Fr. Malachi Martin, a 76-year-old Jesuit exorcist and Vatican advisor since 1965, reveals an 800% surge in demonic possession cases in America since 1970—often triggered by pacts for power or secularism’s erosion of faith. He warns of "perfect possession" victims, untreatable until they reject evil outright, and ties Vatican corruption to Luciferian infiltration post-Second Vatican Council (1962–1965). The Antichrist will exploit humanity’s crises, like economic collapse, before Christ’s sudden return, while demons manipulate souls subtly, not through crude threats. Martin dismisses myths like Heaven’s Gate’s "space aliens" as heresy but confirms cloning’s ethical ambiguity, urging moral discernment. Faith endures even as institutional Christianity weakens, signaling a coming reckoning where divine truth will prevail over secular deception. [Automatically generated summary]
From the high desert in the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening or good morning as the case may be across this great land and beyond, from the Tahitian and Hawaiian Island chains, eastward across flyover country to the Caribbean and the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north all the way to the Pole, and worldwide on the internet.
This is Close A.M. and I'm Mark Bell.
Good morning.
You are about to meet one of the most powerful men on the face of the earth.
I'm certain he would not describe himself that way.
The dark shadows of skyscrapers are falling across New York as an elderly white-haired priest leaves the reassuring comfort of his home, heads through the streets toward the apartment block where the others are waiting.
He walks quite slowly, carrying a small block case filled with the essential paraphernalia of the ritual he is about to perform.
The room has been prepared to his precise instructions.
Cleaned, sprinkled with holy water, stripped of movable objects.
Of those now gathered inside, only the priest, his face drawn and solemn, has any idea what to expect, or rather who to expect.
After 30 years, as an exorcist, Father Malachi Martin has learned to recognize the nature of the demons he pursues.
They may be ingenious or stupid, coarse or charming, brazen or craven.
Hell, it seems, is no place for stereotypes.
I need to know who they are, their names, and their stories.
Father Martin is Irish-born.
Father Martin was in the Vatican, advised to popes, and I would like to let him tell you about himself.
Why would you choose to live in such a big, bustling, dirty, difficult city when you could have at any time in your adult life gone to a soft Midwestern town where things are moving a little slower?
Well, my history in the church generally was because I became, at 18, I entered a religious order called the Jesuits in Ireland.
The war had just broken out.
It was 8th of September 1939.
And I went through the basic training of two years.
And believe it me, it was a basic training.
They shaved your head and took away your nice clean clothes and gave you old patched clean clothes and took away your Bilkrim and your Eaude Colon.
And they put you to bed at about a quarter to ten and got you up at a quarter to five and fed you like a gamecock.
And you didn't study one book for two years.
They concentrated on training your will and analyzing it.
they cut your will down, they dissected it into its component part and examined it and found out if they could live with it and could you conform to the rules and if so then they sort of fused those parts together with an ideology and then shot you out like a missile to study and to labor and to work.
What you have just described I'm sure was even tougher than certainly what I went through.
I was in the Air Force and I went through basic training at Lackland and their job was to almost try and break you, maybe that's the wrong way to put it, in other words they would instill in you discipline and if you could not conform you were out of there.
It was the same thing basically in basic training.
For instance, the first job I had, it was always physical labor with an amount of spiritual reading and contemplation.
The first physical job I had, I was cleaning 300 glasses, tumblers, you know, for drinking water.
And have you ever tried to clean 300 glasses by hand?
No dishwasher.
This is all done by hand.
And in the middle of that labor, a little labor, a young novice like me but a second year man came in and said, "Brother Martin, you need it outside in the garden." So, just for the, I went outside in the garden and I was given a hoe.
My wife was grown with moss and I was ordered to clean the parts.
And in the middle of that, Brother Walsh, the master of works, the other novice came and said, "Brother Martin, what are you doing here?" I said, "I'm hoeing the moss." He said, "Didn't I tell you to clean the glasses this morning?" And of course, my first reaction was, "Yes, bud." Yes, bud.
Because the mind, they left the mind almost go fallow.
You never studied for two years, having studied intensively until I was 18, to get all my exams and matriculation and studying Hebrew and Greek and Latin and geography and math and physics and logic and history and geography and the whole gamut of things we used to learn in school those days.
They let everything go fallow.
You read spiritual books, yes, but no, you learn nothing.
The road in my case, I'm sure it varies with every individual, but the road in my case was simply that, at a certain age of 21, 21 and a half, my superior said, "We want you to train." in semitic languages because those are the languages in which the bible was written mainly hebrew and aramaic sure but there are other allied languages that are useful like qaraonic Egyptian, and Syriac, and South Semitic, and Arabic,
etc., and Abyssinian, or Ethiopian, as we used to call it then.
So they sent me to university, and I studied it for four years.
And at the end of that, they said, all right, now you must study philosophy.
So then they sent me to a school of philosophy for three years.
And it was nothing but rational philosophy, period.
And after that, they said, well, now we want to want to find out, can you teach?
So they sent me teaching little boys, French and Greek, little boys between the ages of 12 and 14, for three years.
And then they said, okay, now you must do theology.
So they gave me four years theology in Belgium, where there was nothing but theology, morning, noon, and night in an international house.
And then they said, after that, okay, now you must get a doctorate in Semitic languages, Oriental art, and history.
And then they gave me four years of that.
And at that point, then they said, all right, you are now posted to the Vatican to teach there as a philosopher as a professor.
Father, were you at some point, I mean, obviously there are so many Jesuits, and somebody at some point must have looked at you or put their hand on you and said, you have a special path to follow, even within the church, and started you down that particular path.
You see, every month in the old system, it's changed now with the Jesuits, but in the old system, every month the superior, the local superior, sent in a speculum.
What they call a speculum.
A speculum is the Latin for mirror.
It's a report on Brother X, Brother Martin, Brother Kelly, whoever he is, each one.
And those are put together according as you advance, year after year, within the order.
And at the end of it all, they call you in and say, listen, this is what people have been saying about you all along.
The decisions in your regard were made on account of these facts, and they were accountable for Mr. Piri had said about you.
And it's that accumulation of facts, a profile, what we now call a profile.
We didn't call it a profile then, we call it a speculum, a mirror of the man.
That is what inclines them to mark you out as useful.
And of course, their use of you was always made in view of your talents.
There were some men with me who were brilliant mathematicians, but couldn't say bonjour.
I guess we're trying an experiment here, folks, and we've got a kind of a little thing over the telephone trying to eliminate the pops and the P's and so forth, but it seems to be moving around.
