought that was and we set up.
[00:17:24]  And we had talked to a man from Joplin, Missouri, who had done some photographic studies.
[00:17:31]  Hold your story.
[00:17:32]  No, hold your story right there.
[00:17:33]  It'll be a cliffhanger during the break.
[00:17:36]  That's how we get people to stick around.
[00:17:41]  His pictures are awesome.
[00:17:42]  You've got to see what he's got.
[00:17:44]  Go to my website.
[00:17:45]  Go to tonight's guest info and click on his website.
[00:17:48]  This is absolutely excellent stuff.
[00:17:50]  Really good photographs.
[00:17:53]  My, my, my.
[00:17:54]  It's the mysteriousdimension.com website, and the link is right there on my website.
[00:17:59]  So go take a look.
[00:18:00]  It's well worth the look.
[00:18:03]  I'm Art Bell.
[00:18:04]  To reach Art Bell in the Kingdom of Nye,
[00:18:31]  from west of the Rockies, dial 1-800-618-8255.
[00:18:35]  East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
[00:18:40]  First time callers may rechart at 1-775-727-1222 or use the wildcard line at 1-775-727-1295.
[00:18:51]  To rechart on the toll-free international line, call your AT ⁇ T operator and have them dial 800-893-0903.
[00:19:00]  This is Coast to Ghost AM with Art Bell on the Premier Radio Networks.
[00:19:06]  From the high desert, that's who we are.
[00:19:08]  We'll be right back.
[00:19:27]  All right.
[00:19:28]  Once again, Rob Riggs, we were talking about plasma balls and the lights and looking at your website.
[00:19:36]  You know what?
[00:19:36]  I'm afraid I'm sorry about this, but I'm being told by people on FastBlast that your website is blown up.
[00:19:46]  It's blown up?
[00:19:47]  Yeah, it's blown up.
[00:19:49]  Too many people hitting it?
[00:19:51]  Yeah.
[00:19:53]  It's too bad.
[00:19:55]  I would still urge people to try this.
[00:19:57]  It's pretty awesome.
[00:19:57]  I mean, the photograph of the forming light in the formation stage is really neat.
[00:20:05]  That is some photograph.
[00:20:06]  That's what we call the luminous mist or luminous fog stage.
[00:20:11]  And the way people who see that describe it in the distance, it's like a small fog bank with a bright spot in it.
[00:20:18]  And you can see at the top of the photograph where it's brighter.
[00:20:21]  You absolutely can, yes.
[00:20:23]  Now, listen to this, Art.
[00:20:25]  When we took that photograph, we did not see that light.

=== Ghost Lights Manifestation (15:15) ===

[00:20:30]  What?
[00:20:30]  Really?
[00:20:31]  Right.
[00:20:32]  We were told by a gentleman who was researching the ghost light in Joppa, Missouri, which I think they call the Ozark spook light.
[00:20:46]  If you would go to a place where the ghost lights manifest, you could take photographs and that sometimes the energy that manifests the lights would be there just outside the visible light range.
[00:21:01]  Is the photograph to the right of it of the same area?
[00:21:04]  Yes, that is the test photograph.
[00:21:06]  The photograph to the right was taken with a flash.
[00:21:09]  The photograph to the left that showed the fog was taken without a flash.
[00:21:14]  That's awesome.
[00:21:15]  These are clear, folks, so you know what you're going after if you can get on the website.
[00:21:19]  These are clear, probably were 35 millimeter.
[00:21:23]  Right, 35 millimeter with the 1,000 speed.
[00:21:26]  Yeah, very clear, very clear.
[00:21:28]  So quite convincing.
[00:21:30]  Ooh, this is cool.
[00:21:32]  Now, Art, that phase can also be visible, though.
[00:21:37]  We got it right outside the visible light range, but it can also be visible.
[00:21:42]  Now, I have also had people testify that they had seen the fog collapse into the bright spot and form the sphere.
[00:21:51]  And that's when it becomes visible to the surface.
[00:21:54]  That's when it becomes the basketball-sized sphere.
[00:21:57]  Now, I have talked to people who have seen that thing for five minutes, who have had the light chase them up and down the road at speeds of 50, 60 miles an hour.
[00:22:11]  Really?
[00:22:12]  Yes.
[00:22:12]  And there's no light known to any thermodynamics or electrodynamics that would act like that.
[00:22:20]  You used the word chase.
[00:22:22]  Yes.
[00:22:24]  Chase.
[00:22:25]  Now, do you really mean that in the literal sense of the word?
[00:22:30]  Because that implies intelligent action, yes.
[00:22:34]  Yes.
[00:22:35]  I interviewed a man in Beaumont.
[00:22:38]  I was teaching school there, and word got out that this is when I first started researching the book.
[00:22:43]  This man came to me, his name was Jim.
[00:22:46]  And he said, Mr. Riggs, he says, I'm going to tell you about what happened to me on Bragg Road.
[00:22:54]  And it's been 30 years since I saw this thing, and I have never told anyone before, and I have never been back to that place.
[00:23:02]  He saw the light.
[00:23:03]  He went out there when he was a teenager, a bunch of kids.
[00:23:06]  The light comes up, approaches them from the front of their vehicle, gets right over their car to their car, and stalls the engine.
[00:23:16]  Oh, that would indicate electromagnetic.
[00:23:18]  Right, it has electromagnetic parameter.
[00:23:21]  But they said these kids were terrified because they said the thing was like it was alive.
[00:23:28]  Now, I have since interviewed a number of witnesses who have had similar experiences with the thing knocking out their electrical systems on their cars.
[00:23:37]  And this is typical of ghost lights around the country.
[00:23:40]  Well, maybe it was alive.
[00:23:42]  Yeah.
[00:23:43]  Now, here's the thing, though.
[00:23:46]  In many ghost light locations, people make that observation that the lights seem to be alive to play with them, to be inquisitive, to be conscious of their presence.
[00:23:58]  Now, so those are now I do not have a photograph of the basketball size phase of the manifestation.
[00:24:07]  I do have a photograph of another phase which is called the firefly phase.
[00:24:14]  Okay.
[00:24:14]  The firefly phase, generally, it is a smaller light, not as big as the basketball size.
[00:24:20]  It looks like a large firefly, and they appear in the treetops.
[00:24:25]  They're also called pinpoint lights.
[00:24:28]  And typically, it would just be one light.
[00:24:33]  And we were out there one night, and the light appeared above our heads.
[00:24:37]  This wouldn't be where George Bush stole that phrase, would it?
[00:24:40]  What phrase?
[00:24:41]  A thousand points light.
[00:24:42]  I don't know.
[00:24:44]  But the point is the light can manifest in different ways, or at least, or you could say this, then there may be phases of the same manifestation of the same phenomenon, or they could be different phenomena.
[00:24:58]  They could be different things, all of which are luminous.
[00:25:03]  Now, here's an interesting thing about Bragg Road.
[00:25:06]  Bragg Road is almost perfectly straight.
[00:25:10]  It's about eight miles long, and it's almost exactly oriented to north and south.
[00:25:17]  It almost has total thicket cover, too.
[00:25:20]  Yes, it is.
[00:25:21]  You know, if there were no lights, no creatures, nothing, at night it would be one freaky, scary road to go down.
[00:25:28]  The Big Thicket is a scary place, Art.
[00:25:31]  Yeah, it is.
[00:25:32]  And it has been known as such for ever since it's been settled by, you know, as a matter of fact, there is archaeological evidence that the Indians never settled the heart of the Big Thicket where the lights appear.
[00:25:49]  That they avoided it.
[00:25:51]  Really?
[00:25:51]  Yes, and the tradition is that they said that that part of the woods was haunted by demons and they wouldn't go there.
[00:25:58]  There is no evidence of any permanent Indian culture having existed in that part of Hardin County.
[00:26:06]  They used the word demons?
[00:26:09]  That's, yes.
[00:26:12]  Well, no, I mean, they had their own word for that.
[00:26:15]  But it amounted to demons.
[00:26:17]  Yes.
[00:26:19]  And traditionally, there are places around the country where this is the case, where the howling, hairy creatures appear, where the weird lights appear.
[00:26:31]  And so the point is that there's a correlation between the appearance of these lights, Art, and the appearance of the wild men.
[00:26:40]  I really was not fully conscious of that association until I started writing stories about the ghost lights.
[00:26:49]  Have you ever heard or seen one of these creatures?
[00:26:55]  I have heard it, yes.
[00:26:57]  And I have interviewed about 15 or 20 people who have actually seen it and or heard it.
[00:27:06]  In 1988.
[00:27:08]  Excuse me, but you've personally heard it.
[00:27:10]  Yes.
[00:27:11]  All right.
[00:27:12]  One moment, please.
[00:27:14]  it in any way sound like this.
[00:27:26]  Now that's one recording that I have.
[00:27:30]  And if I were to categorize that, I'd say we're listening to a wild man.
[00:27:36]  It sounds like a wild man.
[00:27:38]  Laura, let me tell you what happened to me.
[00:27:40]  I had deduced, after having studied it for some time, that there was an area where I could go and I might have a chance of intercepting sort of a travel route that they might use.
[00:27:56]  I went out in the deep woods and it was a pipeline right away that cut through the woods.
[00:28:03]  I got on a deer blind and sat on this deer blind and actually spent the night on the deer blind.
[00:28:11]  I woke up and about an hour before sunrise, that thing couldn't have been more than about 20 yards from me.
[00:28:22]  It was so loud, Art, that you could the air was it's like the air was vibrating and you could feel the vibrations in your chest.
[00:28:31]  All right, here is the other sound.
[00:28:35]  Now this is said to be a Bigfoot sound.
[00:28:39]  So since you've heard something, you listen carefully to the following because this has been verified to be an actual Bigfoot sound.
[00:28:47]  let's see how this one goes with you that obviously recorded at some distance Does that sound anything like that?
[00:29:08]  Well, you know, there are actually now the I work with some guys that call the Texas Bigfoot Research Center.
[00:29:18]  And they have some photographs of what they call these vocalizations.
[00:29:23]  And they and there are actually a number of different calls that the creatures make.
[00:29:29]  One of them, that loud one, the first one you played, that's what I heard.
[00:29:34]  That was a howling, just an indescribable howling sound.
[00:29:39]  They also have another call that's almost more bird-like, very loud and very higher-pitched and is shorter.
[00:29:50]  And like they'll make a series of those sounds.
[00:29:54]  I got an email from a lady who grew up in the swamps around Lafayette, Louisiana.
[00:30:02]  And she said, and Louisiana, they call them the loop garoo or werewolf.
[00:30:10]  And she said it was common knowledge way back in the swamps.
[00:30:15]  And the old people actually left food out for these things.
[00:30:18]  And she said that they heard them frequently.
[00:30:22]  And that there was no animal known to any of the people in the swamps that could make that sound.
[00:30:28]  It was totally couldn't be duplicated by anything else.
[00:30:34]  I will say this, after that experience, I have not gone back into the woods alone again.
[00:30:40]  I wouldn't either.
[00:30:41]  Yeah.
[00:30:42]  So you're not crazy.
[00:30:44]  I'm brave, but I'm not crazy.
[00:30:48]  So you would not seek out after what you experienced.
[00:30:53]  You wouldn't seek out an encounter.
[00:30:55]  I mean, even with others, or would you?
[00:30:57]  Well, yes.
[00:30:59]  You would.
[00:31:00]  I would, and I'll tell you why.
[00:31:01]  So you're a little crazy.
[00:31:03]  Yes.
[00:31:03]  But my feeling was, at that time, when that was happening, that I was totally at the mercy of that thing.
[00:31:11]  Yeah.
[00:31:12]  And that if it had wanted me, it could have had me right there.
[00:31:16]  Well, now that is an interesting point you bring up.
[00:31:21]  I think I've talked to most of the biggest Bigfoot researchers in the world.
[00:31:28]  And inevitably they say that really, even they say the same thing you did.
[00:31:35]  If it had wanted me or wants somebody, believe me, it's got them.
[00:31:40]  But it really doesn't.
[00:31:41]  That these are really friendly creatures.
[00:31:47]  These are creatures that mean us no harm.
[00:31:52]  Yes, and you know, and I think there's a possibility that they may need that the I think the places where these people where these creatures can exist are dwindling.
[00:32:08]  And I think that I think there may be some what in their interest for us to know more about them and hopefully to protect some of the areas where they exist.
[00:32:18]  Because I think that they need the energetic conditions that produce those ghost lights to exist.
[00:32:26]  To exist in order for them to be able to manifest in this space-time.
[00:32:30]  The problem that you've got, and anybody else who believes what you believe, would be that before you can get that protection, and you could get it, if we proved beyond all doubt the existence somehow of these creatures by getting a body, getting irrefutable evidence of some kind, then you could get the kind of protection you want.
[00:32:52]  Till then, you just try and go in and get anything protected with a story like this, and you'll hear the buzzsaws coming.
[00:33:01]  Well, luckily, about 100,000 acres of the big thicket has been protected.
[00:33:06]  Yeah, but not for that reason, I mean.
[00:33:08]  No, not for that reason.
[00:33:10]  But luckily, there are some, you know, there are some places.
[00:33:14]  And they do inhabit the preserve.
[00:33:18]  As a matter of fact, I talked to a park ranger at one of the units of the preserve, and there have been reports, particularly among the Native Americans who live right on the edge of the northern part of the Big Thicket Preserve, of the wild man sightings.
[00:33:39]  I got an email also today from a gentleman who has a hunting camp in that same area.
[00:33:44]  He says that he's had a number of encounters with them.
[00:33:48]  Okay, now I'm also, I've got a lot of sources, you know, because of what I do here.
[00:33:53]  I'm lucky I have all these sources.
[00:33:55]  Right.
[00:33:56]  And I'm hearing all these stories about sudden Bigfoot appearances, sudden Bigfoot interaction with human beings.
[00:34:05]  I mean, all kinds of interaction between these creatures and human beings.
[00:34:10]  That it's really, really, really seriously on the increase.
[00:34:13]  It does seem that way.
[00:34:14]  And you figure it's because we're encroaching?
[00:34:18]  I think it's, yes, I think it's that.
[00:34:22]  And, you know, maybe it's time.
[00:34:25]  You know, I've always thought that we're not talking about discovering an animal here.
[00:34:32]  We're talking about making contact.
[00:34:36]  Well, yes.
[00:34:36]  This is like not only a different culture, a completely different worldview, but that we as human beings have latent within us the very power.
[00:34:53]  That may well be, but by thousands of years, we have lost touch with how to do it.
[00:34:58]  We have lost touch with it.
[00:35:01]  Maybe even millions of years.
[00:35:04]  I don't know.
[00:35:05]  Do you have any sense Of how old these beings might be.
[00:35:12]  No, but I do know that the Native Americans, many, many of them refer to them as the ancient ones, that they go back to very ancient times.
[00:35:26]  You know, let me digress a little bit in talking about, you know, I said that the Bragg Road was a straight line.

