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March 2, 1999 - Art Bell
01:00:01
Coast to Coast AM with Art Bell - Peter Davenport and Roger Leir - UFO Sightings. Richard C. Hoagland - Miami Circle Update (hour 1)
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the great American Southwest.
I wish you all a good evening or a good morning, wherever you may be, across this great land
of ours and well beyond, actually, to the Pahitian and Hawaiian Islands, to the exotic
beauty of the Southwest, East and West.
Virgin Islands, south into South America, north all the way to Poland, worldwide on the Internet.
Thank you, Broadcast.com, and of course, Intel for their wonderful new product that allows you to
see the show actually being done and they're continuing by the way I have this
little screen that I put up and I and they type me messages from Dallas at
broadcast.com which is really cool and they are tweaking it getting a little bit
sharper a little bit better every day I mean you have technology breaking
over your head so if If you have an opportunity, it is free.
F-R-E-E, free.
You simply take your computer to my website, and download the G2 Player.
The G2 Player, it's free.
And once you've done that, you go back to my website, and click on Streaming Video, and you'll be sitting there watching me do the program.
It is an astounding technology, and they are in the middle of perfecting that as we go.
It's really, really fascinating.
And so tonight, it's going to be a little, perhaps a little more clear, a little sharper, and it's going to continue to get better and better and better.
All right.
In a moment, we are going to talk with Peter Davenport and Dr. Roger Lear.
They were down in Laughlin, Nevada, where they saw something.
Now, You've got to wonder about that.
I mean, they're at a UFO Congress in Laughlin, Nevada, and they had a serious sighting.
They had a really serious sighting.
They'll tell you about it in a moment.
I presume you watched the show from Egypt live tonight?
And the consensus I'm getting is that a lot of people thought it was pretty much of a setup, and I'm sure some of it was, but But, and it's a big but, you had yourself a really wonderful tour of a lot of areas at Giza that Americans don't generally get to see.
So, what they found aside are some of the areas they went into.
I got to go into those areas and I must tell you that you really had a treat.
If you were watching it for the aesthetic Beauty?
Aesthetic?
Yes, beauty.
Aesthetic beauty of it all.
Then you got quite a treat.
If you were waiting for some discovery that would change all of mankind, then you were probably disappointed.
If you thought that they set a few things up to be found, then I would agree with you.
They probably did.
That was my take, too.
But you did get to visit areas not normally seen by the American people.
That's for doggone sure.
I was in many of those areas, and as you can see, it's pretty dusty, pretty dirty work.
Pretty hard work, and I can assure you, you're sweating like crazy.
I did it at almost 100 degrees at the plateau when I went into some of those areas, so you can imagine what it was like.
Sweat was just pouring off me.
So, all of that directly ahead tonight.
We'll hear a little bit from Richard Hoagland.
Of course, he was seen also.
In tonight's live, actually his was taped, his little piece was taped, live broadcast from Egypt.
Well, Y2K is pressing inward.
I'm seeing stories now just about every day.
Increasingly on CNN, now on other networks as well.
The white LED flashlight is something you just might want to have around in case something real happens with Y2K.
Still out at sea.
Even in the valleys, wind gusts may exceed 60 miles per hour.
Wish us luck, Alex.
I wish you luck, Alex.
I also wish you had the white LED flashlight.
It, um... Listen to me carefully.
It uses white... Well, in case you don't know, Dr. Lear is the surgeon, uh, who oversaw the removal of the little piece, remember on the confirmation special on NBC?
It was pretty gross stuff, and if you think that's gross, get the videotape, you'll really see gross.
Um, from that man's thumb, and I thought they were gonna pull on that damn thing forever and ever.
Uh, Dr. Roger Lear is with us, also from the UFO Reporting Center, not in Seattle this night, but rather in Arizona, is Peter Davenport.
Gentlemen, welcome to the program.
Thanks for being here, Art.
Dr. Lear, I swear, I thought they were going to keep pulling that damn thing out of that guy's thumb forever.
I was sitting there going, oh, come on, get it out!
Well, I guess that added a little bit of drama to a very dramatic situation.
Yes, it did.
And thanks for the intro for being a television star.
I've never heard that.
And now you're a TV star, officially.
And Peter, you have been a radio star for some time, in the sense that you've been doing a lot of reporting
from Seattle, from the National UFO Reporting Center in Seattle.
But you are down in Arizona, and you were at the, what was it?
What was it officially called, Peter?
It was the International UFO Congress, or symposium, the eighth annual.
This is my first year there.
Roger spoke there too, did a marvelous job in presenting his data.
First time I've ever seen the full body of it.
And we were in Laughlin, Nevada, right at the southern tip of Nevada.
In Laughlin, Nevada.
Now, the last place one would expect to have a UFO sighting is at a UFO conference.
Or maybe not, I don't know.
But you guys had a UFO sighting, didn't you?
We certainly did, Art, and it was more than just an ordinary UFO sighting to me.
As you know, I probably came aboard this subject as sort of the consummate scientific skeptic.
Did a couple of things, wrote a few articles, met a researcher and started doing surgery for the removal of implants wound up writing a book, the aliens and the
scalpel, scientific proof of extraterrestrial implants in humans. And I had a couple of sightings which
you know about previously.
