Art Bell - 19960619_Art-Bell-SIT-Roger-Morris-Hidden-History-of-Bill-and-Hillary-Clinton
Aired: 1996-06-19
Duration: 02:39:42


=== Good Morning, Globe Listeners (02:17) ===

[00:00:23]  Welcome to Art Bell Somewhere in Time.
[00:00:26]  Tonight, featuring Coaster Coach A.M. from June 19th, 1996.
[00:00:31]  From the high desert and the great American Southwest, I bid you all good evening.
[00:00:34]  Good morning across all these many time zones from Hawaii and the Tahitian Island chains, east over flyover country, that's all of us, to the Caribbean and the U.S. Virgin Islands, south into South America, north to the Pole, and worldwide on the internet.
[00:00:53]  This is Coast to Coast A.M. Good morning, I'm Art Bell.
[00:00:57]  Lots and lots and lots to do.
[00:00:59]  Let me give you a couple of quick notes.
[00:01:02]  One is, welcome K-E-R-N Kern Radio in Bakersfield.
[00:01:10]  Good to be with you.
[00:01:11]  They'll be carrying the show from 11 to 5 Pacific and Dreamland, 7 to 10 on Sunday.
[00:01:20]  So a little bit of a switch of gears in Bakersfield.
[00:01:23]  Good to have them on board.
[00:01:26]  From last night's show, I got a call from Graham Hancock doing his American tour from Britain tonight, about an hour ago, on a plane to Dallas on his way down to Dallas.
[00:01:39]  Let me tell you where he's going to be, all right?
[00:01:41]  Monday, June 24th, he'll be at the Phoenix Bookstore, 1514 5th Street in Santa Monica, California from 7 to 8.30, Graham Hancock.
[00:01:53]  That's Los Angeles.
[00:01:54]  I'll give you some of his other dates later.
[00:01:59]  Tomorrow night, we're going to talk a little bit about Russia with Luba Brezhnev, who is Lynette Drezhnev's niece.
[00:02:10]  She's got a lot to tell us about what's going on with the elections and what to expect in Russia.
[00:02:15]  And I'm looking forward to that because, as you know, I'm headed off to Russia the very first of August, right around the 1st of August.
[00:02:23]  So I'm going to be listening very carefully.
[00:02:25]  Coming up in a moment, the man who's written the newest book about the Clintons.

=== Bruce Lindsay's Revelation (15:32) ===

[00:02:31]  It's called Partners in Power, Roger Morris, and I'll tell you more about it and the big news of the day, which happens to be about the Clintons and Whitewater in a moment.
[00:02:59]  Well, okay.
[00:03:01]  First, the news of the day, because it relates the rising tide of whitewater tonight reaches all the way into the inner sanctum of the White House.
[00:03:11]  One of President Clinton's closest political friends, Bruce Lindsay, is apparently going to be named an unindicted co-conspirator.
[00:03:22]  It involves campaign loans during the time that Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas.
[00:03:28]  Lindsay, it seems, handled many of those loans.
[00:03:31]  He's so close to the Prez that there are nearly no decisions made by our president without him.
[00:03:39]  So naming Lindsay will allow the special prosecutor to call him as a witness in the trial of two Arkansas bankers, Herbert Branscombe and Robert Hill.
[00:03:52]  They are respectively charged with illegally funneling money into Mr. Clinton's 1990 campaign for governor from the Perry County Bank.
[00:04:02]  Now, it's been charged that Lindsay told the bankers, don't worry, don't report this withdrawal to the IRS in an effort to hide the contribution.
[00:04:14]  So it is another big scandal for the White House at a time they don't need it.
[00:04:21]  The last person to be named as an unindicted co-conspirator at the White House was Richard Nixon.
[00:04:30]  Now, a White House source says it's a cheap political trick that calls into question the integrity of independent counsel Kenneth Starr.
[00:04:41]  That has echoes from the past as well.
[00:04:44]  They're beginning to question the integrity of the special counsel.
[00:04:50]  Officials are worried that Lindsay could still be indicted himself for possible perjury or obstruction of justice by the day this gets closer to the president than the FBI files.
[00:05:08]  The White House staffer charged with ordering them up has been put on, as you know, paid leave, Craig Livingston.
[00:05:17]  And that's going to be, no doubt, a big investigation.
[00:05:21]  Meanwhile, the administration engaged in big-time damage control on this issue with regard to those 400 FBI files.
[00:05:30]  Somehow, you recall, ended up at the White House for innocent review, no doubt.
[00:05:36]  A veteran Army counterintelligence specialist, Charles Easley, is going to take over the job of personnel security there.
[00:05:46]  What do you think, folks?
[00:05:47]  A simple administrative error by low-level military types or basically your political witch hunt.
[00:05:54]  Now comes Roger Morris, born in Kansas City.
[00:05:59]  In 1938, he holds a Ph.D. in government from Harvard, served in the Foreign Service on the White House staff and on the staff of the National Security Council under both Presidents Johnson and Nixon until resigning over the invasion of Cambodia.
[00:06:17]  He was also an advisor on both foreign and domestic affairs in the U.S. Senate, director of policy studies at the Carnegie Endowment, before turning full-time to writing in 1974, and writing he has done.
[00:06:33]  The latest book on the Clintons.
[00:06:38]  Just as we go to him, let me read you what the New York Post, June 18th, said about his book.
[00:06:46]  Roger Morris's partners in power, the Clintons in their America, is just out from Holt Books.
[00:06:54]  And if this is a preview of what is to come, then this new round of Clintonians is going to make such relatively benign efforts as Primary Colors and Bloodsport look like updated versions of Rebecca of Sonny Farm based on Mr. Morris's own investigations, as well as on material that has already appeared elsewhere, including the American Spectator.
[00:07:22]  Partners in Power goes further than anything yet published in the nailing of the Clintons, both of them as shameless crooks, liars, and impostors in every aspect of their personal and political lives.
[00:07:41]  Morris is a newcomer to the expanding ranks of Clinton chroniclers.
[00:07:47]  He is a member of the National Security Council.
[00:07:49]  We already did all of that.
[00:07:51]  And so, as a matter of fact, here he is right now, Roger Morris.
[00:07:57]  Roger, welcome to the program.
[00:07:59]  Thank you.
[00:08:02]  That's quite a nice little piece they wrote about you in the post.
[00:08:05]  Yes, it was.
[00:08:07]  I'm getting a lot of that these days, as you know.
[00:08:10]  There are a number of interpretations of his book.
[00:08:13]  I'm just hopeful that it'll be read and that people will decide for themselves, of course.
[00:08:17]  He makes primary colors look like something from Rebecca of Sunnybrook Farms?
[00:08:22]  Well, if you remember that, that was a fairly benign child's book.
[00:08:28]  Yes, I do.
[00:08:29]  I'm not sure that's true, but my book is quite different from Primary Colors or from Bloodsport, any of the earlier books about the Clintons.
[00:08:37]  This is a dual biography of the first lady and of the president from the very beginning back to their childhoods and tracing it forward to the making of their dual presidency, really, and up to the moment of their inauguration in 1993.
[00:08:54]  All right.
[00:08:54]  So then you can tell us about the man and the woman, what kind of people they are, why they are as they are, and how do you do that?
[00:09:04]  How would you begin?
[00:09:06]  Well, I think they're, of course, products of their time and of their place.
[00:09:10]  Bill Clinton was very much the product of Arkansas in the 1940s and 50s.
[00:09:16]  He styles himself as being from Hope, the little town in southwestern Arkansas, but he left there at the age of four.
[00:09:22]  He really is a product of Hot Springs.
[00:09:24]  And Hot Springs, as you know, was not just any hometown of any president.
[00:09:29]  It was a small capital of organized crime, a center of vice and corruption, rather extraordinary town that was run by criminal elements whose politics were wild and woolly and thoroughly corrupt.
[00:09:43]  It was in that atmosphere that Bill Clinton grew up.
[00:09:45]  Those were the politics he cut his teeth on.
[00:09:49]  And as the book shows, what's extraordinary is that members of the Clinton family, his uncle, Uncle Raymond Clinton, his father, friends of the family, a man named Gabe Crawford and others, were linked to organized crime.
[00:10:02]  They ran slot machines and bookie operations out of their businesses, and they were very instrumental in launching young Bill Clinton on his political career in the mid-1970s.
[00:10:13]  So this is a very seamy and in some ways shrouded past for a president.
[00:10:20]  It's beginning to sound like a small version of my Las Vegas.
[00:10:24]  Well, there are certain similarities.
[00:10:27]  At one time in the early 1950s, Hot Springs, though gambling was illegal there, grossed more money from gambling than Las Vegas, Nevada, where it was legal.
[00:10:39]  And it was only after a crackdown in the mid-1960s that that ceased to be the case.
[00:10:46]  And many of the gangsters, many of the elements, criminal elements who have been running Hot Springs moved to your hometown, as you know.
[00:10:55]  Well, look, as we look at what's going on with Ms. Clinton right now, and there are very serious problems, as you heard me in the open suggest, cropping up for the Clintons.
[00:11:08]  With what we know about Bill Clinton and his past and how he was brought up, and for that matter, Hillary, what does that tell us about how he's going to handle these things?
[00:11:19]  Well, I think we have a seriously flawed president and first lady in terms of character and ethics.
[00:11:26]  My book really traces the evolution of their corruption and compromise, their political career, and it's a career built upon dissimulation and to a large extent their own personal corruption.
[00:11:40]  Think they're going to handle this unfolding crisis, which seems to grow worse every day, in much the same way they handled past crises in Arkansas by evasion and by trying to move around, hoping that these problems will go away, and by, I think, eventually sacrificing underlings to the legal process.
[00:12:02]  Of course, the problem with that, as Richard Nixon and others have discovered, is that sooner or later, people who are knowledgeable about what you've done begin to talk to the prosecutors, cut their own deals, and that's when you began to get in trouble.
[00:12:16]  They also write books.
[00:12:18]  Yes, they do, and they begin to talk to the press.
[00:12:21]  They begin to realize that their interests may not be the same as the Clinton's interests.
[00:12:26]  We haven't really reached that stage yet in this scandal.
[00:12:30]  The White House has held amazingly firm.
[00:12:32]  They've been quite united.
[00:12:33]  They've circled the wagons.
[00:12:35]  But this action today, naming Bruce Lindsay as an unindicted co-conspirator, as you quite rightly pointed out, brings the Whitewater trials right to the door of the presidential bedroom.
[00:12:49]  Is this going to unwind for the president about the way Watergate did?
[00:12:54]  Well, my sense is that it will bear a striking parallel to what happened to Richard Nixon.
[00:13:01]  I think that the special prosecutor Kenneth Starr is proceeding in a very methodical and deliberate way.
[00:13:07]  I don't think he's guided by any political calendar.
[00:13:09]  I don't think he's running for the Supreme Court or any of the charges that have been made against him.
[00:13:13]  I think he's doing a very thorough and professional job as a prosecutor, much as Archibald Cox and Leon Jaworski, the Widergate prosecutors, did.
[00:13:23]  I don't think that we're going to see decisive actions before the election.
[00:13:28]  In fact, my view is that it's quite possible President Clinton will be re-elected over Bob Dole, and that we will see almost as soon as he's inaugurated for his second term the beginning of a constitutional crisis, the slow undoing of that administration in light of what the special prosecutor is uncovering in Arkansas.
[00:13:47]  I would have to agree with you.
[00:13:48]  I don't think Bob Dole can beat Bill Clinton.
[00:13:50]  I think the only person that can beat Bill Clinton is Bill Clinton.
[00:13:54]  And he's doing quite well at it at the moment.
[00:13:57]  Now, this statement, Roger, is kind of chilling.
[00:14:03]  A White House source says, referring to the special independent prosecutor, it's a cheap political trick that calls into question the integrity of the independent counsel Kenneth Starr.
[00:14:15]  That's kind of chilling, isn't it?
[00:14:16]  Well, it is, and it's typical of this White House.
[00:14:19]  They don't deal with the issues.
[00:14:20]  They don't discuss the substance.
[00:14:22]  They attack the individuals ad hominem.
[00:14:26]  They try to smear and slur the people.
[00:14:30]  And the facts here in this trial about to unfold in Little Rock are quite plain.
[00:14:38]  There was this bank loan from the Perry County Bank.
[00:14:41]  It was done in explicit return for the appointment of Branscombe to become a state highway commissioner in Arkansas, which, as someone told me, is next to God in that state, a very powerful position with contract kickbacks and all the rest.
[00:14:57]  Bruce Lindsay was the bagman for the 1990 campaign, as he had been for other campaigns.
[00:15:03]  He was Clinton's closest associate.
[00:15:05]  He was his traveling partner.
[00:15:07]  He knew where most of the bodies were buried and I think was responsible for some of that.
[00:15:14]  So he is indeed an intimate aide, and to name him as an unindicted co-conspirator is to come, as you said, very close to the president, as close as you can get.
[00:15:25]  Has President Clinton, and for that matter, the First Lady, done anything that would be out of character for anybody who would rise to the top of the political world in Arkansas and then go to the White House?
[00:15:40]  Well, you know, the book is really a chronicle of that tragedy.
[00:15:45]  In many respects, of course, they were just like all the others.
[00:15:49]  And that's a tragic tale in itself.
[00:15:52]  They pretended to be something else, but they were as corrupt not only as the rest of the politicians in Arkansas, but as indeed, as you know, politicians all over this country.
[00:16:02]  The book really makes, I think, a strong case for saying that we're at the dead end of this political system at the end of the 20th century and that we need massive reform involving both parties, not just the Democrats, but the Republicans as well.
[00:16:16]  But the Clintons had lots and lots of opportunity to be something else.
[00:16:21]  Bill Clinton was an extraordinary, effective, and popular politician in Arkansas.
[00:16:26]  He was a young and dynamic leader.
[00:16:28]  He had a lot of loyalty, a lot of earnest support from young people in that state when he started off.
[00:16:34]  He might have challenged the old system.
[00:16:36]  He might have taken on the vested interests that had tyrannized that state economically and politically for so long.
[00:16:42]  He might have built a different kind of politics, a different political party.
[00:16:46]  Instead, he chose to cast his lot with the old system, the good old boy system that was so corrupt.
[00:16:53]  And in doing so, he's brought, of course, all those ghosts with him to the White House.
[00:16:58]  All right.
[00:16:59]  There was a videotape out that I know you're familiar with called the Clinton Chronicles.
[00:17:04]  Now, I didn't buy a lot of it.
[00:17:06]  I didn't buy the allegations of murder.
[00:17:08]  I didn't necessarily buy those of drug dealing.
[00:17:11]  I thought they were unsubstantiated.
[00:17:14]  But the Clinton Chronicles did chronicle the cronyism in the Clinton administration as governor, certainly as governor, and then continuing into the White House.
[00:17:25]  I thought it did that very well indeed.
[00:17:27]  There was nothing but, wasn't there, cronyism constantly in Arkansas.
[00:17:32]  Well, I would agree with you.
[00:17:33]  I think much of that tape was unsubstantiated.
[00:17:36]  It, of course, was sponsored by Clinton opponents on the right.
[00:17:41]  It was a very partisan document in that sense.

=== Closed System Cronyism (01:39) ===

[00:17:44]  But much of it was quite true.
[00:17:46]  It was an accurate depiction of the politics in Arkansas.
[00:17:49]  There was a Clinton machine.
[00:17:51]  By the end of his tenure there, 12 years in the governorship, he had appointed over 2,000 officials to various boards and commissions.
[00:17:59]  They were administering in different ways a budget of over $2 billion, special fixes and favors for all sorts of Clinton backers, lots of state business for bond brokerage houses and for law firms like Hillary Rodham Clinton's Rose firm.
[00:18:16]  It was a closed system of cronyism and of special interest favors that was among the worst in the country.
[00:18:23]  All right.
[00:18:24]  Let me ask you this.
[00:18:24]  It's kind of a fun, tough question.
[00:18:27]  I've been saying for the last year and a half that I thought all of this was going to land pretty much squarely on the first lady's doorstep and that she could be in big trouble, even obstruction of justice somewhere down the line.
[00:18:40]  And were that to occur, if that occurred despite their best efforts, what would President Clinton do?
[00:18:49]  Well, I know there are predictions that he would resign or that this would really be the end of his candidacy.
[00:18:57]  I'm not so sure.
[00:18:58]  Frankly, the Clintons have a long history of battling these things out.
[00:19:03]  Whenever she's been under fire, legal fire, fire for conflicts of interest or whatever, certainly in Arkansas and also in these first three and a half years in the White House, Clinton has rallied to her side.

=== Hang Loose (02:39) ===

[00:19:15]  He's stood behind her and beside her.
[00:19:18]  He's been, I think, fairly brazen in trying to weather these storms.
[00:19:23]  I'm not at all certain that he would leave the battlefield.
[00:19:26]  I think he might make a campaign issue out of it, might try to say that his wife is being persecuted because she was a woman or for partisan reasons or whatever.
[00:19:35]  The Clintons are not known for giving up, as you know.
[00:19:38]  He survived scandal in the 1992 campaign, and he's done so fairly successfully thus far in this administration.
[00:19:46]  I know.
[00:19:46]  They said Ronald Reagan was the Teflon president.
[00:19:49]  This fellow has two coatings, at least.
[00:19:52]  Well, I think he has at least nine lives, and I'm not sure we're seeing some of those being spent right now, but this is a, as a headline in a recent British publication put it, this is a hard dog to get off the porch.
[00:20:06]  All right, Roger Morris, hang loose.
[00:20:08]  We'll be right back to you.
[00:20:10]  Bottom of the hour break time.
[00:20:11]  This is Premier Networks.
[00:20:13]  That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
[00:20:52]  Roger Morris, latest book on the Clintons on the New York Times bestseller list, too, right now.
[00:21:00]  And rising rapidly with a bullet.
[00:21:03]  It's called Partners in Power.
[00:21:06]  We'll get back to him in just a moment.
[00:21:28]  Roger Morris back once again.
[00:21:30]  Roger, before all this is over, could somebody write a book to use Bose or Will They called Partners in Crime?

