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Air Date: May 23, 2008
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	Waging war on corruption.
	Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.
	Big Brother, mainstream media, government cover-ups.
	You want answers?
	Well, so does he.
	He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.
	And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.
	22-year-old Nikki Riley, a convert to militant Islam, described as a vulnerable man who's been preyed upon and radicalized.
	He has a history of mental illness.
	Nikki Riley travelled by bus from Plymouth to Exeter yesterday morning.
	He went to the Princess Hay shopping mall in the city centre.
	It's thought he went into the toilet at the Giraffe restaurant.
	Shortly afterwards, there was an explosion.
	Riley was arrested at the scene of the blast.
	He'd suffered cuts to his eye and some burns on his face when it went off.
	He's being treated at a hospital while under police custody.
	Okay.
	Alright, let's go to Paul Watson just for three minutes.
	Then we've got Ray McGovern, scheduled top CIA analyst to go over the war, the economy, where he thinks things are going.
	You're there in England.
	I mean, it's always the same M.O.
	A mental patient
	With a firecracker with some thumbtacks on it, blows it up in his face, and now they're ninnying, running around, freaking out.
	And this happened right after they were before the European Human Rights Court about secret arrest without habeas corpus.
	And now your El Presidente is taking time out, your Prime Minister, from saying, we need martial law and we need a new world order, he's taking time out to fearmonger Paul Watson.
	Well, yeah, it's, from what I can see, it's basically Dumb and Dumber Part 2.
	You remember the, uh, terror attack on the Glasgow Airport a year ago?
	They called it a terror attack.
	It was actually two retards setting fire to a jeep.
	But it was in the news for about three weeks after.
	And, uh, presented as another reason why we should, you know, be putting a terror database for filming a bunch of flowers at a tube station.
	But, um,
	From what the eyewitnesses said about this one, which happened yesterday morning in Exeter, which is quite a small university town near the south coast of England.
	My brother used to live there.
	Down by Cornwall, isn't it?
	It's in that area.
	The eyewitnesses, and it was in a packed restaurant, but the actual bomb, if you want to call it that, was set off in a locked toilet.
	And the eyewitnesses described it as
	Didn't sound like a bomb, it sounded more like a lightbulb exploding.
	So again, it's some pathetic individual that's got a history of mental illness that's been influenced by some propaganda and being radicalized by it.
	And that's what they do, they now advertise, oh see there's deadly Al-Qaeda, it's white Al-Qaeda, remember they said armies of white Al-Qaeda, thousands trained with missiles, totally deadly force.
	And then they find them, you know, black, mentally ill street kids, mentally retarded.
	They give them a hundred grand to videotape an FBI building, bust them.
	The news says an army of crack assassins, so deadly trained, they were unstoppable.
	Then it turned out some of them can't even talk.
	And then, I mean, it's always the same M.O.
	Always the same M.O.
	Well, in Britain, they're trying to sell it on this so-called Islamo-fascism.
	They actually, they had a bust in Burnley, which is a northern town not too far away from where I live.
	And it was a Neo-Nazi, and he basically had a huge cache of rocket launchers and grenades, and it was in the local newspaper once, and it didn't even make, you know, BBC, whereas this is all over BBC at the moment, so they pick which ones they're going to propagandise about very carefully.
	This is not getting as much traction as Dumb and Dumber did setting fire to a jeep at Glasgow Airport, but it's certainly
	It's more in the news today than it was yesterday.
	Yeah, you would have thought giant alien spacecraft landed at the airport with tanks rolling by and Blair freaking out and panicking and the media saying, will Britannia hold fast against the burning jeep?
	I mean, it's ridiculous.
	It was crazy.
	Well, I mean, then you look at the real bombings, the London bombings,
	The bombers were completely coddled by MI5 and they didn't display the behavior of suicide bombers, which is what they were.
	He runs PrisonPlanet.com.
	We're out of time, Paul.
	Thank you so much for popping in.
	Alright, thanks, Alex.
	Thank you.
	We'll be right back.
	It's ridiculous.
	It was crazy.
	Well, I mean, then you look at the real bombings, the London bombings, which is... The bombers were completely coddled by MI5 and they didn't display the behavior of suicide bombers, which is what they were, so... He runs PrisonPlanet.com.
	We're out of time, Paul.
	Thank you so much for popping in.
	Alright, thanks, Alex.
	Thank you.
	We'll be right back.
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	We are live, not just on the radio, but at PrisonPlanet.tv for all the viewers that tune into that each day.
	Up on the screen I have
	We're good to go.
	We should all pray for Ray McGovern because he's been a great patriot to this country and one of the top senior CIA analysts to several presidents, gave George Bush Sr.
	his daily briefing and under seven presidents for over 27 years,
	We're good to go.
	Thanks Alex, good to be back with you.
	Well actually I've been kind of lucky.
	Aside from the fatigue, the symptoms have been controllable.
	I'm looking forward in a couple weeks to getting a clean bill of health, so I'm very fortunate.
	I've reflected very much on how privileged I am to have the access to medical care that 50 million of my fellow Americans lack, so it's been a kind of wake-up call in many respects for me, Alex.
	Well, for your age, I remember meeting you in person.
	You look 20 years younger than you are.
	So you're a tough guy.
	But they're really saying they think you're going to pull through it.
	Yeah, they've really perfected the art on this kind of lymphoma.
	It happens to be the kind that that Red Sox pitcher that pitched the no-hitter last week had a couple of years ago.
	I'm oiling my baseball glove down in the cellar and I'll be ready to go another month.
	Good, that's fantastic news.
	Didn't mean to spend too much time on that.
	You've written a lot of articles analyzing the fact that they may still be planning to attack Iran.
	Israel said last week, oh yeah, top officials say they're going to attack before Bush leaves.
	Now can you break down the field and give us an intelligence briefing on what you're being told by sources in D.C.
	and what we're getting from leaks in the media and from diplomatic sources about what they're planning.
	Are they going to start a war?
	Well Alex, it looks pretty clear that the administration, that is Bush and Cheney, very much want to head out after Iran.
	Head out on Iran.
	It would be this time with very little warning.
	It would be from the air.
	And
	Since the intelligence says that the Iranians have stopped working on the nuclear weapons related part of their nuclear program, you know, it's going to be kind of difficult to hit out at a program that was stopped in mid-2003.
	So they switched all the propaganda over to the fact that, quote, or the allegation that, quote,
	Iranian-supported groups with Iranian weapons, Iranian training, and Iranian funding are killing hundreds of our troops in southern Iraq.
	And we're going to prove that to you.
	Now, the rub came when Petraeus and Admiral Mullen, who should know better, promised the Western press on the 25th of April
	That Petraeus has the goods on these guys, and we're going to have a big display of these weapons, and we're going to destroy them in front of your eyes!
	And they've done this, like, four or five times last few years, always claiming they've proven Iran did it, and then they always retract very quietly, and the media never makes a big deal about their deception.
	You know, Alex, that's the big story here.
	You know, here they tell the media on April 25th that this is coming, and two weeks later, they kind of go, oh, by the way, you know, people have canceled that briefing.
	And it's become very clear that all these weapons that they captured around Karbala, they couldn't trace one of them to Iranian origin.
	The best they could do is they found five hand grenades up with the Al-Qaeda types up there in the northern part of Iraq, five hand grenades that can clearly be demonstrated to have been made in Iran.
	Give me a break, five hand grenades!
	So what's happened here is it's become very embarrassing for the administration to say,
	Are we talking about these Iranian weapons?
	But we can't deliver any, we can't show you any, and Lieberman can ask Petraeus as he did.
	Is it true to say that hundreds of American servicemen have been killed by Iranian-provided weapons?
	Yes, sir, says Petraeus.
	Petraeus doesn't know the difference.
	I remind you very much of General Westmoreland at the end of the, well, in the middle of the Vietnam War.
	Westmoreland did not tell the truth, and I'll say that Petraeus does not tell the truth.
	And this latest bit about Petraeus saying, well, you know, just wait till, you know, the summer.
	I'll probably recommend withdrawing more troops.
	Well, how many bait-and-switch things are the American people going to put up with?
	Petraeus is not to be trusted.
	And this whole thing about Iran now will reverse, in my view, toward the big lie, which is that Ahmadinejad has threatened to push Israel into the sea, has threatened to destroy Israel.
	How many times has your president said that?
	He didn't.
	Ahmadinejad did not say that.
	It was a terrible translation of what he did say, and we can go into that later.
	But the big lie is that Israel is about to be
	I think?
	The Israeli Ambassador here in Washington repeated, you know, sometimes they sort of slip and say the truth.
	Why did Admiral Fallon really leave?
	Was that because he refuses to launch a Hitlerian preemptive attack like Hitler did on Poland or Czechoslovakia?
	I think that's the core of it, Alex.
	It's very clear from all those interviews he gave to that Esquire reporter.
