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Filename: 20021031_Gertz_Alex.mp3
Air Date: Oct. 31, 2002
315 lines.

The Alex Jones Show discusses a transcript from October 31st, 2002 featuring Bill Gertz, an award- winning writer, and bestselling author of the book Breakdown. The show focuses on intelligence breakdowns within various U.S. administrations, specifically highlighting failures in identifying Osama bin Laden and recognizing the imminent threat of 9/11. Jones accuses the government and mainstream media of covering up criminal activities related to 9/11 and other matters, such as insider trading at major U.S. companies, CIA planes flying into buildings, and building number 7's implosion. However, Gertz denies being aware of or having investigated many of these topics and claims he is a reporter, not an investigative one. The callers on the show express their dissatisfaction with Gertz's lack of coverage on these topics and the mainstream media's supposed complicity in hiding the truth about 9/11 and related events.

Time	Text
	Big Brother.
	Mainstream media.
	Government cover-ups.
	You want answers?
	Well, so does he.
	He's Alex Jones on the GCN Radio Network.
	And now, live from Austin, Texas, Alex Jones.
	All right, folks.
	Welcome back as we blast out nationwide.
	I'm Alex Jones, your host.
	The websites are InfoWars.com and Net.
	We're joined by, well, a great writer who's done a lot of great work exposing Bill Clinton and the missile secrets and the bomb parts to
	Good to be with you.
	Tell us, for those that don't know who you are, just a little bit about the past stories you've written and now how that came together with this new book.
	Because you'd written a lot about what was happening in the intelligence agencies and Clinton and Al Qaeda and the rest of this before Bush even got into office and then of course 9-1-1 took place.
	Millions of Americans, I was asking, you know, how could 9-11 have happened when, you know, we're spending $35 billion a year on intelligence?
	And it's a pretty amazing story, actually, the fact that we had the clues and we should have been able to unravel the 9-11 plot.
	Now Bill Clinton was at a dinner, and Newsmax has reported on this as a tape of it, and bragged that he didn't stop Bin Laden.
	He had all those chances.
	They sued and he's offered to arrest him.
	Well, yeah, that's the case.
	Basically, the problem there was that the Clinton people approached terrorism as a law enforcement problem.
	And if you do that, you're giving every terrorist one free attack because it means that you're not going to be able to
	Get inside their group and disrupt their activities and operations before they carry him out.
	That was the case in 95 when Bin Laden was still somewhat shadowy.
	intelligence didn't have a clear picture of who he was until 1998.
	U.S.
	And as a result, they missed a great opportunity to get him.
	The Sudanese were trying to get off the State Department terrorism list and they offered up intelligence on Bin Laden and his group.
	And the Clinton people balked and instead urged the Sudanese to send him to Saudi Arabia.
	Well, the Saudis also balked at taking him and the result was that bin Laden ended up heading for Afghanistan.
	Why would Clinton then bomb Sudan when they tried to turn him over?
	Well, like I said, they had some suspicion that bin Laden had a chemical
	Weapons factory there.
	Turned out to be the aspirin factory.
	Right.
	And it was an embarrassment.
	It was also an intelligence failure.
	But the intelligence people claim that they were forced to say that this plant was a chemical weapons factory for Bin Laden.
	And, you know, that's again, it's a failure, though.
	They felt that they were forced to do that.
	You know, somebody should have walked instead of doing it.
	All right, when we get back, I want to go through some of the chapters of the book and some of the big intelligence breakdowns, as you said, in the name of the book, when we return after this break.
	How is the book being received by people in the intelligence community, Bill?
	Very well.
	I'm very surprised that, well, not at the top levels, but at the middle levels, there's a lot of really positive feedback that I've received.
	So you would say the breakdown was in both administrations?
	Well, both.
	I would say it's through several administrations going back to the 70s actually.
	Yeah, Carter and even the Ford administration.
	The Genesis Communications Radio Network proudly presents the Alex Jones Show.
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	We're talking to Bill Gertz, best-selling author.
	You know him, of course, from the Washington Times and the great reports he did exposing Bill Clinton's high treason during the 1990s.
	He was one of the guys that dug up a lot of the core information on this.
	We're going to talk a few minutes here and then we've got some time before the bottom of the hour to take some calls.
	If you'd like to join us on air and talk to Bill Gertz,
	The toll-free number to do so is 1-800-259-9231.
	His new book is Breakdown, How the American Intelligence Agencies Dropped the Ball, folks.
	And we have details of that on InfoWars.com.
	Bill?
	In the last segment, you were talking about how the CIA didn't have a clear picture of Bin Laden in the 90s.
	I mean, the Republicans put out a report in 99 about how al-Qaeda was involved in attacking the Serbs and even working with these intelligence agencies.