=== The Clinton Scandal Exposed (15:54) ===

[00:21:37]  Well, you know, that's being said in various radio programs about this book.
[00:21:45]  I think Rush Limbaugh and others have used that term.
[00:21:48]  I think there's no question that both the Clintons have been guilty of legal wrongdoing in Arkansas and elsewhere.
[00:21:55]  You know, this latest trial in Little Rock leading to the conviction of Governor Jim Guy Tucker and the McDougall, Susan and Jim McDougall, really made very plain that the Clintons are guilty of at least two offenses.
[00:22:07]  They benefited directly and personally from fraudulently obtained federal money.
[00:22:14]  And if they knowingly did that, that's a federal offense.
[00:22:18]  And, of course, they had their mortgage, their debt paid on Whitewater estates by federally insured funds from a savings and loan, which, again, may have involved fraud, may have involved also their taking tax deductions to which they were not entitled.
[00:22:34]  Those are very serious charges that I know the special prosecutor is looking at.
[00:22:38]  This is no longer a matter of speculation or abstraction.
[00:22:42]  These are very serious charges, and they, I think, are among the most serious ever made against a sitting president.
[00:22:48]  All right.
[00:22:49]  Well, that's quite a statement.
[00:22:50]  All right.
[00:22:51]  Look, with what you know about the Clintons, will they have, right along, carefully covered their tracks to be able to have plausible deniability?
[00:23:02]  Because that tells us where this might go or might not go.
[00:23:06]  Well, we know that the paper trail is extremely difficult to follow.
[00:23:10]  That there are a lot of missing documents, a lot of shredded documents.
[00:23:14]  That's been the pattern, of course, with this White House, the Rose firm, billing records, and all the rest that appear and disappear and appear again mysteriously.
[00:23:23]  I think the Clintons have tried to erase much of the record, but I think at the same time, the special prosecutor has done an amazing job at reconstructing it.
[00:23:33]  So if I were the president's defense lawyers at this point, I'd be very worried about those documents that still exist.
[00:23:41]  Under those circumstances, are you better off running again or bowing out and hoping the spotlight fades and shifts elsewhere?
[00:23:51]  Well, if you were to resign from office, and especially with any agreement that your successor, Vice President Al Gore, would pardon you in the event of any pursuing indictments, you would, I think, as in the case of Richard Nixon, put an end to the investigation.
[00:24:10]  We don't know the whole story of Watergate because with the president's resignation, that investigation was effectively stopped.
[00:24:17]  And the Clintons could do that.
[00:24:18]  But that's an awful price to pay historically.
[00:24:21]  It really is, in many respects, an admission of guilt.
[00:24:24]  I don't see them ready by any means to do that yet.
[00:24:27]  I think we're in for a long fight.
[00:24:29]  A long fight.
[00:24:31]  All right.
[00:24:31]  I got a report earlier today.
[00:24:33]  I have no idea whether it's true or not.
[00:24:34]  It's another problem for the president.
[00:24:37]  Of course, that involves Paula Jones.
[00:24:40]  And I had a report that on ABC's Nightly News.
[00:24:43]  They said it might be settled.
[00:24:45]  The settlement purportedly would include statements by Clinton that he did meet with Paula Jones, a retraction of his statement in The Spectator, and payment of Paula's legal expenses.
[00:24:55]  Now, I'm not sure if this story has legs or not, but if it's true, would you be surprised?
[00:25:04]  I would be surprised.
[00:25:05]  I think that's virtually an admission that her charges were correct.
[00:25:10]  If he agrees here to a kind of financial settlement, as you describe it, to pay her legal fees or whatever, and what amounts to an apology to the remarks that he made to the American Spectator about her, you know, the Paula Jones case is one of so many that have haunted this president out of Arkansas.
[00:25:30]  There are now over 20 women, as my book describes, who have come forward telling tales of having sexual encounters with Bill Clinton.
[00:25:39]  And I think the Paula Jones case is a very sad one of exploitation and abuse of power.
[00:25:45]  He was in that situation not because he was just any man, but he was there because he was the governor, the chief executive officer of the state.
[00:25:52]  She was a state employee.
[00:25:54]  And that happened again and again, as my book describes.
[00:25:57]  Again and again.
[00:25:59]  Where are these other women, or do they just choose to keep it private?
[00:26:03]  Well, they don't choose to keep it private.
[00:26:06]  More than 20 of them have come forward and talked to the press.
[00:26:10]  I describe that in my book.
[00:26:12]  There have been women who have contemplated legal action.
[00:26:16]  I think most of them have been intimidated by the sheer expense and the difficulty of pursuing anything against the sitting president.
[00:26:23]  And they were, after all, consenting adults.
[00:26:25]  They didn't all have sexual harassment charges that they could bring, as in the Paula Jones case.
[00:26:31]  This was simply a case of compulsive philandering, compulsive womanizing by a sitting politician, a very powerful and popular one.
[00:26:39]  And lots of women, of course, simply chose to keep that very much a secret.
[00:26:44]  Well, and the country, by and large, seems to have decided to pretty much ignore it.
[00:26:49]  You recall President Clinton and Hillary went on 60 minutes in a campaign-saving interview, really, that resulted in his election, in my opinion.
[00:27:02]  Would you agree with that?
[00:27:03]  Yes, it did.
[00:27:04]  And my book describes the origin of all of that.
[00:27:07]  It began with, as you may remember, Senator Gary Hart's scandal in 1987.
[00:27:13]  He was running for president in 88, four years earlier, and had a sex scandal which drove him out of the race.
[00:27:21]  The Clintons looked at that episode and decided how they would handle it if it erupted in their bid for the presidency, as it did in 1992 with Jennifer Flowers.
[00:27:31]  That was a very contrived appearance at 60 Minutes, and it was quite successful.
[00:27:38]  But I think the issue here is not so much personal morality, which I think most Americans are willing to excuse in an American president, as the abuse of power, the exploitation of state troopers and others to act as guards at these trysts and vertical procurers of young women, the abuse of his office as governor.
[00:28:01]  He swept into county fairs and fate conventions and so on and had these conquests, as it were, not just, as I said, another man, but as the governor, as the government itself, Roger, what do you know about the Clintons' personal relationship?
[00:28:16]  You would think through all of this and rumors of things with regard to the First Lady that it would be a troubled marriage, is it?
[00:28:24]  Yes, it is.
[00:28:25]  It's an extraordinarily complex relationship, and my book really traces it from its beginning, from their meeting at Yale Law School, their courtship, the early years of the marriage, and on through the years in the governorship in Little Rock.
[00:28:40]  It's, I think, in many respects, one of the most fascinating relationships in the history of modern American politics.
[00:28:45]  A mix of expedience and opportunism, certainly, on one hand.
[00:28:50]  On the other hand, I think genuine affection.
[00:28:54]  He is unimaginable in the White House without her.
[00:28:57]  I think she was indispensable to his political career, and obviously he was very important to her rise to power as well in this dual presidency.
[00:29:07]  So that it's a very complicated love-hate relationship, not unlike a lot of marriages, except this one, of course, happens to be played out against the backdrop of national politics and enormous power.
[00:29:19]  Well, she's been very important, but she's also, in many ways, been a total disaster for him.
[00:29:24]  I mean, if you look at the health care plan.
[00:29:26]  Absolutely.
[00:29:27]  You know, that's an often missed point, I think, in the reporting about Hillary Rodham Clinton.
[00:29:33]  She was so highly regarded.
[00:29:35]  So much was expected of her.
[00:29:37]  But the pattern, as my book shows, in Arkansas, was that she was given responsibility like that, like the health reform task force, again and again, and it usually issued in failure and even in political disaster.
[00:29:51]  She was by no means adept politically.
[00:29:53]  She was often an embarrassment.
[00:29:55]  But at the same time, she was a disciplining force, a stiffening factor for Bill Clinton, much more an adult, I would say, than he was in both their personal and in their political lives.
[00:30:08]  Is there any turning back or covering up now for the president, or is it inevitable that perhaps shortly into the second term, as you predicted, all of this is going to come tumbling down?
[00:30:22]  Well, I don't think there's any way to stop this.
[00:30:24]  I think she has to face legal accountability for what she did as a Rose lawyer, what she said in the White House as First Lady, trying to evade, and in many respects, I think, falsified his record.
[00:30:40]  She is looking at serious legal charges, and I think inevitably he will, too.
[00:30:44]  We're not only talking about white water and improprieties with his savings and loan.
[00:30:50]  We're talking about shady campaign contributions, as this latest trial will show.
[00:30:54]  We're talking about vote fraud.
[00:30:56]  We're talking about potential bribery and corruption issues that go far beyond anything we've been talking about so far.
[00:31:06]  Remarkable.
[00:31:07]  What about Mr. Clinton's very early life?
[00:31:10]  He had a very troubled family life, didn't he?
[00:31:14]  And does that tell us why he acts the way he does today?
[00:31:19]  Well, I'm not a psychohistorian, and I don't have a license to practice psychotherapy, so I won't draw any conclusions about this.
[00:31:27]  As an historian and an investigative journalist, I can tell you that it was an abused childhood, severely abused emotionally and physically.
[00:31:36]  In fact, he and his younger brother, Roger, were often taken to pediatricians or to the emergency rooms of hospitals in Hot Springs because of the beatings they received from this alcoholic stepfather.
[00:31:48]  And their mother, Virginia Clinton, really tried to cover all of this up, tried to have those records expunged, and was generally successful in doing so.
[00:31:58]  It was a scandal that was kept behind closed doors in the 1940s and 50s in Hot Springs.
[00:32:04]  I interviewed people who lived next door or across the street.
[00:32:07]  Often their closest neighbors didn't know that the police were called in the middle of the night or that there were beatings of the children or beatings of the mother.
[00:32:15]  But young Bill Clinton, from almost the moment he was four or five on, witnessed brutality against his mother, shouting matches in the middle of the night.
[00:32:24]  It was an extremely tortured childhood.
[00:32:26]  Let me tell you why I asked.
[00:32:28]  Ms. Clinton is chameleon-like.
[00:32:32]  He can say anything, do anything, seemingly lie with a smile at just a moment's notice, almost like he makes it up as he goes along.
[00:32:42]  And at the top of page 50, your book, The Hot Springs chapter, like many other children of alcoholics, he learned, quote, to lie automatically, end quote, as one observer put it, without any sense of guilt.
[00:32:57]  Is that accurate?
[00:32:58]  That's accurate.
[00:32:58]  And that observer was a psychotherapist that I consulted in looking at all of this.
[00:33:05]  There are patterns, of course, of children of alcoholics, children of dysfunctional families like this, and the president, I think, reflects much of that.
[00:33:14]  But it's a very sad story.
[00:33:17]  It's a tragic childhood.
[00:33:19]  And I think the moral of that is we ought to be careful about how we treat our children.
[00:33:23]  They may grow up to be president.
[00:33:27]  All right, so then he's able to do that in a practiced way as an adult and has done so on a fairly regular basis to the American people.
[00:33:39]  And yet, he leads, he continues to lead down a bit, albeit in the polls, but continues to lead Bob Dole.
[00:33:47]  And you think that will go basically unchanged through the election?
[00:33:51]  Well, I think it's going to be a very close election, much closer than it is now in the polls, and I think closer than anyone is predicting.
[00:33:57]  But my guess would be that Bill Clinton will survive, will win in effect by default.
[00:34:03]  I don't think there's any great fondness or enthusiasm out there for Bob Dole for this Republican candidate.
[00:34:11]  Bill Clinton, I think, has a capacity here for rallying just that minimum support.
[00:34:19]  He is seen as the lesser of evils.
[00:34:21]  He was seen often as the lesser of evils in Arkansas, and that may be enough for his final victory.
[00:34:27]  It's very interesting.
[00:34:30]  You were, or are perhaps, a liberal, are you not?
[00:34:34]  Well, I tell you that I've been given that name so often in the last few days in radio shows.
[00:34:41]  I disavow that anymore because I'm so disappointed and disgusted, really, with the liberals and the Democratic Party.
[00:34:49]  I really style myself these days as an independent.
[00:34:53]  I think most of my views of American politics are quite different from either the Democrats or the Republicans.
[00:34:59]  I recall Ronald Reagan once saying that he didn't leave the party.
[00:35:03]  The party left him.
[00:35:04]  Is that what you would say?
[00:35:06]  Well, that was my feeling.
[00:35:07]  I think the Democratic Party has betrayed most of its constituents and most of its principles, and that corruption is really a bipartisan scourge in American politics.
[00:35:19]  I think being an independent is sort of the last refuge of sanity here.
[00:35:25]  I agree with you.
[00:35:28]  I'm kind of conservative generally, economically.
[00:35:31]  Politically, I'm sort of all over the place.
[00:35:33]  But right now, independent, and I feel driven to it by lack of interest in either one of the current candidates.
[00:35:41]  As a matter of fact, the American people generally, unless the scandal continues to grow, which I'm sure it will, seem politically, totally unengaged right now.
[00:35:53]  Do you observe that?
[00:35:55]  I think that's true.
[00:35:56]  I think that they're  ⁇ I don't think it's a matter of indifference because I think the American people are hurting in a number of ways.
[00:36:02]  They know that their economic fortunes have been declining relatively, that their futures are uncertain, that for the first time in a half century that they can't be sure that they're going to be better off than their parents were.
[00:36:16]  There's a lot of insecurity and uncertainty out there, and I think a lot of instinctive distrust of government.
[00:36:22]  But that doesn't always lead to engagement.
[00:36:26]  Americans, I think, tend to turn away from this political mess.
[00:36:30]  They find it very repugnant and distasteful.
[00:36:32]  And of course, that's not the way a democracy works.
[00:36:35]  You have to become engaged, whether you like it or not.
[00:36:38]  You have to face up to your problems.
[00:36:39]  I often compare this political system to a dysfunctional family.
[00:36:43]  If you don't know that daddy is an alcoholic or that the aunt is mentally disturbed or whatever, you can't begin the healing process.
[00:36:53]  You can't begin to deal with the problem.
[00:36:55]  Maybe it's because, Roger, the American people care mostly about one thing, their own pocketbook.
[00:37:01]  And while there are worries and concerns and frights of job loss out there, basically, Mr. Clinton, President Clinton has been lucky.
[00:37:10]  The economy has been sailing right along.

=== Whistling Through the Graveyard (15:16) ===

[00:37:13]  Stock market is up.
[00:37:14]  Interest rates remain fairly low.
[00:37:17]  The normal measure of, you know, are you better off than you were four years ago, and about 80-some percent of the American people say they are.
[00:37:26]  And that's what's going to re-elect this president.
[00:37:27]  So is he lucky, Bill?
[00:37:29]  I think he is.
[00:37:30]  But, you know, we're whistling through the graveyard here.
[00:37:33]  As you well know, there are a number of very ominous trends at work, and you can't be certain at all that these short-term gains are going to last.
[00:37:43]  And I think most Americans feel that as well.
[00:37:45]  They don't often connect, however, their own pocketbooks to the political process in Washington.
[00:37:50]  And the connection could not be more direct.
[00:37:53]  The special interest government that really rules in Washington these days with both the Democrats and the Republicans ultimately affects every American in the pocketbook.
[00:38:03]  It is a life and death matter.
[00:38:04]  When they draw those connections, when they see how corrupted the process has become, I think they may be willing to act.
[00:38:12]  When I say I'm an independent, I think I'm very much an independent on the matter of simply restoring the democratic process.
[00:38:18]  We can debate what policy solutions may be best once we've got a democracy back, but we're a long way from that.
[00:38:27]  It's that bad.
[00:38:28]  We don't have, in effect, a democracy.
[00:38:31]  I don't think so.
[00:38:31]  I think it's a special interest republic.
[00:38:33]  The 100,000 lobbyists of K-Street in Washington really run the Congress of the United States.
[00:38:38]  They elect presidents.
[00:38:40]  You know, both these candidates, the Democrat and the Republican, are going to your hometown of Las Vegas to get massive support from the gambling industry and others.
[00:38:51]  There are special interests like that lining up to back and ultimately to buy both parties, both candidates for the presidency.
[00:39:00]  This, I don't think, is a democracy reflective of its people.
[00:39:04]  I think it's very much an oligarchy which is owned by a few special interests.
[00:39:09]  So, Roger, if a miracle occurred and Clinton lost the election, say this stuff got hot enough and he lost the election, if we got Bob Dole, in your view, not much would change.
[00:39:19]  Not much would change.
[00:39:20]  Dole, I think, is the epitome of the old system.
[00:39:23]  I know there are some people who believe that Bob Dole in his last hurrah here might have the courage to do something extraordinary.
[00:39:31]  I don't know.
[00:39:31]  I grew up in the Midwest in Kansas City, not far from Russell, Kansas.
[00:39:35]  I know what it looks like and smells like, and I know Bob Dole's people from whence he comes.
[00:39:42]  I would hope that that might be possible, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
[00:39:47]  The president, you don't think, at some point would be tempted to sack the special prosecutor, do you?
[00:39:54]  I think that would be an absolute disaster.
[00:39:56]  He's got to remember vividly as a young man what happened at the Saturday night massacre in the Nixon administration.
[00:40:03]  And, of course, Hillary Rodham Clinton, as you know, worked for John Doer in the House Impeachment Committee.
[00:40:10]  She knows the history of that crisis.
[00:40:13]  Nothing would hasten the fall of this White House any faster than that kind of arbitrary action.
[00:40:20]  Well, the early shots over the bow from White House sources is a little worrisome.
[00:40:27]  It is worrisome.
[00:40:28]  On the other hand, the efforts to discredit Starr, which have been going on quietly and not so quietly in the press over the last two months, really, I think have proven rather ineffectual.
[00:40:39]  I think Starr is doing a very professional job.
[00:40:43]  You know, any attempt to tamper with him, I think, would really bring the first articles of impeachment out of this Congress.
[00:40:50]  This Congress is waiting with bated breath on every new development, and the FBI files and other scandals here as they erupt weaken the administration still further.
[00:41:01]  So I think that would be a disastrous step.
[00:41:04]  I think they're posturing.
[00:41:05]  This language about Starr, I think, is more bluster than anything else.
[00:41:09]  All right, Roger, top of the hour.
[00:41:11]  Relax.
[00:41:11]  You've got several minutes.
[00:41:12]  We'll come back and take calls.
[00:41:14]  How's that?
[00:41:14]  Good.
[00:41:15]  Roger Morris, Partners in Power.
[00:41:16]  Back in a moment.
[00:41:17]  The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
[00:41:23]  More Somewhere in Time coming up.
[00:41:53]  Works presents Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
[00:41:56]  Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast A.M. from June 19, 1996.
[00:42:01]  It's already on the New York Times bestseller list, Partners in Power by Roger Morris.
[00:42:06]  He's my guest.
[00:42:08]  It's about them.
[00:42:13]  It's about the Clintons, and we'll be back to Roger Morris, and we'll begin taking questions from all of you in a moment.
[00:42:19]  Now to Roger Morris.
[00:42:40]  Roger, I want to read you this facts I just got.
[00:42:43]  Art, when you say you don't see Dole being able to beat Clinton, oh, man, Clinton is so easy to beat, so, so, so, so easy.
[00:42:53]  I hope Dole uses what I'm thinking of.
[00:42:57]  But Clinton, he says, is a piece of cake to beat.
[00:43:01]  And not really true, is it?
[00:43:03]  Not true that the landscape in Arkansas is littered with politicians who thought he was easy to beat.
[00:43:10]  I think George Bush underestimated him in 1992.
[00:43:13]  I think that this is going to be a close election, as I said.
[00:43:17]  But I don't know any serious observer in Washington or anywhere else in the country now who wouldn't be betting on Bill Clinton.
[00:43:26]  Another Fox is saying it's a sad thing when a man running for president can't run the race on his own merit, but rather it must depend on the demerit of his competitor.
[00:43:35]  And that is what it comes down to.
[00:43:37]  And you think not much chance that there are going to be enough demerit points to throw the election toward Dole.
[00:43:46]  Well, I think there are serious problems on the Republican side, as you know.
[00:43:50]  It's going to be a very divided convention for the Republicans.
[00:43:54]  Pat Buchanan and others, even though they may be outside the convention hall, are going to be embarrassing the candidate.
[00:44:01]  This is not a united party.
[00:44:03]  It wasn't united in the primaries, and it's not going to be in the general election.
[00:44:08]  The Republicans have their own problems, and I don't think, as I said earlier, that the prosecutor's process here, which is so important, so historic in Little Rock, is going to unfold in time to save the Dole candidates.
[00:44:24]  Something I've always wondered about, Roger.
[00:44:26]  At the beginning of his administration, I thought it very, very strange that President Clinton chose to squander so much political capital on the gays in the military thing.
[00:44:39]  Any insight on that?
[00:44:40]  Well, I think that was part of a general ineptness, a disarray in the administration, which was very much the pattern of Arkansas.
[00:44:49]  I think if you had known really what happened in the 12 years in the governorship in Little Rock, as my book tells the story, you could have predicted much of the disarray and really the failure of the administration in that first year.
[00:45:03]  And they did squander their capital on an issue which might have been handled very differently.
[00:45:08]  They came up against some of the most powerful forces in Washington in the Armed Services Committee and the Pentagon and so forth.
[00:45:13]  And what was supposed to have been a masterful politician here, the president, Bill Clinton, turned out to be a manifest incompetent.
[00:45:23]  And of course, that wasn't the only issue.
[00:45:25]  There were all the appointments, Zoe Baird and all the others that languished for so long.
[00:45:31]  It was a very, very incompetent presidency.
[00:45:34]  And then the irony of the president's going to San Francisco, facing a mayor who said you better not come, and then when he did, demonstrations against him by the homosexuals.
[00:45:46]  On the other hand, he seems to survive these episodes.
[00:45:49]  As you've been remarking this evening, he seems to be very much the Teflon president, more so even than Ronald Reagan.
[00:45:56]  I'm not sure a reckoning isn't coming eventually, and it will be a close election, but I still see Clinton surviving it.
[00:46:04]  All right, let's go to the phones.
[00:46:05]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[00:46:08]  Hi.
[00:46:08]  Hi, this is Carlos in Minneapolis, sir.
[00:46:10]  How are you?
[00:46:11]  Just fine.
[00:46:11]  Great show again.
[00:46:13]  I've got a quick comment and a question for Mr. Morris.
[00:46:17]  Sure.
[00:46:18]  What you said earlier about the United States being a republic and not a democracy, that's very true.
[00:46:23]  We were founded as a republic, and we won't really have a democracy until we have rule by a simple majority.
[00:46:28]  And as long as we have the Electoral College, of course, that's out.
[00:46:34]  But the main reason I'm calling, the thing that I've always held most against Bill Clinton as a Vietnam theater veteran was not his protesting the war or even protesting in England, but the protesting he did in the Soviet Union.
[00:46:49]  And I will bet you a week's pay that somewhere in a college newspaper or a CAS newspaper or some KGB file, there's a picture of him waving a Viet Cong flag or a hammer and sickle flag.
[00:47:05]  And I just encourage people to find it.
[00:47:08]  And I wonder why maybe no one's looked for it yet.
[00:47:10]  All right.
[00:47:11]  Well, I think if it was there, it would have by now been retrieved, wouldn't you, Roger?
[00:47:16]  Yes, this was a very controversial episode.
[00:47:18]  You know, he went to Moscow from his sojourn at Oxford as a Rhodes Scholar.
[00:47:25]  We actually don't have any evidence, any hard evidence that Bill Clinton participated in anti-war demonstrations while he was there in Moscow.
[00:47:32]  We don't know very much at all about what he was doing.
[00:47:34]  We know he stayed at the National Hotel, which was a very expensive hotel just off of Red Square.
[00:47:40]  We don't know much about people he saw or met there.
[00:47:44]  We do know that he was involved in anti-war demonstrations in London and elsewhere, not in the Soviet Union.
[00:47:51]  But I think you'll find my book very interesting.
[00:47:53]  My book also talks about his contacts with the CIA.
[00:47:57]  He acted in part, I was told, by ranking intelligence officials as an informer against his fellow students in the anti-war movement.
[00:48:06]  So Bill Clinton's politics were very much as they always were Bill Clinton more than any cause.
[00:48:14]  That's an amazing story.
[00:48:15]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[00:48:18]  Hi.
[00:48:18]  Yes, Roger.
[00:48:20]  This is Ed in Los Angeles.
[00:48:22]  I see from my perspective that the Democratic Party is going to suffer a worse loss in 1996 than it did in 1994.
[00:48:31]  I think that the wheels are falling off the Bill Clinton administration.
[00:48:37]  And I don't see him surviving to the convention, to tell you the truth.
[00:48:42]  I may be underestimating Bill Clinton.
[00:48:45]  I'm sorry?
[00:48:46]  You may be underestimating Bill Clinton.
[00:48:48]  Well, that's true, but I've seen a lot of elections.
[00:48:50]  I've been following elections since the FDR, and believe me, this guy is in big trouble right now.
[00:48:56]  Well, I think you're right about being in big trouble.
[00:49:00]  You know, we've been talking this evening about how resilient he is and how bulletproof this administration has been.
[00:49:08]  On the other hand, there are a lot of people in Washington who feel that just what you're saying, that there could be a climactic event before the convention.
[00:49:17]  I know people who believe that Vice President Al Gore has been trying to work behind the scenes to get Clinton to resign, to go quietly, before there was any scandal that would jeopardize their reelection campaign.
[00:49:29]  I think there are a lot of machinations going on now that we don't know about in Washington.
[00:49:34]  I think this is going to be an extraordinary election year, but I still have to disagree with you.
[00:49:40]  I still think he's going to make it.
[00:49:42]  Roger, he has not officially yet said he's the candidate, has he?
[00:49:47]  No, and that's something that everybody's feeding on these days in political speculation that he still could, in effect, formally bow out.
[00:49:57]  But, you know, that's really a technicality.
[00:50:00]  He's been raising millions and millions of dollars.
[00:50:02]  He's been going around the country with the clear understanding that he would be the candidate.
[00:50:07]  He's been taking that money freely from all sorts of sources.
[00:50:11]  And my sense is that Bill Clinton is running very, very hard, has been for a long time.
[00:50:16]  And he's got to.
[00:50:18]  He's got to be in as strong a position as possible to survive these charges that are going to come at him.
[00:50:24]  And we mustn't forget that in many respects his best defense will be to remain right where he is in the White House, where his legal position is a very special one.
[00:50:35]  All right.
[00:50:35]  Wildcard line, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[00:50:38]  Hi.
[00:50:38]  Hi, Morris.
[00:50:43]  Rush, yes.
[00:50:44]  Yeah, he's bashing Hillary too.
[00:50:46]  I can't believe this, you know.
[00:50:48]  It's election time, and it's that same old rhetoric again.
[00:50:51]  You know, they're bringing up all these old bones out of the closet about Clinton.
[00:50:56]  I mean, what President have had this over his trial for president in the last 50 years?
[00:51:04]  I mean, he's all right.
[00:51:05]  That's a fair question.
[00:51:06]  Roger, how different is the trouble that Mr. Clinton is in from what other presidents have faced?
[00:51:14]  Is this more serious?
[00:51:16]  Is this potentially Watergate type serious, or is this just sort of electioneering ahead of time here?
[00:51:24]  Well, your caller is quite right.
[00:51:26]  At least at the beginning of the administration, I think a lot of the attacks on Hillary Rodham Clinton were partisan attacks.
[00:51:32]  They may have been gender attacks, sexist opposition to her, resentment of her as a woman, and certainly some of the attacks against President Clinton were partisan attacks.
[00:51:44]  The Republican right didn't want him as president, and they were bitterly opposed to him.
[00:51:50]  The problem, of course, is that these ghosts of Arkansas have proved to be quite real.
[00:51:56]  And this is not just old bones in the graveyard.
[00:51:59]  This is not only old scandals from Arkansas.
[00:52:01]  This is the cover-up that the White House has been engaged in for the last three and a half years.
[00:52:05]  They have lied, they've evaded, they've destroyed evidence, they've, in effect, obstructed justice.
[00:52:10]  And even if these charges are old, they still involve crimes against the Democratic process and illegalities in Arkansas.