And incidentally those sightings were pretty exciting in themselves, but what we learned
afterwards sort of indicated that they may be a craft that you know belongs to us in some sort
or black budget developed secret craft.
I think you got that opinion too, didn't you Art?
Um, you mean what you saw in Laughlin?
No, what we saw, what I've seen previous, like the fireball that we saw over the freeway, and the, uh, the discovered rocket died.
Um, it's entirely possible that may have been our stuff, who knows?
I know that a sighting that, uh, we had that Peter reported on, uh, I think last week, uh, did in fact turn out to be a launch from Vandenberg.
I was able to confirm that much.
But, I thought what was interesting was, the people that, um, I mean, that is, in fact, what they described.
So it was very interesting to find out after the fact that what we had described was, in fact, what it turned out to be.
And it could have been not ours, but it turned out to be ours, and it also turned out that the descriptions that people gave were roughly accurate.
Peter?
Yeah, I feel I owe an apology to our listeners over that one.
I'm satisfied that what I reported on is a rocket launch based on other reports that have come.
I was preparing for an early departure, and one of the gentlemen reported to me that he felt he was looking east when he was looking at this thing, which I felt would have ruled out a launch from Vandenberg, but I think it's fairly clear I erred on that particular report, and I apologize.
Well, it's always going to happen, Peter.
The important thing is to follow up on whatever we get, and that's what we're doing here.
Yep.
All right, so here you two are at a It's a wonderful conference in Laughlin, Nevada and I guess it's what, down toward the last day or one of the last days of the conference?
It was the last night.
It was the night of the banquet and somewhere around 9.25 we had already finished eating and we were listening to some of the festivities go on.
UFO Congress also is one of the only ones that presents awards for videography and they have what are called the EBE awards and some of the most prestigious of the UFO video videographers or producers that make these things present their material just like the Academy Awards in various categories.
So this was what was going on I was sitting there at a table and Peter Gersten, who you well know, was sitting next to me.
At about 9.25 he got up and came over to the table and tapped me on the shoulder and says, let's go.
I said, Peter, where are we going?
Just come with me.
And so we went through the room and he picked out certain people.
We all went outside.
Well, by this time it was getting close to 9.30.
We walked outside the hotel, just right on the river.
And there was a group of about 30 or 40 people standing there.
And I thought to myself, my gosh, what the heck's going on?
Maybe there's a boat or something people are looking at.
So we get out there and I can see everybody looking up and I can hear the crowd talking about, wow, look at that, look at that.
Just as I got there, I saw something shoot over my head.
And the woman says, well, there goes one now.
So I said, gee, what the heck's going on here?
So I looked up.
There was a very full moon.
Now, I'm going to leave it to Peter to give you all the specific logistics of this, because he does this so well.
I wouldn't even attempt to do it, but I'm going to give you the emotional part of this.
Sure.
Bright, full moon, fairly high in the sky.
Right.
A whole star field.
And I looked at where people were looking and it became very quiet.
I think Peter will notice that too, how quiet this crowd got.
And what I did was I shielded the moonlight with my hand because it was so bright and I looked at some stars and I said to myself, gee if these people are stargazing or something.
And then suddenly I saw a cluster of stars which formed a triangle.
And I don't know why but I just focused in on those stars and whoa and behold two of those stars started to move.
Oh.
And I took my glasses off and I rubbed my eyes because one of the things that I've done since I've been investigating this phenomena is I've gone out with people at night who tell me the stars move and they have a little something called nocturnal nystigmas which is just a twitching of the muscles of the eye.
Sure.
And when you concentrate on it, it looks like the star is moving.
So I tore off my glasses and rubbed my eyes and I wanted to make sure, you know,
I thought, well, gee, that's what's going on.
And I looked up and no, these two stars moved away from the third star.
And they got, as they were moving away, the two objects got closer together
and they very slowly moved into the corona of the moon where the light was so bright
you couldn't see them anymore.
It was that, maybe a minute or so that it took for that to happen.
I mean, the crowd was just absolutely silent.
And here's the part that gets me.
I had a feeling.
I can't say it was some kind of a telepathic message, but I'm just going to say it was a feeling that somebody was telling me, OK, folks, you saw it.
We showed us to you, now we're leaving.
Bye.
And I mean, it was so emotionally overwhelming and this crowd was just absolutely silent.
I mean, they could have just said, oh wow, oh wee, look at that, you know?
But just totally, totally silent.
Silent.
As the lights that moved were silent.
As the lights that moved were silent.
People don't understand what a grand view of the heavens we have here in Nevada.
It is, um, it is really something to behold.
Uh, we don't have the humidity, so everything up there is crystal clear, and you see things you would not otherwise see.
Well, Peter Davenport, a trained observer, uh, and one who is trained to interview people who have observed, himself observed.
You were there, Peter, so...
Well, if I was, let me say that I can echo most of what Roger said about his sighting.
I was going out of the banquet hall at about 9.31 on Saturday night, and to provide our listeners with a little idea of where we were, we're at the very southern tip of Nevada, where Nevada, California, and Arizona all come together.
That's right.
We're in this gigantic hotel, about 25, 26 stories high, right on the western bank of the Colorado that flows to the south at that point.
Well, I was going outside the banquet hall, and a gentleman who's a very well-known investigator and abduction support organizer up in Seattle, Terry Burris, came running at me, and he said, Peter, Peter, come outside.