=== Thought Runways Exist? (00:58) ===

[00:35:33]  Are you familiar with the straight line?
[00:35:39]  You know, the ancient, many ancient cultures built these straight tracks.
[00:35:45]  Oh, sure.
[00:35:46]  Yeah.
[00:35:47]  The Celtic culture and the American Indians and so on.
[00:35:50]  Well, a lot of people thought it was so straight that people thought they were runways.
[00:35:54]  Right.
[00:35:55]  Yeah, absolutely.
[00:35:56]  And, you know, if you've ever read, you know, like John Michelle and John Keel, a number of people have written about this.
[00:36:03]  Ted Holliday wrote a very famous book called The Dragon and the Disc.
[00:36:11]  Apparently, one of the functions of these lines was to connect powerpoints and to facilitate the flow of energy on these lines that they called the serpent power and so on.

=== Riemann Surfaces Conduit (15:19) ===

[00:36:24]  There's an interesting thought.
[00:36:26]  Well, I think.
[00:36:27]  A kind of a geographic conduit.
[00:36:30]  I think you're going to have to hold right at that point.
[00:36:34]  Where's the bottom of the hour?
[00:36:37]  It's really a good point to break, actually, and this is good bumper music to do it.
[00:36:41]  It's in the woods.
[00:36:42]  It's in the thicket.
[00:36:44]  But if you put me down for another.
[00:36:47]  And it's looking at you.
[00:36:49]  Maybe even many of them.
[00:36:51]  Thousands.
[00:36:57]  Have a mother eyes.
[00:36:59]  Can't help but see if you are true to...
[00:37:22]  Wanna take a ride?
[00:37:24]  Call Art Bell from West of the Rockies at 1-800-618-8255.
[00:37:30]  East of the Rockies at 1-800-825-5033.
[00:37:34]  First time callers may reach Art at area code 775-727-1222.
[00:37:40]  Or call the wildcard line at 775-727-1295.
[00:37:45]  To talk with Art on the Toll-Free International Line.
[00:37:48]  Call your ATT operator and have them dial 800-893-0903.
[00:37:55]  Wild Thing Think You Move Me.
[00:37:58]  Sorry, I couldn't resist.
[00:38:02]  I wonder if there's any stories about these things getting interested in our women.
[00:38:09]  You move me.
[00:38:14]  We'll be right back.
[00:38:35]  The Thicket with Rob Riggs, who's written a book, by the way, and you're certainly going to want to see his website.
[00:38:41]  We've got a link up.
[00:38:42]  And I understand the traffic has lessened a little now, and you've got a chance of getting in, so you might give it another try.
[00:38:48]  Just go to tonight's guest info, and you will see his website listed.
[00:38:54]  I hope I don't kadash it again.
[00:38:56]  I don't mean to do that.
[00:38:58]  It's just that when something this fascinating comes along, what are you going to do?
[00:39:03]  You've got to show everybody.
[00:39:04]  I mean, the website is absolutely awesome.
[00:39:07]  So go to artbell.com, go to program, tonight's guest info.
[00:39:12]  And you're going to want to go down and click on the second, actually the book, his book is the first link, which will take you to the book, In the Big Thicket on the Trail of the Wild Man.
[00:39:24]  And then below it, the website, click on the website, and let's see if I can get in.
[00:39:30]  Yes.
[00:39:31]  And then when you do get in, don't click on the intro at the top.
[00:39:34]  Go to the bottom of the page, click there on intro, and oh my, you are on your way.
[00:39:41]  And you will see exactly what he's talking about.
[00:39:43]  We were talking about straight lines.
[00:39:46]  That's the first thing you're going to see is this incredibly straight, eerie, strange, very strange road.
[00:39:56]  And then you're going to be taken on a little trip from there.
[00:40:00]  Then, of course, you can scroll down the page and see the formation of this fog that then becomes one of these lights or plasma balls or whatever the hell they are.
[00:40:12]  All right.
[00:40:13]  We're back on the air again.
[00:40:14]  Okay.
[00:40:15]  So lines, straight lines.
[00:40:18]  Well, Art, I want to say this first.
[00:40:22]  People have seen the wild man step out of that fog.
[00:40:27]  They have.
[00:40:28]  Yes.
[00:40:31]  And this is consistent with observations of the in England.
[00:40:38]  There are many places in England, or not many, but some of the traditional ghost light sightings areas will have what they call the luminous fog, and people will see anthropomorphic forms, human-like forms, shadows within those lights.
[00:40:53]  Oh, brother.
[00:40:54]  Yeah, this is seriously weird stuff.
[00:40:57]  Well, listen, let me tell you a little story.
[00:41:00]  Are you a listener to the show?
[00:41:03]  I am when I'm up that late Art.
[00:41:06]  There's a fella over the hill from me in Las Vegas who's a friend of mine.
[00:41:11]  Yeah.
[00:41:12]  And he is a billionaire.
[00:41:15]  He's big-time rich.
[00:41:18]  His name is Bob Bigelow, and he runs NIDS, which is really a very serious scientific investigatory group that's funded with his money.
[00:41:30]  And they do some incredible, incredible work.
[00:41:35]  He has this farm where they set up some infrared observation through night vision.
[00:41:48]  And a couple or several of his top scientists observed a light forming, a kind of a fog, same thing you're talking about.
[00:42:02]  And they saw a creature come out of it.
[00:42:07]  Literally come out of it.
[00:42:09]  And my God, it sounds like what you're talking about.
[00:42:12]  Yes.
[00:42:13]  Now, these straight lines, we were talking about how in ancient cultures they would actually build these lines to connect these PowerPoints, and they would conduct the serpent power energy and their dragon power.
[00:42:26]  They had different names for it.
[00:42:29]  And many of these cultures, their whole technology and their whole culture was centered around a technology that utilized this energy.
[00:42:38]  I think what happened in the case of the Bragg Road is that inadvertently a straight line connected some major PowerPoints in East Texas.
[00:42:52]  Now, there are some really strange effects other than the light itself that occur there.
[00:43:01]  One of these is sometimes you can go there and the energy can be such that there is this feeling, like say like you're sitting in your car, and I've had this happen to me, and all of a sudden you feel like you're moving backwards.
[00:43:18]  Yeah, sure.
[00:43:19]  I felt that.
[00:43:20]  Sure.
[00:43:20]  You felt that?
[00:43:21]  Sure.
[00:43:23]  I had a witness tell me that, you know, the typical kid, a lot of kids go out there to look for these lights.
[00:43:30]  It's almost a tradition.
[00:43:31]  It is a tradition in Southeast Texas.
[00:43:34]  And they had that experience, and the wild man showed up right after that.
[00:43:38]  A lady emailed me today, and she was a displaced Southeast Texan living up there in the Northwest.
[00:43:45]  And she said she went out with a group.
[00:43:48]  They saw the light in the distance, and it kept approaching them, and they got the sense that it was moving at an incredible speed toward them.
[00:44:00]  And she said that suddenly we felt like we were moving 100 miles an hour backwards.
[00:44:08]  And the light actually came up to them and went through their car.
[00:44:17]  I wouldn't go out there.
[00:44:19]  I wouldn't do that.
[00:44:22]  And I've had witnesses tell me that the light would go through their car, and I've had witnesses tell me that there was a shadow of a human silhouette within the light as it approached them.
[00:44:38]  Shadow light.
[00:44:39]  Yeah.
[00:44:40]  Now you go over to Louisiana and they will tell you that there are wizards that can transform themselves into a ball of light.
[00:44:50]  They call it the Fifolet.
[00:44:52]  You go over to Mississippi and the Choctaw Indians will tell you the same thing.
[00:44:58]  That there are wizards who move around in balls of light and can, you know, this is the old shapeshifter.
[00:45:05]  It's interesting to take the mythology and put it together with the real world reports.
[00:45:11]  And there's probably something there.
[00:45:14]  Now, I'll tell you something else interesting.
[00:45:18]  There's another place where the wild man is not only seen on the back road in the big thicket.
[00:45:24]  It's actually seen in a large area.
[00:45:27]  There's an old bridge in the preserve, the National Preserve.
[00:45:32]  And I interviewed some kids from Saratoga, Texas, a little small town surrounded by the preserve, who told me that they had seen what they called an ape-looking critter a number of times near this bridge.
[00:45:50]  I went there to take some photographs as an illustration for a possible hardcover edition of my book just to illustrate the story in the book.
[00:46:02]  I went there, it was about dusk, Art, and I took five or six shots of the bridge from different angles.
[00:46:10]  When I developed the film, there were, in two frames, there was a light of a very distinct shape from two different distances, from two different perspectives, as if the thing had moved.
[00:46:27]  Do you have those on your website?
[00:46:29]  I don't have them on my website.
[00:46:32]  They have never been published, but I will put them on there.
[00:46:38]  Would you?
[00:46:38]  Yes.
[00:46:39]  All right.
[00:46:41]  And they have never been published before.
[00:46:43]  And you caught that.
[00:46:45]  See, that is interesting.
[00:46:46]  You caught the same light from two different perspectives.
[00:46:48]  Two different perspectives.
[00:46:50]  One close up, one far away.
[00:46:52]  And you can see it's the same thing, the same shape, and you can see that it has moved.
[00:46:58]  Now, another interesting thing, uh have you heard about these orbs?
[00:47:03]  Oh, uh I've heard so much about these orbs that we've had to take an entire portion of our website and devote it to nothing but orb photographs.
[00:47:13]  Yes.
[00:47:14]  The orbs show up on Bragg Road and they show up in areas where there are bigfoot sightings.
[00:47:24]  What is your best guess about what these orbs are?
[00:47:29]  Well, you know, we were talking earlier about the different dimensions.
[00:47:35]  Yes, sir.
[00:47:40]  I favor the theory of what are called Riemann surfaces.
[00:47:45]  That, you know, ordinarily when you're talking about a dimension, you're talking about, you know, we have this is three dimensions.
[00:47:53]  This world is three dimensions.
[00:47:54]  Right.
[00:47:55]  And then you have a fourth dimension would be, you know, another perpendicular.
[00:48:01]  Well, the idea of the Riemann surfaces is that you have three-dimensional universes that are parallel, as it were, but that have what they call multiple connectivity.
[00:48:17]  And that is that these parallel three-dimensional universes can actually have places where they connect.
[00:48:27]  Portals.
[00:48:29]  Points of power.
[00:48:30]  And connection is.
[00:48:31]  That's the exact thing that we've been talking about that Ms. Bigelow documented in the ranch at the ranch on West.
[00:48:41]  I think it's possible, Art, that the ghost light, the standing ghost light locations may be the places where these dimensions intersect.
[00:48:57]  And that these creatures are able to move back and forth from one three-dimensional Riemann surface to another when the energy that manifests these lights is activated.
[00:49:15]  And of course, you know, the Southeast Texas, the energies that manifest these ghost lights sometimes reach incredible intensities.
[00:49:27]  Well, earlier we attributed some intelligence or consciousness to these energies, right?
[00:49:33]  Right.
[00:49:33]  Well, yeah, at least to the lights and to the creatures, yes.
[00:49:38]  So do you think we're talking about the energy itself actually being an intelligence, or do you think that there is some separate intelligence organizing this occurrence or creating this portal that we're talking about?
[00:49:55]  Well, that's interesting.
[00:49:59]  Jacques Bergier wrote a book.
[00:50:02]  Now, he was the co-author of Morning of the Magicians, which is a classic paranormal investigative book, came out in the 70s.
[00:50:10]  He wrote a book called Secret Doors of the Earth, in which he discussed these Riemann surfaces and so on.
[00:50:18]  And his idea was that the doors, doorways, could be made from one, and I hesitate to use the word dimension because they're both three-dimensional.
[00:50:32]  You follow me?
[00:50:33]  To us, though, perceptually, dimension probably is an alright word.
[00:50:38]  Okay.
[00:50:39]  That he felt that there was a psychic component involved in bridging from one dimension to another.
[00:50:52]  Gotcha.
[00:50:54]  And so what might be happening in the case of these creatures is that they are able to supply that psychic component because their worldview see they haven't atrophied.
[00:51:08]  Those powers have not atrophied.
[00:51:09]  Those psychic powers have not atrophied in them.
[00:51:12]  In fact, they're probably fully developed.
[00:51:15]  That they're able to supply that psychic component and literally create doors or passageways between these Riemann surfaces.