	We have Bin Laden in the 80s, the CIA protégé, so I don't know.
	I mean, could you tell us why they didn't have a clear picture of him?
	It was a real failure.
	They just did not understand who he was.
	They thought he was basically some shadowy financier behind what they were at that time calling transnational terrorism.
	Well, it turned out he was involved in the First World Trade Center bombing.
	They just didn't focus on the problem.
	Was that Operation Bajinka?
	Well, that was in 1995, and he was linked into that, too.
	Bojinka was the first time U.S.
	intelligence had a clue that Al-Qaeda was going to use airliners in the commission of terrorist attacks.
	Only how can the White House then say, oh, we never heard of plans to fly planes into buildings when I've got the Pentagon's own website where in November of 2000, they did a mass casualty drill with a jetliner flying in there?
	Yeah, well, it's, you know, they dropped the ball.
	They certainly did.
	So, I've read the book.
	It's got a lot of info.
	What about this defense intelligence analyst who tried to get him to do something earlier?
	Yeah, this is an incredible story.
	It's the story of a DIA analyst named Kai Fallas.
	He's really one of the heroes of my book.
	Basically, he was a specialist on Iranian terrorism and was also working the Al-Qaeda account.
	He had a unique software system that he put together.
	It was basically stuff you could buy at a software store and then into that, it was called Analyst Notebook, and into that software he plugged in top secret intelligence information.
	And he kept seeing certain patterns related to Al Qaeda attacks.
	One of which was that before every major attack, bin Laden or one of his top deputies would surface
	uh... in some type of videotape and we've seen this recently we saw that before the recent Bali attack uh... but in uh... before the USS Cole was bombed in October of two thousand a month before that this happened this uh... bin laden came up and uh... gave a uh... a radical speech about uh... americans and uh... he recognized that this was the tip-off and he went to his supervisors in the D.I.A.
	and said look we gotta put out a warning here we gotta warn
	Our military and diplomatic and other Americans around the world that there's an attack coming.
	Especially, he didn't know exactly where it was, but he knew something was coming.
	The response he got was incredible.
	The supervisor said, no, we're not going to put out a warning.
	He said, you know, he asked around the office and found out that the reason was because a woman analyst, also in DIA, had put out a somewhat contrary assessment saying that it was
	Not likely there was going to be any attack, and also that there was not likely to be any kind of a small boat attack, which is exactly what happened.
	And he had dated her.
	Because he had dated her, the supervisors doubted his sincerity and thought that he was just trying to contradict his former girlfriend's analysis.
	So, trying to shoot her down?
	Yeah.
	I mean, he told me, he said, look, this had nothing to do with who I dated.
	It had everything to do with
	American National Security.
	And when Nicole was bombed on October 12, 2000, he quit in protest.
	And he was disgusted and as well he should have been.
	Now, we see other developments inside this whole thing.
	We find out that the CIA on September 11,
	Was running a drill, according to the Associated Press, of flying planes into buildings, but they had never heard of a plan to fly planes into buildings.
	Again, I get back to this, how can Clinton and then Bush, because they all were out there saying it, say they never had heard of any plan to fly planes into buildings when there were Tom Clancy books out, news articles.
	I mean, I file this stuff.
	There was articles in 96 about plans with Yosef, Ramsey Yosef, to do this.
	How do they claim that, and how does your book tackle that?
	Well, the fact of the matter is that in 1995, in Manila, Philippines, two Al-Qaeda terrorists were hooking up some bomb-making materials in their apartment, and when they raided that apartment, they found out that information.
	It was passed to both the FBI and the CIA, but no one focused on it.
	It's an institutional and cultural problem.
	You know, there's a real lack of creative thinking in the U.S.
	intelligence community.
	It's become so bureaucratic that people are chastised.
	They're not just afraid, but they're chastised if they think outside the box.
	And the thinking in the box, right up until September 11th, was nobody would do that.
	Well, that's because if people think outside the box, they'll see all the criminal stuff the intelligence community's involved in.
	Well, I don't think they're involved in a lot of criminal stuff, although, you know, spying is probably illegal everywhere around the world.
	Well, I mean, look, I mean, we all know that the intelligence agencies work, this is their own admitted, you know, a hundred books written on it, History Channel, work with organized crime around the world, do a lot of different things, that's why they need that.
	My point is, is that inside-the-box thinking keeps people compartmentalized and they won't notice what's going on in other divisions.
	Well, no, that's a different problem.
	The problem of
	Compartmentalization is really, and that leads to the lack of information sharing and that was another key failure in 9-11.
	They weren't sharing information between agencies and within agencies.