As long as the good Lord gives me the strength and there's work to be done and people to be helped and people to be counseled and consoled and strengthened.
And I'll tell you, the particular avocation that I follow, the need for ministration in these matters Has only increased.
For instance, I've been working in the field of exorcism in the northeast corner since 1970.
I came over in 1975, but by 1970 I was hard at work.
These occurrences and happenings, people needing help, needing administration, counseling, needing exorcism.
The number, these mere numbers alone, the number has increased by about 800%.
And then we have new phenomena that we never met that time.
For instance, we now have a series of 20-somethings and 30-somethings, mainly men, but some women, but mainly young men, successful men in brokerage, in medicine, in science, in architecture, in politics, who come and say, look, Father, I wanted such and such a thing.
I wanted a job.
I wanted a salary.
I wanted a position in this university.
I wanted that lady, that woman.
And I finally, in my desperation, I made a pact with the devil, and I got what I wanted, but now he won't let me go.
Please, please, please, somebody says, ask Father Martin if the exorcist movie is not, in fact, based on incidents that occurred at St. Louis University, a Jesuit school in the early 70s.
I'm a graduate of that school, and the folklore has it that there is an abandoned room at the top of Dubork Hall, which was the site of an exorcism which ultimately culminated at St. Francis Xavier Church.
Georgetown New, the home of the protagonist from the Exorcist, also happens to be a Jesuit school.
Please ask him if there is any tie-in and if he has seen the room at Duboric Hall at SLU.
In fact, that exorcism was the landmark exorcism in America.
And it's been published in a repertorial form by a man called Thomas Allen, published by Doubleday a couple of years ago.
And it's a harrowing story.
It's a harrowing story because for, I think it was two years or over, these two Jesuit priests, unknown to their confrères, their brethren, in the same house, had to pursue this gruesome and awesome task of liberating a young man who was liberated completely.
And their brethren, their colleagues, never knew anything about it.
They just knew these two men were on special assignment.
And the only sign the community had was at the very end when it was all over.
The Jesuits at that time used to recite prayers at night, mainly the litany of the saints.
And that night, when they finally staggered home for the night prayers and it was all over, inside in the chapel, the community chapel where they were praying, there was a sudden lightsome vision of Michael the Archangel in triumph.
Momentary, everybody saw it.
And the actual authors, the people who participated in that exodus, said that their colleagues were all philosophers, men plunged in philosophic thought and scientific research, looked up and saw this magnificent spectacle and couldn't make out what it all meant because they had known nothing about what was going on.
There is no way, there is no way you can convey to anybody who hasn't been through it this very upsetting sensation of being in the presence of a possessing demon.
The only parallel might be, I suppose, if you once faced certain death, unless something were to happen.
A wild animal ready to claw you to death, or a killer, about to execute you.
But see, those don't even convey it, because the dominant reaction the human frame, the human soul has in an exorcism is this.
You know, but you know for certain, that something out there hates you.
Hates you personally.
You are the object of hate.
A lion about to tear you to bit nearly once a meal.
Well, once upon a time, when in the Catholic Church, the science of exorcism, the skill, the exercise of exorcism, was something passed on very carefully from generation to generation within each diocese.
There was a school of thought.
An old exorcist would talk with the bishop and say, well, I know young Father so-and-so, and he seems to have the character and the disposition to pick up where I leave off.
Well, that is the prime question being asked today.
And Catholics will say, when they study it, they will say, well, God is not giving the grace, his grace, his favor.
There's an entity, a thing he gives called grace.
It helps you to overcome temptation.
It helps you to be good.
It helps you to help your fellow man and to do your duty.
If he withdraws that grace, and it's a supernatural entity, it's a supernatural ability, if he withdraws that from you because you're unworthy of it, then my friend, you can't act virtuously.
You fall.
And the terrible thing is that once you lose that faith, once you lose that grace, you don't get it back automatically by saying, help me.
you don't well father if this is happening to the church yet and if the need for exorcisms has arisen eight hundred percent You can picture our difficulty out.
That is about the lugubriand there have been There is an intense war, and we are losing battle after battle.
Now, we have a promise from Christ that ultimately we will win the war, or he will win it.
But we're losing battle after battle.
And it's obvious in everyday happenings, and it's obvious in the way our prelates and some of our priests are behaving, and in the dissolution of what was once a monolithic institution, an organization.
Now, all the while I'm talking about the organization art, the actual organization.
Once upon a time, it was the premier monolithic organization, which withstood everything for 2,000 years.
It is no longer there.
We are in deep doo-doo.
We really are.
I make a joke about it because it's a very painful fact for me.
It took merely 30 years, ostensibly, since 1965, for this disruption To take place, but now we know that the rot, the change, started way back at least 100 years ago.
We destroyed an entire way of life, religious way of life, which produced saints and zealous people that did an awful lot of good for so many families, Catholic and non-Catholic.
And we didn't know what we were doing.
We were experimenting with what they call the human potential.
Their argument to the nuns was, you must fulfill your total potential.
And fulfilling their total potential meant that they laid aside their religious habits and they got married or had dates and went through the normal crisis.
But the result was that they lost the grace of their religious vocation and closed their schools.
This was an exorcism in the northeast corner of America, to leave the location actually anonymous at the moment.
Because actually, in all this matter, whenever we talk about it to people outside the circle of exorcists and outside the actual exorcism itself, we are bound by laws of privacy that are very strict.
You'd be surprised at how sensitive people are.
They don't want the people in the office to know they've been exorcised.
Sometimes they don't want their wife to know, or their husband to know, or their family to know.
What it does to the exorcist in the long run, it deprives him of sleep.
After a major exorcism, you never sleep deeply for a couple of weeks.
You don't participate in a good meal, you know, and enjoy the food.
No, you can't.
You just can't.
Something is being cut out of you.
And I must say I agree with that old exorcist who told me years ago when I was a young man of 27 in Cairo and later on in Rome, look, young man, a bit of you is going to die every time you do an exorcism.
Some portion of you is going to die and go away to God and wait until you die and go to the other side.
And it's true.
Something does die in you.
And there are parallels to that.
I mean, any mother or father who really gives to their children and wields them well and invests love and affection and interest in them, you know, you give them something you can't get back and you don't want it back.
Well, normally, this particular young man, the family was sufficiently well off to let him give up his job.
He was a broker.
He was in brokerage.
And they could take the time off.
And it was session after session.
And then he would relapse into normalcy and say, what have I been doing to you people?
And we just say, well, this is what's happening.
his mother and father and his brother would explain to him but the the terrible thing was that his the demon possessing him They vary in quality and they vary in function.