We have a UFO sighting in progress.
Well, despite the fact that I know Terry very well and know him to be a serious-minded person, I was immediately skeptical, as I generally am.
But he said, run!
And based on that, I did run.
You ran.
And I was outside, and I saw this group of, I estimate, 30 to 40 people just pressed up against the fence that prevents people from falling in the Colorado River.
And they're all looking up.
We were looking at about 80 degrees magnetic, at about 45 degrees up, I estimate, in rough, round figures.
In other words, these objects were somewhere across the Colorado River, I presume, over Arizona.
What I first saw, I first mistook to be the belt in the Orion's belt in that constellation.
The stars were about that intensity, about that orientation.
But off to the left of those three, in a row, were two more.
Well, my attention was drawn to them and I was trying to sort things out.
It took me only about 10 or 15 seconds and then I saw the two on the left move.
And it's going to be very difficult for me to explain to our listeners the quality of the movement, which was so interesting, but I would equate it to what you see when you're bumped in the head and you see stars.
That, excuse me, that is the way, that is the manner, the quality in which these two stars, star-looking objects... I know exactly what you're talking about.
I've been cracked in the head like that, and it's sort of a...
It's sort of a surreal movement.
Yes.
It's like watching tropical fish in an aquarium, how they dart, and then stop, and slow, and turn, and start, and suddenly decelerate.
That's what these two objects, I should call them, were doing.
And then, I look back to the three.
At that point, I looked at my watch, and for this crowd of 40 people or so, I called out 9.32 p.m.
to get a time mark on it.
Right.
And then I looked behind me and there was Dr. Lear, off to my right.
Dr. Lear, of course, billed as the world's only UFO surgeon.
Off to my right was Peter Gersten, billed as the world's only UFO investigator.
Close to him was Stephen Bassett, whom you've had as a guest as well, the world's only UFO lobbyist.
So I was in pretty lofty company here, together with the other, I estimate, 30, perhaps even 40, witnesses standing there, all of us, looking at these lights.
At that point, they started moving slowly to the southwest.
And on that note, hold it right there.
Peter, we'll be right back.
Peter Davenport and Dr. Roger Lear, who had an experience at the Experiencers Conference.
KMTO Grass Valley, a A service of Nevada County Broadcasters.
In our 20th year of broadcast excellence.
KNTO News Talk 8.
Who is, I think, probably the world's expert on the removal of implants from human beings.
Was on the confirmation program on NBC.
Is here.
And they saw something.
Down at a conference.
Here in Nevada, in Laughlin, Nevada.
And we'll get back to them in a moment.
I'd like to welcome, by the way, WATZ AM in Alpena, Michigan.
Great to have you on board.
They were taking a little bit of the show on the weekends, and now they're taking all five hours, Monday through Friday.
That's WATZ in Alpena, Michigan.
Welcome to Whatever it is that we do here at night, and it is it's pretty strange.
All right, so Glad to have you on board as the affiliate base continues to grow Rushing right on the edge now of being the largest All night or late night talk show in American history, which would make it the largest in world history Which is no small matter Kind of cool, I think.
Anyway, we'll be right back.
The incredible G2 setup that we've got going.
Here's a typical response.
Hey Art, gotta give you a big fat compliment.
We're looking at you via your website and the video is phenomenal.
Look, we've been to other video locations like CNN and still your video is by far the clearest.
We upgraded our video card and monitor so we could see you.
It's gotta be the next best thing to TV.
Paul and Leah in Albuquerque.
If you want to see it, please feel free to join in, folks.
Just go to my website.
Get the G2 Player.
It's brand new stuff.
I mean, this is just simply breaking technology.
The G2 Player is free.
Download it for free.
If you want to get one with all the bells and whistles, well, you can pay something and get that.
But the basic G2 Player is free.
And then simply come back to the website and click on Streaming Video, and here we will be.
Alright, I also have, I think... This has to be asked.
Art.
Wow!
From what Dr. Lear and Mr. Davenport are saying, you should have some great photos to put on your website.
Just out of curiosity, how many thought to bring a camera?
I mean, here we have the world's only this and the world's only that.
Uh, the big wigs of ufology in this country, meaning probably the whole world, and surely they did come back with a raft of wonderful photographs, right?
Wrong!
Now that's very interesting because here we were a banquet and dressed for the occasion
I don't you know I don't think any one of us Was fit to have a camera to run outside take pictures of
probably one of the most greatest sites that I will ever see
Yeah, I was talking to Peter earlier to be honest, and I think Peter had a good point these were lights
They were as stars in the sky.
They were certainly moving, but they were as stars.
And I have tried to go out myself and take photographs of this sort of thing.
Short of having night vision hooked up to a camera, there's no way in hell.
Oh, I think you're absolutely right.
And as a matter of fact, I looked quite intently at the things that I saw moving,
the objects that were moving.
And I realized after I got back my senses and whipped back above me again,
I looked at them in the luminosity of the two objects, whatever you want to call them,
that were moving away from the star that sort of disguised them in a group.
The luminosity was a little bit less.
Then was the the star also we just got through seeing some video that I'm a little son brought back from
Mexico City and in one of the shots
When it opened up it was a similar scene at night, and there was a bunch of objects in the sky
But I was looking at them, and one was grouped so that it looked like the Little Dipper, another one looked like the Big Dipper, another one looked like the Belt of Orion.