	And that article that came out earlier this year, that he wasn't about to take part in yet another illegal, under international as well as domestic law, illegal war of aggression.
	Because that's exactly the way Nuremberg, the Nuremberg Tribunal after World War II, defined a preemptive or preventive war.
	There's nothing in the UN Treaty, there's nothing in the US Congress legislation that
	That blesses or proves an offense, an invasion, or an attack on a country that does not pose an imminent threat.
	And there is no one, there is no one who knows anything about Iran who can suggest with a straight face that Iran poses an imminent threat to the United States of America.
	Do you ever feel like you're waking up in the middle of a twilight zone, that the United States would be the bad guys, and that we would be attacking all these innocent countries and lying, and that we'd have a war criminal president?
	Well, Alex, it took me a while and my colleagues and veteran intelligence professionals for sanity.
	It took us a while in 2001, 2002.
	To kind of be okay with the notion that, hey, we really needed to turn our analytic skills, develop at government expense, at taxpayer expense, on our own leaders.
	And yes, it is true that they lie a lot.
	Whoops!
	And you know, this may be, these lies may be leading up to what Nuremberg called the War of Aggression.
	We called it three months before.
	We weren't the only ones.
	Scott Ritter and others were also sounding the same, the same note.
	But it happened, and still it was hard for us to believe that our leaders and our former colleagues in the intelligence services would cooperate with this.
	And yet they all did.
	But isn't that what's so dangerous, is they did cooperate, now they're not cooperating as much.
	I'm told the State Department, you know, they're jokingly putting Hitler mustaches on the pictures of somebody of the Bush and the Vice President.
	But this isn't a joke.
	I mean, we're dealing with people that have shown that they're willing to, quote, go for it.
	And, you know, Gulf of Tonkin events, staged events, provocateur events.
	Are you worried about them trying to stage something?
	Because I don't see them being able, even in this Alice in Wonderland system, you know, this Tea Party of insanity, to be able to attack Iran without some type of staged provocation.
	And I'm sure you know, we even talked to him, and he admitted and clarified, Gary Hart told us, that yes, he is afraid the government will stage, blow up a ship,
	I am, Alex, and I think you're right.
	Some kind of provocation would be necessary.
	Now, Fallon, when he was commander of CENTCOM,
	Very, very strict regulations about what they call encounter engagements.
	You know, how do you deal with little outboard motorboats that come speeding up to your naval vessel?
	Do you blow them out of the water or do you try to see if they have any dangerous missiles or anything on them?
	Well, obviously it's the latter.
	Now, what is it now?
	I don't know what it is now, but there is a report that I have seen that the White House has insisted, the next time that happens, that the commander in the Persian Gulf contacted the White House directly, not the Defense Department, to pursue instructions.
	So that's one danger.
	With all those ships out there, it could be a legitimate or it could be a manufactured provocation.
	The other part of it is that the President has rhetorically put himself out on the same kind of limb that he was before Iraq.
	And the people who have put him out there are the same kinds of folks, Richard Perle, Wolfowitz, and the rest of them, that said then and are saying now, look, Mr. President, you said
	That you would not ever permit Iran to have a nuclear weapon, and it looks like they may get one, or are you just going to go out of office and suffer the opprobrium of history that would say, oh, big talk, but George Bush took no action?
	You can't do that, Mr. President.
	And so, what he has done is gotten this country out of the limb, as if we are automatically pledged to defend Israel if it gets attacked by Iran or anybody else.
	And so we've lost the initiative.
	It's not up to us anymore.
	It could be Israel that would set this thing off, and that is really troubling.
	Stay there.
	A senior CIA retired analyst, a briefer for Ronald Reagan, George Bush Sr., Ray McGovern.
	We're going to come back and talk about how we stop a war, or if it happens, what it's going to look like.
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	Riders on the storm Riders on the storm
	We've got a former top CIA analyst, Ray McGovern, who did the big world brief daily for multiple presidents, the wide spectrum analysis of what we're facing.
	A, can we stop them from attacking?
	Because as you said earlier, Israel and others are leaking that they plan to, that's going to happen.
	Or is that another piece of propaganda?
	But then we saw the preparations, and then B, if it happens, what are we likely to see happen worldwide with the economy and then militarily, Ray McGovern?
	Well Alex, can we stop it?
	We just have to stop it.
	I don't know what it's going to take.
	The supreme hurdle, of course, is the captive press, the corporate dominated press that will not tell Americans the real story.
	But there have to be ways, there have to be imaginative ways, ways that you use and other commentators to get the word out that really there is no threat from Iran, and that this is all a sort of manufactured kind of threat of the same kind we saw prior to the attack on Iraq.
	I, as you know, have made a kind of a college try to get Admiral Fallon to realize that it's not enough just to resign.
	He needs to tell the American people.
	I mean, I'm sure that he's lost many sleepless nights thinking about what would happen if we attacked Iran from the air.
	No, these guys in the blue suits, you know, they say, well, hey, we can just, we can do it surgically and everything will be fine.
	Well, they never have to deal with the aftermath.
	You know what the aftermath could involve?
	It could involve cutting the supply lines between Kuwait and Baghdad that are vital to supplying our troops in Iraq, of which there are about 140,000 right now.
	Now, if Iran can do that, and it can do that very readily, we would have the prospect, Alex, of having not, you know, 52 hostages in some embassy this time, but 52,000 U.S.
	servicemen cut off from their supply lines, taken in effect as hostages by the Iranian Revolutionary Guards.
	Do we want that?
	Well, Fallon certainly didn't want that.
	Did he think he might be ordered?
	To do something that would lead to that?
	He did.
	He saw who was calling the shots in the White House.
	It's Elliott Abrams.
	It's Dick Cheney.
	It's not anybody else.
	Who, by the way, are chicken hawks.
	When Secretary of the Army, who was an Enron crook, I'm not defending him, White said, 500,000 troops, they said you're fired.
	This does have, in my mind, images of Hitler in the bunker, commanding armies that didn't exist.
	Well, you know, as many have pointed out, especially Andrew Bukiewicz, the Boston University professor who is the best on this subject, you know, there aren't any troops.
	You know, it was the same in Vietnam, Alex.
	The fellas in the blue suits, you know, they want a piece of the action.
	So these generals from the Air Force come to Cheney and Bush and say, you know, hey, we have these smart bombs, we have these stealth bombers.
	Nobody gets shot down this time.
	We can knock out half of the Iranian nuclear facilities one night, second half the next night.
	Just let us do it, you know?
	Well, again,
	You know, I'm showing my prejudice here, having been an army infantry officer, okay?
	They never have to fight the enemy.
	Yeah, they really... it's sort of... sort of distant.
	It's kind of, you know, you drop the bombs, you say, well, you know, they're well-guided, and you never see the aftermath.
	You don't see the people who are killed.
	You don't see collateral damage.
	You don't see the damage that that does to us, and the insurgence that that cultivates or grows automatically.
	So, what I'm afraid of is that the Cheney and Bush, before they leave,
	They really have not been held accountable for anything.
	And since Bush, at least, is an incredibly risk-taking person, and since he seems to have made a promise... Yeah, the word, sir, unless you disagree, is extremely reckless.
	Reckless is the word, yeah.
	And if he feels, as he seems to, that he's made this promise to Israel that he would deliver Israel from this evil... You know, the vocabulary itself, Alex, give me a pause.
	I think, you know, not until this regime has, as the American administration talked about, good and evil in the apocalyptic, you know, in the kind of sense that these people have been using.
	Well, we know they're playing off of their minions in a really sadistic, mean way.
	Some people who, you know, I guess want the end of the world, but this is, I guess they really are making it apocalyptic then.
	Well, it will be, whether they realize that or not.
	And that's the rub, because Fallon was smart enough to realize what this could mean.
	And I just used one example, Alex.
	I mean, the other things they could do is actually attack Israel with missiles.
	They can hit the oil wellheads in the Gulf and put a lot of them.
	And we'll be paying not $4 a gallon, we'll be paying $10 a gallon automatically.
	They can do all these things, and I'm just wondering if anyone in the very tight circle that is advising Bush and Cheney, whether they have the guts to tell Bush that.
	I mean, do you remember just two months ago when the press said, Mr. President, what do you think about the possibility of $4 a gallon oil?
	Stay there, stay there.
	Ray McGovern, senior former CIA analyst.
	We'll be back.
	We've got a long segment, sir.
	Plenty of time to get into this.
	Thanks for being with us.
	Stay there.
	We'll be right back.
	We're on the march.
	The Empire's on the run.
	Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.
	It is a big idea.
	A new world order.
	In the near future, Earth is dominated by powerful world governments.
	It's known as the Builder.
	Stay there, stay there.
	Ray McGovern, a senior, a former CIA analyst.
	We'll be back.
	We've got a long segment, sir.
	Plenty of time to get into this.