And by the way, the only way you have of identifying demons is by their function.
And that function is a distortion of an angelic function because originally they were all angels before they fell in revolt and rebelled against God and were condemned to hell, and condemned to be demonic for the rest of their existence in eternity.
This particular demon was the demon of the desecration of human love.
And in his paroxysm of possession, this young man would give violent and heart-rending descriptions of contempt for the human act of love, For the act of a mother's love?
Of a mother for her children, of a father for her children, parents, of lovers, love of your Country, but it's the desecration of human love.
And if only some people could realize how contemptuous the demon is of our human love making, whether it's parents and our lovers or whatever, married people.
Well, in most depictions on the silver screen of contempt for love, as there was in The Exorcist, there's just horribly degrading demonstrations of physical disregard for the human sexual act or sexuality.
You have established his name, the name he wants to be called by, or it wants to be called by.
We all say he, because that's a general pronoun in English, which means anything, is she or it.
Yes.
And you know the name, and you say, well, then why are you torturing this young man?
Why are you twisting his lips and filling his mind?
And then there follows a stream of language which nobody would permit to be said on the air as such.
But the idea was that, well, he has become an instrument of real degradation for physical love and for the love of his parents and the love of his brothers.
Father, how would a psychiatrist delineate between, and I certainly understand what you're saying about the symptoms this man had, between a true psychological difficulty and something that goes a step beyond that that require that you be called in.
And this is what the good psychiatrists, whether they're Christian or Jewish or believers or unbelievers, where they send patients to us.
We get them every week letters from a psychiatrist in Illinois, wherever, saying, I have such and such a patient, and he or she wants to come and see you because.
And then what they always find is this, that there is a normal pattern for various mental afflictions, mental troubles that are listed in the diagnostic book published by the American Psychiatric Association.
But then there are a series of phenomena that don't respond to anything.
And when they meet those phenomena, for instance, the person starts speaking suddenly a foreign language.
There is a story about that marvelous saint who went to, was assigned to a convent in France in the 1700s because there was a nun there saying she had visions of Jesus.
And his name was Claude de la Clombier, a Jesuit.
And he spoke with this young nun, Margaret Mary, and she said, well, Jesus told me to spread this devotion, a particular type of devotion to him.
And he said, well, the next time Jesus comes to see you, sister, ask him to tell you the last mortal sin I committed.
It was a test.
So he went away, and he only visited the convent once a month.
And when he came back the next month, he heard the confession of all the nuns.
And then Sister Margaret Mary came in, and he heard her confession and absorbed it.
Then he said to her, did you Jesus come?
She said, yes.
He said, did you ask him the question, what was my last mortal sin?
To prove to me that it was him and you're not being deceived by the devil.
She says, yes, I did ask him.
But he said he has forgotten it because he has forgiven the sin.
Oh, yes, very quickly after the third or fourth session.
You knew that you were up against one of the boys, one of the real background boys, and you know it.
And besides that, then, after this peculiar thing that happened to you, look, you and I are talking at the present moment.
I've never seen your face except on television, I saw it one.
But we've been talking, all right?
And we've been communicating.
And my voice strikes your ear, and your voice strikes my ear.
And the sounds enter in, and they convey the concepts to me.
And we talk, we exchange, okay?
Verbally, we're exchanging.
But at the same time, you and I, being adults, we know that once we really converse and you and I have conversed and are conversing, there's an upper level conversation between us, brain to brain, soul to soul.
We're communicating something beyond words, of which words are the vehicle.
So it's very, very quickly then what you're up against.
And I suppose it must be very sobering, even for somebody who has done what you have done, to realize you are up against something very strong, very serious.
During the course of an exorcism of the kind you talked about, is it directly encountering this evil demon, or is it half that and half psychology and half sort of a brainwashing of the victim of this evil entity?
I would be interested when we come back, relax for a moment, Father, in when you know you've got him, that moment after a year and a half, when you know you've got him, and how you know that.
If you've ever wanted to meet the exorcist, this is your morning.
He is Father Malachi Martin.
He has been doing exorcisms for 30 years.
We'll get back to him in just a moment.
I'm Art Bell, and this, of course, is CBC.
All right, back now to Father Malachi Martin.
Father, Harot, how do you know, Father, when you have arrived at that moment when you have him, when you have found the weakness in this evil, and you can cause it to leave?
Yes, its power properly has been broken, because the will, the will stays firmly anti-God and full of hate and full of filth, real filth, filth that's disgusting.
There comes a moment when you almost hear, and sometimes you do hear, what would be described in human language as a yowl of pain, a real groan, but it sometimes has a physical analogue coming from the mouth of the possessed person.
Yes, probing and tempting each other and threatening each other.
You by commands, it by suggestions.
And it takes, I remember listening to a young exorcist tackle a demon once and interrupting him and pushing him aside because he was beginning to answer questions put to him by the demon.
And the psychologists we've had present register everything, heartbeat and pulse and everything else.
And they say there's a dramatic change in all those things that takes place at that moment of resolution.
But it's chiefly what always struck them was this sudden transformation of the person from being an ugly, distorted, misshapen face and tortured and with filthy language and sometimes filthy smells and filthy cold atmosphere or stinky hot atmosphere.
All is suddenly over.
It's like as if the storm was over and the sun was rising and in an upland scene and God is in heaven and all is right with the world, to use the words of Robert Browning.
Why ever anybody at all is something else and what does the demon get out of it?
And why do they want to leave once they're there?
First of all, why me?
We tried art.
We did our best over a period of years.
And with all the data at our disposal, we had a very good database, as we see nowadays in our computer language, to create a profile of the possessible person.
Yeah, we said about recording age, education, economic condition, father and mother, siblings, location, where were they born, where they go to school, kindergarten, what is their history.
And usually you get all their history from their parents or their friends or their wife or their husband or whatever it is.
You assemble all that and you try and create a profile, their language.
What languages do they know?
Where have they traveled?
And what were their companions?
What habits have they got?
Have they dabbled in their culture?
What?
You assemble all that.
And you know what we found?
What?
With about, oh, I'd case 700 cases where we profile them.
In fact, between you and me And the Holy Spirit, as we say, most of the big, big exorcisms we've done are very well-off, well-eviled people, well-educated people.
No, but then we have a whole galaxy of ordinary people working, clerical workers, blue-collar workers, factory workers, road workers, construction workers of all types, faiths, and descriptions.
There's no profile.
We tried it.
We tried every possible balancer.
And we had a statistician working with us.
And she was great.
She knew exactly what to do with statistics and database facts.
That's the first thing.
Why me is it's your particular fault.