And all of a sudden, these things started to move and dance around.
I would say it was something very similar, because if you looked at this triangular arrangement, there's no way you would realize that all three of them weren't really stars.
Well, I've tried it.
I've seen things of about that luminosity, actually even a little greater, and I went in and grabbed both my 35mm and my video camera, And I was unable to get resolution when the pictures came back.
I was terribly disappointed.
And if anybody doubts that, go try taking a picture of something, the brightness of a star, and see how it comes out.
It doesn't work.
Yeah.
You know, on the subject of their visibility, I think, to my eye anyway, they tended to get dimmer consistently.
When I first saw them, as I think I reported earlier, they were about the intensity of the stars in Orion's belt.
Within two or three minutes, they were becoming difficult for me.
Actually, Roger could see them in proximity to the almost full moon, when I could not see them at all, so they had gotten I think considerably dimmer relatively quickly it would have required some very special optical gear to... Would you imagine that meant they were moving away from you?
That's a possible interpretation, although there was a lot of light pollution there.
We had a 25-story building to our backs as we watched these things, with a lot of spotlight shining on the building.
They were getting closer to the moon, so there are a lot of variables there, I think.
But we saw them for a good six to eight minutes.
Well, I've got a good idea, then.
Why don't we make an appeal to the people in Arizona, since you thought they were in that direction?
To report to your line if others perhaps saw these objects even closer.
Yeah.
Interestingly, there was a very interesting event earlier in the day about 5.30 to 5.35.
Ironically, Art, it was just when the first International Art Bell Chat Club was convening in the hotel.
Of course.
I was present at that.
Of course.
And I wish I could tell you in all honesty that when this UFO report Came through the hotel.
Everybody sat in that meeting, but that room was empty in about three microseconds.
Everybody heading outside to see an object.
Indeed, we did see an object.
A very, very small black stationary object, again to the east of our position.
We will never know what that object was.
It could easily have been a black balloon or anything, but it was an interesting thing.
Uh, earlier... You know what, Peter?
I don't think these things are that tough to see.
I think it simply requires looking.
And most of the American public doesn't look.
They're driving, they're walking, they're doing a lot of things, but they're not looking up in the sky, and if you go outside every night, spend a half hour, 45 minutes, you'll see something you cannot explain.
Soon.
That's my impression, too, and, uh...
As Roger and I have both pointed out here, we had some 40, maybe even more than 40 people standing there, awed by these things.
And the quality of motion was very, very unusual.
I think it's the strangest thing that I've seen.
Oh, in the last seven, maybe nine or ten years even.
And it left no doubt in my mind that what we were looking at was extraordinarily bizarre just because of the quality of the movement of these things.
Doesn't the synchronicity of it being at a UFO conference kind of whack you between the eyes a little bit?
Well, that was the next thing I wanted to address because earlier on in this program you mentioned the unusual nature of seeing UFOs at the final day of the
conference.
This is not the only time it has happened at the International UFO Congress.
I think it's three or perhaps four years in a row now there's been a significant sighting during either the last
day or the latter days of the conference.
We were talking to Bob and Terry Brown about this.
They were just flabbergasted by it.
But whatever we saw last Saturday night was very, very unusual in my opinion.
Now right before I got there, there were two ladies that were standing in front of me and they told me that they saw one of these Same star-like objects move away from an adjoining object, which looked like another star, and started doing 360-degree turns around it.
Really?
It just went round and round and round.
Oh my, my, my.
Yeah, they were going around one another, emphasizing just how strange the quality of the movement was.
Those objects were not moving like any natural aircraft that we're accustomed to.
And they were accelerating, stopping, forming triangles, forming straight lines.
It was really very bizarre, in my opinion.
There was just no way to describe the emotional feeling.
And as I said, the crowd got so quiet, I didn't really realize that until after it was all over.
But I would think that normally people would be screaming and yelling, oh, look at that, look at that, look at that.
but it was just absolutely silent and I was just in a state of shock.
Alright gentlemen, welcome to the club. I don't know how many sightings you've had Peter.
How many?
I think this is about the sixth sighting that I've had since 1954.
since 1954.
Dr. Lear?
This would be my third sighting.
As I mentioned before, the other two, I just kind of got the idea that these may have been
craft that had something to do with man.
These other things, I have no explanation for whatsoever, and I much doubt if they're from this neighborhood.
Well, whatever they are, they're all over our skies, and they're not that hard to see.
And so if people want to spend a little time out looking, they will eventually see one.
It requires actually going out there to look, though.
Yeah, I mentioned something in the book about the state of man today and looking straight ahead or looking down.
Also, I might ask if folks want to get the book.
I've had some more calls.
They want to get that autographed copy.
That's since confirmation.
You've had a bunch.
Yes, they are.
So maybe we could give out that.
Oh, we can.
The name of the book is The Aliens and the Scalpel.
The scalpel would be attached to Dr. Lear.
And how do they get the book autographed at that?
If they get this very special copy, they can purchase that by calling 1-800-366-0264.
1-800-366-0264.
It's 1-800-366-0264.
Now we also have a website where you may order the book directly,
and that's simply 5thworld.com.
Interesting.
All right.
And Peter, your line in Seattle is presently not manned, except I assume by a machine.