	And the problem there was, this was really the result of a string of counterintelligence failures.
	I'm talking about the big
	Extremely damaging spy cases, beginning with Aldrich Ames in 1993 in the CIA.
	I mean, he devastated the CIA's operations directorate, gave away the crown jewels of their secrets to the Russians.
	Then you had the case of Robert Hansen, did the same thing to the FBI.
	And then last, and little noticed, is the case of Anna Montez, who was arrested shortly after September 11th, who'd been under suspicion
	Uh, for about a year, and, uh, she did the same thing to the Defense Intelligence Agency.
	Okay, well what about our... The result of this is, the result was that they compartmented all the information.
	It made it harder to get security clearances, and it made it very difficult to share information.
	Alright, Bill Gertz, Washington Times writer, bestselling author.
	He wrote a story last week about our government
	We've got Mr. Perl, the Deputy Defense Secretary, Richard Perl up there, saying brace for another attack at the military bases domestically, that when we attack Iraq, they're sure to attack us.
	Now it's all over the nightly news, we need troops and all the critical infrastructure, and, you know, in the shopping malls, in the factories.
	This is going to happen.
	Why are they so sure that Iraq's going to attack this time, but they didn't attack us in 1991?
	Well, I'm not so sure that they're sure they're going to attack.
	They're just trying to... They recognize that our bases are vulnerable.
	Well, they've said it's not a question of if, but when.
	Well, the problem is they're not ready for that.
	And all the... I mean, we've never had to deal with the domestic terrorist threat in the past.
	It's always been an away game.
	They've always had to worry about
	Uh, the facilities overseas, now they gotta start worrying about our bases here.
	Well, now the story's been on Fox, CNN, all over talk radio that Iraqis were there involving the Oklahoma City bombing.
	I wonder why Clinton, when they were, when Iraqis were detained, ordered their release.
	Well, you know, I haven't found any information that the Iraqis were involved in that.
	I mean, I've seen that, but I don't believe it.
	You don't believe it.
	They were actually flown back from Scotland Yard, picked up, and ordered their release.
	I've interviewed the police who saw those surveillance cameras.
	I can give you their names.
	They showed Al Husseini Hussain on the tape with McVeigh.
	I haven't seen that.
	That would be news to me.
	So, what are they doing now to fix this so there's not more breakdowns?
	Because we've given them all this new funding, they've done this restructuring of Homeland Security, well, the Patriot Act.
	They're saying, oh, we still can't protect you.
	Have you seen the new Council on Foreign Relations report they put out last week where they say that if we don't follow their recommendations, 80 plus percent in major cities will die.
	If we do, only 20 percent.
	Have you seen that?
	I know.
	I missed that one, too.
	I've been focusing on a lot of stories here lately, but that hasn't been one of them.
	What are some of the stories you've been focusing on?
	Well, I've been working on the Iraq issue pretty much, and I had a story the other day that Saddam was firmly in power, which is kind of a blow to the Bush administration's effort to hope that somebody's going to put a bullet in him at some point from within Iraq.
	This was based on some intelligence that was released to the Senate Intelligence Committee.
	Well, they've got one of his children to defect and then come back and get taken out.
	Do you see the war with Iraq beginning, as a lot of generals have said, in January?
	Yeah, I would say the January or February time frame.
	I think my honest assessment is that I think they're trying to
	I think so.
	Various layers of security.
	He's survived for 20-something years.
	Yeah, he certainly has.
	Bill Gertz, final segment with you.
	We'll try to take some calls here and talk about the book, Breakdown, your new bestseller book on the New York Times bestseller list for five weeks and counting.
	I'm Alex Jones, your host.
	Websites are InfoWars.com, InfoWars.net, JonesReport.com.
	We'll be right back with our guest.
	Stay with us.
	All right, folks.
	Just got about six minutes left with Bill Gertz, the new book, Breakdown.
	Bill, I want to get a little bit more into the book here in a second, but let's take some calls.
	Rhonda in Missouri.
	Rhonda, you're on the air with award-winning writer, best-selling author Bill Gertz.
	Go ahead.
	You're on the air.
	Hi, Bill.
	Hi.
	Hi, Alex.
	Bill, I'm a little disappointed.
	I thought
	Well, maybe that you knew more than you did.
	I'm not sure if you're just compartmentalized.
	I don't see how you get out of all that you've learned that they dropped the ball and that there's no criminal activity going on.
	And just with your little story that you told here about the... It was amazing, the guy wanted to put out a warning, and it comes to shield girlfriend, supposedly, and... Was anybody ever held accountable for that error in judgment?
	And you know what?
	No.
	Nobody's been held accountable for the 9-11
	Intelligence failure.
	Not a single person was fired, demoted, transferred, or anything as a result.