Because, by the way, nobody is ever possessed or obsessed unless they say yes.
I was a smoker and I was addicted and I said yes to it.
It's like I had a marriage case a few years ago where they were breaking up and they were engaged and they were supposed to get married and they came to me because they were breaking up and I knew them.
I knew both their families.
And the confrontation went something like this.
He said, well, I didn't ask to fall in love with you.
And you kissed me on the cheek and you held my hand and you went to bed with me.
You did everything to fall in love with me.
You said yes to me.
And now you want to renege on that yes.
And she needs compensation.
I don't know what she wants.
I forget the details of it.
I prefer not to recount them in public.
But the point is that saying yes is a very, very easy thing to do, to drink, to cocaine, to elicit love, to licit love.
We say yes in various ways.
You haven't got to say YES, you know.
It's very easy.
So same way, I find, for instance, that if I use an Ouija board, I get answers.
And I follow those answers and I profit by it.
It helps me.
Or I find that if I have a seance with certain people in a coven, and they don't call themselves a coven, but they're very nice people, but they do consult the spirits.
And I find I get consolation from it and encouragement, and I slowly enter into a compact.
unidentified
I never say I will make a pact with you, but de facto I do.
That because of my beliefs, I must believe, I must conclude that my Lord Jesus Christ, in whom I believe, and who is for me the source of all power, has used them in their innocence and their faith to cure people outside the reach of, say, a Catholic priest like me.
But, I mean, he has done Trojan work in this matter.
And I cannot imagine that any demon would obey him unless Jesus gave this man the power.
And that was the grace of my Lord Jesus Christ that has helped him do that.
And these are people who have nothing to do with Catholicism or with some of them with Christianity.
But it has worked.
But I have that experience, and I can't deny it.
And actually, there's an old principle in Catholic theology which says, deus non allegata sacramentis in Latin, which means that God is not bound by sacraments as such when he wants to be free of them.
Normally he does use them.
He does use his priests, but he can use his powers wherever he wants to.
And I've seen that power used for good.
And I must conclude that it is the grace of my Lord Jesus.
But once you get, once you come in contact with the source, Jesus, the Lord Jesus, and his life and his church, then you have the obligation in conscience to search and ask.
Because, you know, it's like the rich young man in the Gospels that he came to Jesus and said, Look, I've observed the commandments all my life.
Jewish commandments, the Torah, and the 613 precepts.
What else need I do?
And Jesus looked at him and loved him, the Gospel says, and said, Okay, sell what you have, give it to the poor, and come follow me.
And the young man went away sad because he had many possessions.
And it's a mirror of what does happen with a lot of people.
They see what they should do, but they can't give up that particular thing they love.
They can't renounce what is bad in their lives, of course, repellent, and therefore they can't accept his grace.
Then you see the terrible thing about it, that if you make the deal and live up to it, here's the thing that gives a chill to my spine, and probably what you're talking about in your case.
If you are totally faithful, put it like that, to your agreement, if you're totally faithful to it, you will be helped by the demon to a certain degree or a great degree.
Well, Father, there's a lot of people out there right now who are probably quaking as they listen to this because they're doing well one way or the other.
And I'm sure at some point in their life, they've said to themselves, they thought, you know, I'd just about do anything to have the following.
You see, the normal person that comes to us, or the person that comes to us normally, is somebody tortured.
And his psychologist or his psychiatrist or his parents or somebody says, look, you better go and consult a priest about this because it's nothing to his mental.
And he does.
And he is imperfectly possessed.
He or she is imperfectly possessed.
But the perfectly possessed person is utterly calm.
They're angry with confidence.
They eschew all reference to being helped.
They don't want help.
They're quite happy.
And you learn to recognize them.
And when you recognize them, you run like a rabbit.
Back now to Manhattan, New York, and Father Malachi Martin.
Father, I've got a fax here that I would like to read to you and get a response if I could.
It says, the father said something earlier that really bothered me.
He was talking about the successful guys who made these packs to be successful, and I want to ask something.
Please ask for me.
I've been going downhill financially for two years.
It doesn't look like it's going to get any better.
I could have filed bankruptcy a long time ago, but I have an ethical problem with that, and I believe it's the Lord's will for me to stiff my creditors, not stiff them that way.
But it's getting to the breaking point.
I've pleaded with and nagged the Lord, but he hasn't seemed to want to change anything.
It just keeps getting worse.
About a week ago, I was sitting at my computer, and I had this thought.
I'd sell my soul to get out of debt.
I dismissed the thought, but the fact that I had it really bothered me and still does.
Whoever he or she is, let them listen to this very carefully.
The only reason you repel that idea, the only reason that you choose not to follow that and you were offended by the mere suggestion of it in your mind, that means that the Lord Jesus is in possession of your soul.
And I suppose if this person's life were to change around and they were to suddenly begin doing quite well, then the question would be more intense and more worrisome than ever before.
It is, there's no doubt about it, a significant event.
Here's what I said before, what I think still, and this I give out as my personal interpretation of the human events of our day.
It's this.
That if between the end of winter, which is now the end, I think, and the end of this spring, which is in May, roughly and approximately, there is a great abnormal sign in our human skies, it's not merely the comet, which is a marvelous thing, there's no doubt about it, but something really truly abnormal that makes the whole world stop for an instant, or longer than an instant.
Then in that case, if anybody has any faith, let them take it out of his pocket and polish it up, they will need it because there is coming shortly after that, if that takes place, there is coming shortly after that, a series of events that will fire not merely floods, not merely earthquakes, not merely diseases, but something far worse than that.
If nothing happens, if it's just the comet and the heavens gate event, and that's our business, then okay, there's no immediate pressure of events.
That's my interpretation of it.
So that's why I say keep your eyes on the skies, because it will be visible.
Like in 1938, there was this peculiar display of lights, which we now know was not.
At that time, the scientists said, oh, this is Aurora Borealis.
And of course, we now know it wasn't Aurora Borealis.
And by the way, that night, that night in August 1938, Hitler, Adolf Hitler himself, was in the Wolf's Lair at Desper's Garden, this secret hideaway he had.
He was there with his chief people, Goering and Goebbels and Himmler and their aides.
And they watched this phenomenon of light, brilliant light.
And you know what Hitler said?
He said, gentlemen, this means we now go to bloodshed.
Hitherto, by that time, by the way, he had taken Czechoslovakia and Austria and the Sudetenland, and he was well in his way to be a powerful figure.
And he hadn't shed really blood.
No German blood really shed.
But this time, looking at this, this man instinctually, Who is possessed, by the way.
He said, Now, this is the sign that we have to shed blood, gentlemen.