Oh, thank you for saying that, Art.
Yes, I hope our listeners understand tonight that I am not in Seattle.
Please do not try to call me in Seattle.
I will be back tomorrow, sometime afternoon.
If people have had sightings, we always encourage them to please go to our website.
We have a standardized report form there.
They can fill that out with their sighting and send it to us electronically.
That makes our lives very much easier in Seattle.
Also, if they can confirm the sighting that you just described tonight, From another location, I think that would be particularly interesting.
Absolutely, and if they happen to see anything unusual in the greater area of Arizona, Nevada, or California on Saturday night, the 27th of February, at any hour actually, we would be most grateful if they'd take just five or ten minutes to submit a brief report over our website, the standardized online report form, and I'll be able to take a look at those reports tomorrow when I get back to Seattle.
Excellent.
Well, I want to thank you both for coming on tonight and telling us what you saw at all places, of all places, at a UFO conference.
That's astounding.
And among the whole group of you, even though it would have been impossible, not one photograph.
We're going to have to live with that for a long time.
There was no way we could have photographed those five lights, not with the equipment we had there that night.
Well, at least there were trained observers there.
And perhaps when you in your frustration ask somebody, did you get a picture?
And you'll think back on this.
Well, I'll tell you this, these things are indelibly photographed in my mind.
where they're all staring at the sky going, oh, wow, gee, where's my camera?
Well, I'll tell you this, these things are indelibly photographed in my mind.
I shall never forget them.
That's the problem.
If only we could do a brain dump, we'd all have the same experience.
And one day we may be able to do that, doctor.
All it needs is another kind of an implant.
One more implant.
Alright, thank you both for being here.
And good night.
I look forward to talking to you, Peter, when you get back to Seattle.
So there you have it.
Virtually the world's elite at this sort of thing.
And not one person with a camera to even try a snap.
You see, that's exactly how it occurs.
Even at a UFO conference.
I don't think you exactly go there expecting to have a sighting.
No, you would imagine, wouldn't you?
That going to a conference of that sort, you would take a camera with you.
Or you would be likely to.
Well, alright.
Egypt.
Here's a fact, Art.
I watched the program, Egyptian Tombs.
Very interesting.
I live in San Diego.
And... It was a very interesting program.
I... You know, here's another one.
The live ha-ha exclamation point.
Opening of the tombs.
What a load of dot dot dot dot dot.
What archaeologist worth their salt reaches into a never-before-opened tomb and grabs things out of it without first photographing and carefully documenting everything?
The tombs were so obviously previously opened and prepped for the live broadcast, it was embarrassing to watch.
The only thing live was a broadcast itself.
Dr. Huas obviously had an agenda in that he was trying to buy himself some credibility.
It was, however, interesting that they showed the door at the end of the shaft with the metal handles that was found by a robot camera a few years ago.
Did you know this particular research was stopped by Dr. Huas a few years ago, just as it was getting interesting?
Never did permit the camera.
Yes, that's a Gentbrink shaft.
to continue further up the shaft or allow further excavation.
It was good, however, to see Richard Hoagland presenting the Mars connection.
Yes, I saw Richard and I thought he looked quite dapper.
As a matter of fact, we will reach out to Miami after the top of the hour and touch Richard Hoagland, who you saw, no doubt, earlier tonight, and ask him about a few things.
I am not quite so cynical about the program.
I thought it was really quite good.
Yeah, I thought some of it was set up.
Sure it was.
Now you see what it's like trying to keep up with Dr. Hawass.
This is a very unusual man.
Dr. Zahi Hawass is a friend.
I know him quite well.
But he is... He is unique.
He is a very unique person.
With a very fast, flash temper.
I don't know if you could Discern that from the little bit that you saw on tonight's live broadcast Hard to keep up with that guy can run around Giza like there's no tomorrow.
No joking.
He just for a man his age It's daunting absolutely daunting.
So all in all I thought it was good.
I thought the tour you got I And I went to many of the places, in fact most of the places that you saw tonight.
I was physically there in about 100 degree weather, sweating my bodily parts off.
And I'm glad you got to see it.
I'm really glad you got to see it.
I will, in due time, run my own video.
That's right.
We can do that.
It was a streaming video of what we did when we were in Egypt, and you'll see a lot of the exact same places.
I'm Art Bell.
This of the Circle.
And we then raced down Route 1 to get to the hotel, to get to a TV so I could see what this thing was going to look like.
And the opening shot was the same moon alive from a quarter of a way around the planet behind the head of the Sphinx.
It was the eeriest damn thing you ever saw.
Well, listen, it's been a while since we have had any update on the Miami Circle, so give us one.
What's going on down there?
Well, we're in a kind of a legal limbo.
The bulldozers have been stopped by judges' orders and by the courageous actions of Alex Pinellas, the mayor of Miami-Dade County.
Yes.
And the 10-to-1 vote of the commission a couple weeks ago.
Right.
And we're now in a kind of a legal limbo where by judges' order, nobody gets to go even on the site.
If you look at the night camera of the live Miami webcam we set up overlooking, you know, for security purposes and for curiosity purposes, You'll see in the kind of eerie fluorescent greenish image this round piece of plastic which was put down by Bob Carr and the other archaeologists in the final hours before the judge's order to kind of keep what's there, that 38-foot circle of holes, you know, cut basins in the ground in as good an order without, you know, human oversight as can be done while the
I mean, everyone now here in Miami is suing everyone.