	Thanks for being with us.
	Stay there.
	We'll be right back.
	We're on the march.
	The Empire's on the run.
	Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.
	It is a big idea.
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	Ray McGovern, top CIA analyst to multiple presidents.
	Combat infantry commander, Vietnam.
	outspoken individual has been criticizing we have this clip we can play of him confronting Rumsfeld about his lies and there's all this media there and none of them will do it and they still really won't
	And then about a month ago, Ray McGovern, you may have seen it, there was a clip with the good looking front lady they use for the presidential spokesperson, the press secretary, and they come up to her and they say, is it true the dollar being devalued is making oil prices go up?
	And of course that's part of it.
	The instability makes the speculation as well.
	Are they going to blow the Middle East to pieces and so oil's up?
	That's part of it.
	But mainly dollar devaluation.
	Is it true that's why oil's so much?
	She just said, I can't comment on that.
	I'll be fired if I do.
	She said that like three times.
	I mean that shows
	Just to me, that there's not a lot of connection between the Press Secretary and the President or the Vice President, and it shows kind of like a crying out for help.
	I mean, the way she looked and the way she was saying it, and Ari Fleischer before saying, yeah, they put out fake terror alerts for political purposes and then they removed him the next day.
	I mean, I'm seeing just a lot of really bad signs, because to have an evil government's one thing, that's bad.
	But to have one that's out of control and delusional, and I'm seeing, just as a layman, but I've studied quite a bit, you know, history, I'm getting a lot of signals that things are out of control.
	Do you have any comments on that?
	Well, I agree, Alex.
	And the situation is very much similar to that before of the attack on Iraq.
	On the day that Colin Powell spoke at the UN, we veteran intelligence professionals for sanity issued our first corporate memorandum.
	We finished up by saying, Mr. President, we strongly advise that you broaden the circle of your advisors beyond those already bent on a war for which we see no compelling reason and from which we believe the unintended consequences are likely to be
	Catastrophic.
	Now, we could see at that point in time that the key was this little tight circle of advisors, of whom only Colin Powell knew which end was up, really, and we know what he was worth in the final analysis.
	And now, where we have an even tighter circle, where we know the President doesn't read the newspapers, Dana Perino says, well, you know, I can't answer that because I'll be fired.
	And then when the President himself, as I started to mention before, two months ago when he gets up before a press conference, somebody said, well, what do you think about the prospect of maybe $4 a gallon?
	And he looked shocked.
	He said, well, wait a second.
	Where'd you get that?
	And it had been in the news, like, for the week previous.
	Well, I'll have to ask my advisors about that, because that's the first I heard about this.
	Well, what are you paying at the pump now, Alex?
	Four dollars, right?
	Yeah, four dollars.
	So the guy is detached from reality, he's uninformed, and we know, we know, that Cheney is able to keep the information flow to him and away from him.
	So, what he's being told with respect to weapons from Iran and southern Iraq, for example,
	Twelve days after it was clear that those recent charges by Petraeus and others were bogus, the President is still telling the world openly that we're catching them, we're catching those guys, giving those weapons to Iranian insurgents, and when we get them, we're going to get them.
	You know, we're going to pursue them.
	Well that brings me to my next question, and I know you follow the news, I'm glad you did pick up on that White House Press Secretary story, because that was just amazing to me, and there's so many other indicators that are the same, or similar, and that was a month ago, whenever McCain was in Baghdad, and then surrounding capitals of other countries, and he kept saying, Iran is funding Al-Qaeda, Iran is Al-Qaeda,
	I mean, everybody knows they're Shiites.
	I mean, that's the opposite warring faction, you know, the two main branches of Islam.
	And then Sy Hersh four years ago, and then the White House last year admitted that they're funding three different Wahhabist groups attacking.
	One of them headed up with a number three in Al-Qaeda.
	And so here's our government, or the executive, funding Al-Qaeda to attack and blow up mosques and shoot people, and Iran's suing us over it.
	And then, meanwhile, but then McCain comes back and in a Senate Armed Services Committee says to Petraeus, I mean, Petraeus, excuse me, I just love the nickname Petraeus, and says, isn't it true that Iran funds Al-Qaeda?
	And he said, yes, they're Al-Qaeda.
	I mean, this is, this is, the propaganda is insane!
	Yeah, the problem is that normal Americans, you know, they kick their shoes off in the evening and tune into Fox News and they think they're getting the straight story.
	We have to find imaginative ways to grab them by the collar, these phonies, and say, look, look, Petraeus told us last October that there is absolutely no doubt that Iranians are funding, supporting, giving weapons to, and training these insurgents in southern Iraq.
	Well, what proof has he of that?
	He has none.
	And this last fiasco, which the mainstream press just kind of, you know, ignored for two weeks,
	Here's the mainstream press told, hey, we're going to have a big press conference.
	We're going to show you those Iranian weapons.
	Two weeks later, well, it's been cancelled.
	No story there?
	Give me one break.
	In some respects, Alex, the captive press here, the controlled press, is more controlled now than in the lead-up to the war in Iraq.
	Well here's an example.
	They're having a 125 world leaders meet to set a lot of policy at the Bilderberg group coming up in Chantilly outside DC through the 5th through the 8th I'll be going and just six, seven years ago the media said it didn't exist.
	Now they admit that a lot of policy gets set there and the Logan Act gets violated and things like that happen.
	But we have from inside Bilderberg, they don't normally meet in the US but every five years they're meeting here in North America again
	Because they're saying we have the most controlled press and that the police will ban protest.
	And so now elites are meeting here because we have less freedoms than Europe.
	I mean, that's something else that's just amazing to me that this type of stuff is going on.
	You know, Alex, the parallel with Europe is very unsettling.
	If you look at the parallel between the burning of the Reichstag, the German Parliament in 1933, and what happened at 9-11, you can see that the Germans reacted to that in a very, very passive way.
	They said, well, you know, if terrorists, and that was the word used.
	These particular terrorists were accused of being communists, but it was, if terrorists burn the Reichstag down, then we accept as a matter of course that our telephone calls will be intercepted, that our desks will be broken into, that a mail will be read.
	It's just, you know, all the duty, all the responsibilities the government had toward us and the Constitution, well, they can be put in abeyance.
	Now, we know what happened.
	That was 1933, and Hitler was able to hold his way for the next few years against this passivity.
	And what we have in our country is very similar today.
	Ask your neighbor, do you mind if your telephone calls are being monitored?
	And you know what they'll say?
	Well, you know what they'll say.
	They'll say, well, I don't mind, because I'm not talking to Osama bin Laden.
	They don't understand that they've used the Patriot Act hundreds of thousands of times in non-terror related.
	They don't understand that the greatest threat isn't some guys in a cave, even if the 9-11 attacks were really orchestrated by them.
	Hypothetically, the greater threat is giving up our whole way of life for something that you have a better chance of dying from a peanut allergy or being struck by lightning or drowning.
	Well, yes I can.
	Just take the eavesdropping here, which is probably going on as you and I speak, so to speak.
	Now, you know, people need to know that the very reason that the FISA law, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act, was put into effect in 1978 was to prevent the kind of thing that J. Edgar Hoover was doing, as a matter of course, not only to citizens like us, but to senators, representatives, to presidents, okay?
	Now, you may not, your neighbor may not care if your phone is being tapped, but do you care if Nancy Pelosi's phone is being tapped?
	Do you care if other Democratic leaders are candidates, if their funds are being taxed?
	Let me stop you.
	This is not hypothetical.
	It's come out that Nixon, obviously, and Clinton, and now Bush Sr., and all of them spy on each other.
	But to give a monolithic homeland security, boy how fascist is that, the power to spy, it just came out that MI6 and MI5
	Tony Blair has had them spying on the House of Commons and Lords for political power, and they've been using it to burn their enemies.
	We know they're going to do that, and that gives the executive incredible power to set up a dictatorship.
	Please comment on that.
	Well, that's exactly why they put that law in, and that's exactly why Bush and Cheney decided to circumvent that law.
	Take this General Michael Hayden, okay?
	He's head of the National Security Agency, and the President, who actually was Cheney, goes to him and says, now we know that the first commandment over there at NSA is, thou shalt not eavesdrop on Americans, but we got this terrorist threat now, and we're going to do precisely that.
	Are you with us?
	Are you on our team, General Hayden?
	Now, one of General Hayden's predecessors told me that his saying yes to that, he should have been court-martialed.
	Because that's a violation of the law, that's a violation of the Supreme Law, and that he should have been court-martialed.
	Instead, he said, well, yeah, I suppose I could do that.
	Let me stop you again!
	They always escalate, they always push the envelope until there's nothing holding back anything now.
	That's not hyperbole that he should be court-martialed arrested.
	They're having to go back and pass laws, which themselves are unconstitutional, retroactively, so all these companies and people don't go to jail.
	Go ahead.