Whoever wrote that, it's not the first time they've talked about this subject, and they know, I think, much more than they're putting into those simple lines.
There is a programming system, to put it very briefly, developed since the Second World War, based on the experiments Nazi doctors carried out at Hitler's command to achieve total mind control.
There is now in vogue a system of programming, and it is, I was going to say, devilish in its efficiency.
It is almost unbreakable.
It is so unbreakable that when you so programmed one of your programs, because you have a whole list of programs corresponding to the letters of the Greek alphabet, alpha, beta, delta, down to omega, one of the programs is a program to prevent you to be deprogrammed.
In other words, I mean, I've had somebody sit in my consulting room and say to me, Father, if that phone rings now and the voice mentions two words and they wrote the words down for me, then I will go and do what I'm told to do according to my programming, that I've been programmed.
And they were programmed at the age of two.
They were reinforced to program at the age of seven and 14.
And finally, the entire programming was achieved at 21, age 21.
And there are literally hundreds, probably thousands, who have been programmed.
And we had hours of very serious conversation about this.
And my wife's view is that we are meant to live out, not to mask with drugs, even in the final moments, but to live out our life as it has been dealt to us or as God or our Creator intends for us to live it out.
And if that means suffering, then that's what must be.
But I have a duality, a kind of schizoid view on suicide.
And it is as follows.
In other words, I would not, I believe her, and I believe that is correct, that we should play out this hand where dealt.
But my political view, Father, is that of a libertarian.
In other words, it seems to me that the government, the church aside for a second, the government has no right to make laws that would get between a person and their decision about their own life.
I do not believe that human governments have anything to say to the inner decisions of a man or woman.
Those decisions must be made in the light of their religious education and their religious tradition.
But the last thing in the world that I want to interfere with that is government.
They should have nothing to do with it.
And one of the difficulties, for instance, let's not go into a wide field of discussion, one of the difficulties of the abortion discussion today in America is that it's become politized.
On that point, the significant people would say yes.
That is the ideal.
Whether people achieve that is something else.
But I'll tell you this much.
Christ must abhor.
He abhors a lot of things, I think, that are bad.
But one thing he must abhor are his politicking clergy, a politicking priest.
He was put to death by them.
He paid the price for that.
And politicking clergy, politicking prelates have been the cause of so much misery for Christians, for Catholics, for believers, that they are abhorrent to me too.
That particular prophetic, that particular prophetic fact, excuse my addiction, is based on a private revelation which churchmen have accepted,
which the Roman churchmen have accepted, made in various places in the year 1846 in La Salette, France, and in Catema, Portugal, in 1917, and then at various other places since then.
And it concerns the arrival of a final chastisement, a punishment from God, to purify men and women and prepare them for entry into heaven.
Not rapture-like, according to the normal one evangelical theory, but actually the end of the world.
It's not exactly around the corner art.
at the time when a figure called the Antichrist is abroad, and it's a very complicated issue, the whole thing, but the actual danger itself during those three days of total darkness over the earth,
the dimming of the sun completely, and no light, it's a time when the last efforts of the demons to run our lives and to rescue, take souls away from the salvation that Christ has worked out.
Now, this brings up the whole question of function of angels and demons.
We must touch on that some other time together and go into it.
Otherwise, a lot of this talk is unintelligible to a lot of people, not even intelligent.
But that's the idea of those three days of darkness.
It's spiritual darkness.
It's a spiritual danger in that darkness and will not be pleasant from all the accounts we have.
Yes, the Antichrist is alive, not active as the Antichrist.
He cannot die in the normal way, and he will come forth at the right time, the right time being the time appointed within God's general providence for the human race.
The belief, the Christian, fundamental Christian belief is as follows.
God decided to create this world, this cosmos, of planets and stars and of Earth in particular.
And he decided that he would create on that particular planet, this small little planet, by the way, he decided to create a race of men and women that would have bodies that were mortal and would have spirits that were eternal and immortal.
Now, the nature of God in Christian theology is such that he simply doesn't himself do things directly.
He does it through agents, through emissaries.
He always acts with secondary causes, as they say.
A primary cause, such as God, acts through secondary causes.
Now, he decided to confide the direction and the care and the running of this complicated universe of ours, this complicated earth of ours.
He decided to confide that to a special series of beings he would create, namely angels.
And they were created too, but they had no bodies, only souls.
And of course, will and intellect and memory and imagination of an intellectual kind.
And they would have care and direction of this human race.
But there was one outstanding fact about this human race that he let the angels know about, namely that he himself would allow his son to become a member of the human race.
And therefore, that the angels would have to adore somebody with a body who was human, who was mortal.
And one particular angel, the chief angel, whose name in scripture is given as Lucifer, Son of the Dawn, said, no, I haven't got a mortal body.
So the angels, therefore, the bad angels, were therefore expelled from God's presence.
But they still had a function.
They were still by nature destined to work with men and women.
And they still are tied to the destiny of this cosmos.
And this earth in particular, this particular planet.
They're tied to that by destiny.
But now their destiny is to try and snatch man's allegiance, woman's allegiance, from Christ, from God.
And hence we have this entire battle of good and evil.
Yes, we do.
And there's no doubt about it, Arc, between you and me and the Holy Spirit to invoke that saying again, that in this world, as adults, we finally know it's either Christ or Lucifer.
By the way, I use the word name Lucifer much more than Satan.
Satan is a general term, by the way.
It means, in Hebrew, it means adversary.
That's all it means.
Whereas, when you do exorcisms, you find out that there are two demons, there are many other demons, but there are two demons, one who responds to the name of Lucifer, and he's the big huncher, he's the big banana.
And there's another one who's not as big, but very important, called Satan.
This has been studied and argued over since about the third century A.D. That's about almost 1500, 1700 years.
And as far as you can find out from reading all the people who have written about it and meditated about it and saints and theologians and the churches, today's churches, the idea is this.
Sure, God could create a race of beings who would never commit sin, who would never revoke, who would be his completely.
unidentified
But apparently, God likes certain things above other things.
So then our God may have ego, may wish to be worshipped in that manner, but we may not, and certainly you as a Catholic priest may not, for that would be a sin on my part.
And that, by the way, is the most difficult thing to do.
And by the way, I think you know and I know, I know in my own way and you know in your way because you're fully, you've lived life fully, there's nothing so beautiful, there's nothing so attractive, there's nothing so sweet as somebody who says to you, look, sure, you know, I like you.
You're beautiful, you're good in your own way and attractive.
But I choose you merely because I choose you.
I want to be with you and not with somebody else.
That's right.