It has become a legal food fight.
The county, of course, is suing the developer for eminent domain to have the right to take the property and pay him a fair apportioned remuneration, which he wants $50 million.
The appraisal of the land is $8 million.
And his costs are something... Was that $15,000 or $50,000?
or fifty fifty five zero fifty million fifty million uh... the city of miami
whose mayor is joe carollo decided that it doesn't want miami circle preserved
It would rather have another high-rise and $1.1 million in taxes.
And so it has turned around and is now suing Alex Pinellas, the mayor of the county, and the county's commission.
The only winner is going to be lawyers.
And then Bauman is now filing suit against, I believe, the county as well as the city for not protecting his interests in terms of the permitting.
So everybody's suing everybody and the circle is safe because as long as the lawyers are arguing, and we're spending money in courtrooms, the bulldozers are not rolling.
That's correct, yes.
That's a critical short-term thing.
Well, that's good.
In the longer term, there's been a very important grassroots development here.
The Native American community has gotten very heavily involved and have set up here in Miami something called MiamiCircle.org, which is the name of that website, which is linked through Enterprise.
And the head of it, Eve Smith, is, I believe, an Apache.
and she has been involved in the political world but she also has very strong native roots and she is creating an organization that is going to be the umbrella organization here in Miami to coordinate not only the political campaign To save the circle, but also some of the documentation, some of the research, and some of the communication of the importance at the cultural level of what this means to indigenous peoples, not just here, but all over the world.
Right.
We are signatories, we the United States, since the Clinton administration has taken office in the last six years, to several international treaties.
OAS, Organization of American States, UN treaties that are in several draft versions.
If this was allowed to go the way of most other sacred sites or indigenous sites here in the state of Florida, there would now be, at the international level, major political repercussions.
And what even the Miami Circle folks who had a meeting tonight, while the Fox show was on, they were meeting in their new downtown building, which has been donated, Uh, to decide their plans to join legally with the county at the level of the grassroots, the level of indigenous representation in the suit against Bauman and the city of Miami to save what is really becoming a more and more interesting treasure.
This is like the things that we were watching opened on television, only this is a real one.
It is not a setup.
This is the tip of an extraordinary puzzle here at the mouth of the Miami River, and the more I look at this and the more I do my homework and, you know, pour into old archives and, you know, compare notes with Bob Carr and Ted Riggs, who's the surveyor who found it seven months ago, the more I am convinced that we can document that this is, in fact, nothing less than an American Stonehenge.
All right.
I was told once by somebody, Richard, that With contingency fees for attorneys.
And they take a lot of cases on at least some portion of contingency.
Which means they get a percentage of the settlement.
That eventually all of the world's riches, all of the world's riches will be in the possession of attorneys.
It's only a matter of time.
It's only a matter of time.
10, 20, 30 percent at a time as we continue to sue the hell out of each other, eventually the attorneys will be triumphant and nobody else will have anything.
Yep.
I don't know if that really could happen, but I thought it was interesting.
Well, I mean, that's the sad side of the story.
The upside is that this has now moved into court where major money is fighting major money.
Upside is the circle is safe.
The upside is the circle is safe.
All right, Richard, hold on.
We're going to break here at the bottom of the hour and we'll come right back into another segment with you.
Richard C. Hoagland, the dapper dude that you saw on Funks.
Tonight, if you saw the live broadcast from Egypt, and you know what I'd like to say to a lot of you?
Ignore what you know was set up, and regard it as a study of the incredible Zaheoos.
There's only one Zaheoos.
Regard it as a tour of one of the most sacred places on the face of Earth.
And you got to see a lot of things that no Americans have ever seen before tonight.
A great personal sacrifice and and I might say pain and suffering because they were on a site survey to do a lot of the show and this as you know began last November.
And I somehow managed to convince this very young and capable producer in Los Angeles to, with her crew, on the last day of, I think, a 10-day non-stop... I mean, you've been in Egypt and you know that it's tiring even when you stay at good hotels.
But when you're running out to do site surveys and shots and camera angles and... I mean, they were trying hot air balloons up over the Sphinx and all kinds of weird things for this show tonight.
On the last day I got them to get on a caravan and go hours at dawn out to Abydos before they had to fly back to New York and to photograph with this Fox crew with a Steadicam And other cameras up in the roof of this temple of Seti I at Abydos, which is a site dedicated to Osiris, all right?
This is the Osiris that Zahi was talking about earlier tonight.
Right.
Which is the god of Egypt, the big guy, the head of the pantheon, as it were.
In this temple, what Debra and her cohorts verified on absolute Fox video, is that up in the ceiling on one of the cross beams there is this six foot panel of exquisitely carved technological stuff!
Helicopters and electro-gravitic craft and hovercraft and a whole bunch of things that in no way shape or form belong in ancient Egypt circa 3,000 years ago, which is the date of that temple, let alone earlier.
And the profound mystery that I would like to set Zahi down and have confront And I would love to have it recorded or on live television.
Simply ask him, what the hell is this and who put it there?
Unless it was faked by some guy singing in a hammock, or a whole bunch of guards are running around down below with AK-47s.