=== FBI Files Controversy (08:56) ===

[00:52:19]  That doesn't mean we shouldn't hold them accountable.
[00:52:21]  All right.
[00:52:22]  Well, speaking of crimes against the Democratic process, what about the FBI files?
[00:52:26]  What do you know about that?
[00:52:28]  How serious is that?
[00:52:29]  They said, first of all, it's nothing but a minor military functionary who made a bureaucratic mistake.
[00:52:35]  400 and some odd files, mostly on Republicans, summoned to the White House.
[00:52:40]  You know, I think it's one of the more serious scandals of this administration.
[00:52:45]  I think it's very, very consequential.
[00:52:48]  I think Americans are concerned about privacy issues, and this goes to the heart of that, the abuse of law enforcement for political purposes, using the FBI files here, obviously, against your political opponents.
[00:53:00]  And my book tells the story again and again of how the Clintons did just that in Arkansas.
[00:53:06]  They used the state police in that manner.
[00:53:08]  They smeared their opponents often.
[00:53:11]  They had dossiers on people who were opposed to them, and they used that with the press and even in legal transactions in Arkansas.
[00:53:19]  So that there's a long pattern here of this kind of abuse of power.
[00:53:22]  I think it's a very, very serious one, and I would hope that the congressional hearings will get to the heart of it.
[00:53:28]  I frequently get calls from Arkansas, and people there will say, look, we tried to tell you.
[00:53:34]  And indeed, I've been doing this show, this particular program, for about 13 years, 12, 13 years, and people called from Arkansas and they said, you're going to be sorry.
[00:53:43]  And nobody listened.
[00:53:45]  Well, some people from Arkansas say that.
[00:53:48]  On the other hand, there was very little exposure of these improprieties and these crimes in Arkansas at the time.
[00:53:55]  My book details what I regard as the great failure of the Arkansas media, the Arkansas Gazette and the Arkansas Democrat, the two main papers in the state capitol, the television and radio journalists there who simply did not really warn us, did not tell the whole story what was happening in the Clinton regime.
[00:54:14]  Had they done that, I think it would have been much less of a surprise, and people would have had a clearer choice in 1992, even in the Democratic primary process.
[00:54:24]  With what you know of Bill Clinton's personality, if he were faced with possible impeachment proceedings, as Nixon was, what would Mr. Clinton do?
[00:54:35]  Well, of course, if a president faces that prospect and counts the noses as he has to do and discovers that he doesn't have the votes, then the better part of valor is to resign.
[00:54:47]  And I think Clinton would probably take that course.
[00:54:50]  But I think we're a long way from that.
[00:54:53]  I think this president will stand up and fight these charges.
[00:54:58]  We'll try to label them as just as they said about the special prosecutor today, try to label them as irresponsible partisanship and all the rest.
[00:55:06]  I think he'll try to rely on something of the public backlash against the Republican Congress, which we've seen in the last year or so, the fear of losing benefits and entitlements and so on that the Democrats are banking on in this election.
[00:55:23]  I think there'd be a partisan dogfight, and I don't think Bill Clinton's going to go down quietly.
[00:55:29]  Early on, there were a lot of criticisms from the right about Starr.
[00:55:33]  A lot of people thought he wasn't doing his job.
[00:55:35]  He is, though, isn't he?
[00:55:37]  I think he's a very methodical prosecutor, very professional.
[00:55:40]  They've assembled these trials in a very deliberate way to unfold the story of what was happening in Arkansas.
[00:55:47]  They're building prosecution on prosecution, conviction on conviction.
[00:55:52]  And that has two purposes.
[00:55:53]  One, of course, to make the larger public case about what was happening there.
[00:55:58]  But secondly, eventually to get some of these people to make their deals, make their bargains with the prosecution in return for giving new evidence, perhaps evidence even against the President and the First Lady.
[00:56:12]  Well, they're about halfway up that ladder now, aren't they?
[00:56:14]  Yes, they are.
[00:56:15]  And I understand that a number of people who have pled guilty to various charges in Arkansas are talking to the prosecutors and grand juries.
[00:56:26]  And the prosecutors have begun to talk to Governor Jim Guy Tucker and to the McDougalls, who were just convicted a couple of weeks ago.
[00:56:34]  All right.
[00:56:34]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[00:56:37]  Hello.
[00:56:37]  Greetings and solicitations, Columbia, South Carolina.
[00:56:40]  This is Bernard.
[00:56:41]  Yes, sir.
[00:56:42]  Mr. Morris, my question for you, you've already answered the first one.
[00:56:45]  If Hillary Clinton is indicted, Bill Clinton will not resign.
[00:56:50]  But what is their objective after re-election?
[00:56:57]  That is a good question.
[00:56:58]  If President Clinton is re-elected, the Republican contract with America has been something of a sluggish disappointment.
[00:57:09]  And some of the House could go Democrat.
[00:57:13]  And you never know about Senate.
[00:57:15]  In other words, he might have a clear shot at at least several years of unrestrained power.
[00:57:23]  What do you think he would do?
[00:57:25]  Well, he hasn't done very much with his power in this first administration, although he's been fending off the ghosts of Whitewater and of Arkansas past.
[00:57:35]  So we know what he's been preoccupied with for these last three and a half years.
[00:57:39]  I think the power of the presidency is always extraordinary.
[00:57:42]  He would, of course, have the possibility of other Supreme Court appointments.
[00:57:46]  He might well be able to summon a better majority in the Congress.
[00:57:54]  I don't think, frankly, the Democrats are going to win back both houses.
[00:57:57]  They could win back the House and not the Senate.
[00:58:01]  I don't see Clinton really pursuing any policy agenda in a second administration.
[00:58:06]  I would see it as just the exercise of the same kind of political power day to day, week to week, month to month, that we've seen for the last three and a half years.
[00:58:15]  And, of course, the preparation for the year 2000 when either Vice President Al Gore, his successor, would be the nominee, or, as some think, an ambitious First Lady might well make a bid.
[00:58:28]  If they survive this scandal into a second administration and survive that second four years, I'm not at all certain that Hillary Rodham Clinton wouldn't have ambitions of the presidency herself.
[00:58:42]  Now, there's something that will cause the hair to stand up on the back of your neck.
[00:58:45]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[00:58:47]  Hello, where are you, please?
[00:58:48]  Kansas City.
[00:58:49]  Yes, sir.
[00:58:50]  Roger, what do you feel is the President's role in creating chaos in the world oil price market?
[00:59:00]  And it seems like oil prices are directly proportionate to your popularity in the polls.
[00:59:09]  And oil prices are you go down.
[00:59:14]  All right, well, you'll notice, sir, that, of course, he, I believe, participated in rolling back, what was it, the four-cent gas tax or something, four and a half cents, whatever it was.
[00:59:26]  So, again, Roger, he's got it pretty good, doesn't he?
[00:59:29]  In other words, oil, though it's been up, gas prices have been up.
[00:59:32]  Now they're coming down again.
[00:59:33]  Pretty lucky.
[00:59:35]  He's been very lucky, and really in the absence of any concerted international economic policy.
[00:59:41]  I mean, he's had his trade problems on both fronts in the Pacific and in Europe, but I don't see much of a foreign policy in this administration, and I think he's been very much the beneficiary of favorable trends.
[00:59:55]  He just as easily could have been on the receiving end of not so favorable trends, and that could well happen in a second administration.
[01:00:02]  But thus far, he's been very lucky.
[01:00:05]  I think the more important point is that he doesn't have much of a foreign policy, hasn't devoted much time, hasn't been able to.
[01:00:11]  I'm told that he doesn't even like foreign policy.
[01:00:13]  He doesn't like it.
[01:00:14]  You know, old joke, foreign policy in Arkansas is what happens in Tennessee.
[01:00:18]  And this is not a president, despite his training, despite his Rhodes scholarship and all the rest, who knows very much about the world.
[01:00:27]  He hasn't had time to learn very much.
[01:00:29]  Again, because of what we're talking about here, he's been fending off the scandals of his own history, and that doesn't allow you to be a statesman.
[01:00:38]  First-time caller at line, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[01:00:41]  Hi.
[01:00:41]  Hello, Art.
[01:00:42]  How are you?
[01:00:43]  Fine.
[01:00:43]  Where are you, sir?
[01:00:44]  Montana.
[01:00:44]  All right.
[01:00:45]  And let me comment on your new picture on your webpage.
[01:00:48]  It's great.
[01:00:48]  You look like a big band conductor.
[01:00:51]  All right.
[01:00:52]  Roger, I would like to get back to you with the, you were talking about corruption.