And somebody says, I love you, and it's not because you've got a beautiful body or much money in the bank or a rich family or whatever, whatever, but simply, you know, I just like you.
And whether it's a little dog that does it to you or a man or a woman, it hits our heart immediately to be the object of free choice by somebody who can walk away from you.
And that's why I must confess to you, Art, that after all the exorcisms and all the mutt and the dirt and everything else, the thing that demons abhor is almost a cliché for us, true human love.
They indulge in the most terrible and contemptuous language to show their smirking contempt and despisement of it.
Father, every time, and there are many tragedies that occur, I report on them as a talk post.
People killing people, suicides, children, tossing children out of windows and all that.
Every time that happens, I get a fact from a fellow named Mark who declares himself to be an atheist.
And he will inevitably say, if God is so great and so powerful, why in the world would he allow Hitler, for example, to murder over six million innocent people?
I mean, it's a frightening thing for the gentle Christ to say that.
And it's the truth.
There are things that happen.
We deplore them.
I deplore the whole Shoah, the Holocaust.
I deplore the little boy, Dayton Bennett, who was just beaten and starved by his mother progressively until finally she went to the hospital with a dead body.
Now she's up, she's being hauled in, accused allegedly of murder.
It does seem to be that.
Why does God allow that?
And you know what a priest like me has to do in a case like that?
I say to Christ, please unite Dayton's, and I did, Dayton's sufferings with your sufferings to save souls.
It's something that poured out of me or had to come out of me.
I've been a talk show host doing this radio show in its present incarnation for about 13 years.
And I have found that in every single human area of endeavor, socially, economically, politically, the weather, earth changes, our ecology, which is going absolutely crackers, in every area of human endeavor, things are moving faster exponentially.
And I began to talk about it on the radio, and finally I gave it a name, and I called it The Quickening, and everybody was asking me, well, what do you mean, The Quickening?
And I've answered it a million times.
Finally, I sat down and I wrote a book, Father.
I'm just a talk show host.
I documented what I mean by The Quickening, I think, rather well in this book that's coming out.
East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Father Malachi Martin.
unidentified
Hi, Father.
This is Liz Anne calling you.
I was really interested.
I've talked to my, or tried to talk to the priest in my parish about this.
And I was interested in your thoughts and your teachings about the scriptures' warnings of false prophets.
And also, I'm noticing a number of people, particularly on television, and they seem to be like trying, or they're communicating with accuracy, scary enough, with dead spirits, particularly people who've lost relatives.
Like for instance, Edmund Casey is an outstanding example of one power, that is, simply medical knowledge that, I mean, he didn't get from any study from a university.
He had it with a gift.
Or the savons we have.
But these gifts, these preternatural gifts, now are exercised only by demons and those with whom demons communicate, except that there are people like an Edmund Casey, there are people I have known personally, who have what we call psychic gifts of perception.
They will know at a distance.
I have a sister, for instance, who will always know if I'm ill.
And not because I write her a letter.
Just because there is this connection between her and me.
And if I can be attracted to that plateau and exercise those gifts, if I have some of them, and a lot of us have remnants of these in our beings, I can be deceived.
I can be taken over.
And that's why channeling and remote viewing is so dangerous.
Or things like the Ouija board or transcendental meditation, why?
I will at least get his continental breakfast just right now.
unidentified
Well, Reverend Martin, your allegiance to Jesus Christ is inspiring, and I hope I'm not being objectionable to your years of learning and study or unaware of your help to those in need, sir.
This has to do with the cunning and sometimes extremely subtle influence of Lucifer, Satan.
Yes, sir.
Now, dear sir, I have a question, perhaps rhetorical, concerning the Vatican's treaty with Benito Mussolini in 1929 that was negotiated with representatives of the Vatican.
And I said to Art at an earlier exchange this morning that politicking prelates of any kind are abhorrent to God and have nothing really to do with the salvation of Jesus.
Father, I've got an article here entitled, Two Eminent Churchmen Agree that there actually is, this is a shocker to a lot of people, that there are satanic practices going on at the Vatican.
Could that be true?
Yes.
You want to say that?
If I was a lawyer and you were on the witness chair, I'd say, would you say it's out loud?
It is that amongst Luciferian organizations, there is a prophecy that if they can invade the Citadel, and that's their name for the Vatican, they will have power for a thousand years.
I get all sorts of complaints and statements, but when it comes down to brass text across the table, they say, yeah, you're right.
We are in trouble.
We are in trouble.
And we don't know what to do.
And only Christ himself and the Blessed Virgin, his mother, who has a function in all this, can save the organization of the Holy Roman Catholic Church itself.
The church itself is, again, composed of people in a state of grace, and that's the bride of Christ, the mystical body.
And the quickening is the process is this, that finally we're being driven to turn to Christ and say, save us.
You are our God.
You are our Savior.
Show us what we do.
Solve our problems.
Solve our immigration problems.
Solve our refugee problems.
Solve our population problems.
Solve our missile, nuclear missile problems.
Solve our inherent hatred of each other.
Solve our problems because we will commit global suicide if you don't come and save us.
And the quickening, I suppose, is that men are finally going to rush around looking for solutions and finally raise their hands and say, come, save us.
And the church has adopted all that doctrine, you know.
unidentified
And the angel Azazel and how in the newly released transcripts of the Dead Sea Scrolls, it goes into how this particular angel basically corrupted all species.
It answers many questions that people are still scratching their heads over in the evolution of man and the evolution of animals and the evolution of the world from the beginning.
But all I really learnt about virtue and religion, I learned from watching my father and mother.
I didn't know I was watching.
I didn't know I was learning, but I was learning.
Sure.
I learned what anger was, what patience was, what compassion was, what sorrow was, what purity was, what good behavior was, what politeness was, what humanness was.
I imitated everything I saw.
And that's where I really learned it.
So first thing is the example.
The example you give your children.
And number two, there is formal instruction.
I was shocked a few weeks ago when I was about to say Mass in Long Island.
And before Mass, as I was putting on my vestments, several people came up and said, well, I hear that confession, which I did.
And some of them were young, 18 teenagers, 18-year-olds.
And the old people, there was no difficulty.
You give them a penance, they could say the prayers and make an act of confession.
The young people didn't know the act of confession, didn't know how to say, I'm sorry, to God, and didn't know what they, they couldn't have said to Hail Mary or the Our Father.
You know, if you don't instruct people in prayer, how are they going to pray?
So it's instruction, but it's primarily example.
And then there's one more thing, Art, which we have lost completely.
The consciousness of what we can do as parents.