	Yeah, well, that of course is a great danger.
	I'm delighted that for once, for the one and only time recently, the Democrats have been able to prevent that from happening so far.
	But you know, that's just one of these retroactive immunity things.
	The thing that bothers me the most is the President forcing Congress, just before the Congress changed hands, to give him and all his minions retroactive immunity for torture.
	And that came in the so-called Military Commissions Act, signed in October of 1996, just before Congress changed.
	And what it did was say, well, whatever the President or others have done with respect to torture, well, they shall be held harmless, just like they're trying to hold harmless the telecommunications giant.
	And then once that precedent set, you have the furor precept of what Nixon said.
	He said it's not illegal when the President does it.
	Well, it used to be, and unless we get some spine into congressmen, unless we get a wholesale change, and, you know, it's dubious, but at least we'll get some change coming early next year.
	You know, there's not much hope for us.
	That's why my focus is right now on preventing a new war, because the new war, you know, one of their calculations could well be, Alex, that the new war could help John McCain become president.
	That is scary.
	Yeah, he's got post-traumatic stress disorder.
	He flies off the handle for no reason.
	They say it's been reported multiple times daily.
	It's one thing to have a hot head if you're a talk show host, but I don't think you should be president.
	Now, I want to run through a couple of quick questions here with you.
	What do other, not just people in your Veterans Intelligence Group for sanity, but when you talk to other colleagues and other people you worked with in the NSA, CIA, Defense Intelligence, you know, being in and around all those people, I mean, are they...
	I'm getting a sense from just reading and talking to people and other guests that the government finally is freaked out and says, man, it's one thing to be corrupt and one thing to be out of control in a big government, but it's another thing to really be the bad guys, and that they now see that the whole system may be wrecked by these people.
	Well, there is that sense.
	The question is how much power they could wield.
	And without the press to replay their stories, that power is minimal.
	Now, I take some great encouragement from the fact that there are some people with integrity still working in the analytics section of the CIA.
	I'm not talking about the torturers now, I'm talking about the people who are trying to speak truth to power.
	For these guys to come up and have, blessed by their superiors, a national intelligence estimate that goes 180 degrees betwixt what Bush and Cheney were saying about Iran's intentions to build a nuclear weapon, as they did in December of last year.
	That was true rebellion against the tyranny.
	I mean, that is a big split in the government to have the official estimates say, no, there's no WMDs, no, there's no war, no, we don't need a war.
	Yeah, so there's that underlying basis of integrity, but even that has been eroded.
	Their leaders, McConnell, the head of national intelligence, and this despicable guy, Hayden, I mean, he makes a big speech out in Oklahoma and he says, well now it's my personal opinion, it's my personal opinion, that Iran is hell-bent on getting a nuclear weapon.
	Who cares about his personal opinion?
	If the whole intelligence community, 16 agencies, says Iran stopped trying to do a nuclear weapons related part of this program in 2003, who cares about Hayden's personal opinion?
	And it's all been inspected.
	They've been over the barrel.
	They let him in.
	I don't usually get into a book's cover, but I've watched a lot of hearings with Hayden and seen a lot of him and seen him compared to the same type of person.
	And I don't normally loathe people.
	Like, I don't even loathe George Bush.
	I don't like him.
	But there's something loathsome and something weak and chicken-necked and despotic about him and Richard Perle.
	They seem like two peas in a pod.
	Well, you know, what we have there is a Martinet.
	He's got four stars on his shoulder.
	And unfortunately, the way you get one star these days is to just salute very smartly and say, wonderful idea, to the next guy up.
	And so he's the example of the worst.
	And, you know, there are lots of things that could be adjusted.
	Let me just tell you one little true story here.
	After I questioned Rumsfeld down there in Atlanta, I was invited up to the Lou Dobbs Show in New York, okay, so I'm waiting to go on, and it was the period in which Hayden had been nominated to be head of the CIA.
	Now, I had read something indicating that Bobby Inman, the great Bobby Ray Inman, who I've enjoyed so much respect as head of NSA at one point, and who was there when the FISA law was constructed and had a big hand in constructing it, that at the New York Public Library two nights before he had said, Hayden clearly did something illegal here, he knows better than anyone that the FISA law prohibited what he was doing.
	It was a very sorrowful thing.
	That's what Inman told the New York Public Library.
	What happens next?
	He arrives at Lou Dobbs' show, goes on before me, cuts in ahead of me, puts on a tie.
	Dobbs says, what do you think of Hayden?
	And so I think he's supremely qualified for the job.
	I was on next, and had I had the time, I would have... Ray McGovern, stay there.
	We're on TV on one end of this, so we're going to keep talking during the break.
	We'll be back for everybody else in three minutes.
	Got to go to the Info Wars streams to hear this.
	Okay, Ray, Mr. McGovern, we've got five minutes on the other end, but I want to talk behind the scenes right now for folks that are watching on PrisonPlanet.tv.
	Continue with that story.
	Okay, well, what happens is, you know, he storms in there, somebody gives him a tie, he goes on before me, and he comes out five minutes later, and I'm watching it on the screen, and Lou Dobbs says, what do you think of General Mike Hayden to be the next CIA Director?
	Now, two days
	Not even two days after he said in public at the New York Public Library that Hayden knew what he was doing.
	He violated the law.
	He says to Lou Dobbs, extremely well qualified.
	I know him real well.
	Really great man for the job.
	Now, if you can't trust Bobby Ray Inman, who's sort of the paragon of trustfulness among the retired general or admiral corps, you can't trust anybody.
	And what is Inman doing?
	It's a misguided notion of professional courtesy.
	You know, these generals, these admirals, they've been so kind of molded into this sort of Martinet kind of atmosphere,
	That they're all in it together and will defend each other even though no one knew better than Bobby Ray Inman, the co-author of the FISA law that Hayden had deliberately violated and should have been, as one of the other previous heads of the NSA said, he should have been court-martialed rather than nominated to be head of the CIA.
	So that was a big deal to have Fox Fallon tell one of the biggest magazines in the country, Esquire, that they were planning to go to war and he thought it was a bad idea.
	And then they basically told him to resign, as they do.
	I mean, that was a big deal.
	And to have the CIA finally come out and do something right for a change and say, no, there's no threat, that's got to really upset the neocons.
	But it seems like it's only emboldened them because they know that if they can go ahead and stage something before they leave,
	As you said, that might boost their approval rating for a while, or maybe even, like you said, get the warmonger McCain into power.
	Well, that's what they're calculating, and they only have a few months left to do it.
	Now, the question is, as I started to say before, the initiative really lies with the Israelis at this point.
	They're quite capable.
	They're quite capable of a false flag operation.
	They're quite capable of sinking one of our ships in the Gulf.
	Now, people say, how can you say that, Ray?
	Well, go back to June 8, 1967.
	I'll tell you what, Mr. McGovern, we've only got five minutes on the other side.
	I want you to be able to talk about this.
	Can I hold you five more into the next hour so you have time to talk about that?
	No problem.
	Okay, okay.
	Guys, call the next guest and move them back.
	Okay, just let them know it's five minutes later.
	Okay, we're going live on the main network right now.
	I was talking behind the scenes for PrisonPlanet.tv viewers with Ray McGovern and he dropped a bombshell on me.
	He said, and our viewers, he said that
	It's really up to Israel right now on whether there's going to be an attack on Iran or not, both in the lobby and with things militarily that Israel does.
	They could even go back into Lebanon and claim that's a threat to them.
	I mean, anything could happen.
	And he said, and Israel could stage a false flag.
	Now, you then talked about the USS Liberty.
	I want you to be able to elaborate on that.
	You're in a little over five minutes into the next hour, so we have time.
	I mean, that is an amazing statement.
	I remember in the Washington Post, the week before 9-11, there was a Pentagon analysis saying we're worried Israel could stage a false flag to get us into a war in the Middle East.
	Can you speak to that?
	Well, yes.
	You know, it seems terribly cynical to suggest that what the President calls, quote, our ally, end quote, Israel, would do something like that.
	First off, your listeners should realize that in a juridical sense, there is no defense treaty with Israel.
	They are not our ally in any real sense of the term.
	You know, morally and so forth, they have begun, but that's not an obligation on our part to defend them.
	But that's sort of an academic point, as the President has promised to do precisely that.
	Plus, they've got one of the biggest militaries in the world and 400 nukes.
	Yeah, you know, one boggles the so-called threat from one nuke from Iran, when they have 400.
	But the situation...
	I think people really need to remember is that on the June 8, 1967, in the middle of that first war with the Arabs, the Israeli planes and torpedo boats did their damnedest to sink the USS Liberty, knowing full well that it was a U.S.
	naval ship.
	They killed 34 of the Liberty's crew and wounded over 170.
	Now, we have their intercepted messages.
	There's an American flag on that.
	Attack it.
	You know?
	We have the intercepted messages.