=== Night Vision Research (05:42) ===

[00:51:24]  Have you experimented at all with night vision?
[00:51:29]  No, but you know Linda Moulton Howe, of course.
[00:51:34]  Of course.
[00:51:35]  Well, she and I have become friends, and we are going to be doing some research, field research, this spring using some rather advanced technology that recently developed in some of these locations.
[00:51:59]  We'd be happy to report back to you, you know, if we come up with something within the city.
[00:52:02]  Well, that's interesting.
[00:52:03]  In other words, when I said that, you said that.
[00:52:05]  So that suggests to me that something, either that technology or technology related to it is what you're going to use in your investigation.
[00:52:14]  Is that fair?
[00:52:15]  Sir.
[00:52:16]  Is that fair?
[00:52:17]  Yes.
[00:52:19]  Well, I've got a feeling it's going to succeed because I think that long before whatever it is that we're talking about here is manifested to the human eye, and I mean long before and long after, there will be things visible in the infrared that are not visible to our naked eye.
[00:52:37]  Yeah, we picked it up with a regular 35 millimeter camera.
[00:52:40]  Right, but that was at a pretty high point of the manifestation.
[00:52:44]  Correct.
[00:52:44]  So, in other words, you might catch it earlier.
[00:52:46]  Right.
[00:52:49]  Yeah, we're really excited about it.
[00:52:51]  I had no idea you were involved with Linda.
[00:52:54]  Yes.
[00:52:55]  She's a very serious researcher.
[00:52:57]  She was just in the Far East.
[00:53:00]  Has she told you the story of her trip?
[00:53:04]  Well, I know that she went over to Wort Laos to study the wild man.
[00:53:08]  That's correct.
[00:53:09]  Yes.
[00:53:09]  I told her, I said, we've got him right here.
[00:53:13]  We got him in Texas.
[00:53:17]  I think it would be a very profitable area of investigation for her.
[00:53:22]  Now think about this, Art.
[00:53:27]  If these ghost light locations are these points of multiple connectivity, they could also be holes, so to speak.
[00:53:42]  from one place in this world to another place.
[00:53:46]  Well, that's what they would be.
[00:53:47]  They would be, in essence, some sort of wormhole.
[00:53:51]  Right.
[00:53:52]  Sure.
[00:53:53]  And it might be that it might even be, this might be stretching it, or maybe it isn't stretching it.
[00:54:00]  If creatures can come from one side to this side, then why not have the opposite be true?
[00:54:09]  Right.
[00:54:11]  Why not?
[00:54:13]  Here's a pretty interesting question.
[00:54:16]  Yeah, why not?
[00:54:17]  If you were in the area of the formation, that kind of formation you've got a photograph of, and you had the opportunity to jump through it?
[00:54:27]  Yes, sir.
[00:54:30]  Would you do it?
[00:54:31]  I asked first.
[00:54:35]  Well, that's a good question.
[00:54:39]  Yes, it is.
[00:54:40]  Yes.
[00:54:41]  I guess I'd have to.
[00:54:43]  I'd just have to let that situation arise.
[00:54:47]  Is it something that you've discussed with Linda?
[00:54:51]  No.
[00:54:52]  And you know, here's the thing.
[00:54:55]  From my experience on Bragg Road, you know, there's a tradition down there where people will take their families out there, and it's like a picnic, you know.
[00:55:06]  Oh, let's go look for the light.
[00:55:08]  Right.
[00:55:08]  Well, when my kids were little, they used to want me to take them out there, and I said, there's no way I'm going to take you out there.
[00:55:14]  There's things that happen out there that we do not understand.
[00:55:18]  Well, I've had a number of guests on my show, Rob, that have been involved in some pretty strange things with electromagnetics and the rest of it.
[00:55:28]  And some of them, Rob, have disappeared.
[00:55:30]  And I mean disappeared.
[00:55:32]  They're not around anymore now.
[00:55:35]  They're just flat gone.
[00:55:37]  I mean, yeah, you've got to imagine that's at least part of the risk of doing something like that, the probability that you might get there and you might not get back.
[00:55:45]  Yeah, I think you're right.
[00:55:46]  I think that is a possibility.
[00:55:49]  And, you know, people ask me, well, why do you want to know about these things?
[00:55:54]  Why do you want to study this?
[00:55:57]  And how do you answer that?
[00:55:58]  Well, Art, I think that the world is out of balance.
[00:56:07]  And if you'll go back and study the traditional cultures that understood these energies and these connections with other worlds and so on,
[00:56:20]  you'll find that they had this concept of balance, of the need of maintaining balance, and of the human beings as conscious entities participating in making that balance happen.
[00:56:39]  And if you'll talk to the Hopi Indians.
[00:56:42]  I have.
[00:56:43]  Yes.
[00:56:44]  They understand this concept.

=== Night Creatures and Structures (02:54) ===

[00:56:46]  And what they say is the world that we have live in now, the modern Western scientific materialistic culture, is out of balance.
[00:56:56]  And the reason it's out of balance is we cut ourselves off from our intuitive side.
[00:57:02]  And what's happened as a result of that is that we have lost contact with the spirit world.
[00:57:09]  That's exactly what they told me.
[00:57:11]  Hold on.
[00:57:12]  We're at the top of the hour.
[00:57:13]  That's exactly what they told me.
[00:57:15]  For hours, I interviewed Hopi elders on this program.
[00:57:20]  That's what it came down to, if you heard it.
[00:57:26]  I am a night creature.
[00:57:31]  but I do live in a structure.
[00:57:56]  Call Art Bell in the kingdom of Nye from west of the Rockies at 1-800-618-8255.
[00:58:02]  East of the Rockies, 1-800-825-5033.
[00:58:07]  First-time callers may reach Art at 1-775-727-1222.
[00:58:13]  And the wildcard line is open at 1-775-727-1295.
[00:58:18]  To reach Art on the Toll-Free International line, call your AT ⁇ T operator and have them dial 800-893-0903.
[00:58:27]  This is Coast to Coast A.M. with Art Bell from the Kingdom of Nye.
[00:58:32]  My guest is Rob Riggs, and we're talking about all kinds of really kidding things.
[00:58:37]  Bigfoot, Wild Man, Plasma Balls, Balls of Light, And perhaps something that coexists with us, or perhaps something that coexists in an adjacent dimension with us.
[00:58:53]  Anyway, absolutely fascinating stuff, and we'll get right back to it.
[00:59:15]  Back now to our guest, Rob Riggs.
[00:59:18]  Rob, welcome back.
[00:59:19]  Thank you, sir.
[00:59:20]  I've got a lot of people that would like to chat with you.
[00:59:23]  All right.
[00:59:24]  And I suppose they have questions or comments for you.