=== Policies and Political Posturing (15:52) ===

[01:00:57]  I'm in an organization.
[01:00:59]  I'm an officer, and I found a fellow that had been embezzling several thousand dollars.
[01:01:06]  And I went all through the fraternity to try and get this guy taken out.
[01:01:11]  And someone came to me and they said, Larry, the powers at B that keep us and let us do and accomplish the things that we do are the same powers to be that cover for our misty.
[01:01:24]  And I mean, I'm at my wit's end with this.
[01:01:27]  This guy is impenetrable.
[01:01:30]  Well, he's not going to be able to answer the personal question.
[01:01:33]  We're going to take a quick break here, but when we get back, again, we can return to the subject of corruption in general.
[01:01:38]  Roger Morris, hold on.
[01:01:40]  Roger Morris, Partners in Power is his book.
[01:01:43]  New York Times bestseller list with a bullet moving fast.
[01:01:48]  It's all about the Clintons.
[01:01:49]  And we'll continue with your questions right after this.
[01:01:52]  This is Premier Networks.
[01:01:54]  That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
[01:02:28]  Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 19th, 1996.
[01:02:33]  My guest is Roger Morris.
[01:02:35]  He's written the latest book about the Clintons called Partners in Power.
[01:02:39]  And we're going to get back to him in just a moment.
[01:02:42]  Back now to Roger Morris.
[01:03:02]  Roger, I don't know if you're a science fiction fan, but if you were in the Johnson administration, and what else were you in?
[01:03:09]  In the Nixon administration.
[01:03:12]  You're old enough to remember an old science fiction movie called Forbidden Planet.
[01:03:16]  Do you remember that?
[01:03:17]  Yes, I do.
[01:03:18]  All right.
[01:03:18]  In Forbidden Planet, there was this horrible monster that turned out to be the monster from the id, that is, from within ourselves.
[01:03:28]  And to me, that's what Bill Clinton is.
[01:03:32]  He is, in effect, our creation.
[01:03:35]  He was the right man at the right time for a populace who wanted to hear exactly what they wanted to hear.
[01:03:41]  And he's the guy who knew exactly what to tell them.
[01:03:45]  Is that about right?
[01:03:46]  I think it is.
[01:03:47]  One of my chapters takes its title from a quotation of an Arkansas editor who said to me, we saw in them what we wanted to believe.
[01:03:59]  And I think that's a very accurate portrayal of a lot of people in Arkansas and indeed in the country at large in 1992.
[01:04:06]  All right.
[01:04:07]  First time caller line, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[01:04:09]  Hi.
[01:04:11]  Where are you?
[01:04:12]  Yes, hello.
[01:04:13]  This is Ian calling from Santa Barbara, California.
[01:04:15]  Yes, Ian.
[01:04:16]  Yes, I've been in Costa Rica, Central America.
[01:04:20]  Yes.
[01:04:20]  And I just got back into town, and I've been enjoying your show.
[01:04:24]  I just had a couple points, maybe less than 30 seconds, if you could.
[01:04:28]  Well, please go ahead and get to it.
[01:04:30]  Okay.
[01:04:31]  The American public is not indifferent about the elections.
[01:04:36]  And I believe that the individual needs, of course, monetarily, you know, we are, well, in my position.
[01:04:45]  They're not indifferent, sir.
[01:04:46]  They're just like the American public always is basically self-centered.
[01:04:50]  They care about their own wallet and the general health of the economy.
[01:04:53]  Right on.
[01:04:54]  So I'm saying that the effects of Clinton's actions regarding the church burning are imperative to his re-election.
[01:05:01]  All right.
[01:05:02]  That's a good point, Roger.
[01:05:04]  He's been out conspicuously in front of burned churches and that sort of thing of late.
[01:05:11]  Any comment on that?
[01:05:12]  Well, I think there's an awful irony here because he was very popular with the African-American community in Arkansas.
[01:05:19]  He made a lot of gestures like this.
[01:05:21]  He used to get 18 or 19 percent of the vote automatically in every election in Arkansas because he swept the black precincts, especially in the Mississippi Delta.
[01:05:31]  But he probably did less for the African American community in that state than any recent governor.
[01:05:38]  If you go into the Mississippi Delta today, there are third and fourth world conditions down there.
[01:05:43]  He talked the talk, but he didn't really walk the walk for the black community in Arkansas.
[01:05:49]  I don't think he's done much for blacks in America as president.
[01:05:53]  So a lot of this is political posturing.
[01:05:56]  Whatever he says about civil rights, economic opportunity and violence in the ghettos of our cities and school and other issues for black kids, still just as bad as they were four years ago.
[01:06:09]  Now, I can almost predict when he's going to give a speech, Roger, on welfare.
[01:06:12]  Every time he gets in trouble on something or another, he's going to change welfare as we know it.
[01:06:17]  Have you noticed?
[01:06:18]  Indeed, and that's an old pattern from Arkansas, too.
[01:06:20]  He had a welfare reform proposal there, which proved to be a disastrous failure.
[01:06:25]  No jobs for the people he thought should have jobs, no daycare for the kids, for single parents.
[01:06:33]  It was a disastrous program.
[01:06:34]  It didn't really take people off of welfare.
[01:06:36]  didn't help them gain independence or survive on their own.
[01:06:41]  I don't think that his proposals here are very serious.
[01:06:44]  All right.
[01:06:45]  Again, back to their relationship quickly.
[01:06:47]  There was a rumor, Roger, and there have been various rumors from the Secret Service that at times things have flown in the White House, that the First Lady may have picked up this or that and tossed it at Bill Clinton.
[01:06:59]  Do you get any of that?
[01:07:01]  I've heard the same rumors, and believe me, it would not be at all inconsistent with what happened in Arkansas.
[01:07:09]  Objects were known to fly there in the governor's mansion as well, and some very salty language, a lot of profanity.
[01:07:15]  In fact, the First Lady of Arkansas, now the First Lady of the United States, was known to curse like a sailor.
[01:07:23]  And we have that directly on the record from state police bodyguards and other aides who saw and knew them intimately.
[01:07:31]  So these stories don't surprise me.
[01:07:33]  The Clintons had a very stormy relationship and in many respects a very seedy one.
[01:07:38]  All right, wildcard line, you're on the air with Richard Morris.
[01:07:41]  Hi.
[01:07:42]  Richard, I thought it was Roger.
[01:07:44]  Roger.
[01:07:44]  Yes, you're correct.
[01:07:46]  I'm incorrect.
[01:07:46]  Roger Morris.
[01:07:47]  Go right ahead.
[01:07:48]  Hi, Art.
[01:07:49]  Hi, Roger.
[01:07:50]  This is Jim out in L.A. Last time I was on, I was shouting against a skinhead.
[01:07:56]  I'd like to go over Clinton's presidency.
[01:08:00]  You know, domestic, you know, it seems like unemployment's down, stock market's booming, trends are less government.
[01:08:08]  You say he has no foreign policy.
[01:08:11]  It seems to me the Russians just went through a democratic election, and that seems to be going pretty good.
[01:08:17]  China seemed to be holding training maneuvers, and it seems China backed down when, you know, at least on this show, there were atomic threats being bandied about.
[01:08:29]  North Korea seemed to have some problems, and that seemed to fizzle off.
[01:08:34]  Bosnia, Somalia.
[01:08:40]  All right, I'm not sure you want to include Somalia.
[01:08:43]  You're doing pretty well here, but there were problems, certainly, in Somalia, that are traceable to this administration.
[01:08:51]  But with respect to the other foreign policy matters you're talking about, yes.
[01:08:56]  Basically, they have not been abysmal failures.
[01:08:59]  Roger, have they?
[01:09:01]  But is that luck?
[01:09:02]  Is that because of what he has done or what he has not done?
[01:09:06]  Well, I think those have been very conventional foreign policy issues that you're discussing.
[01:09:11]  I don't think he's done anything out of the ordinary there but continue the policies of previous administrations.
[01:09:18]  And none of those problems have gone away.
[01:09:20]  The North Koreans have still got a proliferation problem with nuclear weapons.
[01:09:24]  Chinese are still abusing human rights, and the Taiwan issue has not been settled.
[01:09:29]  Bosnia, as you well know, is still in turmoil, and Somalia still is.
[01:09:33]  They're still starving people all over Africa.
[01:09:36]  The larger economic problems in the world have not been solved at all.
[01:09:41]  The dollar is still in a very weak condition.
[01:09:44]  I think that the condition of the American economy is precarious despite all the upward trends here.
[01:09:51]  I don't know any serious economist who thinks that in the long run we're in good shape.
[01:09:56]  So we can debate Bill Clinton's policies as president.
[01:10:01]  My point really was very simple, which is that he hasn't had much time, for better or for worse, to devote to either domestic or foreign policy because so much of the energy of this administration has been consumed by Whitewater and by Paula Jones and by scandals of the Arkansas past.
[01:10:17]  He would have had a lot more time and a lot more energy to devote if he hadn't had such a corrupt record in Arkansas.
[01:10:23]  All right.
[01:10:23]  No matter what happens in Russia, and it looks like the deal is in.
[01:10:26]  It's going to be Yeltsin again, and that I guess would be good for us because we've had all our eggs in his basket.
[01:10:32]  But at best, about half the Russian people, or near half, basically want a return to communism.
[01:10:39]  So somewhere down the line, there could be a big problem with Russia.
[01:10:42]  They've got 20,000 nuclear weapons still, basically either pointed at or that could be pointed at us very quickly.
[01:10:52]  I'm sure they still are, frankly.
[01:10:53]  If this president was ever faced with a really serious presidential kind of first strike, what do we do kind of decision, how much trouble would we be in?
[01:11:07]  I don't have very much confidence in Bill Clinton as a crisis manager.
[01:11:11]  He never managed crisis very well again in his years as governor of Arkansas.
[01:11:17]  He hasn't had to confront, thank God, anything very earth-shattering in these first three and a half years.
[01:11:22]  But he is not known as a particularly cool customer.
[01:11:27]  His aides are not particularly strong or brilliant in national security affairs.
[01:11:32]  I think he would be a very political decision-maker.
[01:11:35]  He might well make his choices in terms of what his political fortunes were.
[01:11:40]  That's the peril, of course, of being under siege at home as he is, making a decision about a fateful foreign policy issue in terms of his popularity or in terms of the political problems of the moment, not in terms of the long-range interests of the country.
[01:11:54]  Warren Christopher is an interesting individual who, in my opinion, doesn't do very much of anything.
[01:11:59]  The effective Secretary of State is more like Jimmy Carter.
[01:12:03]  If we run into real trouble, is that who the president would turn to again?
[01:12:08]  Well, I'm not sure.
[01:12:10]  I think that's part of the weakness of this administration.
[01:12:12]  We don't know who would be in charge in a case like that.
[01:12:16]  My old associate from the Nixon administration, Tony Lake, whom I knew very well in government.
[01:12:22]  We were close friends and colleagues.
[01:12:24]  He's his national security advisor.
[01:12:27]  But Tony has played a rather diffident role in this administration.
[01:12:30]  There is no strong commanding figure and no one with a real conceptual sense of what the post-Cold War world ought to look like.
[01:12:38]  So I think the weakness in foreign policy would be quite immediately evident if we faced a real crisis.
[01:12:45]  So we've got a dysfunctional family in the White House.
[01:12:49]  I think we certainly do.
[01:12:50]  We've got one politically and one that's not recognizing the seriousness of the problem.
[01:12:55]  I think they're simply hoping that it will go away.
[01:12:57]  I think Washington, the White House, the American political system is in a serious, serious state of denial.
[01:13:03]  All right.
[01:13:04]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[01:13:07]  Hello, Art.
[01:13:07]  Always enjoy your show.
[01:13:08]  Roger, really enjoying the interview tonight.
[01:13:11]  Just real quickly regarding that last caller talking about some of the triumphs of the Clinton foreign policy.
[01:13:16]  I think Clinton handles his foreign policy very much like he does his domestic policy in being the consummate politician that tells people what they want to hear.
[01:13:25]  And foreign policy, I think, takes a lot longer for those policies to be realized.
[01:13:31]  And so we may inherit a quagmire, I think, down the road with some of his foreign policy.
[01:13:36]  But more importantly, I had an observation that I'd like to just pass on quickly and have Art or Roger both comment on.
[01:13:42]  You know, we're hearing so many things that have been mishandled in this Clinton administration.
[01:13:47]  Things that I think we would agree with a Republican president would have called for impeachment of that individual.
[01:13:54]  But yet I keep hearing, and in fact, Art, you've made a comment that you don't think much would be different in a Dole administration.
[01:14:00]  And I think we can all agree that we had a man who served 30 years or whatever that was a patriot, served honorably.
[01:14:08]  Maybe he's not as charismatic and so forth.
[01:14:12]  I believe he's an honorable man.
[01:14:14]  But we don't have this history that we have in just four years.
[01:14:17]  Yes, but we have, sir, we have some history.
[01:14:19]  In other words, Bob Dole as majority leader and before that minority leader, his job literally was compromised.
[01:14:25]  Sure.
[01:14:26]  But that's not criminal.
[01:14:28]  And we have things that are being looked at as signs of crime attached to them with this Clinton administration.
[01:14:38]  And I'm just saying that what amazes me, and in fact, Roger, here's my compromise.
[01:14:42]  I'll buy your book.
[01:14:43]  With as much as you're saying bad about the administration, whether you're independent or not, it's going to come down to two people, I think, Bob Dole and Bill Clinton.
[01:14:51]  And, Art, are you and Roger, are you going to just go ahead and kind of throw up your hands and maybe vote for Bill Clinton just because we don't see a charismatic man in Bob Dole when we have an honorable man, even though we may not think he's real energetic and someone who, you know, is...
[01:15:08]  All right, I think we get the idea.
[01:15:10]  It's a fair question.
[01:15:11]  Roger, what about that?
[01:15:12]  Well, I certainly am not going to vote for Bill Clinton.
[01:15:15]  And I don't know that I could bring myself to vote for Bob Dole, knowing, as you said, what his record has been in the Senate.
[01:15:22]  He's been in the pocket of special interests himself.
[01:15:25]  If one looks very closely at the Dole record, there's not much to recommend it.
[01:15:29]  But I think this is the end of this system in so many ways.
[01:15:33]  I think that's why we've got to face up to the problem in both parties and reform this system from the ground up.
[01:15:41]  I don't think the Clintons are special cases at all.
[01:15:44]  I think they're emblematic of that failure, and this election is a terrible choice.
[01:15:48]  Roger, who do you like?
[01:15:50]  Who do I like in American politics?
[01:15:52]  That's right.
[01:15:53]  You know, I think there are a handful of people who represent the kind of integrity that I'm talking about.
[01:16:00]  Congressman Jim Leach, for example, who's chairman of the House Banking Committee, is a moderate Republican from Iowa.
[01:16:06]  I think he's in the middle of this whitewater controversy, much less conspicuous than Senator D'Amato on the Senate side, but conducting a methodical and thorough and, I think, fair-minded inquiry into the Clintons' past in Arkansas.
[01:16:22]  Jim Leach, I think, represents the best of American politics.
[01:16:26]  There are not very many like that on either side of the aisle.
[01:16:30]  I think only a handful of politicians, none of whom are running for president.

=== Sensational Charges Surrounding Clinton (08:27) ===

[01:16:34]  All right, well, let me reach out to the other side.
[01:16:36]  What do you think of Sam Nunn?
[01:16:38]  Sam Nunn, I think, was in many respects a creature of the old order that I'm talking about.
[01:16:45]  I think he was a highly intelligent and disciplined man.
[01:16:48]  But, you know, early on in the going, Sam Nunn had some of the same conflicts of interest in Georgia that we're talking about with the Clintons.
[01:16:55]  I don't think he was a paragon by any means.
[01:16:58]  All right.
[01:16:59]  From Craig in Oklahoma, he says your book is so hot that a lot of people refuse to have anything to do with it.
[01:17:06]  And those would include 60 Minutes, Prime Time Live, Larry King Nightline, Dateline, Today Show, C-SPAN book notes, and so forth.
[01:17:15]  Is that what you're running into?
[01:17:16]  That's what I've run into.
[01:17:18]  I think it's been too hot to handle.
[01:17:19]  I think that a lot of the so-called mainstream heavy hitters in the media have cowered from it.
[01:17:26]  I'm hoping that being on the bestseller list, the kind of populist reception, word of mouth, the popularity the book has enjoyed, and from shows like this, that they'll take another look because those are still powerful institutions.
[01:17:39]  I think they have an obligation to tell their listeners, their viewers, what's going on.
[01:17:45]  But he's quite right.
[01:17:47]  It's been rejected and sort of ignored.
[01:17:50]  They've been looking the other way.
[01:17:52]  And yet it climbs the bestseller list anyway.
[01:17:54]  Roger, for the record, you sound like a happy, bright, energetic guy.
[01:18:00]  You don't have any suicidal tendencies, do you?
[01:18:03]  No, I don't.
[01:18:04]  You know, in doing this book, I had people warn me in Arkansas and elsewhere that there was some danger in doing this kind of thing.
[01:18:12]  And, you know, I was born and raised in the Midwest, in Kansas City.
[01:18:16]  I guess I'm an old-fashioned patriot who still thinks that you ought to be able to speak your mind in America, and I'm operating on that premise.
[01:18:24]  And you love life.
[01:18:25]  I do indeed.
[01:18:26]  All right.
[01:18:26]  Good.
[01:18:27]  For the record.
[01:18:28]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air with Roger Morris.
[01:18:30]  Hello.
[01:18:30]  Mr. Arthur's Russell in Los Angeles.
[01:18:33]  Yes, hi.
[01:18:33]  Yes, Dr. Morris.
[01:18:36]  In your book, you described a surveillance tape with Roger Clinton on it and a drug deal.
[01:18:42]  Yes.
[01:18:43]  And in that, he's quoted as saying, I've got to get some for my brother.
[01:18:48]  He has a nose like a vacuum cleaner.
[01:18:51]  Did he, really?
[01:18:52]  Yes, that's a police surveillance tape that was done locally in Arkansas by local law enforcement part of the investigation of Roger Clinton in 1984 and part of a mountain of evidence about his involvement with the cocaine trade, his use of cocaine.
[01:19:11]  And in this case, of course, part of a lot of testimony, as the book points out, of Bill Clinton's personal cocaine use.
[01:19:18]  And, you know, again, it's like the women.
[01:19:20]  I was not concerned about the personal moral question here about what Bill Clinton was doing in terms of drugs.
[01:19:26]  I was concerned with the political issue of cover-up hypocrisy.
[01:19:29]  He was supposedly leading the war on drugs in Arkansas at the time.
[01:19:33]  He knew his brother was deeply involved.
[01:19:36]  Lots of improprieties in the cover-up of and the damage control of the Roger Clinton case.
[01:19:42]  And lots of testimony from law enforcement and other sources that Bill Clinton himself not only used the drug, but was in the presence of people who were dealing and using in rather substantial amounts.
[01:19:53]  Well, listen to the likes of William Bennett, who will say that this administration has the very worst record on finding drugs of any in all of his memory.
[01:20:03]  You know, that's one of the most disturbing aspects, that the record in Arkansas was so shameful, so tolerant of massive crime.
[01:20:12]  The president was so linked to drug dealers and to criminal elements there, and his administration in Washington has turned out to be, I think, very inept, very unenthusiastic about pursuing any of those law enforcement efforts.
[01:20:27]  So I think it's a very ominous record.
[01:20:31]  Years ago, the popular belief, Roger, was that the next Democrat president that we get at that time thought, if we ever get one, would legalize marijuana or at least decriminalize it.
[01:20:44]  This president could not do that, could he?
[01:20:48]  He was crippled politically from doing that by his own involvement in drug use.
[01:20:54]  He admitted, of course, that he had tried marijuana and didn't inhale, which was a blatant lie.
[01:21:00]  There are lots of people on the record, as the book points out, who say that he was quite adept, that he had all the equipment and knew quite how to use it.
[01:21:09]  No, he was prevented from doing that, and of course, that's going to be an act of Congress, not simply an act by a president.
[01:21:16]  But there has been no leadership at all, I think, in confronting the drug problem, either in terms of treatment or rehabilitation or dealing with the social problems that lead to it, or least of all in law enforcement.
[01:21:29]  Well, he, of recent days, has been surrounding himself with the law enforcement types.
[01:21:33]  A lot of pictures on the steps with police officers, that kind of thing.
[01:21:36]  Yeah, there's a new war on drugs, which is, I think, our 30th or 40th new war on drugs.
[01:21:43]  And most of the serious law enforcement sources I know think it's something of a mockery.
[01:21:48]  All right.
[01:21:49]  Roger, your book is bestseller, so I assume people can go into their favorite bookstore and ask for Roger Morris's partners in power.
[01:21:58]  Do you have any numbers or anything you want to give out?
[01:22:00]  No, it's the Henry Holt and Company.
[01:22:02]  It should be available in every bookstore.
[01:22:04]  It's available on the Internet.
[01:22:06]  You can order it from the publisher if you can't find it at your local bookstore.
[01:22:10]  Partners in Power, the Clintons in their America.
[01:22:13]  It's a thoroughly documented book.
[01:22:15]  We've been saying a lot of things tonight about sensational charges and sensational news.
[01:22:22]  It's a thoroughly documented dual biography of the two of them with 30 pages, single space pages of footnotes.
[01:22:30]  This is a serious history of the making of a president, and I think ought to be read by every thinking American.
[01:22:36]  All right.
[01:22:37]  Having said all that, I want to thank you for being here tonight and remind everybody you said you were a fun-loving, life-loving guy with no suicidal tendencies.
[01:22:45]  Absolutely.
[01:22:46]  I wish you well out there on the book grind.
[01:22:49]  It is a grind, Roger.
[01:22:50]  Thank you.
[01:22:51]  Thank you.
[01:22:51]  Take care.
[01:22:52]  That's Roger Morris, who wrote Partners in Power.
[01:22:56]  It's about the hottest new thing on bookstands about the Clintons.
[01:23:00]  There you've got it.
[01:23:01]  When we come back, open line talk radio.
[01:23:03]  I'm Art Bell.
[01:23:04]  The trip back in time continues with Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM.
[01:23:09]  More Somewhere in Time coming up.
[01:23:13]  We take you back to the past on
[01:23:44]  ART BELL, Somewhere In Time.
[01:23:46]  Top of the morning from the high desert.
[01:23:48]  We just spent two very powerfully indicting hours with Roger Morris, author of Partners in Power, New York Times bestseller list, portrait of the Clintons.
[01:24:02]  What a portrait, huh?
[01:24:04]  Now, I got a call from Graham Hancock, who was airborne about two hours ago, just before the program, on his way to Dallas.
[01:24:18]  And he said, you know, after the program, our New York office got so many calls about where we were going to be and when are we going to be there that he asked if I would go ahead and plug when he's going to be in L.A. It'll be Monday, June 24th, the Phoenix Bookstore at 1514 5th Street in Santa Monica.
[01:24:39]  He'll be there from 7 to 8:30 in Portland, Oregon.
[01:24:43]  Wednesday, June 26th, 23rd Avenue Books is the place in Portland, 23rd Avenue Books, 1015 Northwest 23rd Avenue in Portland.

=== Counterfeit Cash Conspiracy (04:16) ===

[01:24:56]  Then Seattle at the University Bookstore.
[01:24:59]  Friday, June 28th.
[01:25:01]  That's the University Bookstore at 4326 University Way in Seattle.
[01:25:08]  And Graham Hancock in San Francisco at the Gaia Bookstore in Berkeley at 7 o'clock.
[01:25:17]  So he's going to be all over the place.
[01:25:19]  And if you're in one of those places, be sure to catch Graham Hancock.
[01:25:22]  He was fascinating.
[01:25:24]  And again, with his program, you'd do well to get a copy of it.
[01:25:27]  1-800-917-4278.
[01:25:31]  Tomorrow, Luba Brezhnev.
[01:25:35]  And she is the niece of Leonid Brezhnev.
[01:25:39]  And she's gone through absolute hell.
[01:25:42]  Luba will talk to us about Russia.
[01:25:45]  She'll talk to us about the elections, the runoffs coming July 5th in Russia.
[01:25:52]  And I've got a lot of interest in talking to Luba because she's going to tell us what it's like in Moscow.
[01:25:58]  And she, you know what she told me earlier today?
[01:26:00]  She said, don't carry your passport.
[01:26:02]  She said, American passports go for about $28,000 American dollars.
[01:26:09]  $28,000 American dollars?
[01:26:11]  I said, Luba, geez, maybe I had to sell it, you know.
[01:26:15]  Why die for it?
[01:26:16]  Just go over there and it's $28,000 American dollars.
[01:26:19]  At any rate, she seriously suggested I take my passport to the American embassy in Moscow before braving the streets of Moscow.
[01:26:30]  And I think I'll probably accept that advice.
[01:26:34]  So we'll go to open lines here shortly.
[01:26:37]  A guest again tomorrow night.
[01:26:38]  I'm on a real guest jag for some reason.
[01:26:41]  I go in cycles with guests.
[01:26:42]  For a while, I really want guests.
[01:26:45]  And then I'll go a month without having one.
[01:26:47]  So it's just been sort of an orgy of guesting.
[01:26:53]  The new $100 bills are out.
[01:26:56]  Have you seen them?
[01:26:57]  Oh, by the way, you know, I've got a story about the new $100 bills.
[01:27:01]  Secret Service agents working with the U.S., this from Reuters, working with the U.S. Attorney's Office, seized $30 million in guess what?
[01:27:11]  Counterfeit $100 bills.
[01:27:14]  Joseph Gallows, special agent in charge of the investigation, announced that Ronnie Sims, 40 of Austin, Texas, was arrested late Tuesday in connection with the bust.
[01:27:25]  The largest seizure of counterfeit money in state history.
[01:27:30]  Gallows said the counterfeit hundreds were produced by an elaborate system using a printing press with quality paper.
[01:27:38]  Quote, this money was very passable.
[01:27:42]  It was completed to a stage where it was ready to be cut.
[01:27:47]  Agents said the fake money was to be distributed abroad.
[01:27:53]  So again, would like to welcome Kern, K-E-R-N in Bakersfield to the program.
[01:27:59]  good to have you along we just talked about it Whitewater is the big news tonight.
[01:28:24]  The president's closest political ally, alloy, he's almost an alloy.
[01:28:33]  Friend, Bruce Lindsay is going to be named an unindicted co-conspirator.
[01:28:39]  It involved, seems to involve campaign loans during the time that Bill Clinton was governor of Arkansas.
[01:28:44]  Lindsay handled many of those loans so close to the Prez that not a move is made without him.