	There's no doubt.
	And by the way, they'd always denied that, and now as you said last year, NSA released the intercepts, what, we'd already had pilots come public and say they refused three times and were ordered, you attack and sink that American ship.
	Go ahead, sir.
	Yeah.
	So, you know, what's important for listeners to understand
	There's no doubt that it was deliberate.
	Now, why they would do such a thing?
	There are some very cogent theories.
	That's not clear.
	In other words, there is some question as to why they would do that.
	That they did it, there's no question about it.
	And one of the things listeners should also know is that the Navy, the Congress, LBJ, McNamara, everyone covered it up for decades.
	And finally, a book was written by a fellow named Jay Kristol that espoused the Israeli version of, oh, this is just a terrible mistake.
	And guess who endorsed that book?
	The younger John McCain, his father having been responsible for a bogus investigation of the incident itself.
	Now, I'm not saying the sins of the father should be visited on the son.
	I am saying that John McCain, Jr., in a crass appeal to the lobby,
	I endorse the conclusions of this book, which are clearly bogus, and which the NSA intercepts now released show are completely bogus.
	The veterans, such as the ones that survived the USS Liberty, deserve better, and their story needs to be told.
	Why?
	Because it was on June 8, 1967, and subsequent years, that the Israeli government was persuaded, for good reason,
	That they could literally get away with murder, and our Congress, and our Executive, and even our Navy would not say anything about it.
	That is a very, very dangerous position to be in, and beware of what might happen in the Gulf.
	Ray McGovern.
	We'll be back in 70 seconds for the final segment.
	Ray McGovern battling lymphoma cancer.
	Everybody should pray for him.
	We'll be right back, ladies and gentlemen.
	Boy, very bold today, and this amazing discussion.
	Final segment with him.
	Then for about 10 minutes, we've got Veterans for Peace on.
	They've been banned from the Memorial Day DC march.
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	Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.
	He did the morning briefings for multiple U.S.
	Presidents, including the President's father.
	Which means he's a CIA analyst.
	They have different types.
	He's the one that integrated all the big threats together for a large picture.
	That's the type of analysis we need.
	As we try to get into minutiae of each little sector, it's impossible.
	We've got about five minutes left with him.
	Ray McGovern, you were just bringing up Israel, staging a false flag.
	That is the elements that control Israel at the time.
	What is going on with Israel?
	I mean, they're endangering the whole world.
	The elite seems to be totally power-mad.
	They want to get rid of Iran, when Iran has tried to be friends with them, going back for 50 years, when they could certainly work things out.
	Every time there's moderate moolahs in control, they seem to freak out even more.
	I mean, what is this?
	Is this just overconfidence?
	I mean, why?
	Well, you know, Alex, I think part of their problem is us.
	You know, I'm talking about Elliott Abrams, arch neoconservative, convicted convict for lying to Congress during the Iran-Contra, and yet running our foreign policy out of the White House, our foreign policy toward that part of the world.
	What we're talking about here is a kind of delusional, extremist fringe.
	Cheney, Abrams are running this thing.
	Now, they have counterparts in Israel.
	Again, extremist, kind of lunatic fringe.
	Not the majority, not only of the Israelis, but the Israeli government.
	And yet, you know, they're being, sort of, egging each other on, thinking, well, we only have seven, eight months left of George W. Bush, we've got to exploit his... And we could be kings, we could start World War III and then be the kings, and then remake the world, like after World War II, and we can fix it all.
	I was just about to say, it seems like they egg each other on, like a group of hunting dogs that get each other really excited.
	You ever seen that?
	Well, exactly.
	Now, what I'm saying here is that this is an incredibly myopic
	I care a lot about Israel, okay?
	And most of the Israelis, I dare say most of them, realize that this is a very myopic policy.
	You know, attacking Lebanon as they did two summers ago, that was crazy!
	They lost, okay?
	Now Hezbollah is more powerful in Lebanon than ever before, and instead of having a multi-confessional government on their border, they're going to have a very hostile government.
	Similarly, now, they're talking with Syria.
	Elliott Abrams doesn't like that.
	So, there are some sensible folks in Israel that have started dealing with these folks as a sort of half measure.
	So what do you think is going to happen?
	We've only got two minutes left.
	What do you think is going to happen?
	Well, I think that unless somebody puts a spoke in the juggernaut toward war, that we will be bombing and missile attacking from our naval ships, Iran, within the next two months.
	So you think that's the window, the next two to three months?
	Well, that's a guess, okay?
	More than 50% confident it's going to happen when it happens, you know.
	Maybe God doesn't even know.
	But the problem is, you know, when you have people like Conyers or Pelosi or other people saying, oh, okay, well, if you tax Iran, then we might think about impeaching them.
	Well, give me a break, you know?
	That won't happen once the war started.
	Right!
	I mean, isn't this failing forward, where they know if they get us in a big enough tar baby, Americans will go, man, it doesn't matter if gas is $10 a gallon, we gotta do this for America.
	We're getting our ass kicked by the Iranians, because the Iranians are going to have the high ground if they counter-strike.
	Great, and so we have kind of the one candidate who wants to bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb, bomb Iran.
	You know, they may actually think that this could help that candidate.
	And then they've got the obliterate candidate.
	Well, you know, yeah, it's going to be interesting these next couple of... I think everyone needs to do something more than they have before, Alex.
	Go not only talk to, but occupy your congressmen and your congresswomen's or your senators' offices.
	Make sure they realize
	You know, for Pelosi and Conyers to say, well, now we'll impeach, that indicates they have no idea, whatever, of what a war with Iran would... We haven't even talked about the terrorist threat.
	I mean, the terrorist threat from Iran, you know, makes al-Qaeda look like Mount Sinai in terms of the damage they can do worldwide.
	Well, well, well, Ray, I mean, I don't want to take up more of your time.
	If you want to come back for five more minutes on the other side and tell people that's fine, or if you've got to go, we can have you back next week.
	Oh, five minutes I can do, Alex.
	Okay, we'll be back in three minutes.
	Stack the next guest up on top of him.
	Be right back, Ray, in three minutes.
	Hi, this is
	I think so.
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	In about five minutes we're going to get the head of veterans for peace on
	They've been banned from the parade.
	They've always been allowed in the parades.
	Brett McGovern, I want to get into Iran, but just briefly, I go out to a protest now, or I go out to even videotape on a street corner, and cops all over the country come over and say, turn it off, get out of here.
	I could go to a third world country.
	And they don't do that.
	And I've been to Latin American third world countries, European third world countries.
	I mean, I don't think Americans realize how they've moved us into martial law light.
	How things have changed.
	How the federal government was able to instruct locals to do that.
	How this hysteria had done that.
	Do you have any comments on that?
	Well, I do Alex.
	You talk about martial law light.
	Well, if anyone's looking for martial law
	Heavy, or black.
	Just wait until we strike Iran.
	If and when we strike Iran from the air, they can do, in addition to the things I've already mentioned, the kind of worldwide terrorism that would, as I started to say, make Al-Qaeda look like, you know, the Mount St.
	Ursula volleyball team.
	I mean, the Iranians have a worldwide capability to do real, real terrorism.
	And you can fully expect that if this happens.
	Now, what are we likely to see in the next few weeks?
	I think that it's going to be real hard for the Americans to come up, the American military, to come up with enough Iranian weapons to insert into southern Iraq and say, well, we found them.
	You know why?
	Because the Iraqis are not cooperating.
	The Iraqis are talking to the Iranians, and the Iraqi leaders are saying, look,
	We want evidence.
	We don't want speculation about Iranian weapons.
	So what are they going to do?
	They're going to resort to the big lie.
	The big lie is the claim that Iranians president had threatened to, quote, wipe Israel off the map.
	He didn't say that, folks.
	What did he say?
	He said, quote,
	I'll say that again.
	He was quoting Khomeini, okay?
	What is he saying?
	He's saying that the regime occupying Jerusalem and the occupied territories for the last 40 years, more years than the Soviets have occupied Eastern Europe, should vanish from the pages of time.
	I agree with that.
	I agree with that.
	I think they should obey the UN Resolution 242.
	Which we voted for back in 1967.
	So it's a big lie to say that what Ahmadinejad was saying, that he's going to wipe Israel off the map, or as the President so often says, threaten to destroy Israel.
	He has done nothing of the kind, and besides all that, he doesn't have the capability to do that.
	So if we strike Iran, it will be completely, because our President has been, as Scowcroft said, mesmerized by the Israeli leaders.
	Ray McGovern, in closing, to be specific, I don't want there to be a war.
	I don't particularly like Iran.
	I like their people, but all these governments are corrupt.
	I'm not saying good guy, bad guy.
	Obviously, though, the neocons are the bad guys that they attack, so I'm not politicizing this.
	I'm just looking at the basic facts here, and to me,
	If Iran doesn't have a capability of aircraft carriers and ICBMs and whatever, they're going to need to use asymmetrical warfare.