=== 1200 Miles Apart (06:58) ===

[00:59:27]  But you've opened up about 10,000 miles of intriguing territory to talk about here.
[00:59:33]  So, obviously, they've got questions.
[00:59:34]  First time caller line, you're on the air with Rob Riggs.
[00:59:37]  Hi.
[00:59:38]  Hello.
[00:59:38]  Good evening.
[00:59:39]  Good evening, sir.
[00:59:40]  Where are you?
[00:59:41]  I am calling from Austin, Texas.
[00:59:43]  I'm at 1,200 out of San Antonio.
[00:59:46]  Now, here's an interesting situation.
[00:59:48]  You're both in the Austin area, which means that this signal is going about several hundred thousand miles for the two of you to be talking to each other right next to each other.
[01:00:03]  Right here.
[01:00:03]  Yeah, so you go right ahead.
[01:00:05]  well actually i'm in san marcus which is right down the road but i was just actually i'm in buta which is almost in san marcus uh...
[01:00:11]  Well, there you go.
[01:00:12]  There you go.
[01:00:13]  I am actually from the Beaumont area.
[01:00:15]  I grew up there and graduated high school there in the early 90s.
[01:00:19]  And I've spent, or I've actually taken several trips up to, we called it the Saratoga Light, Bragg Road, many different things.
[01:00:27]  But I've been up there many times with different people.
[01:00:30]  You know, it was kind of a teenage thing.
[01:00:32]  Like you said earlier, it was kind of a thing to do.
[01:00:34]  And I've seen it, and it's really a different experience.
[01:00:39]  I don't really, the best way to describe it would be, I guess, kind of spooky.
[01:00:44]  But definitely fog and the light coming at you and moving, seems like you're moving away from it.
[01:00:51]  And then all of a sudden, I've never actually had it go through the vehicle I was in, but it would reappear behind us once we got a certain point down the road.
[01:01:00]  So you've seen all of this yourself?
[01:01:02]  I have seen this myself.
[01:01:03]  Yes, I have.
[01:01:04]  More than once.
[01:01:06]  I think twice.
[01:01:07]  The one time I went out there, we did not see anything, but you never know.
[01:01:11]  I guess it was just one of those things.
[01:01:13]  But I've seen it twice out in Saratoga on the Bragg Road.
[01:01:18]  It's kind of a, like you were saying earlier, it's kind of a thing that you do when you're in high school and you're young and you want to go out and drink and party and have a good time.
[01:01:26]  It's like a rite of passage in Southeast Texas, already.
[01:01:29]  Exactly, exactly.
[01:01:30]  I mean, there's a lot of rites of passage, I guess, in Southeast Texas as far as the big thicket goes.
[01:01:35]  I went on a lot of camping trips out there and saw a lot of weird things then, too.
[01:01:40]  Well, I have a lot of people who have a lot of people.
[01:01:41]  Camp Erland is a Boy Scout camp up in there, and they had a lot of strange lights around Camp Erland when I was a kid going to scout camp up there.
[01:01:51]  I know this.
[01:01:52]  I know that a lot of horror movies begin on a road like that late at night, and usually there's some loving going on, and then all that's left after it is just pieces and gore.
[01:02:06]  Well, that might be true.
[01:02:08]  And I don't mean Al Gore.
[01:02:10]  Well, it was definitely a unique experience, you know, being out there with a group of people like that.
[01:02:16]  It was kind of hard for everybody not to say, wow, you know, get a load of that.
[01:02:21]  That's different.
[01:02:22]  I don't know where that came from.
[01:02:24]  And seeing a light, this was at night, seeing a light way down the road, just in the middle of the road and just coming at you is, and then going away and then reappearing behind you.
[01:02:33]  And there was lots of stories.
[01:02:35]  People would say it was swamp gas or that it was this or that.
[01:02:38]  I really never knew what it was.
[01:02:39]  I knew it was different in that everybody kind of felt a little different when we were there.
[01:02:46]  It was kind of an edge, I guess.
[01:02:49]  Everybody was kind of on the edge, and I don't know what it was, and I really couldn't explain to you what it was, but it was definitely a unique experience.
[01:02:56]  And I've hunted those woods also.
[01:02:57]  I know you're talking about the wild man creature and everything.
[01:03:01]  I've hunted in those woods, too, and I've heard some things sitting in a deer blind out in the big thicket area and heard things in the mornings, early, early mornings, and late at the evenings, right about darker.
[01:03:11]  It's weird sounds is all I can say.
[01:03:14]  I wouldn't know what it was.
[01:03:15]  Yeah.
[01:03:16]  I mean, I would not know what it was and wouldn't have any explanation.
[01:03:19]  Yeah, and I'll tell you something.
[01:03:20]  If I didn't know who was on what line, I'm not sure I'd be able to tell the two of you apart.
[01:03:24]  You sound dungeons, dunderslin, dungeons line.
[01:03:27]  It's our East Texas accent, huh?
[01:03:30]  Well, yeah, but it's the deer blind talk and all the rest of it.
[01:03:33]  Yeah, uh-huh.
[01:03:34]  Okay.
[01:03:34]  It's a Texas thing, I guess.
[01:03:35]  Well, you know, it's like I was telling you, Professor Osuki said that in his experience, more people in Texas had seen these lights than anywhere he knew of.
[01:03:44]  Apparently.
[01:03:45]  Yeah.
[01:03:47]  I wonder why.
[01:03:49]  Well, we haven't got into this, but.
[01:03:51]  Do you believe that Texas is on some of these lines you were talking?
[01:03:56]  Yes.
[01:03:57]  I do.
[01:03:58]  And where do they run from Texas?
[01:04:01]  Can you tell me?
[01:04:02]  Well, one of the interesting things about this that I get into in the book is what you know, you've heard of the planetary grid theories, I'm sure.
[01:04:13]  Of course.
[01:04:14]  Yeah.
[01:04:15]  I think that the ghost light, standing ghost light locations may also be indicators of vertices of the grid.
[01:04:27]  And there does seem to be some geometrical alignments of certain of the ghost light areas on 30th degree north latitude, which runs all the way across Texas, all the way from far west Texas all the way through to the Big Thicket.
[01:04:46]  And interestingly enough, we were talking about the Morpholites earlier.
[01:04:50]  Yes.
[01:04:51]  The Marpholites and the Braglight occur on exactly the same latitude, 800 miles apart.
[01:04:58]  Well, that would seem to bolster that idea, wouldn't it?
[01:05:01]  And if you follow that latitude east, there's a ghost light that occurs in Gonzalez, Louisiana, on that same latitude.
[01:05:10]  And a fellow emailed me some time ago and said that there had been one in Mobile, Alabama, near Mobile, Alabama, but it had disappeared when the area was developed.
[01:05:23]  There are going to be a number of people who would like to email you, and if you have the guts, you can give out your email address.
[01:05:29]  Do you wish?
[01:05:30]  Okay, my email address is CR Riggs.
[01:05:35]  C-R-R-I-G-G-S at A-U-S-T-I-N-T-X, AustinTex.net.
[01:05:44]  Wait a minute.
[01:05:45]  And I've had over 50 emails since you posted the promo on your website before coming on the air.
[01:05:53]  Oh, yeah, okay.
[01:05:53]  C-R-Rigs.
[01:05:55]  R-I-G-G-S at Austin T-X.
[01:05:58]  T-X-S-R-Texas.net.
[01:06:01]  Yeah, A-U-S-T-I-N-T-X.net.
[01:06:03]  Well, you'll get plenty of email, all right.
[01:06:05]  Oh, okay.
[01:06:07]  Wildcard line, you're on the air with Rob Riggs.

=== Encounter with a Rabid Coonhound (03:08) ===

[01:06:11]  Hello.
[01:06:11]  Hi, Art.
[01:06:12]  Hi, Rob.
[01:06:13]  How you doing?
[01:06:14]  Okay, sir.
[01:06:15]  Where are you?
[01:06:15]  I'm in Albuquerque, New Mexico.
[01:06:17]  Okay.
[01:06:19]  I was stationed out of Fort Bragg, North Carolina, about eight years ago.
[01:06:25]  And I came across something that I have not told anyone about.
[01:06:30]  And tell you the truth, it's scared of the living daylights.
[01:06:34]  I was out on the far east side of the base about two, three o'clock in the morning, just running around killing time.
[01:06:43]  I lived in the area and came across a coonhound that found out later had rabies.
[01:06:53]  And this animal turned and apparently thought I had it cornered.
[01:06:59]  And something came out of the tree, tore it clean in two.
[01:07:06]  I looked the thing square in the face.
[01:07:08]  I can't tell you what it looked like.
[01:07:10]  The one thing I do remember were those eyes.
[01:07:14]  And when you played that recording about half an hour ago, Art?
[01:07:17]  Yes, sir.
[01:07:18]  It made the hair on the back of my neck and my beard stand straight out.
[01:07:22]  Even your beard.
[01:07:23]  Yeah.
[01:07:24]  Now, I'd like a photo of that.
[01:07:26]  So the thing stood upright like a man?
[01:07:30]  Yeah.
[01:07:30]  And was in the trees.
[01:07:32]  Came down out of the tree.
[01:07:33]  It came out of a tree that was behind me.
[01:07:36]  And tore that thing in half?
[01:07:39]  Damn near.
[01:07:40]  The Bigfoot are known to hate dogs, Art.
[01:07:44]  Oh.
[01:07:45]  Yeah.
[01:07:47]  They're known to hate dogs.
[01:07:49]  I think dogs are able to detect them.
[01:07:54]  But to be able to physically manifest, that's almost feels like a different kind of stage, but I guess not really.
[01:08:03]  We found fur.
[01:08:04]  They found droppings.
[01:08:05]  They found footprints.
[01:08:06]  That's physical manifestation.
[01:08:08]  So I guess why not, huh?
[01:08:10]  I hear a lot of stories about them killing dogs.
[01:08:13]  Really?
[01:08:13]  Yeah.
[01:08:16]  A lot of dog lovers aren't going to want to hear that, but they don't want to.
[01:08:20]  Well, anything else, sir?
[01:08:24]  Well, the thing that really disturbed me about it, I've only talked about this to about two, three other people since this happened.
[01:08:34]  My roommate at the time, he and I went out to the same area because it was only about two miles from where we lived.
[01:08:42]  And we followed the tracks from where I was when it happened about 300, 400 yards back in the woodline, and they stopped.
[01:08:53]  That was it.
[01:08:54]  No more.
[01:08:55]  Did you look in the trees?
[01:08:58]  We checked everything.
[01:09:00]  There were no claw marks.
[01:09:02]  There were no broken twigs on any of the trees nearby.