=== AIDS Breakthrough? (02:46) ===

[01:28:54]  So naming Lindsay is going to allow the special prosecutor to call him as a witness in the trial of two Arkansas bankers coming up, Herbert Branscombe.
[01:29:05]  And as a matter of fact, officials are actually worried that he may still be indicted, yet may be indicted for possible perjury or obstruction of justice.
[01:29:16]  The FBI tape thing is going on.
[01:29:19]  Two church fires, correct that.
[01:29:22]  Two black men have been charged in the torching of a black church in North Carolina last month.
[01:29:30]  These are the first black men charged in the torching of a black church.
[01:29:36]  AIDS news.
[01:29:38]  Scientists call it a major advance in basic research into AIDS, age, AIDS, molecules on the surface of cells that allow the virus to attach itself have been discovered.
[01:29:51]  Now, it's very, very important if they can discover how the AIDS virus attaches itself to a cell, then they may be able to prevent it.
[01:30:01]  And this is an important discovery down that road.
[01:30:05]  It could lead to either a treatment or a vaccine for AIDS.
[01:30:09]  A swarm of 90 minor quakes is hitting the Mammoth Lakes area again.
[01:30:15]  So we have entered another time of quake movement worry in the Mammoth Lakes area.
[01:30:23]  One of these days, one of this series is going to result in something new.
[01:30:30]  Six-point earthquakes all over the place.
[01:30:34]  As a matter of fact, looking back through the 1st of May, there have been 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10 six-point earthquakes around the world.
[01:30:46]  This is probably a quickening item.
[01:30:50]  Art, did you hear the news, the news article in the Associated Press, the Saskatoon, Saskatchewan Times, I guess, 14-year-old boy influenced by a horror film that he had seen, get this, ten times killed a playmate, skinned him, and then cooked his flesh on the stove.
[01:31:15]  His attorney said he was under delusion after seeing the movie Warlock.

=== Levitation Queries (12:49) ===

[01:31:22]  The boy apparently believed that if you cut the fat off a virgin, unbaptized child, then boiled it and drank it down, you'd have the power to fly.
[01:31:35]  He killed him by stabbing him several times until the paring knife became stuck in the boy's eye.
[01:31:44]  Well, Art, I only have one thing to say, the quickening.
[01:31:48]  That's from Port Orchard, Washington.
[01:31:52]  So there you've got it.
[01:31:54]  Does anybody out there know anything about levitation?
[01:31:59]  I've got a fax here from a fellow in Arizona talking about levitation.
[01:32:06]  And we'll get to that.
[01:32:07]  Right now, to the phones, open lines, unscreened, you name it.
[01:32:11]  We'll talk about it.
[01:32:12]  Talk radio.
[01:32:14]  First time caller line, you're on, would have been on the air.
[01:32:17]  West of the rock, whoops.
[01:32:19]  Oh, I see what's happening.
[01:32:21]  Let me do corrective surgery on my little machine down here.
[01:32:26]  In the meantime, we'll go over here.
[01:32:28]  First time caller line, you're on the air.
[01:32:30]  Hi.
[01:32:31]  Hello.
[01:32:32]  Hello.
[01:32:33]  Yes.
[01:32:34]  Turn your radio off, please.
[01:32:37]  Got it.
[01:32:38]  Good.
[01:32:39]  Yeah, this is Fred from Maltby, Washington.
[01:32:41]  Hi, Fred.
[01:32:43]  I was going to call and find out if you'd heard about the new bonds the government's issuing.
[01:32:48]  New bonds.
[01:32:48]  New bonds.
[01:32:50]  The Gindrich bond.
[01:32:52]  A Gingrich bond.
[01:32:53]  Which has no maturity.
[01:32:55]  A Dole Bond, which has no interest.
[01:32:59]  And the new Clinton bond, which has no principle.
[01:33:04]  That is funny.
[01:33:05]  You get points for that.
[01:33:06]  That was genuinely funny.
[01:33:10]  It's a sad state of affairs we're in right now in this country, isn't it?
[01:33:14]  Nice to hear your show, and we listen to you every night.
[01:33:17]  Thank you.
[01:33:18]  Take care.
[01:33:20]  Gee.
[01:33:22]  It really is true, isn't it?
[01:33:24]  We're in a sad state of affairs.
[01:33:28]  Gingrich, all the fire and passion that he had squandered with words that seemed to shoot himself in the foot all the time.
[01:33:41]  Bob Dole, just unable to generate any interest, really.
[01:33:49]  Possibly a winner by default, because we have a president who is in default.
[01:33:55]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:33:57]  Whoops.
[01:33:57]  Oh, no, the sucker is just going to have to be.
[01:34:01]  I see we're going to have to perform major surgery on that.
[01:34:05]  Technical difficulties, we will call it.
[01:34:08]  That's all right.
[01:34:09]  I can yank the power cord from its rear and make it reset.
[01:34:13]  In the meantime, wildcard line, you're on the air.
[01:34:15]  Hello.
[01:34:15]  Art.
[01:34:16]  Yes.
[01:34:18]  Hi.
[01:34:19]  I think Morris is right about Leach.
[01:34:21]  I think he looks like a very good man.
[01:34:25]  Well, unfortunately, though, he is not running.
[01:34:28]  Well, at least he's in the government.
[01:34:31]  Another thing I think we might be living, there's a line from Caligula.
[01:34:37]  Let all the poisons in the mud seep out.
[01:34:41]  We might be living through that.
[01:34:44]  That was a very good joke that guy had.
[01:34:46]  It was, wasn't it?
[01:34:47]  Yeah.
[01:34:48]  All right.
[01:34:49]  Thank you.
[01:34:51]  Yes, it was.
[01:34:54]  Funny in the sense that you should laugh lest you cry.
[01:35:01]  That's been my problem, you know, with politics generally.
[01:35:05]  The nation is not engaged.
[01:35:07]  I am not engaged.
[01:35:08]  I'm sort of a better word.
[01:35:11]  What is a better word?
[01:35:13]  Disgusted?
[01:35:16]  For me to get engaged, I need somebody I believe in.
[01:35:20]  I need somebody out there that I think is going to change what I think is wrong.
[01:35:25]  And I wish I could say that I see that person.
[01:35:28]  I don't.
[01:35:30]  A miracle from Bob Dole, maybe.
[01:35:34]  But if history is a teacher, I don't expect it.
[01:35:40]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:35:42]  Hello.
[01:35:43]  Hi, Art.
[01:35:43]  Hi.
[01:35:44]  This is Mark in Little Rock.
[01:35:45]  How are you doing?
[01:35:46]  Okay, Mark.
[01:35:47]  I was listening to your show the past couple hours, and I wanted to talk about Bill Clinton.
[01:35:55]  What will it take for him to vindicate himself of all these allegations and everything that's going on around him right now?
[01:36:04]  Since you're in Little Rock, I don't know.
[01:36:05]  I don't have that answer, but you're in Little Rock, and I assume he's got a lot of support in Little Rock.
[01:36:12]  That's about 50-50.
[01:36:14]  About 50-50 now, huh?
[01:36:16]  I'd say that, you know, just me being out in the public, because I'm a 25-year-old male, and I'm not around politicians very much, but it's pretty much, we're going amok down here, because Bill Clinton has run us into an economical disaster hole down here.
[01:36:33]  Taxes are unbelievable down here, Art.
[01:36:37]  The cost of living is terrible.
[01:36:39]  The unemployment rate is up.
[01:36:43]  It's pretty bad down here, man.
[01:36:44]  And your guest, Mr. Morris, said that he kind of fought to the media down here for not informing the public of Bill Clinton's previous runnings in the governorship down here.
[01:37:00]  I think it pretty much should have been known that Arkansas has been 48, 49, 50, and everything you want to think about, every category compared to other states for the last five to six, seven years that I would know of.
[01:37:15]  Yeah, the media, though, really didn't give that much attention, not as much as they should have.
[01:37:20]  And there were a lot of people calling from Arkansas saying you'll be sorry.
[01:37:24]  I agree.
[01:37:25]  I probably would have been one of those persons if I ever known you about your show then.
[01:37:30]  I see.
[01:37:31]  Well, you asked, what is it going to take for him to get out of this?
[01:37:36]  Yes, and another question, if all these allegations and these accusations were wrong about him, what would America think of Bill Clinton then?
[01:37:49]  Would they support him?
[01:37:52]  I would rather think so.
[01:37:53]  Oh, yes.
[01:37:54]  Thank you very much.
[01:37:54]  In other words, the economy is rolling along on a fairly even keel.
[01:38:02]  The market's up.
[01:38:03]  Interest rates are not outrageous.
[01:38:04]  They remain low.
[01:38:06]  Jobs, though people complain and worry, are fairly plentiful.
[01:38:12]  So I would think, yes.
[01:38:14]  Minus the kind of scandals that are developing, plural certainly, Bill Clinton would be an easy ride into the White House.
[01:38:23]  I still believe he will win.
[01:38:27]  But like Mr. Morris, I think shortly after the election, there's going to be quite a ride.
[01:38:32]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:38:34]  Hello.
[01:38:36]  Hello there.
[01:38:38]  No, you're not.
[01:38:39]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[01:38:41]  Good morning.
[01:38:41]  Good morning, Art Bill from Youngstown, Ohio.
[01:38:43]  Yes, sir.
[01:38:44]  When you were doing the remote viewing the other night, I tried my darndest and couldn't get through.
[01:38:49]  I did see some things, but you had said that you would tell us what it was at the top of the hour or you go off at 5 a.m.
[01:38:56]  Higher.
[01:38:56]  Oh, I see.
[01:38:57]  All right.
[01:38:58]  Well, it was six dolphins.
[01:39:00]  Six dolphins?
[01:39:01]  Yep.
[01:39:02]  Did the guy that faxed you say six dolphins?
[01:39:05]  Well, he didn't say six dolphins.
[01:39:07]  But he actually saw a dolphin.
[01:39:08]  Yes, uh-huh.
[01:39:09]  Well, that's impressive.
[01:39:10]  I thought so.
[01:39:11]  Okay, can I ask one more thing?
[01:39:13]  Yes.
[01:39:14]  Remember when Jennifer Flowers am I correct that she sold tapes to the National Star?
[01:39:22]  Do you recall that being in the media of conversations with Bill Clinton?
[01:39:27]  I certainly recall the tapes, anyway.
[01:39:30]  Okay, why?
[01:39:31]  My question always has been, since it's illegal to tape a conversation without asking the person's permission, which she certainly wouldn't have done in that case, why wasn't she arrested?
[01:39:43]  Well, I'm not sure.
[01:39:45]  I don't have the answer to that.
[01:39:47]  I just don't have the answer.
[01:39:49]  I thank you for the call, but I don't have the answer to that.
[01:39:53]  Generally, it is not legal, as he points out, to tape somebody without their permission.
[01:39:59]  So it is a good question.
[01:40:01]  First time caller line, you're on the air.
[01:40:04]  Hi.
[01:40:05]  This is Art.
[01:40:06]  It is, yes.
[01:40:07]  Hey, how are you?
[01:40:08]  Okay.
[01:40:09]  My name's Holly.
[01:40:09]  I'm calling about Chupacabra.
[01:40:11]  Okay, Holly, what do you know about the Chupacabra?
[01:40:14]  A lot.
[01:40:16]  You do?
[01:40:17]  He's a very intelligent individual.
[01:40:20]  And I'm a psychic.
[01:40:23]  I'm a mental telepic.
[01:40:25]  And I have spoken to him under mental telepathy.
[01:40:29]  Wait a minute, wait a minute, wait a minute.
[01:40:30]  Turn your radio off, dear.
[01:40:32]  It's number one.
[01:40:33]  Number two, now wait a minute.
[01:40:35]  Bill, turn that radio off.
[01:40:36]  Turn that radio off, Bill.
[01:40:38]  Now, you say you have spoken to the chupacabra.
[01:40:41]  Exactly.
[01:40:41]  What did the chupacabra say?
[01:40:43]  I mean, why?
[01:40:44]  When you told me why he was here?
[01:40:46]  Good, why?
[01:40:46]  We want to know.
[01:40:47]  Why?
[01:40:48]  I have a letter.
[01:40:49]  I wrote down everything that he told me under mental telepathy.
[01:40:52]  I'm a pro.
[01:40:53]  All right, look, look, look.
[01:40:54]  You already said that.
[01:40:55]  I want to know why he's here.
[01:40:59]  Yes.
[01:40:59]  To experience mankind and to bring upon his world.
[01:41:05]  What do you mean, experience mankind?
[01:41:07]  He's sucking the blood from goats and maybe even human beings.
[01:41:10]  He has an explanation to that, too.
[01:41:12]  What kind of experience with mankind is that?
[01:41:15]  To become part of this world.
[01:41:19]  By drinking it up, huh?
[01:41:21]  Well, there's an explanation behind it.
[01:41:24]  Well, the whole thing scares me, and, uh...
[01:41:26]  It doesn't scare me because I...
[01:41:28]  You're trying to tell us that Chupacabra's a nice guy?
[01:41:32]  Or?
[01:41:32]  He's from another galaxy.
[01:41:34]  What galaxy is he from?
[01:41:36]  Europa.
[01:41:37]  Europa.
[01:41:38]  He's got a name for it.
[01:41:40]  I've got it written down here if I can find it.
[01:41:42]  Must be a very bloody place.
[01:41:46]  No, it's not.
[01:41:47]  No, it's not.
[01:41:48]  All right, well.
[01:41:52]  All right, all right.
[01:41:53]  Hold on, hold on.
[01:41:53]  We'll be right back.
[01:41:55]  You're listening to Art Bell somewhere in time.
[01:41:58]  Tonight featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 19, 1996.
[01:42:34]  Premier Networks presents Art Bell, Somewhere in Time.
[01:42:39]  Tonight featuring Coast to Coast A.M. from June 19th, 1996.
[01:42:44]  In a moment, we're going to find out how you get to be a pro-psychic.
[01:42:49]  Which university gives a degree in that?
[01:42:51]  And more about the chupacabra.
[01:43:16]  How do you get to be a pro-psychic?
[01:43:19]  Are you asking me?
[01:43:20]  Well, you're the psychic, right?
[01:43:22]  All right.
[01:43:22]  I don't know.
[01:43:23]  It's a gift.
[01:43:24]  It's a gift from God.
[01:43:26]  Well, then you don't get like a certificate or anything.
[01:43:30]  I don't know, not really.
[01:43:32]  Kind of.
[01:43:33]  Okay, I understand.
[01:43:35]  So it's just one of those things that is.
[01:43:39]  I met the I don't know what you call it.
[01:43:48]  The I conquered the Ten Commandments.
[01:43:51]  Yeah, right.

=== Swear Robin's Laugh (03:49) ===

[01:43:53]  Wait a minute.
[01:43:54]  Now, what about the Ten Commandments?
[01:43:55]  I don't want to get into it.
[01:43:56]  Well, then, why did you mention it?
[01:43:58]  Because it's how I did it.
[01:44:00]  I can communicate with anybody on this earth through mental telepathy.
[01:44:06]  Wow.
[01:44:07]  Abel, I want to.
[01:44:08]  Because I was given a gift.
[01:44:11]  All right.
[01:44:11]  Well, then let me see you do it.
[01:44:13]  Communicate with me telepathically.
[01:44:15]  Give me a message.
[01:44:16]  I love you.
[01:44:18]  That wasn't telepathically.
[01:44:20]  That's it.
[01:44:21]  That's it.
[01:44:21]  Your history.
[01:44:22]  I love you is, as said out loud, is not a telepathic message.
[01:44:28]  Now, if I'd cleared my mind and I'd have received an I love you telepathically and you'd said yes, that was it or something, well then fine.
[01:44:38]  I could go along with it.
[01:44:39]  But under these circumstances, I declare you not to be a pro.
[01:44:44]  On to the next call.
[01:44:46]  On my wildcard line, no, the international line, you're on the air.
[01:44:51]  Hello, Art.
[01:44:52]  Hello there.
[01:44:53]  Where are you?
[01:44:53]  I'm up here in Everett, Washington, where they built Boeing 747.
[01:44:57]  Well, I don't know how you got on my international line, but you're on the wrong line, sir.
[01:45:01]  I appreciate the call.
[01:45:02]  Thank you, but you're on the wrong line.
[01:45:04]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:45:06]  Good morning.
[01:45:07]  No, you're not.
[01:45:08]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:45:10]  Hi.
[01:45:10]  Hi, Art.
[01:45:11]  Let's change the topic totally.
[01:45:13]  You may have mentioned this a couple weeks ago, but I haven't been listening in as much as I used to.
[01:45:18]  All right.
[01:45:19]  Did you see the movie The Arrival?
[01:45:21]  No, I've not seen it yet, but I saw the making of The Arrival, so I know what it's about.
[01:45:26]  Oh, I mean, I assume that's something that interests you.
[01:45:29]  Of course.
[01:45:30]  I mean, have you had any callers call you up about it?
[01:45:33]  Oh, yes.
[01:45:34]  Is the consensus been that they like it?
[01:45:38]  Yes.
[01:45:39]  Good advice.
[01:45:40]  I didn't like it.
[01:45:41]  Oh, really?
[01:45:42]  And I certainly don't mind those sorts of things.
[01:45:44]  What is it that you didn't like about it?
[01:45:48]  Well, it opens, like, the build-up is good.
[01:45:53]  So I certainly didn't have a hard time sitting there watching it.
[01:45:57]  Like, when it's all said and done, you sort of go.
[01:46:00]  Well, now, don't give away the answer.
[01:46:01]  No, I'm not.
[01:46:01]  I'm not.
[01:46:02]  I'm not one of those sort of people.
[01:46:04]  I don't allow that.
[01:46:05]  I mean, those people ought to be shot.
[01:46:07]  I agree.
[01:46:08]  I had a friend who told me the end of the movie, The War of the Roses, before I saw it.
[01:46:12]  Oh, you've got to be kidding.
[01:46:13]  Yeah, and I was like, That's no friend.
[01:46:15]  That's no friend.
[01:46:16]  Tell me about it.
[01:46:17]  But yeah, after all is said and done, you know, and you're walking into the theater, you go, did I need to sit through two hours for that?
[01:46:24]  Hmm.
[01:46:25]  Now, did you ever get to see Strange Days?
[01:46:27]  No.
[01:46:28]  All right, come on.
[01:46:29]  You're missing them left and right here.
[01:46:31]  Why?
[01:46:31]  That one's out on video.
[01:46:33]  I mean, we talked about seven a couple months ago.
[01:46:35]  Yes.
[01:46:36]  And I know you loved that one.
[01:46:37]  I sure did.
[01:46:38]  Okay.
[01:46:39]  Last question, I'll let you go.
[01:46:40]  Yes.
[01:46:40]  Have you read Miss America by Howard Stern yet?
[01:46:43]  No, and the reviews are so bad that I don't plan to.
[01:46:46]  It was the fastest-selling book in the history of printing.
[01:46:51]  Well, where is it on the best-seller list?
[01:46:54]  Well, now it's gone because it's been out for like six months.
[01:46:57]  Where was it ever?
[01:46:58]  It was number one.
[01:46:59]  When?
[01:47:01]  All right, I'm serious now.
[01:47:02]  You really.
[01:47:03]  I know his other book was, but I don't think Miss America was, was it?
[01:47:06]  Oh, I swear to God, Art.
[01:47:07]  I mean, you know, I'm not lying.
[01:47:10]  You check it out.
[01:47:10]  The New York Times best-sellers.
[01:47:12]  You swear on Robin's Laugh it was true?
[01:47:14]  What then?
[01:47:15]  You swear on Robin's Laugh that it was true.
[01:47:17]  You swear on Robin's breasts.
[01:47:20]  Goodbye.
[01:47:24]  She is endowed.
[01:47:25]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:47:27]  Hello.
[01:47:27]  Art.