	You have a hundred, two hundred, a thousand, there's different battle plans, to blow up all their power plants, blow up their bridges, their water plants, anything for quote industry.
	A total bombing to the stone age of their country, mass murder.
	I mean, then any means they've got to fight back, is that even really going to be, quote, terrorism?
	And the media and the government's already said, if they raise a fist to fight back, it will be called terrorism, and that they're then going to nuke them.
	What the neocons have said is, if you fight back, we're going to nuke you.
	Yeah, someone said once that a terrorist is a fighter without aircraft, without stealth bombers, you know?
	If that's all you've got, that's what you're going to use, and you can be assured that an attack on Iran would let loose that kind of terrorism worldwide, and I'm talking about worldwide, and to include our country.
	And instead of it being a fake Saudi Arabian-U.S.-Pakistan run Al-Cieda, we're talking about real terrorists.
	We're talking about real.
	What type of asymmetrical?
	Are we talking about people putting chlorine gas in high-rise apartments?
	Are we talking about blowing up bridges?
	Are we talking about blowing up power plants?
	Are we talking about going into malls and shooting 500 people?
	You know, Alex, I have to say what the Germans say at this point.
	It's beneath you to talk.
	I'm over-asked.
	I'm not a specialist in any of this, and I'd be just guessing.
	But the sky's the limit.
	Well, you know, I know their capability, as well as their intentions in this case, and their capabilities in Europe in particular, and in Asia, and to a slightly less degree in this country, are, as I say, such as to put al-Qaeda to, you know, to ridicule in terms of how much the Iranians could do.
	So, you know, that's one reason, and I think it's
	It's a big mistake on Iran's part, that they're so damn smug, that they're so damn confident that we wouldn't possibly try to do this.
	Well, in closing, just look at the economy.
	If they mine harbors, if they sink ships in canals, they're in the key straits of Ormuz.
	I mean, that right there will send oil to $500 a barrel.
	It would.
	You know, the question is whether anybody's telling Bush that, you know, he knows there's a big gas pump there in Crawford, and he's got a lot of money, and, you know, it's an open question to me as to whether he gives rat fair support, in my expression, as to what happens after January of next year.
	Ray McGovern, are there any particular websites for people to learn more about your organization and other groups you support?
	The best one is ConsortiumNews.com, run by Robert Perry, one of the best investigative journalists in the country.
	Another one would be Common Dreams.
	AfterDowningStreet.org is a wonderful site if you want to keep up with just about everything that's going on in Congress as well as other places.
	AfterDowningStreet.org.
	Okay, Ray McGovern, get well.
	I'm glad to hear the prognosis is good.
	And I'd love to, as things heat up, have you back for 30 minutes an hour in the next month or two.
	And certainly, if things kick off, we're even able to do this radio show to have you come back on as this unfolds.
	But I guess whichever way it goes, you're right, we've got to put the maximum effort out now to say no to war.
	And I guess get that estimate out that they aren't a threat and not poke this sleeping tiger.
	And just thank you so much for your time, sir.
	We really appreciate it and respect it.
	You're most welcome.
	Alright, folks.
	There goes Ray McGovern.
	Do we have Veterans for Peace on?
	He's all set.
	Okay, I apologize for them.
	I apologize for backing Jack McClam up, too.
	Just so much is happening.
	We've only got part of this segment and the next.
	I've got local news stories here out of Virginia.
	I don't know.
	Glad to be part of that here in the great old USA.
	And I hope I'm pronouncing your name right, sir.
	We just set you up for the show.
	It's Michael Maricue, VP for Vice President of Veterans for Peace.
	Is that correct, sir?
	It's Marceau.
	It's Marceau.
	Like, it's Marceau.
	M-A-R-C-E-A-U.
	Like Marceau.
	Marceau.
	Marceau.
	Gotcha, sir.
	Thank you so much for coming on, Michael Marceau.
	In a nutshell, what's happened to your arch-criminal group?
	You're not allowed to be part of the parade.
	Well, let me clarify that we are the Investors for Peace Washington, D.C.
	area chapter, and we have been in contact with this group, American Veterans Center is the one that is sponsoring the parade, and if you go to their website, you will see such entities as Lockheed Martin, Raytheon, Kaki, CACI, which is a huge subcontractor here in the Washington, D.C.
	area,
	The National Rifle Association is also one of the sponsors, and at one time I believe the government of Kuwait was listed on their website as a sponsor.
	I'm just puzzled as to why they think groups like that do not have a political viewpoint, but we do.
	Sure, your phone's a little overdriven.
	Back off of it a bit so we can hear you clearly.
	Yeah, they've got all these clearly political groups there, but they play this game of, oh, we're not being political, no First Amendment for you.
	That's exactly right, and if you also look in past parades here, this group, American Veterans Center, has a lot of groups like Revolutionary War Enactors, active duty military groups to march, and if those guys are not said to be carrying a political message, and I do not understand why, Veterans for Peace,
	We're good to go.
	The resources either from the military medical facilities and the Veterans Administration medical facilities are not adequate, not even very close to being adequate to deal with all these injuries.
	Sure, they don't count people who die outside country as you know, so it's more like 18,000 now, dead troops, and more like 100,000 injured, so your numbers may be a little different from the ones I've ferreted out, but even those official numbers are incredible.
	Plus, we're five plus years into this.
	I bet money, if you guys try to go out there without the permit, I bet they're going to arrest you, but maybe that's the attention we need.
	Are you still going to try to go out and be handing out flyers or educating people?
	While we're still talking about that right now, we have some emails and some phone calls among members of our chapter, and we haven't really decided anything yet.
	But I know last year in Boston, and last year I think it was in Southern California, I want to say Santa Barbara maybe, but two of our Veterans for Peace chapters were not allowed to march in Veterans Day parades.
	There's another chapter in Washington State that is not allowed to march in this year's Memorial Day Parade.
	So, this is not an isolated incident, and that's why we're trying to... Well, yes, sir.
	Stay there.
	Stay there.
	I want to come back with another... I want to stay there and come up with another segment.
	But the key here is...
	A year and a half ago the poll was 71% Gallup poll of US troops polled in Iraq or against the war.
	The number is more like 80% in other polls that have been regional around bases.
	So they're also creating an illusion that the majority of troops are for the war with these fraudulent events for the general public.
	So I'm going to get your comment on that.
	You represent the majority of veterans who aren't for this stinking war.
	You got 80% of the American people against it as well.
	So again, it's all part of this minority forcing their view and their fraud on us and trying to bar us equal access as veterans.
	So it's all part of discrimination.
	Discrimination.
	I can't even say it.
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	And the information you need to effectively wake up your fellow man and fight the New World Order
	Hi, this is Ted Anderson.
	Have you ever wondered why banks, stockbrokers, investment advisors won't talk about gold for your IRA?
	That's right.
	Gold has been available to be placed in IRAs since 1986.
	Yet still, the financial industry refuses to recognize the value of real hard assets for your retirement.
	The truth be told, gold and silver has outperformed paper investments like stocks, bonds, and CDs, yet no word about IRAs.
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	The crime of identity theft occurs every 3.5 seconds, costing the victims an average of $8,000.
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	Yeah.
	We got Michael Marceau, VP of the Local Veterans for Peace in D.C.
	It's a really nice organization.
	One of the little virulent hippie groups.
	I've been to some of their meetings.
	I have to hear about how families are bad and world government is good.
	These are good folks that are against the war and the new world order in many respects.
	But regardless if I agree with them or disagree, the vast majority of veterans are against the war.
	The vast majority of troops are against the war.
	All the polls show that.
	But no, they can't be involved because that would shatter the illusion that the war is tied somehow to being patriotic.
	When the people running the war, Halliburton, have moved to Dubai and Cheney's got a house in Dubai and the Bush's one in Paraguay and they're destroying the U.S.
	They're puppets for the New World Order, but they're doing it.
	Michael, you've got a few minutes left.
	In closing, tell us about your website, your group, and any ideas on what you'll be planning on Veterans Day while the rest of Americans are out, or not Veterans Day, Memorial Day, while the rest of Americans are out dodging police under federal funding, sucking our blood for blood tests.
	Well, our website is www.vfpdc.org.
	We're good to go.
	And stand on the sideline and hold our Veterans for Peace banner and another sign that says, kick out a parade.
	We know that there will be some media that way and we are hoping that we will get our message across in that manner and in a calm, civilized, peaceful manner.
	Now I wonder if enforcers who believe the First Amendment is evil will come over and tell you that you're not allowed to do that.
	YouTube that and keep those cameras rolling 24-7.
	Yeah, we're going to try to see if we can get some folks with video cams and that kind of stuff out there on Monday and see what happens, but so far most of the responses that we've got from being on talk shows the last couple of days have been very positive and we're gratified that the American people can see through the stories and the lies and the information.