Well, I'll tell you what Zion would probably say.
If he was really pushed into a corner on anti-gravitic craft and technological stuff, he would say, well, Just like we have Richard Hoagland, Robert Bavall, and Graham Hancock today, then we had lots of science fiction-y, imaginative, fantasy-filled people then as well, but they were everyday Egyptians.
Yes.
That's what Zahi would say.
I know he would.
Which, of course, concocted out of whole cloth an Apache helicopter sitting in the ceiling of his temple.
If you go to the website right now, if you log on to ARTGOV.com or ENTERPRISEMISSION.COM, courtesy of Scotty Roland, who about an hour ago got this up on the web, you will see stunning, clear close-ups and comparisons of those glyphs from that temple on our website all over the world tonight.
And go and study them, because there is a profound and exquisite, wondrous mystery here, which I would like to see Dr. Hawass answer.
Because if it isn't some starry-eyed Egyptian dreaming technological wet dreams 3,000 years ago, what we have here, surrounded by cartouches of SETI I, is, I believe, a secret set of stuff that was privy only to
the Pharaoh in his temple, which he was in charge of preserving and protecting and
passing on from a long time before his reign.
And if you look carefully at the glyphs, it looks like you're looking at where this stuff was stored.
In other words, it almost looks like some scribe was carefully recording and setting in stone, in the roof of that temple, a museum or a library or some kind of complex where this flying hardware, what the gods used to fly with, was carefully preserved.
And I think there may be a real secret chamber somewhere under Abydos, which frankly would be really interesting to see on live television as you open.
Well, we may yet get there.
He has... This cannot be swept under the rug.
We've got to ask the question, how the hell did they know what they should not have known?
Right.
Richard, when you consider what we have at Giza, and you consider what you are down there with in Miami, and other like sites around the world, then what is your best guess, Richard?
What do we have on our hands here?
have a worldwide collection of things that could not possibly have been put
here in other words there was not travel across the oceans there was not contact
and communication between peoples on different continents so what do we have
What are all of these?
I think, as I described to a reporter at lunch today, who was asking about why we're here and what we're doing and how the circle fits into the bigger picture.
Yes.
I think the subtext of tonight's show, which I've got to give Peter and Nancy and Debra and all that crew an extraordinary vote of thanks for doing this and for Fox for putting it on.
Because it's almost like we're seeing two shows.
As you know, The material that they were running out of Egypt, Zahi was not seeing what was on tape.
So what you had was these two schizophrenic views of Egypt simultaneously broadcast from the heart of Zahi's land.
It was his version of history.
Us other guys were looking at data with perhaps a little wider point of view.
Well, I hope a lot of the audience was able to do that.
In other words, look past the obvious necessity of drama for television and the Zahi Show and the rest of it and actually look at what was there.
Well, let me tell you what happened in Los Angeles.
I actually called Deborah to find out because it was aired three hours later in the Western time zones.
And she had not actually seen the whole show like I hadn't seen it.
We were supposed to see, you know, rough cuts or whatever, and because of the press of live TV, that all went by the board, and they barely got their act together and got it on live tonight, you know, to their credit.
So we were all kind of looking at this for the first time to see how it all integrated.
She watched it, and right following on Fox, the local news usually picks up on the main special the network runs.
Sure.
Channel 11, Fox, and Los Angeles picked up on our segment.
on this segment on that panel.
Really?
They made it their feature news peg on the whole show.
Really?
Zahi notwithstanding.
So opening and showing old dusty moldy linen in a pine box you know 13 feet down didn't quite have the same oomph As seeing hieroglyphics depicting technological things in a place where no one should have considered building flying machines thousands of years ago.
So, the answer to your question is, when you put all these bits and pieces together, you know, Robert, and Graham, and me, and all the other people, like Charles Hapgood, who wrote this book, Map of the Ancient Sea Kings, 30 years ago, the Piraris maps, which are stereographic, Projections from above Cairo looking on a spherical planet with an Antarctic ice cap that's not there.
And all the other little bits and pieces have come out over the last several decades.
The synthesis is that we are not the first.
And I found it really extraordinary that Nancy Stern said last night on your show that she started out believing history You know, this slanty-eyed cynical reporter from New York or whatever?
Sure, sure.
And she wound up having her eyes open to a much wider possibility.
Not a certainty yet, but a set of possibilities that we can test, that we can follow.
We can connect more dots.
We can find more things.
We can open more real, not tombs, but let's open some real things.
Let's find the damn hangars where that stuff on that panel is stored somewhere in Egypt and get cameras in there.
All right, uh, I'm going to leap to one other topic quickly.
I've got a, uh, there is a storm tonight, Richard, closing in on Oregon, probably underway right now, which to some areas of the coast may bring 100 mile per hour winds.
Even in the valleys, they may see 60 miles per hour or better.
It's very serious stuff.
And I've got a fax here that says, Art, the Doppler radar looks very normal around here, except lately.
Like bicycle spokes in the precipitation coming from Whidbey Island, sometimes it makes geometric shapes.
The Doppler Station is actually near Bremerton, not Whidbey.
Now, we have a huge storm coming in tonight.
Actually, now.
Weather has been horrid up here.
The Doppler never has looked like this, as it has lately.
I normally use the Weather Channel's Doppler.
Look for yourself on the net.
What the hell is going on, Chuck, in Seattle?