=== Floating Mystery (08:03) ===

[01:47:28]  Yes.
[01:47:29]  I didn't get to hear you say what your object is.
[01:47:33]  Dolphins, dear dolphins, statue of dolphins.
[01:47:37]  Oh, goodness.
[01:47:38]  And someone guessed it or remotely viewed it?
[01:47:40]  Yes.
[01:47:41]  Was your video on?
[01:47:42]  No.
[01:47:44]  And even if it had been, it would not have been in the field of view.
[01:47:47]  Oh, okay.
[01:47:48]  All right.
[01:47:48]  Thanks.
[01:47:49]  Goodbye.
[01:47:50]  There is no such thing as levitation, says Bryn Marie.
[01:47:54]  No spiritual teacher, yogi, paranormal event has ever proven itself to be a real honest goodness source of levitation.
[01:48:02]  Every time a purported levitation is observed with strict scientific controls, absolutely nobody does any kind of flying.
[01:48:14]  That's very disappointing because I got this fact from Gilbert, Arizona, which says people who levitate often cannot control it.
[01:48:24]  Some have levitated 12 cubits in the air when praying.
[01:48:30]  Hmm.
[01:48:32]  The other famous levitators were St. Joseph of Cupertino, who used to fly around the church, even did it once in front of the Pope.
[01:48:40]  It's not clear he could control when he did it.
[01:48:43]  David Holm could levitate by putting himself in a trance, once went out one window and came in another before members of the Royal Society.
[01:48:53]  But he also was reported to be seen levitating six inches above the seat of his chair when engaging in animated conversation, apparently unaware he was even doing it.
[01:49:04]  Some of this is also described in the Britannica article, and more details are in the Reader's Digest book, Mysteries of the Unexplained.
[01:49:15]  Hmm.
[01:49:17]  Anybody out there know anything at all about levitation?
[01:49:20]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[01:49:22]  Oh, art.
[01:49:23]  Yes.
[01:49:23]  Levitation.
[01:49:24]  Yes, yes.
[01:49:25]  Levitation.
[01:49:26]  You had the grandma last night, which is fantastic.
[01:49:29]  I wish you were.
[01:49:29]  Look, you're going to have to get into that phone and shout.
[01:49:31]  Okay, I'm Chelsea.
[01:49:32]  How's that?
[01:49:33]  That's better.
[01:49:33]  Okay.
[01:49:34]  Now, I wanted to ask him some questions because in 1979, I was on a world cruise and we went to Egypt, and I went to the pyramids one afternoon.
[01:49:45]  And there was a tour going up to the king's chamber, and you climb up a kind of an incline, wooden incline.
[01:49:52]  And as we were going up, I was at the tail end of this group.
[01:49:55]  On my right, I saw this four-foot tunnel, which went to the Queen's chamber.
[01:49:59]  I was familiar with the layout of the pyramid.
[01:50:02]  Well, why didn't you break away from the group and scurry through it?
[01:50:05]  Listen, listen.
[01:50:06]  When they went up, I came back and went into the tunnel.
[01:50:09]  You did do it?
[01:50:10]  Yes, and I went into the Queen's Chamber, Art.
[01:50:12]  Yes?
[01:50:13]  Well, I used to do a lot of meditation, so I went down on my knees into the line posture, and I went into meditation.
[01:50:20]  And?
[01:50:20]  And I left my body.
[01:50:22]  Did you levitate?
[01:50:23]  Yes.
[01:50:24]  Yes, I did.
[01:50:26]  Levitation calls, and you get them.
[01:50:27]  No, I'm serious.
[01:50:28]  You floated up above the base of the chamber.
[01:50:32]  How far?
[01:50:33]  Oh, right up to the ceiling of the Queen's chamber.
[01:50:36]  What did it feel like?
[01:50:37]  Did it feel like flying?
[01:50:38]  It just felt like I was completely free.
[01:50:41]  I was just completely free now.
[01:50:43]  Oh, you were free of gravity.
[01:50:44]  Well, I was free of everything.
[01:50:46]  I mean, spiritually.
[01:50:48]  And, Art, all I know is when I finally came down, I suddenly came to and I thought, my goodness, where am I?
[01:50:55]  And I floated out through that tunnel.
[01:50:57]  That tunnel's only about four feet high.
[01:50:59]  You came down gently.
[01:51:00]  You didn't come down like the roadrunner.
[01:51:02]  No, no, no, no.
[01:51:02]  I was just suddenly back down on the floor and I floated through that tunnel.
[01:51:08]  And Art, believe me, when we went up there, it was about 2 o'clock in the afternoon.
[01:51:12]  They were locking up the pyramid when I was trying to get out.
[01:51:15]  There was just a great big lattice door.
[01:51:18]  Probably lucky you didn't get locked in, huh?
[01:51:20]  Well, I wish I could.
[01:51:21]  Now I wish I'd have stayed overnight.
[01:51:23]  But I yelled at the man, and he let me out, and he kind of looked at me like, where did I come from?
[01:51:28]  And I just kind of floated to a cab and got in a cab and went back to the ship.
[01:51:34]  Now, for about three days after that, on the ship, Art, when I was walking on the deck, I felt like I wasn't touching the floor.
[01:51:42]  Maybe you weren't, and maybe you were levitating.
[01:51:44]  Well, there you go.
[01:51:46]  Boy, you talked about levitation, and here come the levitators.
[01:51:50]  Just walked, just floated about six inches above that peak deck, huh?
[01:51:55]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:51:57]  Hello.
[01:51:58]  Hi, Art.
[01:51:59]  I was trying to call you for like 40 minutes to find out what the object was you were doing with the viewing.
[01:52:06]  I just said that on the radio.
[01:52:07]  No, but let me tell you something.
[01:52:08]  So what I have to say to you is invalidated because...
[01:52:11]  Yeah, that's right.
[01:52:12]  It is.
[01:52:12]  Any questions?
[01:52:13]  I want to ask you a question.
[01:52:14]  What?
[01:52:16]  Because I saw some other stuff, too.
[01:52:18]  I want to ask you these dolphins, as you were facing them, were they at different levels leaping from right to left?
[01:52:26]  That's right.
[01:52:27]  And were they like bronze or gold plates?
[01:52:30]  That's right.
[01:52:31]  And I also didn't get it.
[01:52:33]  But all of this means nothing after the fact.
[01:52:36]  Yeah, but I saw something else.
[01:52:38]  Did you have like a basket and a kettle?
[01:52:42]  Well, the base is kind of like that, yes.
[01:52:44]  No, I mean separate items.
[01:52:46]  No, no, I did not.
[01:52:47]  Okay.
[01:52:49]  All right.
[01:52:49]  All right.
[01:52:50]  So that's done.
[01:52:50]  I mean, forget it.
[01:52:52]  Anybody calling up now to claim that they saw dolphins jumping is just, you know, forget it.
[01:52:59]  Forget it.
[01:53:01]  After I've announced it, forget it.
[01:53:03]  All the Johnny and Joni come late ladies who want to say, oh, I saw it.
[01:53:07]  You know, it was dolphins.
[01:53:09]  Come on, give me a break.
[01:53:11]  If you didn't do it then, you sure can't do it now.
[01:53:13]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[01:53:15]  KQ and that's right, California.
[01:53:17]  Well, hello.
[01:53:18]  You know what?
[01:53:19]  When you did the remote viewing, I was too lazy to get out of bed and draw.
[01:53:22]  Yeah, here comes another one.
[01:53:23]  Uh-huh.
[01:53:24]  I just said fish, but that's what I wanted to do.
[01:53:26]  Yeah, no.
[01:53:27]  No, wait, now it means nothing.
[01:53:28]  I saw a picture of Mona, or somebody who looks like Mona.
[01:53:32]  Yes.
[01:53:33]  On the beach, wearing a white shirt and a bikini bottom, looking over to her left, wearing a hat, and it was a black and white picture.
[01:53:40]  And the beach was partially shaded.
[01:53:43]  That's actually what I saw.
[01:53:46]  You know, you know.
[01:53:47]  You know, that is interesting.
[01:53:49]  I'll tell you why.
[01:53:50]  We have never published that photo, but I have a photograph of exactly that that we took in the Caribbean of my wife.
[01:54:00]  Really?
[01:54:01]  Yep.
[01:54:01]  That's what I really thought.
[01:54:03]  What else was I going to say?
[01:54:04]  Okay, ready?
[01:54:05]  I'm sending you a message by telepathy.
[01:54:09]  Oh, that's disgusting.
[01:54:14]  What was it now?
[01:54:15]  I got to go.
[01:54:15]  Thanks for the call.
[01:54:17]  You know, I think I got that one.
[01:54:19]  On my international line, you're on the air.
[01:54:21]  Art, I called it on your wildcard.
[01:54:23]  No, again, sir, you're on the wrong line.
[01:54:26]  The wildcard line is area code 702-727-1295.
[01:54:32]  Call that one.
[01:54:32]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:54:35]  Yes, Art.
[01:54:36]  This is right in Missouri.
[01:54:38]  Yes, Ray.
[01:54:40]  You've read the Bible, right?
[01:54:41]  Yes, I have, Ray, several times.
[01:54:43]  Yes.
[01:54:44]  Now, you ever wanted to part with the Armor Kids?
[01:54:48]  Yes, what about it?
[01:54:49]  Well, what if this is one of those things that make you go, hmm?
[01:54:54]  What if all the armies of the world are gathering together, just like in the movie Independence is coming out, Independence Day, fought against aliens?
[01:55:06]  Well, what if they do?
[01:55:08]  Well, I mean, doesn't that make you think what could possibly cause all the armies of the world to gather together to fight something?

=== Bonnie's Call (15:38) ===

[01:55:16]  That'd be about it.
[01:55:17]  That's the same thing Ronald Reagan talked about.
[01:55:20]  A common threat, as though we need some kind of a common threat.
[01:55:26]  And I suppose that we do, don't we?
[01:55:29]  We need some kind of common threat.
[01:55:32]  Something that would make us all gather together and say we must all fight it or we'll die.
[01:55:37]  Well, maybe we'll get it.
[01:55:38]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[01:55:41]  Hello.
[01:55:42]  Hello?
[01:55:42]  Hello?
[01:55:43]  Hey, Art.
[01:55:43]  Hi.
[01:55:44]  This is Bonnie, and I was just calling for my sister.
[01:55:47]  I'm really nervous right now.
[01:55:48]  Oh, don't be nervous.
[01:55:49]  I've never actually done anything like this before.
[01:55:51]  Really?
[01:55:52]  Yeah.
[01:55:52]  That's what they all say.
[01:55:55]  So I've been listening for a while, and mostly in the car and everything.
[01:56:00]  And I have some important questions to ask for my sister.
[01:56:02]  She's doing a...
[01:56:03]  A lot of girls said that to me in a car when I was younger.
[01:56:07]  I've never done anything like this before.
[01:56:11]  But my sister wanted me to ask you a few questions because she's busy at her art table right now.
[01:56:16]  All right.
[01:56:17]  Ask for your sister.
[01:56:18]  Okay.
[01:56:19]  And her first question was, how would violet skies affect photosynthesis if it would?
[01:56:26]  How do what?
[01:56:27]  Violet skies?
[01:56:28]  Violet skies.
[01:56:30]  Yeah, if there was a planet somewhere and it had violet skies, how would it affect the photosynthesis of the things?
[01:56:40]  Well, it would depend on the makeup of the nature of the violet light.
[01:56:45]  I would presume there would be a very great effect indeed.
[01:56:49]  Okay.
[01:56:49]  Would there be any of your listeners or anything that would be able to probably grow violet plants?
[01:56:56]  Grow violet plants?
[01:56:58]  I don't have the answer to that.
[01:57:00]  I don't know.
[01:57:01]  And do you think the atmosphere of a violet sky or whatever, I don't know if that has anything to do with atmosphere or anything, but would that be able to support life as we know it?
[01:57:12]  Well, I guess it would depend on whether the oxygen content and other elements were similar to what we have here.
[01:57:19]  So the answer is if it did have those elements, then yes.
[01:57:24]  If it didn't, then you'd have little violet creatures.
[01:57:28]  Okay.
[01:57:29]  All right.
[01:57:30]  I have a few more questions.
[01:57:31]  Is that okay if I go really fast?
[01:57:33]  Well, let's hear them.
[01:57:34]  Okay.
[01:57:36]  How would 23 moons affect the planet, and how small would the moons need to be, or how large the planet, to keep the gravity about the same as Earth?
[01:57:44]  Where do you get these questions?
[01:57:47]  My sister.
[01:57:48]  And where does she get them?
[01:57:49]  She created a planet for this comic book she's doing because she's a comic book artist.
[01:57:54]  And so she wants it to be as real as possible and to be feasible to live and support life.
[01:58:01]  I see.
[01:58:02]  23 planets, huh?
[01:58:03]  I mean, moons.
[01:58:04]  Yeah, moons.
[01:58:05]  Moons.
[01:58:07]  Well, I would think the tidal effects, assuming there was water on our little violet planet, would be crazy.
[01:58:14]  I mean, think what our moon does to our tides.
[01:58:17]  Yeah.
[01:58:18]  So in-out, in-out, in-out, in-out.
[01:58:22]  Be relentless.
[01:58:23]  Okay.
[01:58:25]  And the third question is?
[01:58:27]  Be a good surfing place for violent people.
[01:58:31]  And the final question.
[01:58:32]  Final question is, would a 26-hour day and a 400-day year affect how a planet works?
[01:58:41]  Well, it certainly would affect your workday, wouldn't it?
[01:58:45]  Well, I would assume so, yeah.
[01:58:48]  Your workday would definitely be longer.
[01:58:51]  Your sleep period would be longer, and you'd have to spend more time dreaming of violet things in bed.
[01:58:57]  I don't know.
[01:58:58]  I don't have the answer to that stuff.
[01:59:00]  Tell your sister never to make you call again.
[01:59:02]  First time caller line, you're on the air.
[01:59:05]  Hello, brother Art.
[01:59:06]  How you doing?
[01:59:07]  This is Jerry calling from Houston.
[01:59:08]  Hi, Jerry.
[01:59:09]  First time caller.
[01:59:10]  I've been a listener of yours for a long time.
[01:59:11]  I really enjoy your program.
[01:59:12]  Thank you.
[01:59:14]  I have a question that really pursues with a lot of the subjects that you've been bringing up.
[01:59:22]  I'm very open-minded when it comes to UFOs, alien beings.
[01:59:25]  I'm a very big Star Trek fan.
[01:59:26]  I understand the possibilities of it.
[01:59:28]  However, I kind of have another hypothesis that I'd like to throw at you and get your opinion on it.
[01:59:33]  Yeah, go ahead.
[01:59:36]  I feel that there's a possibility that what we are seeing as far as the sightings, the UFOs, and the experiences are perhaps an indication of an event that's coming up.
[01:59:48]  That in the future, once we learn to break the time barrier going forward and back in time, there are historians that are coming back to observe us, observe the prior time, the 50, 100 years prior to us.
[02:00:00]  Well, you know, I saw a movie like that recently.
[02:00:02]  It was about some people that were tourists in time, and they would come back to a time just before there was going to be a great catastrophic event, like, you know, a meteor or an asteroid plowing into Earth, and they would pick a safe location far enough away, and they would watch it because in their future world, nothing bad ever happened, and they were bored to death.
[02:00:27]  And so they were tourists in time to watch tragedy.
[02:00:31]  So they could, you know, they could sort of get off on the misfortunes of others.
[02:00:36]  Well, if you think about it, it would make sense.
[02:00:38]  Do you want to hold during the news?
[02:00:40]  Absolutely.
[02:00:40]  I'd love to hold.
[02:00:41]  All right.
[02:00:42]  A disaster in time coming up.
[02:00:44]  This is Premier Networks.
[02:00:46]  That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
[02:01:12]  That don't bother the deck of...
[02:01:21]  You're listening to Art Bell, somewhere in time.
[02:01:25]  Tonight, featuring Coast to Coast AM from June 19th, 1996.
[02:01:29]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:01:32]  Hello, Art.
[02:01:32]  This is Ant Man from Tucson, 1400 KTUC.
[02:01:36]  That's the way to do a promo.
[02:01:37]  How you doing tonight?
[02:01:38]  All right.
[02:01:39]  I'm sure you get tired of hearing that.
[02:01:41]  I called you the other night to find out what your stand was on cannabis pot, hemp marijuana, whatever you want to call it.
[02:01:47]  I told you.
[02:01:48]  Yeah.
[02:01:49]  And I was wondering why you weren't more involved with getting it out there and getting the message out there and maybe I don't feel militant about it.
[02:01:57]  I mean, that's my position, but I don't feel like I should be out marching for it or anything.
[02:02:03]  Oh, true, absolutely not.
[02:02:04]  It'll happen.
[02:02:05]  You know, it'll pot will be decriminalized and separated eventually from the rest of the drugs.
[02:02:11]  Then they can perhaps have a meaningful drug war if we ever get a president who wants to wage one.
[02:02:16]  True.
[02:02:16]  I mean, eventually it has to happen.
[02:02:18]  I mean, with $100 billion a year going out for nothing, you know, without stopping anything, there's no way to stop the supply, you know, as long as there's a demand.
[02:02:28]  Never.
[02:02:29]  And somebody like you, though, who has the huge audience that you do, I mean, there are several of us here that sit around smoking all night listening to you.
[02:02:36]  You do?
[02:02:36]  Yeah.
[02:02:37]  Because it's not.
[02:02:38]  Does it make more sense?
[02:02:40]  Pardon?
[02:02:40]  Does it make more sense?
[02:02:42]  Not really, but it allows us to sit back and actually concentrate instead of dealing with all the dreariness of the day.
[02:02:48]  We focus in on you and everything that you have to say.
[02:02:51]  And sometimes we don't agree with it.
[02:02:53]  Sometimes, you know, we think you're wrong.
[02:02:55]  But, you know, you're putting your opinion out there, and that's what counts.
[02:02:57]  Do you ever levitate?
[02:02:59]  Oh, no.
[02:03:00]  No, nothing along that lane.
[02:03:01]  You never get that high.
[02:03:03]  Pardon?
[02:03:03]  I say you never get that high.
[02:03:05]  Oh, no, no.
[02:03:06]  We have some seeds as of today and about a quarter ounce to you.
[02:03:12]  I beg your pardon?
[02:03:14]  We sent you a package today.
[02:03:16]  It should be there in about four or five days.
[02:03:18]  The new demonstration.
[02:03:20]  Have you lost your mind?
[02:03:22]  You're sending marijuana through the mail?
[02:03:24]  Oh, absolutely.
[02:03:25]  You've lost your mind.
[02:03:27]  No way.
[02:03:29]  There shouldn't be anything wrong with that.
[02:03:31]  I mean, until the day that you dream of comes.
[02:03:36]  Well, the gentleman that sent it to you is an authorized cannabis dealer from here in Arizona.
[02:03:40]  He has the tax license.
[02:03:42]  He sent the appropriate tax stamps along with it.
[02:03:44]  Well, I'm not an authorized cannabis receiver.
[02:03:48]  So you wouldn't, you're not going to enjoy that, huh?
[02:03:50]  I think they're going to nail you guys is what I think.
[02:03:53]  Oh, no, no, no.
[02:03:54]  Any, I also think you're lying through your stone teeth.
[02:03:57]  Okay.
[02:03:58]  You think you're, no.
[02:03:59]  All right, goodbye.
[02:04:01]  Lying through his teeth.
[02:04:02]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:04:04]  Well, hello, Art.
[02:04:05]  Hello.
[02:04:05]  Hi, my name's Dale.
[02:04:06]  I'm in Braddington, Florida.
[02:04:08]  Yes, sir.
[02:04:08]  And this is about this major Danes that I've been listening to.
[02:04:13]  Oh, yes.
[02:04:14]  Yes.
[02:04:15]  I got to tell you, I've listened to you for a long time, and this thing scared me first, and then I went into kind of a panic.
[02:04:23]  If this guy is right, what are we going to do?
[02:04:27]  Well, look, I don't see it that way.
[02:04:29]  There's no reason to panic.
[02:04:30]  I don't know whether he's right or wrong, but I, you know, do what I do.
[02:04:35]  Live it a day at a time.
[02:04:36]  If we're all going to go away in a big gust of wind in a few years, then that's the way it is.
[02:04:43]  Well, that's true.
[02:04:44]  But after that, Art, it was more of an anger than what I was feeling.
[02:04:52]  And I'll tell you why, is he tells us to move north and dig a hole eventually.
[02:05:00]  Yeah, that's about right.
[02:05:01]  Well, I just can't buy that.
[02:05:04]  I think that he knows a lot more about this than what he's letting on.
[02:05:09]  And the thing that upsets me is the taxpayers paid for all the research.
[02:05:13]  Yes.
[02:05:14]  Well, no, wait a minute.
[02:05:15]  Now, a lot of what he said the other night came from SciTech, which is a private corporation.
[02:05:22]  Yes.
[02:05:23]  Okay.
[02:05:24]  What he learned for the military, a lot of which he cannot talk about.
[02:05:30]  But the information he gave you came from private work.
[02:05:36]  Well, I understand that.
[02:05:40]  The research that actually set this thing up came from.
[02:05:44]  Well, yeah, but so what?
[02:05:46]  I was a medic in the Air Force.
[02:05:48]  If I had, as they were trying to get me to be, become a doctor's assistant when I got out of the Air Force.
[02:05:57]  I got training in the Air Force, and I applied that then to a civilian position.
[02:06:01]  There's nothing wrong with that.
[02:06:03]  Well, that's true, but I think that I think that, you know, not only just not just power, but I think it's also responsibility.
[02:06:11]  If he does know more than what he's letting us know, he should, you know, I think he should help us.
[02:06:18]  Well, he told you what you need to know.
[02:06:21]  I mean, how do you figure you're going to make out in, of all places, Braden's in Florida?
[02:06:26]  I have not a clue.
[02:06:27]  Well, well, I do.
[02:06:29]  I do.
[02:06:31]  We're talking clean sand dunes here.
[02:06:34]  Right.
[02:06:35]  That's true.
[02:06:36]  That's right.
[02:06:37]  Well, what do you think about the idea of him publishing like a survival guide?
[02:06:42]  Well, I don't know.
[02:06:45]  I guess it would be appropriate.
[02:06:48]  Well, I think so.
[02:06:49]  I mean, the only thing that he's told us is a vague reference to moving to Switzerland or going up north and digging a hole.
[02:06:56]  Well, are you going to go north and dig a hole?
[02:06:59]  I really don't know what, you know, I think what I'm going to do is wait and see if some of these signs...
[02:07:04]  Where would you go?
[02:07:05]  Jacksonville?
[02:07:07]  Well, probably have to go a little farther north than that, I think.
[02:07:10]  Probably somewhere up in Michigan or someplace.
[02:07:12]  Way up in Michigan.
[02:07:13]  I would think that, probably the Upper Peninsula or something like that.
[02:07:16]  Well, that's a hard move from Florida.
[02:07:19]  Yeah, it is.
[02:07:19]  But, you know, what are you going to do if all these things start coming?
[02:07:23]  Somehow I see you with your car all packed up and stuff hanging off the top and a bunch of shovels in the back.
[02:07:28]  There you go.
[02:07:29]  All right, sir.
[02:07:30]  Thank you very much for the call.
[02:07:31]  I don't know what to advise.
[02:07:33]  Go north and dig a hole.
[02:07:36]  Or you could ride it out down there in Florida.
[02:07:39]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[02:07:40]  How are you doing, Art?
[02:07:42]  Okay.
[02:07:43]  Let me tell you, I got to apologize for about two weeks ago.
[02:07:46]  I called you up and I told you a joke about a product called a Koopa Chupa Carbra.
[02:07:52]  Yeah, I remember.
[02:07:53]  And you took it personally.
[02:07:54]  Yeah, I remember.
[02:07:55]  Yeah, I got to apologize.
[02:07:56]  It wasn't meant as a cut on your geo.
[02:07:59]  Well, people just are relentless with me about my geos.
[02:08:02]  I love geos.
[02:08:04]  I don't care what anybody says.
[02:08:06]  Yeah, nothing wrong with saving a bunch of money on gas, is there?
[02:08:09]  Not in my opinion.
[02:08:10]  Yeah.
[02:08:12]  Anyways, about what Major Dean said.
[02:08:15]  Yes.
[02:08:15]  Doesn't that go along with what Gordon Michael Scallion has been talking about?
[02:08:20]  Yes, yes, yes.
[02:08:22]  And I called you a long time ago, and it was about four or five months ago, and I made a comment about.
[02:08:28]  Also goes along with what a lot of my Native American prophets have been saying.
[02:08:32]  Sure.
[02:08:34]  Anyways, I called you a long time ago, and I made a comment about how Charlie tends to lose his composure.
[02:08:42]  He does.
[02:08:44]  You can tell exactly how worried he is by the octave that he reaches.
[02:08:47]  Yeah, that's about what you said last time I talked to you.
[02:08:50]  And, you know, I suggested to Charlie if he's still listening, which he may or may not be.
[02:08:56]  I usually go to bed because when Charlie calls, you know, it's about the highlight of the evening.
[02:09:01]  But if he's still listening.
[02:09:03]  When Charlie calls, is the highlight of the evening?
[02:09:06]  You can count on it.
[02:09:07]  It's like clockwork.
[02:09:08]  It's always between, well, on Pacific time, it's always between midnight and maybe 2 o'clock at the latest.
[02:09:15]  If that's the highlight of your evening, you need a life.
[02:09:18]  Well, I love the way you cut on him, man.
[02:09:22]  Well, real well with him.
[02:09:23]  Oh, yeah, it's almost too easy, actually.
[02:09:26]  Yeah, I know it.
[02:09:27]  And, you know, like you were saying, he has been losing his composure and panicking, as you say lately.
[02:09:33]  Sure.
[02:09:34]  With all the new scandals that have been coming up in the administration.
[02:09:37]  It reminds me of the Watergate days.
[02:09:39]  Every day now, there's a new headline, a new scandal.
[02:09:42]  I mean, we're going to have to have a book of scandal, just a directory to scandals here pretty soon.
[02:09:48]  Well, I was only five years old when I was privileged to see some of the Watergate stuff on TV.
[02:09:54]  And that was before I was politically aware.
[02:09:56]  Oh, I bet a five-year-old really just got into that.
[02:09:59]  I changed it to like the price is right or something, you know.
[02:10:03]  Well, actually, Watergate was something like that.
[02:10:06]  First time caller line, you're on the air.
[02:10:08]  Wow, Art Bell, I got through to you.
[02:10:11]  Yes, you did.
[02:10:11]  Where are you?
[02:10:12]  This is Dean.
[02:10:15]  Dean in Blaine, Minnesota.
[02:10:17]  Blaine, Minnesota.
[02:10:18]  Yeah, I'm a UPS driver, and I listen to you almost all the night.
[02:10:22]  A lot of us do, and we get pumped up listening to your stuff.
[02:10:26]  I don't even know what to talk about now.
[02:10:28]  I've got a question for you.
[02:10:29]  Yeah.
[02:10:30]  Why do UPS guys leave...
[02:10:32]  I know what you're going to ask.
[02:10:34]  Block other people in Double Park?
[02:10:36]  No.
[02:10:36]  No, I wasn't going to ask that at all.
[02:10:38]  Oh, because remember some guy on the slam night or something, some guy said he called up and said, oh, he hates when people double park.