	Their officers have now been taught that freedom in the First Amendment is evil, so look out!
	That's my point.
	How do people contact you, who aren't even part of Veterans for Peace, to come out and videotape, support you, you know, kind of be observers of enemy operations?
	Well, just look for the National Memorial Day Parade.
	It's right down Constitution Avenue in the heart of D.C.
	I think it starts about 2 p.m., so show up around noon, get a good front row seat, and kind of watch the festivities, as they say.
	And fire out your website again, sir.
	Okay, it's www.vfpdc.org.
	And if you get lost, it's Veterans for Peace plus the D.C.
	chapter.
	Alright, and you can find that in Google or YouTube, or by going to Yahoo.
	Well, thank you so much for coming on, sir.
	Hey, we appreciate the chance to tell our story and to understand that the rest of America is with us in spite of the silliness that goes on here in Washington, D.C.
	We know the rest of America is with us, and we certainly appreciate that.
	And to all my fellow veterans, have a safe and quiet and peaceful Memorial Day.
	Thank you so much for coming on with us.
	Take care.
	Good talking to you, sir.
	Gotta defend his First Amendment, ladies and gentlemen.
	We're going to come back with Jack McClam with some really serious information in the next segment, so everybody be sure and stay with us for that.
	Before I end this segment,
	This show is made possible by my documentary film sales and by the other books and videos we carry.
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	So get a PrisonPlanet.tv membership.
	Remember, your support makes what we do here possible.
	Also, the donation buttons and the mailing address and the details of the Money Bomb from our perspective and where you donate is going up on InfoWars.com in the next hour.
	I've just got to read all of it to prove it, but I've looked at it, it looks good.
	And it's got $10 buttons, $20 buttons, $50 buttons, $100 buttons, or a button for whatever you want to give on PayPal.
	There'll be a 1-800 line posted there.
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	We need to have a good showing here.
	I need your support.
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	The Empire's on the run.
	Alex Jones and the GCN Radio Network.
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	It is a big idea.
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	You have been warned.
	Greetings!
	My name is Dr. Buell Von Shunt with the White Paper Chronicles from the main polluted stream media.
	I'm here to expose a fraud and an all-around un-American stinker.
	His name is Steve Schenck.
	His radio show called Fearless Radio.
	He says solution to all the craziness in America is just get independent and healthy so you can be fearless of all of the scary stuff you're not supposed to know about.
	Stay away from this stinker on website E-
	We're good.
	Alright folks, we're back live here.
	Thank you for joining us today.
	We're going to go to Jack McClam in just a moment.
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	Okay.
	Briefly at the start of the show, I mentioned this.
	I'd like to have Jack back on about this as it develops.
	Just in a nutshell, Jack McClam calls me, I guess about three years ago, and he says, whatever 2005 was, yeah, three years ago.
	He says, I've got a guy who volunteers and does one of my websites.
	Police and Military Against the New World Order.
	He's a great guy.
	His name's Chris Jones.
	He lives in California.
	He wants to put in a job application, because they have thousands of servants in there, for the summer, getting the Grove ready and for the 15-day encampment.
	You want to talk to him?
	I said, they've killed other people.
	They have arrested other people.
	And I said, this is very serious.
	And I said, so I'm not telling you to do it.
	But I said, I'm not getting involved with you either.
	And I know Jack wasn't really either.
	He's like, well, this is my volunteer web guy for a few years.
	But he said, better call Alex Jones.
	He's been in there.
	Sure enough, I get sent these memory sticks with video of inside the chalet where they hatched the Manhattan Project, Star Wars, Cold War, so much of it.
	They brag about that.
	The image of the child they burned, you know, so much.
	And I made Order of Death.
	And you knew him as Kyle.
	And so, I mean, it was serious when I snuck in in 2000.
	It was serious when he snuck in and was working there and secretly shot video in 2005.
	Then, years later, and Jack can go over the timeline here and the time we have with the basics, but I'm just giving you the background here.
	You knew him as Kyle a few times he was a guest on the show, and I didn't even want to do that because I knew they could get voice print if he'd been in the military and things.
	You know, I had him on, put the film out, and then he showed neighbors and gave the whole neighborhood, like we recommend, copies of my film and the film he was in, and then teenagers came over, 14, 15 year olds, he gave them copies, and it turned into like a witch hunt in the neighborhood.
	They said, he is killing this child in front of an idol.
	They came and arrested him to investigate if he'd killed the child at Bohemian Grove.
	This is insane.
	I mean, understand, the film he's giving people is aired on national television.
	Okay, and the cops come and arrest him, and he was convicted.
	They said that showing fourteen-year-olds, and we've got all the court documents, that that was a point, a type of child abuse, and they said, we're targeting you, and he didn't want to come on air a year ago when they started the trial and the proceedings, because he thought, well, I'll beat it, this is ridiculous, and he went in court and
	They showed the film and admitted that it was about this and admitted and wouldn't let a lot of other stuff in and just said you're going to jail for this video.
	Now Kelly Rushing gave a Ron Paul video to a state police officer in Kentucky.
	This was in the newspaper.
	They arrested him and said the Ron Paul speech was threatening and they went to trial and he was facing three years in jail.
	Hey brother, good to be here.
	Great.
	Yeah, very important too.
	We here at our two police and military associations are very worried about Chris because just the other day, oh I guess you know, when they first arrested him, the powerful internationalist and politicians who came after him after recording their Bohemian Grove, came after him through the court system and the first time they arrested him,
	They took him down to Theo Lacey Jail, there in Orange, California.
	And the prison guards yelled to all the prisoners, this man, Chris Jones, has F'd two little boys.
	And they yelled that out to all the prisoners, and so they caught Chris in the shower and beat him almost to death.
	The prisoners did.
	And that was all a staged event, and now he's in jail, down at the Theo Lacey Jail, and we're in contact with the sheriff's assistants and sheriff there.
	And telling him of our great concern that he's our brother.
	He's been our webmaster for years.
	He's a Christian kid and he's really a good guy.
	Loves America.
	Loves his country.
	Well, I've met him a few times in California at events.
	He's really classy.
	Nice guy.
	Works for a good company.
	Nice girlfriend.
	Goes to church.
	I know.
	I mean, let's just bring it up.
	Mark Dice goes to the same church with their girlfriends to church.
	But the thing is,
	That what he was convicted of was giving a video to children, which has aired on national television.
	Yeah, he was convicted of three charges.
	Matter of fact, out of six, they charged him with six charges.
	And they had to drop three because the young boys that he babysitted for eight, nine years ago, they said he molested these kids.
	And they took these kids in the room like I've seen them do in the Phoenix Police Department, and Child Protective Services comes in and really psychologically beats the kids up until they finally... Yeah, they'll keep them two days without food and water until they say that... Exactly.
	Yeah, and so that's what they did to the kids, but when the kids got to trial, they got up and said that he never touched us, he never did anything wrong to us, and it just ticked the judge, the criminal judge and the criminal prosecutor off so bad that they... Now, Jack, I want to go back.
	I want to stop you from covering all the facts.
	This started, he was first arrested, because I have all the court documents, or some of them he sent me.
	Where they said it was a video of a snuff film of burning a baby to an idol.
	So that was the original arrest.
	And they said he gave neighborhood kids of 14, 15 the video.
	And then later they brought in, like you said, most of this got dropped.
	But I mean, this is the insanity.
	But you're talking about then later stuff where they even went back.
	I mean, this was a hit job.
	Yeah, eight, nine years ago.
	And these are teenagers today.
	And they told the truth on the witness stand.
	The judge had purposely stacked the jury.
	Luckily, former FBI agent, special agent in charge, Ted Gunnarsson, sat in on the whole trial, and Ted and I have been in a conference over this, and he told me that the judge, when they selected the jury,
	Uh, Alex, uh, there was a guy in there that said he wanted to personally kill Chris because of the charges against him.
	And the judge says, does that mean you can't be, uh, unbiased and serve on the jury?
	And the guy says, well, I'll try judge.
	And he says, okay, you're on the jury.
	Yeah.
	And so the judge just stacked the jury with people that were absolute idiots.
	Now let's go back.
	I interrupted when you brought up the point about when the young men got up and said, no, it's all lies, he didn't do anything to us.
	What happened next?
	Well, they found a kid that had been accused of child molestation that Chris had babysitted.
	The guy got on the witness stand, he's a teenager now too, and I guess he's a pedophile, but they wouldn't let the jury know that, but Chris told me that.
	And the kid said that they got into a wrestling match and pulled their pants down, and Chris sat down on the couch and he had a bulge in his pants.
	Well, Chris says whenever you sit down with a loose pair of jeans on, if they're not form-fitting, you have a bulge right there.
	Yeah, that's the court record.
	When he stood up, it was gone.
	And so he was convicted for a bulge in his pants.