Now, is this evidence, Richard?
I know you haven't seen this particular Doppler radar, but I know you've seen a lot of them.
Is this evidence of some kind of weather control?
Again, as I said on a previous show many months ago, we were looking hot and heavy at this.
I don't think that we're seeing primary effects of weather control.
In other words, people controlling weather to control weather.
I do believe that there is a side effect to an unknown technology Which is Tesla, Scalar, whatever you want to call it, that has another purpose.
And when you turn it on, the two side effects are, it does change weather locally, and two, it shows up on these radar plots because of the material that the radar is painting, i.e.
snow or ice or something like that.
You and I both know a very, very, very reputable scientist.
Who, and I've mentioned this on the show before, and you ran it by this scientist, this whole thing that we're talking about right now with the Doppler, strange Doppler radar.
Yep.
And he reacted so strangely, so profoundly, that I'll never forget it.
He wrote a letter to you, which I've got a copy of, in which he virtually said, if he were to speak out on this subject, he'd be dead within 48 hours.
You want to confirm that?
You want to confirm that for everybody?
Well, that's what he said, yes.
Yeah.
And we both know him.
And we both know that he's a sober, sane, curious guy.
Oh yes.
Heavily involved, among other things, in black projects over the last 30, 40 years.
Absolutely.
And his work has been one of my foundations for claiming that hyperdimensional physics leads to hyperdimensional technologies.
Which can manipulate things that mainstream physics can only dream of.
Indeed.
Have you had any further communication from him?
No, I've not.
Now, in truth, I have not really tried, because I kind of want to let things cool down.
I know.
It was kind of like a, don't call me, I'll call you again.
Exactly.
And I've been here working on this problem, which to some people may look like some kind of a diversion.
No.
Let me tell you why it's not, alright?
I want to close a couple of loops on the circle business.
Sure.
If we are looking at a former sophisticated civilization, which was the closing tag on tonight's show on Fox, that even though Zahi may protest, the evidence from other people, when you collect it all, you can't ignore profound possibilities that we are not the first, and that others went down this road that we're going down, and made the mistakes that we're making, and tried to leave us Signposts.
To not make all those mistakes.
To maybe change the game plan.
Do something different.
Figure it out.
You know, get smarter quicker than we did.
Of course, it is your view, I believe, that some people have already figured this out.
Some people already know what the warnings are.
I believe so.
And what happened way back when.
And I think that they are concerned that it might happen again.
And I'm coming slowly to that model myself, and I don't want to get premature here, but one of the reasons that this circle business in Miami is so critical is that taken to the max, and I know I'm going to get a lot of weird emails now and a lot of strange people saying, oh, he's done it again, you know, like Reagan used to say.
I think if the dating of what else is on this little two acres is correct, if there is a 60-foot shaft that you can't dig at the mouth of the ocean now because the ocean is a few feet down, but could only have been dug between 10,000 and 13,000 years ago, remember the dating of tonight's show.
Remember Vivaldi's dating of the importuning of the information into Egypt circa 10,500 B.C.?
Remember the date of 12,000 to 13,000 mentioned in the show?
Remember that if there was a previous epic, that's when it would have had its catastrophe, sweep it away, except for little bits and pieces here and there.
I'm becoming convinced that the Miami Circle, a la this American Stonehenge, is part of a larger puzzle that was in place here at the mouth of the Miami River when it wasn't the mouth, when it was well inland, because the ocean was several, you know, miles to the east, out by Bimini, and you could walk to Bimini.
Richard, is all of this, is all of this in your opinion a message or a machine, or both?
When you say this, which this?
Well, when you look at what's at Giza, and you look at the Miami Circle, and you look at all of these artifacts, And you imagine that something went tragically wrong a long time ago.
A lot of people refer to what's at Giza, the Great Pyramid, and the rest of it as a machine.
We need to do a show with Stan Tennant on the Giza Complex and the Pyramid specifically as machines, as technological devices.
And we should bring back Chris Dunn, who wrote the Giza Power Plant book.
Who was interviewed during your, uh, uh, hiatus this past, uh, spring.
Why don't you set it up and we'll do it next week?
Okay.
Because this circle here, which is not a circle.
The circle is the thing in the ground the stones were stuck in.
I believe firmly there's more here.
I've got people standing by with equipment to find it.
And I'm proposing to the Radio With Pictures people that we do a sequel to tonight's show and we do it here in Miami and there may in fact be things deep underground that will put whatever Zahi showed us tonight completely in the shade.
That's tempting.
What you might get them to go for is a special on archaeological sites like this that are actually all over the world and try and tie it all together.
That's something they certainly might go for.
Well, that's the Monk Grid and that's part of the discussion.
I talked with Deborah earlier tonight and she is going to New York and next week I'm going to have a conversation between her and Nancy and some other folks and we'll just keep everyone who helped us save this thing to get all the lawyers shooting at each other so we have time to breathe and do real science We'll keep them apprised of where we are and where we're going.
All right, my friend.
Listen, I want to thank you for being here.
Set up a show for us next week and we'll go exactly there.
Terrific.
All right.
Richard, take care.
Well, dapper Hoagland out.
You dapper Hoagland out.
All right.
It's time to go to bed in Miami anyway.
I'm Art Bell.
This is Coast to Coast AM.
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