=== Packages In The Sun Meltdown (05:51) ===

[02:10:44]  But we're so quick we get out right away.
[02:10:47]  Well, I was going to ask why you leave packages in the sun.
[02:10:53]  I guess I don't, but some do.
[02:10:56]  I don't know.
[02:10:57]  Do you have any idea what happens when a package with refrigerated materials gets left in the Nevada sun?
[02:11:04]  Oh, definitely.
[02:11:06]  It melts away.
[02:11:07]  Total meltdown.
[02:11:09]  Oh.
[02:11:13]  I wish your show was on in the daytime so more people would get aware of this.
[02:11:17]  You try to tell people in the work days what's going on.
[02:11:20]  No, the show wouldn't work during the day.
[02:11:22]  And they just don't believe it.
[02:11:24]  That's right.
[02:11:24]  That's because it's so different than what they're doing during the day.
[02:11:29]  Yep.
[02:11:30]  I was online and I was looking through your thing about how their deficit going up and up and up.
[02:11:35]  Yes.
[02:11:35]  You know, and I tried telling some people, oh, they can't believe it's that high.
[02:11:40]  There's got to be something wrong with that.
[02:11:41]  That can't be right.
[02:11:42]  Wait till the announcement of the devaluation.
[02:11:45]  Thank you.
[02:11:46]  You just wait for that.
[02:11:48]  One day you're going to wake up and you're going to find out suddenly your dollar is worth much, much less than it was the night before.
[02:11:57]  You don't think that can happen here?
[02:11:59]  Mark my words.
[02:12:00]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:12:02]  Whoops, would have been.
[02:12:03]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[02:12:05]  Hello.
[02:12:06]  Richmeister Gerhart, conservative in California.
[02:12:10]  Yes, Hickmeister, what's up?
[02:12:11]  Cruising through the skies looking for liberals to shoot down.
[02:12:17]  Say that right away.
[02:12:18]  That sounds mean-spirited, Richard.
[02:12:20]  Oh, yes, of course.
[02:12:23]  Hey, I got to tell you, I'm proud to say that when Clinton loses, when he chokes, let's say, the chicken bone in his throat is going to be called California.
[02:12:38]  He went down to Mexico and he apologized almost on his knees to that venal, corrupt, two-bit government down there, apologized to the people of California voting for 187.
[02:12:53]  Well, we have not forgotten that insult.
[02:12:57]  Bob Dole was here today.
[02:12:58]  Well, it's still not law, is it?
[02:13:00]  Well, let's wait, let's see what happens in the Supreme Court.
[02:13:05]  You know, Bob Dole was here today.
[02:13:07]  Yeah, I heard that.
[02:13:08]  And he was saying something very much in tune with that.
[02:13:12]  So the conservatives are really going to turn out in California because of the CCRI.
[02:13:19]  It's going to be big time in California, and Clinton is going to choke.
[02:13:23]  I mean, by the time The scabrous, corruption-ridden Clintonistas in D.C. are through the next couple of months, they are going to be so busy trying to defend themselves from every single direction, not to mention the direction of Paula Jones is looking at them.
[02:13:46]  I heard a report that that might be settled.
[02:13:48]  Have you heard anything about that?
[02:13:50]  I heard something about that on the news today.
[02:13:52]  Exactly.
[02:13:53]  And I also heard that the lawyers, plural, in the White House said that they're not doing any such thing.
[02:14:02]  And basically, I hope they don't.
[02:14:04]  Listen, did you happen to hear Roger Morris earlier?
[02:14:08]  Yes, I did.
[02:14:09]  That should have been right down your alley.
[02:14:11]  Well, I was furiously trying to get through to tell them that there is hope.
[02:14:16]  The guy is doomed, you know, but I wasn't able to.
[02:14:20]  But, you know, some people are a little bit pessimistic.
[02:14:23]  That's okay.
[02:14:24]  That's life.
[02:14:24]  Well, listen, Heipmeister, I got to go.
[02:14:26]  Adios.
[02:14:27]  All right, adios.
[02:14:28]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:14:31]  All right, Art.
[02:14:32]  Yes.
[02:14:33]  Good morning.
[02:14:34]  Relatively, yes.
[02:14:36]  A little strange, but good.
[02:14:39]  This man, let's see, Stanton Friedman.
[02:14:42]  Yes.
[02:14:43]  I didn't catch the talk that he and you had, but I mailed a package to him about a month ago and to you about a month ago about some possible guests that have had experiences with, let's say, you know, the otherworldly craft and so forth.
[02:15:03]  And what I was wondering about is, did you get that package?
[02:15:08]  Yes, and I had to turn it over to the CIA.
[02:15:11]  You what?
[02:15:12]  Turned it over to the CIA.
[02:15:13]  Seriously?
[02:15:14]  Yeah, sure.
[02:15:15]  These people have already been picked up and processed.
[02:15:19]  I think you're joking with me.
[02:15:22]  Try calling one of them.
[02:15:25]  I got to run, sir.
[02:15:26]  Thank you.
[02:15:27]  We'll be right back.
[02:15:46]  Wild Card Line, you're on the air.
[02:15:48]  Hi.
[02:15:48]  Good morning, Art.
[02:15:49]  Good morning.
[02:15:50]  What's up with Gerbelmeister Wigfart?
[02:15:54]  Now, that's not a nice thing to say at all.
[02:15:57]  well i don't know what his name is i know it's not nice but here my stir here my stir height monster I haven't quite got it down.
[02:16:05]  Well, it's kind of like, I don't understand how someone can be so fanatically partisan.
[02:16:12]  Well, it's because the world is full of all types, and he's one of them.

=== Fine Line Between Parties (04:55) ===

[02:16:17]  Chuck's one of them.
[02:16:18]  There are a whole group of them out there on the right and the left that are extremely focused on hatred of the other political party.
[02:16:28]  But isn't there, I mean, isn't there a fine line between right and left?
[02:16:32]  Isn't there a fine line between, I mean, I'm a young man who's very into politics, but I see so much power from the lobby groups, from corporate America.
[02:16:48]  that it really is unimportant who the president is.
[02:16:53]  I didn't share that for you.
[02:16:55]  And it's just frustrating because...
[02:16:57]  Maybe that's not always true, but in this election, much as I do in a lot of ways, respect Bob Dole, at the presidential level, sir, there's just not going to be a lot of difference between Bob Dole and Bill Clinton.
[02:17:10]  I just, I don't.
[02:17:12]  On the other hand, Bill Clinton, for me, is so bad that Bob Dole, despite his shortcomings, looks good.
[02:17:19]  Well, if Dole is elected, which I think is unlikely, even with all these things happening with the Clinton presidency, what is Bob Dole going to do different that President Clinton wouldn't have done to make this country a better place?
[02:17:36]  I mean, I know.
[02:17:38]  The answer is we don't know yet.
[02:17:40]  Bob Dole has not, to my satisfaction, yet said where he would take America.
[02:17:47]  I know it's a sick old thing, this vision thing, but it really is important.
[02:17:51]  I want to hear from Bob Dole where he would take America.
[02:17:55]  Can he affect change?
[02:17:57]  I mean, can one man make change?
[02:18:00]  Yes.
[02:18:01]  Well?
[02:18:02]  Yes, yes, one man could create change.
[02:18:06]  Substantial, real, profound change.
[02:18:08]  Is that man Bob Dole?
[02:18:10]  I don't know.
[02:18:10]  I would like to interview Bob Dole, and I've got a request into Dole headquarters.
[02:18:14]  I would give him a good interview, and the guy needs to sit down with somebody like me, if not me, and just have a sincere conversation with the American people.
[02:18:23]  Maybe do it from his own home, you know, where he'd be relaxed.
[02:18:26]  Right, but wouldn't he just talk rhetoric with you?
[02:18:29]  I mean, wouldn't he just say what he needs to say?
[02:18:32]  I wouldn't let him.
[02:18:33]  Well, and I hope you don't.
[02:18:34]  All right, thank you very much for the call.
[02:18:36]  The American people need to meet the real Bob Dole.
[02:18:41]  That needs to happen.
[02:18:43]  We'll be right back.
[02:18:44]  This is Premier Networks.
[02:18:46]  That was Art Bell hosting Coast to Coast AM on this Somewhere in Time.
[02:18:54]  We take you back to
[02:19:24]  the past on ART BELL, Somewhere In Time.
[02:19:28]  You ought to thank this radio station because it cares enough for you to have live talk radio on for you instead of regurgitated, recycling, relentless, repetitive repeats.
[02:19:44]  Yes, live right here in the middle of the night.
[02:19:47]  I like this facts.
[02:19:48]  Check this out.
[02:19:50]  Art, if I was Hillary's political advisor and a Bill Clinton strategist, I would advise Hillary: if backed into a political corner in Whitewater, Nanny Gate, Travelgate, FileGate, or Fingerprints on Documents Gate, whether billing records or FBI files, cry.
[02:20:13]  The answer is to cry.
[02:20:15]  And would that affect you?
[02:20:18]  You know, you guys out there, you real men.
[02:20:25]  Would it affect you if Hillary cried?
[02:20:27]  Now, wait a minute.
[02:20:27]  I got to get my Hillary voice.
[02:20:29]  I can do it.
[02:20:30]  Let's see.
[02:20:31]  We go up here and we get to mouth right there.
[02:20:35]  I didn't mean to do it.
[02:20:37]  I did need it a long time ago in Arkansas.
[02:20:40]  I didn't need what about it.
[02:20:47]  Would you guys melt as tears course down the cheeks of one Hillary Clinton?
[02:20:54]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:20:56]  Good morning.