A father or a mother has, according to Christian tradition and Catholic tradition, has the power of giving a blessing to their children.
Literally, a blessing.
It's not quite the blessing a priest gives, but it's more powerful because it's the blessing of a father or a mother.
And how do you do?
You make the sign of the cross on the father with your thumb and say, I bless you.
I give you my blessing as your mother.
I give you my blessing as your father.
And on top of all that, there is this privilege of parents, that Christian parents, that they can ask God for special favors for their children, and God will grant it to a parent when he won't grant it to other people.
He's an African bishop, and he's been, he's engaged at the present moment in a verbal dispute with people in the Vatican because Milingo is a very honest man and he calls a spade a spade.
Sometimes he calls it a bloody shovel, but that's just his manner.
He's almost Irish in that sense, although he's a native African.
And he objects to something Art referred to a short while ago, and one of our speakers, one of our callers referred to, namely the practice of Satanism or Luciferianism amongst Vatican people.
And there's no doubt about it.
It does.
Milingo has emphasized this because he's run up against it because the behavior of Vatican church men in Africa and in Rwanda has not been exemplary.
And Milingo is attacking that.
He's a very honest man, man.
unidentified
Okay.
Also, I was wondering if, now I'm kind of a, well, a lapsed Catholic, I guess.
I am also curious to know, and I'm kind of ignorant when it comes to this, but something to do with a secret that something to do with Statima and the secret.
Yes, the Fatima Secret is something that was written down by the person who received this secret information back in the 1930s and the 20s.
And the person who wrote it down is still alive.
Her name is Lucia, and she's a nun in Spain, in Coimbra.
She's a Carmelite nun.
And it's called the Pope Secret, and it was sent over to the Pope, and according to the instructions that Lucia got, Sister Lucia got from the Blessed Virgin Mary, she says and claims, and we all accept it, it was the Pope of 1960 who was supposed to reveal the secret and follow out the instructions, do what it said.
For one thing, making a long story short, I've had a deep inner knowledge, much like you gentlemen have about certain things, that the Antichrist would rise up through the Catholic Church.
And the whole purpose of it is to turn over the church to Lucifer.
Also, that the Antichrist may not necessarily be male, but may be female.
In addition, I've had a number of what you would call preternatural experiences most of my life.
And I discovered when I was 16 that under certain conditions, I seem to be able to control the weather.
And I wonder, well, I mean, why does the church always say that things that, if, you know, powers like this, they always come from the devil?
We will know by this a series of facts which amounts to the following, that the basic beliefs of Christianity are played down to ground zero and do not matter any longer in the normal life of society and of nations.
Where those who are supposed to be the custodians, supposed to be the administrators of the word and distributors of his grace, where they have stopped all that and have taken to completely secular terms, We'll know it by that.
And rather overnight, art, as far as I can see, the quickening, such a well-chosen word.
It suddenly will dawn on people: hey, hey, this thing has gone completely awry.
There's an in-gathering of people collecting together when they find themselves believing the same thing against the current secularism, the current hedonism, the current corruption.
And at least in my own church art, in the Roman Catholic organization, we now have the spectacle in this country of the underground church.
These are good people who decided that, like Mary Magdalene, they had taken away the body of the Lord and they couldn't find it.
And they wanted valid priests to say valid masses and administer valid sacraments.
And they don't want some person organizing them with Enneagrams or promoting remote viewing in their sermons or advocating completely pornographic sex aid for their children in schools.
I always make that distinction up because there's this firm belief amongst Christians that the body of Christ, composed of those in his grace and the grace of Jesus, whether they're in heaven or in purgatory or on earth, but in a state of grace, that they form his church, as St. Paul calls it, his bride, without spot or wrinkle.
Then there is the organization, the visible organization, supposed to incarnate that.
At the present moment, that organization is going down.
To our regret, it's going down.
There are lots of good people in it, but as an organization, it's going down.
It's like a wood with forest dying out with fresh young saplings.
West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Father Malachi Martin.
unidentified
Hello.
Hi, this is Jack in Seattle.
It's good to talk to you, Father Martin.
I have to be a member of a different faith, but I've always been fascinated when you've been on the show.
The question is, I'm 40 years old, and there's been so much talk, even in my own faith, of this being the last days and the second coming being just around the corner.
And I find I have a really hard time preparing for the future when I think about things like retirement.
I think that the world is not going to be the same when it's time for me to retire.
I have a hard time.
I want to prepare spiritually, but when I think about preparing financially in the way that most people do, it's hard for me.
And, of course, listen, you and I, and I'm sure Art would agree, it's impossible to know what's happening financially because we don't know how the finances of the world are going.
They seem to be marvelous, and then suddenly, you know, Mr. Greenspan speaks, and there are difficulties, and we don't know what the money is going to be like.
There is a quickening also economically, because now we're globalized in everything.
We have now entered a time economically when literally trillions of dollars electronically flash across the world by satellite every night as we sleep, as we wake.
Don't ask me to tell you why I say this or why I speak like this, but not necessarily.
There has to be a sudden preparation for his debut, For his appearance, it must come to the point that we are humanly without a solution of some grave problem that has arisen, which threatens to wipe us all out, which threatens to liquidate human society as we have known it for 2,000 years, and liquidate all of our culture.
We have very little of it left, but we still have a good substantial part of our civilization still standing.
Besides, this is a very good PR job about Lucifer.
I mean, the best spy is somebody you don't know as a spy.
The best enemy in society is the one you don't know as the enemy.
They can work in private.
And the PR job about the devil, you see, Jason, a lot of people depict the devil as an old guy with sloven hoofs and with yellow eyes and a filthy body and his dirty books under his arm.
And it's not that at all.
He's a very, very urbane and polished gentleman, if you want to call him a gentleman.
And he inserts himself very subtly and with skill and never shocking into your soul and your heart.
Father Martin, if people have lost that, they'll have to get it back.
I'll talk to professors and find out if you like that.
Are they giving traditional doctorate?
or are they inventing things?
And then when you go for your I know you won't, with your tender soul.
But in most seminaries today that I know of, in this area and elsewhere, you have three committees to face.
First of all, there's the academic committee, wants to find out have you got your exams?
You know, are you capable of doing the rest of the studies, philosophy and theology, in preparation for priesthood?
Number two, then you have the, and they find out about your health.
You know, are you capable of sustaining the pressures, normally good health?
And thirdly, then there's the spiritual committee, usually headed by a nun, and a nun, a nun, yeah, and with a degree in something.
And they, if they start asking you, you, the prospective seminarian, if they want to know what you think about homosexuality, and if you want to get into the seminary and they ask you that question, don't say you disapprove of it, because then they'll dismiss you as pastorally insensitive.