=== Interdisciplinary Approach Needed (02:49) ===

[01:09:06]  Nothing.
[01:09:08]  Well, that's typical also.
[01:09:10]  Well, there's your dimension shift, see?
[01:09:14]  It just flat physically disappeared.
[01:09:17]  Right.
[01:09:21]  Thank you for that story.
[01:09:24]  How do we proceed, in your opinion, scientifically, to investigate?
[01:09:30]  Well, here's what I think, Art.
[01:09:32]  This is so fascinating, but how do you proceed?
[01:09:35]  Well, for one thing, we have to take an interdisciplinary approach to this.
[01:09:39]  And I think one of the reasons there hasn't been a lot of progress made in researching this stuff is that we're too specialized and too compartmentalized in our branches of knowledge.
[01:09:54]  Right.
[01:09:55]  And I think that in order to investigate these phenomena thoroughly, we're going to have to call on physicists like Osuki, wildlife biologists who are willing to look at the possibilities of these things existing.
[01:10:09]  I know one in Russia and one in Canada.
[01:10:12]  We may need geologists, cultural anthropologists, psychologist.
[01:10:18]  And I think we probably need some American Indian shamans.
[01:10:24]  Well, that'd be quite a group to put together.
[01:10:26]  Yes, and I would like to see that happen.
[01:10:31]  You know, I'm not sure you can investigate by committee, but the fact of the matter is, I think that we're so out of touch with this, you know, the reality that these things pertain to in this culture that that's why it seems so fantastic and otherworldly to us.
[01:10:53]  So that would be our only hope in terms of investigation.
[01:10:57]  The shaman, for example, somebody who is at least far enough into that world to sort of take the first step in for everybody.
[01:11:08]  I think so.
[01:11:09]  And, you know, what this shows is that these other worlds can have physical contact with this world.
[01:11:17]  This is not just dreaming or imagining or visualizing.
[01:11:26]  This is real physical stuff.
[01:11:29]  Well, you've got to wonder with the number of people that disappear every year.
[01:11:34]  Certainly there's plenty of this world explanation for why people disappear, but then there's no doubt plenty that cannot be explained in that way.