	I mean, even their star witness says he had a bulge in his pants.
	This is the conviction.
	That's it.
	Meanwhile, CPS, and we have the court record.
	Meanwhile, CPS is flying little kids out to Israel and Saudi Arabia right now.
	Yes, that's right.
	This is the new wish hunt.
	It's going up to the White House and to the Capitol for pedophilia, you know?
	And Barney Frank can have 14 year olds in his house running a brothel and that's okay.
	But now again, Jack, this all started over the Grove when they all came and said, you've got a video of a baby being killed.
	Right.
	And then once it started, they set him up.
	Uh-huh.
	Yeah, they're really angry at Chris and are going to, I guess, try to kill him in prison.
	And here's how we know it.
	They've sent a shill in as his cellmate, a stooge for the government.
	And that guy got in the cell with Chris here a few days ago and started telling him, saying things to him about his homosexuality and everything.
	Chris's homosexuality.
	And Chris told him to be quiet.
	And he refused to do it.
	He kept hammering on Chris and hammering on Chris.
	And so he couldn't get Chris to get up and fight him.
	So he yelled out through the bars that Chris was going to give a sexual favor to everybody in the prison.
	And so Chris threw his three-inch little pencil at the guy and hit him in the back with his three-inch little pencil.
	And he says, Assault!
	Assault!
	Guards!
	Chris just assaulted me!
	I want to file charges on him!
	Well, the guards came down and they told him to sit down and shut up, that there was nothing to it, because they're just a three-inch-low piece of pencil.
	They only allow them to have those short, low pencils, you know?
	Then he said to Chris, I'm going to get my buddies together and we're going to kill you.
	Now he's already been beaten half to death.
	Yeah, he's already been beaten half to death.
	He was beaten unconscious there when they first arrested him.
	And so Chris got scared and told his mom about it, and her mom got a hold of us here at our two police and military associations, so I contacted the sheriff right away.
	Jack, can we give numbers out concerning this?
	Because I want to get some phone numbers out.
	Yeah, the reason I asked to come on is very important, Alex, that we've got the judge, David Thompson, and we'd like everybody to mail just a sentence or a paragraph to the judge asking the judge
	To let Chris out, because his life's in danger.
	But I mean, to be clear, let's give the numbers out.
	How can he do that?
	I mean, I don't have all the stuff in front of me here.
	How long is he going to be in jail?
	What's the procedure now?
	Well, three years.
	The judge just gave him three years in prison.
	But he's under appeal.
	He's under appeal right now.
	We'd like to have him let out during his appeal.
	Absolutely.
	Well, he never left.
	I mean, this went on for a year.
	Right.
	But, I mean, this is an incredible part.
	Guy with no criminal record, and he's been convicted of having a bulge in his pants nine years ago, which is made up, and it all began with him saying he killed a baby in front of an idol because neighbors saw the video and called the cops.
	I mean, is that what happens, Jack?
	Once the cops come, they're just going to set you up, or what?
	Well, they have special cops like they did in the Phoenix Police Department that they know will commit any crime and will do anything they're told to do, ordered to do, because that's who's promoted up through the ranks.
	Anybody that's
	I don't think so.
	And they'll do anything, say anything, and follow orders exactly.
	Yeah, there's no doubt that they have come after him, and I told him how dangerous it was.
	You know, people don't realize how dangerous this is.
	Infiltrating the Grove, then him getting a job there.
	Everybody's giggling and laughing, saying they're going to go get jobs there.
	I'm not trying to scare you away from it, folks.
	But you remember, Jack, when you called me about this, and I told Chris, I said, you do what you want, buddy, I'm not involved.
	Because I can risk my life in being set up, but I'm not going to risk yours, and he sent me that great footage.
	David Thompson, give us the address, give us the jail number, give us a phone number.
	Please folks, just do a paragraph, a short little few sentences, and ask the judge to let Chris out.
	He's not a flight risk, he's not a threat to society.
	And write to Judge David A. Thompson, T-H-O-M-P-S-O-N, and his address is 700 Civic Center Drive,
	And right after that, there's a large W and a period.
	It might be West, but don't spell out the word West because we don't know if it's a West or not.
	But it's 700 Civic Center Drive with a W period.
	And then it's Santa Ana, Santa, just like Santa Claus, Ana, A-N-A, California, 9-2-7-0-2.
	That's Santa Ana.
	California, 92702.
	Okay, phone numbers are even more important because he's in there, he's in danger right now.
	We need to call the jail.
	Jack, do you have those numbers?
	Well, now, let me tell you what happened yesterday after I called the sheriff and assistant sheriff J.B.
	Davis and told him that he was in fear of his life and that he had just been threatened that they were going to kill him.
	His mother wrote back to us and told us that a friend had just gone by the Theo Lacey jail
	And that Chris was immediately processed out and transferred to Wasco near Bakersfield, where they say he's undergoing a 90 days assessment.
	And his mother says, I can't imagine what they're assessing, but please pray for Chris because they could be shooting him up.
	They could be shooting... No, no, they do that.
	Stay there, Jack.
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	We've only got five minutes left.
	We've got to move fast.
	We've got to get phone numbers out.
	What happens is, they beat you, and then if you complain, they say you're mentally ill, then they drug you.
	This is when they're really politically targeting you.
	There's a famous dentist who was involved in a suit against the government over Medicare and Medicaid.
	Uh, and, uh, they just grabbed him.
	It's been 10 years, solitary confinement, in prison, drug, no judge, no jury, no nothing.
	And yeah, when you hear being assessed, that means they probably got him, uh, put him on Thorazine, injecting him, and they'll say, look, he's slobbering, he's mentally ill.
	Uh, it's a very corrupt system.
	Jack McClam, do you have any phone numbers for us to give out for, uh, Chris Jones?
	Yeah, we do.
	Now, it's very important people write down Christopher Jones' name and his, his, uh, serial number.
	Okay, they must have a serial number.
	It's Christopher, C-H-R-I-S-T, like Christ, T-O-P-H-E-R, L, is the middle initial, Jones, and his prison number is 2439321.
	2439321.
	And I have
	Need that right away you get a paragraph off to the judge But also there's a number here to call the criminal court, and I think it really is a criminal court But it's in Santa Ana, and it's where Judge Thompson is and the phone number is 7 1 4 area code 8 3 4 3 5 9 3 That's 7 1 4 area code 8 3 4 3 5 9 3
	And just tell the lady there or tell the judge if you get through to the judge to let Chris out during his appeal that he's not a flight risk and that he's a proud member of the American Citizens and Lawmen Association.
	A lot of lawmen support him and know about him.
	And that he ought to be out during his appeal because they're talking about killing him now.
	Also, Alex, I would ask the people, please pray for Chris because when they're assessing him for this 90 days, they don't allow him to have any visitors at all.
	And he could be suicided in there.
	You know what I'm talking about.
	He could be depressed and they'll say, well we found him very depressed and found him hanging from his coat cloth.
	And this is the price we pay to get the info out.
	We all should pray for him.
	Chris Jones is a hero.
	714-834-3593.
	And it's Agent David Thompson.
	Agent of Lucifer, David Thompson.
	That's the black-rubbed thug.
	But when you call the scum, be polite.
	Just let them know that the world's watching.
	What about calling the jail?
	Well, please do.
	Well, he's gone from the jail now.
	What facility?
	I mean, wherever he's at, the prison?
	Well, we don't know about this Wasco.
	It's spelled like Costco, but with a W.
	We don't know anything about it right now.
	We're going to check into it, Alex, and find out what it is, but all we can find out is that inmates have gone there for assessment for 90 days and are allowed no visitors.
	Okay?
	So, we'll see if we can find out information about that, but right now,
	The jail that he was in, Theo Lacey Jail, the Sheriff's Jail, he's not there anymore.
	So now they've put you into facilities where no one's even allowed to see you.
	Pretty soon it'll be forever.
	This government's so disgusting.
	Jack McClam will continue to watch this as it develops.
	Have you and maybe Chris Jones' mother on next week.
	That'd be wonderful.
	She's really fighting for her son.
	She knows how he was set up because Ted Gunderson told her all about the horrible, horrible trial there.
	As a matter of fact, I think she was there for the trial.
	Jack, we're out of time.
	Thank you so much.
	God bless you, brother.
	Thanks a lot.
	I warned Mr. Jones when he called me.
	I said, man, better think twice about this.
	Big trouble.
	All right.
	Retransmission starts now at InfoWars.com.
	Go to the audio streams there.
	See you back Sunday, 4 to 6 p.m.
	live.
	This Sunday, the Money Bomb, ladies and gentlemen.
	Money Bomb's coming up next Saturday.
	Thank you for listening to Jeef.
	Good job, Jones.
	You take care.
	Have a nice weekend.
	Hey, thank you, brother.
	Matter of fact, I think she was there for the trial.
	Yeah.
	Jack, we're out of time.