Secondly, I had the extreme honor, as a soldier of God, I met Mother Teresa.
When she came, if you recall, to the United Nations to accept the Nobel Peace Prize, she asked if they would please melt it down for the precious metals to give to the poor.
And if people want to look to see what good is on earth, she is such a beloved child of God.
I've always wanted to ask a priest this, and since here you are, I'm going to ask.
I think it relates to the life of people like yourself, and it relates certainly to the lives of young women who are in Catholic schools.
There's a joke that goes around that there is no young lady wilder than a young Catholic lady, fresh out of Catholic school or even still in Catholic school.
Question number one, when you said, if I can paraphrase you, sort of paraphrase you, something like that God does not want people to be robots, but to, with free will, accept him or reject him, free will to be good or be bad, et cetera, et cetera.
That sounds to me like a good rationalization for someone who believes in, and of course, as you do, in the God and the devil, et cetera, et cetera.
In other words, I'm trying to say a form of question.
Question number one, isn't that a rationalized way of saying what I would say as a non-believing atheist, that it's just a natural world where there is good and evil.
People are good, people are evil.
Some are good, some are evil, some are in between.
That's question number one.
So, in other words, when you say that God gave us free will to be good or bad, it's taking the natural world as I see it as an atheist and trying to bend it into your theology, explaining it away with your theology.
I would say those human beings wrote it, so human beings made it up to begin with.
Question number two, regards, this is a very interesting article, especially if you wired both of you.
Life on other planets.
In other words, assuming the universe is teeming, as most modern-day astronomers would say, teeming with life and intelligent life in the cosmos, you're seeing that, by the way, that God made the cosmos, especially Earth, as if we are somehow special in God's eyes.
Well, there are many astronomers who would say, based on the numbers and the fact that we've discovered microbial life on Mars and blah, blah, that there's a good chance that there's life elsewhere, yes.
In other words, that life is more common than not.
They might say that, yes, but that they say it actually is teeming with intelligent life is a violent exaggeration.
unidentified
Well, if you look at the numbers, obviously, billions, trillions of galaxies, each with billions, billions of stars, many of them having planets, we've now discovered what, eight other planetary systems besides our own solar system.
Father, if other intelligent life is eventually found equal to or even greater in technological development than ourselves, would this in any way shake your faith in God?
That's a lovely thing to be told in the morning, and thank you very much for telling me that.
unidentified
I can't help it.
You know, it's just you kind of project that.
But my question is this.
You said that the Antichrist, possibly, or maybe even in your mind, certainly, which I don't know that I have an opinion on it, is already born at this point.
No, the nature of Antichrist is such that he does know, he will know, he does know completely who he is, who he comes from, and what he's supposed to do.
Father, the Vatican has a very, very great deal of power.
That's right.
We've talked about it.
They have, whether they admit it or not, a great deal of political power all around the world.
One of the things that they did fairly recently was they muscled, and I do intend to use that word, they muscled their way onto a mountain in Arizona, Mount Graham, and they built an observatory on Mount Graham in connection with an Arizona university.
However, the Vatican has the larger part of the control of this observatory.
Because the attitude, the mentality amongst those who at the higher level, the highest levels of Vatican administration and Vatican geopolitics know that now knowledge of what's going on in space and what's approaching us could be of great import in
Well, what you said earlier about the trees getting old and like new saplings growing, like right before you said that, that like telepathically crossed my mind.
So I just, everyone out there listening, I don't want anybody to lose faith like what you're saying.
I mean, I think there's a new wave underneath this quickening that I think it's like leading towards the creation of like a neo-civilization or something.
My question is, I wanted to know if you were familiar with the story that came by, at least to me, by Hal Lindsay, the evangelical author and prophetical scholar.
But what it says is it goes along the line of what Ed Dames said about us being the garden and the gardeners are going to come back and spade us under.
And so it starts off, it was from a weekly, or you know, like a weekly paper, entertainment paper, and it was there one week and didn't show up the next.
And it's from 1993.
Anyways, it starts off, their present civilization is about to be recycled, spaded under.
Well, I was going to tell you what they said about the Luciferians.
What did they say?
They said the reason for the term true kingdom of God is used repeatedly is because there are many space alien races that through the centuries of this civilization and in civilizations prior have represented themselves to humans as gods.
We refer to them recollectively as Luciferians, for their ancestors fell away from the keeping of the true kingdom of God many thousands of years ago.
They are not genderless.
They still need to reproduce.
They are nothing more than technically advanced humans who have retained some of what they learned while in the early training of the members of the true kingdom of God.
The general comment I have is that it really ought, you know, in my opinion, it was a Christian heresy.
It was a distortion of Christianity.
The timing was made to coincide with the resurrection, the central feast day of Christianity.
They denied completely the normal Christian teaching about the body and the soul.
And they also took refuge in mythical things, such as in that quote that Mike just read to us, and also in what we know of what Applewhite used to say about the upper level and getting rid of the body and things like that.
But commentator said that what the writer was talking about.
He was a South Semitic man writing this sometime about, what, who, about 400, 300 B.C., writing this play about Job in three acts, by the way.
There are three acts in the play, in the book.
But he was drawing on sort of mythical or mythologization of things like the storm and things like dragons resembling the rhinoceros.
They were the biggest animals they knew, rhinoceros and elephants.
unidentified
The other thing I'd like to point out is I get a kick how scientists tend to downplay biblical things in the Bible, and then later it's come to be found to be true, like Noah's Ark and they found the parting of the Red Sea to be actually a probable event.
And therefore, cloning a human being, if I say, oh, I want to clone, I want to clone me so that there's somebody like me, they're going to get 76 years of DNA.
And as you know, DNA decreases with age.
But that they're cloning and are going to clone, I am certain.
I hadn't really considered it deeply, but I've given a certain amount of consideration as this.
If I can get cloning another human being without violating the rules of morality, then in principle, I cannot see what's against it.
It's like once upon a time, for instance, in the 19th century, when people propose lessening the pains of travail in birth, they were told brusquely by the fundamentalists, hey, is she supposed to bring forth her children in pain?
And I want to thank you for having me as your guest.
It is a privilege, and I regard it as something that leaves me.
It's like when I was preparing for it and thinking about it all day yesterday, it's like I was like a schoolboy on the eve of a holiday.
It really was.
I was looking forward to it so much.
And you're very patient, and I do explode my P's and my B's, because I get excited and lift the receiver close to my lips to emphasize as if I need to do that.
That's my fuddy-duddy behavior, and I know you forgive me for it.