=== Travis's Sour Lake Hunt (15:50) ===

[01:11:44]  And who is to say that some have not crossed from here to another world?
[01:11:51]  That's a possibility.
[01:11:53]  And the only ones we hear from are the ones that got away.
[01:11:56]  Yeah, that's right.
[01:11:57]  Not the ones that got there.
[01:11:59]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Rob Riggs.
[01:12:02]  Hello.
[01:12:03]  Hi, my name's Travis.
[01:12:04]  I'm calling from Conroe, Texas.
[01:12:06]  All right.
[01:12:07]  Yes.
[01:12:08]  And, well, I actually grew up in the Sour Lake area.
[01:12:14]  And I spent most of my young life hunting out on a piece of property that butts up against the big thicket.
[01:12:21]  And we'll hunt, you know, in the woods, and in addition to that, up and down pipelines.
[01:12:28]  Right.
[01:12:28]  And I've been sitting in a deer blind looking down a pipeline and seen a man cross the road.
[01:12:35]  And we're talking about a distance of two or three miles.
[01:12:38]  And it's not uncommon to see something like that because it's a big common lease.
[01:12:45]  Lots of people hunt on it.
[01:12:47]  But there weren't that many people up at the lease that day.
[01:12:49]  I came back to camp, asked who was down there because we all have to sign in before we go out and hunt.
[01:12:54]  And nobody was down in that area.
[01:12:58]  In addition to that, just lots of strange noises early, early in the morning and late at night.
[01:13:03]  Right.
[01:13:05]  Can you describe those noises?
[01:13:08]  It would sound a lot like the howling Art was playing earlier.
[01:13:12]  It was real faint, though.
[01:13:14]  I mean, I couldn't.
[01:13:16]  Like in the distance.
[01:13:17]  In the distance.
[01:13:18]  Have you heard any reports, any sightings like that anywhere near Sour Lake?
[01:13:22]  Yes.
[01:13:23]  That's where I was when I heard that thing howling was near Sour Lake.
[01:13:27]  Oh, man.
[01:13:28]  This is the first I've heard of it, and I'm just real surprised to hear about my part of the world being on the radio.
[01:13:33]  Well, it is, sir, and your part of the world is responding big time.
[01:13:38]  Here's a very interesting fast blast on computer.
[01:13:42]  It's Wade in Huntsville, Texas, wherever that is.
[01:13:45]  He says, I've got two dogs, and they just totally went into fright when you played that Bigfoot sound.
[01:13:52]  I live in the East Texas woods.
[01:13:54]  So it's East Texas, I guess.
[01:13:56]  Yes, that's near Conroe.
[01:13:58]  And his dogs didn't like that sound at all.
[01:14:02]  But that would figure, wouldn't it?
[01:14:04]  In other words, a dog would instinctually know that whatever that is, it doesn't like them.
[01:14:11]  Right.
[01:14:12]  All right.
[01:14:12]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Rob Briggs.
[01:14:15]  Hi.
[01:14:17]  Hello?
[01:14:18]  Oh, I didn't push that.
[01:14:19]  That's a sticky button.
[01:14:20]  West of the Rockies, now you're on the air.
[01:14:21]  Hi.
[01:14:22]  Hi, Rob.
[01:14:22]  It's a pleasure to talk to you.
[01:14:23]  Hi.
[01:14:24]  I have a question for you in a comment also.
[01:14:27]  All right.
[01:14:28]  And the question is, do you think they can communicate with us in normal English?
[01:14:34]  You know, that is a particularly interesting question because there are some Bigfoot researchers.
[01:14:38]  I've had them on the program that have played tapes that sound just like human voice.
[01:14:45]  Sort of.
[01:14:45]  Close.
[01:14:46]  Hmm, that's really interesting.
[01:14:50]  Do I think they can communicate with us in English?
[01:14:52]  Yes.
[01:14:53]  I have no idea.
[01:14:55]  You haven't heard any reports of it?
[01:14:57]  Of course, I'm from Texas, and I would hope they would also speak Spanish.
[01:15:02]  Well, I lived most of my life in Montana.
[01:15:06]  I have a good friend.
[01:15:07]  He's basically a mountain man.
[01:15:09]  He's been in the woods for nearly 40 years.
[01:15:12]  And last spring, him and another guy found tracks deep in the woods in the Bull River area.
[01:15:22]  And he said, and he was really, I mean, he knows every animal in the woods.
[01:15:26]  And he said the tracks just ended.
[01:15:28]  He just disappeared.
[01:15:29]  And there's no way unless that thing just flew.
[01:15:32]  I mean, this guy is very, I mean, if you walked through the woods, he could tell if you were there.
[01:15:36]  I mean, he's, I hear, I hear those stories over and over again.
[01:15:41]  Well, a guide spent three months.
[01:15:43]  He's seen it several times, and he spent three months back in this area trying to find it, and he never could.
[01:15:49]  You know, you're talking about communicating.
[01:15:52]  I don't know if they speak our language, but I do think they may have kind of telepathic powers.
[01:15:59]  Yeah.
[01:16:00]  And actually, if you were receiving a telepathic message, it might be very difficult to tell the difference between that and speech.
[01:16:07]  Yeah, yeah, that's true.
[01:16:08]  I was being facetious, but I think you're right.
[01:16:11]  Yeah.
[01:16:12]  All right.
[01:16:13]  Thank you very much, Color, and take care.
[01:16:16]  First time caller, you're on the air with Rob Riggs, close to the bottom of the hour.
[01:16:19]  Hello.
[01:16:20]  Hi, gentlemen.
[01:16:21]  Hi.
[01:16:22]  I'm from Madison, Wisconsin, and we had heard of ghost light, I guess is what you'd call it, when I was growing up in Upper Michigan.
[01:16:36]  And a couple years ago, I had the chance to go up with some friends.
[01:16:39]  I wanted them to show it to me, and we went and saw it.
[01:16:43]  And the interesting thing about it is, just based on what you've been talking about, is this light appears over an abandoned railroad bed.
[01:16:53]  And, you know, railroad beds, of course, are long and straight.
[01:16:57]  Right.
[01:16:58]  And I haven't heard of any other sightings of creatures or anything like that, but this light has been known to move.
[01:17:06]  And when I thought it seemed pretty stationary, but it was changing colors and stuff.
[01:17:14]  But the fact that it occurred on something straight like a railroad track, that's absolutely fascinating.
[01:17:21]  Yeah, see, there's your ley line, your inadvertent ley line again, see?
[01:17:26]  That's fascinating.
[01:17:26]  I bet it was during the summer, too.
[01:17:28]  All right.
[01:17:28]  Hold on.
[01:17:28]  We're at the bottom of the hour once again, Rob.
[01:17:31]  Rob Riggs, whose book is In the Big Thicket on the Trail of the Wild Man.
[01:17:39]  If you get on the trail of my website, you can get over there and get that book.
[01:17:43]  Fascinating subject.
[01:17:44]  Fascinating man.
[01:17:46]  I'm Art Bell.
[01:17:47]  This is Coast to Coast AM.
[01:18:12]  To reach Art Bell in the Kingdom of Nye from west of the Rockies.
[01:18:15]  Dial 1-800-618-8255, East of the Rockies.
[01:18:19]  1-800-825-5033.
[01:18:23]  First-time callers may reach out at 1-775-727-1222 or use the wildcard line at 1-775-727-1295.
[01:18:34]  To reach out on the toll-free international line, call your AT ⁇ T operator and have them dial 800-893-0903.
[01:18:43]  This is Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell on the Premier Radio Networks.
[01:18:49]  This is Gordon Lightfoot.
[01:18:54]  And when you interview, I got to interview Gordon Lightfoot, and when you interview him, he is exactly like he sounds when he sings.
[01:19:04]  And by that, I mean when he's singing, he's singing about what happened to him.
[01:19:08]  He's a pretty wild guy, Gordon Lightfoot.
[01:19:11]  Anyway, Rob Riggs is my guest.
[01:19:13]  We're talking about what's in the thickets.
[01:19:16]  we'll be right back welcome back Thank you, sir.
[01:19:39]  Your book is available, I take it, on Amazon.com and such.
[01:19:42]  Yes, it is.
[01:19:43]  How long has it been out?
[01:19:45]  It came out this spring.
[01:19:47]  What kind of reaction have you had?
[01:19:49]  Well, you know, Art, the material in this book is so weird.
[01:19:57]  And I've tried to connect a lot of different things, and it's been kind of hard to pigeonhole it.
[01:20:04]  I had a little problem with the book distributors because, you know, they wanted to label it a Texana item.
[01:20:12]  Is there a what item?
[01:20:14]  Texana, you know, just relating to Texas.
[01:20:16]  Oh, I see.