	Well, sir, the head of the embassy that let in 15 to the hijackers, she just got a $15,000 bonus.
	Your newspaper, The Washington Times, reported on that.
	Right.
	You know, I'll tell you who's being held accountable is the American people.
	They're putting more restrictions on us.
	You know, they want to go through our garbage, but the judge who passed or denied 180-some warrants for Zacharias Massali,
	You know, let's go through her trash.
	You know, I just don't understand how you cannot see the criminal activity that's going on.
	This is all theater, this whole Iraqi thing.
	I say it's not the Republican Guard, I say it's the New World Order Guard.
	Bill, can't you at least say that it's criminal negligence all over the place, bare minimum?
	Well, I haven't seen criminal negligence.
	I just didn't uncover that.
	I mean, you know, I gotta go by what the facts say, and I haven't seen those facts yet.
	What about the insider trading?
	You know, that led back to some of the biggest U.S.
	companies out there on United and American.
	That's been in the mainstream news.
	I mean, the amount of... I've had to make two videos and write a book just to cover all the smoking guys.
	What about the CIA flying planes into buildings that morning or practicing?
	What about building number 7 imploding?
	What about firefighters saying they heard bombs going off?
	Why have they all been suppressed under the National Security Act?
	Alright Rhonda, thank you really... I would like you to ask him if he's ever seen Bohemian Grove, to know just what we're dealing with.
	Maybe he could ask the right question.
	Are you aware of where the Bushes like to holiday, the Washington Times reported about the bizarre rituals going on there?
	Uh, yeah.
	I never got an invite to go there myself.
	Have you seen your tape?
	You know, that's pretty informative if you want to look for facts.
	Well, I snuck in there, yeah.
	Made firing headlines.
	You know, you ought to get Alex not kidding about his tape.
	They really, uh...
	You know, you talk about facts.
	That's what I love about Alex.
	He gives you the facts.
	You can come to your own reality on it.
	Your own conclusion.
	What the truth is.
	Thanks a lot, Ron.
	We've got a few other calls here.
	Thank you.
	Let's talk to... Who's up next, Mark?
	Ron in South Carolina.
	Rose in South Carolina.
	Go ahead, Rose.
	Yes, Alex.
	I haven't heard you ask him about the W199I.
	This gentleman, he's got a little bit of truth and a lot of air.
	This paper is a mainstream newspaper just like everybody else.
	Mr. Moon, and Mr. Moon cringes God, so he's going to ring Bill in and Bill does not report the whole truth and does not look into it.
	Let him respond to that.
	Are you aware of Clinton and Bush forwarding the orders to Defense Intelligence and FBI to leave the Bin Ladens alone and all of this?
	I've seen some reports on that, yeah, but I didn't uncover anything solid on that, no.
	No, you're not going to look into anything.
	You're not an investigative reporter, are you?
	Am I?
	I'm a reporter, you know, that's what I do.
	I don't think, I think all reporters should be investigative reporters.
	Alright, Rose, thank you for the call.
	Let's talk to Mike in Arizona, last caller for our guest.
	Mike, you're on the air with Bill Gertz, go ahead.
	Yeah, hi, Mr. Gertz, Alex.
	I know you've done a lot of good work, but can you understand how some of us, realizing that the CFR is in the business of promoting a global police state, can you appreciate how some of us are a little bit skeptical and that there might be another interpretation of these events of 9-11, that it was not simply an intelligence failure, but
	Yeah, I don't buy into conspiracies.
	You know, I had a CIA guy once told me, he said
	He said, you know, conspiracies are hard to do.
	We tried to do it in Vietnam and it didn't work.
	I'm going to put you on hold and let you talk after Mr. Girtz has left.
	Hold on, Mike.
	The book is whitewashed, I mean, breakdown.
	And Bill, I'm ashamed.
	I think you did some good work in the past, but you've sold out here, whether it's conscious or subconscious.
	And we've looked at the facts.
	We've got the facts.
	And this whole Patriot Act destroys America.
	It does nothing to stop our enemies.
	And I hope that you'll get up there and start reporting what's really going on.
	That's right.
	Go ahead.
	You go have fun out there.
	There he goes, hanging up.
	Just arrogant.
	That's what I thought.
	You hear that voice?
	That's what I thought in the listener's seat.
	Right through it!
	Right through it!
	The CFR.
	Oh, I hadn't heard about that CFR report.
	Oh, I hadn't heard about that.
	I didn't hear anything solid about that.
	Oh, W1999.
	Just the BBC.
	Unbelievable!
	Unbelievable!
	Alright, Mike and, uh...
	Catherine and Kathy and everybody else, your calls are up next 1-800-259-9231.