=== How to Smoke Marijuana (09:26) ===

[02:20:57]  Well, good morning to you.
[02:20:58]  This is Gladys from Sparta, Tennessee.
[02:21:02]  How are you?
[02:21:03]  Sparta, Tennessee.
[02:21:05]  Yes, in the hills of Tennessee.
[02:21:09]  I wanted to ask one thing and then talk about something else.
[02:21:13]  Would that be okay?
[02:21:14]  Yes.
[02:21:15]  The guy who's talking about marijuana.
[02:21:17]  Oh, yes.
[02:21:18]  The one who was going to send it to me?
[02:21:21]  You know, they don't, they're against smoking, but how do you smoke marijuana?
[02:21:27]  What do you mean?
[02:21:28]  Well, in other words, I don't even know how you do you have to smoke cigarette tobacco with marijuana, or do you just smoke?
[02:21:36]  No, no, no, no.
[02:21:37]  It's just like tobacco.
[02:21:39]  I mean, tobacco and a cigarette, they roll it up and they light it up and smoke it like cigarette.
[02:21:44]  All right.
[02:21:45]  Now, about this major Dames.
[02:21:48]  Yes.
[02:21:49]  I'm just fascinated.
[02:21:51]  But have you ever heard of the treaty that United Nations had the United States and Soviet Russia and other countries sign in 1977 about weather modification?
[02:22:07]  I am aware of that, yes.
[02:22:09]  Well, I think this has a lot to do with what Dames is talking about.
[02:22:18]  Well, I do too, and I don't consider it impossible that there could be an environmental change that would produce the jet stream lowering with about the results he talked about.
[02:22:28]  I mean, it's entirely plausible.
[02:22:30]  Yeah.
[02:22:31]  Well, I took it seriously.
[02:22:33]  However, I have heard of something that the Soviets were using back in the early 1970s, 77, something like that.
[02:22:40]  And something called the woodpecker, over the horizon radar, which also saturates, absolutely saturates the ionosphere with energy, but not to the degree that the HAARP project would do so.
[02:22:55]  Okay, well this thing was called something about the Tesla coil.
[02:22:58]  Have you ever heard of it?
[02:23:00]  Well, sure.
[02:23:01]  And they were bombarding the United States, I understand, with extremely low frequency.
[02:23:09]  It's obvious that it's driven some of my listeners nuts.
[02:23:12]  Yes.
[02:23:13]  So are we looking at a man-made type of condition?
[02:23:21]  Or is, you know, that just keeps on culminating into such terrific changes in our weather?
[02:23:30]  Or is this just going to be an occurrence?
[02:23:34]  This is where I'm kind of concerned.
[02:23:37]  You know, the Soviets got electromagnetic, well, it was electromagnet from us in 1977.
[02:23:46]  And they've been using this apparently to do something about weather modification.
[02:23:51]  And I was just wondering if Dames knew anything about this.
[02:23:54]  I don't know.
[02:23:55]  If he was here, we could ask him.
[02:23:56]  Can't you feel it?
[02:23:57]  Radiation every day.
[02:23:59]  We're all being irradiated.
[02:24:02]  The very voice that is modulated on the carriers that carry my voice to you, radiation, right through your body, like a hot knife through butter, every day, day in and day out, relentlessly.
[02:24:17]  It's thriving you crazy.
[02:24:19]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:24:21]  Pancoke.
[02:24:23]  Pancake.
[02:24:25]  That's all he said.
[02:24:27]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[02:24:29]  Good morning.
[02:24:30]  Good morning.
[02:24:30]  Yeah, this is Mike from Glendale, California, KABC.
[02:24:34]  KABC the Mighty, yes.
[02:24:37]  I liked your analysis of the presidential elections.
[02:24:40]  Helpless, hopeless, inevitable.
[02:24:42]  Yeah, I'm just, you know, it's just, it's, except for the scandal business going on right now, it's boring.
[02:24:51]  There is one, in the end game, there is one clear and distinct difference, and that is, in my view, okay, which is that a vote for Bob Dole is a vote for the Republican Party.
[02:25:04]  A vote for President Clinton is a vote for President Clinton.
[02:25:10]  That's a true statement.
[02:25:11]  That's absolutely a true statement.
[02:25:13]  And it's not necessarily a vote for the Democrat Party at all.
[02:25:17]  It's for whatever Mr. Clinton is, and he is the monster from our id, as I told my guest.
[02:25:24]  You know, the Republican Party has its problems, but I think at this stage that as awful as they are, they're the lesser of two evils, and that's, unfortunately, all that can be done right now.
[02:25:36]  Well, that tells you why nobody's really excited.
[02:25:39]  I mean, I feel the same way, of course, and given a choice between Ms. Clinton and Ms. Dole, it's going to be Ms. Dole and a walkaway, no problem.
[02:25:46]  But I'm not happy about it.
[02:25:50]  Yeah.
[02:25:51]  Well, look at our, I know I want to let some other callers on, but if you don't hear from me at all, you know what that means?
[02:25:55]  It means that I haven't been able to get through.
[02:25:57]  All right, sir.
[02:25:58]  Thank you very much.
[02:25:59]  I'm glad you'll keep trying anyway.
[02:26:02]  Yeah, I mean, it's an easy choice.
[02:26:06]  There's nobody else out there right now, no serious third-party rip'em terim candidates who have come along.
[02:26:14]  And right now, if I had to vote today, I'd vote for Bob Dole, and I wouldn't be happy.
[02:26:22]  Just wouldn't be happy.
[02:26:23]  So I'm not engaged in politics right now, except the blood sport of the spectator aspect of watching what's going to happen to Bill Clinton here.
[02:26:36]  It's semi-interesting.
[02:26:38]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:26:40]  Hello.
[02:26:41]  Hi, Art.
[02:26:41]  This is Blaise from Portland, Oregon.
[02:26:43]  I like that name, Blaze.
[02:26:45]  Thank you.
[02:26:45]  How'd you get that name?
[02:26:46]  Well, it was actually my grandmother's middle name.
[02:26:49]  It was a family name.
[02:26:50]  Okay.
[02:26:51]  And I'm not from Portland, so people up here think it has to do with the sports team up here.
[02:26:55]  Oh, I bet they would.
[02:26:56]  Yeah.
[02:26:57]  In fact, that would make you very popular.
[02:26:59]  Yeah.
[02:27:02]  I wanted to say, as far as Clinton and Dole go, I think we've got a win-win situation because the way I look at it, it's pretty pessimistic.
[02:27:10]  But still, if Dole wins, I'm glad.
[02:27:16]  If Clinton wins, though, he's going to get what he deserves because as far as we can see, the world is kind of quickening so fast that who really wants to be president in the middle of this mess?
[02:27:30]  You know, we'll get to see Clinton with his hair all messed up.
[02:27:34]  You know what I'm saying?
[02:27:35]  Yes, there is that.
[02:27:37]  There's kind of a sadistic pleasure in just watching Clinton.
[02:27:40]  Well, that's what I just said, the spectacle.
[02:27:42]  Exactly, the spectacle of watching Hillary shed her crocodile tears.
[02:27:48]  Oh, by the way, were she to do so.
[02:27:51]  Oh, no.
[02:27:52]  No, huh?
[02:27:53]  Oh, it would be so stupid.
[02:27:55]  Tears from Hillary wouldn't.
[02:27:58]  It would make it worse, but I want to say one other thing.
[02:28:04]  That charming young fellow that called about their marijuana thing.
[02:28:10]  Oh, yes.
[02:28:10]  Living up in Portland, Art.
[02:28:13]  You know, I'm a musician.
[02:28:15]  I look like a rock musician.
[02:28:16]  I'm always getting offered all kinds of stuff.
[02:28:18]  It's a very liberal state.
[02:28:20]  And I'm really sick of it.
[02:28:23]  They have hemp festivals up here.
[02:28:25]  Hemp festivals?
[02:28:26]  Yeah.
[02:28:27]  And there's so much hypocrisy associated with the whole legalized marijuana movement.
[02:28:33]  You wouldn't believe it's.
[02:28:34]  I just stay away from it completely.
[02:28:36]  I've seen so many, especially guys, really feminized by smoking it physically.
[02:28:43]  They get a lot of female characteristics, physical female characteristics.
[02:28:47]  Breasts.
[02:28:47]  Yeah, they get breasts, and their sex drive goes down the tooth.
[02:28:50]  And, you know, they get real giggly and kind of, and they also get real mean-spirited, real kind of bitchy.
[02:28:57]  And I would just say to those guys, if they're still awake, you know, if the government wants to legalize it, they're going to do it whether you want to or not.
[02:29:05]  And no movement of a bunch of guys, a little bunch of space cadets, is going to make a difference.
[02:29:12]  If they want to, you know, What's a nice word?
[02:29:17]  If they want to disable, you know, the youth of America, they'll legalize marijuana.
[02:29:24]  Might as well drink straight shots of estrogen, huh?
[02:29:27]  That's right.
[02:29:28]  And these guys are stupid.
[02:29:31]  Let me tell you, I don't look like any church lady either.
[02:29:34]  They think they know who's liberal, who's conservative.
[02:29:36]  No, they don't.
[02:29:37]  Everyone's o up here.
[02:29:38]  They're constantly offering me petitions for the Green Party.
[02:29:42]  No one ever offers me any.
[02:29:44]  I say I'm a Republican.
[02:29:46]  No way, man.
[02:29:47]  How could you be?
[02:29:49]  You're too cool, man.
[02:29:50]  really yeah and then people have i have to say the concerted may be naive about something but i think the most part they're a heck of a lot smarter than liberals Liberals are naive.
[02:29:59]  Yeah, I really thought those days had almost gone, but I guess maybe not in Portland.
[02:30:03]  You know, Portland is a mecca of stupidity as far as I'm concerned.
[02:30:07]  But I mean, there's a lot of nice people here, too.

=== Magic And Christian (09:29) ===

[02:30:08]  Don't get me wrong, but there's a lot of stupidity from what I feel is just the liberalism and the lack of sophistication up here.
[02:30:17]  Well, I really appreciate your call.
[02:30:18]  Thank you.
[02:30:19]  Thank you.
[02:30:19]  And guys, remember what it is she says you're doing to yourself.
[02:30:42]  How do you know when you've smoked too much marijuana?
[02:30:46]  Well, you go to your doctor's office and he urges you to do a frequent self-examination.
[02:30:51]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:30:53]  Hello.
[02:30:53]  King Arthur.
[02:30:54]  Yes.
[02:30:55]  Mitch, the magic Christian.
[02:30:56]  Yes, yes, yes.
[02:30:57]  Calling you from beautiful Ventura by the sea.
[02:30:59]  You know, magic and Christian should not go together.
[02:31:02]  Christians regard magic in a very negative way.
[02:31:07]  Not this one.
[02:31:09]  Well, most do.
[02:31:11]  Well, I'm not aware of that.
[02:31:13]  And any extra power of that sort comes from you know where.
[02:31:17]  Well, there are mystical things that take place on both sides of the fence.
[02:31:23]  And that was one of the things I was going to ask you about tonight.
[02:31:26]  A couple of calls that you had both in this show.
[02:31:29]  I had meant to talk to you about this before, but I always seem to get, you know, sidetracked by Mr. Hoagland or Ed Dames or one of your other fantastic guests.
[02:31:40]  On one call you had, somebody asked you if you'd read the Bible, and you've been asked that, I know, many times, and your response is usually generally the same, and that is, yes, several times.
[02:31:48]  Yes, several times is correct.
[02:31:50]  And then, yet, on the other hand, when someone asks you a question about something that's like, you know, a theme, it isn't even just here or there.
[02:32:00]  It's a theme throughout the whole Old Testament and much more concentrated in the new, and that's the resurrection of the body.
[02:32:06]  You seem to be kind of non-plussed by that or like it's coming out of left field and you're not.
[02:32:12]  No, I know what the Bible says.
[02:32:14]  Yeah, Jesus was.
[02:32:17]  I know the dead shall I know.
[02:32:18]  He called himself the firstborn among many brethren, and he showed his glorified body.
[02:32:22]  It was an unusual body in that he could walk through walls and yet he still could say to Doubting Thomas, here, feel the hole in my hand and the hole in my side from the wounds.
[02:32:39]  Or he also said that he wasn't recognized by some people.
[02:32:44]  So he had the power to either cloud men's minds or...
[02:32:49]  Well, I don't want to be around when they come up.
[02:32:51]  That's all I've got to say.
[02:32:54]  East of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:32:56]  Hello.
[02:32:56]  Yeah, this is Rob in Utah.
[02:32:58]  Hello, Rob.
[02:32:59]  I can levitate.
[02:33:01]  How far?
[02:33:02]  Well, only a few feet, and it's only for a couple seconds.
[02:33:06]  You mean you plunge down or you come down easily?
[02:33:09]  Well, you know, it depends.
[02:33:10]  Because the way my power works is I kind of bend at the knee and forcefully exert myself up.
[02:33:16]  And you push up.
[02:33:17]  Yeah, and then, you know, I levitate for a few seconds.
[02:33:19]  Are your knees still bent as you're levitating, or do they straighten them?
[02:33:22]  Well, I can straighten them out.
[02:33:23]  You can straighten them out.
[02:33:24]  Yeah.
[02:33:24]  And you can hang above the floor or the ground by several feet?
[02:33:29]  Oh, no, I didn't.
[02:33:30]  You know, it depends on how far, you know, how much force I exert with my legs.
[02:33:34]  I'd love to see that.
[02:33:35]  You can try it.
[02:33:36]  Just stand up, bend at the knees, and push up on the balls of your feet.
[02:33:43]  Well, my knee cracked.
[02:33:46]  That's about the only thing that happened.
[02:33:47]  My knee cracked.
[02:33:48]  That's the only way I know.
[02:33:49]  To people levitate.
[02:33:50]  That's it, huh?
[02:33:51]  Yeah.
[02:33:52]  Well, then, maybe there's one part of it that I must be not doing right or something.
[02:33:57]  Now, on the other hand, if I crouch down and bend my knees and spring up very quickly.
[02:34:05]  You levitate.
[02:34:06]  Well, no, I go up a little bit.
[02:34:09]  I jump.
[02:34:10]  White men can jump, and then I come back down.
[02:34:14]  Well, you're still levitating for a few seconds.
[02:34:16]  That's not levitating.
[02:34:18]  I was just kidding.
[02:34:20]  Oh, I told you that's the only way I know of people levitating.
[02:34:23]  In your ear.
[02:34:24]  Goodbye.
[02:34:26]  We're talking floating now.
[02:34:28]  Floating.
[02:34:28]  Levitation is floating, not jumping.
[02:34:32]  First time caller line, you're on the air.
[02:34:37]  Intestinal problems, obviously.
[02:34:39]  Where's the number for natrons?
[02:34:45]  Natrons, Healthy Trinity, sir.
[02:34:47]  You could use it.
[02:34:48]  It's 1-800-992-3323, and soon those problems will go away.
[02:34:54]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:34:57]  Hello there.
[02:34:59]  Wildcard line, you're on the air.
[02:35:01]  Good morning.
[02:35:02]  Good morning, Art.
[02:35:03]  First of all, that young lady, or I don't know if she was young, but she called from Portland.
[02:35:07]  Sounded young.
[02:35:08]  Yeah, I must say that just the way she was talking kind of turned me on there.
[02:35:12]  I wouldn't mind getting her phone number.
[02:35:14]  Second of all, it's a dating service.
[02:35:16]  No, we don't do that.
[02:35:18]  No, no.
[02:35:18]  If anybody gets phone numbers here, it's me, not you.
[02:35:21]  Okay.
[02:35:22]  Second of all, the other night I called you before the show, and I was kind of acting like a jerk.
[02:35:27]  Yeah.
[02:35:27]  To you, asking for your address.
[02:35:29]  Yeah.
[02:35:29]  I need to apologize for that because I was quite drunk at the time.
[02:35:33]  You were?
[02:35:34]  Yeah.
[02:35:35]  I have a feeling that actually I knew that.
[02:35:37]  You did?
[02:35:38]  Yeah, I have what I call a talcoholic meter here.
[02:35:43]  Don't laugh.
[02:35:45]  I do.
[02:35:46]  You do?
[02:35:46]  Yeah.
[02:35:47]  Anyways, I'd like to say that that older lady that was calling wondering about the marijuana.
[02:35:53]  Yes.
[02:35:54]  First of all, unlike tobacco, you don't smoke the leaf.
[02:35:57]  The leaf tastes really bad.
[02:35:59]  You want to smoke the bud of the plant.
[02:36:02]  The buds.
[02:36:03]  Yeah, the buds.
[02:36:04]  That's where all the THC is.
[02:36:06]  And hydroponic bud that's thrown into water that has even more THC.
[02:36:11]  So you smoke, do you?
[02:36:13]  I want to get away from it.
[02:36:14]  And you drink, too.
[02:36:15]  Oh, yeah.
[02:36:16]  How's your breast size?
[02:36:18]  Oh, gosh, my pecs are doing pretty good.
[02:36:21]  Are they?
[02:36:22]  Yeah.
[02:36:23]  Are you approaching the need for a training bra?
[02:36:28]  Not quite.
[02:36:28]  Not quite.
[02:36:29]  All right.
[02:36:29]  Well, let me know.
[02:36:30]  Keep me informed.
[02:36:31]  West of the Rockies, you're on the air.
[02:36:33]  Oh, hello there, Art.
[02:36:34]  Cameron, KSFO.
[02:36:36]  Hi, how are you doing?
[02:36:37]  I'm doing pretty good.
[02:36:37]  I've got to tell you, this has got to be the best show I've ever heard you have.
[02:36:40]  These callers are just nuts.
[02:36:42]  Yeah, it's like the doors opened up and they came marching in.
[02:36:45]  That's the way it goes.
[02:36:46]  I'm telling you, nighttime talk radio is pretty damn good.
[02:36:51]  Well, it's.
[02:36:52]  Well, it wouldn't be the same if you had screened your calls like so many of the others do.
[02:36:56]  They might take a quick hint of watching tonight.
[02:37:00]  Well, I think that any good.
[02:37:02]  My theory is, and eventually I'll be proven right, any good talk host can take any call, good, bad, indifferent, and either make it entertaining or informative or something.
[02:37:12]  There really aren't bad calls.
[02:37:14]  Well, you know, now that you say that, I kind of think of it as kind of pro-wrestling.
[02:37:18]  If you're screening your calls, you might as well be a pro-wrestler.
[02:37:21]  It's just as fake anyhow, you know.
[02:37:22]  It's kind of like that, isn't it?
[02:37:24]  Well, now that I think about it, from listening to it, I've been laughing all night.
[02:37:28]  I listened to the first three callers, and I thought, well, I'm going to have to crack a beer for the first time in a while and just laugh my butt off.
[02:37:35]  Look, entertainment comes in many forms.
[02:37:38]  Sometimes from a very serious program with a guest talking about the end of the world.
[02:37:43]  Sometimes it comes from the callers themselves.
[02:37:45]  Sometimes it comes from the news.
[02:37:48]  Entertainment comes in many forms.
[02:37:49]  Well, that's why you're so dang good.
[02:37:51]  You see, you actually got me to make up a couple of resumes.
[02:37:54]  From listening for the past year, I made up a couple of resumes to send them out to the radio stations around California.
[02:38:02]  I sent one into KSFO.
[02:38:05]  Haven't heard from them yet.
[02:38:08]  You wouldn't necessarily start with a KSFO size.
[02:38:11]  No, yeah, I know it was huge, but I had to try.
[02:38:13]  You've got to go to Bloomberg, Arkansas, you know.
[02:38:16]  Yeah, or Nowhere, California.
[02:38:20]  There's a town down here called that.
[02:38:22]  Would you really want to be a talk host?
[02:38:24]  Actually, yeah, I've been in radio and television all my life.
[02:38:27]  I wouldn't mind doing it live on the air, though, because I think that's really where you're getting to the communication.
[02:38:32]  Not marketing.
[02:38:33]  You're doing communication.
[02:38:34]  You know, you have the marketing with your advertisement.
[02:38:36]  Would you do unscreen calls?
[02:38:38]  Oh, definitely.
[02:38:39]  I wouldn't have it any other way to have that coop call in and tell me she's a pro-psychic.
[02:38:46]  Yeah, and then I asked for a psychically sent message, and she speaks out loud.
[02:38:51]  Yeah, I thought that was funny.
[02:38:52]  That really blew my mind.
[02:38:53]  I went to court the other day, and some guy tried that with interpretation.
[02:38:56]  Judge asked him, could you be the interpreter?
[02:38:58]  And he says, sure.
[02:38:59]  And he didn't speak a word of Spanish.
[02:39:00]  He just kept sitting there saying real carefully, it's a bad ticket.
[02:39:07]  All right, listen.
[02:39:08]  I guess you're going to get the honors tonight.
[02:39:11]  So, you know, this way, from San Francisco, you know what they are.
[02:39:15]  Oh, yeah, from KSFO country.
[02:39:17]  Keep the powder keg dry and dig deep, America.
[02:39:20]  Good night.
[02:39:21]  All right, I guess that'll do it.

=== Facing Tomorrow's Challenges (00:19) ===

[02:39:23]  Listen, don't forget, everybody, tomorrow night, Luba will be here.
[02:39:28]  She's going to talk to us, Luba Brezhnev, that is.
[02:39:30]  She's going to talk to us about Russia.
[02:39:32]  It will be fascinating, and I'm going to Moscow, so I want to hear it all.
[02:39:37]  And it may not all be good.
[02:39:38]  So tomorrow night, you'll see what I'm facing and what we're all facing from the high desert.