[01:20:17]  And, you know, I'd like to show some of these book distributors the emails I'm getting from all over North America.
[01:20:24]  Oh, why don't you?
[01:20:25]  What would do it?
[01:20:26]  Yeah.
[01:20:27]  But it is available on Amazon.com, and you could go to any bookstore in the country and order it.
[01:20:33]  It is available through the book distributors.
[01:20:35]  All right.
[01:20:36]  Or if you want an autographed copy, you can get on my website.
[01:20:41]  I've got a, you know, you can order it by a credit card over my website, and I'll send you an autographed copy.
[01:20:47]  And a secure server, I assume.
[01:20:49]  Yes, sir.
[01:20:49]  Just a secure server.
[01:20:50]  You don't have like an 800 number, do you?
[01:20:52]  No, sir, I don't.
[01:20:54]  Everybody has to have an 800 number.
[01:20:57]  All right, so then go to your website.
[01:20:58]  I'm not as big as you guys.
[01:21:01]  All right.
[01:21:02]  Here we go.
[01:21:03]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Rob Riggs.
[01:21:05]  Hi.
[01:21:07]  No, I'm sorry.
[01:21:08]  Again, that stupid button.
[01:21:09]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air now.
[01:21:11]  Hi.
[01:21:11]  Is this Rob?
[01:21:12]  Yeah.
[01:21:13]  Hi.
[01:21:13]  Yes, sir.
[01:21:14]  Go ahead.
[01:21:14]  Hi, my name is Boone, and I'm in Klima Falls, Oregon.
[01:21:19]  And if anybody's life is as weird as mine, I would like to swap stories with them.
[01:21:27]  Well, we were, I came down from Alaska, me and my girlfriend, we went to this little campsite, and I would swear, and I would swear to this, we had a Bigfoot living about 20 feet from us.
[01:21:43]  He did not like me at all, but he liked my girlfriend.
[01:21:49]  I knew it.
[01:21:52]  And they definitely have PSP powers.
[01:21:56]  They are definitely.
[01:21:58]  You know, I ask that half in humor when I couldn't resist playing Wild Thing and all the rest of that.
[01:22:06]  But does there seem to be any preference with regard to human beings?
[01:22:17]  The different sexes.
[01:22:19]  Do they react differently to women than to men?
[01:22:23]  I don't know, but I haven't been able to get very many women to go out in the big thicket with me, Art.
[01:22:28]  It's a good point.
[01:22:29]  It's a really good point.
[01:22:31]  And so you might not have knowledge in the area.
[01:22:33]  Okay, well, absolutely makes sense.
[01:22:36]  First time caller line, your turn with Rob Riggs.
[01:22:39]  Hello.
[01:22:41]  Hello, this is Larry in Tennessee.
[01:22:44]  Hello, Larry.
[01:22:45]  Hi.
[01:22:45]  I'm about two and a half miles west of a place called Wartburg, Tennessee, and about two and a half miles east of the Catoosa Wildlife Game Reserve area.
[01:22:59]  And in 99, I was doing a night watching job at a place called Nemo.
[01:23:04]  It's about a mile and a half from here.
[01:23:06]  And I saw six at one time, I saw six Bigfoots, I guess you would call them.
[01:23:14]  Wow.
[01:23:15]  They crossed what we call an EPA fence, a silt fence.
[01:23:20]  You know, it stops water from flowing off into the river or something.
[01:23:23]  Right.
[01:23:23]  And five of them were darker color, and one was a lighter color.
[01:23:30]  And it really shocked me.
[01:23:33]  I almost did.
[01:23:34]  Here, you know, about six months, and I saw, more than once, I saw strange things.
[01:23:41]  And all right, six at once.
[01:23:44]  Rob, what's the likelihood that that would be a family?
[01:23:48]  I hear that these creatures, you know, a lot of people, a lot of the Bigfoot people I've interviewed have said that they're family-oriented, really family-oriented.
[01:23:59]  I talked, I was doing a radio show down in Beaumont, Texas, and a lady called from Port Arthur, which is near there, and said when she was a child, they used to go out swimming in the bayou near Fort Arthur.
[01:24:15]  And they went out to go swimming one day, and they saw an adult and a child, you know, a smaller Bigfoot.
[01:24:25]  Right.
[01:24:26]  So that is, that is, you know, that happens.
[01:24:30]  And as friendly as they've said to have been, I know of a case which I can't fully discuss in the center part of the country.
[01:24:44]  I better not say any more than that.
[01:24:48]  South central part of the country, where somebody harmed a Bigfoot, and they are suffering now every day through get this, having stones thrown at them by what appears to be the relatives of this creature that they injured.
[01:25:09]  I can't talk any more about this case, I guess, than that right now, but I'm really serious.
[01:25:14]  This is really serious.
[01:25:16]  They're being stoned, literally, You ever hear of anything like that?
[01:25:24]  I've heard of stones appearing apparently from nowhere and being thrown at people.
[01:25:31]  I've never heard of Bigfoot doing that.
[01:25:35]  Of course, there are not any stones down in Big Thicket.
[01:25:39]  Yeah, that's true.
[01:25:41]  There are where I'm talking about, and I wish I could say more, but it's under investigation.
[01:25:46]  Wildcard line, you're on the air with Rob Briggs.
[01:25:49]  Hi.
[01:25:50]  Hi.
[01:25:51]  Hello.
[01:25:51]  How are you, Erpa?
[01:25:53]  Excuse me.
[01:25:53]  Where are you, sir?
[01:25:54]  I'm coming from Saskatoon, Saskatchewan.
[01:25:56]  Saskatchewan?
[01:25:57]  Way up there.
[01:25:58]  Good.
[01:25:59]  I just got to say one thing.
[01:26:01]  I've listened to your show since about 94, and I love your show, man.
[01:26:04]  This is the coolest stuff I've heard ever.
[01:26:07]  Thank you.
[01:26:08]  Actually, what I was wondering is, has anybody, like to this date, actually caught one of these things?
[01:26:14]  Good question.
[01:26:15]  And, you know, there's another thing, too, about that HARP project up in Alaska.
[01:26:20]  Maybe they could use that to find them, find the caves and stuff.
[01:26:24]  Well, HAARP is said to affect people psychologically, so you never know about maybe Bigfoot, too.
[01:26:32]  The first question is a really good one, though.
[01:26:35]  What's the lore regarding that?
[01:26:36]  Has anybody ever trapped, caught, or otherwise even temporarily detained one of these beings?
[01:26:45]  Well, there are stories, and you don't know whether they're apocryphal or what because we don't have the bodies in hand, but there are stories dating back to the last century where supposedly that there have been some captured.
[01:27:02]  You can go back and read the literature.
[01:27:05]  John Green and some of these fellows that kind of pioneered Bigfoot search, and they supposedly traced back some stories.

=== Roadkill Mysteries (02:22) ===

[01:27:14]  And I think there was one in Tennessee and again, whether these are apocryphal stories, I don't know.
[01:27:23]  Now, somebody asked me, well, has there ever been one, the body of one found?
[01:27:28]  Like a roadkill or something.
[01:27:30]  Right.
[01:27:31]  And there's a website, and you know, anything you see on the Internet, to me, is suspect.
[01:27:40]  Yep.
[01:27:42]  But there are some sites that have photographs of supposed roadkills.
[01:27:49]  Some of it looks fairly interesting.
[01:27:51]  There's one on a website called CryptoKeeper that was forwarded to me by Lou Farrish, who has a UFO organization in Arkansas.
[01:28:02]  And there is a body of a roadkill alleged in DeRitter, Louisiana.
[01:28:10]  Now, DeRitter, Louisiana, is right across the Sabine River from the Big Thicket.
[01:28:16]  Well, now, you see, the Internet is a two-edged sword.
[01:28:19]  While everything is suspect, it's also the venue where things will be seen that otherwise you would never have seen it.
[01:28:27]  It would be suppressed, right?
[01:28:28]  You never would see it.
[01:28:29]  Exactly.
[01:28:30]  Now, you know, there is a story that, you know, frequently there are stories that come up about people finding bodies of what are assumed to be chimpanzees or baboons or apes.
[01:28:49]  There was a story that came up in the 1950s.
[01:28:52]  There was an old Big Thicket guide named Lance Rosier.
[01:28:59]  And supposedly somebody took him the body of what they thought was a gorilla that they found alongside the road in Hardin County.
[01:29:10]  Right.
[01:29:12]  And they just thought it was a gorilla.
[01:29:15]  They didn't have any and they just assumed that it escaped from a zoo or something like that, you know.

=== Girl and the Brag Light (07:58) ===

[01:29:21]  And, you know, what is the likelihood that one of them would be run over?
[01:29:26]  I mean, they're intelligent beings and then mainly in very rural areas.
[01:29:31]  Well, it's not likely, but it's an outside possibility.
[01:29:35]  Yeah.
[01:29:35]  But there is a story that one was taken to him to be identified.
[01:29:41]  Do you know what became of it?
[01:29:43]  No.
[01:29:45]  But the assumption was, now, the story I read didn't even link it to the wild man stories or the Bigfoot stories.
[01:29:53]  They just assumed it was a chimpanzee or something.
[01:29:56]  Gotcha.
[01:29:57]  All right.
[01:29:58]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Rob Riggs.
[01:30:00]  Hello.
[01:30:01]  Hello.
[01:30:01]  Yes, sir.
[01:30:02]  Where are you?
[01:30:03]  I'm in Beaumont, Texas.
[01:30:04]  All right.
[01:30:05]  Mr. Bell, Mr. Riggs, it's a pleasure to meet y'all.
[01:30:09]  I've listened to you all the time.
[01:30:11]  And I just want to let y'all know that I was at Bragg Road tonight.
[01:30:17]  I actually listened to the broadcast.
[01:30:19]  You were at Bragg Road tonight.
[01:30:21]  Did the light show up?
[01:30:23]  No, there was quite a bit of traffic.
[01:30:25]  Actually, there was about three other vehicles up there.
[01:30:29]  I tried to call Don Briscoe down there to tell him.
[01:30:32]  So you have an affiliate in Beaumont, Texas, Art.
[01:30:35]  Yes, sir.
[01:30:35]  And I tried to call Don Briscoe to ask him to tell the listeners to be sure and tune in down there.
[01:30:41]  Well, but I'll be damned if I would go down Bragg Road in the middle of the night listening to this program.
[01:30:47]  No way.
[01:30:49]  We wanted to bat you down.
[01:30:50]  Oh.
[01:30:54]  Well, we've been looking to take some road trips, so maybe, maybe.
[01:30:59]  But you were actually there tonight, huh, sir?
[01:31:01]  Yes.
[01:31:02]  I really didn't.
[01:31:04]  When we drove down it, coming off the farm road, we went about six miles down and turned around, and there was a truck that passed once or twice.
[01:31:15]  But there were no vehicles when it was coming back out.
[01:31:18]  And there was, we did see way up ahead a flash of light go across the road real quick.
[01:31:25]  And then about, I would say about four or five minutes later, another light came back across the other way.
[01:31:33]  Now, I couldn't tell how far ahead of it it was, of us it was, but that's all that I had saw.
[01:31:40]  Well, that'll do.
[01:31:41]  And you were listening to the show while you were there?
[01:31:43]  I sure was.
[01:31:44]  In fact, I made it a point to go out there tonight because I'd never been to Bragg Road before.
[01:31:49]  So you wanted to listen to the show from there?
[01:31:51]  Exactly.
[01:31:52]  That's great.
[01:31:53]  You Texans really are a different breed, aren't you?
[01:31:57]  Let me tell you all this story.
[01:31:58]  I had a guy call in when I was doing a show down there, and he had heard about the Brag Light, and he was dating a girl that lived over in Batson.
[01:32:09]  And they would drive right by Bragg Road when they were going to church.
[01:32:12]  So one night he said, well, let's go on down there.
[01:32:15]  So they go down there.
[01:32:16]  They get out on the road.
[01:32:19]  And the girl is kind of freaking out.
[01:32:22]  And so she's wanting the guy to leave.
[01:32:26]  So he says, well, he needed to answer nature's call.
[01:32:30]  So he opens the door to do that, to get out.
[01:32:35]  And the light shows up.
[01:32:39]  And then.
[01:32:40]  Well, I don't put a crimp in nature's call.
[01:32:45]  And then the light goes off into the woods.
[01:32:48]  And then the wild man shows up, jumps on the back of the car and starts shaking the car.
[01:32:55]  With the girl in it.
[01:32:57]  With the girl in it.
[01:33:00]  Yeah, this guy swore up and down that this is a true story.
[01:33:06]  I wonder if he ever got another date.
[01:33:08]  Not with that girl.
[01:33:10]  That's right.
[01:33:10]  West of the Rockies, you're on there with Rob Riggs.
[01:33:12]  Hello.
[01:33:13]  Yes, Art.
[01:33:14]  Yes, sir.
[01:33:15]  Yeah, this is George North Hill.
[01:33:16]  Hello.
[01:33:17]  I was up in the Bristol Cones about maybe two months ago.
[01:33:22]  And I had my dogs with me in my truck, and I was just, it was out.
[01:33:29]  It was probably 11:30 at night.
[01:33:32]  My dog started growling, and then I could feel something really big was breathing down my back.
[01:33:41]  Oh, man.
[01:33:41]  And then I just turned around, I couldn't see nothing.
[01:33:46]  Actually, actually breathing down your back.
[01:33:49]  Yes.
[01:33:49]  Like he was breathing down my back.
[01:33:52]  Oh, man.
[01:33:53]  You know, I mean, this is the Bristol Cones.
[01:33:55]  And, you know, the Payutes have a song for them for the Bigfoot song.
[01:34:02]  They sing in some of the rituals, you know.
[01:34:07]  Yes.
[01:34:08]  You know.
[01:34:10]  A couple of other crazy things have happened to me up there, too.
[01:34:14]  I've seen some lights that are...
[01:34:17]  This is up at this.
[01:34:21]  Real sort of sacred grounds are, you know.
[01:34:23]  Right.
[01:34:24]  You know, it's, you know, the mountains have all these geological forums and stuff on them.
[01:34:29]  And the Paiutes were really, I guess, personally.
[01:34:33]  Next American.
[01:34:35]  Yes.
[01:34:36]  They have a Bigfoot song.
[01:34:37]  They sing when they do the sweat lodges and stuff like that, you know.
[01:34:41]  And I think that it could be that the Bigfoot is sort of like a spiritual helper, you know?
[01:34:49]  Yeah, there are some familiars to them.
[01:34:54]  You know, that they come in, they call them in, you know, they come in, and that's why nobody ever finds them, you know?
[01:35:03]  Well, they live in two worlds.
[01:35:05]  Exactly, you know, they come in and out, you know.
[01:35:08]  Uh-huh.
[01:35:08]  You know, and it's, yeah, Art, you ought to look up a couple of Paiute medicine men.
[01:35:13]  You're right in the thick of it.
[01:35:15]  In the thick of it.
[01:35:16]  All right.
[01:35:17]  Your book.
[01:35:20]  In the Big Thicket on the Trail of the Wild Man, is it full of anecdotal stories?
[01:35:27]  Is it instructional in any way?
[01:35:29]  How did you...
[01:35:30]  Well, the book is based on about 20 years of research, of my own experience of field research going out into the woods of interviewing of eyewitnesses.
[01:35:44]  of correspondence with leading scientists and investigators from around the world.
[01:35:53]  And it has a lot of stories.
[01:35:55]  And the stories are mainly from eyewitnesses.
[01:35:58]  In some cases, I'll put second or third-hand stories if they corroborate or if they're part of a pattern.
[01:36:09]  I don't put a lot of folklore in there.
[01:36:12]  Right.
[01:36:14]  And all of this is still going on today, if not in greater magnitudes than in prior days, right?
[01:36:21]  Yes.
[01:36:22]  That's a really, really interesting thing to note.
[01:36:24]  There are many of us who believe just we call it the veil.
[01:36:29]  Right.
[01:36:29]  Whatever it is that separates here and there is beginning to lift a little bit or more frequently than it has in the past.
[01:36:37]  I agree.
[01:36:37]  And my interest in all of this is what it implies about paradigm shift.
[01:36:45]  Yeah.
[01:36:46]  Yeah.
[01:36:47]  You hit it right in the head.
[01:36:48]  Listen, guess what?
[01:36:49]  Our program is over.
[01:36:51]  We got to go.
[01:36:52]  What a pleasure it has been to have you on the air.
[01:36:54]  It has been great.
[01:36:55]  I've enjoyed the opportunity of talking to you and your listeners.
[01:36:59]  Rob, thank you.
[01:37:00]  Thank you so much.
[01:37:01]  Good night.
[01:37:02]  Good night.
[01:37:03]  From the high desert, I'm Art Bell.
[01:37:09]  You don't got me there.
[01:37:12]  You know you don't got me there.
[01:37:17]  You don't got me there.